WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:14.560 good evening i'm calling the meeting to order for the city of denton use of force ad hoc committee 00:00:14.560 --> 00:00:23.680 today is thursday august 20th it is six oh three and we will start with the first item on the 00:00:23.680 --> 00:00:29.280 agenda which is to consider the approval of use of force ad hoc committee meeting minutes 00:00:29.280 --> 00:00:37.680 for august 13th 2020 um if you've read over the minutes and you don't have any um any changes or 00:00:37.680 --> 00:00:46.800 any discussions i'll need a motion motion made ronda made the motion and is that a second pam 00:00:46.800 --> 00:00:55.840 second yes second and if all approved um you can just raise your hand and hold it up for a few 00:00:55.840 --> 00:01:05.360 minutes so we can get everybody john john baines are you approving the minutes okay 00:01:05.360 --> 00:01:16.400 all in favor say aye got your hand okay uh non-opposing motion carries 00:01:16.400 --> 00:01:23.440 the next item is item b is review and discuss following items from the previous committee 00:01:23.440 --> 00:01:30.560 meeting on august 13th lillian um this is if you want to we have a quorum so if you want to take 00:01:30.560 --> 00:01:38.160 this off you can thank you thank you so madam chair what time we're starting we just started 00:01:38.160 --> 00:01:40.720 six oh three 00:01:40.720 --> 00:01:51.040 chair english i can uh introduce the second item so this is a follow-up from the last meeting 00:01:51.040 --> 00:01:55.760 we included in your backup kind of a summary of all the questions that the committee had and 00:01:55.760 --> 00:02:00.640 some of the answers that staff provided we did have two questions where we noted that we needed 00:02:00.640 --> 00:02:06.080 to follow up with the committee the first question was question number six in your backup and that's 00:02:06.080 --> 00:02:12.160 in regards to the training that officers receive on disabilities including hearing impairments and 00:02:12.160 --> 00:02:17.840 visual impairments so deputy chief frank pageant is here to address that question and follow up from 00:02:17.840 --> 00:02:25.440 last meeting you're on mute yet deputy chief 00:02:25.440 --> 00:02:37.600 there we go is that better okay there's one in every meeting isn't there um yeah the question 00:02:37.600 --> 00:02:42.960 was whether officers receive training on disabilities excluding autism hearing impairments 00:02:42.960 --> 00:02:49.440 and visual impairments while some of that training is scattered throughout various courses 00:02:49.440 --> 00:02:58.720 there's a specific class the samuel allen law or senate bill 976 what took effect september 19th 00:02:58.720 --> 00:03:05.840 or i mean i'm sorry september 1st 2019 it created a tico course understanding communication 00:03:05.840 --> 00:03:10.400 impediments for law enforcement the course addresses the communication impediments that 00:03:10.400 --> 00:03:15.760 people with disabilities may have when they contact or are contacted by law enforcement 00:03:15.760 --> 00:03:21.280 and the course makes officers aware of those impediments you know those impediments 00:03:21.280 --> 00:03:29.040 say a lack of eye contact or a slow response to questions because someone is processing the answer 00:03:29.040 --> 00:03:34.960 or processing what the officer has told them those can be interpreted by officers as suspicious 00:03:34.960 --> 00:03:41.520 activity or avoidance so this course lets officers know there's other causes out there 00:03:41.520 --> 00:03:49.520 for these actions the individuals can also put communication impediment on the back of their 00:03:49.520 --> 00:03:54.320 driver's license so that when an officer has the license he can look at it she can look at it 00:03:54.320 --> 00:04:00.880 and see that the the person has this communication impediment they can also discreetly attach it to 00:04:00.880 --> 00:04:08.240 their vehicle registration so when they're pulled over say by an officer the officer pulls them over 00:04:08.240 --> 00:04:13.840 checks the tag when the tag return will return and tell the officer that the person may have 00:04:13.840 --> 00:04:18.800 trouble communicating so the officer can go and make the first contact and know that 00:04:18.800 --> 00:04:23.200 you know there's an issue here with communication and i need to be aware of that 00:04:24.640 --> 00:04:31.440 the disabilities that are included in this course include parkinson's disease 00:04:31.440 --> 00:04:37.440 mild intellectual disability speech and language disorders 00:04:37.440 --> 00:04:43.440 down syndrome and brain injury and it does include the autism spectrum disorders 00:04:50.800 --> 00:04:59.920 any questions for deputy chief pageant okay seeing none we'll go to the second follow-up 00:04:59.920 --> 00:05:05.680 item that we had and that was in regards to question 19 bo had asked about training gaps 00:05:05.680 --> 00:05:12.400 regarding use of force so dr williams is going to provide some more information in regards to that 00:05:12.400 --> 00:05:25.280 item good evening everyone it's good to be back with you again 00:05:25.280 --> 00:05:40.240 all right so i did some homework did ever can everybody see the screen 00:05:41.120 --> 00:05:44.720 and the last week i had a little trouble with my screen but everybody got it this time so good thank 00:05:44.720 --> 00:05:51.920 you so much i passed uh so just some follow-up regarding your question your question regarding 00:05:51.920 --> 00:05:58.720 what gaps were identified or in the use of force training and uh what i found was that the the 00:05:58.720 --> 00:06:05.520 response to resistance training the defensive tactics training it was inconsistent uh 00:06:08.080 --> 00:06:16.800 it was inconsistent because of different reasons staffing reasons uh some funding reasons but uh 00:06:16.800 --> 00:06:22.080 the department was taking actions to address those things and actions that were taken were that the 00:06:22.080 --> 00:06:27.760 training budget has been increased and to address the staffing issue the department selected and 00:06:27.760 --> 00:06:34.160 dedicated a full-time defensive tactics instructor to provide regular training to all sworn officers 00:06:34.160 --> 00:06:40.160 so that that erased that inconsistency so not as one officer that is his sole job is to provide 00:06:40.160 --> 00:06:43.600 responsive resistance defensive tactics training 00:06:43.600 --> 00:06:56.640 additional actions that that have been taken by the departments that all sworn personnel are 00:06:56.640 --> 00:07:02.720 currently now receiving and or scheduled to receive the following annual training they're receiving 00:07:02.720 --> 00:07:08.720 de-escalation training response to resistance defensive tactics training they're receiving 00:07:08.720 --> 00:07:14.720 scenario-based training to build on critical thinking skills they're receiving emergency 00:07:14.720 --> 00:07:21.440 vehicle operations training and they're receiving fair and impartial policing training the explicit 00:07:21.440 --> 00:07:27.040 and implicit bias training for all sworn not just the sworn personnel but also the non-sworn personnel 00:07:27.040 --> 00:07:37.600 as well all officers now have access to what we call open mat training to improve and maintain 00:07:37.600 --> 00:07:43.200 their proficiency in response to resistance and defensive tactics and what we mean by open mat is 00:07:43.200 --> 00:07:51.200 that whenever an officer wants to go and practice their skills the training is available to them on 00:07:51.200 --> 00:07:57.200 demand they can go and do it at any time they feel a need to improve upon their their skill set as it 00:07:57.200 --> 00:08:01.680 relates to responsive resistance and defensive tactics training there are no barriers 00:08:01.680 --> 00:08:09.600 a future training that's that's scheduled also scheduled to participate in additional 00:08:09.600 --> 00:08:15.840 scenario-based situational training which is mandatory and as i mentioned last week the 00:08:15.840 --> 00:08:24.000 officers will be participating in active bystander ship train training the department has has requested 00:08:24.000 --> 00:08:30.960 three three trainer trainer slots forward to receive the trainer training and those three 00:08:30.960 --> 00:08:38.640 those three instructors will provide and present this training to all sworn and non-sworn personnel 00:08:43.520 --> 00:08:48.320 and those are the responses to your question does anybody have any additional questions 00:08:48.320 --> 00:08:59.360 here can i ask you my question dr williams if you could bring down the 00:08:59.360 --> 00:09:07.440 slides sorry once so we can have that committee discussion that's okay and i can come in and help 00:09:07.440 --> 00:09:14.240 if you need it stop share got it yes hey 00:09:14.240 --> 00:09:21.840 dr williams thank you so much for that it's really helpful um a couple of questions number one 00:09:21.840 --> 00:09:25.760 yes in terms of the you said there was a particular officer that was 00:09:25.760 --> 00:09:33.120 i can't remember the exact language you used but a large portion if not the the totality of his job 00:09:33.120 --> 00:09:41.360 is to work with defensive tactic training yes sir the department identified an officer they selected 00:09:41.360 --> 00:09:47.120 that officer and he's dedicated to providing uh responsive resistance and defensive tactics training 00:09:47.120 --> 00:09:53.360 that's his that is his job to assure that every every member of the department all swarm members 00:09:53.360 --> 00:10:01.520 receive uh their training and i don't know if you would know this or who might on the call have we 00:10:01.520 --> 00:10:04.320 had the opportunity to speak to that officer 00:10:04.320 --> 00:10:29.440 no you have not uh spoken with that person yet okay uh but i just want to make sure 00:10:29.440 --> 00:10:36.320 i'm understanding correct so a big part of the training gaps the inconsistencies and whatever 00:10:36.320 --> 00:10:44.800 else was a part of that that you found connected to use of force uh was meant to be helped and 00:10:44.800 --> 00:10:52.000 remedied by this particular officer in the position that uh he's serving him 00:10:52.000 --> 00:10:58.400 it's a big part of that that this officer his his responsibility is to make sure that everybody 00:10:58.400 --> 00:11:03.200 receives their training yes sir he delivers that training but particularly connected to some of 00:11:03.200 --> 00:11:09.120 the use of force inconsistencies that you guys found gaps in yes yeah all it took place well i 00:11:09.120 --> 00:11:15.920 i think it'd be wonderful if we could at some meeting have the opportunities talk to him given 00:11:15.920 --> 00:11:23.440 that he's uh uniquely dedicated to this area that we're tasked to be thinking about together 00:11:29.360 --> 00:11:37.120 yes one more one more question yes sir was there any um as you dug into the material was there any 00:11:37.120 --> 00:11:48.560 um in regards to the discipline or the the sustained complaints internally or externally 00:11:48.560 --> 00:11:55.360 that have been made around use of force were there any gaps that you found that sort of or gaps maybe 00:11:55.360 --> 00:12:03.040 the wrong word but consistencies that you found there in in regards to you know we've got the new 00:12:03.040 --> 00:12:08.800 guy training it's going better it's much more consistent and yet in regards to these use of 00:12:08.800 --> 00:12:15.520 force complaints that are sustained here's some common threads that we're continuing to see 00:12:15.520 --> 00:12:24.000 despite all the good healthy steps we've taken i think i'll i'll yield this question to the chief 00:12:24.000 --> 00:12:29.360 i think he he he's prepared to answer that question for you thank you thank you dr rams you're welcome 00:12:29.360 --> 00:12:44.320 good evening so to your answer but no we did not find any gaps the the inconsistency that we found 00:12:44.320 --> 00:12:51.600 in the beginning was an inconsistency of consistency so being able to do it annually on a schedule 00:12:54.000 --> 00:12:57.040 that's where the gap was it wasn't the quality it was the quantity 00:12:57.040 --> 00:13:05.600 so that's what that's what we found when we were doing the analysis of it so so even the more recent 00:13:05.600 --> 00:13:12.800 you know that list that we were given i don't have it right next to me this time but that of the 00:13:12.800 --> 00:13:17.600 internal and external complaints you know about use of force whether it was tasers or some other 00:13:17.600 --> 00:13:22.720 things that were sustained and then last week as we talked about you know part of the discipline 00:13:22.720 --> 00:13:29.120 sometimes is more training you know around those like particularized training i was wondering 00:13:29.120 --> 00:13:36.480 if there was any consistent in in those episodes if there was any consistent hey this is 00:13:36.480 --> 00:13:43.520 this is getting missed consistency consistently with with tasers or with use of force that was 00:13:43.520 --> 00:13:59.200 more what i was trying to get at okay those were the two items that we had noted for follow-up from 00:13:59.200 --> 00:14:03.360 the last meeting unless there's any further questions or follow-up items that committee 00:14:03.360 --> 00:14:12.960 members had were here yes fam so will we be able to speak to this individual then chief 00:14:13.840 --> 00:14:20.560 will he be able to come in and speak to us yes if he at the end of this meeting we'll 00:14:20.560 --> 00:14:25.040 get whatever questions you have so he can be prepared to talk to you about whatever you want 00:14:25.040 --> 00:14:32.400 okay thank you sir certainly 00:14:38.400 --> 00:14:43.760 sarah did you have anything else nope that is all so and move into the next item okay so we're 00:14:43.760 --> 00:14:48.560 moving to item c which has received public comments from citizens regarding their input 00:14:48.560 --> 00:14:55.440 on use of force policies and training on their experiences and stories with the denton police 00:14:55.440 --> 00:15:03.360 department um i want to remind you to only ask questions of clarifications of the caller so we 00:15:03.360 --> 00:15:12.000 will be able to allow most of the comments that we have so we will start with the first caller 00:15:12.000 --> 00:15:19.040 okay we're calling the first caller back okay 00:15:19.040 --> 00:15:29.440 and chair english i also did want we also do want to mention that um the police department has a 00:15:29.440 --> 00:15:35.680 victim services counselor on hand so anyone who speaks and provides a comment if they would like 00:15:35.680 --> 00:15:41.280 to talk to that counselor afterwards we can get them connected by phone separately with that counselor 00:15:41.280 --> 00:15:47.600 true and there's a spanish translator here tonight as well in case anyone needs assistance 00:15:47.600 --> 00:15:50.320 all right thank you sarah 00:15:57.520 --> 00:16:00.560 give us just a second and we will get them queued up 00:16:00.560 --> 00:16:05.920 mr hud spitz i saw you here a minute ago where did you go 00:16:05.920 --> 00:16:10.660 is it 00:16:10.660 --> 00:16:20.240 yeah i'm not gonna mess with that because i'll uh be missing i got room he's on screen too 00:16:20.240 --> 00:16:28.800 madam chair okay but his picture's not up okay i don't want it up 00:16:28.800 --> 00:16:37.920 we need some inspiration brother yeah we want to see you willy i'm inspired every time i see you 00:16:37.920 --> 00:16:51.520 man yeah i've i've seen those emails don't talk don't tell me something 00:16:51.520 --> 00:16:54.640 yeah i'm listening i'm listening everybody say hi to willy 00:16:57.120 --> 00:17:09.040 all of your fingers up all of your fingers uh chief you didn't return my call so 00:17:09.040 --> 00:17:15.120 i'm gonna have to deal with you would you like to meet directly after this or in the morning 00:17:15.840 --> 00:17:27.440 yes i had a question before this meeting but i'll deal with it later 00:17:27.440 --> 00:17:39.280 i'm uh chair english i'm glad you uh communicated that we are just to listen 00:17:40.080 --> 00:17:47.840 and ask clarification questions only yes we are we're gonna get it right willy i have some 00:17:47.840 --> 00:17:54.400 issues i'd like to bring to the table but i've been told that this is not the platform for that 00:17:54.400 --> 00:18:01.600 this is not um well here is our first caller hello caller hi there how are you guys tonight 00:18:01.600 --> 00:18:09.040 okay um i'm gonna go fast i spoke with you guys um last meeting as well and i wanted to 00:18:09.040 --> 00:18:14.400 tell you i'm sorry what is your name sir it's michael motes okay hold on one second because 00:18:14.400 --> 00:18:20.720 we got to get you um and and hang on one second okay 00:18:20.720 --> 00:18:31.200 what is your name and address for the record it's michael motes and it's 1201 cleveland street and 00:18:31.200 --> 00:18:41.200 they live in denton okay and you know you have four minutes i do okay go ahead okay so like i said i 00:18:41.200 --> 00:18:45.120 spoke with you guys last meeting there was something i noticed and uh there were a couple more things 00:18:45.120 --> 00:18:50.160 i wanted to touch on because i went over last time and so wanted to call back uh the first 00:18:50.160 --> 00:18:55.760 thing i wanted to talk to you guys about that i think is worth looking at is i know that ultimately 00:18:55.760 --> 00:19:02.320 the city has the responsibility to oversee the denton police department i i would be curious to 00:19:02.320 --> 00:19:10.320 look at what if any law is in place or potential contracts that allow other police departments 00:19:10.320 --> 00:19:17.120 outside of the texas rangers or the state troopers and or the sheriff's department to come into the 00:19:17.120 --> 00:19:25.040 city limits and potentially pull people over for speeding potentially issuing tickets i in the last 00:19:25.040 --> 00:19:32.720 week have seen um a gentleman from the north lake police department come into the city limits and 00:19:32.720 --> 00:19:40.720 pull someone over so you know obviously as a police department we can only hold our department 00:19:40.720 --> 00:19:47.360 accountable but i want to know when outside jurisdictions come into the city what accountability 00:19:47.360 --> 00:19:55.200 do they have to our city because if another city is coming in and doing things like north lake 00:19:55.200 --> 00:20:00.400 police department pulling people over or our guile potentially pulling people over within those city 00:20:00.400 --> 00:20:08.320 limits i have questions about that the other thing i wanted to to mention was um regarding the 00:20:08.320 --> 00:20:15.600 trainings that were spoken about earlier today when you talk about they have the option to go 00:20:15.600 --> 00:20:23.840 in and do these trainings on demand i would ask what is the requirement or are they being required 00:20:23.840 --> 00:20:28.640 to go into these trainings if there is a complaint filed against the police officer are they being 00:20:28.640 --> 00:20:34.080 required to go in and do these trainings because we can have these trainings available all day long 00:20:34.080 --> 00:20:39.520 but then the question becomes how many of them are actually taking advantage of those trainings 00:20:39.520 --> 00:20:45.360 how many people are actually using those trainings and benefiting from them um rather than just being 00:20:45.360 --> 00:20:48.800 available because i know and i'm a college student i'm a grad student now this is a little bit 00:20:48.800 --> 00:20:55.680 different but if a if a professor tells me i have an optional assignment traditionally it is not 00:20:55.680 --> 00:21:02.880 something that i would go and do optionally um and so that those are the two things i just i really 00:21:02.880 --> 00:21:08.240 wanted to ask you guys about tonight was outside jurisdictions coming in whether it be the courts 00:21:08.240 --> 00:21:12.400 whether it be the states i know that in the last meeting there were some issues about jurisdiction 00:21:12.400 --> 00:21:17.520 between the district attorney's office and what the city of denton handled um you know when you 00:21:17.520 --> 00:21:23.680 have outside departments coming in whether it be the the troopers whether it be other cities whether 00:21:23.680 --> 00:21:29.200 it be the sheriff's office what accountability do they have do we get those report that information 00:21:29.200 --> 00:21:33.840 that they do what they issue a citation or whatever does that information then get reported to the 00:21:33.840 --> 00:21:38.240 city of denton do we have that information available is it included in the numbers that are 00:21:38.240 --> 00:21:43.280 being reported to the committee and are those considerations being taken into consideration 00:21:43.280 --> 00:21:50.240 because even if they're not um even if they're not acting on behalf of the city it is still 00:21:50.240 --> 00:21:55.840 valuable information especially if it's happening within the city limits so that's all i have for 00:21:55.840 --> 00:22:00.560 you guys tonight i just those are the two things i really wanted to address all right any questions 00:22:04.480 --> 00:22:06.160 um thank thank you 00:22:06.160 --> 00:22:16.160 we're waiting for our next caller 00:22:16.160 --> 00:22:30.320 hello hello it's jim beaver hi can you state your um name and address mr beaver 00:22:31.280 --> 00:22:39.840 yes my name is jim beaver aka james d beaver age 88 a four and a half year citizen of denton 00:22:39.840 --> 00:22:49.520 residing at 2820 wind river lane okay go ahead okay madam chairman and english and committee 00:22:49.520 --> 00:22:55.600 members i thank you for allowing me to address the issue that you're charged to study for your 00:22:55.600 --> 00:23:01.920 study i'll present for your consideration two issues that relate to the use of force by policemen 00:23:01.920 --> 00:23:07.040 issues that to my knowledge have not been addressed by your previous meetings 00:23:07.040 --> 00:23:15.280 neither by the media nor by politicians the issues are the rebellion of arrestees at the point of 00:23:15.280 --> 00:23:22.960 arrest and the crime rate of american whites and blacks i am not a racist i have many good friends 00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:29.440 including african americans white and others of various ethnicities and races who would vouch for 00:23:29.440 --> 00:23:36.800 the fact that i am not a racist and i faithfully vote i'll be using the word arrestee as an all 00:23:36.800 --> 00:23:44.240 inclusive of red white black yellow green or purple human beings thankfully most policemen 00:23:44.240 --> 00:23:50.800 are trained to overcome whatever forces they encounter and it is my opinion that the arresting 00:23:50.800 --> 00:23:56.640 policemen are often pushed to their limit of humane treatment by the arrestee's rebellious 00:23:56.640 --> 00:24:03.200 action to resist arrest unfortunately there are to my knowledge no rest statistical records 00:24:03.200 --> 00:24:09.440 that report point of access actions there is public evidence of a few videos focused on the 00:24:09.440 --> 00:24:15.760 events of rebellion at the point of arrest you've seen them on television with my limited time to 00:24:15.760 --> 00:24:21.280 four minutes i will not recall them to your attention here except for one the george floyd 00:24:21.280 --> 00:24:27.440 incident and the portion of the point of arrest video what do you suppose would have been the 00:24:27.440 --> 00:24:33.920 result of all these arrestees who would have humbly submitted to the authority of officers 00:24:33.920 --> 00:24:41.520 relative to that i believe that the george floyd case does not truly reflect the character of any 00:24:41.520 --> 00:24:47.440 police department i also believe that the policeman who at the point of arrest exhibited inhumane 00:24:47.440 --> 00:24:53.280 treatment of mr floyd and should be tried and if judged guilty received a due and just punishment 00:24:53.280 --> 00:25:00.240 rendered the second issue worth of your consideration is this us crime rates of blacks and whites data 00:25:00.240 --> 00:25:08.800 extracted from the 2018 fbi uniform crime report form 43a reveals the following white population 00:25:08.800 --> 00:25:17.920 crime rate is 2.1 percent the black population crime rate is 4.7 percent that black americans 00:25:17.920 --> 00:25:24.080 rate is over two times greater than the white's crime is terrible and that's why it's important 00:25:24.080 --> 00:25:30.400 in my opinion for you to deal with that problem locally in fact it is my opinion that it merits 00:25:30.400 --> 00:25:36.480 much more attention than dealing with the alleged misuse of force by policemen and my heart goes 00:25:36.480 --> 00:25:41.760 out to the black people in our community and elsewhere racism is a problem that must be dealt 00:25:41.760 --> 00:25:50.160 with and is two-sided it's a two-way street ponder that it has existed since adam and eve 00:25:50.160 --> 00:25:55.600 american history has proved that governmental actions have not resolved and will not resolve 00:25:55.600 --> 00:26:04.320 our issue of racism why because racism is a moral issue yes racism is a moral issue a heart issue 00:26:04.320 --> 00:26:10.720 of what one believes about the sanctity of life racism can only be compromised by national 00:26:10.720 --> 00:26:17.040 reformation in matters of morality established on solid fixed truth that truth on which our nation 00:26:17.040 --> 00:26:23.680 was founded scripture not relativism has now taught by our public education institutions 00:26:23.680 --> 00:26:32.160 jesus said i am the way of truth follow my example thank you very much thank you mr beaver does anyone 00:26:32.160 --> 00:26:42.000 have any questions or comments from mr beaver i did have a question uh madam chair yes sir 00:26:42.000 --> 00:26:47.360 mr beaver thank you for your uh comments can you give us the source of those 00:26:47.360 --> 00:26:55.280 statistics that you offer to us please yes i did tell you that those statistics came directly from 00:26:55.280 --> 00:27:02.480 the fbi uh let me see if i can get back and get the correct uh annunciation or the 00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:11.760 correct description it's the fbi uniform crime report form 43a 00:27:11.760 --> 00:27:19.440 they produce that once a year and i think quarterly also 00:27:22.560 --> 00:27:31.840 okay and who had a who had a question one more question katina hello sir um do the statistics 00:27:31.840 --> 00:27:38.960 that you pulled do they take in consideration the uh criminalization rates of black and brown people 00:27:38.960 --> 00:27:48.080 historically and currently what i quoted to you was from the uniform crime report form 43a 00:27:48.640 --> 00:27:54.640 and that is the basis of i i do have other sources i have examined but this was the one that's 00:27:54.640 --> 00:28:00.640 complete and they give an annual report this is from an annual report i cannot report on what you 00:28:00.640 --> 00:28:07.360 just asked me well i'm asking well let me let me address one let me address it one more time i did 00:28:07.360 --> 00:28:13.760 go back to 2017 and the way you can do that is trace back there's uniform crime reports of various 00:28:13.760 --> 00:28:22.400 years to to get your answer to your question it needs examination i agree okay okay 00:28:22.400 --> 00:28:27.680 okay anyone else have any more questions for mr beaver 00:28:27.680 --> 00:28:33.840 thank you sir for calling in and i thank you all right have a good night 00:28:33.840 --> 00:28:38.960 um we have another caller 00:28:44.160 --> 00:28:45.760 good evening mr campbell 00:28:45.760 --> 00:28:56.800 hello good evening how you doing good how are you i'm doing great doing great 00:28:56.800 --> 00:29:04.080 can you state your name and your address please yes wayne campbell 1410 university drive 00:29:06.160 --> 00:29:15.440 okay go ahead you have four minutes okay well if i had a theme for my talk it'll be better together 00:29:15.440 --> 00:29:21.360 i believe that the citizens of denton and the police department of denton are better together 00:29:21.360 --> 00:29:30.000 we need one another we need to be working together as one i don't believe that um we should demonize 00:29:30.000 --> 00:29:37.440 the police nor should the police demonize the citizens um i've been a resident of denton since 00:29:37.440 --> 00:29:45.440 2014 when my wife and i moved here and we pretty much feel that this is a safe city we've had some 00:29:45.440 --> 00:29:51.280 interaction with the police all positive all legal and lawful and we personally haven't had a problem 00:29:51.280 --> 00:29:57.440 with the police department i have great confidence in our chief um frank dixon i believe that he's 00:29:57.440 --> 00:30:04.080 going to do a great job with our police department um the previous chief i think he did um a decent 00:30:04.080 --> 00:30:11.280 job as well he worked from what i understand pretty closely with the NAACP anytime issues might have 00:30:11.280 --> 00:30:18.240 happened so he seemed like he was trying to make sure our force was a um force that was respectful 00:30:18.240 --> 00:30:25.280 to people and it was also trying to stand by our crime to the best of their abilities but i 00:30:25.280 --> 00:30:31.040 personally and everything i've seen from the denton police in my reaction with them they seem to be a 00:30:31.040 --> 00:30:36.960 good force a professional force um i'm all for improvement sensible improvements that's why i 00:30:36.960 --> 00:30:44.240 definitely supported body cams i definitely support um de-escalation training and i support 00:30:44.240 --> 00:30:51.840 um measures to help our police officers not see people in a biased light um no part no force is 00:30:51.840 --> 00:30:58.400 going to be perfect but i think that this force is good i don't believe that this force is one is um 00:30:58.400 --> 00:31:04.400 systemically racist i am african-american by the way um but i do believe that therefore most part 00:31:04.400 --> 00:31:09.040 fair now i'm not going to say everybody in the force is a great person i don't know everybody and 00:31:09.040 --> 00:31:14.640 i'm sure they're bad apples like there'll be bad apples in any place in city committees or city 00:31:14.640 --> 00:31:20.000 councils or any things that nature but i do believe that most people are trying to do what they can 00:31:20.000 --> 00:31:27.280 to make um the street safe i definitely would be against extremist measures like defunding the 00:31:27.280 --> 00:31:31.920 police i don't think that that would help at all as we see in other cities where crime is 00:31:31.920 --> 00:31:39.040 starting to escalate um that would be a good good idea instead we should not only fund the police but 00:31:39.040 --> 00:31:45.520 fund social services fund education fully fund all the things that really make citizens' lives 00:31:45.520 --> 00:31:51.280 better but this is not the time to demonize the police but a time to look at them and enact 00:31:51.280 --> 00:31:57.040 sensible regulations and procedures that will help the police to be the best they can be they will 00:31:57.040 --> 00:32:03.120 respect the rights of citizens but still be able to fight crime because that's what that's what they 00:32:03.120 --> 00:32:11.040 need to do um finally i'll have to say my heart definitely goes out to the parents of Darius um 00:32:11.040 --> 00:32:18.080 Tabber um that was such a tragic um tragic loss of life and i don't believe that those officers 00:32:18.080 --> 00:32:25.120 woke up that day saying we're going to kill a man um just because he's black the i looked at the 00:32:25.120 --> 00:32:32.160 video of it and things definitely spiraled out of control and nobody knew those cops did not know 00:32:32.160 --> 00:32:37.920 his state of mind or what he was facing what he was about they did not know they acted in the best 00:32:37.920 --> 00:32:43.920 manner they could in a short time that happened he was asked repeatedly to put down um the weapons 00:32:43.920 --> 00:32:50.080 which he didn't and unfortunately his life's lost and it's a tragedy that someone that young 00:32:50.080 --> 00:32:54.960 with so much potential had to go but i don't believe that that was something that was 00:32:54.960 --> 00:33:01.360 intentional i think it was tragic but i don't think that that is something that we can demonize 00:33:01.360 --> 00:33:07.600 our force over so in a nutshell guys we're better together as police department i hope that you guys 00:33:07.600 --> 00:33:14.160 come up with sensible procedures that will help our force be the best it can be i think that on 00:33:14.160 --> 00:33:19.680 the whole the force has done a decent job the city's relatively safe in my opinion i lived in 00:33:19.680 --> 00:33:27.360 three states but seems to be a very safe relatively safe city okay mr campbell i'm sorry your your time 00:33:27.360 --> 00:33:36.640 is up does anyone have any questions for mr campbell thank you mr campbell for calling in 00:33:38.240 --> 00:33:41.120 you're welcome you guys have a great day all right you too thank you 00:33:41.120 --> 00:33:49.840 we're queuing up the next call 00:33:49.840 --> 00:33:56.240 hello hi can you state your name and your address please 00:33:57.600 --> 00:34:07.760 yes good evening my name is rita brent reinhart my address is 1817 westminster street apartment 203 00:34:07.760 --> 00:34:14.880 danston okay mr reinhart you'll have four minutes and once we get you started you'll have four 00:34:14.880 --> 00:34:19.920 minutes and then if they have any additional questions they'll ask you so you can start now 00:34:21.440 --> 00:34:31.440 okay i am calling about okay i'm calling about the matter in danton of defending the police 00:34:31.440 --> 00:34:40.320 and i am totally against that we need more funding for the police they need more training more police 00:34:40.320 --> 00:34:47.680 officers we've seen what has happened in cities across the united states that have defunded the 00:34:47.680 --> 00:34:58.640 police there's more crime in new york los angeles seattle portland the seattle police chief quit 00:34:58.640 --> 00:35:10.160 this is a political agenda which puts into risk the safety of the public and of the police officers 00:35:11.200 --> 00:35:20.800 also i will vote with greg abbott on freezing the taxes the property taxes 00:35:20.800 --> 00:35:27.120 all across the state for those cities that defund the police 00:35:27.120 --> 00:35:36.800 and um so i think that's about all i've got to say about it i'm against it completely 00:35:37.920 --> 00:35:41.680 all right thank you for calling in does anyone have any questions for our caller 00:35:41.680 --> 00:35:50.080 thank you miss reinhart okay thank you have a good evening 00:35:50.080 --> 00:35:58.480 and we're queuing up our next our next person 00:36:02.880 --> 00:36:11.200 hello caller hi hi how are you i'm great can you state your name your address 00:36:11.200 --> 00:36:20.000 yes this is janette sorbelo and i live at 205 willowstone street here in denton miss sorbelo 00:36:20.000 --> 00:36:25.520 we're going to give you four minutes and once you get started i will um give let you four minutes 00:36:25.520 --> 00:36:30.800 and if anyone has any additional questions then they'll ask um when your four minutes is up okay 00:36:31.920 --> 00:36:39.120 that sounds good all right you can go now okay i want this is janette sorbelo and i want to express 00:36:39.120 --> 00:36:45.520 my support for the denton police department we know that law and order gives us security 00:36:45.520 --> 00:36:54.160 and we want to raise our children in a safe environment we need the police department for 00:36:54.160 --> 00:37:02.960 that security they keep the citizens and the streets safe we aren't fearful because we can 00:37:02.960 --> 00:37:10.720 rely on them to keep order they help when people are in distress and i appreciate that they put 00:37:10.720 --> 00:37:23.600 their lives on on the line every day for us okay do you have anything else one you have you have more 00:37:23.600 --> 00:37:32.480 time i know i just we just need them okay does anyone have any questions for our caller 00:37:32.480 --> 00:37:39.920 all right no one has any questions thank you so much for calling in and have a great evening 00:37:41.360 --> 00:37:46.480 all right bye-bye 00:37:46.480 --> 00:37:56.720 okay we'll take a quick break for a second while they're queuing up the caller 00:37:56.720 --> 00:38:07.680 pardon me hi caller yes my name is terry vogue can you state your your address terry 00:38:09.280 --> 00:38:18.560 can i give you my address it's 2001 south ridge drive okay 76205 thank you terry you're 00:38:18.560 --> 00:38:23.760 going to have four minutes to speak and i'll let you know when you can get started and go 00:38:23.760 --> 00:38:33.760 okay go now yes okay i'm just calling because i'm concerned of something i saw 00:38:33.760 --> 00:38:44.800 book that someone is making a motion or whatever to defund our police department and i am thoroughly 00:38:44.800 --> 00:38:53.280 and completely against that i've lived in denton since 1985 this is a peaceful town and i think 00:38:53.280 --> 00:39:00.240 it's peaceful because we do have a good police department i think if anything they're under 00:39:01.040 --> 00:39:08.720 funding and i do not want to see any defunding of the police department and i think it's a bad 00:39:08.720 --> 00:39:15.040 ideas in the cities that have done it i think there is just we're just asking for anarchy 00:39:15.040 --> 00:39:25.040 and i hope that the city of denton city council has the good sense not to follow bad judgment 00:39:27.280 --> 00:39:32.240 and that's all i have to say all right thank you does anyone have any questions for our caller 00:39:32.240 --> 00:39:39.120 well thank you for calling in and have a good evening thank you all righty 00:39:39.120 --> 00:39:52.560 madam chair in general uh i would like to see if the callers had any input regarding the 00:39:53.200 --> 00:40:00.800 use of force hang on okay caller yes hi can you state your name and your address please 00:40:00.800 --> 00:40:10.320 this is lee shanglin and it's 4000 fiscal hill and then okay lee you'll have four minutes to speak 00:40:10.320 --> 00:40:17.040 and you can start now okay first time i would just want to let you know i've been a resident 00:40:17.040 --> 00:40:24.560 of denton for the past 24 years in that time i have utilized 911 and the police only a few times 00:40:24.560 --> 00:40:31.520 but each time under the circumstances they were good experiences unfortunately i have received 00:40:31.520 --> 00:40:38.160 a few traffic tickets um but again every time a police officer has always been outstanding 00:40:38.160 --> 00:40:44.240 through my years in denton i've served on the board of numerous non-profit organizations 00:40:44.240 --> 00:40:50.080 and i have given thousands of hours of community service one thing that stands out in my mind is 00:40:50.080 --> 00:40:56.160 the kindness and generosity i have witnessed with the denton police department and denton county 00:40:56.160 --> 00:41:02.160 sheriff's office through various non-profits i have witnessed many law enforcement officers giving 00:41:02.160 --> 00:41:07.280 their time to serve and help their community i think it is important to remember that police 00:41:07.280 --> 00:41:13.760 officers are not just a badge they're not a cop car and they're not a gun they are human beings 00:41:13.760 --> 00:41:19.440 like the rest of us they feel like the rest of us and they have hearts like the rest of us 00:41:19.440 --> 00:41:26.400 they do much good in this world like the rest of us except unlike most of us they put their lives 00:41:26.400 --> 00:41:33.760 on the line and they do that to protect us and because of this i feel that they have the right 00:41:33.760 --> 00:41:44.720 to protect themselves and have the right to have use of force as they see fit i feel that it is 00:41:44.720 --> 00:41:52.240 important that the chief and people within the department are the ones who determine what that 00:41:52.240 --> 00:42:01.920 is where the line is drawn and how they protect their side their selves in their lives this leads 00:42:01.920 --> 00:42:12.160 me to a point also that i want to make quickly and there is a particular city council person that has 00:42:12.160 --> 00:42:22.240 an agenda that is not the same as the agenda of this group this person wants to demonize the denton 00:42:22.240 --> 00:42:31.440 police department and they will go to any length to appear to be a martyr for her constituent 00:42:32.480 --> 00:42:38.880 even if that means she has to lie or make up stories about law enforcement or law enforcement 00:42:38.880 --> 00:42:45.840 officers this particular city council member will also go to such lengths as to line up her buddies 00:42:45.840 --> 00:42:53.120 to call into this committee each time you guys need to bash the denton police department it's 00:42:53.120 --> 00:42:59.760 the same tactic she uses with the denton city council meetings i'm asking that you please keep 00:42:59.760 --> 00:43:05.920 in mind that this organizing of presenting lies and distortions is happening by an attention 00:43:05.920 --> 00:43:12.720 seeking city council member and as difficult as it might be try to decipher between truthful and 00:43:12.720 --> 00:43:20.960 false statements this particular city council member is so anti-police that she has gone as far 00:43:20.960 --> 00:43:28.160 as to call this weekend's rally in denton to support police officers a clan meeting she's 00:43:28.160 --> 00:43:35.360 publicly posted this on facebook and she has posted that these people attending the rally 00:43:35.360 --> 00:43:42.800 should leave their hoods at home she even went further stating that the denton police department 00:43:42.800 --> 00:43:48.960 is toxic and stated that she doesn't understand why anyone would become a police officer there 00:43:48.960 --> 00:43:54.640 she then encouraged denton police officers to speak out against their department promising 00:43:54.640 --> 00:44:00.880 her support and backing there's the cancer that wants there to be trouble with the denton police 00:44:00.880 --> 00:44:08.640 department she wants you to believe that there are issues and she is going to great lengths to 00:44:08.640 --> 00:44:17.360 sway your opinion that way thank you for your time thank you um does anyone have any questions 00:44:17.360 --> 00:44:26.560 for our caller katina hello do you think it's possible that she this person that you're speaking 00:44:26.560 --> 00:44:33.840 of that she doesn't have some type of uh hold on that people actually have their own minds and 00:44:33.840 --> 00:44:41.760 opinions um it sounds like you're putting um the responsibility of people having opinions other 00:44:41.760 --> 00:44:48.400 than yours on this one person's shoulders as if everyone isn't a a free thinker 00:44:48.400 --> 00:44:55.360 i guess i'm not sure i understand your question 00:44:55.360 --> 00:45:06.720 well i'm just a little surprised to hear like i've never heard where someone would call in and talk 00:45:06.720 --> 00:45:13.760 about a person i thought you were so supposed to be talking about issues but you're you're you went 00:45:13.760 --> 00:45:20.320 down this bullet list about this city council person and all but said her name so my question is 00:45:20.320 --> 00:45:26.400 is she solely responsible for all the other the opinions that differ from yours is she 00:45:26.400 --> 00:45:35.840 i wouldn't say all of them but i know that she uh lines up and encourages uh people to call in to 00:45:36.720 --> 00:45:40.320 um put in false information 00:45:40.320 --> 00:45:48.320 and what i'm just saying is be aware and just be just be aware of that 00:45:48.320 --> 00:45:51.840 thank you miss shanklin 00:45:51.840 --> 00:46:05.360 thank you yes willy i want to remind us why we're here well mr willy i asked a question 00:46:05.360 --> 00:46:12.320 don't come with me and i have another one while we're at it and i have and i have some too but i 00:46:12.320 --> 00:46:18.240 that's not where we're here i asked a question and my question is a legitimate question mr willy i 00:46:18.240 --> 00:46:25.760 didn't attack the woman i didn't do what you did in the last meeting i mean you challenge what she 00:46:25.760 --> 00:46:34.480 thought just her thoughts that's what she put the she put the whole of uh everything that's going on 00:46:34.480 --> 00:46:40.960 and didn't i wanted to know it's i mean because you attacked a person in a public forum which i 00:46:40.960 --> 00:46:47.120 think i didn't realize the forum was for that but they all called her name i have a right to know 00:46:47.120 --> 00:46:54.640 that she think this person is that influential or can people think for themselves that's a legitimate 00:46:54.640 --> 00:47:00.720 question yeah you have my second question is are people going to be allowed to call in and 00:47:01.360 --> 00:47:11.360 like attack people or give their thoughts without yes yes this is this is a distinction mr willy 00:47:11.360 --> 00:47:18.160 well well i'm confused then i thought we were just here listening and then we're going and asking 00:47:18.160 --> 00:47:24.160 questions which is what i or clarification i digress okay all right then i don't know what to do 00:47:24.160 --> 00:47:30.000 well i've got some some firemen questions i want to ask okay well this is not this hold on willy 00:47:30.720 --> 00:47:36.160 like i said that's not what this is for easy no it's not yes camion 00:47:36.160 --> 00:47:50.320 i just wanted to share with the caller i believe i wrote oh really okay well i just wanted to share 00:47:50.320 --> 00:47:56.880 because i think a few people on here might not even know what she's talking about or who so i 00:47:56.880 --> 00:48:02.240 just wanted to publicly share that that's not necessary we were just getting clarity and 00:48:02.240 --> 00:48:06.640 everybody said what they had to say we have another caller on hold and we can discuss this 00:48:06.640 --> 00:48:12.640 after we're done all i'm saying is that we have one city council member that's been a part of 00:48:12.640 --> 00:48:18.640 these meetings that has had input and it's jesse davis and we haven't had any input from any other 00:48:18.640 --> 00:48:27.120 city council members that's all i wanted to say well jesse is a part of this of this group and 00:48:27.120 --> 00:48:33.040 he hasn't had much input he's here to listen and to clarify whatever questions that we have 00:48:33.040 --> 00:48:42.800 as so as the police chief so it's designed for that it's not that every city council person 00:48:42.800 --> 00:48:48.080 will call in here and have their own opinion or whatever that's not what this group is for 00:48:48.800 --> 00:48:51.280 so we're going to move on to the next caller 00:48:51.280 --> 00:48:55.840 go ahead 00:48:55.840 --> 00:49:02.400 good evening caller 00:49:02.400 --> 00:49:11.280 yes my name is tom silver i live at 2201 long middle street here in denton hi and i was just 00:49:11.280 --> 00:49:17.280 calling mr silver we're going to give you four minutes and then um you can start now 00:49:18.960 --> 00:49:22.240 okay well i just called because i'm one of those that would like to see 00:49:22.240 --> 00:49:29.280 the i don't want to see the our police officers handicapped because when they get handicapped 00:49:29.280 --> 00:49:34.080 unfortunately i feel like the citizens of denton would be handicapped so i would like to i i don't 00:49:34.080 --> 00:49:40.320 believe in defunding them do i believe that our police officers are doing a good job overall in 00:49:40.320 --> 00:49:46.000 the city of denton i believe that they are i don't think that any police force or any police officer 00:49:46.000 --> 00:49:52.080 or any clergy member or any firefighter or any military person is above reproach but in the same 00:49:52.080 --> 00:49:58.480 instance i think that overall these police officers in our city do a pretty good job so i would rather 00:49:58.480 --> 00:50:07.040 them see them not defunded by any means um if it takes a little education as far as dealing with 00:50:07.040 --> 00:50:12.960 people and stuff that would be okay but i can't see taking away funds just to take away funds if 00:50:12.960 --> 00:50:19.760 you know what i mean i know that many of you in this in this account this group that's here 00:50:19.760 --> 00:50:26.320 understand uh discrimination i do i happen to be a mexican american that has been discriminated 00:50:26.320 --> 00:50:31.520 against in the past but that doesn't necessarily mean that i let that rule my life or dominate 00:50:31.520 --> 00:50:39.200 every thought what what i do think that makes sense is for us to do the best that we can to see that 00:50:39.200 --> 00:50:44.880 we provide our police force with the best that we can give them so they can give the best protection 00:50:44.880 --> 00:50:50.640 to us the citizens of denton so uh that's basically in a nutshell what i wanted to say 00:50:50.640 --> 00:50:58.320 i'll wait for any comments that you guys might have thank you mr silver does anyone have any 00:50:58.320 --> 00:51:08.560 comments for mr selva i just had a quick question this is lillian okay can you can you just clarify 00:51:08.560 --> 00:51:16.960 for me what do you what do you think it means to defend the police okay i would think that you would 00:51:16.960 --> 00:51:20.320 take away i know i know you won't take away all their funding but you would take away some of 00:51:20.320 --> 00:51:24.560 their funding that they might be able to use for equipment that they could use for to better protect 00:51:24.560 --> 00:51:30.800 themselves and us citizens that's what i think defunding is if i'm wrong then i stand corrected 00:51:32.880 --> 00:51:38.560 no i i mean then someone else can jump in too i think you're right it's not taking away everything 00:51:38.560 --> 00:51:42.400 because a lot of people have been calling in and talking about defending it's not dismantling the 00:51:42.400 --> 00:51:47.680 police department it's not taking away you know enormous amounts of money it's just reallocating 00:51:47.680 --> 00:51:52.000 some of those funds to maybe other places where there isn't enough funding that would maybe 00:51:52.000 --> 00:51:56.800 decrease their workload i just want to make sure that the people that talk are understanding that 00:51:56.800 --> 00:52:03.920 yes yes any any uh in order to fully comply with the texas open meetings act using this format we've 00:52:03.920 --> 00:52:11.280 got to see people's faces the videos um so if we could just uh ask that i realized that lillian's 00:52:11.280 --> 00:52:17.040 trying to um juggle two things at one time but the state law is pretty clear that using this technology 00:52:17.040 --> 00:52:24.400 we have to see people's faces for the visual recording thank you yep thank thank you thank you 00:52:24.400 --> 00:52:27.600 mr silver does anyone else have any questions for mr silver 00:52:27.600 --> 00:52:36.480 thank you for calling in mr silver thank you y'all have a blessed evening all right you too 00:52:36.480 --> 00:52:46.880 we're going to take a five minute break um we are trying to get a hold of the last caller 00:52:46.880 --> 00:52:52.160 and we need to do a couple of technical things here so five minutes 00:52:55.280 --> 00:53:03.760 okay thank you everyone for um coming back we are going to continue our meeting we were unable to 00:53:03.760 --> 00:53:11.200 get the last caller um who was calling in and we are going to move to the next item of the agenda 00:53:11.200 --> 00:53:18.240 which is item d receive a report and hold a discussion regarding proposed topic areas related 00:53:18.240 --> 00:53:24.240 to the use of force in the denton police department including a police officer and a police officer 00:53:24.240 --> 00:53:31.040 including internal affairs training accreditation and compliance police policy and use of force and 00:53:31.040 --> 00:53:39.520 provide staff direction on finding or recommendations by topic is that you sarah that is me um hi chair 00:53:39.520 --> 00:53:44.880 english and committee members um so what we'd like to do during this item is we've shared a lot of 00:53:44.880 --> 00:53:49.600 information with the committee members over the last couple months and there's been some questions 00:53:49.600 --> 00:53:55.040 in terms of how do we move forward and transitioning to discussing conclusions and recommendations 00:53:55.040 --> 00:54:00.720 and so i put forward kind of a draft framework and timeline for the remaining committee meetings 00:54:00.720 --> 00:54:04.480 and like to review that with the committee members at this time so let me go ahead and 00:54:04.480 --> 00:54:10.000 pull up that presentation it was also shared with you through email just prior to the meeting 00:54:15.920 --> 00:54:20.720 okay so jumping right in um this is what we're proposing for the remaining meetings 00:54:20.720 --> 00:54:25.760 and we have two that are left to be held on september 3rd and september 10th and we're 00:54:25.760 --> 00:54:32.400 also proposing to add one additional meeting on september 17th and hold if we need another one in 00:54:32.400 --> 00:54:38.800 september 24th and so to walk you through um our next meeting is on september 3rd we would recommend 00:54:38.800 --> 00:54:44.400 having the entire meeting be set aside for the committee to discuss any conclusions and 00:54:44.400 --> 00:54:50.480 recommendations in regards to use of force policy and training and i'll go over a few more slides 00:54:50.480 --> 00:54:56.960 that will kind of set up the committee to discuss that at the next meeting but i'll continue through 00:54:56.960 --> 00:55:02.960 and seeing what the future meetings look like so then in september 10th and we'd kind of do part two 00:55:02.960 --> 00:55:08.560 which would be in regards to use of force review and transparency any feedback conclusions 00:55:08.560 --> 00:55:14.160 recommendations you have in those areas and then mike cronic our city attorney would also present 00:55:14.160 --> 00:55:18.880 some information that was requested from the committee in regards to civilian oversight boards 00:55:18.880 --> 00:55:24.000 following those two meetings staff would go back and draft a report that would be delivered to the 00:55:24.000 --> 00:55:29.520 committee and then on september 17th we would review that draft report with the committee 00:55:29.520 --> 00:55:34.160 and potentially finalize it if needed though we could hold an additional meeting on september 00:55:34.160 --> 00:55:41.520 24th to finalize that report to present to city council and then sometime in early october that 00:55:41.520 --> 00:55:47.600 report and recommendations would be presented to city council and so before i go into the slides 00:55:47.600 --> 00:55:51.440 that will kind of provide a framework for the september 3rd meeting so that the committee 00:55:51.440 --> 00:55:57.280 members are prepared to discuss use of force policy and training i'll bring down the presentation 00:55:57.280 --> 00:56:02.480 to see if committee members have any questions or recommendations regarding that timeline and framework 00:56:06.400 --> 00:56:18.320 yes willie uh who will be the person or persons who will assist us in determining 00:56:18.320 --> 00:56:23.040 what we've agreed on in other words manage that 00:56:23.040 --> 00:56:31.600 meeting who will who which person or persons will be is going to be selected to manage that meeting 00:56:34.080 --> 00:56:41.360 i think it's that process yeah i think it'll be a combination of chair english as well as staff 00:56:41.360 --> 00:56:47.200 helping to provide that support in terms of what are some recommendations or conclusions 00:56:47.200 --> 00:56:52.000 that have majority or just some others that have been suggested by committee members as well 00:56:52.000 --> 00:56:58.800 that's who again uh chair english as well as city staff 00:57:02.560 --> 00:57:11.200 well i i don't agree with that but i don't know that i have any place other than just won't be here 00:57:11.200 --> 00:57:23.280 but uh so okay well i guess is there feedback um committee member hutzpeth i will be trying to 00:57:23.280 --> 00:57:29.600 determine if there is a majority or consensus amongst some of the items there are people that 00:57:29.600 --> 00:57:35.360 when we were as i said before who assisted us when we were looking for the chief 00:57:35.360 --> 00:57:43.360 uh not yeah the chief and the city manager they were professionals they knew they didn't have a 00:57:43.360 --> 00:57:54.480 they didn't they weren't part of trying to communicate anything for us they were just 00:57:55.040 --> 00:58:02.320 there to listen to what we had to say and to steer us in a direction where we could 00:58:02.320 --> 00:58:09.920 say something collectively to respond to what the the city council has asked us to do and so if you 00:58:09.920 --> 00:58:17.120 have someone like that who is not part of the committee and what what we are trying to do as 00:58:17.120 --> 00:58:21.920 far as make making that recommendation i think it will go better you just they're just taking the 00:58:21.920 --> 00:58:28.400 information we give them they've been trained on how to do this and i think it would be 00:58:28.400 --> 00:58:33.760 more effective to get us to the point where we need to be uh quicker 00:58:33.760 --> 00:58:40.960 hold on uh john baines has a comment and then you carry me on 00:58:40.960 --> 00:58:51.680 uh we're at a we're at a critical juncture here and we have a lot of information that's been 00:58:52.080 --> 00:58:58.480 communicated so far and to get our arms around it i have a couple of suggestions 00:58:58.480 --> 00:59:10.160 and i do hear you mr hutzpeth um let me just kind of um i hate to use a 25 cent word but let me let 00:59:10.160 --> 00:59:16.640 me just talk for just maybe a minute minute and a half i'll see if i can get it out what i'd like 00:59:16.640 --> 00:59:26.320 to see us do is two things each of us needs to come up with uh written suggestions in categories 00:59:26.320 --> 00:59:34.480 uh preferably if if uh sarah if you could get us the various categories 00:59:34.480 --> 00:59:42.160 and then we can respond in writing and also give us a chance to have a five minute 00:59:44.240 --> 00:59:51.600 or four minute just like the other input people to kind of communicate our thoughts and then i'd 00:59:51.600 --> 00:59:58.480 like to see all that information put in a matrix where we go through the matrix and we vote on we 00:59:58.480 --> 01:00:02.800 want to include this so we don't want to include that and it's just going to take some time but 01:00:02.800 --> 01:00:09.760 that's kind of a three-pronged uh approach i see because we got so much we got a lot of opinions 01:00:09.760 --> 01:00:14.160 but we're going to need to boil it down to something in writing each of us needs to do that 01:00:14.160 --> 01:00:20.720 and also have a chance to communicate uh any areas that need a little additional information 01:00:20.720 --> 01:00:28.480 and then we lastly once you have a matrix of suggestions then we go through and and yes or no 01:00:28.480 --> 01:00:32.000 and then come up with a final conclusion so that's my input thank you 01:00:34.560 --> 01:00:43.760 camya yeah i just wanted to say i think that willy is saying that it would help us if we had like a 01:00:43.760 --> 01:00:49.840 facilitator that's not a part of the group that can help like lead the discussion draw out all 01:00:49.840 --> 01:00:55.600 the themes that come up from us put them into a digestible draft that we can then turn into a 01:00:55.600 --> 01:01:02.640 report that they can help us write um the second thing that i wanted to say and i think that would 01:01:02.640 --> 01:01:09.120 be helpful also the second thing that i wanted to say is i guess it's more of a question i have a 01:01:09.120 --> 01:01:15.680 document kind of like what mr baines is speaking of it's not into categories but i have a document 01:01:15.680 --> 01:01:21.440 of draft things that i'd like included in the oversight board a draft statement that i'd like 01:01:21.440 --> 01:01:28.240 presented as a part of the report some drafts of changed um policies that we were presented on 01:01:28.240 --> 01:01:37.360 what is the best way for me to share that information with the entire group or yeah so like 01:01:37.360 --> 01:01:46.960 i i did the the thing that we were given for the three top categories um but it's not going to fit 01:01:46.960 --> 01:01:51.680 everything else i have right so what is the best way to do that and ensure that it's shared with 01:01:51.680 --> 01:01:56.960 the group or should i just hold on to it till we meet and like read it aloud you know what i'm 01:01:56.960 --> 01:02:01.680 saying i'm trying to figure out what's the best way to do that stuff if some of us have been 01:02:01.680 --> 01:02:07.920 doing some research on the policies that we have been presented yeah there's probably a 01:02:07.920 --> 01:02:12.720 few different ways to go about it i guess i can propose um that if committee members do for the 01:02:12.720 --> 01:02:17.840 next meeting on september 3rd we're going to be discussing policy and training in those areas 01:02:17.840 --> 01:02:24.080 if you have any um suggestions that you would like to share with all your fellow committee members 01:02:24.080 --> 01:02:30.080 to get those to me by friday august 28th just by email i can compile that into one document 01:02:30.080 --> 01:02:35.920 to share with the committee in advance of the september 3rd uh meeting and that can also be 01:02:35.920 --> 01:02:42.720 used then if as a discussion to help facilitate that discussion i don't know if city manager 01:02:42.720 --> 01:02:48.320 haleman has anything to add in terms of no i think that's exactly right we've tried to break it down 01:02:48.320 --> 01:02:53.600 into um digestible topics i think it was kind of a question jamie brought up last week is how we're 01:02:53.600 --> 01:02:58.880 going to work through these issues and um i think that first one on the policies procedures that 01:02:58.880 --> 01:03:05.040 sort of thing what we really want to understand from the committee is what um you know what 01:03:05.040 --> 01:03:10.480 suggestions do you have that uh you know trainings that you feel like we're not covering um that you'd 01:03:10.480 --> 01:03:15.280 like us to add into the portfolio that sort of thing i've set aside additional funding through 01:03:15.280 --> 01:03:20.560 the next year's budget as well to to try to accommodate uh chief dixon and um and provide 01:03:20.560 --> 01:03:24.800 him some additional dollars to implement new training opportunities as well so it would be 01:03:24.800 --> 01:03:31.600 helpful uh based on all the trainings that they have developed recently um in all the updates to 01:03:31.600 --> 01:03:36.000 the policies if you think that there's still areas that that we haven't addressed sufficiently 01:03:36.000 --> 01:03:41.840 that really is the focus of the next meeting is to give you the you the floor and just say look you 01:03:41.840 --> 01:03:48.240 know we we see that there's progress we we think that we're missing x what what is that and so we 01:03:48.240 --> 01:03:53.760 can have that discussion with the committee and have those recommendations on the training use 01:03:53.760 --> 01:03:58.720 of force continuing those sorts of things in another week or two it's going to be critical 01:03:58.720 --> 01:04:04.480 that we allow michael kronegg our attorney and expert in 143 and that meet confer contract to 01:04:04.480 --> 01:04:09.200 talk to you a little bit about about oversight before we get into that discussion some of the 01:04:09.200 --> 01:04:13.040 things that we're seeing in other communities are just not allowed under the state law in denton 01:04:13.920 --> 01:04:19.280 since we're 143 city or under our meet confer contract so he will help you set that context 01:04:19.280 --> 01:04:24.960 that doesn't mean that there's not ways of getting there in in other forms that there's there's not a 01:04:24.960 --> 01:04:30.320 way to address it but rather than spend a lot of time on things that just simply can't even be 01:04:30.320 --> 01:04:36.560 met from a legal perspective we want to at least allow you the opportunity and give you uh some 01:04:36.560 --> 01:04:40.720 training on his end and then set aside another meeting or two for you to continue kicking that 01:04:40.720 --> 01:04:46.080 item around so we realize these are big issues but what we're really interested right now in the 01:04:46.080 --> 01:04:51.520 training use of force everything that you've seen what are we missing and then we'll get into the 01:04:51.520 --> 01:04:56.080 oversight as well and and just talk about what would you like to see what are some ideas that 01:04:56.080 --> 01:05:01.600 we kick around and i have a few slides that i can share with you that kind of wrap up the policy and 01:05:01.600 --> 01:05:06.720 training areas and provide the links to all the documents we've provided again and give you some 01:05:06.720 --> 01:05:12.960 probing questions to help committee members um become prepared for september 3rd or to send 01:05:12.960 --> 01:05:17.280 some of those recommendations to us in advance in regards to that i can go over those next after 01:05:17.280 --> 01:05:25.840 taking the remaining questions from the committee oh we can't hear you both 01:05:25.840 --> 01:05:32.800 there was uh thanks for putting this together in uh obviously 01:05:35.040 --> 01:05:41.120 there's something that's sort of shaping i think um in your own minds as you're listening to us 01:05:41.120 --> 01:05:45.280 obviously what you're saying this seems like this would be a good direction and i think even one of 01:05:45.280 --> 01:05:51.280 you either you sarah or todd you last week said hey it's pretty clear as we're listening to some 01:05:51.280 --> 01:05:58.960 things that are coming up that are being repeated could you maybe tell us a little bit about what 01:05:58.960 --> 01:06:03.760 those things are that therefore shaped what you're presenting to us tonight even in regards to your 01:06:03.760 --> 01:06:08.000 recommendations about how to best sort of organize this for just what you're hearing what you've 01:06:08.000 --> 01:06:13.600 heard even as kind of like willy's talking about you know you're sitting in and listening and you've 01:06:13.600 --> 01:06:18.400 helped us here and there but you've done a lot of listening and so uh that'd be helpful to hear i 01:06:18.400 --> 01:06:24.400 think what i would like to do is ask sarah she's she's got a slide uh put us we kind of anticipated 01:06:24.400 --> 01:06:29.440 this question and and um i'd like to have her pull that up so you can sort of see how we're thinking 01:06:29.440 --> 01:06:34.480 this through we'll pull it down and if you don't if you don't like it you want to uh change the 01:06:34.480 --> 01:06:37.920 way we're thinking about it we're open to it but we just felt like it's always easier to sort of 01:06:37.920 --> 01:06:43.520 edit someone else's work and try to give you some idea of what we're thinking um but why don't we 01:06:43.520 --> 01:06:49.200 ask sarah to kind of pull that up and we'll take you through it okay one second i'll pull back up 01:06:49.200 --> 01:06:56.960 the powerpoint um so these next um three three slides that i'm going to go through they're just 01:06:56.960 --> 01:07:02.560 kind of a quick review of the policy training accreditation and compliance information and that 01:07:02.560 --> 01:07:08.480 we have provided to you and then the very final slide is some of those questions um for consideration 01:07:08.480 --> 01:07:12.880 some of the main inquiries we've heard some of the themes we've heard that might help facilitate 01:07:12.880 --> 01:07:19.120 the committee's discussion around policy and training um so these next few slides again are 01:07:19.120 --> 01:07:22.560 just intended to help the committee members if there's anything that you want to go back 01:07:23.360 --> 01:07:28.560 re-look at as you're kind of considering um your own recommendations and suggestions 01:07:28.560 --> 01:07:33.440 we've taken each area just kind of summarize some of the main themes that you've heard 01:07:33.440 --> 01:07:40.080 so for policy in terms of all the policies and general orders that were updated since chief 01:07:40.080 --> 01:07:45.520 dixon started him using the lexical system and all of its benefits and all the substantial 01:07:45.520 --> 01:07:50.320 improvements that have made have been made to including all of the resource links so you can 01:07:50.320 --> 01:07:56.720 access again all of the general orders the presentations um the q a's that we've had um 01:07:56.720 --> 01:08:01.680 his recent report on august 13th which included some more information regards to policy if you 01:08:01.680 --> 01:08:07.440 haven't seen it it actually compares um our old general orders prior to 2018 to the new current 01:08:07.440 --> 01:08:11.760 general order so you can see some of the improvements that have been made um and then 01:08:11.760 --> 01:08:17.920 to your right here are the list of specific use of force related policies that chief dixon has 01:08:17.920 --> 01:08:22.880 reviewed with the committee members so if there's any specific language changes that you would like 01:08:22.880 --> 01:08:28.000 to see in these policies again that would be helpful for committee members to review and send 01:08:28.000 --> 01:08:32.960 in any suggestions they might have by august 28th so we can compile those for the committee 01:08:32.960 --> 01:08:41.040 discussion so this is in regards to policy those guidelines that our officers use and then it kind 01:08:41.040 --> 01:08:46.480 of connects policy into training how do we train our officers then to use that and use their 01:08:46.480 --> 01:08:51.520 discretion and make sure that they are prepared when they are providing service to our community 01:08:51.520 --> 01:08:57.360 and so a lot of information was presented here as well in terms of the basic the academy that 01:08:57.360 --> 01:09:02.720 officers go to when they are a new officer from the ongoing training that they receive from the 01:09:02.720 --> 01:09:08.400 legislative mandated training including all of the department mandated training a lot of that has 01:09:08.400 --> 01:09:14.240 changed and increased in the last two years and just by example the chart to the right includes 01:09:14.240 --> 01:09:20.240 those mandated trainings that chief dixon has implemented which include a number of themes 01:09:20.240 --> 01:09:27.200 including de-escalation some new courses including persons with autism and then also just 01:09:27.200 --> 01:09:32.480 reinforcing you know his mission and vision in terms of how our police department does business 01:09:32.480 --> 01:09:39.040 what are the expectations of our police officers and how do we best serve this community and then 01:09:39.040 --> 01:09:44.000 kind of as we talked about in training to the the peer support team that has been in place for over 01:09:44.000 --> 01:09:49.280 a year to make sure that we are providing for officer wellness and and looking at things that 01:09:49.280 --> 01:09:53.520 may be trigger points and helping to make sure that our officers are well supported as well 01:09:53.520 --> 01:09:59.360 and here are the links again if you want to look at any of the information a lot of that information 01:09:59.360 --> 01:10:04.720 came last week including the presentation report and then as well as the q a document that was 01:10:04.720 --> 01:10:08.880 provided there are a lot of great questions from the committee members at the last meeting and so 01:10:08.880 --> 01:10:13.920 we tried to summarize some of those answers into that q a document for your reference if you want 01:10:13.920 --> 01:10:19.360 to go back and take a look and see if there was any suggestions you had while we were having those 01:10:19.360 --> 01:10:26.480 discussions and then just this third area in terms of accreditation and compliance it kind of supports 01:10:26.480 --> 01:10:32.400 both policy and training so what are the best practices in policy and training and then every 01:10:32.400 --> 01:10:37.920 other aspect of the police department as well but this is really important moving forward in terms of 01:10:37.920 --> 01:10:44.800 ensuring that we are constantly evaluating and comparing to the evolving and best practices 01:10:44.800 --> 01:10:50.160 legislation and so forth so that we continue to evaluate and update those and make sure that 01:10:50.160 --> 01:10:55.440 we're remaining within best practices and so that tied really closely to the policy and the training 01:10:55.440 --> 01:11:02.480 areas as well and then included here are the links that you see which some more information that dr 01:11:02.480 --> 01:11:08.880 williams had provided so that kind of is all the review again just kind of providing a resource for 01:11:08.880 --> 01:11:14.880 committee members to go back and review these areas if you would like to lead into a discussion 01:11:14.880 --> 01:11:20.480 regarding policy and training overall these were just some questions we came up with that might 01:11:20.480 --> 01:11:27.200 help to foster that discussion for the committee and also just as you're individually considering 01:11:27.200 --> 01:11:32.560 things in the two weeks prior to the next meeting so how do you have any concerns with the general 01:11:32.560 --> 01:11:40.000 orders are we missing something do you have any recommendations for specific policy language that 01:11:40.000 --> 01:11:44.320 you feel should be revised or that could be improved or that could provide more clarity for 01:11:44.320 --> 01:11:50.000 the officers and the public as well do you feel that there are any training gaps or opportunities 01:11:50.000 --> 01:11:53.600 are there things we're still missing or are there things that you think maybe it just needs more 01:11:53.600 --> 01:11:59.760 volume more quantity and if so what types of trainings are those is it more in de-escalation 01:11:59.760 --> 01:12:05.520 is it in mental health diversity inclusion those are a lot of themes that we heard through last 01:12:05.520 --> 01:12:10.880 week's discussion as well as prior meetings in terms of what resources are we giving to our 01:12:10.880 --> 01:12:15.840 officers to make sure that they're the best equipped to deal with these difficult situations 01:12:15.840 --> 01:12:20.960 that they might find themselves in and then just are there any recommendations regarding support 01:12:20.960 --> 01:12:27.760 for officer wellness or the last one just kind of broadly any recommendations regarding enhancing 01:12:27.760 --> 01:12:32.000 of reporting of information to the public or is there something we can be doing differently in 01:12:32.000 --> 01:12:38.560 terms of public education to describe to our community how the police department operates in 01:12:38.560 --> 01:12:43.680 terms of general operations but then more specifically use of force why it would be needed 01:12:44.640 --> 01:12:51.520 how it is reviewed how you can report a concern and so forth and so that's kind of just a 01:12:51.520 --> 01:12:57.280 framework we had laid out and welcome to hear any input or suggestions as we kind of transition 01:12:57.280 --> 01:13:04.320 into that next meeting so boze it gets back to your question earlier that that discussion on 01:13:04.320 --> 01:13:08.720 policies training gaps that sort of thing we've tried to give some leading questions so we can 01:13:08.720 --> 01:13:13.520 actually start heading the direction that willy was talking about with getting you know what are 01:13:13.520 --> 01:13:19.520 those common themes we can try to get those organized for you as a jumping off point we can 01:13:19.520 --> 01:13:23.920 certainly assign somebody to moderate that meeting just in terms of looking for themes but this is 01:13:23.920 --> 01:13:30.960 really we've sent a lot of information your way you've seen a lot of the progress that's been made 01:13:30.960 --> 01:13:36.640 but that doesn't mean everything's been covered camion brought up a comment a couple weeks ago 01:13:36.640 --> 01:13:43.200 about you know she'd like to see more specific lgbtq training we had heard jamie talk about more 01:13:43.200 --> 01:13:48.880 training you know for folks with disabilities so what does that mean and one of the things i've 01:13:48.880 --> 01:13:54.320 asked the chief to do is to you know try to also work with the universities and say if we want to 01:13:54.320 --> 01:13:58.800 create some different kind of trainings like that you know what kind of resources can we pair up 01:13:58.800 --> 01:14:04.400 with in order to meet this committee's recommendation so we're trying to give you some leading questions 01:14:04.400 --> 01:14:09.600 giving you all the policies we've talked at you a lot but now it's kind of you know we really need 01:14:09.600 --> 01:14:14.880 to hear what you what you think and what we might be missing so we can help you get your thoughts in 01:14:14.880 --> 01:14:21.360 order looking for those gaps and those training policies and procedures and then i think the next 01:14:21.360 --> 01:14:30.560 remaining part of september and in october we can talk about the the actual any oversight 01:14:30.560 --> 01:14:34.240 recommendations as well there's going to be a lot of meeting conversations and we want to get you 01:14:34.240 --> 01:14:39.200 educated in what we can and can't do and then get out of your way so we can kind of organize 01:14:39.200 --> 01:14:43.760 it the way you want but we really need your thoughts up front if we're going to use your time wisely 01:14:43.760 --> 01:14:46.400 willy 01:14:46.400 --> 01:14:55.600 you got to turn it on willy we can't hear you 01:14:55.600 --> 01:15:05.120 there you go i want this time that i'm allowing to interrupt what i'm i need to be doing other 01:15:05.120 --> 01:15:15.120 than this to be beneficial i i i'm a a person that says that thinks this is what i'm asked 01:15:15.120 --> 01:15:22.640 to do and i just i just look at that and then i decide okay this is what i think we should do 01:15:22.640 --> 01:15:30.240 and i've heard from the people in this committee and each one of us do that every one of us is 01:15:30.240 --> 01:15:39.600 doing that so i think i think what mr bain said what katrina said what bo was speaking to is 01:15:39.600 --> 01:15:45.840 we need somebody to pull this together let me give you an example of what i'm struggling with 01:15:45.840 --> 01:15:52.240 right now the charge is and like i say i'm driven with what are you asking me to do 01:15:52.880 --> 01:16:01.280 to develop a report of clear findings lord help me we're gonna get something clear out of this 01:16:01.280 --> 01:16:10.240 clear findings conclusions an achievable recommendation there's no way well all of 01:16:10.240 --> 01:16:16.640 this information that we've been i've been given heck i can't even i can't there's no way i can 01:16:16.640 --> 01:16:22.560 keep up with all of that but some of you can i'll bet you there's some things that you have heard 01:16:22.960 --> 01:16:29.440 that really communicates to you and you want to address that somehow a facilitator would help us 01:16:29.440 --> 01:16:36.400 there's only one thing for example that i want to recommend to the to the chief and to the city 01:16:36.400 --> 01:16:44.880 council on use of force one thing i don't i'm going to allow the rest of you to address whatever you 01:16:44.880 --> 01:16:51.040 want to address okay so if i only have one thing and i'm going to suggest that we do that who is 01:16:51.040 --> 01:16:58.320 going to pull us together with that who's going to hear me and all of what you have to say and then 01:16:58.320 --> 01:17:05.760 pull it together in something that's recommended and achievable who is going to do that we will 01:17:05.760 --> 01:17:11.680 certainly work with you to do that what we will certainly work with you to do that i'm i'm happy 01:17:11.680 --> 01:17:16.800 to even have staff sit down with each of you one on one and get your thoughts so we can get a running 01:17:16.800 --> 01:17:22.320 start on this if that helps things that's a point i didn't think about that and willy we'll even get 01:17:22.320 --> 01:17:28.560 two for you two staff people to work with you you know but if that's what you think but we'll you 01:17:28.560 --> 01:17:37.600 know i i realize i realize this john bain said three for willy i realize this seems like a heavy 01:17:37.600 --> 01:17:42.560 academic lift but we can certainly sit down and just kind of talk you through it compile it and 01:17:42.560 --> 01:17:47.120 i think the best way what any what any moderator is going to do is basically say here's everything 01:17:47.120 --> 01:17:52.080 you've told me let's just seal it down and let's start working through as a committee do you agree 01:17:52.080 --> 01:17:56.720 disagree chief has this already been covered or not what ideas do you have and so i think if we 01:17:56.720 --> 01:18:02.240 can do that and everybody will agree to give our team an hour or two of your lives over the next 01:18:02.240 --> 01:18:07.280 week we can get prepared for that you bet and i will tell you one other thing that we sort of glossed 01:18:07.280 --> 01:18:13.600 over was was the one thing that became very apparent to all of you the first couple to us 01:18:13.600 --> 01:18:18.960 from your comments was just how are we reporting you know you weren't real pleased with the data 01:18:18.960 --> 01:18:25.280 right you know the first couple meetings so chief dixon's actually already started implementing a 01:18:25.280 --> 01:18:31.040 system that he's heavily copied out of san antonio which is very robust much more searchable for the 01:18:31.040 --> 01:18:38.800 information you all wanted to see and and so we're i'm sorry so so we're so that that's how we're 01:18:38.800 --> 01:18:43.920 sort of listening to you and adapting and it's been really good for us because sometimes it can 01:18:43.920 --> 01:18:48.080 be we can become an echo chamber as well so just through the questions that you're asking us 01:18:48.080 --> 01:18:52.400 he's already running and trying to get the data out there in the format you want to see it in the 01:18:52.400 --> 01:18:57.600 public hand so i feel like i feel like that needs to be something we need your feedback on is some 01:18:57.600 --> 01:19:02.640 of the internet improvements or website improvements he's made we need your improvement we need your 01:19:02.640 --> 01:19:08.800 updates on and your input for a running start on the training programs and the that sort of 01:19:08.800 --> 01:19:13.840 thing and then we'll get into the oversight after the next several meetings but our idea would be 01:19:13.840 --> 01:19:19.280 to put everything in in a fashion there to where we can turn it over to you and let you talk to us 01:19:21.280 --> 01:19:29.600 okay um lillian and then camia yeah i i think that um and someone said it earlier i mean if 01:19:29.600 --> 01:19:34.160 each of us on the committee i think if i would like to hear i know that you're saying is suggesting 01:19:34.160 --> 01:19:39.200 that each committee member talked to staff but i would like to hear what other committee members 01:19:39.200 --> 01:19:44.320 have to say so maybe if we could push back the meetings and the next time that we meet that we 01:19:44.320 --> 01:19:48.560 would allow each of us maybe to have the four minutes like like others did just to kind of 01:19:48.560 --> 01:19:53.440 share and kind of just kind of process everything together as a committee because 01:19:53.440 --> 01:19:57.120 there's lots of conversations that we could have between the people that are calling in but we don't 01:19:57.120 --> 01:20:02.000 out of respect for them but i still feel like we need to process some things together as a committee 01:20:02.000 --> 01:20:06.880 before we even go into recommendations or anything like that yeah i think we're saying the same thing 01:20:06.880 --> 01:20:12.080 though i mean if we can if we can sit down with each of you and and say you know here's our here's 01:20:12.080 --> 01:20:16.800 everything that came out put it into a matrix for you and say you know what we forgot about this it 01:20:16.800 --> 01:20:21.680 may spur other ideas things but the idea would be to put that together for all of you to talk 01:20:21.680 --> 01:20:27.840 through together it can't if it's just freewheeling it without any structure where you're going to get 01:20:27.840 --> 01:20:31.520 very frustrated camion 01:20:31.520 --> 01:20:44.320 here i can't we can't hear you sorry okay um first i want to say thank you 01:20:44.320 --> 01:20:54.560 to sarah for what seems like a pretty good digested uh recounting of the questions that we had and the 01:20:54.560 --> 01:20:59.520 the things that we wanted to review so i really appreciate that work and the powerpoint that you 01:20:59.520 --> 01:21:05.280 did and the leading questions that's going to be very helpful um i tried to click on some of 01:21:05.280 --> 01:21:10.560 the links in the pdf that you sent the only one that i could get to open was the one to the 01:21:11.120 --> 01:21:16.480 denton police department link so i was wondering if you could like maybe just send us an email with 01:21:16.480 --> 01:21:24.240 those links because that would be helpful and this is slightly unrelated but is there a way that 01:21:24.240 --> 01:21:31.680 someone can send us like the open meetings act information just so that we know okay that would 01:21:31.680 --> 01:21:35.440 be helpful because i feel like there's a couple meetings where we're learning new things about it 01:21:35.440 --> 01:21:40.240 and i'd like to know i didn't know i couldn't have my camera off you know for instance so 01:21:40.240 --> 01:21:45.120 i'd like to know because sometimes i'm eating back here right and so this is on the internet 01:21:45.120 --> 01:21:51.840 forever and you know what i'm saying so i'm like i'd like to know like what what my responsibilities 01:21:51.840 --> 01:21:57.280 are while i'm on here so as long as as long as that thank you for that as long as we have a quorum 01:21:57.280 --> 01:22:04.480 uh you know it's fine that we have enough cameras on but um if you're asking a question you need to 01:22:04.480 --> 01:22:08.400 be seen and so if you could just kind of remember that if you're if you need to turn it off we've 01:22:08.400 --> 01:22:13.040 got a quorum and eat that's fine but if you're asking questions that people have to see you asking 01:22:13.040 --> 01:22:20.560 them so does that sound fair to everyone that we'll we'll break off to last two or three of 01:22:20.560 --> 01:22:25.040 our staff to kind of sit down with you go through work our way through the questions that um that 01:22:25.040 --> 01:22:29.760 sarah shared with you and then kind of organize that into a matrix for you to talk about i mean 01:22:29.760 --> 01:22:34.320 there could be a lot of these issues once we go through them that that are either in progress or 01:22:34.320 --> 01:22:39.120 we're partly there that you might want us to simply add modules for instance john are you are you 01:22:39.120 --> 01:22:45.440 waving your hands on yes madam chair i was i was wanting to get a copy of that document that 01:22:45.440 --> 01:22:50.320 sarah just just showed on the screen have we received that already or is it something that 01:22:50.320 --> 01:22:56.800 is to come i i sent it by email i think around five right before the committee meeting 01:22:56.800 --> 01:23:02.320 i can share again i'll recheck the links um and make sure they all function and then 01:23:02.320 --> 01:23:06.640 resend them again sorry about that if it's in there i'll go back and look my my assistant 01:23:06.640 --> 01:23:11.120 gave me some documents i did not remember that one so thank you yes and see 01:23:11.120 --> 01:23:19.520 yeah madam chair uh honestly i want to say that i don't i'm not certain that we probably should 01:23:19.520 --> 01:23:25.280 take off next week then because i feel like we might actually run out of time uh discussing the 01:23:25.280 --> 01:23:32.000 remaining items with just two weeks i mean or two more meetings uh one in particular which is not 01:23:32.000 --> 01:23:36.320 to be the elephant in the room is going to be when we discuss the oversight committee i think 01:23:36.320 --> 01:23:40.960 that in and of itself is going to take up the whole two and a half hours that we allot for time 01:23:40.960 --> 01:23:45.760 which means we're not going to be able to really discuss the education or the policy in and of 01:23:45.760 --> 01:23:51.360 itself so my opinion i don't know how that's going to work with staff or anybody else i just don't 01:23:51.360 --> 01:23:56.480 think we should take next week off because here in two weeks i don't think we'll still have a 01:23:56.480 --> 01:24:06.560 consensus of what we were chartered to do and to yancey's point i agree with him if we can impose 01:24:06.560 --> 01:24:12.000 on you but if not we have built in two more meetings and then and then move back our report 01:24:12.000 --> 01:24:18.000 to council until october 5th so um but i agree with him it's going to be a meeting conversation 01:24:18.000 --> 01:24:25.280 and probably not something that'd be achievable in one meeting so are you guys okay with either 01:24:25.280 --> 01:24:30.240 coming back next week or taking a week off and then come back and pushing it back to october 01:24:30.240 --> 01:24:39.520 um just kind of give me a general consensus if you're okay with taking off next week just 01:24:39.520 --> 01:24:48.880 raise your hand up guys if we're okay with taking off next week taking off next week 01:24:48.880 --> 01:24:59.120 you can come back and we've kind of pushed it back yeah what is that gary gary is that a yay or nay 01:24:59.120 --> 01:25:04.480 i agree with yancey i would prefer to meet next week and keep the momentum going 01:25:04.480 --> 01:25:09.600 but you're going to give us two options i just ask a question 01:25:09.600 --> 01:25:15.040 carol i have a board meeting on thursday so i can't meet thursday 01:25:17.040 --> 01:25:20.160 i have class on thursday so be available okay 01:25:20.160 --> 01:25:31.360 i think if we're and going to staff sit down and with each member and kind of interview them 01:25:31.360 --> 01:25:36.160 it might be beneficial to have those two weeks just so we can kind of framework it better for 01:25:36.160 --> 01:25:42.000 september 3rd as long as everyone in the committee could commit to an additional meeting i can pull 01:25:42.000 --> 01:25:48.800 back up the um that first slide that shows the proposed additional meetings um because that would 01:25:48.800 --> 01:25:54.480 be important then to have one more meeting i do think more time will be necessary it's either we 01:25:54.480 --> 01:25:59.360 can fit another meeting in or add that meeting to the end so let me just share that screen 01:25:59.360 --> 01:26:05.200 one more time um to show you what that proposed date looked like 01:26:09.520 --> 01:26:17.360 so it was we do have september 3rd and september 10th scheduled we proposed to add september 17th 01:26:17.360 --> 01:26:23.920 we know that will be necessary and we may even need september 24th to finalize that 01:26:23.920 --> 01:26:28.960 just depending on how long those discussions take on the 10th and the 17th just wanted to 01:26:28.960 --> 01:26:48.800 show that one more time so we have a possibility of four meetings left rather than two even taking 01:26:48.800 --> 01:26:51.600 these weeks off okay yes 01:26:54.560 --> 01:26:59.200 and camion if you want to send us the information to to sarah we'll get we'll get out to everybody 01:26:59.200 --> 01:27:06.160 right away whatever you have but we'll ask we'll we'll we'll ask our staff to sit down with each 01:27:06.160 --> 01:27:10.080 of you for a couple hours if you could make the time and if it if you don't need that long that's 01:27:10.080 --> 01:27:14.400 fine and just try to get it organized to so you can have a productive conversation 01:27:21.440 --> 01:27:32.000 yes angela i think yancy was his hand up was before i'm sorry i didn't see yes yancy 01:27:32.000 --> 01:27:38.080 so i see that we have uh two meetings and a proposed two additional meetings 01:27:38.080 --> 01:27:44.640 my question is uh so if it's going to be a total of four meetings are we going to have like 01:27:44.640 --> 01:27:49.440 three work session meetings and then the fourth meeting is just to finalize the report 01:27:49.440 --> 01:27:53.440 or is that fourth meeting going to be another work meeting and then we're going to have to have 01:27:53.440 --> 01:27:58.320 another meeting in order to finalize the report to bring back to council i'm just trying to get a 01:27:58.320 --> 01:28:04.880 grasp on how these meetings are going to go and uh when when will the finalized report be presented 01:28:04.880 --> 01:28:08.560 to council are we going to continue to work because we're going to have to have a meeting to 01:28:08.560 --> 01:28:16.800 finalize everything yeah we were hoping to have um the uh meeting and on the 24th is sort of that 01:28:16.800 --> 01:28:21.520 last day if we needed to tighten up more recommendations on any of these items that 01:28:21.520 --> 01:28:26.480 we could do it then with the draft report that have it have a report provided to council on 01:28:26.480 --> 01:28:32.800 october 5th at their lunch meeting we really see if we can get all the information from the 01:28:32.800 --> 01:28:38.320 committee members and get it organized well we can probably jump right into many of these topics 01:28:38.320 --> 01:28:44.400 the first meeting or two michael's going to need a solid half a meeting probably to go through some 01:28:44.400 --> 01:28:51.680 of the oversight committee i guess there's kind of a linear continuum of options that from possible 01:28:51.680 --> 01:28:57.280 to not possible before we get into that discussion so we're probably going to need a couple meetings 01:28:57.280 --> 01:29:01.120 for that as well we figured that we'd probably need area all of the meetings if we have to slip 01:29:01.120 --> 01:29:06.720 back we'll talk about it but the idea was to get this report to them no later than their lunch 01:29:06.720 --> 01:29:18.400 meeting in october anybody else having yes willy 01:29:18.400 --> 01:29:28.960 you're on they get uh as far as i'm concerned the suggestion to meet with staff 01:29:28.960 --> 01:29:35.360 just solved all the concerns i have because i'll say to them the one area that 01:29:36.320 --> 01:29:42.400 that i am concerned about and would like to have it in the report somewhere i can just say that and 01:29:42.400 --> 01:29:49.360 then as the city manager said that he will the staff will take all of these things that we're 01:29:49.360 --> 01:29:54.800 saying this is where i where i am and then put them together and then then we have something that 01:29:54.800 --> 01:30:00.240 i think we can just work with and say oh yeah i think that's good right there and just have 01:30:00.240 --> 01:30:06.240 comments about that uh the chief really got my attention what he talked about if these if these 01:30:06.240 --> 01:30:13.680 police officers are asked to take all of this training and the amount of money that it would 01:30:13.680 --> 01:30:20.800 cost to do that and the amount of time it just communicated to me i don't know what i'm talking 01:30:20.800 --> 01:30:28.720 about then if i come in and say you need to do this and my one of my concerns is the required 01:30:28.720 --> 01:30:38.640 training what's required and why when is it required and he said if they're going to specialize 01:30:38.640 --> 01:30:44.000 then they need to have this training so they would decide to take that training instead of 01:30:44.000 --> 01:30:49.120 something else this is these are things that we're just not in positions to know we don't know this 01:30:49.120 --> 01:30:55.280 stuff so i'm not going to waste my time and their time trying to tell them what to do in that area 01:30:55.280 --> 01:31:02.880 there's a general thing about training i want to say in the report as a citizen on the committee 01:31:02.880 --> 01:31:10.480 here's what i'd like to say and i hope it's it's communicated well this is not communicating well 01:31:10.480 --> 01:31:16.160 when you say i just want you to get all the training you can get lord help me what does that mean 01:31:16.160 --> 01:31:23.840 so i think the when i talk to staff i'm pretty sure they'll help me figure out what i'm trying 01:31:23.840 --> 01:31:27.840 to say when i if i have anything to say about training so i think it's a good idea 01:31:27.840 --> 01:31:39.840 yes fronda i just have a question about does the union uh and the department 01:31:39.840 --> 01:31:44.560 they have a memorandum of understanding or memorandum of agreement that we can see 01:31:46.320 --> 01:31:55.360 we can get that out to everyone okay thank you john uh madam chair are we going to have a 01:31:55.360 --> 01:32:01.200 chance for everybody to give their four minutes and you can all listen to one another i'm hoping 01:32:01.200 --> 01:32:07.840 that uh i like lily and i'd kind of like to make sure i hear what others say so if i'm just listening 01:32:07.840 --> 01:32:13.600 to myself uh i don't think i get the benefit of of what others are trying to say so hopefully 01:32:13.600 --> 01:32:19.520 over the next several meetings we'll have a chance to do our four minutes i'm sure we can work that 01:32:19.520 --> 01:32:28.720 in yes angela uh and to piggyback on john baines i guess for clarity what i hear is you want your 01:32:28.720 --> 01:32:36.320 staff members to sit down with each of us to help us articulate what we want to bring to the committee 01:32:36.320 --> 01:32:43.040 me myself i i feel like i'm pretty articulate on my own um and i like mr baines would be really 01:32:43.040 --> 01:32:52.240 interested in hearing as a committee how we feel so i guess i didn't understand why we needed if 01:32:52.240 --> 01:32:56.960 we're going to have that conversation as a committee while we also need to sit down with 01:32:56.960 --> 01:33:03.440 an individual person is that going to be for those who feel like they need help with articulation or 01:33:03.440 --> 01:33:08.240 is everybody going to have to do that i think it's i think it's both i think the idea would be that 01:33:08.240 --> 01:33:14.720 to get everything out there all the ideas are pertaining to to these the first meeting and then 01:33:14.720 --> 01:33:19.520 give you all a chance to to talk as well but at least you've got everything there otherwise what 01:33:19.520 --> 01:33:24.240 happens is we're going to have all these ideas we're going to take another meeting to try to 01:33:24.240 --> 01:33:29.280 organize them and have a discussion on the same ideas so if we can if we can do that work up front 01:33:29.280 --> 01:33:33.760 we can help we can kind of expedite the committee i mean i'm trying to not take take this thing into 01:33:33.760 --> 01:33:38.960 november right so if if we can if we could do both and then just say here's what everybody told us 01:33:38.960 --> 01:33:43.680 here's all the the themes and you know here's areas that are you know we've dealt with already 01:33:43.680 --> 01:33:48.400 here's areas that are missing you all have that and can talk through it i think it's much more 01:33:48.400 --> 01:33:53.200 practical that way otherwise we're just going to be wrapping up your the same comments after that 01:33:53.200 --> 01:33:59.600 meeting next week so is that not what that survey was for where we were asked to give that information 01:33:59.600 --> 01:34:03.920 it is i i think that to be fair i think some people are more comfortable with that than others 01:34:03.920 --> 01:34:09.120 we've only got a couple of them back and and and i think that there's probably a lot of opinions 01:34:09.120 --> 01:34:14.320 like willie's that you know i really we need to sit down and say look is there things missing what's 01:34:14.320 --> 01:34:20.080 important to you take those questions there not not everybody responds to these survey questions 01:34:20.080 --> 01:34:23.840 the same way and so i think just sitting down saying look here's here's what we were told 01:34:23.840 --> 01:34:28.320 you guys you guys have all the information go ahead and continue talking are there things that 01:34:28.320 --> 01:34:32.720 that are missing off the list oftentimes when you have something like that saying you know what 01:34:32.720 --> 01:34:37.440 that spurred another thought and that's not here let's let's talk about it 01:34:37.440 --> 01:34:43.920 but i'm just trying to avoid additional meetings to capture what you're going to discuss next week 01:34:43.920 --> 01:34:50.640 and that way willie gets company and lunch and all the other stuff and so we accommodate him 01:34:53.040 --> 01:35:00.160 yes both so mr baines is your concern lily and you as well um and maybe even you angela that 01:35:00.160 --> 01:35:05.920 because i'm i'm i'm hearing what they're saying in regards to you sit down you get everything out 01:35:05.920 --> 01:35:15.120 they capture it and then we still have four minutes uh in right to to share essentially what 01:35:15.120 --> 01:35:20.640 summarized hopefully in that meeting without the pressure of them having to sort it all out in the 01:35:20.640 --> 01:35:25.520 actual meeting that we shared mr baines is that your concern though that there may be something 01:35:25.520 --> 01:35:32.080 before you sit down with the city staffers that would be helped by you hearing from the other 01:35:32.080 --> 01:35:39.120 committee members is that am i making sense so that therefore if you don't hear us on the front end 01:35:39.120 --> 01:35:44.480 when you sit down with the city staffers it won't be as comprehensive as it otherwise would have been 01:35:44.480 --> 01:35:54.240 in your mind uh thank you uh bo for that request at this point i just hear background noise i hear 01:35:54.240 --> 01:36:04.000 there's a lot of things that have been presented but i'm not really sure i have a feeling of where 01:36:04.000 --> 01:36:12.640 everyone is on the issues so as they give their four minutes i think it will give us a chance to 01:36:12.640 --> 01:36:20.080 to communicate our feeling uh and sometimes the feelings bullet points don't always communicate 01:36:20.080 --> 01:36:26.800 your feelings so even though we will write those uh bullet points down i want to hit your feeling 01:36:26.800 --> 01:36:34.480 and that's why i think it's important that we have a chance to to articulate uh and clarify 01:36:34.480 --> 01:36:39.440 and amplify anything that we write down so that that for me that's what the purpose is i like both 01:36:39.440 --> 01:36:44.240 the writing but i also like the hearing as well but you don't care if that's before or after 01:36:44.240 --> 01:36:51.600 we meet with the city staff it matters not to me i'm okay i'm okay thank you for asking 01:36:51.600 --> 01:36:57.200 i'm the same way to me it doesn't matter if it's before or after i just want to hear what the 01:36:57.200 --> 01:37:02.400 committee members have to say rather than what staff thinks that the committee members said to 01:37:02.400 --> 01:37:08.080 them you know i want to hear straight from the committee members yeah i think this would this 01:37:08.080 --> 01:37:11.280 would be a lot easier if we were able to get together in the room because we'd sit up there 01:37:11.280 --> 01:37:18.400 with a whiteboard and start talking about themes but um this is not the easiest way to do it so 01:37:18.400 --> 01:37:21.920 we're happy to accommodate you both ways and kind of get out of your way 01:37:21.920 --> 01:37:27.840 yes nancy 01:37:27.840 --> 01:37:34.000 uh i don't know if it's possible maybe the chief can chime in or something 01:37:34.640 --> 01:37:39.200 but i think that if we're going to start working together and trying to voice everybody you know 01:37:39.200 --> 01:37:45.760 here here everybody i know for myself i do better with in-person meetings so we got the training 01:37:45.760 --> 01:37:50.800 center i'm not sure if it's open and we can maintain social distancing and all those guidelines 01:37:50.800 --> 01:37:58.880 but for me being able to see somebody and hearing in that way uh i think it's better even if staff 01:37:58.880 --> 01:38:04.640 is there that day we can actually try to hash out a lot of a lot of material as opposed to going 01:38:04.640 --> 01:38:09.200 back and forth and then we have to try to put it in some type of report and now we have to wait 01:38:09.200 --> 01:38:15.120 to next week to discuss it maybe if we have it on the whiteboard like the city manager just said you 01:38:15.120 --> 01:38:19.840 can just jot down these ideas on the whiteboard and we can just go down the list so i don't know 01:38:19.840 --> 01:38:23.360 if it's possible that we can arrange like a meeting place i know the training center is 01:38:23.360 --> 01:38:27.360 is large enough and i'm not sure what the schedule is like but maybe that's an option if 01:38:28.400 --> 01:38:31.360 people are willing to meet in person as opposed to over the zoom call 01:38:31.360 --> 01:38:45.760 so yancy were you saying that um all of us would meet at the at the training center at once 01:38:45.760 --> 01:38:52.720 i just think in-person meetings are better than over the zoom call so in my opinion i think the 01:38:52.720 --> 01:38:56.880 training center i know our training center is large enough to accommodate all of us with the 01:38:56.880 --> 01:39:02.160 social distancing for those that want to practice the social distancing and i'm sure city have a 01:39:02.160 --> 01:39:07.360 spot that we can probably meet if we need to do some type of work session but i think back to what 01:39:07.360 --> 01:39:12.320 the city manager just said that we can write stuff down on the whiteboard and then go down the list 01:39:12.320 --> 01:39:19.280 and start discussing those things as they come up as opposed to we having to let uh staff or sarah 01:39:19.280 --> 01:39:24.400 come up with a form and then she email it out to us and now a whole nother week have passed before 01:39:24.400 --> 01:39:29.280 we even can discuss that we possibly can discuss we can get the discussion out the way that night 01:39:29.280 --> 01:39:39.040 good tana i think that's a great idea and um i also think that it would be great to be 01:39:39.040 --> 01:39:44.960 in the same room with everyone so that we could possibly group up on um like-minded issues that 01:39:44.960 --> 01:39:52.080 we we you know there's five or ten of us that care more about data and you know capturing data as a 01:39:52.080 --> 01:40:00.480 part of the um like excessive force like capturing excessive force data then that that group can group 01:40:00.480 --> 01:40:05.840 together and then another group and we're doing it in a way that's transparent um and accountable 01:40:05.840 --> 01:40:11.120 because we're all together um because i know that you guys have discouraged us from you know gathering 01:40:11.120 --> 01:40:16.160 together outside of the meeting and i i think it would be really helpful for us to come together 01:40:17.440 --> 01:40:22.160 is there anybody that is uncomfortable if we can if we can social distance all of you and 01:40:22.160 --> 01:40:27.280 at the training center and doing it that way it that would that would avoid you know we could 01:40:27.280 --> 01:40:33.360 still do the pre interviews we want but the the reason we set up that process that are suggested 01:40:33.360 --> 01:40:37.680 the way we did is this is it's the only way i think to make this an efficient process if we 01:40:37.680 --> 01:40:44.000 stay on zoom but if if you want us to get if we can find a venue where we can social distance you 01:40:44.000 --> 01:40:49.360 we could probably just means willy's gonna have to yell a little louder but we'll get everybody 01:40:49.360 --> 01:40:54.480 spaced out and can everybody one room it's it's really up to you it's a matter of comfort right 01:40:54.480 --> 01:40:58.240 now some people are a little more worried than others but they're getting out and doing that 01:40:58.240 --> 01:41:04.160 uh todd how many people are we speaking of 01:41:06.720 --> 01:41:15.200 25 or 30 so we've got the rooms to accommodate it we have a room okay just so everyone would know 01:41:15.200 --> 01:41:20.400 i'm a i'm a cancer survivor and i'm almost 70 so i kind of fit into two of those categories so 01:41:20.400 --> 01:41:27.200 i'm a little timid at times so um we'll just see how it goes but that's just me you know others 01:41:27.200 --> 01:41:40.080 may not have those uh yeah understood john thank you ronda yeah i was going to say um 01:41:40.080 --> 01:41:48.320 i don't have any underlying conditions but i am uh older so i'm just wondering if there's a way to 01:41:48.320 --> 01:41:56.400 do a combination of um zoom for those who don't want to you know social distance in a group and 01:41:56.400 --> 01:42:00.160 those others who aren't concerned about it meet face to face 01:42:00.160 --> 01:42:09.280 i think it's possible i mean i was at a chamber meeting this morning and i think half of us were 01:42:09.280 --> 01:42:13.440 there and the other half were on zoom is that correct gary 01:42:13.440 --> 01:42:22.960 yeah it is cheryl but i would tell you being on the zoom unless you're able to communicate both 01:42:22.960 --> 01:42:29.040 ways people on zoom are more watching a meeting as opposed to participating in the meeting 01:42:29.040 --> 01:42:32.080 we'll figure it out 01:42:32.080 --> 01:42:39.360 yeah we're just trying we're just having a discussion here whether we can satisfy the 01:42:39.360 --> 01:42:43.600 open meetings act with doing that i'd have to i probably just need a little bit of time talking 01:42:43.600 --> 01:42:48.080 to our our city attorney's office to see if there's any uh obstacles to that 01:42:50.480 --> 01:42:56.160 there's always an obstacle we'll figure it out yes camya is it possible for people to do a 01:42:56.160 --> 01:43:00.720 phone conference in and be on speakerphone if there's not possibility of video 01:43:00.720 --> 01:43:09.600 is that a part of the open meetings act can people call in yeah i think i think we could 01:43:09.600 --> 01:43:16.160 do that i think that might be easier just as well as we record these meetings so trying to do a dual 01:43:16.160 --> 01:43:23.120 recording of zoom and in person probably doesn't work but if it was in person but on other attendees 01:43:23.120 --> 01:43:29.120 on the phone that that would probably work better just need to investigate it a little further 01:43:29.120 --> 01:43:41.280 let's just um are we done with the last item sarah item e yes okay so let's just um we're going to 01:43:42.640 --> 01:43:49.200 in the meeting and we will kind of reconvene over there and figure it out and and talk with 01:43:49.200 --> 01:43:56.240 todd and sarah and staff and see how we can best accommodate an in-person meeting and get back to 01:43:56.240 --> 01:44:03.840 you guys okay and we'll probably still have staff reach out to you to see if you're interested in 01:44:03.840 --> 01:44:08.960 sitting down and working through those questions if you don't want to that's fine but if you'd like 01:44:08.960 --> 01:44:15.760 to take us up on it it's always easier to have a starting place thank you todd okay that's willy 01:44:15.760 --> 01:44:24.720 we can't hear you willy you got to push the button try to push the button i i do i want 01:44:24.720 --> 01:44:32.480 because it's just simple it only takes me 30 minutes i will say this is what i want here's why 01:44:34.320 --> 01:44:40.640 so communicate that to the committee and then here to staff so staff will say yes i know that's what 01:44:40.640 --> 01:44:48.720 you want i can hear you we can't do that oh and here's why or we can i will tell the committee 01:44:48.720 --> 01:44:57.200 that then i'm good okay now i think lillian had a good point too as well and and uh katrina 01:44:57.200 --> 01:45:03.360 well it really would help me to hear the rest of you i i want to because you'll say something 01:45:03.360 --> 01:45:09.200 in meetings like this i think if we meet individually personally in a group we'll hear 01:45:09.200 --> 01:45:14.400 things that the others are concerned about and it will help us well i think well i didn't think 01:45:14.400 --> 01:45:20.240 about that well yes that is something that i think needs to go into that report to the city 01:45:20.240 --> 01:45:24.480 city council so i think we're we're moving in the right direction i think it's going to help us 01:45:24.480 --> 01:45:32.160 come up with a report that is actionable that can work for the the police department in the city 01:45:32.160 --> 01:45:40.560 so i feel good about that thank you willie will it be recorded if we meet together yes okay 01:45:40.560 --> 01:45:52.400 okay so we're going to adjourn the meeting and um staff sarah will contact you with what what 01:45:52.400 --> 01:45:57.280 conclusions and how we get this worked out um and then we'll see you at the next meeting 01:45:58.080 --> 01:46:02.560 okay and i'd like a suggestion for brother bang to not to wear that hat without getting 01:46:02.560 --> 01:46:08.480 me one like it i like that he doesn't wear he is very good so i want a hat like that 01:46:08.480 --> 01:46:11.920 i got two for you brother i got two 01:46:11.920 --> 01:46:21.120 all right good night everybody