1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:08,260 And we will call this meeting of the special citizens bond advisory committee to order 2 00:00:08,260 --> 00:00:15,360 The first item is agenda item a consider approval of minutes, which you should have seen in your backup. They were electronic 3 00:00:15,360 --> 00:00:17,880 That you could have clicked on to read through 4 00:00:17,880 --> 00:00:24,760 consider approval of the minutes for both June 7th last week's meeting 2023 and June 10th, which was the 5 00:00:24,760 --> 00:00:27,560 tour 6 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:29,560 meeting any motions 7 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:33,380 So I'm out second 8 00:00:33,380 --> 00:00:38,280 I think we need to get in the living McAdams had the second 9 00:00:38,280 --> 00:00:43,680 Any discussion on favor raise your right hand 10 00:00:43,680 --> 00:00:46,840 All opposed same sign that 11 00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:48,720 passes 12 00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:58,120 Moving on to item one B receive a report and hold discussion regarding the following one and inclusion of inclusive playground to aquatics facility 13 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:06,480 Three proposed improvements of to Riddell Street and Mingo Road for proposed implementation of railroad quiet zones 14 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:13,400 Five Oakland Street and upstream detention stormwater drainage infrastructure six pecan Creek 15 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:18,720 tributary drainage improvement project phase three and four and seven public art and just 16 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:24,800 As a note as we jump into these one after another similar processes last time where we'll hear the staff presentation 17 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:26,880 We'll have an open QA 18 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:29,880 facilitated by myself 19 00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:36,160 Then we'll go to some small group conversations as needed and then jumping back into a whole group 20 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:42,120 Conversation that we can have discussion Q&A as needed after that for each project and we'll move on to the next one 21 00:01:42,120 --> 00:01:45,400 So starting with an inclusive program playground 22 00:01:45,400 --> 00:01:48,640 We have a presentation 23 00:01:57,880 --> 00:01:59,880 I 24 00:01:59,880 --> 00:02:14,480 Good evening everyone, my name is Finn say Espinosa 25 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:18,960 I'm the assistant director for the park and rec department in charge of planning and operations 26 00:02:18,960 --> 00:02:23,440 And I'm here to provide you tonight's presentation for the inclusive playground with me 27 00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:28,800 I have Chris Escoto park planner and Mia Macy. She's our adaptive recreation 28 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:32,000 Person that is working with us 29 00:02:32,000 --> 00:02:34,600 To go through this process 30 00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:40,400 So I know I've taken all the classes, you know, he was not supposed to read the inclusive 31 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:46,320 I mean a PowerPoints of verbatim, but since this is a subject we're on for people 32 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:51,280 In the in the recordings can be watching this that are might be vision impaired. I'm just gonna 33 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:53,880 Touch through almost all of these points 34 00:02:53,880 --> 00:03:01,120 So 25% of people living with disability or living live with a disability and less than 3% of 35 00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:03,840 Disabilities are related to orthopedic 36 00:03:03,840 --> 00:03:05,800 impairments 37 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:07,400 90% of people 38 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:10,880 Say communities should offer an all-inclusive playground 39 00:03:10,880 --> 00:03:14,640 for all physical and cognitive abilities a 40 00:03:14,640 --> 00:03:20,240 little over half of the families who have a child with a disability are 41 00:03:20,640 --> 00:03:24,320 unable to play in a park as often as they would like and 42 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:28,100 92 percent of disabilities are not visible 43 00:03:28,100 --> 00:03:35,280 So these excerpts are straight out of our park master plan that was adopted last year 44 00:03:35,280 --> 00:03:38,160 So the first one is the graph on the left 45 00:03:38,160 --> 00:03:45,800 What are the biggest challenges didn't faces now and in the future for parks and recreation as you can see the largest one is sustained 46 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:47,800 growth and second is 47 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:50,280 accessibility and adaptive play 48 00:03:51,640 --> 00:03:57,320 Close thirds or funding and connectivity which ties into last week's presentation 49 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:01,180 And on the right in the word cloud 50 00:04:01,180 --> 00:04:06,240 What is the one word that you would use to describe how you envision the park system in the future? 51 00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:14,520 So the largest response there as you can see is the word accessible and the second largest responses 52 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:17,040 are larger and inclusive 53 00:04:17,400 --> 00:04:24,560 So looking toward 2040 the committee wants a park system to be larger accessible more inclusive and better connected 54 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:28,000 We're all on the same page, which is great oops 55 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:35,080 Okay the purpose 56 00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:42,800 Although the city has accessibility at all playgrounds the proposed playground will be the first of its kind in Denton 57 00:04:43,320 --> 00:04:50,440 So what are we talking about here using using universal design to provide a sensory rich environment that enables children 58 00:04:50,440 --> 00:04:56,840 To develop physically socially and emotionally in the same area in the same space 59 00:04:56,840 --> 00:05:01,640 We're also going to provide equal access and play for all abilities 60 00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:07,560 Support physical and cognitive cognitive development social integration 61 00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:11,480 family engagement community awareness and acceptance 62 00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:14,600 We're going to take a little pause and show a little video 63 00:05:14,600 --> 00:05:25,820 Inclusive playground 64 00:05:25,820 --> 00:05:30,560 56 percent of families who have a child with a physical learning sensory 65 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:37,460 Medical or complex disability or need report that they are unable to play in a park as often as they'd like 66 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:45,680 Imagine a place where everyone regardless of their abilities can come together for a true universal play experience 67 00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:51,800 The all-inclusive playground will be designed so play knows no boundaries a 68 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:54,440 space that encourages 69 00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:57,860 challenges and inspires emotional and social connections 70 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:10,880 You 71 00:06:10,880 --> 00:06:26,000 Thank you Ryan and team for providing that 72 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:33,280 So the the area we're talking about the park we're talking about 73 00:06:33,280 --> 00:06:36,760 Putting this is at North Lakes and the current conditions 74 00:06:37,200 --> 00:06:41,760 the playground there was installed in 2002 15,000 square feet and 75 00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:43,880 our 76 00:06:43,880 --> 00:06:50,280 Standard to replace the playgrounds in the city of Denton is between 15 and 20 years and as you can see we're there 77 00:06:50,280 --> 00:06:57,700 So the site info what I did was I highlighted in the green what the 78 00:06:57,700 --> 00:07:04,200 Areas that are available now for play and the possibilities of expansion in the blue 79 00:07:07,200 --> 00:07:09,200 And 80 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:12,080 The blue area to the north those trees have died 81 00:07:12,080 --> 00:07:18,500 So if we expand there the trees to the south would shade it and the area to the south you could see 82 00:07:18,500 --> 00:07:22,720 That I drew around the tree, but the tree provides shade on 83 00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:26,000 Maybe half of it 84 00:07:26,000 --> 00:07:31,280 And the parking lot was evaluated in the ADA assessment that was performed 85 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:37,120 But and it's not included in this scope, but it will be included in the city's five-year capital budget 86 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:39,800 And it will be aligned along with this project 87 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:49,960 So we're proposing three point four five million dollars for this playground for around a twenty to thirty thousand square foot play area 88 00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:58,400 Using universal design to hit the sensory stimulation and equipment cognitive and physical components to be included 89 00:07:58,400 --> 00:08:05,280 So what we've done we've been touring playgrounds around North, Texas that have other cities that have done this and 90 00:08:05,640 --> 00:08:11,320 Most recently last Friday. We took our managers supervisors playground inspectors is planner city stuff 91 00:08:11,320 --> 00:08:13,880 over to visit some of these 92 00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:19,160 So and I put I ranked them in order from from lowest dollar amount to the highest dollar amount 93 00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:23,480 But as you can see they're all over the place depending on what amenities are 94 00:08:23,480 --> 00:08:25,520 included 95 00:08:25,520 --> 00:08:31,320 Like the first one right here two million dollars fifteen thousand square feet with a seven thousand square foot splash pad in 96 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:34,080 2019 dollars 97 00:08:34,200 --> 00:08:38,000 The next one in Fort Worth was a dream park. We've visited this one a couple times 98 00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:43,440 for a million for fifty thousand fifty seven thousand square feet in 2018 dollars and 99 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:48,240 a lot of that fifty thousand square feet is just turf like 100 00:08:48,240 --> 00:08:51,960 Sawed 101 00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:55,980 Casey's playground, this is a very well done playground included 102 00:08:55,980 --> 00:09:03,120 two plus million dollars in twenty thirteen dollars for a twenty thousand square foot playground and a 103 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:05,280 thirteen hundred square foot pavilion 104 00:09:05,280 --> 00:09:10,560 Which didn't include the restroom that you can see on the picture on the right in the middle behind those two structures 105 00:09:10,560 --> 00:09:17,200 Farmers branch playground that's not built yet, but it will be 106 00:09:17,200 --> 00:09:20,080 this year or early next 107 00:09:20,080 --> 00:09:28,400 Five and a half million dollars for eighteen thousand square foot playground and that one is gonna have glowing amenities as you can see 108 00:09:28,400 --> 00:09:30,600 Which is pretty awesome 109 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:35,640 The one in Iowa five point six million dollars in twenty twenty two dollars 110 00:09:35,640 --> 00:09:39,960 15,000 square feet a miracle field which we're also working on 111 00:09:39,960 --> 00:09:42,960 and a fishing pier 112 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:47,320 So Grand Prairie by far is the best one we've seen to date 113 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:50,560 Phase one only and it's huge 114 00:09:50,560 --> 00:09:55,080 So six and six point six million dollars for phase one 115 00:09:55,080 --> 00:10:01,440 They have an eight acre lot, but the playground itself is thirty to forty thousand square feet because they built a 116 00:10:01,440 --> 00:10:08,880 amenities of phase two areas within phase one, but not quite all the way and the one in Mesa, Arizona 117 00:10:08,880 --> 00:10:17,940 Is seven point nine million in twenty twenty seventeen dollars for a nine thousand square foot playground and an eighteen thousand square foot splash pad 118 00:10:21,520 --> 00:10:28,320 So again, this would be our first one in Denton that's all inclusive using Universal Design and 119 00:10:28,320 --> 00:10:36,680 Our director mr. Packen couldn't make it this week, but I mean ready the redbird he says let's build this 120 00:10:36,680 --> 00:10:41,680 Any questions 121 00:10:51,520 --> 00:10:53,520 Presentation 122 00:10:53,520 --> 00:10:56,240 Come back here 123 00:10:56,240 --> 00:11:02,700 Yeah, we don't have any questions, but can I go to the playground in the in Grand Prairie? 124 00:11:02,700 --> 00:11:06,120 Yes, sir 125 00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:09,040 Where is the one in Fort Worth? 126 00:11:09,040 --> 00:11:13,280 One second 127 00:11:13,280 --> 00:11:16,920 Bring the playground expert. This is Chris's project by the way 128 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:20,880 How's it going guys? So that's located over there by the Fort Worth Zoo 129 00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:27,060 Close to the rose garden just right across if you're familiar with the train that runs around downtown 130 00:11:27,060 --> 00:11:29,580 That's that's that park location 131 00:11:29,580 --> 00:11:39,880 By the community not by the city 132 00:11:39,880 --> 00:11:44,920 So there are some sponsors. So when you walk up to that to that playground, you do see a big 133 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:49,080 Sponsor plaque that there's different tiers. So we do still 134 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:53,720 Anticipate doing that here. So we are going to have sponsorship packages that have that opportunity 135 00:11:53,720 --> 00:12:00,260 But I'm not familiar with the financing on the back end, but it did have funding from outside 136 00:12:00,260 --> 00:12:05,380 Correct and it's currently known as that 137 00:12:05,380 --> 00:12:11,440 Got a question over here 138 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:16,500 Having been having been to the Grand Prairie one 139 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:21,440 Some of the things that are included in that one is 140 00:12:21,440 --> 00:12:29,160 They've got additional acre or part of the acreage where they're putting in and have in 141 00:12:29,160 --> 00:12:32,440 The not a torium type the indoor 142 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:40,540 You know slides they're also looking toward putting in a hotel as part of it 143 00:12:40,540 --> 00:12:46,840 It was funded a lot of it by donations and matching 144 00:12:47,320 --> 00:12:55,000 donations from say company a if you'll give me X then I will match you dollar for dollar 145 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:58,160 so if 146 00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:00,560 You're going to want to do one of these 147 00:13:00,560 --> 00:13:10,500 What is the one saying about either go long or go big and yeah, okay. Thank you 148 00:13:13,360 --> 00:13:20,800 Look into really doing it because if you want your sustainability you want your growth 149 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:32,000 Put it someplace where it does have it and based on what I've seen at the North Lakes Park I 150 00:13:32,000 --> 00:13:39,720 Don't think you'd really get your bang for your bucks and people wouldn't really be coming 151 00:13:39,720 --> 00:13:42,760 so 152 00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:44,760 you know just 153 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:52,560 Kind of of that, but do you agree on the dollar match ideas do you agree on? 154 00:13:52,560 --> 00:13:59,220 Having sufficient acreage out there. Maybe it's just because I don't know where the 155 00:13:59,220 --> 00:14:01,320 boundaries are 156 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:03,320 Yeah, so within our master plan 157 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:09,600 North Lakes Park Southwest Park which is we recently completed master plan does identify another location as 158 00:14:09,880 --> 00:14:16,720 As this future master plan to feature something of this scale as far as whether that will fit appropriately within North Lakes 159 00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:24,120 That was something that we assessed beforehand checking that the area and confirming the square footage where we do seem that it's 160 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:30,660 Appropriate for this size in this scale of course there are I guess concerns when it comes to 161 00:14:30,660 --> 00:14:36,840 Mobility in the sense of the existing parking lot right, but those are opportunities that that we are looking to address 162 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:39,760 separately aside from that 163 00:14:39,760 --> 00:14:42,480 But as far as what you see here to answer your initial 164 00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:47,600 Comment with the master plan vision of Grand Prairie, so as you see just from this render here 165 00:14:47,600 --> 00:14:50,460 This is a very big phased approach, so there's 166 00:14:50,460 --> 00:14:53,360 multi-phase probably eight phases 167 00:14:53,360 --> 00:14:59,320 Within this development that first phase is just a small part. I'm not really familiar with the funding on the back end 168 00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:06,400 But they also do have dedicated funding sources through hop funds that do provide funding for that 169 00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:10,640 Which in this scenario, we don't necessarily have that established for this part 170 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:21,520 Okay, interestingly enough. I'm looking at all of these wonderful structures, and they've got minimum our minimal 171 00:15:21,520 --> 00:15:27,520 Shade, but the one in Grand Prairie looks like it's got pretty much adequate shade 172 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:31,820 We're talking about pretty much shading the whole playground 173 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:36,720 That is something that we're looking at and we're gonna through the master plan stages 174 00:15:36,720 --> 00:15:42,420 We are going to initiate this public engagement platform where the public will be able to initiate that 175 00:15:42,420 --> 00:15:47,880 Within our parks master plan shade is one of the top amenities that are being requested so that is something that we're considering 176 00:15:47,880 --> 00:15:56,280 When you visited the Grand Prairie what stood out to you the most when you were there and did staff describe 177 00:15:56,280 --> 00:16:01,460 Any changes in like the usage or the demographics they were seeing at this new park space? 178 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:04,040 So this is a recently 179 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:10,000 Established part it actually came got built during coded. So it's still using its its its 180 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:14,560 Magnitude is still out there and they're building just a bunch of stuff all around there 181 00:16:14,560 --> 00:16:21,540 But just a scale of the project and when you walk in I mean you see different types of of amenities 182 00:16:21,540 --> 00:16:27,800 There's different experiences the sensory factors to it kind of what we're speaking to they have a dedicated chalk wall 183 00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:34,360 They have just all the different different aspects to it to have a dedicated swing set just specific for wheelchairs 184 00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:39,320 So just the magnitude of it and with the epic next door 185 00:16:39,320 --> 00:16:43,960 Just the name alone kind of speaks to the scale of projects that they're trying to build over there 186 00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:49,480 Not trying to say that that we're also going to get something to this scale, but we can 187 00:16:49,480 --> 00:16:53,820 Find those solutions of what we like there and what the fence 188 00:16:53,820 --> 00:16:58,440 I said we went there last week and what we did is what is it that we like? 189 00:16:58,440 --> 00:17:03,260 What is it that we don't like and how can we maximize that here in Denton? So that's that's what we're looking at 190 00:17:03,260 --> 00:17:09,840 And you give us more detail on what 191 00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:15,040 Equipment would be there and whether or not there would be a splash pad included 192 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:22,320 Yeah, so part of the sensory portion of this matter does include water 193 00:17:22,320 --> 00:17:24,520 I mean there's in me I could probably speak to this too 194 00:17:24,520 --> 00:17:31,880 But the cooling method of as you're playing we could probably have some misters where it cools down the kids as they're out there 195 00:17:31,880 --> 00:17:33,600 And it's just a different element 196 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:39,240 So as far as whether it's actual splash pad is going to be featured that hasn't been discussed 197 00:17:39,240 --> 00:17:42,160 But that could very well be something that happens through the engagement 198 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:48,760 But that is a different dollar amount. That's a little bit separate from from the playground here as you see here 199 00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:54,800 Seven point nine million for nine thousand square foot playground and eighteen thousand square foot splash pad for Mesa 200 00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:59,520 That's a big significant difference in cost just from that playground to that splash pad 201 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:02,180 So that is something to consider as well 202 00:18:02,180 --> 00:18:06,360 but normally yes, there is a water component like 203 00:18:06,360 --> 00:18:09,040 Grapevine had two dolphins 204 00:18:09,040 --> 00:18:10,800 spraying each other 205 00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:18,440 At the entrance and the one in Southlake had the huge Southlake dragon that you push a button and it shoots out 206 00:18:18,840 --> 00:18:23,040 Water into a sandy area so you can not only play with the water part 207 00:18:23,040 --> 00:18:28,280 but you can play with us with the sand and then it also had little alcoves that you can hide and 208 00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:30,880 and 209 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:32,280 the one in 210 00:18:32,280 --> 00:18:34,000 Grand Prairie 211 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:38,720 Was like sectioned off in sections, so you just can't run from one to the other 212 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:44,600 which that was a nice design and in the fencing and the benches and the fake trees and 213 00:18:45,360 --> 00:18:49,760 The interior I mean the exterior as you're walking in and through the grand entrance 214 00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:56,040 It had like butterflies and different shapes of all the sponsors so everything that I just mentioned 215 00:18:56,040 --> 00:19:02,900 Had a sponsor name on it or could have a sponsor name on it, so it wasn't just your regular wood slats that 216 00:19:02,900 --> 00:19:09,560 You can't really see through they don't provide the the septet principles that we'd like to design now 217 00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:15,320 Which is crime prevention through environmental design as PDs driving by we'd like for them to see all the way 218 00:19:15,360 --> 00:19:18,020 Through to the back of anything. We're building now 219 00:19:18,020 --> 00:19:21,480 Mindy had a question 220 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:27,400 Two quick questions the first one I know that you're and I think McKenna has 221 00:19:27,400 --> 00:19:36,400 Adapted inclusive equipment already how many parks do we have that include elements of inclusivity already and then second follow-up question? 222 00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:39,280 With Casey's Clubhouse. It was one of the first 223 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:46,520 Inclusive playgrounds in the Metroplex, and it was really a draw for people outside of the city to come and visit 224 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:52,040 Do you see this as being that type of facility especially right next to the ball fields? 225 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:54,880 And is that sort of how you're designing it as well? 226 00:19:54,880 --> 00:20:03,280 To answer your first question all our playgrounds by law have to have accessibility ATA accessibility and the inclusiveness 227 00:20:03,280 --> 00:20:06,800 Comes along with that, but there's three levels of inclusiveness 228 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:13,640 There's the accessibility and then inclusive playground and then universal design is the highest watch I should say 229 00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:16,480 ATA accessibility 230 00:20:16,480 --> 00:20:23,040 Inclusiveness and then universal design is the highest design form you can have which includes more options of 231 00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:25,760 not only 232 00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:30,240 People with physical disabilities, but more the mental disabilities and then 233 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:38,900 As far as your second question is is this going to be a draw for the region we hope so 234 00:20:38,900 --> 00:20:45,760 But more we're our focus is for the residents here in Denton since since we don't have anything like this to begin with is 235 00:20:45,760 --> 00:20:52,160 Have the schools visit have families visit and then 236 00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:57,920 Our own programs they have meals programs and and you know Mia 237 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:02,800 Can you speak a little bit about your programs that you have now just real quick? I know we have ten minutes 238 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:06,840 Yeah, so currently we have programs for 239 00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:11,240 Youth through adult so we serve five to eighty five years old 240 00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:14,760 We currently have about 300 people that attend our programs throughout the year 241 00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:18,040 We offer everything from sports to art to technology classes 242 00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:25,120 Educational classes socials everything and where a lot of our programs are based out of is there at North Lakes rec center 243 00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:28,600 So this park is one that we utilize often 244 00:21:28,600 --> 00:21:34,840 So it would be great, you know to have it locally and of course the plan is to expand those programs throughout the city 245 00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:36,640 So then that way they're not 246 00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:40,760 Just at North Lakes, but of course it does help out that that's kind of our hub right now 247 00:21:40,760 --> 00:21:43,360 Let's do two more questions 248 00:21:43,360 --> 00:21:46,620 We have one here and if we have another one and just another note that we have 249 00:21:46,620 --> 00:21:52,880 Parking lot questions too if you want to ask additional questions to be answered as a follow-up and we're gonna have another 250 00:21:53,120 --> 00:21:55,120 conversation time after small group I 251 00:21:55,120 --> 00:22:02,440 Wanted to kind of address miss Julianne's comment. I live right by North Lakes 252 00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:03,980 I don't know if you all know me or not 253 00:22:03,980 --> 00:22:11,360 But I'm your wildlife rehabilitator very familiar with all the trails at North Lake very involved in that whole community up there 254 00:22:11,360 --> 00:22:17,480 I'm here to tell you you build this they will come and I think this is going to be one of the shining stars 255 00:22:17,520 --> 00:22:23,880 That this bond committee does is bring not just inclusivity and accessibility to our parks 256 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:30,440 But I'm going for universal. I advocated for it on the 2019 bond committee that we do that for McKenna 257 00:22:30,440 --> 00:22:31,440 We didn't get there 258 00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:38,480 But we almost did if we're going to have a population of a hundred eighty five thousand people in the city of Denton by the end 259 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:41,000 Of this year when you think of all the new schools 260 00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:45,760 We're building when you think of all of the wonderful new people that are coming to our fabulous city 261 00:22:46,120 --> 00:22:48,120 What do we want to show them? 262 00:22:48,120 --> 00:22:55,960 That they are welcome that their kids will be safe and that we have the most outstanding program in the entire Metroplex 263 00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:58,080 Let's do this 264 00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:00,400 Okay, one more question 265 00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:03,560 So I think that it will wind up being a regional draw 266 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:06,760 I know people outside of then who if this came, you know 267 00:23:06,760 --> 00:23:13,400 They're currently going to an inclusive playgrounds much farther away who'd wind up coming here instead. Are there any plans to? 268 00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:18,520 Like the the area where the North Lakes playground is right now is 269 00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:21,400 fairly 270 00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:26,880 Isolated there's not businesses nearby. There's like no place to go and maybe get a meal afterwards 271 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:30,480 That's directly nearby. Are there any plans to do anything with that? I 272 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:37,440 Have to get back with you on that know you from there you can go down and hit University and the torches tacos and all 273 00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:43,880 But as far as our project with this bond that's not even 274 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:46,680 question, but oh I 275 00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:51,520 Could say that with the increase in trails and just connectivity within the park system 276 00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:57,200 That's something that could easily be attainable just within mobility with with razor ranch just being nearby 277 00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:04,000 So those are opportunities that we're also looking to expand outside of this project just increasing the trails system 278 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:07,040 Again kind of back to the kind of last week's conversation 279 00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:12,920 But just to answer that that question that that could very well be something that could happen just with 280 00:24:13,120 --> 00:24:18,120 Increase in trails and such. All right, let's jump into our small groups for a little bit of reflection and 281 00:24:18,120 --> 00:24:24,600 Additional conversation and then we'll come back and wrap it up with a large group conversation for move on to our next one 282 00:24:43,120 --> 00:24:45,120 , right? 283 00:25:13,120 --> 00:25:15,120 , right? 284 00:25:43,120 --> 00:25:45,120 , right? 285 00:26:13,120 --> 00:26:15,120 , right? 286 00:26:43,120 --> 00:26:45,120 , right? 287 00:27:14,120 --> 00:27:16,120 I 288 00:27:44,120 --> 00:27:45,120 , right? 289 00:28:13,120 --> 00:28:15,120 [inaudible] 290 00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:45,120 We're still part of the project 291 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:47,120 [inaudible] 292 00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:49,120 [inaudible] 293 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:51,120 [inaudible] 294 00:28:51,120 --> 00:28:53,120 [inaudible] 295 00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:55,120 [inaudible] 296 00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:57,120 [inaudible] 297 00:28:57,120 --> 00:28:59,120 [inaudible] 298 00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:01,120 [inaudible] 299 00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:03,120 [inaudible] 300 00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:05,120 [inaudible] 301 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:07,120 [inaudible] 302 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,120 Yeah, where does this put you relative? 303 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:11,120 [inaudible] 304 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:14,120 (people chattering) 305 00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:44,120 (people chattering) 306 00:30:11,120 --> 00:30:14,120 (people chattering) 307 00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:26,640 - Let's take another couple minutes 308 00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:28,640 and then we'll return to the big group. 309 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:31,640 (people chattering) 310 00:30:42,120 --> 00:30:45,120 (people chattering) 311 00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:14,120 (people chattering) 312 00:31:40,780 --> 00:31:43,480 Go ahead and wrap up your final comments. 313 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:46,480 (people chattering) 314 00:31:46,480 --> 00:32:02,440 All right, so let's, 315 00:32:02,440 --> 00:32:07,280 a lot of animated discussion on this one, which is awesome. 316 00:32:07,280 --> 00:32:10,320 Anyone care to share anything else? 317 00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:11,640 Maybe it came out of your small group 318 00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:14,280 or anything else that you hasn't got touched on. 319 00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:17,160 I am curious 'cause it felt like 320 00:32:17,160 --> 00:32:20,200 as part of the back and forth during the Q&A, 321 00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:22,520 there seemed to be some inclination to say, 322 00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:25,800 let's push further towards a bigger project, 323 00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:27,200 it sounded like, in some cases, 324 00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:30,160 and then others had more reservations. 325 00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:32,240 So I'm curious, as we think through that, 326 00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:34,800 that's probably gotta be a consideration of this group. 327 00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:38,760 - Are there any renderings 328 00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:41,120 as to what this 3.45 will be? 329 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:43,620 Like, how did we get there? 330 00:32:43,620 --> 00:32:44,620 - Not at the moment. 331 00:32:44,620 --> 00:32:50,440 We are working to gain 30% of renderings 332 00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:52,040 up to the bond vote. 333 00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:55,160 And if the bond passes, if this project passes, 334 00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:57,040 then we'll move to 100%. 335 00:32:57,040 --> 00:32:59,080 - Isn't it easier to sell? 336 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:01,280 You can tell the public what-- 337 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:04,320 - We're working on it, but at this moment, there is none. 338 00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:07,160 We're using other comps around the city, 339 00:33:07,160 --> 00:33:09,020 the North Texas area. 340 00:33:09,020 --> 00:33:11,880 - So I think she's giving a little marketing tip. 341 00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:13,040 (laughing) 342 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:13,880 - Noted. 343 00:33:13,880 --> 00:33:16,600 - Let's make it look nice. 344 00:33:16,600 --> 00:33:20,300 - So how did you arrive at the 3.45 number? 345 00:33:20,300 --> 00:33:25,720 - It was based on our current contracts. 346 00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:28,560 - Which included? 347 00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:32,680 - I just wanted to clarify. 348 00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:36,520 We haven't spent any funding on the design portions 349 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:37,660 of these projects yet 350 00:33:37,660 --> 00:33:40,420 because they haven't gone through this committee. 351 00:33:40,420 --> 00:33:41,880 We don't know where the committee 352 00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:44,160 is gonna land on the projects. 353 00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:45,500 So I just wanna clarify, 354 00:33:45,500 --> 00:33:47,800 that's one of the reasons you're not seeing designs, 355 00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:49,800 you're not seeing a lot of renderings, 356 00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:53,400 because we have not gone through that design process. 357 00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:55,680 If these projects go through the committee 358 00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:58,000 and come out with the recommendation, 359 00:33:58,000 --> 00:33:59,720 then we will start the design process 360 00:33:59,720 --> 00:34:01,520 as we move into the vote. 361 00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:07,400 - Okay, we'll come back. 362 00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:11,120 - What do you hope to have? 363 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:13,660 Do you have a list of all the different things 364 00:34:13,660 --> 00:34:15,720 that you would hope to include in the park 365 00:34:15,720 --> 00:34:17,680 that we could maybe see or look at 366 00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:19,320 so that we could get a better idea 367 00:34:19,320 --> 00:34:22,160 of just sort of the types of equipment 368 00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:24,840 and the different features that you guys would like? 369 00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:26,720 - Sure, we can provide a list. 370 00:34:26,720 --> 00:34:29,820 There's many, and they're expensive. 371 00:34:29,820 --> 00:34:35,040 - Let's go there and then get a question back here. 372 00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:36,720 - Yes. 373 00:34:36,720 --> 00:34:37,540 - Speaking of the list, 374 00:34:37,540 --> 00:34:40,520 what does your parking plan look like for parking? 375 00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:42,320 Because parking at that current park 376 00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:44,600 when there's tournaments on Saturdays, 377 00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:46,240 there's football and soccer games. 378 00:34:46,240 --> 00:34:48,520 I literally have driven around for over 30 minutes 379 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:49,960 looking for a parking spot. 380 00:34:49,960 --> 00:34:52,520 If we're gonna make it bigger, 381 00:34:52,520 --> 00:34:54,760 we're gonna need a bigger parking lot on both sides, 382 00:34:54,760 --> 00:34:57,760 one where the tournaments are and where the parks are. 383 00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:07,240 - So in here, CIP did evaluate the parking 384 00:35:07,240 --> 00:35:08,800 with ADA assessment. 385 00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:10,560 And with their funding, 386 00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:12,440 they're gonna address the parking at this area 387 00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:15,420 and the access to the site. 388 00:35:15,420 --> 00:35:17,840 We did talk to them about it and they're on board. 389 00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:19,080 So thank you all. 390 00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:22,520 - Couple of things. 391 00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:27,560 One, are we thinking about just little kids 392 00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:32,560 or are we thinking about adults or larger children? 393 00:35:33,240 --> 00:35:37,000 Who could participate and use these facilities? 394 00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:41,360 And my second comment is I'm a little concerned 395 00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:44,160 that we may be a little too short-sighted 396 00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:45,960 and that perhaps we should really be looking 397 00:35:45,960 --> 00:35:48,600 for another park similar 398 00:35:48,600 --> 00:35:50,800 at another location within the city. 399 00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:54,760 - Yes, we are looking at all those things, 400 00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:56,720 especially not only for the adults 401 00:35:56,720 --> 00:35:59,680 that can visit this kind of playground, 402 00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:01,080 but for the caregivers. 403 00:36:01,080 --> 00:36:04,560 Universal design includes spaces for the caregivers. 404 00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:08,400 For an example, an embankment slide or any other slide, 405 00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:10,880 they have to hold them as they go down the slide. 406 00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:12,720 So we need spaces for that. 407 00:36:12,720 --> 00:36:14,480 And then we didn't even mention that 408 00:36:14,480 --> 00:36:17,760 people that use in these parks, 409 00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:19,840 we have to retrofit the restroom 410 00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:22,440 to have an adult-size changing table 411 00:36:22,440 --> 00:36:25,320 or changing area for them as well. 412 00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:30,320 So all these items that include in universal design, 413 00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:32,840 we've been talking about them for a while 414 00:36:32,840 --> 00:36:34,360 since this came up. 415 00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:36,280 That's what we've been visiting and seeing what works, 416 00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:38,520 what doesn't work, talking to other directors, 417 00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:40,160 other city managers. 418 00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:45,360 And I've built a couple myself in my previous job, 419 00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:49,360 but I'm really looking forward to having this one built here 420 00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:50,640 for the citizens of Denton. 421 00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:52,560 - Let's do this. 422 00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:56,200 - And I'm sorry, in the Southwest Park Master Plan, 423 00:36:56,200 --> 00:37:01,200 also there's a space in that when that comes on 424 00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:03,440 so it's for the South side of town. 425 00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:05,400 - Just wanted to clarify on the parking piece. 426 00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:07,760 So the ADA assessment that we did did not, 427 00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:10,080 the scope is not expanding any of that parking. 428 00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:12,920 It's fixing the parking lot since it's old 429 00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:14,720 up to meet current standards. 430 00:37:14,720 --> 00:37:21,800 - Go ahead, Mandy. 431 00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:25,000 - Just looking at the project as you've laid it out, 432 00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:27,560 is there a way to have any sort of a ballpark estimate 433 00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:29,640 of what, knowing the age of the playground, 434 00:37:29,640 --> 00:37:32,000 if you were to just replace it as is 435 00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:33,280 with a standard playground, 436 00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:34,760 what would that cost look like 437 00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:37,480 versus what would the design proposal 438 00:37:37,480 --> 00:37:39,320 that you're putting forth look like? 439 00:37:39,320 --> 00:37:42,920 - I'd have to get that number 440 00:37:42,920 --> 00:37:47,240 'cause it would include probably more shade 441 00:37:47,240 --> 00:37:49,320 that every time we have public engagements 442 00:37:49,320 --> 00:37:52,000 at almost every special event or wherever we're at, 443 00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:54,480 soliciting an online and undiscussed then, 444 00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:56,840 shade's a big item. 445 00:37:56,840 --> 00:38:00,200 And then we'd have to repair some of the ADA stuff 446 00:38:00,200 --> 00:38:03,600 that's within that area if we don't touch the footprint, 447 00:38:03,600 --> 00:38:08,720 probably add some irrigation and some other amenities. 448 00:38:08,720 --> 00:38:11,520 So I'd have to get that number, an estimate. 449 00:38:11,520 --> 00:38:17,120 - So a comment first and then a question. 450 00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:21,560 I'm hearing a lot of interest about the sponsorships 451 00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:23,560 and the partnership with the community 452 00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:24,400 and all that kind of stuff, 453 00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:25,240 especially when you're talking 454 00:38:25,240 --> 00:38:27,080 about a pretty expensive facility. 455 00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:30,880 So it seems like definitely something to explore, 456 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:35,000 especially with our parks foundation, those folks. 457 00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:38,920 The question is, are we factoring in ongoing maintenance costs? 458 00:38:38,920 --> 00:38:41,000 So some of these, this is really specialized equipment. 459 00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:43,800 It's not normal off the shelf kind of stuff. 460 00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:46,240 And then also, one of my favorite parts about it 461 00:38:46,240 --> 00:38:49,760 is that kids of different ability levels can play together. 462 00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:51,800 But I know when my kids go places like this, 463 00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:55,120 they use the equipment in ways it's not supposed to be used 464 00:38:55,120 --> 00:38:57,520 'cause it's not familiar to them and 'cause they're kids. 465 00:38:57,520 --> 00:39:00,800 So I would expect higher maintenance costs 466 00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:01,800 for something like this. 467 00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:03,440 And are we, and you're talking about misters 468 00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:05,440 and all this different special stuff, 469 00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:07,920 are we building those costs in, are we planning for those? 470 00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:11,400 Do we know our ability to cover those maintenance costs? 471 00:39:11,400 --> 00:39:16,000 - Yeah, we have. 472 00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:20,560 But most of this stuff is built industrialized. 473 00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:23,560 So to give you one example of what I built previously, 474 00:39:23,560 --> 00:39:27,520 I built a 16,000 square foot all-inclusive playground 475 00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:29,040 in my previous city. 476 00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:32,280 And instead of using, well, five bars out, 477 00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:34,320 the surfacing the wood chips, 478 00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:37,240 but instead of using the rubber or any other type, 479 00:39:37,240 --> 00:39:40,200 we used a specialized synthetic turf 480 00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:43,200 that only one manufacturer makes in the nation right now. 481 00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:45,920 And it has copper woven properties into it 482 00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:47,840 that is grounded to the ground 483 00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:52,720 so you don't get static electricity that won't short out 484 00:39:52,720 --> 00:39:55,080 any devices that you would be wearing, 485 00:39:55,080 --> 00:39:57,880 cochlear implants or pacemakers or anything like that. 486 00:39:57,880 --> 00:40:01,280 But not only that, there's a huge benefit 487 00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:05,080 that that surfacing is a 15-year warranty surfacing. 488 00:40:05,080 --> 00:40:06,560 So if anything happens to it, 489 00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:08,600 if it gets burned or gets whatever, 490 00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:09,920 they come and replace it. 491 00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:11,600 So we're looking at items like that 492 00:40:11,600 --> 00:40:13,840 to incorporate into this project 493 00:40:13,840 --> 00:40:16,600 and stuff that I've used in the past as well. 494 00:40:18,320 --> 00:40:19,520 - Howdy. 495 00:40:19,520 --> 00:40:22,400 - How much is in the Parks Foundation fund these days? 496 00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:24,960 - That's a good question. 497 00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:29,120 Yeah, we'll have to get back to you on that one. 498 00:40:29,120 --> 00:40:33,760 - Let's do two more questions or comments. 499 00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:34,600 We got 'em. 500 00:40:34,600 --> 00:40:42,120 - I noticed that you visited cities in different states. 501 00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:46,560 Does the city of Denton have a list of benchmark cities 502 00:40:46,560 --> 00:40:49,120 that you usually visit? 503 00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:51,720 Or you just decide which park facility 504 00:40:51,720 --> 00:40:54,240 you'd like to emulate and then you go there? 505 00:40:54,240 --> 00:40:56,320 - Well, we visited the ones in Texas, 506 00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:57,920 in North Texas around us. 507 00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:00,720 We didn't, to clarify, we didn't go out of state. 508 00:41:00,720 --> 00:41:05,320 But the more, the newer cities, 509 00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:08,680 the more larger, newest projects that are out there 510 00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:12,280 that we hear from our colleagues when we go to conferences 511 00:41:12,280 --> 00:41:15,480 or just when we're meeting up or through the design firms, 512 00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:17,640 they say, "Hey, go visit here, go visit there." 513 00:41:17,640 --> 00:41:20,880 They got good ideas that you may wanna incorporate, 514 00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:22,520 so we do that. 515 00:41:22,520 --> 00:41:24,800 And we talk, amongst our cities, we talk a lot, 516 00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:26,760 'cause I'm 24 years in myself, 517 00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:30,520 and I know a bunch of other cities that we do the same. 518 00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:32,560 - So there isn't a list? 519 00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:33,960 - No, ma'am, not an official list. 520 00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:35,760 We just speak amongst ourselves 521 00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:39,040 and send a group email, so. 522 00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:43,000 - Yeah, just as a comment for the group, 523 00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:45,880 I drive a special needs school bus in my day job, 524 00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:49,560 and so I have a student who uses a wheelchair, 525 00:41:49,560 --> 00:41:52,480 and on the days, like once every couple of weeks, 526 00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:53,960 where he gets to go to something like this, 527 00:41:53,960 --> 00:41:55,880 'cause it's such a long trip for him right now, 528 00:41:55,880 --> 00:41:58,040 he comes back and he keeps talking about it 529 00:41:58,040 --> 00:41:58,880 for like two days. 530 00:41:58,880 --> 00:42:00,880 He's very excited, he wants his dad to tell me 531 00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:03,000 about what he did on the playground. 532 00:42:03,000 --> 00:42:05,120 It's just something that is very special, I think, 533 00:42:05,120 --> 00:42:06,320 for a lot of these kids. 534 00:42:06,320 --> 00:42:09,520 - Great, okay. 535 00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:14,120 Well, good questions, great conversation. 536 00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:15,560 Let's keep moving. 537 00:42:15,560 --> 00:42:17,440 The next topic is on aquatics. 538 00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:42,360 (water splashing) 539 00:42:42,360 --> 00:42:46,640 - Hello, good evening. 540 00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:49,240 Nikki Sassenes, assistant director of Parks and Recreation, 541 00:42:49,240 --> 00:42:50,080 the other one. 542 00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:51,880 I get to do all the fun things. 543 00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:54,120 Fence builds it all, and then I put people in it. 544 00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:57,120 So I also wanna introduce our staff member here. 545 00:42:57,120 --> 00:42:59,840 She is our program area manager for aquatics. 546 00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:01,440 Her name is Monica Martens. 547 00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:03,320 So she's really the subject matter expert. 548 00:43:03,320 --> 00:43:05,120 I just get to give the presentation. 549 00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:08,720 So aquatic improvements. 550 00:43:08,720 --> 00:43:10,640 We have several different aquatic facilities 551 00:43:10,640 --> 00:43:12,600 within the city of Denton, 552 00:43:12,600 --> 00:43:14,280 but the one we're focusing on right now 553 00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:15,760 is Waterworks Park. 554 00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:19,440 It opened in 2003 and features a lazy river. 555 00:43:19,440 --> 00:43:22,560 We have a slide tower with four different slides. 556 00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:24,120 There's a children's place feature, 557 00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:26,560 which you can see there, it's kinda small. 558 00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:29,920 And then we have had a few expansions and renovations 559 00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:31,960 since it opened in 2003. 560 00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:35,140 We added cabanas in 2016, which provides some shade, 561 00:43:35,140 --> 00:43:36,920 which is always in high demand. 562 00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:38,920 We added the wave pool in 2017, 563 00:43:38,920 --> 00:43:42,280 and then a concessions kitchen in 2018. 564 00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:44,200 And we have a video to show you. 565 00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:54,160 (upbeat music) 566 00:43:54,160 --> 00:43:55,920 Aquatic improvements. 567 00:43:55,920 --> 00:44:00,480 Opened in 2003, Waterworks Park features a lazy river, 568 00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:05,520 a slide tower, a children's play structure, 569 00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:07,720 and a sand volleyball court. 570 00:44:07,720 --> 00:44:11,140 With upgrades in 2017 and 2018, 571 00:44:11,140 --> 00:44:14,560 this park has served residents for over 20 years. 572 00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:17,960 But the infrastructure is worn and nearing end of life. 573 00:44:17,960 --> 00:44:21,800 Equipment and play features need updating to avoid failure, 574 00:44:21,800 --> 00:44:24,640 especially during key operational times. 575 00:44:24,640 --> 00:44:27,560 User expectations and desires have changed 576 00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:30,320 as technology and play features have evolved. 577 00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:33,640 As Denton grows, park spaces must also grow. 578 00:44:36,360 --> 00:44:38,940 (upbeat music) 579 00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:11,520 So some performance measures from summer of 2022. 580 00:45:11,520 --> 00:45:15,000 We had almost 80,000 in total attendance for the summer. 581 00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:18,520 Over 2000 memberships sold, 91 days of operation. 582 00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:22,620 And again, this facility is over 20 years old now. 583 00:45:22,620 --> 00:45:26,100 So planning today for tomorrow. 584 00:45:26,100 --> 00:45:28,120 That's kind of a theme in Parks and Recreation. 585 00:45:28,120 --> 00:45:30,760 We try to do as much as we can 586 00:45:30,760 --> 00:45:33,480 to maximize everything that we have. 587 00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:35,680 The Parks and Recreation Trail System Master Plan 588 00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:38,720 was adopted by Council in March of 2022. 589 00:45:38,720 --> 00:45:40,880 And one of the objectives it outlines 590 00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:43,800 is to implement recommendations and improvements 591 00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:45,400 to Waterworks Park. 592 00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:48,120 We started a aquatics facility master plan, 593 00:45:48,120 --> 00:45:49,560 still in the draft right now. 594 00:45:49,560 --> 00:45:53,500 We kicked off that project in September of 2022. 595 00:45:53,500 --> 00:45:56,780 The process for that looks at what we have 596 00:45:56,780 --> 00:45:58,240 in our overall system. 597 00:45:58,240 --> 00:46:00,480 What condition our current facilities are. 598 00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:02,540 So it wasn't just focusing on Waterworks Park, 599 00:46:02,540 --> 00:46:04,880 it was looking at the community as a whole. 600 00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:07,440 It did look at other surrounding cities. 601 00:46:07,440 --> 00:46:09,240 We looked at some demographics, 602 00:46:09,240 --> 00:46:10,720 benchmarking with surrounding cities. 603 00:46:10,720 --> 00:46:13,320 Someone asked about benchmarking. 604 00:46:13,320 --> 00:46:16,600 And then we looked, we did get feedback from the community 605 00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:17,880 and different stakeholder groups. 606 00:46:17,880 --> 00:46:18,960 What are their needs? 607 00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:20,020 What are their desires? 608 00:46:20,020 --> 00:46:21,280 What are their wants? 609 00:46:21,280 --> 00:46:24,000 So based on all of that and the planned growth for the city, 610 00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:25,960 which we've heard a lot about, 611 00:46:25,960 --> 00:46:29,680 trends, industry standards within aquatics, 612 00:46:29,680 --> 00:46:31,520 they put together a recommendation 613 00:46:31,520 --> 00:46:32,840 and a presentation of findings. 614 00:46:32,840 --> 00:46:34,640 So we're hoping to take this to council 615 00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:37,120 in September of '23 for adoption. 616 00:46:37,120 --> 00:46:39,780 But this would really guide our aquatics programs 617 00:46:39,780 --> 00:46:41,180 over the next 10 years. 618 00:46:41,180 --> 00:46:46,020 So some of the findings from that aquatics master plan, 619 00:46:46,020 --> 00:46:47,680 we need to enhance offerings 620 00:46:47,680 --> 00:46:49,680 and reinvest in Waterworks Park. 621 00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:52,520 Indoor, lap lanes, programmable space, 622 00:46:52,520 --> 00:46:55,120 and year-round aquatic access. 623 00:46:55,120 --> 00:46:57,320 Plans to address the Civic Center Pool, 624 00:46:57,320 --> 00:46:59,800 which is also one of our aging infrastructures. 625 00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:02,440 And then access to seasonal aquatics 626 00:47:02,440 --> 00:47:04,160 and year-round aquatics in the south side 627 00:47:04,160 --> 00:47:05,980 as that area continues to grow. 628 00:47:05,980 --> 00:47:08,520 So a lot of these things are being addressed in other ways. 629 00:47:08,520 --> 00:47:10,980 We have the downtown master plan, Quaker Town Master Plan 630 00:47:10,980 --> 00:47:13,240 coming on to address the Civic Center Pool. 631 00:47:13,240 --> 00:47:15,220 We are talking with different partners, 632 00:47:15,220 --> 00:47:16,860 possible opportunities. 633 00:47:16,860 --> 00:47:19,640 And as then continues to grow south, 634 00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:22,060 we can address those other recommendations. 635 00:47:22,060 --> 00:47:24,780 But the primary focus of this ask right now 636 00:47:24,780 --> 00:47:26,960 is to enhance the offerings and reinvestment 637 00:47:26,960 --> 00:47:27,980 in Waterworks Park. 638 00:47:30,440 --> 00:47:32,680 So as I said, we also talked to the community 639 00:47:32,680 --> 00:47:34,240 and wanna get feedback from you 640 00:47:34,240 --> 00:47:36,160 because you are the user group. 641 00:47:36,160 --> 00:47:39,640 So our 2022 end of season survey, 642 00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:42,920 our top three responses are upgraded restrooms, 643 00:47:42,920 --> 00:47:44,760 more shade, and new attractions. 644 00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:47,860 Those are always the top three requested items. 645 00:47:47,860 --> 00:47:53,680 So those actually touch on some of our challenges now. 646 00:47:53,680 --> 00:47:55,320 So again, I mentioned this again, 647 00:47:55,320 --> 00:47:57,620 our facility is 20 years old. 648 00:47:57,620 --> 00:47:58,920 And you may say, well, I've been there, 649 00:47:58,920 --> 00:48:00,960 I've seen it recently or had friends visit, 650 00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:02,560 it doesn't look that bad to me. 651 00:48:02,560 --> 00:48:05,660 Similar to the senior center. 652 00:48:05,660 --> 00:48:07,000 I'll have to give our staff credit, 653 00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:09,920 they do a really good job of maintaining what we have. 654 00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:12,640 They clean it well, they make things last. 655 00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:15,840 And Tom Klimko is our aquatics technician manager, 656 00:48:15,840 --> 00:48:17,820 and he and his team do a great job 657 00:48:17,820 --> 00:48:19,840 of getting the most life out of what we have 658 00:48:19,840 --> 00:48:21,880 and preserving it and maintaining it. 659 00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:24,420 But we are reaching our 20 year life cycle, 660 00:48:24,420 --> 00:48:26,240 and that is the projected life cycle 661 00:48:26,240 --> 00:48:29,640 for most of the equipment and buildings out there. 662 00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:32,320 You can see we've had some settling issues 663 00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:35,360 with some smoothing of the structure. 664 00:48:35,360 --> 00:48:37,800 Our water treatment system and circulation equipment, 665 00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:39,280 which is essential for treating 666 00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:41,560 and keeping the water safe for users, 667 00:48:41,560 --> 00:48:44,000 is nearing the end of its life cycle. 668 00:48:44,000 --> 00:48:48,960 We have some other challenges, just operationally. 669 00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:50,600 Again, things you don't see as the public, 670 00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:53,360 but that we experience as staff and have to work through. 671 00:48:53,360 --> 00:48:57,100 Our admissions office is small and undersized. 672 00:48:57,100 --> 00:48:58,920 We are required to count down money, 673 00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:01,000 and our Randy's in the room now, 674 00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:03,040 in a secure and safe position. 675 00:49:03,040 --> 00:49:06,180 And we have one entrance into our admissions office, 676 00:49:06,180 --> 00:49:08,120 and it's right through that secure space. 677 00:49:08,120 --> 00:49:10,960 So there's not a secure area to be able to count that down 678 00:49:10,960 --> 00:49:13,800 all the time as people are coming and going. 679 00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:16,560 We have a first aid office slash guard room. 680 00:49:16,560 --> 00:49:18,360 You can see in the picture there. 681 00:49:18,360 --> 00:49:22,300 That office space was built to house two guards 682 00:49:22,300 --> 00:49:24,800 when they're rotating and one manager. 683 00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:26,500 Well, then we added on the wave pool 684 00:49:26,500 --> 00:49:29,680 and the addition of staff to be able to accommodate that. 685 00:49:29,680 --> 00:49:31,840 Now we have to have seven guards in there. 686 00:49:31,840 --> 00:49:33,480 And it's small, there's no place for them 687 00:49:33,480 --> 00:49:37,300 to keep their equipment or their personal belongings. 688 00:49:37,300 --> 00:49:40,120 So if they come and they're working an eight hour shift, 689 00:49:40,120 --> 00:49:43,140 they have water bottles with them, their lunch. 690 00:49:43,140 --> 00:49:44,440 It's very tight in there. 691 00:49:44,440 --> 00:49:47,120 During COVID, there was no place to space out. 692 00:49:47,120 --> 00:49:48,320 So those are some of the challenges 693 00:49:48,320 --> 00:49:49,160 that we're working through. 694 00:49:49,160 --> 00:49:51,900 And when it's hot outside, they go through their rotations, 695 00:49:51,900 --> 00:49:54,600 and part of their rotation to keep them refreshed 696 00:49:54,600 --> 00:49:57,000 is they get to spend about 15 minutes in there 697 00:49:57,000 --> 00:49:58,700 during their rotation. 698 00:49:58,700 --> 00:50:00,040 But there's not a lot of room for them 699 00:50:00,040 --> 00:50:01,480 to be able to do that. 700 00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:04,400 Similarly, they have to be able to respond 701 00:50:04,400 --> 00:50:06,240 if there's an emergency situation. 702 00:50:06,240 --> 00:50:07,760 Everyone in the guard room is expected 703 00:50:07,760 --> 00:50:09,560 to help respond to that situation. 704 00:50:09,560 --> 00:50:11,960 So they can't go leave and walk into the auditorium 705 00:50:11,960 --> 00:50:13,900 to go get their lunch or whatever they had, 706 00:50:13,900 --> 00:50:15,880 their personal effects from over there. 707 00:50:15,880 --> 00:50:17,680 So they're required to stay in that area. 708 00:50:17,680 --> 00:50:20,000 And again, it's not very functional. 709 00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:21,800 That's also our first aid room. 710 00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:24,120 So if you need first aid rendered to you, 711 00:50:24,120 --> 00:50:26,320 you go in there, and it's not very private, 712 00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:28,160 and we have to kick all our guards out 713 00:50:28,160 --> 00:50:30,380 to help render you first aid. 714 00:50:30,380 --> 00:50:32,640 So that's some challenges there. 715 00:50:32,640 --> 00:50:34,740 The bath house, what we call the bath house, 716 00:50:34,740 --> 00:50:36,520 this is a restroom, is aging. 717 00:50:36,520 --> 00:50:39,320 It doesn't really meet the requirements now 718 00:50:39,320 --> 00:50:40,680 from the public. 719 00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:43,360 There's one big changing area that you go in. 720 00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:44,880 So if you have a family and you're trying 721 00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:46,700 to change your kids, you're out there 722 00:50:46,700 --> 00:50:48,720 in the middle of everyone. 723 00:50:48,720 --> 00:50:50,480 Our showers aren't very appealing, 724 00:50:50,480 --> 00:50:53,080 and we just have some other challenges in there. 725 00:50:53,080 --> 00:50:56,160 We upgraded, the facilities team upgraded 726 00:50:56,160 --> 00:51:01,160 a lot of the facility toilets, fountains, sinks, soaps, 727 00:51:01,160 --> 00:51:07,240 to hands-free during COVID just for sanitary purposes. 728 00:51:07,240 --> 00:51:09,320 We're not able to do that at the water park 729 00:51:09,320 --> 00:51:11,640 because all of the plumbing was inside the wall. 730 00:51:11,640 --> 00:51:13,940 So it requires a complete renovation. 731 00:51:13,940 --> 00:51:15,520 So we still have the manual flush, 732 00:51:15,520 --> 00:51:17,820 which some people choose not to use. 733 00:51:20,720 --> 00:51:23,080 Some other current challenges, our security system, 734 00:51:23,080 --> 00:51:25,200 PA system, again, they're aging, 735 00:51:25,200 --> 00:51:27,320 technology's wearing out. 736 00:51:27,320 --> 00:51:29,640 The public address system is important 737 00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:31,680 when we have emergencies, weather updates, 738 00:51:31,680 --> 00:51:34,560 those sorts of things, so we do need to upgrade that. 739 00:51:34,560 --> 00:51:37,040 No passive water or flat water. 740 00:51:37,040 --> 00:51:39,480 We don't have an area for people just to hang out 741 00:51:39,480 --> 00:51:41,200 or to do programming in. 742 00:51:41,200 --> 00:51:44,480 Learn to swim, swimming laps. 743 00:51:44,480 --> 00:51:46,440 So we do want to address that in this. 744 00:51:48,200 --> 00:51:50,560 There's also a high demand for shade and seating. 745 00:51:50,560 --> 00:51:52,680 Again, it's Texas, it's hot when you're out there. 746 00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:54,760 We have very limited shade and seating. 747 00:51:54,760 --> 00:51:56,360 When people come to the water park, 748 00:51:56,360 --> 00:51:57,480 yes, you're in there for the water, 749 00:51:57,480 --> 00:51:59,120 but they want a shaded place to go 750 00:51:59,120 --> 00:52:02,160 and maybe eat their lunch or cool down or dry off. 751 00:52:02,160 --> 00:52:04,360 And we don't have a lot of that out there. 752 00:52:04,360 --> 00:52:07,040 So, and again, we just wanted to keep up 753 00:52:07,040 --> 00:52:09,280 with industry trends, expectations 754 00:52:09,280 --> 00:52:12,040 from the population and desires. 755 00:52:12,040 --> 00:52:14,280 There's a picture there of a larger place structure 756 00:52:14,280 --> 00:52:16,480 that is, if you remember the picture from before, 757 00:52:16,480 --> 00:52:18,840 our place structure is small, again, it's aging. 758 00:52:18,840 --> 00:52:20,000 It's 20 years old. 759 00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:22,840 So the parts there need to be replaced 760 00:52:22,840 --> 00:52:24,240 and we want to take this opportunity 761 00:52:24,240 --> 00:52:25,920 to make a larger place structure 762 00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:28,480 to help address the growth that we're experiencing 763 00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:30,160 and be able to serve more people. 764 00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:37,120 So the proposal for aquatics is $15 million 765 00:52:37,120 --> 00:52:38,720 for improvements and expansions 766 00:52:38,720 --> 00:52:40,360 that would help address all of the issues 767 00:52:40,360 --> 00:52:41,560 that we listed there. 768 00:52:41,560 --> 00:52:45,960 Admissions, bathhouse, guard room, filtration, renovation, 769 00:52:45,960 --> 00:52:48,280 a new and larger children's structure, 770 00:52:48,280 --> 00:52:51,120 and then indoor multipurpose rooms 771 00:52:51,120 --> 00:52:54,360 and leisure programming space and shade additions. 772 00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:56,080 We do have kind of a rendering here, again, 773 00:52:56,080 --> 00:52:58,480 working through the Aquatics Master Plan. 774 00:52:58,480 --> 00:53:03,200 The consultant provided us with a kind of a conceptual idea. 775 00:53:03,200 --> 00:53:04,800 So this is not exactly what it would look like. 776 00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:07,440 We haven't gone through any designs, as Cassie mentioned, 777 00:53:07,440 --> 00:53:09,720 but we have kind of an idea of what we would want 778 00:53:09,720 --> 00:53:12,160 and a basic opinion of probable costs, 779 00:53:12,160 --> 00:53:14,360 which is where we got the $15 million from. 780 00:53:16,800 --> 00:53:18,160 And I'll take any questions. 781 00:53:18,160 --> 00:53:22,280 - All right, let's start with Lauren. 782 00:53:22,280 --> 00:53:26,880 - Thanks, Nikki. 783 00:53:26,880 --> 00:53:28,040 Two questions. 784 00:53:28,040 --> 00:53:30,040 First of all, of the $15 million, 785 00:53:30,040 --> 00:53:31,720 are you able to give us a breakdown 786 00:53:31,720 --> 00:53:33,920 of what replacing the water components 787 00:53:33,920 --> 00:53:36,240 versus putting in new programming would look like 788 00:53:36,240 --> 00:53:37,800 in terms of that $15 million? 789 00:53:37,800 --> 00:53:39,880 - We do have that. 790 00:53:39,880 --> 00:53:41,960 It's a lot of concrete work, 791 00:53:41,960 --> 00:53:44,320 and so some of those overall construction costs 792 00:53:44,320 --> 00:53:45,720 are built into the overall. 793 00:53:45,720 --> 00:53:48,440 So it's hard to kind of parse out each one. 794 00:53:48,440 --> 00:53:52,040 But we can share that with you 795 00:53:52,040 --> 00:53:53,360 with what the consultant gave us. 796 00:53:53,360 --> 00:53:55,440 It'll be included in the Aquatics Master Plan. 797 00:53:55,440 --> 00:53:58,520 But it's hard to pinpoint, okay, this specific project, 798 00:53:58,520 --> 00:54:03,080 because there's all the other grading concrete work 799 00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:05,200 that would be split among quite a few 800 00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:06,320 of the different projects. 801 00:54:06,320 --> 00:54:08,120 - And then how, with the expansion 802 00:54:08,120 --> 00:54:09,400 that you guys are talking about, 803 00:54:09,400 --> 00:54:11,200 what is the staffing needs for this? 804 00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:13,080 How many lifeguards are you gonna have to have? 805 00:54:13,080 --> 00:54:15,560 Are you confident that you can get them? 806 00:54:15,560 --> 00:54:16,840 Because that is an issue 807 00:54:16,840 --> 00:54:18,640 in terms of being open longer hours 808 00:54:18,640 --> 00:54:20,400 or more time during the summer. 809 00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:21,880 What have you guys thought about that? 810 00:54:21,880 --> 00:54:23,280 - That's a great question. 811 00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:26,760 The additions here with the splash ground 812 00:54:26,760 --> 00:54:28,560 or the children's play feature 813 00:54:28,560 --> 00:54:31,040 would really only take maybe three additional guards, 814 00:54:31,040 --> 00:54:33,280 and then the flat water would take three or four. 815 00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:36,360 So we're looking at maybe seven to eight total. 816 00:54:36,360 --> 00:54:39,880 We already currently have one to two guards 817 00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:41,520 on our children's play structure, 818 00:54:41,520 --> 00:54:43,600 depending on how busy we are. 819 00:54:43,600 --> 00:54:45,720 So it wouldn't be that big of an impact 820 00:54:45,720 --> 00:54:47,320 to our overall staffing needs. 821 00:54:47,320 --> 00:54:50,720 - Questions? 822 00:54:50,720 --> 00:54:51,920 Go over to Greg first. 823 00:54:51,920 --> 00:54:55,840 - Thank you. 824 00:54:55,840 --> 00:54:56,800 This is super helpful. 825 00:54:56,800 --> 00:54:58,880 The data is super helpful. 826 00:54:58,880 --> 00:54:59,720 In the day in the beginning, 827 00:54:59,720 --> 00:55:02,440 you talked about the number of events that you've sold 828 00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:04,640 and the revenue at the beginning. 829 00:55:04,640 --> 00:55:08,640 I'm curious, the total cost to operate the water park, 830 00:55:08,640 --> 00:55:10,880 what percentage of that budget ballpark 831 00:55:11,880 --> 00:55:14,280 comes in in additional funding 832 00:55:14,280 --> 00:55:17,040 outside of the just general taxpayer funding? 833 00:55:17,040 --> 00:55:19,960 - I'm sorry. 834 00:55:19,960 --> 00:55:21,680 - Like where you sell memberships 835 00:55:21,680 --> 00:55:25,040 and the question is does the membership sold 836 00:55:25,040 --> 00:55:27,120 and the rental reservation sold, 837 00:55:27,120 --> 00:55:29,320 does that cover the operational cost? 838 00:55:29,320 --> 00:55:30,360 - No. 839 00:55:30,360 --> 00:55:32,160 Since 2017 with the additional wave pool, 840 00:55:32,160 --> 00:55:34,160 we have operated a deficit. 841 00:55:34,160 --> 00:55:36,960 Now we do share, we've entered into a 50 year agreement 842 00:55:36,960 --> 00:55:39,280 several years ago with the ISD 843 00:55:39,280 --> 00:55:41,440 to operate the water works park 844 00:55:41,440 --> 00:55:42,600 and the auditorium. 845 00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:47,600 So they share 50% of the operating costs with us. 846 00:55:47,600 --> 00:55:49,280 - Got it. 847 00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:50,120 Thank you. 848 00:55:50,120 --> 00:55:52,960 Peggy. 849 00:55:52,960 --> 00:55:58,240 - Well, since I took you on a memory trip last week, 850 00:55:58,240 --> 00:56:02,920 I served on the bond committee as did Janet. 851 00:56:02,920 --> 00:56:06,360 We were the building a better Denton committee 852 00:56:06,360 --> 00:56:07,920 20 something years ago. 853 00:56:07,920 --> 00:56:10,760 And Margaret Smith, who was on the city council, 854 00:56:12,000 --> 00:56:14,160 sold this to us. 855 00:56:14,160 --> 00:56:16,680 She had been somewhere and she said, 856 00:56:16,680 --> 00:56:18,440 we have to have one of these. 857 00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:21,120 So our little subcommittee went off 858 00:56:21,120 --> 00:56:23,280 and visited other water works 859 00:56:23,280 --> 00:56:25,640 and you could not have planned it any better 860 00:56:25,640 --> 00:56:28,640 because as we drove up to NRH2O 861 00:56:28,640 --> 00:56:37,280 and our Denton van, there was a group of people 862 00:56:37,280 --> 00:56:39,640 and this fella came to us and he said, 863 00:56:39,640 --> 00:56:40,840 what are y'all doing here? 864 00:56:40,840 --> 00:56:42,520 He says, you're from Denton. 865 00:56:42,520 --> 00:56:44,680 We said, we're looking at parks. 866 00:56:44,680 --> 00:56:47,840 He said, well, we live in Denton 867 00:56:47,840 --> 00:56:50,240 and we're here having a birthday party 868 00:56:50,240 --> 00:56:54,120 because there's nothing like this in Denton. 869 00:56:54,120 --> 00:56:56,840 So it couldn't have been planned any better. 870 00:56:56,840 --> 00:56:58,920 But just remember that this is 871 00:56:58,920 --> 00:57:03,440 the Margaret Smith Memorial Water Park 872 00:57:03,440 --> 00:57:06,040 and it does a lot of good for us. 873 00:57:06,040 --> 00:57:08,040 - Thank you. 874 00:57:08,040 --> 00:57:08,880 Yes, it does. 875 00:57:08,880 --> 00:57:11,320 It's actually a line in our aquatic master plan study. 876 00:57:11,320 --> 00:57:14,320 It is a destination facility for the whole of North Texas. 877 00:57:14,320 --> 00:57:17,160 So it serves not only our Denton population 878 00:57:17,160 --> 00:57:18,360 but surrounding cities as well, 879 00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:21,520 which helps offset some of our operating costs. 880 00:57:21,520 --> 00:57:22,800 - Ms. Hayworth. 881 00:57:22,800 --> 00:57:25,560 - I'd like to explore the deficit a little more. 882 00:57:25,560 --> 00:57:29,760 I remember when this park was losing a million dollars a year 883 00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:34,320 and I'd like to know, what is the deficit these days? 884 00:57:34,320 --> 00:57:35,840 - It's roughly the same. 885 00:57:38,880 --> 00:57:43,640 - So regarding the maintenance, 886 00:57:43,640 --> 00:57:47,480 I know getting the $50 million is one thing, 887 00:57:47,480 --> 00:57:51,440 but will there be funds in your planning 888 00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:52,840 for the maintenance, right? 889 00:57:52,840 --> 00:57:56,960 Because I know it's very labor intensive 890 00:57:56,960 --> 00:57:58,920 and very maintenance intensive. 891 00:57:58,920 --> 00:58:00,480 And so could you speak to that? 892 00:58:00,480 --> 00:58:05,280 - We're very fortunate that the city council 893 00:58:05,280 --> 00:58:08,600 has allowed us to have a capital maintenance plan 894 00:58:08,600 --> 00:58:11,200 or budget for aquatic facilities. 895 00:58:11,200 --> 00:58:12,720 So we use that money. 896 00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:16,480 It varies on year to year based on what we project needing. 897 00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:21,480 I think this last year it was close to $400,000 or $20,000. 898 00:58:21,480 --> 00:58:26,120 And we use that to maintain our current equipment. 899 00:58:26,120 --> 00:58:28,960 So we look at, we currently assess 900 00:58:28,960 --> 00:58:32,200 all of our equipment needs projected out into the future. 901 00:58:32,200 --> 00:58:33,120 As things come up, 902 00:58:33,120 --> 00:58:34,800 obviously we need to shift funding around 903 00:58:34,800 --> 00:58:36,440 to address immediate needs, 904 00:58:36,440 --> 00:58:38,720 but we have everything planned out based on 905 00:58:38,720 --> 00:58:41,120 the life expectancy of each piece of equipment. 906 00:58:41,120 --> 00:58:50,440 - Regarding the leisure programming pool addition, 907 00:58:50,440 --> 00:58:56,080 with your statement with DISD also going in with it, 908 00:58:56,080 --> 00:59:00,400 do you not have the indoor natatorium 909 00:59:00,400 --> 00:59:04,280 that you can use for the classes during the summertime 910 00:59:04,280 --> 00:59:07,920 when school isn't in session or even just year round? 911 00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:10,320 - So great question. 912 00:59:10,320 --> 00:59:12,160 Yes, we do have an indoor natatorium. 913 00:59:12,160 --> 00:59:14,200 It does have a competition pool 914 00:59:14,200 --> 00:59:16,200 and then also a lap swimming pool 915 00:59:16,200 --> 00:59:18,320 for anyone who may not be familiar. 916 00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:21,080 Again, we share that facility with DISD as you pointed out, 917 00:59:21,080 --> 00:59:24,280 but when it was built, DISD had two high schools. 918 00:59:24,280 --> 00:59:26,480 They have five high schools now. 919 00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:28,280 And they did not have water polo. 920 00:59:28,280 --> 00:59:29,360 Now they have water polo. 921 00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:32,200 So we have all of those kids trying to come in 922 00:59:32,200 --> 00:59:33,480 and find practice space. 923 00:59:33,480 --> 00:59:35,480 And of course, they can't do practice 924 00:59:35,480 --> 00:59:39,760 during the middle part of the day 'cause they're in class. 925 00:59:39,760 --> 00:59:42,360 So their primary use time is before school, 926 00:59:42,360 --> 00:59:44,600 which is when the community wants to do lap swim. 927 00:59:44,600 --> 00:59:45,840 And then after school, 928 00:59:45,840 --> 00:59:48,920 which is when the community wants to do water aerobics 929 00:59:48,920 --> 00:59:52,200 or when you wanna do your learn to swim programs. 930 00:59:52,200 --> 00:59:56,440 So there's a high concentration of requests 931 00:59:56,440 --> 00:59:58,360 and a very little pool space. 932 00:59:58,360 --> 01:00:01,160 So that's why we need additional flat water space. 933 01:00:01,160 --> 01:00:06,160 And just anecdotally, you talked about the staffing issues. 934 01:00:06,160 --> 01:00:09,560 One thing that we found just in talking with people 935 01:00:09,560 --> 01:00:12,640 going out to job fairs or trying to recruit lifeguards 936 01:00:12,640 --> 01:00:15,320 is a lot of people don't know how to swim anymore. 937 01:00:15,320 --> 01:00:17,560 And so we need flat water space 938 01:00:17,560 --> 01:00:19,840 to be able to provide those lessons 939 01:00:19,840 --> 01:00:20,960 to then get our lifeguards. 940 01:00:20,960 --> 01:00:22,560 Not only is it a great skill, 941 01:00:22,560 --> 01:00:25,280 but we sufficiently want them for staff later also. 942 01:00:25,280 --> 01:00:28,760 - Well, I agree with what you're saying there. 943 01:00:28,760 --> 01:00:33,560 However, UIL rules in regard to competitive high school 944 01:00:33,560 --> 01:00:38,560 does not allow the kids to be competing or practicing 945 01:00:38,560 --> 01:00:44,160 with their high school coaches during the summer season. 946 01:00:44,160 --> 01:00:48,240 So that should open up that timeframe. 947 01:00:48,240 --> 01:00:50,800 And also during the summer, 948 01:00:50,800 --> 01:00:55,720 you have addressed that during the school year as well, 949 01:00:55,720 --> 01:00:59,800 during the daytime, you could set up some of the classes 950 01:00:59,800 --> 01:01:02,600 for those who need them. 951 01:01:02,600 --> 01:01:04,280 Could you not? 952 01:01:04,280 --> 01:01:06,760 - We do, and we take advantage of that time. 953 01:01:06,760 --> 01:01:08,200 It's open for open swim. 954 01:01:08,200 --> 01:01:09,680 We do have some programs there, 955 01:01:09,680 --> 01:01:11,480 but again, we have a large population. 956 01:01:11,480 --> 01:01:13,840 It's either working or in school. 957 01:01:13,840 --> 01:01:17,040 So there's not like, you wanna, okay. 958 01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:20,920 - Yes, Monica Martin. 959 01:01:20,920 --> 01:01:23,040 I'm the aquatic program area manager. 960 01:01:23,040 --> 01:01:24,480 In regards to the classroom space, 961 01:01:24,480 --> 01:01:27,400 the natatorium was actually built with one classroom, 962 01:01:27,400 --> 01:01:28,320 one communal space. 963 01:01:28,320 --> 01:01:30,000 It serves parties, it serves camps, 964 01:01:30,000 --> 01:01:33,520 it serves the booster club, the lifeguard training, 965 01:01:33,520 --> 01:01:35,600 and everything else that we have in there. 966 01:01:35,600 --> 01:01:40,600 The GISD as well as the city do take a lot of opportunities 967 01:01:40,600 --> 01:01:42,920 to program out that room. 968 01:01:42,920 --> 01:01:45,240 And it is used pretty much from about six in the morning 969 01:01:45,240 --> 01:01:50,240 until about eight to 10 p.m. between December through August. 970 01:01:50,240 --> 01:01:52,840 So that is the one space that we have for indoor classroom. 971 01:01:52,840 --> 01:01:55,680 It is upstairs, which creates a little bit of a problem. 972 01:01:55,680 --> 01:01:58,280 So if you're moving from the deck, the pool deck upstairs, 973 01:01:58,280 --> 01:02:00,480 you do have to go up the stairs. 974 01:02:00,480 --> 01:02:01,880 That creates a lot of water on the stairs, 975 01:02:01,880 --> 01:02:03,400 and it does become an unsafe environment 976 01:02:03,400 --> 01:02:05,440 in order for people to transfer up and down. 977 01:02:05,440 --> 01:02:07,800 Or for party kids who are in the pool, 978 01:02:07,800 --> 01:02:08,880 go upstairs for their party, 979 01:02:08,880 --> 01:02:09,880 and they have to come back down. 980 01:02:09,880 --> 01:02:12,040 We do have some areas where we do have 981 01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:13,920 to have non-slip tapes on there. 982 01:02:13,920 --> 01:02:16,400 We have to keep a lot of maintenance on those stairways. 983 01:02:16,400 --> 01:02:18,880 And it's not an ideal environment for people 984 01:02:18,880 --> 01:02:23,680 who are maybe a little bit mobile, dependent on devices. 985 01:02:23,680 --> 01:02:25,380 They can't watch the kids swim. 986 01:02:25,380 --> 01:02:26,640 They can't watch their families 987 01:02:26,640 --> 01:02:28,920 have a good, enjoyable experience. 988 01:02:28,920 --> 01:02:30,520 Part of the indoor classrooms that you're seeing 989 01:02:30,520 --> 01:02:32,800 on the bond election is going to be building 990 01:02:32,800 --> 01:02:34,360 on three additional classrooms. 991 01:02:34,360 --> 01:02:37,200 That's going to have entrance out to the water park, 992 01:02:37,200 --> 01:02:40,320 as well as into the natatorium off of the pool deck itself. 993 01:02:40,320 --> 01:02:42,600 And it would be facing into the leisure pool area 994 01:02:42,600 --> 01:02:45,260 that is currently the wall of windows. 995 01:02:47,240 --> 01:02:49,760 - Yeah, the next question I had was, 996 01:02:49,760 --> 01:02:53,480 have we explored, so there's a lot of, 997 01:02:53,480 --> 01:02:55,440 there's privately owned water parks, 998 01:02:55,440 --> 01:02:57,160 and there's publicly owned. 999 01:02:57,160 --> 01:03:00,800 Have we explored any sort of a public-private partnership, 1000 01:03:00,800 --> 01:03:05,320 or looked at potentially leasing this facility 1001 01:03:05,320 --> 01:03:07,600 to a privately owned operator? 1002 01:03:07,600 --> 01:03:11,620 Just thinking about, if we're losing a million a year, 1003 01:03:11,620 --> 01:03:13,060 we've already got the facility, right? 1004 01:03:13,060 --> 01:03:13,960 So you don't want to scrap it. 1005 01:03:13,960 --> 01:03:15,760 But are there other opportunities 1006 01:03:15,760 --> 01:03:19,760 to maybe curb our ongoing deficit 1007 01:03:19,760 --> 01:03:21,600 through some sort of an outsourcing? 1008 01:03:21,600 --> 01:03:24,920 - We can look into that. 1009 01:03:24,920 --> 01:03:25,860 We haven't recently. 1010 01:03:25,860 --> 01:03:29,000 We are looking at different opportunities for future 1011 01:03:29,000 --> 01:03:32,060 and potential expansion, but not currently. 1012 01:03:32,060 --> 01:03:35,480 - Question up there. 1013 01:03:35,480 --> 01:03:38,440 My kids are gonna. 1014 01:03:38,440 --> 01:03:42,900 - Higher? 1015 01:03:42,900 --> 01:03:44,080 - Last time it was lower. 1016 01:03:44,080 --> 01:03:44,920 Okay. 1017 01:03:46,320 --> 01:03:49,080 - Anyway, so I'm hearing a lot about 1018 01:03:49,080 --> 01:03:50,960 the need for the flat water. 1019 01:03:50,960 --> 01:03:54,720 And I know that the natatorium is capacity 1020 01:03:54,720 --> 01:03:56,640 most program days. 1021 01:03:56,640 --> 01:04:00,600 I'm wondering if we might need to balance 1022 01:04:00,600 --> 01:04:01,640 the other direction a little bit, 1023 01:04:01,640 --> 01:04:04,360 if we've considered a version of the plan 1024 01:04:04,360 --> 01:04:08,440 that is essential maintenance on the Waterworks Park, 1025 01:04:08,440 --> 01:04:10,800 but more of an emphasis on the flat water, 1026 01:04:10,800 --> 01:04:13,680 or even an additional natatorium. 1027 01:04:13,680 --> 01:04:16,040 I know that's something in the Aquatics Master Plan 1028 01:04:16,040 --> 01:04:16,880 under discussion. 1029 01:04:16,880 --> 01:04:20,360 But a little bit curious why this year's bond 1030 01:04:20,360 --> 01:04:24,000 is the one for Waterworks improvements, 1031 01:04:24,000 --> 01:04:26,100 and not an additional natatorium, 1032 01:04:26,100 --> 01:04:28,800 or even more flat water space. 1033 01:04:28,800 --> 01:04:30,080 'Cause I mean, if you think about it, 1034 01:04:30,080 --> 01:04:33,000 the Civic Center and Waterworks and Natatorium, 1035 01:04:33,000 --> 01:04:35,640 wholly inadequate for our current aquatics needs, 1036 01:04:35,640 --> 01:04:38,800 much less our future aquatics needs. 1037 01:04:38,800 --> 01:04:40,640 On top of that, I don't even know the status 1038 01:04:40,640 --> 01:04:41,880 of swim lessons this Saturday, 1039 01:04:41,880 --> 01:04:44,480 'cause we have some HVAC issues at the natatorium. 1040 01:04:44,480 --> 01:04:46,400 It needs a new HVAC system. 1041 01:04:46,400 --> 01:04:49,180 So just kind of wondering where staff's perspective is 1042 01:04:49,180 --> 01:04:52,160 on that balance between why is this the year 1043 01:04:52,160 --> 01:04:55,260 for Waterworks and not more natatorium space? 1044 01:04:55,260 --> 01:04:58,480 - I'll kind of take that in a few different pieces. 1045 01:04:58,480 --> 01:05:01,640 So the HVAC component, that's the air conditioning 1046 01:05:01,640 --> 01:05:04,020 and the Teresco unit that handle dehumidification 1047 01:05:04,020 --> 01:05:07,440 and air conditioning for the natatorium. 1048 01:05:07,440 --> 01:05:10,180 We are experiencing some issues with that. 1049 01:05:10,180 --> 01:05:13,720 It is a system that is five years old at this point 1050 01:05:13,720 --> 01:05:15,160 and should last about 15. 1051 01:05:15,160 --> 01:05:18,300 So we're hoping to make some improvements 1052 01:05:18,300 --> 01:05:21,160 or some fixes there and then still get the life out of that. 1053 01:05:21,160 --> 01:05:24,200 It was $1.2 million or $1 million 1054 01:05:24,200 --> 01:05:26,920 when it was installed in 2015. 1055 01:05:26,920 --> 01:05:31,240 So that should remedy that issue there. 1056 01:05:31,240 --> 01:05:33,860 As far as expansion of the natatorium, 1057 01:05:33,860 --> 01:05:36,040 that is something that we did explore. 1058 01:05:36,040 --> 01:05:38,280 It's not something that we would do on our own though. 1059 01:05:38,280 --> 01:05:40,200 It would be with maybe different partners. 1060 01:05:40,200 --> 01:05:42,840 DISD, UNT has expressed interest. 1061 01:05:42,840 --> 01:05:44,720 We've gone to those various stakeholders. 1062 01:05:44,720 --> 01:05:46,920 They're not currently in a position to be able to do that 1063 01:05:46,920 --> 01:05:48,120 and it is a high dollar amount. 1064 01:05:48,120 --> 01:05:49,600 So it would be more than the $15 million 1065 01:05:49,600 --> 01:05:50,960 that we're looking at here. 1066 01:05:50,960 --> 01:05:52,240 But that is something that we're looking at 1067 01:05:52,240 --> 01:05:53,740 working towards in the future. 1068 01:05:53,740 --> 01:05:57,920 That answer all your questions? 1069 01:05:57,920 --> 01:05:59,040 - Any other questions? 1070 01:05:59,040 --> 01:06:02,640 All right, let's move to a time of small group conversation 1071 01:06:02,640 --> 01:06:06,300 on this topic and then we'll come back to the large group. 1072 01:06:08,880 --> 01:06:11,880 (people chattering) 1073 01:06:38,280 --> 01:06:41,280 (people chattering) 1074 01:07:08,280 --> 01:07:11,280 (people chattering) 1075 01:07:38,280 --> 01:07:41,280 (people chattering) 1076 01:08:08,480 --> 01:08:11,480 (people chattering) 1077 01:08:38,280 --> 01:08:41,280 (people chattering) 1078 01:09:08,280 --> 01:09:11,280 (people chattering) 1079 01:09:38,280 --> 01:09:41,280 (people chattering) 1080 01:10:08,280 --> 01:10:11,280 (people chattering) 1081 01:10:38,280 --> 01:10:41,280 (people chattering) 1082 01:11:08,440 --> 01:11:11,440 (people chattering) 1083 01:11:38,280 --> 01:11:41,280 (people chattering) 1084 01:12:08,280 --> 01:12:11,280 (people chattering) 1085 01:12:11,280 --> 01:12:26,280 (people chattering) 1086 01:12:38,280 --> 01:12:41,280 (people chattering) 1087 01:12:41,280 --> 01:12:51,280 (people chattering) 1088 01:12:51,280 --> 01:13:02,280 (people chattering) 1089 01:13:09,280 --> 01:13:12,280 (people chattering) 1090 01:13:12,280 --> 01:13:20,720 - Let's take about two more minutes 1091 01:13:20,720 --> 01:13:22,520 to keep the conversation going. 1092 01:13:22,520 --> 01:13:33,200 - While you guys are still doing your small groups, 1093 01:13:33,200 --> 01:13:36,360 I just wanna interrupt and correct some information 1094 01:13:36,360 --> 01:13:37,500 I said earlier. 1095 01:13:37,500 --> 01:13:39,400 The water park itself does not operate 1096 01:13:39,400 --> 01:13:40,840 at a million dollar deficit. 1097 01:13:40,840 --> 01:13:43,080 The water park combined with an auditorium 1098 01:13:43,080 --> 01:13:44,880 operates at a million dollar deficit. 1099 01:13:44,880 --> 01:13:47,480 The water park itself is about $400,000. 1100 01:13:47,480 --> 01:13:50,760 So it's about 75% cost recovery. 1101 01:13:50,760 --> 01:13:52,280 So I just wanna make that clarification 1102 01:13:52,280 --> 01:13:54,240 as you guys are discussing. 1103 01:13:54,240 --> 01:13:55,640 So that's a big difference. 1104 01:13:55,640 --> 01:14:00,640 (people chattering) 1105 01:14:07,500 --> 01:14:10,500 (people chattering) 1106 01:14:10,500 --> 01:14:34,720 - Let's wrap up the table conversations 1107 01:14:34,720 --> 01:14:36,720 and we'll move back to a whole group. 1108 01:14:36,720 --> 01:14:39,000 Again, reminder, parking lot questions. 1109 01:14:39,000 --> 01:14:41,720 You can continue to ask them online. 1110 01:14:41,720 --> 01:14:51,280 All right, again, another lively conversation 1111 01:14:51,280 --> 01:14:52,660 as I scan the room. 1112 01:14:52,660 --> 01:14:56,800 What further comments or questions does anyone have 1113 01:14:56,800 --> 01:14:58,280 on this particular project? 1114 01:14:58,280 --> 01:15:03,440 Comments or questions, yes sir. 1115 01:15:06,640 --> 01:15:11,640 - So we entered into the agreement with DISD in 2003. 1116 01:15:11,640 --> 01:15:15,440 And obviously they've grown at a much faster rate 1117 01:15:15,440 --> 01:15:16,280 than the city. 1118 01:15:16,280 --> 01:15:18,040 Was it not anticipated? 1119 01:15:18,040 --> 01:15:21,440 Or is there not something within the contract that can... 1120 01:15:21,440 --> 01:15:23,720 I mean, I grew up in a small town, 1121 01:15:23,720 --> 01:15:26,480 2,800 people, 69 people in my graduating class, 1122 01:15:26,480 --> 01:15:28,640 and we had a full-size Olympic swimming pool. 1123 01:15:28,640 --> 01:15:32,840 That's something school districts should be doing more of 1124 01:15:35,840 --> 01:15:39,820 than requiring that they do the combined with the community. 1125 01:15:39,820 --> 01:15:42,920 - I can't speak to the agreement. 1126 01:15:42,920 --> 01:15:45,800 Obviously I wasn't here when it was in place. 1127 01:15:45,800 --> 01:15:49,000 But that doesn't mean that agreement can't be renegotiated 1128 01:15:49,000 --> 01:15:50,040 or looked at later. 1129 01:15:50,040 --> 01:15:52,480 So we're not stuck in that forever. 1130 01:15:52,480 --> 01:15:55,040 We can, I'm sure if they want to renegotiate 1131 01:15:55,040 --> 01:15:56,040 what that looks like. 1132 01:15:56,040 --> 01:16:00,800 - Our group had some questions over the park 1133 01:16:00,800 --> 01:16:03,840 and the native budget. 1134 01:16:03,840 --> 01:16:06,880 We were particularly interested, have you explored 1135 01:16:06,880 --> 01:16:09,160 those options for the public partnerships? 1136 01:16:09,160 --> 01:16:11,400 Or could you outline what those other relationships 1137 01:16:11,400 --> 01:16:14,760 might look like in communities around us 1138 01:16:14,760 --> 01:16:17,840 and what other cities might have those types of setups? 1139 01:16:17,840 --> 01:16:19,520 And kind of a follow-up, 1140 01:16:19,520 --> 01:16:21,040 I mean, you might have answered this a little earlier, 1141 01:16:21,040 --> 01:16:25,720 the offset that the cost recovery elements of the park 1142 01:16:25,720 --> 01:16:28,160 to help mitigate that deficit that it faces, 1143 01:16:28,160 --> 01:16:30,920 could you expand upon that a little bit more? 1144 01:16:30,920 --> 01:16:31,760 - Sure, so... 1145 01:16:33,560 --> 01:16:34,960 - Can you guys hear me okay? 1146 01:16:34,960 --> 01:16:40,880 As far as the public-private partnerships, 1147 01:16:40,880 --> 01:16:44,720 we have not explored that. 1148 01:16:44,720 --> 01:16:49,160 That really hasn't come up as an idea or an opportunity 1149 01:16:49,160 --> 01:16:51,400 with like a third party company that comes in 1150 01:16:51,400 --> 01:16:52,680 and just operates it. 1151 01:16:52,680 --> 01:16:56,000 We have explored with potentially DISD 1152 01:16:56,000 --> 01:17:01,000 continuing that partnership, UNT possibly bringing, 1153 01:17:01,000 --> 01:17:03,080 doing some type of joint venture with them, 1154 01:17:03,080 --> 01:17:06,080 PWU possibility, there's economy of scale there, right? 1155 01:17:06,080 --> 01:17:07,920 So we put in a little, they put in a little, 1156 01:17:07,920 --> 01:17:12,000 we get a bigger, better product for the community to use 1157 01:17:12,000 --> 01:17:12,840 and then their use. 1158 01:17:12,840 --> 01:17:15,600 Again, we have to balance what that funding looks like 1159 01:17:15,600 --> 01:17:17,960 and then also make sure that it works for our use 1160 01:17:17,960 --> 01:17:19,880 to speak to your point that we're not locked into something 1161 01:17:19,880 --> 01:17:23,360 for 50 years, we're not anticipating the growth later. 1162 01:17:23,360 --> 01:17:26,360 As far as the cost recovery elements, 1163 01:17:26,360 --> 01:17:29,920 so that was the addition of the concession stand in 2019 1164 01:17:29,920 --> 01:17:33,040 per cap is how much we try to get each person to spend 1165 01:17:33,040 --> 01:17:33,960 while they're in the water park. 1166 01:17:33,960 --> 01:17:36,240 Now you don't have to, you can come to the water park, 1167 01:17:36,240 --> 01:17:39,160 you have your membership, which is a great deal, 1168 01:17:39,160 --> 01:17:40,760 you scan that every time you come in, 1169 01:17:40,760 --> 01:17:43,840 you bring your own food for your $5 cooler fee, 1170 01:17:43,840 --> 01:17:46,960 you can bring in whatever you want as far as eating stuff 1171 01:17:46,960 --> 01:17:48,840 that you've prepared at home, 1172 01:17:48,840 --> 01:17:50,920 or you can make it a destination 1173 01:17:50,920 --> 01:17:53,560 and that's the people that we try to capitalize on, 1174 01:17:53,560 --> 01:17:56,680 the daily admissions, the people who are gonna be buying 1175 01:17:56,680 --> 01:17:58,960 the nachos and the hamburger. 1176 01:17:58,960 --> 01:18:00,760 We have a great concession stand if you're ever hungry, 1177 01:18:00,760 --> 01:18:02,200 come out and have lunch there, 1178 01:18:02,200 --> 01:18:04,720 but we try to capitalize on that opportunity. 1179 01:18:04,720 --> 01:18:05,560 It's a business, right? 1180 01:18:05,560 --> 01:18:08,040 We wanna offset some of our operating expenses 1181 01:18:08,040 --> 01:18:11,200 through those per cap spending per person. 1182 01:18:11,200 --> 01:18:12,600 We also have after hours rentals, 1183 01:18:12,600 --> 01:18:14,880 so we try to recover some costs that way, 1184 01:18:14,880 --> 01:18:18,960 and then birthday parties, cabana rentals, shade rentals, 1185 01:18:18,960 --> 01:18:20,080 so that sort of thing. 1186 01:18:20,080 --> 01:18:21,480 So those are some of the efforts that we do 1187 01:18:21,480 --> 01:18:23,400 to recover some of the costs. 1188 01:18:23,400 --> 01:18:27,680 - Any other comments, questions? 1189 01:18:27,680 --> 01:18:29,360 Jen. 1190 01:18:31,760 --> 01:18:34,400 - Although a million dollars sounds like a lot of money 1191 01:18:34,400 --> 01:18:38,760 to be losing every year, if you think about it, 1192 01:18:38,760 --> 01:18:43,760 it is a benefit that we offer to our citizens 1193 01:18:43,760 --> 01:18:49,160 to have this water park. 1194 01:18:49,160 --> 01:18:50,720 So how do you not lose money? 1195 01:18:50,720 --> 01:18:53,320 You increase the fees that you charge 1196 01:18:53,320 --> 01:18:55,080 or you run more efficiently, 1197 01:18:55,080 --> 01:19:01,120 but we also want to be inclusive of our community 1198 01:19:01,120 --> 01:19:04,240 so that you can afford to have this luxury 1199 01:19:04,240 --> 01:19:07,560 and this benefit to us all. 1200 01:19:07,560 --> 01:19:10,560 We don't charge people to go into our parks. 1201 01:19:10,560 --> 01:19:14,240 We don't charge admission at Eureka. 1202 01:19:14,240 --> 01:19:19,240 We don't charge people to have a fire station, 1203 01:19:19,240 --> 01:19:20,200 and it costs money. 1204 01:19:20,200 --> 01:19:22,520 It may lose a million dollars a year too. 1205 01:19:22,520 --> 01:19:25,480 So I'm just saying that even though that sounds like that, 1206 01:19:25,480 --> 01:19:27,120 it could be a budgeted loss. 1207 01:19:27,120 --> 01:19:29,600 It's something we're offering to our citizens. 1208 01:19:31,920 --> 01:19:34,400 - I suggested to change the term into investment 1209 01:19:34,400 --> 01:19:36,920 instead of deficit as a way of thinking about it. 1210 01:19:36,920 --> 01:19:43,320 Any other questions or comments? 1211 01:19:43,320 --> 01:19:46,920 Okay, we've got a packed agenda, so we're gonna move on. 1212 01:19:46,920 --> 01:19:51,920 And I think the next discussion is Ningo and Riddell, correct? 1213 01:19:51,920 --> 01:19:55,440 And the Quiet Zones, we're packing them together, okay. 1214 01:20:01,120 --> 01:20:04,120 (people chattering) 1215 01:20:04,120 --> 01:20:10,800 - All right, good evening, everyone. 1216 01:20:10,800 --> 01:20:11,960 My name is Trevor Crane. 1217 01:20:11,960 --> 01:20:13,640 I'm the Director of Capital Projects 1218 01:20:13,640 --> 01:20:15,000 here at the City of Denton. 1219 01:20:15,000 --> 01:20:17,240 I want to introduce a couple of other people 1220 01:20:17,240 --> 01:20:19,240 I have here with me tonight to help me with questions 1221 01:20:19,240 --> 01:20:21,160 if I can't handle them. 1222 01:20:21,160 --> 01:20:22,360 I have Ms. Becky Devaney. 1223 01:20:22,360 --> 01:20:25,560 She's our City Engineer and General Manager of Public Works. 1224 01:20:25,560 --> 01:20:26,800 Also have Seth Garcia. 1225 01:20:26,800 --> 01:20:29,280 He's a Program Manager on my team. 1226 01:20:29,280 --> 01:20:31,160 And then I also have Mike Linder in the back. 1227 01:20:31,160 --> 01:20:33,840 He is our Drainage Manager, 1228 01:20:33,840 --> 01:20:36,200 Drainage Engineer on our team as well. 1229 01:20:36,200 --> 01:20:39,600 So y'all are stuck with me for the next three presentations. 1230 01:20:39,600 --> 01:20:40,680 So let's get started. 1231 01:20:40,680 --> 01:20:44,000 So tonight I'm gonna start off with our 1232 01:20:44,000 --> 01:20:46,960 Ningo, Riddell, and Quiet Zone projects. 1233 01:20:46,960 --> 01:20:49,320 So just a little project history. 1234 01:20:49,320 --> 01:20:51,880 The Quiet Zones and Riddell extension 1235 01:20:51,880 --> 01:20:54,760 were included in the 2014 bond. 1236 01:20:54,760 --> 01:20:56,840 Both projects were insufficiently funded. 1237 01:20:56,840 --> 01:20:59,400 So as we kind of started digging into those projects, 1238 01:20:59,400 --> 01:21:01,440 we discovered that they were gonna cost a lot more 1239 01:21:01,440 --> 01:21:04,960 to build them than what was allocated in those bonds. 1240 01:21:04,960 --> 01:21:07,200 So we did ask the Bond Oversight Committee 1241 01:21:07,200 --> 01:21:12,560 to remove those from the bond on May 20th, 2022. 1242 01:21:12,560 --> 01:21:16,840 That request was approved and they asked us 1243 01:21:16,840 --> 01:21:19,880 to bring those back in the 2023 bond, 1244 01:21:19,880 --> 01:21:21,240 which we're doing tonight. 1245 01:21:21,240 --> 01:21:24,640 So the current roadway out here, 1246 01:21:24,640 --> 01:21:27,080 you can see some pictures of what it currently looks like 1247 01:21:27,080 --> 01:21:27,920 out there. 1248 01:21:27,920 --> 01:21:29,800 It's a two-lane, undivided roadway, 1249 01:21:29,800 --> 01:21:31,920 no underground drainage system, 1250 01:21:31,920 --> 01:21:35,200 no pedestrian or biking facilities are out there, 1251 01:21:35,200 --> 01:21:36,840 limited right of way. 1252 01:21:36,840 --> 01:21:40,440 There's also six at-grade UPRR crossings, 1253 01:21:40,440 --> 01:21:41,760 limited street lighting, 1254 01:21:41,760 --> 01:21:44,200 limited and aging utility infrastructure. 1255 01:21:44,200 --> 01:21:46,800 It's also, like I just mentioned, 1256 01:21:46,800 --> 01:21:49,200 not a Union Pacific Quiet Zone, 1257 01:21:49,200 --> 01:21:51,120 which means the train has to blow its horn 1258 01:21:51,120 --> 01:21:53,680 every time it comes through one of those crossings. 1259 01:21:53,680 --> 01:21:55,160 And then, as I stated earlier, 1260 01:21:55,160 --> 01:21:56,840 there were portions of this project 1261 01:21:56,840 --> 01:21:59,080 that were included in the 2014 bond program. 1262 01:21:59,080 --> 01:22:02,360 So we have some pictures here. 1263 01:22:02,360 --> 01:22:05,480 This would be our proposed roadway cross-section. 1264 01:22:05,480 --> 01:22:06,600 And you can see an example 1265 01:22:06,600 --> 01:22:09,080 of what that side path and trail would look like. 1266 01:22:09,080 --> 01:22:10,920 I do wanna just reiterate 1267 01:22:10,920 --> 01:22:13,120 that this is a proposed cross-section. 1268 01:22:13,120 --> 01:22:15,680 Best case scenario, if we were able to fit everything, 1269 01:22:15,680 --> 01:22:17,360 this is what we would propose 1270 01:22:17,360 --> 01:22:20,080 and it would line up with our mobility plan. 1271 01:22:20,080 --> 01:22:22,840 As I mentioned, the real estate is pretty tight out there. 1272 01:22:22,840 --> 01:22:25,160 There's a railroad on one side. 1273 01:22:25,160 --> 01:22:26,880 If anyone's ever had to deal with the railroad, 1274 01:22:26,880 --> 01:22:29,240 they're pretty finicky about their property 1275 01:22:29,240 --> 01:22:31,880 and what you can put near their railroads. 1276 01:22:31,880 --> 01:22:33,720 And then, of course, TW's on the other side. 1277 01:22:33,720 --> 01:22:36,600 So that right of way would be evaluated 1278 01:22:36,600 --> 01:22:40,080 if this project was approved as we went through design. 1279 01:22:40,080 --> 01:22:43,000 So we would propose a three-lane roadway. 1280 01:22:43,000 --> 01:22:46,240 It'd be one lane east and west with a dedicated turn lane, 1281 01:22:46,240 --> 01:22:48,560 bike and pedestrian infrastructure, 1282 01:22:48,560 --> 01:22:51,360 installation of a drainage system, street lighting, 1283 01:22:51,360 --> 01:22:53,320 replacing of any aging utilities 1284 01:22:53,320 --> 01:22:55,240 that are currently out there. 1285 01:22:55,240 --> 01:22:56,560 This would bring us into alignment 1286 01:22:56,560 --> 01:22:58,880 with our 2022 mobility plan 1287 01:22:58,880 --> 01:23:02,280 and also into alignment with our 2022 Parks, Recreation, 1288 01:23:02,280 --> 01:23:04,160 and Trails system master plan. 1289 01:23:04,160 --> 01:23:08,240 So the Rudel portion of this street, 1290 01:23:08,240 --> 01:23:10,560 we would propose something pretty similar 1291 01:23:10,560 --> 01:23:13,440 except you see some parking lane there. 1292 01:23:13,440 --> 01:23:15,800 It would also be a one lane east and west 1293 01:23:15,800 --> 01:23:17,400 with a center turn lane. 1294 01:23:17,400 --> 01:23:20,920 It would include a new alignment of the crossing at Mingo. 1295 01:23:21,800 --> 01:23:23,560 And it would include closures 1296 01:23:23,560 --> 01:23:27,320 of the Willis and Pertain Street railroad crossings. 1297 01:23:27,320 --> 01:23:30,160 We would propose installing bike 1298 01:23:30,160 --> 01:23:32,840 and pedestrian infrastructure, street lighting, 1299 01:23:32,840 --> 01:23:34,560 replacement of any aging facilities 1300 01:23:34,560 --> 01:23:36,120 that are currently out there. 1301 01:23:36,120 --> 01:23:37,800 And this would also bring us into alignment 1302 01:23:37,800 --> 01:23:40,260 with our 2022 mobility plan. 1303 01:23:40,260 --> 01:23:45,960 This is the Rudel Street extension portion of the project. 1304 01:23:45,960 --> 01:23:48,120 So this is what I just mentioned, 1305 01:23:48,120 --> 01:23:51,520 that new alignment of the crossing at UPRR. 1306 01:23:51,520 --> 01:23:54,400 It would include a new traffic signal at Mingo and Rudel, 1307 01:23:54,400 --> 01:23:58,320 bike and pedestrian infrastructure crossing that UPRR, 1308 01:23:58,320 --> 01:23:59,760 railroad crossing. 1309 01:23:59,760 --> 01:24:01,200 It would include street lighting. 1310 01:24:01,200 --> 01:24:03,000 And then once again, bring us into alignment 1311 01:24:03,000 --> 01:24:05,160 with our 2022 master plan. 1312 01:24:05,160 --> 01:24:07,000 Oh, I'm sorry, mobility plan update. 1313 01:24:07,000 --> 01:24:10,520 And the Mingo Quiet Zone. 1314 01:24:10,520 --> 01:24:14,320 So this would include the Quiet Zone implementation 1315 01:24:14,320 --> 01:24:19,320 of the crossings on Mingo from Mockingbird to Frame Street. 1316 01:24:19,320 --> 01:24:25,040 So depending on each Quiet Zone or each crossing, 1317 01:24:25,040 --> 01:24:26,760 it depends on what you have to install 1318 01:24:26,760 --> 01:24:27,960 to make those Quiet Zones. 1319 01:24:27,960 --> 01:24:30,860 So each of those crossings would be evaluated. 1320 01:24:30,860 --> 01:24:33,280 It could be anything from new lights, gates, 1321 01:24:33,280 --> 01:24:36,120 raised medians, traffic signal preemption. 1322 01:24:36,120 --> 01:24:37,560 And then it would also include bike 1323 01:24:37,560 --> 01:24:40,360 and pedestrian infrastructure crossing that railroad. 1324 01:24:43,040 --> 01:24:45,360 So just the project benefits summarized. 1325 01:24:45,360 --> 01:24:47,480 This would be increased safety for vehicular, 1326 01:24:47,480 --> 01:24:49,480 bicycle and pedestrian traffic. 1327 01:24:49,480 --> 01:24:52,440 Provides walkability from Texas Women's University, 1328 01:24:52,440 --> 01:24:54,960 downtown city of Denton, DCTA, 1329 01:24:54,960 --> 01:24:57,200 and nearby residential properties. 1330 01:24:57,200 --> 01:24:59,600 This would bring the area into Quiet Zone compliance, 1331 01:24:59,600 --> 01:25:01,760 meaning the train would no longer be required 1332 01:25:01,760 --> 01:25:04,440 to blow its whistle at those crossings. 1333 01:25:04,440 --> 01:25:05,760 And then it would also remove 1334 01:25:05,760 --> 01:25:09,560 and or realign dangerous UPRR crossings. 1335 01:25:09,560 --> 01:25:11,480 And then I'm gonna have, 1336 01:25:11,480 --> 01:25:13,840 we have a short video here about this project. 1337 01:25:13,840 --> 01:25:15,720 And I will just mention that second link 1338 01:25:15,720 --> 01:25:16,960 is to our mobility plan. 1339 01:25:16,960 --> 01:25:18,360 If anybody wants to go in there, 1340 01:25:18,360 --> 01:25:20,440 it's very big, so we didn't wanna print it out for you, 1341 01:25:20,440 --> 01:25:22,340 but you are able to access it there. 1342 01:25:22,340 --> 01:25:33,480 - Rudel, Mingo and Quiet Zones 1343 01:25:33,480 --> 01:25:36,000 is a combination of three separate projects. 1344 01:25:36,000 --> 01:25:40,640 The Mingo portion proposes constructing 1345 01:25:40,640 --> 01:25:42,400 a three-lane roadway with bike 1346 01:25:42,400 --> 01:25:44,280 and pedestrian infrastructure, 1347 01:25:44,280 --> 01:25:46,640 adding street lighting and a drainage system, 1348 01:25:46,640 --> 01:25:48,700 while also bringing this road into alignment 1349 01:25:48,700 --> 01:25:51,400 with both the 2022 Mobility Plan 1350 01:25:51,400 --> 01:25:53,560 and the 2022 Parks and Recreation 1351 01:25:53,560 --> 01:25:55,280 and Trail System Master Plan. 1352 01:26:11,280 --> 01:26:13,600 The Rudel portion proposes construction 1353 01:26:13,600 --> 01:26:15,160 of a three-lane roadway, 1354 01:26:15,160 --> 01:26:17,240 adding bike and pedestrian infrastructure 1355 01:26:17,240 --> 01:26:20,040 with street lighting and establishing a new alignment 1356 01:26:20,040 --> 01:26:22,400 of the Union Pacific Railroad crossing. 1357 01:26:22,400 --> 01:26:25,920 This work is in alignment with the 2022 Mobility Plan. 1358 01:26:25,920 --> 01:26:39,920 And the Mingo Quiet Zones portion of the project 1359 01:26:39,920 --> 01:26:42,960 allows for the installation of necessary safety measures 1360 01:26:42,960 --> 01:26:45,080 that would create a Union Pacific Railroad 1361 01:26:45,080 --> 01:26:46,440 Quiet Zone in this area. 1362 01:27:10,360 --> 01:27:13,360 - So we do have some estimated costs here. 1363 01:27:13,360 --> 01:27:17,320 This project cost did not include any design costs, 1364 01:27:17,320 --> 01:27:19,920 so of course, that would be added to the numbers 1365 01:27:19,920 --> 01:27:21,960 that you will see in the next meeting. 1366 01:27:21,960 --> 01:27:23,360 We will provide some updated costs 1367 01:27:23,360 --> 01:27:25,200 that will include everything. 1368 01:27:25,200 --> 01:27:27,880 But this does include the construction costs 1369 01:27:27,880 --> 01:27:30,680 that were estimated in January of 2023, 1370 01:27:30,680 --> 01:27:33,560 which of course have gone up between now and then 1371 01:27:33,560 --> 01:27:34,760 just with inflation, 1372 01:27:34,760 --> 01:27:37,880 but we do have some estimated costs here. 1373 01:27:37,880 --> 01:27:40,680 We've gone up between now and then just with inflation. 1374 01:27:40,680 --> 01:27:42,800 And then this does include some of the soft costs, 1375 01:27:42,800 --> 01:27:46,040 which are inspection, project management, permitting, 1376 01:27:46,040 --> 01:27:49,800 working with the railroad as far as those agreements 1377 01:27:49,800 --> 01:27:50,640 and things like that. 1378 01:27:50,640 --> 01:27:54,440 So I will tell you, this number will go up 1379 01:27:54,440 --> 01:27:56,840 between now and the time you see it next week. 1380 01:27:56,840 --> 01:28:01,200 And I'll stand for any questions. 1381 01:28:01,200 --> 01:28:04,560 - All right, questions on this project, right off the bat. 1382 01:28:06,720 --> 01:28:09,960 - I guess my question is on the right of way. 1383 01:28:09,960 --> 01:28:12,560 How much of that do we have to acquire 1384 01:28:12,560 --> 01:28:14,840 to finish this or do this project? 1385 01:28:14,840 --> 01:28:17,400 - Sure, so the ultimate cross section 1386 01:28:17,400 --> 01:28:22,400 for what that road is labeled as is 110 feet. 1387 01:28:22,400 --> 01:28:25,080 We're not gonna be able to get 110 feet 1388 01:28:25,080 --> 01:28:27,800 without damaging out a lot of houses, 1389 01:28:27,800 --> 01:28:30,400 some apartment complexes, things like that. 1390 01:28:30,400 --> 01:28:32,680 The goal would be to get to 90 feet 1391 01:28:32,680 --> 01:28:34,120 is what we think we can get to. 1392 01:28:34,120 --> 01:28:37,120 Of course, we would coordinate that with our planning department. 1393 01:28:37,120 --> 01:28:41,240 I don't know exactly how much we need currently, 1394 01:28:41,240 --> 01:28:44,880 but that would be the goal, would be to get to the 90 feet. 1395 01:28:44,880 --> 01:28:47,000 That would allow us to install the roadway 1396 01:28:47,000 --> 01:28:48,920 that we've talked about. 1397 01:28:48,920 --> 01:28:52,480 The sidewalk on the goal would be a continuous sidewalk 1398 01:28:52,480 --> 01:28:57,480 on the north side of Mingo with some sidewalk on the south 1399 01:28:57,480 --> 01:29:00,040 that would feed people to safe crossings 1400 01:29:00,040 --> 01:29:02,080 like at intersections and things like that, 1401 01:29:02,080 --> 01:29:04,320 cross to the larger side path on the north side 1402 01:29:04,320 --> 01:29:07,240 and then continue everybody down into the downtown 1403 01:29:07,240 --> 01:29:08,960 and Texas women's. 1404 01:29:08,960 --> 01:29:17,520 - Okay, great. 1405 01:29:17,520 --> 01:29:24,840 With the realignment of Rudel and that Willis crossing, 1406 01:29:24,840 --> 01:29:27,920 I believe that that's gonna be going into city property 1407 01:29:27,920 --> 01:29:29,800 on the other side of Mingo. 1408 01:29:29,800 --> 01:29:33,640 What is the kind of market value for that property? 1409 01:29:33,640 --> 01:29:36,920 - I don't know the answer to that question. 1410 01:29:36,920 --> 01:29:39,760 So we are considering that property, the service center, 1411 01:29:39,760 --> 01:29:41,880 that's where the service center is currently located. 1412 01:29:41,880 --> 01:29:46,040 We are currently looking at renovating the service center 1413 01:29:46,040 --> 01:29:48,960 and maybe moving that building around on that property. 1414 01:29:48,960 --> 01:29:50,600 So of course, those would be conversations 1415 01:29:50,600 --> 01:29:53,160 and we would coordinate those projects between this one 1416 01:29:53,160 --> 01:29:55,000 and what that one looks like to make sure 1417 01:29:55,000 --> 01:29:57,560 that we're using that property to the best of its ability, 1418 01:29:57,560 --> 01:29:59,320 I mean, the best of its use. 1419 01:29:59,320 --> 01:30:02,040 I don't know what the property values are out there, 1420 01:30:02,040 --> 01:30:04,000 so we can definitely come back with that. 1421 01:30:04,000 --> 01:30:08,840 - So on the map, I saw the Quiet Zone map 1422 01:30:08,840 --> 01:30:11,640 was from Frame to Mockingbird, 1423 01:30:11,640 --> 01:30:15,240 but the Mingo, two lanes with a turn lane, 1424 01:30:15,240 --> 01:30:18,200 expansion of Mingo, what's the extent of that 1425 01:30:18,200 --> 01:30:19,960 and what happens at either end? 1426 01:30:19,960 --> 01:30:23,200 We've got Bell Street and the way it comes into Bell, 1427 01:30:23,200 --> 01:30:25,320 you just kind of got a neck down right there 1428 01:30:25,320 --> 01:30:28,680 and what's the plan for how that expanded Mingo 1429 01:30:28,680 --> 01:30:30,440 interacts on both ends? 1430 01:30:30,440 --> 01:30:34,680 And my next question is, is there any other funding 1431 01:30:34,680 --> 01:30:36,960 identified or funding that we're going for 1432 01:30:36,960 --> 01:30:38,240 for this particular project? 1433 01:30:38,240 --> 01:30:40,200 Does it qualify for any kind of regional funding 1434 01:30:40,200 --> 01:30:41,040 or anything like that? 1435 01:30:41,040 --> 01:30:44,160 Or is this just a Denton project that we've gotta get done 1436 01:30:44,160 --> 01:30:46,480 with as many bond dollars as we can 1437 01:30:46,480 --> 01:30:49,080 because costs go up every single year? 1438 01:30:49,080 --> 01:30:51,680 - Right, so I'll answer the second one first. 1439 01:30:51,680 --> 01:30:53,680 This is the City of Denton project. 1440 01:30:53,680 --> 01:30:55,400 We've looked at some other, 1441 01:30:55,400 --> 01:30:57,760 or we're always looking for funding, 1442 01:30:57,760 --> 01:31:00,320 reaching out to TxDOT, COG, 1443 01:31:00,320 --> 01:31:02,520 trying to identify other places. 1444 01:31:02,520 --> 01:31:04,440 This project does not qualify for any of that. 1445 01:31:04,440 --> 01:31:08,200 So this would be specifically a City of Denton project. 1446 01:31:08,200 --> 01:31:12,760 And really it's kind of a main corridor getting down, 1447 01:31:12,760 --> 01:31:15,480 especially for walkability, trying to get everyone in, 1448 01:31:15,480 --> 01:31:18,520 down into downtown, back out to Texas Women's. 1449 01:31:18,520 --> 01:31:20,600 So that's why we identified this area 1450 01:31:20,600 --> 01:31:24,360 as a need for a major project like this. 1451 01:31:24,360 --> 01:31:27,560 As far as either end, there are conversations 1452 01:31:27,560 --> 01:31:29,520 about projects for either end. 1453 01:31:29,520 --> 01:31:31,480 They're not anywhere close to, 1454 01:31:31,480 --> 01:31:36,280 I would say even initiation planning at this point. 1455 01:31:36,280 --> 01:31:38,320 Of course, that would be something we would need to, 1456 01:31:38,320 --> 01:31:40,960 the City would have to look at 1457 01:31:40,960 --> 01:31:45,080 and do analysis on to determine if those are project needs. 1458 01:31:45,080 --> 01:31:46,400 - Just frame to Mockingbird, 1459 01:31:46,400 --> 01:31:47,240 that's all we're talking about? 1460 01:31:47,240 --> 01:31:48,080 - For this project. 1461 01:31:48,080 --> 01:31:52,680 - Oh wait, I'm sorry, back there. 1462 01:31:55,560 --> 01:32:00,560 - First of all, it's a accepted fact that sooner or later, 1463 01:32:00,560 --> 01:32:05,480 Bell Avenue will be closed as a through street 1464 01:32:05,480 --> 01:32:06,920 to University Drive. 1465 01:32:06,920 --> 01:32:12,360 - There has been talks about that back and forth with TWU. 1466 01:32:12,360 --> 01:32:14,640 At this point, we're still coordinating with TWU 1467 01:32:14,640 --> 01:32:16,160 about what that looks like. 1468 01:32:16,160 --> 01:32:18,320 At this point, that is not the direction 1469 01:32:18,320 --> 01:32:19,160 that we've been told. 1470 01:32:19,160 --> 01:32:21,560 We're working on different ideas, 1471 01:32:21,560 --> 01:32:24,040 especially to increase that walkability 1472 01:32:25,040 --> 01:32:29,760 and yeah, so I would say that's not necessarily the case. 1473 01:32:29,760 --> 01:32:33,640 - Well, assuming it is the case because it's gonna happen. 1474 01:32:33,640 --> 01:32:39,160 And that's one of our major north-south ways 1475 01:32:39,160 --> 01:32:40,840 to get across town. 1476 01:32:40,840 --> 01:32:43,640 And what you're proposing for Mingo, 1477 01:32:43,640 --> 01:32:47,080 even with this incredible cost and all, 1478 01:32:47,080 --> 01:32:49,680 will not replace Bell Avenue, 1479 01:32:49,680 --> 01:32:54,680 let alone provide any additional capacity for cars 1480 01:32:54,800 --> 01:32:56,720 to get across north-south. 1481 01:32:56,720 --> 01:33:00,520 It seems not good planning to me. 1482 01:33:00,520 --> 01:33:04,960 - I can't speak to the planning. 1483 01:33:04,960 --> 01:33:07,040 All I can tell you is that at this point, 1484 01:33:07,040 --> 01:33:12,040 there are no plans to close Bell north-south 1485 01:33:12,040 --> 01:33:17,120 and this project is specifically for this scope. 1486 01:33:17,120 --> 01:33:21,480 - Well, it's already down to one lane each way 1487 01:33:21,480 --> 01:33:26,480 and 20 miles an hour, it's not a viable north-south artery. 1488 01:33:26,480 --> 01:33:30,400 And we need one, but all this money we're talking about 1489 01:33:30,400 --> 01:33:35,400 spending on Mingo and Rudel doesn't do it. 1490 01:33:35,400 --> 01:33:39,800 That's not, going out with one lane going 1491 01:33:39,800 --> 01:33:44,800 and one lane coming in and a turn lane is insufficient. 1492 01:33:44,800 --> 01:33:49,640 - Yes, ma'am, I understand. 1493 01:33:49,640 --> 01:33:51,760 With the limited right-of-way that's out there, 1494 01:33:51,760 --> 01:33:53,760 this would be the best case scenario 1495 01:33:53,760 --> 01:33:56,320 for improving the infrastructure out there 1496 01:33:56,320 --> 01:33:59,680 and providing that east-west connectability. 1497 01:33:59,680 --> 01:34:02,800 - I just think when we're talking 1498 01:34:02,800 --> 01:34:05,120 about that amount of money, 1499 01:34:05,120 --> 01:34:07,080 we should be getting something more. 1500 01:34:07,080 --> 01:34:10,200 - Got another question up here. 1501 01:34:10,200 --> 01:34:11,120 - Two quick questions. 1502 01:34:11,120 --> 01:34:14,000 The first on the example of the cross-section 1503 01:34:14,000 --> 01:34:16,560 of the roadway for the Rudel Street project, 1504 01:34:16,560 --> 01:34:19,440 it shows a little bit of plants that are included. 1505 01:34:19,440 --> 01:34:22,000 Is there an opportunity to include green infrastructure 1506 01:34:22,000 --> 01:34:24,560 or street trees as part of that project? 1507 01:34:24,560 --> 01:34:27,160 And then my second question, 1508 01:34:27,160 --> 01:34:29,640 with the overall project as a whole, 1509 01:34:29,640 --> 01:34:32,600 looking at the multimodal transportation pieces of it 1510 01:34:32,600 --> 01:34:34,880 where it's including your bike and pedestrian 1511 01:34:34,880 --> 01:34:37,120 and car ability to navigate, 1512 01:34:37,120 --> 01:34:39,420 have you investigated any sort of grant funding 1513 01:34:39,420 --> 01:34:42,920 that would support a complete streets design for the area? 1514 01:34:42,920 --> 01:34:47,920 - So the cross-section, I built this on an app 1515 01:34:48,040 --> 01:34:51,240 so I wanted to make it pretty and put some plants on there, 1516 01:34:51,240 --> 01:34:53,800 but I will tell you that those are absolutely ideas 1517 01:34:53,800 --> 01:34:58,080 that will be entertained during that design process. 1518 01:34:58,080 --> 01:35:00,240 Once we determine what that full right-of-way is, 1519 01:35:00,240 --> 01:35:03,000 we have community meetings at the beginning of projects, 1520 01:35:03,000 --> 01:35:04,360 halfway through design, 1521 01:35:04,360 --> 01:35:06,000 and so we wanna bring the public in 1522 01:35:06,000 --> 01:35:07,160 and hear what they have to say 1523 01:35:07,160 --> 01:35:09,160 and what's really important, 1524 01:35:09,160 --> 01:35:11,600 and anything that we can fit in into that design 1525 01:35:11,600 --> 01:35:15,000 that makes sense, then of course we wanna do that. 1526 01:35:15,000 --> 01:35:18,200 - As far as the second question, 1527 01:35:18,200 --> 01:35:19,880 so like I mentioned earlier, 1528 01:35:19,880 --> 01:35:21,800 we're always looking for grants. 1529 01:35:21,800 --> 01:35:24,160 We do trip, we apply for trip funding, 1530 01:35:24,160 --> 01:35:25,680 which is something we use, 1531 01:35:25,680 --> 01:35:29,720 so anything that we haven't looked at them specific for this, 1532 01:35:29,720 --> 01:35:31,800 but that of course will be something that we're looking at 1533 01:35:31,800 --> 01:35:33,320 as we're moving through those processes 1534 01:35:33,320 --> 01:35:36,120 and determining where we can pull in money from anywhere. 1535 01:35:36,120 --> 01:35:39,600 - I got a couple. 1536 01:35:39,600 --> 01:35:42,680 So you mentioned this was in the quiet zones 1537 01:35:42,680 --> 01:35:45,960 from the 2014 bond, and there was a shortfall. 1538 01:35:45,960 --> 01:35:50,560 How much money were we short on the quiet zones? 1539 01:35:50,560 --> 01:35:52,240 - About $9 million. 1540 01:35:52,240 --> 01:35:54,240 - And how much was allocated? 1541 01:35:54,240 --> 01:35:56,320 - About $900,000. 1542 01:35:56,320 --> 01:35:57,880 - So we had... 1543 01:35:57,880 --> 01:36:00,880 (audience laughing) 1544 01:36:00,880 --> 01:36:04,480 It sounds like one of my estimators did that. 1545 01:36:04,480 --> 01:36:08,280 - The $10 million that it's gonna cost 1546 01:36:08,280 --> 01:36:09,880 about to do the quiet zones this time, 1547 01:36:09,880 --> 01:36:10,720 it's actually a little less, 1548 01:36:10,720 --> 01:36:12,520 just with economies of scale. 1549 01:36:12,520 --> 01:36:15,920 If we include it with this project, that's today's dollars, 1550 01:36:15,920 --> 01:36:20,640 but the $900,000 wouldn't get us one quiet zone compliance. 1551 01:36:20,640 --> 01:36:24,680 - So that money has already been spent on something else? 1552 01:36:24,680 --> 01:36:26,200 I'm guessing. - Yes. 1553 01:36:26,200 --> 01:36:27,800 - Okay, my next question. 1554 01:36:27,800 --> 01:36:31,840 Do we know what the traffic counts are on Mingo? 1555 01:36:31,840 --> 01:36:33,920 - I don't think we've done 1556 01:36:33,920 --> 01:36:36,000 any of the traffic analysis yet. 1557 01:36:36,000 --> 01:36:36,840 Did we do anything? 1558 01:36:36,840 --> 01:36:38,720 We haven't done that yet. 1559 01:36:38,720 --> 01:36:41,920 Those would be something that we would do, 1560 01:36:41,920 --> 01:36:43,760 especially for that signal 1561 01:36:43,760 --> 01:36:46,760 that's gonna happen right there at Mingo and Rudel. 1562 01:36:46,760 --> 01:36:48,280 We know that those traffic counts 1563 01:36:48,280 --> 01:36:50,160 are going to get there here in the near future. 1564 01:36:50,160 --> 01:36:52,800 I don't think it's warranted for that traffic signal yet, 1565 01:36:52,800 --> 01:36:56,120 but it makes sense to incorporate that into this design now, 1566 01:36:56,120 --> 01:36:58,840 get it built so that we're not having to come back 1567 01:36:58,840 --> 01:37:02,000 in a year or two when the traffic warrants that signal 1568 01:37:02,000 --> 01:37:04,240 and getting that installed now. 1569 01:37:04,240 --> 01:37:07,560 - So I have a comment before my question. 1570 01:37:07,560 --> 01:37:08,960 I hope I don't get in trouble. 1571 01:37:08,960 --> 01:37:12,120 I was on another committee like this, 1572 01:37:12,120 --> 01:37:15,640 and a lot of the talk was about bike lanes. 1573 01:37:15,640 --> 01:37:17,440 And then our bike lanes that got built 1574 01:37:17,440 --> 01:37:18,680 were a bunch of small sections 1575 01:37:18,680 --> 01:37:20,800 that didn't connect to other things, 1576 01:37:20,800 --> 01:37:22,880 which actually I think ended up being more dangerous, 1577 01:37:22,880 --> 01:37:25,760 because kids take off on a bike lane, then it ends. 1578 01:37:25,760 --> 01:37:30,760 So curious, I know we don't have traffic counts for Mingo, 1579 01:37:30,760 --> 01:37:32,920 but like we're proposing a 10-foot, 1580 01:37:32,920 --> 01:37:35,080 we got bike lanes and a 10-foot pedestrian lane 1581 01:37:35,080 --> 01:37:40,080 on one side, and I think it's set on there 15,000 people 1582 01:37:40,080 --> 01:37:45,040 per day, and so as I look at Mingo and Rudel, 1583 01:37:45,040 --> 01:37:48,240 I'm curious, are we expecting significantly 1584 01:37:48,240 --> 01:37:50,400 more development to happen in these areas 1585 01:37:50,400 --> 01:37:55,400 to create that much demand for pedestrians? 1586 01:37:55,400 --> 01:37:58,000 'Cause when I look at this land over here, 1587 01:37:58,000 --> 01:38:01,320 it doesn't seem like there's much left to be developed. 1588 01:38:01,320 --> 01:38:04,520 So I'm curious, I mean, I personally have a problem 1589 01:38:04,520 --> 01:38:07,960 with this kind of price tag on a section of road 1590 01:38:07,960 --> 01:38:12,120 like this one, and I'm honestly trying to justify it 1591 01:38:12,120 --> 01:38:15,560 in my mind, 'cause our vehicular lanes don't change. 1592 01:38:15,560 --> 01:38:19,920 And then my last question was, 1593 01:38:19,920 --> 01:38:22,560 if we don't know what the projected pedestrian 1594 01:38:22,560 --> 01:38:24,360 and bicycle traffic would be 1595 01:38:24,360 --> 01:38:27,760 or what the vehicular traffic is, 1596 01:38:27,760 --> 01:38:31,120 it seems to me like it comes back to the quiet zones, 1597 01:38:31,120 --> 01:38:33,760 and so I don't know if we have an analysis 1598 01:38:33,760 --> 01:38:37,080 of how many people sleep within a certain distance 1599 01:38:37,080 --> 01:38:40,120 of where these horns blow, and if we're projecting 1600 01:38:40,120 --> 01:38:43,080 that there's gonna be more, I mean, if you're already there, 1601 01:38:43,080 --> 01:38:45,280 I know it sucks, I live right next to one myself, 1602 01:38:45,280 --> 01:38:49,160 and we just kinda get used to it, and the horns blow. 1603 01:38:49,160 --> 01:38:50,920 But this is a pretty big price tag, 1604 01:38:50,920 --> 01:38:53,760 so I'm curious if we're expecting more growth 1605 01:38:53,760 --> 01:38:56,200 to happen in this area that's gonna create 1606 01:38:56,200 --> 01:38:58,760 all this new demand for these roadways. 1607 01:38:58,760 --> 01:39:00,320 Thank you. 1608 01:39:00,320 --> 01:39:03,960 - Yeah, so I would say as far as the quiet zone, 1609 01:39:03,960 --> 01:39:06,880 so going back to that, that has been a major push 1610 01:39:06,880 --> 01:39:11,040 in the, I'll say the last year, making all of those, 1611 01:39:11,040 --> 01:39:15,200 whether it's DCTA or UPRR, quiet zone compliant. 1612 01:39:15,200 --> 01:39:18,360 So it's been a council priority to make that happen. 1613 01:39:18,360 --> 01:39:21,640 This section, and I think we have a couple projects 1614 01:39:21,640 --> 01:39:25,200 currently underway that are making some of those areas 1615 01:39:25,200 --> 01:39:26,560 quiet zone compliant. 1616 01:39:26,560 --> 01:39:28,960 This section, and there's one more that we just applied 1617 01:39:28,960 --> 01:39:33,120 for trip funding to make those quiet zone compliant as well. 1618 01:39:33,120 --> 01:39:35,240 As far as development in that area, 1619 01:39:35,240 --> 01:39:38,680 I'm not sure about the answer to that question. 1620 01:39:38,680 --> 01:39:40,200 And then going back to the bike lane, 1621 01:39:40,200 --> 01:39:42,880 so just remember that this is a proposed right-of-way, 1622 01:39:42,880 --> 01:39:45,480 and it's really going to be dictated by how much, 1623 01:39:45,480 --> 01:39:48,040 or a proposed cross-section, and it would be dictated 1624 01:39:48,040 --> 01:39:50,520 by how much right-of-way that we can get. 1625 01:39:50,520 --> 01:39:53,520 A lot of places, we're installing a 10 or 12-foot 1626 01:39:53,520 --> 01:39:58,000 mixed-use path that is also able to have bikes on it. 1627 01:39:58,960 --> 01:40:00,600 Ultimately, that would be something 1628 01:40:00,600 --> 01:40:04,040 that would go through our planning department, 1629 01:40:04,040 --> 01:40:06,040 our planning committee, to determine 1630 01:40:06,040 --> 01:40:07,600 what's necessary out there. 1631 01:40:07,600 --> 01:40:11,240 Bikers tend, well, let me put it this way. 1632 01:40:11,240 --> 01:40:15,220 Serious bikers tend to want to be on the street. 1633 01:40:15,220 --> 01:40:18,200 They want to, they don't want to be on a shared-use path 1634 01:40:18,200 --> 01:40:19,340 with other walkers. 1635 01:40:19,340 --> 01:40:22,440 Now, the kind of the biker that's just out there 1636 01:40:22,440 --> 01:40:24,320 having a good time and kind of riding around, 1637 01:40:24,320 --> 01:40:27,000 they're fine with that 12-foot mixed-use path. 1638 01:40:28,040 --> 01:40:30,680 So that would, of course, that would be determined 1639 01:40:30,680 --> 01:40:34,160 by our planning department, and what would be, 1640 01:40:34,160 --> 01:40:36,320 what we would be able to build out here. 1641 01:40:36,320 --> 01:40:37,840 That's what it looks like. 1642 01:40:37,840 --> 01:40:39,760 - Yes, my question. 1643 01:40:39,760 --> 01:40:41,600 - So I've got a couple of things I wanted to add. 1644 01:40:41,600 --> 01:40:45,400 So to answer your question, Mr. Davis, 1645 01:40:45,400 --> 01:40:48,880 the actual quiet zone is from Mingo Mockingbird 1646 01:40:48,880 --> 01:40:52,120 to Frame Street, but the overall roadway project 1647 01:40:52,120 --> 01:40:55,320 would be from where it turns up and connects to 380, 1648 01:40:55,320 --> 01:40:56,480 and then down into Bell. 1649 01:40:56,480 --> 01:40:58,520 So it would be that full cross-section. 1650 01:40:58,520 --> 01:41:01,400 So just wanted to make sure that you understood that. 1651 01:41:01,400 --> 01:41:03,400 I think the other thing that maybe we're missing 1652 01:41:03,400 --> 01:41:06,240 in the conversation that I want to make sure we add is, 1653 01:41:06,240 --> 01:41:09,000 with Bell Avenue, we're looking at many other options 1654 01:41:09,000 --> 01:41:10,920 besides closing that roadway. 1655 01:41:10,920 --> 01:41:13,220 The reason why the roadway is 20 miles per hour 1656 01:41:13,220 --> 01:41:16,280 is because the city passed a city-wide speed study 1657 01:41:16,280 --> 01:41:19,000 where all university streets are 20 miles per hour, 1658 01:41:19,000 --> 01:41:21,440 and that's a university street. 1659 01:41:21,440 --> 01:41:24,360 We just presented on this just a few weeks ago. 1660 01:41:24,360 --> 01:41:27,080 And the other thing I just wanted to mention is, 1661 01:41:27,080 --> 01:41:29,160 throughout this entire corridor, 1662 01:41:29,160 --> 01:41:32,720 it's our team's goal to try to look at anywhere we can 1663 01:41:32,720 --> 01:41:35,040 to provide that multimodal perspective, 1664 01:41:35,040 --> 01:41:38,060 so the bicycle and the pedestrian routes. 1665 01:41:38,060 --> 01:41:39,760 And there's a substantial project 1666 01:41:39,760 --> 01:41:42,200 that TxDOT's doing out of 380. 1667 01:41:42,200 --> 01:41:44,000 If you drive out east of town, 1668 01:41:44,000 --> 01:41:45,680 you'll see all kinds of sidewalk work 1669 01:41:45,680 --> 01:41:47,440 that's happening out in that area. 1670 01:41:47,440 --> 01:41:48,820 It gets you to the green belt. 1671 01:41:48,820 --> 01:41:51,520 So it's our goal to work with the Parks and Rec Department, 1672 01:41:51,520 --> 01:41:52,900 and that's why we've mentioned 1673 01:41:52,900 --> 01:41:54,680 the Park Central's master plan, 1674 01:41:54,680 --> 01:41:56,880 is to give folks an ability to go from 1675 01:41:56,880 --> 01:42:00,000 the Pecan Creek areas, the areas that are near 1676 01:42:00,000 --> 01:42:03,360 the Louisville Lake, all the way down into town, 1677 01:42:03,360 --> 01:42:06,040 which will also get you into the downtown. 1678 01:42:06,040 --> 01:42:07,560 The other thing I would mention is, 1679 01:42:07,560 --> 01:42:09,320 as we're looking at the Bell Avenue, 1680 01:42:09,320 --> 01:42:12,180 and Seth's team is working on this for Trevor, 1681 01:42:12,180 --> 01:42:13,400 we're actually looking at, 1682 01:42:13,400 --> 01:42:15,420 if we were to move forward with this project, 1683 01:42:15,420 --> 01:42:17,880 and we receive the opportunity to do so, 1684 01:42:17,880 --> 01:42:22,180 what could we do to incorporate the bike lanes to connect, 1685 01:42:22,180 --> 01:42:24,360 the bike lane that you see right outside this building, 1686 01:42:24,360 --> 01:42:28,480 right here, from Oakland, around the Quaker Town Park, 1687 01:42:28,480 --> 01:42:31,980 and come down across Frame Street, 1688 01:42:31,980 --> 01:42:34,520 come down into Bell, and provide that ability 1689 01:42:34,520 --> 01:42:35,760 for folks to get into town. 1690 01:42:35,760 --> 01:42:38,840 So don't think that these projects just start and stop. 1691 01:42:38,840 --> 01:42:41,340 We're showing you one portion of the project, 1692 01:42:41,340 --> 01:42:43,660 but we're actually looking and planning 1693 01:42:43,660 --> 01:42:46,080 for how do you get from one side of the town to the other. 1694 01:42:46,080 --> 01:42:47,520 So I just wanted to add that. 1695 01:42:50,120 --> 01:42:53,560 - Yes, my question was, when you said increase safety, 1696 01:42:53,560 --> 01:42:58,560 do you have data on mishap reports for a vehicular, 1697 01:42:58,560 --> 01:43:03,720 bicycle, pedestrian, or has it been a fatality or something 1698 01:43:03,720 --> 01:43:05,040 where you can kind of give us, 1699 01:43:05,040 --> 01:43:07,840 and if that's really something that may be driving the cost 1700 01:43:07,840 --> 01:43:09,700 and you just may not be giving it to us? 1701 01:43:09,700 --> 01:43:13,340 - Sure, so I know Becky is probably gonna come talk about this. 1702 01:43:13,340 --> 01:43:15,780 I'll answer to a part of that. 1703 01:43:15,780 --> 01:43:19,620 So any time that you can pull pedestrians and bicyclists 1704 01:43:19,620 --> 01:43:23,840 out of travel lanes, of driving travel lanes, 1705 01:43:23,840 --> 01:43:24,800 you're increasing safety. 1706 01:43:24,800 --> 01:43:28,120 So when you're dedicating lanes to people 1707 01:43:28,120 --> 01:43:29,840 that are walking, to bicyclists, 1708 01:43:29,840 --> 01:43:32,360 you're increasing safety really for both 1709 01:43:32,360 --> 01:43:36,680 of the person on the bike and the person in the car. 1710 01:43:36,680 --> 01:43:38,800 And of course, there's also other safety things 1711 01:43:38,800 --> 01:43:42,240 that we're proposing in this, increased illumination. 1712 01:43:42,240 --> 01:43:43,380 There's currently nothing out there 1713 01:43:43,380 --> 01:43:46,040 where it's really dark at night. 1714 01:43:46,040 --> 01:43:48,600 So there's a lot of different safety factors, 1715 01:43:48,600 --> 01:43:52,960 even specific to the quiet zones, the double quad gates, 1716 01:43:52,960 --> 01:43:56,280 crossings that meet safety requirements 1717 01:43:56,280 --> 01:43:57,640 and things of that nature. 1718 01:43:57,640 --> 01:44:00,800 So I'll let Becky kind of speak for the crash data 1719 01:44:00,800 --> 01:44:03,040 and things like that. 1720 01:44:03,040 --> 01:44:06,280 - So I would ask you to all take an opportunity 1721 01:44:06,280 --> 01:44:09,120 to drive this roadway and see how many individuals 1722 01:44:09,120 --> 01:44:11,920 are actually walking or bicycling on this roadway. 1723 01:44:11,920 --> 01:44:14,700 You probably have some committee members in this room 1724 01:44:14,700 --> 01:44:15,880 that could speak to that. 1725 01:44:15,880 --> 01:44:19,520 And some will serve on our Traffic Safety Commission 1726 01:44:19,520 --> 01:44:21,720 and definitely have brought this project 1727 01:44:21,720 --> 01:44:23,720 to my attention multiple times. 1728 01:44:23,720 --> 01:44:25,360 I think the other thing I would mention 1729 01:44:25,360 --> 01:44:28,300 is we do evaluate all the individual crashes 1730 01:44:28,300 --> 01:44:29,440 that come through the city. 1731 01:44:29,440 --> 01:44:31,920 Traffic safety brings those to our attention. 1732 01:44:31,920 --> 01:44:34,160 And we also work with our police department 1733 01:44:34,160 --> 01:44:35,680 on different crashes. 1734 01:44:35,680 --> 01:44:37,840 Some of the ones that we really pay attention to, 1735 01:44:37,840 --> 01:44:41,260 obviously, are the fatal injuries or the severe injuries. 1736 01:44:41,260 --> 01:44:44,100 And we review those on a monthly basis 1737 01:44:44,100 --> 01:44:46,380 to see if there's anything that we need to address 1738 01:44:46,380 --> 01:44:49,680 from a safety component or standpoint. 1739 01:44:49,680 --> 01:44:51,480 So I hope that answers your question. 1740 01:44:51,480 --> 01:44:52,480 We do have a map. 1741 01:44:52,480 --> 01:44:54,920 We have links that we work through with COG 1742 01:44:54,920 --> 01:44:56,640 that help track all of that information. 1743 01:44:56,640 --> 01:44:59,840 And it's something that PD has regularly available for us. 1744 01:44:59,840 --> 01:45:02,020 And one thing I wanted to mention, and I'm sorry, 1745 01:45:02,020 --> 01:45:04,320 I just thought about something that would answer 1746 01:45:04,320 --> 01:45:09,320 Ms. McAdams' question is we have performed traffic studies 1747 01:45:09,320 --> 01:45:14,120 in the area that were specific to Mingo and Roodell 1748 01:45:14,120 --> 01:45:17,600 and Bell Avenue during the Bell Avenue discussion. 1749 01:45:17,600 --> 01:45:22,160 We have not performed any recent traffic studies in 2023. 1750 01:45:22,160 --> 01:45:23,960 They were all done in 2020. 1751 01:45:23,960 --> 01:45:26,760 So the studies in 2023 would be specific 1752 01:45:26,760 --> 01:45:28,360 to what we need to do in this area 1753 01:45:28,360 --> 01:45:31,980 and what roadway cross-section would make the most sense. 1754 01:45:31,980 --> 01:45:34,960 We're trying to see what roadway cross-section we can fit, 1755 01:45:34,960 --> 01:45:37,040 like Trevor mentioned, within the right-of-way, 1756 01:45:37,040 --> 01:45:40,940 but still being able to provide that multimodal approach. 1757 01:45:40,940 --> 01:45:42,000 - Okay, you got a question? 1758 01:45:42,000 --> 01:45:43,880 Oh, actually, Susie's got a question, and then you. 1759 01:45:43,880 --> 01:45:45,280 - I've got two questions, actually. 1760 01:45:45,280 --> 01:45:47,400 First one should be easy, I think. 1761 01:45:47,400 --> 01:45:48,900 So, I hope. 1762 01:45:48,900 --> 01:45:52,280 So with the drainage, can you ballpark 1763 01:45:52,280 --> 01:45:56,120 about how much of the total cost is just the drainage? 1764 01:45:56,120 --> 01:45:58,000 - A lot of it. - Ish, like percent even, 1765 01:45:58,000 --> 01:45:58,840 ballpark? 1766 01:45:58,840 --> 01:46:04,080 - Seth, what do you think, 40%, 50%, okay. 1767 01:46:04,080 --> 01:46:04,920 It's pretty high. 1768 01:46:04,920 --> 01:46:07,280 Drainage is usually, if you have to install 1769 01:46:07,280 --> 01:46:09,680 underground drainage, that is usually 1770 01:46:09,680 --> 01:46:12,480 the driving factor on projects. 1771 01:46:12,480 --> 01:46:15,560 So underground drainage is very expensive to install. 1772 01:46:15,560 --> 01:46:18,560 We can get you that number, especially after, 1773 01:46:18,560 --> 01:46:20,800 between now and next week, 'cause we're gonna be pulling 1774 01:46:20,800 --> 01:46:23,400 together those updated numbers, so we can get you 1775 01:46:23,400 --> 01:46:26,200 what, a nice percentage of what that looks. 1776 01:46:26,200 --> 01:46:27,320 Probably 30%. 1777 01:46:27,320 --> 01:46:30,520 I would have to see what size we're putting in, 1778 01:46:30,520 --> 01:46:32,840 but it would be a large portion of it. 1779 01:46:32,840 --> 01:46:35,360 - All right, then my other question is, 1780 01:46:35,360 --> 01:46:38,240 so I know the city's working on a vision zero, 1781 01:46:38,240 --> 01:46:41,560 safe systems kind of plan to try to reduce the fatalities 1782 01:46:41,560 --> 01:46:43,360 and serious injuries in the city. 1783 01:46:43,360 --> 01:46:46,760 And all the studies I've seen, 30 miles an hour 1784 01:46:46,760 --> 01:46:49,760 if somebody's hit, they're about 50% likely 1785 01:46:49,760 --> 01:46:52,040 to be severely injured or killed. 1786 01:46:52,040 --> 01:46:54,000 And it's either at 40 or 45 miles an hour, 1787 01:46:54,000 --> 01:46:56,200 that goes up to about 90% chance of the person 1788 01:46:56,200 --> 01:46:57,880 being injured or killed. 1789 01:46:57,880 --> 01:47:01,440 So what is the target speed for Mingo and Riddell 1790 01:47:01,440 --> 01:47:03,800 that y'all are aiming for, that you're expecting? 1791 01:47:03,800 --> 01:47:07,200 - So that would be dictated by the cross-section 1792 01:47:07,200 --> 01:47:10,280 and the classification of road. 1793 01:47:10,280 --> 01:47:12,520 What is it on a secondary arterial? 1794 01:47:12,520 --> 01:47:18,040 35 or 30 to 40? 1795 01:47:18,040 --> 01:47:26,480 - I was just gonna suggest what she said 1796 01:47:26,480 --> 01:47:28,800 and ask you to drive down there. 1797 01:47:28,800 --> 01:47:30,880 I have lived in Ditten for 34 years 1798 01:47:30,880 --> 01:47:32,800 and I've always lived in District 1 1799 01:47:32,800 --> 01:47:37,160 and I drive down Mingo, Riddell every single day, literally. 1800 01:47:37,160 --> 01:47:40,320 And I've been working for the Ditten ISD for over 10 years 1801 01:47:40,320 --> 01:47:42,080 and I'm familiar with all the schools in that area. 1802 01:47:42,080 --> 01:47:43,680 And it's really disheartening for me 1803 01:47:43,680 --> 01:47:46,240 to drive down that road, especially when you're on Mingo 1804 01:47:46,240 --> 01:47:49,560 and you turn left onto Riddell, like you're going to Paisley. 1805 01:47:49,560 --> 01:47:52,040 That street is the worst street I've ever seen in Ditten 1806 01:47:52,040 --> 01:47:54,160 and I've literally lived here my whole life. 1807 01:47:54,160 --> 01:47:56,600 And when you go to Teasley and it's so pretty on that side 1808 01:47:56,600 --> 01:47:58,000 and now you go over to university 1809 01:47:58,000 --> 01:48:00,400 where the new Ditten High is and it's beautiful on that side 1810 01:48:00,400 --> 01:48:03,800 and then you come over to District 1 and this area 1811 01:48:03,800 --> 01:48:07,480 and it's like you don't even care about your people 1812 01:48:07,480 --> 01:48:08,920 in that street to fix the streets. 1813 01:48:08,920 --> 01:48:10,960 So I really encourage you to drive down there 1814 01:48:10,960 --> 01:48:13,120 and see the difference in just the street 1815 01:48:13,120 --> 01:48:14,960 compared to the other streets in town. 1816 01:48:14,960 --> 01:48:19,680 - Thanks, Maureen. - Thank you. 1817 01:48:19,680 --> 01:48:23,920 - I have a question concerning the walkway 1818 01:48:23,920 --> 01:48:25,160 and the bicycle lanes. 1819 01:48:25,160 --> 01:48:30,160 Have you come up with a cost that that is an additional cost 1820 01:48:30,280 --> 01:48:34,200 if it's for the road only and then additional 1821 01:48:34,200 --> 01:48:37,760 for the bike lane and the walkers? 1822 01:48:37,760 --> 01:48:41,360 How much additional cost is that for this project? 1823 01:48:41,360 --> 01:48:44,280 - I don't have those numbers, but really the, 1824 01:48:44,280 --> 01:48:46,080 so on-street biking, I mean, 1825 01:48:46,080 --> 01:48:48,720 it's really just pavement markings. 1826 01:48:48,720 --> 01:48:51,440 So installing sidewalk, the width of the sidewalk 1827 01:48:51,440 --> 01:48:54,920 is negligible going between a five and a 10 foot. 1828 01:48:54,920 --> 01:48:57,480 It's usually, depending on the length of it, 1829 01:48:57,480 --> 01:49:01,520 a million, maybe half a million, million and a half, 1830 01:49:01,520 --> 01:49:03,240 depending on the length. 1831 01:49:03,240 --> 01:49:06,680 But adding a bike lane is pavement markings, which is. 1832 01:49:06,680 --> 01:49:11,480 - Do you have a question for Paul? 1833 01:49:11,480 --> 01:49:13,320 Okay, go ahead. 1834 01:49:13,320 --> 01:49:14,800 - So I would just like to reiterate 1835 01:49:14,800 --> 01:49:16,440 what a couple of people have said. 1836 01:49:16,440 --> 01:49:20,160 I really think you guys need to go down and drive on Mingo. 1837 01:49:20,160 --> 01:49:23,200 I work at Casa of Denton County, which is right on Bell. 1838 01:49:23,200 --> 01:49:27,320 There are kids walking up and down Mingo 1839 01:49:27,320 --> 01:49:29,640 every single day, particularly in the summer. 1840 01:49:29,640 --> 01:49:32,920 Kids that are biking, kids that are walking, 1841 01:49:32,920 --> 01:49:36,360 trying to get downtown and get to the parks. 1842 01:49:36,360 --> 01:49:39,320 It really is a necessity that we have 1843 01:49:39,320 --> 01:49:41,640 a safer street in that area. 1844 01:49:41,640 --> 01:49:44,040 Also, I would like to say to somebody else's comment 1845 01:49:44,040 --> 01:49:45,920 before about closing Bell. 1846 01:49:45,920 --> 01:49:47,560 Bell was closed for construction 1847 01:49:47,560 --> 01:49:50,120 for almost a year, right? 1848 01:49:50,120 --> 01:49:53,240 And people figured out a way to get around that, 1849 01:49:53,240 --> 01:49:55,680 so I'm not entirely sure that that should be 1850 01:49:55,680 --> 01:49:57,440 one of our biggest considerations. 1851 01:49:57,440 --> 01:50:01,200 Also, to keep in everyone's mind for these quiet zones, 1852 01:50:01,200 --> 01:50:06,200 these were approved by voters previously on the 2014 bond. 1853 01:50:06,200 --> 01:50:09,240 They didn't get done, they need to come back, 1854 01:50:09,240 --> 01:50:12,440 because you have voters who have been out there, 1855 01:50:12,440 --> 01:50:14,800 living out there for several years, 1856 01:50:14,800 --> 01:50:17,840 who have been waiting for these things to come through. 1857 01:50:17,840 --> 01:50:20,880 And we need to fulfill that promise to our constituents. 1858 01:50:22,640 --> 01:50:26,000 - Right, and also I'd like to say that if you have 1859 01:50:26,000 --> 01:50:28,920 more walkable options and options for people 1860 01:50:28,920 --> 01:50:33,040 to bike down this road, to come down to downtown 1861 01:50:33,040 --> 01:50:35,840 for events and things like that, 1862 01:50:35,840 --> 01:50:39,440 you'll have less issues with parking downtown. 1863 01:50:39,440 --> 01:50:43,720 - And just to reiterate, remember the process is 1864 01:50:43,720 --> 01:50:46,040 this time's Q&A, not that it's fine. 1865 01:50:46,040 --> 01:50:48,520 We've had some comments and that's fine. 1866 01:50:48,520 --> 01:50:51,280 But we have the time for further discussion 1867 01:50:51,280 --> 01:50:52,760 after the table talk where you can make 1868 01:50:52,760 --> 01:50:54,000 whatever comments you want. 1869 01:50:54,000 --> 01:50:58,400 So let's try and focus, the remaining will say two questions, 1870 01:50:58,400 --> 01:51:01,560 if they're questions, for the staff on this project. 1871 01:51:01,560 --> 01:51:03,080 Go ahead. 1872 01:51:03,080 --> 01:51:05,720 - My question is, why you're looking at doing this 1873 01:51:05,720 --> 01:51:07,960 as a three lane for a left turn lane 1874 01:51:07,960 --> 01:51:09,640 when you're eliminating two crossings 1875 01:51:09,640 --> 01:51:12,480 across the railroad track and adding a stoplight 1876 01:51:12,480 --> 01:51:15,360 at one of the other ones, so there's not too many people 1877 01:51:15,360 --> 01:51:19,560 gonna be making a left hand turn to the south. 1878 01:51:19,560 --> 01:51:21,480 - Yeah, we can definitely evaluate what those different 1879 01:51:21,480 --> 01:51:25,240 cross sections look like depending on what the feedback is 1880 01:51:25,240 --> 01:51:27,920 or even what traffic patterns look like. 1881 01:51:27,920 --> 01:51:30,600 This was just a proposed example. 1882 01:51:30,600 --> 01:51:32,800 So that would definitely be something we would work through 1883 01:51:32,800 --> 01:51:34,200 during that design process. 1884 01:51:34,200 --> 01:51:38,440 - Okay, I'd like to just clarify, 1885 01:51:38,440 --> 01:51:41,080 what is the extent of the Mingo Road? 1886 01:51:41,080 --> 01:51:44,600 Is it just from Bell to Mockingbird? 1887 01:51:44,600 --> 01:51:47,320 - Bell to 380. 1888 01:51:47,320 --> 01:51:49,120 - Bell to 380, okay. 1889 01:51:49,120 --> 01:51:51,480 - Quiet zone, so the quiet zone portion would create 1890 01:51:51,480 --> 01:51:55,040 the quiet zone from Frame to Mockingbird 1891 01:51:55,040 --> 01:51:59,240 and the project extents would be from Bell to 380. 1892 01:51:59,240 --> 01:52:03,120 - Okay, how far out from there could we go 1893 01:52:03,120 --> 01:52:07,040 and work with the county to extend this type 1894 01:52:07,040 --> 01:52:09,840 of infrastructure all the way out to Collins Road? 1895 01:52:09,840 --> 01:52:15,080 - Whenever she starts walking up, I just get up. 1896 01:52:15,080 --> 01:52:17,040 (laughing) 1897 01:52:17,040 --> 01:52:18,800 - We make a good team. 1898 01:52:18,800 --> 01:52:22,680 We actually are in conversations with the county 1899 01:52:22,680 --> 01:52:25,160 on projects just like what you're talking about. 1900 01:52:25,160 --> 01:52:27,560 This would just be the first phase of trying to get 1901 01:52:27,560 --> 01:52:30,120 the infrastructure that's needed through town. 1902 01:52:30,120 --> 01:52:34,200 I will mention to you as we're working on the Loop 288 1903 01:52:34,200 --> 01:52:39,200 frontage road project that will go from 380 to 35. 1904 01:52:39,200 --> 01:52:41,280 It's currently a controlled freeway 1905 01:52:41,280 --> 01:52:43,720 and they have frontage roads they're adding. 1906 01:52:43,720 --> 01:52:46,200 We're already looking at cross sections where roadways 1907 01:52:46,200 --> 01:52:49,920 would cross, for example, at Mingo and submitting to them 1908 01:52:49,920 --> 01:52:52,760 this as an example to show them what the city 1909 01:52:52,760 --> 01:52:54,920 would like to have in the future. 1910 01:52:54,920 --> 01:52:56,760 So they're making sure that they're dedicating 1911 01:52:56,760 --> 01:52:58,200 enough right of way in those areas. 1912 01:52:58,200 --> 01:53:00,360 So we're already thinking in those terms 1913 01:53:00,360 --> 01:53:03,240 and that would maybe be another phase of a project. 1914 01:53:03,240 --> 01:53:06,400 - Okay, I'm gonna take chair's privilege 1915 01:53:06,400 --> 01:53:08,520 to ask a question at the end. 1916 01:53:08,520 --> 01:53:10,520 Because somebody had asked a question about future 1917 01:53:10,520 --> 01:53:14,120 development in that area and how that might impact this. 1918 01:53:14,120 --> 01:53:18,280 TWU, I understand, has a master plan that envisions 1919 01:53:18,280 --> 01:53:21,440 developing on the former golf course 1920 01:53:21,440 --> 01:53:23,200 with a lot of residence halls 1921 01:53:23,200 --> 01:53:25,560 and all sorts of other sorts of things. 1922 01:53:25,560 --> 01:53:28,520 Do we know whether or not part of their plans 1923 01:53:28,520 --> 01:53:32,240 or have they engaged us on this involve ingress, egress 1924 01:53:32,240 --> 01:53:34,960 onto Riddell or onto Mingo? 1925 01:53:34,960 --> 01:53:36,920 How does that impact your thinking? 1926 01:53:36,920 --> 01:53:40,560 - So we do coordinate with TWU just like we do UNT 1927 01:53:40,560 --> 01:53:42,240 and all these other outside entities. 1928 01:53:42,240 --> 01:53:44,840 We have seen their master plan, 1929 01:53:44,840 --> 01:53:46,920 or at least their draft of it. 1930 01:53:46,920 --> 01:53:49,360 They are not far enough down the road on that 1931 01:53:49,360 --> 01:53:51,400 to let us know what that looks like, 1932 01:53:51,400 --> 01:53:52,680 but we do coordinate with them. 1933 01:53:52,680 --> 01:53:56,120 They know that this is a possible project that's coming up 1934 01:53:56,120 --> 01:53:58,480 and we have had conversations about what that looks like 1935 01:53:58,480 --> 01:54:00,680 in conjunction with their master plan. 1936 01:54:00,680 --> 01:54:02,520 - I miss something that's just out of time. 1937 01:54:02,520 --> 01:54:05,040 - Well, then I would just add that we also 1938 01:54:05,040 --> 01:54:07,640 not only have looked at it from where the roadway 1939 01:54:07,640 --> 01:54:10,480 would connect, but also similar with the trails. 1940 01:54:10,480 --> 01:54:12,560 They are going to have a substantial trail system. 1941 01:54:12,560 --> 01:54:15,840 You might know now where it used to be a golf path, 1942 01:54:15,840 --> 01:54:19,120 where golf carts went, is now more of a trail path. 1943 01:54:19,120 --> 01:54:21,600 And so we would want our trail system to connect to theirs 1944 01:54:21,600 --> 01:54:24,000 no different than their drainage system would connect 1945 01:54:24,000 --> 01:54:25,320 to our drainage system. 1946 01:54:25,320 --> 01:54:27,880 So we are looking big picture as we try to coordinate 1947 01:54:27,880 --> 01:54:29,600 all of these projects. 1948 01:54:29,600 --> 01:54:31,520 - All right, let's get into our small groups 1949 01:54:31,520 --> 01:54:32,840 and continue that conversation. 1950 01:54:32,840 --> 01:54:36,360 We'll come back for more time of discussion. 1951 01:54:36,360 --> 01:54:41,360 (people chattering) 1952 01:55:06,360 --> 01:55:11,360 (people chattering) 1953 01:55:36,360 --> 01:55:41,360 (people chattering) 1954 01:55:41,360 --> 01:55:46,360 (people chattering) 1955 01:55:46,360 --> 01:55:51,360 (people chattering) 1956 01:55:51,360 --> 01:55:56,360 (people chattering) 1957 01:55:56,360 --> 01:56:01,360 (people chattering) 1958 01:56:01,360 --> 01:56:06,360 (people chattering) 1959 01:56:06,360 --> 01:56:11,360 (people chattering) 1960 01:56:11,360 --> 01:56:16,360 (people chattering) 1961 01:56:16,360 --> 01:56:21,360 (people chattering) 1962 01:56:21,360 --> 01:56:26,360 (people chattering) 1963 01:56:26,360 --> 01:56:31,360 (people chattering) 1964 01:56:31,360 --> 01:56:36,360 (people chattering) 1965 01:56:36,360 --> 01:56:41,360 (people chattering) 1966 01:56:41,360 --> 01:56:46,360 (people chattering) 1967 01:56:46,360 --> 01:56:51,360 (people chattering) 1968 01:56:51,360 --> 01:56:56,360 (people chattering) 1969 01:56:56,360 --> 01:57:01,360 (people chattering) 1970 01:57:01,360 --> 01:57:06,360 (people chattering) 1971 01:57:06,360 --> 01:57:11,360 (people chattering) 1972 01:57:11,360 --> 01:57:16,360 (people chattering) 1973 01:57:16,360 --> 01:57:21,360 (people chattering) 1974 01:57:21,360 --> 01:57:26,360 (people chattering) 1975 01:57:26,360 --> 01:57:31,360 (people chattering) 1976 01:57:31,360 --> 01:57:36,360 (people chattering) 1977 01:57:36,360 --> 01:57:41,360 (people chattering) 1978 01:57:41,360 --> 01:57:46,360 (people chattering) 1979 01:57:46,360 --> 01:57:51,360 (people chattering) 1980 01:57:51,360 --> 01:57:56,360 (people chattering) 1981 01:57:56,360 --> 01:58:01,360 (people chattering) 1982 01:58:01,360 --> 01:58:06,360 (people chattering) 1983 01:58:06,360 --> 01:58:11,360 (people chattering) 1984 01:58:11,360 --> 01:58:16,360 (people chattering) 1985 01:58:16,360 --> 01:58:21,360 (people chattering) 1986 01:58:21,360 --> 01:58:26,360 (people chattering) 1987 01:58:26,360 --> 01:58:31,360 (people chattering) 1988 01:58:31,360 --> 01:58:36,360 (people chattering) 1989 01:58:36,360 --> 01:58:41,360 (people chattering) 1990 01:58:41,360 --> 01:58:46,360 (people chattering) 1991 01:58:46,360 --> 01:58:51,360 (people chattering) 1992 01:58:51,360 --> 01:58:56,360 (people chattering) 1993 01:58:56,360 --> 01:59:01,360 (people chattering) 1994 01:59:01,360 --> 01:59:06,360 (people chattering) 1995 01:59:06,360 --> 01:59:11,360 (people chattering) 1996 01:59:11,360 --> 01:59:16,360 (people chattering) 1997 01:59:16,360 --> 01:59:21,360 (people chattering) 1998 01:59:21,360 --> 01:59:26,360 (people chattering) 1999 01:59:26,360 --> 01:59:31,360 (people chattering) 2000 01:59:31,360 --> 01:59:36,360 (people chattering) 2001 01:59:36,360 --> 01:59:41,360 (people chattering) 2002 01:59:41,360 --> 01:59:46,360 (people chattering) 2003 01:59:46,360 --> 01:59:51,360 (people chattering) 2004 01:59:51,360 --> 01:59:56,360 (people chattering) 2005 01:59:56,360 --> 02:00:01,360 (people chattering) 2006 02:00:01,360 --> 02:00:06,360 (people chattering) 2007 02:00:06,360 --> 02:00:11,360 (people chattering) 2008 02:00:11,360 --> 02:00:16,360 (people chattering) 2009 02:00:16,360 --> 02:00:21,360 (people chattering) 2010 02:00:21,360 --> 02:00:26,360 (people chattering) 2011 02:00:26,360 --> 02:00:31,360 (people chattering) 2012 02:00:31,360 --> 02:00:36,360 (people chattering) 2013 02:00:36,360 --> 02:00:41,360 (people chattering) 2014 02:00:41,360 --> 02:00:46,360 (people chattering) 2015 02:00:46,360 --> 02:00:51,360 (people chattering) 2016 02:00:51,360 --> 02:00:56,360 (people chattering) 2017 02:00:56,360 --> 02:01:01,360 (people chattering) 2018 02:01:01,360 --> 02:01:06,360 (people chattering) 2019 02:01:06,360 --> 02:01:11,360 (people chattering) 2020 02:01:11,360 --> 02:01:16,360 (people chattering) 2021 02:01:16,360 --> 02:01:21,360 (people chattering) 2022 02:01:21,360 --> 02:01:26,360 (people chattering) 2023 02:01:26,360 --> 02:01:31,360 (people chattering) 2024 02:01:31,360 --> 02:01:36,360 (people chattering) 2025 02:01:36,360 --> 02:01:41,360 (people chattering) 2026 02:01:41,360 --> 02:01:46,360 (people chattering) 2027 02:01:46,360 --> 02:01:51,360 (people chattering) 2028 02:01:51,360 --> 02:01:56,360 (people chattering) 2029 02:01:56,360 --> 02:02:01,360 (people chattering) 2030 02:02:01,360 --> 02:02:06,360 (people chattering) 2031 02:02:06,360 --> 02:02:11,360 (people chattering) 2032 02:02:11,360 --> 02:02:16,360 (people chattering) 2033 02:02:16,360 --> 02:02:21,360 (people chattering) 2034 02:02:21,360 --> 02:02:26,360 (people chattering) 2035 02:02:26,360 --> 02:02:31,360 (people chattering) 2036 02:02:31,360 --> 02:02:36,360 (people chattering) 2037 02:02:36,360 --> 02:02:41,360 (people chattering) 2038 02:02:41,360 --> 02:02:46,360 (people chattering) 2039 02:02:46,360 --> 02:02:51,360 (people chattering) 2040 02:02:51,360 --> 02:02:56,360 (people chattering) 2041 02:02:56,360 --> 02:03:01,360 (people chattering) 2042 02:03:01,360 --> 02:03:06,360 (people chattering) 2043 02:03:06,360 --> 02:03:11,360 (people chattering) 2044 02:03:11,360 --> 02:03:16,360 (people chattering) 2045 02:03:16,360 --> 02:03:21,360 (people chattering) 2046 02:03:21,360 --> 02:03:26,360 (people chattering) 2047 02:03:26,360 --> 02:03:31,360 (people chattering) 2048 02:03:31,360 --> 02:03:36,360 (people chattering) 2049 02:03:36,360 --> 02:03:41,360 (people chattering) 2050 02:03:41,360 --> 02:03:46,360 (people chattering) 2051 02:03:46,360 --> 02:03:51,360 (people chattering) 2052 02:03:51,360 --> 02:03:56,360 (people chattering) 2053 02:03:56,360 --> 02:04:01,360 (people chattering) 2054 02:04:01,360 --> 02:04:06,360 (people chattering) 2055 02:04:06,360 --> 02:04:11,360 (people chattering) 2056 02:04:11,360 --> 02:04:16,360 (people chattering) 2057 02:04:16,360 --> 02:04:21,360 (people chattering) 2058 02:04:21,360 --> 02:04:26,360 (people chattering) 2059 02:04:26,360 --> 02:04:31,360 (people chattering) 2060 02:04:31,360 --> 02:04:36,360 (people chattering) 2061 02:04:36,360 --> 02:04:41,360 (people chattering) 2062 02:04:41,360 --> 02:04:46,360 (people chattering) 2063 02:04:46,360 --> 02:04:51,360 (people chattering) 2064 02:04:51,360 --> 02:04:56,360 (people chattering) 2065 02:04:56,360 --> 02:05:01,360 (people chattering) 2066 02:05:01,360 --> 02:05:06,360 (people chattering) 2067 02:05:06,360 --> 02:05:11,360 (people chattering) 2068 02:05:11,360 --> 02:05:16,360 (people chattering) 2069 02:05:16,360 --> 02:05:21,360 (people chattering) 2070 02:05:21,360 --> 02:05:26,360 (people chattering) 2071 02:05:26,360 --> 02:05:31,360 (people chattering) 2072 02:05:31,360 --> 02:05:36,360 (people chattering) 2073 02:05:36,360 --> 02:05:41,360 (people chattering) 2074 02:05:41,360 --> 02:05:46,360 (people chattering) 2075 02:05:46,360 --> 02:05:51,360 (people chattering) 2076 02:05:51,360 --> 02:05:56,360 (people chattering) 2077 02:05:56,360 --> 02:06:01,360 (people chattering) 2078 02:06:01,360 --> 02:06:06,360 (people chattering) 2079 02:06:06,360 --> 02:06:11,360 (people chattering) 2080 02:06:11,360 --> 02:06:16,360 (people chattering) 2081 02:06:16,360 --> 02:06:21,360 (people chattering) 2082 02:06:21,360 --> 02:06:26,360 (people chattering) 2083 02:06:26,360 --> 02:06:31,360 (people chattering) 2084 02:06:31,360 --> 02:06:36,360 (people chattering) 2085 02:06:36,360 --> 02:06:41,360 (people chattering) 2086 02:06:41,360 --> 02:06:46,360 (people chattering) 2087 02:06:46,360 --> 02:06:51,360 (people chattering) 2088 02:06:51,360 --> 02:06:56,360 (people chattering) 2089 02:06:56,360 --> 02:07:01,360 (people chattering) 2090 02:07:01,360 --> 02:07:06,360 (people chattering) 2091 02:07:06,360 --> 02:07:11,360 (people chattering) 2092 02:07:11,360 --> 02:07:16,360 (people chattering) 2093 02:07:16,360 --> 02:07:21,360 (people chattering) 2094 02:07:21,360 --> 02:07:26,360 (people chattering) 2095 02:07:26,360 --> 02:07:31,360 (people chattering) 2096 02:07:31,360 --> 02:07:36,360 (people chattering) 2097 02:07:36,360 --> 02:07:41,360 (people chattering) 2098 02:07:41,360 --> 02:07:46,360 (people chattering) 2099 02:07:46,360 --> 02:07:51,360 (people chattering) 2100 02:07:51,360 --> 02:07:56,360 (people chattering) 2101 02:07:56,360 --> 02:08:01,360 (people chattering) 2102 02:08:01,360 --> 02:08:06,360 (people chattering) 2103 02:08:06,360 --> 02:08:11,360 (people chattering) 2104 02:08:11,360 --> 02:08:16,360 (people chattering) 2105 02:08:16,360 --> 02:08:21,360 (people chattering) 2106 02:08:21,360 --> 02:08:26,360 (people chattering) 2107 02:08:26,360 --> 02:08:31,360 (people chattering) 2108 02:08:31,360 --> 02:08:36,360 (people chattering) 2109 02:08:36,360 --> 02:08:41,360 (people chattering) 2110 02:08:41,360 --> 02:08:46,360 (people chattering) 2111 02:08:46,360 --> 02:08:51,360 (people chattering) 2112 02:08:51,360 --> 02:08:56,360 (people chattering) 2113 02:08:56,360 --> 02:09:01,360 (people chattering) 2114 02:09:01,360 --> 02:09:06,360 (people chattering) 2115 02:09:06,360 --> 02:09:11,360 (people chattering) 2116 02:09:11,360 --> 02:09:16,360 (people chattering) 2117 02:09:16,360 --> 02:09:21,360 (people chattering) 2118 02:09:21,360 --> 02:09:26,360 (people chattering) 2119 02:09:26,360 --> 02:09:31,360 (people chattering) 2120 02:09:31,360 --> 02:09:36,360 (people chattering) 2121 02:09:36,360 --> 02:09:41,360 (people chattering) 2122 02:09:41,360 --> 02:09:46,360 (people chattering) 2123 02:09:46,360 --> 02:09:51,360 (people chattering) 2124 02:09:51,360 --> 02:09:56,360 (people chattering) 2125 02:09:56,360 --> 02:10:01,360 (people chattering) 2126 02:10:01,360 --> 02:10:06,360 (people chattering) 2127 02:10:06,360 --> 02:10:11,360 (people chattering) 2128 02:10:11,360 --> 02:10:16,360 (people chattering) 2129 02:10:16,360 --> 02:10:21,360 (people chattering) 2130 02:10:21,360 --> 02:10:26,360 (people chattering) 2131 02:10:26,360 --> 02:10:31,360 (people chattering) 2132 02:10:31,360 --> 02:10:36,360 (people chattering) 2133 02:10:36,360 --> 02:10:41,360 (people chattering) 2134 02:10:41,360 --> 02:10:46,360 (people chattering) 2135 02:10:46,360 --> 02:10:51,360 (people chattering) 2136 02:10:51,360 --> 02:10:56,360 (people chattering) 2137 02:10:56,360 --> 02:11:01,360 (people chattering) 2138 02:11:01,360 --> 02:11:06,360 (people chattering) 2139 02:11:06,360 --> 02:11:11,360 (people chattering) 2140 02:11:11,360 --> 02:11:16,360 (people chattering) 2141 02:11:16,360 --> 02:11:21,360 (people chattering) 2142 02:11:21,360 --> 02:11:26,360 (people chattering) 2143 02:11:26,360 --> 02:11:31,360 (people chattering) 2144 02:11:31,360 --> 02:11:36,360 (people chattering) 2145 02:11:36,360 --> 02:11:41,360 (people chattering) 2146 02:11:41,360 --> 02:11:46,360 (people chattering) 2147 02:11:46,360 --> 02:11:51,360 (people chattering) 2148 02:11:51,360 --> 02:11:56,360 (people chattering) 2149 02:11:56,360 --> 02:12:01,360 (people chattering) 2150 02:12:01,360 --> 02:12:06,360 (people chattering) 2151 02:12:06,360 --> 02:12:11,360 (people chattering) 2152 02:12:11,360 --> 02:12:16,360 (people chattering) 2153 02:12:16,360 --> 02:12:21,360 (people chattering) 2154 02:12:21,360 --> 02:12:26,360 (people chattering) 2155 02:12:26,360 --> 02:12:31,360 (people chattering) 2156 02:12:31,360 --> 02:12:36,360 (people chattering) 2157 02:12:36,360 --> 02:12:41,360 (people chattering) 2158 02:12:41,360 --> 02:12:46,360 (people chattering) 2159 02:12:46,360 --> 02:12:51,360 (people chattering) 2160 02:12:51,360 --> 02:12:56,360 (people chattering) 2161 02:12:56,360 --> 02:13:01,360 (people chattering) 2162 02:13:01,360 --> 02:13:06,360 (people chattering) 2163 02:13:06,360 --> 02:13:11,360 (people chattering) 2164 02:13:11,360 --> 02:13:16,360 (people chattering) 2165 02:13:16,360 --> 02:13:21,360 (people chattering) 2166 02:13:21,360 --> 02:13:26,360 (people chattering) 2167 02:13:26,360 --> 02:13:31,360 (people chattering) 2168 02:13:31,360 --> 02:13:36,360 (people chattering) 2169 02:13:36,360 --> 02:13:41,360 (people chattering) 2170 02:13:41,360 --> 02:13:46,360 (people chattering) 2171 02:13:46,360 --> 02:14:01,360 (people chattering) 2172 02:14:01,360 --> 02:14:06,360 (people chattering) 2173 02:14:06,360 --> 02:14:11,360 (people chattering) 2174 02:14:11,360 --> 02:14:16,360 (people chattering) 2175 02:14:16,360 --> 02:14:21,360 (people chattering) 2176 02:14:21,360 --> 02:14:26,360 (people chattering) 2177 02:14:26,360 --> 02:14:31,360 (people chattering) 2178 02:14:31,360 --> 02:14:36,360 (people chattering) 2179 02:14:36,360 --> 02:14:41,360 (people chattering) 2180 02:14:41,360 --> 02:14:46,360 (people chattering) 2181 02:14:46,360 --> 02:14:51,360 (people chattering) 2182 02:14:51,360 --> 02:14:56,360 (people chattering) 2183 02:14:56,360 --> 02:15:01,360 (people chattering) 2184 02:15:01,360 --> 02:15:06,360 (people chattering) 2185 02:15:06,360 --> 02:15:11,360 (people chattering) 2186 02:15:11,360 --> 02:15:16,360 (people chattering) 2187 02:15:16,360 --> 02:15:21,360 (people chattering) 2188 02:15:21,360 --> 02:15:26,360 (people chattering) 2189 02:15:26,360 --> 02:15:31,360 (people chattering) 2190 02:15:31,360 --> 02:15:36,360 (people chattering) 2191 02:15:36,360 --> 02:15:41,360 (people chattering) 2192 02:15:41,360 --> 02:15:46,360 (people chattering) 2193 02:15:46,360 --> 02:15:51,360 (people chattering) 2194 02:15:51,360 --> 02:15:56,360 (people chattering) 2195 02:15:56,360 --> 02:16:25,360 (people chattering) 2196 02:16:25,360 --> 02:16:30,360 (people chattering) 2197 02:16:30,360 --> 02:16:35,360 (people chattering) 2198 02:16:35,360 --> 02:16:40,360 (people chattering) 2199 02:16:40,360 --> 02:16:45,360 (people chattering) 2200 02:16:45,360 --> 02:16:50,360 (people chattering) 2201 02:16:50,360 --> 02:16:55,360 (people chattering) 2202 02:16:55,360 --> 02:17:00,360 (people chattering) 2203 02:17:00,360 --> 02:17:05,360 (people chattering) 2204 02:17:05,360 --> 02:17:10,360 (people chattering) 2205 02:17:10,360 --> 02:17:15,360 (people chattering) 2206 02:17:15,360 --> 02:17:20,360 (people chattering) 2207 02:17:20,360 --> 02:17:25,360 (people chattering) 2208 02:17:25,360 --> 02:17:30,360 (people chattering) 2209 02:17:30,360 --> 02:17:35,360 (people chattering) 2210 02:17:35,360 --> 02:17:46,360 (people chattering) 2211 02:17:46,360 --> 02:17:51,360 (people chattering) 2212 02:17:51,360 --> 02:17:56,360 (people chattering) 2213 02:17:56,360 --> 02:18:01,360 (people chattering) 2214 02:18:01,360 --> 02:18:06,360 (people chattering) 2215 02:18:06,360 --> 02:18:11,360 (people chattering) 2216 02:18:11,360 --> 02:18:16,360 (people chattering) 2217 02:18:16,360 --> 02:18:21,360 (people chattering) 2218 02:18:21,360 --> 02:18:26,360 (people chattering) 2219 02:18:26,360 --> 02:18:31,360 (people chattering) 2220 02:18:31,360 --> 02:18:36,360 (people chattering) 2221 02:18:36,360 --> 02:18:41,360 (people chattering) 2222 02:18:41,360 --> 02:18:46,360 (people chattering) 2223 02:18:46,360 --> 02:18:51,360 (people chattering) 2224 02:18:51,360 --> 02:18:56,360 (people chattering) 2225 02:18:56,360 --> 02:19:01,360 (people chattering) 2226 02:19:01,360 --> 02:19:06,360 (people chattering) 2227 02:19:06,360 --> 02:19:11,360 (people chattering) 2228 02:19:11,360 --> 02:19:16,360 (people chattering) 2229 02:19:16,360 --> 02:19:21,360 (people chattering) 2230 02:19:21,360 --> 02:19:26,360 (people chattering) 2231 02:19:26,360 --> 02:19:31,360 (people chattering) 2232 02:19:31,360 --> 02:19:36,360 (people chattering) 2233 02:19:36,360 --> 02:19:41,360 (people chattering) 2234 02:19:41,360 --> 02:19:46,360 (people chattering) 2235 02:19:46,360 --> 02:19:51,360 (people chattering) 2236 02:19:51,360 --> 02:19:56,360 (people chattering) 2237 02:19:56,360 --> 02:20:01,360 (people chattering) 2238 02:20:01,360 --> 02:20:06,360 (people chattering) 2239 02:20:06,360 --> 02:20:11,360 (people chattering) 2240 02:20:11,360 --> 02:20:16,360 (people chattering) 2241 02:20:16,360 --> 02:20:21,360 (people chattering) 2242 02:20:21,360 --> 02:20:26,360 (people chattering) 2243 02:20:26,360 --> 02:20:31,360 (people chattering) 2244 02:20:31,360 --> 02:20:36,360 (people chattering) 2245 02:20:36,360 --> 02:20:41,360 (people chattering) 2246 02:20:41,360 --> 02:20:46,360 (people chattering) 2247 02:20:46,360 --> 02:20:51,360 (people chattering) 2248 02:20:51,360 --> 02:20:56,360 (people chattering) 2249 02:20:56,360 --> 02:21:01,360 (people chattering) 2250 02:21:01,360 --> 02:21:06,360 (people chattering) 2251 02:21:06,360 --> 02:21:11,360 (people chattering) 2252 02:21:11,360 --> 02:21:16,360 (people chattering) 2253 02:21:16,360 --> 02:21:21,360 (people chattering) 2254 02:21:21,360 --> 02:21:26,360 (people chattering) 2255 02:21:26,360 --> 02:21:31,360 (people chattering) 2256 02:21:31,360 --> 02:21:36,360 (people chattering) 2257 02:21:36,360 --> 02:21:41,360 (people chattering) 2258 02:21:41,360 --> 02:21:46,360 (people chattering) 2259 02:21:46,360 --> 02:21:51,360 (people chattering) 2260 02:21:51,360 --> 02:21:56,360 (people chattering) 2261 02:21:56,360 --> 02:22:19,360 (people chattering) 2262 02:22:19,360 --> 02:22:24,360 (people chattering) 2263 02:22:24,360 --> 02:22:29,360 (people chattering) 2264 02:22:29,360 --> 02:22:34,360 (people chattering) 2265 02:22:34,360 --> 02:22:39,360 (people chattering) 2266 02:22:39,360 --> 02:22:44,360 (people chattering) 2267 02:22:44,360 --> 02:22:49,360 (people chattering) 2268 02:22:49,360 --> 02:22:54,360 (people chattering) 2269 02:22:54,360 --> 02:22:59,360 (people chattering) 2270 02:22:59,360 --> 02:23:04,360 (people chattering) 2271 02:23:04,360 --> 02:23:09,360 (people chattering) 2272 02:23:09,360 --> 02:23:14,360 (people chattering) 2273 02:23:14,360 --> 02:23:19,360 (people chattering) 2274 02:23:19,360 --> 02:23:24,360 (people chattering) 2275 02:23:24,360 --> 02:23:29,360 (people chattering) 2276 02:23:29,360 --> 02:23:34,360 (people chattering) 2277 02:23:34,360 --> 02:23:39,360 (people chattering) 2278 02:23:39,360 --> 02:23:44,360 (people chattering) 2279 02:23:44,360 --> 02:23:49,360 (people chattering) 2280 02:23:49,360 --> 02:23:54,360 (people chattering) 2281 02:23:54,360 --> 02:23:59,360 (people chattering) 2282 02:23:59,360 --> 02:24:04,360 (people chattering) 2283 02:24:04,360 --> 02:24:09,360 (people chattering) 2284 02:24:09,360 --> 02:24:14,360 (people chattering) 2285 02:24:14,360 --> 02:24:19,360 (people chattering) 2286 02:24:19,360 --> 02:24:24,360 (people chattering) 2287 02:24:24,360 --> 02:24:29,360 (people chattering) 2288 02:24:29,360 --> 02:24:34,360 (people chattering) 2289 02:24:34,360 --> 02:24:39,360 (people chattering) 2290 02:24:39,360 --> 02:24:44,360 (people chattering) 2291 02:24:44,360 --> 02:24:49,360 (people chattering) 2292 02:24:49,360 --> 02:24:54,360 (people chattering) 2293 02:24:54,360 --> 02:24:59,360 (people chattering) 2294 02:24:59,360 --> 02:25:04,360 (people chattering) 2295 02:25:04,360 --> 02:25:09,360 (people chattering) 2296 02:25:09,360 --> 02:25:28,360 (people chattering) 2297 02:25:28,360 --> 02:25:33,360 (people chattering) 2298 02:25:33,360 --> 02:25:38,360 (people chattering) 2299 02:25:38,360 --> 02:25:43,360 (people chattering) 2300 02:25:43,360 --> 02:25:48,360 (people chattering) 2301 02:25:48,360 --> 02:25:53,360 (people chattering) 2302 02:25:53,360 --> 02:25:58,360 (people chattering) 2303 02:25:58,360 --> 02:26:03,360 (people chattering) 2304 02:26:03,360 --> 02:26:08,360 (people chattering) 2305 02:26:08,360 --> 02:26:13,360 (people chattering) 2306 02:26:13,360 --> 02:26:18,360 (people chattering) 2307 02:26:18,360 --> 02:26:23,360 (people chattering) 2308 02:26:23,360 --> 02:26:28,360 (people chattering) 2309 02:26:28,360 --> 02:26:33,360 (people chattering) 2310 02:26:33,360 --> 02:26:38,360 (people chattering) 2311 02:26:38,360 --> 02:26:43,360 (people chattering) 2312 02:26:43,360 --> 02:26:48,360 (people chattering) 2313 02:26:48,360 --> 02:26:53,360 (people chattering) 2314 02:26:53,360 --> 02:26:58,360 (people chattering) 2315 02:26:58,360 --> 02:27:03,360 (people chattering) 2316 02:27:03,360 --> 02:27:08,360 (people chattering) 2317 02:27:08,360 --> 02:27:13,360 (people chattering) 2318 02:27:13,360 --> 02:27:18,360 (people chattering) 2319 02:27:18,360 --> 02:27:23,360 (people chattering) 2320 02:27:23,360 --> 02:27:28,360 (people chattering) 2321 02:27:28,360 --> 02:27:33,360 (people chattering) 2322 02:27:33,360 --> 02:27:38,360 (people chattering) 2323 02:27:38,360 --> 02:27:43,360 (people chattering) 2324 02:27:43,360 --> 02:27:48,360 (people chattering) 2325 02:27:48,360 --> 02:27:53,360 (people chattering) 2326 02:27:53,360 --> 02:27:58,360 (people chattering) 2327 02:27:58,360 --> 02:28:03,360 (people chattering) 2328 02:28:03,360 --> 02:28:08,360 (people chattering) 2329 02:28:08,360 --> 02:28:13,360 (people chattering) 2330 02:28:13,360 --> 02:28:18,360 (people chattering) 2331 02:28:18,360 --> 02:28:23,360 (people chattering) 2332 02:28:23,360 --> 02:28:28,360 (people chattering) 2333 02:28:28,360 --> 02:28:33,360 (people chattering) 2334 02:28:33,360 --> 02:28:38,360 (people chattering) 2335 02:28:38,360 --> 02:28:43,360 (people chattering) 2336 02:28:43,360 --> 02:28:48,360 (people chattering) 2337 02:28:48,360 --> 02:28:53,360 (people chattering) 2338 02:28:53,360 --> 02:28:58,360 Thank you, Ryan. So these are some maps of the current condition 2339 02:28:58,360 --> 02:29:03,360 and the proposed conditions. So on the left, that's what it looks like now. And then after this project 2340 02:29:03,360 --> 02:29:08,360 would be completed, you can see the benefit and the proposed conditions 2341 02:29:08,360 --> 02:29:13,360 after completion. So here's the estimated cost. 2342 02:29:13,360 --> 02:29:18,360 We didn't have any design costs associated in here, but usually that runs about 2343 02:29:18,360 --> 02:29:23,360 10% of what the construction cost looks like. So you can estimate that or be anywhere from 2344 02:29:23,360 --> 02:29:28,360 one and a half million dollars to design this project. With a total project cost would 2345 02:29:28,360 --> 02:29:33,360 most likely be around the 22, 23 million dollar project, but like I said earlier, you'll get those 2346 02:29:33,360 --> 02:29:38,360 updated numbers next week. 2347 02:29:38,360 --> 02:29:43,360 And that's the end. That's this one yet. Thank you. 2348 02:29:43,360 --> 02:29:48,360 Questions, comments? We're going to take away table talk on this one as well, so we'll 2349 02:29:48,360 --> 02:29:53,360 keep it all in one section. I'll be really quick. I just want to say that drainage 2350 02:29:53,360 --> 02:29:58,360 is probably the least sexy thing we're going to look at in this whole bond. It looks like a water slide, but it's not as cool 2351 02:29:58,360 --> 02:30:03,360 as a water slide. But bang for our buck, 2352 02:30:03,360 --> 02:30:08,360 one of the very best things we can spend bond money on. If you go back and look at the last 2353 02:30:08,360 --> 02:30:13,360 four or five years of city council meetings trying to find funding for this part of this project, 2354 02:30:13,360 --> 02:30:18,360 because the other part you saw has already been completed, has been difficult looking under every stone, 2355 02:30:18,360 --> 02:30:23,360 looking at different pots of money, looking at different regional partners and stuff. 2356 02:30:23,360 --> 02:30:28,360 Finding the funding has been very difficult, but look at the number of businesses and homes that are out of the floodplain 2357 02:30:28,360 --> 02:30:33,360 and what this can do for downtown. This is maybe the most important project 2358 02:30:33,360 --> 02:30:38,360 we're going to look at this whole project, or excuse me, this whole process, and it's 2359 02:30:38,360 --> 02:30:43,360 rainwater. It's stormwater and stuff. So don't underestimate the value 2360 02:30:43,360 --> 02:30:48,360 of putting some of this underground and moving that stormwater further 2361 02:30:48,360 --> 02:30:53,360 downstream. And look for more of these projects in the future, because there's more opportunities around town. 2362 02:30:53,360 --> 02:30:58,360 Thank you. I wanted to ask about the channels 2363 02:30:58,360 --> 02:31:03,360 that are near the Carroll Courts building in Oakland. Some of the older 2364 02:31:03,360 --> 02:31:08,360 parts of town you could see that they had the stone walls. 2365 02:31:08,360 --> 02:31:13,360 Those were actually installed during WPA, 2366 02:31:13,360 --> 02:31:18,360 the works project. I'm so tired, y'all. 2367 02:31:18,360 --> 02:31:23,360 I'm sure y'all are too. My brain has quit. There's some historic 2368 02:31:23,360 --> 02:31:28,360 significance to that. Is there a possibility of saving those and utilizing them for some other type 2369 02:31:28,360 --> 02:31:33,360 of project for the community? Yeah, great question. So we actually already have 2370 02:31:33,360 --> 02:31:38,360 95% plans on this. We were able to use some drainage funding to get part of this project already designed. 2371 02:31:38,360 --> 02:31:43,360 So portions of the channel in front of the Carroll Courts building, actually it was really close to 2372 02:31:43,360 --> 02:31:48,360 the Carroll Courts building, the boxes you can see we propose are going to be in the street. So we would actually 2373 02:31:48,360 --> 02:31:53,360 connect those existing stone channels into these boxes and leave those in place. 2374 02:31:53,360 --> 02:31:58,360 And so that would be kind of drainage for those properties that would then connect to the main boxes in the 2375 02:31:58,360 --> 02:32:03,360 street. So our main boxes would not leave kind of Mulberry, Bernard, 2376 02:32:03,360 --> 02:32:08,360 but of course as we go north and south it would cut in between the homes as we went that direction. 2377 02:32:08,360 --> 02:32:13,360 So I just want to encourage you guys and I really appreciate you saying 2378 02:32:13,360 --> 02:32:18,360 we're going to update these costs. Nothing more frustrating 2379 02:32:18,360 --> 02:32:23,360 than going to these committees, do the work, go out and convince people, get them excited. 2380 02:32:23,360 --> 02:32:28,360 And like this one, we got a lot of these downtown property owners excited 2381 02:32:28,360 --> 02:32:33,360 only to find out later that the project was going to stop at Elm because 2382 02:32:33,360 --> 02:32:38,360 the cost estimates that were used were old. So I really encourage you guys to think about 2383 02:32:38,360 --> 02:32:43,360 like I would much rather you overestimate and say this one we think will 2384 02:32:43,360 --> 02:32:48,360 happen, the work will happen sometime between whatever, 25 and 27 and the project 2385 02:32:48,360 --> 02:32:53,360 will cost likely somewhere between this and this than to assign a value to it 2386 02:32:53,360 --> 02:32:58,360 and then the next bond committee is here and we're hearing about 2387 02:32:58,360 --> 02:33:03,360 quiet zones that were 10% funded, right? And so I would rather have 2388 02:33:03,360 --> 02:33:08,360 overestimated costs which give us a little bit of cushion 2389 02:33:08,360 --> 02:33:13,360 that allow us when we prioritize at the end, we want to make sure we have a big enough 2390 02:33:13,360 --> 02:33:18,360 bucket of money because I think some of our citizens, I've heard it, 2391 02:33:18,360 --> 02:33:23,360 they get frustrated with there's another bond election but you've only spent half of what you got 2392 02:33:23,360 --> 02:33:28,360 seven or eight years ago. And to piggyback on what Jesse said, 2393 02:33:28,360 --> 02:33:33,360 if you take a drive and just look south of the square between 2394 02:33:33,360 --> 02:33:38,360 Locust and Elm and look at the revitalization that's happening as a result 2395 02:33:38,360 --> 02:33:43,360 of the first phase of this, it will be 2396 02:33:43,360 --> 02:33:48,360 five times that when this one happens. So I would really encourage 2397 02:33:48,360 --> 02:33:53,360 everybody, Jesse's right, it's not sexy but 2398 02:33:53,360 --> 02:33:58,360 five to ten years later when you see what happens and the tax base that gets created because we made the 2399 02:33:58,360 --> 02:34:03,360 investment, these things will pay for themselves an additional tax base 2400 02:34:03,360 --> 02:34:08,360 but we got to get them done and so please give us safe estimates. 2401 02:34:08,360 --> 02:34:13,360 And we'll be creating Drainage's sexy t-shirts for everyone 2402 02:34:13,360 --> 02:34:18,360 at the next couple meetings. I'll buy one of those 2403 02:34:18,360 --> 02:34:23,360 t-shirts and I want to pile on to what everyone else is saying. I mean the downtown is some of 2404 02:34:23,360 --> 02:34:28,360 our most efficient acre per acre tax revenue makers so 2405 02:34:28,360 --> 02:34:33,360 this is going to pay for itself. I'm curious if anybody in the room at all can 2406 02:34:33,360 --> 02:34:38,360 estimate a dollar value of how much we unlock by removing 2407 02:34:38,360 --> 02:34:43,360 these areas out of the floodplain or I can parking lot that if we think it's possible to even get that number. 2408 02:34:43,360 --> 02:34:48,360 I think we can work with our development services 2409 02:34:48,360 --> 02:34:53,360 team and our downtown economic team to get those numbers. 2410 02:34:53,360 --> 02:34:58,360 Any other comments or questions on this one? 2411 02:34:58,360 --> 02:35:03,360 And you guys are moving right along. Yeah, Susie. I'll be quick. So as far as 2412 02:35:03,360 --> 02:35:08,360 completing this project, are there any thoughts or plans of putting anything on top of the channels 2413 02:35:08,360 --> 02:35:13,360 that y'all are putting in? So most of these are under the street if I remember correctly. 2414 02:35:13,360 --> 02:35:18,360 Yeah, so Trevor's right. Most of it's in the street. 2415 02:35:18,360 --> 02:35:23,360 The portion that goes from Prairie Street all the way up to Mulberry will still have to have surface drainage 2416 02:35:23,360 --> 02:35:28,360 so you'll still have flumes with inlets on top of the boxes so it's probably not the safest 2417 02:35:28,360 --> 02:35:33,360 best idea to put people through there and of course these will also be really close to folks' homes 2418 02:35:33,360 --> 02:35:38,360 so having people walking through backyards and stuff may be a little bit invasive. 2419 02:35:38,360 --> 02:35:43,360 Alright, next item, number seven and the last one, public art. 2420 02:35:43,360 --> 02:35:48,360 Thank you guys. 2421 02:35:48,360 --> 02:35:53,360 Okay, we've arrived at the 2422 02:35:53,360 --> 02:35:58,360 last presentation. Mindy, I hope you can hang in there for it. 2423 02:35:58,360 --> 02:36:03,360 So as a committee you have a charge 2424 02:36:03,360 --> 02:36:08,360 as you're thinking about all these projects. You have a decision, do you want public art 2425 02:36:08,360 --> 02:36:13,360 to be in and if yes, then what percentage do you want to fund it? 2426 02:36:13,360 --> 02:36:18,360 Some background information on how prior committees have handled public art. So in 2427 02:36:18,360 --> 02:36:23,360 2020-2012 Vaughn Program they did 2% of all projects 2428 02:36:23,360 --> 02:36:28,360 which was a very large amount of public art, $400,000. After that happened in 2429 02:36:28,360 --> 02:36:33,360 2012 the city council came back and did a revised public art policy 2430 02:36:33,360 --> 02:36:38,360 that spoke to any future bond city council will determine 2431 02:36:38,360 --> 02:36:43,360 will consider anywhere between 2-4% of basically vertical construction 2432 02:36:43,360 --> 02:36:48,360 projects, ones that didn't apply to streets, drainage, traffic control or other related 2433 02:36:48,360 --> 02:36:53,360 infrastructure. So the 2014 Vaughn Program was the next one after that revised 2434 02:36:53,360 --> 02:36:58,360 public art policy and they did 2% of the vertical construction projects. 2435 02:36:58,360 --> 02:37:03,360 They did amend that policy into a small portion to streets, the majority of it 2436 02:37:03,360 --> 02:37:08,360 to the public safety facilities which were part of that proposition and then 2437 02:37:08,360 --> 02:37:13,360 $180,000 to park system improvements. In 2019 they did things a little differently and 2438 02:37:13,360 --> 02:37:18,360 again they did a revision to the art policy and did a separate proposition for public art. 2439 02:37:18,360 --> 02:37:23,360 And that proposition did not pass that separate proposition. 2440 02:37:23,360 --> 02:37:28,360 A couple different art projects in the community. So your 2441 02:37:28,360 --> 02:37:33,360 decision, your charge as the committee is to decide and maybe have these options backwards 2442 02:37:33,360 --> 02:37:38,360 is first you can recommend not to include public art. The second option is 2443 02:37:38,360 --> 02:37:43,360 you can include to recommend it and then what percentage would you like to make a 2444 02:37:43,360 --> 02:37:48,360 recommendation on. So starting in meeting 5 and 6 you're going to have those updated 2445 02:37:48,360 --> 02:37:53,360 numbers. We have a cap in which you are unable to go over. 2446 02:37:53,360 --> 02:37:58,360 So right now 2% of the vertical construction 2447 02:37:58,360 --> 02:38:03,360 projects. 2448 02:38:03,360 --> 02:38:08,360 So 2%, 3% or 4% on the current projects. That's right now what you're seeing currently 2449 02:38:08,360 --> 02:38:13,360 as presented. So if you change, if you leave library in, take another 2450 02:38:13,360 --> 02:38:18,360 structure out, those percentages will change and then you'll be making a recommendation. 2451 02:38:18,360 --> 02:38:23,360 And just a quick reminder 2452 02:38:23,360 --> 02:38:28,360 as part of this you're not considering any specific projects. So public art right now 2453 02:38:28,360 --> 02:38:33,360 is governed by, there's a public art policy, there's a public art master plan the city's 2454 02:38:33,360 --> 02:38:38,360 adopted and then we have a public art committee. And in addition to that any bond program 2455 02:38:38,360 --> 02:38:43,360 which public art is included in goes through a bond oversight committee. So projects 2456 02:38:43,360 --> 02:38:48,360 once they're funded then we'll go through the public art committee to determine what type of art at the 2457 02:38:48,360 --> 02:38:53,360 specific locations and we'll go through that ultimately council approval process before any 2458 02:38:53,360 --> 02:38:58,360 projects are started. And that question has come up 2459 02:38:58,360 --> 02:39:03,360 in a couple different ones I wanted to hit on. So bond funds are dedicated to the purchase and installation of the art 2460 02:39:03,360 --> 02:39:08,360 and then ongoing maintenance as part of the parks and recreation 2461 02:39:08,360 --> 02:39:13,360 operating budget. Any questions on public art? 2462 02:39:13,360 --> 02:39:18,360 Christine, one quick question. Does the policy at one point require that the 2463 02:39:18,360 --> 02:39:23,360 art be a part of the project that was approved by the 2464 02:39:23,360 --> 02:39:28,360 voters? Is that still what the policy is? That's correct unless you amend it to do a separate one 2465 02:39:28,360 --> 02:39:33,360 for streets but yes it does have to be connected to it. So in some of those pictures where in prior 2466 02:39:33,360 --> 02:39:38,360 bonds you've had a fire station there's public art out at that facility. 2467 02:39:38,360 --> 02:39:43,360 In the 2014 one I think it showed there was a street dollar amount for streets which is the 2468 02:39:43,360 --> 02:39:48,360 roundabout over near the hospital where you're seeing that dog star public art on the roundabout. 2469 02:39:48,360 --> 02:39:53,360 So the location of the art would be tied to the proximity of the projects that are 2470 02:39:53,360 --> 02:39:58,360 approved in the propositions. Any of the vertical projects? Correct. Questions? 2471 02:39:58,360 --> 02:40:03,360 How much money is in the public art fund today? 2472 02:40:03,360 --> 02:40:08,360 I don't have that. So I don't have that. We can follow up on what that fund balance looks like. 2473 02:40:08,360 --> 02:40:13,360 They get an allocation annually from hot funds but major projects are typically 2474 02:40:13,360 --> 02:40:18,360 funded out of the bond program. So the utility wraps that you're seeing 2475 02:40:18,360 --> 02:40:23,360 on some of the utility boxes right now came from that budget. They go after different 2476 02:40:23,360 --> 02:40:28,360 grants for public art but we'll send through the parking lot what their current balance is. Okay because there was 2477 02:40:28,360 --> 02:40:33,360 a half million dollars in the public art fund in 2019. During that bond program? 2478 02:40:33,360 --> 02:40:38,360 And if you can tell around town Parks and Recreation and the Public Art Committee has done 2479 02:40:38,360 --> 02:40:43,360 an amazing job the last couple years. There is so much public art throughout the community so 2480 02:40:43,360 --> 02:40:48,360 we'll see if that was maybe utilized when it's gone down. For the design and creation of the 2481 02:40:48,360 --> 02:40:53,360 art pieces, does that go to artists in Denton or does that money 2482 02:40:53,360 --> 02:40:58,360 stay in Denton? So we're giving it but it's sort of reinvesting back in the community a bit. Public art 2483 02:40:58,360 --> 02:41:03,360 has a little bit different procurement policies than typically anything else the city procures. 2484 02:41:03,360 --> 02:41:08,360 We do go out and do a call for artists and there is an evaluation so they do 2485 02:41:08,360 --> 02:41:13,360 the evaluation committee does have the opportunity to say we want that to be a local artist 2486 02:41:13,360 --> 02:41:18,360 but there's not a requirement that it has to be a local artist. 2487 02:41:18,360 --> 02:41:23,360 My question is on that slide where you said proposed we have option one and option two. 2488 02:41:23,360 --> 02:41:28,360 Could this committee decide or make a recommendation for an option 2489 02:41:28,360 --> 02:41:33,360 three which would be we want to include in this bond election 2490 02:41:33,360 --> 02:41:38,360 one million dollars or two million dollars whatever the number is specifically for 2491 02:41:38,360 --> 02:41:43,360 public art and not have it be a percentage and not have it be no we don't want 2492 02:41:43,360 --> 02:41:48,360 it included? I think you can make that recommendation and because that's previously what's been done is to 2493 02:41:48,360 --> 02:41:53,360 go back and just amend that policy so yes. I think if you're wanting to determine 2494 02:41:53,360 --> 02:41:58,360 a certain dollar amount we would then need to do recommend to council and then we do an amendment 2495 02:41:58,360 --> 02:42:03,360 to the public art policy prior to going in at any proposition. 2496 02:42:03,360 --> 02:42:08,360 Okay thanks. 2497 02:42:08,360 --> 02:42:13,360 Any other questions or discussion on this topic? 2498 02:42:13,360 --> 02:42:18,360 Okay thank you Christine and we 2499 02:42:18,360 --> 02:42:23,360 just in the nick of time. 2500 02:42:23,360 --> 02:42:28,360 As one who has lived here since 1957 when we didn't have 2501 02:42:28,360 --> 02:42:33,360 public art to speak of at all I think it has made an amazing 2502 02:42:33,360 --> 02:42:38,360 difference in our city. I just what we've done about 2503 02:42:38,360 --> 02:42:43,360 public art and I hope we continue. 2504 02:42:43,360 --> 02:42:48,360 Thank you. Okay we have one more topic 2505 02:42:48,360 --> 02:42:53,360 relating to the facilities tour in case there's any conversation about that. 2506 02:42:53,360 --> 02:42:58,360 We wanted to have a point on the agenda for it but before we get to that the facilitators 2507 02:42:58,360 --> 02:43:03,360 at your table have those half sheets of paper for the temperature gauge that we did. 2508 02:43:03,360 --> 02:43:08,360 Hopefully you saw the results of that which I think is helpful to just kind of get a sense of what those are 2509 02:43:08,360 --> 02:43:13,360 and this will help bring us up to date in case there's any movement on any of our thoughts on those 2510 02:43:13,360 --> 02:43:18,360 projects as well as 2511 02:43:18,360 --> 02:43:23,360 the ones we heard today. So while you guys can do that I wanted to see in 2512 02:43:23,360 --> 02:43:28,360 item C hold a discussion to provide feedback regarding the June 10th facilities tour. 2513 02:43:28,360 --> 02:43:33,360 Any comments or discussion? There doesn't have to be much but we 2514 02:43:33,360 --> 02:43:38,360 wanted to make a placeholder in here in case there was. 2515 02:43:38,360 --> 02:43:43,360 I just wanted to thank all the staff that came along with us and not all of them are here the department heads and 2516 02:43:43,360 --> 02:43:48,360 at the facilities but everybody just did an excellent job 2517 02:43:48,360 --> 02:43:53,360 explaining things and answering questions and not all of our questions were expected or even 2518 02:43:53,360 --> 02:43:58,360 necessarily pertinent to what they expected to be talking about but the staff just did a fantastic job 2519 02:43:58,360 --> 02:44:03,360 doing the tour and facilitating it and answering questions at each site. So thank you. 2520 02:44:03,360 --> 02:44:08,360 And just a quick comment, if you are having trouble 2521 02:44:08,360 --> 02:44:13,360 facilitating the survey through your phone, the temperature gauge, I think we have some 2522 02:44:13,360 --> 02:44:18,360 options there in the back to be able to help you do that while you're here 2523 02:44:18,360 --> 02:44:23,360 because this will eventually turn off at some point and so we want to make sure you have the option to do that. 2524 02:44:23,360 --> 02:44:28,360 Any other comments? It's laptops, yes. So if somebody needs a bigger screen 2525 02:44:28,360 --> 02:44:33,360 or your device is dying, there are laptops in the back you can use and I think last time we 2526 02:44:33,360 --> 02:44:38,360 closed it down shortly after the meeting. Any other comments or 2527 02:44:38,360 --> 02:44:43,360 discussion relating to the facilities tour? 2528 02:44:43,360 --> 02:44:48,360 Okay, well we'll close out that item and then real quick before we adjourn on 2529 02:44:48,360 --> 02:44:53,360 including items, we had a couple questions about kind of the meetings moving forward. 2530 02:44:53,360 --> 02:44:58,360 There's no meeting scheduled for next week and then there's a meeting for the next week 2531 02:44:58,360 --> 02:45:03,360 and then the following week. The following week is July 7th I believe 2532 02:45:03,360 --> 02:45:08,360 and there has been some conversation as to whether or not folks are out on vacation. 2533 02:45:08,360 --> 02:45:13,360 That's July 4th week with July 4th hitting a Tuesday I think. 2534 02:45:13,360 --> 02:45:18,360 So the option is to be able to actually move that meeting back 2535 02:45:18,360 --> 02:45:23,360 a week. So I'm throwing that out there as a pitch for you all 2536 02:45:23,360 --> 02:45:28,360 not to discuss right now but that we'll follow up via email if you have any thoughts one way 2537 02:45:28,360 --> 02:45:33,360 or the other on moving that to the subsequent week. We have the ability to do so 2538 02:45:33,360 --> 02:45:38,360 and get it out of that July 4th week and into the following week. 2539 02:45:38,360 --> 02:45:43,360 So I'll throw something out. If you have comments, email me 2540 02:45:43,360 --> 02:45:48,360 contact me via phone or email after this meeting and we don't want to screw up 2541 02:45:48,360 --> 02:45:53,360 anyone's schedule if you already kind of scheduled that in but if it's an option to do that we might be able to 2542 02:45:53,360 --> 02:45:58,360 since it's the last meeting get more people involved in that final important discussion. 2543 02:45:58,360 --> 02:46:03,360 Alright with that, finish up your survey and thank you all 2544 02:46:03,360 --> 02:46:08,360 for your patience and time and attention. We are adjourned.