Good morning, everyone.
We are here at the mobility committee.
Today is Wednesday, March 27, 2024, 10 a.m.
We're here in the city's council work session room.
We have determined that a quorum has been reached.
We are going to start with our citizens' comment on any agenda items.
Have you all heard of any citizens' comments or the agenda items, okay?
So we'll go to number two, items for individual consideration.
MC2 -- before I start that, I do want to make a note very early on that for item D, MC24-006,
we have this information that has been sent to the committee on this -- in this area.
So what we're going to do is we're going to ask for you all to click on those items and
get those updates there, like we have done.
So we're not going to spend any time going through those visuals, but we will set it
up for us to ask any questions if we have any from the committee.
So going back up to item A, MC24-005, consider approval of the minutes of February 28, 2024.
Do we have any -- can we get a motion for approval?
>> Approve approval.
>> Okay.
Any second?
Okay.
So we've got a second that.
Do we have any discussion of anything?
All right.
So let's get a vote for approval.
Raise your hand.
Okay.
It's been moved and approved.
MC24-007, receive a report and hold a discussion regarding the City of Denton Transportation
Mobility Project status update.
Good morning.
>> Good morning.
Let's see if I can work this.
Is it on the second one?
>> Second tab.
>> At the top?
>> Second.
>> Second tab.
Why didn't you say that?
Okay.
John Polster with Innovative Transportation Solutions.
We'll be going over these projects fairly quickly today because we went through them
fairly thoroughly last month and I don't want to take all of y'all's time again.
Again, 35 North is a project from -- I'll show you the map from basically the Fort Worth
Drive 77 -- I mean the 77 Drive impact at the -- right by the truck stop north all the
way to the county line and it's being built in three phases, all of them which are funded
at a little over $800 million.
And you'll see the yellow is in the utility zones and mostly what we've done since we
met last with y'all is updated what we are in the utilities, City of Denton is the most
important, it's clear in those segments and so they are on track for their various let
dates between '24 and '27 and those are in those years because that's where those dollar
amounts are for those various CSJs.
Just plugging away on the utilities on that.
The merge, let's April 4th and it'll go from the $2.35 up to $2.77, it's about a little
over $480 million and when it goes under the knife it will not be pleasant in that section
of the city.
And so if it goes -- when they let April 4th, when it lets April 4th, it'll probably be
about 60 days before you actually see the contractor out because they have to get their
contract signed, their bond documents in, mobilize and then so you'll probably start
seeing them in the summer, early part of the summer, actually start putting your barricades
up, your SW3P fences, your storm water prevention, that's what SW3P is, is those fences that
they put up to keep the silt from coming out and so you'll see a lot of staging, a lot
of moving into their sites for their offices, but probably by the end of summer you'll start
to see heavy activity in the corridor.
Awesome.
Excuse me?
I said awesome.
Oh, I'm not usually getting positive feedback.
No, I meant that, I'm happy.
Okay, so the Mayo job, the utilities are progressing, that's the major critical path, all the utilities
are on track for completion in the November timeframe, but the funding for this project
is in the June 2025 let date so we probably won't be able to get that moved up, but what's
also happening at the same time is your project on May Hill is scheduled to be completed around
October, November, so that gives us a little bit of a reprieve and then 12 months later
we come back and start all over again.
And we have coordinated with TechStat since our last meeting and the county to let them
know that we will be progressing the segment of May Hill between the 35 job and your Colorado
project as a regional total revenue project, we'll do it like what we're doing in Lewisville,
where it's different funding category, but it'll be let with the 35 project.
Okay.
When you say reconstruct the interchange there, will you be changing the design of that or
will it just be a- Yeah, so right now it's a, I think two, three
lanes go under, two through and a continuous left, and there's six lanes of traffic going
over the May Hill.
This will look like Luke 288, where you've got a huge interchange there and it will have
12 lanes going under, six general purpose lanes, four turning lanes, and two Texas U-turns
on either end.
And then we will build the ultimate section on the bridge structure, which will include
the six general purpose lanes and the four toll manage lanes for the future when the
toll manage lanes come through up to 380.
So it'll be fairly significant.
And we go all the way north to the Luke 288 intersection and at Brinker, we flip one of
the frontage roads so that it goes up even with the main lanes and back down.
So if you're going from exiting May Hill to get to Luke 288, you won't have to stop at
the Brinker light going north.
And if you exit 288 trying to get to May Hill, you won't have to stop at a light at Brinker
going south.
So they'll have one frontage road go to the signal, and then one frontage road go up and
over and bypass the signal in both directions.
Very significant improvements.
Once this is done, this whole L area is going to open up.
My husband just texted me and said, "Yay."
You got to remember people are watching.
Okay, 35W frontage roads.
This is called the middle section because, like I told you last month, nobody wants to
build a section from 2449 up to a railroad track because it's just basically a drainage
job.
Right now, there's no funding.
But after this unified transportation plan is approved in August, there will be funding
allocated to this project.
And we will start to segment what portions of those frontage roads need to be built first.
We're looking at somewhere around 188 to 204 million of the 423 million.
So what we'll end up doing is finding those segments that are most critical and then build
not only the frontage roads, but if there are interchanges in that particular segment
that we choose, we'll build the full future grade separation in that area as well.
So if we're at 2449, we'll do that; if we're at 407, we'll do that; Crawford and Robeson,
we'll do that with it.
And it's got a ready to let of September 2025, which means all the stuff that we need
to get done is ready to go and we'll coordinate with city staff.
Scott's pretty good at letting me know what he wants financially and we'll identify places
to start.
Did I hear you say you thought it was about 60% drainage?
Is that what I was hearing?
No, this segment from 2449 up, if you look at the two projects, the merge and this one,
there's a gap.
So when I call it 35W middle, everybody goes, "Well, it's the northern half.
Why is it called middle?"
Well, we're leaving that little piece out because it's just a drainage job.
And so there's no development that attaches there.
So the four lanes that are there will stay there.
Okay.
Appreciate that, thank you.
So this is the 380 job from 288 out to 377.
It's essentially substantially complete.
They're just basically doing cleanup on some of the peripheral stuff, the pedestrian rails,
the striping, some of what I call the farming, where they're putting this grass and stuff
out to make it grow.
And there will be daily lane closures, but essentially the six-lane divided facility
is open to traffic.
Yeah, so this is wrapping up.
We're all done, but the dotting of the I's, and so how much delay do you think there'll
be before the bypass project?
Just an estimate.
I'm not asking to pin you down, but are we looking at a year or a year or two, because
sort of like when do we stop and start?
Because that feels pretty close in the scheme of things, but not really.
So I'm moving to the bypass that you were talking about, and we're looking at being
environmentally clear next year.
So what that means is we've got the schematic approved and the environmental process completed,
and the alignment is set and established.
And so what'll happen, probably starting the first part of 2025, is TextDOT will retain
a firm to begin what's the right-of-way acquisition, and then depending upon how long they think
that'll take, they will start utility relocations.
Because when they fund the right-of-way on a project, it comes out of a different bucket
than their constrained construction bucket.
It's a bucket that is statewide, so whoever's fastest gets the mostest.
And so North Texas is always usually the fastest.
So when you get right-of-way money for a project, you also get the utility relocation dollars.
So if they start the right-of-way, then right on behind that, they'll start the utility
relocations.
And the reason they do it staggered is because a lot of times the utilities need to be in
TextDOT right-of-way, the future right-of-way, and so the state has to buy the right-of-way
first for them to be able to move.
So you're talking probably 27 before we actually start constructing any of this, and that's
assuming I come up with $92 million somewhere, which I will when it always works out.
It does, it works out.
For staff, I think we just need to integrate tightly with the businesses and the residences
in that corridor, so we minimize start and stop on those folks.
So the other loop...
Excuse me.
Oh, do I...
Where am I supposed to be?
Go back to the bridge.
Yeah.
That's right there.
That's good.
And you can even go to the summary there, because I had a question about the summary
area.
Where's my mouse?
This one or this one?
It's the next page.
That page right there.
This one?
Yeah.
Okay.
I was going to ask about the, I guess, the edge of the roadway that have those concrete
barriers there.
When you talk about the pedestrian rail, pedestrians are going to be able to walk across the bridge,
and there is some railing that I kind of noticed, but wasn't really paying attention to.
Is that the permanent railing that we're talking about?
Yes.
So if you're talking about the very outside...
Yeah, the very outside.
I would cross over the lake.
Yeah.
The concrete barrier there is a concrete barrier to preclude vehicles from...
Right.
Then on top of that, they put a ped rail, because people are taller in general than
cars are.
Right.
So that's the ability to fall over by putting a ped rail along the concrete barrier.
And how wide is that sidewalk?
They're usually five and a half, six feet.
Oh, is that so wide?
At least five feet, but typically they're six on a state facility.
And that's required.
I mean, the state has been doing it lately anyway, but the feds require us to include
sidewalks on everything we build.
Right.
That's what I'm saying.
Do you think people have an opportunity to safely ride a bike across there?
Is that...
Have you all thought of...
I can't answer that question.
Is that a bike?
Oh, we have the bike person.
I've ridden from Mayhill along 380 just past the green belt, because I wanted to see how
far it goes.
And there was some railing on the outside to prevent me from falling in the water that
was still incomplete.
It was just wood.
And you could tell they weren't done with that yet, but yeah, I mean, it's a little
uncomfortable because fast traffic, but I mean, yes, I can get to the...
They can get to the green belt at this point.
On the north side, there's a 10 foot shared use path from 288 all the way to the green
belt.
And that was something that the city was very instrumental in getting done.
Okay.
So that's pretty nice.
And there is like a little driveway that people use to fish.
For fishing.
It's still there.
Is that going to be affected by any of this project at all?
They reconstructed it.
I'm not sure what that driveway's for.
It may be a Corps of Engineers access point, but it was there when the project started,
so they had to put it back.
Okay.
And yeah, just starting at the middle of March to about the middle of April is when the sand
bass run, and that's why you see all those vehicles up there.
Pecan Creek's running right behind my house, and so people are always cutting through my
property to get to the creek on the Corp.
That's how I know when the fish start running, when people start trespassing.
And the other thing is that median, I may have asked this question last month and forgotten
the answer, but that median is just the same color as the roadway and at night.
Is there going to be any kind of improvement or some breaks or something?
That median is the median.
I don't know if the city has, I'll have to go look to see if the plans call for any kind
of aesthetic.
Recreation.
Right.
A lot of times the city will come in with some of that paystone, but I don't think that
this project has that, but I can go look.
But no, it's what you see out there, if it's the middle of the road, that this project
is essentially complete, so what you see is what's going to be there.
Okay.
I just thought it was just a little bit, you know, it was just too, the aesthetic was just
too simple, you know, for someone that never drives through that way, but, you know, people
that are around here that drive back and forth that way, we know there's a very wide median
there.
Right.
But anyway, that's just my thought.
Anybody else have any other questions?
Striping?
Okay.
All right.
Well, thank you for that.
So the other 288 is the western portion, and essentially we are in the middle of acquiring
a right-of-way on this project, advancing the PS&E on this project.
We had a little bit of an environmental modification down here for Underwood that's progressing
properly and we coordinated with the city and the property owners out there.
And so this project is just two frontage roads, north and southbound.
We're looking at somewhere around a little over $220 million.
We would do great separations at the railroad track and at 380 initially.
And then in the future, we'd have to find out where the other ones are consistent with
the city's thoroughfare plan.
And we are looking at it being ready about this time in two years from now.
And again, I keep saying this every time I talk, you'll see that this timeframe is a
lot longer than the other ones I've shown you.
And that the reason is because of all of the gas wells out there and the transmission lines
that we have to deal with.
Any questions on that one?
And then we just talked, we can talk more about this one if you want.
I've given Scott the schematic, preliminary schematic for this area.
He and his staff are analyzing that and when I guess at some point we'll come and bring
all that to you guys to go over, jot until chapter and verse on it to make sure we're
all swing on the same side of the plate.
We've got a question.
Is that between the two of you, is that the same schematic that you used in the presentation
last night?
No.
You'll see a new one.
Okay.
Yeah, for this, I'll just prelude my comment on this one and the outer loop in general
comment.
I'm not asking you to skip to it.
I would really love to see all the proto-alignments.
If the combination of the group could get those, I mean I know there might be 12 of
them and six of them have almost no probability but I would love to see the alignments as
they've been trimmed down from where they were in the past for both the bypass and the
outer loop just because the questions are endless and there's no ability to get in front
of it at all and even if you're trying to mitigate fear, uncertainty, and doubt in the
people, even if you do what you do is put a big cloud on it and say we're not sure,
that's actually making it worse.
That's not me that's doing that.
The thinking was if I show the 22 alignments that are because the federal process says
if somebody says in this stage of the process why don't you go across the dam on Ray Roberts,
you got to put a line on a map and tell them why that won't work because the court won't
let you touch their dam but you got to put it on and then take it off.
Right now if I was to put all the alignments that have been suggested by all of the civil
engineers that live in the northern part of your city and county, it would look like that
green blob so we just did the green blob so that there's no there there until and we're
down to seven and they're really not seven, they're two alternatives that have different
meandering on the ends because we have certain criteria we have to hit for the court to hit
so we can get you that it's a at the staff level that's okay to communicate but every
time we show alignments that are that are we're just suggested to us that we have to
go run the matrix on every time we show that we add to the confusion and what the and that's
because the federal choir what we're trying to do is minimize that yeah that silliness.
I appreciate that and so if the either me or the committee in general I think if we
could get that I would I would love to to see those yeah and there's literally I think
in the next in what time is it in about five minutes there's a Denton County Outer Loop
meeting fixing to start that my staff's going to so there we're meeting almost every week
on that project because there's some some some well if I knew you'd be I'd say some
rat to kill but I won't say that there's something we got to get dealt with on that
project so it's easy enough to bring it to the staff or to to elected officials but just
we don't want to broadly distribute it yet because it most of it's inaccurate by design
so Luke 28 basically a frontage road job the main lanes are there and we're looking at
it cleared in July so you're talking probably two years after that 27 before we have a chance
to start it and we got to get the money and text that really wants this road as well and
so do y'all because that way you can push truck traffic completely out of your downtown
area and everything I just told you is basically what's in the yellow there okay so again Bonnie
Bray is a segment right here we just show it separately because we're funding it with
federal dollars and state dollars and not city dollars but it's one of y'all segments
that you call Bonnie Bray segment 7 and then 1515 we're just punching the clock we're getting
trying to get ready to let summer next year and it's a you know it's only 34 million so
shouldn't be too hard and this is another one where we've designed it the way the city
wants and the reason I think this project will let sooner than later is because it's
a brand spanking new road 10 inches of asphalt you know maybe seven inches of asphalt like
10 inches of concrete so it's a very good road and the city has suggested that in the
future they would be willing to take it off system as long as it was reconstructed that
way you can manage it because there's a lot of big businesses out here and you're constrained
to know what you can do with that road while it's on system but once you build it to six
lanes divided you get you know 40-year life concrete then you take it off system and manage
it the way you want that's going to be really really nice that is a very very useful idea
whoever came up with that idea I certainly do applaud them because that's a very busy
tight road in there have you all been in been over through that seeing those roads I always
get stuck at the frontage road and the bridge those people coming out are not nice working
all day they want to get home yeah I 1173 this project is going to be ready you know
February 25 we are in the process of completing utilities we're going to be focusing again
from the rural track back east to include in the 35 job so that'll adjust the cost
of the project once we take that in to the bigger 35 project and we are coordinating
with crumb on some issues with their historic downtown area but as long as they make up
their mind we'll be able to help them outer loop again we are looking at summer 26 to
be completed essentially there are three alignments with dangling parciples on either end that
we have to look at and we'll get you we'll get something set up through Scott and everybody
to get a briefing on it so you'll know because literally it's Salina Aubrey Krugerville
and Denton are the critical stakeholders other than the county which is driving the boat
and then text up in the car so it's important that we keep you guys in the loop and Alma
Locus starts supposed to let project has been awarded so they're saying it should take what's
the there are 118 working days eight months of barricades so they think it's eight months
and we're coordinating on the pre-con meeting so I drive that road all the time and it's
embarrassing it's very bad and every time I would drive down that road I think about
you I don't have kidney stones because I always and that's my report right are there any additional
questions before we move on thank you John okay well we'll move on to see em see two
four days zero zero one receive a report and hold a discussion regarding bike lanes a practical
perspective on the u.s. best practices bike lane
apparently they already have your exhibits on tab already morning chair morning committee
members morning for last few months transportation services division received a lot of requests
regarding bike lanes and we're responding to them all and this presentation is basically
a summary of collective inquiry on from all of those requests and and we just try to split
it into three sections where we will have introduction of best u.s. best practices and
then we'll also talk about jurisdictional perspectives on how we are in Texas and all
as well as in city of Denton how we are dealing with bike lanes and then also briefly I'll
talk about what's the way forward and how we how transportation services division and
city of Denton is looking at bike lanes when it comes to future implementations and planning
so the u.s. best practice groups the bike lanes into four distinct types including conventional
bike lanes buffered bike lanes contra flow and left side bike lanes when it comes to
conventional bike lanes that's the standard practice that's all over u.s. most cities
have these types of bike lanes they are basically on both side they could be provided on both
sides of the directions on the on any given facility and some of the demerits are that
they have little buffer when it comes to the separation between door zones on right side
or left side car parkings as well as and the bikers so that essentially means that the
bikers would be very close to the door zones and in many cases if the drivers or the users
of vehicles are not careful they would just open the door and could cause an incident
another issue is that they have minimum buffer between the modes of travel where these could
possess challenge for the bikers where they are too close to the other modes of travel
especially I've seen in many cases if there's a multimodal environment large buses or trucks
would be passing very close in a very close proximity to the bikers and posing the risk
factor simply increases so another so this is just a basic design or some of the design
not if not complete design sketch for for these lanes but some of the key things include
that their width should be six feet and I've seen wider as well but in certain locations
but six feet is a minimum and then signage is is one of the most important aspect it
should be complying to the TM UTCD and generally MUTCD requirements are 317 and then there
are you know the striping should be in particular is very important as well where six to eight
inch solid line wide line and four inch solid line on the right side.
Most of US cities have these types of bike lanes and they're you know widely used all
over US.
Another type of bike lanes widely used in US is buffered bike lanes they are I think
their main advantage is that they have wide buffer between mode of travels and also they
provide some buffer between the door zones on the parking side so as you can see before
I go to the design stage I would just mention their demerits as well one of the challenge
with these bike lanes is the buffer because the buffer is necessary by design the implementation
is a challenge in areas where which are built out and they don't have as much capacity available.
Another issue is that they restrict the right of way for future expansions for instance
if you are to expand a facility then buffer would become a problem either you'll have
to curtail it or you'll have to redesign it or retrofit it.
When it comes to design some of the key features include that buffer shall be clearly marked
it should be with two solid lines and if the extra width is available then buffer could
also be cross hashed three feet is general and I've seen a little bit wider as well and
then the separation between the parking and bike lane is also would also have a six to
eighteen sometimes a foot of buffer I've seen 12 inch of buffer I've seen as well.
These kind of buffered bike lanes they are readily used in Austin Texas when we are talking
about best practices in Cape Coral Florida I've seen myself because I've lived there
for some time and also New York City and Phoenix Arizona and Tucson Arizona some of the cities
but there are other cities we could list Contra bike lanes I have a question about that if
you would allow me the green over to the side yes and so is that required to go all the
way through or not and why do some cities use green or is there other colors or how
does that I'm seeing maybe dark green some places so it changes I mean for instance the
color is there to reflect conflicts conflict zone this would this does not show completely
but likely in this picture the message is that there was an intersection or some kind
of conflict there maybe a bus stop or something that shows that okay you know this zone should
bikers and other users other mode users should be careful so in many cases for example in
Contra flow bike lanes you would see that there is there you know the crossings between
the intersections they are colored because the Contra flow would go in the other direction
as well so wherever we see use of color it is to highlight the conflict okay with other
modes thank you and they could vary in I mean it could be green I've seen red as well if
for example in Austin they have different color as well they have been using different
colors thank you oh you have another question no I appreciate the chair bringing this up
because I have a similar question and it's it's kind of scanned through the criterion
manual it wasn't clear to me when when we color our conflict zones and when we don't
in the city of Denton and and so if we can either address that at some point in the presentation
or or get back to us later I would appreciate understanding more you know when we just strike
versus when we paint I'll partially address it in this presentation and then we could
circle back on details if you have more questions on that thank you okay so on Contra flow bike
lanes basically provide in if the facility is one one way and then if we have additional
capacity available we could provide bike lanes on the opposite direction and use the capacity
I think the advantage of these lanes these bike lanes is that instead of rerouting the
bikers to another facility just because this is a one-way road bikers could get an edge
and they just could traverse through the facility on the dedicated bike lane and don't have
to traverse through many blocks to get to the right direction the merits include implementation
limitations in built-up areas again you know because they are capacity constrained they
have capacity capacity issue and then also may restrict right of way for future expansions
as well in fact you know in many cases they would just block any expansion possibilities
because then you have to eradicate the remove the the bike lane and then expand on design
side both options are available if if the bike lane is present on the direction on the
direction of the flow then we could depending on the availability of space we could provide
buffer between the traffic regular movement and the bikers on the opposite direction as
you can see in this case and if and then also we could have the shared lane markings for
instance if the if there's capacity issue and there on the on the in the direction of
the flow we have capacity constraints we could use shelves to provide sharing possibilities
lane sharing possibilities for the bikers but it also depends on the speed we have to
be careful in making sure that you know when we are mixing bikers with the regular traffic
flow we have to make sure that they're safe and these are left side bike lanes these are
I call them half contra flow that means is that they are against the flow but on one
side only and this you would see those in the in New York or larger cities where we
have a lot of traffic congestion and and heavy usage of highway facilities and then you know
the bike lane is provided on the left side only and for the design standard it's pretty
much same there which is similar to the regular bike lanes except they are provided they have
you know their direction is they are typically not on the right side but on the left side
of the of the flow and of course the signage is needed on the right side there are some
examples we have Chicago Portland and San Francisco where they are being used there there's
a big list I just selected some of the cities which I thought that I'll just mention let
me ask you a question about that yes you have a question and I've seen this in large cities
like that and I've always had a question ever in this regards that right turn so you have
that bus only with with with an entity allow a right turn at all on this road or is this
this is a straight road or a right turn when you oh look it's probably a right turn you
know whenever you can something going on over here yeah it's a selective it's a selective
approach on certain intersection the right right turn would be allowed for example you
see this green striped area or marking that's a crossing indication so typically what happens
is that there are there are traffic flow crossings and there are biker crossings so they are
dedicated you know alternate their alternate crossings and in this case probably next next
one or next two crossings would be bikers crossing and then this green striping would
just continue or our color striping would continue until they reach the right turn crossings
and then and they be able to make the right turn so basically the just like a detour they
are provided a mechanism colored mechanism to take the right turn okay okay all right
yes ma'am I just wanted to add for the sake of the rest of the committee members another
demerit on all of these is they're not protected and so what I've learned seems to be a worldwide
phenomenon is if somebody can put their car there they will so if we spend a bunch of
money on something that people can just easily park in there for or stop in there for any
period of time it kind of makes the bike lane unusable and so we've spent all that money
in time and it's not even usable or in some cases people can get killed when they have
to go around a vehicle that's in the bike lane so just something to keep in mind that's
true so other bike lanes include the diamond striping with bike signs where these would
not be continuous they would just come and go as the application basically is to provide
bikers a continuous flow because in many cases they are using multi-use path and are on the
side not on the road bike using on the road bike biking facility then they would be given
on certain spots they would be given opportunity to if the trail or the multi-use path could
not continue they would just be given our opportunity to on street bike lane partial
bike lane to get to get through that segment of the road where the multi-use path is not
available and then get back on the multi-use path and then we have sharos typically they
are on the residential streets but one caution with these is that when whenever we use share
we recommend that we allow full usage of bike lane or full usage of the lane traffic flow
lane the reason is that in many cases drive as you could see in this image as well there
are drive access points there are driveways in residential areas and if there are multiple
of them approaching the roadway it is recommended that you know we put a signage that says full
lane will be used by the bikers just to provide them extra protection and we have other concepts
as you know full colored lanes but there are different ideas for example Austin is using
color mixed in in pavement material and then they are using utilizing that that's a very
that's interesting idea that's very good one other cities are partially coloring them all
of those opportunities are available and they could be used to enhance biking culture and
biking environment in the in the cities shared use paths are another one our city is using
as well and then yes and the idea is that we could provide not only pedestrians but
bikers 10 foot to in some cases 12 foot as well a way of paths where they could just
use the facility instead of being on the high speed or relatively high speed road and but
they're they are exploited in many cases because if we don't provide a guidance on our striping
on the on this side use path then it poses risk to the pedestrian versus bikers versus
micro mobility users which are operating at different speeds so one caution is that whenever
we are we are now making sure that through the review process we highlight this back
to the developers that these look into this aspect and and provide the striping and then
we have trails as well which are there and then they could also be used by all users
so quickly in the interest of time I'll just be quick on this one so we go to the state
of Texas perspective and city of Denton perspective quickly on this and you had a question yes
I had a question in regards to the various colors that are used in Austin yes did you
all kind of research as to why they would use various colors it seemed like for me monochromatic
I mean just the same color throughout the city would you know get the folks to understand
when they see this particular color then it means something a bit more I'm just not understanding
why would a city use various colors and I'll let you address that if you want to but I
know that the city of Austin worked with the Dutch embassy so the Netherlands is considered
one of the top places for biking you've got you've got all sorts of people doing young
old women children and so they worked with the Dutch embassy the Dutch embassy came to
Austin and worked with them Austin elected and leadership went to the Netherlands to
look at it and so they're sort of working closely with the Dutch embassy to try to create
a low stress bike route and so that's kind of where the red came from because that's
sort of what they do in the Netherlands oh okay but that's lower maintenance in the long
run if you just mix it in the asphalt like that so the paint we have to keep maintaining
repainting every three five years yeah oh so it's mixed in the asphalt it is and so
they are last article that I'd read a few weeks back they would be sticking to red color
that's what my understanding is they are not changing the colors anymore yeah it's kind
of like slow down people so this is for the jurisdiction from just jurisdiction standpoint
this is the tech starts bicycle accommodation design guide basically that that reflects
this method or this approach where they are highlighting where we could use shared bike
and bike lane separate buffered and separated bike lane or shared use path and you would
just one one observation that is important here is that you would just see that by 35
miles per hour speed basically any type of bike lane vanishes if the facility is higher
than 35 miles per hour on on road bike lane is poses too much risk for the bikers unless
it is separated made exclusive bike lane to some separate separation measure so that's
the I think if that's the crux of this this graph that we are seeing here and exhibit
that we are seeing here other than that you know the for bridge replacement and rehabilitation
they go with minimum five-foot clear space and then for the trails and Texas bicycle
tourism trails they go for 10-foot general or minimum eight-foot okay are we including
regional standards as well so for example the North Central Texas Council of Governments
has their VeloWeb 2045 I think and so for routes through Denton that are part of the
VeloWeb they're recommending 12 to 14 feet of width so some kind of ongoing projects
we have in Denton that are included in the VeloWeb are Mayhill which I think is 10-foot
but the new part we're doing is still 10-foot it's not that 12 to 14 and then Mingo which
I don't think it's finalized yet but I think it looked like we were maybe doing 10-foot
for that one and that's part of the VeloWeb as well and that's also part of the Texas
tourism trail so I looked that up and I did see the Texas tourism trails does recommend
12 to 14 feet for their routes so I'm curious if we're sort of incorporating also NCT cog
and at least trying to hit like yes they said 10-foot minimum but 12-foot is a lot better
so the rail trail is really narrow and so it just feels a lot more likely a crash would
happen especially if it's a busier route so I'm just kind of curious if we're incorporating
regional and look we are looking into that aspect as well but you know when it comes
to cities guidelines on multi-use path and I would just say side box as well so the standard
I mean the approach is for now is 5 feet for residential and then 10 feet for other functional
classifications so that's a simple answer but at other places we have recommended 12
feet as well, 8 feet as well depending on it's actually design context I mean contextual
design where the facility is being designed and what other what the environment is and
if it is a built out area then of course there are constraints so we are looking into that
for our next study that we are going to have for bike lane feasibility and shared mobility
feasibility study we will look into all of these aspects okay and so we have another
question here yes yeah no on this chart most of most of our residential speeds are 30 so
we're immediately pretty much requiring some sort of separation some sort of mechanism
you know where we no longer yet yet I say that yet that we have sharos in a lot of
these 30 30 mile an hour zones so I guess my question goes to how do we how do we integrate
our residential speeds that are 5 miles over the safety you know the vanishing point there
look for the essential street there's a challenge the challenge is that we have so many drivers
yes I give you example of Ryan Ryan road what was that road there was a facility that we
are looking at the request came from one of the I think council members we were looking
at that facility Riney Road by the highest Riney Road no no it was a different facility
Montecito yes thank you so Montecito we were looking at that facility we audited that and
we found that there are so many drive access points and if we put a bike lane right next
to these drive access points where where residents are mostly reversing their vehicles to come
out of the driveway and not aware of if the biker is coming at what speed and let let's
not talk about that but I think that's a serious safety risk then I ended up referring to to
a I think it's a county county associations standards on bike lanes and they are cautioning
on that as well I also looked at TRB resources design standards they are cautioning on that
as well that be careful on allowing bike lanes in residential streets where so many drive
access points are there so that's why I think the recommendation is that we use Sharos with
signage that full bike lane could be used that provides full protection to the bikers
because they could they don't have to be now on the edge of the road they could just use
one full lane yes and then the other side is that there would be differential speeds
but expectation is that they're in residential streets the speeds are relatively lower I have
a fault on this but I'll wait till the end of the presentation and it's the exactly this
point but on Old North okay okay we can discuss after them okay I want to discuss more so
the last one is Denton mobility we in on our end in the city we have Denton mobility plan
bicycle plan we have Denton transportation criteria manual and development codes and
standard I'll show you I just mentioned that the five foot sidewalks and ten foot multi
use path is pretty much that's what we are looking at right now unless until we have
our study done and then we will be able to update that and then this is the sketch of
the standard details document where it shows that this is five feet sidewalk for residential
streets and for collectors it is ten feet and I could cities mobility plan is referring
to a basic information on on bike lanes and through this transportation services division
is planning to launch a shared mobility feasibility study now and based on that we will be able
to make many updates will be informed based on not only the best practice but also other
other reference information as well so this is a way forward for us we are planning for
bike lanes as one of the priorities here in the city transportation services division
is working on the participation of bike lanes as we speak we are planning to develop localized
standards for four distinct types clearly stating where we could use each one of those
and enhance the transportation criteria manual as well for bike lanes and their designs and
also we appreciate City Council's considerations for on street bike lanes standards as well
and interest as well if you have any more questions I could come so we'll start here
and we'll just so what's the city's thinking on raised crosswalks because for example the
Mayhill side path there are points where when if you're driving in your car and you're crossing
the side path you come up to meet the side path so it's like you have a bump kind of
before you potentially hit somebody and I think that visually you know kind of slows
people down they don't want that bumpy ride as they turn their car so they'll slow down
and be more careful crossing that and at other points it's not the side path comes down to
meet the road is there a standard for that decision or for now the design the standard
is that we consult first thing is that we consult our fire department and their guidance
on that is their equipment is not geared to traverse through these bumps or or tables
or there are many forms they come in so that's why I know that the standard practice that
we are following now is that at least we just say as long as fire department is not buying
that we will not go with in that direction but there are other uses to avoid that kind
of situation there are high lighters flashlights that glow as soon as the as soon as the pedestrian
or biker is crossing that they are in use in elementary schools as well in the neighborhoods
and they are successfully used in many areas because they provide some kind of caution
to the road users drivers.
Thanks for this presentation Farhan I'm glad to see you all are working on it and I really
appreciate that I did want to ask about or maybe just comment on the five foot sidewalk
recommendation I haven't ever seen that recommended as a bike accommodation anywhere and I haven't
seen that really count for anything in terms of like becoming a bicycle friendly community
with the League of American Bicyclists.
People can use the sidewalks especially when they're really nervous but I'm certified to
teach bike safety classes and we're taught to tell people to stay off the sidewalk in
most cases because there's obstacles there's pedestrian conflicts drivers aren't looking
for you there and they don't expect somebody traveling that fast so I certainly don't want
anybody in the room to think that you know sidewalks is a bike accommodation and I definitely
don't want to send that message because I haven't seen cases where that's true.
Yes they are not and but the violations are there yeah because of the desperate situations
the bikers could get in I mean if you ride on 50 miles per hour facility or 40 miles
per hour facility versus sidewalk so they will end up choosing sidewalk yeah so that's
the situation and then in other cases these sidewalks now standard five foot sidewalk
are now being converted to multi-use paths and therefore for a good reason because you
know this should not be I apologize I called it violation it is actually not a violation
we are forcing them to do that so I think in this case when the multi-use path is provided
that essentially means that we are providing a dedicated pedestrian walkway and as well
as a space for bikers as well they could ride the bike safely any other questions I have
more but we can go over there whatever you do in terms of the transportation criteria
manual update if y'all aren't already considering this if y'all could include considerations
for design speed so like the Mayhill side path has some sharp turns that seem to think
that everyone's walking rather than maybe moving a little more quickly so you know gentle
curves things like that and then also considering non-standard bicycles so we have families
in town with cargo bikes which are long and a bit wide and maybe not as maneuverable so
I know this wasn't the city but like on the DCTA rail trail they installed some z-gate
crossings at the crossings and those are really hard for somebody on a cargo bike or pulling
kids in a bike trailer so if that could be included in the transportation criteria manual
updates too.
Yes we are looking into that as a matter of fact we are conducting vision zero phase two
implementation effort and one of the first requirement for safe systems approach and
vision zero is to load the speeds and to look into well not load the speed but to review
the speeds so we will do that and as part of that process and then to that transportation
criteria manual and add it as an addendum so that is there and then of course for bike
lanes we are looking we are going to look at holistically through this shared mobility
study that we are planning to launch.
And when I just to clarify when I said design speeds I meant for the side path so considering
how quickly somebody on a bicycle travels versus walking and those standards should
be different between sidewalk and like a shared use path or something.
Okay we will look into that no issues.
And only other thing on transportation criteria manual and it looks like you all are already
thinking about it but where possible maybe we can consider intersection markings to suggest
oh there is a bike lane coming through here stuff like that.
Sure that will be that is already we are already reviewing that in process.
I had a question in regards to I guess the bumps speed bumps that's the basic term for
them and the use of those in HOAs is it are HOAs exempt from getting fire truck permission
standards.
In my understanding if it becomes a public road which is maintained by city then they
are not they will have to be abiding by the city's code and there are some examples where
they requested there is at least two there are two examples where we visited and audited
the site and they were requesting certain changes but then we found out that the essential
services and fire service would not be able to reach to the community or will have difficulty
because the equipment is very sensitive to bumps and it will probably damage their shocks
or whatever equipment is there to make them because the water load is so much that the
shocks won't be able to take it.
So that's why I think in many cases if it becomes a public facility later on cities
maintaining it then yes cities code will apply.
Okay and if it is a private then they could they can do what they need to do okay.
And so when we're talking about bike lanes and we have those vehicles those bikes that
also turn into motorbikes they could be bikes and then they can be motorbikes yes how is
the how is the the standard I guess so a person won't get a ticket you know if they're on
a motorcycle you know the bike is turned into a motorcycle bike am I saying that right ebikes
that's it how does the the law allow a e-bike in a bike path or are they now required to
be on the street?
They are called micro mobility options but they are since their speeds are faster they
are not considered usable at even at multi-use path they are to be used in well there is
no there's no criteria right now because it's a new tech newer technology and and cities
are trying to absorb it but they are typically allowed on road and due to differential speed
speeds they are not allowed on multi-use path I can add to that okay so I know at the state
level they did identify three classes of ebikes and so it depends some of them you don't have
to pedal at all some you have to pedal to keep going and they all have a cap on the
speed that they are allowed to go otherwise if they go faster than like 28 miles an hour
something like that then it becomes a different type of vehicle all together and so those
are not ebikes anymore so ebikes are going to be about 28 miles an hour or below and
cities could as far as you know mac or somebody can correct me but cities have the ability
to if they want to say I mean we can set speed limits on paths if we want to so if that's
the concern because some people might have a nicer bike they can go a little faster and
if we want to still allow them to use that path but we don't want them going 28 miles
an hour we could say 20 mile per hour speed limit on this path or something like that
but the challenge with that is that the users they would just take their liberty assuming
that oh I'm not going to be faster and my mode is the ebike I'm using is not as fast
so there is a bit of challenge so for now I think I know that cities are allowing on
street and multi-use path wherever I've seen there are many speed related issues that are
coming and we'll have to face those issues as well at some point.
That's why we are recommending that we have we clearly stripe pedestrian versus bikers
area.
I think class 2 is less than 28 miles an hour I think class 2 is I may be wrong Susie is
the expert class 2 I believe is up to 20 miles with the motor and up to 28 miles with motor
and pedaling and I'll just throw in that I ride a electric ebike around that's the brand
name electric and during my rides with Susie who does not use ebikes she is faster than
me.
I'm a big huge dude and my ebike does not get up to 28 miles per hour poor motor cannot
push my weight.
We could circle back as well if we need more information.
Circle back.
Okay but thank you so you had some other questions so a couple of questions relating to sort
of these this where modes cross we haven't really addressed sort of raised crosswalks
they don't they don't have to be a speed bump but just raised that that can not necessarily
throw out the shocks of emergency vehicles but or inhibit them but clearly an engineering
difference at an intersection what's what's what do we say about those kinds of changes.
If you need details on that I would just definitely research it and then and get back to you and
circle back to you in the next mobility committee meeting.
Yeah we could look into what what design requirements they have and what what different types are
there.
I appreciate that so then I'll add on to that slightly and that is I mean yeah I understand
speed bumps because they're what six inches or whatever above the road grade but speed
cushions are an inch or two they often have emergency vehicle tracks in them you know
our rumble strips are what are they three-quarters of an inch or something they're not throwing
anybody's you know vehicles out of alignment but they are clearly creating an engineering
response to speeds and and and different use conflicts so I if we could include some updates
about the use of those those lower height uses we will have to have that as well we
will do that I just want to point out that something like that does exist in the city
of Den on central village drive in a neighborhood off of south 77 there is kind of the intersection
that's at the entrance to their neighborhood that's entirely raised and so you just go
up like two or three inches into the intersection and that kind of signifies hey you're entering
or leaving the neighborhood speeds need to change and then it just dips off on the other
side of the intersection.
That's on central village off of south 77 yeah yeah and just on the end on those bollards
are on those intersection conditions and separation issues I love that y'all are being really
proactive and sort of experimental on Hector and Old North and Parkway please continue
to do that but then I'm going to pass along questions as we do these sorts of use separations
and intersection separations it is a almost a weekly question of when we did our bollards
on Old North where we're trying to manage the the park/sharrow and buffer combination
why why I guess the question is bollard placement what's what's the goals and criteria and for
bollard placement because one of the things that pops up on Old North all the time is
why is the furthest in bollard the furthest towards the intersection rather than the other
way around because they have displaced bollards that ends up making all the cars clip them
and y'all are always out on an engaged dent ticket putting a new bollard in like you know
it's a weekly occurrence kind of thing so we might save a little cash and but if there's
an engineering reason and and so I guess the general question is engineering wise what
are the standards and we can get back to that in the future for for bollard placement then
but then specifically for Old North why why are we doing it in that way we will let me
audit that area and then I'll get a circle back again with more information on that item
as well I appreciate that thank you that's all you know while you while you all are talking
I'm thinking that they're probably placed that way to encourage people to slow down
when they're making those turn and that may be because people want to cut short big wide
turns and you know you don't want to clip a cyclist I have suggested that to people
but I have to come back and say I'm not a road engineer and I don't know that that's
the reason that he did it yes ma'am only final comment I wanted that was not related to that
but sort of I guess I I know in past staff have considered but maybe not looked into
fully the possibility of us becoming either a member or an affiliate of the National Association
of city transportation officials and I saw you showed us a lot of pictures from their
site so you know I'd love us to look into the possibility of maybe becoming more involved
with them maybe adopting some of their standards which you were showing us on the screen some
Texas member cities are Austin Houston and San Antonio and then some affiliates are Fort
Worth and El Paso so I noticed those are all larger cities so I don't know what it entails
to get more involved with them but maybe you know we'll have this discussion get started
in our division and I think probably we'll have to discuss with Scott as well and Cassie
about that thank you any other questions any other questions all right thank you so much
it is a little bit after 11 o'clock so we're gonna just kind of spend this time just kind
of perusing through some of these topics here and if there's any of you all that have any
any questions regarding anything that you see listed that's written out this is your
opportunity to ask questions question and answer time yes sir so on the item for the
interchange of near sage oak 382 a interchange we discussed the completion of the side paths
along sage oak up up to the 7-eleven up to the intersection and then I think we're nearly
complete from the from odb to the south but there may be some gaps but there's one notable
gap and that's on our own property at the old DME staging field and and so I guess the
general question is for this entire thing is could we get some follow-up information
about us where we are at stitching the entire side path pathway together sure Trevor crane
director of capital projects so that project is almost completed with design and so we
won't be completing all of those gaps filling in the entire entire section all the way from
380 down to McKinney and that's going to include lighting or not include light not lighting
for that section though sir okay oh while he's looking for the other question I have a question
in regards to land ownership and responsibilities and sidewalks are just a for clarification
most of the time when there's not a sidewalk that's that that land is owned by private
people and then we run into a public space like you know our shelter area what is the
obligation of us you know requiring them to you know feeling in or it sounds like we're
taking on the responsibility for feeling in for private spaces is that what I'm hearing
sure so a couple of different things there typically if it's a private you know private
landowner if they come in to develop that then that will be a part of the development
process we will require them to put in and make that connection put in that sidewalk
as a part of the development if we get to a point to where we're wanting the city is
wanting to connect that such as along 28 then we will come in and buy that property and
connect that ourselves so it's kind of a timing issue depending on if we if we want to wait
for the development to come in and do it for us or if we come in and purchase that property
and make that connection similar to what we're doing on McKinney filling in those spots and
then a long loop to 88 so it really comes down to a timing issue as to kind of who gets
there first and where we want to how we want to move that forward I know that that there's
been discussion on at the City Council level in regards to McKinney Street between Woodrow
and 288 and so I understand that there you all were going to design some kind of pathway
but we still have private landowners out there with those extend over across this will be
one of the things that you're talking about extending that pathway across their property
correct so that project was approved as part of our CIP last year the McKinney sidewalks
and so it's currently under design and we will be if we're evaluating the sections that
are private property and so if we need to go purchase right away to make those connections
we will as a part of that project but that's currently under design right now and I'm just
asking that question you know for the folks out there that you know they just don't know
that hey when the land is not developed the city is not going to come and put necessarily
come and put a file correct but in this case for Luke 288 you know the traffic is just
astounding you know between you know in in these areas so you know I appreciate the the
opportunity for us to do that right and that's one of those things that we consider as a
part of that that PPI score that how we evaluate sidewalk sections so we call them goat paths
but you see where people are actually traversing in the in the grass and so those are those
are one of the things that we take into account as we evaluate those different sections of
sidewalk thank you so much yes ma'am yes for for the staff member and in part of this
do you want all the questions now or just the staff member in the questions I just want
the staff member random questions right here okay so then my last question on that before
we get to the I mean I'm sorry let me let me tricks and everything together no I'm just
trying to get through the part that's written here that's a staff memorandum part yeah that's
what I want to do yeah yeah I did have one more for this section okay and I appreciate
the the clarity that we had on that lying in landscaping for construction projects the
next of one of the last sections of the response but from the the goals of that that was about
landscaping goals for given the limitations that we have but still the goals that we wish
to attain the if we looked into and it came up today in both talking about bike paths
in coloring the the asphalts themselves and I've sort of hinted at it in earlier meetings
but are we investigating any heat island mitigation areas where we can't control the street trees
for one reason or another but we still wish to attain our sustainability goals are we
looking at pavement additives in those areas that are more reflective better you know you
know less heat island inducing yeah so I'll say we're definitely starting to get into
that so we're always looking at new technologies different things that you can you know add
into concrete or you know even for drainage there's permeable pavement and things of that
nature so that it all kind of ties in to you know our sustainability initiatives those
type of from that department so those are absolutely things that we're looking at I
don't think we have any projects where we've initiated are incorporated into that yet but
as we start looking through those items working with our different stakeholders to see you
know what those things are how if they still meet the specifications and standards that
we're trying to meet those are absolutely conversations we're having with those different
stakeholders as we as we design these projects I appreciate that I think there's sometimes
we can kill the same bird with a different stone absolutely yeah we're always open to
looking at new and new and that's not very sustainable of me I'm sorry about that I get
to hear that all the time with my last name you're going to kill two birds with one stone
yeah look at it see he's the main one look out his lap minor just clarification question
so on neighborhood 5b and I have three questions total um a neighborhood 5b it says that the
construction timeline is about a year and a half to me that sounded short for drainage
and streets so I just wanted to clarify that's the drainage and the street one and a half
years it is so um 5b let me make sure I'm not going to confuse it with the oakland oakland
yes so 5b is a part of the 2019 bond package um oakland drainage is was approved as part
of the 2023 bond since it's all kind of combined together we we're going to put those projects
together I'll put it out as a seamar um yes that time it is both um there are some other
things we're considering right now with the retention pond and some other conversations
so that timeline may change but as of right now we're moving forward with the current
timeline that we sent forward or that we presented here and that that is correct okay thank you
my other question is what is seamar I haven't heard that one before so seamar is a is actually
stands for construction manager at risk it is a project delivery method the main difference
in that versus kind of the other ways that we deliver projects is instead of waiting
until we get to 100 percent design and then bidding it out to a contractor we're actually
bringing a contractor in at zero percent and having them help us design those projects
so bringing in their expertise kind of identifying risk helping with value engineering those types
of things typically it's used for you know larger projects that have a lot of complexities
to it so it made a lot of sense to use it in this with that drainage piece and kind
of the environment and those types of things that we're going to be delivering this project
in so just a different type of project delivery method thank you and then my final question
is on the interchange 380 slash loop 288 I think that's on the other page I read it and
I was a little unclear is tech stock planning to build side paths as part of the project
so yeah this question came up actually about some escrow issues and then some sidewalk
issues to build that so text dot we talked with text dot they don't currently have any
any money in escrow or anything I actually spoke with these residents and they were not
as sure that the escrow was taken they had some turnover they were mainly concerned about
the sidewalk being placed from 380 down to down to McKinney and so that that's actually
a city of Denton project that we are delivering so the city is putting in side paths yes correct
text not doing that no even though they allegedly do or is the timeline just not right on that
for them to the time yeah that that project was already already completed all right thank
you that's it yes ma'am okay um did you have any questions uh I am don't have any particular
questions uh my my questions are it my primary question is and if you just explain to us
how does a city or state or county make a decision to put trees in medians I may have
even asked this question before to put trees in medians and lights in medians and or not
how does how is that determined is it and are trees more aesthetic or is it more environmental
so I can only speak to the city portion of that okay um so that's dictated by our criteria
manuals and so I think trees definitely have multiple reasons why you would put it in one
is aesthetics you know it looks it looks great for um you know being out there but also heat islands
things that um you know co-chair uh back brought up um I didn't yeah so you I mean you know because
you know because some areas can be very dark correct with no trees or anything and then some
areas are beautifully lit with or without trees you know and that could be just any space on any
street why why why not the consistency of even just aesthetically aesthetics how does that work
sure I'll I'll talk to some of the aesthetic part first since that's the question
before yeah that's a good that's a good question uh angel manglis development
review manager over in the planning department okay um so street trees as the the information
sheet kind of explained there are three different types of of streets our city capital improvement
built streets the the private ones that are constructed as part of a development and then
our our tech stop uh the ones we have most kind of control over is when uh private development is
constructing a street either internally or part of the perimeter of the development we have our
street tree requirements in the development code which requires one tree per every 30 linear feet
of street frontage those are required to be spaced at intervals between 25 and 50 feet we
encourage not any closer nor further apart partially for the aesthetic part however when you do see
differences in that spacing or possibly even the location a lot of that is going to be driven by
utility placement so we do have to maintain certain separations from underground utilities
as well as being mindful of overhead electric lines to make sure that those trees are going to
stay in a safe area that's not going to impact that later down the line text dot doesn't typically
allow street trees in there in the right of way as noted in this memo but there are some occasions
where we have maintenance agreements to allow for some landscaping within the medians but again
taller trees are going to become a possible site visibility issue as well as being mindful of any
utilities that are in the area though that's kind of how some of those decisions are are made and
they're um they're looked at as each project comes in to ensure we're meeting those spacing
requirements as well as meeting just the minimum numbers we require sure and so whenever there's
trees put out in the medians is it the same type of tree or there's certain
you know i know there's i've noticed this different kind of trees and just you know plainly
speaking in layperson's mindset why are there different types of trees we do actually encourage
uh biodiversity uh for a number of reasons one for some variety but also in the event that there
were to be some tree specific disease it wouldn't wipe out an entire area's street trees maintaining
some of that biodiversity is a goal of ours all right anybody else have any other questions i was
just kind of floating out there in the atmosphere all right well if there are not any additional
questions um are there any additional comments that we need to make oh you have a question
yeah now are we going on to the the matrix section chair uh the matrix section uh i'm
we have the um construction update timeline first is the exhibit two in case you had any questions
on that one did you um we don't have a you know pull it up you don't have a you can pull it up
i'll wait until we get the images and then we have what are you talking about number three
future items future okay that's what i mean by the nature okay so there's a timeline
this schedule you saw this last time so nothing has changed since the last time you saw anybody
else okay i just want to say i i really love this edition thank you staff for putting this in this
is all really helpful i i've been able to answer a lot of community questions by looking at having
this available to me so thank you yeah it's a nice visual uh and if there's not any questions in that
regards i guess we can go to future items on there anybody have any future items you don't have any
did you have any future items okay so um i do have a couple i know that we had um we we're asking to
get rid of the first item but it's not clear to me that that that item is not that's actually done
so i i recognize that we've done a lot of updates on that one but i feel like you know until we get
to a final alignment and we're actually proceeding forward i'd like that one to kind of tacitly stay
on even though i recognize that you sort of you did mostly answer but there's sort of some
outstanding pieces we can we can leave that one on i heard a couple of more discussion about it
today so we'll leave it we leave that item on and uh then then the other thing is i know and this is
this is we're just like hot in the middle of it because we have the the community uh engagement
meetings on uh the windsor potential extension which i think is coming up very soon item 12
sort of yeah um but uh do we have in in both the talks and today i didn't see any updates on
on uh sort of let dates and completion dates and things so if we could you know i know this one
isn't done but if we could include that those those kinds of timelines like i just praised you
know a minute and a half ago i'd appreciate that um and if get re-brought up at the meeting scott
on the 28th i'd love that um unless you want to answer it now i i don't know who knows what
uh but i also can wait i don't think it's super urgent and the last thing i wanted to add to the
matrix is um i i love that we're seeing cassie here all the time because we're inserting it at
the high level but i guess the uh do we have an eta on on uh vacancy updates uh we have bike pad
and and farhan has come on recently and and the replacement of the city engineer and those sorts
of things so it doesn't have to be today but if it could be today that'd be cool otherwise i'd like
love to have a vacancy update i was going to add something to the next meeting because i was hoping
to have an update for everyone by the next meeting who will be i mean i love having you here cassie
like also i'm really feeling the love today
um my i'm looking at number 13 there november 14 20 cmo transportation services
uh division report uh last update was on february the 28th um second quarter um provide in the city
quarter second quarter we are planning to provide you quarterly updates um of that division's kind
of work in progress so that's it'll we're proposing to keep that on and just add it as a quarterly
update to this committee now um what about dcta um and that's really what what you know brought
me this to mind when i saw transportation services out of the cmo uh is this going to i haven't we
haven't heard from dcta in in a minute but of course my time frame is off on everything
since i'm retired um don't have to keep up with dates too much um what what do we what do we uh
decided about dcta and them uh connecting with the city and giving us some updates or
how is that gonna work for us what's the outlook i believe we still have it penciled in for dcta
to give council quarterly updates okay um i'm not aware of them providing this committee
right because we moved them from here yes because we moved it over to council yeah okay so that's
where we're going to uh and so we're not gonna see that here uh to let us know to to be on a lookout
for uh i can add it if as an upcoming kind of that'll be nice highlight that it may when it's
scheduled for council that'll be nice i would appreciate that so we can just uh prepare our
mindset for that all right anything else everyone's okay okay uh if there is not any additional
information to be given now we're going to go to our um is there a uh concluding item
anybody have any concluding items okay if there's not any concluding items then we are going to
close out the meeting at 11 30 um and thank you all for visiting thank you everybody