1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:10,400 good morning welcome to the mobility committee meeting Wednesday October 25th 2 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:17,000 2023 8 o'clock we're here in the work session room forum is present do we have 3 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:22,920 any citizens comment on any agenda items nothing gets coming in you all know okay 4 00:00:22,920 --> 00:00:26,800 so we're gonna move forward that go to number two items for individual 5 00:00:26,800 --> 00:00:37,160 consideration we need approval for the minutes of September 27th all right and 6 00:00:37,160 --> 00:00:44,440 I second that so that is approved then we're gonna read I'm sorry 7 00:00:44,440 --> 00:00:49,560 do we not actually have to have a vote okay so we have first and a second we 8 00:00:49,560 --> 00:00:55,000 have a vote can I get a vote I I so it is our approved thank you for the 9 00:00:55,000 --> 00:01:01,600 reminder we are going to skip item B and we're gonna come back to item B but 10 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:08,000 we're gonna go to item C MC to three days zero to zero our staff memorandums 11 00:01:08,000 --> 00:01:15,920 starting with our Bonnie Bay break update all right good morning everybody 12 00:01:15,920 --> 00:01:20,720 Seth Garcia deputy director of capital projects so quickly Bonnie Bray update 13 00:01:20,720 --> 00:01:26,000 so phase three we did award a contract to sunk construction we issued a notice 14 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:30,800 to proceed for October 16th so they're currently working on submittals here in 15 00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:34,600 the next few weeks you're gonna see them out there replacing utilities and 16 00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:39,240 starting on the duck bank work in front of UNT's Apogee Stadium so we've got a 17 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:44,700 lot of active coordination going on with UNT for the football schedule so once we 18 00:01:44,700 --> 00:01:48,880 get all those submittals completed you'll see those utility crews moving 19 00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:53,800 out there to start those installations Bonnie Bray six so we're currently 20 00:01:53,800 --> 00:01:59,320 shooting to advertise in quarter four of 2023 we're working with text are really 21 00:01:59,320 --> 00:02:03,240 closely to try and get our state letter of authority we've got one more 22 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:08,040 relocation agreement for Eagle Ridge that's coming through it will come before 23 00:02:08,040 --> 00:02:12,840 council so currently we're pursuing a path with text dot to be able to 24 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:18,200 advertise the project prior to having that relocation completed but with the 25 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:23,640 understanding that the relocation will be done before we begin construction 26 00:02:23,640 --> 00:02:30,600 Hickory Creek Road phase three so we're currently in active construction we've 27 00:02:30,600 --> 00:02:36,000 hit a little hiccup with the Kansas City Southern Canadian Pacific Railway so 28 00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:40,160 we're currently working through a few things with that item as well as our 29 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:46,000 encore relocations we have an encore electric line that feeds the lights and 30 00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:50,600 gates for the signal crossing so we're working through with the railroad 31 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:53,840 company to have a temporary service brought over until we take that rail 32 00:02:53,840 --> 00:03:00,080 crossing out so right now we're kind of a little hesitant on how we're going on 33 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:04,080 the bridge work but with the weather coming in there's not a whole lot we can 34 00:03:04,080 --> 00:03:09,440 do out on that site currently anyways so we're keeping an active eye on that and 35 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:17,000 monitoring the request came in for Bradshaw Street and East Prairie after 36 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:22,560 the rain event so this is southeast in package B part of that project does 37 00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:26,960 include subgrade restoration and so we're actually digging out approximately 38 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:32,080 8 to 12 inches and putting in flex space subgrade we got hit with a rainstorm 39 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:37,000 essentially once we had dug a pond in the roadway which made conditions very 40 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:40,560 treacherous for some of those residents so our contractor McCarthy worked 41 00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:44,200 quickly to try and get a drivable surface back in place for those folks of 42 00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:48,280 course we have it currently closed to through traffic it's just supposed to be 43 00:03:48,280 --> 00:03:53,400 accessed for local residents since that time we were able to get the subgrade in 44 00:03:53,400 --> 00:03:58,480 place and pave out the first few layers and so we'll be coming back with topping 45 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:02,600 here in the next few weeks hopefully prior to Thanksgiving as we move on to 46 00:04:02,600 --> 00:04:08,240 East Sycamore another portion of that was we did have an area that experienced 47 00:04:08,240 --> 00:04:13,560 a trench failure next to the creek that was caused by a bore pit that was there 48 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:18,120 so we actually bored a new water line underneath the drainage channel so as we 49 00:04:18,120 --> 00:04:23,240 bored they're supposed they're required to compact and lifts coming upwards when 50 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:26,300 you have vertical infrastructure such as the water line coming up it gets 51 00:04:26,300 --> 00:04:30,160 difficult to compact around that infrastructure that's sticking up so we 52 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:34,480 did experience a small trench failure the contractor is working to address 53 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:39,840 that and before we get that topping that surface layer of asphalt on so that is 54 00:04:39,840 --> 00:04:43,760 warranty work that's at the the dime of the contractor so they'll be replacing 55 00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:48,000 that and of course we still have our two-year warranty after contract 56 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:51,480 acceptance so we'll continue to monitor that area since we've experienced a 57 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:59,240 failure there as well yes ma'am so the what it looked like to me was that the 58 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:06,960 road kind of buckled up this way it kind of went up like a little mountain yeah 59 00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:11,800 so it's actually the opposite everything around it caved in where the water pipe 60 00:05:11,800 --> 00:05:16,400 was sticking oh yeah and so what you saw was the actual infrastructure holding up 61 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:24,360 the subgrade and then everything around it had settled yes ma'am yes ma'am very 62 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:29,360 close though mm-hmm all right any other questions 63 00:05:29,360 --> 00:05:35,360 thank you 64 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:46,220 good morning Brett Bouchard deputy city engineer so we're looking at I believe 65 00:05:46,220 --> 00:05:50,720 last month looked at the accidents on the Tickrey Street back in parking so 66 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:54,920 the request came in to look at was there any follow-up accidents or pedestrian 67 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:59,240 vehicle accidents collisions that happened we did confirm with our PD and 68 00:05:59,240 --> 00:06:04,440 the report that we pulled these numbers are correct we did look at the different 69 00:06:04,440 --> 00:06:08,640 accidents by vehicle and pedestrian or bicyclist and vehicle or bicycles 70 00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:15,260 pedestrian we show that there is three total crashes in that time frame one in 71 00:06:15,260 --> 00:06:21,640 2017 are three in 2017 one in 2018 and one in 2019 so that's included in this 72 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:26,440 total number of collisions or crashes on the back-end parking can I ask a 73 00:06:26,440 --> 00:06:32,760 question about the back-end parking yeah now we I've noticed that there are more 74 00:06:32,760 --> 00:06:38,600 people where people are pulling in I don't I'm not saying more people but I'm 75 00:06:38,600 --> 00:06:45,680 noticing there's a higher relation that people are pulling in are these crashes 76 00:06:45,680 --> 00:06:51,560 related to them backing out or is it have we recognize that these are people 77 00:06:51,560 --> 00:06:57,160 that have backed in and they may have had an incident can you can you all tell 78 00:06:57,160 --> 00:07:01,360 so the only way we can tell is by looking at how the crashes are are 79 00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:05,000 categorized and a lot of times it's categorized to yield right away 80 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:10,560 categorized to yield the left turn turning an unsafe condition and so 81 00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:14,440 there's nothing specific that says related to the back-end parking but when 82 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:17,240 I looked at all the crashes on that section Hickory we went through and we 83 00:07:17,240 --> 00:07:21,400 looked at all the different what the tags were the way they categorized it 84 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:25,960 and so all the ones that were either a failed to yield turning an unsafe 85 00:07:25,960 --> 00:07:31,000 condition those types of related incidences what were keyed in is what 86 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:38,360 we pulled as we related to the back-end parking okay yes I appreciate the the 87 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:41,880 follow-up on the date and I think part of the reason that I asked for in our 88 00:07:41,880 --> 00:07:47,400 previous discussion was is it accomplishing the the goal of you know 89 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:53,280 getting towards what in later years became vision zero in terms of fatalities 90 00:07:53,280 --> 00:07:59,440 and error incidences not even fatalities but and so I guess reviewing 91 00:07:59,440 --> 00:08:05,840 the data before the meeting do we have a feel for what the ratio of pedestrian 92 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:13,280 vehicle interactions are in the downtown quarter in general because this is so 93 00:08:13,280 --> 00:08:23,040 low that's essentially random edge case and and so essentially let's say one 94 00:08:23,040 --> 00:08:28,080 could argue it's working great there's there's hardly any pedestrian vehicle 95 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:33,360 interactions but we would only know that if we knew the level pedestrian vehicle 96 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:38,600 interactions in general in the region as to whether this area and and it's going 97 00:08:38,600 --> 00:08:43,040 to be really tricky because not everything is the same as Hickory 98 00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:49,400 because of all the use that they have so that I'm realizing that there's a lot of 99 00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:55,560 noise in this is in the equations are there do we have a feel for what the 100 00:08:55,560 --> 00:09:01,240 general level of pedestrian vehicle interactions are because my sense is if 101 00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:08,200 it's basically zero you could argue this is working and and that's sort of what 102 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:11,800 I'm asking so I think you know the way that you might be able to answer that 103 00:09:11,800 --> 00:09:17,520 question our approach is people don't want to get new crashes they'll do they 104 00:09:17,520 --> 00:09:21,720 they'll do they'll adapt to whatever the road situation is and you can see that 105 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:25,240 from the data where in the earlier years there was a higher collision rate or more 106 00:09:25,240 --> 00:09:28,640 crashes because people weren't used to the road condition and as people have 107 00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:32,680 gotten used to that road condition they've adapted and fit in to avoid 108 00:09:32,680 --> 00:09:36,640 collisions I know I've driven down Hickory Creek out Hickory Street went 109 00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:42,120 down there on Monday not relatively regularly there's a lot of pedestrians a 110 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:47,600 lot of people that's a busy road to see this few crashes I think that's you know 111 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:51,560 reflective of the character of the road and people driving a safe behavior and 112 00:09:51,560 --> 00:09:55,440 pedestrians acting a safe behavior so when we've actually had a couple of 113 00:09:55,440 --> 00:10:00,200 Friday Friday report requests come in about putting some additional signage or 114 00:10:00,200 --> 00:10:04,000 some additional crosswalk or elimination on Hickory Creek and we are looking at 115 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:09,480 putting in let pedestrian signs making that more pedestrian friendly corridor 116 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:13,680 to kind of slow make drivers more aware that pedestrians might not cross at just 117 00:10:13,680 --> 00:10:17,520 the crosswalks but anywhere on the roadway so we're doing things to make 118 00:10:17,520 --> 00:10:22,560 drivers aware of that situation it's not a high number of crashes a very crashes 119 00:10:22,560 --> 00:10:30,040 you know a lot of statistics right you can't ever get to zero yeah so it's um 120 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:34,240 it's a tool in our toolbox as to what we can use on other roadways and we want to 121 00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:38,480 develop other roadways it's we get community feedback as to what they like 122 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:42,200 what people the community wants it does not want and we can also look at the 123 00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:46,520 number of tickets that are written in as you you know Councilmember Bird was 124 00:10:46,520 --> 00:10:49,580 saying is that people are still pulling in instead of backing it and there's 125 00:10:49,580 --> 00:10:54,400 enforcement signs there so we have enforced throughout the years written a 126 00:10:54,400 --> 00:10:58,600 numerous number of tickets for people parking in the wrong direction now I 127 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:03,560 appreciate all that follow-up I guess I think it's clear that there's at least a 128 00:11:03,560 --> 00:11:07,480 I don't know if they're a majority or minority but there's there's it's clear 129 00:11:07,480 --> 00:11:11,920 that there's a vocal group of citizens that are uncomfortable with either the 130 00:11:11,920 --> 00:11:18,520 change aspect or or just the scenario period and the reason I think you see the 131 00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:25,120 the policy leaders asking the questions is if we're going to go away from that 132 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:29,800 comparability factor then we need to have the data that suggests it is is a 133 00:11:29,800 --> 00:11:40,440 viable tool but seeing four accidents in eight years is I I feel like it does 134 00:11:40,440 --> 00:11:45,360 feel like it's sounding like a viable tool if there's been four pedestrian 135 00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:49,480 collisions in eight years I think that's that's a good indication yeah and 136 00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:52,640 everything that we're trying all these different pilot projects we're doing is 137 00:11:52,640 --> 00:11:57,280 just adding tools to our toolbox so we every situation is unique we have to 138 00:11:57,280 --> 00:12:01,480 look at the conditions and the context of it before we choose what might work 139 00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:06,160 in that area and so this is just another tool in our toolbox of okay what does the 140 00:12:06,160 --> 00:12:09,440 roadway look like we've gotten some lessons learned we've talked internally 141 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:12,400 about the way that it's functioning about the issues that we're seeing with 142 00:12:12,400 --> 00:12:15,740 it the feedback we're getting it so there's definitely lessons learned that 143 00:12:15,740 --> 00:12:20,440 we would know to change going forward if we want to use this type of measure on 144 00:12:20,440 --> 00:12:26,120 a different roadway I would just add to that Brett that I think in order to 145 00:12:26,120 --> 00:12:32,920 actually see whether or not you know this is an example or a certain area 146 00:12:32,920 --> 00:12:37,960 this is you know the right design you're asking kind of overall downtown I think 147 00:12:37,960 --> 00:12:41,560 we would need to collect the data and look at the accident information of 148 00:12:41,560 --> 00:12:46,000 other surrounding roadways to do some kind of comparison whether it is we 149 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:50,520 collect data whether it is we go back and pull the same exact sample for roadways 150 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:55,600 that have either parallel or front in parking around the square before you 151 00:12:55,600 --> 00:13:00,880 would want to say that this is working in comparison to other situations you 152 00:13:00,880 --> 00:13:05,000 could have similar situations and we don't have that level of information 153 00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:09,960 right now to tell you that back in parking is safer or is working in a 154 00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:15,240 different mode than front end parking or then parallel parking so when you ask 155 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:18,480 what's happening in the downtown and what people are comfortable with they've 156 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:23,480 adapted to the current situation they haven't necessarily said we like this 157 00:13:23,480 --> 00:13:26,880 better than we like that there's always going to be people that like different 158 00:13:26,880 --> 00:13:30,280 things but in order to actually understand what's going on in the overall 159 00:13:30,280 --> 00:13:34,840 downtown and some of that may even come from the downtown parking study but in 160 00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:38,460 order to understand that we would want to pull exactly the same information for 161 00:13:38,460 --> 00:13:43,440 the surrounding areas and evaluate it before you could actually do an apples 162 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:47,760 to apples comparison no that's why I ask if we had that data available in the 163 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:52,080 area I'm hesitant to ask for on the matrix because I don't know if it gives 164 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:58,560 us anything because we have no other back projects at the moment so I I just 165 00:13:58,560 --> 00:14:05,040 I guess I'm asking for us to if there's bandwidth available in the future as a 166 00:14:05,040 --> 00:14:10,720 lowest priority item if we can you know see the kind of data that Becky just 167 00:14:10,720 --> 00:14:14,200 mentioned that but I mean it since there's no capital projects involved in 168 00:14:14,200 --> 00:14:18,120 something like that then I feel uncomfortable at this time asking for 169 00:14:18,120 --> 00:14:23,760 for much effort in that direction understood okay all right next up is 170 00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:29,760 speeding on Morris so Morris Street we do have driver feedback signs on Morris 171 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:34,280 Street located between Lakey Street and Newton Street one in each direction we 172 00:14:34,280 --> 00:14:37,800 have been collecting data on Morris Street for quite a while now we know 173 00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:42,840 there is a relatively higher average speed about 36 miles per hour believe on 174 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:48,280 a 30 mile an hour roadway we do have funding from DCTA trip project to do a 175 00:14:48,280 --> 00:14:53,800 traffic calming project on Morris Street we have been talking with the community 176 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:56,880 have there's a couple of community meetings that were held to get an idea 177 00:14:56,880 --> 00:14:59,760 of what the community would like to see and how that roadway would be developed 178 00:14:59,760 --> 00:15:06,520 or modified to calm the traffic on that roadway we were still in that scoping 179 00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:09,840 and planning phase we don't have a clear direction as to what we're going to do 180 00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:13,800 on that road but we do have the funding to do a striping traffic calming type of 181 00:15:13,800 --> 00:15:18,600 project to change the so to hopefully reduce the speeds on the roadway in 182 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:21,800 addition to that we also have the driver feedback sign program that is being 183 00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:26,720 developed and being worked on to help you know move driver feedback signs 184 00:15:26,720 --> 00:15:36,800 around the city and slow down traffic question yes what kind of feedback did 185 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:39,520 you get from the community as to what they thought they would like to see 186 00:15:39,520 --> 00:15:46,240 there have we had anything that's concrete the first the first meeting 187 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:50,640 that we held we presented a couple different roadways in the city Hickory 188 00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:56,080 Street Hinkle old north some other roadways where we've done traffic calming 189 00:15:56,080 --> 00:15:59,980 on them the response was they don't like any of them don't do anything to the 190 00:15:59,980 --> 00:16:04,840 roadway just slow people down which makes it very hard to slow people down 191 00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:08,940 we can't anything right and then we had a follow-up community meeting where 192 00:16:08,940 --> 00:16:12,480 they're much more open to doing bike lanes and ballers and stuff like that so 193 00:16:12,480 --> 00:16:15,760 we're we've gotten two very mixed responses and so we're working through 194 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:20,440 okay what what direction are we going to go in did they say anything about a 195 00:16:20,440 --> 00:16:26,760 turning lane in the middle and I don't believe anything but a turning lane at 196 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:33,760 our recent Southeast neighborhood Association meeting Julie brought in 197 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:39,840 some visuals to show I think it's hard for people to just there's some people 198 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:45,000 that just can't make a decision without seeing it and so I think that that was 199 00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:50,120 that was very helpful for them to see the crosswalks you know what kind of 200 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:54,720 crosswalks would you like to see it Lakey and Morris particularly that's a 201 00:16:54,720 --> 00:17:01,760 busy corner there so I'm sure you all get with her to see what she found out 202 00:17:01,760 --> 00:17:06,200 about what they'd like to have in that in those turns but I was under the 203 00:17:06,200 --> 00:17:12,440 impression that maybe a turn signal you know just to narrow the road a middle 204 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:17,600 lane turn you know maybe viable but that's what I've heard I didn't know if 205 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:23,160 it was sent to you all in whatever kind of way all right thank you thank you for 206 00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:29,880 more Street oh also the check the you know what I'm gonna put that engaged in 207 00:17:29,880 --> 00:17:32,600 I'm not gonna worry about that right here I'll just put it through engaged in 208 00:17:32,600 --> 00:17:37,360 yeah I was just gonna mention we have been coordinating with Julie and her team 209 00:17:37,360 --> 00:17:42,240 along with transportation services and some of the other feedback we received 210 00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:48,760 is in relation to Tomas Rivera and when schools getting out the amount of cars 211 00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:53,040 that are stacking in order to pick up their children in that area so there's a 212 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:57,960 lot of competing factors in that area and so we're evaluating those looking at 213 00:17:57,960 --> 00:18:02,280 what is the right way or the best way and what we committed to the community 214 00:18:02,280 --> 00:18:06,040 was coming back within the next six months as far as presenting several 215 00:18:06,040 --> 00:18:10,000 different options and plans so Julie was working on kind of scoping some of those 216 00:18:10,000 --> 00:18:14,800 different options to see if there's anything that you know sunk in or 217 00:18:14,800 --> 00:18:19,080 someone really liked or attached to and so definitely several different options 218 00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:22,780 will be brought back but I just wanted to mention that parking and stacking 219 00:18:22,780 --> 00:18:27,960 during those times of drop-off and specifically pick up was one of the 220 00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:31,060 major topics that was discussed yeah because it's kind of stacking all the way 221 00:18:31,060 --> 00:18:36,360 back up to Woodrow that's correct yeah it does push back work yes sir just 222 00:18:36,360 --> 00:18:41,800 because we we brought that up and it's it's common for all of our elementary 223 00:18:41,800 --> 00:18:47,160 schools throughout the city where we have these these pick up and drop off 224 00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:55,640 stacking issues if is there a policy guideline that you could point us to in 225 00:18:55,640 --> 00:19:02,480 terms of our policies regarding mobility design around elementary that I could 226 00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:08,880 educate myself about for what we're doing in that regard I think what would 227 00:19:08,880 --> 00:19:13,320 be best is if we get to future agenda items if you ask that specific question 228 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:18,680 so we can add it to the agenda there is a lot of coordination that goes on from 229 00:19:18,680 --> 00:19:24,800 the development services team when new schools come into play existing schools 230 00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:29,880 are different because we work to retrofit or find other ways but definitely 231 00:19:29,880 --> 00:19:33,360 something I think that could be brought back as a future item as to how 232 00:19:33,360 --> 00:19:40,560 development services and transportation services evaluate those all right next 233 00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:46,840 one up is the traffic assumptions for the Bell Eagle Bell locusts Eagle Bell 234 00:19:46,840 --> 00:19:55,880 Dallas roundabout that's a mistake so we contracted HDR for the roundabout and we 235 00:19:55,880 --> 00:20:00,240 gave them the 2040 comprehensive plan to look at the growth projections and then 236 00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:07,140 they also use the tent the Texas text dot responses for the actually have a 237 00:20:07,140 --> 00:20:11,640 future planning document that says what your growth projection should be for the 238 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:16,120 metro area and out years so that you use a comp plan for the in years and your 239 00:20:16,120 --> 00:20:20,120 outer years use the the tech stock standard the cog standard so the growth 240 00:20:20,120 --> 00:20:24,660 projections for 20 from 2020 to 2024 using the comp plan was one was three 241 00:20:24,660 --> 00:20:28,640 point one nine percent looking out at the future growth beyond that looked at 242 00:20:28,640 --> 00:20:32,080 three percent based on text that recommendation and then an out year and 243 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:36,520 then looked at further years out we use I think about two percent I believe was 244 00:20:36,520 --> 00:20:40,000 the text that recommendation so we've looked at different standards we gave we 245 00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:45,680 provided the final copy of the report to on the as an attachment and it showed 246 00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:51,320 that even using the the projections of we had if we did a 2% projection 247 00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:55,320 starting this year of growth the roundabout would be out of function in 248 00:20:55,320 --> 00:20:59,840 2030 is what the report showed is that we couldn't even get it functioning at 249 00:20:59,840 --> 00:21:08,560 that that time question yes no I really appreciate the the backup in the report 250 00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:13,080 I will admit that I haven't had it there's there's a lot of data in there 251 00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:18,120 and I haven't had a chance I mean dating in in excess of what we saw at the when 252 00:21:18,120 --> 00:21:23,320 we reviewed this for council so I haven't had a chance so in I will I will 253 00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:28,280 ask forbearance while I work through it if I may ask for questions on a future 254 00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:34,460 matrix but I'm digesting it now but I really I really appreciate the additional 255 00:21:34,460 --> 00:21:38,400 data thank you yes of course thank you and then want to give an update on the 256 00:21:38,400 --> 00:21:41,960 citywide speed study so last year to the citywide speed study we brought that 257 00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:46,960 forward we changed a lot speed limits on numerous city owned roadways and we had 258 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:51,320 the numerous recommendations on text on roadways we did submit those all off to 259 00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:54,800 text last winter we've gone back and forth a couple of times with them 260 00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:58,440 throughout the spring we're just now getting responses back we've gotten 261 00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:01,640 responses back on a handful of roadways that they agree with that we can change 262 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:05,560 the speed limit so we have updated we have a redline ordinance that we're 263 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:09,440 updating I got a couple got a couple responses back on Friday of ones they 264 00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:12,840 declined but they gave us comments so we work through those comments we're on a 265 00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:16,400 resubmit those and they're still working through the remaining streets that we've 266 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:19,720 submitted so once we get all those comments back we'll bring back one big 267 00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:23,960 ordinance revision for the textile roadways instead of bringing back smaller 268 00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:31,720 ones updating them one street at a time but our plan is I know you haven't 269 00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:37,400 reviewed them and I hear and take that we're going to come back as a package 270 00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:43,280 deal where were there anything that jumped out on the declines one of the 271 00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:50,360 clients so far is one that we're not it's FM 1515 they declined the the speed 272 00:22:50,360 --> 00:22:53,520 limit recommendation we had on it however we know that roadways going to 273 00:22:53,520 --> 00:22:57,160 be rebuilt and their comment was after it's rebuilt restudy it and submit 274 00:22:57,160 --> 00:23:02,000 again so we're in the middle design of utilities for that so it's it's going to 275 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:05,520 be rebuilt very soon so we're not too much of a heartburn on that one to 276 00:23:05,520 --> 00:23:08,120 getting the client because we can change it and we'll change it again once it's 277 00:23:08,120 --> 00:23:11,960 reconstructed because the roadway character changes we did have a 278 00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:15,440 recommendation one that we were trying to get through is a 17 mile an hour 279 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:20,240 speed reduction on North Locust north of loop 288 and tech stock can't go below 280 00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:24,860 15 miles per hour speed reduction we tried to emphasize like hey this is a 281 00:23:24,860 --> 00:23:27,760 good reason to do it and they said we can only go down 15 miles per hour so 282 00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:32,120 they basically said you can't go down to 45 you can only go down to 50 or 283 00:23:32,120 --> 00:23:35,400 something like that I don't remember the exact numbers but we'd have to revise 284 00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:39,800 our submittal and we submit it okay that makes sense thank you 285 00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:56,560 I look forward to the future report yes all righty Brett's quite a bit taller 286 00:23:56,560 --> 00:24:04,120 than I am so let's go through the matrix for a future agenda item so Bonnie 287 00:24:04,120 --> 00:24:09,880 Bray and Hickory Creek as you know we bring to you every single meeting Bradshaw 288 00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:16,480 and we're requesting to remove along with the accident data from downtown 289 00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:21,780 parking although we will note that at some period of time if necessary we'll 290 00:24:21,780 --> 00:24:25,080 evaluate if there's additional things that need to be done I'm in the 291 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:29,400 downtown and I think some of that will come from the downtown parking study 292 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:34,720 speeding on Moore Street we're going to remove traffic assumptions we've sent 293 00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:40,440 you that information at such time you feel like you've had an opportunity to 294 00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:43,680 do the download on all of that and want us to bring it back we're gonna take it 295 00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:49,560 off for now and then of course the text that response on speed study we're gonna 296 00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:53,080 remove and we'll bring back at a future date so we'll leave it at the bottom of 297 00:24:53,080 --> 00:25:00,520 the agenda as Brett works through all of those with textile DCTA presentation I 298 00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:05,120 know we talked a little bit about the abundance didn't letter that was 299 00:25:05,120 --> 00:25:10,360 received I have taken that information and sent it over to Paul Christina with 300 00:25:10,360 --> 00:25:15,160 DCTA and they are preparing a presentation currently and will be 301 00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:20,480 making a beer first work session item on November 7th I believe I know it's on 302 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:23,800 November 7th I can't remember if it's the first one or not but you will hear 303 00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:27,440 from Paul Christina and he is aware of that information that was received so 304 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:33,520 have passed that along so instead of us making a presentation here because you 305 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:35,960 are both members of the council we're just gonna wait and let that 306 00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:40,680 presentation be made at the council meeting and if there's any questions in 307 00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:47,440 advance that you'd like for us to find out please feel free to submit those 308 00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:54,520 actually that were essentially you're asking for nine to be off as well eight 309 00:25:54,520 --> 00:26:00,680 and nine yes we're asking for eight and nine because we have prepared actually 310 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:04,880 yes that's incorrect we're not gonna bring that back as a future staff report 311 00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:08,760 I apologize that's my mistake we're gonna we've sent that information over 312 00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:13,080 DCTA that's not really something that we can speak to or respond to and we pass 313 00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:18,800 that information along so we will allow DCTA to make whatever comments that 314 00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:22,400 they would like during that time frame and I would just recommend that if 315 00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:26,440 there's specific questions or comments that you have in advance of the DCTA 316 00:26:26,440 --> 00:26:31,320 presentation on the seventh once you receive the work session packet and 317 00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:36,320 information I assume on Friday that you ask or prepare any questions that you 318 00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:40,120 might have and you may already have some so that those can be addressed by mr. 319 00:26:40,120 --> 00:26:47,880 Christine on the seventh and speaking to that I'm gonna be going on the DCTA 320 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:54,520 route presentation today awesome they're gonna pick us up up the Hickory station 321 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:59,400 fantastic and we're supposed to tour they're gonna drop us back off at about 322 00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:03,640 6 p.m. sounds great so that sounds like it's gonna be very exciting enjoy your 323 00:27:03,640 --> 00:27:12,960 day I hope you brought your umbrella awesome okay so last meeting also we 324 00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:17,920 talked about the pedestrian and bicycle safety audit concerns that'll come as a 325 00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:21,400 future staff memo if there's specific things that we want to bring to you but 326 00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:27,880 realize that there are we did receive the email from miss rumor and then we 327 00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:32,040 also will bring that back through the audit process when there's a follow-up 328 00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:35,680 so we're gonna leave that on the agenda because we know there'll be future times 329 00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:39,200 that we want to be able to come back to you and speak on that specifically yes 330 00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:44,160 sir thank you chair the one of the things that I think has come up in the 331 00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:53,320 interim and I'm not I don't recall miss rumors exact items but I'm one of the 332 00:27:53,320 --> 00:27:59,960 things that come up in terms of bicycle and pedestrian safety is whether we are 333 00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:05,240 going to engage in separate mobility planning for this came up in DC RC the 334 00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:09,120 other day and other locations of whether we're going to engage in separate 335 00:28:09,120 --> 00:28:15,440 mobility planning for side paths especially ones that are not necessarily 336 00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:21,160 adjacent to or separable from the roadway and so I don't know if that would 337 00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:25,560 be part of this discussion we need to be a separate discussion and that I guess 338 00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:30,520 I'm really throwing that back to you is form for side path mobility and trail 339 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:37,200 mobility are is that part of this discussion in terms of the same sorts of 340 00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:42,800 roadway mobility planning that we always do for everything are we considering for 341 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:48,360 this bicycle and safety audit that that separability concept where you know we're 342 00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:54,240 we're doing mobility planning on this trail as you know destination planning 343 00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:59,520 all the other things that they go in it separately than roadways or not and is 344 00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:03,920 that part of this or should should I be requesting that as a separate matrix 345 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:10,700 item so let me answer that the best way that I know how so the mobility plan has 346 00:29:10,700 --> 00:29:15,600 three components to it as you're aware a thoroughfare plan a bicycle plan and 347 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:19,080 then of course a pedestrian plan so there are three different layers to that 348 00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:23,280 along with that there was coordination with the parks trails master plan that 349 00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:29,760 is specific to their side paths and infrastructure that is not in concert 350 00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:33,640 with what would happen along a roadway so there's constant coordination and 351 00:29:33,640 --> 00:29:39,000 correlation between those two documents obviously we want a side path to connect 352 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:45,080 to a location where folks can get from a roadway to a side path so there's going 353 00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:49,280 to be caught that constant correlation so I think as far as mobility we're 354 00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:55,400 looking at it as a whole so there's conversation and of course coordination 355 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,880 with the parks department so think of their specific things that you're seeing 356 00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:02,960 from a side path perspective or questions that come up those need to be 357 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:06,040 addressed at the same time they are being evaluated with the bicycle and 358 00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:14,520 pedestrian concerns do do we have and I can't think of any right now but do we 359 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:21,520 we have any non no they would all be just considered trails I'll answer my 360 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:25,920 question for myself but I'll finish anyway do we have any side paths that 361 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:31,200 are not trails that are not considered trails they're just in sort of your 362 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:36,920 domain in in in capital projects and engineering there's nothing that's 363 00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:40,880 coming to my head at the moment I'm not thinking of anything either okay so and 364 00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:47,440 I guess the reason I bring that up is the the the vector of sort of feedback 365 00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:52,760 and why it may or may not relate to Susie's concerns sorry misrumors audit 366 00:30:52,760 --> 00:31:01,240 concerns is that's the same sort of mapping and destination planning it's 367 00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:07,200 not necessarily a trail it is is it a it is really more of a mobility argument so 368 00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:10,960 I will take under you know advisement that this this should be brought up except 369 00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:17,480 excuse me as a separate matrix item or here I guess that's my my my question is 370 00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:23,280 is if I want to bring this up as a separate matrix item or here and and and 371 00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:30,880 and you can you can advise me on that you know mobility as it is itself not 372 00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:36,320 necessarily recreational mobility so if it's not specifically related to 373 00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:39,160 something that came up during the bike pet audit then I would recommend that 374 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:42,920 you bring it up as a separate item and then let staff determine whether or not 375 00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:46,640 there's a correlation between that and what was a part of the bike pet audit 376 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:52,240 fair and then I'll probably get my ducks in a row then and ask for very specific 377 00:31:52,240 --> 00:31:59,200 questions at the next meeting no problem thank you so bike etiquette was one of 378 00:31:59,200 --> 00:32:02,000 the topics that was discussed we're gonna be working with transportation 379 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:07,920 services and bringing that back at the next meeting on the 29th along with the 380 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:12,720 corner of Moore Street and Woodrow that was a specific question about a signal 381 00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:17,800 in that location and so we'll be bringing that back and we are currently 382 00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:22,800 working on some GIS efforts to map sidewalks and bike corridors that is 383 00:32:22,800 --> 00:32:27,760 taking some time and because some of those elements have never been mapped so 384 00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:32,360 that'll come back in a future conversation the downtown parking study 385 00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:37,440 I know you're seeing lots of information we did provide an update back in August 386 00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:40,320 but we will provide additional update but I know you're seeing a lot of 387 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:44,200 information out there on social media currently about the downtown parking 388 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:48,520 study so we encourage you to share that and the citywide parking study is 389 00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:52,360 actually out on the street right now so we're waiting to receive information 390 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:57,840 back on that too and of course those two are working together as similar 391 00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:02,600 information as being asked on both of those whether it be citywide or specific 392 00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:08,800 to downtown and then Ryan Road we will work to continue to bring something 393 00:33:08,800 --> 00:33:12,580 forward as soon as that's available and as you know we have that project on hold 394 00:33:12,580 --> 00:33:17,880 until we get through Hickory Creek I have a question about number 14 okay sure 395 00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:24,600 it is update oh I skipped it I apologize yeah what is that so that is the update 396 00:33:24,600 --> 00:33:33,000 to the spur or the connector as people say between the loop 288 and 380 and what 397 00:33:33,000 --> 00:33:38,200 we are going to be doing is holding off on that when John makes his presentation 398 00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:42,920 he'll have that map that shows that location but they still have received a 399 00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:47,920 tremendous amount of public feedback and public comment from when they held the 400 00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:52,080 public hearing along with text dot reviewing all of that comment with the 401 00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:57,040 consultant at this time also the city has had some comments associated with 402 00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:00,960 that there's not a clear path forward and not information to bring forward yet 403 00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:06,480 so that's why it's just on this message as a future item when John fills its 404 00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:11,760 partner along with text out in the city John will have someone come as a part of 405 00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:15,360 his presentation and bring that information forward but it's not ready 406 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:22,920 to go live at this point so it's still a graphical representation yes ma'am well 407 00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:30,200 I'm still having to get used to the fact that 288 does go past 380 you know I was 408 00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:35,440 thinking 288 to 35 and in not remembering there's another 288 yeah so 409 00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:41,040 that's on me no problem that so what other items do you have that might you 410 00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:44,440 might like to have added to the matrix we want to make sure that we get those 411 00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:50,160 down okay the one that we we just talked about a few minutes ago if I could get 412 00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:55,520 some information to to either this committee or council whichever way you 413 00:34:55,520 --> 00:35:00,720 want to do it sure about our policies regarding design around schools because 414 00:35:00,720 --> 00:35:04,520 it's a pretty old issue and we're constantly bringing in these school 415 00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:09,360 stacking questions to you all the time and and I feel like some of that could 416 00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:14,040 be mitigated if we had a better understanding and can communicate that 417 00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:19,260 understanding back to the public through our bully pulpit mechanisms I think that 418 00:35:19,260 --> 00:35:23,920 would be helpful if we had some you know policy guidelines that we could review 419 00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:28,680 and educate ourselves about that was one and then I don't know this is quite 420 00:35:28,680 --> 00:35:37,920 reaches the level of matrix item but I'll bring it up here sure and that is in the 421 00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:42,680 2019 bond program is especially in the as it's gone through the north parts of 422 00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:47,480 town where they've been lowering the grade of the gas lines to do the 423 00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:53,120 intersection or in for the future renovations of the roadbed we've been 424 00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:55,960 getting all right I don't know if Vicki has but I've been getting a lot of 425 00:35:55,960 --> 00:36:01,600 feedback and I think some of the other counselors have to saying yes we got the 426 00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:06,480 letter like a month or six weeks in advance of when they actually started 427 00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:11,400 doing it what but maybe this is just a question what is our policy for our 428 00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:16,120 contractors in terms of when they actually notify people about start of 429 00:36:16,120 --> 00:36:23,760 starting construction is it just the letter that we sent out or or do they do 430 00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:28,680 a in five days we're gonna start or in 48 hours we're gonna start kind of notice 431 00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:33,200 so it varies so I think it'd be best for us to bring that back to you because it 432 00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:36,720 depends on whether it's internal crews whether it's one of our utility 433 00:36:36,720 --> 00:36:42,200 contractors whether it's one of our franchise utility contractors so there's 434 00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:46,280 a lot of information that's presented when those public meetings happen with 435 00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:50,360 the residents and so I think it'd be best if we bring that information back 436 00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:56,080 to you specifically and kind of talk through what is the typical pattern that 437 00:36:56,080 --> 00:37:01,960 happens so that sounds fine so I'll ask for that to be and I'll provide just a 438 00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:08,360 little more context to the ask and that is in general the the neighbors that are 439 00:37:08,360 --> 00:37:13,160 there they're not they understand they want the road beds fixed they want the 440 00:37:13,160 --> 00:37:18,520 gas lines fixed all that nobody's I mean everybody's understanding that it's 441 00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:24,840 gonna be discombobulating while we're in process they are what they don't like is 442 00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:28,960 the surprise and they all admit to me when I talked to them on the phone yeah 443 00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:35,080 we got the letter so they're not truly surprised but they're surprised when it 444 00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:40,300 commences sure and that's the part that they find discomforting it you know so 445 00:37:40,300 --> 00:37:46,000 if we could get some clarity on when and perhaps so then we can decide whether 446 00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:51,120 new policy directives need to be done I would love that absolutely thank you for 447 00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:56,840 the feedback and we'd be happy to bring that back anything okay already then we 448 00:37:56,840 --> 00:38:01,360 will close this item and move on to the next thing we'll let you call the other 449 00:38:01,360 --> 00:38:07,880 item all right well we'll go back to be item MC to three there's zero four six 450 00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:12,280 receive a report and hold a discussion regarding the city of the end 451 00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:20,280 transportation wait a minute it's a very one mobility status report mr. John 452 00:38:20,280 --> 00:38:28,600 Polster he's here looking good everybody good morning I'm a little taller than 453 00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:55,000 Becky so on on 35 North job the you see there's a bunch of dates here they're 454 00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:58,840 ready to let dates the four late dates correlate with the four different 455 00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:07,520 projects north of 77 you'll notice that they're all roughly in 2024 which is 456 00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:11,600 when they'll be ready to let we have the full funding of eight hundred and one 457 00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:18,680 million dollars for these four projects the different let dates you see actually 458 00:39:18,680 --> 00:39:21,800 showing the let date columns are their current let dates based on where those 459 00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:28,680 dollars are put in the 10-year unified transportation plan so there are 460 00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:35,240 opportunities to move some of these projects up if there's room in the UTP 461 00:39:35,240 --> 00:39:41,040 for that cycle when we come through next year to update it if we're ready they 462 00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:47,480 can move those up but essentially everything north of 370s I mean 77 is 463 00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:55,240 fully funded at eight hundred million dollars and we'll be ready to let by 464 00:39:55,240 --> 00:40:03,440 next year and that goes to six lanes so six lane main lanes and then two lane 465 00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:10,120 frontage roads all the designs is almost done we've got most of the right away 466 00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:14,800 acquired and the critical path items are the utilities and we're working 467 00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:18,320 constantly with each of those utility providers to make sure they hit their 468 00:40:18,320 --> 00:40:26,120 marks I have a question on that one you bet you I apologize I just wanted to 469 00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:33,560 confirm or clarify where I see it starts at the 288 35 and where is that where 470 00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:40,360 does it in is that Milam that's all the way up on County Road 3008 or 3007 it's 471 00:40:40,360 --> 00:40:47,840 in 2002 it's one of those numbers but it ends at the county line so it goes into 472 00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:53,120 it goes into two what is that Grayson or cook up there it goes into another 473 00:40:53,120 --> 00:41:00,080 textile district actually okay so all the way through Denton County 35 north of 474 00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:12,400 Denton will be six lanes no ma'am just the six lanes general purpose now this is 475 00:41:12,400 --> 00:41:19,920 the merge project and it's 35 E and W north to 77 where the other project 476 00:41:19,920 --> 00:41:29,680 starts so it's about 500 million dollars and this project will go under the knife 477 00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:37,040 in April so come April everything from the merge basically everything in 478 00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:45,080 Denton will be under construction and it'll be the ultimate design so from 479 00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:51,360 where 35 E picks up all the way to 380 with they will be building the told 480 00:41:51,360 --> 00:41:56,760 managed lane components they will not be activating them because we don't have a 481 00:41:56,760 --> 00:42:01,840 toll manage line to the south of there but the bridge structures the pavement 482 00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:08,920 and all of the the necessities will be there for the future and it'll go to six 483 00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:14,880 lanes with three two two three two frontage roads which means that you'll 484 00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:19,160 have two lanes as you leave across street and then an auxiliary line will 485 00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:24,320 come on at the exit ramp stay on the frontage road a third lane and then as 486 00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:29,320 the entrance ramp goes on to the freeway it'll drop off and go back to two so it 487 00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:35,660 goes two three two throughout the corridor and that's a in your more urban 488 00:42:35,660 --> 00:42:41,280 areas that's a traffic control situation so that the main lanes get impacted or 489 00:42:41,280 --> 00:42:48,400 you want to go in an in-town movement but you don't want to ride the frontage 490 00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:51,640 road you can get on the main lanes get off come on back and forth and it allows 491 00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:56,040 the traffic to flow better and again it's going to go under the knife in 492 00:42:56,040 --> 00:43:02,600 April and that's assuming all these utilities get completed but city of 493 00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:09,720 Denton is on track one other thing I wanted to bring up is we have the 494 00:43:09,720 --> 00:43:15,880 aesthetics from the city and we've got comments back from text art from the 495 00:43:15,880 --> 00:43:19,880 Dallas bridge section back to the city and so we're working out all the 496 00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:25,540 aesthetic issues that are going through y'all's normal aesthetic process to be 497 00:43:25,540 --> 00:43:33,000 included in the in the project once it goes to construction will the will we 498 00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:38,640 have an opportunity to see the aesthetics before they're finalized so we 499 00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:46,000 can make a comment on them or not we as in City Council members and currently 500 00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:50,720 don't have that in the plan although you will see the plans come through through 501 00:43:50,720 --> 00:43:55,080 an AFA agreement with text art and an interlocal agreement there's two 502 00:43:55,080 --> 00:44:01,760 competing situations going on one is specific information related to 503 00:44:01,760 --> 00:44:06,280 aesthetics that the city would be paying for through the parks department and the 504 00:44:06,280 --> 00:44:11,840 the parks art fund and then the other is TWU going through their board of regents 505 00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:15,920 to make a determination as far as the financial obligation that they want to 506 00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:21,080 make for the aesthetics that they actually have planned and we've been 507 00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:25,840 working on we're happy to bring that forward if council wants to see that 508 00:44:25,840 --> 00:44:30,320 level of information I'll think about what's the best way to do that we might 509 00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:35,640 submit it in a Friday report maybe that's a or an ISR type situation but we 510 00:44:35,640 --> 00:44:38,800 can definitely work through that so I'll get with Seth and Trevor and find out 511 00:44:38,800 --> 00:44:43,440 what way is best to be able to receive some feedback we're on the very tail end 512 00:44:43,440 --> 00:44:48,440 of it's been designed we're on the very tail end of that and wanting to make 513 00:44:48,440 --> 00:44:54,480 sure it works through the process and in order for it all to be a part of the 514 00:44:54,480 --> 00:45:00,600 project it has to have all of its documents completed through council and 515 00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:07,560 funding to text art in January so we are on the very tail end so that's why I 516 00:45:07,560 --> 00:45:11,000 said maybe a Friday report or something is better than trying to get on a 517 00:45:11,000 --> 00:45:14,480 council agenda so we'll work through that thank you 518 00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:21,120 yes ma'am yes sir are you are you done with this item because I'm gonna ask 519 00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:25,120 chairs indulgence I missed a note of mine on the previous item so whenever 520 00:45:25,120 --> 00:45:34,160 you're done okay I'd love to boom great that that ball of our water yeah they're 521 00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:45,320 not kind of coordinating with you what is the what are the implications for for 522 00:45:45,320 --> 00:45:50,720 test stop in the city in terms of you know the project completion times and 523 00:45:50,720 --> 00:45:54,640 the utility movements and things like that I mean obviously the project is 524 00:45:54,640 --> 00:45:59,060 gonna go forward but what is it what does it mean when when you hit a bump in 525 00:45:59,060 --> 00:46:03,300 the road like this so whenever I get a notice that says somebody's not 526 00:46:03,300 --> 00:46:09,040 responding tech start gives that to me and I go do my Guido stuff and so we go 527 00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:15,120 meet with ball of water and we tear them up we threaten them we buy them off 528 00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:19,160 whatever we got to do because I got a eight hundred million dollar job that we 529 00:46:19,160 --> 00:46:26,840 can't hold up so I just got this notice last week I'm gonna give a judge eats to 530 00:46:26,840 --> 00:46:31,320 see what he wants to do and we go sit down and ask him what the problem is 531 00:46:31,320 --> 00:46:36,600 they tell us what the problem is if it's a money thing we take care of it if it's 532 00:46:36,600 --> 00:46:43,240 some other third thing you try to take care of it but we just deal with it 533 00:46:43,240 --> 00:46:48,800 aggressively but from our perspective here in the city just don't be on the 534 00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:55,560 list yeah and and really this is this is this is something we can be aware of but 535 00:46:55,560 --> 00:47:00,760 as yes so no action items for us no not for y'all y'all action items are in your 536 00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:08,620 utility coordination so in all of these there is a city component for y'all when 537 00:47:08,620 --> 00:47:13,800 that's why we started these quarterly actually we meet monthly now mobility 538 00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:17,740 meetings with textile we bring in the district we bring in the area office we 539 00:47:17,740 --> 00:47:22,680 bring in the utility coordinators and we make sure the city of Denton is not on 540 00:47:22,680 --> 00:47:29,480 that naughty list right because it has ramifications and the main ramifications 541 00:47:29,480 --> 00:47:32,840 is if you can't get your projects ready you're not going to get any more 542 00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:38,800 projects that's what started this whole thing back in the day when we were doing 543 00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:46,840 2499 2181 the and then we wanted Buc-E's to come in right there was a lot of 544 00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:52,080 things that the city needed and the state was reluctant at the time to 545 00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:56,240 provide any more projects in the city because they weren't able to deliver the 546 00:47:56,240 --> 00:48:01,520 projects they had different regime I don't think I'd see anybody here that was 547 00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:07,720 here then and so we had a lot of come to Jesus meetings then so you just it's 548 00:48:07,720 --> 00:48:12,000 best to stay off the list but it won't have any impact because the reason the 549 00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:16,840 county gets involved with the project delivery is to make sure they hit their 550 00:48:16,840 --> 00:48:25,560 marks so there's things that a county can do that text I can't I appreciate 551 00:48:25,560 --> 00:48:34,240 that clarity mr. when I know you better I'll tell you what I tell my kids when 552 00:48:34,240 --> 00:48:43,920 they ask me what I do for a little bit okay Mayhill at 35 this is the big job 553 00:48:43,920 --> 00:48:51,120 well you can't see it on the map okay so what we're doing is just for 554 00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:56,220 clarification or recap when we did the 288 job we did the southbound and 555 00:48:56,220 --> 00:49:01,360 frontage road between 288 Mayhill and the brinker interchange now that we're 556 00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:04,720 doing Mayhill we're going to do the frontage road from Mayhill to 288 557 00:49:04,720 --> 00:49:11,000 northbound which wasn't done previously and we're going to do a grade separation 558 00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:17,880 or a bypass lane over a brinker so that when you're going from Mayhill to 288 or 559 00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:23,160 288 to Mayhill you don't have to stop at the light at Bucky's anymore you'll be 560 00:49:23,160 --> 00:49:29,160 able to go up parallel at the same elevation as the main lanes and then drop 561 00:49:29,160 --> 00:49:38,160 back down to go to 288 or drop back down to go to Mayhill yes the interchange 562 00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:44,400 itself at Mayhill will be 12 lanes of traffic unlike 288 which is only 10 so 563 00:49:44,400 --> 00:49:51,480 it'll be a significantly larger structure and we are working on a lot of 564 00:49:51,480 --> 00:50:00,760 utilities that's the critical path item we are have a lot of atlas continues to 565 00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:10,640 be our big problem on all of our projects and we just get in and talk to 566 00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:14,880 them about it but they are critical path item on this job and the date that we're 567 00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:19,880 getting for ready to let that February 2024 is the date that Atlus is given 568 00:50:19,880 --> 00:50:29,600 that they'll be done and we'll see we meet with them every month on it but 569 00:50:29,600 --> 00:50:33,720 it's a hundred and twenty five million dollar project it started out at about 570 00:50:33,720 --> 00:50:39,380 fifty and then we added things that we knew we had to add like the bypass at 571 00:50:39,380 --> 00:50:45,160 Brinker and then cost escalations over the last from 2018 to this year 572 00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:55,000 construction escalation tech stops escalation rate is 88 80% increase so 573 00:50:55,000 --> 00:51:02,480 we're ready in February 2024 they don't want to move the let day because they're 574 00:51:02,480 --> 00:51:09,920 not necessarily trusting Atmos yet right so if they have to go through some more 575 00:51:09,920 --> 00:51:15,840 part of 24 then when we they don't like to move a let date out text doesn't like 576 00:51:15,840 --> 00:51:21,480 to move it to a further out month they will move it up so we can move it up but 577 00:51:21,480 --> 00:51:24,760 they're not moving it up to their confident that Atmos is going to hit 578 00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:29,360 their mark and right now they're the critical path on this project and it 579 00:51:29,360 --> 00:51:34,920 seems like every time we speak of Atmos I almost hate to say the name Atmos 580 00:51:34,920 --> 00:51:40,280 because I know my our bill seems to go up every every time we could say 581 00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:45,320 something about Apple so yeah you all be nice to Atmos for trying for us don't 582 00:51:45,320 --> 00:51:57,160 make it easy don't make it easy all right so you're 35 W frontage roads from 583 00:51:57,160 --> 00:52:05,920 basically Luke 288 West which is 2449 now down to 407 we've got a ready to let 584 00:52:05,920 --> 00:52:19,160 date of September of 2025 the right away all 56 parcels are in some phase of 585 00:52:19,160 --> 00:52:25,240 acquisition the over the half of those are in eminent domain which means that 586 00:52:25,240 --> 00:52:29,560 the people didn't agree with the values or some of the third thing there's other 587 00:52:29,560 --> 00:52:36,320 reasons why you go to condemnation but we only have 18 of the 58 acquired and 588 00:52:36,320 --> 00:52:42,280 we are as we're asked to help the county steps in and helps whenever the state 589 00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:49,480 asks us to but right away the right away is progressing and it is a 341 million 590 00:52:49,480 --> 00:52:54,440 dollar project and we're fairly confident that once we get closer to 591 00:52:54,440 --> 00:52:58,720 that let date that some portion of this project will be funded probably in the 592 00:52:58,720 --> 00:53:03,960 next unified transportation plan update which is we're in August September 593 00:53:03,960 --> 00:53:09,480 October so they just started the next cycle so it'll be next August when we'll 594 00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:18,280 know if this project gets additional funding okay and then the section to the 595 00:53:18,280 --> 00:53:25,800 east of us that's 380 from 288 to 377 this is the interim project where we're 596 00:53:25,800 --> 00:53:31,600 adding to the fifth and sixth lane and it's progressing and it is anticipated 597 00:53:31,600 --> 00:53:36,680 on tech stops project report to be completed in January so a couple of 598 00:53:36,680 --> 00:53:39,560 months away and if you're out there driving it you see they're pretty close 599 00:53:39,560 --> 00:53:46,520 to to being done and we have filled in some questions at least at the county 600 00:53:46,520 --> 00:53:54,200 level at the city level of some concerns about the continuous raised median from 601 00:53:54,200 --> 00:54:03,240 288 to to May Hill and we're walking the logic with them and understanding that 602 00:54:03,240 --> 00:54:08,200 you know the volume of traffic and and that what they're thinking is is it'll 603 00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:11,520 act like it is now while it's under construction and right now you're at 604 00:54:11,520 --> 00:54:20,520 11-foot lanes the medians protected by barriers so we're walking through that 605 00:54:20,520 --> 00:54:23,600 process with everybody but that's the only real complaint we've had is that 606 00:54:23,600 --> 00:54:27,880 people don't want to have to turn right they want to turn left and that was the 607 00:54:27,880 --> 00:54:41,360 problem all right yeah just send them to textile it's theirs to do 608 00:54:41,360 --> 00:54:48,080 288 frontage road this is 288 West project so we designed it's a controlled 609 00:54:48,080 --> 00:54:52,320 access facility so it'll be main lanes and frontage roads and grade separations 610 00:54:52,320 --> 00:55:00,040 and it's fully designed for that and the right-of-way acquisition will be for a 611 00:55:00,040 --> 00:55:06,200 full freeway cross-section but what we're proposing to do initially is build 612 00:55:06,200 --> 00:55:12,480 the northbound frontage road first because it's the inside of the circle 613 00:55:12,480 --> 00:55:16,760 which means the city can allow all the development to come up adjacent to the 614 00:55:16,760 --> 00:55:20,680 roadway and they won't have to change any of their connections because that will 615 00:55:20,680 --> 00:55:27,000 be the easterly most connection for the 288 section so they won't have to redo 616 00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:38,560 their driveways and etc in the future they'll be set and again it's 200 and 617 00:55:38,560 --> 00:55:44,200 it'll be it'll be 300 million by the time we get to 2026 and the reason it 618 00:55:44,200 --> 00:55:48,760 taking so long I think I've told you all this that the right-of-way acquisition 619 00:55:48,760 --> 00:55:53,400 we had the project cleared in 2020 and we were saying well it's going to take 620 00:55:53,400 --> 00:55:58,440 us to 2024 to get all the right-of-way which we usually only do about a year 621 00:55:58,440 --> 00:56:03,560 and we only do about a year for utility relocates but it's about a year and a 622 00:56:03,560 --> 00:56:11,160 half is because we've gone through a gas field before and you have to deal with 623 00:56:11,160 --> 00:56:17,960 those gas wells as both a right-of-way acquisition and a utility relocation all 624 00:56:17,960 --> 00:56:24,000 at the same time which drags them out because part of the value of those 625 00:56:24,000 --> 00:56:29,720 structures or their transmission lines that move the gas from from the well to 626 00:56:29,720 --> 00:56:37,760 the collections areas and they have to be moved and calculated so there's a 627 00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:42,680 whole lot of moving parts on that and where we've gone through gas wells 628 00:56:42,680 --> 00:56:48,920 fields in the past we've had extended timelines for both the right-of-way and 629 00:56:48,920 --> 00:56:58,240 the utility so they're calculating those in in that sort of circumstance just 630 00:56:58,240 --> 00:57:05,520 just text up buy them out is that just easier or it's all just relocation so no 631 00:57:05,520 --> 00:57:12,900 entity can acquire right-of-way without paying fair market value not more or less 632 00:57:12,900 --> 00:57:20,280 they can compensate damages etc and so they don't actually they buy them out if 633 00:57:20,280 --> 00:57:25,160 they have to a lot of times they want to be relocated because their revenue 634 00:57:25,160 --> 00:57:29,080 generators right and so that's where the right-of-way and the utility comes in 635 00:57:29,080 --> 00:57:38,040 at the same time because they are just going to move but unlike a a normal 636 00:57:38,040 --> 00:57:43,360 utility they lose revenue as they are down while they're moving so that has to 637 00:57:43,360 --> 00:57:49,320 be calculated so it's not only a utility relocation it's a value to the reload so 638 00:57:49,320 --> 00:57:55,360 textile there is a formula it's like a parking space for a car dealership 639 00:57:55,360 --> 00:58:00,200 textile tried to used to buy that stuff out of you know by the acre and car 640 00:58:00,200 --> 00:58:04,160 dealerships over the years won the cases that those each one of those car slots 641 00:58:04,160 --> 00:58:08,960 generates a certain amount of revenue because they display a vehicle and so 642 00:58:08,960 --> 00:58:16,000 over the time the law leveled out to where if you know you got ten spots in a 643 00:58:16,000 --> 00:58:21,720 dealership you know those are going to cost you you know $120,000 a pop or a 644 00:58:21,720 --> 00:58:27,160 billboard right a billboard is going to cost you 750 to a million five to buy 645 00:58:27,160 --> 00:58:34,880 and $26,000 or will relocate typically when a billboard gets unmoored 646 00:58:34,880 --> 00:58:40,040 communities have policies that say you can't come back so when textile wants 647 00:58:40,040 --> 00:58:45,520 them to move ten feet in reality they're going away so there's a value set same 648 00:58:45,520 --> 00:58:49,680 thing with these gas wells they know historically what it's cost them and so 649 00:58:49,680 --> 00:58:56,720 textile won't go beyond that on their own but they can be told to go beyond that 650 00:58:56,720 --> 00:59:02,840 by a judge or or a commission for the remnant domain so typically if they can't 651 00:59:02,840 --> 00:59:09,280 agree on the value they just simply let somebody else decide the value and it 652 00:59:09,280 --> 00:59:11,880 takes a long time 653 00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:22,840 okay this is sorry I apologize John a question I've got from from the 654 00:59:22,840 --> 00:59:27,860 communities is one of education they're they're very interested as as the 655 00:59:27,860 --> 00:59:34,720 project goes across Hickory Creek there I've had some people from UNT and others 656 00:59:34,720 --> 00:59:40,640 yeah yeah and I know that we're far out and so I guess CP&Y is gonna do the 657 00:59:40,640 --> 00:59:46,800 environmental leader environmental was completed environmental clearance was 658 00:59:46,800 --> 00:59:53,920 done in September of 2020 then then just for the record when I started this 659 00:59:53,920 --> 01:00:01,400 project I was single skinny and handsome three children and they're all out of 660 01:00:01,400 --> 01:00:07,480 college it's taking a long time to get this road to where it is right now then 661 01:00:07,480 --> 01:00:13,960 then I guess well what I'll do is I'll figure out how to get a whole CP&Y and 662 01:00:13,960 --> 01:00:20,040 get the report they work for me okay so ask me what you want the people were 663 01:00:20,040 --> 01:00:24,520 just interested in you know the report in their findings they wouldn't get there 664 01:00:24,520 --> 01:00:28,280 so it sort of what was the the biology that they found when they did the 665 01:00:28,280 --> 01:00:33,360 environmental and any cultural resources absolutely there's no complaint they 666 01:00:33,360 --> 01:00:39,120 just know what the information is so just as a for going forward when you get a 667 01:00:39,120 --> 01:00:43,980 question like that you can throw it to whoever but text that you're in the 668 01:00:43,980 --> 01:00:51,520 Dallas district the Dallas district has a very good open source internet site 669 01:00:51,520 --> 01:00:58,560 called keep it moving Dallas dot org calm not not org it's calm I think it 670 01:00:58,560 --> 01:01:03,240 should be work but it's calm and you go in and you think it's an interstate or 671 01:01:03,240 --> 01:01:07,680 state highway or whatever there's a list I'm up type you hit that type and all 672 01:01:07,680 --> 01:01:13,560 those roads will be listed you hit loop 288 West and then you'll look for 673 01:01:13,560 --> 01:01:17,080 anything that says environmental clearance right or environmental 674 01:01:17,080 --> 01:01:22,080 assessment you hit that it'll show the report and you can download it or you 675 01:01:22,080 --> 01:01:25,040 can just read it right there it'll go it'll get you the schematic you'll 676 01:01:25,040 --> 01:01:28,480 everything you want to know that's happened on that project will be in that 677 01:01:28,480 --> 01:01:38,040 in that in that report so it's a it's there and yeah we closed that out just 678 01:01:38,040 --> 01:01:41,400 as a little bit of the history the reason why it's taken 25 years usually 679 01:01:41,400 --> 01:01:48,920 doesn't take 25 years is that right here is the best place for that section of 680 01:01:48,920 --> 01:01:54,520 288 to go because before we were way off the map out here which was a 681 01:01:54,520 --> 01:01:59,760 significantly higher impact of the Hickory Creek floodplain area and we 682 01:01:59,760 --> 01:02:03,520 moved out there because back in the day Denton Airport was going to go to a 683 01:02:03,520 --> 01:02:08,980 second runway and they had to have a 5,000 foot displacement from the 684 01:02:08,980 --> 01:02:14,240 existing well a state highway has to have a 5,000 foot separation from a 685 01:02:14,240 --> 01:02:19,520 runway so we had to be 5,000 feet further from the second runway so what 686 01:02:19,520 --> 01:02:23,800 we had it you know halfway through the environmental clearance in the city 687 01:02:23,800 --> 01:02:28,760 came back said you know what we changed our mind we're not going to the second 688 01:02:28,760 --> 01:02:33,640 runway and you know I talked to the county and I said look the best place 689 01:02:33,640 --> 01:02:36,480 for that road was where the second runway was going to be I know we've got 690 01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:41,040 a lot of work into this is we're five years into it but we need to start from 691 01:02:41,040 --> 01:02:46,200 scratch and so we sucked it in which reduced the crossing of the floodplain 692 01:02:46,200 --> 01:02:52,720 and it put it where it needed to go to begin with which was right at that 5,000 693 01:02:52,720 --> 01:02:57,640 foot separation from your existing runway reduces the impact to the to the 694 01:02:57,640 --> 01:03:12,600 to the flora and 25 years later here we are so this is where we're back he was 695 01:03:12,600 --> 01:03:16,880 talking about this area where we're talking about the time between the two 696 01:03:16,880 --> 01:03:22,320 380 and 288 since we already know the 380 and everybody's plan is a freeway 697 01:03:22,320 --> 01:03:32,040 it makes sense of 288 through freeway to have a some type of a free flowing 698 01:03:32,040 --> 01:03:43,920 connection between 380 and 288 this is a pictorial of what Westwood has been 699 01:03:43,920 --> 01:03:48,680 working with where we knew knew there was some development going on closer to 700 01:03:48,680 --> 01:03:59,080 the the actual loop itself and so they tried to find a way to thread the needle 701 01:03:59,080 --> 01:04:09,120 cities going through some study for the north east quadrant and tech start 702 01:04:09,120 --> 01:04:13,200 looked at all this and so what I have is a bunch of kids that are fighting on 703 01:04:13,200 --> 01:04:16,600 much like each other and so we're I'd say we're gonna have a come to Jesus 704 01:04:16,600 --> 01:04:21,600 meeting and I think it's this week sometime or next week I can't remember I 705 01:04:21,600 --> 01:04:29,080 think it's next week and we're gonna get in the room and we're gonna find out 706 01:04:29,080 --> 01:04:35,040 what the problems are and then so typically when I'm beating somebody up I 707 01:04:35,040 --> 01:04:38,280 don't like that it'd be a lot of people right because I don't want to think I'm 708 01:04:38,280 --> 01:04:41,840 beating them up because I'm showing I don't want them to beat them up because 709 01:04:41,840 --> 01:04:47,400 they need to be beat up so we're gonna beat them up figure out what the art of 710 01:04:47,400 --> 01:04:51,280 the possible is then we're gonna come back and meet with Becky staff and then 711 01:04:51,280 --> 01:04:59,120 based on that we're gonna bring what we think is the best path forward but right 712 01:04:59,120 --> 01:05:07,360 now I got I got arguing engineers that need to be corralled yeah I really 713 01:05:07,360 --> 01:05:11,200 appreciate that because you know there's a there's we had the discussion last 714 01:05:11,200 --> 01:05:16,360 month of the month before about this and and and and this is this and the outer 715 01:05:16,360 --> 01:05:22,920 loop that you'll covered next is are in another soon are causing me as a 716 01:05:22,920 --> 01:05:28,060 counselor so much heartburn right now yeah because of all the stakeholders so 717 01:05:28,060 --> 01:05:32,760 I'm I'm really following this closely so I'm really interested so we're gonna 718 01:05:32,760 --> 01:05:38,440 get down to finally will be we're good well again it won't be the we're 719 01:05:38,440 --> 01:05:45,000 anticipating an environmental clearance in 25 and so that's when this alignment 720 01:05:45,000 --> 01:05:49,920 is set right anything prior to that if someone tells you they know where that 721 01:05:49,920 --> 01:05:53,920 roads going their line to you because if it's not environmentally cleared it's 722 01:05:53,920 --> 01:05:57,440 not protected and that's not the alignment you can't buy right away you 723 01:05:57,440 --> 01:06:03,040 can't do anything with it it's a it's a line on a map but we're working towards 724 01:06:03,040 --> 01:06:09,840 that and what we have to do in order to get to that point is you have to consider 725 01:06:09,840 --> 01:06:15,160 the environment floor and fauna we got to include the public and the process 726 01:06:15,160 --> 01:06:19,880 and we can't violate any of your property rights right that's why it takes 727 01:06:19,880 --> 01:06:22,680 so long I mean you don't let me make me not have to do any of those three things 728 01:06:22,680 --> 01:06:28,400 and we'll build you that road tomorrow but that's not the way it works so this 729 01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:37,040 is an iterative process so the engineers went crazy on wild alignments and there 730 01:06:37,040 --> 01:06:43,080 was like 13 of them at one point and every alignment you show is a new group 731 01:06:43,080 --> 01:06:55,080 of people to deal with right so you I appreciate creativity but not at the 732 01:06:55,080 --> 01:06:59,200 expense of trauma right so we're gonna we're gonna get it we're gonna get it 733 01:06:59,200 --> 01:07:05,080 back into the realm of reality and it'll reduce the number of people that are 734 01:07:05,080 --> 01:07:10,560 worried because we will have one or two specific alignments that we think we can 735 01:07:10,560 --> 01:07:15,920 carry through the process what are the questions I asked you last time or maybe 736 01:07:15,920 --> 01:07:20,700 honestly if I had been a question of Becky so I apologize that that cemetery 737 01:07:20,700 --> 01:07:24,240 there did we get any clarity because that's a I mean with cemeteries that's 738 01:07:24,240 --> 01:07:29,160 a fixed point in space yeah we're not going near those cemetery right there do 739 01:07:29,160 --> 01:07:33,440 we have any clarity on that sort of concept well I will tell you that we're 740 01:07:33,440 --> 01:07:37,120 not going anywhere near if there's if any one of my engineers showed an 741 01:07:37,120 --> 01:07:40,760 alignment they had anything to do with the cemetery they're fired we're gonna 742 01:07:40,760 --> 01:07:45,720 get because you don't touch cemeteries and you don't touch churches so John 743 01:07:45,720 --> 01:07:51,000 during the public feedback what Mayor Pro Tembeck is referring to is there was 744 01:07:51,000 --> 01:07:55,320 additional conversation about there is a cemetery currently shown on the 745 01:07:55,320 --> 01:07:59,560 schematic but an additional cemetery that maybe folks weren't aware of that 746 01:07:59,560 --> 01:08:08,220 was I believe to the northwest or maybe northeast of the alignment so when the 747 01:08:08,220 --> 01:08:14,040 evaluation is going on such as you've spoken to with text odd and yourself 748 01:08:14,040 --> 01:08:17,880 those are a part of those comments and feedback that was received from the 749 01:08:17,880 --> 01:08:21,440 public so that's what he's referring to it's not just the one that's shown 750 01:08:21,440 --> 01:08:26,720 currently on maps but there was another area so but your comment I'm sure still 751 01:08:26,720 --> 01:08:31,280 stands regardless we're gonna we're gonna get this down to the reality and 752 01:08:31,280 --> 01:08:35,040 then we'll bring you back and then that will reduce the number of people that 753 01:08:35,040 --> 01:08:43,360 are torqued because there'll be fewer alignments if you were engineers okay 754 01:08:43,360 --> 01:08:52,480 this this segment segment no no not her the ones I pay for I can't do anything 755 01:08:52,480 --> 01:08:56,720 to her she does stuff to me so this segment seven I will show it as a 756 01:08:56,720 --> 01:08:59,720 separate project because you'll have it as a separate project but this is 757 01:08:59,720 --> 01:09:05,920 actually this part of the project right here and so we're doing the segment seven 758 01:09:05,920 --> 01:09:12,080 environmental with the Westwood job for 288 but y'all call it Bonnie Bray section 759 01:09:12,080 --> 01:09:16,480 segment seven so I just call it out for you that it's it's on the same track as 760 01:09:16,480 --> 01:09:22,880 the loop and then 1515 that we were talking about a minute ago that's got a 761 01:09:22,880 --> 01:09:30,880 radio let of June of 2025 and in between now and then I got to come up with you 762 01:09:30,880 --> 01:09:39,280 know 34 million dollars we'll we'll figure that out I'm sure I'll figure it 763 01:09:39,280 --> 01:09:49,200 out somehow I have a question certainly it's 1515 the same as Oak Street airport 764 01:09:49,200 --> 01:09:56,800 oh I have that same question whenever they wanted somebody said hey we need to 765 01:09:56,800 --> 01:10:00,200 start the engineering on 1515 I said I'll do it as soon as you tell me where 766 01:10:00,200 --> 01:10:12,800 it is I know that we're not you know at the end here but at the same token 1515 767 01:10:12,800 --> 01:10:17,560 is where it is and it's there's not there's no space for it to move around 768 01:10:17,560 --> 01:10:22,040 and do things so you're really just doing the renovation project so I guess 769 01:10:22,040 --> 01:10:29,840 my question is considering the the heavy load that this road bears when folks 770 01:10:29,840 --> 01:10:35,420 reach out to me what can I tell them about alternative pathways and how all 771 01:10:35,420 --> 01:10:39,440 that industrial usage is okay it's gonna be accommodated while you're renovating 772 01:10:39,440 --> 01:10:47,160 the right it's not so text that doesn't do alternate routes they you've got two 773 01:10:47,160 --> 01:10:54,040 lanes of traffic roughly out there right now in some cases more they'll keep the 774 01:10:54,040 --> 01:10:59,040 existing number of lanes open that you have right now and then they'll go build 775 01:10:59,040 --> 01:11:03,400 the road that's the policy so they don't need an alternate route because if you 776 01:11:03,400 --> 01:11:08,080 had four lanes like on the interstates you typically if you've got four lanes 777 01:11:08,080 --> 01:11:11,920 of traffic before you when you start most of the time while they're building 778 01:11:11,920 --> 01:11:16,280 an interstate you'll keep the four lanes they just may go from 12 feet to 9 and a 779 01:11:16,280 --> 01:11:22,720 quarter you know but they'll still be there this road is it going to be a six 780 01:11:22,720 --> 01:11:29,920 lane divided facility with flush medians in some short distances where we have a 781 01:11:29,920 --> 01:11:36,320 lot of left-turn movements and before we started right we had the county decided 782 01:11:36,320 --> 01:11:44,640 we had basically two clients the city of Denton and all of the people that have 783 01:11:44,640 --> 01:11:48,720 businesses out there so we met with Tetra Pak we met with all all people 784 01:11:48,720 --> 01:11:54,120 there along that corridor Peter belt and we wanted to know about their their 785 01:11:54,120 --> 01:12:00,560 shift timing and so part of what we're going to do is once we get into the 786 01:12:00,560 --> 01:12:05,600 traffic control plan once we let the project is we're going to come back to 787 01:12:05,600 --> 01:12:10,400 everybody and find out what their schedules are and how we can somehow 788 01:12:10,400 --> 01:12:16,640 tweak the shift changes so that they're staggered without screwing everybody up 789 01:12:16,640 --> 01:12:24,640 out there while we're building the road so we're going to try to you know put 790 01:12:24,640 --> 01:12:31,760 ten pounds in a five pound bag but it's still ten pounds that's that analogy is 791 01:12:31,760 --> 01:12:42,720 normally used I'm not sure about that it's the same thing okay FM 1173 good 792 01:12:42,720 --> 01:12:50,640 news is the project is cleared let me see we cleared it in 2021 and all 793 01:12:50,640 --> 01:12:56,240 right aways acquired which is basically what we needed and now we are relocating 794 01:12:56,240 --> 01:13:05,200 utilities primarily on the railroad track back to the third to 35 and that's 795 01:13:05,200 --> 01:13:12,920 because when we do the 35 job we want to go ahead and build the 1173 new 796 01:13:12,920 --> 01:13:17,400 interchange location at Barthol road which means we got to build that part of 797 01:13:17,400 --> 01:13:26,880 1173 with the project so it's while it's not funded completely well at all we 798 01:13:26,880 --> 01:13:34,160 will have a good chunk of it funded through the 35 project next starts to go 799 01:13:34,160 --> 01:13:45,720 to construction six lanes the outer loop now the deal on the outer loop is the 800 01:13:45,720 --> 01:13:53,600 number of people that become irritated significantly reduces the further along 801 01:13:53,600 --> 01:14:01,440 the line you go because right now we're not willing to show you the 72 802 01:14:01,440 --> 01:14:06,600 alignments that everybody wants us to look at because we were doing it what's 803 01:14:06,600 --> 01:14:11,520 called there's a categorical exclusion lags a programmatic categorical exclusion 804 01:14:11,520 --> 01:14:15,880 which means if you fit a certain criteria you just check a box and you're 805 01:14:15,880 --> 01:14:20,040 cleared then you get the environmental assessment and then you've got the 806 01:14:20,040 --> 01:14:23,340 environmental impact statement that's the highest level of environmental 807 01:14:23,340 --> 01:14:30,360 clearance with the core new alignment green belt conservation the county 808 01:14:30,360 --> 01:14:36,360 decided we were going to go ahead and spend 37 million dollars and do the full 809 01:14:36,360 --> 01:14:45,020 on EIS which takes a longer but it covers a whole lot more stuff and by 810 01:14:45,020 --> 01:14:49,840 the time you get to an alignment on an EA you only got to do two alignments 811 01:14:49,840 --> 01:14:56,440 which is no build and the alignment that you want but once you get them all 812 01:14:56,440 --> 01:15:02,640 vetted through the process on a EIS you have to take two alignments almost all 813 01:15:02,640 --> 01:15:07,000 the way through to the very end and then at the very end pick the one that's 814 01:15:07,000 --> 01:15:13,320 least impacted but right now we've got 14 that we're going to try to get down 815 01:15:13,320 --> 01:15:19,460 to seven and then those seven we're going to try to get down to two and then 816 01:15:19,460 --> 01:15:24,880 take those two through the process and the problem we have is isn't a problem 817 01:15:24,880 --> 01:15:31,000 I take that back is that in the EIS if somebody says why can't you go up on 455 818 01:15:31,000 --> 01:15:36,680 and go across the dam well we already know what that answer is you can't go 819 01:15:36,680 --> 01:15:41,800 across the dam core won't let you but you can't say that without putting a 820 01:15:41,800 --> 01:15:49,240 line on a map going out and doing the work and showing a matrix that says the 821 01:15:49,240 --> 01:15:54,080 core won't let you cross there and so during that year and a half period where 822 01:15:54,080 --> 01:15:58,920 those 17 18 lines are on a map everybody thinks the outer loops coming in their 823 01:15:58,920 --> 01:16:03,340 backyard because if they think it's somewhere that a whole green blob is the 824 01:16:03,340 --> 01:16:14,360 outer look but we learned over time that instead of me showing you 17 lines that 825 01:16:14,360 --> 01:16:19,040 look like spaghetti they're on the wall just to give you a blob and say we're 826 01:16:19,040 --> 01:16:26,760 working in this blob area the three places that we are governed by 827 01:16:26,760 --> 01:16:32,360 physically is Collin County has already built a portion of the outer loop in 828 01:16:32,360 --> 01:16:38,640 their area and when you drive the northbound D&T section in Denton County 829 01:16:38,640 --> 01:16:43,440 up to Grayson County there is a street crossing called the outer loop so that's 830 01:16:43,440 --> 01:16:49,240 generally where we have to start the Corps of Engineers has told us and we 831 01:16:49,240 --> 01:16:53,400 couldn't just take this on their word we'd have to eliminate all the other 832 01:16:53,400 --> 01:16:59,120 alignments if but not for this other issue has told us we can't cross the 833 01:16:59,120 --> 01:17:08,060 green belt any other location than at 428 okay and the reason they can say 834 01:17:08,060 --> 01:17:16,680 that is because when the green belt was established they got the Corps of Engineers 835 01:17:16,680 --> 01:17:22,480 got money from Congress to buy conservation easements on long both 836 01:17:22,480 --> 01:17:28,700 sides of the green belt and the conservation easement says you can live 837 01:17:28,700 --> 01:17:35,540 out there if you got a barn you can keep your barn your gardening and garden but 838 01:17:35,540 --> 01:17:40,960 if the barn burns down you can't replace it you can't add to the barn you can 839 01:17:40,960 --> 01:17:45,320 only do what's there and anything that changes has to change less it can't 840 01:17:45,320 --> 01:17:53,320 change for more and so literally cross anywhere other than 428 the the green 841 01:17:53,320 --> 01:17:59,080 belt would take an act of Congress so they can say 428 so we got across at 428 842 01:17:59,080 --> 01:18:06,100 so you got ten alignments 428 six alignments Milam because we had to hit 843 01:18:06,100 --> 01:18:12,480 Milam two reasons one it's on your thoroughfare plan is Milam to that 35 844 01:18:12,480 --> 01:18:18,320 job that does going under the knife next year it cleared the outer loop at Milam 845 01:18:18,320 --> 01:18:25,200 Road so the box interchange for the outer loop will be in place in the next 846 01:18:25,200 --> 01:18:33,640 couple of years so those three points are fixed plus or minus so plus or minus 847 01:18:33,640 --> 01:18:41,400 means 428 has a hundred and twenty foot easement well we need 550 so are they 848 01:18:41,400 --> 01:18:50,160 gonna let us widen and they're saying if you can't get through with 120 feet 25 849 01:18:50,160 --> 01:18:53,400 whatever it is you're gonna make it significantly harder on yourself and so 850 01:18:53,400 --> 01:19:00,000 we're looking at taking 500 foot of road freeway in frontage rows and double 851 01:19:00,000 --> 01:19:07,200 stacking it to get across 428 and then fair it and back out so if that works 852 01:19:07,200 --> 01:19:14,220 then we're good Milam we're tweaking a little bit but as we get through the 853 01:19:14,220 --> 01:19:18,720 process next year about this time you'll have fewer people yelling at you because 854 01:19:18,720 --> 01:19:25,340 you'll that green blob will move further north out of who get closer to 855 01:19:25,340 --> 01:19:34,280 428 and Milam so that's a long answer but that's where we're at 856 01:19:34,280 --> 01:19:43,040 made sense to me I know that there's been a lot of activity in the Carter and 857 01:19:43,040 --> 01:19:49,120 Hannah properties and determine whether what kind of development was going to go 858 01:19:49,120 --> 01:19:57,080 through and that's right there south of the the core bridge on 428 with it and 859 01:19:57,080 --> 01:20:04,160 with the more recent activity being sort of a if prop 14 passes could we possibly 860 01:20:04,160 --> 01:20:11,440 get some parkland there instead of build out there and and so in in that 861 01:20:11,440 --> 01:20:15,840 hypothetical I know that several hypotheticals down down the path but in 862 01:20:15,840 --> 01:20:23,920 the case of that hypothetical would it be easier if that was state land or 863 01:20:23,920 --> 01:20:30,480 harder if that was state land to get a final alignment if it's a park we're 864 01:20:30,480 --> 01:20:36,520 screwed don't build any parts yet yet now one of the things we're doing to 865 01:20:36,520 --> 01:20:42,720 make it harder on our own self is that Council of Governments Corps of 866 01:20:42,720 --> 01:20:53,680 Engineers they have a overarching plan called transportation stormwater 867 01:20:53,680 --> 01:21:02,800 improvement program and basically if you look at half of Wise County half of 868 01:21:02,800 --> 01:21:07,700 Denton County it funnels right down the Trinity River into Dallas right there's 869 01:21:07,700 --> 01:21:14,480 this Delta that goes right to Dallas well Dallas didn't plan for any runoff 870 01:21:14,480 --> 01:21:20,440 up north and they didn't build for it and so initially you know Coggan of course 871 01:21:20,440 --> 01:21:23,280 said hey what we'll do is we'll just take all that Denton County and Wise County 872 01:21:23,280 --> 01:21:29,840 and turn it into a floodplain right which isn't going to work clearly so we 873 01:21:29,840 --> 01:21:33,960 said now we we want to look at a better idea so one of the things we're doing 874 01:21:33,960 --> 01:21:40,280 is and we are a pilot project the outer loop is a pilot project for this TSI 875 01:21:40,280 --> 01:21:45,640 program where we're we're going to be building a 23 mile long dam right it's 876 01:21:45,640 --> 01:21:53,600 called a road so we want to be able to not only acquire right away to the feds 877 01:21:53,600 --> 01:21:58,360 because the Corps part of the federal government too but we want to go up and 878 01:21:58,360 --> 01:22:05,520 down all of the floodways and create more detention along those natural 879 01:22:05,520 --> 01:22:12,240 corridors and then what we also want to do is have retention and I know I'm not 880 01:22:12,240 --> 01:22:15,160 sure which one's the right one because I'm not an engineer but what we want to 881 01:22:15,160 --> 01:22:21,840 do is take the water instead of running it down slower down the Trinity right 882 01:22:21,840 --> 01:22:26,840 which is what you would do when you have big ponds that hold it for a while is 883 01:22:26,840 --> 01:22:32,560 send it down and recharge the aquifers right they just as long as it goes away 884 01:22:32,560 --> 01:22:38,680 they don't care if it goes down they just don't want it going into Dallas so 885 01:22:38,680 --> 01:22:44,720 what we're trying to do is find a way to hold the water not until it can get 886 01:22:44,720 --> 01:22:50,920 through Dallas right hold the water until we can find a faster but efficient 887 01:22:50,920 --> 01:22:56,960 clean way to get it down into the aquifer and so we're studying that on 888 01:22:56,960 --> 01:23:05,280 top of just trying to build a road no I appreciate that there's a there's a lot 889 01:23:05,280 --> 01:23:10,440 of simultaneous yeah stakeholders and concerns going on in the region and so 890 01:23:10,440 --> 01:23:13,040 one of the things we knew I'll ride off the bat and I know I'm beating a dead 891 01:23:13,040 --> 01:23:20,840 horse but this is horse country we don't want the road to be just another highway 892 01:23:20,840 --> 01:23:25,360 right if we can we want it to be aesthetically compatible with the area 893 01:23:25,360 --> 01:23:32,780 you know it's going to all build out we got a heat map that we keep internal but 894 01:23:32,780 --> 01:23:38,800 we lay out all the developments in that green area and when people tell me they 895 01:23:38,800 --> 01:23:42,800 moved out to this area because they want to be in the country I already tell them 896 01:23:42,800 --> 01:23:47,720 you're no longer in the country you just don't see it yet because in that area 897 01:23:47,720 --> 01:23:56,600 between 377 where the outer loop will be the toll road and 380 this little area 898 01:23:56,600 --> 01:24:02,280 right here okay 90,000 people are moving into that little square in the next 10 899 01:24:02,280 --> 01:24:11,360 years 90 that's the city Addison right there and that's all across the top part 900 01:24:11,360 --> 01:24:17,520 of the county so we're gonna try to make it aesthetically pleasing but mostly we 901 01:24:17,520 --> 01:24:22,560 want to make sure that we don't get penalized because we're last to develop 902 01:24:22,560 --> 01:24:30,200 right and the regions trying to turn us into a detention pond and basically 903 01:24:30,200 --> 01:24:36,400 everything I just said didn't know bullets and here's where I stopped 904 01:24:36,400 --> 01:24:50,680 talking I can get it to turn green it's like at the magic touch I don't have so 905 01:24:50,680 --> 01:24:56,400 yes Alma locust we are currently working with text on the resolution to bring 906 01:24:56,400 --> 01:25:01,240 forward to council it's currently slated to come to council on November 14th that 907 01:25:01,240 --> 01:25:08,240 resolution specifically is to prepare information for council so that you 908 01:25:08,240 --> 01:25:15,520 understand our intent is to ultimately have Elman Locust from 380 to Eagle 909 01:25:15,520 --> 01:25:21,120 become a city roadway and have the turn back to the city of Denton there's 910 01:25:21,120 --> 01:25:27,000 several steps that have to go through the first step that the city has 911 01:25:27,000 --> 01:25:33,120 specifically is bringing that resolution to council and so Ben and myself have 912 01:25:33,120 --> 01:25:38,000 been working on that for quite some time along with Travis Campbell and Amanda 913 01:25:38,000 --> 01:25:42,840 Miller to get that through the process text on is moving forward with their 914 01:25:42,840 --> 01:25:48,360 project to reconstruct Alma and Locust from south of the courthouse including 915 01:25:48,360 --> 01:25:53,800 Eagle along Elm and Locust and so that projects moving through its process and 916 01:25:53,800 --> 01:25:57,800 then of course the portion on the north is what we partnered with the county for 917 01:25:57,800 --> 01:26:02,200 funding and we're working through getting that project kicked back off 918 01:26:02,200 --> 01:26:06,400 working through right-of-way acquisition additional design that's needed so that 919 01:26:06,400 --> 01:26:11,280 we can go in replace the utility infrastructure at additional drainage 920 01:26:11,280 --> 01:26:17,800 infrastructure and then reconstruct the roadway so once the resolution goes 921 01:26:17,800 --> 01:26:22,600 through council we'll submit that to text dot and then text dot will submit 922 01:26:22,600 --> 01:26:26,800 that information to the Texas Transportation Commission and they will 923 01:26:26,800 --> 01:26:31,840 go through the process of reviewing it and then a minute order will be approved 924 01:26:31,840 --> 01:26:36,640 similar to how we do resolutions that will then state that that is going to 925 01:26:36,640 --> 01:26:43,400 become a city of Denton roadway and that's all subject to the reconstruction 926 01:26:43,400 --> 01:26:47,760 of the roadway that is south of the courthouse and so text that's moving 927 01:26:47,760 --> 01:26:53,680 along and at this point we don't have any concerns or some additional data 928 01:26:53,680 --> 01:26:58,480 which is an exhibit that has to be included with the resolution and so that 929 01:26:58,480 --> 01:27:02,280 information we should have here in the next week or so so that we can make that 930 01:27:02,280 --> 01:27:13,680 November 14th deadline I do and I am not sure where it inserts but I know one of 931 01:27:13,680 --> 01:27:22,400 the items again on our internal bond proposals for floodplain and that's this 932 01:27:22,400 --> 01:27:31,520 region I don't expect the timelines to change but how does that impact our you 933 01:27:31,520 --> 01:27:40,400 know our receipt of these roads versus that funding and maybe this this 934 01:27:40,400 --> 01:27:45,880 committee isn't the time for that question but I do have questions on how 935 01:27:45,880 --> 01:27:50,360 those are integrated if they both come to pass and this one's coming to pass so 936 01:27:50,360 --> 01:27:55,400 I mean that's a fate of complete so then the integration of those drainage 937 01:27:55,400 --> 01:28:00,600 projects with our adoption of these roads I'd be interested in learning how 938 01:28:00,600 --> 01:28:08,800 those are integrated should the voters pass the pep for drainage issues okay 939 01:28:08,800 --> 01:28:13,120 sure no problem because we tore up that area we the 940 01:28:13,120 --> 01:28:19,400 collective we everyone and it impacted the the economic development in that 941 01:28:19,400 --> 01:28:24,400 South downtown region and and so I'm trying to be mindful of that activity 942 01:28:24,400 --> 01:28:29,600 going forward so again I'm not sure if it sure now or not you can answer if you 943 01:28:29,600 --> 01:28:34,200 think it is but I think it would be best for us to bring that back maybe as a 944 01:28:34,200 --> 01:28:37,560 future item or have a separate conversation about that we can explain 945 01:28:37,560 --> 01:28:42,400 to you the implications of the pack for phases three and four and there's also 946 01:28:42,400 --> 01:28:45,880 additional drainage projects in that area that are all a part of the bond 947 01:28:45,880 --> 01:28:51,880 package but essentially some of those projects would be coinciding with each 948 01:28:51,880 --> 01:28:55,600 other others of them are really separate because they're separate drainage basins 949 01:28:55,600 --> 01:29:16,880 specifically absolutely you're great thank you John thank you okay well 950 01:29:16,880 --> 01:29:22,520 we've gone through all of our items and we're here down at number three 951 01:29:22,520 --> 01:29:28,000 concluding items we have any concluding items just the one that Becky and I just 952 01:29:28,000 --> 01:29:32,680 discussed anything it's more of a concluding item okay well with all that 953 01:29:32,680 --> 01:29:40,640 being said we will close out the meeting at 9 31 a.m. thanks everyone for watching 954 01:29:40,640 --> 01:29:44,960 and thank you all for being here and being very supportive of us especially 955 01:29:44,960 --> 01:29:47,040 you