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 Good afternoon. I'm calling to order the Friday, August 22nd, 2025 meeting of the Sustainability

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 Framework Advisory Committee here in the work session room of Stanton City Hall. Our first

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 item on the agenda is considered the approval of July 25th, 2025 minutes. Is there any discussion

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 or any motion? I move to approve. I second. Motion made to approve and seconded. So done.

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 Minutes passed. Okay, next item is to receive a report and hold a discussion regarding updates

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 to the Dent Renewable Resource Plan and the potential acquisition of additional... Sorry,

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 I apologize for interrupting. You need to take a vote. Oh, I'm sorry. We have a vote on the

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 minutes. All in favor? All opposed? Thank you. Are you ready now? Yeah. Tony Puente will make

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 the presentation. Mr. Chair, members of the committee, thank you for having me this afternoon.

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 My name is Tony Puente. I'm the general manager for DME. With me, I also brought Chris Nutrick,

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 who's our executive manager of operations, and Chris has been with DME for a while, and he kind

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 of helped with the construction of the Dent Energy Center, so if there's questions that I can't

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 answer, Chris will help me out. We have Jose Gaitan and Tony Roybal that manage all our power

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 supply processes, all our energy trading, and so if there's questions that come up that I can't

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 answer, they're here as resources as well. So just really quickly, today's presentation is on a

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 recap of what's called the Dent Renewable Resource Plan that was adopted back in 2018. There's a

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 couple of other things that we'll cover here as well. Part two is, we'll talk a little bit about

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 the integrated resource plan, and then part three is acquisition of the special generation. This

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 entire presentation, although I kind of culled some of the slides from what I presented to the

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 council and the PV, but it's still about 15 slides in total, so bear with me as I try to go through

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 all of these. And certainly if there's questions, Mr. Chair, in between, just let me know and happy

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 to pause and try to address those. Thank you. So Dent Renewable Resource Plan, as I mentioned,

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 was adopted back in 2018. That plan called for 100% renewable energy for the city, and when I say

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 the city, that's for just the service territory that's served by Dent Municipal Electric. There

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 are citizens in Dent that are served by Coastal Electric and Encore as well, or TXU. This plan

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 does not apply to those utilities. There was a goal of 100% renewable by 2020 or 2024. There was

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 a variety of strategies within why those dates are there. There was five objectives, the leading

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 being that we would pursue lease cost alternatives or lease cost supplies, and so over the years we've

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 brought forward a number of RFPs and proposals to councils that have not moved forward, primarily

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 because of the cost of those resources. Dent Energy Center, within that plan, was certainly

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 recognized as a cost hedge. I know that certainly since Winter's Farm period there's been a lot of

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 questions about that facility. I will mention to you that facility does not provide power directly

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 to our residents. That is interconnected into ERCOT just like any other facility. All the PPAs that

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 we have with renewable resources are all interconnected into the ERCOT grid as well, and so this facility

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 is no different than any other facility out there that's producing power. Certainly there are some

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 facilities out there that might be interconnected into a distribution system like a community solar

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 or even our rooftop solar stuff, and there's other smaller kind of generators out there,

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 combined heating power plants and various universities that are interconnected kind of

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 behind the meter, and so but here certainly I wanted to just be clear that this facility

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 is interconnected into the grid, and certainly acknowledge that there are some challenges in

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 balancing that portfolio with 100% renewable energy, and certainly that's part of our conversation

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 today. Just as an inventory for you, this is currently what we have by way of resources.

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 Power purchase agreements. The latest one that we executed was Yellow Viking. We executed that

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 last year. That was a solar project at 100 megawatts. That project is still not online.

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 As a matter of fact, and we'll talk a little bit about some of the challenges that we're seeing

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 with some of these PPAs and just the overall market, but you know at this point we're uncertain

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 whether or not that 100 megawatts of capacity will come online. We're kind of working through

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 that process now, and what's that accounted for here is that we currently have an RFP. We issue an

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 RFP for up to 300 megawatts of additional solar, wind, and/or battery storage. I will tell you that

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 we're close to bringing that forward to the council for consideration here in the next couple of weeks

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 for a wind resource and potential battery resource as well, all through a power purchase agreement.

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 But anyway, so that's kind of the inventory of what we have. Just for some context,

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 generally when we look at these resources on the wind side, when you look at that total

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 capacity of 150 megawatts, we're really counting at about 30 percent of that capacity that will

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 actually show up. On the solar side, it's about 40 percent, right? And so while we have here,

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 where we listed 455 megawatts of capacity, actual production is only going to be about 167, right?

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 And so you know, much of the recommendations back in 2018 was that you needed basically twice as

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 much renewable resources to get to the amount of your peak load that you needed, right? And I will

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 tell you Georgetown is an example, or TheExample, that's exactly what they did. And I'll tell you

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 that that became a challenge for them, and they're still unwinding some of those agreements because

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 they ended up in a very long position, right? For D&E, I think as we've been kind of moderately kind

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 of heading in that direction, we're certainly not in that kind of position where we're long on

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 renewables, right? And so certainly if that was the case, we probably wouldn't be issuing

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 another request for proposals. So just the timeline, kind of going back to 2009,

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 you know, D&E had a goal of 40 percent and moved it to 70 percent in 2016. 2018 certainly was 100

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 percent, and certainly we believe that in 2021 we achieved that 100 percent renewable goal based on

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 the parameters established within their renewable resource plan. So in 2021, we served 1.5, almost

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 1.6 million megawatt hours of load. So we, this is the energy that we buy from the market,

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 and then that amount at the end of the year that we account for it, we look and see, well,

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 how much power was generated from the renewables, right? And so that particular year, we had one

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 point three million megawatt hours of actual power that was produced by these PPAs sold into the

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 market. And so when we accounted for those, we were short, right, roughly 30 megawatts,

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 and so what is equivalent of the 262,000 megawatt hours. We had a conversation with the council

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 leading into this discussion. We had a contract called the Whitetail contract that included 30

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 megawatts of energy and included 30 megawatts of renewable energy credits without the energy,

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 and so we advocated or we proposed to the council that we count those 30 megawatts of RECs

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 towards this goal, and that's what represented here, right? And so that particular contract

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 expired in December of 2023, and so in 2022, those 30 megawatts were included in that 353,

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 same thing in 2023, and in 2024, we went out and we actually purchased 400 megawatt hours

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 of renewable energy credits, right, to round out that 100 percent renewable goal. The conversation

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 we had with the council at the time was that in order for us to buy those three years worth of

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 energy equivalent to the 30 megawatts of RECs would have cost D&E an additional five million,

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 almost five and a half million dollars, and so the council's direction was go ahead and count

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 the RECs, do not buy the energy. We recognize that the RECs count towards that goal, and so

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 since that time, yes sir. I'm sorry, I'm just confused. I need to be enlightened here. You've

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 got the renewable energy column and then you've got RECs without energy. What the RECs meaning

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 no direct, that's the energy that goes into the grid, correct? So all the energy goes into the

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 grid. Then what is the renewable energy represent, the specific category before that? So the

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 renewable energy, that is the energy that's produced from contracts that we have with wind

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 and solar producers. For every megawatt of power that they generate through our contract, the city

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 gets one REC, right, and so it's one REC for every one megawatt hour of power that's generated.

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 This additional RECs that we purchased, right, well we had already purchased them through the

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 Whiteside contract. We already owned those, and so that particular company would also deposit into

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 our account an additional 30 megawatts of RECs. The 400,000 were RECs that we went out into the

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 market and we purchased, but again I think it's important to understand that for a REC to be

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 awarded, right, that power has to be generated, right? So for every one megawatt hour of renewable

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 energy, it's awarded one REC, and so even though we didn't own the energy for these RECs,

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 there was energy produced that's validated through those RECs that we purchased.

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 Tell me again what renewable energy represents? This renewable energy is the actual energy

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 that was generated by the contracts that we have, that the city owns, and that's evidence

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 through the RECs that are deposited into the DME's account along with the compensation that

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 we receive for the energy that we purchase. Okay, so that's still RECs energy. There's still RECs.

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 Okay, that's what it is. Anything that's on here, there are RECs associated with it. That's the

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 evidence that the power was produced and that we own it, and that we can designate it towards our

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 goal of a 100% goal. Gotcha. Thank you. Yes sir? That's a good question. My question is how the

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 renewable energy column matches the previous slide because those numbers are a lot bigger than the

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 PPAs. Yes, so this is just in capacity, right, and so what's produced here, right, you know,

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 and you convert it to megawatt hours right in total because the units come up close to,

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 you know, about a million megawatt hours. Gotcha. Gotcha. Thanks.

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 Okay. The other thing that I'll just point out just really quick here, and a couple things that

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 we'll talk about, so when DME gets these RECs, currently we do not retire them. We let them

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 expire, and so each, every REC has a three-year life, right, and so from the year that it's

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 produced, it has two additional years, right, so you can go out in the market and buy a REC that's

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 two years old or three years old, right, and so these RECs currently, we do not retire them.

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 We also don't roll them over to the next year, right. That's why in this particular year, 2021,

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 it shows 101% renewable because that's how the accounting kind of works for us. And we'll talk

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 a little about that, kind of the basis for some of the recommendations that we're making in this

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 particular policy that we have, that we took to the council. So, just to kind of get into that, so,

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 you know, certainly a lot of additional detail. I did reference and I asked that there are

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 additional slides that we presented to the council that I did not include in here,

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 but the recommendation that we made to the council is to create or develop a city renewable energy

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 policy that is very clear about how that goal is calculated, what resources are actually acceptable.

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 Those are all tied to what's called the Texas Renewable Portfolio Standard that identifies

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 only specific types of facilities, solar, wind, geothermal, hydro, wave, tidal, biomass are actually

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 the ones that are considered renewable because through the Texas Portfolio Standard, those are

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 the only types of facilities that are actually awarded renewable energy credits. And so,

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 what is an allowable resource to account towards that? Certainly, we would like to

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 tie that to that standard. And also, how are we going to treat recs, right? And there's also this

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 other kind of nebulous thing called compliance premiums that are awarded in addition to recs to

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 certain types of solar facilities. Now, we'll tell you that those are starting to wind down.

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 And so, within this policy, we would also stipulate how those recs are going to be counted

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 towards that goal and that they must be retired, right? And so, and why are we recommending that?

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 So, you could count a rec today towards your goal, monetize it, and then somebody else counts it

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 towards their goal, and there could be that potential double counting, right? And so, we

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 think that certainly, based on an audit that our internal audit made as well, kind of came to the

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 same conclusions that this policy would require that DME retire those recs if we're going to count

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 towards our goal. And also, that DME be allowed to sell any excess recs. So, if I end up in a situation

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 where I have 101%, 105%, that excess, I can go ahead and monetize it and sell it since I'm going

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 to count towards our goal. We didn't think that recommending that those be rolled over, now you're

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 crossing years. You know, I come from the finance side, you know, where you buy, you can go out to

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 the Fed window and buy a brand new treasury that hasn't been traded before. Kind of looking at it

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 this way is we're going to buy recs that are produced in the same year in which we're going

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 to count them, and therefore, we're not going to roll them over to next year, because I think you

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 kind of get away from kind of what the true nature of those are, plus not only that, if the power is

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 generated in 2024, but you're counting in 2025, now you've got some time difference there. And

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 frankly, the impact that those have. And then also, when needed to meet the 100% goal, so if we are

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 short, that we would go out and we would actually do what we've been doing, and that's to go out and

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 buy these renewable energy credits. Recs on the open market range, and there's certainly a range

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 of costs anywhere from roughly $1.50 to $2.25. And so, when you're talking about buying a rec,

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 right, and the cost of that rec versus the energy, there's a substantial amount of cost difference

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 if you haven't already pre-negotiated that contract to a PPA. And so, now you're basically

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 exposed yourself to a real-time market or, you know, just the normal market conditions.

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 And then there's also this other concept of large loads. As you can imagine, you know,

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 large loads are big in the news, certainly here in Denton, but across the state. Across the state,

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 it's projecting, you know, certainly over 80, excuse me, over 80 gigawatts of data center load

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 to come in the DFW area alone. I recently read an article that Encore has over 200 gigawatts of

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 interconnection requests for data center loads across their entire service territory. If you

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 think about that data center load that's coming alive in the total generation capacity of all

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 types, you know, now you're talking about renewable, coal, wind, I mean, natural gas, everything,

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 it just, there's just not enough generation, right. And so, certainly that becomes a need.

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 So, I think addressing how we're going to treat these loads from a risk profile standpoint is

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 important. You know, the other thing too that I'll mention, you know, these renewable PPAs that we do,

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 they're 15 and 20 years long, right. And so, if I have a large load that comes into our system,

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 that's 200 megawatts, that could be gone tomorrow, but yet I've entered into a PPA for 15 or 20 years,

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 and then the load's not there, now I'm in a potential Georgetown long type of position, right. So,

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 and all these, and these loads, they're not all created equal, right. You know, in the oil and gas

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 industry, they call them wall catters, right. So, we're seeing a lot of speculators, speculative

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 developers that are saying, hey, let us interconnect into your system at 300 megawatts, and we're going

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 to build it and they will come. Well, entering into a very long-term contract for something that's

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 speculative, I think puts a lot of risk on our ratepayers. And so, evaluating them, you know,

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 who are the counterparties, who are the financial backings, making sure that we're monitoring them,

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 you know, maybe the strategy, if it is a solid company that has good financials, is maybe we do

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 a short-term type of agreement for a five-year kind of short position on renewable energy. We kind of

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 take a, you know, on the finance side, we call it the prudent investor rule, right. And so, that

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 would be the approach that we would recommend. But certainly, addressing these large loads

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 is something that we would envision putting into this policy. Yes, sir. So, you're saying you could,

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 and I imagine this is competitive with other cities, but you could stipulate in a contract

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 with these large loads that you're paying us for five years of electricity. Is that what you're

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 saying? So that they can't just up and leave a year later. Can that be stipulated in the contract?

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 Yeah, certainly. I mean, it's a negotiation. You know, we can and have asked for the moon

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 in some of these cases. Whether or not there's any takers or not is certainly something that

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 we evaluate as we're negotiating.

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 I was just, I've read where some of the larger data companies are actually

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 building their own on-site generation. Has there been any consideration of making,

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 bringing that into play, assuming that we get more than one center here?

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 So, certainly, SB6 that passed by the legislature and the legislature this year does mandate and

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 require a co-location of backup generation for this facility. I can tell you just purely on a

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 business practice, the data center that we have had already made that decision is already installing

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 backup generation. So, I just think it's a good business practice anyways. I think most of these

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 developers, certainly the AI type of developers that are going to be operational 24/7, you know,

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 they have a lot of counterparty risk with their own customers that they have to have the power.

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 So, if there's outages, particularly for interruption, they're going to have on-site

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 generation. But now through this legislation, it's going to be required.

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 So, do you know what type of generation they're going to have? Is it wind or solar?

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 No, the backup generation that they have is natural gas or diesel. They have generators.

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 They also are looking to do some battery storage as well.

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 I have one more question. Could you clarify, again, in the weeds on this, what is meant by

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 addressing the environmental or offset goal of matching the annual load served with renewable

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 energy and not the resource mix, et cetera? What is the offset goal?

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 Yeah. So, the conversation we have with the council is that there is a renewable kind of environmental

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 impact aspect of the generation that DNE has. And then there's the generation mix in managing

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 our portfolio and ensuring that we have safe, reliable, and affordable power to our customers.

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 And so, this particular policy is only going to address that environmental kind of renewable

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 aspect of our load and how we manage that. The generation mix is what the integrated

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 resource plan will end up eventually vetting out and then coming back and making recommendations

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 to the council on what that generation mix should be for the city long term.

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 If you remember, this 2018 goal mandated that DNE be 100% renewable with just renewable energy.

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 And so, certainly we think that some of the challenges that we'll talk about on the

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 regulatory and market side, that that's continuing to be more and more difficult, right? To say we're

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 going to have nothing but wind and solar generation to meet the needs of our customers and to be able

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 to keep rates affordable and power reliable across the market. As a grid participant, we are as

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 responsible as any other interconnected member of ERCOT to ensure that there's reliability of the

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 grid. Because as you know, during winter storm year eight, there was outages, and so those outages

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 impacted us as well, right? So, that's what I mean by keeping these two things separate.

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 Just to clarify, this policy statement that's presented here, this is our current 2018 policy,

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 this is where you're thinking of taking this renewed, the direction that you received from the

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 June council meeting. Yeah, so what that policy statement eventually is may not necessarily be

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 this. This was just to stipulate to the council that having a policy statement, and certainly we

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 think that something along these lines may be workable, but certainly I think as we continue to

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 go through the process, that may eventually be tweaked a little bit, or a little bit different.

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 So, this is your draft policy statement? Yes, yes. So, I guess I'm just trying to clarify what our

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 function in this discussion is, because you received the direction to begin this planning

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 phase with your renewable energy policy, your integrated resource plan. We have it on our agenda

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 to receive your report and hold your discussion, and you stipulate in your backup that this is

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 going to be a six to nine month process for you guys. Is this the point at which we're providing

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 or you're hearing input from us on that policy statement, or you're just giving us a point in time

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 with where you're at in your thinking? Well, I think it's a dual process, and so certainly

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 you're the first set of community members that we're presenting this to. So, certainly we would

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 welcome your feedback, we'll collect that, eventually we'll incorporate it, or make

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 recommendations to the council, and then outline to the council what that feedback was. Mr. Chair,

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 I would like to come back to this policy statement at the end of the presentation if we could.

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 I have one more question, please. Yes, sir.

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 So, when you say the goal of matching the annual load served with renewable energy,

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 meaning the renewable energy we get with recs through the purchase of recs?

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 So, certainly I think this draft is based on, we will count the recs from the PPAs that we own,

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 and to make up the difference, we will buy recs out of the market. And what will those recs offset?

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 Are they part of that environmental offset goal? Correct, and the load as well.

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 So, whatever amount of load that we serve, I've served 1.6 million megawatt hours of load,

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 I'm going to look at how much did the PPAs produce, and then the difference will be

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 renewable energy credits. So, I'm trying to get my mind around, is this load served with renewable

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 energy also put towards offsetting, say, the emissions of the deck? No. Okay. They're tied

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 directly to the amount of load that we serve. Okay, thank you for the clarification. Yes, sir.

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 In addition to this policy, we would envision that we would have an actual calculation of how we

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 would calculate on an annual basis what that goal is. That was something that was absent from the

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 plan and determined that the internal auditor has advocated for as well, and that there'd be an

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 annual reporting. After the audit, we began to provide a report to the council annually. We do

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 what's called an "interformal staff report," basically an accounting of how much load did

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 we serve, how much power came from these PPAs, and then how much did we buy in renewable energy

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 credits. And then, of course, there would be a glossary of the assortment of acronyms that are

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 out there in the ERCOT market, just the electric industry as a whole. Tony, if I may, we are only

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 posted to receive a report and hold a discussion on this item. And so, as far as like providing

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 direction, we would have to do that under a different posting. I just wanted to put that out

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 there before you're earning your money today. So part two is this concept of an integrated

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 resource plan. I will tell you that DME has not ever had an integrated resource plan. In 2017,

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 the city conducted a management study that's required of all the utilities in 18 years. That

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 was part of the recommendation. Certainly, it's taken us some time to get there. Certainly, we

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 think that the dead renewable resource plan had aspects of an integrated resource plan. But the

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 plan in general is a strategy to meet the kind of future electric demand, both on the supply side,

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 that's on the generation side, and also on the demand side. And so looking at all those

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 within the context of what it's going to take to serve DME's load over 15 to 20 years. I'll tell

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 you, the P&B is thinking that 15 to 20 years is probably not long enough. And so part of their

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 feedback is you really should be looking at at least a 30-year type of plan. What I communicate

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 to them, what I communicate to you, is that whether it's a 15, 20, or 30-year plan, every five years,

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 we need to refresh that. Technology changes, the regulatory environment changes, the market changes,

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 and so making sure that we're staying on top of things. As an example, currently at the

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 federal level, there's movement to streamline the process for nuclear, right? And so that was

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 something that was not there. So if there's types of developments that come forward, if there's

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 additional pipeline networks on hydrogen, you know, an assortment of a variety of things, every five

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 years you want to stay on top of it, but at least you have a plan where you're headed. As an example

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 for nuclear, the permitting process, you're looking at probably at least a decade, the construction

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 process, another decade. So now you're talking 20 years on any type of nuclear development. Certainly

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 the current federal administration is looking at trying to streamline some of those processes.

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 There's the advent of what's called small module nuclear reactors that I think are being very

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 attractive, and that's certainly something that they're trying to pinpoint. One major aspect of

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 this IRP development is that there be a stakeholder involvement. Some of the feedback that we got on

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 the policy is that, well we need to have stakeholder involvement as well on the policy. We're working

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 through that, certainly coming here is part of that aspect as well. But how do we get additional

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 feedback from the community on that policy, just like we're going to do right here with this

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 integrated resource plan. And to be clear, we would anticipate that we would hire an outside firm

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 to do this. We don't think this is something that we can do internally. We just don't have the

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 bandwidth, and so we're going to go out and do a solicitation and look at hiring a firm, or firms,

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 both CPS Energy in San Antonio and Austin Energy, who we're kind of modeling some of these processes

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 to as kind of what they've done. So just kind of going down to a little bit of kind of where our

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 load is, and where we think it's going, and some of the challenges that we have. So today, you know,

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 DME has one dispatchable generation facility. That's the deck, that's about 225 megawatts

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 of power that we can generate. Our peak load, which was set back in the summer of '23, was 408

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 megawatts. And so the shortage that we're seeing here is about 183 megawatts in dispatchable

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 generation. And we'll talk a little bit further along these slides, and how kind of DME works,

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 and how we manage that. But just to be clear, the reason why we've addressed it this way is that in

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 this last legislative session, there was a number of bills that would have required all load-serving

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 entities that include DME, and THU, and all these other facilities, providers out there,

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 to firm their loads, right? To guarantee and back up their load with dispatchable generation.

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 They were very clear that dispatchable generation did not include wind and solar, did not include

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 battery storage, right? Now, that particular bill, as we were drafting this presentation,

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 eventually did not pass, right? Now, we suspect that in the next two years, when the legislature

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 gets back together, there'll probably be an additional effort to do that, right? And all of

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 that is behind, or the reason behind that is to ensure that there's reliability of the grid, right?

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 Renewable resources, you know, you don't really know when they're going to show up. I mean,

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 we have very smart folks in our EMO that have a lot of probabilistic forecasting of when wind's

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 going to show up, when the sun's going to show up. But unlike the deck, where we can push a button

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 and it starts producing power on demand, it's very difficult in managing a grid where there's

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 requirements for reliability through all renewable generation. And so, again, I'm giving you the

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 context of kind of the regulatory legislative environment. So currently, like I said, we're at

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 408. We anticipate that by 2028, our load will be somewhere in the 800 range. By 2036, certainly

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 we'll be almost at 900. And we think by 2044, we will be 900, if not a little bit north of 900.

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 So twice the peak load that we have today. Those forecasts, while they aren't somewhat dated and

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 they've been somewhat impacted, we've had a very mild summer this year. But those forecasts do not

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 assume any additional large loads coming onto the DME's network or system. I'll tell you, we have no

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 less than two to three prospects now that are wanting to locate in our service territory,

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 and they're as big or bigger than the current facility that we've already entered into a deal

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 with. But again, we're refreshing what the forecast would be, and ultimately wherever we'll be within

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 the context of that 15-, 20-, or 30-year horizon is something that we'll be working with with

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 whoever the consultant is on that particular project. May I just interject something? Yes,

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 sir. I'm sure you're aware of this, but for everybody else here, the U.S. Energy Information

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 Administration just earlier this week released a report on new electric generating capacity,

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 and just from a Texas standpoint, it's pretty amazing. About 27%, 3.2 gigawatts of the solar

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 capacity added so far in 2025 is in Texas, and developers plan to bring another 9.7 gigawatts

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 of solar online in Texas in the second half of this year. In the last year, Texas surpassed

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 California as the state with the most utility solar capacity. As for battery storage, it accounted

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 for the second largest share of capacity additions in the first half of the year at 26%, about half

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 of which was in Arizona or California. Developers in Texas are expecting to bring 7 gigawatts of

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 battery storage capacity online this year, with much of that capacity coming online in the second

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 half of the year. So it's really exploding. So certainly Texas leads the nation in both wind and

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 solar production and in small capacity. One thing that's important to also just kind of keep in

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 mind is that in the 88th legislature, the legislature mandated that all renewable energy

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 facilities after January 1st of 2027 install backup generation. And so it's for that firming

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 requirement. If you say you're going to produce a megawatt hour and it doesn't produce because

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 the sun wasn't there, you've got to be able to produce it either yourself or through some kind

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 of contract. And that's already state law. That's already mandated. The 89th legislature actually

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 wanted to expand that and take away basically the grandfathering of existing facilities.

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 Something that we were looking at was our current PPAs. If in fact those PPAs would have been

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 required to install backup generation, then likelihood the price would have escalated

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 in those PPAs and certainly taking them out of the money. They're in the money today, but they'd

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 likely would take them out of the money because the generator is going to pass that cost of that

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 backup generation back to their customers. In this case, it was going to be in need.

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 But that grandfathering is still in place. It was not taken away. But again, any installation after

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 2027 of January has to have backup generation. And so that's why you're seeing some of this kind

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 of rush to install. In addition, the federal government is doing away with a lot of the tax

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 credits and subsidies that both went to solar and battery storage containers. So there there is a

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 rush to try to get those so they can preserve those tax credits because otherwise the economics

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 changes for those types of facilities. Thank you. So within this, so the recommendation that we make

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 to the council was to create this integrated resource plan. Certainly from our position within

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 20 years, is that certainly we've gotten feedback on 15 to as much as 30 years. This particular plan

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 would or the process would evaluate the various types of resources that may be out there. And so

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 for example, if nuclear is something that the city might be interested in that can be justified

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 within the forecasted load, then we need to start that process now. But remember, that's likely a

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 20 year process that many of our ratepayers today that will have to foot a lot of that bill will

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 never see that right. And so so those are some of the challenges, you know, prioritizing and looking

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 at, you know, nuclear, hydrogen, geothermal, battery storage, all different technologies that

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 are out there are certainly something that we think needs to be vetted through through this process,

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 including natural gas. And then consider short term needs to reduce the risk. And so as we continue

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 to serve our load in in the current state that we have in the short position, that certainly poses a

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 lot of risks to our ratepayers and not being able to manage that. We'll talk a little bit about

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 about what happened in August of 2023, where we did not have enough generations to meet that,

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 and when we're exposed to real time prices, and, and then incorporated the local demand side

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 management. That's certainly something that we hear a lot of from our customers. We're certainly

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 interested we're need to assess where our system can and can do to do something like installing the

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 trouble thermostats in people's homes, right, and managing our virtual power plants when it comes to

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 battery storage to somebody may have in the garage or, or their Tesla or whatever the case may be.

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 There's a lot of system improvements that we believe we may have to make it. And we need to

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 get started on that. And having that plan, I think is important. Same thing with community solar.

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 Now we'll mention to you that we we have identified currently two properties that DME already owns,

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 and we're in the process of looking at a potential community solar installation within those, but

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 you're talking about one megawatt each, right. When we're short 183 megawatts, it doesn't make

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 a big splash, but at least it gets us moving in that direction, right. And so while some of these

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 resources may not be economical, they may still make sense from just the diversification standpoint,

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 right. You know, when I look at this plan, I look at almost like a retirement plan, right. You know,

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 you don't put your entire life savings in McDonald's stock, right. You have to have a good diversified

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 mix, right, to be able to give you that kind of long-term protection. And so that's how these

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 integrated resource plans are looked at. And certainly that plan as we develop it in concert

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 with, you know, Catherine and Michael and cognizant of this climate action plan and the goals,

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 is certainly something that needs to be incorporated into the consideration for these various

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 type of resources. And then we would anticipate that that process would likely take us 18 to

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 24 months to complete, and then be able to come back and make those recommendations from that plan

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 to the city council. So with that, I have any questions on the integrated resource plan? Anybody?

376
00:38:22,400 --> 00:38:34,320
 Okay, so got a couple graphs here for you. You know, just trying to explain here how DME works.

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 This is probably not necessarily a typical day, but certainly was a day in August, August 25th of 2023.

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 And just kind of walk you through kind of what some of these bars are. So this is,

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 the solid line is our load. This is generally how our load is. It kind of picks up, you know,

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 starts to drop off during the day hours, and it picks up in the afternoon hours. Usually our peak

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 is around the four to five o'clock range, if you're familiar on the transmission side. They talk about

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 this four coincident peaks, right, and that normally happens between four or five o'clock.

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 But really the scarcity periods are in the afternoons, during the summer, roughly between

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00:39:16,720 --> 00:39:23,680
 seven o'clock and ten o'clock at night. And so as we go, and we're managing our position,

385
00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:29,360
 certainly we're looking at, okay, what can we produce? Where are prices? How are we locking

386
00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:36,080
 in things? Can we expose ourselves, and frankly our ratepayers, to real-time prices? Right now,

387
00:39:36,080 --> 00:39:41,200
 in many cases during the day, real-time prices, when there's a lot of solar, are down in the

388
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:45,760
 five dollar range in some cases, there's been some days that we've seen prices go negative,

389
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:51,840
 right? And so if I have a PPA, as an example, and I'm paying forty dollars a megawatt hour,

390
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:57,600
 that's when I'm paying the developer, when he sells that into ERCOT, I get back the five dollars,

391
00:39:57,600 --> 00:40:02,320
 or in some cases, I'm going to pay an additional ten dollars for people to take that power. So now

392
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:07,120
 that power hasn't cost me forty dollars, that power is now costing fifty dollars, right? And so those

393
00:40:07,120 --> 00:40:12,000
 are some of the things that we're managing, right, through these positions. We also use

394
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:18,000
 these positions on our renewables, these green bars, in the late afternoon hours. We're looking

395
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:22,080
 at, okay, are we certain that they're going to produce? Are we going to have a hedge there to

396
00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:28,880
 protect us from those price spikes? That's exactly what we do with the deck, right? We use the deck

397
00:40:28,880 --> 00:40:33,760
 as that hedge, right? We're buying power, so they're buying power two or three days in advance, or

398
00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:38,880
 some cases even months in advance. I'm using the deck to protect us, right, that if the power,

399
00:40:38,880 --> 00:40:44,000
 if power that day all of a sudden goes above the thirty-five dollar strike price of the deck,

400
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:48,400
 the deck also produces and gives us that protection. It's the same thing that we do

401
00:40:48,400 --> 00:40:55,600
 with renewable energies, with the renewable energy PPAs as well. Part of the difference here is that

402
00:40:55,600 --> 00:41:00,080
 we have far more control of the deck, right? Now it is a machine, and there could be mechanical

403
00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:04,720
 issues, and certainly there could be fuel issues, so we recognize that. But by and large,

404
00:41:04,720 --> 00:41:11,920
 the deck, we push a button, it starts producing power, we have a lot more certainty. My AMO guys

405
00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:17,520
 call it doing the average of the average when it comes to how they're forecasting these renewable

406
00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:24,080
 energy, the renewable energy, and how we're managing our position, right? But anytime that the deck or

407
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:31,760
 the renewables do not meet our forecasted load, actually our actual load, then we are then at that

408
00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:38,480
 point buying power that same day, right? So we are now exposed to real-time prices. And so that's

409
00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:46,720
 what happened to us in the summer of '23. We incurred, you know, 31 million dollars of cost

410
00:41:46,720 --> 00:41:55,760
 over a couple of week period, where the temperatures were so high that the demand for power

411
00:41:55,760 --> 00:42:02,960
 in our community stayed much higher than what we forecasted. And then wind didn't show up until

412
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:08,640
 prices spiked up, and I did not have enough dispatchable generation to cover that position,

413
00:42:08,640 --> 00:42:13,440
 right? And so we ended up with all of these hours, three to four hours, where we were buying

414
00:42:13,440 --> 00:42:19,280
 power, right, in the market to serve the load, right? Very similar to the challenge that we had

415
00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:24,960
 during winter storm Uri. Certainly the option could have been just don't buy the power, right? And then

416
00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:30,880
 we're doing localized outages. We certainly don't think when the temperature is down minus six,

417
00:42:30,880 --> 00:42:36,160
 or the temperature is up 110, right, that our customers are really going to look at this very

418
00:42:36,160 --> 00:42:42,320
 favorably, that we didn't go out there and buy the power to serve them. So. Yes, sir?

419
00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:46,640
 Of course I want to apologize because I have to go, I have to run to another meeting. But before I go,

420
00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:52,880
 one question. This is really fascinating. I'm hearing two reasons why you want to go out looking

421
00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:59,520
 for more dispatchable power. The one was that the legislature might require amended that. The other

422
00:42:59,520 --> 00:43:05,200
 is what you're showing us here, that we get exposed to the retail market sometimes, and we don't have

423
00:43:05,200 --> 00:43:10,720
 enough with the deck to cover that. Am I understanding this? Yes, sir. Okay. All right, thanks for your

424
00:43:10,720 --> 00:43:16,960
 presentation. Sorry, I have to go. Could you discuss the role of time arbitrage in this graph

425
00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:26,000
 scenario? The what? Of energy time arbitrage or time shifting for load. Yeah, so, you know,

426
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:32,560
 demand side management, I think, is kind of, you know, kind of what you're addressing. And certainly

427
00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:38,960
 we try to let our customers know when we anticipate these types of shortages, right, as, you know,

428
00:43:38,960 --> 00:43:47,040
 we'll issue, you know, conservation notices. Now we don't have the type of programs currently that

429
00:43:47,040 --> 00:43:53,120
 ERCOT has where we can dial up, you know, a major industrial customer and say, hey, can you shut down

430
00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:59,200
 and then we'll do some cost sharing with you on that. And so we try to do that. You know, I think

431
00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:04,400
 battery storage can also kind of provide some of that protection. It's certainly something we're

432
00:44:04,400 --> 00:44:09,280
 looking at. We have been looking at it. The economics just haven't been there. What I will

433
00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:15,600
 tell you is that in many cases we're looking at what other partner utilities, other MOUs are doing.

434
00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:24,560
 No other MOUs currently are buying and building their own wind and solar. They're not investing

435
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:29,680
 in their own battery storage. They're capturing those through purchase power agreements. It's

436
00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:44,160
 kind of what we're moving to as well. So the generation need, as I mentioned earlier,

437
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:51,360
 you know, in one of the graphs that I had, today we have a short position of about 183 megawatts.

438
00:44:51,360 --> 00:44:59,360
 We anticipate that that will continue to grow with our peak load to over 600 megawatts. You know,

439
00:44:59,360 --> 00:45:06,240
 native load, which is the non-data center load, is what we refer to that. We think that that's

440
00:45:06,240 --> 00:45:11,520
 going to probably grow about 100 megawatts. That's just normal development, multifamily,

441
00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:17,440
 you know, commercial, residential. Certainly that 100 megawatts is an estimate. There is a lot of

442
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:24,560
 growth happening in Denton that certainly the 100 megawatts by 2036 may be a very conservative

443
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:32,560
 number. I will mention to you that as a share of the ERCOT market, we comprise about half a percent,

444
00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:38,080
 and that continues to decrease. Because believe it or not, as much growth as there is in Denton,

445
00:45:38,080 --> 00:45:42,480
 there's actually even more growth in other parts of the state, right? That our share of the ERCOT

446
00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:49,440
 grid continues to actually come down a little bit. The scarcity period, I kind of mentioned the summer,

447
00:45:50,400 --> 00:45:56,080
 you know, that's usually, you know, six, seven to ten o'clock at night. In the winter, it's actually

448
00:45:56,080 --> 00:46:04,080
 a two-event situation. During the winter, we actually see scarcity periods in the morning,

449
00:46:04,080 --> 00:46:09,280
 about seven o'clock to nine o'clock in the morning. As wind starts to die out or sun doesn't show up,

450
00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:15,040
 you start seeing scarcity there in the winter, and of course then also in the afternoon as well.

451
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:24,240
 Power price is something to be aware of, is that the current scarcity cap is $5,000 a megawatt hour.

452
00:46:24,240 --> 00:46:30,640
 During winter storm year eight, that was $9,000. There's some legislation that was reduced. What I

453
00:46:30,640 --> 00:46:37,360
 will tell you is that there are folks in the market today that are advocating that that scarcity cap

454
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:43,760
 be moved back to $9,000 in order to be able to spur the economic incentive to build additional

455
00:46:43,760 --> 00:46:49,040
 generation, and there are folks out there that believe that that cap should be completely removed,

456
00:46:49,040 --> 00:46:55,280
 right? And so if you think about the cost that we incurred during winter storm year eight,

457
00:46:55,280 --> 00:47:02,320
 you know, $200 million at $9,000 a megawatt hour, right? If there was no cap of that,

458
00:47:02,320 --> 00:47:06,960
 you know, it would be a pretty devastating situation. But not just, frankly, not just

459
00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:14,640
 the immediate with the entire market. And so I mentioned already the cost that we had for

460
00:47:14,640 --> 00:47:22,400
 year eight, summer '23. And so our primary needs as we see them today is that we certainly believe

461
00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:28,720
 that dispatchable generation is kind of the immediate, you know, thing that would help address

462
00:47:28,720 --> 00:47:34,880
 some of the challenges that we're seeing from a price risk standpoint. And we're not alone in that.

463
00:47:35,920 --> 00:47:41,680
 Brownsville, Greenville, even Austin Energy, certainly CPS Energy, all our counterpart

464
00:47:41,680 --> 00:47:47,760
 MOUs have already kicked off the process to build additional generation. And that generation

465
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:54,240
 is quick start generation, very similar to the facility that we own today. Maybe not necessarily

466
00:47:54,240 --> 00:47:59,920
 a combustion engine, but certainly they're looking at turbines. What I will tell you is that in the

467
00:47:59,920 --> 00:48:07,440
 market today, delivery of both combustion engines and turbines, if you put the if you put the order

468
00:48:07,440 --> 00:48:13,680
 today, right, you're probably not going to see those to 2030, 2031 at best, right? And so we're

469
00:48:13,680 --> 00:48:19,600
 already kind of behind the curve. If ultimately that's where we need to go. Certainly, if you're

470
00:48:19,600 --> 00:48:25,280
 going to add an additional two years of having to go through the process of creating an IRP. And if

471
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:30,320
 in fact, that's what we decide to do, now you have to add an additional two years, if not longer,

472
00:48:30,320 --> 00:48:34,800
 right? And so, you know, we'll talk a little bit about how we might be able to kind of jump to the

473
00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:40,560
 front of the line. If that's something that ultimately we get the direction to do. We sort

474
00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:48,320
 of believe that currently the most viable alternative is a natural gas facility. We think that there's

475
00:48:48,320 --> 00:48:56,000
 ample fuel out there in supply to meet that. Surely, as we look at where we might acquire a

476
00:48:56,000 --> 00:49:01,680
 facility or replace a new facility, Denton is certainly not something that we would look at

477
00:49:01,680 --> 00:49:07,360
 for a number of reasons. One, currently, and I'll mention to you why, but currently Denton is in a

478
00:49:07,360 --> 00:49:12,400
 non-attainment area. So a facility would be limited in run hours, very similar to the facility that

479
00:49:12,400 --> 00:49:17,280
 we have today. It's limited through an EPA permit on how many hours it could run, although that

480
00:49:17,280 --> 00:49:24,800
 facility's never exceeded those requirements. And then also, we really don't need another competing

481
00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:30,320
 resource right next to our facility. You know, one of the challenges that Wind and Solar has

482
00:49:30,320 --> 00:49:35,920
 primarily in west Texas is the station of congestion, right? There's just too much power

483
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:40,240
 going through very limited transmission lines, and so you see a lot of curtailment. And so we

484
00:49:40,240 --> 00:49:45,120
 think that certainly the economics of placing something in Denton is certainly problematic.

485
00:49:45,760 --> 00:49:49,360
 In addition to the fact that I think we've hurt our community, right? I think the community doesn't

486
00:49:49,360 --> 00:49:56,880
 want another facility in Denton, right? And so I think that would be a mistake to do that. Acquiring

487
00:49:56,880 --> 00:50:02,240
 an existing facility is certainly something that, at the time that I presented this to the council,

488
00:50:02,240 --> 00:50:10,000
 might have been viable. It may still be viable. A couple of things that have happened at the federal

489
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:14,720
 level, and that's why I mentioned the non-attainment area, is that there's changes happening at the

490
00:50:14,720 --> 00:50:21,280
 federal level, both at the Department of Energy and also at the EPA, right? And rewriting, right? And

491
00:50:21,280 --> 00:50:27,840
 recopulating many of the greenhouse gas provisions that have been in place. And so there could be the

492
00:50:27,840 --> 00:50:34,720
 potential that that non-attainment area designation in the DFW area may just completely go away. And

493
00:50:34,720 --> 00:50:41,200
 at that point, there wouldn't be any limitations on running hours of our facility or any of the

494
00:50:41,200 --> 00:50:48,400
 facility within this area. In addition to that, a number of programs have been eliminated.

495
00:50:48,400 --> 00:51:00,320
 The last one that I read was $3.7 billion, $3.7 billion federal incentives for carbon capture

496
00:51:00,320 --> 00:51:06,160
 and decarbonization through grants have been eliminated, right? There's also been a lot of

497
00:51:06,800 --> 00:51:12,640
 previously held Clean Air Act provisions that are now being eliminated that would have,

498
00:51:12,640 --> 00:51:18,480
 if they had stayed in place, right? Shuttered some coal plants and older gas generation facilities.

499
00:51:18,480 --> 00:51:24,480
 That may go away. And so then those facilities, the economics of those facilities have now changed.

500
00:51:24,480 --> 00:51:30,240
 So the possibility of doing something like CPS Energy did, where they acquired two coal plants,

501
00:51:30,240 --> 00:51:35,440
 right? With the idea that they were going to convert them to natural gas, is likely at this

502
00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:41,360
 point might be somewhat of a challenge. We have not recommended to the council to go out there

503
00:51:41,360 --> 00:51:47,280
 and buy a coal plant to convert it, but certainly that's something that may be possible. It certainly

504
00:51:47,280 --> 00:51:51,600
 has been done, not just here in the state of Texas, but across the country as well.

505
00:51:51,600 --> 00:52:01,280
 Yes, sir. Did you have a question? Go ahead. On your generation, earlier in the presentation,

506
00:52:01,280 --> 00:52:07,120
 you were discussing a current RFP for 300 megawatts of solar wind and battery. How does

507
00:52:07,120 --> 00:52:13,680
 that relate to this slide here? Yeah, so our current mandate is still that we have 100% renewable,

508
00:52:13,680 --> 00:52:21,440
 right? And so we continue to be good stewards of the mandate that we have. And so certainly

509
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:25,120
 we're going to be bringing that forward to council. Ultimately, it's going to be council's decision

510
00:52:25,120 --> 00:52:30,720
 whether or not to move forward with that. That's no different than how we're managing our power

511
00:52:30,720 --> 00:52:38,720
 plant today, right? That's owned by the citizens. And so we operate and we manage that facility

512
00:52:38,720 --> 00:52:44,320
 just like we do anything else at the city level. We have a fiduciary and steward responsibility.

513
00:52:44,320 --> 00:52:48,560
 And so that's what we do. That's what we're doing here is we're still taking those forward

514
00:52:48,560 --> 00:52:52,720
 for consideration to the council. Now, within the context of all these discussions,

515
00:52:52,720 --> 00:52:58,480
 we'll certainly see where the council lands on moving forward with those agreements or not.

516
00:53:01,200 --> 00:53:14,000
 Yeah, the fact that so many federal regulations are being axed concerns me, and I know it concerns

517
00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:26,080
 you, especially you, because all those, well, we still have to think about being carbon neutral by

518
00:53:26,080 --> 00:53:36,960
 2050, correct? That's still the goal. Yeah. And despite what happens in Washington, I would hope

519
00:53:36,960 --> 00:53:50,160
 that you will still find ways to keep rates low, et cetera, et cetera, without further endangering

520
00:53:51,120 --> 00:54:01,760
 the future of climate change. Because it's, it's, from my standpoint, when I, when I get a place,

521
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:09,520
 a paper like this, a very succinct and great presentation, but in no, no place is climate

522
00:54:09,520 --> 00:54:16,800
 change mentioned. And I think the more that we bring that into the equation,

523
00:54:18,800 --> 00:54:24,240
 the better it's going to be for everybody, business-wise and everything. Because the more

524
00:54:24,240 --> 00:54:30,240
 we can get ahead of the curve now, the better shape will be in when everybody else has decided

525
00:54:30,240 --> 00:54:39,520
 to jump on the wagon down the road. So I just, I just hope that we keep our goal of 2050 in mind

526
00:54:39,520 --> 00:54:48,640
 and that the specter of climate change is always there. Because, as you know, as we all know,

527
00:54:48,640 --> 00:54:57,040
 it is happening and things aren't getting any better. So that's all. Yes, sir. What I'll say

528
00:54:57,040 --> 00:55:01,760
 is that certainly as a public utility, you know, we want to listen to our customers and certainly

529
00:55:01,760 --> 00:55:06,880
 many of them have my cell phone number and call me directly. And we're certainly happy to take those

530
00:55:06,880 --> 00:55:13,280
 calls. What I will tell you, and certainly don't have any documented data to show you, I can just

531
00:55:13,280 --> 00:55:18,640
 tell you anecdotally, I've gotten more phone calls from more customers about the price increases that

532
00:55:18,640 --> 00:55:25,840
 we have than about how we're dealing with our renewable goal, right? And so certainly addressing

533
00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:32,080
 that and making sure that we're doing the best we can. You know, Jose and Tony and their folks

534
00:55:32,080 --> 00:55:37,280
 are in the market every day and they're working hard to try to make sure that we're doing the best

535
00:55:37,280 --> 00:55:42,560
 for our customer from a rate standpoint. But at some point, if they don't have the resources

536
00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:48,480
 that they need to be able to continue doing that, it becomes a very challenging position, right? And

537
00:55:48,480 --> 00:55:53,040
 so the last thing that we want to do is to have to come back to the council and ask them for another

538
00:55:53,040 --> 00:55:59,760
 $31 million to finance over five years. Yes, sir. Not to jump ahead too far, but on the mention of

539
00:55:59,760 --> 00:56:05,680
 keeping prices in focus, I see that even in slide 13, you have discussion about a price increase from

540
00:56:05,680 --> 00:56:12,000
 14.2 to 14.3 in the anticipation of bringing on additional generation capacity. I'm just curious

541
00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:17,760
 how we're framing this discussion around what seems to be a pretty prescriptive need for a,

542
00:56:17,760 --> 00:56:23,760
 what I'm reading as a peaker gas plant, but I'm also hearing discussion of taking on base load.

543
00:56:23,760 --> 00:56:29,360
 It's confusing to me why we're taking that as the assumption without direction. And I understand

544
00:56:29,360 --> 00:56:35,840
 this is just a discussion on our agenda, but a future discussion point for council. I guess I've

545
00:56:35,840 --> 00:56:40,640
 just not seen some of those economics you're discussing about why these alternatives aren't

546
00:56:40,640 --> 00:56:46,960
 being explored to the degree we seem so certain about acquisitions of existing facilities. I guess

547
00:56:46,960 --> 00:56:52,880
 that's just a concern of mine that I look forward to hearing more from you about. Yeah, I think

548
00:56:52,880 --> 00:56:58,160
 principally because of what we're seeing in the market, you know, and what's actually being

549
00:56:58,160 --> 00:57:04,160
 constructed in the market and what the plans are by, you know, other utilities, very similar to us,

550
00:57:04,160 --> 00:57:11,040
 right? And so that's certainly grounded in that. Ultimately, that's a decision for the community

551
00:57:11,040 --> 00:57:16,480
 and a decision for the council on what direction we're going to head, right? As an example,

552
00:57:16,480 --> 00:57:23,760
 Austin Energy is building a five megawatt hydro, geothermal facility out in Nacogdoches, right?

553
00:57:23,760 --> 00:57:30,000
 And that's great, right? And certainly we think geothermal might have a place for DME as well.

554
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:34,240
 I think it was important to understand that five megawatts for Austin Energy, when they have a peak

555
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:41,920
 load of 2,700 megawatts, it's really just a drop, right, in the bucket. And not only that, but, you

556
00:57:41,920 --> 00:57:47,440
 know, conversations I've had with folks in Austin Energy is that folks in Nacogdoches are concerned

557
00:57:47,440 --> 00:57:51,200
 that that facility is going to cause earthquakes in Nacogdoches. And so they've not been very

558
00:57:51,200 --> 00:57:56,480
 supportive of that facility, right? And so again, I think each resource has its challenges, but I

559
00:57:56,480 --> 00:58:02,560
 think that if we're looking at a diversified portfolio, looking at all of those resources and

560
00:58:02,560 --> 00:58:07,600
 how they ultimately interplay and how we're managing our energy needs for our community is

561
00:58:07,600 --> 00:58:13,600
 something that we'll continue to have conversations about. But also kind of based on the availability

562
00:58:13,600 --> 00:58:20,320
 and what others are doing, I think Quick Start Generation today is likely the best alternative,

563
00:58:20,320 --> 00:58:24,960
 the most immediate alternative. And we'll talk a little bit about the Texas Energy Fund as well

564
00:58:24,960 --> 00:58:31,040
 that contains many of those. But a base load unit, you know, kind of the best practice is once you get

565
00:58:31,040 --> 00:58:38,240
 at about 1,200 megawatts, you know, that's when a base load unit really makes sense, right? Again,

566
00:58:38,240 --> 00:58:43,920
 2024 will be at 900 megawatts. I don't think a base load unit makes sense, but things can change

567
00:58:43,920 --> 00:58:48,400
 between now and then, right? And so now if you're talking about nuclear, whether it's a traditional

568
00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:55,440
 nuclear facility or an SMR, those are base load units, right? And so again, a lot of different

569
00:58:55,440 --> 00:59:01,280
 numbers here that we're still going to have to go through. And we'll see ultimately where the

570
00:59:01,280 --> 00:59:07,120
 community stands on this integrated resource plan. Does DME have any concern about the availability

571
00:59:07,120 --> 00:59:13,440
 of natural gas for power generation? Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think, you know, Winter Storm

572
00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:20,160
 URI is kind of one big example. I read an article the other day that some of the winterization that

573
00:59:20,160 --> 00:59:25,760
 that the oil and gas industry was supposed to do, you know, they may not have completely done,

574
00:59:25,760 --> 00:59:30,080
 right? And so certainly it's something that's on our mind constantly as we're managing that

575
00:59:30,080 --> 00:59:36,960
 facility. What I can tell you is that since URI, we've not seen any drop in that fuel to that

576
00:59:36,960 --> 00:59:42,560
 facility. Now we're still exposed that we have one gas pipeline. We only have one source. We don't

577
00:59:42,560 --> 00:59:48,800
 have gas storage on site. And so there's still some level of risk. But what I'll tell you is

578
00:59:48,800 --> 00:59:56,480
 that natural gas currently is the leading fuel mix out in the market. And those that are looking to

579
00:59:56,480 --> 01:00:08,560
 build additional generation, which only dispatchable, is natural gas. So this is just some of the power

580
01:00:08,560 --> 01:00:14,640
 trends, kind of what we see. Again, this is just a data that I picked, just to give you some context

581
01:00:14,640 --> 01:00:20,640
 of where we are. So in the morning hours, you know, certainly at seven o'clock, you have very little

582
01:00:20,640 --> 01:00:25,440
 wind that's kind of depicted here in this graph. There's very little solar. There's no solar that

583
01:00:25,440 --> 01:00:30,160
 starts to pick up around seven o'clock, right? You know, wind at that time is pretty good, and it

584
01:00:30,160 --> 01:00:35,520
 starts to die down. Solar starts to pick up during the day, right? And then it dies out in the

585
01:00:35,520 --> 01:00:42,080
 afternoon. You know, and in the afternoon, wind picks up, right? And it's in these periods here,

586
01:00:42,080 --> 01:00:48,320
 in the morning and in the afternoon, when the sun's coming down and the wind starts to pick up,

587
01:00:48,320 --> 01:00:52,720
 that if one or the other fails, then all of a sudden you start to see scarcity prices. Same thing

588
01:00:52,720 --> 01:00:58,240
 during the day, right? If there is issues that happen on the transmission side, or certainly

589
01:00:58,240 --> 01:01:03,440
 if solar doesn't begin, isn't producing, or there's an issue that happens, then you can have some

590
01:01:03,440 --> 01:01:10,320
 scarcity during the day. And in this particular slide, you have, you know, some hydro, just to

591
01:01:10,320 --> 01:01:15,120
 give you some context of how much hydro is out there. You know, also power storage. These are

592
01:01:15,120 --> 01:01:20,320
 batteries, right? Now that continues to grow, and we anticipate that there will continue to be

593
01:01:20,320 --> 01:01:26,400
 additional resources, a battery storage, excuse me. But the natural gas continues to certainly

594
01:01:26,400 --> 01:01:31,920
 still make up kind of the lion's share of the power that's there. And then you have, you know,

595
01:01:31,920 --> 01:01:37,520
 some coal. I'll show you another graph with coal that has actually started to come down. Again,

596
01:01:37,520 --> 01:01:44,000
 we'll see what happens with some of the plants that had been scheduled to be shuttered kind of

597
01:01:44,000 --> 01:01:49,360
 in this new environment. And then you have your two nuclear facilities here in the state of Texas.

598
01:01:49,360 --> 01:01:55,280
 And so generally this is kind of a day in the life of kind of what we see. And, I mean, these

599
01:01:55,280 --> 01:02:01,360
 charts and this information you can find on the ERCOT website that's there, and it's updated

600
01:02:01,360 --> 01:02:08,160
 every five minutes. And then for the prices standpoint, you know, these are also directly

601
01:02:08,160 --> 01:02:15,440
 from the ERCOT grid, right, after the ERCOT website. This dotted line that you can see here,

602
01:02:15,440 --> 01:02:22,720
 this is kind of the forecast of where prices ERCOT believes will be in the next day, right? Same

603
01:02:22,720 --> 01:02:27,920
 thing in this slide here. It's a dotted line. And then the solid line is actually what happened,

604
01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:33,600
 right? And so many cases, you know, ERCOT's actually pretty good, right? And so the actual

605
01:02:33,600 --> 01:02:38,640
 real-time prices match up pretty well to their forecast. But if there's some type of interruption,

606
01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:43,280
 if there's some type of issue, if there's more demand, all of a sudden you start seeing those

607
01:02:43,280 --> 01:02:48,320
 prices go up. In this particular case, prices, we're going to forecast it to be a little bit

608
01:02:48,320 --> 01:02:55,120
 over $100. Before a very short period of time, they actually spiked up to over $150. It's during

609
01:02:55,120 --> 01:02:59,280
 those spikes, right, that many of these resources that are out there that are sitting on the

610
01:02:59,280 --> 01:03:04,560
 sidelines that aren't producing like the deck, right, once they get those price signals, right,

611
01:03:04,560 --> 01:03:10,400
 that's when they start producing. For the deck, it's about $35. So at $35, when prices go above

612
01:03:10,400 --> 01:03:17,200
 $35, the deck's producing power at whatever time of day or night that may happen. And so this is

613
01:03:17,200 --> 01:03:23,280
 kind of the normal type of picture that we see during the summer. This particular day, you know,

614
01:03:23,280 --> 01:03:27,760
 we don't know what happened other than there was some type of interruption. There was either a

615
01:03:27,760 --> 01:03:34,800
 downage or at some facility or there was some type of transmission issue that during that early morning

616
01:03:34,800 --> 01:03:43,760
 hours, all of a sudden prices peaked, right, or increased from where they were projected to be.

617
01:03:43,760 --> 01:03:50,480
 And these are the types of data and types of things that our energy management organization

618
01:03:50,480 --> 01:03:56,800
 is constantly looking at and monitoring to make sure that we're staying on top of

619
01:03:56,800 --> 01:04:06,240
 what the ultimate cost to our rents is. So this is Mr. Richter, the slide that you were referring to.

620
01:04:06,240 --> 01:04:14,880
 So currently, our summer price, so D&E has a winter and summer rate structure for residential.

621
01:04:14,880 --> 01:04:22,000
 So this is the summer schedule. So at 1,000 kilowatt hours, which is what in the market

622
01:04:22,000 --> 01:04:28,800
 is an average residential customer, you know, they're paying about $122 per month. That's about,

623
01:04:28,800 --> 01:04:34,880
 you know, that's 14.2 cents per kilowatt hour. We certainly think that that rate's still very

624
01:04:34,880 --> 01:04:41,760
 competitive. Certainly, you know, when we compare ourselves to the deregulating market, we're still

625
01:04:41,760 --> 01:04:48,240
 below what is being offered at 12 in the 24-month contract. Certainly, we believe that without the

626
01:04:48,240 --> 01:04:55,680
 deck, if the deck wasn't there, that cost to our ratepayers would increase by $96. Again,

627
01:04:55,680 --> 01:05:00,160
 these are estimates, right? They are a little bit dated from when I put this presentation together.

628
01:05:00,160 --> 01:05:06,480
 With additional generation, if we were to build additional generation or acquire additional

629
01:05:06,480 --> 01:05:11,200
 generation today, we certainly think that that would help us continue to moderate and keep those

630
01:05:11,200 --> 01:05:19,360
 rates pretty stable over the next several years. Without additional generation, and certainly we're

631
01:05:19,360 --> 01:05:25,280
 seeing that now, is we continue to see the price of power increasing as we're buying power. Whether

632
01:05:25,280 --> 01:05:30,800
 we're buying power to the foreign market or we're buying it the next day or real time, we continue

633
01:05:30,800 --> 01:05:38,160
 to see the cost of power continue to increase, right? And now for next year, you may have seen

634
01:05:38,160 --> 01:05:44,560
 in our budget presentation, we are recommending no base rate increase to our customers for the

635
01:05:44,560 --> 01:05:50,160
 next fiscal year. We are already ready to come to the PUB and the Council, and our recommendation

636
01:05:50,160 --> 01:05:55,200
 on the ECA, which is how we pass through our cost to our customers, is to maintain it at where we

637
01:05:55,200 --> 01:06:02,000
 are. So we're not projecting an increase to the ECA either. So this power to choose, these are the,

638
01:06:02,640 --> 01:06:08,160
 at the time when I looked at this, on a 12-month contract, if you were in an unregulated area,

639
01:06:08,160 --> 01:06:14,080
 you could pick your own provider. You'd be looking at a little bit over 15 cents a kilowatt hour

640
01:06:14,080 --> 01:06:20,160
 compared to our 14 cents. A 24-month contract would be a little bit more expensive at 15.8.

641
01:06:20,160 --> 01:06:26,880
 And something that many of our customers just don't know, right, is when you're in a deregulated

642
01:06:26,880 --> 01:06:34,960
 market, if your provider goes out of business, or if you are outside of your contract, you go

643
01:06:34,960 --> 01:06:39,760
 to their highest tiered rate, right? In this particular case, it's called the polymer rate,

644
01:06:39,760 --> 01:06:45,280
 the provider of last resort. That rate at the time when I looked at it was almost 20 cents, right?

645
01:06:45,280 --> 01:06:48,800
 And so if you're a customer and you're not constantly managing your contract and you're

646
01:06:48,800 --> 01:06:54,800
 on a contract, you're going to go to their most expensive rate, right? So for many customers in

647
01:06:54,800 --> 01:07:02,720
 those situations, they may go a couple of months not realizing until they get that bill, right? Oh,

648
01:07:02,720 --> 01:07:06,560
 I should have renewed that contract, right? So with DME, there is no contract, right? With DME,

649
01:07:06,560 --> 01:07:11,520
 everybody gets the same rate across all the rate classes. And then for our commercial customers,

650
01:07:11,520 --> 01:07:19,600
 this is what they would actually pay with, without the additional generation and with

651
01:07:20,560 --> 01:07:27,040
 additional generation. So certainly, we have two types, three types of customers, currently small,

652
01:07:27,040 --> 01:07:30,640
 and they use about a thousand, a little bit over a thousand kilowatt hours on average,

653
01:07:30,640 --> 01:07:36,800
 general service medium. You know, once you get to the medium and large, you're not only playing

654
01:07:36,800 --> 01:07:41,840
 a usage rate, you're also playing a demand rate, right? So, but for them, again, you see here kind

655
01:07:41,840 --> 01:07:48,080
 of what the cost would be for a large average customer without generation, you're looking at

656
01:07:48,080 --> 01:07:54,720
 over $46,000 additional cost. So we have four total rate tiers, if we're including residential

657
01:07:54,720 --> 01:08:00,400
 and the three commercial? Yes. Do you see a role at all for, I guess, broadening the amount of

658
01:08:00,400 --> 01:08:05,600
 buckets that we have in rate tiers? I'm thinking of water, for example, having over six tiers for

659
01:08:05,600 --> 01:08:13,360
 different uses, right? Do you see a function there for kind of helping even out what people are paying?

660
01:08:13,360 --> 01:08:18,560
 So we're working on what's called a cost of service study now, and we're planning to bring that forward

661
01:08:18,560 --> 01:08:24,480
 to the PV and the council towards the end of this year to talk about where our rate structure is,

662
01:08:24,480 --> 01:08:30,080
 our design, and then we've hired a consultant to do that, and we'll be making some recommendations

663
01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:37,200
 based on what's out there in the market and what may be right for this community. And then certainly,

664
01:08:37,200 --> 01:08:41,120
 if council wants us to look at a different type of rate structure, they also want to be their

665
01:08:41,120 --> 01:08:46,320
 prerogative, and we'll be looking for that direction to do that. So the PV's rate structure has been in

666
01:08:46,320 --> 01:08:54,400
 place for many, many years, and it's probably more along the traditional lines of what a utility

667
01:08:54,400 --> 01:08:59,360
 rate structure is, but you find differences throughout the country and certainly across the state of Texas as well.

668
01:08:59,360 --> 01:09:06,160
 Like a data center is paying the same rate as any other commercial customer?

669
01:09:07,440 --> 01:09:14,960
 No. So we have two data centers. Both data centers are covered under a power purchase agreement,

670
01:09:14,960 --> 01:09:25,840
 and so their rates on what we call the base rate side are confidential, so they don't pay a tariff

671
01:09:25,840 --> 01:09:31,520
 rate. Part of this process of doing a rate study is ultimately we're going to recommend

672
01:09:31,520 --> 01:09:37,920
 a actual tariff rate that will be a separate, so instead of having three general service commercial

673
01:09:37,920 --> 01:09:44,640
 rates, we'll have a fourth one that'll be for all data centers. Now the data centers will also pay

674
01:09:44,640 --> 01:09:52,240
 an ECA, and we've now created what's called large load ECA. So we have a native ECA, so all our other

675
01:09:52,240 --> 01:10:00,320
 customers pay a 462 is what they're paying per kilowatt hour on ECA. The data center currently

676
01:10:00,320 --> 01:10:06,480
 is paying a little bit over five cents, and so we're managing those separately, but those are

677
01:10:06,480 --> 01:10:15,040
 published rates. And then there's also this other rate called the transmission cost recovery factor

678
01:10:15,040 --> 01:10:19,920
 that does apply to the data centers as well, and all our customers. And that's how we pass

679
01:10:19,920 --> 01:10:23,120
 through cost for transmission across our system. Thank you.

680
01:10:27,360 --> 01:10:33,200
 So the conversations we have with the council and in the possibility of acquiring an existing

681
01:10:33,200 --> 01:10:38,960
 facility, again I already mentioned to you based on some of the federal initiatives, some of the

682
01:10:38,960 --> 01:10:46,240
 economics on that may have changed. I will tell you that I've had probably no less than five or

683
01:10:46,240 --> 01:10:52,320
 seven phone calls from folks that are willing to enter into conversations about us acquiring their

684
01:10:52,320 --> 01:10:57,760
 facility. I think we've lost a little bit of our initiative, right, and because now I'm getting

685
01:10:57,760 --> 01:11:03,600
 solicited instead of me calling out there and looking for a deal. But certainly keeping,

686
01:11:03,600 --> 01:11:08,480
 looking at facility within ERCOT, right, there's actually areas in the state of Texas that are not

687
01:11:08,480 --> 01:11:12,800
 in the ERCOT region, so we would not be looking at that. Certainly we wouldn't be looking for

688
01:11:12,800 --> 01:11:19,680
 something out of the state. So certainly in the ERCOT grid within the North Load Zone, so

689
01:11:19,680 --> 01:11:23,680
 so ERCOT is broken out of the various load zones. We think that certainly keeping it within our

690
01:11:23,680 --> 01:11:29,200
 load zone would be preferable, but certainly not, we wouldn't necessarily limit ourselves to

691
01:11:29,200 --> 01:11:34,960
 a deal if there is a deal to be made outside of that zone. And then I already mentioned

692
01:11:34,960 --> 01:11:40,240
 that we would not be looking at something within the City of Dent. Nuclear, I mentioned from a

693
01:11:40,240 --> 01:11:47,280
 generation type, very unlikely, right, that those two facilities would be sold. I think they'll be

694
01:11:47,280 --> 01:11:53,600
 certainly cost prohibitive. Coal and lignite, well I think, you know, I mentioned CPS Energy did that.

695
01:11:53,600 --> 01:11:58,960
 You know, there might be some attraction to saying we're going to buy a coal plant and then we're

696
01:11:58,960 --> 01:12:05,040
 going to convert it to natural gas, right, and so now you take a very dirty type of facility and

697
01:12:05,040 --> 01:12:08,880
 you're going to convert it to something that's not, and you kind of take that credit, right, but

698
01:12:08,880 --> 01:12:15,360
 certainly we understand, I mean, D&E through TNPA shut down Givens Creek, right, so I think

699
01:12:15,360 --> 01:12:20,800
 going and purchasing another coal plant is, you know, probably unlikely. Again, maybe now

700
01:12:20,800 --> 01:12:26,160
 uneconomical based on some of the provisions in the federal level. And in natural gas there are

701
01:12:26,160 --> 01:12:32,320
 existing about 100 generators out there today that are already in existence. I'll talk a little bit

702
01:12:32,320 --> 01:12:39,040
 about the Texas Energy Fund and some potential projects there as well that might be acquired,

703
01:12:39,040 --> 01:12:44,160
 right. And then from a design standpoint, surely some of these facilities might be baseloads,

704
01:12:44,160 --> 01:12:48,880
 some may be quick start generation. You can still take a baseload unit and convert it to,

705
01:12:48,880 --> 01:12:53,440
 you know, to a quick start generation if that, if the investment to keep it at a baseload level

706
01:12:53,440 --> 01:12:59,920
 might be too expensive, be cost prohibitive. There is another facility in Denton that I office right

707
01:12:59,920 --> 01:13:06,320
 next to on Spencer that's owned by Garland. That is a baseload unit, but again that's certainly well,

708
01:13:06,320 --> 01:13:12,240
 D&E, the city used to own that, right. We likely wouldn't be looking to acquire that type of

709
01:13:12,240 --> 01:13:17,680
 facility. I think from a capacity standpoint, in light of the fact that we believe we need 600

710
01:13:17,680 --> 01:13:22,560
 megawatts, I think anything less than 100 megawatts is probably not something we're going to look at.

711
01:13:22,560 --> 01:13:26,480
 So I think kind of setting that threshold. But then at that point you're looking at multiple

712
01:13:26,480 --> 01:13:33,600
 type of facilities to get you that 600. And then, or if it's a single hundred that you can expand,

713
01:13:33,600 --> 01:13:39,360
 that might be something that might be attractive as well. And so this is just kind of what the

714
01:13:39,360 --> 01:13:47,040
 generation mix has been, you know, over the last, you know, 24, 25 years. And you can see here on

715
01:13:47,040 --> 01:13:52,240
 the straight line, you know, this is coal, right. So coal has steadily decreased over the years.

716
01:13:52,240 --> 01:13:58,640
 We'll see what the next few years kind of has in store for that. Then you have your nuclear

717
01:13:58,640 --> 01:14:05,280
 nuclear bomb. There's been two for a very long time. You have now natural gas that kind of has

718
01:14:05,280 --> 01:14:11,680
 wavered. If you start looking here in these outer years, or the more current years, the spikes here

719
01:14:11,680 --> 01:14:18,400
 are starting to come down as renewables start to come into the market, right. And so as we're

720
01:14:18,400 --> 01:14:23,280
 looking for opportunities to acquire what makes sense, certainly natural gas continues to be

721
01:14:23,280 --> 01:14:28,160
 the lion's share of what's out there, certainly as coal continues to come down.

722
01:14:30,880 --> 01:14:36,320
 And it's just a recap of what's out there again. In megawatts, two nuclear facilities over 400

723
01:14:36,320 --> 01:14:43,760
 megawatts, leg-mounted coal still over 16,000 megawatts, natural gas over 65,000 megawatts

724
01:14:43,760 --> 01:14:51,600
 that comprise that hundred generators of which the deck is one. I have a question. Yes, sir. Just a

725
01:14:51,600 --> 01:14:58,560
 matter of diminishing, is battery storage considered dispatchable? No, it's not. Why is that?

726
01:15:00,880 --> 01:15:06,960
 Because the regulators decided that it's not dispatchable. Even though you can get it like that.

727
01:15:06,960 --> 01:15:19,360
 Huh. Thanks. So in November of '23, there was a statewide election. There was a proposition

728
01:15:19,360 --> 01:15:26,880
 to adopt what's called the Texan Energy Fund. That was approved. I would say overwhelmingly across

729
01:15:26,880 --> 01:15:33,200
 the state, in the city of Denton, it was approved by over 60 percent of voters that voted in the

730
01:15:33,200 --> 01:15:40,560
 election. So about 15,000 voters that that particular proposition, over 60 percent of them

731
01:15:40,560 --> 01:15:49,600
 voted in favor. What that proposition did is added $10 billion over two biennium. Of that $10 billion,

732
01:15:49,600 --> 01:15:56,480
 $7 billion was to build additional dispatchable generation up to 10,000 megawatts of additional

733
01:15:56,480 --> 01:16:03,840
 dispatchable generation. And so the application process opened. There have been a number of

734
01:16:03,840 --> 01:16:10,640
 facilities that are proposals that have been made. This is kind of where things stand today

735
01:16:10,640 --> 01:16:17,360
 of what's being considered. There's been a number of facilities that were proposed that have now

736
01:16:17,360 --> 01:16:24,880
 dropped out. Two provisions or two requirements in applying for this particular funding was that you

737
01:16:24,880 --> 01:16:30,960
 had to have land and or control of land and that you have to have a facility that was designed.

738
01:16:30,960 --> 01:16:36,240
 And so DME did not have land. We didn't have a design and we didn't have a direction to apply

739
01:16:36,240 --> 01:16:41,840
 for this funding. So DME did not provide for this funding. But in looking at what may be out there

740
01:16:41,840 --> 01:16:48,080
 from an opportunity standpoint to acquire, these are some facilities that we might look at to acquire.

741
01:16:48,080 --> 01:16:53,920
 Right? There's already land that they've acquired or have rights to and there's already a design.

742
01:16:53,920 --> 01:17:00,560
 Right? So, and likelihood, they've already placed orders for their types of engines or turbines

743
01:17:00,560 --> 01:17:07,360
 or combined cycle, whatever that may be. And so these will also be some potential facilities

744
01:17:07,360 --> 01:17:13,200
 that we could look at to try to acquire. In this particular case, in order to do that,

745
01:17:13,200 --> 01:17:18,400
 it would likely come with some of that Texas Energy Fund funding as well. So, but again,

746
01:17:19,200 --> 01:17:24,000
 just trying to give the council and certainly, you know, here at the committee kind of what the breadth of all

747
01:17:24,000 --> 01:17:27,600
 the possibilities might be. Again, there's not anything out there that we have in the works

748
01:17:27,600 --> 01:17:33,760
 or that we've talked to. Just kind of what is the realm of possibilities that exist today.

749
01:17:33,760 --> 01:17:41,120
 So with that, that concludes my presentation. Certainly, if you have any additional questions,

750
01:17:41,120 --> 01:17:52,000
 happy to try to address them. Anyone? Well, I have a question. In the future, you're interested in

751
01:17:52,000 --> 01:18:01,040
 storage batteries, as you said, at one point. So my comment is, thank you very much for a very

752
01:18:01,040 --> 01:18:09,760
 well-documented and thorough presentation. And I really appreciate that you look at a diversified

753
01:18:11,120 --> 01:18:18,400
 acquisition portfolio. Thank you, sir. Yeah, thanks very much. And I know we all look forward

754
01:18:18,400 --> 01:18:26,640
 to getting the presentation on the renewable resource or the integrated resource plan.

755
01:18:26,640 --> 01:18:31,440
 Yes, sir. When it's ready. This was good luck with that. Thank you. Thank you very much. Appreciate it.

756
01:18:31,440 --> 01:18:36,560
 Thank you for me, too. You guys have a difficult job and we appreciate everything you do for the

757
01:18:36,560 --> 01:18:52,080
 community. It's actually a lot of fun. So thank you. All right. Are we still in session? We are.

758
01:18:52,080 --> 01:19:05,760
 Our next report is CIVA report. Hold discussion and give staff direction on the new public

759
01:19:05,760 --> 01:19:22,000
 facing city of Denton air quality dashboard. Good afternoon, community. Caitlin Davis,

760
01:19:22,000 --> 01:19:27,360
 I'm one of the conservation program coordinators in the environmental services and sustainability

761
01:19:27,360 --> 01:19:31,200
 department. And today I'm just going to talk to you guys about our new city of Denton

762
01:19:31,200 --> 01:19:37,040
 public facing air quality dashboard. So I'm going to outline what I'm going to be speaking

763
01:19:37,040 --> 01:19:41,520
 to you all about today. First, I'm going to give a brief background over the city of Denton air

764
01:19:41,520 --> 01:19:48,400
 quality monitoring in the area. And I'm going to give an overview of the dashboard as it resides

765
01:19:48,400 --> 01:19:55,200
 on our sustainable Denton website. Throughout the presentation, I'm going to give time for questions

766
01:19:55,200 --> 01:19:59,360
 and feedback from the committee. And then I'll talk about some next steps for the dashboard.

767
01:20:01,760 --> 01:20:08,000
 All right. So a bit of a background as Mr. Fuente stated in his presentation that the Denton is in

768
01:20:08,000 --> 01:20:14,400
 DFW and DFW is a non-attainment for ground level ozone. This means an area is considered

769
01:20:14,400 --> 01:20:19,600
 non-attainment when it has ozone levels that exceed limits set by the national ambient air

770
01:20:19,600 --> 01:20:26,160
 quality standards or NAQS. It's looking like we may be a non-attainment for particulate matter as well.

771
01:20:28,160 --> 01:20:33,280
 And the Clear Air Act establishes NAQS for criteria pollutants or common air quality

772
01:20:33,280 --> 01:20:39,520
 pollutants that can be harmful to the environment. This includes ground level ozone, particulate

773
01:20:39,520 --> 01:20:46,560
 matter, carbon monoxide, lead, sulfur dioxide, and nitrogen dioxide. And the Texas Commission

774
01:20:46,560 --> 01:20:54,400
 on Environmental Quality or TCEQ has 46 regulatory monitors in DFW alone. And there is one TCEQ

775
01:20:54,400 --> 01:21:00,880
 air quality site in Northwest Denton near the airport. This site measures ambient weather,

776
01:21:00,880 --> 01:21:08,000
 so wind data, so wind speed and wind direction, precipitation, solar radiation. It also measures

777
01:21:08,000 --> 01:21:15,680
 nitric oxide, nitrogen dioxide, oxides and nitrogen, and particulate matter, specifically PM2.5. So

778
01:21:15,680 --> 01:21:21,520
 this is particulate matter that is 2.5 microns or less in diameter, so very small particles.

779
01:21:21,520 --> 01:21:30,160
 It also measures total volatile organic compounds or TBOC. However, this air quality monitor does

780
01:21:30,160 --> 01:21:35,120
 not provide a wider look or even a closer look at the neighborhood level throughout the city.

781
01:21:35,120 --> 01:21:42,880
 So in 2023, City of Denton Environmental Services and Sustainability began the process of acquiring

782
01:21:42,880 --> 01:21:49,520
 and installing several AQ mesh sensors throughout the city. These sensors were chosen because they

783
01:21:49,520 --> 01:21:55,360
 are small and they are easy to install. They are a little bit cheaper to install and acquire.

784
01:21:55,360 --> 01:22:00,720
 They are customizable, so you can pick and choose which sensors you want to include and

785
01:22:00,720 --> 01:22:07,520
 which pollutants to measure. They are extremely accurate, and data is provided in near real time.

786
01:22:07,520 --> 01:22:13,760
 So these sensors, they collect air quality data every 15 minutes, and at the top of every hour,

787
01:22:13,760 --> 01:22:21,440
 it'll average that data and then record that average every hour. So in collaboration with

788
01:22:21,440 --> 01:22:29,120
 Denton Municipal Electric, staff installed these sensors, 12 sensors, in two different phases.

789
01:22:29,120 --> 01:22:35,600
 Phase two was completed in February 2023, and we installed six different sensors at electric

790
01:22:35,600 --> 01:22:41,840
 substations. These were a little bit more difficult to install, just the connections were difficult

791
01:22:41,840 --> 01:22:45,520
 and a little bit more difficult to access by staff. We have to coordinate with DME when we

792
01:22:45,520 --> 01:22:53,040
 come out and do any sort of maintenance on these. So in phase two, we decided to install an additional

793
01:22:53,040 --> 01:22:58,560
 six sensors at these light poles, which are a little bit easier to access. They're right off

794
01:22:58,560 --> 01:23:04,640
 of the roads, and site locations for the sensors were chosen based on several criteria, including

795
01:23:04,640 --> 01:23:10,560
 sufficient spatial distribution throughout the city, as well as DC power availability, minimal tree

796
01:23:10,560 --> 01:23:16,320
 canopy cover, which can impact the readings here, and distance from roadways. So keeping them out of

797
01:23:16,320 --> 01:23:20,960
 access by the public, but still easy to access by staff.

798
01:23:20,960 --> 01:23:27,760
 So like I said, these sensors were chosen because they're extremely accurate, and they have a low

799
01:23:27,760 --> 01:23:33,360
 detection limit, which means they can pick up relatively low levels of different pollutants.

800
01:23:33,360 --> 01:23:40,000
 And these are configured to measure ozone particulate matter, PM2.5 and PM10 specifically,

801
01:23:40,560 --> 01:23:45,760
 nitrogen dioxide, total volatile organic compounds, or TVOC, and sulfur dioxide.

802
01:23:45,760 --> 01:23:53,200
 And ozone and particulate matter are especially a primary concern in North Texas. That is the

803
01:23:53,200 --> 01:24:01,520
 AQI, or air quality index. That's ozone and PM. Particulate matter is included in that AQI,

804
01:24:01,520 --> 01:24:08,400
 NCTCOG. They report on ozone particulate matter through AQI. However, we also included these other

805
01:24:08,400 --> 01:24:14,880
 pollutants because they also present health concerns of their own, and they lead to ozone formation.

806
01:24:14,880 --> 01:24:22,640
 So here is an overview of what the air quality dashboard currently looks like on our Sustainable

807
01:24:22,640 --> 01:24:30,080
 Denton website. Residents, they can go to www.cityofdenton.com/airquality, and they can

808
01:24:30,080 --> 01:24:36,480
 view this dashboard. And this dashboard is comprised of five different maps. Our GIS team

809
01:24:36,480 --> 01:24:41,360
 was great, and they helped build out this map for us. And whenever they first log on to the dashboard,

810
01:24:41,360 --> 01:24:46,640
 they will come to this homepage, or this landing page, which will show the distribution of all of

811
01:24:46,640 --> 01:24:52,560
 the different air quality sensors throughout the City of Denton. The green circles and the red squares

812
01:24:52,560 --> 01:25:00,240
 denote the City of Denton monitors. So the four red squares are sensors that also include wind

813
01:25:00,240 --> 01:25:05,760
 and wind data, so wind speed and wind direction. Only four of them are configured with that currently.

814
01:25:06,560 --> 01:25:14,880
 And we also have that Navy triangle is the TCEQ site, and residents can toggle and they can click

815
01:25:14,880 --> 01:25:21,040
 between these different sites. And if they click on any of the City of Denton locations, that it

816
01:25:21,040 --> 01:25:28,640
 will provide an average reading of ozone PM2.5, PM10, and wind data for the sensors that record them.

817
01:25:28,640 --> 01:25:36,240
 And these are weekly averages. Currently, this data is not automated, so we have to do a

818
01:25:36,240 --> 01:25:42,640
 manual upload of the data. So due to staff time, we are currently reporting weekly averages. I will

819
01:25:42,640 --> 01:25:47,520
 talk about it in the next few slides, but we will eventually move towards an automated data poll,

820
01:25:47,520 --> 01:25:54,240
 where it'll be reporting every hour. But that's where we're at right now. And so anyone can click

821
01:25:54,240 --> 01:25:58,240
 on the City of Denton monitor. They can look at the weekly averages of the previous week.

822
01:25:58,240 --> 01:26:03,120
 They can also click on the sites for the TCEQ monitor, and that will direct them away from the

823
01:26:03,120 --> 01:26:08,160
 City of Denton dashboard into the TCEQ website. And they can delve into the data there, and they

824
01:26:08,160 --> 01:26:15,520
 can compare between TCEQ and Denton if they wish. And then at the top from there, they can look,

825
01:26:15,520 --> 01:26:19,200
 if they wanted to delve into that data even further, if they wanted to look at the hourly

826
01:26:19,200 --> 01:26:23,760
 readings for any of our pollutants, they can go along the top and click on any of the tabs.

827
01:26:23,760 --> 01:26:29,200
 For instance, if they click on ozone, it'll take them to another map where, again, it shows the

828
01:26:29,200 --> 01:26:34,240
 distribution of the City of Denton monitors, and it'll show a list of our active monitors,

829
01:26:34,240 --> 01:26:41,280
 including the pod name. Again, that weekly average reading for ozone, in this case,

830
01:26:41,280 --> 01:26:47,840
 in parts per billion. It'll also show an hourly log of those readings. And this is historical data.

831
01:26:47,840 --> 01:26:55,360
 Currently, this is displaying data all the way from October, whenever we had all 12 sensors online,

832
01:26:55,360 --> 01:27:01,120
 just so it could be a bit more comparable when there's gaps in the data. Additionally, we have

833
01:27:01,120 --> 01:27:09,840
 configured some functionality where at each of the sites along the map, we have included that air

834
01:27:09,840 --> 01:27:18,480
 quality index color. And this is based on the weekly average again. So what that was is the air

835
01:27:18,480 --> 01:27:25,840
 quality index or the AQI. This is just a way to communicate to the public based on colors,

836
01:27:25,840 --> 01:27:32,640
 the level of concern to public health based on the air quality in that area. So this is an index,

837
01:27:32,640 --> 01:27:37,920
 but it's based on EPA breakpoints. So this is based on a range of different concentrations of

838
01:27:37,920 --> 01:27:46,240
 different pollutants. So as you can see on our dashboard, we are reporting the data as is,

839
01:27:46,240 --> 01:27:50,960
 as it's pulled. So it's based on concentrations, so in ozone, parts per billion, et cetera.

840
01:27:50,960 --> 01:27:55,680
 So we just provided these charts here on each of the maps so that our residents,

841
01:27:55,680 --> 01:27:59,760
 whenever they're looking at these green colors and they see, all right, that color is green,

842
01:27:59,760 --> 01:28:03,840
 what does that mean? And they can look at the data and get some more information there.

843
01:28:03,840 --> 01:28:14,800
 All right. And so the next steps, like I said earlier, currently, this is a manual data pull.

844
01:28:14,800 --> 01:28:20,480
 So I'm pulling this data. Every Monday, I'm pulling the previous week's data and uploading

845
01:28:20,480 --> 01:28:26,000
 it into the dashboard. We are currently working on migrating to an application programming interface,

846
01:28:26,000 --> 01:28:34,240
 which is an API, not to be confused with AQI, which I've done. And this will automatically pull

847
01:28:34,240 --> 01:28:43,040
 that data from the sensors into the dashboard. And it will report a rolling 24 average of the air

848
01:28:43,040 --> 01:28:47,600
 quality data as well, so that whenever residents are looking and if they've signed up for air

849
01:28:47,600 --> 01:28:55,040
 quality alerts, they're seeing, okay, so today the forecast, their air quality, the AQI is yellow.

850
01:28:55,040 --> 01:29:00,240
 What does it look like at city of Denton? Okay, all right. And then you can compare from there.

851
01:29:00,240 --> 01:29:07,040
 And with that 24 hour average, it's a little more informative and comparable. We're also working

852
01:29:07,040 --> 01:29:14,320
 towards a, we're not currently working, but we're wanting to also include a mobile configuration of

853
01:29:14,320 --> 01:29:19,440
 the air quality dashboard. Currently, you can only view this dashboard on the desktop. If you try to

854
01:29:19,440 --> 01:29:24,960
 look at it on your cell phone, iPad, it doesn't work. So there was interest in moving towards a

855
01:29:24,960 --> 01:29:30,320
 mobile configuration as well. And we're hearing the same concerns with other cities. They're

856
01:29:30,320 --> 01:29:36,080
 wanting to move towards a mobile configuration as well. And then finally, we really want to work

857
01:29:36,080 --> 01:29:40,960
 towards analyzing this air quality data. We have a ton of data. You know, it's only about a year or

858
01:29:40,960 --> 01:29:46,640
 more, but that's good data. So there's interest in analyzing that from there to where is this meeting.

859
01:29:46,640 --> 01:29:56,960
 And with that, I'll take any questions. Questions? So you mentioned that you go into analyzing the data.

860
01:29:58,640 --> 01:30:07,200
 Do you envision making graphs, annual graphs of all these pollutants that you monitor and

861
01:30:07,200 --> 01:30:16,480
 look into the, maybe the cause of why they are above EPA standards and advise the public or

862
01:30:16,480 --> 01:30:22,480
 come back and report to us? Absolutely. Absolutely. That's one way you can analyze that data. I,

863
01:30:22,480 --> 01:30:27,440
 currently, I don't know if that will be us or if we'll partner or collaborate with anyone,

864
01:30:27,440 --> 01:30:31,200
 but there is interest there. That's something that we could absolutely do. Yeah, because you have,

865
01:30:31,200 --> 01:30:37,840
 as you said, lots of data and that, you know, all this analysis will be very informative for the public.

866
01:30:37,840 --> 01:30:52,240
 So I saw that our sensors can sense additional material than the PMs and the ozone. Are we

867
01:30:52,240 --> 01:30:57,840
 storing that information anywhere? Absolutely. Yeah. So we have, we have access to that data on

868
01:30:57,840 --> 01:31:05,200
 the back end. Okay. And if anyone is interested in looking at that data, because as you saw our

869
01:31:05,200 --> 01:31:12,880
 dashboard currently, it only, we're only publicly presenting ozone and particulate matter. So that

870
01:31:12,880 --> 01:31:18,640
 when residents, this is informational only, these sensors are non-regulatory. So these, if anyone

871
01:31:18,640 --> 01:31:22,480
 wants to look into that data further, they can reach out to me. My contact information is there,

872
01:31:22,480 --> 01:31:28,240
 and if they want that data, they can. I know that there is student researchers at local universities,

873
01:31:28,240 --> 01:31:34,000
 UNT, TWU, if they want that data and they want to use that for research, they can reach out to us.

874
01:31:34,000 --> 01:31:39,280
 To Camilla's point, I think that information, if it's not like accessible on this dashboard,

875
01:31:39,280 --> 01:31:45,120
 would be really great to hear. I just was making sure we didn't over-buy sensors. It's doing

876
01:31:45,120 --> 01:31:49,120
 information that we're not going to be looking at. So that's really helpful to know that it's still

877
01:31:49,120 --> 01:31:57,120
 going to be around. The weekly averages. So this is just, it's a, we're casting back a little bit,

878
01:31:57,120 --> 01:32:01,360
 right? Whenever I open up this dashboard, I can see what was, I don't really have the ability to

879
01:32:01,360 --> 01:32:07,760
 see what's happening right now. Is that correct? Yes, correct. Okay. And within the dashboard's

880
01:32:07,760 --> 01:32:14,720
 functionality, I can only see that average of the weekly and then see the logs specifically.

881
01:32:14,720 --> 01:32:21,520
 Yes. Okay. And I guess to reflect what you just said, if I wanted additional information or I

882
01:32:21,520 --> 01:32:25,920
 wanted to maybe understand a little bit more about my local context and what I may or may not be

883
01:32:25,920 --> 01:32:30,880
 being exposed to, I could request that information from you. Yes, for now, yes.

884
01:32:30,880 --> 01:32:37,440
 Maybe a little in the weeds, but is there any kind of regular calibration or sanity

885
01:32:37,440 --> 01:32:42,640
 checks that have to be done with those sensors? That's a great question. I'm not sure about

886
01:32:42,640 --> 01:32:48,000
 calibration. That is something that I can reach out to for our technicians or not our technicians,

887
01:32:48,000 --> 01:33:00,800
 but I don't know. They are calibrated before they're installed. Yeah. I think I'm on the

888
01:33:00,800 --> 01:33:07,440
 screen right here. No, and they reference with the TCEQ monitors, so they do a calibration that way

889
01:33:07,440 --> 01:33:17,680
 as well. Yeah. I had a couple of questions. First of all, this is a great asset. I appreciate all

890
01:33:17,680 --> 01:33:25,520
 your work in developing it. Do you have any way to ascertain how many people have accessed the site

891
01:33:25,520 --> 01:33:31,280
 and information? Is there a counter on there where you can see how many folks are getting the message?

892
01:33:32,960 --> 01:33:40,080
 I believe so. Yes. Do you have any numbers on that now? Not currently, no. Yes, you can get that.

893
01:33:40,080 --> 01:33:53,600
 Okay. Also, you're probably already doing it, but is there a way to obviously,

894
01:33:53,600 --> 01:33:58,800
 let me put it this way, if I go on this website and I see the error numbers,

895
01:34:00,720 --> 01:34:10,400
 is there a button? Can I push a button and go to a part that tells me what Denton is doing

896
01:34:10,400 --> 01:34:18,560
 to combat this? In other words, what are the clean air initiatives that sustainability offers?

897
01:34:18,560 --> 01:34:23,600
 I don't know if you've done that yet, but it would be neat if you could unify the whole thing

898
01:34:23,600 --> 01:34:29,920
 so that people start to understand how it's all interrelated, just like an ecosystem.

899
01:34:31,040 --> 01:34:37,520
 Currently, we don't have anything on the dashboard. However, the dashboard is located on the

900
01:34:37,520 --> 01:34:42,880
 Sustainable Denton, that air quality greenhouse gas page, so we have a list of the different

901
01:34:42,880 --> 01:34:46,960
 initiatives that we're doing, the partnerships, and then when they scroll down, they can find

902
01:34:46,960 --> 01:34:51,120
 that dashboard. But currently, it's not in the dashboard. Okay. It's something that we could add.

903
01:34:51,680 --> 01:35:02,960
 Okay. I might go one more. Yeah, I just hope that you will, as soon as is possible,

904
01:35:02,960 --> 01:35:08,240
 get it so that I can find this on my phone. As fast as our GIS.

905
01:35:08,240 --> 01:35:16,240
 To this previous question, if I wanted to know, I don't know what ozone is, I don't know what PM2.5

906
01:35:16,240 --> 01:35:23,920
 is, I can find that still on the greenhouse gas website on sustainability, right? It was. We can

907
01:35:23,920 --> 01:35:29,760
 add that to that greenhouse gas page. It is on the dashboard, so if they wanted to go and they wanted

908
01:35:29,760 --> 01:35:35,760
 to see... Like a descriptor, or maybe sources that this could be coming, like VOCs, for example. I

909
01:35:35,760 --> 01:35:40,240
 know that's not a part of the dashboard, but it's something that they do record, like even trees,

910
01:35:40,240 --> 01:35:47,360
 for example, can release VOCs, right? Or sulfur dioxide or whatever. Where just it's a little bit

911
01:35:47,360 --> 01:35:53,120
 more interpretive or intuitive for a user to see, "Oh, gosh, last week I was exposed to red levels

912
01:35:53,120 --> 01:35:58,800
 of eggs. Now I'm curious, where was that coming from? What's contributing to that?" And at this

913
01:35:58,800 --> 01:36:03,440
 point, maybe I'm thinking, "Oh, gosh, this city should be doing something about that." I think it

914
01:36:03,440 --> 01:36:08,560
 leads to a lot of interesting jumping off questions as an educational tool. That it'd be nice to try

915
01:36:08,560 --> 01:36:13,360
 to consolidate some of those information that way. If there are concerns or there's just curiosity

916
01:36:13,360 --> 01:36:17,040
 about what's happening and why it may be happening, and it's all kind of localized in one spot for

917
01:36:17,040 --> 01:36:21,840
 people to quickly understand what is ozone, where does it come from, what does the city do about it,

918
01:36:21,840 --> 01:36:25,760
 and here's what your neighborhood looked like the week prior. I think that's really informative for

919
01:36:25,760 --> 01:36:31,280
 people. No, that's a great point. And currently, right now, we do have on each of the pollutant pages,

920
01:36:31,280 --> 01:36:37,040
 again, it's only ozone in particular matter, but if they wanted to learn more about this pollutant,

921
01:36:37,040 --> 01:36:42,000
 they can click on this language that says, "For more information about this pollutant, click here,"

922
01:36:42,000 --> 01:36:47,200
 and it does take them to the EPA page specifically on that pollutant. So that gives the resident the

923
01:36:47,200 --> 01:36:54,400
 opportunity to research that on their own. Awesome. Any other comments, questions?

924
01:36:54,400 --> 01:37:05,840
 All right. Now we shall receive a report, hold a discussion, and give staff direction on

925
01:37:05,840 --> 01:37:19,520
 Sustainability Framework Fund 2024-2025, those programs and the prioritization of programs in 2025-2026.

926
01:37:19,520 --> 01:37:28,000
 Pardon me? I'm going to take that one, we're all good for a few more minutes? Yeah, sure. Okay.

927
01:37:28,000 --> 01:37:32,800
 Catherine Barnett, Sustainability Manager. I'm just going to talk a little bit about the

928
01:37:32,800 --> 01:37:36,880
 2024-2025 Sustainability Framework Fund programs, and then a little bit about

929
01:37:36,880 --> 01:37:39,760
 what we are looking for for next year.

930
01:37:39,760 --> 01:37:46,640
 So we'll do some project updates, talk about the expenditures,

931
01:37:46,640 --> 01:37:52,400
 have a discussion about prioritization for 2025-2026, and then out to look at our next steps.

932
01:37:52,400 --> 01:38:02,720
 So just a reminder, for 2024-2025, we have about $600,000 planned in programs and projects,

933
01:38:03,520 --> 01:38:09,680
 I've listed the funding that we have earmarked for those, and our expenditures. A few of them,

934
01:38:09,680 --> 01:38:15,520
 the water conservation specifically, we ended up not funding out of the Framework Fund because

935
01:38:15,520 --> 01:38:19,920
 Denton Water Utilities chose to go ahead and fund those incentives through their budget.

936
01:38:19,920 --> 01:38:26,400
 We postponed a little bit on the ecosystem protection and enhancement. We had a little

937
01:38:26,400 --> 01:38:33,520
 bit of a rebound with the privet at a couple of our sites this summer. Potentially the heavy

938
01:38:33,520 --> 01:38:41,840
 rains that we had in the spring helped out a lot. We have the EV rebates, the E-5 rebates,

939
01:38:41,840 --> 01:38:46,240
 and I'll go ahead and talk about the lawn equipment pilot here too. All three of those

940
01:38:46,240 --> 01:38:54,400
 programs are doing really well. Those amounts, the $72,000 expended, the almost $38,000 and about

941
01:38:54,400 --> 01:39:02,320
 $35,000. Those were as of the eighth, whenever we had to have the backup finalized, but we are at

942
01:39:02,320 --> 01:39:11,040
 about $44,000 on e-bikes now, $79,000 on EV, and about $45,000 on lawn equipment as of today.

943
01:39:11,040 --> 01:39:20,160
 So really well received. The lawn equipment project program just really took off. We've had 287

944
01:39:20,160 --> 01:39:26,800
 applicants. Some of those are duplicates. They're buying it one piece at a time, but they're getting

945
01:39:26,800 --> 01:39:35,760
 them. So yeah, really happy with how that program took off. We funded the electric bikes for PD.

946
01:39:35,760 --> 01:39:42,080
 That was a $31,000 expenditure. Worked on that charging management for the city as a whole,

947
01:39:42,080 --> 01:39:49,920
 which are the chargers that are at our facilities. Parks mowers, we have here marked 52,500

948
01:39:49,920 --> 01:39:55,040
 that should be coming to council for approval soon, and those will be the electric robotic mowers.

949
01:39:55,040 --> 01:40:02,080
 See, we didn't have to spend any money on the electric vehicle for the city fleet support. We

950
01:40:02,080 --> 01:40:07,360
 talked about that during the climate action plan update, the vehicles that we purchased. The

951
01:40:07,360 --> 01:40:11,360
 department's purchased that within their own funding and didn't need that support from the

952
01:40:11,360 --> 01:40:17,200
 sustainability fund, so that was great. We have a little bit of O&M costs with the monitor program.

953
01:40:19,920 --> 01:40:23,360
 We'll see a little bit of that continuing in the next year.

954
01:40:23,360 --> 01:40:32,160
 Catherine, could you remind us, so the funding column 600k, that was our budgeted or that was

955
01:40:32,160 --> 01:40:40,400
 our actual fund total for FY24? That was the project total for 24. That was what we were

956
01:40:40,400 --> 01:40:49,440
 programming to spend for 24. Whenever we set that amount, we had, I think we had an $800,000

957
01:40:49,440 --> 01:40:57,680
 budget, 750, sorry, 750 for 24/25, so we went at that 600 because we hadn't hit those revenue

958
01:40:57,680 --> 01:41:03,920
 projections before. So yeah, so that's where we are. That was just our program budget.

959
01:41:03,920 --> 01:41:09,760
 My question, outside of the budgeting for how much we anticipate receiving, I understand the

960
01:41:09,760 --> 01:41:20,400
 fund is franchise E funded, our actual FY24 total that was within the fund. We expended 280, how

961
01:41:20,400 --> 01:41:30,880
 much was left in the pot? I'll have to get that together. I know every year we go through this

962
01:41:30,880 --> 01:41:34,400
 and we're like, did we ballpark right? Did we ballpark right? And we kind of get a little bit

963
01:41:34,400 --> 01:41:38,880
 of a reflection back to see, we know what our programs did during the year, and then we look

964
01:41:38,880 --> 01:41:43,280
 at the next year and say, here's what we are thinking we're going to be around. And I know

965
01:41:43,280 --> 01:41:47,120
 there's always a fine-tuning process. I didn't know if there's additional details we could be

966
01:41:47,120 --> 01:41:54,000
 thinking about in regards to, it looks like well underestimated or perhaps some of the programs

967
01:41:54,000 --> 01:41:57,920
 uptake, wasn't it? What we may have thought. I'm just trying to think about those balances.

968
01:41:57,920 --> 01:42:06,480
 We'll get that information. We don't get finalized numbers until later in the year,

969
01:42:06,480 --> 01:42:13,200
 so we do have enough funding available for what we're proposing. Cool, thank you. I think that's

970
01:42:13,200 --> 01:42:22,880
 it. I'll clean this way on that. So just some specifics about the different programs. We launched

971
01:42:22,880 --> 01:42:31,600
 that electric line up in the program May 29th. Like I said, we're right at 45,000 spent now,

972
01:42:32,160 --> 01:42:38,720
 and then we are in regular inclusion of that project for 25-26 as a continuity program.

973
01:42:38,720 --> 01:42:53,920
 EV and EVITE incentives. Again, we're at 79,000 now and 44,000 or 5,000. We have funded those

974
01:42:53,920 --> 01:42:59,920
 at a higher level, so we haven't reached the entire spend from what we have programmed for 25-26.

975
01:43:02,160 --> 01:43:06,960
 I think that those are established programs and can continue forward if that's what the committee

976
01:43:06,960 --> 01:43:18,240
 desires. And then kind of moving into the 25-26 proposed programs, looking at that transportation

977
01:43:18,240 --> 01:43:24,960
 travel movement that this area kind of ties back to our climate action plan goals. We have the EV,

978
01:43:24,960 --> 01:43:30,800
 rebank the EVITE, the lot equipment. We have a three-year program planned with parks for the

979
01:43:30,800 --> 01:43:40,000
 mowers. So that would be about $52,500 per year to get them up to six mowers working in our ball

980
01:43:40,000 --> 01:43:46,160
 fields. So including that again for next year for expense and then the O&M for their quality

981
01:43:46,160 --> 01:43:52,400
 sensors. And then one thing that we've had this in the plan since our original big $4 million

982
01:43:52,400 --> 01:43:58,640
 proposal to work on the bike lane and sidewalk connections just to improve walkability and

983
01:43:58,640 --> 01:44:03,360
 bikeability in town. So really work with transportation on that and if there's anywhere

984
01:44:03,360 --> 01:44:07,760
 we can help close some of those gaps. And then we've heard a lot this year about some of the

985
01:44:07,760 --> 01:44:15,040
 school areas and some white line gaps and sidewalk gaps. Anything that we can do to help facilitate.

986
01:44:15,040 --> 01:44:24,560
 On the building focus area, we're talking with community development about partnering with them

987
01:44:24,560 --> 01:44:30,160
 with their minor improvement program where we could go in and if they're working on a home we

988
01:44:30,160 --> 01:44:36,240
 could go in and we can work on energy efficiency. We would work on the building envelope insulation

989
01:44:36,240 --> 01:44:41,680
 kind of do all of that upgrade at that one point in time so they only have one construction

990
01:44:41,680 --> 01:44:52,560
 disturbance and try to try to get them up to a better energy efficient home, more comfortable home.

991
01:44:53,600 --> 01:44:59,120
 They work between 30 and 50 homes a year and so we would partner with them for up to 50

992
01:44:59,120 --> 01:45:05,440
 and we're looking at an average of 7,000 and that would help increase this year of their HVAC

993
01:45:05,440 --> 01:45:13,040
 heat pump units. I was curious on this like because that is a proposed program. Do they have a team

994
01:45:13,040 --> 01:45:17,440
 that goes in and does the installation for these types of projects or they contract that out to

995
01:45:17,440 --> 01:45:23,440
 somebody here? They contract. Okay, so we would just be adding some of those additional efficiencies

996
01:45:23,440 --> 01:45:31,840
 and weatherization programs? Exactly and providing an energy outlet up front. Prior to work? Yes,

997
01:45:31,840 --> 01:45:40,240
 so we identify the goal of the whole project. Yeah, we're excited about this one. It helps us

998
01:45:41,440 --> 01:45:49,360
 against that gap that we have from the green sense program that able to go in and help witness things

999
01:45:49,360 --> 01:45:57,520
 on the front. And you'll see it matches with the green sense that we would bring up to the green sense standard.

1000
01:45:57,520 --> 01:46:08,480
 For land use focus area we're proposing 200,000. That'd be the carryover from 24, 25 as well.

1001
01:46:09,840 --> 01:46:15,680
 Talking with parks about some low water use median projects, the safe routes to schools, anything that

1002
01:46:15,680 --> 01:46:23,600
 we can do to help with that, shade, tree planting by parking canopies, and then the ecosystem

1003
01:46:23,600 --> 01:46:31,040
 protection and enhancement that we're continuing that into the park. Yes? Does ecosystem protection

1004
01:46:31,040 --> 01:46:38,320
 and enhancement, does that encompass say if somebody wanted to zero escape the law? No, no, no.

1005
01:46:39,120 --> 01:46:45,040
 There is a turf buyback program through water utilities that would work for that. Okay. Yeah,

1006
01:46:45,040 --> 01:46:52,000
 but not through this. This would be in our parks. Thank you. So how many previous areas do we have?

1007
01:46:52,000 --> 01:47:03,200
 Do you have a? How many are we working on in Denton? You worked on three of them? I think we've done,

1008
01:47:04,640 --> 01:47:11,200
 I think we're up to about half a dozen now, just off the top of my head. Not all of them are scheduled

1009
01:47:11,200 --> 01:47:18,800
 for the enhancement, but we are monitoring up to about half a dozen sites. Okay, and I know that in

1010
01:47:18,800 --> 01:47:27,120
 your report you're signing 100,000 dollars for them. Do you think that's enough? I think I raised

1011
01:47:27,120 --> 01:47:36,400
 an issue before. Yes, and I think as we look at outer years, we may need more. Some of it's

1012
01:47:36,400 --> 01:47:42,080
 being accomplished through existing projects right now, so I think we have adequate funding

1013
01:47:42,080 --> 01:47:47,680
 for the next year, especially rolling over the current year into next year. I think we're good

1014
01:47:47,680 --> 01:47:54,320
 with that. A big project is kicked off just recently down on the south side of town. It's a village

1015
01:47:54,320 --> 01:48:00,960
 with a new permel project, and they've been working through that site. I'm really excited

1016
01:48:00,960 --> 01:48:05,360
 to see this slide. The Safe Cross to School Initiative projects was particularly of interest.

1017
01:48:05,360 --> 01:48:11,840
 I've learned recently that KDB's tree or block program is not that active anymore, and so I think

1018
01:48:11,840 --> 01:48:18,320
 this fills the gap that we have some flexibility to dedicate funds to, and honestly it's a really

1019
01:48:18,320 --> 01:48:22,800
 great way to have some cost-effective programs that people can tell there's a difference,

1020
01:48:22,800 --> 01:48:26,560
 and so this is a really interesting idea, and I think we can see some progress here.

1021
01:48:26,560 --> 01:48:32,880
 Yeah, and I mean it fits in with the bike lane blocking pedestrian connections.

1022
01:48:32,880 --> 01:48:39,120
 Just trying to make it more palatable for folks to walk to school in 100 degrees.

1023
01:48:39,120 --> 01:48:49,680
 So just talking about the prioritization. From our side, we would look at that minor

1024
01:48:49,680 --> 01:48:53,520
 home repair energy efficiency upgrade project kind of as our number one priority,

1025
01:48:53,520 --> 01:49:00,560
 the 350,000 for that, and then move into the bike lane cycle connections and the

1026
01:49:00,560 --> 01:49:08,800
 ecosystem connections. We have a little over a million dollars proposed for next year's budget,

1027
01:49:08,800 --> 01:49:19,120
 and so that's the first 590,000. We would want to focus on those three, and then we'll keep an eye

1028
01:49:19,120 --> 01:49:26,480
 on revenue as it comes to them and expand that as we can. I know we just talked about this,

1029
01:49:26,480 --> 01:49:30,880
 but the relationship with the prioritization specifically. When you talked about community

1030
01:49:30,880 --> 01:49:37,280
 development's program, we're describing this as a pilot, and you mentioned something about 30 homes

1031
01:49:37,280 --> 01:49:42,800
 and then thinking of 50 homes. Is there an existing program that they have that we're building into

1032
01:49:42,800 --> 01:49:50,400
 and then increasing their scope of? It's increasing the scope. They work on 30 to 50 homes a year

1033
01:49:50,400 --> 01:49:57,680
 through their minor home repair program, so we would come in and partner with them, or they may

1034
01:49:57,680 --> 01:50:02,720
 be replacing an air conditioner now, but they're not replacing it up to a 15.2 sear, so we would

1035
01:50:02,720 --> 01:50:08,000
 help them bridge that cost difference, and then they may not be touching insulation, so we would

1036
01:50:08,000 --> 01:50:13,680
 say, okay, we could go in and we can do the insulation piece. The average cost that we're

1037
01:50:13,680 --> 01:50:19,440
 seeing for insulation and then the difference on the HVACs, we feel like 70,000 is a great

1038
01:50:19,440 --> 01:50:23,840
 average cost for that, even if we had to get into some weatherization and maybe a little bit more.

1039
01:50:23,840 --> 01:50:32,400
 And that would be our individual home-by-home investment? Yes. If possible, it would be helpful

1040
01:50:32,400 --> 01:50:36,560
 to see some additional information, and maybe I can find this independently. What community

1041
01:50:36,560 --> 01:50:42,480
 developments process for applicants or how they develop that list for what they can actually get

1042
01:50:42,480 --> 01:50:46,320
 to in a year? I think that'd be interesting information as we think about it. We can get

1043
01:50:46,320 --> 01:50:48,320
 their application process for you. I think I'll send them.

1044
01:50:48,320 --> 01:51:01,840
 So the continuing existing programs, that's about 410,000, so that gets us up to a million,

1045
01:51:01,840 --> 01:51:08,160
 but 410 of that would be continuing existing programs, and those are just proposed by the

1046
01:51:08,160 --> 01:51:21,280
 levels for each. So what we'll do next steps, we'll close out the 24-25 year and then come back and

1047
01:51:21,280 --> 01:51:26,720
 report back on how all those projects closed out for the year, and we'll prepare a framework by

1048
01:51:26,720 --> 01:51:33,920
 work plan for consideration at our next meeting and present that. If we want to go back and talk

1049
01:51:33,920 --> 01:51:39,280
 about the different programs and where your interests lie for prioritization, that would be great.

1050
01:51:39,280 --> 01:51:46,480
 Any feedback that you can offer today? I'm

1051
01:51:46,480 --> 01:51:55,600
 pretty partial to the energy efficiency upgrades. I think they are very crucial

1052
01:51:56,480 --> 01:52:02,400
 given the situation. And also, I know it's perhaps not germane to this

1053
01:52:02,400 --> 01:52:09,760
 now, but at some point, as it's already on the matrix, is to look about reinstating

1054
01:52:09,760 --> 01:52:15,440
 some sort of solar incentive, residential solar incentive, and a battery incentive as well.

1055
01:52:22,320 --> 01:52:28,480
 So we are currently looking at zeroing out the fleet support upgrades?

1056
01:52:28,480 --> 01:52:37,120
 We have that money earmarked in the project right now,

1057
01:52:37,120 --> 01:52:40,880
 so we would not be adding additional funding to that next year.

1058
01:52:40,880 --> 01:52:46,240
 Okay, so keeping it at the 175 for the next work plan?

1059
01:52:47,680 --> 01:52:56,240
 Yes. That's true. We are pausing our participating goals with budget next year.

1060
01:52:56,240 --> 01:53:06,480
 I would be, I would love to see at that future work plan presentation, if we know that's going

1061
01:53:06,480 --> 01:53:11,040
 to be a policy on the books, it makes sense to me to go ahead and just zero that line on account,

1062
01:53:11,040 --> 01:53:14,960
 and we can just hold it in our minds that maybe a year or two from now, and that's a door that's

1063
01:53:14,960 --> 01:53:20,400
 open again, we can support those efforts. But if they needed no support in this previous fiscal or

1064
01:53:20,400 --> 01:53:24,960
 anticipating no additional procurement next fiscal, I think it just might make sense to

1065
01:53:24,960 --> 01:53:30,000
 clean it up a little bit and just say we're going to focus on some other issues as my input.

1066
01:53:30,000 --> 01:53:39,520
 Anything else? Thank you.

1067
01:53:44,960 --> 01:53:53,920
 Under staff reports, does anyone have anything they want to add to the matrix?

1068
01:53:53,920 --> 01:54:05,360
 So I think I would like for us to get more information on the styrofoam recycling.

1069
01:54:08,560 --> 01:54:15,920
 I know that's something new that we do, and I'm not sure we know a lot about it and also

1070
01:54:15,920 --> 01:54:20,480
 then tonight, so. Yes, we do.

1071
01:54:20,480 --> 01:54:26,640
 Any other matrix items? I would like for it to go in our matrix

1072
01:54:26,640 --> 01:54:34,560
 during D&E's IOP and R&P development process that we do from then again in an item where we can

1073
01:54:34,560 --> 01:54:41,600
 provide direct feedback to staff regarding our position on some of their policy development as

1074
01:54:41,600 --> 01:55:01,920
 we move through those programs. Zero timeline on this, but at some point I would really love to see

1075
01:55:01,920 --> 01:55:07,440
 that maybe annual or semi-annual analysis of the air quality data that we do capture especially

1076
01:55:07,440 --> 01:55:12,160
 ones that aren't presented or available on the publicly viewable dashboard and that would be

1077
01:55:12,160 --> 01:55:16,800
 really fascinating to kind of understand what are we capturing on that localized basis if we could

1078
01:55:17,520 --> 01:55:33,760
 get that one. Anybody else? I have one thing. A while back we were told about a landfill that

1079
01:55:33,760 --> 01:55:43,200
 was being closed here in Denton and it's out near Crossroads 74 acres. It's adjacent to Mosley Road

1080
01:55:43,920 --> 01:55:49,920
 about four and a half miles east of Denton. Its record ID, which I assume is the state

1081
01:55:49,920 --> 01:55:55,120
 registration with the state, is 239 and its facility ID is 13.

1082
01:55:55,120 --> 01:56:03,920
 And what I would like an update on what plans there are, what they're going to do with this

1083
01:56:03,920 --> 01:56:10,080
 landfill because I know when Brian presented it way back when there was some talk of thinking

1084
01:56:10,080 --> 01:56:15,520
 about turning it into a park, but I'm just curious to see if there's been any development with that.

1085
01:56:15,520 --> 01:56:23,840
 Not to my knowledge, but I'll get an update. Thank you. Anything else?

1086
01:56:23,840 --> 01:56:30,480
 Do we have a motion to adjourn? So moved. So moved. All in favor?

1087
01:56:30,480 --> 01:56:35,840
 Thank you. We are adjourned. Thank you.