WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.000 [INAUDIBLE] 00:00:02.000 --> 00:00:02.500 Anything? 00:00:02.500 --> 00:00:04.000 No? 00:00:04.000 --> 00:00:05.000 No? 00:00:05.000 --> 00:00:05.500 OK. 00:00:08.880 --> 00:00:12.759 Item four, our one item for individual consideration, 00:00:12.759 --> 00:00:15.880 that has been withdrawn. 00:00:15.880 --> 00:00:17.679 And we don't have a date certain on that. 00:00:17.679 --> 00:00:19.280 So that will just have to come back 00:00:19.280 --> 00:00:21.199 at some point in the future. 00:00:21.199 --> 00:00:23.679 [INAUDIBLE] 00:00:23.679 --> 00:00:24.480 The one? 00:00:24.480 --> 00:00:25.519 The Carmel? 00:00:25.519 --> 00:00:26.519 Mm-hmm. 00:00:26.519 --> 00:00:27.019 OK. 00:00:27.019 --> 00:00:27.960 I didn't see it. 00:00:27.960 --> 00:00:28.519 All right. 00:00:28.519 --> 00:00:31.920 Well, it just happened here at the meeting. 00:00:31.920 --> 00:00:37.679 So that will take us to public hearings. 00:00:37.679 --> 00:00:42.520 And I will call on Haley for a presentation on item A, 00:00:42.520 --> 00:00:52.640 Z18-0010. 00:00:52.640 --> 00:00:53.280 All right. 00:00:53.280 --> 00:00:54.119 Good evening. 00:00:54.119 --> 00:00:59.119 This is case Z18-10 for a people's funeral home. 00:00:59.119 --> 00:01:02.359 So the request before you is to hold this public hearing 00:01:02.359 --> 00:01:05.000 and make a recommendation to council regarding a zoning 00:01:05.000 --> 00:01:07.480 change from neighborhood residential four districts 00:01:07.480 --> 00:01:09.799 to downtown commercial neighborhood. 00:01:09.799 --> 00:01:13.719 The site is a total of 0.64 acres. 00:01:13.719 --> 00:01:15.079 As you can see here on the map, it's 00:01:15.079 --> 00:01:17.319 located on the south side of Mulberry, 00:01:17.319 --> 00:01:20.840 north side of Sycamore. 00:01:20.840 --> 00:01:23.120 The property is comprised of four lots. 00:01:23.120 --> 00:01:25.920 One of those, as you can see here on the eastern side, 00:01:25.920 --> 00:01:28.000 is developed with the existing funeral home. 00:01:28.000 --> 00:01:30.879 The other three lots are currently vacant. 00:01:30.879 --> 00:01:32.519 The owner of the funeral home is seeking 00:01:32.519 --> 00:01:36.040 to expand the building to enlarge their chapel space 00:01:36.040 --> 00:01:38.280 and to add a parking lot. 00:01:38.280 --> 00:01:40.359 The funeral home has been in operation 00:01:40.359 --> 00:01:43.560 at this current location since 1974. 00:01:43.560 --> 00:01:45.599 But the business itself, People's Funeral Home, 00:01:45.599 --> 00:01:47.760 and what was previously known as Citizens' Undertaking, 00:01:47.760 --> 00:01:52.739 has been operational in Denton since the 1930s. 00:01:52.739 --> 00:01:55.680 A mortuary, which is how our code would classify a funeral 00:01:55.680 --> 00:01:58.719 home, is not permitted within the NR4 district or any 00:01:58.719 --> 00:02:01.079 of our residential districts. 00:02:01.079 --> 00:02:03.680 This use at this location is not considered 00:02:03.680 --> 00:02:07.000 a legal nonconforming or a special exception, 00:02:07.000 --> 00:02:09.120 because it hasn't been permitted under the zoning 00:02:09.120 --> 00:02:10.919 of this property in its entire history. 00:02:10.919 --> 00:02:14.520 Prior to the NR4 designation in 2002, 00:02:14.520 --> 00:02:20.439 it has been zoned SF7 or single family seven since 1969. 00:02:20.439 --> 00:02:22.199 The downtown commercial neighborhood district 00:02:22.199 --> 00:02:24.120 is the least intensive zoning district that 00:02:24.120 --> 00:02:25.800 would permit a funeral home use. 00:02:28.680 --> 00:02:31.120 Just looking at what's proposed for the site, 00:02:31.120 --> 00:02:33.159 this is the concept plan as we've seen it now. 00:02:33.159 --> 00:02:35.840 So they have just over 3,200 square feet 00:02:35.840 --> 00:02:37.039 in the current building. 00:02:37.039 --> 00:02:40.080 They're looking to add approximately 2,500 square feet 00:02:40.080 --> 00:02:41.479 for the chapel. 00:02:41.479 --> 00:02:44.120 Currently, they only have two on-site parking spaces, which 00:02:44.120 --> 00:02:46.120 are these two shown here along Mulberry. 00:02:46.120 --> 00:02:48.400 So they're looking to add a parking lot 00:02:48.400 --> 00:02:51.680 for a total of 25 spaces. 00:02:51.680 --> 00:02:53.919 And they are proposing appropriate landscape buffers 00:02:53.919 --> 00:02:57.240 along the Western property line, the eastern side here, 00:02:57.240 --> 00:02:58.840 and along the south side of the building. 00:03:01.879 --> 00:03:05.000 So in looking at this, staff has two criteria for approval 00:03:05.000 --> 00:03:06.719 generally for rezoning conformity 00:03:06.719 --> 00:03:09.020 to the future land use plan and then the facilitation 00:03:09.020 --> 00:03:10.759 of infrastructure. 00:03:10.759 --> 00:03:13.879 When an application does not meet the future land use 00:03:13.879 --> 00:03:16.639 designation, we are given additional criteria. 00:03:16.639 --> 00:03:19.000 And those are all outlined and gone through in-depth 00:03:19.000 --> 00:03:20.080 in your staff analysis. 00:03:20.080 --> 00:03:22.960 So I'll just kind of breeze through some of the highlights 00:03:22.960 --> 00:03:25.000 of that discussion. 00:03:25.000 --> 00:03:27.039 The future land use designation for the property 00:03:27.039 --> 00:03:29.919 is low-density residential, as you're all familiar with, 00:03:29.919 --> 00:03:33.719 that typically permits between one and four units per acre. 00:03:33.719 --> 00:03:35.599 Churches and places of worship are permitted 00:03:35.599 --> 00:03:38.000 within the residential districts. 00:03:38.000 --> 00:03:39.879 And a funeral home, if you look at the land use 00:03:39.879 --> 00:03:42.879 and the functionality of it, is similar to those uses. 00:03:42.879 --> 00:03:44.919 But the use is not directly permitted 00:03:44.919 --> 00:03:47.120 under the current zoning. 00:03:47.120 --> 00:03:51.080 DCN is not consistent with this future land use designation 00:03:51.080 --> 00:03:51.360 . 00:03:51.360 --> 00:03:53.520 It does permit a wide variety of commercial uses 00:03:53.520 --> 00:03:54.840 as well as multifamily. 00:03:56.080 --> 00:03:58.919 But I did want to point out our comprehensive plan 00:03:58.919 --> 00:04:00.960 does call for the preservation of the character 00:04:00.960 --> 00:04:02.199 of existing neighborhoods. 00:04:02.199 --> 00:04:04.240 Given the longstanding history that was outlined 00:04:04.240 --> 00:04:06.900 in your staff report, based on our research, 00:04:06.900 --> 00:04:09.620 we felt that this funeral home is probably an integral part 00:04:09.620 --> 00:04:10.699 of this neighborhood character. 00:04:10.699 --> 00:04:13.360 It's been in operation for over 40 years. 00:04:13.360 --> 00:04:15.360 And just from stories we've heard from, 00:04:15.360 --> 00:04:18.120 not just the owner, but people who have frequented 00:04:18.120 --> 00:04:20.360 the funeral home, it is an integral part 00:04:20.360 --> 00:04:22.160 of that Solomon Hills neighborhood. 00:04:25.600 --> 00:04:27.120 - Commissioner Ellis. - Thank you, Chair. 00:04:27.120 --> 00:04:30.199 So Haley, at this location, it's been operational since '74 00:04:30.199 --> 00:04:30.439 . 00:04:30.439 --> 00:04:31.279 Is that correct? - Yes. 00:04:31.279 --> 00:04:33.600 Yes, as best we could tell. 00:04:33.600 --> 00:04:35.180 - Commissioner Sanchez. 00:04:35.180 --> 00:04:37.240 - Okay, but you go back to 1930. 00:04:37.240 --> 00:04:39.920 It calls for a funeral home, 00:04:39.920 --> 00:04:44.220 and I also called it a funeral parlor. 00:04:44.220 --> 00:04:45.439 What's the difference? 00:04:45.439 --> 00:04:48.040 I always heard growing up, we either called it 00:04:48.040 --> 00:04:50.959 a funeral home or a funeral parlor, 00:04:50.959 --> 00:04:53.360 back in the '60s. 00:04:53.360 --> 00:04:55.839 So what's the difference between a mortuary 00:04:55.839 --> 00:04:59.019 and a funeral home and a funeral parlor? 00:05:00.079 --> 00:05:01.839 - Really, they're all describing the same thing. 00:05:01.839 --> 00:05:04.879 Mortuary is the technical term our code uses for that use. 00:05:04.879 --> 00:05:07.439 - So it really goes back to 1930. 00:05:07.439 --> 00:05:09.319 - Not at this location. 00:05:09.319 --> 00:05:12.439 Citizens Undertaking is the same business entity, 00:05:12.439 --> 00:05:15.199 and that operated back on Hickory Street, I believe, 00:05:15.199 --> 00:05:16.839 was its original location. 00:05:16.839 --> 00:05:20.720 And then through the Quaker Town and the history 00:05:20.720 --> 00:05:23.319 of the relocation to this area 00:05:23.319 --> 00:05:24.600 for the Solomon Hills neighborhood 00:05:24.600 --> 00:05:26.959 is when the funeral home was relocated 00:05:26.959 --> 00:05:28.439 kind of as part of that transition. 00:05:28.439 --> 00:05:30.480 - I must've missed that, 'cause I thought it was all part 00:05:30.480 --> 00:05:33.399 within that Solomon-- 00:05:33.399 --> 00:05:35.279 - No, the original funeral home was located 00:05:35.279 --> 00:05:36.839 on Hickory Street, I believe. 00:05:39.920 --> 00:05:42.639 So just kind of continuing with our thought process 00:05:42.639 --> 00:05:46.079 on this case, DCN is not compatible 00:05:46.079 --> 00:05:46.959 with the surrounding zoning. 00:05:46.959 --> 00:05:48.399 As you can see here, it would kind of be 00:05:48.399 --> 00:05:52.000 this isolated pocket within the subdivision. 00:05:52.000 --> 00:05:54.600 Some of our concerns with DCN are that it does permit 00:05:54.600 --> 00:05:55.720 a wide variety of uses. 00:05:55.720 --> 00:05:58.480 Densities allowed at up to 72 units per acre, 00:05:58.480 --> 00:06:01.000 and buildings can go up to 100 feet in height. 00:06:01.000 --> 00:06:03.879 So DCN alone could be-- 00:06:06.279 --> 00:06:07.480 - Jesus is trying to help. 00:06:09.720 --> 00:06:12.439 - So a straight rezoning to DCN could really be a catalyst 00:06:12.439 --> 00:06:14.399 for a lot of change in this neighborhood. 00:06:14.399 --> 00:06:15.720 It could start chipping away at the fabric 00:06:15.720 --> 00:06:16.959 of the neighborhood. 00:06:16.959 --> 00:06:19.319 So for that reason, we felt overlay restrictions 00:06:19.319 --> 00:06:21.519 would probably be very appropriate here 00:06:21.519 --> 00:06:24.040 to restrict the uses back to mortuary 00:06:24.040 --> 00:06:25.680 and to limit that building height. 00:06:27.879 --> 00:06:28.879 As I mentioned, it would kind of be 00:06:28.879 --> 00:06:31.160 an isolated pocket of DCN. 00:06:31.160 --> 00:06:33.399 However, in looking at how the site would develop 00:06:33.399 --> 00:06:34.959 under the concept plan they've shown, 00:06:34.959 --> 00:06:36.720 they do have adequate space on the site 00:06:36.720 --> 00:06:39.199 to provide for buffers and landscaping screening 00:06:39.199 --> 00:06:40.959 for the parking lot, 00:06:40.959 --> 00:06:43.600 which would kind of protect the surrounding homes. 00:06:43.600 --> 00:06:46.279 And the expansion would also be serving 00:06:46.279 --> 00:06:47.279 the public good, if you will, 00:06:47.279 --> 00:06:50.040 because currently there is only two spaces on site. 00:06:50.040 --> 00:06:52.360 They hold services pretty frequently, 00:06:52.360 --> 00:06:54.319 and my understanding is that people are parking 00:06:54.319 --> 00:06:56.279 for blocks around when that occurs. 00:06:56.279 --> 00:06:58.519 So this would take some of that traffic off the streets 00:06:58.519 --> 00:07:00.279 and enhance the safety of the area. 00:07:02.600 --> 00:07:04.639 Again, just the funeral homes history on the site 00:07:04.639 --> 00:07:08.560 is over 40 years, so we didn't see how the continuation 00:07:08.560 --> 00:07:11.319 of the use and even the expansion with the buffers 00:07:11.319 --> 00:07:14.439 that they're proposing would really be injuries 00:07:14.439 --> 00:07:15.399 to the neighborhood. 00:07:17.240 --> 00:07:20.000 We also wanted to point out that this has been 00:07:20.000 --> 00:07:20.839 a known facility. 00:07:20.839 --> 00:07:23.560 We don't have a permitting history for it, 00:07:23.560 --> 00:07:25.639 but it has been known and operational in the city 00:07:25.639 --> 00:07:27.720 for over 40 years, and there have been no actions 00:07:27.720 --> 00:07:29.879 that we could find in our records where the city 00:07:29.879 --> 00:07:32.040 has ever made an effort to shut down the use, 00:07:32.040 --> 00:07:34.600 even though it was not legally permitted at the site. 00:07:35.600 --> 00:07:38.439 Also, when the citywide rezoning occurred in 2002, 00:07:38.439 --> 00:07:39.439 the use was known. 00:07:39.439 --> 00:07:41.040 It was not addressed at the time, 00:07:41.040 --> 00:07:42.720 so we continued the nonconformity 00:07:42.720 --> 00:07:44.720 and the illegal nonconformity with that. 00:07:46.839 --> 00:07:48.639 Just looking at the other criteria for approval 00:07:48.639 --> 00:07:51.079 I mentioned in terms of access and infrastructure, 00:07:51.079 --> 00:07:52.720 there is adequate access to the site. 00:07:52.720 --> 00:07:54.480 As you saw, their driveway would punch through 00:07:54.480 --> 00:07:57.319 from Mulberry to Sycamore, and then water 00:07:57.319 --> 00:07:59.800 and sewer services are already provided to the site 00:07:59.800 --> 00:08:01.240 and would still be available. 00:08:02.720 --> 00:08:04.240 Notices were sent regarding the case. 00:08:04.240 --> 00:08:07.199 We received one written response in opposition 00:08:07.199 --> 00:08:10.160 that was included in your backup, as well as one in favor. 00:08:11.120 --> 00:08:12.959 And the applicant did hold a neighborhood meeting 00:08:12.959 --> 00:08:13.779 on June 9th. 00:08:13.779 --> 00:08:15.480 They had, I believe, eight to nine people 00:08:15.480 --> 00:08:17.279 attend the meeting, and there was no opposition 00:08:17.279 --> 00:08:18.560 expressed at that time. 00:08:20.279 --> 00:08:23.120 So to conclude, just given the uniqueness of the request 00:08:23.120 --> 00:08:24.560 and the history that we've outlined here, 00:08:24.560 --> 00:08:26.600 staff found that the rezoning to DCN 00:08:26.600 --> 00:08:29.519 could be appropriate with strict overlay conditions. 00:08:30.800 --> 00:08:32.320 And those conditions that we've proposed 00:08:32.320 --> 00:08:34.840 would be permitted uses within DCN 00:08:34.840 --> 00:08:37.360 would be restricted to only mortuaries 00:08:37.360 --> 00:08:40.720 to keep multifamily or anything else 00:08:40.720 --> 00:08:42.000 that could be injurious to the neighborhood 00:08:42.000 --> 00:08:43.879 from going in there, and then also limiting 00:08:43.879 --> 00:08:45.960 the building height to one story, 00:08:45.960 --> 00:08:49.240 which is compatible with what the applicants proposed 00:08:49.240 --> 00:08:51.159 in that concept plan that you saw. 00:08:51.159 --> 00:08:53.919 And I'd be happy to answer any other questions. 00:08:53.919 --> 00:08:54.960 - Commissioner Back. 00:08:54.960 --> 00:08:55.779 - Thank you, Chair. 00:08:55.779 --> 00:08:56.620 Thanks, Haley. 00:08:56.620 --> 00:08:58.440 As I indicated to you earlier, I thought you did 00:08:58.440 --> 00:09:01.120 an excellent job putting this thing together 00:09:01.120 --> 00:09:04.480 as far as pointing out how the city can't drop the ball 00:09:04.480 --> 00:09:07.399 in this year's back and how you've left us an open 00:09:07.399 --> 00:09:10.759 go with this, but I am, and I was trying to find it here, 00:09:10.759 --> 00:09:13.120 scramble in the last minute, and I don't mean to put 00:09:13.120 --> 00:09:15.440 Jerry on the spot or legal or anything like that, 00:09:15.440 --> 00:09:20.440 but I'm curious why, because this obviously was a screw-up 00:09:21.960 --> 00:09:24.879 on the part of the city back in time for whatever reason, 00:09:24.879 --> 00:09:28.480 we can only speculate, but why we couldn't go forward 00:09:28.480 --> 00:09:31.639 with either a variance through ZBA 00:09:31.639 --> 00:09:34.919 or consider this special use. 00:09:34.919 --> 00:09:38.919 I mean, what was the legal problem there for-- 00:09:38.919 --> 00:09:41.559 - Use variances are illegal in Texas, 00:09:41.559 --> 00:09:46.559 and so you cannot authorize a particular use 00:09:47.120 --> 00:09:50.120 at the ZBA with a variance. 00:09:50.120 --> 00:09:55.120 You can only vary things like if there's a maximum height 00:09:55.899 --> 00:09:58.799 for a building or a side yard setback 00:09:58.799 --> 00:10:01.580 or something of that nature, ZBA can look 00:10:01.580 --> 00:10:04.559 at changing the standards that are applicable 00:10:04.559 --> 00:10:09.320 to the given zoning and the given use, 00:10:09.320 --> 00:10:11.480 but they cannot authorize a use that's not 00:10:11.480 --> 00:10:14.440 specifically authorized by the existing zoning. 00:10:14.440 --> 00:10:16.480 - And our hands are tied as far as doing 00:10:16.480 --> 00:10:18.759 a one-time special use of this. 00:10:18.759 --> 00:10:22.179 And the reason I bring it up here is I don't have 00:10:22.179 --> 00:10:25.519 a problem with this, I'm planning on approving this thing. 00:10:25.519 --> 00:10:28.000 It has been there a while, it's part of the culture over 00:10:28.000 --> 00:10:28.600 there, 00:10:28.600 --> 00:10:32.240 but I'm concerned about the future, 00:10:32.240 --> 00:10:35.639 making sure we don't make another egregious oversight 00:10:35.639 --> 00:10:38.080 like this, so I was gonna, as you know, 00:10:38.080 --> 00:10:39.879 I was gonna suggest an added amendment, 00:10:39.879 --> 00:10:43.120 which probably isn't gonna be germane 00:10:43.120 --> 00:10:46.159 to the way things run, so that's fine. 00:10:46.159 --> 00:10:49.679 But you did suggest something, and I'll go ahead 00:10:49.679 --> 00:10:51.159 and make that in the public hearing, 00:10:51.159 --> 00:10:56.100 but I am concerned that somehow we protect this 00:10:56.100 --> 00:10:56.159 neighborhood 00:10:56.879 --> 00:11:00.120 from future instances that would allow commercial 00:11:00.120 --> 00:11:02.720 non-residential development to encroach 00:11:02.720 --> 00:11:04.080 in this neighborhood, so. 00:11:04.080 --> 00:11:07.720 - Right, clearly it's not an ideal situation 00:11:07.720 --> 00:11:12.720 that we would ordinarily base a rezoning case on, 00:11:13.000 --> 00:11:17.600 but there's some rather unusual facts in here 00:11:17.600 --> 00:11:22.600 because the citywide rezoning should have picked this up. 00:11:22.799 --> 00:11:26.559 And there are a lot of uses that got adjusted 00:11:26.559 --> 00:11:31.559 because of the citywide rezoning in 1969 and then in 2002. 00:11:32.200 --> 00:11:34.399 And those were both based upon comp plans 00:11:34.399 --> 00:11:37.960 that didn't pick this up, but as reflected 00:11:37.960 --> 00:11:42.960 in the staff report, there are a number of considerations 00:11:44.639 --> 00:11:49.440 and policies that were voiced in the 1999 comprehensive 00:11:49.440 --> 00:11:49.639 plan 00:11:50.639 --> 00:11:55.639 that do support the idea of recognizing this use, 00:11:55.980 --> 00:12:00.980 and in considering the zoning, the future land use 00:12:03.279 --> 00:12:06.080 is only one component of our comprehensive plan. 00:12:06.080 --> 00:12:10.759 There are numerous features of our comprehensive plan, 00:12:10.759 --> 00:12:14.039 and among those are the policies that underlie 00:12:14.039 --> 00:12:16.240 how we establish zoning and defend 00:12:16.240 --> 00:12:18.639 the comprehensive plan itself. 00:12:18.639 --> 00:12:19.720 - Okay, thank you. 00:12:21.440 --> 00:12:26.440 Is either Clifton Maxfield or Johnny Brownfield 00:12:27.440 --> 00:12:28.799 gonna be here? 00:12:28.799 --> 00:12:30.639 - I believe they both plan to attend the meeting tonight. 00:12:30.639 --> 00:12:31.799 - Okay, good, thank you. 00:12:35.879 --> 00:12:38.519 - If you don't mind, would you go back to the site plan 00:12:38.519 --> 00:12:41.679 that has the actual parking lot and all the landscaping? 00:12:43.679 --> 00:12:47.039 All the buffering, is that a function of the zoning 00:12:47.039 --> 00:12:50.240 or the parking lot requirements? 00:12:50.240 --> 00:12:53.360 - Yeah, so the landscaping you see here along Mulberry 00:12:53.360 --> 00:12:54.679 would be to screen the parking lot, 00:12:54.679 --> 00:12:56.919 similarly here on Sycamore. 00:12:56.919 --> 00:12:59.240 The buffers on the east and west sides 00:12:59.240 --> 00:13:01.360 and here along the south would be to satisfy 00:13:01.360 --> 00:13:03.039 the requirement for compatibility buffers 00:13:03.039 --> 00:13:05.580 between a commercial and a residential zoning. 00:13:08.799 --> 00:13:10.720 - Is there any way we can lessen some of that, 00:13:10.720 --> 00:13:13.120 or is that something that's beyond our purview? 00:13:14.919 --> 00:13:17.399 - With a rezoning, I'm not sure that that would be 00:13:17.399 --> 00:13:18.240 applicable. 00:13:18.240 --> 00:13:20.159 The buffer provisions are actually something in the code 00:13:20.159 --> 00:13:23.639 that staff is allowed to approve alternatives to. 00:13:23.639 --> 00:13:26.299 So this is what they've presented as their best attempt 00:13:26.299 --> 00:13:29.360 to just outright meet the code requirements. 00:13:29.360 --> 00:13:32.480 But during site plan, if they do run into some tight spots 00:13:32.480 --> 00:13:35.080 on the site, that is something that staff could look at 00:13:35.080 --> 00:13:36.639 and possibly approve alternatives to 00:13:36.639 --> 00:13:38.879 without them having to come back for an ADP. 00:13:40.679 --> 00:13:41.919 - Well, that's kind of where I'm going, 00:13:41.919 --> 00:13:46.519 is I'm sure they designed this to meet the code. 00:13:46.519 --> 00:13:48.320 And I didn't know if there was any discussion 00:13:48.320 --> 00:13:50.600 just in looking at there's quite a bit of landscaping there 00:13:50.600 --> 00:13:52.759 if they were given the option or if there was any 00:13:52.759 --> 00:13:53.320 discussion 00:13:53.320 --> 00:13:55.879 based on kind of what the area looks like 00:13:55.879 --> 00:14:00.080 of still doing some landscape, but maybe not that much. 00:14:00.080 --> 00:14:03.159 And so that was just the kind of a point to throw out 00:14:03.159 --> 00:14:04.559 or question to ask. 00:14:04.559 --> 00:14:07.399 - Yeah, so far I haven't heard an indication from them 00:14:07.399 --> 00:14:10.159 that they're opposed to providing all of the landscaping 00:14:10.159 --> 00:14:12.480 as is required, but I'm sure that's something 00:14:12.480 --> 00:14:15.720 that we could be open to if they do have a need 00:14:15.720 --> 00:14:18.159 to reduce landscaping in some areas. 00:14:18.159 --> 00:14:20.559 - Okay, all right. 00:14:20.559 --> 00:14:21.960 Anybody else on this item? 00:14:23.879 --> 00:14:26.159 Okay, Commissioner Ellis. 00:14:26.159 --> 00:14:27.000 - Thank you, Chair. 00:14:27.000 --> 00:14:29.559 Real quick, Haley, so they're keeping the existing building 00:14:29.559 --> 00:14:30.919 and just adding the addition? 00:14:30.919 --> 00:14:32.159 - That's correct. 00:14:33.399 --> 00:14:38.120 Now I have the, yeah, so this would be what they're 00:14:38.120 --> 00:14:38.399 proposing. 00:14:38.480 --> 00:14:41.000 So this would be the existing structure here 00:14:41.000 --> 00:14:43.600 with just a very consistent addition to the side 00:14:43.600 --> 00:14:46.500 to make it look like it was all designed together. 00:14:46.500 --> 00:14:49.039 Just some minor updates to the front of the building 00:14:50.120 --> 00:14:51.440 here with the awnings and things like that 00:14:51.440 --> 00:14:53.700 that you see on the bottom picture. 00:14:58.519 --> 00:15:00.720 - Any other questions for Haley on this one? 00:15:02.759 --> 00:15:05.519 Okay, we have the next one as well. 00:15:05.519 --> 00:15:07.919 So nobody else has any questions? 00:15:07.919 --> 00:15:12.440 Let's move on to item B, and Haley has that item as well. 00:15:16.679 --> 00:15:19.600 (papers rustling) 00:15:19.600 --> 00:15:22.720 - So this request is for a PD amendment 00:15:22.720 --> 00:15:25.519 to adopt a detail plan for the clean and green car wash. 00:15:27.159 --> 00:15:29.440 So you can see the property outlined here in yellow. 00:15:29.440 --> 00:15:32.320 As I mentioned, the request is for a detail plan 00:15:32.320 --> 00:15:34.840 for a site that's within plan development 176, 00:15:34.840 --> 00:15:36.840 otherwise known as Wheeler Ridge, 00:15:36.840 --> 00:15:40.419 to depict an auto laundry facility, our 91 code, 00:15:40.419 --> 00:15:41.679 rather than calling it a car wash, 00:15:41.679 --> 00:15:45.639 called it an auto laundry, so hence the odd term there. 00:15:45.639 --> 00:15:47.639 The property is just over two acres, 00:15:47.639 --> 00:15:50.360 and as you can see, it's located along this new expansion 00:15:50.360 --> 00:15:53.500 of FM 2499, just north of Hickory Creek Road. 00:15:55.919 --> 00:15:57.360 The future land use for this area 00:15:57.360 --> 00:15:59.879 is low density residential, which as we just talked about, 00:15:59.879 --> 00:16:02.080 is intended for that one to four units per acre 00:16:02.080 --> 00:16:04.080 of single family development. 00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:06.960 So while this request is not directly conformed to that, 00:16:06.960 --> 00:16:09.440 I wanted to point out that the, 00:16:09.440 --> 00:16:13.360 since the concept plan for this PD was adopted in the '90s, 00:16:13.360 --> 00:16:16.240 this site has been designated for commercial development. 00:16:16.240 --> 00:16:18.759 They anticipated FM 2499 going through, 00:16:18.759 --> 00:16:20.840 it just, the site hasn't been right for development 00:16:20.840 --> 00:16:23.620 until that road was fully extended. 00:16:25.480 --> 00:16:27.340 So as I mentioned, the current zoning, 00:16:27.340 --> 00:16:30.000 this site is part of PD 176. 00:16:30.000 --> 00:16:32.840 You can see this area of town has numerous PDs, 00:16:32.840 --> 00:16:35.159 many of which kind of overlap, 00:16:35.159 --> 00:16:37.960 and got adopted and pulled in together. 00:16:37.960 --> 00:16:40.600 The PD process does require both a concept plan 00:16:40.600 --> 00:16:42.279 and a detail plan be approved. 00:16:42.279 --> 00:16:46.080 The concept plan for this site was adopted in 1999. 00:16:46.080 --> 00:16:49.320 And at the time, the site was designated for commercial 00:16:49.320 --> 00:16:52.039 and any use permitted in the 1991 code 00:16:52.039 --> 00:16:54.320 for commercial zoning was going to be permitted there. 00:16:54.320 --> 00:16:56.600 So auto laundry was among that list. 00:16:58.679 --> 00:17:01.240 Looking at what they've proposed for their detail plan, 00:17:01.240 --> 00:17:03.960 they have about 4,400 square feet of building area, 00:17:03.960 --> 00:17:05.740 which is outlined in yellow. 00:17:05.740 --> 00:17:07.279 They do have one driveway, 00:17:07.279 --> 00:17:08.839 which I believe they intend to share 00:17:08.839 --> 00:17:10.839 with whatever may develop on the northern part 00:17:10.839 --> 00:17:12.079 of the site in the future. 00:17:13.519 --> 00:17:16.480 They're proposing six staff and customer parking spaces 00:17:16.480 --> 00:17:20.000 and a total of 20 vacuums here on the south side 00:17:20.000 --> 00:17:22.680 that would be developed immediately. 00:17:22.680 --> 00:17:24.400 And then they have an area called out 00:17:24.400 --> 00:17:27.200 for five future vacuum stalls to be added in the future. 00:17:29.880 --> 00:17:32.200 What they've proposed for building materials 00:17:32.200 --> 00:17:35.000 is a combination of fiber cement panels, glass, 00:17:35.000 --> 00:17:38.299 and an architectural grade aluminum panel. 00:17:38.299 --> 00:17:40.279 The PD permits a variety of materials, 00:17:40.279 --> 00:17:42.759 glass, stones, stucco, tile, concrete, wood, 00:17:42.759 --> 00:17:44.619 or any similar material. 00:17:46.240 --> 00:17:48.000 And the total building height, 00:17:48.000 --> 00:17:49.559 in case you were wondering here on the tower, 00:17:49.559 --> 00:17:52.160 is just over, I believe it's right at 30 feet tall. 00:17:53.259 --> 00:17:54.279 - Commissioner Beck. 00:17:54.279 --> 00:17:57.000 - What is the maximum allowable height on that? 00:17:57.000 --> 00:17:58.920 - It permitted up to 100 feet. 00:17:58.920 --> 00:18:00.160 - Is it? 00:18:00.160 --> 00:18:01.000 Okay, thank you. 00:18:04.599 --> 00:18:07.880 - So just a look at the other sides of the building here. 00:18:07.880 --> 00:18:10.279 It's a common theme all the way around. 00:18:10.279 --> 00:18:13.240 The landscaping, according to the PD, 00:18:13.240 --> 00:18:15.599 was to follow the, whatever landscaping ordinance 00:18:15.599 --> 00:18:19.109 was in place at the time, which was the 1998 landscape code 00:18:19.109 --> 00:18:19.359 . 00:18:19.359 --> 00:18:23.000 So this resulted in, based on the lot area, 00:18:23.000 --> 00:18:26.440 the need for 27 trees and 33 shrubs to be added, 00:18:26.440 --> 00:18:28.539 which is what they've proposed here. 00:18:28.539 --> 00:18:32.039 Overall landscaping for the site would be 39%. 00:18:32.039 --> 00:18:34.160 The key feature of the landscaping I wanted to point out 00:18:34.160 --> 00:18:37.240 is a buffer area on the south side. 00:18:37.240 --> 00:18:40.880 So there are numerous existing tall trees in this area. 00:18:40.880 --> 00:18:44.440 They're proposing to keep as many of those as possible. 00:18:44.440 --> 00:18:46.759 They're providing a six foot masonry wall, 00:18:46.759 --> 00:18:48.559 which is called for in the PD here 00:18:48.559 --> 00:18:50.720 on just the north side of that landscaping. 00:18:50.720 --> 00:18:52.440 So the trees will face the residences. 00:18:52.440 --> 00:18:55.279 And then they are adding eight additional trees 00:18:55.279 --> 00:18:56.880 to further enhance that buffer. 00:18:59.420 --> 00:19:02.039 So as I mentioned, in the '91 code, 00:19:02.039 --> 00:19:05.099 it was one of the criteria for approval of the detail plan 00:19:05.099 --> 00:19:07.279 was that it comply with the concept plan. 00:19:07.279 --> 00:19:10.829 So here we can see the concept plan for this adopted in 00:19:10.829 --> 00:19:12.000 1999. 00:19:12.000 --> 00:19:14.160 The subject property is the southern half 00:19:14.160 --> 00:19:15.599 of this tract outlined in red, 00:19:15.599 --> 00:19:17.599 which was called for commercial. 00:19:18.920 --> 00:19:20.920 So this being a commercial development, 00:19:20.920 --> 00:19:23.119 it is in conformance with the concept plan. 00:19:25.099 --> 00:19:27.759 The other criteria for detail plan approval 00:19:27.759 --> 00:19:29.819 was that the plan provided a compatible arrangement 00:19:29.819 --> 00:19:32.720 of buildings and land uses that wouldn't adversely affect 00:19:32.720 --> 00:19:35.960 adjoining neighborhood or properties outside 00:19:35.960 --> 00:19:38.019 the boundaries of the plan. 00:19:38.019 --> 00:19:40.480 So this development is in line with what would typically 00:19:40.480 --> 00:19:44.079 be seen along primary arterial, such as 2499. 00:19:44.079 --> 00:19:46.119 They are maintaining that existing tree line, as I 00:19:46.119 --> 00:19:46.839 mentioned, 00:19:46.839 --> 00:19:48.859 and then adding the required wall, 00:19:48.859 --> 00:19:51.920 as well as some new trees to help screen and buffer 00:19:51.920 --> 00:19:54.839 between this and the adjoining residences to the south. 00:19:54.839 --> 00:19:56.440 On the west side of the property, 00:19:56.440 --> 00:19:59.680 there is a approximately 175 feet of separation 00:19:59.680 --> 00:20:01.559 created by those power line easements. 00:20:01.559 --> 00:20:03.839 And then they're furthering the separation of the building 00:20:03.839 --> 00:20:05.759 by locating their detention pond, 00:20:05.759 --> 00:20:08.220 as well as some landscaping behind the building. 00:20:09.559 --> 00:20:11.400 Staff did have concerns in looking at this 00:20:11.400 --> 00:20:14.079 with regards to lighting and signage. 00:20:14.079 --> 00:20:16.519 Lighting is loosely addressed in the PD regulations 00:20:16.519 --> 00:20:18.299 and signage not at all. 00:20:18.299 --> 00:20:20.960 So we felt that there may be some room for concern there 00:20:20.960 --> 00:20:22.920 with how the lights and glare from the site 00:20:22.920 --> 00:20:24.680 could affect surrounding properties. 00:20:26.119 --> 00:20:28.400 Another other criteria-- - Commissioner Sanchez. 00:20:28.400 --> 00:20:30.680 - In considering the neighborhood as far as lighting 00:20:30.680 --> 00:20:33.160 or the neighbors, another consideration I think 00:20:33.160 --> 00:20:36.279 that should be given is the safety of people in there, 00:20:36.279 --> 00:20:39.359 not keep it so dark if it is approved, 00:20:39.359 --> 00:20:42.299 that people don't feel safe going in there. 00:20:42.299 --> 00:20:45.160 So it should be balanced. - Certainly. 00:20:45.160 --> 00:20:47.480 - Not just the neighbors, but also the safety 00:20:47.480 --> 00:20:50.000 of the people utilizing the-- 00:20:50.000 --> 00:20:53.839 - Yes, and with the criteria that we've proposed, 00:20:53.839 --> 00:20:55.559 as you'll see, we're proposing that they comply 00:20:55.559 --> 00:20:57.500 with current lighting standards for the site, 00:20:57.500 --> 00:20:59.660 which does allow for adequate safety 00:20:59.660 --> 00:21:02.359 within the property, it just restricts how bright 00:21:02.359 --> 00:21:04.359 it can be on the edges of the property. 00:21:08.240 --> 00:21:11.720 So yeah, the other criteria, adequate and safe circulation 00:21:11.720 --> 00:21:13.599 of vehicular traffic, as you saw, they have just 00:21:13.599 --> 00:21:15.759 that one drive aisle that would provide kind of a one-way 00:21:15.759 --> 00:21:18.400 loop around and through the property. 00:21:18.400 --> 00:21:20.799 Then they are restricting the access off of 2499 00:21:20.799 --> 00:21:22.359 by having that shared driveway. 00:21:23.799 --> 00:21:26.440 We did find that the plan was in substantial conformance 00:21:26.440 --> 00:21:29.160 with the city's regulations and the PD regulations. 00:21:30.660 --> 00:21:32.920 Notices were sent regarding this request. 00:21:32.920 --> 00:21:34.920 A couple of those were included in your backup, 00:21:34.920 --> 00:21:37.480 and then before the meeting, I placed a few more 00:21:37.480 --> 00:21:39.799 that had been received at each of your seats. 00:21:39.799 --> 00:21:42.599 So in total, we had five opposition responses 00:21:42.599 --> 00:21:44.480 that accounted for 2% of the land area 00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:47.319 within this 200-foot buffer. 00:21:47.319 --> 00:21:49.319 Actually, one of the responses was from a property 00:21:49.319 --> 00:21:51.240 that's even off the map here. 00:21:51.240 --> 00:21:53.079 It was well outside of the 500-foot area, 00:21:53.079 --> 00:21:55.960 but I believe the HOA shared the notice 00:21:55.960 --> 00:21:57.880 with everyone in the neighborhood. 00:21:57.880 --> 00:21:59.720 And then we received one response in favor, 00:21:59.720 --> 00:22:01.819 which was from the current property owner. 00:22:03.660 --> 00:22:05.039 - Commissioner Beck. 00:22:05.039 --> 00:22:06.240 - Help me with my math here. 00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:10.440 We've got five opposed, and they amount to 2% of the total, 00:22:10.440 --> 00:22:14.039 and I've got one in favor, and they're 23%. 00:22:14.039 --> 00:22:16.319 - That calculation, under the local government code, 00:22:16.319 --> 00:22:19.579 is based on the land area that those responses represent 00:22:19.579 --> 00:22:21.119 within that 200-foot buffer. 00:22:21.119 --> 00:22:22.079 - Okay, thanks. 00:22:25.039 --> 00:22:27.000 - So with that, staff is recommending approval 00:22:27.000 --> 00:22:30.759 with the request because it met our criteria for approval. 00:22:30.759 --> 00:22:32.779 However, we did find that there were a couple of conditions 00:22:32.779 --> 00:22:35.180 that we thought would help make this more compatible. 00:22:35.180 --> 00:22:38.079 The first being restricting exterior lighting 00:22:38.079 --> 00:22:40.000 on the building so that it does not face 00:22:40.000 --> 00:22:41.940 single-family residents as adjoining, 00:22:41.940 --> 00:22:45.170 or if it does, that it be screened from view of those homes 00:22:45.170 --> 00:22:45.519 . 00:22:45.519 --> 00:22:47.700 And then also with that, a photometric plan 00:22:47.700 --> 00:22:49.819 should be provided with the building permit application 00:22:49.819 --> 00:22:51.200 to demonstrate compliance 00:22:51.200 --> 00:22:53.200 with our current site lighting standards. 00:22:54.920 --> 00:22:56.559 And the second condition would be, 00:22:56.559 --> 00:22:58.200 due to the proximity of this location 00:22:58.200 --> 00:23:00.440 and the number of residences around there, 00:23:00.440 --> 00:23:03.240 that the project comply with the current code of ordinances 00:23:03.240 --> 00:23:06.240 sign criteria, which does impose setbacks 00:23:06.240 --> 00:23:08.599 from residences on the sign. 00:23:08.599 --> 00:23:10.680 And along with that, we would also propose 00:23:10.680 --> 00:23:14.079 limiting the signs so that no illuminated wall signs 00:23:14.079 --> 00:23:16.480 directly face a single-family residence. 00:23:16.480 --> 00:23:17.900 So on that 30-foot tall tower, 00:23:17.900 --> 00:23:20.440 there is possibility for a sign on each face, 00:23:20.440 --> 00:23:24.740 some of which would directly face into some homes. 00:23:24.740 --> 00:23:27.640 With that, I'd be happy to answer any other questions. 00:23:27.640 --> 00:23:28.480 - Commissioner Bec. 00:23:28.480 --> 00:23:29.680 - Thank you, Chair. 00:23:29.680 --> 00:23:33.559 So this is not like a zoning change request. 00:23:33.559 --> 00:23:35.799 It's a PD, they can build by right, 00:23:37.359 --> 00:23:42.200 as long as they meet the criteria in the design, right? 00:23:42.200 --> 00:23:43.440 - Correct, yeah, any use permitted 00:23:43.440 --> 00:23:45.240 within the 1991 commercial district 00:23:45.240 --> 00:23:46.319 was permitted by right here. 00:23:46.319 --> 00:23:48.960 - Maybe a quick question for Scott on this. 00:23:48.960 --> 00:23:51.240 We're looking in the future as we rewrite 00:23:51.240 --> 00:23:54.519 the development code where a zoning change request 00:23:54.519 --> 00:23:57.599 would require, I believe, correct me if I'm wrong, 00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:03.640 a neighborhood meeting on a zoning change request, right? 00:24:06.640 --> 00:24:08.880 Sorry, Richard, I didn't mean to diminish you. 00:24:08.880 --> 00:24:10.200 - No, that's correct. 00:24:10.200 --> 00:24:13.039 One of the items that we're looking at 00:24:13.039 --> 00:24:15.859 as part of the DDC update is having a neighborhood meeting 00:24:15.859 --> 00:24:18.359 be mandatory as opposed to optional. 00:24:18.359 --> 00:24:22.400 - Would that fall in with a PD, though? 00:24:22.400 --> 00:24:24.339 - It would be for any zoning change. 00:24:24.339 --> 00:24:26.799 So yes, 'cause with a PD. 00:24:28.400 --> 00:24:30.059 - Okay, okay. 00:24:30.059 --> 00:24:31.359 Once we said-- - For a new PD, 00:24:31.359 --> 00:24:33.160 I think what we'd have to look at is 00:24:33.160 --> 00:24:36.579 for these already established PDs 00:24:36.579 --> 00:24:39.920 and whether or not the detailed plan like this 00:24:39.920 --> 00:24:41.819 would need to go to a neighborhood meeting. 00:24:41.819 --> 00:24:43.680 I think that one we have to flesh out a little bit, 00:24:43.680 --> 00:24:44.599 but it's a good point. 00:24:44.599 --> 00:24:47.700 - Okay, I guess what bothers me is the fact 00:24:47.700 --> 00:24:49.680 that there's a 100-foot height on that. 00:24:49.680 --> 00:24:52.200 In other areas, it may not be a problem, 00:24:52.200 --> 00:24:54.839 but if somebody comes in in that other two acres there 00:24:54.839 --> 00:24:57.000 and wants to build something along that line, 00:24:57.000 --> 00:25:01.039 I can see torches burning now coming across there. 00:25:01.039 --> 00:25:03.599 So that just seemed odd to me. 00:25:03.599 --> 00:25:04.440 Thank you. 00:25:05.519 --> 00:25:06.559 - Commissioner Ellis. 00:25:06.559 --> 00:25:08.039 - Thank you, Chair. 00:25:08.039 --> 00:25:10.359 So back to the neighborhood meeting concept, 00:25:10.359 --> 00:25:11.640 I know we didn't have one. 00:25:11.640 --> 00:25:13.359 Was it suggested? 00:25:13.359 --> 00:25:15.799 - Yes, it was suggested the applicant declined 00:25:15.799 --> 00:25:17.259 to host that meeting. 00:25:17.259 --> 00:25:18.839 - Somehow, I'm not surprised. 00:25:18.839 --> 00:25:21.279 But just because I think a neighborhood meeting 00:25:21.279 --> 00:25:23.160 invites a lot more comment. 00:25:24.200 --> 00:25:28.119 I'm struggling with a couple of things here. 00:25:29.299 --> 00:25:31.880 Meeting all the criteria, which it must do, 00:25:34.039 --> 00:25:38.599 how did you come to determination that it satisfies, 00:25:38.599 --> 00:25:40.720 well, it was criteria B in the staff analysis, 00:25:40.720 --> 00:25:45.720 so that's the adversely affecting surrounding property? 00:25:47.359 --> 00:25:52.359 Because to me, you've got how many vacuums 00:25:53.380 --> 00:25:57.220 that are lined up behind an entire street 00:25:57.220 --> 00:25:58.880 of residential property. 00:25:58.880 --> 00:26:00.400 That's where the vacuums are. 00:26:00.400 --> 00:26:03.319 Not where there aren't residential property, 00:26:03.319 --> 00:26:07.599 but their entire line is the full line of single property. 00:26:07.599 --> 00:26:10.640 So to me, that adversely affects. 00:26:10.640 --> 00:26:12.940 That's my interpretation of adversely affecting. 00:26:12.940 --> 00:26:16.480 So I'm trying to come to staff's brain there 00:26:16.480 --> 00:26:19.039 where, 'cause you didn't mention noise 00:26:19.039 --> 00:26:20.000 or anything like that with vacuum, 00:26:20.000 --> 00:26:23.640 you mentioned light and what else did you mention? 00:26:23.640 --> 00:26:25.440 - The signage was the other criteria. 00:26:27.440 --> 00:26:30.440 We did, I had discussions with the applicant on this 00:26:30.440 --> 00:26:31.720 and the location of the vacuums. 00:26:31.720 --> 00:26:33.880 Their statement was that the, 00:26:33.880 --> 00:26:36.079 and I don't know the average noise level of their vacuums, 00:26:36.079 --> 00:26:39.599 but they stated it shouldn't be audible necessarily, 00:26:39.599 --> 00:26:42.839 especially with all of the buffering that's provided there. 00:26:42.839 --> 00:26:44.920 And we did feel that the existing tree line 00:26:44.920 --> 00:26:47.400 is fairly substantial in talking to our urban forester 00:26:47.400 --> 00:26:48.920 about the site. 00:26:48.920 --> 00:26:52.880 And then with the addition of the wall and the other trees, 00:26:52.880 --> 00:26:55.400 it seemed likely that it would provide 00:26:55.400 --> 00:26:57.359 adequate buffering there from the noise. 00:26:57.359 --> 00:27:00.200 But that would certainly be something within the parameters 00:27:00.200 --> 00:27:02.920 of an additional criteria on this, I would think. 00:27:03.920 --> 00:27:06.160 - Wait, are they gonna be there tonight? 00:27:06.160 --> 00:27:07.799 - Yes, my understanding is the applicant will be here. 00:27:07.799 --> 00:27:11.000 - Yeah, 'cause I don't know how high up the vacuums are. 00:27:11.000 --> 00:27:15.880 Number one, I don't know of any silent vacuums ever. 00:27:15.880 --> 00:27:17.680 But the wall's six feet. 00:27:18.680 --> 00:27:23.119 But the mechanism, I think, is gonna sit above that, 00:27:23.119 --> 00:27:25.480 where the tubes of the vacuum go in. 00:27:25.480 --> 00:27:27.079 - That's possible, I'm not sure what the structure 00:27:27.079 --> 00:27:30.839 of them would be, but many of them are oriented that way. 00:27:30.839 --> 00:27:33.440 And I did wanna correct to your question of building height 00:27:33.440 --> 00:27:33.440 . 00:27:33.440 --> 00:27:35.599 My brain was back on the previous case. 00:27:35.599 --> 00:27:37.799 The PD restricts it to three stories in height. 00:27:37.799 --> 00:27:41.359 No direct number, but a three story building height. 00:27:41.359 --> 00:27:42.200 - Good. 00:27:43.960 --> 00:27:44.799 Commissioner Bec. 00:27:44.799 --> 00:27:46.319 - Thank you, Chair. 00:27:46.319 --> 00:27:49.799 Picking back in on Commissioner Ellis's concerns there, 00:27:49.799 --> 00:27:51.779 is this a 24/7 operation? 00:27:52.720 --> 00:27:53.880 - That I'm not sure of. 00:27:53.880 --> 00:27:58.440 - Okay, 'cause I can see it being a nuisance factor 00:27:58.440 --> 00:28:01.200 later in the evening, sure, during the day, not so much. 00:28:02.779 --> 00:28:06.559 Now, they're gonna add a wall on the south end 00:28:06.559 --> 00:28:09.519 of their property right, which is six foot in height. 00:28:10.839 --> 00:28:13.279 - Yes, the wall would be located just on the north side 00:28:13.279 --> 00:28:14.480 of this tree line here. 00:28:14.480 --> 00:28:18.039 - Okay, to the west, isn't there an existing 00:28:18.039 --> 00:28:19.799 masonry wall there already? 00:28:19.799 --> 00:28:23.359 And so what is the height on that? 00:28:24.559 --> 00:28:25.519 Seems there is. 00:28:25.519 --> 00:28:27.599 - I'm not aware of any wall on their property. 00:28:27.599 --> 00:28:29.440 I know there is an existing fence line 00:28:29.440 --> 00:28:30.559 here on the south side. 00:28:30.559 --> 00:28:32.599 - Okay, there's not a masonry wall now. 00:28:32.599 --> 00:28:34.480 - I'm not aware of a wall on this side. 00:28:34.480 --> 00:28:35.480 - It's on 2499. 00:28:35.480 --> 00:28:37.279 - Right, that's what I'm talking about. 00:28:37.279 --> 00:28:40.000 Not on their property, but that shields 00:28:40.000 --> 00:28:42.200 that housing development sound 24/7. 00:28:42.200 --> 00:28:44.559 - Yes, there's a sound wall along that way. 00:28:44.559 --> 00:28:46.759 - Do we know how high that is, at eight foot? 00:28:49.160 --> 00:28:50.000 - Probably close to eight foot. 00:28:50.000 --> 00:28:51.480 - Just from driving by, I would say at least eight feet. 00:28:51.480 --> 00:28:52.720 I'm not sure of the height. 00:28:52.720 --> 00:28:54.880 - So that's better than a six foot wall 00:28:54.880 --> 00:28:58.880 that would address Commissioner Ellis's concern on noise, 00:28:58.880 --> 00:29:01.039 and mine too, really, to be honest. 00:29:01.039 --> 00:29:01.960 - Okay, thanks. 00:29:02.960 --> 00:29:06.480 - Haley, on the vacuum cleaner on most of these buildings 00:29:06.480 --> 00:29:09.359 that I've seen, aren't those units in the building itself 00:29:09.359 --> 00:29:11.039 when they just have tubes that come out 00:29:11.039 --> 00:29:14.359 and the vacuum actually runs, and when you pull it out, 00:29:14.359 --> 00:29:16.119 it's already running? 00:29:16.119 --> 00:29:17.720 - That I'm not sure of. 00:29:17.720 --> 00:29:20.039 I know, when I mentioned the sound to the applicant, 00:29:20.039 --> 00:29:22.759 he just said that their vacuums are generally very quiet. 00:29:22.759 --> 00:29:25.680 He didn't think it would be an issue for offsite. 00:29:25.680 --> 00:29:27.079 But I'm sure he could speak more directly 00:29:27.079 --> 00:29:30.200 to how those operate and where the actual vacuum itself 00:29:30.200 --> 00:29:31.079 is located. 00:29:31.079 --> 00:29:34.000 - Well, I've been to their location that they have on, 00:29:34.000 --> 00:29:37.720 I guess it's 2181, over there next to O'Reilly's, 00:29:37.720 --> 00:29:40.519 and the vacuum runs essentially all the time, 00:29:40.519 --> 00:29:44.319 and you pull the little wand out, it's already going. 00:29:45.599 --> 00:29:49.839 So it'd be interesting to hear if it's individual, 00:29:49.839 --> 00:29:52.660 kind of old style vacuum stations that you turn on 00:29:52.660 --> 00:29:54.640 right there at the car, or if it's actually the equipment's 00:29:54.640 --> 00:29:56.880 in the building and it's just the wand, 00:29:56.880 --> 00:29:59.480 just kind of like your regular extension 00:29:59.480 --> 00:30:02.000 of a regular household vacuum cleaner, top deal. 00:30:02.000 --> 00:30:05.519 But you might just point for us to clarify 00:30:05.519 --> 00:30:07.519 when we get in there with the applicant. 00:30:09.359 --> 00:30:10.319 - Commissioner Ellis. 00:30:10.319 --> 00:30:11.640 - Thank you, Chair. 00:30:11.640 --> 00:30:13.859 Haley, do we know anything about, right now, 00:30:13.859 --> 00:30:17.599 where Longleaf and High Point have that curb, 00:30:17.599 --> 00:30:21.240 there isn't a cutout to 2499. 00:30:21.240 --> 00:30:22.920 It looks like it could possibly, 00:30:22.920 --> 00:30:27.079 I mean, the wall is there now, but do we have any knowledge 00:30:27.079 --> 00:30:28.819 of if that's gonna open up? 00:30:30.480 --> 00:30:34.519 - Oh, we're referring to this kind of vacant lot here. 00:30:34.519 --> 00:30:38.440 - I mean, it looks like it's crying for an out to 2499. 00:30:39.920 --> 00:30:42.359 - I don't know of any plans. 00:30:42.359 --> 00:30:45.319 One of the responses, or a joining property owner 00:30:45.319 --> 00:30:47.319 had asked about this same thing here at Countess, 00:30:47.319 --> 00:30:48.680 and when I inquired with engineering, 00:30:48.680 --> 00:30:50.960 they said they weren't aware of any other plans 00:30:50.960 --> 00:30:52.940 punched through to 2499. 00:30:54.440 --> 00:30:59.440 But I know this little gravel road has been there, 00:30:59.519 --> 00:31:01.759 pretty far back, when you look at the aerial. 00:31:01.759 --> 00:31:03.920 So I'm not sure what that originally 00:31:03.920 --> 00:31:05.160 was intended to connect to, 00:31:05.160 --> 00:31:07.559 but I don't know of any plans for a street extension. 00:31:07.559 --> 00:31:08.400 - Okay. 00:31:11.039 --> 00:31:13.240 - I'll call on Jerry Drake, legal. 00:31:13.240 --> 00:31:14.079 - Thank you. 00:31:14.900 --> 00:31:16.680 To the staff, I'm just wondering, 00:31:16.680 --> 00:31:19.920 the residential component of PD 176, 00:31:19.920 --> 00:31:23.160 is that still considered under the PD? 00:31:23.160 --> 00:31:27.319 And if so, with the proposed rezoning 00:31:27.319 --> 00:31:30.759 and the assignment of new zoning classifications, 00:31:30.759 --> 00:31:34.359 is it proposed to remain as a PD, 00:31:34.359 --> 00:31:39.359 or to be assigned a close residential classification? 00:31:40.200 --> 00:31:44.279 - I believe we're maintaining all existing PDs as PDs 00:31:44.279 --> 00:31:45.480 under the proposed zoning. 00:31:45.480 --> 00:31:47.200 - Well, and the reason why I ask, 00:31:47.200 --> 00:31:51.079 and this could possibly provide some more insight, 00:31:51.079 --> 00:31:55.079 is I know that in the 2002 citywide rezoning, 00:31:56.319 --> 00:32:00.519 most of the PDs, if they were completely approved, 00:32:00.519 --> 00:32:05.400 were rezoned, in my neighborhood, for example, 00:32:05.400 --> 00:32:07.640 was originally a PD, and was rezoned 00:32:07.640 --> 00:32:11.440 to a standard single family rezoning. 00:32:11.440 --> 00:32:14.000 The idea being to get rid of PDs 00:32:14.000 --> 00:32:16.839 to the extent that we could in 2002, 00:32:16.839 --> 00:32:20.039 they're being distrusted them on both sides. 00:32:20.039 --> 00:32:24.119 And they were continued in the code as special exceptions. 00:32:24.119 --> 00:32:29.119 And I guess the question kind of remains in my mind 00:32:29.880 --> 00:32:33.559 is whether it might be an option 00:32:33.559 --> 00:32:38.559 to even put in some kind of a standard zoning 00:32:39.640 --> 00:32:43.599 rather than a PD, either under the existing 00:32:43.599 --> 00:32:48.599 or future proposed zoning designations. 00:32:49.960 --> 00:32:54.960 And I think that if it were proposed 00:32:55.240 --> 00:32:59.000 to rezone all of the existing residences 00:32:59.000 --> 00:33:01.200 to a standard residential zoning, 00:33:01.200 --> 00:33:02.960 as they did back in 2002, 00:33:03.880 --> 00:33:08.680 that might be one possible way of handling it as well. 00:33:08.680 --> 00:33:11.079 - Yeah, I think the current plan is all the PDs 00:33:11.079 --> 00:33:12.359 and overlays that we currently have 00:33:12.359 --> 00:33:17.000 would be rezoned as PD with the citywide rezoning. 00:33:17.000 --> 00:33:19.680 And just speak to this particular property here, 00:33:19.680 --> 00:33:21.960 that was one of the options that the applicant considered 00:33:21.960 --> 00:33:25.680 was zoning out of the PD to a straight zoning. 00:33:25.680 --> 00:33:28.480 We recently had NRMU approved across the street here 00:33:28.480 --> 00:33:30.640 with some overlay restrictions, 00:33:30.640 --> 00:33:32.079 but they thought that they could operate 00:33:32.079 --> 00:33:34.200 within the parameters that the PD had outlined 00:33:34.200 --> 00:33:35.359 for commercial development. 00:33:35.359 --> 00:33:37.599 So chose to stay with that option. 00:33:48.000 --> 00:33:51.759 - I guess just a follow-up question from your presentation. 00:33:51.759 --> 00:33:55.279 Essentially, they by right can put that in, 00:33:55.279 --> 00:33:58.680 as is their only requirement is that they must comply 00:33:58.680 --> 00:34:02.319 with the development code as far as the lighting 00:34:02.319 --> 00:34:04.119 and the signage. 00:34:05.119 --> 00:34:07.920 - Yeah, the two criteria that we would recommend. 00:34:07.920 --> 00:34:10.039 And then like I mentioned to Commissioner Ellis, 00:34:10.039 --> 00:34:11.599 if there's anything else that you'll feel 00:34:11.599 --> 00:34:14.480 would help prevent nuisances at this location, 00:34:14.480 --> 00:34:17.739 I think that would be within your authority 00:34:17.739 --> 00:34:19.039 to assign other conditions 00:34:19.039 --> 00:34:20.880 that you thought might be appropriate. 00:34:20.880 --> 00:34:22.679 But these two have been discussed with the applicant 00:34:22.679 --> 00:34:25.239 and they're generally in agreement 00:34:25.239 --> 00:34:26.920 with conforming with current light 00:34:26.920 --> 00:34:29.239 and sign standards at the property. 00:34:29.239 --> 00:34:30.960 - So I would, it's not the same, 00:34:30.960 --> 00:34:34.059 but it's similar to almost like platting per se. 00:34:35.320 --> 00:34:36.340 By right they can do it, 00:34:36.340 --> 00:34:39.079 and as long as they meet the criteria that's in place, 00:34:41.239 --> 00:34:42.840 that's kind of where we are on this. 00:34:42.840 --> 00:34:43.920 - That's sort of helping you get it. 00:34:43.920 --> 00:34:45.119 - Yeah. - Okay. 00:34:45.119 --> 00:34:48.559 - Well, they're certainly entitled to a commercial use. 00:34:48.559 --> 00:34:52.480 There was nothing in the concept plan 00:34:52.480 --> 00:34:56.679 that entitled a car wash per se, 00:34:56.679 --> 00:35:00.400 or the details beyond that. 00:35:01.320 --> 00:35:06.320 PDs, at least as the city has applied them historically, 00:35:07.440 --> 00:35:11.800 have been a multi-step zoning process 00:35:11.800 --> 00:35:16.480 with the first step being the approval of a concept plan. 00:35:16.480 --> 00:35:18.800 And then as a detailed plan comes forward, 00:35:18.800 --> 00:35:22.679 as long as it's consistent with the concept plan, 00:35:22.679 --> 00:35:24.519 it should be approvable. 00:35:24.519 --> 00:35:29.519 But again, the whole idea of a detailed plan 00:35:29.519 --> 00:35:32.480 is to provide the details necessary 00:35:32.480 --> 00:35:35.119 to show that it would satisfy the purposes 00:35:35.119 --> 00:35:38.199 of the concept plan as originally approved. 00:35:39.320 --> 00:35:41.760 - All right, well, just to follow up and clarify, 00:35:41.760 --> 00:35:44.559 I think you stated in your presentation 00:35:44.559 --> 00:35:47.920 that car washes were permitted as part of the PD. 00:35:47.920 --> 00:35:52.760 So whether it was in the, 00:35:52.760 --> 00:35:54.719 I mean, that was included in the concept plans. 00:35:54.719 --> 00:35:56.920 Now we're at the detailed plan, 00:35:56.920 --> 00:35:59.159 and that's my question, and really where we are, 00:35:59.159 --> 00:36:02.559 is as long as they meet the requirements 00:36:02.559 --> 00:36:04.360 that we have in the code, 00:36:04.360 --> 00:36:06.159 as far as how they build their site, 00:36:06.159 --> 00:36:08.039 with their buffering, with their lighting, 00:36:08.039 --> 00:36:11.000 with their signage, they by right can go build that 00:36:11.000 --> 00:36:12.960 where they have asked to build it 00:36:12.960 --> 00:36:17.519 because it was an approved use 00:36:17.519 --> 00:36:20.519 or an approved commercial purpose 00:36:23.559 --> 00:36:25.199 as a car wash in that area. 00:36:26.320 --> 00:36:29.119 And now they're actually trying to now put it in detail 00:36:29.119 --> 00:36:30.519 and meet the code. 00:36:30.519 --> 00:36:34.159 So that's where I'm trying to go is what sort of leeway 00:36:34.159 --> 00:36:38.159 do we have to say we like it, don't like it, 00:36:38.159 --> 00:36:40.920 we'll change it, do something different 00:36:40.920 --> 00:36:45.920 of what has been essentially vested since the '90s. 00:36:47.079 --> 00:36:49.840 - Yeah, in that sense, the use is one of the listed 00:36:49.840 --> 00:36:52.679 permitted uses for commercial development. 00:36:52.679 --> 00:36:54.719 With respect to the remainder of the site, 00:36:54.719 --> 00:36:57.559 I think, Jerry, you can certainly correct me 00:36:57.559 --> 00:36:58.760 if I'm speaking out of turn here, 00:36:58.760 --> 00:37:01.119 but I would just imagine anything that you feel 00:37:01.119 --> 00:37:05.079 is necessary to satisfy those criteria for approval 00:37:05.079 --> 00:37:07.800 and that it is compatible with the surrounding properties 00:37:07.800 --> 00:37:10.039 and not causing nuisances, it would be similar 00:37:10.039 --> 00:37:12.960 to how an SUP you can provide for criteria 00:37:12.960 --> 00:37:14.280 on things like lighting and noise 00:37:14.280 --> 00:37:15.800 that would make it more compatible 00:37:15.800 --> 00:37:17.079 with the surrounding neighborhood. 00:37:17.079 --> 00:37:20.159 - Well, and again, I'm not sure, 00:37:20.159 --> 00:37:25.159 going back to the section that I was referring to earlier 00:37:25.480 --> 00:37:30.480 in sub-chapter one of the 35.15, 00:37:31.719 --> 00:37:34.360 I'm not sure that it's quite as constraining 00:37:34.360 --> 00:37:39.360 as was pointed out because what the code did 00:37:39.760 --> 00:37:43.800 in the citywide rezoning was to approve 00:37:43.800 --> 00:37:47.119 the existing PDs as special exceptions. 00:37:47.119 --> 00:37:49.679 The point of the special exception was to ensure 00:37:49.679 --> 00:37:54.679 that any current legal use that was legal 00:37:54.920 --> 00:37:59.920 prior to the adoption of the 2002 DDC 00:38:00.039 --> 00:38:04.719 would be allowed to continue after adoption of the 2002 DDC 00:38:04.719 --> 00:38:05.039 . 00:38:06.000 --> 00:38:11.000 It did not, it was not stated as preserving 00:38:11.480 --> 00:38:16.480 expectations associated prior to the adoption 00:38:18.599 --> 00:38:21.119 of the 2002 DDC. 00:38:21.119 --> 00:38:26.119 It was stated as allowing the existing uses 00:38:26.960 --> 00:38:30.559 to continue as legal uses. 00:38:30.559 --> 00:38:34.400 There was nothing stated about what might be done 00:38:34.400 --> 00:38:37.719 as far as any kind of expected future uses 00:38:37.719 --> 00:38:41.599 from an approved concept plan that didn't carry forward. 00:38:41.599 --> 00:38:46.599 I think it almost seems kind of implicit in here 00:38:47.360 --> 00:38:49.239 that there might have been an expectation 00:38:49.239 --> 00:38:54.239 that there would be rezoning to standard zoning 00:38:54.360 --> 00:38:57.760 classifications at some point if they did not continue 00:38:57.760 --> 00:39:00.079 as PDs as originally intended. 00:39:03.599 --> 00:39:04.440 Does that make sense? 00:39:04.440 --> 00:39:05.260 I'm sorry. 00:39:05.260 --> 00:39:06.559 - It does, I was trying to think through all of it. 00:39:06.559 --> 00:39:07.760 - Yeah. 00:39:07.760 --> 00:39:10.239 - 'Cause I guess our thought process was with this, 00:39:10.239 --> 00:39:12.039 conforming with that concept plan, 00:39:12.039 --> 00:39:15.039 it is continuing as the PD was originally proposed 00:39:15.039 --> 00:39:15.880 and intended. 00:39:17.440 --> 00:39:21.159 - Okay, any other questions on this item? 00:39:21.159 --> 00:39:22.000 Commissioner Ellis. 00:39:22.000 --> 00:39:22.820 - Thank you, Chair. 00:39:22.820 --> 00:39:24.559 I wanted to go back to I guess some of your comments 00:39:24.559 --> 00:39:26.599 and how I'm struggling here. 00:39:26.599 --> 00:39:30.420 So I understand what you're saying that it's a allowed use, 00:39:31.679 --> 00:39:33.639 but what it says in here is that the detailed plan 00:39:33.639 --> 00:39:36.159 shall be approved if all of the criteria are met. 00:39:36.159 --> 00:39:38.800 And the problem is I think the criteria depends 00:39:38.800 --> 00:39:40.360 on how you interpret it. 00:39:40.360 --> 00:39:42.300 And that criteria that says the plan provides 00:39:42.300 --> 00:39:44.880 for a compatible arrangement of buildings and land uses 00:39:44.880 --> 00:39:47.119 that would not adversely affect adjoining neighborhoods 00:39:47.119 --> 00:39:50.239 or properties outside of the plan is where 00:39:50.239 --> 00:39:55.239 that interpretation can be varying. 00:39:56.920 --> 00:39:59.360 So I don't look at it like just a Plaid approval. 00:39:59.360 --> 00:40:01.920 I mean, I guess that's what I wanted to say. 00:40:01.920 --> 00:40:04.840 That I'm struggling with, 00:40:06.320 --> 00:40:09.420 does this development not adversely affect the properties 00:40:09.420 --> 00:40:10.920 that are around it? 00:40:10.920 --> 00:40:13.320 - Okay, well let me clarify my comment. 00:40:14.199 --> 00:40:18.800 The point I was trying to make in summarizing my thoughts 00:40:18.800 --> 00:40:23.480 about what's been presented is that all the requirements 00:40:23.480 --> 00:40:26.960 that we have as far as site requirements, 00:40:26.960 --> 00:40:31.699 as far as buffering, the photometric study, 00:40:33.280 --> 00:40:35.239 the signage on the building, 00:40:35.239 --> 00:40:38.820 all of those development requirements have to be met 00:40:38.820 --> 00:40:41.960 with the site and they are being met with the site. 00:40:41.960 --> 00:40:46.539 So they aren't just, to try to clarify, 00:40:46.539 --> 00:40:48.159 they aren't just building it and saying 00:40:48.159 --> 00:40:50.599 we don't have to meet those things because we're vested. 00:40:50.599 --> 00:40:53.599 They're saying the use was vested from the '90s. 00:40:53.599 --> 00:40:56.760 We're putting in what was approved to go here on this area 00:40:56.760 --> 00:40:58.800 and we are now meeting what the current 00:40:58.800 --> 00:41:02.199 Denton Development Code requires for a commercial building 00:41:02.199 --> 00:41:05.619 to be built on that site as far as setbacks, 00:41:05.619 --> 00:41:10.400 buffering, screening, lighting, signage, 00:41:10.400 --> 00:41:13.320 all of the requirements that we have that if 00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:15.719 this wasn't even a PD, it was already zoned 00:41:15.719 --> 00:41:19.400 and it was a site plan, if they met the site plan, 00:41:19.400 --> 00:41:22.559 just like in the other project that we just talked about 00:41:22.559 --> 00:41:25.519 as far as the parking lot and the screening, 00:41:25.519 --> 00:41:27.760 they've met all of our requirements. 00:41:27.760 --> 00:41:30.679 And that was the point that I was trying to make 00:41:30.679 --> 00:41:34.440 from the standpoint of platting that when it comes before 00:41:34.440 --> 00:41:34.760 us, 00:41:34.760 --> 00:41:37.480 they meet all of our requirements and it conforms 00:41:37.480 --> 00:41:39.719 to what is required for it to be platted. 00:41:39.719 --> 00:41:42.760 We essentially, I hate to say the word, 00:41:42.760 --> 00:41:45.960 have to approve it because they've met all the requirements 00:41:45.960 --> 00:41:45.960 . 00:41:45.960 --> 00:41:49.519 I was just liking that it's a similar type of process 00:41:49.519 --> 00:41:51.659 is that they are meeting all the requirements 00:41:51.659 --> 00:41:53.760 that we currently have in our DDC 00:41:54.840 --> 00:41:58.280 in the detail plan to build the site. 00:41:58.280 --> 00:42:01.280 And so that was the only thing that I was speaking to 00:42:01.280 --> 00:42:04.039 is to how much room do we have when they meet 00:42:04.039 --> 00:42:07.440 the requirements that we have in the DDC to say, 00:42:07.440 --> 00:42:10.480 I don't like it, I don't want it next to neighborhood, 00:42:10.480 --> 00:42:12.920 I wish they would do this or that 00:42:12.920 --> 00:42:15.039 when they're actually being in compliance 00:42:15.039 --> 00:42:16.000 with the development code. 00:42:16.000 --> 00:42:18.239 And that was the only point that I was making 00:42:18.239 --> 00:42:21.780 and asking the question of how much leeway do we have 00:42:21.780 --> 00:42:25.340 to ask them to do additional things, locate vacuum, 00:42:25.340 --> 00:42:28.199 whatever the question is when they're in compliance 00:42:28.199 --> 00:42:29.480 with the DDC. 00:42:29.480 --> 00:42:32.119 It was more of a clarification and statement 00:42:32.119 --> 00:42:34.639 of what can we do if we're gonna start talking 00:42:34.639 --> 00:42:36.619 about additional conditions 00:42:36.619 --> 00:42:38.800 if they're meeting the development code. 00:42:38.800 --> 00:42:40.199 Commissioner Ellis. 00:42:40.199 --> 00:42:41.119 - Thank you, Chair. 00:42:41.119 --> 00:42:43.880 Okay, then it may be I'm not interpreting this correctly, 00:42:43.880 --> 00:42:46.239 then I don't feel like this is trying 00:42:46.239 --> 00:42:47.360 to meet the development code, 00:42:47.360 --> 00:42:51.159 I feel like this is trying to meet the PD requirements 00:42:51.159 --> 00:42:53.599 that these are allowed uses, 00:42:53.599 --> 00:42:56.119 now do we want this as part of the PD? 00:42:56.119 --> 00:42:59.840 That's how I'm, that is how I read 00:42:59.840 --> 00:43:01.639 the way this analysis was done. 00:43:01.639 --> 00:43:05.440 So if that's my lack of interpretation, 00:43:05.440 --> 00:43:07.920 then I guess I would love clarity on that. 00:43:09.840 --> 00:43:11.639 - Mr. Richard, you look like you wanna say something 00:43:11.639 --> 00:43:13.079 or you wanna take time then. 00:43:13.079 --> 00:43:14.280 (laughing) 00:43:14.280 --> 00:43:15.119 Or were you just thinking-- 00:43:15.119 --> 00:43:16.920 - I seem like I always answer it, kind of both. 00:43:16.920 --> 00:43:19.159 (laughing) 00:43:20.260 --> 00:43:24.960 I think part of the issue is while the PD 00:43:24.960 --> 00:43:27.800 does describe certain requirements, 00:43:27.800 --> 00:43:31.800 i.e. height is three stories, it is silent on others. 00:43:31.800 --> 00:43:36.219 And so with those, we defer to the DDC, 00:43:36.219 --> 00:43:37.099 if that makes any sense, 00:43:37.099 --> 00:43:38.960 because there really were no standards 00:43:38.960 --> 00:43:41.599 to go off of within that PD, 00:43:41.599 --> 00:43:44.400 unless it's explicit and it says it shall defer to 00:43:45.320 --> 00:43:47.079 the current regulations. 00:43:47.079 --> 00:43:49.599 But then it goes back to what were the current regulations, 00:43:49.599 --> 00:43:51.679 what was it zoned prior to the PD, 00:43:51.679 --> 00:43:53.760 and then it gets into a whole mess 00:43:53.760 --> 00:43:56.360 and a whole slew of other issues. 00:43:56.360 --> 00:43:57.800 - Yeah, like landscaping, for example, 00:43:57.800 --> 00:44:00.880 the PD explicitly says it shall follow the landscaping code 00:44:00.880 --> 00:44:03.719 in effect at the time of the adoption of the PD, 00:44:03.719 --> 00:44:06.920 which then we deferred back to the 1998 landscape code 00:44:06.920 --> 00:44:08.920 rather than the current code. 00:44:08.920 --> 00:44:10.360 And then things like the masonry wall 00:44:10.360 --> 00:44:11.960 were specifically called for in the PD, 00:44:11.960 --> 00:44:14.719 but lighting, it just had one general clause 00:44:14.719 --> 00:44:17.500 saying it shouldn't shine onto other properties. 00:44:17.500 --> 00:44:21.760 So we felt it was appropriate to specifically say 00:44:21.760 --> 00:44:24.059 that we think it appropriate for them 00:44:24.059 --> 00:44:26.320 to follow the current lighting standards, 00:44:26.320 --> 00:44:28.440 as opposed to just that general statement in the PD. 00:44:28.440 --> 00:44:30.000 And then signage wasn't addressed at all, 00:44:30.000 --> 00:44:33.639 so that's where we drew from the current code of ordinances 00:44:33.639 --> 00:44:36.280 to provide some guidelines for them to operate within. 00:44:38.039 --> 00:44:39.039 - Commissioner Reynolds? 00:44:46.280 --> 00:44:50.360 Any other questions on this item? 00:44:53.280 --> 00:44:55.960 Okay, thank you, Hayden. 00:44:55.960 --> 00:44:59.559 That will move us to our item C in public hearings. 00:44:59.559 --> 00:45:00.460 Cindy Jackson. 00:45:08.039 --> 00:45:11.619 (council member laughing) 00:45:24.519 --> 00:45:26.280 - Thank you, Chair, commissioners. 00:45:29.360 --> 00:45:34.360 This is a request to rezone a one acre site. 00:45:35.159 --> 00:45:36.340 It's not actually rezoned, 00:45:36.340 --> 00:45:39.119 it's to assign an initial zoning designation 00:45:39.119 --> 00:45:43.039 to an area, a one acre land use site of land 00:45:43.039 --> 00:45:47.480 that was actually annexed in 2010. 00:45:47.480 --> 00:45:48.719 This site, as you can see, 00:45:48.719 --> 00:45:51.159 is located on the north side of Miller Road, 00:45:52.079 --> 00:45:53.800 east of Marsh Branch. 00:45:55.519 --> 00:45:57.800 The current zoning is RD5X, 00:45:57.800 --> 00:46:00.199 which is the holding zoning giving two properties 00:46:00.199 --> 00:46:03.119 when they are initially annexed into the city. 00:46:03.119 --> 00:46:07.150 And the proposed initial zoning is NR2, which you can see 00:46:07.150 --> 00:46:07.579 here. 00:46:11.659 --> 00:46:14.900 The site is actually a designated business innovation 00:46:14.900 --> 00:46:16.679 on the future land use map. 00:46:16.679 --> 00:46:19.079 The intent of the business innovation district 00:46:19.079 --> 00:46:23.659 is to create large tracts of lands that are appropriate 00:46:23.659 --> 00:46:27.519 for well-planned, larger scale office and employment parks, 00:46:27.519 --> 00:46:31.000 our research and development type uses, 00:46:31.000 --> 00:46:33.000 developed in a campus-like setting, 00:46:33.000 --> 00:46:35.679 with accessory type uses, 00:46:35.679 --> 00:46:40.320 which would support the businesses such as hotels, 00:46:40.320 --> 00:46:41.920 retail, and restaurants. 00:46:42.920 --> 00:46:46.440 The types and uses of scale and development permitted 00:46:46.440 --> 00:46:47.679 in the NR2 district, 00:46:47.679 --> 00:46:50.500 which are primarily large lot residential, 00:46:50.500 --> 00:46:52.320 do not conform to the goals 00:46:52.320 --> 00:46:55.460 of the business innovation designation. 00:46:58.639 --> 00:47:02.119 The NR2 district permits large lot residential uses 00:47:02.119 --> 00:47:05.360 and is inconsistent with the future land use element. 00:47:05.360 --> 00:47:08.440 The RD5 district is designated to the property 00:47:08.440 --> 00:47:11.159 after annexation and is also inconsistent 00:47:11.159 --> 00:47:13.599 with the future land use element. 00:47:13.599 --> 00:47:16.880 The site is part of a large lot single family neighborhood. 00:47:16.880 --> 00:47:19.639 This was established in the late 70s. 00:47:22.679 --> 00:47:24.840 The site was actually, 00:47:24.840 --> 00:47:28.880 the subdivision was created by Meats and Bounds 00:47:28.880 --> 00:47:32.480 from another plat, 00:47:36.360 --> 00:47:39.800 I'm sorry, I just missed my place here, 00:47:39.800 --> 00:47:40.960 from another plat, 00:47:42.599 --> 00:47:46.579 the Brook side addition, Little Brook Estates. 00:47:48.119 --> 00:47:51.719 It was subdivided by Meats and Bounds prior to annexation 00:47:51.719 --> 00:47:55.199 in 1977 into 16 one acre lots. 00:47:55.199 --> 00:47:57.880 Miller Road is actually an easement. 00:47:57.880 --> 00:48:01.880 It is now considered prescribed right of way. 00:48:01.880 --> 00:48:03.739 So when this site is plotted, 00:48:03.739 --> 00:48:06.599 they will have to dedicate their portion of Miller Road. 00:48:10.159 --> 00:48:13.559 The proposed NR2 zoning district is consistent 00:48:13.559 --> 00:48:16.159 with the proposed and surrounding land uses. 00:48:16.159 --> 00:48:18.039 The applicant is proposing a large lot, 00:48:18.039 --> 00:48:19.920 one acre single family house. 00:48:19.920 --> 00:48:23.119 This site is surrounded on Miller Road 00:48:23.119 --> 00:48:26.900 with one acre large lot single family uses. 00:48:28.880 --> 00:48:33.199 As well seeing, here you can see Miller Road, 00:48:33.199 --> 00:48:36.119 and here you can see there are additional single family, 00:48:36.119 --> 00:48:38.500 large lot single family here. 00:48:38.500 --> 00:48:42.980 The site also has gas wells in proximity 00:48:42.980 --> 00:48:44.400 to the north and south. 00:48:44.400 --> 00:48:48.440 However, the site is between six and 800 feet away 00:48:48.440 --> 00:48:50.840 from those gas wells and meets the required 00:48:51.880 --> 00:48:54.000 reverse setback for gas wells. 00:48:55.360 --> 00:48:57.559 The use is permitted in the NR2 district. 00:48:57.559 --> 00:49:01.260 Are consistent with what is on the ground today. 00:49:05.159 --> 00:49:06.440 As well as, 00:49:08.980 --> 00:49:12.719 the site will take access from North Mosh Branch. 00:49:12.719 --> 00:49:15.380 Mosh Branch right here is considered to be 00:49:15.380 --> 00:49:18.179 a collector street north of Miller Road 00:49:18.179 --> 00:49:23.179 and changes into a primary arterial south on the, 00:49:23.320 --> 00:49:25.940 excuse me, north of Miller Road and south of Miller Road. 00:49:25.940 --> 00:49:27.320 It is a collector, I'm sorry. 00:49:27.320 --> 00:49:32.320 I just, and Miller Road itself on the east side 00:49:33.159 --> 00:49:36.360 is a local street and on the west side of Mosh Branch 00:49:36.360 --> 00:49:38.000 is a collector. 00:49:38.000 --> 00:49:40.639 Water and sewer is available on the site, 00:49:40.639 --> 00:49:42.159 excuse me, water is available on the site 00:49:42.159 --> 00:49:43.480 as you can see here. 00:49:43.480 --> 00:49:47.019 All of these properties were developed with septic systems 00:49:47.019 --> 00:49:50.039 and this will also be developed with the septic system. 00:49:50.039 --> 00:49:53.920 That's the one acre size for the site 00:49:53.920 --> 00:49:55.400 as required for septic. 00:49:57.480 --> 00:49:59.920 Notifications were sent out on July 6th. 00:49:59.920 --> 00:50:03.320 We sent out 10 notifications via certified mail 00:50:03.320 --> 00:50:06.519 within 200 feet and 15 notifications 00:50:06.519 --> 00:50:08.199 within 500 feet of the site 00:50:08.199 --> 00:50:10.679 and we have received no responses. 00:50:10.679 --> 00:50:13.719 If you recall, this site was, 00:50:13.719 --> 00:50:17.760 this request was first scheduled in May 00:50:17.760 --> 00:50:20.440 to be heard by the Planning and Zoning Commission 00:50:20.440 --> 00:50:22.360 and the applicant requested withdrawal 00:50:22.360 --> 00:50:25.519 to reconsider whether or not they wanted to follow through. 00:50:25.519 --> 00:50:28.079 At that time we had somebody show up 00:50:28.079 --> 00:50:30.880 who was in opposition to the site. 00:50:30.880 --> 00:50:33.000 She did not send in a notice however. 00:50:33.000 --> 00:50:35.039 I did call and talk to this person 00:50:35.039 --> 00:50:38.039 and she's now in favor of the request. 00:50:38.039 --> 00:50:40.639 She thought that they were rezoning for multifamily. 00:50:45.599 --> 00:50:47.719 Staff recommends approval of this request 00:50:47.719 --> 00:50:52.500 as the NR2 is consistent with the criteria for approval 00:50:52.500 --> 00:50:55.159 in section 3533B3, 00:50:55.159 --> 00:50:57.440 which is the criteria for when the site 00:50:57.440 --> 00:51:01.000 is not consistent with the future land use designation 00:51:01.000 --> 00:51:04.320 and the NR2 is compatible with the surrounding property 00:51:04.320 --> 00:51:06.400 in terms of existing and permitted uses 00:51:06.400 --> 00:51:07.679 and meets the requirement 00:51:07.679 --> 00:51:09.840 for maintaining the character of the area. 00:51:10.760 --> 00:51:12.360 That concludes my presentation. 00:51:13.519 --> 00:51:14.719 - Commissioner Sanchez. 00:51:16.239 --> 00:51:19.659 - Originally there was 16 lots developed 00:51:19.659 --> 00:51:23.679 but we're only talking about the one lot. 00:51:23.679 --> 00:51:24.519 - Exactly. 00:51:24.519 --> 00:51:28.159 - So why would, I mean, what does that buy him? 00:51:28.159 --> 00:51:29.480 The rest of them already put in, 00:51:29.480 --> 00:51:31.039 I'm just trying to figure out, 00:51:31.039 --> 00:51:36.039 why would you want just to rezone one lot out of the 16 00:51:36.119 --> 00:51:40.760 when the other 16 have the designation RD5X? 00:51:40.760 --> 00:51:43.119 - Because the others were actually developed 00:51:43.119 --> 00:51:45.960 prior to being annexed into the city. 00:51:45.960 --> 00:51:47.639 When this was annexed into the city, 00:51:47.639 --> 00:51:51.840 it took on the requirement for the zoning designation 00:51:51.840 --> 00:51:53.719 of RD5X as a holding zoning. 00:51:53.719 --> 00:51:55.039 The whole area. 00:51:55.039 --> 00:51:59.219 However, if you want to develop on the site, 00:51:59.219 --> 00:52:02.519 you need to give it an initial zoning designation 00:52:02.519 --> 00:52:06.199 because the RD5X is a holding zoning. 00:52:06.199 --> 00:52:07.840 Technically the site has no zoning. 00:52:07.840 --> 00:52:09.440 It's just a holding zoning. 00:52:09.440 --> 00:52:10.400 - Right, right. 00:52:10.400 --> 00:52:12.360 But I guess what I'm thinking is, 00:52:12.360 --> 00:52:15.400 okay, the other people developed under the 5X. 00:52:15.400 --> 00:52:16.599 - No, actually they developed. 00:52:16.599 --> 00:52:18.320 - They just put in houses, 'cause there's houses. 00:52:18.320 --> 00:52:21.000 - It was developed before it was annexed into the city. 00:52:21.000 --> 00:52:22.719 There was no zoning. 00:52:22.719 --> 00:52:24.840 So they were already there since the 70s, 00:52:24.840 --> 00:52:27.000 some of them since the late 70s. 00:52:27.000 --> 00:52:30.159 The site developed from the late 70s through today. 00:52:30.159 --> 00:52:34.090 And just lot by lot they developed when it was in the 00:52:34.090 --> 00:52:34.719 county. 00:52:34.719 --> 00:52:36.559 - So what's their designation right now, 00:52:36.559 --> 00:52:37.760 the rest of the lots? 00:52:37.760 --> 00:52:38.880 - RD5X. 00:52:38.880 --> 00:52:43.880 - Okay, so I guess I'm still going back to, 00:52:44.559 --> 00:52:49.559 if you're gonna do it, develop the whole 16 lots 00:52:50.800 --> 00:52:53.840 rather than just one lot, that's gonna be like an oddball 00:52:53.840 --> 00:52:55.639 for the rest of them unless the rest of them come out. 00:52:55.639 --> 00:52:58.920 - Well, not really because the other lots are developed. 00:52:58.920 --> 00:53:00.880 - Right, right, right. 00:53:00.880 --> 00:53:04.840 - So they don't need to come in and rezone 00:53:04.840 --> 00:53:06.840 because they're already developed. 00:53:06.840 --> 00:53:08.920 This is a site that will be included 00:53:08.920 --> 00:53:11.079 in the city-wide rezoning. 00:53:11.079 --> 00:53:13.000 And they will ultimately all have 00:53:13.000 --> 00:53:14.559 the same zoning designation. 00:53:15.480 --> 00:53:16.840 - Okay, okay. 00:53:19.119 --> 00:53:20.119 - Commissioner Beck. 00:53:21.000 --> 00:53:21.840 - Thank you, Chair. 00:53:21.840 --> 00:53:24.119 Thanks, Cindy, for your presentation. 00:53:24.119 --> 00:53:28.679 Where is this, where's US 380 related? 00:53:28.679 --> 00:53:30.719 North or south of this? 00:53:30.719 --> 00:53:32.480 - University is to the south. 00:53:32.480 --> 00:53:33.840 - How far away? 00:53:33.840 --> 00:53:36.119 Half a mile, quarter mile? 00:53:36.119 --> 00:53:39.480 - Well, I can see if I can pull up the map. 00:53:39.480 --> 00:53:41.199 - 'Cause I'm kind of curious why we got, 00:53:41.199 --> 00:53:44.599 if it's pretty good distance from 380, 00:53:44.599 --> 00:53:45.920 we're talking about a better half mile. 00:53:45.920 --> 00:53:48.960 I'm wondering for what it's worth, 00:53:48.960 --> 00:53:50.760 I'm wondering why we got business innovation 00:53:50.760 --> 00:53:53.360 going so deep into the area 00:53:53.360 --> 00:53:55.559 off of the primary arterial 00:53:56.719 --> 00:53:59.440 and actually into an area where we have established 00:53:59.440 --> 00:54:01.000 residential neighborhoods. 00:54:07.320 --> 00:54:09.119 - I think, Commissioner Beck, my recollection 00:54:09.119 --> 00:54:11.119 on a lot of stuff out west of Denton, 00:54:11.119 --> 00:54:14.280 the reason that a lot of it is not gonna be residential 00:54:14.280 --> 00:54:16.000 is 'cause of the gas wells, 00:54:16.000 --> 00:54:18.079 the setbacks that are required. 00:54:18.079 --> 00:54:19.400 I think there was some discussion, 00:54:19.400 --> 00:54:22.400 it's been a number of meetings ago 00:54:22.400 --> 00:54:27.199 about looking at future land use out west of Denton, 00:54:27.199 --> 00:54:29.559 about making some of it more commercial 00:54:29.559 --> 00:54:31.119 because you're not gonna be able to meet 00:54:31.119 --> 00:54:32.960 some of the setback requirements 00:54:32.960 --> 00:54:34.280 and things on the residential. 00:54:34.280 --> 00:54:37.280 - That makes sense, that's what I was saying. 00:54:48.119 --> 00:54:50.300 (mumbles) 00:54:58.320 --> 00:55:00.519 - Okay, here's University right here 00:55:00.519 --> 00:55:01.599 and here's the site. 00:55:02.880 --> 00:55:05.639 The site is right on the edge of the city limit. 00:55:05.639 --> 00:55:07.320 This is our ETJ right here 00:55:08.519 --> 00:55:10.639 and University right here. 00:55:11.960 --> 00:55:15.119 - Well, considering now what Chairman Strangis said 00:55:15.119 --> 00:55:20.119 about how unlikely it is 00:55:20.239 --> 00:55:22.079 that we'd wanna build residential out there 00:55:22.079 --> 00:55:24.559 around gas wells, yet here we are, 00:55:24.559 --> 00:55:28.000 fixing to looking at approving this one. 00:55:30.000 --> 00:55:32.880 - Well, the site is between six and 800 feet 00:55:32.880 --> 00:55:34.599 away from the two gas wells. 00:55:34.599 --> 00:55:36.559 - I understand that, but nonetheless, 00:55:36.559 --> 00:55:38.599 there's still a lot of concern by other people 00:55:38.599 --> 00:55:43.599 that just gas wells, even outside the allowed limits 00:55:44.320 --> 00:55:46.000 pose a health and safety risk. 00:55:46.000 --> 00:55:48.679 But the fact that we're looking at this 00:55:48.679 --> 00:55:51.480 as a business innovative area, 00:55:51.480 --> 00:55:53.760 I'm wondering why we're even considering this. 00:55:53.760 --> 00:55:56.119 If we really wanna push for that, 00:55:56.119 --> 00:55:57.920 and I don't have a problem with that, 00:55:59.039 --> 00:56:00.800 pushing for a business innovative area, 00:56:00.800 --> 00:56:04.599 it seems like we've got a set of rules here 00:56:04.599 --> 00:56:06.519 that allows this to happen, 00:56:06.519 --> 00:56:10.800 yet it's gonna create some conflict down the road. 00:56:10.800 --> 00:56:13.480 - Well, the business, I don't think that 00:56:13.480 --> 00:56:16.519 when the site was designated business innovation, 00:56:16.519 --> 00:56:21.119 the intent was not to negate any 00:56:22.039 --> 00:56:23.599 existing residential neighborhoods. 00:56:23.599 --> 00:56:25.000 - No, not existing, but new development. 00:56:25.000 --> 00:56:27.760 - And because of, well, see, all this he is doing 00:56:27.760 --> 00:56:32.639 is trying to go into an existing residential neighborhood. 00:56:32.639 --> 00:56:33.880 He's not creating a new one. 00:56:33.880 --> 00:56:36.679 This has been here since the '70s, the late '70s. 00:56:39.079 --> 00:56:42.320 - There's been a residence on that particular, 00:56:42.320 --> 00:56:44.719 oh, okay, he just now wants to zone it in. 00:56:44.719 --> 00:56:45.960 - That's right. 00:56:45.960 --> 00:56:48.199 He just found this little place that he likes, 00:56:48.199 --> 00:56:50.719 and it's his version of paradise, 00:56:50.719 --> 00:56:53.000 and this is where he wants to settle down. 00:56:53.000 --> 00:56:55.199 - Okay, all right, thank you. 00:56:56.840 --> 00:56:58.960 - Yeah, just to add a little more background, 00:56:58.960 --> 00:57:01.039 I think part of the issue is, 00:57:01.039 --> 00:57:02.119 they were annexed into the city. 00:57:02.119 --> 00:57:05.159 They came in to get a building permit to build their house, 00:57:05.159 --> 00:57:08.079 and then learned that they had to replat, 00:57:08.079 --> 00:57:09.119 or I shouldn't say replat, 00:57:09.119 --> 00:57:11.639 but really plat the property for the first time. 00:57:11.639 --> 00:57:12.880 But in order to plat the property, 00:57:12.880 --> 00:57:15.800 they have to have the zoning in place. 00:57:15.800 --> 00:57:18.239 And so that's where they are. 00:57:19.440 --> 00:57:20.800 - If they were still out in the county, 00:57:20.800 --> 00:57:22.239 they would have to plat, 00:57:22.239 --> 00:57:23.280 but they wouldn't have to zone 00:57:23.280 --> 00:57:25.079 because there's no zoning in the county. 00:57:25.079 --> 00:57:27.840 However, they were annexed in 2010, so. 00:57:30.480 --> 00:57:33.199 - So that's where I'm gonna have a question 00:57:33.199 --> 00:57:36.039 on these little small parcels like this. 00:57:36.039 --> 00:57:39.719 We've had over the years a number of these. 00:57:39.719 --> 00:57:42.480 Is there some way administratively 00:57:42.480 --> 00:57:47.159 to handle these little small odds and ends projects 00:57:47.159 --> 00:57:50.840 versus we treat a one acre single lot 00:57:50.840 --> 00:57:53.400 like we do a 500 lot subdivision? 00:57:53.400 --> 00:57:56.079 You gotta zone it, plat it, the expense, 00:57:56.079 --> 00:58:00.639 the time to go build a single family residence 00:58:00.639 --> 00:58:02.840 on a small piece of property. 00:58:02.840 --> 00:58:07.119 And it's just a question while we're doing updates with DDC 00:58:07.119 --> 00:58:07.239 s 00:58:07.239 --> 00:58:09.559 if there's a simple way to do that 00:58:09.559 --> 00:58:12.400 or do the people have to go through the process. 00:58:12.400 --> 00:58:13.239 - As far as I know, 00:58:13.239 --> 00:58:15.159 there's no way to zone administratively. 00:58:15.159 --> 00:58:16.760 - No, there's not. 00:58:16.760 --> 00:58:18.559 The state law is very specific 00:58:18.559 --> 00:58:23.559 and consistent with a state zoning enabling act 00:58:23.599 --> 00:58:26.360 that is pretty much the law of the land 00:58:26.360 --> 00:58:28.400 in just about all the states 00:58:28.400 --> 00:58:31.800 that prescribes pretty much the same zoning process 00:58:31.800 --> 00:58:34.639 that involves a two-stage process. 00:58:34.639 --> 00:58:37.239 - If there were, believe me, we would have utilized it. 00:58:37.239 --> 00:58:39.639 - Well then that prompts a follow-up question. 00:58:39.639 --> 00:58:41.760 When the city annexes property 00:58:41.760 --> 00:58:44.800 and assigns a zoning category, 00:58:44.800 --> 00:58:47.039 is there a possibility for the city 00:58:47.039 --> 00:58:49.119 to assign a zoning category 00:58:49.119 --> 00:58:52.239 that's more appropriate to the existing land use? 00:58:52.239 --> 00:58:55.119 - Well, the city doesn't assign a zoning category 00:58:55.119 --> 00:58:57.119 upon annexation. 00:58:57.119 --> 00:58:59.199 When property is annexed, 00:58:59.199 --> 00:59:01.159 we are required by state law 00:59:01.159 --> 00:59:05.320 to allow all existing legal uses of property 00:59:05.320 --> 00:59:07.679 and not interfere with the continuation 00:59:07.679 --> 00:59:11.880 of any legal use of property on any annexed land. 00:59:11.880 --> 00:59:16.280 That doesn't mean that somebody will necessarily 00:59:16.280 --> 00:59:20.559 have their dreams or expectations carried out 00:59:20.559 --> 00:59:22.000 when it is initially zoned. 00:59:23.239 --> 00:59:27.119 So we do have the process that's in place here. 00:59:28.920 --> 00:59:32.199 I guess I'm a little bit unclear as to why it's NR2 00:59:32.199 --> 00:59:34.039 instead of NR1 if it's a one-acre lot, 00:59:34.039 --> 00:59:39.039 but there's no entitlement as such 00:59:40.119 --> 00:59:42.880 to any particular use. 00:59:42.880 --> 00:59:46.960 And we have, in some cases, 00:59:46.960 --> 00:59:51.000 where there was a desired zone for an area, 00:59:52.199 --> 00:59:56.039 worked to combine the zoning and the annexation 00:59:56.039 --> 00:59:57.800 to where they're in rapid succession, 00:59:57.800 --> 01:00:01.639 but those are kind of the exception rather than the rule. 01:00:03.000 --> 01:00:05.679 - Sure, if I can just add to the conversation 01:00:05.679 --> 01:00:08.800 on a future land use discussion. 01:00:08.800 --> 01:00:13.519 We did, back in 2015, sign this area, business innovation, 01:00:13.519 --> 01:00:15.079 and again, the idea, again, 01:00:15.079 --> 01:00:18.679 more of these type of development in this part of the city, 01:00:18.679 --> 01:00:22.519 trying to identify locations for future development, 01:00:22.519 --> 01:00:24.440 really high level in understanding 01:00:24.440 --> 01:00:27.119 that we do have gas wells in this location. 01:00:27.119 --> 01:00:29.880 However, that being said, 01:00:29.880 --> 01:00:32.360 we also have an established neighborhood, 01:00:32.360 --> 01:00:35.320 and the next step after we do 01:00:35.320 --> 01:00:37.000 a future land use designation update, 01:00:37.000 --> 01:00:38.719 such as what we did in 2015, 01:00:38.719 --> 01:00:43.079 is to start to look at the rezoning or zoning code update. 01:00:43.079 --> 01:00:44.679 And that is where we are today, 01:00:44.679 --> 01:00:47.760 and when we bring forward a code update, 01:00:47.760 --> 01:00:50.559 we will be also looking at some rezonings 01:00:50.559 --> 01:00:52.159 or city-wide rezonings. 01:00:53.159 --> 01:00:54.000 This area right here, 01:00:54.000 --> 01:00:57.280 I counted 12 of the 16 being developed. 01:00:57.280 --> 01:00:59.639 To me, that's almost an established neighborhood. 01:01:00.679 --> 01:01:04.920 So this may be under the zoning request today, 01:01:04.920 --> 01:01:06.360 because they submitted an application, 01:01:06.360 --> 01:01:08.480 they may be looking at developing sooner 01:01:08.480 --> 01:01:11.719 than the update of the code. 01:01:11.719 --> 01:01:15.079 However, when we, again, bring forward a code update 01:01:15.079 --> 01:01:16.360 with the zoning map, 01:01:16.360 --> 01:01:19.000 we will certainly look at this location 01:01:19.000 --> 01:01:24.000 and zone it correctly, thinking that it is established. 01:01:24.599 --> 01:01:27.599 Now, that's difficult to say for the other locations. 01:01:27.599 --> 01:01:30.239 However, I think 12 out of 16 01:01:30.239 --> 01:01:34.400 potentially 13 out of 16 is an established neighborhood. 01:01:34.400 --> 01:01:36.679 - Okay, I'm gonna allow a question, 01:01:36.679 --> 01:01:38.039 and I know we're getting short on time, 01:01:38.039 --> 01:01:40.239 so Commissioner Back. - Quickly. 01:01:40.239 --> 01:01:43.119 So if they're gonna develop those other areas, 01:01:43.119 --> 01:01:48.119 they need to, what, have a primary plan in place 01:01:48.719 --> 01:01:51.039 before the DDC changes? 01:01:51.039 --> 01:01:53.440 - No, they don't. 01:01:53.440 --> 01:01:55.320 - Just an application? - Just an application. 01:01:55.320 --> 01:01:56.199 Right, right. - Okay. 01:01:56.199 --> 01:02:00.199 So any future development, this site, 01:02:00.199 --> 01:02:02.599 if the zoning is right, then they're fine. 01:02:02.599 --> 01:02:04.159 They would just need, obviously, to come in and apply 01:02:04.159 --> 01:02:06.119 whenever they're proposing to develop. 01:02:08.639 --> 01:02:10.159 - Any other questions on this item? 01:02:10.159 --> 01:02:11.000 Thank you, Ron. 01:02:20.400 --> 01:02:21.679 Okay, thank you, Cindy. 01:02:23.039 --> 01:02:25.840 Let's call a recess here at 6.08. 01:02:25.840 --> 01:02:29.000 Let's get food, and then we'll pick back up with Dee, 01:02:29.000 --> 01:02:31.639 and then get on back to our work session 01:02:31.639 --> 01:02:34.559 with the project matrix. 01:02:37.840 --> 01:02:41.320 - And welcome back to call us back in the session 01:02:41.320 --> 01:02:46.039 at 6.15 for continuation of our work session. 01:02:46.039 --> 01:02:49.079 We're in our public hearing section of item D. 01:02:49.079 --> 01:02:52.400 We'll call on Julie White for presentation. 01:02:52.400 --> 01:02:53.840 - Good afternoon. 01:02:53.840 --> 01:02:57.000 I am presenting Z189, Mayhill Edwards. 01:02:57.880 --> 01:02:59.960 The request before you is to hold a public hearing 01:02:59.960 --> 01:03:04.519 and consider an initial zoning for a 15-acre track 01:03:04.519 --> 01:03:09.400 to Regional Center Residential One, RCR One District. 01:03:09.400 --> 01:03:11.880 The subject property is outlined here in yellow. 01:03:11.880 --> 01:03:14.760 It is located on the north side of Edwards Road. 01:03:14.760 --> 01:03:17.480 It's situated in the southeast part of town. 01:03:17.480 --> 01:03:18.880 We're probably all familiar with it. 01:03:18.880 --> 01:03:21.480 It's where Colorado and Mayhill and Edwards 01:03:21.480 --> 01:03:23.039 all kind of converge. 01:03:23.039 --> 01:03:24.519 So it's near that area. 01:03:26.880 --> 01:03:28.239 So we'll look at the current zoning. 01:03:28.239 --> 01:03:31.519 Right now it has a place holding zoning of RD5X. 01:03:31.519 --> 01:03:33.400 I know we had a pretty extensive discussion 01:03:33.400 --> 01:03:35.239 about that a few minutes ago, 01:03:35.239 --> 01:03:37.400 and there's gonna be a lot of parallels to this. 01:03:37.400 --> 01:03:41.840 So just a little bit of background on the property. 01:03:41.840 --> 01:03:44.920 It is the 15-acre track that we're talking about today 01:03:44.920 --> 01:03:48.360 is actually part of a larger parent tract. 01:03:48.360 --> 01:03:51.719 It is part of a 19-acre property 01:03:51.719 --> 01:03:56.559 where the western four acres of the tract 01:03:56.559 --> 01:03:58.920 were annexed in the early '80s. 01:03:58.920 --> 01:04:01.760 And during the 2002 citywide rezoning, 01:04:01.760 --> 01:04:05.079 it received a zoning designation of RCR One. 01:04:06.039 --> 01:04:09.519 The subject property was annexed in 2010 01:04:09.519 --> 01:04:12.559 as part of the municipal annexation, 01:04:12.559 --> 01:04:15.559 and it received that place holding designation 01:04:15.559 --> 01:04:18.920 until it could be zoned. 01:04:18.920 --> 01:04:21.639 At this point, the applicant is proposing 01:04:21.639 --> 01:04:24.000 is coming to you for the initial zoning, 01:04:24.000 --> 01:04:27.480 and they're proposing to extend that RCR One 01:04:27.480 --> 01:04:31.420 that's currently on the property to this 15 acres. 01:04:34.400 --> 01:04:37.159 So when we analyze a request, 01:04:37.159 --> 01:04:41.909 our first analysis point is to look at the Comprehensive 01:04:41.909 --> 01:04:42.159 Plan. 01:04:42.440 --> 01:04:45.119 And this area has a designation 01:04:45.119 --> 01:04:47.559 in the future land use of business innovation. 01:04:47.559 --> 01:04:49.239 And as we talked about before, 01:04:49.239 --> 01:04:52.239 this is intended for large-scale employment parks, 01:04:52.239 --> 01:04:55.860 but also with supporting uses such as retail hotels 01:04:55.860 --> 01:04:58.599 and residential for employees. 01:04:59.480 --> 01:05:01.360 RCR district in this instance 01:05:01.360 --> 01:05:03.800 fits this future land use designation 01:05:03.800 --> 01:05:07.139 because it does permit, or for two reasons rather. 01:05:07.139 --> 01:05:10.039 First, it permits those residential uses, 01:05:10.039 --> 01:05:14.800 the some small-scale commercial and retail office uses 01:05:14.800 --> 01:05:18.300 in order to compliment nearby employment centers. 01:05:18.300 --> 01:05:21.519 However, it does permit these uses 01:05:21.519 --> 01:05:24.400 at a kind of a lower scale and intensity 01:05:24.400 --> 01:05:27.320 so that it would develop in a way 01:05:27.320 --> 01:05:29.599 that would be sensitive to nearby neighborhoods. 01:05:29.599 --> 01:05:32.920 So it's got those two parameters within RCR One district. 01:05:35.000 --> 01:05:36.559 We'll take a look at the mobility. 01:05:36.559 --> 01:05:39.019 There's a few mobility options in the area. 01:05:39.019 --> 01:05:41.239 First of all, the property here in yellow 01:05:41.239 --> 01:05:44.099 is located on Edwards, as I said, 01:05:44.099 --> 01:05:46.760 and it has the entire 19-acre tract, 01:05:46.760 --> 01:05:49.400 has approximately 1,000 linear feet 01:05:49.400 --> 01:05:52.679 of frontage along Edwards Road, which is a collector. 01:05:52.679 --> 01:05:57.500 But it's also near the DCTA rail trail, 01:05:57.500 --> 01:05:58.760 and that's that purple. 01:05:58.760 --> 01:06:01.059 It's within a quarter mile of that, 01:06:01.059 --> 01:06:03.960 and also within half a mile of the Med Park Center. 01:06:03.960 --> 01:06:07.059 So there's quite a bit of mobility options in the area. 01:06:08.239 --> 01:06:10.119 And I wanna take a little deeper dive 01:06:10.119 --> 01:06:12.320 in a nearby roadway, May Hill. 01:06:12.320 --> 01:06:15.000 We're all aware that May Hill's under construction, 01:06:15.000 --> 01:06:17.159 and it is close to this property, 01:06:17.159 --> 01:06:19.400 so we just kinda wanted to go through that. 01:06:19.400 --> 01:06:23.280 Now, I will caution you that this little leg of May Hill 01:06:23.280 --> 01:06:27.719 near this property, the alignment is not fully designed. 01:06:29.039 --> 01:06:33.119 So while we're talking about some conceptual issues here, 01:06:33.119 --> 01:06:35.079 the final design may not look like this. 01:06:35.079 --> 01:06:37.360 So let's go over the schematic really quickly. 01:06:37.360 --> 01:06:39.880 I know we're running out of time. 01:06:39.880 --> 01:06:42.599 So if you could see down here at the bottom 01:06:42.599 --> 01:06:44.320 is Colorado, right here. 01:06:44.320 --> 01:06:47.599 And then Edwards is right in this location. 01:06:47.599 --> 01:06:50.480 So this is the current development. 01:06:50.480 --> 01:06:53.280 Here's that DCTA, and if you've driven this, 01:06:53.280 --> 01:06:55.679 you know that you can drive down Colorado, 01:06:55.679 --> 01:06:57.760 and then you go over the railroad tracks, 01:06:57.760 --> 01:06:59.320 and then you take a right to get on Edwards, 01:06:59.320 --> 01:07:02.380 or you kinda curve and stay straight to go up South May 01:07:02.380 --> 01:07:02.900 Hill. 01:07:04.280 --> 01:07:08.500 The future plans, or what they're conceptually considering 01:07:08.500 --> 01:07:12.719 to be the future plans, are May Hill's gonna stay 01:07:12.719 --> 01:07:14.039 in the same location right here. 01:07:14.039 --> 01:07:16.559 So it's gonna punch through across Colorado. 01:07:16.559 --> 01:07:19.880 It will actually go over the railroad tracks in this area. 01:07:19.880 --> 01:07:23.519 So this will be a bridge, and then it will tie in 01:07:23.519 --> 01:07:26.440 to the May Hill construction on the north side. 01:07:26.440 --> 01:07:31.440 Edwards Road, currently this connection here will go away. 01:07:32.440 --> 01:07:36.960 And at grade crossing it, the railroad will go away 01:07:36.960 --> 01:07:38.440 on Edwards Road. 01:07:38.440 --> 01:07:41.880 Instead, Edwards Road, if you're traveling on it 01:07:41.880 --> 01:07:46.880 from the east, it's gonna veer north 01:07:46.920 --> 01:07:51.559 and tie into what is currently the South May Hill Road, 01:07:51.559 --> 01:07:54.000 and it will then continue on. 01:07:54.000 --> 01:07:59.000 Now here's where some phasing comes in. 01:07:59.440 --> 01:08:03.119 First of all, phase one, this Edwards Road will come in, 01:08:03.119 --> 01:08:05.400 and it will go north on the existing alignment, 01:08:05.400 --> 01:08:08.119 and then it will tie in to the future May Hill 01:08:08.119 --> 01:08:11.280 in this location, going both north and south. 01:08:11.280 --> 01:08:12.360 That's phase one. 01:08:12.360 --> 01:08:14.639 Phase two, and the ultimate conditions, 01:08:14.639 --> 01:08:18.479 are you'll be going north on Edwards to here, 01:08:18.479 --> 01:08:20.720 and then it will tie in at this location, 01:08:20.720 --> 01:08:22.800 and you can go either south or north. 01:08:22.800 --> 01:08:27.199 So that's generally what the mobility is gonna be doing 01:08:27.199 --> 01:08:29.319 with May Hill in this location. 01:08:29.319 --> 01:08:30.340 Any questions? 01:08:31.439 --> 01:08:33.739 - We're south of the key. 01:08:33.739 --> 01:08:34.819 - Yes sir, yes sir. 01:08:36.239 --> 01:08:38.800 Yes sir, and one thing I failed to mention, 01:08:38.800 --> 01:08:42.199 May Hill will either maybe track this direction, 01:08:42.199 --> 01:08:43.560 or track in this direction. 01:08:43.560 --> 01:08:45.680 They don't quite know which alignment 01:08:45.680 --> 01:08:48.600 it will ultimately take. 01:08:50.399 --> 01:08:53.180 As part of our review, we also looked at the compatibility, 01:08:53.180 --> 01:08:56.880 not only of the zoning, but also of the surrounding uses. 01:08:56.880 --> 01:08:58.880 So here's our subject property again in yellow, 01:08:58.880 --> 01:09:02.119 I'm sorry, outlined in yellow. 01:09:02.119 --> 01:09:04.159 We have the RCR one to the north, 01:09:04.159 --> 01:09:08.880 as well as on the adjacent tract and on the same tract. 01:09:10.039 --> 01:09:12.279 NRMU 12 is just to the east, 01:09:12.279 --> 01:09:14.920 and that's developed with the multifamily use. 01:09:14.920 --> 01:09:17.520 Further to the east, you have single family neighborhoods, 01:09:17.520 --> 01:09:20.000 and they have a mixture of zoning districts, 01:09:20.000 --> 01:09:23.520 RD5X, NR6, as well as planned development. 01:09:23.520 --> 01:09:25.319 To the west is a little bit of a different story, 01:09:25.319 --> 01:09:27.439 you've got some employment uses. 01:09:27.439 --> 01:09:30.479 You have a lot of development on the highway 01:09:30.479 --> 01:09:33.319 that has medical, you've got the hospital there, 01:09:33.319 --> 01:09:35.119 you've got a lot of doctor's offices. 01:09:35.119 --> 01:09:37.800 You also have flowers, food, a bakery, 01:09:37.800 --> 01:09:39.199 just on the south side of Edwards. 01:09:39.199 --> 01:09:42.760 So you've got a lot of employment uses in this area, 01:09:42.760 --> 01:09:45.239 and in transitioning to residential. 01:09:45.239 --> 01:09:47.359 Our property's kind of in the middle of that. 01:09:47.359 --> 01:09:49.720 And so the property we're considering tonight. 01:09:49.720 --> 01:09:53.479 So in that respect, RCR one would permit some uses 01:09:53.479 --> 01:09:56.439 that can be in transition, 01:09:56.439 --> 01:09:58.600 and we'll talk about that in just a minute. 01:09:59.539 --> 01:10:03.960 So our analysis points included RCR one is consistent 01:10:03.960 --> 01:10:06.640 with that existing zoning pattern that we just talked about 01:10:06.640 --> 01:10:06.640 . 01:10:06.640 --> 01:10:09.319 It really is an extension of that RCR one 01:10:09.319 --> 01:10:10.819 to the north and to the west. 01:10:13.079 --> 01:10:15.600 So it's consistent with the existing zoning pattern 01:10:15.600 --> 01:10:17.399 on the same parcel, as well as the extension 01:10:17.399 --> 01:10:19.600 of that existing zoning pattern. 01:10:19.600 --> 01:10:22.840 If approved, RCR one would consolidate the zoning 01:10:22.840 --> 01:10:27.279 on the property so that development could go forward 01:10:27.279 --> 01:10:30.510 under a uniform set of regulations, including use and scale 01:10:30.510 --> 01:10:30.760 . 01:10:31.920 --> 01:10:34.079 As we talked about on that map, 01:10:34.079 --> 01:10:35.760 this kind of is a transition area 01:10:35.760 --> 01:10:39.039 between those large-scale, high-intensity employment 01:10:39.039 --> 01:10:39.520 centers 01:10:39.520 --> 01:10:42.180 to the west and then those residential neighborhoods. 01:10:42.180 --> 01:10:44.380 And RCR one fits in this area 01:10:44.380 --> 01:10:46.920 because it does permit some higher-density housing 01:10:46.920 --> 01:10:50.819 with an SUP, but also limited office service, 01:10:50.819 --> 01:10:52.560 retail and commercial uses, 01:10:52.560 --> 01:10:57.560 things that would support those employment centers, 01:10:57.720 --> 01:10:59.800 but would also be more compatible in use 01:10:59.800 --> 01:11:01.560 with the residential areas. 01:11:01.560 --> 01:11:05.600 RCR one also has a development scale, building envelope, 01:11:05.600 --> 01:11:08.560 lot coverage, building height that is similar to, 01:11:08.560 --> 01:11:11.359 or actually more restrictive than the surrounding zoning. 01:11:12.399 --> 01:11:14.239 If approved, if the zoning's approved, 01:11:14.239 --> 01:11:17.079 development must comply with all development regulations, 01:11:17.079 --> 01:11:19.720 including any tree preservation, ESA, 01:11:19.720 --> 01:11:21.600 buffer screening, lighting. 01:11:21.600 --> 01:11:24.479 A water service is available along Edwards. 01:11:24.479 --> 01:11:25.859 There is sewer in the area. 01:11:25.859 --> 01:11:29.180 They may have to do some extension when they develop. 01:11:30.600 --> 01:11:32.159 Public notification was sent out. 01:11:32.159 --> 01:11:35.060 We haven't received any responses. 01:11:36.699 --> 01:11:38.640 And so based upon the criteria for approval 01:11:38.640 --> 01:11:40.159 in the Denton Development Code, 01:11:40.159 --> 01:11:44.199 as well as the conformance with the Denton Plan 2030 01:11:44.199 --> 01:11:47.520 and the compatibility of the surrounding property, 01:11:47.520 --> 01:11:49.640 staff does recommend approval of the request, 01:11:49.640 --> 01:11:51.239 and I'll stand for any questions. 01:11:52.479 --> 01:11:53.319 Commissioner Becker. 01:11:53.319 --> 01:11:54.920 - I'll make it quick. 01:11:54.920 --> 01:11:56.119 Probably Amy, this is Richard, 01:11:56.119 --> 01:11:57.920 'cause I was quizzing Julia a while ago, 01:11:57.920 --> 01:11:59.760 and she was perplexed about, 01:11:59.760 --> 01:12:01.840 we've got that trailer park sitting in there, 01:12:01.840 --> 01:12:03.680 just north of there, 01:12:03.680 --> 01:12:08.680 and is that considered manufactured housing, 01:12:09.159 --> 01:12:14.000 or is that the old pre-1976 trailer park classification? 01:12:16.520 --> 01:12:19.800 Well, again, because I'm on this DDC rewrite, 01:12:19.800 --> 01:12:22.800 we're looking at non-conforming conditions. 01:12:22.800 --> 01:12:27.079 - It wouldn't fall under the new definition of, 01:12:27.079 --> 01:12:29.760 it wouldn't, it's really a non-conforming 01:12:30.960 --> 01:12:32.760 manufactured home park. 01:12:32.760 --> 01:12:34.119 I think part of the issue is-- 01:12:34.119 --> 01:12:34.960 - HUD approved? 01:12:36.039 --> 01:12:39.039 - It's prior to, I think those are the older homes. 01:12:39.039 --> 01:12:40.800 - Okay, so once it's gone, it's gone. 01:12:40.800 --> 01:12:41.640 - It's gone. 01:12:45.640 --> 01:12:47.039 - I don't know whether to get you to go forward or backward 01:12:47.039 --> 01:12:47.039 , 01:12:47.039 --> 01:12:51.000 but I thought I saw where you had RCR, 01:12:53.039 --> 01:12:56.199 okay, right there, RCR 1, manufactured housing. 01:12:56.199 --> 01:12:58.359 - Yes, that is just a, 01:12:58.359 --> 01:13:00.479 manufactured housing is what it's developed with, 01:13:00.479 --> 01:13:03.399 just to let you know what the surrounding uses are. 01:13:03.399 --> 01:13:05.560 So it's not saying that that's an approved-- 01:13:05.560 --> 01:13:07.359 - That's not allowed, RCR 1 is allowed? 01:13:07.359 --> 01:13:08.960 - Right, it's just that's what it's developed with. 01:13:08.960 --> 01:13:10.560 - Okay, all right, good enough. 01:13:12.760 --> 01:13:15.279 - Any other questions for Julie on this item? 01:13:17.159 --> 01:13:18.000 All right, thanks. 01:13:18.000 --> 01:13:18.840 - Thank you, Julie. 01:13:20.560 --> 01:13:25.560 That'll take us to our final item on our work session, 01:13:25.680 --> 01:13:27.800 which is gonna be our matrix. 01:13:29.920 --> 01:13:32.479 - I'll be brief, what I attempted to do here 01:13:32.479 --> 01:13:34.000 is really pull off all of the items 01:13:34.000 --> 01:13:38.720 that have been lingering, I think some of them since 2016, 01:13:39.680 --> 01:13:42.399 where we talked about scheduling work session items 01:13:42.399 --> 01:13:43.840 for further discussion. 01:13:43.840 --> 01:13:46.840 And so what I did here is really just assign those dates 01:13:47.680 --> 01:13:49.119 sort of moving forward. 01:13:49.119 --> 01:13:52.399 I did fail to include the discussion on zoning changes 01:13:52.399 --> 01:13:54.560 for single family residential. 01:13:55.680 --> 01:13:57.760 I guess this RD5X one tonight, 01:13:57.760 --> 01:13:59.800 I think that the Little Brook Estates 01:13:59.800 --> 01:14:02.199 is probably a good example of that. 01:14:02.199 --> 01:14:06.359 I will include as part of the September 12th, 01:14:06.359 --> 01:14:08.359 so I'll add that. 01:14:08.359 --> 01:14:12.119 I do have two dates for the tree code. 01:14:12.119 --> 01:14:14.119 The first one is really to give an update, 01:14:14.119 --> 01:14:16.760 we're going back to the Committee on the Environment, 01:14:16.760 --> 01:14:19.600 August 6th, and then I think we'll be going 01:14:19.600 --> 01:14:22.039 to City Council shortly thereafter. 01:14:22.039 --> 01:14:24.239 And so that was really just to provide an update 01:14:24.239 --> 01:14:26.279 as far as where we are on things 01:14:26.279 --> 01:14:27.840 and where things are progressing, 01:14:27.840 --> 01:14:30.800 and then sort of bringing it back a few weeks later 01:14:31.680 --> 01:14:34.920 once we start revising based on input. 01:14:38.279 --> 01:14:40.100 Another item I wanted to include, 01:14:42.239 --> 01:14:43.960 we will be losing our chair. 01:14:47.600 --> 01:14:48.680 We'll be having a new chair, 01:14:48.680 --> 01:14:53.359 so that will be on most likely on next meeting's agenda. 01:14:54.520 --> 01:14:58.199 There was a new appointee, I got word last night. 01:14:58.199 --> 01:15:03.199 And so kind of going back to the matrix, 01:15:04.359 --> 01:15:06.359 wanting to start the meetings early, 01:15:06.359 --> 01:15:08.319 so I wanted to make sure if we started at four o'clock, 01:15:08.319 --> 01:15:10.680 maybe 4.30 depending on the topic, 01:15:10.680 --> 01:15:13.600 just wanted to make sure that was okay with everybody. 01:15:13.600 --> 01:15:14.720 - The next B and Z? 01:15:15.800 --> 01:15:19.520 - Yeah, moving forward with all of these items, correct. 01:15:19.520 --> 01:15:21.039 One, making sure we had enough time 01:15:21.039 --> 01:15:24.000 for the agenda items as well as discussion, 01:15:24.880 --> 01:15:29.880 but also for next week to have a little reception for Jim. 01:15:30.039 --> 01:15:31.239 - Absolutely. - Have a cupcake, 01:15:31.239 --> 01:15:33.119 that's tradition. (laughing) 01:15:33.119 --> 01:15:35.340 - When's your official cutoff date? 01:15:35.340 --> 01:15:38.199 - Today. - What, seriously? 01:15:38.199 --> 01:15:39.039 - Seriously. 01:15:39.039 --> 01:15:41.760 - I thought not August or September, huh? 01:15:41.760 --> 01:15:44.159 - I think next meeting I'll have a replacement. 01:15:44.159 --> 01:15:48.399 So we'll get to have cake and say thank yous and goodbyes 01:15:48.399 --> 01:15:50.539 and business continues. 01:15:52.159 --> 01:15:53.439 - Happily, he says. 01:15:54.680 --> 01:15:56.880 - For everybody. - Gonna miss your expertise. 01:15:56.880 --> 01:15:58.479 Gonna miss your expertise. 01:15:58.479 --> 01:15:59.840 - Thank you. 01:15:59.840 --> 01:16:02.000 - The only other item I wanted to add, 01:16:05.720 --> 01:16:07.359 given that we have four tonight, 01:16:08.479 --> 01:16:11.199 and we had the issue previously on the tie vote 01:16:11.199 --> 01:16:13.119 and sort of what that does, 01:16:14.479 --> 01:16:17.840 Scott, maybe Scott can give a, 01:16:17.840 --> 01:16:21.920 I know he had provided some guidance on this matter. 01:16:21.920 --> 01:16:25.760 I think it was also brought up at the city council level. 01:16:25.760 --> 01:16:30.079 So I'll let Scott answer or update. 01:16:30.079 --> 01:16:32.319 (laughing) 01:16:33.600 --> 01:16:37.600 - Ultimately, we know how the tie vote resulted 01:16:37.600 --> 01:16:39.880 and what we're gonna do is look at changing. 01:16:39.880 --> 01:16:42.619 We've got a couple of different avenues that we're pursuing 01:16:42.619 --> 01:16:42.840 . 01:16:43.800 --> 01:16:45.760 One is changing the development code. 01:16:45.760 --> 01:16:47.779 One is changing the municipal code. 01:16:48.800 --> 01:16:50.199 Well, there are three options really, 01:16:50.199 --> 01:16:55.109 or whether council opts to eliminate the tie vote provision 01:16:55.109 --> 01:16:55.199 . 01:16:57.800 --> 01:16:59.899 The bottom line is council has a desire 01:16:59.899 --> 01:17:02.760 to correct that deficiency 01:17:02.760 --> 01:17:06.199 because based on the learning example that we had, 01:17:06.199 --> 01:17:10.000 that it would just end up in a circular fashion 01:17:10.000 --> 01:17:11.279 that could never be resolved 01:17:11.279 --> 01:17:15.439 because we couldn't ultimately have a full board 01:17:16.439 --> 01:17:18.119 or full commission. 01:17:18.119 --> 01:17:19.399 So with that being said, 01:17:19.399 --> 01:17:22.680 we'll most likely be bringing something back 01:17:22.680 --> 01:17:27.680 through the commission to amend the development code 01:17:30.039 --> 01:17:33.159 and or we will take it directly to council, 01:17:33.159 --> 01:17:37.760 which they will be amending the council rules of procedure, 01:17:37.760 --> 01:17:41.800 which address this particular commission. 01:17:41.800 --> 01:17:44.239 So going forward, just certainly, 01:17:44.239 --> 01:17:46.119 we're gonna make the change necessary 01:17:46.119 --> 01:17:49.720 so that this commission does not find itself 01:17:49.720 --> 01:17:54.079 in a precarious position that it can't ultimately act. 01:17:54.079 --> 01:17:55.319 The bottom line that is, 01:17:55.319 --> 01:17:59.819 is that a tie vote will result in a denial. 01:17:59.819 --> 01:18:02.300 And then again, we're trying to address the denial 01:18:02.300 --> 01:18:06.699 in such a fashion that it may not require 01:18:06.699 --> 01:18:09.159 a super majority at council. 01:18:09.159 --> 01:18:12.680 So that way council can hear it as a denial 01:18:12.680 --> 01:18:14.720 just by the mere fact that it was a tie vote 01:18:14.720 --> 01:18:17.520 and then they can vote and it would be a simple majority. 01:18:17.520 --> 01:18:19.760 So it'll be up to council really to determine 01:18:19.760 --> 01:18:21.920 whether it's a simple majority 01:18:21.920 --> 01:18:25.960 or require a three quarter majority, super majority. 01:18:28.439 --> 01:18:31.800 Jerry, to capture that accurately or close enough. 01:18:31.800 --> 01:18:36.319 - I'm not sure that that's going to work under the statute, 01:18:36.319 --> 01:18:38.039 but we can sure take a look at it. 01:18:39.760 --> 01:18:42.960 I think a denial is going to create a super majority. 01:18:42.960 --> 01:18:45.920 - Yeah, and that's what council has to ultimately decide 01:18:45.920 --> 01:18:47.319 as to which route they're gonna pursue. 01:18:47.319 --> 01:18:48.880 - No, I think the statute says 01:18:48.880 --> 01:18:51.479 that the denial proves super majority. 01:18:51.479 --> 01:18:53.199 But we can sure look into that. 01:18:54.079 --> 01:18:55.680 - Yeah, that's Aaron, thank you. 01:18:59.079 --> 01:19:02.720 - Anything else on matrix and law session? 01:19:03.600 --> 01:19:05.079 Okay. 01:19:05.079 --> 01:19:09.960 Great, well at 6.32, we're gonna close our work session 01:19:09.960 --> 01:19:11.760 and reconvene as quickly as we can. 01:19:15.359 --> 01:19:17.159 - Good evening everyone and welcome to the 01:19:17.159 --> 01:19:19.380 city of Denton planning and zoning commission meeting 01:19:19.380 --> 01:19:22.380 for July 25th, 2018. 01:19:23.720 --> 01:19:25.180 This meeting has been duly posted 01:19:25.180 --> 01:19:26.939 and we do have a quorum present 01:19:26.939 --> 01:19:30.640 and I will call us to order at 6.45. 01:19:30.640 --> 01:19:32.479 Our first order of business will be to stand 01:19:32.479 --> 01:19:34.880 and give the pledge to the US and the Texas flag. 01:19:35.079 --> 01:19:38.239 (audience applauding) 01:19:39.640 --> 01:19:41.880 - I pledge allegiance to the flag 01:19:41.880 --> 01:19:44.520 of the United States of America 01:19:44.520 --> 01:19:47.560 and to the republic for which it stands, 01:19:47.560 --> 01:19:51.199 one nation, under God, indivisible, 01:19:51.199 --> 01:19:54.199 with liberty and justice for all. 01:19:56.199 --> 01:19:58.359 - I honor the Texas flag. 01:19:58.359 --> 01:20:01.359 - I pledge allegiance to thee, Texas, 01:20:01.359 --> 01:20:06.359 one nation, under God, one indivisible. 01:20:20.920 --> 01:20:24.119 - The next item on our agenda will be 01:20:24.119 --> 01:20:27.640 consider approval of the planning and zoning commission 01:20:27.640 --> 01:20:29.880 minutes for July the 11th. 01:20:29.880 --> 01:20:31.239 Commissioner Beck. 01:20:31.239 --> 01:20:33.600 - Thank you, I move we approve the minutes. 01:20:33.600 --> 01:20:35.279 - Okay, Commissioner Ellis. 01:20:35.279 --> 01:20:36.119 - Second. 01:20:36.119 --> 01:20:38.880 - Okay, we have a first and a second for approval. 01:20:38.880 --> 01:20:39.800 Any discussion? 01:20:41.239 --> 01:20:43.640 Seeing none, I'll call for a vote on the board. 01:20:49.359 --> 01:20:51.159 Motion's gonna carry four to zero. 01:20:52.439 --> 01:20:54.859 That will take us to our consent agenda. 01:20:57.500 --> 01:20:58.399 Commissioner Ellis. 01:20:58.399 --> 01:21:00.960 - Thank you, Chair, I move approval of consent agenda. 01:21:00.960 --> 01:21:02.319 Commissioner Beck. 01:21:02.319 --> 01:21:03.159 - Second. 01:21:03.159 --> 01:21:06.399 - Okay, we have a first and a second for approval. 01:21:06.399 --> 01:21:07.279 Any discussion? 01:21:09.039 --> 01:21:10.680 I'll call for a vote on the board. 01:21:16.039 --> 01:21:18.359 That motion's gonna carry four to zero. 01:21:19.880 --> 01:21:22.760 That moves us to our item four on our agenda, 01:21:22.760 --> 01:21:25.720 which is individual consideration items. 01:21:25.720 --> 01:21:28.479 This particular item has been withdrawn 01:21:28.479 --> 01:21:31.760 and it will have to come back at a future date 01:21:31.760 --> 01:21:33.319 and it is not a date certain. 01:21:35.640 --> 01:21:38.319 That will move us to our public hearings section 01:21:38.319 --> 01:21:40.960 this evening and at this time I'm gonna open 01:21:40.960 --> 01:21:45.720 the public hearing for Z18-0010 01:21:45.720 --> 01:21:48.039 and I will call on Haley for presentation. 01:21:59.479 --> 01:22:02.399 - Good evening, this is case Z18-10 01:22:02.399 --> 01:22:03.920 for the People's Funeral Home. 01:22:04.960 --> 01:22:07.159 The request before you is to hold a public hearing 01:22:07.159 --> 01:22:09.840 and consider making a recommendation to the city council 01:22:09.840 --> 01:22:11.800 regarding a request for a zoning change 01:22:11.800 --> 01:22:13.699 from neighborhood residential four district 01:22:13.699 --> 01:22:16.420 to downtown commercial neighborhood district. 01:22:16.420 --> 01:22:19.520 The subject property is outlined in black on the maps there 01:22:19.520 --> 01:22:21.140 so you can see the current zoning on the top 01:22:21.140 --> 01:22:24.159 and the proposed zoning on the bottom. 01:22:24.159 --> 01:22:26.680 The total site is a 0.64 acres 01:22:26.680 --> 01:22:29.000 and as you can see it's situated in between Mulberry 01:22:29.000 --> 01:22:30.340 and Sycamore streets. 01:22:32.199 --> 01:22:34.560 The property is comprised of four lots. 01:22:34.560 --> 01:22:37.380 You see the eastern most lot on the map is developed 01:22:37.380 --> 01:22:39.239 with the existing people's funeral home. 01:22:39.239 --> 01:22:42.119 The other three lots are vacant at this time. 01:22:42.119 --> 01:22:44.800 The owner is seeking to expand the existing building 01:22:44.800 --> 01:22:46.760 to enlarge their chapel space 01:22:46.760 --> 01:22:49.119 and as well as to add a parking lot. 01:22:49.119 --> 01:22:52.039 The funeral home has been in operation at this location 01:22:52.039 --> 01:22:54.340 since at least 1974. 01:22:54.340 --> 01:22:57.239 However, the business itself, People's Funeral Home 01:22:57.239 --> 01:22:59.479 was previously citizens undertaking 01:22:59.479 --> 01:23:02.119 and the use has been in multiple locations. 01:23:02.119 --> 01:23:04.960 I believe it started on Hickory Street back in the 1930s 01:23:04.960 --> 01:23:06.159 from what we could find. 01:23:08.520 --> 01:23:10.859 The funeral home use is classified as a mortuary 01:23:10.859 --> 01:23:12.199 in the Denton Development Code 01:23:12.199 --> 01:23:15.039 and mortuaries are not permitted in NR4 01:23:15.039 --> 01:23:17.579 or in any of our residential zoning districts. 01:23:18.720 --> 01:23:22.039 The use is not considered to be legally nonconforming 01:23:22.039 --> 01:23:24.340 or a special exception in this case 01:23:24.340 --> 01:23:26.039 because the use has never been permitted 01:23:26.039 --> 01:23:27.640 under the zoning for this property. 01:23:27.640 --> 01:23:30.840 Prior to the 2002 rezoning to NR4, 01:23:30.840 --> 01:23:35.279 the property had been designated SF7 since 1969. 01:23:36.739 --> 01:23:39.420 DCN is the least intensive zoning district 01:23:39.420 --> 01:23:41.619 that would permit the use on this property. 01:23:42.840 --> 01:23:46.520 So to give you a few more details about what is proposed, 01:23:46.520 --> 01:23:49.960 they currently have just over 3,200 square feet of building 01:23:49.960 --> 01:23:51.399 on that one lot. 01:23:51.399 --> 01:23:54.060 They're proposing to add about 2,500 square feet, 01:23:54.060 --> 01:23:56.720 as I said, primarily to add more chapel space 01:23:56.720 --> 01:23:57.960 to the building. 01:23:57.960 --> 01:24:00.600 There's currently only two on-site parking spaces 01:24:00.600 --> 01:24:02.159 located along Mulberry. 01:24:02.159 --> 01:24:04.619 So they're proposing to add parking here 01:24:04.619 --> 01:24:09.039 on the two Western lots for a total of 25 spaces. 01:24:09.039 --> 01:24:11.920 And they are also proposing landscaping buffers 01:24:11.920 --> 01:24:14.640 on the Western, Eastern and Southern portions 01:24:14.640 --> 01:24:17.479 of the property to buffer between this commercial use 01:24:17.479 --> 01:24:19.939 and the surrounding single-family properties. 01:24:22.239 --> 01:24:24.560 Staff looked at multiple criteria for approval 01:24:24.560 --> 01:24:25.640 with this request. 01:24:25.640 --> 01:24:27.560 Our two basic criteria are conformity 01:24:27.560 --> 01:24:30.720 to the future land use element of our Denton plan 01:24:30.720 --> 01:24:34.199 as well as the facilitation of infrastructure provision. 01:24:34.199 --> 01:24:36.640 When a request does not conform to the future land use map, 01:24:36.640 --> 01:24:39.159 the code gives us several other criteria to look at 01:24:39.159 --> 01:24:40.680 that you can see outlined here, 01:24:40.680 --> 01:24:43.399 described in full detail in your agenda backup. 01:24:43.399 --> 01:24:45.859 So I'll just kind of breeze through some of these. 01:24:47.640 --> 01:24:48.960 The first criteria, as I mentioned, 01:24:48.960 --> 01:24:51.800 being the future land use element of the Denton plan, 01:24:51.800 --> 01:24:54.199 this property as well as the surrounding area 01:24:54.199 --> 01:24:56.840 is designated for low density residential. 01:24:56.840 --> 01:25:00.399 That designation typically applies to areas 01:25:00.399 --> 01:25:02.720 with development between one and four dwelling units 01:25:02.720 --> 01:25:03.680 per acre. 01:25:03.680 --> 01:25:05.199 Other uses that are permitted 01:25:05.199 --> 01:25:07.359 in low density residential areas are churches 01:25:07.359 --> 01:25:09.119 and places of worship. 01:25:09.119 --> 01:25:10.640 Wanted to point out that functionally, 01:25:10.640 --> 01:25:12.760 a funeral home is very similar to a church 01:25:12.760 --> 01:25:15.000 or a place of worship in terms of how much traffic 01:25:15.000 --> 01:25:17.000 visits the site and the frequency of it. 01:25:18.039 --> 01:25:19.920 So DCN is not consistent 01:25:19.920 --> 01:25:22.039 with this future land use designation 01:25:22.039 --> 01:25:26.260 because it does allow in addition to the funeral home, 01:25:26.260 --> 01:25:29.100 many other commercial uses as well as multifamily. 01:25:30.520 --> 01:25:32.159 Another element of the comprehensive plan 01:25:32.159 --> 01:25:34.680 that I thought was important for this case is 01:25:34.680 --> 01:25:36.680 that one of its criteria is the preservation 01:25:36.680 --> 01:25:39.119 of the character of existing neighborhoods. 01:25:39.119 --> 01:25:42.119 Due to the longevity of this use and its history, 01:25:42.119 --> 01:25:44.640 it seems very reasonable to assume that this funeral home 01:25:44.640 --> 01:25:46.119 is an integral part of the character 01:25:46.119 --> 01:25:47.880 of the Solomon Hills neighborhood. 01:25:48.920 --> 01:25:52.640 So as I mentioned, the request to DCN district 01:25:52.640 --> 01:25:54.960 is not compatible with the future land use. 01:25:54.960 --> 01:25:56.500 It's also not directly compatible 01:25:56.500 --> 01:25:59.720 with the surrounding zoning of NR4. 01:25:59.720 --> 01:26:02.399 DCN would permit, as I mentioned, commercial uses 01:26:02.399 --> 01:26:04.319 as well as multifamily at up to a density 01:26:04.319 --> 01:26:06.319 of 72 units per acre. 01:26:06.319 --> 01:26:08.680 It also permits a building height of 100 feet. 01:26:09.760 --> 01:26:13.300 Combined, everything permitted in DCN could be a catalyst 01:26:13.300 --> 01:26:14.520 for change in this neighborhood 01:26:14.520 --> 01:26:15.800 where other properties around it 01:26:15.800 --> 01:26:18.159 could also apply for rezonings. 01:26:18.159 --> 01:26:20.399 So to allow some protection on that, 01:26:20.399 --> 01:26:22.000 staff looked at this as a situation 01:26:22.000 --> 01:26:24.079 where an overlay would be very applicable 01:26:24.079 --> 01:26:26.279 'cause it would allow us to restrict the uses 01:26:26.279 --> 01:26:28.000 as well as the scale of development 01:26:28.000 --> 01:26:29.199 to make this more compatible 01:26:29.199 --> 01:26:31.399 with the surrounding zoning and neighborhood. 01:26:33.079 --> 01:26:36.319 The rezoning would create kind of an isolated pocket of DCN 01:26:36.319 --> 01:26:36.399 . 01:26:37.359 --> 01:26:39.039 However, it wanted to point out 01:26:39.039 --> 01:26:42.039 that based on the concept plan they provided, 01:26:42.039 --> 01:26:44.800 they are still able to provide all of the required elements 01:26:44.800 --> 01:26:46.359 for buffering and screening this use 01:26:46.359 --> 01:26:48.279 that would be required by the code. 01:26:48.279 --> 01:26:50.279 So that will help make this more compatible 01:26:50.279 --> 01:26:51.960 with the surrounding area. 01:26:51.960 --> 01:26:53.960 The expansion would also be kind of serving 01:26:53.960 --> 01:26:55.399 the public good of the neighborhood, if you will, 01:26:55.399 --> 01:26:56.960 because it would take a lot of the parking 01:26:56.960 --> 01:26:59.829 that's currently provided on street onto the property 01:26:59.829 --> 01:27:00.199 itself, 01:27:00.199 --> 01:27:01.640 which would make the neighborhood more safe 01:27:01.640 --> 01:27:04.550 for emergency services to access the site if they needed to 01:27:04.550 --> 01:27:04.739 . 01:27:07.220 --> 01:27:09.000 Just a little more background, as I mentioned, 01:27:09.000 --> 01:27:11.560 the funeral home has been there for 40 years. 01:27:11.560 --> 01:27:12.920 We looked through all of our files 01:27:12.920 --> 01:27:15.119 and found no complaints about the property, 01:27:15.119 --> 01:27:17.920 no instances where CIS had to go out there 01:27:17.920 --> 01:27:19.359 for anything beyond parking 01:27:19.359 --> 01:27:22.439 on one of the unimproved lots next door. 01:27:22.439 --> 01:27:24.439 So we found that the continuation of this use 01:27:24.439 --> 01:27:26.800 would be very unlikely to cause any injury 01:27:26.800 --> 01:27:27.939 to the surrounding neighborhood 01:27:27.939 --> 01:27:30.640 since it's been there for so long without ill effect. 01:27:32.000 --> 01:27:35.060 Also wanted to point out the fact that the city and staff 01:27:35.060 --> 01:27:36.760 have known about this use. 01:27:36.760 --> 01:27:38.479 It's been there since '74, as I said, 01:27:38.479 --> 01:27:40.460 we have had a couple of cases of parking 01:27:40.460 --> 01:27:43.399 on the adjoining properties where CIS has gone out, 01:27:43.399 --> 01:27:45.619 but the city's taken no enforcement actions 01:27:45.619 --> 01:27:46.899 to try to shut down this use, 01:27:46.899 --> 01:27:49.159 despite it not being legal on the property. 01:27:50.359 --> 01:27:53.779 It's also worth noting that with the 2002 rezoning, 01:27:53.779 --> 01:27:56.800 as well as our two comprehensive plans in '99 01:27:56.800 --> 01:27:59.739 and then in 2015, again, the use was known 01:27:59.739 --> 01:28:02.579 and the city did not make the use legal at that time 01:28:02.579 --> 01:28:05.180 with the zoning district that could have been applied, 01:28:05.180 --> 01:28:07.279 or even through addressing that 01:28:07.279 --> 01:28:09.479 in the comprehensive plan somehow. 01:28:11.399 --> 01:28:13.060 And looking at our other main criteria, 01:28:13.060 --> 01:28:16.359 which was the provision of access and infrastructure, 01:28:16.359 --> 01:28:18.399 there's ample access to the site already, 01:28:18.399 --> 01:28:19.579 as you saw with their site plan, 01:28:19.579 --> 01:28:22.279 they're proposing a drive that would connect the site 01:28:22.279 --> 01:28:25.460 from Mulberry to Sycamore to allow through traffic, 01:28:25.460 --> 01:28:27.319 and water and service utilities 01:28:27.319 --> 01:28:28.739 are currently serving the site, 01:28:28.739 --> 01:28:31.239 and of course would be available for the expansion. 01:28:32.880 --> 01:28:35.739 Public notices were sent regarding the request. 01:28:35.739 --> 01:28:38.460 Before this meeting, I received one in opposition, 01:28:38.460 --> 01:28:39.880 which is shown in red on the map, 01:28:39.880 --> 01:28:43.220 and then one in favor, which that person happened 01:28:43.220 --> 01:28:45.380 to own two properties adjoining the site. 01:28:45.380 --> 01:28:47.420 You see those outlined in green on the map. 01:28:47.420 --> 01:28:49.699 A neighborhood meeting was held on June 9th. 01:28:49.699 --> 01:28:51.500 There were eight to nine people at that meeting, 01:28:51.500 --> 01:28:54.619 and at the time, no opposition or concerns were voiced. 01:28:56.760 --> 01:28:59.079 So given the uniqueness of this request, 01:28:59.079 --> 01:29:02.979 staff has found that the DCN zoning could be appropriate 01:29:02.979 --> 01:29:04.720 and compatible with the site 01:29:04.720 --> 01:29:07.239 if overlay restrictions are applied. 01:29:07.239 --> 01:29:09.460 We propose that those restrictions would be 01:29:09.460 --> 01:29:12.060 to limit the permitted uses within the DCN district 01:29:12.060 --> 01:29:15.420 to only the mortuary use that is desired for the property, 01:29:15.420 --> 01:29:18.220 and to limit the building height to one story, 01:29:18.220 --> 01:29:20.859 rather than the 100 feet that would be permitted by ride. 01:29:20.859 --> 01:29:23.060 And I'd be happy to stand for any questions. 01:29:27.380 --> 01:29:28.819 - No questions? 01:29:28.819 --> 01:29:30.739 Okay, you did a good job on the work session. 01:29:30.739 --> 01:29:31.579 - Thank you. 01:29:31.579 --> 01:29:32.399 - Thank you. 01:29:32.399 --> 01:29:33.239 - And the applicant is here as well, 01:29:33.239 --> 01:29:35.100 if there are any questions. 01:29:35.100 --> 01:29:36.180 - This is a public hearing, 01:29:36.180 --> 01:29:38.380 so I'll call on the applicant at this time. 01:29:39.460 --> 01:29:41.699 (coughing) 01:29:50.819 --> 01:29:53.220 - If you'll give us your name and address, 01:29:53.220 --> 01:29:54.619 we'd appreciate it. 01:29:54.619 --> 01:29:56.380 - My name is Johnny Brumfield, 01:29:56.380 --> 01:29:59.699 and I'm a member of local church, 01:29:59.699 --> 01:30:01.220 Flesk Grove Baptist Church, 01:30:01.220 --> 01:30:04.439 which is kind of a category for the funeral home. 01:30:05.260 --> 01:30:08.699 And as the owner's representative, 01:30:08.699 --> 01:30:12.380 we have a expansion that has been expressed, 01:30:12.380 --> 01:30:14.659 and a couple of good things it's gonna do 01:30:14.659 --> 01:30:15.939 for the neighborhood, 01:30:15.939 --> 01:30:19.340 it's gonna also help the funeral home to meet its needs, 01:30:19.340 --> 01:30:20.539 its current needs, 01:30:20.539 --> 01:30:22.699 because there is no available parking, 01:30:22.699 --> 01:30:24.680 as you see, only two parking spaces. 01:30:24.680 --> 01:30:27.340 So we're gonna drastically improve that. 01:30:27.340 --> 01:30:30.579 And we also want to add some beautification, 01:30:30.579 --> 01:30:32.479 so we're gonna be doing some buffering 01:30:32.479 --> 01:30:37.260 that's going to help to also beautify the area. 01:30:37.260 --> 01:30:39.739 So I thank you all that this is gonna meet 01:30:39.739 --> 01:30:41.500 the current needs of the funeral home, 01:30:41.500 --> 01:30:44.800 and it's also going to help alleviate the parking problem 01:30:44.800 --> 01:30:46.140 on those streets. 01:30:47.460 --> 01:30:49.659 - Okay, see if I have any questions. 01:30:49.659 --> 01:30:51.539 - Are there any questions? 01:30:51.539 --> 01:30:52.359 - Commissioner Backer. 01:30:52.359 --> 01:30:53.199 - Thank you, Chair. 01:30:53.199 --> 01:30:55.420 Thank you, Mr. Brumfield, for your presentation. 01:30:55.420 --> 01:30:57.340 Just wanna bring something up that came up in the work 01:30:57.340 --> 01:30:58.060 session 01:30:58.060 --> 01:30:59.739 regarding landscaping and everything. 01:30:59.739 --> 01:31:03.699 I believe this is required for when you've got 01:31:03.699 --> 01:31:04.819 a different development, 01:31:04.819 --> 01:31:06.100 butting up against residential. 01:31:06.100 --> 01:31:10.100 Are you okay with the amount of landscaping 01:31:10.100 --> 01:31:12.020 that this requires? 01:31:12.020 --> 01:31:13.619 - We definitely are okay with that, 01:31:13.619 --> 01:31:15.380 but we wanted to leave that as an option, 01:31:15.380 --> 01:31:17.779 just so we could kinda have some flexibility there. 01:31:17.779 --> 01:31:18.760 - Sure, sure. 01:31:18.760 --> 01:31:19.720 Okay, thank you. 01:31:22.500 --> 01:31:24.500 - Any other questions for the applicant? 01:31:26.060 --> 01:31:28.260 Okay, thank you, sir. 01:31:28.260 --> 01:31:29.100 - Thank you. 01:31:34.380 --> 01:31:35.659 - Have a whole bunch of cards, 01:31:35.659 --> 01:31:37.460 and I think we ran out of cards, 01:31:37.460 --> 01:31:40.659 so I don't know exactly who would like to speak 01:31:40.659 --> 01:31:42.460 and who just wanted to, 01:31:44.460 --> 01:31:46.399 some of them are marked, no speaking. 01:31:49.979 --> 01:31:51.819 Do not wish to speak. 01:31:51.819 --> 01:31:52.979 Let me read through the cards, 01:31:52.979 --> 01:31:54.579 and I'm just gonna kinda go through these, 01:31:54.579 --> 01:31:56.140 and let me get through the cards that I have 01:31:56.140 --> 01:31:57.060 that don't wish to speak, 01:31:57.060 --> 01:31:58.880 and then we'll get to the cards in here 01:31:58.880 --> 01:32:01.159 that do request to speak. 01:32:04.699 --> 01:32:07.420 I think it says Lori, 01:32:07.420 --> 01:32:12.420 and it looks like Mingo Road 2601, I think. 01:32:14.100 --> 01:32:15.739 No speaking in support. 01:32:16.800 --> 01:32:21.300 Cynthia Cochran, you do wanna speak? 01:32:22.140 --> 01:32:25.539 Okay, if you'll let me come on the bottom. 01:32:27.899 --> 01:32:31.420 Then I've got Mabel, 01:32:31.420 --> 01:32:35.340 I can't make out the name, 111 South Crawford. 01:32:38.539 --> 01:32:41.739 Dura Vette, 111 South Crawford, 01:32:41.739 --> 01:32:43.979 in support, does not wish to speak. 01:32:45.699 --> 01:32:46.539 Okay. 01:32:48.460 --> 01:32:52.420 Got Ethe McQueen, 1418 Noble Street, 01:32:52.420 --> 01:32:54.659 in support, not wishing to speak. 01:32:57.539 --> 01:32:58.899 Does wish to speak. 01:33:01.420 --> 01:33:06.140 Okay, will not speak. 01:33:06.140 --> 01:33:11.140 And I've got Gene Robertson, 2308 Mercedes Road, 01:33:11.420 --> 01:33:13.720 in support, does not wish to speak. 01:33:14.819 --> 01:33:19.819 I have Roland Lucas, 206 South Wood Street, 01:33:22.079 --> 01:33:24.899 in support, not wishing to speak. 01:33:27.180 --> 01:33:30.880 Does wish to speak, does wish to speak. 01:33:31.420 --> 01:33:36.420 Then I have Curtis Himes, 1213 Haggard, 01:33:39.619 --> 01:33:42.079 in support, does not wish to speak. 01:33:45.579 --> 01:33:50.479 I have Doris Parks, 3500 East McKinney Street, 01:33:51.739 --> 01:33:54.100 in support, does not wish to speak. 01:33:59.180 --> 01:34:04.180 And I have Reginald Logan, 705 Park Lane. 01:34:04.539 --> 01:34:08.220 He is in support as well, and it says, 01:34:08.220 --> 01:34:09.899 "Do not wish to speak," on the card, 01:34:09.899 --> 01:34:11.739 but it does have a note, "Speak, please." 01:34:11.739 --> 01:34:14.699 So if you do want to speak, I'll put you, okay, 01:34:14.699 --> 01:34:18.180 let me put you to the back here with these. 01:34:19.779 --> 01:34:24.779 And I have Ivy Four, 5409 Galant Lane, 01:34:25.939 --> 01:34:28.899 does not wish to speak, in support, correct? 01:34:29.859 --> 01:34:30.699 Okay. 01:34:34.579 --> 01:34:35.920 Do wish to speak. 01:34:39.060 --> 01:34:40.779 And I think I already called on Ms. Cochran, 01:34:40.779 --> 01:34:43.539 who said she did want to speak. 01:34:45.020 --> 01:34:46.420 Do you want to speak, okay? 01:34:47.539 --> 01:34:49.300 Let me call on you first. 01:34:49.300 --> 01:34:52.399 Ms. Cynthia Cochran, 2420 McKinney. 01:34:55.140 --> 01:34:56.939 Please, for the record, if you'll give us your name 01:34:56.939 --> 01:34:59.039 and address when you get to the microphone. 01:34:59.979 --> 01:35:02.260 (speaking faintly) 01:35:02.260 --> 01:35:07.260 And I was born and raised in Denton, Texas. 01:35:07.340 --> 01:35:12.020 I just want to say, on behalf of Southeast Denton, 01:35:12.020 --> 01:35:16.380 we have really appreciated what Mr. Maxfield, 01:35:16.380 --> 01:35:19.739 Mr. Clifton has done as for us having 01:35:19.739 --> 01:35:22.340 a greater, better funeral home, 01:35:22.340 --> 01:35:26.359 and we have never had anything that looks so beautiful 01:35:26.359 --> 01:35:29.859 and gorgeous in our Southeast Denton town. 01:35:29.859 --> 01:35:34.739 And it also lifts up, it's no bother to none of us, 01:35:34.739 --> 01:35:37.220 we don't get to smell nothing coming out. 01:35:37.220 --> 01:35:39.939 It's so beautiful, neatly and everything. 01:35:39.939 --> 01:35:43.939 So I just want to say, on behalf of Southeast Denton, 01:35:43.939 --> 01:35:48.939 we are so excited if we can have the people home expansion 01:35:49.460 --> 01:35:52.659 to give us a lot of space, you know, 01:35:52.659 --> 01:35:54.380 parking spaces and everything, 01:35:54.380 --> 01:35:56.699 because we find a way to park, 01:35:56.699 --> 01:35:58.739 but we parking like in people's yard. 01:35:58.739 --> 01:36:02.380 So with this expansion and with the beautiful work 01:36:02.380 --> 01:36:06.260 that he has done and has brought to our city, 01:36:06.260 --> 01:36:09.140 and it's just gorgeous, and we are so proud 01:36:09.140 --> 01:36:12.020 that we can have something nice and beautiful 01:36:12.020 --> 01:36:17.020 in our town or either in Southeast Denton. 01:36:17.260 --> 01:36:18.699 And I also would like to say, 01:36:18.699 --> 01:36:20.380 we really want to thank Mr. Clifton 01:36:20.380 --> 01:36:22.539 for what all he has done for us. 01:36:22.539 --> 01:36:25.300 And I just hope that we get this done 01:36:25.300 --> 01:36:27.819 and y'all can approve it for us 01:36:27.819 --> 01:36:31.140 because we want to look pretty like everyone else. 01:36:31.140 --> 01:36:33.539 And we are really looking pretty. 01:36:33.539 --> 01:36:36.500 We really looking pretty in Southeast Denton. 01:36:36.500 --> 01:36:39.380 So I want to thank each and every one of you all. 01:36:39.380 --> 01:36:43.199 And we hope we can get what we came for tonight. 01:36:43.199 --> 01:36:44.979 God bless each and every one of y'all 01:36:44.979 --> 01:36:47.579 and thank our people for being here. 01:36:47.579 --> 01:36:48.420 Thank you. 01:36:48.420 --> 01:36:50.380 - Thank you for coming out to speak tonight. 01:36:53.300 --> 01:36:57.159 Kim McKibbin, 1306 West Hickory, 01:36:57.159 --> 01:36:59.699 does wish to speak and in opposition. 01:37:02.640 --> 01:37:05.899 - My name is Kim McKibbin, 1306 West Hickory Street. 01:37:05.899 --> 01:37:07.539 Hi guys. 01:37:07.539 --> 01:37:09.699 I've been going for a while and I had to say 01:37:09.699 --> 01:37:12.260 that I'm pretty excited to see this many people 01:37:12.260 --> 01:37:13.819 in this chamber tonight. 01:37:13.819 --> 01:37:15.619 I think that's amazing. 01:37:17.699 --> 01:37:19.739 I was in opposition of this, 01:37:19.739 --> 01:37:24.739 but I think that staff has given a solution to my concerns. 01:37:24.739 --> 01:37:29.340 I was concerned about the zoning that was being requested 01:37:29.340 --> 01:37:32.239 because it would allow high density apartment buildings 01:37:32.239 --> 01:37:34.020 at a hundred feet. 01:37:34.020 --> 01:37:36.220 I went out and looked at the area out there. 01:37:36.220 --> 01:37:38.779 It is a nice looking funeral home. 01:37:38.779 --> 01:37:43.699 But if the staff's recommendations for some sort of overlay 01:37:43.699 --> 01:37:46.699 or special use permit or whatever it is 01:37:46.699 --> 01:37:48.079 that needs to be there, 01:37:48.079 --> 01:37:49.939 I think that's an excellent solution. 01:37:49.939 --> 01:37:54.380 It's a very established funeral home in an area 01:37:54.380 --> 01:37:57.899 that is obviously very proud of that. 01:37:57.899 --> 01:38:01.399 I am concerned about this neighborhood. 01:38:01.399 --> 01:38:04.539 It is a neighborhood at risk as the future land use 01:38:04.539 --> 01:38:08.539 for the downtown city development moves that direction. 01:38:08.539 --> 01:38:12.420 I think that this council is going to get 01:38:12.420 --> 01:38:16.619 more and more request for zoning creep, 01:38:16.619 --> 01:38:17.939 as I would call it. 01:38:19.939 --> 01:38:23.140 The downtown zoning will take over quite a few houses 01:38:23.140 --> 01:38:25.979 in that area and change that neighborhood 01:38:25.979 --> 01:38:30.020 if we are not very careful about what we're doing 01:38:30.020 --> 01:38:31.979 and how we're impacting people 01:38:33.060 --> 01:38:35.859 and give those folks a voice 01:38:35.859 --> 01:38:37.779 to stand up for their neighborhood. 01:38:37.779 --> 01:38:41.020 So once again, I started out in opposition 01:38:41.020 --> 01:38:42.939 because I was opposed to the zoning 01:38:42.939 --> 01:38:47.380 and what it would allow if the property was ever sold again 01:38:47.380 --> 01:38:47.380 . 01:38:47.380 --> 01:38:50.640 But if the city is, if you guys are willing 01:38:50.640 --> 01:38:53.779 to put that special overlay on it, 01:38:53.779 --> 01:38:56.979 I withdraw my opposition and I would be in favor of that. 01:38:56.979 --> 01:38:59.659 The one thing that does concern me just a tiny bit 01:38:59.659 --> 01:39:04.659 is the exiting driveway is going to go right out 01:39:05.260 --> 01:39:07.260 in front of the new splash pad, 01:39:08.060 --> 01:39:10.420 the splash pad park that's there. 01:39:10.420 --> 01:39:14.739 And you might want to look at making that the entrance 01:39:14.739 --> 01:39:17.779 and the exit, the entrance on Sycamore 01:39:17.779 --> 01:39:21.380 and the exit on Mulberry 01:39:21.380 --> 01:39:24.279 so that the cars are not literally coming out 01:39:24.279 --> 01:39:27.579 in a great big line where children might be playing 01:39:27.579 --> 01:39:29.500 in the splash park. 01:39:29.500 --> 01:39:33.579 So that's the only real safety concern I saw about that 01:39:33.579 --> 01:39:35.859 and that would be easy enough to remedy 01:39:35.859 --> 01:39:38.560 if someone would go out and look at how that traffic 01:39:38.560 --> 01:39:41.300 is going to be moving in and out through there. 01:39:42.220 --> 01:39:43.140 Thank you. 01:39:43.140 --> 01:39:43.979 - Thank you. 01:39:43.979 --> 01:39:45.699 So I'll change your card from opposition then 01:39:45.699 --> 01:39:47.659 to in support, is that what you like? 01:39:47.659 --> 01:39:49.539 - With the reservation that you follow 01:39:49.539 --> 01:39:51.220 the staff's recommendation. 01:39:51.220 --> 01:39:53.060 - Gotcha, we've got that. 01:39:53.060 --> 01:39:56.420 Okay, in support with conditions, how about that? 01:39:56.420 --> 01:39:57.819 - That works, thank you. 01:39:57.819 --> 01:39:58.659 - You're welcome. 01:39:59.859 --> 01:40:02.090 Commissioner Beck, did you have a question for Mrs. McKib 01:40:02.090 --> 01:40:02.460 bin? 01:40:02.460 --> 01:40:04.539 - Not a question so much, it's just a statement. 01:40:04.539 --> 01:40:07.100 Thank her for her presentation. 01:40:07.100 --> 01:40:08.659 I always enjoy listening to Kim. 01:40:08.659 --> 01:40:12.100 She's so articulate and informed 01:40:12.100 --> 01:40:15.260 and I agree that support for this neighborhood 01:40:15.260 --> 01:40:17.819 is important and going forward, 01:40:17.819 --> 01:40:21.100 I'm hoping there's something we can do legally 01:40:21.100 --> 01:40:24.500 and binding that ensures that this neighborhood 01:40:24.500 --> 01:40:27.779 doesn't get overrun by commercial interests. 01:40:27.779 --> 01:40:29.680 So thanks again, Kim. 01:40:29.680 --> 01:40:30.520 - Okay. 01:40:33.100 --> 01:40:37.899 - Next card I have is Shelly Johnson, 1109 East Hickory. 01:40:41.500 --> 01:40:43.659 In support, you do wish to speak or do not? 01:40:45.939 --> 01:40:48.060 Okay, we'll record as in support 01:40:48.060 --> 01:40:51.180 and do not wish to speak. 01:40:51.180 --> 01:40:52.020 Thank you, ma'am. 01:40:56.500 --> 01:41:01.500 Ruby Sachs, 110 or 1109 East Hickory. 01:41:01.640 --> 01:41:04.140 In support, wishing to speak? 01:41:04.140 --> 01:41:06.420 Nope, no speak, but in support? 01:41:06.420 --> 01:41:07.520 Okay, thank you, ma'am. 01:41:14.659 --> 01:41:18.020 Okay, next card I have is Marcella Franklin, 01:41:18.939 --> 01:41:20.859 317 Mill Street. 01:41:20.859 --> 01:41:22.659 In support, wishing to speak? 01:41:24.659 --> 01:41:25.500 No speak? 01:41:25.500 --> 01:41:27.380 Okay, in support, we'll record that. 01:41:31.060 --> 01:41:35.460 Okay, next card I have is Vanessa Reed, 01:41:35.460 --> 01:41:38.100 617 Boardwalk. 01:41:38.100 --> 01:41:39.819 In support, wishing to speak? 01:41:41.460 --> 01:41:42.300 Okay. 01:41:44.619 --> 01:41:47.220 You guys are gonna make it easy on us tonight up here. 01:41:48.180 --> 01:41:53.180 All right, Patrice Tobias, 618 East Prairie. 01:41:53.699 --> 01:41:56.060 Support, wishing to speak? 01:41:56.819 --> 01:41:57.739 No, okay. 01:42:01.899 --> 01:42:06.859 And last card I have is Reginald Logan, 01:42:06.859 --> 01:42:09.300 705 Park Lane. 01:42:09.300 --> 01:42:10.319 In support? 01:42:12.619 --> 01:42:17.020 And he says, do not wish to speak 01:42:17.020 --> 01:42:19.699 and we're gonna change that to do want to speak. 01:42:19.699 --> 01:42:20.619 How about that? 01:42:20.619 --> 01:42:22.020 - Speaking briefly, yes sir. 01:42:22.020 --> 01:42:23.020 My name is Reginald Logan, 01:42:23.020 --> 01:42:26.460 live on 705 Park Lane here in the city of Denton. 01:42:26.460 --> 01:42:27.779 Thank you for hearing us tonight 01:42:27.779 --> 01:42:30.100 and coming in support of this expansion 01:42:30.100 --> 01:42:31.579 of People's Funeral Home. 01:42:31.579 --> 01:42:33.140 You know, it's great when you have an opportunity 01:42:33.140 --> 01:42:35.220 to come for a commercial establishment 01:42:35.220 --> 01:42:36.300 that's placed in your neighborhood 01:42:36.300 --> 01:42:38.699 and I understand the concerns that the lady had, 01:42:38.699 --> 01:42:41.619 but at least this time we can control the creeping. 01:42:41.619 --> 01:42:42.659 We got something to say about 01:42:42.659 --> 01:42:44.300 what's gonna creep in our neighborhood. 01:42:44.300 --> 01:42:47.100 Something that's gonna enhance our neighborhood. 01:42:47.100 --> 01:42:49.939 Something that's gonna build support for our neighborhood. 01:42:49.939 --> 01:42:51.859 Something that we're gonna support a man 01:42:51.859 --> 01:42:53.859 that's come into our city 01:42:53.859 --> 01:42:56.960 and supporting the people that live in the city. 01:42:56.960 --> 01:42:59.659 They didn't, Mr. Maxwell has really been someone 01:42:59.659 --> 01:43:01.380 that has really come and said, 01:43:01.380 --> 01:43:03.180 "Hey, I wanna be part of you guys 01:43:03.180 --> 01:43:05.579 "and be part of the city and come and be of support 01:43:05.579 --> 01:43:07.380 "and do all I can to help." 01:43:07.380 --> 01:43:08.779 And that's what he's done. 01:43:08.779 --> 01:43:10.460 So I hope tonight that you'll come 01:43:10.460 --> 01:43:12.380 and give us support of this planning zone. 01:43:12.380 --> 01:43:13.859 Your planning is good. 01:43:13.859 --> 01:43:15.579 Now you can plan for something 01:43:15.579 --> 01:43:17.140 for a commercial establishment 01:43:17.140 --> 01:43:19.859 that is actually part of the neighborhood. 01:43:19.859 --> 01:43:22.819 Like a church, like a hospital. 01:43:22.819 --> 01:43:25.859 This place somewhere and it's really gonna be a help. 01:43:25.859 --> 01:43:28.779 And the big word that I know the planning zoning looks for 01:43:28.779 --> 01:43:31.659 an asset, an asset to the community. 01:43:31.659 --> 01:43:34.340 Not only for Southeast Denton, guess what? 01:43:34.340 --> 01:43:36.979 He just doesn't bury people in Southeast Denton. 01:43:36.979 --> 01:43:39.140 He's burying people all over the place. 01:43:39.140 --> 01:43:42.180 And you may even be his next customer. 01:43:42.180 --> 01:43:43.380 (audience laughing) 01:43:43.380 --> 01:43:46.220 And wouldn't you want, and I'm gonna close with this, 01:43:46.220 --> 01:43:49.979 and wouldn't you not want for your people to come 01:43:49.979 --> 01:43:51.939 and have a place to park? 01:43:51.939 --> 01:43:53.699 And I hope after I speak tonight 01:43:53.699 --> 01:43:56.859 that he'll have a designated parking for preachers. 01:43:56.859 --> 01:43:59.859 (audience laughing) 01:44:04.539 --> 01:44:07.060 No, no question sir, you did a good job. 01:44:10.180 --> 01:44:12.060 Okay, those are all the cards I have, 01:44:12.060 --> 01:44:13.220 but this is a public hearing. 01:44:13.220 --> 01:44:15.659 So anyone else that would like to come speak 01:44:15.659 --> 01:44:17.060 for or against this project, 01:44:17.060 --> 01:44:18.739 please come forward at this time. 01:44:20.819 --> 01:44:21.779 Anyone else? 01:44:23.020 --> 01:44:24.340 It's a public hearing, it's wide open. 01:44:24.340 --> 01:44:26.380 Anybody else that would like to come speak? 01:44:27.819 --> 01:44:31.180 Okay, seeing none, I will close the public hearing 01:44:31.180 --> 01:44:34.420 and I will open the floor for discussion or motion. 01:44:34.420 --> 01:44:35.819 Commissioner Beck. 01:44:35.819 --> 01:44:36.659 - Thank you, Chair. 01:44:36.659 --> 01:44:38.979 And thank each and every one of y'all for coming down. 01:44:38.979 --> 01:44:40.899 And like Chairman Trane said, 01:44:40.899 --> 01:44:42.380 you really made it easy for us. 01:44:42.380 --> 01:44:44.180 And I just will go quickly if no one's speaking, 01:44:44.180 --> 01:44:48.180 but I would have loved to hear what some of you had to say, 01:44:48.180 --> 01:44:49.819 but that being said, 01:44:52.779 --> 01:44:55.659 I wanna thank Haley Zagurski 01:44:55.659 --> 01:44:57.420 that put this presentation together 01:44:57.420 --> 01:45:02.420 because I thought she did a good job of discreetly, 01:45:02.420 --> 01:45:04.979 is probably the word, explaining how the city blundered. 01:45:04.979 --> 01:45:06.260 But let's be honest here, 01:45:07.340 --> 01:45:11.739 the predominantly white city fathers let y'all down 01:45:11.739 --> 01:45:14.619 years ago and that's a disappointment to all of us. 01:45:16.739 --> 01:45:21.739 I thought I was glad also to see that she presented a case 01:45:21.899 --> 01:45:23.500 where we could allow this zone change 01:45:23.500 --> 01:45:25.060 without any difficulty. 01:45:25.060 --> 01:45:27.300 She opened the door there and I was glad to see that 01:45:27.300 --> 01:45:31.140 because people's funeral home historically 01:45:31.140 --> 01:45:34.060 is always needed to provide mortuary services 01:45:35.380 --> 01:45:37.140 for people of color during a time 01:45:37.140 --> 01:45:40.020 when the predominantly white culture didn't in the 1930s 01:45:40.020 --> 01:45:42.819 and later most likely would have forbade 01:45:42.819 --> 01:45:45.619 such interracial accommodations. 01:45:47.340 --> 01:45:49.899 I suspect that as a matter of convenience, 01:45:49.899 --> 01:45:53.300 the predominant white culture of the 1960s and 70s, 01:45:53.300 --> 01:45:56.979 which I was a part of and for me was, 01:45:56.979 --> 01:45:59.699 allowed the continuous of this mortuary 01:45:59.699 --> 01:46:02.579 a non-residential usage because Denton, 01:46:02.579 --> 01:46:05.140 like other Texas communities, 01:46:05.140 --> 01:46:08.180 was still not ready to sanction interracial contact 01:46:08.180 --> 01:46:10.619 even at this level at the end of life. 01:46:10.619 --> 01:46:15.619 So I plan on supporting this zone change request 01:46:16.420 --> 01:46:18.579 with the two stated restrictions 01:46:18.579 --> 01:46:21.460 for the simple reason that people's funeral home has 01:46:21.460 --> 01:46:23.500 and will continue to be a part of 01:46:23.500 --> 01:46:27.260 Solomon Hills Three Edition, Southeast Denton. 01:46:27.260 --> 01:46:29.180 Part of a city that now has, 01:46:29.180 --> 01:46:33.220 despite its unfortunate origins as it was forced to move 01:46:33.220 --> 01:46:37.899 out of what was known as Quaker Town Park, 01:46:38.779 --> 01:46:43.380 is now one that has a rich ethnic culture in it. 01:46:43.380 --> 01:46:47.300 So as I mentioned earlier, I hope to, 01:46:47.300 --> 01:46:50.220 I'm gonna go ahead and make a motion to approve this 01:46:50.220 --> 01:46:54.579 and would like to speak to some kind of means that 01:46:55.420 --> 01:46:58.300 Legal and I discussed how we can ensure 01:46:58.300 --> 01:47:02.180 that this neighborhood doesn't become encroached upon 01:47:02.180 --> 01:47:03.539 any further than they have. 01:47:04.699 --> 01:47:08.380 So do I make the, I can make the motion now 01:47:08.380 --> 01:47:11.140 to approve this and we do that and then address that. 01:47:11.140 --> 01:47:14.180 I think what Jerry suggested was that 01:47:17.260 --> 01:47:18.739 there were things we couldn't do, 01:47:18.739 --> 01:47:23.739 but that, let me find it here. 01:47:25.699 --> 01:47:28.020 The best option would be to recommend that staff 01:47:28.020 --> 01:47:31.500 or the city council to investigate a comp plan amendment 01:47:31.500 --> 01:47:34.939 or small area plan amendment to accomplish the concern 01:47:34.939 --> 01:47:39.420 to protect this neighborhood from any further commercial, 01:47:39.420 --> 01:47:41.100 non-residential encroachment. 01:47:42.899 --> 01:47:47.899 So I'm making the motion that we approve this 01:47:48.579 --> 01:47:53.460 that we also as advised by legal proceed 01:47:53.460 --> 01:47:55.979 with making some kind of comp plan. 01:47:57.300 --> 01:47:58.260 - Well, I think just to clarify, 01:47:58.260 --> 01:47:59.619 we'll have a motion on the item 01:47:59.619 --> 01:48:01.899 and then once we get a motion before us, 01:48:01.899 --> 01:48:03.979 I think it'd be appropriate if you'd like to address that 01:48:03.979 --> 01:48:07.020 as just in the discussion, your concern 01:48:07.020 --> 01:48:11.699 or asking city council to take that into consideration 01:48:11.699 --> 01:48:13.100 at whatever point in the future 01:48:13.100 --> 01:48:16.739 and just further clarification, your motion to approve, 01:48:16.739 --> 01:48:18.819 does it have the two conditions on it? 01:48:18.819 --> 01:48:19.659 - It does. 01:48:19.659 --> 01:48:23.260 - So it has a condition as far as the overlay on the height 01:48:23.260 --> 01:48:23.380 . 01:48:24.460 --> 01:48:27.420 - And that it be limited to be in the mortuary. 01:48:27.420 --> 01:48:29.060 - As in our backup, okay. 01:48:29.060 --> 01:48:31.260 - Yeah, and just wanna make a matter of record 01:48:31.260 --> 01:48:34.140 that we do proceed going forward 01:48:34.140 --> 01:48:35.659 to try and protect this neighborhood. 01:48:35.659 --> 01:48:36.579 - Okay. - Okay. 01:48:36.579 --> 01:48:38.220 - Thank you for your motion. 01:48:38.220 --> 01:48:39.380 Commissioner Sanchez. 01:48:41.180 --> 01:48:42.020 - Good evening. 01:48:42.020 --> 01:48:44.140 I just like to say I live in East Denton 01:48:44.140 --> 01:48:45.779 and it's a very unique community, 01:48:45.779 --> 01:48:48.260 unlike other parts of Denton. 01:48:48.260 --> 01:48:51.100 To me, it's like a small community. 01:48:51.100 --> 01:48:55.520 We have our own barbershop, we have our parks, 01:48:55.520 --> 01:48:58.720 we have a Martin Luther King Recreation Center, 01:48:58.720 --> 01:49:00.819 all within walking distance 01:49:00.819 --> 01:49:02.979 and we even have a funeral home. 01:49:02.979 --> 01:49:05.979 So I'm gonna vote to approve it 01:49:05.979 --> 01:49:10.340 because I do believe it is part of that community 01:49:10.340 --> 01:49:15.340 and I think anything different would be in opposition 01:49:15.380 --> 01:49:16.979 to make it a better community. 01:49:17.819 --> 01:49:19.850 - Commissioner Sanchez, would you like to second the motion 01:49:19.850 --> 01:49:20.020 ? 01:49:20.020 --> 01:49:21.579 - Yes. - Okay. 01:49:21.579 --> 01:49:24.140 We have a first and a second for approval 01:49:24.140 --> 01:49:27.899 with the two conditions that are listed in our backup. 01:49:27.899 --> 01:49:29.500 Commissioner Ellis. 01:49:29.500 --> 01:49:30.420 - Thank you, Chair. 01:49:30.420 --> 01:49:32.260 I just wanted to say a couple of words. 01:49:32.260 --> 01:49:33.979 Thank you everybody for coming out 01:49:33.979 --> 01:49:36.460 to speak your support of this. 01:49:36.460 --> 01:49:38.779 It is with great pleasure that I will support this 01:49:38.779 --> 01:49:41.180 and help this part of your community. 01:49:41.180 --> 01:49:42.000 I think it's wonderful. 01:49:42.000 --> 01:49:44.220 On paper, it didn't make sense. 01:49:44.220 --> 01:49:46.460 Haley, as far as the zoning, 01:49:46.460 --> 01:49:48.520 Haley did a beautiful job putting it all together, 01:49:48.520 --> 01:49:49.819 describing the history. 01:49:49.819 --> 01:49:52.340 I drove the neighborhood a couple of different times 01:49:52.340 --> 01:49:54.859 and then your wonderful words of support. 01:49:55.899 --> 01:49:58.100 It's just great that you all came out. 01:49:58.100 --> 01:49:58.939 - Okay. 01:49:59.819 --> 01:50:01.680 A couple of comments myself. 01:50:03.140 --> 01:50:05.140 Kinda key on what I think Commissioner Beck's 01:50:05.140 --> 01:50:06.340 gonna bring up here in just a minute 01:50:06.340 --> 01:50:08.840 as far as the neighbors in general. 01:50:10.420 --> 01:50:12.380 The best voice that you all have, 01:50:12.380 --> 01:50:14.579 not only on this case, but any other cases 01:50:14.579 --> 01:50:16.699 that may come in the future 01:50:16.699 --> 01:50:18.460 where there may be zoning changes 01:50:18.460 --> 01:50:21.479 proposed for your neighborhood is to show up. 01:50:22.380 --> 01:50:25.739 So when you show up and use your voice to support 01:50:25.739 --> 01:50:28.699 or against is the best thing that you can do 01:50:28.699 --> 01:50:30.800 when you come before any commission or board 01:50:30.800 --> 01:50:32.460 or council in our city. 01:50:32.460 --> 01:50:36.100 And as citizens of our city, I encourage you to do so. 01:50:36.100 --> 01:50:39.079 And I appreciate everybody coming out tonight. 01:50:39.079 --> 01:50:43.739 And I do wanna let you know I'm supporting this as well, 01:50:43.739 --> 01:50:47.340 but this is just one step in a two step process. 01:50:47.340 --> 01:50:49.579 So this will come before planning and zoning tonight, 01:50:49.579 --> 01:50:51.619 which we will get you ready to vote on it now. 01:50:51.619 --> 01:50:55.180 And then it will come before city council 01:50:55.180 --> 01:50:58.260 on August the seventh at 630. 01:50:58.260 --> 01:51:01.960 And city council will take up the final determination 01:51:01.960 --> 01:51:03.720 from our recommendation as to whether 01:51:03.720 --> 01:51:05.699 to do the rezoning or not. 01:51:05.699 --> 01:51:08.180 So I encourage you all just like you have this evening 01:51:08.180 --> 01:51:11.619 to show up to show up on August the seventh at 630 01:51:11.619 --> 01:51:16.619 and city council and speak for or against at city council. 01:51:18.000 --> 01:51:20.220 And they will be the ones that will take the final vote 01:51:20.220 --> 01:51:23.979 and the decision on changing the zoning on this item. 01:51:23.979 --> 01:51:27.939 So again, thank you all for coming out this evening. 01:51:27.939 --> 01:51:31.479 And with that, I will recognize Commissioner Beck. 01:51:31.479 --> 01:51:34.220 I think he had a statement he wanted to make in discussion 01:51:34.220 --> 01:51:37.619 about asking city council to consider 01:51:37.619 --> 01:51:39.659 a small area plan or something to that effect. 01:51:39.659 --> 01:51:42.819 - Exactly, what steps do we need to take 01:51:42.819 --> 01:51:44.220 in that regard, Chair? 01:51:44.220 --> 01:51:46.819 - Call on legal to clarify that. 01:51:49.659 --> 01:51:54.659 - See, Scott is motioning over to Richard here 01:51:55.579 --> 01:51:58.899 to address this, I'll defer to him in a moment. 01:51:58.899 --> 01:52:00.539 - I was actually gonna mention as part of that, 01:52:00.539 --> 01:52:02.100 as part of adding it to the matrix, 01:52:02.100 --> 01:52:04.060 what I'd like to do is bring that item back 01:52:04.060 --> 01:52:07.399 as a work session and just discuss the various two options 01:52:07.399 --> 01:52:09.300 and how to move forward. 01:52:09.300 --> 01:52:10.220 If that's-- 01:52:10.220 --> 01:52:12.979 - Something that we could submit to city council. 01:52:12.979 --> 01:52:15.140 Okay, good enough, thanks. 01:52:16.100 --> 01:52:18.579 - Okay, with that-- 01:52:18.579 --> 01:52:19.500 - One other thing. 01:52:20.460 --> 01:52:21.300 - Commissioner Beck. 01:52:21.300 --> 01:52:23.420 - We wanna make this public too, 01:52:23.420 --> 01:52:25.779 so if anybody does wanna come to that work session 01:52:25.779 --> 01:52:28.659 to hear how we're gonna proceed, please stay tuned 01:52:28.659 --> 01:52:32.420 and be alert to that and Kim and Kim 01:52:32.420 --> 01:52:35.180 would be a good source, she'll probably let everybody know. 01:52:35.180 --> 01:52:39.500 But we'd like to have your input on that work session too. 01:52:42.180 --> 01:52:46.159 - Okay, we have a motion on the floor to approve 01:52:46.159 --> 01:52:48.670 with the two conditions and see no one else wishing to 01:52:48.670 --> 01:52:49.500 speak 01:52:49.500 --> 01:52:51.939 and so at this time I'll call for a vote on board. 01:53:01.020 --> 01:53:03.300 Motion's gonna carry four to zero. 01:53:03.300 --> 01:53:05.659 Congratulations and good luck on your project. 01:53:05.659 --> 01:53:08.819 (audience applauding) 01:53:16.460 --> 01:53:20.619 We're going to move on to item B. 01:53:20.619 --> 01:53:22.880 At this time I'm gonna open the public hearing 01:53:22.880 --> 01:53:27.880 for PDA 18-0004 and I will call on Haley for presentation. 01:53:33.300 --> 01:53:36.300 , okay. (mumbles) 01:54:03.300 --> 01:54:06.460 (audience chattering) 01:54:20.260 --> 01:54:22.500 - I'm gonna give a couple minutes here, 01:54:22.500 --> 01:54:25.220 I think we've got a few more folks wanting to get out 01:54:25.220 --> 01:54:27.300 and clear the room and then we'll go ahead 01:54:27.300 --> 01:54:29.500 and start on the next item, good suggestion. 01:54:33.300 --> 01:54:36.460 (audience chattering) 01:55:03.300 --> 01:55:05.460 (mumbles) 01:55:05.460 --> 01:55:06.300 - Thank you. 01:55:22.020 --> 01:55:24.060 - I think most everybody's cleared the room, 01:55:24.060 --> 01:55:25.420 so go ahead Haley, thank you. 01:55:25.420 --> 01:55:29.579 - All right, all right, so this is item PDA 18-4 01:55:29.579 --> 01:55:31.220 for the cleaning green car wash. 01:55:32.979 --> 01:55:35.180 The request before you is to hold a public hearing 01:55:35.180 --> 01:55:37.260 and consider making a recommendation to council 01:55:37.260 --> 01:55:40.140 regarding a detailed plan for a property 01:55:40.140 --> 01:55:42.659 that's located within plan development 176, 01:55:42.659 --> 01:55:44.220 which is known as Wheeler Ridge. 01:55:45.220 --> 01:55:48.380 And the plan is to depict an auto laundry facility 01:55:48.380 --> 01:55:52.939 or a car wash on a site that's about 2.13 acres 01:55:52.939 --> 01:55:55.979 located on the west side of FM 2499, 01:55:55.979 --> 01:55:58.640 about 750 feet north of Hickory Creek Road. 01:56:00.619 --> 01:56:02.180 The future land use for this property 01:56:02.180 --> 01:56:05.420 is low residential as we saw in the previous case. 01:56:05.420 --> 01:56:08.619 So the proposal for a car washer commercial development 01:56:08.619 --> 01:56:09.899 doesn't necessarily conform 01:56:09.899 --> 01:56:11.859 to the future land use designation, 01:56:11.859 --> 01:56:14.979 but it's important to note that this subject property 01:56:14.979 --> 01:56:17.460 has been designated for commercial development 01:56:17.460 --> 01:56:20.699 since the PD was adopted in 1999. 01:56:20.699 --> 01:56:24.819 At that time they knew FM 2499 was intended to come through 01:56:24.819 --> 01:56:24.819 , 01:56:24.819 --> 01:56:27.300 but until that road actually was put in place, 01:56:27.300 --> 01:56:29.100 the property probably wasn't ripe 01:56:29.100 --> 01:56:30.460 for commercial development. 01:56:31.939 --> 01:56:35.380 So as I mentioned, this property is part of PD 176. 01:56:36.619 --> 01:56:39.020 Plan developments within the city of Denton, 01:56:39.020 --> 01:56:41.739 we don't currently have them in our current code, 01:56:41.739 --> 01:56:43.380 but in the 91 code they were permitted 01:56:43.380 --> 01:56:47.500 and it outlined a process that required a concept plan 01:56:47.500 --> 01:56:49.079 and a detailed plan be approved 01:56:49.079 --> 01:56:51.260 before a site could be developed. 01:56:51.260 --> 01:56:52.819 The concept plan for this property 01:56:52.819 --> 01:56:55.380 was approved in October of 1999. 01:56:56.260 --> 01:56:59.380 The PD allowed for on this property, 01:56:59.380 --> 01:57:00.520 any use that was permitted 01:57:00.520 --> 01:57:04.659 within the commercial zoning district in the 1991 code. 01:57:04.659 --> 01:57:06.539 So an auto laundry or a car wash 01:57:06.539 --> 01:57:08.380 was one of those permitted uses. 01:57:10.380 --> 01:57:13.260 Looking in detail at the plan they've proposed, 01:57:13.260 --> 01:57:16.140 you can see outlined in yellow the building footprint. 01:57:16.140 --> 01:57:18.819 It's just over 4,400 square feet. 01:57:18.819 --> 01:57:20.340 There is one driveway proposed 01:57:20.340 --> 01:57:21.859 on the north side of the property 01:57:21.859 --> 01:57:23.279 that could serve as a shared drive 01:57:23.279 --> 01:57:25.619 for when the northern portion develops. 01:57:25.619 --> 01:57:28.579 And then you will see six parking spaces 01:57:28.579 --> 01:57:30.819 for customers and employees outlined in red. 01:57:30.819 --> 01:57:33.659 And then there's a total of 25 vacuum stalls 01:57:33.659 --> 01:57:34.500 shown on the plan. 01:57:34.500 --> 01:57:36.979 Five of those may not be immediately developed, 01:57:36.979 --> 01:57:39.079 but are planned for future expansion. 01:57:41.779 --> 01:57:43.460 You can see on the top part of the screen here, 01:57:43.460 --> 01:57:46.859 a colored elevation of what the building would look like. 01:57:46.859 --> 01:57:50.260 The proposed materials are fiber cement panel, glass, 01:57:50.260 --> 01:57:53.079 and then an architectural grade aluminum panel. 01:57:53.079 --> 01:57:56.100 The PD permits a wide variety of materials, 01:57:56.100 --> 01:57:59.300 glass, stones, stucco, tile, concrete, wood, 01:57:59.300 --> 01:58:02.899 and then it has a clause for other similar materials. 01:58:02.899 --> 01:58:05.020 Because building materials are consistently changing, 01:58:05.020 --> 01:58:08.239 so it wanted to allow for those other options. 01:58:08.239 --> 01:58:11.140 The total building height is approximately 30 feet 01:58:11.140 --> 01:58:13.420 at that tower that you see there 01:58:13.420 --> 01:58:16.079 on the left side of the screen. 01:58:17.020 --> 01:58:19.140 So just looking at this from the other sides 01:58:19.140 --> 01:58:21.699 of the building, you see kind of a similar modern theme 01:58:21.699 --> 01:58:23.859 throughout the architecture on the building. 01:58:25.699 --> 01:58:28.539 The other piece to this is their landscaping plan. 01:58:28.539 --> 01:58:31.420 The PD, as I mentioned, was first created in '99, 01:58:31.420 --> 01:58:34.619 and at that time, it stated in the regulations for the PD 01:58:34.619 --> 01:58:37.460 that landscaping of this site would follow the code 01:58:37.460 --> 01:58:39.819 that was in place at the time of PD adoption, 01:58:39.819 --> 01:58:42.899 which was a 1998 landscape code. 01:58:42.899 --> 01:58:45.579 Landscaping under that code was based just roughly 01:58:45.579 --> 01:58:47.420 on the size of the property being developed. 01:58:47.420 --> 01:58:48.779 So based on a number of square footage, 01:58:48.779 --> 01:58:51.060 you had to have so many trees and shrubs. 01:58:51.060 --> 01:58:54.460 The result was that the site required 27 new trees 01:58:54.460 --> 01:58:56.899 to be planted and 33 shrubs. 01:58:56.899 --> 01:58:59.140 So those are all shown here on the plan. 01:58:59.140 --> 01:59:01.819 Overall, their site design allows 01:59:01.819 --> 01:59:04.020 for 39% landscaping on the site. 01:59:05.060 --> 01:59:08.500 They are preserving in the area shown in dark green 01:59:08.500 --> 01:59:11.020 an existing line of trees that's there along the fence line 01:59:11.020 --> 01:59:13.229 that's shared with those residential properties to the 01:59:13.229 --> 01:59:14.119 south. 01:59:14.119 --> 01:59:17.180 The PD requires a six-foot masonry wall be provided 01:59:17.180 --> 01:59:18.859 on that side of the property. 01:59:18.859 --> 01:59:20.739 The wall in this case is proposed 01:59:20.739 --> 01:59:21.960 just north of those trees. 01:59:21.960 --> 01:59:24.079 They didn't wanna have to remove any trees 01:59:24.079 --> 01:59:26.470 to put in the wall, so they scooted it further into the 01:59:26.470 --> 01:59:26.899 site. 01:59:26.899 --> 01:59:28.479 And then in the light green color, 01:59:28.479 --> 01:59:29.939 you can see where they're proposing 01:59:29.939 --> 01:59:31.060 new plantings on the site. 01:59:31.060 --> 01:59:32.859 So a few of those would be added 01:59:32.859 --> 01:59:35.100 to that buffer area to enhance the screening. 01:59:37.119 --> 01:59:39.720 So per the 1991 development code, 01:59:39.720 --> 01:59:41.500 there were a few criteria to be examined 01:59:41.500 --> 01:59:43.739 when a detail plan is proposed. 01:59:43.739 --> 01:59:45.859 The first of those is that it complies 01:59:45.859 --> 01:59:47.579 with the general concept plan 01:59:47.579 --> 01:59:50.640 and approved development standards for the property. 01:59:50.640 --> 01:59:52.899 Here on the screen, you can see that concept plan 01:59:52.899 --> 01:59:55.060 that was adopted in 1999. 01:59:55.060 --> 01:59:57.420 This property is part of this red track 01:59:57.420 --> 02:00:01.060 that was labeled for commercial development. 02:00:01.060 --> 02:00:04.880 So the use and the plan that we see here is in conformance 02:00:04.880 --> 02:00:06.939 with this being a commercial development. 02:00:08.100 --> 02:00:10.760 Some of the other criteria were that the plan provide 02:00:10.760 --> 02:00:13.819 for adequate and safe circulation of vehicular traffic. 02:00:13.819 --> 02:00:15.720 As you can see, they're limiting the driveways there 02:00:15.720 --> 02:00:17.859 to just the one on 2499, 02:00:17.859 --> 02:00:19.579 so one way in and out of the property. 02:00:19.579 --> 02:00:21.180 And then, you know, just kind of that one way 02:00:21.180 --> 02:00:23.140 of circular pattern around the site 02:00:23.140 --> 02:00:25.939 to control how traffic flows through there. 02:00:25.939 --> 02:00:28.140 One of the other criteria was that the plan 02:00:28.140 --> 02:00:30.340 be in substantial compliance with landscaping, 02:00:30.340 --> 02:00:33.500 sign, subdivision, and other regulations of the city, 02:00:33.500 --> 02:00:36.060 or that it offers some corresponding benefit 02:00:36.060 --> 02:00:39.180 for things if it proposes a deviation. 02:00:39.180 --> 02:00:41.300 This detail plan is in substantial conformance 02:00:41.300 --> 02:00:42.899 with the regulations of the PD 02:00:42.899 --> 02:00:44.760 and the city's current requirements. 02:00:46.779 --> 02:00:49.460 Notifications were sent about this request. 02:00:49.460 --> 02:00:53.500 As of this meeting, we had received five in opposition, 02:00:53.500 --> 02:00:55.460 four of those you see outlined here on the map 02:00:55.460 --> 02:00:59.000 that fell within that 200-foot notification ring. 02:00:59.000 --> 02:01:01.020 One of those was received from a property owner 02:01:01.020 --> 02:01:03.420 that's just off the scale of this map here 02:01:03.420 --> 02:01:04.819 further to the west. 02:01:04.819 --> 02:01:07.020 And then we received one response in favor, 02:01:07.020 --> 02:01:08.100 which was from a representative 02:01:08.100 --> 02:01:09.899 of the property's current ownership. 02:01:12.260 --> 02:01:15.159 And staff is recommending approval of this request. 02:01:15.159 --> 02:01:18.899 We found that it complied with those criteria for approval. 02:01:18.899 --> 02:01:21.739 With the following conditions to allow for some things 02:01:21.739 --> 02:01:24.539 that weren't specified in the PD regulations. 02:01:24.539 --> 02:01:27.539 Our first criteria would be that no exterior lighting 02:01:27.539 --> 02:01:30.539 face the single-family residential uses surrounding this, 02:01:30.539 --> 02:01:33.140 or if such lighting is proposed that it be screened 02:01:33.140 --> 02:01:35.439 from the view of those adjoining residences. 02:01:35.439 --> 02:01:37.420 Along with that, a photometric plan 02:01:37.420 --> 02:01:39.300 shall be provided at the time of building permit 02:01:39.300 --> 02:01:39.979 application 02:01:39.979 --> 02:01:42.800 to demonstrate compliance with the Denton Development Code 02:01:42.800 --> 02:01:46.279 site lighting requirements in section 3513.12 of the code. 02:01:47.420 --> 02:01:50.500 Our second recommendation or criteria is that 02:01:50.500 --> 02:01:52.100 due to the proximity of the location 02:01:52.100 --> 02:01:53.979 to single-family residences 02:01:53.979 --> 02:01:57.819 and the fact that the majority of this PD is residential, 02:01:57.819 --> 02:01:59.979 there is a lack of signage requirements in the PD. 02:01:59.979 --> 02:02:02.180 So we feel it appropriate that the project comply 02:02:02.180 --> 02:02:05.060 with the current code of ordinances sign requirements 02:02:05.060 --> 02:02:07.420 for non-residential zoning districts, 02:02:07.420 --> 02:02:09.619 as well as comply with the following limitation 02:02:09.619 --> 02:02:12.239 that no illuminated wall signs directly face 02:02:12.239 --> 02:02:14.260 any adjoining single-family use. 02:02:15.140 --> 02:02:17.939 And with that, I'd be happy to stand for any questions. 02:02:20.699 --> 02:02:21.800 - Commissioner Bec. 02:02:21.800 --> 02:02:22.659 - Thank you, Chair. 02:02:22.659 --> 02:02:25.819 Haley, bring your site plan back up, would you? 02:02:27.739 --> 02:02:28.579 Now the means of-- 02:02:28.579 --> 02:02:29.779 - Oh, this one or the other? 02:02:29.779 --> 02:02:30.619 - That one. 02:02:30.619 --> 02:02:34.380 The means of ingress and egress is just that one area, 02:02:34.380 --> 02:02:34.739 right? 02:02:34.739 --> 02:02:38.060 Is there any recessed area off 2499 02:02:38.060 --> 02:02:41.739 as it approaches that entrance, or is the traffic, 02:02:41.739 --> 02:02:43.439 'cause that's three lanes in that, 02:02:43.439 --> 02:02:45.340 the traffic that's gonna pull in there 02:02:45.340 --> 02:02:47.300 is gonna pull out of that far right-hand lane, 02:02:47.300 --> 02:02:48.119 is that right? 02:02:48.119 --> 02:02:50.939 There's no recessed area? 02:02:50.939 --> 02:02:52.659 - I don't believe so, not at this time. 02:02:52.659 --> 02:02:53.500 - Okay. 02:02:54.380 --> 02:02:56.180 Okay, if the applicant's here, 02:02:56.180 --> 02:02:57.579 I can talk to him about that. 02:02:57.579 --> 02:02:59.659 Okay, thank you. - Yeah, the applicant is here. 02:02:59.659 --> 02:03:01.539 I can address maybe more specifically that question. 02:03:01.539 --> 02:03:02.539 - Talk to him about it. 02:03:02.539 --> 02:03:03.380 Thank you. 02:03:03.380 --> 02:03:04.659 - Okay, another question. 02:03:04.659 --> 02:03:06.260 Commissioner Ellis. 02:03:06.260 --> 02:03:07.100 - Thank you, Chair. 02:03:07.100 --> 02:03:09.699 Haley, what are the sign requirements 02:03:09.699 --> 02:03:12.060 for non-residential districts that you mentioned? 02:03:12.060 --> 02:03:13.300 What does that mean? 02:03:13.300 --> 02:03:15.220 - There are several specifics outlined 02:03:15.220 --> 02:03:16.140 in the Code of Ordinances. 02:03:16.140 --> 02:03:19.279 It provides for setbacks between one and 200 feet 02:03:19.279 --> 02:03:21.020 from residential properties, 02:03:21.020 --> 02:03:23.739 depending on the type of sign that's proposed. 02:03:23.739 --> 02:03:25.979 There are some height restrictions. 02:03:27.220 --> 02:03:28.460 I can't quote them off the top of my head. 02:03:28.460 --> 02:03:29.899 I'd be happy to look them up, 02:03:29.899 --> 02:03:31.180 but there are height limitations 02:03:31.180 --> 02:03:33.600 for the different types of signs, 02:03:33.600 --> 02:03:36.460 but in general, it would be a monument or a pole sign 02:03:36.460 --> 02:03:37.779 would be allowed on the property. 02:03:37.779 --> 02:03:40.340 And I believe based on its length of frontage, 02:03:40.340 --> 02:03:43.420 it would be permitted to have one of those signs. 02:03:43.420 --> 02:03:44.260 - Mm-hmm. 02:03:46.899 --> 02:03:48.500 Any other questions for Haley? 02:03:50.220 --> 02:03:51.060 Thank you, Haley. 02:03:52.479 --> 02:03:55.579 Call on the assumed owner and applicant, 02:03:56.880 --> 02:04:01.880 Joshua Borsche, 12-821 Saratoga Downs. 02:04:05.939 --> 02:04:08.100 I don't know if I got that close or not. 02:04:08.100 --> 02:04:09.979 You're coming, so I'd close them out. 02:04:10.420 --> 02:04:11.659 - Yes. 02:04:11.659 --> 02:04:13.500 All right, good evening, everyone. 02:04:14.380 --> 02:04:15.220 I'm Joshua Borsche. 02:04:15.220 --> 02:04:16.979 I'm the current landowner. 02:04:16.979 --> 02:04:18.819 I also own the Clean and Green Car Wash 02:04:18.819 --> 02:04:23.180 that already exists in the PD 176. 02:04:23.180 --> 02:04:24.579 It's on the opposite corner. 02:04:25.539 --> 02:04:27.100 We've been there five years. 02:04:27.100 --> 02:04:29.300 We're proud to say that we try and run 02:04:29.300 --> 02:04:30.859 a clean and tidy business. 02:04:30.859 --> 02:04:33.979 We've been very respectful of all of our neighbors 02:04:33.979 --> 02:04:37.600 and try and support the local community as much as we can. 02:04:38.539 --> 02:04:41.300 On that front, that was a first business. 02:04:41.300 --> 02:04:42.420 This would be a second business, 02:04:42.420 --> 02:04:44.180 solely owned by my wife and two children. 02:04:44.180 --> 02:04:48.060 So this is our family's business. 02:04:50.300 --> 02:04:52.340 Obviously happy to answer any questions. 02:04:52.340 --> 02:04:53.939 Wanted to address just a couple things 02:04:53.939 --> 02:04:57.000 and maybe some of your traffic as well. 02:04:58.500 --> 02:05:01.060 Since 2499 is a text dot road, 02:05:03.340 --> 02:05:04.600 we do have approval from them. 02:05:04.600 --> 02:05:08.180 We do have an existing permit to add a left turn lane 02:05:08.180 --> 02:05:11.060 at Pine Hills Lane there. 02:05:11.060 --> 02:05:16.060 So there will be additional traffic easement 02:05:16.140 --> 02:05:19.779 well with the turn lane that will be added inside of 2499. 02:05:19.779 --> 02:05:22.180 From a right-hand turn perspective, there is not. 02:05:25.020 --> 02:05:27.380 One of the other concerns we probably heard about 02:05:27.380 --> 02:05:31.140 was possibly noise. 02:05:31.140 --> 02:05:33.899 And specifically since we do have vacuums 02:05:33.899 --> 02:05:36.420 on the south side of our property there, 02:05:36.420 --> 02:05:38.220 one thing hopefully that can ease quite a bit 02:05:38.220 --> 02:05:41.020 of those concerns in that we actually house 02:05:41.020 --> 02:05:43.699 our vacuum producers, those big electric motors 02:05:43.699 --> 02:05:45.420 with a big fan on them that make the vacuum. 02:05:45.420 --> 02:05:48.260 We house them inside the building in an insulated room 02:05:48.260 --> 02:05:50.020 and they're actually vented into the tunnel. 02:05:50.020 --> 02:05:53.180 And you can actually go to our existing facility. 02:05:53.180 --> 02:05:55.939 It's virtually quiet 24/7. 02:05:55.939 --> 02:05:58.979 So the noise isn't an issue. 02:05:58.979 --> 02:06:01.020 And any additional details are needed, 02:06:01.020 --> 02:06:04.579 don't have any problems supplying those as well. 02:06:06.500 --> 02:06:08.300 I think one of the things we're proud of too, 02:06:08.300 --> 02:06:11.899 like Haley mentioned, we're preserving those, 02:06:11.899 --> 02:06:13.539 I don't know what you would call them, heritage legacy, 02:06:13.539 --> 02:06:15.380 those oak and elm trees. 02:06:15.380 --> 02:06:17.460 I mean, they're 50 to 80 foot tall. 02:06:17.460 --> 02:06:18.300 They're huge. 02:06:18.300 --> 02:06:19.420 I'm sure the neighbors love them. 02:06:19.420 --> 02:06:21.500 So we're keeping every one of them. 02:06:22.380 --> 02:06:25.060 And then with the screening wall, 02:06:25.060 --> 02:06:29.060 it should really move the car wash out of sight. 02:06:29.060 --> 02:06:31.899 The screening wall that's required by the PD, 02:06:31.899 --> 02:06:33.659 we've got on our plans. 02:06:33.659 --> 02:06:35.819 One of the other pieces that actually adds to it 02:06:35.819 --> 02:06:37.140 is actually the grading. 02:06:37.140 --> 02:06:38.500 If you look at the open property, 02:06:38.500 --> 02:06:41.819 and my engineers here as well this evening, 02:06:41.819 --> 02:06:44.100 that property lies two to three feet higher 02:06:44.100 --> 02:06:47.260 than the residents that neighbor it. 02:06:47.260 --> 02:06:49.380 So when we do put up the screening wall, 02:06:49.380 --> 02:06:50.979 it'll, the six foot screening wall, 02:06:50.979 --> 02:06:53.779 it'll actually have an eight to nine foot working height. 02:06:56.220 --> 02:06:57.899 Up to six foot it actually is when it's viewed 02:06:57.899 --> 02:07:00.279 from the residential area. 02:07:01.659 --> 02:07:05.180 Plans, we'll employ five to 10 local residents. 02:07:05.180 --> 02:07:07.859 We'll, we're not gonna be open 24 hours 02:07:07.859 --> 02:07:09.699 like our other facility. 02:07:09.699 --> 02:07:12.659 This one will be open 7 a.m. to 9 p.m. 02:07:13.819 --> 02:07:15.340 seven days a week. 02:07:15.340 --> 02:07:18.420 So in general, that's the scope of the plan again. 02:07:18.420 --> 02:07:19.260 Thank you, Haley. 02:07:19.260 --> 02:07:20.079 You did a great job. 02:07:20.079 --> 02:07:22.779 I appreciate working with you over the last few weeks here. 02:07:25.060 --> 02:07:26.300 I think those are my opening comments. 02:07:26.300 --> 02:07:29.100 If you have any questions, I'd be happy to respond. 02:07:29.100 --> 02:07:30.699 - I have one question. 02:07:30.699 --> 02:07:34.859 We had some discussion, work session or right thereabouts 02:07:34.859 --> 02:07:38.260 about the noise and I appreciate you bringing that up. 02:07:38.260 --> 02:07:40.579 Would you be open to on the, 02:07:40.579 --> 02:07:42.619 guess what would be on your property side, 02:07:42.619 --> 02:07:44.699 raising that six foot screening wall to eight foot 02:07:44.699 --> 02:07:46.619 on that side and then whatever side height 02:07:46.619 --> 02:07:49.279 that would be maybe 10 or 11 on the other side. 02:07:49.279 --> 02:07:50.979 Would that be something you would consider? 02:07:50.979 --> 02:07:51.819 - I would be open to that, yes. 02:07:51.819 --> 02:07:52.659 - You'd be open to that? 02:07:52.659 --> 02:07:53.500 - Yep, as needed. - Okay. 02:07:53.500 --> 02:07:56.680 Thank you for addressing some of those concerns that way. 02:07:57.779 --> 02:07:58.619 Commissioner Beck. 02:07:58.619 --> 02:07:59.460 - Thank you, Chair. 02:07:59.460 --> 02:08:01.260 Thank you, Mr. Boshie for your presentation. 02:08:01.260 --> 02:08:06.260 And I agree you have done quite a lot here to make this 02:08:06.260 --> 02:08:06.260 work 02:08:07.020 --> 02:08:10.300 in an area where it backs up against residential housing. 02:08:10.300 --> 02:08:12.060 So I appreciate what you've done here. 02:08:12.060 --> 02:08:16.060 To be clear, going back to means of ingress and egress 02:08:17.060 --> 02:08:22.060 on the, I guess it'd be the southbound part of 2499. 02:08:23.619 --> 02:08:27.220 Did you consider making a little inlet part to come off 02:08:27.220 --> 02:08:28.180 that? 02:08:28.180 --> 02:08:30.359 And I don't wanna burden you with any more expense, 02:08:30.359 --> 02:08:32.659 but is that something that y'all considered 02:08:32.659 --> 02:08:35.260 and decided it wasn't worth it? 02:08:35.260 --> 02:08:40.260 - Yep, have not, with text dot and they're building the 02:08:40.260 --> 02:08:40.260 road. 02:08:41.619 --> 02:08:44.899 - Okay, so they're preventing you from doing anything? 02:08:44.899 --> 02:08:47.060 - Absolutely, and then there also is 02:08:48.140 --> 02:08:51.979 existing retaining wall there that they installed. 02:08:51.979 --> 02:08:55.260 So we'd have to have a significant engineering project 02:08:55.260 --> 02:09:00.260 to change that retaining wall. 02:09:00.340 --> 02:09:02.500 We'll say for lack of it, you'd have to move it. 02:09:02.500 --> 02:09:05.640 There is, I wanna say it's about four or five feet tall. 02:09:05.640 --> 02:09:08.420 You can see over it, but it's significant. 02:09:08.420 --> 02:09:09.260 'Cause the property is higher than that. 02:09:09.260 --> 02:09:10.100 - If you have the engineer here, 02:09:10.100 --> 02:09:11.659 if you'd like to come up and help. 02:09:11.659 --> 02:09:12.500 - Sure. 02:09:12.500 --> 02:09:14.380 - Sure, we'd be happy to entertain that as well. 02:09:14.380 --> 02:09:16.979 If you'll give us name and address. 02:09:16.979 --> 02:09:19.420 - Mickey Thomas, I'm Jay Thomas, engineering, 02:09:19.420 --> 02:09:22.939 3973 West Pickery Boulevard, Fort Worth, Texas. 02:09:22.939 --> 02:09:26.260 As far as the deceleration lane is what you were looking 02:09:26.260 --> 02:09:29.060 to describe right there, the site does not currently 02:09:29.060 --> 02:09:31.659 meet those warrants under the current text guidelines 02:09:31.659 --> 02:09:33.659 therefore it was not required under that. 02:09:36.460 --> 02:09:39.739 - But now the northbound part of 2499, 02:09:39.739 --> 02:09:42.140 there's a median in the middle right. 02:09:42.140 --> 02:09:46.779 There's no means of getting to your location from that. 02:09:46.779 --> 02:09:48.899 Is there gonna be a left turn lane there? 02:09:48.899 --> 02:09:50.739 There is, okay, that's what I thought I heard you say. 02:09:50.739 --> 02:09:53.380 - There's a continuous left. 02:09:53.380 --> 02:09:55.819 It's a left-hand turn lane at that intersection, yes sir. 02:09:55.819 --> 02:09:56.979 - Very good, thank you. 02:10:00.060 --> 02:10:01.380 - Any further questions? 02:10:01.380 --> 02:10:03.300 - Any other questions for either the owner 02:10:03.300 --> 02:10:05.300 or the engineer while we have them here? 02:10:07.220 --> 02:10:08.500 Okay, thank you sir. 02:10:10.739 --> 02:10:15.739 This is a public hearing, I've got a number of cards. 02:10:17.180 --> 02:10:20.020 And I'm gonna kinda do the same thing on some of these 02:10:20.020 --> 02:10:23.939 that I have at least that are marked, not wishing to speak. 02:10:23.939 --> 02:10:26.000 So I'll go through these first and then I'll get to the 02:10:26.000 --> 02:10:26.340 cards 02:10:26.340 --> 02:10:29.619 that I've kinda got some of them a mix wishing and not to 02:10:29.619 --> 02:10:33.060 and we'll try to get our way through those as well. 02:10:33.060 --> 02:10:37.779 So the first card I have is Otto Hanneman, 02:10:37.779 --> 02:10:42.779 65, Corrid Lane, and he's in opposition 02:10:43.020 --> 02:10:44.420 and did not wish to speak. 02:10:45.779 --> 02:10:49.180 - I reserve that, I wanna hear what my neighbors say. 02:10:49.180 --> 02:10:51.699 If they say what I wanna say, I'm not gonna bug you, 02:10:51.699 --> 02:10:53.539 but I'll see what they say. 02:10:54.579 --> 02:10:55.420 - No more. 02:10:57.300 --> 02:10:58.939 (audience laughing) 02:10:58.939 --> 02:11:01.699 - How about I move you to the back of the card 02:11:01.699 --> 02:11:03.060 and we'll kinda go there. 02:11:04.180 --> 02:11:05.979 Then I have Rose Brandt. 02:11:07.899 --> 02:11:09.100 You do wish to speak? 02:11:09.100 --> 02:11:13.140 Okay, please come forward, give us your name and address 02:11:13.140 --> 02:11:15.380 and I have your card marked as in opposition. 02:11:16.300 --> 02:11:18.020 - Thank you, my name is Rose Brandt, 02:11:18.020 --> 02:11:22.140 I live at 6600 Haling Way in Denton. 02:11:22.939 --> 02:11:27.220 My backyard, my sanctuary is gonna overlook 02:11:27.220 --> 02:11:31.560 that 30 foot tower that's elevated higher than my houses. 02:11:33.020 --> 02:11:35.100 You may not have lights in it, 02:11:35.100 --> 02:11:39.199 but I don't pay taxes to look into a car wash. 02:11:39.199 --> 02:11:40.779 That's number one. 02:11:40.779 --> 02:11:42.899 What are you gonna do for the drainage? 02:11:42.899 --> 02:11:45.180 What are you gonna do for the rats and the bugs 02:11:45.180 --> 02:11:47.979 that develop from that area? 02:11:47.979 --> 02:11:51.000 This is a residential area. 02:11:51.000 --> 02:11:53.500 Most of us bought properties in that area 02:11:53.500 --> 02:11:56.000 with the false assumption that it was a dead end. 02:11:57.319 --> 02:12:01.180 Your turn lane is going to go right into, 02:12:01.180 --> 02:12:04.659 what is that, Nolan, what's the name of that street 02:12:04.659 --> 02:12:06.380 you live on? - Pine Hills. 02:12:06.380 --> 02:12:09.659 - Pine Hills, it's gonna be right on Pine Hills 02:12:09.659 --> 02:12:12.659 and there's a swimming pool for the community 02:12:12.659 --> 02:12:15.600 about a block and a half, two blocks down. 02:12:15.600 --> 02:12:17.699 Right now that is a speed zone. 02:12:17.699 --> 02:12:20.319 We've asked for speed bumps and have been denied. 02:12:21.619 --> 02:12:23.380 So you and the planning commission, 02:12:23.380 --> 02:12:25.380 what are you gonna do for the residents 02:12:25.380 --> 02:12:26.819 of this neighborhood? 02:12:26.819 --> 02:12:30.699 We have seen a slow and steady decline since 2000. 02:12:35.220 --> 02:12:39.020 It's gonna be opened from seven to nine p.m. 02:12:39.020 --> 02:12:41.800 There are children sleeping in this neighborhood. 02:12:41.800 --> 02:12:44.539 You're gonna tell me that there's no noise level? 02:12:44.539 --> 02:12:48.539 That wonderful sound barrier that TechStalk put up 02:12:48.539 --> 02:12:50.520 is an echo chamber. 02:12:50.520 --> 02:12:54.300 I have to go out and buy other equipment 02:12:54.300 --> 02:12:57.340 to deaden the noise that comes off of that highway. 02:12:58.220 --> 02:13:02.180 There's a fan running in my house 24/7 now. 02:13:02.180 --> 02:13:05.420 Am I gonna have more noise because of that? 02:13:05.420 --> 02:13:08.060 Put office buildings, do something else 02:13:08.060 --> 02:13:09.539 besides put that in there. 02:13:09.539 --> 02:13:12.020 That is not fair to the community 02:13:12.020 --> 02:13:15.500 and to the people that pay higher taxes this year 02:13:15.500 --> 02:13:16.899 than they did last year. 02:13:18.260 --> 02:13:21.140 I thank you for your consideration. 02:13:21.140 --> 02:13:23.100 - Thank you for coming out this evening. 02:13:27.180 --> 02:13:28.020 The next. 02:13:28.020 --> 02:13:29.420 - I had a question for him. 02:13:29.420 --> 02:13:30.260 - I'm sorry. 02:13:30.260 --> 02:13:31.659 - Commissioner Sanchez. 02:13:31.659 --> 02:13:33.220 - Rose, I have a question for you. 02:13:33.220 --> 02:13:34.060 - Yes. 02:13:34.060 --> 02:13:34.880 - You want. 02:13:34.880 --> 02:13:36.659 - If you'll come please back up to the mic. 02:13:40.300 --> 02:13:42.340 - You said the neighborhood was in decline. 02:13:42.340 --> 02:13:43.180 What do you mean? 02:13:43.180 --> 02:13:44.739 You said the neighborhood was in decline? 02:13:44.739 --> 02:13:45.579 - Yes it is. 02:13:45.579 --> 02:13:46.739 - Based on what? 02:13:46.739 --> 02:13:48.460 - They put that road up. 02:13:48.460 --> 02:13:50.979 There are people zooming in and out 02:13:50.979 --> 02:13:52.619 of Pine Hills continuously. 02:13:52.619 --> 02:13:56.859 It is a drag strip going from 35 through there. 02:13:56.859 --> 02:13:58.939 People take that as a shortcut. 02:13:58.939 --> 02:14:02.300 There are children that I watch them out of my kitchen 02:14:02.300 --> 02:14:02.779 window 02:14:02.779 --> 02:14:04.779 and I wanna run out there and grab them 02:14:04.779 --> 02:14:06.420 to get them off the street. 02:14:06.420 --> 02:14:09.899 There are more houses being for rent than for sale. 02:14:11.720 --> 02:14:12.899 It's just declined. 02:14:14.100 --> 02:14:15.359 - Okay, thank you. 02:14:16.739 --> 02:14:19.079 (murmuring) 02:14:25.539 --> 02:14:28.859 - The next card I have is Shannon Garza 02:14:28.859 --> 02:14:33.430 at 6545 Pine Hills Lane in opposition, not wishing to speak 02:14:33.430 --> 02:14:33.619 . 02:14:37.060 --> 02:14:38.500 - Would you like to speak? 02:14:38.500 --> 02:14:41.199 Okay, please come forward and give us your name and address 02:14:41.199 --> 02:14:41.500 . 02:14:45.340 --> 02:14:50.020 - So Shannon Garza at 6545 Pine Hills Lane. 02:14:50.020 --> 02:14:55.020 And so I live three houses in from 2499 on Pine Hills. 02:14:56.300 --> 02:14:59.539 And so my house is a drag strip now. 02:14:59.539 --> 02:15:01.899 So not only do I have a highway behind my house 02:15:01.899 --> 02:15:04.779 where they tore down every tree in the 30 foot easement 02:15:04.779 --> 02:15:05.960 that they were supposed to keep, 02:15:05.960 --> 02:15:07.699 that they told me they were gonna do when I bought the 02:15:07.699 --> 02:15:08.140 house. 02:15:08.140 --> 02:15:10.420 And I have small children. 02:15:10.420 --> 02:15:12.460 There are small children on Hailing Way. 02:15:12.460 --> 02:15:14.979 My kids' friends can't come down to my house 02:15:14.979 --> 02:15:16.460 because they can't cross the street 02:15:16.460 --> 02:15:17.979 from Hailing Way to my house 02:15:17.979 --> 02:15:20.300 because people park on the street. 02:15:20.300 --> 02:15:23.020 And so you can't see around 02:15:23.020 --> 02:15:25.060 to make sure no car is coming either way, 02:15:25.060 --> 02:15:26.340 which is not your problem. 02:15:26.340 --> 02:15:31.220 But when people turn right or left off of 2499 onto my 02:15:31.220 --> 02:15:31.340 street, 02:15:32.340 --> 02:15:33.819 they're going so fast 02:15:33.819 --> 02:15:36.739 because there's no speed limit signs on 2499 yet. 02:15:36.739 --> 02:15:40.260 They're going anywhere between 45 and 55 miles an hour. 02:15:40.260 --> 02:15:41.739 And they turn down Pine Hills, 02:15:41.739 --> 02:15:44.060 still going 45, 55 miles an hour. 02:15:44.060 --> 02:15:46.260 And they have no way to stop. 02:15:46.260 --> 02:15:50.060 And so now we're gonna have the proposed driveway 02:15:50.060 --> 02:15:53.720 coming in and out of the car wash with additional traffic. 02:15:53.720 --> 02:15:58.720 Already you have accidents at the Kroger Hickory Creek 02:15:58.899 --> 02:16:01.300 in 2499 and you guys have blocked off, 02:16:01.300 --> 02:16:03.539 or not you, but they blocked off the right turn lane 02:16:03.539 --> 02:16:05.260 because people can't see. 02:16:05.260 --> 02:16:07.020 So now you're gonna be turning left or right 02:16:07.020 --> 02:16:10.260 out of the car wash with cars coming at you. 02:16:10.260 --> 02:16:14.380 And so, and I don't wanna walk out of my house 02:16:14.380 --> 02:16:16.659 and look to my right where used to be pretty trees 02:16:16.659 --> 02:16:18.939 and grass and see a building. 02:16:18.939 --> 02:16:19.899 That's all I have to say. 02:16:19.899 --> 02:16:20.819 Thank you. 02:16:20.819 --> 02:16:21.939 - I have a question for you. 02:16:21.939 --> 02:16:22.760 - Yes, sir. 02:16:22.760 --> 02:16:23.600 - Commissioner Beck. 02:16:23.600 --> 02:16:24.439 - Thank you, Chair. 02:16:24.439 --> 02:16:25.939 Thank you, Ms. Garza for speaking. 02:16:25.939 --> 02:16:28.300 We appreciate everybody coming in and speaking on this. 02:16:28.300 --> 02:16:29.140 Let me ask you this. 02:16:29.140 --> 02:16:30.880 I noticed that there wasn't a, 02:16:30.880 --> 02:16:33.700 that the applicant didn't have a neighborhood meeting, 02:16:33.700 --> 02:16:34.540 which is disappointing. 02:16:34.540 --> 02:16:35.979 We always like to encourage that 02:16:35.979 --> 02:16:38.459 when a business comes in in close proximity. 02:16:39.379 --> 02:16:41.180 Are you hearing some things tonight 02:16:41.180 --> 02:16:43.059 that you haven't heard before 02:16:43.059 --> 02:16:47.100 that eases your mind a little bit about this development? 02:16:47.100 --> 02:16:49.979 The fact that they're putting these buffers up? 02:16:49.979 --> 02:16:50.979 - But those buffers, I think, 02:16:50.979 --> 02:16:53.219 are gonna be on the opposite side. 02:16:53.219 --> 02:16:56.899 My side is the Oakmont side and not Wheeler Ridge. 02:16:56.899 --> 02:17:01.899 And so, the in and out are gonna be in front of my house. 02:17:01.899 --> 02:17:05.059 And so, I mean, I see the left turn lane, 02:17:05.059 --> 02:17:08.500 but that's only helping people turn into the car wash. 02:17:08.500 --> 02:17:10.500 So, it's gonna increase traffic there, 02:17:10.500 --> 02:17:12.219 and I'm gonna have to look at it. 02:17:12.219 --> 02:17:13.920 I don't wanna look at a 30-foot building. 02:17:13.920 --> 02:17:14.860 When I bought the house, 02:17:14.860 --> 02:17:17.379 I was told they were gonna keep some of the trees. 02:17:17.379 --> 02:17:20.299 So, can't fix that problem, but. 02:17:20.299 --> 02:17:21.459 - I guess what I was trying to express, 02:17:21.459 --> 02:17:23.299 and anybody else that comes down and speak, 02:17:23.299 --> 02:17:24.459 if you can address that, 02:17:24.459 --> 02:17:26.739 that had there been a neighborhood meeting 02:17:26.739 --> 02:17:29.739 where you could have confronted the applicant on this 02:17:29.739 --> 02:17:31.299 and addressed your concerns, 02:17:31.299 --> 02:17:35.780 do you feel like this would have helped you in some way, 02:17:35.780 --> 02:17:38.379 in some respect, and better understand? 02:17:39.379 --> 02:17:41.100 - I don't, I may be wrong. 02:17:41.100 --> 02:17:44.180 I don't know that we had an HOA or neighborhood meeting. 02:17:44.180 --> 02:17:45.540 I think-- - No, no, you didn't. 02:17:45.540 --> 02:17:46.379 That's what I'm saying. - Right. 02:17:46.379 --> 02:17:47.979 - Had there been one scheduled, 02:17:47.979 --> 02:17:49.500 you would have gotten, you should have gotten 02:17:49.500 --> 02:17:50.700 notification from the NPU. - Probably. 02:17:50.700 --> 02:17:53.219 I don't think our new HOA board people, 02:17:54.739 --> 02:17:56.100 I won't say any more about that. - Pursued that too much? 02:17:56.100 --> 02:17:57.459 Okay, okay. - Yes, sir. 02:17:57.459 --> 02:17:58.899 - All right, thank you. - Yes, sir. 02:17:58.899 --> 02:18:00.239 - One more question. - Yes, sir. 02:18:00.239 --> 02:18:01.620 - Commissioner Sanchez. 02:18:01.620 --> 02:18:04.040 - Yes, when you bought the house, 02:18:04.040 --> 02:18:05.940 were you aware that there was a commercial piece 02:18:05.940 --> 02:18:07.379 of property there? 02:18:07.379 --> 02:18:08.540 - No, I wasn't aware of that. 02:18:08.540 --> 02:18:11.260 When I was there, it was all green space. 02:18:11.260 --> 02:18:14.840 My realtor told me, yes, they're gonna put 2499 back there, 02:18:14.840 --> 02:18:17.899 but where your house is, 'cause we're kinda at the curb, 02:18:17.899 --> 02:18:21.420 you'll have 30 feet before there's the road, 02:18:21.420 --> 02:18:24.819 and that should still be left green the way that it was. 02:18:24.819 --> 02:18:26.819 And of course it didn't. - And who told you this? 02:18:26.819 --> 02:18:27.940 - My realtor. 02:18:27.940 --> 02:18:28.979 So it's not your fault. 02:18:28.979 --> 02:18:29.819 Yeah, my realtor told me that. 02:18:29.819 --> 02:18:31.219 - Okay, and I'm just saying this. 02:18:31.219 --> 02:18:32.500 - Right. - Part of it is 02:18:32.500 --> 02:18:33.940 when there's open space like that. 02:18:33.940 --> 02:18:35.299 - Yes. - It's open to you, 02:18:35.299 --> 02:18:37.340 especially if it's commercial. 02:18:37.340 --> 02:18:38.219 - Well, it wasn't open then. 02:18:38.219 --> 02:18:39.379 It was trees. - Yeah, well. 02:18:39.379 --> 02:18:40.459 - So I couldn't even see that. 02:18:40.459 --> 02:18:41.700 It looked like nice forest to me, 02:18:41.700 --> 02:18:43.500 and there were birds and all kinds of stuff. 02:18:43.500 --> 02:18:45.340 But I will agree with my neighbor 02:18:45.340 --> 02:18:48.620 that there are more houses for rent or lease 02:18:48.620 --> 02:18:50.899 than you can count. 02:18:50.899 --> 02:18:53.620 And so, especially one-story houses, 02:18:54.860 --> 02:18:57.479 real estate people are buying them and renting them out 02:18:57.479 --> 02:19:00.180 because of what's going on right now. 02:19:02.379 --> 02:19:03.780 - Thank you. - Yes, sir. 02:19:03.780 --> 02:19:04.700 - Well, we'll see no other questions. 02:19:04.700 --> 02:19:05.940 Thank you for coming out this evening. 02:19:05.940 --> 02:19:06.940 - Yes, sir, thank you. 02:19:09.420 --> 02:19:12.260 - The next card I have is Jonathan Acker, 02:19:12.260 --> 02:19:15.340 6325 Thorough Red Trail. 02:19:15.340 --> 02:19:17.340 In opposition, do not wish to speak. 02:19:18.700 --> 02:19:19.540 Okay. 02:19:21.700 --> 02:19:26.700 Next card I have is Gina Lomlin, I believe, 02:19:27.139 --> 02:19:29.760 6020 English Manor Road. 02:19:31.239 --> 02:19:33.540 In opposition, do not wish to speak. 02:19:34.540 --> 02:19:35.459 Correct, okay. 02:19:37.780 --> 02:19:40.940 And then these are cards that are currently shown 02:19:40.940 --> 02:19:42.020 wishing to speak. 02:19:42.899 --> 02:19:47.059 First card I have is Stephen Shannon, in support, 02:19:47.059 --> 02:19:47.899 wishing to speak. 02:19:54.420 --> 02:19:58.680 - Stephen Shannon, 319 West Oak, here in Denton. 02:19:58.680 --> 02:20:00.739 We are the property owner immediately 02:20:00.739 --> 02:20:02.700 to the north of the car wash, 02:20:02.700 --> 02:20:06.139 and we are in support of what Josh is doing. 02:20:06.139 --> 02:20:08.420 It conforms with the PD. 02:20:08.420 --> 02:20:10.260 Seems to me that he's made every attempt 02:20:10.260 --> 02:20:13.340 to make it a compatible use. 02:20:13.340 --> 02:20:15.540 It's already compatible use by right and by law, 02:20:15.540 --> 02:20:19.979 but just to be compatible with the neighborhood 02:20:19.979 --> 02:20:21.620 and the request of the neighborhood. 02:20:22.979 --> 02:20:25.340 The PD's been around since '99. 02:20:25.340 --> 02:20:27.139 It's been in effect for a long time. 02:20:28.700 --> 02:20:31.139 The rules of what could happen with that property 02:20:31.139 --> 02:20:33.100 have been established at that point, 02:20:33.100 --> 02:20:35.340 at the beginning of Wheelridge development. 02:20:35.340 --> 02:20:37.579 So we're in support of it. 02:20:37.579 --> 02:20:40.659 We feel that it's a good use. 02:20:40.659 --> 02:20:43.979 One thing I know you'd mentioned about the D-cell lane 02:20:43.979 --> 02:20:47.459 and the turn lane, in order to get our TxDOT permit, 02:20:47.459 --> 02:20:49.340 we're part of that as well. 02:20:50.459 --> 02:20:53.059 The city commented and TxDOT commented 02:20:53.059 --> 02:20:54.399 before we could get our permit. 02:20:54.399 --> 02:20:56.379 So it was per all of the requirements 02:20:56.379 --> 02:20:57.700 from the city and TxDOT. 02:21:00.739 --> 02:21:01.940 Anyway, we're in support of it. 02:21:01.940 --> 02:21:02.780 We think it's good use. 02:21:02.780 --> 02:21:04.739 We think it's compatible with what goes there 02:21:04.739 --> 02:21:06.899 and compliance with the PD. 02:21:06.899 --> 02:21:08.819 - Okay, I don't see any questions. 02:21:08.819 --> 02:21:10.860 Thank you, sir, for coming out this evening. 02:21:12.500 --> 02:21:17.500 Next card I have is David Furr in opposition. 02:21:17.700 --> 02:21:18.579 Wishing to speak. 02:21:23.600 --> 02:21:26.219 To be followed by Kim Hurst. 02:21:29.260 --> 02:21:33.000 - David Furr, 6500 Longleaf Lane in Denton. 02:21:35.659 --> 02:21:37.299 I'll start off by saying one of the things 02:21:37.299 --> 02:21:39.239 that did put my mind at ease. 02:21:39.239 --> 02:21:43.180 No, we did not have a community meeting. 02:21:43.180 --> 02:21:47.379 We got the notice like a week ago that this was planned. 02:21:47.379 --> 02:21:49.620 So this just was like out of the blue. 02:21:49.620 --> 02:21:50.879 We had no clue. 02:21:52.040 --> 02:21:57.040 My house faces where they're proposing to build this thing 02:21:58.700 --> 02:22:03.579 and I don't like the idea of walking out 02:22:03.579 --> 02:22:06.020 to a 30 foot building, 02:22:06.020 --> 02:22:08.780 even with a six foot easement all the way around it. 02:22:10.020 --> 02:22:11.100 One of the things, like I said, 02:22:11.100 --> 02:22:12.940 that did put my mind at ease was that he did say 02:22:12.940 --> 02:22:16.059 that this was not gonna be a 24 hour operation, 02:22:16.059 --> 02:22:18.100 which that was another big concern of mine 02:22:18.100 --> 02:22:21.920 because I've been by the one over by 7-Eleven. 02:22:23.500 --> 02:22:25.559 The lights are on all the time. 02:22:27.100 --> 02:22:28.739 When there are people there, 02:22:28.739 --> 02:22:30.340 and there's usually a lot of people there, 02:22:30.340 --> 02:22:32.219 he does very good business, 02:22:32.219 --> 02:22:34.860 but when there are people there, it is very loud. 02:22:34.860 --> 02:22:36.420 And not just because of the vacuums, 02:22:36.420 --> 02:22:38.340 but because people like to listen to the radios 02:22:38.340 --> 02:22:41.420 when they run their vacuums and you gotta turn it up. 02:22:41.420 --> 02:22:43.299 And so you've got about 10 or 15 cars 02:22:43.299 --> 02:22:45.180 blaring about 15 different stations. 02:22:47.059 --> 02:22:51.120 The noise pollution is awful just driving through there. 02:22:56.559 --> 02:22:59.420 The traffic is a big concern of mine. 02:22:59.420 --> 02:23:02.340 24.99 just got finished. 02:23:02.340 --> 02:23:04.139 Everybody's enjoying it. 02:23:04.139 --> 02:23:06.340 Yes, there are speed problems on there, 02:23:06.340 --> 02:23:08.639 but now they're talking about building this building 02:23:08.639 --> 02:23:10.059 and creating easements. 02:23:10.059 --> 02:23:12.299 And now you're gonna close a lane down 02:23:12.299 --> 02:23:15.219 because you have to put the entrance in there. 02:23:15.219 --> 02:23:19.399 You're gonna close it all off for God only knows how long. 02:23:19.399 --> 02:23:20.979 Teasley's already torn up. 02:23:22.500 --> 02:23:24.840 So you can't just say, oh, well, go down Teasley. 02:23:24.840 --> 02:23:28.059 Well, no, Teasley's being torn up and fixed right now, 02:23:28.059 --> 02:23:30.639 which is great, but it's not done yet. 02:23:32.100 --> 02:23:34.260 I don't like the idea of, again, 02:23:34.260 --> 02:23:37.020 looking at a 30-foot building 02:23:37.020 --> 02:23:39.299 when I'm sitting upstairs in my game room 02:23:39.299 --> 02:23:42.340 and I don't see my trees out there. 02:23:42.340 --> 02:23:45.059 I completely agree with some of these people 02:23:45.059 --> 02:23:48.020 to where it's like I enjoy my trees and my sanctuary 02:23:48.020 --> 02:23:50.639 and it's nice to look at nature. 02:23:50.639 --> 02:23:52.659 I moved into a neighborhood to live in a neighborhood, 02:23:52.659 --> 02:23:57.379 not to live in a neighborhood with a commercial district 02:23:57.379 --> 02:23:58.360 right next door to me 02:23:58.360 --> 02:24:00.860 to where I had to look at stores and businesses. 02:24:02.139 --> 02:24:03.979 But that's all I've got. 02:24:03.979 --> 02:24:05.579 - Thank you, sir, for coming out this evening. 02:24:05.579 --> 02:24:06.579 I do have a question. 02:24:06.579 --> 02:24:07.540 Commissioner Sanchez. 02:24:07.540 --> 02:24:12.540 - Yes, 2499 is pretty much, okay, it's very busy road. 02:24:14.739 --> 02:24:19.299 So along these roads, normally they put commercial 02:24:19.299 --> 02:24:19.739 businesses. 02:24:21.819 --> 02:24:24.780 - Yes, but this is a commercial business within, 02:24:24.780 --> 02:24:27.340 you've got a neighborhood on either side of this road. 02:24:27.340 --> 02:24:28.420 And yeah, this is a road 02:24:28.420 --> 02:24:30.059 that's running through a neighborhood, 02:24:30.059 --> 02:24:32.059 but you've got one spot, 02:24:32.059 --> 02:24:34.299 well, two spots of land right there 02:24:34.299 --> 02:24:37.659 that you're gonna open for a commercial business. 02:24:37.659 --> 02:24:40.420 So I mean, it's almost like what sense does that make? 02:24:44.700 --> 02:24:47.379 You got a neighborhood here, a neighborhood here, 02:24:47.379 --> 02:24:48.639 but right in the middle of everything, 02:24:48.639 --> 02:24:51.559 we've got two businesses. 02:24:52.299 --> 02:24:53.659 - Do you have any recommendations 02:24:53.659 --> 02:24:55.420 to what to do with those lots? 02:24:55.420 --> 02:24:57.780 I mean, those commercial properties? 02:24:57.780 --> 02:24:58.899 - Commercial properties? 02:24:58.899 --> 02:25:00.260 - Yeah, I mean, they already exist 02:25:00.260 --> 02:25:04.860 and they've been there since PD was created. 02:25:04.860 --> 02:25:07.100 So what would be your recommendation? 02:25:07.100 --> 02:25:08.659 - My recommendation would be 02:25:09.620 --> 02:25:12.399 let the city buy it back and build a park there. 02:25:14.100 --> 02:25:15.299 Put a park there. 02:25:18.420 --> 02:25:21.020 But I mean, I don't know. 02:25:21.020 --> 02:25:23.379 Something that's not gonna obstruct the view 02:25:23.379 --> 02:25:27.139 and you sit here and say it's a 30-foot building, 02:25:27.139 --> 02:25:28.219 but then he just said, too, 02:25:28.219 --> 02:25:32.700 oh, well, it goes up three feet or six feet above 02:25:32.700 --> 02:25:34.579 the neighbors behind them. 02:25:34.579 --> 02:25:36.540 And yeah, that's all well and good, 02:25:36.540 --> 02:25:38.780 but that just raises the height of the building up even 02:25:38.780 --> 02:25:39.540 more. 02:25:40.559 --> 02:25:42.659 That's just something else we have to look at. 02:25:42.659 --> 02:25:45.739 (indistinct chatter) 02:25:48.340 --> 02:25:49.500 - Any other questions? 02:25:51.739 --> 02:25:53.739 Thank you, sir, for coming out this evening. 02:25:54.739 --> 02:25:56.739 As chair, I just wanna clarify something 02:25:56.739 --> 02:25:59.500 that was, I think, stated by Haley 02:25:59.500 --> 02:26:00.780 that that property by right 02:26:00.780 --> 02:26:02.780 can have a 100-foot tall building on it. 02:26:06.379 --> 02:26:07.340 - She was thinking of a different, 02:26:07.340 --> 02:26:09.780 it was the max height, it didn't get into feet. 02:26:09.780 --> 02:26:12.739 It's three, for commercial, three stories, 02:26:12.739 --> 02:26:15.100 residential, two and a half stories. 02:26:15.100 --> 02:26:17.219 - Okay, so I'm incorrect. 02:26:17.219 --> 02:26:19.379 We don't have a maximum height, 02:26:19.379 --> 02:26:22.020 then we have a stories, three stories. 02:26:22.020 --> 02:26:23.219 Okay, my mistake. 02:26:26.500 --> 02:26:30.100 Next speaker we have is Kim Hurst, 02:26:32.020 --> 02:26:33.620 wishing to speak in opposition. 02:26:39.379 --> 02:26:41.139 - Good evening, my name is Kimberly Hurst 02:26:41.139 --> 02:26:43.219 at 3301 High Point Drive. 02:26:43.219 --> 02:26:45.100 I apologize in advance 'cause you're about to drink 02:26:45.100 --> 02:26:48.180 from a fire hose so I can get this all out in time. 02:26:48.180 --> 02:26:51.819 My first issue is gonna be the decrease in property values. 02:26:51.819 --> 02:26:56.459 Having this commercial property right behind my home 02:26:56.459 --> 02:26:58.659 is gonna decrease the value of my home. 02:26:58.659 --> 02:27:01.059 We bought our home to be in a residential area 02:27:01.059 --> 02:27:02.299 because we have children. 02:27:03.379 --> 02:27:04.940 The noise that is gonna come from this, 02:27:04.940 --> 02:27:07.139 you've already heard somebody mention the echo chamber 02:27:07.139 --> 02:27:09.819 we already have from 2499. 02:27:09.819 --> 02:27:11.180 Now we're gonna have another one. 02:27:11.180 --> 02:27:15.379 So we are gonna be boxed or held in from two walls 02:27:15.379 --> 02:27:17.180 just sending these echo chambers down, 02:27:17.180 --> 02:27:20.299 which defeats the purpose of being in a residential area 02:27:20.299 --> 02:27:22.659 that's supposed to be nice and calm and quiet. 02:27:23.979 --> 02:27:27.379 This is going to increase issues in crime 02:27:27.379 --> 02:27:29.700 and having neighborhood safety. 02:27:29.700 --> 02:27:31.299 Because we are a residential area, 02:27:31.299 --> 02:27:33.780 our children are out on the weekends all weekend, 02:27:33.780 --> 02:27:37.579 which is the busiest time for a business like this. 02:27:37.579 --> 02:27:39.479 Our kids go through the green belt. 02:27:39.479 --> 02:27:42.139 They go through the utility easement that's there. 02:27:42.139 --> 02:27:44.739 There is harm that could happen to them from being there. 02:27:44.739 --> 02:27:47.100 You're also gonna have people that go to these businesses 02:27:47.100 --> 02:27:48.700 and it can take up to two hours 02:27:48.700 --> 02:27:51.319 to get the full service of these. 02:27:51.319 --> 02:27:52.940 What do they do when they get bored? 02:27:52.940 --> 02:27:54.260 They start walking. 02:27:54.260 --> 02:27:56.579 They're either gonna be walking in our neighborhood 02:27:56.579 --> 02:27:59.639 or on the other side of 2499 in that neighborhood, 02:27:59.639 --> 02:28:00.940 but most likely they're gonna be walking 02:28:00.940 --> 02:28:03.059 through our utility easement to get to the shops 02:28:03.059 --> 02:28:05.500 on Teasley and Hickory Creek Road, 02:28:05.500 --> 02:28:06.819 which is right behind my property. 02:28:06.819 --> 02:28:09.440 That is gonna increase the trash that people leave 02:28:09.440 --> 02:28:11.780 back there, that is gonna increase the traffic 02:28:11.780 --> 02:28:12.879 that we have back there. 02:28:12.879 --> 02:28:14.520 It could increase the crime that we have 02:28:14.520 --> 02:28:15.780 because they are gonna spot things 02:28:15.780 --> 02:28:17.620 that we have in our neighborhoods 02:28:17.620 --> 02:28:21.079 that could then turn around and start having more break-ins 02:28:21.079 --> 02:28:21.299 . 02:28:25.620 --> 02:28:28.219 With this being strictly residential, 02:28:28.219 --> 02:28:30.420 there are other options that could be there. 02:28:30.420 --> 02:28:32.239 Right now we have multiple car washes 02:28:32.239 --> 02:28:33.340 within a five mile radius. 02:28:33.340 --> 02:28:35.500 We have two full service ones already. 02:28:35.500 --> 02:28:37.780 We have one at 288 in Colorado. 02:28:37.780 --> 02:28:39.659 We have another one at Swisher and Jorall 02:28:39.659 --> 02:28:40.780 that are full service. 02:28:40.780 --> 02:28:43.860 Then we have the drive-through 24-hour versions 02:28:43.860 --> 02:28:47.459 at Robinson and Teasley as well as State School Road 35. 02:28:47.459 --> 02:28:50.780 How many car washes do we need in that small radius? 02:28:50.780 --> 02:28:52.420 There are other options. 02:28:52.420 --> 02:28:53.379 Yes, it's commercial. 02:28:53.379 --> 02:28:55.340 There could be other things, whether it be a rec center, 02:28:55.340 --> 02:28:57.620 whether it be a dog grooming company. 02:28:57.620 --> 02:29:00.139 I could care less versus something 02:29:00.139 --> 02:29:03.420 that's gonna be 30 foot tall, adding to the noise level, 02:29:03.420 --> 02:29:05.219 adding to the traffic levels. 02:29:05.219 --> 02:29:07.379 Ever since 2499 opened up, 02:29:07.379 --> 02:29:09.680 people use our housing division as a cut-through 02:29:09.680 --> 02:29:12.260 to avoid the construction on Teasley. 02:29:13.219 --> 02:29:15.219 We have no lights on 2499, 02:29:15.219 --> 02:29:17.319 so people are rushing through there at night. 02:29:17.319 --> 02:29:19.620 You cannot see anything. 02:29:19.620 --> 02:29:22.219 Now we're gonna add another reason to have more traffic 02:29:22.219 --> 02:29:22.340 there 02:29:22.340 --> 02:29:23.959 when we haven't even been able to address 02:29:23.959 --> 02:29:25.340 and fix the issues that we have there. 02:29:25.340 --> 02:29:26.819 We don't have speed limit signs. 02:29:26.819 --> 02:29:28.520 We do not have lights. 02:29:28.520 --> 02:29:30.819 We've got more traffic in our residential area. 02:29:30.819 --> 02:29:35.139 We bought these homes for ourselves, for our families. 02:29:35.139 --> 02:29:37.059 And my home will turn into a rental property 02:29:37.059 --> 02:29:38.420 if something like this goes through 02:29:38.420 --> 02:29:42.280 because I won't have a 30 foot tower in my backyard. 02:29:42.280 --> 02:29:44.780 Adding another wall, that just means more echo. 02:29:44.780 --> 02:29:47.219 We're already getting it from 2499. 02:29:47.219 --> 02:29:49.420 Now you're just gonna give it a double tunnel. 02:29:50.620 --> 02:29:51.860 Thank you. 02:29:51.860 --> 02:29:52.680 - Thank you. 02:29:52.680 --> 02:29:54.260 I have a question. 02:29:54.260 --> 02:29:55.180 - Yeah. 02:29:55.180 --> 02:29:56.379 You said you're gonna get more traffic. 02:29:56.379 --> 02:29:58.059 - Mr. Sanchez. 02:29:58.059 --> 02:29:59.540 - That you're gonna have more traffic, 02:29:59.540 --> 02:30:04.540 but won't the existing people utilizing that car wash, 02:30:04.579 --> 02:30:07.139 won't they be people from that neighborhood? 02:30:07.139 --> 02:30:07.979 - No. 02:30:07.979 --> 02:30:11.020 If you saw the amount of traffic that goes through 2499, 02:30:11.020 --> 02:30:14.739 it is what people use to cut from Argyle to 35 02:30:14.739 --> 02:30:17.540 without having to go straight down 377. 02:30:17.540 --> 02:30:18.420 They all use these. 02:30:18.420 --> 02:30:20.739 They take Hickory Creek Road, Country Club Road, 02:30:20.739 --> 02:30:23.780 and then come straight through into our neighborhoods. 02:30:23.780 --> 02:30:25.420 They're also, because of the construction 02:30:25.420 --> 02:30:28.219 where they're widening Teasley at this moment, 02:30:28.219 --> 02:30:31.040 nobody wants to sit with the construction out there 02:30:31.040 --> 02:30:34.239 with the postman saying which way you can go one lane. 02:30:34.239 --> 02:30:35.860 So they're using our housing division 02:30:35.860 --> 02:30:37.659 and literally the street that I live on, 02:30:37.659 --> 02:30:39.219 'cause I'm on a corner lot, 02:30:39.219 --> 02:30:41.899 is the main road that they're using to cut through 02:30:41.899 --> 02:30:44.139 our housing division already to get to the other side 02:30:44.139 --> 02:30:45.700 to avoid traffic. 02:30:45.700 --> 02:30:49.879 Because 2499 does not have any stop signs 02:30:49.879 --> 02:30:51.840 going four ways at Hickory Creek Road, 02:30:51.840 --> 02:30:53.159 there are three accidents there, 02:30:53.159 --> 02:30:55.559 a minimum a week since it's opened. 02:30:55.559 --> 02:30:56.959 They keep trying to put up cones 02:30:56.959 --> 02:31:00.579 to block the right-hand lane to try and prevent that. 02:31:00.579 --> 02:31:01.899 It slows it down. 02:31:01.899 --> 02:31:03.340 It doesn't prevent the accidents. 02:31:03.340 --> 02:31:06.420 So now we're gonna have people that are coming off of 2499 02:31:06.420 --> 02:31:07.940 to go to another car wash 02:31:07.940 --> 02:31:09.399 to cut through our housing division 02:31:09.399 --> 02:31:11.620 to avoid the construction on Teasley. 02:31:11.620 --> 02:31:13.379 It's just adding more traffic 02:31:13.379 --> 02:31:16.379 and we have a huge neighborhood. 02:31:16.379 --> 02:31:20.500 And the number of families with children is quite high. 02:31:20.500 --> 02:31:22.620 We just had our HOA do something great 02:31:22.620 --> 02:31:25.379 of giving us a new park for our children. 02:31:25.379 --> 02:31:27.420 Why are we gonna even take our children to that park 02:31:27.420 --> 02:31:29.700 if we can't even know that they're gonna be safe 02:31:29.700 --> 02:31:30.979 because of the additional traffic 02:31:30.979 --> 02:31:32.680 that we're already getting through? 02:31:35.579 --> 02:31:37.500 - One more question for you, Commissioner Beck. 02:31:37.500 --> 02:31:38.340 - Thank you, Chair. 02:31:38.340 --> 02:31:39.340 Thank you, Ms. Hurst, for your presentation. 02:31:39.340 --> 02:31:40.459 Is it Hurst or Hurst? 02:31:40.459 --> 02:31:42.700 - Hurst, like city. - Hurst, okay. 02:31:42.700 --> 02:31:44.059 Right, okay. 02:31:44.059 --> 02:31:46.540 You mentioned that you were concerned about people 02:31:46.540 --> 02:31:49.500 that would leave their car there for a couple hours 02:31:49.500 --> 02:31:52.620 and then walk into your neighborhood. 02:31:52.620 --> 02:31:53.940 Which street do you live on? 02:31:53.940 --> 02:31:56.440 - I live on the corner of High Point and Saddleback. 02:31:56.440 --> 02:31:58.620 So they would literally walk through the easement 02:31:58.620 --> 02:31:59.979 behind our home. 02:31:59.979 --> 02:32:02.459 And I went and spent seven and a half hours 02:32:02.459 --> 02:32:05.700 since we've gotten this at both the Heritage Car Wash 02:32:05.700 --> 02:32:08.940 at Colorado and 288 and the one that's right there 02:32:08.940 --> 02:32:13.059 off of Giralt and Swisher to watch what traffic did, 02:32:13.059 --> 02:32:14.780 to make sure that my complaint was valid 02:32:14.780 --> 02:32:16.379 versus just a thought. 02:32:16.379 --> 02:32:18.819 And I have watched these people leave their vehicles 02:32:18.819 --> 02:32:20.500 while they're being done, 02:32:20.500 --> 02:32:24.260 walking off to go to the shops that are near 02:32:24.260 --> 02:32:25.180 and then coming back. 02:32:25.180 --> 02:32:26.940 Well, there's no reason to think if it's happening 02:32:26.940 --> 02:32:28.500 at both of these that it's not gonna happen 02:32:28.500 --> 02:32:29.780 in our neighborhood as well. 02:32:29.780 --> 02:32:32.700 - Okay, is there not, and I'm sorry, I'm asking, 02:32:32.700 --> 02:32:36.180 I really don't know, but I thought there was a wall, 02:32:36.180 --> 02:32:38.500 six or eight foot wall that's already there 02:32:38.500 --> 02:32:40.379 that backed up to your property, no? 02:32:40.379 --> 02:32:41.219 - No. - Oh. 02:32:41.219 --> 02:32:42.540 - There is no wall there right now. 02:32:42.540 --> 02:32:44.379 It is an open utility easement 02:32:44.379 --> 02:32:47.100 and then this commercial property that is filled with trees 02:32:47.100 --> 02:32:48.260 and things of the like. - Okay, okay. 02:32:48.260 --> 02:32:49.659 Then I understand, thank you. 02:32:51.979 --> 02:32:54.299 - Don't have any other questions. 02:32:54.299 --> 02:32:56.500 Thank you very much for coming out this evening. 02:32:58.500 --> 02:33:01.299 Next card I have is Tom Brandt, 02:33:01.299 --> 02:33:03.260 wishing to speak in opposition. 02:33:09.059 --> 02:33:10.420 - Hi, my name's Tom Brandt. 02:33:10.420 --> 02:33:14.979 I reside at 6600 Haling Way in Denton, Texas. 02:33:14.979 --> 02:33:19.979 Our property is on the southeast corner of Pine Hills 02:33:19.979 --> 02:33:23.620 and intersects at 2499. 02:33:23.620 --> 02:33:27.459 Everyone's discussing noise and how to prevent it. 02:33:27.459 --> 02:33:30.379 We were provided when they built 2499 02:33:30.379 --> 02:33:33.340 that the realtor forgot to tell us back in '02 02:33:33.340 --> 02:33:35.659 that it's been planned since 1980. 02:33:35.659 --> 02:33:40.299 So our wooded area in cul-de-sac is now 2499 02:33:40.299 --> 02:33:45.299 and the intersection road on to 2499, being Pine Hills. 02:33:45.340 --> 02:33:47.739 What happens is that sound wall stops. 02:33:47.739 --> 02:33:48.700 It's got a hole in it. 02:33:48.700 --> 02:33:52.059 Right next to my property is the intersection. 02:33:52.059 --> 02:33:55.180 I can hear at all traffic, all the time, 02:33:55.180 --> 02:33:58.819 a quarter mile in each direction from that road right now. 02:33:58.819 --> 02:34:01.860 I can hear it coming down the road back and forth. 02:34:02.819 --> 02:34:05.059 I can hear it coming down our street 02:34:05.059 --> 02:34:07.020 because it's getting more traffic too, 02:34:07.020 --> 02:34:11.100 which was a residential street with a community pool on it. 02:34:11.100 --> 02:34:12.579 The community I'm referring to, 02:34:12.579 --> 02:34:15.739 we actually live in, it's called Windstone 02:34:15.739 --> 02:34:17.940 and it's part of Oakmont West 02:34:17.940 --> 02:34:21.819 or West Oakmont area, kind of called there. 02:34:21.819 --> 02:34:23.379 But that's the biggest thing. 02:34:23.379 --> 02:34:26.700 And what happens, that particular, where the wall stops, 02:34:26.700 --> 02:34:30.260 that sound resonates down from the road 02:34:30.260 --> 02:34:32.940 all the way through our complete subdivision, 02:34:32.940 --> 02:34:34.020 just about literally. 02:34:34.020 --> 02:34:35.940 Several dozen homes are affected 02:34:35.940 --> 02:34:38.739 by just basic street noise right now. 02:34:38.739 --> 02:34:40.540 So that's not gonna diminish. 02:34:40.540 --> 02:34:44.579 The company in question wants to propose, 02:34:44.579 --> 02:34:46.139 already induces more noise 02:34:46.139 --> 02:34:49.299 on top of attracting more noise as customers, 02:34:49.299 --> 02:34:50.860 which is part of his business. 02:34:50.860 --> 02:34:52.819 His business shouldn't be located 02:34:52.819 --> 02:34:54.940 surrounded by a residential area. 02:34:54.940 --> 02:34:58.420 It's surrounded on all two to three sides at least. 02:34:58.420 --> 02:35:01.940 And it's not a place for that type of business 02:35:01.940 --> 02:35:05.459 that induces more noise than you already got. 02:35:05.459 --> 02:35:10.459 Traffic wise, danger wise from intersections 02:35:10.459 --> 02:35:12.979 that corner of where you wanna propose, 02:35:12.979 --> 02:35:14.899 I believe it's pretty close to it, 02:35:14.899 --> 02:35:18.260 propose to go directly across from Pine Hills 02:35:18.260 --> 02:35:23.260 is a limited vision, limited distance turn right now. 02:35:23.700 --> 02:35:27.020 And cars are driving, I'm gonna call it a highway. 02:35:27.020 --> 02:35:28.860 It's not a Texas community road. 02:35:28.860 --> 02:35:29.680 It's a highway. 02:35:29.680 --> 02:35:32.059 They're doing 50, 60 miles an hour on that road 02:35:32.059 --> 02:35:33.739 in this area right now. 02:35:33.739 --> 02:35:35.979 I don't know what it's like a mile down the road. 02:35:35.979 --> 02:35:37.579 Maybe that wall helps. 02:35:37.579 --> 02:35:41.219 Right now it's an elaborate privacy fence 02:35:41.219 --> 02:35:42.340 as far as I'm concerned. 02:35:42.340 --> 02:35:45.579 I like it, doesn't work, but I like it. 02:35:45.579 --> 02:35:48.739 But it's an effort on the part of the tech side 02:35:48.739 --> 02:35:49.920 to do their thing. 02:35:49.920 --> 02:35:51.579 But in that particular environment 02:35:51.579 --> 02:35:53.299 where this is being proposed, 02:35:53.299 --> 02:35:55.500 it doesn't work, we don't want it. 02:35:55.500 --> 02:35:58.340 You can put a professional buildings in, 02:35:58.340 --> 02:35:59.659 you can build a park there. 02:35:59.659 --> 02:36:01.020 That'd be a good idea. 02:36:01.020 --> 02:36:04.020 But anything that doesn't induce, 02:36:04.020 --> 02:36:05.739 we don't need a 7-Eleven. 02:36:05.739 --> 02:36:09.059 We don't need, I can tell you what we don't need. 02:36:09.059 --> 02:36:10.899 If you just put in some professional buildings 02:36:10.899 --> 02:36:12.819 like you have in a probably neighborhoods, 02:36:12.819 --> 02:36:15.500 there's several car washes on our neighborhood currently. 02:36:15.500 --> 02:36:17.959 People from our neighborhood go to those car washes. 02:36:17.959 --> 02:36:19.639 We don't want one across the street. 02:36:19.639 --> 02:36:21.459 I don't think you would either. 02:36:21.459 --> 02:36:24.780 So that's the main thing is mostly noise, 02:36:24.780 --> 02:36:27.739 traffic and inconvenience to our residents 02:36:27.739 --> 02:36:29.979 that bought property here. 02:36:29.979 --> 02:36:31.899 We've been there since '02. 02:36:31.899 --> 02:36:34.020 And this is what it's turned into. 02:36:34.020 --> 02:36:36.620 So we're just trying to preserve what we've got left. 02:36:39.299 --> 02:36:40.620 - I don't see any questions. 02:36:40.620 --> 02:36:42.659 Thank you, sir, for coming out this evening. 02:36:45.260 --> 02:36:46.100 Thank you. 02:36:49.739 --> 02:36:54.659 Hector Lumelin, 6020 English Manor. 02:36:54.659 --> 02:36:56.700 And opposition does wish to speak. 02:36:56.700 --> 02:36:58.139 - Yes. 02:36:58.139 --> 02:37:00.540 So I live along Teasley. 02:37:00.540 --> 02:37:01.899 I back up to it. 02:37:01.899 --> 02:37:04.399 And I've been living in Wheeler Ridge since 2008. 02:37:04.399 --> 02:37:08.260 And I'm not too far down from his other car wash 02:37:08.260 --> 02:37:10.540 that like David was talking about 02:37:10.540 --> 02:37:13.840 with the noise from people just using their stereos 02:37:13.840 --> 02:37:15.059 whenever they're using the car wash. 02:37:15.059 --> 02:37:16.659 We're getting to see the nice neon lights 02:37:16.659 --> 02:37:18.459 that are on at night. 02:37:18.459 --> 02:37:19.940 We already have to deal with that with a doctor 02:37:19.940 --> 02:37:21.180 that likes to send people to the ER 02:37:21.180 --> 02:37:23.860 all the way over at the little hospital, 02:37:23.860 --> 02:37:26.379 whatever quick hospital thing they have right there. 02:37:26.379 --> 02:37:28.020 And I can't imagine the noise 02:37:28.020 --> 02:37:29.420 that they're gonna have to deal with with that thing 02:37:29.420 --> 02:37:31.299 shoehorned right in behind their neighborhood. 02:37:31.299 --> 02:37:34.260 Sure, you guys can put up a three story building, 02:37:34.260 --> 02:37:35.680 but that doesn't mean you should. 02:37:35.680 --> 02:37:36.979 Just because it's been in the plans 02:37:36.979 --> 02:37:38.579 doesn't mean it can't be changed. 02:37:38.579 --> 02:37:41.420 This is something that literally is just shoehorned 02:37:41.420 --> 02:37:43.760 in Wheeler Ridge. 02:37:43.760 --> 02:37:45.700 It's not like, oh, it's a long sight. 02:37:45.700 --> 02:37:48.139 It is crammed in there. 02:37:48.139 --> 02:37:51.659 If this was Wheeler Ridge, this is the car wash. 02:37:51.659 --> 02:37:52.940 I could understand if you were to put that 02:37:52.940 --> 02:37:54.860 on the other side of 2499 02:37:54.860 --> 02:37:56.500 when the plan was originally made 02:37:56.500 --> 02:37:58.899 and then maybe not putting so many houses on Oakmont 02:37:58.899 --> 02:38:00.420 so that way the curvature goes around it. 02:38:00.420 --> 02:38:02.420 But in this case, it's really just kind of in there. 02:38:02.420 --> 02:38:03.420 And I was under the impression 02:38:03.420 --> 02:38:06.799 that maybe this was taken during the eminent domain grab 02:38:06.799 --> 02:38:08.860 that they took from Wheeler Ridge years ago. 02:38:08.860 --> 02:38:10.459 But I'm guessing you guys were saying, 02:38:10.459 --> 02:38:12.959 Haley was saying that it was just recently 02:38:12.959 --> 02:38:15.540 or not recently was put in place in the early 90s 02:38:15.540 --> 02:38:17.540 or maybe back in the 80s even. 02:38:17.540 --> 02:38:20.739 But I'm in favor of doing office buildings, 02:38:20.739 --> 02:38:22.659 putting a rec center, putting a daycare, 02:38:22.659 --> 02:38:25.860 putting any other item that isn't going to be 02:38:25.860 --> 02:38:29.340 a seven to nine noise inducing facility, 02:38:29.340 --> 02:38:31.659 a 30 foot tower that's going to be 02:38:31.659 --> 02:38:34.059 another three feet higher than that. 02:38:34.059 --> 02:38:35.020 Maybe just set it lower. 02:38:35.020 --> 02:38:37.620 Is that part of the engineering aspect 02:38:37.620 --> 02:38:39.260 of having water flow so that way the water 02:38:39.260 --> 02:38:41.620 can have adequate pressure? 02:38:41.620 --> 02:38:43.379 Otherwise, can it just be lower? 02:38:43.379 --> 02:38:45.299 Do we need a 30 foot tower since people are gonna be 02:38:45.299 --> 02:38:47.420 staring straight at it as they're driving 50 miles an hour 02:38:47.420 --> 02:38:49.700 down 24.99? 02:38:49.700 --> 02:38:51.680 I'm trying to understand the logic. 02:38:51.680 --> 02:38:54.620 I understand the tax revenue that's involved with this. 02:38:54.620 --> 02:38:57.500 But I can also see the option of possibly selling it back 02:38:57.500 --> 02:39:02.379 to Wheeler Ridge HOA and having them develop it further. 02:39:02.379 --> 02:39:03.459 You're talking about the walls. 02:39:03.459 --> 02:39:05.459 The walls, they're not gonna do much. 02:39:05.459 --> 02:39:07.459 This is literally, what? 02:39:07.459 --> 02:39:10.680 It's gonna be like 20 feet from her fence line? 02:39:12.260 --> 02:39:14.979 Do you want a car wash 20 feet from your house? 02:39:14.979 --> 02:39:16.540 I imagine you wouldn't. 02:39:16.540 --> 02:39:18.739 I don't think any of you would. 02:39:18.739 --> 02:39:21.100 Sure, she should have probably bothered the city 02:39:21.100 --> 02:39:22.860 to get more information on her plans. 02:39:22.860 --> 02:39:25.620 And granted, we're starting to look a little bit 02:39:25.620 --> 02:39:27.920 like Lewisville along Main Street where they like to shove 02:39:27.920 --> 02:39:28.079 in 02:39:28.079 --> 02:39:29.739 every little business that they can 02:39:29.739 --> 02:39:31.620 right next to the neighborhoods. 02:39:31.620 --> 02:39:33.379 But is that really what we're going for? 02:39:33.379 --> 02:39:36.020 Is there not enough space that we could put another car 02:39:36.020 --> 02:39:36.360 wash 02:39:36.360 --> 02:39:37.579 just a little bit further down? 02:39:37.579 --> 02:39:39.399 I know there's areas that are developing 02:39:39.399 --> 02:39:41.620 next to a large pond that's further down 24.9 02:39:41.620 --> 02:39:43.940 that they could put something that isn't going to be 02:39:43.940 --> 02:39:46.260 smashed right into a neighborhood. 02:39:46.260 --> 02:39:48.579 But right here, it's just going to, like she said, 02:39:48.579 --> 02:39:50.340 we've got traffic problems through there already. 02:39:50.340 --> 02:39:51.540 We've addressed it with the city. 02:39:51.540 --> 02:39:53.219 City won't put in speed bumps. 02:39:53.219 --> 02:39:55.540 We had to, the HOA had to install 02:39:55.540 --> 02:39:57.659 our own little speedometer signs. 02:39:57.659 --> 02:40:02.659 So what are you guys doing to maintain our property values? 02:40:03.139 --> 02:40:05.219 Because that's a good chunk of tax revenue 02:40:05.219 --> 02:40:06.139 that you're getting. 02:40:06.139 --> 02:40:07.639 Sure, we could just go ahead and rent it. 02:40:07.639 --> 02:40:09.100 You guys will still get your tax revenue. 02:40:09.100 --> 02:40:12.440 But now the neighborhood's gonna decrease in quality. 02:40:12.440 --> 02:40:15.219 And it's just going to be, we've got Kroger. 02:40:15.219 --> 02:40:16.579 We've got the other car wash. 02:40:16.579 --> 02:40:17.700 We've got a storage facility. 02:40:17.700 --> 02:40:19.700 We've got that minor emergency. 02:40:19.700 --> 02:40:21.219 We've got a church. 02:40:21.219 --> 02:40:22.420 We've got a mechanic. 02:40:22.420 --> 02:40:24.420 All this, Teasley and 24.99, 02:40:24.420 --> 02:40:29.139 weren't already sandwiched in, surrounded by commercial. 02:40:29.139 --> 02:40:33.979 So I'd like to see just a little bit less commercial 02:40:33.979 --> 02:40:36.500 crammed into every corner around my neighborhood 02:40:36.500 --> 02:40:38.500 so that we maybe we could enjoy it a little bit more. 02:40:38.500 --> 02:40:40.219 Because as it is, I already got sirens 02:40:40.219 --> 02:40:41.860 and everything else going down my street 02:40:41.860 --> 02:40:43.500 four or five times a day 02:40:43.500 --> 02:40:46.540 just because that doctor can't handle people that come in. 02:40:47.940 --> 02:40:48.979 Any questions? 02:40:50.180 --> 02:40:51.500 Yeah. 02:40:51.500 --> 02:40:52.340 - Thank you. 02:40:54.979 --> 02:40:59.139 The next card we have is Otto Hanneman, 02:40:59.139 --> 02:41:03.180 6500 Coral or Coeur d'Alene. 02:41:04.659 --> 02:41:09.659 In opposition, says the debt, do not wish to speak. 02:41:10.340 --> 02:41:11.459 - I'll stop when I speak. 02:41:11.459 --> 02:41:12.299 - Okay. 02:41:13.500 --> 02:41:14.340 - Okay. 02:41:20.420 --> 02:41:23.780 - The name is Otto Hanneman and it's 6500 Coral Lane. 02:41:23.780 --> 02:41:24.620 - Coral. 02:41:24.620 --> 02:41:26.500 - In fact, the other day they sent the mail in 02:41:26.500 --> 02:41:27.700 from somewhere else, sent it back. 02:41:27.700 --> 02:41:29.579 So it's a long story. 02:41:29.579 --> 02:41:33.860 My neighbors have made some good points about the traffic, 02:41:33.860 --> 02:41:35.899 the decrease in home value. 02:41:35.899 --> 02:41:38.420 I think there's too many things going on, 02:41:38.420 --> 02:41:40.659 squeezing our neighborhood in. 02:41:40.659 --> 02:41:43.940 There's about 700 homes or so in that neighborhood. 02:41:43.940 --> 02:41:48.940 And I think a lot of the neighborhood, 02:41:49.059 --> 02:41:51.100 a little history was built, 02:41:51.100 --> 02:41:52.340 my house was built in 2008, 02:41:52.340 --> 02:41:54.459 right when the economy was crashing. 02:41:54.459 --> 02:41:59.459 And so a lot of the original owners went into foreclosure, 02:41:59.459 --> 02:42:02.819 investors bought it and turned it into rental homes. 02:42:02.819 --> 02:42:07.579 I think we're finally getting residents to buy the homes 02:42:07.579 --> 02:42:11.340 and to stay there and to enhance the homes 02:42:11.340 --> 02:42:12.500 in the neighborhood. 02:42:12.500 --> 02:42:15.899 And I think this, I wish Joshua the best. 02:42:15.899 --> 02:42:17.540 I just wish it somewhere else. 02:42:17.540 --> 02:42:19.180 Let's move him somewhere else, 02:42:19.180 --> 02:42:21.739 have him make a lot of money and pay a lot of taxes 02:42:21.739 --> 02:42:23.979 so our taxes can be decreased, 02:42:23.979 --> 02:42:25.819 but not in our neighborhood. 02:42:25.819 --> 02:42:27.420 That's the thing. 02:42:27.420 --> 02:42:29.500 I'm trying to look for a win-win here. 02:42:29.500 --> 02:42:32.659 I think you're gonna pick him or you're gonna pick us. 02:42:32.659 --> 02:42:34.180 And I would like to have a win-win, 02:42:34.180 --> 02:42:35.579 but I don't know how to do that. 02:42:35.579 --> 02:42:38.700 So on that note, I'll go ahead and stop. 02:42:38.700 --> 02:42:39.860 Thank you. 02:42:39.860 --> 02:42:40.700 - Thank you for coming. 02:42:40.700 --> 02:42:42.139 I do have a question for you. 02:42:42.139 --> 02:42:43.059 - I do have a question. 02:42:43.059 --> 02:42:44.219 - Commissioner Sanchez. 02:42:44.219 --> 02:42:45.260 - Yes, sir. 02:42:45.260 --> 02:42:47.139 - Several people have raised the issue 02:42:47.139 --> 02:42:48.979 about a lot of renters, 02:42:48.979 --> 02:42:51.379 and you just kind of clarified stuff for us, 02:42:51.379 --> 02:42:54.219 is that when the crash came, 02:42:54.219 --> 02:42:56.459 a lot of people ended up losing their home 02:42:56.459 --> 02:42:58.139 and investors bought it. 02:42:58.139 --> 02:43:02.459 So it's not the result of having this commercial property 02:43:02.459 --> 02:43:03.379 there or anything. 02:43:03.379 --> 02:43:05.979 It was caused by the economy. 02:43:05.979 --> 02:43:07.899 We have to look at issues in your neighborhood 02:43:07.899 --> 02:43:11.299 based on what happened and not try to blame somebody else. 02:43:11.299 --> 02:43:14.260 That's kind of what it kind of turning into blaming 02:43:14.260 --> 02:43:16.420 this individual trying to build here 02:43:16.420 --> 02:43:20.059 for having a lot of rental property there. 02:43:20.059 --> 02:43:23.059 But that had to do with the economy. 02:43:23.059 --> 02:43:25.739 So I just wanted to make that a statement. 02:43:25.739 --> 02:43:26.579 - May I make a comment? 02:43:26.579 --> 02:43:27.899 - Yeah, sure. 02:43:27.899 --> 02:43:30.420 - That may be true, but by having this car wash there, 02:43:30.420 --> 02:43:33.340 it's gonna decrease home values in certain ways. 02:43:33.340 --> 02:43:34.979 I don't know about my other neighbors, 02:43:34.979 --> 02:43:37.079 but I've been going around with the HOA about certain 02:43:37.079 --> 02:43:37.379 things 02:43:37.379 --> 02:43:41.340 that they're making decisions about letting renters 02:43:41.340 --> 02:43:42.780 really destroy properties, 02:43:42.780 --> 02:43:45.299 which decreases the value of everybody's home 02:43:45.299 --> 02:43:46.579 in our neighborhood. 02:43:46.579 --> 02:43:48.180 I think the addition of this car wash 02:43:48.180 --> 02:43:50.579 in the present location will do the same thing, 02:43:50.579 --> 02:43:53.059 especially for the people that live right around it. 02:43:53.059 --> 02:43:53.979 I don't live near it, 02:43:53.979 --> 02:43:56.020 but I'm gonna be seeing the lights from that thing 02:43:56.020 --> 02:43:57.219 from my house. 02:43:57.219 --> 02:43:58.780 I can sit out at night 02:43:58.780 --> 02:44:01.540 and look around a lot of the neighborhood from it, 02:44:01.540 --> 02:44:03.299 and I'm gonna be able to see the lights from that 02:44:03.299 --> 02:44:04.139 at night. 02:44:04.139 --> 02:44:05.700 I'll probably be able to hear the noise from it 02:44:05.700 --> 02:44:06.860 during the day. 02:44:06.860 --> 02:44:08.819 And they say only seven to nine. 02:44:08.819 --> 02:44:10.620 That's a long time during the day. 02:44:10.620 --> 02:44:13.299 Kids are trying to take naps during the day 02:44:13.299 --> 02:44:14.819 and in the afternoon for that. 02:44:14.819 --> 02:44:17.100 And I think it's, you know, like I said, 02:44:17.100 --> 02:44:19.139 I wish him the best somewhere else. 02:44:19.139 --> 02:44:20.780 I don't think it should be in our neighborhood, 02:44:20.780 --> 02:44:22.899 right next to our neighborhood like it is. 02:44:22.899 --> 02:44:26.579 I'd like to see it turn into a green park or something. 02:44:26.579 --> 02:44:29.219 If it has to go commercial, have it something 02:44:29.219 --> 02:44:31.540 that's not an activity like that, 02:44:31.540 --> 02:44:35.059 that generates a lot of noise, of trash, 02:44:35.059 --> 02:44:37.299 potential people that come in there 02:44:37.299 --> 02:44:39.979 to increase the crime in our neighborhood. 02:44:39.979 --> 02:44:40.979 I hadn't even thought about that 02:44:40.979 --> 02:44:42.819 till the lady mentioned it. 02:44:42.819 --> 02:44:45.579 That we'll have more people going through the neighborhood, 02:44:45.579 --> 02:44:47.579 more vandalism and theft also. 02:44:47.579 --> 02:44:50.100 So again, I wish Joshua the best. 02:44:50.100 --> 02:44:51.899 I wish we could find a win-win here. 02:44:51.899 --> 02:44:54.860 If you could say, let's move them over here, 02:44:54.860 --> 02:44:56.540 this will be a great location, 02:44:56.540 --> 02:44:57.899 I'd say let's do that. 02:44:58.940 --> 02:45:02.299 But I think it's gonna decrease the values of the homes 02:45:02.299 --> 02:45:05.100 right next to it in some form or fashion. 02:45:07.540 --> 02:45:08.500 Thank you for listening. 02:45:08.500 --> 02:45:10.700 - Thank you for coming out this evening, sir. 02:45:12.100 --> 02:45:16.459 Next card I have is Greg Johnson in support. 02:45:16.459 --> 02:45:17.620 I wish to speak. 02:45:26.340 --> 02:45:28.579 - Thank you, Greg Johnson, 319 West Oak, 02:45:28.579 --> 02:45:29.780 here in Denton. 02:45:29.780 --> 02:45:31.340 Thank you all for your service. 02:45:32.500 --> 02:45:34.500 So I get it. 02:45:34.500 --> 02:45:36.780 I've never been to any one of these 02:45:36.780 --> 02:45:39.700 where people didn't want something built behind them. 02:45:41.739 --> 02:45:44.940 There's about to be self storage built behind my house. 02:45:44.940 --> 02:45:46.379 Am I excited about it? 02:45:46.379 --> 02:45:49.780 No, but it's not my property. 02:45:49.780 --> 02:45:52.819 And so I think it's important, so I get it. 02:45:52.819 --> 02:45:55.180 I get the concerns of everybody here 02:45:55.180 --> 02:45:57.579 and you guys hear this a lot 02:45:57.579 --> 02:45:59.059 when commercial property is being developed 02:45:59.059 --> 02:46:02.860 because a residence has been able to enjoy a free view 02:46:02.860 --> 02:46:06.659 of somebody's beautiful, treed field for a long time. 02:46:06.659 --> 02:46:09.780 And so I get it and I don't make anybody wrong 02:46:09.780 --> 02:46:11.579 for coming in voicing their concerns 02:46:11.579 --> 02:46:13.819 or not wanting it there because let's face it, 02:46:13.819 --> 02:46:16.260 if it was your house, you wouldn't want it either. 02:46:16.260 --> 02:46:19.020 The question really is, do they have a right to say 02:46:19.020 --> 02:46:20.340 whether it should be there or not? 02:46:20.340 --> 02:46:22.940 And so I just wanted to kind of say, 02:46:22.940 --> 02:46:25.780 I think it's important to kind of hit the reset button 02:46:25.780 --> 02:46:28.700 and remember what is before you tonight 02:46:28.700 --> 02:46:29.899 and why you're here, right? 02:46:29.899 --> 02:46:32.500 So it's in a PD, it's allowed to be built there 02:46:32.500 --> 02:46:34.340 by writing the PD. 02:46:34.340 --> 02:46:37.420 There's already a car wash owned by the same gentleman 02:46:37.420 --> 02:46:39.299 in the same PD. 02:46:39.299 --> 02:46:43.479 And so the process of course is to approve the detailed 02:46:43.479 --> 02:46:43.899 plan, 02:46:43.899 --> 02:46:48.180 which is everything at Teasley and Robinson Road, 02:46:48.180 --> 02:46:52.260 the 7-Eleven, his car wash, O'Reilly Auto Parts, all those, 02:46:52.260 --> 02:46:54.780 all went through this process. 02:46:54.780 --> 02:46:56.020 None with a neighborhood meeting 02:46:56.020 --> 02:46:58.020 and none with cards sent out 02:46:58.020 --> 02:47:01.700 because it's a procedural process. 02:47:03.100 --> 02:47:05.340 Larry, I think you bring up a good point, 02:47:05.340 --> 02:47:08.180 which is maybe we should have neighborhood meeting 02:47:08.180 --> 02:47:10.500 requirements for certain things. 02:47:10.500 --> 02:47:12.340 But I think the question really is, 02:47:12.340 --> 02:47:13.379 do you guys wanna be sending out 02:47:13.379 --> 02:47:16.079 a neighborhood meeting requirement 02:47:16.079 --> 02:47:17.659 every time something's getting built? 02:47:17.659 --> 02:47:20.100 There's no zoning request change, there's no SUP, 02:47:20.100 --> 02:47:23.340 so that's one of those things. 02:47:24.739 --> 02:47:29.739 So what's before you is to approve the detailed plan. 02:47:30.020 --> 02:47:33.040 And so long as the site plan conforms 02:47:33.040 --> 02:47:35.180 and it meets the code requirements for the PD 02:47:35.180 --> 02:47:37.739 and if the PD is silent to it, 02:47:37.739 --> 02:47:39.239 then you point to the current code, 02:47:39.239 --> 02:47:41.420 like the trees and so on. 02:47:43.340 --> 02:47:44.540 Some of the things I've heard tonight 02:47:44.540 --> 02:47:47.219 were, has my realtor told me this or that? 02:47:47.219 --> 02:47:48.500 Well, that's not on this gentleman, 02:47:48.500 --> 02:47:50.940 that's on the realtor that might have lied 02:47:50.940 --> 02:47:52.500 to somebody to make a fee. 02:47:52.500 --> 02:47:55.500 And you should report him to the real estate commission. 02:47:55.500 --> 02:47:58.219 Pine Hills on the east side is a drag strip. 02:47:58.219 --> 02:48:00.540 That's on the east side, this is on the west side, 02:48:00.540 --> 02:48:03.180 people are gonna turn into this car wash from 2499 02:48:03.180 --> 02:48:04.819 and get back out on 2499. 02:48:04.819 --> 02:48:06.680 (audience member speaking) 02:48:06.680 --> 02:48:08.659 I don't wanna look at it, again, I get it. 02:48:08.659 --> 02:48:09.780 I don't wanna look at the storage 02:48:09.780 --> 02:48:10.899 that's getting built behind my house, 02:48:10.899 --> 02:48:13.100 but the gentleman has a right to build it there. 02:48:15.260 --> 02:48:16.459 It's gonna increase traffic. 02:48:16.459 --> 02:48:19.020 Well, it's 2499, I mean, it's a six lane 02:48:19.020 --> 02:48:21.540 major text dot thoroughfare, 02:48:21.540 --> 02:48:23.379 and things are gonna get built there. 02:48:24.299 --> 02:48:26.819 I don't want commercial in my neighborhood. 02:48:26.819 --> 02:48:29.379 Well, it's not in the neighborhood, it's on 2499. 02:48:34.899 --> 02:48:37.020 We don't want commercial in that area. 02:48:37.020 --> 02:48:38.620 Well, if you go down to Flyer Mound 02:48:38.620 --> 02:48:40.200 and drive through Flyer Mound, 02:48:40.200 --> 02:48:43.059 look how Flyer Mound developed along 2499. 02:48:43.059 --> 02:48:44.700 All the residential was built first, 02:48:44.700 --> 02:48:45.780 that's how it goes, right? 02:48:45.780 --> 02:48:47.819 Residential happens first, then the services 02:48:47.819 --> 02:48:49.860 for the residential happen second. 02:48:49.860 --> 02:48:52.739 You've got commercial uses all the way down 2499 02:48:52.739 --> 02:48:55.020 in Flyer Mound, backing up to neighborhoods 02:48:55.020 --> 02:48:56.940 separated by masonry screen walls. 02:48:58.860 --> 02:49:03.020 I think this gentleman has, he's actually offered 02:49:03.020 --> 02:49:05.700 to do more than what the PD requires. 02:49:05.700 --> 02:49:07.180 He's gonna build the screen wall 02:49:07.180 --> 02:49:08.420 on the other side of the trees, 02:49:08.420 --> 02:49:12.479 so the trees are preserved, and he didn't have to do that. 02:49:12.479 --> 02:49:15.379 It actually creates more yard for those folks behind him. 02:49:17.459 --> 02:49:21.540 And he's, in my opinion, offered to do things 02:49:21.540 --> 02:49:22.579 to mitigate the noise. 02:49:22.579 --> 02:49:24.940 He builds his vacuums inside the building, 02:49:24.940 --> 02:49:26.799 whereas some of these other car washes, 02:49:26.799 --> 02:49:28.340 they're in an outbuilding. 02:49:28.340 --> 02:49:30.379 I use his car wash on Teasley all the time. 02:49:30.379 --> 02:49:32.180 It's not loud when you're standing outside, 02:49:32.180 --> 02:49:33.059 you can't hear the vacuums. 02:49:33.059 --> 02:49:34.940 And so while you've heard people 02:49:34.940 --> 02:49:37.420 that don't want the car wash there, I get it, 02:49:37.420 --> 02:49:40.379 but it meets all the requirements of the PD and the code. 02:49:41.459 --> 02:49:42.979 The staff has recommended approval, 02:49:42.979 --> 02:49:44.659 and I would ask you to do the same. 02:49:44.659 --> 02:49:45.500 Thank you. 02:49:45.500 --> 02:49:46.340 - Any questions? 02:49:48.139 --> 02:49:50.940 - Thank you for coming out and speaking this evening. 02:49:50.940 --> 02:49:53.180 - If I could say something real quick. 02:49:53.180 --> 02:49:54.420 - Just a second. 02:49:54.420 --> 02:49:56.420 That's all the cards that we have. 02:49:56.420 --> 02:49:58.420 This is a public hearing. 02:49:58.420 --> 02:50:02.139 Anyone who hasn't spoken yet is welcome to come down 02:50:02.139 --> 02:50:04.899 at this time and give your comments 02:50:04.899 --> 02:50:07.979 or any of your feedback that you'd like to. 02:50:07.979 --> 02:50:09.139 It is a public hearing. 02:50:10.420 --> 02:50:12.940 Anyone else wishing to speak on this item? 02:50:15.100 --> 02:50:17.020 Okay, Commissioner Begg. 02:50:17.020 --> 02:50:17.860 - Thank you, Chair. 02:50:17.860 --> 02:50:19.219 I believe the gentleman, Hector, 02:50:19.219 --> 02:50:22.059 had a question he didn't get a chance to ask, 02:50:22.059 --> 02:50:24.139 and I'd like to ask him to come down and ask that now. 02:50:24.139 --> 02:50:25.139 - Please come forward. 02:50:26.899 --> 02:50:29.379 Do you have a question for him, Commissioner Begg? 02:50:29.379 --> 02:50:30.940 - No, I believe he had a question 02:50:30.940 --> 02:50:31.780 that he didn't get solved last time. 02:50:31.780 --> 02:50:34.819 - Regarding the not having the meeting 02:50:34.819 --> 02:50:36.819 for whenever the car wash was built previously, 02:50:36.819 --> 02:50:38.299 we did have a meeting, 02:50:38.299 --> 02:50:40.819 'cause again, I've been living there for a while. 02:50:40.819 --> 02:50:43.340 It was actually the storage group 02:50:43.340 --> 02:50:45.260 that came and met with the HOA 02:50:45.260 --> 02:50:47.180 and had the community come out and voice their concerns. 02:50:47.180 --> 02:50:50.940 There was a road that goes right to it, 02:50:50.940 --> 02:50:53.020 and they were wanting to go ahead 02:50:53.020 --> 02:50:55.260 and open up that road into the storage community 02:50:55.260 --> 02:51:00.260 to try to promote, let's see, it's Lost Pony Drive. 02:51:00.819 --> 02:51:03.579 They were trying to promote accessibility 02:51:03.579 --> 02:51:06.020 from the neighborhood into the storage area, 02:51:06.020 --> 02:51:08.819 but we were all very much in the neighborhood against that 02:51:08.819 --> 02:51:11.139 because it would, again, increase traffic, 02:51:11.139 --> 02:51:14.180 and I'm not too concerned about traffic on 2499. 02:51:15.340 --> 02:51:18.940 People are gonna get in wrecks because of the planning, 02:51:18.940 --> 02:51:20.940 but that's gonna be how it is, 02:51:20.940 --> 02:51:22.819 but my concern is the traffic of, 02:51:22.819 --> 02:51:26.100 and I think, Rose, her concern about traffic 02:51:26.100 --> 02:51:28.139 is the traffic that goes through our neighborhoods 02:51:28.139 --> 02:51:29.139 of people trying to cut through. 02:51:29.139 --> 02:51:31.340 I was just looking at the Denton crime map, 02:51:31.340 --> 02:51:33.020 and one of the houses that backs up 02:51:33.020 --> 02:51:36.420 right over towards the storage area in the car wash 02:51:36.420 --> 02:51:38.420 has a theft marker on it. 02:51:38.420 --> 02:51:40.979 There's a theft marker right there at 7-Eleven, 02:51:40.979 --> 02:51:42.940 so it's gonna increase crime. 02:51:42.940 --> 02:51:44.579 Those are just from 2018. 02:51:44.579 --> 02:51:45.940 I didn't feel like trying to dig around 02:51:45.940 --> 02:51:47.059 and see how much further we can go, 02:51:47.059 --> 02:51:50.059 but there's the concerns about the noise, 02:51:50.059 --> 02:51:51.819 the concerns about the traffic. 02:51:51.819 --> 02:51:54.700 Those are still very much valid concerns, 02:51:54.700 --> 02:51:57.739 and I believe Haley was saying that the map, 02:51:57.739 --> 02:52:01.219 the building of the noise barriers and all that 02:52:01.219 --> 02:52:03.100 was going to be the adjacent properties, 02:52:03.100 --> 02:52:04.459 but not so much addressing the ones 02:52:04.459 --> 02:52:06.059 across the street from it, right? 02:52:08.899 --> 02:52:12.340 So if they're living on pine hills, 02:52:12.340 --> 02:52:15.420 they're just gonna get a great view of this new car wash. 02:52:16.420 --> 02:52:17.260 Go ahead. 02:52:23.860 --> 02:52:26.899 - The only wall will be on the south side of the building, 02:52:26.899 --> 02:52:28.379 just north of that existing tree line. 02:52:28.379 --> 02:52:30.379 There is no wall proposed on 2499 02:52:30.379 --> 02:52:32.180 or on the backside of the property. 02:52:32.180 --> 02:52:36.219 - Okay, so Ray, you're gonna get a great earful 02:52:36.219 --> 02:52:38.819 living on that north side over there by Thoroughbred. 02:52:40.299 --> 02:52:43.260 That's what, like a couple hundred yards away, maybe? 02:52:47.340 --> 02:52:48.180 200 feet? 02:52:50.180 --> 02:52:52.819 So 175 feet away. 02:52:52.819 --> 02:52:55.180 I'm sure the noise will stop before then, though. 02:52:55.180 --> 02:52:56.020 Right. 02:52:57.940 --> 02:52:58.860 - Do you have a question for you? 02:52:58.860 --> 02:52:59.780 Commissioner Beck. 02:53:00.700 --> 02:53:01.940 - Hector, I understand your concerns. 02:53:01.940 --> 02:53:02.780 I really do. 02:53:02.780 --> 02:53:03.620 I'm empathetic. 02:53:03.620 --> 02:53:05.020 Everybody's concerned that this thing 02:53:05.020 --> 02:53:07.540 is gonna be more negative than positive. 02:53:07.540 --> 02:53:09.579 I understand that, but you made a couple of comments 02:53:09.579 --> 02:53:12.940 about crime being increased and indicating 02:53:12.940 --> 02:53:15.540 that this is directly gonna impact that. 02:53:15.540 --> 02:53:17.899 What tends to impact crime from what I've seen 02:53:17.899 --> 02:53:19.979 is when population growth occurs, 02:53:19.979 --> 02:53:22.340 and you have to accommodate that population growth. 02:53:22.340 --> 02:53:23.420 Crime's gonna happen. 02:53:23.420 --> 02:53:25.819 It's gonna happen less where there's fewer people. 02:53:25.819 --> 02:53:27.860 It's gonna happen more often when there's more people. 02:53:27.860 --> 02:53:28.899 That's gonna be a part of that. 02:53:28.899 --> 02:53:32.780 It's kind of unfair to go after this particular vendor 02:53:32.780 --> 02:53:36.860 and assess that your crime situation is gonna increase 02:53:36.860 --> 02:53:38.020 I don't know how many fold because of that. 02:53:38.020 --> 02:53:40.379 - Great, crime is gonna increase because of an increase. 02:53:40.379 --> 02:53:41.819 - Crime can also be controlled 02:53:41.819 --> 02:53:43.819 with neighborhood watch programs and everything. 02:53:43.819 --> 02:53:45.700 That's something that if you're concerned about, 02:53:45.700 --> 02:53:47.219 that should be a consideration. 02:53:47.219 --> 02:53:48.379 - Right, but the city has-- - And the city of Denton 02:53:48.379 --> 02:53:51.059 has programs, city of Man, please, 02:53:51.059 --> 02:53:53.739 city of Denton has programs 02:53:53.739 --> 02:53:56.100 that help neighborhoods form these. 02:53:56.100 --> 02:53:57.500 And I would strongly recommend 02:53:57.500 --> 02:53:58.659 that you get involved with that, too. 02:53:58.659 --> 02:54:01.979 But again, I'm not unsympathetic to your concerns here. 02:54:01.979 --> 02:54:05.299 I'm just saying, you're putting this owner 02:54:05.299 --> 02:54:07.780 in a position that seems a little unfair 02:54:07.780 --> 02:54:10.459 and weighs a little bit too heavily on him, 02:54:10.459 --> 02:54:12.379 even though it may not seem like it. 02:54:12.379 --> 02:54:15.139 So the other thing-- - Well, alternate businesses 02:54:15.139 --> 02:54:18.739 would generate a more regular group of people 02:54:18.739 --> 02:54:21.659 that were to come versus a car wash generates 02:54:21.659 --> 02:54:23.780 more random, sporadic individuals. 02:54:23.780 --> 02:54:25.260 And like you said, increasing population, 02:54:25.260 --> 02:54:27.379 increasing crime, your increasing population 02:54:27.379 --> 02:54:29.059 into this area that's gonna be elevated enough 02:54:29.059 --> 02:54:30.819 to where people, I'm not sure if they'll be able 02:54:30.819 --> 02:54:32.700 to see over the wall in other funds, 02:54:32.700 --> 02:54:33.540 but they'll certainly be able to see over the wall. 02:54:33.540 --> 02:54:35.620 - So you want us to shove it to another area 02:54:35.620 --> 02:54:36.659 where they have to deal with it? 02:54:36.659 --> 02:54:37.659 It's gonna happen. 02:54:37.659 --> 02:54:38.659 - Well, there's places, right? 02:54:38.659 --> 02:54:40.819 I mean, I don't know if I can use this. 02:54:40.819 --> 02:54:42.379 - Well, and I don't wanna get-- 02:54:42.379 --> 02:54:43.780 - Pull up a map and show you. 02:54:43.780 --> 02:54:45.500 - Hector, I don't wanna get any spitting match with you. 02:54:45.500 --> 02:54:47.860 I'm just saying that there's certain circumstances 02:54:47.860 --> 02:54:52.059 that a developer can't control, PNZ can't control. 02:54:52.059 --> 02:54:55.540 - Well, it can't be controlled if we change the business 02:54:55.540 --> 02:54:56.379 that's gonna be put in there. 02:54:56.379 --> 02:54:57.819 - But we don't have that authority here. 02:54:57.819 --> 02:54:59.180 I think there's the understanding, 02:54:59.180 --> 02:55:01.979 there's a feeling that PNZ can make that kind of change, 02:55:01.979 --> 02:55:03.459 and we don't have that authority. 02:55:03.459 --> 02:55:04.700 This is a plan development. 02:55:04.700 --> 02:55:05.659 This went before the city. 02:55:05.659 --> 02:55:07.020 This thing's law. 02:55:07.020 --> 02:55:09.979 As long as they build it, they have the right to build 02:55:09.979 --> 02:55:12.100 as long as they meet certain specifications. 02:55:12.100 --> 02:55:14.700 What I've seen, they've done that, and then some too. 02:55:14.700 --> 02:55:18.979 And I realize that it's still unnerving to you, 02:55:18.979 --> 02:55:21.420 but our hands are gonna be tied too, 02:55:21.420 --> 02:55:23.159 as much as we'd like to help you. 02:55:23.159 --> 02:55:25.459 We can't just say, we can't just turn it off. 02:55:26.659 --> 02:55:27.620 - All right. - Okay? 02:55:29.620 --> 02:55:30.459 Thank you, sir. 02:55:32.260 --> 02:55:33.620 - This is a public hearing, 02:55:33.620 --> 02:55:37.059 and I don't have any more cards. 02:55:37.059 --> 02:55:39.340 Anyone else who hasn't already spoken 02:55:39.340 --> 02:55:42.979 that would like to speak, please come forward at this time. 02:55:42.979 --> 02:55:45.079 And if any commissioner has a question 02:55:45.079 --> 02:55:48.500 for a particular person who has spoken, 02:55:48.500 --> 02:55:50.860 you're free to address the chair, 02:55:50.860 --> 02:55:52.739 and I'll be happy to recognize them. 02:55:52.739 --> 02:55:55.139 Commissioner Sanchez, do you have a question? 02:55:55.139 --> 02:55:56.540 - Several of the people have mentioned 02:55:56.540 --> 02:55:58.819 about the 30-foot tower. 02:55:58.819 --> 02:56:00.979 Would you consider anything about the, 02:56:00.979 --> 02:56:02.700 is that part of the design, 02:56:02.700 --> 02:56:04.299 and you'd have to go with that design, 02:56:04.299 --> 02:56:09.299 or would you be willing to do some about that tower, 02:56:09.620 --> 02:56:12.340 and bring it down a little bit in order to, 02:56:12.340 --> 02:56:15.670 meet with the neighborhood, and talk to them about that 02:56:15.670 --> 02:56:15.940 tower, 02:56:15.940 --> 02:56:18.200 'cause it seems several people have brought that up. 02:56:18.200 --> 02:56:21.840 Other than that, I don't know what else could be done. 02:56:23.139 --> 02:56:28.139 - Yeah, absolutely, and we would rather not consider that, 02:56:28.620 --> 02:56:32.260 you know, 30-foot is well within the three-story limit, 02:56:32.260 --> 02:56:35.399 and we do use both stories inside of there, 02:56:36.399 --> 02:56:38.059 for functionality of equipment 02:56:38.059 --> 02:56:39.540 to keep the footprint smaller. 02:56:39.540 --> 02:56:40.659 - That's all I wanted. 02:56:40.659 --> 02:56:42.299 If it can't be done, it can't be done. 02:56:42.299 --> 02:56:44.860 - Have another question, Commissioner Ellis. 02:56:44.860 --> 02:56:47.299 - Thank you, Chair, it's actually for Josh as well. 02:56:50.059 --> 02:56:52.579 Somebody who spoke mentioned earlier, 02:56:52.579 --> 02:56:54.579 talking like a full-service car wash. 02:56:54.579 --> 02:56:56.180 Is yours a full-service car wash 02:56:56.180 --> 02:56:57.299 where people drop off their cars? 02:56:57.299 --> 02:57:00.139 - No, it's not, no, thanks for bringing that point up. 02:57:00.139 --> 02:57:02.180 This is what, in the car wash industry, 02:57:02.180 --> 02:57:04.860 we consider an express exterior car wash. 02:57:04.860 --> 02:57:09.270 So, in the big picture, our services are as long as it 02:57:09.270 --> 02:57:09.500 takes 02:57:09.500 --> 02:57:11.899 to go through the tunnel, which is about two and a half 02:57:11.899 --> 02:57:15.219 minutes, you know, so the car wash is two and a half 02:57:15.219 --> 02:57:15.579 minutes, 02:57:15.579 --> 02:57:18.739 and then we're gonna have those row of vacuums 02:57:18.739 --> 02:57:21.520 we've been discussing, 20 free vacuums. 02:57:21.520 --> 02:57:23.579 It is then up to the customer 02:57:23.579 --> 02:57:25.860 how long they choose to stay there. 02:57:25.860 --> 02:57:28.399 You know, so if they wanna detail their own car there, 02:57:28.399 --> 02:57:30.819 yes, that could be a possibility. 02:57:30.819 --> 02:57:32.139 The majority, you can go to Google, 02:57:32.139 --> 02:57:35.020 even at our current facility, 20 minutes is typically 02:57:35.020 --> 02:57:37.639 the maximum time anyone spends on the property. 02:57:39.500 --> 02:57:40.739 - Follow-up, please. 02:57:40.739 --> 02:57:42.780 - Thank you, and then just one more thing. 02:57:42.780 --> 02:57:43.620 - No problem. 02:57:43.620 --> 02:57:45.260 - Why it's important to have a neighborhood meeting, 02:57:45.260 --> 02:57:47.940 so a lot of this stuff could have been maybe talked about 02:57:47.940 --> 02:57:51.340 and maybe discussed and maybe understood better 02:57:51.340 --> 02:57:52.979 for exactly what your development was 02:57:52.979 --> 02:57:56.940 and what we have the parameters to do. 02:57:58.100 --> 02:58:00.459 One of the gentlemen mentioned it, a win-win. 02:58:00.459 --> 02:58:03.819 That is what we really have to produce here, in my opinion. 02:58:03.819 --> 02:58:05.700 Something that works for you, we can't stop you. 02:58:05.700 --> 02:58:07.139 I wish you were bringing me something else 02:58:07.139 --> 02:58:08.940 and it wasn't a car wash, honestly. 02:58:09.860 --> 02:58:13.459 But knowing the car wash is allowed in the PD by right, 02:58:13.459 --> 02:58:16.659 what we have to do is figure out how to mitigate 02:58:16.659 --> 02:58:19.260 the nuisances that a car wash causes here. 02:58:19.260 --> 02:58:21.100 The PD, when it was put in place in the '90s, 02:58:21.100 --> 02:58:23.899 allowed for your use to happen. 02:58:23.899 --> 02:58:26.020 So now what we need to do is how do we allow 02:58:26.020 --> 02:58:29.459 your use to happen by sticking you 02:58:29.459 --> 02:58:30.860 in the middle of all these homes. 02:58:30.860 --> 02:58:31.700 - Right, right. 02:58:31.700 --> 02:58:33.739 - And certainly that's where their concerns are, 02:58:33.739 --> 02:58:36.340 that's where some of our concerns lie as well. 02:58:36.340 --> 02:58:37.180 - Absolutely. 02:58:38.620 --> 02:58:41.059 - Commissioner Beck, do you have a follow-up question? 02:58:42.100 --> 02:58:43.459 Okay, I understand. 02:58:45.739 --> 02:58:47.059 Sure. 02:58:47.059 --> 02:58:48.899 - I did have a couple of things to address 02:58:48.899 --> 02:58:51.620 some couple of the questions that were brought up. 02:58:51.620 --> 02:58:54.219 I have one item down here regarding the drainage. 02:58:54.219 --> 02:58:56.659 We are building a detention pond at the back of the site 02:58:56.659 --> 02:59:00.500 to mitigate the increase in drainage runoff from the site. 02:59:00.500 --> 02:59:01.860 So we've taken that into account, 02:59:01.860 --> 02:59:04.379 designed that according to city ordinances, 02:59:04.379 --> 02:59:05.540 and obviously we'll follow along 02:59:05.540 --> 02:59:07.420 with any additional comments city staff 02:59:07.420 --> 02:59:09.100 may have associated with that. 02:59:10.420 --> 02:59:13.020 As far as the lane closure up there on the front 02:59:13.020 --> 02:59:15.500 that was concerned on 2499, 02:59:15.500 --> 02:59:18.020 that'd be for a short duration just for the construction 02:59:18.020 --> 02:59:19.500 of it, so it really shouldn't have 02:59:19.500 --> 02:59:21.819 any long-term impacts on that. 02:59:21.819 --> 02:59:25.340 And then as far as the height going up three feet 02:59:25.340 --> 02:59:28.659 on the site with the building, 02:59:28.659 --> 02:59:30.340 one of the intents we were trying to do 02:59:30.340 --> 02:59:32.299 is there's a row of trees back there 02:59:32.299 --> 02:59:36.379 to preserve that existing buffer that's there, 02:59:36.379 --> 02:59:39.739 the trees for the help to mitigate sound, site, 02:59:39.739 --> 02:59:42.739 other stuff with some fully mature trees there. 02:59:42.739 --> 02:59:45.420 That's one of the things that the client came to us with 02:59:45.420 --> 02:59:46.979 is hey, let's try and save those 02:59:46.979 --> 02:59:49.860 because that will kind of shade that away 02:59:49.860 --> 02:59:52.620 from some of the close residences there. 02:59:52.620 --> 02:59:54.420 So we did pull that back there. 02:59:54.420 --> 02:59:57.459 Plus the building we're actually cutting down 02:59:57.459 --> 02:59:59.340 inside of the hill, so we're not building up 02:59:59.340 --> 03:00:02.940 at elevations that are closer to the existing conditions. 03:00:02.940 --> 03:00:05.540 With some of those concerns we have dropped it down, 03:00:05.540 --> 03:00:06.860 but there is a little bit of a burn, 03:00:06.860 --> 03:00:08.840 but it does go up much higher than where we're at right now 03:00:08.840 --> 03:00:08.979 . 03:00:08.979 --> 03:00:10.620 I think we're benching into the site roughly 03:00:10.620 --> 03:00:12.579 about three or four feet right now. 03:00:12.579 --> 03:00:15.139 - Do you have a couple follow-up questions? 03:00:15.139 --> 03:00:16.139 Commissioner Back. 03:00:17.020 --> 03:00:17.860 - Thank you, Chair. 03:00:17.860 --> 03:00:20.780 Actually this is for Mr. Boshy if you don't mind. 03:00:23.579 --> 03:00:25.700 The neighborhood meeting concept is important. 03:00:25.700 --> 03:00:28.459 Now right now it isn't required. 03:00:29.979 --> 03:00:33.020 It is suggested for zone changes 03:00:33.020 --> 03:00:35.260 and anytime there's gonna be a commercial development 03:00:35.260 --> 03:00:38.700 come in next to, in the future for the citizens 03:00:38.700 --> 03:00:40.420 that will be a mandated thing 03:00:40.420 --> 03:00:41.899 that when there's a zone change. 03:00:41.899 --> 03:00:46.899 But our obligation here is to respect your rights there, 03:00:48.459 --> 03:00:51.700 but we've also got an obligation to the citizens 03:00:51.700 --> 03:00:53.020 that you're gonna be neighbors with too. 03:00:53.020 --> 03:00:54.979 So let me ask you this. 03:00:54.979 --> 03:00:57.780 Would you be opposed to a motion 03:00:57.780 --> 03:01:00.459 to postpone this for two weeks 03:01:00.459 --> 03:01:03.459 and give you an opportunity to sit down with your neighbors 03:01:03.459 --> 03:01:03.459 ? 03:01:03.459 --> 03:01:05.170 'Cause they've asked a lot of questions that we can't 03:01:05.170 --> 03:01:05.540 answer. 03:01:05.540 --> 03:01:08.059 They've made a lot of statements that 03:01:08.059 --> 03:01:09.579 there's a little bit of hyperbole in there 03:01:09.579 --> 03:01:11.299 and there's a little misinformation in there 03:01:11.299 --> 03:01:14.219 and you're really the only one that can answer that. 03:01:14.219 --> 03:01:17.579 Would you be opposed to a motion to postpone this 03:01:17.579 --> 03:01:21.340 until for two weeks, the next PNZ meeting, 03:01:21.340 --> 03:01:23.899 establish a meeting with your neighbors, 03:01:23.899 --> 03:01:26.979 give them a location and sit down and talk with them? 03:01:26.979 --> 03:01:29.780 I know it's kind of a frightening prospect 03:01:29.780 --> 03:01:33.420 what you'll face, but you are gonna be their neighbor. 03:01:35.139 --> 03:01:36.020 You need to be a good neighbor. 03:01:36.020 --> 03:01:37.299 They need to be a good neighbor too. 03:01:37.299 --> 03:01:38.139 - Absolutely. - And this will give you 03:01:38.139 --> 03:01:40.620 an opportunity to get a chance to know each other, 03:01:40.620 --> 03:01:41.459 fill each other out. 03:01:41.459 --> 03:01:44.940 So in response to my question. 03:01:44.940 --> 03:01:46.219 - I would prefer not. 03:01:46.219 --> 03:01:48.219 - You would prefer not, okay, understand. 03:01:48.219 --> 03:01:50.059 All right, thank you. 03:01:50.059 --> 03:01:53.670 - Well, Commissioner Beck, just to kind of piggyback on 03:01:53.670 --> 03:01:54.500 that, 03:01:54.500 --> 03:01:56.819 this is gonna go on to city council. 03:01:56.819 --> 03:01:59.700 So we will not be the final say on this. 03:01:59.700 --> 03:02:02.540 This is a recommendation to city council. 03:02:02.540 --> 03:02:05.020 So I would encourage all the residents 03:02:05.020 --> 03:02:08.260 that this is with whatever action that we take this evening 03:02:08.260 --> 03:02:08.260 , 03:02:08.260 --> 03:02:10.739 this is not the final action on this item. 03:02:10.739 --> 03:02:12.219 It will move on to city council 03:02:12.219 --> 03:02:14.579 and you are more than welcome to come back out. 03:02:14.579 --> 03:02:16.139 You'll be able to fill out cards. 03:02:16.139 --> 03:02:18.340 You'll be able to have your three or four minutes 03:02:18.340 --> 03:02:21.579 time to speak and voice your concerns to city council. 03:02:21.579 --> 03:02:24.899 And they will be the ultimate decision makers 03:02:24.899 --> 03:02:27.260 on this particular project. 03:02:27.260 --> 03:02:28.739 So I do want to let all of you know 03:02:28.739 --> 03:02:31.899 that you do have an opportunity to continue 03:02:31.899 --> 03:02:33.659 to be involved in the process 03:02:33.659 --> 03:02:36.180 and to speak again on this item. 03:02:36.180 --> 03:02:38.020 So I do want to make that clarification 03:02:38.020 --> 03:02:40.139 that there is additional opportunity 03:02:40.139 --> 03:02:41.940 to continue to be involved. 03:02:43.340 --> 03:02:44.540 Commissioner Ellis. 03:02:44.540 --> 03:02:45.579 - Thank you, Chair. 03:02:45.579 --> 03:02:47.940 So maybe for you, Josh, maybe engineering. 03:02:47.940 --> 03:02:49.379 I don't know. 03:02:49.379 --> 03:02:53.979 One of my concerns, staff talked about a light pollution, 03:02:53.979 --> 03:02:55.420 talked about signage, 03:02:55.420 --> 03:02:57.219 but they didn't talk about was noise. 03:02:59.700 --> 03:03:01.860 Given their concerns with the vacuum created 03:03:01.860 --> 03:03:03.780 from the masonry wall and that, 03:03:03.780 --> 03:03:07.200 is there another route to go that would be better than that 03:03:07.200 --> 03:03:07.219 ? 03:03:07.219 --> 03:03:11.260 Is, you know, I don't have that expertise. 03:03:13.540 --> 03:03:17.700 - I guess I can allude to some options on the table. 03:03:18.819 --> 03:03:21.340 We were discussing that in the back of the room slightly, 03:03:21.340 --> 03:03:24.739 but a big picture, I guess, 03:03:24.739 --> 03:03:26.940 I'd really encourage everyone to do some research 03:03:26.940 --> 03:03:29.340 and get close to a car wash. 03:03:29.340 --> 03:03:30.700 Find out what, you know, 03:03:30.700 --> 03:03:32.940 we all assume there's noise pollution. 03:03:32.940 --> 03:03:34.819 Being a car wash owner, 03:03:34.819 --> 03:03:36.659 there is not a lot of noise involved. 03:03:36.659 --> 03:03:39.819 Is there the errant car that blares the stereo too loud? 03:03:39.819 --> 03:03:40.659 Yeah, but you know what? 03:03:40.659 --> 03:03:42.739 My neighbor blares the stereo too loud too. 03:03:42.739 --> 03:03:45.260 You know, so at some point, 03:03:45.260 --> 03:03:47.659 we have to control that ourselves. 03:03:47.659 --> 03:03:51.700 But, you know, we're putting up a masonry wall. 03:03:51.700 --> 03:03:54.379 You know, is there a landscape alternative? 03:03:54.379 --> 03:03:57.059 You know, would a row of bushes be better 03:03:57.059 --> 03:03:59.340 than a row of concrete? 03:03:59.340 --> 03:04:00.860 You know, so I mean, 03:04:00.860 --> 03:04:02.500 that's the kind of stuff I'm thinking about 03:04:02.500 --> 03:04:05.059 'cause we absolutely do want to honor 03:04:05.059 --> 03:04:06.899 as many of these comments as we can. 03:04:08.059 --> 03:04:09.739 - Do you have any, if I may? 03:04:09.739 --> 03:04:11.139 - Sure, continue. - Thank you. 03:04:11.139 --> 03:04:14.459 Do you have any parameters in your business model 03:04:14.459 --> 03:04:18.139 that keeps people from blasting their radios 03:04:18.139 --> 03:04:21.139 while they're detailing their cars for a couple of hours? 03:04:22.059 --> 03:04:22.899 - There isn't. 03:04:22.899 --> 03:04:25.659 I think it would probably be up to me and my staff members 03:04:25.659 --> 03:04:27.940 to just ask them to be respectful. 03:04:27.940 --> 03:04:29.979 You know, and that would be different at this car wash 03:04:29.979 --> 03:04:32.540 versus my existing car wash on Teasley. 03:04:32.540 --> 03:04:35.020 The existing car wash on Teasley is open 24 hours 03:04:35.020 --> 03:04:37.340 and it is an unstaffed model. 03:04:37.340 --> 03:04:38.299 This one, you know, like I said, 03:04:38.299 --> 03:04:40.899 we will employ five to 10 employees, 03:04:40.899 --> 03:04:45.020 but two to four will be on staff at any given time. 03:04:45.020 --> 03:04:49.059 So that is something that we could police at this site 03:04:49.059 --> 03:04:50.899 in opposition to the other site. 03:04:50.899 --> 03:04:51.739 - I'd love to encourage you to do that. 03:04:51.739 --> 03:04:52.979 - Yes. - Because the row 03:04:52.979 --> 03:04:54.940 where people will be doing the detailing, 03:04:54.940 --> 03:04:57.299 you know, 'cause the houses are right there. 03:04:57.299 --> 03:05:00.700 Then I guess my final question would be 03:05:01.659 --> 03:05:04.500 for the folks across 2499, 03:05:04.500 --> 03:05:08.979 that obviously you're going to affect visually. 03:05:08.979 --> 03:05:09.899 - Visually, correct. 03:05:09.899 --> 03:05:10.940 - Is there anything, 03:05:10.940 --> 03:05:13.340 I don't have the plant pulled up in front of me, 03:05:13.340 --> 03:05:16.020 what do you have proposed fronting? 03:05:17.379 --> 03:05:19.780 - We have a green belt, 03:05:19.780 --> 03:05:22.100 we'll call it for lack of better terms there, 03:05:22.100 --> 03:05:26.540 that does fall into 2499 easement right away, 03:05:26.540 --> 03:05:27.379 that kind of thing. 03:05:27.379 --> 03:05:29.899 So as far as us putting anything there, 03:05:29.899 --> 03:05:31.540 it's gonna be grass, 03:05:31.540 --> 03:05:36.540 because it falls in under those easements and right away. 03:05:36.620 --> 03:05:38.819 So we're restricted there. 03:05:40.899 --> 03:05:42.579 (man mumbling) 03:05:42.579 --> 03:05:45.059 Yeah, yeah, so we actually worked with staff 03:05:45.059 --> 03:05:48.020 and our original landscape plan did call 03:05:48.020 --> 03:05:50.780 for some landscaping there that we were asked to remove, 03:05:52.100 --> 03:05:53.860 due to the easement and right away. 03:05:57.500 --> 03:05:59.020 - One more question, Commissioner Beck. 03:05:59.020 --> 03:05:59.860 - Thank you, Chair. 03:05:59.860 --> 03:06:02.260 I remembered what it was that I couldn't let go. 03:06:03.219 --> 03:06:04.299 Several people had mentioned 03:06:04.299 --> 03:06:06.219 that there's multiple car washes around there, 03:06:06.219 --> 03:06:07.780 you actually own one of them. 03:06:07.780 --> 03:06:11.500 Is this good business practice to put another car wash 03:06:11.500 --> 03:06:14.139 in close proximity to where the ones are? 03:06:14.139 --> 03:06:16.139 What's the rationale behind? 03:06:17.219 --> 03:06:19.620 - The rationale, it goes back to one of your comments too, 03:06:19.620 --> 03:06:21.420 it comes down to population density, right? 03:06:21.420 --> 03:06:22.899 And if we look at that area 03:06:22.899 --> 03:06:24.299 and we look at the number of rooftops, 03:06:24.299 --> 03:06:26.940 the number of people, the number of cars in that area, 03:06:26.940 --> 03:06:28.420 it's astronomical. 03:06:29.659 --> 03:06:31.860 My existing car wash does do very well, 03:06:31.860 --> 03:06:34.940 it is very busy based on the traffic, right? 03:06:34.940 --> 03:06:39.020 Now we have 2499, Teasley's getting expanded to six lanes. 03:06:39.020 --> 03:06:41.299 This is a very popular area of the city. 03:06:41.299 --> 03:06:44.500 There are more subdivisions getting built all the time. 03:06:44.500 --> 03:06:45.979 The demand is there. 03:06:45.979 --> 03:06:48.100 - So you're just trying to stay ahead of the loop? 03:06:48.100 --> 03:06:51.620 - Absolutely, and in general, car washes have a, 03:06:51.620 --> 03:06:55.180 you pull from a one to two mile area around your car wash. 03:06:55.180 --> 03:06:57.620 It is largely local residents that use it. 03:07:00.860 --> 03:07:01.780 - So any other questions? 03:07:01.780 --> 03:07:02.620 Thank you, sir. 03:07:05.620 --> 03:07:07.780 Again, do not have any other cards. 03:07:07.780 --> 03:07:09.739 Anyone else who hasn't spoke 03:07:09.739 --> 03:07:11.139 that would like to speak on this item, 03:07:11.139 --> 03:07:12.780 please come forward at this time. 03:07:14.139 --> 03:07:16.700 Have you, I'm gonna allow one exception 03:07:16.700 --> 03:07:18.860 and I'll give you an opportunity to make a final point 03:07:18.860 --> 03:07:22.059 and then we're gonna move on with the business tonight. 03:07:22.059 --> 03:07:26.700 - Tom Brandt, what is the process of changing the ordinance 03:07:26.700 --> 03:07:27.059 ? 03:07:27.260 --> 03:07:30.340 What can we do as citizens to tell you we wanna change? 03:07:30.340 --> 03:07:34.020 Do we make a motion? 03:07:34.979 --> 03:07:37.979 How do we get the process changed to change that ordinance, 03:07:37.979 --> 03:07:41.620 at least in that area of our residential area? 03:07:41.620 --> 03:07:45.620 He's talking about populated, his other car wash is 24/7. 03:07:45.620 --> 03:07:48.780 They're not surrounded by our neighborhoods, 03:07:48.780 --> 03:07:51.940 several hundreds of houses, neighborhoods. 03:07:51.940 --> 03:07:54.340 I see his point, business is business. 03:07:54.340 --> 03:07:58.459 We don't want that business in our neighborhood. 03:07:58.459 --> 03:07:59.299 That's all. 03:07:59.299 --> 03:08:01.299 If we don't want that, legal or not, 03:08:01.299 --> 03:08:06.299 that it's a set aside 1990, how can we change that this 03:08:06.299 --> 03:08:06.299 year? 03:08:08.979 --> 03:08:10.219 Can we change that? 03:08:10.219 --> 03:08:11.059 - No. 03:08:11.059 --> 03:08:12.459 - Or make a motion to change it? 03:08:12.459 --> 03:08:13.299 - No. 03:08:13.299 --> 03:08:14.139 - Okay. 03:08:14.139 --> 03:08:17.020 - I think it's been said as deftly as we can say it. 03:08:17.020 --> 03:08:18.260 - Is it something to go through the state? 03:08:18.260 --> 03:08:19.899 I mean, what is the process? 03:08:20.899 --> 03:08:22.340 - You buy the property yourself 03:08:22.340 --> 03:08:24.739 and then you can do what you like with it. 03:08:24.739 --> 03:08:25.579 - Hey. 03:08:25.579 --> 03:08:26.420 (audience laughing) 03:08:26.420 --> 03:08:28.379 - And unfortunately-- 03:08:28.379 --> 03:08:29.219 - I wanna pool. 03:08:29.219 --> 03:08:31.500 - Well, that's an option too. 03:08:31.500 --> 03:08:32.540 - I'm just watering. 03:08:32.540 --> 03:08:33.700 - The problem that we really have 03:08:33.700 --> 03:08:35.579 and everyone here on this commission 03:08:35.579 --> 03:08:38.299 is sympathetic to the plight of all the residents. 03:08:38.299 --> 03:08:39.120 - I accept that. 03:08:39.120 --> 03:08:40.979 - The unfortunate situation that we have 03:08:40.979 --> 03:08:43.139 is we have a property owner who's bought a piece of 03:08:43.139 --> 03:08:43.979 property 03:08:44.979 --> 03:08:48.700 that is already been designated back in the '90s 03:08:48.700 --> 03:08:50.700 that it's a permitted use, 03:08:50.700 --> 03:08:53.180 that they can put that kind of business there. 03:08:53.180 --> 03:08:55.379 And then the requirement that we have 03:08:55.379 --> 03:08:57.579 and that we spend a lot of time in work session 03:08:57.579 --> 03:08:59.860 and again here this evening is to make sure 03:08:59.860 --> 03:09:01.500 that if that business goes in there 03:09:01.500 --> 03:09:03.840 that it meets all of the requirements 03:09:03.840 --> 03:09:06.500 that our city has citywide for any business, 03:09:06.500 --> 03:09:09.100 his business or anyone else's business 03:09:09.100 --> 03:09:12.979 that it meets our requirements for lighting, 03:09:12.979 --> 03:09:16.219 that the lighting doesn't bleed into your neighborhood, 03:09:16.219 --> 03:09:17.819 setbacks that it has to have 03:09:17.819 --> 03:09:20.180 and how far it has to be away from the neighborhood, 03:09:20.180 --> 03:09:25.010 what time of buffers, landscaping, ingress, egress does it 03:09:25.010 --> 03:09:25.180 have? 03:09:25.739 --> 03:09:27.579 And those are the things that this commission 03:09:27.579 --> 03:09:30.180 has the ability to have a say in. 03:09:30.180 --> 03:09:32.700 And our hands beyond that are really tied 03:09:32.700 --> 03:09:34.700 because it is a piece of property 03:09:34.700 --> 03:09:36.979 that was designated many years ago 03:09:36.979 --> 03:09:39.459 with multiple types of uses that can go there 03:09:39.459 --> 03:09:41.299 and that is one of the uses that's there. 03:09:41.299 --> 03:09:42.420 So it's kind of like us saying, 03:09:42.420 --> 03:09:44.700 well you can't have a house in your neighborhood. 03:09:44.700 --> 03:09:46.700 And you go, well everybody has a house here, 03:09:46.700 --> 03:09:47.940 they was determined to have houses. 03:09:47.940 --> 03:09:51.100 Well what color can it be and what color, 03:09:51.100 --> 03:09:52.500 what kind of brick can you put on it? 03:09:52.500 --> 03:09:53.700 Those are the types of things 03:09:53.700 --> 03:09:56.379 that we're put in a position of here 03:09:56.379 --> 03:09:58.139 is that it's permitted to go there 03:09:58.139 --> 03:09:59.620 and then there are only certain things 03:09:59.620 --> 03:10:01.139 that we have the ability to have a say on 03:10:01.139 --> 03:10:04.100 and we're trying as hard as we can in work session. 03:10:04.100 --> 03:10:06.540 And here to put is make sure 03:10:06.540 --> 03:10:08.299 that all of those conditions are met 03:10:08.299 --> 03:10:09.899 and if there are a few other things 03:10:09.899 --> 03:10:11.579 that we can ask them to do, 03:10:11.579 --> 03:10:14.260 like will they make the wall taller 03:10:14.260 --> 03:10:16.979 to try to mitigate the noise even more 03:10:16.979 --> 03:10:18.979 above what they're required to do 03:10:18.979 --> 03:10:20.379 and out of the goodness of their heart, 03:10:20.379 --> 03:10:21.899 will they do that? 03:10:21.899 --> 03:10:24.700 We have tried to do the best we can as this commission 03:10:24.700 --> 03:10:26.540 to have them be compliant 03:10:26.540 --> 03:10:27.739 and if there's a few other things 03:10:27.739 --> 03:10:29.180 that we can have them agree to, 03:10:29.180 --> 03:10:32.020 to do that, to do all that we can on the commission. 03:10:32.020 --> 03:10:33.459 And other than that, 03:10:33.459 --> 03:10:36.379 we're very sympathetic to the issues of the neighbors 03:10:36.379 --> 03:10:39.659 and understand that they don't want it there, 03:10:39.659 --> 03:10:42.420 but the problem is is it's permitted to go there. 03:10:42.420 --> 03:10:45.620 To your point, if it wasn't permitted to go there, 03:10:45.620 --> 03:10:48.340 this commission has a very different say in it. 03:10:48.340 --> 03:10:50.219 But when it is permitted to go there, 03:10:50.219 --> 03:10:53.379 legally, we don't have a lot of ability 03:10:53.379 --> 03:10:55.500 to tell somebody that you can't put something 03:10:55.500 --> 03:10:57.100 on a piece of property that legally 03:10:57.100 --> 03:10:59.700 the city has said in the 90s, you can. 03:10:59.700 --> 03:11:01.500 And that's really where our hands are tied 03:11:01.500 --> 03:11:05.059 and it's unfortunate and I know people don't like it. 03:11:05.059 --> 03:11:07.059 People aren't happy with us as commissioners 03:11:07.059 --> 03:11:09.899 serving here as volunteers trying to enforce 03:11:09.899 --> 03:11:12.260 the rules and the regulation of the city 03:11:12.260 --> 03:11:14.100 and respect people's property rights, 03:11:14.100 --> 03:11:16.979 taxpayers that live here and pay taxes now, 03:11:16.979 --> 03:11:19.340 people who are going to be taxpayers 03:11:19.340 --> 03:11:23.059 and try to find, as someone said, a win-win. 03:11:23.059 --> 03:11:24.899 And I wish we could have a win-win 03:11:24.899 --> 03:11:26.139 that he could go down the street 03:11:26.139 --> 03:11:29.100 and y'all could have a park behind your houses. 03:11:29.100 --> 03:11:31.459 And I think that opportunity for that 03:11:31.459 --> 03:11:33.139 was probably about 30 years ago. 03:11:33.139 --> 03:11:35.819 And that's not the hand that we have here this evening. 03:11:35.819 --> 03:11:40.819 And so I appreciate all of the residents 03:11:40.979 --> 03:11:42.979 who come out tonight to share their thoughts. 03:11:42.979 --> 03:11:45.180 And I hope that the residents understand 03:11:45.180 --> 03:11:48.780 we have a limited ability in what we as a commission can do 03:11:48.780 --> 03:11:48.780 . 03:11:48.780 --> 03:11:50.860 And one of those things for sure is to tell them 03:11:50.860 --> 03:11:52.739 that they can't, we don't have the ability 03:11:52.739 --> 03:11:55.819 to do that on this particular incident. 03:11:55.819 --> 03:11:59.100 I'm sorry that we don't, but we don't. 03:11:59.100 --> 03:12:01.700 And so it's not that we're not sympathetic, 03:12:01.700 --> 03:12:04.219 it is there's limits that we have 03:12:04.219 --> 03:12:07.579 and that's where we are on this issue tonight. 03:12:07.579 --> 03:12:09.540 And so I hope you appreciate, 03:12:10.780 --> 03:12:11.979 trying to give you an opportunity to come back 03:12:11.979 --> 03:12:13.940 and speak a second time, that's not a protocol. 03:12:13.940 --> 03:12:16.739 We've tried to get as much information 03:12:16.739 --> 03:12:18.979 from the owner and the engineer to provide 03:12:18.979 --> 03:12:22.180 as much information to the neighbors and the residents. 03:12:22.180 --> 03:12:25.059 And like I said earlier, we are not gonna be 03:12:25.059 --> 03:12:27.100 the final decision maker on this. 03:12:27.100 --> 03:12:29.899 We will make a recommendation to city council 03:12:29.899 --> 03:12:32.780 and city council will be the final decision maker 03:12:32.780 --> 03:12:33.620 on this item. 03:12:33.620 --> 03:12:36.979 And so I invite everyone who's come out this evening, 03:12:36.979 --> 03:12:37.860 keep an eye on this. 03:12:37.860 --> 03:12:40.579 I'm sure your neighborhood is going to be 03:12:40.579 --> 03:12:41.899 very involved with it. 03:12:41.899 --> 03:12:44.739 Come back out and come speak at city council. 03:12:44.739 --> 03:12:47.100 You'll have another opportunity to make any 03:12:47.100 --> 03:12:50.020 and all of the points that you would like on this item. 03:12:50.020 --> 03:12:52.100 So thank you all for coming. 03:12:52.100 --> 03:12:53.299 - Thank you for your info. 03:12:53.299 --> 03:12:54.899 - Yes, sir, thank you. 03:12:56.739 --> 03:12:59.659 With that, I have no other cards and no one else to speak 03:12:59.659 --> 03:13:03.500 and I'll call on Haley before I close a public hearing. 03:13:04.739 --> 03:13:06.659 - Just wanted to clarify from some comments 03:13:06.659 --> 03:13:07.500 I heard behind me. 03:13:07.500 --> 03:13:10.219 This will be going on the August 21st council agenda 03:13:10.219 --> 03:13:11.780 rather than August 7th. 03:13:11.780 --> 03:13:13.739 - And that meeting starts at what time? 03:13:13.739 --> 03:13:14.579 - 630. 03:13:14.579 --> 03:13:15.979 - 630 on the 21st. 03:13:15.979 --> 03:13:16.819 - Yes, sir. 03:13:16.819 --> 03:13:17.659 - Okay, great. 03:13:17.659 --> 03:13:19.219 I hope you all come back out for that. 03:13:19.219 --> 03:13:22.700 You're welcome to reach out to your city council people 03:13:22.700 --> 03:13:26.579 if you have concerns about that and voice your concerns 03:13:26.579 --> 03:13:28.219 and your opinions to them as well. 03:13:29.780 --> 03:13:30.700 Commissioner Ellis. 03:13:30.700 --> 03:13:31.979 - Thank you, Chair. 03:13:31.979 --> 03:13:33.540 So you had mentioned a little bit ago 03:13:33.540 --> 03:13:36.700 about the wall height again. 03:13:36.700 --> 03:13:38.860 So engineering point of view or, 03:13:41.219 --> 03:13:42.700 if we raise it two feet, 03:13:42.700 --> 03:13:44.979 is that? 03:13:44.979 --> 03:13:46.260 - That's not a problem. 03:13:46.260 --> 03:13:50.899 I think my engineer here spoke to that general area 03:13:50.899 --> 03:13:54.139 is we'll just call it the high point in the neighborhood. 03:13:54.139 --> 03:13:56.299 Right, you know, my property as well as the property 03:13:56.299 --> 03:13:58.620 in the north to me that are both undeveloped. 03:13:58.620 --> 03:14:00.659 That's the high part in the neighborhood. 03:14:01.860 --> 03:14:04.420 We are through engineering and grading, 03:14:04.420 --> 03:14:07.620 lowering our property about three feet. 03:14:07.620 --> 03:14:10.219 But in comparison to the residents, 03:14:10.219 --> 03:14:13.579 that is still above the residential neighborhood above us. 03:14:13.579 --> 03:14:16.420 So I was talking about the three feet up from the residents 03:14:16.420 --> 03:14:16.420 . 03:14:16.420 --> 03:14:18.620 He was talking that we're actually lowering it 03:14:18.620 --> 03:14:19.819 from the existing grade. 03:14:19.819 --> 03:14:23.780 So it'll actually be lower than the land is currently. 03:14:24.860 --> 03:14:27.979 We are setting the wall on top of the curb, 03:14:27.979 --> 03:14:29.780 on top of the fire lane that goes around us. 03:14:29.780 --> 03:14:32.180 So we do have a nice green belt around that, 03:14:32.180 --> 03:14:35.260 those existing legacy trees that are there. 03:14:37.059 --> 03:14:38.299 Because our property is higher 03:14:38.299 --> 03:14:40.700 and we'll have a wall on top of our curb. 03:14:40.700 --> 03:14:43.059 We're gonna have the working height of 89 feet 03:14:43.059 --> 03:14:45.819 when you're viewing it from those residents backyard. 03:14:45.819 --> 03:14:50.139 If you'd make the recommendation to add additional feet 03:14:50.139 --> 03:14:52.860 to that wall, that is something I would absolutely consider 03:14:52.860 --> 03:14:53.059 . 03:14:54.659 --> 03:14:56.020 - I think I had asked you earlier 03:14:56.020 --> 03:14:58.139 if you would add two feet to it on your side 03:14:58.139 --> 03:14:59.020 and make it eight foot. 03:14:59.020 --> 03:15:00.219 Are you agreeable to that? 03:15:00.219 --> 03:15:03.780 If we make that as a condition? 03:15:03.780 --> 03:15:07.420 - I would just, the only concern from an engineer, 03:15:07.420 --> 03:15:09.659 I stand, sorry, the only concern 03:15:09.659 --> 03:15:11.979 from an engineering standpoint, landscape, 03:15:13.020 --> 03:15:16.299 the wall height will create the limbing up of the trees. 03:15:16.299 --> 03:15:19.620 So the trees will actually, the wall will go up. 03:15:19.620 --> 03:15:22.299 So your trees will actually be impacted 03:15:22.299 --> 03:15:24.100 with the wall height on that. 03:15:25.780 --> 03:15:28.340 - Thank you for letting us know that as well. 03:15:30.059 --> 03:15:33.379 Again, I'm going to, thank you Jerry. 03:15:34.500 --> 03:15:38.620 I have no more cards and I've asked for additional speakers 03:15:38.620 --> 03:15:40.059 a couple of times and at this time 03:15:40.059 --> 03:15:41.780 I'm going to close the public hearing 03:15:41.780 --> 03:15:45.100 and I'm gonna open this item for discussion or a motion. 03:15:50.020 --> 03:15:50.940 Commissioner Beck. 03:15:52.059 --> 03:15:54.899 - Let me make a comment first and then I'll make a motion. 03:15:54.899 --> 03:15:57.840 Again, I'm gonna repeat myself here and explain that. 03:15:58.739 --> 03:16:01.700 We're in a position where we have to honor the rights 03:16:01.700 --> 03:16:05.540 of the property owner that has bought property 03:16:05.540 --> 03:16:07.899 that he can legally build what he's building. 03:16:07.899 --> 03:16:10.979 Our job here is not to pick and choose what gets there, 03:16:10.979 --> 03:16:14.020 but what does go there has to meet certain requirements 03:16:14.020 --> 03:16:17.700 and I honestly feel Mr. Boshie has done a lot more 03:16:18.620 --> 03:16:21.979 than he has to to try and accommodate noise, traffic, 03:16:21.979 --> 03:16:23.979 and the things he can do. 03:16:23.979 --> 03:16:27.899 You bought your property feeling like it was gonna be 03:16:27.899 --> 03:16:30.739 that way for a lot longer than it turned out to 03:16:30.739 --> 03:16:33.340 and that's unfortunate, I understand that feeling. 03:16:34.500 --> 03:16:39.500 But again, population growth is gonna affect change 03:16:40.139 --> 03:16:42.260 in negative ways for some people 03:16:42.260 --> 03:16:43.659 and positive ways in others. 03:16:43.659 --> 03:16:47.860 So I'm gonna go ahead and make a motion 03:16:47.860 --> 03:16:50.180 that we approve this with the understanding 03:16:50.180 --> 03:16:52.219 that we really don't have any other choice. 03:16:52.219 --> 03:16:54.180 By right he can build that there 03:16:54.180 --> 03:16:59.180 and as Chairman Strange pointed out, 03:16:59.979 --> 03:17:01.819 this will move on to the City Council 03:17:01.819 --> 03:17:03.739 where you can voice your concerns there. 03:17:03.739 --> 03:17:07.739 So I motion that we approve PDA 18-04. 03:17:10.940 --> 03:17:12.260 - Commissioner Becker, I'm gonna second 03:17:12.260 --> 03:17:14.700 and ask for a friendly amendment 03:17:14.700 --> 03:17:18.620 to extend the wall two feet higher 03:17:18.620 --> 03:17:20.819 from a six foot height to an eight foot height 03:17:20.819 --> 03:17:23.260 and I believe you said you were agreeable to that. 03:17:25.020 --> 03:17:28.379 And then do we have any other conditions staff wise on this 03:17:28.379 --> 03:17:30.700 that we need to make sure to get in this motion 03:17:31.780 --> 03:17:33.500 in our backup? 03:17:33.500 --> 03:17:36.620 - Certainly, let me pull those up here. 03:17:37.899 --> 03:17:39.500 And I did also wanna point out, 03:17:39.500 --> 03:17:41.940 I received one more email opposition letter 03:17:41.940 --> 03:17:44.739 while we were sitting here that someone asked to share. 03:17:44.739 --> 03:17:49.739 Vincent Colano from 3210 Friesian Court 03:17:50.979 --> 03:17:52.139 is concerned about noise 03:17:52.139 --> 03:17:54.659 and keeping his neighborhood peaceful. 03:17:54.659 --> 03:17:56.459 - Thank you for bringing that into the record as well. 03:17:56.459 --> 03:17:57.299 Thank you. 03:17:58.700 --> 03:18:01.500 - Yes, so the recommended conditions 03:18:01.500 --> 03:18:03.899 were the one related to sight lighting 03:18:03.899 --> 03:18:06.100 and then the second condition about signage. 03:18:06.100 --> 03:18:08.579 - Okay, so I'd like to include those 03:18:08.579 --> 03:18:10.059 as well as a friendly amendment 03:18:10.059 --> 03:18:12.540 to additional conditions of what we have in backup 03:18:12.540 --> 03:18:15.620 as well as the wall height from six to eight feet. 03:18:15.620 --> 03:18:16.459 - Agreed. 03:18:16.459 --> 03:18:20.579 - Okay, we have a first and a second for approval 03:18:20.579 --> 03:18:23.739 with conditions in the staff report 03:18:23.739 --> 03:18:27.180 and then the wall height increasing from six to eight feet 03:18:27.180 --> 03:18:29.379 and I'll open the floor for discussion. 03:18:30.540 --> 03:18:31.579 Commissioner Ellis. 03:18:31.579 --> 03:18:32.420 - Thank you, Chair. 03:18:32.420 --> 03:18:34.420 I just wanted to address everyone who came out to speak 03:18:34.420 --> 03:18:36.059 and thank you for doing so. 03:18:37.059 --> 03:18:40.180 In understanding probably more than you did 03:18:40.180 --> 03:18:42.139 when you got in here as far as what really 03:18:42.139 --> 03:18:43.940 we had the power to do, 03:18:44.979 --> 03:18:47.780 hopefully you'll participate in city council 03:18:47.780 --> 03:18:50.620 and maybe think about are there other conditions 03:18:50.620 --> 03:18:54.020 that maybe can be placed that they could consider 03:18:54.020 --> 03:18:56.180 because again, it is something that is allowed 03:18:56.180 --> 03:18:57.700 in the plan development by right 03:18:57.700 --> 03:19:02.700 and it's just a matter of making it work in its space. 03:19:02.700 --> 03:19:05.180 I know there are a lot of concerns about 2499 03:19:05.180 --> 03:19:09.659 and that's unfortunately text out and they own it 03:19:09.659 --> 03:19:13.260 and that's their fault and not this property owner's fault 03:19:13.260 --> 03:19:15.659 but I absolutely sympathize with everything 03:19:15.659 --> 03:19:17.139 that you said about it. 03:19:17.139 --> 03:19:19.659 So thanks for coming out and continue to participate. 03:19:19.659 --> 03:19:20.500 I hope you do. 03:19:22.420 --> 03:19:23.620 - Commissioner Sanchez. 03:19:24.500 --> 03:19:26.260 - Also I'd like to thank you all for showing up. 03:19:26.260 --> 03:19:28.459 I think when you all show up, 03:19:28.459 --> 03:19:30.819 it kind of helps us understand the neighborhoods, 03:19:30.819 --> 03:19:34.540 what they want and it also has helped us understand 03:19:34.540 --> 03:19:39.540 to talk to the business owners is go out 03:19:40.340 --> 03:19:41.899 and talk to your neighbors 03:19:42.780 --> 03:19:45.540 because that's how things are resolved before they get here 03:19:45.540 --> 03:19:48.500 and so I would just like to thank you all for showing up. 03:19:49.540 --> 03:19:50.379 - Thank you. 03:19:51.420 --> 03:19:54.579 We have a motion for approval with conditions 03:19:54.579 --> 03:19:57.620 and I will call for a vote on the board at this time. 03:20:06.139 --> 03:20:09.059 The motion is going to carry four to zero 03:20:09.059 --> 03:20:11.559 and again, this is an announcement for you all here 03:20:11.559 --> 03:20:13.180 and those that are watching this item 03:20:13.180 --> 03:20:16.979 will then come before city council on August the 21st 03:20:16.979 --> 03:20:20.940 at 630 and you're welcome to continue to participate. 03:20:20.940 --> 03:20:23.100 Thank you all for coming out this evening. 03:20:50.940 --> 03:20:53.940 (people chattering) 03:21:13.100 --> 03:21:16.299 Given the room a few minutes to clear 03:21:16.299 --> 03:21:19.899 and we're gonna move on to our next item 03:21:19.899 --> 03:21:22.700 and at this time I'm gonna open the public hearing 03:21:22.700 --> 03:21:27.700 on item C, Z18-0007B. 03:21:28.100 --> 03:21:31.219 We'll call on Cindy Jackson for presentation. 03:21:31.219 --> 03:21:33.020 - Thank you chairman, commissioners. 03:21:35.620 --> 03:21:39.979 Z18-0007 is a request to hold a public hearing 03:21:39.979 --> 03:21:42.940 and consider making a recommendation to the city council 03:21:42.940 --> 03:21:44.579 regarding a request for assignment 03:21:44.579 --> 03:21:46.579 of initial zoning designation 03:21:46.579 --> 03:21:51.299 of neighborhood residential two NR2 district 03:21:51.299 --> 03:21:55.219 to a one acre site that is located east of Mosh Branch 03:21:55.219 --> 03:21:56.899 on the north side of Miller Road 03:21:56.899 --> 03:21:58.799 or you can see located right here. 03:22:00.139 --> 03:22:02.500 Current zoning is already 5X. 03:22:03.399 --> 03:22:07.500 The site is part of lot seven of Little Brook Estates. 03:22:07.500 --> 03:22:11.579 Lot seven was subdivided by Meats and Bounds in 1977 03:22:11.579 --> 03:22:13.920 into one acre lots. 03:22:15.340 --> 03:22:18.360 Miller Road was created by Easeman at the same time. 03:22:19.819 --> 03:22:24.020 This one acre lot is subject site 03:22:24.020 --> 03:22:28.200 was annexed into the city along with the surrounding area 03:22:28.200 --> 03:22:30.860 that you can see here in 2010. 03:22:32.100 --> 03:22:34.059 It is currently zoned already 5X 03:22:34.059 --> 03:22:36.940 which is a holding distance district 03:22:36.940 --> 03:22:39.420 which is assigned to newly annexed property. 03:22:40.340 --> 03:22:41.780 Here you can see the zoning map 03:22:41.780 --> 03:22:44.340 if the site is approved with the NR2 zoning. 03:22:46.139 --> 03:22:51.379 Subject site has a future land use designation 03:22:51.379 --> 03:22:56.260 of business innovation which is for large tracts of land 03:22:56.260 --> 03:22:59.700 that are appropriate for well planned larger scale office 03:22:59.700 --> 03:23:02.760 and employment parks developed in a campus light setting 03:23:02.760 --> 03:23:05.000 along with their supporting uses. 03:23:06.100 --> 03:23:08.049 The types of uses and the scale of the development 03:23:08.049 --> 03:23:08.799 permitted 03:23:08.799 --> 03:23:12.280 in the NR2 district do not conform to the goals 03:23:12.280 --> 03:23:14.280 of the business innovation designation. 03:23:15.739 --> 03:23:20.739 Section 3533B3 actually has criteria to consider 03:23:25.559 --> 03:23:30.559 when looking to add a request for rezoning in an area 03:23:32.260 --> 03:23:35.459 in which the proposed zoning does not correspond 03:23:35.459 --> 03:23:39.100 with the future yet land use underlying designation. 03:23:40.000 --> 03:23:45.000 The NR2 district permits lodge residential uses 03:23:45.219 --> 03:23:49.260 and this is inconsistent with future land use element. 03:23:49.260 --> 03:23:53.260 The RD5 district which was assigned to the property 03:23:53.260 --> 03:23:57.219 after annexation in 2010 is also inconsistent 03:23:57.219 --> 03:23:59.620 with this land use district. 03:23:59.620 --> 03:24:02.719 The site is part of a large lot single family neighborhood 03:24:02.719 --> 03:24:05.860 which was established beginning in the late 70s 03:24:05.860 --> 03:24:09.860 as discussed in the previous slide. 03:24:09.860 --> 03:24:12.020 The single family uses are inconsistent 03:24:12.020 --> 03:24:14.819 with the future land use designation. 03:24:14.819 --> 03:24:18.299 The proposed NR2 zoning designation is consistent 03:24:18.299 --> 03:24:22.100 with both the proposed and the surrounding land uses 03:24:22.100 --> 03:24:24.620 and it does contribute to the preservation 03:24:24.620 --> 03:24:27.420 of the character of the existing neighborhood. 03:24:27.420 --> 03:24:30.620 In the backup you received I did go into great detail 03:24:30.620 --> 03:24:35.620 on how this site complies with the criteria for approval. 03:24:36.340 --> 03:24:40.459 I'm going to just kind of go over them right now, 03:24:40.459 --> 03:24:42.479 not in as much detail however. 03:24:44.860 --> 03:24:47.420 The requested NR2 zoning district is consistent 03:24:47.420 --> 03:24:49.780 with both the proposed use of the subject site 03:24:49.780 --> 03:24:53.020 and the uses that are currently in place. 03:24:55.260 --> 03:24:57.059 This zoning would be consistent 03:24:57.059 --> 03:25:00.540 with the character of the area today. 03:25:05.219 --> 03:25:08.399 The site takes access from North Mosh Branch 03:25:08.399 --> 03:25:12.739 which is a collector street located south of Miller Road 03:25:12.739 --> 03:25:17.739 and it is a primary arterial north of Miller Road. 03:25:19.260 --> 03:25:22.100 Water is available for the site through an eight inch line 03:25:22.100 --> 03:25:25.139 which is along Miller Road and all of the lots 03:25:25.139 --> 03:25:29.379 in this subdivision are on septic as sewer is not available 03:25:29.379 --> 03:25:29.579 . 03:25:31.979 --> 03:25:36.219 The impacts of one single family residential lot 03:25:36.219 --> 03:25:40.579 would be minimal on the transportation infrastructure 03:25:40.579 --> 03:25:41.420 in the area. 03:25:43.540 --> 03:25:46.739 Public notifications were sent out July 6th. 03:25:46.739 --> 03:25:51.139 Within 200 feet 10 certified notices were sent out 03:25:51.139 --> 03:25:55.459 and 15 courtesy notices were sent out within 500 feet 03:25:55.459 --> 03:25:58.500 of the site and we did not receive any response. 03:26:01.180 --> 03:26:03.540 Staff recommends approval of this request. 03:26:03.540 --> 03:26:06.860 The NR2 is consistent with the criteria for approval 03:26:06.860 --> 03:26:11.760 in section 35, 33B3 and the NR2 district is compatible 03:26:11.760 --> 03:26:14.139 with the surrounding property in terms of existing 03:26:14.139 --> 03:26:16.100 and permitted uses. 03:26:16.100 --> 03:26:19.260 That concludes my presentation and the applicant is present 03:26:19.260 --> 03:26:19.579 . 03:26:19.579 --> 03:26:22.340 - Thank you Cindy, I don't see any questions. 03:26:22.340 --> 03:26:23.500 This is a public hearing. 03:26:23.500 --> 03:26:25.340 Anyone who would like to speak on this item 03:26:25.340 --> 03:26:26.940 please come forward at this time. 03:26:31.540 --> 03:26:32.620 - Good evening commissioners. 03:26:32.620 --> 03:26:35.819 My name is Bill Coleman and I am representing the owners 03:26:35.819 --> 03:26:37.780 of this property in this matter. 03:26:37.780 --> 03:26:41.079 We're here to ask that you go ahead and grant our request 03:26:41.079 --> 03:26:43.979 and that we're trying to do what is compatible 03:26:43.979 --> 03:26:47.260 with the neighborhood and not what the use would suggest 03:26:47.260 --> 03:26:49.219 and build a warehouse or something like that 03:26:49.219 --> 03:26:51.500 in the middle of the neighborhoods. 03:26:51.500 --> 03:26:52.340 Thank you very much. 03:26:52.340 --> 03:26:54.540 If you have any questions. 03:26:54.540 --> 03:26:56.120 - Okay, don't see any questions. 03:26:56.120 --> 03:26:56.959 Thank you Bill. 03:26:58.940 --> 03:27:00.059 This is a public hearing. 03:27:00.059 --> 03:27:02.540 Anyone who would like to speak on this item 03:27:02.540 --> 03:27:04.100 please come forward at this time. 03:27:05.979 --> 03:27:08.139 Seeing none I will close the public hearing 03:27:08.139 --> 03:27:10.020 and open the floor for discussion 03:27:10.020 --> 03:27:11.979 in the motion, Commissioner Ellis. 03:27:11.979 --> 03:27:12.819 - Thank you Chair. 03:27:12.819 --> 03:27:15.479 I move to approve Z187B. 03:27:16.899 --> 03:27:18.299 - Commissioner Beck. - Second. 03:27:18.299 --> 03:27:21.840 - Okay, we have a first and a second for approval. 03:27:21.840 --> 03:27:23.159 Any further discussion? 03:27:24.700 --> 03:27:26.940 Seeing none I'll call for a vote on the board. 03:27:31.600 --> 03:27:33.459 Motion's gonna carry four to zero. 03:27:35.420 --> 03:27:37.260 We'll move us to item D. 03:27:38.100 --> 03:27:42.500 We're going to open the public hearing for Z18-0009 03:27:42.500 --> 03:27:45.319 and I will call on Julie Wyatt for a presentation. 03:27:52.100 --> 03:27:53.299 - Good evening, I'm Julie Wyatt, 03:27:53.299 --> 03:27:54.899 senior planner at the City of Denton 03:27:54.899 --> 03:27:58.340 and I'm presenting Z189 Mayhill Edwards. 03:27:58.340 --> 03:28:00.760 The request is to hold a public hearing 03:28:00.760 --> 03:28:03.620 and consider making a recommendation to city council 03:28:03.620 --> 03:28:05.340 regarding an initial zoning 03:28:05.340 --> 03:28:08.540 of regional center residential one, RCR one, 03:28:08.540 --> 03:28:10.600 on approximately 15 acres. 03:28:10.600 --> 03:28:13.940 The subject property is shown here outlined in yellow. 03:28:13.940 --> 03:28:15.420 It is north of Edwards Road. 03:28:15.420 --> 03:28:17.739 It's situated in the southeast part of town. 03:28:17.739 --> 03:28:21.579 It's near the Mayhill new alignment and existing road 03:28:21.579 --> 03:28:23.459 and also near Colorado. 03:28:25.219 --> 03:28:27.600 Just a little bit of background on the property. 03:28:27.600 --> 03:28:30.340 Like the previous case, 03:28:30.340 --> 03:28:35.100 this does have a place holding zoning designation of RD5X. 03:28:35.860 --> 03:28:38.540 This 15 acres that we're considering tonight 03:28:38.540 --> 03:28:40.219 is actually part of a larger tract. 03:28:40.219 --> 03:28:43.700 It's part of a 19 acre tract where a portion of it, 03:28:43.700 --> 03:28:47.100 four acres of it was annexed in the early '80s 03:28:47.100 --> 03:28:49.940 and during the citywide 2002 rezoning, 03:28:49.940 --> 03:28:52.579 it received a zoning designation of RCR one. 03:28:53.500 --> 03:28:57.840 Tonight, what we're considering is the initial zoning. 03:28:57.840 --> 03:29:02.500 The applicant has asked for the initial zoning of RCR one 03:29:02.500 --> 03:29:05.540 for the remainder, which was annexed in 2010. 03:29:05.540 --> 03:29:08.819 And so you'll see here the proposal is to just extend 03:29:08.819 --> 03:29:10.700 that existing RCR one. 03:29:13.620 --> 03:29:14.659 When we analyze the project, 03:29:14.659 --> 03:29:17.500 the first thing we do is look at the comprehensive plan. 03:29:17.500 --> 03:29:19.299 This is in a business innovation, 03:29:19.299 --> 03:29:21.379 future land use designation. 03:29:21.379 --> 03:29:24.540 This is intended for large scale employment uses, 03:29:24.540 --> 03:29:27.459 but also with supporting uses such as retail hotels 03:29:27.459 --> 03:29:28.420 and residential. 03:29:28.420 --> 03:29:30.379 RCR one in this instance fits 03:29:30.379 --> 03:29:32.620 within the future land use designation 03:29:32.620 --> 03:29:33.819 for a couple of reasons. 03:29:33.819 --> 03:29:36.360 First of all, it permits the residential uses 03:29:36.360 --> 03:29:38.540 and some of those commercial uses that are needed 03:29:38.540 --> 03:29:42.299 to compliment the employment areas nearby. 03:29:42.299 --> 03:29:45.340 Second of all, it does restrict the development 03:29:45.340 --> 03:29:48.360 for these uses to a smaller scale 03:29:48.360 --> 03:29:50.579 so that they would be more compatible 03:29:50.579 --> 03:29:53.319 with the residential areas nearby. 03:29:55.420 --> 03:29:58.620 The mobility of the area contains quite a few options 03:29:58.620 --> 03:30:03.620 for the residents in this and businesses in this area. 03:30:04.500 --> 03:30:06.739 The subject property is in yellow 03:30:06.739 --> 03:30:10.180 and it is located on Edwards Road, as I said. 03:30:10.180 --> 03:30:15.180 The entire 19 acre tract has about a thousand linear feet 03:30:15.500 --> 03:30:18.280 along Edwards Road and that is a collector. 03:30:19.959 --> 03:30:23.379 It is also near the rail trail, which is in purple, 03:30:23.379 --> 03:30:24.780 and that's about a quarter mile away 03:30:24.780 --> 03:30:26.680 as well as the Med Park Transit Center, 03:30:26.680 --> 03:30:28.219 that's about a half a mile away. 03:30:29.459 --> 03:30:33.219 And then there is some mobility changes in the area 03:30:33.219 --> 03:30:36.899 having to do with the construction of Mayhill Road 03:30:36.899 --> 03:30:37.860 and some new alignment. 03:30:37.860 --> 03:30:41.540 So that is gonna be a regional road 03:30:41.540 --> 03:30:42.940 within the city of Denton 03:30:42.940 --> 03:30:46.840 and that is it will get near this property. 03:30:46.840 --> 03:30:50.379 This area near the property isn't quite finalized 03:30:50.379 --> 03:30:52.459 in terms of final design for Mayhill, 03:30:52.459 --> 03:30:57.459 but we do know that some elements to it 03:30:57.620 --> 03:31:01.459 that will probably move forward in the final design. 03:31:01.459 --> 03:31:05.180 So here's a schematic of what is proposed right now. 03:31:05.180 --> 03:31:07.700 Just to orient you, here's Colorado Boulevard 03:31:07.700 --> 03:31:11.780 on the south end as well as here's that Edwards Road 03:31:11.780 --> 03:31:14.579 adjacent to the DCTA rail. 03:31:16.780 --> 03:31:20.319 In the future, as construction moves forward, 03:31:20.319 --> 03:31:25.319 Mayhill will actually go north in this direction 03:31:25.420 --> 03:31:27.459 and it will go over the railroad tracks 03:31:27.459 --> 03:31:28.899 with a bridge. 03:31:28.899 --> 03:31:30.899 I will then connect to parts north 03:31:30.899 --> 03:31:33.139 to the construction that's going forward north. 03:31:33.139 --> 03:31:36.100 The final alignment in this area has not been set. 03:31:36.100 --> 03:31:39.180 It could either track to the west or to the east. 03:31:39.180 --> 03:31:42.739 Edwards Road, this intersection here outlined in red 03:31:42.739 --> 03:31:44.620 will actually go away. 03:31:44.620 --> 03:31:47.299 And Edwards Road will veer north 03:31:47.299 --> 03:31:50.260 and connect with the existing South Mayhill Road 03:31:50.260 --> 03:31:54.620 in this area, which will then move forward 03:31:54.620 --> 03:31:59.180 in order to connect to that new Mayhill alignment. 03:31:59.180 --> 03:32:02.459 That connection will happen in two phases. 03:32:02.459 --> 03:32:07.219 The first phase is that you would travel on Edwards Road 03:32:07.219 --> 03:32:10.139 then connect to that old South Mayhill alignment 03:32:10.139 --> 03:32:12.459 and then connect to the new construction, 03:32:12.459 --> 03:32:14.139 the new road up here. 03:32:14.139 --> 03:32:15.059 That's phase one. 03:32:15.059 --> 03:32:18.219 Phase two will actually come in a little south of there 03:32:18.219 --> 03:32:20.340 and will then hit this intersection. 03:32:20.340 --> 03:32:23.959 So anyone traveling on Edwards could then go south or north 03:32:23.959 --> 03:32:24.200 . 03:32:25.459 --> 03:32:29.780 As part of the request, we also looked at the compatibility 03:32:29.780 --> 03:32:32.979 of not only the zoning, but the existing development. 03:32:32.979 --> 03:32:35.299 The subject property is once again outlined in yellow. 03:32:35.299 --> 03:32:37.459 To the north and to the west of the property, 03:32:37.459 --> 03:32:38.700 we have RCR1. 03:32:38.700 --> 03:32:42.219 So we have already that RCR1 in place in the area. 03:32:42.219 --> 03:32:44.280 And that to the north is developed 03:32:44.280 --> 03:32:46.500 with a manufactured housing development. 03:32:46.500 --> 03:32:50.540 To the east is multifamily and that's NRMU 12. 03:32:50.540 --> 03:32:53.319 Further east is single family neighborhoods 03:32:53.319 --> 03:32:56.260 and they have a variety of zoning districts. 03:32:56.260 --> 03:32:59.299 To the west and southwest, you've got RCCD, 03:32:59.299 --> 03:33:00.780 our regional zoning districts, 03:33:00.780 --> 03:33:03.420 and those are developed with employment uses, 03:33:03.420 --> 03:33:07.059 including medical, hospital, and then also Flowers Food, 03:33:07.059 --> 03:33:10.139 which is an industrial bakery operation. 03:33:13.000 --> 03:33:15.379 So RCR1, based upon our analysis, 03:33:15.379 --> 03:33:17.780 is consistent with that existing zoning pattern 03:33:17.780 --> 03:33:20.260 on the same parcel as well as an extension 03:33:20.260 --> 03:33:22.139 of that existing zoning pattern 03:33:22.139 --> 03:33:24.780 from the properties to the north and to the west. 03:33:24.780 --> 03:33:28.719 If approved, RCR1 would consolidate zoning on the property 03:33:28.719 --> 03:33:30.540 so it would facilitate development 03:33:30.540 --> 03:33:32.379 under a uniform set of regulations, 03:33:32.379 --> 03:33:35.700 including both use and development scale. 03:33:35.700 --> 03:33:37.340 As we looked at in the previous slide, 03:33:37.340 --> 03:33:40.500 this area is situated between some employment uses 03:33:40.500 --> 03:33:41.860 and then some residential uses, 03:33:41.860 --> 03:33:43.700 so it really is a transitional area. 03:33:43.700 --> 03:33:47.319 And in that respect, RCR1 is appropriate, 03:33:47.319 --> 03:33:49.780 given that it permits some higher density housing 03:33:49.780 --> 03:33:51.459 with approval of an SUP, 03:33:51.459 --> 03:33:54.899 also limited office service retail, those commercial uses 03:33:54.899 --> 03:33:56.540 that could serve both the employment 03:33:56.540 --> 03:33:58.700 as well as the residential. 03:33:58.700 --> 03:34:01.219 Also, RCR1 has lot coverage 03:34:01.219 --> 03:34:02.799 and building envelope standards 03:34:02.799 --> 03:34:06.500 that are similar to the nearby residential areas 03:34:06.500 --> 03:34:08.780 so that any development would be consistent 03:34:08.780 --> 03:34:12.100 with those visual, with kind of the development pattern 03:34:12.100 --> 03:34:13.000 in the area. 03:34:14.040 --> 03:34:16.340 If the zoning is approved, any development 03:34:16.340 --> 03:34:19.100 would have to meet all of our development standards. 03:34:19.100 --> 03:34:21.819 And water and sewer are either available 03:34:21.819 --> 03:34:24.479 or would be extended as part of the development. 03:34:25.379 --> 03:34:27.000 Public notification was sent out. 03:34:27.000 --> 03:34:29.780 We haven't received any responses. 03:34:29.780 --> 03:34:31.420 So based upon the criteria of approval 03:34:31.420 --> 03:34:33.200 in the Denton Development Code, 03:34:33.200 --> 03:34:35.420 it's consistency with the comprehensive plan 03:34:35.420 --> 03:34:38.700 as well as the compatibility with the surrounding property. 03:34:38.700 --> 03:34:40.780 Staff recommends approval of the request. 03:34:40.780 --> 03:34:43.579 I'll stand for any questions, and the applicant is here. 03:34:45.459 --> 03:34:47.659 - Don't have any questions, thank you, Julie. 03:34:48.780 --> 03:34:50.260 This is a public hearing. 03:34:50.260 --> 03:34:53.620 I do not have any cards on front, 03:34:53.620 --> 03:34:56.059 but anyone who would like to speak on this item, 03:34:56.059 --> 03:34:57.540 please come forward if you'd like to. 03:34:57.540 --> 03:35:00.270 You're not required to, but you're welcome to if you'd like 03:35:00.270 --> 03:35:00.540 . 03:35:04.739 --> 03:35:05.579 No, okay. 03:35:07.139 --> 03:35:08.020 Commissioner Batt. 03:35:08.020 --> 03:35:08.860 - Thank you, Chair. 03:35:08.860 --> 03:35:12.219 I would like to ask the applicant, if he doesn't mind, 03:35:12.219 --> 03:35:14.979 if he does mind, I understand that too, 03:35:14.979 --> 03:35:17.819 share with us what, if he can, 03:35:17.819 --> 03:35:20.100 what his plans are for this. 03:35:20.100 --> 03:35:22.700 Do you have any concrete plans right now? 03:35:22.700 --> 03:35:23.659 - No, sir, I don't. 03:35:23.659 --> 03:35:25.219 We don't have any plans. - Nothing, sir? 03:35:25.219 --> 03:35:26.659 Would you give us your name and address please? 03:35:26.659 --> 03:35:31.379 - Randy Thompson, Stonewood, 4116 West Spring Creek Parkway 03:35:31.379 --> 03:35:31.659 . 03:35:31.739 --> 03:35:33.299 - Thank you very much. 03:35:33.299 --> 03:35:34.739 - To answer your question, no, at this time, 03:35:34.739 --> 03:35:37.139 we don't have any plans in the works 03:35:37.139 --> 03:35:38.639 for a development project. 03:35:39.979 --> 03:35:42.780 Without the zoning, there's not much we can plan for, 03:35:42.780 --> 03:35:44.219 so we have to get the zoning first, 03:35:44.219 --> 03:35:46.459 and then we can go from that point on. 03:35:46.459 --> 03:35:49.540 - Okay, not a vision out there though. 03:35:49.540 --> 03:35:51.979 Okay, all right. - I don't have the point. 03:35:51.979 --> 03:35:53.059 - All right, thank you. 03:35:54.180 --> 03:35:55.020 - Thank you, sir. 03:35:55.020 --> 03:35:56.579 We don't have any other questions. 03:35:59.860 --> 03:36:00.979 Again, this is a public hearing. 03:36:00.979 --> 03:36:02.579 Anyone else who'd like to speak? 03:36:03.500 --> 03:36:05.340 Seeing none, we'll close the public hearing 03:36:05.340 --> 03:36:07.860 and open the floor for discussion or a motion. 03:36:10.299 --> 03:36:12.100 Commissioner Sanchez. 03:36:12.100 --> 03:36:16.100 - I make a motion to adopt Z18-009. 03:36:16.100 --> 03:36:17.780 - Okay, Commissioner Beck. 03:36:17.780 --> 03:36:19.139 - Second. - Okay. 03:36:19.139 --> 03:36:22.059 We have a first and a second for approval. 03:36:22.059 --> 03:36:23.319 Any further discussion? 03:36:25.059 --> 03:36:26.059 Commissioner Ellis. 03:36:26.059 --> 03:36:26.899 - Thank you, Chair. 03:36:26.899 --> 03:36:29.040 Just real quick to thank Julie for your detailed 03:36:29.040 --> 03:36:29.620 presentation. 03:36:29.620 --> 03:36:30.780 I appreciate it. 03:36:30.780 --> 03:36:31.940 You put a lot together there, 03:36:31.940 --> 03:36:35.059 and it was very informative and helpful, so thank you. 03:36:35.059 --> 03:36:36.659 - Okay. - Hear, hear, hear. 03:36:36.659 --> 03:36:38.700 - Yeah, okay. 03:36:38.700 --> 03:36:40.579 Any other questions or discussion? 03:36:42.700 --> 03:36:44.219 Okay. 03:36:44.219 --> 03:36:46.379 I'm gonna call for a vote on the board then. 03:36:52.260 --> 03:36:54.440 Motion's gonna carry four to zero. 03:36:56.819 --> 03:36:58.219 Good luck with your project. 03:36:59.700 --> 03:37:02.340 That will move us to our final item 03:37:02.340 --> 03:37:03.780 on our agenda this evening, 03:37:03.780 --> 03:37:06.219 our matrix and concluding items. 03:37:09.739 --> 03:37:11.139 I hit the microphone with a piece of paper. 03:37:11.139 --> 03:37:12.459 My fault. 03:37:12.459 --> 03:37:13.739 Sorry. 03:37:13.739 --> 03:37:15.579 I'll wake everybody up. 03:37:15.579 --> 03:37:16.860 Commissioner Beck. 03:37:16.860 --> 03:37:17.739 - Thank you, Chair. 03:37:17.739 --> 03:37:20.100 Is this the point where I, again, 03:37:20.100 --> 03:37:24.739 bring up the issue of recommending to staff or council 03:37:24.739 --> 03:37:28.059 to investigate the comp plan amendment 03:37:28.059 --> 03:37:30.579 or a smaller amendment for the... 03:37:33.819 --> 03:37:34.780 I'm sorry. 03:37:34.780 --> 03:37:36.340 - For our workstation project matrix? 03:37:36.340 --> 03:37:37.180 - Yes. 03:37:37.979 --> 03:37:38.819 - Okay. 03:37:39.700 --> 03:37:41.020 - To get on the matrix is-- 03:37:41.020 --> 03:37:41.860 - Yes. - Okay. 03:37:41.860 --> 03:37:45.620 - What we'll do is, I know we went over 03:37:45.620 --> 03:37:47.579 some of the work session dates 03:37:47.579 --> 03:37:48.540 for the variety of the topics. 03:37:48.540 --> 03:37:50.299 I know one we're probably gonna have to adjust already 03:37:50.299 --> 03:37:52.299 on the gas well. 03:37:52.299 --> 03:37:56.739 So what I may do is try to move, 03:37:56.739 --> 03:37:58.979 I'll rework this and get this out 03:37:58.979 --> 03:38:01.139 by the end of the week, by Friday. 03:38:01.139 --> 03:38:03.260 That way we have an idea. 03:38:03.260 --> 03:38:05.299 But we will be adding to that 03:38:06.180 --> 03:38:08.299 the discussion on the zoning changes 03:38:08.299 --> 03:38:10.180 and then as well as the item 03:38:10.180 --> 03:38:11.219 that you had brought up with the comp plan. 03:38:11.219 --> 03:38:14.180 - Okay, very good. - I may even try to lump 03:38:14.180 --> 03:38:15.219 bring all of those together 03:38:15.219 --> 03:38:18.860 'cause there might be other discussions as part of that. 03:38:18.860 --> 03:38:19.700 Or separate. - Okay. 03:38:19.700 --> 03:38:21.780 - It's-- - Okay. 03:38:21.780 --> 03:38:22.620 Thank you. 03:38:24.979 --> 03:38:29.299 - With that, I will close our public hearing this evening 03:38:29.299 --> 03:38:31.100 at 9.05. 03:38:31.100 --> 03:38:32.260 - Thank you, everyone.