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Welcome to the City of Denton Planning and Zoning

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Commission meeting for January 10th, 2018.

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This will be our work session.

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This meeting has been duly posted and we do have a quorum

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present and I will call us to

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order at 5-0-2.

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Our first order of business will be to receive

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clarification of agenda items and so that

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will move us in our work session down to our consent agenda

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.

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And if there are questions, Haley can come and answer those

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on the consent agenda.

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The Denton traffic to partners.

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Okay.

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Haley, you want to come up to the mic?

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Commissioner Beck.

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Thank you, Chair.

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Just a quick question.

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On the Google map thing, it looks like there's a gas well

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there now.

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So is that on lot 8?

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Yes, sir.

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That is on lot 8 and there is an access easement and a

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pipeline easement coming off of Jim

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Crystal there.

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Okay.

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Is that remaining?

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They're not removing that?

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It is to remain.

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There's an approved gas well site plan for that site and as

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far as I know it will remain

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there.

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Okay.

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Thank you.

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Any other questions for Haley on this item?

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No?

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Okay.

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That will then take us to our items for individual

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consideration and I'll call on Haley for a

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presentation on P17-10 Creekside on Ryan Road.

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Yes.

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So some of you may be familiar with Creekside.

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It's a large parcel of unannexed property.

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It was under a non-annexation agreement for several years

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and when the last of those was

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about to expire in 2016, they entered into a pre-annexation

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development agreement with

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the city.

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So it subdivided the entire parcel into three tracts of

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land.

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This is just one of those tracts.

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It's tract 1C in the agreement and it is for a single

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family subdivision that will have

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137 residential lots and three common area lots.

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You can see the plat has multiple pages here but it would

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be your standard single family

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at roughly an NR3 density is what we would be looking at

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here.

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And we did put this on individual consideration because

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there is a section in the agreement

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that requires the gas well on site to be plugged before the

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final plat is approved so we just

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wanted to be abundantly clear about that that they will not

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get a final plat approved for

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this until such time as the gas well is plugged.

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Commissioner Beck.

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And on that note, so those, I guess those are storage tanks

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that are there now too?

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They have all been removed at this point.

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The operator is in the process.

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Oh, the tanks are already gone?

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Yes.

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Yeah, they're in the process of closing the site.

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I just wanted that for clarification.

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Thank you.

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Commissioner Sullivan.

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Sorry.

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Sir, my understanding is the last traffic survey was done

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in 2014.

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Is that right for this, for Ryan Road?

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I know there was one done in 2014 for a subdivision further

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to the west from this property.

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I'm not sure if there's been anything done in time since

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then though.

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Okay.

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Also, how does the impact fee or whatever it's called now,

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how is it assessed since

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on the street side of this subdivision is not nearly as big

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as the whole subdivision?

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How is it determined who's going to take care of the street

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and when is that determined?

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My understanding is all of that was laid out in the pre-

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annexation development agreement.

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There were agreed upon amounts for roadway impact fees and

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all of the impact fees that

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would be associated with the development at that time

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knowing the full scope of all three

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tracks that were intended to be developed.

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So all of that has been kind of predetermined at this point

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.

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Okay.

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When is that going to happen though?

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I mean, is there a deadline by which I think it's $589,000

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is going to be spent to widen

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or to do something with Ryan Road is not specified exactly

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what's going to happen.

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And so I'm just curious when is that street improvement

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supposed to happen?

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I'm not sure when the improvements will happen.

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I know the impact fees will be assessed and paid at the

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time of permitting for the individual

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building permits.

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So it will be split over all of these individual lots as

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they're developed in terms of when

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it's paid.

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Because I know Ryan Meadows on the other end, on the west

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end, there hasn't been anything

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done to the street that they front on Ryan Road.

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Yeah.

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And they've been there for a year or more.

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Yeah, I'm not aware of any immediate plans for improvements

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on Ryan Road, but the impact

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fees will be paid with each permit.

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Okay.

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Haley, you may want to give a clarification to Commissioner

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Sullivan that it's at the

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city's option, whether the perimeter street paving is done

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or whether they collect the

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fees.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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In this case, the agreement outlined how much would be paid

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for each phase of this development

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for impact fees for road, water and sewer.

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So Commissioner Smith, thank you, Chair.

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Clarification on the bottom of the plat there.

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It says street D just ends and they're in the map.

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Is that connecting to the neighborhood that's south of that

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track?

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What exactly is happening there?

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Yeah.

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Let's see which.

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I can't quite tell.

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It goes further south, Creek View, whatever.

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Creek Day.

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Oh, does it?

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I'm sorry.

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Yeah, it does tie into the existing subdivision.

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I don't see the exact street that you were referencing, but

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it ties into the existing

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subdivision.

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So basically, my question is I just-

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Street E.

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I was reading it.

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I wasn't paying attention.

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I looked at that.

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I didn't flip the next page.

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Does this plat eventually connect the neighborhood from

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Ryan all the way down to Hickory Creek?

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Or is there through the neighborhood?

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Or is the only way for people to get to Hickory Creek going

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to be go back out to Teasley or

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go back out to 1830?

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It would be connected through the neighborhoods.

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Yeah.

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That was a question I had from a resident.

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Another thing that was brought up.

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Commissioner Sullivan talked about the traffic impact

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analysis.

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Can we get any information on that?

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There was one done in 2014 for this.

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Can we get a refresher on that during the actual meeting at

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630?

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I could look into that.

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To my knowledge, there hasn't been one done for this subdiv

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ision.

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The one I think from 2014 was for another subdivision along

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Ryan Road.

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What say does the city have in requiring the developer to

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put in acceleration and deceleration

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lanes coming into the neighborhood itself off of Ryan Road?

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At this point in time, is there anything we could do?

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Honestly, I'm not certain on that.

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Since they did enter into the agreement that specified how

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much they would contribute towards

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the roadways, I don't know that there would be any room for

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that, but we could look into

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it.

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I'm just bringing up concerns that was brought to me by a

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couple of different citizens in

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the neighborhood that abuts it.

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The last thing was, within the preliminary plotting process

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that we're in, what landscaping

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requirements are there currently?

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Is it zoned NR2?

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At this point, it's technically still in the city's ETJ.

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Their agreement requires that once their final plan is

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approved, they apply for annexation

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into the city.

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Then at that point, it stipulates that they would apply for

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an NR3 zoning designation for

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the property.

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In terms of landscaping, the agreement outlined a very

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specific landscaping plan for the entire

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subdivision as well as the other tracts.

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The primary feature in this portion would be ... Let me get

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to the right page.

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All of the trees that exist along the west side of the

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property, most of them are to

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remain in place.

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The same thing on the south side.

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Okay.

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Those are the biggest questions I had there.

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One other thing we brought up, what are the other ... You

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said this is tract 1C.

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What are the other tracts within this?

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Is it going to be one?

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It's kind of hard to see here.

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The one immediately adjoining it where all of the flood

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plain is, is 1B.

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The agreement specified that that would have up to three

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single family homes.

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The majority of the ESA and the floodplain is all to remain

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intact.

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Then the other portion is further east from there.

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That would be a second phase of the Good Samaritan Center.

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Okay.

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That works.

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Thank you.

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Any other questions for Haley on this item?

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No?

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Okay.

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Thank you, Haley.

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As far as our public hearings this evening, we'll need to

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get a ... We'll open item A

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and the chair would like to get a motion from one of the

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other commissioners to continue

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this to the 21st and we'll leave it open.

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Then the other two items, we're not going to take any

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action on those since they have

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been withdrawn.

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That will take us through the items that are on our agenda.

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I think Richard has got some other items that are off

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agenda that he wanted to go over with

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us here at work session.

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Just wanted to sort of update everybody what's kind of

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going to go on the next meeting.

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That's going to be a pretty hefty agenda, particularly for

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the work session.

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We'll have three items specific for work session.

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Two of those I handed out tonight.

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These are the new or draft design criteria manual for

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transportation and drainage.

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I wanted to get those well in advance rather than just

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sending them that Friday before

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so everybody had a chance to take a look at it.

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They are online as well.

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We can provide that in an email.

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They're on the city's website if you wanted to look at them

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electronically.

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In the transportation manual you'll see quite a bit of

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changes from the existing, specifically

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with it outlines TIA changes to pavement standards right

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away with.

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I'll save all of the details for engineering, Todd Estes,

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director of capital improvements

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will be here as well as pre-TAM to go over both of these.

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Commissioner Beck.

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Thank you, chair.

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Will this affect the mobility plan in any way?

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Are we changing streets, directions or anything like that?

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It'll actually widen some of the residential streets.

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But not necessarily change the mobility plan.

274
00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:00,480
One thing you'll see in here, they're going -- they're

275
00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:02,480
starting to go with context sensitive

276
00:11:02,480 --> 00:11:06,000
corridors so that will ultimately play into that.

277
00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:09,960
So there's sort of some give and take.

278
00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:13,470
So if it's on a context sensitive corridor, there are some

279
00:11:13,470 --> 00:11:15,580
things that you can do to possibly

280
00:11:15,580 --> 00:11:18,480
reduce parking if you put a bike lane.

281
00:11:18,480 --> 00:11:23,029
So there's a number of different options sort of outlined

282
00:11:23,029 --> 00:11:24,399
in the manual.

283
00:11:24,399 --> 00:11:27,860
Also as the only member here that's part of that sub

284
00:11:27,860 --> 00:11:31,360
committee dealing with the DDC change,

285
00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:34,240
are we going to be holding any more meetings?

286
00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:35,240
Yes.

287
00:11:35,240 --> 00:11:37,240
Before they actually implement it?

288
00:11:37,240 --> 00:11:41,870
Because isn't a new rewrite supposed to be set up for the

289
00:11:41,870 --> 00:11:43,639
summer sometime?

290
00:11:43,639 --> 00:11:46,159
Even probably sooner than that.

291
00:11:46,159 --> 00:11:50,860
We're looking at getting sort of a first initial draft,

292
00:11:50,860 --> 00:11:53,679
possibly next month of some of the

293
00:11:53,679 --> 00:11:54,679
chapters.

294
00:11:54,679 --> 00:11:58,279
And so at that point in time, that subcommittee will then

295
00:11:58,279 --> 00:12:00,879
reconvene and start to go over those.

296
00:12:00,879 --> 00:12:04,899
And so what we suspect is probably March, April sort of

297
00:12:04,899 --> 00:12:07,200
alternating work session and

298
00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:11,039
then the following meeting, you probably plan on every work

299
00:12:11,039 --> 00:12:12,919
session having a subchapter

300
00:12:12,919 --> 00:12:16,500
or at least a section to review to get through that.

301
00:12:16,500 --> 00:12:20,259
So I just wanted to kind of preface that as we move forward

302
00:12:20,259 --> 00:12:20,879
that.

303
00:12:20,879 --> 00:12:23,840
Not to carry it on just real quickly.

304
00:12:23,840 --> 00:12:28,090
Are they scheduled to have at least one more public hearing

305
00:12:28,090 --> 00:12:30,240
on that before it goes to city

306
00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:31,240
council?

307
00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:34,639
There'll be a cut on the criteria or the code.

308
00:12:34,639 --> 00:12:36,600
The code itself.

309
00:12:36,600 --> 00:12:37,600
We'll have a number of public hearings.

310
00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:38,600
Okay.

311
00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:39,600
Okay.

312
00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:41,960
Thanks, Richard.

313
00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:44,940
The only other item that we'll get it to you prior to -- I

314
00:12:44,940 --> 00:12:46,639
'll try to get that to you next

315
00:12:46,639 --> 00:12:50,360
week again so you have it before the meeting.

316
00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:53,419
Deborah Vieras will be here to present changes to subch

317
00:12:53,419 --> 00:12:56,440
apter 17 which deals with our environmentally

318
00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:57,820
sensitive areas.

319
00:12:57,820 --> 00:13:01,350
So there's some changes that she'd work through with her

320
00:13:01,350 --> 00:13:02,019
group.

321
00:13:02,019 --> 00:13:05,360
So we wanted to bring that to a work session as well.

322
00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:08,159
And then we have just to give you an idea, we have three

323
00:13:08,159 --> 00:13:09,799
rezoning, a rezoning and an

324
00:13:09,799 --> 00:13:12,039
SUP and then two preliminary plaques.

325
00:13:12,039 --> 00:13:17,740
So it's going to be, like I said, it'll be a bountiful

326
00:13:17,740 --> 00:13:19,039
agenda.

327
00:13:19,039 --> 00:13:22,240
What's the expected date for the adoption of the

328
00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:24,759
transportation criteria manual and

329
00:13:24,759 --> 00:13:27,600
the storm water and when those would go into effect?

330
00:13:27,600 --> 00:13:30,549
I think they're -- I know they're pushing to get them done

331
00:13:30,549 --> 00:13:31,799
sooner than later.

332
00:13:31,799 --> 00:13:35,960
They've opened up a sort of a 30-day window.

333
00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:40,129
And so what we talked about was rather than sort of have

334
00:13:40,129 --> 00:13:42,840
the meet, you know, sort of let's

335
00:13:42,840 --> 00:13:45,039
just do it -- let's open the window and then we can have

336
00:13:45,039 --> 00:13:46,440
that public hearing in between

337
00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:49,990
and that way if somebody from the public -- I guess if they

338
00:13:49,990 --> 00:13:51,879
want to come, they could.

339
00:13:51,879 --> 00:13:53,860
So whether or not we want to open something up at the

340
00:13:53,860 --> 00:13:55,399
regular meeting, I mean, I guess

341
00:13:55,399 --> 00:13:56,840
that's an option that we can do.

342
00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:00,340
I don't know if -- again, it's sort of up to -- I'll leave

343
00:14:00,340 --> 00:14:02,000
that up to you guys how you

344
00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:04,870
want to handle that or just leave it as a work session item

345
00:14:04,870 --> 00:14:05,120
.

346
00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:06,120
Okay.

347
00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:07,120
Commissioner Smith.

348
00:14:07,120 --> 00:14:13,980
Off topic of these, just for the public hearings, you

349
00:14:13,980 --> 00:14:18,639
probably mentioned the spine here.

350
00:14:18,639 --> 00:14:21,690
Do we need to make a motion to continue public hearing A

351
00:14:21,690 --> 00:14:23,480
and then B and C since they're for

352
00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:25,120
items from withdrawal and we just --

353
00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:26,120
No action.

354
00:14:26,120 --> 00:14:27,120
No action.

355
00:14:27,120 --> 00:14:28,120
Okay.

356
00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:29,120
Just wanted to make sure.

357
00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:30,120
Yep.

358
00:14:30,120 --> 00:14:31,120
Okay.

359
00:14:31,120 --> 00:14:32,120
Is that it?

360
00:14:32,120 --> 00:14:33,120
All right.

361
00:14:33,120 --> 00:14:39,799
Well, with that, I will call a conclusion to our work

362
00:14:39,799 --> 00:14:44,480
session at 517 and we will reconvene

363
00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:47,799
in council chambers at 630.

364
00:14:47,799 --> 00:14:48,799
Thank you.

365
00:14:48,799 --> 00:14:54,960
Good evening and welcome to the City of Denton Planning and

366
00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:58,320
Zoning Commission meeting for

367
00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:01,279
January 10th, 2018.

368
00:15:01,279 --> 00:15:03,870
This meeting's been duly posted and we do have a quorum

369
00:15:03,870 --> 00:15:05,279
present and I will call us to

370
00:15:05,279 --> 00:15:07,840
order at 630.

371
00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:09,919
Our first order of business will be to stand and give the

372
00:15:09,919 --> 00:15:11,360
pledge to the U.S. and the Texas

373
00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:12,360
flag.

374
00:15:12,360 --> 00:15:19,269
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of

375
00:15:19,269 --> 00:15:23,360
America and to the republic for

376
00:15:23,360 --> 00:15:30,220
which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with

377
00:15:30,220 --> 00:15:33,039
liberty and justice for all.

378
00:15:33,039 --> 00:15:34,039
Honor the Texas flag.

379
00:15:34,039 --> 00:15:44,700
I pledge allegiance to thee, Texas, one state, under God,

380
00:15:44,700 --> 00:15:48,879
one and indivisible.

381
00:15:48,879 --> 00:15:50,710
Before we get started this evening on the rest of our

382
00:15:50,710 --> 00:15:52,240
agenda, I want to make an announcement

383
00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:54,399
for some of you who may be here.

384
00:15:54,399 --> 00:15:59,740
We have two items that are on our public hearing items, 4B

385
00:15:59,740 --> 00:16:03,600
and 4C, that are the Woodlands Project

386
00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:06,519
on McKinney Street.

387
00:16:06,519 --> 00:16:09,080
That item has been withdrawn from our meeting this evening.

388
00:16:09,080 --> 00:16:12,460
So if you're here for that item or either of those two

389
00:16:12,460 --> 00:16:14,519
items, that will not be heard

390
00:16:14,519 --> 00:16:17,440
tonight and we do not have a date certain on that, so I'll

391
00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:18,960
announce that before we get

392
00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:22,360
started on the rest of our meeting.

393
00:16:22,360 --> 00:16:27,750
With that announcement, we will now move on to our consent

394
00:16:27,750 --> 00:16:28,759
agenda.

395
00:16:28,759 --> 00:16:32,480
Chair would entertain a motion on the consent agenda.

396
00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:33,480
Commissioner Smith?

397
00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:35,840
Motion to approve.

398
00:16:35,840 --> 00:16:36,840
Commissioner Beck?

399
00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:37,840
Second.

400
00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:38,840
Okay.

401
00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:39,960
We have a first and a second for approval.

402
00:16:39,960 --> 00:16:42,220
Any discussion?

403
00:16:42,220 --> 00:16:43,220
Commissioner Sullivan?

404
00:16:43,220 --> 00:16:44,960
Not just a...

405
00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:45,960
Okay.

406
00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:56,370
We have a motion and a second for approval and we will call

407
00:16:56,370 --> 00:17:01,120
for a vote on the board.

408
00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:04,079
Motion is going to carry 5 to 0.

409
00:17:04,079 --> 00:17:08,740
That will take us to our items for individual consideration

410
00:17:08,740 --> 00:17:10,880
and I will call on Haley for

411
00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:23,599
presentation of item P17-0010.

412
00:17:23,599 --> 00:17:24,599
Good evening.

413
00:17:24,599 --> 00:17:26,779
This item is a preliminary plat for the Creekside Subdiv

414
00:17:26,779 --> 00:17:28,400
ision located on the south side of Ryan

415
00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:29,599
Road.

416
00:17:29,599 --> 00:17:33,940
It's 137 residential lots and three common area lots.

417
00:17:33,940 --> 00:17:36,109
These are being developed in accordance with the terms of a

418
00:17:36,109 --> 00:17:37,279
pre-annexation development

419
00:17:37,279 --> 00:17:41,720
agreement that was passed in 2016 by the City Council.

420
00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:45,559
This is one of three phases for the entire Creekside

421
00:17:45,559 --> 00:17:46,839
development.

422
00:17:46,839 --> 00:17:49,299
Staff is recommending approval of this plan with the

423
00:17:49,299 --> 00:17:51,119
condition that the existing gas well

424
00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:54,210
on site be plugged in accordance with the terms of the pre-

425
00:17:54,210 --> 00:17:56,240
annexation development agreement

426
00:17:56,240 --> 00:17:58,450
and that a final plan not be considered by the Planning and

427
00:17:58,450 --> 00:17:59,680
Zoning Commission until such

428
00:17:59,680 --> 00:18:02,559
time as the well is plugged.

429
00:18:02,559 --> 00:18:03,559
Okay.

430
00:18:03,559 --> 00:18:07,519
I can stand for any questions.

431
00:18:07,519 --> 00:18:09,519
Questions?

432
00:18:09,519 --> 00:18:11,519
Okay.

433
00:18:11,519 --> 00:18:13,200
Great.

434
00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:15,279
Thank you, Haley.

435
00:18:15,279 --> 00:18:17,279
This is an item of individual consideration.

436
00:18:17,279 --> 00:18:20,990
I have a number of cards here to speak on this item and I

437
00:18:20,990 --> 00:18:23,480
will start with the applicant,

438
00:18:23,480 --> 00:18:26,480
Thomas Fletcher.

439
00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:31,559
If you'll give your name and address.

440
00:18:31,559 --> 00:18:33,799
Good evening, Commissioners.

441
00:18:33,799 --> 00:18:38,180
Thomas Fletcher with Kimley-Horn, 5750 Genesis Court, Fr

442
00:18:38,180 --> 00:18:40,559
isco, Texas, 75034.

443
00:18:40,559 --> 00:18:44,440
Appreciate y'all's consideration to this item tonight.

444
00:18:44,440 --> 00:18:48,740
I realize there's a lot of citizens of Thistle Hill and

445
00:18:48,740 --> 00:18:52,079
maybe some of the surrounding neighborhoods

446
00:18:52,079 --> 00:18:54,880
that are in attendance tonight that have some questions and

447
00:18:54,880 --> 00:18:55,559
concerns.

448
00:18:55,559 --> 00:18:58,369
What I'd like to do is kind of give an overview of the

449
00:18:58,369 --> 00:19:00,519
project and hopefully maybe that will

450
00:19:00,519 --> 00:19:06,240
shed some light or maybe answer some of the questions that

451
00:19:06,240 --> 00:19:07,359
are had.

452
00:19:07,359 --> 00:19:11,279
If we can show the preliminary plat.

453
00:19:11,279 --> 00:19:14,180
The preliminary plat, the portion that you're seeing on the

454
00:19:14,180 --> 00:19:15,880
screen here, this is the northern

455
00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:17,559
portion of the track.

456
00:19:17,559 --> 00:19:20,940
When we went through the PAD process, the PADA process with

457
00:19:20,940 --> 00:19:22,640
the city, one of the things

458
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:26,319
we looked at is we wanted to do a development that really

459
00:19:26,319 --> 00:19:28,440
took advantage of the existing

460
00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:30,200
natural features of the track.

461
00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:32,880
There's a lot of beautiful mature trees.

462
00:19:32,880 --> 00:19:36,259
When we did the layout and the design and we were working

463
00:19:36,259 --> 00:19:38,119
with staff, we tried to keep

464
00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:41,200
the residential lots kind of towards the center portion of

465
00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:43,000
the track and create and keep the

466
00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:45,599
buffers that are on the perimeter.

467
00:19:45,599 --> 00:19:49,839
As you notice, there is a residential street running north

468
00:19:49,839 --> 00:19:50,579
south.

469
00:19:50,579 --> 00:19:53,839
We do not have lots that are backing to Thistle Hill.

470
00:19:53,839 --> 00:19:58,359
We have a landscape buffer there of the existing trees.

471
00:19:58,359 --> 00:20:02,400
It's approximately 120 feet wide on the north portion.

472
00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:06,549
As you go further south, I think it trims down to about 80

473
00:20:06,549 --> 00:20:07,200
feet.

474
00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:10,960
Another thing when we were looking at this and we were

475
00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:13,200
doing the layout, early on we

476
00:20:13,200 --> 00:20:15,240
had looked at the Thistle Hill development.

477
00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:19,630
When Thistle Hill was developed, Thistle Ridge actually had

478
00:20:19,630 --> 00:20:21,720
a right of way stub out to this

479
00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:22,720
track.

480
00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:26,109
When the development occurred, they did not build the road

481
00:20:26,109 --> 00:20:27,920
way stub in the plans that said

482
00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:31,799
future right of way for future extension to connect to the

483
00:20:31,799 --> 00:20:33,640
existing development.

484
00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:36,839
As we worked with staff and we talked about the development

485
00:20:36,839 --> 00:20:38,359
and concerns that Thistle

486
00:20:38,359 --> 00:20:41,819
Hill might have with this connection to their development

487
00:20:41,819 --> 00:20:43,880
and bringing additional traffic

488
00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:46,970
into their development, we looked at how do we meet the

489
00:20:46,970 --> 00:20:48,920
fire department or the fire code

490
00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:52,609
requirement of two access points in the distance between

491
00:20:52,609 --> 00:20:54,200
those access points.

492
00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:58,670
This particular track has an 80 foot wide piece that runs

493
00:20:58,670 --> 00:21:00,839
south to Creekdale Drive.

494
00:21:00,839 --> 00:21:03,720
For our two points of access, we have access to Creekdale

495
00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:05,279
and then we have access to Ryan

496
00:21:05,279 --> 00:21:06,400
Road.

497
00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:10,529
You will have some traffic split that will go between the

498
00:21:10,529 --> 00:21:11,160
two.

499
00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:14,569
Not all the traffic is going to be let out from the subdiv

500
00:21:14,569 --> 00:21:16,160
ision onto Ryan Road.

501
00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:19,400
Also as part of the agreement, because of the impact,

502
00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:21,240
because of what we were asking

503
00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:25,599
of the city, we looked at Ryan Road.

504
00:21:25,599 --> 00:21:29,869
We talked about improvements to Ryan Road or our portion of

505
00:21:29,869 --> 00:21:31,839
contribution to the improvements

506
00:21:31,839 --> 00:21:34,980
or future improvements of Ryan Road.

507
00:21:34,980 --> 00:21:38,660
Because there are concerns within the city about piece mill

508
00:21:38,660 --> 00:21:40,279
ing the roadway and doing

509
00:21:40,279 --> 00:21:44,450
these little scab on pieces adjacent to development, the

510
00:21:44,450 --> 00:21:47,079
decision was made with the city or by

511
00:21:47,079 --> 00:21:51,400
the city that the escrow of funds to assist with the future

512
00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:53,480
construction of Ryan Road

513
00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:56,480
was in the best interest of the city.

514
00:21:56,480 --> 00:22:02,420
The PADA stipulates that $589,000 will be donated by this

515
00:22:02,420 --> 00:22:04,799
development for perimeter

516
00:22:04,799 --> 00:22:07,240
roadway improvements to Ryan Road.

517
00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:11,599
That comes out to $4,300 per lot, which is more than twice

518
00:22:11,599 --> 00:22:13,480
what the roadway impact fee

519
00:22:13,480 --> 00:22:17,480
per lot is within the city's current ordinance.

520
00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:22,779
Along the south where we abut to Ryan Ranch, we've got a 70

521
00:22:22,779 --> 00:22:25,279
foot buffer along there.

522
00:22:25,279 --> 00:22:28,519
If you see this, this is the south portion of the track.

523
00:22:28,519 --> 00:22:31,299
I know it's not, it's a little bit hard to see on the

524
00:22:31,299 --> 00:22:33,720
screen, but you've got the north-south

525
00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:37,799
road that curves over and goes through the piece.

526
00:22:37,799 --> 00:22:41,680
I'd call it a flag lot, but there's 80 foot wide there.

527
00:22:41,680 --> 00:22:45,359
That's going to have a residential street, which will be 27

528
00:22:45,359 --> 00:22:46,640
feet back to back.

529
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:50,700
There will be a sidewalk connecting the development down to

530
00:22:50,700 --> 00:22:52,160
Creekdale Drive.

531
00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:57,220
There's a 70 foot buffer between the proposed development

532
00:22:57,220 --> 00:22:58,720
and Ryan Ranch.

533
00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:03,019
The majority of the mature trees within all of these open

534
00:23:03,019 --> 00:23:05,400
spaces are to be preserved.

535
00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:08,519
We've got trails throughout the development.

536
00:23:08,519 --> 00:23:12,440
We're taking advantage of the nice open spaces and putting

537
00:23:12,440 --> 00:23:14,519
in a meandering trail through

538
00:23:14,519 --> 00:23:16,640
the trees.

539
00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:20,279
To the east of the project, adjacent to the floodplain in

540
00:23:20,279 --> 00:23:22,480
the actual creek, we're putting

541
00:23:22,480 --> 00:23:25,970
in an amenity center with a children's playground and a

542
00:23:25,970 --> 00:23:27,160
swimming pool.

543
00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:30,839
In the development, like as Haley had mentioned, the

544
00:23:30,839 --> 00:23:33,599
development is contingent upon the well

545
00:23:33,599 --> 00:23:34,599
being cap.

546
00:23:34,599 --> 00:23:37,160
There's an existing gas well on the site.

547
00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:40,359
As part of this development, that gas well is to be capped.

548
00:23:40,359 --> 00:23:42,519
That process has already begun.

549
00:23:42,519 --> 00:23:45,079
All the surface equipment has been removed.

550
00:23:45,079 --> 00:23:47,079
The surface has been cleaned up.

551
00:23:47,079 --> 00:23:49,759
Now we're waiting for the plugging company.

552
00:23:49,759 --> 00:23:52,369
They're very busy at this time of the year, but we're on

553
00:23:52,369 --> 00:23:53,759
their schedule and we're waiting

554
00:23:53,759 --> 00:23:57,359
for the plugging company to come up and cap the well.

555
00:23:57,359 --> 00:24:00,119
That should occur within the next few weeks.

556
00:24:00,119 --> 00:24:03,039
Anyway, that's kind of an overview.

557
00:24:03,039 --> 00:24:07,400
I tried to hit on transportation, the open space, the gas

558
00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:08,079
well.

559
00:24:08,079 --> 00:24:10,970
I'll be happy to answer any questions and I'd be glad to

560
00:24:10,970 --> 00:24:12,839
come up afterwards if there's

561
00:24:12,839 --> 00:24:16,059
questions that are generated from the residents that I

562
00:24:16,059 --> 00:24:17,880
could potentially answer.

563
00:24:17,880 --> 00:24:19,960
Do you have a question?

564
00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:20,960
Commissioner Smith.

565
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:21,960
Thank you, Commissioner.

566
00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:22,960
Thank you, Chair.

567
00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:26,640
Can you give me a rough estimate of property values for the

568
00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:29,720
development that's going in?

569
00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:31,599
Let me defer to the developer.

570
00:24:31,599 --> 00:24:32,599
Sure.

571
00:24:32,599 --> 00:24:33,599
Let him come up and introduce himself.

572
00:24:33,599 --> 00:24:34,599
Stay up here.

573
00:24:34,599 --> 00:24:35,599
I got another question for you.

574
00:24:35,599 --> 00:24:36,599
Okay.

575
00:24:36,599 --> 00:24:37,599
Go ahead.

576
00:24:37,599 --> 00:24:40,599
Yeah, it's one of the property values.

577
00:24:40,599 --> 00:24:43,049
Mr. Chairman, members of the Planning and Zoning Commission

578
00:24:43,049 --> 00:24:44,599
, I'm John Dickerson, 8333

579
00:24:44,599 --> 00:24:47,200
Douglas, Suite 1300, Dallas, Texas.

580
00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:50,859
I'm the president of Dickerson Development and we are very

581
00:24:50,859 --> 00:24:52,960
excited to be your applicant.

582
00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:54,480
I actually own the property.

583
00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:57,359
We've closed on the property in November, so we're the

584
00:24:57,359 --> 00:24:59,400
owners of this 47-acre tract.

585
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:03,990
We're very, very excited to be bringing this community into

586
00:25:03,990 --> 00:25:05,000
your city.

587
00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:07,349
We have two home builders lined up for this community and

588
00:25:07,349 --> 00:25:08,519
the price range of the homes

589
00:25:08,519 --> 00:25:13,799
that they've told us are $350,000 to $450,000.

590
00:25:13,799 --> 00:25:15,039
Great.

591
00:25:15,039 --> 00:25:18,119
The two different home builders that are coming in, one of

592
00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:19,920
the questions that was raised by

593
00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:23,099
a citizen and brought to me was the worry of a cookie

594
00:25:23,099 --> 00:25:25,079
cutter facade being put up.

595
00:25:25,079 --> 00:25:27,880
Anything you could speak to that at all publicly?

596
00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:28,880
Certainly.

597
00:25:28,880 --> 00:25:32,650
The PADA, which was negotiated before we took over this

598
00:25:32,650 --> 00:25:35,000
property, addressed a lot of the

599
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:39,589
issues of site plans and setbacks to avoid the cookie

600
00:25:39,589 --> 00:25:42,400
cutter look that occurs in a lot

601
00:25:42,400 --> 00:25:46,599
of communities throughout the Metroplex.

602
00:25:46,599 --> 00:25:50,880
Namely, we stagger front yard setbacks.

603
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:55,200
There's basically three categories, A, B, and C, to stagger

604
00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:56,839
so that there's not just

605
00:25:56,839 --> 00:25:59,960
a linear line of front yard setback.

606
00:25:59,960 --> 00:26:04,559
Then in our homeowners association deed restrictions, we've

607
00:26:04,559 --> 00:26:07,960
got restrictions on front elevations,

608
00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:13,059
building materials, masonry, brick, and protections in

609
00:26:13,059 --> 00:26:16,279
there to make sure that it doesn't look

610
00:26:16,279 --> 00:26:20,690
like there's not so many homes of the same type, that there

611
00:26:20,690 --> 00:26:22,680
's different product.

612
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:24,930
Did you guys drive through Thistle Hills at all to take

613
00:26:24,930 --> 00:26:26,559
ideas about how to create continuity

614
00:26:26,559 --> 00:26:30,279
within the area, keep the façades at least looking the same

615
00:26:30,279 --> 00:26:31,960
is the wrong word to use,

616
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:33,559
but something similar to what's already around it?

617
00:26:33,559 --> 00:26:38,519
I think Thistle Hill is the standard or the quality of the

618
00:26:38,519 --> 00:26:41,720
quality that we envision happening

619
00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:42,720
on this property.

620
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:43,720
Great.

621
00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:44,720
Absolutely.

622
00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:45,720
Thanks, sir.

623
00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:46,720
Yes.

624
00:26:46,720 --> 00:26:47,720
Thank you, sir.

625
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:48,839
Did you guys ever have a neighborhood meeting with

626
00:26:48,839 --> 00:26:49,680
residents of Thistle Hill to discuss

627
00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:50,680
this?

628
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:51,680
No, we did not.

629
00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:55,519
All the meetings were with city staff and the city

630
00:26:55,519 --> 00:26:56,680
officials.

631
00:26:56,680 --> 00:26:57,680
Sure.

632
00:26:57,680 --> 00:26:59,009
It's usually brought up during zoning issues, not usually

633
00:26:59,009 --> 00:27:00,079
during our preliminary platting,

634
00:27:00,079 --> 00:27:02,029
but as you can probably see, this is a little bit more

635
00:27:02,029 --> 00:27:03,799
charged than our preliminary platting,

636
00:27:03,799 --> 00:27:04,799
so stop at that.

637
00:27:04,799 --> 00:27:05,799
Right.

638
00:27:05,799 --> 00:27:10,359
I think that was because the tract is currently located in

639
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:11,279
the ETJ.

640
00:27:11,279 --> 00:27:15,140
As part of the PADA, once the final plat is approved, we

641
00:27:15,140 --> 00:27:17,319
have to submit for annexation

642
00:27:17,319 --> 00:27:18,319
within 10 days.

643
00:27:18,319 --> 00:27:19,319
Thanks.

644
00:27:19,319 --> 00:27:20,319
More questions?

645
00:27:20,319 --> 00:27:21,799
Okay.

646
00:27:21,799 --> 00:27:22,799
Another question.

647
00:27:22,799 --> 00:27:23,799
Commissioner Sullivan.

648
00:27:23,799 --> 00:27:24,799
Thanks, Chair.

649
00:27:24,799 --> 00:27:27,829
I know that you all have paid for the street impact fees or

650
00:27:27,829 --> 00:27:29,079
to be paid up front.

651
00:27:29,079 --> 00:27:35,150
In fact, all three phases combined are going to be $896,700

652
00:27:35,150 --> 00:27:35,519
.

653
00:27:35,519 --> 00:27:38,230
And my question is, since the traffic survey has not been

654
00:27:38,230 --> 00:27:39,720
done, how do you know what you're

655
00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:41,119
paying for?

656
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:44,200
So when we met with the city, the city was in the process

657
00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:46,000
of doing their roadway impact

658
00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:50,609
fee, and what the city's consultant had determined was they

659
00:27:50,609 --> 00:27:53,039
had gone through and done a study

660
00:27:53,039 --> 00:27:56,390
of impacts on what a single family lot impacts within a

661
00:27:56,390 --> 00:27:58,079
certain area of Denton.

662
00:27:58,079 --> 00:28:01,579
What does that impact have on the roadway infrastructure in

663
00:28:01,579 --> 00:28:02,440
the system?

664
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:06,200
And at the time, I think at one point, the city was looking

665
00:28:06,200 --> 00:28:08,880
at bringing forward a $3,000

666
00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:11,319
per lot impact fee.

667
00:28:11,319 --> 00:28:15,720
And then as it went through the process, it was settled out

668
00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:18,440
on a $2,000 per lot impact

669
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:19,440
fee.

670
00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:22,920
But what the study shows is that the actual impact is a

671
00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:25,200
little bit more significant than

672
00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:26,200
that.

673
00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:29,490
But if you make your roadway impact fee too high, then it

674
00:28:29,490 --> 00:28:31,440
could drive developers away.

675
00:28:31,440 --> 00:28:34,500
Because this project is located in the ETJ, and we were

676
00:28:34,500 --> 00:28:36,960
asking for a pre-annexation development

677
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:42,240
agreement, that's why we came in at a roadway impact fee

678
00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:46,079
that is more in line with or appropriate

679
00:28:46,079 --> 00:28:48,000
to the impact of our development.

680
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:53,630
So that figure was determined by the city and presented to

681
00:28:53,630 --> 00:28:56,920
us as part of the pre-annexation

682
00:28:56,920 --> 00:28:58,119
development agreement.

683
00:28:58,119 --> 00:29:01,819
So the study that was done by the city's consultant is what

684
00:29:01,819 --> 00:29:04,200
was utilized to help determine that

685
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:05,680
appropriate fee amount.

686
00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:09,289
Well, I guess what I'm asking is, is that going to pay just

687
00:29:09,289 --> 00:29:11,079
to re-asphalt Ryan Road?

688
00:29:11,079 --> 00:29:12,079
Is it going to expand it?

689
00:29:12,079 --> 00:29:15,680
No, what it does is that covers, like if we were to go out

690
00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:17,680
and do the perimeter roadway

691
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:22,619
improvements, that fee is in line with the cost of that

692
00:29:22,619 --> 00:29:24,720
section of roadway.

693
00:29:24,720 --> 00:29:29,460
So because if you go out and you drive, there are several

694
00:29:29,460 --> 00:29:32,279
areas adjacent to the Walmart,

695
00:29:32,279 --> 00:29:36,190
Forest Hill, Teasley Trails where with the development the

696
00:29:36,190 --> 00:29:38,279
road was actually constructed

697
00:29:38,279 --> 00:29:40,559
and you get some incontinuity.

698
00:29:40,559 --> 00:29:44,319
So the city said, well, if we start assessing these impact

699
00:29:44,319 --> 00:29:46,519
fees versus having the developer

700
00:29:46,519 --> 00:29:49,980
themselves build this small section or their half of the

701
00:29:49,980 --> 00:29:52,200
roadway, then once we accumulate

702
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:55,119
a certain amount of dollars, we can start the process of

703
00:29:55,119 --> 00:29:56,759
going out and doing schematic

704
00:29:56,759 --> 00:30:02,259
design, determination of road section, determination of

705
00:30:02,259 --> 00:30:04,920
right of way acquisition.

706
00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:07,200
We can go through and do our flood study.

707
00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:11,289
So they can start using, so once these dollars are paid and

708
00:30:11,289 --> 00:30:13,559
put into the account, the city

709
00:30:13,559 --> 00:30:17,400
can start the process of planning for the improvements of

710
00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:18,279
this road.

711
00:30:18,279 --> 00:30:21,440
That planning will help them determine the overall, do an

712
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:23,160
estimation of the overall cost

713
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:26,680
and then they can use that to start looking for sources to

714
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:27,279
fund.

715
00:30:27,279 --> 00:30:31,230
Because you have, I mean, if you look at the area, I think

716
00:30:31,230 --> 00:30:34,019
about 60% of the frontage adjacent

717
00:30:34,019 --> 00:30:36,460
to Ryan Road is already developed.

718
00:30:36,460 --> 00:30:38,700
So you don't have as much development that's going to come

719
00:30:38,700 --> 00:30:39,599
in and contribute.

720
00:30:39,599 --> 00:30:43,849
So the city has to look at where are, what is the cost and

721
00:30:43,849 --> 00:30:46,859
then how can we fund the improvements

722
00:30:46,859 --> 00:30:48,079
to the overall roadway.

723
00:30:48,079 --> 00:30:51,240
- You trust it more than I do.

724
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:55,880
But y'all are going to be adding about what, 137 homes?

725
00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:56,880
Is that right?

726
00:30:56,880 --> 00:30:57,880
- Correct.

727
00:30:57,880 --> 00:30:58,880
- 137 homes.

728
00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:02,480
My concern is that Thistle Hill, phase one and two has

729
00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:04,319
about 150 homes.

730
00:31:04,319 --> 00:31:07,970
And a couple of years ago, there was a traffic survey done

731
00:31:07,970 --> 00:31:10,200
on Andrew because residents were

732
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:13,079
concerned about the speeding of cars because it's pretty

733
00:31:13,079 --> 00:31:14,640
straight shot from the back of

734
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:17,319
Thistle Hill to Ryan Road.

735
00:31:17,319 --> 00:31:23,170
And during the five day period, they had 2,968 cars that

736
00:31:23,170 --> 00:31:26,440
went southbound from Ryan Road onto

737
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:28,160
Andrew.

738
00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:33,430
Another 3,173 cars that went northbound going from Andrew

739
00:31:33,430 --> 00:31:34,880
onto Ryan Road.

740
00:31:34,880 --> 00:31:40,880
So that's 6,141 cars that were either going onto or off of

741
00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:42,220
Ryan Road.

742
00:31:42,220 --> 00:31:45,589
So that means that y'all's development is going to add an

743
00:31:45,589 --> 00:31:48,079
additional 6,000 cars going

744
00:31:48,079 --> 00:31:51,839
into or out of Ryan Road, but they're going to be traveling

745
00:31:51,839 --> 00:31:53,059
that Ryan Road.

746
00:31:53,059 --> 00:31:58,109
How do y'all plan to get people out in a safe and expedited

747
00:31:58,109 --> 00:32:00,400
manner when you have all

748
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:05,160
of these cars coming within, what, 300 feet of each other

749
00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:07,759
from Andrew to street A or whatever

750
00:32:07,759 --> 00:32:08,759
you call it?

751
00:32:08,759 --> 00:32:11,549
The driveway spacing, when we look at the driveway spacing

752
00:32:11,549 --> 00:32:13,240
from Thistle Hill to our entry

753
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:17,430
road, we look at the city's, the ultimate use of that road

754
00:32:17,430 --> 00:32:18,039
way.

755
00:32:18,039 --> 00:32:20,000
What is the ultimate design section?

756
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:21,279
What is the spacing?

757
00:32:21,279 --> 00:32:24,099
So if you look at Ryan Road and you drive up, there's a lot

758
00:32:24,099 --> 00:32:25,599
of, because it's developed

759
00:32:25,599 --> 00:32:29,720
over time, there's a lot of homes that front Ryan Road.

760
00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:35,039
So you have a lot of driveways with spacing that is

761
00:32:35,039 --> 00:32:37,400
relatively close.

762
00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:40,400
I think there's probably, you could probably find drives

763
00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:42,759
that are within 75 to 100 feet.

764
00:32:42,759 --> 00:32:45,829
Well when we look at our development, we go through our

765
00:32:45,829 --> 00:32:47,759
design, we set our entry to where

766
00:32:47,759 --> 00:32:52,700
it is, the distance apart from the entry to Thistle Hill

767
00:32:52,700 --> 00:32:55,480
meets the city's thoroughfare

768
00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:59,529
standards or traffic design standards so that there's

769
00:32:59,529 --> 00:33:02,279
adequate sight distance, there's

770
00:33:02,279 --> 00:33:03,759
adequate visibility.

771
00:33:03,759 --> 00:33:07,450
So somebody that stopped in our development at Ryan Road,

772
00:33:07,450 --> 00:33:09,720
they have good sight visibility,

773
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:12,839
there's nothing impeding their visibility, and there's not

774
00:33:12,839 --> 00:33:14,240
going to be a car coming out

775
00:33:14,240 --> 00:33:17,279
of an adjacent driveway, whereas if they're coming out

776
00:33:17,279 --> 00:33:19,359
quickly and we're coming, somebody

777
00:33:19,359 --> 00:33:22,789
in ours is coming out slowly where it would create an issue

778
00:33:22,789 --> 00:33:23,079
.

779
00:33:23,079 --> 00:33:25,890
As far as the traffic count, I would imagine if those

780
00:33:25,890 --> 00:33:28,079
traffic count numbers, I would assume

781
00:33:28,079 --> 00:33:31,779
that those traffic count numbers probably included maybe

782
00:33:31,779 --> 00:33:34,279
traffic that was going through Thistle

783
00:33:34,279 --> 00:33:37,759
Hill to get south to Creek Delta, maybe other developments.

784
00:33:37,759 --> 00:33:41,259
So from a traffic, I'm not a traffic engineer, but working

785
00:33:41,259 --> 00:33:43,119
with our traffic engineers, I

786
00:33:43,119 --> 00:33:46,269
know that a residential, single family residential

787
00:33:46,269 --> 00:33:49,440
development typically generates about 9.5 trips

788
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:50,539
per day.

789
00:33:50,539 --> 00:33:54,789
So if you round that up to 10, you're talking about 1,370

790
00:33:54,789 --> 00:33:56,759
trips per day that's generated

791
00:33:56,759 --> 00:33:59,079
from this development.

792
00:33:59,079 --> 00:34:03,829
In a peak hour, AM and PM, it's around one per lot, so you

793
00:34:03,829 --> 00:34:06,680
're talking about 137 peak

794
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:11,719
hour trips that are added to the roadway system.

795
00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:14,670
Because the way our development is laid out, one of the

796
00:34:14,670 --> 00:34:16,360
things we did is, so we didn't

797
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:22,500
have a straight through from Creekdale up to Ryan, we made

798
00:34:22,500 --> 00:34:25,239
it to where anyone coming

799
00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:28,440
or trying to go through the development would have to come

800
00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:29,719
down and go around.

801
00:34:29,719 --> 00:34:32,400
So we made several turns within the development that they

802
00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:33,480
would have to make.

803
00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:37,119
We didn't want to create a straight cut through.

804
00:34:37,119 --> 00:34:39,000
Studies have shown that if you make it harder for someone

805
00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:40,039
to cut through, you're going

806
00:34:40,039 --> 00:34:42,219
to reduce that traffic.

807
00:34:42,219 --> 00:34:44,670
So we didn't want to make this a development that's going

808
00:34:44,670 --> 00:34:46,039
to create an opportunity for

809
00:34:46,039 --> 00:34:47,840
a lot of cut through traffic.

810
00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,539
So I don't know if maybe their development has some cut

811
00:34:50,539 --> 00:34:52,960
through traffic in those numbers,

812
00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:57,090
but from a TIA standpoint, we would expect that 1,370 trips

813
00:34:57,090 --> 00:34:58,840
would be generated from this

814
00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:00,360
development per day.

815
00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:03,400
We would assume a certain percentage of those are going to

816
00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:05,000
go down to Creekdale and then

817
00:35:05,000 --> 00:35:07,119
go further south from there.

818
00:35:07,119 --> 00:35:11,349
What that percentage is without a TIA, I would probably

819
00:35:11,349 --> 00:35:14,079
guess that you might have 25% go

820
00:35:14,079 --> 00:35:17,260
south and 75% go north.

821
00:35:17,260 --> 00:35:20,599
Just because the lots on the southern portion of the

822
00:35:20,599 --> 00:35:23,260
development, it's going to be quicker

823
00:35:23,260 --> 00:35:25,519
for them to get out if they go down to Creekdale.

824
00:35:25,519 --> 00:35:28,639
Then I'm not sure there's another north-south connector

825
00:35:28,639 --> 00:35:30,440
street that goes out and I think

826
00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:32,039
comes out over by Sprouts.

827
00:35:32,039 --> 00:35:33,920
I'm not sure of all the street names.

828
00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:37,679
But that would be one way that the residents would get out

829
00:35:37,679 --> 00:35:39,639
and over to 2181.

830
00:35:39,639 --> 00:35:44,030
Well, they'd have to go to Creekdale to River Pass, Hickory

831
00:35:44,030 --> 00:35:46,039
Creek to then go on Hickory

832
00:35:46,039 --> 00:35:50,760
Creek, which is probably worse condition than Ryan Road.

833
00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:55,019
Let me ask you, did y'all talk to Ryan Ranch people,

834
00:35:55,019 --> 00:35:57,840
residents as far as dumping ever how

835
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,559
many people into their neighborhood?

836
00:36:00,559 --> 00:36:03,000
We don't have any connectivity to their neighborhood.

837
00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:04,000
Well, Creekdale.

838
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:08,340
Well, Creekdale, I believe River Chase, if it's the correct

839
00:36:08,340 --> 00:36:09,199
street.

840
00:36:09,199 --> 00:36:10,199
Yeah, River Pass.

841
00:36:10,199 --> 00:36:11,199
River Pass.

842
00:36:11,199 --> 00:36:12,199
It's a collector.

843
00:36:12,199 --> 00:36:13,199
Yeah, that's the western boundary of ...

844
00:36:13,199 --> 00:36:17,219
There's a north-south collector that ties into Creekdale

845
00:36:17,219 --> 00:36:19,119
that doesn't have any lots

846
00:36:19,119 --> 00:36:21,440
located on it.

847
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:25,650
Ryan Ranch, it's my understanding if I'm thinking correctly

848
00:36:25,650 --> 00:36:28,039
, because I know when we looked at

849
00:36:28,039 --> 00:36:32,110
the sewer, because one of the things we looked at with the

850
00:36:32,110 --> 00:36:34,440
city is taking the Granada lift

851
00:36:34,440 --> 00:36:37,699
station offline and making it gravity, which would save the

852
00:36:37,699 --> 00:36:39,639
city money with operation expense

853
00:36:39,639 --> 00:36:41,239
for that lift station.

854
00:36:41,239 --> 00:36:43,989
One of the things we had to look at is there needed some

855
00:36:43,989 --> 00:36:46,280
upsizing of some of the sewer

856
00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:49,739
lines further south in that, I believe it's River Pass,

857
00:36:49,739 --> 00:36:50,760
River Chase.

858
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:52,639
Yeah, River Pass, yeah.

859
00:36:52,639 --> 00:36:55,230
They mentioned that when we were talking about, they

860
00:36:55,230 --> 00:36:57,239
mentioned that if there was any upsizing

861
00:36:57,239 --> 00:37:01,230
required, they could potentially go that route because it's

862
00:37:01,230 --> 00:37:03,280
a collector and it did not impact

863
00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:08,440
any lots or a sewer line with services on it.

864
00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:11,309
But I'd have to look at a map to verify that because I'm

865
00:37:11,309 --> 00:37:12,199
not ...

866
00:37:12,199 --> 00:37:13,199
Okay.

867
00:37:13,199 --> 00:37:14,199
Thank you.

868
00:37:14,199 --> 00:37:18,760
It is River Pass, River Pass Drive.

869
00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:20,639
Are there lots fronting River Pass?

870
00:37:20,639 --> 00:37:21,639
They back to it.

871
00:37:21,639 --> 00:37:22,639
Back to it.

872
00:37:22,639 --> 00:37:23,639
Thank you.

873
00:37:23,639 --> 00:37:28,480
On the east side, the east side lots back to it and the

874
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:31,719
west of that is still farmland.

875
00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:36,559
Any other questions for the applicant?

876
00:37:36,559 --> 00:37:37,559
Thank you.

877
00:37:37,559 --> 00:37:42,150
This is an individual agenda item and so I do have several

878
00:37:42,150 --> 00:37:44,920
other cards wishing to speak.

879
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:46,829
I'll just take these in the order in which they were

880
00:37:46,829 --> 00:37:47,480
presented.

881
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:52,480
I have Richard, I believe, Bodo, 3913 Maggie Meadow and it

882
00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:54,599
's not marked whether it's in

883
00:37:54,599 --> 00:37:56,320
support of opposition.

884
00:37:56,320 --> 00:37:59,820
Please come forward, give us your name and address and then

885
00:37:59,820 --> 00:38:01,239
the card I have to follow

886
00:38:01,239 --> 00:38:04,840
you will be Karn Catherwood.

887
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:05,840
Yes.

888
00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:07,960
Good evening.

889
00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:10,440
Thanks for the opportunity to speak to the board or to the

890
00:38:10,440 --> 00:38:12,440
commission.

891
00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:15,800
I am a member of Thistle Hills.

892
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:22,840
Richard Bodo, 3913 Maggie's Meadow in Denton, 76210.

893
00:38:22,840 --> 00:38:28,630
I am actually the president of our Thistle Hills phase one

894
00:38:28,630 --> 00:38:31,079
HOA newly formed about one

895
00:38:31,079 --> 00:38:34,039
year ago.

896
00:38:34,039 --> 00:38:38,090
We do have some concerns, I wouldn't call it complete

897
00:38:38,090 --> 00:38:41,719
opposition, but we have some concerns

898
00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:42,719
on the new neighborhood.

899
00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:46,710
One, I guess I didn't get the question quickly and enough

900
00:38:46,710 --> 00:38:48,159
to the applicant.

901
00:38:48,159 --> 00:38:56,090
There's, I believe, it was indicated that there's 120 to 80

902
00:38:56,090 --> 00:38:58,559
feet wide buffer on the

903
00:38:58,559 --> 00:39:04,360
one side and presently there's multiple trees that are

904
00:39:04,360 --> 00:39:07,840
tagged with yellow ribbons, but there's

905
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:12,139
a whole lot of foliage in that area as well that are major

906
00:39:12,139 --> 00:39:13,920
trees that are not.

907
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:18,380
I guess I would like to first of all ask the question if we

908
00:39:18,380 --> 00:39:20,760
can get an understanding if

909
00:39:20,760 --> 00:39:23,670
just the ones that are tagged yellow at the moment are

910
00:39:23,670 --> 00:39:25,440
planned to be saved or more than

911
00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:27,400
just that in that area.

912
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:31,389
Okay, can I ask you if you have several questions for the

913
00:39:31,389 --> 00:39:33,280
applicant or just one?

914
00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:34,679
Probably the rest are more for the city.

915
00:39:34,679 --> 00:39:38,010
Okay, I'll ask the applicant to please come forward and let

916
00:39:38,010 --> 00:39:42,920
's address the.

917
00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:46,769
As far as the tree tags, we have not done any tagging to

918
00:39:46,769 --> 00:39:49,039
signify what's being removed

919
00:39:49,039 --> 00:39:50,440
versus what's being saved.

920
00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:53,530
So when we go out and do our tree survey, when they tag

921
00:39:53,530 --> 00:39:55,719
certain trees, typically that's

922
00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:58,900
going to, the city of Denton has different classifications

923
00:39:58,900 --> 00:39:59,679
for trees.

924
00:39:59,679 --> 00:40:03,210
So the trees that have the ribbon would meet a certain

925
00:40:03,210 --> 00:40:05,639
classification, but what we do is

926
00:40:05,639 --> 00:40:10,079
we go out and we tag, we'll tag and tie all the trees that

927
00:40:10,079 --> 00:40:12,719
are six inches or larger, then

928
00:40:12,719 --> 00:40:17,000
we go through and put together a tree survey.

929
00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:21,219
When we did our development, our design, we, that buffer,

930
00:40:21,219 --> 00:40:23,360
the distance we set the buffer

931
00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:28,000
enabled us to look at minimal impacts to the trees.

932
00:40:28,000 --> 00:40:31,099
So there's very minimal, there are some trees that are

933
00:40:31,099 --> 00:40:33,559
being removed, but within that primary

934
00:40:33,559 --> 00:40:39,190
120 feet width, the majority of those trees are being

935
00:40:39,190 --> 00:40:40,599
preserved.

936
00:40:40,599 --> 00:40:43,059
As far as when we have to go out and do some grading right

937
00:40:43,059 --> 00:40:44,679
up by the right of way, typically

938
00:40:44,679 --> 00:40:49,420
if there's a tree within 10 to 15 foot of the right of way,

939
00:40:49,420 --> 00:40:51,280
the grading activity is

940
00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:56,349
going to usually damage the tree to where it wouldn't

941
00:40:56,349 --> 00:40:57,559
survive.

942
00:40:57,559 --> 00:41:01,400
So any tree within probably 110 feet of that back property

943
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:03,079
line would be preserved.

944
00:41:03,079 --> 00:41:05,829
And then that 10 and then 50 foot right of way, those were

945
00:41:05,829 --> 00:41:07,159
where you would start seeing

946
00:41:07,159 --> 00:41:08,960
tree removal.

947
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:11,550
And then we're doing a trail through the trees and

948
00:41:11,550 --> 00:41:13,519
basically what we do on the design for

949
00:41:13,519 --> 00:41:16,389
the trail through the trees is it's kind of a design build

950
00:41:16,389 --> 00:41:17,840
trail so that we can kind of

951
00:41:17,840 --> 00:41:21,079
go through and weave through the trees and so that we're

952
00:41:21,079 --> 00:41:23,039
not removing trees to add concrete

953
00:41:23,039 --> 00:41:24,039
walk.

954
00:41:24,039 --> 00:41:27,989
We're building a concrete walk within the trees so that the

955
00:41:27,989 --> 00:41:30,360
citizens can enjoy the trees

956
00:41:30,360 --> 00:41:31,360
within the area.

957
00:41:31,360 --> 00:41:32,360
Does that answer your question?

958
00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:33,360
It does.

959
00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:34,360
Okay.

960
00:41:34,360 --> 00:41:36,639
I have a follow up while you're there at the mic.

961
00:41:36,639 --> 00:41:38,559
Have you already done your tree survey?

962
00:41:38,559 --> 00:41:39,559
We have.

963
00:41:39,559 --> 00:41:40,559
We have done the tree survey.

964
00:41:40,559 --> 00:41:44,519
It's been submitted to the city for review.

965
00:41:44,519 --> 00:41:45,840
We've done our grading plan.

966
00:41:45,840 --> 00:41:50,119
Our construction plans are under review through the city.

967
00:41:50,119 --> 00:41:53,619
So I'd have to go back and relook at the numbers, but if we

968
00:41:53,619 --> 00:41:55,519
looked at the overall tract and

969
00:41:55,519 --> 00:41:59,360
we looked at the percentage of canopy and caliper inches

970
00:41:59,360 --> 00:42:01,280
that we're saving, I think

971
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:06,480
we're saving about 65% of the caliper inches on the site.

972
00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:09,639
The city has two different standards.

973
00:42:09,639 --> 00:42:12,519
They have canopy trees and then they have trees that are

974
00:42:12,519 --> 00:42:14,119
kind of individual trees.

975
00:42:14,119 --> 00:42:19,119
But as far as canopy goes, the requirement is preserving 20

976
00:42:19,119 --> 00:42:20,480
%, I believe.

977
00:42:20,480 --> 00:42:26,349
I know a lot of the standards have been reviewed and there

978
00:42:26,349 --> 00:42:29,079
's changes that are maybe being proposed.

979
00:42:29,079 --> 00:42:32,590
But the last time I looked, if something's been updated or

980
00:42:32,590 --> 00:42:34,280
changed, then I may not be

981
00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:35,880
speaking to what's current.

982
00:42:35,880 --> 00:42:41,469
But based on what's current, we're saving about probably

983
00:42:41,469 --> 00:42:44,639
around 45% over and above what

984
00:42:44,639 --> 00:42:47,079
would typically be required.

985
00:42:47,079 --> 00:42:51,400
So it's a very conservative approach, a very preservation-

986
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:54,280
oriented approach to the trees.

987
00:42:54,280 --> 00:42:55,280
I figured it was.

988
00:42:55,280 --> 00:42:56,780
I'm going to give you the opportunity to address that.

989
00:42:56,780 --> 00:42:58,599
So thank you for answering my question.

990
00:42:58,599 --> 00:42:59,599
Please.

991
00:42:59,599 --> 00:43:01,599
May I ask him one additional question?

992
00:43:01,599 --> 00:43:02,599
Sure.

993
00:43:02,599 --> 00:43:07,639
With the development . . .

994
00:43:07,639 --> 00:43:09,900
Can you step closer to the mic so we can make sure and get

995
00:43:09,900 --> 00:43:11,480
it on the recording?

996
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:12,480
I apologize.

997
00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:17,170
So with the development against Ryan Road, can you help us

998
00:43:17,170 --> 00:43:19,559
understand what type of, if

999
00:43:19,559 --> 00:43:24,269
you're going to have a wall in front of the development to

1000
00:43:24,269 --> 00:43:27,000
Ryan Road and the construction

1001
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:28,360
of that wall?

1002
00:43:28,360 --> 00:43:29,679
Yeah, absolutely.

1003
00:43:29,679 --> 00:43:31,920
We are going to have a screening wall.

1004
00:43:31,920 --> 00:43:35,340
So one of the other things we did is, if you notice on the

1005
00:43:35,340 --> 00:43:37,360
connection to Ryan Road, a lot

1006
00:43:37,360 --> 00:43:40,519
of developments will typically back lots to Ryan Road.

1007
00:43:40,519 --> 00:43:44,059
We wanted ours to be kind of set back and create a buffer.

1008
00:43:44,059 --> 00:43:47,070
So not only do we have the 120-foot buffer along our

1009
00:43:47,070 --> 00:43:49,000
western edge, we've carried that

1010
00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:51,679
through across Ryan.

1011
00:43:51,679 --> 00:43:55,440
We are, as part of our requirements, we're going to have a

1012
00:43:55,440 --> 00:43:57,340
masonry screen wall across

1013
00:43:57,340 --> 00:44:00,260
Ryan Road.

1014
00:44:00,260 --> 00:44:03,960
And then we also have an entry feature that's going to look

1015
00:44:03,960 --> 00:44:06,039
. . . John could probably describe

1016
00:44:06,039 --> 00:44:11,820
it better than I can, but it's going to be an entry

1017
00:44:11,820 --> 00:44:15,320
monument that kind of has a bridge

1018
00:44:15,320 --> 00:44:19,480
type feel as if you were going across a covered bridge into

1019
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:20,400
a . . .

1020
00:44:20,400 --> 00:44:21,400
Appalachian.

1021
00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:24,679
I knew you had a word for it.

1022
00:44:24,679 --> 00:44:27,880
An Appalachian style entry feature.

1023
00:44:27,880 --> 00:44:31,639
So it will be a real nice entryway.

1024
00:44:31,639 --> 00:44:34,869
We've got a divided median for the street that's connecting

1025
00:44:34,869 --> 00:44:35,800
to Ryan Road.

1026
00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:39,000
So that divided median will have landscaping in it.

1027
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:42,800
So the amenity center will sit right in here.

1028
00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:45,809
So as you're going westbound on Ryan Road and you look down

1029
00:44:45,809 --> 00:44:47,440
through the creek and all,

1030
00:44:47,440 --> 00:44:49,679
you'll be able to see the amenity center, the children's

1031
00:44:49,679 --> 00:44:50,880
playground and the swimming

1032
00:44:50,880 --> 00:44:51,880
pool.

1033
00:44:51,880 --> 00:44:55,960
As you turn into Street A, we've got an HOA lot.

1034
00:44:55,960 --> 00:45:00,000
So when you turn in, you're not going to see homes right of

1035
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:00,599
way.

1036
00:45:00,599 --> 00:45:03,960
We have a masonry screen wall along there as well that kind

1037
00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:05,440
of protects those first

1038
00:45:05,440 --> 00:45:09,210
row of homes so that the headlights aren't shining into

1039
00:45:09,210 --> 00:45:11,679
homes or backyards or anything.

1040
00:45:11,679 --> 00:45:16,809
So we've got real nice landscaping, hardscaping designed

1041
00:45:16,809 --> 00:45:18,440
for this entry.

1042
00:45:18,440 --> 00:45:22,679
So there's quite a bit of beautification that's going on

1043
00:45:22,679 --> 00:45:24,840
right there at Ryan Road.

1044
00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:25,840
Thank you.

1045
00:45:25,840 --> 00:45:26,840
Please continue.

1046
00:45:26,840 --> 00:45:27,840
Okay.

1047
00:45:27,840 --> 00:45:30,840
The next, thank you.

1048
00:45:30,840 --> 00:45:36,559
The next question that I had is with the addition of Creeks

1049
00:45:36,559 --> 00:45:40,559
ide now in addition to Teasley Trails,

1050
00:45:40,559 --> 00:45:44,400
Forest Meadows, Ryan Meadows, so now we'll have basically

1051
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:46,360
four new developments coming

1052
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:48,000
in there.

1053
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:52,349
There was a traffic impact study for Ryan Road, I believe,

1054
00:45:52,349 --> 00:45:54,280
done in 2014.

1055
00:45:54,280 --> 00:45:59,980
And the first question is, is there, what is the plan to

1056
00:45:59,980 --> 00:46:02,880
have another study done now

1057
00:46:02,880 --> 00:46:07,360
that all these four new neighborhoods are coming in and the

1058
00:46:07,360 --> 00:46:09,000
study was done before any

1059
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:12,320
of them have basically been in at all?

1060
00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:13,320
Okay.

1061
00:46:13,320 --> 00:46:16,960
That'd be something to have to ask staff to speak to on H

1062
00:46:16,960 --> 00:46:18,880
aley or Richard who would like

1063
00:46:18,880 --> 00:46:24,920
to take that.

1064
00:46:24,920 --> 00:46:28,070
At this time, there are no immediate plans for any traffic

1065
00:46:28,070 --> 00:46:29,559
study that I'm aware of.

1066
00:46:29,559 --> 00:46:31,929
But as he mentioned with the impact fees being collected

1067
00:46:31,929 --> 00:46:33,440
for each of the new subdivisions,

1068
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:36,550
the city will ask her that money and have it available when

1069
00:46:36,550 --> 00:46:38,079
the plans are made for Ryan

1070
00:46:38,079 --> 00:46:42,320
Road to be fully improved to its full right of way.

1071
00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:44,559
I think Commissioner Beck has a follow up question for you

1072
00:46:44,559 --> 00:46:45,000
Haley.

1073
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:46,519
Thank you Chair.

1074
00:46:46,519 --> 00:46:51,230
Okay, nobody's talked about it yet, but correct me if I'm

1075
00:46:51,230 --> 00:46:52,079
wrong.

1076
00:46:52,079 --> 00:46:56,239
On our mobility plan, isn't Ryan Road scheduled to become

1077
00:46:56,239 --> 00:46:58,880
either a main arterial or secondary

1078
00:46:58,880 --> 00:47:01,880
arterial, a four lane road, possibly even with a medium in

1079
00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:02,679
the middle?

1080
00:47:02,679 --> 00:47:05,750
I know that could be way down the road, but isn't that in

1081
00:47:05,750 --> 00:47:07,599
the plans on our mobility plan?

1082
00:47:07,599 --> 00:47:08,599
Yes, sir.

1083
00:47:08,599 --> 00:47:10,719
The ultimate attendance for it to be a secondary arterial,

1084
00:47:10,719 --> 00:47:12,119
that would be at least 110 feet

1085
00:47:12,119 --> 00:47:13,119
of right of way.

1086
00:47:13,119 --> 00:47:15,219
So at least four lanes divided.

1087
00:47:15,219 --> 00:47:16,599
So that's something to look forward to.

1088
00:47:16,599 --> 00:47:19,519
The problem is that may not happen anytime soon.

1089
00:47:19,519 --> 00:47:21,480
Yeah, that's the ultimate intent.

1090
00:47:21,480 --> 00:47:23,880
Okay, but it would be able to handle a lot of the traffic

1091
00:47:23,880 --> 00:47:25,239
that these developments are

1092
00:47:25,239 --> 00:47:27,639
going to bring in when that happens.

1093
00:47:27,639 --> 00:47:28,639
Yeah.

1094
00:47:28,639 --> 00:47:29,639
Okay, thank you.

1095
00:47:29,639 --> 00:47:33,460
I hate to have Haley getting up and down, so maybe if we

1096
00:47:33,460 --> 00:47:35,280
just keep her here close.

1097
00:47:35,280 --> 00:47:36,840
She can take a seat right there.

1098
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:37,840
Keep her here close.

1099
00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:38,840
Close by, sure.

1100
00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:40,840
Because the next question, I'm sorry.

1101
00:47:40,840 --> 00:47:42,679
No, you're fine, go ahead.

1102
00:47:42,679 --> 00:47:46,570
Because the next question really becomes, when do we think

1103
00:47:46,570 --> 00:47:48,880
that will be with 137 homes

1104
00:47:48,880 --> 00:47:53,659
here, with the other three subdivisions, which are hundreds

1105
00:47:53,659 --> 00:47:55,280
of homes in there.

1106
00:47:55,280 --> 00:48:04,920
With the one, sorry, I don't have the names all down.

1107
00:48:04,920 --> 00:48:09,250
With the Ryan Meadows there, I think we were just talking

1108
00:48:09,250 --> 00:48:11,519
about it over Christmas that

1109
00:48:11,519 --> 00:48:15,360
before the beginning of last year, there was a lot of dirt

1110
00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:17,039
work done, but we didn't see

1111
00:48:17,039 --> 00:48:20,719
a home in there and we turn around now and there has to be

1112
00:48:20,719 --> 00:48:24,559
30 or more homes in there,

1113
00:48:24,559 --> 00:48:27,340
several waiting on some permits, I think, and then moment

1114
00:48:27,340 --> 00:48:28,679
arily people start flooding

1115
00:48:28,679 --> 00:48:31,119
into that neighborhood.

1116
00:48:31,119 --> 00:48:37,980
They're flooding into forest meadows and teesley

1117
00:48:37,980 --> 00:48:39,860
continuously.

1118
00:48:39,860 --> 00:48:46,789
We expect to see a huge influx of traffic in there very,

1119
00:48:46,789 --> 00:48:49,000
very quickly.

1120
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:54,389
Can the commission help us to understand when we think that

1121
00:48:54,389 --> 00:48:56,880
road is going to happen and

1122
00:48:56,880 --> 00:49:00,440
where do we go to make sure that happens before we run into

1123
00:49:00,440 --> 00:49:02,519
problems both with traffic and

1124
00:49:02,519 --> 00:49:03,519
both with safety?

1125
00:49:03,519 --> 00:49:05,440
We also have an elementary school back there.

1126
00:49:05,440 --> 00:49:09,599
Needless to say, if we've got a lot of traffic there and we

1127
00:49:09,599 --> 00:49:11,880
have a problem, obviously we

1128
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:17,150
have people parking on our right of way there in front of

1129
00:49:17,150 --> 00:49:20,119
Thistle Hills on the median on

1130
00:49:20,119 --> 00:49:21,119
a regular basis.

1131
00:49:21,119 --> 00:49:24,239
I didn't realize that was a parking lot, by the way.

1132
00:49:24,239 --> 00:49:28,940
That happens on a regular basis, so we have cars all over

1133
00:49:28,940 --> 00:49:30,119
the place.

1134
00:49:30,119 --> 00:49:33,000
Question one is when do we believe that that will actually

1135
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:34,400
happen and become a road?

1136
00:49:34,400 --> 00:49:39,960
Then number two, we talked about this kiddie that all the

1137
00:49:39,960 --> 00:49:43,039
developers are throwing money

1138
00:49:43,039 --> 00:49:44,039
into.

1139
00:49:44,039 --> 00:49:47,329
At what threshold does this kiddie hit the mark that says,

1140
00:49:47,329 --> 00:49:48,920
"Okay, it's time to spend

1141
00:49:48,920 --> 00:49:51,639
us," and start doing something to the roads?

1142
00:49:51,639 --> 00:49:54,280
I'll take a stab at that.

1143
00:49:54,280 --> 00:49:57,679
That's not something that our commission deals with.

1144
00:49:57,679 --> 00:50:00,250
That's something that actually is going to be internal city

1145
00:50:00,250 --> 00:50:01,280
staff and policy that they

1146
00:50:01,280 --> 00:50:05,300
draft, so we can't address when those improvements will be

1147
00:50:05,300 --> 00:50:07,239
or what the timeframe is.

1148
00:50:07,239 --> 00:50:10,619
That was something that you would need to address to city

1149
00:50:10,619 --> 00:50:12,280
staff directly on that.

1150
00:50:12,280 --> 00:50:15,639
I'm sorry that that's just the honest answer that I can

1151
00:50:15,639 --> 00:50:16,480
give you.

1152
00:50:16,480 --> 00:50:17,480
Okay.

1153
00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:23,769
As we would address that to city staff in a non-event like

1154
00:50:23,769 --> 00:50:26,800
this, where would we then

1155
00:50:26,800 --> 00:50:30,460
put that on record for the issue that we have in need out

1156
00:50:30,460 --> 00:50:31,199
there?

1157
00:50:31,199 --> 00:50:34,280
Looks like staff would like to weigh in here.

1158
00:50:34,280 --> 00:50:38,440
Richard, if you can.

1159
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:40,079
A lot of that happens.

1160
00:50:40,079 --> 00:50:44,750
Every year we look at it, they do a capital improvement

1161
00:50:44,750 --> 00:50:45,519
plan.

1162
00:50:45,519 --> 00:50:48,269
What they'll look at is the amount of money that's

1163
00:50:48,269 --> 00:50:49,199
collected.

1164
00:50:49,199 --> 00:50:52,570
Part of the issue, particularly with Ryan and the applicant

1165
00:50:52,570 --> 00:50:54,199
's representative, kind of

1166
00:50:54,199 --> 00:50:57,380
headed to that, sort of to the west of you, there's still a

1167
00:50:57,380 --> 00:50:58,920
lot of single family homes

1168
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:03,199
that abut Ryan Road.

1169
00:51:03,199 --> 00:51:05,960
There's quite a bit of acquisition that still needs to take

1170
00:51:05,960 --> 00:51:06,480
place.

1171
00:51:06,480 --> 00:51:11,719
Some of that occurs when there's a plat.

1172
00:51:11,719 --> 00:51:15,210
It's just a matter of acquiring that right away and at what

1173
00:51:15,210 --> 00:51:15,760
time.

1174
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:19,949
When they come into plat, that's usually when the city is

1175
00:51:19,949 --> 00:51:22,159
able to acquire that land.

1176
00:51:22,159 --> 00:51:26,849
Otherwise, you're sort of really negotiating with a home

1177
00:51:26,849 --> 00:51:29,519
owner to try to purchase that.

1178
00:51:29,519 --> 00:51:33,389
I'll just further say that, of course, this is the

1179
00:51:33,389 --> 00:51:35,480
preliminary plat stage.

1180
00:51:35,480 --> 00:51:40,090
As this development continues, there will be other public

1181
00:51:40,090 --> 00:51:42,320
forums within this board or

1182
00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:45,840
with the city council to put those comments on record, I

1183
00:51:45,840 --> 00:51:48,159
think is what you were asking,

1184
00:51:48,159 --> 00:51:49,159
right?

1185
00:51:49,159 --> 00:51:50,159
Yes.

1186
00:51:50,159 --> 00:51:51,159
Okay.

1187
00:51:51,159 --> 00:51:53,760
Thank you for your comments.

1188
00:51:53,760 --> 00:52:05,239
My next speaker is Karn Catherwood to be followed by John

1189
00:52:05,239 --> 00:52:08,199
Dickerson.

1190
00:52:08,199 --> 00:52:11,800
Good evening, gentlemen and ladies.

1191
00:52:11,800 --> 00:52:13,239
My name is Karn Catherwood.

1192
00:52:13,239 --> 00:52:19,079
I live at 3941 Andrew Avenue, which is the freeway that

1193
00:52:19,079 --> 00:52:22,360
runs through the middle of Thistle

1194
00:52:22,360 --> 00:52:23,360
Hills Estates.

1195
00:52:23,360 --> 00:52:26,559
We have a huge traffic problem.

1196
00:52:26,559 --> 00:52:30,000
I've lived there 11 years.

1197
00:52:30,000 --> 00:52:34,360
I'm aware of the concerns of most of the people who have

1198
00:52:34,360 --> 00:52:37,199
moved in since we've been there and

1199
00:52:37,199 --> 00:52:40,639
those who were there before us.

1200
00:52:40,639 --> 00:52:43,630
Most of these concerns have been answered by the previous

1201
00:52:43,630 --> 00:52:45,280
gentleman, and I'm grateful

1202
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:49,519
to hear some positive answers.

1203
00:52:49,519 --> 00:52:52,730
I won't go back over those issues that he's already

1204
00:52:52,730 --> 00:52:53,719
addressed.

1205
00:52:53,719 --> 00:52:58,440
I would like to just mention once again and emphasize that

1206
00:52:58,440 --> 00:53:00,820
there is a need for a traffic

1207
00:53:00,820 --> 00:53:05,309
survey, traffic study, whether this is something that you

1208
00:53:05,309 --> 00:53:08,360
guys do or that is delegated to somebody

1209
00:53:08,360 --> 00:53:09,659
else.

1210
00:53:09,659 --> 00:53:13,679
We are very worried about Gridlock and Ryan Road.

1211
00:53:13,679 --> 00:53:16,199
All the new subdivisions, I'm not against them.

1212
00:53:16,199 --> 00:53:18,800
I'm glad that they're there.

1213
00:53:18,800 --> 00:53:22,639
We have to fill in the South Denton with folks, and that's

1214
00:53:22,639 --> 00:53:24,039
what we're doing.

1215
00:53:24,039 --> 00:53:29,409
But Ryan Road is not quite what I would call a mess, but it

1216
00:53:29,409 --> 00:53:31,440
's getting there.

1217
00:53:31,440 --> 00:53:34,559
It's a little fuzzy in my mind whether or not there is a

1218
00:53:34,559 --> 00:53:36,320
traffic survey planned.

1219
00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:40,650
There was one done I think in 2014, but with all the houses

1220
00:53:40,650 --> 00:53:42,800
, all the people, all the cars,

1221
00:53:42,800 --> 00:53:44,559
you really need to do another one.

1222
00:53:44,559 --> 00:53:46,750
It needs to be official, not just something that a

1223
00:53:46,750 --> 00:53:48,599
developer does, and I'm grateful for

1224
00:53:48,599 --> 00:53:53,420
the input from those who are developing Creekside, and that

1225
00:53:53,420 --> 00:53:56,280
's helpful, but something that is

1226
00:53:56,280 --> 00:53:59,820
official from Country Club to Teasley, the whole length of

1227
00:53:59,820 --> 00:54:02,000
the road in front of the elementary

1228
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:04,159
school.

1229
00:54:04,159 --> 00:54:05,360
We need something done officially.

1230
00:54:05,360 --> 00:54:09,070
It will cost a few bucks, I know, but it would make the

1231
00:54:09,070 --> 00:54:12,239
people in my neighborhood very happy,

1232
00:54:12,239 --> 00:54:15,219
and with time, it would probably accelerate Ryan Road

1233
00:54:15,219 --> 00:54:17,320
becoming Four Lanes, which is going

1234
00:54:17,320 --> 00:54:19,559
to have to become at some point in the future.

1235
00:54:19,559 --> 00:54:23,019
So I just throw that out there as something for you folks

1236
00:54:23,019 --> 00:54:24,199
to think about.

1237
00:54:24,199 --> 00:54:26,760
One other item, and I'll be very brief.

1238
00:54:26,760 --> 00:54:30,900
When preapproval was given for Creekside back in August of

1239
00:54:30,900 --> 00:54:33,920
2016, those of us who live next

1240
00:54:33,920 --> 00:54:36,119
door to them knew nothing about it.

1241
00:54:36,119 --> 00:54:39,480
It was really done very quietly and very discreetly.

1242
00:54:39,480 --> 00:54:43,480
We all wish it had been done a little bit more publicly.

1243
00:54:43,480 --> 00:54:47,519
We wish we had known a little bit about it.

1244
00:54:47,519 --> 00:54:48,519
We didn't.

1245
00:54:48,519 --> 00:54:51,880
We thought all that land was still for sale, and I was sort

1246
00:54:51,880 --> 00:54:53,719
of shocked and surprised just

1247
00:54:53,719 --> 00:54:57,199
a couple of weeks ago to find out that this kind of

1248
00:54:57,199 --> 00:54:59,840
development and analysis had been

1249
00:54:59,840 --> 00:55:01,679
going on for a couple of years.

1250
00:55:01,679 --> 00:55:05,739
I know it takes time to do this analysis, and the folks

1251
00:55:05,739 --> 00:55:08,199
involved have done, from what

1252
00:55:08,199 --> 00:55:10,849
I can see, a very good job, and I compliment them, but I

1253
00:55:10,849 --> 00:55:12,480
wish there had been a little bit

1254
00:55:12,480 --> 00:55:14,440
more openness about it.

1255
00:55:14,440 --> 00:55:18,369
It has created a funny impression in my neighborhood, and

1256
00:55:18,369 --> 00:55:21,400
you don't want to create those kinds of

1257
00:55:21,400 --> 00:55:25,090
funny impressions, because you have to deal with them, and

1258
00:55:25,090 --> 00:55:27,239
people exaggerate and get worried,

1259
00:55:27,239 --> 00:55:29,199
and there's no point in that happening.

1260
00:55:29,199 --> 00:55:33,280
A little bit more openness would have been helpful.

1261
00:55:33,280 --> 00:55:38,110
I do want to congratulate the developer for the plans for

1262
00:55:38,110 --> 00:55:41,360
common areas in the new neighborhood,

1263
00:55:41,360 --> 00:55:42,840
plans to keep the trees.

1264
00:55:42,840 --> 00:55:44,280
We were all worried about that.

1265
00:55:44,280 --> 00:55:47,539
They're going to come in now and cut down all of our

1266
00:55:47,539 --> 00:55:50,039
beautiful trees that we have hanging

1267
00:55:50,039 --> 00:55:54,179
over our backyards from the other side of the fence that

1268
00:55:54,179 --> 00:55:56,320
divides us from the new area

1269
00:55:56,320 --> 00:55:57,320
for Creekside.

1270
00:55:57,320 --> 00:56:00,199
They're going to keep, I think he said 65 percent or 45

1271
00:56:00,199 --> 00:56:01,559
percent of them, quite a few

1272
00:56:01,559 --> 00:56:02,559
of them.

1273
00:56:02,559 --> 00:56:05,650
Thank you, thank you, thank you on behalf of the folks

1274
00:56:05,650 --> 00:56:08,239
whose homes back up to your neighborhood.

1275
00:56:08,239 --> 00:56:11,880
We'll watch you as you're building your houses, because we

1276
00:56:11,880 --> 00:56:13,440
can see you out there.

1277
00:56:13,440 --> 00:56:16,809
Thank you as well to whoever did it, that the gas well,

1278
00:56:16,809 --> 00:56:18,679
which was directly in back of

1279
00:56:18,679 --> 00:56:24,380
my backyard, within 400 feet of my property, is now defunct

1280
00:56:24,380 --> 00:56:25,440
and dead.

1281
00:56:25,440 --> 00:56:28,329
I'm so grateful that we don't have to look out our kitchen

1282
00:56:28,329 --> 00:56:29,920
window and see that horrible

1283
00:56:29,920 --> 00:56:33,869
apparatus and the infrastructure and know what's going on

1284
00:56:33,869 --> 00:56:35,400
behind the scenes.

1285
00:56:35,400 --> 00:56:38,840
I'm all for gas wells, mind you.

1286
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:42,329
I know we need them in Texas, but when they were that close

1287
00:56:42,329 --> 00:56:44,039
to my backyard, that was a

1288
00:56:44,039 --> 00:56:45,400
little worrisome.

1289
00:56:45,400 --> 00:56:48,619
Thank you that that is now defunct and we can look at some

1290
00:56:48,619 --> 00:56:50,320
nice houses rather than have

1291
00:56:50,320 --> 00:56:52,300
to look at stuff like that.

1292
00:56:52,300 --> 00:56:53,559
Thank you for your attention.

1293
00:56:53,559 --> 00:56:55,559
Thank you for your comments, sir.

1294
00:56:55,559 --> 00:56:57,039
Just a clarification.

1295
00:56:57,039 --> 00:56:59,039
Mr. Dickson, have you already spoke?

1296
00:56:59,039 --> 00:57:00,039
Okay.

1297
00:57:00,039 --> 00:57:01,039
Let me go on.

1298
00:57:01,039 --> 00:57:13,079
I have Billy Carraway, 3909 Andrew Avenue.

1299
00:57:13,079 --> 00:57:17,210
I'm Billy Carraway, 3909 Andrew Avenue, and our home backs

1300
00:57:17,210 --> 00:57:18,719
up to the development.

1301
00:57:18,719 --> 00:57:21,400
I think most of my questions have been answered.

1302
00:57:21,400 --> 00:57:25,039
I do have a couple to the developer.

1303
00:57:25,039 --> 00:57:28,289
They had resurfaced Rhine Road and then they put the

1304
00:57:28,289 --> 00:57:30,800
housing condition down at the end.

1305
00:57:30,800 --> 00:57:33,159
Within two weeks, all Rhine Roads tore up.

1306
00:57:33,159 --> 00:57:37,150
How are we going to handle this, keeping it from getting

1307
00:57:37,150 --> 00:57:39,840
tore up once construction starts?

1308
00:57:39,840 --> 00:57:44,539
The other one is most of the people on Andrew Avenue all

1309
00:57:44,539 --> 00:57:46,679
have swimming pools.

1310
00:57:46,679 --> 00:57:48,480
Where are we going to put the batch plants at?

1311
00:57:48,480 --> 00:57:51,119
Are they going to be right up close to us or are we going

1312
00:57:51,119 --> 00:57:52,119
to put them back when they

1313
00:57:52,119 --> 00:57:54,320
start building the roads out there?

1314
00:57:54,320 --> 00:57:55,719
Those are my two questions.

1315
00:57:55,719 --> 00:57:56,719
Great.

1316
00:57:56,719 --> 00:57:57,719
That's all I have.

1317
00:57:57,719 --> 00:57:58,719
Thank you.

1318
00:57:58,719 --> 00:58:00,420
I'll ask the developer's last card I have and he can

1319
00:58:00,420 --> 00:58:01,639
address those two questions for

1320
00:58:01,639 --> 00:58:02,639
us.

1321
00:58:02,639 --> 00:58:06,070
The last card I have is John Dickerson or if you'd like to

1322
00:58:06,070 --> 00:58:08,159
have your, Mr. Fletcher speak

1323
00:58:08,159 --> 00:58:11,880
on your behalf, that'd be fine with me.

1324
00:58:11,880 --> 00:58:14,690
I'll answer the first question first as far as the batch

1325
00:58:14,690 --> 00:58:15,239
plant.

1326
00:58:15,239 --> 00:58:19,650
The batch plant would be located within the development on

1327
00:58:19,650 --> 00:58:22,119
the outside of the tree preserve

1328
00:58:22,119 --> 00:58:24,480
kind of in the lots.

1329
00:58:24,480 --> 00:58:27,000
Typically what they'll do is they'll come in, they'll do

1330
00:58:27,000 --> 00:58:28,360
all the earth work, they'll

1331
00:58:28,360 --> 00:58:31,710
bench the lots, they'll create an area within the lots that

1332
00:58:31,710 --> 00:58:33,480
's flat where they can set up

1333
00:58:33,480 --> 00:58:35,199
the batch plant.

1334
00:58:35,199 --> 00:58:37,960
They'll go in, they'll put all the utilities in.

1335
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:40,550
Once they get ready to pave, typically the paving on a

1336
00:58:40,550 --> 00:58:42,119
project like this is probably

1337
00:58:42,119 --> 00:58:46,280
only going to take four to five weeks at the most.

1338
00:58:46,280 --> 00:58:49,489
So the amount of time the batch plant would be up would

1339
00:58:49,489 --> 00:58:51,440
probably be four to five weeks

1340
00:58:51,440 --> 00:58:55,780
and the batch plant would probably be located no closer

1341
00:58:55,780 --> 00:58:57,719
than 250 feet.

1342
00:58:57,719 --> 00:59:00,860
I think there's requirements within the city code that we

1343
00:59:00,860 --> 00:59:01,920
have to follow.

1344
00:59:01,920 --> 00:59:05,269
I'm not sure exactly what that distance is, but just the

1345
00:59:05,269 --> 00:59:07,139
areas that would accommodate

1346
00:59:07,139 --> 00:59:12,219
the batch plant would probably be well over 200 feet from

1347
00:59:12,219 --> 00:59:14,719
those back property lines.

1348
00:59:14,719 --> 00:59:18,579
As far as the roadway construction, generally when we go

1349
00:59:18,579 --> 00:59:20,760
through and have pre-con, the city

1350
00:59:20,760 --> 00:59:24,460
inspectors go out and they do an inspection of Ryan Road,

1351
00:59:24,460 --> 00:59:26,480
the existing conditions.

1352
00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:29,480
The city inspectors are monitoring the contractors

1353
00:59:29,480 --> 00:59:31,920
throughout the development process.

1354
00:59:31,920 --> 00:59:34,829
If there's damage to Ryan Road that they feel is directly

1355
00:59:34,829 --> 00:59:36,679
associated with the construction

1356
00:59:36,679 --> 00:59:40,320
or a specific contractor, they will note that and that will

1357
00:59:40,320 --> 00:59:42,119
be something that they will

1358
00:59:42,119 --> 00:59:46,599
have to fix or remedy.

1359
00:59:46,599 --> 00:59:49,949
That portion of the process is really, I would say it's

1360
00:59:49,949 --> 00:59:52,199
really governed or watched over by

1361
00:59:52,199 --> 00:59:56,039
the city inspectors, but there is a process to where they

1362
00:59:56,039 --> 00:59:58,119
're watching the construction

1363
00:59:58,119 --> 01:00:02,300
and making note of any damages that they feel that were

1364
01:00:02,300 --> 01:00:05,400
accounted for by the construction.

1365
01:00:05,400 --> 01:00:09,099
Mr. Hutchins, while you're at the microphone, city staff

1366
01:00:09,099 --> 01:00:11,360
has all of your contact information

1367
01:00:11,360 --> 01:00:13,360
for you and your firms, is that correct?

1368
01:00:13,360 --> 01:00:15,329
Any of the residents that are here that may have some

1369
01:00:15,329 --> 01:00:16,639
follow-up questions or so forth

1370
01:00:16,639 --> 01:00:20,190
can certainly reach out to Haley and request contact

1371
01:00:20,190 --> 01:00:22,760
information for you to follow up with

1372
01:00:22,760 --> 01:00:25,320
additional questions if they have them.

1373
01:00:25,320 --> 01:00:26,320
Absolutely.

1374
01:00:26,320 --> 01:00:27,519
I'd be happy to.

1375
01:00:27,519 --> 01:00:30,099
The other thing, I apologize I didn't bring it tonight, we

1376
01:00:30,099 --> 01:00:31,800
've got some real nice renderings,

1377
01:00:31,800 --> 01:00:32,800
color renderings.

1378
01:00:32,800 --> 01:00:35,760
If I would have realized that there were a lot of questions

1379
01:00:35,760 --> 01:00:37,239
, I would have brought that

1380
01:00:37,239 --> 01:00:38,559
and shared that with you.

1381
01:00:38,559 --> 01:00:41,039
I'm happy to provide that and share it.

1382
01:00:41,039 --> 01:00:44,639
It shows kind of the tree preserves, the trails, the

1383
01:00:44,639 --> 01:00:47,280
amenities that we're doing, it shows the

1384
01:00:47,280 --> 01:00:50,340
entry feature, it shows the screening fences.

1385
01:00:50,340 --> 01:00:54,519
So if there's interest in that, I would be happy to share.

1386
01:00:54,519 --> 01:00:58,090
That's part of the PADA, so it is a public document, but I

1387
01:00:58,090 --> 01:00:59,920
'll be glad to email that out

1388
01:00:59,920 --> 01:01:00,920
to anyone.

1389
01:01:00,920 --> 01:01:02,519
Where can they get that if it's a public document?

1390
01:01:02,519 --> 01:01:04,119
They could request it through the city.

1391
01:01:04,119 --> 01:01:09,239
It's part of Ordinance 2016-251.

1392
01:01:09,239 --> 01:01:12,380
The documents, a lot of times when they scan the ordinance,

1393
01:01:12,380 --> 01:01:13,920
the quality of the exhibits

1394
01:01:13,920 --> 01:01:17,340
isn't quite what it would be if I provided the PDF, so they

1395
01:01:17,340 --> 01:01:18,960
can either get it through

1396
01:01:18,960 --> 01:01:22,880
there or I'll be happy to provide that to anyone that would

1397
01:01:22,880 --> 01:01:24,280
want a copy of it.

1398
01:01:24,280 --> 01:01:25,320
Okay, great.

1399
01:01:25,320 --> 01:01:26,320
Thank you for that.

1400
01:01:26,320 --> 01:01:27,320
You have something?

1401
01:01:27,320 --> 01:01:30,269
I just wanted to add, if someone is interested in receiving

1402
01:01:30,269 --> 01:01:31,760
that document, at the end of

1403
01:01:31,760 --> 01:01:35,119
the meeting, if you want to provide your email address to

1404
01:01:35,119 --> 01:01:37,000
Athenia, we can email that out

1405
01:01:37,000 --> 01:01:38,000
to everyone tomorrow.

1406
01:01:38,000 --> 01:01:39,000
Okay, great.

1407
01:01:39,000 --> 01:01:40,000
Thank you.

1408
01:01:40,000 --> 01:01:44,519
That's all the cards that I have here before us.

1409
01:01:44,519 --> 01:01:46,829
This is not a public hearing, but it is an item for

1410
01:01:46,829 --> 01:01:48,380
individual consideration.

1411
01:01:48,380 --> 01:01:51,000
So if you would like to speak on the item, you may.

1412
01:01:51,000 --> 01:01:56,079
You'll need to fill out a card, and I have no more cards.

1413
01:01:56,079 --> 01:02:00,719
So with that, I will move us on on this particular item and

1414
01:02:00,719 --> 01:02:04,199
open the floor up, and then Commissioner

1415
01:02:04,199 --> 01:02:05,199
Sullivan.

1416
01:02:05,199 --> 01:02:07,119
Thank you, Chair.

1417
01:02:07,119 --> 01:02:11,909
My biggest concern about this project is simply the traffic

1418
01:02:11,909 --> 01:02:14,679
that is going to be the result,

1419
01:02:14,679 --> 01:02:19,429
resulting on Ryan Road, number one, Hickory Creek, second

1420
01:02:19,429 --> 01:02:21,840
of all, because I don't think

1421
01:02:21,840 --> 01:02:25,599
that when you look at the size of Thistle Hill and how many

1422
01:02:25,599 --> 01:02:27,760
trips that generates, you're

1423
01:02:27,760 --> 01:02:32,079
all going to be about the same size, and who knows how many

1424
01:02:32,079 --> 01:02:34,519
cars are going to be in there.

1425
01:02:34,519 --> 01:02:38,150
The last traffic survey, as has been mentioned, was 2014,

1426
01:02:38,150 --> 01:02:39,800
and that was for just a portion

1427
01:02:39,800 --> 01:02:43,280
of Ryan Road, not the entire Ryan Road.

1428
01:02:43,280 --> 01:02:48,170
Since then, Teasley Trail has added 167 homes, Ryan Meadows

1429
01:02:48,170 --> 01:02:51,519
141, to go along with 150-some

1430
01:02:51,519 --> 01:02:54,869
odd in Thistle Hill, plus who knows how many in Forest

1431
01:02:54,869 --> 01:02:59,639
Ridge and Montecito subdivisions.

1432
01:02:59,639 --> 01:03:03,849
Forest Ridge and Montecito were on the north side of Sharon

1433
01:03:03,849 --> 01:03:04,519
Rose.

1434
01:03:04,519 --> 01:03:09,480
Elementary schools at both ends, plus a Walmart on the

1435
01:03:09,480 --> 01:03:11,400
eastern end of it.

1436
01:03:11,400 --> 01:03:14,780
I noticed in the handout that we got this evening for next

1437
01:03:14,780 --> 01:03:16,800
meeting that a traffic analysis

1438
01:03:16,800 --> 01:03:19,719
is required, but the development would generate equal to or

1439
01:03:19,719 --> 01:03:21,760
more than 1,000 vehicle trips

1440
01:03:21,760 --> 01:03:22,760
per day.

1441
01:03:22,760 --> 01:03:26,119
Well, obviously, one development may or may not do that to

1442
01:03:26,119 --> 01:03:27,800
the size that we're talking

1443
01:03:27,800 --> 01:03:31,099
about, but when you look at all the developments that have

1444
01:03:31,099 --> 01:03:33,360
gone in, in a relatively short length

1445
01:03:33,360 --> 01:03:37,760
of road, I think that the least the city could do is to

1446
01:03:37,760 --> 01:03:40,920
perform a traffic survey, spend the

1447
01:03:40,920 --> 01:03:46,599
$896,000 that these guys are putting up, plus who knows how

1448
01:03:46,599 --> 01:03:49,320
much more Teasley and Ryan Meadows

1449
01:03:49,320 --> 01:03:53,840
has put up, and make it a full four-lane highway.

1450
01:03:53,840 --> 01:03:57,150
I don't know if that is a condition that we can add to

1451
01:03:57,150 --> 01:03:59,039
these people, or if it's something

1452
01:03:59,039 --> 01:04:04,630
that maybe needs to be tabled so that the city can do its

1453
01:04:04,630 --> 01:04:07,360
magic in making sure that

1454
01:04:07,360 --> 01:04:11,199
there is no additional impact done on Ryan Road to further

1455
01:04:11,199 --> 01:04:13,079
deteriorate the road, and

1456
01:04:13,079 --> 01:04:15,550
just make it more of a hassle, because what's going to

1457
01:04:15,550 --> 01:04:17,280
happen is, as every citizen in this

1458
01:04:17,280 --> 01:04:21,179
room can attest to, the one thing we all agree to is our

1459
01:04:21,179 --> 01:04:23,960
city's streets are not very good.

1460
01:04:23,960 --> 01:04:27,869
Why compound the problem to come in after the fact, after

1461
01:04:27,869 --> 01:04:29,920
all these subdivisions have

1462
01:04:29,920 --> 01:04:32,929
gone in, including the other two phases that they're going

1463
01:04:32,929 --> 01:04:34,400
to put in, and then we're going

1464
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:38,000
to tear up Ryan Road and make it a bigger hassle to get up

1465
01:04:38,000 --> 01:04:39,599
and down the street?

1466
01:04:39,599 --> 01:04:42,880
It just makes no sense to me.

1467
01:04:42,880 --> 01:04:43,880
Thank you.

1468
01:04:43,880 --> 01:04:44,880
Thank you.

1469
01:04:44,880 --> 01:04:45,880
Commissioner Beck.

1470
01:04:45,880 --> 01:04:46,880
Thank you, Chair.

1471
01:04:46,880 --> 01:04:49,280
And actually, Commissioner Sullivan kind of hit a lot of

1472
01:04:49,280 --> 01:04:50,639
what I wanted to address, too,

1473
01:04:50,639 --> 01:04:54,039
but I did want to go on record and see if we could give

1474
01:04:54,039 --> 01:04:56,360
some satisfaction to the people

1475
01:04:56,360 --> 01:04:59,739
that have to live out there, whether it's anybody in City

1476
01:04:59,739 --> 01:05:01,679
Night, Haley, Ron, that can

1477
01:05:01,679 --> 01:05:06,130
give us an idea when we could motivate whoever needs to be

1478
01:05:06,130 --> 01:05:08,480
to do a TIA, a traffic impact

1479
01:05:08,480 --> 01:05:09,480
analysis.

1480
01:05:09,480 --> 01:05:10,480
I agree.

1481
01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:13,570
It's frustrating to know that this road is going to be

1482
01:05:13,570 --> 01:05:15,679
widened eventually, but not knowing

1483
01:05:15,679 --> 01:05:17,679
when is frustrating.

1484
01:05:17,679 --> 01:05:22,059
We can't get a handle on that as well as we like, but a TIA

1485
01:05:22,059 --> 01:05:24,679
, it seems like, considering

1486
01:05:24,679 --> 01:05:27,130
all the development that's going on there, we should be

1487
01:05:27,130 --> 01:05:28,440
able to do that and be able to

1488
01:05:28,440 --> 01:05:32,719
give the citizens an answer when that will happen.

1489
01:05:32,719 --> 01:05:37,440
Ron, would you be the right person to ask on that?

1490
01:05:37,440 --> 01:05:42,179
Who would be the individual in the city that we could pick

1491
01:05:42,179 --> 01:05:45,000
on to try and get that started?

1492
01:05:45,000 --> 01:05:48,400
Commissioner, I'll try to attempt to answer that question.

1493
01:05:48,400 --> 01:05:52,159
Of course, right around has always been on our radar.

1494
01:05:52,159 --> 01:05:56,110
It's obviously part of our future mobility plan and

1495
01:05:56,110 --> 01:05:59,039
hopefully our CIP program as well.

1496
01:05:59,039 --> 01:06:03,849
I think the people that are in charge or are responsible

1497
01:06:03,849 --> 01:06:06,559
for that are listening, or if

1498
01:06:06,559 --> 01:06:11,010
they're not, we will definitely make sure that they hear

1499
01:06:11,010 --> 01:06:13,159
you and watch this video to

1500
01:06:13,159 --> 01:06:17,280
make sure that they hear what the concerns are along Ryan

1501
01:06:17,280 --> 01:06:18,159
Road is.

1502
01:06:18,159 --> 01:06:21,590
I'm wondering, would it be possible to, maybe Richard or

1503
01:06:21,590 --> 01:06:23,519
somebody can answer this, could

1504
01:06:23,519 --> 01:06:27,150
by our next P&Z meeting, could we have somebody maybe come

1505
01:06:27,150 --> 01:06:29,079
to the work session and give us

1506
01:06:29,079 --> 01:06:32,260
a little bit more detailed information that we can share

1507
01:06:32,260 --> 01:06:33,639
with the community?

1508
01:06:33,639 --> 01:06:34,639
Is that possible?

1509
01:06:34,639 --> 01:06:35,639
That's a higher-end project matrix.

1510
01:06:35,639 --> 01:06:36,639
I ask about that.

1511
01:06:36,639 --> 01:06:37,639
Yes.

1512
01:06:37,639 --> 01:06:41,480
In fact, at the next meeting, we'll be discussing the new

1513
01:06:41,480 --> 01:06:44,639
criteria manual and the capital improvements

1514
01:06:44,639 --> 01:06:49,360
director, city engineer, will be here at that meeting.

1515
01:06:49,360 --> 01:06:52,269
I will let him know to be prepared to answer those

1516
01:06:52,269 --> 01:06:53,239
questions.

1517
01:06:53,239 --> 01:06:54,239
Great.

1518
01:06:54,239 --> 01:06:55,239
Thank you.

1519
01:06:55,239 --> 01:06:56,239
Thanks, Ron.

1520
01:06:56,239 --> 01:06:57,239
Will that be Todd Estes?

1521
01:06:57,239 --> 01:06:58,239
It'll be Todd Estes.

1522
01:06:58,239 --> 01:06:59,239
The other contact person might be Jim Jenks?

1523
01:06:59,239 --> 01:07:00,239
Correct.

1524
01:07:00,239 --> 01:07:03,809
Those would be a couple of city staffers that would be in a

1525
01:07:03,809 --> 01:07:05,679
position to address some of

1526
01:07:05,679 --> 01:07:08,679
the questions here before us.

1527
01:07:08,679 --> 01:07:09,679
Commissioner Smith.

1528
01:07:09,679 --> 01:07:10,679
Thank you, Chair.

1529
01:07:10,679 --> 01:07:13,969
The TIA would be a great thing to do, but let's look at the

1530
01:07:13,969 --> 01:07:15,679
material facts, what we're

1531
01:07:15,679 --> 01:07:16,679
talking about tonight.

1532
01:07:16,679 --> 01:07:18,949
We're talking about a development that's ready to come in

1533
01:07:18,949 --> 01:07:19,320
now.

1534
01:07:19,320 --> 01:07:22,030
Even if the TIA comes back, as Richard's already mentioned,

1535
01:07:22,030 --> 01:07:23,880
there's further down Orion Road

1536
01:07:23,880 --> 01:07:28,369
if there wanted to be future expansion, we've got land that

1537
01:07:28,369 --> 01:07:30,559
still needs to be claimed.

1538
01:07:30,559 --> 01:07:32,670
We have to wait for either emino domain or have to wait for

1539
01:07:32,670 --> 01:07:33,880
replotting on those lands,

1540
01:07:33,880 --> 01:07:38,079
and you tell me when that's going to happen.

1541
01:07:38,079 --> 01:07:40,420
The expansion of Orion Road is unknown, and if we had to

1542
01:07:40,420 --> 01:07:41,800
put at least a timeline on it,

1543
01:07:41,800 --> 01:07:44,750
it's probably not within the next five years if I had to

1544
01:07:44,750 --> 01:07:46,599
make a wild guess off the cuff.

1545
01:07:46,599 --> 01:07:49,280
So sit here and say, "Let's get a TIA done."

1546
01:07:49,280 --> 01:07:52,099
The TIAs is going to come back and tell us exactly what we

1547
01:07:52,099 --> 01:07:53,039
already know.

1548
01:07:53,039 --> 01:07:54,039
It's bogged.

1549
01:07:54,039 --> 01:07:55,039
It's going to be bogged.

1550
01:07:55,039 --> 01:07:57,030
We're going to come back and say, "All right, we need to

1551
01:07:57,030 --> 01:07:58,000
expand Orion Road."

1552
01:07:58,000 --> 01:08:00,869
Okay, we're not going to be able to expand Orion Road

1553
01:08:00,869 --> 01:08:02,960
tomorrow or next week or next year.

1554
01:08:02,960 --> 01:08:06,030
So I just say put it up for consideration that, yes, while

1555
01:08:06,030 --> 01:08:07,840
the TIA and talk about expanding

1556
01:08:07,840 --> 01:08:10,480
Orion Road is great, it's not immediate.

1557
01:08:10,480 --> 01:08:12,380
It's not something that can be done quickly, and we have

1558
01:08:12,380 --> 01:08:13,519
something we have to vote on now

1559
01:08:13,519 --> 01:08:14,519
and talk about.

1560
01:08:14,519 --> 01:08:17,020
So not really anything more to add to it than just help

1561
01:08:17,020 --> 01:08:18,680
everyone understand and get some

1562
01:08:18,680 --> 01:08:22,199
clarity to the actual gravitas of the situation here.

1563
01:08:22,199 --> 01:08:26,539
If I can just add to that, just a reminder that this is a

1564
01:08:26,539 --> 01:08:29,239
preliminary plan, so this item

1565
01:08:29,239 --> 01:08:33,939
will come up for final, and I think that might give staff

1566
01:08:33,939 --> 01:08:36,680
some more time to address those

1567
01:08:36,680 --> 01:08:37,680
concerns.

1568
01:08:37,680 --> 01:08:38,680
Okay.

1569
01:08:38,680 --> 01:08:39,680
Commissioner Smith.

1570
01:08:39,680 --> 01:08:44,680
Motion to accept with the city staff's conditions.

1571
01:08:44,680 --> 01:08:50,439
Are there some conditions on that?

1572
01:08:50,439 --> 01:08:52,439
Recommendation for approval?

1573
01:08:52,439 --> 01:08:53,439
No.

1574
01:08:53,439 --> 01:08:54,439
That's it.

1575
01:08:54,439 --> 01:08:55,439
I think there were.

1576
01:08:55,439 --> 01:08:58,880
That's a with city staff condition on my motion.

1577
01:08:58,880 --> 01:09:00,359
The two that are presented in the back?

1578
01:09:00,359 --> 01:09:02,000
The two that are presented in the back, yes.

1579
01:09:02,000 --> 01:09:03,000
So with the city staff's recommendations.

1580
01:09:03,000 --> 01:09:05,100
Just for clarification for the guys in the back when they

1581
01:09:05,100 --> 01:09:05,840
do the records.

1582
01:09:05,840 --> 01:09:06,840
Yes, you're welcome.

1583
01:09:06,840 --> 01:09:10,189
So we have a motion to approve with the two conditions as

1584
01:09:10,189 --> 01:09:12,119
recommended in our backup.

1585
01:09:12,119 --> 01:09:13,119
Okay.

1586
01:09:13,119 --> 01:09:14,119
Commissioner Sanchez.

1587
01:09:14,119 --> 01:09:15,399
I second that.

1588
01:09:15,399 --> 01:09:18,239
We have a first and a second for approval.

1589
01:09:18,239 --> 01:09:21,239
Any discussion?

1590
01:09:21,239 --> 01:09:25,600
I'll make a comment before we vote.

1591
01:09:25,600 --> 01:09:29,630
I would echo Commissioner Sullivan's concerns about Ryan

1592
01:09:29,630 --> 01:09:32,399
Road and the improvements and a

1593
01:09:32,399 --> 01:09:36,859
lot of your points were discussed in great detail a number

1594
01:09:36,859 --> 01:09:39,319
or a couple years ago, I guess,

1595
01:09:39,319 --> 01:09:42,020
when the traffic impact fees came before us and were

1596
01:09:42,020 --> 01:09:43,279
adopted by the city.

1597
01:09:43,279 --> 01:09:45,850
There's a concern I expressed at the time is that we're

1598
01:09:45,850 --> 01:09:47,479
going to collect the fees, people

1599
01:09:47,479 --> 01:09:50,069
are going to move in, finally get enough money, and we're

1600
01:09:50,069 --> 01:09:51,479
going to tear up the roads.

1601
01:09:51,479 --> 01:09:55,920
And that's unfortunately the way that that moved forward.

1602
01:09:55,920 --> 01:09:58,409
And it's going to be, I think, the process for our city

1603
01:09:58,409 --> 01:10:00,319
going forward to play, unfortunately,

1604
01:10:00,319 --> 01:10:02,319
some catch up.

1605
01:10:02,319 --> 01:10:05,359
But these gentlemen are contributing a significant amount

1606
01:10:05,359 --> 01:10:07,439
of money to that effort above and beyond

1607
01:10:07,439 --> 01:10:10,399
two times what's currently required.

1608
01:10:10,399 --> 01:10:13,859
And so I think they're certainly paying their fair share

1609
01:10:13,859 --> 01:10:16,319
for their impact and their development.

1610
01:10:16,319 --> 01:10:19,529
And so with that, I'm going to support the motion and have

1611
01:10:19,529 --> 01:10:21,260
a comment from Commissioner

1612
01:10:21,260 --> 01:10:23,840
Sanchez.

1613
01:10:23,840 --> 01:10:26,250
I'm relatively new on this commission and it seems like

1614
01:10:26,250 --> 01:10:27,560
that's one of the big issues

1615
01:10:27,560 --> 01:10:31,050
we've had every time we talk about developments is that the

1616
01:10:31,050 --> 01:10:32,880
roads usually aren't going to

1617
01:10:32,880 --> 01:10:35,800
be done when the development is done.

1618
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:40,090
So I don't really see a solution until the funds, those

1619
01:10:40,090 --> 01:10:42,640
impact funds are collected.

1620
01:10:42,640 --> 01:10:46,060
So it just seems like you're not the only people that are

1621
01:10:46,060 --> 01:10:47,680
facing this every week or

1622
01:10:47,680 --> 01:10:49,600
every couple of weeks that we meet.

1623
01:10:49,600 --> 01:10:53,369
We find the same issue over and over again throughout the

1624
01:10:53,369 --> 01:10:54,000
city.

1625
01:10:54,000 --> 01:10:57,609
And there's no solution at this time other than when those

1626
01:10:57,609 --> 01:10:59,479
funds are collected and then

1627
01:10:59,479 --> 01:11:03,880
the city starts using those funds to be able to expand

1628
01:11:03,880 --> 01:11:05,199
these roads.

1629
01:11:05,199 --> 01:11:10,310
And just like Mr. Smith said, basically, you know, we don't

1630
01:11:10,310 --> 01:11:12,960
have the answer, but hopefully

1631
01:11:12,960 --> 01:11:19,819
as the as money to get collected, then those roads are

1632
01:11:19,819 --> 01:11:20,960
developed.

1633
01:11:20,960 --> 01:11:21,960
Commissioner Beck.

1634
01:11:21,960 --> 01:11:22,960
Thank you, Chair.

1635
01:11:22,960 --> 01:11:25,420
I just want to thank everybody for coming out tonight for

1636
01:11:25,420 --> 01:11:26,800
the citizens and making their

1637
01:11:26,800 --> 01:11:27,800
presentation.

1638
01:11:27,800 --> 01:11:32,189
You know, this commission needs a lot of input from the

1639
01:11:32,189 --> 01:11:33,479
people out there that we serve.

1640
01:11:33,479 --> 01:11:34,479
So I appreciate you coming down.

1641
01:11:34,479 --> 01:11:36,720
I appreciate Mr. Fletcher and Mr. Dickerson for their

1642
01:11:36,720 --> 01:11:38,279
presentation, for clearing up a lot

1643
01:11:38,279 --> 01:11:39,279
of things.

1644
01:11:39,279 --> 01:11:42,239
As Commissioner Smith suggested, and I know this is just a

1645
01:11:42,239 --> 01:11:44,079
preliminary plat, but community

1646
01:11:44,079 --> 01:11:47,760
meetings are always a great, great thing to do to offset a

1647
01:11:47,760 --> 01:11:49,000
lot of concern.

1648
01:11:49,000 --> 01:11:52,220
One of the one thing I did want to point out that I was

1649
01:11:52,220 --> 01:11:54,800
delighted to hear you mention is

1650
01:11:54,800 --> 01:11:58,680
the salvaging of I think 60, 65 percent of the trees.

1651
01:11:58,680 --> 01:12:01,800
Yeah, you could have removed a lot more by city standards.

1652
01:12:01,800 --> 01:12:04,010
The fact that you've done that, that pleases me

1653
01:12:04,010 --> 01:12:04,920
tremendously.

1654
01:12:04,920 --> 01:12:05,920
So I'm glad to hear that.

1655
01:12:05,920 --> 01:12:08,130
And I think everybody that lives in that area ought to

1656
01:12:08,130 --> 01:12:09,600
recognize the fact that it could

1657
01:12:09,600 --> 01:12:10,680
have been a lot worse.

1658
01:12:10,680 --> 01:12:13,779
So these gentlemen are being commended for salvaging what

1659
01:12:13,779 --> 01:12:15,119
they have done there.

1660
01:12:15,119 --> 01:12:17,119
So thank you for that.

1661
01:12:17,119 --> 01:12:21,310
Mr. Sullivan, I can understand the philosophy of, gosh,

1662
01:12:21,310 --> 01:12:22,920
that's not our role.

1663
01:12:22,920 --> 01:12:26,340
And gee, you know, the city works slow and this is what we

1664
01:12:26,340 --> 01:12:27,960
talked about forever.

1665
01:12:27,960 --> 01:12:32,949
But I don't understand the idea that current citizens

1666
01:12:32,949 --> 01:12:36,039
living in current houses have to

1667
01:12:36,039 --> 01:12:40,039
pay the price for the city not doing their job.

1668
01:12:40,039 --> 01:12:43,550
And so I don't see why it is we continue as a board to

1669
01:12:43,550 --> 01:12:46,000
approve developments when we know

1670
01:12:46,000 --> 01:12:49,510
darn good and well other people are going to be negatively

1671
01:12:49,510 --> 01:12:50,399
impacted.

1672
01:12:50,399 --> 01:12:54,159
And yet we use the idea of growth as the excuse.

1673
01:12:54,159 --> 01:12:55,359
You know what?

1674
01:12:55,359 --> 01:12:56,359
People are already here.

1675
01:12:56,359 --> 01:12:58,159
Let's take care of our own first.

1676
01:12:58,159 --> 01:13:01,920
If speculators want to come in and buy land and build

1677
01:13:01,920 --> 01:13:04,680
houses someday, great for them.

1678
01:13:04,680 --> 01:13:08,069
But meanwhile, I think we need to protect our citizens

1679
01:13:08,069 --> 01:13:08,720
first.

1680
01:13:08,720 --> 01:13:11,239
Thank you.

1681
01:13:11,239 --> 01:13:12,239
Commissioner Schmidt.

1682
01:13:12,239 --> 01:13:13,239
Thank you, Chair.

1683
01:13:13,239 --> 01:13:17,489
Anything on my motion or anything you would want to add to

1684
01:13:17,489 --> 01:13:19,560
a motion that would make it

1685
01:13:19,560 --> 01:13:21,399
better for the citizens who are currently there?

1686
01:13:21,399 --> 01:13:24,539
That's purely just an informational question that we can go

1687
01:13:24,539 --> 01:13:25,199
to vote.

1688
01:13:25,199 --> 01:13:26,239
It can be struck down.

1689
01:13:26,239 --> 01:13:28,939
If you bring up a motion or bring up a motion that sounds

1690
01:13:28,939 --> 01:13:30,560
that would be more amenable to

1691
01:13:30,560 --> 01:13:31,560
the situation.

1692
01:13:31,560 --> 01:13:32,560
Commissioner Sullivan.

1693
01:13:32,560 --> 01:13:36,000
I've been told that we can't do that.

1694
01:13:36,000 --> 01:13:38,659
So a condition would be we wait until the traffic impact

1695
01:13:38,659 --> 01:13:40,119
study is made for the entire

1696
01:13:40,119 --> 01:13:43,279
Ryan Road before any more construction is done.

1697
01:13:43,279 --> 01:13:48,399
That would be my motion.

1698
01:13:48,399 --> 01:13:49,399
Commissioner Schmidt.

1699
01:13:49,399 --> 01:13:50,840
Not to keep playing tennis ball here.

1700
01:13:50,840 --> 01:13:55,130
Legal, can you give just a public statement for Plenary Pl

1701
01:13:55,130 --> 01:13:55,760
att?

1702
01:13:55,760 --> 01:13:58,199
It's approved tonight, moves forward.

1703
01:13:58,199 --> 01:14:00,569
How much timeline, how much runway do we think we have to

1704
01:14:00,569 --> 01:14:01,840
be able to get a TIA in before

1705
01:14:01,840 --> 01:14:03,800
a final approval for this is done?

1706
01:14:03,800 --> 01:14:08,680
When would the final, do we have it scheduled already?

1707
01:14:08,680 --> 01:14:10,399
Final Platt?

1708
01:14:10,399 --> 01:14:12,760
I'd have Haley address the-

1709
01:14:12,760 --> 01:14:15,800
I think planning would have a better idea of the timeline.

1710
01:14:15,800 --> 01:14:16,800
The timeline.

1711
01:14:16,800 --> 01:14:17,800
Yeah.

1712
01:14:17,800 --> 01:14:20,159
There's two years between a preliminary plot and a final

1713
01:14:20,159 --> 01:14:21,560
plot before the preliminary would

1714
01:14:21,560 --> 01:14:25,039
expire and a new one would be required.

1715
01:14:25,039 --> 01:14:28,189
So that would be the potential timeframe in which that

1716
01:14:28,189 --> 01:14:29,239
could be done.

1717
01:14:29,239 --> 01:14:32,380
But I will say that the final plot for this is in review

1718
01:14:32,380 --> 01:14:33,960
with staff currently.

1719
01:14:33,960 --> 01:14:36,720
So fairly soon after the gas well plugging is complete, I

1720
01:14:36,720 --> 01:14:38,359
expect that that would be ready

1721
01:14:38,359 --> 01:14:40,319
to come before the board.

1722
01:14:40,319 --> 01:14:46,449
Do you know, I guess the question was talking months, weeks

1723
01:14:46,449 --> 01:14:46,880
?

1724
01:14:46,880 --> 01:14:49,520
It really depends on the gas well and the review of their

1725
01:14:49,520 --> 01:14:50,880
civil plans, but it would

1726
01:14:50,880 --> 01:14:53,520
most likely be within the next couple of months.

1727
01:14:53,520 --> 01:14:54,520
Okay.

1728
01:14:54,520 --> 01:14:55,520
And then-

1729
01:14:55,520 --> 01:14:56,520
But up to two years is possible.

1730
01:14:56,520 --> 01:14:59,819
I'm making a statement that would still come, the final

1731
01:14:59,819 --> 01:15:03,159
would come before this board again.

1732
01:15:03,159 --> 01:15:06,689
Just to clarify, the TIA would only relate to their project

1733
01:15:06,689 --> 01:15:06,960
.

1734
01:15:06,960 --> 01:15:07,960
Correct.

1735
01:15:07,960 --> 01:15:08,960
It would be for the entire-

1736
01:15:08,960 --> 01:15:09,960
Yeah.

1737
01:15:09,960 --> 01:15:14,039
And there's nothing we can add on to be able to request TIA

1738
01:15:14,039 --> 01:15:15,760
before we approve?

1739
01:15:15,760 --> 01:15:18,720
I think it would be difficult to have it for the entire

1740
01:15:18,720 --> 01:15:20,760
length considering that they are

1741
01:15:20,760 --> 01:15:24,659
contributing to the impact fee that they are, what was

1742
01:15:24,659 --> 01:15:27,479
negotiated part of that agreement.

1743
01:15:27,479 --> 01:15:30,380
Typically when you look at a road, it's designed to

1744
01:15:30,380 --> 01:15:32,560
obviously a certain capacity or it can

1745
01:15:32,560 --> 01:15:35,680
handle a certain amount of vehicles per lane.

1746
01:15:35,680 --> 01:15:39,229
It's kind of like the chicken or the egg type approach of

1747
01:15:39,229 --> 01:15:40,680
what comes first.

1748
01:15:40,680 --> 01:15:43,260
And it starts to, when it starts to, that level of service

1749
01:15:43,260 --> 01:15:44,600
starts to degrade, that's

1750
01:15:44,600 --> 01:15:49,119
typically when you'll see those improvements move forward.

1751
01:15:49,119 --> 01:15:51,090
With this one, it's a little bit more complicated because

1752
01:15:51,090 --> 01:15:52,279
there is right of way that needs to

1753
01:15:52,279 --> 01:15:56,380
be acquired as well as, if I'm not mistaken, there's some,

1754
01:15:56,380 --> 01:15:58,319
quite a bit of utility lines

1755
01:15:58,319 --> 01:16:00,579
that would probably need to be relocated as well.

1756
01:16:00,579 --> 01:16:04,640
So it's quite a bit of an undertaking.

1757
01:16:04,640 --> 01:16:09,989
And I'll just add or reaffirm that that traffic impact

1758
01:16:09,989 --> 01:16:13,479
study would be narrowly for that development

1759
01:16:13,479 --> 01:16:14,479
only.

1760
01:16:14,479 --> 01:16:15,479
Correct.

1761
01:16:15,479 --> 01:16:16,479
That's all you would get out of it.

1762
01:16:16,479 --> 01:16:19,289
It's going to be tough for us to be able to ask for a TIA

1763
01:16:19,289 --> 01:16:20,880
for an entire road whenever

1764
01:16:20,880 --> 01:16:21,880
it's a world.

1765
01:16:21,880 --> 01:16:23,500
We're only talking about the preliminary plotting for one

1766
01:16:23,500 --> 01:16:23,880
subject.

1767
01:16:23,880 --> 01:16:24,880
Correct.

1768
01:16:24,880 --> 01:16:25,880
Thank you.

1769
01:16:25,880 --> 01:16:28,880
I just want to exasperate all things publicly.

1770
01:16:28,880 --> 01:16:29,880
That's all.

1771
01:16:29,880 --> 01:16:33,880
We've got a motion before us and a second for approval with

1772
01:16:33,880 --> 01:16:36,239
the two conditions as mentioned

1773
01:16:36,239 --> 01:16:37,960
in backup.

1774
01:16:37,960 --> 01:16:50,390
And seeing more, any more discussion, I'm going to call for

1775
01:16:50,390 --> 01:16:54,880
a vote on the board.

1776
01:16:54,880 --> 01:16:58,439
Motion is going to carry four to one.

1777
01:16:58,439 --> 01:17:02,430
That will move us to our public hearing section this

1778
01:17:02,430 --> 01:17:03,399
evening.

1779
01:17:03,399 --> 01:17:12,539
Give the room a minute to clear if people are going to head

1780
01:17:12,539 --> 01:17:13,720
out.

1781
01:17:13,720 --> 01:17:25,680
Good luck on your project.

1782
01:17:25,680 --> 01:17:39,279
Members are coming out.

1783
01:17:39,279 --> 01:17:42,640
This time I'm going to move on on our agenda item 4A.

1784
01:17:42,640 --> 01:17:53,399
I'm going to open the public hearing for Z17-0025B.

1785
01:17:53,399 --> 01:17:55,840
This is the item that's going to be continued.

1786
01:17:55,840 --> 01:17:56,840
Commissioner Beck.

1787
01:17:56,840 --> 01:18:02,880
I move that we move this as it puts us forward to the date

1788
01:18:02,880 --> 01:18:06,119
certain of February 21st.

1789
01:18:06,119 --> 01:18:07,119
Awesome.

1790
01:18:07,119 --> 01:18:08,119
Good job.

1791
01:18:08,119 --> 01:18:09,119
Commissioner Smith.

1792
01:18:09,119 --> 01:18:10,119
I second.

1793
01:18:10,119 --> 01:18:11,119
All right.

1794
01:18:11,119 --> 01:18:14,840
We have a motion to continue to date certain of February

1795
01:18:14,840 --> 01:18:16,880
the 21st on this item.

1796
01:18:16,880 --> 01:18:20,310
We're going to leave it open so it does not need to be re-

1797
01:18:20,310 --> 01:18:21,239
noticed.

1798
01:18:21,239 --> 01:18:32,199
And I will call for a vote on the board.

1799
01:18:32,199 --> 01:18:35,479
That motion is going to carry five to zero.

1800
01:18:35,479 --> 01:18:39,369
As announced at the beginning of our meeting, our items 4B

1801
01:18:39,369 --> 01:18:41,840
and 4C, the woodlands on McKinney

1802
01:18:41,840 --> 01:18:46,439
Street have both been withdrawn and we do not have a date

1803
01:18:46,439 --> 01:18:48,199
certain on those.

1804
01:18:48,199 --> 01:18:51,960
That will conclude our public hearings items tonight and

1805
01:18:51,960 --> 01:18:54,079
that will move us to our project

1806
01:18:54,079 --> 01:18:58,640
matrix and concluding items.

1807
01:18:58,640 --> 01:18:59,640
Commissioner Smith.

1808
01:18:59,640 --> 01:19:00,640
Thank you, Chair.

1809
01:19:00,640 --> 01:19:03,840
Richard, is there any kind of conversation we can have, at

1810
01:19:03,840 --> 01:19:05,439
least during work session,

1811
01:19:05,439 --> 01:19:08,750
that would be around what power we have as a commission or

1812
01:19:08,750 --> 01:19:10,479
recommendation we can make

1813
01:19:10,479 --> 01:19:13,960
to City Council for developers to have more neighborhood

1814
01:19:13,960 --> 01:19:15,960
meetings and what scenarios we

1815
01:19:15,960 --> 01:19:16,960
can do that?

1816
01:19:16,960 --> 01:19:19,729
I think we have maybe a report from you guys on what we can

1817
01:19:19,729 --> 01:19:21,039
do to be able to try to put

1818
01:19:21,039 --> 01:19:22,039
that.

1819
01:19:22,039 --> 01:19:24,470
Make that a precedent because I think that's a question we

1820
01:19:24,470 --> 01:19:25,880
've been having quite a bit

1821
01:19:25,880 --> 01:19:29,060
during meetings, having a call to African up here, let's

1822
01:19:29,060 --> 01:19:30,560
talk to them real quick.

1823
01:19:30,560 --> 01:19:31,560
Have you had a neighborhood meeting?

1824
01:19:31,560 --> 01:19:32,560
Yes, you have.

1825
01:19:32,560 --> 01:19:33,560
No, you haven't.

1826
01:19:33,560 --> 01:19:35,189
And it seems like every single time it's been, yes, there's

1827
01:19:35,189 --> 01:19:37,600
been a neighborhood meeting,

1828
01:19:37,600 --> 01:19:40,800
it's just such a much smoother process.

1829
01:19:40,800 --> 01:19:41,800
Absolutely.

1830
01:19:41,800 --> 01:19:46,039
In fact, we have that as one of the items for the, as part

1831
01:19:46,039 --> 01:19:48,079
of the code update to sort

1832
01:19:48,079 --> 01:19:51,239
of formalize that more in the code.

1833
01:19:51,239 --> 01:19:54,399
Just to kind of give a for example, if you remember the

1834
01:19:54,399 --> 01:19:56,239
palladium, I was telling the

1835
01:19:56,239 --> 01:19:59,770
Chair earlier, we had quite a number of folks here speaking

1836
01:19:59,770 --> 01:20:00,840
against that.

1837
01:20:00,840 --> 01:20:03,840
Would you say which project that was again?

1838
01:20:03,840 --> 01:20:04,840
Could take me a minute.

1839
01:20:04,840 --> 01:20:09,079
This was the site on, it had a component of affordable

1840
01:20:09,079 --> 01:20:11,760
housing that was changing to NRMU

1841
01:20:11,760 --> 01:20:12,760
12.

1842
01:20:12,760 --> 01:20:17,760
This was loop and Poinsettia.

1843
01:20:17,760 --> 01:20:19,840
Sherman Drive, Poinsettia, and Harvard.

1844
01:20:19,840 --> 01:20:22,989
When that item came to council, there were the applicant

1845
01:20:22,989 --> 01:20:25,000
actually the very next day started

1846
01:20:25,000 --> 01:20:28,199
revising their plan, went out and met with the neighbors.

1847
01:20:28,199 --> 01:20:31,560
And when we had the public hearing in front of city council

1848
01:20:31,560 --> 01:20:33,199
, the two ladies that were

1849
01:20:33,199 --> 01:20:36,770
very outspoken, they were the only ones that showed up, sat

1850
01:20:36,770 --> 01:20:38,560
through five hours of public

1851
01:20:38,560 --> 01:20:41,289
hearing to get up to speak in support of the development is

1852
01:20:41,289 --> 01:20:42,720
the first thing I first time

1853
01:20:42,720 --> 01:20:45,520
I've ever seen that in my 22 years doing it.

1854
01:20:45,520 --> 01:20:46,840
But it goes to your point.

1855
01:20:46,840 --> 01:20:48,760
It goes, it goes a long way.

1856
01:20:48,760 --> 01:20:52,600
So we anytime an applicant comes forward now, we we've been

1857
01:20:52,600 --> 01:20:54,279
advising them it's really in

1858
01:20:54,279 --> 01:20:56,279
their best interest to meet to meet with the neighbors.

1859
01:20:56,279 --> 01:20:58,800
I don't think Commissioner Strange could probably sympath

1860
01:20:58,800 --> 01:20:59,640
ize with me here.

1861
01:20:59,640 --> 01:21:01,649
I'd hate to be going to the developers and having to throw

1862
01:21:01,649 --> 01:21:03,319
up another piece of red tape.

1863
01:21:03,319 --> 01:21:06,350
But I don't like adding more bureaucracy to bureaucracy

1864
01:21:06,350 --> 01:21:07,039
already.

1865
01:21:07,039 --> 01:21:10,180
But there are sometimes some new rules and regulations can

1866
01:21:10,180 --> 01:21:11,720
can speed up a process, you

1867
01:21:11,720 --> 01:21:13,600
had a rule to be able to speed up a process.

1868
01:21:13,600 --> 01:21:16,600
So yeah, we can have an update on it or if there's no need

1869
01:21:16,600 --> 01:21:18,479
for it, then I think it's

1870
01:21:18,479 --> 01:21:21,979
one of those, you know, if you know going into it, it's one

1871
01:21:21,979 --> 01:21:23,479
thing you can sort of plan

1872
01:21:23,479 --> 01:21:24,479
that in your schedule.

1873
01:21:24,479 --> 01:21:26,229
But if you know, an applicant comes in and we're through

1874
01:21:26,229 --> 01:21:27,199
the and then all of a sudden

1875
01:21:27,199 --> 01:21:28,199
we spring it on them.

1876
01:21:28,199 --> 01:21:30,960
Yeah, it's it's not I mean, it's not fair.

1877
01:21:30,960 --> 01:21:34,000
But we just need to be consistent in how we sure.

1878
01:21:34,000 --> 01:21:35,000
Thank you.

1879
01:21:35,000 --> 01:21:39,359
Anything else?

1880
01:21:39,359 --> 01:21:41,680
When is the item that I asked for?

1881
01:21:41,680 --> 01:21:44,869
I want to say it's been a few weeks ago, maybe before

1882
01:21:44,869 --> 01:21:45,840
Christmas.

1883
01:21:45,840 --> 01:21:48,069
That kind of the same thing we spent a lot of time on

1884
01:21:48,069 --> 01:21:50,239
tonight talking about whose responsibility

1885
01:21:50,239 --> 01:21:52,039
it is on all the painting.

1886
01:21:52,039 --> 01:21:54,720
Is that going to be next week's or that will be that will

1887
01:21:54,720 --> 01:21:58,399
be that will be part of the discussion

1888
01:21:58,399 --> 01:22:00,989
at the next work session with respect to the the

1889
01:22:00,989 --> 01:22:02,439
transportation manual.

1890
01:22:02,439 --> 01:22:03,439
Great.

1891
01:22:03,439 --> 01:22:04,439
Looking forward to that.

1892
01:22:04,439 --> 01:22:05,439
I'm getting that on.

1893
01:22:05,439 --> 01:22:06,439
OK, anything else?

1894
01:22:06,439 --> 01:22:11,210
OK, with that, I'm going to close us tonight at seven

1895
01:22:11,210 --> 01:22:12,800
thirty seven.

1896
01:22:12,800 --> 01:22:13,680
Thank you, everyone, for coming out.