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 good evening i'm calling the meeting to order for the city of denton use of force ad hoc committee

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 today is thursday august 20th it is six oh three and we will start with the first item on the

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 agenda which is to consider the approval of use of force ad hoc committee meeting minutes

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 for august 13th 2020 um if you've read over the minutes and you don't have any um any changes or

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 any discussions i'll need a motion motion made ronda made the motion and is that a second pam

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 second yes second and if all approved um you can just raise your hand and hold it up for a few

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 minutes so we can get everybody john john baines are you approving the minutes okay

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 all in favor say aye got your hand okay uh non-opposing motion carries

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 the next item is item b is review and discuss following items from the previous committee

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 meeting on august 13th lillian um this is if you want to we have a quorum so if you want to take

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 this off you can thank you thank you so madam chair what time we're starting we just started

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 six oh three

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 chair english i can uh introduce the second item so this is a follow-up from the last meeting

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 we included in your backup kind of a summary of all the questions that the committee had and

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 some of the answers that staff provided we did have two questions where we noted that we needed

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 to follow up with the committee the first question was question number six in your backup and that's

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 in regards to the training that officers receive on disabilities including hearing impairments and

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 visual impairments so deputy chief frank pageant is here to address that question and follow up from

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 last meeting you're on mute yet deputy chief

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 there we go is that better okay there's one in every meeting isn't there um yeah the question

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 was whether officers receive training on disabilities excluding autism hearing impairments

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 and visual impairments while some of that training is scattered throughout various courses

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 there's a specific class the samuel allen law or senate bill 976 what took effect september 19th

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 or i mean i'm sorry september 1st 2019 it created a tico course understanding communication

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 impediments for law enforcement the course addresses the communication impediments that

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 people with disabilities may have when they contact or are contacted by law enforcement

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 and the course makes officers aware of those impediments you know those impediments

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 say a lack of eye contact or a slow response to questions because someone is processing the answer

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 or processing what the officer has told them those can be interpreted by officers as suspicious

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 activity or avoidance so this course lets officers know there's other causes out there

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 for these actions the individuals can also put communication impediment on the back of their

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 driver's license so that when an officer has the license he can look at it she can look at it

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 and see that the the person has this communication impediment they can also discreetly attach it to

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 their vehicle registration so when they're pulled over say by an officer the officer pulls them over

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 checks the tag when the tag return will return and tell the officer that the person may have

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 trouble communicating so the officer can go and make the first contact and know that

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 you know there's an issue here with communication and i need to be aware of that

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 the disabilities that are included in this course include parkinson's disease

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 mild intellectual disability speech and language disorders

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 down syndrome and brain injury and it does include the autism spectrum disorders

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 any questions for deputy chief pageant okay seeing none we'll go to the second follow-up

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 item that we had and that was in regards to question 19 bo had asked about training gaps

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 regarding use of force so dr williams is going to provide some more information in regards to that

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 item good evening everyone it's good to be back with you again

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 all right so i did some homework did ever can everybody see the screen

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 and the last week i had a little trouble with my screen but everybody got it this time so good thank

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 you so much i passed uh so just some follow-up regarding your question your question regarding

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 what gaps were identified or in the use of force training and uh what i found was that the the

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 response to resistance training the defensive tactics training it was inconsistent uh

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 it was inconsistent because of different reasons staffing reasons uh some funding reasons but uh

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 the department was taking actions to address those things and actions that were taken were that the

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 training budget has been increased and to address the staffing issue the department selected and

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 dedicated a full-time defensive tactics instructor to provide regular training to all sworn officers

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 so that that erased that inconsistency so not as one officer that is his sole job is to provide

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 responsive resistance defensive tactics training

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 additional actions that that have been taken by the departments that all sworn personnel are

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 currently now receiving and or scheduled to receive the following annual training they're receiving

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 de-escalation training response to resistance defensive tactics training they're receiving

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 scenario-based training to build on critical thinking skills they're receiving emergency

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 vehicle operations training and they're receiving fair and impartial policing training the explicit

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 and implicit bias training for all sworn not just the sworn personnel but also the non-sworn personnel

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 as well all officers now have access to what we call open mat training to improve and maintain

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 their proficiency in response to resistance and defensive tactics and what we mean by open mat is

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 that whenever an officer wants to go and practice their skills the training is available to them on

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 demand they can go and do it at any time they feel a need to improve upon their their skill set as it

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 relates to responsive resistance and defensive tactics training there are no barriers

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 a future training that's that's scheduled also scheduled to participate in additional

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 scenario-based situational training which is mandatory and as i mentioned last week the

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 officers will be participating in active bystander ship train training the department has has requested

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 three three trainer trainer slots forward to receive the trainer training and those three

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 those three instructors will provide and present this training to all sworn and non-sworn personnel

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 and those are the responses to your question does anybody have any additional questions

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 here can i ask you my question dr williams if you could bring down the

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 slides sorry once so we can have that committee discussion that's okay and i can come in and help

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 if you need it stop share got it yes hey

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 dr williams thank you so much for that it's really helpful um a couple of questions number one

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 yes in terms of the you said there was a particular officer that was

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 i can't remember the exact language you used but a large portion if not the the totality of his job

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 is to work with defensive tactic training yes sir the department identified an officer they selected

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 that officer and he's dedicated to providing uh responsive resistance and defensive tactics training

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 that's his that is his job to assure that every every member of the department all swarm members

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 receive uh their training and i don't know if you would know this or who might on the call have we

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 had the opportunity to speak to that officer

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 no you have not uh spoken with that person yet okay uh but i just want to make sure

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 i'm understanding correct so a big part of the training gaps the inconsistencies and whatever

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 else was a part of that that you found connected to use of force uh was meant to be helped and

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 remedied by this particular officer in the position that uh he's serving him

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 it's a big part of that that this officer his his responsibility is to make sure that everybody

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 receives their training yes sir he delivers that training but particularly connected to some of

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 the use of force inconsistencies that you guys found gaps in yes yeah all it took place well i

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 i think it'd be wonderful if we could at some meeting have the opportunities talk to him given

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 that he's uh uniquely dedicated to this area that we're tasked to be thinking about together

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 yes one more one more question yes sir was there any um as you dug into the material was there any

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 um in regards to the discipline or the the sustained complaints internally or externally

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 that have been made around use of force were there any gaps that you found that sort of or gaps maybe

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 the wrong word but consistencies that you found there in in regards to you know we've got the new

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 guy training it's going better it's much more consistent and yet in regards to these use of

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 force complaints that are sustained here's some common threads that we're continuing to see

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 despite all the good healthy steps we've taken i think i'll i'll yield this question to the chief

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 i think he he he's prepared to answer that question for you thank you thank you dr rams you're welcome

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 good evening so to your answer but no we did not find any gaps the the inconsistency that we found

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 in the beginning was an inconsistency of consistency so being able to do it annually on a schedule

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 that's where the gap was it wasn't the quality it was the quantity

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 so that's what that's what we found when we were doing the analysis of it so so even the more recent

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 you know that list that we were given i don't have it right next to me this time but that of the

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 internal and external complaints you know about use of force whether it was tasers or some other

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 things that were sustained and then last week as we talked about you know part of the discipline

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 sometimes is more training you know around those like particularized training i was wondering

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 if there was any consistent in in those episodes if there was any consistent hey this is

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 this is getting missed consistency consistently with with tasers or with use of force that was

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 more what i was trying to get at okay those were the two items that we had noted for follow-up from

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 the last meeting unless there's any further questions or follow-up items that committee

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 members had were here yes fam so will we be able to speak to this individual then chief

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 will he be able to come in and speak to us yes if he at the end of this meeting we'll

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 get whatever questions you have so he can be prepared to talk to you about whatever you want

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 okay thank you sir certainly

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 sarah did you have anything else nope that is all so and move into the next item okay so we're

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 moving to item c which has received public comments from citizens regarding their input

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 on use of force policies and training on their experiences and stories with the denton police

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 department um i want to remind you to only ask questions of clarifications of the caller so we

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 will be able to allow most of the comments that we have so we will start with the first caller

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 okay we're calling the first caller back okay

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 and chair english i also did want we also do want to mention that um the police department has a

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 victim services counselor on hand so anyone who speaks and provides a comment if they would like

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 to talk to that counselor afterwards we can get them connected by phone separately with that counselor

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 true and there's a spanish translator here tonight as well in case anyone needs assistance

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 all right thank you sarah

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 give us just a second and we will get them queued up

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 mr hud spitz i saw you here a minute ago where did you go

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 is it

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 yeah i'm not gonna mess with that because i'll uh be missing i got room he's on screen too

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 madam chair okay but his picture's not up okay i don't want it up

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 we need some inspiration brother yeah we want to see you willy i'm inspired every time i see you

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 man yeah i've i've seen those emails don't talk don't tell me something

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 yeah i'm listening i'm listening everybody say hi to willy

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 all of your fingers up all of your fingers uh chief you didn't return my call so

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 i'm gonna have to deal with you would you like to meet directly after this or in the morning

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 yes i had a question before this meeting but i'll deal with it later

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 i'm uh chair english i'm glad you uh communicated that we are just to listen

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 and ask clarification questions only yes we are we're gonna get it right willy i have some

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 issues i'd like to bring to the table but i've been told that this is not the platform for that

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 this is not um well here is our first caller hello caller hi there how are you guys tonight

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 okay um i'm gonna go fast i spoke with you guys um last meeting as well and i wanted to

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 tell you i'm sorry what is your name sir it's michael motes okay hold on one second because

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 we got to get you um and and hang on one second okay

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 what is your name and address for the record it's michael motes and it's 1201 cleveland street and

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 they live in denton okay and you know you have four minutes i do okay go ahead okay so like i said i

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 spoke with you guys last meeting there was something i noticed and uh there were a couple more things

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 i wanted to touch on because i went over last time and so wanted to call back uh the first

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 thing i wanted to talk to you guys about that i think is worth looking at is i know that ultimately

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 the city has the responsibility to oversee the denton police department i i would be curious to

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 look at what if any law is in place or potential contracts that allow other police departments

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 outside of the texas rangers or the state troopers and or the sheriff's department to come into the

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 city limits and potentially pull people over for speeding potentially issuing tickets i in the last

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 week have seen um a gentleman from the north lake police department come into the city limits and

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 pull someone over so you know obviously as a police department we can only hold our department

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 accountable but i want to know when outside jurisdictions come into the city what accountability

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 do they have to our city because if another city is coming in and doing things like north lake

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 police department pulling people over or our guile potentially pulling people over within those city

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 limits i have questions about that the other thing i wanted to to mention was um regarding the

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 trainings that were spoken about earlier today when you talk about they have the option to go

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 in and do these trainings on demand i would ask what is the requirement or are they being required

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 to go into these trainings if there is a complaint filed against the police officer are they being

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 required to go in and do these trainings because we can have these trainings available all day long

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 but then the question becomes how many of them are actually taking advantage of those trainings

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 how many people are actually using those trainings and benefiting from them um rather than just being

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 available because i know and i'm a college student i'm a grad student now this is a little bit

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 different but if a if a professor tells me i have an optional assignment traditionally it is not

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 something that i would go and do optionally um and so that those are the two things i just i really

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 wanted to ask you guys about tonight was outside jurisdictions coming in whether it be the courts

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 whether it be the states i know that in the last meeting there were some issues about jurisdiction

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 between the district attorney's office and what the city of denton handled um you know when you

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 have outside departments coming in whether it be the the troopers whether it be other cities whether

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 it be the sheriff's office what accountability do they have do we get those report that information

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 that they do what they issue a citation or whatever does that information then get reported to the

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 city of denton do we have that information available is it included in the numbers that are

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 being reported to the committee and are those considerations being taken into consideration

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 because even if they're not um even if they're not acting on behalf of the city it is still

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 valuable information especially if it's happening within the city limits so that's all i have for

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 you guys tonight i just those are the two things i really wanted to address all right any questions

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 um thank thank you

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 we're waiting for our next caller

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 hello hello it's jim beaver hi can you state your um name and address mr beaver

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 yes my name is jim beaver aka james d beaver age 88 a four and a half year citizen of denton

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 residing at 2820 wind river lane okay go ahead okay madam chairman and english and committee

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 members i thank you for allowing me to address the issue that you're charged to study for your

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 study i'll present for your consideration two issues that relate to the use of force by policemen

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 issues that to my knowledge have not been addressed by your previous meetings

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 neither by the media nor by politicians the issues are the rebellion of arrestees at the point of

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 arrest and the crime rate of american whites and blacks i am not a racist i have many good friends

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 including african americans white and others of various ethnicities and races who would vouch for

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 the fact that i am not a racist and i faithfully vote i'll be using the word arrestee as an all

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 inclusive of red white black yellow green or purple human beings thankfully most policemen

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 are trained to overcome whatever forces they encounter and it is my opinion that the arresting

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 policemen are often pushed to their limit of humane treatment by the arrestee's rebellious

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 action to resist arrest unfortunately there are to my knowledge no rest statistical records

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 that report point of access actions there is public evidence of a few videos focused on the

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 events of rebellion at the point of arrest you've seen them on television with my limited time to

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 four minutes i will not recall them to your attention here except for one the george floyd

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 incident and the portion of the point of arrest video what do you suppose would have been the

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 result of all these arrestees who would have humbly submitted to the authority of officers

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 relative to that i believe that the george floyd case does not truly reflect the character of any

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 police department i also believe that the policeman who at the point of arrest exhibited inhumane

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 treatment of mr floyd and should be tried and if judged guilty received a due and just punishment

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 rendered the second issue worth of your consideration is this us crime rates of blacks and whites data

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 extracted from the 2018 fbi uniform crime report form 43a reveals the following white population

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 crime rate is 2.1 percent the black population crime rate is 4.7 percent that black americans

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 rate is over two times greater than the white's crime is terrible and that's why it's important

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 in my opinion for you to deal with that problem locally in fact it is my opinion that it merits

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 much more attention than dealing with the alleged misuse of force by policemen and my heart goes

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 out to the black people in our community and elsewhere racism is a problem that must be dealt

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 with and is two-sided it's a two-way street ponder that it has existed since adam and eve

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00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:55,600
 american history has proved that governmental actions have not resolved and will not resolve

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 our issue of racism why because racism is a moral issue yes racism is a moral issue a heart issue

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 of what one believes about the sanctity of life racism can only be compromised by national

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 reformation in matters of morality established on solid fixed truth that truth on which our nation

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 was founded scripture not relativism has now taught by our public education institutions

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 jesus said i am the way of truth follow my example thank you very much thank you mr beaver does anyone

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 have any questions or comments from mr beaver i did have a question uh madam chair yes sir

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00:26:42,000 --> 00:26:47,360
 mr beaver thank you for your uh comments can you give us the source of those

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 statistics that you offer to us please yes i did tell you that those statistics came directly from

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 the fbi uh let me see if i can get back and get the correct uh annunciation or the

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00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:11,760
 correct description it's the fbi uniform crime report form 43a

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 they produce that once a year and i think quarterly also

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00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:31,840
 okay and who had a who had a question one more question katina hello sir um do the statistics

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 that you pulled do they take in consideration the uh criminalization rates of black and brown people

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00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:48,080
 historically and currently what i quoted to you was from the uniform crime report form 43a

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 and that is the basis of i i do have other sources i have examined but this was the one that's

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 complete and they give an annual report this is from an annual report i cannot report on what you

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 just asked me well i'm asking well let me let me address one let me address it one more time i did

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 go back to 2017 and the way you can do that is trace back there's uniform crime reports of various

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 years to to get your answer to your question it needs examination i agree okay okay

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 okay anyone else have any more questions for mr beaver

234
00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:33,840
 thank you sir for calling in and i thank you all right have a good night

235
00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:38,960
 um we have another caller

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00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:45,760
 good evening mr campbell

237
00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:56,800
 hello good evening how you doing good how are you i'm doing great doing great

238
00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:04,080
 can you state your name and your address please yes wayne campbell 1410 university drive

239
00:29:06,160 --> 00:29:15,440
 okay go ahead you have four minutes okay well if i had a theme for my talk it'll be better together

240
00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:21,360
 i believe that the citizens of denton and the police department of denton are better together

241
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:30,000
 we need one another we need to be working together as one i don't believe that um we should demonize

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 the police nor should the police demonize the citizens um i've been a resident of denton since

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 2014 when my wife and i moved here and we pretty much feel that this is a safe city we've had some

244
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:51,280
 interaction with the police all positive all legal and lawful and we personally haven't had a problem

245
00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:57,440
 with the police department i have great confidence in our chief um frank dixon i believe that he's

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00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:04,080
 going to do a great job with our police department um the previous chief i think he did um a decent

247
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:11,280
 job as well he worked from what i understand pretty closely with the NAACP anytime issues might have

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 happened so he seemed like he was trying to make sure our force was a um force that was respectful

249
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 to people and it was also trying to stand by our crime to the best of their abilities but i

250
00:30:25,280 --> 00:30:31,040
 personally and everything i've seen from the denton police in my reaction with them they seem to be a

251
00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:36,960
 good force a professional force um i'm all for improvement sensible improvements that's why i

252
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:44,240
 definitely supported body cams i definitely support um de-escalation training and i support

253
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:51,840
 um measures to help our police officers not see people in a biased light um no part no force is

254
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:58,400
 going to be perfect but i think that this force is good i don't believe that this force is one is um

255
00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:04,400
 systemically racist i am african-american by the way um but i do believe that therefore most part

256
00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:09,040
 fair now i'm not going to say everybody in the force is a great person i don't know everybody and

257
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:14,640
 i'm sure they're bad apples like there'll be bad apples in any place in city committees or city

258
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:20,000
 councils or any things that nature but i do believe that most people are trying to do what they can

259
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 to make um the street safe i definitely would be against extremist measures like defunding the

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 police i don't think that that would help at all as we see in other cities where crime is

261
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 starting to escalate um that would be a good good idea instead we should not only fund the police but

262
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 fund social services fund education fully fund all the things that really make citizens' lives

263
00:31:45,520 --> 00:31:51,280
 better but this is not the time to demonize the police but a time to look at them and enact

264
00:31:51,280 --> 00:31:57,040
 sensible regulations and procedures that will help the police to be the best they can be they will

265
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 respect the rights of citizens but still be able to fight crime because that's what that's what they

266
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 need to do um finally i'll have to say my heart definitely goes out to the parents of Darius um

267
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:18,080
 Tabber um that was such a tragic um tragic loss of life and i don't believe that those officers

268
00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:25,120
 woke up that day saying we're going to kill a man um just because he's black the i looked at the

269
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 video of it and things definitely spiraled out of control and nobody knew those cops did not know

270
00:32:32,160 --> 00:32:37,920
 his state of mind or what he was facing what he was about they did not know they acted in the best

271
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:43,920
 manner they could in a short time that happened he was asked repeatedly to put down um the weapons

272
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 which he didn't and unfortunately his life's lost and it's a tragedy that someone that young

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 with so much potential had to go but i don't believe that that was something that was

274
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 intentional i think it was tragic but i don't think that that is something that we can demonize

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 our force over so in a nutshell guys we're better together as police department i hope that you guys

276
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 come up with sensible procedures that will help our force be the best it can be i think that on

277
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 the whole the force has done a decent job the city's relatively safe in my opinion i lived in

278
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:27,360
 three states but seems to be a very safe relatively safe city okay mr campbell i'm sorry your your time

279
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:36,640
 is up does anyone have any questions for mr campbell thank you mr campbell for calling in

280
00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:41,120
 you're welcome you guys have a great day all right you too thank you

281
00:33:41,120 --> 00:33:49,840
 we're queuing up the next call

282
00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:56,240
 hello hi can you state your name and your address please

283
00:33:57,600 --> 00:34:07,760
 yes good evening my name is rita brent reinhart my address is 1817 westminster street apartment 203

284
00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:14,880
 danston okay mr reinhart you'll have four minutes and once we get you started you'll have four

285
00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:19,920
 minutes and then if they have any additional questions they'll ask you so you can start now

286
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:31,440
 okay i am calling about okay i'm calling about the matter in danton of defending the police

287
00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:40,320
 and i am totally against that we need more funding for the police they need more training more police

288
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:47,680
 officers we've seen what has happened in cities across the united states that have defunded the

289
00:34:47,680 --> 00:34:58,640
 police there's more crime in new york los angeles seattle portland the seattle police chief quit

290
00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:10,160
 this is a political agenda which puts into risk the safety of the public and of the police officers

291
00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:20,800
 also i will vote with greg abbott on freezing the taxes the property taxes

292
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:27,120
 all across the state for those cities that defund the police

293
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 and um so i think that's about all i've got to say about it i'm against it completely

294
00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:41,680
 all right thank you for calling in does anyone have any questions for our caller

295
00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:50,080
 thank you miss reinhart okay thank you have a good evening

296
00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:58,480
 and we're queuing up our next our next person

297
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:11,200
 hello caller hi hi how are you i'm great can you state your name your address

298
00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:20,000
 yes this is janette sorbelo and i live at 205 willowstone street here in denton miss sorbelo

299
00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:25,520
 we're going to give you four minutes and once you get started i will um give let you four minutes

300
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:30,800
 and if anyone has any additional questions then they'll ask um when your four minutes is up okay

301
00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:39,120
 that sounds good all right you can go now okay i want this is janette sorbelo and i want to express

302
00:36:39,120 --> 00:36:45,520
 my support for the denton police department we know that law and order gives us security

303
00:36:45,520 --> 00:36:54,160
 and we want to raise our children in a safe environment we need the police department for

304
00:36:54,160 --> 00:37:02,960
 that security they keep the citizens and the streets safe we aren't fearful because we can

305
00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:10,720
 rely on them to keep order they help when people are in distress and i appreciate that they put

306
00:37:10,720 --> 00:37:23,600
 their lives on on the line every day for us okay do you have anything else one you have you have more

307
00:37:23,600 --> 00:37:32,480
 time i know i just we just need them okay does anyone have any questions for our caller

308
00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:39,920
 all right no one has any questions thank you so much for calling in and have a great evening

309
00:37:41,360 --> 00:37:46,480
 all right bye-bye

310
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:56,720
 okay we'll take a quick break for a second while they're queuing up the caller

311
00:37:56,720 --> 00:38:07,680
 pardon me hi caller yes my name is terry vogue can you state your your address terry

312
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:18,560
 can i give you my address it's 2001 south ridge drive okay 76205 thank you terry you're

313
00:38:18,560 --> 00:38:23,760
 going to have four minutes to speak and i'll let you know when you can get started and go

314
00:38:23,760 --> 00:38:33,760
 okay go now yes okay i'm just calling because i'm concerned of something i saw

315
00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:44,800
 book that someone is making a motion or whatever to defund our police department and i am thoroughly

316
00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:53,280
 and completely against that i've lived in denton since 1985 this is a peaceful town and i think

317
00:38:53,280 --> 00:39:00,240
 it's peaceful because we do have a good police department i think if anything they're under

318
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:08,720
 funding and i do not want to see any defunding of the police department and i think it's a bad

319
00:39:08,720 --> 00:39:15,040
 ideas in the cities that have done it i think there is just we're just asking for anarchy

320
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:25,040
 and i hope that the city of denton city council has the good sense not to follow bad judgment

321
00:39:27,280 --> 00:39:32,240
 and that's all i have to say all right thank you does anyone have any questions for our caller

322
00:39:32,240 --> 00:39:39,120
 well thank you for calling in and have a good evening thank you all righty

323
00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:52,560
 madam chair in general uh i would like to see if the callers had any input regarding the

324
00:39:53,200 --> 00:40:00,800
 use of force hang on okay caller yes hi can you state your name and your address please

325
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:10,320
 this is lee shanglin and it's 4000 fiscal hill and then okay lee you'll have four minutes to speak

326
00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:17,040
 and you can start now okay first time i would just want to let you know i've been a resident

327
00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:24,560
 of denton for the past 24 years in that time i have utilized 911 and the police only a few times

328
00:40:24,560 --> 00:40:31,520
 but each time under the circumstances they were good experiences unfortunately i have received

329
00:40:31,520 --> 00:40:38,160
 a few traffic tickets um but again every time a police officer has always been outstanding

330
00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:44,240
 through my years in denton i've served on the board of numerous non-profit organizations

331
00:40:44,240 --> 00:40:50,080
 and i have given thousands of hours of community service one thing that stands out in my mind is

332
00:40:50,080 --> 00:40:56,160
 the kindness and generosity i have witnessed with the denton police department and denton county

333
00:40:56,160 --> 00:41:02,160
 sheriff's office through various non-profits i have witnessed many law enforcement officers giving

334
00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:07,280
 their time to serve and help their community i think it is important to remember that police

335
00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:13,760
 officers are not just a badge they're not a cop car and they're not a gun they are human beings

336
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:19,440
 like the rest of us they feel like the rest of us and they have hearts like the rest of us

337
00:41:19,440 --> 00:41:26,400
 they do much good in this world like the rest of us except unlike most of us they put their lives

338
00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:33,760
 on the line and they do that to protect us and because of this i feel that they have the right

339
00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:44,720
 to protect themselves and have the right to have use of force as they see fit i feel that it is

340
00:41:44,720 --> 00:41:52,240
 important that the chief and people within the department are the ones who determine what that

341
00:41:52,240 --> 00:42:01,920
 is where the line is drawn and how they protect their side their selves in their lives this leads

342
00:42:01,920 --> 00:42:12,160
 me to a point also that i want to make quickly and there is a particular city council person that has

343
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:22,240
 an agenda that is not the same as the agenda of this group this person wants to demonize the denton

344
00:42:22,240 --> 00:42:31,440
 police department and they will go to any length to appear to be a martyr for her constituent

345
00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:38,880
 even if that means she has to lie or make up stories about law enforcement or law enforcement

346
00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:45,840
 officers this particular city council member will also go to such lengths as to line up her buddies

347
00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:53,120
 to call into this committee each time you guys need to bash the denton police department it's

348
00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:59,760
 the same tactic she uses with the denton city council meetings i'm asking that you please keep

349
00:42:59,760 --> 00:43:05,920
 in mind that this organizing of presenting lies and distortions is happening by an attention

350
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:12,720
 seeking city council member and as difficult as it might be try to decipher between truthful and

351
00:43:12,720 --> 00:43:20,960
 false statements this particular city council member is so anti-police that she has gone as far

352
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:28,160
 as to call this weekend's rally in denton to support police officers a clan meeting she's

353
00:43:28,160 --> 00:43:35,360
 publicly posted this on facebook and she has posted that these people attending the rally

354
00:43:35,360 --> 00:43:42,800
 should leave their hoods at home she even went further stating that the denton police department

355
00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:48,960
 is toxic and stated that she doesn't understand why anyone would become a police officer there

356
00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:54,640
 she then encouraged denton police officers to speak out against their department promising

357
00:43:54,640 --> 00:44:00,880
 her support and backing there's the cancer that wants there to be trouble with the denton police

358
00:44:00,880 --> 00:44:08,640
 department she wants you to believe that there are issues and she is going to great lengths to

359
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:17,360
 sway your opinion that way thank you for your time thank you um does anyone have any questions

360
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:26,560
 for our caller katina hello do you think it's possible that she this person that you're speaking

361
00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:33,840
 of that she doesn't have some type of uh hold on that people actually have their own minds and

362
00:44:33,840 --> 00:44:41,760
 opinions um it sounds like you're putting um the responsibility of people having opinions other

363
00:44:41,760 --> 00:44:48,400
 than yours on this one person's shoulders as if everyone isn't a a free thinker

364
00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:55,360
 i guess i'm not sure i understand your question

365
00:44:55,360 --> 00:45:06,720
 well i'm just a little surprised to hear like i've never heard where someone would call in and talk

366
00:45:06,720 --> 00:45:13,760
 about a person i thought you were so supposed to be talking about issues but you're you're you went

367
00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:20,320
 down this bullet list about this city council person and all but said her name so my question is

368
00:45:20,320 --> 00:45:26,400
 is she solely responsible for all the other the opinions that differ from yours is she

369
00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:35,840
 i wouldn't say all of them but i know that she uh lines up and encourages uh people to call in to

370
00:45:36,720 --> 00:45:40,320
 um put in false information

371
00:45:40,320 --> 00:45:48,320
 and what i'm just saying is be aware and just be just be aware of that

372
00:45:48,320 --> 00:45:51,840
 thank you miss shanklin

373
00:45:51,840 --> 00:46:05,360
 thank you yes willy i want to remind us why we're here well mr willy i asked a question

374
00:46:05,360 --> 00:46:12,320
 don't come with me and i have another one while we're at it and i have and i have some too but i

375
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:18,240
 that's not where we're here i asked a question and my question is a legitimate question mr willy i

376
00:46:18,240 --> 00:46:25,760
 didn't attack the woman i didn't do what you did in the last meeting i mean you challenge what she

377
00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:34,480
 thought just her thoughts that's what she put the she put the whole of uh everything that's going on

378
00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:40,960
 and didn't i wanted to know it's i mean because you attacked a person in a public forum which i

379
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:47,120
 think i didn't realize the forum was for that but they all called her name i have a right to know

380
00:46:47,120 --> 00:46:54,640
 that she think this person is that influential or can people think for themselves that's a legitimate

381
00:46:54,640 --> 00:47:00,720
 question yeah you have my second question is are people going to be allowed to call in and

382
00:47:01,360 --> 00:47:11,360
 like attack people or give their thoughts without yes yes this is this is a distinction mr willy

383
00:47:11,360 --> 00:47:18,160
 well well i'm confused then i thought we were just here listening and then we're going and asking

384
00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:24,160
 questions which is what i or clarification i digress okay all right then i don't know what to do

385
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:30,000
 well i've got some some firemen questions i want to ask okay well this is not this hold on willy

386
00:47:30,720 --> 00:47:36,160
 like i said that's not what this is for easy no it's not yes camion

387
00:47:36,160 --> 00:47:50,320
 i just wanted to share with the caller i believe i wrote oh really okay well i just wanted to share

388
00:47:50,320 --> 00:47:56,880
 because i think a few people on here might not even know what she's talking about or who so i

389
00:47:56,880 --> 00:48:02,240
 just wanted to publicly share that that's not necessary we were just getting clarity and

390
00:48:02,240 --> 00:48:06,640
 everybody said what they had to say we have another caller on hold and we can discuss this

391
00:48:06,640 --> 00:48:12,640
 after we're done all i'm saying is that we have one city council member that's been a part of

392
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:18,640
 these meetings that has had input and it's jesse davis and we haven't had any input from any other

393
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:27,120
 city council members that's all i wanted to say well jesse is a part of this of this group and

394
00:48:27,120 --> 00:48:33,040
 he hasn't had much input he's here to listen and to clarify whatever questions that we have

395
00:48:33,040 --> 00:48:42,800
 as so as the police chief so it's designed for that it's not that every city council person

396
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:48,080
 will call in here and have their own opinion or whatever that's not what this group is for

397
00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:51,280
 so we're going to move on to the next caller

398
00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:55,840
 go ahead

399
00:48:55,840 --> 00:49:02,400
 good evening caller

400
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:11,280
 yes my name is tom silver i live at 2201 long middle street here in denton hi and i was just

401
00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:17,280
 calling mr silver we're going to give you four minutes and then um you can start now

402
00:49:18,960 --> 00:49:22,240
 okay well i just called because i'm one of those that would like to see

403
00:49:22,240 --> 00:49:29,280
 the i don't want to see the our police officers handicapped because when they get handicapped

404
00:49:29,280 --> 00:49:34,080
 unfortunately i feel like the citizens of denton would be handicapped so i would like to i i don't

405
00:49:34,080 --> 00:49:40,320
 believe in defunding them do i believe that our police officers are doing a good job overall in

406
00:49:40,320 --> 00:49:46,000
 the city of denton i believe that they are i don't think that any police force or any police officer

407
00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:52,080
 or any clergy member or any firefighter or any military person is above reproach but in the same

408
00:49:52,080 --> 00:49:58,480
 instance i think that overall these police officers in our city do a pretty good job so i would rather

409
00:49:58,480 --> 00:50:07,040
 them see them not defunded by any means um if it takes a little education as far as dealing with

410
00:50:07,040 --> 00:50:12,960
 people and stuff that would be okay but i can't see taking away funds just to take away funds if

411
00:50:12,960 --> 00:50:19,760
 you know what i mean i know that many of you in this in this account this group that's here

412
00:50:19,760 --> 00:50:26,320
 understand uh discrimination i do i happen to be a mexican american that has been discriminated

413
00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:31,520
 against in the past but that doesn't necessarily mean that i let that rule my life or dominate

414
00:50:31,520 --> 00:50:39,200
 every thought what what i do think that makes sense is for us to do the best that we can to see that

415
00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:44,880
 we provide our police force with the best that we can give them so they can give the best protection

416
00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:50,640
 to us the citizens of denton so uh that's basically in a nutshell what i wanted to say

417
00:50:50,640 --> 00:50:58,320
 i'll wait for any comments that you guys might have thank you mr silver does anyone have any

418
00:50:58,320 --> 00:51:08,560
 comments for mr selva i just had a quick question this is lillian okay can you can you just clarify

419
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:16,960
 for me what do you what do you think it means to defend the police okay i would think that you would

420
00:51:16,960 --> 00:51:20,320
 take away i know i know you won't take away all their funding but you would take away some of

421
00:51:20,320 --> 00:51:24,560
 their funding that they might be able to use for equipment that they could use for to better protect

422
00:51:24,560 --> 00:51:30,800
 themselves and us citizens that's what i think defunding is if i'm wrong then i stand corrected

423
00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:38,560
 no i i mean then someone else can jump in too i think you're right it's not taking away everything

424
00:51:38,560 --> 00:51:42,400
 because a lot of people have been calling in and talking about defending it's not dismantling the

425
00:51:42,400 --> 00:51:47,680
 police department it's not taking away you know enormous amounts of money it's just reallocating

426
00:51:47,680 --> 00:51:52,000
 some of those funds to maybe other places where there isn't enough funding that would maybe

427
00:51:52,000 --> 00:51:56,800
 decrease their workload i just want to make sure that the people that talk are understanding that

428
00:51:56,800 --> 00:52:03,920
 yes yes any any uh in order to fully comply with the texas open meetings act using this format we've

429
00:52:03,920 --> 00:52:11,280
 got to see people's faces the videos um so if we could just uh ask that i realized that lillian's

430
00:52:11,280 --> 00:52:17,040
 trying to um juggle two things at one time but the state law is pretty clear that using this technology

431
00:52:17,040 --> 00:52:24,400
 we have to see people's faces for the visual recording thank you yep thank thank you thank you

432
00:52:24,400 --> 00:52:27,600
 mr silver does anyone else have any questions for mr silver

433
00:52:27,600 --> 00:52:36,480
 thank you for calling in mr silver thank you y'all have a blessed evening all right you too

434
00:52:36,480 --> 00:52:46,880
 we're going to take a five minute break um we are trying to get a hold of the last caller

435
00:52:46,880 --> 00:52:52,160
 and we need to do a couple of technical things here so five minutes

436
00:52:55,280 --> 00:53:03,760
 okay thank you everyone for um coming back we are going to continue our meeting we were unable to

437
00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:11,200
 get the last caller um who was calling in and we are going to move to the next item of the agenda

438
00:53:11,200 --> 00:53:18,240
 which is item d receive a report and hold a discussion regarding proposed topic areas related

439
00:53:18,240 --> 00:53:24,240
 to the use of force in the denton police department including a police officer and a police officer

440
00:53:24,240 --> 00:53:31,040
 including internal affairs training accreditation and compliance police policy and use of force and

441
00:53:31,040 --> 00:53:39,520
 provide staff direction on finding or recommendations by topic is that you sarah that is me um hi chair

442
00:53:39,520 --> 00:53:44,880
 english and committee members um so what we'd like to do during this item is we've shared a lot of

443
00:53:44,880 --> 00:53:49,600
 information with the committee members over the last couple months and there's been some questions

444
00:53:49,600 --> 00:53:55,040
 in terms of how do we move forward and transitioning to discussing conclusions and recommendations

445
00:53:55,040 --> 00:54:00,720
 and so i put forward kind of a draft framework and timeline for the remaining committee meetings

446
00:54:00,720 --> 00:54:04,480
 and like to review that with the committee members at this time so let me go ahead and

447
00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:10,000
 pull up that presentation it was also shared with you through email just prior to the meeting

448
00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:20,720
 okay so jumping right in um this is what we're proposing for the remaining meetings

449
00:54:20,720 --> 00:54:25,760
 and we have two that are left to be held on september 3rd and september 10th and we're

450
00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:32,400
 also proposing to add one additional meeting on september 17th and hold if we need another one in

451
00:54:32,400 --> 00:54:38,800
 september 24th and so to walk you through um our next meeting is on september 3rd we would recommend

452
00:54:38,800 --> 00:54:44,400
 having the entire meeting be set aside for the committee to discuss any conclusions and

453
00:54:44,400 --> 00:54:50,480
 recommendations in regards to use of force policy and training and i'll go over a few more slides

454
00:54:50,480 --> 00:54:56,960
 that will kind of set up the committee to discuss that at the next meeting but i'll continue through

455
00:54:56,960 --> 00:55:02,960
 and seeing what the future meetings look like so then in september 10th and we'd kind of do part two

456
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:08,560
 which would be in regards to use of force review and transparency any feedback conclusions

457
00:55:08,560 --> 00:55:14,160
 recommendations you have in those areas and then mike cronic our city attorney would also present

458
00:55:14,160 --> 00:55:18,880
 some information that was requested from the committee in regards to civilian oversight boards

459
00:55:18,880 --> 00:55:24,000
 following those two meetings staff would go back and draft a report that would be delivered to the

460
00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:29,520
 committee and then on september 17th we would review that draft report with the committee

461
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:34,160
 and potentially finalize it if needed though we could hold an additional meeting on september

462
00:55:34,160 --> 00:55:41,520
 24th to finalize that report to present to city council and then sometime in early october that

463
00:55:41,520 --> 00:55:47,600
 report and recommendations would be presented to city council and so before i go into the slides

464
00:55:47,600 --> 00:55:51,440
 that will kind of provide a framework for the september 3rd meeting so that the committee

465
00:55:51,440 --> 00:55:57,280
 members are prepared to discuss use of force policy and training i'll bring down the presentation

466
00:55:57,280 --> 00:56:02,480
 to see if committee members have any questions or recommendations regarding that timeline and framework

467
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:18,320
 yes willie uh who will be the person or persons who will assist us in determining

468
00:56:18,320 --> 00:56:23,040
 what we've agreed on in other words manage that

469
00:56:23,040 --> 00:56:31,600
 meeting who will who which person or persons will be is going to be selected to manage that meeting

470
00:56:34,080 --> 00:56:41,360
 i think it's that process yeah i think it'll be a combination of chair english as well as staff

471
00:56:41,360 --> 00:56:47,200
 helping to provide that support in terms of what are some recommendations or conclusions

472
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:52,000
 that have majority or just some others that have been suggested by committee members as well

473
00:56:52,000 --> 00:56:58,800
 that's who again uh chair english as well as city staff

474
00:57:02,560 --> 00:57:11,200
 well i i don't agree with that but i don't know that i have any place other than just won't be here

475
00:57:11,200 --> 00:57:23,280
 but uh so okay well i guess is there feedback um committee member hutzpeth i will be trying to

476
00:57:23,280 --> 00:57:29,600
 determine if there is a majority or consensus amongst some of the items there are people that

477
00:57:29,600 --> 00:57:35,360
 when we were as i said before who assisted us when we were looking for the chief

478
00:57:35,360 --> 00:57:43,360
 uh not yeah the chief and the city manager they were professionals they knew they didn't have a

479
00:57:43,360 --> 00:57:54,480
 they didn't they weren't part of trying to communicate anything for us they were just

480
00:57:55,040 --> 00:58:02,320
 there to listen to what we had to say and to steer us in a direction where we could

481
00:58:02,320 --> 00:58:09,920
 say something collectively to respond to what the the city council has asked us to do and so if you

482
00:58:09,920 --> 00:58:17,120
 have someone like that who is not part of the committee and what what we are trying to do as

483
00:58:17,120 --> 00:58:21,920
 far as make making that recommendation i think it will go better you just they're just taking the

484
00:58:21,920 --> 00:58:28,400
 information we give them they've been trained on how to do this and i think it would be

485
00:58:28,400 --> 00:58:33,760
 more effective to get us to the point where we need to be uh quicker

486
00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:40,960
 hold on uh john baines has a comment and then you carry me on

487
00:58:40,960 --> 00:58:51,680
 uh we're at a we're at a critical juncture here and we have a lot of information that's been

488
00:58:52,080 --> 00:58:58,480
 communicated so far and to get our arms around it i have a couple of suggestions

489
00:58:58,480 --> 00:59:10,160
 and i do hear you mr hutzpeth um let me just kind of um i hate to use a 25 cent word but let me let

490
00:59:10,160 --> 00:59:16,640
 me just talk for just maybe a minute minute and a half i'll see if i can get it out what i'd like

491
00:59:16,640 --> 00:59:26,320
 to see us do is two things each of us needs to come up with uh written suggestions in categories

492
00:59:26,320 --> 00:59:34,480
 uh preferably if if uh sarah if you could get us the various categories

493
00:59:34,480 --> 00:59:42,160
 and then we can respond in writing and also give us a chance to have a five minute

494
00:59:44,240 --> 00:59:51,600
 or four minute just like the other input people to kind of communicate our thoughts and then i'd

495
00:59:51,600 --> 00:59:58,480
 like to see all that information put in a matrix where we go through the matrix and we vote on we

496
00:59:58,480 --> 01:00:02,800
 want to include this so we don't want to include that and it's just going to take some time but

497
01:00:02,800 --> 01:00:09,760
 that's kind of a three-pronged uh approach i see because we got so much we got a lot of opinions

498
01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:14,160
 but we're going to need to boil it down to something in writing each of us needs to do that

499
01:00:14,160 --> 01:00:20,720
 and also have a chance to communicate uh any areas that need a little additional information

500
01:00:20,720 --> 01:00:28,480
 and then we lastly once you have a matrix of suggestions then we go through and and yes or no

501
01:00:28,480 --> 01:00:32,000
 and then come up with a final conclusion so that's my input thank you

502
01:00:34,560 --> 01:00:43,760
 camya yeah i just wanted to say i think that willy is saying that it would help us if we had like a

503
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:49,840
 facilitator that's not a part of the group that can help like lead the discussion draw out all

504
01:00:49,840 --> 01:00:55,600
 the themes that come up from us put them into a digestible draft that we can then turn into a

505
01:00:55,600 --> 01:01:02,640
 report that they can help us write um the second thing that i wanted to say and i think that would

506
01:01:02,640 --> 01:01:09,120
 be helpful also the second thing that i wanted to say is i guess it's more of a question i have a

507
01:01:09,120 --> 01:01:15,680
 document kind of like what mr baines is speaking of it's not into categories but i have a document

508
01:01:15,680 --> 01:01:21,440
 of draft things that i'd like included in the oversight board a draft statement that i'd like

509
01:01:21,440 --> 01:01:28,240
 presented as a part of the report some drafts of changed um policies that we were presented on

510
01:01:28,240 --> 01:01:37,360
 what is the best way for me to share that information with the entire group or yeah so like

511
01:01:37,360 --> 01:01:46,960
 i i did the the thing that we were given for the three top categories um but it's not going to fit

512
01:01:46,960 --> 01:01:51,680
 everything else i have right so what is the best way to do that and ensure that it's shared with

513
01:01:51,680 --> 01:01:56,960
 the group or should i just hold on to it till we meet and like read it aloud you know what i'm

514
01:01:56,960 --> 01:02:01,680
 saying i'm trying to figure out what's the best way to do that stuff if some of us have been

515
01:02:01,680 --> 01:02:07,920
 doing some research on the policies that we have been presented yeah there's probably a

516
01:02:07,920 --> 01:02:12,720
 few different ways to go about it i guess i can propose um that if committee members do for the

517
01:02:12,720 --> 01:02:17,840
 next meeting on september 3rd we're going to be discussing policy and training in those areas

518
01:02:17,840 --> 01:02:24,080
 if you have any um suggestions that you would like to share with all your fellow committee members

519
01:02:24,080 --> 01:02:30,080
 to get those to me by friday august 28th just by email i can compile that into one document

520
01:02:30,080 --> 01:02:35,920
 to share with the committee in advance of the september 3rd uh meeting and that can also be

521
01:02:35,920 --> 01:02:42,720
 used then if as a discussion to help facilitate that discussion i don't know if city manager

522
01:02:42,720 --> 01:02:48,320
 haleman has anything to add in terms of no i think that's exactly right we've tried to break it down

523
01:02:48,320 --> 01:02:53,600
 into um digestible topics i think it was kind of a question jamie brought up last week is how we're

524
01:02:53,600 --> 01:02:58,880
 going to work through these issues and um i think that first one on the policies procedures that

525
01:02:58,880 --> 01:03:05,040
 sort of thing what we really want to understand from the committee is what um you know what

526
01:03:05,040 --> 01:03:10,480
 suggestions do you have that uh you know trainings that you feel like we're not covering um that you'd

527
01:03:10,480 --> 01:03:15,280
 like us to add into the portfolio that sort of thing i've set aside additional funding through

528
01:03:15,280 --> 01:03:20,560
 the next year's budget as well to to try to accommodate uh chief dixon and um and provide

529
01:03:20,560 --> 01:03:24,800
 him some additional dollars to implement new training opportunities as well so it would be

530
01:03:24,800 --> 01:03:31,600
 helpful uh based on all the trainings that they have developed recently um in all the updates to

531
01:03:31,600 --> 01:03:36,000
 the policies if you think that there's still areas that that we haven't addressed sufficiently

532
01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:41,840
 that really is the focus of the next meeting is to give you the you the floor and just say look you

533
01:03:41,840 --> 01:03:48,240
 know we we see that there's progress we we think that we're missing x what what is that and so we

534
01:03:48,240 --> 01:03:53,760
 can have that discussion with the committee and have those recommendations on the training use

535
01:03:53,760 --> 01:03:58,720
 of force continuing those sorts of things in another week or two it's going to be critical

536
01:03:58,720 --> 01:04:04,480
 that we allow michael kronegg our attorney and expert in 143 and that meet confer contract to

537
01:04:04,480 --> 01:04:09,200
 talk to you a little bit about about oversight before we get into that discussion some of the

538
01:04:09,200 --> 01:04:13,040
 things that we're seeing in other communities are just not allowed under the state law in denton

539
01:04:13,920 --> 01:04:19,280
 since we're 143 city or under our meet confer contract so he will help you set that context

540
01:04:19,280 --> 01:04:24,960
 that doesn't mean that there's not ways of getting there in in other forms that there's there's not a

541
01:04:24,960 --> 01:04:30,320
 way to address it but rather than spend a lot of time on things that just simply can't even be

542
01:04:30,320 --> 01:04:36,560
 met from a legal perspective we want to at least allow you the opportunity and give you uh some

543
01:04:36,560 --> 01:04:40,720
 training on his end and then set aside another meeting or two for you to continue kicking that

544
01:04:40,720 --> 01:04:46,080
 item around so we realize these are big issues but what we're really interested right now in the

545
01:04:46,080 --> 01:04:51,520
 training use of force everything that you've seen what are we missing and then we'll get into the

546
01:04:51,520 --> 01:04:56,080
 oversight as well and and just talk about what would you like to see what are some ideas that

547
01:04:56,080 --> 01:05:01,600
 we kick around and i have a few slides that i can share with you that kind of wrap up the policy and

548
01:05:01,600 --> 01:05:06,720
 training areas and provide the links to all the documents we've provided again and give you some

549
01:05:06,720 --> 01:05:12,960
 probing questions to help committee members um become prepared for september 3rd or to send

550
01:05:12,960 --> 01:05:17,280
 some of those recommendations to us in advance in regards to that i can go over those next after

551
01:05:17,280 --> 01:05:25,840
 taking the remaining questions from the committee oh we can't hear you both

552
01:05:25,840 --> 01:05:32,800
 there was uh thanks for putting this together in uh obviously

553
01:05:35,040 --> 01:05:41,120
 there's something that's sort of shaping i think um in your own minds as you're listening to us

554
01:05:41,120 --> 01:05:45,280
 obviously what you're saying this seems like this would be a good direction and i think even one of

555
01:05:45,280 --> 01:05:51,280
 you either you sarah or todd you last week said hey it's pretty clear as we're listening to some

556
01:05:51,280 --> 01:05:58,960
 things that are coming up that are being repeated could you maybe tell us a little bit about what

557
01:05:58,960 --> 01:06:03,760
 those things are that therefore shaped what you're presenting to us tonight even in regards to your

558
01:06:03,760 --> 01:06:08,000
 recommendations about how to best sort of organize this for just what you're hearing what you've

559
01:06:08,000 --> 01:06:13,600
 heard even as kind of like willy's talking about you know you're sitting in and listening and you've

560
01:06:13,600 --> 01:06:18,400
 helped us here and there but you've done a lot of listening and so uh that'd be helpful to hear i

561
01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:24,400
 think what i would like to do is ask sarah she's she's got a slide uh put us we kind of anticipated

562
01:06:24,400 --> 01:06:29,440
 this question and and um i'd like to have her pull that up so you can sort of see how we're thinking

563
01:06:29,440 --> 01:06:34,480
 this through we'll pull it down and if you don't if you don't like it you want to uh change the

564
01:06:34,480 --> 01:06:37,920
 way we're thinking about it we're open to it but we just felt like it's always easier to sort of

565
01:06:37,920 --> 01:06:43,520
 edit someone else's work and try to give you some idea of what we're thinking um but why don't we

566
01:06:43,520 --> 01:06:49,200
 ask sarah to kind of pull that up and we'll take you through it okay one second i'll pull back up

567
01:06:49,200 --> 01:06:56,960
 the powerpoint um so these next um three three slides that i'm going to go through they're just

568
01:06:56,960 --> 01:07:02,560
 kind of a quick review of the policy training accreditation and compliance information and that

569
01:07:02,560 --> 01:07:08,480
 we have provided to you and then the very final slide is some of those questions um for consideration

570
01:07:08,480 --> 01:07:12,880
 some of the main inquiries we've heard some of the themes we've heard that might help facilitate

571
01:07:12,880 --> 01:07:19,120
 the committee's discussion around policy and training um so these next few slides again are

572
01:07:19,120 --> 01:07:22,560
 just intended to help the committee members if there's anything that you want to go back

573
01:07:23,360 --> 01:07:28,560
 re-look at as you're kind of considering um your own recommendations and suggestions

574
01:07:28,560 --> 01:07:33,440
 we've taken each area just kind of summarize some of the main themes that you've heard

575
01:07:33,440 --> 01:07:40,080
 so for policy in terms of all the policies and general orders that were updated since chief

576
01:07:40,080 --> 01:07:45,520
 dixon started him using the lexical system and all of its benefits and all the substantial

577
01:07:45,520 --> 01:07:50,320
 improvements that have made have been made to including all of the resource links so you can

578
01:07:50,320 --> 01:07:56,720
 access again all of the general orders the presentations um the q a's that we've had um

579
01:07:56,720 --> 01:08:01,680
 his recent report on august 13th which included some more information regards to policy if you

580
01:08:01,680 --> 01:08:07,440
 haven't seen it it actually compares um our old general orders prior to 2018 to the new current

581
01:08:07,440 --> 01:08:11,760
 general order so you can see some of the improvements that have been made um and then

582
01:08:11,760 --> 01:08:17,920
 to your right here are the list of specific use of force related policies that chief dixon has

583
01:08:17,920 --> 01:08:22,880
 reviewed with the committee members so if there's any specific language changes that you would like

584
01:08:22,880 --> 01:08:28,000
 to see in these policies again that would be helpful for committee members to review and send

585
01:08:28,000 --> 01:08:32,960
 in any suggestions they might have by august 28th so we can compile those for the committee

586
01:08:32,960 --> 01:08:41,040
 discussion so this is in regards to policy those guidelines that our officers use and then it kind

587
01:08:41,040 --> 01:08:46,480
 of connects policy into training how do we train our officers then to use that and use their

588
01:08:46,480 --> 01:08:51,520
 discretion and make sure that they are prepared when they are providing service to our community

589
01:08:51,520 --> 01:08:57,360
 and so a lot of information was presented here as well in terms of the basic the academy that

590
01:08:57,360 --> 01:09:02,720
 officers go to when they are a new officer from the ongoing training that they receive from the

591
01:09:02,720 --> 01:09:08,400
 legislative mandated training including all of the department mandated training a lot of that has

592
01:09:08,400 --> 01:09:14,240
 changed and increased in the last two years and just by example the chart to the right includes

593
01:09:14,240 --> 01:09:20,240
 those mandated trainings that chief dixon has implemented which include a number of themes

594
01:09:20,240 --> 01:09:27,200
 including de-escalation some new courses including persons with autism and then also just

595
01:09:27,200 --> 01:09:32,480
 reinforcing you know his mission and vision in terms of how our police department does business

596
01:09:32,480 --> 01:09:39,040
 what are the expectations of our police officers and how do we best serve this community and then

597
01:09:39,040 --> 01:09:44,000
 kind of as we talked about in training to the the peer support team that has been in place for over

598
01:09:44,000 --> 01:09:49,280
 a year to make sure that we are providing for officer wellness and and looking at things that

599
01:09:49,280 --> 01:09:53,520
 may be trigger points and helping to make sure that our officers are well supported as well

600
01:09:53,520 --> 01:09:59,360
 and here are the links again if you want to look at any of the information a lot of that information

601
01:09:59,360 --> 01:10:04,720
 came last week including the presentation report and then as well as the q a document that was

602
01:10:04,720 --> 01:10:08,880
 provided there are a lot of great questions from the committee members at the last meeting and so

603
01:10:08,880 --> 01:10:13,920
 we tried to summarize some of those answers into that q a document for your reference if you want

604
01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:19,360
 to go back and take a look and see if there was any suggestions you had while we were having those

605
01:10:19,360 --> 01:10:26,480
 discussions and then just this third area in terms of accreditation and compliance it kind of supports

606
01:10:26,480 --> 01:10:32,400
 both policy and training so what are the best practices in policy and training and then every

607
01:10:32,400 --> 01:10:37,920
 other aspect of the police department as well but this is really important moving forward in terms of

608
01:10:37,920 --> 01:10:44,800
 ensuring that we are constantly evaluating and comparing to the evolving and best practices

609
01:10:44,800 --> 01:10:50,160
 legislation and so forth so that we continue to evaluate and update those and make sure that

610
01:10:50,160 --> 01:10:55,440
 we're remaining within best practices and so that tied really closely to the policy and the training

611
01:10:55,440 --> 01:11:02,480
 areas as well and then included here are the links that you see which some more information that dr

612
01:11:02,480 --> 01:11:08,880
 williams had provided so that kind of is all the review again just kind of providing a resource for

613
01:11:08,880 --> 01:11:14,880
 committee members to go back and review these areas if you would like to lead into a discussion

614
01:11:14,880 --> 01:11:20,480
 regarding policy and training overall these were just some questions we came up with that might

615
01:11:20,480 --> 01:11:27,200
 help to foster that discussion for the committee and also just as you're individually considering

616
01:11:27,200 --> 01:11:32,560
 things in the two weeks prior to the next meeting so how do you have any concerns with the general

617
01:11:32,560 --> 01:11:40,000
 orders are we missing something do you have any recommendations for specific policy language that

618
01:11:40,000 --> 01:11:44,320
 you feel should be revised or that could be improved or that could provide more clarity for

619
01:11:44,320 --> 01:11:50,000
 the officers and the public as well do you feel that there are any training gaps or opportunities

620
01:11:50,000 --> 01:11:53,600
 are there things we're still missing or are there things that you think maybe it just needs more

621
01:11:53,600 --> 01:11:59,760
 volume more quantity and if so what types of trainings are those is it more in de-escalation

622
01:11:59,760 --> 01:12:05,520
 is it in mental health diversity inclusion those are a lot of themes that we heard through last

623
01:12:05,520 --> 01:12:10,880
 week's discussion as well as prior meetings in terms of what resources are we giving to our

624
01:12:10,880 --> 01:12:15,840
 officers to make sure that they're the best equipped to deal with these difficult situations

625
01:12:15,840 --> 01:12:20,960
 that they might find themselves in and then just are there any recommendations regarding support

626
01:12:20,960 --> 01:12:27,760
 for officer wellness or the last one just kind of broadly any recommendations regarding enhancing

627
01:12:27,760 --> 01:12:32,000
 of reporting of information to the public or is there something we can be doing differently in

628
01:12:32,000 --> 01:12:38,560
 terms of public education to describe to our community how the police department operates in

629
01:12:38,560 --> 01:12:43,680
 terms of general operations but then more specifically use of force why it would be needed

630
01:12:44,640 --> 01:12:51,520
 how it is reviewed how you can report a concern and so forth and so that's kind of just a

631
01:12:51,520 --> 01:12:57,280
 framework we had laid out and welcome to hear any input or suggestions as we kind of transition

632
01:12:57,280 --> 01:13:04,320
 into that next meeting so boze it gets back to your question earlier that that discussion on

633
01:13:04,320 --> 01:13:08,720
 policies training gaps that sort of thing we've tried to give some leading questions so we can

634
01:13:08,720 --> 01:13:13,520
 actually start heading the direction that willy was talking about with getting you know what are

635
01:13:13,520 --> 01:13:19,520
 those common themes we can try to get those organized for you as a jumping off point we can

636
01:13:19,520 --> 01:13:23,920
 certainly assign somebody to moderate that meeting just in terms of looking for themes but this is

637
01:13:23,920 --> 01:13:30,960
 really we've sent a lot of information your way you've seen a lot of the progress that's been made

638
01:13:30,960 --> 01:13:36,640
 but that doesn't mean everything's been covered camion brought up a comment a couple weeks ago

639
01:13:36,640 --> 01:13:43,200
 about you know she'd like to see more specific lgbtq training we had heard jamie talk about more

640
01:13:43,200 --> 01:13:48,880
 training you know for folks with disabilities so what does that mean and one of the things i've

641
01:13:48,880 --> 01:13:54,320
 asked the chief to do is to you know try to also work with the universities and say if we want to

642
01:13:54,320 --> 01:13:58,800
 create some different kind of trainings like that you know what kind of resources can we pair up

643
01:13:58,800 --> 01:14:04,400
 with in order to meet this committee's recommendation so we're trying to give you some leading questions

644
01:14:04,400 --> 01:14:09,600
 giving you all the policies we've talked at you a lot but now it's kind of you know we really need

645
01:14:09,600 --> 01:14:14,880
 to hear what you what you think and what we might be missing so we can help you get your thoughts in

646
01:14:14,880 --> 01:14:21,360
 order looking for those gaps and those training policies and procedures and then i think the next

647
01:14:21,360 --> 01:14:30,560
 remaining part of september and in october we can talk about the the actual any oversight

648
01:14:30,560 --> 01:14:34,240
 recommendations as well there's going to be a lot of meeting conversations and we want to get you

649
01:14:34,240 --> 01:14:39,200
 educated in what we can and can't do and then get out of your way so we can kind of organize

650
01:14:39,200 --> 01:14:43,760
 it the way you want but we really need your thoughts up front if we're going to use your time wisely

651
01:14:43,760 --> 01:14:46,400
 willy

652
01:14:46,400 --> 01:14:55,600
 you got to turn it on willy we can't hear you

653
01:14:55,600 --> 01:15:05,120
 there you go i want this time that i'm allowing to interrupt what i'm i need to be doing other

654
01:15:05,120 --> 01:15:15,120
 than this to be beneficial i i i'm a a person that says that thinks this is what i'm asked

655
01:15:15,120 --> 01:15:22,640
 to do and i just i just look at that and then i decide okay this is what i think we should do

656
01:15:22,640 --> 01:15:30,240
 and i've heard from the people in this committee and each one of us do that every one of us is

657
01:15:30,240 --> 01:15:39,600
 doing that so i think i think what mr bain said what katrina said what bo was speaking to is

658
01:15:39,600 --> 01:15:45,840
 we need somebody to pull this together let me give you an example of what i'm struggling with

659
01:15:45,840 --> 01:15:52,240
 right now the charge is and like i say i'm driven with what are you asking me to do

660
01:15:52,880 --> 01:16:01,280
 to develop a report of clear findings lord help me we're gonna get something clear out of this

661
01:16:01,280 --> 01:16:10,240
 clear findings conclusions an achievable recommendation there's no way well all of

662
01:16:10,240 --> 01:16:16,640
 this information that we've been i've been given heck i can't even i can't there's no way i can

663
01:16:16,640 --> 01:16:22,560
 keep up with all of that but some of you can i'll bet you there's some things that you have heard

664
01:16:22,960 --> 01:16:29,440
 that really communicates to you and you want to address that somehow a facilitator would help us

665
01:16:29,440 --> 01:16:36,400
 there's only one thing for example that i want to recommend to the to the chief and to the city

666
01:16:36,400 --> 01:16:44,880
 council on use of force one thing i don't i'm going to allow the rest of you to address whatever you

667
01:16:44,880 --> 01:16:51,040
 want to address okay so if i only have one thing and i'm going to suggest that we do that who is

668
01:16:51,040 --> 01:16:58,320
 going to pull us together with that who's going to hear me and all of what you have to say and then

669
01:16:58,320 --> 01:17:05,760
 pull it together in something that's recommended and achievable who is going to do that we will

670
01:17:05,760 --> 01:17:11,680
 certainly work with you to do that what we will certainly work with you to do that i'm i'm happy

671
01:17:11,680 --> 01:17:16,800
 to even have staff sit down with each of you one on one and get your thoughts so we can get a running

672
01:17:16,800 --> 01:17:22,320
 start on this if that helps things that's a point i didn't think about that and willy we'll even get

673
01:17:22,320 --> 01:17:28,560
 two for you two staff people to work with you you know but if that's what you think but we'll you

674
01:17:28,560 --> 01:17:37,600
 know i i realize i realize this john bain said three for willy i realize this seems like a heavy

675
01:17:37,600 --> 01:17:42,560
 academic lift but we can certainly sit down and just kind of talk you through it compile it and

676
01:17:42,560 --> 01:17:47,120
 i think the best way what any what any moderator is going to do is basically say here's everything

677
01:17:47,120 --> 01:17:52,080
 you've told me let's just seal it down and let's start working through as a committee do you agree

678
01:17:52,080 --> 01:17:56,720
 disagree chief has this already been covered or not what ideas do you have and so i think if we

679
01:17:56,720 --> 01:18:02,240
 can do that and everybody will agree to give our team an hour or two of your lives over the next

680
01:18:02,240 --> 01:18:07,280
 week we can get prepared for that you bet and i will tell you one other thing that we sort of glossed

681
01:18:07,280 --> 01:18:13,600
 over was was the one thing that became very apparent to all of you the first couple to us

682
01:18:13,600 --> 01:18:18,960
 from your comments was just how are we reporting you know you weren't real pleased with the data

683
01:18:18,960 --> 01:18:25,280
 right you know the first couple meetings so chief dixon's actually already started implementing a

684
01:18:25,280 --> 01:18:31,040
 system that he's heavily copied out of san antonio which is very robust much more searchable for the

685
01:18:31,040 --> 01:18:38,800
 information you all wanted to see and and so we're i'm sorry so so we're so that that's how we're

686
01:18:38,800 --> 01:18:43,920
 sort of listening to you and adapting and it's been really good for us because sometimes it can

687
01:18:43,920 --> 01:18:48,080
 be we can become an echo chamber as well so just through the questions that you're asking us

688
01:18:48,080 --> 01:18:52,400
 he's already running and trying to get the data out there in the format you want to see it in the

689
01:18:52,400 --> 01:18:57,600
 public hand so i feel like i feel like that needs to be something we need your feedback on is some

690
01:18:57,600 --> 01:19:02,640
 of the internet improvements or website improvements he's made we need your improvement we need your

691
01:19:02,640 --> 01:19:08,800
 updates on and your input for a running start on the training programs and the that sort of

692
01:19:08,800 --> 01:19:13,840
 thing and then we'll get into the oversight after the next several meetings but our idea would be

693
01:19:13,840 --> 01:19:19,280
 to put everything in in a fashion there to where we can turn it over to you and let you talk to us

694
01:19:21,280 --> 01:19:29,600
 okay um lillian and then camia yeah i i think that um and someone said it earlier i mean if

695
01:19:29,600 --> 01:19:34,160
 each of us on the committee i think if i would like to hear i know that you're saying is suggesting

696
01:19:34,160 --> 01:19:39,200
 that each committee member talked to staff but i would like to hear what other committee members

697
01:19:39,200 --> 01:19:44,320
 have to say so maybe if we could push back the meetings and the next time that we meet that we

698
01:19:44,320 --> 01:19:48,560
 would allow each of us maybe to have the four minutes like like others did just to kind of

699
01:19:48,560 --> 01:19:53,440
 share and kind of just kind of process everything together as a committee because

700
01:19:53,440 --> 01:19:57,120
 there's lots of conversations that we could have between the people that are calling in but we don't

701
01:19:57,120 --> 01:20:02,000
 out of respect for them but i still feel like we need to process some things together as a committee

702
01:20:02,000 --> 01:20:06,880
 before we even go into recommendations or anything like that yeah i think we're saying the same thing

703
01:20:06,880 --> 01:20:12,080
 though i mean if we can if we can sit down with each of you and and say you know here's our here's

704
01:20:12,080 --> 01:20:16,800
 everything that came out put it into a matrix for you and say you know what we forgot about this it

705
01:20:16,800 --> 01:20:21,680
 may spur other ideas things but the idea would be to put that together for all of you to talk

706
01:20:21,680 --> 01:20:27,840
 through together it can't if it's just freewheeling it without any structure where you're going to get

707
01:20:27,840 --> 01:20:31,520
 very frustrated camion

708
01:20:31,520 --> 01:20:44,320
 here i can't we can't hear you sorry okay um first i want to say thank you

709
01:20:44,320 --> 01:20:54,560
 to sarah for what seems like a pretty good digested uh recounting of the questions that we had and the

710
01:20:54,560 --> 01:20:59,520
 the things that we wanted to review so i really appreciate that work and the powerpoint that you

711
01:20:59,520 --> 01:21:05,280
 did and the leading questions that's going to be very helpful um i tried to click on some of

712
01:21:05,280 --> 01:21:10,560
 the links in the pdf that you sent the only one that i could get to open was the one to the

713
01:21:11,120 --> 01:21:16,480
 denton police department link so i was wondering if you could like maybe just send us an email with

714
01:21:16,480 --> 01:21:24,240
 those links because that would be helpful and this is slightly unrelated but is there a way that

715
01:21:24,240 --> 01:21:31,680
 someone can send us like the open meetings act information just so that we know okay that would

716
01:21:31,680 --> 01:21:35,440
 be helpful because i feel like there's a couple meetings where we're learning new things about it

717
01:21:35,440 --> 01:21:40,240
 and i'd like to know i didn't know i couldn't have my camera off you know for instance so

718
01:21:40,240 --> 01:21:45,120
 i'd like to know because sometimes i'm eating back here right and so this is on the internet

719
01:21:45,120 --> 01:21:51,840
 forever and you know what i'm saying so i'm like i'd like to know like what what my responsibilities

720
01:21:51,840 --> 01:21:57,280
 are while i'm on here so as long as as long as that thank you for that as long as we have a quorum

721
01:21:57,280 --> 01:22:04,480
 uh you know it's fine that we have enough cameras on but um if you're asking a question you need to

722
01:22:04,480 --> 01:22:08,400
 be seen and so if you could just kind of remember that if you're if you need to turn it off we've

723
01:22:08,400 --> 01:22:13,040
 got a quorum and eat that's fine but if you're asking questions that people have to see you asking

724
01:22:13,040 --> 01:22:20,560
 them so does that sound fair to everyone that we'll we'll break off to last two or three of

725
01:22:20,560 --> 01:22:25,040
 our staff to kind of sit down with you go through work our way through the questions that um that

726
01:22:25,040 --> 01:22:29,760
 sarah shared with you and then kind of organize that into a matrix for you to talk about i mean

727
01:22:29,760 --> 01:22:34,320
 there could be a lot of these issues once we go through them that that are either in progress or

728
01:22:34,320 --> 01:22:39,120
 we're partly there that you might want us to simply add modules for instance john are you are you

729
01:22:39,120 --> 01:22:45,440
 waving your hands on yes madam chair i was i was wanting to get a copy of that document that

730
01:22:45,440 --> 01:22:50,320
 sarah just just showed on the screen have we received that already or is it something that

731
01:22:50,320 --> 01:22:56,800
 is to come i i sent it by email i think around five right before the committee meeting

732
01:22:56,800 --> 01:23:02,320
 i can share again i'll recheck the links um and make sure they all function and then

733
01:23:02,320 --> 01:23:06,640
 resend them again sorry about that if it's in there i'll go back and look my my assistant

734
01:23:06,640 --> 01:23:11,120
 gave me some documents i did not remember that one so thank you yes and see

735
01:23:11,120 --> 01:23:19,520
 yeah madam chair uh honestly i want to say that i don't i'm not certain that we probably should

736
01:23:19,520 --> 01:23:25,280
 take off next week then because i feel like we might actually run out of time uh discussing the

737
01:23:25,280 --> 01:23:32,000
 remaining items with just two weeks i mean or two more meetings uh one in particular which is not

738
01:23:32,000 --> 01:23:36,320
 to be the elephant in the room is going to be when we discuss the oversight committee i think

739
01:23:36,320 --> 01:23:40,960
 that in and of itself is going to take up the whole two and a half hours that we allot for time

740
01:23:40,960 --> 01:23:45,760
 which means we're not going to be able to really discuss the education or the policy in and of

741
01:23:45,760 --> 01:23:51,360
 itself so my opinion i don't know how that's going to work with staff or anybody else i just don't

742
01:23:51,360 --> 01:23:56,480
 think we should take next week off because here in two weeks i don't think we'll still have a

743
01:23:56,480 --> 01:24:06,560
 consensus of what we were chartered to do and to yancey's point i agree with him if we can impose

744
01:24:06,560 --> 01:24:12,000
 on you but if not we have built in two more meetings and then and then move back our report

745
01:24:12,000 --> 01:24:18,000
 to council until october 5th so um but i agree with him it's going to be a meeting conversation

746
01:24:18,000 --> 01:24:25,280
 and probably not something that'd be achievable in one meeting so are you guys okay with either

747
01:24:25,280 --> 01:24:30,240
 coming back next week or taking a week off and then come back and pushing it back to october

748
01:24:30,240 --> 01:24:39,520
 um just kind of give me a general consensus if you're okay with taking off next week just

749
01:24:39,520 --> 01:24:48,880
 raise your hand up guys if we're okay with taking off next week taking off next week

750
01:24:48,880 --> 01:24:59,120
 you can come back and we've kind of pushed it back yeah what is that gary gary is that a yay or nay

751
01:24:59,120 --> 01:25:04,480
 i agree with yancey i would prefer to meet next week and keep the momentum going

752
01:25:04,480 --> 01:25:09,600
 but you're going to give us two options i just ask a question

753
01:25:09,600 --> 01:25:15,040
 carol i have a board meeting on thursday so i can't meet thursday

754
01:25:17,040 --> 01:25:20,160
 i have class on thursday so be available okay

755
01:25:20,160 --> 01:25:31,360
 i think if we're and going to staff sit down and with each member and kind of interview them

756
01:25:31,360 --> 01:25:36,160
 it might be beneficial to have those two weeks just so we can kind of framework it better for

757
01:25:36,160 --> 01:25:42,000
 september 3rd as long as everyone in the committee could commit to an additional meeting i can pull

758
01:25:42,000 --> 01:25:48,800
 back up the um that first slide that shows the proposed additional meetings um because that would

759
01:25:48,800 --> 01:25:54,480
 be important then to have one more meeting i do think more time will be necessary it's either we

760
01:25:54,480 --> 01:25:59,360
 can fit another meeting in or add that meeting to the end so let me just share that screen

761
01:25:59,360 --> 01:26:05,200
 one more time um to show you what that proposed date looked like

762
01:26:09,520 --> 01:26:17,360
 so it was we do have september 3rd and september 10th scheduled we proposed to add september 17th

763
01:26:17,360 --> 01:26:23,920
 we know that will be necessary and we may even need september 24th to finalize that

764
01:26:23,920 --> 01:26:28,960
 just depending on how long those discussions take on the 10th and the 17th just wanted to

765
01:26:28,960 --> 01:26:48,800
 show that one more time so we have a possibility of four meetings left rather than two even taking

766
01:26:48,800 --> 01:26:51,600
 these weeks off okay yes

767
01:26:54,560 --> 01:26:59,200
 and camion if you want to send us the information to to sarah we'll get we'll get out to everybody

768
01:26:59,200 --> 01:27:06,160
 right away whatever you have but we'll ask we'll we'll we'll ask our staff to sit down with each

769
01:27:06,160 --> 01:27:10,080
 of you for a couple hours if you could make the time and if it if you don't need that long that's

770
01:27:10,080 --> 01:27:14,400
 fine and just try to get it organized to so you can have a productive conversation

771
01:27:21,440 --> 01:27:32,000
 yes angela i think yancy was his hand up was before i'm sorry i didn't see yes yancy

772
01:27:32,000 --> 01:27:38,080
 so i see that we have uh two meetings and a proposed two additional meetings

773
01:27:38,080 --> 01:27:44,640
 my question is uh so if it's going to be a total of four meetings are we going to have like

774
01:27:44,640 --> 01:27:49,440
 three work session meetings and then the fourth meeting is just to finalize the report

775
01:27:49,440 --> 01:27:53,440
 or is that fourth meeting going to be another work meeting and then we're going to have to have

776
01:27:53,440 --> 01:27:58,320
 another meeting in order to finalize the report to bring back to council i'm just trying to get a

777
01:27:58,320 --> 01:28:04,880
 grasp on how these meetings are going to go and uh when when will the finalized report be presented

778
01:28:04,880 --> 01:28:08,560
 to council are we going to continue to work because we're going to have to have a meeting to

779
01:28:08,560 --> 01:28:16,800
 finalize everything yeah we were hoping to have um the uh meeting and on the 24th is sort of that

780
01:28:16,800 --> 01:28:21,520
 last day if we needed to tighten up more recommendations on any of these items that

781
01:28:21,520 --> 01:28:26,480
 we could do it then with the draft report that have it have a report provided to council on

782
01:28:26,480 --> 01:28:32,800
 october 5th at their lunch meeting we really see if we can get all the information from the

783
01:28:32,800 --> 01:28:38,320
 committee members and get it organized well we can probably jump right into many of these topics

784
01:28:38,320 --> 01:28:44,400
 the first meeting or two michael's going to need a solid half a meeting probably to go through some

785
01:28:44,400 --> 01:28:51,680
 of the oversight committee i guess there's kind of a linear continuum of options that from possible

786
01:28:51,680 --> 01:28:57,280
 to not possible before we get into that discussion so we're probably going to need a couple meetings

787
01:28:57,280 --> 01:29:01,120
 for that as well we figured that we'd probably need area all of the meetings if we have to slip

788
01:29:01,120 --> 01:29:06,720
 back we'll talk about it but the idea was to get this report to them no later than their lunch

789
01:29:06,720 --> 01:29:18,400
 meeting in october anybody else having yes willy

790
01:29:18,400 --> 01:29:28,960
 you're on they get uh as far as i'm concerned the suggestion to meet with staff

791
01:29:28,960 --> 01:29:35,360
 just solved all the concerns i have because i'll say to them the one area that

792
01:29:36,320 --> 01:29:42,400
 that i am concerned about and would like to have it in the report somewhere i can just say that and

793
01:29:42,400 --> 01:29:49,360
 then as the city manager said that he will the staff will take all of these things that we're

794
01:29:49,360 --> 01:29:54,800
 saying this is where i where i am and then put them together and then then we have something that

795
01:29:54,800 --> 01:30:00,240
 i think we can just work with and say oh yeah i think that's good right there and just have

796
01:30:00,240 --> 01:30:06,240
 comments about that uh the chief really got my attention what he talked about if these if these

797
01:30:06,240 --> 01:30:13,680
 police officers are asked to take all of this training and the amount of money that it would

798
01:30:13,680 --> 01:30:20,800
 cost to do that and the amount of time it just communicated to me i don't know what i'm talking

799
01:30:20,800 --> 01:30:28,720
 about then if i come in and say you need to do this and my one of my concerns is the required

800
01:30:28,720 --> 01:30:38,640
 training what's required and why when is it required and he said if they're going to specialize

801
01:30:38,640 --> 01:30:44,000
 then they need to have this training so they would decide to take that training instead of

802
01:30:44,000 --> 01:30:49,120
 something else this is these are things that we're just not in positions to know we don't know this

803
01:30:49,120 --> 01:30:55,280
 stuff so i'm not going to waste my time and their time trying to tell them what to do in that area

804
01:30:55,280 --> 01:31:02,880
 there's a general thing about training i want to say in the report as a citizen on the committee

805
01:31:02,880 --> 01:31:10,480
 here's what i'd like to say and i hope it's it's communicated well this is not communicating well

806
01:31:10,480 --> 01:31:16,160
 when you say i just want you to get all the training you can get lord help me what does that mean

807
01:31:16,160 --> 01:31:23,840
 so i think the when i talk to staff i'm pretty sure they'll help me figure out what i'm trying

808
01:31:23,840 --> 01:31:27,840
 to say when i if i have anything to say about training so i think it's a good idea

809
01:31:27,840 --> 01:31:39,840
 yes fronda i just have a question about does the union uh and the department

810
01:31:39,840 --> 01:31:44,560
 they have a memorandum of understanding or memorandum of agreement that we can see

811
01:31:46,320 --> 01:31:55,360
 we can get that out to everyone okay thank you john uh madam chair are we going to have a

812
01:31:55,360 --> 01:32:01,200
 chance for everybody to give their four minutes and you can all listen to one another i'm hoping

813
01:32:01,200 --> 01:32:07,840
 that uh i like lily and i'd kind of like to make sure i hear what others say so if i'm just listening

814
01:32:07,840 --> 01:32:13,600
 to myself uh i don't think i get the benefit of of what others are trying to say so hopefully

815
01:32:13,600 --> 01:32:19,520
 over the next several meetings we'll have a chance to do our four minutes i'm sure we can work that

816
01:32:19,520 --> 01:32:28,720
 in yes angela uh and to piggyback on john baines i guess for clarity what i hear is you want your

817
01:32:28,720 --> 01:32:36,320
 staff members to sit down with each of us to help us articulate what we want to bring to the committee

818
01:32:36,320 --> 01:32:43,040
 me myself i i feel like i'm pretty articulate on my own um and i like mr baines would be really

819
01:32:43,040 --> 01:32:52,240
 interested in hearing as a committee how we feel so i guess i didn't understand why we needed if

820
01:32:52,240 --> 01:32:56,960
 we're going to have that conversation as a committee while we also need to sit down with

821
01:32:56,960 --> 01:33:03,440
 an individual person is that going to be for those who feel like they need help with articulation or

822
01:33:03,440 --> 01:33:08,240
 is everybody going to have to do that i think it's i think it's both i think the idea would be that

823
01:33:08,240 --> 01:33:14,720
 to get everything out there all the ideas are pertaining to to these the first meeting and then

824
01:33:14,720 --> 01:33:19,520
 give you all a chance to to talk as well but at least you've got everything there otherwise what

825
01:33:19,520 --> 01:33:24,240
 happens is we're going to have all these ideas we're going to take another meeting to try to

826
01:33:24,240 --> 01:33:29,280
 organize them and have a discussion on the same ideas so if we can if we can do that work up front

827
01:33:29,280 --> 01:33:33,760
 we can help we can kind of expedite the committee i mean i'm trying to not take take this thing into

828
01:33:33,760 --> 01:33:38,960
 november right so if if we can if we could do both and then just say here's what everybody told us

829
01:33:38,960 --> 01:33:43,680
 here's all the the themes and you know here's areas that are you know we've dealt with already

830
01:33:43,680 --> 01:33:48,400
 here's areas that are missing you all have that and can talk through it i think it's much more

831
01:33:48,400 --> 01:33:53,200
 practical that way otherwise we're just going to be wrapping up your the same comments after that

832
01:33:53,200 --> 01:33:59,600
 meeting next week so is that not what that survey was for where we were asked to give that information

833
01:33:59,600 --> 01:34:03,920
 it is i i think that to be fair i think some people are more comfortable with that than others

834
01:34:03,920 --> 01:34:09,120
 we've only got a couple of them back and and and i think that there's probably a lot of opinions

835
01:34:09,120 --> 01:34:14,320
 like willie's that you know i really we need to sit down and say look is there things missing what's

836
01:34:14,320 --> 01:34:20,080
 important to you take those questions there not not everybody responds to these survey questions

837
01:34:20,080 --> 01:34:23,840
 the same way and so i think just sitting down saying look here's here's what we were told

838
01:34:23,840 --> 01:34:28,320
 you guys you guys have all the information go ahead and continue talking are there things that

839
01:34:28,320 --> 01:34:32,720
 that are missing off the list oftentimes when you have something like that saying you know what

840
01:34:32,720 --> 01:34:37,440
 that spurred another thought and that's not here let's let's talk about it

841
01:34:37,440 --> 01:34:43,920
 but i'm just trying to avoid additional meetings to capture what you're going to discuss next week

842
01:34:43,920 --> 01:34:50,640
 and that way willie gets company and lunch and all the other stuff and so we accommodate him

843
01:34:53,040 --> 01:35:00,160
 yes both so mr baines is your concern lily and you as well um and maybe even you angela that

844
01:35:00,160 --> 01:35:05,920
 because i'm i'm i'm hearing what they're saying in regards to you sit down you get everything out

845
01:35:05,920 --> 01:35:15,120
 they capture it and then we still have four minutes uh in right to to share essentially what

846
01:35:15,120 --> 01:35:20,640
 summarized hopefully in that meeting without the pressure of them having to sort it all out in the

847
01:35:20,640 --> 01:35:25,520
 actual meeting that we shared mr baines is that your concern though that there may be something

848
01:35:25,520 --> 01:35:32,080
 before you sit down with the city staffers that would be helped by you hearing from the other

849
01:35:32,080 --> 01:35:39,120
 committee members is that am i making sense so that therefore if you don't hear us on the front end

850
01:35:39,120 --> 01:35:44,480
 when you sit down with the city staffers it won't be as comprehensive as it otherwise would have been

851
01:35:44,480 --> 01:35:54,240
 in your mind uh thank you uh bo for that request at this point i just hear background noise i hear

852
01:35:54,240 --> 01:36:04,000
 there's a lot of things that have been presented but i'm not really sure i have a feeling of where

853
01:36:04,000 --> 01:36:12,640
 everyone is on the issues so as they give their four minutes i think it will give us a chance to

854
01:36:12,640 --> 01:36:20,080
 to communicate our feeling uh and sometimes the feelings bullet points don't always communicate

855
01:36:20,080 --> 01:36:26,800
 your feelings so even though we will write those uh bullet points down i want to hit your feeling

856
01:36:26,800 --> 01:36:34,480
 and that's why i think it's important that we have a chance to to articulate uh and clarify

857
01:36:34,480 --> 01:36:39,440
 and amplify anything that we write down so that that for me that's what the purpose is i like both

858
01:36:39,440 --> 01:36:44,240
 the writing but i also like the hearing as well but you don't care if that's before or after

859
01:36:44,240 --> 01:36:51,600
 we meet with the city staff it matters not to me i'm okay i'm okay thank you for asking

860
01:36:51,600 --> 01:36:57,200
 i'm the same way to me it doesn't matter if it's before or after i just want to hear what the

861
01:36:57,200 --> 01:37:02,400
 committee members have to say rather than what staff thinks that the committee members said to

862
01:37:02,400 --> 01:37:08,080
 them you know i want to hear straight from the committee members yeah i think this would this

863
01:37:08,080 --> 01:37:11,280
 would be a lot easier if we were able to get together in the room because we'd sit up there

864
01:37:11,280 --> 01:37:18,400
 with a whiteboard and start talking about themes but um this is not the easiest way to do it so

865
01:37:18,400 --> 01:37:21,920
 we're happy to accommodate you both ways and kind of get out of your way

866
01:37:21,920 --> 01:37:27,840
 yes nancy

867
01:37:27,840 --> 01:37:34,000
 uh i don't know if it's possible maybe the chief can chime in or something

868
01:37:34,640 --> 01:37:39,200
 but i think that if we're going to start working together and trying to voice everybody you know

869
01:37:39,200 --> 01:37:45,760
 here here everybody i know for myself i do better with in-person meetings so we got the training

870
01:37:45,760 --> 01:37:50,800
 center i'm not sure if it's open and we can maintain social distancing and all those guidelines

871
01:37:50,800 --> 01:37:58,880
 but for me being able to see somebody and hearing in that way uh i think it's better even if staff

872
01:37:58,880 --> 01:38:04,640
 is there that day we can actually try to hash out a lot of a lot of material as opposed to going

873
01:38:04,640 --> 01:38:09,200
 back and forth and then we have to try to put it in some type of report and now we have to wait

874
01:38:09,200 --> 01:38:15,120
 to next week to discuss it maybe if we have it on the whiteboard like the city manager just said you

875
01:38:15,120 --> 01:38:19,840
 can just jot down these ideas on the whiteboard and we can just go down the list so i don't know

876
01:38:19,840 --> 01:38:23,360
 if it's possible that we can arrange like a meeting place i know the training center is

877
01:38:23,360 --> 01:38:27,360
 is large enough and i'm not sure what the schedule is like but maybe that's an option if

878
01:38:28,400 --> 01:38:31,360
 people are willing to meet in person as opposed to over the zoom call

879
01:38:31,360 --> 01:38:45,760
 so yancy were you saying that um all of us would meet at the at the training center at once

880
01:38:45,760 --> 01:38:52,720
 i just think in-person meetings are better than over the zoom call so in my opinion i think the

881
01:38:52,720 --> 01:38:56,880
 training center i know our training center is large enough to accommodate all of us with the

882
01:38:56,880 --> 01:39:02,160
 social distancing for those that want to practice the social distancing and i'm sure city have a

883
01:39:02,160 --> 01:39:07,360
 spot that we can probably meet if we need to do some type of work session but i think back to what

884
01:39:07,360 --> 01:39:12,320
 the city manager just said that we can write stuff down on the whiteboard and then go down the list

885
01:39:12,320 --> 01:39:19,280
 and start discussing those things as they come up as opposed to we having to let uh staff or sarah

886
01:39:19,280 --> 01:39:24,400
 come up with a form and then she email it out to us and now a whole nother week have passed before

887
01:39:24,400 --> 01:39:29,280
 we even can discuss that we possibly can discuss we can get the discussion out the way that night

888
01:39:29,280 --> 01:39:39,040
 good tana i think that's a great idea and um i also think that it would be great to be

889
01:39:39,040 --> 01:39:44,960
 in the same room with everyone so that we could possibly group up on um like-minded issues that

890
01:39:44,960 --> 01:39:52,080
 we we you know there's five or ten of us that care more about data and you know capturing data as a

891
01:39:52,080 --> 01:40:00,480
 part of the um like excessive force like capturing excessive force data then that that group can group

892
01:40:00,480 --> 01:40:05,840
 together and then another group and we're doing it in a way that's transparent um and accountable

893
01:40:05,840 --> 01:40:11,120
 because we're all together um because i know that you guys have discouraged us from you know gathering

894
01:40:11,120 --> 01:40:16,160
 together outside of the meeting and i i think it would be really helpful for us to come together

895
01:40:17,440 --> 01:40:22,160
 is there anybody that is uncomfortable if we can if we can social distance all of you and

896
01:40:22,160 --> 01:40:27,280
 at the training center and doing it that way it that would that would avoid you know we could

897
01:40:27,280 --> 01:40:33,360
 still do the pre interviews we want but the the reason we set up that process that are suggested

898
01:40:33,360 --> 01:40:37,680
 the way we did is this is it's the only way i think to make this an efficient process if we

899
01:40:37,680 --> 01:40:44,000
 stay on zoom but if if you want us to get if we can find a venue where we can social distance you

900
01:40:44,000 --> 01:40:49,360
 we could probably just means willy's gonna have to yell a little louder but we'll get everybody

901
01:40:49,360 --> 01:40:54,480
 spaced out and can everybody one room it's it's really up to you it's a matter of comfort right

902
01:40:54,480 --> 01:40:58,240
 now some people are a little more worried than others but they're getting out and doing that

903
01:40:58,240 --> 01:41:04,160
 uh todd how many people are we speaking of

904
01:41:06,720 --> 01:41:15,200
 25 or 30 so we've got the rooms to accommodate it we have a room okay just so everyone would know

905
01:41:15,200 --> 01:41:20,400
 i'm a i'm a cancer survivor and i'm almost 70 so i kind of fit into two of those categories so

906
01:41:20,400 --> 01:41:27,200
 i'm a little timid at times so um we'll just see how it goes but that's just me you know others

907
01:41:27,200 --> 01:41:40,080
 may not have those uh yeah understood john thank you ronda yeah i was going to say um

908
01:41:40,080 --> 01:41:48,320
 i don't have any underlying conditions but i am uh older so i'm just wondering if there's a way to

909
01:41:48,320 --> 01:41:56,400
 do a combination of um zoom for those who don't want to you know social distance in a group and

910
01:41:56,400 --> 01:42:00,160
 those others who aren't concerned about it meet face to face

911
01:42:00,160 --> 01:42:09,280
 i think it's possible i mean i was at a chamber meeting this morning and i think half of us were

912
01:42:09,280 --> 01:42:13,440
 there and the other half were on zoom is that correct gary

913
01:42:13,440 --> 01:42:22,960
 yeah it is cheryl but i would tell you being on the zoom unless you're able to communicate both

914
01:42:22,960 --> 01:42:29,040
 ways people on zoom are more watching a meeting as opposed to participating in the meeting

915
01:42:29,040 --> 01:42:32,080
 we'll figure it out

916
01:42:32,080 --> 01:42:39,360
 yeah we're just trying we're just having a discussion here whether we can satisfy the

917
01:42:39,360 --> 01:42:43,600
 open meetings act with doing that i'd have to i probably just need a little bit of time talking

918
01:42:43,600 --> 01:42:48,080
 to our our city attorney's office to see if there's any uh obstacles to that

919
01:42:50,480 --> 01:42:56,160
 there's always an obstacle we'll figure it out yes camya is it possible for people to do a

920
01:42:56,160 --> 01:43:00,720
 phone conference in and be on speakerphone if there's not possibility of video

921
01:43:00,720 --> 01:43:09,600
 is that a part of the open meetings act can people call in yeah i think i think we could

922
01:43:09,600 --> 01:43:16,160
 do that i think that might be easier just as well as we record these meetings so trying to do a dual

923
01:43:16,160 --> 01:43:23,120
 recording of zoom and in person probably doesn't work but if it was in person but on other attendees

924
01:43:23,120 --> 01:43:29,120
 on the phone that that would probably work better just need to investigate it a little further

925
01:43:29,120 --> 01:43:41,280
 let's just um are we done with the last item sarah item e yes okay so let's just um we're going to

926
01:43:42,640 --> 01:43:49,200
 in the meeting and we will kind of reconvene over there and figure it out and and talk with

927
01:43:49,200 --> 01:43:56,240
 todd and sarah and staff and see how we can best accommodate an in-person meeting and get back to

928
01:43:56,240 --> 01:44:03,840
 you guys okay and we'll probably still have staff reach out to you to see if you're interested in

929
01:44:03,840 --> 01:44:08,960
 sitting down and working through those questions if you don't want to that's fine but if you'd like

930
01:44:08,960 --> 01:44:15,760
 to take us up on it it's always easier to have a starting place thank you todd okay that's willy

931
01:44:15,760 --> 01:44:24,720
 we can't hear you willy you got to push the button try to push the button i i do i want

932
01:44:24,720 --> 01:44:32,480
 because it's just simple it only takes me 30 minutes i will say this is what i want here's why

933
01:44:34,320 --> 01:44:40,640
 so communicate that to the committee and then here to staff so staff will say yes i know that's what

934
01:44:40,640 --> 01:44:48,720
 you want i can hear you we can't do that oh and here's why or we can i will tell the committee

935
01:44:48,720 --> 01:44:57,200
 that then i'm good okay now i think lillian had a good point too as well and and uh katrina

936
01:44:57,200 --> 01:45:03,360
 well it really would help me to hear the rest of you i i want to because you'll say something

937
01:45:03,360 --> 01:45:09,200
 in meetings like this i think if we meet individually personally in a group we'll hear

938
01:45:09,200 --> 01:45:14,400
 things that the others are concerned about and it will help us well i think well i didn't think

939
01:45:14,400 --> 01:45:20,240
 about that well yes that is something that i think needs to go into that report to the city

940
01:45:20,240 --> 01:45:24,480
 city council so i think we're we're moving in the right direction i think it's going to help us

941
01:45:24,480 --> 01:45:32,160
 come up with a report that is actionable that can work for the the police department in the city

942
01:45:32,160 --> 01:45:40,560
 so i feel good about that thank you willie will it be recorded if we meet together yes okay

943
01:45:40,560 --> 01:45:52,400
 okay so we're going to adjourn the meeting and um staff sarah will contact you with what what

944
01:45:52,400 --> 01:45:57,280
 conclusions and how we get this worked out um and then we'll see you at the next meeting

945
01:45:58,080 --> 01:46:02,560
 okay and i'd like a suggestion for brother bang to not to wear that hat without getting

946
01:46:02,560 --> 01:46:08,480
 me one like it i like that he doesn't wear he is very good so i want a hat like that

947
01:46:08,480 --> 01:46:11,920
 i got two for you brother i got two

948
01:46:11,920 --> 01:46:21,120
 all right good night everybody