Mar 02, 2026 Historic Landmark Commission on 2026-03-02 5:30 PM

maybe one or two. I agree that I've known her my entire life so I still should have remembered her. All right we do have a quorum present and so I'm going to call the meeting to order. It is Monday, March 2nd, 2026 at 5 30 p.m. If you will please stand with me for the pledge of allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Honor the Texas flag. I pledge allegiance to thee Texas one state under God one and indivisible. All right thank you and can we have a presentation from any members? Keep moving on. There are no cards. Well hello! We started just a smidge early. All right on the agenda item 3a number HLC 26-005 is to consider approval of the February 9th 2026 minutes. Move to approve. Okay we have a second I mean we have a motion and a second. Wow I'm getting ahead of myself now. So thank you Commissioner Black and Hogan. Any questions or further discussion on the minutes? If not I'll move for approval say aye. Any just all right so motion passed. Item 3b number HLC 26-0001 on the agenda is to hold a public meeting and consider making a recommendation to the Planning and Zoning Commission and City Council regarding an application for historically marked designation in accordance with section 2.9.4 of the Ditten Development Code for the property located at 1403. How do you say this? Kindolf? Kindolf Drive. The property is located on the east side of Kindolf Drive approximately 360 feet north of Whippoorwill Lane HL 26-001. All right thank you Chair. As stated this is for the property at 1403 Kindolf Drive which is highlighted there in the red box. The owner is Jennifer Morales or the applicant is Jennifer Morales as well and the construction date is circa 1959. As stated this request is for historic landmark designation. It is located within the Denia neighborhood. It's at R3 zoning. As you can see they're surrounded by R3 zoning, single family residence and the property is approximately 0.3 acres. These are the front west and rear east facades here as you can see and we have our north and south facades there as well. So staff looked at section 2.9.4b of the Ditten Development Code looking specifically at the historic landmark designation criteria that it meets and in this case the property needs criteria one which is character, interest or value as part of the development heritage or cultural characteristics of the city state or the United States. Criteria three reflects a distinguishing characteristic of an architectural type or specimen. Criteria four, identification of the work of an architect or master builder. Criteria nine, exemplification of the cultural, economic, social, ethnic, historical heritage of the city. Criteria 11, identification with a person with significantly contributed to the cultural development of the city state or the United States and then lastly criteria 12, a building or structure that because of its location has become a value to the neighborhood community area or the city. So criteria one, three and nine are very similar so that's why you see them all grouped onto one page but the property itself does show how Ditten during the mid-century really kind of embraced those natural trends that were ongoing so that innovative design both in the exterior and the interior kind of that suburban style development but with a little bit of flair and that integration of natural landscapes into that design as well. It also captured many of the elements of mid-century design kind of that lot of natural light, lots of windows on the exterior, exposed structural elements, overhanging flat roof as you can see in some of these photos and then that indoor outdoor flow being able to go kind of inside to outside just by being kind of like what we saw on Willowood with one of our previous destinations. And then also especially as we've learned with the Deenian neighborhood, it has a lot of mid-century modern homes and so this is just another example of that modernist art architecture that we see in that Deenian neighborhood. Approval criteria four, it was designed by the Mount Millers so Tom Holt Miller and Isabel Mount who were part of Mount Miller architects and as you all are very familiar they designed and remodeled over between 200 and 300 homes within Ditten alone between 1953 and 2000 and a lot of these were in the Deenian neighborhood so just wanted to kind of call out some of the examples that we have. Both of these are in Deenia also a local landmark designation that you all have seen and then the Denton Unitarian Universalist fellowship. Looking approval criteria 11, we have Dr. Hiram Freidsen. Freidsen thank you okay Freidsen. He served in the U.S. Marine Corps during and after World War II. He was also a UNT professor and administrator for 40 or less a little less than 40 years but he also was a delegate to the White House conferences on aging in 1961, 1971, and 1981 and I have tried to pronounce this correctly gerontological gerontological I apologize okay well Google told me the wrong way to pronounce it so I apologize. Society of America created the Hiram Freidsen award so just wanted to highlight so he actually him and his wife were actually the ones who worked with Mount Miller to design the home and get it constructed. And then lastly looking at approval criteria 12 it is kind of a key landmark within the Deenia neighborhood especially with these kind of iconic paneling that we see on the side. It is part of that cluster of Mount Miller homes within the Deenia neighborhood. It's been featured on a lot of public architectural tours including last year's walking tour of the Deenia neighborhood and it really is kind of recognized within Denton promotions as that haven of mid-century modern architecture that we know as Deenia. So staff's analysis also looked at the 2019 historic preservation plan goal one policy 1.3 as well as the Denton 2040 comprehensive plan goal CC-2. So staff is recommending approval of the request for a historic landmark designation of the property located at 1403 Kindolf Drive as it does consist with our goals and objectives of that Denton 2040 comprehensive plan and our 2019 historic preservation plan as well as our Denton development capital. That can stand for any questions and we do have the applicants here if you do have any specific questions for them as well. So the remodel what was before and after you have pictures of that? That is in your backup of the before and after they were not included in this one. They were not included in this but that just in the back. Yes correct. I was surprised to read that it is now rental property so did I read that wrong? I restored it and my first tenant was the dean for the school of art at UNT. He was there for six years and then the next tenant was the hospitality. She left her house straight out of this department. So it really is the Dean Yeh neighborhood. There are some other rental houses on that street that aren't nearly as pristine. She wanted to buy it. I looked at it. I said if you want to do this I'm not kidding you this would be overhanging part of the front elevated there. There are huge steel poles that support it along the beam and they have buried it over the years to the point that those beams those round steel poles had a hole so big you could put your fist inside and we found stuff like that all over this. We stripped it down to the studs reinforced it with heavier wood and it was really an early construction for Mount Miller and a lot of it was done we understand by students and you know I'm not saying it was subpar but there was some stuff and we went through everything. Everything would actually replace the air conditioning system a quick system twice to get it right. So these plans here yes they the originals or they the remodel okay they're the originals okay so it left the footprint they just did things on the inside or yes so I would say do you want to explain kind of the process that you all went through with remodeling but keeping everything similar or exactly with maybe some new materials here and there for the Mount Miller's? Just exterior if you want to tell us about the interior you can. We left the polished concrete floors and the cork was not good so we brought guy with the cork. We slightly changed the floor plan in respect that we moved the bathrooms around slightly and they're in the same footprint but you know just changing where a couple doors work with more space and it was like four by eight so we took the hall. Everything that we did we tried to be consistent with materials to the left side of that image right there there's a courtyard with cinder block and that's something we added when we were doing the entire front yard has been redone all those stairs and all the we can't really see it there but there's a bunch of steel or walls or painted walls that go down the hill there and everything was you know tried to we tried to restore in this image on the right there's a small cinder block area there on the bottom left corner it was completely falling apart and had a staircase built into it that when you walk through it it was about five feet tall and you know it's just poorly done and so we took and rebuilt it used the same materials used cinder block and you could most people couldn't tell that it was something that was recently redone same thing with the there's some wrought iron that we had to put out on the stairs we copied the internal the interior that used a certain design a certain pattern and we then made that so everything you know that we did we tried to keep as it was a little bit of change the the front porch and back porch were added and uh i was i was happy you said that was one of the features that went with that style because that you know something we added the back for it was added uh if you would see the before pictures the house had been through a lot of owners and was really it was a rental house it was a dentin rental house it was in bad shape it had lots of layers of pain on the inside and all the because we went to college here so we know that design on the end of the house uh was originally supposed to be uh similarity and uh you know we couldn't change that yeah there's a picture of the original and it was literally falling apart and that's the after that sidewalk right there uh actually tilted toward the front door it actually slanted with the front door which was built by me and joe green when he was in college that's what they said this is the one we did to breathe breathe there you can see some of the steel that goes around there there it cascades down that hill which was just a pile of sand when we lived in that haydye block was popular then our swimming pool is built out of haydye blocks yeah you can kind of uh you can kind of see some of the other stuff down below that uh little cinder block thing when i was mentioning that's the rebuild of course you can see before it was one block lower and we had it completely taken out and rebuilt and then an actual staircase built through there everything's been replaced i mean everything it was a year and a half lenny knows how long we were working on it because you watched from back to front but i was in really good shape those colors make me think of the partridge family we went ahead and step up the wall are anyone else on any discussion cameron in your opinion the renovations on the exterior any way that have been done are they consistent uh you know we're talking about the old adams building right are they consistent with sort of keeping the dominant architectural features of the building it seems like it is to me yes yes i make a motion we accept staff recommendation second all right we have a motion and a second to accept as staff presented any all right all in favor return say yes all right any opposition all right motion passes thank you thank you guys thank you so much you know it's it's right there from my house okay all right our next item is item 48 number hlc 26-013 to hold a discussion regarding whether the hlc will provide an informational advisory statement to city council about historic preservation issues related to the future use of the ditton women's club women's club building so we had discussions on our last i think it was during our matrix time or something we were talking about this item to bring it up my understanding is that as far as use of the as far as the building any changes or anything that does come to hlc uses of that usually does not fall into hlc category that would be correct so that doesn't as how they use it now that doesn't prevent us to say putting a word in from that but as far as anything voting on on our purview is not really part right and chair if i may so in your list of powers and duties one of the things that the hlc is author is to do is provide information and counseling to owners of historic structures so that's the context that staff and i would encourage you all to focus your discussion on of a whether to have the disc whether to draft the opinion or advisory letter and be generally what to say in it and then our recommendation would be whoever gets well and told to write a draft who would look at it next meeting and and to get an adopted question so it says related to the future use of the building but this pertains to the renewal of the lease or not correct is that what why this is up for discussion and it is it is so it's a delicate thread to needle to thread of uh opining on how the in progress negotiations should go versus um i don't want to put words in anyone's mouth but like here's why we think the structure is important and here's what we'd encourage any future owner or leaseholder slash whatever to to keep in mind so i was also thinking um you know part of the reason obviously that we're all concerned about this is because you we can't touch on this stuff also touching on quaker town um and i feel like you know part of the reason that you know quaker town has not gotten the uh you know preservation or narrative or interpretive attention it needs is because you know we're still not necessarily giving the story the full daylight that it deserves um and from that perspective i think i feel there is a case here that uh you know consciously or intentionally or not um you know when we don't use something like the women's building to tell that story we are impeding best use of uh historical resources regarding the quaker town district which i feel like you know maybe does bring it a little bit closer to our normal purview that you know essentially this is an issue about how to uh you know promote or impede historical resources rather than am i right in thinking that basically your advice is to be informational so for example whatever document we decide to write one you're talking about the history of the building the history of the park but we don't necessarily weigh in on the issue of whether or not a lease should be granted into hooman for how much or whatever right that would be my strong recommendation can we get into the needle and say things like you know we yeah we would hope that day we negotiate a lease with blah blah blah blah i mean if not specifically say at least you know reflect the many historical resources or resources or historical dimensions of this physical space i don't know what that phrase means okay we hope that the women's club will in the future play greater knowledge one of the fact they have stolen land yeah okay so you're this is delicate because it's putting staff in a spot too potentially because what's our job is to effectuate city council's direction and um city council has not given a direction and so um what we guide you on needs to leave room for city council to give a direction and then for us to follow it um and so i love how you're just letting me talk this is binding we're just going on record right what you're doing is no you're not binding council yeah we're inviting ourselves i mean that's weird are we ever just saying yeah we think this is how we might do it if we were y'all or actually more more to the point these are the things we would take in a serious consideration if we were in your place i think looking at historic structures one but looking at the use like this structure is known for this and that usually play to me plays a lot of weight into future things too that you know do you do we want to go in on say these are things we would look at on yes we would grant them another lease for a penny or a dollar or or whatever that i don't think we want to get into um how much we should be that that's not yeah to me that is not ours at all we tell the history of that building it came to be in the land that it came to be and and and if we simply said something to the effect of you know we hope that that history will be represented in whatever exactly yeah council decides to do whether the lease is renewed or or it goes to someone else that whatever happens that it's and i i mean i've grown up knowing that all my life that building the use right but only in the last few years i was in my 60s before i found out the real history i mean i think our advice we are you have an advice in the capacity here our advice is that that history be acknowledged and you know really forthright present and whatever yeah the city decides to do with that and um you know go ahead i was just going to ask can we say anything about the marker that supposedly talks about it but doesn't really it sits over there you don't know that i think they could advise that the marker be redone in the future to i guess tell the true story yeah tell the full story so my my thoughts for you all is that the more we can stay factually accurate because i want to say something in my personal capacity um but not my attorney capacity so pardon me while i filter that um the more that we can say factually accurate and just agnostic as to um the politics or the competing values um that are at play here the more i think that what i'm inferring of many of the commissioners personal preferences for the site the more the facts will speak for themselves well it concerns me a great deal that the marker that's there is not factual and it sits across the little creek or whatever that is and you can actually read that marker and look around and think wonder what does that have anything to do with any of these buildings i'm seeing because it it does not specify that building in no way does it specify building uh and i i wonder if we can't comment on we'd like to have a marker that truthfully talks about that particular building yeah it is to go on okay to linnie's point um and keeping this informational as an advisory about a history of that building specifically because that building doesn't have any interpretation well that but the marker across the i understand that was the first quicker time right the 1991 city historic one um and and you're absolutely right about that one so could that be a possibility that we uh in our advisory capacity uh maybe describe um kind of the need for uh some type of um whether it's a marker or something informational that helps to tell the story of that in the context of wakertown sketch out some factual parameters correct yes and and and in that way what that will do is then open uh possibilities for that space to play a more active role in interpreting wakertown yes that sounds like that's within our group yes yes i i don't see any issue with that being as part of the informational letter and you know advice or suggestion that you all bring to council stating you know whatever the use may be we do feel however these facts seem to be stated and they need to be presented to create the larger story of quaker town i think that's more than fine it would be appropriate to assert that our community has not fully come to terms with what happened at quaker town and uh and perhaps this building uh is part of that lack of that's what's trying to get out my i mean i don't i don't i mean i don't want to go to i certainly don't want to tell council what to do or suggest that they do this out of the other but as an historian i i feel like it is i'm on very firm footing by saying that we as a community have absolutely not come to terms with that that's just a statement and that building is not the only part of that story but it's all very highly visible and symbolic one yeah and whether that's a plaque or you know something whatever it is that i think you're gonna have to come to terms with that building as a community and i think i don't see that being a legal issue in terms of you all expressing just that in the letter just saying we are concerned as you know the commission that this might be just a point of contention and that we haven't come to terms with the story of quaker town and you know the displacement of that community and that our hopes with having this you know informational conversation is that we start taking steps to rectify that um and from a legal perspective uncomfortable with the direction this is going because it is completely it doesn't matter who controls the site um and that doesn't change the message that you all are conveying from a parliamentary perspective could we please take a vote to confirm that we're all um in all our majority of us are in consensus to drop the letter yeah i so move okay so we have a motion and a second that we're all in agreement for the drafting of the letter i think the focus on the history is the thing we're the historic historic landmark mission so it's absolutely appropriate for us to be concerned that the history be factual and that the history be presented so everybody knows i dare say because i did the walking tour at the park a couple of weeks ago and i learned a lot and i i would predict that there are a number of women in the texas federation of women club and aerial club and all that who don't know who do not know why and how instrumental the texas federation of women's club was in the whole thing and that ought to be said they don't need to be ashamed these women don't you know what they were not here they were not here you're right the federation is a wonderful things but neither one against the other right so on that on that note one of the things that we're asking about the idea of drafting something i'm volunteering to do that i've been actually working on that aspect of the history with dr annetta ramsey she has a book that's going to be coming out here in the next week that specifically deals with the dent women's interracial fellowship but it also touches on the history of women's clubs in denton and so she has some new research that i've been privy to that helped contribute to specifically regarding the conditions of how that building got there because i'll be real when you talk about people don't know that history i had to go looking i had to go digging to find the original lease agreement because it wasn't available it wasn't where it was supposed to be but yeah right right but but i mean that's that's what got me started with somebody said well it's not there i'm like now i'm putting on my shirt like hometown right so um we do have a lot of new pieces uh to this but i think uh i think we can we can very much as you point you know um judiciously be able to offer information on how that property is itself a valuable part of the quaker town story and focus on um possibilities for perhaps better contributing to tell that history because i feel like that's the most positive does that make sense but it's a very positive way of making making us um partners and in doing that and helping to provide a forward context for the quaker town history so commissioner tree i'm comfortable with you drafting a letter with any option or happy to help if you want it if not like yourself i can't i mean it's a manager i can't commit so much but i'd be more than happy to give it a readover you know so what we're going to do if we have no more than three drafters with that is you guys communicating in terms of doing what i'd like to have done is have uh everybody's drafts or whatever you come with together a week before yeah so by march 31st perfect so that we could then promulgate a staff report that goes out to everyone so we're doing open records yes that's what i mean who has a desire to participate in this i'm more than happy to not do well yes and that'll be in your yeah yeah i don't mind stepping out of that before i wrote novels like the 25 years of public communications i'm happy to help okay so we have commissioner treat and mcadam's working on it and so we only need one more so you want john okay okay if you need for edits i'll be happy to but for you guys to do it i'm good with that if you need i'm betting it'll come back and that's fine you know what i was gonna say so i'll it'll come back in april so once if staff receives a letter on march 31st that draft will go to all of you all so then you can come with your edits and your suggestions and then there can be a conversation that happens so that everyone would we be able to walk through edit it yeah i i can i can do track changes and stuff we can do that way yeah we can do that so if it were in perfect world and we could do this draft this letter if we could ask the i what i would love to see in quite the town park and it's not blind for that one building which i think that building deserves it so i'm too good with that but have you seen the big it would be like a a big um sign of some kind that would have the history have you been to historic places where you can sit there it's like almost like they're in it's in stone the lettering and stuff where you can actually read about the whole history of that entire park and then if it would even have a map okay this building was here with this and then this and then even if what you could even say and then at whatever year the swimming pool was built you know that type of thing and tell the history go back and tell the history of the park and what happened i would actually love a virtual walking tour that you can complete on your phone well we want to i would say we want to get back on topic well here's the thing when we're talking about this to me it's kind of on topic because we have a sign it doesn't have anything to do that it's not factual and it doesn't have that so if they were to do that and even expand it and i think that you know if we could say what our wishes were even not just that building but even for quaker town park yes here's what yes so you know y'all are writing this but um consider the effectiveness of your communication um i would posit that a more targeted approach if this particular structure is what we're most concerned about at this structure um might want to go that direction but i think you're going to bring this into two projects basically focus on the letter now regarding the lease and then maybe we take up a broader you know this is what the hlc feels like an ideal here ideal interpret display for quaker town looks like well what about just including in this letter that we want the building to represent a broader vision for the park as a whole and then we would love to provide input on that or something like don't don't give them give them the whole story but just say that you know we're here we're advisors yeah and i would say definitely look at the design downtown denim plan because there is a lot of references to doing historical markers and historical pathways so i would read that and if there's things that you all don't agree with in terms of obviously they're broad but if there's things that you all don't agree with or you feel like should be added to i think that's a good starting point for you all at least a baseline in terms of there's a lot of that i did think it was interesting in the in the prep materials because i think you reference that or do you have to reference that but it was that building wasn't really a part of that discussion which i find exactly what i said earlier so just to clarify that part of having been to most of the meetings and the presentations on the downtown didn't plan which is great that's that's a good tip is to tie it into these aspirational future uses and development of quicker town itself the building wasn't talked about it wasn't brought up right because i don't think anyone knew it was on the table but what was on the table and what people were mostly kind of distracted by was the pool i don't know if you remember how excited everybody got from that so that being said and staying close to you know the possible future uses not uses but utilization of the building and the property it sits on in quicker town yeah to tie that in close with something that is going to help us then plug into these goals of the master plan i think it just gives you all kind of that more factual baseline because that was something that was approved by council that's right and i think so that's kind of why i was just saying them there's there's something you can state that hey council you all approve this and we're just trying to build on this correct and that's your point about discussing about okay some other interpretive things in the park that's where that would then provide kind of introductory rationale justification that we have been giving guidance by council we're helping you execute what you want to do all the way along now you got it that's right so so yes um great and this is just first draft business right so we'll get together and try to create something first draft and then be able to bring it here for editing the vision input that's that's a way a good community to vote on that on the personnel decision yeah we can it was more just voting on which option you all won yeah so that's totally well we've been making some committees and chair can i do a pardon shot so just from a strategy perspective and an effectiveness perspective i want to make a factual note that i've been with the school for about five years and i have not yet run into a board of commission that has done this yet and to to to write an advisory opinion um so just be sensitive to whether or not people like being managed up and in your in your drafting i think that'll that'll be um that'll be a key concern like with tone that we'll be able to address in editing yes i just kind of wanted to remind me of additional like at draft i take that as an experienced editor because you know the first draft is always with ferment it's like then anything you send to these staff is also an open record correct yes it is and you know that's a great point because i didn't really think about them looking at it as being managed up except that they put us on these boards for a reason yeah and it could be that hey those are the things we want you to draw to our attention but to your point not to like hey you know managing up that this is right i think we're here to advise you it's an informational advisory here's what we know there you go yes literally good point thank you all right are we good with that i was just gonna say and and it can all be positive i mean the bad stuff is behind us that's happened you can't change that now we're talking about positive things that we can do to acknowledge what was done and but we know better now and we do better and i think that's the proper tone for whatever i think you could put that in there all right then we will move on to another discussion to item 4b number hlc 26-112 on our agenda is to receive a report called a discussion to give staff direction regarding the historic landmark commission's participation and didn't reveal preservation map 2026 yes so we have a little bit more of the scheduling um as didn't figure it out uh the proclamation just so you all know for the city has been moved to may 5th uh and the dead historic bar tour and cemetery tour kind of like similar like last time are happening we're just kind of waiting on the date and time for the dead and historic bar tour and then the cemetery tour in terms of the location but the rest of it's finalized um so wanted to bring this all back because this was something you all had discussed in february um i know there was a couple different ideas that were thrown out such as like first friday tour um doing denton trivia night but i know it's kind of seemed to go geared towards kind of more of education and just making sure that people know that you all are around kind of what the historic preservation processes are with the city um and get people excited about preservation and denton um so this is kind of this you know topic or i guess this agenda item for you all kind of to finalize that um and determine for sure that you all want to do x y and z events um so just wanted to bring that back and then we'll make sure that obviously that gets added to the calendar as well you just want to remind everybody that an alternative bar tour was on the table yes there was that was you will present my idea i'm so sorry um so as you all see i guess one that's really neat that crumb has brought they are joining and doing restoring the crumb depot and they're going to do a tour of their city hall and the depot as well yeah can someone remind me i know we had a conversation about where uh we might because the idea was maybe that we're going to piggyback off of something else right is that i think there was consensus on that but we the fight arts one seemed like it was maybe a difficult one to do unless we did it in the limited space yeah unless we did in the courthouse across the street right which is where they're going to be doing the lecture so you all could do something there prior to the lecture and there was going to be involved there was waiting involved for them to get the tour right so that you have a captive audience correct and then obviously with the southridge neighborhood walking tour that one's outside so you know in terms of being able to sit and chat with someone not as horrible of a setting um so there's that opportunity there but um i know one of the ideas was to present stuff from the research subcommittee um and i know that we're next on the agenda so i won't say too much i think our ability to do a lot would be fairly limited just based on where we're at in the process right now um that's not to say that it couldn't be included somehow but i don't think that should be necessarily the entire sure that's not a full event at this point right okay and i know there are some discussions about you all kind of talking about like kind of the wins that you have had um and talking about some of the projects that you all have worked on and seen over the last couple years and how preservation has kind of changed as the chair strictly has stated in the past kind of it's not as black and white anymore in terms of preservation is that um it's a little bit more flexible not as stringent um kind of taking more that national parks approach in terms of how you're doing preservation um so i remember that was also a topic of discussion so well i think we just need to let people know that we're encouraging preservation and i think before it was it was not even encouraged you don't want to do anything but that we're encouraging that for homeowners to be able to just even upkeep their properties i mean i like the idea of showcasing some of the lands some of these houses and you might have to get a really big cookie cake i don't know but but i like that idea and then there could be an element where the stuff that we're going to talk about next is sort of a part of that a small part of that like hey this is a direction that we're looking at right now but the focus is really on the things that the wins of which the fight arts theater is one of those right and i don't know they didn't have any of that come through here but i'd still call it a win or history yeah it's all the way right and even some of the um downtown things that we've approved that i think that's you can do a tour of the temporary andy's windows they don't look bad though fine so do you need anything else from us well so the only thing i kind of need from you all is i want to make sure that whatever event you all host is shown on this schedule of events so if it's a southridge neighborhood walking tour i would do you know preservation education you know we would come up with a title that allows people to know that there's going to be kind of this you know supporting preservation and how you can get involved in the preservation of denton and a walking tour so i just want to make sure that whatever you all are doing gets promoted so there might have to be a little bit more conversation of date time all that but i want to make sure that i know where it's kind of falling would help me at least because we do want to start promoting this as soon as possible and will we get little um posters yeah i would get them to you lini don't worry i'm leaning against doing it during south bridge neighborhood only because it's outside yeah and hard i think to get that audience that we're looking for i agree i'm looking at things like the legacy lab tour at emily bellwood library that would be a much more conducive uh endorsement or we could have like a powerpoint slider presentation yeah uh there's also um something like so um and maybe ask if we can add something to either open or close the vintage short film fest maybe have a few words a little sizzle reel of like historic preservation look what exciting things are going on right that's cool something like that that might be a that might be a good opportunity um what does the legacy lab tour research so um so the legacy lab tour um just to let you all know that is going to only be limited to 20 people because it is this very small space but yes so it is going to be limited so you might not get as big of a crowd um unless it's promoted as a separate event prior to but what the legacy lab is is um it's essentially a lab where you can preserve documentation photographs um video all that kind of stuff but our library actually offers that i kind of like the short film festival too because i think i think you might get a different audience than so you might get some of these sort of things as someone's at last year's uh film festival there's a lot of attendance but it's not really conducive i mean it's a surprisingly chaotic environment so i mean if we want kind of what kind of like we want to shoehorn a few words the beginning or end that that might work but in terms like interacting with folks i just if it's like it was last year i just don't see anything feasible so even if we're just walking around i mean so basically again if it's like it was last year it's not a film festival like we might think if you'd like me it would be the southpaw or something like that i mean it's pretty much 50 chairs set in front of one of the walls to collab and non-stop back-to-back we don't yes so there you know there's always noise and activity in darkness okay it wasn't until really the end that people have the opportunity to talk yeah we don't really do breaks because the films the reels are very long and we want to make sure that people get to see them i mean we've got this new portion around the courthouse 150 times otherwise what's the point what if we did it i don't know what time it starts at so i don't know the logistics of it but what if what if before it started we were there so it will start at 6 30 and it will end at 8 so it's about a two hour period so if you all wanted to get there because people started showing up at six to grab seats well that's the thing in that there is kind of a captive audience there then what if we were there from five to six thirty almost like ushering people that's great because we were having to usher and we were failing because there was four of us and we were like hi i'm running over here not a big popcorn we do that like host right that's what i was saying we don't have a budget for like a mixer type thing right no we kind of just all pitched in and got candy and popcorn and all that stuff at that point if we had something whatever it might be then it might have a reason to come earlier yeah because i staff can print out flyers for you all to pass out so if we if someone wanted to design something in canva to kind of direct people or i don't know canvas my best friend but a popcorn machine that we could use the county has a popcorn machine machine so they brought it last year and then we covered the rest with like candy and stuff the staff did okay would it be possible if it starts at 6 30 like at 6 15 for us to have an intro right for historical issues so we're like ushering and then we know well that we could be welcoming everybody and then like at 6 15 it's going to start a reel of this you being interviewed or things like that you know or the real of the of the projects that we had that have gone through just and it could just be pictures of them too just so they know these are the things or or maybe have a slide that say you know this is historic preservation indeed yes and this is the black pretend like it's 1959 when this house was built you guys haven't had to dress up in like costumes and we'll take it like black and white images i don't think we have to have a formal presentation i think just something quick we're there we can hand out things and then just have something because it's a film festival just yeah if it's a slideshow you could have it on the loop for the hour before it starts i would like that and i guess at some point the announcement could be made hey you have a historic house you want to you know ask questions talk to our answers yeah well wear t-shirts ask i mean this is just one end and not the collab so it's going to have materials available on the table we've kind of got a captive audience as they come in going yeah they make that walkway real near yeah yeah yeah maybe with like you know one of our starter working members going yes you will take one of these camera for the legacy lab tour that's going on emily feller yes what time is that going to be um i believe that's going to be at either 10 or 11 a.m so i can i was to say i just didn't want to give you guys like yeah so much information but i can um tomorrow send you all kind of the full screenshot where you see like the time and everything um i just didn't want to over what i'm asking is that i have a quaker town tour a walking tour of quaker town oh that i could um follow that with okay um since people are there the idea is maybe we have a walking tour in quaker town park or something i already have it actually did one this weekend um just throwing that out there because that's something that i have and then because what i do is i actually take them we started the civic center and i use the interpretive things that they have already in the park and i use those as my touchstones i move around and show them different things in the park and where this was and what happened the people were involved here the businesses that were here right and so it's a it's a walk where you actually physically get to be in this do you hand out a map i did the one that the county did a couple weeks ago that kim cubitt did and so this was the overall map and then this is more detail of quaker town and so they would we would walk to where um the allen restaurant was right or and then talk about you know pleasant grow or yeah pleasant road by this church was here and this used to be a street hope avenue went here and the terry road went this way so it's very interesting but also it's nice to be able to look at it to have it to look at yeah i think we do a tour of city hall west after the short film festival and maybe we can drum up public support for actually doing something with that if i am hit the building facilities i don't know if they want to stay that late on a friday unless they go to the film fest how long is it we have to wait again before we can do another bond in that building try to push something wasn't it i don't know my time was well spent i have to go back and look it up i know it i wish i could give you an answer i have no idea i'll look it up okay and who is hosting the the film fest film fest is um unt colab and then dead reveal team so the county myself and then but we can add you guys on there okay that's what i was gonna say i don't want to just kind of like hey let's just slide in like yeah shouldn't we like ads oh yeah yeah so you all can be a host of that event um and then like you stated you all can usher from five to six fifteen then there can be kind of that reel going with handouts and then um you all can kind of introduce and talk about the work that you all are doing and then i guess pass it over to me or someone from the county and then we'll start talking about the individual reels that we're showing and i'm talking with jason boudoir the downtown denton foundation that did oh yeah i've already put that together for them yes he did tell us that but he just wasn't sure about the timing yet and then i'm letting him set the date okay but i'm saying it's go but that would also be a good place for us to again show like a sizzle reel someplace and talk about the benefits of historic preservation because it's on topic you know what i mean oh yeah it's like we can totally roll that in where you know one of it stops because we do let them stop and get a drink and have time to get a drink perfect time to like if i'm a quick five minute can we get that can we get that reel on the screen at east side i doubt i doubt it would be going at east side but i might i might be able to get a screen inside of uh the loophole in the back it has been a while but i'm just i'm just letting you know that because no no i think that's perfect so yeah use a plug into things that are and you're going to reach different audiences so if you guys if you're real could play at the historic bar tour you're going to get a different audience and then obviously with the vintage port uh jenton vintage short film fest you'll get another audience there but at least he'll play twice throughout the month and then and then you can play it for city council chambers during proclamation it'll give you an opportunity to give them hey by the way here's all the cool stuff we've been preserving i'm just gonna start pointing stuff like on the screen i'll be like look at this and it'll pop up in a bowl we did that we did that should we do things for you to post if we're all going to be at some of these things like i think yes you should be at the proclamation i do too yeah yes so i will yes if we have more than three folks at certain events if you all definitely think you're gonna there's gonna be more than three of you all at proclamation i'll for sure put a notice of public hearing or public yes possible thank you there's a possible quorum i've been gone for two weeks sorry there's a possible quorum for the proclamation and you'll sit to put it on our calendar yes it's kind of what time yes once i get all these like i said once all these events are like truly finalized you all are going to get a lot of calendar invites for me um so if you definitely know you're going to come it'd be great if you're able to say i'm able to attend that so then we know for sure which ones will definitely have possible quorum and then where ones where we only see one of y'all is accepted then we should be fine okay so just to reiterate so i make sure my notes are correct definitely a real but you all are going to be pairing with the short film fest and be there prior to it happening at 6 30 kind of educating the public talking to folks about preservation answering any questions they may have we'll make sure that you all have a flyer to hand out and then 6 15 kind of kick it off and then go from there so um i know that was very quick summary but okay cool all right we're ready to move on yes ma'am item 4c number hlc 26-009 held a discussion regarding the next steps of the designation to research subcommittee and the community outreach subcommittee community i don't know why to establish a potential new local historic district generally located along north elm street and north loco street corridors between west mckinney street and west university john i can make this pretty quick we've kind of divided things up a little bit i'm doing the grunt work i'm doing a bunch of data entry and john is uh kind of having fun in the narratives yes i'm pursuing some stories about specific stuff um data entry is slow i've been working my way through some of the city directories tell them about the widow's block though that's fascinating the what the widow's block uh well i don't know if i found anything quite yet but in one of the city directories i'm seeing a lot of uh mrs women who appear to be living alone uh and this would have been i think i can't remember which year like 20 or 20 i mean right after in the 20s whichever 20s when they had um and so i don't i don't know if these are war widows i don't know if these are the husbands just aren't listed in the city directories for some reason uh or if they're widows for other reasons or you know i'm not sure so or if they were at war and couldn't register they did it for them yeah yeah right i'm not sure so hopefully you wanted off one time and she buried him in the back now we have a bunch of houses with archaeological back so uh i would like is it possible for me to do like a brief presentation next meeting just i so i would like to start giving you all like a usb stick that has some of the specific stuff that we found i just don't feel like i have quite enough there to make you for a while um but i can maybe present that i'm not going to go over every piece of information just give you an idea of what to look for and how it's organized or something as long as camera gets yeah and then it can be part of the right yeah that's great thank you anything else to add not really um i think i feel like the widow's block was the biggest mystery uncovered but also having fun uh delving into the stir spinning wheels um did not know it opened in 58 i thought was younger than that um so and also the what is known as sleeping lizards building has a fascinating history oh i bet it does yeah oh yeah denman's first dairy queen but then became like a series of like increasingly interesting like local restaurants so you have me i'm gonna try and see if i can nail down now like a menu at least one of those restaurants just as you know hey folks look at this is cool by the way here's a potential recipe you can try to uh when people do all that stuff oh yeah yeah nice all right um outreach committee nothing to report uh we need to get a list of the owners i think because one of the things i'm running to is i've just been doing walk-ins of like different places and none of them are the owners i will i can provide you that information great next month fantastic i i i stole all the information straight from the cad and perfect perfect okay so that will help because that what i need to do is follow up because so far good news is um just in meet and greet and like quick like pitch of like we're looking to turn this in um interesting so there's the interest is there and i'd mentioned last time that i had a conversation with ken curran that he had he hasn't gotten back to me but he had a prior membership list of people in a neighborhood group whenever that was something that was happening during their last what year was that whatever i think what's that 2012 i think that sounds right yeah that whenever that process had happened before that he had a list of people that were involved at that time and so he said he would try to dig out that list and and share that because uh obviously it's going to need to be updated and provide but it's a start so that's kind of where we're at is getting the names of the people who uh own the properties because that's what we need for the yes right um but so fun to have people that are in the properties they did blue and several others like that they're all interested and enthusiastic about it so let's go you did have stuff to report just a little all right thank you guys we appreciate your work on that next item for b number hlc 26 - euro 10 to receive a report hold the discussion and give staff direction on the historic landmark commission's request for local historic designation of eligible historic properties does anyone have an additional one to add i think all these properties are properly enough swimming in them right yes okay there's none there okay and number 4b hlc 26 - euro 11 on our agendas to hold a discussion regarding historic landmark commission project matrix yes so regarding the former entry wall at park place we had mentioned talking about bringing that back in may so that we could get through some other items first and so that will be coming back may 11th obviously we talked about the den revealed event um today and then in terms of the possible historic designation of the corridors the faq i'm so sorry y'all that just keeps getting thrown on my back burner and then i've been out the last two weeks so did not get that down between february and now um so and then obviously incentivizing historic preservation which we will keep as ongoing until our budget it is a better place but is there anything that you all would like to add to the matrix or do you think you're you're good for now can you make one comment on park place um i have been in contact with uh joyce who's less than a blocking on the granddaughter of uh kina's thank you um she is absolutely delightful um i cannot tell you how tickled she was that we had stuff to add that she didn't know um she's like yeah yeah every christmas i send out a yo card to all my relatives like a fun fact about uh you know uh you know clinton dewitt they didn't know and i've got so much stuff now thank you um but i have just kind of started the like the oral history component with her and uh you know i have nothing exciting to report on that i was gonna i was just thinking about the uh faq and the processes documents stuff and no pressure but some of that might be cool for us to hand out right yes yes yes that's in the back of my mind because i'm like i i need to get it done for you all for may so don't worry um definitely moving up in the priority i think we're good okay i didn't say anything else to your plate right now all right any further discussion tonight we drew all right we're dirt six thirty eight we uh