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This meeting has been duly posted and we do have a quorum

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present and I will call

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us to order at 5 o 5 and I'll begin with starting with

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clarification of agenda

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items so we will go on to the consent agenda and I will

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call well I guess does

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anybody have questions on the consent agenda?

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Do you want to go through each item or just if we have

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questions?

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Yeah we do.

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You do? Okay well we'll just go through each item then and

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we'll address any questions and Haley will you come forward

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and give us an

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update on the consent agenda item A and I think you also

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have B, C, D.

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Yes sir.

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So we got pretty good odds.

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Commissioner Beck did you have a question on a particular

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item?

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Not on this one, on B I think it is.

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FP 17003329.

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Okay.

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Would you like me to go over item A?

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Well I'll just go over we've got a lot of people here today

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obviously so a lot of interest in what's on our agenda and

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we'll just do your standard quick presentation for work

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session and we'll see what questions come up.

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Okay so this is a preliminary plat for the Titus South

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development. It's located at the corner of Mosk Branch Road

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and Jim Crystal.

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This plat is for eight commercial lots and one common area

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lot that would be for drainage.

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Three of the lots have frontage here, I'm sorry four of the

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lots have frontage on Mosk Branch.

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The remaining lots are accessed by a common public access

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easement that you can see kind of winding through here.

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I can answer any questions about the plat if you have them.

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Okay.

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Not on that one.

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Okay.

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Thank you.

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We'll go on to B then.

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Okay.

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Item B is a final plat of four lots within the Razor Ranch

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South development.

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It's lot 17, I'm sorry five lots, lot 17 through 20 of

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block A and then lot one of block B which is a detention

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pond and drainage area.

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These lots are located along Panhandle Drive and Heritage

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Trail and I can answer any questions if you have them.

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Commissioner Beck.

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Thank you Chair.

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Julie for our clarification here.

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Could you focus in on lot 20 block A where it shows if you

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've got a bigger version of it.

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On my plans, it shows what appears to be two different

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outlines of storm drainage in close proximity to one

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another one being 105 square feet, the other 42 square feet

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.

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Am I reading this right?

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There's two different ones on this one lot close together.

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Yes, sir.

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Okay.

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So now is that supposed to serve the entire drainage for

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this entire plant for all four lots or?

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I'm going to look to Jim and see if he can speak more to

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the specifics of what those two drains would be serving.

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I'm trying to add the two storm drains here.

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I believe that those two storm drainage easements are

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basically, I would assume that they are being dedicated for

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future tie-ins of a private storm sewer system in that lot,

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the southern part of that lot, into the new public storm

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sewer that is going down that street, that north-south road

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.

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Okay.

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So I would assume that that's, I mean, we sort of have this

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throughout Razor Ranch water and sewer and storm.

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And I suspect that it's no different here that that's the

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intent.

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Well, my concern was they were so close together, so I'm

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assuming that the way everything designed here that water

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is going to flow in that general direction.

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Yes, sir.

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Okay.

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So I'm not sure that we can set up for that.

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And some of these are sort of leave-outs for the future.

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I don't know if that part of that lot, I don't think it's

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been designed out yet, but that's sort of a judicious

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location that the designer has left for an anticipated

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future connection to the storm sewer system.

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So this is subject to change if necessary?

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Yes.

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Okay.

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If absolutely necessary.

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Okay.

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Okay.

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And then the other thing I got, Ms. Mayor's Hayes, is the

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property line seemed to encompass Heritage Trail, that main

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road.

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They're on that side of it.

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Am I reading that right?

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And if that's the case, does this mean the developer will

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be responsible for developing this part of that road, on

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this stretch of the road?

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Yes, sir.

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Heritage Trail is within the boundaries of this property.

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The only other part of that is being dedicated by this plat

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en is right up there.

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Okay.

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So they're going to do it all at one time and not half on

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one side and then wait for the other side to develop?

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It's actually currently under design.

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Okay.

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Okay.

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Great.

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Thank you.

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Would you have that, sir?

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Recommendation.

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Recommendation.

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If we've got a move in.

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Okay.

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Anything else on this one?

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Anything else on B?

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[inaudible]

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Okay.

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How about item C?

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All right.

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So we need to announce that B is going to be pulled and go

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to individual.

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Because we've got a recommendation on item B that's going

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to be pulled from the consent agenda and that can become

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our, you want to make it item B then for individual

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consideration items to add that condition?

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Okay.

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Pardon me.

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What are you doing then?

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There's a condition on that.

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It actually is tied somewhat to your question if there has

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to be a tweak or a change on that storm drain.

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Gotcha.

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It can be handled at the RC level rather than having to

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come all the way back to PMZ.

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Okay.

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Thanks.

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To C. Thank you, Haley.

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All right.

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Okay.

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This is a final plan for eight residential lots that are

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located in the ETJ.

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So this property is situated at the corner of Hickory Hill

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Road and Bell Cote Circle.

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So these will be eight single family residential lots.

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Any questions on this one?

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Any questions on this?

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Commissioner Ellis.

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Thank you, Chair.

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It's more of a typo question.

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On the plat, it's got PRDCT instead of DRDCT.

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I don't know if that makes a difference, but the legend and

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the plat do not match.

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Thank you for pointing that out.

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You are welcome.

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Anything else on this one?

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Let's go on to D.

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Okay.

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This is a preliminary plat for a single lot.

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It's located on the south side of the Razor Ranch

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development.

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It actually has frontage on Panhandle, the service road,

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and Scripture Street on the south.

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Thank you.

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Anybody have a question on E?

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Does Julie need to come up on anything on that item?

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Okay.

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And if you want to stay there, we'll move on to 3A then.

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Okay.

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This item is a site plan for an entertainment center to be

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located in Razor Ranch.

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So the request is for approval of a site plan for an

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entertainment venue to be constructed on lot 17, block A,

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that we just saw on the final plat that we looked at.

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You can see general location outlined here in red.

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You may remember this property was recently part of a rez

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oning request.

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We brought it from the south mixed use district to the

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south RR2 district.

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To give you a better idea of where this is located, you can

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see the property is situated just south of the Embassy Suit

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es and Convention Center.

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It will be located just a little ways north of the future

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extension of Panhandle Drive.

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As we've discussed before, all site plans for properties

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within the south RR2 district of the Razor Ranch overlay

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are subject to certain architectural and landscape

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standards that are outlined in the overlay district.

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So with a site plan approval, they are required to submit a

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site plan, a landscape plan, and building elevations for

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your consideration.

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So to walk through the site plan we have here, it's a

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building is just over 41,000 square feet.

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Outlined in red are the areas where there will be 20

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bowling lanes.

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There's an arcade also proposed outlined here in green.

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There's an event space within the building that's in this

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blue box here.

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And then there's also a restaurant in the remainder of the

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building.

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There will be a total of 165 parking spaces as it's shown

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here.

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151 would be the minimum requirement, but Razor Ranch doesn

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't have a maximum on the parking, so they're able to go over

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that minimum.

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There are bicycle racks proposed on the site.

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They'll be located here just outside the building.

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And this will be accessed from two internal private drives.

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You have what's called Private Drive C here on the side and

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Private Road A will be over here.

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And then looking at their landscape plan,

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they're proposing a site that would have just over 16%

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landscaping, 50% mature tree canopy.

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You can see all the areas in green would be landscaping

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throughout the parking lot and around the building.

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They're also proposing about 4,800 square feet of plaza

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area located outside the building here on the south side.

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That will contain benches, tables, some shade structures,

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and as well as some landscape plantings.

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To give you an idea of what the building will look like,

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this is the elevation for the south side.

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So that would be the front of the building and well as the

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left or the west side of the building here on the bottom.

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And then this would be the back side of the building, so

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the north side and the east side of the building.

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The Razor Ranch Overlay District outlines criteria for

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approval for their site plans.

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The site plan shall substantially comply with the concept

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and schematic plan that was approved by council.

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The site plan provides for a compatible arrangement of

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buildings and land uses that won't adversely affect

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neighboring properties.

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Provides for adequate and safe circulation of vehicular

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traffic and complies with all sections of the overlay.

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And staff through our analysis and study of the site plan

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found that we have met these conditions.

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>> Commissioner Sullivan.

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>> Anytime something comes in along the service road here,

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I'm concerned about the traffic.

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And even though the main entrance is on a smaller road,

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they all gotta get there somehow, they all have to leave

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somehow.

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00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:06,480
And that's either through Bonnie Bray or the service road.

251
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And anytime you want to look at the service road on Google

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Map, you see all the backup, the red line is always there.

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I think it's, so what's gonna happen to that intersection

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and to Bonnie Bray and

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all of that to alleviate any traffic concerns that the

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residential area is gonna have in this building.

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I mean, I think it's great to have a rec center there.

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I think it's great to have the bowling lanes and all those

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things.

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But I'm just concerned about the traffic getting to and

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from.

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And what that's going to do to already a bad traffic

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situation.

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>> Certainly, so there would be multiple means of access to

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the site.

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Just to walk through a few of them, we have the service

267
00:12:54,480 --> 00:12:56,480
road here, as we've mentioned.

268
00:12:56,480 --> 00:12:58,610
There will also be heritage trail that is under

269
00:12:58,610 --> 00:13:01,740
construction and design right now that will also be a north

270
00:13:01,740 --> 00:13:04,480
south option off of university.

271
00:13:04,480 --> 00:13:06,480
And then Bonnie Bray is also under improvement.

272
00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:09,480
This phase is, I believe, under design right now.

273
00:13:09,480 --> 00:13:12,710
So within the next few years, Bonnie Bray will be widened

274
00:13:12,710 --> 00:13:14,480
and expanded in this area.

275
00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:17,440
And then there will also be Panhandle Road on the south

276
00:13:17,440 --> 00:13:20,480
that would provide some cross connectivity there.

277
00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:24,480
>> What's the few years versus the construction for this?

278
00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:28,240
>> I believe they're looking in the ballpark, 2020, 2021,

279
00:13:28,240 --> 00:13:30,480
somewhere in that range for Bonnie Bray.

280
00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:34,480
So potentially for a few years, it would be kind of tight.

281
00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:37,909
But you do have multiple means of access east, west, and

282
00:13:37,909 --> 00:13:41,480
north, south in this area that would provide options.

283
00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:42,480
>> Commissioner Smith.

284
00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:43,480
>> Thank you, Chair.

285
00:13:43,480 --> 00:13:46,100
Commissioner Sullivan, I think if you look at the Google

286
00:13:46,100 --> 00:13:49,470
Maps, the exit off of 35 to go to 380, if that's what your

287
00:13:49,470 --> 00:13:51,480
real concern is, where the backup is there.

288
00:13:51,480 --> 00:13:54,240
That is much further up from where the site that we're in

289
00:13:54,240 --> 00:13:55,480
conversation about.

290
00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:57,940
So they'd have to exit off at Oak Street to be able to get

291
00:13:57,940 --> 00:13:58,480
there.

292
00:13:58,480 --> 00:13:59,480
>> I understand.

293
00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:02,629
>> But when they leave there, they want to go back home

294
00:14:02,629 --> 00:14:06,519
south, they've got to get on the service road, get into the

295
00:14:06,519 --> 00:14:11,840
Mixmaster stuff at the university to then come around and

296
00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:13,480
go back south on 35.

297
00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:17,240
>> Sure. >> Or they go on Bonnie Bray, which is a four lane

298
00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:21,519
road when it turns into, when you get down to scripture, it

299
00:14:21,519 --> 00:14:22,480
's terrible.

300
00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:26,240
I mean, it just doesn't make sense why all of those roads

301
00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:29,990
aren't being done at the same time that we're planning on

302
00:14:29,990 --> 00:14:35,590
having how many more cars, 165 cars potentially enter that

303
00:14:35,590 --> 00:14:36,480
area.

304
00:14:36,480 --> 00:14:38,480
It just doesn't make sense to me.

305
00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:39,480
>> Okay.

306
00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:42,480
>> I'm not against the development.

307
00:14:42,480 --> 00:14:45,399
I just wish the roads and streets would get built out, the

308
00:14:45,399 --> 00:14:48,389
infrastructure would get built out at the same time so we

309
00:14:48,389 --> 00:14:51,250
don't have the same mess that we have every time something

310
00:14:51,250 --> 00:14:52,480
happens like this.

311
00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:54,480
That's all.

312
00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:55,480
>> Commissioner Beck.

313
00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:56,480
>> Thank you, Chair.

314
00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:59,480
I think the answer to all this is bicycles.

315
00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:01,929
I'm glad, I'm delighted that there's bicycle racks there

316
00:15:01,929 --> 00:15:04,279
and this will encourage people to bike there and they can

317
00:15:04,279 --> 00:15:05,480
avoid all that traffic.

318
00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:07,480
So that's one solution.

319
00:15:07,480 --> 00:15:11,070
My only concern here, or just question, really, the site

320
00:15:11,070 --> 00:15:14,799
plan shows six parking spaces that are proposed 165 for

321
00:15:14,799 --> 00:15:16,480
handicapped parking.

322
00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:19,480
So I'm assuming that's meeting a minimum requirement?

323
00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:20,480
>> Yes, sir. >> Okay.

324
00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:21,480
Okay.

325
00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:22,480
Thank you.

326
00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:23,480
>> Commissioner Rozell.

327
00:15:23,480 --> 00:15:25,480
>> Thank you, Chair.

328
00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:29,259
I have one question that I think is going to be stopped by

329
00:15:29,259 --> 00:15:32,990
the overlay, but you said that there's not a maximum

330
00:15:32,990 --> 00:15:36,480
parking requirement for this entire overlay.

331
00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:40,250
Within the overlay ordinance for razor ranch, they have to

332
00:15:40,250 --> 00:15:44,129
meet the city minimums of our code, but they are allowed to

333
00:15:44,129 --> 00:15:47,480
exceed that parking as much as they choose.

334
00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:49,480
There are landscape standards that come into play, though.

335
00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:52,909
They're required to have a landscape island every 15 spaces

336
00:15:52,909 --> 00:15:55,899
, end caps with landscaping and things like that to help

337
00:15:55,899 --> 00:15:57,480
enhance the parking lots.

338
00:15:57,480 --> 00:16:00,769
>> Yes, so I don't know if there's anything we can do with

339
00:16:00,769 --> 00:16:03,860
this project, but I just know the shopping center at

340
00:16:03,860 --> 00:16:07,070
University in Carroll is a concrete jungle because there's

341
00:16:07,070 --> 00:16:09,470
not a maximum parking requirement for them and they just

342
00:16:09,470 --> 00:16:10,480
pave the entire thing.

343
00:16:10,480 --> 00:16:13,169
And I would hate to see razor ranch turn into a ton of

344
00:16:13,169 --> 00:16:15,480
excess concrete when it's not needed.

345
00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:19,259
So 14 spaces isn't too much, but it's still probably a

346
00:16:19,259 --> 00:16:21,480
couple thousand square feet.

347
00:16:21,480 --> 00:16:22,480
>> Yes, sir.

348
00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:25,480
>> So that has a little pause in just future development.

349
00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:29,399
Maybe the city can think about ways to council development

350
00:16:29,399 --> 00:16:31,480
not to have excess parking.

351
00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:34,490
The other question I had, because that wasn't really a

352
00:16:34,490 --> 00:16:38,480
question, is on the elevations, can you show me this?

353
00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:42,480
So on the southwest, is that a massive poster?

354
00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:44,480
What is the proposal there?

355
00:16:44,480 --> 00:16:48,669
>> That will be a still graphic that will be on the side of

356
00:16:48,669 --> 00:16:50,480
the building there.

357
00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:53,840
It will be required to go through a sign permit, but it is

358
00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:57,159
intended to be a static graphic on the side of the building

359
00:16:57,159 --> 00:16:57,480
.

360
00:16:57,480 --> 00:16:59,480
>> And it wraps around to the side, it looks like.

361
00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:00,480
>> Yes.

362
00:17:00,480 --> 00:17:04,259
>> So that's outside our, within the elevation requirements

363
00:17:04,259 --> 00:17:07,750
, they're allowed to put a billboard more or less on the

364
00:17:07,750 --> 00:17:09,480
side of their building?

365
00:17:09,480 --> 00:17:12,839
>> Yeah, they have signed standards, so it can't exceed, I

366
00:17:12,839 --> 00:17:16,480
believe, I think 30% of the total building can be signed.

367
00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:20,250
I would have to look into that to confirm that number, but

368
00:17:20,250 --> 00:17:23,480
yes, they are allowed graphics of this nature.

369
00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:26,480
>> Okay, thanks.

370
00:17:26,480 --> 00:17:28,480
>> Commissioner Sanchez.

371
00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:30,480
>> My question was also on the parking.

372
00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:33,480
How do they come up with a number?

373
00:17:33,480 --> 00:17:38,940
I know last week, I mean, at our last meeting, on one of

374
00:17:38,940 --> 00:17:42,480
the construction sites, areas that were being constructed

375
00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:43,480
building,

376
00:17:43,480 --> 00:17:48,480
there was like one parking lot for every 420 square feet.

377
00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,769
How do they arrive at here as how many parking lots, how

378
00:17:51,769 --> 00:17:54,480
many parking spaces there's going to be?

379
00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:57,240
>> So there are different ratios for the different uses

380
00:17:57,240 --> 00:17:58,480
within the building.

381
00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:01,569
So I believe there is, I don't have the full site plan here

382
00:18:01,569 --> 00:18:04,059
on the screen, but if you look, there's a parking tab

383
00:18:04,059 --> 00:18:07,029
ulation table on the site plan that walks through what the

384
00:18:07,029 --> 00:18:08,480
different ratios are.

385
00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:12,109
So many parking spaces for each bowling lane, for each seat

386
00:18:12,109 --> 00:18:13,480
in the restaurant.

387
00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:17,500
It is looked at depending on each individual use within the

388
00:18:17,500 --> 00:18:18,480
building.

389
00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:20,480
There's a different ratio applied to each use.

390
00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:25,480
>> Okay.

391
00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:26,480
>> Commissioner Ellis.

392
00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:27,480
>> Thank you, Chair.

393
00:18:27,480 --> 00:18:32,140
Haley, what is the percentage of landscaping that a site

394
00:18:32,140 --> 00:18:35,480
must have in the razor ranch overlay?

395
00:18:35,480 --> 00:18:36,480
>> Let me grab my files real quick.

396
00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:57,480
>> Thanks.

397
00:18:57,480 --> 00:19:04,349
>> For this district, it is 10% landscape area and 20% tree

398
00:19:04,349 --> 00:19:05,480
canopy.

399
00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:12,480
Any other questions for Haley on this item?

400
00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:16,869
>> And just for housekeeping purposes, we do have the one

401
00:19:16,869 --> 00:19:20,480
item that was our 2B consent agenda item.

402
00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:25,839
That's FP 17-0023 and that will now be moved to our item B

403
00:19:25,839 --> 00:19:29,480
under items of individual consideration.

404
00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:35,480
>> That will move us on to public hearings.

405
00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:44,480
Haley.

406
00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:45,480
>> Okay.

407
00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:47,299
So items A and B are for the same site, so I've combined

408
00:19:47,299 --> 00:19:52,099
this into one presentation for you to try to keep things a

409
00:19:52,099 --> 00:19:54,480
little simpler.

410
00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:59,740
We have two requests for this site, the first being a rez

411
00:19:59,740 --> 00:20:03,480
oning from ICE district to NRMU district.

412
00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:06,750
And the second being an SUP request, so a specific use

413
00:20:06,750 --> 00:20:08,480
permit for two different uses.

414
00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:11,400
Multi-family use on a portion of the property and outdoor

415
00:20:11,400 --> 00:20:13,480
recreation use on another portion.

416
00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:17,480
In total, the site is just over 72 acres.

417
00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:21,710
Located on the west side of town, on the south side of Oak

418
00:20:21,710 --> 00:20:24,480
Street, and along the rail line.

419
00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:29,339
Looking at the future land use, this area is designated as

420
00:20:29,339 --> 00:20:31,480
industrial commerce.

421
00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:34,519
The intent of that designation being to promote both light

422
00:20:34,519 --> 00:20:37,480
and heavy industrial uses in and around the airport.

423
00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:41,920
The proposed NRMU district does not meet the intent of that

424
00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:44,480
future land use designation.

425
00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:47,599
So when a rezoning request doesn't conform to the future

426
00:20:47,599 --> 00:20:50,839
land use map, the Denton Development Code does provide

427
00:20:50,839 --> 00:20:53,480
additional criteria that we're charged with looking at.

428
00:20:53,480 --> 00:20:56,670
These criteria are intended to balance a lot of competing

429
00:20:56,670 --> 00:20:59,599
interests, public health, safety, and the general welfare

430
00:20:59,599 --> 00:21:02,480
of the public against the right to the use of the property.

431
00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:05,839
These criteria include the existing land use pattern,

432
00:21:05,839 --> 00:21:09,220
whether or not an isolated zoning district would be created

433
00:21:09,220 --> 00:21:09,480
.

434
00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:12,480
Is there adequate infrastructure to serve the property?

435
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:14,480
Any potential environmental impacts?

436
00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:16,480
And then just the overall character of the district.

437
00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:20,250
So we'll kind of go through those and look at some maps to

438
00:21:20,250 --> 00:21:22,480
see what we have going on here.

439
00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:25,960
One of those being that the site is within the West Park

440
00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:28,480
Tax Increment Reinvestment Zone.

441
00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:32,500
So that's an approximately 800 acre area that you can see

442
00:21:32,500 --> 00:21:34,480
all hatched here on the map.

443
00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:37,829
The intent of the TERS is to promote industrial development

444
00:21:37,829 --> 00:21:40,500
in this area by providing some incentives to help

445
00:21:40,500 --> 00:21:43,900
compensate for the cost of public infrastructure that is

446
00:21:43,900 --> 00:21:49,480
required to help support this development.

447
00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:52,759
Looking at what's going on in the area in terms of zoning

448
00:21:52,759 --> 00:21:56,220
and uses, you see the subject property and much of the

449
00:21:56,220 --> 00:21:58,480
property to the north and south.

450
00:21:58,480 --> 00:21:59,480
Commissioner Beck.

451
00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:00,480
Thank you, Chair.

452
00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:04,779
I have a question here concerning the TERS. So it's

453
00:22:04,779 --> 00:22:07,480
explicitly for industrial development, is that correct?

454
00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:09,480
That is the stated intent of the TERS.

455
00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:14,450
And just for the record, not for an NRMU usage, as the

456
00:22:14,450 --> 00:22:19,480
applicant wants to do for multifamily dwellings.

457
00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:22,460
I can speak to the intent of it is to promote industrial

458
00:22:22,460 --> 00:22:23,480
development.

459
00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:26,480
So this would be outside the intent of that.

460
00:22:26,480 --> 00:22:27,480
Okay, thanks.

461
00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:35,480
I can read the mission statement.

462
00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:41,089
The mission of the Tax Increment Reinvestment Zone number

463
00:22:41,089 --> 00:22:43,869
two is to provide a source of funding for public

464
00:22:43,869 --> 00:22:46,480
infrastructure improvements to encourage and accelerate

465
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:50,029
necessary development within the largest industrial zoned

466
00:22:50,029 --> 00:22:51,480
area within the city.

467
00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:55,480
That's the mission statement.

468
00:22:55,480 --> 00:22:57,480
Commissioner Beck.

469
00:22:57,480 --> 00:22:59,480
Does that go along with what I was saying then?

470
00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:02,480
It kind of negates anything outside of industrial use?

471
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:03,480
Correct.

472
00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:05,480
I'm going to call them legal.

473
00:23:05,480 --> 00:23:08,480
If I could chime in just a minute.

474
00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:11,640
The intention is that it would promote the industrial, but

475
00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:14,740
that's not to the exclusion of all else, because it's the

476
00:23:14,740 --> 00:23:16,480
least restrictive.

477
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:24,440
So you're going to be able to have whatever accumulation is

478
00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:26,480
under that. So we anticipate that there are going to be

479
00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:26,480
commercial uses in that area, for example.

480
00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:29,910
And I think that there is a current agreement for the TERS

481
00:23:29,910 --> 00:23:33,640
that contemplates that, that there would be industrial and

482
00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:34,480
commercial.

483
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:39,930
Okay, my concern, I guess, here is, and I'm not trying to

484
00:23:39,930 --> 00:23:43,779
jump ahead, but to me this proposal is a round peg trying

485
00:23:43,779 --> 00:23:45,480
to fit a square hole.

486
00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:51,980
But should this thing go forward, then I guess, are you

487
00:23:51,980 --> 00:23:56,400
saying, Jennifer, that the money from TERS could be used

488
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,480
for this multifamily development?

489
00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:03,670
That's exactly what would happen. I think the reimbursement

490
00:24:03,670 --> 00:24:06,509
agreement, the money goes to RASER, but I think there might

491
00:24:06,509 --> 00:24:07,480
be a pass-through.

492
00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,670
But you can ask the applicant when we go into regular

493
00:24:10,670 --> 00:24:11,480
session.

494
00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:14,480
Okay, thanks.

495
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:17,480
Okay.

496
00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:18,480
All right.

497
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:20,480
Commissioner Sullivan.

498
00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:25,789
Quick question. It seems like the major thing that I see

499
00:24:25,789 --> 00:24:29,480
here is a lake pond retention something.

500
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:33,480
How is that going to fit into the overall scheme?

501
00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:39,700
And I guess being neighborhood, might be less runoff, less

502
00:24:39,700 --> 00:24:42,480
waste than industrial?

503
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:47,000
So you're correct, there is. I believe it's about 15 acres

504
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:52,069
of pond associated zone X flood plain and environmentally

505
00:24:52,069 --> 00:24:55,480
sensitive area that all surround the pond.

506
00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:59,670
So as far as the drainage and runoff from the site, when

507
00:24:59,670 --> 00:25:02,539
they're going through the planning process, they will

508
00:25:02,539 --> 00:25:06,480
analyze what the best plan is for that.

509
00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:08,789
But I would anticipate that it would drain to the pond in

510
00:25:08,789 --> 00:25:11,240
general, as the site does currently based on the topography

511
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:11,480
.

512
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:19,089
Well, I'm guessing neighborhood would be a better fit than

513
00:25:19,089 --> 00:25:20,480
industrial.

514
00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:24,859
I mean, I'm just guessing that there's a lot less waste

515
00:25:24,859 --> 00:25:27,480
that could go into that area.

516
00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:31,960
If it were homes or apartments, then it would be from

517
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:35,480
factories, car washes or whatever.

518
00:25:35,480 --> 00:25:37,789
I would imagine that's correct, but not sure of the

519
00:25:37,789 --> 00:25:38,480
specifics.

520
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:40,480
Thank you.

521
00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:42,480
Commissioner Sanchez.

522
00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:47,440
Yes. When you were talking about the 800 acres of

523
00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:50,890
industrial designation, and it also talks about

524
00:25:50,890 --> 00:25:52,480
environmental impacts.

525
00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:56,269
Now, when you looked at the 800 acres, did somebody go out

526
00:25:56,269 --> 00:25:59,359
there and actually look at it and say, okay, these areas

527
00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:02,509
within this 800 acres, or there's different topography,

528
00:26:02,509 --> 00:26:04,480
there's different issues.

529
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:07,829
Are we going to look at that and say, you know, not the

530
00:26:07,829 --> 00:26:10,480
whole 800 acres are identical.

531
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:15,069
And so each area has to be looked at, just not designate

532
00:26:15,069 --> 00:26:19,779
the whole 800 acres, without doing some type of impact

533
00:26:19,779 --> 00:26:20,480
study.

534
00:26:20,480 --> 00:26:24,250
As are they all equal, or is there some areas that are much

535
00:26:24,250 --> 00:26:25,480
more sensitive?

536
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,950
Yes. So the 800 acres that's shown here, that's just the

537
00:26:28,950 --> 00:26:30,480
boundary of the towers.

538
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:33,839
Of course, each site will have to be looked at individually

539
00:26:33,839 --> 00:26:37,480
as it develops, based on the unique conditions of the site.

540
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:41,539
In terms of one of the considerations for the rezoning

541
00:26:41,539 --> 00:26:46,440
approval, environmental, potential environmental impacts on

542
00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:51,089
this particular site are a concern that should be looked at

543
00:26:51,089 --> 00:26:52,480
, certainly.

544
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,910
One thing to point out, you might want to go through the SU

545
00:26:55,910 --> 00:26:59,349
P, because the lake is actually not a component of the SUP

546
00:26:59,349 --> 00:27:00,480
application. It is excluded from that.

547
00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:03,230
From the SUP, that's correct. It is within the boundaries

548
00:27:03,230 --> 00:27:07,480
of the rezoning request, which covers the whole 72 acres.

549
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:10,579
What difference does that make? Commissioner Smith. Thank

550
00:27:10,579 --> 00:27:11,480
you, Chair. What difference does that make?

551
00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:14,910
It has rights to other, I'm not sure if there can be convey

552
00:27:14,910 --> 00:27:17,480
ance. Maybe that's a question the applicant can ask for.

553
00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:20,710
There's specific rights to that water, so I don't know if

554
00:27:20,710 --> 00:27:23,480
conveyance from that site could go to that.

555
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:26,220
Again, that's a question for the applicant, and we would

556
00:27:26,220 --> 00:27:28,539
look at that at Platting, but it is not part of this

557
00:27:28,539 --> 00:27:29,480
application.

558
00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:31,869
Well, and one thing the Chair wants to step in is this is

559
00:27:31,869 --> 00:27:35,390
going to be a public hearing item, so the applicant will be

560
00:27:35,390 --> 00:27:38,829
able to speak, and they'll have their engineer, and a lot

561
00:27:38,829 --> 00:27:41,480
of these questions that we're kind of getting off on,

562
00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:43,930
we can actually address to somebody that can answer those

563
00:27:43,930 --> 00:27:46,569
questions. So let's try to get through the presentation and

564
00:27:46,569 --> 00:27:48,240
the high points, and then we'll get into some of these

565
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:50,910
details when we get into our public session with the

566
00:27:50,910 --> 00:27:53,480
applicant to address them specifically.

567
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:56,480
So if you'll please continue. Thank you, Hayley. Certainly.

568
00:27:56,480 --> 00:28:00,759
Yeah, so looking at the compatibility of the rezoning

569
00:28:00,759 --> 00:28:03,660
request, the subject property and properties to the north

570
00:28:03,660 --> 00:28:05,480
and south are within the ICE district.

571
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:08,930
There are existing industrial facilities developed both to

572
00:28:08,930 --> 00:28:11,480
the south and the east along the rail line.

573
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:14,319
Just a few specifics, there's the Benning Keith Dist

574
00:28:14,319 --> 00:28:17,910
ribution Center reader link distribution, 84 lumber to the

575
00:28:17,910 --> 00:28:18,480
north.

576
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:22,480
We also have the ICG district to the west of the property.

577
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:24,480
You can see here the Peterbilt site.

578
00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:27,569
There's several Gaswell sites and quite a large chunk of

579
00:28:27,569 --> 00:28:29,480
undeveloped land in this area.

580
00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:33,089
If you cross I-35, you'll see a much larger mix of zoning

581
00:28:33,089 --> 00:28:36,660
districts, just some high points. There is Razor Ranch here

582
00:28:36,660 --> 00:28:38,480
to the northeast for orientation.

583
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,839
There is the hospital, quite a bit of residential

584
00:28:41,839 --> 00:28:45,759
development, and then the UNT campus here and UNT Stadium

585
00:28:45,759 --> 00:28:47,480
here to the southeast.

586
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:52,900
Looking at how access would be provided to the site, one

587
00:28:52,900 --> 00:28:56,640
condition, there is an existing rail line that runs along

588
00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:58,480
the east boundary of the property.

589
00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:01,829
We have Oak Street, which turns into Jim Crystal here on

590
00:29:01,829 --> 00:29:04,480
the north, which is a primary arterial.

591
00:29:04,480 --> 00:29:07,970
Currently, two-lane undivided roadway intended based on its

592
00:29:07,970 --> 00:29:11,480
classification to eventually be a six-lane divided road.

593
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:14,690
All dedication and improvements required for this

594
00:29:14,690 --> 00:29:18,480
development would be determined at the time of platting.

595
00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:21,099
Precision Drive currently extends just up to the southern

596
00:29:21,099 --> 00:29:22,480
boundary of the property.

597
00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:25,730
It is intended to be extended north as part of this

598
00:29:25,730 --> 00:29:29,250
development, and that is intended to be developed as a two-

599
00:29:29,250 --> 00:29:31,730
lane undivided roadway per its classification as a

600
00:29:31,730 --> 00:29:33,480
commercial mixed-use collector.

601
00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:38,019
Now looking into the specifics of what they're hoping to do

602
00:29:38,019 --> 00:29:42,210
on the property, they've applied for an SUP for two uses,

603
00:29:42,210 --> 00:29:43,480
as I mentioned.

604
00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:47,480
So we have two phases of multifamily development proposed.

605
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:49,480
Here in green would be phase one.

606
00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:52,440
The red area represents phase two of the multifamily

607
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:53,480
development.

608
00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:56,960
In total, that's about 32 and a half acres of the property

609
00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:59,480
that would be dedicated to multifamily.

610
00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:03,480
Phase one is proposed as 189 units.

611
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:08,240
That would be 700 bedrooms, a density of about 8.8 dwelling

612
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:09,480
units per acre.

613
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:13,690
Phase two would contain an additional 100 units, 376

614
00:30:13,690 --> 00:30:17,349
bedrooms, and again, be just under nine dwelling units per

615
00:30:17,349 --> 00:30:18,480
acre in density.

616
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:22,240
Then phase three of the development is the proposed outdoor

617
00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:23,480
recreation use.

618
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:26,309
It would be on approximately 20 acres of land on the south

619
00:30:26,309 --> 00:30:27,480
side of the property.

620
00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:31,009
And as it's shown here, would contain approximately five

621
00:30:31,009 --> 00:30:33,480
ball fields and associated parking.

622
00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:36,630
The remaining area of the property, the balance of the acre

623
00:30:36,630 --> 00:30:39,480
age being the large lake that's in the middle of it,

624
00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:43,670
I've outlined in blue the boundaries of the riparian buffer

625
00:30:43,670 --> 00:30:47,799
environmentally sensitive area that is associated with the

626
00:30:47,799 --> 00:30:51,480
lake and the upstream and downstream of the lake.

627
00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:53,900
And as Richard mentioned, that is excluded from the SUP

628
00:30:53,900 --> 00:30:54,480
request.

629
00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:55,480
They're not providing-

630
00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:56,480
Commissioner Smith.

631
00:30:56,480 --> 00:30:57,480
Thank you, Chair.

632
00:30:57,480 --> 00:30:58,480
Either of those uses in that area.

633
00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:02,480
So can you give us stream flow on the blue lines there?

634
00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:04,960
Just in regards to the recreation area, would that come

635
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:07,119
into an area where that lake flooded, that those

636
00:31:07,119 --> 00:31:09,630
recreational areas will be flooded too because they're

637
00:31:09,630 --> 00:31:10,480
downstream?

638
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:13,480
I believe that's downstream, yeah.

639
00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:16,119
So I'm not sure of the conditions there for flooding, but

640
00:31:16,119 --> 00:31:17,480
it does flow to the south.

641
00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:19,480
Okay. Thank you.

642
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:20,480
Commissioner Rosell.

643
00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:22,480
Thank you, Chair.

644
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:27,190
Would they have to change any floodplain regulations or

645
00:31:27,190 --> 00:31:31,480
stipulations in order to build phase two in red?

646
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,480
Yes, so there would be a lengthy process ahead of them.

647
00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:38,670
There is FEMA designation on there, so they would have to

648
00:31:38,670 --> 00:31:41,640
go through the conditional letter of map revision to

649
00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:44,480
potentially develop within the floodplain.

650
00:31:44,480 --> 00:31:48,849
On top of that, this whole area in blue is ESA, so they

651
00:31:48,849 --> 00:31:51,630
would need to first do a field assessment to verify the

652
00:31:51,630 --> 00:31:53,480
existence of the riparian area.

653
00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:56,109
And then if that is verified, there would potentially be

654
00:31:56,109 --> 00:31:58,730
the alternative ESA plan that would come back before you

655
00:31:58,730 --> 00:31:59,480
and council.

656
00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:04,480
Thank you.

657
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:06,470
Just to give you an idea of the product that we're looking

658
00:32:06,470 --> 00:32:08,480
at, these are some of the conceptual elevations.

659
00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:11,450
Many more examples were included in your backup, but this

660
00:32:11,450 --> 00:32:14,480
is the type of apartments they would be looking to build.

661
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:17,480
You can see some look more like traditional single family.

662
00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:22,880
Others would contain multiple units and be more like a

663
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:25,480
triplex or a fourplex.

664
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:28,480
Notifications were sent about the request.

665
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:29,480
We received two responses.

666
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:32,480
One of those was included in your backup in the packet.

667
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:34,480
The other I passed out prior to the meeting.

668
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:36,480
One was in favor and one was in opposition.

669
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:38,480
You can see those outlines here on the map.

670
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:42,039
And I did want to point out we ran the numbers, and it's

671
00:32:42,039 --> 00:32:45,990
currently at 22% opposition, so that would trigger a super

672
00:32:45,990 --> 00:32:50,480
majority vote at council, not at P&Z.

673
00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:51,480
Commissioner Sullivan.

674
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:56,509
Do we know at this point the average square footage of the

675
00:32:56,509 --> 00:33:00,480
residential uses and approximate cost?

676
00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:06,480
I know that's a long way away, but I'm just thinking, would

677
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:13,589
this be considered, quote, low income or moderate housing

678
00:33:13,589 --> 00:33:17,480
costs or something of that nature?

679
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:19,480
It is intended for student housing.

680
00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:22,480
That's what it would be marketed towards.

681
00:33:22,480 --> 00:33:24,930
I believe there were some floor plans included in your

682
00:33:24,930 --> 00:33:25,480
backup.

683
00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:27,480
I'm not sure of the exact square footage on those.

684
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:31,250
It would have to meet our minimum of at least $500 per unit

685
00:33:31,250 --> 00:33:31,480
.

686
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:33,450
And as to the cost, I'm not sure what that would be, but

687
00:33:33,450 --> 00:33:35,480
the applicant will be here at the public hearing.

688
00:33:35,480 --> 00:33:36,480
Okay.

689
00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:37,480
Could maybe speak to that.

690
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:40,480
Okay.

691
00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:41,480
All right.

692
00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:44,250
In terms of the rezoning request, staff is recommending

693
00:33:44,250 --> 00:33:46,480
denial of the request for these reasons.

694
00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:49,910
Incompatibility with the surrounding property uses, incons

695
00:33:49,910 --> 00:33:53,829
istency with the goals of the West Park TURS, and inconsist

696
00:33:53,829 --> 00:33:56,509
ency with the goals and objectives of the Denton Plan 2030

697
00:33:56,509 --> 00:33:58,480
and that industrial commerce designation.

698
00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:02,930
Similarly for the SUP, we're recommending denial of that

699
00:34:02,930 --> 00:34:05,480
request for the same reasons.

700
00:34:05,480 --> 00:34:09,670
However, if P&Z votes to recommend approval, we do have

701
00:34:09,670 --> 00:34:13,480
some conditions that we would like to see on that.

702
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,630
The first of those being that the site plan, landscape plan

703
00:34:16,630 --> 00:34:19,480
, and elevations provided to you would be considered

704
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:20,480
conceptual.

705
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:22,789
So that the site would need to go through a full site plan

706
00:34:22,789 --> 00:34:26,679
submittal for each phase to ensure that it meets all of the

707
00:34:26,679 --> 00:34:28,809
requirements of the Denton Development Code in terms of

708
00:34:28,809 --> 00:34:30,480
landscaping, parking, and building design.

709
00:34:30,480 --> 00:34:33,480
Let's go through these first.

710
00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:35,480
Yeah, that's what I'm going to do.

711
00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:38,780
The second condition is we would require that before any of

712
00:34:38,780 --> 00:34:41,730
phase two or phase three be developed that that ESA be

713
00:34:41,730 --> 00:34:45,030
examined fully through an assessment and then a potential

714
00:34:45,030 --> 00:34:47,480
alternative ESA requirement there.

715
00:34:47,480 --> 00:34:50,590
And then the third requirement would be that the multif

716
00:34:50,590 --> 00:34:53,550
amily use be limited strictly to the acreage that was

717
00:34:53,550 --> 00:34:56,480
proposed here with this conceptual site plan.

718
00:34:56,480 --> 00:34:59,300
Similarly for the outdoor recreation, it be limited to

719
00:34:59,300 --> 00:35:02,480
those approximately 20 acres and that the multifamily not

720
00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:05,480
contain more than the maximum number of units shown here,

721
00:35:05,480 --> 00:35:07,480
which was 289.

722
00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:12,480
And can answer any questions you might have.

723
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:14,480
Call on legal for clarification.

724
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:17,440
I just want to address what I had indicated earlier about

725
00:35:17,440 --> 00:35:18,480
reimbursement.

726
00:35:18,480 --> 00:35:22,250
It looks like in the project plan for the TURS, multifamily

727
00:35:22,250 --> 00:35:25,480
was specifically excluded for reimbursement.

728
00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:27,480
Thank you.

729
00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:29,480
Commissioner back. Thank you, Chair.

730
00:35:29,480 --> 00:35:34,480
Just out of curiosity, part of our information deals with

731
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:38,480
cost to the city to help develop this area.

732
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:42,380
Would the expense to the city and other government entities

733
00:35:42,380 --> 00:35:46,309
and providing improving increasing or maintaining public

734
00:35:46,309 --> 00:35:50,230
utilities school streets and other public safety measures

735
00:35:50,230 --> 00:35:53,920
in your opinion, or if you know, be greater or less for an

736
00:35:53,920 --> 00:35:56,480
NRMU district over an ICI district.

737
00:35:56,480 --> 00:36:09,480
Unfortunately, I can't speak to that. This would be a high

738
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:09,480
volume of students. So I imagine the potential traffic

739
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:09,480
impacts could be substantial. I believe it was total of

740
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:09,480
1000 bedrooms roughly.

741
00:36:09,480 --> 00:36:12,480
But I'm not sure what the comparison would be there.

742
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:16,289
I think my impression that when you develop a residential

743
00:36:16,289 --> 00:36:19,699
area like this, the demand is going to be greater on

744
00:36:19,699 --> 00:36:23,820
infrastructure and everything as opposed to industrial uses

745
00:36:23,820 --> 00:36:26,480
more plumbing, that type of thing.

746
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:29,480
But that's just my.

747
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:32,440
I would say, given the topography of the site and the

748
00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,550
unique conditions there with the lake it's unlikely it

749
00:36:35,550 --> 00:36:38,789
would be a large industrial user more likely, if not this

750
00:36:38,789 --> 00:36:42,019
then develop as smaller supporting commercial uses or

751
00:36:42,019 --> 00:36:43,480
something similar to that.

752
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:46,710
Okay, but that just the concern to the cost of city should

753
00:36:46,710 --> 00:36:49,480
I think you know way in here on which way we go.

754
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:51,480
Thank you.

755
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:55,250
Commissioner Smith. Thank you, not to bog things down legal

756
00:36:55,250 --> 00:36:55,480
.

757
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:58,719
If we were to make if we were to approve this what we have

758
00:36:58,719 --> 00:37:01,630
to make the motion to accept it with second staff

759
00:37:01,630 --> 00:37:03,480
recommendations then.

760
00:37:03,480 --> 00:37:04,480
Correct.

761
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:07,369
If they're saying that yes, do we work with we recommend

762
00:37:07,369 --> 00:37:10,389
denial but if you do approve we recommend that you approve

763
00:37:10,389 --> 00:37:13,340
with these recommendations will we need to make our motion

764
00:37:13,340 --> 00:37:14,480
to say yes we need to.

765
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:17,289
We recommend we approve and we are, but the motion is a

766
00:37:17,289 --> 00:37:20,480
motion to approve but with staff recommendations then.

767
00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:25,480
Yes, because they would be in the record already. Thank you

768
00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:25,480
.

769
00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:29,480
This is your backup right. Yes. Yes. Okay.

770
00:37:29,480 --> 00:37:32,480
Commissioner Sanchez.

771
00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:35,480
And there's two ponds big ponds in there.

772
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:50,480
Two lakes.

773
00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:54,769
And some of those areas further down properties, the land

774
00:37:54,769 --> 00:37:59,250
there's pretty flat. So my biggest concern would be, what

775
00:37:59,250 --> 00:38:03,469
would you, how would you, there'd be a lot of, what do you

776
00:38:03,469 --> 00:38:07,739
call it, runoff in that area because of the topography and

777
00:38:07,739 --> 00:38:11,960
putting the large industrial complex there or several of

778
00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:16,170
them would increase that erosion or you know you couldn't

779
00:38:16,170 --> 00:38:18,480
do that because of the.

780
00:38:18,480 --> 00:38:21,480
Because of the landscape.

781
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:23,480
Thank you. Microsoft over there.

782
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:26,480
Commissioner.

783
00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:30,480
Did you hear me. Yes, sir. Okay.

784
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:36,190
Yes, as I mentioned, I don't think even, you know, this

785
00:38:36,190 --> 00:38:42,389
request aside, given the topography and that, like, I think

786
00:38:42,389 --> 00:38:47,320
it unlikely the site would ever develop with large

787
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:52,949
intensive industrial users, such as what's out there at

788
00:38:52,949 --> 00:38:54,480
this time.

789
00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:57,650
But in terms of the runoff, I'm not, I'm not sure how that

790
00:38:57,650 --> 00:39:00,929
would compare between the residential and the industrial

791
00:39:00,929 --> 00:39:01,480
use.

792
00:39:01,480 --> 00:39:04,469
Other than I can speak to the NRMU zoning would require

793
00:39:04,469 --> 00:39:07,389
more landscape area overall on the sites that could

794
00:39:07,389 --> 00:39:10,880
potentially treat runoff, then would be permitted under the

795
00:39:10,880 --> 00:39:12,480
industrial district.

796
00:39:12,480 --> 00:39:18,480
If that gives you any comparison there.

797
00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:21,940
The only question I have is in regards to the changing the

798
00:39:21,940 --> 00:39:25,269
zoning, what would it do as far as the buffering or set

799
00:39:25,269 --> 00:39:28,719
backs for neighboring properties like to the west being

800
00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:32,480
industrial against a residential use versus if it stayed

801
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:33,480
industrial.

802
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,909
Yes, so with the current industrial abutting industrial

803
00:39:36,909 --> 00:39:40,599
there wouldn't be buffering requirements. There wouldn't

804
00:39:40,599 --> 00:39:44,110
necessarily be buffers required across precision drive here

805
00:39:44,110 --> 00:39:47,530
but there would be buffers between the uses required on the

806
00:39:47,530 --> 00:39:48,480
south side.

807
00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:52,480
Assuming this would develop with those recreation uses.

808
00:39:52,480 --> 00:39:57,079
I believe it would be a 15 foot buffer that would be

809
00:39:57,079 --> 00:39:58,480
required between there.

810
00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:01,840
But the buffering would be against an industrial use coming

811
00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:05,269
up against a residential use in the future. Is that correct

812
00:40:05,269 --> 00:40:05,480
.

813
00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:08,510
I don't believe there's any place where the industrial

814
00:40:08,510 --> 00:40:11,909
would immediately about the residential as they've shown it

815
00:40:11,909 --> 00:40:15,110
, because there would be streets separating it on both the

816
00:40:15,110 --> 00:40:16,480
north and west side.

817
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:20,480
The railroad currently exists between that on the east.

818
00:40:20,480 --> 00:40:23,440
So the red light that has the buffer that we've gotten into

819
00:40:23,440 --> 00:40:26,980
sometimes before so that's fine so the property to the west

820
00:40:26,980 --> 00:40:30,510
then wouldn't be impacted that they would have to set back

821
00:40:30,510 --> 00:40:35,030
further for buffering because of the street, because it has

822
00:40:35,030 --> 00:40:36,480
that separation.

823
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:40,250
Any impact if we did changes are all on this side it doesn

824
00:40:40,250 --> 00:40:44,480
't impact the uses to the west. No sir. Okay.

825
00:40:44,480 --> 00:40:48,269
One other question that I would have or ask of staff or

826
00:40:48,269 --> 00:40:51,480
spend a couple questions about the impacts.

827
00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:54,559
Would it be possible between now and when we get into our

828
00:40:54,559 --> 00:40:57,639
public meeting to get what the impact fees based on this

829
00:40:57,639 --> 00:41:00,449
site plan would be as far as the traffic impact fees

830
00:41:00,449 --> 00:41:01,480
wastewater.

831
00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:05,030
I can see numbers see how big that number really is for if

832
00:41:05,030 --> 00:41:08,750
they decide to move forward what those fees would be to the

833
00:41:08,750 --> 00:41:09,480
city.

834
00:41:09,480 --> 00:41:13,289
I can hear the demands on the infrastructure rough numbers

835
00:41:13,289 --> 00:41:16,989
there for you. That'd be great. Any other questions on this

836
00:41:16,989 --> 00:41:17,480
item.

837
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:20,480
Okay.

838
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:24,480
I think Julie gets to come up now.

839
00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:31,480
Thank you Haley great job on all your presentations.

840
00:41:31,480 --> 00:41:44,480
Okay.

841
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:48,010
So I'm Julie Wyatt senior planner with the city of Denton

842
00:41:48,010 --> 00:41:52,480
and I am presenting the 1722 East side of Mont.

843
00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,969
So the request before you is to consider an initial zoning

844
00:41:55,969 --> 00:41:59,699
of neighborhood residential mixed use for a property that's

845
00:41:59,699 --> 00:42:03,480
approximately six acres here in the yellow is generally

846
00:42:03,480 --> 00:42:08,519
located on the east side of the future FM 2499 alignment

847
00:42:08,519 --> 00:42:12,480
about 1400 feet south of Robinson Road.

848
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:16,710
So most of us haven't traveled this portion of the road. It

849
00:42:16,710 --> 00:42:22,500
's and and it doesn't look today like it does in the aerial.

850
00:42:22,500 --> 00:42:23,480
This is a new road. I believe it's opening in 2018.

851
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:27,449
So, so we're going to have to use our imaginations tonight

852
00:42:27,449 --> 00:42:31,440
about what it's what it actually looks like adjacent to the

853
00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:32,480
property.

854
00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:36,260
So currently the property has an RD 5x zoning designation.

855
00:42:36,260 --> 00:42:39,690
As you probably are aware this is our place holding zoning

856
00:42:39,690 --> 00:42:43,199
designation for properties once they're annexed into the

857
00:42:43,199 --> 00:42:44,480
city of Denton.

858
00:42:44,480 --> 00:42:48,059
When this property was annexed a long time ago it received

859
00:42:48,059 --> 00:42:49,480
that designation.

860
00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:53,380
It didn't develop at that time and it's it was it was kind

861
00:42:53,380 --> 00:42:57,809
of landlocked until until until about next year. So, so now

862
00:42:57,809 --> 00:43:02,019
the applicant is proposing an NRM use zoning district to

863
00:43:02,019 --> 00:43:03,480
develop the site.

864
00:43:03,480 --> 00:43:07,400
The didn't plan 2030 designates this area is low low

865
00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:11,179
density residential. The intent of this is to encourage

866
00:43:11,179 --> 00:43:15,119
that sort of low density suburban development pattern those

867
00:43:15,119 --> 00:43:18,989
those single family neighborhoods that we're all familiar

868
00:43:18,989 --> 00:43:23,699
with the proposed zoning does not technically meet this,

869
00:43:23,699 --> 00:43:26,480
this low density residential designation.

870
00:43:26,480 --> 00:43:31,000
So in that case the section 35 dot 3 dot 3 dot B dot 3

871
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:35,480
kicks in and we take a little closer look at the request.

872
00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:38,190
There's a there's a little more criteria as you talked

873
00:43:38,190 --> 00:43:39,480
about a Haley's case.

874
00:43:39,480 --> 00:43:42,949
So these criteria are intended to look at the existing land

875
00:43:42,949 --> 00:43:46,480
use patterns see if the proposed zoning conforms to it.

876
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:49,420
See if this creates an isolated zoning district if there's

877
00:43:49,420 --> 00:43:52,480
adequate infrastructure, what the environmental impacts

878
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:55,300
would be and then what the character is of the area and the

879
00:43:55,300 --> 00:43:56,480
proposed district.

880
00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:59,159
So we're going to go through the area and just kind of talk

881
00:43:59,159 --> 00:44:02,150
about these together. So first of all, I'm sure you all

882
00:44:02,150 --> 00:44:05,880
remember this slide. We've had a lot of zoning cases come

883
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:08,480
adjacent to this future roadway.

884
00:44:08,480 --> 00:44:14,679
And so this one's no different. In this case, the 2499

885
00:44:14,679 --> 00:44:19,480
arterial will run through Denton in this fashion.

886
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:23,690
The the star is the subject property and this this road is

887
00:44:23,690 --> 00:44:27,760
going to connect Denton to DFW airport south of Flower M

888
00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:33,119
ound. So it's going to be a major thoroughfare and regional

889
00:44:33,119 --> 00:44:34,480
connector.

890
00:44:34,480 --> 00:44:37,130
So based upon that staff does not believe that this

891
00:44:37,130 --> 00:44:40,480
property would actually develop with single family uses.

892
00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:45,949
It's because of this 900 feet along the arterial. It really

893
00:44:45,949 --> 00:44:48,480
is sort of sandwiched up against this arterial.

894
00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:51,219
We don't we don't really don't believe that single family

895
00:44:51,219 --> 00:44:53,739
uses would actually develop on the six acres and that

896
00:44:53,739 --> 00:44:56,329
commercial use is a really more appropriate given the

897
00:44:56,329 --> 00:44:58,480
visibility and the access of the site.

898
00:44:58,480 --> 00:45:02,690
So 2499 in this area. Here's a text dot plan of it. It's

899
00:45:02,690 --> 00:45:06,090
proposed to be a six lane divided roadway. As I said, it's

900
00:45:06,090 --> 00:45:07,480
currently under construction.

901
00:45:07,480 --> 00:45:11,000
The final design just just to point out has some noise

902
00:45:11,000 --> 00:45:13,909
walls in this area. So one that will actually affect the

903
00:45:13,909 --> 00:45:17,000
subject property on the south end of the of the property

904
00:45:17,000 --> 00:45:22,480
line and then one across across the street from the

905
00:45:22,480 --> 00:45:24,480
adjacent residential.

906
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:30,679
Here's the subject property here in in the light green. So

907
00:45:30,679 --> 00:45:35,480
we also looked at the neighboring subdivisions and area.

908
00:45:35,480 --> 00:45:40,280
So in this in this to the north of the subject property, we

909
00:45:40,280 --> 00:45:43,480
have a single family subdivision.

910
00:45:43,480 --> 00:45:46,710
It is part of plan development 176 that included

911
00:45:46,710 --> 00:45:49,480
neighborhoods as well as public utilities.

912
00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:52,300
If you'll see right along here, this is actually an

913
00:45:52,300 --> 00:45:55,960
electric transmission line that cuts between the subject

914
00:45:55,960 --> 00:45:59,480
property and the neighborhoods to the north.

915
00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:02,489
And then there's also some commercial kind of over here

916
00:46:02,489 --> 00:46:06,079
near Teasley. And then there's some undeveloped commercial

917
00:46:06,079 --> 00:46:10,650
in this plan development in this location to the north is

918
00:46:10,650 --> 00:46:12,480
already five X as well.

919
00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:17,159
It is developed with a gas well facility to the to the east

920
00:46:17,159 --> 00:46:20,460
of the subject property. You have in our four that's

921
00:46:20,460 --> 00:46:22,480
developed with the single family neighborhood.

922
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:25,369
There is an open space lot that separates the subject

923
00:46:25,369 --> 00:46:28,679
property from those neighborhoods and to the south. You

924
00:46:28,679 --> 00:46:32,480
have PD 111, which is also a single family neighborhood.

925
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:37,480
It also includes some open spaces. So when we. Yes, sir.

926
00:46:37,480 --> 00:46:40,579
Commissioner back. Thank you, Chair. That open space like

927
00:46:40,579 --> 00:46:43,389
that separates that housing development from what are we

928
00:46:43,389 --> 00:46:46,480
talking about in with dimensions?

929
00:46:46,480 --> 00:46:49,909
I mean, yeah, I measured it. You know, it gets a little

930
00:46:49,909 --> 00:46:52,650
gets a little wider here on the south end, a little

931
00:46:52,650 --> 00:46:54,480
narrower here in the middle.

932
00:46:54,480 --> 00:46:58,090
I want to say it probably isn't more than at the narrow

933
00:46:58,090 --> 00:47:01,949
part, maybe 30 feet wide. Okay. Is there a whole landscape

934
00:47:01,949 --> 00:47:02,480
in there?

935
00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:06,670
I think it's more natural. It isn't a floodplain. And so it

936
00:47:06,670 --> 00:47:11,030
's kind of just natural existing canopy in that area. Okay.

937
00:47:11,030 --> 00:47:12,480
Okay. Thank you.

938
00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:15,150
So when we talk about commercial development next to next

939
00:47:15,150 --> 00:47:18,389
to single family residential neighborhoods, we want to be

940
00:47:18,389 --> 00:47:22,480
sensitive and in use and scale.

941
00:47:22,480 --> 00:47:24,949
We we understand and in the comp plan, we want our

942
00:47:24,949 --> 00:47:27,929
neighborhoods to have commercial services that day to day

943
00:47:27,929 --> 00:47:29,480
type shopping near them.

944
00:47:29,480 --> 00:47:33,260
You know, the the the dry cleaners and the drug store and

945
00:47:33,260 --> 00:47:35,480
and maybe a doctor's office.

946
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:37,789
But we but we realize that there are some commercial uses

947
00:47:37,789 --> 00:47:40,219
that really are incompatible with single family residential

948
00:47:40,219 --> 00:47:44,050
, something like vehicle repair where it would create a lot

949
00:47:44,050 --> 00:47:47,840
of noise and potential potential nuisance for that single

950
00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:48,480
family neighborhood.

951
00:47:48,480 --> 00:47:52,670
So so that's why we we we looked at NRMU because it does

952
00:47:52,670 --> 00:47:57,230
sort of limit the scale of development of some commercial

953
00:47:57,230 --> 00:48:01,440
uses as well as limit some of those more high intensive

954
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:02,480
commercial uses.

955
00:48:02,480 --> 00:48:06,670
The intent of NRMU really is to be located near those

956
00:48:06,670 --> 00:48:11,349
residential areas to provide those necessary services for

957
00:48:11,349 --> 00:48:13,480
those neighborhoods.

958
00:48:13,480 --> 00:48:16,840
There is a flood zone on the back. Of course, you know,

959
00:48:16,840 --> 00:48:20,199
they would have to meet any requirements associated with

960
00:48:20,199 --> 00:48:22,480
that once they get to development.

961
00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:27,500
Just just wanted to show you where that that flood area is

962
00:48:27,500 --> 00:48:32,480
and how it takes up that that open space lot adjacent.

963
00:48:32,480 --> 00:48:37,900
So public notification was sent out for the the the

964
00:48:37,900 --> 00:48:39,480
proposal.

965
00:48:39,480 --> 00:48:43,929
Thirty five notices were sent in the 200 foot buffer. We've

966
00:48:43,929 --> 00:48:48,480
received five in opposition and zero in favor of the NRMU.

967
00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:51,500
Now, I want to caution you and Commissioner Beck and I

968
00:48:51,500 --> 00:48:54,480
talked earlier today about this in your packet.

969
00:48:54,480 --> 00:48:58,889
There was there were some notifications that were sent

970
00:48:58,889 --> 00:49:03,800
regarding a rezoning to maybe a higher intensity commercial

971
00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:04,480
use.

972
00:49:04,480 --> 00:49:07,179
So I wanted you all to have all of the available

973
00:49:07,179 --> 00:49:10,480
information that the city got from the residents.

974
00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:14,820
So that's why in your packet you had you had some responses

975
00:49:14,820 --> 00:49:19,070
from neighbors that were in association with an already

976
00:49:19,070 --> 00:49:20,480
five X to a CMG.

977
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:23,780
However, they've actually dialed back that commercial use

978
00:49:23,780 --> 00:49:26,690
to that NRMU because they wanted to make sure that they

979
00:49:26,690 --> 00:49:29,480
were compatible with those residential areas.

980
00:49:29,480 --> 00:49:33,389
So you received some additional responses on your table

981
00:49:33,389 --> 00:49:36,480
that were in association with that NRMU.

982
00:49:36,480 --> 00:49:40,039
So that way you have all of the information that the city

983
00:49:40,039 --> 00:49:43,630
that the city received in terms of response from the

984
00:49:43,630 --> 00:49:44,480
neighborhood.

985
00:49:44,480 --> 00:49:46,480
McCall on staff. Richard has a comment.

986
00:49:46,480 --> 00:49:50,900
I just wanted to add, if you recall, this item was on the

987
00:49:50,900 --> 00:49:55,250
last agenda and we had continued it to this one for this

988
00:49:55,250 --> 00:49:56,480
very reason.

989
00:49:56,480 --> 00:50:01,489
Commissioner Sullivan. I realize that there is a buffer on

990
00:50:01,489 --> 00:50:06,190
the east side, but I'm concerned about the buffer on the

991
00:50:06,190 --> 00:50:07,480
south side.

992
00:50:07,480 --> 00:50:12,429
Any idea what those people thought were going in at the

993
00:50:12,429 --> 00:50:15,480
time they bought their homes?

994
00:50:15,480 --> 00:50:17,789
I don't know what was told to them at the time they bought

995
00:50:17,789 --> 00:50:18,480
their homes.

996
00:50:18,480 --> 00:50:22,250
I think one of the responses in front of you, the neighbor

997
00:50:22,250 --> 00:50:24,989
did say that they were told that that was going to remain

998
00:50:24,989 --> 00:50:25,480
open.

999
00:50:25,480 --> 00:50:28,480
So I really don't know what they were told at the time.

1000
00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:31,440
I can tell you that the Denton Development Code does have

1001
00:50:31,440 --> 00:50:33,480
requirements in terms of buffers.

1002
00:50:33,480 --> 00:50:37,130
So a commercial use adjacent to a single family use would

1003
00:50:37,130 --> 00:50:40,789
be required to put in a 15 foot buffer that included a

1004
00:50:40,789 --> 00:50:43,480
certain number of trees and shrubs.

1005
00:50:43,480 --> 00:50:46,829
Any development would also be required to conform to any

1006
00:50:46,829 --> 00:50:49,920
light and glare requirements in the code, any tree

1007
00:50:49,920 --> 00:50:52,920
preservation as well as landscape screening, parking lot

1008
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:53,480
screening.

1009
00:50:53,480 --> 00:50:58,480
So they would be required to have some design interventions

1010
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:02,420
in the development to try to ensure compatibility with

1011
00:51:02,420 --> 00:51:04,480
those residential.

1012
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:08,030
I guess my concern is that the only way that they could

1013
00:51:08,030 --> 00:51:11,480
service the people closest to them is to come all the way

1014
00:51:11,480 --> 00:51:16,480
24/99 to Robinson to Pine Hills to then do all of that.

1015
00:51:16,480 --> 00:51:22,389
And I just don't see what kind of a service industry other

1016
00:51:22,389 --> 00:51:27,480
than Domino's Pizza maybe would want to travel that each

1017
00:51:27,480 --> 00:51:30,480
and every time they want to service.

1018
00:51:30,480 --> 00:51:34,239
Or if their customers are coming the other way, how are

1019
00:51:34,239 --> 00:51:41,070
they going to get from the east side of 24/99 down Robinson

1020
00:51:41,070 --> 00:51:43,480
and now come across to that area?

1021
00:51:43,480 --> 00:51:46,670
I don't know what streets are going to be like and so I'm

1022
00:51:46,670 --> 00:51:47,480
not sure.

1023
00:51:47,480 --> 00:51:51,030
That's a really good point and part of what we looked at is

1024
00:51:51,030 --> 00:51:54,739
that this commercial area didn't provide direct access to

1025
00:51:54,739 --> 00:51:56,480
those residential areas.

1026
00:51:56,480 --> 00:51:59,840
So it did provide that seclusion from those residential

1027
00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:00,480
areas.

1028
00:52:00,480 --> 00:52:03,719
If you'll look at text dot plans, you'll see that Pine

1029
00:52:03,719 --> 00:52:07,550
Hills here does actually will connect to 24/99 in this

1030
00:52:07,550 --> 00:52:08,480
location.

1031
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:13,070
So it will provide some connectivity for those residential

1032
00:52:13,070 --> 00:52:17,480
areas if it ended up being some sort of convenience use.

1033
00:52:17,480 --> 00:52:20,360
I know the applicant spoke in their neighborhood meeting

1034
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:23,480
that they were looking at more office uses.

1035
00:52:23,480 --> 00:52:27,920
But retail is permitted in the zoning district so it could

1036
00:52:27,920 --> 00:52:32,099
be a retail type use and there is some connectivity in this

1037
00:52:32,099 --> 00:52:36,480
area to get neighborhoods in there.

1038
00:52:36,480 --> 00:52:40,250
While you have the map up, I know Jim Jenks had to step out

1039
00:52:40,250 --> 00:52:40,480
.

1040
00:52:40,480 --> 00:52:43,360
Would you mind getting with him between now and when we get

1041
00:52:43,360 --> 00:52:46,119
in public if they're going to be allowed to have any curb

1042
00:52:46,119 --> 00:52:48,480
cuts out there in that center divider?

1043
00:52:48,480 --> 00:52:51,840
Because according to that map, it doesn't look like there's

1044
00:52:51,840 --> 00:52:54,730
any left turn lanes on the southbound to be able to get

1045
00:52:54,730 --> 00:52:55,480
access.

1046
00:52:55,480 --> 00:52:58,179
I don't think there is, but I'll confirm. I think it would

1047
00:52:58,179 --> 00:53:00,480
just be a right in, right out at this location.

1048
00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:01,480
Okay.

1049
00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:03,480
But I'll check for you.

1050
00:53:03,480 --> 00:53:04,480
Great. Thank you.

1051
00:53:04,480 --> 00:53:05,480
Commissioner Smith, did you have a question?

1052
00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:08,150
Yes, thank you, Chair. You did say that they did have a

1053
00:53:08,150 --> 00:53:09,480
community meeting?

1054
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:10,480
They did, yes, sir.

1055
00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:13,480
Okay, gotcha. Is the applicant going to be present tonight?

1056
00:53:13,480 --> 00:53:14,480
He is supposed to be, yes, sir.

1057
00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:22,480
Okay, gotcha. Thank you. I'll ask him then.

1058
00:53:22,480 --> 00:53:23,480
Any other question?

1059
00:53:23,480 --> 00:53:25,480
Commissioner Beck.

1060
00:53:25,480 --> 00:53:29,539
Thank you, Chair. You threw me your presentation, though. I

1061
00:53:29,539 --> 00:53:31,480
wanted to let you at least finish. Are you at that point?

1062
00:53:31,480 --> 00:53:33,480
Yes, sir. I'm done. Absolutely.

1063
00:53:33,480 --> 00:53:39,389
Okay. Just to better visualize this for me and anybody else

1064
00:53:39,389 --> 00:53:43,940
, 2499 is that part that currently is developed, and it's

1065
00:53:43,940 --> 00:53:44,480
four lanes.

1066
00:53:44,480 --> 00:53:48,480
Two lanes going each way until it switches to road.

1067
00:53:48,480 --> 00:53:50,400
So are you saying when we cross over, it says in the

1068
00:53:50,400 --> 00:53:52,670
information here, there's going to be a six lane, three

1069
00:53:52,670 --> 00:53:53,480
lanes in each way.

1070
00:53:53,480 --> 00:53:56,829
So it changes at that point. And this is a road that goes

1071
00:53:56,829 --> 00:53:59,480
up and eventually connects to State School Road.

1072
00:53:59,480 --> 00:54:00,480
Yes, sir.

1073
00:54:00,480 --> 00:54:02,409
So we can see what that's going to look like, that whole

1074
00:54:02,409 --> 00:54:04,480
area is going to look like if you go up to the State School

1075
00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:07,480
right now and see anybody that's been up there.

1076
00:54:07,480 --> 00:54:10,780
It's wide. Yeah. And it's going to haul a lot of traffic

1077
00:54:10,780 --> 00:54:11,480
through there.

1078
00:54:11,480 --> 00:54:16,539
So I understand residents' concerns about this being

1079
00:54:16,539 --> 00:54:18,480
developed for commercial.

1080
00:54:18,480 --> 00:54:22,480
Are we, if we do approve this, when it comes back around to

1081
00:54:22,480 --> 00:54:26,340
us, then we can, because I'm concerned that you can put

1082
00:54:26,340 --> 00:54:30,480
hotels in and NRMU, and I think residents would be too.

1083
00:54:30,480 --> 00:54:36,409
You can put clubs and other things that would probably be

1084
00:54:36,409 --> 00:54:39,480
unsuitable for that area.

1085
00:54:39,480 --> 00:54:41,789
But there are other things like laundering mats, you can go

1086
00:54:41,789 --> 00:54:44,070
in there, things that are quieter, low key and stuff like

1087
00:54:44,070 --> 00:54:44,480
that.

1088
00:54:44,480 --> 00:54:48,940
So will we as a commission be able to be a little selective

1089
00:54:48,940 --> 00:54:53,659
there as to the type of commercial enterprises that go in

1090
00:54:53,659 --> 00:54:54,480
there?

1091
00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:57,480
I'll call on legal to give a response to that.

1092
00:54:57,480 --> 00:55:01,090
I just wanted to remind everyone that this is one of the

1093
00:55:01,090 --> 00:55:04,889
few times where you can actually use your overlay because

1094
00:55:04,889 --> 00:55:07,480
it's an NRMU and it's a budding residential area.

1095
00:55:07,480 --> 00:55:11,239
So we have that mixed use overlay that we can use and we've

1096
00:55:11,239 --> 00:55:14,480
already provided notice for it in the agenda.

1097
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:17,909
We do that now. So if you want to remove uses from the

1098
00:55:17,909 --> 00:55:21,480
zoning category, you can do that with an overlay.

1099
00:55:21,480 --> 00:55:24,219
And when would we, at what time would we be able to do that

1100
00:55:24,219 --> 00:55:25,480
? When you do your motion.

1101
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:32,480
Tonight? Okay. Thank you.

1102
00:55:32,480 --> 00:55:35,480
I think that's it, yes.

1103
00:55:35,480 --> 00:55:39,070
Any other questions for Julie on this item? Commissioner

1104
00:55:39,070 --> 00:55:39,480
Smith.

1105
00:55:39,480 --> 00:55:41,820
Thank you, Chair. You said earlier, you said it's at a

1106
00:55:41,820 --> 00:55:42,480
floodplain.

1107
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:48,710
Well, there's a portion of the lot. This is schematic. This

1108
00:55:48,710 --> 00:55:50,480
isn't based upon it on the ground.

1109
00:55:50,480 --> 00:55:55,480
This is really just sort of generally where that would be.

1110
00:55:55,480 --> 00:56:02,480
Got it. Thank you.

1111
00:56:02,480 --> 00:56:06,480
Move us on to agenda item D.

1112
00:56:06,480 --> 00:56:11,480
All right. This is PDA 17.6 CARMAX.

1113
00:56:11,480 --> 00:56:14,630
So this request before you is to consider approval of a

1114
00:56:14,630 --> 00:56:19,760
detailed plan for Plan Development 12, that's PD 12, to

1115
00:56:19,760 --> 00:56:24,880
depict a new or used car sales lot on approximately 7.11

1116
00:56:24,880 --> 00:56:28,480
acres out of a 34.4 acre tract.

1117
00:56:28,480 --> 00:56:31,829
So the subject property is generally located adjacent to I-

1118
00:56:31,829 --> 00:56:35,349
35. It's south of state school, so we're still in the

1119
00:56:35,349 --> 00:56:37,480
general location we were before.

1120
00:56:37,480 --> 00:56:41,460
The area outlined in yellow is that 34 acre tract. The red

1121
00:56:41,460 --> 00:56:49,489
is very conceptually where the proposed development would

1122
00:56:49,489 --> 00:56:50,480
go.

1123
00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:54,849
So the Denton plan calls this area regional mixed use. The

1124
00:56:54,849 --> 00:56:58,960
intent is to serve as a regional destination. These are

1125
00:56:58,960 --> 00:57:01,480
primarily found along our I-35 corridors.

1126
00:57:01,480 --> 00:57:06,400
So it brings people to the area and either from outside the

1127
00:57:06,400 --> 00:57:10,480
city of Denton or within the city of Denton.

1128
00:57:10,480 --> 00:57:15,880
And the proposal does meet this future land use designation

1129
00:57:15,880 --> 00:57:17,480
, the car lot.

1130
00:57:17,480 --> 00:57:21,739
So let's talk about the current zoning as well as the

1131
00:57:21,739 --> 00:57:23,480
adjacent zoning.

1132
00:57:23,480 --> 00:57:30,480
So this is in PD 12. And PDs in the city of Denton were,

1133
00:57:30,480 --> 00:57:32,840
our current development code doesn't actually have plan

1134
00:57:32,840 --> 00:57:37,780
developments except for 15 that were left over from the pre

1135
00:57:37,780 --> 00:57:39,480
2002 code.

1136
00:57:39,480 --> 00:57:44,590
And the pre 2002 code, it was the 1991 code, it was a plan

1137
00:57:44,590 --> 00:57:48,019
developments were a two step process. The first process was

1138
00:57:48,019 --> 00:57:48,480
the concept plan,

1139
00:57:48,480 --> 00:57:51,829
which outlined the boundaries of the plan development and

1140
00:57:51,829 --> 00:57:55,059
the uses and the general areas of where those uses would go

1141
00:57:55,059 --> 00:57:57,480
also design considerations often.

1142
00:57:57,480 --> 00:58:03,949
So this was PD 12, it was approved in 87 and it did permit

1143
00:58:03,949 --> 00:58:09,440
the use. At that time they called the use new or use car

1144
00:58:09,440 --> 00:58:13,480
sales lot in open and that was permitted.

1145
00:58:13,480 --> 00:58:17,690
The surrounding zoning includes RCCD adjacent to the

1146
00:58:17,690 --> 00:58:22,480
subject property and those are developed with similar uses,

1147
00:58:22,480 --> 00:58:23,480
vehicle sales.

1148
00:58:23,480 --> 00:58:29,170
RCCN is to the north also developed with similar uses. And

1149
00:58:29,170 --> 00:58:35,480
then we have some vehicle sales to the south within the PD.

1150
00:58:35,480 --> 00:58:40,739
There are properties, single family properties developed to

1151
00:58:40,739 --> 00:58:43,480
the west of the subject property.

1152
00:58:43,480 --> 00:58:46,559
And then across the highway there's also some single family

1153
00:58:46,559 --> 00:58:50,480
development. So that's really what's surrounding the area.

1154
00:58:50,480 --> 00:58:55,730
Commissioner Sullivan. Just to be clear, because in my map

1155
00:58:55,730 --> 00:58:58,480
I don't show the red box. Oh yes you don't.

1156
00:58:58,480 --> 00:59:01,139
This is just for our- So we're only talking about the red

1157
00:59:01,139 --> 00:59:06,480
box, we're not talking about the black box or whatever.

1158
00:59:06,480 --> 00:59:11,539
It includes the entire black box, but their detailed plan

1159
00:59:11,539 --> 00:59:16,690
is only for the red box. And here's where the difference in

1160
00:59:16,690 --> 00:59:21,480
our straight zoning versus plan development lies.

1161
00:59:21,480 --> 00:59:25,320
So in a straight zoning we would be talking about should it

1162
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:28,480
be RCCN, RCCD, or whatever one of our zoning districts.

1163
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:31,659
And then it could develop in accordance with that zoning

1164
00:59:31,659 --> 00:59:32,480
district.

1165
00:59:32,480 --> 00:59:35,639
PDs are a little different in that what they're really

1166
00:59:35,639 --> 00:59:39,110
essentially doing with this plan development is getting

1167
00:59:39,110 --> 00:59:42,480
approval of a site plan for their development.

1168
00:59:42,480 --> 00:59:45,260
Because we're really now looking at the details of the site

1169
00:59:45,260 --> 00:59:48,480
. The use is permitted under the PD.

1170
00:59:48,480 --> 00:59:51,829
Now we're looking at just how the site develops. And it

1171
00:59:51,829 --> 00:59:54,869
will have to develop in accordance with whatever is

1172
00:59:54,869 --> 01:00:00,480
approved or denied by virtue of this public hearing.

1173
01:00:00,480 --> 01:00:04,670
So the site plan, the landscape plan, and the elevations

1174
01:00:04,670 --> 01:00:07,760
that are in your backup, and we'll talk about the site plan

1175
01:00:07,760 --> 01:00:09,480
and landscape plan in the presentation.

1176
01:00:09,480 --> 01:00:12,369
Those are what would be approved and it would have to

1177
01:00:12,369 --> 01:00:14,480
develop in accordance with that.

1178
01:00:14,480 --> 01:00:19,550
So my concerns with the black line backing up to the houses

1179
01:00:19,550 --> 01:00:22,480
on Waterford is nonexistent.

1180
01:00:22,480 --> 01:00:25,480
Because we're only talking about the red box.

1181
01:00:25,480 --> 01:00:29,980
Yes, sir. And if they did want to expand their use into the

1182
01:00:29,980 --> 01:00:33,860
part that is beyond the red box, they would have to come

1183
01:00:33,860 --> 01:00:36,480
back again and amend their detail plan.

1184
01:00:36,480 --> 01:00:37,980
That's probably the way I should have said it at the

1185
01:00:37,980 --> 01:00:38,480
beginning.

1186
01:00:38,480 --> 01:00:40,480
It's almost similar to what we just did with Razor Ranch.

1187
01:00:40,480 --> 01:00:41,480
Yes.

1188
01:00:41,480 --> 01:00:43,300
Where we kind of set the boundary of the whole area and

1189
01:00:43,300 --> 01:00:45,480
then we're sort of looking at these individual parcels.

1190
01:00:45,480 --> 01:00:47,539
Almost the exact same thing, just a different, calling it

1191
01:00:47,539 --> 01:00:48,480
something different.

1192
01:00:48,480 --> 01:00:49,480
Commissioner Ellis.

1193
01:00:49,480 --> 01:00:53,480
Thank you, Chair. And that's already planned.

1194
01:00:53,480 --> 01:00:55,880
That's already, like, the black is, it's already been

1195
01:00:55,880 --> 01:00:56,480
approved.

1196
01:00:56,480 --> 01:00:58,480
It's been in place, correct?

1197
01:00:58,480 --> 01:01:01,480
Yes.

1198
01:01:01,480 --> 01:01:05,030
So because we don't have planned developments in the 2002

1199
01:01:05,030 --> 01:01:08,480
code, we look at the 1991 code to review these projects.

1200
01:01:08,480 --> 01:01:12,239
And there are criteria for approval for detail plans in the

1201
01:01:12,239 --> 01:01:13,480
1991 code.

1202
01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:17,690
And just generally that the proposal must comply with the

1203
01:01:17,690 --> 01:01:21,400
concept plan, that it must provide for compatible

1204
01:01:21,400 --> 01:01:25,469
arrangements of buildings that would not adversely affect

1205
01:01:25,469 --> 01:01:27,480
adjoining properties outside of the PD.

1206
01:01:27,480 --> 01:01:30,480
That it would provide adequate circulation of traffic.

1207
01:01:30,480 --> 01:01:32,789
And that would be in substantial compliance with the city

1208
01:01:32,789 --> 01:01:33,480
regulations.

1209
01:01:33,480 --> 01:01:36,980
Staff has reviewed their request in association with the

1210
01:01:36,980 --> 01:01:40,269
criteria for approval and we believe that it meets the

1211
01:01:40,269 --> 01:01:43,510
criteria for approval and we'll go over some of these

1212
01:01:43,510 --> 01:01:44,480
things now.

1213
01:01:44,480 --> 01:01:48,250
So first of all, we'll just take a look at what the concept

1214
01:01:48,250 --> 01:01:49,480
plan called for.

1215
01:01:49,480 --> 01:01:52,119
And there were a couple maps in the concept plan and they

1216
01:01:52,119 --> 01:01:54,739
're a little hard to read, so we're going to do our best

1217
01:01:54,739 --> 01:01:55,480
together.

1218
01:01:55,480 --> 01:01:59,480
But so here is the general area we're talking about.

1219
01:01:59,480 --> 01:02:03,750
Here was the concept plan and the yellow circle is about

1220
01:02:03,750 --> 01:02:05,480
where the property is.

1221
01:02:05,480 --> 01:02:11,090
And I can tell because here is the city of Denton municipal

1222
01:02:11,090 --> 01:02:12,480
boundary.

1223
01:02:12,480 --> 01:02:15,480
And then you can tell this little corner is right here.

1224
01:02:15,480 --> 01:02:20,480
So it's in this general location.

1225
01:02:20,480 --> 01:02:22,480
Yes sir, yes sir.

1226
01:02:22,480 --> 01:02:25,829
And this was in a commercial shopping area which permitted

1227
01:02:25,829 --> 01:02:26,480
the use.

1228
01:02:26,480 --> 01:02:29,500
So that's the concept plan and that's what laid out the

1229
01:02:29,500 --> 01:02:31,480
uses in this area for this use.

1230
01:02:31,480 --> 01:02:33,480
And then we'll look at the site plan.

1231
01:02:33,480 --> 01:02:38,070
So this is kind of a just a zoomed in part of the site plan

1232
01:02:38,070 --> 01:02:38,480
.

1233
01:02:38,480 --> 01:02:42,090
So they're proposing an approximately 7400 square foot

1234
01:02:42,090 --> 01:02:45,480
building made of or constructed with masonry materials.

1235
01:02:45,480 --> 01:02:49,239
They're proposing, and that's in the yellow, they're

1236
01:02:49,239 --> 01:02:53,480
proposing a one access point to the I-35 frontage road.

1237
01:02:53,480 --> 01:02:58,380
This is the sale staging area here and it will be screened

1238
01:02:58,380 --> 01:03:02,480
from public view with a six foot masonry wall.

1239
01:03:02,480 --> 01:03:06,440
The code also in subchapter 13 has requirements related to

1240
01:03:06,440 --> 01:03:07,480
light and glare,

1241
01:03:07,480 --> 01:03:11,289
which they would conform with when they get to the building

1242
01:03:11,289 --> 01:03:12,480
permit stage.

1243
01:03:12,480 --> 01:03:17,739
And they are also agreed to making sure that those public

1244
01:03:17,739 --> 01:03:21,480
access address speakers would be faced in a way

1245
01:03:21,480 --> 01:03:26,480
that would minimize any impacts to adjacent properties.

1246
01:03:26,480 --> 01:03:28,480
This is their landscape plan.

1247
01:03:28,480 --> 01:03:32,739
They're proposing trees and shrubs along I-35 to present

1248
01:03:32,739 --> 01:03:35,480
well to the I-35 frontage road.

1249
01:03:35,480 --> 01:03:41,230
They're also proposing additional tree canopy to be planted

1250
01:03:41,230 --> 01:03:45,480
71,000 square feet at maturity.

1251
01:03:45,480 --> 01:03:49,130
And that they're also sort of back loaded those trees right

1252
01:03:49,130 --> 01:03:53,519
here adjacent to those residential areas to try to mitigate

1253
01:03:53,519 --> 01:03:58,769
any impacts that any light that would or noise that would

1254
01:03:58,769 --> 01:04:00,480
come from the site.

1255
01:04:00,480 --> 01:04:02,480
Public notification was sent out.

1256
01:04:02,480 --> 01:04:07,280
We've received two responses in favor and three in

1257
01:04:07,280 --> 01:04:08,480
opposition.

1258
01:04:08,480 --> 01:04:11,909
And I will, staff does recommend approval of the request as

1259
01:04:11,909 --> 01:04:14,480
it's consistent with the future land use.

1260
01:04:14,480 --> 01:04:17,829
It's compatible with the surrounding property and it meets

1261
01:04:17,829 --> 01:04:21,480
the criteria for approval for detail plans in the 91 code.

1262
01:04:21,480 --> 01:04:23,480
Can I stand for any questions?

1263
01:04:23,480 --> 01:04:24,480
Commissioner Sullivan.

1264
01:04:24,480 --> 01:04:27,829
I think in your presentation, if you would make it abund

1265
01:04:27,829 --> 01:04:31,900
antly clear that you're talking about the red line and not

1266
01:04:31,900 --> 01:04:32,480
the black,

1267
01:04:32,480 --> 01:04:36,480
because I think every one of these people who are opposed

1268
01:04:36,480 --> 01:04:39,880
sees the yellow line coming up next to Waterford and they

1269
01:04:39,880 --> 01:04:43,480
're going, whoa, Jack, back it up a little bit.

1270
01:04:43,480 --> 01:04:47,360
And so I think that needs to be clarified that we're not

1271
01:04:47,360 --> 01:04:53,190
talking about that hole in your map here, yellow, but in

1272
01:04:53,190 --> 01:04:54,480
the red.

1273
01:04:54,480 --> 01:04:57,480
Yes, sir. I will. I will. I'll do that.

1274
01:04:57,480 --> 01:04:58,480
Thank you very much.

1275
01:04:58,480 --> 01:04:59,480
You bet.

1276
01:04:59,480 --> 01:05:00,480
Commissioner Beck.

1277
01:05:00,480 --> 01:05:01,480
Thank you, Chair.

1278
01:05:01,480 --> 01:05:04,909
So down the road, because this is a planned development

1279
01:05:04,909 --> 01:05:08,599
area, things that would probably, but up close to these

1280
01:05:08,599 --> 01:05:11,969
neighborhoods would be something more amenable than a high

1281
01:05:11,969 --> 01:05:13,480
traffic business.

1282
01:05:13,480 --> 01:05:16,480
I think all of that area is in floodplain anyway.

1283
01:05:16,480 --> 01:05:19,480
Yeah. So here's the floodplain.

1284
01:05:19,480 --> 01:05:22,269
So as you can see, this is probably even better look at

1285
01:05:22,269 --> 01:05:25,960
where, really where they're proposing, because they're

1286
01:05:25,960 --> 01:05:30,480
trying to stay out of what are some natural conditions.

1287
01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:33,440
Okay, so there isn't much room for any other development

1288
01:05:33,440 --> 01:05:36,480
because of the floodplain unless they do some extensive.

1289
01:05:36,480 --> 01:05:39,730
I would say with any amount of engineering and money, you

1290
01:05:39,730 --> 01:05:42,480
could probably make a lot of things happen.

1291
01:05:42,480 --> 01:05:43,480
But, yeah.

1292
01:05:43,480 --> 01:05:47,480
Okay. So that's kind of a safeguard.

1293
01:05:47,480 --> 01:05:50,639
Would that be you then as a safeguard for these residents

1294
01:05:50,639 --> 01:05:52,480
that they're worried about?

1295
01:05:52,480 --> 01:05:55,610
I would ask C staff, but I don't think you can do anything

1296
01:05:55,610 --> 01:05:57,480
at the floodplain like that.

1297
01:05:57,480 --> 01:06:00,480
Thanks.

1298
01:06:00,480 --> 01:06:04,480
Okay. Any other questions on this item?

1299
01:06:04,480 --> 01:06:12,179
I'm going to call a break at 10 after six and let's try to

1300
01:06:12,179 --> 01:06:20,159
grab something to eat real quick and I'm going to visit

1301
01:06:20,159 --> 01:06:23,480
with Roman right quick.

1302
01:06:23,480 --> 01:06:30,349
To our agenda item five, I think it's E, four E, excuse me,

1303
01:06:30,349 --> 01:06:33,480
four E. I'll call on Roman for presentation.

1304
01:06:33,480 --> 01:06:36,739
Thank you, Chairman. I just want to give you all an outline

1305
01:06:36,739 --> 01:06:37,480
of this.

1306
01:06:37,480 --> 01:06:41,400
This is ordinance revisions of the historic preservation

1307
01:06:41,400 --> 01:06:42,480
ordinances.

1308
01:06:42,480 --> 01:06:45,710
The work for this, these revisions began in June and July

1309
01:06:45,710 --> 01:06:48,480
of last year with some community meetings.

1310
01:06:48,480 --> 01:06:53,110
And so I'm just going to actually I've got all that in here

1311
01:06:53,110 --> 01:06:54,139
. So the updated timeline of what happened here back in

1312
01:06:54,139 --> 01:06:55,989
April of 2016, we went to the Landmark Commission and City

1313
01:06:55,989 --> 01:07:01,929
Council and briefed them and received input to go forward

1314
01:07:01,929 --> 01:07:03,480
with revising the code.

1315
01:07:03,480 --> 01:07:08,760
We had meetings in June and July with the three historic

1316
01:07:08,760 --> 01:07:13,480
districts and got their input about the code.

1317
01:07:13,480 --> 01:07:16,909
And then we went in September to the Landmark Commission,

1318
01:07:16,909 --> 01:07:20,130
which asked for a month to look at the documents and then

1319
01:07:20,130 --> 01:07:22,480
unanimously recommended approval.

1320
01:07:22,480 --> 01:07:27,949
It's not on your staff report there. It was eight to zero

1321
01:07:27,949 --> 01:07:29,480
on the approval.

1322
01:07:29,480 --> 01:07:33,849
The major changes are it's just a thorough house cleaning

1323
01:07:33,849 --> 01:07:37,090
of the ordinances, which were really began, they were

1324
01:07:37,090 --> 01:07:40,480
really drafted in 86 and then amended over the years.

1325
01:07:40,480 --> 01:07:43,550
And through the good work of our staff and the legal

1326
01:07:43,550 --> 01:07:47,480
department, we're presenting a much more refined ordinance,

1327
01:07:47,480 --> 01:07:51,360
which can be easily integrated into the development code

1328
01:07:51,360 --> 01:07:52,480
amendments.

1329
01:07:52,480 --> 01:07:55,480
The multiple references to certificate of appropriateness.

1330
01:07:55,480 --> 01:07:58,389
There were like five sections that have that. That's all in

1331
01:07:58,389 --> 01:07:59,480
one section now.

1332
01:07:59,480 --> 01:08:03,239
The definitions have been aggregated into a section of the

1333
01:08:03,239 --> 01:08:05,480
city code that has definitions.

1334
01:08:05,480 --> 01:08:13,869
Criteria for designation has been clarified and all proced

1335
01:08:13,869 --> 01:08:18,020
urally oriented subsections were combined into a different

1336
01:08:18,020 --> 01:08:19,479
procedure section.

1337
01:08:19,479 --> 01:08:24,399
Substantive changes were recognition of the Belle Avenue

1338
01:08:24,399 --> 01:08:26,479
Conservation District.

1339
01:08:26,479 --> 01:08:27,479
Commissioner Ellis.

1340
01:08:27,479 --> 01:08:30,479
Thank you, Chair.

1341
01:08:30,479 --> 01:08:33,399
Roman does changing that from a conservation district to

1342
01:08:33,399 --> 01:08:36,510
historic district have any immediate impact on the property

1343
01:08:36,510 --> 01:08:37,479
owners there?

1344
01:08:37,479 --> 01:08:40,609
No, it doesn't. There's an additional change in the

1345
01:08:40,609 --> 01:08:44,270
ordinance itself with respect to a differentiation between

1346
01:08:44,270 --> 01:08:47,479
historic districts and conservation districts.

1347
01:08:47,479 --> 01:08:50,479
When that district was created as a conservation district,

1348
01:08:50,479 --> 01:08:53,720
the way we treated him was practically identical to the way

1349
01:08:53,720 --> 01:08:55,479
we treated historic districts.

1350
01:08:55,479 --> 01:08:59,529
With these amendments now, if you have a conservation

1351
01:08:59,529 --> 01:09:02,630
district, it truly can be called historic district light

1352
01:09:02,630 --> 01:09:07,029
because the only items you have to take to the Landmark

1353
01:09:07,029 --> 01:09:10,479
Commission would be demolitions and new construction.

1354
01:09:10,479 --> 01:09:13,909
Any other request in a future conservation district can be

1355
01:09:13,909 --> 01:09:17,479
approved administratively by the preservation officer.

1356
01:09:17,479 --> 01:09:20,579
So it's a way for a neighborhood that says we kind of want

1357
01:09:20,579 --> 01:09:23,479
to preserve the way this neighborhood looks.

1358
01:09:23,479 --> 01:09:26,109
If you're going to tear down one of our buildings or build

1359
01:09:26,109 --> 01:09:28,840
a new building, we do want the Landmark Commission to look

1360
01:09:28,840 --> 01:09:29,479
at that.

1361
01:09:29,479 --> 01:09:31,850
Anything else we want it to ride through quickly. And so

1362
01:09:31,850 --> 01:09:34,479
that is a differentiation in this code.

1363
01:09:34,479 --> 01:09:38,909
So for the district there, it has no difference other than

1364
01:09:38,909 --> 01:09:42,479
the name and whatever that comes with that.

1365
01:09:42,479 --> 01:09:45,760
So this is the way that looks in terms of seeing it struct

1366
01:09:45,760 --> 01:09:46,479
urally.

1367
01:09:46,479 --> 01:09:49,069
What happened on their left is the original sections or the

1368
01:09:49,069 --> 01:09:51,479
existing sections on your right is what you'll have.

1369
01:09:51,479 --> 01:09:56,010
So it's a little shorter and just a little more precise and

1370
01:09:56,010 --> 01:09:57,479
easier to read.

1371
01:09:57,479 --> 01:10:01,479
The minor changes are here.

1372
01:10:01,479 --> 01:10:04,479
The definitions that we that we have that are being moved.

1373
01:10:04,479 --> 01:10:07,909
And then on this item, this section 35, four, three, with

1374
01:10:07,909 --> 01:10:10,729
respect to the Landmark Commission, it's real simple

1375
01:10:10,729 --> 01:10:11,479
changes.

1376
01:10:11,479 --> 01:10:15,779
We're changing chairman to chair and we're changing that a

1377
01:10:15,779 --> 01:10:19,729
preservation plan will not be created by the Landmark

1378
01:10:19,729 --> 01:10:23,710
Commission itself, but that they will bless that that

1379
01:10:23,710 --> 01:10:26,420
creation of a plan because they wouldn't be creating that

1380
01:10:26,420 --> 01:10:27,479
plan on their own.

1381
01:10:27,479 --> 01:10:31,460
These are the input posters that I used in the community

1382
01:10:31,460 --> 01:10:32,479
meetings.

1383
01:10:32,479 --> 01:10:36,130
We had questions on fencing and landscaping and painting

1384
01:10:36,130 --> 01:10:39,649
and administrative authority and asked the people who

1385
01:10:39,649 --> 01:10:42,829
attended the different meetings to vote on what they

1386
01:10:42,829 --> 01:10:45,199
whether they wanted administrative approval or to go to the

1387
01:10:45,199 --> 01:10:47,750
Landmark Commission, where they wanted people to look at

1388
01:10:47,750 --> 01:10:48,479
the paint color.

1389
01:10:48,479 --> 01:10:53,479
So it was a good how we got the input and.

1390
01:10:53,479 --> 01:10:58,140
The next steps are we're here today and based on what you

1391
01:10:58,140 --> 01:11:01,479
recommend them will go to City Council.

1392
01:11:01,479 --> 01:11:04,479
And take any questions.

1393
01:11:04,479 --> 01:11:05,479
Commissioner Smith.

1394
01:11:05,479 --> 01:11:08,380
So the changes have no real real impact whatsoever on any

1395
01:11:08,380 --> 01:11:11,479
development done in those overlay districts correct.

1396
01:11:11,479 --> 01:11:12,479
That's correct.

1397
01:11:12,479 --> 01:11:12,479
Okay.

1398
01:11:12,479 --> 01:11:15,479
Not that wouldn't just just clerical cleanup.

1399
01:11:15,479 --> 01:11:18,479
If you're doing a new construction in any of the districts,

1400
01:11:18,479 --> 01:11:20,479
you'll be required to get a certificate of.

1401
01:11:20,479 --> 01:11:22,479
Of course, but no, no, no changing.

1402
01:11:22,479 --> 01:11:32,479
No real big changes other than just it's clear.

1403
01:11:32,479 --> 01:11:33,479
Thank you.

1404
01:11:33,479 --> 01:11:35,479
Right.

1405
01:11:35,479 --> 01:11:36,479
Wonderful.

1406
01:11:36,479 --> 01:11:38,510
We'll look forward to going through it a little more detail

1407
01:11:38,510 --> 01:11:39,479
in our public session.

1408
01:11:39,479 --> 01:11:41,479
Thanks for the abbreviated.

1409
01:11:41,479 --> 01:11:42,479
Thanks for at least getting through it.

1410
01:11:42,479 --> 01:11:47,479
Let us take a look at it before we run out of time.

1411
01:11:47,479 --> 01:11:52,869
So with that, no questions, I will close our work session

1412
01:11:52,869 --> 01:11:57,109
at six twenty two and we will try to reconvene as close as

1413
01:11:57,109 --> 01:12:00,479
we can at six thirty and council chambers.

1414
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:13,479
Thank you.

1415
01:12:13,479 --> 01:12:16,069
Good evening and welcome to the city of Denton planning and

1416
01:12:16,069 --> 01:12:19,479
zoning commission meeting for November the eighth, 2017.

1417
01:12:19,479 --> 01:12:23,239
This meeting has been duly posted and we do have a quorum

1418
01:12:23,239 --> 01:12:26,479
present and I will call us to order at six forty.

1419
01:12:26,479 --> 01:12:30,510
Our first first item of business will be to stand and give

1420
01:12:30,510 --> 01:12:39,479
the pledge to the U.S. and the Texas flag.

1421
01:12:39,479 --> 01:12:43,239
To the United States of America and to the republic for

1422
01:12:43,239 --> 01:12:48,250
which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with

1423
01:12:48,250 --> 01:12:52,479
liberty and justice for all.

1424
01:12:52,479 --> 01:13:10,260
one state, one God, one invisible.

1425
01:13:10,260 --> 01:13:12,640
And we'll move us to our consent agenda.

1426
01:13:12,640 --> 01:13:19,880
And we have one item it's going to be item B, FP17-0023.

1427
01:13:19,880 --> 01:13:23,800
That item is going to be moved to our items for individual

1428
01:13:23,800 --> 01:13:25,680
consideration and it will become

1429
01:13:25,680 --> 01:13:28,760
3B.

1430
01:13:28,760 --> 01:13:32,260
Other than that clarification and change, the chair would

1431
01:13:32,260 --> 01:13:33,840
entertain a motion for the

1432
01:13:33,840 --> 01:13:37,119
consent agenda.

1433
01:13:37,119 --> 01:13:38,119
Commissioner Smith.

1434
01:13:38,119 --> 01:13:41,109
A motion to accept with moving item B to items for

1435
01:13:41,109 --> 01:13:43,159
individual consideration.

1436
01:13:43,159 --> 01:13:44,159
Good.

1437
01:13:44,159 --> 01:13:45,159
Go ahead.

1438
01:13:45,159 --> 01:13:46,159
You have something?

1439
01:13:46,159 --> 01:13:47,159
I say correctly.

1440
01:13:47,159 --> 01:13:51,439
A motion for the consent agenda.

1441
01:13:51,439 --> 01:13:54,630
A motion to accept consent agenda with moving item B to

1442
01:13:54,630 --> 01:13:57,119
items for individual consideration.

1443
01:13:57,119 --> 01:13:59,760
Thank you for repeating that.

1444
01:13:59,760 --> 01:14:01,840
We're all on the same page now.

1445
01:14:01,840 --> 01:14:02,840
Commissioner Ellis.

1446
01:14:02,840 --> 01:14:03,840
Thank you, chair.

1447
01:14:03,840 --> 01:14:04,840
Second.

1448
01:14:04,840 --> 01:14:05,840
Okay.

1449
01:14:05,840 --> 01:14:09,390
We have a first and a second for approval with the change

1450
01:14:09,390 --> 01:14:11,600
of moving item 2B to our individual

1451
01:14:11,600 --> 01:14:14,199
consideration and that becomes 3B.

1452
01:14:14,199 --> 01:14:19,670
Any other discussion or clarification on the consent agenda

1453
01:14:19,670 --> 01:14:20,039
?

1454
01:14:20,039 --> 01:14:30,319
Seeing none, I'll call for a vote on the board.

1455
01:14:30,319 --> 01:14:33,239
That motion carries 7 to 0.

1456
01:14:33,239 --> 01:14:38,770
That will move us to our items for individual consideration

1457
01:14:38,770 --> 01:14:39,159
.

1458
01:14:39,159 --> 01:15:02,800
I will call on Haley for presentation of SP17-0051.

1459
01:15:02,800 --> 01:15:04,720
Good evening.

1460
01:15:04,720 --> 01:15:07,180
This request is for approval of a site plan for an

1461
01:15:07,180 --> 01:15:09,359
entertainment center to be constructed

1462
01:15:09,359 --> 01:15:12,319
within the razor ranch south RR2 district.

1463
01:15:12,319 --> 01:15:16,239
It's located on lot 17, block A of the razor ranch within

1464
01:15:16,239 --> 01:15:18,359
the razor ranch town center.

1465
01:15:18,359 --> 01:15:21,640
This area was recently rezoned to bring it from the south

1466
01:15:21,640 --> 01:15:23,479
mixed use district to the south

1467
01:15:23,479 --> 01:15:25,000
RR2 district.

1468
01:15:25,000 --> 01:15:29,229
The approximate location is shown here on the zoning map

1469
01:15:29,229 --> 01:15:30,680
outlined in red.

1470
01:15:30,680 --> 01:15:33,539
The property is about 3.7 acres.

1471
01:15:33,539 --> 01:15:36,439
It is located north of the future extension of panhandle.

1472
01:15:36,439 --> 01:15:39,399
You can see on the map here the general location in yellow.

1473
01:15:39,399 --> 01:15:43,590
It's just south of the current embassy suites and

1474
01:15:43,590 --> 01:15:47,960
convention center that's under construction.

1475
01:15:47,960 --> 01:15:51,750
Site plans within razor ranch are required to bring back to

1476
01:15:51,750 --> 01:15:54,140
the planning and zoning commission

1477
01:15:54,140 --> 01:15:55,359
for approval.

1478
01:15:55,359 --> 01:15:57,859
They are subject to the architectural and landscape

1479
01:15:57,859 --> 01:15:59,800
standards outlined in exhibit C1

1480
01:15:59,800 --> 01:16:02,920
and D1 of the overlay.

1481
01:16:02,920 --> 01:16:05,229
The site plans are required to contain a site plan, a

1482
01:16:05,229 --> 01:16:07,159
landscape plan, and building elevations,

1483
01:16:07,159 --> 01:16:09,960
which we'll now look at.

1484
01:16:09,960 --> 01:16:12,800
The site plan for this facility can be seen here.

1485
01:16:12,800 --> 01:16:16,560
It is just over 41,000 square feet total in building.

1486
01:16:16,560 --> 01:16:19,840
It has multiple uses that will be within there.

1487
01:16:19,840 --> 01:16:23,319
In red you can see an area where bowling lanes will be.

1488
01:16:23,319 --> 01:16:25,939
Outlined in green is the approximate location for an arcade

1489
01:16:25,939 --> 01:16:26,159
.

1490
01:16:26,159 --> 01:16:28,840
There will be an event space, which is outlined in blue.

1491
01:16:28,840 --> 01:16:32,300
And then there will be a restaurant within the remainder of

1492
01:16:32,300 --> 01:16:33,079
the area.

1493
01:16:33,079 --> 01:16:37,270
The site will feature 165 parking spaces, which are all

1494
01:16:37,270 --> 01:16:38,800
shown here on the map.

1495
01:16:38,800 --> 01:16:40,319
Bicycle racks will also be provided.

1496
01:16:40,319 --> 01:16:43,109
They'll be within what's labeled as a gathering area on the

1497
01:16:43,109 --> 01:16:45,340
south side of the building.

1498
01:16:45,340 --> 01:16:49,550
And access to the site will be taken from internal streets

1499
01:16:49,550 --> 01:16:52,520
within the razor ranch development.

1500
01:16:52,520 --> 01:16:56,710
The site will contain around 16% landscaping and 50% tree

1501
01:16:56,710 --> 01:16:57,359
canopy.

1502
01:16:57,359 --> 01:17:00,060
Those both exceed the minimum requirements for the overlay,

1503
01:17:00,060 --> 01:17:01,720
which would be 10% landscaping

1504
01:17:01,720 --> 01:17:03,840
and 20% canopy.

1505
01:17:03,840 --> 01:17:07,920
The site also exceeds the requirements for plaza area.

1506
01:17:07,920 --> 01:17:11,189
So it's going to have about 4,800 square feet of outdoor pl

1507
01:17:11,189 --> 01:17:12,640
aza area that will include

1508
01:17:12,640 --> 01:17:15,789
benches, tables, trees, other shade provided by the

1509
01:17:15,789 --> 01:17:16,600
building.

1510
01:17:16,600 --> 01:17:20,920
And those bicycle racks will be incorporated into that pl

1511
01:17:20,920 --> 01:17:21,859
aza area.

1512
01:17:21,859 --> 01:17:23,840
The elevations for the building can be seen here.

1513
01:17:23,840 --> 01:17:25,359
This is the south side.

1514
01:17:25,359 --> 01:17:27,840
So the front of the building will face south.

1515
01:17:27,840 --> 01:17:32,520
The west elevation is shown there on the bottom.

1516
01:17:32,520 --> 01:17:36,760
Then we have the north elevation, which will be the rear of

1517
01:17:36,760 --> 01:17:39,720
the building and the east elevation.

1518
01:17:39,720 --> 01:17:42,029
As outlined in the overlay, the Planning and Zoning

1519
01:17:42,029 --> 01:17:43,659
Commission shall approve a site plan

1520
01:17:43,659 --> 01:17:46,550
if it substantially complies with the concept and schematic

1521
01:17:46,550 --> 01:17:47,000
plan.

1522
01:17:47,000 --> 01:17:49,789
If it provides a compatible arrangement of buildings and

1523
01:17:49,789 --> 01:17:51,560
land uses, it wouldn't adversely

1524
01:17:51,560 --> 01:17:55,199
affect adjoining properties.

1525
01:17:55,199 --> 01:17:57,789
If it provides for adequate and safe circulation of veh

1526
01:17:57,789 --> 01:17:59,640
icular traffic and if it complies with

1527
01:17:59,640 --> 01:18:02,079
all other sections of the overlay district.

1528
01:18:02,079 --> 01:18:05,510
Through our review of the site plan, we did find that it

1529
01:18:05,510 --> 01:18:07,479
meets all of these criteria.

1530
01:18:07,479 --> 01:18:09,819
Staff is recommending approval of the site plan because it

1531
01:18:09,819 --> 01:18:10,920
is compliant with all the

1532
01:18:10,920 --> 01:18:13,890
regulations of the razor range overlay district and meets

1533
01:18:13,890 --> 01:18:15,600
the criteria for approval that were

1534
01:18:15,600 --> 01:18:16,600
just outlined.

1535
01:18:16,600 --> 01:18:18,640
I can stand for any questions.

1536
01:18:18,640 --> 01:18:19,640
One question.

1537
01:18:19,640 --> 01:18:20,640
Commissioner Beck.

1538
01:18:20,640 --> 01:18:21,640
Thank you, Chair.

1539
01:18:21,640 --> 01:18:26,920
Does the plaza area have a canopy over it or is it open?

1540
01:18:26,920 --> 01:18:27,920
Much of it is open.

1541
01:18:27,920 --> 01:18:30,229
There will be shade provided by some protrusions from the

1542
01:18:30,229 --> 01:18:31,600
building as well as from the trees

1543
01:18:31,600 --> 01:18:32,600
that are planted within it.

1544
01:18:32,600 --> 01:18:33,600
Okay.

1545
01:18:33,600 --> 01:18:34,600
But no canopy of any kind.

1546
01:18:34,600 --> 01:18:35,600
Okay.

1547
01:18:35,600 --> 01:18:36,600
Thank you.

1548
01:18:36,600 --> 01:18:41,399
Any other questions for Haley?

1549
01:18:41,399 --> 01:18:43,079
Thank you, Haley.

1550
01:18:43,079 --> 01:18:45,479
This is an individual consideration item.

1551
01:18:45,479 --> 01:18:48,300
It's not a public hearing, but if you would like to speak

1552
01:18:48,300 --> 01:18:49,840
on it on this item, you're welcome

1553
01:18:49,840 --> 01:18:50,840
to come forward.

1554
01:18:50,840 --> 01:18:53,739
I don't know if the applicant would like to add anything to

1555
01:18:53,739 --> 01:18:55,560
the staff's presentation.

1556
01:18:55,560 --> 01:18:56,560
No?

1557
01:18:56,560 --> 01:18:57,560
Okay.

1558
01:18:57,560 --> 01:19:04,279
Seeing none, the chair will open this item, put it on the

1559
01:19:04,279 --> 01:19:08,399
floor for discussion or motion.

1560
01:19:08,399 --> 01:19:10,359
Commissioner Beck.

1561
01:19:10,359 --> 01:19:11,359
Thank you.

1562
01:19:11,359 --> 01:19:14,359
I move to approve Z170016.

1563
01:19:14,359 --> 01:19:15,359
Okay.

1564
01:19:15,359 --> 01:19:16,359
Thank you.

1565
01:19:16,359 --> 01:19:17,359
Oops.

1566
01:19:17,359 --> 01:19:18,359
Sorry.

1567
01:19:18,359 --> 01:19:19,359
Not the right one.

1568
01:19:19,359 --> 01:19:21,359
I move to approve this item.

1569
01:19:21,359 --> 01:19:22,359
Okay.

1570
01:19:22,359 --> 01:19:23,359
Commissioner Smith.

1571
01:19:23,359 --> 01:19:28,640
I second the motion to approve SB170051 just for correction

1572
01:19:28,640 --> 01:19:28,960
.

1573
01:19:28,960 --> 01:19:29,960
Good.

1574
01:19:29,960 --> 01:19:31,680
Thank you for the clarification.

1575
01:19:31,680 --> 01:19:35,359
We have a first and a second for approval.

1576
01:19:35,359 --> 01:19:37,560
Any further discussion?

1577
01:19:37,560 --> 01:19:48,039
I'll call for a vote on board.

1578
01:19:48,039 --> 01:19:49,720
Motion carries 7-0.

1579
01:19:49,720 --> 01:19:52,399
Good luck with your project.

1580
01:19:52,399 --> 01:19:55,920
That will move us to our item.

1581
01:19:55,920 --> 01:19:59,319
Get the correct number.

1582
01:19:59,319 --> 01:20:04,579
Our second item on our individual consideration tonight is

1583
01:20:04,579 --> 01:20:08,039
going to be FP17-0023.

1584
01:20:08,039 --> 01:20:17,800
And I will call on Haley for a presentation of that item.

1585
01:20:17,800 --> 01:20:22,390
FP17-0023 is a final plat of five lots within the Razor

1586
01:20:22,390 --> 01:20:23,840
Ranch Town Center.

1587
01:20:23,840 --> 01:20:27,859
We have lot 17 through 20 of block A here on the north side

1588
01:20:27,859 --> 01:20:29,560
of Panhandle and lot 1 of

1589
01:20:29,560 --> 01:20:33,239
block B located on the south side.

1590
01:20:33,239 --> 01:20:35,550
This plat also includes the dedication of right of way for

1591
01:20:35,550 --> 01:20:36,680
Heritage Trail and Panhandle

1592
01:20:36,680 --> 01:20:37,680
Drive.

1593
01:20:37,680 --> 01:20:39,159
And I can stand for any questions.

1594
01:20:39,159 --> 01:20:41,760
I'm going to ask for a clarification from Richard.

1595
01:20:41,760 --> 01:20:43,949
I believe we pulled this item off the consent agenda

1596
01:20:43,949 --> 01:20:45,720
because there was a recommendation.

1597
01:20:45,720 --> 01:20:49,439
Do we want to add that to this?

1598
01:20:49,439 --> 01:20:50,439
Yes, sir.

1599
01:20:50,439 --> 01:20:51,439
Have that correct?

1600
01:20:51,439 --> 01:20:53,039
Yeah, I can discuss that.

1601
01:20:53,039 --> 01:20:55,819
So the condition for approval is that this is still pending

1602
01:20:55,819 --> 01:20:57,199
approval of the associated

1603
01:20:57,199 --> 01:20:58,500
civil plans.

1604
01:20:58,500 --> 01:21:00,500
Those are under review by staff.

1605
01:21:00,500 --> 01:21:02,970
We don't anticipate any major changes, but there could be

1606
01:21:02,970 --> 01:21:04,640
minor tweaks to easement locations

1607
01:21:04,640 --> 01:21:07,250
or something like that that we would request to be able to

1608
01:21:07,250 --> 01:21:08,920
be approved at the staff level.

1609
01:21:08,920 --> 01:21:10,720
Does that take care of it?

1610
01:21:10,720 --> 01:21:11,720
That does.

1611
01:21:11,720 --> 01:21:12,720
Okay.

1612
01:21:12,720 --> 01:21:13,720
Great.

1613
01:21:13,720 --> 01:21:17,239
I'm going to call for a clarification.

1614
01:21:17,239 --> 01:21:18,239
Commissioner Roselle.

1615
01:21:18,239 --> 01:21:25,119
I motion to approve FP 17-003 with those conditions.

1616
01:21:25,119 --> 01:21:26,119
Commissioner Smith.

1617
01:21:26,119 --> 01:21:27,119
I second that motion.

1618
01:21:27,119 --> 01:21:28,119
Okay.

1619
01:21:28,119 --> 01:21:29,520
We have a first and a second for approval.

1620
01:21:29,520 --> 01:21:33,880
Any further discussion?

1621
01:21:33,880 --> 01:21:42,039
Seeing none, I'll call for a vote on the board.

1622
01:21:42,039 --> 01:21:44,279
Motion carries 7-0.

1623
01:21:44,279 --> 01:21:49,979
Good luck with your project.

1624
01:21:49,979 --> 01:21:52,859
That will move us to our public hearing section this

1625
01:21:52,859 --> 01:21:53,600
evening.

1626
01:21:53,600 --> 01:21:59,270
At this time, I'm going to open the public hearing for Z17-

1627
01:21:59,270 --> 01:22:02,720
0016, and I will call on Haley

1628
01:22:02,720 --> 01:22:04,119
for presentation.

1629
01:22:04,119 --> 01:22:07,920
Because while we're waiting on that, I want to pause.

1630
01:22:07,920 --> 01:22:11,960
We have one card from Jason Dernbos.

1631
01:22:11,960 --> 01:22:14,550
It doesn't have an agenda item, and I just want to clarify

1632
01:22:14,550 --> 01:22:15,800
which agenda item you would

1633
01:22:15,800 --> 01:22:17,560
like to speak on.

1634
01:22:17,560 --> 01:22:18,560
This one?

1635
01:22:18,560 --> 01:22:19,560
Okay.

1636
01:22:19,560 --> 01:22:20,560
Glad I asked at this time.

1637
01:22:20,560 --> 01:22:21,560
All right.

1638
01:22:21,560 --> 01:22:22,560
Good.

1639
01:22:22,560 --> 01:22:25,479
Lucky for you.

1640
01:22:25,479 --> 01:22:26,479
Thank you, Haley.

1641
01:22:26,479 --> 01:22:27,479
Please continue.

1642
01:22:27,479 --> 01:22:28,479
All right.

1643
01:22:28,479 --> 01:22:31,960
So this presentation will cover both items A and B on the

1644
01:22:31,960 --> 01:22:35,319
public hearing agenda, so Z17-0016

1645
01:22:35,319 --> 01:22:38,800
and S17-09.

1646
01:22:38,800 --> 01:22:40,439
So there are two requests.

1647
01:22:40,439 --> 01:22:44,630
The first is for a rezoning that would be for the entire 72

1648
01:22:44,630 --> 01:22:46,600
acres outlined here in yellow

1649
01:22:46,600 --> 01:22:49,350
from an industrial center employment district to

1650
01:22:49,350 --> 01:22:52,159
neighborhood residential mixed use district.

1651
01:22:52,159 --> 01:22:55,680
The second aspect of the request is for a specific use

1652
01:22:55,680 --> 01:22:58,000
permit to allow for a multifamily

1653
01:22:58,000 --> 01:23:03,909
use on about 32.6 acres and an outdoor recreation use on 19

1654
01:23:03,909 --> 01:23:05,239
.9 acres.

1655
01:23:05,239 --> 01:23:07,550
As you can see here, the property is located on the south

1656
01:23:07,550 --> 01:23:08,380
side of Oak Street.

1657
01:23:08,380 --> 01:23:13,119
This is west of I-35 near the airport.

1658
01:23:13,119 --> 01:23:15,430
The future land use designation for the property is

1659
01:23:15,430 --> 01:23:16,539
industrial commerce.

1660
01:23:16,539 --> 01:23:20,729
The intent of that designation is to promote both light and

1661
01:23:20,729 --> 01:23:22,600
heavy industrial uses.

1662
01:23:22,600 --> 01:23:28,010
This area also encourages supporting commercial uses as

1663
01:23:28,010 --> 01:23:28,840
well.

1664
01:23:28,840 --> 01:23:32,300
The proposed NRMU district does not meet the intent of that

1665
01:23:32,300 --> 01:23:34,279
future land use designation.

1666
01:23:34,279 --> 01:23:36,920
And when a request doesn't conform to the future land use

1667
01:23:36,920 --> 01:23:38,399
map, the Denton Development

1668
01:23:38,399 --> 01:23:42,279
Code provides for additional criteria for consideration.

1669
01:23:42,279 --> 01:23:45,159
Those criteria are meant to balance the competing interests

1670
01:23:45,159 --> 01:23:47,079
that occur between public health,

1671
01:23:47,079 --> 01:23:50,640
safety, the general welfare versus the right to the use of

1672
01:23:50,640 --> 01:23:51,720
the property.

1673
01:23:51,720 --> 01:23:54,539
These criteria include examining the existing land use

1674
01:23:54,539 --> 01:23:56,479
pattern, whether or not an isolated

1675
01:23:56,479 --> 01:23:59,180
zoning district would be created, adequate infrastructure

1676
01:23:59,180 --> 01:24:00,960
provision, potential environmental

1677
01:24:00,960 --> 01:24:05,359
impacts and the general character of the district.

1678
01:24:05,359 --> 01:24:08,020
So looking into those a little bit further, it's important

1679
01:24:08,020 --> 01:24:09,520
to point out that this property

1680
01:24:09,520 --> 01:24:13,340
is within the boundaries of the West Park tax increment

1681
01:24:13,340 --> 01:24:15,000
reinvestment zone.

1682
01:24:15,000 --> 01:24:18,289
That entire area shown here in the hatched orange lines, it

1683
01:24:18,289 --> 01:24:20,279
's about 800 acres total.

1684
01:24:20,279 --> 01:24:23,880
This entire area is designated this way to promote

1685
01:24:23,880 --> 01:24:26,720
industrial development by providing

1686
01:24:26,720 --> 01:24:29,840
some tax incentives to help support the public

1687
01:24:29,840 --> 01:24:32,760
infrastructure needs that would be here as

1688
01:24:32,760 --> 01:24:36,640
the area develops.

1689
01:24:36,640 --> 01:24:39,130
Looking at what's around the property in terms of zoning,

1690
01:24:39,130 --> 01:24:41,159
we have primarily industrial districts

1691
01:24:41,159 --> 01:24:44,449
west of I-35, so the ICE district, which includes the

1692
01:24:44,449 --> 01:24:46,800
subject property, as well as some other

1693
01:24:46,800 --> 01:24:50,560
key features such as 84 lumber to the north.

1694
01:24:50,560 --> 01:24:53,789
There's a reader link and the Benny Keith distribution

1695
01:24:53,789 --> 01:24:55,119
centers in the area.

1696
01:24:55,119 --> 01:24:58,350
We also have the ICG district adjoining the property across

1697
01:24:58,350 --> 01:25:00,079
what would be precision drive,

1698
01:25:00,079 --> 01:25:01,720
it's undeveloped land.

1699
01:25:01,720 --> 01:25:03,560
There's some gas wells in the area.

1700
01:25:03,560 --> 01:25:06,520
And then we have the Peterbilt facility here to the

1701
01:25:06,520 --> 01:25:08,359
southwest of the property.

1702
01:25:08,359 --> 01:25:11,039
Across I-35, you get a much greater mixture of zoning

1703
01:25:11,039 --> 01:25:12,960
districts and uses, some key features

1704
01:25:12,960 --> 01:25:16,720
being the razor ranch area here to the northeast, the

1705
01:25:16,720 --> 01:25:17,960
hospital area.

1706
01:25:17,960 --> 01:25:22,180
We have UNT's campus and many of the associated multifamily

1707
01:25:22,180 --> 01:25:23,279
uses there.

1708
01:25:23,279 --> 01:25:30,159
And then the UNT football stadium here to the southeast.

1709
01:25:30,159 --> 01:25:33,640
Access to the site would primarily be from West Oak Street.

1710
01:25:33,640 --> 01:25:36,000
That is designated as a primary arterial.

1711
01:25:36,000 --> 01:25:38,640
Currently it's a two-lane undivided roadway.

1712
01:25:38,640 --> 01:25:41,909
Based on its classification, it's intended to ultimately be

1713
01:25:41,909 --> 01:25:43,460
a six-lane divided road.

1714
01:25:43,460 --> 01:25:46,720
We have precision drive, which currently dead ends as a two

1715
01:25:46,720 --> 01:25:48,439
-lane undivided road here at the

1716
01:25:48,439 --> 01:25:51,520
south end of the property, that would be extended north

1717
01:25:51,520 --> 01:25:53,880
with this development and would continue

1718
01:25:53,880 --> 01:25:57,119
to be a two-lane undivided road as it moves north.

1719
01:25:57,119 --> 01:26:01,350
There's also a Kansas City rail line that runs along the

1720
01:26:01,350 --> 01:26:04,279
eastern boundary of the property.

1721
01:26:04,279 --> 01:26:07,510
Now getting into more of the specifics of what this request

1722
01:26:07,510 --> 01:26:09,439
is intended to help develop,

1723
01:26:09,439 --> 01:26:13,359
and that would be multifamily and outdoor recreation uses.

1724
01:26:13,359 --> 01:26:17,180
So the specific use permit is requesting the permission to

1725
01:26:17,180 --> 01:26:19,079
do a multifamily use here in

1726
01:26:19,079 --> 01:26:20,079
the area shown as green.

1727
01:26:20,079 --> 01:26:22,880
That would be phase one of the development.

1728
01:26:22,880 --> 01:26:27,689
That would include 189 units of multifamily, a total of 700

1729
01:26:27,689 --> 01:26:29,279
bedrooms, with a density just

1730
01:26:29,279 --> 01:26:32,020
under nine dwelling units per acre.

1731
01:26:32,020 --> 01:26:35,739
Phase two would also be multifamily, shown here in red.

1732
01:26:35,739 --> 01:26:39,439
That would be 100 units, 376 bedrooms total.

1733
01:26:39,439 --> 01:26:43,649
Again, just about nine dwelling units per acre in total

1734
01:26:43,649 --> 01:26:44,520
density.

1735
01:26:44,520 --> 01:26:48,159
The third phase includes the second use, which is outdoor

1736
01:26:48,159 --> 01:26:50,479
recreation, and this is shown here

1737
01:26:50,479 --> 01:26:55,239
as five ball fields and associated parking.

1738
01:26:55,239 --> 01:26:58,119
The balance of the acreage of the property is encompassed

1739
01:26:58,119 --> 01:26:59,600
in this lake, which is about

1740
01:26:59,600 --> 01:27:02,479
15 acres total.

1741
01:27:02,479 --> 01:27:06,250
The lake also is surrounded by a floodplain as well as rip

1742
01:27:06,250 --> 01:27:08,439
arian buffer environmentally

1743
01:27:08,439 --> 01:27:09,600
sensitive area.

1744
01:27:09,600 --> 01:27:12,689
The boundaries of that environmentally sensitive area are

1745
01:27:12,689 --> 01:27:14,479
outlined in blue on the map, so it

1746
01:27:14,479 --> 01:27:17,640
is a sizable portion of the property.

1747
01:27:17,640 --> 01:27:21,699
And any development within that ESA would require that the

1748
01:27:21,699 --> 01:27:23,760
applicant go through a field

1749
01:27:23,760 --> 01:27:26,659
assessment to determine if the ESA is in fact intact on the

1750
01:27:26,659 --> 01:27:28,239
property, and if it is, they

1751
01:27:28,239 --> 01:27:30,359
would then have to go through an alternative

1752
01:27:30,359 --> 01:27:32,680
environmentally sensitive area plan to allow

1753
01:27:32,680 --> 01:27:37,579
any development within that boundary.

1754
01:27:37,579 --> 01:27:39,710
These are just some samples of the elevations and the type

1755
01:27:39,710 --> 01:27:40,920
of building that they would be

1756
01:27:40,920 --> 01:27:41,920
including on the property.

1757
01:27:41,920 --> 01:27:44,880
You can see it's a mixture of styles, some looking more

1758
01:27:44,880 --> 01:27:46,960
like single family, others looking

1759
01:27:46,960 --> 01:27:52,319
more like a threeplex or a fourplex.

1760
01:27:52,319 --> 01:27:54,630
Notification was sent about both of the requests, the

1761
01:27:54,630 --> 01:27:55,600
zoning and the SUP.

1762
01:27:55,600 --> 01:27:59,579
We received two responses from those within 200 feet.

1763
01:27:59,579 --> 01:28:01,720
Both of those were for the zoning request.

1764
01:28:01,720 --> 01:28:02,720
One was in opposition.

1765
01:28:02,720 --> 01:28:06,479
You can see the property outlined in red, and one was in

1766
01:28:06,479 --> 01:28:07,140
favor.

1767
01:28:07,140 --> 01:28:09,989
Within the 200 foot boundary, based on the area that is

1768
01:28:09,989 --> 01:28:12,000
just within that boundary, 22%

1769
01:28:12,000 --> 01:28:15,039
of the land area expressed opposition to the request.

1770
01:28:15,039 --> 01:28:19,760
So at City Council, there would be a super majority vote

1771
01:28:19,760 --> 01:28:20,939
required.

1772
01:28:20,939 --> 01:28:23,979
Staff is recommending denial of the zoning request based on

1773
01:28:23,979 --> 01:28:25,319
these three criteria.

1774
01:28:25,319 --> 01:28:28,329
It's incompatibility with the surrounding land use pattern,

1775
01:28:28,329 --> 01:28:29,859
inconsistency with the goals

1776
01:28:29,859 --> 01:28:32,449
of the West Park terrors, and inconsistency with the goals

1777
01:28:32,449 --> 01:28:33,800
and objectives of the Denton

1778
01:28:33,800 --> 01:28:37,270
Plan 2030 in terms of this area being designated for

1779
01:28:37,270 --> 01:28:38,800
industrial commerce.

1780
01:28:38,800 --> 01:28:39,800
Staff?

1781
01:28:39,800 --> 01:28:44,449
>> Can I just clarify for the record that that 22%

1782
01:28:44,449 --> 01:28:47,399
objection is for the SUP portion?

1783
01:28:47,399 --> 01:28:48,640
>> Those were -- >> Or the zoning?

1784
01:28:48,640 --> 01:28:50,439
>> Those were sent in for the zoning case.

1785
01:28:50,439 --> 01:28:51,439
>> For the zoning case.

1786
01:28:51,439 --> 01:28:52,439
Okay.

1787
01:28:52,439 --> 01:28:56,239
>> Staff is also recommending denial of the SUP request for

1788
01:28:56,239 --> 01:28:57,840
those same reasons.

1789
01:28:57,840 --> 01:28:59,739
Incompatibility with the land use pattern, the goals of the

1790
01:28:59,739 --> 01:29:00,720
terrors, and the goals of

1791
01:29:00,720 --> 01:29:02,520
the Denton Plan 2030.

1792
01:29:02,520 --> 01:29:05,279
However, if the Planning and Zoning Commission votes to

1793
01:29:05,279 --> 01:29:07,399
recommend approval of this request,

1794
01:29:07,399 --> 01:29:10,449
staff would recommend the following conditions be placed on

1795
01:29:10,449 --> 01:29:11,039
the SUP.

1796
01:29:11,039 --> 01:29:13,460
The first condition being that the site plan, landscape

1797
01:29:13,460 --> 01:29:15,000
plan, and building elevations as

1798
01:29:15,000 --> 01:29:18,350
presented to you tonight would all be considered conceptual

1799
01:29:18,350 --> 01:29:18,560
.

1800
01:29:18,560 --> 01:29:21,149
A full site plan submittal would be required for each phase

1801
01:29:21,149 --> 01:29:22,479
of the development as it moves

1802
01:29:22,479 --> 01:29:26,449
forward to help verify and ensure that all aspects of it

1803
01:29:26,449 --> 01:29:28,680
are compliant with the Denton

1804
01:29:28,680 --> 01:29:32,039
Development Code in terms of site design, landscaping,

1805
01:29:32,039 --> 01:29:34,119
parking, and building design.

1806
01:29:34,119 --> 01:29:37,550
The second criteria or condition would be that a full

1807
01:29:37,550 --> 01:29:39,479
assessment of the ESA on site

1808
01:29:39,479 --> 01:29:42,300
would be required before any development could occur within

1809
01:29:42,300 --> 01:29:43,680
those boundaries and if that

1810
01:29:43,680 --> 01:29:46,359
is verified that an alternative ESA plan would have to be

1811
01:29:46,359 --> 01:29:48,119
approved for that development to

1812
01:29:48,119 --> 01:29:50,000
occur.

1813
01:29:50,000 --> 01:29:52,869
The third criteria would be that the development of the

1814
01:29:52,869 --> 01:29:55,439
multifamily use be limited to the 32.6

1815
01:29:55,439 --> 01:29:58,560
acres shown here tonight and the outdoor recreation use be

1816
01:29:58,560 --> 01:30:00,720
limited to the 19.9 acres that were

1817
01:30:00,720 --> 01:30:02,520
outlined.

1818
01:30:02,520 --> 01:30:05,770
The multifamily use we would encourage to not contain any

1819
01:30:05,770 --> 01:30:07,960
more than the 289 units shown

1820
01:30:07,960 --> 01:30:11,189
and the density for that be calculated strictly on the land

1821
01:30:11,189 --> 01:30:12,840
area that was outlined on the

1822
01:30:12,840 --> 01:30:15,920
site plan rather than the total acreage of the property.

1823
01:30:15,920 --> 01:30:17,479
And with that I can stand for any questions.

1824
01:30:17,479 --> 01:30:18,479
>> Yep.

1825
01:30:18,479 --> 01:30:19,479
Got a couple questions for you.

1826
01:30:19,479 --> 01:30:20,479
Commissioner Smith.

1827
01:30:20,479 --> 01:30:21,479
>> Thank you, Chair.

1828
01:30:21,479 --> 01:30:25,529
We did clarify in our work session that the TURS would not

1829
01:30:25,529 --> 01:30:27,960
be applicable for a multifamily

1830
01:30:27,960 --> 01:30:29,720
within an RMU.

1831
01:30:29,720 --> 01:30:30,720
>> That's correct.

1832
01:30:30,720 --> 01:30:33,109
The TURS project plan specifically excludes reimbursement

1833
01:30:33,109 --> 01:30:34,000
for multifamily.

1834
01:30:34,000 --> 01:30:35,000
>> Got it.

1835
01:30:35,000 --> 01:30:36,000
Thank you.

1836
01:30:36,000 --> 01:30:40,640
Jim, Jinx, can I ask you a quick question about mobility?

1837
01:30:40,640 --> 01:30:52,189
I don't think Haley wants to answer questions about DCTA

1838
01:30:52,189 --> 01:30:55,000
bus lines.

1839
01:30:55,000 --> 01:30:58,000
Not even sure if you're 100% the right person to ask on

1840
01:30:58,000 --> 01:30:59,640
this, but if we were to approve

1841
01:30:59,640 --> 01:31:03,630
it and this is the applicant wants to use this for student

1842
01:31:03,630 --> 01:31:05,680
housing primarily, no bus

1843
01:31:05,680 --> 01:31:08,689
lines go on that side of 35 to be able to service student

1844
01:31:08,689 --> 01:31:10,520
housing, be able to get students

1845
01:31:10,520 --> 01:31:14,729
to the university, what -- would there be a process for the

1846
01:31:14,729 --> 01:31:16,439
applicant to have to go

1847
01:31:16,439 --> 01:31:19,869
through to try to get expansion that way or there's nothing

1848
01:31:19,869 --> 01:31:21,159
we can do with DCTA to try

1849
01:31:21,159 --> 01:31:24,600
to get bus lines over to that side at all, correct?

1850
01:31:24,600 --> 01:31:27,359
>> I would think that we could approach DCTA.

1851
01:31:27,359 --> 01:31:30,260
>> But otherwise they'd have to drive to the university,

1852
01:31:30,260 --> 01:31:31,800
drive to the closest bus stop

1853
01:31:31,800 --> 01:31:33,399
or walk to the closest bus stop.

1854
01:31:33,399 --> 01:31:34,399
>> Yes, sir.

1855
01:31:34,399 --> 01:31:35,399
>> Correct.

1856
01:31:35,399 --> 01:31:36,399
Got it.

1857
01:31:36,399 --> 01:31:37,399
That's all.

1858
01:31:37,399 --> 01:31:38,399
>> Commissioner Rossell.

1859
01:31:38,399 --> 01:31:40,600
>> Thank you, chair.

1860
01:31:40,600 --> 01:31:41,600
Excuse me.

1861
01:31:41,600 --> 01:31:45,369
Haley, can you tell me a little bit about the TURS,

1862
01:31:45,369 --> 01:31:47,920
specifically, do you know when it

1863
01:31:47,920 --> 01:31:50,359
was established and what established that?

1864
01:31:50,359 --> 01:31:53,829
Was that a council vote or was that a citywide vote that

1865
01:31:53,829 --> 01:31:55,359
established that?

1866
01:31:55,359 --> 01:32:01,300
>> You're talking about the election, an election or a city

1867
01:32:01,300 --> 01:32:03,039
council vote?

1868
01:32:03,039 --> 01:32:05,920
>> I just -- the TURS, how did that come into being?

1869
01:32:05,920 --> 01:32:10,310
>> The TURS is created by city council and there's a board

1870
01:32:10,310 --> 01:32:12,439
that's established and then

1871
01:32:12,439 --> 01:32:14,560
the project and finance plans are approved through the

1872
01:32:14,560 --> 01:32:15,760
board and then to city council

1873
01:32:15,760 --> 01:32:16,760
for approval.

1874
01:32:16,760 --> 01:32:18,119
>> It didn't go to a citywide vote?

1875
01:32:18,119 --> 01:32:19,119
>> No.

1876
01:32:19,119 --> 01:32:20,119
>> Okay.

1877
01:32:20,119 --> 01:32:23,119
>> It was created in 2012, I believe.

1878
01:32:23,119 --> 01:32:24,119
>> 2012?

1879
01:32:24,119 --> 01:32:25,119
>> Mm-hmm.

1880
01:32:25,119 --> 01:32:29,680
>> And then can you also help me understand the density?

1881
01:32:29,680 --> 01:32:32,350
Typically they would have the ability to use their entire

1882
01:32:32,350 --> 01:32:34,039
property to calculate density.

1883
01:32:34,039 --> 01:32:38,539
Why are you recommending, if the zoning was to approve it,

1884
01:32:38,539 --> 01:32:40,560
the third condition on the

1885
01:32:40,560 --> 01:32:41,560
density?

1886
01:32:41,560 --> 01:32:45,319
>> The intent was to limit it to the number of units shown

1887
01:32:45,319 --> 01:32:48,439
because 1,000 potential bedrooms

1888
01:32:48,439 --> 01:32:51,029
in this area is quite a large enhancement to the number of

1889
01:32:51,029 --> 01:32:52,319
people driving and living

1890
01:32:52,319 --> 01:32:53,640
in the area.

1891
01:32:53,640 --> 01:32:57,069
The intent with the density was that there not be a density

1892
01:32:57,069 --> 01:32:58,720
bonus obtained by using the

1893
01:32:58,720 --> 01:33:01,409
acreage for the lake or something that's not going to be a

1894
01:33:01,409 --> 01:33:03,079
multifamily use count towards

1895
01:33:03,079 --> 01:33:04,079
that.

1896
01:33:04,079 --> 01:33:06,880
So it would be limited to the 32 acres that they're

1897
01:33:06,880 --> 01:33:09,039
proposing to actually do a multifamily

1898
01:33:09,039 --> 01:33:10,199
development.

1899
01:33:10,199 --> 01:33:13,560
>> If they could build by right, they would be able to use

1900
01:33:13,560 --> 01:33:15,640
ponds in the density calculation

1901
01:33:15,640 --> 01:33:16,640
traditionally in the city?

1902
01:33:16,640 --> 01:33:19,279
>> Traditionally, yes, if it's all on the same lot.

1903
01:33:19,279 --> 01:33:20,760
They could potentially count that.

1904
01:33:20,760 --> 01:33:21,760
>> Okay.

1905
01:33:21,760 --> 01:33:26,279
Thank you.

1906
01:33:26,279 --> 01:33:32,279
>> And we also ran some numbers for your question, Chair.

1907
01:33:32,279 --> 01:33:38,319
So, granted that these are all very rough estimates.

1908
01:33:38,319 --> 01:33:42,090
Typical industrial use would generate $100,000 to $200,000

1909
01:33:42,090 --> 01:33:43,399
in water and wastewater impact

1910
01:33:43,399 --> 01:33:45,279
fees.

1911
01:33:45,279 --> 01:33:48,399
For the amount of units shown here, it's estimated that

1912
01:33:48,399 --> 01:33:51,279
phase one would be around 1.1 million

1913
01:33:51,279 --> 01:33:57,000
and phase two would be at 600,000, roughly.

1914
01:33:57,000 --> 01:33:59,859
In terms of roadway impact fees, that would be offset by

1915
01:33:59,859 --> 01:34:01,680
the improvements that they would

1916
01:34:01,680 --> 01:34:03,720
be doing with precision drive, the construction of that

1917
01:34:03,720 --> 01:34:04,199
roadway.

1918
01:34:04,199 --> 01:34:05,199
>> Okay.

1919
01:34:05,199 --> 01:34:07,300
So they're going to be responsible for the perimeter street

1920
01:34:07,300 --> 01:34:08,319
paving rather than in lieu

1921
01:34:08,319 --> 01:34:12,100
of paying traffic impact fees, essentially, approximately

1922
01:34:12,100 --> 01:34:13,880
for discussion purposes.

1923
01:34:13,880 --> 01:34:16,899
>> Yes, because in this case, the precision drive does not

1924
01:34:16,899 --> 01:34:18,439
exist currently along their

1925
01:34:18,439 --> 01:34:19,439
perimeter.

1926
01:34:19,439 --> 01:34:20,439
>> Okay.

1927
01:34:20,439 --> 01:34:22,590
And based on that, it's going to be a considerable sum to

1928
01:34:22,590 --> 01:34:23,199
put that in.

1929
01:34:23,199 --> 01:34:24,199
>> Yes.

1930
01:34:24,199 --> 01:34:25,199
>> Millions.

1931
01:34:25,199 --> 01:34:26,199
Million.

1932
01:34:26,199 --> 01:34:29,199
>> Probably between half a million and a million.

1933
01:34:29,199 --> 01:34:30,199
>> Okay.

1934
01:34:30,199 --> 01:34:31,199
Sorry.

1935
01:34:31,199 --> 01:34:32,199
>> It's okay.

1936
01:34:32,199 --> 01:34:33,199
>> It's okay.

1937
01:34:33,199 --> 01:34:34,199
>> Okay.

1938
01:34:34,199 --> 01:34:37,489
So it's a substantial difference in impact fees to the city

1939
01:34:37,489 --> 01:34:38,960
if this is rezoned versus

1940
01:34:38,960 --> 01:34:42,050
industrial, because I know there were some other questions

1941
01:34:42,050 --> 01:34:43,359
as to what kind of impact

1942
01:34:43,359 --> 01:34:46,250
it would have on our services, but it's a considerable

1943
01:34:46,250 --> 01:34:47,640
additional funds that they would

1944
01:34:47,640 --> 01:34:48,640
pay.

1945
01:34:48,640 --> 01:34:51,090
>> I think whichever the use is, irregardless of the use,

1946
01:34:51,090 --> 01:34:52,279
there would be that perimeter

1947
01:34:52,279 --> 01:34:56,439
street pavement exaction.

1948
01:34:56,439 --> 01:35:00,359
Or the difference would lie would be with the water sewer

1949
01:35:00,359 --> 01:35:02,359
impact fees based on the number

1950
01:35:02,359 --> 01:35:04,239
of bedrooms, the very high number of bedrooms that they're

1951
01:35:04,239 --> 01:35:06,359
talking about for this project.

1952
01:35:06,359 --> 01:35:09,500
That's what the source, that's directly related to the

1953
01:35:09,500 --> 01:35:11,319
numbers that Haley gave you.

1954
01:35:11,319 --> 01:35:14,970
For industrial water demands can really vary depending on

1955
01:35:14,970 --> 01:35:16,760
the industrial process.

1956
01:35:16,760 --> 01:35:20,710
So we're given a range of common meter sizes we see, you

1957
01:35:20,710 --> 01:35:23,119
know, like she said, anywhere

1958
01:35:23,119 --> 01:35:25,159
from 100 to 200,000.

1959
01:35:25,159 --> 01:35:26,279
>> Okay.

1960
01:35:26,279 --> 01:35:30,560
Thank you for the additional information.

1961
01:35:30,560 --> 01:35:31,560
Commissioner Beck.

1962
01:35:31,560 --> 01:35:32,560
>> Thank you, Chair.

1963
01:35:32,560 --> 01:35:35,479
Let me ask you a hypothetical here.

1964
01:35:35,479 --> 01:35:38,979
If this were approved for this residential area, how would

1965
01:35:38,979 --> 01:35:40,939
this impact future development

1966
01:35:40,939 --> 01:35:44,800
in those ICA areas, say another Peterbilt type or 84 lumber

1967
01:35:44,800 --> 01:35:46,640
type built across the street

1968
01:35:46,640 --> 01:35:47,640
from them?

1969
01:35:47,640 --> 01:35:51,239
Would they have to do changes with sound and lighting as a

1970
01:35:51,239 --> 01:35:53,560
result of being in close proximity

1971
01:35:53,560 --> 01:35:58,640
to a residential neighborhood where that wouldn't be a

1972
01:35:58,640 --> 01:36:01,479
consideration otherwise?

1973
01:36:01,479 --> 01:36:03,439
>> The lighting provisions in the development code would

1974
01:36:03,439 --> 01:36:04,760
apply no matter what the development

1975
01:36:04,760 --> 01:36:05,760
is.

1976
01:36:05,760 --> 01:36:08,640
So that would be the same between the uses.

1977
01:36:08,640 --> 01:36:13,300
In terms of their site layout, because we go back to one of

1978
01:36:13,300 --> 01:36:15,800
the maps here, because they

1979
01:36:15,800 --> 01:36:17,909
are separated by right of way on both the north and west,

1980
01:36:17,909 --> 01:36:19,279
there wouldn't be any additional

1981
01:36:19,279 --> 01:36:21,199
buffer requirements there.

1982
01:36:21,199 --> 01:36:23,789
Standing on the east because of the separation of the

1983
01:36:23,789 --> 01:36:25,840
railroad, there could be some buffering

1984
01:36:25,840 --> 01:36:28,359
requirements here on the south side where we would have --

1985
01:36:28,359 --> 01:36:31,409
>> Not so much buffering issues, but if you've got a

1986
01:36:31,409 --> 01:36:33,840
business in there that its production

1987
01:36:33,840 --> 01:36:36,979
creates a lot of noise, okay, that's going to reach across

1988
01:36:36,979 --> 01:36:38,220
that street there.

1989
01:36:38,220 --> 01:36:41,279
So would they be inhibited then because they are in close

1990
01:36:41,279 --> 01:36:43,239
proximity to a residential area?

1991
01:36:43,239 --> 01:36:46,359
Would that negatively impact their business?

1992
01:36:46,359 --> 01:36:48,229
>> I would say it could create some nuisances potentially,

1993
01:36:48,229 --> 01:36:49,359
but they would ultimately have

1994
01:36:49,359 --> 01:36:51,520
to follow the city's sound ordinances.

1995
01:36:51,520 --> 01:36:52,520
>> Okay.

1996
01:36:52,520 --> 01:36:55,869
But if that residential area was there, would it be any

1997
01:36:55,869 --> 01:36:56,840
different?

1998
01:36:56,840 --> 01:36:57,840
>> No, sir.

1999
01:36:57,840 --> 01:37:01,699
>> In an industrial area, aren't they allowed a certain

2000
01:37:01,699 --> 01:37:04,119
decibel level as opposed to areas

2001
01:37:04,119 --> 01:37:07,079
that are in close proximity to residential areas?

2002
01:37:07,079 --> 01:37:09,390
>> I'm not familiar with what the code of ordinances states

2003
01:37:09,390 --> 01:37:10,399
on that, but they would

2004
01:37:10,399 --> 01:37:13,039
have to follow the city's general ordinances.

2005
01:37:13,039 --> 01:37:14,039
>> Okay.

2006
01:37:14,039 --> 01:37:15,039
Thanks.

2007
01:37:15,039 --> 01:37:16,039
>> Commissioner Ellis.

2008
01:37:16,039 --> 01:37:17,039
>> Thank you, Chair.

2009
01:37:17,039 --> 01:37:20,680
I'm going to go back to a question on the TURS.

2010
01:37:20,680 --> 01:37:24,039
Okay, so that was put in place in 2012.

2011
01:37:24,039 --> 01:37:30,800
How often is that revoted on to continue it?

2012
01:37:30,800 --> 01:37:34,449
>> For the TURS, it usually -- the reinvestment zone -- I'm

2013
01:37:34,449 --> 01:37:39,199
trying to think of -- till August?

2014
01:37:39,199 --> 01:37:45,079
Oh, it was just put in last August.

2015
01:37:45,079 --> 01:37:49,729
And it seems to me like this one was for quite a few number

2016
01:37:49,729 --> 01:37:50,840
of years.

2017
01:37:50,840 --> 01:37:55,199
It wouldn't be revisited unless there was a change to the

2018
01:37:55,199 --> 01:37:57,680
project or finance plans or

2019
01:37:57,680 --> 01:37:59,800
they wanted to dissolve the TURS.

2020
01:37:59,800 --> 01:38:03,399
I think this is only the second TURS in the city.

2021
01:38:03,399 --> 01:38:07,000
And so the first one is the downtown area.

2022
01:38:07,000 --> 01:38:09,000
And so there was a lot of talk about that.

2023
01:38:09,000 --> 01:38:13,829
It's not like a tax zone or like a reinvestment zone where

2024
01:38:13,829 --> 01:38:17,079
you have to do it every five years.

2025
01:38:17,079 --> 01:38:19,960
It's a little bit different.

2026
01:38:19,960 --> 01:38:22,159
>> So does it have an end date?

2027
01:38:22,159 --> 01:38:23,159
>> Yeah.

2028
01:38:23,159 --> 01:38:28,159
Do you have the exact end date?

2029
01:38:28,159 --> 01:38:31,159
Let me see here.

2030
01:38:31,159 --> 01:38:35,560
You don't have the actual -- >> I believe that's just the

2031
01:38:35,560 --> 01:38:36,199
annual update.

2032
01:38:36,199 --> 01:38:38,760
>> Yeah, this is not the right document.

2033
01:38:38,760 --> 01:38:41,949
So I couldn't tell you off the top of my head what the end

2034
01:38:41,949 --> 01:38:42,680
date is.

2035
01:38:42,680 --> 01:38:44,479
>> And I guess the reason for my question is if we're --

2036
01:38:44,479 --> 01:38:45,479
>> 20 years.

2037
01:38:45,479 --> 01:38:46,479
>> 20 years.

2038
01:38:46,479 --> 01:38:47,479
>> Yeah.

2039
01:38:47,479 --> 01:38:48,479
>> I think it's 20 years.

2040
01:38:48,479 --> 01:38:50,880
It's usually between 20 and 20.

2041
01:38:50,880 --> 01:38:56,380
>> And taking 72 acres out of this does not weaken it as we

2042
01:38:56,380 --> 01:38:59,159
move through it, correct?

2043
01:38:59,159 --> 01:39:05,689
Does this do anything rezoning these 72 acres to the rest

2044
01:39:05,689 --> 01:39:07,859
of the TURS area?

2045
01:39:07,859 --> 01:39:10,340
>> Only to the original developer because we have an

2046
01:39:10,340 --> 01:39:12,079
agreement for reimbursement for

2047
01:39:12,079 --> 01:39:15,399
the infrastructure to the original developer.

2048
01:39:15,399 --> 01:39:18,359
And so since multifamily is specifically cut out of the

2049
01:39:18,359 --> 01:39:20,319
project plan, that tax increment

2050
01:39:20,319 --> 01:39:23,619
for this particular parcel, if we change it, they won't get

2051
01:39:23,619 --> 01:39:25,000
that money flow back.

2052
01:39:25,000 --> 01:39:26,000
So it will take longer to pay back.

2053
01:39:26,000 --> 01:39:28,319
>> It's just for this particular parcel, though, correct?

2054
01:39:28,319 --> 01:39:29,319
>> Right.

2055
01:39:29,319 --> 01:39:31,319
>> So other areas that will continue?

2056
01:39:31,319 --> 01:39:32,319
>> Correct.

2057
01:39:32,319 --> 01:39:33,319
>> Okay.

2058
01:39:33,319 --> 01:39:35,800
Thank you.

2059
01:39:35,800 --> 01:39:38,800
>> Next question, Rosalyn.

2060
01:39:38,800 --> 01:39:41,159
>> You mentioned that multifamily is specifically called

2061
01:39:41,159 --> 01:39:41,960
out in the TURS.

2062
01:39:41,960 --> 01:39:44,550
Is there any other zoning classification that is

2063
01:39:44,550 --> 01:39:46,720
specifically called out in the TURS?

2064
01:39:46,720 --> 01:39:47,720
>> No.

2065
01:39:47,720 --> 01:39:48,720
>> Okay.

2066
01:39:48,720 --> 01:39:51,479
>> The TURS specifically contemplates industrial and

2067
01:39:51,479 --> 01:39:52,479
commercial use.

2068
01:39:52,479 --> 01:39:55,489
And there's actually a limit in the statute as to how much

2069
01:39:55,489 --> 01:39:57,039
residential you can have in

2070
01:39:57,039 --> 01:39:58,039
a TURS.

2071
01:39:58,039 --> 01:39:59,039
So --

2072
01:39:59,039 --> 01:40:00,039
>> Thank you.

2073
01:40:00,039 --> 01:40:01,039
>> Okay.

2074
01:40:01,039 --> 01:40:04,039
Any other questions for Haley?

2075
01:40:04,039 --> 01:40:08,199
Okay.

2076
01:40:08,199 --> 01:40:09,840
This is a public hearing.

2077
01:40:09,840 --> 01:40:14,600
And I have several cards that wish to speak on this item.

2078
01:40:14,600 --> 01:40:19,199
First will be Jason Dernbos, the applicant in support.

2079
01:40:19,199 --> 01:40:21,960
Is there someone else who would like to speak first?

2080
01:40:21,960 --> 01:40:24,960
>> Mr. Chairman, may I?

2081
01:40:24,960 --> 01:40:25,960
>> Sure.

2082
01:40:25,960 --> 01:40:26,960
>> First, I'm sorry.

2083
01:40:26,960 --> 01:40:27,960
I may not have gotten the cards in the right order.

2084
01:40:27,960 --> 01:40:28,960
I'm Lance Van Zandt.

2085
01:40:28,960 --> 01:40:29,960
>> I probably reshuffled them.

2086
01:40:29,960 --> 01:40:30,960
My apologies.

2087
01:40:30,960 --> 01:40:31,960
>> I'm sorry.

2088
01:40:31,960 --> 01:40:33,960
I'm sorry.

2089
01:40:33,960 --> 01:40:35,960
I'm sorry.

2090
01:40:35,960 --> 01:40:37,960
I'm sorry.

2091
01:40:37,960 --> 01:40:39,960
I'm sorry.

2092
01:40:39,960 --> 01:40:43,060
>> Just as a point of order, if you are representing the

2093
01:40:43,060 --> 01:40:45,920
applicant, then you, too, get ten minutes.

2094
01:40:45,920 --> 01:40:48,520
Or you'll have to share your minutes for a total of 20.

2095
01:40:48,520 --> 01:40:49,920
You can't take more than 20 minutes.

2096
01:40:49,920 --> 01:40:50,920
>> Okay.

2097
01:40:50,920 --> 01:40:52,739
Yeah, we had planned if we have about three folks, we were

2098
01:40:52,739 --> 01:40:53,920
going to divvy up 20 minutes

2099
01:40:53,920 --> 01:40:54,920
if that's acceptable from the Chair.

2100
01:40:54,920 --> 01:40:55,920
>> Sure.

2101
01:40:55,920 --> 01:40:56,920
Absolutely.

2102
01:40:56,920 --> 01:40:59,229
>> I was going to kind of get things started if I could, Mr

2103
01:40:59,229 --> 01:40:59,920
. Chairman.

2104
01:40:59,920 --> 01:41:02,920
I'm Lance Van Zandt, 512 West Hickory here in Denton.

2105
01:41:02,920 --> 01:41:03,920
I represent Landmark Properties.

2106
01:41:03,920 --> 01:41:07,970
I've had the pleasure of working with Landmark and our

2107
01:41:07,970 --> 01:41:10,920
development team here as well as Haley

2108
01:41:10,920 --> 01:41:13,640
and the staff in putting this application for both these

2109
01:41:13,640 --> 01:41:15,199
items together on your agenda

2110
01:41:15,199 --> 01:41:18,199
tonight, the zoning change and the SUP.

2111
01:41:18,199 --> 01:41:22,680
We've got it before you tonight for the final decision.

2112
01:41:22,680 --> 01:41:23,680
We're asking for your approval.

2113
01:41:23,680 --> 01:41:25,989
There are many good questions that were brought up in the

2114
01:41:25,989 --> 01:41:26,680
work session.

2115
01:41:26,680 --> 01:41:29,699
We took notes on those and want to make sure we get those

2116
01:41:29,699 --> 01:41:30,560
addressed.

2117
01:41:30,560 --> 01:41:34,020
I believe Mr. Jinx's comments on the impact fees and the

2118
01:41:34,020 --> 01:41:36,199
road costs were fairly consistent

2119
01:41:36,199 --> 01:41:37,199
with our calculations.

2120
01:41:37,199 --> 01:41:39,539
We understood we were going to have about a million dollars

2121
01:41:39,539 --> 01:41:41,000
in water and wastewater impact

2122
01:41:41,000 --> 01:41:42,000
fees.

2123
01:41:42,000 --> 01:41:44,710
And our estimated construction cost of precision drive,

2124
01:41:44,710 --> 01:41:46,319
which we will have to do to develop

2125
01:41:46,319 --> 01:41:49,600
this project, is approximately a million dollars.

2126
01:41:49,600 --> 01:41:51,750
I believe we're going to be paying roadway impact fees of

2127
01:41:51,750 --> 01:41:53,119
about 800,000.

2128
01:41:53,119 --> 01:41:55,800
So we're actually going to contribute a little more cost-

2129
01:41:55,800 --> 01:41:56,279
wise.

2130
01:41:56,279 --> 01:41:59,199
We anticipate that we would have just paying impact fees.

2131
01:41:59,199 --> 01:42:02,239
So those are the numbers that we have on those two items.

2132
01:42:02,239 --> 01:42:05,380
And if anything comes up, we've got our engineers that will

2133
01:42:05,380 --> 01:42:06,880
be able to address that.

2134
01:42:06,880 --> 01:42:09,840
So I won't go in detail through the application.

2135
01:42:09,840 --> 01:42:12,979
Haley did a good job of summarizing that, but I did want to

2136
01:42:12,979 --> 01:42:14,399
respect our time limits

2137
01:42:14,399 --> 01:42:17,890
here and make sure we address questions that were brought

2138
01:42:17,890 --> 01:42:19,479
up in the work session.

2139
01:42:19,479 --> 01:42:23,079
Also, some items that we thought were of importance.

2140
01:42:23,079 --> 01:42:26,310
I think if you just look at this project as a whole, with

2141
01:42:26,310 --> 01:42:28,319
especially the 22 acres that

2142
01:42:28,319 --> 01:42:32,310
we're looking at doing in phase one, the quality of the

2143
01:42:32,310 --> 01:42:34,840
vertical construction that we're looking

2144
01:42:34,840 --> 01:42:39,239
at-- and you all saw some examples of that in your packet--

2145
01:42:39,239 --> 01:42:40,760
the fact that we're going

2146
01:42:40,760 --> 01:42:44,109
from an industrial to an NRMU greatly enhances the

2147
01:42:44,109 --> 01:42:46,039
landscape requirements.

2148
01:42:46,039 --> 01:42:51,520
You go from about a 10% tree canopy to a 40% tree canopy.

2149
01:42:51,520 --> 01:42:55,020
We have some existing natural features on the property that

2150
01:42:55,020 --> 01:42:56,479
to an industrial user would

2151
01:42:56,479 --> 01:42:58,239
be a significant challenge.

2152
01:42:58,239 --> 01:43:02,289
We think in an NRMU district, this will eventually be an

2153
01:43:02,289 --> 01:43:05,079
amenity and will create an aesthetic

2154
01:43:05,079 --> 01:43:10,239
feature that can be used with the ball fields.

2155
01:43:10,239 --> 01:43:14,430
So along with bringing public infrastructure now to the

2156
01:43:14,430 --> 01:43:17,000
area, the extension of precision

2157
01:43:17,000 --> 01:43:19,590
drive, the extension of water and wastewater utilities to

2158
01:43:19,590 --> 01:43:20,920
serve that area, we think this

2159
01:43:20,920 --> 01:43:21,920
is a great project.

2160
01:43:21,920 --> 01:43:24,300
And I understand that the real question we have to answer

2161
01:43:24,300 --> 01:43:25,800
here tonight is, well, as great

2162
01:43:25,800 --> 01:43:27,600
as this project is, is this where it belongs?

2163
01:43:27,600 --> 01:43:28,600
Is this a good location?

2164
01:43:28,600 --> 01:43:29,600
Mr. Beck, you addressed that specifically.

2165
01:43:29,600 --> 01:43:30,600
Is this a square pavement around Houghton?

2166
01:43:30,600 --> 01:43:31,600
And we actually don't think it is.

2167
01:43:31,600 --> 01:43:32,180
We think that maybe this is a unique, particularly unique

2168
01:43:32,180 --> 01:43:32,600
tract of land that doesn't at all fit

2169
01:43:32,600 --> 01:43:33,600
the current zoning category for a number of reasons.

2170
01:43:33,600 --> 01:43:34,270
And I'm going to ask the representative of the owner to

2171
01:43:34,270 --> 01:43:34,600
come up and speak.

2172
01:43:34,600 --> 01:43:35,600
He's got quite a bit of institutional history.

2173
01:43:35,600 --> 01:43:36,600
He's got a lot of experience in the area.

2174
01:43:36,600 --> 01:43:37,600
He's got a lot of experience in the area.

2175
01:43:37,600 --> 01:43:38,600
He's got a lot of experience in the area.

2176
01:43:38,600 --> 01:43:39,600
He's got a lot of experience in the area.

2177
01:43:39,600 --> 01:43:40,600
He's got a lot of experience in the area.

2178
01:43:40,600 --> 01:43:51,600
He's got a lot of experience in the area.

2179
01:43:51,600 --> 01:43:56,600
He's got a lot of experience in the area.

2180
01:43:56,600 --> 01:43:59,600
He's got a lot of experience in the area.

2181
01:43:59,600 --> 01:44:02,600
He's got a lot of experience in the area.

2182
01:44:02,600 --> 01:44:07,600
He's got a lot of experience in the area.

2183
01:44:07,600 --> 01:44:12,079
And Dan Grant, who serves as the engineering consultant for

2184
01:44:12,079 --> 01:44:14,119
the Razor family and their

2185
01:44:14,119 --> 01:44:16,800
properties has a great deal of experience with marketing

2186
01:44:16,800 --> 01:44:18,279
and developing properties in

2187
01:44:18,279 --> 01:44:19,279
this area.

2188
01:44:19,279 --> 01:44:22,159
So I'm going to ask him to come up and speak as well.

2189
01:44:22,159 --> 01:44:25,920
First off, I wanted to introduce to you directly to you my

2190
01:44:25,920 --> 01:44:27,720
client, Jason Dornbos.

2191
01:44:27,720 --> 01:44:29,840
Jason's the principal with Landmark Properties.

2192
01:44:29,840 --> 01:44:33,310
They develop student housing across the southeastern,

2193
01:44:33,310 --> 01:44:35,039
southern United States.

2194
01:44:35,039 --> 01:44:38,140
They have one existing project in Denton, the retreat at

2195
01:44:38,140 --> 01:44:38,760
Denton.

2196
01:44:38,760 --> 01:44:42,970
It's been a successful facility that they constructed and

2197
01:44:42,970 --> 01:44:44,640
continue to operate.

2198
01:44:44,640 --> 01:44:48,590
And, you know, one thing that brought Landmark not only to

2199
01:44:48,590 --> 01:44:50,800
Denton, but to this particular

2200
01:44:50,800 --> 01:44:53,689
piece of property is they were attuned to some of the

2201
01:44:53,689 --> 01:44:55,760
debate that's gone on around student

2202
01:44:55,760 --> 01:44:57,520
housing in the last couple of years in Denton.

2203
01:44:57,520 --> 01:44:59,829
There have been some controversial projects that have come

2204
01:44:59,829 --> 01:45:00,920
before you that I know have

2205
01:45:00,920 --> 01:45:01,920
been really tough votes.

2206
01:45:01,920 --> 01:45:03,960
And you spent a lot of time thinking about this.

2207
01:45:03,960 --> 01:45:08,170
And the community's been very involved on one side or

2208
01:45:08,170 --> 01:45:10,079
another of this issue.

2209
01:45:10,079 --> 01:45:12,729
And what Jason and Landmark heard was that there's a

2210
01:45:12,729 --> 01:45:14,680
significant concern in Denton about

2211
01:45:14,680 --> 01:45:17,770
student housing being placed in existing residential areas,

2212
01:45:17,770 --> 01:45:19,840
especially in the historic areas around

2213
01:45:19,840 --> 01:45:22,159
the university.

2214
01:45:22,159 --> 01:45:26,890
And he has an understanding of how student housing in

2215
01:45:26,890 --> 01:45:29,880
existing residential areas can

2216
01:45:29,880 --> 01:45:32,840
worsen the affordable housing problem when investors buy up

2217
01:45:32,840 --> 01:45:34,279
rental properties and rent

2218
01:45:34,279 --> 01:45:35,279
them to students.

2219
01:45:35,279 --> 01:45:38,579
It becomes harder and harder for your residents to live and

2220
01:45:38,579 --> 01:45:40,560
work and buy houses close to where

2221
01:45:40,560 --> 01:45:43,399
they work and where their kids go to school.

2222
01:45:43,399 --> 01:45:49,520
So it was really an intentional targeting of this property

2223
01:45:49,520 --> 01:45:52,319
to, in fact, remove this

2224
01:45:52,319 --> 01:45:55,590
while still close to the university and reasonably close

2225
01:45:55,590 --> 01:45:57,880
proximity, completely away from any

2226
01:45:57,880 --> 01:46:02,069
existing residential neighborhoods or historic districts or

2227
01:46:02,069 --> 01:46:04,039
any other uses that this would

2228
01:46:04,039 --> 01:46:06,039
significantly impact.

2229
01:46:06,039 --> 01:46:11,970
I'm going to let Mr. Baker talk in detail about his attempt

2230
01:46:11,970 --> 01:46:14,800
to market this property.

2231
01:46:14,800 --> 01:46:17,949
That's something he can talk about in more expert manner

2232
01:46:17,949 --> 01:46:18,760
than I can.

2233
01:46:18,760 --> 01:46:22,739
But I think the fact that, one, we really intend on trying

2234
01:46:22,739 --> 01:46:25,159
to answer the community interest

2235
01:46:25,159 --> 01:46:28,390
of keeping these projects outside of existing residential

2236
01:46:28,390 --> 01:46:29,479
historic areas.

2237
01:46:29,479 --> 01:46:32,439
We've got a really unique piece of property that the owners

2238
01:46:32,439 --> 01:46:33,920
have had an impossible time

2239
01:46:33,920 --> 01:46:37,800
marketing over the last 20 plus years to users in the

2240
01:46:37,800 --> 01:46:39,600
industrial category.

2241
01:46:39,600 --> 01:46:43,079
And three, there's a reason for that.

2242
01:46:43,079 --> 01:46:46,649
And Mr. Grant's going to talk briefly about this, is the

2243
01:46:46,649 --> 01:46:49,119
just topographical characteristics

2244
01:46:49,119 --> 01:46:52,159
to the land that you saw on your map, the lake in the

2245
01:46:52,159 --> 01:46:54,039
middle of it and the slope and

2246
01:46:54,039 --> 01:46:58,090
the very just not a lot of land mass there outside the

2247
01:46:58,090 --> 01:47:00,600
water to have large industrial

2248
01:47:00,600 --> 01:47:02,920
type warehouse commercial uses.

2249
01:47:02,920 --> 01:47:06,220
So those are some of the challenges that we would like to

2250
01:47:06,220 --> 01:47:08,039
alert you to, make you aware

2251
01:47:08,039 --> 01:47:11,300
of, and try to convince you that this is, in fact, the

2252
01:47:11,300 --> 01:47:13,119
highest and best use for this

2253
01:47:13,119 --> 01:47:14,119
property.

2254
01:47:14,119 --> 01:47:17,390
And actually, what is a very difficult piece of property to

2255
01:47:17,390 --> 01:47:19,039
develop as an industrial use

2256
01:47:19,039 --> 01:47:22,229
actually presents a lot of attractive qualities for a

2257
01:47:22,229 --> 01:47:23,520
student housing.

2258
01:47:23,520 --> 01:47:27,289
So if I may, Mr. Chairman, I ask Mr. Dornbos to come up

2259
01:47:27,289 --> 01:47:28,119
here next.

2260
01:47:28,119 --> 01:47:29,119
That's convenient for you.

2261
01:47:29,119 --> 01:47:32,090
Please give your name and address also and you approach the

2262
01:47:32,090 --> 01:47:32,520
mic.

2263
01:47:32,520 --> 01:47:36,399
Jason Dornbos, 455 Epsbridge Parkway, Athens, Georgia.

2264
01:47:36,399 --> 01:47:37,399
Thank you, Commissioner.

2265
01:47:37,399 --> 01:47:38,399
Appreciate your time tonight.

2266
01:47:38,399 --> 01:47:39,399
I'll skip the slideshow.

2267
01:47:39,399 --> 01:47:42,079
I was going to give just and hit some highlights as really

2268
01:47:42,079 --> 01:47:43,920
just talk about our experience.

2269
01:47:43,920 --> 01:47:47,680
But we're a nationally, or the largest national student

2270
01:47:47,680 --> 01:47:49,920
housing development company.

2271
01:47:49,920 --> 01:47:51,720
We are vertically integrated.

2272
01:47:51,720 --> 01:47:54,909
We special out, we have our own management company,

2273
01:47:54,909 --> 01:47:57,279
development company, obviously the

2274
01:47:57,279 --> 01:47:59,399
development company as well.

2275
01:47:59,399 --> 01:48:02,029
So just kind of real quick, just wanted to give you some

2276
01:48:02,029 --> 01:48:02,960
information.

2277
01:48:02,960 --> 01:48:06,720
We developed what was originally called the retreat, now

2278
01:48:06,720 --> 01:48:08,640
called the Republic, back in

2279
01:48:08,640 --> 01:48:09,640
2011.

2280
01:48:09,640 --> 01:48:12,930
And since that time, we've been actively looking to try and

2281
01:48:12,930 --> 01:48:14,920
find another project in this market,

2282
01:48:14,920 --> 01:48:17,510
another site to do a project just to meet the increasing

2283
01:48:17,510 --> 01:48:18,800
demand from students at the

2284
01:48:18,800 --> 01:48:23,880
University of North Texas, and the feedback we received in

2285
01:48:23,880 --> 01:48:26,520
reading the news articles and

2286
01:48:26,520 --> 01:48:29,390
watch monitoring the market was that there was just getting

2287
01:48:29,390 --> 01:48:30,760
a lot of opposition and push

2288
01:48:30,760 --> 01:48:33,220
back in the neighborhoods to the north of campus, which is

2289
01:48:33,220 --> 01:48:34,359
really the side we prefer

2290
01:48:34,359 --> 01:48:37,250
to be on just because it's closer, it's an easy shot into

2291
01:48:37,250 --> 01:48:38,600
campus on Oak, and it just

2292
01:48:38,600 --> 01:48:39,600
made a lot of sense.

2293
01:48:39,600 --> 01:48:42,710
So we've been actively looking at that and I've been

2294
01:48:42,710 --> 01:48:44,920
working with Phil for probably two

2295
01:48:44,920 --> 01:48:48,880
years to try and, he's thoughtfully trying to find a way to

2296
01:48:48,880 --> 01:48:50,840
do a project on his property

2297
01:48:50,840 --> 01:48:53,859
that maximized the value of that portion was the highest

2298
01:48:53,859 --> 01:48:55,600
possible use and we really felt

2299
01:48:55,600 --> 01:48:58,439
like this would really fit the bill.

2300
01:48:58,439 --> 01:49:04,829
So you know, again, we've developed industrial properties

2301
01:49:04,829 --> 01:49:07,239
around the country.

2302
01:49:07,239 --> 01:49:10,699
We've got several that are under construction right now

2303
01:49:10,699 --> 01:49:12,600
that we've had to rezone, do a

2304
01:49:12,600 --> 01:49:15,039
new comp plan amendment to do those projects.

2305
01:49:15,039 --> 01:49:17,630
They were all similar in a lot of ways to what we're doing

2306
01:49:17,630 --> 01:49:18,720
here or proposing to do

2307
01:49:18,720 --> 01:49:19,720
here.

2308
01:49:19,720 --> 01:49:22,659
Just large pieces of property that were very close to

2309
01:49:22,659 --> 01:49:24,680
campus and industrial just didn't

2310
01:49:24,680 --> 01:49:27,600
make sense on those particular pieces of property due to

2311
01:49:27,600 --> 01:49:29,680
environmental concerns or just where

2312
01:49:29,680 --> 01:49:33,319
the market was.

2313
01:49:33,319 --> 01:49:36,279
You know, this project, this product type is really

2314
01:49:36,279 --> 01:49:38,319
designed to appeal to students that

2315
01:49:38,319 --> 01:49:41,520
are seeking single family residences.

2316
01:49:41,520 --> 01:49:44,159
So what we've seen, we've done a bunch of polls of our

2317
01:49:44,159 --> 01:49:45,680
residents and we've found is

2318
01:49:45,680 --> 01:49:48,270
that these projects actually pull a lot of the residents

2319
01:49:48,270 --> 01:49:49,720
that would typically be renting

2320
01:49:49,720 --> 01:49:53,220
single family houses and neighborhoods out of those houses

2321
01:49:53,220 --> 01:49:54,720
and puts them in a project

2322
01:49:54,720 --> 01:49:57,180
where they can live among their peers as opposed to living

2323
01:49:57,180 --> 01:49:58,760
in houses and neighborhoods where

2324
01:49:58,760 --> 01:50:02,949
they're living next door to professors or families where it

2325
01:50:02,949 --> 01:50:04,720
's just kind of a conflict

2326
01:50:04,720 --> 01:50:07,079
of use even in those single family neighborhoods.

2327
01:50:07,079 --> 01:50:10,510
So we feel like this property is a way to, because of the

2328
01:50:10,510 --> 01:50:12,520
size, we can do something like

2329
01:50:12,520 --> 01:50:15,199
that and appeal to those students.

2330
01:50:15,199 --> 01:50:18,699
And again, someone had mentioned earlier in the work

2331
01:50:18,699 --> 01:50:21,600
session about the environmental sensitivity

2332
01:50:21,600 --> 01:50:24,039
to this on the site.

2333
01:50:24,039 --> 01:50:27,130
This, our project, as opposed to a lot of multifamily

2334
01:50:27,130 --> 01:50:29,159
projects, has an extremely high

2335
01:50:29,159 --> 01:50:32,319
percentage of pervious surface.

2336
01:50:32,319 --> 01:50:35,210
I think it's, talking to Dan, it's like over 40% on this

2337
01:50:35,210 --> 01:50:36,800
particular project, which for

2338
01:50:36,800 --> 01:50:40,560
an apartment complex is really high, which is great given

2339
01:50:40,560 --> 01:50:42,680
that the lake is next door.

2340
01:50:42,680 --> 01:50:45,699
There's a lot of other features we do that we build all of

2341
01:50:45,699 --> 01:50:46,720
our projects.

2342
01:50:46,720 --> 01:50:51,319
They're designed to meet national green building standards.

2343
01:50:51,319 --> 01:50:53,560
So we put a lot of thought into it.

2344
01:50:53,560 --> 01:50:56,750
It's important to our residents to have features like that

2345
01:50:56,750 --> 01:50:58,760
that are, you know, appeal to that

2346
01:50:58,760 --> 01:51:01,039
environmental nature.

2347
01:51:01,039 --> 01:51:04,680
And then it came up earlier about running the bus.

2348
01:51:04,680 --> 01:51:07,960
We will do one of, we're required to, by our lenders, to do

2349
01:51:07,960 --> 01:51:09,199
one of two things.

2350
01:51:09,199 --> 01:51:11,500
We're either going to have to work out an agreement with

2351
01:51:11,500 --> 01:51:12,800
the university to run the bus

2352
01:51:12,800 --> 01:51:15,880
over there, or we will run a private shuttle ourselves.

2353
01:51:15,880 --> 01:51:20,199
And that's just because there's never parking on campus.

2354
01:51:20,199 --> 01:51:22,560
All of our residents are going to the same place.

2355
01:51:22,560 --> 01:51:23,560
It's easy.

2356
01:51:23,560 --> 01:51:27,439
It works out well and it helps us market the property.

2357
01:51:27,439 --> 01:51:32,560
So with that, I will kick it over to Phil.

2358
01:51:32,560 --> 01:51:33,560
Thank you for your time.

2359
01:51:33,560 --> 01:51:46,640
Phil Baker, PO Box 2424, Denton, Texas.

2360
01:51:46,640 --> 01:51:48,039
My name is Philip Baker.

2361
01:51:48,039 --> 01:51:50,689
I am Vice President of the Razor Company, which controls

2362
01:51:50,689 --> 01:51:52,159
both Razor Investments and the

2363
01:51:52,159 --> 01:51:56,060
current owner of the subject land and its affiliate West

2364
01:51:56,060 --> 01:51:57,119
Park Group.

2365
01:51:57,119 --> 01:51:59,500
I've been employed with the Razor Company for over 30 years

2366
01:51:59,500 --> 01:52:00,800
, the last 15 of which have

2367
01:52:00,800 --> 01:52:04,149
been involved in responsibility for real estate management

2368
01:52:04,149 --> 01:52:04,880
and sales.

2369
01:52:04,880 --> 01:52:07,310
In addition to the subject property, Razor Investments and

2370
01:52:07,310 --> 01:52:08,619
West Park Group owns hundreds

2371
01:52:08,619 --> 01:52:11,470
of acres to the west, northwest, and southwest of the

2372
01:52:11,470 --> 01:52:13,680
subject property within the West Denton

2373
01:52:13,680 --> 01:52:14,680
area.

2374
01:52:14,680 --> 01:52:17,539
I'm here tonight on behalf of Razor Investments and West

2375
01:52:17,539 --> 01:52:19,359
Park Group to express our support

2376
01:52:19,359 --> 01:52:21,739
of the requested zoning change, not merely because we have

2377
01:52:21,739 --> 01:52:22,880
an interest in the pending

2378
01:52:22,880 --> 01:52:26,640
sales transaction, but also as the largest remaining land

2379
01:52:26,640 --> 01:52:28,760
owner in the immediate vicinity

2380
01:52:28,760 --> 01:52:31,520
with an equal interest in maintaining land uses which are

2381
01:52:31,520 --> 01:52:33,079
compatible to the anticipated

2382
01:52:33,079 --> 01:52:36,439
future uses of our other remaining lands.

2383
01:52:36,439 --> 01:52:39,630
Like the city planning department, we have historically

2384
01:52:39,630 --> 01:52:41,199
been of the mindset that the

2385
01:52:41,199 --> 01:52:44,210
area south of University and West of Iowa Interstate 35

2386
01:52:44,210 --> 01:52:46,039
corridor is generally industrial

2387
01:52:46,039 --> 01:52:50,850
and warehousing, and we've had no interest in straying from

2388
01:52:50,850 --> 01:52:52,039
that focus.

2389
01:52:52,039 --> 01:52:57,380
And all of it is identified as such in the Denton 2030 plan

2390
01:52:57,380 --> 01:52:57,779
.

2391
01:52:57,779 --> 01:53:00,810
Our prior sales of tracks to users such as the original

2392
01:53:00,810 --> 01:53:02,800
Peterbilt Motor Company plant,

2393
01:53:02,800 --> 01:53:06,369
the Tetra Pak plant, and Anderson Merchandisers, and more

2394
01:53:06,369 --> 01:53:08,439
recent sales to Target Fest and all

2395
01:53:08,439 --> 01:53:11,789
Peerless Manufacturing, Winko Foods, additional land to

2396
01:53:11,789 --> 01:53:14,479
Peterbilt Motor for their future expansion,

2397
01:53:14,479 --> 01:53:17,359
and 84 Lumber for their future expansion, all point

2398
01:53:17,359 --> 01:53:19,479
development of this area as an industrial

2399
01:53:19,479 --> 01:53:21,960
area with high quality users.

2400
01:53:21,960 --> 01:53:26,170
This has always been our focus and continues to be so in

2401
01:53:26,170 --> 01:53:27,159
general.

2402
01:53:27,159 --> 01:53:43,640
And I have a map I want to show real quickly here.

2403
01:53:43,640 --> 01:53:47,159
On the left is what this land looked like in 2007.

2404
01:53:47,159 --> 01:53:50,520
You can see it's pretty much Peterbilt, Tetra Pak, and

2405
01:53:50,520 --> 01:53:52,439
Anderson, and that is all that's

2406
01:53:52,439 --> 01:53:55,800
been there since that land was virgin ground.

2407
01:53:55,800 --> 01:53:58,390
On the right, we'll show you what we've been doing for the

2408
01:53:58,390 --> 01:53:59,920
last 12 years in developing

2409
01:53:59,920 --> 01:54:01,840
that industrial land.

2410
01:54:01,840 --> 01:54:06,029
You'll see those companies, Target, Winko, Rush Enterprises

2411
01:54:06,029 --> 01:54:07,800
, I didn't mention that one.

2412
01:54:07,800 --> 01:54:11,380
They're taking 30 acres and they're under development right

2413
01:54:11,380 --> 01:54:12,560
next to Tetra Pak.

2414
01:54:12,560 --> 01:54:15,439
We saw the corridor of Western Boulevard put in all the way

2415
01:54:15,439 --> 01:54:16,880
to the university to open up

2416
01:54:16,880 --> 01:54:21,039
that area.

2417
01:54:21,039 --> 01:54:23,479
But when other interested parties with extensive

2418
01:54:23,479 --> 01:54:25,800
development experience actually evaluated

2419
01:54:25,800 --> 01:54:28,920
the subject property, we began to develop a different

2420
01:54:28,920 --> 01:54:31,000
viewpoint of this subject site.

2421
01:54:31,000 --> 01:54:33,600
After gaining development insight from several experienced

2422
01:54:33,600 --> 01:54:34,960
parties, we came to understand

2423
01:54:34,960 --> 01:54:38,510
why the site is uniquely situated as compared to the others

2424
01:54:38,510 --> 01:54:40,199
lands in the area and is not

2425
01:54:40,199 --> 01:54:43,369
suitable for light industrial warehousing or other

2426
01:54:43,369 --> 01:54:45,239
currently permitted uses.

2427
01:54:45,239 --> 01:54:49,579
In 2007, IDI Gasly, one of the world's leading investors

2428
01:54:49,579 --> 01:54:51,520
and developers of logistic warehouses

2429
01:54:51,520 --> 01:54:54,380
and distribution parks in North America and Europe,

2430
01:54:54,380 --> 01:54:56,359
evaluated acquiring all of our land

2431
01:54:56,359 --> 01:55:01,920
in the US 380 and west of Interstate 35.

2432
01:55:01,920 --> 01:55:05,529
While IDI confirmed the existing industrial warehouse uses

2433
01:55:05,529 --> 01:55:07,199
under the Denton Plan as the

2434
01:55:07,199 --> 01:55:10,590
highest and best use for most of our lands, they concluded

2435
01:55:10,590 --> 01:55:12,520
that the subject property would

2436
01:55:12,520 --> 01:55:15,529
be best slated for multifamily and planned to simply sell

2437
01:55:15,529 --> 01:55:17,399
that portion off to a multifamily

2438
01:55:17,399 --> 01:55:20,000
developer.

2439
01:55:20,000 --> 01:55:23,359
This is what they proposed and was going to be the accepted

2440
01:55:23,359 --> 01:55:24,279
zoning plan.

2441
01:55:24,279 --> 01:55:27,489
That portion in red is the multifamily site that they

2442
01:55:27,489 --> 01:55:29,760
intended to get rid of because they're

2443
01:55:29,760 --> 01:55:34,039
not multifamily developers.

2444
01:55:34,039 --> 01:55:36,350
But when other interested parties with extensive

2445
01:55:36,350 --> 01:55:38,479
development experience actually evaluated

2446
01:55:38,479 --> 01:55:42,810
the subject property, we began to develop a different view

2447
01:55:42,810 --> 01:55:44,000
of this site.

2448
01:55:44,000 --> 01:55:46,329
After gaining development insight from several experienced

2449
01:55:46,329 --> 01:55:47,600
parties, we came to understand

2450
01:55:47,600 --> 01:55:50,560
why the site is uniquely situated as compared to other

2451
01:55:50,560 --> 01:55:52,619
lands in the area and is not suitable

2452
01:55:52,619 --> 01:55:55,579
for light industrial warehousing and other currently

2453
01:55:55,579 --> 01:55:56,680
permitted uses.

2454
01:55:56,680 --> 01:55:59,239
I'm sorry, I've repeated myself.

2455
01:55:59,239 --> 01:56:01,239
Let me go back.

2456
01:56:01,239 --> 01:56:04,000
Sorry, I was out of place.

2457
01:56:04,000 --> 01:56:07,920
The community planning staff at the time that IDI proposed

2458
01:56:07,920 --> 01:56:10,079
this zoning, they agreed with

2459
01:56:10,079 --> 01:56:13,510
the proposed land uses under the IDI plan including the

2460
01:56:13,510 --> 01:56:15,600
multifamily use for the subject

2461
01:56:15,600 --> 01:56:17,199
property.

2462
01:56:17,199 --> 01:56:19,789
But because of the downturn in the economic conditions in

2463
01:56:19,789 --> 01:56:21,640
2008, the sales transaction

2464
01:56:21,640 --> 01:56:25,630
ultimately did not go through and the zoning changes were

2465
01:56:25,630 --> 01:56:27,960
not pursued by us at that time.

2466
01:56:27,960 --> 01:56:30,609
More recently, Landmark approached us with interest in the

2467
01:56:30,609 --> 01:56:31,600
subject property.

2468
01:56:31,600 --> 01:56:35,140
They like IDI identified the subject property as being most

2469
01:56:35,140 --> 01:56:37,000
suitable for multifamily.

2470
01:56:37,000 --> 01:56:40,289
Before moving forward with this, we hired Kemley Horne

2471
01:56:40,289 --> 01:56:42,100
consulting engineers to give

2472
01:56:42,100 --> 01:56:45,520
us their evaluation of the best land use for the site.

2473
01:56:45,520 --> 01:56:48,189
Kemley Horne has significant experience in industrial and

2474
01:56:48,189 --> 01:56:49,699
other developments and assists

2475
01:56:49,699 --> 01:56:53,359
major U.S. corporations in performing site analysis for

2476
01:56:53,359 --> 01:56:55,399
various commercial projects.

2477
01:56:55,399 --> 01:56:58,359
Kemley Horne confirmed the analysis of both IDI and Land

2478
01:56:58,359 --> 01:56:58,880
mark.

2479
01:56:58,880 --> 01:57:01,189
They concluded that industrial and warehouse users would

2480
01:57:01,189 --> 01:57:02,439
never be interested in the subject

2481
01:57:02,439 --> 01:57:06,250
property because those users inherently need flat land

2482
01:57:06,250 --> 01:57:08,840
suitable for large single buildings

2483
01:57:08,840 --> 01:57:12,359
without topographical variations, floodplain areas and

2484
01:57:12,359 --> 01:57:13,960
drainage constraints.

2485
01:57:13,960 --> 01:57:17,069
The subject property slopes significantly from the east and

2486
01:57:17,069 --> 01:57:19,319
the west boundaries to the center

2487
01:57:19,319 --> 01:57:22,689
and from the north to the south with a 15 to 20 acre lake

2488
01:57:22,689 --> 01:57:24,159
located in the middle.

2489
01:57:24,159 --> 01:57:27,159
It is affected by an area wide drainage channel running

2490
01:57:27,159 --> 01:57:29,640
from the north to the south that essentially

2491
01:57:29,640 --> 01:57:32,550
splits the track into two long very narrow rectangular

2492
01:57:32,550 --> 01:57:34,520
pieces and contains approximately

2493
01:57:34,520 --> 01:57:37,890
15 acres south of the lake dam which would be in the flood

2494
01:57:37,890 --> 01:57:39,439
way and in all likelihood

2495
01:57:39,439 --> 01:57:42,789
can never be developed for any purpose other than green

2496
01:57:42,789 --> 01:57:43,420
space.

2497
01:57:43,420 --> 01:57:46,329
Natural features such as these are precisely those which a

2498
01:57:46,329 --> 01:57:48,159
potential industrial or warehouse

2499
01:57:48,159 --> 01:57:50,520
developer wants to avoid.

2500
01:57:50,520 --> 01:57:53,569
We recognize that other uses beyond light industrial and

2501
01:57:53,569 --> 01:57:55,319
warehousing are permitted under

2502
01:57:55,319 --> 01:58:00,170
the existing zoning classification such as hotels, motels,

2503
01:58:00,170 --> 01:58:02,479
indoor recreation and medical

2504
01:58:02,479 --> 01:58:04,220
facilities.

2505
01:58:04,220 --> 01:58:06,920
But development of those type of facility and uses would

2506
01:58:06,920 --> 01:58:08,359
substantially face the same

2507
01:58:08,359 --> 01:58:11,430
issues and challenges in dealing with the natural features

2508
01:58:11,430 --> 01:58:12,920
of the subject property.

2509
01:58:12,920 --> 01:58:16,109
And because the subject property would not be located on a

2510
01:58:16,109 --> 01:58:18,000
major roadway with high traffic

2511
01:58:18,000 --> 01:58:21,460
volume it would never support such uses as hotels, motels,

2512
01:58:21,460 --> 01:58:23,159
entertainment centers and

2513
01:58:23,159 --> 01:58:25,039
restaurants in any case.

2514
01:58:25,039 --> 01:58:27,960
Lakes, creeks and flood plain areas can be utilized as

2515
01:58:27,960 --> 01:58:30,159
attractive green space and recreation

2516
01:58:30,159 --> 01:58:33,229
areas to enhance the vibrant residential community but

2517
01:58:33,229 --> 01:58:35,640
present nothing but obstacles to the needs

2518
01:58:35,640 --> 01:58:39,359
of industrial, warehouse and other types of users.

2519
01:58:39,359 --> 01:58:41,670
Development of the subject property for any uses other than

2520
01:58:41,670 --> 01:58:42,920
the multifamily would present

2521
01:58:42,920 --> 01:58:45,520
site characteristic issues and would fail to meet the

2522
01:58:45,520 --> 01:58:47,319
threshold requirements as to their

2523
01:58:47,319 --> 01:58:51,039
juxtaposition to major highways and roadways.

2524
01:58:51,039 --> 01:58:53,810
We certainly recognize the need for land uses on the

2525
01:58:53,810 --> 01:58:56,119
subject property that will be compatible

2526
01:58:56,119 --> 01:58:59,409
with existing anticipated and industrial warehouse uses for

2527
01:58:59,409 --> 01:59:00,840
other lands in the area.

2528
01:59:00,840 --> 01:59:03,529
We are confident that the proposed zoning change will work

2529
01:59:03,529 --> 01:59:04,760
for the subject property

2530
01:59:04,760 --> 01:59:08,109
and will not create any conflict with any industrial users

2531
01:59:08,109 --> 01:59:09,560
concentrated to the west

2532
01:59:09,560 --> 01:59:10,800
of it.

2533
01:59:10,800 --> 01:59:13,500
The construction of precision drive on the west boundary

2534
01:59:13,500 --> 01:59:14,920
lane of the subject property

2535
01:59:14,920 --> 01:59:17,699
along with the drainage channel on the south boundary line,

2536
01:59:17,699 --> 01:59:19,279
the Kansas City southern railway

2537
01:59:19,279 --> 01:59:22,260
on the east boundary and Oak Street on the north segregates

2538
01:59:22,260 --> 01:59:23,640
the subject property in a

2539
01:59:23,640 --> 01:59:26,529
manner that will give this site its own identity with

2540
01:59:26,529 --> 01:59:28,720
physical boundaries that will make it

2541
01:59:28,720 --> 01:59:33,340
distinctly separate and apart from the industrial areas to

2542
01:59:33,340 --> 01:59:34,319
the west.

2543
01:59:34,319 --> 01:59:37,300
While we respect and support the Denton 2030 plan and

2544
01:59:37,300 --> 01:59:39,239
understand city planning department

2545
01:59:39,239 --> 01:59:42,180
simply following it as the basis for its current

2546
01:59:42,180 --> 01:59:45,520
recommendation, the 2030 Denton plan is by

2547
01:59:45,520 --> 01:59:48,319
its nature conceptual in providing general guidance for the

2548
01:59:48,319 --> 01:59:49,600
future development of the

2549
01:59:49,600 --> 01:59:51,199
city within the city.

2550
01:59:51,199 --> 01:59:54,779
It is a good starting point and it is an important document

2551
01:59:54,779 --> 01:59:56,840
but it by no means tells the whole

2552
01:59:56,840 --> 02:00:00,090
story and how the city should be developed in every

2553
02:00:00,090 --> 02:00:01,000
instance.

2554
02:00:01,000 --> 02:00:04,000
While a well thought out concept plan certainly provides

2555
02:00:04,000 --> 02:00:05,880
the critical foundation to foster

2556
02:00:05,880 --> 02:00:08,779
good development, it is just as critical for the city to

2557
02:00:08,779 --> 02:00:10,560
recognize unique dynamics that

2558
02:00:10,560 --> 02:00:15,479
apply to specific situations as actual development unfolds.

2559
02:00:15,479 --> 02:00:18,180
We know from dealings with the city on prior development

2560
02:00:18,180 --> 02:00:19,760
situations evolving our lands

2561
02:00:19,760 --> 02:00:22,350
that city staff often tends to be overly dogmatic in

2562
02:00:22,350 --> 02:00:24,640
applying conceptual principles under the

2563
02:00:24,640 --> 02:00:28,409
mobility plan, the city environmental sensitive area map

2564
02:00:28,409 --> 02:00:31,800
and the Denton 2030 plan within sufficient

2565
02:00:31,800 --> 02:00:36,119
analysis of particular development dynamics and constraints

2566
02:00:36,119 --> 02:00:36,399
.

2567
02:00:36,399 --> 02:00:38,880
While the pursuit of development in the city without these

2568
02:00:38,880 --> 02:00:40,319
concept tools as a guiding force

2569
02:00:40,319 --> 02:00:43,550
would be dangerous, ignoring and failing to properly

2570
02:00:43,550 --> 02:00:46,159
analyze specific development constraints

2571
02:00:46,159 --> 02:00:49,800
and opportunities for specific development situations could

2572
02:00:49,800 --> 02:00:51,359
be just as detrimental.

2573
02:00:51,359 --> 02:00:54,069
We need smart and sensible development decisions based on

2574
02:00:54,069 --> 02:00:55,800
actual realities in the context of

2575
02:00:55,800 --> 02:00:59,579
the intended goals and principles laid down under those

2576
02:00:59,579 --> 02:01:00,880
concept tools.

2577
02:01:00,880 --> 02:01:04,069
As highlighted in my discussion, an in-depth examination of

2578
02:01:04,069 --> 02:01:07,439
the subject property by experienced

2579
02:01:07,439 --> 02:01:10,619
development professionals clearly reveals that the existing

2580
02:01:10,619 --> 02:01:12,159
permitted uses are not viable

2581
02:01:12,159 --> 02:01:14,880
on this site and multifamily use provides the best

2582
02:01:14,880 --> 02:01:17,119
opportunity for the site to contribute

2583
02:01:17,119 --> 02:01:24,159
to the needs and the tax base of this community.

2584
02:01:24,159 --> 02:01:26,750
We believe the zoning change should be approved for the

2585
02:01:26,750 --> 02:01:28,239
good of the area, the good of the

2586
02:01:28,239 --> 02:01:33,039
city and respectfully request your approval.

2587
02:01:33,039 --> 02:01:34,039
Thank you.

2588
02:01:34,039 --> 02:01:35,039
A couple of questions.

2589
02:01:35,039 --> 02:01:36,039
I'm sorry.

2590
02:01:36,039 --> 02:01:37,840
I burned up all that time.

2591
02:01:37,840 --> 02:01:39,680
We appreciate your comments.

2592
02:01:39,680 --> 02:01:40,680
Commissioner Beck.

2593
02:01:40,680 --> 02:01:41,680
Thank you, Chair.

2594
02:01:41,680 --> 02:01:42,680
Thank you, Mr. Baker, for your presentation.

2595
02:01:42,680 --> 02:01:47,210
It actually answered a lot of things for me and makes I see

2596
02:01:47,210 --> 02:01:49,560
now why we're looking at someone

2597
02:01:49,560 --> 02:01:52,640
that's actually looking at residential development in an

2598
02:01:52,640 --> 02:01:53,800
industrial area.

2599
02:01:53,800 --> 02:01:58,100
I see that you're trying to address the issue for housing

2600
02:01:58,100 --> 02:02:00,520
for college kids, and I appreciate

2601
02:02:00,520 --> 02:02:01,520
that.

2602
02:02:01,520 --> 02:02:04,920
This development, I've got great admiration for it.

2603
02:02:04,920 --> 02:02:06,840
I love the designs and everything.

2604
02:02:06,840 --> 02:02:11,140
I am having a problem with it being where it is, and I

2605
02:02:11,140 --> 02:02:13,840
would ask you why the buildings

2606
02:02:13,840 --> 02:02:16,590
that you can use, offices, hotels, vehicle repair, research

2607
02:02:16,590 --> 02:02:17,920
facilities, limited retail

2608
02:02:17,920 --> 02:02:23,489
and restaurants, why those smaller building units pose a

2609
02:02:23,489 --> 02:02:26,640
problem for this landscape area

2610
02:02:26,640 --> 02:02:31,840
where the individual apartment complexes don't.

2611
02:02:31,840 --> 02:02:35,069
If we're talking square footage, why is there basically

2612
02:02:35,069 --> 02:02:35,680
equal?

2613
02:02:35,680 --> 02:02:38,930
It's a matter of the ... I'll let Mr. Grant talk more to

2614
02:02:38,930 --> 02:02:40,880
that, but it has to do with the

2615
02:02:40,880 --> 02:02:43,800
kind of development it is.

2616
02:02:43,800 --> 02:02:50,430
The apartment, the multifamily can work with the topography

2617
02:02:50,430 --> 02:02:50,920
.

2618
02:02:50,920 --> 02:02:53,270
Industrial commercial uses, they need pretty much the same

2619
02:02:53,270 --> 02:02:53,720
thing.

2620
02:02:53,720 --> 02:02:54,720
They need flat land.

2621
02:02:54,720 --> 02:02:58,220
They don't need drainage running through it, and they need

2622
02:02:58,220 --> 02:02:59,640
flat land to build on.

2623
02:02:59,640 --> 02:03:06,060
They can't afford to ... The economics of doing the dirt

2624
02:03:06,060 --> 02:03:08,439
work breaks the budget.

2625
02:03:08,439 --> 02:03:11,590
I guess what I'm visualizing is say like an office park in

2626
02:03:11,590 --> 02:03:13,760
this area with building sizes

2627
02:03:13,760 --> 02:03:18,619
... The footing, if you would, is basically going to be the

2628
02:03:18,619 --> 02:03:21,000
same as a unit of apartments

2629
02:03:21,000 --> 02:03:26,319
there, where they're spaced about the same too.

2630
02:03:26,319 --> 02:03:28,399
I don't understand why that wouldn't work.

2631
02:03:28,399 --> 02:03:30,579
I can see where some big industrial complex would have a

2632
02:03:30,579 --> 02:03:32,239
problem, but when you're essentially

2633
02:03:32,239 --> 02:03:38,670
building commercial buildings that have about the same foot

2634
02:03:38,670 --> 02:03:41,840
as an apartment complex, I'm

2635
02:03:41,840 --> 02:03:45,600
not sure why it becomes a problem with one and not the

2636
02:03:45,600 --> 02:03:46,319
other.

2637
02:03:46,319 --> 02:03:49,420
My understanding from the engineers is the topography is a

2638
02:03:49,420 --> 02:03:51,039
big factor, and it all comes

2639
02:03:51,039 --> 02:03:52,920
down to dollars and cents.

2640
02:03:52,920 --> 02:03:55,119
It works for residential.

2641
02:03:55,119 --> 02:03:56,640
It works for the multifamily.

2642
02:03:56,640 --> 02:03:59,039
It doesn't work for commercial.

2643
02:03:59,039 --> 02:04:03,250
Also, the problem is commercial ... It's a matter of

2644
02:04:03,250 --> 02:04:04,439
economics too.

2645
02:04:04,439 --> 02:04:08,359
Precision road, when built, is essentially a fixed road.

2646
02:04:08,359 --> 02:04:09,640
It dead ends in Oak Street.

2647
02:04:09,640 --> 02:04:11,439
It dead ends at airport.

2648
02:04:11,439 --> 02:04:13,800
It doesn't take anybody anywhere.

2649
02:04:13,800 --> 02:04:16,300
Those kinds of developments want to be on roadways that go

2650
02:04:16,300 --> 02:04:17,760
someplace, that take traffic

2651
02:04:17,760 --> 02:04:22,409
through them, and that makes sense on the way people travel

2652
02:04:22,409 --> 02:04:22,760
.

2653
02:04:22,760 --> 02:04:25,439
Nobody's going to make a loop around to that area.

2654
02:04:25,439 --> 02:04:29,000
It makes no sense for restaurants.

2655
02:04:29,000 --> 02:04:32,319
We could hold it forever.

2656
02:04:32,319 --> 02:04:35,399
We could build the roadway, but it's not like the movie.

2657
02:04:35,399 --> 02:04:36,800
We build it, they will come.

2658
02:04:36,800 --> 02:04:39,390
No, they're going to go like over ways of ranch, where

2659
02:04:39,390 --> 02:04:41,000
there's a lot of through streets

2660
02:04:41,000 --> 02:04:44,289
and a lot of traffic, where they know they're going to pick

2661
02:04:44,289 --> 02:04:45,159
up people.

2662
02:04:45,159 --> 02:04:48,210
Nobody's going to be traveling just for pleasure over in

2663
02:04:48,210 --> 02:04:49,000
that area.

2664
02:04:49,000 --> 02:04:51,079
It's industrial.

2665
02:04:51,079 --> 02:04:53,430
It's just if you're going to be there, that's why you're

2666
02:04:53,430 --> 02:04:54,399
going to go there.

2667
02:04:54,399 --> 02:04:56,750
I will defer to you because you're more the expert on this

2668
02:04:56,750 --> 02:04:57,319
than I am.

2669
02:04:57,319 --> 02:05:01,090
I'm just still having a little bit of problem accepting

2670
02:05:01,090 --> 02:05:02,439
that completely.

2671
02:05:02,439 --> 02:05:04,479
I understand that you're trying to address the student

2672
02:05:04,479 --> 02:05:05,279
population here.

2673
02:05:05,279 --> 02:05:08,430
I think that's great, but this isn't going to be limited

2674
02:05:08,430 --> 02:05:09,960
strictly to students.

2675
02:05:09,960 --> 02:05:13,319
You probably will have working families in there with kids.

2676
02:05:13,319 --> 02:05:16,100
Again, this area being close to the interstate and a

2677
02:05:16,100 --> 02:05:17,840
railroad track, I'm concerned about

2678
02:05:17,840 --> 02:05:18,840
that too.

2679
02:05:18,840 --> 02:05:23,210
How would you ameliorate that concern where you're dealing

2680
02:05:23,210 --> 02:05:25,920
with families with small children

2681
02:05:25,920 --> 02:05:27,840
in an area like this?

2682
02:05:27,840 --> 02:05:31,600
I don't see why it would be a problem.

2683
02:05:31,600 --> 02:05:35,439
Traffic laws, last time I checked, we all have to play by

2684
02:05:35,439 --> 02:05:36,680
the same rules.

2685
02:05:36,680 --> 02:05:39,649
Whether you're driving a truck or an automobile, you have

2686
02:05:39,649 --> 02:05:41,279
to respect the rules of the road

2687
02:05:41,279 --> 02:05:42,279
and all the other things.

2688
02:05:42,279 --> 02:05:45,130
Parents will always warn their kids to stay away from the

2689
02:05:45,130 --> 02:05:46,840
railroad tracks, but how many

2690
02:05:46,840 --> 02:05:47,840
times?

2691
02:05:47,840 --> 02:05:52,430
Well, I can tell you that railroad track is probably 50

2692
02:05:52,430 --> 02:05:54,039
feet up in the air.

2693
02:05:54,039 --> 02:05:56,079
Nobody's going to play on it, much less walk over.

2694
02:05:56,079 --> 02:05:58,130
That would have been a great challenge for me as a kid

2695
02:05:58,130 --> 02:05:59,319
scaling that mountain.

2696
02:05:59,319 --> 02:06:01,369
That would have been a great challenge for me as a kid, but

2697
02:06:01,369 --> 02:06:02,520
I hear what you're saying.

2698
02:06:02,520 --> 02:06:04,520
I'm not sure I'm qualified to answer that.

2699
02:06:04,520 --> 02:06:05,520
Okay, I understand.

2700
02:06:05,520 --> 02:06:08,880
It's just, I think there's protectors there that we haven't

2701
02:06:08,880 --> 02:06:11,319
probably looked at deep enough.

2702
02:06:11,319 --> 02:06:15,640
We have, well, all I can say to you on that point is there

2703
02:06:15,640 --> 02:06:18,560
already are existing developments

2704
02:06:18,560 --> 02:06:20,439
this city has put in by railroads.

2705
02:06:20,439 --> 02:06:23,449
When you look downtown area, you've got two multifamily

2706
02:06:23,449 --> 02:06:25,199
units within spitting distance

2707
02:06:25,199 --> 02:06:26,199
of the city.

2708
02:06:26,199 --> 02:06:27,199
No, no, I understand that.

2709
02:06:27,199 --> 02:06:28,949
The family in Northern, which goes through this town

2710
02:06:28,949 --> 02:06:29,640
several times a day.

2711
02:06:29,640 --> 02:06:30,640
And I'm not disputing that.

2712
02:06:30,640 --> 02:06:34,079
I'm just as uncomfortable with those as I would be creating

2713
02:06:34,079 --> 02:06:35,399
a whole new one too.

2714
02:06:35,399 --> 02:06:39,369
In the, in the, in the Rose lawn area, there's two main

2715
02:06:39,369 --> 02:06:41,920
tracks, Kansas City Southern and

2716
02:06:41,920 --> 02:06:42,920
Union Pacific.

2717
02:06:42,920 --> 02:06:43,920
Right.

2718
02:06:43,920 --> 02:06:44,920
Okay.

2719
02:06:44,920 --> 02:06:47,000
One other little small question and it might be for one of

2720
02:06:47,000 --> 02:06:48,399
the other gentlemen, the material

2721
02:06:48,399 --> 02:06:51,119
that you're using, I didn't see any brick on these units.

2722
02:06:51,119 --> 02:06:57,510
So it's all siding and I assume that's going to be hardy

2723
02:06:57,510 --> 02:06:58,760
plank.

2724
02:06:58,760 --> 02:06:59,760
Thank you, Mr. Baker.

2725
02:06:59,760 --> 02:07:04,960
Yeah, it'll be brick masonry up above the water level.

2726
02:07:04,960 --> 02:07:05,960
Okay.

2727
02:07:05,960 --> 02:07:08,850
We do built up slabs and this kind of answers your question

2728
02:07:08,850 --> 02:07:10,439
earlier about the footprints

2729
02:07:10,439 --> 02:07:13,199
because we did built up slabs so you can stagger the

2730
02:07:13,199 --> 02:07:14,039
buildings.

2731
02:07:14,039 --> 02:07:17,500
I mean, these, these footprints are actually, I mean, they

2732
02:07:17,500 --> 02:07:19,760
're single unit buildings or duplexes

2733
02:07:19,760 --> 02:07:20,760
or quadplexes.

2734
02:07:20,760 --> 02:07:23,420
So they're, they're really not like a typical gardens out

2735
02:07:23,420 --> 02:07:24,520
apartment complex.

2736
02:07:24,520 --> 02:07:27,229
We've got a big footprint that may be similar to like an

2737
02:07:27,229 --> 02:07:29,000
office building or something.

2738
02:07:29,000 --> 02:07:30,000
These are very small.

2739
02:07:30,000 --> 02:07:32,680
What are, what is the biggest unit should be building?

2740
02:07:32,680 --> 02:07:33,680
Fourplex type?

2741
02:07:33,680 --> 02:07:37,159
I believe in the plan is that there's a six unit building.

2742
02:07:37,159 --> 02:07:38,159
Six units.

2743
02:07:38,159 --> 02:07:39,159
Okay.

2744
02:07:39,159 --> 02:07:40,159
Okay.

2745
02:07:40,159 --> 02:07:41,159
Yeah, it's like six town names.

2746
02:07:41,159 --> 02:07:42,159
Square footage would be for that whole thing.

2747
02:07:42,159 --> 02:07:43,159
I'd have to check.

2748
02:07:43,159 --> 02:07:46,520
I think the square footage of the building, I mean, it's

2749
02:07:46,520 --> 02:07:48,359
obvious it's three stories.

2750
02:07:48,359 --> 02:07:51,359
Well no, let's just say the ground, at the ground level.

2751
02:07:51,359 --> 02:07:52,359
Yeah.

2752
02:07:52,359 --> 02:07:53,359
Foot, the footprint.

2753
02:07:53,359 --> 02:07:54,359
I'd have to check on it.

2754
02:07:54,359 --> 02:07:55,359
I don't know if I'm going to have time.

2755
02:07:55,359 --> 02:07:56,359
Okay.

2756
02:07:56,359 --> 02:07:57,359
Let me put you on the spot a little bit here.

2757
02:07:57,359 --> 02:07:58,680
Are we looking possibly at affordable housing here?

2758
02:07:58,680 --> 02:08:01,140
I mean, I know you're, you're targeting for students and

2759
02:08:01,140 --> 02:08:02,640
the Lord knows they, they need,

2760
02:08:02,640 --> 02:08:05,729
but I mean, are we looking at reasonable price units here

2761
02:08:05,729 --> 02:08:07,359
and I'm out of place in asking

2762
02:08:07,359 --> 02:08:08,359
this right now or?

2763
02:08:08,359 --> 02:08:09,359
Yeah, I mean.

2764
02:08:09,359 --> 02:08:10,359
We are getting kind of outside the boundaries.

2765
02:08:10,359 --> 02:08:11,359
Okay.

2766
02:08:11,359 --> 02:08:12,359
Way.

2767
02:08:12,359 --> 02:08:13,359
It'll be market rate.

2768
02:08:13,359 --> 02:08:14,359
Okay.

2769
02:08:14,359 --> 02:08:15,359
Okay.

2770
02:08:15,359 --> 02:08:16,359
Thank you, sir.

2771
02:08:16,359 --> 02:08:19,079
So I've got several other questions.

2772
02:08:19,079 --> 02:08:20,600
I don't know which of you gentlemen will be for

2773
02:08:20,600 --> 02:08:21,439
Commissioner Smith.

2774
02:08:21,439 --> 02:08:22,439
Thank you, Chair.

2775
02:08:22,439 --> 02:08:24,960
Well, sorry, you Jason, you're under the mic.

2776
02:08:24,960 --> 02:08:27,380
Just to address some of the Mr. Beck brought up, this is

2777
02:08:27,380 --> 02:08:28,319
student housing?

2778
02:08:28,319 --> 02:08:29,319
Yeah.

2779
02:08:29,319 --> 02:08:30,319
Correct.

2780
02:08:30,319 --> 02:08:31,319
So it's designed and marketed to students.

2781
02:08:31,319 --> 02:08:32,319
Got it.

2782
02:08:32,319 --> 02:08:34,199
So are the ones you have now, I can't, the Republic, I

2783
02:08:34,199 --> 02:08:35,640
think is what you said it is currently

2784
02:08:35,640 --> 02:08:36,640
now.

2785
02:08:36,640 --> 02:08:38,479
Is it going to be, I don't know how the Republic set up,

2786
02:08:38,479 --> 02:08:39,840
but most student housing, the way

2787
02:08:39,840 --> 02:08:42,479
you can't necessarily say these are only for students or

2788
02:08:42,479 --> 02:08:44,199
some policing, there's some Texas

2789
02:08:44,199 --> 02:08:47,680
real estate law issues on that, but you can design the

2790
02:08:47,680 --> 02:08:50,079
apartment to where it is individual

2791
02:08:50,079 --> 02:08:53,210
with each individual inside the bedroom has its own

2792
02:08:53,210 --> 02:08:54,039
bathroom.

2793
02:08:54,039 --> 02:08:57,760
So it is designed to be more for individual living.

2794
02:08:57,760 --> 02:08:58,760
Is it the same thing in your guys?

2795
02:08:58,760 --> 02:09:00,840
Is that what you're building now?

2796
02:09:00,840 --> 02:09:03,159
So each unit, the bedrooms are all the same size.

2797
02:09:03,159 --> 02:09:04,520
There's not like a master suite.

2798
02:09:04,520 --> 02:09:05,520
There's no dining room.

2799
02:09:05,520 --> 02:09:08,949
And you're right, like a typical unit would be a four

2800
02:09:08,949 --> 02:09:11,199
bedroom, four bathroom with the

2801
02:09:11,199 --> 02:09:13,159
bathrooms inside and then like a common area.

2802
02:09:13,159 --> 02:09:14,920
So they're not legally, of course, not legally restricted

2803
02:09:14,920 --> 02:09:15,960
to student housing, but they are

2804
02:09:15,960 --> 02:09:19,720
designed for student housing, probably not encouraging for

2805
02:09:19,720 --> 02:09:21,520
family use with small children

2806
02:09:21,520 --> 02:09:23,840
who like to play on railroad tracks.

2807
02:09:23,840 --> 02:09:24,840
Okay.

2808
02:09:24,840 --> 02:09:29,189
So the question I have for you was brought up during work

2809
02:09:29,189 --> 02:09:31,760
session, the ball fields that

2810
02:09:31,760 --> 02:09:33,850
are down there, as Mr. Vincent liked to refer to them, I

2811
02:09:33,850 --> 02:09:35,199
don't know if they're ball fields

2812
02:09:35,199 --> 02:09:36,760
or soccer fields or whatever, but-

2813
02:09:36,760 --> 02:09:37,760
Recreational fields.

2814
02:09:37,760 --> 02:09:38,760
Okay.

2815
02:09:38,760 --> 02:09:41,520
Those will be downstream.

2816
02:09:41,520 --> 02:09:42,520
Is that a worry at all?

2817
02:09:42,520 --> 02:09:45,109
I mean, if this is something we're approving and putting up

2818
02:09:45,109 --> 02:09:46,359
there, is that an issue of

2819
02:09:46,359 --> 02:09:48,239
having it downstream where flooding can come in?

2820
02:09:48,239 --> 02:09:49,239
Can I kick that one to Dan?

2821
02:09:49,239 --> 02:09:50,239
Yeah, come on, Dan.

2822
02:09:50,239 --> 02:09:51,239
Thank you.

2823
02:09:51,239 --> 02:09:52,239
Good evening, Commissioner.

2824
02:09:52,239 --> 02:10:00,819
Dan Grant, Kimley-Horn, 13755 Dwell Road, Suite 700 Dallas,

2825
02:10:00,819 --> 02:10:01,880
Texas.

2826
02:10:01,880 --> 02:10:03,720
You asked about downstream.

2827
02:10:03,720 --> 02:10:05,680
I'm an engineer, so I like to talk off maps.

2828
02:10:05,680 --> 02:10:15,390
So Haley, you might have to help me get back up to your

2829
02:10:15,390 --> 02:10:18,720
presentation.

2830
02:10:18,720 --> 02:10:21,960
So let's actually go to the actual land plan.

2831
02:10:21,960 --> 02:10:23,479
Let's speak off of this one.

2832
02:10:23,479 --> 02:10:26,300
In short, I think your question is more concerned about

2833
02:10:26,300 --> 02:10:28,039
what's happening in this zone.

2834
02:10:28,039 --> 02:10:30,770
Yeah, I guess the question's more about, I don't care if

2835
02:10:30,770 --> 02:10:32,199
you guys put soccer fields

2836
02:10:32,199 --> 02:10:35,460
or baseball fields, but just that it's downstream and if we

2837
02:10:35,460 --> 02:10:37,319
did approve it, there could be a

2838
02:10:37,319 --> 02:10:39,989
heavy rain that could fully wash out the entire development

2839
02:10:39,989 --> 02:10:40,199
.

2840
02:10:40,199 --> 02:10:43,020
Today, let's talk about the end phases.

2841
02:10:43,020 --> 02:10:44,439
We have this currently phase in.

2842
02:10:44,439 --> 02:10:48,500
Phase one here in green, which is everything we'll call

2843
02:10:48,500 --> 02:10:50,960
high and dry to the west side of

2844
02:10:50,960 --> 02:10:51,960
Lake.

2845
02:10:51,960 --> 02:10:55,039
Phase two of multifamily and phase three are both gonna be

2846
02:10:55,039 --> 02:10:56,600
conditioned as presented by

2847
02:10:56,600 --> 02:11:01,119
staff on some continuing analysis of the dam, which there

2848
02:11:01,119 --> 02:11:03,439
is an existing TCEQ dam on the

2849
02:11:03,439 --> 02:11:06,159
property that retains Razor Lake.

2850
02:11:06,159 --> 02:11:10,479
You're looking at the limits of Razor Lake within the blue

2851
02:11:10,479 --> 02:11:11,239
lines.

2852
02:11:11,239 --> 02:11:14,439
The dam would need to be reconstructed.

2853
02:11:14,439 --> 02:11:18,210
And downstream of that, one of the highest and best uses of

2854
02:11:18,210 --> 02:11:19,840
land downstream or in an

2855
02:11:19,840 --> 02:11:23,039
encumbered area by floodplain is recreation.

2856
02:11:23,039 --> 02:11:24,039
Perfect.

2857
02:11:24,039 --> 02:11:27,390
So that's the intent here, is to create a use that is

2858
02:11:27,390 --> 02:11:29,479
compliant with the highest and

2859
02:11:29,479 --> 02:11:30,479
best for the animals.

2860
02:11:30,479 --> 02:11:31,479
Great.

2861
02:11:31,479 --> 02:11:32,479
Thank you, Dan.

2862
02:11:32,479 --> 02:11:33,479
Mr. Baker.

2863
02:11:33,479 --> 02:11:38,479
This is a zoning case, right?

2864
02:11:38,479 --> 02:11:39,479
Yes.

2865
02:11:39,479 --> 02:11:43,960
This, you've talked a lot about the history of the sale of

2866
02:11:43,960 --> 02:11:46,399
this land, the possible sale

2867
02:11:46,399 --> 02:11:50,329
of this land, correct, and that you've had other industrial

2868
02:11:50,329 --> 02:11:52,079
manufacturers try to come

2869
02:11:52,079 --> 02:11:54,279
in and buy it and it was not feasible, correct?

2870
02:11:54,279 --> 02:11:55,279
Just to get clarification.

2871
02:11:55,279 --> 02:11:56,279
No one's ever looked at this land.

2872
02:11:56,279 --> 02:11:57,279
No one's?

2873
02:11:57,279 --> 02:11:59,390
Just because they just, they knew right off the bat that

2874
02:11:59,390 --> 02:12:00,680
there was no way they could ever

2875
02:12:00,680 --> 02:12:03,979
do it because of the way, just the feasibility of the cost

2876
02:12:03,979 --> 02:12:05,720
of having to move dirt to make

2877
02:12:05,720 --> 02:12:08,760
it usable for manufacturing use.

2878
02:12:08,760 --> 02:12:09,760
That's right.

2879
02:12:09,760 --> 02:12:10,760
Okay.

2880
02:12:10,760 --> 02:12:11,760
Currently, is it ag exempt?

2881
02:12:11,760 --> 02:12:12,760
Yes.

2882
02:12:12,760 --> 02:12:13,760
Okay.

2883
02:12:13,760 --> 02:12:14,760
So currently it is untaxable land?

2884
02:12:14,760 --> 02:12:15,760
No.

2885
02:12:15,760 --> 02:12:16,760
Well, it's in ag use.

2886
02:12:16,760 --> 02:12:17,760
Correct.

2887
02:12:17,760 --> 02:12:20,460
Which is, as you know, it's a reduced tax value based on ag

2888
02:12:20,460 --> 02:12:21,359
value, which is-

2889
02:12:21,359 --> 02:12:22,359
Sorry, miscommunication.

2890
02:12:22,359 --> 02:12:26,359
I think we chip in about 50 bucks a year to the tax bill.

2891
02:12:26,359 --> 02:12:28,359
Thank you very much for that $50.

2892
02:12:28,359 --> 02:12:29,359
Okay.

2893
02:12:29,359 --> 02:12:32,359
And a lot of manure.

2894
02:12:32,359 --> 02:12:33,359
Hey, that works.

2895
02:12:33,359 --> 02:12:34,359
All right.

2896
02:12:34,359 --> 02:12:37,359
That's all the questions I have for me, Mr. Baker.

2897
02:12:37,359 --> 02:12:38,359
Thank you.

2898
02:12:38,359 --> 02:12:39,359
All right.

2899
02:12:39,359 --> 02:12:40,359
Thank you.

2900
02:12:40,359 --> 02:12:41,359
Thank you, sir.

2901
02:12:41,359 --> 02:12:42,359
You're welcome.

2902
02:12:42,359 --> 02:12:45,319
I'm just going to, as the chair, kind of bring us back to

2903
02:12:45,319 --> 02:12:47,159
focus that this is a zoning case

2904
02:12:47,159 --> 02:12:49,279
that we're considering at this time.

2905
02:12:49,279 --> 02:12:52,710
And it's nice to have some of these other exhibits for us

2906
02:12:52,710 --> 02:12:54,640
to see what the possibilities

2907
02:12:54,640 --> 02:12:57,560
are to evaluate what another use might be on this property.

2908
02:12:57,560 --> 02:13:00,460
So I'd like to ask the commission, let's pull it in and

2909
02:13:00,460 --> 02:13:01,560
keep it our time.

2910
02:13:01,560 --> 02:13:04,579
We have a lot of people here before us tonight with a lot

2911
02:13:04,579 --> 02:13:06,520
of other items, and it's almost

2912
02:13:06,520 --> 02:13:07,520
eight o'clock.

2913
02:13:07,520 --> 02:13:11,979
I'd like us to stay focused on the zoning items at this

2914
02:13:11,979 --> 02:13:12,760
time.

2915
02:13:12,760 --> 02:13:16,750
I might add to that we have a separate public hearing for

2916
02:13:16,750 --> 02:13:19,119
the SUP, which is to determine

2917
02:13:19,119 --> 02:13:21,569
whether or not they would be able to have a multifamily on

2918
02:13:21,569 --> 02:13:22,399
the property.

2919
02:13:22,399 --> 02:13:25,750
So you, of course, would be allotted some time for each

2920
02:13:25,750 --> 02:13:27,800
item, but you may want to choose

2921
02:13:27,800 --> 02:13:31,819
which item is most important to you just for time's sake

2922
02:13:31,819 --> 02:13:35,279
and speak on that particular item.

2923
02:13:35,279 --> 02:13:36,479
Okay.

2924
02:13:36,479 --> 02:13:39,560
And with those two clarifications, Commissioner Rosell.

2925
02:13:39,560 --> 02:13:41,439
Thank you, chair.

2926
02:13:41,439 --> 02:13:45,409
This might not redirect us wholly, but I'd like two

2927
02:13:45,409 --> 02:13:46,600
questions.

2928
02:13:46,600 --> 02:13:47,600
Jason, I didn't get your last name.

2929
02:13:47,600 --> 02:13:52,880
We can ask you two questions real fast.

2930
02:13:52,880 --> 02:13:55,670
Does landmark construction do any single-resident, single-

2931
02:13:55,670 --> 02:13:56,680
room occupancies?

2932
02:13:56,680 --> 02:13:57,680
No.

2933
02:13:57,680 --> 02:13:59,439
Oh, yeah, sorry.

2934
02:13:59,439 --> 02:14:02,800
All the rooms are going to be single-occupant restricted.

2935
02:14:02,800 --> 02:14:03,800
Okay.

2936
02:14:03,800 --> 02:14:08,319
The retreat to the Republic, was that a rebrand or a sell?

2937
02:14:08,319 --> 02:14:09,600
That was a rebrand.

2938
02:14:09,600 --> 02:14:12,920
Well, we did sell it and they rebranded it.

2939
02:14:12,920 --> 02:14:16,399
Does landmark typically hold and then sell later?

2940
02:14:16,399 --> 02:14:18,039
What's your ownership duration typically?

2941
02:14:18,039 --> 02:14:19,880
We probably, we do both.

2942
02:14:19,880 --> 02:14:23,640
We hold stuff in perpetuity and then we sell some

2943
02:14:23,640 --> 02:14:25,399
properties as well.

2944
02:14:25,399 --> 02:14:26,399
Okay.

2945
02:14:26,399 --> 02:14:27,399
Thank you.

2946
02:14:27,399 --> 02:14:28,399
Sure.

2947
02:14:28,399 --> 02:14:29,399
Commissioner Sanchez.

2948
02:14:29,399 --> 02:14:32,659
Tim asked the question I was going to ask about the housing

2949
02:14:32,659 --> 02:14:34,079
, student housing.

2950
02:14:34,079 --> 02:14:35,079
Okay.

2951
02:14:35,079 --> 02:14:36,079
Okay.

2952
02:14:36,079 --> 02:14:37,079
It's been taken care of.

2953
02:14:37,079 --> 02:14:38,079
Great.

2954
02:14:38,079 --> 02:14:39,079
Okay.

2955
02:14:39,079 --> 02:14:42,100
This is a public hearing and the only other, I don't have

2956
02:14:42,100 --> 02:14:43,199
any other cards.

2957
02:14:43,199 --> 02:14:45,380
So if there's anyone else who would like to come forward

2958
02:14:45,380 --> 02:14:47,000
tonight and speak on this item,

2959
02:14:47,000 --> 02:14:50,000
please do so at this time.

2960
02:14:50,000 --> 02:14:56,050
Well, I have a bunch and if I'm, missed your name, if you

2961
02:14:56,050 --> 02:14:59,319
'll give me your name and address,

2962
02:14:59,319 --> 02:15:00,319
I will.

2963
02:15:00,319 --> 02:15:01,319
I'm Jim Flikes.

2964
02:15:01,319 --> 02:15:04,319
I represent Peterbilt Motors, 3200 Airport Road.

2965
02:15:04,319 --> 02:15:07,840
And I want to speak in opposition of the zoning change.

2966
02:15:07,840 --> 02:15:08,840
Found it.

2967
02:15:08,840 --> 02:15:09,840
Thank you.

2968
02:15:09,840 --> 02:15:14,760
Manufacturing and industrial facilities require a buffer.

2969
02:15:14,760 --> 02:15:20,260
I-35 and the railroad track provide that buffer from the

2970
02:15:20,260 --> 02:15:24,079
residential areas in the university.

2971
02:15:24,079 --> 02:15:27,840
We also own the area that's directly across the street from

2972
02:15:27,840 --> 02:15:30,199
where these are, this multifamily

2973
02:15:30,199 --> 02:15:33,439
will be constructed.

2974
02:15:33,439 --> 02:15:37,000
We currently have 60 receiving docks in our facility.

2975
02:15:37,000 --> 02:15:43,399
We move about a hundred tractor trailers a day per truck.

2976
02:15:43,399 --> 02:15:48,199
So we're moving material all day long from all over Denton

2977
02:15:48,199 --> 02:15:49,960
and north of here.

2978
02:15:49,960 --> 02:15:53,729
So precision drive going through would be a good thing for

2979
02:15:53,729 --> 02:15:55,399
us because we need another

2980
02:15:55,399 --> 02:15:56,399
outlet.

2981
02:15:56,399 --> 02:16:00,010
I mean, if anybody's ever been over there at Shift Change

2982
02:16:00,010 --> 02:16:02,560
on Airport Road, it's a zone.

2983
02:16:02,560 --> 02:16:04,850
Western Boulevard has relieved that quite a bit, but what

2984
02:16:04,850 --> 02:16:05,880
we're getting now is people

2985
02:16:05,880 --> 02:16:09,170
going up Western, cutting back through Jim Crystal and

2986
02:16:09,170 --> 02:16:11,359
going over Oak Street to I-35.

2987
02:16:11,359 --> 02:16:14,760
So this would help relieve some of the traffic congestion.

2988
02:16:14,760 --> 02:16:19,350
But when you start putting pedestrians and bicycles and

2989
02:16:19,350 --> 02:16:22,000
other things in a roadway, that

2990
02:16:22,000 --> 02:16:25,180
you've got that much traffic going down, it presents a

2991
02:16:25,180 --> 02:16:26,199
safety issue.

2992
02:16:26,199 --> 02:16:30,159
And that's where our concerns are.

2993
02:16:30,159 --> 02:16:31,899
Industrial environments, you talked a little bit about

2994
02:16:31,899 --> 02:16:32,200
noise.

2995
02:16:32,200 --> 02:16:35,639
Yeah, we have to comply with the noise ordinance, but still

2996
02:16:35,639 --> 02:16:37,600
you've got lighting and we're a

2997
02:16:37,600 --> 02:16:39,559
24-hour, seven-day-a-week operation.

2998
02:16:39,559 --> 02:16:43,219
So it would be an issue.

2999
02:16:43,219 --> 02:16:48,120
We have 250 acres out on Airport Road between three

3000
02:16:48,120 --> 02:16:49,920
different sites.

3001
02:16:49,920 --> 02:16:50,920
Can I answer any questions?

3002
02:16:50,920 --> 02:16:51,920
Yes.

3003
02:16:51,920 --> 02:16:52,920
Commissioner Beck.

3004
02:16:52,920 --> 02:16:53,920
Thank you, Chair.

3005
02:16:53,920 --> 02:16:54,920
Thank you.

3006
02:16:54,920 --> 02:16:55,920
Jim Wyatt?

3007
02:16:55,920 --> 02:16:56,920
Fights.

3008
02:16:56,920 --> 02:16:57,920
Fights.

3009
02:16:57,920 --> 02:16:58,920
Thank you for coming down.

3010
02:16:58,920 --> 02:17:01,840
So am I hearing you right that building this residential

3011
02:17:01,840 --> 02:17:03,959
development creates future problems

3012
02:17:03,959 --> 02:17:08,399
for you from an industrial construction?

3013
02:17:08,399 --> 02:17:11,440
We feel like the potential is there just because of the

3014
02:17:11,440 --> 02:17:13,879
residents and what you're putting in,

3015
02:17:13,879 --> 02:17:15,840
the density that you're putting in there.

3016
02:17:15,840 --> 02:17:18,129
And that was a concern I raised earlier and I was wondering

3017
02:17:18,129 --> 02:17:19,520
if you concurred with that,

3018
02:17:19,520 --> 02:17:22,159
that this imposes on you a little bit now.

3019
02:17:22,159 --> 02:17:23,159
It could.

3020
02:17:23,159 --> 02:17:24,159
And down the road.

3021
02:17:24,159 --> 02:17:25,159
Okay.

3022
02:17:25,159 --> 02:17:26,159
Okay.

3023
02:17:26,159 --> 02:17:27,159
Thank you.

3024
02:17:27,159 --> 02:17:28,159
Thank you.

3025
02:17:28,159 --> 02:17:29,159
I'll see you on the questions.

3026
02:17:29,159 --> 02:17:31,360
Thank you, sir, for your comments.

3027
02:17:31,360 --> 02:17:32,360
This is a public hearing.

3028
02:17:32,360 --> 02:17:34,520
Anyone else who'd like to speak on this item, please come

3029
02:17:34,520 --> 02:17:35,680
forward and give us your name

3030
02:17:35,680 --> 02:17:39,110
and address and fill out a card for us if you haven't

3031
02:17:39,110 --> 02:17:39,959
already.

3032
02:17:39,959 --> 02:17:41,479
My name is Kate Linus.

3033
02:17:41,479 --> 02:17:44,680
I live at 1120 North Locust, Denton.

3034
02:17:44,680 --> 02:17:46,040
And I did not fill out a card.

3035
02:17:46,040 --> 02:17:47,040
I'm sorry.

3036
02:17:47,040 --> 02:17:48,040
I wasn't actually going to speak on that.

3037
02:17:48,040 --> 02:17:49,040
You can fill in after you speak.

3038
02:17:49,040 --> 02:17:50,040
Thank you.

3039
02:17:50,040 --> 02:17:51,040
Okay.

3040
02:17:51,040 --> 02:17:54,579
There had been a number of questions from the members of

3041
02:17:54,579 --> 02:17:56,360
the PNC regarding the TURS

3042
02:17:56,360 --> 02:17:58,200
and how long that was going to be.

3043
02:17:58,200 --> 02:18:03,129
So that you know I work for Denton County and West Park TUR

3044
02:18:03,129 --> 02:18:05,239
S is actually one of the

3045
02:18:05,239 --> 02:18:08,440
TURS that the county has also signed off on.

3046
02:18:08,440 --> 02:18:14,350
And as it was indicated, December of 2012 was when it was

3047
02:18:14,350 --> 02:18:15,600
initiated.

3048
02:18:15,600 --> 02:18:21,000
And it is to go through December 31st of 2037.

3049
02:18:21,000 --> 02:18:28,389
And the city contributed, but the county, according to the

3050
02:18:28,389 --> 02:18:31,959
forms that they filled out,

3051
02:18:31,959 --> 02:18:37,379
the participation agreement with Denton County was 40% of

3052
02:18:37,379 --> 02:18:40,120
the real property taxes levied

3053
02:18:40,120 --> 02:18:43,770
and collected by the county for the year captured assessed

3054
02:18:43,770 --> 02:18:45,879
value of real property taxable by

3055
02:18:45,879 --> 02:18:47,319
the county.

3056
02:18:47,319 --> 02:18:51,920
So there is some of that tax also then is part of what the

3057
02:18:51,920 --> 02:18:54,719
county has given up and everything

3058
02:18:54,719 --> 02:18:55,799
else.

3059
02:18:55,799 --> 02:18:58,000
So you had questions about that.

3060
02:18:58,000 --> 02:19:03,909
My concern primarily is as a parent who has actually rented

3061
02:19:03,909 --> 02:19:07,440
student housing for her university

3062
02:19:07,440 --> 02:19:13,350
child living in this kind of an environment without public

3063
02:19:13,350 --> 02:19:16,639
transportation, without easy

3064
02:19:16,639 --> 02:19:20,430
access to where the university is or to the highway, those

3065
02:19:20,430 --> 02:19:22,479
two streets, there is a whole

3066
02:19:22,479 --> 02:19:25,840
lot of traffic coming in because of industrial, all the

3067
02:19:25,840 --> 02:19:27,959
industrial and commercial use of the

3068
02:19:27,959 --> 02:19:28,959
streets.

3069
02:19:28,959 --> 02:19:30,200
It's already there.

3070
02:19:30,200 --> 02:19:34,790
And it would be very difficult for the type of renter that

3071
02:19:34,790 --> 02:19:37,239
's wanting to go into that.

3072
02:19:37,239 --> 02:19:40,600
Also if there are ball fields in this way, are they for use

3073
02:19:40,600 --> 02:19:42,079
for the city and they're

3074
02:19:42,079 --> 02:19:45,049
helping to have the kids from the city out there with all

3075
02:19:45,049 --> 02:19:46,760
the industrialization that's

3076
02:19:46,760 --> 02:19:51,170
around working 24 hours as the gentleman from Peterbilt

3077
02:19:51,170 --> 02:19:51,840
said.

3078
02:19:51,840 --> 02:19:57,129
And this is all industrial and commercial area very clearly

3079
02:19:57,129 --> 02:19:58,479
on the maps.

3080
02:19:58,479 --> 02:20:03,879
And if the exception is made under the request for item 4A,

3081
02:20:03,879 --> 02:20:06,920
then what's to stop the exception

3082
02:20:06,920 --> 02:20:08,600
being made further out?

3083
02:20:08,600 --> 02:20:10,780
There is an airport there.

3084
02:20:10,780 --> 02:20:14,299
And housing and airports don't really work well together

3085
02:20:14,299 --> 02:20:16,319
because people who rent houses

3086
02:20:16,319 --> 02:20:20,200
or buy houses or invest in housing multifamily or single

3087
02:20:20,200 --> 02:20:22,520
family property out there don't

3088
02:20:22,520 --> 02:20:26,770
want airplanes buzzing across them, let alone trucks coming

3089
02:20:26,770 --> 02:20:28,559
in and out 24/7.

3090
02:20:28,559 --> 02:20:30,760
So it is something to consider.

3091
02:20:30,760 --> 02:20:33,000
That's why it's coming before the P&Z.

3092
02:20:33,000 --> 02:20:36,840
It's also why the staff denied the request.

3093
02:20:36,840 --> 02:20:37,879
They don't approve it.

3094
02:20:37,879 --> 02:20:41,909
They don't think that this is the best use as presented in

3095
02:20:41,909 --> 02:20:42,840
this way.

3096
02:20:42,840 --> 02:20:45,680
So that's my comments.

3097
02:20:45,680 --> 02:20:50,319
One question for you, Commissioner Beck.

3098
02:20:50,319 --> 02:20:51,879
Thank you for your comments.

3099
02:20:51,879 --> 02:20:54,760
Again, this is a public hearing.

3100
02:20:54,760 --> 02:20:56,879
Anyone who would like to speak on this item, please come

3101
02:20:56,879 --> 02:20:57,879
forward at this time.

3102
02:20:57,879 --> 02:21:02,920
While I'm waiting, I have one other response form that was

3103
02:21:02,920 --> 02:21:05,840
sent in by Leon Hent with Peterbilt

3104
02:21:05,840 --> 02:21:11,959
at 3200 Airport Road and he was opposed to the request.

3105
02:21:11,959 --> 02:21:14,040
Commissioner Beck, if you've got a question for staff.

3106
02:21:14,040 --> 02:21:17,040
I do, I'm not sure who to ask.

3107
02:21:17,040 --> 02:21:20,040
Hayley, maybe we can start with you.

3108
02:21:20,040 --> 02:21:23,760
Oh dear God.

3109
02:21:23,760 --> 02:21:28,120
I hate brain farts and I think I've just had one.

3110
02:21:28,120 --> 02:21:33,600
I sit here and let this slip by.

3111
02:21:33,600 --> 02:21:34,600
Forgive me.

3112
02:21:34,600 --> 02:21:36,840
Hopefully it will pop back up later.

3113
02:21:36,840 --> 02:21:39,159
Stand by.

3114
02:21:39,159 --> 02:21:40,479
This is a public hearing.

3115
02:21:40,479 --> 02:21:43,520
Anyone who would like to speak on this item, please come

3116
02:21:43,520 --> 02:21:44,879
forward at this time.

3117
02:21:44,879 --> 02:21:47,469
Seeing none, I will close the public hearing and open the

3118
02:21:47,469 --> 02:21:48,920
floor for discussion or motion

3119
02:21:48,920 --> 02:21:55,360
or question possibly.

3120
02:21:55,360 --> 02:21:56,360
Commissioner Beck.

3121
02:21:56,360 --> 02:21:59,659
I'd like to make a motion before I do just make a statement

3122
02:21:59,659 --> 02:22:00,280
first.

3123
02:22:00,280 --> 02:22:03,629
I'm always sympathetic to people who have property that

3124
02:22:03,629 --> 02:22:05,319
doesn't seem to move, sits

3125
02:22:05,319 --> 02:22:07,319
there for long periods of time.

3126
02:22:07,319 --> 02:22:10,409
The only way to be able to be developed is laid out with

3127
02:22:10,409 --> 02:22:12,399
the zoning designations we have

3128
02:22:12,399 --> 02:22:15,200
and per the future land use map.

3129
02:22:15,200 --> 02:22:18,370
But I'm equally reluctant to change zoning that can allow

3130
02:22:18,370 --> 02:22:20,079
for residential dwellings in

3131
02:22:20,079 --> 02:22:24,110
an area in town that is surrounded by property established

3132
02:22:24,110 --> 02:22:25,840
for industrial uses.

3133
02:22:25,840 --> 02:22:28,969
City planning is best served, best served the public when

3134
02:22:28,969 --> 02:22:31,040
it sets aside areas that accommodate

3135
02:22:31,040 --> 02:22:33,440
specific uses and prevents the effects of certain

3136
02:22:33,440 --> 02:22:35,399
businesses that can negatively impact

3137
02:22:35,399 --> 02:22:36,399
residential domains.

3138
02:22:36,399 --> 02:22:39,860
I feel this zone change request will have this negative

3139
02:22:39,860 --> 02:22:40,600
impact.

3140
02:22:40,600 --> 02:22:43,770
In my opinion, it also weakens our commitment to well-conce

3141
02:22:43,770 --> 02:22:45,719
ived future land use designations

3142
02:22:45,719 --> 02:22:49,079
as they're currently set and alters land uses in a random

3143
02:22:49,079 --> 02:22:51,680
manner, which contributes, I think,

3144
02:22:51,680 --> 02:22:54,600
uncertainty for other property owners in the area.

3145
02:22:54,600 --> 02:22:58,280
And I do have some concern for the ESA area, too.

3146
02:22:58,280 --> 02:23:01,260
I'm always worried about when these type of developments

3147
02:23:01,260 --> 02:23:02,840
come in how effectively they

3148
02:23:02,840 --> 02:23:05,440
will preserve these ESA areas.

3149
02:23:05,440 --> 02:23:10,030
So I would encourage -- I'm going to vote for denial on

3150
02:23:10,030 --> 02:23:13,040
this and encourage the applicant

3151
02:23:13,040 --> 02:23:16,090
to consider the suggestions that the staff made about

3152
02:23:16,090 --> 02:23:17,719
smaller scale uses here.

3153
02:23:17,719 --> 02:23:20,950
I'm still just not convinced that it can't be worked out

3154
02:23:20,950 --> 02:23:21,719
that way.

3155
02:23:21,719 --> 02:23:24,870
But I'm going to follow suit with the developer review

3156
02:23:24,870 --> 02:23:27,000
committee and city staff and move to

3157
02:23:27,000 --> 02:23:29,399
deny this request.

3158
02:23:29,399 --> 02:23:33,590
I think what you want to do is move to approve the staff's

3159
02:23:33,590 --> 02:23:34,440
denial.

3160
02:23:34,440 --> 02:23:36,840
>> I move to.

3161
02:23:36,840 --> 02:23:37,840
>> Okay.

3162
02:23:37,840 --> 02:23:40,600
So we have a motion on the floor.

3163
02:23:40,600 --> 02:23:44,920
Do we have a second?

3164
02:23:44,920 --> 02:23:45,920
>> What exactly is the motion?

3165
02:23:45,920 --> 02:23:46,920
What was that?

3166
02:23:46,920 --> 02:23:47,920
I didn't hear what it was.

3167
02:23:47,920 --> 02:23:48,920
>> To approve denial.

3168
02:23:48,920 --> 02:23:57,319
>> I'm going to approve denial of the request.

3169
02:23:57,319 --> 02:23:58,319
>> Okay.

3170
02:23:58,319 --> 02:24:00,719
We have -- >> Commissioner Sullivan.

3171
02:24:00,719 --> 02:24:01,719
>> Second.

3172
02:24:01,719 --> 02:24:08,840
>> I will second the approval to deny.

3173
02:24:08,840 --> 02:24:09,840
>> Commissioner Rozelle.

3174
02:24:09,840 --> 02:24:13,000
>> Thank you, Chair.

3175
02:24:13,000 --> 02:24:15,959
Before we go to a vote, I just wanted to take a minute to

3176
02:24:15,959 --> 02:24:17,440
express my thoughts.

3177
02:24:17,440 --> 02:24:23,569
I'm not going to be supporting the approval for denial for

3178
02:24:23,569 --> 02:24:25,840
a couple reasons.

3179
02:24:25,840 --> 02:24:30,440
I'm convinced based on the testimonies tonight that land

3180
02:24:30,440 --> 02:24:32,920
has a very real chance of lying

3181
02:24:32,920 --> 02:24:37,440
dormant for a lot of years like it has in the past.

3182
02:24:37,440 --> 02:24:40,299
And so I would like to see development and it sounds or at

3183
02:24:40,299 --> 02:24:41,760
least I'm convinced based

3184
02:24:41,760 --> 02:24:45,270
on the things said tonight that it's not going to be

3185
02:24:45,270 --> 02:24:47,440
developed for industrial.

3186
02:24:47,440 --> 02:24:51,010
And the concerns against it in terms of the fields and

3187
02:24:51,010 --> 02:24:53,399
residents near airports and what

3188
02:24:53,399 --> 02:24:57,700
Mr. Fikes said about his business interests, UNT already

3189
02:24:57,700 --> 02:25:00,159
has several acres of fields right

3190
02:25:00,159 --> 02:25:03,719
on Airport Road in the more dense area.

3191
02:25:03,719 --> 02:25:07,149
And so I think we've seen that fields and recreational

3192
02:25:07,149 --> 02:25:08,879
outdoor use can be used.

3193
02:25:08,879 --> 02:25:11,860
There are great estates on Jim Crystal right under the

3194
02:25:11,860 --> 02:25:13,719
airplane paths that people have

3195
02:25:13,719 --> 02:25:16,280
invested in and continue to reside in.

3196
02:25:16,280 --> 02:25:19,190
So I don't know if residents near airports don't always

3197
02:25:19,190 --> 02:25:19,719
work.

3198
02:25:19,719 --> 02:25:22,040
It seems to be working on Jim Crystal.

3199
02:25:22,040 --> 02:25:26,450
And so yeah, it's just a tough one because coming into this

3200
02:25:26,450 --> 02:25:28,680
, I looked at the future land

3201
02:25:28,680 --> 02:25:31,920
use and I saw it was all industry and I thought this is a

3202
02:25:31,920 --> 02:25:32,959
no-brainer.

3203
02:25:32,959 --> 02:25:36,829
I'll agree with staff because of the TURS and the pre-plan

3204
02:25:36,829 --> 02:25:38,959
ning we've had for industrial

3205
02:25:38,959 --> 02:25:40,760
in that area.

3206
02:25:40,760 --> 02:25:43,079
But this is the very far east of it.

3207
02:25:43,079 --> 02:25:46,229
It's not dead center and I don't feel there will be zoning

3208
02:25:46,229 --> 02:25:47,920
creep because it seems like

3209
02:25:47,920 --> 02:25:50,510
there's a lot of interest to still develop industrial on

3210
02:25:50,510 --> 02:25:51,159
that area.

3211
02:25:51,159 --> 02:25:53,750
And so based on those things, I'm not going to support the

3212
02:25:53,750 --> 02:25:55,159
motion that Commissioner Beck

3213
02:25:55,159 --> 02:25:58,600
put in.

3214
02:25:58,600 --> 02:25:59,600
Commissioner Smith.

3215
02:25:59,600 --> 02:26:00,600
Oh, you're good.

3216
02:26:00,600 --> 02:26:01,600
Don't worry about it.

3217
02:26:01,600 --> 02:26:02,600
Okay.

3218
02:26:02,600 --> 02:26:03,600
Commissioner Sanchez.

3219
02:26:03,600 --> 02:26:06,239
Yeah, I would like to say that the history that you

3220
02:26:06,239 --> 02:26:08,239
provided, I think, gives us a good

3221
02:26:08,239 --> 02:26:13,389
indication that that property is not suitable for

3222
02:26:13,389 --> 02:26:15,040
industrial.

3223
02:26:15,040 --> 02:26:20,299
I myself went by there today and I kind of had second

3224
02:26:20,299 --> 02:26:22,959
thoughts about it too.

3225
02:26:22,959 --> 02:26:27,270
I drove the whole area and I saw those areas where there

3226
02:26:27,270 --> 02:26:30,440
was big warehouses, nice and flat.

3227
02:26:30,440 --> 02:26:32,799
The topography was flat.

3228
02:26:32,799 --> 02:26:37,319
But once I hit that Crystal Road and Western Road, you

3229
02:26:37,319 --> 02:26:40,120
could see the topography change

3230
02:26:40,120 --> 02:26:41,200
completely.

3231
02:26:41,200 --> 02:26:47,090
And having those two ponds, to me, indicated that there is

3232
02:26:47,090 --> 02:26:49,959
a, what do you call it, issue

3233
02:26:49,959 --> 02:26:53,159
when it comes to water runoff.

3234
02:26:53,159 --> 02:26:57,959
And that's why those ponds were put in there years ago.

3235
02:26:57,959 --> 02:27:06,059
So again, I'll probably, my vote will probably not support

3236
02:27:06,059 --> 02:27:10,600
what the city has recommended.

3237
02:27:10,600 --> 02:27:11,600
Commissioner Smith.

3238
02:27:11,600 --> 02:27:12,600
Thank you, Chair.

3239
02:27:12,600 --> 02:27:15,190
I want to echo what Commissioner Rozelle said about the

3240
02:27:15,190 --> 02:27:16,879
land being dormant and everything

3241
02:27:16,879 --> 02:27:17,879
else.

3242
02:27:17,879 --> 02:27:22,680
My bigger thing is this, is that my recent research due to

3243
02:27:22,680 --> 02:27:24,719
other forces in the city

3244
02:27:24,719 --> 02:27:27,360
to look into student housing as a way of effects,

3245
02:27:27,360 --> 02:27:29,840
affordable housing, the biggest problem we

3246
02:27:29,840 --> 02:27:30,840
have is an enbyism.

3247
02:27:30,840 --> 02:27:31,979
And we see it.

3248
02:27:31,979 --> 02:27:34,139
We saw it with the Scripture Street project that we came in

3249
02:27:34,139 --> 02:27:35,280
front of this commission and

3250
02:27:35,280 --> 02:27:38,120
came in front of the city council and ultimately got voted

3251
02:27:38,120 --> 02:27:39,239
down back in April.

3252
02:27:39,239 --> 02:27:41,719
If we're going to put student housing in the city, it's got

3253
02:27:41,719 --> 02:27:42,639
to go somewhere.

3254
02:27:42,639 --> 02:27:44,829
And if we're not wanting to put it in residential

3255
02:27:44,829 --> 02:27:47,000
neighborhoods around the university, it's

3256
02:27:47,000 --> 02:27:48,000
got to go somewhere.

3257
02:27:48,000 --> 02:27:50,319
And if this land is going to lay dormant or we have a

3258
02:27:50,319 --> 02:27:52,360
chance to put it on, make it multifamily

3259
02:27:52,360 --> 02:27:55,569
and build student housing, it's really, really hard for us

3260
02:27:55,569 --> 02:27:56,799
to vote against it.

3261
02:27:56,799 --> 02:27:58,120
Really hard for me to vote against it.

3262
02:27:58,120 --> 02:28:02,440
So that's my little input there.

3263
02:28:02,440 --> 02:28:03,799
Okay.

3264
02:28:03,799 --> 02:28:06,559
Any other comments before I call for a vote on this

3265
02:28:06,559 --> 02:28:07,959
particular motion?

3266
02:28:07,959 --> 02:28:12,760
Seeing none, I'll call for a vote on the board.

3267
02:28:12,760 --> 02:28:16,540
We have a motion before us with first and a second to

3268
02:28:16,540 --> 02:28:18,280
approve the denial.

3269
02:28:18,280 --> 02:28:23,239
So a vote for would be to approve the denial.

3270
02:28:23,239 --> 02:28:31,959
I am messed up again.

3271
02:28:31,959 --> 02:28:33,239
Okay.

3272
02:28:33,239 --> 02:28:37,559
Can I change that?

3273
02:28:37,559 --> 02:28:38,559
Sure.

3274
02:28:38,559 --> 02:28:39,559
Request?

3275
02:28:39,559 --> 02:28:40,559
Okay.

3276
02:28:40,559 --> 02:28:41,559
Request?

3277
02:28:41,559 --> 02:28:49,520
So, we can't show it up yet.

3278
02:28:49,520 --> 02:28:51,639
Maybe you can just state for the record.

3279
02:28:51,639 --> 02:28:52,639
Okay.

3280
02:28:52,639 --> 02:28:53,639
Okay.

3281
02:28:53,639 --> 02:28:54,639
Revote?

3282
02:28:54,639 --> 02:28:55,639
Okay.

3283
02:28:55,639 --> 02:28:56,639
Revote.

3284
02:28:56,639 --> 02:28:57,639
So we're going to vote to...

3285
02:28:57,639 --> 02:29:01,840
I got mixed up there.

3286
02:29:01,840 --> 02:29:02,840
Sorry.

3287
02:29:02,840 --> 02:29:06,690
The motion is to deny the applicant's request, which would

3288
02:29:06,690 --> 02:29:07,920
be no rezoning.

3289
02:29:07,920 --> 02:29:11,879
What would be no rezoning?

3290
02:29:11,879 --> 02:29:14,680
Okay.

3291
02:29:14,680 --> 02:29:24,719
That motion is going to fail four to three.

3292
02:29:24,719 --> 02:29:28,680
The Chair would entertain another motion or have some

3293
02:29:28,680 --> 02:29:31,399
further discussion on this item.

3294
02:29:31,399 --> 02:29:33,000
Senator Rozelle.

3295
02:29:33,000 --> 02:29:37,209
I've already said my piece, so I'll just go ahead and

3296
02:29:37,209 --> 02:29:40,360
motion to deny staff's recommendation

3297
02:29:40,360 --> 02:29:43,000
and approve the rezoning of this project.

3298
02:29:43,000 --> 02:29:46,559
You can say motion to approve applicant's submission.

3299
02:29:46,559 --> 02:29:48,680
I motion to approve applicant's submission.

3300
02:29:48,680 --> 02:29:49,680
Okay.

3301
02:29:49,680 --> 02:29:51,520
Let's make it easy.

3302
02:29:51,520 --> 02:29:54,409
The Chair will ask for clarification if you have any of the

3303
02:29:54,409 --> 02:29:55,239
conditions.

3304
02:29:55,239 --> 02:29:57,829
I think there were three conditions that were requested if

3305
02:29:57,829 --> 02:29:58,959
those are going to be a part

3306
02:29:58,959 --> 02:30:00,719
of your motion or be excluded.

3307
02:30:00,719 --> 02:30:03,959
Just as a comment, you don't have to use those conditions.

3308
02:30:03,959 --> 02:30:07,920
You can use whatever conditions that you would like.

3309
02:30:07,920 --> 02:30:13,879
Are they for the SUP only?

3310
02:30:13,879 --> 02:30:16,000
Are they for the SUP or the rezoning?

3311
02:30:16,000 --> 02:30:17,000
Okay.

3312
02:30:17,000 --> 02:30:18,000
Chair's apology.

3313
02:30:18,000 --> 02:30:20,479
I'm ahead of myself in the next item.

3314
02:30:20,479 --> 02:30:24,559
I second.

3315
02:30:24,559 --> 02:30:29,479
We have a first and second to approve the rezoning.

3316
02:30:29,479 --> 02:30:35,639
Any other discussion or comments?

3317
02:30:35,639 --> 02:30:45,639
Seeing none, I'll call for a vote on the board.

3318
02:30:45,639 --> 02:30:53,200
The motion to approve the zoning change passes 4 to 3.

3319
02:30:53,200 --> 02:30:54,200
Commissioner Beck.

3320
02:30:54,200 --> 02:30:55,200
Thank you, Chair.

3321
02:30:55,200 --> 02:30:58,100
I believe we stated earlier that the opposition met the

3322
02:30:58,100 --> 02:31:01,120
criteria that it would require a supermajority

3323
02:31:01,120 --> 02:31:02,120
in city council.

3324
02:31:02,120 --> 02:31:03,120
Is that correct?

3325
02:31:03,120 --> 02:31:04,120
I believe that's correct.

3326
02:31:04,120 --> 02:31:05,120
That's correct.

3327
02:31:05,120 --> 02:31:06,120
Okay.

3328
02:31:06,120 --> 02:31:07,120
Thanks.

3329
02:31:07,120 --> 02:31:08,120
Okay.

3330
02:31:08,120 --> 02:31:09,120
Okay.

3331
02:31:09,120 --> 02:31:12,120
To continue, do we need to take a break?

3332
02:31:12,120 --> 02:31:13,120
Good.

3333
02:31:13,120 --> 02:31:14,120
Okay.

3334
02:31:14,120 --> 02:31:18,280
I will move us on to our next item.

3335
02:31:18,280 --> 02:31:24,190
I'm going to open the public hearing for B, which is S17-

3336
02:31:24,190 --> 02:31:25,920
0009.

3337
02:31:25,920 --> 02:31:30,200
This will be to have a presentation by Haley.

3338
02:31:30,200 --> 02:31:33,000
Are we going to, I think, just for clarification.

3339
02:31:33,000 --> 02:31:38,350
We can just incorporate your presentation from item 17-0016

3340
02:31:38,350 --> 02:31:39,680
into this item.

3341
02:31:39,680 --> 02:31:42,280
Just clarify that this is just for the SUP?

3342
02:31:42,280 --> 02:31:47,959
Just for the SUP portion.

3343
02:31:47,959 --> 02:31:50,729
If the recommendation of denial is rejected, we have the

3344
02:31:50,729 --> 02:31:52,280
three conditions associated with

3345
02:31:52,280 --> 02:31:53,280
this issue.

3346
02:31:53,280 --> 02:31:54,280
Correct.

3347
02:31:54,280 --> 02:31:55,280
To consider.

3348
02:31:55,280 --> 02:31:56,280
To consider.

3349
02:31:56,280 --> 02:31:57,280
If we'd like.

3350
02:31:57,280 --> 02:31:58,280
Okay.

3351
02:31:58,280 --> 02:32:00,200
Just for clarification, this is the same item.

3352
02:32:00,200 --> 02:32:03,719
It's just going to be to consider the SUP component to

3353
02:32:03,719 --> 02:32:05,280
allow multifamily.

3354
02:32:05,280 --> 02:32:13,520
Do we need to call for any, this is a public hearing.

3355
02:32:13,520 --> 02:32:16,680
So if anyone would like to speak on this item, whether it

3356
02:32:16,680 --> 02:32:18,479
be the applicant or a member of

3357
02:32:18,479 --> 02:32:21,760
the public, please come forward at this time.

3358
02:32:21,760 --> 02:32:25,280
Please state your name and address for us again.

3359
02:32:25,280 --> 02:32:28,129
Mr. Chairman, Lance Van Zandt, representing the applicant

3360
02:32:28,129 --> 02:32:29,319
landmark properties.

3361
02:32:29,319 --> 02:32:31,309
Just don't want to take up any additional time that we don

3362
02:32:31,309 --> 02:32:32,319
't need to, but we're here

3363
02:32:32,319 --> 02:32:33,319
available for questions.

3364
02:32:33,319 --> 02:32:35,649
And of course, we want to hear the speaker in support of

3365
02:32:35,649 --> 02:32:36,200
the SUP.

3366
02:32:36,200 --> 02:32:37,200
Okay.

3367
02:32:37,200 --> 02:32:38,200
Thank you.

3368
02:32:38,200 --> 02:32:39,200
Thank you.

3369
02:32:39,200 --> 02:32:40,200
Commissioner Smith.

3370
02:32:40,200 --> 02:32:43,120
Mr. Van Zandt.

3371
02:32:43,120 --> 02:32:47,319
Have you guys read over the recommendations that have been

3372
02:32:47,319 --> 02:32:49,239
made by the city if we have

3373
02:32:49,239 --> 02:32:50,639
approved the rezoning?

3374
02:32:50,639 --> 02:32:52,399
Have you guys read those?

3375
02:32:52,399 --> 02:32:55,520
Did you guys read the three conditions that were presented?

3376
02:32:55,520 --> 02:32:56,520
Yes.

3377
02:32:56,520 --> 02:32:57,520
Yes.

3378
02:32:57,520 --> 02:32:58,520
Any comments?

3379
02:32:58,520 --> 02:32:59,520
Anything you'd like to add?

3380
02:32:59,520 --> 02:33:00,520
Anything that.

3381
02:33:00,520 --> 02:33:03,520
I don't believe that that elicited any comments or concerns

3382
02:33:03,520 --> 02:33:04,079
from us.

3383
02:33:04,079 --> 02:33:05,079
Okay.

3384
02:33:05,079 --> 02:33:06,079
Great.

3385
02:33:06,079 --> 02:33:07,079
Thank you.

3386
02:33:07,079 --> 02:33:08,079
Commissioner Beck.

3387
02:33:08,079 --> 02:33:12,600
Just a quick question for clarification.

3388
02:33:12,600 --> 02:33:15,520
So if we voted yes on this, we're voting for the SUP.

3389
02:33:15,520 --> 02:33:17,520
Is that my understanding?

3390
02:33:17,520 --> 02:33:18,520
Yeah.

3391
02:33:18,520 --> 02:33:20,079
You can just vote.

3392
02:33:20,079 --> 02:33:22,399
If you're voting in the affirmative, you can vote to

3393
02:33:22,399 --> 02:33:24,200
approve the applicant submission.

3394
02:33:24,200 --> 02:33:25,200
Right.

3395
02:33:25,200 --> 02:33:26,200
Okay.

3396
02:33:26,200 --> 02:33:27,200
Thanks.

3397
02:33:27,200 --> 02:33:30,200
Commissioner Smith.

3398
02:33:30,200 --> 02:33:36,729
I motion to accept the, to accept the, what am I trying to

3399
02:33:36,729 --> 02:33:38,600
say, legal?

3400
02:33:38,600 --> 02:33:39,600
Approve.

3401
02:33:39,600 --> 02:33:44,290
Accept to approve the SCP taking into account the

3402
02:33:44,290 --> 02:33:48,120
recommendations made by city staff for

3403
02:33:48,120 --> 02:33:49,120
additional recommendations.

3404
02:33:49,120 --> 02:33:50,120
Okay.

3405
02:33:50,120 --> 02:33:53,200
The three conditions that are in our backup?

3406
02:33:53,200 --> 02:33:54,200
You got it.

3407
02:33:54,200 --> 02:33:57,200
I think we're going to break after this.

3408
02:33:57,200 --> 02:33:58,239
Yes, we will.

3409
02:33:58,239 --> 02:34:01,479
Since we have a motion, let me, I haven't yet.

3410
02:34:01,479 --> 02:34:05,079
That's why I was going to say we're getting a little ahead

3411
02:34:05,079 --> 02:34:06,239
of ourselves.

3412
02:34:06,239 --> 02:34:09,850
Since this is still a public hearing and public hearing is

3413
02:34:09,850 --> 02:34:10,819
still open.

3414
02:34:10,819 --> 02:34:13,829
So we have tabled the motion for right now until we make

3415
02:34:13,829 --> 02:34:15,600
sure everyone that would like

3416
02:34:15,600 --> 02:34:17,479
to speak on this item has an opportunity.

3417
02:34:17,479 --> 02:34:20,440
Then I will close the public hearing and then we can get a

3418
02:34:20,440 --> 02:34:21,760
motion on the floor.

3419
02:34:21,760 --> 02:34:24,069
Since a public hearing, anyone who would like to speak on

3420
02:34:24,069 --> 02:34:25,360
this item, please come forward

3421
02:34:25,360 --> 02:34:28,360
at this time.

3422
02:34:28,360 --> 02:34:35,739
I have no other cards up here wishing to speak on this item

3423
02:34:35,739 --> 02:34:36,280
.

3424
02:34:36,280 --> 02:34:38,870
Seeing none, I will close the public hearing and I will

3425
02:34:38,870 --> 02:34:40,360
call on Commissioner Smith for

3426
02:34:40,360 --> 02:34:41,360
a motion.

3427
02:34:41,360 --> 02:34:48,969
I motion to accept the SUP as written plus the city staff

3428
02:34:48,969 --> 02:34:51,840
recommendations.

3429
02:34:51,840 --> 02:34:52,840
Commissioner Sanchez.

3430
02:34:52,840 --> 02:34:53,840
I second the motion.

3431
02:34:53,840 --> 02:34:54,840
Okay.

3432
02:34:54,840 --> 02:34:57,450
We have a first and a second with the three conditions that

3433
02:34:57,450 --> 02:34:58,760
are mentioned in our staff

3434
02:34:58,760 --> 02:35:00,920
backup on this item.

3435
02:35:00,920 --> 02:35:03,600
Any further discussion or questions?

3436
02:35:03,600 --> 02:35:09,680
I'm going to request to speak on this item.

3437
02:35:09,680 --> 02:35:14,350
I'm going to speak in favor of the SUP and recommending the

3438
02:35:14,350 --> 02:35:15,840
multifamily.

3439
02:35:15,840 --> 02:35:19,389
And the reason being is that there's currently multifamily

3440
02:35:19,389 --> 02:35:21,399
just on the other side of 35 on

3441
02:35:21,399 --> 02:35:22,399
Oak Street.

3442
02:35:22,399 --> 02:35:24,959
There are a number of apartment communities there.

3443
02:35:24,959 --> 02:35:27,850
And I understand Peterbilt's concern about it, but it's

3444
02:35:27,850 --> 02:35:29,559
essentially the same roadway.

3445
02:35:29,559 --> 02:35:31,870
And I think the bus service currently comes to those

3446
02:35:31,870 --> 02:35:33,479
apartment communities that are right

3447
02:35:33,479 --> 02:35:34,479
there.

3448
02:35:34,479 --> 02:35:37,069
And I think it will be a very easy transition for them to

3449
02:35:37,069 --> 02:35:38,579
come a little bit farther west

3450
02:35:38,579 --> 02:35:40,559
and serve y'all's community as well.

3451
02:35:40,559 --> 02:35:44,750
And so with that, I'm going to be in favor of supporting

3452
02:35:44,750 --> 02:35:45,520
the SUP.

3453
02:35:45,520 --> 02:36:01,719
And I will call for a vote on the board.

3454
02:36:01,719 --> 02:36:06,159
That motion is going to pass or carry four to three.

3455
02:36:06,159 --> 02:36:08,600
It's approved.

3456
02:36:08,600 --> 02:36:14,879
I will move us to our item C.

3457
02:36:14,879 --> 02:36:18,440
Good luck with your project, gentlemen.

3458
02:36:18,440 --> 02:36:26,879
Give a couple minutes.

3459
02:36:26,879 --> 02:36:27,879
It's 8.05.

3460
02:36:27,879 --> 02:36:29,239
I'm going to call a recess.

3461
02:36:29,239 --> 02:36:31,120
And let's try to take about a 10-minute break.

3462
02:36:31,120 --> 02:36:42,739
And we'll come back.

3463
02:36:42,739 --> 02:36:48,200
And I will call us back into order at 8.24.

3464
02:36:48,200 --> 02:36:51,040
We are in our public hearing section.

3465
02:36:51,040 --> 02:36:55,760
And we are now on item C. This item is still open.

3466
02:36:55,760 --> 02:36:59,680
It was continued at our last meeting and left open.

3467
02:36:59,680 --> 02:37:02,780
So I'm not going to have to reopen this item.

3468
02:37:02,780 --> 02:37:05,159
And so at this time, I'm going to call on Julie Wyatt for

3469
02:37:05,159 --> 02:37:06,040
presentation.

3470
02:37:06,040 --> 02:37:07,040
Good evening.

3471
02:37:07,040 --> 02:37:11,520
I'm Julie Wyatt, senior planner with the City of Denton.

3472
02:37:11,520 --> 02:37:16,850
And I'm presenting Z1722 this evening, east side at Oakmont

3473
02:37:16,850 --> 02:37:17,200
.

3474
02:37:17,200 --> 02:37:20,680
The request before you is to consider an initial zoning for

3475
02:37:20,680 --> 02:37:22,639
the subject property of Neighborhood

3476
02:37:22,639 --> 02:37:26,159
Residential Mixed Use District.

3477
02:37:26,159 --> 02:37:28,319
It's approximately six acres.

3478
02:37:28,319 --> 02:37:30,920
And it's located on the east side of the future alignment

3479
02:37:30,920 --> 02:37:34,600
of 2499, about 1400 feet south of

3480
02:37:34,600 --> 02:37:37,559
Robinson Road.

3481
02:37:37,559 --> 02:37:41,450
The current zoning is RD5X, and I know you all are familiar

3482
02:37:41,450 --> 02:37:42,520
with RD5X.

3483
02:37:42,520 --> 02:37:46,290
That's our place holding zoning designation for when a

3484
02:37:46,290 --> 02:37:48,920
property is annexed into the city.

3485
02:37:48,920 --> 02:37:55,719
They are proposing on the bottom photo of NRMU.

3486
02:37:55,719 --> 02:37:59,069
So when we look at the Denton Plan 2030, this area is

3487
02:37:59,069 --> 02:38:01,479
designated as low density residential.

3488
02:38:01,479 --> 02:38:04,940
The intent of this is to encourage single family

3489
02:38:04,940 --> 02:38:07,879
development, one to four dwelling units

3490
02:38:07,879 --> 02:38:12,829
per acre, think suburban type development with individual

3491
02:38:12,829 --> 02:38:14,440
neighborhoods.

3492
02:38:14,440 --> 02:38:17,870
So when we analyzed the request against the Denton Plan,

3493
02:38:17,870 --> 02:38:20,120
the future land use, we determined

3494
02:38:20,120 --> 02:38:23,149
that the use does not technically conform to low density

3495
02:38:23,149 --> 02:38:24,920
residential in the future land

3496
02:38:24,920 --> 02:38:25,920
use.

3497
02:38:25,920 --> 02:38:28,600
So when that happens, we have to take a little extra

3498
02:38:28,600 --> 02:38:29,959
scrutiny of the site.

3499
02:38:29,959 --> 02:38:33,760
And additional criteria for approval are required in the

3500
02:38:33,760 --> 02:38:35,719
Denton Development Code.

3501
02:38:35,719 --> 02:38:38,719
Those include looking at the existing land use pattern,

3502
02:38:38,719 --> 02:38:40,440
creation of an isolated zoning

3503
02:38:40,440 --> 02:38:43,889
district, if there's adequate infrastructure that can be

3504
02:38:43,889 --> 02:38:46,040
provided, environmental impacts

3505
02:38:46,040 --> 02:38:47,799
in the character of the district.

3506
02:38:47,799 --> 02:38:51,860
So we'll kind of go over those as we go forward in the

3507
02:38:51,860 --> 02:38:53,440
presentation.

3508
02:38:53,440 --> 02:38:57,260
So I'm looking at access of the site, it is located

3509
02:38:57,260 --> 02:39:00,360
adjacent to the future extension of

3510
02:39:00,360 --> 02:39:01,360
FM 2499.

3511
02:39:01,360 --> 02:39:04,389
And I believe that's going to be opening in the next few

3512
02:39:04,389 --> 02:39:05,120
months.

3513
02:39:05,120 --> 02:39:12,239
This road is intended to connect Denton to DFW Airport.

3514
02:39:12,239 --> 02:39:15,459
And it will actually extend north of the site, will cross I

3515
02:39:15,459 --> 02:39:17,840
-35 and then head to points north.

3516
02:39:17,840 --> 02:39:21,069
So this is going to be a significant corridor within the

3517
02:39:21,069 --> 02:39:22,959
city of Denton and for the entire

3518
02:39:22,959 --> 02:39:23,959
region.

3519
02:39:23,959 --> 02:39:27,520
The subject property is located adjacent to this.

3520
02:39:27,520 --> 02:39:33,079
And it has 975 linear feet of frontage on this corridor.

3521
02:39:33,079 --> 02:39:35,670
So when we look at the request and we look at what the

3522
02:39:35,670 --> 02:39:37,559
existing zoning is, what the future

3523
02:39:37,559 --> 02:39:41,799
land use is, staff didn't feel that the property would

3524
02:39:41,799 --> 02:39:44,600
develop with a low density residential

3525
02:39:44,600 --> 02:39:45,600
use.

3526
02:39:45,600 --> 02:39:48,940
So really this isn't the type of site for that use.

3527
02:39:48,940 --> 02:39:51,670
And that commercial development given the access and the

3528
02:39:51,670 --> 02:39:53,479
visibility is probably appropriate

3529
02:39:53,479 --> 02:39:55,600
at this site.

3530
02:39:55,600 --> 02:39:59,790
And then here we'll look at a little more deeply at FM 2499

3531
02:39:59,790 --> 02:40:00,079
.

3532
02:40:00,079 --> 02:40:03,510
So here are the tech stop plans, the subject property is

3533
02:40:03,510 --> 02:40:05,879
here in green, it's that triangle.

3534
02:40:05,879 --> 02:40:09,450
There are noise walls that are planned for this road that

3535
02:40:09,450 --> 02:40:11,440
will impact the southern edge

3536
02:40:11,440 --> 02:40:13,719
of the subject property.

3537
02:40:13,719 --> 02:40:16,479
As I said, this is currently under construction.

3538
02:40:16,479 --> 02:40:19,719
It is intended to be a six lane divided roadway.

3539
02:40:19,719 --> 02:40:22,870
I know there was a question in the work session regarding

3540
02:40:22,870 --> 02:40:24,840
full access to the site, whether

3541
02:40:24,840 --> 02:40:28,159
they could have a left turn lane in and out of the site.

3542
02:40:28,159 --> 02:40:30,649
I spoke with engineering and they said that is something

3543
02:40:30,649 --> 02:40:32,200
because this is a text dot road,

3544
02:40:32,200 --> 02:40:35,549
that's something that the applicant would have to approach

3545
02:40:35,549 --> 02:40:36,879
text dot with and see if

3546
02:40:36,879 --> 02:40:38,520
that would be something that they would permit.

3547
02:40:38,520 --> 02:40:40,370
And then it would be at the expense of the applicant as to

3548
02:40:40,370 --> 02:40:41,319
whether or not they wanted

3549
02:40:41,319 --> 02:40:44,719
to punch through that median.

3550
02:40:44,719 --> 02:40:47,459
We also looked at the compatibility of the request with the

3551
02:40:47,459 --> 02:40:48,520
surrounding area.

3552
02:40:48,520 --> 02:40:51,090
So we'll just take a minute to look at what this

3553
02:40:51,090 --> 02:40:53,239
surrounding zoning and uses are.

3554
02:40:53,239 --> 02:40:56,729
So northwest of the subject property is a planned

3555
02:40:56,729 --> 02:40:57,959
development.

3556
02:40:57,959 --> 02:41:00,280
It includes single family uses.

3557
02:41:00,280 --> 02:41:04,760
There is a public utility that cuts across this PD and

3558
02:41:04,760 --> 02:41:08,520
actually is adjacent to that 2499

3559
02:41:08,520 --> 02:41:12,239
and actually cuts across that 2499 corridor.

3560
02:41:12,239 --> 02:41:14,829
There's some undeveloped commercial just south of the

3561
02:41:14,829 --> 02:41:17,040
subject property in that planned development.

3562
02:41:17,040 --> 02:41:20,399
Their concept plan set aside that land to be commercial

3563
02:41:20,399 --> 02:41:22,319
developed, to be developed in

3564
02:41:22,319 --> 02:41:24,479
a commercial way.

3565
02:41:24,479 --> 02:41:28,690
To the south there's a planned development that has a

3566
02:41:28,690 --> 02:41:31,440
single family uses and open space.

3567
02:41:31,440 --> 02:41:34,610
To the east is NR4 and that has single family development

3568
02:41:34,610 --> 02:41:36,280
and there is an open space lot

3569
02:41:36,280 --> 02:41:40,200
that is a slender lot that separates the subject property

3570
02:41:40,200 --> 02:41:42,680
from the adjacent residential.

3571
02:41:42,680 --> 02:41:48,420
And then there is a gas well facility to the north east of

3572
02:41:48,420 --> 02:41:51,639
the site and that is RD5X.

3573
02:41:51,639 --> 02:41:55,549
So when we looked at the request, and I should back up a

3574
02:41:55,549 --> 02:41:58,200
minute, when the applicant first

3575
02:41:58,200 --> 02:42:02,889
submitted the request, they came in requesting CMG, that is

3576
02:42:02,889 --> 02:42:05,399
our community mixed use general

3577
02:42:05,399 --> 02:42:07,200
zoning district.

3578
02:42:07,200 --> 02:42:11,170
That is one of our slightly more intense zoning districts

3579
02:42:11,170 --> 02:42:13,559
in terms of commercial uses in the

3580
02:42:13,559 --> 02:42:16,360
city of Denton.

3581
02:42:16,360 --> 02:42:20,659
Whereas NRMU is intended to be close to neighborhoods and

3582
02:42:20,659 --> 02:42:23,840
to provide some smaller scale commercial

3583
02:42:23,840 --> 02:42:27,159
development and mix of uses, CMG is the next step up.

3584
02:42:27,159 --> 02:42:28,920
It's more of the community mixed use.

3585
02:42:28,920 --> 02:42:32,260
It's below regional, but it's a step up.

3586
02:42:32,260 --> 02:42:34,739
We half looked at their request and we felt like it was too

3587
02:42:34,739 --> 02:42:36,079
intensive because it was so

3588
02:42:36,079 --> 02:42:38,239
close to residential.

3589
02:42:38,239 --> 02:42:41,100
It's kind of a compact area and we felt like it would be

3590
02:42:41,100 --> 02:42:42,700
just too close together.

3591
02:42:42,700 --> 02:42:46,540
It's got some intense commercial uses like vehicle repair,

3592
02:42:46,540 --> 02:42:48,280
things that could present

3593
02:42:48,280 --> 02:42:49,840
nuisances for those residential.

3594
02:42:49,840 --> 02:42:53,200
So we talked to the applicant and they said they agreed to

3595
02:42:53,200 --> 02:42:55,040
the NRMU because we felt like

3596
02:42:55,040 --> 02:42:58,840
that allowed the commercial development that is typically

3597
02:42:58,840 --> 02:43:01,200
appropriate on arterial streets,

3598
02:43:01,200 --> 02:43:05,840
but something that's a smaller scale, scales back the uses

3599
02:43:05,840 --> 02:43:08,079
a little bit to provide that

3600
02:43:08,079 --> 02:43:13,079
more compatible development pattern.

3601
02:43:13,079 --> 02:43:18,840
There's also FEMA flood zone on the subject property.

3602
02:43:18,840 --> 02:43:21,819
That's something that they will have to deal with and look

3603
02:43:21,819 --> 02:43:23,319
at as they move forward with

3604
02:43:23,319 --> 02:43:24,319
development.

3605
02:43:24,319 --> 02:43:27,100
I just want to caution you that this is just schematic on

3606
02:43:27,100 --> 02:43:27,799
this map.

3607
02:43:27,799 --> 02:43:30,940
It's not necessarily studied and this isn't based upon a

3608
02:43:30,940 --> 02:43:32,959
study, but just to let you know

3609
02:43:32,959 --> 02:43:37,040
that that's a factor once they do develop.

3610
02:43:37,040 --> 02:43:41,879
Public notification was sent out on the proposal.

3611
02:43:41,879 --> 02:43:48,479
I also want to bring up the initial proposal of CMG because

3612
02:43:48,479 --> 02:43:50,520
we initially sent out a notification

3613
02:43:50,520 --> 02:43:51,879
with the CMG.

3614
02:43:51,879 --> 02:43:54,590
I provided those responses that we got from those neighbors

3615
02:43:54,590 --> 02:43:55,719
in your back out because I

3616
02:43:55,719 --> 02:43:58,389
wanted you to have all of the information that we heard

3617
02:43:58,389 --> 02:43:59,799
from the community in terms

3618
02:43:59,799 --> 02:44:03,840
of the intensity of the use.

3619
02:44:03,840 --> 02:44:07,709
But this reflects, this map only reflects the responses

3620
02:44:07,709 --> 02:44:10,079
that we received for the NRMU,

3621
02:44:10,079 --> 02:44:12,559
the current request of the NRMU.

3622
02:44:12,559 --> 02:44:16,879
So we received five notices in opposition and that is five

3623
02:44:16,879 --> 02:44:18,799
percent of the adjoining

3624
02:44:18,799 --> 02:44:21,260
land area.

3625
02:44:21,260 --> 02:44:23,850
So based upon all of these factors, staff recommends

3626
02:44:23,850 --> 02:44:25,319
approval of their requests.

3627
02:44:25,319 --> 02:44:28,319
And although the request is technically inconsistent with

3628
02:44:28,319 --> 02:44:30,280
the future land use designation, we feel

3629
02:44:30,280 --> 02:44:33,190
it is consistent with the overall goals of the Denton Plan

3630
02:44:33,190 --> 02:44:35,120
2030 and that the proposal

3631
02:44:35,120 --> 02:44:37,430
does conform to their criteria for approval in the Denton

3632
02:44:37,430 --> 02:44:38,840
Development Code and I'll stand

3633
02:44:38,840 --> 02:44:40,600
for any questions.

3634
02:44:40,600 --> 02:44:41,600
Commissioner Smith.

3635
02:44:41,600 --> 02:44:42,600
Thank you, Chair.

3636
02:44:42,600 --> 02:44:46,569
Julie, whenever it comes to the trees that are being put on

3637
02:44:46,569 --> 02:44:48,840
the buffer that I was discussing

3638
02:44:48,840 --> 02:44:52,030
during work session, the bottom, that bottom, you know what

3639
02:44:52,030 --> 02:44:54,000
I'm talking about, the landscape

3640
02:44:54,000 --> 02:44:56,750
buffer down there, what are the guidelines in regards to

3641
02:44:56,750 --> 02:44:58,159
those trees being put in?

3642
02:44:58,159 --> 02:45:00,629
I mean, is it something where the developer has to put in

3643
02:45:00,629 --> 02:45:02,440
something that's actually large

3644
02:45:02,440 --> 02:45:04,790
and of scale so it actually is blocking something or is it

3645
02:45:04,790 --> 02:45:06,360
oh, just, you know, plant an oak,

3646
02:45:06,360 --> 02:45:08,510
it doesn't matter if it's a little sapling and it won't be

3647
02:45:08,510 --> 02:45:09,600
big enough to really block

3648
02:45:09,600 --> 02:45:12,879
any noise or light for, you know, five or ten years?

3649
02:45:12,879 --> 02:45:13,879
Sure.

3650
02:45:13,879 --> 02:45:17,340
Our code does require two-inch caliper trees to be planted

3651
02:45:17,340 --> 02:45:19,079
and to be irrigated and they

3652
02:45:19,079 --> 02:45:21,159
have to stay alive.

3653
02:45:21,159 --> 02:45:23,639
So there are, so they are smaller trees.

3654
02:45:23,639 --> 02:45:26,260
That helps them, you know, gives them a better chance at

3655
02:45:26,260 --> 02:45:27,319
actually growing.

3656
02:45:27,319 --> 02:45:30,799
So it's a two-inch caliper tree and then there are also shr

3657
02:45:30,799 --> 02:45:32,559
ubs that are associated with that

3658
02:45:32,559 --> 02:45:36,200
buffer and the trees also have to be a mixture of evergreen

3659
02:45:36,200 --> 02:45:37,440
and deciduous.

3660
02:45:37,440 --> 02:45:41,040
So we want to make sure that there's leafy coverage there.

3661
02:45:41,040 --> 02:45:42,040
Okay.

3662
02:45:42,040 --> 02:45:43,399
But it won't go away in the winter?

3663
02:45:43,399 --> 02:45:46,280
Most of it won't go away in the winter.

3664
02:45:46,280 --> 02:45:47,280
Commissioner Ellis.

3665
02:45:47,280 --> 02:45:48,280
Thank you, Chair.

3666
02:45:48,280 --> 02:45:51,510
Hey, Julie, we talked in work session that pine hills will

3667
02:45:51,510 --> 02:45:53,559
be going through out to 2499.

3668
02:45:53,559 --> 02:45:55,670
Do we know if there's a road in the Wheeler Ridge subdiv

3669
02:45:55,670 --> 02:45:57,600
ision that also will be coming?

3670
02:45:57,600 --> 02:45:58,600
I don't.

3671
02:45:58,600 --> 02:46:02,170
But we can provide, we can pull those text-out plans and

3672
02:46:02,170 --> 02:46:03,399
get them to you.

3673
02:46:03,399 --> 02:46:05,520
But I don't know specifically if there are any.

3674
02:46:05,520 --> 02:46:07,520
Yeah, I'd be curious if one of those roads as well.

3675
02:46:07,520 --> 02:46:08,520
Okay.

3676
02:46:08,520 --> 02:46:09,520
Thanks.

3677
02:46:09,520 --> 02:46:13,600
I see no other questions for staff.

3678
02:46:13,600 --> 02:46:15,639
Thank you, Julie.

3679
02:46:15,639 --> 02:46:17,360
This is a public hearing.

3680
02:46:17,360 --> 02:46:19,280
I do have some cards on this item.

3681
02:46:19,280 --> 02:46:21,639
I have three so far.

3682
02:46:21,639 --> 02:46:27,100
I will call on Kay O'Keefe first to be followed by Renee Is

3683
02:46:27,100 --> 02:46:28,719
erman and then Chris Smolke are

3684
02:46:28,719 --> 02:46:32,280
the cards that I've got.

3685
02:46:32,280 --> 02:46:33,280
The applicant is here.

3686
02:46:33,280 --> 02:46:39,200
I'd call on the applicant first.

3687
02:46:39,200 --> 02:46:41,399
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

3688
02:46:41,399 --> 02:46:43,920
Thank you, commissioners, for your service.

3689
02:46:43,920 --> 02:46:48,600
I am one of the partners in the applicant group.

3690
02:46:48,600 --> 02:46:50,840
I wanted to just address a few things.

3691
02:46:50,840 --> 02:46:55,840
Give me your Greg Johnson 319 West Oak for the record.

3692
02:46:55,840 --> 02:46:56,840
Here in Denton, Texas.

3693
02:46:56,840 --> 02:46:57,840
Thank you.

3694
02:46:57,840 --> 02:46:58,840
All right.

3695
02:46:58,840 --> 02:46:59,840
Thank you.

3696
02:46:59,840 --> 02:47:01,760
Just a couple of things I think that merit clarification.

3697
02:47:01,760 --> 02:47:03,600
Obviously you guys are very familiar with RD5X.

3698
02:47:03,600 --> 02:47:08,639
So this property has to get zoned to be used.

3699
02:47:08,639 --> 02:47:12,719
The 2030 plan didn't contemplate 2499 coming through.

3700
02:47:12,719 --> 02:47:16,489
And so had it, I think it probably would have addressed

3701
02:47:16,489 --> 02:47:18,840
what should have been contemplated

3702
02:47:18,840 --> 02:47:21,000
in terms of commercial uses along 2499.

3703
02:47:21,000 --> 02:47:22,440
So just point of clarification.

3704
02:47:22,440 --> 02:47:25,579
Obviously staff has to point to the 2030 plan as it's

3705
02:47:25,579 --> 02:47:26,280
written.

3706
02:47:26,280 --> 02:47:28,729
But had it contemplated 2499, I'm guessing that the

3707
02:47:28,729 --> 02:47:30,360
commercial uses would have been shown

3708
02:47:30,360 --> 02:47:31,360
up and down there.

3709
02:47:31,360 --> 02:47:36,049
Second point of clarification is we did apply originally

3710
02:47:36,049 --> 02:47:36,979
for CMG.

3711
02:47:36,979 --> 02:47:41,079
That was upon recommendation of staff.

3712
02:47:41,079 --> 02:47:43,159
That staff member is no longer here.

3713
02:47:43,159 --> 02:47:46,350
So we got when Julie took over the project and started

3714
02:47:46,350 --> 02:47:48,280
working with us, we did have a

3715
02:47:48,280 --> 02:47:49,280
neighborhood meeting.

3716
02:47:49,280 --> 02:47:52,020
We had about 15 or 20 folks show up.

3717
02:47:52,020 --> 02:47:55,850
We heard what their concerns were in terms of use types in

3718
02:47:55,850 --> 02:47:56,639
the CMG.

3719
02:47:56,639 --> 02:47:58,520
Julie contacted us afterwards and said, you know, some of

3720
02:47:58,520 --> 02:47:59,579
these use types that they're

3721
02:47:59,579 --> 02:48:02,399
concerned about, I really agree with.

3722
02:48:02,399 --> 02:48:04,989
Our position was those use types would never go there

3723
02:48:04,989 --> 02:48:05,479
anyway.

3724
02:48:05,479 --> 02:48:06,780
And so we're fine.

3725
02:48:06,780 --> 02:48:09,500
We just have to be able to zone it for the kind of uses

3726
02:48:09,500 --> 02:48:10,840
that would go there.

3727
02:48:10,840 --> 02:48:13,399
Julie did put the map up showing the floodplain.

3728
02:48:13,399 --> 02:48:15,360
A couple things about the site.

3729
02:48:15,360 --> 02:48:18,020
Julie, I don't want to mess with your stuff, but is there

3730
02:48:18,020 --> 02:48:19,360
one of the site that kind of

3731
02:48:19,360 --> 02:48:27,239
shows the trees or just an aerial shot of it?

3732
02:48:27,239 --> 02:48:32,319
You can go to the one that had the flood on it.

3733
02:48:32,319 --> 02:48:33,319
Okay.

3734
02:48:33,319 --> 02:48:34,319
We'll use that.

3735
02:48:34,319 --> 02:48:38,659
So to orient you on the site, there's a really big -- this

3736
02:48:38,659 --> 02:48:40,879
line is kind of covering it.

3737
02:48:40,879 --> 02:48:44,489
But up against this residential on the south side, there's

3738
02:48:44,489 --> 02:48:46,479
a big stand of trees, probably

3739
02:48:46,479 --> 02:48:49,989
I would say 6 to 10 feet from their fence line, a lot of

3740
02:48:49,989 --> 02:48:51,079
big oak trees.

3741
02:48:51,079 --> 02:48:53,819
You can't build in that anyway in terms of -- because of

3742
02:48:53,819 --> 02:48:54,680
the setback.

3743
02:48:54,680 --> 02:48:59,239
So logically -- are you coming to save me, Jim?

3744
02:48:59,239 --> 02:49:00,239
That's perfect.

3745
02:49:00,239 --> 02:49:01,239
Thank you.

3746
02:49:01,239 --> 02:49:07,719
That doesn't count against my time.

3747
02:49:07,719 --> 02:49:10,819
You can really kind of see here the dark area along the

3748
02:49:10,819 --> 02:49:11,760
south side.

3749
02:49:11,760 --> 02:49:14,399
You can get a good feel for -- those are big trees.

3750
02:49:14,399 --> 02:49:18,590
In fact, the lady called us literally like three days after

3751
02:49:18,590 --> 02:49:20,239
we bought it, and one of

3752
02:49:20,239 --> 02:49:21,719
these fences was on her fence.

3753
02:49:21,719 --> 02:49:24,700
I mean, one of these trees was on her fence, so I owned it

3754
02:49:24,700 --> 02:49:26,200
for three days and got to go

3755
02:49:26,200 --> 02:49:27,879
fix it.

3756
02:49:27,879 --> 02:49:29,799
There's big, big trees along that southern border.

3757
02:49:29,799 --> 02:49:33,989
The reason I'm bringing that up is on this site, if you can

3758
02:49:33,989 --> 02:49:36,079
come back to the main screen

3759
02:49:36,079 --> 02:49:40,479
instead of that one, Billy.

3760
02:49:40,479 --> 02:49:43,829
On this site, the floodplain actually -- this is pretty

3761
02:49:43,829 --> 02:49:46,239
close, but the floodplain is actually

3762
02:49:46,239 --> 02:49:47,719
more like up here.

3763
02:49:47,719 --> 02:49:50,709
So while this is six acres, really the only place you could

3764
02:49:50,709 --> 02:49:52,280
logically build anything is

3765
02:49:52,280 --> 02:49:55,750
right here, because the topography falls off dramatically

3766
02:49:55,750 --> 02:49:57,639
at about this point right here.

3767
02:49:57,639 --> 02:50:01,069
It falls off about 20 feet into a drainage system that Tech

3768
02:50:01,069 --> 02:50:02,559
Stat put in right here when

3769
02:50:02,559 --> 02:50:04,040
they built the road.

3770
02:50:04,040 --> 02:50:06,629
So there's a TechStat culvert, and this almost looks like a

3771
02:50:06,629 --> 02:50:08,159
bridge when you're crossing it.

3772
02:50:08,159 --> 02:50:10,440
There's a wall right here.

3773
02:50:10,440 --> 02:50:13,690
And this is about a 20, 25-foot drop-off down the center of

3774
02:50:13,690 --> 02:50:15,239
this property, and it drains

3775
02:50:15,239 --> 02:50:18,159
back here into this drainage system.

3776
02:50:18,159 --> 02:50:22,389
So really the one part of this site you can really use is

3777
02:50:22,389 --> 02:50:23,579
right here.

3778
02:50:23,579 --> 02:50:24,760
So what goes there?

3779
02:50:24,760 --> 02:50:25,760
It's mid-block.

3780
02:50:25,760 --> 02:50:27,079
There's no traffic signal.

3781
02:50:27,079 --> 02:50:28,920
It's not retail.

3782
02:50:28,920 --> 02:50:32,149
So NRMU was fine with us, because what would go there if

3783
02:50:32,149 --> 02:50:34,239
you look at this today, it's going

3784
02:50:34,239 --> 02:50:37,079
to look like Teasley is what 2499 looked like.

3785
02:50:37,079 --> 02:50:43,170
And so if we could go look at this exhibit -- if you can

3786
02:50:43,170 --> 02:50:49,280
zoom out a little bit, Billy.

3787
02:50:49,280 --> 02:50:51,280
That's my wedding ring right there.

3788
02:50:51,280 --> 02:50:52,280
You see it, honey?

3789
02:50:52,280 --> 02:50:55,639
I'm sure she's watching.

3790
02:50:55,639 --> 02:50:58,920
If you look at this -- here is Teasley.

3791
02:50:58,920 --> 02:51:03,680
So CMG, CMG, CMG, CMG, NRMU, NRMU, NRMU, right?

3792
02:51:03,680 --> 02:51:05,159
You guys have been up and down Teasley.

3793
02:51:05,159 --> 02:51:06,159
You know what it looks like.

3794
02:51:06,159 --> 02:51:08,750
You've got offices, and the public library is a large

3795
02:51:08,750 --> 02:51:10,479
building with houses sitting right

3796
02:51:10,479 --> 02:51:11,479
behind it.

3797
02:51:11,479 --> 02:51:14,440
2499 is going to be built just like Teasley.

3798
02:51:14,440 --> 02:51:17,200
Six lanes divided with a median.

3799
02:51:17,200 --> 02:51:20,000
So this is a logical use for there.

3800
02:51:20,000 --> 02:51:23,139
Nobody's going to build a house on it.

3801
02:51:23,139 --> 02:51:26,309
We need to bring this property into use, an office, medical

3802
02:51:26,309 --> 02:51:28,079
office, doctor's office, vet

3803
02:51:28,079 --> 02:51:31,319
clinic, something like that is what makes sense.

3804
02:51:31,319 --> 02:51:34,409
Like I said, two-thirds of the site is not usable because

3805
02:51:34,409 --> 02:51:35,879
it's in the floodplain.

3806
02:51:35,879 --> 02:51:38,879
So you've got tons of trees that will remain.

3807
02:51:38,879 --> 02:51:41,469
There's about a -- there's that big piece that Julie

3808
02:51:41,469 --> 02:51:43,159
referenced behind it separating

3809
02:51:43,159 --> 02:51:45,760
the houses to the east.

3810
02:51:45,760 --> 02:51:47,239
It's actually owned by the city, I believe.

3811
02:51:47,239 --> 02:51:48,920
It's a utility easement.

3812
02:51:48,920 --> 02:51:51,280
So there's a ton of separation between the usable area of

3813
02:51:51,280 --> 02:51:52,520
this site and where there's

3814
02:51:52,520 --> 02:51:54,799
actually houses.

3815
02:51:54,799 --> 02:51:56,719
So I won't use my 20 minutes.

3816
02:51:56,719 --> 02:51:59,149
I would just say that this requested zoning is consistent

3817
02:51:59,149 --> 02:52:00,399
with what you see up and down

3818
02:52:00,399 --> 02:52:02,959
this corridor.

3819
02:52:02,959 --> 02:52:04,719
It's a logical use.

3820
02:52:04,719 --> 02:52:07,600
I understand some of the opposition.

3821
02:52:07,600 --> 02:52:11,469
I think you'd find the opposition backs up to the site, and

3822
02:52:11,469 --> 02:52:12,799
I totally get it.

3823
02:52:12,799 --> 02:52:15,149
If I had a free view of something for a long time, I really

3824
02:52:15,149 --> 02:52:16,360
wouldn't want anybody building

3825
02:52:16,360 --> 02:52:17,360
anything back there either.

3826
02:52:17,360 --> 02:52:22,389
So I don't make anybody wrong for opposing something being

3827
02:52:22,389 --> 02:52:24,319
built behind them.

3828
02:52:24,319 --> 02:52:26,959
It's just the property needs to be used at this point.

3829
02:52:26,959 --> 02:52:29,559
So we would appreciate your support.

3830
02:52:29,559 --> 02:52:31,000
Got several questions for you.

3831
02:52:31,000 --> 02:52:32,000
Commissioner Rosell.

3832
02:52:32,000 --> 02:52:33,000
Thank you, Chair.

3833
02:52:33,000 --> 02:52:34,000
Thank you, Mr. Price.

3834
02:52:34,000 --> 02:52:38,600
The majority of the oppositions we received were from Pan

3835
02:52:38,600 --> 02:52:42,000
ina Trail and Palmetto Court,

3836
02:52:42,000 --> 02:52:45,959
the two streets here.

3837
02:52:45,959 --> 02:52:49,719
But it seemed like through what you were saying from the

3838
02:52:49,719 --> 02:52:53,360
east side, which is that Panina Trail,

3839
02:52:53,360 --> 02:52:56,239
there's a significant portion that wouldn't be able to be

3840
02:52:56,239 --> 02:52:57,879
developed because of that flood

3841
02:52:57,879 --> 02:52:58,879
plain?

3842
02:52:58,879 --> 02:53:02,239
Well, so we only own where this yellow line is.

3843
02:53:02,239 --> 02:53:04,520
Here's the back of their houses right here.

3844
02:53:04,520 --> 02:53:07,659
So this is actually a big utility easement that runs

3845
02:53:07,659 --> 02:53:09,959
through here that I believe is owned

3846
02:53:09,959 --> 02:53:10,959
by the city.

3847
02:53:10,959 --> 02:53:14,520
So nothing can be built in there.

3848
02:53:14,520 --> 02:53:18,200
And then secondly, you jump all the way over to here.

3849
02:53:18,200 --> 02:53:20,290
I mean, I don't know how many feet that is, but so here's

3850
02:53:20,290 --> 02:53:21,680
somebody's house in their entire

3851
02:53:21,680 --> 02:53:22,920
lot.

3852
02:53:22,920 --> 02:53:28,180
So you're talking one, two, two and a half, three times the

3853
02:53:28,180 --> 02:53:30,879
size of their entire lot before

3854
02:53:30,879 --> 02:53:33,239
you get to usable property.

3855
02:53:33,239 --> 02:53:36,389
So and there's a ton of trees back here in this back part

3856
02:53:36,389 --> 02:53:38,040
of this flood plain, which

3857
02:53:38,040 --> 02:53:39,040
you can't build in.

3858
02:53:39,040 --> 02:53:42,120
So there should be significant screening there, noise

3859
02:53:42,120 --> 02:53:42,879
barriers.

3860
02:53:42,879 --> 02:53:45,629
And then the other piece of it is when somebody's at an

3861
02:53:45,629 --> 02:53:47,799
office working is when people are gone

3862
02:53:47,799 --> 02:53:50,440
from their homes and when people come home from work, the

3863
02:53:50,440 --> 02:53:51,559
offices are vacant.

3864
02:53:51,559 --> 02:53:54,020
So it should be a pretty compatible use and plenty of

3865
02:53:54,020 --> 02:53:55,079
screening there.

3866
02:53:55,079 --> 02:53:56,079
Perfect.

3867
02:53:56,079 --> 02:53:57,079
Thank you.

3868
02:53:57,079 --> 02:53:58,079
Commissioner Ellis.

3869
02:53:58,079 --> 02:53:59,079
Thank you, Chair.

3870
02:53:59,079 --> 02:54:00,079
Thank you, Mr. Johnson.

3871
02:54:00,079 --> 02:54:01,079
Okay.

3872
02:54:01,079 --> 02:54:05,329
So my concern, of course, is that this is just right there

3873
02:54:05,329 --> 02:54:07,520
in all this density of single

3874
02:54:07,520 --> 02:54:08,520
family houses.

3875
02:54:08,520 --> 02:54:11,950
Have you considered an overlay on this being that it's a

3876
02:54:11,950 --> 02:54:14,040
zoning change, we can't tie it

3877
02:54:14,040 --> 02:54:16,770
to any kind of development or anything that you're saying

3878
02:54:16,770 --> 02:54:18,159
that it might be tonight.

3879
02:54:18,159 --> 02:54:23,530
Have you considered eliminating certain uses, creating an

3880
02:54:23,530 --> 02:54:26,760
overlay with this zoning change?

3881
02:54:26,760 --> 02:54:28,200
Nobody has brought that up to us.

3882
02:54:28,200 --> 02:54:32,409
I mean, so when I look at the site, if I look at the allow

3883
02:54:32,409 --> 02:54:34,760
able uses in NRMU and I look at

3884
02:54:34,760 --> 02:54:41,250
roughly 1.9 to 2 acres that's usable, I don't really know

3885
02:54:41,250 --> 02:54:44,000
what else would go there.

3886
02:54:44,000 --> 02:54:49,600
So the staff didn't ask us for one or nobody asked.

3887
02:54:49,600 --> 02:54:53,440
I mean, the concerns from the citizens that we heard were

3888
02:54:53,440 --> 02:54:55,280
automotive repair, the stuff

3889
02:54:55,280 --> 02:54:57,920
that's allowed in CMG, or really tall buildings that can

3890
02:54:57,920 --> 02:54:59,600
see down into my yard over the trees

3891
02:54:59,600 --> 02:55:00,600
and those things.

3892
02:55:00,600 --> 02:55:04,360
So with going from CMG to NRMU, I don't really know what

3893
02:55:04,360 --> 02:55:06,319
else there would be that anybody

3894
02:55:06,319 --> 02:55:07,319
would be concerned about.

3895
02:55:07,319 --> 02:55:09,559
Well, I mean, it could be concerned with height.

3896
02:55:09,559 --> 02:55:10,559
It's possible.

3897
02:55:10,559 --> 02:55:16,120
I mean, I think we're at, what, 65 feet with NRMU?

3898
02:55:16,120 --> 02:55:17,120
Within NRMU?

3899
02:55:17,120 --> 02:55:19,319
I think so.

3900
02:55:19,319 --> 02:55:22,440
I don't know what goes there that's 65 feet, meaning just

3901
02:55:22,440 --> 02:55:24,040
with the area, the buildable

3902
02:55:24,040 --> 02:55:30,760
area that you have, so.

3903
02:55:30,760 --> 02:55:32,319
Were you at the community meeting?

3904
02:55:32,319 --> 02:55:33,319
Yeah.

3905
02:55:33,319 --> 02:55:34,319
Okay.

3906
02:55:34,319 --> 02:55:36,629
Did you, were you able to address citizens' concerns,

3907
02:55:36,629 --> 02:55:37,680
residents' concerns?

3908
02:55:37,680 --> 02:55:41,079
Well, we answered all the questions that people had.

3909
02:55:41,079 --> 02:55:42,600
Was that during the CMG discussion?

3910
02:55:42,600 --> 02:55:43,600
That was during the CMG discussion.

3911
02:55:43,600 --> 02:55:46,040
So you didn't have another one with the NRMU then?

3912
02:55:46,040 --> 02:55:47,040
No.

3913
02:55:47,040 --> 02:55:49,489
Staff just came back to us and said that based on the

3914
02:55:49,489 --> 02:55:51,520
concerns that we heard, if you'd switched

3915
02:55:51,520 --> 02:55:54,260
to NRMU, I think that would address the concerns, are you

3916
02:55:54,260 --> 02:55:55,719
willing to switch to NRMU?

3917
02:55:55,719 --> 02:55:57,709
Because what we think really goes here, I mean, we don't

3918
02:55:57,709 --> 02:55:58,360
know, right?

3919
02:55:58,360 --> 02:56:02,420
We don't have a user yet, but what we think really goes

3920
02:56:02,420 --> 02:56:04,879
here is mid-block, no light, right

3921
02:56:04,879 --> 02:56:08,280
in, right out access, and it's a pretty small parcel.

3922
02:56:08,280 --> 02:56:12,049
So if you just look up and down Teasley, what's up and down

3923
02:56:12,049 --> 02:56:14,360
Teasley, it's logical to understand

3924
02:56:14,360 --> 02:56:16,840
that's what's going to happen over here, just because you

3925
02:56:16,840 --> 02:56:18,059
're pretty limited on your

3926
02:56:18,059 --> 02:56:20,760
buildable area.

3927
02:56:20,760 --> 02:56:24,239
So in other words, could you build 65 feet in NRMU?

3928
02:56:24,239 --> 02:56:25,239
I guess you could.

3929
02:56:25,239 --> 02:56:27,200
I've never seen anybody do it.

3930
02:56:27,200 --> 02:56:28,200
Okay.

3931
02:56:28,200 --> 02:56:29,200
Because it just doesn't.

3932
02:56:29,200 --> 02:56:30,200
But it can be done.

3933
02:56:30,200 --> 02:56:31,200
It doesn't pencil.

3934
02:56:31,200 --> 02:56:34,600
Won't be by me.

3935
02:56:34,600 --> 02:56:35,600
Commissioner Beck.

3936
02:56:35,600 --> 02:56:36,600
Thank you, Chair.

3937
02:56:36,600 --> 02:56:40,790
Greg, I think I was the one that raised the concern about

3938
02:56:40,790 --> 02:56:43,040
what citizens around that area

3939
02:56:43,040 --> 02:56:45,200
are concerned about, about what's going to be built there.

3940
02:56:45,200 --> 02:56:48,680
So bringing up the overlay district, I don't think would

3941
02:56:48,680 --> 02:56:50,000
hurt either side.

3942
02:56:50,000 --> 02:56:52,590
You're right, there's certain things that can't be built

3943
02:56:52,590 --> 02:56:53,879
there, and it would convey

3944
02:56:53,879 --> 02:56:56,930
a sense of security for the people who are concerned what

3945
02:56:56,930 --> 02:56:58,200
can be built there.

3946
02:56:58,200 --> 02:57:01,520
I mean, a hotel can be built there, obviously.

3947
02:57:01,520 --> 02:57:04,680
I don't think there's room for that.

3948
02:57:04,680 --> 02:57:08,120
The only other negative thing I see that would be allowed

3949
02:57:08,120 --> 02:57:10,319
in an NRMU that people might object

3950
02:57:10,319 --> 02:57:15,159
to is the semi-public halls, clubs, and lodges.

3951
02:57:15,159 --> 02:57:19,920
So by putting an overlay district there and allowing things

3952
02:57:19,920 --> 02:57:22,360
like a laundromat or doctor's

3953
02:57:22,360 --> 02:57:25,020
offices, things like that, I think would give some

3954
02:57:25,020 --> 02:57:27,559
assurance to the people there that what's

3955
02:57:27,559 --> 02:57:30,170
going to be built there is going to be amenable to the area

3956
02:57:30,170 --> 02:57:31,000
they live in.

3957
02:57:31,000 --> 02:57:34,639
And I know you were comparing Teasley to, or 2499 to Teas

3958
02:57:34,639 --> 02:57:36,280
ley, but I believe Teasley

3959
02:57:36,280 --> 02:57:38,079
was there long before anything was.

3960
02:57:38,079 --> 02:57:41,909
So they zoned accordingly around Teasley where these things

3961
02:57:41,909 --> 02:57:43,920
, this area was already zoned

3962
02:57:43,920 --> 02:57:46,860
and we're building a road through it, so just to make a

3963
02:57:46,860 --> 02:57:47,479
point.

3964
02:57:47,479 --> 02:57:50,829
But again, the overlay thing, would you be totally opposed

3965
02:57:50,829 --> 02:57:51,440
to that?

3966
02:57:51,440 --> 02:57:52,440
No.

3967
02:57:52,440 --> 02:57:54,469
Again, if somebody wants to propose something and say, "

3968
02:57:54,469 --> 02:57:55,879
Would this cause you any heartburn?"

3969
02:57:55,879 --> 02:57:57,760
I certainly can respond to that.

3970
02:57:57,760 --> 02:58:00,579
But I will correct your comment about Teasley was already

3971
02:58:00,579 --> 02:58:02,319
built and all that stuff was there

3972
02:58:02,319 --> 02:58:03,559
when the neighborhoods were built.

3973
02:58:03,559 --> 02:58:05,040
It actually didn't happen that way.

3974
02:58:05,040 --> 02:58:09,629
So you have office buildings on Teasley and properties on

3975
02:58:09,629 --> 02:58:12,000
Teasley's own CMG and NRMU after

3976
02:58:12,000 --> 02:58:13,479
all the residential was there.

3977
02:58:13,479 --> 02:58:17,250
I remember driving down, biking down Teasley in the 70s

3978
02:58:17,250 --> 02:58:19,200
when there was nothing but open

3979
02:58:19,200 --> 02:58:20,200
fields.

3980
02:58:20,200 --> 02:58:21,200
So...

3981
02:58:21,200 --> 02:58:22,969
I don't know, the road was there, but I'm really talking

3982
02:58:22,969 --> 02:58:24,399
about when the commercial...

3983
02:58:24,399 --> 02:58:28,440
The zoning that came in, commercial, whatever CMG accommod

3984
02:58:28,440 --> 02:58:29,399
ated that.

3985
02:58:29,399 --> 02:58:32,649
But now we've got something that's already zoned and we

3986
02:58:32,649 --> 02:58:34,319
built a road through it.

3987
02:58:34,319 --> 02:58:37,290
So I'm just saying it's not a fair comparison, but it's not

3988
02:58:37,290 --> 02:58:38,040
our...

3989
02:58:38,040 --> 02:58:40,420
Yeah, I think, well, with all due respect, I think what we

3990
02:58:40,420 --> 02:58:41,680
're trying to talk about here

3991
02:58:41,680 --> 02:58:45,069
is can you... does it make sense to put NRMU zoning on a

3992
02:58:45,069 --> 02:58:46,799
road frontage when there's houses

3993
02:58:46,799 --> 02:58:47,799
behind it?

3994
02:58:47,799 --> 02:58:48,799
I think that's really the question.

3995
02:58:48,799 --> 02:58:51,850
And all I'm trying to respectfully say is that is what

3996
02:58:51,850 --> 02:58:53,280
happened on Teasley.

3997
02:58:53,280 --> 02:58:54,280
So if we...

3998
02:58:54,280 --> 02:58:55,280
So...

3999
02:58:55,280 --> 02:58:56,280
I guess here's the question.

4000
02:58:56,280 --> 02:58:59,309
But if there's a question about a certain overlay, again,

4001
02:58:59,309 --> 02:59:00,399
no one's asked us.

4002
02:59:00,399 --> 02:59:01,399
We're open.

4003
02:59:01,399 --> 02:59:03,719
I mean, if you're worried about a hotel, done.

4004
02:59:03,719 --> 02:59:04,719
Nightclub, done.

4005
02:59:04,719 --> 02:59:05,719
Or not done.

4006
02:59:05,719 --> 02:59:06,719
Because it's not...

4007
02:59:06,719 --> 02:59:09,000
Meaning, if you want to put that in overlay, we're fine.

4008
02:59:09,000 --> 02:59:13,020
So if we approve this with that condition, you'd be okay

4009
02:59:13,020 --> 02:59:14,040
with that?

4010
02:59:14,040 --> 02:59:15,680
With no hotel and no...

4011
02:59:15,680 --> 02:59:18,729
With the overlay that would specify what could and couldn't

4012
02:59:18,729 --> 02:59:19,719
be built there.

4013
02:59:19,719 --> 02:59:22,299
Well, I just want you to tell me what that is before I say

4014
02:59:22,299 --> 02:59:22,840
I agree.

4015
02:59:22,840 --> 02:59:25,959
Well, really, I only see a couple of things on here that

4016
02:59:25,959 --> 02:59:28,799
would probably upset citizens.

4017
02:59:28,799 --> 02:59:31,200
We would have no problem if you said we want an overlay

4018
02:59:31,200 --> 02:59:32,879
that says no nightclubs, no bars,

4019
02:59:32,879 --> 02:59:33,879
no hotels.

4020
02:59:33,879 --> 02:59:34,879
Well, they're not allowed anyway.

4021
02:59:34,879 --> 02:59:38,799
And I don't see them being allowed in here permitted.

4022
02:59:38,799 --> 02:59:40,120
Oh, I thought that's what I heard you say.

4023
02:59:40,120 --> 02:59:41,120
I'm sorry.

4024
02:59:41,120 --> 02:59:44,760
Well, there was this semi-public halls, clubs, and lodges

4025
02:59:44,760 --> 02:59:46,920
which could be perceived as that.

4026
02:59:46,920 --> 02:59:47,920
And it may be, I don't know.

4027
02:59:47,920 --> 02:59:50,850
But as far as just a rank bar or something like that, I don

4028
02:59:50,850 --> 02:59:52,559
't think they'd be allowed.

4029
02:59:52,559 --> 02:59:58,159
But anyway, what we're looking at is what's allowed in here

4030
02:59:58,159 --> 03:00:00,959
that's not intense, low key,

4031
03:00:00,959 --> 03:00:03,360
you know, and amenable to the neighborhood.

4032
03:00:03,360 --> 03:00:04,360
Sure.

4033
03:00:04,360 --> 03:00:05,360
Yeah.

4034
03:00:05,360 --> 03:00:07,819
And what we're looking for is to be treated just like

4035
03:00:07,819 --> 03:00:09,479
everybody else is, on a similar

4036
03:00:09,479 --> 03:00:13,000
tract, on a similar road, with similar neighborhood behind

4037
03:00:13,000 --> 03:00:13,399
it.

4038
03:00:13,399 --> 03:00:17,159
The city built a very large public library with houses

4039
03:00:17,159 --> 03:00:18,440
right behind it.

4040
03:00:18,440 --> 03:00:20,899
We just saying, you know, we just want to be treated the

4041
03:00:20,899 --> 03:00:21,399
same.

4042
03:00:21,399 --> 03:00:24,670
And this property is pretty unique in that it has a huge

4043
03:00:24,670 --> 03:00:26,879
floodplain area in the back and

4044
03:00:26,879 --> 03:00:28,520
an additional buffer behind that.

4045
03:00:28,520 --> 03:00:30,989
So quite a bit of distance between the houses and where you

4046
03:00:30,989 --> 03:00:32,120
can build a building.

4047
03:00:32,120 --> 03:00:34,709
And I guess I was educated and I had some staff correct me

4048
03:00:34,709 --> 03:00:35,440
if I'm wrong.

4049
03:00:35,440 --> 03:00:40,040
But the fact that it's a floodplain and it can't be built

4050
03:00:40,040 --> 03:00:42,280
in, aren't there ways you can

4051
03:00:42,280 --> 03:00:43,280
work around that?

4052
03:00:43,280 --> 03:00:45,000
How are we working through any floodplain?

4053
03:00:45,000 --> 03:00:48,770
Don't you, like an alternate ESA, isn't there something you

4054
03:00:48,770 --> 03:00:51,360
can to work through these floodplains?

4055
03:00:51,360 --> 03:00:56,049
I don't know if this is for me, but I know that you can do

4056
03:00:56,049 --> 03:00:58,680
reclamation, which is very

4057
03:00:58,680 --> 03:00:59,680
expensive.

4058
03:00:59,680 --> 03:01:00,680
Right.

4059
03:01:00,680 --> 03:01:01,680
Okay.

4060
03:01:01,680 --> 03:01:04,120
So you can't build there, but if you did, it'd be pretty

4061
03:01:04,120 --> 03:01:04,840
expensive.

4062
03:01:04,840 --> 03:01:09,360
That's probably something you don't see happening.

4063
03:01:09,360 --> 03:01:12,159
The answer is you can't build in floodplains.

4064
03:01:12,159 --> 03:01:13,760
So you just can't.

4065
03:01:13,760 --> 03:01:14,760
Okay.

4066
03:01:14,760 --> 03:01:15,760
That's what I was saying.

4067
03:01:15,760 --> 03:01:16,760
Reclamation is just...

4068
03:01:16,760 --> 03:01:20,559
You would build it up so that it's no longer in the flood

4069
03:01:20,559 --> 03:01:21,319
plain.

4070
03:01:21,319 --> 03:01:22,319
Okay.

4071
03:01:22,319 --> 03:01:24,120
But not actually in the floodplain.

4072
03:01:24,120 --> 03:01:25,120
Right.

4073
03:01:25,120 --> 03:01:26,120
Okay.

4074
03:01:26,120 --> 03:01:27,120
All right.

4075
03:01:27,120 --> 03:01:28,120
Great.

4076
03:01:28,120 --> 03:01:29,120
Thanks.

4077
03:01:29,120 --> 03:01:30,120
Floodway versus floodplain would be the difference.

4078
03:01:30,120 --> 03:01:31,120
Okay.

4079
03:01:31,120 --> 03:01:32,120
Thank you.

4080
03:01:32,120 --> 03:01:33,120
Thank you.

4081
03:01:33,120 --> 03:01:34,120
Commissioner Sullivan.

4082
03:01:34,120 --> 03:01:37,120
Thank you, Chair.

4083
03:01:37,120 --> 03:01:40,159
My concerns would be, as you've already addressed, on the

4084
03:01:40,159 --> 03:01:42,399
east side, you've got the floodplain.

4085
03:01:42,399 --> 03:01:46,190
You've got plenty of easement between the homes that were

4086
03:01:46,190 --> 03:01:48,159
there before you bought your

4087
03:01:48,159 --> 03:01:49,159
property.

4088
03:01:49,159 --> 03:01:50,959
And so that's okay.

4089
03:01:50,959 --> 03:01:53,959
To the west, you've got $24.99.

4090
03:01:53,959 --> 03:01:55,680
So that's what's going in.

4091
03:01:55,680 --> 03:01:58,750
The biggest concern, though, is on the south side, we've

4092
03:01:58,750 --> 03:02:00,399
got those homes that have been

4093
03:02:00,399 --> 03:02:05,200
there for a while, and I think there's a community pool at

4094
03:02:05,200 --> 03:02:07,319
the end of that circle.

4095
03:02:07,319 --> 03:02:12,430
And so I guess my concern is what kind of an easement is

4096
03:02:12,430 --> 03:02:15,559
going to be between those lines

4097
03:02:15,559 --> 03:02:20,260
of homes and access to the pool area that is going to get

4098
03:02:20,260 --> 03:02:22,760
it far enough away from them

4099
03:02:22,760 --> 03:02:26,950
that it's not going to intrude on what they've been living

4100
03:02:26,950 --> 03:02:28,799
with for the past five or six

4101
03:02:28,799 --> 03:02:30,319
or ten years or whatever.

4102
03:02:30,319 --> 03:02:31,319
Sure.

4103
03:02:31,319 --> 03:02:34,920
And so just like any similar property where you have a

4104
03:02:34,920 --> 03:02:37,799
commercial use next to a neighborhood,

4105
03:02:37,799 --> 03:02:41,149
which is very typical with office uses, et cetera, the city

4106
03:02:41,149 --> 03:02:42,479
has a guideline in place

4107
03:02:42,479 --> 03:02:43,479
for that.

4108
03:02:43,479 --> 03:02:46,159
So you've got a true setback, and then you've got a

4109
03:02:46,159 --> 03:02:48,600
building setback, and you've got landscape

4110
03:02:48,600 --> 03:02:51,559
requirements and buffer requirements and either a

4111
03:02:51,559 --> 03:02:55,079
separation fence or an alternative landscape

4112
03:02:55,079 --> 03:02:58,340
buffer where you can do more landscaping in lieu of the

4113
03:02:58,340 --> 03:02:59,000
fence.

4114
03:02:59,000 --> 03:03:01,309
And so when it comes time for somebody to build on this,

4115
03:03:01,309 --> 03:03:02,360
whether it's a doctor or a

4116
03:03:02,360 --> 03:03:05,469
dentist or whoever, they're going to have to follow all

4117
03:03:05,469 --> 03:03:07,079
those criteria and meet the

4118
03:03:07,079 --> 03:03:08,639
city's requirement for the separation.

4119
03:03:08,639 --> 03:03:12,120
And so that's why NRMU probably does make sense, which is

4120
03:03:12,120 --> 03:03:14,120
its neighborhood residential

4121
03:03:14,120 --> 03:03:15,120
makes use.

4122
03:03:15,120 --> 03:03:18,479
It's the purpose of the zoning is to have it up against

4123
03:03:18,479 --> 03:03:20,600
neighborhoods, and then so they've

4124
03:03:20,600 --> 03:03:23,750
got all those requirements in there in terms of the per

4125
03:03:23,750 --> 03:03:26,200
vious area, landscape requirements,

4126
03:03:26,200 --> 03:03:27,200
et cetera.

4127
03:03:27,200 --> 03:03:31,250
But when you held your public meeting, it was based on the

4128
03:03:31,250 --> 03:03:33,120
other zoning and not this

4129
03:03:33,120 --> 03:03:34,120
zoning.

4130
03:03:34,120 --> 03:03:36,430
It was based on CMG, which allows a lot of the same uses,

4131
03:03:36,430 --> 03:03:37,520
but also allows a lot more

4132
03:03:37,520 --> 03:03:38,520
intense uses.

4133
03:03:38,520 --> 03:03:39,520
Exactly.

4134
03:03:39,520 --> 03:03:40,520
And that's what I'm saying.

4135
03:03:40,520 --> 03:03:43,799
And I'm just wondering if you were to go back to the

4136
03:03:43,799 --> 03:03:46,040
neighborhood and say, "Okay, here's

4137
03:03:46,040 --> 03:03:51,540
what we've revised, going to a different NRMU zoning, and

4138
03:03:51,540 --> 03:03:54,440
here's what the possibilities

4139
03:03:54,440 --> 03:03:55,440
are."

4140
03:03:55,440 --> 03:03:57,959
I just wonder, would that alleviate some of their concerns?

4141
03:03:57,959 --> 03:04:02,319
I mean, obviously I don't know, and you don't know, but I'm

4142
03:04:02,319 --> 03:04:04,280
just wondering if that is a

4143
03:04:04,280 --> 03:04:09,430
possibility of going back and rather than having -- because

4144
03:04:09,430 --> 03:04:11,479
actually I count eight,

4145
03:04:11,479 --> 03:04:14,760
I think, negative responses and not what we have here.

4146
03:04:14,760 --> 03:04:19,840
But so it seems like there are a lot of -- there are no

4147
03:04:19,840 --> 03:04:23,600
positives at all and negatives with

4148
03:04:23,600 --> 03:04:25,760
the old zoning.

4149
03:04:25,760 --> 03:04:30,250
So I'm just wondering, would that -- would you be opposed

4150
03:04:30,250 --> 03:04:32,520
to having a public meeting,

4151
03:04:32,520 --> 03:04:37,020
another meeting, with the new zoning and talk to them about

4152
03:04:37,020 --> 03:04:39,639
what the possibilities are?

4153
03:04:39,639 --> 03:04:40,639
Sure.

4154
03:04:40,639 --> 03:04:44,600
So when we re-noticed everyone with NRMU, I did receive

4155
03:04:44,600 --> 03:04:46,719
some phone calls from some of

4156
03:04:46,719 --> 03:04:47,719
the folks.

4157
03:04:47,719 --> 03:04:48,719
My information was provided.

4158
03:04:48,719 --> 03:04:52,930
Anyone that wanted to call me could call me, answer any

4159
03:04:52,930 --> 03:04:55,360
questions that they may have.

4160
03:04:55,360 --> 03:04:58,389
We talked in the public meeting about, here's what likely

4161
03:04:58,389 --> 03:04:59,159
goes here.

4162
03:04:59,159 --> 03:05:01,440
I mean, in the neighborhood meeting, sorry.

4163
03:05:01,440 --> 03:05:02,440
Here's what likely goes here.

4164
03:05:02,440 --> 03:05:04,959
I mean, I'm in the business, been in business a long time.

4165
03:05:04,959 --> 03:05:07,000
I sell property like this.

4166
03:05:07,000 --> 03:05:09,350
There's just certain uses that won't go because of the

4167
03:05:09,350 --> 03:05:11,239
nature of where it sits and the access

4168
03:05:11,239 --> 03:05:12,719
and so on.

4169
03:05:12,719 --> 03:05:16,879
So I mean, do I want to delay this even longer?

4170
03:05:16,879 --> 03:05:17,879
We've been at it a while.

4171
03:05:17,879 --> 03:05:20,399
Do I want to delay it longer and do another public meeting?

4172
03:05:20,399 --> 03:05:23,360
Frankly, I don't know that you get a different result

4173
03:05:23,360 --> 03:05:25,479
because I'm not so sure that all these

4174
03:05:25,479 --> 03:05:29,670
people are opposed to a doctor's office or whatever, you

4175
03:05:29,670 --> 03:05:31,840
know, the logical use that will

4176
03:05:31,840 --> 03:05:32,840
go here.

4177
03:05:32,840 --> 03:05:33,840
I get it.

4178
03:05:33,840 --> 03:05:36,000
They don't want anything to be built behind them.

4179
03:05:36,000 --> 03:05:37,000
It's a great view.

4180
03:05:37,000 --> 03:05:38,000
It's free.

4181
03:05:38,000 --> 03:05:39,860
I mean, I think if you were to say a doctor, I mean, heck,

4182
03:05:39,860 --> 03:05:41,239
most of them might be patients,

4183
03:05:41,239 --> 03:05:45,010
but you know, I'm not sure how quick that area is going to

4184
03:05:45,010 --> 03:05:47,319
be built out because 2499

4185
03:05:47,319 --> 03:05:49,079
is still waiting to open up.

4186
03:05:49,079 --> 03:05:52,969
But the point is, once it is built out, then you're going

4187
03:05:52,969 --> 03:05:55,040
to have limited access to and

4188
03:05:55,040 --> 03:06:00,479
from, you know, say the neighborhoods behind you, when they

4189
03:06:00,479 --> 03:06:02,920
come out under Robinson and

4190
03:06:02,920 --> 03:06:06,200
come over and turn, they're not going to be able to go

4191
03:06:06,200 --> 03:06:07,520
south and turn in.

4192
03:06:07,520 --> 03:06:10,370
They have to go on further down somewhere, make a U-turn

4193
03:06:10,370 --> 03:06:11,200
and come in.

4194
03:06:11,200 --> 03:06:13,440
So that's not going to be convenient.

4195
03:06:13,440 --> 03:06:16,909
So I'm just wondering how much in and out traffic is, you

4196
03:06:16,909 --> 03:06:18,840
know, what kind of a business

4197
03:06:18,840 --> 03:06:22,360
would want that limited traffic?

4198
03:06:22,360 --> 03:06:24,360
Right.

4199
03:06:24,360 --> 03:06:27,340
And that's the point I'm making is what uses would go there

4200
03:06:27,340 --> 03:06:28,879
, retail won't go there.

4201
03:06:28,879 --> 03:06:30,959
The access is bad for retail.

4202
03:06:30,959 --> 03:06:33,479
The visibility, it's not on the corner.

4203
03:06:33,479 --> 03:06:35,100
There's not a traffic signal.

4204
03:06:35,100 --> 03:06:37,959
And so what we think logically ends up going here is some

4205
03:06:37,959 --> 03:06:39,319
sort of an office use.

4206
03:06:39,319 --> 03:06:41,819
And that's pretty much, if you look at the map I showed, if

4207
03:06:41,819 --> 03:06:43,040
you just drive up and down

4208
03:06:43,040 --> 03:06:47,719
Teasley, what goes on these kind of sites, office buildings

4209
03:06:47,719 --> 03:06:48,040
?

4210
03:06:48,040 --> 03:06:52,690
So you know, we don't really have a whole lot of options on

4211
03:06:52,690 --> 03:06:53,719
access.

4212
03:06:53,719 --> 03:06:57,909
The wall that TexDOT built because of the drainage system

4213
03:06:57,909 --> 03:06:59,840
they put right through the

4214
03:06:59,840 --> 03:07:03,479
middle of our property, there's going to be a place for a

4215
03:07:03,479 --> 03:07:05,479
curb cut somewhere right down

4216
03:07:05,479 --> 03:07:07,440
here and that's going to be it.

4217
03:07:07,440 --> 03:07:09,870
Because you can't, you know, it wouldn't make sense for

4218
03:07:09,870 --> 03:07:11,399
anybody to build a bridge across

4219
03:07:11,399 --> 03:07:14,200
flood plain to have a curb cut over here.

4220
03:07:14,200 --> 03:07:16,510
So you know, most logically you have to have the, meet the

4221
03:07:16,510 --> 03:07:17,959
distance requirement from Pine

4222
03:07:17,959 --> 03:07:21,559
Hills and have a right in, right out because there's a

4223
03:07:21,559 --> 03:07:23,760
median that runs from Pine Hills

4224
03:07:23,760 --> 03:07:24,920
all the way up here.

4225
03:07:24,920 --> 03:07:26,620
There's no separation.

4226
03:07:26,620 --> 03:07:30,520
So who would go on a one way right in, right out access?

4227
03:07:30,520 --> 03:07:34,420
Not retail, not car servicing, not you know, those things

4228
03:07:34,420 --> 03:07:35,120
in CMG.

4229
03:07:35,120 --> 03:07:37,760
It's likely going to be an office use.

4230
03:07:37,760 --> 03:07:40,920
Thank you.

4231
03:07:40,920 --> 03:07:42,079
See any other questions?

4232
03:07:42,079 --> 03:07:44,280
Thank you.

4233
03:07:44,280 --> 03:07:48,639
This is a public hearing and I do have three cards.

4234
03:07:48,639 --> 03:07:49,639
Kay O'Keefe?

4235
03:07:49,639 --> 03:07:55,319
Do you not want to speak?

4236
03:07:55,319 --> 03:07:56,319
Okay.

4237
03:07:56,319 --> 03:07:57,319
You're correct.

4238
03:07:57,319 --> 03:08:00,319
I'm sorry, I see a yellow card.

4239
03:08:00,319 --> 03:08:02,479
I got a lot up here.

4240
03:08:02,479 --> 03:08:03,479
You're in opposition.

4241
03:08:03,479 --> 03:08:05,479
I'll just read this into the record.

4242
03:08:05,479 --> 03:08:07,479
Kay O'Keefe, 3711.

4243
03:08:07,479 --> 03:08:11,319
Palmetto Court, in opposition.

4244
03:08:11,319 --> 03:08:15,079
I have another card.

4245
03:08:15,079 --> 03:08:18,520
Renee Iserman does not wish to speak.

4246
03:08:18,520 --> 03:08:19,520
Okay.

4247
03:08:19,520 --> 03:08:21,280
You're welcome to change your mind.

4248
03:08:21,280 --> 03:08:24,879
Please come forward and state your name and address.

4249
03:08:24,879 --> 03:08:28,600
My name is Renee Iserman.

4250
03:08:28,600 --> 03:08:33,760
Renee Iserman, 3901 Luck Hole Drive, Dent, Texas.

4251
03:08:33,760 --> 03:08:38,440
We discussed Pinnatrell and I understand that there is,

4252
03:08:38,440 --> 03:08:41,159
they're not going to be building

4253
03:08:41,159 --> 03:08:42,159
on that.

4254
03:08:42,159 --> 03:08:45,200
The biggest concern is that Palmetto Court.

4255
03:08:45,200 --> 03:08:47,819
If you look at that, there are houses that are backed up to

4256
03:08:47,819 --> 03:08:50,319
that yellow line.

4257
03:08:50,319 --> 03:08:56,450
And it's the land that we're looking at is a known flood

4258
03:08:56,450 --> 03:08:57,479
zone.

4259
03:08:57,479 --> 03:09:02,739
And where you see the pool right off of Palmetto, right

4260
03:09:02,739 --> 03:09:06,040
next to that is a large strip of land

4261
03:09:06,040 --> 03:09:07,040
that's deep.

4262
03:09:07,040 --> 03:09:09,280
It's never flooded.

4263
03:09:09,280 --> 03:09:15,190
However, in the small area that they're proposing to build

4264
03:09:15,190 --> 03:09:18,239
on this lot, it backs right up to

4265
03:09:18,239 --> 03:09:19,680
the houses.

4266
03:09:19,680 --> 03:09:25,959
And it's going to be closer to the houses than not.

4267
03:09:25,959 --> 03:09:28,559
Is there going to be an engineering study for flooding

4268
03:09:28,559 --> 03:09:30,360
before they even start to build?

4269
03:09:30,360 --> 03:09:33,280
Is that a requirement of the city?

4270
03:09:33,280 --> 03:09:36,239
They'll have to go through a full civil process on this.

4271
03:09:36,239 --> 03:09:37,360
That's not before us tonight.

4272
03:09:37,360 --> 03:09:38,840
We're just looking at the zoning.

4273
03:09:38,840 --> 03:09:40,959
But that's, see, that's a big, that's a concern.

4274
03:09:40,959 --> 03:09:44,799
I don't think people mind there being something there.

4275
03:09:44,799 --> 03:09:46,440
We don't know what's going to be there.

4276
03:09:46,440 --> 03:09:48,850
And we don't know what effect it's going to have on these

4277
03:09:48,850 --> 03:09:50,239
houses at Palmetto Court.

4278
03:09:50,239 --> 03:09:51,239
Okay.

4279
03:09:51,239 --> 03:09:54,280
Well, that will all be addressed when this comes back

4280
03:09:54,280 --> 03:09:56,159
before us for, before it could

4281
03:09:56,159 --> 03:09:57,159
be final platted.

4282
03:09:57,159 --> 03:09:58,159
Okay.

4283
03:09:58,159 --> 03:10:00,799
They would have to have a full set of engineering and civil

4284
03:10:00,799 --> 03:10:02,319
study and city staff would have

4285
03:10:02,319 --> 03:10:03,319
to review all of that.

4286
03:10:03,319 --> 03:10:04,319
Okay.

4287
03:10:04,319 --> 03:10:06,329
And make sure that it meets all the city requirements for

4288
03:10:06,329 --> 03:10:07,000
development.

4289
03:10:07,000 --> 03:10:09,719
So tonight you could possibly approve it.

4290
03:10:09,719 --> 03:10:12,309
However, what's the next step before we see that it's gone

4291
03:10:12,309 --> 03:10:13,879
through the engineering study?

4292
03:10:13,879 --> 03:10:15,840
Is that after city council or?

4293
03:10:15,840 --> 03:10:18,879
So we're just looking at zoning tonight.

4294
03:10:18,879 --> 03:10:21,469
And then the next step for a developer, if they find a user

4295
03:10:21,469 --> 03:10:22,600
, is to do what's called a

4296
03:10:22,600 --> 03:10:24,600
preliminary plat or a site plan.

4297
03:10:24,600 --> 03:10:25,600
Okay.

4298
03:10:25,600 --> 03:10:27,700
And then bring that back before us and then a final plat

4299
03:10:27,700 --> 03:10:28,959
and those go through all types

4300
03:10:28,959 --> 03:10:30,959
of reviews with city staff before they come forward.

4301
03:10:30,959 --> 03:10:34,590
Yeah, I think there needs to be some assurances to the

4302
03:10:34,590 --> 03:10:37,280
neighbors because we've been here for

4303
03:10:37,280 --> 03:10:38,280
over 15 years.

4304
03:10:38,280 --> 03:10:39,280
Sure.

4305
03:10:39,280 --> 03:10:40,280
And never had a problem.

4306
03:10:40,280 --> 03:10:44,489
And anytime something new comes in, I know that 2499 has

4307
03:10:44,489 --> 03:10:46,040
done their studies.

4308
03:10:46,040 --> 03:10:50,629
However, their studies didn't include a change in zoning

4309
03:10:50,629 --> 03:10:51,520
either.

4310
03:10:51,520 --> 03:10:52,520
Sure.

4311
03:10:52,520 --> 03:10:54,000
So that's our concern.

4312
03:10:54,000 --> 03:10:55,000
Okay.

4313
03:10:55,000 --> 03:10:57,000
Well, thank you for bringing those to our attention.

4314
03:10:57,000 --> 03:10:58,000
Question?

4315
03:10:58,000 --> 03:10:59,000
Commissioner Beck.

4316
03:10:59,000 --> 03:11:00,000
Ms. Isherman.

4317
03:11:00,000 --> 03:11:01,000
Yes, sir.

4318
03:11:01,000 --> 03:11:04,000
I have a question for you, please.

4319
03:11:04,000 --> 03:11:06,159
First off, thanks for coming down and speaking.

4320
03:11:06,159 --> 03:11:07,760
We always appreciate public input.

4321
03:11:07,760 --> 03:11:08,760
Thank you.

4322
03:11:08,760 --> 03:11:09,760
So thank you for taking the time.

4323
03:11:09,760 --> 03:11:14,030
Were you listening a while ago when I was talking to Greg

4324
03:11:14,030 --> 03:11:16,440
Johnson about approving this

4325
03:11:16,440 --> 03:11:20,340
zoning change but with an overlay district that would allow

4326
03:11:20,340 --> 03:11:21,719
us to control to a certain

4327
03:11:21,719 --> 03:11:24,760
degree the things that go in there, things that would be

4328
03:11:24,760 --> 03:11:26,440
amenable to backing up to your

4329
03:11:26,440 --> 03:11:29,930
house like a doctor's office, something that runs 8 to 5,

4330
03:11:29,930 --> 03:11:31,799
maybe Monday through Friday.

4331
03:11:31,799 --> 03:11:32,799
Right.

4332
03:11:32,799 --> 03:11:35,110
And to be real honest with you, I did understand that I did

4333
03:11:35,110 --> 03:11:36,559
hear the overlay but I just didn't

4334
03:11:36,559 --> 03:11:37,559
understand what that meant.

4335
03:11:37,559 --> 03:11:38,559
Okay.

4336
03:11:38,559 --> 03:11:40,280
So you didn't understand that it would be with controls?

4337
03:11:40,280 --> 03:11:41,280
Right.

4338
03:11:41,280 --> 03:11:45,989
There are certain things that are permitted within the NRMU

4339
03:11:45,989 --> 03:11:46,319
.

4340
03:11:46,319 --> 03:11:48,959
Some of them may not be to your liking, like a hotel,

4341
03:11:48,959 --> 03:11:50,879
especially a big one, but a laundry

4342
03:11:50,879 --> 03:11:54,149
mat would, you know, if it worked within certain hours,

4343
03:11:54,149 --> 03:11:56,000
that wouldn't be disrupted.

4344
03:11:56,000 --> 03:11:57,680
That's kind of a quiet thing.

4345
03:11:57,680 --> 03:11:58,680
Okay.

4346
03:11:58,680 --> 03:12:01,329
And the other thing is what kind of a buffer other than the

4347
03:12:01,329 --> 03:12:02,799
trees would be there against

4348
03:12:02,799 --> 03:12:05,239
-- you know, that's another thing that we need to work on

4349
03:12:05,239 --> 03:12:06,479
as far as that goes because

4350
03:12:06,479 --> 03:12:08,600
there needs to be a buffer there.

4351
03:12:08,600 --> 03:12:10,040
I'll let staff answer that.

4352
03:12:10,040 --> 03:12:12,530
I think though that there will be -- there will probably be

4353
03:12:12,530 --> 03:12:13,479
some kind of wall.

4354
03:12:13,479 --> 03:12:15,600
I call on Julie to answer your question.

4355
03:12:15,600 --> 03:12:31,000
She can give you some specific information.

4356
03:12:31,000 --> 03:12:34,139
Single family development adjacent to commercial requires a

4357
03:12:34,139 --> 03:12:36,079
type C buffer, which is a 15 foot

4358
03:12:36,079 --> 03:12:37,079
buffer.

4359
03:12:37,079 --> 03:12:42,670
Planted with six evergreen and deciduous trees and 25 shr

4360
03:12:42,670 --> 03:12:45,799
ubs per 100 linear feet.

4361
03:12:45,799 --> 03:12:48,280
We don't require fencing in the city of Denver.

4362
03:12:48,280 --> 03:12:49,280
Okay.

4363
03:12:49,280 --> 03:12:53,159
So it would be landscaping, not a wall or anything.

4364
03:12:53,159 --> 03:12:54,159
Okay.

4365
03:12:54,159 --> 03:12:55,159
Thank you.

4366
03:12:55,159 --> 03:12:56,159
Thank you, Ms. Easterman.

4367
03:12:56,159 --> 03:12:59,440
I have one more card.

4368
03:12:59,440 --> 03:13:03,200
Chris Mulkey does not wish to speak.

4369
03:13:03,200 --> 03:13:09,040
He's on 6200 Pinien Trail and he is in opposition.

4370
03:13:09,040 --> 03:13:15,229
I don't know that I have -- I have some other -- I think

4371
03:13:15,229 --> 03:13:20,680
these are duplicates.

4372
03:13:20,680 --> 03:13:28,329
I have one other -- just a letter in response to the notice

4373
03:13:28,329 --> 03:13:32,280
sent out from Joyce George at

4374
03:13:32,280 --> 03:13:42,280
6509 Alder Brook Drive as opposed to the request.

4375
03:13:42,280 --> 03:13:56,159
It would be Jacob Piot, 3715 Palmetto Court as opposed.

4376
03:13:56,159 --> 03:14:04,709
A's, can't make out the handwriting on the last name, and

4377
03:14:04,709 --> 03:14:10,040
Roger at 6404 Pinien Trail

4378
03:14:10,040 --> 03:14:13,040
as opposed.

4379
03:14:13,040 --> 03:14:20,920
P, Baria, I think Maeve already sent in.

4380
03:14:20,920 --> 03:14:30,680
6212 Pinien Trail as opposed.

4381
03:14:30,680 --> 03:14:34,979
Those are all the comment cards or responses that we

4382
03:14:34,979 --> 03:14:36,000
receive.

4383
03:14:36,000 --> 03:14:37,000
This is a public hearing.

4384
03:14:37,000 --> 03:14:38,920
If there's someone else who'd like to speak, please come

4385
03:14:38,920 --> 03:14:39,920
forward and give us your name

4386
03:14:39,920 --> 03:14:43,920
and address and then we've got your card.

4387
03:14:43,920 --> 03:14:44,920
Awesome.

4388
03:14:44,920 --> 03:14:48,360
Steven Shannon, 319 West Oak here in Denton, Texas.

4389
03:14:48,360 --> 03:14:51,719
I'm also one of the owners of the property.

4390
03:14:51,719 --> 03:14:55,239
On those oppositions, I noticed you read the CMG ones as

4391
03:14:55,239 --> 03:14:55,840
well.

4392
03:14:55,840 --> 03:14:58,280
The only thing that's before you is the NRMU.

4393
03:14:58,280 --> 03:15:01,819
So I think it's -- while we want to be transparent, there's

4394
03:15:01,819 --> 03:15:04,799
only five neighbors that are in opposition.

4395
03:15:04,799 --> 03:15:08,989
Well, it doesn't say this was just -- It should say it at

4396
03:15:08,989 --> 03:15:10,040
the top.

4397
03:15:10,040 --> 03:15:15,040
It says REX -- REX, RNMU, and then CMG as well.

4398
03:15:15,040 --> 03:15:19,680
Let me double check that they're all that way, NRMU, NRMU,

4399
03:15:19,680 --> 03:15:20,440
NRMU.

4400
03:15:20,440 --> 03:15:21,440
So these are current.

4401
03:15:21,440 --> 03:15:22,440
Okay, good.

4402
03:15:22,440 --> 03:15:24,239
I received a package from the CMG.

4403
03:15:24,239 --> 03:15:27,340
They were brought to us right before a meeting, so that's

4404
03:15:27,340 --> 03:15:29,040
the last count that we have.

4405
03:15:29,040 --> 03:15:30,040
Great.

4406
03:15:30,040 --> 03:15:33,989
Much like Greg has already told you, we feel like the -- we

4407
03:15:33,989 --> 03:15:35,840
came in and asked based on

4408
03:15:35,840 --> 03:15:38,540
first staff recommendation for CMG zoning and after our

4409
03:15:38,540 --> 03:15:40,280
neighborhood meeting and meeting

4410
03:15:40,280 --> 03:15:46,260
with neighbors, reduced that density down to NRMU to help

4411
03:15:46,260 --> 03:15:50,120
alleviate some of their concerns.

4412
03:15:50,120 --> 03:15:52,149
One of the great things about our city is that we have

4413
03:15:52,149 --> 03:15:53,079
straight zoning.

4414
03:15:53,079 --> 03:15:56,850
And so that each thing that we have zoned, it's got a set

4415
03:15:56,850 --> 03:15:58,680
of rules that we've got to

4416
03:15:58,680 --> 03:15:59,680
follow.

4417
03:15:59,680 --> 03:16:01,840
And so there are setback requirements.

4418
03:16:01,840 --> 03:16:06,030
All the things that Julie just mentioned govern what we can

4419
03:16:06,030 --> 03:16:06,479
do.

4420
03:16:06,479 --> 03:16:09,909
I understand that there's concerns, as I've heard you talk

4421
03:16:09,909 --> 03:16:11,520
about, what are we going to

4422
03:16:11,520 --> 03:16:12,520
do from an engineering standpoint?

4423
03:16:12,520 --> 03:16:14,520
What are we going to do from a floodplain standpoint?

4424
03:16:14,520 --> 03:16:18,739
I mean, all of those things are contemplated as we go to

4425
03:16:18,739 --> 03:16:20,120
development.

4426
03:16:20,120 --> 03:16:23,090
And I've been through that process with the city, and it's

4427
03:16:23,090 --> 03:16:24,639
an exhaustive process, which

4428
03:16:24,639 --> 03:16:26,879
is great.

4429
03:16:26,879 --> 03:16:31,069
And so we feel comfortable with what the city's asked us to

4430
03:16:31,069 --> 03:16:32,559
do to build here.

4431
03:16:32,559 --> 03:16:35,610
And we know that will govern this property, regardless of

4432
03:16:35,610 --> 03:16:37,319
how it gets zoned, those rules

4433
03:16:37,319 --> 03:16:38,940
are still in place.

4434
03:16:38,940 --> 03:16:43,840
We feel that NRMU is appropriate for what's in the area.

4435
03:16:43,840 --> 03:16:47,799
You look at Teasley, you've got NRMU and even more dense CM

4436
03:16:47,799 --> 03:16:51,319
G backing up to residential neighborhoods.

4437
03:16:51,319 --> 03:16:55,200
So to kind of say this property wouldn't qualify is a

4438
03:16:55,200 --> 03:16:58,159
little bit beyond me when you're allowing

4439
03:16:58,159 --> 03:17:03,319
that use in numerous other places right next to us.

4440
03:17:03,319 --> 03:17:07,379
The buffer, somebody asked earlier, it's over 200 feet from

4441
03:17:07,379 --> 03:17:09,040
that back fence outside of the

4442
03:17:09,040 --> 03:17:11,879
floodplain going from east to west.

4443
03:17:11,879 --> 03:17:19,399
So that's a very wide swath of trees and green space.

4444
03:17:19,399 --> 03:17:21,989
We do want to be, we live here as well, we want to be

4445
03:17:21,989 --> 03:17:22,959
neighborly.

4446
03:17:22,959 --> 03:17:24,239
And so we understand the concerns.

4447
03:17:24,239 --> 03:17:27,209
We want to build things that last beyond us and that we can

4448
03:17:27,209 --> 03:17:28,959
be proud of in our community.

4449
03:17:28,959 --> 03:17:33,389
So we do want to be sensitive to the neighborhoods, but we

4450
03:17:33,389 --> 03:17:36,319
also want to utilize the property to

4451
03:17:36,319 --> 03:17:37,319
its best use.

4452
03:17:37,319 --> 03:17:38,319
So thank you.

4453
03:17:38,319 --> 03:17:39,319
>> Thank you.

4454
03:17:39,319 --> 03:17:40,719
Do you have a question for me?

4455
03:17:40,719 --> 03:17:41,719
Commissioner Beck?

4456
03:17:41,719 --> 03:17:42,719
>> Thank you, Chair.

4457
03:17:42,719 --> 03:17:46,200
Thank you, Mr. Shannon, for your presentation.

4458
03:17:46,200 --> 03:17:48,260
And it's become clear from what you said and what Greg

4459
03:17:48,260 --> 03:17:49,559
Johnson has said that really there's

4460
03:17:49,559 --> 03:17:52,000
not a lot you can build on this thing.

4461
03:17:52,000 --> 03:17:54,729
And it seems the bulk of the concern for the citizens, and

4462
03:17:54,729 --> 03:17:56,280
I know there's only five, but

4463
03:17:56,280 --> 03:17:58,340
they are the five that back up to this property and

4464
03:17:58,340 --> 03:18:00,239
naturally they would be more concerned,

4465
03:18:00,239 --> 03:18:02,719
but is what is going to be built there.

4466
03:18:02,719 --> 03:18:06,280
So again, I would submit to you, would you have a problem

4467
03:18:06,280 --> 03:18:08,600
if we approved this with conditions

4468
03:18:08,600 --> 03:18:11,760
and the condition being an overlay that would control to

4469
03:18:11,760 --> 03:18:13,600
some degree what you're going to

4470
03:18:13,600 --> 03:18:14,600
build there.

4471
03:18:14,600 --> 03:18:17,600
I don't think you're going to build a hotel there.

4472
03:18:17,600 --> 03:18:18,639
There's no room for it.

4473
03:18:18,639 --> 03:18:21,799
And there's maybe one or two other items on here that might

4474
03:18:21,799 --> 03:18:23,280
be a concern to neighbors

4475
03:18:23,280 --> 03:18:25,040
on there that you probably wouldn't build.

4476
03:18:25,040 --> 03:18:29,250
But an office complex for a doctor or a small laundromat's

4477
03:18:29,250 --> 03:18:31,520
allowed, I don't know if that

4478
03:18:31,520 --> 03:18:32,520
would be built.

4479
03:18:32,520 --> 03:18:34,659
But something quiet and not too intense, would you be

4480
03:18:34,659 --> 03:18:35,559
opposed to that?

4481
03:18:35,559 --> 03:18:38,639
>> As long as I don't have to arm Russell and Greg, I'm

4482
03:18:38,639 --> 03:18:39,200
good.

4483
03:18:39,200 --> 03:18:42,520
No, we get it.

4484
03:18:42,520 --> 03:18:44,920
As long as you tell us what you're asking for us from the

4485
03:18:44,920 --> 03:18:46,200
overlay and we understand

4486
03:18:46,200 --> 03:18:47,200
what you're asking.

4487
03:18:47,200 --> 03:18:49,120
>> Right, and we would want you to be able to build

4488
03:18:49,120 --> 03:18:50,639
something to be successful too.

4489
03:18:50,639 --> 03:18:54,799
At the same time, we have to weigh this between you and me.

4490
03:18:54,799 --> 03:18:56,680
>> I don't think anything that I think we're pretty

4491
03:18:56,680 --> 03:18:57,559
reasonable folks.

4492
03:18:57,559 --> 03:19:00,229
As long as you're being reasonable, then I don't think we

4493
03:19:00,229 --> 03:19:01,440
have a problem at all.

4494
03:19:01,440 --> 03:19:03,239
>> Reasonable is the way we want to go.

4495
03:19:03,239 --> 03:19:04,239
All right.

4496
03:19:04,239 --> 03:19:05,239
Thank you, sir.

4497
03:19:05,239 --> 03:19:06,709
>> Commissioner Back, do you have some things that you'd

4498
03:19:06,709 --> 03:19:07,799
like to propose to give the applicant

4499
03:19:07,799 --> 03:19:13,040
a chance to consider those while we work through this list?

4500
03:19:13,040 --> 03:19:18,959
>> Again, the only thing that I can see that would be

4501
03:19:18,959 --> 03:19:22,520
permitted under NMRU that anybody

4502
03:19:22,520 --> 03:19:25,639
would be opposed to is the hotel.

4503
03:19:25,639 --> 03:19:33,239
They won't even allow motels.

4504
03:19:33,239 --> 03:19:37,559
And the semi-public halls, clubs and lodges, adult and

4505
03:19:37,559 --> 03:19:40,079
child care and daycare, kindergarten,

4506
03:19:40,079 --> 03:19:41,079
they're all allowed.

4507
03:19:41,079 --> 03:19:43,430
I don't know that citizens would be opposed to those kind

4508
03:19:43,430 --> 03:19:44,000
of things.

4509
03:19:44,000 --> 03:19:47,280
I don't know that you've got the room to build it though.

4510
03:19:47,280 --> 03:19:50,879
>> I don't think that use would comply with it.

4511
03:19:50,879 --> 03:19:53,659
>> Bars and restaurants are allowed, so that overlay would

4512
03:19:53,659 --> 03:19:55,079
prevent those kind of things

4513
03:19:55,079 --> 03:19:56,079
from being put in.

4514
03:19:56,079 --> 03:19:57,079
>> So you'd prevent a restaurant from going there?

4515
03:19:57,079 --> 03:19:59,319
>> Well, are you going to have the room?

4516
03:19:59,319 --> 03:20:00,319
What do you got there?

4517
03:20:00,319 --> 03:20:02,680
>> Well, I think that's pretty -- I mean, part of it I'll

4518
03:20:02,680 --> 03:20:03,799
look at and I'll say we do

4519
03:20:03,799 --> 03:20:07,040
have straight zoning for a reason.

4520
03:20:07,040 --> 03:20:09,350
I want to be reasonable about it, but if you just go

4521
03:20:09,350 --> 03:20:11,000
through and take everything out of

4522
03:20:11,000 --> 03:20:12,000
it, then we just chuck --

4523
03:20:12,000 --> 03:20:13,000
>> I don't want to do that either.

4524
03:20:13,000 --> 03:20:14,840
I don't want to convey that sense to you.

4525
03:20:14,840 --> 03:20:17,000
I think we can look at that.

4526
03:20:17,000 --> 03:20:19,959
>> I think what you did ask originally and you've been

4527
03:20:19,959 --> 03:20:21,799
saying consistently is hotels

4528
03:20:21,799 --> 03:20:22,799
and the lodges.

4529
03:20:22,799 --> 03:20:23,799
>> Yeah, bars and --

4530
03:20:23,799 --> 03:20:24,799
>> Bars and lodges.

4531
03:20:24,799 --> 03:20:25,799
>> Yeah.

4532
03:20:25,799 --> 03:20:27,799
>> We're good with an overlay restricting those uses.

4533
03:20:27,799 --> 03:20:28,799
>> Okay.

4534
03:20:28,799 --> 03:20:29,799
>> Is that reasonable?

4535
03:20:29,799 --> 03:20:32,780
>> That sounds good to me unless any of the citizens that

4536
03:20:32,780 --> 03:20:34,360
are here that oppose this see

4537
03:20:34,360 --> 03:20:35,360
anything else.

4538
03:20:35,360 --> 03:20:37,670
If they have a problem with that, I'd appreciate they'd

4539
03:20:37,670 --> 03:20:39,040
come back and speak or I could ask

4540
03:20:39,040 --> 03:20:40,040
them to come back up.

4541
03:20:40,040 --> 03:20:41,040
>> Okay.

4542
03:20:41,040 --> 03:20:42,040
Pardon me?

4543
03:20:42,040 --> 03:20:47,479
Yeah, I don't -- yeah, quick vehicle service, which is --

4544
03:20:47,479 --> 03:20:49,760
>> It's restricted by an SEP anyway.

4545
03:20:49,760 --> 03:20:50,760
>> Right, right.

4546
03:20:50,760 --> 03:20:51,760
Okay.

4547
03:20:51,760 --> 03:20:52,760
Okay.

4548
03:20:52,760 --> 03:20:53,760
That's all I have then.

4549
03:20:53,760 --> 03:20:54,760
Thank you, sir.

4550
03:20:54,760 --> 03:20:55,760
>> Okay.

4551
03:20:55,760 --> 03:20:56,760
>> Yep.

4552
03:20:56,760 --> 03:20:57,760
>> Did I get that?

4553
03:20:57,760 --> 03:20:58,760
>> Yep.

4554
03:20:58,760 --> 03:21:02,190
I just want to get them updated to get some -- what you

4555
03:21:02,190 --> 03:21:03,559
actually were considering, some

4556
03:21:03,559 --> 03:21:05,600
facts.

4557
03:21:05,600 --> 03:21:07,719
Commissioner Sanchez.

4558
03:21:07,719 --> 03:21:11,479
I just wanted to mention that I think what you've talked

4559
03:21:11,479 --> 03:21:13,440
about and I think what you've

4560
03:21:13,440 --> 03:21:16,959
been very reasonable on this piece of property and what you

4561
03:21:16,959 --> 03:21:18,360
want to build and what you've

4562
03:21:18,360 --> 03:21:19,360
said.

4563
03:21:19,360 --> 03:21:23,950
And as I was looking at some of these -- what do you call

4564
03:21:23,950 --> 03:21:25,200
it?

4565
03:21:25,200 --> 03:21:26,200
Opposition.

4566
03:21:26,200 --> 03:21:29,280
And I think sometimes we look at them and say you have five

4567
03:21:29,280 --> 03:21:31,040
oppositions or ten oppositions,

4568
03:21:31,040 --> 03:21:34,110
but then you read them and it says we don't want -- you're

4569
03:21:34,110 --> 03:21:35,399
taking our trees.

4570
03:21:35,399 --> 03:21:38,549
We need to be reasonable on when we talk about what kind of

4571
03:21:38,549 --> 03:21:40,600
opposition you're getting on

4572
03:21:40,600 --> 03:21:42,920
these notices.

4573
03:21:42,920 --> 03:21:46,840
Because I think you've done a diligent work that you've met

4574
03:21:46,840 --> 03:21:48,159
with the people.

4575
03:21:48,159 --> 03:21:54,079
You've changed the zoning to be more reasonable.

4576
03:21:54,079 --> 03:21:57,159
And so I think we also have to be reasonable.

4577
03:21:57,159 --> 03:22:00,590
And when we look at this, you know, so you're going to cut

4578
03:22:00,590 --> 03:22:01,520
some trees.

4579
03:22:01,520 --> 03:22:04,879
You know, we may not like it, but you know, you have a

4580
03:22:04,879 --> 03:22:06,879
business and just cutting trees

4581
03:22:06,879 --> 03:22:09,639
is not really affecting anybody.

4582
03:22:09,639 --> 03:22:14,659
I guess I just don't want to impose so many restrictions on

4583
03:22:14,659 --> 03:22:17,120
you that pretty soon people

4584
03:22:17,120 --> 03:22:19,200
want to stop building.

4585
03:22:19,200 --> 03:22:21,719
We have to be reasonable.

4586
03:22:21,719 --> 03:22:24,909
And as people -- we have to understand that people are

4587
03:22:24,909 --> 03:22:27,680
trying to make a living or building,

4588
03:22:27,680 --> 03:22:31,280
making -- you know, making -- trying to develop their

4589
03:22:31,280 --> 03:22:32,399
properties.

4590
03:22:32,399 --> 03:22:36,590
And based on what the city restrictions, there's a lot of

4591
03:22:36,590 --> 03:22:38,000
restrictions.

4592
03:22:38,000 --> 03:22:42,350
It's not just, you know, if you're used to looking at

4593
03:22:42,350 --> 03:22:45,159
people in a vacant lot and that's

4594
03:22:45,159 --> 03:22:46,680
what you want to continue doing.

4595
03:22:46,680 --> 03:22:50,870
It's hard -- we can't continue putting restrictions on you

4596
03:22:50,870 --> 03:22:53,479
just because somebody wants to keep

4597
03:22:53,479 --> 03:22:54,479
looking at trees.

4598
03:22:54,479 --> 03:22:56,790
And I don't know if I'm coming from the right place, but

4599
03:22:56,790 --> 03:22:59,040
that's the way I look at it.

4600
03:22:59,040 --> 03:23:00,440
Okay.

4601
03:23:00,440 --> 03:23:01,440
This is a public hearing.

4602
03:23:01,440 --> 03:23:04,280
Is there anyone else who would like to speak on this item?

4603
03:23:04,280 --> 03:23:06,729
Please come forward and give us your name, address at this

4604
03:23:06,729 --> 03:23:07,159
time.

4605
03:23:07,159 --> 03:23:09,760
My name is Chris Mulkey.

4606
03:23:09,760 --> 03:23:11,559
I live at 6200 Panina.

4607
03:23:11,559 --> 03:23:16,350
It's the northmost property touching the top right corner

4608
03:23:16,350 --> 03:23:18,520
of the triangle there.

4609
03:23:18,520 --> 03:23:21,000
My primary concern is not the use.

4610
03:23:21,000 --> 03:23:24,090
I don't really have a problem with what could be built

4611
03:23:24,090 --> 03:23:25,719
there with this zoning.

4612
03:23:25,719 --> 03:23:31,840
My primary concern is how it will affect the floodplain.

4613
03:23:31,840 --> 03:23:34,430
I know he's not going -- they are not going to build in the

4614
03:23:34,430 --> 03:23:35,239
floodplain.

4615
03:23:35,239 --> 03:23:40,889
However, if they do pave a large portion of that parking or

4616
03:23:40,889 --> 03:23:43,479
for just a structure, the

4617
03:23:43,479 --> 03:23:47,950
more that's covered, there's less saturation there and more

4618
03:23:47,950 --> 03:23:50,120
runoff and that could affect

4619
03:23:50,120 --> 03:23:52,879
myself and everyone else that backs up this property.

4620
03:23:52,879 --> 03:23:55,479
That is my primary concern.

4621
03:23:55,479 --> 03:23:58,719
Thank you for sharing your concern with us.

4622
03:23:58,719 --> 03:23:59,719
This is a public hearing.

4623
03:23:59,719 --> 03:24:01,840
Is there anyone else who would like to speak on this item?

4624
03:24:01,840 --> 03:24:15,760
Please come forward at this time.

4625
03:24:15,760 --> 03:24:17,079
Please give us your name and address.

4626
03:24:17,079 --> 03:24:21,120
Hi, my name is Linda Torres and I live at 6512 Pine Hills.

4627
03:24:21,120 --> 03:24:22,120
Thank you.

4628
03:24:22,120 --> 03:24:24,799
I am concerned about the trees.

4629
03:24:24,799 --> 03:24:32,840
We've lived there over 10 years and it's a green belt.

4630
03:24:32,840 --> 03:24:37,430
And not only the pool, but there's also a children's

4631
03:24:37,430 --> 03:24:40,440
playground right beside the pool.

4632
03:24:40,440 --> 03:24:44,959
And I just -- all my neighbors were against it.

4633
03:24:44,959 --> 03:24:51,829
I know that on the map it looks like that water area is a

4634
03:24:51,829 --> 03:24:55,520
lake, but really it's kind

4635
03:24:55,520 --> 03:24:58,239
of small and narrow.

4636
03:24:58,239 --> 03:25:00,590
And that water gets really high because I live right next

4637
03:25:00,590 --> 03:25:01,600
to the bridge and it gets

4638
03:25:01,600 --> 03:25:02,600
very high.

4639
03:25:02,600 --> 03:25:05,750
And like the last gentleman said, something else is put in

4640
03:25:05,750 --> 03:25:07,280
there and it could just make

4641
03:25:07,280 --> 03:25:11,040
it worse.

4642
03:25:11,040 --> 03:25:13,239
I don't know what else to say.

4643
03:25:13,239 --> 03:25:15,600
We don't really want any more concrete.

4644
03:25:15,600 --> 03:25:18,190
And there are so many doctor's offices in Unicorn Lake

4645
03:25:18,190 --> 03:25:19,559
right now that's going up.

4646
03:25:19,559 --> 03:25:21,600
I don't think we need any more.

4647
03:25:21,600 --> 03:25:25,600
But anyway, I've never done this before, but I'm kind of

4648
03:25:25,600 --> 03:25:27,719
doing it for my neighbors.

4649
03:25:27,719 --> 03:25:29,059
Thank you.

4650
03:25:29,059 --> 03:25:33,719
Thank you for coming tonight and sharing your comments.

4651
03:25:33,719 --> 03:25:34,920
This is a public hearing.

4652
03:25:34,920 --> 03:25:35,920
It's still open.

4653
03:25:35,920 --> 03:25:41,899
Anyone else who would like to come before us and speak,

4654
03:25:41,899 --> 03:25:43,639
please do so.

4655
03:25:43,639 --> 03:25:47,940
Seeing none, I'll close the public hearing and open the

4656
03:25:47,940 --> 03:25:50,799
floor for discussion or a motion.

4657
03:25:50,799 --> 03:25:51,799
Commissioner Beck.

4658
03:25:51,799 --> 03:25:56,139
I move that we approve subject to conditions with an

4659
03:25:56,139 --> 03:25:59,360
overlay that will allow us to control

4660
03:25:59,360 --> 03:26:01,799
what is built there within reason.

4661
03:26:01,799 --> 03:26:04,520
Define the overlay.

4662
03:26:04,520 --> 03:26:07,200
Okay, help me here.

4663
03:26:07,200 --> 03:26:08,200
Define the overlay.

4664
03:26:08,200 --> 03:26:11,850
Well, I think you listed to help, there were three things

4665
03:26:11,850 --> 03:26:13,719
that you asked the applicant

4666
03:26:13,719 --> 03:26:17,520
to restrict the property from.

4667
03:26:17,520 --> 03:26:18,520
Right.

4668
03:26:18,520 --> 03:26:24,360
Bars, semi-public halls, clubs, lodges, and hotels.

4669
03:26:24,360 --> 03:26:25,360
Okay.

4670
03:26:25,360 --> 03:26:26,360
Okay.

4671
03:26:26,360 --> 03:26:29,090
Everything else that I see on here, I don't see as

4672
03:26:29,090 --> 03:26:30,040
disruptive.

4673
03:26:30,040 --> 03:26:34,440
I live in an area where I'm right next to an NRMU itself

4674
03:26:34,440 --> 03:26:36,719
and we've got a grocery store

4675
03:26:36,719 --> 03:26:38,600
and a laundry.

4676
03:26:38,600 --> 03:26:43,370
So I don't think with those kind of commercial enterprises,

4677
03:26:43,370 --> 03:26:45,799
it will be that disruptive.

4678
03:26:45,799 --> 03:26:47,909
I think as staff has pointed out, because we've got this

4679
03:26:47,909 --> 03:26:49,319
major thoroughfare going through

4680
03:26:49,319 --> 03:26:53,120
there, you're not going to get anything else built there.

4681
03:26:53,120 --> 03:26:55,610
It's just not the suitable for more single family

4682
03:26:55,610 --> 03:26:56,520
residential.

4683
03:26:56,520 --> 03:27:00,440
I think legal clarification, just to make sure we get it

4684
03:27:00,440 --> 03:27:02,120
clear on the record.

4685
03:27:02,120 --> 03:27:03,120
Okay.

4686
03:27:03,120 --> 03:27:04,120
Yeah.

4687
03:27:04,120 --> 03:27:06,079
And of course, you meant no conditions.

4688
03:27:06,079 --> 03:27:07,200
We're not doing conditional zoning.

4689
03:27:07,200 --> 03:27:08,959
We are putting a mixed use overlay.

4690
03:27:08,959 --> 03:27:09,959
Yes.

4691
03:27:09,959 --> 03:27:13,120
We're switching it to NRMU with a mixed use overlay.

4692
03:27:13,120 --> 03:27:15,709
And in the overlay, you're removing certain uses from the

4693
03:27:15,709 --> 03:27:17,000
zoning classification.

4694
03:27:17,000 --> 03:27:18,000
Right.

4695
03:27:18,000 --> 03:27:20,000
And those uses are?

4696
03:27:20,000 --> 03:27:21,000
Hotels.

4697
03:27:21,000 --> 03:27:28,360
Semi-public halls, clubs, lodges, and bars.

4698
03:27:28,360 --> 03:27:29,360
Okay.

4699
03:27:29,360 --> 03:27:32,329
You want to remove hotels, but do you want to remove bed

4700
03:27:32,329 --> 03:27:33,440
and breakfasts?

4701
03:27:33,440 --> 03:27:34,440
Nope.

4702
03:27:34,440 --> 03:27:35,440
Okay.

4703
03:27:35,440 --> 03:27:37,239
And what about quick vehicle servicing?

4704
03:27:37,239 --> 03:27:39,079
You had mentioned that.

4705
03:27:39,079 --> 03:27:41,079
You had mentioned quick vehicle servicing.

4706
03:27:41,079 --> 03:27:42,079
Yes.

4707
03:27:42,079 --> 03:27:44,600
I would include that.

4708
03:27:44,600 --> 03:27:45,600
Okay.

4709
03:27:45,600 --> 03:27:46,600
So hotel.

4710
03:27:46,600 --> 03:27:54,760
Well, this would prohibit you from even going forward on an

4711
03:27:54,760 --> 03:27:55,799
SUP.

4712
03:27:55,799 --> 03:27:56,799
Quick service, you're right.

4713
03:27:56,799 --> 03:27:57,799
It is an SUP.

4714
03:27:57,799 --> 03:27:59,799
So yeah, disregard that then.

4715
03:27:59,799 --> 03:28:00,799
Okay.

4716
03:28:00,799 --> 03:28:05,559
We just remove it from the ability for you to get an SUP.

4717
03:28:05,559 --> 03:28:07,559
Yeah.

4718
03:28:07,559 --> 03:28:11,200
Now, subtract the quick service.

4719
03:28:11,200 --> 03:28:13,639
There's an SUP, and we can deal with that as it comes up.

4720
03:28:13,639 --> 03:28:19,360
So hotels, semi-public halls, clubs, and lodges, and bars.

4721
03:28:19,360 --> 03:28:20,360
And bars.

4722
03:28:20,360 --> 03:28:21,360
Is that good?

4723
03:28:21,360 --> 03:28:22,360
That's it.

4724
03:28:22,360 --> 03:28:23,360
Okay.

4725
03:28:23,360 --> 03:28:24,360
Okay.

4726
03:28:24,360 --> 03:28:29,200
We'll restate it and make sure that you guys have an

4727
03:28:29,200 --> 03:28:32,159
opportunity to respond to that.

4728
03:28:32,159 --> 03:28:36,239
So just so the Chair understands, were there three items?

4729
03:28:36,239 --> 03:28:37,239
Yes.

4730
03:28:37,239 --> 03:28:38,239
Hotels?

4731
03:28:38,239 --> 03:28:39,760
Well, there's -- Bars?

4732
03:28:39,760 --> 03:28:45,129
One is a combination of three, semi-public halls, clubs,

4733
03:28:45,129 --> 03:28:46,559
lodges.

4734
03:28:46,559 --> 03:28:54,680
So you could say there's five, I guess, all told.

4735
03:28:54,680 --> 03:28:59,680
Give staff to submit to make sure we get this correct.

4736
03:28:59,680 --> 03:29:02,479
Okay.

4737
03:29:02,479 --> 03:29:05,200
From our list, under the commercial land use, we've got

4738
03:29:05,200 --> 03:29:05,760
hotels.

4739
03:29:05,760 --> 03:29:10,719
That's permitted, that would be in the overlay as a no.

4740
03:29:10,719 --> 03:29:12,719
I'm sorry, say it again, Richard.

4741
03:29:12,719 --> 03:29:13,719
Hotels?

4742
03:29:13,719 --> 03:29:14,719
Right.

4743
03:29:14,719 --> 03:29:16,809
Going through the -- under the commercial land use category

4744
03:29:16,809 --> 03:29:17,000
.

4745
03:29:17,000 --> 03:29:18,000
Right.

4746
03:29:18,000 --> 03:29:20,920
Hotels would go from P to N?

4747
03:29:20,920 --> 03:29:21,920
Right.

4748
03:29:21,920 --> 03:29:24,920
Rest -- I'm sorry.

4749
03:29:24,920 --> 03:29:26,920
Bar would go from L11 --

4750
03:29:26,920 --> 03:29:27,920
To N.

4751
03:29:27,920 --> 03:29:28,920
To N.

4752
03:29:28,920 --> 03:29:29,920
Right.

4753
03:29:29,920 --> 03:29:32,440
It's an L11, is that an SUP?

4754
03:29:32,440 --> 03:29:37,200
And what L11 does is it's a restriction of 100 seats and 4,

4755
03:29:37,200 --> 03:29:38,360
000 square feet of restaurant

4756
03:29:38,360 --> 03:29:39,360
area.

4757
03:29:39,360 --> 03:29:40,360
So there's already a limitation.

4758
03:29:40,360 --> 03:29:41,959
Well, yeah, not restaurant, just bar.

4759
03:29:41,959 --> 03:29:42,959
Just bar.

4760
03:29:42,959 --> 03:29:43,959
Right.

4761
03:29:43,959 --> 03:29:45,440
And then the other was --

4762
03:29:45,440 --> 03:29:48,920
Under institutional land uses on the next page.

4763
03:29:48,920 --> 03:29:49,920
Institutional --

4764
03:29:49,920 --> 03:29:50,920
You forgot the private club.

4765
03:29:50,920 --> 03:29:53,920
About five down, semi-public halls.

4766
03:29:53,920 --> 03:29:56,920
Okay, private club.

4767
03:29:56,920 --> 03:29:58,479
Clubs and lodges.

4768
03:29:58,479 --> 03:30:02,760
And then under institutional -- okay.

4769
03:30:02,760 --> 03:30:03,760
Okay.

4770
03:30:03,760 --> 03:30:04,760
That's it.

4771
03:30:04,760 --> 03:30:05,760
So there's four.

4772
03:30:05,760 --> 03:30:06,760
Okay.

4773
03:30:06,760 --> 03:30:07,760
Just a minute.

4774
03:30:07,760 --> 03:30:10,760
So we have five items in?

4775
03:30:10,760 --> 03:30:11,760
Yes.

4776
03:30:11,760 --> 03:30:12,760
Four.

4777
03:30:12,760 --> 03:30:13,760
Four.

4778
03:30:13,760 --> 03:30:14,760
Four?

4779
03:30:14,760 --> 03:30:15,760
Okay.

4780
03:30:15,760 --> 03:30:16,760
Four items.

4781
03:30:16,760 --> 03:30:17,760
No.

4782
03:30:17,760 --> 03:30:24,479
Wait, we've got the three and then the bar and the hotel,

4783
03:30:24,479 --> 03:30:26,319
that's five.

4784
03:30:26,319 --> 03:30:27,319
Bar, hotel, semi --

4785
03:30:27,319 --> 03:30:28,680
We've got semi-public --

4786
03:30:28,680 --> 03:30:30,239
Private clubs and private clubs.

4787
03:30:30,239 --> 03:30:31,239
We count that as one.

4788
03:30:31,239 --> 03:30:32,239
Okay.

4789
03:30:32,239 --> 03:30:33,239
Then we have three.

4790
03:30:33,239 --> 03:30:34,239
It's different, yeah.

4791
03:30:34,239 --> 03:30:37,239
We've got that, hotels and bars.

4792
03:30:37,239 --> 03:30:39,959
And private club.

4793
03:30:39,959 --> 03:30:40,959
They're separate.

4794
03:30:40,959 --> 03:30:43,959
There's a club and there's a private club.

4795
03:30:43,959 --> 03:30:46,959
One's under commercial.

4796
03:30:46,959 --> 03:30:47,959
I didn't mention that.

4797
03:30:47,959 --> 03:30:48,959
Private club.

4798
03:30:48,959 --> 03:30:55,959
Do you have a definition for what you meant?

4799
03:30:55,959 --> 03:30:56,959
Pardon me?

4800
03:30:56,959 --> 03:31:03,959
It's in our DIT and development code.

4801
03:31:03,959 --> 03:31:04,959
Right.

4802
03:31:04,959 --> 03:31:11,719
We've got permitted access here.

4803
03:31:11,719 --> 03:31:18,329
These are things under NMRU that are permitted that we want

4804
03:31:18,329 --> 03:31:20,319
to not permit.

4805
03:31:20,319 --> 03:31:29,319
Okay.

4806
03:31:29,319 --> 03:31:31,319
I don't have any other items I want to add.

4807
03:31:31,319 --> 03:31:32,319
Are the ones okay?

4808
03:31:32,319 --> 03:31:35,319
Are you saying there's some --

4809
03:31:35,319 --> 03:31:36,319
Okay.

4810
03:31:36,319 --> 03:31:41,469
Call on the applicant just to respond to the conditions and

4811
03:31:41,469 --> 03:31:43,600
make sure they have -- if they

4812
03:31:43,600 --> 03:31:45,909
have any concerns about those, we'll try to get this

4813
03:31:45,909 --> 03:31:46,440
resolved.

4814
03:31:46,440 --> 03:31:47,440
Sure.

4815
03:31:47,440 --> 03:31:52,059
It feels kind of like we're creating a new zoning district

4816
03:31:52,059 --> 03:31:53,680
here at the dais.

4817
03:31:53,680 --> 03:31:56,079
I would like to have clarification.

4818
03:31:56,079 --> 03:32:01,500
For example, my understanding from talking to Julie on semi

4819
03:32:01,500 --> 03:32:04,639
-public halls and gatherings

4820
03:32:04,639 --> 03:32:05,639
are nonprofit.

4821
03:32:05,639 --> 03:32:09,829
It would be specific to nonprofit, meaning it couldn't be a

4822
03:32:09,829 --> 03:32:12,959
for-profit gathering place.

4823
03:32:12,959 --> 03:32:16,930
Also in the head, I think about we're pretty charitable

4824
03:32:16,930 --> 03:32:19,479
people, the Children's Advocacy

4825
03:32:19,479 --> 03:32:23,040
Center, they do counseling for families.

4826
03:32:23,040 --> 03:32:24,040
That's nonprofit.

4827
03:32:24,040 --> 03:32:27,469
All I'm trying to say here is we have straight zoning for a

4828
03:32:27,469 --> 03:32:29,319
reason, and I can appreciate

4829
03:32:29,319 --> 03:32:33,399
trying to eliminate everything that might upset somebody.

4830
03:32:33,399 --> 03:32:37,350
My fear is that here, trying not to get delayed any further

4831
03:32:37,350 --> 03:32:39,559
in this process, that we agree

4832
03:32:39,559 --> 03:32:42,200
to something that I'm a little bit confused still about

4833
03:32:42,200 --> 03:32:43,799
what's being asked, trying to

4834
03:32:43,799 --> 03:32:48,780
get it done and then have an unintended consequence like we

4835
03:32:48,780 --> 03:32:52,120
can't build a facility for counseling

4836
03:32:52,120 --> 03:32:55,989
for families or children or gathering space or the Knights

4837
03:32:55,989 --> 03:32:57,760
of Columbus or -- there's a

4838
03:32:57,760 --> 03:33:00,940
million good organizations that sometimes need a building

4839
03:33:00,940 --> 03:33:01,959
or a place to go.

4840
03:33:01,959 --> 03:33:06,420
I'm a little nervous about these -- I heard hotels and bars

4841
03:33:06,420 --> 03:33:06,760
.

4842
03:33:06,760 --> 03:33:08,680
Well, I'm fine.

4843
03:33:08,680 --> 03:33:09,680
No one will go there.

4844
03:33:09,680 --> 03:33:10,680
We're not into bars.

4845
03:33:10,680 --> 03:33:11,680
We wouldn't put one there.

4846
03:33:11,680 --> 03:33:13,360
It wouldn't go there anyway.

4847
03:33:13,360 --> 03:33:14,639
But now we're adding things.

4848
03:33:14,639 --> 03:33:16,739
And so it just seemed like we kept adding to the list, and

4849
03:33:16,739 --> 03:33:17,760
I don't want an unintended

4850
03:33:17,760 --> 03:33:18,760
consequence.

4851
03:33:18,760 --> 03:33:22,309
We want to be neighborly and we want to be helpful and amen

4852
03:33:22,309 --> 03:33:24,280
able, but it feels like we're

4853
03:33:24,280 --> 03:33:26,590
kind of designing on the fly and that -- I just don't want

4854
03:33:26,590 --> 03:33:27,959
an unintended consequence.

4855
03:33:27,959 --> 03:33:28,959
So --

4856
03:33:28,959 --> 03:33:30,489
Greg, I think you've got a commissioner that will be

4857
03:33:30,489 --> 03:33:31,280
reasonable with you.

4858
03:33:31,280 --> 03:33:33,870
If it comes back in, we're looking at that, and it looks

4859
03:33:33,870 --> 03:33:35,319
like it's going to be a routing

4860
03:33:35,319 --> 03:33:36,319
organization.

4861
03:33:36,319 --> 03:33:39,780
I'd probably say no, but if you're talking about VA,

4862
03:33:39,780 --> 03:33:42,239
veteran four or something like that

4863
03:33:42,239 --> 03:33:44,709
on a low-key level, I don't think there's going to be any

4864
03:33:44,709 --> 03:33:45,760
objection on that.

4865
03:33:45,760 --> 03:33:48,450
Larry, what I think you're asking as far as to eliminate

4866
03:33:48,450 --> 03:33:50,040
that as a possible use, which

4867
03:33:50,040 --> 03:33:51,520
means they couldn't come back.

4868
03:33:51,520 --> 03:33:52,520
That's true.

4869
03:33:52,520 --> 03:33:53,520
Right?

4870
03:33:53,520 --> 03:33:54,600
And so there's a lot of limitations in here.

4871
03:33:54,600 --> 03:33:57,649
If you look at the zoning ordinance, a lot of the things

4872
03:33:57,649 --> 03:33:59,879
you mentioned, there's limitations

4873
03:33:59,879 --> 03:34:01,280
that they have to point to.

4874
03:34:01,280 --> 03:34:02,280
Let me suggest --

4875
03:34:02,280 --> 03:34:03,719
And some of the things have SUPs.

4876
03:34:03,719 --> 03:34:05,690
So they'd have to -- before something got built in, they'd

4877
03:34:05,690 --> 03:34:06,440
have to come back.

4878
03:34:06,440 --> 03:34:07,440
Well, let me suggest it then, right.

4879
03:34:07,440 --> 03:34:10,399
I don't want to eliminate it completely, so what if we made

4880
03:34:10,399 --> 03:34:13,520
that particular one with an

4881
03:34:13,520 --> 03:34:14,520
SUP?

4882
03:34:14,520 --> 03:34:17,709
Let's just keep it simple, and let's try to -- if you don't

4883
03:34:17,709 --> 03:34:19,639
mind, have a friendly amendment.

4884
03:34:19,639 --> 03:34:21,319
Let's take the hotels and the bars.

4885
03:34:21,319 --> 03:34:22,319
Okay.

4886
03:34:22,319 --> 03:34:24,670
And was there -- I think there was one other one that was a

4887
03:34:24,670 --> 03:34:26,559
major concern for you, and

4888
03:34:26,559 --> 03:34:27,559
there were three.

4889
03:34:27,559 --> 03:34:30,159
Hotel, bar, is there anything else?

4890
03:34:30,159 --> 03:34:34,000
No, it was the semi-public halls, clubs, and lodges.

4891
03:34:34,000 --> 03:34:35,000
That was --

4892
03:34:35,000 --> 03:34:37,000
It's a semi-public, the one that's a charitable?

4893
03:34:37,000 --> 03:34:38,000
Yeah.

4894
03:34:38,000 --> 03:34:39,000
Okay.

4895
03:34:39,000 --> 03:34:40,000
Yeah.

4896
03:34:40,000 --> 03:34:41,000
And I agree with Greg.

4897
03:34:41,000 --> 03:34:44,190
There's probably -- we shouldn't shut that out completely,

4898
03:34:44,190 --> 03:34:45,239
so I would suggest --

4899
03:34:45,239 --> 03:34:46,239
Just do the two then?

4900
03:34:46,239 --> 03:34:47,239
Hotel and bar?

4901
03:34:47,239 --> 03:34:48,239
We can't make an SUP with the --

4902
03:34:48,239 --> 03:34:49,239
Come on, Larry.

4903
03:34:49,239 --> 03:34:50,239
Come on.

4904
03:34:50,239 --> 03:34:51,239
Why?

4905
03:34:51,239 --> 03:34:52,239
We can't.

4906
03:34:52,239 --> 03:34:53,239
Why?

4907
03:34:53,239 --> 03:34:57,059
I'm sorry, for the record, are you amenable to that

4908
03:34:57,059 --> 03:34:58,920
friendly amendment?

4909
03:34:58,920 --> 03:35:00,520
Just doing the hotels and the bars?

4910
03:35:00,520 --> 03:35:01,520
Yes, I am.

4911
03:35:01,520 --> 03:35:02,520
Okay.

4912
03:35:02,520 --> 03:35:03,520
Okay.

4913
03:35:03,520 --> 03:35:04,520
Do we have a motion?

4914
03:35:04,520 --> 03:35:08,340
We have a motion on the floor to approve with the overlay

4915
03:35:08,340 --> 03:35:10,520
restricting it from hotels and

4916
03:35:10,520 --> 03:35:11,520
bars.

4917
03:35:11,520 --> 03:35:14,520
I'm sorry, can I have -- do I have anything to speak?

4918
03:35:14,520 --> 03:35:16,590
I'll just get the motion on the floor, and then we can

4919
03:35:16,590 --> 03:35:17,959
certainly call if we're going

4920
03:35:17,959 --> 03:35:21,840
to do some additional discussion.

4921
03:35:21,840 --> 03:35:22,840
Commissioner Roselle.

4922
03:35:22,840 --> 03:35:25,840
The chair is closed.

4923
03:35:25,840 --> 03:35:26,840
Yeah.

4924
03:35:26,840 --> 03:35:30,520
I just, I guess, want to be clear.

4925
03:35:30,520 --> 03:35:35,780
The motion is to approve the rezoning with a mixed-use

4926
03:35:35,780 --> 03:35:39,040
overlay changing hotels to not

4927
03:35:39,040 --> 03:35:41,879
permitted and bars to not permitted.

4928
03:35:41,879 --> 03:35:44,280
Is that what's on the table right now?

4929
03:35:44,280 --> 03:35:46,360
Seems to be.

4930
03:35:46,360 --> 03:35:49,879
And is the applicant okay with those two conditions?

4931
03:35:49,879 --> 03:35:51,280
I appreciate the clarification.

4932
03:35:51,280 --> 03:35:52,280
Okay.

4933
03:35:52,280 --> 03:35:56,469
Do we have a first and a second for approval with the two

4934
03:35:56,469 --> 03:35:58,799
conditions of an overlay?

4935
03:35:58,799 --> 03:36:00,799
I never spoke the second.

4936
03:36:00,799 --> 03:36:01,799
Huh?

4937
03:36:01,799 --> 03:36:02,799
I never spoke the second.

4938
03:36:02,799 --> 03:36:05,440
Well, I missed you as a seconder.

4939
03:36:05,440 --> 03:36:08,239
I had Commissioner Roselle on there, so I apologize.

4940
03:36:08,239 --> 03:36:09,239
Do we have a --

4941
03:36:09,239 --> 03:36:10,239
I second.

4942
03:36:10,239 --> 03:36:11,239
It's laid.

4943
03:36:11,239 --> 03:36:14,399
It's laid, and we're going around the tree here.

4944
03:36:14,399 --> 03:36:19,200
So we have a first and a second clarification.

4945
03:36:19,200 --> 03:36:22,280
Is there going to be some other discussion or comments?

4946
03:36:22,280 --> 03:36:23,879
And I think there was a question.

4947
03:36:23,879 --> 03:36:26,959
I'd be happy to entertain your question, ma'am.

4948
03:36:26,959 --> 03:36:28,959
Thank you.

4949
03:36:28,959 --> 03:36:34,200
The question is, what do you constitute as a bar?

4950
03:36:34,200 --> 03:36:36,909
If you have a restaurant that has a bar in it, does that

4951
03:36:36,909 --> 03:36:38,360
mean that they can't -- that

4952
03:36:38,360 --> 03:36:39,360
that's not allowed?

4953
03:36:39,360 --> 03:36:42,200
Is that part of the overlay or --

4954
03:36:42,200 --> 03:36:47,049
Well, a bar, I think our definition requires a certain

4955
03:36:47,049 --> 03:36:50,280
percentage of receipts to come from

4956
03:36:50,280 --> 03:36:51,280
alcohol.

4957
03:36:51,280 --> 03:36:55,280
But under the L11, it includes that.

4958
03:36:55,280 --> 03:36:58,100
L11 states limited to sit down -- again, this is the

4959
03:36:58,100 --> 03:37:00,520
restriction on bar as well, L11, limited

4960
03:37:00,520 --> 03:37:04,090
to sit down only and no drive-up service permitted, limited

4961
03:37:04,090 --> 03:37:06,600
to no more than 100 seats and no more

4962
03:37:06,600 --> 03:37:09,079
than 4,000 square feet of restaurant area.

4963
03:37:09,079 --> 03:37:11,079
So it would be pretty small.

4964
03:37:11,079 --> 03:37:14,440
Yeah, well, yeah, right.

4965
03:37:14,440 --> 03:37:15,440
It would be, yeah.

4966
03:37:15,440 --> 03:37:17,790
And the other question, I think that what we were

4967
03:37:17,790 --> 03:37:19,959
discussing with the overlay was possibly

4968
03:37:19,959 --> 03:37:24,170
business being doctor's office or whatever, like from 9 to

4969
03:37:24,170 --> 03:37:26,520
5, whereas a restaurant would

4970
03:37:26,520 --> 03:37:30,200
go into like 12, 1 o'clock, whatever.

4971
03:37:30,200 --> 03:37:31,920
That's something to look at.

4972
03:37:31,920 --> 03:37:32,920
That's my concern.

4973
03:37:32,920 --> 03:37:33,920
Okay.

4974
03:37:33,920 --> 03:37:38,110
I think -- does the restaurant have to come back before us

4975
03:37:38,110 --> 03:37:39,200
for SUP or not?

4976
03:37:39,200 --> 03:37:40,200
It does not.

4977
03:37:40,200 --> 03:37:41,200
It's limited to 4,000 square feet.

4978
03:37:41,200 --> 03:37:42,200
Okay.

4979
03:37:42,200 --> 03:37:43,200
Matter of right.

4980
03:37:43,200 --> 03:37:44,200
Okay.

4981
03:37:44,200 --> 03:37:46,219
A drive-through, if it were to be a fast food with a drive-

4982
03:37:46,219 --> 03:37:47,520
through, that would come to you

4983
03:37:47,520 --> 03:37:48,520
as an SUP.

4984
03:37:48,520 --> 03:37:49,520
Okay.

4985
03:37:49,520 --> 03:37:52,709
We're trying to find hopefully a good balance here between

4986
03:37:52,709 --> 03:37:53,639
all parties.

4987
03:37:53,639 --> 03:37:55,680
So thank you for your comments.

4988
03:37:55,680 --> 03:37:58,260
We have a first and a second.

4989
03:37:58,260 --> 03:38:05,520
Any further discussion?

4990
03:38:05,520 --> 03:38:07,319
Seeing none, I will call for a vote on the board.

4991
03:38:07,319 --> 03:38:12,159
A vote yes is for approval.

4992
03:38:12,159 --> 03:38:19,399
The motion is going to carry 7 to 0.

4993
03:38:19,399 --> 03:38:22,719
Thank you and good luck with your project.

4994
03:38:22,719 --> 03:38:29,479
We'll move us to item D. We'll open the public hearing for

4995
03:38:29,479 --> 03:38:33,639
PDA 17-0006 and call on Julie

4996
03:38:33,639 --> 03:38:37,920
Wyatt for presentation.

4997
03:38:37,920 --> 03:38:41,520
Sorry.

4998
03:38:41,520 --> 03:38:47,440
I was thinking.

4999
03:38:47,440 --> 03:39:07,399
This might get interesting.

5000
03:39:07,399 --> 03:39:21,040
I should quit touching it.

5001
03:39:21,040 --> 03:39:30,879
That's generally the best course of action.

5002
03:39:30,879 --> 03:39:31,879
All right.

5003
03:39:31,879 --> 03:39:32,879
Here we go.

5004
03:39:32,879 --> 03:39:33,879
All right.

5005
03:39:33,879 --> 03:39:34,879
This is PDA 7-6, CARMACS.

5006
03:39:34,879 --> 03:39:39,909
The request before you is to consider approval of a detail

5007
03:39:39,909 --> 03:39:43,079
plan for Plan Development 12 to

5008
03:39:43,079 --> 03:39:46,840
depict a newer used car sales lot on approximately seven

5009
03:39:46,840 --> 03:39:49,200
acres out of a 34-acre tract.

5010
03:39:49,200 --> 03:39:52,290
And just on this first slide, I want to point out a

5011
03:39:52,290 --> 03:39:54,920
discussion we had in work session where

5012
03:39:54,920 --> 03:40:00,020
this property, the 34-acre tract is this entire yellow

5013
03:40:00,020 --> 03:40:01,559
outlined area.

5014
03:40:01,559 --> 03:40:06,340
However, the development is only contemplated for an area,

5015
03:40:06,340 --> 03:40:08,719
and this might even be a little

5016
03:40:08,719 --> 03:40:09,719
large.

5017
03:40:09,719 --> 03:40:11,280
It's just for this area right here.

5018
03:40:11,280 --> 03:40:15,780
So at this point, development is not contemplated for this

5019
03:40:15,780 --> 03:40:18,799
portion of the property or this portion

5020
03:40:18,799 --> 03:40:19,799
of the property.

5021
03:40:19,799 --> 03:40:20,799
It's just this site.

5022
03:40:20,799 --> 03:40:22,520
So I wanted to make that clear.

5023
03:40:22,520 --> 03:40:28,670
So the property is adjacent to I-35 and it is southeast of

5024
03:40:28,670 --> 03:40:30,920
State School Road.

5025
03:40:30,920 --> 03:40:35,510
For the Denton Plan 2030, it is in a regional mixed use

5026
03:40:35,510 --> 03:40:36,120
area.

5027
03:40:36,120 --> 03:40:38,590
These are areas that are destinations, commercial

5028
03:40:38,590 --> 03:40:40,840
destinations, and they're often found along

5029
03:40:40,840 --> 03:40:44,000
our I-35 corridors.

5030
03:40:44,000 --> 03:40:47,639
The proposed use does meet the future land use designation.

5031
03:40:47,639 --> 03:40:49,520
All right.

5032
03:40:49,520 --> 03:40:50,520
Just a little bit of background.

5033
03:40:50,520 --> 03:40:51,520
I'll go quick.

5034
03:40:51,520 --> 03:40:54,840
This isn't a plan development.

5035
03:40:54,840 --> 03:40:58,049
We currently in our Denton Development Code do not have

5036
03:40:58,049 --> 03:40:59,959
plan developments as a possible

5037
03:40:59,959 --> 03:41:04,149
use, but we do have some left over from our 1991 code, and

5038
03:41:04,149 --> 03:41:05,600
this is one of them.

5039
03:41:05,600 --> 03:41:08,020
Our plan developments in the City of Denton were two-step

5040
03:41:08,020 --> 03:41:08,719
processes.

5041
03:41:08,719 --> 03:41:11,659
First, the concept plan, which outlined the uses and the

5042
03:41:11,659 --> 03:41:13,200
project boundaries and where

5043
03:41:13,200 --> 03:41:15,879
those uses would go and design standards.

5044
03:41:15,879 --> 03:41:21,399
And then detail plans were intended to get more information

5045
03:41:21,399 --> 03:41:24,120
on where the buildings would

5046
03:41:24,120 --> 03:41:27,000
go, where the parking areas would go, almost a site plan

5047
03:41:27,000 --> 03:41:28,600
approval for these commercial

5048
03:41:28,600 --> 03:41:29,600
developments.

5049
03:41:29,600 --> 03:41:31,479
And that's what we're here for today.

5050
03:41:31,479 --> 03:41:35,239
The use is permitted under the plan development.

5051
03:41:35,239 --> 03:41:39,200
That was set out in the concept plan approved in 1987.

5052
03:41:39,200 --> 03:41:43,790
The use under 1991 code was newer use car sales lot in open

5053
03:41:43,790 --> 03:41:44,079
.

5054
03:41:44,079 --> 03:41:45,079
So it is permitted.

5055
03:41:45,079 --> 03:41:47,520
So the use really isn't in discussion.

5056
03:41:47,520 --> 03:41:51,600
It's just how it's put together on the lot.

5057
03:41:51,600 --> 03:41:54,649
The 1991 code outlines the criteria for approval, and what

5058
03:41:54,649 --> 03:41:56,239
it does, it wants to make sure that

5059
03:41:56,239 --> 03:42:00,430
the request conforms to the concept plan, that the

5060
03:42:00,430 --> 03:42:03,319
arrangement of the buildings would

5061
03:42:03,319 --> 03:42:06,090
not adversely affect the adjoining properties outside of

5062
03:42:06,090 --> 03:42:07,920
the PD, that there would be adequate

5063
03:42:07,920 --> 03:42:10,719
circulation for traffic, and that would be in substantial

5064
03:42:10,719 --> 03:42:12,680
compliance with the city regulations.

5065
03:42:12,680 --> 03:42:15,940
And staff has reviewed their proposal and has determined

5066
03:42:15,940 --> 03:42:18,340
that it does meet these requirements.

5067
03:42:18,340 --> 03:42:22,100
So just to go over those briefly, so first we looked at the

5068
03:42:22,100 --> 03:42:23,760
concept plan, is the use

5069
03:42:23,760 --> 03:42:25,799
permitted?

5070
03:42:25,799 --> 03:42:28,680
And this is a map that was pulled from that PD.

5071
03:42:28,680 --> 03:42:31,959
This is approximately the location of the subject property.

5072
03:42:31,959 --> 03:42:33,280
There's not dimensions on this.

5073
03:42:33,280 --> 03:42:36,520
So but this is the approximate location.

5074
03:42:36,520 --> 03:42:38,959
And this was in commercial shopping.

5075
03:42:38,959 --> 03:42:40,600
That was what the CS stood for.

5076
03:42:40,600 --> 03:42:43,760
And that did permit this use.

5077
03:42:43,760 --> 03:42:45,930
And then we looked at their site plan that they proposed

5078
03:42:45,930 --> 03:42:47,239
along with their narrative.

5079
03:42:47,239 --> 03:42:50,850
So they're proposing a 7,400 square foot building

5080
03:42:50,850 --> 03:42:53,440
constructed with masonry, one driveway

5081
03:42:53,440 --> 03:42:58,200
connection to I-35, the frontage road.

5082
03:42:58,200 --> 03:43:02,719
The sales staging area would be located behind a 6 foot m

5083
03:43:02,719 --> 03:43:04,000
asonry wall.

5084
03:43:04,000 --> 03:43:06,440
The display for cars would be in this location.

5085
03:43:06,440 --> 03:43:09,350
And then the customer employee parking would be in this

5086
03:43:09,350 --> 03:43:10,120
location.

5087
03:43:10,120 --> 03:43:13,559
They would have to meet all requirements regarding lighting

5088
03:43:13,559 --> 03:43:14,360
and glare.

5089
03:43:14,360 --> 03:43:17,790
And then they also talked in their narrative that they want

5090
03:43:17,790 --> 03:43:19,520
to, that they would cite the

5091
03:43:19,520 --> 03:43:24,379
public address speakers in such a way to minimize impacts

5092
03:43:24,379 --> 03:43:26,799
to adjacent properties.

5093
03:43:26,799 --> 03:43:32,379
The landscape plan depicts trees along I-35 as well as a

5094
03:43:32,379 --> 03:43:33,680
hedgerow.

5095
03:43:33,680 --> 03:43:37,129
They also are proposing trees planted throughout the site,

5096
03:43:37,129 --> 03:43:39,040
particularly on the buffer or on

5097
03:43:39,040 --> 03:43:42,040
the perimeter areas.

5098
03:43:42,040 --> 03:43:46,379
Landscape islands to direct traffic appropriately and then

5099
03:43:46,379 --> 03:43:49,079
with trees located in those areas.

5100
03:43:49,079 --> 03:43:52,440
Public notification was sent out.

5101
03:43:52,440 --> 03:43:57,200
We've received three in opposition and then two in favor.

5102
03:43:57,200 --> 03:44:01,030
So based upon the request compatibility with the

5103
03:44:01,030 --> 03:44:04,399
surrounding property, we feel it's consistent

5104
03:44:04,399 --> 03:44:07,909
with the Denton Plan 2030 and it also meets criteria for

5105
03:44:07,909 --> 03:44:09,719
approval for a detailed plan.

5106
03:44:09,719 --> 03:44:12,719
And I'll stand for any questions.

5107
03:44:12,719 --> 03:44:16,600
>> Any questions for Julie?

5108
03:44:16,600 --> 03:44:21,120
Thank you, Julie.

5109
03:44:21,120 --> 03:44:22,120
This is a public hearing.

5110
03:44:22,120 --> 03:44:26,280
I do have a couple of cards wishing to speak.

5111
03:44:26,280 --> 03:44:29,879
I have the first card from John Thatcher.

5112
03:44:29,879 --> 03:44:33,940
If you'll give us your name and address and you'll have

5113
03:44:33,940 --> 03:44:36,200
four minutes unless you're the

5114
03:44:36,200 --> 03:44:37,200
applicant.

5115
03:44:37,200 --> 03:44:38,200
>> Yes.

5116
03:44:38,200 --> 03:44:42,879
John Thatcher, 800 East 18th, Denver, Colorado.

5117
03:44:42,879 --> 03:44:45,840
I am with CenterPoint Integrated Solutions, a development

5118
03:44:45,840 --> 03:44:47,760
consultant for CarMax representing

5119
03:44:47,760 --> 03:44:48,760
them here today.

5120
03:44:48,760 --> 03:44:49,760
>> Okay.

5121
03:44:49,760 --> 03:44:50,760
We've got 10 minutes now.

5122
03:44:50,760 --> 03:44:51,760
>> 10 minutes.

5123
03:44:51,760 --> 03:44:52,760
I'm not going to use it.

5124
03:44:52,760 --> 03:44:57,709
We do have a short presentation that I would like to run

5125
03:44:57,709 --> 03:45:00,040
through very quickly.

5126
03:45:00,040 --> 03:45:04,079
Uh-oh.

5127
03:45:04,079 --> 03:45:07,079
Or not.

5128
03:45:07,079 --> 03:45:09,079
Okay.

5129
03:45:09,079 --> 03:45:20,719
So we had a few slides about CarMax as a company.

5130
03:45:20,719 --> 03:45:23,719
I'll spare you those.

5131
03:45:23,719 --> 03:45:26,030
In short, they're a great company, do a lot of good charity

5132
03:45:26,030 --> 03:45:27,000
work and they're great to

5133
03:45:27,000 --> 03:45:28,760
the employees.

5134
03:45:28,760 --> 03:45:32,659
But onto their specific vision for this store, estimating $

5135
03:45:32,659 --> 03:45:34,760
10 million investment.

5136
03:45:34,760 --> 03:45:39,479
Their XF prototype is about 7,500 square feet.

5137
03:45:39,479 --> 03:45:43,270
As staff noted, that's on seven acres developed out of the

5138
03:45:43,270 --> 03:45:45,760
total 34, just the seven acres

5139
03:45:45,760 --> 03:45:48,760
closest to the I-35 frontage up there.

5140
03:45:48,760 --> 03:45:52,579
They'll have 225 vehicles available for inventory on the

5141
03:45:52,579 --> 03:45:55,479
site, a potential employment of 27

5142
03:45:55,479 --> 03:46:02,629
full-time associates with average pay of 45,000 plus

5143
03:46:02,629 --> 03:46:03,920
benefits.

5144
03:46:03,920 --> 03:46:08,420
My plan is what I really wanted you to see, and that's not

5145
03:46:08,420 --> 03:46:09,440
loading.

5146
03:46:09,440 --> 03:46:14,319
But she had it up during her presentation.

5147
03:46:14,319 --> 03:46:18,680
I don't want to rehash what's there.

5148
03:46:18,680 --> 03:46:23,139
We're trying to provide a nice landscaped lot, certain, you

5149
03:46:23,139 --> 03:46:25,399
know, trees along the frontage

5150
03:46:25,399 --> 03:46:30,459
and a majority of them in the customer employee lot.

5151
03:46:30,459 --> 03:46:34,969
Here we have building elevations, as you can see, CarMax

5152
03:46:34,969 --> 03:46:37,840
has, you know, a nice high quality

5153
03:46:37,840 --> 03:46:44,360
building with preliminary earth-toned split-face CMU block.

5154
03:46:44,360 --> 03:46:48,549
And we also have a few pictures of the store interior just

5155
03:46:48,549 --> 03:46:51,159
to give you some real-life examples

5156
03:46:51,159 --> 03:46:56,600
of the quality of the build that CarMax does.

5157
03:46:56,600 --> 03:46:59,770
They're really high-class operation and we think they'd be

5158
03:46:59,770 --> 03:47:01,440
a great addition to the community.

5159
03:47:01,440 --> 03:47:03,120
So I know it's getting late.

5160
03:47:03,120 --> 03:47:05,280
I'll keep it short.

5161
03:47:05,280 --> 03:47:07,239
We are here to answer any questions you might have.

5162
03:47:07,239 --> 03:47:10,489
I've got representatives from CarMax and our engineering

5163
03:47:10,489 --> 03:47:11,399
firm as well.

5164
03:47:11,399 --> 03:47:12,399
Do you have a question for you?

5165
03:47:12,399 --> 03:47:13,399
Commissioner Smith.

5166
03:47:13,399 --> 03:47:14,399
Thank you, Chair.

5167
03:47:14,399 --> 03:47:17,940
The 34.4 acres, you guys own that entire tract and you're

5168
03:47:17,940 --> 03:47:19,639
only developing the seven?

5169
03:47:19,639 --> 03:47:22,319
They're under contract to purchase the entire 34 acres.

5170
03:47:22,319 --> 03:47:23,319
They will purchase the 344.

5171
03:47:23,319 --> 03:47:26,719
No plans whatsoever to develop the other 27 acres?

5172
03:47:26,719 --> 03:47:30,909
Not at this time and I would imagine never, but I think if

5173
03:47:30,909 --> 03:47:32,920
we did, we would have to.

5174
03:47:32,920 --> 03:47:35,399
Yeah, there'd be a lot of crap to do too.

5175
03:47:35,399 --> 03:47:38,399
Okay, just wanted to check.

5176
03:47:38,399 --> 03:47:42,200
Any other questions?

5177
03:47:42,200 --> 03:47:43,200
Commissioner Sullivan.

5178
03:47:43,200 --> 03:47:47,159
Yes, thank you, Chair.

5179
03:47:47,159 --> 03:47:50,520
Initially, I was glad to see you all coming because I hate

5180
03:47:50,520 --> 03:47:52,120
having to drive to Plano or

5181
03:47:52,120 --> 03:47:55,920
Grapevine to go to those CarMax places.

5182
03:47:55,920 --> 03:47:59,680
But then when I saw the map and I saw how close you were

5183
03:47:59,680 --> 03:48:01,840
getting to the houses to the

5184
03:48:01,840 --> 03:48:05,040
south and west, I was disappointed.

5185
03:48:05,040 --> 03:48:13,360
Then when I learned it was not the whole area but just that

5186
03:48:13,360 --> 03:48:17,360
small area, thank you.

5187
03:48:17,360 --> 03:48:18,360
Commissioner Beck.

5188
03:48:18,360 --> 03:48:22,360
Thank you, Chair.

5189
03:48:22,360 --> 03:48:26,360
You are running the business.

5190
03:48:26,360 --> 03:48:29,360
We plan to see you in the future.

5191
03:48:29,360 --> 03:48:30,360
Thank you.

5192
03:48:30,360 --> 03:48:31,360
Put in real will.

5193
03:48:31,360 --> 03:48:32,360
There it is on.

5194
03:48:32,360 --> 03:48:33,360
Anyway, welcome.

5195
03:48:33,360 --> 03:48:34,360
Thanks.

5196
03:48:34,360 --> 03:48:35,360
Any other questions or comments for the applicant?

5197
03:48:35,360 --> 03:48:36,360
Thank you, sir.

5198
03:48:36,360 --> 03:48:37,360
Thank you.

5199
03:48:37,360 --> 03:48:40,920
Do we have another card?

5200
03:48:40,920 --> 03:48:46,920
Rick Wick, you in support?

5201
03:48:46,920 --> 03:48:57,030
I'm Rick Wick, 4984 Classic Limited, DBA Classic Chrysler,

5202
03:48:57,030 --> 03:49:01,200
Deep Dodge, Amasta and Chair and

5203
03:49:01,200 --> 03:49:02,520
Commissioners.

5204
03:49:02,520 --> 03:49:03,520
Thank you for your time.

5205
03:49:03,520 --> 03:49:04,520
Steve, come see me.

5206
03:49:04,520 --> 03:49:07,959
You don't have to drive to Plano.

5207
03:49:07,959 --> 03:49:09,639
We'll keep the tax dollars here.

5208
03:49:09,639 --> 03:49:13,280
We'll keep the tax dollars here.

5209
03:49:13,280 --> 03:49:17,049
I'm not opposed but Julie, if you bring up the other slides

5210
03:49:17,049 --> 03:49:18,920
you have, I have a question

5211
03:49:18,920 --> 03:49:24,920
about property because it butts up against our property.

5212
03:49:24,920 --> 03:49:28,280
Does that help?

5213
03:49:28,280 --> 03:49:31,479
Yeah, that worked perfect.

5214
03:49:31,479 --> 03:49:34,290
Now this, I understand this property, I understand this,

5215
03:49:34,290 --> 03:49:36,440
what the building is and come on, CarMax,

5216
03:49:36,440 --> 03:49:40,600
I'll take the competition all day long.

5217
03:49:40,600 --> 03:49:45,209
But my question is all this property here, I know it's

5218
03:49:45,209 --> 03:49:46,639
floodplain.

5219
03:49:46,639 --> 03:49:50,159
I built the Toyota store there and we tried to buy this

5220
03:49:50,159 --> 03:49:52,280
property and it's floodplain and

5221
03:49:52,280 --> 03:49:53,760
you can't build on it.

5222
03:49:53,760 --> 03:49:58,159
But my question is the current property owner has not

5223
03:49:58,159 --> 03:50:00,200
maintained all this.

5224
03:50:00,200 --> 03:50:01,200
It's a hazard.

5225
03:50:01,200 --> 03:50:02,840
It's a fire hazard.

5226
03:50:02,840 --> 03:50:04,559
It's big growth.

5227
03:50:04,559 --> 03:50:08,559
I have to maintain all this frontage all the way down

5228
03:50:08,559 --> 03:50:11,639
through here, even come down through

5229
03:50:11,639 --> 03:50:15,000
this area here where my master building is.

5230
03:50:15,000 --> 03:50:16,879
I'm to maintain it.

5231
03:50:16,879 --> 03:50:21,200
My question is, and maybe this isn't the point, but what

5232
03:50:21,200 --> 03:50:24,040
happens to this property as far as

5233
03:50:24,040 --> 03:50:26,680
you're being maintained?

5234
03:50:26,680 --> 03:50:30,959
It's high grass.

5235
03:50:30,959 --> 03:50:32,360
It's overcome.

5236
03:50:32,360 --> 03:50:35,899
I can't cut it because previous property owner won't let me

5237
03:50:35,899 --> 03:50:37,360
into that property.

5238
03:50:37,360 --> 03:50:39,399
But that's what our question is.

5239
03:50:39,399 --> 03:50:42,690
What's getting done with all that waste area that's high

5240
03:50:42,690 --> 03:50:43,280
grass?

5241
03:50:43,280 --> 03:50:46,040
It goes all the way back off the property off of there.

5242
03:50:46,040 --> 03:50:49,809
If I could step in and call on staff, I think if we can

5243
03:50:49,809 --> 03:50:52,239
turn on the ESA area, because I'm

5244
03:50:52,239 --> 03:50:55,379
going to guess with it being floodplain, it's also going to

5245
03:50:55,379 --> 03:50:56,840
be ESA and then there's going

5246
03:50:56,840 --> 03:51:00,840
to be limitations as to what can be done to clean it up.

5247
03:51:00,840 --> 03:51:04,069
No, I'm just looking to maintain the area that can maintain

5248
03:51:04,069 --> 03:51:04,319
.

5249
03:51:04,319 --> 03:51:06,629
Not the area in the middle that's floodplain, but there's

5250
03:51:06,629 --> 03:51:08,159
areas alongside that has overgrown

5251
03:51:08,159 --> 03:51:11,159
grass that's accessible.

5252
03:51:11,159 --> 03:51:32,600
There's no person that helped plan it.

5253
03:51:32,600 --> 03:51:46,680
So, it looks like there is an ESA floodplain as well as a

5254
03:51:46,680 --> 03:51:52,000
riparian buffer.

5255
03:51:52,000 --> 03:51:55,760
So, Chapter 17 of the Denton Development Code outlines

5256
03:51:55,760 --> 03:51:57,920
requirements as to what you can do

5257
03:51:57,920 --> 03:52:00,239
in an environmentally sensitive area.

5258
03:52:00,239 --> 03:52:04,520
We don't allow any impacts in a riparian buffer.

5259
03:52:04,520 --> 03:52:11,120
So, I don't even think that includes mowing because it is

5260
03:52:11,120 --> 03:52:12,600
habitat.

5261
03:52:12,600 --> 03:52:17,120
So, I don't know.

5262
03:52:17,120 --> 03:52:19,639
This area right here is riparian buffer.

5263
03:52:19,639 --> 03:52:22,639
Yeah, it's just a small area.

5264
03:52:22,639 --> 03:52:26,360
It's probably 300 feet off the highway.

5265
03:52:26,360 --> 03:52:32,280
So, under current code, that could not be mowed.

5266
03:52:32,280 --> 03:52:34,079
It would have to stay in its natural state.

5267
03:52:34,079 --> 03:52:40,680
Highway Department just did it.

5268
03:52:40,680 --> 03:52:43,680
They cleaned all that area up in front.

5269
03:52:43,680 --> 03:52:47,799
So, I'm just curious.

5270
03:52:47,799 --> 03:52:48,799
Thank you.

5271
03:52:48,799 --> 03:52:49,799
That's all my comments.

5272
03:52:49,799 --> 03:52:51,360
But you're in support of the project?

5273
03:52:51,360 --> 03:52:52,360
Yes.

5274
03:52:52,360 --> 03:52:53,360
Okay.

5275
03:52:53,360 --> 03:52:54,360
Thank you, sir.

5276
03:52:54,360 --> 03:52:57,639
I'm sorry I'm so late.

5277
03:52:57,639 --> 03:52:58,879
This is a public hearing.

5278
03:52:58,879 --> 03:53:02,000
Anyone else who would like to speak on this item?

5279
03:53:02,000 --> 03:53:03,399
Please come forward at this time.

5280
03:53:03,399 --> 03:53:10,549
I do have – I'm going to read all these in or just – pretty

5281
03:53:10,549 --> 03:53:11,680
good.

5282
03:53:11,680 --> 03:53:17,000
I have a number of – have James Jordan.

5283
03:53:17,000 --> 03:53:18,399
He's opposed the request.

5284
03:53:18,399 --> 03:53:21,600
He was concerned about the floodplain.

5285
03:53:21,600 --> 03:53:25,639
John McCoy is opposed to the request.

5286
03:53:25,639 --> 03:53:31,049
So, noise pollution and natural wildlife in there and flood

5287
03:53:31,049 --> 03:53:31,959
plain.

5288
03:53:31,959 --> 03:53:35,559
Curtis Fisher is opposed to the request.

5289
03:53:35,559 --> 03:53:38,360
It's floodplain.

5290
03:53:38,360 --> 03:53:40,840
Van Harris opposed to the request.

5291
03:53:40,840 --> 03:53:42,719
There's no comment.

5292
03:53:42,719 --> 03:53:46,520
Joyce Reed is opposed to request.

5293
03:53:46,520 --> 03:53:49,639
She's got eight different items listed here.

5294
03:53:49,639 --> 03:53:55,120
There's Rick Wick, already spoken.

5295
03:53:55,120 --> 03:53:59,399
There is Scott Fly is in favor of request.

5296
03:53:59,399 --> 03:54:02,600
Al McNatt in favor of request.

5297
03:54:02,600 --> 03:54:05,959
And Rob Tharp in favor of request.

5298
03:54:05,959 --> 03:54:10,149
Those are all the requests to speak comment cards and all

5299
03:54:10,149 --> 03:54:12,000
the responses that we got to

5300
03:54:12,000 --> 03:54:13,620
the notification.

5301
03:54:13,620 --> 03:54:17,600
Is there anyone else who would like to speak on this item

5302
03:54:17,600 --> 03:54:18,799
at this time?

5303
03:54:18,799 --> 03:54:22,159
Seeing none, I will close the public hearing and open the

5304
03:54:22,159 --> 03:54:24,280
floor for discussion or motion.

5305
03:54:24,280 --> 03:54:25,280
Commissioner Smith.

5306
03:54:25,280 --> 03:54:28,760
I motion to accept.

5307
03:54:28,760 --> 03:54:29,760
Accept or approve?

5308
03:54:29,760 --> 03:54:30,760
Accept.

5309
03:54:30,760 --> 03:54:33,760
I accept to approve.

5310
03:54:33,760 --> 03:54:34,879
Okay.

5311
03:54:34,879 --> 03:54:35,879
Commissioner Sullivan.

5312
03:54:35,879 --> 03:54:37,360
I second the motion.

5313
03:54:37,360 --> 03:54:38,360
Okay.

5314
03:54:38,360 --> 03:54:43,799
So, we have a motion on the floor to approve and a second.

5315
03:54:43,799 --> 03:54:48,659
Any further discussion?

5316
03:54:48,659 --> 03:54:57,879
Seeing none, we'll call for a vote on the board.

5317
03:54:57,879 --> 03:54:59,680
Motion carries seven to zero.

5318
03:54:59,680 --> 03:55:05,920
Congratulations and good luck with your project.

5319
03:55:05,920 --> 03:55:11,180
We'll move us to item E. I'm going to open the public

5320
03:55:11,180 --> 03:55:15,360
hearing for DCA 17-0009.

5321
03:55:15,360 --> 03:55:27,479
We'll call on Roman for presentation.

5322
03:55:27,479 --> 03:55:28,479
Thank you.

5323
03:55:28,479 --> 03:55:29,479
I'm Roman McAllen.

5324
03:55:29,479 --> 03:55:31,829
I'm the historic preservation officer for the City of Dent

5325
03:55:31,829 --> 03:55:32,159
on.

5326
03:55:32,159 --> 03:55:34,510
This is a request to hold a public hearing and consider

5327
03:55:34,510 --> 03:55:36,000
making a recommendation to city

5328
03:55:36,000 --> 03:55:40,840
council regarding repealing and replacing section 3576,

5329
03:55:40,840 --> 03:55:43,600
repealing sections 3577 and

5330
03:55:43,600 --> 03:55:57,229
3578, adding sections 35315, adding definitions to -- sorry

5331
03:55:57,229 --> 03:55:57,559
, adding definitions to section

5332
03:55:57,559 --> 03:56:03,309
35232 and making changes to section 3543 of the Denton

5333
03:56:03,309 --> 03:56:05,079
Development Code.

5334
03:56:05,079 --> 03:56:10,799
This process began in April of 2016, a little after I was

5335
03:56:10,799 --> 03:56:12,120
hired here.

5336
03:56:12,120 --> 03:56:14,190
By going to the -- I went to the landmark commission and

5337
03:56:14,190 --> 03:56:15,360
the city council and briefed

5338
03:56:15,360 --> 03:56:19,120
them on some conditions existing in our preservation ordin

5339
03:56:19,120 --> 03:56:19,760
ances.

5340
03:56:19,760 --> 03:56:23,120
And there was a recommendation to move forward with am

5341
03:56:23,120 --> 03:56:24,799
ending the ordinances.

5342
03:56:24,799 --> 03:56:29,319
In June of July of 2016, we held three public meetings in

5343
03:56:29,319 --> 03:56:31,840
the historic districts along with

5344
03:56:31,840 --> 03:56:35,489
an additional meeting here in this room where I presented

5345
03:56:35,489 --> 03:56:37,479
in general the changes that we

5346
03:56:37,479 --> 03:56:39,639
would be putting forth.

5347
03:56:39,639 --> 03:56:43,829
And then we -- there was a large gap there where we spent

5348
03:56:43,829 --> 03:56:46,159
some staff time and legal time

5349
03:56:46,159 --> 03:56:49,409
working on going through these disordinates and really in

5350
03:56:49,409 --> 03:56:51,760
the end, we're finding it much

5351
03:56:51,760 --> 03:56:54,680
better than I intended to in the beginning.

5352
03:56:54,680 --> 03:56:59,030
So that went to landmark commission and they recommended

5353
03:56:59,030 --> 03:57:00,719
approval 8-0.

5354
03:57:00,719 --> 03:57:04,209
The major changes are in general cleanup and efficiency

5355
03:57:04,209 --> 03:57:05,079
oriented.

5356
03:57:05,079 --> 03:57:07,520
The structure has changed.

5357
03:57:07,520 --> 03:57:10,110
And then there were multiple references to certificates of

5358
03:57:10,110 --> 03:57:11,040
appropriateness.

5359
03:57:11,040 --> 03:57:14,319
There were in fact four or five ways that was described.

5360
03:57:14,319 --> 03:57:17,120
Now there's one way that's described.

5361
03:57:17,120 --> 03:57:20,569
Definitions were scattered throughout the ordinance in

5362
03:57:20,569 --> 03:57:22,079
different sections.

5363
03:57:22,079 --> 03:57:24,549
They're all in one section which is going to be -- which is

5364
03:57:24,549 --> 03:57:26,040
part of the Denton Development

5365
03:57:26,040 --> 03:57:28,000
Code that has definitions.

5366
03:57:28,000 --> 03:57:30,459
The criteria and procedures for designation of historic

5367
03:57:30,459 --> 03:57:31,959
landmarks, historic districts

5368
03:57:31,959 --> 03:57:34,879
and conservation districts have been arranged sequentially

5369
03:57:34,879 --> 03:57:37,479
and revised for clarity and consistency.

5370
03:57:37,479 --> 03:57:40,760
And then all procedurally oriented subsections were

5371
03:57:40,760 --> 03:57:43,520
combined and sequenced into one section.

5372
03:57:43,520 --> 03:57:47,280
The substantive changes, those were more structural there,

5373
03:57:47,280 --> 03:57:49,520
were that we will recognize the Belle

5374
03:57:49,520 --> 03:57:53,559
Avenue Conservation District as an historic district.

5375
03:57:53,559 --> 03:57:57,049
And then this slide, it says a more efficient process was

5376
03:57:57,049 --> 03:57:59,280
introduced for local designation

5377
03:57:59,280 --> 03:58:03,469
of properties that have been recognized by the state or by

5378
03:58:03,469 --> 03:58:05,479
the National Park Service

5379
03:58:05,479 --> 03:58:09,479
like our square downtown is a National Registered District.

5380
03:58:09,479 --> 03:58:12,450
But really one step has been removed and that is since it

5381
03:58:12,450 --> 03:58:14,159
is a national district in that

5382
03:58:14,159 --> 03:58:18,319
case you wouldn't have to do the historical presentation.

5383
03:58:18,319 --> 03:58:20,750
It's presumed that that district could be designated as a

5384
03:58:20,750 --> 03:58:21,639
local district.

5385
03:58:21,639 --> 03:58:24,680
You still would have to have the public input present that

5386
03:58:24,680 --> 03:58:26,360
and then present an ordinance

5387
03:58:26,360 --> 03:58:28,120
to city council.

5388
03:58:28,120 --> 03:58:30,739
Language pertaining to certificates of appropriateness for

5389
03:58:30,739 --> 03:58:32,520
painting, landscaping and fencing was

5390
03:58:32,520 --> 03:58:36,290
amended per the input from the three different districts

5391
03:58:36,290 --> 03:58:38,440
and that input varied just a little

5392
03:58:38,440 --> 03:58:39,440
bit.

5393
03:58:39,440 --> 03:58:43,829
A maintenance clause was amended where previously the Land

5394
03:58:43,829 --> 03:58:46,440
mark Commission could take action

5395
03:58:46,440 --> 03:58:51,030
if a historic landmark appeared to be being neglected and

5396
03:58:51,030 --> 03:58:53,280
then they could take action

5397
03:58:53,280 --> 03:58:56,280
and ask for the city to take action to preserve that

5398
03:58:56,280 --> 03:58:58,600
building or to take action to prevent

5399
03:58:58,600 --> 03:59:01,120
any further demolition or neglect of it.

5400
03:59:01,120 --> 03:59:05,370
So the revision is that if there's a structure that could

5401
03:59:05,370 --> 03:59:08,000
be designated a landmark then the

5402
03:59:08,000 --> 03:59:11,040
Landmark Commission can make that recommendation.

5403
03:59:11,040 --> 03:59:13,969
There are structures that we just recently demolished a

5404
03:59:13,969 --> 03:59:15,760
structure here on West Oak where

5405
03:59:15,760 --> 03:59:19,190
we could have used that clause to take action a little

5406
03:59:19,190 --> 03:59:21,959
earlier and perhaps prevent the building

5407
03:59:21,959 --> 03:59:24,020
from being so deteriorated.

5408
03:59:24,020 --> 03:59:26,780
How that kind of looks graphically on your left here are

5409
03:59:26,780 --> 03:59:28,280
all the sections as they are

5410
03:59:28,280 --> 03:59:32,049
today and then as they would be proposed you notice that

5411
03:59:32,049 --> 03:59:34,040
you start out with the general

5412
03:59:34,040 --> 03:59:37,879
historic preservation description, its purpose, the

5413
03:59:37,879 --> 03:59:40,000
penalties and enforcement.

5414
03:59:40,000 --> 03:59:44,049
Then the procedural section is extracted and then that's

5415
03:59:44,049 --> 03:59:46,319
how you designate landmarks, how

5416
03:59:46,319 --> 03:59:52,809
you designate districts and how certificate of appropriaten

5417
03:59:52,809 --> 03:59:55,760
ess process works and these

5418
03:59:55,760 --> 03:59:57,159
other little categories.

5419
03:59:57,159 --> 03:59:59,770
And again the maintenance and emission repairs is the one I

5420
03:59:59,770 --> 04:00:00,680
was speaking of.

5421
04:00:00,680 --> 04:00:02,520
And then you have the three districts.

5422
04:00:02,520 --> 04:00:04,639
So it's a little easier to read.

5423
04:00:04,639 --> 04:00:08,100
Minor changes, those definitions again have been moved out

5424
04:00:08,100 --> 04:00:10,200
to this section 3523 to the

5425
04:00:10,200 --> 04:00:14,110
Landmark Commission just chairman to chair and a little

5426
04:00:14,110 --> 04:00:16,440
section about that the Landmark

5427
04:00:16,440 --> 04:00:20,159
Commission doesn't actually make the preservation plan.

5428
04:00:20,159 --> 04:00:23,200
The public input part of this, there were these three

5429
04:00:23,200 --> 04:00:24,040
meetings.

5430
04:00:24,040 --> 04:00:26,950
These are some boards that I presented to these districts

5431
04:00:26,950 --> 04:00:28,559
and then they voted by putting

5432
04:00:28,559 --> 04:00:31,639
dots on whether they wanted the Landmark Commission to have

5433
04:00:31,639 --> 04:00:33,440
to approve painting and what have

5434
04:00:33,440 --> 04:00:34,440
you.

5435
04:00:34,440 --> 04:00:38,340
The general there at the bottom concerns varied by district

5436
04:00:38,340 --> 04:00:41,040
but clarity and deference to administrative

5437
04:00:41,040 --> 04:00:42,040
approvals.

5438
04:00:42,040 --> 04:00:45,250
All of, everyone wanted more administrative approvals so we

5439
04:00:45,250 --> 04:00:46,879
could streamline the process

5440
04:00:46,879 --> 04:00:50,120
and only take the more substantive things to the Landmark

5441
04:00:50,120 --> 04:00:51,079
Commission.

5442
04:00:51,079 --> 04:00:54,190
I want to add along with the public input, I presented you

5443
04:00:54,190 --> 04:00:55,799
all in the work session some

5444
04:00:55,799 --> 04:00:57,879
results of the public notification.

5445
04:00:57,879 --> 04:01:02,090
There were four letters in favor, three favorable emails

5446
04:01:02,090 --> 04:01:04,600
and I have a letter that I was asked

5447
04:01:04,600 --> 04:01:06,750
to read and to read to you by one of our Landmark

5448
04:01:06,750 --> 04:01:09,079
Commissioners had to leave a little earlier

5449
04:01:09,079 --> 04:01:10,079
today.

5450
04:01:10,079 --> 04:01:13,629
It's not too long but it's signed by residents in the Belle

5451
04:01:13,629 --> 04:01:14,959
Avenue district.

5452
04:01:14,959 --> 04:01:17,430
It says to all members of the City of Denton Planning and Z

5453
04:01:17,430 --> 04:01:19,100
oning Commission and City Council

5454
04:01:19,100 --> 04:01:22,239
regarding the recent notice of Public Hearing Project

5455
04:01:22,239 --> 04:01:25,239
number DCA 17-9, the following signatures

5456
04:01:25,239 --> 04:01:28,329
of homeowners in the Belle Avenue Historic Conservation

5457
04:01:28,329 --> 04:01:30,120
District reflect a vote in favor

5458
04:01:30,120 --> 04:01:34,309
of the making of the required changes to Section 35-43 of

5459
04:01:34,309 --> 04:01:36,520
the Denton Development Code that

5460
04:01:36,520 --> 04:01:40,409
recommends our neighborhood becoming the Belle Avenue Hist

5461
04:01:40,409 --> 04:01:41,600
oric District.

5462
04:01:41,600 --> 04:01:44,670
After becoming the first historic conservation district in

5463
04:01:44,670 --> 04:01:46,120
our city and the third in the

5464
04:01:46,120 --> 04:01:49,079
state of Texas, we look forward to becoming the third

5465
04:01:49,079 --> 04:01:50,920
historic district in Denton and

5466
04:01:50,920 --> 04:01:53,510
further contributing to the city's neighborhood

5467
04:01:53,510 --> 04:01:54,799
preservation efforts.

5468
04:01:54,799 --> 04:02:01,229
This is signed by Stephen Amdoul of 2003-2007 North Belle,

5469
04:02:01,229 --> 04:02:04,559
by Jeannie Naylor at 1912 North

5470
04:02:04,559 --> 04:02:08,860
Belle, by Angie and Ernie Stripling at 1815 North Belle, by

5471
04:02:08,860 --> 04:02:10,680
David and Jessica Pierce at

5472
04:02:10,680 --> 04:02:15,819
1916 North Belle, and by Gary Hayden at 2106, 2019, and

5473
04:02:15,819 --> 04:02:17,760
2021 North Belle.

5474
04:02:17,760 --> 04:02:20,760
If we're here tonight, November the 8th, I would go forward

5475
04:02:20,760 --> 04:02:22,520
hopefully to the City Council

5476
04:02:22,520 --> 04:02:25,120
as soon as possible, possibly December the 12th, and we

5477
04:02:25,120 --> 04:02:26,399
would of course publish these

5478
04:02:26,399 --> 04:02:33,350
changes to our webpage and I'll answer any questions you

5479
04:02:33,350 --> 04:02:34,920
may have.

5480
04:02:34,920 --> 04:02:41,600
Any questions?

5481
04:02:41,600 --> 04:02:47,510
Do we have an exhibit for what the Belle Avenue Historic

5482
04:02:47,510 --> 04:02:50,399
District is going to be?

5483
04:02:50,399 --> 04:02:59,319
If you go to the backup material, there's a map on it.

5484
04:02:59,319 --> 04:03:04,850
So it's the same district that exists today and that page 6

5485
04:03:04,850 --> 04:03:07,840
, when you get into the general

5486
04:03:07,840 --> 04:03:11,629
section of page 6, be your first attachment I believe that

5487
04:03:11,629 --> 04:03:15,159
refers to proposed changes.

5488
04:03:15,159 --> 04:03:20,790
It says proposed general section code and then it's page 6

5489
04:03:20,790 --> 04:03:22,920
and you'll see a map there

5490
04:03:22,920 --> 04:03:27,280
of the Belle Avenue Conservation District.

5491
04:03:27,280 --> 04:03:34,719
So between Sherman and University.

5492
04:03:34,719 --> 04:03:37,450
That district has existed for a number of years and when it

5493
04:03:37,450 --> 04:03:38,959
was created as a conservation

5494
04:03:38,959 --> 04:03:42,190
district, I believe the reason it wasn't a historic

5495
04:03:42,190 --> 04:03:44,280
district is there was not enough

5496
04:03:44,280 --> 04:03:48,469
a percentage of homes that were older than 50 years at the

5497
04:03:48,469 --> 04:03:50,079
time it was created.

5498
04:03:50,079 --> 04:03:52,920
And now they're over that.

5499
04:03:52,920 --> 04:03:55,530
One other thing with respect to conservation districts, at

5500
04:03:55,530 --> 04:03:56,959
the time that one was created,

5501
04:03:56,959 --> 04:03:59,290
the way the ordinance was written, historic districts and

5502
04:03:59,290 --> 04:04:00,520
conservation districts were

5503
04:04:00,520 --> 04:04:04,260
in fact treated the same, exactly the same way.

5504
04:04:04,260 --> 04:04:07,389
So what we've done in the ordinance is said that now if you

5505
04:04:07,389 --> 04:04:09,360
have a conservation district,

5506
04:04:09,360 --> 04:04:13,329
only demolitions and new construction will go to the Land

5507
04:04:13,329 --> 04:04:14,799
mark Commission.

5508
04:04:14,799 --> 04:04:17,829
All other permits could be approved by the preservation

5509
04:04:17,829 --> 04:04:19,559
officer using our standard.

5510
04:04:19,559 --> 04:04:22,299
So that if somebody wanted to create a district, was a

5511
04:04:22,299 --> 04:04:24,440
little nervous about the whole Landmark

5512
04:04:24,440 --> 04:04:27,340
Commission and that thing, but they still feel like the

5513
04:04:27,340 --> 04:04:28,959
layout of their neighborhood

5514
04:04:28,959 --> 04:04:31,809
and the feel of that neighborhood is important to a group

5515
04:04:31,809 --> 04:04:33,920
of people, only your new construction

5516
04:04:33,920 --> 04:04:37,350
and your demolition would require more thought, you know,

5517
04:04:37,350 --> 04:04:38,760
more people's input.

5518
04:04:38,760 --> 04:04:40,799
Great.

5519
04:04:40,799 --> 04:04:41,799
Thank you for answering the question.

5520
04:04:41,799 --> 04:04:42,799
We've got one more.

5521
04:04:42,799 --> 04:04:43,799
Commissioner Beck.

5522
04:04:43,799 --> 04:04:44,799
Thank you, Chair.

5523
04:04:44,799 --> 04:04:47,239
Roman, I confess I haven't read all this in detail.

5524
04:04:47,239 --> 04:04:49,950
It's a lot, but I've known you since you've been here and I

5525
04:04:49,950 --> 04:04:51,600
have full faith and confidence

5526
04:04:51,600 --> 04:04:54,950
in your ability and I think you've done an excellent work

5527
04:04:54,950 --> 04:04:56,360
here, so thank you.

5528
04:04:56,360 --> 04:04:58,639
Jennifer helped me a lot with this, really tremendous.

5529
04:04:58,639 --> 04:05:00,680
She put a lot of time into it.

5530
04:05:00,680 --> 04:05:07,799
It's really as good as it is because of her talent.

5531
04:05:07,799 --> 04:05:09,399
Thank you very much.

5532
04:05:09,399 --> 04:05:13,780
Any other questions for Roman?

5533
04:05:13,780 --> 04:05:14,780
Thank you, sir.

5534
04:05:14,780 --> 04:05:16,600
We do have a couple of cards.

5535
04:05:16,600 --> 04:05:18,639
This is a public hearing.

5536
04:05:18,639 --> 04:05:23,120
I have Deb Conte.

5537
04:05:23,120 --> 04:05:24,120
She's left.

5538
04:05:24,120 --> 04:05:25,120
Okay.

5539
04:05:25,120 --> 04:05:31,620
And then I have Karen Devaney, does not wish to speak, is

5540
04:05:31,620 --> 04:05:33,360
in support.

5541
04:05:33,360 --> 04:05:36,709
Is there anyone else who would like to come before us and

5542
04:05:36,709 --> 04:05:38,600
speak on this item tonight?

5543
04:05:38,600 --> 04:05:43,399
This is the one I came for.

5544
04:05:43,399 --> 04:05:44,399
Okay.

5545
04:05:44,399 --> 04:05:45,399
Please give us your name and address.

5546
04:05:45,399 --> 04:05:49,799
My name is Katherine Linus and I live at 1120 North Locust

5547
04:05:49,799 --> 04:05:50,719
in Denton.

5548
04:05:50,719 --> 04:05:52,079
And I'm in favor of this.

5549
04:05:52,079 --> 04:05:56,290
I think it's a good deal to be able to clarify what all is

5550
04:05:56,290 --> 04:05:58,840
required and to bring it all into

5551
04:05:58,840 --> 04:05:59,840
consensus.

5552
04:05:59,840 --> 04:06:04,260
And yeah, it's a lot of material to read, but it's a lot

5553
04:06:04,260 --> 04:06:06,559
better reading now than it

5554
04:06:06,559 --> 04:06:08,000
used to be.

5555
04:06:08,000 --> 04:06:09,799
So I'm in support of it.

5556
04:06:09,799 --> 04:06:13,600
I do have one question, however, going through all of it.

5557
04:06:13,600 --> 04:06:17,649
This is on the proposed historic landmark commission

5558
04:06:17,649 --> 04:06:21,040
section as amended, because I do not recall

5559
04:06:21,040 --> 04:06:23,559
offhand what the old language was.

5560
04:06:23,559 --> 04:06:25,760
This is page one of that.

5561
04:06:25,760 --> 04:06:32,190
It says 35.4.3, the historic landmark commission A. This is

5562
04:06:32,190 --> 04:06:33,639
creating the commission and who

5563
04:06:33,639 --> 04:06:35,200
all should be it.

5564
04:06:35,200 --> 04:06:37,930
And they should include at least one representative from

5565
04:06:37,930 --> 04:06:39,920
each of the following organizations.

5566
04:06:39,920 --> 04:06:44,139
Number one is the county historical commission, and then if

5567
04:06:44,139 --> 04:06:46,639
you go down to C, number three,

5568
04:06:46,639 --> 04:06:50,139
these are the ex officio members, the chairperson of the

5569
04:06:50,139 --> 04:06:52,360
county historical commission.

5570
04:06:52,360 --> 04:06:56,159
I'm guessing that can't be the same person.

5571
04:06:56,159 --> 04:06:57,159
Is that correct?

5572
04:06:57,159 --> 04:06:58,959
That it cannot be the same person.

5573
04:06:58,959 --> 04:07:01,729
And then my other question would be, does the county

5574
04:07:01,729 --> 04:07:03,600
historical commission know that

5575
04:07:03,600 --> 04:07:06,590
it's supposed to have two representatives on the historic

5576
04:07:06,590 --> 04:07:07,959
landmark commission?

5577
04:07:07,959 --> 04:07:08,959
So that's it.

5578
04:07:08,959 --> 04:07:10,520
Thank you very much.

5579
04:07:10,520 --> 04:07:11,520
Okay.

5580
04:07:11,520 --> 04:07:13,239
Thank you for your comments.

5581
04:07:13,239 --> 04:07:14,239
Sure.

5582
04:07:14,239 --> 04:07:18,250
Rome, if you'd like to respond to that and just clarify

5583
04:07:18,250 --> 04:07:19,399
that for us.

5584
04:07:19,399 --> 04:07:24,200
Well, as far as having the two people, I'd have to kind of

5585
04:07:24,200 --> 04:07:26,680
more carefully read this.

5586
04:07:26,680 --> 04:07:31,719
Now, we don't have members of the county commission on our

5587
04:07:31,719 --> 04:07:32,639
board.

5588
04:07:32,639 --> 04:07:35,829
We have somebody from the county, the director of the

5589
04:07:35,829 --> 04:07:38,079
county museum is Peggy Riddle, and

5590
04:07:38,079 --> 04:07:39,639
she's been the chair.

5591
04:07:39,639 --> 04:07:44,600
I think that- Director of office in history, Colton.

5592
04:07:44,600 --> 04:07:46,719
Yes, that's right.

5593
04:07:46,719 --> 04:07:49,280
So there's included.

5594
04:07:49,280 --> 04:07:50,280
And then you have a phrase.

5595
04:07:50,280 --> 04:07:52,729
So as far as there being, I really can't answer this a lot

5596
04:07:52,729 --> 04:07:54,799
of clear, but real careful detail

5597
04:07:54,799 --> 04:07:57,770
here, but it sounds to me like in addition, it says here,

5598
04:07:57,770 --> 04:07:59,680
in addition to the nine members,

5599
04:07:59,680 --> 04:08:02,719
these three shall sit as ex officio members.

5600
04:08:02,719 --> 04:08:05,799
So we may need to recruit somebody from the county

5601
04:08:05,799 --> 04:08:08,520
commission to serve on the commission.

5602
04:08:08,520 --> 04:08:09,520
Yes.

5603
04:08:09,520 --> 04:08:13,729
I just wanted to add that this is the existing code

5604
04:08:13,729 --> 04:08:16,799
language that this is one of the items

5605
04:08:16,799 --> 04:08:17,799
that we did keep.

5606
04:08:17,799 --> 04:08:21,040
So it's not like we added new folks.

5607
04:08:21,040 --> 04:08:24,840
So this is from when the board was established.

5608
04:08:24,840 --> 04:08:27,600
So you're not the follow-up now.

5609
04:08:27,600 --> 04:08:28,600
Okay.

5610
04:08:28,600 --> 04:08:29,600
Again, it's ex officio.

5611
04:08:29,600 --> 04:08:31,239
So it's not that they have a- They don't have a vote.

5612
04:08:31,239 --> 04:08:41,799
They don't have a vote, so it's whether they sent it or not

5613
04:08:41,799 --> 04:08:42,520
.

5614
04:08:42,520 --> 04:08:45,120
We can work on recruiting on it.

5615
04:08:45,120 --> 04:08:48,280
That's not a problem.

5616
04:08:48,280 --> 04:08:49,280
Okay.

5617
04:08:49,280 --> 04:08:53,520
Thank you for the clarification.

5618
04:08:53,520 --> 04:08:59,920
Any other questions on this item?

5619
04:08:59,920 --> 04:09:02,860
Seeing no one else wishing to speak, I'm going to close the

5620
04:09:02,860 --> 04:09:04,319
public hearing and the floor

5621
04:09:04,319 --> 04:09:07,920
would entertain a motion or additional discussion.

5622
04:09:07,920 --> 04:09:09,280
Commissioner Ellis.

5623
04:09:09,280 --> 04:09:10,280
Thank you, Chair.

5624
04:09:10,280 --> 04:09:14,079
I will move to approve DCA 17.9.

5625
04:09:14,079 --> 04:09:15,079
And Roman, thank you very much.

5626
04:09:15,079 --> 04:09:17,799
I think you gave a great presentation and it sounds like

5627
04:09:17,799 --> 04:09:19,399
you had a great community input

5628
04:09:19,399 --> 04:09:20,399
on that.

5629
04:09:20,399 --> 04:09:22,079
So thank you.

5630
04:09:22,079 --> 04:09:23,579
Thank you.

5631
04:09:23,579 --> 04:09:24,579
Commissioner Sullivan.

5632
04:09:24,579 --> 04:09:25,579
Second that motion.

5633
04:09:25,579 --> 04:09:26,579
Okay.

5634
04:09:26,579 --> 04:09:29,040
We have a first and a second for approval.

5635
04:09:29,040 --> 04:09:30,040
Commissioner Roselle.

5636
04:09:30,040 --> 04:09:33,399
I was trying to motion or second this, but I was slow, so I

5637
04:09:33,399 --> 04:09:34,760
wasn't able to talk.

5638
04:09:34,760 --> 04:09:36,790
I just wanted to publicly thank Roman for all his work, too

5639
04:09:36,790 --> 04:09:37,000
.

5640
04:09:37,000 --> 04:09:40,280
And I see the photos of the dots and how they voted at all

5641
04:09:40,280 --> 04:09:42,159
these public meetings over the

5642
04:09:42,159 --> 04:09:44,000
past year and a half.

5643
04:09:44,000 --> 04:09:45,280
He continues to do stellar work.

5644
04:09:45,280 --> 04:09:46,280
I appreciate it, Roman.

5645
04:09:46,280 --> 04:09:51,399
And so I'm happy to support this.

5646
04:09:51,399 --> 04:09:56,520
Okay.

5647
04:09:56,520 --> 04:09:58,959
We have a first and a second.

5648
04:09:58,959 --> 04:10:00,360
Thank you again for all of your hard work.

5649
04:10:00,360 --> 04:10:12,079
And we'll call for a vote on the board for approval.

5650
04:10:12,079 --> 04:10:15,799
The motion carries 7-0.

5651
04:10:15,799 --> 04:10:24,569
That will move us to our concluding items in our project

5652
04:10:24,569 --> 04:10:27,680
matrix tonight.

5653
04:10:27,680 --> 04:10:28,680
Commissioner Ellis.

5654
04:10:28,680 --> 04:10:29,680
Thank you, Chair.

5655
04:10:29,680 --> 04:10:30,680
Real quick.

5656
04:10:30,680 --> 04:10:35,000
I'm just bringing this one up again because it's a concern

5657
04:10:35,000 --> 04:10:35,879
of mine.

5658
04:10:35,879 --> 04:10:41,159
We're supposed to have a workshop discussing what we can

5659
04:10:41,159 --> 04:10:44,159
discuss in work session versus

5660
04:10:44,159 --> 04:10:45,440
public meeting, that kind of a thing.

5661
04:10:45,440 --> 04:10:47,040
I think I brought it up back in January.

5662
04:10:47,040 --> 04:10:49,700
So just wanted to make sure it's not getting lost because I

5663
04:10:49,700 --> 04:10:51,440
think it needs to -- the discussion

5664
04:10:51,440 --> 04:10:52,440
needs to happen.

5665
04:10:52,440 --> 04:10:57,799
The workshop discussion needs to happen.

5666
04:10:57,799 --> 04:11:01,399
Just for you to understand, got clarification?

5667
04:11:01,399 --> 04:11:02,399
I do.

5668
04:11:02,399 --> 04:11:04,709
One thing I was going to add, I know some of these items

5669
04:11:04,709 --> 04:11:05,920
have been lingering for some

5670
04:11:05,920 --> 04:11:06,920
time.

5671
04:11:06,920 --> 04:11:11,510
My intention is at the 1129 meeting is to have a memo sort

5672
04:11:11,510 --> 04:11:13,559
of summarizing all of these

5673
04:11:13,559 --> 04:11:14,559
items.

5674
04:11:14,559 --> 04:11:17,159
I think some may have been addressed and just kind of have

5675
04:11:17,159 --> 04:11:17,959
been left on.

5676
04:11:17,959 --> 04:11:21,110
But I know there's new members, so I would rather just

5677
04:11:21,110 --> 04:11:23,200
address all of them, provide sort

5678
04:11:23,200 --> 04:11:26,260
of just a general write-up, and then if we need additional

5679
04:11:26,260 --> 04:11:27,879
information, we can kind of

5680
04:11:27,879 --> 04:11:28,879
go from there.

5681
04:11:28,879 --> 04:11:30,399
But I just don't like to have things lingering.

5682
04:11:30,399 --> 04:11:31,399
Okay.

5683
04:11:31,399 --> 04:11:34,260
So you're going to essentially take all of them, clean them

5684
04:11:34,260 --> 04:11:36,159
all up, and if for some reason

5685
04:11:36,159 --> 04:11:39,450
someone's question isn't addressed, then it can be put back

5686
04:11:39,450 --> 04:11:41,079
on Project Matrix for additional

5687
04:11:41,079 --> 04:11:42,079
discussion?

5688
04:11:42,079 --> 04:11:43,079
Correct.

5689
04:11:43,079 --> 04:11:44,079
If that's okay with everyone.

5690
04:11:44,079 --> 04:11:47,079
I think that sounds like a good idea.

5691
04:11:47,079 --> 04:11:48,079
Okay.

5692
04:11:48,079 --> 04:11:49,079
Anybody else?

5693
04:11:49,079 --> 04:11:50,079
Chair.

5694
04:11:50,079 --> 04:11:51,079
Commissioner Sullivan.

5695
04:11:51,079 --> 04:11:55,200
What is our end of the year meeting schedule?

5696
04:11:55,200 --> 04:11:58,799
Is that going to come out to us?

5697
04:11:58,799 --> 04:12:01,149
I think the next meeting we have actually is pushed until

5698
04:12:01,149 --> 04:12:02,680
after Thanksgiving, I believe,

5699
04:12:02,680 --> 04:12:03,680
on the calendar.

5700
04:12:03,680 --> 04:12:06,680
So the 22nd or the 29th?

5701
04:12:06,680 --> 04:12:07,680
I think it's the 29th.

5702
04:12:07,680 --> 04:12:10,829
And the second, and I guess the fifth week in December, is

5703
04:12:10,829 --> 04:12:11,680
that right?

5704
04:12:11,680 --> 04:12:14,280
I think there's only one, I think we only have one meeting

5705
04:12:14,280 --> 04:12:15,680
in December, if I recall.

5706
04:12:15,680 --> 04:12:16,680
Okay.

5707
04:12:16,680 --> 04:12:17,680
Okay.

5708
04:12:17,680 --> 04:12:18,680
Thank you.

5709
04:12:18,680 --> 04:12:19,680
Go over your 2018 schedule.

5710
04:12:19,680 --> 04:12:21,680
I was going to add.

5711
04:12:21,680 --> 04:12:22,680
The 13th.

5712
04:12:22,680 --> 04:12:23,680
Oh, okay.

5713
04:12:23,680 --> 04:12:24,680
The 13th of December.

5714
04:12:24,680 --> 04:12:25,680
The final meeting of the year?

5715
04:12:25,680 --> 04:12:26,680
We don't know.

5716
04:12:26,680 --> 04:12:27,680
No, we don't want to join on that.

5717
04:12:27,680 --> 04:12:31,979
The final meeting, but you'll get an account of the

5718
04:12:31,979 --> 04:12:34,680
November 29th meeting.

5719
04:12:34,680 --> 04:12:35,680
Okay.

5720
04:12:35,680 --> 04:12:36,680
Great.

5721
04:12:36,680 --> 04:12:37,680
All right.

5722
04:12:37,680 --> 04:12:38,680
Anybody else?

5723
04:12:38,680 --> 04:12:39,680
Okay.

5724
04:12:39,680 --> 04:12:46,680
With that, I'm just going to say it's 10 o'clock.

5725
04:12:46,680 --> 04:12:49,040
We'll close our meeting tonight.

5726
04:12:49,040 --> 04:12:49,639
Thank you, everyone.