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2018. This is a special call meeting to hear module three.

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This meeting has been

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duly posted and we do have a quorum present and will call

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us to order at 405

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and our first order of business will be to receive a report

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, hold a discussion

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and provide direction to staff. So I'll turn it over to

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Richard to see who's

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going to present for us. I'll just be brief. I'll introduce

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Tark. I think most

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of you know who he is. He's here to present module three

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which is the last

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of the modules. After tonight we will no longer be

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referring to them as

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modules but rather than still all with his thunder I'll go

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ahead and turn over

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to him. Thanks for the introduction. Good to see you all

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again. Chairman, members of

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the Commission and some of you will see this again. Sorry

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Larry. But great to be

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back here. This is an exciting time in the project when we

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've actually drafted

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all three parts of the code at this point at least one time

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. Now we're in the

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refinement process and that should be as exciting for you

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as it is for us. We can

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see the finish line at the end. Now it's time to really

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focus on the details of

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what's in the draft. So we're not going to spend any time.

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You notice our first

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slide is content-based. We're not going to describe our

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firm. We're not going to

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describe how we got here, why we got here, what the

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schedule is quite yet. We're

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just going to jump right into the standards for this third

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and final piece

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development standards. Remember back to the first piece was

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all about zoning

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districts and land uses. The second piece when we were here

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three weeks ago was

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about administration and procedures, how you get a project

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approved. This final

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piece is all about the quality. We heard a lot about

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raising the bar for quality

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in Denton and I mentioned in a couple of meetings earlier

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today that you already

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have a lot of really good development in Denton. So it wasn

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't a matter of saying

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everything you have is bad let's make it better. It's

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capturing the good pieces in

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Denton and codifying them so that that sets the new minimum

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bar. This is sub

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chapter 6, table of contents that you're looking at here at

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the development

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standards. There's a lot of material in here, too much to

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cover in one meeting

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with the Planning Commission. So what we're going to do is

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focus in on some of

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the things that we think will be most interesting, most

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relevant, will generate

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the most discussion with you all and then certainly can

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follow up either with

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staff in our absence or through public comments, submitting

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your

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comments to staff or amongst each other. Today we're going

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to talk about

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landscaping, we'll talk about parking and loading, we'll

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talk about site and

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building design, we'll briefly mention exterior lighting

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and then the final

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part of this sub chapter or pardon me module 3 is subdiv

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ision and we've got

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one change there too that we'd like to raise with you as

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well. Beyond quality

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standards how we divide lots into additional lots. So

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jumping right into

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the details, just a reminder of the goals here for

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development quality

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standards. Avoid a one-size-fits-all approach. Right now a

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lot of your

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standards say if you're in Denton thou shall apply to you.

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Well that's not

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necessarily the case. Zoning districts are different, they

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have different context.

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The square is certainly much different in terms of

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regulating development there

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than it is out by 35 or 288 in the loop. So we need to take

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those individual

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contexts and apply standards that are tailored uniquely.

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Increased flexibility.

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It's hard to get projects approved in Denton. Now Scott the

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new planning

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director has made a lot of cultural changes internally that

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have made things

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smoother. You will continue to see those moving forward.

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The DDC can actually be

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updated to allow for more flexibility. Not at the expense

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of neighborhoods which

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are important to Denton. Don't chip away at that fabric but

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allow more

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flexibility. Allow development to be creative and give you

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projects that you

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need and want. Finally is just to coordinate this project

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which is a big

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undertaking but it's not everything. You've got engineering

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standards, you

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have wastewater standards, you have electric standards. A

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lot of things that

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live outside of the code that have been updated in the last

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couple of years and

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we want to make sure that we're cross-referencing those but

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certainly not

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being inconsistent with them. So that was one of the goals

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of the projects. Diving

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right into the first topic. Gonna start with landscaping,

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screening, buffering and

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fences. How good does it have to be? How much do we need?

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And just showing some

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images to get your your minds going. The juice is flowing

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on why landscaping is

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important. We talked about buffers in the landscaping

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standards. How we address

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incompatible land uses. If I'm residential next to non-

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residential,

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there's an incompatibility there that's not impossible and

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that should be

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allowed but with certain parameters and buffers are one way

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to do that. How we

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think about loading areas, screening areas, making sure

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that the trash refuse

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is enclosed so that not everybody has to look at it and

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driving around the city

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you see a lot of dumpsters just out there in the open. We

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can prevent that in

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the future. And then what happens with a complete and total

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lack of landscaping?

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You end up with a non-desirable result. Not a friendly

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place to walk. Not much

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better to even drive in that scenario. So how do we beaut

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ify things while also

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providing good landscaping? We'll jump right into the

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summary of changes and

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this is how each of the topics is going to work. We'll get

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your thoughts going.

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We'll share some of the summary of changes, the big changes

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, and then take

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any questions that you have on that topic. So well I do

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want to mention

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though we need to get through all of the topics. So we'll

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take a few questions on

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each topic but at some point I'm gonna kick the

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conversation to the next and

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then at the end for the remaining time that we have with

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you we can revisit

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each of these individual topics. Landscaping. Alternative

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landscaping plan

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option. We say this right up front. We know that no matter

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how good we draft a

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code and we've drafted a lot of codes somebody's gonna come

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to you with a

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project that is gonna be unique. It's going to have a

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certain set of site

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conditions that are different than other properties in Dent

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on. So how do we take

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care of that? Well you don't want to require a public

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hearing where

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everything gets hashed out and neighborhoods have to get

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involved. This

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is an opportunity to talk to the director and to say look I

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've got unique

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conditions here. I can't meet the black and white letter of

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the landscaping

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standard. Here's what I can do that's an equal benefit to

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the city that still

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meets the intent of the code but gives us a little bit of

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wiggle room because

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I've got utilities where you want me to plant trees. I can

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't do that. They won't

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survive. So this is a new procedure. It's a new option. You

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'll see a lot of

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flexible alternatives throughout the development standards

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that say

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alternatives may be allowed where the director approves

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them or shall comply

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to the maximum extent practicable. That's less than

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feasible. It's saying this just

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doesn't make good common sense to require you to do that on

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this particular

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property. Another important change to landscaping is how

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the buffers work.

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Right now you do require buffers between incompatible uses

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but it's very rigid in

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the term in the the types of buffers that you can provide.

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Instead we have

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proposed an optional point system that allow it you have to

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reach a certain

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point total for a buffer. I'll use the earlier example

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single-family

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residential. If I want to develop industrial next to an

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existing

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single-family residential neighborhood I need to earn 50

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points in a buffer and

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then there's another table page 56 of your draft shows you

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how you can earn

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those points. You're not decreasing the quality of the

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buffer by giving them

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options for points. You're just saying you earn the points

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however you want to

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a stone wall gets you more points trees get you more points

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. You keep adding up

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those options until you've reached 50. Now if I'm single-

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family and I want to

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build next to another single-family you don't have to do a

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buffer. That just

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doesn't make sense right we want to protect things from

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more intense uses.

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The last one I'll mention here in the landscaping then we

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'll get into some

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some questions about this one is low impact development.

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Green infrastructure

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rather than requiring everything to be in pipes and piped

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infrastructure and

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putting downspouts directly into pipes. How could we run

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water across a

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property to actually improve the water quality to require

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less piped

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infrastructure? This still needs some working out with

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coordinating with the

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engineering department making sure that we can actually do

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all of these things

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but I'll mention Denton is very proud of and should be to

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be a silver-servant

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certified I swim for stormwater management city. That's

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important in

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terms of thinking about how you treat and move water across

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the site

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sustainably. We have given you options to do green

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infrastructure not mandates

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saying you can do these things where it makes sense where

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it's allowed by

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drainage and other departments within the city. Those are

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the three the big

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three for landscaping. I'll open it up to questions before

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we move to the next

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topic. Commissioner Beck. Explain rain garden just for

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clarification I'm not

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familiar with that I understand the other things you're

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talking about there

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what are we looking at and what's a rain garden? Rain

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garden also known as a

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bioretention facility. These are ways of planting certain

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water loving plants and

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natural organic materials into a depression area that

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actually captures

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the water and holds it for a short period of time. They can

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be inundated by

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water when a big rainstorm comes and hold that water

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without it killing the

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plants without it shifting landscaping material all across

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the site it can hold

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the water improve the quality of the water and then release

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it slowly into

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the into the ground or across the site. When these they

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have the option to do

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these they're not mandated they have the option so correct

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when they choose

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whatever they choose to do it'll still will still come

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before the P&Z and we'll

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look at what they've got and could we question why they

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00:11:12,850 --> 00:11:14,320
chose one option over

271
00:11:14,320 --> 00:11:16,919
the other is that something that the P&Z will see is that

272
00:11:16,919 --> 00:11:18,480
something the director

273
00:11:18,480 --> 00:11:23,940
will it's a great question from it. Commissioner Beck a lot

274
00:11:23,940 --> 00:11:24,919
of this came out

275
00:11:24,919 --> 00:11:28,419
of the procedures that we talked about last month. Some

276
00:11:28,419 --> 00:11:30,360
applications warrant a

277
00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:34,340
public hearing because they're complex they're big they

278
00:11:34,340 --> 00:11:35,600
mean a lot your phone's

279
00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:38,179
been ringing off the hook you're gonna need a public

280
00:11:38,179 --> 00:11:39,279
hearing some projects

281
00:11:39,279 --> 00:11:42,340
require City Council approval some come to the Commission a

282
00:11:42,340 --> 00:11:43,399
lot of simple

283
00:11:43,399 --> 00:11:47,850
projects especially now with a more straightforward and

284
00:11:47,850 --> 00:11:49,039
transparent code a

285
00:11:49,039 --> 00:11:52,139
lot of decisions can just be made at the staff level. If

286
00:11:52,139 --> 00:11:53,600
you've already told the

287
00:11:53,600 --> 00:11:58,080
community this site is appropriate for a Taco Bell fast

288
00:11:58,080 --> 00:11:59,440
food restaurant on a

289
00:11:59,440 --> 00:12:03,179
site and I'm coming to you with the Taco Bell what's there

290
00:12:03,179 --> 00:12:04,840
to talk about at a

291
00:12:04,840 --> 00:12:08,429
public hearing right so it's a matter of staff being able

292
00:12:08,429 --> 00:12:09,159
and the Planning

293
00:12:09,159 --> 00:12:12,529
Commission being able to review did they meet the code do

294
00:12:12,529 --> 00:12:13,720
they have enough trees

295
00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:17,350
did they get enough points for buffers if they're providing

296
00:12:17,350 --> 00:12:18,000
LID or green

297
00:12:18,000 --> 00:12:21,220
infrastructure options they can question it you can

298
00:12:21,220 --> 00:12:23,080
question it but are they

299
00:12:23,080 --> 00:12:25,929
meeting all of the requirements of the city? Right okay but

300
00:12:25,929 --> 00:12:26,519
it is something we

301
00:12:26,519 --> 00:12:30,970
can review absolutely okay thank you Commissioner Smith.

302
00:12:30,970 --> 00:12:32,720
Thank you Chair. On the

303
00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:36,929
the landscape buffers and the ability to direct to approve

304
00:12:36,929 --> 00:12:38,559
alternates on the

305
00:12:38,559 --> 00:12:43,200
from the director standpoint yeah so what to what level are

306
00:12:43,200 --> 00:12:43,919
they allowed to

307
00:12:43,919 --> 00:12:46,529
approve those alternates essentially what there's got to be

308
00:12:46,529 --> 00:12:47,120
some sort of

309
00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:48,669
threshold that's put into there is that back whenever we

310
00:12:48,669 --> 00:12:49,639
were talking procedures

311
00:12:49,639 --> 00:12:53,899
last the last module I mean they can prove alternates if

312
00:12:53,899 --> 00:12:55,320
you give that if you

313
00:12:55,320 --> 00:12:57,490
give that unilateral decision that yeah you can you can

314
00:12:57,490 --> 00:12:58,519
prove those alternates

315
00:12:58,519 --> 00:13:00,970
at what point does it stop and say well actually that

316
00:13:00,970 --> 00:13:02,159
probably should come in

317
00:13:02,159 --> 00:13:05,440
front of a public hearing or item for individual

318
00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:06,159
consideration or something like that.

319
00:13:06,159 --> 00:13:09,240
Very good question and it does relate partially to what we

320
00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:09,919
talked about last

321
00:13:09,919 --> 00:13:12,210
month but that's a different than what I've talked about

322
00:13:12,210 --> 00:13:13,559
today. Last month we

323
00:13:13,559 --> 00:13:18,070
presented minor modifications and those allow numeric

324
00:13:18,070 --> 00:13:19,840
standards to change a

325
00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:23,799
numeric change in the setback requirements or the building

326
00:13:23,799 --> 00:13:24,320
height

327
00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:27,809
requirements up to a certain percentage. There we can apply

328
00:13:27,809 --> 00:13:28,559
very strict

329
00:13:28,559 --> 00:13:32,519
thresholds to say look director we want you to be able to

330
00:13:32,519 --> 00:13:34,639
approve up to a this

331
00:13:34,639 --> 00:13:37,730
amount anything above that is too much it needs to come to

332
00:13:37,730 --> 00:13:38,440
the Planning

333
00:13:38,440 --> 00:13:42,080
Commission or to City Council. In this case the alternative

334
00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:43,240
actually builds in

335
00:13:43,240 --> 00:13:46,970
additional approval criteria. First of all we lay out a

336
00:13:46,970 --> 00:13:48,440
through H parameters

337
00:13:48,440 --> 00:13:52,240
under which the director has the authority to even consider

338
00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:53,519
other other

339
00:13:53,519 --> 00:13:56,879
alternatives including utilities on the site that are

340
00:13:56,879 --> 00:13:58,360
challenging including

341
00:13:58,360 --> 00:14:04,110
infill or redevelopment properties. This is page 53 of the

342
00:14:04,110 --> 00:14:05,679
draft alternative

343
00:14:05,679 --> 00:14:16,720
landscaping and so a lot of these features replace the

344
00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:17,480
alternative

345
00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:22,149
development plan procedure that you're used to now. That's

346
00:14:22,149 --> 00:14:22,960
fine we have it

347
00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:25,279
currently in place I'll look over page 53 and I'll ask more

348
00:14:25,279 --> 00:14:26,559
questions at the end

349
00:14:26,559 --> 00:14:28,960
just for the sake of time. Okay. As you referenced earlier

350
00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:29,720
one thing I did have

351
00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:32,639
asked question on the what is your pedagogy to the point

352
00:14:32,639 --> 00:14:35,080
minimum on the

353
00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:38,389
the buffering set the standards on the point based system.

354
00:14:38,389 --> 00:14:39,720
Yeah you're looking

355
00:14:39,720 --> 00:14:43,320
through that on page 56 it's ten point twenty point type

356
00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:44,679
stuff where's the

357
00:14:44,679 --> 00:14:47,710
pedagogy come from say this is our this is the reason why

358
00:14:47,710 --> 00:14:48,960
we chose this point

359
00:14:48,960 --> 00:14:52,679
this reason why we assigned these certain buffers these

360
00:14:52,679 --> 00:14:54,720
certain points. Yeah

361
00:14:54,720 --> 00:14:58,500
where did that come from? Great question so we had to come

362
00:14:58,500 --> 00:14:59,519
up with a system. Yeah.

363
00:14:59,519 --> 00:15:02,409
One way of doing that was being very thoughtful about what

364
00:15:02,409 --> 00:15:03,320
's worth twice as

365
00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:06,049
much than something else. Okay. And then what's worth twice

366
00:15:06,049 --> 00:15:07,159
as much as even that

367
00:15:07,159 --> 00:15:10,730
is and so our first step was rather than looking at the

368
00:15:10,730 --> 00:15:12,440
buffer points scale for

369
00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:16,440
how much things are worth how much should be required

370
00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:17,840
between the different

371
00:15:17,840 --> 00:15:21,299
types of uses residential versus industrial we knew right

372
00:15:21,299 --> 00:15:22,360
away that you

373
00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:24,679
require the most buffer points regardless of how much

374
00:15:24,679 --> 00:15:25,480
points those are

375
00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:28,080
they should be the biggest number you have to hit. For

376
00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:29,120
coming up with the point

377
00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:32,840
totals we did use some methodology and we've looked at

378
00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:33,759
other examples and we've

379
00:15:33,759 --> 00:15:36,059
looked at a lot of the other codes that we've written it

380
00:15:36,059 --> 00:15:37,279
comes down to a fence

381
00:15:37,279 --> 00:15:41,919
is not a very big deal it's not hard to do but it is a good

382
00:15:41,919 --> 00:15:43,080
buffer tool so that's

383
00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:46,570
worth ten points you want to plant some shrubs in the

384
00:15:46,570 --> 00:15:48,799
landscape buffer shrubs are

385
00:15:48,799 --> 00:15:53,379
great not the best buffering tool because you can walk over

386
00:15:53,379 --> 00:15:53,960
and step

387
00:15:53,960 --> 00:15:57,240
through and look through shrubs those are worth five points

388
00:15:57,240 --> 00:15:58,759
you build a taller

389
00:15:58,759 --> 00:16:02,740
masonry wall that's gonna get you 20 points because it does

390
00:16:02,740 --> 00:16:03,559
a better job

391
00:16:03,559 --> 00:16:06,639
meeting the intent of this section of the code. So in this

392
00:16:06,639 --> 00:16:07,639
specifically did you

393
00:16:07,639 --> 00:16:09,850
look at our current you look at our current code our

394
00:16:09,850 --> 00:16:10,840
current buffer rules

395
00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:14,059
yes and essentially line up those points to kind of okay

396
00:16:14,059 --> 00:16:15,240
currently this is what

397
00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:18,940
it is now essentially this is amicable this point system is

398
00:16:18,940 --> 00:16:19,559
amicable so we're

399
00:16:19,559 --> 00:16:22,480
not just choosing these points out of thin air randomly

400
00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:23,320
assigning masonry

401
00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:27,279
walls 20 because it feels like a 20 and wooden fences get a

402
00:16:27,279 --> 00:16:28,519
10 and you know what

403
00:16:28,519 --> 00:16:31,879
I actually like you know the I like chain link fences so I

404
00:16:31,879 --> 00:16:32,559
'm actually give

405
00:16:32,559 --> 00:16:35,200
them seven instead of five that kind of crap we're not

406
00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:36,159
choosing stuff out of thin air.

407
00:16:36,159 --> 00:16:49,600
You said the secret word of the day. It's a great question

408
00:16:49,600 --> 00:16:50,519
I'll respond in the

409
00:16:50,519 --> 00:16:54,940
following way we don't pull this stuff out of thin air it's

410
00:16:54,940 --> 00:16:56,360
not willy-nilly it

411
00:16:56,360 --> 00:16:59,529
is based on some of your current standards we did make some

412
00:16:59,529 --> 00:17:01,039
changes we

413
00:17:01,039 --> 00:17:03,960
have to land somewhere to get a draft that's out there for

414
00:17:03,960 --> 00:17:05,279
review it's not

415
00:17:05,279 --> 00:17:08,750
science I will put it to that you're you're not going to

416
00:17:08,750 --> 00:17:09,480
find a study that

417
00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:13,880
says no it should be worth seven and a half points you are

418
00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:15,079
you're wrong so at

419
00:17:15,079 --> 00:17:18,839
some point we land on thresholds the same be told for what

420
00:17:18,839 --> 00:17:20,079
types of projects

421
00:17:20,079 --> 00:17:23,890
you require expansions of an existing property to to comply

422
00:17:23,890 --> 00:17:25,039
with the code we

423
00:17:25,039 --> 00:17:28,480
picked 25 percent because it's a good starting point.

424
00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:32,440
If I say I'm not bogging people down I think I'll relinqu

425
00:17:32,440 --> 00:17:33,279
ish my mic.

426
00:17:33,279 --> 00:17:46,259
Any other questions on this section? That's a fun one. Okay

427
00:17:46,259 --> 00:17:48,200
. Well that was easy.

428
00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:54,769
Move forward. Okay. Parking and loading you know what I

429
00:17:54,769 --> 00:17:55,960
like parking and loading

430
00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:58,819
but not as much as Jim so I'm gonna have Jim come up and

431
00:17:58,819 --> 00:18:02,000
present this please.

432
00:18:03,880 --> 00:18:10,450
All right parking and loading so we made a lot of changes

433
00:18:10,450 --> 00:18:13,839
to this section based

434
00:18:13,839 --> 00:18:17,349
on the feedback that we heard from everyone that we spoke

435
00:18:17,349 --> 00:18:17,920
to in our

436
00:18:17,920 --> 00:18:21,910
previous visits. This is a quick overview just like landsca

437
00:18:21,910 --> 00:18:23,519
ping summary of changes

438
00:18:23,519 --> 00:18:26,599
as we've created a new parking table that matches the land

439
00:18:26,599 --> 00:18:27,640
use types from the

440
00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:32,119
first set of material that we delivered with the parking

441
00:18:32,119 --> 00:18:34,000
standards so every use

442
00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:36,509
that's allowed in the city has a corresponding parking

443
00:18:36,509 --> 00:18:37,279
standard so there's

444
00:18:37,279 --> 00:18:41,089
no question of well what how much parking do I need well

445
00:18:41,089 --> 00:18:42,240
look in the table

446
00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:46,269
because it's there so that's new and that's really intended

447
00:18:46,269 --> 00:18:47,319
to make it easy

448
00:18:47,319 --> 00:18:50,269
for everybody to understand exactly what's required without

449
00:18:50,269 --> 00:18:50,880
having a lot of

450
00:18:50,880 --> 00:18:55,160
question marks there. We revised the parking and loading

451
00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:55,839
requirements to

452
00:18:55,839 --> 00:18:59,509
reflect parking trends both nationally and in here in Texas

453
00:18:59,509 --> 00:19:01,119
so a lot of times

454
00:19:01,119 --> 00:19:04,769
parking standards get outdated because things change you

455
00:19:04,769 --> 00:19:06,240
get uber and Lyft and

456
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:08,970
autonomous vehicles and things like that and parking

457
00:19:08,970 --> 00:19:10,420
standards will continue to

458
00:19:10,420 --> 00:19:15,519
evolve over time so we've updated those to reflect current

459
00:19:15,519 --> 00:19:17,160
trends and then

460
00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:22,130
another big change is the the maximum so right now and it's

461
00:19:22,130 --> 00:19:23,319
it's fairly unusual

462
00:19:23,319 --> 00:19:26,789
to have a minimum requirement and a maximum requirement

463
00:19:26,789 --> 00:19:27,880
that are the same

464
00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:31,259
and that's that's currently what Denton has so we've

465
00:19:31,259 --> 00:19:33,000
adjusted the maximum to be

466
00:19:33,000 --> 00:19:37,089
125% of the required minimum so for example if you have a

467
00:19:37,089 --> 00:19:38,440
restaurant that

468
00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:42,400
needs a hundred parking stalls hundred but you can't

469
00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:44,400
provide more than 125

470
00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:48,720
parking stalls and we've also introduced a whole suite of

471
00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:50,799
alternatives just like

472
00:19:50,799 --> 00:19:53,849
landscaping we've made the parking a lot more flexible to

473
00:19:53,849 --> 00:19:55,319
say these are the

474
00:19:55,319 --> 00:19:58,349
standards but there's ways you can adjust them if you're

475
00:19:58,349 --> 00:19:59,319
close to a fixed

476
00:19:59,319 --> 00:20:02,730
transit station you can adjust the parking minimum by 25

477
00:20:02,730 --> 00:20:04,440
percent if you're

478
00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:07,359
if you have shared parking with another use you can adjust

479
00:20:07,359 --> 00:20:08,480
the parking minimum

480
00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:11,599
by a certain number so we've introduced a number of those

481
00:20:11,599 --> 00:20:14,440
alternatives again to

482
00:20:14,440 --> 00:20:20,049
make it to make it address the context of where the

483
00:20:20,049 --> 00:20:24,240
development is the the

484
00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:27,269
next bullet there we've introduced a discretionary parking

485
00:20:27,269 --> 00:20:28,000
requirements with

486
00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:31,359
the demand study so there are some land uses that there's

487
00:20:31,359 --> 00:20:32,759
there's no way to

488
00:20:32,759 --> 00:20:38,349
predict how much parking you'll need let's say let me find

489
00:20:38,349 --> 00:20:40,640
an example here

490
00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:47,859
so one example is like an electric substation is there

491
00:20:47,859 --> 00:20:50,839
parking required for

492
00:20:50,839 --> 00:20:54,440
that so we've we've drafted something to say that based on

493
00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:55,640
a demand study the

494
00:20:55,640 --> 00:21:00,380
director can determine how much parking is required so

495
00:21:00,380 --> 00:21:02,599
another example is like a

496
00:21:02,599 --> 00:21:02,599
sanitary landfill you know that that use can vary

497
00:21:02,599 --> 00:21:11,279
drastically we've also adjusted

498
00:21:11,279 --> 00:21:16,329
the loading loading and unloading standards so in today's

499
00:21:16,329 --> 00:21:18,039
day and age you

500
00:21:18,039 --> 00:21:22,000
get a lot more frequent deliveries in smaller vehicles back

501
00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:24,119
20 30 years ago it

502
00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:27,809
was pretty common to have a big semi come and unload a load

503
00:21:27,809 --> 00:21:28,920
every one or two

504
00:21:28,920 --> 00:21:32,569
weeks now you see almost daily deliveries with smaller

505
00:21:32,569 --> 00:21:34,720
vehicles so we've we've

506
00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:38,500
exempted small buildings less than 10,000 square feet from

507
00:21:38,500 --> 00:21:39,400
having to provide a

508
00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:44,519
loading dock on site anything more than that we do have

509
00:21:44,519 --> 00:21:46,240
loading standards based

510
00:21:46,240 --> 00:21:49,740
on the size of the structure commissioner back thank you

511
00:21:49,740 --> 00:21:50,680
chair question

512
00:21:50,680 --> 00:21:54,890
on that when you go downtown now I'm assuming this refers

513
00:21:54,890 --> 00:21:55,920
to areas around the

514
00:21:55,920 --> 00:21:59,589
square then yeah anywhere in the city okay what we usually

515
00:21:59,589 --> 00:22:00,440
see down there and

516
00:22:00,440 --> 00:22:03,259
I can understand small trucks like ups trucks and stuff

517
00:22:03,259 --> 00:22:04,160
like that but every

518
00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:07,279
once in a while there will be a semi parked in one lane on

519
00:22:07,279 --> 00:22:08,000
the square so are

520
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:11,220
we gonna the new rules going to establish that they have to

521
00:22:11,220 --> 00:22:11,539
be the

522
00:22:11,539 --> 00:22:14,859
smaller vehicles that they won't allow these big semis has

523
00:22:14,859 --> 00:22:15,940
that been taken in

524
00:22:15,940 --> 00:22:20,430
consideration no so that the DDC will will just write the

525
00:22:20,430 --> 00:22:22,039
rules for what what

526
00:22:22,039 --> 00:22:24,539
a developer has to provide on a site if they're building

527
00:22:24,539 --> 00:22:25,640
something or changing

528
00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:29,029
something on the property so again this applies to two

529
00:22:29,029 --> 00:22:29,839
buildings that are

530
00:22:29,839 --> 00:22:32,559
smaller than 10,000 square feet which is relatively small

531
00:22:32,559 --> 00:22:34,359
or commercial use but

532
00:22:34,359 --> 00:22:37,420
if you've got a 40 foot trailer and they're not always 40

533
00:22:37,420 --> 00:22:38,319
foot but they're the

534
00:22:38,319 --> 00:22:41,819
long trader types they take up several parking places they

535
00:22:41,819 --> 00:22:43,279
have to move stuff

536
00:22:43,279 --> 00:22:45,799
around to get to it takes a lot longer for them to get

537
00:22:45,799 --> 00:22:46,920
their product out and

538
00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:49,650
into the store so that's not gonna change then they're they

539
00:22:49,650 --> 00:22:50,519
're not gonna be

540
00:22:50,519 --> 00:22:57,839
restricted right okay okay thank you and then to to move

541
00:22:57,839 --> 00:22:58,839
down here we've also

542
00:22:58,839 --> 00:23:02,470
increased flexibility with parking with exemptions so in

543
00:23:02,470 --> 00:23:04,160
the new MD zone that

544
00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:07,869
the mixed-use downtown core zone we've exempted any

545
00:23:07,869 --> 00:23:09,640
property from having to

546
00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:13,480
provide the minimum parking it's difficult to do that in a

547
00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:13,920
downtown

548
00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,390
because if if you require parking then you have a lot of

549
00:23:16,390 --> 00:23:17,400
surface parking and

550
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:20,710
you no longer have a downtown or you require parking and no

551
00:23:20,710 --> 00:23:21,319
one can do

552
00:23:21,319 --> 00:23:24,539
anything because there's not enough space to park cars so

553
00:23:24,539 --> 00:23:25,619
in the MDs

554
00:23:25,619 --> 00:23:30,099
district we've said just build your product and if it doesn

555
00:23:30,099 --> 00:23:32,000
't work then pick

556
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:34,460
a different product but we're not going to say that you

557
00:23:34,460 --> 00:23:35,480
have to provide this

558
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:39,329
this many parking stalls in the downtown and then the last

559
00:23:39,329 --> 00:23:40,359
bullet is we've

560
00:23:40,359 --> 00:23:44,920
exempted any property any non-residential use on a lot less

561
00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:45,119
than

562
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:47,680
five thousand square feet from having to provide parking

563
00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:48,839
and that's pretty small

564
00:23:48,839 --> 00:23:52,869
five thousand square foot lot is is small but if you have a

565
00:23:52,869 --> 00:23:54,359
tiny insurance

566
00:23:54,359 --> 00:23:58,319
agency that has a three thousand square foot lot we're not

567
00:23:58,319 --> 00:23:59,359
going to require them

568
00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:05,660
to provide parking for that use in the city so with that

569
00:24:05,660 --> 00:24:07,720
are there questions on

570
00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:12,700
parking and loading and yes commissioner Smith a chair

571
00:24:12,700 --> 00:24:14,440
roughly how much did you

572
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:18,400
change or give the ability for us to change the minimum

573
00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:19,759
downwards if we've

574
00:24:19,759 --> 00:24:23,720
also increased the maximum of 25% just doing this in search

575
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:24,480
of being able to

576
00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:27,319
how much how much flexibility will this Commission and the

577
00:24:27,319 --> 00:24:28,079
City Council in the

578
00:24:28,079 --> 00:24:32,069
future have to start eliminating unnecessary parking where

579
00:24:32,069 --> 00:24:32,799
I think it's

580
00:24:32,799 --> 00:24:39,119
it probably exists now yeah so the the adjustment to the

581
00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:39,880
minimums we've already

582
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,839
done that in the table so we've already reduced what you

583
00:24:42,839 --> 00:24:43,759
currently require in

584
00:24:43,759 --> 00:24:47,990
many cases lower than what it is now would you say it's I'm

585
00:24:47,990 --> 00:24:48,240
just looking for

586
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:51,470
generalities here is it you say you you you grossly reduce

587
00:24:51,470 --> 00:24:52,720
the minimum in

588
00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:55,539
comparison to what we currently have we looked at each you

589
00:24:55,539 --> 00:24:56,460
specifically so we

590
00:24:56,460 --> 00:24:59,559
didn't just say we're gonna reduce everything by 20% sure

591
00:24:59,559 --> 00:25:00,000
but we looked at

592
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:03,680
it all individually I know for retail for example right now

593
00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:04,400
you guys require

594
00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:08,710
one stall per 350 square feet we made that one stall per

595
00:25:08,710 --> 00:25:11,240
300 okay or no it was

596
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:13,829
the reverse so right now you require one per 300 we made it

597
00:25:13,829 --> 00:25:16,279
one per 350 and then

598
00:25:16,279 --> 00:25:20,690
with the alternatives we allow the alternatives to reduce

599
00:25:20,690 --> 00:25:21,960
the parking so

600
00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:25,720
for example if you have shared parking off-site parking if

601
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:27,079
you're proximate to

602
00:25:27,079 --> 00:25:30,769
transit if you provide affordable housing you can reduce

603
00:25:30,769 --> 00:25:31,799
the the number of

604
00:25:31,799 --> 00:25:38,950
parking up to 50% cumulatively so for example on street

605
00:25:38,950 --> 00:25:39,799
parking you can reduce

606
00:25:39,799 --> 00:25:47,630
the percentage by on a one-to-one ratio so if you have four

607
00:25:47,630 --> 00:25:48,480
spaces in front of

608
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:51,559
your building you can take four spaces off the off-site

609
00:25:51,559 --> 00:25:52,640
parking required

610
00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:56,910
proximate to transit you can reduce up to 25% and you can

611
00:25:56,910 --> 00:25:57,799
combine all those

612
00:25:57,799 --> 00:26:01,019
things to reduce it up to 50% just trying to get an overall

613
00:26:01,019 --> 00:26:01,759
feel for it yes

614
00:26:01,759 --> 00:26:04,319
we've increased things we did it was bad that we had our

615
00:26:04,319 --> 00:26:05,279
minimum our maximum

616
00:26:05,279 --> 00:26:07,680
the same that's pretty restrictive it's good to know that

617
00:26:07,680 --> 00:26:08,559
we have the ability to

618
00:26:08,559 --> 00:26:12,680
to increase by 25% but I wanted to know on a general level

619
00:26:12,680 --> 00:26:13,960
how much flexibility

620
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:16,789
have we given to the minimums it seems like the revisions

621
00:26:16,789 --> 00:26:18,079
gonna allow for for

622
00:26:18,079 --> 00:26:21,160
lower smaller minimums that are right are gonna go down it

623
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:22,000
seems like on an

624
00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:25,170
overall judgment they're all gonna go down then you allow

625
00:26:25,170 --> 00:26:26,359
for alternatives to

626
00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:29,529
even decrease even more in certain scenarios right that's

627
00:26:29,529 --> 00:26:30,480
right perfect

628
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:32,680
that's what we want we don't want to have to have builders

629
00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:33,640
have to expend more

630
00:26:33,640 --> 00:26:36,690
for parking that's unnecessary for a certain site because

631
00:26:36,690 --> 00:26:37,480
of very simple

632
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:40,019
logic that we can decide upon as a commission yeah and we

633
00:26:40,019 --> 00:26:40,720
think I mean a

634
00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:43,750
huge factor in this is the market I mean people developers

635
00:26:43,750 --> 00:26:44,480
aren't gonna build

636
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:49,069
stuff that isn't gonna work so it's a lot of times it's to

637
00:26:49,069 --> 00:26:49,920
say get out of the

638
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:52,599
way of good development and just let them do their thing

639
00:26:52,599 --> 00:26:53,740
and then where the

640
00:26:53,740 --> 00:26:56,599
city's interested is when we'll step in and say okay we

641
00:26:56,599 --> 00:26:57,839
want to address traffic

642
00:26:57,839 --> 00:27:01,359
concerns safety concerns things like that and that's where

643
00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:02,119
we have the

644
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:05,599
minimums sure and just the second question I was just as we

645
00:27:05,599 --> 00:27:06,359
're doing a

646
00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:11,660
city-wide rezone with this with this update if a you know a

647
00:27:11,660 --> 00:27:13,480
business is you

648
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,740
know these new parking minimums and maximums are applied a

649
00:27:16,740 --> 00:27:17,480
business is

650
00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:19,670
operating then they go through a change where they need to

651
00:27:19,670 --> 00:27:20,519
come back in front of

652
00:27:20,519 --> 00:27:25,049
us for a reapproval for whatever whatever use whatever it

653
00:27:25,049 --> 00:27:26,160
is they would

654
00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:28,779
then be allowed within the way this is written the way we

655
00:27:28,779 --> 00:27:29,880
're update the DDC

656
00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:32,700
they would then be allowed to change their parking lot

657
00:27:32,700 --> 00:27:33,519
structure if they're

658
00:27:33,519 --> 00:27:36,980
I'll say they're asking for a rezone or they're doing a

659
00:27:36,980 --> 00:27:38,559
replat or something like

660
00:27:38,559 --> 00:27:40,980
that they would that would allow us to then also change

661
00:27:40,980 --> 00:27:42,000
with their current

662
00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:44,920
standing minimums and maximums are for their parking

663
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:45,799
depending upon whatever

664
00:27:45,799 --> 00:27:48,619
project they're wanting to build or do yeah so at the

665
00:27:48,619 --> 00:27:49,960
beginning of the parking

666
00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:53,920
section on page 85 and 86 there's applicability standards

667
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:55,359
to say in what

668
00:27:55,359 --> 00:27:58,869
scenario do you have to essentially comply with these

669
00:27:58,869 --> 00:28:01,240
standards so there you

670
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,569
have standards for new development any new development in

671
00:28:03,569 --> 00:28:04,319
the city is gonna

672
00:28:04,319 --> 00:28:07,559
have to comply with these standards once they're adopted

673
00:28:07,559 --> 00:28:08,640
expansions and

674
00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:11,670
enlargements under some cases you'll have to comply others

675
00:28:11,670 --> 00:28:12,960
you may not depends

676
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:16,920
on the scale of what you're doing and then we did have in

677
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:18,880
here that the entire

678
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:23,849
site complies if you're adding or expanding one or more

679
00:28:23,849 --> 00:28:24,400
structures that

680
00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:26,660
requires a specific use permit so that would be something

681
00:28:26,660 --> 00:28:27,440
that the Planning

682
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:29,990
Commission and the council would review so that could

683
00:28:29,990 --> 00:28:31,200
trigger them to say okay

684
00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:33,400
if you want to have this use on the property you have to

685
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:34,119
bring your whole

686
00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:41,980
site into compliance with parking works thank you other

687
00:28:41,980 --> 00:28:44,039
questions I'll just make

688
00:28:44,039 --> 00:28:48,309
a comment I think this is a huge cleanup this has been a an

689
00:28:48,309 --> 00:28:50,000
issue in our city for

690
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:54,480
a long long time and I've sat there with clients making

691
00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:55,519
decisions on where they're

692
00:28:55,519 --> 00:28:58,920
gonna locate their business whether they can park it or not

693
00:28:58,920 --> 00:28:59,759
because the use

694
00:28:59,759 --> 00:29:03,730
change from office to medical or whatever and the ability

695
00:29:03,730 --> 00:29:04,599
of property

696
00:29:04,599 --> 00:29:08,039
owners or business owners to be able to determine how to

697
00:29:08,039 --> 00:29:10,359
park their business and

698
00:29:10,359 --> 00:29:13,599
give them the ability to do that I think is a huge cleanup

699
00:29:13,599 --> 00:29:16,279
and I think it will

700
00:29:16,279 --> 00:29:21,960
make some good changes in our city on places that need to

701
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:24,160
be renewed but have

702
00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:26,900
been overlooked because you can't park them and so you can

703
00:29:26,900 --> 00:29:27,599
't go put a new

704
00:29:27,599 --> 00:29:30,849
business there because you can't make the parking standards

705
00:29:30,849 --> 00:29:31,960
and so I think this

706
00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:35,920
is a I would just applaud you I think this is a very good

707
00:29:35,920 --> 00:29:37,079
change for our

708
00:29:37,079 --> 00:29:45,720
city any other questions on this side item all right

709
00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:47,960
forward so we'll jump

710
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:53,970
into site and building design so right now this this topic

711
00:29:53,970 --> 00:29:55,400
really covers a lot

712
00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,220
of things how buildings are oriented on a site the level of

713
00:29:58,220 --> 00:29:59,039
quality for the

714
00:29:59,039 --> 00:30:04,720
building how the pedestrians and vehicles interact with the

715
00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:05,480
site this

716
00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:09,190
this section also addresses wall articulation you can see

717
00:30:09,190 --> 00:30:10,319
here this is an

718
00:30:10,319 --> 00:30:14,799
example of not very good articulation so really this this

719
00:30:14,799 --> 00:30:15,480
section our approach

720
00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:19,170
was to say let's write rules to rule out all the bad

721
00:30:19,170 --> 00:30:20,960
players and encourage

722
00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:24,289
designers and architects and developers to be creative and

723
00:30:24,289 --> 00:30:25,400
to create projects

724
00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:28,619
that they think will contribute to Denton and as Tarek said

725
00:30:28,619 --> 00:30:29,400
there's a lot

726
00:30:29,400 --> 00:30:32,500
of great stuff already here and we use that as a baseline

727
00:30:32,500 --> 00:30:33,680
to say these are the

728
00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:35,960
projects that are working well and that people love here

729
00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:36,960
let's write the

730
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:40,549
standards to allow those types of buildings but to not be

731
00:30:40,549 --> 00:30:41,480
too strict to

732
00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:43,630
say you have to do this this and this to where it

733
00:30:43,630 --> 00:30:46,720
eliminates creativity and

734
00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:50,829
flexibility so this section also addresses visual interest

735
00:30:50,829 --> 00:30:52,519
in relief this

736
00:30:52,519 --> 00:30:55,740
is an example of maybe what a mixed-use district might look

737
00:30:55,740 --> 00:30:57,240
like and then

738
00:30:57,240 --> 00:31:00,769
architectural features your downtown district is very

739
00:31:00,769 --> 00:31:01,799
different than other

740
00:31:01,799 --> 00:31:04,089
areas of the city and there may be more stringent

741
00:31:04,089 --> 00:31:05,759
architectural design standards

742
00:31:05,759 --> 00:31:09,349
or guidelines for the downtown area than there would be

743
00:31:09,349 --> 00:31:10,920
elsewhere in the city so

744
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:15,059
we've really looked at this on a context approach to say

745
00:31:15,059 --> 00:31:16,240
what's appropriate in

746
00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:19,859
this area something in the industrial park maybe we don't

747
00:31:19,859 --> 00:31:20,759
care as much as it

748
00:31:20,759 --> 00:31:26,440
is here downtown so as far as an overview the organization

749
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:26,839
of this

750
00:31:26,839 --> 00:31:31,490
section is quite different than what you have now we start

751
00:31:31,490 --> 00:31:32,359
with single-family

752
00:31:32,359 --> 00:31:35,269
duplex and townhome standards those are different than

753
00:31:35,269 --> 00:31:36,720
multifamily which are

754
00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:39,400
different than non-residential and mixed-use and then

755
00:31:39,400 --> 00:31:40,359
finally the MN and

756
00:31:40,359 --> 00:31:44,319
MD districts for the mixed-use districts so each tier has

757
00:31:44,319 --> 00:31:45,000
its own set of

758
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:49,029
standards that apply to those areas in those contexts so as

759
00:31:49,029 --> 00:31:50,519
you read through

760
00:31:50,519 --> 00:31:55,640
the draft you'll see that and then other things that this

761
00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:56,599
chapter addresses are

762
00:31:56,599 --> 00:32:00,000
site design and orientation like I said it's common for

763
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:01,359
multifamily projects to

764
00:32:01,359 --> 00:32:03,980
have several buildings on one site how should those

765
00:32:03,980 --> 00:32:05,480
buildings be organized and

766
00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:09,029
placed so that it makes the most sense for both the

767
00:32:09,029 --> 00:32:10,680
pedestrian the developers

768
00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:14,769
the city to achieve their goals the mass and form of

769
00:32:14,769 --> 00:32:17,039
buildings that brings us

770
00:32:17,039 --> 00:32:19,930
back to the articulation how frequently should you have a

771
00:32:19,930 --> 00:32:22,000
recess or some

772
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:25,089
articulation in a wall so that you don't have these blank

773
00:32:25,089 --> 00:32:26,799
walls along important

774
00:32:26,799 --> 00:32:32,680
streets in Denton architectural variety building materials

775
00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:34,880
is masonry

776
00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:38,839
required how much is metal allowed how much and then

777
00:32:38,839 --> 00:32:39,960
transparency in windows

778
00:32:39,960 --> 00:32:43,339
it's important to be able to both see in and out of

779
00:32:43,339 --> 00:32:44,920
buildings for visual

780
00:32:44,920 --> 00:32:48,650
interest but also just from a functional standpoint of the

781
00:32:48,650 --> 00:32:52,079
structure itself so

782
00:32:52,079 --> 00:32:55,049
some key changes we've introduced alternative standards for

783
00:32:55,049 --> 00:32:55,440
infill

784
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:59,529
development and higher quality design again it's really

785
00:32:59,529 --> 00:33:00,839
tough to have a one

786
00:33:00,839 --> 00:33:04,920
size fits all so infill projects can be very challenging

787
00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:05,839
and it may not be

788
00:33:05,839 --> 00:33:10,130
practical to comply black and white with with the letter of

789
00:33:10,130 --> 00:33:11,440
the law so we've

790
00:33:11,440 --> 00:33:14,420
allowed for alternative designs to say okay you can get

791
00:33:14,420 --> 00:33:15,680
creative and propose

792
00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:20,740
something that that exceeds the code requirements new

793
00:33:20,740 --> 00:33:21,960
standards for

794
00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:25,130
multifamily building developments so again how are those

795
00:33:25,130 --> 00:33:26,599
buildings oriented on

796
00:33:26,599 --> 00:33:30,119
the site you have common gathering space courtyards are you

797
00:33:30,119 --> 00:33:31,000
framing the corner of

798
00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:34,690
the intersection things like that and then new specific

799
00:33:34,690 --> 00:33:35,759
standards for the MN

800
00:33:35,759 --> 00:33:39,920
and MD districts so here's an example 60% of the street

801
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:40,640
frontage shall have

802
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:43,859
buildings within 10 feet of the front lot line in the MN or

803
00:33:43,859 --> 00:33:45,079
MD zones and those

804
00:33:45,079 --> 00:33:47,970
zones are pedestrian oriented districts so you want to have

805
00:33:47,970 --> 00:33:49,039
buildings closer to

806
00:33:49,039 --> 00:33:52,599
the street to provide visual interest people are walking so

807
00:33:52,599 --> 00:33:53,640
it's a lot easier

808
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:57,759
to access the buildings things like that so that's a quick

809
00:33:57,759 --> 00:33:59,119
overview of site and

810
00:33:59,119 --> 00:34:06,269
building design if you have additional questions or

811
00:34:06,269 --> 00:34:11,280
comments we're making record

812
00:34:11,280 --> 00:34:15,610
time continue yeah we're doing well okay so exterior

813
00:34:15,610 --> 00:34:17,079
lighting so this is the last

814
00:34:17,079 --> 00:34:21,039
topic that will that will dress the the code right now is

815
00:34:21,039 --> 00:34:22,400
really doesn't really

816
00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:26,960
address lighting in detail so we've added really general

817
00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:28,079
basic standards to

818
00:34:28,079 --> 00:34:31,690
say that if you do provide lighting on your site have it be

819
00:34:31,690 --> 00:34:33,199
downcast don't shed

820
00:34:33,199 --> 00:34:37,590
light onto your neighboring properties so that someone

821
00:34:37,590 --> 00:34:38,840
trying to sleep at night

822
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:41,869
doesn't have this glaring bright window shine or light

823
00:34:41,869 --> 00:34:42,719
shining through their

824
00:34:42,719 --> 00:34:47,849
window and because we're requiring a lot more pedestrian

825
00:34:47,849 --> 00:34:49,159
facility sidewalks

826
00:34:49,159 --> 00:34:54,099
pathways they we want them to be lit so that they're safe

827
00:34:54,099 --> 00:34:54,880
so we've included some

828
00:34:54,880 --> 00:34:58,050
really basic standards to say those pedestrian areas should

829
00:34:58,050 --> 00:34:59,039
be lit with with

830
00:34:59,039 --> 00:35:03,289
lighting no more than 16 feet tall to relate to the scale

831
00:35:03,289 --> 00:35:04,880
of a person they

832
00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:08,150
should be full cut off downcast fixtures and that they

833
00:35:08,150 --> 00:35:09,760
should be required along

834
00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:12,980
internal sidewalks and paths and then for parking area

835
00:35:12,980 --> 00:35:13,960
lighting we've

836
00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:16,530
introduced some standards saying there shouldn't be taller

837
00:35:16,530 --> 00:35:17,440
than 25 feet and

838
00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:20,469
again they should be downcast and that light shouldn't

839
00:35:20,469 --> 00:35:21,679
spill on neighboring

840
00:35:21,679 --> 00:35:25,269
properties more than one foot candle at the property line

841
00:35:25,269 --> 00:35:26,559
which is something

842
00:35:26,559 --> 00:35:29,510
that the code enforcement can can actually go out and

843
00:35:29,510 --> 00:35:30,440
measure with an

844
00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:35,900
instrument so with that there are questions on lighting

845
00:35:35,900 --> 00:35:36,800
Commissioner

846
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:39,320
Sullivan

847
00:35:46,679 --> 00:35:50,280
so we don't have that standard in the current ordinance

848
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:51,360
that's something that

849
00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:54,539
the that the developer would decide or the the staff would

850
00:35:54,539 --> 00:35:55,639
say listen you have

851
00:35:55,639 --> 00:35:58,230
you need more than just one light on this pathway because

852
00:35:58,230 --> 00:35:59,199
it only lights this

853
00:35:59,199 --> 00:36:03,889
one area and a lot of places require a photometric lighting

854
00:36:03,889 --> 00:36:05,199
plan to show how

855
00:36:05,199 --> 00:36:07,510
much light is going to be cast on the site and that's

856
00:36:07,510 --> 00:36:08,679
something that the staff

857
00:36:08,679 --> 00:36:11,659
can include in their administrative manual that they're

858
00:36:11,659 --> 00:36:12,719
drafting is if that

859
00:36:12,719 --> 00:36:16,679
would be required so that's something that the staff can

860
00:36:16,679 --> 00:36:18,039
work out internally to

861
00:36:18,039 --> 00:36:20,579
say how much lighting is required we just say if you

862
00:36:20,579 --> 00:36:22,400
provide lighting these

863
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:25,920
are the general standards it shouldn't be taller than this

864
00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:30,320
on the site in

865
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:34,699
commercial and non-residential lighting we do specify in

866
00:36:34,699 --> 00:36:36,360
parking lots that the

867
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,579
average illuminance values in that parking lot shall be at

868
00:36:39,579 --> 00:36:41,000
least two foot

869
00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:45,349
candles which is a standard for measuring the amount of

870
00:36:45,349 --> 00:36:46,840
light downcast

871
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:49,710
we say it can't go over one at the property line so you're

872
00:36:49,710 --> 00:36:50,559
not creating a

873
00:36:50,559 --> 00:36:53,280
nuisance issue but it's got to be at least two in the

874
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:54,559
parking area that's

875
00:36:54,559 --> 00:36:57,590
just for basic safety it's up to you how you get to that

876
00:36:57,590 --> 00:36:59,639
two foot candles in an

877
00:36:59,639 --> 00:37:03,639
even distribution also there are a lot of places where in

878
00:37:03,639 --> 00:37:05,199
the evening it may be

879
00:37:05,199 --> 00:37:08,170
well lit on the main street but then when you want to turn

880
00:37:08,170 --> 00:37:09,239
you can't even see

881
00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:12,300
that you know where the curb is because there's no light

882
00:37:12,300 --> 00:37:13,519
you know that you can't

883
00:37:13,519 --> 00:37:16,900
see and then for pedestrians it's hard to see pedestrians

884
00:37:16,900 --> 00:37:18,840
and so what's you

885
00:37:18,840 --> 00:37:24,000
know is there a an amount of light that should be well all

886
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:25,800
those places so people

887
00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:29,599
don't get hurt it's an excellent point I will tell you our

888
00:37:29,599 --> 00:37:30,880
method here was to

889
00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:35,199
take a relatively light touch primarily because you don't

890
00:37:35,199 --> 00:37:36,639
really regulate light

891
00:37:36,639 --> 00:37:40,739
much now we stepped it up a notch to get you to have some

892
00:37:40,739 --> 00:37:42,119
minimal regulations

893
00:37:42,119 --> 00:37:46,190
oftentimes communities want some standards for crime

894
00:37:46,190 --> 00:37:47,400
prevention and

895
00:37:47,400 --> 00:37:50,699
environmental design and that's kind of what you're getting

896
00:37:50,699 --> 00:37:52,119
at how much light is

897
00:37:52,119 --> 00:37:55,369
too much light and if you have too much light in one space

898
00:37:55,369 --> 00:37:56,679
and not enough light

899
00:37:56,679 --> 00:38:01,670
over here it's almost blinding once you exit the well-lit

900
00:38:01,670 --> 00:38:02,960
area you can't see

901
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:06,719
pedestrians you can't see somebody on the bike and also you

902
00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:07,119
create

903
00:38:07,119 --> 00:38:10,960
opportunities for criminal activity if it's not a better

904
00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:12,519
distribution of light

905
00:38:12,519 --> 00:38:15,730
we can explore some of that if we get that type of

906
00:38:15,730 --> 00:38:17,960
direction we have drafted

907
00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:20,329
those types of standards before and we're we're happy to

908
00:38:20,329 --> 00:38:21,119
bring something

909
00:38:21,119 --> 00:38:23,800
before you on that

910
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:38,360
anything else on lighting okay so subdivisions so this is

911
00:38:38,360 --> 00:38:40,199
sub chapter 7 of

912
00:38:40,199 --> 00:38:43,369
the draft there this is a table of contents for what's

913
00:38:43,369 --> 00:38:44,480
included in that

914
00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:47,650
subchapter so there's a purpose statement the applicability

915
00:38:47,650 --> 00:38:48,239
when when do

916
00:38:48,239 --> 00:38:52,659
these standards apply subdivision design standards and then

917
00:38:52,659 --> 00:38:53,559
improvement standards

918
00:38:53,559 --> 00:38:57,519
so we'll walk through just a few changes there we've we've

919
00:38:57,519 --> 00:38:58,519
introduced new

920
00:38:58,519 --> 00:39:02,199
flag lot standards in the city I'm sure you all are aware

921
00:39:02,199 --> 00:39:03,400
of what a flag lot is

922
00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:06,619
but those those standards are really minimal right now so

923
00:39:06,619 --> 00:39:07,519
we've enhanced

924
00:39:07,519 --> 00:39:11,360
those to make it clear as to when when these are allowed

925
00:39:11,360 --> 00:39:12,800
and exactly how you

926
00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:16,210
would design flag lots and then a new tool that we've

927
00:39:16,210 --> 00:39:17,840
introduced is a cluster

928
00:39:17,840 --> 00:39:21,570
subdivision tool and this allows flexibility and lot design

929
00:39:21,570 --> 00:39:22,920
and layout if

930
00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:26,880
if the developer protects sensitive lands and or open areas

931
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:28,320
so let's say you

932
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:32,289
have a site near a riparian area maybe it's a hundred acre

933
00:39:32,289 --> 00:39:33,480
site but really

934
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:37,750
only 20 to 30 acres is developable the developer can

935
00:39:37,750 --> 00:39:39,079
propose a cluster

936
00:39:39,079 --> 00:39:43,329
subdivision to consolidate or cluster the development into

937
00:39:43,329 --> 00:39:44,400
one area of the

938
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:48,750
site and and preserve the remainder of the site through

939
00:39:48,750 --> 00:39:50,079
either an easement or

940
00:39:50,079 --> 00:39:53,530
deed restriction or some other way to protect it in perpet

941
00:39:53,530 --> 00:39:56,239
uity and that would

942
00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:59,800
then open the door to smaller lot sizes to smaller setbacks

943
00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:00,840
essentially you're

944
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:04,429
you're allowing more density for preserving open areas in

945
00:40:04,429 --> 00:40:05,679
the city and a

946
00:40:05,679 --> 00:40:08,500
lot of communities are doing this now especially in the

947
00:40:08,500 --> 00:40:09,519
western areas with

948
00:40:09,519 --> 00:40:14,519
hazard mitigation if you have a very high wildfire area you

949
00:40:14,519 --> 00:40:15,400
can preserve

950
00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:18,300
those areas and push the development away into other

951
00:40:18,300 --> 00:40:20,360
portions of the site and

952
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:23,630
you're not you're not losing the density that you would

953
00:40:23,630 --> 00:40:24,920
have had otherwise but

954
00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:28,570
you're clustering it into a different area so Commissioner

955
00:40:28,570 --> 00:40:29,480
Smith saying you're

956
00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:35,000
reducing the setbacks you're making it more dense do you

957
00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:36,519
have an idea of how

958
00:40:36,519 --> 00:40:40,949
much yes scale what ratio that is to do that yeah so page

959
00:40:40,949 --> 00:40:42,400
133 there's a table

960
00:40:42,400 --> 00:40:46,360
that says what the cluster subdivision standards would be

961
00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:48,360
so the first you need

962
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:51,909
at least three acres to do a cluster subdivision so there's

963
00:40:51,909 --> 00:40:52,719
a minimum there

964
00:40:52,719 --> 00:40:55,889
there's a block length you have to have at least a block

965
00:40:55,889 --> 00:40:57,159
length of six no more

966
00:40:57,159 --> 00:41:01,119
than 600 feet your lot size can be reduced to 2,500 square

967
00:41:01,119 --> 00:41:01,960
feet if you're

968
00:41:01,960 --> 00:41:05,320
doing a cluster subdivision your lot width can be up to 20

969
00:41:05,320 --> 00:41:06,800
feet and then your

970
00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:10,570
setbacks are outlined there as well so so we do set

971
00:41:10,570 --> 00:41:12,599
parameters and and again

972
00:41:12,599 --> 00:41:15,960
this is a draft I mean these numbers can be tweaked to

973
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:17,159
reflect what's what's best

974
00:41:17,159 --> 00:41:20,880
for Denton but the idea is to say that the city will

975
00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:22,239
benefit more if you

976
00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:26,889
preserve this area that's sensitive then we so it's a trade

977
00:41:26,889 --> 00:41:28,199
-off you say if you

978
00:41:28,199 --> 00:41:31,150
preserve that area will allow you to have a smaller lots to

979
00:41:31,150 --> 00:41:32,199
to make the

980
00:41:32,199 --> 00:41:38,239
project pencil essentially I'll make a comment while we're

981
00:41:38,239 --> 00:41:39,300
stopped here on

982
00:41:39,300 --> 00:41:42,480
cluster subdivision I think it's a great idea we've talked

983
00:41:42,480 --> 00:41:43,400
about it numerous

984
00:41:43,400 --> 00:41:48,860
times here at before this Commission I guess an ask would

985
00:41:48,860 --> 00:41:50,000
be is if you are

986
00:41:50,000 --> 00:41:55,880
looking at the traffic utility design standards to see if

987
00:41:55,880 --> 00:41:57,920
these are possible

988
00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:01,539
because that's always been the problem in the past is there

989
00:42:01,539 --> 00:42:02,280
's not enough

990
00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:06,909
flexibility in our street designs our utility designs to be

991
00:42:06,909 --> 00:42:08,159
able to do those

992
00:42:08,159 --> 00:42:11,329
to meet the curves the maximum grades and those types of

993
00:42:11,329 --> 00:42:12,480
things so I just point

994
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:15,130
that out while you all are reviewing this and if we're

995
00:42:15,130 --> 00:42:16,219
going to put it in the

996
00:42:16,219 --> 00:42:19,869
DDC here may want to look and talk with engineering about

997
00:42:19,869 --> 00:42:21,239
if if somebody does

998
00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:24,719
want to do these is there any flexibility that we have in

999
00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:25,000
our

1000
00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:28,619
engineering requirements to make it possible yeah and that

1001
00:42:28,619 --> 00:42:29,760
's a great point

1002
00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:32,159
I mean we want to make sure if this is an available option

1003
00:42:32,159 --> 00:42:33,840
that it's viable that

1004
00:42:33,840 --> 00:42:36,920
people can actually do it that's why it hasn't been done

1005
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:40,079
today so Commissioner

1006
00:42:40,079 --> 00:42:46,460
Beck thank you chair on a lot with says and these are

1007
00:42:46,460 --> 00:42:47,679
minimum I understand that

1008
00:42:47,679 --> 00:42:52,670
it's got a 20-foot minimum that's the width of my garage

1009
00:42:52,670 --> 00:42:53,800
down here in the foot

1010
00:42:53,800 --> 00:42:57,800
note it says this can be discussed to reduce even further

1011
00:42:57,800 --> 00:42:58,760
so that just seems

1012
00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:04,769
unreasonable how do you develop well yeah and that that may

1013
00:43:04,769 --> 00:43:05,519
be a townhome

1014
00:43:05,519 --> 00:43:09,820
product where you have a townhouse that's 20 to 30 feet but

1015
00:43:09,820 --> 00:43:10,840
again that's

1016
00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:13,340
the minimum and the developer is not going to create a

1017
00:43:13,340 --> 00:43:14,400
subdivision that he

1018
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:17,920
can't build a product that to sell so like I said earlier

1019
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:19,079
we want to we want

1020
00:43:19,079 --> 00:43:21,369
to get out of their way to say okay if you can make it work

1021
00:43:21,369 --> 00:43:22,079
and sell something

1022
00:43:22,079 --> 00:43:26,150
that meets all the other standards of the code go for it

1023
00:43:26,150 --> 00:43:27,599
you know get creative

1024
00:43:27,599 --> 00:43:30,260
but we're not going to say you can't do something if you

1025
00:43:30,260 --> 00:43:31,639
can I don't know just

1026
00:43:31,639 --> 00:43:35,960
in seeing feasible 20 feet I don't know it's small really

1027
00:43:35,960 --> 00:43:38,079
okay it's small but

1028
00:43:38,079 --> 00:43:43,679
10 ohms okay I didn't want to set a standard that right

1029
00:43:43,679 --> 00:43:44,400
with something that

1030
00:43:44,400 --> 00:43:47,010
would move and they're fluid I mean like I said that all

1031
00:43:47,010 --> 00:43:48,079
this stuff is up for

1032
00:43:48,079 --> 00:43:51,670
discussion we can change it and if 30 feet or 40 feet is

1033
00:43:51,670 --> 00:43:52,800
more appropriate but

1034
00:43:52,800 --> 00:43:56,179
that it's important to strike a balance between what's

1035
00:43:56,179 --> 00:43:57,000
going to be an incentive

1036
00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:03,360
to do this and what's what's not okay I would just add to

1037
00:44:03,360 --> 00:44:05,559
your question is if

1038
00:44:05,559 --> 00:44:10,199
you don't give the flexibility you certainly don't aren't

1039
00:44:10,199 --> 00:44:12,119
allowed to leave

1040
00:44:12,119 --> 00:44:15,289
areas undisturbed if you're gonna say they have to be 50

1041
00:44:15,289 --> 00:44:15,960
foot minimum like a

1042
00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:19,750
regular lot then there's no incentive to try to preserve

1043
00:44:19,750 --> 00:44:21,280
the areas where you can

1044
00:44:21,280 --> 00:44:23,960
get a density trade-off to say I'm gonna leave these areas

1045
00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:25,599
undisturbed and in

1046
00:44:25,599 --> 00:44:28,639
return I'm gonna be able to put and transfer that density

1047
00:44:28,639 --> 00:44:29,559
to another area

1048
00:44:29,559 --> 00:44:32,960
and have a smaller lot size to be able to accomplish you

1049
00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:34,639
know the density part

1050
00:44:34,639 --> 00:44:38,320
that that's where that is no I agree I you know I wouldn't

1051
00:44:38,320 --> 00:44:39,400
want things a whole

1052
00:44:39,400 --> 00:44:41,639
lot bigger but it just seems like 20 feet was so small but

1053
00:44:41,639 --> 00:44:42,360
if you're saying

1054
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:44,900
that's a feasible it'd be a town home I don't see it being

1055
00:44:44,900 --> 00:44:45,760
a single-family

1056
00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:48,239
rather that didn't surprise me but I'll take your word for

1057
00:44:48,239 --> 00:44:49,079
it because you do this

1058
00:44:49,079 --> 00:44:53,039
for thank you yeah and again like I said it's striking that

1059
00:44:53,039 --> 00:44:55,280
balance and in other

1060
00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:57,900
communities we found that this type of approach really

1061
00:44:57,900 --> 00:44:58,800
helps home values

1062
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:01,739
because once you have common open area and green space as

1063
00:45:01,739 --> 00:45:02,440
part of your

1064
00:45:02,440 --> 00:45:05,079
subdivision depending on how you lay out the design it's

1065
00:45:05,079 --> 00:45:06,239
really an amenity for

1066
00:45:06,239 --> 00:45:08,800
people to know that that area is preserved it's never going

1067
00:45:08,800 --> 00:45:09,079
to be

1068
00:45:09,079 --> 00:45:13,039
developed and it's a great amenity for folks so we just

1069
00:45:13,039 --> 00:45:14,199
wanted to open the door

1070
00:45:14,199 --> 00:45:17,369
to say this this is an option indent and if you want to do

1071
00:45:17,369 --> 00:45:19,039
that you can there's

1072
00:45:19,039 --> 00:45:21,699
standards you have to meet but we're not going to tell you

1073
00:45:21,699 --> 00:45:22,599
no if you can make it

1074
00:45:22,599 --> 00:45:26,789
work Commissioner Sullivan thank you I've never heard the

1075
00:45:26,789 --> 00:45:27,519
term cluster

1076
00:45:27,519 --> 00:45:30,460
subdivision is this the same thing as a zero lot line or a

1077
00:45:30,460 --> 00:45:32,280
garden home that type

1078
00:45:32,280 --> 00:45:37,960
of an area or what's no that the idea of a cluster setback

1079
00:45:37,960 --> 00:45:40,519
on the sides I mean

1080
00:45:40,519 --> 00:45:46,159
that's almost Eve Eve you know yeah so that the term

1081
00:45:46,159 --> 00:45:47,320
cluster subdivision comes

1082
00:45:47,320 --> 00:45:50,489
from it again looking at a whole side and laying it out as

1083
00:45:50,489 --> 00:45:51,360
if as you would

1084
00:45:51,360 --> 00:45:54,179
developing the entire thing as a subdivision and then

1085
00:45:54,179 --> 00:45:55,039
taking that same

1086
00:45:55,039 --> 00:45:58,590
number of houses and clustering them into one small area of

1087
00:45:58,590 --> 00:45:59,400
the site and

1088
00:45:59,400 --> 00:46:02,619
preserving everything else so that's where the term comes

1089
00:46:02,619 --> 00:46:04,960
from and and one

1090
00:46:04,960 --> 00:46:08,519
way to do that is to offer smaller lot sizes smaller set

1091
00:46:08,519 --> 00:46:10,320
backs so the result

1092
00:46:10,320 --> 00:46:14,599
may be smaller setbacks not zero lot line development but

1093
00:46:14,599 --> 00:46:16,000
you may definitely

1094
00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:18,320
have homes that are closer to the five feet what's the

1095
00:46:18,320 --> 00:46:19,400
difference between that

1096
00:46:19,400 --> 00:46:23,239
and a zero lot line where that's pretty much what you have

1097
00:46:23,239 --> 00:46:24,079
is it well you have

1098
00:46:24,079 --> 00:46:27,920
ten feet wrong on that or you know you'd have ten feet

1099
00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:29,000
between buildings if each

1100
00:46:29,000 --> 00:46:31,989
building had five feet or they'd be touching I mean that's

1101
00:46:31,989 --> 00:46:32,920
that would be the

1102
00:46:32,920 --> 00:46:36,380
difference and it's man oh there's I think it's called

1103
00:46:36,380 --> 00:46:38,000
Villa of Corinth or

1104
00:46:38,000 --> 00:46:41,400
something over in Corinth not didn't that the houses are

1105
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:43,320
narrow I don't not

1106
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:46,139
ten feet but they're in our twenty but they're narrow they

1107
00:46:46,139 --> 00:46:48,519
're deep and they've

1108
00:46:48,519 --> 00:46:52,789
got a very small side yard that they share and so and that

1109
00:46:52,789 --> 00:46:54,119
's more of a what I

1110
00:46:54,119 --> 00:46:57,340
would consider a zero lot line as opposed to having a ten

1111
00:46:57,340 --> 00:46:58,480
foot setback on

1112
00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:03,469
the sides I mean I'm just trying to get the idea of what a

1113
00:47:03,469 --> 00:47:04,679
cluster or subdivision

1114
00:47:04,679 --> 00:47:09,650
would look like so I I just want to clarify a couple of

1115
00:47:09,650 --> 00:47:11,039
points on setbacks

1116
00:47:11,039 --> 00:47:14,789
versus zero lot line versus cluster subdivision in cluster

1117
00:47:14,789 --> 00:47:15,960
subdivision we

1118
00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:21,179
are only talking about the lot don't picture a product on

1119
00:47:21,179 --> 00:47:22,840
that lot the idea is

1120
00:47:22,840 --> 00:47:27,340
that you can do just as many lots on the entire project

1121
00:47:27,340 --> 00:47:28,719
site that you otherwise

1122
00:47:28,719 --> 00:47:31,539
could but they're going to be much smaller than they they

1123
00:47:31,539 --> 00:47:32,099
would in a

1124
00:47:32,099 --> 00:47:35,440
traditional subdivision that captures the the cluster

1125
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:36,880
portion of it put more

1126
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:40,559
of your lots over there and they can be smaller that's fine

1127
00:47:40,559 --> 00:47:41,639
and your setbacks

1128
00:47:41,639 --> 00:47:45,059
might be reduced now for the product types you might be

1129
00:47:45,059 --> 00:47:46,280
able to do a single

1130
00:47:46,280 --> 00:47:49,940
family detached home if you get enough wiggle room on those

1131
00:47:49,940 --> 00:47:51,119
setbacks it would

1132
00:47:51,119 --> 00:47:54,480
be very skinny and narrow but I'm seeing products come out

1133
00:47:54,480 --> 00:47:55,760
of production home

1134
00:47:55,760 --> 00:48:00,110
builders that are that narrow for attached products we

1135
00:48:00,110 --> 00:48:01,679
address this not in

1136
00:48:01,679 --> 00:48:05,159
the cluster subdivision but rather in that first piece of

1137
00:48:05,159 --> 00:48:06,119
the code on the

1138
00:48:06,119 --> 00:48:08,840
zoning districts where we talk about how lot lines are

1139
00:48:08,840 --> 00:48:10,559
measured how setbacks are

1140
00:48:10,559 --> 00:48:13,590
measured if you're building an attached product like a town

1141
00:48:13,590 --> 00:48:14,840
home you're sharing

1142
00:48:14,840 --> 00:48:17,659
a common wall you don't have to meet the side setback

1143
00:48:17,659 --> 00:48:20,239
obviously because your

1144
00:48:20,239 --> 00:48:23,059
building is connected to the one next door to it so that

1145
00:48:23,059 --> 00:48:24,119
would be the case you

1146
00:48:24,119 --> 00:48:27,059
could do that product in a cluster subdivision and not have

1147
00:48:27,059 --> 00:48:27,719
to meet that

1148
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:31,239
setback requirement but then would you run into the density

1149
00:48:31,239 --> 00:48:31,920
problem that we've

1150
00:48:31,920 --> 00:48:36,019
run into many times where you've got a lot of people a lot

1151
00:48:36,019 --> 00:48:37,679
of cars and no place

1152
00:48:37,679 --> 00:48:40,380
to put the cars there's still got a you still got to meet

1153
00:48:40,380 --> 00:48:41,079
the parking

1154
00:48:41,079 --> 00:48:46,789
requirements yeah nothing in cluster subdivision says you

1155
00:48:46,789 --> 00:48:47,519
don't have to meet

1156
00:48:47,519 --> 00:48:51,679
the parking requirements however we have introduced a new

1157
00:48:51,679 --> 00:48:53,480
type of parking

1158
00:48:53,480 --> 00:48:57,980
organization called an auto court which is actually within

1159
00:48:57,980 --> 00:48:58,920
the cluster

1160
00:48:58,920 --> 00:49:01,800
subdivision regulations that say all right if you're gonna

1161
00:49:01,800 --> 00:49:02,400
organize a

1162
00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:05,699
development where you've got a lot more people living

1163
00:49:05,699 --> 00:49:07,440
closer together than a

1164
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:10,760
traditional single-family detached neighborhood you can

1165
00:49:10,760 --> 00:49:11,960
have a shared auto

1166
00:49:11,960 --> 00:49:15,610
court where everybody's parking over there they access that

1167
00:49:15,610 --> 00:49:16,639
from an alley or

1168
00:49:16,639 --> 00:49:20,599
something and then they walk to their homes that very short

1169
00:49:20,599 --> 00:49:21,880
short walk patio

1170
00:49:21,880 --> 00:49:26,690
homes cottage homes things like that so the main concept

1171
00:49:26,690 --> 00:49:28,400
here is try to get out

1172
00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:31,869
of the way of somebody doing some more creative missing

1173
00:49:31,869 --> 00:49:33,599
middle housing types

1174
00:49:33,599 --> 00:49:36,659
people are willing to live in much different places than

1175
00:49:36,659 --> 00:49:37,800
they were 20 years

1176
00:49:37,800 --> 00:49:41,400
ago and we need to be flexible for those types of products

1177
00:49:41,400 --> 00:49:43,159
where appropriate

1178
00:49:43,159 --> 00:49:47,599
thank you Mr. Sanchez

1179
00:50:03,599 --> 00:50:09,059
you got your microphone on but it was getting that's how I

1180
00:50:09,059 --> 00:50:10,000
see it it just

1181
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:12,940
gives you different options so that you can still be able

1182
00:50:12,940 --> 00:50:13,599
to protect the

1183
00:50:13,599 --> 00:50:16,489
environment and I think that's what you're saying you have

1184
00:50:16,489 --> 00:50:17,280
all different

1185
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:21,869
options within that that smaller area to develop and I'm

1186
00:50:21,869 --> 00:50:23,400
not sure that to the

1187
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:27,800
chairman's point it's never been used before here in Denton

1188
00:50:27,800 --> 00:50:29,480
it's actually has

1189
00:50:29,480 --> 00:50:33,590
not been used a lot in Texas communities in general based

1190
00:50:33,590 --> 00:50:34,880
on ETJ requirements and

1191
00:50:34,880 --> 00:50:37,800
lots of different reasons however you make the incentive

1192
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:39,400
strong enough to say

1193
00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:41,349
all right we're willing to get out of the way on some of

1194
00:50:41,349 --> 00:50:41,960
these stricter

1195
00:50:41,960 --> 00:50:45,000
standards eventually you're gonna see one eventually you'll

1196
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:45,679
see some benefit

1197
00:50:45,679 --> 00:50:48,260
that doesn't mean this is the only way to protect those

1198
00:50:48,260 --> 00:50:49,719
sensitive areas you you

1199
00:50:49,719 --> 00:50:53,000
have other ways of doing so

1200
00:50:55,559 --> 00:51:00,239
Commissioner Smith thank you sure question I had early

1201
00:51:00,239 --> 00:51:00,480
about the

1202
00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:03,199
calculation of the density and all like stuff what sizes

1203
00:51:03,199 --> 00:51:04,239
width all that good

1204
00:51:04,239 --> 00:51:07,460
stuff great awesome if what I'm trying to I guess what's

1205
00:51:07,460 --> 00:51:08,199
trying to ask earlier

1206
00:51:08,199 --> 00:51:12,920
was this if that area and my maybe it maybe I'm screwed up

1207
00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:13,440
because he's really

1208
00:51:13,440 --> 00:51:16,440
would be a PD zone at that point in time wouldn't it wouldn

1209
00:51:16,440 --> 00:51:17,800
't be a with this if

1210
00:51:17,800 --> 00:51:21,760
you're talking about let's say it's a it's a six six lots

1211
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:22,880
per yeah six six

1212
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:29,349
units six building units per acre type area and that's the

1213
00:51:29,349 --> 00:51:30,000
subdivision that

1214
00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:32,260
we've got now and we're clustering does that mean that you

1215
00:51:32,260 --> 00:51:33,119
still have to meet

1216
00:51:33,119 --> 00:51:36,809
the dwelling unit requirement for the hundred hundred acre

1217
00:51:36,809 --> 00:51:37,840
area but now you

1218
00:51:37,840 --> 00:51:40,289
need to put all your unit requirement that can't go any

1219
00:51:40,289 --> 00:51:41,400
more than what's

1220
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:44,010
already there but now it has to be done in a 30 unit area

1221
00:51:44,010 --> 00:51:44,960
and we're removing

1222
00:51:44,960 --> 00:51:47,150
some of the restrictions that normally would be there so

1223
00:51:47,150 --> 00:51:48,619
that you can meet that

1224
00:51:48,619 --> 00:51:51,909
unit that unit area require them on the zoning so that

1225
00:51:51,909 --> 00:51:53,079
question makes sense

1226
00:51:53,079 --> 00:51:57,409
because it didn't make sense to me so I jumbled my words it

1227
00:51:57,409 --> 00:51:58,519
does make sense I

1228
00:51:58,519 --> 00:52:02,219
knew what you were hinting at there and you got there so we

1229
00:52:02,219 --> 00:52:04,480
do not say by

1230
00:52:04,480 --> 00:52:09,030
district thou shall not exceed the following dwelling units

1231
00:52:09,030 --> 00:52:10,239
per acre rather

1232
00:52:10,239 --> 00:52:12,570
there are other parameters to get you there through

1233
00:52:12,570 --> 00:52:13,800
building height through

1234
00:52:13,800 --> 00:52:16,980
setback requirements through building coverage requirements

1235
00:52:16,980 --> 00:52:17,880
your plan says an

1236
00:52:17,880 --> 00:52:20,449
awful lot about density so it gets into the which zoning

1237
00:52:20,449 --> 00:52:21,179
districts are

1238
00:52:21,179 --> 00:52:24,780
appropriate where in the city now using a cluster subdiv

1239
00:52:24,780 --> 00:52:26,199
ision the idea does not

1240
00:52:26,199 --> 00:52:30,760
increase your density it shifts all of your lots to a small

1241
00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:31,519
so that smaller

1242
00:52:31,519 --> 00:52:35,019
portion taken in and of itself might have a higher density

1243
00:52:35,019 --> 00:52:36,039
than otherwise

1244
00:52:36,039 --> 00:52:40,019
allowed but the site in totality does not correct and in

1245
00:52:40,019 --> 00:52:41,559
fact in order for a

1246
00:52:41,559 --> 00:52:45,059
cluster subdivision to work you have to guarantee in perpet

1247
00:52:45,059 --> 00:52:46,119
uity that it won't be

1248
00:52:46,119 --> 00:52:50,480
subdivided again so there's parameters in here that say you

1249
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:51,039
got to sign the

1250
00:52:51,039 --> 00:52:55,000
dotted line that says no so I'm gonna use and I'm gonna use

1251
00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:55,719
current coding

1252
00:52:55,719 --> 00:52:59,360
words because that's just what no now so on an nr4 area and

1253
00:52:59,360 --> 00:53:00,400
a hundred acres

1254
00:53:00,400 --> 00:53:03,320
you're saying there could be 400 units on this hundred acre

1255
00:53:03,320 --> 00:53:04,559
area this cluster

1256
00:53:04,559 --> 00:53:07,909
subdivision we're gonna now we're gonna reduce it by let's

1257
00:53:07,909 --> 00:53:09,320
go down to 25 acres

1258
00:53:09,320 --> 00:53:13,400
instead of 100 acres so you still can have at most 400

1259
00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:14,760
units but that for you

1260
00:53:14,760 --> 00:53:18,719
it's could be in a 25 acre area and the other 75 acres in

1261
00:53:18,719 --> 00:53:20,559
perpetuity can never

1262
00:53:20,559 --> 00:53:23,590
have a dwelling unit on it as well as what this is this is

1263
00:53:23,590 --> 00:53:24,480
what this this

1264
00:53:24,480 --> 00:53:29,519
cluster division yeah I'm getting the concept now keep in

1265
00:53:29,519 --> 00:53:30,079
mind they still have

1266
00:53:30,079 --> 00:53:40,239
to meet all the other standards so yeah and to keep in mind

1267
00:53:40,239 --> 00:53:41,079
that they still have

1268
00:53:41,079 --> 00:53:44,539
to meet all the other standards so as if they can make it

1269
00:53:44,539 --> 00:53:46,320
work then yeah they can

1270
00:53:46,320 --> 00:53:53,630
do up to the 400 units feasibility is a whole different

1271
00:53:53,630 --> 00:53:54,800
standard just wanted to

1272
00:53:54,800 --> 00:53:56,880
know the actual concept of it but thank you yeah and it's

1273
00:53:56,880 --> 00:53:57,360
and it's also

1274
00:53:57,360 --> 00:53:59,449
important to note that it's a lot cheaper for developers

1275
00:53:59,449 --> 00:54:00,000
not to have to

1276
00:54:00,000 --> 00:54:02,190
build all the infrastructure over a hundred acre site I

1277
00:54:02,190 --> 00:54:02,840
mean if you can

1278
00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:05,659
consolidate all your costs and resources into one area

1279
00:54:05,659 --> 00:54:06,840
maybe the quality of the

1280
00:54:06,840 --> 00:54:10,170
product will be higher because they have funds to allocate

1281
00:54:10,170 --> 00:54:11,800
more to design and open

1282
00:54:11,800 --> 00:54:17,019
space for things like that it's not required but it's

1283
00:54:17,019 --> 00:54:18,679
possible that could

1284
00:54:18,679 --> 00:54:21,599
happen so for those that are interested I did a subdivision

1285
00:54:21,599 --> 00:54:22,320
like that here in

1286
00:54:22,320 --> 00:54:25,210
the city of Denton it's over on the corner of El Paseo and

1287
00:54:25,210 --> 00:54:26,079
Santa Monica it's

1288
00:54:26,079 --> 00:54:28,440
on the southeast corner a little shadow Brook Village and

1289
00:54:28,440 --> 00:54:29,400
that's probably as

1290
00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:33,639
close as I can think of to what we're talking about here

1291
00:54:33,639 --> 00:54:36,519
very small eight lots

1292
00:54:36,519 --> 00:54:41,519
of people walking the walk before it was even caught by

1293
00:54:41,519 --> 00:54:43,079
that's right great well

1294
00:54:43,079 --> 00:54:50,289
any other any other questions on subdivision okay so the

1295
00:54:50,289 --> 00:54:51,559
the last part of

1296
00:54:51,559 --> 00:54:54,019
our presentation is next steps and then we're going to talk

1297
00:54:54,019 --> 00:54:54,639
a little bit about

1298
00:54:54,639 --> 00:54:57,809
the zoning map process that's that's currently underway and

1299
00:54:57,809 --> 00:54:58,559
that's going to

1300
00:54:58,559 --> 00:55:03,780
get really going here in the next month or so so next steps

1301
00:55:03,780 --> 00:55:05,480
for as Tarek said

1302
00:55:05,480 --> 00:55:07,650
we're making a consolidated draft so we've drafted all

1303
00:55:07,650 --> 00:55:08,440
three parts of the

1304
00:55:08,440 --> 00:55:12,400
code and now it's time to knit them all together and have

1305
00:55:12,400 --> 00:55:14,199
one big document with

1306
00:55:14,199 --> 00:55:17,880
everything in it and that's what the consolidated draft is

1307
00:55:17,880 --> 00:55:19,880
so there's a date

1308
00:55:19,880 --> 00:55:22,730
here that says comments for the consolidated draft by April

1309
00:55:22,730 --> 00:55:24,000
26th the

1310
00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:26,949
consolidated draft is going to get delivered sometime in

1311
00:55:26,949 --> 00:55:28,559
May so if you have

1312
00:55:28,559 --> 00:55:31,820
comments that you want in the consolidated draft we need

1313
00:55:31,820 --> 00:55:32,480
those soon

1314
00:55:32,480 --> 00:55:35,039
there's still more opportunities to comment after the

1315
00:55:35,039 --> 00:55:36,360
consolidated draft but

1316
00:55:36,360 --> 00:55:40,079
that's that's the deadline for that document you can submit

1317
00:55:40,079 --> 00:55:40,880
comments on the

1318
00:55:40,880 --> 00:55:45,139
website you see the URL there you can email comments to

1319
00:55:45,139 --> 00:55:47,079
planning staff PZ at

1320
00:55:47,079 --> 00:55:50,300
City of Den you can call the staff there's a lot of ways

1321
00:55:50,300 --> 00:55:51,280
you can do that

1322
00:55:51,280 --> 00:55:55,630
now the zoning map process is is directly related to the D

1323
00:55:55,630 --> 00:55:56,619
DC update we

1324
00:55:56,619 --> 00:56:00,389
have this new lineup of districts they have to be mapped on

1325
00:56:00,389 --> 00:56:01,760
somewhere in the

1326
00:56:01,760 --> 00:56:05,320
city if they're not on the map they don't apply and all

1327
00:56:05,320 --> 00:56:06,400
these standards

1328
00:56:06,400 --> 00:56:10,039
we've written don't matter so the the mapping process is

1329
00:56:10,039 --> 00:56:10,800
currently underway

1330
00:56:10,800 --> 00:56:14,440
there's a web page you can see there a screenshot of that

1331
00:56:14,440 --> 00:56:15,039
that staff has

1332
00:56:15,039 --> 00:56:18,219
prepared on the right hand side there's a link that will

1333
00:56:18,219 --> 00:56:19,000
take you to an

1334
00:56:19,000 --> 00:56:22,699
interactive map where you can click on any property in the

1335
00:56:22,699 --> 00:56:24,039
city and it pulls up

1336
00:56:24,039 --> 00:56:27,599
a window to say this is your existing zoning there's a link

1337
00:56:27,599 --> 00:56:28,840
there to prove that

1338
00:56:28,840 --> 00:56:32,570
you can click on to say okay what are my standards now and

1339
00:56:32,570 --> 00:56:33,960
then there's a line

1340
00:56:33,960 --> 00:56:36,389
there for the draft zoning so this is what we want the

1341
00:56:36,389 --> 00:56:37,280
zoning or what we've

1342
00:56:37,280 --> 00:56:41,510
proposed the zoning to be changed to and then you can click

1343
00:56:41,510 --> 00:56:42,199
there and it will

1344
00:56:42,199 --> 00:56:44,800
direct you to the drafts that we've that we've created to

1345
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:45,639
correlate those

1346
00:56:45,639 --> 00:56:48,570
standards so this is a tool available to anybody in the

1347
00:56:48,570 --> 00:56:50,039
city we really encourage

1348
00:56:50,039 --> 00:56:53,519
you to use it it's really helpful staffs done a great job

1349
00:56:53,519 --> 00:56:54,360
of making this

1350
00:56:54,360 --> 00:56:59,820
interactive and user-friendly you can see here there's a

1351
00:56:59,820 --> 00:57:01,519
there's a comment a

1352
00:57:01,519 --> 00:57:04,739
section of the page if you just scroll down you can put

1353
00:57:04,739 --> 00:57:06,159
your name your address

1354
00:57:06,159 --> 00:57:09,050
and then here you see there's a zig existing zoning and

1355
00:57:09,050 --> 00:57:10,440
preferred zoning and

1356
00:57:10,440 --> 00:57:14,199
then you can say you agree you disagree and then there's a

1357
00:57:14,199 --> 00:57:15,920
comment box so this

1358
00:57:15,920 --> 00:57:19,010
is the opportunity for any resident in the city to say we

1359
00:57:19,010 --> 00:57:20,000
think you got it

1360
00:57:20,000 --> 00:57:24,000
wrong this is why we think you got it right this is why and

1361
00:57:24,000 --> 00:57:25,239
that the city is

1362
00:57:25,239 --> 00:57:28,409
going to start having a lot of feedback from the public

1363
00:57:28,409 --> 00:57:30,400
this is a list of public

1364
00:57:30,400 --> 00:57:34,650
open houses for just the zoning map process the first ones

1365
00:57:34,650 --> 00:57:35,360
on Monday and

1366
00:57:35,360 --> 00:57:40,349
then there's a series of them through May so attend these

1367
00:57:40,349 --> 00:57:43,280
give your input this is

1368
00:57:43,280 --> 00:57:46,670
a lot easier to to make your case for a zone change that

1369
00:57:46,670 --> 00:57:48,199
you've always wanted

1370
00:57:48,199 --> 00:57:50,860
without having to go through a big arduous process you just

1371
00:57:50,860 --> 00:57:51,440
talk to staff

1372
00:57:51,440 --> 00:57:56,000
submit a card and it may show up on the map so get involved

1373
00:57:56,000 --> 00:57:56,599
there's plenty of

1374
00:57:56,599 --> 00:58:02,059
opportunities to do that here in the city so with that are

1375
00:58:02,059 --> 00:58:03,320
there any other

1376
00:58:03,320 --> 00:58:07,440
questions or comments on anything that we've covered

1377
00:58:07,440 --> 00:58:08,880
Commissioner Sullivan

1378
00:58:08,880 --> 00:58:12,599
thank you chair I've got a couple questions regarding

1379
00:58:12,599 --> 00:58:16,079
traffic in six point

1380
00:58:16,079 --> 00:58:19,610
eight point nine talks about traffic calming devices it

1381
00:58:19,610 --> 00:58:20,760
talks about the fact

1382
00:58:20,760 --> 00:58:25,239
that they are put in at the same time as the street is

1383
00:58:25,239 --> 00:58:27,000
there no allowance for

1384
00:58:27,000 --> 00:58:30,699
those to be added at a later date and under certain you

1385
00:58:30,699 --> 00:58:32,280
know what conditions

1386
00:58:32,280 --> 00:58:40,530
could they be added yeah so do you have a page number for

1387
00:58:40,530 --> 00:58:43,800
that reference page 69

1388
00:58:46,079 --> 00:59:00,539
yeah so traffic sorry what was your question about it well

1389
00:59:00,539 --> 00:59:00,840
it gives a you

1390
00:59:00,840 --> 00:59:06,530
know a way to add those at the time the street yes is there

1391
00:59:06,530 --> 00:59:08,400
a way to put those

1392
00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:12,500
in after the fact in other words the street is longer more

1393
00:59:12,500 --> 00:59:14,280
you know kids or

1394
00:59:14,280 --> 00:59:18,090
screwball adults driving higher speeds and so we want to

1395
00:59:18,090 --> 00:59:20,159
slow them down yeah to

1396
00:59:20,159 --> 00:59:23,800
put you know the bumps in their bump outs and planners and

1397
00:59:23,800 --> 00:59:24,760
meetings I'm gonna

1398
00:59:24,760 --> 00:59:32,119
defer to Scott yeah so for the for everybody's benefit

1399
00:59:32,119 --> 00:59:33,119
traffic calming

1400
00:59:33,119 --> 00:59:36,400
devices things within the public right-of-way or the street

1401
00:59:36,400 --> 00:59:37,639
generally that

1402
00:59:37,639 --> 00:59:42,070
slow down traffic they can be as simple as bumping out the

1403
00:59:42,070 --> 00:59:42,800
curb at an

1404
00:59:42,800 --> 00:59:47,389
intersection things that visually to a driver make them

1405
00:59:47,389 --> 00:59:49,639
feel constrained on

1406
00:59:49,639 --> 00:59:52,949
street parking on both sides of the street is actually a

1407
00:59:52,949 --> 00:59:54,039
traffic calming

1408
00:59:54,039 --> 00:59:58,239
device because it seems constrained I'm not going to drive

1409
00:59:58,239 --> 00:59:59,480
as fast the question

1410
00:59:59,480 --> 01:00:02,320
before us you know obviously you want those things to

1411
01:00:02,320 --> 01:00:03,079
happen while you're

1412
01:00:03,079 --> 01:00:07,039
designing and putting in the infrastructure how do we retro

1413
01:00:07,039 --> 01:00:07,239
fit

1414
01:00:07,239 --> 01:00:10,840
existing development as development occurs it's challenging

1415
01:00:10,840 --> 01:00:11,719
especially on

1416
01:00:11,719 --> 01:00:15,050
infill you get one person in the middle of the block who's

1417
01:00:15,050 --> 01:00:15,460
doing a

1418
01:00:15,460 --> 01:00:18,719
redevelopment project are they required to calm that

1419
01:00:18,719 --> 01:00:20,039
particular street if it

1420
01:00:20,039 --> 01:00:24,679
doesn't exist probably not and so the question is what are

1421
01:00:24,679 --> 01:00:25,719
are there public

1422
01:00:25,719 --> 01:00:28,639
private partnerships are there business improvement

1423
01:00:28,639 --> 01:00:31,119
improvement districts that

1424
01:00:31,119 --> 01:00:33,480
want to pony up and address certain blocks are there

1425
01:00:33,480 --> 01:00:34,239
neighborhoods that

1426
01:00:34,239 --> 01:00:37,860
organize but I think there are engineering standards that

1427
01:00:37,860 --> 01:00:38,400
would allow

1428
01:00:38,400 --> 01:00:41,260
that to happen I'm just not sure how we would coordinate

1429
01:00:41,260 --> 01:00:42,440
that with the DDC that's

1430
01:00:42,440 --> 01:00:47,900
what why Scott's up here well and another piece of that is

1431
01:00:47,900 --> 01:00:48,800
it that's really in our

1432
01:00:48,800 --> 01:00:51,829
traffic criteria manuals and ultimately is gonna be the

1433
01:00:51,829 --> 01:00:53,519
traffic engineer and and

1434
01:00:53,519 --> 01:00:57,019
I think where this started and that's why I asked Tark to

1435
01:00:57,019 --> 01:00:58,199
explain traffic

1436
01:00:58,199 --> 01:01:03,739
calming devices when we think of speed bumps that is the

1437
01:01:03,739 --> 01:01:06,239
last resort or

1438
01:01:06,239 --> 01:01:11,699
ultimately is really not going to happen so excuse me our

1439
01:01:11,699 --> 01:01:14,199
trucks yeah yeah it's

1440
01:01:14,199 --> 01:01:16,920
it's just it's one of those issues so that's the first

1441
01:01:16,920 --> 01:01:18,239
thing that people think

1442
01:01:18,239 --> 01:01:21,800
of of traffic calming devices the intent of the code really

1443
01:01:21,800 --> 01:01:22,679
is talking about

1444
01:01:22,679 --> 01:01:25,860
bulb outs and where it is that you changed the design of

1445
01:01:25,860 --> 01:01:26,960
the street to calm

1446
01:01:26,960 --> 01:01:30,190
traffic and and so that's the intent of that rather than

1447
01:01:30,190 --> 01:01:31,199
trying to come back and

1448
01:01:31,199 --> 01:01:37,599
do that but there's so so it's mentioned in the area of new

1449
01:01:37,599 --> 01:01:39,559
development but not

1450
01:01:39,559 --> 01:01:43,679
in existing development correct is that the case that yes

1451
01:01:43,679 --> 01:01:45,119
and and ultimately

1452
01:01:45,119 --> 01:01:48,480
unless there's a street redesign then we're probably not

1453
01:01:48,480 --> 01:01:49,519
going to achieve

1454
01:01:49,519 --> 01:01:51,920
traffic calming devices and that can be done any number of

1455
01:01:51,920 --> 01:01:53,679
ways through signals

1456
01:01:53,679 --> 01:01:57,489
roundabouts etc even in existing where it is if we have

1457
01:01:57,489 --> 01:01:58,800
adequate right away or

1458
01:01:58,800 --> 01:02:02,639
to do some other things okay along the same lines on page

1459
01:02:02,639 --> 01:02:05,599
73 goes into vehicle

1460
01:02:05,599 --> 01:02:08,420
trips and less than a hundred daily trips and a hundred to

1461
01:02:08,420 --> 01:02:09,400
a thousand daily

1462
01:02:09,400 --> 01:02:14,179
vehicle trips and blah blah blah and my question is we've

1463
01:02:14,179 --> 01:02:15,800
again something that

1464
01:02:15,800 --> 01:02:20,960
we've had to deal with on a regular basis is that we have a

1465
01:02:20,960 --> 01:02:21,960
development going

1466
01:02:21,960 --> 01:02:25,760
in there is an you know a street that's designated whatever

1467
01:02:25,760 --> 01:02:28,159
and that means that

1468
01:02:28,159 --> 01:02:32,920
there can be X number of thousands of cars going on that

1469
01:02:32,920 --> 01:02:34,280
street so the

1470
01:02:34,280 --> 01:02:38,400
question is well how many vehicles do we have we don't know

1471
01:02:38,400 --> 01:02:39,760
how many vehicles

1472
01:02:39,760 --> 01:02:42,650
going to be coming on the new development into that street

1473
01:02:42,650 --> 01:02:43,119
we don't

1474
01:02:43,119 --> 01:02:48,090
know so what's the point of having these numbers here if

1475
01:02:48,090 --> 01:02:49,920
our traffic people don't

1476
01:02:49,920 --> 01:02:54,289
know on a regular basis how many cars go up and down Ryan

1477
01:02:54,289 --> 01:02:56,840
Road and how many cars

1478
01:02:56,840 --> 01:03:00,260
going to be added to that with the development off of Ryan

1479
01:03:00,260 --> 01:03:02,079
Road and so is

1480
01:03:02,079 --> 01:03:06,750
there any place in this new stuff that's going to give us

1481
01:03:06,750 --> 01:03:08,159
that information or

1482
01:03:08,159 --> 01:03:13,130
require that to be done before development is put in yes

1483
01:03:13,130 --> 01:03:15,360
and yes so the

1484
01:03:15,360 --> 01:03:19,320
next page which is six point eight point nine speaks to a T

1485
01:03:19,320 --> 01:03:20,679
IA or some

1486
01:03:20,679 --> 01:03:23,340
developments may be as simple as just an analysis a basic

1487
01:03:23,340 --> 01:03:24,400
analysis of what that

1488
01:03:24,400 --> 01:03:28,230
that development is going to generate in trips what we're

1489
01:03:28,230 --> 01:03:29,559
attempting to do on the

1490
01:03:29,559 --> 01:03:32,909
front side of the model is is have at least an evaluation

1491
01:03:32,909 --> 01:03:34,039
of what it is that

1492
01:03:34,039 --> 01:03:37,619
that that impact is going to be of the development and then

1493
01:03:37,619 --> 01:03:38,639
what we have for

1494
01:03:38,639 --> 01:03:43,360
infrastructure today or what it may cause to the future so

1495
01:03:43,360 --> 01:03:44,880
absolutely we have

1496
01:03:44,880 --> 01:03:49,369
that and we're requesting that of developers when it is

1497
01:03:49,369 --> 01:03:50,159
that we see that

1498
01:03:50,159 --> 01:03:54,130
impact so we try to do a pre-development meeting before we

1499
01:03:54,130 --> 01:03:55,280
get to this point to

1500
01:03:55,280 --> 01:03:59,480
say it looks as if it appears as if this is going to have

1501
01:03:59,480 --> 01:04:01,039
an impact these are the

1502
01:04:01,039 --> 01:04:04,400
documents that we'd like to see before and as we go through

1503
01:04:04,400 --> 01:04:05,960
the design phase of

1504
01:04:05,960 --> 01:04:09,130
this so that way we're not suggesting that they build this

1505
01:04:09,130 --> 01:04:09,940
first street when

1506
01:04:09,940 --> 01:04:13,280
they may need this first street well that's all really good

1507
01:04:13,280 --> 01:04:15,199
however at what

1508
01:04:15,199 --> 01:04:19,769
point is the city required to do something along the same

1509
01:04:19,769 --> 01:04:21,000
lines again if

1510
01:04:21,000 --> 01:04:25,320
a developments coming in off Orion Road and the city has

1511
01:04:25,320 --> 01:04:26,920
never done a traffic

1512
01:04:26,920 --> 01:04:30,750
survey to know how many cars go up and down Ryan Road how's

1513
01:04:30,750 --> 01:04:31,719
that going to

1514
01:04:31,719 --> 01:04:35,900
impact it or if you're going down up and down Hickory or

1515
01:04:35,900 --> 01:04:37,519
Bonnie Bray I mean

1516
01:04:37,519 --> 01:04:40,800
there's number of streets that are in terrible condition

1517
01:04:40,800 --> 01:04:42,280
and nobody knows how

1518
01:04:42,280 --> 01:04:45,460
many cars travel on them because nobody puts out the cord

1519
01:04:45,460 --> 01:04:47,239
or the whatever pick

1520
01:04:47,239 --> 01:04:50,500
out the cars to then say this is what needs to be done and

1521
01:04:50,500 --> 01:04:51,320
we can't add

1522
01:04:51,320 --> 01:04:55,139
development on this street until those things are done and

1523
01:04:55,139 --> 01:04:56,260
we're actually in

1524
01:04:56,260 --> 01:04:59,989
the process of doing that so our city engineer through

1525
01:04:59,989 --> 01:05:01,639
through this summer and

1526
01:05:01,639 --> 01:05:06,340
really in alignment with this we're looking at evaluating

1527
01:05:06,340 --> 01:05:07,000
all of those

1528
01:05:07,000 --> 01:05:09,639
traffic patterns because we know that that we have

1529
01:05:09,639 --> 01:05:11,239
development that that is

1530
01:05:11,239 --> 01:05:14,710
ultimately ending up in places that we may not have planned

1531
01:05:14,710 --> 01:05:16,119
to the past so are

1532
01:05:16,119 --> 01:05:18,940
we putting our capital dollars in the right direction so

1533
01:05:18,940 --> 01:05:19,960
then we can have that

1534
01:05:19,960 --> 01:05:22,880
that master plan as how it is that we look at where we're

1535
01:05:22,880 --> 01:05:24,000
gonna go what we're

1536
01:05:24,000 --> 01:05:28,090
going to do so we actually are doing that I think they've

1537
01:05:28,090 --> 01:05:29,039
done some preliminary

1538
01:05:29,039 --> 01:05:32,570
work already and they have intentions of either through an

1539
01:05:32,570 --> 01:05:34,440
RFP process having

1540
01:05:34,440 --> 01:05:37,340
that done as well as we're gonna collect this on individual

1541
01:05:37,340 --> 01:05:38,840
developments so to

1542
01:05:38,840 --> 01:05:42,010
the past we may not have done this comprehensively today we

1543
01:05:42,010 --> 01:05:42,880
are so we're

1544
01:05:42,880 --> 01:05:46,050
looking a little broader view of what's what's happening

1545
01:05:46,050 --> 01:05:47,159
where it's happening

1546
01:05:47,159 --> 01:05:50,449
and then how it's going to impact the city overall thank

1547
01:05:50,449 --> 01:05:53,199
you yes sir

1548
01:06:01,039 --> 01:06:06,250
anybody else I've got one I was just reading here in

1549
01:06:06,250 --> 01:06:10,159
between on page 135 on

1550
01:06:10,159 --> 01:06:15,869
C one private streets a this has been the policy in the

1551
01:06:15,869 --> 01:06:18,159
city of Denton for as

1552
01:06:18,159 --> 01:06:21,329
long as I can remember that all gated communities have to

1553
01:06:21,329 --> 01:06:22,400
be private streets

1554
01:06:22,400 --> 01:06:25,960
yeah those private streets have to be put in to city

1555
01:06:25,960 --> 01:06:27,159
standards and they have

1556
01:06:27,159 --> 01:06:30,739
to be inspected and they're done just like a city street so

1557
01:06:30,739 --> 01:06:33,199
the question is is

1558
01:06:33,199 --> 01:06:37,030
it not possibility to have some discussion about those

1559
01:06:37,030 --> 01:06:38,079
streets being

1560
01:06:38,079 --> 01:06:45,469
public rather than private because when I've done some of

1561
01:06:45,469 --> 01:06:46,400
this stuff before

1562
01:06:46,400 --> 01:06:50,960
private street subdivisions it's a big hindrance to people

1563
01:06:50,960 --> 01:06:53,719
the possible cost to

1564
01:06:53,719 --> 01:06:56,820
do those streets but there's a big demand for people that

1565
01:06:56,820 --> 01:06:58,000
would like to live in a

1566
01:06:58,000 --> 01:07:01,440
gated community utterly people single people they go to

1567
01:07:01,440 --> 01:07:02,360
apartments with the

1568
01:07:02,360 --> 01:07:05,440
big fences around them but they'd rather have a home but

1569
01:07:05,440 --> 01:07:06,599
they want the security

1570
01:07:06,599 --> 01:07:11,000
portion however people don't develop those very often

1571
01:07:11,000 --> 01:07:11,800
because streets all

1572
01:07:11,800 --> 01:07:16,320
have to be private and HOA with possibly big fees so the

1573
01:07:16,320 --> 01:07:19,159
confusion and question

1574
01:07:19,159 --> 01:07:21,239
I've always had it if you have to put it into city

1575
01:07:21,239 --> 01:07:23,079
standards why can't it be a

1576
01:07:23,079 --> 01:07:27,659
public street and it may be an egress issue and that might

1577
01:07:27,659 --> 01:07:28,599
be something legal

1578
01:07:28,599 --> 01:07:31,420
has to talk about but it's just something to throw on the

1579
01:07:31,420 --> 01:07:31,960
table for

1580
01:07:31,960 --> 01:07:36,300
discussion if there's some consideration for those to be

1581
01:07:36,300 --> 01:07:37,800
public streets in a

1582
01:07:37,800 --> 01:07:41,760
gated community to meet a need in our community that

1583
01:07:41,760 --> 01:07:43,559
typically is not addressed

1584
01:07:43,559 --> 01:07:46,409
because of those issues we had one here before us within

1585
01:07:46,409 --> 01:07:48,679
the last 30 60 days I

1586
01:07:48,679 --> 01:07:51,559
don't say it's the villas of piney something that's back in

1587
01:07:51,559 --> 01:07:52,079
there behind

1588
01:07:52,079 --> 01:07:55,800
it would bank it's not gated but it's private streets big

1589
01:07:55,800 --> 01:07:56,679
issue between them

1590
01:07:56,679 --> 01:08:00,500
and development to trying to go to the east of them so just

1591
01:08:00,500 --> 01:08:01,559
want to throw that

1592
01:08:01,559 --> 01:08:04,849
out is we're talking about that if that's something that's

1593
01:08:04,849 --> 01:08:05,760
can be further

1594
01:08:05,760 --> 01:08:10,400
discussed long question no it you Chairman you have well

1595
01:08:10,400 --> 01:08:11,960
articulated the

1596
01:08:11,960 --> 01:08:15,360
trade-offs between doing gated community development and

1597
01:08:15,360 --> 01:08:17,359
traditional community

1598
01:08:17,359 --> 01:08:21,060
development and there are trade-offs and that's a big one

1599
01:08:21,060 --> 01:08:22,479
for you but what is the

1600
01:08:22,479 --> 01:08:26,430
one thing that maintains a gated community status as being

1601
01:08:26,430 --> 01:08:26,960
a gated

1602
01:08:26,960 --> 01:08:30,640
community it's the ability to go in and out of it and when

1603
01:08:30,640 --> 01:08:31,840
that gate is removed

1604
01:08:31,840 --> 01:08:35,390
ultimately at some point and streets are ultimately

1605
01:08:35,390 --> 01:08:37,600
dedicated back to the city

1606
01:08:37,600 --> 01:08:41,060
it'd be nice if those streets were built to city standards

1607
01:08:41,060 --> 01:08:42,159
and that is they are

1608
01:08:42,159 --> 01:08:44,880
built to city yeah they are and they're continued to be

1609
01:08:44,880 --> 01:08:47,039
required to do that the

1610
01:08:47,039 --> 01:08:50,069
question is why why can't the city help foot the bill for

1611
01:08:50,069 --> 01:08:51,720
some of that right and

1612
01:08:51,720 --> 01:08:55,899
and and no potentially share some of the ownership and well

1613
01:08:55,899 --> 01:08:57,199
that I think the real

1614
01:08:57,199 --> 01:08:59,760
issue is probably a legal issue is if it's a public street

1615
01:08:59,760 --> 01:09:00,520
it has to be open

1616
01:09:00,520 --> 01:09:04,090
to the public versus just the people that have the code to

1617
01:09:04,090 --> 01:09:05,439
the access gate and

1618
01:09:05,439 --> 01:09:08,100
that may be the issue but I know the streets and all the

1619
01:09:08,100 --> 01:09:09,119
utilities are put

1620
01:09:09,119 --> 01:09:13,680
into city standards but it's it's a hindrance to market

1621
01:09:13,680 --> 01:09:14,680
those properties and

1622
01:09:14,680 --> 01:09:17,770
try to do those to people when you say it's a private

1623
01:09:17,770 --> 01:09:19,319
street and the question

1624
01:09:19,319 --> 01:09:22,289
is well when we have to redo the street in 20 years and it

1625
01:09:22,289 --> 01:09:23,079
costs a hundred

1626
01:09:23,079 --> 01:09:25,760
thousand dollars who has to pay for that and it's the

1627
01:09:25,760 --> 01:09:27,239
people that live in there

1628
01:09:27,239 --> 01:09:30,819
because it's a private street right so the question just to

1629
01:09:30,819 --> 01:09:31,680
throw out for

1630
01:09:31,680 --> 01:09:34,899
discussion is if there's a possibility that instead of them

1631
01:09:34,899 --> 01:09:35,960
always having to be

1632
01:09:35,960 --> 01:09:39,800
a private street if they can truly be a public street then

1633
01:09:39,800 --> 01:09:41,199
the HOA dues that are

1634
01:09:41,199 --> 01:09:45,159
in those can be much more reasonable and there are more

1635
01:09:45,159 --> 01:09:46,760
market option for people

1636
01:09:46,760 --> 01:09:50,460
to look at versus gosh am I gonna have ten thousand dollars

1637
01:09:50,460 --> 01:09:51,479
or five thousand

1638
01:09:51,479 --> 01:09:54,699
dollars 20 years from now when it comes time to redo the

1639
01:09:54,699 --> 01:09:55,239
streets

1640
01:09:55,239 --> 01:10:00,319
Victor was itching to respond to that question

1641
01:10:04,319 --> 01:10:07,600
but I think the reality is is if it's private it's private

1642
01:10:07,600 --> 01:10:08,560
I mean that's the

1643
01:10:08,560 --> 01:10:12,060
bottom line and and where that's at in the law I don't know

1644
01:10:12,060 --> 01:10:13,119
but we absolutely

1645
01:10:13,119 --> 01:10:16,520
have captured the comment and we can we can follow up

1646
01:10:16,520 --> 01:10:18,000
thanks for letting me make

1647
01:10:18,000 --> 01:10:22,359
the comment thank you for anything commissioner Sullivan

1648
01:10:22,359 --> 01:10:22,840
just to add to

1649
01:10:22,840 --> 01:10:25,380
your point I mean it's kind of like the street lights the

1650
01:10:25,380 --> 01:10:26,640
builder comes in

1651
01:10:26,640 --> 01:10:28,869
they've got a certain street light they could put in they

1652
01:10:28,869 --> 01:10:30,000
put the street out in

1653
01:10:30,000 --> 01:10:32,869
and then they deed it over to the city and that's the city

1654
01:10:32,869 --> 01:10:34,720
street light one I

1655
01:10:34,720 --> 01:10:38,109
do the same thing with a street I'm sure but I'm sure the

1656
01:10:38,109 --> 01:10:39,920
homeowners get a cut on

1657
01:10:39,920 --> 01:10:42,890
their tax rate because they have a private street don't

1658
01:10:42,890 --> 01:10:44,119
they you know they

1659
01:10:44,119 --> 01:10:52,539
do no they do not it's the same for everybody thanks for

1660
01:10:52,539 --> 01:10:53,039
let me ask the

1661
01:10:53,039 --> 01:10:56,500
question Commissioner Ellis thank you chair I'll just throw

1662
01:10:56,500 --> 01:10:58,760
out my two cents I

1663
01:10:58,760 --> 01:11:03,409
understand what you're saying but it's a private street so

1664
01:11:03,409 --> 01:11:04,640
if it's a private

1665
01:11:04,640 --> 01:11:09,119
street it's hard to use public funds and then it's only

1666
01:11:09,119 --> 01:11:10,840
allowed for these 75

1667
01:11:10,840 --> 01:11:15,359
homes that are in there so I I mean I I assume that's why

1668
01:11:15,359 --> 01:11:16,279
it's written as it's

1669
01:11:16,279 --> 01:11:20,239
written because it is a private street and so if you want

1670
01:11:20,239 --> 01:11:21,560
it private you want

1671
01:11:21,560 --> 01:11:25,520
it gated and you only want access to those 75 homes then I

1672
01:11:25,520 --> 01:11:27,399
think I mean it's

1673
01:11:27,399 --> 01:11:30,970
a tough argument to have as to why public funding would be

1674
01:11:30,970 --> 01:11:31,880
allowed to be

1675
01:11:31,880 --> 01:11:38,180
used for 75 homeowners and I'd love a response for that you

1676
01:11:38,180 --> 01:11:38,880
know it's coming

1677
01:11:38,880 --> 01:11:45,340
right well to Commissioner Stelvin's point you those people

1678
01:11:45,340 --> 01:11:46,300
pay exactly the

1679
01:11:46,300 --> 01:11:49,329
same rates on all their utility bills all their fees is

1680
01:11:49,329 --> 01:11:50,760
everybody else but

1681
01:11:50,760 --> 01:11:53,939
however they don't get the services back in their subdiv

1682
01:11:53,939 --> 01:11:55,359
ision so they pay twice

1683
01:11:55,359 --> 01:11:59,069
because it is private they have to pay not only the city

1684
01:11:59,069 --> 01:12:00,479
fees but if there is

1685
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:03,430
an issue in then they got to come out of pocket themselves

1686
01:12:03,430 --> 01:12:04,640
to pay for that so

1687
01:12:04,640 --> 01:12:11,149
really they subsidize the city's streets and not the public

1688
01:12:11,149 --> 01:12:11,600
not the private ones

1689
01:12:11,600 --> 01:12:14,840
so they're paying for things that they don't get

1690
01:12:14,840 --> 01:12:17,840
Commissioner Ellis okay so

1691
01:12:17,840 --> 01:12:21,020
maybe then that's another avenue of discussion of how do

1692
01:12:21,020 --> 01:12:22,680
how do we maybe

1693
01:12:22,680 --> 01:12:26,750
help that versus just because the other thing does define

1694
01:12:26,750 --> 01:12:27,960
doesn't make sense to

1695
01:12:27,960 --> 01:12:31,609
me which is why we have to define it there I'm just gonna

1696
01:12:31,609 --> 01:12:32,960
raise a cautionary

1697
01:12:32,960 --> 01:12:38,960
flag this may be getting off the germane

1698
01:12:38,960 --> 01:12:42,479
notice thank you yeah well thank you again for let me make

1699
01:12:42,479 --> 01:12:44,520
the comment and

1700
01:12:44,520 --> 01:12:48,159
post a question for consideration

1701
01:12:54,640 --> 01:13:03,800
any other questions for we any other questions on this

1702
01:13:03,800 --> 01:13:04,520
under we have

1703
01:13:04,520 --> 01:13:10,229
additional items are we wrapping up this was it okay I

1704
01:13:10,229 --> 01:13:12,520
wanted to say how excited

1705
01:13:12,520 --> 01:13:15,840
I was to see some some students in the room that was mad

1706
01:13:15,840 --> 01:13:17,239
sent zoning to that

1707
01:13:17,239 --> 01:13:20,869
that is very exciting and very unusual for our line of work

1708
01:13:20,869 --> 01:13:22,359
so I appreciate you

1709
01:13:22,359 --> 01:13:30,420
coming today I was going to ask since we've stopped why are

1710
01:13:30,420 --> 01:13:31,159
you all here are

1711
01:13:31,159 --> 01:13:35,239
you here for a school project or good

1712
01:13:43,359 --> 01:13:45,439
nonetheless we're glad you're here yes thank you all for

1713
01:13:45,439 --> 01:13:47,720
coming out it's good

1714
01:13:47,720 --> 01:13:50,159
to see young people come out and be a part of the process

1715
01:13:50,159 --> 01:13:51,000
so thanks for taking

1716
01:13:51,000 --> 01:13:56,560
time out of your day to come for whatever the reason is so

1717
01:13:56,560 --> 01:13:57,800
with that if

1718
01:13:57,800 --> 01:14:02,250
there aren't any other questions we'll close this at 520

1719
01:14:02,250 --> 01:14:05,479
record time today

1720
01:14:22,000 --> 01:14:24,039
you