Dec 12, 2022 Historic Landmark Commission on 2022-12-12 5:30 PM

Good evening everybody, taking note that we do have a forum present, we're going to open the regularly scheduled meeting of the Historic Landmark Commission. If we will all rise and say the U.S. Pledge of Allegiance and the Texas Pledge, I'd appreciate it. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Honor the Texas flag, I pledge allegiance to the Texas, one state, under God, one, and indivisible. Thank you everyone for showing up, a pretty robust crowd for a Friday night. Okay, the first item on our agenda is item A, HLC 22-106, consider approval of the November 14, 2022 Minutes. Is that going to add any corrections or comments? So moved. Yes ma'am. Motion to move. Oh, we have a motion to approve, do we have a second? Yes. Motion and a second, all in favor say aye. Aye. Aye. Do we have a copy for Ms. Monica? The next on our agenda is COA 22-0015, hold a public meeting and consider an application for a certificate of appropriateness in accordance with section 2.9.2 of the DIN Development Code to add a new sanctuary building on the existing St. Maximus Orthodox Church campus located at 2026 West Oak, within the West Oak Historic District, the site is located on the north side of West Oak Street between Bradley and Thomas Street and with that I'll turn it over to Cameron. Thank you Chair, Commission. So as stated it's at 2026 West Oak Street highlighted here in red, it's located on that north side of Oak Street between Bradley Street and Thomas Street, the owners are the St. Maximus Confessor Orthodox Church and the construction date of the property that's currently on the site is circa 1910. So the request as stated is construction of new sanctuary building on the existing campus, the location would be located here in that front yard or that southern half of the property which is highlighted here in red and the proposed sanctuary is considered the main building of this property. So this is the current conditions for that property at 2026 West Oak Street. So as stated again that proposed sanctuary would be located roughly in this area of the property. So looking first back at 2019 when the COA originally went through and was approved the materials were brick and stucco, we have that existing layout of the new sanctuary building here on that lower southwest corner of the property and we have that existing building. The property or the proposed sanctuary was supposed to be approximately 55 feet tall with that metal cross at the top, the approximately 50 feet with the dome itself and then approximately 17 foot base. So this shows both that south elevation which would be facing West Oak Street, eastern elevation which turns onto the property itself and then that western elevation that faces that western property line. These are the proposed elevations and site plan for 2022. It's predominantly the same site plan as we saw in 2019. We do see that extension of the sanctuary building as you can see here. It's highlighted in that dark black line there. It's extended approximately 36 feet in length and that would be utilized for bathrooms and other utilities. So these are the proposed renderings for 2019 and 2022 so they're roughly the same. So you are seeing a mixture of brick and stucco and these are some of the examples that the applicant did provide to us during staff's analysis. So looking at that West Oak Street comparison as stated they look predominantly the same. There is a little bit of an extension here to complete that roof line extension so it matches that eastern side but as stated the view from West Oak would look predominantly the same. So staff first looked at the standards for rehabilitation and this comes from the Secretary of Interior Standards for Historic Properties and staff focused on the first three standards of rehabilitation and then these last two which are in regards to new construction. In addition staff also looked at our debt and development code specifically section 4.9.6c which is in regards to the West Oak area historic district and in that area staff focused on these areas of architectural requirements so we looked at architectural detail, building placement, color, facade materials, front entrances and porches, roof forms, windows and doors as well as parking. So staff is recommending approval of the Search for Properties and request to add a new proposed sanctuary building on the existing St. Maximus Orthodox Church campus located at 2026 West Oak. As the proposed project does meet the Secretary of Interior Standards for Rehabilitation as well as section 4.9.6c of the debt and development code. Any questions? Are they going to have to take out the tree? There will have to be some trees removed from the property but they are required to do a tree preservation plan as well as a landscape plan in relation to this proposed sanctuary. If we are ready for a motion I'll make one. Are there any other questions? Yes this height would be the same so that's approximately 50 I'm not sure where my label went but it was supposed to say approximately 55 and then this is also approximately 55 from 2019. The new extension is the new extension is in the rear so you do see this kind of hashed line here in the 2019 plans but it wasn't reviewed by the HLC at that time but then you show it in full drawing which is at approximately 36 feet in length. Any other questions? And by the way when you guys were here before you guys took the time to have us come out and see the place and we very much appreciated that because it helped us to understand what you guys were doing and it's one thing to see it on paper but something else to get a tour so thank you. Excuse me hearing no other questions do we have this motion can continue with the motion to continue there's my thing here. Can they speak if I want to? Yes. Sorry about that. We go forward by approving a motion as submitted approve the motion subject to conditions deny the motion or continue the item do I hear a motion? I move approval of item COA 22-0015. We have a motion and a second now I'll open the board for discussion. Wow they're still alive and much well they've been here before and I'm not suggesting there needs to be discussions. No they're very compliant they've done a lot of work. So having done all that stuff let's call the vote all those in favor say aye and raise your right hand. Aye. Aye. Motion passes unanimously. Thank you. You're welcome. Okay next up on our agenda is COA 22-0017. Yes poll public meeting and consider an application fee or a certificate of appropriateness. Say what Mary I'm going to turn it over to you. That's fine not a problem I'm here for you. So it's a certificate of appropriateness according to section 2.9.2 of the Denton Development Code to install solar panels on the roof of existing residence located at 22-24 Houston Place within the West Oak Area Historic District. The site is located on the north side of Houston Place east of Thomas and Cameron is going to tell us all about it. Thank you Chair. So as stated it's at 20-24 Houston Place it is owners are Theodore and Alina Wood and the construction date is circa 1940. So it was just to give you all a little bit of background at the building's history it was constructed for Joe Ray. The architectural style is a colonial revival style some of its defining features is the Gabriel roof which actually is interesting enough about 10% of colonial revivals have that roof with like paired windows symmetrical front facade of the windows in the central door as well as double hung windows. So the request is for the installation of 36 solar panels on the roof which are highlighted here in red these would be located on the first and second stories of the property. So this is the current conditions this is looking northwest from Houston Place. So I stated it'd be located here on that second story roof line as well as the front of this southern south facing roof line. So looking at the architectural drawings so just to coordinate you all this is looking south towards that Houston Place we would have four solar panels in the rear towards the backyard we would have also additional 10 solar panels on that second story which would be facing the backyard then 10 solar panels on the front facade and then the 12 solar panels as well on that front first story of that eastern wing. The solar panel elevation similar to a Paseo A it would be a maximum of 10 inches in height from the roof and this would be the proposed system layout. So these are some of the solar panel detailings you guys have seen this in the past we have the solar panels themselves we have the cross rail and the splice butt which connected to the roof and then once again just showing you all how the solar panels would be connected to that current roof line and then these are just the solar panel details in regards to the system itself and how it runs. So staffs analysis looked at the standards for rehabilitation specifically looking at points 9 and 10 which are related to new additions and exterior alterations and then also looking at section 4.9.6 c looking specifically at the roof forms of skylights and solar panels which the historic landmark commission may allow skylights and solar panels on a building if their placement does not have an adverse effect on the architecture of a building or the district as a whole. So staffs recommendation does recommend approval of the COA to install solar panels at the 2020 2224 Houston Place as the project does meet the Secretary of Interior's standards for rehabilitation and 4.9.6 c subject to the following conditions that the 12 proposed solar panels proposed for that south side of the one story eastern wing of the residence would be located to that north side of the roof facing the backyard any questions can you bring back up the picture again with that would show it of the structure yes so Cameron there it's going to be on the front on that front story correct story yes so the 12 would be proposed right here not on this section not on this lower section but right here on this section and then the 10 would be proposed over here and then the rest of the rear but nothing on that front on the front door nothing over the front door no nothing over the front door just on this second story and then on the first story on that roof and the sum of those on where the cars are that you want to move to the other side of that yes so these right here what uh staff is proposing to uh move them to the rear facing the backyard on that north side of the roof line and they've already got four panels on the other side which what does the back side look like we do not have a photo of the back since it's not visible from the street so they're going to put 24 up even without that side panel if you were to exclude the 12 solar panels in general yes it would be 24 panels in total the owner's been made aware of staff's recommendation uh staff did talk to the property owners last week and at that time staff didn't have a full recommendation of where the panels would be proposed to go but staff had stated that all the panels they planned on keeping all the panels i just don't know how adversely this is going to affect them having those in a different place i would think on the north side would be better um just from a sun standpoint yeah okay that's probably what they want on the southern side so you know people have put up panels in the neighborhood on the east side i was surprised we've approved one on the east side of oak and i thought they were crazy and they did just fine they have a lot fewer but uh it faces east and they get sun even though there's trees around so i was actually remarkably amazed that they didn't ask for the ones facing you know so that there was less visibility i was amazed i thought they would be there victorian the mustard victorian any um concerns over having them in the front of the house even though it's on the second story but it's at the front of the home it's higher i don't i don't it's mostly because it's higher and you don't see it as much the angle is such that it's like i mean i the roof on this one is what do you know the pictures on these about camera i do not know the pictures and you can tell it's much more in your face yeah it's a gamble um but i was saying i believe the applicant is here so if they do want to answer any additional questions that you all may have um i'd love to know who the salesman has been around that neighborhood um do you have any strong opinions about whether or not they're on the north or south side well i don't i don't know if it'll work on the other side because the way the sun goes that um they figured that if they put them on the south side it would not have given us sunlight now it's possible that we could put them on the detached garage the rest of them because that's way further back from the street yeah but i don't know if they want to do that because then they'd have to do some extra wiring and wiring and stuff you can probably get a lot i'd have to ask but i don't think that putting them on the south side would be like the whole thing wouldn't be worth it i hear that worth it thing i you know but nobody ever shows me the dollars and cents i kind of like the attached garage idea just because it's not as visible from the street you get a lot of panels on there so i'm assuming what what the gamble roof was used to be a garage that could be our concern is the ones facing the street on the house yes and the reason being is because we've said as a group here that i'm facing the street and that very clearly is facing the street whether it's the first story or the second story it is um but it wasn't just this last one where we ran that same issue and and we okayed it was a side street went on the front oh i see it takes it faces front and then can you show me overhead picture oh the other aerial yes thank you yeah i worry about the trees as well and how well they will so that would be the main residence and then that's that eastern wing so it does show some of the sunlight in based on that aerial but i don't and then there's the rear garage in the back oh that is oh i see okay i'm not happy that so much of it shows i mean you know the the trick on a solar panel cost has come down and the number of panels one needs is to even power any kind of house is pretty pretty minimal in comparison to we're looking at 24 plus 12 36 yeah 36 so there would be 10 on the main residence with the four in the rear and then 12 on the one story eastern wing so the ones on the main house are facing the back some of them are facing the back so these would be facing the back so these 14 would be facing the back these i guess 22 would be facing the front and so if you're gonna put some in the back you can put the rest in the back you know well i don't know if they have enough room to put the ones they need to put some on the front no matter what to have enough room i think we're are we open to this discussion at this point yeah i say okay um we're at the point of questions for the builder or the owner or amaran do i have any more of those questions uh do you actually know that it wouldn't work if the pounds were on the other side i don't know for sure but i figured that's i'll ask i'll ask but don't have to ask me i think they would have suggested putting them back there if it would have made sense or maybe they just didn't put them back there because they had enough with the current configuration but it seems like um the way the sun goes it doesn't hit that part of the roof that well i guess i don't know why they did it the way they did it exactly uh probably possibly because they didn't realize the restrictions and they definitely did not realize that uh which is a good thing to tell anybody that you're going to have to do something for you in this historical history would i mean i think i i think i told them that but they didn't understand i don't think they understood what it meant okay uh we can simply um if we approve this uh with a number of them going on the back or not on the front so are you so i guess in terms of so here's staff's recommendation are you saying to not do what's staff's recommendation and have everything moved to the rear or so i so i just have no understanding staff's recommendation okay okay so as long as we okay so now uh for the discussion to continue we need a motion that motion can be to approve as submitted prove subject to condition deny or continue do i have a motion i'd like to motion as submitted uh i'd like to get that out first just my lawyer here okay do we have a second i'll second it just to get it on the floor okay we have a motion to approve it as submitted and second the floor is open okay now what i saw is the panels were on the front part of the roof over here correct on the one that faces more this way yes so let me pull back this this is the easiest photo for me to describe it yes so you would have the 10 solar panels lined up in a row on the second story you would have an additional 10 panels lined up on the backside which you can't see from hughes in place lined up in a row and then four other on the backside so then the 12 that staff is recommending to be pushed to the back this would be six right here six right here okay now my question from the the owner discussions so we can't talk to them anymore i can't ask a question of them not in discussion so you say what my my issue is this so they're they're wanting to improve the property they're wanting to maintain the property which is ultimately our goal is that these these historical properties have this people interested in maintaining and updating them on a continuous basis i think this achieves that uh how's it maintaining i don't see maintaining i just say i just see getting new solar panels i don't see that's a maintenance thing it's not a new roof or anything well it's not a paint job it's it's putting something that doesn't fit the character of the neighborhood one it protects the roof there's a lot of protective things that go wait till the wind gets it it's gonna rip it up okay i don't think that's an overly big issue but uh there's a storm tonight but yeah i don't to me is this is if our goal is to encourage people to to invest in these in these older homes and to preserve them i don't want to dissuade anyone from doing that by putting onerous restrictions on it i want to try to encourage that as much as possible and and to completely rework a plan that we don't know if it's even going to be workable as suggested um oh i think so well i was thinking that if they uh have panels on the back side of this section over here to begin with yes they can put them together then and they must have thought they would work otherwise they wouldn't be proposing to put them there correct so these are all the backside ones and so i don't see the difference with putting this section right here back there so i think they used up all the square footage they could facing south and it was just i think it's just a matter of that's where you get the maximum exposure that it's not enough so they had to do them on the north side as well well if they showed the calculation i'd be more minimal but i don't see a calculation that it's not enough i've seen very few things that need that many solar panels if you showed the calculations maybe you could convince me but the waving hands is not convincing me there's still a garage in the back with a little wire you can do it i i think staff is holding up to the preservation standards well that is what my question would be why can't eight of them be on that garage i agree yeah and the rest of the bases are under i agree it's not that much of a difference in cost garage you would require a whole bunch of extra wiring i think you'd have to have like a an extra inverter or something i don't know i've done wiring in the back underground so problems probably a separate solar panel system according to that garage unit and then one operating the main house we ran wires all the way from under the ground into our house from the back so i i mean you can put a wire underground and i doubt you would need a panel but we don't know that and i i will you know without knowing that i don't see that we should say maybe yeah i think that we're kind of assuming we have to go with what's presented to us they also assume exactly they didn't know about these proposed changes they i mean we're expecting them to come in and defend something they didn't know what's about to happen right i wish they had known that so that they could ask the question of the installer the proposed seller so about those applicant wasn't staff did talk to the applicant last week asking if the solar panels were to be moved and that would be possible if it would be adjusting that rate of the in terms of how much energy was coming in and then stuff didn't receive any additional documentation okay okay so let me ask the commission a question if this motion fails and we went forward with the motion to approve as uh such as conditions the staff conditions and ask them to do their dang level best to try and get some of them off of that and in the back are you guys comfortable with that okay because that way we get out of here not get out of here right but they get to they definitely are going to have the sense we don't want them facing the road but you can only do what you can do right and it's their house right so i'm thinking that's maybe the fair way to go but we have a motion yeah we have a motion now so so we have a motion and a second on the floor all those in favor say aye aye all those opposed say no no no that motion has now failed now do we have another motion i knew that we approved that we approved with conditions that staff had to move the panels to the back okay do we have a second to that motion second we have a motion and a second do we have any discussion on that i think it's it meets the historical standards i i think that we need to stick as much as possible to that everything else is conjecture they've already got some on the back it's still at the front of the house they are and that's one thing here's one thought it's on a second story or it's on the first story it's still facing the street let's see if it's on the second story what difference does that make if it's on the first story you've got a good pointer anti okay uh camera do you guys need more clarification than just do everything you can do to get some more of them off of the garage onto the real garage so the motion the motion on the floor right now is to follow the staff's recommendation as submitted in the presentation yeah so that we'll have to deal with that motion first and then we can make another motion if you want to have an alternative option i thought it was subject to conditions yeah yeah it's a staff's condition subject to staffs our discussion is are we completely happy with everything for the commission's benefit depending upon how these various motions play out if there is additional information that the commission is wanting in order to be able to assist in decision making then another available option is to continue the item and also giving additional direction to the applicant so just know that that option so yeah but continuing means if nothing happens it's approved after how many days 75 no we don't want to do you don't want to continue but we could continue yeah you can do a date certain time can we not correct you would have to sit for instance our next meeting is january 23rd 2023 you would have to say to a date certain of january 23rd 23 to have the updates made okay so that is an option as well these solar panels generally i don't have a lot of experience in this area do we are we is it a fair presumption that the number of panels that were presented that that's the minimum number to make it effective no i mean are we assuming that or is that do we know we just okay all right because of course you can sell your power back so it's it's not i don't think it's a valid assumption okay any further discussion if we if we approve it and it's not workable what's their solution afterwards is it to resubmit a new coa you don't have to wait a year if it's significantly different from this plan they can submit a coa prior to it'd be up to the hbs discretion well the year bar is only related to a denial correct yes that's i think okay so if it's if we approve it with stop conditions and it's for whatever reason i'm working they want to come back and retry their original one and have better backing as to why that can't be worked i would like a lot of detail that was happening but that could happen it can uh that also be as you know suggested a way to continue it as if you wanted to move to continue it and ask for that information no what was i saying and further i mean the reason why i suggested that is just listen to some of the discussion about you know is it feasible to have the panels on the north side of the attached garage you know if that's a feasible option or to understand the feasibility of placing any of the panels on the accessory structure in the back and then also maybe to have a representative from the solar company that's doing the install help understand some of you know be able to address some of the questions that the commission is asking in terms of minimum versus maximum numbers why why placed on certain locations of the of the roof i guess there's certain exposures or do they get better sun exposure on one side versus the other having that representative available but i would like an independent to somebody who's not selling this i mean you're you're talking to a salesman then so i they're going to guarantee that it's going to be better if you do it their way so i i think that you know can we get somebody from that municipal or somebody that has another out an outside expert that will will speak to that because i'm asking a salesman to give you a pitch is i would really prefer that we continue it under january and try to get some information independently for the for our uh well i mean the question cameron because it's going to come up again and again as we try to decide what's a good location and what's not and if you do more about you know whether or not this is solar panels providing enough electricity that you've got quite a bit to sell back or whether it's generally the electricity enough solar panel just to provide what you need a home uh i just think if we knew that we could make a better informed decision well i mean but it that that isn't our decision to make about whether it's enough or not the informed decision should be does it match the the secretary of interior standards for solar panels i mean i'm i'm all about saving money but there are other options that were not considered like the back garage and the back side and independent of that we're being asked whether putting them on the front is the answer no no my question would be putting what's the possibility of putting them on the back side would that work just as well from some independent person in terms of giving them the necessary solar power to run their house not to sell back but just to run the house but the garage is also available to put a lot on there facing the same direction they're asking for a valid question would be about the additional expense and but we also need to know this information going forward not everybody's going to have a garage in the back that gives them an alternative and we're going to continue to see roofs that may be something that you want to put on the matrix yes yeah i like the idea for a matrix because i think that it will keep coming up you know what is the character of the neighborhood does it meet the secretary of interior standards and i think we've got you know staff has looked at it very carefully and i'm going to support the staff requirement that's suggestion okay so we've had um fairly in-depth discussion any other comments okay then let's vote this one we're going to do this with hands to make sure we get it right all those and this motion is to approve subject to the conditions that the staff has asked for okay all those in favor raise your right hand so we have one two three four five cassandra five in favor those against one the motion passes down obviously i have seen better health days with your permission i will depart we're just glad to see you here oh i'm getting better no you look a lot better than you did before the last time i saw you so i'm happy to see that so basically okay so in my absence i will turn the chair over to miss mary happy new year or until we see each other again which hopefully is christmas yes so that's what i was trying to make sure we need to be better i don't mean you i'm just saying in general you're here yeah we saw ourselves that's a different factor okay okay because you're taking from the world so we have to get you a sign i have never heard of that one we were talking about you know okay and i'll i'll contact you and we'll figure out how to do it because for them it shouldn't be more than just we really are we don't know and then up to that point all right thank you so much we've reassured and i think we don't have a lot left but we do have some important issues are we going to the uh item 2d okay um hlc 22-101 provide a recommendation to the historic preservation officer requiring an enforcement action of a contributing structure on a property located at 928 west hickory street and so lance this is your i got you staying from right you have a lead merry christmas so i'll be out there are you presenting anything or are you already not presenting anything it's just need a motion oh you need a motion yes okay i'm just making sure where we work i will move to recommend uh to staff that uh they pursue criminal prosecution with the municipal office second okay um do we have any discussion i hope it's limited no discussion shall we have a vote all those in favor show hands uh we have five forward one abstention out okay the motion passes unanimously all right next up is a are we doing a work session well this is our normal this is our like every time oh okay i got confused yeah all right so hold a discussion uh regarding the historic landmark commission project matrix and so you've got a matrix oh i think oh that was quick where did you go all right a little bit exactly for those of us that are eyes are tired okay so these are some of the items that were discussed last meeting that were brought forward into the request section um we have the public outreach enforcement action and give recommendation which is on tonight's agenda of historic landmark commission ordinance regarding membership qualifications which staff will do a presentation on a later date as well as the quantify the economic impact of preserving historic properties in addition to regarding benefits for preserving historic properties and how cities are incentivizing owners to designate their properties as well as a presentation of preliminary guidelines regarding property features such as fencing and windows for use by the public and hlc and this will be presented by the definitions ad hoc sometime in early 2023 we do have some additional items for historic landmark commission's consideration which you all can vote on tonight or you can add your own that you want to put in as a request but these are some of the items that were not discussed last time but they were not asked to be removed so they're still on that matrix if i could just offer a suggestion given the discussion that occurred on the past item regarding maybe having an independent solar panel company come and address the commission that would be an item appropriate to include on the matrix i'm not sure i want a i don't want a sales company i understand but we could um we staff could contact dme see if they might have a recommended source or we could ask for a couple of different installers to come and address the commission and that way you can get a couple of different perspectives associated with it but just note that if that's something the commission's interested in having this would be an appropriate item to include on the matrix and happy to bring that back then if you don't but that's not a motion that's just uh it would just yeah we would just need foreign votes to get it on as a request onto the matrix i'd like to definitely add that we if staff could try to locate somebody that could help us become more informed on solar panels in general i think wearing a suggestion ideally would be somebody uh within the city if there's somebody knowledgeable if not then possibly trying to find somebody outside the city sphere of influence yes do we have to vote that i think yes we need a minimum of four votes to put it on the matrix teach us do we need to put on them if if we're is it possible to add something to the coa do we need to put it on here and where i'm going with that is if people are doing solar panels can we say will you be selling back energy or will you be is it for you i don't know if we can do that if that will help and then do we have to put that on this matrix to be able to discuss that and do that i think i'd like what i'd like to have is information not just for you know to come and educate us on how many watts of power people typically run per square foot and then how many watts you get out of a typical solar panel depending on angles and measurements so that you can quantify the number of solar panels that are actually needed i was just saying i think that that could be a discussion when that person from dme or someone comes and has a discussion but i don't think you all have jurisdiction on terms of energy usage and whether they're selling that back you're more focused on the structure itself and how the solar panels are affecting the structure on the number of panels i'm thinking right so hopefully yeah are are they doing it for to be for income but i don't think we get that i don't know can you ask that question but if we know how many panels will provide energy yes for what space then we can figure out whether or not if we ask them to delete right it doesn't matter to me if they are or not if they fit our guidelines i'm not yeah if they sell it back i don't care as long as they don't they don't bother the look right yeah i was gonna say why don't when cameron when we do the um the independent entity coming back and addressing the commission whatever that looks like yeah maybe on that same meeting agenda then what we can do is add um post a follow-up discussion and include that as part of our matrix item and in that way if the commission wants to have any additional discussion following that item regarding um its applications for coas on on solar panel we can address it at that time okay just since we're not posted for discussion exactly do you have any more homework for cameron you didn't take a vacation did you i just think that um the people don't know obviously from the discussions we've had a limited discussion with the property owners who are coming in and asking it they don't know this information either right and mary's right their only source of information is probably a salesperson right and they want to sell more and so that's why we need to be informed so that we know whether they're what they're asking for is what they really need in order to provide them with solar power or not i could concern marsala that that if we have too much information that turns it turns into a problem my lawyer friends that we're denying the right to use their property i i thought i thought you said this earlier case and so i'm going to bring it up to you yeah i think maybe we've drifted a little bit but i i think at the end of the day what we're your commission is is tasked to do is look at the impacts to the historic property and to the extent that information can help you determine that we're happy to discuss adding it to the cfa process but i think maybe this discussion would be better had after we get some more information all right anything else yep okay you got one more in work session yep oh yeah okay sorry i forgot about that i wish we'll thank you okay our work session is this closed no are we closed so i'm sorry do i need to mention my thing oh yes to remove myself from the subcommittee yeah i don't know what the process is so you would need to ask to have it voted on to come back onto the matrix so that we could add another volunteer or vote someone onto that subcommittee and if you don't get four votes you still have to stay okay so then i would request that uh the vote on whether um you know i kept for the next matrix whether i may need to be removed it was a pleasure to serve oh no you know you can be removed now i'm saying in terms of like we need to add to the matrix if we need to vote on having you as an agenda item come back and a replacement getting you a replacement so we need to put that as an agenda item so that needs to go on the matrix so let's please put on the matrix to ask someone else to it's a wonderful job so a replacement appointee to the subcommittee so we need four votes okay okay now we can go on if there's no more matrix items are we done now can we go to the work session yes okay okay part a um we were on part oh yeah b oh that's it we're on the b behind this that was so quick b hlc 22-103 to receive a report hold a discussion and give staff directions on historic landmark commissions request for local historic landmark designation of eligible historic properties i guess cameron's going to talk to us well this is actually the historic landmarks commission's opportunity to bring forward any designated properties drive around to see anything like they'd like us so this is what was discussed last agenda and this is something that's going to be reoccurring item where you all bring forward to the commission a property you think that is worthy of designation and if every we get a minimum of four votes then it goes on a list that staff keeps up to date and that we kind of start going through and designating properties so just a reminder obviously this is the second time we've seen it the first time was more of an introduction this is kind of second time but this is something that we'll have on our um agenda from here on out yes ma'am i don't know the address so okay saying to me and i apologize i haven't had a chance to go by and actually get the address yeah i mean it's only two houses from mine you think i would know what it is i just need a map i had somebody cut me off but i didn't follow them to see where they live so i don't know so if there's no items that are no properties that you all have ready to share we can uh we can very yeah look for uh no we have to vote to adjourn we are done we are out of here thank you folks have a very merry christmas a very happy new year thank you all for dinner that was amazing thank you thank you and a great dinner thank you