1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:04,320 So six o'clock and we will go ahead and call the 2 00:00:05,040 --> 00:00:06,839 April 23rd 3 00:00:06,839 --> 00:00:09,119 2018 public utilities board 4 00:00:10,279 --> 00:00:12,279 meeting to order and 5 00:00:12,599 --> 00:00:15,279 First on our agenda is a work session 6 00:00:16,399 --> 00:00:19,149 Where we will receive a report and hold a discussion 7 00:00:19,149 --> 00:00:23,480 regarding the fiscal year 2017 water audit 8 00:00:26,000 --> 00:00:28,000 We're ready 9 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:33,359 We're gonna go over today our fiscal year 2017 water audit 10 00:00:33,759 --> 00:00:36,509 similar to a budget audit where we scrutinize every dollar 11 00:00:36,509 --> 00:00:39,219 and cent that goes into a budget and where it ends up we do 12 00:00:39,219 --> 00:00:39,359 the 13 00:00:39,359 --> 00:00:41,799 Same thing with our water system will scrutinize every drop 14 00:00:41,799 --> 00:00:45,270 of water that we put into our system and where it ended up 15 00:00:45,270 --> 00:00:45,520 and 16 00:00:46,479 --> 00:00:49,600 So in its most basic form a water audit is where we take 17 00:00:49,600 --> 00:00:51,439 all of the water we produce 18 00:00:51,439 --> 00:00:53,829 So this is finished water from our plant that gets pumped 19 00:00:53,829 --> 00:00:54,579 into our system 20 00:00:54,579 --> 00:00:57,750 And then from that total we subtract out how much water we 21 00:00:57,750 --> 00:01:00,399 sold that was captured in our billing system 22 00:01:00,399 --> 00:01:03,149 And the difference in what we're left over with is referred 23 00:01:03,149 --> 00:01:04,359 to as non-revenue water 24 00:01:04,359 --> 00:01:07,269 And so there are a lot of different reasons for having non- 25 00:01:07,269 --> 00:01:10,620 revenue water, but every utility will have non-revenue water 26 00:01:11,599 --> 00:01:13,599 We have operational usage 27 00:01:13,760 --> 00:01:17,189 So the flushing of new lines the flushing out of dead-end 28 00:01:17,189 --> 00:01:20,790 mains new development every time we put a new development 29 00:01:20,790 --> 00:01:21,140 in the ground 30 00:01:21,140 --> 00:01:22,890 We do have to flush those mains out to get all the 31 00:01:22,890 --> 00:01:24,849 chemicals out of the new pipes and get them ready and 32 00:01:24,849 --> 00:01:25,280 healthy 33 00:01:25,319 --> 00:01:28,459 For service for our customers. There are errors with our 34 00:01:28,459 --> 00:01:31,680 data in our metering system and unfortunately we do have 35 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:31,920 theft 36 00:01:32,599 --> 00:01:35,349 There are also system breaks and leaks that cause us to 37 00:01:35,349 --> 00:01:37,840 lose water water quality maintenance 38 00:01:37,840 --> 00:01:40,590 So hydrants and dead-end mains and then parts of the 39 00:01:40,590 --> 00:01:42,480 utility system that are spread out 40 00:01:42,920 --> 00:01:44,909 We do have to flush the water because after a while the 41 00:01:44,909 --> 00:01:47,709 chemicals bond together differently and it's no longer safe 42 00:01:47,709 --> 00:01:48,420 for consumption 43 00:01:48,420 --> 00:01:51,530 And then also for firefighting we don't meter our firefight 44 00:01:51,530 --> 00:01:53,040 ing usage and training time 45 00:01:54,879 --> 00:01:57,049 So what we want to do is now that we know why we have non- 46 00:01:57,049 --> 00:02:00,019 revenue water we need to kind of understand what that means 47 00:02:00,019 --> 00:02:02,370 So we'll analyze our non-revenue water and it's a really 48 00:02:02,370 --> 00:02:04,620 good starting point for figuring out the health of our 49 00:02:04,620 --> 00:02:05,040 system 50 00:02:05,560 --> 00:02:08,310 It's also good for budgeting because we do have to absorb 51 00:02:08,310 --> 00:02:10,139 the cost of non-revenue water 52 00:02:10,599 --> 00:02:13,349 In the amount of water that we sell it's good at 53 00:02:13,349 --> 00:02:16,719 identifying potential concerns on a broad scale and 54 00:02:16,719 --> 00:02:18,000 operational decision-making 55 00:02:18,479 --> 00:02:20,409 But what it's not good for and where we want to further 56 00:02:20,409 --> 00:02:23,110 analyze is engaging the health of our system because there 57 00:02:23,110 --> 00:02:23,919 are different 58 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:26,750 Factors that go into non-revenue water. It doesn't quite 59 00:02:26,750 --> 00:02:28,599 let us know how good our actual pipes are 60 00:02:29,319 --> 00:02:31,530 It's not the best for identifying specific opportunities 61 00:02:31,530 --> 00:02:34,560 for improvement. We have to have a little bit more of a 62 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:35,300 granular analysis 63 00:02:35,759 --> 00:02:38,080 And it's not the best for benchmarking either 64 00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:41,659 However, because we're all curious. This is how we stack up 65 00:02:41,659 --> 00:02:44,560 in terms of benchmarking through throughout the 66 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:47,500 Metroplex and so if you look we are in the median but we 67 00:02:47,500 --> 00:02:50,840 are in the higher end and there is a good reason for that 68 00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:53,939 Some considerations when it comes to benchmarking with 69 00:02:53,939 --> 00:02:56,340 other utilities are the size of the system 70 00:02:56,479 --> 00:03:00,080 So as a system grows more we're gonna lose a lot more water 71 00:03:00,080 --> 00:03:03,300 from our billing system as we flush out these new lines 72 00:03:04,240 --> 00:03:07,159 Also the topology of the system and our water quality 73 00:03:07,159 --> 00:03:09,909 So for example if everyone thinks of the north end of town 74 00:03:09,909 --> 00:03:12,319 by north loop 288 where we've got that water tower 75 00:03:12,599 --> 00:03:15,340 Because the usage isn't as heavy but we still have the 76 00:03:15,340 --> 00:03:17,259 infrastructure taking the water out there 77 00:03:17,319 --> 00:03:20,210 We do have more instances of needing to flush out that 78 00:03:20,210 --> 00:03:24,319 water for to maintain our regulations on water quality age 79 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:28,539 Also the age of our infrastructure the older system is the 80 00:03:28,539 --> 00:03:30,199 more prone it is to breaks and leaks 81 00:03:30,479 --> 00:03:33,449 And we do have an older infrastructure as compared to some 82 00:03:33,449 --> 00:03:35,280 of the other cities in the area 83 00:03:36,199 --> 00:03:38,939 Audit validation so that's actually the quality of 84 00:03:38,939 --> 00:03:41,919 information that goes into our water audit. So 85 00:03:42,719 --> 00:03:45,360 We do vet our data and we have a lot of 86 00:03:45,879 --> 00:03:48,620 Check marks and validation processes that we go through to 87 00:03:48,620 --> 00:03:49,759 make sure it's accurate 88 00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,189 Not all other cities are large enough and staffed up enough 89 00:03:53,189 --> 00:03:56,199 to be able to do the level of validation we do and then 90 00:03:56,199 --> 00:03:56,560 some 91 00:03:56,560 --> 00:03:59,240 Cities are going to do more validation such as Dallas 92 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:02,110 And then the differences and unbilled authorized 93 00:04:02,110 --> 00:04:03,780 consumption across utilities 94 00:04:03,780 --> 00:04:06,909 So I mentioned we don't bill and meter our fire department, 95 00:04:06,909 --> 00:04:08,840 but other other municipalities do 96 00:04:09,439 --> 00:04:12,180 And so that's why it's no longer an apples to apples 97 00:04:12,180 --> 00:04:14,680 comparison when we look at non-revenue water across 98 00:04:14,680 --> 00:04:15,400 different utilities 99 00:04:16,480 --> 00:04:18,589 There are several types of non-revenue water that are 100 00:04:18,589 --> 00:04:21,910 important to understand. We've got unbilled authorized 101 00:04:21,910 --> 00:04:22,879 consumption 102 00:04:22,879 --> 00:04:25,079 Which is exactly what it sounds like we don't bill it but 103 00:04:25,079 --> 00:04:28,120 it's authorized and we're completely fine with that water 104 00:04:28,120 --> 00:04:29,079 being used but not billed 105 00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:31,899 So we've got our firefighting and our firefighter training 106 00:04:31,899 --> 00:04:35,290 time the flushing out of new lines and the operational us 107 00:04:35,290 --> 00:04:36,839 ages such as the water quality maintenance 108 00:04:37,319 --> 00:04:40,170 Hydrant maintenance flushing new development. We have a 109 00:04:40,170 --> 00:04:43,639 parent loss a parent loss is exactly what it sounds like 110 00:04:43,639 --> 00:04:46,959 It looks as though we lost it, but we didn't quite a parent 111 00:04:46,959 --> 00:04:50,000 loss is water that we didn't capture in our billing system 112 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:53,189 But it did in fact go through the meter or was used by a 113 00:04:53,189 --> 00:04:54,000 customer 114 00:04:54,000 --> 00:04:56,199 So the instance of theft it's not going to go through a 115 00:04:56,199 --> 00:04:57,720 meter, but it was used by a customer 116 00:04:58,319 --> 00:05:01,540 Billing system errors also customer service on occasion. We 117 00:05:01,540 --> 00:05:03,120 have waived some bills where 118 00:05:03,600 --> 00:05:07,399 customers do have a leak on their side and just as a 119 00:05:07,839 --> 00:05:09,360 You know as good customer service 120 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:10,980 We will forgive that bill even though it passed through the 121 00:05:10,980 --> 00:05:13,480 meter and then there are metering and accuracy is meters 122 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:14,800 slow down as they age 123 00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:18,180 And that's just a fact of the water business and then real 124 00:05:18,180 --> 00:05:18,560 loss 125 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:21,990 We have main breaks main leaks and then service leaks 126 00:05:21,990 --> 00:05:24,759 before the meter and the real loss is water 127 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:27,709 That is really lost from our system that actually leaks and 128 00:05:27,709 --> 00:05:30,370 it's a good gauge of the health of our actual pipes and 129 00:05:30,370 --> 00:05:31,360 infrastructure 130 00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:36,430 So for benchmarking the water development board and the 131 00:05:36,430 --> 00:05:39,540 American Water Works Association looks at three different 132 00:05:39,540 --> 00:05:40,639 performance indicators 133 00:05:40,879 --> 00:05:43,639 Real loss so the amount of loss that's really lost through 134 00:05:43,639 --> 00:05:46,129 the system through our leaks and breaks and that's an 135 00:05:46,129 --> 00:05:47,480 indicator of our system health 136 00:05:48,319 --> 00:05:49,959 Apparent loss which is our paper loss 137 00:05:49,959 --> 00:05:52,329 So the water that was used but wasn't accounted for and 138 00:05:52,329 --> 00:05:55,430 that's more of an indicator of our fiscal health and then 139 00:05:55,430 --> 00:05:56,220 our infrastructure 140 00:05:56,519 --> 00:05:59,899 Leakage index which is a fairly new benchmarking 141 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:04,009 Statistic but it's the theoretical minimum loss a system 142 00:06:04,009 --> 00:06:06,740 can have and it's a ratio of that minimum loss 143 00:06:06,879 --> 00:06:09,810 Based off some factors unique to our system compared to 144 00:06:09,810 --> 00:06:10,920 what we actually lost 145 00:06:10,920 --> 00:06:14,399 and so these are the three key things that the that we use 146 00:06:14,399 --> 00:06:15,800 for benchmarking and 147 00:06:16,560 --> 00:06:20,160 So kind of an easier way to look at and understand the way 148 00:06:20,160 --> 00:06:21,600 the audit breaks down is 149 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:26,839 The water produced that we produced for the fiscal year 150 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:30,000 that top area going across is water that's exported 151 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:32,740 So we have some wholesale customers on Krummen Sanger and 152 00:06:32,740 --> 00:06:35,480 then the water supplied that's the amount of water that 153 00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:36,160 went into our 154 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:40,600 City of Denton billing system that large arrow right there 155 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:43,350 The build authorized consumption is all the water of the 156 00:06:43,350 --> 00:06:46,300 water supplied that was building captured in North Star our 157 00:06:46,300 --> 00:06:47,100 billing system 158 00:06:47,100 --> 00:06:49,920 And then below that we have our non revenue water as a 159 00:06:49,920 --> 00:06:51,759 component of non revenue water 160 00:06:51,759 --> 00:06:55,040 You'll see the unbilled authorized color coded in blue to 161 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:57,439 indicate that we are okay with that usage 162 00:06:57,439 --> 00:07:00,160 And that once again is our operational usage our firefight 163 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:00,160 ing 164 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:03,860 Below that is our apparent loss. So that's gonna that's all 165 00:07:03,860 --> 00:07:06,319 the water once again that was used 166 00:07:06,439 --> 00:07:08,879 But we didn't capture it in our billing system and that can 167 00:07:08,879 --> 00:07:11,480 be farther broken down into metering inaccuracies 168 00:07:12,139 --> 00:07:15,029 Unauthorized consumption data errors and it's important for 169 00:07:15,029 --> 00:07:17,389 us to break it down further so we know where our 170 00:07:17,389 --> 00:07:18,079 opportunities are 171 00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:21,459 And then the real losses we've got main breaks and then 172 00:07:21,459 --> 00:07:23,199 also water that we suspect 173 00:07:23,439 --> 00:07:26,089 Leaked from our system, but it is unaccounted for and so we 174 00:07:26,089 --> 00:07:27,519 didn't physically see that break 175 00:07:27,519 --> 00:07:30,160 But we know it's somewhere out there either broken or 176 00:07:30,160 --> 00:07:31,019 leaking into our system 177 00:07:31,959 --> 00:07:34,879 And so real loss is a gauge of our system health 178 00:07:35,199 --> 00:07:38,579 That's where our main breaks and leaks will let us know 179 00:07:38,579 --> 00:07:41,639 where we really need to target our capital improvement 180 00:07:41,839 --> 00:07:44,540 We want to minimize them within economic reasons 181 00:07:44,540 --> 00:07:48,329 So we assign a dollar value to how much revenue we've lost 182 00:07:48,329 --> 00:07:49,540 because of these breaks 183 00:07:49,540 --> 00:07:52,439 And so we are going to try to mitigate those losses up to 184 00:07:52,439 --> 00:07:54,540 that point, but we certainly don't want to find ourselves 185 00:07:54,540 --> 00:07:54,839 in a situation 186 00:07:54,879 --> 00:07:56,879 Where we're spending a dollar to save a dime 187 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:00,300 But the water audit does help estimate the costs and 188 00:08:00,300 --> 00:08:03,600 engages our system health for fiscal year 2017 189 00:08:03,600 --> 00:08:05,970 We lost five hundred and thirty one million gallons and 190 00:08:05,970 --> 00:08:08,139 while it seems like a large amount that was only eight 191 00:08:08,139 --> 00:08:09,519 point five percent of our total 192 00:08:09,519 --> 00:08:11,519 produced water for the year 193 00:08:12,439 --> 00:08:15,339 Now our apparent loss which is an indicator of our fiscal 194 00:08:15,339 --> 00:08:15,680 health 195 00:08:16,279 --> 00:08:19,029 That is mostly due to metering and accuracy. So customer 196 00:08:19,029 --> 00:08:20,620 meters, they actually decline 197 00:08:20,620 --> 00:08:22,959 I know there's sometimes sticker shock in the summer where 198 00:08:22,959 --> 00:08:23,639 you get a large 199 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:26,439 Water bill and there is fear of over registering 200 00:08:26,439 --> 00:08:29,189 But typically as time goes on the meters will slow down and 201 00:08:29,189 --> 00:08:32,570 under register due to calcification and other issues with 202 00:08:32,570 --> 00:08:33,480 the meter itself 203 00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:37,769 And so the water audit also estimates this apparent loss is 204 00:08:37,769 --> 00:08:40,279 much more expensive than real loss 205 00:08:41,279 --> 00:08:44,320 Because real loss leaks before it reaches a customer we 206 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:47,480 understand and value that at what it costs us to produce 207 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:48,179 that water 208 00:08:48,399 --> 00:08:51,539 Which is about 33 cents per thousand gallons 209 00:08:51,600 --> 00:08:54,429 But we can sell that water for four dollars and fifteen 210 00:08:54,429 --> 00:08:55,980 cents per thousand gallons 211 00:08:55,980 --> 00:08:59,919 And so when that water is used by our customer base, it's 212 00:08:59,919 --> 00:09:03,200 quantified at a much more expensive rate that four dollars 213 00:09:03,200 --> 00:09:04,000 and fifteen cents 214 00:09:04,440 --> 00:09:08,860 So for 2017 we estimate about 197 million gallons of 215 00:09:08,860 --> 00:09:09,559 apparent loss 216 00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:12,429 Which was three percent three point one percent of the 217 00:09:12,429 --> 00:09:15,159 entire amount of water we produced that year and 218 00:09:15,840 --> 00:09:18,899 Then the infrastructure leakage index which is that new 219 00:09:18,899 --> 00:09:21,750 benchmarking target that we have which is the ratio of the 220 00:09:21,750 --> 00:09:23,039 theoretical minimum 221 00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:25,159 Based off of the size of our system 222 00:09:25,159 --> 00:09:27,490 So we have a little over 600 miles of pipe and then the 223 00:09:27,490 --> 00:09:29,580 number of connections that we have in our system 224 00:09:29,919 --> 00:09:32,659 It's a standard calculation provided by the water 225 00:09:32,659 --> 00:09:33,080 development board 226 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:36,250 Based off of those factors and then it compares that to our 227 00:09:36,250 --> 00:09:36,840 actual loss 228 00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:40,200 And so we're left with a ratio which is considered the best 229 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:43,070 kind of apples to apples comparison across different 230 00:09:43,070 --> 00:09:44,480 utilities for benchmarking 231 00:09:44,879 --> 00:09:49,279 For 2017 we had a 2.07 and here's what that means 232 00:09:49,759 --> 00:09:52,340 So there are several target ILI ranges 233 00:09:53,960 --> 00:09:57,100 Anywhere from a 1 to an 8 is considered acceptable. We 234 00:09:57,100 --> 00:09:58,779 shoot for the tightest 235 00:09:59,519 --> 00:10:03,309 Range which is a 1 to 3 which is four systems where water 236 00:10:03,309 --> 00:10:03,679 is scarce 237 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:06,669 We are a semi-arid region and to where we really don't want 238 00:10:06,669 --> 00:10:08,000 to push rate increases 239 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:09,480 Upon our customers 240 00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:11,629 But if you look down where it says five to eight that could 241 00:10:11,629 --> 00:10:13,970 be a city along the Great Lakes or somewhere where water is 242 00:10:13,970 --> 00:10:14,399 plentiful 243 00:10:14,399 --> 00:10:17,149 It's cheap to develop new resources and it's not going to 244 00:10:17,149 --> 00:10:19,480 push that development out to our ratepayers 245 00:10:20,120 --> 00:10:22,769 Anything over the Nates not recommended anything under than 246 00:10:22,769 --> 00:10:25,720 one is not considered valid data 247 00:10:27,159 --> 00:10:28,200 And 248 00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:31,000 So if you look across region C, which is our water planning 249 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:33,769 region, you'll see that we are much lower than if you just 250 00:10:33,769 --> 00:10:34,240 looked 251 00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:37,789 At non-revenue water alone. So still in the median but on 252 00:10:37,789 --> 00:10:39,080 the lower end of that 253 00:10:41,080 --> 00:10:42,240 And 254 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:46,029 So just to summarize the reason we audit is it does help us 255 00:10:46,029 --> 00:10:48,440 gauge how well we steward our water resources 256 00:10:48,440 --> 00:10:50,590 Which is very important and how efficiently we turn those 257 00:10:50,590 --> 00:10:52,279 resources into income 258 00:10:52,279 --> 00:10:56,120 And so we'll take the results and analyze that and that'll 259 00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:59,080 help us decide a leak detection detection program system 260 00:10:59,080 --> 00:10:59,960 reinvestment and meter 261 00:11:00,399 --> 00:11:02,399 accuracy issues 262 00:11:02,679 --> 00:11:04,679 Any questions? 263 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:12,000 Question about the 264 00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:16,059 What you were saying before about how meters when they're 265 00:11:16,059 --> 00:11:17,279 first installed 266 00:11:18,480 --> 00:11:22,950 They tend to overestimate usages am I hearing that right? 267 00:11:22,950 --> 00:11:23,659 No, okay 268 00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:28,350 They start at about we can't have them estimate it caps at 269 00:11:28,350 --> 00:11:30,679 a hundred but it can be as low as I want to say 270 00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:33,080 99.98 percent of under registration 271 00:11:33,679 --> 00:11:36,600 And then over time it goes down at about 272 00:11:37,279 --> 00:11:40,759 we tend to replace our meters on about a 14 year cycle, but 273 00:11:40,759 --> 00:11:42,039 actually the 274 00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:45,000 Cost wise if we replace it at 18 years 275 00:11:45,120 --> 00:11:48,000 That's kind of the margin of diminishing return where the 276 00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:50,710 amount of lost water is kind of equivocal to the cost of 277 00:11:50,710 --> 00:11:51,600 replacing the meter 278 00:11:51,840 --> 00:11:54,580 We do it a little bit sooner just because we are in a semi- 279 00:11:54,580 --> 00:11:55,039 arid region 280 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:58,100 Tolerant to drought not completely drought tolerant and we 281 00:11:58,100 --> 00:12:00,610 just want to make sure we are kind of stewarding our 282 00:12:00,610 --> 00:12:01,000 resources 283 00:12:01,639 --> 00:12:03,960 Okay. Good. Thank you. Thanks. That's very helpful. Thank 284 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:04,200 you 285 00:12:06,519 --> 00:12:09,940 Questions Charlie what what is the method for breaking down 286 00:12:09,940 --> 00:12:13,700 the non-revenue water into those three categories? Oh sure 287 00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:16,679 To that 288 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:20,169 Was it the unbilled apparent and real-loss categories here? 289 00:12:20,169 --> 00:12:22,600 Okay. Yes, so the unbilled authorized 290 00:12:22,600 --> 00:12:24,840 We have a bunch of different data sets 291 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:27,870 So even though we don't actually meter the water that the 292 00:12:27,870 --> 00:12:30,789 fire department uses they do keep record of their fire 293 00:12:30,789 --> 00:12:31,279 events 294 00:12:31,279 --> 00:12:34,399 and so we try to kind of get a gauge of the time and 295 00:12:35,000 --> 00:12:37,750 There are some formulas that can take the water pressure 296 00:12:37,750 --> 00:12:40,789 versus the four inch diameter of the hose pulling from the 297 00:12:40,789 --> 00:12:42,039 the fire hydrant and 298 00:12:42,039 --> 00:12:44,220 The pressure of our system we can take all those factors 299 00:12:44,220 --> 00:12:47,279 together and multiply it across the number of firefighter 300 00:12:47,279 --> 00:12:48,340 events and get a rough 301 00:12:48,340 --> 00:12:50,629 Estimate on that the same with the firefighting training 302 00:12:50,629 --> 00:12:52,080 time. We also 303 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:58,600 We do where it says unbilled we still meter our usage for 304 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:01,799 some of the events such as new line flushing and 305 00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:05,269 Some of our operational usages, so we still have a handle 306 00:13:05,269 --> 00:13:07,039 on that. It's metered, but we're just not 307 00:13:08,120 --> 00:13:10,860 Administratively re billing the water department for the 308 00:13:10,860 --> 00:13:13,879 water the water department uses the main breaks 309 00:13:13,879 --> 00:13:15,559 That is once again 310 00:13:15,559 --> 00:13:17,929 It's kind of a standard formula where we take the the type 311 00:13:17,929 --> 00:13:20,799 of failure mode on the pipe the estimated amount of time 312 00:13:20,799 --> 00:13:23,860 It's leaking so it's not perfect because we start it when 313 00:13:23,860 --> 00:13:24,820 it gets called in 314 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:28,120 And then the meter metering and accuracies 315 00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:31,600 We have something called high low reports and that flags 316 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:34,409 when a customer has an anomalous spilling read kind of 317 00:13:34,409 --> 00:13:35,799 based off of their particular 318 00:13:35,799 --> 00:13:38,870 Baseline and so we can look at the data on that and kind of 319 00:13:38,870 --> 00:13:40,200 see if it was an error 320 00:13:40,279 --> 00:13:43,850 How much was it? We also have some I think I mentioned 321 00:13:43,850 --> 00:13:46,000 earlier we have forgiven some high bills 322 00:13:46,519 --> 00:13:49,230 And so we kind of keep that into account on apparent loss 323 00:13:49,230 --> 00:13:50,320 as well theft 324 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:53,440 That's a kind of a standard calculation provided by the 325 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:55,960 water development board as is the a 326 00:13:56,519 --> 00:13:59,159 component of the systematic data handling error 327 00:13:59,159 --> 00:14:01,899 And so these are just kind of standard across the board 328 00:14:01,899 --> 00:14:04,409 calculations that they they give to us their pretty boiler 329 00:14:04,409 --> 00:14:04,539 plate 330 00:14:04,539 --> 00:14:07,289 But that's how we go into there. There's a couple other 331 00:14:07,289 --> 00:14:08,519 factors as well. I know with our 332 00:14:09,200 --> 00:14:10,559 billing cycles 333 00:14:10,559 --> 00:14:12,980 With our water systems we kind of keep into account that 334 00:14:12,980 --> 00:14:16,000 the billing cycles will overlap the the calendar dates 335 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,429 And so sometimes if there's bills being forgiven in that 336 00:14:18,429 --> 00:14:20,799 time, we'll kind of try to quantify them to the correct 337 00:14:20,799 --> 00:14:21,159 year 338 00:14:21,720 --> 00:14:23,720 and then a couple other 339 00:14:24,120 --> 00:14:27,519 Small little pieces of data going to thank you. Oh sure 340 00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:35,799 So you mentioned that sometimes you forgive large bills 341 00:14:36,519 --> 00:14:39,679 What's the I can imagine what the answer would be but I'm 342 00:14:39,679 --> 00:14:41,360 more interested in what the actual answer is 343 00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:46,200 You know, what is the the the protocol for that, you know? 344 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:51,450 Is there an actual policy in place on on you know 345 00:14:51,450 --> 00:14:52,840 forgiveness policy or? 346 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:59,320 Is if you could just go into a little bit more detail on 347 00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:00,480 you know, what kind of 348 00:15:01,720 --> 00:15:06,230 Circumstances lead to forgiveness and then what what doesn 349 00:15:06,230 --> 00:15:06,519 't 350 00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:15,039 Can you get a little closer to the mic I'm sorry 351 00:15:15,039 --> 00:15:18,370 Thank you. It is it's a component of us having outstanding 352 00:15:18,370 --> 00:15:21,299 customer service. It is on a case-by-case basis 353 00:15:21,299 --> 00:15:23,759 and so while we don't like to 354 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:27,149 Advertise that we do that because anything that any leaks 355 00:15:27,149 --> 00:15:29,679 that do happen after the customers meter 356 00:15:29,799 --> 00:15:32,929 So from their meter to their house, that's their service 357 00:15:32,929 --> 00:15:35,360 line and while they are responsible for that 358 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:38,600 There are just some times where it's just not 359 00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:41,480 economically 360 00:15:41,759 --> 00:15:44,769 In their well-being to charge the customer that so we don't 361 00:15:44,769 --> 00:15:48,200 have any policies in place because we we like to make sure 362 00:15:48,200 --> 00:15:48,720 everybody is 363 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:50,659 Responsible for the water they use and their plumbing 364 00:15:50,659 --> 00:15:53,509 But it it does happen where just for customer service and 365 00:15:53,509 --> 00:15:56,360 kind of goodwill to our citizens. We will forgive it 366 00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:01,879 Thanks, and that would be in is that the unbilled metered 367 00:16:08,519 --> 00:16:12,440 Okay, okay and just 368 00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:17,080 We do this we do not it once a year or is that right? 369 00:16:17,919 --> 00:16:21,250 Yes, we do it once a year. However, we actually are in the 370 00:16:21,250 --> 00:16:24,559 process right now of moving towards doing a monthly audit 371 00:16:24,960 --> 00:16:27,590 There are several reasons behind that but it is just kind 372 00:16:27,590 --> 00:16:30,000 of getting a tighter control over 373 00:16:31,200 --> 00:16:34,220 When exactly if we have are having issues that they would 374 00:16:34,220 --> 00:16:37,110 be occurring the main reasoning behind moving towards that 375 00:16:37,110 --> 00:16:37,639 monthly audit 376 00:16:37,639 --> 00:16:40,580 To you as we have we have to have our system built out in a 377 00:16:40,580 --> 00:16:43,120 manner to handle our big peak flows in the summer 378 00:16:43,279 --> 00:16:46,340 But then also still keep it running and pressurized 379 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:49,350 When we slow down in the winter and so it'll kind of give 380 00:16:49,350 --> 00:16:52,240 us a better clue as to is it actually our equipment 381 00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:56,490 That we're having issues with our data or is it the nature 382 00:16:56,490 --> 00:17:00,279 of higher demand? So but right now it is annual. Okay 383 00:17:01,200 --> 00:17:05,269 How does this compare to like the last couple of audits we 384 00:17:05,269 --> 00:17:06,759 've had is it up down? 385 00:17:07,519 --> 00:17:11,769 So it does fluctuate. So I y'all may have noticed I was 386 00:17:11,769 --> 00:17:14,759 talking about this is an update and all the figures in here 387 00:17:14,759 --> 00:17:15,079 are our 388 00:17:16,680 --> 00:17:18,240 2017 389 00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:21,180 Figures that were mentioning however on the the bar graphs 390 00:17:21,180 --> 00:17:24,480 I showed it was 2016 data because this isn't due until May 391 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:24,839 1st 392 00:17:25,039 --> 00:17:28,950 We had to pull from last year's and so for example on this 393 00:17:28,950 --> 00:17:31,019 chart for the non revenue water 394 00:17:31,599 --> 00:17:33,200 It was 395 00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:35,200 11 point five seven percent 396 00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:39,119 It was up to 13 percent for 2017 397 00:17:39,119 --> 00:17:42,589 But then I just for fun did a mid-year audit recently and 398 00:17:42,589 --> 00:17:44,480 we were back down to 12 percent 399 00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:47,779 So we will fluctuate as long as we're under 15 percent 400 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:51,049 Non revenue water that's what's expected as per the water 401 00:17:51,049 --> 00:17:53,759 development board and the American Water Works Association 402 00:17:53,799 --> 00:17:56,549 So those those fluctuations are expected now if we have a 403 00:17:56,549 --> 00:17:59,160 big dip say under eight percent all of a sudden 404 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:01,380 We'll actually start to look not so much at our system 405 00:18:01,380 --> 00:18:01,559 health 406 00:18:01,680 --> 00:18:04,430 But at our data and our data handling because that would be 407 00:18:04,430 --> 00:18:06,000 unexpected or if we have a big jump 408 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:08,730 But historically we haven't witnessed any of that. It's 409 00:18:08,730 --> 00:18:10,559 been stable within one or two percent points 410 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:18,880 All right, maybe other questions 411 00:18:22,599 --> 00:18:24,599 Yes 412 00:18:24,880 --> 00:18:28,960 Question about the the water forgiveness. I wonder and you 413 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:31,920 might not be able to answer this now 414 00:18:33,839 --> 00:18:38,880 But if there was a kind of a checklist that 415 00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:43,279 That would be something, you know on paper on the website 416 00:18:43,279 --> 00:18:46,440 that customers could see and again 417 00:18:46,440 --> 00:18:49,519 I'm not even sure if this is a good idea, but this is my 418 00:18:49,519 --> 00:18:51,480 inclination is to think it is but 419 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:54,960 Whereby 420 00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:57,759 You know customers could see that okay if people get 421 00:18:57,759 --> 00:18:59,680 forgiven on water 422 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:03,160 It's because they've had say one or more of the following 423 00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:06,109 You know and as long as it and of course you want to leave, 424 00:19:06,109 --> 00:19:07,319 you know some kind of leeway 425 00:19:07,319 --> 00:19:09,569 So it could be it's holistic, you know, you could say it's 426 00:19:09,569 --> 00:19:10,759 holistic something like that 427 00:19:11,039 --> 00:19:13,470 but at the very least because I'm thinking from the point 428 00:19:13,470 --> 00:19:16,240 of view of a custom, you know say customer who 429 00:19:16,640 --> 00:19:19,289 you know, they have a leak in this big bill and then they 430 00:19:19,289 --> 00:19:20,200 have to pay and then 431 00:19:20,960 --> 00:19:23,049 Just but then they hear a story that somebody else had 432 00:19:23,049 --> 00:19:24,640 theirs forgiven, you know 433 00:19:24,640 --> 00:19:27,509 So and I have no reason to think that it's not fair but 434 00:19:27,509 --> 00:19:28,880 just to be able to show 435 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:33,390 Customers look it's it's on an individual basis and it's we 436 00:19:33,390 --> 00:19:35,359 take a holistic approach 437 00:19:36,039 --> 00:19:39,829 But it's not arbitrary. You know what I mean instead of 438 00:19:39,829 --> 00:19:42,079 just saying oh trust us we go 439 00:19:42,079 --> 00:19:45,150 So, you know, so I'd also be interested to know, you know, 440 00:19:45,150 --> 00:19:47,079 does the forgiveness tend to happen? 441 00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:51,960 More in residential accounts or commercial accounts kind of 442 00:19:51,960 --> 00:19:55,430 what's the breakdown how often that's I guess that that is 443 00:19:55,430 --> 00:19:56,299 data that I would 444 00:19:56,299 --> 00:19:57,920 like to see 445 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:01,269 And and you know and and maybe the answer is well, it's you 446 00:20:01,269 --> 00:20:02,440 know for legal reasons 447 00:20:02,440 --> 00:20:05,930 It's not a good idea to do that. But still I would like to 448 00:20:05,930 --> 00:20:06,299 know 449 00:20:09,200 --> 00:20:13,319 To hear your thoughts on that sure colleagues thoughts on 450 00:20:13,319 --> 00:20:13,559 that 451 00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:17,529 Sure, so I think and then just off of the top of my head 452 00:20:17,529 --> 00:20:17,859 today 453 00:20:17,859 --> 00:20:19,970 That doesn't mean we might not come to a different 454 00:20:19,970 --> 00:20:21,079 conclusion if we explored it more 455 00:20:21,079 --> 00:20:23,819 but we probably don't want to advertise on the website or 456 00:20:23,819 --> 00:20:26,039 have a checklist that we do this because it really 457 00:20:26,599 --> 00:20:27,960 We don't want to do it often 458 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:31,029 It really is like I said us just trying to adhere to our 459 00:20:31,029 --> 00:20:33,619 core value of outstanding customer service and if someone 460 00:20:33,619 --> 00:20:34,920 really really needs it 461 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:37,970 And that tends to be you know, one of the first thresholds 462 00:20:37,970 --> 00:20:39,200 is not advertising it 463 00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:42,319 But if they get to a point where they reach out to us 464 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:44,480 then that 465 00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:46,559 Without finding that information on there and just you know 466 00:20:46,559 --> 00:20:50,000 , hey guys, please work with me. That's so far 467 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:51,059 That's how we have handled it 468 00:20:51,059 --> 00:20:53,809 But I'm definitely willing to take a look and kind of 469 00:20:53,809 --> 00:20:56,559 analyze that data a little bit closer. Oh sure 470 00:20:56,559 --> 00:20:59,539 Yeah, I just be curious to know what you know, what kinds 471 00:20:59,539 --> 00:21:00,240 of accounts? 472 00:21:01,039 --> 00:21:04,240 It's not an arbitrary decision generally speaking. We do 473 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:07,160 not forgive any kind of water leaks or any kind of issues 474 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:08,799 related to accounts because it is 475 00:21:09,079 --> 00:21:12,220 she was mentioning water that we've produced and we paid 476 00:21:12,220 --> 00:21:12,720 for and 477 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:15,240 There are other customers are paying for that 478 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:17,480 So let us get you some more statistics and we can come back 479 00:21:17,480 --> 00:21:18,400 with a report on 480 00:21:18,960 --> 00:21:21,700 Exactly how that's done and the specificity that it's done 481 00:21:21,700 --> 00:21:23,789 with but there's not an arbitrary basis and we're not out 482 00:21:23,789 --> 00:21:24,680 there deciding that 483 00:21:24,839 --> 00:21:27,579 We're going to relieve this forgive this one and not 484 00:21:27,579 --> 00:21:29,400 forgive this one and those kinds of things 485 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:32,799 There's very specific reasons are very far and few between 486 00:21:32,799 --> 00:21:34,960 that if there is something like that that happens 487 00:21:34,960 --> 00:21:37,079 So we'll get your report. So thank you address that 488 00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:41,859 Okay, thank you. I have no reason to think is our well, I 489 00:21:41,859 --> 00:21:42,920 just want to make sure it's clear 490 00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:46,049 We're not we're not forgiving bills if it the water has 491 00:21:46,049 --> 00:21:48,279 been used we're gonna charge for that water 492 00:21:48,279 --> 00:21:51,019 Oh, yeah, I'm in the num I mean in the numbers and that 493 00:21:51,019 --> 00:21:52,759 slide showed that that's very rare 494 00:21:52,759 --> 00:21:56,119 But thank you for answering questions about them. Thank you 495 00:21:56,119 --> 00:21:56,319 , Brian 496 00:21:59,440 --> 00:22:01,440 Any other questions 497 00:22:02,880 --> 00:22:04,880 No, thank you 498 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:12,640 Okay 499 00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:16,799 Our next next on our agenda is 500 00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:23,079 To convene in a closed meeting to consider specific items 501 00:22:23,759 --> 00:22:26,500 When those items are listed below under the closed meeting 502 00:22:26,500 --> 00:22:27,319 section of this agenda 503 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:33,920 Okay, we'll now reconvene into our regular meeting 504 00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:41,920 First item we have is our consent agenda we have items a B 505 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:47,079 C and D on the consent agenda is there any 506 00:22:50,519 --> 00:22:53,369 Member who would like to have any of these items pulled for 507 00:22:53,369 --> 00:22:56,880 individual consideration see 508 00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:00,200 item C 509 00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:03,880 Okay 510 00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:06,680 Anybody else 511 00:23:07,759 --> 00:23:12,200 Okay, then we have a motion then for items a 512 00:23:13,319 --> 00:23:15,960 B and D on the consent agenda 513 00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:20,930 Recommend approval a second have a motion and a second for 514 00:23:20,930 --> 00:23:24,920 approval any discussion on the motion 515 00:23:26,039 --> 00:23:30,059 Hearing none all in favor say aye. Aye any opposed same 516 00:23:30,059 --> 00:23:30,680 sign 517 00:23:31,519 --> 00:23:34,119 Okay motion carries item C 518 00:23:36,599 --> 00:23:40,029 Mr. Cox will be right with us. Okay. I'll just read what it 519 00:23:40,029 --> 00:23:40,319 says 520 00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:43,940 Consider recommending adoption of an ordinance of the city 521 00:23:43,940 --> 00:23:46,700 of Denton, Texas the Texas home rule municipal 522 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:50,440 corporation authorizing the city manager to exit a contract 523 00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:54,960 for odor neutralizer chemicals with probe America 524 00:23:55,640 --> 00:23:57,079 incorporated 525 00:23:57,079 --> 00:23:59,829 Providing for the expenditure of funds therefore and 526 00:23:59,829 --> 00:24:01,079 providing an effective date 527 00:24:03,599 --> 00:24:08,559 In the three-year not to exceed amount of $130,000 528 00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,039 No, this is a new thing for me 529 00:24:20,039 --> 00:24:23,220 So I just wanted to ask a few questions because I didn't 530 00:24:23,220 --> 00:24:25,319 see anything in the in the information that was provided 531 00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:29,000 The odor neutralizer chemicals is this the same have we 532 00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:31,720 been using this for a number of years? 533 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:34,470 We have there's actually two layers of our odor control 534 00:24:34,470 --> 00:24:36,279 system. The first is on our perimeter 535 00:24:36,279 --> 00:24:39,309 There's actually a network of tubes that actually spray 536 00:24:39,309 --> 00:24:42,259 vapor into the air. So that's kind of the perimeter 537 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:45,029 odor control this is actually for the odor control that we 538 00:24:45,029 --> 00:24:46,559 put in our water trucks that's 539 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:49,769 Used directly on the working base to try to neutralize the 540 00:24:49,769 --> 00:24:50,160 odors 541 00:24:50,240 --> 00:24:54,160 Okay, and then to I was just a little concerned anytime you 542 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:57,650 're talking about chemicals and sure putting them into the 543 00:24:57,650 --> 00:24:58,599 air or into 544 00:24:58,599 --> 00:25:00,599 you know water 545 00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:04,240 Transfer whatever I didn't see anything with regards to any 546 00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:05,559 kinds of 547 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:10,500 Stats on the effect on the environment or to humans or to 548 00:25:10,500 --> 00:25:12,640 animals or anything like that 549 00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:15,390 So I was just wanting to know if you had any information 550 00:25:15,390 --> 00:25:16,119 about that 551 00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:18,589 I don't have it with me this evening, but I can certainly 552 00:25:18,589 --> 00:25:20,960 get that back to the board in terms of a staff report 553 00:25:21,279 --> 00:25:22,400 Okay 554 00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:24,400 because that's one of the 555 00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:29,009 Concerns I have certainly yeah huge concern. I had I had 556 00:25:29,009 --> 00:25:31,960 that concern too. I'm glad you asked that 557 00:25:32,319 --> 00:25:34,319 But we have used this company before 558 00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:37,650 We've used the chemical. I'm not sure about the company, 559 00:25:37,650 --> 00:25:40,240 but we have used these chemicals before we have used these 560 00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:40,640 chemicals before 561 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:49,119 Okay, thank you, okay 562 00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:52,680 All right any other questions 563 00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:57,880 If 564 00:25:57,880 --> 00:25:59,240 how 565 00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:02,470 As far as you can describe, you know, how bad the smell 566 00:26:02,470 --> 00:26:06,119 would be without it, you know, is it more it's more for the 567 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:11,880 Protection of and comfort level of workers people in the 568 00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:12,440 area 569 00:26:13,039 --> 00:26:15,259 We actually have some regulatory requirements. I can't 570 00:26:15,259 --> 00:26:16,559 recite them off the top of my head 571 00:26:16,559 --> 00:26:19,309 But there is an odor control requirement in our TCEQ 572 00:26:19,309 --> 00:26:21,809 operating permit that requires certain things like this for 573 00:26:21,809 --> 00:26:22,480 odor abatement 574 00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:27,480 Certain days are more important to use this and others high 575 00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:30,000 wind days are particularly challenging for us because 576 00:26:30,319 --> 00:26:33,059 The perimeter odor control system isn't quite as effective 577 00:26:33,059 --> 00:26:35,440 when the winds are above a certain miles per hour 578 00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:38,420 And so that's when we do use the water trucks and try to 579 00:26:38,420 --> 00:26:39,500 suppress not just the odors 580 00:26:39,500 --> 00:26:42,250 But also the dust so we mix these chemicals with the water 581 00:26:42,250 --> 00:26:44,799 in the water truck to suppress both at the same time 582 00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:50,380 Thank you. Okay, so for clarification that I mean we've 583 00:26:50,380 --> 00:26:53,160 used the chemicals before they're 584 00:26:54,039 --> 00:26:55,400 approved 585 00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:57,400 EPA whatever 586 00:26:58,319 --> 00:27:02,029 Public safety they all come with that certification and all 587 00:27:02,029 --> 00:27:03,799 that is that correct? 588 00:27:03,799 --> 00:27:07,029 I'll need to clarify relative to the question about because 589 00:27:07,029 --> 00:27:08,920 I'm not getting a yeah 590 00:27:09,500 --> 00:27:12,519 That's one of the things that concerns me is that you know, 591 00:27:12,519 --> 00:27:14,880 if it's been approved if it's EPA approved 592 00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:18,079 You know, it's you know blessed and whatever that then that 593 00:27:18,079 --> 00:27:19,420 would you know 594 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:22,839 Then I could say yes. Well, let's go for it, but I'm not 595 00:27:22,839 --> 00:27:23,759 getting that information 596 00:27:23,759 --> 00:27:26,519 Is there any reason we couldn't get that research done and 597 00:27:26,519 --> 00:27:29,009 bring it back to them? Absolutely. We can certainly pull 598 00:27:29,009 --> 00:27:29,279 the atom 599 00:27:29,279 --> 00:27:31,279 Why don't we do that? 600 00:27:31,279 --> 00:27:34,079 That would be great. I'd be curious to know 601 00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:37,000 Are there any? 602 00:27:38,240 --> 00:27:40,240 alternatives and 603 00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:42,279 Maybe we don't 604 00:27:42,279 --> 00:27:45,079 You know, maybe there's no reason for alternatives because 605 00:27:45,079 --> 00:27:47,119 maybe this is perfectly safe 606 00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:49,869 But you know, it are there more environmentally friendly 607 00:27:49,869 --> 00:27:53,390 alternatives and it's so what's the cost is it cost prohib 608 00:27:53,390 --> 00:27:53,799 itive? 609 00:27:55,839 --> 00:27:59,380 Let me look into this and make sure that we've done our due 610 00:27:59,380 --> 00:28:01,519 diligence on that invented that out in terms of the 611 00:28:01,519 --> 00:28:02,480 environmental impacts 612 00:28:02,599 --> 00:28:04,839 I'll circle back and we'll repost the item for you 613 00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:11,000 Okay 614 00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:17,640 So item C is pulled replaced on a future agenda 615 00:28:19,319 --> 00:28:21,319 Okay 616 00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:23,440 All right 617 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,190 Items other items for individual consideration. We have the 618 00:28:26,190 --> 00:28:27,160 public utility board 619 00:28:28,160 --> 00:28:30,160 meeting minutes of April 9th 620 00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:32,160 2018 621 00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,799 These are in your packet been distributed in advance 622 00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:38,400 Or any questions comments? 623 00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:41,480 Corrections 624 00:28:43,039 --> 00:28:45,930 Hearing none is there a motion to approve those minutes as 625 00:28:45,930 --> 00:28:46,839 submitted 626 00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:49,440 so many 627 00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,039 to prove 628 00:28:51,039 --> 00:28:55,799 Most to approve second second and a second discussion 629 00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:58,640 All in favor say aye 630 00:28:58,759 --> 00:29:00,359 Any opposed? 631 00:29:00,359 --> 00:29:01,880 Thank you 632 00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:05,369 Item B under items for individual consideration is to 633 00:29:05,369 --> 00:29:07,000 consider recommending 634 00:29:07,759 --> 00:29:10,069 adoption of an ordinance of the city of Denton, Texas the 635 00:29:10,069 --> 00:29:11,759 Texas Home Rural Municipal Corporation 636 00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:15,990 Authorizing the city manager to execute a contract for the 637 00:29:15,990 --> 00:29:19,000 supply of a mission system reducing agent 638 00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:24,359 Ammonia for the Denton Energy Center via Southern ionics 639 00:29:25,200 --> 00:29:26,559 incorporated 640 00:29:26,559 --> 00:29:29,200 Providing for the expenditure of funds therefore and 641 00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:30,079 providing an effective date 642 00:29:30,880 --> 00:29:34,559 in this in the three-year not to exceed amount of 643 00:29:35,319 --> 00:29:37,319 1,000,000 644 00:29:37,319 --> 00:29:38,319 287,000 645 00:29:38,319 --> 00:29:40,319 $772.50 646 00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:45,119 George Morrill DME general manager I rise to introduce 647 00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:48,720 Chris Lutrick Chris is our project manager for the Denton 648 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:49,880 Energy Center and 649 00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:53,849 He handled this procurement. I'm gonna let him take away 650 00:29:53,849 --> 00:29:56,490 the presentation. You know, it's his presentations have 651 00:29:56,490 --> 00:29:57,140 more pictures 652 00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:06,799 Good evening, thank you for your time 653 00:30:06,799 --> 00:30:10,599 So give you a little bit more information on the aqua 654 00:30:10,599 --> 00:30:14,579 ammonia supply that was detailed in the IFB 655 00:30:15,279 --> 00:30:16,359 6701 656 00:30:16,359 --> 00:30:19,119 As you see we have some updated pictures if you haven't 657 00:30:19,119 --> 00:30:21,819 been out to the deck to see what it's looking like these 658 00:30:21,819 --> 00:30:22,079 days 659 00:30:22,839 --> 00:30:25,759 In this in this quick presentation, we're going to talk 660 00:30:25,759 --> 00:30:26,759 about what is ammonia 661 00:30:27,279 --> 00:30:30,779 What is the function of aqua ammonia at the Denton Energy 662 00:30:30,779 --> 00:30:32,880 Center the important the safety? 663 00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:35,880 storage and handling of the aqua ammonia 664 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:38,319 emergency response plan 665 00:30:38,319 --> 00:30:41,109 The bid summaries and then any questions you may have some 666 00:30:41,109 --> 00:30:43,680 of the information in here is a little bit technical 667 00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:47,640 So if I say something that's not quite clear just just stop 668 00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:47,799 me 669 00:30:47,799 --> 00:30:50,980 I'll be glad to try to clarify it. If not, dr. Banks is 670 00:30:50,980 --> 00:30:52,839 here to help with the chemistry 671 00:30:57,279 --> 00:30:59,279 So ammonia 672 00:30:59,559 --> 00:31:03,349 Chemical compound is NH3 its chemical properties are it's a 673 00:31:03,349 --> 00:31:07,039 colorless gas with a characteristic pundits pungent smell 674 00:31:07,319 --> 00:31:10,319 It is a naturally occurring compound that is present in 675 00:31:10,319 --> 00:31:12,799 nature and it is also in the human body 676 00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:17,259 An important fact is readily dissolves in water and there's 677 00:31:17,259 --> 00:31:19,759 everybody's probably heard of anhydrous ammonia 678 00:31:19,759 --> 00:31:23,359 Anhydrous is Greek for without water. That's ammonia in its 679 00:31:23,359 --> 00:31:24,799 pure form. It's a gas 680 00:31:25,799 --> 00:31:28,750 Aqua, ammonia is a solution of water and ammonia where the 681 00:31:28,750 --> 00:31:30,839 ammonia has been dissolved in the water 682 00:31:31,759 --> 00:31:35,200 Aqua ammonia is defined as between 15 and 30 percent 683 00:31:35,839 --> 00:31:38,400 And 19 percent is what we'll use at the deck 684 00:31:39,279 --> 00:31:42,240 Ammonia is everywhere. It has industrial and household uses 685 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:45,750 and hydros ammonia is used worldwide as an agricultural 686 00:31:45,750 --> 00:31:46,920 fertilizer and 687 00:31:47,519 --> 00:31:50,519 Being that it's it's to get in its liquids form. It has to 688 00:31:50,519 --> 00:31:51,079 be compressed 689 00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:54,859 So gases that change state easily from a gas to a liquid 690 00:31:54,859 --> 00:31:57,119 have some cooling properties. So therefore 691 00:31:58,359 --> 00:32:00,589 Ammonia is very prevalent in industrial refrigeration 692 00:32:00,589 --> 00:32:02,799 systems as a refrigerant these days 693 00:32:04,279 --> 00:32:07,119 Ammonia solutions five to ten percent probably a lot of 694 00:32:07,119 --> 00:32:10,319 people here have that under your sink at home. It's basic 695 00:32:10,839 --> 00:32:14,630 Mr. Clean Windex a lot of these products started as ammonia 696 00:32:14,630 --> 00:32:15,960 based solutions 697 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:20,809 And ammonia is a it dissolves organic materials to oil 698 00:32:20,809 --> 00:32:21,880 grease grime 699 00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:24,799 It's good at that. So it's used as a cleaner 700 00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:29,410 In our application, there's aqua ammonia at our percentage 701 00:32:29,410 --> 00:32:32,640 of 19 percent and urea is another term 702 00:32:33,559 --> 00:32:36,440 That's that's commonly used. It's about a 40 percent 703 00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:40,319 the city of Denton so urea is primarily used as 704 00:32:41,559 --> 00:32:44,200 Reducing agent much like our aqua ammonia at the plant 705 00:32:45,119 --> 00:32:48,980 Some quick stops and racetracks the city of Denton has a u 706 00:32:48,980 --> 00:32:49,440 rea pump 707 00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:53,150 So a modern diesel vehicles rely on a similar system to the 708 00:32:53,150 --> 00:32:55,200 deck. They now have urea 709 00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:58,289 Tanks on them. So when you fill up your tank with diesel, 710 00:32:58,289 --> 00:32:59,599 you have to keep your urea tank full 711 00:33:00,039 --> 00:33:02,519 So you ammonia is all around us 712 00:33:03,359 --> 00:33:06,880 Aqua, ammonia as I said in urea are widely used in reducing 713 00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:10,480 agents in selective catalytic reduction systems or SCRs 714 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:14,200 So in particular for the deck 715 00:33:14,519 --> 00:33:17,839 our SCR are basically to give you some background on what 716 00:33:17,839 --> 00:33:21,799 the SCR is the SCR system uses a chemical reaction to 717 00:33:21,799 --> 00:33:23,039 reduce in part the 718 00:33:23,039 --> 00:33:26,920 Nitrogen oxides that are produced by combustion engines in 719 00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:30,319 particular the the SCR system at the deck 720 00:33:30,359 --> 00:33:35,609 Will remove about 97.5 percent of the NOx from our plants 721 00:33:35,609 --> 00:33:38,240 emissions. So they're very effective system 722 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:39,519 So that's why you're seeing them 723 00:33:39,519 --> 00:33:42,630 Most commercial or nearly all diesel engines nowadays use 724 00:33:42,630 --> 00:33:45,279 the same type of system because it's very it's very 725 00:33:45,279 --> 00:33:47,559 effective at reducing the NOx output 726 00:33:47,920 --> 00:33:51,180 The three main components of the system are the catalyst 727 00:33:51,180 --> 00:33:54,660 the reducing agent in our case. That's the aqua ammonia and 728 00:33:54,660 --> 00:33:54,960 heat 729 00:33:55,519 --> 00:33:59,230 The AA is introduced into the exhaust stream just outside 730 00:33:59,230 --> 00:34:01,799 of the building where it's mixed in a mixing duck 731 00:34:02,119 --> 00:34:05,349 And using the the heat that's present in the exhaust gases 732 00:34:05,349 --> 00:34:08,360 and it enters the catalyst housing and this catalyst 733 00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:09,159 housing is where the 734 00:34:09,159 --> 00:34:10,119 chemical 735 00:34:10,119 --> 00:34:12,119 interaction of the three main components 736 00:34:13,119 --> 00:34:16,800 Effectively reduces the NOx down to nitrogen and water 737 00:34:18,320 --> 00:34:22,980 The deck SCR system utilizes aqua ammonia as a reducing 738 00:34:22,980 --> 00:34:23,400 agent 739 00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:27,110 So of the of the other forms of ammonia that I've mentioned 740 00:34:27,110 --> 00:34:30,920 that there's an hydrous ammonia and urea 741 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:34,800 Aquas ammonia is by far the safest and most stable 742 00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:39,340 Form of nitrogen that's available. So being it's 19% you 743 00:34:39,340 --> 00:34:42,559 have to handle about five times the amount of volume 744 00:34:42,679 --> 00:34:44,679 But it but it's much safer 745 00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:47,360 So the 746 00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:50,960 Aquas ammonia will be consumed at a rate of between 18.5 747 00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:53,400 and 14.5 gallons per engine hour 748 00:34:53,679 --> 00:34:58,000 The 18.5 is the manufacturers guaranteed consumption rate 749 00:34:58,559 --> 00:35:02,079 the 14.5 being their expected consumption rate and 750 00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:06,449 The plant has an automated system that will ensure that the 751 00:35:06,449 --> 00:35:08,480 aqua ammonia is dosed properly 752 00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:13,039 So here we have a picture if you can see my mouse here 753 00:35:13,039 --> 00:35:15,869 So here's actually a the ammonia storage tank at the Denton 754 00:35:15,869 --> 00:35:19,719 Energy Center as you can see it sets within a concrete 755 00:35:19,719 --> 00:35:20,639 containment 756 00:35:21,199 --> 00:35:22,559 Dyke 757 00:35:22,559 --> 00:35:25,039 Where this truck is parked here, you'll see these grates 758 00:35:26,039 --> 00:35:29,539 The tankers will back into this area here. So when that 759 00:35:29,539 --> 00:35:30,760 when the plan is finished 760 00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:33,909 This will also be concreted. You don't have roll curbs on 761 00:35:33,909 --> 00:35:34,039 it 762 00:35:34,039 --> 00:35:37,510 so as the tanker backs in even the tanker will be encaps 763 00:35:37,510 --> 00:35:39,320 ulated within a containment area and 764 00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:42,139 Just for note that this same system is used for the lube 765 00:35:42,139 --> 00:35:43,880 oil, which is on the other side 766 00:35:46,519 --> 00:35:50,579 So the plants storage capacity is 30,000 gallons and again 767 00:35:50,579 --> 00:35:52,840 based on that maximum consumption rate 768 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:56,699 That's 172 plant hours of runtime and a plant hour is all 769 00:35:56,699 --> 00:35:59,559 12 engines running at a 100% load 770 00:36:00,559 --> 00:36:03,840 The storage tank that you saw in the previous picture was 771 00:36:03,840 --> 00:36:06,239 designed and rated to store ammonia 772 00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:08,440 the 773 00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:11,849 Ammonia will arrive to the plant via tanker and that 774 00:36:11,849 --> 00:36:14,519 frequency depends on plant operation 775 00:36:14,519 --> 00:36:18,250 So the tankers carry about 6,500 gallons of ammonia at a 776 00:36:18,250 --> 00:36:18,519 time 777 00:36:18,519 --> 00:36:21,570 So it takes four to five tankers to completely fill the 778 00:36:21,570 --> 00:36:24,719 tank and again and the plant has offloading facilities to 779 00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:25,940 properly transfer 780 00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:29,099 The ammonia from the tankers to the tank. It's a closed- 781 00:36:29,099 --> 00:36:29,719 loop system 782 00:36:29,719 --> 00:36:32,730 So any any any vapors any any gas that's in the tank is 783 00:36:32,730 --> 00:36:34,960 transferred to the tanker as it fills 784 00:36:35,119 --> 00:36:37,119 So it's a closed-loop system 785 00:36:39,039 --> 00:36:41,980 Safety is important. So it is it is a chemical 786 00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:45,619 The plant has an overall emergency response plan and a 787 00:36:45,619 --> 00:36:47,159 section of that plant 788 00:36:47,679 --> 00:36:51,679 that plan addresses the aqua ammonia spill prevention and 789 00:36:51,679 --> 00:36:53,519 containment countermeasures 790 00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:56,920 As I showed you in the picture the storage tank it sits 791 00:36:56,920 --> 00:36:58,539 within a concrete dike 792 00:36:58,679 --> 00:37:01,679 That has sufficient capacity to contain all of the tank 793 00:37:01,679 --> 00:37:02,460 contents 794 00:37:02,460 --> 00:37:05,389 So say there was a tank failure the tank ruptured the 795 00:37:05,389 --> 00:37:08,519 liquid would be would be contained within the containment 796 00:37:08,519 --> 00:37:08,719 dike 797 00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:12,329 And as I mentioned again the plan also has a tanker offload 798 00:37:12,329 --> 00:37:14,440 ing area to handle any minor spills 799 00:37:14,679 --> 00:37:17,469 When you're when that when the products coming in for the 800 00:37:17,469 --> 00:37:18,019 transfer 801 00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:21,400 Those facilities are in place 802 00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:24,820 The emergency response has multiple layers if day-to-day 803 00:37:24,820 --> 00:37:25,880 activity the plant 804 00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:29,280 The plant staff would be responsible for any minor spills 805 00:37:31,079 --> 00:37:34,150 Anything of that sort of nature would be taken care of by 806 00:37:34,150 --> 00:37:36,159 the plant following the safety data 807 00:37:37,079 --> 00:37:40,159 Sheets provided by the manufacturer and their own safety 808 00:37:40,159 --> 00:37:40,539 plan 809 00:37:41,920 --> 00:37:44,780 The next level would be provided emergency response to be 810 00:37:44,780 --> 00:37:46,500 provided by the den fire department 811 00:37:46,519 --> 00:37:50,530 So the the plant manager has has had contact with the den 812 00:37:50,530 --> 00:37:51,599 fire department 813 00:37:51,599 --> 00:37:54,530 They've already been out there kind of an informal basis 814 00:37:54,530 --> 00:37:57,170 and when the plan is when all of the facilities are 815 00:37:57,170 --> 00:37:57,960 completely finished 816 00:37:58,039 --> 00:38:02,230 The fire department will perform a site site audit. They'll 817 00:38:02,230 --> 00:38:04,400 visit the site. They'll get list of everything that's 818 00:38:04,400 --> 00:38:05,079 stored on site 819 00:38:05,079 --> 00:38:07,480 So that'll be done prior to the plant going 820 00:38:08,119 --> 00:38:11,019 Commercial and any and if we were to have a spill that got 821 00:38:11,019 --> 00:38:13,239 outside of our containment area 822 00:38:13,880 --> 00:38:16,630 The remediation would be handled by an environmental 823 00:38:16,630 --> 00:38:20,400 contractor if warranted and finally any 824 00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:23,750 Non-contained discharges greater than 25 gallons would be 825 00:38:23,750 --> 00:38:26,989 reported to the TCEQ. That's the reportable limit for the 826 00:38:26,989 --> 00:38:27,860 aqua ammonia 827 00:38:30,039 --> 00:38:33,239 So the summary of bids this is kind of a specialty chemical 828 00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:36,469 But we use the process the invitation for bid for a three- 829 00:38:36,469 --> 00:38:38,480 year supply of aqua ammonia 830 00:38:39,079 --> 00:38:42,789 Two bids were received the low bid was about 65 cents per 831 00:38:42,789 --> 00:38:47,119 gallon and the the high bid was about 74 cents per gallon 832 00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:50,960 The staff recommends awarding the lowest cost bid so 833 00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:54,199 submitted by Southern ionics out of a Pasadena, Texas 834 00:38:54,719 --> 00:38:56,719 an amount not to exceed 835 00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:58,000 1,000,000 836 00:38:58,000 --> 00:39:01,510 287 thousand seven hundred seventy two dollars and fifty 837 00:39:01,510 --> 00:39:04,679 cents and I should note that that's a budgetary amount 838 00:39:04,679 --> 00:39:08,559 So we calculated that based on that guaranteed guaranteed 839 00:39:08,559 --> 00:39:11,719 consumption rate by the manufacturer. So we 840 00:39:12,400 --> 00:39:15,510 And it's covered in the budget, but we expect that cost to 841 00:39:15,510 --> 00:39:18,559 actually come in at about 70% of this of this figure 842 00:39:20,159 --> 00:39:22,719 So with that I'll open it up to any questions 843 00:39:26,599 --> 00:39:28,599 Okay questions 844 00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:39,480 Yeah 845 00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:43,760 I think I think you're very thoroughly presentation. I 846 00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:45,440 tried to be quick. So 847 00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:49,920 Yes recommending approval 848 00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:55,280 I have two questions waiting to see 849 00:39:56,599 --> 00:40:01,840 One, you know, so this week obviously the the testing on 850 00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:04,679 the deck is gonna start in and I saw that 851 00:40:04,679 --> 00:40:06,679 Unless that's been changed 852 00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:09,750 But I know we're in the testing case now. Yeah, and I 853 00:40:09,750 --> 00:40:11,000 noticed that I 854 00:40:12,559 --> 00:40:14,559 Read that 855 00:40:14,679 --> 00:40:17,929 Whereas the testing for knocks and VOCs in particulate 856 00:40:17,929 --> 00:40:21,719 matter is gonna that's gonna be test sent out 857 00:40:21,719 --> 00:40:26,340 I guess to a lab somewhere and then the results will come 858 00:40:26,340 --> 00:40:26,760 back 859 00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:29,510 I'll take a while for those to come back but that for the 860 00:40:29,510 --> 00:40:32,079 ammonia testing this the relevance of the ammonia 861 00:40:32,079 --> 00:40:35,760 But I saw that that there's an ammonia test 862 00:40:36,519 --> 00:40:40,920 That in the results of that are gonna be available on site 863 00:40:40,920 --> 00:40:43,039 at the end of each day 864 00:40:43,039 --> 00:40:45,789 So I was wondering since you know, there's a presentation 865 00:40:45,789 --> 00:40:49,019 about about ammonia and the role of ammonia and the catal 866 00:40:49,019 --> 00:40:49,920 ytic conversion 867 00:40:50,400 --> 00:40:53,829 if you could say a little something about how the ammonia 868 00:40:53,829 --> 00:40:55,719 testing happens and 869 00:40:57,159 --> 00:41:00,739 Because that's something that I know less about than about 870 00:41:00,739 --> 00:41:01,119 the 871 00:41:02,039 --> 00:41:05,530 The particulate matter. Yes, ma'am. So that that is part of 872 00:41:05,530 --> 00:41:06,880 our emissions testing 873 00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:09,250 So actually you don't send the lab out you bring the lab to 874 00:41:09,250 --> 00:41:12,000 the plant. So for our test plan 875 00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:16,730 We'll have four four labs. So what their lab is is a it's a 876 00:41:16,730 --> 00:41:17,480 trailer 877 00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:19,909 They pull behind a truck it has all their sensors and all 878 00:41:19,909 --> 00:41:21,639 their equipment inside the truck 879 00:41:21,639 --> 00:41:24,150 And then what they do is they have leads that actually run 880 00:41:24,150 --> 00:41:25,920 out to the exhaust stacks. They take 881 00:41:26,599 --> 00:41:28,599 The old days used to get your emissions test 882 00:41:28,599 --> 00:41:31,360 They put something on the end of your tailpipe to to 883 00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:33,719 measure the gas. That's exactly what this is 884 00:41:33,719 --> 00:41:36,440 so there's probe ports that are built into the 885 00:41:43,039 --> 00:41:45,599 Yeah, so if you can can you see my mouse there 886 00:41:45,880 --> 00:41:48,260 So this is basically the backside of the plant 887 00:41:48,260 --> 00:41:51,280 So as we come through here that the silver boxes in the 888 00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:54,840 middle or the catalytic converter then after this is just 889 00:41:55,159 --> 00:41:58,510 Exhaust up to the stacks. So actually right there is one of 890 00:41:58,510 --> 00:41:58,920 them 891 00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:01,739 You can see one there one there one there that is where the 892 00:42:01,739 --> 00:42:02,599 testing is done 893 00:42:02,599 --> 00:42:06,159 So it's come it's after it's gone through the the SCR unit. 894 00:42:06,159 --> 00:42:07,960 Those probes will be placed in 895 00:42:09,039 --> 00:42:11,960 At 90 degrees at each one of these engine tests 896 00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:14,699 So then while the engines running those probes are 897 00:42:14,699 --> 00:42:15,239 gathering data 898 00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:17,510 So they're gathering data on all of the parameters that we 899 00:42:17,510 --> 00:42:19,460 're testing including ammonia slip 900 00:42:19,460 --> 00:42:22,340 So the that's the test that they're that they will be 901 00:42:22,340 --> 00:42:23,559 running at that time 902 00:42:23,559 --> 00:42:26,659 They will gather that data in real time and then process 903 00:42:26,659 --> 00:42:28,440 that and then generate a report 904 00:42:28,599 --> 00:42:31,079 In a pretty quick in a pretty quick manner 905 00:42:31,079 --> 00:42:33,820 So that that is a report that we will be when it's when it 906 00:42:33,820 --> 00:42:35,440 's when it's finished with that 907 00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:38,190 We will be sharing with the P B and the and the City 908 00:42:38,190 --> 00:42:38,559 Council 909 00:42:39,679 --> 00:42:41,679 So the ammonia 910 00:42:42,639 --> 00:42:46,039 Testing the results of that are immediately available 911 00:42:46,039 --> 00:42:49,940 But there was something in the it was in a staff report for 912 00:42:49,940 --> 00:42:51,920 council about about the testing 913 00:42:52,679 --> 00:42:57,440 That said that that the for particulate matter the results 914 00:42:58,239 --> 00:43:01,159 Would not I think they analyze their data. I don't exactly 915 00:43:01,159 --> 00:43:03,059 they have a turnaround. It's pretty quick 916 00:43:03,059 --> 00:43:06,130 I want to say we're getting a draft report within a week. 917 00:43:06,130 --> 00:43:08,480 Yeah. Yeah, it was something like seven to eight days 918 00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:11,369 Yes, whereas it's a pneumonia will be part of that as well. 919 00:43:11,369 --> 00:43:13,599 So that they validate their their calibration 920 00:43:14,320 --> 00:43:17,070 All of that so that that ammonia will come with the with 921 00:43:17,070 --> 00:43:17,880 all the other 922 00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:22,420 Reports we get okay. Yeah, okay. That's interesting. Okay. 923 00:43:22,420 --> 00:43:23,000 Thank you 924 00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:28,070 And then that sets your so then that sets your your ammonia 925 00:43:28,070 --> 00:43:30,139 usage. So the plant 926 00:43:32,079 --> 00:43:35,190 Has a way so they're gonna test so every year or every on 927 00:43:35,190 --> 00:43:36,639 the testing cycle for the 928 00:43:37,119 --> 00:43:40,130 For the energy center all of those tests will be run again. 929 00:43:40,130 --> 00:43:42,559 So you'll see that hey our ammonia slip 930 00:43:42,559 --> 00:43:45,039 I just happen to have it in front of me. It's three point 931 00:43:45,039 --> 00:43:46,519 one seven pounds per hour 932 00:43:46,519 --> 00:43:49,679 So you're gonna gonna find a rate so that matches your dos 933 00:43:49,679 --> 00:43:50,260 ing rate 934 00:43:50,260 --> 00:43:53,289 So that is your the plants indication that that you're 935 00:43:53,289 --> 00:43:56,230 maintaining your ammonia slip by knowing what you're 936 00:43:56,230 --> 00:43:57,900 putting in is what's coming out 937 00:43:59,719 --> 00:44:03,090 Okay, thank you. You're welcome. And then my other question 938 00:44:03,090 --> 00:44:03,559 was just about 939 00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:06,880 emergency preparedness 940 00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:09,860 You know, you'd mentioned that you've worked with a fire 941 00:44:09,860 --> 00:44:11,159 department 942 00:44:12,159 --> 00:44:14,199 To be prepared for in case there's an emergency 943 00:44:15,239 --> 00:44:19,380 and is there been any if there been any discussions kind of 944 00:44:19,380 --> 00:44:21,599 between the or among the 945 00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:25,119 Deck and fire and the airport since the airport is such an 946 00:44:25,119 --> 00:44:26,199 enclosed proximity 947 00:44:27,480 --> 00:44:29,280 as to 948 00:44:29,280 --> 00:44:32,570 You know if there is an incident what the you know people 949 00:44:32,570 --> 00:44:36,929 working at the airport would would do you know, is there 950 00:44:36,929 --> 00:44:37,519 some collect? 951 00:44:38,159 --> 00:44:40,269 There hasn't so we've had some collaboration with the 952 00:44:40,269 --> 00:44:42,679 airport and some other issues the stacks are 953 00:44:43,360 --> 00:44:46,559 125 feet tall as far as particular on the ammonia 954 00:44:47,559 --> 00:44:49,469 One of the one of the reasons that aqua ammonia was 955 00:44:49,469 --> 00:44:53,309 selected is because it's a liquid so there some of the 956 00:44:53,309 --> 00:44:54,960 other there's other 957 00:44:56,719 --> 00:44:58,719 Businesses near the airport that have 958 00:44:59,000 --> 00:45:01,820 Ammonia gas which is I think what you're referencing is if 959 00:45:01,820 --> 00:45:02,960 you did have an issue 960 00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:06,030 That ammonia could live again a gas form could leak and 961 00:45:06,030 --> 00:45:08,320 drift around and that would affect the airport 962 00:45:08,320 --> 00:45:11,920 But ours is in a liquid form. So it's it's it's contained 963 00:45:12,679 --> 00:45:16,510 It's it's not going to cause an issue that a refrigeration 964 00:45:16,510 --> 00:45:19,960 would leak would have so we haven't had direct 965 00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:23,980 Communications on the ammonia. Yeah, I guess yeah. No, that 966 00:45:23,980 --> 00:45:25,179 's that's absolutely true 967 00:45:27,239 --> 00:45:30,440 Yeah, I kind of saw where you're going yeah, yeah we have 968 00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:36,309 Yeah, we've worked with them that it's been good we 969 00:45:36,309 --> 00:45:39,280 actually are sewer line that we brought to you 970 00:45:41,440 --> 00:45:44,190 Before Christmas last year actually crosses the airport so 971 00:45:44,190 --> 00:45:48,320 we're working with them on a daily basis. So yeah, you're 972 00:45:48,320 --> 00:45:48,719 welcome 973 00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:52,960 Okay 974 00:45:53,599 --> 00:45:56,389 So, but I mean the safety features on the ammonia is self- 975 00:45:56,389 --> 00:46:02,119 contained yes in the storage tank and the off off 976 00:46:04,440 --> 00:46:08,519 Offload area and all that stuff. So, okay. Yes, sir. Okay 977 00:46:08,519 --> 00:46:10,440 any other questions 978 00:46:12,440 --> 00:46:17,179 No, we have a motion for this item I move 979 00:46:18,840 --> 00:46:23,400 Prove motion for approval and a second further discussion 980 00:46:24,519 --> 00:46:26,519 All in favor say aye 981 00:46:26,800 --> 00:46:32,230 Any opposed same sign. Thank you motion passes item number 982 00:46:32,230 --> 00:46:32,400 C 983 00:46:34,039 --> 00:46:36,670 Is to consider recommending approval of an ordinance affir 984 00:46:36,670 --> 00:46:40,059 ming the authority of the city manager or his designee 985 00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:43,739 To enter into a purchase of natural gas for operation of 986 00:46:43,739 --> 00:46:45,320 the Ditten energy center 987 00:46:45,800 --> 00:46:48,619 after completion of the projects test phase 988 00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:52,960 Good evening, George Morrow 989 00:46:53,639 --> 00:46:58,239 general manager of DMA again, so before you to this evening 990 00:46:58,239 --> 00:46:59,000 is an 991 00:46:59,599 --> 00:47:03,159 ordinance that would affirm the and authorize the city 992 00:47:03,159 --> 00:47:04,840 manager to execute a a 993 00:47:06,119 --> 00:47:08,869 An agreement for the purchase of natural gas for the 994 00:47:08,869 --> 00:47:12,719 commercial operation of the Denton Energy Center may recall 995 00:47:12,719 --> 00:47:13,039 you've 996 00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:16,039 previously viewed and recommended a 997 00:47:17,519 --> 00:47:21,170 Gas agreement for the deck prior to commercial operation 998 00:47:21,170 --> 00:47:22,739 and this is the pace that goes 999 00:47:24,679 --> 00:47:28,690 Beyond that time so commercial operation is scheduled for 1000 00:47:28,690 --> 00:47:29,880 about the 1st of June 1001 00:47:30,639 --> 00:47:33,019 I'm open to any questions or comments 1002 00:47:35,639 --> 00:47:37,639 Questions 1003 00:47:43,119 --> 00:47:49,079 So one question that I have is why why is it 1004 00:47:53,599 --> 00:47:57,389 Incumbent on the city manager to make that agreement 1005 00:47:57,389 --> 00:47:59,000 instead of having it go before 1006 00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:01,639 Council 1007 00:48:01,639 --> 00:48:03,639 We're gonna take it to the City Council also 1008 00:48:04,119 --> 00:48:06,119 Yeah, so 1009 00:48:07,960 --> 00:48:10,170 The way these agreements are set up, you know, there could 1010 00:48:10,170 --> 00:48:12,760 be a number of short-term long-term 1011 00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:16,719 Transactions under this nays be and I think it's just 1012 00:48:18,159 --> 00:48:20,760 And there is some authority provided to 1013 00:48:21,519 --> 00:48:23,880 the city manager under the 1014 00:48:24,679 --> 00:48:27,739 Risk-management policy. So a short-term transaction wouldn 1015 00:48:27,739 --> 00:48:30,400 't need necessarily to go to the City Council 1016 00:48:30,400 --> 00:48:33,559 I know the city manager thought it was prudent and 1017 00:48:34,159 --> 00:48:36,760 Go forward on such a large transaction is this 1018 00:48:37,679 --> 00:48:41,469 So but he may at other times think you know if it's just a 1019 00:48:41,469 --> 00:48:43,400 day or a week or a month 1020 00:48:43,440 --> 00:48:46,769 Maybe to just do an arrangement like that. Yeah, so if 1021 00:48:46,769 --> 00:48:48,280 there was an adjustment 1022 00:48:49,400 --> 00:48:52,039 So the con the terms of the contract that were that you 1023 00:48:52,039 --> 00:48:55,420 know council will be discussing in closed session that 1024 00:48:55,420 --> 00:48:56,519 specific terms 1025 00:48:58,119 --> 00:49:01,420 If something came up and there was an adjustment and not 1026 00:49:02,599 --> 00:49:04,199 those terms 1027 00:49:04,199 --> 00:49:06,559 that would go right to the 1028 00:49:07,559 --> 00:49:09,699 the city manager, you know 1029 00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:12,719 would would have authority to 1030 00:49:13,679 --> 00:49:16,440 Deal with them without having to go back to 1031 00:49:17,639 --> 00:49:21,500 To council. I don't see I don't see any adjustment to the 1032 00:49:21,500 --> 00:49:22,880 terms of the agreement 1033 00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:26,780 Basically, we're asking for it's the it's a time period and 1034 00:49:26,780 --> 00:49:29,320 we're trying and we try to provide you some 1035 00:49:29,679 --> 00:49:32,800 Ideas to the amount to be spent but the terms will be set 1036 00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:36,539 once the agreements pass. So it's really no negotiating 1037 00:49:36,539 --> 00:49:39,280 There's just simply authorizing the agreement after the 1038 00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:40,719 council approves it 1039 00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:43,469 Okay, and then the other reason I thought this was so 1040 00:49:43,469 --> 00:49:45,320 important to bring back to you is about 1041 00:49:45,800 --> 00:49:48,150 You know, it's just the fact that it's a negotiated deal. 1042 00:49:48,150 --> 00:49:50,460 It's something that we don't do often don't 1043 00:49:51,519 --> 00:49:54,599 It's not our preference. However, in this particular case 1044 00:49:54,599 --> 00:49:57,500 given the ball top volatility of the gas market and 1045 00:49:58,159 --> 00:50:01,760 This follows important to educate the PUB council public as 1046 00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:04,360 to as far as why this approach is necessary 1047 00:50:04,599 --> 00:50:08,159 Okay. Okay. Got it. Yeah, so you know, so there are no 1048 00:50:08,159 --> 00:50:08,599 changes 1049 00:50:10,400 --> 00:50:13,039 Anticipated yes, so it's basically giving city manager 1050 00:50:13,800 --> 00:50:18,039 Authority to exactly yep to sign on what council and PB had 1051 00:50:18,039 --> 00:50:20,440 agreed. Okay. Yeah, that was my one 1052 00:50:21,119 --> 00:50:23,119 Good clarification question 1053 00:50:26,719 --> 00:50:29,199 Okay, other questions comments 1054 00:50:30,559 --> 00:50:34,579 Their motion I have it I have a comment if nobody has 1055 00:50:34,579 --> 00:50:35,920 comments or questions 1056 00:50:37,119 --> 00:50:38,559 Okay 1057 00:50:38,559 --> 00:50:41,300 You'll do it now or after we get the mode. It doesn't 1058 00:50:41,300 --> 00:50:43,519 matter. Yeah, I would like to do it 1059 00:50:43,519 --> 00:50:47,519 I would like to do it now. Okay, just to you. Can you put I 1060 00:50:47,519 --> 00:50:50,679 just like can you can you put on the board the redact 1061 00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:51,960 on the 1062 00:50:51,960 --> 00:50:54,960 appear on the screen the redacted contract 1063 00:50:55,760 --> 00:50:59,159 That's a see what I can do public 1064 00:51:01,719 --> 00:51:03,719 That's right in the backup 1065 00:51:07,000 --> 00:51:10,110 Confirmation agreement. Yes. Sorry. Yeah natural gas kind 1066 00:51:10,110 --> 00:51:12,800 of confirmation agreement 1067 00:51:16,039 --> 00:51:18,039 Just a second here 1068 00:51:25,800 --> 00:51:27,800 You 1069 00:51:40,400 --> 00:51:42,400 Sorry, but I don't I don't have that 1070 00:51:43,679 --> 00:51:45,610 You want to do it on the website that somebody has a guys 1071 00:51:45,610 --> 00:51:48,079 have probably been through this before 1072 00:51:49,679 --> 00:51:51,679 Go ahead and 1073 00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:58,960 Let's see do we need to sign into our camp 1074 00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:01,119 All right 1075 00:52:01,119 --> 00:52:04,139 Thank you so much. I would just I just like for the public 1076 00:52:04,139 --> 00:52:04,360 to 1077 00:52:05,119 --> 00:52:08,840 To see because people don't always go and look at the back 1078 00:52:10,679 --> 00:52:13,599 Not just people who are here but people watching at home 1079 00:52:25,760 --> 00:52:27,760 You 1080 00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:36,380 Talk about the confirmation. Yeah that one that one if you 1081 00:52:36,380 --> 00:52:39,199 could click on that 1082 00:52:41,039 --> 00:52:43,000 Great yeah 1083 00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:45,829 Yeah, that's the one. Yeah, and if you could scroll just to 1084 00:52:45,829 --> 00:52:46,920 the very bottom of that 1085 00:52:48,599 --> 00:52:50,599 Yeah, and 1086 00:52:51,960 --> 00:52:54,889 Yeah, so I just wanted to say thank you so much for yeah, 1087 00:52:54,889 --> 00:52:55,840 that's perfect 1088 00:52:56,599 --> 00:53:00,389 I just want to say just for people who are watching here 1089 00:53:00,389 --> 00:53:01,400 now people who are 1090 00:53:02,760 --> 00:53:05,440 You know what people who might be watching at home? 1091 00:53:07,199 --> 00:53:10,239 That I myself plan to vote 1092 00:53:11,000 --> 00:53:16,250 No on this because of how much has been redacted from the 1093 00:53:16,250 --> 00:53:18,440 contract, but I also want people to know 1094 00:53:19,119 --> 00:53:22,489 Here and at home that and this was something that we 1095 00:53:22,489 --> 00:53:23,440 discussed in 1096 00:53:24,360 --> 00:53:26,360 the closed session that 1097 00:53:26,639 --> 00:53:28,639 This is redacted 1098 00:53:29,079 --> 00:53:30,800 because the 1099 00:53:30,800 --> 00:53:34,400 The company that we're doing business with had requested 1100 00:53:34,400 --> 00:53:37,840 this but but efforts were made on 1101 00:53:38,760 --> 00:53:40,760 behalf of the 1102 00:53:40,800 --> 00:53:43,719 art management to try to 1103 00:53:46,119 --> 00:53:49,000 Make this information public so that this is being this 1104 00:53:49,000 --> 00:53:53,119 information is being withheld by request of the 1105 00:53:55,639 --> 00:53:59,659 Corporation not by request of the city so the city really 1106 00:53:59,659 --> 00:54:00,119 did 1107 00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:07,250 You know do their job in really trying to to get this 1108 00:54:07,250 --> 00:54:10,210 information made public and it's just it's an unfortunate 1109 00:54:10,210 --> 00:54:10,559 situation 1110 00:54:11,480 --> 00:54:13,480 that 1111 00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:16,760 they this company said no and 1112 00:54:18,159 --> 00:54:20,679 there they had the leverage because 1113 00:54:22,039 --> 00:54:26,000 For a number of reasons they're the only one that that we 1114 00:54:26,000 --> 00:54:27,440 could do this deal with 1115 00:54:28,239 --> 00:54:31,119 So anyway, I just wanted to make that clear that this is 1116 00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:34,800 That 1117 00:54:34,800 --> 00:54:38,400 That the city did what they could to try to get make this 1118 00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:40,079 information available 1119 00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:43,280 to the public but 1120 00:54:43,920 --> 00:54:45,960 And I don't expect anybody to just trust me 1121 00:54:45,960 --> 00:54:48,980 But I do have to say like this information that it's 1122 00:54:48,980 --> 00:54:51,800 missing that the special provisions is a secret stuff 1123 00:54:52,039 --> 00:54:54,559 It's the most banal ordinary 1124 00:54:56,239 --> 00:55:00,030 It is you know, it's just pretty banal ordinary standard 1125 00:55:00,030 --> 00:55:02,840 stuff and I just I think it's unfortunate because 1126 00:55:03,159 --> 00:55:05,980 You know nothing we can do about it. But when people see 1127 00:55:05,980 --> 00:55:07,960 this they're gonna think what is the secret, you know? 1128 00:55:08,880 --> 00:55:11,000 Being withheld. So anyway, so sorry to go on about that, 1129 00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:12,760 but this is really for the public 1130 00:55:13,760 --> 00:55:15,840 To let them know why I'm voting no 1131 00:55:16,599 --> 00:55:19,340 You know and I see at the bottom of this it's got our on 1132 00:55:19,340 --> 00:55:22,400 the letterhead our core values integrity, you know 1133 00:55:22,400 --> 00:55:23,420 transparency 1134 00:55:24,119 --> 00:55:26,119 Obviously this doesn't show transparency 1135 00:55:26,679 --> 00:55:30,559 But that's not because our you know management didn't try 1136 00:55:30,559 --> 00:55:33,610 for the utmost transparency. So I just wanted people to 1137 00:55:33,610 --> 00:55:34,739 know that so thank you 1138 00:55:35,639 --> 00:55:37,639 Thanks a lot 1139 00:55:41,639 --> 00:55:44,000 See anybody else have a statement 1140 00:55:44,960 --> 00:55:48,360 Is there a motion on this item? I move to approve 1141 00:55:49,400 --> 00:55:50,679 second 1142 00:55:50,679 --> 00:55:52,679 motion and a second 1143 00:55:52,760 --> 00:55:54,159 discussion 1144 00:55:54,159 --> 00:55:57,360 All in favor say aye. Aye any opposed? 1145 00:55:57,880 --> 00:55:59,320 me 1146 00:55:59,320 --> 00:56:01,320 Okay motion carries 1147 00:56:02,639 --> 00:56:04,639 Thank you George, thank you very much 1148 00:56:07,760 --> 00:56:10,960 Next item we have is the ACM update 1149 00:56:11,679 --> 00:56:13,679 Mr. Chairman members of the board. I'll be short 1150 00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:17,889 There are a couple of things listed on your future agendas 1151 00:56:17,889 --> 00:56:21,719 item for the next couple of meetings as we roll into 1152 00:56:23,280 --> 00:56:26,989 Later part of the spring into the to the budget cycle of 1153 00:56:26,989 --> 00:56:27,719 the PUB 1154 00:56:29,079 --> 00:56:32,199 And then as far as your the business matrix goes 1155 00:56:33,039 --> 00:56:34,969 There are still a few items outstanding that will be 1156 00:56:34,969 --> 00:56:37,860 covered through the bit through the budget process 1157 00:56:38,239 --> 00:56:42,300 The PUB as I mentioned here shortly shortly ago. Those are 1158 00:56:42,300 --> 00:56:45,400 the reconnect fees for the meters now that there were 1159 00:56:45,400 --> 00:56:46,579 implementing the smart meters 1160 00:56:48,119 --> 00:56:50,860 The impact on revenues along with some information 1161 00:56:50,860 --> 00:56:54,840 regarding to capital projects in DME and solid waste, okay 1162 00:56:56,360 --> 00:56:58,360 And looks like 1163 00:56:59,559 --> 00:57:01,599 We're projecting budget discussions 1164 00:57:03,840 --> 00:57:05,840 Second meeting in May, is that correct? 1165 00:57:06,760 --> 00:57:08,760 That's correct. Okay 1166 00:57:10,559 --> 00:57:13,179 Any comments on the ACM report questions 1167 00:57:13,179 --> 00:57:17,099 I was just a question. Is this where we would put that 1168 00:57:18,039 --> 00:57:19,559 report on the 1169 00:57:19,559 --> 00:57:21,559 odor neutralizer 1170 00:57:23,519 --> 00:57:26,440 Typically yes, but we'll have that ready for you on May 7th 1171 00:57:26,440 --> 00:57:27,360 the agenda 1172 00:57:28,800 --> 00:57:30,800 I think that she had to we 1173 00:57:31,400 --> 00:57:35,000 That agenda item is going to be voted on or looked at 1174 00:57:36,760 --> 00:57:38,760 Okay 1175 00:57:40,559 --> 00:57:42,559 Concluding items 1176 00:57:44,679 --> 00:57:48,869 Under section 551 point 042 the Texas Open Meetings Act 1177 00:57:48,869 --> 00:57:51,119 respond to inquiries from 1178 00:57:51,719 --> 00:57:54,469 public utilities board or the public with specific factual 1179 00:57:54,469 --> 00:57:55,599 information or 1180 00:57:56,400 --> 00:57:58,239 recitation of policy 1181 00:57:58,239 --> 00:58:01,659 Or accept the proposal to place the matter on the agenda 1182 00:58:01,659 --> 00:58:03,119 for an upcoming meeting 1183 00:58:04,639 --> 00:58:06,280 We have any 1184 00:58:06,280 --> 00:58:09,000 requests for agenda items for future meetings 1185 00:58:15,559 --> 00:58:18,380 There's going to be after the testing is done that'll come 1186 00:58:18,380 --> 00:58:19,239 back 1187 00:58:24,119 --> 00:58:26,280 Okay, very good I 1188 00:58:28,039 --> 00:58:32,039 Want to thank the people in the audience who so graciously 1189 00:58:32,039 --> 00:58:34,960 excuse themselves a little for just a little while and 1190 00:58:35,320 --> 00:58:37,320 Sticking around hopefully you learn a little bit about 1191 00:58:38,440 --> 00:58:40,440 How these things operate? 1192 00:58:42,239 --> 00:58:44,239 Thank you for coming 1193 00:58:45,000 --> 00:58:47,000 Is there a motion to adjourn 1194 00:58:49,360 --> 00:58:54,610 Move in seconds all in favor say aye any opposed very good. 1195 00:58:54,610 --> 00:58:55,360 Thank you