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 Alright everyone, welcome to Sustainability Framework Advisory Committee.

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 It is June 7th at 1 o'clock.

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 We are in the City Council Work Session Room and we do have a quorum today.

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 Just a couple of things, we will be moving item C, Reissued Report, Hold a Discussion

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 and Give Staff Direction regarding the value of solar study under item A and then B will

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 come after that and then we will have a couple of speakers before that item.

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 So we will first continue with items for individual consideration.

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 Consider approval of the February 23, 2024 minutes.

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 Does anyone have any comments or questions about those?

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 Okay and so we have a first and a second, all in favor of approval of the minutes?

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 Aye.

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 Alright so we will move on to the next item which will be C and we do have a couple of

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 speakers requesting to speak.

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 Catherine, do you know, do they get two or three minutes?

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 Is it normally, what is normally, I think we're done for in the past, up in the past.

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 So we will give them three minutes and you can come up and speak and we are using the

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 mics from the ceiling and as soon as your time is up, your time is up.

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 Alright so the first speaker, we will receive a report, hold a discussion and give staff

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 direction regarding the value of solar study and the speakers are speaking directly to

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 this item.

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 Alright.

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 Who's first Catherine?

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 Bill Maness.

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 Bill.

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 I just decided five minutes ago to speak, I want to thank the committee for allowing

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 me to speak.

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 I'm speaking regarding to item C which is now item A, I think, DME's proposal which

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 I haven't heard but I just, over the last two years DME has taken several actions regarding

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 solar panels.

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 I'm a solar panel owner but my interest is more in the city as a whole and I've heard

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 a lot of, I've even gone on video and listened to some meetings here and from my view, when

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 DME speaks, they speak for DME.

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 I don't think they speak that much for the city as a whole and when they're arguing,

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 making an argument, they don't get both sides.

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 They're going to give you all the items, all the facts that support their view and their

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 change and that's all they do.

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 And I was just amazed where the committee doesn't hear the other side.

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 So don't expect an unbiased view from these guys.

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 That's all I have.

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 I'll leave.

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 I'm out.

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 Thank you.

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 And I do have one more speaker signed up.

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 Thank you for considering this item.

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 Environment Texas, I'm with Environment Texas, I'm the North Texas City Hall advocate for

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 Environment Texas.

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 We are not in favor of moving away from net metering policies.

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 If anything, we are for advancing net metering policies across the state.

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 Net metering policies dramatically increase the benefits of solar for homeowners.

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 You are much more likely to install solar on your home if you have net metering in your

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 district.

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 Our reports across Texas and across California have shown this.

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 Meanwhile, in California, as is seen in the report, has moved to the net energy metering

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 3.0, which is somewhat similar to this point.

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 And what we've seen is 17,000 solar industry layoffs, mass bankruptcies across the solar

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 in California, and a complete flatlining of rooftop solar across the state.

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 What we don't want to see is that here in Texas.

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 Specifically here in Denton, the report says that there is not really any real pollution

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 or greenhouse gas benefits from keeping the net energy metering policy because Denton

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 Municipal Electric already has power purchase agreements.

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 That is not true because every time somebody brings on more solar energy on their rooftop,

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 they are adding renewable energy to the grid.

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 The net total of renewable energy across the state does increase.

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 By stopping that increase here in Denton, we are, in effect, preventing future growth

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 of renewables in the county.

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 So for these reasons, environment taxes is opposed to a change from the metering.

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 Thank you.

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 Thank you.

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 Great.

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 So we will continue with a presentation on the item, and we have some out of town guests

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 today doing that presentation for us.

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 Yes ma'am.

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 Good afternoon, Madam Chair, committee members.

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 I'm Bill Shepard with DME.

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 And before I introduce who's going to be doing the presentation, I just wanted to remind

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 everybody about the conversations that we've had about a year ago.

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 We came through and talked about the solar program, as well as the green sense program,

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 and made a couple of recommendations back then, and with feedback from you all, feedback

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 from the PUB, and feedback from some council members, we sort of backed up, backed up and

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 regrouped a little bit, and we did hear a lot about the value of solar.

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 We want to see what the value of solar is here at Denton.

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 So with that, we commissioned the same company that did the value of solar study for Austin

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 Energy, and Ms. Jill Schupbach is here with that company, NUGEN, to go over those results.

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 You've already got the report, as well, that was a conclusion of the study.

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 And at the end, we'll have our staff recommendations, and I'll come up and talk about those.

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 And what we're hoping for is to get your support moving forward with that.

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 And also, if I could ask to hold questions until the end, that way we'll get through

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 the presentation.

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 It's not a terribly long presentation, but that way we can sort of have a good two-way

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 conversation.

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 All right, Jill.

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 Thank you.

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 Thank you for having me.

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 Okay, so today we'll cover the value of solar methodology, the components that we looked

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 at.

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 We'll review the findings of our research and our analysis.

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 We'll look at some bill impacts and then staff recommendations.

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 So the value of solar represents the energy purchased from a customer that's valued above

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 the avoided cost, based on utilities policies.

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 The value of solar methodology has three components.

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 The avoided cost, which is your left column, the middle column, which is societal benefits,

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 and the last column, which is policy-driven incentives.

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 The avoided cost column, this is the cost, the actual instant cost that Denton receive,

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 or the avoided cost that Denton has, the savings that they have, by not having to buy any of

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 the additional power, because the customer is now generating their own power.

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 Avoided costs over the years have been calculated many ways.

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 This has been around since the '70s from some federal legislation.

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 So of the many ways you can look at it, we've calculated it two ways.

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 We've looked at the ERCOT market, because Denton is in the ERCOT market, and we also

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 looked at Denton's existing solar purchase power agreements.

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 The second piece of that is societal benefits.

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 This is the benefit of not emitting more greenhouse gases or more carbon, and in societal benefits,

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 there's not a federal market for greenhouse gases or a state market, but there are other

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 ways to measure it.

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 There's multiple groups that have measured it, including the federal government.

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 There is a market in the Northeast for greenhouse gases also, and depending on the study, the

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 benefit of not emitting another ton of carbon varies from one cent to eight cents per kilowatt

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 hour.

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 The policy-driven incentives part, there are state and federal policies that support rooftop

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 solar and renewables and solar generation, but this part is more driven on local policy

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 and what Denton's local policies and city council policies are.

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 So for example, Denton's already 100% renewable, and that's based on city council policy and

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 decisions that city council has made.

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 Denton has also, for over a decade, been incentivizing rooftop solar through their rebates and their

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 net billing programs.

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 So first, we'll talk about avoided costs.

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 Just for our visual understanding, if you look at the graph first, the green line is

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 how solar generates throughout the 24 hours of the day.

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 You can see it peaks during lunch when the sun is the strongest.

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 The blue line represents the ERCAT market, and when it peaks, it tends to peak late afternoon

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 and into the early evening.

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 As I said, we looked at the avoided costs, we did it two different ways.

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 The first way we looked at the ERCAT market was an hourly analysis.

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 We looked at when solar was generating.

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 We used NREL's PVWatts calculator for their load sheet, and we looked at ERCAT hourly

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 pricing and compared the two to come up with an avoided cost.

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 And that avoided cost is seven cents per kilowatt hour.

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 Next, we also looked at Denton's existing purchased power contracts for solar, because

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 that's what Denton's already paying for solar power.

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 And when you look at the average of those contracts, it averages about four cents.

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 For societal benefits, again, remember, this is the cost of not emitting another ton of

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 carbon or greenhouse gases.

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 As I said, there's a variety of studies depending on who you look at.

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 The market in the northeast, it's called Reggie, they estimated about $15 a ton.

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 The EPA recently estimated $190 per ton, if you convert that into dollars per kilowatt

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 hour.

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 It varies from about one cents to eight cents a kilowatt hour.

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 Denton already mitigates their emissions for the utility as a whole.

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 So they already have 100% renewable energy.

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 Therefore, if we're looking at a value of solar rate, we've assigned this zero because

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 they've already mitigated their emissions.

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 Now, all of that said, city council can make a policy decision to change this and they

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 can include, you know, really anything from one cents to eight cents if they want to add

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 that to the value of solar.

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 We're going to take a moment and have a question.

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 So I'm just wondering which one is accurate.

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 Oh, there's, yeah, one of them I put in the rounding from one cent to eight cent.

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 This one says 0.006 to 0.0770, on slide five, the one you were just on, there for the second.

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 Yeah, and I just ran with it from one cent to eight cents.

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 Oh, okay.

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 That's all.

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 I thought it was easier to understand one cent to eight cents than a lot of decimals.

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 Let's see.

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 Okay.

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 As far as policy-driven incentives, there are federal policies and state policies that

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 support renewables.

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 As far as Denton policy, we reviewed multiple policies and right now none of them support

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 the need for local renewables.

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 They do support the need for 100% renewables to balance out Denton's load.

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 So with that said, the incentive we'd add to value of solar is zero because there's

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 not a policy supporting that at the time, but again, this is city council's choice.

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 City council can make a policy to set that however they want to set it, however much

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 they want to incentivize solar.

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 It's also important to note that there are ways to incentivize rooftop solar and local

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 solar beyond just adding it into your value of solar rate.

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 You can streamline installation processes, permits, inspections, waive some of the fees

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 that customers have to pay to connect to the system, provide grants or rebates, or sometimes

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 utilities can offer low-cost loans for installation because one of the hardest things about getting

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 to be a solar customer is just that huge installation cost, that upfront cost.

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 So in summary, the value of solar has three components, the avoided costs, societal benefits,

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 policy-driven incentives.

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 For the avoided cost rate, anything from that four cent to seven cent range is reasonable

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 to use for avoided costs as far as societal benefits and policy-driven incentives.

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 We've set those at zero, but again, this is a city council decision on how much they want

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 to incentivize solar.

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 So if they want to add anything for societal benefits or if any policies come about, that

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 can be adjusted.

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 This is an example of what bills would look like.

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 This bill is for somebody that uses more energy than they produce.

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 So you can see in the top row, the usage is 1,365 kilowatt hours a month.

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 This first column is just for a standard residential customer that does not have solar installed.

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 Their bill is about $181 if you look at the bottom row.

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 The next column is the current net billing customer under dense current rates with the

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 RCA.

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 Their bill is about $140.

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 If we switch and use an avoided cost rate, this is still net billing, but we're using

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 an avoided cost rate from the PPAs of four cents.

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 Their bill is about $167.

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 If we use the ERCAP market rate, it's $154.

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 Now if we switch to one of these columns with the Purchased Power Agreement or the ERCAP

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 market, the net effect is in that bottom row is that if you use the debt and PPA for the

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 avoided cost, debt is going to have about $463 more thousand dollars that they can use

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 for other programs, which Bill will talk about shortly.

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 And if you choose the ERCAP market avoided cost, it's about $236,000.

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 So these are annual numbers.

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 Thank you Jill.

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 And so staff's recommendation would be to go ahead and implement the avoided cost based

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 on DME's, PPA's.

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 So that would be the 3.79 cents and that would go into effect October 1st.

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 What we'd also recommend is similar to how we transitioned out of the rebate, the solar

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 rebates, is we would take that savings from that change and apply that to the Green Sense

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 Incentive Programs and make that budget $463,000 more.

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 So that is staff's recommendation.

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 Do I have any questions, comments, members?

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 Oh, I do.

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 Just some general comments about the report here with me here.

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 The DEX emissions, as you saw in the presentation, are discounted as are fuel costs and other

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 externalities as well as air quality impacts of the DEC.

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 The DEC is an integral part of Denton's energy portfolio and will become even more so given

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 hotter days and more severe storms.

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 I would hope that all components of DME's energy generation be evaluated within this

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 report.

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 I have some figures between 2018 and 2023 and I don't know if the folks who wrote the

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 Value of Solar report were given these, but for the public record, between 2018 and 2023,

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 CO2 emissions from the DEC amounted to 767,536 tons which translates into 1,535,072,000 pounds.

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 As of matter 10 and 2.5 for those years, 2018 to 2023, 298,870 pounds, NOx 2,019,654 pounds

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 and VOCs 181,799 pounds.

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 I quote from the study, "Despite DME's achievement of 100% renewable energy, ongoing initiatives

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 like the city's cap underscore the importance of furthering sustainable energy goals including

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 specific targets for installed solar, distributed generation.

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 However, the study does not estimate the cost of those incentives and their impact on the

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 value of solar."

233
00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:08,460
 There's no mention of grandfathering existing installations and as you'll recall, this was

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 a matter of great concern in previous discussions.

235
00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:19,320
 The study praises distributed generation and battery storage and variable pricing structures

236
00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:26,280
 during the course of the day, however, none of these aspects were included in the study.

237
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 I did not find any data showing the amount of reduction in energy consumption per dollar

238
00:19:32,840 --> 00:19:43,720
 of Green Sense initiatives such as $1,000 in incentives equals what kind of reduction

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00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:46,860
 in energy use.

240
00:19:46,860 --> 00:19:57,920
 So those are my concerns and as a question, just in a simple nutshell, if this program

241
00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:03,600
 is adopted, what will become of net metering in DME?

242
00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:10,800
 Just, you know, as plainly as answers as possible, thanks to whomever, I mean that's...

243
00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:14,520
 Is that the only question you had or was there some questions on the front part?

244
00:20:14,520 --> 00:20:17,080
 No, no, so far that's it.

245
00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:22,840
 Okay, so DME is a net billing program, so it's very similar to the net metering other than

246
00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:27,900
 the fact that instead of netting the usage, we net the dollars.

247
00:20:27,900 --> 00:20:33,600
 So we have the amount of energy that comes to the house is charged with the retail rate

248
00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:38,640
 is for that energy, the amount of energy that comes out of that house is credited currently

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00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:43,440
 a retail plus the RCA rate going out, and then the differential is what shows up on

250
00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:45,080
 the bottom line of the bill.

251
00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:50,560
 That is still going to be the same way as far as the net billing piece, so we're going

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00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:55,160
 to charge a retail rate for the energy coming into the house, the energy coming out of the

253
00:20:55,160 --> 00:21:00,400
 house instead of doing what we're doing now, which is retail plus RCA, we're just going

254
00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:03,840
 to pay the value of solar for that energy going out of the house.

255
00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:08,240
 You're still going to get 100% of the benefit for the kilowatt hours that you use inside

256
00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:09,240
 your walls.

257
00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:10,240
 All right.

258
00:21:10,240 --> 00:21:18,860
 And is the $60 facility fee that was discussed last year, which was going to be put on solar,

259
00:21:18,860 --> 00:21:20,040
 is that dead?

260
00:21:20,040 --> 00:21:21,040
 Yes.

261
00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:22,040
 All right.

262
00:21:22,040 --> 00:21:28,560
 So in this discussion, what we did was we sort of shifted courses and looked at it from

263
00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:33,640
 a value of solar standpoint versus trying to recover our loss in those fixed costs and

264
00:21:33,640 --> 00:21:34,640
 elsewhere.

265
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:35,640
 Okay.

266
00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:40,360
 Well, I guess my biggest concern in regard to the study and the reason why I would wish

267
00:21:40,360 --> 00:21:47,080
 further review and study of what's going on is the dismissal of the DEX emissions and

268
00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:49,980
 its possible impacts.

269
00:21:49,980 --> 00:21:54,480
 So this study was just looking at the value of solar and how it impacts our programs now.

270
00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:59,780
 There's currently a study going on which is the Dent Renewable Resource Plan 2.0 and that's

271
00:21:59,780 --> 00:22:04,720
 being worked on and that's going to be brought forth probably within the next four, six months.

272
00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:08,960
 I'd still like to see something.

273
00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:18,400
 I have a problem with just the flat dismissal under societal benefits of the DEX emissions.

274
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:27,880
 They're just too big and the future is too precarious to just put that under the rug.

275
00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:28,880
 Thank you.

276
00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:29,880
 Brian, Adam?

277
00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:30,880
 Yeah.

278
00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:33,880
 I'm still trying to catch up to this.

279
00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:34,880
 Okay.

280
00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:35,880
 You want to go?

281
00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:36,880
 Go ahead, Brian.

282
00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:41,880
 So I'm aware of a lot of emerald studies that go into distributed generation, especially

283
00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:48,040
 at the local level being one of the most cost-based ways to get energy into a grid and I understand

284
00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:53,120
 that and I hear our consultants saying that a lot of this does come down to a purely policy

285
00:22:53,120 --> 00:22:58,640
 discussion about what our values are as a community and I've read through the report.

286
00:22:58,640 --> 00:23:00,740
 I see your math there.

287
00:23:00,740 --> 00:23:05,400
 I am echoing Ed's concerns about the debt is mentioned in this report as an integral

288
00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:10,240
 part of our grid and I wish at the end of the day we were looking at an apples to apples

289
00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:14,200
 comparison in our cost savings here because I understand that you do pay this one way

290
00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:20,000
 or another and this is a policy discussion about what we are willing to pay, but my issue

291
00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:25,120
 with funneling money from essentially DMA into the Greensense program, which is return

292
00:23:25,120 --> 00:23:29,920
 to residents as rebates, is we're not examining a carbon to carbon value and this is really

293
00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:34,960
 coming down to a carbon question about what type of behaviors are we looking to incentivize

294
00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:35,960
 in our city.

295
00:23:35,960 --> 00:23:42,360
 I think we're still very much reeling from winter storm Uri a couple years ago and the

296
00:23:42,360 --> 00:23:48,840
 very clear need for reliable, consistent, and localized generation to support residents

297
00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:53,120
 in crisis just from a reliability standpoint.

298
00:23:53,120 --> 00:23:58,680
 This to me, I'm not seeing where we can make that fair comparison about what that distributed

299
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:04,240
 generation does even though distributed generation is called for in this report including battery

300
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:08,880
 storage and among other things I'm not seeing this in the proposal either and I understand

301
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:12,440
 this is the second time you're coming to us for a recommendation and we don't make the

302
00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:13,440
 final decision here.

303
00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:14,440
 It's just our recommendation.

304
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:22,520
 I know that you're looking for ways to recoup some of those costs from this very cost expensive

305
00:24:22,520 --> 00:24:23,520
 energy generation.

306
00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:27,400
 It's just that for us to be able to make a decision it's we really need to see what it

307
00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:28,760
 is we're comparing.

308
00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:32,600
 So having some sort of data about what our carbon reduction just from our Greensense

309
00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:38,840
 program looks like based on what we're getting from the reliability costs and societal benefits

310
00:24:38,840 --> 00:24:43,000
 from having distributed generation across the city that would help me make a better

311
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:44,000
 decision.

312
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:48,280
 We've got into net metering and had quite a lengthy discussion in this committee about

313
00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:52,840
 what our values were there and to me this also discounts the grandfathering that we

314
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:58,680
 supported from that initiative and I'm not seeing anything that talks about how we spent

315
00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:03,520
 a long time supporting those early adopters when there was a real clear need to build

316
00:25:03,520 --> 00:25:08,920
 in renewable energy into our portfolio again this is another way that we're looking at

317
00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:13,160
 effectively taxing the people who we spend more than a decade trying to incentivize that

318
00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:14,160
 adoption.

319
00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:18,600
 I'm just not seeing where we recognize that they supported our program then and here's

320
00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:23,200
 a bait and switch on them once again and so if those components were included I think

321
00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:27,240
 that's a much easier way for us to look at this from a holistic sense.

322
00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:31,680
 I just disagree fundamentally that this is a truly representative value of the policy

323
00:25:31,680 --> 00:25:35,500
 direction we choose to go as a city.

324
00:25:35,500 --> 00:25:39,800
 So if I could just address one of the comments that he makes I think Mr. Soap made it as

325
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:47,160
 well and that's as far as the dollar value of these dollars shifting from solar to the

326
00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:48,160
 greensense program.

327
00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:54,680
 So on our previous presentation we did clearly list that out as far as the dollar savings

328
00:25:54,680 --> 00:26:00,680
 and the carbon offset for dollars spent on those programs because quite honestly the best

329
00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:05,440
 way to save carbon is to not have the energy use at all and that's what those rebate programs

330
00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:08,680
 incentivize is production and use.

331
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:13,320
 So it was a pretty clear difference between the two I don't have the slide in front of

332
00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:19,440
 me now but if you go back you can see that and I apologize that it wasn't part of this

333
00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:24,760
 slide deck but it is a clear difference between the value of those dollars going to solar

334
00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:30,560
 and the value of those dollars going to greensense.

335
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:38,200
 Yeah can you just talk a little bit about the concerns that have been expressed around

336
00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:45,360
 the equity dimensions of this that in other words we've had you've incentivized to buy

337
00:26:45,360 --> 00:26:48,600
 into this program and now the cost is going up.

338
00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:57,480
 Can you or remind us of the way you think about fairness when it comes to distribution

339
00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:02,600
 of costs for energy distribution around the city.

340
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:07,960
 Sure so right now and this is really what started this conversation over a year actually

341
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:14,520
 even prior to my arrival at DME was the fact that the amount of money that we're spending

342
00:27:14,520 --> 00:27:19,880
 both in rebates and in the net metering credits that were going to customers was being borne

343
00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:20,880
 by the rest of our customers.

344
00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:27,440
 It was being borne by the 64,000 customers that don't have solar and in order to try

345
00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:32,880
 to make that equitable we were looking more at valuing that solar coming out of those

346
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:37,760
 customers that have the rooftop and valuing it properly so it doesn't impact the rest

347
00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:40,320
 of the rate base that we have.

348
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:45,920
 And remind us how does it impact how are the others shouldering the extra cost is it from

349
00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:47,920
 the fixed infrastructure?

350
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:53,840
 For the yes so fixed infrastructure is one of the big ones so those customers that have

351
00:27:53,840 --> 00:28:00,240
 net zero or you know get a $10 credit at the end of the month or a $20 electric bill at

352
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:04,400
 the end of the month they're not paying their share of the fixed cost for the distribution

353
00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:09,600
 system for the administrative in general for the all the trucks we have on the road they're

354
00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:14,640
 not paying that fair share because that right now through a cost of service study takes

355
00:28:14,640 --> 00:28:19,280
 all those costs and distribute them amongst the customers that we have so we have 65,000

356
00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:25,360
 customers when 1,100 of those customers and it was continuing to grow and it does continue

357
00:28:25,360 --> 00:28:30,560
 still continue to grow when that number goes down the rest of those customers are having

358
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:34,560
 to make up that difference.

359
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:40,640
 Another way to think about it also is again the presentation didn't find solar power around

360
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:46,240
 four cents and if you look at what you're paying the customers we go back to that billing

361
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:53,760
 slide on here that column that says net billing customer what you're paying them now is you're

362
00:28:53,760 --> 00:29:02,000
 paying them seven cents plus that RCA so whereas them could buy a solar contract for four cents

363
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:08,400
 you're paying customers you know 10 plus cents and so who makes up that difference well your

364
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:12,960
 other customers make up that difference so it's a fair to them to pay 10 cents for this

365
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:18,560
 power when you can get it for four cents you know and if the utility as a whole or a city

366
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:22,960
 council as a whole says yes we think it's that valuable we should do it you know then that's

367
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:28,720
 fine that's what you do but there's also some utilities that say no it's cost-based everybody's

368
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:34,400
 going to pay you know what the power is worth and so that's another place you see the difference.

369
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:40,560
 I see so if I'm understanding what you're saying under the proposed plan staff's recommendation

370
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:46,800
 we're going to pay out the energy that's created put back on the grid from the house we're going

371
00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:52,720
 to pay out at four cents because that's what we could buy solar for in our PPAs.

372
00:29:52,720 --> 00:30:00,160
 Right and so and so when you have somebody like like Austin Energy and they have a little bit

373
00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:04,880
 different program you know that it's buy all sell all the customer buys 100% of the utilities if

374
00:30:04,880 --> 00:30:10,480
 they didn't have solar and then they sell the solar back to the utility a certain amount and so

375
00:30:10,480 --> 00:30:16,400
 Austin has a value of solar rate and they have an avoided cost which they used or caught which was

376
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:22,080
 around six or seven cents and then they did add on some societal benefit because they weren't 100%

377
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:29,280
 renewable and so they ended up closer to nine cents so so they put a they chose to put a higher

378
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:34,240
 value on that at the same time they're also netting that's not net metering it's not net billing

379
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:45,760
 it's buy all sell all so it's also a different metering setup does anybody have a you know put

380
00:30:45,760 --> 00:30:57,600
 it back on the direction page. Yeah and some of the some of you already mentioned the grandfathering

381
00:30:57,600 --> 00:31:03,440
 too so we had had long discussions about that we had discussions in this body we had discussions

382
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:11,120
 in PBB about it we did consult our legal staff about that and there are some equity challenges

383
00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:16,080
 with that as well because now we have one solar customer being treated different than another

384
00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:24,320
 solar customer i.e. the existing one versus anybody that comes on so we chose to not make that part of

385
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:32,640
 our recommendation. When you're ready I was going to clarify a little bit on the deck if you want

386
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:42,800
 to. We have one more question from Brandon. So if this is your full slate of recommendations

387
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:51,040
 on slide six of this slide deck we did talk about application fees, the installation process,

388
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:57,920
 grants or rebates. I know that we've removed our solar installation rebates previously is there

389
00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:05,600
 any discussion about adding possibly to the green sense program some sort of rebate that incentivizes

390
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:14,240
 solar installation at the local level? Yeah I will leave that up to to Mr. Gagne and his plans moving

391
00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:21,280
 forward. I know batteries were discussed in the past but as far as DME is concerned we're sort

392
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:26,880
 of taking that packaging those dollars that would otherwise been spent on solar and the green sense

393
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:34,160
 program and having them do what what is asked of them. Did that answer your question? Yes.

394
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:39,680
 Do you want to come on up and talk about the deck for just a minute?

395
00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:46,560
 And I will confirm with our legal team it's okay that some did his mission in our report

396
00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:52,160
 that we can talk about them. Great I'm Terry Holt the assistant general manager of DME and I just

397
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:58,720
 want to make sure in the context of the discussion you're having about the deck that we you know

398
00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:05,040
 we're as transparent as we can be about why the deck is there and what role it plays.

399
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:13,440
 You know we we are very transparent about the emissions from the deck. We publish a every month

400
00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:20,000
 a report what our carbon emissions are NOx emissions and our particular emissions are.

401
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:30,000
 How many hours we run the deck and while while we don't back away from the fact that it does

402
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:37,680
 contribute to atmospheric emissions of carbon and other pollutants the reality is is that

403
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:46,000
 the deck was originally part of the program the renewable end program in order to provide

404
00:33:46,720 --> 00:33:54,960
 a price hedge against the intermittency of renewables and the physics of the transmission

405
00:33:54,960 --> 00:34:02,960
 system is such that if we did not provide that ourselves we would be relying on some other

406
00:34:02,960 --> 00:34:09,600
 entity to provide that backup energy that that replacement energy during those intermittent

407
00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:17,120
 periods. Because as a utility we not only have a responsibility for adhering with the

408
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:23,120
 Denton renewable resource plan but to maintain the reliability of our system and to meet ERCOT

409
00:34:23,120 --> 00:34:30,960
 protocols with respect to that reliability of the overall credit. You know leaving it up to others

410
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:39,360
 would probably result in even higher emissions for that intermittency backup because the Denton

411
00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:46,400
 energy center is one of the cleanest if not the cleanest resource in the ERCOT market

412
00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:54,880
 as a gas fire generator. So again I think as Jill Bill pointed out you know these are policy

413
00:34:54,880 --> 00:35:01,440
 decisions that the council will ultimately make and certainly with with your role as an advisory

414
00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:12,560
 committee we'll take into account your wishes your guidance but the energy center again is a

415
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:19,600
 necessary evil so to speak in order to maintain the reliability that we're obligated to to provide

416
00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:27,120
 to the ERCOT grid and it's done in a way that is as clean as possible because of the nature of the

417
00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:32,000
 technology that we've employed. So just want to make sure that that was on the record and then

418
00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:40,240
 you all understand that while there is emissions we do it as as responsible a manner as we possibly

419
00:35:40,240 --> 00:35:47,360
 can. I want a question um because I don't think anyone was questioning the deck we were just

420
00:35:47,360 --> 00:35:52,080
 yeah explaining the emissions since this is the environmental and sustainability committee that's

421
00:35:52,080 --> 00:36:01,360
 kind of like our our niche so it was worth mentioning. So if the if more people so like

422
00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:07,840
 as of today no one else installs rooftop solar like we were just left with whatever is out there

423
00:36:07,840 --> 00:36:17,920
 what does that mean for like our PPAs or the deck does that mean more the deck is turned on more

424
00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:23,760
 does that mean that we're using that more frequently to put energy into the grid to make

425
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:32,160
 up for that absence of because as our city grows the need for more energy grows so when people add

426
00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:37,760
 rooftop solar that kind of helps I mean it doesn't make up for the energy we need with the growth but

427
00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:45,600
 it helps right it balances that out a little bit so if if we basically as our first commenter said

428
00:36:45,600 --> 00:36:53,600
 kill solar and didn't what does that mean for us relying on these other um these other things to

429
00:36:53,600 --> 00:37:01,920
 use that create more emissions and carbon in our local atmosphere. Yeah so the question you're

430
00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:09,280
 asking is a very good one and we are facing significant low growth which means our electrical

431
00:37:09,920 --> 00:37:18,160
 supply has to increase. You probably saw we recently signed another 100 megawatt solar contract

432
00:37:18,160 --> 00:37:26,720
 a 15-year contract for 100 megawatts of additional solar and we will continue to add to that portfolio

433
00:37:26,720 --> 00:37:34,640
 of renewable resources to ensure that on an annual basis we're 100 percent renewable. Now will that

434
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:44,000
 meet the reliability requirements that we are mandated to follow from ERCOT? No it won't and

435
00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:51,280
 there was legislation that was passed last session for renewable resources intermittent renewable

436
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:59,680
 resources that are started up post-2027 with respect to farming of that energy because of

437
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:07,600
 the intermittency and so when we bring the dental renewable resource plan to the council for the new

438
00:38:07,600 --> 00:38:14,080
 dental renewable resource plan or version 2.0 that will be at one of the major issues that will have

439
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:20,240
 to be debated publicly about how we want to move forward to meet the growth requirements of our

440
00:38:20,240 --> 00:38:27,120
 of our community as well as the reliability requirements of the community and of ERCOT.

441
00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:34,800
 So not giving a direct answer but we do continue to always scale in additional renewable resources.

442
00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:43,440
 There is also you know we have a responsibility to provide the lowest rates possible to the

443
00:38:43,440 --> 00:38:51,840
 65,000 customers we serve and so as Jill has pointed out you know we can buy utility scale

444
00:38:51,840 --> 00:39:01,440
 solar much cheaper than we can buy energy from rooftop solar and so that has to be taken into

445
00:39:01,440 --> 00:39:06,480
 account as well. What we want to incentivize and encourage people to put rooftop solar on their

446
00:39:06,480 --> 00:39:12,560
 on their homes it's for the benefit of the homeowner because it offsets their utility bill

447
00:39:12,560 --> 00:39:18,560
 and that value still will exist. I have one more question for you while you're here or maybe for

448
00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:27,120
 for anyone really because we're we're talking about the what you can buy solar for right and then so

449
00:39:27,120 --> 00:39:34,000
 and you may have mentioned this our transmission cost included in that because I know they are

450
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:40,400
 significant and so what is the difference say so when we have our our PPA solar that we're paying

451
00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:46,960
 for four cents right and then a homeowner we're paying six cents or eight cents I can't remember

452
00:39:47,520 --> 00:39:53,120
 but is that a transmission I mean do we pay transmission costs on that as well

453
00:39:53,120 --> 00:40:00,000
 because it goes directly into the grid so I mean I feel like there's like this amount of money

454
00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:07,280
 in transmission cost and distribution that isn't accounted for or it may be I'm just

455
00:40:07,280 --> 00:40:12,640
 so we did we looked at the two avoided costs right we looked at one which is the purchase

456
00:40:12,640 --> 00:40:17,040
 agreements which comes into the market that's four cents when we looked at the one that's

457
00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:21,360
 based on the ERCAT market where we did an hourly analysis let's say we had to buy all this from the

458
00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:27,600
 ERCAT market we didn't have these purchase power agreements that one that's the one that was seven

459
00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:35,280
 cents and that one has energy costs in it has ancillary costs in it and it has the transmission

460
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:42,400
 or CP cost included in it and then everything's adjusted for losses also because if you generated

461
00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:48,080
 a kilowatt hour at your house and use it it's if you if you're generating that at the grid it might

462
00:40:48,080 --> 00:40:52,640
 be 1.1 kilowatt hours and because you're generating where you're using it you're avoiding losses so

463
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:57,520
 there's a credit for that in there also so it does have a credit for losses across the system in

464
00:40:57,520 --> 00:41:06,640
 transmission. I don't know maybe I missed it in the report but do you know what impact this would

465
00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:13,440
 have on the overall DME users rate this $463,000 savings that would go to the green sense program?

466
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:22,800
 Are you talking about for example I know we're also going to be raising our DME rates right

467
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:26,480
 does this have any direct impact on those rates through these savings?

468
00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:32,080
 So we are not pocketing those savings so to speak we're transferring into another program so it's

469
00:41:32,080 --> 00:41:36,480
 still going to be a cost but it's going to be a cost that's going to go towards a program that

470
00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:46,320
 we feel is a little bit more better bang for the buck. Yeah and if I can speak to the killing of

471
00:41:46,320 --> 00:41:54,800
 the solar nothing here is suggesting that we kill solar we still allow so systems to connect they

472
00:41:54,800 --> 00:42:01,280
 may be more incentivized to now couple their solar with a battery so instead of sending that energy

473
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:05,680
 to us for that cost they're now sending it to their battery and they're using it at different

474
00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:12,000
 times of the day so that will still continue to happen we still see systems coming online we

475
00:42:12,000 --> 00:42:17,760
 still see systems coming online on other utilities that that don't have as lucrative a program as

476
00:42:17,760 --> 00:42:27,040
 DME has had. Okay members do you have a recommendation? It does say it does ask us

477
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:35,440
 if we have any direction regarding the value of solar so so there are these recommendations

478
00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:44,320
 one and two. Does anybody for one or two or have a third option maybe you would like to send a council?

479
00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:50,560
 Adam you go first. Well I'm in favor of both.

480
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:54,880
 I do think that the

481
00:42:54,880 --> 00:43:03,440
 value that we're talking about Michael's yelling at me to yell um I do think that we might be

482
00:43:04,160 --> 00:43:11,280
 undervaluing again our societal costs here and I don't believe that the 3.7 cents necessarily

483
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:16,720
 captures all of that I would be more comfortable with a number closer to six or seven personally.

484
00:43:16,720 --> 00:43:23,760
 I again I want to read back again to make sure that I understand our carbon to carbon savings

485
00:43:23,760 --> 00:43:29,120
 that we're talking about in transferring these savings from DME's costs to the green sense program

486
00:43:29,120 --> 00:43:35,600
 we have more discussions on that later today as well and I recognize how valuable that program

487
00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:41,040
 has been and what an injection of funds would do for it it just hurts me again to see that

488
00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:46,480
 14 years we told people this is our policy this is direction we'd like you to go this is how we'd

489
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:52,080
 like you to support your community in your own home to bait and switch like that and pull the

490
00:43:52,080 --> 00:44:01,360
 rug away just as we were recommending for the net metering program it feels really it just doesn't

491
00:44:01,360 --> 00:44:04,400
 feel great it doesn't feel great to me and I don't even own somewhere on my roof I'm more than

492
00:44:04,400 --> 00:44:09,040
 comfortable paying for people like Ed who do I really am and to me I think that it is valuable

493
00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:15,200
 to have that in our local grid regardless of what it does cost seven cents to me doesn't feel

494
00:44:15,200 --> 00:44:20,160
 egregious at all and I know that that impacts our savings to other programs but I feel that the

495
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:26,640
 reliability of having our own ability to generate energy and you know maybe this is a discussion

496
00:44:26,640 --> 00:44:31,600
 where we if we go with this recommendation we're talking more about local batteries and

497
00:44:31,600 --> 00:44:37,520
 local energy savings but this just doesn't get me there I would like to see a higher number

498
00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:46,560
 so just uh so you would like on the recommendation okay so a rate of six cents

499
00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:54,560
 again we we're not setting the policy right now I'm purely advisory and so I don't want to

500
00:44:54,560 --> 00:44:58,240
 give you a number without looking at your math and I know you've done a lot of math on this

501
00:44:58,240 --> 00:45:02,880
 and I don't want to suggest a number without my own data right I would like to see something that

502
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:08,960
 puts our our societal and policy value of solar higher than what you put it here at you know zero

503
00:45:08,960 --> 00:45:18,240
 three seventy nine dollars so I know that today's the day that we are doing recommendations for city

504
00:45:18,240 --> 00:45:24,000
 council but as far as this group is it something that DME could come back and talk about the

505
00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:32,560
 what that would look like for the say six nights I thought the question was going to come up okay

506
00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:43,600
 so uh what we did so so uh we added one alternative that just fell in the middle

507
00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:47,600
 between the four cents and seven cents and that's this last column that's a blended rate

508
00:45:48,640 --> 00:45:49,600
 and so you can see that

509
00:45:49,600 --> 00:45:58,640
 I'm not sure you guys see the mouse oh yeah okay so the seven cents that's the

510
00:45:58,640 --> 00:46:03,680
 the ERCOT remember I said that you would recommend between this four cents and seven cents based on

511
00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:09,680
 the avoided cost that's the ERCOT and then this four cents that's the PPA rate and you average

512
00:46:09,680 --> 00:46:15,440
 them it's about five and a half cents so we just did a simple average of the of the bookends of

513
00:46:15,440 --> 00:46:19,440
 the avoided cost and that's more in the middle if that's something you're more comfortable with

514
00:46:19,440 --> 00:46:24,960
 and this might be a question for you I apologize um the way that we're able to acquire PPAs versus

515
00:46:24,960 --> 00:46:29,520
 how that's weighted against the general ERCOT grid why is there discrepancy in those numbers

516
00:46:29,520 --> 00:46:37,600
 just as a financial um well the the PPAs and Terry may have to help me but

517
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:46,240
 PPAs for solar usually are around two three four cents is what we've seen they're huge installations

518
00:46:46,240 --> 00:46:50,480
 they don't have any ongoing you know fuel costs there's very little maintenance and things like

519
00:46:50,480 --> 00:47:00,480
 that so on an energy basis they are much more affordable um in in the market in ERCOT's market

520
00:47:00,480 --> 00:47:05,840
 when you're buying power it's a mix of you've got coal and gas and renewables and who knows what

521
00:47:07,040 --> 00:47:11,680
 but in the market you know the part of this too is you know solar's generating in the middle of the

522
00:47:11,680 --> 00:47:17,040
 day and when we need when we need power and power cost of the highest is at the end of the day

523
00:47:17,040 --> 00:47:24,080
 so it's just a mix of like the hourly profiles of them and of what units are feeding into it

524
00:47:24,080 --> 00:47:31,760
 so this PPA cost reflects DME's specific average solar PPA exactly because I know we have a number

525
00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:39,280
 of them and your ERCOT cost there represents an average of the market rate per kilowatt hour if

526
00:47:39,280 --> 00:47:44,400
 we had to go to ERCOT and buy that power instead of the customer generating it it's that seven

527
00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:49,840
 cents but because previous policies that has purchased power agreements for all of their

528
00:47:49,840 --> 00:47:58,080
 energy and that's the four cents but that's very helpful thank you I have one other question just

529
00:47:58,080 --> 00:48:06,080
 because you did mention in the presentation that the Denton renewable resource plan is being

530
00:48:06,080 --> 00:48:12,080
 looked at again and is coming back and I know the old one I do believe some of that solar was

531
00:48:12,080 --> 00:48:22,880
 included and my question is are we making this decision a little ahead of the game so like what

532
00:48:22,880 --> 00:48:29,440
 happens if they come back and they're like you need this solar and you need so much more solar

533
00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:37,280
 localized because it benefits and you know directly our renewable resource plan so like

534
00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:43,280
 and then we have to like backtrack so I'm just I'm just trying to understand why you want a

535
00:48:43,280 --> 00:48:49,760
 decision today when that plan is still being discussed and that may not be for this I don't

536
00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:54,720
 I think it's a good question but but I think I think the answer is real simple

537
00:48:54,720 --> 00:49:06,640
 that even if we had a huge incentive to incentivize rooftop solar it's not going to move the needle on

538
00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:13,680
 the big picture of the community's needs for energy and renewable energy so I don't think

539
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:18,880
 it's premature for you to make this decision a recommendation it really will have great impact

540
00:49:19,760 --> 00:49:28,880
 on what we do the plan as we're developing it will include the value proposition from rooftop

541
00:49:28,880 --> 00:49:36,160
 solar in terms of the total inventory of renewable energy that's used to serve the city and the

542
00:49:36,160 --> 00:49:43,760
 benefit of energy efficiency programs and the avoided emissions avoided energy that would have

543
00:49:43,760 --> 00:49:51,120
 been would have been needed to serve the load so again it's just it's not it's just not big enough

544
00:49:51,120 --> 00:50:01,280
 okay and last question then we're kind of going to wrap this up if you covered this I apologize

545
00:50:01,280 --> 00:50:09,600
 it's pretty simple but you mentioned the fact that non-solar customers subsidize the people who had

546
00:50:09,600 --> 00:50:17,760
 solar that's been a discussion before how is that being dealt with now it will be less of amount

547
00:50:17,760 --> 00:50:24,400
 of dollars that we're paying to those customers for the rooftop solar and those dollars will be

548
00:50:24,400 --> 00:50:30,960
 channeled to the uh the greensense program but we may we'll be paying more of an appropriate rate

549
00:50:30,960 --> 00:50:36,240
 for that solar energy coming back versus a retail plus rate that's the bigger difference is that the

550
00:50:36,240 --> 00:50:44,160
 same rate that is that like it's what point tip point one zero six five yes so right now

551
00:50:44,160 --> 00:50:48,720
 to blend it it's about ten and a half cents right that we paid for every kilowatt hour that so

552
00:50:48,720 --> 00:50:53,840
 is that going to change yes that'll change to the to the value of solar rate so it'd be the three

553
00:50:53,840 --> 00:51:01,120
 point three point seven nine in the recommendation

554
00:51:03,200 --> 00:51:07,920
 yeah so all these rates have been presented are just what is then going to pay the customer

555
00:51:07,920 --> 00:51:15,200
 when the customer sells them power so that will be the that the point zero three seven nine is

556
00:51:15,200 --> 00:51:25,760
 what a solar owner of what will be the return for for what they send to us yes again every

557
00:51:25,760 --> 00:51:31,680
 kilowatt hour they displace on their side of the meter is a full retail offset

558
00:51:34,160 --> 00:51:41,600
 and just want to say because i said i'm in favor both i didn't say why so what's going on in my mind

559
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:47,200
 here is folks we haven't mentioned because i do remember our previous conversations about the

560
00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:54,800
 greater bang for the buck other ways of avoiding energy use in the city this would be a significant

561
00:51:54,800 --> 00:51:59,600
 influx of money to that so i'm thinking about people in low-income communities in the city of

562
00:51:59,600 --> 00:52:07,360
 dinn who could benefit from this this extra money to insulate their homes or whatever

563
00:52:07,360 --> 00:52:12,080
 and as things get hotter you know they're the ones who are going to maybe beat this

564
00:52:12,080 --> 00:52:17,440
 come up so i do think there's equity issues to be considered that are built into this i know i i

565
00:52:17,440 --> 00:52:22,960
 really wish we could grandfather too it sounds like we can't but that's why i in favor of this maybe we

566
00:52:22,960 --> 00:52:28,320
 could move the number up a little bit or something that makes trades interesting i didn't know we

567
00:52:28,320 --> 00:52:36,480
 could do that something like that i mean i just want to recall we had decided we could as a

568
00:52:36,480 --> 00:52:43,040
 community have a lot greater impact for the goals and values that we have by putting that money into

569
00:52:43,040 --> 00:52:48,160
 this program times have changed we've got all these big ppas going on that right so i think we've been

570
00:52:48,160 --> 00:52:54,400
 paying too high of a rate we're still doing that billing with those trades so you're still buying

571
00:52:54,400 --> 00:53:04,400
 that energy back so that's just me that's why i was in favor of it okay do you have recommendation

572
00:53:04,400 --> 00:53:10,640
 are you good with the limited rate that was shown or are are you not wanting to make a

573
00:53:10,640 --> 00:53:17,920
 recommend for either one of these so you're not in favor of either of those okay you're in favor of

574
00:53:17,920 --> 00:53:26,160
 both of them yeah right again we are purely an advisory body yeah you take this to puv and you

575
00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:32,480
 take this to council and ultimately this is council's decision but i personally would not

576
00:53:32,480 --> 00:53:38,320
 feel comfortable without some recognition of the people who we've led on effectively for more than

577
00:53:38,320 --> 00:53:43,680
 a decade to say this is what we wanted you to do and these are the financial choices into you know

578
00:53:43,680 --> 00:53:49,200
 2030 financial plans that you're going to invest yourself into this feels like we're doing those

579
00:53:49,200 --> 00:53:55,200
 people wrong who said you know we see the need for local generation we see the need for renewable

580
00:53:55,200 --> 00:54:01,200
 energy and we want to support the city in this way i know that it costs us as a community but

581
00:54:01,200 --> 00:54:05,520
 if this is a conversation about how much do we value that i just don't think that does them justice

582
00:54:05,520 --> 00:54:11,760
 so i would like to see closer to the blended rate from our recommendation

583
00:54:13,840 --> 00:54:18,880
 and you're okay with the blended rate as well well that's not on our slide could you go back

584
00:54:18,880 --> 00:54:24,240
 to the blended rate because i don't think that included what was nice about the recommendation

585
00:54:24,240 --> 00:54:31,440
 that showed us the impact on green sense budget yeah what would that so it would be in between the

586
00:54:31,440 --> 00:54:41,040
 236 000 and 463 000 it's in the bio right here okay 350 350 000 that would go to green sense

587
00:54:41,840 --> 00:54:51,040
 i mean that's a decent compromise for me i could get on board with that okay so maybe when you go

588
00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:57,680
 back to council we pretty much are kind of undecided but moving more towards the the blended rate if

589
00:54:57,680 --> 00:55:03,920
 there was something to be discussed grandfathering is still a big issue for this body i know you said

590
00:55:03,920 --> 00:55:09,600
 that you know legal had some issues with the equality of it i would like i have some more

591
00:55:09,600 --> 00:55:14,800
 legal questions for those who bought the solar and thought they were getting something they may have

592
00:55:14,800 --> 00:55:22,240
 something else to say about it legally so i don't i don't really i feel like it's still a big issue

593
00:55:22,240 --> 00:55:29,520
 for this body like grandfathering so if when you bring the recommendations from this body to council

594
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:36,800
 please explain that to them i'm sure the conversation will continue on grandfathering

595
00:55:36,800 --> 00:55:39,600
 so if i can if i can just make sure

596
00:55:39,600 --> 00:55:48,400
 thank you so uh the blended rate is the

597
00:55:48,400 --> 00:56:03,520
 0.054 so are you comfortable making our recommendation 0.054 with that differential going to

598
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:10,560
 the greensense program and that's what we can modify moving forward with your support

599
00:56:10,560 --> 00:56:20,560
 um i don't think we need to vote i think it's just

600
00:56:20,560 --> 00:56:30,480
 i don't i don't suppose that's a direction yeah my recommendation would be is just each member

601
00:56:30,480 --> 00:56:34,880
 provide their direction and they'll capture that and move forward yeah i think we pretty much have

602
00:56:34,880 --> 00:56:42,240
 done that i i'm a little uncomfortable with this going forward one because of the um

603
00:56:42,240 --> 00:56:50,640
 the dip renewable plan coming forward and also the the grandfathering being left out and i'm afraid

604
00:56:50,640 --> 00:56:55,680
 that if we say okay i'm in favor of these recommendations that conversation is going

605
00:56:55,680 --> 00:57:00,800
 to get thrown by the wayside and we'll just be you know moving forward so

606
00:57:00,800 --> 00:57:06,320
 that that's me personally i think adam said he's okay

607
00:57:06,320 --> 00:57:14,320
 brand but blended rate feels more comfortable to me and it does still benefit the greensense program

608
00:57:14,320 --> 00:57:19,840
 which we've had for long conversations about the larger community benefit of that program and so i

609
00:57:19,840 --> 00:57:26,480
 i personally feel like that would be my suggestion okay all right so i mean if if a race going forward

610
00:57:26,480 --> 00:57:32,160
 i would prefer the blended right up there likewise and too so i think that you have a pretty okay

611
00:57:32,160 --> 00:57:36,480
 and then i'll mention the the the conference uh the conversation that we had on the grandfather

612
00:57:36,480 --> 00:57:41,280
 and again i i would be very surprised if it didn't come up in both bodies coming up okay

613
00:57:41,280 --> 00:57:46,160
 all right well thank you thank you for your presentation and time thank you we appreciate it

614
00:57:46,880 --> 00:57:56,080
 and we will um go ahead and move on to what was the receipt report and home discussion about

615
00:57:56,080 --> 00:58:02,000
 commercial organics pilot program thank you all so much for for waiting we appreciate your time

616
00:58:02,000 --> 00:58:17,840
 in there is it brandy are you giving it yes it's a brady meal

617
00:58:32,000 --> 00:58:40,080
 all right well we'll get started good afternoon madam chair and

618
00:58:40,080 --> 00:58:46,880
 my name is brady neal i'm the administration manager for solid waste recycling and i'm here

619
00:58:46,880 --> 00:58:53,440
 today just to give you an update on our commercial organics pilot so starting just with some background

620
00:58:53,440 --> 00:59:00,640
 in 2021 solid waste adopted a conference of solid waste management strategy that helped plan out the

621
00:59:00,640 --> 00:59:07,440
 next 75 plus years for us giving us some diversion goals you may have heard these goals but it's 30

622
00:59:07,440 --> 00:59:14,960
 diversion by 2030 40 by 40 and 75 by 75 as a part of that comprehensive solid waste management

623
00:59:14,960 --> 00:59:21,120
 strategy our consultants conducted a waste characterization study this waste characterization

624
00:59:21,120 --> 00:59:26,080
 study took samples from residential homes multi-family properties and commercial properties

625
00:59:26,880 --> 00:59:31,920
 and the results told us that of that waste stream about 32 percent of it was considered

626
00:59:31,920 --> 00:59:36,400
 food waste so that's pre-consumer and post-consumer that is a huge number

627
00:59:36,400 --> 00:59:43,680
 so just to give a quick background some of the things that we're doing prior to the pilot that

628
00:59:43,680 --> 00:59:49,920
 we just put into place we offer a commercial organics program to our commercial businesses

629
00:59:49,920 --> 00:59:56,320
 it is a front-load service just like this picture here we have several customers it is mostly big

630
00:59:56,320 --> 01:00:03,440
 box stores like walmart sams morrison millings those types of places we do only collect pre-consumer

631
01:00:03,440 --> 01:00:08,000
 food waste which is just their raw fruits and vegetables there is some bread that goes into

632
01:00:08,000 --> 01:00:13,440
 those dumpsters as well that gets delivered straight over to beneficial reuse it goes into

633
01:00:13,440 --> 01:00:20,160
 their windrows like a compost and gets put right there so in last year fiscal year 22 23 we were

634
01:00:20,160 --> 01:00:27,520
 able to deliver 792 tons of food waste to them and then moving on to residential and most of

635
01:00:27,520 --> 01:00:32,160
 you are probably aware but we have a curbside yard waste cart so outside of just putting grass

636
01:00:32,160 --> 01:00:37,760
 clippings and small branches you can also put your pre-consumer food waste items in there as well

637
01:00:37,760 --> 01:00:43,920
 we at that level of residential it's mostly you know most people preparing fruits and vegetables

638
01:00:43,920 --> 01:00:49,680
 it just goes in those things like that so nothing that has been cooked no graces no fats we do

639
01:00:49,680 --> 01:00:54,960
 introduce some eggshells from time to time some coffee grounds and we have about a 26

640
01:00:54,960 --> 01:00:58,800
 percent participation rate for our residents using that bin for that purpose

641
01:00:58,800 --> 01:01:05,200
 so it brings us to our commercial organics pilot so knowing we again we have about 32

642
01:01:05,200 --> 01:01:10,960
 percent of food waste that is missing being diverted from the landfill so that's kind of

643
01:01:10,960 --> 01:01:16,080
 where we want to introduce post-consumer so we already had a couple of programs in place

644
01:01:16,080 --> 01:01:20,560
 for our pre-consumer we know that this is probably where we're missing the mark a lot of people are

645
01:01:20,560 --> 01:01:25,280
 cooking their foods and they have those leftovers that they're not able to use and they're just

646
01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:30,800
 scraping the plate so that's the material that we wanted to capture i just wanted to point out that

647
01:01:30,800 --> 01:01:34,480
 none of this would be possible without our partnership with wastewater and environmental

648
01:01:34,480 --> 01:01:39,840
 services of course and some important information to talk about is our existing infrastructure so

649
01:01:39,840 --> 01:01:45,200
 we're really lucky that we own and operate our own landfill and our collections and wastewater

650
01:01:45,200 --> 01:01:50,080
 has their own treatment plan as well so they have a digester they have all of the underground

651
01:01:50,080 --> 01:01:55,040
 piping that they need and they have the placement so all of it kind of starts us at a net zero

652
01:01:55,040 --> 01:01:59,840
 starting out you know not needing a lot of funding to get this pilot off the ground

653
01:01:59,840 --> 01:02:03,840
 there is some grant funding so the north central texas council governments

654
01:02:03,840 --> 01:02:08,320
 awarded us a grant to help us pay for some items that we'll talk about in a little bit

655
01:02:08,320 --> 01:02:14,320
 so i want to introduce you to our customers so our customers are going to be the downtown

656
01:02:14,320 --> 01:02:20,320
 fry street area you may have seen this before we're back in 2019 we removed all the dumpsters from

657
01:02:20,320 --> 01:02:25,200
 the streets and we gave them all carts so just like residential they're all provided a trash

658
01:02:25,200 --> 01:02:30,800
 and a residential cart this is a premium service they're collected multiple times a day depending

659
01:02:30,800 --> 01:02:36,320
 on their level of tier that they are signed up to pay for up to five times some are three times so

660
01:02:36,320 --> 01:02:43,120
 we do go out there multiple times there's about 150 customers that are on valet services and through

661
01:02:43,120 --> 01:02:48,560
 this implementation of switching them over from dumpsters to carts we're able to build a really

662
01:02:48,560 --> 01:02:52,560
 good relationship with them as well so we knew that we already had and and with the main street

663
01:02:52,560 --> 01:02:58,720
 association they actually wrote us a letter of recommendation as we applied for our grant so

664
01:02:58,720 --> 01:03:04,000
 thinking about those 150 customers you know who is going to be having the most food waste was kind of

665
01:03:04,000 --> 01:03:09,760
 the question that we had to ask ourselves about 50 of them were bars and restaurants and then taking

666
01:03:09,760 --> 01:03:15,440
 it even just a step further you know there are some bars that serve bar food but mostly we knew

667
01:03:15,440 --> 01:03:20,000
 restaurants were probably the main one producing them the biggest amount of post-consumer food

668
01:03:20,000 --> 01:03:25,200
 waste is what we were trying to capture so the restaurants became our focus in this area and

669
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:33,760
 there is about 30 of those between both areas so I want to introduce you to our equipment so some of

670
01:03:33,760 --> 01:03:38,160
 the new equipment that was purchased with grant funding so again this is actually wastewater you

671
01:03:38,160 --> 01:03:43,520
 probably recognize in the background so they had the space for us but we had to buy a couple things

672
01:03:43,520 --> 01:03:48,880
 to get the program going so these post-consumer food waste is going to end up in the digester

673
01:03:48,880 --> 01:03:54,640
 and it needed to be grinded up because now we're going to introduce bones and raw meat and any

674
01:03:54,640 --> 01:03:59,280
 table scraps pizza all those things they can't just be entered into the windmill without going

675
01:03:59,280 --> 01:04:03,760
 through this process first so we had to purchase a grinder you can see it's right on top it's the

676
01:04:03,760 --> 01:04:09,280
 final piece and so it's really simple you open up the lid drop the food in I have a video for y'all

677
01:04:09,280 --> 01:04:16,720
 and then it's going to hit several blades with 24 teeth on each blade and it will break it down

678
01:04:16,720 --> 01:04:21,040
 to about a quarter inch and so breaks it down to a little bit of pieces and then it will push it

679
01:04:21,040 --> 01:04:25,600
 through so actually goes down to the bottom piece which is the pump the pump will feed it right to

680
01:04:25,600 --> 01:04:31,760
 the digester um brandy we have a question yes you said windrow is that is that the facility where

681
01:04:31,760 --> 01:04:37,840
 they make the diamond dirt yes okay thank you thank you and please stop me you have a question

682
01:04:37,840 --> 01:04:44,480
 i'm a fast talker all right so looking at the supply so this is for our customers we wanted

683
01:04:44,480 --> 01:04:49,280
 to set them up for success give them everything that they needed so the first thing that you're

684
01:04:49,280 --> 01:04:54,880
 looking at here is their kitchen bin so this bin was meant to be used inside of the restaurant

685
01:04:54,880 --> 01:04:58,880
 really for them just to store material throughout the day so as they're prepping in the kitchen or

686
01:04:58,880 --> 01:05:02,880
 cleaning off tables they can put them in those buckets so it's a five gallon bucket and there

687
01:05:02,880 --> 01:05:07,120
 are some educational material on it that we'll talk about next and so that's meant to be inside

688
01:05:07,120 --> 01:05:11,840
 it does have a lid there is best practices that's listed on there where they should store it to

689
01:05:11,840 --> 01:05:17,040
 reduce odor and those kind of things as well and then the second one is the outside bin so that's

690
01:05:17,040 --> 01:05:22,560
 going to go right beside the trash bin and beside the recycling bin what you can't see here is this

691
01:05:22,560 --> 01:05:28,320
 lock or this car is locked so there is a lock on it that's just going to prevent any scavenging or

692
01:05:28,320 --> 01:05:34,960
 if it accidentally gets knocked over or whether somebody just walking by on a bad day none of

693
01:05:34,960 --> 01:05:39,120
 those things would get spilled out onto the ground so each business would be provided with

694
01:05:39,120 --> 01:05:43,360
 the indoor cart or the indoor bin and then keys or the outdoor cart

695
01:05:43,360 --> 01:05:50,880
 so some of the education and outreach that was performed so outreach we went out door to door had

696
01:05:50,880 --> 01:05:57,440
 conversations with each of the 30 restaurants really wanted to outline them with exactly what to expect

697
01:05:57,440 --> 01:06:03,600
 you know what is the program items are acceptable how long the pilot is going to run for so we gave

698
01:06:03,600 --> 01:06:09,920
 them all flyer with all of that information was able to talk to each of them and give the material

699
01:06:09,920 --> 01:06:17,040
 everybody was presented with a poster which is on this far side the poster is large it's 24 by 16

700
01:06:17,040 --> 01:06:22,400
 so it's really big we didn't know how they would handle that but some people wanted multiple posters

701
01:06:22,400 --> 01:06:27,520
 so it's good that they wanted to see it and then some of the educational material as you can see

702
01:06:27,520 --> 01:06:32,880
 everything is very consistent and all saves the same message it tells them exactly what they can

703
01:06:32,880 --> 01:06:38,720
 put in the car and what they shouldn't put in the car so those prohibited items obviously is styrofoam

704
01:06:38,720 --> 01:06:44,080
 plastic bags those kind of things you don't want but really anything that is food it can go inside

705
01:06:44,080 --> 01:06:48,960
 that cart and again giving them those best practices and you know how to wash their container how to

706
01:06:48,960 --> 01:06:54,400
 manage it to to prevent any rodents or whatnot on the inside and then we saw the waste and recycling

707
01:06:54,400 --> 01:07:02,880
 cleaning organics bins weekly i think we do it weekly all of any of those messes

708
01:07:02,880 --> 01:07:09,920
 so looking at the collection piece of it so again you know with our existing infrastructure

709
01:07:09,920 --> 01:07:14,880
 we already have valet staff they're already in the area they're down there multiple times a day

710
01:07:14,880 --> 01:07:20,160
 so we have the equipment to handle it we have the trucks this is harvey he's our crew leader kind

711
01:07:20,160 --> 01:07:24,720
 of ran that show and we did have to do a practice run because we want to make sure it worked before

712
01:07:24,720 --> 01:07:29,440
 we started which is the video that i have for you so i'm going to try to see if it will play

713
01:07:29,440 --> 01:07:42,720
 i'm gonna mute it so you don't hear me scream

714
01:07:44,960 --> 01:07:52,720
 so

715
01:08:09,920 --> 01:08:15,680
 so that was our practice round so as you can see it's it's type of a process so because we had to

716
01:08:15,680 --> 01:08:20,720
 get the grinder and the pump that thing is about eight feet in the air so it's not easy to get the

717
01:08:20,720 --> 01:08:25,520
 material up in the air so you can't see here but you can tell that there's a forklift involved

718
01:08:25,520 --> 01:08:30,720
 in that as well so there's a lot of aftermarket things that had to be added on so luckily we have

719
01:08:30,720 --> 01:08:37,120
 a great group of welders in solid waste they were able to build a catwalk and retrofit everything

720
01:08:37,120 --> 01:08:42,480
 that we needed to safely get up there and manage that material so just talking about contamination

721
01:08:42,480 --> 01:08:46,720
 a little bit so in the very beginning as we started we went out introduced everybody to the

722
01:08:46,720 --> 01:08:52,480
 program everybody got started in july we initially seen a lot of pre-consumer food waste but i think

723
01:08:52,480 --> 01:08:56,480
 it's where people are putting their buckets mostly in their kitchen as they're preparing food

724
01:08:56,480 --> 01:09:02,480
 they weren't really using it as like a table scraps yet and so you can see in the pictures

725
01:09:02,480 --> 01:09:06,480
 here we have lots of bread in this one container and then below it lots of fruits and vegetables

726
01:09:07,360 --> 01:09:11,600
 we did have slight contamination maybe like a paper around a piece of bread here and there

727
01:09:11,600 --> 01:09:18,000
 or plastic bag the nice part about valet is we touch every single container so unlike residential

728
01:09:18,000 --> 01:09:22,880
 they're not collected with the you know automatic side load where they're just grabbing them going

729
01:09:22,880 --> 01:09:26,640
 we actually have staff touching the container opening the container so we're able to find any

730
01:09:26,640 --> 01:09:31,120
 contamination before it enters the truck and then also we know exactly where it's coming from

731
01:09:31,120 --> 01:09:35,120
 because the cart's right behind the business and so we can immediately go around have a

732
01:09:35,120 --> 01:09:40,000
 conversation with them and let them know so once we found out we were getting a lot of pre-consumer

733
01:09:40,000 --> 01:09:44,960
 we wanted to encourage that post-consumer so we went back out had conversations with them again

734
01:09:44,960 --> 01:09:49,120
 let them know this is the things that can go in there make sure we're very clear that you know

735
01:09:49,120 --> 01:09:54,400
 they can put table scraps we want all of those items which introduced a new contamination to us

736
01:09:54,400 --> 01:10:01,520
 which was silverware so we quickly ran into an issue issue with it luckily the grinder is

737
01:10:01,520 --> 01:10:06,560
 set up for success and they have a lot of safety features that shuts everything down so as soon as

738
01:10:06,560 --> 01:10:12,160
 they need that silverware makes it to the blade it stops it so we're able to back it out but working

739
01:10:12,160 --> 01:10:17,120
 with environmental services we made a really quick flag to go out and put it on every single

740
01:10:17,120 --> 01:10:22,960
 container went back out had conversations with businesses that we believe might have been the

741
01:10:22,960 --> 01:10:28,880
 corporate of the butter knife we could figure it out by seeing other butter knives and then we also

742
01:10:28,880 --> 01:10:33,600
 changed our practices to incorporate some magnets into the collection so that we can grab those items

743
01:10:33,600 --> 01:10:42,960
 before they make it into that grinder so all pilots you got to see what's going on so some

744
01:10:42,960 --> 01:10:48,720
 of our key performance indicators are here so the first graph you're seeing is the participation rate

745
01:10:48,720 --> 01:10:54,240
 and so again we delivered buckets to about 30 businesses downtown we started in july and we

746
01:10:54,240 --> 01:11:01,040
 ran it for about six months you can see the first is 31 so we need about 31 of the businesses were

747
01:11:01,040 --> 01:11:07,040
 actually putting items in their cart so valet was able to track that this doesn't show how full is

748
01:11:07,040 --> 01:11:11,200
 their cart some of them were quarter full some were half full we have one customer who builds two

749
01:11:11,200 --> 01:11:18,560
 full carts every single week so hurrah for them but as you can see as we went along the more

750
01:11:18,560 --> 01:11:23,200
 communication we have with them as we started the program we went out every other week in the

751
01:11:23,200 --> 01:11:27,840
 beginning and then we were able to stretch it out to monthly or as needed but in september we had a

752
01:11:27,840 --> 01:11:34,880
 huge jump of 85 which is exactly what we would love to see you can see we have 73 69 so really

753
01:11:34,880 --> 01:11:40,560
 just in between 50 and 60 which is it's a great turnout for us and then the second graph shows

754
01:11:40,560 --> 01:11:46,800
 you your collection by waste type now this does include all of valet so it's not just the 30

755
01:11:46,800 --> 01:11:52,880
 businesses the first part of the line is your trash so you can see in july about 70 tons of

756
01:11:52,880 --> 01:12:00,320
 trash was collected and then right below that is the recycling which was 6.3 tons and then the

757
01:12:00,320 --> 01:12:06,080
 organics which was 4.1 tons and as you watch it grow you can see in august we kind of had a dip

758
01:12:06,080 --> 01:12:12,400
 they're probably still trying to figure it out but september we moved it to 5.7 october we collected

759
01:12:12,400 --> 01:12:17,440
 nine tons so we're seeing that grow on the bottom and the really cool thing to look at is the trash

760
01:12:17,440 --> 01:12:22,560
 so you start to see it go down which is exactly what we want to see so we were collecting 70 tons

761
01:12:22,560 --> 01:12:27,280
 and then you see these peaks are these lows down here in november of 43 tons of trash this

762
01:12:27,280 --> 01:12:33,120
 organics number on the side there is that including this pilot program as well as the

763
01:12:33,120 --> 01:12:38,640
 yard waste bin or no this is just the pilot okay that's fascinating it's crazy to see that

764
01:12:38,640 --> 01:12:44,320
 ranked up with right there with recycling and it's heavy yard or food waste is heavy too so we expect

765
01:12:44,320 --> 01:12:49,520
 it to be a lot heavier but it is a great graph to visualize exactly what's happening

766
01:12:52,320 --> 01:12:58,800
 all right then wrapping up the pilot program we went out and we gave them a participant survey

767
01:12:58,800 --> 01:13:04,240
 wanted to get their feedback we made it super easy just five simple questions scan this qr code

768
01:13:04,240 --> 01:13:10,480
 please we want your feedback overall we got an average rating of 4.88 it's not a five but we will

769
01:13:10,480 --> 01:13:17,040
 take a 4.88 most respondents said it was extremely easy which is great so they understood the program

770
01:13:17,040 --> 01:13:23,360
 it wasn't hard most reported problem problem was staffing issues so this was something we quickly

771
01:13:23,360 --> 01:13:28,480
 realized that there was a high turnover turnover in restaurants so every time we would go back and

772
01:13:28,480 --> 01:13:33,440
 have a conversation it was always a new manager it was always a new staff but they were always very

773
01:13:33,440 --> 01:13:38,640
 open to hear our story we would tell them the same message they were always very eager we had a lot

774
01:13:38,640 --> 01:13:43,360
 of people who are excited about it but getting their staff to take one additional step was the

775
01:13:43,360 --> 01:13:48,160
 most most challenge that we would hear from them and then some of the improvements this is just a

776
01:13:48,160 --> 01:13:56,000
 fun one and said make it mandatory so everybody wants to see it and then just next steps for us

777
01:13:56,000 --> 01:14:02,160
 is making it a permanent service for ballet step one we are currently still running it in our ballet

778
01:14:02,160 --> 01:14:09,520
 program downtown we are pending the tceq approval we have received verbal approval to move forward

779
01:14:09,520 --> 01:14:14,160
 but we're just pending they're written so right now we are still moving along we're still doing

780
01:14:14,160 --> 01:14:20,400
 ballet and then after that our plan is to do some multi-stage phases we're planning to work with

781
01:14:20,400 --> 01:14:27,280
 environmental services and getting into dentin isd we'll keep it very micro pilot so probably just

782
01:14:27,280 --> 01:14:33,600
 one school and working with them getting with the university's multifamily we really want to try it

783
01:14:33,600 --> 01:14:38,960
 out with different types of businesses to see how it works ultimately the goal is to spread it across

784
01:14:38,960 --> 01:14:43,520
 all of the commercial businesses that's a couple years out from there and then at the end of the

785
01:14:43,520 --> 01:14:51,520
 day having some sort of residential drop off for post-consumer so that thing that is it any questions

786
01:14:51,520 --> 01:15:00,400
 adam go ahead yeah first of all this is great thank you very educational and i'm glad to see

787
01:15:00,400 --> 01:15:05,600
 you're having success with this um it different of questions so you're educating with these

788
01:15:05,600 --> 01:15:11,520
 categories they've got pre-consumer and then even the post-consumer is there a category for

789
01:15:11,520 --> 01:15:18,400
 food that's still edible like you know i don't know a grocery store or donut shop or something

790
01:15:18,400 --> 01:15:25,760
 and do you all track that and is there a way to actually get that food not just to a composting

791
01:15:25,760 --> 01:15:32,160
 program but to hungry people is that in the conversation at all and currently no um but

792
01:15:32,160 --> 01:15:36,800
 yeah right now we're just tracking you know what is going into the carts that is getting collected

793
01:15:36,800 --> 01:15:45,920
 by us and but not a current conversation but for future okay friend only praise for you guys about

794
01:15:45,920 --> 01:15:49,760
 every time you come because it's always just so exhilarating to hear of all the good ideas

795
01:15:49,760 --> 01:15:54,960
 that you guys have um loved this i worked at a restaurant downtown ran into you several times

796
01:15:54,960 --> 01:16:01,520
 actually and in our space there in those old buildings space was always the biggest challenge

797
01:16:01,520 --> 01:16:05,840
 i love that you guys thought of storage and it sounds like you really communicated well

798
01:16:05,840 --> 01:16:11,920
 with nsa and and your vendors there that this looks like it's going to be a really cool program

799
01:16:11,920 --> 01:16:16,480
 everyone there always talked about like gosh how could we do something better in this space and

800
01:16:16,480 --> 01:16:21,520
 there was just never any structural option for us to get rid of or divert food from just going into

801
01:16:21,520 --> 01:16:26,080
 the dumpster so this is a really great idea i would love to start seeing it rolled out especially at

802
01:16:26,080 --> 01:16:31,200
 the university level it's a conversation that we have every single time we meet on our sustainability

803
01:16:31,200 --> 01:16:39,200
 council there um so really really excited to see how this program scales thank you yeah this is

804
01:16:39,200 --> 01:16:44,560
 great it's great to see the progress a lot of thought a lot of effort gone into it it's paying

805
01:16:44,560 --> 01:16:52,880
 off it's great uh i was just wondering that the 26 participation rate residential

806
01:16:52,880 --> 01:17:00,160
 are there any plans to try to increase that i think so i think we have been adding more

807
01:17:00,160 --> 01:17:04,480
 social media posts about the pre-consumer food waste i think a lot of people just aren't familiar

808
01:17:04,480 --> 01:17:08,960
 with this i think the hard part is not everybody follows social and so those are some of the

809
01:17:08,960 --> 01:17:13,440
 challenges that you know we run into but citizen connection like all of those things have been

810
01:17:13,440 --> 01:17:20,320
 getting added so absolutely good and also just mirroring what adam said i've seen other programs

811
01:17:20,320 --> 01:17:29,760
 where the the edible edibles are given to places like our daily bread and so i hope at some point

812
01:17:29,760 --> 01:17:38,560
 that that becomes a consideration to it i also had a question on that metric um the 26 participation

813
01:17:38,560 --> 01:17:45,280
 is that for using the yard waste bin period or using pre-consumer foods within the yard waste bin

814
01:17:45,280 --> 01:17:50,640
 i believe it's a yard waste bin so roughly a quarter of solid waste users have a yard waste

815
01:17:50,640 --> 01:17:57,680
 bin that they use yes i also had a question on that too because i know that it's fantastic by

816
01:17:57,680 --> 01:18:02,720
 the way and i use mine all the time but i know that when that program originally came out it was

817
01:18:02,720 --> 01:18:09,040
 a a fee like an extra fee and i wonder if that prevented a lot of people originally from doing

818
01:18:09,040 --> 01:18:14,480
 that and i know it has since been um i don't think there is a separate fee for that anymore

819
01:18:14,480 --> 01:18:21,680
 maybe for the bin but not monthly that's correct and so i wonder if that originally you know extra

820
01:18:21,680 --> 01:18:26,560
 added monthly cost prevented people from joining and then it just kind of like flew by the way like

821
01:18:26,560 --> 01:18:33,120
 they just forgot about it so i don't know if maybe that's why it's low it hasn't increased or

822
01:18:33,120 --> 01:18:39,200
 maybe that's no i agree i think that's possible i know that one of the things we've been working on

823
01:18:39,200 --> 01:18:46,160
 is getting um brian's coming up too but getting more information out about the bin and it is a

824
01:18:46,160 --> 01:18:51,440
 one-time fee of 20 but that's it one time but getting more information out to our residents so

825
01:18:51,440 --> 01:18:55,760
 that they know that they can buy it and no environmental services just sent out a postcard

826
01:18:55,760 --> 01:19:01,520
 to a very heavily treated area just kind of promoting that and helping them um recognize

827
01:19:01,520 --> 01:19:05,760
 you know the craft bags how many go into a car and trying to promote that and then

828
01:19:05,760 --> 01:19:11,200
 brian what you want to end i'll just say i love what it is it's fantastic well good afternoon i'm

829
01:19:11,200 --> 01:19:16,080
 brian burner i'm solid waste director here in the city and to answer your question or to add on to

830
01:19:16,080 --> 01:19:21,360
 the response here you know we didn't see a market improvement in the number of folks that jumped on

831
01:19:21,360 --> 01:19:27,600
 once we we brought the fee we've considered to we've continued to see people log log into the

832
01:19:27,600 --> 01:19:32,320
 program and in fact we've gotten a fairly substantial slug of people asking for carts

833
01:19:32,320 --> 01:19:36,960
 following our storm here in the past couple of weeks you know so you know sometimes you know

834
01:19:36,960 --> 01:19:41,760
 the adverse is really a positive for us but at the end of the day we've got to remember that in the

835
01:19:41,760 --> 01:19:48,240
 city of denton we're not uniformly treated you look up on the north side north of 380 south of 380

836
01:19:48,240 --> 01:19:53,200
 very heavily very densely treated you get to go towards the south of the community it's very

837
01:19:53,200 --> 01:19:58,800
 likely treated so at the end of the day you know i think the maximum amount we'd probably see is

838
01:19:58,800 --> 01:20:04,480
 about 50 60 percent only because that's really where the peak is of the two lines crossing and

839
01:20:04,480 --> 01:20:10,720
 people that that have enough uh brush to fulfill a yard part on a week or bi-weekly basis versus

840
01:20:10,720 --> 01:20:14,960
 those that may just have a handful of stuff that they have to you know either compost on site just

841
01:20:14,960 --> 01:20:20,320
 on the radio trash can whatever brand you have a question for him it builds off of this so when

842
01:20:20,320 --> 01:20:24,080
 we're kind of talking about scaling out and understanding that roughly a quarter of the

843
01:20:24,080 --> 01:20:29,920
 community has these bins to begin with just for yard waste pre-consumer when you're thinking

844
01:20:29,920 --> 01:20:36,720
 about residential level if we're thinking about residential level post-consumer waste are we

845
01:20:36,720 --> 01:20:42,400
 thinking about different bin types or sizes given the what volume we get to clarify we will never go

846
01:20:42,400 --> 01:20:48,720
 house to house to house compost consumer waste so that carp will not exist okay we're going to be

847
01:20:48,720 --> 01:20:55,040
 promoting either one self-composting compost bin in your yard or potentially setting up some sort

848
01:20:55,040 --> 01:20:59,520
 of system where you bring it to a centralized location and we take it from there and right now

849
01:20:59,520 --> 01:21:04,720
 between the pre-consumer waste you eat everything that you have and wash plates off that is really

850
01:21:04,720 --> 01:21:09,840
 designed optimally i mean we don't want to have just massive amount of waste so part of our

851
01:21:09,840 --> 01:21:15,520
 education you see in the future is sort of menu planning right planning you know eat what you make

852
01:21:15,520 --> 01:21:20,960
 make what you going back to what our grandmother's told us clean your plate you know that's what you

853
01:21:20,960 --> 01:21:27,840
 gotta do so you would see this program specifically mainly targeting those large commercial vendors

854
01:21:27,840 --> 01:21:36,240
 and then our denser valley services correct so i have some questions about the presentation so

855
01:21:36,240 --> 01:21:43,200
 maybe friends that's right so one i'm just super excited about this i can't thank you enough like

856
01:21:43,200 --> 01:21:53,440
 this is fantastic so that that's that oh i i'm wondering on the version so like you had the

857
01:21:53,440 --> 01:22:05,200
 792 tons of impact reduction so like have we or can we as we're bringing those to council or

858
01:22:05,200 --> 01:22:11,040
 coming back here or putting out the public kid because people like numbers is there a way to say

859
01:22:11,040 --> 01:22:17,200
 okay well that is so much space in our landfill which you know we'll say okay so the more food

860
01:22:17,200 --> 01:22:26,480
 waste we keep out the longer this our our landfill will we can keep using it right so like that that's

861
01:22:26,480 --> 01:22:33,200
 pretty important for us as we're talking about reduction in our landfill so like do we have those

862
01:22:33,200 --> 01:22:41,520
 numbers so say you know we get 100 participation from the larger people that were asking to do this

863
01:22:41,520 --> 01:22:47,520
 what does that look like like does that saves us a lot of landfill space in in the future or

864
01:22:47,520 --> 01:22:55,040
 i mean it's pretty significant amount yeah the tonnage up front is significant the thing you

865
01:22:55,040 --> 01:23:00,080
 gotta remember about food waste it's a majority water once the water evaporates it exits about

866
01:23:00,080 --> 01:23:05,280
 leachate it shrinks okay and then all of a sudden it decays you take the molecules of gas out so at

867
01:23:05,280 --> 01:23:09,680
 the end of the day you know food waste is really one of those things we really want the landfill

868
01:23:09,680 --> 01:23:15,040
 because again over the 30 years it really compacts it really doesn't take up much space of life

869
01:23:15,040 --> 01:23:20,560
 landfill if we're looking at extending life landfill we've got to focus on on like construction

870
01:23:20,560 --> 01:23:26,160
 demolition those things that do not rot that do not break down that take up a lot of space

871
01:23:26,160 --> 01:23:31,680
 you know mattresses mattresses are the bane of landfills because again they're very light they

872
01:23:31,680 --> 01:23:36,320
 take up a lot of space so we gotta figure out a way to manage those but again going back to food

873
01:23:36,320 --> 01:23:42,480
 waste you know when you look when you're looking at the long sum of this the amount of space that

874
01:23:42,480 --> 01:23:50,000
 it actually takes up is in the long term is is fairly minimal okay so then what is the is the

875
01:23:50,800 --> 01:23:57,760
 one i know the benefit to me but i'm saying like for you to support this program to fund it to keep

876
01:23:57,760 --> 01:24:05,440
 going right what is that is that benefit for the city well part of it is you know it it is part of

877
01:24:05,440 --> 01:24:10,560
 the waste stream coming in so again if we can break it out and not have to manage it on the front end

878
01:24:10,560 --> 01:24:16,720
 it's less material that we have to to manage here immediately uh secondarily we are very heavily

879
01:24:16,720 --> 01:24:21,680
 regulated by both the state and federal governments so we you know this this decay that happens is

880
01:24:21,680 --> 01:24:27,600
 you know forms into landfill gas which is methane oxygen sulfur dioxide you know things of that

881
01:24:27,600 --> 01:24:34,080
 nature so if we can move this out of the landfill it actually benefits us from a cost standpoint of

882
01:24:34,080 --> 01:24:40,080
 managing that type of waste that comes out of the landfill so there are net benefits to us from a

883
01:24:40,080 --> 01:24:48,240
 cost standpoint if it's not the long fund of moving losing landfill to pex so it also for our purposes

884
01:24:48,240 --> 01:24:54,640
 in the sustainability committee reduces those emissions and may reduce flaring from the gases

885
01:24:54,640 --> 01:25:02,480
 that that it puts off correct okay thank you you're welcome and i'm excited about um disd i know they

886
01:25:02,480 --> 01:25:09,440
 have a like their food waste is probably equal to the city of titan residents i mean it's a lot i've

887
01:25:09,440 --> 01:25:15,600
 seen just so kids get their whole trays i'll just dump them um so i'm excited about maybe that

888
01:25:15,600 --> 01:25:25,040
 uh partnership and also unt and twu and um so my question is for the the restaurants people that

889
01:25:25,040 --> 01:25:32,000
 do participate is it a is it a cost of it no no currently because they're not generating more

890
01:25:32,000 --> 01:25:36,720
 waste they're just moving it from one bin to the next oh okay um so we were able to keep it cost

891
01:25:36,720 --> 01:25:43,120
 neutral um now as a commercial business as they implement a new program there will be a fee that

892
01:25:43,120 --> 01:25:47,280
 we don't know what that fee is yet but there will be but for ballet it's not because we're already

893
01:25:47,280 --> 01:25:54,640
 down there they're just moving it around basically okay and then um can you just run through the cycle

894
01:25:54,640 --> 01:26:01,680
 of it for us so um there's the food waste they get put in the bin the bin gets picked and kind of had

895
01:26:01,680 --> 01:26:08,720
 a little yeah yeah yeah no it's a process so um the first you know the businesses put it in their

896
01:26:08,720 --> 01:26:13,920
 kitchen bin inside and then they carry it out into the day or how many times they need to they put it

897
01:26:13,920 --> 01:26:19,040
 into the outdoor bin our ballet staff collects it every morning so they go by in a morning shift it

898
01:26:19,040 --> 01:26:25,120
 goes every single day saturday and sunday and they'll collect it they actually put it on a trailer

899
01:26:25,120 --> 01:26:30,000
 we don't even put it in a truck right now we just it works out better that way for us so they'll take

900
01:26:30,000 --> 01:26:35,120
 it in a trailer drive it across town go across the scales of a way in and then we go over to

901
01:26:35,120 --> 01:26:39,360
 wastewater so we work with wastewater we call them and tell them they're on the way because

902
01:26:39,360 --> 01:26:44,240
 they manage all of the equipment on site in case something's down they need to be to tell be able

903
01:26:44,240 --> 01:26:50,640
 to tell us no once we get there we actually install the ramp in just like a i don't know what it is

904
01:26:50,640 --> 01:26:57,440
 like a low spot at wastewater and so we will work at that point to move all of the material from the

905
01:26:57,440 --> 01:27:03,840
 carts into the white thing that you see dropper dropping is the hopper and so go into that hopper

906
01:27:03,840 --> 01:27:08,960
 and then that hopper is then carried over by the forklift to the equipment site and then it just

907
01:27:08,960 --> 01:27:14,160
 goes straight up in the air that's right and there's a clean off station and everything so we'll clean

908
01:27:14,160 --> 01:27:18,800
 off the material clean out the bucket make sure there's nothing on the ground and then it cycles

909
01:27:18,800 --> 01:27:24,400
 back into what what is it so to the digester so it goes the grinding process goes straight to the

910
01:27:24,400 --> 01:27:32,640
 pump the pump shoots it back and then it ultimately they we tied into an unused or retired system

911
01:27:32,640 --> 01:27:37,200
 piping system i don't know how you call it and then it shoots back up straight to the digester

912
01:27:37,200 --> 01:27:44,480
 and then from there does it come to the sledge yep and from there the the bio solids are dumped

913
01:27:44,480 --> 01:27:50,080
 and put into the windrows of the downer dirt process so again you know we're using existing

914
01:27:50,080 --> 01:27:55,920
 infrastructures existing staff to actually enhance the program now again this is a pilot

915
01:27:55,920 --> 01:28:00,320
 you know long term what we want to be able to do as part of the wastewater treatment plant redesign

916
01:28:00,320 --> 01:28:05,760
 which is currently about to kick off is we actually want to create a system that instead of having to

917
01:28:05,760 --> 01:28:10,480
 manage this material eight feet in the air it's at ground level so you pour it in it grinds and it

918
01:28:10,480 --> 01:28:16,480
 goes automatically and it's safer easier to be able to manage much larger volume we talked about

919
01:28:16,480 --> 01:28:21,600
 needing approval from the tcq because we're actually putting another component in the in the

920
01:28:21,600 --> 01:28:27,760
 wastewater process that required basically a permanent amendment and that's part of what

921
01:28:27,760 --> 01:28:32,880
 that approval is to ensure that the way this is designed is that does not impact the flow

922
01:28:32,880 --> 01:28:38,960
 or the operation of the facility we received you know ripped approval on the solid waste side

923
01:28:38,960 --> 01:28:43,360
 we've received verbal approval we're just waiting for the written approval on the waste water side

924
01:28:43,360 --> 01:28:48,320
 that's fantastic i just see it like as a cycle it is it just it just goes back well and at the end

925
01:28:48,320 --> 01:28:52,800
 of the day you know part of part of what we have to recognize is in this digester not only are we

926
01:28:52,800 --> 01:28:57,280
 breaking down the organics to go into the sludge of the biosod there's also natural gas that comes

927
01:28:57,280 --> 01:29:01,840
 off the top part of that natural gas is used to actually keep the digesters towards the process

928
01:29:01,840 --> 01:29:06,560
 so what we want to be able to do is create excess natural gas that will be sold back

929
01:29:07,440 --> 01:29:14,080
 to a renewable natural gas company who will make that into pipeline very quality gas dropping into

930
01:29:14,080 --> 01:29:18,240
 an atmost line that we have on the north side of the facility and actually what we do is what we

931
01:29:18,240 --> 01:29:23,040
 will be doing is supplanting existing demand that currently exists so we don't have to take it you

932
01:29:23,040 --> 01:29:28,640
 know from from a wellhead it's that renewable natural gas that the landfill and the wastewater

933
01:29:28,640 --> 01:29:33,840
 plant already so then we get rid of the flares on both sides and we're actually putting this

934
01:29:33,840 --> 01:29:39,280
 beneficial reuse back into the community well i appreciate y'all's presentation today and for

935
01:29:39,280 --> 01:29:44,240
 waiting patiently for the first presentation thank you so much i think we're good everybody

936
01:29:44,240 --> 01:29:50,880
 good yeah thank you brandy thank you all right so we will move on to our next item receive a

937
01:29:50,880 --> 01:30:04,080
 report hold the discussion and give staff direction regarding this employment action plan

938
01:30:04,080 --> 01:30:07,680
 chair committee members michael garnier director of environmental service sustainability i have

939
01:30:07,680 --> 01:30:12,480
 catherine here as well another staff that have been part of the overall plan it's been a while

940
01:30:12,480 --> 01:30:17,200
 since we've been in front of y'all with the climate action plan you may notice the word adaptation is

941
01:30:17,200 --> 01:30:22,320
 not there we've been focused more on the actual actions they know that adaptation goes beyond

942
01:30:22,320 --> 01:30:28,400
 what was really in there initially so just to put a little bit of perspective this is more of a

943
01:30:28,400 --> 01:30:33,200
 reminder we have some new members of council as well we had one new member here she's not present

944
01:30:33,200 --> 01:30:39,840
 this started back in april 2022 when council took action to establish science-based targets

945
01:30:39,840 --> 01:30:45,760
 and established a need for the actual formal climate action plan that's what's actually being

946
01:30:45,760 --> 01:30:52,080
 discussed today the graphic on the right hand side of the slide is the emission sources as broken

947
01:30:52,080 --> 01:30:57,760
 down by our 2019 greenhouse gas inventory which of course the elephant in the room always is

948
01:30:57,760 --> 01:31:03,600
 transportation 53 percent the bear for how we move buildings is 35 percent and the other is roughly

949
01:31:03,600 --> 01:31:08,400
 12 other is fugitive emissions and some landfill emissions that you just heard about from several

950
01:31:08,400 --> 01:31:13,760
 places sorry michael i'm trying to check with you is your presentation in our backup no it is not

951
01:31:15,280 --> 01:31:21,120
 i'm sorry to clarify we did a dry run on late on tuesday i couldn't make it back in time so i

952
01:31:21,120 --> 01:31:27,280
 apologize so this is just a quick timeline this is also for new members and all of y'all were here

953
01:31:27,280 --> 01:31:31,360
 for this but it does talk to a little bit of for council to make sure they know we started back in

954
01:31:31,360 --> 01:31:38,720
 april 2022 got a contract in place by july had a draft in front of them in october of last year

955
01:31:38,720 --> 01:31:43,280
 we had come before this committee three different times as well during that planning process to

956
01:31:43,280 --> 01:31:46,640
 talk about outreach different things the actions the goals and the targets

957
01:31:46,640 --> 01:31:53,120
 if you got the chance to watch it this is kind of a summary of feedback from council

958
01:31:53,120 --> 01:31:58,800
 during the october 24 2023 work session some of the things we heard was i got confusion over what

959
01:31:58,800 --> 01:32:04,240
 do we directly control who's actually affected by the plan what are we asking people to do is

960
01:32:04,240 --> 01:32:09,280
 this going to be mandatory it's going to be voluntary how did we calculate savings how do

961
01:32:09,280 --> 01:32:16,720
 the evie forecast align with market conditions some you know another one the big one was is it

962
01:32:16,720 --> 01:32:24,320
 going to be voluntary mandatory and then the overall overarching need for an awareness or

963
01:32:24,320 --> 01:32:29,440
 outreach to make sure the community is aware of all the different resources and the needs to move

964
01:32:29,440 --> 01:32:36,640
 this plan forward so as we move through to answer one of the first questions just as a clarity this

965
01:32:36,640 --> 01:32:42,080
 climate action plan covers all of that everything in green on the graphic everything in green is

966
01:32:42,080 --> 01:32:47,360
 covered by the plan what does the city of denton directly control as y'all are aware we control

967
01:32:47,360 --> 01:32:51,920
 our fleet for sure our facilities our infrastructure and then we get down into where we can do

968
01:32:51,920 --> 01:32:57,840
 ordinances codes zoning requirements or rates similar to what you heard from dne earlier

969
01:32:57,840 --> 01:33:03,600
 there's different things we do control that can drive the actions to move the climate action plan

970
01:33:03,600 --> 01:33:11,280
 forward one thing that wasn't discussed really as clearly during the initial briefings on some of

971
01:33:11,280 --> 01:33:16,320
 the climate action plan was the regulatory context just as a reminder in the state of texas the state

972
01:33:16,320 --> 01:33:24,320
 legislature said we as a city can't directly or indirectly affect what utilities the way to put

973
01:33:24,320 --> 01:33:30,160
 that layman's term is i can't say only use electric or only use natural gas it's an open market so as

974
01:33:30,160 --> 01:33:35,760
 the buildings and how things get built we can't limit we can't influence how those utility

975
01:33:35,760 --> 01:33:40,320
 development can't speed up permits we can't slow down permits can't charge more fees it's pretty

976
01:33:40,320 --> 01:33:46,640
 simple in that regard as a reminder the state energy conservation officer cico sets the state

977
01:33:46,640 --> 01:33:52,640
 wide energy code and all already there is reminded that they're currently at 2015 we here in denton

978
01:33:52,640 --> 01:33:57,360
 have already adopted 2021 international energy conservation code and we're currently reviewing

979
01:33:57,360 --> 01:34:05,280
 2024 the right hand side hud recently updated their speakers so hud's going from 2009 to 2021

980
01:34:05,280 --> 01:34:12,640
 what they have estimated is by moving from 2009 to upgrade to the 2021 code overall there's a 40

981
01:34:12,640 --> 01:34:20,480
 percent efficiency gain also the icc updates on a three-year cycle and each one of those cycles

982
01:34:20,480 --> 01:34:25,840
 effectively brings or gains eight percent efficiency the other thing hud says is one of

983
01:34:25,840 --> 01:34:32,000
 their supports of making this change is their proposed they're predicting that moving from 2009

984
01:34:32,000 --> 01:34:38,720
 to 2021 a individual single-family house could realize one thousand dollars per year for energy

985
01:34:38,720 --> 01:34:46,880
 savings and multi-family households can save four one thing we've spent a whole lot of time on over

986
01:34:46,880 --> 01:34:50,480
 the last six months is trying to look across everything the city's already working we heard

987
01:34:50,480 --> 01:34:54,080
 some things just a little while ago on the comprehensive solid waste management strategy

988
01:34:54,080 --> 01:34:58,880
 we as a city have a lot of plans this is just five examples if you don't know which ones they are

989
01:34:58,880 --> 01:35:03,440
 just in case it starts on the left hand side is simply sustainable framework which all are

990
01:35:03,440 --> 01:35:08,560
 clearly aware of and been intimately involved with then there's the mobility plan the parks and

991
01:35:08,560 --> 01:35:14,000
 trails master plan the one where the title is hard to see is the denton 2040 comprehensive plan

992
01:35:14,000 --> 01:35:18,160
 that's the blue document and on the far right is the comprehensive solid waste management strategy

993
01:35:18,160 --> 01:35:22,880
 so we spent a lot of time in here trying to show how the actions being proposed to move our climate

994
01:35:22,880 --> 01:35:30,800
 credentials tie into plans that are already adopted so to jump right into it we've adjusted

995
01:35:30,800 --> 01:35:36,560
 the planning or the discussions that were presented to council to come back with an overarching one

996
01:35:36,560 --> 01:35:42,400
 first goal is how people move how the community moves or gets around or delivers goods within the

997
01:35:42,400 --> 01:35:48,000
 city today so it's focused on movement or transportation within that we have five key actions

998
01:35:48,960 --> 01:35:54,880
 which you've seen before it goes down with instead of having fleet sources broken out separately we

999
01:35:54,880 --> 01:36:00,800
 roll them all together the cpa the city of denton public businesses are all in action 1.1

1000
01:36:00,800 --> 01:36:05,200
 then we pulled out to improve the active transportation infrastructure

1001
01:36:05,200 --> 01:36:09,200
 to actually make sure we're building that structure that infrastructure make sure it's

1002
01:36:09,200 --> 01:36:14,560
 accessible and available we also want to encourage people to walk and bike or use no emission modes

1003
01:36:14,560 --> 01:36:19,600
 how do we get that out of vehicles the next one is how do we decrease the total number of vehicle

1004
01:36:19,600 --> 01:36:24,800
 trips and vehicles how do we get people out of cars and actually walking or biking or doing other

1005
01:36:24,800 --> 01:36:29,760
 means the last one we want to make sure we're positioned in case the heavy duty fleet goes

1006
01:36:29,760 --> 01:36:34,320
 towards the hydrogen market that we're not missing that so still want to be closely involved with

1007
01:36:34,320 --> 01:36:40,080
 facilitating the installation of a green hydrogen facility here in denton if that's the way that

1008
01:36:40,080 --> 01:36:45,200
 market goes we want to make sure we're not losing perspective on that the far right hand column says

1009
01:36:45,200 --> 01:36:49,040
 resident action what that means is we have some questions over what are we actually asking the

1010
01:36:49,040 --> 01:36:54,320
 community to do these are the actions when it says yes we're going to ask them to change behavior

1011
01:36:54,320 --> 01:37:00,800
 or invest their own dollars in making the change so when it comes to the fleet it could be making

1012
01:37:00,800 --> 01:37:07,840
 a change in how you use your fleet or making the change in buying an ev or some other vehicle has

1013
01:37:07,840 --> 01:37:12,640
 composed to a gas engine but that's what the yes there means because generally speaking the public

1014
01:37:12,640 --> 01:37:16,800
 is not going to directly invest in the infrastructure for active transportation

1015
01:37:16,800 --> 01:37:24,160
 the next goal we're focused on which is the the bearing room which is buildings the goal would be

1016
01:37:24,160 --> 01:37:30,400
 to improve the efficiency resiliency and reduce the long-term impact of how we use those buildings

1017
01:37:30,400 --> 01:37:35,760
 so we've walked through all the actions here there's eight actions they start out with

1018
01:37:35,760 --> 01:37:40,160
 efficient energy efficiency upgrades in existing buildings helping people encouraging people and

1019
01:37:40,160 --> 01:37:45,760
 showing the value and changing how a building operates the second one is probably one of our

1020
01:37:45,760 --> 01:37:50,400
 critical ones it actually gets to how do we actually consume energy how do we change our

1021
01:37:50,400 --> 01:37:56,880
 energy set points do we need the air conditioner 73 could we do 75 those kind of things how do we

1022
01:37:56,880 --> 01:38:01,040
 actually operate and use how do we reduce our overall energy consumption also start the city

1023
01:38:01,040 --> 01:38:06,560
 facilities then we get into the very high efficiency energy standard that was one that was debated a

1024
01:38:06,560 --> 01:38:11,280
 lot some people call it the passive house standard they're trying to look at that for new buildings

1025
01:38:11,280 --> 01:38:16,400
 how do we actually make that happen then we get into zero emission systems which really ties into

1026
01:38:16,400 --> 01:38:22,640
 the heat pump discussion primarily but it's heating and cooling and natural in your hot water heating

1027
01:38:22,640 --> 01:38:27,520
 and how do we get those to be zero emissions then we start moving into what you just heard a little

1028
01:38:27,520 --> 01:38:33,040
 bit on was organics so we get into we want to reduce the amount of waste produced per capita

1029
01:38:33,040 --> 01:38:38,720
 we want to increase waste diversion obviously as you just heard we want to maximize organic

1030
01:38:38,720 --> 01:38:44,880
 diversion for renewable natural gas and the last one which we just recently you remember the date

1031
01:38:44,880 --> 01:38:48,480
 council just adopted the new drought and conservation plan for water department

1032
01:38:48,480 --> 01:38:52,400
 i believe it was last month or might have been the month before but overall we want to reduce

1033
01:38:52,400 --> 01:39:01,840
 water consumption the last goal is to really look at how we as a city can plan and use the land we

1034
01:39:01,840 --> 01:39:06,720
 have available so it's more of a land use how are we using that land so we want to make sure people

1035
01:39:06,720 --> 01:39:12,240
 have access to necessities how they can minimize their energy needs and ensure connectivity across

1036
01:39:12,240 --> 01:39:18,800
 them so none of these are new except for maybe the wording on 3.1 which is enhance access to

1037
01:39:18,800 --> 01:39:24,480
 necessities or create walkable communities by doing that we're looking at how do you get the

1038
01:39:24,480 --> 01:39:28,880
 density to where people can walk and live how do we get to shared wall space how do we get all those

1039
01:39:28,880 --> 01:39:34,800
 things that are of value of having connections or course produce natural renewable natural gas from

1040
01:39:34,800 --> 01:39:41,040
 landfill that's just a direct day-to-day operation of land of the actual landfill above and beyond

1041
01:39:41,040 --> 01:39:45,200
 what you heard about with organics diversion are there how do we actually make sure that gas being

1042
01:39:45,200 --> 01:39:51,360
 produced by the natural process of the landfill can be used for rng and of course we're going to

1043
01:39:51,360 --> 01:40:00,480
 increase local renewable energy generation capacity across that is that solar that's anything that's

1044
01:40:00,480 --> 01:40:06,320
 renewable yes and solar wind and we'll get to that that one's not what i'll go over but i there in

1045
01:40:06,320 --> 01:40:12,240
 your backup on the measures that we'll be looking at any type of solar that's installed how many are

1046
01:40:12,240 --> 01:40:17,440
 installed what's the capacity how does that compare to our peak services wind generation how is that

1047
01:40:17,440 --> 01:40:23,760
 done we'd want to track measures such as how city facilities we don't have any solar or wind at a

1048
01:40:23,760 --> 01:40:27,600
 city facility at this point but how do we get that installed how do we make use of that as we can

1049
01:40:27,600 --> 01:40:32,480
 invest those dollars so that would be tied into that as well so that would go a little deeper dive

1050
01:40:32,480 --> 01:40:37,200
 to walk you through what's in the plan i'm going to go through two of the actions in a little more

1051
01:40:37,200 --> 01:40:44,480
 detail so decarbonizing the fleet was a tough discussion over hey is are evs even available

1052
01:40:44,480 --> 01:40:50,320
 can you charge on those things so this ties into the comprehensive plan on the local side we do

1053
01:40:50,320 --> 01:40:56,320
 have ev and e-biking centers under the greensense program on a federal level there's a tax credit

1054
01:40:56,320 --> 01:41:01,600
 both for individuals and businesses on the state level there's a grant program as well that helps

1055
01:41:01,600 --> 01:41:08,960
 support move that needle to make this happen the market assessment as of march of last year

1056
01:41:08,960 --> 01:41:15,440
 it's a little over a year ago there were 40 evs and 33 plug-in hybrids but by the end of this

1057
01:41:15,440 --> 01:41:21,200
 calendar year it's projected we'll have over 100 models available and gm is actually one of the

1058
01:41:21,200 --> 01:41:27,360
 first manufacturers to step out and say they want to cease production of gas-powered light duty

1059
01:41:27,360 --> 01:41:33,680
 vehicles by 2035 so that just helps put in perspective that this is where we're going so

1060
01:41:33,680 --> 01:41:38,960
 within the decarbonization of the fleet we want to we're proposing some of the measures the measures

1061
01:41:38,960 --> 01:41:44,000
 can be fluid can be added to the leading enhance but we think it's important to look at how many ev

1062
01:41:44,000 --> 01:41:48,960
 registrations we have also how many non are we actually making progress it's not good enough just

1063
01:41:48,960 --> 01:41:54,720
 to know how many evs how does that compare to the overall population then the next three focus in on

1064
01:41:54,720 --> 01:41:58,640
 the city we want to make sure we're very clear on what our light duty fleets do what our medium and

1065
01:41:58,640 --> 01:42:04,640
 heavy duty fleets do and our non-road or just extra electric equipment so when you see grounds

1066
01:42:04,640 --> 01:42:10,720
 maintenance around city hall how are we doing on that to decarbonize that and the last one is the

1067
01:42:10,720 --> 01:42:16,640
 availability of basically getting fuel are there enough ev charging facilities if we go to hydrogen

1068
01:42:16,640 --> 01:42:21,520
 it's hydrogen available how does all that come together so we want to go track that and show that

1069
01:42:22,080 --> 01:42:27,520
 the right hand side is part dimension lizard is three things we're currently doing we provide ev

1070
01:42:27,520 --> 01:42:34,320
 charging at five city facilities solid wasted pilot an ev trash truck recently we did sit back

1071
01:42:34,320 --> 01:42:39,280
 and wait for research we tried it ourselves and the fire department is actually looking to acquire

1072
01:42:39,280 --> 01:42:46,320
 and should be here probably in october our first ev fire truck so we're moving the moving the needle

1073
01:42:47,120 --> 01:42:53,280
 then we get that mouthful of walkable communities it can mean so many things so this slide the

1074
01:42:53,280 --> 01:42:58,640
 intent of this is it's really deeply committed a piece of our comprehensive plan it's what the

1075
01:42:58,640 --> 01:43:03,360
 public was involved with the comprehensive planning as well as the climate action plan and spoke to

1076
01:43:03,360 --> 01:43:08,560
 they wanted more density the right hand side some key quotes that came out one of the reasons i call

1077
01:43:08,560 --> 01:43:14,800
 it the compact scenario receiving of those votes the compact scenario called for roughly 80 multi

1078
01:43:14,800 --> 01:43:21,440
 unit construction going forward so that was a big diversion from what we were doing historically

1079
01:43:21,440 --> 01:43:27,680
 but all this ties together this is not an existent not exhaustive list there's other ones in the plan

1080
01:43:27,680 --> 01:43:33,280
 and in your backup measures how do you measure success to make a walkable community so it's

1081
01:43:33,280 --> 01:43:37,520
 kind of tough but one of the things we want to look at is the number of infill housing permits

1082
01:43:37,520 --> 01:43:42,320
 how are we making good use of already developed areas to revitalize those and make use of those

1083
01:43:43,280 --> 01:43:48,080
 the walkability could be a chance this is key there's things that come to council that are not

1084
01:43:48,080 --> 01:43:54,320
 allowed by right so anytime that's not allowed by right how do we make sure that we as an entity

1085
01:43:54,320 --> 01:43:58,720
 are driving people to encourage and add those walkability finishes so how are we doing so that'll

1086
01:43:58,720 --> 01:44:04,560
 be something we have to manually track right now but if we think it's important if we as staff are

1087
01:44:04,560 --> 01:44:08,720
 making a recommendation to plan your zoning permission or city council we want to make sure

1088
01:44:08,720 --> 01:44:13,600
 we're identifying have we actually asked for and addressed walkability within those things that are

1089
01:44:13,600 --> 01:44:20,560
 not allowed by right sorry i'm looking back and forth between the draft plan in the backup and

1090
01:44:20,560 --> 01:44:26,080
 this presentation and you have a couple items in this measure that's not included in that summary

1091
01:44:26,080 --> 01:44:30,560
 table at the very end is there concurrency between these slides and what we're looking at here in the

1092
01:44:30,560 --> 01:44:36,880
 backup usually yes this one what i you beat me to what i was about to say bottom three on this slide

1093
01:44:36,880 --> 01:44:43,440
 the bottom three are actually more tied to action 1.2 which is active active transportation

1094
01:44:43,440 --> 01:44:47,920
 infrastructure but they're also key to making a walkable community so i'm showing them here

1095
01:44:47,920 --> 01:44:54,080
 but we will be tracking those under 1.2 and the key thing on the bottom four here is the bottom four

1096
01:44:54,080 --> 01:44:59,600
 are all direct measures or metrics out of two other plans the 10 minute walk to park and the

1097
01:44:59,600 --> 01:45:04,640
 miles of trails are both the parts of trail master plan the miles of sidewalks and miles of bike lanes

1098
01:45:04,640 --> 01:45:10,400
 are both called for in the mobility plan so even though they're part of this plan they're also part

1099
01:45:10,400 --> 01:45:20,480
 of another plan that everyone's actively working on on our uh so like when you say it's our

1100
01:45:20,480 --> 01:45:27,600
 opportunities so some of these things aren't all right the economic development board like um or

1101
01:45:28,400 --> 01:45:35,920
 economic development for the city i'm sorry are these things that they're going to start thinking

1102
01:45:35,920 --> 01:45:41,200
 about before they bring or when they bring someone to our city are they going to start

1103
01:45:41,200 --> 01:45:47,600
 going through um these things in our plan and say okay can you do this this this and this will

1104
01:45:47,600 --> 01:45:54,640
 in turn allow us to give you an incentive like that is our goal to tie those to tie those together

1105
01:45:55,840 --> 01:45:59,840
 and so if i back up to this slide there's a lot of different things here that are called for in

1106
01:45:59,840 --> 01:46:04,240
 the content that we're working towards and all those things have to come together how do we

1107
01:46:04,240 --> 01:46:08,960
 maximize those new developments to ensure we have that connectivity i don't think it's on this one

1108
01:46:08,960 --> 01:46:15,280
 but there is one walk basically public gathering and connections i think i truncated on here but

1109
01:46:15,280 --> 01:46:21,360
 there is a requirement for new development to ensure we have public walkways to allow through

1110
01:46:21,360 --> 01:46:25,840
 new development so existing development can connect so we don't want to have those islands where we

1111
01:46:25,840 --> 01:46:28,880
 either don't have a sidewalk or don't have a means to move within at all

1112
01:46:28,880 --> 01:46:36,480
 so that was a deep dive into two of the actions i'm willing to go through all the actions

1113
01:46:36,480 --> 01:46:42,960
 i know it's been a long day for y'all already um just as a reminder the original the ssg plan

1114
01:46:42,960 --> 01:46:51,040
 had 15 actions broken over four sectors or major shifts in those 15 actions three of those 15 were

1115
01:46:51,040 --> 01:46:57,440
 on fleet because they had dcta the city of denton and not and everything else we combine those into

1116
01:46:57,440 --> 01:47:02,640
 one we also went in if there was actions where there was two parts to an action instead of two

1117
01:47:02,640 --> 01:47:10,000
 parts to an action may not be individual actions so this these actions align with what ssg had done

1118
01:47:10,000 --> 01:47:16,000
 their modeling on how they recommended that since we've slightly modified them i can't directly say

1119
01:47:16,000 --> 01:47:23,440
 100 the savings are the same the overall emission reduction if you recall they were saying we could

1120
01:47:23,440 --> 01:47:30,160
 reach 87 reduction by 2050 that should stay because we haven't moved on anything else

1121
01:47:30,160 --> 01:47:36,320
 we're going to be doing analysis on how any years and how we traffic each year to make sure we make

1122
01:47:36,320 --> 01:47:42,800
 the progress necessary again right now my recommendation would be to go voluntary before

1123
01:47:42,800 --> 01:47:48,320
 we have to go make this whereas ssg has some hard numbers they wanted us to do certain things

1124
01:47:48,320 --> 01:47:55,040
 starting in 2025 maybe 2028 we're looking at all those all those targets will still be in there

1125
01:47:55,040 --> 01:47:58,800
 and part of this says we're going to report back to council which should also include this body

1126
01:47:58,800 --> 01:48:03,680
 we're proposing in june of every year that'll give us sufficient time to wrap up anything if

1127
01:48:03,680 --> 01:48:08,240
 we're doing emission cycles different things to ensure the data is complete for the prior year

1128
01:48:09,200 --> 01:48:13,360
 so the next step we're scheduled to be in front of council at this point and we're scheduled to

1129
01:48:13,360 --> 01:48:21,840
 be on june 18th to walk through this and then of course we have to implement that which is the

1130
01:48:21,840 --> 01:48:26,240
 next biggest barrier is how do we actually get everything done so with that i'll stand for any

1131
01:48:26,240 --> 01:48:34,960
 questions okay go ahead i'm if you could clarify for me that the economic information in the

1132
01:48:34,960 --> 01:48:43,040
 original plan which showed the savings that's not going to be presented with this i can't directly

1133
01:48:43,040 --> 01:48:47,920
 tie at this point within the six month period we had to be working on this i can't stand with those

1134
01:48:47,920 --> 01:48:54,320
 same numbers because the proposed actions don't directly align but they are similar so that document

1135
01:48:54,320 --> 01:48:59,040
 that you're looking at from ssg so on the record council has it from their travel work session

1136
01:48:59,040 --> 01:49:04,080
 it'll be there we're referencing it it's in this plan to say we did present it we did talk through

1137
01:49:04,080 --> 01:49:09,760
 it and we as staff will be coming back with updated metrics on that when we update it a year

1138
01:49:09,760 --> 01:49:14,800
 good we just didn't have the time to realign everything in that window good yeah because

1139
01:49:14,800 --> 01:49:22,880
 that's so impressive it is yeah and the only other thing i thought was uh is it going to be

1140
01:49:23,760 --> 01:49:35,680
 just as public has been educated about recycling will there be any sort of program educational

1141
01:49:35,680 --> 01:49:43,920
 program regarding the climate action plan not only for the public you know bill stuffers and

1142
01:49:43,920 --> 01:49:50,880
 that sort of thing but also using entrance into the schools as well since we already have recycling

1143
01:49:50,880 --> 01:49:56,320
 programs there is introducing that here's here's the next step to make a better world sort of thing

1144
01:49:56,320 --> 01:50:01,520
 yes the goal here as i started out with i went back to the side one of the things we heard is

1145
01:50:01,520 --> 01:50:07,440
 outreach and awareness and education has to be a critical component to everything so all 16 actions

1146
01:50:07,440 --> 01:50:14,000
 will have that embedded within it to be successful do i have dedicated staff right now to do that not

1147
01:50:14,000 --> 01:50:19,120
 necessarily we'll work through that and figure out how to best align some of the actions directly

1148
01:50:19,120 --> 01:50:24,240
 relate to staff we already have whether it be on waste reduction or organics diversion some of those

1149
01:50:24,240 --> 01:50:29,040
 we have win-wins some mobility things we have win-wins there's other ones that we'll have to

1150
01:50:29,040 --> 01:50:33,840
 figure out how we're going to do all that but yes 100 our push is going to be on awareness we're

1151
01:50:33,840 --> 01:50:38,160
 going to work on everything we can on a website basis which limits us if it does reach certain

1152
01:50:38,160 --> 01:50:42,320
 individuals it's a good place to start and then go out and go through whether it be to the chamber

1153
01:50:42,320 --> 01:50:47,680
 of commerce whether it go through business entities all different outlets to reach the

1154
01:50:47,680 --> 01:50:53,600
 business community to reach all the residents to bridge the gap to hopefully also reach out and

1155
01:50:53,600 --> 01:50:58,080
 talk to people who are coming in our community because we do have a certain amount of transients

1156
01:50:58,080 --> 01:51:02,160
 we want to make sure they're aware of what all resources are working towards so they can be a

1157
01:51:02,160 --> 01:51:07,280
 part of it as well because they impact us on a daily basis and one of the one other question is

1158
01:51:07,280 --> 01:51:13,520
 there any way at all to establish a relationship with the county in regard to what we're doing

1159
01:51:13,520 --> 01:51:18,800
 here i know they don't have a dedicated sustainability man or lady but there is a

1160
01:51:18,800 --> 01:51:24,080
 person over there whose name just went right out of my head that i've had some discussions with

1161
01:51:24,080 --> 01:51:31,520
 about the county's take on doing something like this go on my class second or third flower it says

1162
01:51:31,520 --> 01:51:36,800
 it covers everything in the green so the county is part of that okay we will be working with them

1163
01:51:36,800 --> 01:51:43,600
 to make sure we can maximize the team together and make that happen terrific just like the dentin isd

1164
01:51:43,600 --> 01:51:49,120
 dcta we met with both dentin isd and dcta to discuss two things good regarding our fleets great

1165
01:51:49,120 --> 01:51:59,120
 yeah thank you for this i'm so happy that it's back on our agenda it's been a long time behind

1166
01:51:59,120 --> 01:52:05,680
 the scenes and we've been doing this as you said for a long time one suggestion and then maybe two

1167
01:52:05,680 --> 01:52:11,040
 questions i remember so for the outreach and education i remember when we were first talking

1168
01:52:11,040 --> 01:52:18,160
 about this we would deputize people as like you can do a climate action in a box presentation

1169
01:52:18,160 --> 01:52:23,440
 or something that was part of our outreach effort initially to make sure we could receive that

1170
01:52:23,440 --> 01:52:28,400
 input back from the public it was a meeting in a box i wonder if we could as you said we'd maybe

1171
01:52:28,400 --> 01:52:33,600
 have the staff to to do all the outreach and education maybe we could get volunteers to

1172
01:52:34,640 --> 01:52:39,760
 train them up then they can do a lot of that work i would say back to that is nothing's off the table

1173
01:52:39,760 --> 01:52:43,840
 we're going to look at every option we can to move this because we can't continue to wait you know

1174
01:52:43,840 --> 01:52:49,840
 that and we're trying to engage the whole community as the community not just anyone's sector okay good

1175
01:52:49,840 --> 01:52:56,480
 um so my question maybe two questions you talked on this a couple times but how do you because the

1176
01:52:56,480 --> 01:53:04,320
 big took takeaway i took from council too was the mandatory or voluntary question i guess my take on

1177
01:53:04,320 --> 01:53:09,920
 that was well like any plan this is a plan like you said the city has a lot of plans it'll come

1178
01:53:09,920 --> 01:53:15,200
 down to the implementation decisions on the ground with all the decisions we make as a city all the

1179
01:53:15,200 --> 01:53:21,680
 time um but can you just say a bit more about how you think of this plan along that line of the

1180
01:53:21,680 --> 01:53:28,720
 mandatory voluntary dimension everything right now we're going to try to do with encouragement

1181
01:53:28,720 --> 01:53:37,120
 on centers primarily however on energy efficiency as i pointed out going from 2009 to 2021 hud

1182
01:53:37,120 --> 01:53:43,680
 estimates that's a 40 efficiency deck what i would say to that is there's about 80 percent of the

1183
01:53:43,680 --> 01:53:51,200
 housing stock in denton that was built before 2010 so we have a huge opportunity to go in like you

1184
01:53:51,200 --> 01:53:56,560
 had mentioned earlier with the green sense incentive to help those buildings help those

1185
01:53:56,560 --> 01:54:02,800
 residences to improve their efficiency so one way we have mandatory there is that they do a

1186
01:54:02,800 --> 01:54:08,960
 certain amount of upgrade they have to meet the 2021 standard so we get that win that's more

1187
01:54:08,960 --> 01:54:13,200
 mandatory how do we incentivize how do we make sure our green sense program is getting money

1188
01:54:13,200 --> 01:54:18,400
 in the hands of the right people to make the right changes and hopefully an equitable manner

1189
01:54:18,400 --> 01:54:22,000
 so we'll be back in front of you coming up with some other change on the green sense program but

1190
01:54:22,640 --> 01:54:27,520
 i see it as instead of trying to say hey if you're going to build a dent you got to build this way

1191
01:54:27,520 --> 01:54:31,840
 we're aware of builders in dent that are building close to the net zero or the high efficiency

1192
01:54:31,840 --> 01:54:36,960
 standard they got small little pocket communities let's see how they sell how their price compares

1193
01:54:36,960 --> 01:54:42,080
 and how their utility consumption compares to others and that might start moving the target

1194
01:54:42,080 --> 01:54:46,960
 i think one of the changes is going to happen to all of us as a community is we may have to spend

1195
01:54:46,960 --> 01:54:51,760
 a little more on the house but we're going to be spending less on the utility bill so instead of

1196
01:54:51,760 --> 01:54:58,080
 spending the $200 to the electric bill we might be spending 100 and our house may be $40 more

1197
01:54:58,080 --> 01:55:02,320
 which means if you stay in the home long enough you'd have a better return on investment but

1198
01:55:02,320 --> 01:55:10,000
 since i can't predict that we would have changes there okay good thank you my other question was

1199
01:55:10,000 --> 01:55:16,480
 about the bear uh like the elephant the bear that's really nice the distraction squirrel

1200
01:55:17,120 --> 01:55:24,800
 a squirrel um it seems like the elephant within the bear to me is like new and maybe that's not

1201
01:55:24,800 --> 01:55:32,560
 true but new building i think about was a coal a hunter ranch and we did mention the limitations

1202
01:55:32,560 --> 01:55:41,280
 that the state legislature has put on on cities in terms of utilities um can you speak a little bit

1203
01:55:41,280 --> 01:55:48,800
 more to the challenge maybe that that presents any ideas about how to overcome that challenge

1204
01:55:48,800 --> 01:55:54,080
 when we're looking at perhaps building out natural gas infrastructure to all these builds and the

1205
01:55:54,080 --> 01:56:01,440
 kind of built-in emissions that come with that are there strategies it's always a tough one to

1206
01:56:01,440 --> 01:56:05,920
 address there are certain areas of dentin that are being built that don't currently have natural gas

1207
01:56:05,920 --> 01:56:10,560
 services some of those areas are being built full metric other ones are going to have a high enough

1208
01:56:10,560 --> 01:56:14,560
 density that the gas providers are looking to add that infrastructure to provide that to those

1209
01:56:14,560 --> 01:56:20,800
 customers what i would say is just because the infrastructure gets installed doesn't necessarily

1210
01:56:20,800 --> 01:56:27,280
 mean it'll be fully utilized either it'll kind of depend on the market as the building mechanics

1211
01:56:27,280 --> 01:56:33,600
 change over the years it may drive it towards a certain direction so as for example if electric

1212
01:56:33,600 --> 01:56:39,920
 heat pump becomes almost the price of an HVAC but is truly three or four hundred times more efficient

1213
01:56:40,800 --> 01:56:45,200
 someone may actually choose to go that direction regardless of the fuel source but

1214
01:56:45,200 --> 01:56:49,200
 most of those the higher efficiencies are on the electric there's still some natural gas back in

1215
01:56:49,200 --> 01:56:57,360
 there just like it's efficient so i can't i can't say we'll be moving away from any fuel source

1216
01:56:57,360 --> 01:57:01,840
 i think the biggest thing is we're going to gain a whole lot of efficiency gains

1217
01:57:01,840 --> 01:57:05,760
 in a lot of those new constructions i've been a part of various meetings and people being very

1218
01:57:05,760 --> 01:57:12,160
 creative to do efficient build there's a billion alignment some are even looking at which way

1219
01:57:12,160 --> 01:57:17,520
 streets should run to minimize waste west facing versus east and north and south different alignments

1220
01:57:17,520 --> 01:57:23,120
 how do we maximize areas where you might have less tree cover or you might know to be more rooftop

1221
01:57:23,120 --> 01:57:28,080
 solar whereas when you have the tree cover you want to use that to shield the building to then

1222
01:57:28,080 --> 01:57:32,400
 offset the energy bill they're looking at all those things they're also looking at how to enhance

1223
01:57:32,400 --> 01:57:37,200
 which is a part of this enhanced reduced space which is a key aspect of walkable because people

1224
01:57:37,200 --> 01:57:44,560
 like to walk but there's something pretty different okay thank you um might kind of take away from

1225
01:57:44,560 --> 01:57:51,200
 watching the council deliberations back in october this how do we package this as a win for

1226
01:57:51,200 --> 01:57:55,600
 residents how do you sell it so i just wondered like generally what do you see is your bigger

1227
01:57:55,600 --> 01:58:04,400
 taglines off of this modified draft it's kind of a revision from what ssg had given us biggest tag

1228
01:58:04,400 --> 01:58:12,640
 lines um well one of the ones would be is with the efficiency that we're going for if you're

1229
01:58:12,640 --> 01:58:16,800
 going to keep more money in your pocket your records because of not spending on a utility bill

1230
01:58:16,800 --> 01:58:25,040
 then if we can also build that into um reducing vehicle miles traveled we're actually moved up

1231
01:58:25,040 --> 01:58:30,080
 to a more serious attainment level for ground level loads on climate which has a negative impact

1232
01:58:30,080 --> 01:58:35,680
 on local health so we can actually show them by changing how they move within denton they're

1233
01:58:35,680 --> 01:58:42,160
 having a direct public health impact by reducing those emissions so i think if you try to tie it

1234
01:58:42,160 --> 01:58:47,520
 into a public health initiative over the healthy side of things as well as trying to get the

1235
01:58:47,520 --> 01:58:53,120
 understanding that the overall goal here is to minimize our consumption which has the ultimate

1236
01:58:53,120 --> 01:58:59,280
 benefit of reducing emissions it also reduces our costs overall day-to-day so i know obviously the

1237
01:58:59,280 --> 01:59:03,280
 bulk of what we're looking at is emissions reductions and the bulk of our emissions are

1238
01:59:03,280 --> 01:59:09,920
 transportation related i know a lot of that is fixed based on the infrastructure we already have

1239
01:59:09,920 --> 01:59:17,280
 and i know a lot of our transportation measures do look at how do we mitigate that down versus the

1240
01:59:18,560 --> 01:59:24,320
 more of the land use planning measures what overlap have we had or conversations or

1241
01:59:24,320 --> 01:59:31,040
 overlap that we're looking at with say planning and development and how going forward with the

1242
01:59:31,040 --> 01:59:35,840
 non-infield space that we have and our growth potential in these new areas around town

1243
01:59:35,840 --> 01:59:43,360
 building environments that fit with this vision of more connected communities more closer access

1244
01:59:43,360 --> 01:59:49,040
 to amenities less reliance on a single combustible automobile i think that directly ties into the

1245
01:59:49,040 --> 01:59:52,720
 dentin 2040 comp plan as well if you actually read through it and look at it and look at the key

1246
01:59:52,720 --> 01:59:59,760
 actions like there's 278 key actions 280 key actions if you get into that plan there's a lot of things

1247
01:59:59,760 --> 02:00:06,240
 that mainly focus back on building that compact that density making things accessible so it's a

1248
02:00:06,240 --> 02:00:12,560
 key route of how we're trying to build that plan within the comp 340 plan the goal of this plan is

1249
02:00:12,560 --> 02:00:17,280
 to draw awareness to by doing all those actions we're actually having a climate impact as well

1250
02:00:17,280 --> 02:00:22,080
 so it's a double win so the hopeful goal there is we already have that built into a lot of things

1251
02:00:22,080 --> 02:00:28,160
 are working on and how do we continue to maximize that and grow that i know that some of the other

1252
02:00:28,160 --> 02:00:34,960
 concerns were the mandatory behavioral changes that some people felt a little bit anxious about

1253
02:00:34,960 --> 02:00:39,920
 i liked the way that you packaged some of your measures up there where was it that a resident

1254
02:00:39,920 --> 02:00:45,520
 might have individual control over versus what does the city have operative control over i wonder if

1255
02:00:45,520 --> 02:00:50,480
 that would be helpful in that summary table there as well under those measures when we're looking at

1256
02:00:50,480 --> 02:00:55,440
 you know number of ev registrations that's going to be an individual's uptake right but versus our

1257
02:00:55,440 --> 02:01:00,720
 miles of trails built if it was labeled there that that's something that the city is capable of doing

1258
02:01:00,720 --> 02:01:04,800
 and that way it's very clearly distinguished about what is it that we're asking the residents you know

1259
02:01:04,800 --> 02:01:10,720
 what cost are we incentivize or inducing versus what is the city capable of changing whether it's

1260
02:01:10,720 --> 02:01:15,920
 already in a plan or whether this is a new proposal outside of say the comp plan or mobility

1261
02:01:15,920 --> 02:01:24,000
 and that might help visualize what exactly we're expecting okay so make sure i heard you clearly

1262
02:01:24,000 --> 02:01:31,120
 on the measures table you're thinking within that by each measure we propose kind of have an action

1263
02:01:31,120 --> 02:01:38,720
 i have of it directly impacts like a behavior change or the cost of a resident correct or the

1264
02:01:38,720 --> 02:01:46,400
 community okay how would that be difficult just normally yes kind of we did it on the slides i

1265
02:01:46,400 --> 02:01:51,120
 didn't do it there because the measures are kind of uh it was to see how those would work how they

1266
02:01:51,120 --> 02:01:57,120
 would grow this is just our preliminary they grow out a lot of the areas are actually a summary

1267
02:01:57,120 --> 02:02:02,800
 statement ahead of other plans there may be six metrics in track but for this to be able to model

1268
02:02:02,800 --> 02:02:09,680
 i simplify it instead of tracking six different things like bike lanes or bike paths so i care

1269
02:02:09,680 --> 02:02:14,320
 about the side path a dedicated road a side path you know all those things i wonder how many bike

1270
02:02:14,320 --> 02:02:18,960
 lanes yeah so i try to simplify it here because that's how i can plug it into the model

1271
02:02:21,360 --> 02:02:27,120
 i think i stopped coughing but yes we can we'll definitely take that into consideration thank you

1272
02:02:27,120 --> 02:02:34,080
 i have a common question if i can there's water can you some water you've got your cell phone

1273
02:02:34,080 --> 02:02:43,840
 okay so might have peppermints we started this in 2022 we yes it's right on top yes

1274
02:02:43,840 --> 02:02:49,520
 it's been a while so i'm really glad this has come to us although it's an altered version

1275
02:02:50,880 --> 02:02:58,400
 my question is and this may not be something that that you can answer but are you how

1276
02:02:58,400 --> 02:03:10,320
 how confident are you that council will approve this without any metrics or costs added to it

1277
02:03:10,320 --> 02:03:17,840
 like if that if that's a big concern for them say so like in the first plan we had you had all of

1278
02:03:17,840 --> 02:03:23,440
 that out there which showed the people the the residents like this is gonna put this much money

1279
02:03:23,440 --> 02:03:30,960
 back into our pockets or your pockets which is fantastic it was a large amount and that's not

1280
02:03:30,960 --> 02:03:36,960
 yet hasn't been trimmed it hasn't been added to this one yet

1281
02:03:36,960 --> 02:03:42,640
 so i'm just i'm just curious like do you think that's going to be

1282
02:03:43,840 --> 02:03:49,200
 that's going to be prevent them from going forward with this is it that big of a deal or

1283
02:03:49,200 --> 02:03:56,960
 i support the plan as we're proposing it yeah to be able to go forward i think a lot of the costs

1284
02:03:56,960 --> 02:04:02,640
 got stuck and i think there was about a split of different people having different

1285
02:04:02,640 --> 02:04:07,520
 challenges of how it was calculated or what it meant okay so i think by not having it now

1286
02:04:07,520 --> 02:04:12,560
 it outlines all the actions to make sure we're committing to it while we then build that back

1287
02:04:12,560 --> 02:04:17,200
 in so part of that's why i was trying to quote those HUD standards is that they're estimated

1288
02:04:17,200 --> 02:04:22,240
 that a household will save a thousand dollars a year in utilities that's quite a bit that's

1289
02:04:22,240 --> 02:04:27,280
 eighty dollars a month and then for multi-payments four hundred dollars per year that's still not

1290
02:04:27,280 --> 02:04:33,360
 you know tiny enough that's 330 to 40 dollars a month so we're just not going hard on the savings

1291
02:04:33,360 --> 02:04:39,760
 we tried to work through that some i don't think it'll distract for council i think there'll be at

1292
02:04:39,760 --> 02:04:43,760
 least two members that i'll ask about it pretty heavily yeah um i don't think it'll keep it from

1293
02:04:43,760 --> 02:04:48,880
 being moved forward i hope okay does it mean they will ask for it we have to put it in before we

1294
02:04:48,880 --> 02:04:53,280
 bring it forward yeah i just i don't have a good answer on how long that would take to break that

1295
02:04:53,280 --> 02:05:00,640
 back down and match these actions okay and then just um another thing so ssg like just bring me

1296
02:05:00,640 --> 02:05:07,920
 back like 2022 originally our conversations here on this body were about a carbon reduction goal

1297
02:05:08,480 --> 02:05:16,640
 right and that goal was or is net zero net zero by 2050 that's still in here and it was 46.3 percent

1298
02:05:16,640 --> 02:05:23,520
 of your from your baseline by 2030 which even out of their low carbons here we were going to

1299
02:05:23,520 --> 02:05:28,080
 miss quite a bit by 2030 because of the timing where we're starting we made up a lot of headway

1300
02:05:28,080 --> 02:05:36,720
 later in like between 2030 and 2050 okay so that um i'm so sorry so that is still still in here and

1301
02:05:36,720 --> 02:05:45,840
 the the purpose that this body addressed for the reason for the carbon action plan so i i think this

1302
02:05:45,840 --> 02:05:54,800
 is great i just wanted to tie this plan back to our original goal that's all i wanted to do here

1303
02:05:54,800 --> 02:06:00,160
 and it does clearly the one thing i think i said this in front of council too

1304
02:06:00,160 --> 02:06:06,080
 by keeping it simple here people don't get lost in what's in there i think it's right in front of

1305
02:06:06,080 --> 02:06:11,440
 them they can see that their actions that we all can take we all can accomplish and while they're

1306
02:06:11,440 --> 02:06:15,920
 big lifts they're still attainable so part of the feedback from council was how do we make it

1307
02:06:15,920 --> 02:06:21,280
 realistic not make it be perfection how do we make it realistic this presentation i feel makes it

1308
02:06:21,280 --> 02:06:27,280
 be realistic and attainable for the bulk of the community to understand and get behind it i think

1309
02:06:27,280 --> 02:06:36,560
 so too i think you did a great job you worked quite hard to do yeah okay all right um it says

1310
02:06:36,560 --> 02:06:41,840
 give staff direction regarding this plan so is everybody okay with this plan do we have any

1311
02:06:41,840 --> 02:06:50,080
 feedback for council or just i i'll just echo what you said i thought this was brilliant it shows how

1312
02:06:50,080 --> 02:06:54,560
 this is in alignment with so many of our other plans and our goals and our values as a city

1313
02:06:55,440 --> 02:06:59,440
 and it helps people see well if that's the case then it has all of these co-benefits that come

1314
02:06:59,440 --> 02:07:07,840
 along with our already agreed to value of getting to net zero by 2050 so i just think it's it's great

1315
02:07:07,840 --> 02:07:15,120
 i agree i mean you have a unanimous consent to move forward with our previous draft this was just a

1316
02:07:15,120 --> 02:07:20,720
 little bit more concise and i think the way that you build the bridges between our already adopted

1317
02:07:20,720 --> 02:07:26,880
 plans really really helps tie in why what we're doing is just a continuous and not something

1318
02:07:26,880 --> 02:07:31,920
 it's like a radical pivot that just clearly aligns us all under an umbrella that we can

1319
02:07:31,920 --> 02:07:37,120
 get behind i think that's a really nice way to distinctly do it so i recommend approval

1320
02:07:37,120 --> 02:07:44,560
 i recommend approval good thank you so much the only thing i would say is it allows us to take

1321
02:07:44,560 --> 02:07:49,280
 all those other measures and put them into a carbon reduction yeah who wants the carbon reduction

1322
02:07:49,280 --> 02:07:54,000
 yeah so you're just kind of pulling things for we're making it put it in perspective for the

1323
02:07:54,000 --> 02:08:01,760
 person we're talking to yeah that's great thank you very much all right we have got item e

1324
02:08:01,760 --> 02:08:09,040
 receiver report and hold a discussion about greensense incentive program expenditures

1325
02:08:13,040 --> 02:08:21,840
 and um i did phone a friend text a friend jp says that i can trust the state of the h reduction

1326
02:08:21,840 --> 02:08:29,680
 number that's in our power bi it's just for the h back and insulation but it's a 360

1327
02:08:29,680 --> 02:08:34,640
 thousand kilowatt hour reduction so i'll have to get you a number of rebates that that

1328
02:08:34,640 --> 02:08:40,000
 includes so they're going to try to get to the cost curve i know jp's done that before i was

1329
02:08:40,000 --> 02:08:48,080
 trying to find out the best of hearsay so just a little update today on where we are for instance

1330
02:08:48,080 --> 02:08:55,840
 for this year um i can't move um so we'll talk a little bit about the revisions that were made for

1331
02:08:55,840 --> 02:09:02,240
 this year where we are on the budget what we have upcoming and then our next steps

1332
02:09:05,440 --> 02:09:11,680
 so just the background y'all heard this before we began in 2009 um prior to the 24 update that

1333
02:09:11,680 --> 02:09:16,160
 incentive levels have been in place since fiscal year 18 so a significant amount of time without

1334
02:09:16,160 --> 02:09:22,640
 addressing the inflation program is administered by our department and funding through dme and only

1335
02:09:22,640 --> 02:09:29,280
 available to dme customers energy focused on heating and cooling and then we have a million

1336
02:09:29,280 --> 02:09:37,680
 dollars for this year just a little bit of an update on how they were increased so the rebates

1337
02:09:37,680 --> 02:09:46,240
 for h5 were significantly increased the attic insulation as well we did the e-bike rebate

1338
02:09:46,240 --> 02:09:49,120
 this year and we increased the electric vehicle rebate as well

1339
02:09:52,960 --> 02:09:59,760
 that was done away there we go um so for h5 we spent um this was as a

1340
02:09:59,760 --> 02:10:07,440
 531 65 000 that was 366 so we have about nine percent remaining of what we've marked for that

1341
02:10:07,440 --> 02:10:12,400
 for this year i think i've seen that where we kind of set up that budget it may actually be in your

1342
02:10:12,400 --> 02:10:19,760
 backup but it's not legible um that very small chart um we spent the presentation as well okay

1343
02:10:21,680 --> 02:10:27,840
 um we have about 62 remaining on insulation and then smart furnace that we've got a little bit

1344
02:10:27,840 --> 02:10:35,120
 of money there's two on the ev and the e-bike we adjusted both of those rebates in december

1345
02:10:35,120 --> 02:10:40,800
 and pulled a little bit of money from multifamily to to increase those because the demand was so

1346
02:10:40,800 --> 02:10:45,920
 high for them both of those are on hold again now they've gone through the adjusted amount

1347
02:10:46,560 --> 02:10:51,600
 so with us having less than 30 percent left we were focusing strictly on energy efficiency

1348
02:10:51,600 --> 02:10:59,760
 the bank giveaway is funded however incense i don't want to let you all know we have some giveaway

1349
02:10:59,760 --> 02:11:03,840
 events coming up for those we'll be at senior we'll be at mlk

1350
02:11:03,840 --> 02:11:09,840
 those are kind of ad hoc we try to

1351
02:11:16,320 --> 02:11:18,640
 and then if you have any questions about where we are so far

1352
02:11:18,640 --> 02:11:35,120
 okay i have i'm sorry everybody i have a question at what point um can we

1353
02:11:37,040 --> 02:11:47,680
 talk about adding something to our uh our rebates so like we can do the next meeting

1354
02:11:47,680 --> 02:11:53,120
 we can bring back funding recommendations in the manual just want to give you kind of an update

1355
02:11:53,120 --> 02:11:57,760
 on where we are and as we start moving through the modifications to the manual for next year

1356
02:11:57,760 --> 02:12:03,440
 we have some lessons learned um it's a lot more money and a lot more to the process

1357
02:12:04,480 --> 02:12:10,000
 but it's working we've got some things worked out we're working with um our procurement and

1358
02:12:10,000 --> 02:12:17,840
 our accounts payable folks to try to streamline it a little bit more so those are new again at

1359
02:12:17,840 --> 02:12:24,960
 end of the school right yes october 1 to clarify that that's part of the recommended budget council

1360
02:12:24,960 --> 02:12:31,040
 has to take action to adopt yes but it is being recommended to be included so if we were to do

1361
02:12:31,040 --> 02:12:36,080
 an amendment to the items or categories included in the program you would want to see that adopted

1362
02:12:36,080 --> 02:12:46,480
 for fy 25 yes the manual will have to be adopted all right so those discussions will come with a

1363
02:12:46,480 --> 02:12:52,720
 different presentation not this this was just the update okay all right thank you can we get

1364
02:12:52,720 --> 02:12:56,240
 suggestions here shouldn't you put them on the matrix we'll just wait till the matrix so that

1365
02:13:00,240 --> 02:13:03,440
 which brings us everybody to the matrix

1366
02:13:03,440 --> 02:13:11,760
 so um ed do you want to go ahead and sit down for a minute yeah i'd like to uh

1367
02:13:11,760 --> 02:13:18,240
 second what akili just mentioned about expansion of the incentive program

1368
02:13:18,240 --> 02:13:30,080
 with a particular focus on battery storage residential uh also i was curious as

1369
02:13:30,080 --> 02:13:36,080
 if there are any green sense incentives for low income households i know in looking over the

1370
02:13:36,080 --> 02:13:43,280
 the schedule of what's available it seems that the person has to make an expenditure for whatever

1371
02:13:43,280 --> 02:13:53,360
 they want to do before they can get the incentive and um i would like to talk about some policies

1372
02:13:53,360 --> 02:14:02,560
 where the rebates might be a bit easier for folks uh low income housing uh and

1373
02:14:02,560 --> 02:14:12,560
 maybe uh if there could be an audit of prior greenhouse disbursements and analyzing how the

1374
02:14:12,560 --> 02:14:19,200
 funds have been utilized by low income households uh i guess you could use the appraisal district

1375
02:14:19,760 --> 02:14:25,600
 for assessing home values i don't know but at any rate i i would like to open a discussion of

1376
02:14:25,600 --> 02:14:31,040
 making our green sense incentives uh easier to

1377
02:14:31,040 --> 02:14:38,720
 or yeah easier to to obtain by folks who may not have the money put down out front

1378
02:14:38,720 --> 02:14:42,240
 anyone else

1379
02:14:44,800 --> 02:14:51,600
 you want to have anything to add i would like to put it on the matrix to discuss additional

1380
02:14:51,600 --> 02:14:55,920
 categories or items or maybe we just call it an adjustment to the greensense program

1381
02:14:55,920 --> 02:15:01,520
 specifically in consideration of battery and top solar incentives

1382
02:15:01,520 --> 02:15:09,920
 and then also and this is a little bit out there and maybe it builds into the greensense program

1383
02:15:09,920 --> 02:15:15,760
 possibly too um in the space that i work in which is mostly ecological restoration there's been a

1384
02:15:15,760 --> 02:15:24,240
 number of municipalities moving towards managing green spaces in the sense of carbon sequestration

1385
02:15:24,240 --> 02:15:31,280
 or looking at it as a community that is very public health sense frisco lewisville grand prairie

1386
02:15:31,280 --> 02:15:38,720
 corinth for example are all racing ahead and looking at enhancing green spaces with

1387
02:15:39,520 --> 02:15:45,920
 pollinator habitat call it carbon sequestration areas that it does kind of feel that it's kind

1388
02:15:45,920 --> 02:15:51,280
 of slipping a little bit behind some of our peers and this might be something that we look at a

1389
02:15:51,280 --> 02:15:59,760
 partnership parks for so call it a matrix title consideration of green space enhancements

1390
02:16:06,080 --> 02:16:10,400
 and i would like to add a presentation for this body to discuss

1391
02:16:10,400 --> 02:16:19,120
 speakers and like the process for if we want to have that on the agenda or to add a little spot

1392
02:16:19,120 --> 02:16:23,600
 on our agenda that says if you want to speak you have to pull out of the car just so it's consistent

1393
02:16:23,600 --> 02:16:31,200
 for everyone and we can decide as a body if we want to have them or not and in the process for that

1394
02:16:35,280 --> 02:16:39,760
 and i don't that that may not be up to us it may be up to somebody else but

1395
02:16:39,760 --> 02:16:46,960
 um we'll kind of go that route just so we can look into that okay bring it back okay thank you

1396
02:16:46,960 --> 02:16:52,640
 okay um was there anything on staff reports you wanted to go over kathryn or

1397
02:16:52,640 --> 02:17:02,560
 don't we just have the matrix okay okay all right um anybody have any concluding items or

1398
02:17:02,560 --> 02:17:13,360
 hope you feel better i was just so excited about stuff just kidding all right well i appreciate

1399
02:17:13,360 --> 02:17:22,640
 everybody's time today and we will close the meeting at 3 18 thank you so oh i have a question

1400
02:17:22,640 --> 02:17:29,040
 we can't can't do that we just close oh really

1401
02:17:33,040 --> 02:17:33,120
 you