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 >> Good evening and welcome to the planning

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 and zoning work session meeting for November 28th, 2018.

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 We can open the meeting at 437.

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 First item on the agenda is any clarification of agenda items.

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 It seems like other than two postponed items.

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 Is there any other changes?

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 >> The work session report, we're going to come back

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 on the design standards.

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 We just need to work through some more details on sort

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 of the governance of that.

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 So we'll be bringing that to another meeting.

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 Probably when we have less of a full agenda.

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 I know we've got quite-- I don't even know

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 if we would actually probably get to it anyways given the number

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 of items that we have today.

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 We won't be doing that.

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 >> And without a consent agenda,

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 we will spend the next two hours potentially

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 in our public hearing items.

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 So with that, we can jump right into item B

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 since item A is being postponed to the December 12th meeting.

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 Item B is the SUP that we heard last meeting

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 but I'll invite Haley for continued discussion

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 on the item.

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 >> All right, good evening.

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 I will keep this brief hopefully unless we need

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 to dive back into the details.

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 So this is the Windsor Drive Apartments SUP.

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 The request as you may remember was to make a recommendation

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 to city council regarding a request for an SUP

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 for a multifamily use on the property that's outlined

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 in yellow, it's approximately 31 acres located at the intersection

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 of Windsor and the I-35 frontage road.

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 This item was continued from the November 14th meeting

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 at the applicant's request.

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 They asked for more time to develop a modified plan.

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 I did want to point out that the public hearing was closed

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 that night so this would just be

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 for discussion and motion this evening.

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 And we're following the meeting, the applicant did decide

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 to move forward with staff's original recommended condition

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 so there is no revised plan to go

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 over with you all at this time.

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 And as you may remember, notices were sent for this case

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 but we've received no responses to that.

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 And just a refresher, with this case, we are trying

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 to capture all the details of the site plan in the ordinance

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 so all of these requirements listed

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 on the screen would be expressly outlined in the ordinance.

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 All six items relate to the details

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 that were on the original site plan.

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 And then based on that, staff did have four conditions

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 that we're recommending with the SUP.

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 The first be that council would recognize

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 that driveway access locations

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 from the state highway must be approved by TechStot

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 and that alterations to the configuration

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 of I-35 are currently in the planning stages.

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 So any driveway access locations

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 on the northbound frontage road which have to be altered

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 as a result of TechStot's plans during the permitting process,

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 we ask that those be able to be administratively approved

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 by staff providing that all other elements

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 of the site plan are complied with.

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 The second condition is that landscaping on the site plan does

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 reflect an intent to comply with all the DDC requirements

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 in terms of parking lot landscaping, street trees,

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 minimum landscaping, canopy area and buffers.

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 However, the applicant is requesting administrative

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 approval for an alternative buffer along

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 that western property line as you may remember

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 from the discussion last time.

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 So minor alterations to the locations

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 of individual plantings shown on the plan may be approved

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 by staff provided that the final landscaping complies

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 with the site plan in terms of buffer and open space locations

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 as well as all other components of the DDC.

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 The third condition relates to an agreement

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 between the surface developer and the gas well operator.

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 So one of our conditions recommended is

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 that the agreement entered into by these two parties

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 that sets forth the 250 foot reverse setbacks shown

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 on the site plan for both of the well sites be filed in the records

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 of Denton County prior to approval of a plat

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 for the subject property and then that a note be placed

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 on the plant recognizing the agreement and the setbacks.

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 And then finally the fourth condition would be

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 that notwithstanding the limited administrative approvals

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 that were outlined in these criteria as well as conditions one

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 and two that the city would reserve the right

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 to require approval by ordinance of any amendment to the SUP.

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 And I'm happy to go through any other details of the case.

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 It's just kind of a high level overview of where we're at.

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 >> Mr. Beck.

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 >> Thank you Chair.

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 Just to be clear, there is no-- currently there is no definitive

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 commercial development that will happen.

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 >> Correct.

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 There are-- if I can get to the site plan, the area shown

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 in red are intended for commercial development someday

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 but there are no definitive plans for that yet.

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 >> There's no date.

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 >> Okay.

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 >> Not that I'm aware of.

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 >> Great, thanks.

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 >> Commissioner Smith.

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 >> Thank you Chair.

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 So what was-- the applicant originally was asking once the,

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 once the, you know, the conditions that--

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 or the recommendations I should say that the city staff were one

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 to put on there, they found out only a short period

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 of time before they would come back and see it.

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 Why did they eventually give in to the recommendations

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 and why is there no change?

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 Because that was the discussion a lot of last time was like,

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 well we'd actually have to see it this way instead.

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 >> Correct.

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 It was through discussions actually

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 with legal staff following the meeting.

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 The way our notices are worded, it implies that PNZ

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 and council can recommend and approve anything that is--

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 make sure I get this right--

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 equal to or more restrictive than what was seen

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 at the meeting.

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 What they were proposing is actually less restrictive.

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 >> Okay, so--

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 >> So it would have required another notification.

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 >> So, oh, so that's-- so they just said just for the sake

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 of notification issue and delaying the process--

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 >> Correct, yeah, just to keep moving forward--

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 >> Go ahead and--

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 >> Correct.

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 >> -- bend to the will.

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 Okay. And then if we vote-- vote any type of motion,

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 it would be for staff's recommendations

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 and the conditions, correct?

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 >> Mm-hmm.

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 >> Okay, got it.

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 Perfect, thank you.

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 >> Any other questions for Haley?

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 Great. Thank you, Haley.

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 >> Thank you.

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 >> Next item is the specific use permit S18-0002B.

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 This item was continued from October 24th meeting.

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 I'll ask Cindy.

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 Is Cindy here?

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 >> Yeah.

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 >> Oh, I'm behind Matt's head.

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 I couldn't see.

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 I'll invite Cindy Jackson for presentation.

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 >> And this was for which one, sir?

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 >> S18-002B, 2B, got to be that--

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 >> One above that, two above that.

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 >> No.

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 >> Yeah.

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 >> Two above you highlighted.

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 >> Third one down.

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 >> This one?

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 >> Yeah.

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 >> Okay, yes.

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 And I-- you are familiar with this one.

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 This is the request for an SUP for a specific use permit

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 to allow quick vehicle servicing in suite 110 and suite 111

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 of the budget self-storage site.

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 The property, again, is located at 2820 Virginia Circle.

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 You can see it right here.

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 Now, when we were last here, the item was continued

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 from the October 28th planning and zoning commission meeting

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 to allow the tenants, the two tenants involved time

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 to address the parking issues associated with these two suites.

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 If you'll recall, there was parking--

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 quite a bit of parking on the lot that was adjacent

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 to the site, the vacant lot adjacent to the site.

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 At that time, the public hearing was not closed.

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 We had-- we went out there today and as of today,

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 the vehicles have been removed from the lot adjacent to the site

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 and there are-- there are not a lot of vehicles

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 in the parking area in front of the units.

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 Mr. Melton who was in suite 111 has left

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 and Mr. Haney now has leased the unit

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 and has both units 110 and 111.

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 These are the photos that were taken back in February 2018

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 and you can see the cars are stacked.

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 There's no room between them.

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 I don't know how they get them out to be honest.

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 Along the front of the site, this shows the adjacent lot

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 and this shows the two units right here and here's a head

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 on of the two units right here.

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 This was taken November 11th and as you can see,

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 there are still some cars parked around here to the side

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 of the site and these-- the cars on the adjacent lot as well,

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 you can see these two cars which are right here, here

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 and there are also cars here.

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 So there's a total of approximately four cars still

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 on the vacant lot next door.

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 You can see there's quite a few less cars.

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 There are fewer cars there along the--

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 in the parking area in the front.

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 Now this was November 11th

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 and these pictures were taken this afternoon.

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 The adjacent lot is clear.

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 There are what you'd expect to see a normal number of cars along

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 the front of the site and here's a close up of that.

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 Again, just to remind you, this is a public hearing.

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 We sent out notices via certified mail

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 and courtesy postcards and we received no responses.

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 There was one site-- one sign posted on the site.

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 Staff recommends denial of this request.

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 However, should the commission decide to recommend approval,

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 staff recommends the following recommendations.

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 A new certificate of occupancy should be issued

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 for the correct use, quick vehicle servicing.

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 A new-- the new certificate of occupancy shall state

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 that the proposed use of new quick vehicle servicing is

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 limited to this particular business owner

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 and these two particular suites.

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 This specific use permit will be limited to the use description

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 and floor plan as shown in Exhibits 8 and 9.

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 Overnight, outdoor storage of automobiles is prohibited

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 and no more than two customer vehicles per business can be

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 parked in the parking spaces

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 in front of the building during business hours.

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 And that concludes my presentation.

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 >> Ms. Charles.

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 >> Thank you, Chair.

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 So Cindy, we actually only have one business now.

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 So, does that need to be reworded or?

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 >> No, no, he's in both suites, suite 110 and 111.

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 >> But it's just one, not per each.

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 >> So you're saying for each suite?

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 >> For each suite, yes.

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 We have to park each suite

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 and that's what we're saying is each suite can have two spaces

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 for customer parking.

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 >> Commissioner Pernetta.

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 >> Okay. And kind of along those lines,

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 I believe it was Mr. Melton-- Mr. Melton wasn't here.

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 It was Mr. Haney before.

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 >> Mr. Haney was here last time.

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 >> Okay. And Mr. Melton has since vacated the property

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 as we were told.

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 So Mr. Haney is now occupying both of them?

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 >> Yes, he is.

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 >> So he would need a specific use permit for both.

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 >> That's right.

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 >> Okay.

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 >> Commissioner Sanchez.

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 >> If I remember correctly, when we first discussed this issue,

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 one of the things is he mentioned that he had rented

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 that lot next to him and he had gotten permission

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 to actually gravel that and according to--

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 if I remember correctly, I guess he had gotten

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 from code enforcement permission to utilize that as long

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 as it was graveled but the problem was

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 that gone beyond that or something?

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 >> Code enforcement never gave them permission to do that.

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 >> Okay.

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 >> Code enforcement was concerned about the number of cars,

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 the fact that they were parking on grass as well as gravel

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 and the nuisance factor that was out there.

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 >> Okay, that's what I remember him saying something about,

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 that he had put gravel out there but then they had gone beyond

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 that so that was one of the big issues.

264
00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:52,960
 Now, my other question is, there's other offices there?

265
00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:53,420
 >> Yes.

266
00:12:53,420 --> 00:12:56,660
 >> So each one gets two parking spots, right?

267
00:12:56,660 --> 00:12:57,260
 Is that correct?

268
00:12:57,260 --> 00:13:01,240
 >> Each one gets-- well, it depends on the floor area

269
00:13:01,240 --> 00:13:05,800
 of their suite and it depends on the use.

270
00:13:05,800 --> 00:13:12,120
 So each one, I went through the manager of the site gave me a list

271
00:13:12,120 --> 00:13:18,140
 of all of the tenants in their-- the strip, the building right now

272
00:13:18,140 --> 00:13:20,480
 and I went through and looked at each CEO

273
00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:24,420
 to see how much parking each one required

274
00:13:24,420 --> 00:13:28,320
 and for the total strip, 12 spaces are required

275
00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:30,360
 and that's how many are provided.

276
00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:31,200
 >> Right, right.

277
00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:37,200
 And so, when we saw that one picture of all those cars,

278
00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:40,200
 were some of those cars belong to some of those other suites

279
00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:42,680
 or was it just-- we just assumed that they all belong to--

280
00:13:42,680 --> 00:13:43,740
 >> I don't know.

281
00:13:43,740 --> 00:13:44,280
 >> Okay.

282
00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:45,440
 >> We can't tell that.

283
00:13:45,440 --> 00:13:46,480
 >> Well, that's what I was wondering.

284
00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:48,580
 We just saw that one picture but we don't know

285
00:13:48,580 --> 00:13:52,640
 if those cars belong to anybody else in that office space

286
00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:56,280
 and so we don't know how many of those actually belong to that.

287
00:13:56,280 --> 00:14:00,620
 >> Well, I can tell you that 12 cars are permitted to park

288
00:14:00,620 --> 00:14:01,420
 in that area.

289
00:14:01,420 --> 00:14:02,360
 >> Okay.

290
00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:05,360
 >> And there were over 15 cars there.

291
00:14:05,360 --> 00:14:07,160
 >> Okay.

292
00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:09,200
 >> Okay. But we don't know who they belong to,

293
00:14:09,200 --> 00:14:11,300
 if they belong to him or they belong to somebody else.

294
00:14:11,300 --> 00:14:15,400
 >> Well, the-- now, from my discussions with the applicant,

295
00:14:15,400 --> 00:14:18,200
 some of them did belong to these two businesses.

296
00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:19,580
 >> Okay, okay.

297
00:14:19,580 --> 00:14:25,120
 >> The number, I don't know but, yeah, they had.

298
00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:27,080
 >> Commissioner Beck.

299
00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:28,520
 >> Thank you, Chair.

300
00:14:28,520 --> 00:14:34,580
 And I hate to be Mr. Skeptical here but do we have any provision

301
00:14:34,580 --> 00:14:38,860
 other than maybe a complaint that down the road he may be

302
00:14:38,860 --> 00:14:42,820
 in violation again, I would maybe put before the commission,

303
00:14:42,820 --> 00:14:45,300
 maybe should we put that sometime

304
00:14:45,300 --> 00:14:48,060
 in the next year there would be a random inspection,

305
00:14:48,060 --> 00:14:51,400
 a one-time random inspection just to make sure it's compliant

306
00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:54,680
 because I can see this getting out of control again.

307
00:14:54,680 --> 00:14:57,980
 >> You're welcome to add any stipulations that you want

308
00:14:57,980 --> 00:14:59,840
 to add to the recommendation.

309
00:14:59,840 --> 00:15:04,180
 >> Would it be fair to kind of just ask, just a general nod

310
00:15:04,180 --> 00:15:07,720
 from everybody if that would be a--

311
00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:10,280
 >> I do have some concerns with putting

312
00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:12,920
 that in there as a requirement because this is passed

313
00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:20,860
 by ordinance and, you know, the enforcement is generally left

314
00:15:20,860 --> 00:15:24,140
 to the code enforcement department to enforce the provisions

315
00:15:24,140 --> 00:15:28,000
 of the ordinance that go through the legislative process.

316
00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:28,900
 >> OK.

317
00:15:28,900 --> 00:15:31,180
 >> I can tell you that the code enforcement officer is going

318
00:15:31,180 --> 00:15:34,040
 to have this on his radar for a while.

319
00:15:34,040 --> 00:15:35,140
 >> OK.

320
00:15:35,140 --> 00:15:37,120
 >> That's good enough for me then, thank you.

321
00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:38,120
 Commissioner Pernetta.

322
00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:41,520
 >> OK. So the-- you mentioned that there's about 15 cars,

323
00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:43,360
 that was as of today?

324
00:15:43,360 --> 00:15:44,860
 >> No, there's 12 today.

325
00:15:44,860 --> 00:15:45,660
 >> 12 today, OK.

326
00:15:45,660 --> 00:15:49,320
 >> Right. They had 15 parking spaces originally

327
00:15:49,320 --> 00:15:51,520
 and when the site plan was originally submitted

328
00:15:51,520 --> 00:15:56,140
 and I checked the dimensions of the parking spaces they had,

329
00:15:56,140 --> 00:15:59,960
 they didn't meet our required dimensions for parallel parking.

330
00:15:59,960 --> 00:16:02,840
 So the applicant restriped them according to code

331
00:16:02,840 --> 00:16:05,240
 and reduced the parking down to 12.

332
00:16:05,240 --> 00:16:09,180
 >> OK. The other thing that I remember, Mr. Haney talked

333
00:16:09,180 --> 00:16:14,020
 about the possibility of storing cars within the facility.

334
00:16:14,020 --> 00:16:15,020
 >> Yeah.

335
00:16:15,020 --> 00:16:17,380
 >> Were you able to check the size of, you know,

336
00:16:17,380 --> 00:16:19,620
 the building or the interior to see

337
00:16:19,620 --> 00:16:22,500
 if that could effectively do what he claimed?

338
00:16:22,500 --> 00:16:25,320
 >> We have-- I included a dimension site plan

339
00:16:25,320 --> 00:16:29,060
 in your exhibits and you can take a look at that

340
00:16:29,060 --> 00:16:31,360
 and see if that would work out.

341
00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:34,700
 It looks to me like he could fit at least two in there

342
00:16:34,700 --> 00:16:40,100
 but I'm not a car person so I don't know.

343
00:16:40,100 --> 00:16:41,240
 >> Thank you very much.

344
00:16:41,240 --> 00:16:42,940
 >> I think legal wants to ask a question.

345
00:16:42,940 --> 00:16:45,780
 >> Yeah. Cindy, just so we don't have any, you know,

346
00:16:45,780 --> 00:16:50,120
 misunderstandings here as far as if the commission were

347
00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:51,580
 to recommend this.

348
00:16:51,580 --> 00:16:57,420
 Are there still building code issues that would remain apart

349
00:16:57,420 --> 00:17:02,260
 from the zoning issues that might prevent this

350
00:17:02,260 --> 00:17:07,100
 from ever being a viable option for a business?

351
00:17:07,100 --> 00:17:08,240
 >> Not that I'm aware of.

352
00:17:08,240 --> 00:17:09,340
 >> OK.

353
00:17:09,340 --> 00:17:13,200
 >> No. The whole issue was the fact that they were

354
00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:17,280
 in violation of their CO and that they were parking

355
00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:19,920
 on the adjacent lot.

356
00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:20,620
 >> Christopher Smith.

357
00:17:20,620 --> 00:17:21,840
 >> Thank you, Chair.

358
00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:24,460
 Yeah, that's actually slightly what my question was going

359
00:17:24,460 --> 00:17:26,780
 to be with legal ask which was that what was the likelihood

360
00:17:26,780 --> 00:17:29,380
 that an actual CO would be issued for this because--

361
00:17:29,380 --> 00:17:30,960
 but I'm guessing that you're what you're saying is

362
00:17:30,960 --> 00:17:33,400
 that the reason they're in the violation of their CO is

363
00:17:33,400 --> 00:17:36,060
 that they had filed for a use that was allowed

364
00:17:36,060 --> 00:17:38,400
 and if there's zoning but because we'll have an SCP,

365
00:17:38,400 --> 00:17:41,300
 now this use would be allowed so really other

366
00:17:41,300 --> 00:17:45,440
 than just building standard things, you know, exits,

367
00:17:45,440 --> 00:17:47,240
 mark, bathrooms, everything else.

368
00:17:47,240 --> 00:17:48,740
 They should be able to get a CO pretty easily.

369
00:17:48,740 --> 00:17:49,640
 >> Yes.

370
00:17:49,640 --> 00:17:51,020
 >> So it is very likely that if we approve the CO

371
00:17:51,020 --> 00:17:54,380
 that they approve the SCP that they will get a CO.

372
00:17:54,380 --> 00:17:54,980
 >> Exactly.

373
00:17:54,980 --> 00:17:55,980
 >> Sure. OK, awesome.

374
00:17:55,980 --> 00:17:57,580
 Thank you.

375
00:17:57,580 --> 00:17:58,360
 >> Christopher Beck.

376
00:17:58,360 --> 00:18:02,760
 >> Thank you, Chair and in so doing then, should he grow

377
00:18:02,760 --> 00:18:06,020
 and expand and move out of there that would allow somebody else

378
00:18:06,020 --> 00:18:06,920
 to come in and do this?

379
00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:07,560
 >> No.

380
00:18:07,560 --> 00:18:08,500
 >> We'd have to start over, right?

381
00:18:08,500 --> 00:18:12,060
 >> That is why we are putting that requirement

382
00:18:12,060 --> 00:18:14,440
 that you see right here.

383
00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:17,400
 The new certificate of occupancy shall state

384
00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:20,440
 that the proposed use of quick vehicle service is limited

385
00:18:20,440 --> 00:18:22,580
 to this particular business owner and these two.

386
00:18:22,580 --> 00:18:23,180
 >> OK.

387
00:18:23,180 --> 00:18:26,320
 >> So when the business owner leaves, they have to--

388
00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:29,880
 if they wanted to put quick vehicle servicing in there again,

389
00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:31,680
 they would have to go through the SUP process.

390
00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:32,580
 >> OK. Good.

391
00:18:32,580 --> 00:18:33,920
 Thanks.

392
00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:39,160
 >> So I have a couple of questions.

393
00:18:39,160 --> 00:18:43,740
 We took last time of limiting SUP to a business

394
00:18:43,740 --> 00:18:46,500
 and we-- I think the conclusion was the SUP is limited

395
00:18:46,500 --> 00:18:49,480
 to the use of the land.

396
00:18:49,480 --> 00:18:53,180
 Is it within this authority or the council authority

397
00:18:53,180 --> 00:18:58,320
 to limit the CO to a business?

398
00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:04,460
 >> Yes. This is how the city attorney said it had

399
00:19:04,460 --> 00:19:07,360
 to be restricted during the meeting last time.

400
00:19:07,360 --> 00:19:08,360
 >> OK.

401
00:19:08,360 --> 00:19:10,460
 >> The CO would be the instrument.

402
00:19:10,460 --> 00:19:11,120
 >> Gotcha.

403
00:19:11,120 --> 00:19:11,960
 >> It wasn't me.

404
00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:13,000
 >> Yeah, it was.

405
00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:14,200
 It's in the minutes.

406
00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:16,540
 [ Laughter ]

407
00:19:16,540 --> 00:19:20,400
 >> Remind me a dog when you guys come up with the minutes.

408
00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:21,340
 >> Yeah.

409
00:19:21,340 --> 00:19:24,600
 [ Laughter ]

410
00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:28,540
 >> Well, then, that'd be my question is if there can be

411
00:19:28,540 --> 00:19:31,080
 stipulations enforced, whoever issues the certificate

412
00:19:31,080 --> 00:19:32,680
 of occupancy, that that has to be limited

413
00:19:32,680 --> 00:19:34,980
 and what's the mechanism to ensure

414
00:19:34,980 --> 00:19:37,720
 that the individual's issuing the CO know about this.

415
00:19:37,720 --> 00:19:40,460
 That would be more just to put on their radar.

416
00:19:40,460 --> 00:19:43,120
 Commissioner Pernette asked a question.

417
00:19:43,120 --> 00:19:45,000
 I was surprised by the answer.

418
00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:50,300
 He said would each suite need to have its own SUP.

419
00:19:50,300 --> 00:19:53,740
 You responded affirmatively, we're only seeing one SUP.

420
00:19:53,740 --> 00:19:56,340
 So is this SUP for suite 110 or 110?

421
00:19:56,340 --> 00:19:58,600
 >> Well, then I must have misunderstood his question then.

422
00:19:58,600 --> 00:19:59,600
 >> OK.

423
00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:04,340
 >> Because this suite is for-- this SUP is for suite 110 and 111.

424
00:20:04,340 --> 00:20:04,840
 >> OK.

425
00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:05,840
 >> Those two.

426
00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:06,720
 >> Perfect.

427
00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:07,620
 That was my understanding.

428
00:20:07,620 --> 00:20:09,980
 I was a little confused by the response.

429
00:20:09,980 --> 00:20:12,760
 >> Yeah. I just misunderstood the question then.

430
00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:15,220
 >> Lastly, I'm not sure if it's articulated

431
00:20:15,220 --> 00:20:18,500
 or can you re-articulate, given these provisions,

432
00:20:18,500 --> 00:20:23,200
 why the staff would be in denial of this request?

433
00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:27,460
 >> Well, this-- we call this a soft denial to be honest

434
00:20:27,460 --> 00:20:31,780
 with you where we feel that because it was denied

435
00:20:31,780 --> 00:20:36,080
 as an automotive use previously back in 2010,

436
00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:41,080
 we feel that we would be better served if we went ahead

437
00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:44,080
 and recommended denial again and let the commission

438
00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:48,620
 and the council decide if this is an appropriate location.

439
00:20:48,620 --> 00:20:51,220
 >> OK. Thank you.

440
00:20:51,220 --> 00:20:54,060
 So any other questions for this item?

441
00:20:54,060 --> 00:20:56,960
 Great. Thank you, Cindy.

442
00:20:56,960 --> 00:20:58,600
 >> Thank you.

443
00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:00,160
 >> Although, don't go too far.

444
00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:00,840
 >> Oh.

445
00:21:00,840 --> 00:21:07,840
 >> Next item is S189A, the SUP for Verizon Wireless.

446
00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:13,480
 >> I have a lot of-- it would be at all possible to skip

447
00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:16,320
 to the next one while I sort of-- I printed out a bunch--

448
00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:19,020
 >> This one's-- I'm getting a notification

449
00:21:19,020 --> 00:21:19,860
 that you're not mic'd.

450
00:21:19,860 --> 00:21:22,960
 You're wanting to come back to the Verizon?

451
00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:23,460
 OK.

452
00:21:23,460 --> 00:21:25,460
 >> Yes. I'll come back after the next one

453
00:21:25,460 --> 00:21:28,220
 because I just need to sort out all of the notifications,

454
00:21:28,220 --> 00:21:30,400
 responses we got to give to you.

455
00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:32,440
 >> And just for those listening, Cindy said that she's going

456
00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:34,200
 to sort out some things and come back.

457
00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:36,200
 I wanted to make sure we don't miss that.

458
00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:44,280
 With that, Julie Wyatt, can you present on PDA 18-1?

459
00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:45,480
 >> Yes.

460
00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:57,760
 >> Good evening.

461
00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:00,260
 I'm Julie Wyatt, Senior Planner with the City of Denton.

462
00:22:00,260 --> 00:22:04,740
 And I'm presenting PDA 18-1, King's Ridge.

463
00:22:04,740 --> 00:22:06,740
 The request before you is to hold a public hearing

464
00:22:06,740 --> 00:22:08,100
 and consider a recommendation

465
00:22:08,100 --> 00:22:12,180
 to City Council regarding a general concept plan amendment

466
00:22:12,180 --> 00:22:16,420
 and detail plan approval for PD 115.

467
00:22:16,420 --> 00:22:19,520
 The property is on approximately 78 acres

468
00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:22,920
 and it is located adjacent to Bonnie Bray.

469
00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:25,420
 Bonnie Bray is here, just south of Elm Street.

470
00:22:25,420 --> 00:22:28,920
 So it's sort of in the north part of the city.

471
00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:33,360
 So we don't see PDs a whole lot so we'll just go

472
00:22:33,360 --> 00:22:38,760
 over briefly general items about plan developments.

473
00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:42,680
 So the 2002 Denton Development Code doesn't actually have plan

474
00:22:42,680 --> 00:22:47,880
 developments but it did carry over 15 PDs that were

475
00:22:47,880 --> 00:22:52,880
 in effect prior to the adoption of the 2002 code.

476
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:57,180
 Because these are holdovers from prior to 2002,

477
00:22:57,180 --> 00:23:02,300
 we looked to the 1991 code in order to regulate these

478
00:23:02,300 --> 00:23:04,800
 and administer the PDs.

479
00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:06,600
 So in the '91 code it says

480
00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:09,600
 that plan developments generally encourage flexible

481
00:23:09,600 --> 00:23:12,940
 and creative planning to ensure compatibility of uses

482
00:23:12,940 --> 00:23:17,380
 and superior design, amenities, open space, and environmental

483
00:23:17,380 --> 00:23:18,480
 or historic preservation.

484
00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:20,680
 That was the intent of PDs.

485
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:24,580
 And PDs were generally approved in a two-step process.

486
00:23:24,580 --> 00:23:30,620
 The general concept plan which was the broadest part of the PD.

487
00:23:30,620 --> 00:23:33,720
 It established maybe broad general guidelines,

488
00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:37,300
 the land use types, the general locations of those land uses,

489
00:23:37,300 --> 00:23:39,500
 and then the project boundaries.

490
00:23:39,500 --> 00:23:43,360
 It does not expire, it's kind of the base zoning of the property.

491
00:23:43,360 --> 00:23:48,440
 >> I'm hearing myself and it's freaking me out.

492
00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:51,080
 >> I imagine so.

493
00:23:51,080 --> 00:23:52,620
 >> It's very meta.

494
00:23:52,620 --> 00:23:53,740
 >> Guys.

495
00:23:53,740 --> 00:24:01,620
 [ Inaudible Remarks ]

496
00:24:01,620 --> 00:24:04,260
 >> Step two is a detail plan.

497
00:24:04,260 --> 00:24:07,160
 That is the final step in the PD process.

498
00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:10,920
 It really lays out the details, what the buildings look like,

499
00:24:10,920 --> 00:24:13,200
 the orientation, the landscaping.

500
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:16,960
 These do expire after 24 months if it's not developed.

501
00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:20,640
 So the two steps for PDs, and we're actually going to be looking

502
00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:24,200
 at both of these items for PD 115 tonight.

503
00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:30,120
 So more generally, let's look at the background of PD 115.

504
00:24:30,120 --> 00:24:33,020
 It was established back in 1986.

505
00:24:33,020 --> 00:24:35,880
 The first general concept plan was approved at that time

506
00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:37,980
 and it was a mixed use development.

507
00:24:37,980 --> 00:24:41,960
 And you can see by the map here, this is PD 115 and it took

508
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:44,920
 in all of this green area right here.

509
00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:48,400
 PD 142 is also green, it's adjacent to it,

510
00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:51,040
 but really we're looking at this area right here.

511
00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:54,740
 It wasn't developed, so in 2000 they revised the general concept

512
00:24:54,740 --> 00:25:00,140
 plan to reallocate some of those uses and that is still in effect.

513
00:25:00,140 --> 00:25:01,640
 That has not expired and we'll look

514
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:04,520
 at that general concept plan in just a minute.

515
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:06,720
 Also in 2000, a detailed plan

516
00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:09,880
 for the single family uses was approved, it expired.

517
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,720
 And then in 2006, they came again, once again,

518
00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:17,120
 with a detailed plan for single family uses and it also expired.

519
00:25:17,120 --> 00:25:20,640
 So now we'll look at the 2000 general concept plan

520
00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:22,760
 that is in effect today.

521
00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:26,640
 It is-- it's actually much larger than the subject property.

522
00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:30,840
 So it continues to the south but this--

523
00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:32,140
 the subject property we're looking

524
00:25:32,140 --> 00:25:34,640
 at is just this part in black here.

525
00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:36,940
 And we'll look at just the mix of uses.

526
00:25:36,940 --> 00:25:40,020
 So they proposed single family, multi-family and commercial

527
00:25:40,020 --> 00:25:41,080
 and office.

528
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:44,760
 The single family was located in these areas

529
00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:46,720
 and there were two lot sizes.

530
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:52,020
 SF5, located here and here, called for 5,000 square foot lots.

531
00:25:52,020 --> 00:25:55,740
 SF7, in this general area and actually then continuing

532
00:25:55,740 --> 00:25:58,940
 on to the south, called for 7,000 square foot lots.

533
00:25:58,940 --> 00:26:02,140
 Multi-family was proposed in this general direct area

534
00:26:02,140 --> 00:26:04,740
 and then commercial and office in this area adjacent

535
00:26:04,740 --> 00:26:08,680
 to Bonnie Bray.

536
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:11,120
 So they are proposing to revise this

537
00:26:11,120 --> 00:26:15,320
 to only permit single family uses in this area.

538
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:18,960
 So this is the new concept plan and this is really just zooming

539
00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:23,760
 in on the most important part 'cause it's big,

540
00:26:23,760 --> 00:26:24,800
 it's hard to see.

541
00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:26,960
 So they are just proposing to flatten out the uses,

542
00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:30,100
 only permit single family dwellings at a maximum density

543
00:26:30,100 --> 00:26:33,400
 of 3.6 dwelling units per acre, minimum lot size

544
00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:37,840
 of 6,000 square feet with the dimensions of 50 by 100.

545
00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:39,520
 They also have other dimensional standards,

546
00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:41,880
 maximum height of 36 feet.

547
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:44,020
 They have the setbacks, the front side

548
00:26:44,020 --> 00:26:47,960
 and rear yard setbacks and then maximum lot coverage of 60%.

549
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:50,760
 This is fairly typical of what we see in our zoning

550
00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:54,200
 for our standard neighborhood residential districts.

551
00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:54,920
 >> Commissioner Beck.

552
00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:55,720
 >> Thank you, Chair.

553
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:57,700
 So my math is right, they could build a house

554
00:26:57,700 --> 00:27:03,000
 up to 3,600 square feet, 60% of 6,000.

555
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:04,500
 >> Well, that's a really good question.

556
00:27:04,500 --> 00:27:07,540
 The way we calculate lot coverage within the city

557
00:27:07,540 --> 00:27:09,440
 of Denton is not just the building,

558
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:11,240
 it is all impervious surface.

559
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:11,840
 >> Driveways.

560
00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:13,720
 >> That would be the building, driveway, sidewalk.

561
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:14,680
 And really they're kind

562
00:27:14,680 --> 00:27:17,420
 of following those general development standards

563
00:27:17,420 --> 00:27:18,480
 within the PD.

564
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:22,460
 >> 'Cause that seems if, yeah, if you got a house that big,

565
00:27:22,460 --> 00:27:25,620
 that doesn't really fit over there, does it seem like, yeah.

566
00:27:25,620 --> 00:27:28,160
 Okay, thanks.

567
00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:30,860
 >> So just generally the detail plan, the text,

568
00:27:30,860 --> 00:27:31,800
 it's in your backup.

569
00:27:31,800 --> 00:27:33,240
 I know it's pretty lengthy.

570
00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:35,440
 It discusses administration of the PD,

571
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:38,580
 what the rules control, the phasing, infrastructure,

572
00:27:38,580 --> 00:27:41,000
 the uses and dimensions, those are consistent

573
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:44,240
 with that concept plan that they're coming in with today.

574
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:46,980
 Mobility, open space, landscaping,

575
00:27:46,980 --> 00:27:49,180
 perimeter fencing, and design.

576
00:27:49,180 --> 00:27:53,620
 We'll go over some of these a little more specifically now.

577
00:27:53,620 --> 00:27:58,400
 So we just wanted to kind of show you what they're proposing

578
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:01,460
 versus what our standards are.

579
00:28:01,460 --> 00:28:04,700
 So the intent of the PD is to have more creative design

580
00:28:04,700 --> 00:28:07,500
 and superior, more quality development.

581
00:28:07,500 --> 00:28:10,240
 And so we wanted to show you what they're proposing

582
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:13,600
 versus what a typical NR4 would permit.

583
00:28:13,600 --> 00:28:18,420
 So if they came in and just said we just want to do NR4,

584
00:28:18,420 --> 00:28:21,420
 we don't want to do the PD, that would allow a maximum density

585
00:28:21,420 --> 00:28:23,020
 of four dwelling units per acre.

586
00:28:23,020 --> 00:28:26,060
 They're proposing a little less than that at 3.6.

587
00:28:26,060 --> 00:28:28,220
 Minimum open space in our residential areas,

588
00:28:28,220 --> 00:28:29,320
 we don't have any.

589
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:35,000
 They're actually proposing 13.38 acres of common open space.

590
00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:37,840
 Perimeter fencing, we don't have any requirements

591
00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:39,800
 for subdivision perimeter fencing

592
00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:41,700
 under the Denton Development Code.

593
00:28:41,700 --> 00:28:45,300
 They're proposing perimeter fencing in different locations

594
00:28:45,300 --> 00:28:47,840
 of masonry near Bonnie Bray and then wood

595
00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:49,880
 and ornamental metal to the south.

596
00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:51,640
 >> Mr. Smith?

597
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:53,340
 >> I'll wait for you to get down to him.

598
00:28:53,340 --> 00:28:55,680
 Sorry, once he gets into your body, I'm sorry.

599
00:28:55,680 --> 00:28:58,680
 >> We don't have any requirements for tree canopy

600
00:28:58,680 --> 00:29:01,120
 and open spaces under current rules

601
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:02,760
 in the Denton Development Code.

602
00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:04,320
 As part of our discussion with them,

603
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:08,560
 they're proposing an average 40% tree canopy

604
00:29:08,560 --> 00:29:11,260
 throughout their open space areas.

605
00:29:11,260 --> 00:29:14,000
 We don't have any requirements for entry monuments.

606
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:16,100
 They're proposing up to four.

607
00:29:16,100 --> 00:29:19,080
 Off-street trails, they're proposing 600 feet

608
00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:21,280
 of all-weather off-street trails.

609
00:29:21,280 --> 00:29:24,480
 Minimum masonry, we don't have any minimum masonry requirements

610
00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:26,840
 for single-family homes in the Denton Development Code.

611
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:29,420
 They're proposing a minimum 70% masonry.

612
00:29:29,420 --> 00:29:30,720
 >> Commissioner Smith?

613
00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:31,660
 >> Thank you, Chair.

614
00:29:31,660 --> 00:29:33,080
 So on the entry monuments, just to make sure,

615
00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:34,160
 because I'm reading through this and you're going

616
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:35,520
 to keep going through it, I'm sorry to interrupt you

617
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:35,960
 halfway through.

618
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:36,520
 >> No, it's all right.

619
00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:40,260
 >> But it seems like the things we're really making sure

620
00:29:40,260 --> 00:29:42,560
 as a commission, we want to make sure is that minimums,

621
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:44,760
 if they want to set minimums, if there's pretty much most

622
00:29:44,760 --> 00:29:46,760
 of that stuff is, there is no minimum.

623
00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:48,400
 But we want to make sure they're not, you know,

624
00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:50,540
 superseding any maximums on there.

625
00:29:50,540 --> 00:29:53,880
 So the entry monument, when it says there's on requirements,

626
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:58,640
 there's none, that doesn't mean that entry monuments are allowed

627
00:29:58,640 --> 00:29:59,640
 within our form, correct?

628
00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:00,880
 >> That is a very good question.

629
00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:01,740
 Yes, sir, they are.

630
00:30:01,740 --> 00:30:03,280
 >> It's just saying that they're allowed.

631
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:04,820
 We just don't have any minimum requirements.

632
00:30:04,820 --> 00:30:05,680
 >> Correct.

633
00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:06,820
 >> They're going to say our minimum

634
00:30:06,820 --> 00:30:08,320
 for entry monuments is going to be four.

635
00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:09,160
 >> Yes.

636
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:10,260
 >> So then that's not unusual, so okay, got it.

637
00:30:10,260 --> 00:30:13,160
 Just wanted to make clarification.

638
00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:15,160
 >> Perimeter street trees, under current code,

639
00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:18,160
 we don't require perimeter street trees for,

640
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:21,640
 if say a subdivision comes in and it's adjacent to one

641
00:30:21,640 --> 00:30:25,440
 of arterials, there's no requirement for a developer

642
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:28,380
 to put perimeter streets along that arterial

643
00:30:28,380 --> 00:30:31,840
 that abuts a subdivision.

644
00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:35,640
 They are proposing those perimeter trees.

645
00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:37,020
 And then neighborhood street trees,

646
00:30:37,020 --> 00:30:39,420
 our code does require those, and they are,

647
00:30:39,420 --> 00:30:42,220
 they are proposing to put those in.

648
00:30:42,220 --> 00:30:44,320
 They're a little different than our requirement,

649
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:47,460
 and we could talk about that as we get a little down a little

650
00:30:47,460 --> 00:30:48,920
 further in our site design.

651
00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:52,660
 They're proposing a minimum medium canopy tree every 45

652
00:30:52,660 --> 00:30:56,500
 to 50 feet, and then they are proposing the right-of-ways

653
00:30:56,500 --> 00:30:58,040
 widths to be consistent

654
00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:01,540
 with what our transportation criteria manual requires now,

655
00:31:01,540 --> 00:31:04,780
 which is 55 feet of right-of-way.

656
00:31:04,780 --> 00:31:07,680
 So here's what the detailed plan looks like.

657
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:12,320
 So as you can see, they show the single-family lots

658
00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:15,060
 in that minimum 6,000 square feet.

659
00:31:15,060 --> 00:31:20,600
 This area right here is the contiguous open space.

660
00:31:20,600 --> 00:31:25,060
 It does provide a linear open space through the neighborhood.

661
00:31:25,060 --> 00:31:29,000
 It's also got several points of entry to the open space

662
00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:30,600
 in these cul-de-sac areas.

663
00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:34,180
 So it's a little more accessible.

664
00:31:34,180 --> 00:31:37,720
 They are proposing traffic calming on some

665
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:40,580
 of these longer streets to make sure that cars go

666
00:31:40,580 --> 00:31:45,580
 with safe speed, and then there are additional open spaces

667
00:31:45,580 --> 00:31:48,120
 and buffers surrounding the subject property,

668
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:49,820
 and we'll look at those in a little more detail

669
00:31:49,820 --> 00:31:51,060
 in just a minute.

670
00:31:51,060 --> 00:31:54,220
 So here's their proposed landscape plan.

671
00:31:54,220 --> 00:31:55,360
 This is the broad view of it.

672
00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:56,600
 It's conceptual.

673
00:31:56,600 --> 00:31:58,400
 Within the text, it lays

674
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:03,100
 out a little more specifically what they are proposing to do,

675
00:32:03,100 --> 00:32:08,640
 but just in general, the open space, this open space,

676
00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:11,820
 along with the buffers and this open space where it would have

677
00:32:11,820 --> 00:32:19,460
 that average of 40% tree canopy, and then there is a pond here

678
00:32:19,460 --> 00:32:22,860
 with a little stream.

679
00:32:22,860 --> 00:32:26,200
 So now we'll look at a little more detail,

680
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:30,700
 zoom in on a few specific areas of that landscape plan.

681
00:32:30,700 --> 00:32:35,200
 So on the south side of the property, and as you may know,

682
00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:38,600
 the Denton ISD has acquired the property to the south,

683
00:32:38,600 --> 00:32:42,580
 so when we were talking with the applicant, we wanted to make sure

684
00:32:42,580 --> 00:32:47,320
 that that edge of their development was treated

685
00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:49,760
 in a really sensitive way because there's going to be a lot

686
00:32:49,760 --> 00:32:52,760
 of cars coming out on that area, and we wanted to make sure

687
00:32:52,760 --> 00:32:55,460
 that the buffers and the screening was appropriate.

688
00:32:55,460 --> 00:33:00,020
 So they are proposing a minimum 15-foot landscape buffer area.

689
00:33:00,020 --> 00:33:02,340
 That minimum is there because you can see it skinnies

690
00:33:02,340 --> 00:33:07,000
 up adjacent to those proposed lots,

691
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:10,480
 but then it gets a little larger when you've got the open space areas.

692
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:17,340
 That perimeter fencing along the edge will be wood with masonry columns

693
00:33:17,340 --> 00:33:21,560
 when it's 15 feet, and then along those open space areas,

694
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:27,320
 they're proposing an ornamental metal fence to provide those views.

695
00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:29,760
 Street trees are proposed.

696
00:33:29,760 --> 00:33:32,600
 Every 45 linear feet, however, they are asking

697
00:33:32,600 --> 00:33:35,100
 that they could cluster those if they needed

698
00:33:35,100 --> 00:33:37,800
 to provide a little more natural landscape area.

699
00:33:37,800 --> 00:33:43,240
 They are proposing monument entry signs along this arterial.

700
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:46,880
 Turf and native grasses, they are proposing some burming

701
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:50,680
 in some of the open space areas, once again, to provide a visual break

702
00:33:50,680 --> 00:33:55,920
 as cars are driving along that roadway, and then a sidewalk.

703
00:33:55,920 --> 00:34:02,560
 All right, on the east property line, it's a little more straightforward.

704
00:34:02,560 --> 00:34:08,460
 They're proposing a 20-foot landscape area with trees planted every 45 linear feet.

705
00:34:08,460 --> 00:34:12,560
 Once again, they're requesting that clustering if needed.

706
00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:19,980
 A 6-foot masonry wall along Bonny Bray, monument entry sign, and then turf

707
00:34:19,980 --> 00:34:25,680
 and native grasses, turf or native grasses and landscape beds and sidewalk.

708
00:34:25,680 --> 00:34:29,680
 As we get into the internal part of the development,

709
00:34:29,680 --> 00:34:35,020
 they are proposing 600 feet of all-weather trail to--

710
00:34:35,020 --> 00:34:39,760
 throughout the internal, five seating areas.

711
00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:43,340
 They're looking at putting five seating areas somewhere within the--

712
00:34:43,340 --> 00:34:48,700
 that open space along the trail and it to be sort of a natural stone bench.

713
00:34:48,700 --> 00:34:54,140
 One shade structure, dogway stations, tree preservation,

714
00:34:54,140 --> 00:34:59,240
 and that tree preservation would go toward that 40% canopy that they're proposing.

715
00:34:59,240 --> 00:35:05,180
 Street trees along the internal streets at one every 45 to 50 feet.

716
00:35:05,180 --> 00:35:08,820
 They asked for that little wiggle room in the 45 to 50 feet because they wanted

717
00:35:08,820 --> 00:35:11,620
 to make sure that trees were planted in the right places.

718
00:35:11,620 --> 00:35:17,800
 And sometimes, depending on where the driveway is, it may increase that footage

719
00:35:17,800 --> 00:35:21,960
 of where that tree should go, so they wanted that little wiggle room, 45 to 50 feet,

720
00:35:21,960 --> 00:35:24,340
 to make sure that those street trees were put in the right place

721
00:35:24,340 --> 00:35:28,480
 and that they weren't put somewhere that would conflict with the driveway.

722
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:33,340
 And then each lot is proposed to have one tree.

723
00:35:33,340 --> 00:35:40,360
 Additionally, each lot will maintain a 50% landscape area in the front yard.

724
00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:49,860
 So these are conceptual elevations and in the text, they're proposing four parking spaces,

725
00:35:49,860 --> 00:35:52,500
 which is consistent with the Denton Development Code.

726
00:35:52,500 --> 00:35:57,980
 It will essentially mean that each lot, each house will have a two-car garage.

727
00:35:57,980 --> 00:36:03,340
 The PD also calls for architectural variety, certain architectural elements

728
00:36:03,340 --> 00:36:08,080
 from a menu they'll choose from in order to make sure that the houses are distinctive.

729
00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:14,460
 Any attached front entry garage would be constructed of wood, synthetic wood

730
00:36:14,460 --> 00:36:18,700
 or stained fiberglass, so it would have a wood-look feel to it.

731
00:36:18,700 --> 00:36:24,240
 That, once again, that 70% masonry and then the 50% landscape front yard.

732
00:36:24,240 --> 00:36:30,700
 So we go back to our criteria for approval in the 1991 code and we're going to look

733
00:36:30,700 --> 00:36:34,080
 at two sections of criteria for approval because we really have two things we're looking at.

734
00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:35,380
 First, the general concept plan.

735
00:36:35,380 --> 00:36:39,420
 It just has one criteria and that is, does the proposed amendment,

736
00:36:39,420 --> 00:36:42,380
 is it in harmony with the plan for the entire district?

737
00:36:42,380 --> 00:36:48,320
 Well, the district's kind of shrunk due to the high school and just the evolution

738
00:36:48,320 --> 00:36:54,620
 of the district, but PD 115 was originally conceived of as a mixed-use development

739
00:36:54,620 --> 00:36:58,040
 with commercial office and residential uses.

740
00:36:58,040 --> 00:37:04,240
 Since it's shrunk, the uses have narrowed in the PD to only that single family.

741
00:37:04,240 --> 00:37:10,920
 However, the surrounding zoning and the future uses will really maintain

742
00:37:10,920 --> 00:37:12,020
 that mixed-use feel.

743
00:37:12,020 --> 00:37:16,060
 We're still going to have a mix of uses in the general area.

744
00:37:16,060 --> 00:37:20,600
 Additionally, the proposal is an extension of that land use pattern that was established

745
00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:23,760
 in 2000, it's really just broadening the single family use,

746
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:27,060
 just really pulling out the multi-family use in the commercial uses.

747
00:37:27,060 --> 00:37:31,240
 So staff feels like it is consistent with that criteria for approval.

748
00:37:31,240 --> 00:37:34,140
 The detail plan has four criteria for approval.

749
00:37:34,140 --> 00:37:37,280
 So first, does the plan comply with the general concept plan?

750
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:40,640
 Well, if the general concept plan is approved as proposed,

751
00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:42,920
 then the detail plan would be consistent with it

752
00:37:42,920 --> 00:37:46,520
 because it calls for those single family uses.

753
00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:51,760
 Does the detail plan provide for compatible arrangement of buildings and land uses

754
00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:54,300
 that would not adversely affect adjoining neighborhoods

755
00:37:54,300 --> 00:37:56,400
 or properties outside the plan?

756
00:37:56,400 --> 00:38:00,600
 So what they're proposing is really a cluster of single family development that's oriented

757
00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:03,800
 inward toward those common open spaces.

758
00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:09,640
 They're proposing those buffers around it, either the 20-foot or the 15-foot buffers

759
00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:16,280
 around it, to separate from the adjacent uses and also from the high traffic.

760
00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:23,360
 And one area that is close to that is a very large lot subdivision to the southwest of

761
00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:25,120
 the subject site.

762
00:38:25,120 --> 00:38:31,520
 There's no proposal for any connection, roadway connection to that neighborhood, to the southwest.

763
00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:34,760
 So they won't be introducing traffic to that neighborhood.

764
00:38:34,760 --> 00:38:41,000
 So we feel like the proposal complies with this criteria for approval.

765
00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:42,000
 Commissioner Beck.

766
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:50,320
 On that note, then, this arterial is going to be running on the south face.

767
00:38:50,320 --> 00:38:57,360
 That is going to connect with that road that connects that commercial area there.

768
00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:58,360
 Yes.

769
00:38:58,360 --> 00:38:59,360
 So you're right.

770
00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:04,480
 The road will actually connect, eventually, will connect through to here.

771
00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:06,840
 It won't connect to this road.

772
00:39:06,840 --> 00:39:07,840
 Okay.

773
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:10,320
 Is that going to be considered a collector arterial?

774
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:13,320
 I believe it's going to be an arterial.

775
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:14,320
 It's a secondary arterial.

776
00:39:14,320 --> 00:39:15,320
 Secondary arterial.

777
00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:16,320
 We'll get to the mobility.

778
00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:17,320
 Okay.

779
00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:18,320
 Okay.

780
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:19,320
 Thanks.

781
00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:24,960
 It's going to be a four-lane divided, as proposed.

782
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:28,040
 All right.

783
00:39:28,040 --> 00:39:32,760
 Does the plan provide for the adequate and safe circulation of vehicular traffic?

784
00:39:32,760 --> 00:39:39,440
 The proposal complies with all current standards for streets, and it's also proposing traffic

785
00:39:39,440 --> 00:39:42,320
 calming in accordance with our transportation criteria manuals.

786
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:44,840
 We feel like it meets that criteria.

787
00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:49,020
 And finally, is it in substantial compliance with the landscape sign subdivision and other

788
00:39:49,020 --> 00:39:50,880
 regulations of the city?

789
00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:56,720
 So once again, because it's a PD, we look to an old code, and that's the 1998 landscape

790
00:39:56,720 --> 00:39:57,720
 code.

791
00:39:57,720 --> 00:40:03,520
 That required 15 trees to be planted per acre, or it could be a part of tree preservation.

792
00:40:03,520 --> 00:40:08,040
 So a combination of preservation and planting, there had to be 15 trees per acre, which really

793
00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:13,600
 came out to about 34% canopy per acre.

794
00:40:13,600 --> 00:40:18,960
 They're actually proposing, in their open space areas, a 40% average canopy.

795
00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:24,200
 In addition, they're proposing one tree per lot and also street trees, not only internally,

796
00:40:24,200 --> 00:40:34,680
 but also in excess of what the code requires, and that's the perimeter street trees.

797
00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:39,260
 So we feel like it does meet that requirement.

798
00:40:39,260 --> 00:40:41,440
 We also looked at the mobility of the area.

799
00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:45,360
 I know it's always a topic on everyone's mind.

800
00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:51,640
 They did do a trick generation analysis for the request.

801
00:40:51,640 --> 00:40:56,040
 They assumed 350 dwellings, so they assumed more than what they're proposing.

802
00:40:56,040 --> 00:41:04,120
 Per the trip generation manual, the 350 dwellings would generate about 3,300 trips per day,

803
00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:12,160
 which would be AM peak hour traffic of 230 trips, the PM peak would be 338 trips.

804
00:41:12,160 --> 00:41:17,720
 This coupled with so much going on in this corner, and I know we've talked about this,

805
00:41:17,720 --> 00:41:22,960
 mobility is looking at regional improvements for traffic, and that's why the Bonnebray

806
00:41:22,960 --> 00:41:24,720
 improvements are forthcoming.

807
00:41:24,720 --> 00:41:30,440
 So as we've discussed before, Bonnebray will be improved from university going north.

808
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:35,520
 It will be a four lane divided as currently proposed, but it will have enough right of

809
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:39,360
 way to come to six if they need it.

810
00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:45,140
 The final alignment is still under design, so we don't know where it will end up.

811
00:41:45,140 --> 00:41:49,320
 We're thinking it's probably going to track to the east, but we don't know the final

812
00:41:49,320 --> 00:41:50,320
 alignment.

813
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:57,120
 It is targeted to be complete for the opening of the Denton High School, and that's in late

814
00:41:57,120 --> 00:41:58,120
 2021.

815
00:41:58,120 --> 00:42:04,920
 And then also as you asked earlier, this connector road here will be also as part of the improvements

816
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:11,360
 of any development adjacent to it, and it would be a four lane divided, and at some

817
00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:16,800
 point in the future it will connect out to I-35.

818
00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:17,800
 Notification was sent out.

819
00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:19,120
 They also had a neighborhood meeting.

820
00:42:19,120 --> 00:42:20,760
 They actually had it on Monday night.

821
00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:26,760
 They had a few attendees, and they really were just asking questions about what they

822
00:42:26,760 --> 00:42:29,480
 were going to do.

823
00:42:29,480 --> 00:42:32,660
 So we haven't received any feedback.

824
00:42:32,660 --> 00:42:37,280
 Based upon the criteria for approval, staff recommends approval of the request with the

825
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:42,720
 condition that it complies with the general concept plan, the detailed plan, and the text

826
00:42:42,720 --> 00:42:46,040
 associated with those as included in your backup.

827
00:42:46,040 --> 00:42:48,000
 And I'll stand for questions.

828
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:49,000
 We've got a couple of questions.

829
00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:50,000
 Commissioner Smith.

830
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:51,000
 Thank you, Chair.

831
00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:58,640
 On the -- can you go back to the slides when you were showing kind of the conceptual -- just

832
00:42:58,640 --> 00:43:01,520
 something where I can see that right there, that's perfect.

833
00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:07,240
 That pond, is there any type of -- first of all, is that a detention pond?

834
00:43:07,240 --> 00:43:08,320
 What is that?

835
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:10,840
 They will use it as part of their drainage system.

836
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:11,840
 Gotcha.

837
00:43:11,840 --> 00:43:12,840
 Okay.

838
00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:14,600
 Was it naturally there before?

839
00:43:14,600 --> 00:43:18,720
 Was this back in -- back in 2000 or whatever this whole thing started?

840
00:43:18,720 --> 00:43:19,960
 Did they begin doing a detention?

841
00:43:19,960 --> 00:43:21,880
 What was the history of it?

842
00:43:21,880 --> 00:43:22,880
 I just don't know.

843
00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:23,880
 I don't know.

844
00:43:23,880 --> 00:43:24,880
 Okay.

845
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:25,880
 It is there.

846
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:26,880
 And there was --

847
00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:27,880
 It was there.

848
00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:28,880
 We got it.

849
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:29,880
 We see that there.

850
00:43:29,880 --> 00:43:32,880
 There was a gentleman at the neighborhood meeting who's farmed this area for many years,

851
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:35,840
 and I should have asked him, but I don't know.

852
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:41,600
 The only question I'm really having about that in regards to the pond is just the flooding

853
00:43:41,600 --> 00:43:44,680
 that might be created, because it looks like if you go back to the conceptual and if you

854
00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:48,080
 look at it on the -- if you get a closer look on the satellite picture, you can see that

855
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:52,880
 far left in there, that just -- it just -- the river appears.

856
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:53,880
 It's not really a river.

857
00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:55,840
 It's more of a drainage ditch is what it really is.

858
00:43:55,840 --> 00:43:59,880
 It's kind of a naturally flowing drainage creek, but I'm just afraid of building up

859
00:43:59,880 --> 00:44:04,960
 a bunch of concrete around that and causing what now -- what used to be a permeable area

860
00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:07,880
 to soak up a lot of that rain is now going to be funneled down to that.

861
00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:14,680
 And so I don't know, as a city, if we have done -- required the applicant to do an analysis

862
00:44:14,680 --> 00:44:18,280
 on that to make sure there's not going to be massive flooding once we build up a neighborhood

863
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:19,280
 there.

864
00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:20,280
 As part of platting, they will have --

865
00:44:20,280 --> 00:44:21,280
 They will?

866
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:24,560
 They always have to do the pre- and post-development conditions, and they will have to make sure

867
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:25,560
 that they address that drainage.

868
00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:26,560
 So it's a great question.

869
00:44:26,560 --> 00:44:27,560
 They will have to do that.

870
00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:32,760
 And then would that also -- so adding onto that, the pre- and post-development, will

871
00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:36,280
 that extend to the property -- it's going to sound weird because I think the answer

872
00:44:36,280 --> 00:44:37,280
 is going to be no.

873
00:44:37,280 --> 00:44:39,240
 But will that extend to the property across the way?

874
00:44:39,240 --> 00:44:44,160
 Because you can't see it, but if you go onto an aerial view, you see that that creek, because

875
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:51,080
 it goes out the right side, it actually extends basically underneath Bonnie Bray into a -- you

876
00:44:51,080 --> 00:44:54,080
 see just right of your cursor, that pond there.

877
00:44:54,080 --> 00:44:59,160
 And so while it may not affect that pond there, it may affect what looks like the natural

878
00:44:59,160 --> 00:45:03,000
 flow goes across Bonnie Bray to the other side, may affect that land over there.

879
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:07,000
 So I'd hate to say -- hate to have a property owner do something to their property that

880
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:08,240
 affects their next-door neighbor.

881
00:45:08,240 --> 00:45:12,600
 It may not affect them, but it affects their next-door neighbors.

882
00:45:12,600 --> 00:45:18,800
 Engineering always makes sure that they can't make conditions to adjacent property owners

883
00:45:18,800 --> 00:45:19,800
 worse.

884
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:20,800
 Sure.

885
00:45:20,800 --> 00:45:21,800
 Okay.

886
00:45:21,800 --> 00:45:22,800
 So they have to make sure that they take care of the water.

887
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:26,840
 The post-development does say, okay, well, it won't affect anybody next to us, that kind

888
00:45:26,840 --> 00:45:27,840
 of thing.

889
00:45:27,840 --> 00:45:28,840
 Correct.

890
00:45:28,840 --> 00:45:30,480
 So that's the Bonnie Bray improvements.

891
00:45:30,480 --> 00:45:37,560
 I suspect as part of that, there will also be some infrastructure placed in to accommodate

892
00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:38,560
 for water.

893
00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:39,560
 Okay.

894
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:42,560
 And then could you show me on the map, just because I can't remember off the top of my

895
00:45:42,560 --> 00:45:45,280
 head, and looking at it, there's too many open fields to pick which -- where it's supposed

896
00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:46,280
 to be.

897
00:45:46,280 --> 00:45:47,280
 Where is the new high school?

898
00:45:47,280 --> 00:45:48,280
 It will be...

899
00:45:48,280 --> 00:45:51,280
 Is it right across the way, or is it just south of it?

900
00:45:51,280 --> 00:45:52,280
 Okay.

901
00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:53,840
 Somebody's honestly thinking it was north of '77.

902
00:45:53,840 --> 00:45:54,840
 Okay.

903
00:45:54,840 --> 00:45:57,120
 So it's right, right, smack dab.

904
00:45:57,120 --> 00:45:58,120
 There.

905
00:45:58,120 --> 00:45:59,120
 Okay.

906
00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:00,120
 All right.

907
00:46:00,120 --> 00:46:01,120
 Thank you.

908
00:46:01,120 --> 00:46:02,120
 Commissioner Beck.

909
00:46:02,120 --> 00:46:03,880
 Thank you, Chair.

910
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:04,880
 Just a couple of questions.

911
00:46:04,880 --> 00:46:10,440
 Now, on the north boundary line there, the property between that and the I-35 ramping

912
00:46:10,440 --> 00:46:12,640
 out, that's still PD?

913
00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:19,600
 Well, you probably remember, you've recently seen a rezoning case for this property to

914
00:46:19,600 --> 00:46:26,400
 zone it out of the PD to the adjacent -- the adjacent is RCCD.

915
00:46:26,400 --> 00:46:30,160
 They requested RCCD to be consistent with the adjacent property.

916
00:46:30,160 --> 00:46:31,160
 Okay.

917
00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:32,480
 It's actually going to City Council on December 4th.

918
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:33,480
 Okay.

919
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:36,360
 So that conceivably could be commercial?

920
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:40,440
 The intent is to use the commercial to have some mix of uses in that area, which is not

921
00:46:40,440 --> 00:46:41,440
 even necessary.

922
00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:42,440
 That's part of a future land use, ma'am?

923
00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:43,440
 Yes, sir.

924
00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:44,440
 Okay.

925
00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:48,800
 That is actually business innovation to the north of there, but, you know, that's kind

926
00:46:48,800 --> 00:46:54,040
 of one of those areas of business innovation where those sort of supporting uses make a

927
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:55,040
 lot of sense there.

928
00:46:55,040 --> 00:46:56,040
 Okay.

929
00:46:56,040 --> 00:47:01,040
 So as far as concerning tree canopy, do we know what kind of trees are going to lie in

930
00:47:01,040 --> 00:47:02,040
 the yard?

931
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:05,040
 Are they going to be nice canopy trees, or do we know?

932
00:47:05,040 --> 00:47:07,080
 I brought the tree list.

933
00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:09,280
 I brought the tree list just in case.

934
00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:10,280
 Okay.

935
00:47:10,280 --> 00:47:16,040
 So as part of the PD, we talk mostly about medium canopy trees, particularly in the street

936
00:47:16,040 --> 00:47:20,320
 trees, because we want to make sure that they grow to a nice street tree, frame the street,

937
00:47:20,320 --> 00:47:23,400
 but not so much that garbage trucks are going to hit them and they're not going to -- they're

938
00:47:23,400 --> 00:47:24,400
 going to get pruned in a way.

939
00:47:24,400 --> 00:47:31,880
 The ones in the yard, the ones in the yard, there aren't any provisions for what actual

940
00:47:31,880 --> 00:47:34,720
 tree except that -- to take off of the tree list.

941
00:47:34,720 --> 00:47:39,120
 But they have the developer had suggested -- okay, that's all I wanted to know.

942
00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:40,120
 All right.

943
00:47:40,120 --> 00:47:41,120
 Thanks, Julie.

944
00:47:41,120 --> 00:47:42,120
 Commissioner Sanchez.

945
00:47:42,120 --> 00:47:43,120
 Yeah.

946
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:44,120
 I just wanted to mention -- you mentioned about the pond.

947
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:47,280
 If you look at this whole area, there's several ponds out there.

948
00:47:47,280 --> 00:47:50,560
 It's probably soil conservation service at one time.

949
00:47:50,560 --> 00:47:53,280
 If you look at some of that topography, it kind of rolls.

950
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:58,120
 And in order to control erosion, they probably built a lot of those ponds in that area.

951
00:47:58,120 --> 00:48:04,960
 I just wanted to mention that.

952
00:48:04,960 --> 00:48:09,440
 Any other questions for Ms. Haley?

953
00:48:09,440 --> 00:48:10,520
 Perfect.

954
00:48:10,520 --> 00:48:11,520
 Thank you.

955
00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:13,360
 Thank you.

956
00:48:13,360 --> 00:48:23,120
 That was item E. We can go back now to item D, which is Cindy Jackson's SUP for Verizon

957
00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:24,120
 Wireless.

958
00:48:24,120 --> 00:48:25,120
 Thank you.

959
00:48:25,120 --> 00:48:40,120
 I appreciate you letting me take care of these.

960
00:48:40,120 --> 00:49:08,480
 I'm going to go ahead and turn it over to Ms. Haley.

961
00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:26,120
 Where did it go?

962
00:49:26,120 --> 00:49:35,520
 S180009 is a request for a specific use permit for a freestanding monopole telecommunications

963
00:49:35,520 --> 00:49:38,400
 tower and associated equipment room.

964
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:41,440
 The property is located at 816 Frame Street.

965
00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:43,040
 You can see it right here.

966
00:49:43,040 --> 00:49:44,040
 Here's Frame.

967
00:49:44,040 --> 00:49:51,880
 Paisley also runs along the south side of the site and the railroad is along the northwest

968
00:49:51,880 --> 00:49:53,420
 side of the site.

969
00:49:53,420 --> 00:49:55,680
 Over here you can see the city service center.

970
00:49:55,680 --> 00:50:00,280
 So it's very close to the service center.

971
00:50:00,280 --> 00:50:07,080
 The subject site is zone DCG and approval of an SUP is required for a monopole tower

972
00:50:07,080 --> 00:50:08,840
 up to 85 feet in height.

973
00:50:08,840 --> 00:50:14,920
 In fact, according to the table, approval of an SUP is required for any monopole tower

974
00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:19,200
 in the DCG district.

975
00:50:19,200 --> 00:50:25,000
 When looking at whether or not to recommend approval for an SUP, we actually look at the

976
00:50:25,000 --> 00:50:28,200
 SUP criteria.

977
00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:32,600
 We look at the -- we do a compatibility analysis between the surrounding property and the request

978
00:50:32,600 --> 00:50:37,760
 it used and we also look for telecommunications towers.

979
00:50:37,760 --> 00:50:43,560
 We look at 3513.8 telecommunication tower standards.

980
00:50:43,560 --> 00:50:50,600
 The site complies with both sets of criteria as noted in your backup.

981
00:50:50,600 --> 00:50:55,440
 Here you see the site plan of the warehouse in which it's located.

982
00:50:55,440 --> 00:50:57,280
 It will be located right here.

983
00:50:57,280 --> 00:51:03,240
 The tower and the equipment room will take up three storage spaces.

984
00:51:03,240 --> 00:51:13,080
 Those are going to be removed and the tower and the equipment room will be placed instead.

985
00:51:13,080 --> 00:51:16,080
 This is an elevation of the site.

986
00:51:16,080 --> 00:51:25,440
 You can see the tower which is a total of 80 feet and you can see the site plan.

987
00:51:25,440 --> 00:51:27,080
 This is the monopole tower.

988
00:51:27,080 --> 00:51:32,080
 This is the generator and equipment room and you can kind of see where the three units

989
00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:33,080
 used to be.

990
00:51:33,080 --> 00:51:36,080
 There's one, two, three.

991
00:51:36,080 --> 00:51:44,320
 Analysis, the zoning DCG, monopole towers less than 85 feet are permitted with approval

992
00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:47,280
 of a specific use permit, an SUP.

993
00:51:47,280 --> 00:51:54,840
 You can see the site is zoned DCG and then we've got DR1, DR2, NR4 and then DCG in the

994
00:51:54,840 --> 00:51:57,840
 proximity.

995
00:51:57,840 --> 00:52:03,900
 The subject site is located within a self-storage warehouse adjacent to the railroad tracks.

996
00:52:03,900 --> 00:52:09,480
 This location will minimize both nuisance caused by the site as well as visibility of the site.

997
00:52:09,480 --> 00:52:14,640
 The only thing that will be visible from adjoining streets or neighborhoods will be the pole

998
00:52:14,640 --> 00:52:15,880
 itself.

999
00:52:15,880 --> 00:52:23,280
 The actual equipment room and the emergency backup generator will not be visible unless

1000
00:52:23,280 --> 00:52:28,280
 you go into the self-storage facility.

1001
00:52:28,280 --> 00:52:39,180
 We sent out notices, 29 notices via certified mail and 118 notices via courtesy mail via

1002
00:52:39,180 --> 00:52:40,640
 regular mail.

1003
00:52:40,640 --> 00:52:45,240
 We received two responses in favor which I handed out to you.

1004
00:52:45,240 --> 00:52:49,080
 Two signs were posted on the site and the applicant did hold a neighborhood meeting

1005
00:52:49,080 --> 00:52:52,780
 to which I was the only attendee.

1006
00:52:52,780 --> 00:52:57,440
 We got no response to that.

1007
00:52:57,440 --> 00:52:59,040
 Staff recommends approval of this request.

1008
00:52:59,040 --> 00:53:04,360
 It is compatible with the surrounding property and conforms to all applicable requirements

1009
00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:10,600
 of section 35128, wireless telecommunications facilities as well as the requirements for

1010
00:53:10,600 --> 00:53:11,840
 a specific use permit.

1011
00:53:11,840 --> 00:53:13,400
 And that concludes my presentation.

1012
00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:14,400
 Thank you Cindy.

1013
00:53:14,400 --> 00:53:15,400
 Mr. Smith.

1014
00:53:15,400 --> 00:53:16,400
 Hey Chair.

1015
00:53:16,400 --> 00:53:19,880
 The neighborhood meeting, when was, do you know when the applicant sent out notifications

1016
00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:23,120
 of the neighborhood meeting and where it was looked, do you know the details around it,

1017
00:53:23,120 --> 00:53:26,000
 just whenever there's neighborhood meetings that are poorly attended, all that stuff.

1018
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:31,880
 The applicant sent the notices out a good 10 days at least before the meeting and it

1019
00:53:31,880 --> 00:53:35,440
 was actually held at the Fowler Museum.

1020
00:53:35,440 --> 00:53:36,440
 Okay.

1021
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:37,440
 Museum, I'm sorry, library.

1022
00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:42,520
 I'm not going to say it's like whatever, I didn't know there was a museum there.

1023
00:53:42,520 --> 00:53:43,520
 Fowler Library.

1024
00:53:43,520 --> 00:53:48,200
 Museums, libraries, quietly both, got it, okay.

1025
00:53:48,200 --> 00:53:52,920
 Any other questions on this item?

1026
00:53:52,920 --> 00:53:53,920
 Thank you Cindy.

1027
00:53:53,920 --> 00:53:54,920
 Thank you.

1028
00:53:54,920 --> 00:53:57,840
 Do you have one more this evening?

1029
00:53:57,840 --> 00:53:58,840
 Yes.

1030
00:53:58,840 --> 00:54:22,480
 That is the next item, item FZ18-8 for the Sentinel Centennial on North Elm.

1031
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:46,160
 We have received quite a few responses to this in the past few days and I'm sorry the

1032
00:54:46,160 --> 00:54:59,360
 one on the back.

1033
00:54:59,360 --> 00:55:04,800
 We can wait until you're on the mic, I'm getting in trouble for you speaking off the mic.

1034
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:11,600
 Sorry about that, can you say that note again?

1035
00:55:11,600 --> 00:55:12,600
 I will.

1036
00:55:12,600 --> 00:55:30,080
 I will note that the one on the back is a duplicate of one that's on the inside.

1037
00:55:30,080 --> 00:55:44,240
 Okay, Z18-0008 is a request for approval of a zoning change of a site from Neighborhood

1038
00:55:44,240 --> 00:55:51,400
 Residential Mixed Use NRMU 12 to Neighborhood Residential Mixed Use NRMU.

1039
00:55:51,400 --> 00:55:58,080
 The 2.411 acre site is located at 3131 and 3161 North Elm Street.

1040
00:55:58,080 --> 00:55:59,920
 You can see it right here.

1041
00:55:59,920 --> 00:56:04,840
 This is North Elm Street and this is Joyce that is across from it.

1042
00:56:04,840 --> 00:56:09,640
 Windsor Drive is to the south.

1043
00:56:09,640 --> 00:56:14,840
 This shows the current zoning map of the site and you can see most of this entire triangle

1044
00:56:14,840 --> 00:56:22,160
 is NRMU with a couple of exceptions, excuse me NRMU 12 and we've got some NRMU here and

1045
00:56:22,160 --> 00:56:26,680
 NR4 here.

1046
00:56:26,680 --> 00:56:32,440
 If this is approved, this is what the zoning map will look like.

1047
00:56:32,440 --> 00:56:37,880
 You'll notice that this would be a continuation of the NRMU district that is to the north

1048
00:56:37,880 --> 00:56:42,000
 across Elm Street.

1049
00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:43,920
 Here's the proposed concept plan.

1050
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:52,700
 This is just a concept plan, it is not something that the applicant is being held to.

1051
00:56:52,700 --> 00:56:59,760
 The applicant is proposing 71 units, one and two bedroom apartments, three stories and

1052
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:06,000
 I want to note that any future multi-family development that would go here if this zoning

1053
00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:11,840
 is approved would require a specific use permit so you would see this before you again and

1054
00:57:11,840 --> 00:57:19,600
 you would have a closer look at what is actually proposed.

1055
00:57:19,600 --> 00:57:25,200
 When looking at criteria for approval for rezoning we look at whether the request conforms

1056
00:57:25,200 --> 00:57:30,240
 to the future land use plan and if there is adequate provision of transportation, water,

1057
00:57:30,240 --> 00:57:35,320
 sewer, schools, parks, public services.

1058
00:57:35,320 --> 00:57:39,920
 The site is designated as neighborhood mixed use on the future land use plan.

1059
00:57:39,920 --> 00:57:46,400
 The intent of neighborhood mixed use is applied to areas of Denton which are primarily residential

1060
00:57:46,400 --> 00:57:51,440
 but were a mix of housing types along with retail and service uses that support the surrounding

1061
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:53,240
 neighborhoods are encouraged.

1062
00:57:53,240 --> 00:57:56,600
 It recommends moderate to high density residential.

1063
00:57:56,600 --> 00:58:01,160
 The types and uses and scale of the development permitted in the NRMU district conforms with

1064
00:58:01,160 --> 00:58:07,800
 the goals of the neighborhood mixed use designation.

1065
00:58:07,800 --> 00:58:09,600
 We also look at zoning compatibility.

1066
00:58:09,600 --> 00:58:14,740
 The requested NRMU district is a continuation of the NRMU district located on the north

1067
00:58:14,740 --> 00:58:17,400
 side of the site across Elm.

1068
00:58:17,400 --> 00:58:24,720
 The proposed NRMU zoning is compatible with the goals and objectives outlined in the Denton

1069
00:58:24,720 --> 00:58:28,840
 plan 2030 for areas designated neighborhood mixed use.

1070
00:58:28,840 --> 00:58:33,600
 It is the most intensive of the neighborhood residential districts and permits a variety

1071
00:58:33,600 --> 00:58:40,680
 of institutional, commercial and moderate to high density residential uses.

1072
00:58:40,680 --> 00:58:48,680
 Now with regards to infrastructure, the applicant will be required to actually bore across North

1073
00:58:48,680 --> 00:58:51,800
 Elm Street to bring water and sewer to the site.

1074
00:58:51,800 --> 00:58:56,660
 You can see this is where it is located right now and they would have to get a text-top

1075
00:58:56,660 --> 00:59:02,620
 permit to bore under North Elm.

1076
00:59:02,620 --> 00:59:08,200
 North Elm Street is designated as a primary arterial with 135 feet of right of way.

1077
00:59:08,200 --> 00:59:16,520
 It's currently constructed as four-lane divided roadway with an ultimate buildout of 135 feet.

1078
00:59:16,520 --> 00:59:23,080
 So the applicant may have to dedicate right of way to bring it to their half of the street

1079
00:59:23,080 --> 00:59:26,320
 to that width.

1080
00:59:26,320 --> 00:59:31,720
 We'll know more when the site goes forward for plotting.

1081
00:59:31,720 --> 00:59:38,080
 I want to note that the applicant will only have access to North Elm Street.

1082
00:59:38,080 --> 00:59:45,960
 There's going to be no other access available to the applicant and based on the number of

1083
00:59:45,960 --> 00:59:52,200
 units the proposed development is expected to generate 468 trips daily.

1084
00:59:52,200 --> 01:00:01,600
 The PM peak total number of trips is 41 and that's per the 8th edition ITE trip generation

1085
01:00:01,600 --> 01:00:02,600
 table.

1086
01:00:02,600 --> 01:00:08,320
 >> Can I ask a question real fast if I understand that correctly?

1087
01:00:08,320 --> 01:00:14,200
 The PM peak hour for 71 units is 48 cars?

1088
01:00:14,200 --> 01:00:15,200
 >> 41.

1089
01:00:15,200 --> 01:00:16,200
 >> Mm-hmm.

1090
01:00:16,200 --> 01:00:17,200
 >> Okay.

1091
01:00:17,200 --> 01:00:20,200
 That seems low.

1092
01:00:20,200 --> 01:00:26,360
 >> Well, I'll be honest with you, I'm not a transportation planner so I'm not sure how

1093
01:00:26,360 --> 01:00:27,880
 they came up with those numbers.

1094
01:00:27,880 --> 01:00:28,880
 >> Okay.

1095
01:00:28,880 --> 01:00:32,440
 >> But that's what the table said when I checked it.

1096
01:00:32,440 --> 01:00:33,440
 >> Okay.

1097
01:00:33,440 --> 01:00:34,440
 Thanks.

1098
01:00:34,440 --> 01:00:35,440
 Chris, you're back.

1099
01:00:35,440 --> 01:00:36,440
 >> Thank you, Chair.

1100
01:00:36,440 --> 01:00:44,560
 While we're on the impact of traffic and I know this is a text out road but in the consideration

1101
01:00:44,560 --> 01:00:50,920
 of how traffic is going to be affected, you're going to have a little back up there if you're

1102
01:00:50,920 --> 01:00:57,520
 heading I guess it's northwest on Elm and you're going to try and turn into that first means

1103
01:00:57,520 --> 01:01:03,120
 of egress there and there's no left-turn lane there so was that taken into consideration?

1104
01:01:03,120 --> 01:01:06,200
 >> No, because that's a concept plan.

1105
01:01:06,200 --> 01:01:10,960
 And they have to get a tech stop permit for a driveway.

1106
01:01:10,960 --> 01:01:12,920
 >> So it's not likely that we don't know that?

1107
01:01:12,920 --> 01:01:16,360
 >> It's not like they're going to have to be honest with you.

1108
01:01:16,360 --> 01:01:23,920
 They might but normally they only permit one driveway for a site unless it's very large.

1109
01:01:23,920 --> 01:01:29,800
 >> Okay and the only way you can access this is going to be off of Elm from what I can

1110
01:01:29,800 --> 01:01:30,800
 see here.

1111
01:01:30,800 --> 01:01:31,800
 Okay.

1112
01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:32,800
 Interesting.

1113
01:01:32,800 --> 01:01:33,800
 Thank you.

1114
01:01:33,800 --> 01:01:34,800
 >> Commissioner Sanchez.

1115
01:01:34,800 --> 01:01:39,640
 >> You mentioned that they'd have to drill under Elm Street to get water.

1116
01:01:39,640 --> 01:01:42,920
 Swordline already exists on that south side, I guess.

1117
01:01:42,920 --> 01:01:43,920
 Is that what you're --

1118
01:01:43,920 --> 01:01:44,920
 >> No.

1119
01:01:44,920 --> 01:01:45,920
 >> No.

1120
01:01:45,920 --> 01:01:46,920
 >> Water and wastewater.

1121
01:01:46,920 --> 01:01:47,920
 You can see both of them.

1122
01:01:47,920 --> 01:01:50,220
 The water is blue, wastewater is red.

1123
01:01:50,220 --> 01:01:53,000
 >> So everything will have to be brought in.

1124
01:01:53,000 --> 01:01:58,840
 Is there any idea of creating the same water and sewage lines on the south side?

1125
01:01:58,840 --> 01:02:02,040
 I mean long-term that whole area is going to be developed.

1126
01:02:02,040 --> 01:02:06,040
 >> Well at this time I'm not aware of any plans.

1127
01:02:06,040 --> 01:02:10,840
 Typically the lines are put in as sites develop and the city participates if they request

1128
01:02:10,840 --> 01:02:13,840
 oversizing.

1129
01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:18,320
 >> Because eventually I'm just thinking eventually they're going to build it.

1130
01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:25,520
 That's a long -- big cost for that particular -- to bore underneath that little Elm Street

1131
01:02:25,520 --> 01:02:29,920
 if they could extend those lines at least up to where they exist.

1132
01:02:29,920 --> 01:02:32,920
 I'm sure there's some other businesses further down there.

1133
01:02:32,920 --> 01:02:35,320
 >> We agree with you.

1134
01:02:35,320 --> 01:02:42,160
 It's not inexpensive to do something like this.

1135
01:02:42,160 --> 01:02:49,280
 The applicant may be able to answer more questions about this, but that's what they've been advised

1136
01:02:49,280 --> 01:02:53,960
 is that they have to bore under the street and they have to get approval from TXDOT to

1137
01:02:53,960 --> 01:02:58,440
 do it.

1138
01:02:58,440 --> 01:03:09,360
 Okay, analysis, well I pretty much went through this already.

1139
01:03:09,360 --> 01:03:12,800
 The NRMU district permits a mix of housing types and density.

1140
01:03:12,800 --> 01:03:15,440
 It's consistent with the future land use element.

1141
01:03:15,440 --> 01:03:20,120
 The NRMU district permits a maximum 30 dwelling units per acre, also consistent with the future

1142
01:03:20,120 --> 01:03:21,720
 land use element.

1143
01:03:21,720 --> 01:03:28,120
 The concept plan that was presented to us has a density, proposed density of 29.4 dwelling

1144
01:03:28,120 --> 01:03:30,240
 units per acre.

1145
01:03:30,240 --> 01:03:35,580
 The proposed NRMU district provides a transition between established single family neighborhoods

1146
01:03:35,580 --> 01:03:44,280
 to the South and the potential mixed use or commercial areas located along North Elm Street.

1147
01:03:44,280 --> 01:03:49,840
 Existing land uses surrounding the site includes single family residents in a church, a regional

1148
01:03:49,840 --> 01:03:53,600
 drainage facility, and undeveloped land.

1149
01:03:53,600 --> 01:03:58,480
 The subject site is located on the north side of North Elm Street, approximately 1.65 miles

1150
01:03:58,480 --> 01:04:01,680
 southeast of Loop 288.

1151
01:04:01,680 --> 01:04:06,760
 Demand was to comply with all ESA, tree preservation, buffer screening, tree canopy, and lighting

1152
01:04:06,760 --> 01:04:07,760
 requirements.

1153
01:04:07,760 --> 01:04:16,040
 An extension of both water and wastewater service will be necessary to serve the site.

1154
01:04:16,040 --> 01:04:23,840
 Public notices were sent out, 12 notices were sent out via certified mail, and 58 were sent

1155
01:04:23,840 --> 01:04:27,080
 out courtesy notices via regular mail.

1156
01:04:27,080 --> 01:04:33,760
 We received, in opposition, well, in opposition within the 200 foot buffer, we received four,

1157
01:04:33,760 --> 01:04:39,880
 which equates to 40% of the land within the 200 foot boundary.

1158
01:04:39,880 --> 01:04:46,520
 That will require this to be approved by council with a super majority vote of 6 to 1.

1159
01:04:46,520 --> 01:04:53,400
 We received one response in favor, that representing 4% of the property.

1160
01:04:53,400 --> 01:05:00,680
 One sign was posted on the site, and like I said, a super majority vote will be required.

1161
01:05:00,680 --> 01:05:07,120
 We received a lot of notices from people who were outside the site or within the 500 foot

1162
01:05:07,120 --> 01:05:12,440
 buffer, which are included in your packet as well, and they're pointed out here.

1163
01:05:12,440 --> 01:05:17,100
 I received more, I noticed in my email just before I came here.

1164
01:05:17,100 --> 01:05:23,280
 We will add those to the computations and present them to city council.

1165
01:05:23,280 --> 01:05:26,840
 >> City is the opposition one land owner.

1166
01:05:26,840 --> 01:05:28,480
 >> It's not, no.

1167
01:05:28,480 --> 01:05:35,760
 These are all separate land owners.

1168
01:05:35,760 --> 01:05:51,120
 These three, they are related, but no, this one land owner right here is not related.

1169
01:05:51,120 --> 01:05:55,360
 >> Staff recommends approval of this request as it is compatible with the surrounding property

1170
01:05:55,360 --> 01:05:59,120
 and consistent with the goals and objectives of the Denton plan 2030.

1171
01:05:59,120 --> 01:06:00,920
 >> Mr. Beck.

1172
01:06:00,920 --> 01:06:03,120
 >> Thank you, chair.

1173
01:06:03,120 --> 01:06:04,120
 Okay.

1174
01:06:04,120 --> 01:06:05,120
 Thank you, Cindy.

1175
01:06:05,120 --> 01:06:07,560
 I'm sitting here looking at the Google map on this.

1176
01:06:07,560 --> 01:06:12,160
 I wasn't aware that there were any residential houses that backed up to this property, but

1177
01:06:12,160 --> 01:06:13,760
 you say there's three.

1178
01:06:13,760 --> 01:06:14,760
 >> Yep.

1179
01:06:14,760 --> 01:06:15,760
 There's one here.

1180
01:06:15,760 --> 01:06:21,040
 >> I thought that belonged, I thought, looking at, again, the Google map, I can see one.

1181
01:06:21,040 --> 01:06:22,040
 >> Mm-hmm.

1182
01:06:22,040 --> 01:06:25,960
 >> But then you've got the church there, the Jehovah's Witness, I believe it is.

1183
01:06:25,960 --> 01:06:26,960
 >> That's Jehovah's Witness.

1184
01:06:26,960 --> 01:06:27,960
 >> Okay.

1185
01:06:27,960 --> 01:06:31,200
 That isn't their land then that backs up to that property.

1186
01:06:31,200 --> 01:06:32,200
 >> No.

1187
01:06:32,200 --> 01:06:33,200
 >> It's parcel.

1188
01:06:33,200 --> 01:06:34,200
 >> No.

1189
01:06:34,200 --> 01:06:35,200
 >> Okay.

1190
01:06:35,200 --> 01:06:36,200
 >> No.

1191
01:06:36,200 --> 01:06:37,200
 This is a house.

1192
01:06:37,200 --> 01:06:38,200
 >> Okay.

1193
01:06:38,200 --> 01:06:57,360
 In your statement that you're in favor of this, you point out that it aligns with the NRM

1194
01:06:57,360 --> 01:07:02,960
 units across now, and I don't disagree with that, but I'm curious when I look at the future

1195
01:07:02,960 --> 01:07:09,080
 land use map, that whole area is considered moderate residential, which NRMU wouldn't fit,

1196
01:07:09,080 --> 01:07:11,080
 and yet there we have it.

1197
01:07:11,080 --> 01:07:14,080
 How did that occur?

1198
01:07:14,080 --> 01:07:17,240
 You weren't here when that happened, right?

1199
01:07:17,240 --> 01:07:20,760
 >> Well, you can see north we've got moderate residential.

1200
01:07:20,760 --> 01:07:21,760
 >> All right.

1201
01:07:21,760 --> 01:07:25,720
 >> South we've got neighborhood mixed use, and they kind of overlap like our --

1202
01:07:25,720 --> 01:07:26,720
 >> Right.

1203
01:07:26,720 --> 01:07:31,160
 On the southern part of Elm, yeah, it does align with the future land use map.

1204
01:07:31,160 --> 01:07:33,640
 >> I'm just curious how that entered.

1205
01:07:33,640 --> 01:07:37,360
 >> The actual neighborhood mixed use, you can see it goes to here.

1206
01:07:37,360 --> 01:07:39,280
 They overlap right here.

1207
01:07:39,280 --> 01:07:40,280
 >> Okay.

1208
01:07:40,280 --> 01:07:41,280
 >> So you can be either.

1209
01:07:41,280 --> 01:07:42,280
 >> Okay.

1210
01:07:42,280 --> 01:07:43,280
 All right.

1211
01:07:43,280 --> 01:07:44,280
 Thank you.

1212
01:07:44,280 --> 01:07:45,280
 >> Sure.

1213
01:07:45,280 --> 01:07:46,280
 >> Commissioner Ellis.

1214
01:07:46,280 --> 01:07:47,280
 >> Thank you, Chair.

1215
01:07:47,280 --> 01:07:55,680
 Cindy, with the zoning change, it opens up other uses other than just bigger density

1216
01:07:55,680 --> 01:07:56,680
 for multifamily.

1217
01:07:56,680 --> 01:07:59,040
 Did you take into consideration that?

1218
01:07:59,040 --> 01:08:01,040
 >> Yes, I did.

1219
01:08:01,040 --> 01:08:08,000
 The fact that this is neighborhood mixed use, and the NRMU district provides for neighborhood

1220
01:08:08,000 --> 01:08:17,600
 services and neighborhood-sized retail and commercial, and it is along a primary arterial

1221
01:08:17,600 --> 01:08:24,400
 that directly connects to the loop, we felt that this was appropriate.

1222
01:08:24,400 --> 01:08:29,360
 If it doesn't happen, we actually talked about whether or not we should overlay it, and because

1223
01:08:29,360 --> 01:08:36,000
 of the fact that we've got this primary arterial here close to the loop, we thought that it

1224
01:08:36,000 --> 01:08:37,000
 may not be necessary.

1225
01:08:37,000 --> 01:08:40,640
 If you feel it's necessary, you can recommend that as a condition.

1226
01:08:40,640 --> 01:08:45,240
 >> So mainly just because it's fronting Elm, it was your reason for it didn't really take

1227
01:08:45,240 --> 01:08:48,160
 into consideration what's behind it?

1228
01:08:48,160 --> 01:08:54,120
 >> Well, what's behind it is a house and vacant land.

1229
01:08:54,120 --> 01:09:00,560
 We've got a lot of residential here, however, this is not going to have any access to this.

1230
01:09:00,560 --> 01:09:04,400
 It's not really going to interact with them at all unless we have people coming around.

1231
01:09:04,400 --> 01:09:10,400
 >> Chris, you're back.

1232
01:09:10,400 --> 01:09:20,560
 >> Along those same lines, well, I just had one of those memory lapses again.

1233
01:09:20,560 --> 01:09:24,920
 It'll come back to me, sorry about that.

1234
01:09:24,920 --> 01:09:32,360
 >> Cindy, kind of piggybacking off Mr. Ellis' question, the past two P&Z meetings we've had

1235
01:09:32,360 --> 01:09:37,480
 actually zoning and SUP cases almost in tandem.

1236
01:09:37,480 --> 01:09:42,000
 I'm surprised not to see the SUP in tandem with this.

1237
01:09:42,000 --> 01:09:48,400
 Is there a reason why there's going to be a delay to get an SUP on this property?

1238
01:09:48,400 --> 01:09:52,480
 >> The applicant did not submit an SUP.

1239
01:09:52,480 --> 01:09:56,600
 They really haven't started the engineering yet.

1240
01:09:56,600 --> 01:09:57,600
 That became clear.

1241
01:09:57,600 --> 01:10:03,280
 The applicant had a neighborhood meeting last night and it became clear during the meeting

1242
01:10:03,280 --> 01:10:06,800
 that the applicant hasn't even started the engineering really for this yet.

1243
01:10:06,800 --> 01:10:11,200
 They're waiting to see if they get this approval before they start that.

1244
01:10:11,200 --> 01:10:12,200
 >> Okay.

1245
01:10:12,200 --> 01:10:13,200
 Mr. Beck.

1246
01:10:13,200 --> 01:10:22,320
 >> Thank you, I remember, realistically, the way this is zoned now, we could have apartments

1247
01:10:22,320 --> 01:10:26,200
 on that whole side of Elm Street from Windsor all the way up to Rhineland, correct?

1248
01:10:26,200 --> 01:10:27,200
 >> Yes.

1249
01:10:27,200 --> 01:10:30,840
 >> And that's a little troubling to me because it is supposed to be mixed use.

1250
01:10:30,840 --> 01:10:31,840
 >> Yes.

1251
01:10:31,840 --> 01:10:39,120
 >> And just going forward on this, I would think not only to city planners but when it

1252
01:10:39,120 --> 01:10:43,400
 comes to us, that we ought to be considering that as we get down the road that we just

1253
01:10:43,400 --> 01:10:48,320
 don't have bumper to bumper multifamily units there without a little commercial because

1254
01:10:48,320 --> 01:10:51,800
 otherwise you're building up all that residential there and yet they're still going to have

1255
01:10:51,800 --> 01:10:57,920
 to come into town or drive a good distance to get to some convenience stores or whatever.

1256
01:10:57,920 --> 01:10:58,920
 >> Right.

1257
01:10:58,920 --> 01:11:08,200
 Right now we actually talked about this too and we don't feel that the mixed use aspect

1258
01:11:08,200 --> 01:11:10,080
 would work there right now.

1259
01:11:10,080 --> 01:11:11,080
 >> Where?

1260
01:11:11,080 --> 01:11:15,560
 In that from Rhineland to Windsor?

1261
01:11:15,560 --> 01:11:17,120
 >> No, this property here.

1262
01:11:17,120 --> 01:11:18,120
 >> Okay.

1263
01:11:18,120 --> 01:11:19,360
 >> We need more --

1264
01:11:19,360 --> 01:11:20,360
 >> Commercial.

1265
01:11:20,360 --> 01:11:21,360
 >> Commercial.

1266
01:11:21,360 --> 01:11:22,360
 >> I agree.

1267
01:11:22,360 --> 01:11:23,360
 I agree.

1268
01:11:23,360 --> 01:11:31,480
 >> And a good example is Victoria Station, that's a mixed use and those offices and those

1269
01:11:31,480 --> 01:11:35,520
 retail spaces are usually vacant.

1270
01:11:35,520 --> 01:11:37,200
 >> But we can't dictate --

1271
01:11:37,200 --> 01:11:38,200
 >> No, we can't.

1272
01:11:38,200 --> 01:11:39,200
 >> -- what the mixed use is.

1273
01:11:39,200 --> 01:11:40,200
 That's the problem.

1274
01:11:40,200 --> 01:11:44,920
 But, yeah, going forward I think we need to keep that in mind because I think then the

1275
01:11:44,920 --> 01:11:48,400
 neighborhood of the people that live in the neighborhood would have a legitimate complaint

1276
01:11:48,400 --> 01:11:53,000
 if you've got strictly multifamily all the way up and down Elm Street there.

1277
01:11:53,000 --> 01:11:55,920
 Even though you're beginning to look like that now.

1278
01:11:55,920 --> 01:12:01,000
 >> It would be up to you and the City Council if we would have that happen because multifamily

1279
01:12:01,000 --> 01:12:02,960
 would require an SUP.

1280
01:12:02,960 --> 01:12:04,400
 >> Okay.

1281
01:12:04,400 --> 01:12:09,520
 And conceivably it would probably be easier said than done we could rezone it to accommodate

1282
01:12:09,520 --> 01:12:10,680
 more commercial, correct?

1283
01:12:10,680 --> 01:12:11,680
 >> Mm-hmm.

1284
01:12:11,680 --> 01:12:12,680
 >> Yeah.

1285
01:12:12,680 --> 01:12:13,680
 Okay.

1286
01:12:13,680 --> 01:12:14,680
 Thanks.

1287
01:12:14,680 --> 01:12:15,680
 >> Commissioner Smith.

1288
01:12:15,680 --> 01:12:24,320
 >> Was the applicant ever, when we were talking about permitted uses, was the applicant ever

1289
01:12:24,320 --> 01:12:28,640
 agreeable to restrictions put on the zoning to restrict it just to multifamily and then

1290
01:12:28,640 --> 01:12:32,400
 take out the commercial at that point in time just if they're -- I didn't see any of the

1291
01:12:32,400 --> 01:12:37,760
 opposition letters that we see sometimes with people who are coming in for rezoning specifically

1292
01:12:37,760 --> 01:12:42,640
 for multifamily use, don't worry about the new zoning allowing bars and clubs and kind

1293
01:12:42,640 --> 01:12:43,640
 of things like that.

1294
01:12:43,640 --> 01:12:45,760
 But I don't know if that was --

1295
01:12:45,760 --> 01:12:50,960
 >> It wasn't broached with the applicant but he's going to be here tonight so you could

1296
01:12:50,960 --> 01:12:51,960
 ask.

1297
01:12:51,960 --> 01:12:52,960
 >> Okay.

1298
01:12:52,960 --> 01:12:53,960
 Thanks.

1299
01:12:53,960 --> 01:12:54,960
 >> Commissioner Ellis.

1300
01:12:54,960 --> 01:12:55,960
 >> Thank you, Chair.

1301
01:12:55,960 --> 01:12:58,160
 Cindy, you mentioned a neighborhood meeting.

1302
01:12:58,160 --> 01:12:59,160
 Did you go to that?

1303
01:12:59,160 --> 01:13:00,160
 >> Yes, I did.

1304
01:13:00,160 --> 01:13:01,160
 >> Can you fill us in?

1305
01:13:01,160 --> 01:13:02,160
 >> Oh, yes.

1306
01:13:02,160 --> 01:13:03,160
 Thank you.

1307
01:13:03,160 --> 01:13:08,920
 There were approximately 14 people here and the -- I have a list.

1308
01:13:08,920 --> 01:13:15,520
 A lot of -- all of the people there were not in favor of this request and some of the concerns

1309
01:13:15,520 --> 01:13:20,360
 that they had were with the density.

1310
01:13:20,360 --> 01:13:26,700
 They had concerns about visitor parking which actually visitor parking under our new parking

1311
01:13:26,700 --> 01:13:31,560
 requirements they have to provide for visitor parking.

1312
01:13:31,560 --> 01:13:35,560
 No transition from apartments on the north side of Northam to single family on the south

1313
01:13:35,560 --> 01:13:37,480
 side of Windsor.

1314
01:13:37,480 --> 01:13:44,360
 Well, again, it doesn't touch Windsor so there would be -- whatever happens here could act

1315
01:13:44,360 --> 01:13:47,800
 as a transition.

1316
01:13:47,800 --> 01:13:54,280
 One of the neighbors lived here, lives here.

1317
01:13:54,280 --> 01:14:00,280
 She's concerned that if this property is allowed to be rezoned NRMU, then the remaining portions

1318
01:14:00,280 --> 01:14:11,200
 of the neighborhood mixed use in this triangle area would be rezoned to NRMU as well.

1319
01:14:11,200 --> 01:14:13,240
 Another person was concerned about safety.

1320
01:14:13,240 --> 01:14:18,300
 She's got trouble with people crossing her property and littering.

1321
01:14:18,300 --> 01:14:25,600
 She wanted to know about fencing that may be put up around the site.

1322
01:14:25,600 --> 01:14:28,880
 Several attendees had questions about the cost of the apartments which they didn't know at

1323
01:14:28,880 --> 01:14:34,120
 this time, they're not that far in the design.

1324
01:14:34,120 --> 01:14:35,640
 They were concerned about affordable.

1325
01:14:35,640 --> 01:14:39,840
 The applicant stated in his letter these were going to be affordable apartments and so they

1326
01:14:39,840 --> 01:14:42,880
 were concerned about that.

1327
01:14:42,880 --> 01:14:50,960
 The applicants asked -- again, they asked for more information about the rent.

1328
01:14:50,960 --> 01:14:56,160
 Concerns about traffic, a lot of concerns about traffic increasing along North Elm.

1329
01:14:56,160 --> 01:15:00,240
 There apparently are apartments across from the UNT engineering center that are being

1330
01:15:00,240 --> 01:15:05,800
 developed as well as Denton High School on the south side of West Gate which Julie showed

1331
01:15:05,800 --> 01:15:10,720
 you that location on hers.

1332
01:15:10,720 --> 01:15:17,680
 And they're concerned about the parking that will be generated by all the development in

1333
01:15:17,680 --> 01:15:19,680
 the area.

1334
01:15:19,680 --> 01:15:28,240
 Concerns about the capacity of water and sewer service and storm water runoff.

1335
01:15:28,240 --> 01:15:32,920
 The company that was there, the applicant indicated there's an eight-inch existing

1336
01:15:32,920 --> 01:15:36,560
 water main on the north side of Elm and an eight-inch sanitary sewer line on the north

1337
01:15:36,560 --> 01:15:39,440
 side of West Windsor.

1338
01:15:39,440 --> 01:15:43,720
 The project could potentially connect through easements on adjacent private property with

1339
01:15:43,720 --> 01:15:50,800
 relevant landowners or they would bore across through -- right now their plan is to bore

1340
01:15:50,800 --> 01:15:53,680
 under North Elm.

1341
01:15:53,680 --> 01:15:58,600
 And they are going to -- they indicated they would contact TechStat to determine the capacity

1342
01:15:58,600 --> 01:16:02,760
 of the storm drain system in North -- in North Elm.

1343
01:16:02,760 --> 01:16:07,520
 If it was lacking capacity, they would have to look at detention.

1344
01:16:07,520 --> 01:16:18,120
 Just to circle back on the apartments, you mentioned they stated they would be affordable.

1345
01:16:18,120 --> 01:16:20,080
 That's what they said.

1346
01:16:20,080 --> 01:16:23,520
 Was there any discussion about the type of leases they had?

1347
01:16:23,520 --> 01:16:28,280
 I know there's been a lot of concern around town about new apartments going up and moving

1348
01:16:28,280 --> 01:16:31,360
 towards a single room occupancy model.

1349
01:16:31,360 --> 01:16:37,720
 These apartment homes, usually when you see single room occupancy you see four-bedroom

1350
01:16:37,720 --> 01:16:38,720
 apartments.

1351
01:16:38,720 --> 01:16:41,840
 These are one- and two-bedroom apartments.

1352
01:16:41,840 --> 01:16:49,080
 So I don't anticipate that they would be student housing, but they could be.

1353
01:16:49,080 --> 01:16:51,440
 We have nothing restricting that.

1354
01:16:51,440 --> 01:16:52,440
 Okay.

1355
01:16:52,440 --> 01:16:54,000
 Commissioner Beck.

1356
01:16:54,000 --> 01:16:57,720
 Thank you, Chair.

1357
01:16:57,720 --> 01:17:06,880
 This whole area, including this parcel of land that wants to be rezoned, NRMU, what

1358
01:17:06,880 --> 01:17:13,120
 would be the buffer requirement between that parcel and the existing land around it?

1359
01:17:13,120 --> 01:17:17,600
 Well, we have -- it's based on user zoning.

1360
01:17:17,600 --> 01:17:25,360
 So if this were residential zoning and not NRMU, they'd have to buffer all the way around.

1361
01:17:25,360 --> 01:17:30,440
 Right now there's no buffer requirements on the vacant property.

1362
01:17:30,440 --> 01:17:37,520
 They will have to buffer along the church and the single family home.

1363
01:17:37,520 --> 01:17:38,520
 Okay.

1364
01:17:38,520 --> 01:17:39,520
 And what's that buffer requirement?

1365
01:17:39,520 --> 01:17:42,520
 It's a type C buffer, 10-foot.

1366
01:17:42,520 --> 01:17:43,520
 10-foot.

1367
01:17:43,520 --> 01:17:44,520
 Okay.

1368
01:17:44,520 --> 01:17:47,240
 Does it include fencing?

1369
01:17:47,240 --> 01:17:52,900
 No, it doesn't, but we can require -- that's something that you can require when it comes

1370
01:17:52,900 --> 01:17:53,900
 forward for SUP.

1371
01:17:53,900 --> 01:17:54,900
 Okay.

1372
01:17:54,900 --> 01:17:55,900
 Thanks.

1373
01:17:55,900 --> 01:18:03,880
 Any other questions for Cindy?

1374
01:18:03,880 --> 01:18:07,040
 Great.

1375
01:18:07,040 --> 01:18:08,040
 Thank you, Cindy.

1376
01:18:08,040 --> 01:18:09,040
 Sure.

1377
01:18:09,040 --> 01:18:15,080
 Item G is being postponed to January 9th, so that would move us to item H. But prior

1378
01:18:15,080 --> 01:18:20,040
 to Haley's presentation, I'm going to call for a break so we can get food.

1379
01:18:20,040 --> 01:18:27,500
 It is 555, we'll reconvene at 605.

1380
01:18:27,500 --> 01:18:29,800
 Welcome back to the work session meeting for plan and zoning.

1381
01:18:29,800 --> 01:18:47,700
 We'll reconvene the meeting at 610 on the city staff presentation.

1382
01:18:47,700 --> 01:18:52,200
 So the item tonight -- and I didn't know how much detail we wanted to get into in the work

1383
01:18:52,200 --> 01:18:57,600
 session since this will be sort of our first time to discuss this sort of in a public hearing

1384
01:18:57,600 --> 01:19:04,400
 setting, and we just presented this to council about two weeks ago as part of a work session.

1385
01:19:04,400 --> 01:19:08,920
 And so legal is still going through their review, but we wanted to at least still have

1386
01:19:08,920 --> 01:19:10,880
 a discussion publicly.

1387
01:19:10,880 --> 01:19:16,440
 I know that has been talked about here, I think, the last time we presented around some

1388
01:19:16,440 --> 01:19:18,240
 of the concepts and where we're headed.

1389
01:19:18,240 --> 01:19:23,920
 So I'd like to just sort of run through some of these fairly quickly, but then a little

1390
01:19:23,920 --> 01:19:27,860
 bit more in detail tonight.

1391
01:19:27,860 --> 01:19:33,960
 But again, just wanted to go over the overall approach, again, looking at this sort of holistically

1392
01:19:33,960 --> 01:19:40,320
 and really ways and how we manage and improve the urban forest and kind of the steps that

1393
01:19:40,320 --> 01:19:41,920
 we went through.

1394
01:19:41,920 --> 01:19:48,520
 Then really looking at that inventory, which was completed in 2016, setting goals and then

1395
01:19:48,520 --> 01:19:53,680
 establishing those methods to achieve the goals, both publicly -- I'm sorry, privately

1396
01:19:53,680 --> 01:19:58,440
 through the regulatory mechanism and then publicly through programatically.

1397
01:19:58,440 --> 01:20:04,880
 How do we handle with public funds, tree fund dollars, how do we both kind of attack this

1398
01:20:04,880 --> 01:20:07,480
 on a two-fold basis?

1399
01:20:07,480 --> 01:20:13,320
 And then what I think is equally important is establishing metrics and sort of a report

1400
01:20:13,320 --> 01:20:20,360
 card and evaluation on an annual basis of how are we performing, both from private and

1401
01:20:20,360 --> 01:20:26,460
 public side, and are there adjustments that we need to make moving forward?

1402
01:20:26,460 --> 01:20:34,480
 And so the way we kind of arranged this presentation is it was even good for me to kind of go back

1403
01:20:34,480 --> 01:20:41,400
 to the real history of how the tree code started and go through kind of the background, past

1404
01:20:41,400 --> 01:20:50,540
 and present, get into that regulatory framework with really the just of the presentation,

1405
01:20:50,540 --> 01:20:55,520
 talk about the tree fund, that's kind of that bridge between the private and public, and

1406
01:20:55,520 --> 01:21:01,640
 then talk to how we program some of that, both from land acquisition right away plannings

1407
01:21:01,640 --> 01:21:09,560
 and how parks becomes -- has a role in this.

1408
01:21:09,560 --> 01:21:14,640
 Interestingly enough, 2003 Flow Hospital redeveloped and there were a number of established oaks

1409
01:21:14,640 --> 01:21:16,360
 on that site.

1410
01:21:16,360 --> 01:21:20,880
 There was a lot of public outcry as a result of that redevelopment.

1411
01:21:20,880 --> 01:21:29,440
 And in reaction to that outcry in 2003, the tree preservation ordinance was -- had begun

1412
01:21:29,440 --> 01:21:32,600
 and it was adopted in 2004.

1413
01:21:32,600 --> 01:21:39,400
 Interestingly a year later, the Denton citizens tree committee was created and they recommended

1414
01:21:39,400 --> 01:21:43,120
 tightening that ordinance and removing some of the loopholes.

1415
01:21:43,120 --> 01:21:46,960
 And I won't go through every draft.

1416
01:21:46,960 --> 01:21:52,800
 There were probably well over a dozen, if not more, maybe two dozen drafts from staff

1417
01:21:52,800 --> 01:21:58,920
 members, consultants, staff, committee members, consultants, I mean, it was numerous drafts

1418
01:21:58,920 --> 01:22:04,200
 and there was never a consensus that could be reached from a year after this thing was

1419
01:22:04,200 --> 01:22:07,200
 originally adopted to where we are today.

1420
01:22:07,200 --> 01:22:11,360
 But I kind of -- what I also wanted to highlight in there, some of the actions that the state

1421
01:22:11,360 --> 01:22:17,000
 legislature has kind of been picking at with respect to tree preservation and some of the

1422
01:22:17,000 --> 01:22:25,520
 bills that they had been trying to pass through the years to where we are with this last legislative

1423
01:22:25,520 --> 01:22:32,460
 session 2017, House Bill 7 and sort of what that did.

1424
01:22:32,460 --> 01:22:41,360
 So here we are again, 2018, and this just gives you kind of that framework of where

1425
01:22:41,360 --> 01:22:45,680
 we are present in coming up with this draft.

1426
01:22:45,680 --> 01:22:50,160
 If you remember, we started talking about it towards the beginning of the year and kind

1427
01:22:50,160 --> 01:22:57,800
 of put a hold on it to really look at this, not just tree, but also tree landscape, ESA

1428
01:22:57,800 --> 01:23:00,120
 and how we move forward.

1429
01:23:00,120 --> 01:23:02,320
 And so that's really where this draft is.

1430
01:23:02,320 --> 01:23:07,400
 Again, it started with kind of this initial policy discussion back in April and May and

1431
01:23:07,400 --> 01:23:12,280
 then listening to input from the Committee on the Environment, of course, Planning and

1432
01:23:12,280 --> 01:23:20,920
 Zoning Commission, DCRC, as well as City Council, and then sort of holding with making sure

1433
01:23:20,920 --> 01:23:26,600
 we're going to comply with Local Government Code 212095, making sure we're increasing

1434
01:23:26,600 --> 01:23:30,800
 preservation and mitigation and then unifying the standards.

1435
01:23:30,800 --> 01:23:38,400
 And so a little bit of House Bill 7, again, there are some prohibitions requiring homeowners

1436
01:23:38,400 --> 01:23:44,100
 pay mitigation fees for removing trees under 10 inches in DBH and then mitigation removal

1437
01:23:44,100 --> 01:23:49,120
 for dead or diseased or trees that pose an imminent or immediate threat to a person or

1438
01:23:49,120 --> 01:23:50,120
 property.

1439
01:23:50,120 --> 01:23:54,600
 Again, how that's defined is anyone's guess.

1440
01:23:54,600 --> 01:23:57,240
 I think that's part of that carryover from that fire bill.

1441
01:23:57,240 --> 01:23:58,240
 Commissioner Beck.

1442
01:23:58,240 --> 01:24:00,240
 Thank you, Chair.

1443
01:24:00,240 --> 01:24:05,720
 A mitigation fee for removing trees under 10 inches, that kind of struck me as odd.

1444
01:24:05,720 --> 01:24:10,400
 And I can see over, you know, charging somebody if they were going to move a bigger tree,

1445
01:24:10,400 --> 01:24:12,840
 but if they're under 10 inch...

1446
01:24:12,840 --> 01:24:19,840
 If it's less than 10 inches in diameter, the municipality cannot require a person...

1447
01:24:19,840 --> 01:24:20,840
 Cannot require?

1448
01:24:20,840 --> 01:24:23,840
 Yeah, to pay a tree mitigation fee for removing a tree.

1449
01:24:23,840 --> 01:24:24,840
 Okay.

1450
01:24:24,840 --> 01:24:30,280
 We're going to charge them, so thank you for clarifying that.

1451
01:24:30,280 --> 01:24:35,240
 Mitigation fee credit, again, I think we went over this previously, but just wanted to touch

1452
01:24:35,240 --> 01:24:37,000
 on it.

1453
01:24:37,000 --> 01:24:40,480
 If a municipality imposes a tree mitigation fee credit for the removal, it must allow

1454
01:24:40,480 --> 01:24:43,280
 for a credit to offset that fee.

1455
01:24:43,280 --> 01:24:46,800
 And then if it's planted on the property for which the mitigation fee was assessed or on

1456
01:24:46,800 --> 01:24:50,700
 a mutually agreed upon by the municipality and the person.

1457
01:24:50,700 --> 01:24:56,880
 And then it requires that any tree that's replanted must be a minimum of two inches

1458
01:24:56,880 --> 01:25:00,880
 in diameter at a point on the trunk of four and a half feet above the ground, which is

1459
01:25:00,880 --> 01:25:04,360
 that DBH, diameter at breast height.

1460
01:25:04,360 --> 01:25:10,160
 And then mutually agreed upon, it kind of defines and kind of hints to what that means.

1461
01:25:10,160 --> 01:25:15,400
 We're really looking at just requiring it primarily on that replanting to be done on

1462
01:25:15,400 --> 01:25:18,800
 the property itself.

1463
01:25:18,800 --> 01:25:25,880
 There's language also in there that talks about 50% credit for residential and a 40%

1464
01:25:25,880 --> 01:25:26,880
 credit for non-residential.

1465
01:25:26,880 --> 01:25:33,040
 Interestingly, I think we can all read this a number of different ways.

1466
01:25:33,040 --> 01:25:38,080
 We've called a couple of the cities that have modified their code to address this.

1467
01:25:38,080 --> 01:25:41,960
 As we're calling, a lot have not yet addressed it.

1468
01:25:41,960 --> 01:25:45,560
 And they asked us, how are you guys addressing it?

1469
01:25:45,560 --> 01:25:52,400
 We looked at two in particular that I think Irving was the first to incorporate some language

1470
01:25:52,400 --> 01:25:54,840
 in their tree code.

1471
01:25:54,840 --> 01:26:01,120
 It was done in 2017 or 2018.

1472
01:26:01,120 --> 01:26:04,160
 And then Flower Mound recently amended theirs.

1473
01:26:04,160 --> 01:26:08,880
 They more or less adopted the language right from the local government code, but they were

1474
01:26:08,880 --> 01:26:14,320
 one of the ones, how are you administering this when we spoke to, when staff spoke to

1475
01:26:14,320 --> 01:26:15,500
 their staff?

1476
01:26:15,500 --> 01:26:21,040
 And so the approach we really took is a very liberal interpretation of it and kind of mimicked

1477
01:26:21,040 --> 01:26:31,880
 that of Irving and just took a straight 50% credit off, kind of off the top, if you will.

1478
01:26:31,880 --> 01:26:36,120
 But I'll get into those, get into that example.

1479
01:26:36,120 --> 01:26:40,240
 A little bit of the goals, again, unified approach, make sure we comply with local government

1480
01:26:40,240 --> 01:26:41,240
 code.

1481
01:26:41,240 --> 01:26:45,560
 Limit clear cutting and increased preservation, require mitigation for all trees removed,

1482
01:26:45,560 --> 01:26:50,560
 guide priorities towards preserving larger quality trees, tree stands and habitat, promote

1483
01:26:50,560 --> 01:26:57,120
 multi-age forest with native and quality trees, and then balance trees with reasonable development.

1484
01:26:57,120 --> 01:27:02,440
 Looking at canopy goals, this was an item that was discussed pretty heavily with respect

1485
01:27:02,440 --> 01:27:04,560
 to whether it should be 30%.

1486
01:27:04,560 --> 01:27:13,160
 Ultimately, we looked at then splitting it between 40 and 20, 40% east of 35, 20% west

1487
01:27:13,160 --> 01:27:14,880
 of 35.

1488
01:27:14,880 --> 01:27:21,080
 What we did was just looked at where we are today with that, what's on the ground now,

1489
01:27:21,080 --> 01:27:25,660
 and so we're about 33% and 16%.

1490
01:27:25,660 --> 01:27:33,040
 We also looked at all of the current parcels and their zoning classification and applying

1491
01:27:33,040 --> 01:27:38,920
 that canopy coverage that's required in the DDC now, if it would actually bring it up.

1492
01:27:38,920 --> 01:27:45,400
 We're still shy, but what that doesn't include are any public plantings that would be done

1493
01:27:45,400 --> 01:27:50,040
 with respect to right-of-way plantings or anything else or any future zoning changes.

1494
01:27:50,040 --> 01:27:56,280
 So again, it's a goal for us to reach, but I think it could be attainable and it's pretty

1495
01:27:56,280 --> 01:27:57,280
 close.

1496
01:27:57,280 --> 01:28:02,440
 Kind of the summary of changes, I wanted to sort of start at more of a higher level and

1497
01:28:02,440 --> 01:28:09,920
 just kind of talk about some broad categories rather than do a page turn, I think, with

1498
01:28:09,920 --> 01:28:14,200
 each section of the code, but get into kind of some of the major changes, applicability,

1499
01:28:14,200 --> 01:28:20,920
 tree type, again, the preservation and landscape, new opportunities for preservation, habitat,

1500
01:28:20,920 --> 01:28:22,520
 and mitigation.

1501
01:28:22,520 --> 01:28:27,520
 And so the first applicability, you may recall we talked pretty heavily about whether or not

1502
01:28:27,520 --> 01:28:33,320
 the city should have to comply with the same rules as everybody.

1503
01:28:33,320 --> 01:28:37,000
 There were some exemptions, and the only one that really stayed was the airport, which

1504
01:28:37,000 --> 01:28:39,200
 kind of makes sense.

1505
01:28:39,200 --> 01:28:45,160
 I don't think there's a lot of trees out there anyways to preserve to begin with, but one

1506
01:28:45,160 --> 01:28:50,160
 of the major changes, and I have it kind of highlighted as a discussion item, is again,

1507
01:28:50,160 --> 01:28:55,680
 we took straight from local government code single family duplex lots with trees under

1508
01:28:55,680 --> 01:28:57,880
 10 inches at DBH.

1509
01:28:57,880 --> 01:29:04,320
 Currently the code exempts all single family, regardless of DBH or size.

1510
01:29:04,320 --> 01:29:06,360
 And so this would not.

1511
01:29:06,360 --> 01:29:12,160
 So that is a change that a single family property, which currently is exempt if they had a tree

1512
01:29:12,160 --> 01:29:21,300
 at 15 inches or 16 inches, they would have to get a tree removal permit and possibly

1513
01:29:21,300 --> 01:29:25,200
 preserve or mitigate depending the type of tree.

1514
01:29:25,200 --> 01:29:31,520
 Again, that's a substantial change, but I just wanted to highlight that.

1515
01:29:31,520 --> 01:29:36,880
 Tree type and mitigation, this was something, this is probably the most discussed and debated

1516
01:29:36,880 --> 01:29:40,200
 topic.

1517
01:29:40,200 --> 01:29:45,920
 If you remember, we have a variety of preserve, protected quality, quality tree stands, secondary

1518
01:29:45,920 --> 01:29:47,960
 secondary tree stands.

1519
01:29:47,960 --> 01:29:52,440
 And so we try to consolidate some of those, and again, keep that landmark, which is a

1520
01:29:52,440 --> 01:29:55,680
 historic or Texas big tree registry.

1521
01:29:55,680 --> 01:30:00,560
 Right now we don't have any, but we think it's still a worthy category to have.

1522
01:30:00,560 --> 01:30:06,680
 Heritage trees, which would be all protected trees with a DBH of 18 inches or greater,

1523
01:30:06,680 --> 01:30:11,880
 and then all post and black check oaks, DBH of 4 inches or greater.

1524
01:30:11,880 --> 01:30:17,040
 And then quality trees, any non-secondary trees between 6 and 17.

1525
01:30:17,040 --> 01:30:23,200
 And so 30% minimum preservation, and that would be made up of those in green.

1526
01:30:23,200 --> 01:30:32,040
 Now, secondary, 6 to 17 inches in DBH, the boat arc hackberry or cottonwood, there is

1527
01:30:32,040 --> 01:30:36,040
 no preservation requirement for those.

1528
01:30:36,040 --> 01:30:39,040
 However, if they are removed, there is a replacement rate.

1529
01:30:39,040 --> 01:30:45,720
 But rather than on an inch for inch, it's for every tree removed, it's replacement with

1530
01:30:45,720 --> 01:30:47,800
 a 2-inch tree.

1531
01:30:47,800 --> 01:30:51,840
 And then there's some, the ability to get some credits, again, that's to sort of foster

1532
01:30:51,840 --> 01:30:57,440
 or push towards preserving some of those larger type trees.

1533
01:30:57,440 --> 01:31:03,200
 But if the hackberry, so if that secondary tree is greater than 17 inches, just say it's

1534
01:31:03,200 --> 01:31:08,180
 18 inches, then it falls into that heritage tree.

1535
01:31:08,180 --> 01:31:15,240
 So they would be, they essentially would be protected if they are greater than 18 inches.

1536
01:31:15,240 --> 01:31:21,040
 >> Is this for all development, including single family residents?

1537
01:31:21,040 --> 01:31:25,160
 >> Correct, correct.

1538
01:31:25,160 --> 01:31:32,320
 And then non-protected, again, still a debate, you know, a debated item, particularly the

1539
01:31:32,320 --> 01:31:35,920
 first two, the mesquite and honey locust.

1540
01:31:35,920 --> 01:31:41,440
 What we did include, what we, trying to kind of meet in the middle, if you remember, we

1541
01:31:41,440 --> 01:31:46,480
 have the concept of a preserved habitat or conservation easement.

1542
01:31:46,480 --> 01:31:51,480
 So if it is part of a natural area that's adjacent to an, that's undisturbed, we would

1543
01:31:51,480 --> 01:31:53,640
 allow for credit for that.

1544
01:31:53,640 --> 01:32:02,400
 Interestingly, I'll show you on another slide, some of our parks folks brought me a limb

1545
01:32:02,400 --> 01:32:09,400
 from a honey locust, and everybody that comes by my office thinks it looks like some barbaric

1546
01:32:09,400 --> 01:32:10,400
 staff from Conan.

1547
01:32:10,400 --> 01:32:13,400
 I mean, it is, it's pretty wicked when you look at it.

1548
01:32:13,400 --> 01:32:18,680
 And so when you think of it in terms of preserving these in a park or somewhere else, it may

1549
01:32:18,680 --> 01:32:21,200
 not be conducive to that.

1550
01:32:21,200 --> 01:32:26,640
 Again, crepe myrtle, malty trunk, any diseased or dead tree, trees that pose an eminent or

1551
01:32:26,640 --> 01:32:31,520
 immediate threat to a person's or property, again, I think we need to ultimately define

1552
01:32:31,520 --> 01:32:37,260
 what that means, but that's straight from the local government code.

1553
01:32:37,260 --> 01:32:41,960
 And then any tree listed on the Department of Ag's noxious and invasive plant list, and

1554
01:32:41,960 --> 01:32:48,340
 that was a request that came from our watershed folks.

1555
01:32:48,340 --> 01:32:53,520
 And so again, should the mesquite and honey locust be preserved, replaced, or just considering

1556
01:32:53,520 --> 01:32:56,880
 a non-protected tree?

1557
01:32:56,880 --> 01:33:05,480
 And this is that branch, and so I'm happy I got the ruler to balance, but it's almost

1558
01:33:05,480 --> 01:33:11,160
 three inches in length, and it is, I couldn't bend the thing, and I didn't want to try

1559
01:33:11,160 --> 01:33:14,980
 that much, but it is, it's pretty wicked.

1560
01:33:14,980 --> 01:33:18,800
 And so that's, again, something to consider.

1561
01:33:18,800 --> 01:33:25,000
 What I'm going to do is tag my partner, Haley, to come up on the landscape components, and

1562
01:33:25,000 --> 01:33:29,840
 she's really been working on that component of this ordinance.

1563
01:33:29,840 --> 01:33:38,840
 All right, I see the clock shows we only have five minutes left, so do you want to continue

1564
01:33:38,840 --> 01:33:45,080
 with this now, or just continue the conversation in the regular meeting?

1565
01:33:45,080 --> 01:33:47,760
 I mean, let's go ahead and take five minutes.

1566
01:33:47,760 --> 01:33:48,760
 Okay.

1567
01:33:48,760 --> 01:33:54,440
 All right, so we've talked about the landscape code in depth pretty well before now.

1568
01:33:54,440 --> 01:33:57,760
 It hasn't changed a whole lot in the form, if you look through the draft code that we

1569
01:33:57,760 --> 01:34:02,480
 provided, but one of the main goals overall of this entire code update was to maintain

1570
01:34:02,480 --> 01:34:07,880
 and improve our minimum landscape area and canopy requirements city-wide.

1571
01:34:07,880 --> 01:34:11,200
 So that's kind of broken down into three major components, the preservation that Richard

1572
01:34:11,200 --> 01:34:16,800
 will talk about further, and then buffers in landscape areas within new development.

1573
01:34:16,800 --> 01:34:21,280
 Some of the major changes that we're proposing, preserve trees will now be allowed to count

1574
01:34:21,280 --> 01:34:25,720
 towards landscape and canopy goals, currently in the code, unless you're preserving in excess

1575
01:34:25,720 --> 01:34:29,400
 of the minimum, that doesn't count, so that would give a little bit more credit there

1576
01:34:29,400 --> 01:34:31,880
 towards landscaping.

1577
01:34:31,880 --> 01:34:37,400
 We are going to introduce some requirements for diversity in terms of age and species

1578
01:34:37,400 --> 01:34:39,640
 with new plantings on site.

1579
01:34:39,640 --> 01:34:44,600
 We're introducing some low-impact design standards that Clarion had originally proposed that

1580
01:34:44,600 --> 01:34:49,240
 we thought were definitely worthy of introducing, just bioswales and things like that, to give

1581
01:34:49,240 --> 01:34:54,520
 a little more creative options, and then we are taking away the credit you may be familiar

1582
01:34:54,520 --> 01:35:00,120
 with where pervious paving on a site can count towards landscaping in the current code.

1583
01:35:00,120 --> 01:35:03,920
 And then we're also proposing to remove the credits that are currently allowed for ESA

1584
01:35:03,920 --> 01:35:08,280
 to count towards your landscaping.

1585
01:35:08,280 --> 01:35:14,520
 So those credits that were recently introduced in the ESA update, sub-chapter 17, were that

1586
01:35:14,520 --> 01:35:18,000
 for tree canopy, you would get one square foot of canopy credit for every square foot

1587
01:35:18,000 --> 01:35:22,240
 of ESA tree canopy, and then in addition, you could get two square feet of landscaping

1588
01:35:22,240 --> 01:35:27,200
 credits for every square foot of ESA tree canopy, and one square foot for every square

1589
01:35:27,200 --> 01:35:29,000
 foot of non-wooded ESA canopy.

1590
01:35:29,000 --> 01:35:33,200
 So you'll see a little bit later on, we're introducing a new concept called the development

1591
01:35:33,200 --> 01:35:38,000
 impact area that would take ESA out of your landscape requirements entirely, so we thought

1592
01:35:38,000 --> 01:35:42,160
 it made sense to concurrently take away those credits, and so now it won't count for you

1593
01:35:42,160 --> 01:35:46,200
 or against you, in essence.

1594
01:35:46,200 --> 01:35:48,080
 So you've seen this table before.

1595
01:35:48,080 --> 01:35:51,000
 We are proposing point systems be introduced.

1596
01:35:51,000 --> 01:35:55,640
 So for buffers, the point system, again, it would depend on the use that's developing

1597
01:35:55,640 --> 01:35:59,360
 and what is adjoining it to determine how many points you would have to have and what

1598
01:35:59,360 --> 01:36:05,040
 the width of that buffer would be, and then within the required points, there would be

1599
01:36:05,040 --> 01:36:07,720
 kind of a menu of options that they could choose from.

1600
01:36:07,720 --> 01:36:11,000
 The current code is very prescriptive in what has to be in that buffer.

1601
01:36:11,000 --> 01:36:14,540
 This would give a greater amount of flexibility in site design.

1602
01:36:14,540 --> 01:36:20,040
 So just looking at example, multi-family, developing and joining single-family.

1603
01:36:20,040 --> 01:36:21,040
 Family is very stringent.

1604
01:36:21,040 --> 01:36:25,700
 It has to be 10 feet wide with five trees and 30 shrubs for every 100 linear feet.

1605
01:36:25,700 --> 01:36:29,560
 Under the current option, all it would dictate is that it has to have at least that 10-foot

1606
01:36:29,560 --> 01:36:32,480
 width and then 20 points from that list of options.

1607
01:36:32,480 --> 01:36:37,360
 So that could be obtained by something as simple as a masonry wall or by some combination

1608
01:36:37,360 --> 01:36:42,760
 of a wood fence with landscaping or just with landscaping alone.

1609
01:36:42,760 --> 01:36:47,120
 We're also recommending a point system for all of the other aspects of site design and

1610
01:36:47,120 --> 01:36:48,120
 landscaping.

1611
01:36:48,120 --> 01:36:51,640
 We can go through those tables a little bit more in the regular meeting, because it looks

1612
01:36:51,640 --> 01:36:56,000
 like we're almost out of time, but the general goal of the landscape code is to now provide

1613
01:36:56,000 --> 01:37:01,080
 greater flexibility in site design while enhancing the requirements, but it looks like we're

1614
01:37:01,080 --> 01:37:02,080
 almost out of time.

1615
01:37:02,080 --> 01:37:03,080
 Yeah.

1616
01:37:03,080 --> 01:37:10,200
 Let's go ahead and we can close the work session now at 5-20, yeah, is it 6-28, 6-28, yeah,

1617
01:37:10,200 --> 01:37:18,780
 and we'll meet it for regular session in council chambers.

1618
01:37:18,780 --> 01:37:19,780
 Good evening.

1619
01:37:19,780 --> 01:37:22,920
 Welcome to the plan and zoning meeting for November 28th.

1620
01:37:22,920 --> 01:37:27,280
 It is 6-37, we'll call this meeting to order.

1621
01:37:27,280 --> 01:37:29,280
 Appreciate y'all waiting for us.

1622
01:37:29,280 --> 01:37:32,080
 There's a delay in work session, so appreciate your patience.

1623
01:37:32,080 --> 01:37:35,400
 First order of business is to stand and give the Pledge of Allegiance to the U.S. and Texas

1624
01:37:35,400 --> 01:37:36,400
 flag.

1625
01:37:36,400 --> 01:37:44,600
 I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, to the republic for which

1626
01:37:44,600 --> 01:37:53,280
 it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

1627
01:37:53,280 --> 01:38:10,600
 I pledge allegiance to the U.S. and Texas flag, one state under God, one indivisible.

1628
01:38:10,600 --> 01:38:14,800
 With no consent agenda items on the docket for this evening, we'll move right into the

1629
01:38:14,800 --> 01:38:16,560
 public hearings.

1630
01:38:16,560 --> 01:38:20,840
 Item A has been postponed to the December 12th meeting.

1631
01:38:20,840 --> 01:38:25,320
 That brings us to item B, S18-0008E.

1632
01:38:25,320 --> 01:38:31,040
 I'll invite Haley for presentation.

1633
01:38:31,040 --> 01:38:34,780
 This is a continued item that had a public hearing closed, so this evening there will

1634
01:38:34,780 --> 01:38:39,160
 not be any public hearing on the item, but I wanted to invite Haley for presentation

1635
01:38:39,160 --> 01:38:41,880
 so that we can have a discussion.

1636
01:38:41,880 --> 01:38:45,400
 All right, and similar to work session, I'll keep it fairly brief unless there are some

1637
01:38:45,400 --> 01:38:47,920
 specific questions we need to go look at.

1638
01:38:47,920 --> 01:38:52,480
 So this is case S18-8 for the Windsor Drive Apartments.

1639
01:38:52,480 --> 01:38:56,840
 The request before you is to consider making a recommendation to city council regarding

1640
01:38:56,840 --> 01:39:01,120
 a request for a specific use permit to allow a multifamily use on the property that is

1641
01:39:01,120 --> 01:39:03,360
 outlined in yellow on the map.

1642
01:39:03,360 --> 01:39:07,320
 The property is a total of approximately 31 acres, located at the intersection of Windsor

1643
01:39:07,320 --> 01:39:11,880
 Drive and the R35 frontage road.

1644
01:39:11,880 --> 01:39:15,680
 As the chairman mentioned, this item was continued from the November 14th meeting.

1645
01:39:15,680 --> 01:39:19,560
 At that time, the applicant requested the postponement to allow them time to develop

1646
01:39:19,560 --> 01:39:21,000
 a modified plan.

1647
01:39:21,000 --> 01:39:23,800
 The public hearing was closed at that time.

1648
01:39:23,800 --> 01:39:29,400
 And then following that meeting, staff had discussions with legal and with the applicant,

1649
01:39:29,400 --> 01:39:32,680
 and it was ultimately determined that the applicant would move forward with staff's

1650
01:39:32,680 --> 01:39:37,820
 original recommended conditions and the original site plan that was shown on November 14th.

1651
01:39:37,820 --> 01:39:41,960
 No modifications to that site plan are being proposed at this time.

1652
01:39:41,960 --> 01:39:45,120
 A notification was sent out for this public hearing.

1653
01:39:45,120 --> 01:39:47,440
 We received no written responses to that.

1654
01:39:47,440 --> 01:39:51,640
 And the applicant did hold a neighborhood meeting back on September 6th and had approximately

1655
01:39:51,640 --> 01:39:58,000
 20 people in attendance at that meeting with generally positive feedback at that time.

1656
01:39:58,000 --> 01:40:02,840
 So staff does have several requirements based upon the site plan that was provided that

1657
01:40:02,840 --> 01:40:07,840
 will be written into the ordinance to provide clarity, because ultimately, over time, the

1658
01:40:07,840 --> 01:40:11,240
 plans, when they get attached to our ordinances, lose a little bit of their legibility and

1659
01:40:11,240 --> 01:40:15,400
 integrity, so to preserve the integrity of what you all in council have seen, we're

1660
01:40:15,400 --> 01:40:18,440
 adding these elements into the text of the ordinance.

1661
01:40:18,440 --> 01:40:22,920
 With this, we're requesting that staff have the ability to approve an increase or decrease

1662
01:40:22,920 --> 01:40:26,320
 of less than or equal to 5% of any of the amounts described below.

1663
01:40:26,320 --> 01:40:31,280
 So first, the multifamily portion is part of a mixed-use development and will encompass

1664
01:40:31,280 --> 01:40:35,600
 a maximum of 17 out of the 31 acres you saw on the map.

1665
01:40:35,600 --> 01:40:41,440
 16 buildings are indicated on the site plan with a building footprint at 112,724 square

1666
01:40:41,440 --> 01:40:42,440
 feet.

1667
01:40:42,440 --> 01:40:47,360
 There are 336 dwelling units specified on the plan for a density of 20.48 dwelling units

1668
01:40:47,360 --> 01:40:49,320
 per acre.

1669
01:40:49,320 --> 01:40:53,960
 No fewer than 629 parking spaces are required for that amount of dwelling units.

1670
01:40:53,960 --> 01:40:58,320
 The plan does reflect 632 spaces, however, 60 of those are within the footprint of the

1671
01:40:58,320 --> 01:41:02,280
 building, so it doesn't trigger any need for pervious paving or an alternative development

1672
01:41:02,280 --> 01:41:03,840
 plan.

1673
01:41:03,840 --> 01:41:08,960
 The site plan specifies a total of 49% lot coverage, 51% landscape area.

1674
01:41:08,960 --> 01:41:13,160
 This includes a 30-foot wide type D buffer along the eastern property line.

1675
01:41:13,160 --> 01:41:17,800
 The plan does reflect an alternative buffer request that would be one tree for every 40

1676
01:41:17,800 --> 01:41:21,400
 linear feet and a six-foot high opaque fence.

1677
01:41:21,400 --> 01:41:25,800
 The DDC does grant the director the ability to approve this alternative buffer.

1678
01:41:25,800 --> 01:41:29,480
 So we specify that the director may approve any alternative buffer that's equivalent

1679
01:41:29,480 --> 01:41:32,780
 to or more restrictive than what's on the plan.

1680
01:41:32,780 --> 01:41:36,880
 And then finally, the sample building elevation specify an earth tone and gray tone color

1681
01:41:36,880 --> 01:41:41,560
 palette with facades of stucco, hardy board plank siding, and hardy board panels.

1682
01:41:41,560 --> 01:41:45,840
 The final building elevations should reflect these materials and colors and be in compliance

1683
01:41:45,840 --> 01:41:50,600
 with the Denton Development Code multifamily standards.

1684
01:41:50,600 --> 01:41:55,680
 And then with that, staff does have four recommended conditions for this SUP.

1685
01:41:55,680 --> 01:41:59,420
 First be that the City Council would recognize that the driveway access location from the

1686
01:41:59,420 --> 01:42:02,760
 state highway must be approved by TxDOT.

1687
01:42:02,760 --> 01:42:05,960
 Alternations in the configuration of I-35 are currently in planning at this time.

1688
01:42:05,960 --> 01:42:10,320
 So any driveway access locations from the northbound I-35 frontage road, which must

1689
01:42:10,320 --> 01:42:15,240
 be altered in response to changing TxDOT requirements during the permitting process, may be administratively

1690
01:42:15,240 --> 01:42:19,840
 approved by City staff provided that such alterations comply with all DDC and criteria

1691
01:42:19,840 --> 01:42:25,480
 manual requirements and that all remaining elements of the approved site plan be satisfied.

1692
01:42:25,480 --> 01:42:28,800
 Second is that landscaping in the attached plan reflects an intent to comply with all

1693
01:42:28,800 --> 01:42:33,880
 DDC requirements for parking, street trees, minimum landscape, and canopy areas and compatibility

1694
01:42:33,880 --> 01:42:38,400
 buffers with the administrative approval allowance for an alternative buffer.

1695
01:42:38,400 --> 01:42:41,980
 Minor alterations to the depicted locations of the individual plantings on that plan may

1696
01:42:41,980 --> 01:42:46,600
 be approved by City staff provided that the final landscaping as planted comply with the

1697
01:42:46,600 --> 01:42:51,640
 site plan in terms of buffer and open space locations as well as all DDC requirements.

1698
01:42:51,640 --> 01:42:56,560
 Third, that the agreement that has been entered into and executed by CL Ventures LLC and Sage

1699
01:42:56,560 --> 01:43:01,820
 Natural Resources LLC, which sets forth the 250-foot reverse setback for the multifamily

1700
01:43:01,820 --> 01:43:06,080
 development from the two wells shown on the attached site plan, must be filed in the records

1701
01:43:06,080 --> 01:43:09,980
 of Denton County prior to approval of a plat for the subject property and that a note be

1702
01:43:09,980 --> 01:43:14,440
 placed on the plat that reference the agreements and the approved setbacks.

1703
01:43:14,440 --> 01:43:19,040
 And finally, notwithstanding the limited administrative approvals authorized in conditions one and

1704
01:43:19,040 --> 01:43:22,960
 two, the City reserves the right to require approval by ordinance of any amendments to

1705
01:43:22,960 --> 01:43:28,040
 the SUP, the attached site plan, and the elements described on the previous slide, including

1706
01:43:28,040 --> 01:43:30,080
 those referenced in condition one and two.

1707
01:43:30,080 --> 01:43:33,680
 And I'd be happy to walk you all through the plans if there are any questions.

1708
01:43:33,680 --> 01:43:36,920
 Are there any questions for Haley?

1709
01:43:36,920 --> 01:43:41,880
 I do not see any questions for you.

1710
01:43:41,880 --> 01:43:47,160
 At this time, the public hearing was closed last week, but I would like to invite the

1711
01:43:47,160 --> 01:43:53,680
 applicant, Mr. Allison, to come and at least present the rationale or context for bringing

1712
01:43:53,680 --> 01:44:00,280
 this item back and just any information you can provide for clarity.

1713
01:44:00,280 --> 01:44:01,280
 Thank you.

1714
01:44:01,280 --> 01:44:02,280
 Good evening.

1715
01:44:02,280 --> 01:44:04,120
 Lee Allison with Allison Engineering Group.

1716
01:44:04,120 --> 01:44:07,420
 Let's start over.

1717
01:44:07,420 --> 01:44:14,160
 Last time we came before you, and I think I'm going the wrong, okay, you know, here to obtain

1718
01:44:14,160 --> 01:44:21,440
 or seeking a specific use permit to incorporate 336-unit multifamily project into a larger

1719
01:44:21,440 --> 01:44:24,320
 31-acre mixed use development.

1720
01:44:24,320 --> 01:44:28,920
 We're in agreement with the staff's report, and I think I indicated at the last meeting

1721
01:44:28,920 --> 01:44:32,240
 that we could work with the staff's report.

1722
01:44:32,240 --> 01:44:36,200
 We were seeking some more flexibility in the site, depending on who could come along and

1723
01:44:36,200 --> 01:44:38,280
 what could accomplish it.

1724
01:44:38,280 --> 01:44:43,960
 We really didn't understand that we were upzoning in our request.

1725
01:44:43,960 --> 01:44:49,000
 We felt like because we were requesting limits that were lower than what the zoning category

1726
01:44:49,000 --> 01:44:51,960
 required that it was still a downzoning, but apparently not.

1727
01:44:51,960 --> 01:44:57,880
 So we're here and ready to go forward.

1728
01:44:57,880 --> 01:45:04,880
 The development code requires a 250-foot reverse setback for protected uses.

1729
01:45:04,880 --> 01:45:09,200
 I'm not an expert in the health industry in what these setbacks should be, so I'm not

1730
01:45:09,200 --> 01:45:14,800
 here to argue whether it should be 250 or 1,000 or 100 or whatever.

1731
01:45:14,800 --> 01:45:18,720
 That's something that y'all get to work with, and you have a responsibility to be working

1732
01:45:18,720 --> 01:45:19,720
 with it.

1733
01:45:19,720 --> 01:45:25,040
 And if technology and other things change, maybe the code needs to be changed, but that's

1734
01:45:25,040 --> 01:45:26,680
 something that needs to be discussed.

1735
01:45:26,680 --> 01:45:30,000
 But it's from the gas well pad site.

1736
01:45:30,000 --> 01:45:37,640
 Our proposed site plan provides 433-foot setback from pain number one to a habitable structure.

1737
01:45:37,640 --> 01:45:44,080
 A 300-foot setback from pain number two on the south to a habitable structure.

1738
01:45:44,080 --> 01:45:51,520
 Currently, that particular gas well is between 50 and 75 feet from the subdivision to the

1739
01:45:51,520 --> 01:45:52,520
 east of it.

1740
01:45:52,520 --> 01:45:53,520
 That doesn't make it right.

1741
01:45:53,520 --> 01:45:55,680
 It's just what it is.

1742
01:45:55,680 --> 01:45:59,920
 Any future plan by the well operator to reduce those setbacks will require a specific use

1743
01:45:59,920 --> 01:46:00,920
 permit.

1744
01:46:00,920 --> 01:46:02,680
 That's a lie.

1745
01:46:02,680 --> 01:46:04,760
 My fault got into the slide.

1746
01:46:04,760 --> 01:46:06,760
 It doesn't require a specific use permit.

1747
01:46:06,760 --> 01:46:13,000
 It requires a watershed protection permit because of their nearness to the flood plain.

1748
01:46:13,000 --> 01:46:17,140
 That does require P&Z as well as city council consideration.

1749
01:46:17,140 --> 01:46:21,640
 So any changes they want to make in the future will have to come back to planning and zoning.

1750
01:46:21,640 --> 01:46:22,640
 That's a correct statement.

1751
01:46:22,640 --> 01:46:28,820
 But it's not as a specific use permit, and I apologize for that error in our presentation.

1752
01:46:28,820 --> 01:46:32,940
 This is a slide you saw before that shows the pain number one to the north, pain number

1753
01:46:32,940 --> 01:46:38,360
 two to the south, the various setbacks, the distances and what's been agreed to.

1754
01:46:38,360 --> 01:46:47,760
 Well, actually, what I do want to mention is our agreement with the gas well operator

1755
01:46:47,760 --> 01:46:53,840
 is if they come in with an application to move their pad site to within 250 feet of

1756
01:46:53,840 --> 01:46:56,480
 our protected uses, we will not oppose it.

1757
01:46:56,480 --> 01:46:57,480
 It's not a pre-approval.

1758
01:46:57,480 --> 01:47:02,160
 It's anything that just means we're not going to oppose it if that occurs.

1759
01:47:02,160 --> 01:47:07,240
 The south on pain number two, our agreement is we won't put anything in that area.

1760
01:47:07,240 --> 01:47:11,640
 We won't develop it at all, the commercial or the apartments.

1761
01:47:11,640 --> 01:47:13,480
 Hopefully someday they'll abandon that site.

1762
01:47:13,480 --> 01:47:17,080
 That's the ones that's so close to the neighbors, but for now it's still there.

1763
01:47:17,080 --> 01:47:22,440
 They want that area free and clear in case there's ever a need for emergency vehicles.

1764
01:47:22,440 --> 01:47:26,560
 You might be aware that pain number one had a lightning strike a few years ago.

1765
01:47:26,560 --> 01:47:31,480
 Fortunately, I'm sure it was a big scare, but fortunately no one was in real danger,

1766
01:47:31,480 --> 01:47:37,520
 but at the same time there were some issues about fire access and things.

1767
01:47:37,520 --> 01:47:43,480
 I looked up the definition of protected use and on the left-hand side of this slide by

1768
01:47:43,480 --> 01:47:47,620
 definition it itemizes what protected uses are.

1769
01:47:47,620 --> 01:47:55,160
 On the right-hand side of the slide, I listed what I believe are the protected uses under

1770
01:47:55,160 --> 01:47:56,960
 NRMU.

1771
01:47:56,960 --> 01:48:00,600
 Some of those include dwellings and some are businesses, et cetera.

1772
01:48:00,600 --> 01:48:05,400
 The items listed in black do not have to come to planning and zoning commission.

1773
01:48:05,400 --> 01:48:10,160
 As long as we meet the agreed to setbacks with the operator, we can move forward, attach

1774
01:48:10,160 --> 01:48:14,800
 single family, dwelling above businesses, live work units, et cetera.

1775
01:48:14,800 --> 01:48:18,920
 The items listed in red require a specific use permit.

1776
01:48:18,920 --> 01:48:22,920
 Those do have to come before planning and zoning and you do have an opportunity to consider

1777
01:48:22,920 --> 01:48:25,120
 and vote on those.

1778
01:48:25,120 --> 01:48:31,680
 I did put the L4 by multifamily in black, and the reason is if we were to reduce this

1779
01:48:31,680 --> 01:48:37,200
 to 12 acres, which really doesn't work economically on the site at this time, but if we were to

1780
01:48:37,200 --> 01:48:43,800
 reduce it to 12 acres so that the multifamily is only 40% or less of a mixed use development,

1781
01:48:43,800 --> 01:48:47,840
 it doesn't have to come to the planning and zoning commission either.

1782
01:48:47,840 --> 01:48:55,040
 Home occupation, hotels, again under the protected uses or public schools, et cetera, these are

1783
01:48:55,040 --> 01:49:02,920
 on the right again more uses that are allowed by right under the current zoning consideration.

1784
01:49:02,920 --> 01:49:05,200
 I just wanted to present that as a perspective.

1785
01:49:05,200 --> 01:49:11,280
 I know that things got very discombobulated at the last meeting.

1786
01:49:11,280 --> 01:49:16,840
 I think now we're back to being focused on the item as presented with some concerns and

1787
01:49:16,840 --> 01:49:21,080
 considerations regarding gas wells, and I wanted to provide you some of our perspectives,

1788
01:49:21,080 --> 01:49:24,720
 so I go back to my seat and watch y'all deliberate.

1789
01:49:24,720 --> 01:49:27,800
 I'll be glad to respond to any questions if you should have any.

1790
01:49:27,800 --> 01:49:28,800
 We do.

1791
01:49:28,800 --> 01:49:29,800
 Commissioner Smith.

1792
01:49:29,800 --> 01:49:30,800
 Thank you, Chair.

1793
01:49:30,800 --> 01:49:34,600
 Mr. Allison, if you go back to the setbacks that you're talking about, you had mentioned

1794
01:49:34,600 --> 01:49:40,360
 on the one more back to the numbers, the 433 and the 300.

1795
01:49:40,360 --> 01:49:43,680
 You said that the, and it's not the specific use permit.

1796
01:49:43,680 --> 01:49:48,680
 It's the watershed, that watershed protection, some of the things they have to apply to.

1797
01:49:48,680 --> 01:49:51,760
 They would have to apply that if they want to reduce the setbacks from 250 downwards,

1798
01:49:51,760 --> 01:49:55,760
 not from 433 or 300, but from 200, 250 downward, correct?

1799
01:49:55,760 --> 01:49:56,760
 Or is that a question for staff?

1800
01:49:56,760 --> 01:50:00,680
 I believe the current setback for a gas well would be 500 feet.

1801
01:50:00,680 --> 01:50:02,280
 I think staff has something to say, too.

1802
01:50:02,280 --> 01:50:05,800
 And I think it's really a staff determination as far as the setback itself.

1803
01:50:05,800 --> 01:50:09,960
 I guess the question I have is that if you say, "Well, right now our proposed site plan

1804
01:50:09,960 --> 01:50:17,400
 is 433 and 300," is it, they have to go and make that request to the watershed change

1805
01:50:17,400 --> 01:50:22,320
 at 433 or 300, or is it only the change of the 250?

1806
01:50:22,320 --> 01:50:28,720
 My understanding is they're going to ask for the setbacks to be where these red lines are.

1807
01:50:28,720 --> 01:50:35,880
 And you can see on here the blue, that's where they're, the green is where their future set

1808
01:50:35,880 --> 01:50:39,520
 pad site that they're wanting to put it and they're talking about.

1809
01:50:39,520 --> 01:50:42,120
 And that would be a 250-foot setback there.

1810
01:50:42,120 --> 01:50:46,360
 I guess I'm asking if they're, you're saying that if they wanted to reduce it, if they

1811
01:50:46,360 --> 01:50:50,800
 wanted to do something to make that setback reduced, you're talking about the reduction

1812
01:50:50,800 --> 01:50:56,600
 would be from, they have the right to come in and go all the way up to 250 feet away,

1813
01:50:56,600 --> 01:51:02,920
 or if the site plan is 433 and 300, if they want to go any closer than 433 or 300 closer,

1814
01:51:02,920 --> 01:51:03,920
 they have to file a change.

1815
01:51:03,920 --> 01:51:04,920
 There's a special process.

1816
01:51:04,920 --> 01:51:05,920
 I need to.

1817
01:51:05,920 --> 01:51:06,920
 Okay.

1818
01:51:06,920 --> 01:51:07,920
 We'll let Haley.

1819
01:51:07,920 --> 01:51:08,920
 Sure.

1820
01:51:08,920 --> 01:51:12,800
 So the gas well setback is different from the reverse setback.

1821
01:51:12,800 --> 01:51:17,800
 So the operator is, I get vested for lack of a better word, in their existing site.

1822
01:51:17,800 --> 01:51:21,340
 If they leave it as is, they need not go through any changes.

1823
01:51:21,340 --> 01:51:26,800
 If they seek to modify the site and enlarge the site, do anything to it, it's substantial.

1824
01:51:26,800 --> 01:51:29,480
 They have a 500-foot setback that's imposed upon them.

1825
01:51:29,480 --> 01:51:30,480
 Got it.

1826
01:51:30,480 --> 01:51:34,320
 So right now, as it stands, they couldn't do anything to, because they're already in

1827
01:51:34,320 --> 01:51:35,320
 a 500-foot setback.

1828
01:51:35,320 --> 01:51:36,320
 Correct.

1829
01:51:36,320 --> 01:51:40,480
 They're already not meeting that setback, so they would have a very onerous process

1830
01:51:40,480 --> 01:51:44,920
 that would start by having to get waivers from either all property owners within the

1831
01:51:44,920 --> 01:51:49,040
 500-foot buffer saying that they're okay with it being reduced as low as 250.

1832
01:51:49,040 --> 01:51:51,480
 It can never go below 250.

1833
01:51:51,480 --> 01:51:55,120
 They could ask the Board of Adjustment for that permission as well, and then staff could

1834
01:51:55,120 --> 01:51:59,840
 get them to a happy medium of 375, but that wouldn't help them out as well.

1835
01:51:59,840 --> 01:52:02,600
 So they would either be going through one of those first two processes.

1836
01:52:02,600 --> 01:52:06,320
 If they get that, they would then require the watershed protection permit, which, Lee,

1837
01:52:06,320 --> 01:52:11,120
 you were correct, actually does require an SUP as part of that process.

1838
01:52:11,120 --> 01:52:14,840
 So it would be a multifaceted process for them to ever get a reduction, but it would

1839
01:52:14,840 --> 01:52:15,840
 be from the 500.

1840
01:52:15,840 --> 01:52:21,080
 I guess what I was trying to say is that from the way the site plan is built at 433 on one

1841
01:52:21,080 --> 01:52:27,080
 site and 300 on another site, that in reality, the development isn't going to go any closer

1842
01:52:27,080 --> 01:52:33,920
 to the gas well up to the 250, and the gas well operator, they have a very cumbersome

1843
01:52:33,920 --> 01:52:37,600
 process ahead of them if they try to move anywhere, basically.

1844
01:52:37,600 --> 01:52:41,960
 Correct, and there's no means of them getting a setback approved for anything less than

1845
01:52:41,960 --> 01:52:42,960
 250 feet.

1846
01:52:42,960 --> 01:52:43,960
 That's the absolute minimum.

1847
01:52:43,960 --> 01:52:44,960
 Okay.

1848
01:52:44,960 --> 01:52:45,960
 Thank you.

1849
01:52:45,960 --> 01:52:46,960
 That's all I wanted to know.

1850
01:52:46,960 --> 01:52:47,960
 Commissioner Pernitta.

1851
01:52:47,960 --> 01:52:50,960
 Actually, if you have a question for me, just to kind of piggyback on what we're talking

1852
01:52:50,960 --> 01:52:51,960
 about.

1853
01:52:51,960 --> 01:52:58,680
 So right now, those gas wells are not being used at all, right?

1854
01:52:58,680 --> 01:52:59,680
 No, they're both in use.

1855
01:52:59,680 --> 01:53:00,680
 They are both in use?

1856
01:53:00,680 --> 01:53:01,680
 Correct.

1857
01:53:01,680 --> 01:53:07,400
 So when we talked last week about, or a couple of weeks ago about, you know, the watershed

1858
01:53:07,400 --> 01:53:14,360
 and everything, that was only if they were to expand the path from 433 to the 250?

1859
01:53:14,360 --> 01:53:17,560
 No, that requirement would come into play for the northern site.

1860
01:53:17,560 --> 01:53:20,240
 The southern site is not within the floodplain.

1861
01:53:20,240 --> 01:53:22,600
 The northern site is within the floodplain already.

1862
01:53:22,600 --> 01:53:27,240
 So any modifications to the site boundaries, or if they needed additional wells on that

1863
01:53:27,240 --> 01:53:31,880
 site, would require that watershed protection permit process.

1864
01:53:31,880 --> 01:53:32,880
 Okay.

1865
01:53:32,880 --> 01:53:38,000
 But right now, the wells are in use and what we are voting on would be, and I guess out

1866
01:53:38,000 --> 01:53:44,080
 of my misunderstanding, last time I thought the wells were not in use, but they are in

1867
01:53:44,080 --> 01:53:45,080
 use and we're looking at 433 and 300.

1868
01:53:45,080 --> 01:53:46,080
 Correct.

1869
01:53:46,080 --> 01:53:47,080
 Both pad sites are considered active.

1870
01:53:47,080 --> 01:53:51,000
 I don't think the production is all that high on either site, but they both are active

1871
01:53:51,000 --> 01:53:52,000
 wells.

1872
01:53:52,000 --> 01:53:53,000
 All right.

1873
01:53:53,000 --> 01:53:54,000
 Thank you.

1874
01:53:54,000 --> 01:53:55,000
 I did not see any other questions.

1875
01:53:55,000 --> 01:53:56,000
 Thank you, Mr. Ellison.

1876
01:53:56,000 --> 01:53:59,640
 All righty.

1877
01:53:59,640 --> 01:54:00,640
 Thank you.

1878
01:54:00,640 --> 01:54:04,680
 Sorry about getting wrong on the SUP too.

1879
01:54:04,680 --> 01:54:08,360
 So because the public hearing is closed, there won't be opportunities to speak.

1880
01:54:08,360 --> 01:54:14,840
 However, I wanted to read in the record the opposition of Ed Soft at 1620 Victoria Drive

1881
01:54:14,840 --> 01:54:17,360
 in Texas.

1882
01:54:17,360 --> 01:54:27,080
 With the public hearing closed, the dais is open for discussion or motion.

1883
01:54:27,080 --> 01:54:28,080
 Commissioner Smith.

1884
01:54:28,080 --> 01:54:36,160
 I'd like to make a motion for approval with staff's recommendations and conditions.

1885
01:54:36,160 --> 01:54:40,560
 And just to add on to that, I think that, yes, while it is close to the gas wells, and

1886
01:54:40,560 --> 01:54:48,040
 I understand the health concerns and the science for and against the health concerns there,

1887
01:54:48,040 --> 01:54:50,840
 I think the project makes sense where it is.

1888
01:54:50,840 --> 01:54:55,960
 I think that there's already other residential near that gas well as is, not that that makes

1889
01:54:55,960 --> 01:55:04,200
 it right, but with the developer as well as the engineer working hard to even go above

1890
01:55:04,200 --> 01:55:09,640
 and beyond the 250, I think this site could work.

1891
01:55:09,640 --> 01:55:13,080
 And there is no promise that the gas will work for forever.

1892
01:55:13,080 --> 01:55:16,960
 And so I do want to make a motion in support.

1893
01:55:16,960 --> 01:55:17,960
 Commissioner Sanchez.

1894
01:55:17,960 --> 01:55:20,320
 I'd like to second that motion.

1895
01:55:20,320 --> 01:55:21,320
 Thank you.

1896
01:55:21,320 --> 01:55:22,880
 Commissioner Beck.

1897
01:55:22,880 --> 01:55:23,880
 Thank you, Chair.

1898
01:55:23,880 --> 01:55:28,200
 I just want to, and I'm going to read from a note too, if that's okay.

1899
01:55:28,200 --> 01:55:33,480
 I just want to reiterate what I stated at the last PNZ meeting on this agenda item.

1900
01:55:33,480 --> 01:55:38,440
 The current science is showing us that the 250-foot setbacks, the minimums they can have

1901
01:55:38,440 --> 01:55:44,680
 for these active gas wills may well be inadequate, especially for small children, the elderly,

1902
01:55:44,680 --> 01:55:46,160
 and pregnant women.

1903
01:55:46,160 --> 01:55:50,520
 I appreciate what the developer and the gas will operator have tried to achieve here at

1904
01:55:50,520 --> 01:55:55,240
 keeping these minimum setback distances from the gas wells and the residential development

1905
01:55:55,240 --> 01:55:56,240
 they are promoting.

1906
01:55:56,240 --> 01:56:00,160
 And I have no doubt that they too share my concern for the health and safety of those

1907
01:56:00,160 --> 01:56:03,880
 vulnerable populations that can live near these gas wells.

1908
01:56:03,880 --> 01:56:08,600
 But they have been given distances by state and federal agencies that too often seem to

1909
01:56:08,600 --> 01:56:15,240
 favor profits over people, putting human life at risk based on industry standards that seldom

1910
01:56:15,240 --> 01:56:18,720
 reflect the independent science that disputes their claims.

1911
01:56:18,720 --> 01:56:24,120
 According to one research paper, the majority of setback distances in the area we study,

1912
01:56:24,120 --> 01:56:29,120
 which Barnett Shell is a part of, are not derived from peer-reviewed data, data-driven

1913
01:56:29,120 --> 01:56:31,720
 analysis, or historical events.

1914
01:56:31,720 --> 01:56:36,400
 They are a compromise between governments, the regulated community, environmental and

1915
01:56:36,400 --> 01:56:39,640
 citizen interest groups, and landowners.

1916
01:56:39,640 --> 01:56:46,280
 The chances of any devastating explosion or massive emission of toxic elements might be

1917
01:56:46,280 --> 01:56:52,640
 small, but reports have shown that some explosion radii can be as much as 0.8 miles.

1918
01:56:52,640 --> 01:56:58,400
 However, there will always be those small leaks of volatile organic compounds and particulate

1919
01:56:58,400 --> 01:57:04,640
 matter that fall within the allowable limits that the TCEQ and EPA advocate.

1920
01:57:04,640 --> 01:57:10,320
 Yet people who live in close proximity to these wells and who have physiological sensitivities

1921
01:57:10,320 --> 01:57:16,520
 like asthma and other respiratory illnesses could well suffer these lesser effects, impacting

1922
01:57:16,520 --> 01:57:21,520
 not only their health, but their health care costs with more than normal visits to the

1923
01:57:21,520 --> 01:57:25,600
 doctor or ER than those less susceptible.

1924
01:57:25,600 --> 01:57:31,040
 There's a history of catastrophic events that result from chemicals in the human area.

1925
01:57:31,040 --> 01:57:38,280
 Bhopal India comes to mind, the Gulf BP oil well disaster, the Texas City refinery explosion

1926
01:57:38,280 --> 01:57:44,360
 in 2005, and in 2013, we all remember the West Texas fertilizer explosion, and these

1927
01:57:44,360 --> 01:57:47,760
 are just the tip of the icebergs of these kind of events.

1928
01:57:47,760 --> 01:57:52,040
 Yes, these are dramatic events, but they do illustrate the serious threat that hazardous

1929
01:57:52,040 --> 01:57:57,520
 chemicals can pose when neglect and short-sightedness are part of the equation.

1930
01:57:57,520 --> 01:58:02,160
 These tracks of lands with gas and oil wells on them can eventually be fully developed

1931
01:58:02,160 --> 01:58:06,960
 once they are depleted and certifiably capped.

1932
01:58:06,960 --> 01:58:10,720
 But even before then, they can be commercially developed with the existing setback limits

1933
01:58:10,720 --> 01:58:16,680
 because the human patronage to these commercial sites will not routinely and necessarily reside

1934
01:58:16,680 --> 01:58:21,640
 there over any duration that could pose a threat from these gas and oil wells like it

1935
01:58:21,640 --> 01:58:27,260
 will the permanent residents who live at those locations, and with that in mind, I will oppose

1936
01:58:27,260 --> 01:58:28,260
 this agenda item.

1937
01:58:28,260 --> 01:58:29,260
 Thank you.

1938
01:58:29,260 --> 01:58:30,880
 Thank you, Mr. Rebeck, for those words.

1939
01:58:30,880 --> 01:58:31,880
 Commissioner Pernetta?

1940
01:58:31,880 --> 01:58:38,520
 Yeah, I just wanted to first start off with a clarifying question because I know, as Commissioner

1941
01:58:38,520 --> 01:58:42,480
 Rebeck mentioned just a second ago, there are concerns about proximity to the wells

1942
01:58:42,480 --> 01:58:44,960
 and how they may affect health.

1943
01:58:44,960 --> 01:58:49,600
 I don't know what the vote would be right now, but if it was a vote to deny, it would

1944
01:58:49,600 --> 01:58:54,480
 still go before city council and require a supermajority, right?

1945
01:58:54,480 --> 01:58:58,680
 And that's one of the things that I want to have put out on the record.

1946
01:58:58,680 --> 01:59:05,360
 While certainly we always encourage development in Denton, and as someone who pushes for affordable

1947
01:59:05,360 --> 01:59:11,960
 housing, the addition of units is kind of a big deal to me.

1948
01:59:11,960 --> 01:59:16,960
 Knowing that this vote or how I vote, how Commissioner Beck votes, et cetera, may not

1949
01:59:16,960 --> 01:59:21,440
 make a decision on what happens with this property, I think it is important if we're

1950
01:59:21,440 --> 01:59:26,520
 going to have developments that are close to wells to have them go before the city council

1951
01:59:26,520 --> 01:59:32,680
 and have these things be discussed in a more open area where people can come out and discuss

1952
01:59:32,680 --> 01:59:33,680
 these.

1953
01:59:33,680 --> 01:59:38,800
 You know, similarly to Commissioner Beck, I'll be voting against this.

1954
01:59:38,800 --> 01:59:42,480
 When I say that, though, I want to make sure that everyone who's paying attention to the

1955
01:59:42,480 --> 01:59:47,040
 proceedings understands that this isn't killing this project going forward.

1956
01:59:47,040 --> 01:59:51,840
 What I hope to do is open a discussion about, you know, how this thing impacts people and,

1957
01:59:51,840 --> 01:59:57,520
 like I said, push this on to a larger forum where more citizens can come out and discuss

1958
01:59:57,520 --> 01:59:58,520
 things.

1959
01:59:58,520 --> 02:00:02,120
 Because I know city council is also looking at reverse setbacks and, you know, long-term,

1960
02:00:02,120 --> 02:00:08,120
 you know, whether or not the current minimums, you know, satisfy the public good.

1961
02:00:08,120 --> 02:00:09,120
 That's all I have to say.

1962
02:00:09,120 --> 02:00:10,120
 Thank you.

1963
02:00:10,120 --> 02:00:14,720
 Commissioner Pernetta, I have a couple things to say.

1964
02:00:14,720 --> 02:00:18,960
 I'm going to be supporting this project, and I think the research Commissioner Beck's done

1965
02:00:18,960 --> 02:00:21,240
 is valuable.

1966
02:00:21,240 --> 02:00:23,760
 It seems valid and worth it.

1967
02:00:23,760 --> 02:00:29,160
 I think this project is not the correct venue to make those debates.

1968
02:00:29,160 --> 02:00:35,320
 I think it's a council decision, and if the governing body of our city deems that those

1969
02:00:35,320 --> 02:00:39,880
 need to be addressed, then that needs to be taken to the council in full force of all

1970
02:00:39,880 --> 02:00:40,880
 its supporters.

1971
02:00:40,880 --> 02:00:50,040
 But I think if the council has agreed upon and set these setbacks, it provides developers

1972
02:00:50,040 --> 02:00:56,120
 some confusion and ambiguity that the commission of planning and zoning might be setting arbitrary

1973
02:00:56,120 --> 02:01:00,120
 conditions that are not codified and they're not from the council.

1974
02:01:00,120 --> 02:01:05,600
 And so now by stipulating that we have some commissioners stating that we're going to

1975
02:01:05,600 --> 02:01:12,080
 change the codified rules of our city, I think that that doesn't promote a lot of unambiguity

1976
02:01:12,080 --> 02:01:14,760
 and clarity to the process to be approved.

1977
02:01:14,760 --> 02:01:19,120
 And so I'm not necessarily against increasing setbacks or looking into that to see what

1978
02:01:19,120 --> 02:01:24,280
 the correct solution should be, but I'm not, I do not believe that the developer should

1979
02:01:24,280 --> 02:01:28,200
 be held accountable for something that's not codified by the city.

1980
02:01:28,200 --> 02:01:30,600
 That is the prevailing rule of the land right now.

1981
02:01:30,600 --> 02:01:33,400
 And they're meeting all those things more than the minimums.

1982
02:01:33,400 --> 02:01:37,360
 And so for that, I support that it looks like a couple more discussion items.

1983
02:01:37,360 --> 02:01:39,020
 Commissioner Ellis.

1984
02:01:39,020 --> 02:01:40,020
 Thank you, chair.

1985
02:01:40,020 --> 02:01:41,020
 Yeah, just a couple of words.

1986
02:01:41,020 --> 02:01:46,880
 I absolutely appreciate the concerns raised by Commissioner Beck.

1987
02:01:46,880 --> 02:01:52,160
 But in front of us right now is an SUP and it more than complies with our current gas

1988
02:01:52,160 --> 02:01:55,640
 well ordinances.

1989
02:01:55,640 --> 02:01:58,360
 It's possible that our code needs to be looked at.

1990
02:01:58,360 --> 02:01:59,880
 It does need to be looked at.

1991
02:01:59,880 --> 02:02:02,800
 But it's not this applicant's responsibility, in my opinion.

1992
02:02:02,800 --> 02:02:06,000
 Its responsibility is to fall within the parameters of our code right now.

1993
02:02:06,000 --> 02:02:07,840
 And it does that.

1994
02:02:07,840 --> 02:02:13,600
 And it's not that I am unsympathetic to the concerns in the new studies coming before us.

1995
02:02:13,600 --> 02:02:17,440
 But that's not what is before us right now, in my opinion.

1996
02:02:17,440 --> 02:02:18,440
 And I will be supporting.

1997
02:02:18,440 --> 02:02:19,440
 Thank you, Mr. Ellis.

1998
02:02:19,440 --> 02:02:20,440
 Commissioner Beck.

1999
02:02:20,440 --> 02:02:21,440
 Thank you, chair.

2000
02:02:21,440 --> 02:02:22,440
 And I appreciate both of your points of view.

2001
02:02:22,440 --> 02:02:23,440
 And I don't disagree with it at all.

2002
02:02:23,440 --> 02:02:33,960
 It likely is going to go forward and I realize that when I made my presentation, but if anything,

2003
02:02:33,960 --> 02:02:37,320
 I hope it does start a conversation on moving in the right direction.

2004
02:02:37,320 --> 02:02:41,520
 So it may be nothing more than a protest vote, it is for sure.

2005
02:02:41,520 --> 02:02:43,520
 But there is a discussion that needs to be had.

2006
02:02:43,520 --> 02:02:47,360
 And if this sets the wheels in motion on that, then I'll be set aside with that.

2007
02:02:47,360 --> 02:02:50,800
 But I respect everybody's decision here to do what they feel like they got to do.

2008
02:02:50,800 --> 02:02:51,800
 Thank you, Mr. Beck.

2009
02:02:51,800 --> 02:02:57,200
 We have a first and a second for approval with conditions based on staffs recommendations.

2010
02:02:57,200 --> 02:03:12,300
 Seeing no other discussion, I'll call for a vote on the board.

2011
02:03:12,300 --> 02:03:17,520
 Motion carries 4-3.

2012
02:03:17,520 --> 02:03:25,520
 Next item on the agenda is item C, S18-0002B.

2013
02:03:25,520 --> 02:03:29,840
 This item was continued from our October 24th meeting.

2014
02:03:29,840 --> 02:03:31,360
 So we will continue the public hearing.

2015
02:03:31,360 --> 02:03:34,200
 We will not be opening it since it's already open.

2016
02:03:34,200 --> 02:03:50,920
 I'll invite Cindy Jackson for presentation.

2017
02:03:50,920 --> 02:03:55,080
 Thank you, Chair, commissioners.

2018
02:03:55,080 --> 02:04:02,760
 S18-0002, as you recall, is a request for approval of a specific use permit to allow

2019
02:04:02,760 --> 02:04:08,880
 quick vehicle servicing in suites 110 and 111 of budget self-storage.

2020
02:04:08,880 --> 02:04:14,360
 Just to refresh your memory, the site is located at 2820 Virginia Circle.

2021
02:04:14,360 --> 02:04:21,280
 You can see right here, and it's very close to University, which runs parallel to Virginia.

2022
02:04:21,280 --> 02:04:27,520
 This item was continued from the October 28th, 2018 meeting to allow the tenants the opportunity

2023
02:04:27,520 --> 02:04:34,940
 to address the parking issues that were noted during that meeting with regards to parking

2024
02:04:34,940 --> 02:04:42,000
 on the lot next door, as well as excess parking in front of the building.

2025
02:04:42,000 --> 02:04:45,160
 The public hearing at that time was not closed.

2026
02:04:45,160 --> 02:04:49,440
 The vehicles have been removed from the lot adjacent to the site.

2027
02:04:49,440 --> 02:04:55,240
 Mr. Melton has vacated suite 111, and Mr. Haney has now leased the unit.

2028
02:04:55,240 --> 02:05:02,140
 So Mr. Haney now is a tenant of both 110 and 111.

2029
02:05:02,140 --> 02:05:07,520
 For some comparison purposes, here are the photos that were taken February 19th, and

2030
02:05:07,520 --> 02:05:16,080
 you can see that the cars were stacked up very close to each other in front of the building.

2031
02:05:16,080 --> 02:05:21,280
 Here's a view of the lot next door, and you can see that there's cars everywhere on that,

2032
02:05:21,280 --> 02:05:27,400
 and then just some views, different views of the two suites.

2033
02:05:27,400 --> 02:05:32,160
 Photos were taken again on November 11th, a couple of weeks ago, and you can see there's

2034
02:05:32,160 --> 02:05:37,640
 a few cars still on the lot next door, and here's another view of the cars on the lot

2035
02:05:37,640 --> 02:05:39,280
 next door.

2036
02:05:39,280 --> 02:05:45,680
 You can see there's far fewer cars along the road parking in front of the building, and

2037
02:05:45,680 --> 02:05:48,400
 that view is replicated right here.

2038
02:05:48,400 --> 02:05:51,720
 Now these next photos were taken this morning.

2039
02:05:51,720 --> 02:05:54,440
 You can see there's no cars on the lot.

2040
02:05:54,440 --> 02:06:03,840
 You can see that the parking is not jammed in there like it was in February, and that

2041
02:06:03,840 --> 02:06:08,000
 there is parking available for people to visit the other businesses.

2042
02:06:08,000 --> 02:06:16,040
 Since this is a public hearing, we did send out notices to within 200 and 500 feet of

2043
02:06:16,040 --> 02:06:17,040
 the site.

2044
02:06:17,040 --> 02:06:19,440
 We received no responses.

2045
02:06:19,440 --> 02:06:23,440
 One sign was posted on the site.

2046
02:06:23,440 --> 02:06:26,240
 Staff does recommend denial of this request.

2047
02:06:26,240 --> 02:06:29,920
 Should the Planning and Zoning Commission decide to approve this request, staff recommends

2048
02:06:29,920 --> 02:06:33,760
 the following conditions for Suite 110 and 111.

2049
02:06:33,760 --> 02:06:38,520
 A new certificate of occupancy for the correct use of quick vehicle servicing must be applied

2050
02:06:38,520 --> 02:06:40,120
 for and approved.

2051
02:06:40,120 --> 02:06:45,200
 The new certificate of occupancy shall state that the proposed use of quick vehicle service

2052
02:06:45,200 --> 02:06:50,680
 is limited to this particular business owner and these two particular suites to prevent

2053
02:06:50,680 --> 02:06:53,320
 them being grandfathered in.

2054
02:06:53,320 --> 02:06:57,760
 This specific use permit will be limited to the use description and floor plan shown in

2055
02:06:57,760 --> 02:07:00,880
 Exhibit 8 and Exhibit 9.

2056
02:07:00,880 --> 02:07:05,800
 Overnight outdoor storage of automobiles is prohibited, and no more than two customer

2057
02:07:05,800 --> 02:07:10,600
 vehicles per each business can be parked in the parking spaces in front of the building

2058
02:07:10,600 --> 02:07:12,040
 during business hours.

2059
02:07:12,040 --> 02:07:13,040
 And that concludes my presentation.

2060
02:07:13,040 --> 02:07:15,840
 We have a couple of questions, or at least one.

2061
02:07:15,840 --> 02:07:17,800
 Commissioner Pernetta?

2062
02:07:17,800 --> 02:07:21,840
 So I just kind of want to circle back on a few things because I know when we were here

2063
02:07:21,840 --> 02:07:28,960
 a few weeks ago, the major concerns were parking in the vacant lot and parking in the front.

2064
02:07:28,960 --> 02:07:32,920
 And the majority of things that we brought up, you know, to the applicant and everything,

2065
02:07:32,920 --> 02:07:35,480
 seem to have been resolved on those fronts.

2066
02:07:35,480 --> 02:07:36,480
 Is that correct?

2067
02:07:36,480 --> 02:07:37,480
 That's correct.

2068
02:07:37,480 --> 02:07:43,920
 And as we discussed in the work session, the reason for the denial is based on the Certificate

2069
02:07:43,920 --> 02:07:48,480
 of Occupancy, which we don't have and they can't get because of the current zoning.

2070
02:07:48,480 --> 02:07:52,840
 But if we were to get the current, you know, award the current zoning, the Certificate

2071
02:07:52,840 --> 02:07:56,380
 of Occupancy would most likely be approved.

2072
02:07:56,380 --> 02:07:57,380
 So it's kind of a…

2073
02:07:57,380 --> 02:07:58,380
 Right.

2074
02:07:58,380 --> 02:08:04,120
 If this SUP is approved, then the applicant would have no problem getting a Certificate

2075
02:08:04,120 --> 02:08:05,120
 of Occupancy.

2076
02:08:05,120 --> 02:08:06,120
 Okay.

2077
02:08:06,120 --> 02:08:13,680
 So I guess my next question is, if much of the denial is based on the lack of the Certificate

2078
02:08:13,680 --> 02:08:19,080
 of Occupancy, are there any concerns that we have right now outside of that, once we

2079
02:08:19,080 --> 02:08:26,760
 remove that, that would precipitate, you know, a suggestion or a recommendation of denial?

2080
02:08:26,760 --> 02:08:34,400
 Well, as I spoke earlier in the work session, staff did not feel that they could reverse

2081
02:08:34,400 --> 02:08:43,340
 the original denial because the situation is still as it was where we just don't feel

2082
02:08:43,340 --> 02:08:48,280
 this is really an appropriate site for quick vehicle servicing.

2083
02:08:48,280 --> 02:08:54,120
 However, with the conditions that we've got here and what the applicant has agreed

2084
02:08:54,120 --> 02:09:00,160
 to and has done, we feel the situation has improved and that's why we're doing what

2085
02:09:00,160 --> 02:09:01,880
 we call a soft denial.

2086
02:09:01,880 --> 02:09:02,880
 Okay.

2087
02:09:02,880 --> 02:09:10,600
 So if we were to vote to approve this, currently there are no adjacent properties that are

2088
02:09:10,600 --> 02:09:12,600
 objecting or anything like that?

2089
02:09:12,600 --> 02:09:13,600
 We receive no responses.

2090
02:09:13,600 --> 02:09:14,600
 Okay.

2091
02:09:14,600 --> 02:09:15,600
 Thank you very much.

2092
02:09:15,600 --> 02:09:16,600
 To Mr. Sanchez.

2093
02:09:16,600 --> 02:09:17,600
 When you say the original denial, when was that original denial?

2094
02:09:17,600 --> 02:09:18,600
 2010.

2095
02:09:18,600 --> 02:09:19,600
 Right.

2096
02:09:19,600 --> 02:09:20,600
 That's what I was getting at.

2097
02:09:20,600 --> 02:09:21,600
 Exactly.

2098
02:09:21,600 --> 02:09:34,320
 Several years have been passed and then he had got a certificate for something else.

2099
02:09:34,320 --> 02:09:37,320
 Can you turn your mic on, Commissioner?

2100
02:09:37,320 --> 02:09:38,320
 Okay.

2101
02:09:38,320 --> 02:09:41,680
 So it was, it's been about eight years since it was denied?

2102
02:09:41,680 --> 02:09:42,680
 Yes, it has.

2103
02:09:42,680 --> 02:09:43,680
 It has.

2104
02:09:43,680 --> 02:09:44,680
 Okay.

2105
02:09:44,680 --> 02:09:48,720
 If you'll recall, Mr. Melton applied for a certificate of occupancy for automotive repair,

2106
02:09:48,720 --> 02:09:49,720
 which was denied.

2107
02:09:49,720 --> 02:09:50,720
 Right.

2108
02:09:50,720 --> 02:09:57,240
 And he changed his application, as you can see in your backup, to office as the use and

2109
02:09:57,240 --> 02:10:07,720
 his certificate of occupancy even said office only, but he just went in there and did automotive

2110
02:10:07,720 --> 02:10:08,720
 repair.

2111
02:10:08,720 --> 02:10:09,720
 Okay.

2112
02:10:09,720 --> 02:10:12,320
 I do not see any other questions for you.

2113
02:10:12,320 --> 02:10:14,440
 Thank you for your presentation.

2114
02:10:14,440 --> 02:10:17,840
 This is a public hearing, so anyone wishing to speak may certainly do so.

2115
02:10:17,840 --> 02:10:21,640
 I do have a couple of cards, I think.

2116
02:10:21,640 --> 02:10:23,400
 The first one is Chris Haney.

2117
02:10:23,400 --> 02:10:25,200
 Are you wanting to speak this evening?

2118
02:10:25,200 --> 02:10:30,440
 If you could just state your name and address for the record.

2119
02:10:30,440 --> 02:10:37,360
 Chris Haney, 17787 West FM 922, Forestburg, Texas.

2120
02:10:37,360 --> 02:10:40,120
 I'm the owner of Haney's Grudge.

2121
02:10:40,120 --> 02:10:42,920
 As she said, that was Mr. Melton.

2122
02:10:42,920 --> 02:10:47,760
 We had this conversation at 1.30 in the morning the last time I was here.

2123
02:10:47,760 --> 02:10:56,160
 That was Melton, Mr. Melton, that was denied and changed, like she said earlier and like

2124
02:10:56,160 --> 02:10:57,840
 you saw earlier.

2125
02:10:57,840 --> 02:10:58,840
 He's gone.

2126
02:10:58,840 --> 02:11:02,540
 I've rented that unit for the sole purpose.

2127
02:11:02,540 --> 02:11:07,480
 Not knowing what was going to happen with this, I actually bought his tools and stuff

2128
02:11:07,480 --> 02:11:11,160
 that he had in there, so I went ahead and rented the unit until I see where this goes,

2129
02:11:11,160 --> 02:11:16,720
 where it pans out, because everything in that unit is mine now.

2130
02:11:16,720 --> 02:11:18,560
 The parking was an issue.

2131
02:11:18,560 --> 02:11:21,200
 You can see from the pictures, none of those vehicles.

2132
02:11:21,200 --> 02:11:35,320
 Mr. Melton moved out on November the 21st, which was the day before Thanksgiving.

2133
02:11:35,320 --> 02:11:36,320
 Was his last day.

2134
02:11:36,320 --> 02:11:37,320
 He was out.

2135
02:11:37,320 --> 02:11:40,280
 I wasn't able to rent the unit until the day after Thanksgiving, because the office was

2136
02:11:40,280 --> 02:11:41,280
 closed on Thanksgiving.

2137
02:11:41,280 --> 02:11:45,740
 We were all closed on Thanksgiving, so I actually took over the unit on November the 23rd.

2138
02:11:45,740 --> 02:11:50,280
 From that day forward, there's no vehicles on the side lot.

2139
02:11:50,280 --> 02:11:54,520
 Only customer vehicles that pull up, drop off, and hand me the keys are out front.

2140
02:11:54,520 --> 02:11:59,040
 With both units now, there's room for up to 10 vehicles, if I have to cram everything

2141
02:11:59,040 --> 02:12:00,780
 in at night.

2142
02:12:00,780 --> 02:12:04,840
 Working space is eight vehicles inside the building.

2143
02:12:04,840 --> 02:12:07,400
 Right now, I have space for two cars inside.

2144
02:12:07,400 --> 02:12:11,840
 Everything's in at night, like it's supposed to, and there's space for two more cars.

2145
02:12:11,840 --> 02:12:15,160
 Everything's in and out, in and out.

2146
02:12:15,160 --> 02:12:22,600
 Like I said, the denial was from 2010 for him, and I've done nothing but everything

2147
02:12:22,600 --> 02:12:24,600
 you all have asked me to do.

2148
02:12:24,600 --> 02:12:26,120
 I appreciate you being here.

2149
02:12:26,120 --> 02:12:27,360
 We have a couple questions for you.

2150
02:12:27,360 --> 02:12:28,360
 Yes.

2151
02:12:28,360 --> 02:12:29,360
 Commissioner Smith.

2152
02:12:29,360 --> 02:12:30,360
 Thank you.

2153
02:12:30,360 --> 02:12:31,360
 Mr. Haney?

2154
02:12:31,360 --> 02:12:32,360
 Yes, sir.

2155
02:12:32,360 --> 02:12:33,360
 Glad you're back.

2156
02:12:33,360 --> 02:12:34,360
 Glad you made all the changes and everything else.

2157
02:12:34,360 --> 02:12:35,360
 Happy to have you back.

2158
02:12:35,360 --> 02:12:36,360
 Thank you.

2159
02:12:36,360 --> 02:12:40,400
 I'll just let you know now, before we get to the motion, I'll support you to get your

2160
02:12:40,400 --> 02:12:41,400
 working space up and going.

2161
02:12:41,400 --> 02:12:44,520
 Don't want to hold back a small business, even though it is in a self-storage area and

2162
02:12:44,520 --> 02:12:45,520
 everything else.

2163
02:12:45,520 --> 02:12:49,720
 I know it's kind of a weird area, but the only question I have for you, as I think Commissioner

2164
02:12:49,720 --> 02:12:55,520
 Parnetta was trying to get to, is that there was no ... His question lined to Ms. Jackson

2165
02:12:55,520 --> 02:12:59,720
 was there was no reason why the certificate of occupancy could be denied for things like

2166
02:12:59,720 --> 02:13:00,720
 safety.

2167
02:13:00,720 --> 02:13:06,840
 I'm assuming then that with your knowledge of what a quick service repair shop, safety-wise,

2168
02:13:06,840 --> 02:13:09,960
 would need, you would have no safety issues.

2169
02:13:09,960 --> 02:13:14,680
 There's nothing with fumes or hazardous materials or power tools or anything like that that

2170
02:13:14,680 --> 02:13:16,120
 would be a safety issue.

2171
02:13:16,120 --> 02:13:19,400
 I think that's the biggest thing, is that being in a non-traditional ... There's not

2172
02:13:19,400 --> 02:13:24,400
 a whole lot of quick service vehicle repair places that are inside of storage utilities.

2173
02:13:24,400 --> 02:13:29,640
 It's not necessarily a storage ... The building that I'm in is an actual warehouse building

2174
02:13:29,640 --> 02:13:34,280
 with concrete walls, and then all the buildings behind it are metal storage buildings.

2175
02:13:34,280 --> 02:13:35,280
 Correct.

2176
02:13:35,280 --> 02:13:39,080
 The building that I'm in is in the concrete warehouse building in the front.

2177
02:13:39,080 --> 02:13:41,160
 Yeah, I guess I misspoke.

2178
02:13:41,160 --> 02:13:44,800
 It's still not a ... It's not like a standalone place out in the corner of the road or whatever

2179
02:13:44,800 --> 02:13:45,800
 it is.

2180
02:13:45,800 --> 02:13:46,800
 Correct.

2181
02:13:46,800 --> 02:13:48,800
 Yeah, there's no safety issues, nothing like that.

2182
02:13:48,800 --> 02:13:53,760
 No, as far as the certificate of occupancy, I shouldn't have any problem at all getting

2183
02:13:53,760 --> 02:13:55,680
 the CO the way I'm supposed to.

2184
02:13:55,680 --> 02:13:59,560
 I don't know a lot of conversation that I know that Commissioner Beck had in the work

2185
02:13:59,560 --> 02:14:06,840
 session, but just the fact that it's fixed now, it's good now, snapshot in time, cars

2186
02:14:06,840 --> 02:14:10,600
 are off the lot, everything's good and clean, I think you're an upstanding guy, and I think

2187
02:14:10,600 --> 02:14:15,000
 that was Mr. Melton's, a lot of his issues, the reason why it was all dirtied up.

2188
02:14:15,000 --> 02:14:18,960
 I guess, not really a question, but more just an encouragement.

2189
02:14:18,960 --> 02:14:22,120
 We do know that code enforcement's probably going to be really keeping a strong eye on

2190
02:14:22,120 --> 02:14:27,920
 you for making sure you're there, and as long as you know that, and you're willing to play

2191
02:14:27,920 --> 02:14:33,400
 by the rules, then I'm willing to support you in business.

2192
02:14:33,400 --> 02:14:35,240
 As you would say, I'm on the map now.

2193
02:14:35,240 --> 02:14:47,240
 I was kind of hitting back there for a long time, and we had this discussion last time.

2194
02:14:47,240 --> 02:14:54,440
 I did nothing wrong with my CO at the time, and then my business evolved, and we had this

2195
02:14:54,440 --> 02:14:56,280
 discussion last time.

2196
02:14:56,280 --> 02:15:02,580
 But I'm aware now that I saw Mr. Sanchez driving by checking it out today, the building

2197
02:15:02,580 --> 02:15:08,160
 inspections guy, I've seen him pass through, eyeballing.

2198
02:15:08,160 --> 02:15:18,960
 I'm aware that everybody's looking, and I have no intentions of going backwards or anything.

2199
02:15:18,960 --> 02:15:22,200
 I'm here to do what the city wants me to do, keep the city clean.

2200
02:15:22,200 --> 02:15:24,960
 I love Denton, I'm born and raised in Denton.

2201
02:15:24,960 --> 02:15:29,920
 Unfortunately, I got some property left to me, and I don't have to pay any house payments

2202
02:15:29,920 --> 02:15:34,200
 or anything, so I don't live in the city anymore, but I love this town, and I've been born and

2203
02:15:34,200 --> 02:15:35,200
 raised here.

2204
02:15:35,200 --> 02:15:36,200
 Great.

2205
02:15:36,200 --> 02:15:37,200
 Well, thank you, Mr. Haney.

2206
02:15:37,200 --> 02:15:38,200
 I appreciate it.

2207
02:15:38,200 --> 02:15:39,200
 Mr. Cole.

2208
02:15:39,200 --> 02:15:40,200
 Thank you, Chair.

2209
02:15:40,200 --> 02:15:42,960
 I just want to say you're a man of your word, Mr. Haney, and I do appreciate that.

2210
02:15:42,960 --> 02:15:45,520
 I mean, you did everything.

2211
02:15:45,520 --> 02:15:50,560
 I was skeptical, and it was one something a.m.

2212
02:15:50,560 --> 02:15:51,560
 You came at the right time.

2213
02:15:51,560 --> 02:15:52,560
 We were whooped down.

2214
02:15:52,560 --> 02:15:53,560
 Thirty-seven cars in 28 days.

2215
02:15:53,560 --> 02:15:54,560
 Yeah, that's impressive.

2216
02:15:54,560 --> 02:15:55,560
 I wish you well in your small business.

2217
02:15:55,560 --> 02:16:02,160
 I didn't realize how much was there and how much had accumulated until I had to get it

2218
02:16:02,160 --> 02:16:03,160
 moved in that amount of time.

2219
02:16:03,160 --> 02:16:04,160
 Well, you're a man of your word, and I appreciate your word.

2220
02:16:04,160 --> 02:16:05,160
 I appreciate it.

2221
02:16:05,160 --> 02:16:06,160
 I don't see any other questions for you.

2222
02:16:06,160 --> 02:16:07,160
 I appreciate it.

2223
02:16:07,160 --> 02:16:08,160
 All right.

2224
02:16:08,160 --> 02:16:09,160
 Thank you.

2225
02:16:09,160 --> 02:16:10,160
 Thank you.

2226
02:16:10,160 --> 02:16:11,160
 I just want to clarify.

2227
02:16:11,160 --> 02:16:22,160
 Is Vincent Huebinger here for the next agenda item, or this one?

2228
02:16:22,160 --> 02:16:27,960
 Perfect, that's what I assume, but if you want to speak on this item, you're more than

2229
02:16:27,960 --> 02:16:28,960
 welcome to.

2230
02:16:28,960 --> 02:16:35,160
 Is there anyone else wishing to speak on this item?

2231
02:16:35,160 --> 02:16:40,280
 It is a public hearing, so anyone can speak.

2232
02:16:40,280 --> 02:16:44,000
 Seeing none, I will close the public hearing and open for a motion or discussion.

2233
02:16:44,000 --> 02:16:45,000
 Commissioner Burnetta.

2234
02:16:45,000 --> 02:16:53,360
 I'd like to make a motion to approve the staff recommendations.

2235
02:16:53,360 --> 02:16:56,360
 The staff is recommending denial, so ... No, I'm sorry.

2236
02:16:56,360 --> 02:16:57,360
 With the suggestions.

2237
02:16:57,360 --> 02:16:58,360
 With the suggestions.

2238
02:16:58,360 --> 02:16:59,360
 I'm sorry.

2239
02:16:59,360 --> 02:17:00,360
 With the suggestions.

2240
02:17:00,360 --> 02:17:01,360
 Okay.

2241
02:17:01,360 --> 02:17:02,360
 Yeah, let me clarify that.

2242
02:17:02,360 --> 02:17:04,240
 Motion to approve with staff suggestions.

2243
02:17:04,240 --> 02:17:05,240
 Got it.

2244
02:17:05,240 --> 02:17:06,240
 Perfect.

2245
02:17:06,240 --> 02:17:07,240
 Thank you for that clarification.

2246
02:17:07,240 --> 02:17:08,240
 Thank you.

2247
02:17:08,240 --> 02:17:09,240
 All right.

2248
02:17:09,240 --> 02:17:10,240
 Commissioner Smith.

2249
02:17:10,240 --> 02:17:11,240
 Second.

2250
02:17:11,240 --> 02:17:12,240
 Having a first and a second.

2251
02:17:12,240 --> 02:17:13,240
 Commissioner Ellis.

2252
02:17:13,240 --> 02:17:14,240
 Thank you, Chair.

2253
02:17:14,240 --> 02:17:15,240
 Commissioner Haney.

2254
02:17:15,240 --> 02:17:16,240
 You don't have to come up here.

2255
02:17:16,240 --> 02:17:19,320
 I just wanted to say thank you for doing everything that you said you were going to do when we

2256
02:17:19,320 --> 02:17:22,560
 sent you away that night in the middle of the night.

2257
02:17:22,560 --> 02:17:23,560
 I appreciate it.

2258
02:17:23,560 --> 02:17:27,520
 I know you worked hard, because I drove by there a couple of times this week as well.

2259
02:17:27,520 --> 02:17:34,760
 We have a first and a second.

2260
02:17:34,760 --> 02:17:36,880
 Before calling the motion, I want to echo what the other commissioner said.

2261
02:17:36,880 --> 02:17:38,680
 I appreciate you doing what you said you'd do.

2262
02:17:38,680 --> 02:17:45,480
 It wasn't a small task, and it's a first initial step in providing a lot of confidence in us

2263
02:17:45,480 --> 02:17:50,200
 as a city to have you as a business owner and working and thriving in that location.

2264
02:17:50,200 --> 02:17:52,800
 When I drive by, it's a front door and a bay.

2265
02:17:52,800 --> 02:17:53,800
 It seems perfect.

2266
02:17:53,800 --> 02:17:55,120
 Open that bay up and get to work.

2267
02:17:55,120 --> 02:18:00,160
 So I wish you all the best, and hopefully the CEO has no issue with the processing and

2268
02:18:00,160 --> 02:18:01,160
 maintenance of that.

2269
02:18:01,160 --> 02:18:03,160
 So I congratulate someone to be supporting this.

2270
02:18:03,160 --> 02:18:15,720
 Seeing no other discussion, I'm going to call for a vote on the board.

2271
02:18:15,720 --> 02:18:17,720
 Motion is approved, 7-0.

2272
02:18:17,720 --> 02:18:18,720
 Congratulations.

2273
02:18:18,720 --> 02:18:24,560
 Next item on the agenda is item D, S18-009.

2274
02:18:24,560 --> 02:18:29,600
 I'll invite Cindy Jackson for presentation.

2275
02:18:29,600 --> 02:18:55,320
 Okay, S18-009 is a request for a specific use permit for a freestanding monopole and

2276
02:18:55,320 --> 02:18:57,840
 associated equipment room.

2277
02:18:57,840 --> 02:19:05,320
 The site is located at 816 Frame Street within the South Storage Facility.

2278
02:19:05,320 --> 02:19:13,000
 Frame Street is here, Paisley is along the south side, and the railroad goes northwest.

2279
02:19:13,000 --> 02:19:17,960
 The site is located in the DCG Zoning District.

2280
02:19:17,960 --> 02:19:27,540
 Approval of an SUP is required for a monopole tower up to 85 feet in height in the DCG District.

2281
02:19:27,540 --> 02:19:36,080
 We did a compatibility analysis, both following the SUP criteria and Section 35-12-8, telecommunications

2282
02:19:36,080 --> 02:19:37,920
 tower standards.

2283
02:19:37,920 --> 02:19:45,520
 As detailed in your backup, the site does comply with all of these standards.

2284
02:19:45,520 --> 02:19:52,280
 Here is the site plan, and you can see that the tower site will be located right here.

2285
02:19:52,280 --> 02:20:00,880
 The applicant intends to remove three existing storage units and place the monopole and equipment

2286
02:20:00,880 --> 02:20:05,720
 shed in this location.

2287
02:20:05,720 --> 02:20:10,360
 Here's a site plan of the site, which shows the monopole tower, the equipment, and the

2288
02:20:10,360 --> 02:20:11,360
 generator.

2289
02:20:11,360 --> 02:20:18,280
 If you look here, the dashed lines show you where the three units will be removed from.

2290
02:20:18,280 --> 02:20:25,840
 And elevation shows the 80-foot site pole, rather.

2291
02:20:25,840 --> 02:20:31,240
 Zoning analysis, as mentioned previously, a monopole tower less than 85 feet is permitted

2292
02:20:31,240 --> 02:20:37,440
 upon approval of a specific use permit.

2293
02:20:37,440 --> 02:20:43,400
 For compatibility, the subject site is going to be located within a South Storage Facility.

2294
02:20:43,400 --> 02:20:51,800
 It will not be visible from the neighboring communities, streets, or the railroad, really.

2295
02:20:51,800 --> 02:20:55,080
 All is anyone will see is the tower.

2296
02:20:55,080 --> 02:21:00,600
 This will help minimize any nuisance caused by the visibility of the site.

2297
02:21:00,600 --> 02:21:03,240
 This is a public hearing.

2298
02:21:03,240 --> 02:21:07,840
 Notices were sent out within 200 and 500 feet of the site.

2299
02:21:07,840 --> 02:21:11,120
 We received two responses in favor.

2300
02:21:11,120 --> 02:21:16,960
 You can see them in green here, and I handed them out to you at the work session, representing

2301
02:21:16,960 --> 02:21:20,480
 16 percent of the land area within 200 feet.

2302
02:21:20,480 --> 02:21:22,840
 Two signs were also posted on this site.

2303
02:21:22,840 --> 02:21:30,520
 The applicant held a neighborhood meeting to which no property owners or citizens attended.

2304
02:21:30,520 --> 02:21:32,160
 Staff recommends approval of this request.

2305
02:21:32,160 --> 02:21:39,720
 It is compatible with the surrounding property, conforms with all requirements of Section 35-12-8,

2306
02:21:39,720 --> 02:21:44,780
 wireless telecommunications facilities, as well as the SUP criteria.

2307
02:21:44,780 --> 02:21:47,360
 That concludes my presentation, and the applicant is here.

2308
02:21:47,360 --> 02:21:48,360
 >> Thank you, Cindy.

2309
02:21:48,360 --> 02:21:52,680
 I don't see any questions for you.

2310
02:21:52,680 --> 02:21:55,200
 This is a public hearing, so anyone wishing to speak may do so.

2311
02:21:55,200 --> 02:21:56,600
 We have one card in.

2312
02:21:56,600 --> 02:21:59,200
 It's the applicant, Mr. Vincent Hubebinger.

2313
02:21:59,200 --> 02:22:06,600
 I don't know if I'm pronouncing that correctly.

2314
02:22:06,600 --> 02:22:12,560
 >> Mr. Chair, Commissioners, my name is Vince Hubebinger.

2315
02:22:12,560 --> 02:22:13,920
 >> It should be one of these up here.

2316
02:22:13,920 --> 02:22:14,920
 >> Yeah, it is.

2317
02:22:14,920 --> 02:22:15,920
 I got it from here.

2318
02:22:15,920 --> 02:22:16,920
 Thank you.

2319
02:22:16,920 --> 02:22:19,720
 >> If you could just state your address for the record, that would be helpful.

2320
02:22:19,720 --> 02:22:20,720
 >> Sure.

2321
02:22:20,720 --> 02:22:25,920
 1715 Keplup, Texas Highway, Austin, Texas.

2322
02:22:25,920 --> 02:22:27,040
 Thank you for having me.

2323
02:22:27,040 --> 02:22:35,960
 Basically, this is a request for Verizon site located at this location kind of south of downtown

2324
02:22:35,960 --> 02:22:40,520
 southeast of downtown.

2325
02:22:40,520 --> 02:22:45,960
 Closer view shows it within the Thumbtack area, as Cindy was saying, in the storage

2326
02:22:45,960 --> 02:22:46,960
 area.

2327
02:22:46,960 --> 02:22:50,480
 They're going to take one of those, three of those units down, put the monopole in there

2328
02:22:50,480 --> 02:22:53,840
 just south of Texas Women's University.

2329
02:22:53,840 --> 02:22:54,840
 Very unique.

2330
02:22:54,840 --> 02:22:59,280
 >> Is it possible for you to put that into presentation mode so viewers at home can view

2331
02:22:59,280 --> 02:23:00,280
 it?

2332
02:23:00,280 --> 02:23:01,280
 >> Is it not in presentation mode?

2333
02:23:01,280 --> 02:23:08,240
 I'm seeing the presentation button at the bottom right.

2334
02:23:08,240 --> 02:23:12,160
 >> Yes.

2335
02:23:12,160 --> 02:23:13,160
 >> Thank you.

2336
02:23:13,160 --> 02:23:14,160
 Sorry for the interruption.

2337
02:23:14,160 --> 02:23:15,160
 >> My technology.

2338
02:23:15,160 --> 02:23:16,160
 That's okay.

2339
02:23:16,160 --> 02:23:17,160
 Let me go back to where I was.

2340
02:23:17,160 --> 02:23:23,240
 Anyway, it's very unique to find a heavy commercial use in this area that meets the setbacks of

2341
02:23:23,240 --> 02:23:26,560
 three times the height that complies with the code.

2342
02:23:26,560 --> 02:23:32,000
 We thought this was a good site from the beginning and we moved it a couple of times and reduced

2343
02:23:32,000 --> 02:23:34,560
 the height to make sure it worked.

2344
02:23:34,560 --> 02:23:38,840
 You're going to ask why do we need another tower?

2345
02:23:38,840 --> 02:23:40,320
 This is a capacity site.

2346
02:23:40,320 --> 02:23:44,760
 What we have going on in this situation is all the apps that you're running on your smartphones,

2347
02:23:44,760 --> 02:23:49,720
 your Amber Alerts, your Weather Alerts, your favorite sport teams, the Cowboys, of course,

2348
02:23:49,720 --> 02:23:54,880
 alerts on their scores is all taken up infrastructure on that network.

2349
02:23:54,880 --> 02:23:59,720
 So what all the carriers are having to do is try to download that capacity and that

2350
02:23:59,720 --> 02:24:05,240
 capacity is only been dealt with by having a new site between them.

2351
02:24:05,240 --> 02:24:08,340
 I'll show you the RF maps.

2352
02:24:08,340 --> 02:24:13,120
 These are propagation maps and this is a basic map showing green in building coverage which

2353
02:24:13,120 --> 02:24:17,680
 is what's preferred for everybody in kitchen coverage in your rooftops.

2354
02:24:17,680 --> 02:24:22,400
 Very light yellow in there in any vehicle only and you can tell that's north of the

2355
02:24:22,400 --> 02:24:26,880
 University, Women's University and up there by the loop.

2356
02:24:26,880 --> 02:24:32,560
 You can see the existing sites around the area and you can see the proposed in the red

2357
02:24:32,560 --> 02:24:33,560
 triangle.

2358
02:24:33,560 --> 02:24:39,560
 Now once we turn it on air, it does take away some of that yellow but this is really a capacity

2359
02:24:39,560 --> 02:24:43,200
 site for three of the sites that are surrounding.

2360
02:24:43,200 --> 02:24:46,920
 Centrally located between those two would be perfect but we can't get into Texas Women's

2361
02:24:46,920 --> 02:24:52,680
 University, the best we can do is this site right here.

2362
02:24:52,680 --> 02:24:56,880
 This is just an aerial of all our existing sites surrounding us, you can see how we're

2363
02:24:56,880 --> 02:24:57,880
 trying to spread out.

2364
02:24:57,880 --> 02:25:02,880
 You may have not known where these are but they are there, a lot of times I mention that

2365
02:25:02,880 --> 02:25:07,720
 monopoles are somewhat discrete, a lot of people don't know where their closest tower

2366
02:25:07,720 --> 02:25:16,520
 is but for E911, if Denton has E911 capabilities and a 911 call comes in, it triangulates and

2367
02:25:16,520 --> 02:25:21,320
 dispatch where you are within nine feet and that is through the GPS navigation, also in

2368
02:25:21,320 --> 02:25:25,040
 the infrastructure so it's important for safety to get this done.

2369
02:25:25,040 --> 02:25:31,120
 It meets all the requirements as Cindy said, goals, three times the height, those things.

2370
02:25:31,120 --> 02:25:36,200
 Location again, in the middle of a structure that you really can't see any of the equipment,

2371
02:25:36,200 --> 02:25:40,280
 you may see the monopole but a lot of the neighborhoods around there have fairly large

2372
02:25:40,280 --> 02:25:44,880
 trees, it's a pretty older neighborhood that will kind of block up that view as well.

2373
02:25:44,880 --> 02:25:52,360
 So we were a quiet but needed structure and there's the 210 setback from all residential

2374
02:25:52,360 --> 02:25:53,360
 uses.

2375
02:25:53,360 --> 02:25:56,880
 If you have any questions, let me have an answer.

2376
02:25:56,880 --> 02:25:58,760
 Thank you for your presentation.

2377
02:25:58,760 --> 02:25:59,760
 Thank you.

2378
02:25:59,760 --> 02:26:02,720
 I do not see any questions.

2379
02:26:02,720 --> 02:26:06,240
 This is a public hearing, anyone wishing to speak on this may certainly do so.

2380
02:26:06,240 --> 02:26:12,760
 I don't have any other cards and I don't see any motion in the audience so we'll go ahead

2381
02:26:12,760 --> 02:26:17,760
 and close the public hearing and I will turn it over to the dais for motion or discussion.

2382
02:26:17,760 --> 02:26:19,000
 Commissioner Smith.

2383
02:26:19,000 --> 02:26:20,000
 Motion for approval.

2384
02:26:20,000 --> 02:26:23,000
 We have a first, Commissioner Pernetta.

2385
02:26:23,000 --> 02:26:24,000
 Second that motion.

2386
02:26:24,000 --> 02:26:26,880
 We have a first and a second, any discussion on the item?

2387
02:26:26,880 --> 02:26:36,720
 Seeing none, I'll call for a vote on the board.

2388
02:26:36,720 --> 02:26:44,200
 Motion carries 7-0.

2389
02:26:44,200 --> 02:26:51,160
 Next item on the agenda is item E, PDA 18-1, I'll invite Julie Wyatt for presentation

2390
02:26:51,160 --> 02:26:53,560
 and open to public hearing.

2391
02:26:53,560 --> 02:27:04,680
 Good evening, I'm Julie Wyatt, Senior Planner and I want to get my presentation.

2392
02:27:04,680 --> 02:27:14,520
 So I'm presenting to you PDA 18-1, Kings Ridge.

2393
02:27:14,520 --> 02:27:18,560
 The request is to hold a public hearing and consider making a recommendation to city council

2394
02:27:18,560 --> 02:27:23,680
 regarding a general concept plan amendment and a detailed plan approval for PD 115.

2395
02:27:23,680 --> 02:27:30,360
 The subject property is 78 acres and it is located on the north side of town adjacent

2396
02:27:30,360 --> 02:27:34,800
 to Bonnie Bray, just south of Elm.

2397
02:27:34,800 --> 02:27:42,680
 PDs in Denton are a two-step process and are governed by our 91 code and that two-step

2398
02:27:42,680 --> 02:27:46,040
 process includes a general concept plan and a detailed plan.

2399
02:27:46,040 --> 02:27:54,000
 The applicant is proposing an amendment to that concept plan regarding the uses and then

2400
02:27:54,000 --> 02:27:56,960
 the detailed plan as well, approval.

2401
02:27:56,960 --> 02:28:01,000
 The concept plan never expires, it's kind of the zoning of the property.

2402
02:28:01,000 --> 02:28:05,560
 The detailed plan, if the property did not develop in accordance with it, would expire

2403
02:28:05,560 --> 02:28:07,800
 after 24 months.

2404
02:28:07,800 --> 02:28:13,720
 So a little bit of background about the existing PD, it was approved in 1986, it was a mixed

2405
02:28:13,720 --> 02:28:14,720
 use PD.

2406
02:28:14,720 --> 02:28:20,560
 It had commercial and office and residential uses.

2407
02:28:20,560 --> 02:28:27,080
 That PD was amended, the concept plan, in 2000 to reallocate those uses and in 2002

2408
02:28:27,080 --> 02:28:32,320
 and 2006 they did do detailed plans for the single family uses, however those expired.

2409
02:28:32,320 --> 02:28:40,240
 So that 2000 general concept plan and here we'll just briefly look at those uses that

2410
02:28:40,240 --> 02:28:43,240
 are permitted in the locations for those uses.

2411
02:28:43,240 --> 02:28:49,600
 So it provides for single family, lots that are 5,000 square feet would be located in

2412
02:28:49,600 --> 02:28:51,360
 this area and this area.

2413
02:28:51,360 --> 02:28:56,160
 7,000 square foot lots are proposed for this general area plus south.

2414
02:28:56,160 --> 02:29:00,080
 Multifamily was proposed for this central portion and then adjacent to Bonnie Bray there

2415
02:29:00,080 --> 02:29:02,640
 was commercial and office uses.

2416
02:29:02,640 --> 02:29:07,400
 The applicant is proposing to amend this to remove those commercial office and multifamily

2417
02:29:07,400 --> 02:29:13,280
 uses and just have straight single family neighborhood in that area.

2418
02:29:13,280 --> 02:29:18,320
 So that is the detached single family at a maximum density of 3.6 dwelling units per

2419
02:29:18,320 --> 02:29:19,320
 acre.

2420
02:29:19,320 --> 02:29:23,600
 The dimensional requirements that they're proposing are 6,000 square foot lots with

2421
02:29:23,600 --> 02:29:29,720
 the minimum width of 50 feet, minimum depth of 100 feet, maximum height of 36 feet.

2422
02:29:29,720 --> 02:29:34,720
 They have setbacks that they're proposing as well as a maximum lot coverage of 60 percent

2423
02:29:34,720 --> 02:29:37,600
 all impervious surface.

2424
02:29:37,600 --> 02:29:38,720
 So that's the concept plan.

2425
02:29:38,720 --> 02:29:41,840
 The detail plan gets a little more fine grain.

2426
02:29:41,840 --> 02:29:46,320
 It outlines the administration of the PD, the uses and dimensions that are consistent

2427
02:29:46,320 --> 02:29:48,200
 with that general concept plan.

2428
02:29:48,200 --> 02:29:53,080
 Talks about mobility, open space, landscaping, perimeter fencing, those amenities as well

2429
02:29:53,080 --> 02:29:55,400
 as design guidelines.

2430
02:29:55,400 --> 02:30:02,800
 So just briefly a comparison of what if they went straight zoning versus the proposed PD.

2431
02:30:02,800 --> 02:30:05,960
 The benefit of the proposed PD is we kind of know what they want to do and it gives

2432
02:30:05,960 --> 02:30:09,800
 us certainty about what they're proposing as well as any amenities.

2433
02:30:09,800 --> 02:30:13,200
 They're proposing things like open space which is not required in the Denton Development

2434
02:30:13,200 --> 02:30:20,800
 Code, things like perimeter fencing, the masonry walls at arterials, they're proposing tree

2435
02:30:20,800 --> 02:30:27,720
 canopy within the open space, trails, minimum masonry on those single family homes.

2436
02:30:27,720 --> 02:30:28,720
 They're proposing that.

2437
02:30:28,720 --> 02:30:32,200
 The Denton Development Code does not require that.

2438
02:30:32,200 --> 02:30:36,280
 Perimeter streets and neighborhood street trees as well as the right of way widths that

2439
02:30:36,280 --> 02:30:39,880
 they're proposing are consistent with what we would require with any other single family

2440
02:30:39,880 --> 02:30:42,840
 development in the city.

2441
02:30:42,840 --> 02:30:47,280
 So here is the detailed plan that they are proposing.

2442
02:30:47,280 --> 02:30:50,720
 It shows the locations of the single family lots.

2443
02:30:50,720 --> 02:31:00,880
 They're proposing 267 as part of this as well as the street networks and traffic calming

2444
02:31:00,880 --> 02:31:03,720
 devices for some of those longer streets.

2445
02:31:03,720 --> 02:31:07,160
 Here's the main open space common area.

2446
02:31:07,160 --> 02:31:12,760
 It's connected and it provides several opportunities for people to enter that open space through

2447
02:31:12,760 --> 02:31:15,440
 out the neighborhood.

2448
02:31:15,440 --> 02:31:23,760
 Also buffers and open space surrounding the property adjacent to those arterials and abutting

2449
02:31:23,760 --> 02:31:25,560
 land uses.

2450
02:31:25,560 --> 02:31:30,440
 You're probably aware and most are aware that Denton ISD has acquired the property

2451
02:31:30,440 --> 02:31:39,880
 south of this proposal and the new Denton High School is proposed to go in this location.

2452
02:31:39,880 --> 02:31:43,600
 So here's the landscape plan that they are proposing as part of this.

2453
02:31:43,600 --> 02:31:50,760
 We'll look at this briefly and then we'll kind of zoom into some specific spots.

2454
02:31:50,760 --> 02:31:54,920
 This kind of gives you a broad overview of what they're proposing and what those open

2455
02:31:54,920 --> 02:32:02,520
 spaces may look like as well as some photographs of the typologies of those amenities.

2456
02:32:02,520 --> 02:32:07,320
 So when we zoom into that southern boundary of the PD, they're proposing a minimum 15

2457
02:32:07,320 --> 02:32:08,320
 foot landscape buffer.

2458
02:32:08,320 --> 02:32:13,960
 It'll get a little narrower in some spots, for instance in these general locations, but

2459
02:32:13,960 --> 02:32:18,600
 it'll increase in other locations to provide open spaces.

2460
02:32:18,600 --> 02:32:23,400
 The rumor of fence sitting in this area will be wood with masonry columns or ornamental

2461
02:32:23,400 --> 02:32:28,560
 metal if a lot is adjacent to a larger open space.

2462
02:32:28,560 --> 02:32:33,360
 They're proposing street trees along that arterial that is going to be on the southern

2463
02:32:33,360 --> 02:32:34,360
 boundary.

2464
02:32:34,360 --> 02:32:38,960
 On every 45 linear feet, however, those may be grouped together to provide a little more

2465
02:32:38,960 --> 02:32:40,840
 natural setting.

2466
02:32:40,840 --> 02:32:47,240
 Monument entry signs, turf or native grasses, berms in order to mitigate any visual impacts

2467
02:32:47,240 --> 02:32:51,040
 that the high school traffic is going to put on that road.

2468
02:32:51,040 --> 02:32:55,120
 So they really want to be really sensitive to the treatment of that landscape and that

2469
02:32:55,120 --> 02:32:56,740
 buffering and screening there.

2470
02:32:56,740 --> 02:33:00,120
 And then a sidewalk.

2471
02:33:00,120 --> 02:33:05,100
 The eastern property boundary along Bonnie Bray is proposed to have a minimum 20 foot

2472
02:33:05,100 --> 02:33:10,240
 landscape buffer with trees and a minimum six foot masonry wall as well as a monument

2473
02:33:10,240 --> 02:33:12,080
 entry sign.

2474
02:33:12,080 --> 02:33:19,400
 Internally, they are proposing 600 feet of all weather trail within their open space

2475
02:33:19,400 --> 02:33:20,400
 areas.

2476
02:33:20,400 --> 02:33:27,840
 Seating areas, blocks of natural stone, a shade structure, dogway stations, tree preservation

2477
02:33:27,840 --> 02:33:34,400
 within those open space areas, they are proposing 40% landscape on average throughout the open

2478
02:33:34,400 --> 02:33:40,000
 space areas and that'll be a combination of tree preservation as well as new plantings.

2479
02:33:40,000 --> 02:33:44,880
 Street trees along the neighborhood streets and also lot trees for the individual single

2480
02:33:44,880 --> 02:33:47,880
 family homes.

2481
02:33:47,880 --> 02:33:54,800
 The design for the single family homes includes four parking spaces per lot and that essentially

2482
02:33:54,800 --> 02:33:59,080
 requires a garage, so each of them would have a two car garage.

2483
02:33:59,080 --> 02:34:03,960
 The PD also puts in architectural variety, there's a menu of items that they can choose

2484
02:34:03,960 --> 02:34:07,440
 in order to make sure that there's variety among the homes.

2485
02:34:07,440 --> 02:34:13,120
 Any attached front-end garages would have to have a wood look to them, either with actual

2486
02:34:13,120 --> 02:34:16,360
 wood or stained fiberglass or synthetic wood.

2487
02:34:16,360 --> 02:34:23,400
 70% masonry is required and then that front yard would need to be 50% landscaped.

2488
02:34:23,400 --> 02:34:28,000
 So the criteria for approval is in the 1991 code, it does meet the criteria for approval

2489
02:34:28,000 --> 02:34:31,880
 for both the concept plan and the detail plan.

2490
02:34:31,880 --> 02:34:35,120
 There's only one criteria for approval for the concept plan and it has to be in harmony

2491
02:34:35,120 --> 02:34:36,800
 with the entire district.

2492
02:34:36,800 --> 02:34:43,840
 PD 115 was envisioned to be a mixed use district, it has shrunk in size due to the high school

2493
02:34:43,840 --> 02:34:50,560
 coming in and so, but the surrounding zoning and the future uses will really mimic that

2494
02:34:50,560 --> 02:34:55,400
 mixed use component, so it really is maintaining that mixed use feel in the area.

2495
02:34:55,400 --> 02:35:00,160
 It's also just an extension of what the uses are, that it's really just broadening that

2496
02:35:00,160 --> 02:35:02,360
 residential use.

2497
02:35:02,360 --> 02:35:04,840
 The detail plan has four criteria for approval.

2498
02:35:04,840 --> 02:35:11,240
 First is it comply with the general concept plan and if approved, it would.

2499
02:35:11,240 --> 02:35:15,600
 It would also provide for compatible arrangement of buildings and land uses that would not

2500
02:35:15,600 --> 02:35:18,200
 adversely impact the adjoining properties.

2501
02:35:18,200 --> 02:35:24,400
 This is a single family neighborhood that's oriented toward its common open space.

2502
02:35:24,400 --> 02:35:29,880
 The buffers around it will kind of provide that screening and that separation between

2503
02:35:29,880 --> 02:35:35,200
 those, not only those arterials, but also the adjacent properties.

2504
02:35:35,200 --> 02:35:39,840
 And then also nearby, it's not going to connect to any nearby neighborhoods, it really is

2505
02:35:39,840 --> 02:35:46,280
 going to kind of be adjacent to those collector streets, or arterials, I'm sorry.

2506
02:35:46,280 --> 02:35:50,000
 Does the plan provide for adequate and safe vehicular circulation?

2507
02:35:50,000 --> 02:35:51,000
 It does.

2508
02:35:51,000 --> 02:35:56,200
 It's going to comply with all Denton code requirements, as well as provide traffic calming.

2509
02:35:56,200 --> 02:36:01,000
 And is it in substantial compliance with landscape signs, subdivision, and other regulations?

2510
02:36:01,000 --> 02:36:05,360
 The 1998 Landscape Code, which is what we kind of look at when we look at these PDs,

2511
02:36:05,360 --> 02:36:12,360
 and it does, it requires 15 trees per acre and that could include planting and preservation

2512
02:36:12,360 --> 02:36:16,320
 and that really comes out to about 34% canopy.

2513
02:36:16,320 --> 02:36:21,240
 They're actually proposing 40% canopy on average throughout the open spaces, as well

2514
02:36:21,240 --> 02:36:23,560
 as one tree per lot and one street tree.

2515
02:36:23,560 --> 02:36:27,660
 So they really are meeting the intent of that, they're really increasing that canopy and

2516
02:36:27,660 --> 02:36:30,800
 making sure there's adequate landscaping.

2517
02:36:30,800 --> 02:36:34,920
 We looked at the mobility, it's not a criteria for approval, but it's certainly on everyone's

2518
02:36:34,920 --> 02:36:39,960
 mind in that area, especially with the high school coming in and all of those, the additional

2519
02:36:39,960 --> 02:36:42,720
 developments.

2520
02:36:42,720 --> 02:36:47,840
 They provided a trip generation analysis, they actually assumed a little more density

2521
02:36:47,840 --> 02:36:55,080
 than what they're proposing and based upon that 350 dwellings, they had nearly 3,300

2522
02:36:55,080 --> 02:37:02,440
 trips with 230 of those in the morning and then 338 in the evening.

2523
02:37:02,440 --> 02:37:07,480
 Based upon this development, but really also the high school in the area, there's a UNT

2524
02:37:07,480 --> 02:37:12,280
 campus in the area, there's other residential developments, as well as a regional park.

2525
02:37:12,280 --> 02:37:15,800
 Bonnie Bray is going to be improved, it's going to be improved, it's just the improvements

2526
02:37:15,800 --> 02:37:21,160
 are going to continue north of university, it'll be a two lane divided, things like

2527
02:37:21,160 --> 02:37:27,040
 capacity, safety, storm water, and utility will all come into play, that final design

2528
02:37:27,040 --> 02:37:30,000
 isn't going to be ready until next year, so we really don't know where it's going

2529
02:37:30,000 --> 02:37:36,360
 to land, but they know that it needs to be done by 2021 when that high school opens.

2530
02:37:36,360 --> 02:37:41,240
 Information was sent out, the applicant did have a neighborhood meeting, a few attended,

2531
02:37:41,240 --> 02:37:44,880
 really they wanted to know kind of what they were doing, it really seemed like a more fact

2532
02:37:44,880 --> 02:37:47,440
 finding kind of neighborhood meeting.

2533
02:37:47,440 --> 02:37:53,200
 We haven't received any feedback at all from residents.

2534
02:37:53,200 --> 02:37:57,880
 Based upon the criteria for approval, staff recommends approval with the following condition

2535
02:37:57,880 --> 02:38:04,840
 that any development would conform with that general concept plan, detail plan, and including

2536
02:38:04,840 --> 02:38:08,920
 that landscape plan and that text that is in your backup and I'll stand for any questions

2537
02:38:08,920 --> 02:38:09,920
 and the applicant is here.

2538
02:38:09,920 --> 02:38:14,120
 Thank you Julie for the presentation, we do have a couple questions, Commissioner Ellis.

2539
02:38:14,120 --> 02:38:15,120
 Thank you Chair.

2540
02:38:15,120 --> 02:38:19,400
 Julie, hey I noticed in the detailed plan that the street that they're putting in on

2541
02:38:19,400 --> 02:38:23,880
 the south there, they've labeled as Westgate, but they're not tying that into the current

2542
02:38:23,880 --> 02:38:25,400
 Westgate, the north-south.

2543
02:38:25,400 --> 02:38:33,680
 Well, there's, it's kind of, so this is named Westgate right now, and this is also

2544
02:38:33,680 --> 02:38:35,280
 named Westgate.

2545
02:38:35,280 --> 02:38:36,280
 This is Riney.

2546
02:38:36,280 --> 02:38:42,480
 I suspect this will change, so although they're calling it Westgate because really when they

2547
02:38:42,480 --> 02:38:46,600
 drew up their plan, they were continuing on with this street, which is named Westgate,

2548
02:38:46,600 --> 02:38:52,720
 but I suspect fire is going to want, some, one of them has to change because--

2549
02:38:52,720 --> 02:38:56,720
 Well, and it's really the north-south Westgate that has the homes on it that I was concerned

2550
02:38:56,720 --> 02:38:58,680
 about, but it is not tying into that from what we've discussed.

2551
02:38:58,680 --> 02:38:59,680
 It is not.

2552
02:38:59,680 --> 02:39:01,920
 This will, this dead-end's here and will remain dead-end.

2553
02:39:01,920 --> 02:39:02,920
 Perfect.

2554
02:39:02,920 --> 02:39:03,920
 Thank you.

2555
02:39:03,920 --> 02:39:04,920
 Commissioner Smith.

2556
02:39:04,920 --> 02:39:05,920
 Thank you, Chair.

2557
02:39:05,920 --> 02:39:12,480
 To piggyback on what Commissioner Alice was mentioning, the, that Westgate that does jump

2558
02:39:12,480 --> 02:39:18,880
 behind the, I should know, my grandma's shop's out there, the businesses out there on 35.

2559
02:39:18,880 --> 02:39:19,880
 Stonehill Center.

2560
02:39:19,880 --> 02:39:20,880
 Stonehill Center.

2561
02:39:20,880 --> 02:39:21,880
 Thank you very much.

2562
02:39:21,880 --> 02:39:22,880
 Sorry, I blanked.

2563
02:39:22,880 --> 02:39:23,880
 Who's responsible for expanding that?

2564
02:39:23,880 --> 02:39:26,680
 Is that going to be the developers, the city project?

2565
02:39:26,680 --> 02:39:30,480
 What is that secondary arterial, that expansion of that?

2566
02:39:30,480 --> 02:39:31,760
 There is a gap here.

2567
02:39:31,760 --> 02:39:35,900
 So as part of this development and as part of the high school development, they will

2568
02:39:35,900 --> 02:39:41,720
 have to improve the portion of the street that's adjacent to their site.

2569
02:39:41,720 --> 02:39:47,440
 I'm not sure if the city plans on, you know, as part of any regional improvements, plans

2570
02:39:47,440 --> 02:39:55,840
 on closing this gap, but as it typically develops, this would remain undeveloped or this would

2571
02:39:55,840 --> 02:40:00,640
 remain a gap until the adjacent properties develop.

2572
02:40:00,640 --> 02:40:01,640
 So really, Westgate--

2573
02:40:01,640 --> 02:40:02,640
 Really?

2574
02:40:02,640 --> 02:40:07,400
 So the school and the PD could be and will be developed, and there's that connection

2575
02:40:07,400 --> 02:40:10,440
 to the Stonehill Crossing and Bonnie Bray.

2576
02:40:10,440 --> 02:40:11,440
 There wouldn't be a connection.

2577
02:40:11,440 --> 02:40:14,580
 There'd be stub outs, but it'd be closed off.

2578
02:40:14,580 --> 02:40:16,320
 It could be, yes.

2579
02:40:16,320 --> 02:40:17,320
 Could be.

2580
02:40:17,320 --> 02:40:22,480
 Well, and I don't know if as part of any city projects that that would be something that

2581
02:40:22,480 --> 02:40:26,400
 would go forward, but it wouldn't be a requirement of the developer.

2582
02:40:26,400 --> 02:40:27,400
 Okay.

2583
02:40:27,400 --> 02:40:28,400
 All right.

2584
02:40:28,400 --> 02:40:29,400
 Thank you.

2585
02:40:29,400 --> 02:40:30,400
 Commissioner Beck.

2586
02:40:30,400 --> 02:40:31,400
 Thank you, Chair.

2587
02:40:31,400 --> 02:40:38,840
 You mentioned that there was going to be some tree preservation on their part, like 34 percent?

2588
02:40:38,840 --> 02:40:39,840
 Well that will be--

2589
02:40:39,840 --> 02:40:44,160
 What's that number come from?

2590
02:40:44,160 --> 02:40:49,680
 So under-- when we review these, we have to look at previous codes because the development

2591
02:40:49,680 --> 02:40:50,680
 code.

2592
02:40:50,680 --> 02:40:51,680
 Okay.

2593
02:40:51,680 --> 02:40:52,680
 Okay.

2594
02:40:52,680 --> 02:40:55,240
 So the '98 code required 15 trees per acre.

2595
02:40:55,240 --> 02:40:56,240
 Gotcha.

2596
02:40:56,240 --> 02:40:59,840
 Whether that was a preservation or whether that was planting on site, they didn't-- it

2597
02:40:59,840 --> 02:41:00,840
 wasn't prescriptive.

2598
02:41:00,840 --> 02:41:02,720
 It was just 15 trees.

2599
02:41:02,720 --> 02:41:08,560
 So just by doing the rough math, that's about 34 percent canopy.

2600
02:41:08,560 --> 02:41:13,480
 Their intent is in their open space areas is to do their tree preservation in those

2601
02:41:13,480 --> 02:41:16,040
 areas to have those tree stands.

2602
02:41:16,040 --> 02:41:22,160
 That may not get them to that 40 percent, so there will be additional plantings that

2603
02:41:22,160 --> 02:41:23,160
 they'll have to do.

2604
02:41:23,160 --> 02:41:24,160
 Well--

2605
02:41:24,160 --> 02:41:25,160
 So it's going to be a combination.

2606
02:41:25,160 --> 02:41:26,160
 And that'll be interesting.

2607
02:41:26,160 --> 02:41:28,400
 I'm sitting here looking at the aerial map and I'm wondering if there's any trees in

2608
02:41:28,400 --> 02:41:29,400
 that area.

2609
02:41:29,400 --> 02:41:35,960
 I'm not talking about any substantive area of trees that they can't preserve.

2610
02:41:35,960 --> 02:41:40,480
 It seems like they would be planning quite a bit to get to a 40 percent canopy, so.

2611
02:41:40,480 --> 02:41:43,160
 But they are assuring us they will--

2612
02:41:43,160 --> 02:41:48,080
 Well, and that would be something that would be a requirement of the plan development if

2613
02:41:48,080 --> 02:41:49,960
 it is approved as it's written.

2614
02:41:49,960 --> 02:41:50,960
 Okay.

2615
02:41:50,960 --> 02:41:51,960
 So-- okay.

2616
02:41:51,960 --> 02:41:53,680
 Well, I'll deal with it when we get down the road then.

2617
02:41:53,680 --> 02:41:54,680
 Thank you.

2618
02:41:54,680 --> 02:41:59,480
 I don't see any other questions, Julie, except I have one.

2619
02:41:59,480 --> 02:42:04,840
 Will this come back to us for a site plan, or is this PD approval, they can go break

2620
02:42:04,840 --> 02:42:05,840
 ground?

2621
02:42:05,840 --> 02:42:09,500
 Well, they would have to go-- so if it moves forward, it's approved.

2622
02:42:09,500 --> 02:42:11,920
 They would still have to plat, so you would see the plat.

2623
02:42:11,920 --> 02:42:12,920
 Okay.

2624
02:42:12,920 --> 02:42:14,480
 A preliminary and then final plat.

2625
02:42:14,480 --> 02:42:15,480
 Okay.

2626
02:42:15,480 --> 02:42:16,480
 Perfect.

2627
02:42:16,480 --> 02:42:17,480
 I don't see any other questions for you.

2628
02:42:17,480 --> 02:42:18,960
 Thank you.

2629
02:42:18,960 --> 02:42:20,120
 This is a public hearing item.

2630
02:42:20,120 --> 02:42:21,880
 Anyone wishing to speak may certainly do so.

2631
02:42:21,880 --> 02:42:25,840
 I do not have any cards on the item.

2632
02:42:25,840 --> 02:42:33,680
 If you could just state your name and address for the record.

2633
02:42:33,680 --> 02:42:34,680
 Good evening.

2634
02:42:34,680 --> 02:42:38,680
 Warren Corwin, Corwin Engineering, 200 West Belmont in Allen, Texas.

2635
02:42:38,680 --> 02:42:40,280
 I'm representing the developer.

2636
02:42:40,280 --> 02:42:42,680
 I'm the engineer working on the project.

2637
02:42:42,680 --> 02:42:47,640
 Julie did a good job of showing what we're hoping to do, but I just want to give you

2638
02:42:47,640 --> 02:42:52,960
 a quick thought process of our thinking on this property.

2639
02:42:52,960 --> 02:42:59,000
 We have a concept plan now that would allow us to do single-family, multi-family and commercial,

2640
02:42:59,000 --> 02:43:05,880
 but if you look at the area, much more appropriate for that use is north of us, because you got

2641
02:43:05,880 --> 02:43:13,440
 the loop and you got 77, so that's the appropriate place for commercial multi-family retail.

2642
02:43:13,440 --> 02:43:19,800
 So to get a buffer between the high school and that existing zoning, we felt the single

2643
02:43:19,800 --> 02:43:25,880
 family basically, the 6,000 square foot lot would be the appropriate transition.

2644
02:43:25,880 --> 02:43:32,840
 So when we first brought this project in a year ago, we had a 230 acre project that we

2645
02:43:32,840 --> 02:43:35,720
 were really excited about working on.

2646
02:43:35,720 --> 02:43:38,200
 I've been involved with this project since 2000.

2647
02:43:38,200 --> 02:43:44,080
 In 2007, we did actual engineering plans right to break ground, and you know what the economy

2648
02:43:44,080 --> 02:43:45,080
 did to that.

2649
02:43:45,080 --> 02:43:51,240
 So we got back involved, like I say, last November, three weeks after we make a submittal

2650
02:43:51,240 --> 02:43:56,200
 to the city, we get the curve ball from the school district where they want two-thirds

2651
02:43:56,200 --> 02:43:57,200
 of the project.

2652
02:43:57,200 --> 02:44:01,800
 So this 78 acres is what we're left with.

2653
02:44:01,800 --> 02:44:05,360
 We're not really, I don't want to say we're burdened, but we have all the open space and

2654
02:44:05,360 --> 02:44:11,080
 we have to deal with the thoroughfare that's going through us, so you know, this is our

2655
02:44:11,080 --> 02:44:17,780
 thinking of what works, we feel works best for the project, does for that piece of land

2656
02:44:17,780 --> 02:44:20,840
 that was left from the school in our piece north.

2657
02:44:20,840 --> 02:44:24,840
 So I'd be happy to answer any questions, but that's where we're at.

2658
02:44:24,840 --> 02:44:25,840
 I appreciate you being here.

2659
02:44:25,840 --> 02:44:26,840
 We do have a couple of questions.

2660
02:44:26,840 --> 02:44:27,840
 Commissioner Beck.

2661
02:44:27,840 --> 02:44:28,840
 Thank you, Chair.

2662
02:44:28,840 --> 02:44:32,360
 Mr. Corwin, thank you for your presentation.

2663
02:44:32,360 --> 02:44:38,040
 On the secondary arterial that's going to go through there, Julie explained, I think

2664
02:44:38,040 --> 02:44:43,320
 you're going to be responsible for that part of it on your side of the road and the school

2665
02:44:43,320 --> 02:44:44,320
 on the other part.

2666
02:44:44,320 --> 02:44:45,320
 Yes.

2667
02:44:45,320 --> 02:44:46,320
 Are you working with them?

2668
02:44:46,320 --> 02:44:47,320
 With the school?

2669
02:44:47,320 --> 02:44:48,320
 Yes.

2670
02:44:48,320 --> 02:44:49,320
 Oh, yeah.

2671
02:44:49,320 --> 02:44:50,320
 We've had several meetings.

2672
02:44:50,320 --> 02:44:51,320
 Okay.

2673
02:44:51,320 --> 02:44:52,320
 Where it'll all be developed in one fell swoop.

2674
02:44:52,320 --> 02:44:54,720
 Well, I don't know about that.

2675
02:44:54,720 --> 02:45:00,120
 We will develop, we'll build what we plant against initially.

2676
02:45:00,120 --> 02:45:06,400
 Now, where the conversation goes with the school and us as far as working together to

2677
02:45:06,400 --> 02:45:11,960
 build it all at one time, sometimes it's difficult for us to build a private road.

2678
02:45:11,960 --> 02:45:14,640
 Ours is private, but we have private money.

2679
02:45:14,640 --> 02:45:16,160
 Theirs is public money.

2680
02:45:16,160 --> 02:45:22,640
 So the way you bid projects and build with private public money may create the situation

2681
02:45:22,640 --> 02:45:25,200
 where we just have to work that out.

2682
02:45:25,200 --> 02:45:26,200
 Okay.

2683
02:45:26,200 --> 02:45:31,040
 Just a question and concern I had, you're looking at a minimum of 6,000 square foot

2684
02:45:31,040 --> 02:45:32,040
 lots.

2685
02:45:32,040 --> 02:45:33,040
 Correct.

2686
02:45:33,040 --> 02:45:34,040
 Is that right?

2687
02:45:34,040 --> 02:45:38,640
 Can you give us an idea, a range of the housing square footages you're looking at from smallest

2688
02:45:38,640 --> 02:45:39,640
 to largest?

2689
02:45:39,640 --> 02:45:40,640
 I'm the engineer.

2690
02:45:40,640 --> 02:45:43,960
 I've got the owner here could address that better than me.

2691
02:45:43,960 --> 02:45:44,960
 Okay.

2692
02:45:44,960 --> 02:45:47,440
 Because I was curious about pricing too, if you want to dare that.

2693
02:45:47,440 --> 02:45:48,440
 I don't dare to.

2694
02:45:48,440 --> 02:45:49,440
 Yeah.

2695
02:45:49,440 --> 02:45:51,920
 I stick with what I think I know how to do.

2696
02:45:51,920 --> 02:45:53,160
 Just always curious about that.

2697
02:45:53,160 --> 02:45:59,160
 Mr. Smith, can we finish questioning this individual and then just so we have ...

2698
02:45:59,160 --> 02:46:03,440
 If he can't answer that, then I'm through, yes.

2699
02:46:03,440 --> 02:46:06,560
 We'll put this gentleman on standby to come up, but Mr. Smith, you have a question.

2700
02:46:06,560 --> 02:46:07,560
 Yep.

2701
02:46:07,560 --> 02:46:08,560
 Let's do that.

2702
02:46:08,560 --> 02:46:11,120
 Just to add on to that, the average square footage is one of the questions I had, then

2703
02:46:11,120 --> 02:46:15,520
 average house price whenever you guys build was a question I was going to have as well.

2704
02:46:15,520 --> 02:46:20,120
 The only thing I really had a question of is that I know from asking about the Westgate

2705
02:46:20,120 --> 02:46:26,840
 connection, the only reason I had for asking about that was the connection to 35 and just

2706
02:46:26,840 --> 02:46:34,000
 knowing that that then creates an inclination to go that way, but you guys have no plans

2707
02:46:34,000 --> 02:46:35,000
 to do that.

2708
02:46:35,000 --> 02:46:36,000
 It's not even on your land.

2709
02:46:36,000 --> 02:46:37,000
 It's not even part of your development.

2710
02:46:37,000 --> 02:46:40,840
 It's going to be close, but it won't be a connecting there.

2711
02:46:40,840 --> 02:46:44,040
 I was going to ask about neighborhood meeting and actually reaching out to the businesses

2712
02:46:44,040 --> 02:46:47,920
 at Stonehill Crossing, but I don't think that happened.

2713
02:46:47,920 --> 02:46:50,960
 Yeah, we're addressing our piece.

2714
02:46:50,960 --> 02:46:51,960
 That's it.

2715
02:46:51,960 --> 02:46:52,960
 That's fine.

2716
02:46:52,960 --> 02:46:55,040
 Yeah, just the average price is all I have, so if you want to come ...

2717
02:46:55,040 --> 02:46:59,400
 Commissioner Becker, will you restate your question and then whoever on your team is

2718
02:46:59,400 --> 02:47:01,400
 best prepared to answer?

2719
02:47:01,400 --> 02:47:02,400
 Yes.

2720
02:47:02,400 --> 02:47:05,960
 Along with Commissioner Smith, I'm curious to what kind of square footage we're looking

2721
02:47:05,960 --> 02:47:10,600
 at that range from smallest to largest, along with pricing of your houses.

2722
02:47:10,600 --> 02:47:13,200
 If you could just state your name and address for the record.

2723
02:47:13,200 --> 02:47:14,200
 Yes.

2724
02:47:14,200 --> 02:47:19,760
 My question was since you're an American, 1800 Valley View, Suite 300, Farmer's Branch,

2725
02:47:19,760 --> 02:47:21,520
 75234.

2726
02:47:21,520 --> 02:47:30,320
 The square footage of the home should be between like 1700 and 3000, and the price point on

2727
02:47:30,320 --> 02:47:37,600
 the home should be starting in the 270s and go to the 330s, 340s, something like that.

2728
02:47:37,600 --> 02:47:38,600
 Okay.

2729
02:47:38,600 --> 02:47:39,600
 Great.

2730
02:47:39,600 --> 02:47:40,600
 Thank you.

2731
02:47:40,600 --> 02:47:41,600
 That's it.

2732
02:47:41,600 --> 02:47:42,600
 Thank you.

2733
02:47:42,600 --> 02:47:43,600
 That's all we got for you right now.

2734
02:47:43,600 --> 02:47:44,600
 Thank you.

2735
02:47:44,600 --> 02:47:45,600
 Thanks for y'all's time.

2736
02:47:45,600 --> 02:47:46,920
 Thanks for being here.

2737
02:47:46,920 --> 02:47:47,920
 This is a public hearing.

2738
02:47:47,920 --> 02:47:50,240
 Anyone wishing to speak may certainly do so.

2739
02:47:50,240 --> 02:47:54,360
 For the individuals who did speak, we would ask if you fill in a card just for our records,

2740
02:47:54,360 --> 02:47:58,040
 that'd be helpful if you get a chance.

2741
02:47:58,040 --> 02:48:01,960
 I do not see any other individuals wishing to speak, so I'm going to go ahead and close

2742
02:48:01,960 --> 02:48:05,920
 the public hearing and open to the dais discussion or motion.

2743
02:48:05,920 --> 02:48:06,920
 Commissioner Pernitta.

2744
02:48:06,920 --> 02:48:07,920
 Motion to approve.

2745
02:48:07,920 --> 02:48:08,920
 Commissioner.

2746
02:48:08,920 --> 02:48:09,920
 Motion to approve.

2747
02:48:09,920 --> 02:48:10,920
 Commissioner Cole.

2748
02:48:10,920 --> 02:48:11,920
 Second.

2749
02:48:11,920 --> 02:48:16,160
 We have a first and a second.

2750
02:48:16,160 --> 02:48:20,960
 Any discussion?

2751
02:48:20,960 --> 02:48:26,100
 Is Commissioner Pernitta, are you recommending approval with staff recommendations?

2752
02:48:26,100 --> 02:48:27,100
 That is correct.

2753
02:48:27,100 --> 02:48:28,100
 Yes.

2754
02:48:28,100 --> 02:48:29,480
 Yes, I'm seconding that.

2755
02:48:29,480 --> 02:48:30,480
 Perfect.

2756
02:48:30,480 --> 02:48:31,480
 Thank you for that clarification.

2757
02:48:31,480 --> 02:48:39,080
 Seeing no discussion, I will call for a motion on the board.

2758
02:48:39,080 --> 02:48:53,680
 Motion carries, 7-0, congratulations.

2759
02:48:53,680 --> 02:49:01,200
 Next on the agenda is item FZ18-0008.

2760
02:49:01,200 --> 02:49:05,960
 I will open the public hearing and call Cindy Jackson for presentation.

2761
02:49:05,960 --> 02:49:28,340
 Thank you, Chairman, commissioners.

2762
02:49:28,340 --> 02:49:35,920
 This is a request for zoning change from neighborhood residential mixed use 12 and RMU 12 to new

2763
02:49:35,920 --> 02:49:39,920
 neighborhood residential mixed use NRMU.

2764
02:49:39,920 --> 02:49:47,120
 The 2.411 acre site is located on south side of Elm Street across from Joyce.

2765
02:49:47,120 --> 02:49:57,120
 Oh, I'm sorry, I brought the wrong one down.

2766
02:49:57,120 --> 02:50:14,960
 Let me go up and get my right notes.

2767
02:50:14,960 --> 02:50:34,800
 I apologize.

2768
02:50:34,800 --> 02:50:40,020
 This is a request to rezone from NRMU 12 to NRMU.

2769
02:50:40,020 --> 02:50:45,940
 As you can see on the current zoning map right here, the site as it's currently situated

2770
02:50:45,940 --> 02:50:52,720
 surrounded by NRMU 12 on all sides except the north.

2771
02:50:52,720 --> 02:51:00,240
 If this is approved, the NRMU would be an extension of the NRMU which is located to

2772
02:51:00,240 --> 02:51:05,280
 the north across Elm Street.

2773
02:51:05,280 --> 02:51:16,120
 This is a request that the applicant is requesting to rezone to NRMU in order to construct a

2774
02:51:16,120 --> 02:51:25,200
 multi-family development consisting of approximately 71 units at a density of 29.4 dwelling units

2775
02:51:25,200 --> 02:51:27,040
 per acre.

2776
02:51:27,040 --> 02:51:30,720
 This is a concept plan that the applicant has provided.

2777
02:51:30,720 --> 02:51:33,880
 I would like to point out that this is just a concept plan.

2778
02:51:33,880 --> 02:51:36,320
 It hasn't gone through review.

2779
02:51:36,320 --> 02:51:42,760
 If this is approved, the next step would be for a specific use permit for multi-family.

2780
02:51:42,760 --> 02:51:51,040
 At that point, we'll be able to work on the details of the site design more.

2781
02:51:51,040 --> 02:51:58,920
 The criteria for approval of a zoning request according to 3534B, does the request conform

2782
02:51:58,920 --> 02:52:05,320
 to the future land use plan and is there adequate provision of transportation, water, sewer,

2783
02:52:05,320 --> 02:52:08,800
 parks, public services if the request is granted?

2784
02:52:08,800 --> 02:52:13,920
 First, we're going to look at the future land use designation.

2785
02:52:13,920 --> 02:52:17,800
 The site is designated neighborhood mixed use.

2786
02:52:17,800 --> 02:52:24,080
 As you can see here, the intent of neighborhood mixed use is applied to areas of Denton which

2787
02:52:24,080 --> 02:52:29,060
 are primarily residential, but where a mix of housing types along with retail and service

2788
02:52:29,060 --> 02:52:36,200
 uses that would support the surrounding neighborhoods are encouraged, recommends moderate to high

2789
02:52:36,200 --> 02:52:38,500
 density residential.

2790
02:52:38,500 --> 02:52:44,120
 The types and uses of scaled and of development, which is permitted in the NRMU district, which

2791
02:52:44,120 --> 02:52:51,280
 is requested, conforms to the goals of the neighborhood mixed use designation.

2792
02:52:51,280 --> 02:52:58,120
 In compatibility, the requested NRMU district, as mentioned earlier, is a continuation of

2793
02:52:58,120 --> 02:53:02,760
 the NRMU district located to the north of the site, as can be seen here.

2794
02:53:02,760 --> 02:53:07,200
 The proposed NRMU zoning district is compatible with the goals and objectives outlined in

2795
02:53:07,200 --> 02:53:11,080
 the Denton plan 2020-30.

2796
02:53:11,080 --> 02:53:15,920
 It is the most intensive of the neighborhood residential districts and permits a variety

2797
02:53:15,920 --> 02:53:23,400
 of commercial, institutional, and moderate to high density residential uses.

2798
02:53:23,400 --> 02:53:29,560
 In order, another test is whether or not there's infrastructure available for the site.

2799
02:53:29,560 --> 02:53:40,300
 The applicant has stated that they propose to bore along underneath Elm Street to provide

2800
02:53:40,300 --> 02:53:42,640
 water and sewer to the site.

2801
02:53:42,640 --> 02:53:48,780
 There is, I believe, there's some utilities that are located along Windsor, but they would

2802
02:53:48,780 --> 02:53:59,440
 have to try to get the needed easements to get the utility to the site.

2803
02:53:59,440 --> 02:54:05,600
 North Elm Street is designated as a primary arterial with 135 feet of right of way.

2804
02:54:05,600 --> 02:54:09,280
 It's currently developed as four lane divided.

2805
02:54:09,280 --> 02:54:14,640
 At the time of platting, if any right of way is required to ensure that it will meet the

2806
02:54:14,640 --> 02:54:22,720
 ultimate right of way requirement, they will be required at that time.

2807
02:54:22,720 --> 02:54:27,000
 The NRMU district permits a mix of housing types and densities and is consistent with

2808
02:54:27,000 --> 02:54:29,000
 the future land use element.

2809
02:54:29,000 --> 02:54:34,280
 The NRMU district permits a maximum of 30 dwelling units per acre, and that's also

2810
02:54:34,280 --> 02:54:36,840
 consistent with the future land use element.

2811
02:54:36,840 --> 02:54:41,400
 The proposed NRMU district provides a transition between the established single family neighborhoods

2812
02:54:41,400 --> 02:54:48,800
 to the south on the south side of Windsor, and potential mixed use or commercial areas

2813
02:54:48,800 --> 02:54:53,720
 which may be located along North Elm in the future.

2814
02:54:53,720 --> 02:54:58,960
 The existing land uses surrounding the site include a single family residence, a church,

2815
02:54:58,960 --> 02:55:02,840
 a regional drainage facility, and undeveloped land.

2816
02:55:02,840 --> 02:55:08,960
 The subject site is located on the south side of North Elm, approximately 1.65 miles southeast

2817
02:55:08,960 --> 02:55:11,480
 of Loop 288.

2818
02:55:11,480 --> 02:55:16,880
 Development must comply with all ESA, tree preservation, buffer screening, tree canopy

2819
02:55:16,880 --> 02:55:23,240
 and lighting requirements, and extension of both water and wastewater, as I mentioned

2820
02:55:23,240 --> 02:55:26,120
 earlier, would be required.

2821
02:55:26,120 --> 02:55:29,960
 Public notices were sent out as well as courtesy notices.

2822
02:55:29,960 --> 02:55:34,760
 I handed the responses out to you during the work session.

2823
02:55:34,760 --> 02:55:38,040
 Received them all within the past two days.

2824
02:55:38,040 --> 02:55:45,120
 We have received enough responses from property owners within 200 feet of the site to require

2825
02:55:45,120 --> 02:55:48,200
 a supermajority vote of the city council.

2826
02:55:48,200 --> 02:55:57,760
 40% of the land area within 200 feet of the site, property owners are in opposition.

2827
02:55:57,760 --> 02:55:59,280
 Received one in favor.

2828
02:55:59,280 --> 02:56:04,200
 That represents 4% of the land, and one sign was posted on the site.

2829
02:56:04,200 --> 02:56:12,320
 The applicant did hold a neighborhood meeting last night to which 14 people attended.

2830
02:56:12,320 --> 02:56:15,680
 The applicant will discuss that further in his presentation.

2831
02:56:15,680 --> 02:56:22,120
 I did go over briefly what was discussed during the work session.

2832
02:56:22,120 --> 02:56:26,360
 Staff recommends approval of this request as it is compatible with the surrounding property

2833
02:56:26,360 --> 02:56:31,560
 and it is consistent with the goals and objectives of the Denton Plan 2030, and that would conclude

2834
02:56:31,560 --> 02:56:33,480
 my presentation.

2835
02:56:33,480 --> 02:56:36,120
 The applicant is present.

2836
02:56:36,120 --> 02:56:37,120
 Thank you, Cindy.

2837
02:56:37,120 --> 02:56:38,800
 We do have a question for you, Mr. Beck.

2838
02:56:38,800 --> 02:56:39,800
 Thank you, Chair.

2839
02:56:39,800 --> 02:56:42,840
 Cindy, did you mention the analysis, the TRIP analysis?

2840
02:56:42,840 --> 02:56:46,280
 I know you did in the work session, but did you do that here publicly?

2841
02:56:46,280 --> 02:56:47,280
 I did not.

2842
02:56:47,280 --> 02:56:48,280
 Thank you.

2843
02:56:48,280 --> 02:56:49,280
 I did not.

2844
02:56:49,280 --> 02:56:57,080
 Did you do the I.T.E. TRIP analysis?

2845
02:56:57,080 --> 02:56:58,080
 Let's see.

2846
02:56:58,080 --> 02:57:01,480
 Sorry, I've got to find it.

2847
02:57:01,480 --> 02:57:11,000
 I kind of went off instead of following my script.

2848
02:57:11,000 --> 02:57:16,320
 Here it is.

2849
02:57:16,320 --> 02:57:21,520
 Based on the number of units, which is 71, the proposed development is expected to generate

2850
02:57:21,520 --> 02:57:28,840
 approximately 468 daily trips with a P.M. peak total of 41 trips per the eighth edition

2851
02:57:28,840 --> 02:57:32,360
 of the I.T.E. TRIP generation report.

2852
02:57:32,360 --> 02:57:33,360
 Okay.

2853
02:57:33,360 --> 02:57:40,200
 So, it's going to -- there's going to be 460 more vehicles traveling up and down Almore

2854
02:57:40,200 --> 02:57:41,200
 Island.

2855
02:57:41,200 --> 02:57:42,200
 That's correct.

2856
02:57:42,200 --> 02:57:43,200
 What was the 71?

2857
02:57:43,200 --> 02:57:45,760
 71 is the number of units proposed.

2858
02:57:45,760 --> 02:57:46,760
 Okay.

2859
02:57:46,760 --> 02:57:47,760
 But there was another number.

2860
02:57:47,760 --> 02:57:48,760
 I'm sorry.

2861
02:57:48,760 --> 02:57:49,760
 There -- 41?

2862
02:57:49,760 --> 02:57:50,760
 Yes.

2863
02:57:50,760 --> 02:57:51,760
 Right.

2864
02:57:51,760 --> 02:57:54,760
 A P.M. peak total of 41 trips.

2865
02:57:54,760 --> 02:57:57,240
 That's an increased number compared to --

2866
02:57:57,240 --> 02:57:58,240
 No.

2867
02:57:58,240 --> 02:57:59,240
 It's just 41 trips.

2868
02:57:59,240 --> 02:58:06,480
 P.M. peak total of 41 trips will be generated by the site if it is developed with 71 units.

2869
02:58:06,480 --> 02:58:07,480
 Okay.

2870
02:58:07,480 --> 02:58:09,440
 P.M. being from 12 noon to midnight?

2871
02:58:09,440 --> 02:58:10,440
 Rush hour.

2872
02:58:10,440 --> 02:58:11,440
 Rush hour.

2873
02:58:11,440 --> 02:58:12,440
 Got you.

2874
02:58:12,440 --> 02:58:13,440
 Okay.

2875
02:58:13,440 --> 02:58:14,440
 Thank you.

2876
02:58:14,440 --> 02:58:15,440
 We do have a couple more questions.

2877
02:58:15,440 --> 02:58:23,440
 Elm Street is what kind of road -- I think you called it a main arterial?

2878
02:58:23,440 --> 02:58:24,440
 Yes.

2879
02:58:24,440 --> 02:58:25,440
 It's a primary arterial.

2880
02:58:25,440 --> 02:58:26,440
 Primary arterial.

2881
02:58:26,440 --> 02:58:31,520
 Now, what kind of businesses go on a primary arterial and what kind of -- how -- what kind

2882
02:58:31,520 --> 02:58:35,760
 of planning do we look at when we look at --

2883
02:58:35,760 --> 02:58:41,520
 Well, what we look at when we're looking at locating businesses, you want -- large traffic

2884
02:58:41,520 --> 02:58:47,280
 generators should be along an arterial so that they have instant access, immediate access

2885
02:58:47,280 --> 02:58:52,200
 to the arterial and they won't clog up the collector streets, our neighborhood streets.

2886
02:58:52,200 --> 02:58:55,320
 So basically traffic generators.

2887
02:58:55,320 --> 02:58:56,320
 Okay.

2888
02:58:56,320 --> 02:59:04,840
 Something that is -- would not be sensitive to the traffic and noise of being close to

2889
02:59:04,840 --> 02:59:06,560
 an arterial.

2890
02:59:06,560 --> 02:59:11,560
 So primarily you're looking at probably businesses or multi-family kind of thing rather than

2891
02:59:11,560 --> 02:59:12,760
 single residential?

2892
02:59:12,760 --> 02:59:13,760
 That's correct.

2893
02:59:13,760 --> 02:59:14,760
 Okay.

2894
02:59:14,760 --> 02:59:15,760
 Christian Pernetta.

2895
02:59:15,760 --> 02:59:16,760
 Yeah.

2896
02:59:16,760 --> 02:59:23,280
 I just wanted to kind of get a gauge of the responses that you've got.

2897
02:59:23,280 --> 02:59:26,520
 So if you could go back to the aerial of --

2898
02:59:26,520 --> 02:59:27,520
 This?

2899
02:59:27,520 --> 02:59:28,520
 Okay.

2900
02:59:28,520 --> 02:59:29,520
 Yes.

2901
02:59:29,520 --> 02:59:30,520
 Right there.

2902
02:59:30,520 --> 02:59:34,960
 So when I look at the -- when I zoom in on the map and everything, you know, obviously

2903
02:59:34,960 --> 02:59:40,200
 to the -- to the slight southwest we have the church and then on the southwest corner

2904
02:59:40,200 --> 02:59:42,160
 I do see a house.

2905
02:59:42,160 --> 02:59:47,560
 The properties immediately to the south and then I guess to the east of those.

2906
02:59:47,560 --> 02:59:48,560
 Are there --

2907
02:59:48,560 --> 02:59:49,560
 Here?

2908
02:59:49,560 --> 02:59:50,560
 Yes.

2909
02:59:50,560 --> 02:59:51,560
 Are there houses there?

2910
02:59:51,560 --> 02:59:54,720
 Because I can't see them in the map.

2911
02:59:54,720 --> 02:59:56,680
 I couldn't see any houses on there.

2912
02:59:56,680 --> 03:00:01,400
 I know this property owner lives -- this property owner lives here.

2913
03:00:01,400 --> 03:00:02,400
 I don't believe this.

2914
03:00:02,400 --> 03:00:03,560
 This is not developed.

2915
03:00:03,560 --> 03:00:06,640
 Coming to the DCAD, these are not developed sites.

2916
03:00:06,640 --> 03:00:07,640
 Okay.

2917
03:00:07,640 --> 03:00:09,000
 These three are not developed sites.

2918
03:00:09,000 --> 03:00:10,000
 Okay.

2919
03:00:10,000 --> 03:00:11,000
 Yeah, because I see one just outside that.

2920
03:00:11,000 --> 03:00:15,520
 I just wanted to make sure that in those little plots there -- yeah, I didn't see it on the

2921
03:00:15,520 --> 03:00:16,520
 aerial.

2922
03:00:16,520 --> 03:00:18,840
 Well, I'm pretty sure the property owners are here tonight, so they could clarify for

2923
03:00:18,840 --> 03:00:19,840
 you when they come up.

2924
03:00:19,840 --> 03:00:20,840
 All right.

2925
03:00:20,840 --> 03:00:21,840
 Thank you.

2926
03:00:21,840 --> 03:00:26,600
 So now I don't see any other questions.

2927
03:00:26,600 --> 03:00:27,600
 Okay.

2928
03:00:27,600 --> 03:00:29,600
 Thank you for your presentation.

2929
03:00:29,600 --> 03:00:30,600
 This is a public hearing.

2930
03:00:30,600 --> 03:00:32,440
 And we do have several cards.

2931
03:00:32,440 --> 03:00:38,720
 So if you are wishing to speak, we'd ask that you fill out a card, or when we run out, you're

2932
03:00:38,720 --> 03:00:41,280
 more than welcome just to walk down and introduce yourself.

2933
03:00:41,280 --> 03:00:44,680
 But before we begin that, I believe the applicant is here.

2934
03:00:44,680 --> 03:00:45,680
 Is the applicant here?

2935
03:00:45,680 --> 03:00:52,120
 Would you like to come down, and if you have a presentation or stand for questions?

2936
03:00:52,120 --> 03:00:59,560
 I'm sorry, I don't have a card for you.

2937
03:00:59,560 --> 03:01:01,920
 Can you just state your name and address?

2938
03:01:01,920 --> 03:01:02,920
 My name is Craig Bond.

2939
03:01:02,920 --> 03:01:05,720
 I live at 1107 Woodmount Court here in Denton.

2940
03:01:05,720 --> 03:01:13,160
 And I work for KJE, we're the silver firm that put together the rezoning application

2941
03:01:13,160 --> 03:01:15,240
 for the client.

2942
03:01:15,240 --> 03:01:25,680
 And as Cindy said, the site, you know, meets the requirements to be able to apply for rezoning.

2943
03:01:25,680 --> 03:01:29,640
 And so I thought probably the best thing for me to do is just -- we had the public meeting

2944
03:01:29,640 --> 03:01:35,480
 last night is kind of go through the comments that everybody had that showed up.

2945
03:01:35,480 --> 03:01:38,960
 I sent these to Cindy this morning so she could kind of review them as well.

2946
03:01:38,960 --> 03:01:47,280
 Of course, the first concern was that we were going from NRMU 12 to NRMU, which goes from

2947
03:01:47,280 --> 03:01:50,880
 12 units per acre to 30 units per acre.

2948
03:01:50,880 --> 03:01:58,840
 And you know, I understand people having a concern about this, but out of all the property

2949
03:01:58,840 --> 03:02:05,400
 around us, most of it is vacant except for there's one house where one of the residents

2950
03:02:05,400 --> 03:02:09,040
 lives over there next to the family dollar store and then the other residence is over

2951
03:02:09,040 --> 03:02:10,440
 next to the church.

2952
03:02:10,440 --> 03:02:13,280
 So all the rest of the land around it is vacant.

2953
03:02:13,280 --> 03:02:19,280
 And I'm sure that those landowners plan on developing that at some point.

2954
03:02:19,280 --> 03:02:25,520
 Now on our site plan, we had I think 107 parking spaces and we didn't have any visitors parking.

2955
03:02:25,520 --> 03:02:31,560
 So we're probably going to have to remove about four units to make room for that additional

2956
03:02:31,560 --> 03:02:32,560
 parking space.

2957
03:02:32,560 --> 03:02:37,680
 And so the count per acre will go down a little bit, not a whole lot, but we'll have to make

2958
03:02:37,680 --> 03:02:41,200
 room for the guest parking.

2959
03:02:41,200 --> 03:02:45,800
 I think in May is when they passed the new ordinance that required, you know, the guest

2960
03:02:45,800 --> 03:02:48,720
 parking, I think 10% of the total parking count.

2961
03:02:48,720 --> 03:02:54,000
 So we'll have to include that.

2962
03:02:54,000 --> 03:02:59,120
 One of the residents, Mrs. Dean, she was concerned about safety and her house is the one down

2963
03:02:59,120 --> 03:03:01,240
 there by the Dollar General store.

2964
03:03:01,240 --> 03:03:06,520
 And in her complaint, she was saying that a lot of people would cross through her property

2965
03:03:06,520 --> 03:03:08,160
 to get to the Dollar General.

2966
03:03:08,160 --> 03:03:13,400
 And one thing we can do is we can put a fence, you know, around the south, east and west

2967
03:03:13,400 --> 03:03:18,480
 side to and that would encourage people to go out to Elm Street and then walk down the

2968
03:03:18,480 --> 03:03:21,320
 street to the family dollar instead of cutting across.

2969
03:03:21,320 --> 03:03:25,580
 So I think that might help, you know, alleviate that problem.

2970
03:03:25,580 --> 03:03:36,400
 And there were several questions about the cost of the -- or let's see, how did I put

2971
03:03:36,400 --> 03:03:37,400
 that?

2972
03:03:37,400 --> 03:03:38,400
 Let's see.

2973
03:03:38,400 --> 03:03:42,680
 I think we introduced the project as more affordable housing as opposed to somebody

2974
03:03:42,680 --> 03:03:45,040
 having to rent a single family home.

2975
03:03:45,040 --> 03:03:48,040
 And there was some misconception for a little while that we were trying to put in Section

2976
03:03:48,040 --> 03:03:53,280
 8 housing and we reiterated several times that it's not Section 8, it's just multi-family,

2977
03:03:53,280 --> 03:03:56,860
 which is going to be cheaper than having to go out and rent single family.

2978
03:03:56,860 --> 03:04:02,200
 And from what I understand, the City of Denton still has a shortage of apartments or student

2979
03:04:02,200 --> 03:04:10,220
 housing and so it makes sense for the project to proceed.

2980
03:04:10,220 --> 03:04:20,200
 And now there was some concern about the traffic or actually there was several of the people

2981
03:04:20,200 --> 03:04:23,000
 mentioned that they were concerned about the traffic in the area.

2982
03:04:23,000 --> 03:04:26,760
 They mentioned the UNT Engineering Center and then they also mentioned that there's

2983
03:04:26,760 --> 03:04:29,880
 probably going to be some additional traffic from Denton High School that's going to go

2984
03:04:29,880 --> 03:04:31,780
 up not too far away.

2985
03:04:31,780 --> 03:04:36,640
 And I didn't really know what to tell them about that other than it's a four-lane arterial,

2986
03:04:36,640 --> 03:04:40,400
 it can handle lots of traffic, and I think as these other developments occur, the city

2987
03:04:40,400 --> 03:04:42,880
 is probably going to have to look at putting in some signals along there.

2988
03:04:42,880 --> 03:04:50,360
 So I think at some point that will be taken care of and our client can't really do too

2989
03:04:50,360 --> 03:04:51,360
 much about that.

2990
03:04:51,360 --> 03:04:56,680
 So there's going to have to be participation from the city for traffic calming and stuff

2991
03:04:56,680 --> 03:04:59,120
 in the area.

2992
03:04:59,120 --> 03:05:02,520
 And of course, they had questions about the water and sewer and like Cindy said, there's

2993
03:05:02,520 --> 03:05:06,920
 existing water and sewer on the north side, so we're going to propose boring underneath

2994
03:05:06,920 --> 03:05:08,880
 the road to bring water and sewer.

2995
03:05:08,880 --> 03:05:14,320
 And we also pointed out that for future development, for the other folks there, this is going to

2996
03:05:14,320 --> 03:05:19,240
 be to their benefit because our client is going to incur the cost of the bores and extending

2997
03:05:19,240 --> 03:05:27,320
 that water and sewer to the south side of Elm Street, so that's going to benefit everybody.

2998
03:05:27,320 --> 03:05:34,000
 And the other thing I wanted to point out too is everybody was, a lot of folks were

2999
03:05:34,000 --> 03:05:41,020
 opposed to the higher density, but our client, he did his own study and for his project to

3000
03:05:41,020 --> 03:05:46,600
 make a go of things, 12 units per acre isn't going to, the math isn't going to work out,

3001
03:05:46,600 --> 03:05:51,280
 so he's going to have to increase that to make the math work out, otherwise the construction

3002
03:05:51,280 --> 03:05:55,040
 costs, the project won't work for him.

3003
03:05:55,040 --> 03:06:00,840
 So that's why we, that's why he wants to rezone it.

3004
03:06:00,840 --> 03:06:08,520
 And I think I've addressed most of the comments there that people had, so if you all have

3005
03:06:08,520 --> 03:06:10,560
 any questions, we're glad to answer.

3006
03:06:10,560 --> 03:06:12,920
 I appreciate you being here and for speaking.

3007
03:06:12,920 --> 03:06:14,300
 We do have a couple of questions.

3008
03:06:14,300 --> 03:06:17,920
 I think it might be prudent to remind the commission that we are only looking at a rezone

3009
03:06:17,920 --> 03:06:23,280
 case tonight, so density, land use, those type things, specifics of parking and engineering

3010
03:06:23,280 --> 03:06:28,880
 questions and those things would certainly come before us at an SUP case.

3011
03:06:28,880 --> 03:06:33,840
 But if we could stay focused on a rezone case tonight, as tempting as it is to get into

3012
03:06:33,840 --> 03:06:37,320
 a concept plan, I think that'd be productive for the discussion.

3013
03:06:37,320 --> 03:06:38,320
 With that being said, Commissioner Smith.

3014
03:06:38,320 --> 03:06:39,320
 Thank you, Chair.

3015
03:06:39,320 --> 03:06:44,960
 I know you said, Mr. Bond, I know you said that the owner did his own study and his own

3016
03:06:44,960 --> 03:06:50,280
 maths to get down to that a 12 unit per acre was not financially viable, and so that's

3017
03:06:50,280 --> 03:06:55,160
 actually one of my first questions I have for you, is why not a 12, why not keeping

3018
03:06:55,160 --> 03:06:57,640
 within RME 12 and stick it to 12 units per acre?

3019
03:06:57,640 --> 03:07:03,720
 I mean, on the acreage you have, you can get to 28.9 is where the math works out, so basically

3020
03:07:03,720 --> 03:07:09,720
 28, too bad Cindy Jackson won't let you bump up to 29, but 28 units out there, do you as

3021
03:07:09,720 --> 03:07:17,380
 an engineer, would you agree with the owner then, with your client, that at 28 units there's

3022
03:07:17,380 --> 03:07:24,200
 no way to financially make that viable to be able to build a 12 unit per acre site?

3023
03:07:24,200 --> 03:07:27,840
 We don't get into the cost that much, but we've had several clients on other projects

3024
03:07:27,840 --> 03:07:33,440
 that they've had to kill the project because they couldn't get the density that they needed.

3025
03:07:33,440 --> 03:07:34,440
 Okay.

3026
03:07:34,440 --> 03:07:42,760
 I find it hard to believe, to be honest, that there are sites I feel like around Denton

3027
03:07:42,760 --> 03:07:48,060
 that have that density and make that financially viable, we've seen that come before us, and

3028
03:07:48,060 --> 03:07:53,840
 I just feel like it could be done, to be honest with you, but that's just a question.

3029
03:07:53,840 --> 03:07:58,240
 And then I guess the other one was, this is just a zoning case, and Commissioner Rozelle,

3030
03:07:58,240 --> 03:08:03,060
 our Chair Rozelle brought it up in a work session about, usually we see that the zoning

3031
03:08:03,060 --> 03:08:07,240
 and the SCP, when it is going to be an SCP case, we see them come together.

3032
03:08:07,240 --> 03:08:12,680
 And so the SCP wasn't done, and as Ms. Jackson mentioned, a lot of that was because, you

3033
03:08:12,680 --> 03:08:16,280
 guys hadn't gotten into the engineering conversation yet, could you give us some clarity why?

3034
03:08:16,280 --> 03:08:20,600
 Was it just timing, you know, the project came on too quickly to get the engineering

3035
03:08:20,600 --> 03:08:25,440
 started, to be able to warrant the SCP, or waiting to see if the zoning passes first,

3036
03:08:25,440 --> 03:08:28,480
 be able to spend the money and the time on the engineering to get to the SCP?

3037
03:08:28,480 --> 03:08:31,000
 Any clarity you can give there, I appreciate it.

3038
03:08:31,000 --> 03:08:34,720
 Yeah, I think it may have been a little of what you just said, that they wanted to make

3039
03:08:34,720 --> 03:08:39,240
 sure that they were going to be able to rezone, because, you know, in addition to what we've

3040
03:08:39,240 --> 03:08:48,560
 discussed here, we still have to talk to TxDOT, you know, about the, about the driveway entrances,

3041
03:08:48,560 --> 03:08:52,120
 and we still need to look at detention, you know, we've got to talk to TxDOT and find

3042
03:08:52,120 --> 03:08:56,160
 out if they have capacity in Elm Street, if they don't, then there's going to be detention

3043
03:08:56,160 --> 03:09:00,640
 and we're going to lose, you know, lose some units there.

3044
03:09:00,640 --> 03:09:05,880
 Yeah, so you're saying, I mean, there's obstacles past just the rezoning, that, you know, we

3045
03:09:05,880 --> 03:09:10,220
 could rezone the site for this project, but there's a lot of obstacles afterwards that

3046
03:09:10,220 --> 03:09:12,560
 could trip this project up even further.

3047
03:09:12,560 --> 03:09:18,380
 Well, it might trip up the 30 units per acre, but, you know, we'd really like to be somewhere

3048
03:09:18,380 --> 03:09:23,560
 between the 12 and 30 units per acre, you know, to make it more, you know, cost effective

3049
03:09:23,560 --> 03:09:25,560
 and stuff and make the project work.

3050
03:09:25,560 --> 03:09:26,560
 Understood.

3051
03:09:26,560 --> 03:09:27,560
 All right.

3052
03:09:27,560 --> 03:09:28,560
 Thank you.

3053
03:09:28,560 --> 03:09:29,560
 Chris Trebek.

3054
03:09:29,560 --> 03:09:30,560
 Thank you, Chair.

3055
03:09:30,560 --> 03:09:31,560
 Thank you, Mr. Bond, for your presentation.

3056
03:09:31,560 --> 03:09:42,200
 Would you be willing to work with an overlay that will keep you above the 12 but puts you

3057
03:09:42,200 --> 03:09:48,160
 down a little bit closer to something that might be more acceptable, 20 units per acre,

3058
03:09:48,160 --> 03:09:49,160
 say?

3059
03:09:49,160 --> 03:09:52,680
 I think we're going to end up having to work with less than, you know, less than 30 units

3060
03:09:52,680 --> 03:09:56,240
 just to get the parking and, you know, possibly the detention as well.

3061
03:09:56,240 --> 03:10:01,720
 About four, though, I mean, I don't think you're going to come down much, that much,

3062
03:10:01,720 --> 03:10:06,400
 so an overlay would bring you down a little bit more, but it would still keep you probably,

3063
03:10:06,400 --> 03:10:11,160
 hopefully, within the financial arena to make it cost--

3064
03:10:11,160 --> 03:10:14,360
 I mean, I wouldn't-- you know, our client would have to speak more to that than me.

3065
03:10:14,360 --> 03:10:15,360
 Okay.

3066
03:10:15,360 --> 03:10:16,360
 Is he here?

3067
03:10:16,360 --> 03:10:17,360
 Yeah, he's here.

3068
03:10:17,360 --> 03:10:18,360
 Okay.

3069
03:10:18,360 --> 03:10:19,360
 If he wants to come down.

3070
03:10:19,360 --> 03:10:22,360
 Well, is there any more-- if there's no more questions for him, then, yeah, if we could

3071
03:10:22,360 --> 03:10:23,360
 bring him down.

3072
03:10:23,360 --> 03:10:24,360
 Chair?

3073
03:10:24,360 --> 03:10:29,820
 I don't see any more questions at this time, so if you're wanting to open up a--

3074
03:10:29,820 --> 03:10:32,720
 Could we have the owner come down?

3075
03:10:32,720 --> 03:10:33,720
 The owner?

3076
03:10:33,720 --> 03:10:34,720
 Yeah.

3077
03:10:34,720 --> 03:10:37,720
 Muhammad, do you want to come down for a second?

3078
03:10:37,720 --> 03:10:41,600
 We're actually the architects here, too.

3079
03:10:41,600 --> 03:10:42,600
 He may be better.

3080
03:10:42,600 --> 03:10:43,600
 Okay.

3081
03:10:43,600 --> 03:10:48,800
 Whatever you think's best, whoever you think can answer it best, and if you'll state your

3082
03:10:48,800 --> 03:10:51,800
 name and address when you come to the mic, please.

3083
03:10:51,800 --> 03:10:58,040
 My name is Muhammad Parva, I live 3110 Hillside Drive in Highland Village.

3084
03:10:58,040 --> 03:10:59,040
 Okay.

3085
03:10:59,040 --> 03:11:05,600
 Muhammad, I guess my question to Mr. Bond was, a lot of the problem that a lot of the

3086
03:11:05,600 --> 03:11:11,320
 residents are having is the higher density that an NRMU would allow, and I was trying

3087
03:11:11,320 --> 03:11:12,600
 to seek a compromise.

3088
03:11:12,600 --> 03:11:18,720
 We could put an overlay on that area to help bring the numbers down, keep you above 12,

3089
03:11:18,720 --> 03:11:22,160
 but keep you considerably lower than 28 units per acre.

3090
03:11:22,160 --> 03:11:27,000
 Say if we got you around 20 units per acre, you think that would be manageable, financially

3091
03:11:27,000 --> 03:11:28,000
 feasible for you?

3092
03:11:28,000 --> 03:11:29,000
 Yeah, that would work.

3093
03:11:29,000 --> 03:11:30,000
 Okay.

3094
03:11:30,000 --> 03:11:34,720
 Okay, so that would be something we could consider and you would consider.

3095
03:11:34,720 --> 03:11:39,360
 So if it's 20 units per acre and he's got about 2.4, so he'd be able to get 40 plus

3096
03:11:39,360 --> 03:11:42,760
 units is what you're looking at.

3097
03:11:42,760 --> 03:11:54,000
 Okay, you don't have to make an effort to make a decision right now, Bond.

3098
03:11:54,000 --> 03:12:02,640
 When I said 20 units for work, it kind of, I didn't do the math, yeah, that's correct,

3099
03:12:02,640 --> 03:12:03,640
 it's 44 units.

3100
03:12:03,640 --> 03:12:05,840
 Yeah, because it's 2.4 acres times 48.

3101
03:12:05,840 --> 03:12:14,480
 Our math genius is up here saying you're looking at 48 units as opposed to it would have come

3102
03:12:14,480 --> 03:12:16,360
 down to 67.

3103
03:12:16,360 --> 03:12:21,400
 So that is less than, that's about almost half.

3104
03:12:21,400 --> 03:12:26,840
 So instead of rezoning, you would get an overlay, but you would have to limit it to that 48

3105
03:12:26,840 --> 03:12:27,840
 units.

3106
03:12:27,840 --> 03:12:30,880
 Well, you would get the rezone, but we'd put an overlay on it.

3107
03:12:30,880 --> 03:12:31,880
 Okay.

3108
03:12:31,880 --> 03:12:32,880
 Yeah, that would work.

3109
03:12:32,880 --> 03:12:33,880
 Will that work, 48 units?

3110
03:12:33,880 --> 03:12:34,880
 Yes.

3111
03:12:34,880 --> 03:12:35,880
 That would work.

3112
03:12:35,880 --> 03:12:36,880
 Something to consider then.

3113
03:12:36,880 --> 03:12:37,880
 Yeah.

3114
03:12:37,880 --> 03:12:38,880
 All right.

3115
03:12:38,880 --> 03:12:39,880
 Thank you.

3116
03:12:39,880 --> 03:12:40,880
 Okay.

3117
03:12:40,880 --> 03:12:41,880
 Thank you.

3118
03:12:41,880 --> 03:12:42,880
 Thanks.

3119
03:12:42,880 --> 03:12:44,000
 We have one more question for, no, not for him, for you.

3120
03:12:44,000 --> 03:12:45,000
 Okay.

3121
03:12:45,000 --> 03:12:46,000
 Sorry.

3122
03:12:46,000 --> 03:12:47,000
 Commissioner Sanchez.

3123
03:12:47,000 --> 03:12:54,800
 My concern is I guess the cost of boring under the road and have you even looked at what

3124
03:12:54,800 --> 03:12:55,800
 kind of costs you have?

3125
03:12:55,800 --> 03:13:03,200
 It seems like we're putting, you're looking at doing a, changing the zoning, but you don't,

3126
03:13:03,200 --> 03:13:07,760
 maybe you had taken the time to figure out what it's going to cost to bore that.

3127
03:13:07,760 --> 03:13:14,240
 Because I know, I know the reason I was looking at something in a project I was doing and

3128
03:13:14,240 --> 03:13:18,720
 it wasn't even close to the width of that road and the costs are astronomical.

3129
03:13:18,720 --> 03:13:23,720
 Have you looked at that before we even decide that we want to change, that it would even

3130
03:13:23,720 --> 03:13:35,160
 be a viable idea right now until maybe looking at bringing the utilities and all that on

3131
03:13:35,160 --> 03:13:37,320
 the south side of Elm Street?

3132
03:13:37,320 --> 03:13:41,240
 Well, it'd probably be about $100 per foot, 135 feet.

3133
03:13:41,240 --> 03:13:50,360
 So you're looking at 135 to 150,000 per bore, so about 300,000 for the bore probably.

3134
03:13:50,360 --> 03:13:51,360
 Yeah.

3135
03:13:51,360 --> 03:13:53,000
 And that's what I'm thinking.

3136
03:13:53,000 --> 03:13:56,920
 That's pretty steep considering everything else you're going to have to do.

3137
03:13:56,920 --> 03:14:00,760
 I think that's why he wanted to have a higher density.

3138
03:14:00,760 --> 03:14:05,320
 Okay, yeah, because it's going to be high.

3139
03:14:05,320 --> 03:14:12,280
 So I guess my concern, my biggest concern is if we change it and then you look at it,

3140
03:14:12,280 --> 03:14:16,240
 we can't do it because the costs are too expensive.

3141
03:14:16,240 --> 03:14:20,960
 I guess it's what Tim was saying a while ago, looking at getting all the information first

3142
03:14:20,960 --> 03:14:23,220
 before we go in there and change it.

3143
03:14:23,220 --> 03:14:29,040
 Though I think in time, because this is a primary arterial, those kinds of businesses

3144
03:14:29,040 --> 03:14:36,680
 or those kinds of projects are viable on a primary arterial.

3145
03:14:36,680 --> 03:14:37,920
 I do agree with that.

3146
03:14:37,920 --> 03:14:46,480
 I mean, that's my feeling, but I don't think at this point it's a viable project.

3147
03:14:46,480 --> 03:14:51,500
 I mean, I'm just saying it's based on the cost and not having those that information

3148
03:14:51,500 --> 03:14:52,500
 yet.

3149
03:14:52,500 --> 03:14:59,400
 Would it be better to table this then and come back later with a more developed site

3150
03:14:59,400 --> 03:15:00,400
 plan?

3151
03:15:00,400 --> 03:15:01,400
 I don't know.

3152
03:15:01,400 --> 03:15:08,840
 I was just going by, you know, you haven't done the whole research, I think, on it and

3153
03:15:08,840 --> 03:15:12,200
 I think we're going to jump into it and then you're going to find out, you know what, maybe

3154
03:15:12,200 --> 03:15:13,760
 this isn't what I want.

3155
03:15:13,760 --> 03:15:15,480
 I mean, it's your decision.

3156
03:15:15,480 --> 03:15:18,560
 I'm just saying it's based on what I can see here.

3157
03:15:18,560 --> 03:15:24,040
 I'd be afraid that we'd be make a decision and then a year from now or several months

3158
03:15:24,040 --> 03:15:28,640
 from now, you're going to come back and say, "Well, that wasn't the best decision because

3159
03:15:28,640 --> 03:15:33,000
 boring across that street, across that road is going to be expensive."

3160
03:15:33,000 --> 03:15:36,360
 I think it's worth interjecting here.

3161
03:15:36,360 --> 03:15:40,920
 We're not looking at what the cost to build the construction is.

3162
03:15:40,920 --> 03:15:46,300
 As a commission, we are trying to address, is it appropriate to have an NRMU zoning district

3163
03:15:46,300 --> 03:15:50,880
 in that location, regardless of what their project can and will be?

3164
03:15:50,880 --> 03:15:54,480
 There's a lot of other things that they could actually build besides multifamily.

3165
03:15:54,480 --> 03:15:58,360
 They could come back to us and present to us.

3166
03:15:58,360 --> 03:16:06,560
 Our duty here is not to see if their project is viable per se, but rather try to best ascertain

3167
03:16:06,560 --> 03:16:09,840
 the request to rezone.

3168
03:16:09,840 --> 03:16:14,260
 Like I said, I think rezoning based on the fact that we're on our primary arterial to

3169
03:16:14,260 --> 03:16:18,600
 me is a good decision.

3170
03:16:18,600 --> 03:16:24,360
 I agree with the staff and I'm just throwing that out.

3171
03:16:24,360 --> 03:16:29,880
 I do agree with them that a primary arterial, as you look 20, 30 years from now, this primary

3172
03:16:29,880 --> 03:16:34,080
 arterial is going to be ... There's a lot of vacant land in there in time.

3173
03:16:34,080 --> 03:16:35,080
 It's going to be developed.

3174
03:16:35,080 --> 03:16:42,080
 What do we want developed in a primary arterial, if not businesses and those kinds of things?

3175
03:16:42,080 --> 03:16:45,560
 Residential is not going ... It doesn't really fit that for me.

3176
03:16:45,560 --> 03:16:49,080
 Thank you, Mr. Sanchez.

3177
03:16:49,080 --> 03:16:51,200
 We have a couple more questions.

3178
03:16:51,200 --> 03:16:54,200
 Commissioner Pernetta.

3179
03:16:54,200 --> 03:16:58,280
 I'm not going to say too much on this one, but based on where we are right now, the understanding

3180
03:16:58,280 --> 03:17:02,320
 is that this would have to go to city council for a super majority anyway, due to the number

3181
03:17:02,320 --> 03:17:04,280
 of objections we have.

3182
03:17:04,280 --> 03:17:11,360
 Based on the idea that you guys are considering making adjustments to your request, I think

3183
03:17:11,360 --> 03:17:16,360
 maybe tabling it at this time would be best, because even if we did approve it, you'd have

3184
03:17:16,360 --> 03:17:22,480
 a long road to hoe to get through to city council, perhaps a revisit to try and find

3185
03:17:22,480 --> 03:17:28,400
 something that might be more amenable to the surrounding neighbors might be the best.

3186
03:17:28,400 --> 03:17:34,520
 Would it be possible if we table it now when we come back, can we do the rezoning and the

3187
03:17:34,520 --> 03:17:36,760
 SUP at the same time then?

3188
03:17:36,760 --> 03:17:38,200
 It would be possible to put them on the same agenda.

3189
03:17:38,200 --> 03:17:39,200
 They would be separate items.

3190
03:17:39,200 --> 03:17:40,200
 Okay.

3191
03:17:40,200 --> 03:17:42,240
 They wouldn't be technically at the same time.

3192
03:17:42,240 --> 03:17:47,480
 It would be one herd and then the SUP following that.

3193
03:17:47,480 --> 03:17:49,120
 Okay.

3194
03:17:49,120 --> 03:17:52,120
 That is an option.

3195
03:17:52,120 --> 03:17:53,120
 Commissioner Smith.

3196
03:17:53,120 --> 03:17:54,120
 Thank you, Chair.

3197
03:17:54,120 --> 03:18:00,160
 I was discussing this with legal and sidebar with Commissioner Pernetta, but I think my

3198
03:18:00,160 --> 03:18:05,040
 biggest fear is, look, development in the city of Denton, all for it.

3199
03:18:05,040 --> 03:18:08,200
 I think we're going to have people move in here, we need to put them somewhere.

3200
03:18:08,200 --> 03:18:16,680
 I think apartments and renting are great ways to subsidize low income housing and to have

3201
03:18:16,680 --> 03:18:17,680
 affordable housing.

3202
03:18:17,680 --> 03:18:22,120
 I should not say low income housing, but affordable places for people to live, but I would hate

3203
03:18:22,120 --> 03:18:29,720
 to rezone a piece of land and then you guys go do the engineering and find out the cost

3204
03:18:29,720 --> 03:18:35,260
 and then maybe possibly, because this happens, we have cases presented to us pretty constantly

3205
03:18:35,260 --> 03:18:37,760
 of this is rezoned, the project fell through.

3206
03:18:37,760 --> 03:18:41,080
 Well, that stinks because now this other person is coming through and having to pay to rezone

3207
03:18:41,080 --> 03:18:45,160
 this land again because it's not compatible to what the project they want to do.

3208
03:18:45,160 --> 03:18:49,760
 I'd hate to change the zoning on a piece of land and then come back and find out the cost

3209
03:18:49,760 --> 03:18:54,560
 through the SUP process and the engineering process, finding that out isn't going to be

3210
03:18:54,560 --> 03:18:55,560
 viable.

3211
03:18:55,560 --> 03:18:59,440
 That's why I'd have a hard time approving it or moving forward with this was that I

3212
03:18:59,440 --> 03:19:04,000
 would rather see both of them present at the same time, see what the cost with the SUP

3213
03:19:04,000 --> 03:19:08,280
 would be, see what the engineering cost, be able to actually do everything and see a site

3214
03:19:08,280 --> 03:19:13,440
 plan and all that great stuff and then know there's more financial viability there and

3215
03:19:13,440 --> 03:19:16,240
 then from there we could have conversations like Commissioner Beck brought up, which is

3216
03:19:16,240 --> 03:19:23,200
 okay, how financial viable can a project be while keeping the unity density down to be

3217
03:19:23,200 --> 03:19:27,960
 able to appease the neighborhood and be able to protect the neighborhoods around it.

3218
03:19:27,960 --> 03:19:32,480
 So I guess it's not really a question so much as it's a comment and that's what I was talking

3219
03:19:32,480 --> 03:19:36,560
 with legal about was that the possibility that after we hear public hearing and hear

3220
03:19:36,560 --> 03:19:43,040
 from residents is a possibility we might table this and request you guys bring it back whenever

3221
03:19:43,040 --> 03:19:48,720
 you have some better numbers and some engineering and some financial viability.

3222
03:19:48,720 --> 03:19:53,440
 We would hate to be up here and even talk with you Mr. Pavar and say hey would you be

3223
03:19:53,440 --> 03:19:57,120
 able to do 20 units an acre and you say yep and then you come back and find out it's like

3224
03:19:57,120 --> 03:20:00,760
 you know what we just put an overlay on a zoning for 20 units an acre and that's not

3225
03:20:00,760 --> 03:20:01,760
 financially viable.

3226
03:20:01,760 --> 03:20:04,800
 That doesn't seem like good work on our end either.

3227
03:20:04,800 --> 03:20:09,680
 That's unfair to you as the applicant and so that's my opinion.

3228
03:20:09,680 --> 03:20:14,480
 Would you guys be opposed to a table if we got to that part I mean would you think you

3229
03:20:14,480 --> 03:20:18,360
 would be willing to go through that process of starting the SCP getting those engineering

3230
03:20:18,360 --> 03:20:20,280
 numbers and we did get to a tabling?

3231
03:20:20,280 --> 03:20:23,440
 I think that would be the best.

3232
03:20:23,440 --> 03:20:27,360
 Okay, well we'll let the public hearing see I'm not saying to make a decision but just

3233
03:20:27,360 --> 03:20:33,360
 wanted to make sure that if we did as a commission make a motion to table and that was approved

3234
03:20:33,360 --> 03:20:37,360
 to table that you guys would step away and start doing the numbers so as long as I hear

3235
03:20:37,360 --> 03:20:40,160
 that from you then I'm good to go.

3236
03:20:40,160 --> 03:20:43,360
 Sounds like that'd be the best course of action at this point.

3237
03:20:43,360 --> 03:20:49,360
 With that conversation being said if we're wanting to table it might be prudent to try

3238
03:20:49,360 --> 03:20:54,680
 to push the table with the public hearing open so typically when I would call for a

3239
03:20:54,680 --> 03:20:59,400
 motion it's after I close the public hearing so if there is going to be a motion to table

3240
03:20:59,400 --> 03:21:03,600
 it needs to be done proactively before the chair requests one.

3241
03:21:03,600 --> 03:21:10,560
 So with that said I want to have Commissioner Prunette ask for the floor and then I'll give

3242
03:21:10,560 --> 03:21:14,000
 it back to you Commissioner Smith.

3243
03:21:14,000 --> 03:21:17,040
 That was actually going to be my question you know what the best procedure would be

3244
03:21:17,040 --> 03:21:23,160
 whether we table it before we go into the public hearing because we'd have a lot of

3245
03:21:23,160 --> 03:21:26,560
 people who want to speak and most likely they'll be speaking about something that's not actually

3246
03:21:26,560 --> 03:21:32,800
 going to be what the decision is made on eventually what would be the best thing to you know make

3247
03:21:32,800 --> 03:21:36,080
 sure this moves forward table it and then allow them to have the rest of their lives

3248
03:21:36,080 --> 03:21:38,720
 back so they can save it for another day.

3249
03:21:38,720 --> 03:21:43,000
 That's certainly an option just for point of order if there is a motion to table it's

3250
03:21:43,000 --> 03:21:48,040
 second and approved the public hearing will remain open anyone wishing to speak tonight

3251
03:21:48,040 --> 03:21:53,400
 I'll provide them that opportunity to still vocalize but it will come back before us which

3252
03:21:53,400 --> 03:21:56,720
 would give them an opportunity to come back the night of the vote.

3253
03:21:56,720 --> 03:22:00,920
 So public hearing and discourse will partake this evening regardless if there's a table

3254
03:22:00,920 --> 03:22:03,360
 or not.

3255
03:22:03,360 --> 03:22:09,600
 With that said there's a motion on the floor and Commissioner Smith I'll just ask that

3256
03:22:09,600 --> 03:22:13,360
 there's an affirmation from the applicant about the motion.

3257
03:22:13,360 --> 03:22:19,240
 Sure I'll make a motion to table the item until date certain.

3258
03:22:19,240 --> 03:22:24,840
 We will remain I'm assuming no date name just date certain.

3259
03:22:24,840 --> 03:22:25,840
 Date uncertain.

3260
03:22:25,840 --> 03:22:35,240
 I'm sorry yeah okay got it motion motion to table date uncertain.

3261
03:22:35,240 --> 03:22:41,800
 Yeah I'm sorry I didn't have my microphone on you're gonna have to table it to a date

3262
03:22:41,800 --> 03:22:45,840
 certain if you're going to leave the public hearing open without re-noticing it.

3263
03:22:45,840 --> 03:22:50,920
 If you're going to table it to a date uncertain then it will require staff to send out new

3264
03:22:50,920 --> 03:22:51,920
 notices.

3265
03:22:51,920 --> 03:22:56,440
 I mean the applicant can make can request city staff to postpone on agenda items we

3266
03:22:56,440 --> 03:23:00,680
 can put it as a date certain and then if the applicant feels like the date after we have

3267
03:23:00,680 --> 03:23:04,720
 a discussion here to figure out what what date would work for the applicant they can

3268
03:23:04,720 --> 03:23:09,120
 postpone that right because we have that that item is removed from agendas.

3269
03:23:09,120 --> 03:23:16,680
 Well you may have to re-notice it because you're going to be tabling it to date certain.

3270
03:23:16,680 --> 03:23:23,120
 So one one possibility may be to extend your date certain out pretty far you know just

3271
03:23:23,120 --> 03:23:27,720
 to make sure that sooner it's got to be date it's got to be right re-noticed as well.

3272
03:23:27,720 --> 03:23:34,000
 Mr. Bond Mr. Pavard do you guys have an idea of if the request that's being made is one

3273
03:23:34,000 --> 03:23:38,640
 is that clear what we're trying to find as a commission and two if it is clear what date

3274
03:23:38,640 --> 03:23:42,680
 would be how much time do you think you would need and I would say be generous with the

3275
03:23:42,680 --> 03:23:43,680
 time.

3276
03:23:43,680 --> 03:23:46,800
 We could put it out two months.

3277
03:23:46,800 --> 03:23:47,800
 Two months?

3278
03:23:47,800 --> 03:23:48,800
 Yeah.

3279
03:23:48,800 --> 03:23:49,800
 Could we get up?

3280
03:23:49,800 --> 03:23:50,800
 I think Richard's working on getting the calendar.

3281
03:23:50,800 --> 03:23:55,680
 Does anyone have the approved P and Z calendar?

3282
03:23:55,680 --> 03:23:57,160
 They're working they're working on it.

3283
03:23:57,160 --> 03:23:58,160
 Awesome.

3284
03:23:58,160 --> 03:24:03,560
 And I guess why slow the floor chair Rozelle did mention that for those who are here and

3285
03:24:03,560 --> 03:24:08,800
 wishing to speak you will still have the chance to speak tonight and voice your opinion if

3286
03:24:08,800 --> 03:24:20,440
 you would like.

3287
03:24:20,440 --> 03:24:21,440
 January 23rd?

3288
03:24:21,440 --> 03:24:22,440
 Yeah.

3289
03:24:22,440 --> 03:24:27,400
 That'd be that'd be two months out would be okay.

3290
03:24:27,400 --> 03:24:29,160
 January 23rd.

3291
03:24:29,160 --> 03:24:34,360
 Now by that time we may or may not have the textile driveways worked out but we will have

3292
03:24:34,360 --> 03:24:37,160
 a site plan we'll know what the costs are for the boring.

3293
03:24:37,160 --> 03:24:41,480
 Would you prefer us moving into February or would the 23rd be fine still?

3294
03:24:41,480 --> 03:24:43,740
 If I may I would probably recommend February.

3295
03:24:43,740 --> 03:24:44,740
 Okay.

3296
03:24:44,740 --> 03:24:48,720
 That way if there is an SGP associated with that we will notice for that so that gives

3297
03:24:48,720 --> 03:24:49,720
 us enough time.

3298
03:24:49,720 --> 03:24:53,880
 It's typically two to three weeks in advance of the meeting for us to send the notices

3299
03:24:53,880 --> 03:24:54,880
 so.

3300
03:24:54,880 --> 03:24:57,880
 February 6th or 20th then would that be better to say that?

3301
03:24:57,880 --> 03:25:02,440
 I don't have it entered yet is it the 6th or 13th?

3302
03:25:02,440 --> 03:25:07,800
 I don't have the calendar is there two that month?

3303
03:25:07,800 --> 03:25:14,640
 So it has to be at 6th or the 20th?

3304
03:25:14,640 --> 03:25:19,360
 Why don't we go with the 20th and that'll give us time to get all the text out as well.

3305
03:25:19,360 --> 03:25:25,360
 I'm gonna make a motion then a motion to table table the item until date certain of the Planning

3306
03:25:25,360 --> 03:25:30,400
 and Zoning Commission meeting as of February 20th and yep.

3307
03:25:30,400 --> 03:25:32,680
 We have a first looks Commissioner Beck.

3308
03:25:32,680 --> 03:25:33,680
 Second.

3309
03:25:33,680 --> 03:25:38,680
 We have a first and a second to table we'll go ahead and hear that vote now and then progress

3310
03:25:38,680 --> 03:25:42,560
 with the public hearing so I'm going to call for a vote on the board to table this to a

3311
03:25:42,560 --> 03:25:53,400
 date certain of February 20th.

3312
03:25:53,400 --> 03:25:59,520
 That motion carries 7-0 we'll enjoy the presentation in a couple months for y'all thank you.

3313
03:25:59,520 --> 03:26:00,520
 Thank you.

3314
03:26:00,520 --> 03:26:08,240
 This is the public hearing is still open and so we will still welcome your feedback and

3315
03:26:08,240 --> 03:26:14,440
 comments we have a couple cards for speaking and a couple cards not for speaking the first

3316
03:26:14,440 --> 03:26:20,040
 individual will be Terry Martin if you just state your name and address for the record

3317
03:26:20,040 --> 03:26:24,960
 and then I'm gonna ask the Commission if we can jot down notes if they have any questions

3318
03:26:24,960 --> 03:26:30,340
 that we want to post to staff if we jot those down once we go through all citizens feedback

3319
03:26:30,340 --> 03:26:34,600
 we can bring up the appropriate city staff to collectively answer those just as a point

3320
03:26:34,600 --> 03:26:38,320
 of moving the discussion along.

3321
03:26:38,320 --> 03:26:42,480
 You can obviously ask the applicant any questions I'm not saying that but for city staff you

3322
03:26:42,480 --> 03:26:43,480
 could hold them.

3323
03:26:43,480 --> 03:26:48,040
 Yes sir if you just state your name and address for the record.

3324
03:26:48,040 --> 03:26:53,760
 My name is Terry Martin I live at 1216 Mistywood here in Denton.

3325
03:26:53,760 --> 03:27:00,480
 I'm representing or I'm responsible for the could we get a this picture like a plan of

3326
03:27:00,480 --> 03:27:01,480
 plan view of this.

3327
03:27:01,480 --> 03:27:05,200
 The aerial view of the surrounding area as well yes.

3328
03:27:05,200 --> 03:27:06,200
 Yeah we can get that for you.

3329
03:27:06,200 --> 03:27:14,680
 You don't have to stand up here with me I thought you was gonna do that for me.

3330
03:27:14,680 --> 03:27:17,200
 Yeah so I'm just here in case he needs help hearing something.

3331
03:27:17,200 --> 03:27:18,200
 I'm his son.

3332
03:27:18,200 --> 03:27:19,200
 Perfect.

3333
03:27:19,200 --> 03:27:20,200
 And what is your name?

3334
03:27:20,200 --> 03:27:21,200
 Daniel Martin.

3335
03:27:21,200 --> 03:27:22,200
 Thank you.

3336
03:27:22,200 --> 03:27:23,200
 Same address.

3337
03:27:23,200 --> 03:27:39,080
 The very first plan view that went on whenever you prefer this or come on back okay you're

3338
03:27:39,080 --> 03:27:46,540
 getting close right I'd like to show which I'd like to show Windsor there that's right

3339
03:27:46,540 --> 03:27:52,760
 there that's good that's good thank you thank you all for my inability to handle

3340
03:27:52,760 --> 03:27:56,200
 computers and things like that.

3341
03:27:56,200 --> 03:28:05,760
 The property that I'm speaking for is the property due south of this main body and the

3342
03:28:05,760 --> 03:28:17,400
 property due east that runs down that runs down Elm Street the the I think common sense

3343
03:28:17,400 --> 03:28:25,800
 many times many many times whether it's whatever outweighs what somebody has printed in a computer

3344
03:28:25,800 --> 03:28:32,160
 program or a book or something or other this traffic you can't I don't I don't I don't

3345
03:28:32,160 --> 03:28:37,600
 believe you can anticipate what the traffic is going to be there.

3346
03:28:37,600 --> 03:28:43,120
 We have we have all these other projects going to high school out there that that huge apartment

3347
03:28:43,120 --> 03:28:53,040
 complex across from from the research center the the the day to day and here we're fixing

3348
03:28:53,040 --> 03:29:01,120
 to throw another hundred cars possibly easily a hundred cars at work time coming and going

3349
03:29:01,120 --> 03:29:12,520
 the distance from that drive to Windsor is the is the bare minimum it's nothing whenever

3350
03:29:12,520 --> 03:29:17,200
 that whenever that that Windsor is going to get so clogged up you can't imagine it and

3351
03:29:17,200 --> 03:29:21,320
 then you're going to throw another hundred cars out there trying to get out and half

3352
03:29:21,320 --> 03:29:26,420
 of those are going to try to go left and go north.

3353
03:29:26,420 --> 03:29:30,920
 Denton is eat up with traffic problems I see no need in creating another one and but that's

3354
03:29:30,920 --> 03:29:36,960
 but that's that's that's a my that's in my opinion that's a minor problem.

3355
03:29:36,960 --> 03:29:42,680
 I understand about development I've been in construction all my life I understand about

3356
03:29:42,680 --> 03:29:46,920
 development and progress and moving forward.

3357
03:29:46,920 --> 03:29:55,880
 But that this exact property or the right hand side one has sold in the last 15 years

3358
03:29:55,880 --> 03:30:05,460
 20 years has sold probably a dozen times and the deal fell through because of the expense

3359
03:30:05,460 --> 03:30:10,320
 of boring under the highway and then when you get it bored under the highway yes there's

3360
03:30:10,320 --> 03:30:14,860
 water there and there's a sewer line over there but that sewer line is already maxed

3361
03:30:14,860 --> 03:30:22,780
 out everybody keeps failing to admit to admit that and and research that.

3362
03:30:22,780 --> 03:30:28,600
 So even if so somebody is going to have to which it sounds like the taxpayer if they

3363
03:30:28,600 --> 03:30:35,540
 have to enlarge that line to handle 60 apartments.

3364
03:30:35,540 --> 03:30:41,880
 I don't know who's that who's that who's that's up to but I don't want to be paying for it.

3365
03:30:41,880 --> 03:30:46,880
 Plus like I said the deals have fallen through whenever the they would have a contract and

3366
03:30:46,880 --> 03:30:51,560
 then whenever the whenever they would start researching that it's a tremendous expense

3367
03:30:51,560 --> 03:30:57,600
 to bore under a text on highway and they would back out on the deals that's happened over

3368
03:30:57,600 --> 03:31:01,560
 and over and over over over a long period of time.

3369
03:31:01,560 --> 03:31:11,960
 The the the developer very nice guy I've talked to him at length yesterday and today.

3370
03:31:11,960 --> 03:31:18,800
 Last night meeting they could not tell us what the departments were going to rent for

3371
03:31:18,800 --> 03:31:23,160
 they keep throwing around this affordable rent affordable rent that's the key that's

3372
03:31:23,160 --> 03:31:28,280
 the key phrase affordable rent but yet we we we don't even have a clue what departments

3373
03:31:28,280 --> 03:31:33,000
 are going to rent for.

3374
03:31:33,000 --> 03:31:38,680
 I never went into a project in my life that I didn't have a have have a pretty good sight

3375
03:31:38,680 --> 03:31:41,280
 of what the end was going to be.

3376
03:31:41,280 --> 03:31:47,440
 I didn't go try to build something without researching what the what the plywood was going

3377
03:31:47,440 --> 03:31:53,400
 to cost what what the what the hardware on that cabinet was going to cost I had a pretty

3378
03:31:53,400 --> 03:31:57,920
 good idea now it wasn't always exact but I had a very very good idea and I knew what

3379
03:31:57,920 --> 03:32:06,160
 the goal was the developer he'd has no no clue period and I think that's been discussed

3380
03:32:06,160 --> 03:32:09,040
 a little bit only I'm putting it in a little bit harder terms.

3381
03:32:09,040 --> 03:32:20,200
 Two and a half minutes left huh two and a half minutes left oh oh oh okay the the the

3382
03:32:20,200 --> 03:32:26,360
 lot the lot due south is a very nice lot huge huge oak trees it's a very nice situated

3383
03:32:26,360 --> 03:32:30,080
 place there's a there's a there's a house right down the way that's a huge mansion

3384
03:32:30,080 --> 03:32:37,840
 type house this is a this is a pristine place for a very nice house prime some nobody's

3385
03:32:37,840 --> 03:32:44,320
 going to want to build a very nice house without a swimming pool without a barbecue every time

3386
03:32:44,320 --> 03:32:50,840
 whoever builds this house wife or daughter wants to have a swimming party everybody from

3387
03:32:50,840 --> 03:32:57,240
 the second floor up in that in that apartment complex is going to enjoy the party with them.

3388
03:32:57,240 --> 03:33:02,040
 I say that's a huge deterrent.

3389
03:33:02,040 --> 03:33:07,160
 Apartments work well this kind of apartment works very well at a street intersection all

3390
03:33:07,160 --> 03:33:12,880
 over Denton they work well there will you find them all over Denton they adjacent to

3391
03:33:12,880 --> 03:33:19,520
 a storage facility something where people don't actually live a gas station that kind

3392
03:33:19,520 --> 03:33:28,360
 of thing even even strip center but jamming it in there it won't work.

3393
03:33:28,360 --> 03:33:34,480
 This vacant land we lost a picture this vacant land is not very big on the picture it looks

3394
03:33:34,480 --> 03:33:41,160
 like you just you can't comprehend it from the south side there to Windsor Street this

3395
03:33:41,160 --> 03:33:48,840
 guy can throw a football that far it's not very far that it's it's it's not two point

3396
03:33:48,840 --> 03:33:52,760
 something acres sounds like huge it's really not that very big you get out there walk around

3397
03:33:52,760 --> 03:34:04,400
 and it's not very big. And privacy concerns is before we came over here I wouldn't pick

3398
03:34:04,400 --> 03:34:08,280
 my end up and there's people out there in the middle of that taking pictures she has

3399
03:34:08,280 --> 03:34:12,880
 a tremendous problem with people out there all the time they throw their trash down they

3400
03:34:12,880 --> 03:34:17,600
 go out there and take these pictures they cross in there they dump their trash it's

3401
03:34:17,600 --> 03:34:24,600
 a dump she keeps it very nice and they just love to go out there and ride four wheelers

3402
03:34:24,600 --> 03:34:29,520
 all this stuff every kid in that part and that apartment complex right down Windsor

3403
03:34:29,520 --> 03:34:35,040
 Street here there the city has got a beautiful park all kinds of games all kinds of play

3404
03:34:35,040 --> 03:34:41,960
 things the North Lake Center ball fields every kid is going to walk out of that apartment

3405
03:34:41,960 --> 03:34:48,000
 boundary that big fine fence that restrains them walk right it walk right down the side

3406
03:34:48,000 --> 03:34:54,520
 of it cross my property cross my aunt's property hit that very nice sidewalk that you built

3407
03:34:54,520 --> 03:34:58,960
 in front of the and a long a long Windsor and they're going to walk right out to that

3408
03:34:58,960 --> 03:35:04,200
 park they're going to come back and they're going to make that same crossing this is the

3409
03:35:04,200 --> 03:35:09,040
 first time I want to interrupt a little bit if you wrap up and start to conclude the points

3410
03:35:09,040 --> 03:35:23,360
 okay the developer bought this land knowing what the zoning was he had an idea of what

3411
03:35:23,360 --> 03:35:30,720
 to do with it now he's decided something else and he's asking everybody else to make the

3412
03:35:30,720 --> 03:35:39,720
 concessions for him to do something else he invested his money I'm just asking you to

3413
03:35:39,720 --> 03:35:45,440
 do the right thing and deny this let's use some common sense I'm not above progress I'm

3414
03:35:45,440 --> 03:35:51,960
 not above change but this particular situation is not it go back to the duplex plan he told

3415
03:35:51,960 --> 03:35:57,000
 me himself he bought it with planning on duplexes it would be absolutely wonderful it fit the

3416
03:35:57,000 --> 03:36:05,160
 area but there will be no buffer between that crop that zoning and the single-family houses

3417
03:36:05,160 --> 03:36:10,960
 across Windsor if you approve that that is a tongue down there you need you need Elm

3418
03:36:10,960 --> 03:36:15,840
 Street to stop to be the drawing line I'm sorry we went over thank you that's right

3419
03:36:15,840 --> 03:36:25,080
 thank you Mr. Martin next individual is Julie Smith if you just state your name and address

3420
03:36:25,080 --> 03:36:30,400
 for the record and it might be a good reminder that we will have a four-minute clock we'll

3421
03:36:30,400 --> 03:36:33,360
 try to be if you want to go over a little bit we'll have some flexibility if we'd stick

3422
03:36:33,360 --> 03:36:38,520
 to four minutes I'll be great thank you okay four minutes for a three-story apartment and

3423
03:36:38,520 --> 03:36:42,000
 mr. Drake good to see you again kind of odd to be on this side of the dice and I will

3424
03:36:42,000 --> 03:36:46,320
 say to you you do an excellent job of describing what is in front of the commission in terms

3425
03:36:46,320 --> 03:36:50,520
 of the zoning and I really appreciate that I may have you come up and explain that to

3426
03:36:50,520 --> 03:36:58,120
 the commission I'm responsible to and mr. Smith besides sharing a name in common that

3427
03:36:58,120 --> 03:37:06,480
 no one else ever has I also really do appreciate your comments my sense is that we are probably

3428
03:37:06,480 --> 03:37:11,800
 short in every housing type that there is in Denton right now there's a demand for any

3429
03:37:11,800 --> 03:37:18,200
 type and and whether duplexes are built here or a six-story apartment building is built

3430
03:37:18,200 --> 03:37:26,280
 here I think people will pay to live there I have been in Denton since 1969 that's why

3431
03:37:26,280 --> 03:37:30,700
 Jerry and I have the same hair color and and and I had the pleasure of going to school

3432
03:37:30,700 --> 03:37:39,160
 in a one high school town and so I understand also about growth if we're on the I-35 corridor

3433
03:37:39,160 --> 03:37:46,280
 we're going to grow every city does who knew where Thackerville was five years ago and

3434
03:37:46,280 --> 03:37:51,840
 now the entire United States knows where Thackerville is so so that is a done deal I mean we are

3435
03:37:51,840 --> 03:37:56,640
 going to grow and growth is good and especially mixed growth for all the economic reasons

3436
03:37:56,640 --> 03:38:01,120
 we all we all know about so the only question for I think planning and zoning commissions

3437
03:38:01,120 --> 03:38:04,760
 and city councils and those of us who choose to live in these cities is how are we going

3438
03:38:04,760 --> 03:38:11,280
 to grow I think it's a little disingenuous and let me preface this by saying Cindy has

3439
03:38:11,280 --> 03:38:16,420
 been great answering my questions but things a little disingenuous to rely on the existing

3440
03:38:16,420 --> 03:38:23,680
 zoning map to support a staff support as a recommendation to support this rezoning and

3441
03:38:23,680 --> 03:38:30,320
 also on a future land use map that are mutually exclusive and what I mean by that is if you

3442
03:38:30,320 --> 03:38:37,560
 look at your existing zoning map the area that's due north of the proposed is in this

3443
03:38:37,560 --> 03:38:41,720
 red slash stuff and it's vacant right now there's nothing there if you look at your

3444
03:38:41,720 --> 03:38:49,480
 proposed 2030 plan that's back to moderate density not high density so you may not eat

3445
03:38:49,480 --> 03:38:54,300
 your cake and have it too so whatever your recommendation I would I would ask you to

3446
03:38:54,300 --> 03:38:58,600
 notice that that there is a conflict between those two things having said that the existing

3447
03:38:58,600 --> 03:39:04,600
 zoning here 12 I'm sure every commissioner has heard this but just for anyone in the audience

3448
03:39:04,600 --> 03:39:10,840
 it hasn't it's it's beautiful writing in terms of the description which is this is 12 units

3449
03:39:10,840 --> 03:39:16,960
 breaker where we are right now mixed-use development intended to preserve and protect existing

3450
03:39:16,960 --> 03:39:21,520
 neighborhoods and to ensure that any new infill development is compatible with existing land

3451
03:39:21,520 --> 03:39:28,280
 uses patterns and design standards and it also mentions that low and multifamily low

3452
03:39:28,280 --> 03:39:32,640
 and moderate male to family which fit in that not unlike what you have mentioned Mr. Sanchez

3453
03:39:32,640 --> 03:39:39,440
 and including retail uses if you back up and look at a Google shot of this okay you'll

3454
03:39:39,440 --> 03:39:44,560
 notice that we do have retail uses they're tiny and wonderful if you have not had pizza

3455
03:39:44,560 --> 03:39:50,120
 it bruises Romans pizza I suggest that you do so because you actually provides our dinner

3456
03:39:50,120 --> 03:39:54,400
 quite regularly and of course his son Sam has the wash interior right next door we have

3457
03:39:54,400 --> 03:39:58,960
 a dollar general store right there that's actually acts as this convenience store for

3458
03:39:58,960 --> 03:40:04,560
 every parent on Saturday morning who has no milk and that little corner is the gather

3459
03:40:04,560 --> 03:40:10,200
 up neighborhood type corner it's not intense commercial it's neighborhood retail that's

3460
03:40:10,200 --> 03:40:14,600
 how it operates and dollar general things probably only brick and mortar that's going

3461
03:40:14,600 --> 03:40:19,280
 to survive Amazon at least in the near future and so that building's not going away anytime

3462
03:40:19,280 --> 03:40:26,000
 soon that use is not going away anytime soon we you know when you look at your 200 notice

3463
03:40:26,000 --> 03:40:31,680
 full disclosure I'm the one house everybody keeps mentioning at a 1935 farmhouse I've

3464
03:40:31,680 --> 03:40:37,160
 lived over 20 years now so I am the closest one to it but the house that people seem to

3465
03:40:37,160 --> 03:40:42,640
 that you couldn't see is belongs to Agnes my dear neighbor there I mean she is next

3466
03:40:42,640 --> 03:40:47,520
 to the dollar general so there are two homes but that's a very close look all you have

3467
03:40:47,520 --> 03:40:55,000
 to do is back up and you'll notice my lots the smallest one as you go along Windsor to

3468
03:40:55,000 --> 03:40:59,600
 the west at the corner there's some smaller lots but they're actually zoned less than

3469
03:40:59,600 --> 03:41:04,400
 12 I think they're four I think they're four units per acre zone and then of course as

3470
03:41:04,400 --> 03:41:10,480
 you go up Riney they get larger and larger the Northridge development subdivision to the

3471
03:41:10,480 --> 03:41:16,360
 south of us which has always been kind enough to include me in their neighborhood and those

3472
03:41:16,360 --> 03:41:22,320
 are three units per acre okay everything around us is between two and four units per acre

3473
03:41:22,320 --> 03:41:28,600
 it's 77 is a huge corridor I recognize that I recognize it makes sense to grow and I actually

3474
03:41:28,600 --> 03:41:33,640
 like to see retail and commercial and I that's a great use because I don't have a college

3475
03:41:33,640 --> 03:41:37,960
 student coming home at 2 in the morning slamming car doors and that type of thing and when

3476
03:41:37,960 --> 03:41:43,320
 what was proposed was one at the risk of doing what I say we shouldn't do a proposed one

3477
03:41:43,320 --> 03:41:48,480
 and two bedroom we're talking college it means going to be primarily transient college student

3478
03:41:48,480 --> 03:41:58,880
 renting so that's what's going to go there we are neighborhood we are a neighborhood

3479
03:41:58,880 --> 03:42:04,320
 and so we're not just vacant land there was a home on Terry's property what he didn't

3480
03:42:04,320 --> 03:42:09,680
 tell you is it actually was pre-civil war his father lived next to me he died of Parkinson's

3481
03:42:09,680 --> 03:42:15,600
 years ago but as a child he watched his grandfather and the gentleman across the street put on

3482
03:42:15,600 --> 03:42:22,600
 their respective union and Confederate uniforms and not speak to each other on Veterans Day

3483
03:42:22,600 --> 03:42:28,280
 okay but then the rest of the time they were fine so there's a lot of history here and

3484
03:42:28,280 --> 03:42:33,400
 we recognize it's going to change it's a huge deal for this to go to 12 for us right I mean

3485
03:42:33,400 --> 03:42:39,880
 that's a big difference just to put 12 units per acre on this next to us but there are

3486
03:42:39,880 --> 03:42:45,080
 other folks in town that are making plenty on 12 units per acre and all these other ones

3487
03:42:45,080 --> 03:42:48,920
 that you talked to you and I thought maybe you should read notice this as the corridor

3488
03:42:48,920 --> 03:42:54,240
 77 planning its own commission but the others are closer to 35 they're closer to more arterials

3489
03:42:54,240 --> 03:42:58,120
 and they're less dense than what is proposed here every one that you have looked at tonight

3490
03:42:58,120 --> 03:43:04,760
 is less dense than this and this is further from 35 it's closer to downtown and it's certainly

3491
03:43:04,760 --> 03:43:10,040
 closer to the Northridge neighborhood and so in terms of zoning I don't think it's appropriate

3492
03:43:10,040 --> 03:43:14,720
 to ups the zoning I think 12 makes sense even though I will admit I'll have trouble adjusting

3493
03:43:14,720 --> 03:43:21,520
 to that but 77 is a growing corridor and I get it but more than doubling that I am opposed

3494
03:43:21,520 --> 03:43:28,480
 to that thank you for your time tonight absolutely thanks for coming out.

3495
03:43:28,480 --> 03:43:47,400
 The affirmation Agnes Dean is next.

3496
03:43:47,400 --> 03:43:50,160
 And if you could state your name and address for the record.

3497
03:43:50,160 --> 03:44:01,640
 My name is Agnes Dean I live at 428 West Windsor and I have been there since 1939 not at 428

3498
03:44:01,640 --> 03:44:08,000
 Miss West Windsor but on the property in 1939 my mother and dad moved into the house my

3499
03:44:08,000 --> 03:44:14,720
 mother was born in upon Terry's property that house has since burned and there was another

3500
03:44:14,720 --> 03:44:23,780
 house there that has been destroyed but I have seen a lot of change when I was a child

3501
03:44:23,780 --> 03:44:30,240
 the only people who came down and it was a gravel road two cars had to slow down to even

3502
03:44:30,240 --> 03:44:37,760
 pass and it had was called the old Sanger Road was at one time was the main way to get

3503
03:44:37,760 --> 03:44:47,700
 to Sanger and so we used to go into history I could tell a lot of stories but I'm very

3504
03:44:47,700 --> 03:44:53,720
 concerned about the zoning they're trying they were trying to put too much on too little

3505
03:44:53,720 --> 03:45:02,360
 and as far as my own safety I've hoped to be able to spend my last days right there

3506
03:45:02,360 --> 03:45:09,960
 where I am few people get to live in the generations of history that I've been less blessed to

3507
03:45:09,960 --> 03:45:19,880
 enjoy and I have to now ask people to leave the property I still mow and do a lot of things

3508
03:45:19,880 --> 03:45:26,120
 that 85 year old women don't usually do and I'll have to go out and pick up paper and

3509
03:45:26,120 --> 03:45:32,960
 trash and glass and cans and things where people have come across and have thrown their

3510
03:45:32,960 --> 03:45:38,300
 things away as Terry and I left when he came to pick me up this afternoon there were people

3511
03:45:38,300 --> 03:45:45,060
 out there and we had to ask them to leave my property I get a lot of trash over Dollar

3512
03:45:45,060 --> 03:45:50,880
 General's fence but I have not really had the disturbance from Dollar General that I

3513
03:45:50,880 --> 03:45:58,460
 thought I would have so I just asked that you preserve the integrity of the community

3514
03:45:58,460 --> 03:46:06,980
 and of that neighborhood Northridge is a very good and stable neighborhood they have for

3515
03:46:06,980 --> 03:46:14,200
 years asked and hoped that there would be a transition of town homes or something between

3516
03:46:14,200 --> 03:46:19,120
 their neighborhood and then the commercial that's going to be back on Elm Street and

3517
03:46:19,120 --> 03:46:24,660
 the high density that will be back there so I don't have very much more to say I'll wait

3518
03:46:24,660 --> 03:46:31,440
 and see what the applicant comes up with in his next plan before I come back and say very

3519
03:46:31,440 --> 03:46:35,960
 much more but I do appreciate your time in your consideration thank you very much.

3520
03:46:35,960 --> 03:46:38,240
 Thank you Ms. Dean we actually have a question for you.

3521
03:46:38,240 --> 03:46:39,240
 Okay.

3522
03:46:39,240 --> 03:46:40,240
 Commissioner Smith.

3523
03:46:40,240 --> 03:46:41,240
 Thank you Chair.

3524
03:46:41,240 --> 03:46:45,080
 Not really a question for you Ms. Dean thank you very much for coming out and I'd love

3525
03:46:45,080 --> 03:46:49,900
 to pick your brain some time I like here in history and funny stories so more of something

3526
03:46:49,900 --> 03:46:54,040
 I read into the minutes to remind myself when I come back around on February 20th and then

3527
03:46:54,040 --> 03:47:00,120
 something maybe a suggestion to the applicant fencing some sort of foot traffic mitigation

3528
03:47:00,120 --> 03:47:06,440
 from keeping the backlots that are there because I think that the last two public last three

3529
03:47:06,440 --> 03:47:11,500
 public speakers have definitely brought up something that it would be pretty natural

3530
03:47:11,500 --> 03:47:18,360
 for folks to cut through their land behind there so I don't I know there was the conceptual

3531
03:47:18,360 --> 03:47:23,340
 plan that was put in the presentation was just that it was conceptual so if some sort

3532
03:47:23,340 --> 03:47:27,000
 of foot traffic mitigation could be looked at and if my comments could be read into the

3533
03:47:27,000 --> 03:47:30,800
 minutes to remind ourselves to bring that back up February 20th I'd appreciate it but

3534
03:47:30,800 --> 03:47:31,800
 thank you Ms. Dean.

3535
03:47:31,800 --> 03:47:35,800
 Thank you very much.

3536
03:47:35,800 --> 03:47:42,760
 The next card I have of individual wishing to speak is Ashley Bender.

3537
03:47:42,760 --> 03:47:46,760
 This is the last card requesting to speak I have other ones in opposition but if you

3538
03:47:46,760 --> 03:47:51,680
 do have a blue card you can come up here and hand it in or we can just call you up next

3539
03:47:51,680 --> 03:47:55,940
 and I'll take the card from you good evening Ms. Bender if you can say your name and address

3540
03:47:55,940 --> 03:47:56,940
 for the record.

3541
03:47:56,940 --> 03:48:00,920
 Hi I'm Ashley Bender I live at 606 Northridge Street I just want to reiterate what my neighbors

3542
03:48:00,920 --> 03:48:09,680
 have said that we are a really magnificent sorry I'm really love my neighborhood and

3543
03:48:09,680 --> 03:48:16,440
 I want to protect the integrity to use your terms I want to protect the integrity of residential

3544
03:48:16,440 --> 03:48:23,520
 life that we have I am not opposed to development I am not opposed to new housing I know that

3545
03:48:23,520 --> 03:48:28,240
 we need that in town I see it with my students all the time they need affordable places to

3546
03:48:28,240 --> 03:48:35,120
 live but with the new development going in at Hinkle and Windsor and then with this proposed

3547
03:48:35,120 --> 03:48:41,800
 zoning change that will infiltrate our neighborhood in really negative ways we already have through

3548
03:48:41,800 --> 03:48:51,920
 traffic on my street cars going regularly well over the speed limit we have and nothing

3549
03:48:51,920 --> 03:48:56,440
 to calm traffic there and when a development like this if a development like this were

3550
03:48:56,440 --> 03:49:01,840
 to go in that will creep into the neighborhood because there is a cut-through on Mesquite

3551
03:49:01,840 --> 03:49:08,480
 from Windsor and it's not just about traffic on Elm Street that traffic will be using Windsor

3552
03:49:08,480 --> 03:49:13,560
 Windsor is already quite dangerous we've had to make changes on Windsor and change the

3553
03:49:13,560 --> 03:49:19,440
 speed limit on Windsor because of accidents happening on that street we have kids who

3554
03:49:19,440 --> 03:49:25,520
 have to cross Windsor to get to elementary school we have kids who have to cross Windsor

3555
03:49:25,520 --> 03:49:31,720
 to get to we do have kids who will walk to Calhoun because they can't take the bus and

3556
03:49:31,720 --> 03:49:40,820
 so we have kids crossing back and forth this very busy street I appreciate the conversation

3557
03:49:40,820 --> 03:49:50,740
 that we have had tonight I am very concerned about this zoning change setting a precedent

3558
03:49:50,740 --> 03:49:56,560
 for other changes rights other zoning changes in the adjacent lots and losing that potential

3559
03:49:56,560 --> 03:50:06,520
 buffer that my neighbors have talked about I am also concerned about infrastructure and

3560
03:50:06,520 --> 03:50:16,960
 I am sorry I wrote my notes and then I got choked up so I'm concerned about encroachment

3561
03:50:16,960 --> 03:50:23,600
 on to Windsor specifically that is a residential street that whole strip right there people

3562
03:50:23,600 --> 03:50:35,040
 live there and so I just want us to move forward with this neighborhood in mind we want to

3563
03:50:35,040 --> 03:50:42,480
 be good neighbors to other developments we want to be good community members I feel confident

3564
03:50:42,480 --> 03:50:48,120
 I can speak for my neighbors in saying that and we want to welcome new people into our

3565
03:50:48,120 --> 03:50:54,320
 area but we want to do so in a way that protects the integrity that protects the quality of

3566
03:50:54,320 --> 03:51:00,360
 life for the people currently there and that ensures a good residential experience for

3567
03:51:00,360 --> 03:51:08,360
 people who will be moving into that area that's all I got thank you thank you Miss Bender

3568
03:51:08,360 --> 03:51:19,280
 this is a public hearing of anyone wishing to speak we certainly do so you just hand

3569
03:51:19,280 --> 03:51:29,280
 them to she will take care of it and if you could just state your name and address for

3570
03:51:29,280 --> 03:51:38,320
 the record my name is Edward Cuthbertson I live at 512 Northridge Street in Denton I

3571
03:51:38,320 --> 03:51:45,640
 where we live fall within falls within the 500 foot radius or whatever you call it of

3572
03:51:45,640 --> 03:51:54,080
 the proposed zoning change anyway I'm not well versed in these kind of matters I don't

3573
03:51:54,080 --> 03:52:04,440
 think of too much time but to have the zoning change from a 12 unit situation per acre to

3574
03:52:04,440 --> 03:52:15,600
 a 12 unit to a 30 unit and multiple that times two it would be 24 units for if it was 12

3575
03:52:15,600 --> 03:52:25,320
 or 60 units or whatever if it was 30 it to me it poses quite a transition that is not

3576
03:52:25,320 --> 03:52:30,960
 compatible with the surrounding areas I don't know all the codes but I did remember last

3577
03:52:30,960 --> 03:52:36,000
 night that I think our neighborhood is is NR for if that's the right code I don't know

3578
03:52:36,000 --> 03:52:44,440
 if that's even the right thing to say but anyway to me my impression is apartments once

3579
03:52:44,440 --> 03:52:51,440
 you have apartments you have transient population that's just the nature of apartments town

3580
03:52:51,440 --> 03:52:55,880
 homes if they're for sale maybe that might be less transient but then of course the whoever

3581
03:52:55,880 --> 03:53:01,920
 owns and buys them could rent them out so that could also be a rental situation. Duplexes

3582
03:53:01,920 --> 03:53:08,880
 I'm going in order of least desirable to maybe more desirable in my concept from apartments

3583
03:53:08,880 --> 03:53:14,320
 to town homes to duplexes I didn't even think of that that might be more acceptable if the

3584
03:53:14,320 --> 03:53:23,160
 zoning is kept at NR 12. Somebody suggested to me and I hadn't even thought of this what

3585
03:53:23,160 --> 03:53:28,080
 would be the feasibility or the appropriateness of taking this parcel of land and making it

3586
03:53:28,080 --> 03:53:32,800
 into a park I don't know if anybody's ever thought of that but I don't know if there's

3587
03:53:32,800 --> 03:53:37,600
 funding in the city for such things like that this area would you know I don't know all

3588
03:53:37,600 --> 03:53:44,840
 the details it's just an idea which I'll just throw out that maybe will be thrown out but

3589
03:53:44,840 --> 03:53:51,840
 as a possible possibility that would be very nice for surrounding areas I think these people

3590
03:53:51,840 --> 03:53:58,880
 that are south of the of this 2.68 acres and east of it that own these this older tracts

3591
03:53:58,880 --> 03:54:04,400
 of land I think their thoughts are that their offspring could develop something there for

3592
03:54:04,400 --> 03:54:09,880
 you know housing for themselves but if I had that land and I was going to develop it and

3593
03:54:09,880 --> 03:54:15,520
 there was apartments right in my backyard that would be less desirable to you know go

3594
03:54:15,520 --> 03:54:22,160
 forward with something like that so I'm I'm in opposition to the zoning change I think

3595
03:54:22,160 --> 03:54:28,440
 the the 12 capacity is is good enough it's probably actually a lot more than what could

3596
03:54:28,440 --> 03:54:34,920
 be done in a more gradual transition but anyway I'm running out of time here thank you for

3597
03:54:34,920 --> 03:54:38,600
 your time I appreciate all your consideration all the technicalities you have to consider

3598
03:54:38,600 --> 03:54:44,240
 and that's like that's all I have to say we actually have one question for you Mr. Beck

3599
03:54:44,240 --> 03:54:49,000
 thank you chair thank you Mr. Cuthberson yes did I say that right thank you for your presentation

3600
03:54:49,000 --> 03:54:55,440
 appreciate your time here if I had my way we would put a park like we do churches on

3601
03:54:55,440 --> 03:55:00,600
 every other block but that's not gonna happen you've got North Lakes just up you've got

3602
03:55:00,600 --> 03:55:07,400
 North Lakes just up the street so I would like to ask you a question this really would

3603
03:55:07,400 --> 03:55:14,760
 go out to the other ones that responded to I'd mention to the property owner if he would

3604
03:55:14,760 --> 03:55:20,280
 consider reducing the density with an overlay I'm curious if we got it down to 20 and that

3605
03:55:20,280 --> 03:55:25,600
 was financially feasible for him would that be more acceptable to you and if some of you

3606
03:55:25,600 --> 03:55:29,920
 want to just nod or shake your head can't all does that mean that the zoning we would

3607
03:55:29,920 --> 03:55:34,880
 be lower well zoning would still say it - 12 or would it it would go past 12 but it would

3608
03:55:34,880 --> 03:55:40,880
 be less than the 28 he's proposing right now if we got it down to 20 units per acre that's

3609
03:55:40,880 --> 03:55:46,720
 kind of a it would be less dense but then it would accommodate we would go ahead and

3610
03:55:46,720 --> 03:55:53,160
 zone it NRMU but with an overlay that say we couldn't build more than 20 units per acre

3611
03:55:53,160 --> 03:55:58,920
 is that she's shaking her head no so just curious that gives room for other adjacent

3612
03:55:58,920 --> 03:56:03,960
 development to go up higher amounts well now there's limits to height oh no I don't I don't

3613
03:56:03,960 --> 03:56:09,560
 mean right I mean they're usually gonna be density one right that could be three stories

3614
03:56:09,560 --> 03:56:14,880
 so I don't have the knowledge of okay that was just I just thought I'd throw that out

3615
03:56:14,880 --> 03:56:19,480
 there because it was something that we approached him with and he may bring back I just wanted

3616
03:56:19,480 --> 03:56:24,080
 to say 20 unit does a 20 unit deal mean it's still gonna be an apartment or would it be

3617
03:56:24,080 --> 03:56:29,900
 duplexes or townhomes it'll be multi-family still it just won't be as dense density was

3618
03:56:29,900 --> 03:56:36,440
 the concern of I don't think anybody's really I don't think okay all right I had to throw

3619
03:56:36,440 --> 03:56:42,680
 it out there thank you sir thank you very much I don't have any other cards for individuals

3620
03:56:42,680 --> 03:56:45,880
 wishing to speak I have something to read into the record but if there's anyone else

3621
03:56:45,880 --> 03:56:52,360
 wishing to speak you may certainly do so the public hearing will remain open seeing none

3622
03:56:52,360 --> 03:57:01,240
 I'll read the following individuals into the record as opposition Gene Cuthbertson 512

3623
03:57:01,240 --> 03:57:10,880
 Northridge Street W Lee Negrang sorry if I missed that 506 Northridge John Hyatt 513

3624
03:57:10,880 --> 03:57:19,520
 Northridge Street at this time since we've had a motion to table and it's passed we

3625
03:57:19,520 --> 03:57:28,000
 will close discussion on this I keep the public here open and that will be the end of this

3626
03:57:28,000 --> 03:57:33,480
 item for this evening and I hope and encourage everyone to come back out when we take action

3627
03:57:33,480 --> 03:57:40,520
 on this Christian back so none of us can cut I mean just make comments in general about

3628
03:57:40,520 --> 03:57:44,960
 what we've heard tonight would you rather put that off until if you like to make a comment

3629
03:57:44,960 --> 03:57:49,680
 go for it well I would just throw out to the audience kind of give a sense where I'm at

3630
03:57:49,680 --> 03:57:54,840
 get some feedback when we come back in I'd like to hit a couple points if I may I think

3631
03:57:54,840 --> 03:57:59,320
 one point that was made and I think the property owner is probably going to be looking at pretty

3632
03:57:59,320 --> 03:58:04,640
 seriously too is the high cost of infrastructure whether it's going to be worth it to build

3633
03:58:04,640 --> 03:58:11,080
 what he wants to build and add the infrastructure that he's going to need in the form of water

3634
03:58:11,080 --> 03:58:17,940
 and sewage so that's something that yeah should be considered if we're gonna anything that

3635
03:58:17,940 --> 03:58:22,120
 gets rezoned in our MU and then they don't come in and build what they say they're going

3636
03:58:22,120 --> 03:58:26,560
 to build it opens it up NRM you can build a lot of things in there that in our in our

3637
03:58:26,560 --> 03:58:32,720
 in you 12 can't bars of being one of them of course it has to have a little not a special

3638
03:58:32,720 --> 03:58:37,600
 use permit but it has to meet certain criteria to allow that it would come before this commission

3639
03:58:37,600 --> 03:58:45,840
 to do so now on the other hand the traffic issue I and somebody help me with this I understand

3640
03:58:45,840 --> 03:58:51,200
 that everybody's concerned about traffic on Windsor but I'm not sure how this apartment

3641
03:58:51,200 --> 03:58:57,320
 complex or any apartment complex that faces and can only be exited and entered off Elm

3642
03:58:57,320 --> 03:59:02,720
 Street can impact Windsor that much that you're not going to have already you're right we're

3643
03:59:02,720 --> 03:59:08,920
 going to have growth and I wish it was going to be commercial as much as residential in

3644
03:59:08,920 --> 03:59:14,680
 fact that's one of the concerns I've got here is that whole area could be opened up to wall

3645
03:59:14,680 --> 03:59:20,080
 to wall apartments multifamily so I want to see some commercial in there but eventually

3646
03:59:20,080 --> 03:59:24,520
 as that grows eventually you're going to see some more traffic on Windsor but there's a

3647
03:59:24,520 --> 03:59:27,840
 pretty good barrier there where people are going to be forced if they're coming from

3648
03:59:27,840 --> 03:59:32,880
 the south they're going to come up Carol Boulevard they're going to hit Elm and then go up Elm

3649
03:59:32,880 --> 03:59:38,960
 that way the other direction would be coming down Bonnie Bray yeah you're going to get

3650
03:59:38,960 --> 03:59:44,280
 a little traffic from that but I just don't see that being a major issue especially with

3651
03:59:44,280 --> 03:59:49,720
 one complex as that whole area gets developed as that whole area gets developed you're going

3652
03:59:49,720 --> 04:00:01,240
 to see some anyway okay so just that no no sorry hang on the mixed use well I mentioned

3653
04:00:01,240 --> 04:00:06,200
 that I am concerned that we're going to do more apartments in our commercial so that's

3654
04:00:06,200 --> 04:00:10,200
 something that I mentioned in the work session that I hope staff can look at and as a commission

3655
04:00:10,200 --> 04:00:14,520
 we can look at that we just don't open the door strictly to apartments here that we get

3656
04:00:14,520 --> 04:00:20,160
 some useful commercial development in there so you people aren't having to go to Razor

3657
04:00:20,160 --> 04:00:25,480
 Ranch or go into town or anything like that you can do it within walking distance again

3658
04:00:25,480 --> 04:00:31,480
 whether it's NRMU or NRMU 12 they can build apartments here by right right now and I know

3659
04:00:31,480 --> 04:00:35,840
 12 doesn't seem like a lot but if you do that all the way along there you're still going

3660
04:00:35,840 --> 04:00:43,800
 to have the same problems and concerns you're going to have so whether it takes away from

3661
04:00:43,800 --> 04:00:48,600
 the type of people who move in there or not no one knows that for sure but if we right

3662
04:00:48,600 --> 04:00:53,080
 now if we did nothing you could still have apartments all the way up down there but again

3663
04:00:53,080 --> 04:00:57,600
 one of my concerns I'm sure the concern some of the other commissioners is we want to develop

3664
04:00:57,600 --> 04:01:04,880
 that where there is a true mixed use in there and I think that's all the points I want to

3665
04:01:04,880 --> 04:01:14,620
 make so this bender I think you had a concern about something if you'd like to come down

3666
04:01:14,620 --> 04:01:19,000
 would that be okay for her to do that yes you have a question for you do you have a

3667
04:01:19,000 --> 04:01:29,560
 question about the traffic issue along Windsor Drive that I mentioned that what you consider

3668
04:01:29,560 --> 04:01:34,840
 to be not that big of a concern is actually a significant concern because Windsor is using

3669
04:01:34,840 --> 04:01:41,560
 it as a I use it all the time to get fraud to raise a ranch to get to Sherman and more

3670
04:01:41,560 --> 04:01:45,600
 people because we're all looking for backwards right it's hard to get anywhere in town now

3671
04:01:45,600 --> 04:01:52,800
 right so we're all looking for alternative routes and so the higher density the population

3672
04:01:52,800 --> 04:01:57,640
 grows in that area and I know it's going to happen right the more people will be using

3673
04:01:57,640 --> 04:02:05,380
 Windsor for that purpose which makes it a pretty many thoroughfares all the way from

3674
04:02:05,380 --> 04:02:13,520
 out 35 to 288 almost right and that's what to a major community park right so it has

3675
04:02:13,520 --> 04:02:18,840
 a pedestrian and bike component it does and that helps sometimes I think that the traffic

3676
04:02:18,840 --> 04:02:23,800
 a little bit I just I just wanted I know y'all I just wanted to counter that I I do believe

3677
04:02:23,800 --> 04:02:31,320
 it is far more of a significance concern than you're suggesting because yes while the entrance

3678
04:02:31,320 --> 04:02:40,760
 and exit into this proposed apartment housing right would be on elm people will be using

3679
04:02:40,760 --> 04:02:46,400
 Windsor to get where they need to go and it's already it's already dangerous right it's

3680
04:02:46,400 --> 04:02:51,100
 already I don't I don't walk my kids across the street to go to the park but again you're

3681
04:02:51,100 --> 04:02:59,960
 going to have that if it says NRU 12 - yes I understand that there will be increased

3682
04:02:59,960 --> 04:03:06,520
 traffic but there is there is a way that we can try and prevent it right try and limit

3683
04:03:06,520 --> 04:03:16,520
 it in some way that would be ideal okay thank you very much Mr. Pernitta so I'm probably

3684
04:03:16,520 --> 04:03:25,120
 going to leave myself open to some harassment in the future I live in North Lakes so I kind

3685
04:03:25,120 --> 04:03:31,880
 of feel your sympathy you know I feel so because you know I go down Windsor I jog at night

3686
04:03:31,880 --> 04:03:36,160
 I like to jog at night because you know just to get away from the heat and one of the biggest

3687
04:03:36,160 --> 04:03:40,000
 things that breaks my heart is that nice big open field that's on the corner of Hinkle

3688
04:03:40,000 --> 04:03:46,280
 and Windsor is going to be gone I liked walking by running by high grass I don't know why

3689
04:03:46,280 --> 04:03:51,920
 so you know when we talk about Windsor you know I didn't know I was walking by your house

3690
04:03:51,920 --> 04:04:02,840
 my wife and I go up there often yeah exactly so you know one of the things you know I would

3691
04:04:02,840 --> 04:04:06,800
 encourage everybody to do because one of the one of the things that we hear a lot is that

3692
04:04:06,800 --> 04:04:12,280
 there are concerns about traffic and everything and I and I feel you I you know I a pedestrian

3693
04:04:12,280 --> 04:04:18,680
 there and I get hit countless almost almost hit countless times you know I would encourage

3694
04:04:18,680 --> 04:04:23,480
 people to talk to city council about you know possibly widening Windsor and things like that

3695
04:04:23,480 --> 04:04:29,240
 because in addition to the thing that we're putting on Hinkle and Windsor which breaks

3696
04:04:29,240 --> 04:04:36,840
 my heart tonight we put you know 236 units on Bonnie Bray just north of where the school

3697
04:04:36,840 --> 04:04:41,960
 is going to go and those people are going to go on those same streets and everything

3698
04:04:41,960 --> 04:04:45,960
 I don't know how I feel about you know about what's been proposed tonight yet and I'll

3699
04:04:45,960 --> 04:04:50,240
 also deliberate and I'll see what they come back with because as somebody who wants affordable

3700
04:04:50,240 --> 04:04:54,720
 housing I look at this and I also kind of cringe because then I find myself going you

3701
04:04:54,720 --> 04:05:00,320
 know feeling that not in my backyard thing but you know I guess the point I wanted to

3702
04:05:00,320 --> 04:05:06,760
 say is that you know you know kind of what Larry was saying you know I do understand

3703
04:05:06,760 --> 04:05:11,440
 the traffic in Windsor I do understand everything around it you know no matter what happens I

3704
04:05:11,440 --> 04:05:16,480
 always encourage people to talk to city council especially when it comes to things that affect

3705
04:05:16,480 --> 04:05:22,640
 the roads because my daughter walks to Calhoun you know every day I walk my son to Newton

3706
04:05:22,640 --> 04:05:28,240
 razor and I've seen the development that goes there and that is a concern to me so in addition

3707
04:05:28,240 --> 04:05:32,000
 to this I would encourage people I would encourage everyone in the neighborhood to make sure

3708
04:05:32,000 --> 04:05:37,280
 that whatever we do in terms of you know we do traffic studies but the traffic studies

3709
04:05:37,280 --> 04:05:43,100
 don't always reflect the real impact of what you know people who walk in and live and play

3710
04:05:43,100 --> 04:05:49,560
 in a vibrant neighborhood do so just wanted to toss it out there thanks Commissioner for

3711
04:05:49,560 --> 04:05:55,960
 now before we move on to the next item the only I would say is I don't speak on behalf

3712
04:05:55,960 --> 04:06:00,600
 of the commissioners but when we come into a meeting like this what we have is it's typically

3713
04:06:00,600 --> 04:06:03,600
 data it sounds like Commissioner for now might have more first-hand knowledge I don't I don't

3714
04:06:03,600 --> 04:06:08,440
 have first-hand knowledge of the area so we have data and staff analysis and citizens

3715
04:06:08,440 --> 04:06:13,880
 coming out and vocalizing and providing feedback of what's happening on the ground is infinitely

3716
04:06:13,880 --> 04:06:20,000
 important for us to have a healthy perspective of the context of the situation and so thank

3717
04:06:20,000 --> 04:06:23,120
 you for coming out here it's certainly been enlightening to me to understand kind of the

3718
04:06:23,120 --> 04:06:26,760
 scope what's going on I would encourage you and invite your neighbors to come out to the

3719
04:06:26,760 --> 04:06:32,440
 next meeting in terms of the next meeting a couple notes if you did fill out a card this

3720
04:06:32,440 --> 04:06:36,840
 evening the city will come they will follow up with you and remind you and let you know

3721
04:06:36,840 --> 04:06:40,960
 the next meeting so you're not falling through the cracks and invites you back and so these

3722
04:06:40,960 --> 04:06:46,800
 will be filed away and your phone numbers will be used to contact you and then secondly

3723
04:06:46,800 --> 04:06:52,560
 not knowing how the applicants going to come back it could include an SUP which is a different

3724
04:06:52,560 --> 04:06:57,480
 type of approval it will be in a separate agenda item which would provide separate ability

3725
04:06:57,480 --> 04:07:04,040
 to speak but your opposition to one item does not correlate to another so if you have opinions

3726
04:07:04,040 --> 04:07:10,480
 on either item they need to be expressed independently we can't apply one to the other so if that's

3727
04:07:10,480 --> 04:07:15,080
 helpful going forward to know that they're they're potentially could be two items coming

3728
04:07:15,080 --> 04:07:21,200
 back before you in February so if anyone else has any other thing certainly provide the

3729
04:07:21,200 --> 04:07:27,600
 day is an opportunity if not we will move on to the next item what I'll do is is maybe

3730
04:07:27,600 --> 04:07:31,400
 provide a five minute recess to clear the room unless you're staying for our tree talk

3731
04:07:31,400 --> 04:07:39,960
 then we'll pick that up in about five minutes thank you and welcome back to our final item

3732
04:07:39,960 --> 04:07:49,480
 which is item H it is DCA 18-008 a discussion about proposed revisions to the Denton Development

3733
04:07:49,480 --> 04:08:02,160
 Code subchapters seven thirteen and seventeen the floor Richard Richard can only Development

3734
04:08:02,160 --> 04:08:07,400
 Services Department what I wanted to do is I guess I'll call this our soft opening for

3735
04:08:07,400 --> 04:08:12,880
 a public hearing on on the on the tree code I know we've we've talked about this a number

3736
04:08:12,880 --> 04:08:18,800
 of times in in a work session but wanted to at least start the process to be able to talk

3737
04:08:18,800 --> 04:08:25,640
 about it publicly as well as get those individuals in the audience or from the public public

3738
04:08:25,640 --> 04:08:31,520
 would like to comment we are planning on coming back in in two weeks again for another public

3739
04:08:31,520 --> 04:08:36,280
 hearing just to kind of continue that continue that discussion what we will make sure that

3740
04:08:36,280 --> 04:08:43,080
 we do is try to get the word out a little bit more to the various groups that are interested

3741
04:08:43,080 --> 04:08:48,960
 but again this is this is just kind of the first of many before before we ultimately

3742
04:08:48,960 --> 04:08:56,000
 adopt this the draft that that is part of the packet has not been fully vetted by legal

3743
04:08:56,000 --> 04:09:01,840
 so there's we're still kind of in that concept stage so I suspect when we come back it might

3744
04:09:01,840 --> 04:09:05,240
 be a little bit you know some of the language might be a little bit tighter and and how

3745
04:09:05,240 --> 04:09:10,960
 we interpret some of the some of the items from from this last house bill will probably

3746
04:09:10,960 --> 04:09:16,560
 be somewhat different as well so with that I'll just kind of jump in jump into the presentation

3747
04:09:16,560 --> 04:09:21,960
 feel free to stop me anytime when we when we first looked at this we really wanted to

3748
04:09:21,960 --> 04:09:27,720
 you know we started working on a variety of number of drafts that were out there and quite

3749
04:09:27,720 --> 04:09:31,480
 honestly I was getting confused at some point as far as which draft was the last one that

3750
04:09:31,480 --> 04:09:35,800
 was presented to the various different groups and so we kind of just stepped back and looked

3751
04:09:35,800 --> 04:09:38,880
 at it and okay let's let's really look at this holistically and what we're trying to

3752
04:09:38,880 --> 04:09:43,520
 accomplish and let let's really kind of set up how we should how we should look at this

3753
04:09:43,520 --> 04:09:49,600
 moving forward and and the base really being that that State of the Denton State of State

3754
04:09:49,600 --> 04:09:54,200
 of the Denton Urban Force that was done in 2016 and let's kind of use that as as as kind

3755
04:09:54,200 --> 04:09:59,680
 of the base map if you will in in in moving forward from there really setting goals of

3756
04:09:59,680 --> 04:10:04,680
 what we what we want this ordinance to be or what we want want it to accomplish and

3757
04:10:04,680 --> 04:10:09,000
 what we've seen I think in the in the past have been these little fixes throughout where

3758
04:10:09,000 --> 04:10:14,160
 we really haven't fixed the whole ordinance together and so so that attempt is is really

3759
04:10:14,160 --> 04:10:20,040
 let's set some goals and then really look at how can we achieve those both from a regulatory

3760
04:10:20,040 --> 04:10:26,360
 or private private perspective but also programmatically through through how we spend our public funds

3761
04:10:26,360 --> 04:10:31,080
 whether that be through capital improvement projects through tree fund dollars and and

3762
04:10:31,080 --> 04:10:37,200
 the like but but most importantly how how how are we performing how how are these ordinances

3763
04:10:37,200 --> 04:10:41,780
 or these codes that we write on what what results are they actually producing and making

3764
04:10:41,780 --> 04:10:48,560
 sure that we have sort of a report card or metrics and we can we can evaluate this annually

3765
04:10:48,560 --> 04:10:52,600
 and so that so the way we kind of set this up kind of try to color code it yellow and

3766
04:10:52,600 --> 04:11:00,160
 blue me makes green is is go through the background sort of past and present talk get into the

3767
04:11:00,160 --> 04:11:07,560
 kind of that the main breast of the conversation the regulatory or the private side get into

3768
04:11:07,560 --> 04:11:12,040
 a little bit of the tree fund and then and then kind of hit on on some of the programmatic

3769
04:11:12,040 --> 04:11:16,960
 changes that that recently have occurred particularly in our parks department with the creation

3770
04:11:16,960 --> 04:11:23,220
 of the of a forestry division and so a little bit of background kind of touch on this briefly

3771
04:11:23,220 --> 04:11:29,080
 the tree code was born out of like a lot of things public outcry over redevelopment of

3772
04:11:29,080 --> 04:11:35,840
 of flow hospital and so the first tree preservation landscape requirements as we have it today

3773
04:11:35,840 --> 04:11:41,320
 were adopted in two thousand four a year later there was a committee established to recommend

3774
04:11:41,320 --> 04:11:47,080
 tightening that ordinance so from a year after it's been adopted there were always concerns

3775
04:11:47,080 --> 04:11:54,080
 with the ordinance wasn't wasn't performing to how how it should be and as you can see

3776
04:11:54,080 --> 04:12:00,600
 the the variety of of attempts and and and reports that went back and forth and and and

3777
04:12:00,600 --> 04:12:05,120
 various committees there was never consensus in how to how to actually move forward in

3778
04:12:05,120 --> 04:12:10,960
 in addressing it in two thousand and fifty in fourteen council directed staff again to

3779
04:12:10,960 --> 04:12:17,040
 proceed with an update to accomplish there were three objectives that were were outlined

3780
04:12:17,040 --> 04:12:21,360
 one one being that I've had provided more robust code that will expand and protect tree

3781
04:12:21,360 --> 04:12:26,440
 canopy including planning of trees on private property with expenditures from the tree fund

3782
04:12:26,440 --> 04:12:33,200
 and so in two thousand and fifteen there there was one change to the to the to the tree tree

3783
04:12:33,200 --> 04:12:39,240
 ordinance that allowed tree mitigation funds for the planning of of trees on private property

3784
04:12:39,240 --> 04:12:43,520
 as ordinance two thousand fifteen two five two I'm not aware that we've actually done

3785
04:12:43,520 --> 04:12:51,200
 that but that that that language was changed in the in the code back in twenty fifteen

3786
04:12:51,200 --> 04:12:57,160
 year later that's when we had the the Denton urban forest state of urban force was completed

3787
04:12:57,160 --> 04:13:02,480
 and then as you know over the last over the last two years at least there's been a variety

3788
04:13:02,480 --> 04:13:09,300
 a variety of drafts back and forth there's also a work session that talked about purchasing

3789
04:13:09,300 --> 04:13:15,280
 properties for preservation there were five properties at that that time they had considered

3790
04:13:15,280 --> 04:13:20,080
 none of which were purchased at that time and it was sort of how how do we you know

3791
04:13:20,080 --> 04:13:25,920
 establish metrics or or kind of a decision tree for that and then kind of in the midst

3792
04:13:25,920 --> 04:13:32,100
 of all of this there was a legislative session House Bill seven forty four failed they brought

3793
04:13:32,100 --> 04:13:39,280
 it back at a special session House Bill seven which was signed into law creating two one

3794
04:13:39,280 --> 04:13:46,240
 two zero nine five local government code specifically dealing with tree preservation kind of where

3795
04:13:46,240 --> 04:13:53,800
 we were over where we are over the last year we we went to city council for a work session

3796
04:13:53,800 --> 04:13:59,640
 in in April to talk sort of some policy get some policy direction we then followed that

3797
04:13:59,640 --> 04:14:04,640
 up with with committee on the environment in in May and as you can see we've and as

3798
04:14:04,640 --> 04:14:08,720
 you know we've we've kind of gone back and forth a number of times with various drafts

3799
04:14:08,720 --> 04:14:13,480
 and and kind of building up to kind of the concepts or discussion draft that that we

3800
04:14:13,480 --> 04:14:19,640
 have in front of you today and again looking really at at the base of this is is that policy

3801
04:14:19,640 --> 04:14:25,320
 discussion that we had in April in May but then really looking at at making sure we comply

3802
04:14:25,320 --> 04:14:30,320
 with local government code increased preservation and mitigation kind of the charge back from

3803
04:14:30,320 --> 04:14:35,720
 two thousand and five and then and then making sure that we really unified unify our our

3804
04:14:35,720 --> 04:14:41,560
 landscape and and ESA standards among among others House Bill seven I'll just touch on

3805
04:14:41,560 --> 04:14:48,660
 on briefly there are some some limitations that we can and can't do with respect to requiring

3806
04:14:48,660 --> 04:14:56,440
 mitigation for for homeowners if if it's under ten inches DBH it's four and a half feet above

3807
04:14:56,440 --> 04:15:04,040
 we're limited in required in in in requiring any mitigation for that same with any dead

3808
04:15:04,040 --> 04:15:09,640
 or disease tree or tree that poses an eminent or immediate threat to a person or property

3809
04:15:09,640 --> 04:15:13,880
 I don't know what that means to be quite honest yet that was in a local government code there

3810
04:15:13,880 --> 04:15:20,680
 was a a bill that was brought forward maybe two or three years ago it was the I before

3811
04:15:20,680 --> 04:15:25,600
 I was in Texas but we I always heard it as the fire tree bill and that was one where

3812
04:15:25,600 --> 04:15:29,760
 there was a fire I don't know if it was I forget which city it was in and there was

3813
04:15:29,760 --> 04:15:34,160
 a discussion that if they were able to take down the trees they wouldn't have had the

3814
04:15:34,160 --> 04:15:38,800
 fire and cause the damage well there's no tree preservation ordinance in that city but

3815
04:15:38,800 --> 04:15:44,040
 but the bill had to do with if you felt that a tree was going to pose an eminent threat

3816
04:15:44,040 --> 04:15:49,920
 you're able to remove it without any any sort of repercussions it ultimately didn't pass

3817
04:15:49,920 --> 04:15:54,480
 but I have a feeling that's where this language kind of carried forward but that's just something

3818
04:15:54,480 --> 04:15:59,480
 we need to ultimately flush out with with the city attorney's office mitigation fee

3819
04:15:59,480 --> 04:16:05,800
 credit and even if a municipality imposes a mitigation fee you have to allow a credit

3820
04:16:05,800 --> 04:16:12,960
 for the tree for a tree planting to offset that amount we do that now but we just want

3821
04:16:12,960 --> 04:16:17,200
 to make sure that we carry that forward one thing that that's that's I thought was interesting

3822
04:16:17,200 --> 04:16:23,800
 they they specify in that bill the size of the tree that that has to be planted so it's

3823
04:16:23,800 --> 04:16:30,680
 only a two two inch tree at DBH which is a little interesting because when you trees that

3824
04:16:30,680 --> 04:16:35,480
 size you typically don't measure it DBH are typically done in a caliper basis so that's

3825
04:16:35,480 --> 04:16:39,640
 just something we have to we have to contend through as as we work through this as we work

3826
04:16:39,640 --> 04:16:45,320
 through the language there's also there's also a section that talks about credit for

3827
04:16:45,320 --> 04:16:51,800
 residential and and non-residential there's a 50 percent credit for residential 40 percent

3828
04:16:51,800 --> 04:16:59,240
 credit for for non-residential as I stated previously there's a number of different ways

3829
04:16:59,240 --> 04:17:03,200
 I think even even us internally I think we read it read it all we have three different

3830
04:17:03,200 --> 04:17:08,960
 ways to interpret this very few cities have haven't have amended their codes to really

3831
04:17:08,960 --> 04:17:14,960
 address it we sort of modeled but but Irving did but but really took more of a liberal

3832
04:17:14,960 --> 04:17:20,240
 approach and just applied the 50 percent credit to both residential and and non-residential

3833
04:17:20,240 --> 04:17:26,800
 for an easier way to just enforce that and then you get into a mixed use development

3834
04:17:26,800 --> 04:17:30,720
 and then how do you how do you differentiate between there so we thought 50 percent would

3835
04:17:30,720 --> 04:17:36,480
 just be across the board be be be the easiest and then getting in again getting into some

3836
04:17:36,480 --> 04:17:41,520
 of the backgrounds and goals you know again unified approach making sure we comply with

3837
04:17:41,520 --> 04:17:46,560
 with local government code limit clear-cutting require mitigation for all trees removed guide

3838
04:17:46,560 --> 04:17:51,200
 priorities to preserving larger and quality trees tree stains and habitat promoting that

3839
04:17:51,200 --> 04:17:56,380
 multi-aged urban forest with native and quality trees and then balance that with with with

3840
04:17:56,380 --> 04:18:02,640
 reasonable development and one of the early discussions was a canopy goal for the city

3841
04:18:02,640 --> 04:18:07,240
 part of it had to do with preservation if you recall there was a we had a discussion

3842
04:18:07,240 --> 04:18:14,400
 whether it should be on on DBH or on canopy sort of the direction we we got was we were

3843
04:18:14,400 --> 04:18:21,520
 okay with with setting the the the preservation on a D on a can on I'm sorry on a DBH basis

3844
04:18:21,520 --> 04:18:26,800
 diameter at breast height but still keeping that overall canopy goal or preservation is

3845
04:18:26,800 --> 04:18:32,120
 just a component of that we still have landscaping that that speaks to that and so the summary

3846
04:18:32,120 --> 04:18:39,360
 the changes kind of kind of big picture for for this for this for this opening night applicability

3847
04:18:39,360 --> 04:18:44,160
 types of tree again getting a little bit more into the preservation and landscape the meat

3848
04:18:44,160 --> 04:18:51,880
 of it some some new options with respect to tree preservation and habitat and then get

3849
04:18:51,880 --> 04:18:59,400
 into the mitigation applicability we remove the exemptions primarily for city facilities

3850
04:18:59,400 --> 04:19:05,540
 with the exception of of the city airport for obvious reasons there's not many trees

3851
04:19:05,540 --> 04:19:12,160
 at the airport to begin with but we did leave that in single-family and duplex lots with

3852
04:19:12,160 --> 04:19:18,400
 trees under 10 inches at DBH currently we exempt all single-family and duplex one of

3853
04:19:18,400 --> 04:19:23,640
 the initial policy discussions we have is had was should we just adopt but you know

3854
04:19:23,640 --> 04:19:28,160
 but was in the local government code and that was sort of the direction we got at that time

3855
04:19:28,160 --> 04:19:33,280
 and so that's that's why that is the way the way it is today at least in the draft whether

3856
04:19:33,280 --> 04:19:39,080
 we ultimately change that through through discussion but that's that's where it is today the tree

3857
04:19:39,080 --> 04:19:46,280
 types and mitigation this is obviously one of the most discussed items primarily as it

3858
04:19:46,280 --> 04:19:54,480
 retain as it pertains to secondary trees we've we've reduced the category of trees to just

3859
04:19:54,480 --> 04:20:01,000
 landmark heritage quality and secondary so right now the 30 percent minimum preservation

3860
04:20:01,000 --> 04:20:06,480
 of DBH is based off of either landmark heritage or quality so secondary trees there is no

3861
04:20:06,480 --> 04:20:12,920
 minimum preservation of those trees however whatever you remove you are required to mitigate

3862
04:20:12,920 --> 04:20:21,080
 there's a replacement rate I'll call them the green trees if you will for simple to

3863
04:20:21,080 --> 04:20:27,200
 keep it simple they're at a replacement rate on a per inch basis so that the the larger

3864
04:20:27,200 --> 04:20:33,520
 the tree the more the more the replacement rate is so if you're a landmark tree and

3865
04:20:33,520 --> 04:20:39,600
 the replacement rates at four to one for a heritage it's at three to one and a quality

3866
04:20:39,600 --> 04:20:44,640
 it's a one to one when you get to secondary the replacement rate is instead of on an inch

3867
04:20:44,640 --> 04:20:48,760
 by inch basis it's it's so you take out a tree you have to replace it you have to replace

3868
04:20:48,760 --> 04:20:53,120
 it with a tree from from the approved tree list where it gets a little where it gets

3869
04:20:53,120 --> 04:21:00,440
 a little convoluted is in our criteria manual we have we have a list of numerous types of

3870
04:21:00,440 --> 04:21:04,720
 trees we have native trees but then we have preferred and then we have a not preferred

3871
04:21:04,720 --> 04:21:10,440
 list and so the majority of the secondary trees for preservation are on kind of the

3872
04:21:10,440 --> 04:21:15,840
 non-preferred planting list already so you can't get credit for planning those you're

3873
04:21:15,840 --> 04:21:20,960
 not supposed to get credit for planning those based on canopy and so it's just trying to

3874
04:21:20,960 --> 04:21:26,920
 just clean trying to clean all of that up however a secondary tree Boadark hackberry

3875
04:21:26,920 --> 04:21:33,960
 or cottonwood could be a heritage tree if it's 18 inches or greater and so we've we

3876
04:21:33,960 --> 04:21:37,080
 we try to kind of meet in the middle on on some of the stuff initially we were exempting

3877
04:21:37,080 --> 04:21:45,680
 it it totally tree types again non-protected trees mesquite honey locusts crepe myrtle

3878
04:21:45,680 --> 04:21:50,560
 diseases are dead trees again the eminent the eminent or immediate threat and then any

3879
04:21:50,560 --> 04:21:58,480
 tree listed on the department of ag noxious and invasive plant list again one of the major

3880
04:21:58,480 --> 04:22:03,600
 major points of contention or discussion items have been you know the mesquite and honey

3881
04:22:03,600 --> 04:22:10,040
 locust and whether or not those should be a non-protected tree or a or a protected secondary

3882
04:22:10,040 --> 04:22:18,160
 tree and even should secondary should we require preservation of secondary trees again we we

3883
04:22:18,160 --> 04:22:24,060
 added in because we have the concept of preserve habitat or conservation easement allowing

3884
04:22:24,060 --> 04:22:30,040
 a mesquite or or honey locusts to remain if those areas were adjacent to a an ESA for

3885
04:22:30,040 --> 04:22:35,160
 example where where it's you're not going to have much interaction with with individuals

3886
04:22:35,160 --> 04:22:40,260
 anyways so that was sort of our our attempt to to try to again try to meet meet and meet

3887
04:22:40,260 --> 04:22:48,120
 in the middle and and this is this is my my my barbara club that that he would have actually

3888
04:22:48,120 --> 04:22:53,320
 brought because I I just could not I mean I've seen that the thorns on a mesquite but

3889
04:22:53,320 --> 04:22:59,040
 on on the honey locusts I never really pictured it to be this this large and so you can see

3890
04:22:59,040 --> 04:23:06,920
 this the branch is not that big but the thorns are quite large so over just about three three

3891
04:23:06,920 --> 04:23:12,000
 inches so you know these are I don't know if we really want to preserve these with it

3892
04:23:12,000 --> 04:23:19,280
 within a within a landscape buffer or or or parking lot so again it's just looking at

3893
04:23:19,280 --> 04:23:28,240
 it in in that that that that perspective landscape and and preservation at this point I'm going

3894
04:23:28,240 --> 04:23:38,400
 to have Haley come up this is really been her Mr. Beck thank you chair this future public

3895
04:23:38,400 --> 04:23:44,160
 hearing you're going to have that is there a date certain on that the next week the 12th

3896
04:23:44,160 --> 04:23:49,920
 okay is this going to be a PNZ yep okay any chance we can do it earlier I mean because

3897
04:23:49,920 --> 04:23:55,320
 if you're going to get the public here you don't want the last presentation of the we

3898
04:23:55,320 --> 04:24:00,560
 certainly could okay just something we can put that as the first agenda item okay to

3899
04:24:00,560 --> 04:24:15,920
 get a lot of public input I would thank you not a problem right so the one of the main

3900
04:24:15,920 --> 04:24:20,560
 goals of the code update is of course improving our minimum standards for landscape entry

3901
04:24:20,560 --> 04:24:25,000
 canopy so the three major elements that will aid in that are the preservation component

3902
04:24:25,000 --> 04:24:30,680
 that Richard will speak to a little bit further here in a moment but buffers and landscape

3903
04:24:30,680 --> 04:24:35,040
 area are also important in looking at that some of the major changes we're looking at

3904
04:24:35,040 --> 04:24:39,640
 in the landscape code are allowing preserve trees that are within what we're now calling

3905
04:24:39,640 --> 04:24:44,520
 the development impact area of a site to count towards the tree canopy current code only

3906
04:24:44,520 --> 04:24:50,160
 allows you to count those trees if they are in excess of the minimum preservation we also

3907
04:24:50,160 --> 04:24:55,160
 are adding language to encourage and require biodiversity within the trees planted on a

3908
04:24:55,160 --> 04:24:59,680
 site so that in the event there is some sort of pest or disease that comes through that

3909
04:24:59,680 --> 04:25:05,240
 not all of the trees on site would be wiped out potentially we are adopting some low impact

3910
04:25:05,240 --> 04:25:10,160
 development standards that were first introduced by clarion in the draft DDC we thought those

3911
04:25:10,160 --> 04:25:14,800
 were worth bringing forward ahead of time with the landscape code and then we are also

3912
04:25:14,800 --> 04:25:20,120
 proposing to eliminate the credits are currently in the code for pervious paving to count as

3913
04:25:20,120 --> 04:25:24,600
 landscaping on the site as well as eliminating the credits for ESA that were introduced with

3914
04:25:24,600 --> 04:25:32,580
 the latest version of subchapter 17 specifically the the ESA code that was recently adopted

3915
04:25:32,580 --> 04:25:37,200
 allows for one square foot of canopy credit for every square foot of ESA canopy as well

3916
04:25:37,200 --> 04:25:43,080
 as two square feet of landscaping credit for every square foot of tree ESA and one square

3917
04:25:43,080 --> 04:25:47,960
 foot for every square foot of non-wooded ESA that's preserved on the site as you'll see

3918
04:25:47,960 --> 04:25:52,280
 a little bit later with the development impact area concept we're proposing to take ESAs

3919
04:25:52,280 --> 04:25:55,800
 out of the mix altogether their preservation will still be required but it won't count

3920
04:25:55,800 --> 04:26:03,400
 for or against the development when they look to what their required landscaping is on site.

3921
04:26:03,400 --> 04:26:08,040
 So speaking of buffers what we have in our code currently that you've probably heard

3922
04:26:08,040 --> 04:26:12,920
 reference to even this evening is the type A B C and D that are very prescriptive what

3923
04:26:12,920 --> 04:26:18,280
 we're proposing is with the table that you see here depending on what your use is it

3924
04:26:18,280 --> 04:26:23,360
 would prescribe a number of points that you have to meet within the required buffer area

3925
04:26:23,360 --> 04:26:28,120
 and then to meet those points there is a proposed list of options that include fencing various

3926
04:26:28,120 --> 04:26:31,680
 sizes of trees and shrubs so you can kind of pick and choose what fits best for your

3927
04:26:31,680 --> 04:26:37,400
 site so just an example that we've looked at before whereas the type D buffer now is

3928
04:26:37,400 --> 04:26:42,200
 a very specific number of trees and shrubs under this system there'd be multiple ways

3929
04:26:42,200 --> 04:26:46,860
 of meeting that that could be as simple as a masonry wall or any combination of landscaping

3930
04:26:46,860 --> 04:26:51,000
 that would work with your site design.

3931
04:26:51,000 --> 04:26:55,880
 Similarly we're proposing a point system for all other aspects of site landscaping so

3932
04:26:55,880 --> 04:27:00,000
 we'd require moving forward that a landscape plan be provided that demonstrates a minimum

3933
04:27:00,000 --> 04:27:04,920
 of 30 points are provided on the site as well as that the site meets the minimum landscaping

3934
04:27:04,920 --> 04:27:07,680
 canopy percentages.

3935
04:27:07,680 --> 04:27:12,240
 So within these options we would require that two of the elements be in the form of right

3936
04:27:12,240 --> 04:27:16,840
 away screening so that we have adequate screening for parking lots along the street and that

3937
04:27:16,840 --> 04:27:20,840
 two of the elements be from within the internal parking lot landscaping categories to ensure

3938
04:27:20,840 --> 04:27:24,900
 that we have adequate canopy and shade within our parking lots and then the remaining points

3939
04:27:24,900 --> 04:27:28,760
 could be from any of the options.

3940
04:27:28,760 --> 04:27:32,320
 So just looking at some of those options you can see for right away screening we have five

3941
04:27:32,320 --> 04:27:36,420
 different things listed there a variety of things that could fit in different widths

3942
04:27:36,420 --> 04:27:40,760
 of areas in front of the parking lot and then within the parking lot there are options that

3943
04:27:40,760 --> 04:27:45,200
 include internal islands end caps at the end of your parking rows as well as an option

3944
04:27:45,200 --> 04:27:49,440
 for a landscape median between rows of spaces.

3945
04:27:49,440 --> 04:27:53,240
 And then other elements on the site this is where we get a little creative and introduce

3946
04:27:53,240 --> 04:27:58,700
 some of those low impact design standards such as bioswales bioretention facilities

3947
04:27:58,700 --> 04:28:03,080
 things like that that we haven't explicitly had in the code prior to this.

3948
04:28:03,080 --> 04:28:07,960
 In addition we're also introducing the option for a living walls or even rooftop vegetation

3949
04:28:07,960 --> 04:28:12,120
 is more frequently these days we're seeing requests for that but it doesn't necessarily

3950
04:28:12,120 --> 04:28:16,320
 fit within landscaping in our current code.

3951
04:28:16,320 --> 04:28:20,160
 And then because we've recently found out that Denton is a monarch city we've also added

3952
04:28:20,160 --> 04:28:25,120
 an option for a butterfly or pollinator gardens that hopefully people can find a way to incorporate

3953
04:28:25,120 --> 04:28:27,720
 on their site.

3954
04:28:27,720 --> 04:28:39,240
 And with that I will pass it back to Richard to talk through the development impact areas.

3955
04:28:39,240 --> 04:28:44,680
 If you recall when we first started talking about the various concepts and eliminating

3956
04:28:44,680 --> 04:28:52,360
 the credits for the ESA we came up with the idea of this development impact area and then

3957
04:28:52,360 --> 04:28:57,680
 looked at through our discussions at the Committee on the Environment it's really looking at

3958
04:28:57,680 --> 04:29:05,240
 ways to preserve how can we continue to preserve habitat and it was interesting because around

3959
04:29:05,240 --> 04:29:12,880
 the same time we've had a couple projects that have come in where we also have this

3960
04:29:12,880 --> 04:29:19,160
 concept of artificial lot line that someone can use and it really gets a little convoluted

3961
04:29:19,160 --> 04:29:26,480
 and it works in some instances but there's not a lot of guidance so what we wanted to

3962
04:29:26,480 --> 04:29:33,440
 do is just try to provide a little bit more predictability and also give staff some guidance

3963
04:29:33,440 --> 04:29:37,000
 in what and how it should work.

3964
04:29:37,000 --> 04:29:47,080
 Where right now we had an area that was an industrial property that had an ESA with scrub

3965
04:29:47,080 --> 04:29:52,280
 grass that they were able to count towards meeting their landscape requirements.

3966
04:29:52,280 --> 04:29:58,480
 And so I understand the intent but it really wasn't I don't think getting the results

3967
04:29:58,480 --> 04:30:00,840
 that we really intended.

3968
04:30:00,840 --> 04:30:06,500
 And so with this instance what we did is we if you had an ESA on your site it really was

3969
04:30:06,500 --> 04:30:12,960
 to exclude it from that development impact area and there's a couple of cities a number

3970
04:30:12,960 --> 04:30:19,640
 of cities in the Metroplex that have kind of a similar concept but what we looked at

3971
04:30:19,640 --> 04:30:25,640
 is but also trying to incentivize it so if you do have a preserved habitat you're able

3972
04:30:25,640 --> 04:30:33,040
 to reduce your minimum preservation down to 20%.

3973
04:30:33,040 --> 04:30:40,520
 And then we set some minimums 10% of the total site or 5,000 square foot and then mitigate

3974
04:30:40,520 --> 04:30:46,200
 for that for 80% with some additional credits as a result of that preserved habitat.

3975
04:30:46,200 --> 04:30:51,080
 And then we looked at it as you know should other folks be allowed to take advantage of

3976
04:30:51,080 --> 04:30:55,160
 that if they don't have an ESA and then how do we differentiate it.

3977
04:30:55,160 --> 04:30:58,520
 And so we really came up with sort of this conservation easement or conservation area

3978
04:30:58,520 --> 04:31:03,640
 and we've had this conservation easement in the code for some time and it's really never

3979
04:31:03,640 --> 04:31:06,740
 been never really been used.

3980
04:31:06,740 --> 04:31:13,520
 So we also put that kind of follow the same model as a preserved habitat but also looked

3981
04:31:13,520 --> 04:31:18,240
 at this as a possibility and I'll get to it later in the slide of you know if we do want

3982
04:31:18,240 --> 04:31:22,920
 to look to purchase property or partner with someone with the Tree Fund maybe this is a

3983
04:31:22,920 --> 04:31:29,760
 method that we can do that to preserve some of these some of these natural areas.

3984
04:31:29,760 --> 04:31:35,960
 And so again this development impact area is also relates to the preservation but then

3985
04:31:35,960 --> 04:31:39,120
 your landscape requirements are also based on it so your landscape requirements would

3986
04:31:39,120 --> 04:31:46,520
 not be based on that ESA or if you had a preserved habitat or conservation easement either.

3987
04:31:46,520 --> 04:31:50,680
 And so what I've done is I've just kind of put together you may remember some of these

3988
04:31:50,680 --> 04:31:51,680
 some of these examples.

3989
04:31:51,680 --> 04:31:57,920
 So I kind of gave a single family example a multi-family and a non-residential and so

3990
04:31:57,920 --> 04:32:04,160
 this was a project recently approved on the south end of Bonnie Bray and I know the numbers

3991
04:32:04,160 --> 04:32:09,400
 kind of look a little I know when I first presented to council there were some concern

3992
04:32:09,400 --> 04:32:16,280
 because it's such a reduction in the amount of preserved DBH but I think it was almost

3993
04:32:16,280 --> 04:32:22,840
 ninety percent if not more of the trees that were on this site were hackberry and mesquite

3994
04:32:22,840 --> 04:32:28,960
 and so what this really does is there was a lot less preservation obviously because

3995
04:32:28,960 --> 04:32:36,880
 they were secondary trees under the new and so but the mitigation obviously was much higher

3996
04:32:36,880 --> 04:32:42,360
 and so when you kind of pencil it all out at the end of the day there's a five percent

3997
04:32:42,360 --> 04:32:49,600
 increase of total DBH but you get a much what I guess we would call a much more quality

3998
04:32:49,600 --> 04:32:57,240
 tree as opposed to preserving hackberries and mesquites and honey locusts on the site.

3999
04:32:57,240 --> 04:33:03,480
 And so what we actually did is mapped or attempted to map where those trees were that were preserved

4000
04:33:03,480 --> 04:33:07,680
 based on the tree preservation plan and so what they did is most of them are really stacked

4001
04:33:07,680 --> 04:33:16,160
 up here in the corner anyways but this is a good opportunity also to look at ways to

4002
04:33:16,160 --> 04:33:22,840
 preserve this there is a small little pond on here and that could easily been that conservation

4003
04:33:22,840 --> 04:33:29,640
 area so there is some there is some flexibility with respect to that but I wanted to also

4004
04:33:29,640 --> 04:33:35,280
 point out where we apply that fifty percent credit and so we calculate the DBH removed

4005
04:33:35,280 --> 04:33:41,480
 and you have the calculated DBH which includes those that has those multipliers and then

4006
04:33:41,480 --> 04:33:46,320
 from that point we took that fifty percent credit and then there's additional credit

4007
04:33:46,320 --> 04:33:50,440
 depending on the type of tree again there were I think there were a handful of post

4008
04:33:50,440 --> 04:33:54,600
 oaks out there so since those were preserved you would get you would get you know a greater

4009
04:33:54,600 --> 04:34:00,960
 credit again pushing pushing towards more quality quality trees and so that's sort

4010
04:34:00,960 --> 04:34:05,360
 of the single family example and again some of these are kind of the extremes but wanted

4011
04:34:05,360 --> 04:34:09,400
 to look at it in those perspectives.

4012
04:34:09,400 --> 04:34:18,400
 This is a multi-family site at 404 industrial the change in preservation is a one percent

4013
04:34:18,400 --> 04:34:27,360
 reduction however there were substantial hack berries on the site that would require mitigation

4014
04:34:27,360 --> 04:34:34,320
 and so that 365 inches is really because it's two inches per tree so that's where we came

4015
04:34:34,320 --> 04:34:41,720
 up with that number and so you look at the total DBH is 141 percent this site poses some

4016
04:34:41,720 --> 04:34:47,380
 other challenges this is one where they were able to use quite a bit of their driveway

4017
04:34:47,380 --> 04:34:53,320
 and paved area as credit for open space because it was before some of the code changed now

4018
04:34:53,320 --> 04:34:58,560
 and so whether or not this this could actually develop as it does today may may not be able

4019
04:34:58,560 --> 04:35:04,380
 to or just in a different in a different form or form or fashion.

4020
04:35:04,380 --> 04:35:10,520
 This is the one that that I think everybody knows the site that again I think was a lot

4021
04:35:10,520 --> 04:35:19,040
 of the similar to when this was first created there was a lot of people were upset about

4022
04:35:19,040 --> 04:35:24,260
 that the post books that were removed on this property for a restaurant and so just looking

4023
04:35:24,260 --> 04:35:31,400
 at kind of the comparison so based on the proposed it would have been 80 percent more

4024
04:35:31,400 --> 04:35:43,760
 DBH required slightly higher mitigation but overall 49 almost a 50 percent increase in

4025
04:35:43,760 --> 04:35:48,600
 in total DBH and again that's that's after applying that again that 50 percent credit

4026
04:35:48,600 --> 04:35:57,360
 but then also giving those credits back for for preserving those those post oaks.

4027
04:35:57,360 --> 04:36:02,120
 Looking at mitigation fee this has been another one that that we've tried to attempt to to

4028
04:36:02,120 --> 04:36:09,160
 address the current fee is at a hundred and twenty five dollars per DBH and I don't believe

4029
04:36:09,160 --> 04:36:14,120
 this has been updated since it was first put in place and I haven't seen it change in quite

4030
04:36:14,120 --> 04:36:20,220
 a while and so what we did is we looked at what we were proposing was a method based

4031
04:36:20,220 --> 04:36:27,440
 on a manual that sets values for for maintaining a tree again a reasonable cost for maintenance

4032
04:36:27,440 --> 04:36:33,200
 and irrigation for a period of three years what we did is we looked we talked with parks

4033
04:36:33,200 --> 04:36:38,840
 and said well what's the actual cost for the same thing and they're at about three hundred

4034
04:36:38,840 --> 04:36:45,960
 and seventeen dollars an inch and so we haven't we as we discussed it at the council work

4035
04:36:45,960 --> 04:36:50,360
 session we didn't there was there hasn't been clear direction it was like you know

4036
04:36:50,360 --> 04:36:55,860
 let's sort of talk how we should whether it should be what what was proposed or whether

4037
04:36:55,860 --> 04:37:00,840
 or not we should just charge the fee for what what it costs some other considerations that

4038
04:37:00,840 --> 04:37:08,520
 we had is where there are certain street characteristics or construction requirements make it infeasible

4039
04:37:08,520 --> 04:37:13,940
 to meet planning requirements whether or not at that point in time rather than seek a variance

4040
04:37:13,940 --> 04:37:18,640
 or some other method should they be allowed to pay into the tree fund for that right now

4041
04:37:18,640 --> 04:37:24,480
 there there's we have some flexibility already I think with where we're headed with the point

4042
04:37:24,480 --> 04:37:30,120
 system right now you can propose an alternative buffer but there's really no guidance with

4043
04:37:30,120 --> 04:37:35,840
 respect to how how staff enforces that what we what we what I've been typically doing

4044
04:37:35,840 --> 04:37:39,640
 is when we get those requests is making sure that if you can't plant the tree because there's

4045
04:37:39,640 --> 04:37:44,680
 an easement or overhead utility line trying to plant those trees at least somewhere somewhere

4046
04:37:44,680 --> 04:37:51,160
 else on the site but currently there's no there's no guidance or any set way to do that

4047
04:37:51,160 --> 04:37:54,080
 so at least with this we wanted to again have that predictability or at least have that

4048
04:37:54,080 --> 04:37:58,560
 menu of items that everybody knows is out there with respect to the point system but

4049
04:37:58,560 --> 04:38:04,520
 in those extreme cases particularly when we get an infill is there another possible relief

4050
04:38:04,520 --> 04:38:12,640
 valve to allow for that and then any any enforcement actions restoration fees that are a result

4051
04:38:12,640 --> 04:38:18,360
 of enforcement actions should those fees from that enforcement action go into the tree fund

4052
04:38:18,360 --> 04:38:22,840
 or should they just go into into a general fund and we haven't gotten any guidance yet

4053
04:38:22,840 --> 04:38:28,600
 on that but that was something that that we thought might be might be something to consider

4054
04:38:28,600 --> 04:38:39,040
 with respect to the to the tree fund we don't have a lot of it but we we may in the future

4055
04:38:39,040 --> 04:38:44,280
 again managing the urban forest on the on the public side our current tree tree fund

4056
04:38:44,280 --> 04:38:51,000
 regulations the bullet points it's what kind of what's in the code today we really weren't

4057
04:38:51,000 --> 04:38:55,400
 recommending any changes at this point purchase plant maintain trees preserve wooded property

4058
04:38:55,400 --> 04:39:01,720
 remaining in a naturalistic state and perpetuity perform and maintain citywide tree inventory

4059
04:39:01,720 --> 04:39:07,440
 education and then support programs for public purpose of increasing tree canopy within the

4060
04:39:07,440 --> 04:39:12,760
 city as approved by by the council and so what we really looked at as kind of the the

4061
04:39:12,760 --> 04:39:18,800
 the center of all of this is is a forestry plan that I had mentioned previously and so

4062
04:39:18,800 --> 04:39:24,040
 that is that that is something that that has been budgeted there there will be a project

4063
04:39:24,040 --> 04:39:29,320
 kickoff in in december this this is actually going to be managed through the through the

4064
04:39:29,320 --> 04:39:34,840
 parks department which is i think is probably a lot more appropriate and what they have

4065
04:39:34,840 --> 04:39:41,120
 since done is is created a forestry division to really carry out a carry out a lot of these

4066
04:39:41,120 --> 04:39:49,120
 these programs and so part of the what they've established as far as far as the outcomes

4067
04:39:49,120 --> 04:39:56,040
 of that study again is staff training and and development opportunities look at prefer

4068
04:39:56,040 --> 04:40:02,680
 tree and plant species identification identification and priority prioritization of planning areas

4069
04:40:02,680 --> 04:40:09,280
 particularly as we get into planning for parks within parks within trail areas within our

4070
04:40:09,280 --> 04:40:15,960
 within our rights away again best management practices strategies for preservation expansion

4071
04:40:15,960 --> 04:40:24,920
 benchmarks again keeping that inventory and optimizing data branding outreach again going

4072
04:40:24,920 --> 04:40:30,080
 also kind of promoting that educational component letting people know why it's good to have

4073
04:40:30,080 --> 04:40:35,240
 trees and what those what the benefits are and really looking at again monitoring and

4074
04:40:35,240 --> 04:40:43,320
 measuring our success and so part of part of that whole discussion too has been when

4075
04:40:43,320 --> 04:40:48,640
 is it appropriate and how how should we consider land acquisition and so these were some items

4076
04:40:48,640 --> 04:40:53,880
 that were presented at that council work session and when is it appropriate for for the city

4077
04:40:53,880 --> 04:40:58,980
 to look at at that should it be part of a of a of a plan development that's something

4078
04:40:58,980 --> 04:41:04,520
 that we're looking at bringing back as part of the ddc update we've had had some projects

4079
04:41:04,520 --> 04:41:08,880
 that come forward as part of a pre annexation development agreement that was the creek side

4080
04:41:08,880 --> 04:41:15,120
 development since that time we've had other larger tracks of land now interested in in

4081
04:41:15,120 --> 04:41:20,440
 annexing in the city wanting to pursue something similar and so is that you know is that a

4082
04:41:20,440 --> 04:41:25,520
 time that we should we should look at it just through the development review process or

4083
04:41:25,520 --> 04:41:30,000
 or as a partnership you know should we be the the outright owner of the land or should

4084
04:41:30,000 --> 04:41:34,560
 should we look at being a partnership through an easement where it where it's where it's

4085
04:41:34,560 --> 04:41:39,040
 controlled through through some other entity or the city itself and then really where and

4086
04:41:39,040 --> 04:41:41,440
 what is it what what are we going to prove you know what are we going to purchase or

4087
04:41:41,440 --> 04:41:48,360
 what are we going to maintain is are they tree stands is it vacant land to plant trees

4088
04:41:48,360 --> 04:41:52,760
 should it be those iso or conservation areas or is it market rate land that we want to

4089
04:41:52,760 --> 04:41:59,920
 just kind of take take off kind of take off the rules and and and purchase and then what's

4090
04:41:59,920 --> 04:42:06,280
 the cost should it be should be a fixed amount or percentage of the tree fund annually how

4091
04:42:06,280 --> 04:42:12,200
 do we look at what what those those lost revenues are and then or or should we if we decide

4092
04:42:12,200 --> 04:42:16,720
 to purchase vacant land to plant should we look at a mitigation bank where we can sell

4093
04:42:16,720 --> 04:42:22,320
 credits similar to you know they're like a wetland mitigation area where we can look

4094
04:42:22,320 --> 04:42:28,200
 at continuing funding that so I think there's a that that might come in the future but but

4095
04:42:28,200 --> 04:42:33,200
 I at least wanted to to look at all options of how how how we should how we should approach

4096
04:42:33,200 --> 04:42:38,360
 this since this item seems to be one of the items that continues to be discussed and provide

4097
04:42:38,360 --> 04:42:43,440
 some guidance we tried to look at at a number of of cities that that do land acquisition

4098
04:42:43,440 --> 04:42:49,240
 for tree preservation and just see if they have sort of a a matrix you know almost like

4099
04:42:49,240 --> 04:42:54,320
 a decision tree or policy guidance and and none of them really have it so this was kind

4100
04:42:54,320 --> 04:43:01,000
 of our best attempt to kind of kind of weave something together for for consideration and

4101
04:43:01,000 --> 04:43:06,160
 then again getting back to the to the metrics and evaluation making sure that that whatever

4102
04:43:06,160 --> 04:43:12,120
 ordinance ultimately gets adopted or passed we know that it's effective we can communicate

4103
04:43:12,120 --> 04:43:18,080
 what we're doing we can have the transparency of what what we're preserving people don't

4104
04:43:18,080 --> 04:43:22,400
 really have to ask that the information should be there making sure we're meeting those those

4105
04:43:22,400 --> 04:43:27,080
 established goals and and what I'd like to ultimately get to a point is is publishing

4106
04:43:27,080 --> 04:43:32,920
 those results as part of an annual annual report but also in talking with with Gary

4107
04:43:32,920 --> 04:43:38,680
 and Parks is also using that as kind of a tool when they do their their forestry has

4108
04:43:38,680 --> 04:43:42,640
 their own capital improvements project plan where they look at the number of plannings

4109
04:43:42,640 --> 04:43:48,760
 that they're going to do each year for certain parks for trails and and rights of way mediums

4110
04:43:48,760 --> 04:43:53,080
 and really looking at at how how we can use these tools effectively and what I put in

4111
04:43:53,080 --> 04:43:59,560
 here this was I came across the city of Portland has has a pretty robust program but I thought

4112
04:43:59,560 --> 04:44:04,320
 it was interesting you know they they tagged the number of inspections permits issue trees

4113
04:44:04,320 --> 04:44:11,200
 permitted street trees parks and schools private emergency response but but you know right

4114
04:44:11,200 --> 04:44:19,240
 away what what they what they did on an annual basis and and and where where the where the

4115
04:44:19,240 --> 04:44:23,280
 need is and and so it kind of paints a kind of paints a picture I I don't know if we'll

4116
04:44:23,280 --> 04:44:29,160
 get up to 15,000 inspections annually for trees maybe as we continue to grow but but

4117
04:44:29,160 --> 04:44:37,600
 but it's at least somewhere I think to to to point and and and set the goal and so this

4118
04:44:37,600 --> 04:44:42,760
 was just sort of an anticipated schedule.

4119
04:44:42,760 --> 04:44:48,480
 Coming back again December December 12th what we'll do is we'll put that we'll put this

4120
04:44:48,480 --> 04:44:57,720
 item on for the first public hearing coming back again on on on 123 we make me wait at

4121
04:44:57,720 --> 04:45:02,080
 at that point in time we we may want to come back and have another public hearing what

4122
04:45:02,080 --> 04:45:06,560
 I just try to do is just kind of forecast as far as when we want to when we want to

4123
04:45:06,560 --> 04:45:12,560
 get this ultimately adopted we we talked about whether or not we should just fold it in with

4124
04:45:12,560 --> 04:45:19,440
 with the DDC overall but I think it's been such obviously discussed item since a year

4125
04:45:19,440 --> 04:45:24,840
 after it's been adopted in 2004 that we will we're going to take this sort of on a separate

4126
04:45:24,840 --> 04:45:32,320
 track for adoption and so it kind of doesn't get doesn't get lost in in the weeds but that's

4127
04:45:32,320 --> 04:45:41,640
 that's kind of the the the anticipated schedule I'll be happy to answer any questions clarifications

4128
04:45:41,640 --> 04:45:49,160
 I know it's exciting stuff when I tell my wife she gets really really excited.

4129
04:45:49,160 --> 04:45:52,160
 It's a lot to take in.

4130
04:45:52,160 --> 04:45:57,240
 Richard I had a question and it wasn't your presentation was in her backup tree fund history

4131
04:45:57,240 --> 04:46:06,560
 of revenue and expenses and yes balances it's really confusing to me not not the numbers

4132
04:46:06,560 --> 04:46:12,160
 per se but the math do you have that it wasn't one of your talking points so this isn't the

4133
04:46:12,160 --> 04:46:17,160
 venue I'm happy to table it yeah that that was something that that parks had had prepared

4134
04:46:17,160 --> 04:46:24,840
 since they they really have managed that fund okay what I can do is if you want to ask the

4135
04:46:24,840 --> 04:46:32,480
 questions maybe I can respond if not I will get I will get the answers sure the last column

4136
04:46:32,480 --> 04:46:42,280
 budget 2018 to 19 expenses are set at seven hundred fifty thousand revenues are I assume

4137
04:46:42,280 --> 04:46:46,920
 positive although parentheses typically mean negative two hundred seventy six two ninety

4138
04:46:46,920 --> 04:46:51,800
 five it would seem to be that the annual net balance then based on that math would be a

4139
04:46:51,800 --> 04:47:03,300
 negative four hundred seventy three thousand not a positive so I'm not sure about that

4140
04:47:03,300 --> 04:47:10,920
 do you have in front of you the tiny version you have the tiny version so I may and again

4141
04:47:10,920 --> 04:47:19,040
 that that it might just be reporting inconsequential although being down half a million dollars

4142
04:47:19,040 --> 04:47:29,360
 is of consequence or why expenses jumped three times year over year from 17 18 18 19 and

4143
04:47:29,360 --> 04:47:36,760
 then the current balance of the fund says two point two million how long has this fund

4144
04:47:36,760 --> 04:47:41,640
 been around if we're annual net balances a hundred thousand dollars that we have two

4145
04:47:41,640 --> 04:47:51,020
 point two million in the in the bank for this fund again it might just be that these numbers

4146
04:47:51,020 --> 04:47:58,280
 is to be cleaned up from a right reporting purposes but this slide I think would solicit

4147
04:47:58,280 --> 04:48:08,960
 a lot more questions than the department necessarily wants to have solicited I'll get the I'll

4148
04:48:08,960 --> 04:48:16,680
 get I'll get get the answer I know that that in the last at least this last year there

4149
04:48:16,680 --> 04:48:26,400
 was a substantial expenditures for for capital projects out of out of parks capital projects

4150
04:48:26,400 --> 04:48:38,320
 there was a there was an agenda item a month or two ago that hasn't I don't I don't I'm

4151
04:48:38,320 --> 04:48:42,520
 not aware that it ultimately got approved there Council did have some questions about

4152
04:48:42,520 --> 04:48:48,960
 the expenditures for the for the amount of the amount of trees I'm not aware that that

4153
04:48:48,960 --> 04:48:53,580
 item came back but what I'll do is I'll get that I'll get that answer included for the

4154
04:48:53,580 --> 04:48:59,560
 backup for this might be helpful to have if we're gonna put in the history of the fund

4155
04:48:59,560 --> 04:49:06,080
 maybe reported with more clarity that's all I had I don't see any other questions Larry

4156
04:49:06,080 --> 04:49:19,200
 are you awake down there okay thank you Commissioner so is this a public hearing right it yeah it

4157
04:49:19,200 --> 04:49:24,840
 we advertise it as a public hearing I didn't know what other way to really get input from

4158
04:49:24,840 --> 04:49:31,600
 from the public we can we can just leave it open I guess and and continue it for the for

4159
04:49:31,600 --> 04:49:39,680
 the 12th oh they make a motion for that uh Christian Smith make a motion to table the

4160
04:49:39,680 --> 04:49:50,000
 discussion till date certain which was uh j uh December 12th to 2018 Christian Pernetta

4161
04:49:50,000 --> 04:49:59,120
 I'll second that motion so first and second to table this item until December 12th seeing

4162
04:49:59,120 --> 04:50:26,480
 no discussion I call for a vote on the board

4163
04:50:26,480 --> 04:50:51,200
 other but you're mic'd up Commissioner that's probably right motion carries 7-0 that moves

4164
04:50:51,200 --> 04:51:01,560
 us to our last item I'll let Richard meander back up here for the matrix Richard I'll let

4165
04:51:01,560 --> 04:51:06,560
 you start with any updates to the matrix then if any commissioners want to add anything

4166
04:51:06,560 --> 04:51:19,160
 to the matrix yeah just wanted to note a couple items obviously 12 12 coming back tree code

4167
04:51:19,160 --> 04:51:27,040
 update also I have the historic preservation incentive program I know we had we had talked

4168
04:51:27,040 --> 04:51:34,000
 about that previously the Lakota group will be in town that that Monday and Tuesday I

4169
04:51:34,000 --> 04:51:40,600
 was trying to get them to stay an extra day but unfortunately was not able to but Roman

4170
04:51:40,600 --> 04:51:45,400
 will be here to kind of give an update one on the overall historic preservation plan

4171
04:51:45,400 --> 04:51:51,960
 where where that isn't sort of initial kickoff but also talk about how those incentive programs

4172
04:51:51,960 --> 04:52:03,000
 will be incorporated into that into that plan will be bringing back probably one nine I'll

4173
04:52:03,000 --> 04:52:10,080
 add back to this the the update on the downtown design standards and if you recall we we also

4174
04:52:10,080 --> 04:52:15,400
 talked about that training that first meeting in January on Robert's Rules of Order and

4175
04:52:15,400 --> 04:52:25,880
 sort of what what can be talked about at at a work session and I think that was it one

4176
04:52:25,880 --> 04:52:34,760
 other item sorry I have I failed to do it yet but but I have Charlie helping work on

4177
04:52:34,760 --> 04:52:40,720
 on a system where as we get community meetings scheduled we'll be able to send out sort

4178
04:52:40,720 --> 04:52:46,040
 of that that blast notification to let everyone everyone know when those are when those are

4179
04:52:46,040 --> 04:52:53,800
 scheduled so that that that is in the works does anyone have anything to add to the matrix

4180
04:52:53,800 --> 04:52:59,840
 Mr. Ellis thank you just real quick as maybe just some cleanup with staff is can you make

4181
04:52:59,840 --> 04:53:05,160
 sure that the the affidavit and the signs are in our backup I mean I drove out to a

4182
04:53:05,160 --> 04:53:11,160
 property today to ensure that the sign was up because it wasn't in our material certainly

4183
04:53:11,160 --> 04:53:15,840
 so I mean I know that's supposed to be part of it so if they post it as scheduled there

4184
04:53:15,840 --> 04:53:19,640
 should be plenty of time to get it in our backup so we have it we'll do okay thank you

4185
04:53:19,640 --> 04:53:27,040
 anyone else have any items I'd like to Christian Sanchez I know wall back we had on this list

4186
04:53:27,040 --> 04:53:31,440
 we had talked that we're gonna have some training or talk about roundabouts whatever happened

4187
04:53:31,440 --> 04:53:39,560
 to that is that we decide not to do it or we're talking about you don't remember yeah

4188
04:53:39,560 --> 04:53:49,440
 and I thought perhaps pre temp covered it I can have I can have him provide some additional

4189
04:53:49,440 --> 04:54:01,520
 background on on the on the roundabouts might get trade to cover that meeting for us so

4190
04:54:01,520 --> 04:54:07,000
 I don't see anyone else the only things that I would don't I have two points rather than

4191
04:54:07,000 --> 04:54:12,880
 than maybe three points I think that first I don't know if it's a guessing game or if

4192
04:54:12,880 --> 04:54:17,520
 there's thought to it but I appreciate the stacking of the agenda tonight I thought it

4193
04:54:17,520 --> 04:54:22,320
 went really well to have the quick ones up front to get them out so just wanted whoever

4194
04:54:22,320 --> 04:54:28,880
 stacks these agendas I noted that it went well tonight so I appreciate that apart from

4195
04:54:28,880 --> 04:54:37,080
 I know coaster Beck once trees up front next time yeah I totally agree there wasn't too

4196
04:54:37,080 --> 04:54:43,520
 many people here the only other thing that I would I would like to just say to the commission

4197
04:54:43,520 --> 04:54:50,840
 before even have our rules it's it's difficult for me as a chair to step into the engagement

4198
04:54:50,840 --> 04:54:58,040
 from the audience members to the commission and so if we can refrain from pulling the

4199
04:54:58,040 --> 04:55:04,480
 audience or entertaining individuals that aren't announced it just it alleviates that

4200
04:55:04,480 --> 04:55:08,040
 selfishness for me but it just tonight there's a couple banters that I didn't know how to

4201
04:55:08,040 --> 04:55:13,080
 interject properly and so if it's possible to refrain from engaging the audience members

4202
04:55:13,080 --> 04:55:19,060
 that would be super helpful to first one that would come up I would say ask him that question

4203
04:55:19,060 --> 04:55:25,000
 then anybody else coming up if they'd answer that question too sorry about that no no worries

4204
04:55:25,000 --> 04:55:31,800
 the last thing is and I told city staff this and let vice chair Ellis know I will not be

4205
04:55:31,800 --> 04:55:37,520
 at the next meeting the 12th so vice chair Ellis will be taking lead on that thank you

4206
04:55:37,520 --> 04:55:41,640
 for that and then if it works out great for Roman is still provide that update I know

4207
04:55:41,640 --> 04:55:47,960
 I asked request if I requested it I'm certainly able to catch the video so I just want it

4208
04:55:47,960 --> 04:55:55,520
 is what it is okay seeing no other discussion items will close the meeting at 10.05