WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:12.100 Okay. It is Monday, June 3rd, 2024 at 5.30 p.m. and I'm going to call this Board of Ethics 00:00:12.100 --> 00:00:18.000 meeting to order. And do we have any presentations from the public? 00:00:18.000 --> 00:00:20.000 Not that I have seen anything, sir. 00:00:20.000 --> 00:00:29.000 Okay. So we will move on to items for consideration. So item 2A, BOE 24-21, 00:00:29.000 --> 00:00:38.000 consider approval of minutes from March 4th, 2024. So do we hear a motion in that order? 00:00:38.000 --> 00:00:40.000 Move. 00:00:40.000 --> 00:00:47.000 David Zeltner has moved to approve them. I'll sign. Andrea has seconded. So all in favor? 00:00:47.000 --> 00:00:49.000 Aye. 00:00:49.000 --> 00:01:00.000 So the minutes are approved. Item B, BOE 24-022, receive a report, hold a discussion, 00:01:00.000 --> 00:01:07.000 and give staff direction regarding future meeting topics. So I'll give it to Madison. 00:01:07.000 --> 00:01:13.000 I have prepared the agenda item I always prepare. Our next meeting is in August. 00:01:13.000 --> 00:01:19.000 We have a break in July for our schedule because we usually need the beginning and 00:01:19.000 --> 00:01:24.000 because of the fourth holiday. And then we have a break in September for a similar 00:01:24.000 --> 00:01:29.000 holiday reason, I believe. And so then our meeting after that is in October. So right 00:01:29.000 --> 00:01:35.000 now, apart from doing our annual ethics training in October, there's nothing on the 00:01:35.000 --> 00:01:43.000 agenda. So I'd like to get direction on what to do next meeting. Some of the potential 00:01:43.000 --> 00:01:48.000 agenda topics that y'all discussed previously are on the slide. 00:01:48.000 --> 00:01:57.000 I did want to say tomorrow we finally get to go to the city council to take the two 00:01:57.000 --> 00:02:05.000 things that we have spent many hours deliberating. So hopefully, I'm the one who 00:02:05.000 --> 00:02:10.000 did not think that we should meet last month. So if you're unhappy about that, please 00:02:10.000 --> 00:02:15.000 blame me. I just didn't feel that until we got to go to council that we really had 00:02:15.000 --> 00:02:27.000 anything to talk about. So I want to talk, can we talk about what do we do if they 00:02:27.000 --> 00:02:32.000 say no to these things that we've thought about? And what do we do if they say yes? 00:02:32.000 --> 00:02:36.000 As long as we're talking about future agenda topics, I think we're good. 00:02:36.000 --> 00:02:44.000 Right, yeah. That's important. So if they pass these things, 00:02:44.000 --> 00:02:53.000 then I really think that we should get busy and start looking at some of the other 00:02:53.000 --> 00:03:00.000 little things that work, or maybe not little. If they don't, then I'd like to 00:03:00.000 --> 00:03:11.000 hear what you think is next. What should we do next meeting topics? 00:03:11.000 --> 00:03:15.000 Can we put an item on the agenda to review their recommendations? 00:03:15.000 --> 00:03:20.000 Yes, good. I think that is exactly what I was going to say. 00:03:20.000 --> 00:03:27.000 So if we have an agenda item, then we can discuss whatever. If they project some 00:03:27.000 --> 00:03:31.000 or all of it, we can at least have it on the agenda so we can discuss it in a 00:03:31.000 --> 00:03:37.000 meeting and then make a plan for if we need to modify our recommendations and 00:03:37.000 --> 00:03:45.000 then resubmit or I don't know what we would do. But if it's not on the agenda, 00:03:45.000 --> 00:03:50.000 then we as a group are not going to have an opportunity to discuss that and 00:03:50.000 --> 00:03:53.000 address any concerns. Good point. 00:03:53.000 --> 00:03:59.000 And I think whatever we get back, I mean at times there's also been guidance, 00:03:59.000 --> 00:04:04.000 correct? It's like guidance in terms of like maybe tightening up language or 00:04:04.000 --> 00:04:09.000 definitions and things like that. So I think we would be much better off using 00:04:09.000 --> 00:04:17.000 the meeting next month to discuss what comes out of the city council meeting 00:04:17.000 --> 00:04:23.000 and then plan our year starting October with those topics and those 00:04:23.000 --> 00:04:26.000 considerations in mind. 00:04:26.000 --> 00:04:31.000 If they do take both of our recommendations, maybe we could talk about 00:04:31.000 --> 00:04:37.000 and we have this little grid of potential topics so maybe we could require 00:04:37.000 --> 00:04:42.000 more of that. 00:04:42.000 --> 00:04:47.000 Yeah, I wouldn't want to use -- if they accept our recommendations, I don't 00:04:47.000 --> 00:04:52.000 think it would make sense to have a whole meeting where we're just, you know, 00:04:52.000 --> 00:05:01.000 celebrating. 00:05:01.000 --> 00:05:06.000 Yeah, and then I have just a couple of things, minor issues with what will 00:05:06.000 --> 00:05:11.000 actually I guess be presented tomorrow. You said the next meeting, you mean 00:05:11.000 --> 00:05:14.000 August, not July, right? 00:05:14.000 --> 00:05:15.000 Yeah, August. 00:05:15.000 --> 00:05:22.000 Two very minor things, language-wise. 00:05:22.000 --> 00:05:25.000 Are we talking about to discuss in August or? 00:05:25.000 --> 00:05:26.000 Yes. 00:05:26.000 --> 00:05:32.000 Okay. What is being presented tomorrow, I cannot change at this point. 00:05:32.000 --> 00:05:35.000 Because it's our meeting. 00:05:35.000 --> 00:05:41.000 And I want to say, Madison, you did a really wonderful job of pinpointing the 00:05:41.000 --> 00:05:48.000 topics because they're kind of complicated and I think you -- I so 00:05:48.000 --> 00:05:51.000 appreciate the very good work you do. 00:05:51.000 --> 00:05:54.000 So that letter I signed, I didn't write it. 00:05:54.000 --> 00:05:56.000 I did read it before I signed it. 00:05:56.000 --> 00:06:00.000 I completely agree with that and I've already sent Madison a message saying 00:06:00.000 --> 00:06:04.000 that these are two very minor points just with the language itself, not 00:06:04.000 --> 00:06:06.000 changing anything. 00:06:06.000 --> 00:06:10.000 Under the definition of relative that you're going to be discussing or 00:06:10.000 --> 00:06:16.000 presenting tomorrow, it says with regard to the latest individual state 00:06:16.000 --> 00:06:18.000 income. 00:06:18.000 --> 00:06:24.000 I think we're off-posting because we're supposed to be talking about it. 00:06:24.000 --> 00:06:31.000 So maybe a topic would be tweaking anything that just passed. 00:06:31.000 --> 00:06:35.000 Just clarifying what's going to be discussed tomorrow, that's all. 00:06:35.000 --> 00:06:38.000 That's not what the posting is on the agenda. 00:06:38.000 --> 00:06:41.000 I think for our meeting today is what he's saying. 00:06:41.000 --> 00:06:47.000 We don't have that on our agenda for today. 00:06:47.000 --> 00:06:49.000 Well, just last-minute clarification there. 00:06:49.000 --> 00:06:51.000 I mean, we're not changing anything. 00:06:51.000 --> 00:06:56.000 There's two wording, some wording in here that I just wanted to mention. 00:06:56.000 --> 00:06:58.000 If it changes anything, I don't know at this point. 00:06:58.000 --> 00:07:04.000 But I was just concerned about that word plus the fact that -- let me just 00:07:04.000 --> 00:07:08.000 throw this in for whatever it's worth. 00:07:08.000 --> 00:07:15.000 Under the -- you have done a fine job here with this burden of proof issue. 00:07:15.000 --> 00:07:25.000 The only thing that I was curious about was under Section 282, there is -- 00:07:25.000 --> 00:07:34.000 it is still possible for a respondent -- hang on here for just two seconds. 00:07:34.000 --> 00:07:36.000 This is just clarifying what's going to be discussed tomorrow. 00:07:36.000 --> 00:07:37.000 That's all. 00:07:37.000 --> 00:07:41.000 I would like to hear this because I might ask a question. 00:07:41.000 --> 00:07:42.000 Well, this isn't what we're posting. 00:07:42.000 --> 00:07:43.000 Oh, okay. 00:07:43.000 --> 00:07:45.000 Well, then we can't talk about it. 00:07:45.000 --> 00:07:49.000 If you want to talk to Madison after the meeting about it, 00:07:49.000 --> 00:07:54.000 you can talk about it, but we're not posting for that in this meeting right now. 00:07:54.000 --> 00:07:56.000 Well, that's fine then if you don't want to. 00:07:56.000 --> 00:07:57.000 Okay. 00:07:57.000 --> 00:07:58.000 I'm just clarifying -- 00:07:58.000 --> 00:08:00.000 I just don't want you to violate the open meeting fact. 00:08:00.000 --> 00:08:02.000 In case there are questions coming from counsel tomorrow, 00:08:02.000 --> 00:08:08.000 that's all I'm doing is just trying to address any confusion that might come up. 00:08:08.000 --> 00:08:13.000 Well, it wouldn't be a telma violation if he talked to you and I listened. 00:08:13.000 --> 00:08:15.000 Would that be -- 00:08:15.000 --> 00:08:16.000 As long as it's not a quorum. 00:08:16.000 --> 00:08:17.000 Right. 00:08:17.000 --> 00:08:18.000 Okay. 00:08:18.000 --> 00:08:19.000 You can -- 00:08:19.000 --> 00:08:20.000 Okay. 00:08:20.000 --> 00:08:24.000 I suggest that you all just individually talk to Madison about whatever concerns you have 00:08:24.000 --> 00:08:28.000 about what's going to come up tomorrow, just on your own, 00:08:28.000 --> 00:08:34.000 but not in this meeting where we have quorum and we need to be following our posting. 00:08:34.000 --> 00:08:35.000 Okay. 00:08:35.000 --> 00:08:37.000 No, I'm 100% in favor. 00:08:37.000 --> 00:08:38.000 There were just two things. 00:08:38.000 --> 00:08:43.000 In case it came up tomorrow, I just wanted to clarify that -- 00:08:43.000 --> 00:08:48.000 And you can do that with Madison after the meeting. 00:08:48.000 --> 00:08:53.000 In this position. 00:08:53.000 --> 00:08:58.000 Well, I'm guessing that if they have a question, then I'll hear it. 00:08:58.000 --> 00:08:59.000 Okay. 00:08:59.000 --> 00:09:00.000 Here it is. 00:09:00.000 --> 00:09:01.000 Okay. 00:09:01.000 --> 00:09:02.000 Last one. 00:09:02.000 --> 00:09:03.000 I promise. 00:09:03.000 --> 00:09:04.000 Under 282 -- 00:09:04.000 --> 00:09:07.000 Can I ask that we move forward with the agenda? 00:09:07.000 --> 00:09:08.000 Let's move forward with the agenda. 00:09:08.000 --> 00:09:11.000 Well, it's only in case there's a question -- 00:09:11.000 --> 00:09:16.000 Maybe I'll talk with you in Madison afterwards, as long as nobody else is present. 00:09:16.000 --> 00:09:22.000 282A4, the complainant failed to testify at a hearing. 00:09:22.000 --> 00:09:23.000 That's it. 00:09:23.000 --> 00:09:27.000 That's just maybe something that would come up in discussion. 00:09:27.000 --> 00:09:31.000 That possibly should have been included with the -- so that's it. 00:09:31.000 --> 00:09:32.000 Okay. 00:09:32.000 --> 00:09:33.000 We can talk about it. 00:09:33.000 --> 00:09:34.000 Offline. 00:09:34.000 --> 00:09:39.000 Yeah, I mean, it was not redlined as it probably should have been, 00:09:39.000 --> 00:09:42.000 just to match what's over here on the -- that's it. 00:09:42.000 --> 00:09:46.000 We're not changing anything, just clarifying in case you're asked tomorrow 00:09:46.000 --> 00:09:48.000 or in case something comes up. 00:09:48.000 --> 00:09:49.000 Yes, that goes along with -- 00:09:49.000 --> 00:09:50.000 Okay. 00:09:50.000 --> 00:09:51.000 We're moving on. 00:09:51.000 --> 00:09:52.000 All right. 00:09:52.000 --> 00:09:53.000 All right. 00:09:53.000 --> 00:09:54.000 Thank you. 00:09:54.000 --> 00:10:02.000 So I would suggest that -- I know we were going to talk about definition of complainant. 00:10:02.000 --> 00:10:06.000 Yeah, that was -- we had talked about talking about that next, basically. 00:10:06.000 --> 00:10:07.000 Yeah. 00:10:07.000 --> 00:10:12.000 That, to me, that's an easy one to put up. 00:10:12.000 --> 00:10:17.000 I'm looking at the agenda information sheet. 00:10:17.000 --> 00:10:39.000 So do you guys -- okay, I can pull it up, but that would be weird. 00:10:39.000 --> 00:10:49.000 All right. 00:10:49.000 --> 00:11:01.000 There's a tentative reading topics. 00:11:01.000 --> 00:11:02.000 This one? 00:11:02.000 --> 00:11:05.000 Yeah. 00:11:05.000 --> 00:11:06.000 Yeah. 00:11:06.000 --> 00:11:13.000 Okay. 00:11:13.000 --> 00:11:19.000 Or I guess the one before, I'm actually looking at the agenda information sheet. 00:11:19.000 --> 00:11:23.000 All right, that's the second one. 00:11:23.000 --> 00:11:25.000 Okay, yeah. 00:11:25.000 --> 00:11:33.000 So perhaps put definition of complainant on for the first thing in August. 00:11:33.000 --> 00:11:41.000 And then what other -- 00:11:41.000 --> 00:11:55.000 Is the management report that you normally list on there with the discussion of the city council direction or comments, would that fall under that or is that a separate topic? 00:11:55.000 --> 00:12:03.000 I think it depends a little on what they do. If they give direction, I'll probably bring that as a separate item. 00:12:03.000 --> 00:12:10.000 If they just adopt everything, I'll probably just give a management report that says, you did it. 00:12:10.000 --> 00:12:18.000 And then also probably include something about how the annual training will be changed to reflect the changes. 00:12:18.000 --> 00:12:33.000 I have a topic that's not on this list. I would like to look at what the citizens voted on in -- was it 2015? 00:12:33.000 --> 00:12:45.000 And I would like to look at whether or not our code fulfills those four things they said we should do. 00:12:45.000 --> 00:12:50.000 So just so I understand, like the specific ballot language that was included? 00:12:50.000 --> 00:12:51.000 Right. 00:12:51.000 --> 00:12:53.000 We can get that. 00:12:53.000 --> 00:12:55.000 I think that would be very important. 00:12:55.000 --> 00:12:59.000 Would you like that to be an item or would you like me to just provide that information? 00:12:59.000 --> 00:13:00.000 I would like it to be an item. 00:13:00.000 --> 00:13:02.000 Okay. 00:13:02.000 --> 00:13:06.000 What do you guys think about that? 00:13:06.000 --> 00:13:08.000 So that's one that was first voted in? 00:13:08.000 --> 00:13:13.000 Yeah, there were four things that were voted on and I would like to look at all four of them. 00:13:13.000 --> 00:13:20.000 And I would like to start considering how we can make sure the code covers those four things. 00:13:20.000 --> 00:13:24.000 Okay, that makes sense. 00:13:24.000 --> 00:13:26.000 To me, that's very important. 00:13:26.000 --> 00:13:30.000 Yeah, I guess -- is there a direction to put that on August? 00:13:30.000 --> 00:13:33.000 Yes, please. Are you guys okay with that? 00:13:33.000 --> 00:13:40.000 Because I feel like that would inform the future. 00:13:40.000 --> 00:13:44.000 I would like to second that also because of those four, 00:13:44.000 --> 00:13:50.000 the first one referred to having a conflict of interest code, which we've done. 00:13:50.000 --> 00:13:55.000 But the issues are the appearance of impropriety. 00:13:55.000 --> 00:13:59.000 That was to be in the introduction to this code. 00:13:59.000 --> 00:14:05.000 And for some reason during its authorship, whatever, that word "appearance" got struck. 00:14:05.000 --> 00:14:14.000 And so when the voters went to the polls in November of 2015, that was one of the four things that they expected to see. 00:14:14.000 --> 00:14:23.000 The fourth was the disposition of an ethics complaint, sanctions only. 00:14:23.000 --> 00:14:34.000 Or when the Charter Committee met in 2015, they discussed not only sanctions, but the possibility of fines being applied. 00:14:34.000 --> 00:14:40.000 And so all of that got dropped when the City Council went to work actually constructing this code. 00:14:40.000 --> 00:14:43.000 So there are four -- I've got it copied. 00:14:43.000 --> 00:14:46.000 Are those just the reasons why I want to put this on each other? 00:14:46.000 --> 00:14:50.000 Well, yeah. Just to clarify. 00:14:50.000 --> 00:14:52.000 I understand. 00:14:52.000 --> 00:14:56.000 Well, for the others and for the record. So that's all. 00:14:56.000 --> 00:15:05.000 So yeah, so we'll look at what the language the voters voted on that led to the ordinance that we have that was created in 2018. 00:15:05.000 --> 00:15:11.000 So I think that should cover August very well. 00:15:11.000 --> 00:15:15.000 And then I would think that would inform the future. 00:15:15.000 --> 00:15:22.000 Yeah, so we'll have an update on what occurs tomorrow. 00:15:22.000 --> 00:15:29.000 We'll have a look at what the origins of the ethics ordinance, I guess, I'll call it that. 00:15:29.000 --> 00:15:36.000 And then you also want to include definition of complaint, or no? 00:15:36.000 --> 00:15:42.000 I guess wait, because I feel like that other thing that I put up is going to be a big item. 00:15:42.000 --> 00:15:46.000 Yeah, and we can discuss if everyone is okay with that. 00:15:46.000 --> 00:15:54.000 If we have time for that, or not, depending on what happens tomorrow, if that's fine with the rest of the board. 00:15:54.000 --> 00:15:55.000 Yes. 00:15:55.000 --> 00:15:57.000 For definition. 00:15:57.000 --> 00:15:59.000 Leave it on, are you saying? 00:15:59.000 --> 00:16:05.000 We'll say tentatively, and then if you think we'll have time in August, we'll just decide that offline. 00:16:05.000 --> 00:16:07.000 Because we can always put it for the next meeting. 00:16:07.000 --> 00:16:09.000 Yeah, we can always postpone it. 00:16:09.000 --> 00:16:12.000 Right. 00:16:12.000 --> 00:16:17.000 So you're going to force me with us tomorrow? 00:16:17.000 --> 00:16:19.000 It's going to go pretty well. 00:16:19.000 --> 00:16:21.000 Thank you, Dustin. 00:16:21.000 --> 00:16:23.000 Dustin says it's going to be great. 00:16:23.000 --> 00:16:24.000 I like that. 00:16:24.000 --> 00:16:26.000 Let's do this. 00:16:26.000 --> 00:16:27.000 Okay. 00:16:27.000 --> 00:16:29.000 Thank you for the direction. 00:16:29.000 --> 00:16:37.000 The next meeting is scheduled for August 5th at 5.30 p.m., like, are you equal time? 00:16:37.000 --> 00:16:41.000 So, I guess that's the end of our meeting. 00:16:41.000 --> 00:16:47.000 So, seeing no more comments, this meeting is adjourned at 5.47. 00:16:47.000 --> 00:16:52.000 It is the shortest meeting we have ever had. 00:16:52.000 --> 00:16:53.000 Great job.