WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:15.000 Welcome to this special call meeting of the Benton Board of Ethics. It's January 6th, 2025, 531 P.M. 00:00:15.000 --> 00:00:23.000 And I call the meeting to order. There's three members here and we'll elect a presiding officer first. 00:00:31.000 --> 00:00:33.000 What do you want me to do? 00:00:33.000 --> 00:00:36.000 I'll move to elect Diane as the presiding officer. 00:00:36.000 --> 00:00:39.000 No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. 00:00:39.000 --> 00:00:41.000 I do appreciate that. 00:00:41.000 --> 00:00:46.000 I'll move to make Kenneth Ferguson the presiding officer. 00:00:46.000 --> 00:01:00.000 And I second that motion. 00:01:00.000 --> 00:01:02.000 I think you have to vote. 00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:17.000 I think you can say if there's no objection, then Kenneth Ferguson will serve as the chair. 00:01:17.000 --> 00:01:18.000 Okay. 00:01:18.000 --> 00:01:28.000 Let's call item number BOE 25-001. 00:01:28.000 --> 00:01:45.000 And this is an ethics complaint number 25-003, filed on December 24, 2024, concerning allegations of the ethics ordinance, section 2-273. 00:01:45.000 --> 00:01:48.000 And so as part of the process, the complaint gets submitted to me. 00:01:48.000 --> 00:01:54.000 I determine if basically the form is filled out correctly, according to the chair who assigns the panel. 00:01:54.000 --> 00:02:03.000 That's where we are currently, so you as the panel now determine if the complaint is actionable, baseless, or if there's an option to recommend the hearing preferability. 00:02:03.000 --> 00:02:09.000 I'll pull up the definitions of what those mean, but that's the extent of what we're doing today. 00:02:09.000 --> 00:02:29.000 Any questions about that? 00:02:29.000 --> 00:02:39.000 This section of the ordinance has the information on what actionable and baseless means. I can zoom in. 00:02:39.000 --> 00:02:42.000 I'm having a little trouble hearing you from over here. 00:02:42.000 --> 00:02:52.000 Okay. So this meeting is just to determine if the complaint is actionable or baseless, which is defined on the slide. 00:02:52.000 --> 00:02:53.000 Does that make sense? 00:02:53.000 --> 00:02:58.000 Got it. 00:02:58.000 --> 00:02:59.000 Can we talk now? 00:02:59.000 --> 00:03:04.000 Yes, you can talk. 00:03:04.000 --> 00:03:19.000 Well, I did read it all, and I did read the ethics complaint form, and something struck out at me unwarding. 00:03:19.000 --> 00:03:27.000 And it said possible violation, which gave me great grief to wonder if there was a true violation or not. 00:03:27.000 --> 00:03:39.000 Me personally, after reading this and understanding all this and reading all that, I do not think there was intent here. 00:03:39.000 --> 00:03:53.000 I do not know the person, but I do think that -- I do not believe that there was intent to break the rules. 00:03:53.000 --> 00:03:57.000 And the biggest thing for me was there was not enough information. 00:03:57.000 --> 00:04:06.000 It is the mayor's job to give me and them as much information as we can. 00:04:06.000 --> 00:04:14.000 And I was like, well, when did this happen? When did the roof get on? How much did the roof get on? 00:04:14.000 --> 00:04:23.000 Were they getting the same deal as everybody else in the community? 00:04:23.000 --> 00:04:30.000 And I just do not think there is enough information for me to make that decision based on this. 00:04:30.000 --> 00:04:39.000 So I just do not think we should go forward on it, because they did not fulfill their responsibility. 00:04:39.000 --> 00:04:47.000 They did not fulfill his responsibility to this committee to make sure they got all they needed before they made their decision. 00:04:47.000 --> 00:04:53.000 Unless there is some other information out there I do not know about. 00:04:53.000 --> 00:04:59.000 I think the only other information was the video, the link to the video, which -- there was a link to the work session video, 00:04:59.000 --> 00:05:04.000 which I think that was the only other thing provided apart from the pictures of this. 00:05:04.000 --> 00:05:10.000 You know, council people are human beings, and I understand what ethics is. 00:05:10.000 --> 00:05:14.000 I have worked in it a long time, but they are human beings. 00:05:14.000 --> 00:05:23.000 And sometimes they get an advantage -- they are not getting an advantage, but they get a discount, just like everybody else gets a discount. 00:05:23.000 --> 00:05:29.000 And I do not think we should beat up council people to not allow them to have a life because they are council people. 00:05:29.000 --> 00:05:32.000 There is no wonder nobody wants to ruin. 00:05:32.000 --> 00:05:40.000 I just do not believe that this warrants us going forward. 00:05:40.000 --> 00:05:42.000 I tend to agree. 00:05:42.000 --> 00:05:47.000 I want to clarify. 00:05:47.000 --> 00:05:53.000 This specifically is about Section E, the improper influence, correct? 00:05:53.000 --> 00:05:54.000 Correct. 00:05:54.000 --> 00:06:02.000 So it shall be a violation of this article for a city official to use such person's official title and position to secure privileges, 00:06:02.000 --> 00:06:09.000 special privileges, or benefits for such person or others. 00:06:09.000 --> 00:06:25.000 I would say that the deliberations was meant to get, if you want to call it, a benefit or a privilege for an entire section of the city, 00:06:25.000 --> 00:06:29.000 population or residents, and not just one person. 00:06:29.000 --> 00:06:43.000 That is where I want to go back to what we talked about before, that I do not think that the person got any special privileges through this, 00:06:43.000 --> 00:06:53.000 because it is hoped that those rates would go toward everybody that has the same things. 00:06:53.000 --> 00:07:11.000 I do not agree with you. I do not think that you should go forward with it. 00:07:11.000 --> 00:07:27.000 It further states in Section E that those benefits go beyond that which is normally available to every other citizen. 00:07:27.000 --> 00:07:37.000 Now, obviously, it is not available to every citizen, because it is a subsection of citizens who have the same setup, 00:07:37.000 --> 00:07:46.000 but every citizen has the opportunity and the choice to get solar panels on their roof as well. 00:07:46.000 --> 00:07:48.000 That is where I totally agree with you. 00:07:48.000 --> 00:07:58.000 I mean, they have the right, as any other citizen, to receive what any other citizen would have an advantage in that. 00:07:58.000 --> 00:08:08.000 So, I see nothing there that shows me, personally, that this is some kind of a violation. 00:08:08.000 --> 00:08:17.000 I just do not think it is intent. I use that word, but when you talk about ethics, you have got to have an intent of doing something wrong. 00:08:17.000 --> 00:08:25.000 I think we have a piece of paper here that says, "Possible Violation." Well, they do not even know if it is a violation. 00:08:25.000 --> 00:08:35.000 So, I am going to agree totally with you that they have the right to have the same rights of other people 00:08:35.000 --> 00:08:39.000 about what happens, their discounts and whatever, as long as the other people. 00:08:39.000 --> 00:08:51.000 They cannot have special treatment. They cannot get special pricing. We all know that under the rules, but I just do not see this happening. 00:08:51.000 --> 00:09:05.000 I think that I tend to agree that it is not baseless and not going to be actionable, 00:09:05.000 --> 00:09:17.000 but I would like to just kind of come out and defend a little bit of our complainants here and that we are mandated to make these complaints. 00:09:17.000 --> 00:09:28.000 And so, I do not think that we are faced with a malice complaint, or I do not like the word "baseless," 00:09:28.000 --> 00:09:38.000 but a complaint that was made in bad faith. I think this complaint was made by mandate to say, "Hey, is this possible?" 00:09:38.000 --> 00:09:42.000 I do not know. It is possible. This is what happened. Go watch the video. See for yourself. 00:09:42.000 --> 00:09:45.000 You all decide. That is your job. You are the Board of Ethics. 00:09:45.000 --> 00:09:55.000 So, I do want to thank the Mayor for taking the time to write this out and present it to us and run it through the proper process, 00:09:55.000 --> 00:10:03.000 as we, as city officials, are mandated to do under Section 272. 00:10:03.000 --> 00:10:10.000 But yeah, I do tend to agree that it is not actionable. 00:10:10.000 --> 00:10:19.000 The Mayor did what he had to do. He wrote up a complaint based on what it says he has to report. 00:10:19.000 --> 00:10:26.000 Obviously, there is nothing to be taken. I would rather something be reported than not. 00:10:26.000 --> 00:10:46.000 You know, I would rather fight in the butt right away than have it grow. Based on all the information, I think we are together on this. 00:10:46.000 --> 00:10:56.000 So, I want to make a motion. I'll make a motion that we move to that this is not an actionable complaint. 00:10:56.000 --> 00:11:01.000 Second? I'm sorry. We have a second from Diane. 00:11:01.000 --> 00:11:08.000 Okay. With that, the motion passes. And this is a baseless complaint. 00:11:08.000 --> 00:11:12.000 Well, I think the motion was not actionable. And then... 00:11:12.000 --> 00:11:16.000 I did repeat it differently. You are correct. 00:11:16.000 --> 00:11:22.000 So the baseless is something you could consider now if you wanted to. 00:11:22.000 --> 00:11:25.000 I'm sorry. So the action was that it was not actionable? 00:11:25.000 --> 00:11:31.000 Not actionable, yeah. 00:11:31.000 --> 00:11:37.000 Okay. Do we have a motion as to whether this is a baseless complaint or not? 00:11:37.000 --> 00:11:51.000 I think the next step is frivolity. Because you find either actionable or baseless. 00:11:51.000 --> 00:12:03.000 And then the next step is... 00:12:03.000 --> 00:12:17.000 I think once you find it's not actionable, you can't determine frivolity. You would do that rest. 00:12:17.000 --> 00:12:24.000 So it's not actionable, but that doesn't mean it's baseless? Should we determine it's baseless? 00:12:24.000 --> 00:12:28.000 Or should we make a motion about that? 00:12:28.000 --> 00:12:33.000 If it's not actionable, there's no movement on it, right? Correct? Yeah. 00:12:33.000 --> 00:12:38.000 I think not actionable and baseless are one and the same thing. 00:12:38.000 --> 00:12:45.000 Yes. Based on that language, I would agree. If it's not actionable, therefore it's baseless, right? 00:12:45.000 --> 00:12:46.000 Yeah. 00:12:46.000 --> 00:12:52.000 So now we need to decide if it's going to be...if it was... 00:12:52.000 --> 00:12:53.000 Frivolous? 00:12:53.000 --> 00:13:00.000 It's frivolous. Now, is that a separate committee that determines the frivolity or is that on us? 00:13:00.000 --> 00:13:07.000 You can determine if the full board should determine if it was frivolous or just let it go. 00:13:07.000 --> 00:13:09.000 Okay, yes. It goes to the full board. 00:13:09.000 --> 00:13:13.000 Right. If you wanted to have a hearing on frivolity, that would go to the full board. 00:13:13.000 --> 00:13:17.000 Or you could just say it's baseless and that's it. 00:13:17.000 --> 00:13:26.000 I'd like to move to say that it is baseless and that it dies here. 00:13:26.000 --> 00:13:28.000 You're moving it as baseless? 00:13:28.000 --> 00:13:29.000 Yes. 00:13:29.000 --> 00:13:30.000 I would second that. 00:13:30.000 --> 00:13:32.000 Okay. 00:13:32.000 --> 00:13:44.000 Can I ask a quick question before we move on with frivolity? I would like to find out...can we discuss previous complaints related to this? 00:13:44.000 --> 00:13:49.000 If you're discussing frivolity, you can discuss things outside of the complaint. So yes. 00:13:49.000 --> 00:13:50.000 Okay. 00:13:50.000 --> 00:13:56.000 And then I can scroll down to the frivolity part of this. These are the... 00:13:56.000 --> 00:13:58.000 So when you... 00:13:58.000 --> 00:14:00.000 Well, we have a motion. 00:14:00.000 --> 00:14:03.000 Yeah, there's still a motion for baseless on the board. 00:14:03.000 --> 00:14:06.000 And we have a second, so now we need to call a vote. So all opposed? 00:14:06.000 --> 00:14:08.000 Well, I think we have to vote then, right? 00:14:08.000 --> 00:14:09.000 Then we would have to vote. 00:14:09.000 --> 00:14:14.000 You have a motion. I second that we have to open to voting. 00:14:14.000 --> 00:14:17.000 I'm a little concerned because we didn't really discuss the frivolity. 00:14:17.000 --> 00:14:18.000 The what? 00:14:18.000 --> 00:14:24.000 We did not really discuss if there was frivolity or not. We just moved ahead with the motion. 00:14:24.000 --> 00:14:31.000 So can we lay the motion on the table? I am not a certified parliamentarian. 00:14:31.000 --> 00:14:40.000 So I think it says before filing notification of your determination. So if you decided it's not actionable, 00:14:40.000 --> 00:14:46.000 your motion is now to also determine whether it's baseless or not. 00:14:46.000 --> 00:14:52.000 If it's...you determine it's baseless, then I believe you move to the frivolity, don't you? 00:14:52.000 --> 00:14:57.000 Are there other procedures? 00:14:57.000 --> 00:14:58.000 Oh yes, Rich. 00:14:58.000 --> 00:15:02.000 It says clearly out there, baseless complaint shall be dismissed. 00:15:02.000 --> 00:15:06.000 Well, it says if the panel determines the complaint is not actionable, 00:15:06.000 --> 00:15:12.000 does not recommend a frivolity hearing the complaint is baseless and is dismissed. 00:15:12.000 --> 00:15:17.000 So I don't know if you have to make a separate determination on baseless. 00:15:17.000 --> 00:15:21.000 If you made the determination on not actionable, 00:15:21.000 --> 00:15:31.000 the next determination is to whether the allegations will not constitute a violation 00:15:31.000 --> 00:15:55.000 and should be dismissed for whether you want to recommend a frivolity hearing. 00:15:55.000 --> 00:16:03.000 So the choice is, do you want to recommend that it's frivolous? 00:16:03.000 --> 00:16:06.000 But wouldn't you have a hearing on that? 00:16:06.000 --> 00:16:11.000 In order to determine it was frivolous, they would recommend that we have a hearing to do that. 00:16:11.000 --> 00:16:14.000 Yes. 00:16:14.000 --> 00:16:19.000 So they wouldn't determine that it was, just that... 00:16:19.000 --> 00:16:25.000 They would move forward to the whole forward. 00:16:25.000 --> 00:16:30.000 But this was based on this complaint, not complaints of the past. 00:16:30.000 --> 00:16:37.000 That's why I asked if that can be discussed as part of the... 00:16:37.000 --> 00:16:39.000 I think you just look at this particular... 00:16:39.000 --> 00:16:47.000 Okay, then that's it. Then I will go with that. 00:16:47.000 --> 00:16:50.000 Then I will go along with the motion. I don't have an issue with it. 00:16:50.000 --> 00:16:51.000 Okay. 00:16:51.000 --> 00:16:55.000 I'm dismissing it. 00:16:55.000 --> 00:17:02.000 All voting... 00:17:02.000 --> 00:17:04.000 All votes in the affirmative, say aye. 00:17:04.000 --> 00:17:05.000 What did you say? 00:17:05.000 --> 00:17:07.000 All in the affirmative, say aye. 00:17:07.000 --> 00:17:09.000 Aye. 00:17:09.000 --> 00:17:18.000 Okay, with that, the motion passes unanimously. 00:17:18.000 --> 00:17:21.000 I think that we're done. 00:17:21.000 --> 00:17:25.000 I promise I will pick this stuff up, guys. I will learn it. 00:17:25.000 --> 00:17:27.000 I just want to check without a yeah. 00:17:27.000 --> 00:17:30.000 Yeah, I think that they determined it's not actionable. 00:17:30.000 --> 00:17:39.000 They don't recommend the frivolity hearing the complaints baseless, because they made a motion that it was baseless. 00:17:39.000 --> 00:17:52.000 And it's dispensed under number eight of the ethics complaint preliminary assessment process. 00:17:52.000 --> 00:18:01.000 So then we'll just close the meeting at the time. 00:18:01.000 --> 00:18:06.000 That concludes the meeting at 5.49 p.m. 00:18:06.000 --> 00:18:08.000 And we're adjourned. 00:18:08.000 --> 00:18:09.000 And we're adjourned.