WEBVTT

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 Okay, so here we are. It is August 7th, Friday August 7th. This is the City of Denton's public

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 art meeting. And we're going to start now by starting with item one, or item 2A, which

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 is going to be to consider the meeting, the minutes from last month's meeting. Does anyone

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 have any comments or changes to make from last month's meeting?

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 Michelle, just before you go into that, on item one, the presentation to the members

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 of the public, we do not have any.

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 Okay, then let's start again then. All right. So item one, we're not going to skip it. It's

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 just that we don't have anybody confirmed to be in this meeting to give us comments

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 today.

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 All right. So then we'll move on to 2A. Would anybody like to approve the meeting minutes

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 from last month?

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 I would like to approve the meeting minutes from last month.

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 Thank you, Mr. Steele. Could anybody second it?

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 I'll second.

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 All right. Well, then are we going to go like we did last month and do it by name for everyone

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 who's in favor?

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 That would be preferred. Thank you.

00:01:12.640 --> 00:01:19.520
 Okay, Gary. Thanks. All right. So let me make a note then. This first time it might be a

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 little bit slow. Mr. Steele.

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 Aye.

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 Ms. Ismert.

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 Aye.

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 Is it Ms. Eggert? Yes.

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 Aye.

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 Aye. Okay. Who else do we have in here? Meredith, do we?

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 Aye.

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 And is that everybody?

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 Yourself.

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 And myself. Okay. Other than that, and I will approve it. So there's just five of us. Okay.

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 Do we have a quorum?

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 There's nine. So yes, we are a quorum.

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 Right? Isn't it a simple majority? Gary, help me out.

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 That's correct.

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 We're good. Okay. All right. Then let's move on to number two. Receive a report, hold a

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 discussion and give direction to staff regarding a temporary art program and associated program

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 guidelines.

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 Okay. Let me pull that up. I have two things to share with you. In your packet, there was

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 some guidelines that, let's see, make sure you can see this. There we go. So this was

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 a draft for discussion purposes that was in your packet that Jessica had put together

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 regarding temporary public art program. Not sure if everyone had an opportunity to review

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 that. We could, you know, discuss this item and come back next month with some updates

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 if you'd like. I do have a short PowerPoint of some additional sculptures that somebody

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 reached out to us over the past two weeks that's interested in possibly leasing them

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 to the city. That could be a part of that program if you wanted to consider that just

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 as a future idea. But if we could maybe just discuss this at this point in regards to any

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 comments or thoughts in regards to the temporary art program guidelines that were provided

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 to you. I read through it as we were sitting here waiting for the meeting to start and

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 it all looks good to me. The one comment that I would make is about the funding and stipends.

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 This calls out a really specific number of $1,500. And so the one comment I wanted to

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 make was that is definitely a good stipend for someone to do a temporary public art project.

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 But I wonder if there's a way that we could leave it open so that depending on what the

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 opportunity actually is that funding or stipend amount could change. Does that make sense?

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 So how would you determine that variability? Well, the one thing I can think of for example

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 is the difference between bringing a large scale sculpture to a site and being responsible

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 for transportation installation and then removal versus participating in one of those opportunities

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 that's more of like a wrap around some sort of electrical box. Like the stipend for an

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 electrical box application I would imagine would be much smaller than something that

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 required a lot more work on the artist's behalf. So something on the electrical box, I mean,

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 you could leave that there. You may not need a stipend for that if it was something that

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 we did and we select artists for designs. And we said, hey, we're going to do five electrical

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 boxes and we're calling for designs on that art. And you could go through basically an

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 RFP process for that. We're going to have to pay for that sticker in that installation

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 on the box itself. And it could be up there for 10 years until it's to a point where it's

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 either vandalized or it's starting to come off or it fades.

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 So maybe the electrical box example wasn't the best example because that's not as temporary

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 as like a sculpture being on the site for a year. But I guess I just thought that if

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 we could build in a way that that stipend is adjustable based on what the opportunity

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 actually involves, I don't know if that makes sense.

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 I guess one way is if we have a temporary sculpture program and let's say you have pads,

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 you have 10 different pads in various locations and maybe it's by size. In that way, you could

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 be specific and say these pads that are four by four are going to be $1,000 for three years.

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 And this pad that is 20 by 15 is a larger piece, obviously a higher scale and maybe

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 that's $1,500 or $2,000 for three years because the expectation is it's going to be a larger

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 piece, maybe even more expensive. So that's something that we could try to articulate in

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 a future draft if that's the way the group wants to go.

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 Right, and I guess we don't really know what these opportunities are actually going to

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 be yet. So I just thought if right now we're just drafting a document that can be applied

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 to a bunch of different kinds of opportunities in the future, can we draft that part of it

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 in a way that builds in that kind of flexibility?

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 Maybe the beginning level is $1,500 and then for larger projects, additional funds may

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 be considered by the committee.

00:08:05.120 --> 00:08:09.800
 I like that, Ed, keeping it as flexible as possible because also you have to take into

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 term not just scope but like inflation and our city's budget. We know that we are going

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 into what's probably going to be a very difficult budget process. So yeah, I like that idea

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 of making it as vague and open as possible, not only to accommodate different types of

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 sculpture and artwork but also to -- well, and even beyond that, like if we did something

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 that was theater arts based or written art based, I like being able to have as much flexibility

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 and the people who take our places down the road to have as much flexibility as possible.

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 Is there any thought by any of the board members in regards to if a piece is sold while it's

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 on city property that a percentage of the sale would go back to the public art kind

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 of kitty for future lease opportunities?

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 Is that normal?

00:09:02.400 --> 00:09:03.400
 Yeah, that's normal.

00:09:03.400 --> 00:09:04.400
 It is.

00:09:04.400 --> 00:09:05.400
 Okay.

00:09:05.400 --> 00:09:09.640
 Alicia, what have you seen that's the standard percentage?

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 I think typically like municipalities take less than a commercial gallery. A commercial

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 gallery would normally take 50%. But I would think that the city would take something more

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 along the lines of like, you know, I don't really know. I know that Gary has participated

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 in programs like this before, right, Gary? What did the other city that you did this

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 with take?

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 I think in Arlington, it was either 15% or 20%. We never did sell one before I left.

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 But it was, you know, 15% or 20% that would go back.

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 Yeah.

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 We can also throw out 15% or 20%.

00:09:43.320 --> 00:09:45.240
 Okay.

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 Those pieces don't leave the site before like the agreement is over, correct? Or is that

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 up to the artist or do you have it in agreement? Like it's huge. I mean, in my experience,

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 it's been an agreement. Like if you sell a piece, it does not leave until the agreement

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 is complete or, you know.

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 The only issue that could come up with that in the context specific to temporary art is

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 you assume that it's outdoors or in a location where it could potentially get damaged in

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 one way or another. So the purchaser might want it sooner than later.

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 That's exactly what I was thinking.

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 Yeah. Or could we just replace it?

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 But whatever contract or agreement that you draw up for it would specify the amount of

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 time that it would be there. And if someone wanted to purchase it, you'd have to negotiate

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 the timeframe in which they would be able to secure it. So you're really talking about

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 two agreements.

00:10:51.960 --> 00:10:59.720
 Yeah. What we had in our agreement, it was there for three years. If for some reason,

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 if it was sold and it needed to leave before the end of that agreement, we'd either work

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 out a ratio of refund on the percentage of the time or the artist had to provide another

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 piece of art approved by the group to replace it during that timeframe. And then the piece

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 that was sold, obviously a percentage of that sale would come back. So that's how that framework

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 was set up.

00:11:26.240 --> 00:11:29.000
 Okay. I was just curious.

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 And making sure that they would be responsible for the replacement, like the cost of it,

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 I would imagine too, because I would hate to think that we pay to have something installed

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 and then someone buys it and then we have to pay to have something installed again.

00:11:41.600 --> 00:11:52.440
 Yeah. I'm curious as to why we want to even consider that as an option, rather than taking

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 the position that this is a piece that belongs to the city that we want to remain in place.

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 And it is temporary, you're right, Georgina, if it's a temporary piece, it's going to come

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 down that could go to someone's house or business after that.

00:12:08.240 --> 00:12:10.240
 Okay.

00:12:10.240 --> 00:12:16.540
 So I see your point.

00:12:16.540 --> 00:12:22.320
 I mean, obviously the easier solution is to just say that while it's under contract with

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 us for this exhibition, it won't be removed. So, you know, if it is sold, that new owner

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 doesn't get to have it until the exhibition ends. But I think that also what the kind

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 of exhibition that Gary was talking about was three years long. So that's very long.

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 And so I guess that's why they were open to this idea of, you know, if something sold,

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 it could potentially be taken down before that contract ended and replaced with something

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 else. But I think if the exhibition period is more like a year, it's totally reasonable

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 to just say, like, if it sells during that year, you know, the new owner just doesn't

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 get to have it until the year is over.

00:13:06.840 --> 00:13:13.680
 You guys, I might not be on the same page because I came in a little late. I was thinking

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 we were talking about the sculpture for the monument. What GDAC does, if people want to

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 purchase, because we do sell the art, if they want to purchase, they cannot remove the artwork

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 until after the exhibit has closed. And our percentage breakdown is 30-70, 30 to GDAC-70

00:13:37.540 --> 00:13:42.520
 to the artists. And that's a part of our contract.

00:13:42.520 --> 00:13:46.240
 In that specific instance, though, GDAC is a protected environment. What we're talking

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 about is temporary art, which would not be in a protected environment. And I think, Gary,

00:13:51.080 --> 00:13:55.200
 you'd mentioned exactly how many were sold during...

00:13:55.200 --> 00:14:03.520
 We didn't have any sold during that timeframe, but it was just about three years. The downside

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 of having it on a shorter timeframe is you're constantly looking to replace it, and it becomes

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 cumbersome. So we wanted to put a couple of years timeframe there so it wasn't a constant

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 shuffle of art too quickly.

00:14:18.600 --> 00:14:24.360
 I think... I don't know how many would get purchased if we start having them get sold

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 left and right. Maybe we'd want to reconsider it. But based on your experience, perhaps

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 we just make it so that if it's purchased, it's gone. We replace it with something else

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 quickly. The artist benefits, we benefit, and we move forward.

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 So we can look at those additions and amendments.

00:14:52.040 --> 00:15:01.180
 Anything about it? I just understood that the entire concept of the temporary art was

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 going to be things, not just like telephone rat boxes, but things that were going to be...

00:15:06.960 --> 00:15:12.480
 Like Ed had talked about, painting the streets and murals, stuff that couldn't be sold anyways.

00:15:12.480 --> 00:15:19.080
 You can't sell a light exhibit over a downtown building. You can't sell 3D paints to be a

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 traffic calming device. I guess I'm just still kind of... That's not meeting the expectations

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 that we had talked about in the past as temporary art is what I'm saying. And I'm not trying

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 to limit it. I'm just saying that this isn't something that we had mentioned.

00:15:35.800 --> 00:15:42.360
 Yeah, I think we're on the same page. I think rather than spend a lot of time in thinking

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 about it, we set some parameters. We move on. And if the parameters don't match what

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 we were expecting, then we adjust for that.

00:15:52.280 --> 00:16:01.380
 Okay. I think the only thing that would sell would be a sculpture, agreed. So I guess we

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 have to have it in the contract just in case, or in our draft of what the program is just

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 in case. But yeah, I'm actually more excited about those kinds of projects that are not

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 even saleable, but they're really just kind of like in a place for a short time and then

00:16:20.400 --> 00:16:22.600
 they go away.

00:16:22.600 --> 00:16:23.600
 Okay.

00:16:23.600 --> 00:16:29.040
 Yeah, we can add that. I guess one thing for discussion with the group and feedback is

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 a priority. With all the other projects we have going on, where does this fit into a

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 priority between the... I guess it'd be item D with the other sculptures we're trying to

00:16:41.600 --> 00:16:52.040
 get under works? Is this something that you want us to start tackling sooner, or is this

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 something that we can just kind of slowly work on until we get these other ones under

00:16:56.440 --> 00:17:02.080
 production and in place and then kind of launch this afterwards?

00:17:02.080 --> 00:17:07.640
 Remind me, did we not set money aside for this for our budget next year? I thought we

00:17:07.640 --> 00:17:16.000
 had set like $3,000 aside or something.

00:17:16.000 --> 00:17:19.800
 I don't have that in front of me, but I can double check and follow up.

00:17:19.800 --> 00:17:25.320
 Right. I mean, it certainly can wait until next month until we look at a final document

00:17:25.320 --> 00:17:28.520
 and are going to vote on accepting it or not.

00:17:28.520 --> 00:17:29.520
 Okay.

00:17:29.520 --> 00:17:32.160
 Don't you all think? Is that okay?

00:17:32.160 --> 00:17:40.160
 Yeah, my impression was that there would probably be no budget for this until the next year.

00:17:40.160 --> 00:17:41.160
 Right.

00:17:41.160 --> 00:17:42.160
 Yeah.

00:17:42.160 --> 00:17:49.040
 Okay. Were there any other things that we needed to talk about our temporary art program

00:17:49.040 --> 00:17:56.040
 and its guidelines? Anyone else have anything they want to get off their chest? Okay, so

00:17:56.040 --> 00:17:59.200
 we don't need to vote on that, so shall we move on to item C then?

00:17:59.200 --> 00:18:00.200
 Sure.

00:18:00.200 --> 00:18:02.200
 Gary, are you good for that?

00:18:02.200 --> 00:18:03.200
 Yes.

00:18:03.200 --> 00:18:07.320
 So we have agreed that we're going to come back and visit this next month and have some

00:18:07.320 --> 00:18:15.360
 sort of wording about items which may be purchased and what circumstances would entail if we

00:18:15.360 --> 00:18:20.240
 had a piece of art that could potentially be bought and it is bought while it's on display.

00:18:20.240 --> 00:18:25.520
 So let's move on to C, receive a report, hold a discussion and give staff direction regarding

00:18:25.520 --> 00:18:29.400
 the use of budgeted project funds for artist proposals.

00:18:29.400 --> 00:18:47.160
 Okay, let me pull that up.

00:18:47.160 --> 00:18:57.880
 Okay, this is a public art stipend research. I hope everybody can see this. That was done

00:18:57.880 --> 00:19:05.120
 by staff in regards to some other cities in regards to stipends that were provided for

00:19:05.120 --> 00:19:12.840
 artwork for projects. So as of right now, you can see in the second and third column

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 of stipends, majority of the top few, I guess there's five or six of the cities provided

00:19:20.680 --> 00:19:26.280
 no stipend and then there were five or six that provided a stipend. So it's a little

00:19:26.280 --> 00:19:36.000
 bit varied in regards to what that is in regards to the location. So I guess that's, you know,

00:19:36.000 --> 00:19:41.160
 something for the group to discuss in regards to the direction they went ahead. If we do

00:19:41.160 --> 00:19:48.000
 want to provide a stipend, what that is going to be for those proposals and, you know, where

00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:50.920
 the money will come from.

00:19:50.920 --> 00:19:57.280
 Okay, so comments from anybody about this?

00:19:57.280 --> 00:20:04.880
 Yes, if I could learn to push the unmute button. I like Lewisville and Richardson. I think

00:20:04.880 --> 00:20:10.560
 Lewisville, we would lower that amount just a little bit. Oops, it went away.

00:20:10.560 --> 00:20:14.920
 We have to, we're not allowed to show, we have to show everybody when there's discussion.

00:20:14.920 --> 00:20:24.960
 Sorry. That's all right. So Lewisville had the requirement that a stipend was applied

00:20:24.960 --> 00:20:31.800
 if it was over 100k, I think we could lower that. Richardson had that the stipend would

00:20:31.800 --> 00:20:40.040
 be 2.5% of the project amount. I gravitated towards those two variables for our specific

00:20:40.040 --> 00:20:50.160
 applications, but obviously it's open to discussion. I think we might lower ours to 50k, where

00:20:50.160 --> 00:20:58.920
 Lewisville is 100k and 2.5%, which is what Richardson has, I think is kind of works.

00:20:58.920 --> 00:21:01.480
 But what does everyone else think?

00:21:01.480 --> 00:21:07.200
 I'm curious about the rationale for this stipend. If we're talking about a stipend being given

00:21:07.200 --> 00:21:14.720
 to people we are soliciting proposals from, I don't, it may be something new that's happening

00:21:14.720 --> 00:21:21.560
 that I'm not aware of, but that's not typically how it's done. Especially at a time when there

00:21:21.560 --> 00:21:28.880
 are limited resources. One would think that we would want to have that money available

00:21:28.880 --> 00:21:39.480
 to the artists that we select to do the work. So I don't understand the rationale for it.

00:21:39.480 --> 00:21:45.960
 I think artists negotiating for artists come at this from a different perspective. From

00:21:45.960 --> 00:21:53.800
 a business perspective, it doesn't make sense to me that we would pay people to submit proposals

00:21:53.800 --> 00:21:55.920
 to us.

00:21:55.920 --> 00:22:01.800
 The Richardson requirement, it was the top three, if I remember correctly from the slides.

00:22:01.800 --> 00:22:06.520
 Even if I look at it, Ed, I'm not going to agree with it. And that's okay.

00:22:06.520 --> 00:22:11.080
 That's okay. Sure. And from my perspective, as a photographer, if someone reached out

00:22:11.080 --> 00:22:17.760
 to me and said, look, I'm considering two other people and I need you to do some mockup

00:22:17.760 --> 00:22:23.400
 photos of a very specific scene that's going to require models, that's going to require

00:22:23.400 --> 00:22:28.080
 props, that's going to require a lot of my time and work and research on lighting the

00:22:28.080 --> 00:22:34.920
 scene properly, I would be less inclined to apply unless there was some form of a stipend

00:22:34.920 --> 00:22:41.440
 applied. So I actually see the rationale from it. That's just my individual perspective.

00:22:41.440 --> 00:22:46.280
 And I do think that from an artist's perspective, it makes sense. But I also think there's another

00:22:46.280 --> 00:22:53.640
 side of that, where the artist knows that they are indeed competing with other potential

00:22:53.640 --> 00:23:02.440
 candidates. And that artist then would be on that artist to decide if that's something

00:23:02.440 --> 00:23:10.920
 they want to go forward with. I can tell you, I accept whatever it is the full body agrees

00:23:10.920 --> 00:23:16.760
 with. I will continue to say it does not make sense to me. It's not something that I have

00:23:16.760 --> 00:23:24.600
 ever done. So, and that's okay. I personally think it's more professional to offer the

00:23:24.600 --> 00:23:34.000
 stipend. Like for example, I mean, because this isn't for people who are throwing a proposals,

00:23:34.000 --> 00:23:37.480
 like a whole slew of people, this is for people that we've reached out to and you said you're

00:23:37.480 --> 00:23:43.660
 in the top three or however many you've qualified, we want you to do something. And so in a sense,

00:23:43.660 --> 00:23:49.400
 like I think even from a business perspective, like, I would expect if I was interviewing

00:23:49.400 --> 00:23:54.400
 for a position and I needed to travel, that they were going to pay for my flight and my

00:23:54.400 --> 00:24:00.360
 hotel room. That's completely within the realm of what we do in business. And so

00:24:00.360 --> 00:24:09.280
 Alisha, what's your experience with this?

00:24:09.280 --> 00:24:16.880
 I like the idea. So, in my head, the best way to explain this is like there are different

00:24:16.880 --> 00:24:27.800
 kinds of selection processes for different, all of a sudden my dog is there. Different

00:24:27.800 --> 00:24:33.560
 kinds of selection processes for different kinds of projects. So it makes sense to me

00:24:33.560 --> 00:24:40.720
 that for a project with a larger budget, like $100,000 or more, instead of just looking

00:24:40.720 --> 00:24:49.040
 at, so when we do an RFQ, a request for qualifications, we're asking for their CV and for images

00:24:49.040 --> 00:24:54.520
 of past projects. We're not asking them for a proposal for what they would do with this

00:24:54.520 --> 00:25:02.320
 site that we have, right? And then from that RFQ, we have all of these pre-qualified artists

00:25:02.320 --> 00:25:09.300
 that again, still haven't done any proposals for us. For smaller, like budget projects,

00:25:09.300 --> 00:25:15.560
 like $30,000 or so, it makes sense to just look at their past work and say that person

00:25:15.560 --> 00:25:21.080
 seems like the most qualified, let's go with them. And then basically just put them into

00:25:21.080 --> 00:25:28.320
 a contract right away and the proposal becomes part of that contract. But for a project that's

00:25:28.320 --> 00:25:38.600
 larger scale, bigger budget, to basically put all of our bets on one artist coming up

00:25:38.600 --> 00:25:43.840
 with the best proposal without even actually seeing their proposal and putting them under

00:25:43.840 --> 00:25:49.240
 contract for that much money before we even see what their idea would be is basically

00:25:49.240 --> 00:25:54.000
 like taking a huge risk on someone based on just seeing a couple images of their past

00:25:54.000 --> 00:26:01.400
 work, right? So for me, a big budget project, it does make sense to actually have like three

00:26:01.400 --> 00:26:07.800
 artists that we ask for proposals and then when we see those proposals, we decide which

00:26:07.800 --> 00:26:14.960
 artists to go with. So if we're asking them to do that work, to make a proposal, I think

00:26:14.960 --> 00:26:19.920
 we should pay them like without putting them under contract yet because we're basically

00:26:19.920 --> 00:26:24.920
 saying like we might not choose you, but we want you to do this work because we want to

00:26:24.920 --> 00:26:31.320
 see what your idea would be. And then like I think that document that Gary was showing

00:26:31.320 --> 00:26:39.040
 us, one of the other cities mentioned that once you get those proposals, you could potentially

00:26:39.040 --> 00:26:44.400
 use that proposal for a different site or a different project later on down the road.

00:26:44.400 --> 00:26:54.480
 So it's not always necessarily wasted money, right? So yeah, that's my kind of thought

00:26:54.480 --> 00:26:59.040
 around it is that yeah, maybe smaller budgets don't, we don't need to do this. We can just

00:26:59.040 --> 00:27:03.240
 go into contract, but bigger projects, bigger budgets, it makes sense.

00:27:03.240 --> 00:27:09.760
 And that's where the Lewisville cap comes into play and the way I'm hearing you describe

00:27:09.760 --> 00:27:16.720
 it, it's almost a mechanism designed to protect the city's investment because you could just

00:27:16.720 --> 00:27:25.040
 as easily go with an artist and throw everything at them and not receive what they advertise

00:27:25.040 --> 00:27:28.880
 they could actually provide.

00:27:28.880 --> 00:27:32.040
 It's kind of an interview basically, you know?

00:27:32.040 --> 00:27:38.440
 Yes, Lewisville was $100,000, anything if projects are more than $100,000.

00:27:38.440 --> 00:27:46.760
 And I think for our application, we could reduce that by 50% or more. So 50K or whatever

00:27:46.760 --> 00:27:54.380
 input anyone else provides, I think 100K would be a bit exorbitant for the type of stuff

00:27:54.380 --> 00:27:58.640
 that I've seen the committee do in the past years that I've been serving.

00:27:58.640 --> 00:28:05.960
 Well, then I think it raises the question. So let's just say as a number, we have an

00:28:05.960 --> 00:28:13.840
 $80,000 budget because right now Georgina and I and Michelle are serving on the interracial

00:28:13.840 --> 00:28:19.440
 fellowship projects subcommittee. And so that budget looks like it's going to fall somewhere

00:28:19.440 --> 00:28:28.040
 around $80,000. So if that $80,000 has to cover the cost of site preparation, in addition

00:28:28.040 --> 00:28:35.000
 to the fabrication and installation of whatever monument goes onto the site, we're already

00:28:35.000 --> 00:28:41.300
 eating away a lot at that $80,000 with all of those other costs, right?

00:28:41.300 --> 00:28:46.080
 So for a project of $80,000, if you think about all of the other money that's already

00:28:46.080 --> 00:28:54.600
 getting taken out, you're really only left over with maybe $50,000, $60,000 to actually

00:28:54.600 --> 00:29:01.680
 make a sculpture and to make a monument that's going to last potentially forever costs a

00:29:01.680 --> 00:29:06.360
 lot of money and materials and resources. So that doesn't actually leave a lot of money

00:29:06.360 --> 00:29:12.760
 left over for the artist to actually receive the fee, right? So to me, it actually does

00:29:12.760 --> 00:29:21.520
 make more sense to reserve this process of paying people to do proposals for bigger budget.

00:29:21.520 --> 00:29:32.240
 Actually, I think $100,000 does make sense to me in terms of a cap, but just because

00:29:32.240 --> 00:29:35.760
 of all those other expenses that end up getting rolled in.

00:29:35.760 --> 00:29:42.440
 All right. Again, I'm going to ask, would it be possible to make this as flexible as

00:29:42.440 --> 00:29:49.240
 possible and to say that the committee has the right to choose to do this for projects

00:29:49.240 --> 00:29:54.660
 which are in excess of let's say 50% of our annual budget, because that way you're taking

00:29:54.660 --> 00:30:03.040
 away the hard dollar limit giving for inflation or deflation and changes in our budget. I'm

00:30:03.040 --> 00:30:07.280
 going to take a step back and say that in the film and theater business, it is normal

00:30:07.280 --> 00:30:12.680
 procedure as well to ask artistic directors and artistic people to say, "Hey, what is

00:30:12.680 --> 00:30:18.080
 your concept for this commercial and we're going to do a test shoot?" And all the people

00:30:18.080 --> 00:30:22.420
 who are involved in the test shoot get paid for the test. And if that's the test that

00:30:22.420 --> 00:30:27.560
 says, "No, this is not the team we want," I would rather have the artist spend, I would

00:30:27.560 --> 00:30:32.800
 rather spend $1,000, $2,000 on an artist who brings back something that's clearly not what's

00:30:32.800 --> 00:30:38.440
 best for our city and take the rest of that money and put the egg in another basket personally.

00:30:38.440 --> 00:30:45.040
 So would it be possible, Gary, if you guys, I'd like for you to toss it around, if we

00:30:45.040 --> 00:30:51.760
 could say that we have the option to do it, we're going to make a grayscale of where it

00:30:51.760 --> 00:30:55.640
 could kick in and what it could look like, but let's not have it be more than X percent

00:30:55.640 --> 00:31:00.200
 of our budget if we feel strongly about it. How does that sound?

00:31:00.200 --> 00:31:08.200
 Would you want it to be kind of like mandatory of anything over $100,000 of X number of budget

00:31:08.200 --> 00:31:14.560
 not to exceed and then maybe anything between $50,000 and $100,000? It could be at the discretion

00:31:14.560 --> 00:31:19.280
 of the committee based on the budget? Well, again, I'm thinking why can't it just

00:31:19.280 --> 00:31:23.920
 be a percentage of the budget and therefore be flexible as we go into the future? I mean,

00:31:23.920 --> 00:31:29.000
 I know how hard it is to change these documents once we've written them, but that's just my

00:31:29.000 --> 00:31:34.200
 opinion. If everyone else loves $50,000 or $100,000, I'll definitely agree to it.

00:31:34.200 --> 00:31:38.280
 Just for clarification, you said percent of the budget, percent of that project budget?

00:31:38.280 --> 00:31:42.320
 The public art budget. Yeah, like if it's something that's a percentage of our public art budget

00:31:42.320 --> 00:31:48.880
 over a certain percentage, we have the right and option to do that.

00:31:48.880 --> 00:31:59.360
 Okay, so just some clarification. So we have ongoing budget. We don't have a specific allocation

00:31:59.360 --> 00:32:05.440
 every year. It's not like we have a $100,000 budget that comes in, but we have bond funds

00:32:05.440 --> 00:32:11.400
 that are dedicated to sculptures that may be five years old that's in a revolving account.

00:32:11.400 --> 00:32:18.680
 Are you counting that same amount every year? That's a great question. I mean, maybe this

00:32:18.680 --> 00:32:24.160
 is an impractical solution. What do the rest of you all think?

00:32:24.160 --> 00:32:33.320
 I liked what Gary proposed. It's mandatory for projects over $100,000 and then optional

00:32:33.320 --> 00:32:42.320
 for projects over $50,000. The committee has to at least have a discussion and make a decision

00:32:42.320 --> 00:32:46.080
 about whether or not we want to pay people for proposals.

00:32:46.080 --> 00:32:50.560
 I think you might want to add to that that it would be limited to no more than three

00:32:50.560 --> 00:33:01.580
 people per project. Yes, let's limit it to a small, maximum three. Yes. I would be fine

00:33:01.580 --> 00:33:05.800
 with just one person. And if we don't like them, go to person number two and pay them

00:33:05.800 --> 00:33:13.800
 personally. Jodi, Meredith, do you all haven't piped in much here? Do you have anything to

00:33:13.800 --> 00:33:17.920
 add? I'm fine with that kind of joint conclusion

00:33:17.920 --> 00:33:20.160
 that you all just made. I think that's a great idea.

00:33:20.160 --> 00:33:22.600
 Okay. I like the two actually.

00:33:22.600 --> 00:33:25.920
 There we go. We're going to be with them.

00:33:25.920 --> 00:33:29.120
 Terry's here as well. I don't know if you could see him, but he's...

00:33:29.120 --> 00:33:34.040
 No, I didn't. Hi, Terry. Welcome. I'm going to add you to the list. All right.

00:33:34.040 --> 00:33:37.520
 Just to make sure we got... Is that the consensus from everybody?

00:33:37.520 --> 00:33:40.560
 I have a question. Okay.

00:33:40.560 --> 00:33:46.200
 The question is, how much money were you talking per proposal? Is it going to be a percentage

00:33:46.200 --> 00:33:54.120
 of the commission? Yeah, it looks like the cities had different

00:33:54.120 --> 00:33:58.440
 percentages and different caps. Did you see that document in the agenda and that he put

00:33:58.440 --> 00:34:02.360
 up on the screen? Were you here for that? No, I was not.

00:34:02.360 --> 00:34:06.080
 Okay. Sorry. He showed us different cities from around

00:34:06.080 --> 00:34:12.200
 the Metroplex and there's some of them who say that only a certain small percentage of

00:34:12.200 --> 00:34:17.000
 the total budget can be spent in this endeavor. We're saying that maybe two and a half percent

00:34:17.000 --> 00:34:22.160
 might be the percentage that we would pay an artist to inquire about what they're going

00:34:22.160 --> 00:34:28.160
 to give us, what kind of project, what kind of result we would get from them.

00:34:28.160 --> 00:34:35.880
 Just for instance, Frisco was for projects that are larger than 150,000, it was 2,500

00:34:35.880 --> 00:34:43.080
 to 5,000 per artist. Allen was 500 honorarium for most projects.

00:34:43.080 --> 00:34:51.640
 On larger projects could go up to 1,000. Let's see.

00:34:51.640 --> 00:35:03.240
 I think Lewisville was 2.5%. I have it up, 100,000 projects more than $100,000.

00:35:03.240 --> 00:35:11.560
 In Richardson, Mr. Steele was 2.5% of the project for the final three selecting.

00:35:11.560 --> 00:35:15.860
 Something that we do, we've done in parks, we've done quite a few RFQs and we have quite

00:35:15.860 --> 00:35:26.640
 a few more in our taboo list right now. We narrow that down to, for instance, we're in

00:35:26.640 --> 00:35:31.000
 the middle of master planning, we narrowed it down to three and interviewed all of them.

00:35:31.000 --> 00:35:35.920
 Granted, those consultants didn't get a stipend, but we understand kind of where we're going

00:35:35.920 --> 00:35:40.760
 with this decision at the moment. It makes total sense, we just need your help

00:35:40.760 --> 00:35:50.160
 making a decision on is it the final three, what's the cap, all that good stuff.

00:35:50.160 --> 00:36:08.000
 Would you prefer a percentage or a flat rate? 2.5% of $100,000 is $2,500.

00:36:08.000 --> 00:36:19.120
 That's really generous in my opinion. I would say that would be, yeah, if you ask three

00:36:19.120 --> 00:36:29.760
 different artists for proposals, that's $7,500 that you're taking away from that 100K budget.

00:36:29.760 --> 00:36:35.160
 I would say that that's definitely the most we should do, but we could potentially, as

00:36:35.160 --> 00:36:41.840
 a smaller, being that we are a smaller city, we could potentially make it more like $1,500

00:36:41.840 --> 00:36:47.600
 or fall in line or in between one of those other cities that are nearby.

00:36:47.600 --> 00:36:55.880
 The other idea that just came to me would be to narrow it down to two artists, and if

00:36:55.880 --> 00:37:03.520
 out of the two, both of them fail, then obviously we don't know how to pick candidates, right?

00:37:03.520 --> 00:37:08.280
 So then make it three, make it two, so instead of thinking I'm competing against two other

00:37:08.280 --> 00:37:12.840
 people, I'm competing against one other person, I'm going to really make it happen sort of

00:37:12.840 --> 00:37:13.840
 thing.

00:37:13.840 --> 00:37:19.960
 What if we did a percentage, so I know you, Mr. Still, you like the percentage and maybe

00:37:19.960 --> 00:37:25.400
 want to cut the 100K, what if we do a percentage and not to exceed amount? So if the not to

00:37:25.400 --> 00:37:32.080
 exceed amount we say is, I'm just using the example, 2,000, and then it's 2.5% not to

00:37:32.080 --> 00:37:39.280
 exceed $2,000, so if in the future we pick a $200,000 art piece, or we get that amount

00:37:39.280 --> 00:37:44.400
 of money, then we're only paying up to the $2,000, and then for the smaller art pieces

00:37:44.400 --> 00:37:49.880
 that are in the $30,000 to $50,000 range, the artist is still getting some kind of stipend,

00:37:49.880 --> 00:37:52.540
 and it leaves that flexibility.

00:37:52.540 --> 00:37:54.160
 If we choose to, yeah.

00:37:54.160 --> 00:37:55.160
 If we choose to.

00:37:55.160 --> 00:37:58.440
 I think that's a great condition to add. What does everyone else think?

00:37:58.440 --> 00:38:01.560
 I like it too.

00:38:01.560 --> 00:38:06.480
 One thing that could be added to that, and I'll ask the group what their experience is,

00:38:06.480 --> 00:38:13.360
 so if we went out and asked for two proposals, and we select proposal A, could we count that

00:38:13.360 --> 00:38:18.060
 $2,000 towards the cost of the sculpture?

00:38:18.060 --> 00:38:23.080
 That should definitely go towards the cost of the project, I think.

00:38:23.080 --> 00:38:25.240
 That makes a lot of sense, Gary.

00:38:25.240 --> 00:38:31.720
 So the winner receives that as part of the sculpture, the second place person receives

00:38:31.720 --> 00:38:33.880
 that as having put in the effort.

00:38:33.880 --> 00:38:34.880
 Yes.

00:38:34.880 --> 00:38:35.880
 I think that makes sense.

00:38:35.880 --> 00:38:36.880
 As the runner-up.

00:38:36.880 --> 00:38:37.880
 Yep.

00:38:37.880 --> 00:38:38.880
 Okay.

00:38:38.880 --> 00:38:42.920
 So what we'll do is we'll put some wording together based on those protocols, and have

00:38:42.920 --> 00:38:48.280
 it for the next meeting for you guys to consider and vote on.

00:38:48.280 --> 00:38:49.280
 Excellent.

00:38:49.280 --> 00:38:52.280
 Sounds great.

00:38:52.280 --> 00:38:55.320
 All right.

00:38:55.320 --> 00:38:58.520
 Are we ready for item D now?

00:38:58.520 --> 00:39:01.520
 Yes.

00:39:01.520 --> 00:39:03.000
 Staff is yes.

00:39:03.000 --> 00:39:04.000
 Okay.

00:39:04.000 --> 00:39:05.280
 I want to apologize.

00:39:05.280 --> 00:39:10.760
 I'm having technical problems in getting power to my device and in hearing and seeing you

00:39:10.760 --> 00:39:15.000
 guys, so that's why I'm trying different options, but I think I'm okay now.

00:39:15.000 --> 00:39:18.440
 So I apologize for me floating in and off screen lately.

00:39:18.440 --> 00:39:19.440
 All right.

00:39:19.440 --> 00:39:25.240
 So item D, receive a report, hold a discussion, and give staff direction regarding the status

00:39:25.240 --> 00:39:28.640
 of our ongoing public art committee projects.

00:39:28.640 --> 00:39:29.640
 Okay.

00:39:29.640 --> 00:39:43.360
 Let me pull that up.

00:39:43.360 --> 00:39:59.080
 Okay, I've added a couple pictures to this to kind of provide some additional information

00:39:59.080 --> 00:40:04.880
 and some updates to this of things we've worked on this past week.

00:40:04.880 --> 00:40:08.520
 North Lakes Dog Park, we have a budget of $35,000.

00:40:08.520 --> 00:40:11.680
 We did spend a little of that to put in the foundation.

00:40:11.680 --> 00:40:18.120
 The committee narrowed it down to two specific artists.

00:40:18.120 --> 00:40:22.360
 John Whitmore, who's with Parks and Recreation, is also on the call.

00:40:22.360 --> 00:40:29.560
 We both reached out to artists, and unfortunately, both have declined.

00:40:29.560 --> 00:40:36.240
 One was recently declined, and the other one, I believe, is not accepting any projects at

00:40:36.240 --> 00:40:37.240
 this point in time.

00:40:37.240 --> 00:40:42.760
 John, do you have anything you'd like to add to that?

00:40:42.760 --> 00:40:47.560
 That pretty much wraps it up for that particular project.

00:40:47.560 --> 00:40:53.600
 What we're finding on a lot of people that when they decline, they're talking about most

00:40:53.600 --> 00:40:59.480
 of their projects are up in the six-figure or higher range because of their current market,

00:40:59.480 --> 00:41:05.640
 and then also their current media that they work with is much more expensive.

00:41:05.640 --> 00:41:10.240
 So that's been told to me by a couple of the artists so far.

00:41:10.240 --> 00:41:13.400
 Does that include the artists that Jessica reached out to?

00:41:13.400 --> 00:41:19.680
 I know that she said she heard from somebody who was enthusiastic about the project initially.

00:41:19.680 --> 00:41:26.240
 We talked to Crawford and Gold, which were the top two candidates from the subcommittee.

00:41:26.240 --> 00:41:32.140
 So we could circle back around with Jessica and see if that was an option.

00:41:32.140 --> 00:41:37.640
 Okay, so that committee needs to find more artists.

00:41:37.640 --> 00:41:42.440
 We need to make our expanse a little bigger, eh?

00:41:42.440 --> 00:41:45.600
 Or we could go to number three on the list for the subcommittee.

00:41:45.600 --> 00:41:51.040
 Okay, well, we'll talk about that when we have that subcommittee meeting, but okay,

00:41:51.040 --> 00:41:52.160
 I just wanted to clarify.

00:41:52.160 --> 00:41:53.160
 Thank you so much.

00:41:53.160 --> 00:41:54.160
 Okay.

00:41:54.160 --> 00:41:58.280
 So we'll definitely get a subcommittee meeting scheduled for that.

00:41:58.280 --> 00:42:06.560
 G. Rowland Vela Athletic Complex did talk to Mr. King, and Mr. Whitmore talked to him

00:42:06.560 --> 00:42:11.320
 as well, and he also declined based on budget.

00:42:11.320 --> 00:42:18.240
 And then John had reached out to the next person in line, and John, do you want to provide

00:42:18.240 --> 00:42:19.920
 that information?

00:42:19.920 --> 00:42:27.360
 I reached out to Osmond Aikon, and he actually lives in Brooklyn, and he had quite a bit

00:42:27.360 --> 00:42:29.520
 of damage from the storm that just came through there.

00:42:29.520 --> 00:42:35.680
 So he really just contacted me this afternoon prior to our meeting here, and saying pretty

00:42:35.680 --> 00:42:43.160
 much the same thing, is that he intends to deal with larger projects that are more expensive

00:42:43.160 --> 00:42:44.160
 media.

00:42:44.160 --> 00:42:51.360
 So he said probably about $130,000 is about where he typically falls for the projects

00:42:51.360 --> 00:42:55.560
 that he's involved with.

00:42:55.560 --> 00:43:02.160
 So we'll have to get that committee together as well to revisit that.

00:43:02.160 --> 00:43:06.800
 The tennis center, we are just finalizing the bids for that.

00:43:06.800 --> 00:43:13.360
 We had additional meeting this week about some permitting design issues, and I think

00:43:13.360 --> 00:43:14.400
 we've worked through that.

00:43:14.400 --> 00:43:18.720
 So the Pro Shop itself is scheduled to be done pretty quickly.

00:43:18.720 --> 00:43:23.280
 They're well ahead of schedule, and the courts itself will be going out to bid.

00:43:23.280 --> 00:43:27.660
 So we still have a lot of time in regards to moving on this one.

00:43:27.660 --> 00:43:30.040
 So I'd say this one's not a huge priority.

00:43:30.040 --> 00:43:33.760
 We definitely need to focus on the other ones to try to get those rolling.

00:43:33.760 --> 00:43:40.060
 So maybe we can put this one on the back burner until we get the dog park and the vela complex

00:43:40.060 --> 00:43:44.800
 underway.

00:43:44.800 --> 00:43:52.060
 Fire station number three, one of our fire chiefs is on the call as well.

00:43:52.060 --> 00:43:58.360
 This is a $25,000 budget, the initial concept and discussion, there's been a lot of discussion

00:43:58.360 --> 00:43:59.360
 about this.

00:43:59.360 --> 00:44:00.960
 I'm not privy to all of that.

00:44:00.960 --> 00:44:08.120
 So I welcome some feedback in regards to some decorative fencing that is supposed to be

00:44:08.120 --> 00:44:11.200
 functional as well as decorative.

00:44:11.200 --> 00:44:18.020
 The chief does have a design, and we've had some discussion with our purchasing department

00:44:18.020 --> 00:44:23.240
 in regards to if we want to move forward, there is a proposal here that I can provide

00:44:23.240 --> 00:44:30.960
 you that was designed by the chief, I believe, and I'll let him kind of chime in and discuss

00:44:30.960 --> 00:44:33.700
 the project.

00:44:33.700 --> 00:44:39.520
 First of all, thank you for allowing me to be with you today, and I am by no means any

00:44:39.520 --> 00:44:40.960
 type of artist whatsoever.

00:44:40.960 --> 00:44:44.440
 I can draw straight lines, but that's about it.

00:44:44.440 --> 00:44:49.400
 I'm the liaison for this project for the fire station building.

00:44:49.400 --> 00:44:55.080
 If you're not aware, our station three that's being rebuilt is right there on the highway

00:44:55.080 --> 00:44:57.360
 if you haven't been by it lately.

00:44:57.360 --> 00:45:01.960
 But phase two of the I-35 construction is going to demolish the gas station that's right

00:45:01.960 --> 00:45:05.100
 in front of the fire station right now, and they're going to be adding four more lanes

00:45:05.100 --> 00:45:10.160
 to that highway, which puts our fire station right on the frontage road, right in great

00:45:10.160 --> 00:45:11.160
 view of I-35.

00:45:11.160 --> 00:45:16.880
 It's going to be kind of a showplace for people coming into the city to see this fire station.

00:45:16.880 --> 00:45:24.960
 The fence on the southeast side of the building will be facing the highway.

00:45:24.960 --> 00:45:30.640
 It's a 40-foot by 20-foot L-shaped fence, and what we really envisioned was having some

00:45:30.640 --> 00:45:37.260
 sort of decorative artistic fire-themed fencing around that patio area, and whether that's

00:45:37.260 --> 00:45:41.520
 a core tin metal or something else, there's lots of different designs out there.

00:45:41.520 --> 00:45:46.200
 But that was just something that we have seen online with pictures, what our architect has

00:45:46.200 --> 00:45:51.680
 done up in Oklahoma City, what I've gathered from some other, you know, pictures that I've

00:45:51.680 --> 00:45:54.040
 looked at, you know, doing Google searches.

00:45:54.040 --> 00:45:59.720
 But you know, obviously artists can make art out of any type of material, and we thought,

00:45:59.720 --> 00:46:01.960
 well, why not make it out of a fence?

00:46:01.960 --> 00:46:05.600
 So we'd like to put that for your consideration.

00:46:05.600 --> 00:46:13.720
 So the last, when the committee met last, the discussion had boiled down to I think there's

00:46:13.720 --> 00:46:22.400
 some specific security requirements for the fence and design requirements for the fence.

00:46:22.400 --> 00:46:28.560
 So what we did was abstract the art layer from the fence layer.

00:46:28.560 --> 00:46:30.400
 So there should be a fence.

00:46:30.400 --> 00:46:37.200
 The fence should have the security and design requirements that are necessary for the fire

00:46:37.200 --> 00:46:39.960
 department to serve its function.

00:46:39.960 --> 00:46:45.240
 Then after that, we add the artistic elements to the fence.

00:46:45.240 --> 00:46:48.280
 So the art is added to the fence.

00:46:48.280 --> 00:46:52.120
 So rather than make the fence the piece of art, the fence is designed and constructed,

00:46:52.120 --> 00:46:55.820
 and then art is added to it.

00:46:55.820 --> 00:47:00.080
 Those on the committee with me can chime in if I'm not getting that exactly right.

00:47:00.080 --> 00:47:04.520
 But that was the last discussion that we had.

00:47:04.520 --> 00:47:09.560
 Ed, you mean something on top the fence?

00:47:09.560 --> 00:47:10.560
 I don't recall this.

00:47:10.560 --> 00:47:15.360
 I recalled you wanting to have something besides the fence as the artistic expression that

00:47:15.360 --> 00:47:17.200
 the bond money would get spent on.

00:47:17.200 --> 00:47:21.720
 Well, we kind of discussed, you know, what we're talking about, we're talking about two

00:47:21.720 --> 00:47:22.720
 different things here.

00:47:22.720 --> 00:47:29.440
 We're talking about a design element and a security element that has specific requirements.

00:47:29.440 --> 00:47:33.920
 And then we're trying to add, we're trying to make that into art.

00:47:33.920 --> 00:47:37.520
 And those things don't really match up that well.

00:47:37.520 --> 00:47:45.120
 So the fire department should create its fence per the security and design specifications

00:47:45.120 --> 00:47:46.780
 that are needed for it.

00:47:46.780 --> 00:47:55.080
 And then as an after the thought or after the fact, or in addition to enhance that fence,

00:47:55.080 --> 00:47:57.800
 then the artistic element should be added.

00:47:57.800 --> 00:48:04.240
 And did we come to that decision, Ed, based upon costs associated with both of those pieces?

00:48:04.240 --> 00:48:11.400
 That if we did it as a fence with art incorporated, we would be assuming the costs for the fence

00:48:11.400 --> 00:48:17.400
 that's necessary, that's functional, versus just paying for the artwork.

00:48:17.400 --> 00:48:24.320
 I'm just asking as a way of being reminded of why we came to that.

00:48:24.320 --> 00:48:31.640
 There's costs, I mean, for lack of a better comparison, it's oil and vinegar, right?

00:48:31.640 --> 00:48:39.480
 I need to design a master lock that is secure in its function in locking the specific door,

00:48:39.480 --> 00:48:42.440
 but I also want it to be a piece of art.

00:48:42.440 --> 00:48:46.400
 How many things like that exist that you can think of off the top of your head that they

00:48:46.400 --> 00:48:47.400
 don't?

00:48:47.400 --> 00:48:49.960
 I've seen some pretty nice looking locks.

00:48:49.960 --> 00:48:55.080
 I would like to add though, Ed, that this is still something that is being debated by

00:48:55.080 --> 00:49:02.480
 the subcommittee, because personally, I feel like no offense to the design you just showed,

00:49:02.480 --> 00:49:10.760
 sir, but I mean, like, we would get the artist to design it, but I do like the idea of having,

00:49:10.760 --> 00:49:16.200
 I still like the idea that came up to us years ago of having a fence with an artistic motif

00:49:16.200 --> 00:49:18.880
 in it that is functional.

00:49:18.880 --> 00:49:23.280
 So I realized that this was what your idea was, but I also felt that the committee hadn't

00:49:23.280 --> 00:49:29.360
 quite settled and agreed upon what you had just said, and I still strongly feel that

00:49:29.360 --> 00:49:34.800
 they should be able to make a fence and not have to jump through an art circle.

00:49:34.800 --> 00:49:39.840
 And if we want to go to a Dyson level of design, but we don't have the budget for that.

00:49:39.840 --> 00:49:43.560
 If you're going at the Dyson level of design, yeah, you can get a vacuum that looks like

00:49:43.560 --> 00:49:47.680
 a piece of art, but I don't think that's the budget that we have for this fence.

00:49:47.680 --> 00:49:54.560
 So if the fence were designed in such a way that art could be applied to it, I kind of

00:49:54.560 --> 00:49:56.680
 think that makes more sense.

00:49:56.680 --> 00:50:04.040
 Obviously, it's open to discussion, but Ed, if I may, obviously, my drawing was just off

00:50:04.040 --> 00:50:08.840
 the top of my head, you know, looking at some other things that I'd seen online.

00:50:08.840 --> 00:50:09.840
 That's just an idea.

00:50:09.840 --> 00:50:14.760
 Like I said, I'm not an artist, and the artist would definitely work on something like that.

00:50:14.760 --> 00:50:22.160
 But my thought was that the metal would be the canvas to be able to be used to design

00:50:22.160 --> 00:50:23.320
 some sort of artwork.

00:50:23.320 --> 00:50:25.200
 What we have is basically three parts.

00:50:25.200 --> 00:50:31.800
 We have the artistic design on the fence itself.

00:50:31.800 --> 00:50:38.240
 We have the manufacturer of the metal that will actually do the cutting, and then the

00:50:38.240 --> 00:50:40.520
 installer that would install the fence itself.

00:50:40.520 --> 00:50:46.000
 So three parts all working together, but the artist could use the quartet metal or some

00:50:46.000 --> 00:50:49.800
 other type of material on the fence as the canvas.

00:50:49.800 --> 00:50:52.040
 Mr. Bates, can I ask you?

00:50:52.040 --> 00:50:55.840
 Everyone sees you've already decided on the material.

00:50:55.840 --> 00:50:57.960
 You've already decided on the design.

00:50:57.960 --> 00:51:00.200
 We're not talking about art here.

00:51:00.200 --> 00:51:07.580
 So I agree that art should definitely be a part of this as per the location and the application.

00:51:07.580 --> 00:51:14.480
 But the fence is one thing, and the art that's applied to it is a different thing.

00:51:14.480 --> 00:51:17.360
 They're not the same thing.

00:51:17.360 --> 00:51:21.640
 Mr. Bates, do you still have the original pictures that might have been presented to

00:51:21.640 --> 00:51:25.440
 the Public Art Committee, let's say, it must have been two, three, four years ago?

00:51:25.440 --> 00:51:28.160
 I think they were from the architect.

00:51:28.160 --> 00:51:30.720
 I do have some pictures.

00:51:30.720 --> 00:51:34.960
 Are there not some that have some fence with designs on them?

00:51:34.960 --> 00:51:35.960
 I sure do.

00:51:35.960 --> 00:51:38.040
 I would like to still consider doing them.

00:51:38.040 --> 00:51:44.160
 I feel that it's appropriate to the place, the location.

00:51:44.160 --> 00:51:48.040
 I feel like it's appropriate to the need.

00:51:48.040 --> 00:51:53.540
 And I mean, we can go back into our subcommittee and pull each other's hair out some more.

00:51:53.540 --> 00:52:00.080
 But I'm personally very much on the side that the firemen should deserve to have the fence

00:52:00.080 --> 00:52:02.240
 that, you know, that's beautiful to me.

00:52:02.240 --> 00:52:05.120
 I think that's appropriate and beautiful.

00:52:05.120 --> 00:52:08.760
 But that's a decision for our subcommittee, and I guess not all for us to look at right

00:52:08.760 --> 00:52:09.760
 now.

00:52:09.760 --> 00:52:13.640
 That's just something that can be done.

00:52:13.640 --> 00:52:15.680
 Yeah.

00:52:15.680 --> 00:52:18.280
 Okay.

00:52:18.280 --> 00:52:19.280
 Thank you, first.

00:52:19.280 --> 00:52:25.480
 That's one of the designs that I think we saw all those years ago.

00:52:25.480 --> 00:52:29.720
 And I've been on this I've been on the subcommittee for a very long time, and we've gone back and

00:52:29.720 --> 00:52:39.040
 forth, and we at one point had discussed having almost a fence made out of vines, you know,

00:52:39.040 --> 00:52:43.920
 or something that was an artistic element.

00:52:43.920 --> 00:52:51.820
 And at the point you start to incorporate security and specific, you know, requirements

00:52:51.820 --> 00:52:55.160
 that are appropriate to a building, it's no longer a piece of art.

00:52:55.160 --> 00:52:58.160
 So we kind of have to design.

00:52:58.160 --> 00:53:01.240
 Are we designing, I'm sorry, let me finish, please.

00:53:01.240 --> 00:53:07.400
 Are we designing a fence or are we designing a piece of art that functions as a barrier?

00:53:07.400 --> 00:53:12.320
 Michelle and Ed, I think the other thing that would be helpful to us is to go back and look

00:53:12.320 --> 00:53:15.120
 at the minutes.

00:53:15.120 --> 00:53:18.880
 And I don't think it was three years ago, I think it was two.

00:53:18.880 --> 00:53:28.760
 And at some point, we had reached an agreement about moving forward with this project.

00:53:28.760 --> 00:53:32.880
 And if we could go back and look at those final minutes related to it would help to

00:53:32.880 --> 00:53:38.480
 guide our decision making going forward.

00:53:38.480 --> 00:53:43.920
 And I do think it had to do with separating the fence from the artwork.

00:53:43.920 --> 00:53:49.080
 And that in part was because of the costs that we would need to absorb as the Public

00:53:49.080 --> 00:53:56.640
 Arts Committee versus the costs that the fire department would need to absorb.

00:53:56.640 --> 00:54:00.600
 I remember that wasn't bond money, right?

00:54:00.600 --> 00:54:04.360
 But it was bond money that was already set aside for the fire department.

00:54:04.360 --> 00:54:07.240
 So it's like, correct?

00:54:07.240 --> 00:54:10.060
 I think so.

00:54:10.060 --> 00:54:16.920
 So David, correct me if I'm incorrect, we have $25,000 for the fence and the artwork

00:54:16.920 --> 00:54:19.160
 total.

00:54:19.160 --> 00:54:21.800
 That's my understanding, sir.

00:54:21.800 --> 00:54:25.720
 Was there a cost associated with the proposal that was done a few years ago that you're

00:54:25.720 --> 00:54:27.440
 aware of?

00:54:27.440 --> 00:54:32.120
 I'm not sure I was not I was not privy to that at the time.

00:54:32.120 --> 00:54:33.120
 Okay.

00:54:33.120 --> 00:54:36.880
 We could we could see if that down.

00:54:36.880 --> 00:54:40.960
 I do believe there was a cost associated with it.

00:54:40.960 --> 00:54:49.840
 And if we could find those minutes, that would help.

00:54:49.840 --> 00:54:54.680
 Well let's let's say then that we'll get Jessica to put us back into a committee meeting and

00:54:54.680 --> 00:54:59.120
 investigate all that stuff by the time we meet September 3, or whenever our next meeting

00:54:59.120 --> 00:55:00.120
 is.

00:55:00.120 --> 00:55:01.560
 Is that fair enough?

00:55:01.560 --> 00:55:02.560
 We can do that.

00:55:02.560 --> 00:55:03.560
 Okay.

00:55:03.560 --> 00:55:04.560
 Thanks.

00:55:04.560 --> 00:55:16.720
 Thank you.

00:55:16.720 --> 00:55:21.680
 Okay foundations of our history mural, we are staff is still working on getting final

00:55:21.680 --> 00:55:24.320
 approval from Union Pacific.

00:55:24.320 --> 00:55:28.880
 I think they're shorthanded they we reached out to him a couple times and they basically

00:55:28.880 --> 00:55:32.400
 said please be patient, we'll get back to you as soon as possible.

00:55:32.400 --> 00:55:39.420
 We have set up a online virtual community meeting for both this as well as the MLK sculpture.

00:55:39.420 --> 00:55:44.720
 If you recall, we had a meeting scheduled, it was towards the middle of March, and that

00:55:44.720 --> 00:55:46.880
 was right when everything shut down.

00:55:46.880 --> 00:55:50.080
 So we, we obviously canceled that.

00:55:50.080 --> 00:55:55.000
 So the city is working on protocols for public meetings right now.

00:55:55.000 --> 00:55:59.760
 So we've we've pencil penciled this in with September 3, to get feedback from the the

00:55:59.760 --> 00:56:08.640
 entire community, both on the foundations of our history mural, as well as the MLK sculpture.

00:56:08.640 --> 00:56:13.720
 Once we get get that approved, then we can move forward on the design on the painting.

00:56:13.720 --> 00:56:17.360
 I think Jessica had shared this with you in the past.

00:56:17.360 --> 00:56:19.720
 Oh, I love it.

00:56:19.720 --> 00:56:24.360
 Replicating similar to what was done over off of Bonnie Bray.

00:56:24.360 --> 00:56:30.480
 There would not be anything in the middle, as you can see in this picture on the left,

00:56:30.480 --> 00:56:36.320
 because of a stain, I'm sorry stains that run down from the bridge itself.

00:56:36.320 --> 00:56:41.280
 The artist has made this kind of color almost look like, you know, rusted steel to try to

00:56:41.280 --> 00:56:47.580
 hide that and didn't put any of the faces or specific artwork in the middle.

00:56:47.580 --> 00:56:52.160
 So it's all on the wings of the underpass at Robertson.

00:56:52.160 --> 00:56:56.600
 So this is his current proposal.

00:56:56.600 --> 00:56:57.600
 That's breathtaking.

00:56:57.600 --> 00:57:02.600
 I love it.

00:57:02.600 --> 00:57:06.000
 Love it.

00:57:06.000 --> 00:57:11.280
 And that that'll be used for the public meeting and then the MLK rec center we're still in

00:57:11.280 --> 00:57:17.320
 the kind of the same place that we were back in March, we have a budget a little over $70,000,

00:57:17.320 --> 00:57:21.160
 we're going to have that community meeting so make sure we get the input from the community

00:57:21.160 --> 00:57:27.120
 before moving forward with an official contract and taking that to City Council.

00:57:27.120 --> 00:57:33.020
 And then if that's all approved, hopefully we can start construction as soon as we can

00:57:33.020 --> 00:57:38.600
 and get that project underway.

00:57:38.600 --> 00:57:46.080
 And then the, the monument that we had talked about earlier $80,000 is the budget, I guess

00:57:46.080 --> 00:57:51.160
 there needs to, I guess I'm assuming that's for everything, including the foundation and

00:57:51.160 --> 00:57:54.760
 the placement any lighting that's in there.

00:57:54.760 --> 00:57:58.520
 If not, maybe there needs to be some discussion and clarity on that.

00:57:58.520 --> 00:58:01.440
 I haven't been involved in these specific subcommittee meetings.

00:58:01.440 --> 00:58:06.880
 So Michelle, I'm not sure exactly where things are if you want to maybe just do a quick update.

00:58:06.880 --> 00:58:09.180
 Well, we are meeting weekly.

00:58:09.180 --> 00:58:13.320
 So for those of you who aren't on the subcommittee, we've been having weekly meetings we have

00:58:13.320 --> 00:58:19.180
 I don't know what's changed since our last meeting because it's been a stressed out week,

00:58:19.180 --> 00:58:24.880
 but I will tell you that we have been in contact with with different members of the Denton women's

00:58:24.880 --> 00:58:28.640
 interfaith group of the fellowship.

00:58:28.640 --> 00:58:33.780
 We have actually taken their input as to how they felt about the location.

00:58:33.780 --> 00:58:38.680
 The top two locations we're thinking about right now are not carved in stone, but potentially

00:58:38.680 --> 00:58:44.840
 either Fred Moore Park next to the expansion of the Legion building or industrial street

00:58:44.840 --> 00:58:45.840
 park.

00:58:45.840 --> 00:58:51.000
 We've also talked about a really exciting overarching project of how this could become

00:58:51.000 --> 00:58:58.120
 the starting or terminus of a black history walk in our town, which would include the

00:58:58.120 --> 00:59:04.280
 rails to trails path that has its six interpretive signs already and also include the Black History

00:59:04.280 --> 00:59:08.120
 Museum that's down there by the Bayless Selby House on Carroll.

00:59:08.120 --> 00:59:13.640
 And so there is a way to to consider that there is a walkable.

00:59:13.640 --> 00:59:20.400
 I'm not sure if it's 100% wheelchairable like like for people with mobility issues.

00:59:20.400 --> 00:59:21.400
 I think it is.

00:59:21.400 --> 00:59:25.940
 I know that the entire rail trail is, but that would definitely be a priority.

00:59:25.940 --> 00:59:30.080
 And we've got people on City Council who are going to help us with getting that taken care

00:59:30.080 --> 00:59:32.000
 of if it's an issue.

00:59:32.000 --> 00:59:39.840
 And so tying this into an even larger statement about racial diversity and unity in our community,

00:59:39.840 --> 00:59:41.240
 which is super exciting.

00:59:41.240 --> 00:59:43.960
 So that's where we are right now.

00:59:43.960 --> 00:59:49.200
 And we will continue to update you as the months pass and we get closer to finding out

00:59:49.200 --> 00:59:56.200
 if our grant got accepted and where we are starting our fundraising efforts very shortly.

00:59:56.200 --> 01:00:03.840
 So we will keep you posted when that project gets to that point.

01:00:03.840 --> 01:00:09.800
 Anyone else who's on the committee want to add anything?

01:00:09.800 --> 01:00:15.200
 I would just add that at yesterday's meeting, we all decided that we're going to review

01:00:15.200 --> 01:00:18.360
 the pre the list of pre qualified artists.

01:00:18.360 --> 01:00:24.440
 Our next step for next Thursday is to have each of us to have a short list of five that

01:00:24.440 --> 01:00:27.160
 we can share and deliberate with each other.

01:00:27.160 --> 01:00:28.160
 Awesome.

01:00:28.160 --> 01:00:29.160
 Thanks.

01:00:29.160 --> 01:00:30.160
 All right.

01:00:30.160 --> 01:00:31.160
 That's us.

01:00:31.160 --> 01:00:37.160
 Anyone else want to make a comment on the fellowship monument or anything?

01:00:37.160 --> 01:00:42.280
 All right, Gary, is it okay if we move on to the staff reports and then close up?

01:00:42.280 --> 01:00:44.480
 Let me make sure that's the last one.

01:00:44.480 --> 01:00:45.480
 Yes.

01:00:45.480 --> 01:00:46.480
 That's the last one there.

01:00:46.480 --> 01:00:47.480
 All right.

01:00:47.480 --> 01:00:48.480
 Let's do it.

01:00:48.480 --> 01:00:54.440
 Let's get a staff reports update on the potentially public meeting.

01:00:54.440 --> 01:00:55.440
 Okay.

01:00:55.440 --> 01:01:16.400
 So we have hang on, let me back up.

01:01:16.400 --> 01:01:25.320
 I had to close the file, so I had to go back to it, sorry.

01:01:25.320 --> 01:01:26.320
 Okay.

01:01:26.320 --> 01:01:32.120
 So as of right now, so we're looking at September 3rd for the next public art committee meeting.

01:01:32.120 --> 01:01:39.880
 That is the same day as the the specific public art meetings that we're having those two items.

01:01:39.880 --> 01:01:43.400
 So if you want to consider a different date, that's fine.

01:01:43.400 --> 01:01:47.680
 If not, we can we can stay with that, and then that meeting is scheduled for 6 p.m.

01:01:47.680 --> 01:01:49.720
 So we should be okay.

01:01:49.720 --> 01:01:54.360
 But as of right now, project updates would be project subcommittees and artist proposals

01:01:54.360 --> 01:02:00.120
 if we can get any in check by then, and then an update on the temporary art program.

01:02:00.120 --> 01:02:06.160
 And then we also could provide an update on the funding for artist proposals as discussed

01:02:06.160 --> 01:02:07.160
 this afternoon.

01:02:07.160 --> 01:02:08.160
 Sounds excellent.

01:02:08.160 --> 01:02:14.840
 Is September 3rd okay for everybody, if I'm assuming we're still going to zoom, correct?

01:02:14.840 --> 01:02:16.840
 We have not heard otherwise.

01:02:16.840 --> 01:02:21.900
 So zoom until further notice, I'm going to zoom till I have a vaccine in me.

01:02:21.900 --> 01:02:22.900
 So okay.

01:02:22.900 --> 01:02:26.740
 Can I, who else, anyone?

01:02:26.740 --> 01:02:29.520
 Yeah, can I request something?

01:02:29.520 --> 01:02:35.760
 I wonder if, if this is a this situation that we're dealing with, with the fact that a lot

01:02:35.760 --> 01:02:41.520
 of the artists that ended up on our pre-qualified list are not actually interested in doing

01:02:41.520 --> 01:02:47.560
 projects of the size that we are doing.

01:02:47.560 --> 01:02:54.160
 So it just makes me wonder, in the future, if we're going to do like an open call for

01:02:54.160 --> 01:03:01.480
 pre-qualified artists every year, if we should change the language of that call, or if we

01:03:01.480 --> 01:03:07.400
 should have an additional question as part of the information that we asked from those

01:03:07.400 --> 01:03:13.160
 artists about that kind of addresses, like, would you be interested in projects of this

01:03:13.160 --> 01:03:15.880
 size, this size, and this size?

01:03:15.880 --> 01:03:21.360
 So that maybe there's another kind of additional, so we're not wasting our time as much in the

01:03:21.360 --> 01:03:22.360
 future.

01:03:22.360 --> 01:03:23.360
 I totally agree.

01:03:23.360 --> 01:03:26.200
 Georgina, you work with CAFE regularly, don't you?

01:03:26.200 --> 01:03:27.200
 Georgina?

01:03:27.200 --> 01:03:29.720
 Oh, I don't actually.

01:03:29.720 --> 01:03:40.720
 But let me say this, that last year, Michelle Cunningham made a push and effort to host

01:03:40.720 --> 01:03:47.080
 artists at GDAC so that they could learn how to use CAFE and go through that pre-qualifying

01:03:47.080 --> 01:03:48.560
 process.

01:03:48.560 --> 01:03:53.120
 No one showed up for that meeting.

01:03:53.120 --> 01:04:01.300
 So I don't know, I don't know how old the pre-qualified list is that we currently have.

01:04:01.300 --> 01:04:02.920
 It's less than a year.

01:04:02.920 --> 01:04:03.920
 They are new.

01:04:03.920 --> 01:04:07.800
 Jodi and I were on this, it was just a couple months ago.

01:04:07.800 --> 01:04:11.160
 I'll tell you, I mean, I hear the stereotype of the starving artist, and now I'm a little

01:04:11.160 --> 01:04:13.960
 surprised that people have turned us down.

01:04:13.960 --> 01:04:20.120
 Alicia, I do feel like maybe if this isn't successful for us, maybe we do just go ahead

01:04:20.120 --> 01:04:25.040
 and call for entries on an individual project by project basis.

01:04:25.040 --> 01:04:29.360
 I know that the reason we did this was to speed up the process of getting the art done.

01:04:29.360 --> 01:04:34.480
 But if it is counterproductive, maybe we go back to having, maybe we do that.

01:04:34.480 --> 01:04:42.640
 You know what, Michelle, it might be worth it to go through this process that we're going

01:04:42.640 --> 01:04:49.640
 through right now because we'll learn something about how artists respond.

01:04:49.640 --> 01:04:56.280
 What I wanted to say in addition is that we put out calls for material art in soft as

01:04:56.280 --> 01:05:01.480
 well as other exhibitions, and we get a pretty good response at GDAC like we did with the

01:05:01.480 --> 01:05:05.640
 30 under 30 exhibition.

01:05:05.640 --> 01:05:12.960
 Pre-qualified artists, like RFQs like this, the artists that are applying are assuming

01:05:12.960 --> 01:05:17.640
 that we'll have these like $100,000 budget projects.

01:05:17.640 --> 01:05:25.480
 So maybe we do an RFQ like this for pre-qualified artists, but we only use that RFQ process

01:05:25.480 --> 01:05:32.840
 for those big budget projects, whereas smaller budget projects, we do a cafe call for proposals

01:05:32.840 --> 01:05:34.640
 and RFP instead.

01:05:34.640 --> 01:05:38.100
 So we have both for different projects.

01:05:38.100 --> 01:05:42.720
 So Michelle, if I can inject, this is not specifically on the agenda, so I don't want

01:05:42.720 --> 01:05:45.760
 to get too far off target.

01:05:45.760 --> 01:05:50.040
 But we do have some options, and we can circle back around with you next month.

01:05:50.040 --> 01:05:53.260
 We can't still work off the pre-qualified list.

01:05:53.260 --> 01:05:56.600
 We got some recent discussions with our purchasing.

01:05:56.600 --> 01:06:02.360
 We can issue an RFP for a specific project if we wanted to be, this is where this sculpture

01:06:02.360 --> 01:06:03.360
 is going to go.

01:06:03.360 --> 01:06:07.600
 It needs to be this size and this weight, and this theme, give us your idea.

01:06:07.600 --> 01:06:08.600
 Here's the budget.

01:06:08.600 --> 01:06:11.080
 We can go in that direction.

01:06:11.080 --> 01:06:18.880
 We also have been given clearance that we can, if we see an artist that the group prefers,

01:06:18.880 --> 01:06:22.760
 we can reach out to them and have them put a proposal together.

01:06:22.760 --> 01:06:29.340
 So that's a recent opportunity that we can possibly speed things up.

01:06:29.340 --> 01:06:34.280
 They do want us to get into a routine of a process that we follow.

01:06:34.280 --> 01:06:39.720
 So if we do the RFQ, that might be for those higher end projects for sure.

01:06:39.720 --> 01:06:45.280
 But I think issuing an RFP would provide some clarity to the artist ahead of time, knowing

01:06:45.280 --> 01:06:47.880
 exactly what they're getting into.

01:06:47.880 --> 01:06:52.520
 And if we go on a national scale, obviously getting the art is going to be a little bit

01:06:52.520 --> 01:06:54.360
 more expensive getting it here.

01:06:54.360 --> 01:06:59.640
 So there might be an opportunity, maybe we focus on Texas or the Texas Sculpture Association,

01:06:59.640 --> 01:07:05.360
 you know, more locally, might provide more of a budgetary opportunity for us as well.

01:07:05.360 --> 01:07:07.320
 But we can definitely add that to the agenda.

01:07:07.320 --> 01:07:08.520
 That's an excellent idea.

01:07:08.520 --> 01:07:11.480
 We can add that to the agenda for discussion.

01:07:11.480 --> 01:07:15.320
 And then hopefully we get, you know, more local Texas people involved too.

01:07:15.320 --> 01:07:22.280
 Yeah, and even local.

01:07:22.280 --> 01:07:24.200
 We can put that on the agenda.

01:07:24.200 --> 01:07:29.920
 If that's okay with you guys.

01:07:29.920 --> 01:07:35.920
 Michelle, you broke up a little bit there, I couldn't hear you.

01:07:35.920 --> 01:07:39.440
 Oh, I think that's an excellent idea worth exploring.

01:07:39.440 --> 01:07:40.440
 Yes.

01:07:40.440 --> 01:07:41.440
 Okay.

01:07:41.440 --> 01:07:47.880
 All right, so we have, as right now, four items for the agenda.

01:07:47.880 --> 01:07:55.240
 Project updates, temporary art, stipend, and then kind of the selection process.

01:07:55.240 --> 01:07:57.600
 Okay.

01:07:57.600 --> 01:08:02.200
 And if anyone thinks of anything else, contact Gary.

01:08:02.200 --> 01:08:03.200
 Or Jessica.

01:08:03.200 --> 01:08:04.200
 Or Jessica.

01:08:04.200 --> 01:08:09.800
 All right, does that conclude us or do we have anything else to?

01:08:09.800 --> 01:08:14.400
 So that's conclude, unless there's anything else under concluding items, that's the agenda

01:08:14.400 --> 01:08:15.400
 for this evening.

01:08:15.400 --> 01:08:16.400
 Okay.

01:08:16.400 --> 01:08:17.400
 Okay.

01:08:17.400 --> 01:08:22.180
 Well, anybody have anything else to add before we sign off and start our weekends?

01:08:22.180 --> 01:08:28.720
 Okay, then I will call this meeting concluded and I don't have a clock showing what time

01:08:28.720 --> 01:08:29.720
 is it Gary?

01:08:29.720 --> 01:08:30.720
 416.

01:08:30.720 --> 01:08:31.720
 416.

01:08:31.720 --> 01:08:32.720
 Thank you.

01:08:32.720 --> 01:08:33.720
 You all stay safe.

01:08:33.720 --> 01:08:41.860
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