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Zoning Commission work session for September the 27th 2017.

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This meeting's

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been duly posted and we do have a quorum present and I will

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call us to order at

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5 o 2 and at this time I will turn the meeting over to Ron

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for clarification

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of agenda items. Thank you chair. Before we get to the

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clarification for agenda

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items I wanted to take a few moments to introduce some

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staff members. First one

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is Scott McDonald our interim director of development

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services and then I'm

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gonna have Jerry introduce Victor since he... Sure from

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down in the proud city of

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McAllen Texas Victor Flores joins us as a deputy city

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attorney. Okay so the first

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one is a plaque and I'm gonna have Julie come up and make

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that presentation.

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Hey Julie before you get started I'm gonna need to recuse

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myself on this

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item A and since it's a consent agenda I'll probably just

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stay out of the next

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item as well just hopefully it'll go quickly and then I was

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going to ask

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because I have a second item which is unusual to have this

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many for me but

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item B I'll need to recuse myself on that so if you all

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want to take that in

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out of order and just follow the consent agenda and I'll

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just recuse myself for

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both of those items then come back so we don't have to do

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musical chairs of me

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here and gone and back and forth if that's okay. Yes.

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All right so this is a preliminary plot for a single-family

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residential

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subdivision it's Evers way it it is located on North Locust

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and this will be

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Hercules Lane and I'll stand for any questions that you

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have.

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Commissioner Sanchez.

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I'm gonna I'm gonna call Jim Jinx up with DRC engineering

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he can more fully

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explain here. Tristan Trail well you have Tristan Trail

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that's a that's a road

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straight right that goes lead right into Hercules okay okay

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I just wasn't sure

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because it also called it so all your utilities are coming

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on that on that

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road because I believe it called it an easement utility eas

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ement.

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I see a label for four foot electrical easement looks like

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it's just outside.

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Just outside. Joe can I ask you to go to the mic.

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Keep forgetting. Okay there's a four foot electrical eas

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ement just outside of each

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right of way and then typically for the city utilities

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water sewer storm typical

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sections those are within the street right of way. Okay

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okay.

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Commissioner Beck. Thank you Mr. Chair. Just along the same

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line Jim then when they start

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this development Hercules will be linked from where it ends

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there Locust over into

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that housing development you'll be able to take Hercules

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all the way from near

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Discovery Park to Sherman Drive. Would that be a good guess

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? This Evers way does

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not reach it by itself it does not reach far enough west to

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connect to the

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existing Hercules. It would connect to it would connect to

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Locust.

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We are going to widen we're going to take Hercules at least

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the length of the

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developer. Yes yes and we are in talks with the developer

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this this property as

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well as the adjacent property to the north whose frontage

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does extend further

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west and trying to work out an arrangement whereby the full

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width of

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Hercules is built the whole way for that connection. When

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they're working on this

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development? Yeah. As opposed to waiting for that area on

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the north. That's all

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that's a sort of all being discussed right now yeah and

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there are more or

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less at this point along with the DME substation kind of

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coming in the process

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together which is good. Okay thanks.

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Yes sir. I have another question. Commissioner Sanchez. Oh

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okay. On the here on the right side you have

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a two what is it? Can you pick it up a little bit? What's

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the name of that street?

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Locust. Go up a little bit. Oh this way? Yeah. Yes sir. 21

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64 and then you have

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Skeleton Street that comes it's inside that that subdiv

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ision is and I'm just

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curious it's becomes the exit is going to be where though

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the existing

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subdivision is it seems like is that correct? On to 2164?

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I was just curious. Okay it comes all the way down here.

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Okay right here. Okay.

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It seems like there's and I don't know if this if it's pert

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inent but it seems

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like that whole subdivision that they're building they're

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gonna have to come all

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the way down here is there is it pertinent to even ask if

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there should be

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another entry into 2164 so that it's all the all the

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traffic from this

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neighborhood it only has two exits and I'm just I don't

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know if that's part of

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this project would involve the connection of Hercules to 21

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64 and then

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they have an entrance shown off Hercules that Tristan Road.

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Right there's that exit

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right there going into Hercules and then the other one

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comes down Skeleton

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Road all the way down right and it comes in that that's a

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subdivision already

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exists so what I was my question is it seems like there's a

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lot of homes there

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you didn't have to go up to Hercules or have to come all

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the way down to exit

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out of that subdivision. I'm just curious. Can you explain

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the separation for roads

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and driveways for a subdivision? It seems like Mr. Sanchez

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is asking if there

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should there be a another entrance exit for this subdiv

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ision on 2164?

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Well I can tell you we've been in discussion with the

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applicant about a

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TIA to look at issues like that and you look at issues like

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turn lanes and to

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see what configuration would would work best. Some of that

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is not resolved here

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at the point of pruning plat and we don't really feel it

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has to be but it's

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certainly my final plat and it will be and we're in

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frequent discussions with

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the applicant about that with those concerns in mind.

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Commissioner Smith.

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Thank you Vice Chair. There is a response form with a woman

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who did request

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that she does not wish to sell. Can you give me quick

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clarification? Is there

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is there a purchasing happening here? That has to miss

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information on that. That

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actually has to do with one of the zoning cases that will

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be coming up. It

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lines up with I'm sorry it does. You're right. Apologies.

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Any other questions? Commissioner Sanchez.

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At the bottom you have what there I guess the right what do

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they call that?

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I can't I don't know. The water right there where those

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dotted lines are? Right

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here? A little bit to the left. Oh right here? Is that you

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have I guess some some

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ponds there, settlement ponds or something for that

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currently exist for

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the drainage? Is that is that correct? This is a drainage

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Eastman. Okay is that

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is that part of what was going to help the previous the McC

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amey Evers

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phase one and how is that going to affect if you if you get

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rid of those how

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are you going to take care of the drainage in that area in

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the other

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subdivision? I was assuming that's why they built those. I

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am not sure offhand

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what is in that easement now but there is a detention pond

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for McCamey Evers

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phase one down near their southern or southeast property

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corner and then we

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would be I believe that the drainage layout for phase two

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here basically

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connects to storm sewers that stub to the north property

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line of phase one

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that that would be tied to. So coming down the street I

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think Skeleton Way is

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one such street and as well as the Doris Drive here is my

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recollection. Okay. To

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clarify this is the preliminary plat so once this all gets

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vetted there'll be a

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final plat coming back to us for final approval? Yes. Okay.

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Yeah and as part of

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the final plat we review the construction plans so we give

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that a

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thorough look. Any other questions? Thank you very much Jim

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. So the next item is

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the preliminary plat for the Robeson Ranch unit 2-5. Julie

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would be making this

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presentation. So this this proposed preliminary plat is

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within the Robeson

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Ranch plan development and it is for a single-family

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residential development

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that is in accordance with the plan development

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requirements. It does meet

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the technical requirements as well not only for the

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engineering but also for

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the gas well the nearby gas wells as well. So I'll stand

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for any questions and

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Jim's here if you have any engineering ones. Commissioner

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Beck. Thank you Vice

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Chair. In relation to the gas wells I just was kind of

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confused the asterisk and on

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the notes down there it points out that the asterisk den

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otes those lots that are

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within a thousand feet of gas well drilling and production

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site and the

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measurement was like was in there was one inch for 200 feet

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so actually not

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all those lots are within 1,000 feet so I was wondering why

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they went ahead and

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marked them as such anyway. I can't answer that for that

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for the applicant. We have

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reviewed it and within this boundary line. That was my next

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question on the south side of

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Creekwood is the boundary line. Yes sir. Yeah and it seemed

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like all of Kirkwood

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would be eliminated if that were the boundary line using

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the measurement on

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the plat so I was just curious why that was there and since

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this is a preliminary

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plan we can probably deal with it later too. Yes sir. Okay

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thank you. Any other

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questions? Thank you Julie. I think Julie if we go ahead

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and move to the first

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public hearing item Z1713A. All right. Vice Chair yes we're

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gonna move to item B. Correct.

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Apologies. So that we can discuss this and then bring Chair

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Strange back for

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the first item. All right so I'm Julie Wyatt, senior

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planner at the city of Denton and

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I'm presenting Z1715 McKinney-Mayhill. So the request

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before you is to hold a

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public hearing and consider a read of making a

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recommendation regarding a

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rezoning on 73 acres from ECI district to CMG district.

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Just to orient you the

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site is located or situated in the east side of town at the

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corner of McKinney

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and Loop 288. Currently as a zoning designation of ECI it

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also has frontage

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along Loop 288, McKinney, Market Street and then also the

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future alignment of

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Mayhill. So there's quite a bit of access to the property.

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There's some

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existing development on the site so I just want to go over

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that briefly and

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just let you know what's going on on the site. So first of

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all there's an existing

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vacant building to the north and I believe that is being

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redeveloped as a

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community service use. There are also some warehouses to

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the south.

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Commissioner Beck. Thank you Vice Chair. On that building

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does not serve, didn't

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occupy part of that building? I believe it does. I think I

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saw that in the paper.

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Okay so in regards to that are they moving or will they be

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staying there?

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Commissioner Smith. Yes, Sir Denton does actually own that

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building now according to the

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to the past executive director and one of the board members

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Pat Smith. They do

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own it so that was actually gonna be a question of mine.

267
00:14:38,570 --> 00:14:40,159
They own that building

268
00:14:40,159 --> 00:14:44,200
now. They have not received notification nor have they

269
00:14:44,200 --> 00:14:44,720
talked to

270
00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:48,320
anybody talked to them whatsoever about the zoning issue.

271
00:14:48,320 --> 00:14:49,519
That was owned by the

272
00:14:49,519 --> 00:14:51,620
building was previously owned by the person who's

273
00:14:51,620 --> 00:14:52,879
requesting the rezoning as

274
00:14:52,879 --> 00:14:55,960
well so I don't know if that's been clarifiable or not but

275
00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:56,779
yes they do own

276
00:14:56,779 --> 00:14:59,860
it they're owning the entire building now correct.

277
00:14:59,860 --> 00:15:03,240
Commissioner Beck. Are they currently occupying the

278
00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:03,799
building?

279
00:15:03,799 --> 00:15:06,340
They're currently remodeling it yes. Okay so nobody's occup

280
00:15:06,340 --> 00:15:09,240
ying it right now but they do plan on getting a certificate

281
00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:10,159
of occupancy.

282
00:15:10,159 --> 00:15:13,639
Well those are some great comments and what I'll do is I

283
00:15:13,639 --> 00:15:14,279
can talk with the

284
00:15:14,279 --> 00:15:16,960
applicant before the regular meeting and get some

285
00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:19,320
clarification on that. There's

286
00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:23,159
also three warehouses on the on the site. There was a

287
00:15:23,159 --> 00:15:25,039
previous lumberyard I don't

288
00:15:25,039 --> 00:15:28,419
know if anybody remembers that in this location and there

289
00:15:28,419 --> 00:15:29,320
are some trees

290
00:15:29,320 --> 00:15:33,460
there's the heavily treed in the center part of the site

291
00:15:33,460 --> 00:15:34,559
and an environmentally

292
00:15:34,559 --> 00:15:37,370
sensitive area assessment will need to be done prior to

293
00:15:37,370 --> 00:15:38,679
development to determine

294
00:15:38,679 --> 00:15:42,039
if that tree area is upland habitat so that would happen at

295
00:15:42,039 --> 00:15:42,799
the development

296
00:15:42,799 --> 00:15:45,539
stage it's not really something considered at the plot at

297
00:15:45,539 --> 00:15:46,120
the zoning

298
00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:51,100
stage but it is something to that will be addressed in the

299
00:15:51,100 --> 00:15:53,200
future. So we look at

300
00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:57,039
the compatibility and the surrounding zoning and uses.

301
00:15:57,039 --> 00:15:58,120
First we look at what's

302
00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:02,220
immediately adjacent to the site so as we've talked about

303
00:16:02,220 --> 00:16:03,440
the subject property

304
00:16:03,440 --> 00:16:06,990
has an ECI zoning designation there's also some adjacent EC

305
00:16:06,990 --> 00:16:08,039
I there's some self

306
00:16:08,039 --> 00:16:11,399
storage included in that there's some office uses as well

307
00:16:11,399 --> 00:16:12,320
as some vehicle

308
00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:18,029
repair across McKinney there's CMG and CME and those areas

309
00:16:18,029 --> 00:16:19,039
are developed with

310
00:16:19,039 --> 00:16:23,080
commercial development and multifamily. In this area there

311
00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:24,399
's some NRMU zoning

312
00:16:24,399 --> 00:16:28,879
with developed with multifamily. As we zoom out a little

313
00:16:28,879 --> 00:16:31,399
further there are

314
00:16:31,399 --> 00:16:36,559
there's RD5X off to the east that has office some office

315
00:16:36,559 --> 00:16:37,960
use single family and

316
00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:42,639
also agriculture. NR2 is in this location developed with

317
00:16:42,639 --> 00:16:44,679
the school there's also

318
00:16:44,679 --> 00:16:48,429
NRMU 12 in this location with multifamily and then that

319
00:16:48,429 --> 00:16:49,120
there's a

320
00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:52,419
single-family residential neighborhood here which has an NR

321
00:16:52,419 --> 00:16:53,440
4 zoning district so

322
00:16:53,440 --> 00:17:00,970
there's quite a mix of uses in the area. And what I really

323
00:17:00,970 --> 00:17:02,399
want to focus on on

324
00:17:02,399 --> 00:17:05,400
this slide is mobility because it kind of affects not only

325
00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:06,400
the development of

326
00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:11,160
this type of the zoning so we've got several large roads in

327
00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:11,839
this area. First

328
00:17:11,839 --> 00:17:16,039
of all McKinney which is a secondary arterial. A secondary

329
00:17:16,039 --> 00:17:16,839
arterial is

330
00:17:16,839 --> 00:17:21,339
intended to move move citizens throughout different areas

331
00:17:21,339 --> 00:17:22,640
of the city.

332
00:17:22,640 --> 00:17:27,000
Also you've got an arterial here you've got the loop as

333
00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:28,680
most know it's kind of a

334
00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:31,809
commercial corridor especially in this area and arterials

335
00:17:31,809 --> 00:17:32,920
are intended to once

336
00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:36,390
again move people through the city and also into and out of

337
00:17:36,390 --> 00:17:37,519
the city so that's

338
00:17:37,519 --> 00:17:42,400
the intent of that arterial. We've also have collectors

339
00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:44,079
north of the subject

340
00:17:44,079 --> 00:17:49,140
property as well as Mills is a collector and then and then

341
00:17:49,140 --> 00:17:50,559
we have the future

342
00:17:50,559 --> 00:17:54,559
alignment of Mayhill and and it's it's not finished being

343
00:17:54,559 --> 00:17:55,920
built yet but it's

344
00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:59,960
going to affect this subject property as it's going to be

345
00:17:59,960 --> 00:18:01,319
adjacent to it. And I

346
00:18:01,319 --> 00:18:04,240
wanted to spend a little more time on Mayhill because it's

347
00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:04,920
going to be a

348
00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:09,859
pretty a pretty dominant road on that side of town at some

349
00:18:09,859 --> 00:18:10,759
point in the in the

350
00:18:10,759 --> 00:18:14,869
near future. So I zoomed out a little further and we can

351
00:18:14,869 --> 00:18:16,359
see this the subject

352
00:18:16,359 --> 00:18:21,039
property is this yellow star and and Mayhill is going to go

353
00:18:21,039 --> 00:18:22,200
continue north

354
00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:25,619
from the subject property and it will also connect to the

355
00:18:25,619 --> 00:18:27,440
south to 2499 at

356
00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:32,019
Teasley so it will link Denton to DFW Airport essentially

357
00:18:32,019 --> 00:18:32,599
so it's going to be

358
00:18:32,599 --> 00:18:38,730
a real regional thoroughfare. The Denton plan 2030

359
00:18:38,730 --> 00:18:40,559
identifies this area's

360
00:18:40,559 --> 00:18:43,680
community mixed use. A community mixed use is intended to

361
00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:44,799
promote a mix of uses

362
00:18:44,799 --> 00:18:48,079
primarily commercial but can have some office uses some

363
00:18:48,079 --> 00:18:48,880
multi-family those

364
00:18:48,880 --> 00:18:52,240
supporting uses. This future development should be

365
00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:53,640
developed in a commercial way

366
00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:57,460
and raise the standards of the site design. A typical

367
00:18:57,460 --> 00:18:59,000
development may include

368
00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:03,210
like a grocery store or drugstore especially shops maybe

369
00:19:03,210 --> 00:19:04,119
offices and

370
00:19:04,119 --> 00:19:08,160
employment uses and then uses within the proposed CMG

371
00:19:08,160 --> 00:19:09,960
district do align with this

372
00:19:09,960 --> 00:19:13,069
future land use so it is it does conform to that future

373
00:19:13,069 --> 00:19:17,519
land use designation. So

374
00:19:17,519 --> 00:19:22,359
so although the future the the request does conform to the

375
00:19:22,359 --> 00:19:23,960
future land use we

376
00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:26,859
did also look at the compatibility of the request and what

377
00:19:26,859 --> 00:19:27,880
's around the area.

378
00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:33,700
So staff does believe that DCG is or I'm sorry CMG is

379
00:19:33,700 --> 00:19:34,440
appropriate in this

380
00:19:34,440 --> 00:19:37,289
location because it permits commercial development that's

381
00:19:37,289 --> 00:19:38,240
typically found on

382
00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:41,839
arterial roadways so you can see that there is going to be

383
00:19:41,839 --> 00:19:43,480
access not only from

384
00:19:43,480 --> 00:19:46,279
loop 288 and McKinney but also from Mayhill so this is the

385
00:19:46,279 --> 00:19:47,119
type of development

386
00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:52,559
you typically see on arterials. CMG would develop with a

387
00:19:52,559 --> 00:19:54,440
commercial character

388
00:19:54,440 --> 00:19:57,380
prohibiting the uses and design character that's allowed

389
00:19:57,380 --> 00:19:58,000
under current

390
00:19:58,000 --> 00:20:00,440
zoning. Undercurrent zoning is more of one of our more

391
00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:01,359
industrial zoning

392
00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:05,829
districts and so if it developed under current zoning it's

393
00:20:05,829 --> 00:20:06,920
more industrial uses

394
00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:10,549
and could be developed with an industrial character and

395
00:20:10,549 --> 00:20:11,680
this is kind of

396
00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:16,119
a large corridor that's going to bring a lot of commercial

397
00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:16,920
development so

398
00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:22,380
staff doesn't feel that ECI is is appropriate in this area

399
00:20:22,380 --> 00:20:23,480
considering the

400
00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:27,619
access and the visibility. CMG is a logical extension of

401
00:20:27,619 --> 00:20:28,599
the existing zoning

402
00:20:28,599 --> 00:20:32,089
as you can see in the map in the bottom it might be small

403
00:20:32,089 --> 00:20:33,400
but all of the other

404
00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:37,960
corners of loop 288 and McKinney do have that CMG zoning so

405
00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:38,400
this would really

406
00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:42,990
just complete that intersection. The existing and future

407
00:20:42,990 --> 00:20:43,779
road network

408
00:20:43,779 --> 00:20:46,069
provides the access that you typically want to see for

409
00:20:46,069 --> 00:20:46,759
commercial development

410
00:20:46,759 --> 00:20:51,369
but we do want to be sensitive to the nearby neighborhoods

411
00:20:51,369 --> 00:20:52,240
and so when you see

412
00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:56,339
that existing those arterials that surround the subject

413
00:20:56,339 --> 00:20:56,960
property they do

414
00:20:56,960 --> 00:20:59,930
provide that physical separation between any commercial

415
00:20:59,930 --> 00:21:00,839
uses that would be

416
00:21:00,839 --> 00:21:03,390
developed there and the nearby neighborhoods so to provide

417
00:21:03,390 --> 00:21:03,920
that buffer

418
00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:07,720
and a little little mitigation between any potential nuis

419
00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:09,880
ances. Notification was

420
00:21:09,880 --> 00:21:13,569
sent out we've received two in favor I did provide sorry I

421
00:21:13,569 --> 00:21:14,200
stapled them

422
00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:17,490
together and I believe though the the responses that I

423
00:21:17,490 --> 00:21:18,640
received for this

424
00:21:18,640 --> 00:21:23,140
project are at the back and there were two of them that I

425
00:21:23,140 --> 00:21:25,200
received so based

426
00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:27,940
upon the criteria for approval and the future land use and

427
00:21:27,940 --> 00:21:28,559
the debt and

428
00:21:28,559 --> 00:21:30,710
development code staff does recommend approval of your

429
00:21:30,710 --> 00:21:32,319
request and I'll stand

430
00:21:32,319 --> 00:21:40,119
for any questions. Commissioner Smith. What is the current

431
00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:42,400
RL right away on McKinney

432
00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:46,990
there bordering the proposed zoning change and if McKinney

433
00:21:46,990 --> 00:21:47,599
ever does get

434
00:21:47,599 --> 00:21:49,960
expanded will that our way be big enough to be able to

435
00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:51,160
allow for the type of in

436
00:21:51,160 --> 00:21:53,750
flow that you're looking for by changing the zoning? Well

437
00:21:53,750 --> 00:21:55,880
when it if and when it

438
00:21:55,880 --> 00:21:59,309
develops platting would be required and typically we have

439
00:21:59,309 --> 00:22:00,519
additional right-of-way

440
00:22:00,519 --> 00:22:04,269
dedication that comes in with the replatting so and

441
00:22:04,269 --> 00:22:05,720
perimeter street

442
00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:10,089
improvements so that type of improvement to McKinney would

443
00:22:10,089 --> 00:22:11,119
come at the time of

444
00:22:11,119 --> 00:22:19,829
development. There's a northeast residence up there on McK

445
00:22:19,829 --> 00:22:20,680
inney I was

446
00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:26,359
about to Google the address of one of the folks who replied

447
00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:27,839
I think they were

448
00:22:27,839 --> 00:22:32,359
on they're on Fawn Drive but if you look on the map there

449
00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:33,279
if you're able to see

450
00:22:33,279 --> 00:22:38,960
that just south of Saffron along May Hill it's a long

451
00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:40,880
driveway backwards it's a

452
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:43,220
single-family it looks like a single family when I drove up

453
00:22:43,220 --> 00:22:43,839
to the side it

454
00:22:43,839 --> 00:22:46,400
looks like a single-family residence is that going to be

455
00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:47,359
impacted at all by the

456
00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:51,019
changing of the zoning in any way? I'm sorry but when you

457
00:22:51,019 --> 00:22:52,039
said it's off of

458
00:22:52,039 --> 00:22:55,339
McKinney in this off of May Hill I apologize. May Hill so

459
00:22:55,339 --> 00:22:56,880
is it right there to the

460
00:22:56,880 --> 00:23:00,240
left of your mouse? Right right here? Go down just a little

461
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:01,079
bit right there that

462
00:23:01,079 --> 00:23:04,589
area if there's a single-family residence right there off

463
00:23:04,589 --> 00:23:05,319
May Hill that

464
00:23:05,319 --> 00:23:08,039
will be in that development is there? That's a part of the

465
00:23:08,039 --> 00:23:09,160
request and so it

466
00:23:09,160 --> 00:23:12,930
would I would and the applicant it will be here to answer

467
00:23:12,930 --> 00:23:13,960
any questions specific

468
00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:17,609
to the future development so they could probably provide a

469
00:23:17,609 --> 00:23:18,400
little more

470
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:20,750
information about what's going to happen to those those

471
00:23:20,750 --> 00:23:23,599
residences there now.

472
00:23:23,599 --> 00:23:27,279
That's it. I'm done Commissioner. Thank you. Any other

473
00:23:27,279 --> 00:23:33,970
questions? Julie does the property owner can you help me

474
00:23:33,970 --> 00:23:34,240
out with the

475
00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:38,059
applicant does is everything in the yellow box belong to

476
00:23:38,059 --> 00:23:39,680
the property owner?

477
00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:42,829
That was that is my understanding but I can certainly

478
00:23:42,829 --> 00:23:44,240
confirm with them because

479
00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:48,539
if we'll need to confirm that because it's not the case

480
00:23:48,539 --> 00:23:49,519
then if they don't

481
00:23:49,519 --> 00:23:52,190
own all that property within the yellow box they can't

482
00:23:52,190 --> 00:23:53,359
request a rezone of that

483
00:23:53,359 --> 00:23:56,960
property can they? Well and for instance this corner right

484
00:23:56,960 --> 00:23:58,000
here on seven oh this

485
00:23:58,000 --> 00:24:02,250
this is owned by 7-eleven staff did want this to come into

486
00:24:02,250 --> 00:24:03,200
the request because we

487
00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:05,210
didn't want to create an isolated zoning district by rez

488
00:24:05,210 --> 00:24:06,240
oning everything around

489
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:10,109
it and so we did have to get 7-eleven's approval to move

490
00:24:10,109 --> 00:24:11,079
forward with the

491
00:24:11,079 --> 00:24:14,650
rezoning so yes if you they would have to have approval

492
00:24:14,650 --> 00:24:16,319
from property owners if

493
00:24:16,319 --> 00:24:20,119
they did not own that property. And who's the

494
00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:23,039
responsibility on to document such

495
00:24:23,039 --> 00:24:28,059
permission? It's a part of the application so it's provided

496
00:24:28,059 --> 00:24:28,200
by the

497
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:31,430
applicant. Can we have that verified before the public

498
00:24:31,430 --> 00:24:32,200
session about those

499
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:38,279
properties? Absolutely absolutely. Thank you. Any other

500
00:24:38,279 --> 00:24:40,720
questions on this item?

501
00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:46,279
Thank You Julie. Sure. We can invite chair back.

502
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:05,200
, please.

503
00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:45,200
[inaudible]

504
00:25:45,200 --> 00:26:13,200
[inaudible]

505
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:19,960
All right so you're in a go with A now. Yes. I'm going to

506
00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:22,559
ask Julie White to come back and

507
00:26:22,559 --> 00:26:29,450
present the item for Justice Plaza. All right so we have

508
00:26:29,450 --> 00:26:31,160
another proposed

509
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:35,029
rezoning on kind of on the east side of town. So this

510
00:26:35,029 --> 00:26:37,079
request is to rezone

511
00:26:37,079 --> 00:26:43,369
approximately 3.2 acres from NR 6 to NRMU 12. The subject

512
00:26:43,369 --> 00:26:44,359
property like I

513
00:26:44,359 --> 00:26:47,009
said is on the east side of town. It's north of McKinney

514
00:26:47,009 --> 00:26:47,880
and east of Janney

515
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,769
Street in this yellow box. Just to orient you this is the

516
00:26:51,769 --> 00:26:52,599
Denton County

517
00:26:52,599 --> 00:26:58,900
courthouse. So this property was part of a rezoning that

518
00:26:58,900 --> 00:27:01,559
happened in 2014 that

519
00:27:01,559 --> 00:27:06,319
rezoned this entire a seven acre tract from NR 4 to a mix

520
00:27:06,319 --> 00:27:07,680
of zoning districts

521
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:12,920
that included NR 6, NRMU 12, and NRMU. It was a part of a

522
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:14,119
comprehensive mixed use

523
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:18,900
plan that included office, retail, and some restaurants,

524
00:27:18,900 --> 00:27:20,119
and some cluster

525
00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:24,119
moderate density housing to the north or on the subject

526
00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:26,039
property which is why the

527
00:27:26,039 --> 00:27:31,369
zoning lines are a little different. Once again we'll look

528
00:27:31,369 --> 00:27:31,960
at the

529
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:34,509
compatibility. First what's most adjacent to the site and

530
00:27:34,509 --> 00:27:36,880
then we'll zoom out. So

531
00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:40,029
first of all surrounding the subject property to the north

532
00:27:40,029 --> 00:27:40,920
and the east and

533
00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:44,839
the west you have NR 4 district which is developed with

534
00:27:44,839 --> 00:27:45,559
single-family

535
00:27:45,559 --> 00:27:48,269
residential uses. This is an established neighborhood that

536
00:27:48,269 --> 00:27:49,039
's been there quite

537
00:27:49,039 --> 00:27:53,039
some time. To the south of this subject property is NRMU 12

538
00:27:53,039 --> 00:27:54,279
and that has a

539
00:27:54,279 --> 00:27:59,740
single-family residence on it developed on it and then NRMU

540
00:27:59,740 --> 00:28:00,759
adjacent to

541
00:28:00,759 --> 00:28:05,839
McKinney right here has some office uses developed. Across

542
00:28:05,839 --> 00:28:07,279
McKinney you've got the

543
00:28:07,279 --> 00:28:09,269
Denton County courthouse and some other government

544
00:28:09,269 --> 00:28:11,400
buildings. As we move out a

545
00:28:11,400 --> 00:28:16,519
little further we've got additional commercial space

546
00:28:16,519 --> 00:28:18,720
brought in on the on

547
00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:23,079
McKinney. CMG has some additional government as well as

548
00:28:23,079 --> 00:28:23,920
commercial office

549
00:28:23,920 --> 00:28:28,359
and some multi-family development and then you can see that

550
00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:29,119
that neighborhood

551
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,380
comes into focus as you zoom out. You can see it's a it's a

552
00:28:32,380 --> 00:28:32,720
fairly large

553
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:37,410
neighborhood. We'll look at the mobility of the area. We've

554
00:28:37,410 --> 00:28:38,920
got two roadway types

555
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:42,130
that are dominant on this map. First you've got your

556
00:28:42,130 --> 00:28:44,079
secondary arterials that

557
00:28:44,079 --> 00:28:48,329
is McKinney right here it's this in green. Once again this

558
00:28:48,329 --> 00:28:49,759
is a road that is

559
00:28:49,759 --> 00:28:52,990
intended to move our residents through the city to

560
00:28:52,990 --> 00:28:54,720
different parts of the city

561
00:28:54,720 --> 00:29:00,799
in a quick fashion. You also have Woodrow and Audra here

562
00:29:00,799 --> 00:29:02,039
also a secondary

563
00:29:02,039 --> 00:29:05,779
arterial. You've also got some collector streets. Paisley

564
00:29:05,779 --> 00:29:07,920
to the north connects to

565
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:13,119
Audra as well as goes further west of it and then you have

566
00:29:13,119 --> 00:29:14,319
Riddell Street which

567
00:29:14,319 --> 00:29:18,640
goes all the way up to Mingo. Jani which is adjacent to the

568
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:19,480
subject property is

569
00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:23,180
also considered excuse me to be a collector primarily

570
00:29:23,180 --> 00:29:24,079
because of the

571
00:29:24,079 --> 00:29:27,799
number of single-family residential uses that are on the

572
00:29:27,799 --> 00:29:29,160
that are located on the

573
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:33,259
street as well as some of the commercial zoning that's near

574
00:29:33,259 --> 00:29:34,480
to McKinney but as

575
00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:40,160
you can see it really doesn't function as a collector

576
00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:41,400
street because

577
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:44,490
it's got more of a residential nature on the north side of

578
00:29:44,490 --> 00:29:46,200
it also because it

579
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,559
dead ends at Paisley it doesn't directly connect to other

580
00:29:49,559 --> 00:29:51,799
arterials so it's it

581
00:29:51,799 --> 00:29:58,160
doesn't provide a lot of connectivity. The subject property

582
00:29:58,160 --> 00:29:59,440
is considered low

583
00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:02,799
residential per the Dent Plan 2030 that's the future land

584
00:30:02,799 --> 00:30:03,720
use designation

585
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:07,470
for the subject property. Low residential is intended to be

586
00:30:07,470 --> 00:30:07,799
single

587
00:30:07,799 --> 00:30:11,220
family uses for a maximum density of one to four dwelling

588
00:30:11,220 --> 00:30:13,380
units per acre. So when

589
00:30:13,380 --> 00:30:15,829
you think a low residential within the Dent Plan 2030 you

590
00:30:15,829 --> 00:30:16,480
kind of think of

591
00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:20,250
suburban type development. Single-family neighborhoods that

592
00:30:20,250 --> 00:30:20,880
are that are distinct

593
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:24,480
and that are attacked that are connect to the city with

594
00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:25,759
limited access to

595
00:30:25,759 --> 00:30:29,319
arterials so that's that's really what the intent is. NRMU

596
00:30:29,319 --> 00:30:31,519
12 does not conform

597
00:30:31,519 --> 00:30:35,029
to this future land use designation because it permits some

598
00:30:35,029 --> 00:30:36,039
commercial uses

599
00:30:36,039 --> 00:30:38,849
as well as it has a maximum density of 12 dwelling units

600
00:30:38,849 --> 00:30:39,920
per acre so it's more

601
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:46,559
of a moderate density zoning district. So when a rezoning

602
00:30:46,559 --> 00:30:47,119
doesn't

603
00:30:47,119 --> 00:30:50,769
conform to the future land use staff takes takes a little

604
00:30:50,769 --> 00:30:51,920
closer look a

605
00:30:51,920 --> 00:30:55,200
little more scrutiny is applied to the case in order to

606
00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:56,240
ensure that any

607
00:30:56,240 --> 00:31:00,339
request would conform to the character of the area and and

608
00:31:00,339 --> 00:31:01,599
be compatible with

609
00:31:01,599 --> 00:31:06,400
the existing uses. So and we did and we we perform that

610
00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:07,160
analysis for this

611
00:31:07,160 --> 00:31:09,829
request. So as you can see that this site is situated in

612
00:31:09,829 --> 00:31:11,180
the center of an existing

613
00:31:11,180 --> 00:31:14,109
established neighborhood. The development pattern around it

614
00:31:14,109 --> 00:31:14,240
is

615
00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:20,059
consistently low density single-family dwellings and and

616
00:31:20,059 --> 00:31:21,160
this neighborhood

617
00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:24,990
derives its protection from that that current zoning

618
00:31:24,990 --> 00:31:26,920
pattern. So as you can see

619
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:31,299
the map on the bottom this is all in our four so if and

620
00:31:31,299 --> 00:31:32,039
when any

621
00:31:32,039 --> 00:31:35,269
redevelopment occurred within this area it would have to

622
00:31:35,269 --> 00:31:36,160
redevelop in a

623
00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:40,650
single-family way consistent with what is already already

624
00:31:40,650 --> 00:31:41,799
in place so it's it

625
00:31:41,799 --> 00:31:45,680
conforms to it. An extension of NRMU 12 into this

626
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:47,039
neighborhood would introduce

627
00:31:47,039 --> 00:31:50,400
new uses new commercial uses and a higher density than what

628
00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:51,319
is existing and

629
00:31:51,319 --> 00:31:56,559
so it would really be inconsistent with what's surrounding

630
00:31:56,559 --> 00:31:58,960
it. Under the current

631
00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:02,730
zoning NR6 provides a nice transition between that lower

632
00:32:02,730 --> 00:32:04,079
density NR4 and

633
00:32:04,079 --> 00:32:06,750
then the higher intensity development that you typically

634
00:32:06,750 --> 00:32:07,680
want to see along the

635
00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:12,220
secondary arterial like McKinney. So that staff is in

636
00:32:12,220 --> 00:32:13,400
agreement with this

637
00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:16,660
existing zoning pattern in order to provide a gradual

638
00:32:16,660 --> 00:32:17,960
transition not only

639
00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:21,339
transitioning up to the higher intensity development on the

640
00:32:21,339 --> 00:32:22,000
road but also

641
00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:24,579
transitioning from the road into those single-family

642
00:32:24,579 --> 00:32:26,920
neighborhoods. This current

643
00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:29,609
zoning pattern could encourage a thoughtfully mixed use

644
00:32:29,609 --> 00:32:30,039
develop a

645
00:32:30,039 --> 00:32:33,170
thoughtfully designed mixed-use development that could

646
00:32:33,170 --> 00:32:33,920
bring in some

647
00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:36,769
compatible compatible uses and also just some moderate

648
00:32:36,769 --> 00:32:38,319
density housing within

649
00:32:38,319 --> 00:32:42,240
this area. Now the applicant has proposed a mixed-use

650
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:43,720
residential protection

651
00:32:43,720 --> 00:32:47,559
overlay to address some of these compatibility issues

652
00:32:47,559 --> 00:32:48,099
through some

653
00:32:48,099 --> 00:32:52,000
design consideration and staff looked at that but we really

654
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:53,200
feel that the

655
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:55,779
incompatibilities are coming from the uses that

656
00:32:55,779 --> 00:32:57,440
introduction of the commercial

657
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:00,359
development within that existing neighborhood that really

658
00:33:00,359 --> 00:33:01,039
creates that

659
00:33:01,039 --> 00:33:03,549
conflict between those uses and so the design

660
00:33:03,549 --> 00:33:05,200
considerations we feel just

661
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:09,609
aren't sufficient and that the current zoning should stay

662
00:33:09,609 --> 00:33:11,799
in place. Public

663
00:33:11,799 --> 00:33:15,390
notification was sent out on the property we have received

664
00:33:15,390 --> 00:33:16,279
some letters

665
00:33:16,279 --> 00:33:19,940
in opposition I believe you have eight in front of you not

666
00:33:19,940 --> 00:33:21,559
all of those were

667
00:33:21,559 --> 00:33:24,609
within the 200 foot boundary I believe only three of them

668
00:33:24,609 --> 00:33:25,640
so right now we're at

669
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:30,099
5.8% opposition and this map kind of shows you who was in

670
00:33:30,099 --> 00:33:34,799
that that within

671
00:33:34,799 --> 00:33:37,930
that 200 foot boundary we've also received two letters in

672
00:33:37,930 --> 00:33:38,839
favor of the

673
00:33:38,839 --> 00:33:43,859
request so based yes sir. Commissioner back. Thank you

674
00:33:43,859 --> 00:33:45,920
chair. Going back to that overlay I

675
00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:50,299
noticed in the background material you indicated that that

676
00:33:50,299 --> 00:33:51,599
information the

677
00:33:51,599 --> 00:33:55,430
things they wanted to do to gain favorability the applicant

678
00:33:55,430 --> 00:33:55,799
that

679
00:33:55,799 --> 00:33:59,299
information did not go out in the notification but they had

680
00:33:59,299 --> 00:34:00,039
a meeting a

681
00:34:00,039 --> 00:34:03,250
neighborhood meeting I believe on in July. Yes sir. Was

682
00:34:03,250 --> 00:34:04,640
that discussed was that

683
00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:07,640
overlay discussed at that meeting? There was a potential

684
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:08,880
for overlay discussed at

685
00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:11,369
that meeting to address some of those site design

686
00:34:11,369 --> 00:34:12,599
considerations so it was

687
00:34:12,599 --> 00:34:16,170
something that the applicant did bring up that they would

688
00:34:16,170 --> 00:34:16,360
be that they would be

689
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:20,199
open to and would consider putting on the site but nothing

690
00:34:20,199 --> 00:34:21,360
nothing definitive

691
00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:24,829
was was presented at that neighborhood meeting at that time

692
00:34:24,829 --> 00:34:26,599
. Oh on considering

693
00:34:26,599 --> 00:34:29,230
the overlay and some of the things they would do okay so

694
00:34:29,230 --> 00:34:31,440
when they are at least

695
00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:35,219
the ones we received that opposes project they really didn

696
00:34:35,219 --> 00:34:36,079
't have a lot of

697
00:34:36,079 --> 00:34:42,250
information about what the overlay would do. Correct. Yes

698
00:34:42,250 --> 00:34:43,480
sir. Thank you. So based upon the

699
00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:46,489
future land use designation in the Denton plan and the

700
00:34:46,489 --> 00:34:47,360
goals that are

701
00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:50,960
associated with that low density residential future land

702
00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:51,679
use and the

703
00:34:51,679 --> 00:34:56,480
character in the compatibility of a rezoning to NRMU 12

704
00:34:56,480 --> 00:34:58,199
staff recommends

705
00:34:58,199 --> 00:35:00,769
denial of the request based upon those factors and I'll

706
00:35:00,769 --> 00:35:02,519
stand for any questions.

707
00:35:02,519 --> 00:35:06,690
Commissioner Ellis. Thank you Chair. Julie it seems to be

708
00:35:06,690 --> 00:35:07,920
the same owner that owns

709
00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:11,960
all of that land is there a reason that they gave you why

710
00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:13,559
they're not doing this

711
00:35:13,559 --> 00:35:16,409
development at the front where it would be allowed to be

712
00:35:16,409 --> 00:35:17,559
without a zoning change?

713
00:35:17,559 --> 00:35:22,440
They are proposing to develop the the southern part the

714
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:24,679
front part of the the

715
00:35:24,679 --> 00:35:30,730
land as as it is zoned they however and the applicants here

716
00:35:30,730 --> 00:35:30,960
and they could

717
00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:33,539
probably address this further but what they what they have

718
00:35:33,539 --> 00:35:34,400
presented to me is

719
00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:37,559
that they would like to continue that office type

720
00:35:37,559 --> 00:35:38,920
development to to include

721
00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:41,590
the whole seven acre tract. Okay so basically have it be

722
00:35:41,590 --> 00:35:42,400
one development

723
00:35:42,400 --> 00:35:46,789
from the from the south part. Okay thank you. Commissioner

724
00:35:46,789 --> 00:35:48,440
Smith. And the

725
00:35:48,440 --> 00:35:54,170
definition of NR6 says that there is the allowance for some

726
00:35:54,170 --> 00:35:55,079
supportive

727
00:35:55,079 --> 00:35:59,559
commercial uses. Is that definition of NR6 what's currently

728
00:35:59,559 --> 00:36:00,320
zoned? Can you

729
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:03,239
help help define what that means by by some supportive

730
00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:04,440
commercial uses? I'm

731
00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:06,280
looking here at the just with the planning and zoning

732
00:36:06,280 --> 00:36:06,760
department of city

733
00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:10,039
of Denton is what it says for NR6. Hold on let me get my

734
00:36:10,039 --> 00:36:10,960
staff report.

735
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:13,960
Make sure I'm looking at the right thing.

736
00:36:25,400 --> 00:36:25,909
If you could direct me to where you're looking in that way

737
00:36:25,909 --> 00:36:29,039
I can make sure.

738
00:36:29,039 --> 00:36:32,079
Commissioner Rossell helped it's just very limited it just

739
00:36:32,079 --> 00:36:33,119
the definition here

740
00:36:33,119 --> 00:36:37,260
is very general but the actual use list now helped answer

741
00:36:37,260 --> 00:36:38,920
my question. Okay great

742
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:45,000
thank you. Commissioner Rossell. Thank you chair. Can you

743
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:46,239
help with the history of

744
00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:55,519
the properties being zoned? MRU 12. I mean do you have a

745
00:36:55,519 --> 00:36:56,639
timeline of when that was

746
00:36:56,639 --> 00:37:01,869
done or? That was done in 2014. Was the NR6 also done in

747
00:37:01,869 --> 00:37:04,480
2014? Yes sir. The entire

748
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:07,969
seven acre tract was part of a rezoning request that rez

749
00:37:07,969 --> 00:37:11,000
oned it from the NR4 to

750
00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:15,449
to these three zoning districts and the applicant at that

751
00:37:15,449 --> 00:37:16,800
time presented a

752
00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:21,110
concept that included some retail and and maybe some

753
00:37:21,110 --> 00:37:22,679
restaurants or drive

754
00:37:22,679 --> 00:37:27,400
through uses here along McKinney transitioning to office

755
00:37:27,400 --> 00:37:29,320
uses in this NRM

756
00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:35,059
U12 and then a cluster home type development in the NR6 so

757
00:37:35,059 --> 00:37:35,840
it was it was

758
00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:38,599
kind of a comprehensively planned mixed-use development.

759
00:37:38,599 --> 00:37:39,079
That sounds like a

760
00:37:39,079 --> 00:37:43,000
great idea in 2014. Is it the same property owner coming

761
00:37:43,000 --> 00:37:44,639
back now? It is a

762
00:37:44,639 --> 00:37:48,489
new no it is a new developer who would like to do something

763
00:37:48,489 --> 00:37:49,800
different with the

764
00:37:49,800 --> 00:37:54,159
site. Okay thank you. Sure. Commissioner Beck. Thank you

765
00:37:54,159 --> 00:37:55,920
chair. The house that

766
00:37:55,920 --> 00:37:58,969
seems to be about right in the middle of the area on Je

767
00:37:58,969 --> 00:38:00,239
annie Street is that

768
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:04,670
property is that the owner of this property of this seven

769
00:38:04,670 --> 00:38:05,679
acre tract? There

770
00:38:05,679 --> 00:38:10,480
is the owner yes on this seven acre tract is I don't know

771
00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:11,679
if he lives on that.

772
00:38:11,679 --> 00:38:15,360
I'm not sure. It's a residence though? I believe so it is

773
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:16,440
still a residence yes

774
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:21,039
sir. That's my understanding. Okay thanks. Commissioner

775
00:38:21,039 --> 00:38:22,440
Smith. Jeannie

776
00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:26,320
Street's in pretty terrible condition if anybody's gone out

777
00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:27,519
there. I know we're

778
00:38:27,519 --> 00:38:29,530
talking specifically about zoning not to talk about plat

779
00:38:29,530 --> 00:38:31,960
ting right now but with a

780
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:35,599
new zoning extending that type of commercial use backwards

781
00:38:35,599 --> 00:38:37,199
is there some

782
00:38:37,199 --> 00:38:40,670
sort of quality of street that we have to abide by in the

783
00:38:40,670 --> 00:38:41,599
future that that

784
00:38:41,599 --> 00:38:43,280
that would have to be repaired before you're allowed to

785
00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:43,960
have commercial use

786
00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:46,440
used that far back? Does that question make sense? It does

787
00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:47,119
make sense. Thank you.

788
00:38:47,119 --> 00:38:50,340
Yes during the platting and development stage and a

789
00:38:50,340 --> 00:38:51,880
developer would have to

790
00:38:51,880 --> 00:38:55,289
under current requirements would have to improve the

791
00:38:55,289 --> 00:38:57,960
perimeter streets for their

792
00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:05,230
side and their section so so half of Jeannie Street and up

793
00:39:05,230 --> 00:39:06,760
to wherever the

794
00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:10,460
development stops would have to provide improvements and

795
00:39:10,460 --> 00:39:12,960
Jim is nodding so I

796
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:16,239
said it right.

797
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:31,559
Anything else? I'll ask a question of staff. They put an

798
00:39:31,559 --> 00:39:32,840
overlay on here and reading

799
00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:36,360
through the overlay it looks to be that they've actually

800
00:39:36,360 --> 00:39:38,000
reduced some of the

801
00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:43,460
things that are allowed as far as heights as far as set

802
00:39:43,460 --> 00:39:45,159
backs that you could

803
00:39:45,159 --> 00:39:53,239
do in NR6. It seems just as a question even though you may

804
00:39:53,239 --> 00:39:55,440
not like the zoning

805
00:39:55,440 --> 00:39:59,489
request the actual restrictions restrict the property more

806
00:39:59,489 --> 00:40:00,280
than what they could

807
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:06,590
do there now and so I guess the question is are we looking

808
00:40:06,590 --> 00:40:07,440
at it just because

809
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:10,849
it's a zoning classification or are we looking at it what

810
00:40:10,849 --> 00:40:12,000
can you build there

811
00:40:12,000 --> 00:40:16,099
with an overlay that it's actually probably less intense

812
00:40:16,099 --> 00:40:17,320
and impactful to

813
00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:21,840
the surrounding neighborhood versus I don't like it being

814
00:40:21,840 --> 00:40:23,800
in our MU12. Well

815
00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:28,840
NR6 without the overlay is actually more intensive than

816
00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:29,000
what

817
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:31,849
they're proposing so they're kind of doing a give us a

818
00:40:31,849 --> 00:40:33,639
little bit and make

819
00:40:33,639 --> 00:40:36,369
our deal work and we'll take some stuff away. Is that a

820
00:40:36,369 --> 00:40:38,400
fair? They have proposed

821
00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:41,969
those those limitations on scale of development and we

822
00:40:41,969 --> 00:40:43,320
looked at that and we

823
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:46,119
just felt that the incompatibilities came not from

824
00:40:46,119 --> 00:40:47,519
necessarily the scale in

825
00:40:47,519 --> 00:40:52,110
NRME 12 but more of the uses that those commercial uses in

826
00:40:52,110 --> 00:40:53,480
the center of an

827
00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:59,559
existing neighborhood. Well I've got to hear that

828
00:40:59,559 --> 00:41:01,760
mechanical units have to be a

829
00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:08,760
hundred feet away from adjacent properties and in NR6 this

830
00:41:08,760 --> 00:41:10,920
50 by 120

831
00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:15,449
lot so I mean they've got to have all that stuff a hundred

832
00:41:15,449 --> 00:41:16,480
feet away whereas

833
00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:20,280
you could have it right next door if you built houses there

834
00:41:20,280 --> 00:41:23,400
so I'm gonna push a

835
00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:26,539
little bit I'm I understand the argument of it being

836
00:41:26,539 --> 00:41:29,079
existing neighborhood but I

837
00:41:29,079 --> 00:41:31,840
think there needs to be some consideration when they put an

838
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:32,239
overlay

839
00:41:32,239 --> 00:41:36,030
district that really caps what they're asking for that

840
00:41:36,030 --> 00:41:37,079
might make it less

841
00:41:37,079 --> 00:41:40,869
intensive than what you could do there with residential. So

842
00:41:40,869 --> 00:41:42,559
just a question is

843
00:41:42,559 --> 00:41:46,210
that if staff worked through all that and still felt like

844
00:41:46,210 --> 00:41:47,559
even with all these

845
00:41:47,559 --> 00:41:51,750
restrictions of things that you can't do there and the

846
00:41:51,750 --> 00:41:55,480
heights and the setbacks

847
00:41:55,480 --> 00:42:00,150
screening walls it's completely looks like it's surrounded

848
00:42:00,150 --> 00:42:01,480
by a forest around

849
00:42:01,480 --> 00:42:04,579
all the edges that what impact really is the concern that

850
00:42:04,579 --> 00:42:05,559
would be against

851
00:42:05,559 --> 00:42:09,530
neighbors other than when you look at it from up above on a

852
00:42:09,530 --> 00:42:11,320
map it looks like it

853
00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:15,119
versus impracticality the restrictions and what's around it

854
00:42:15,119 --> 00:42:15,920
I don't know that

855
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:22,000
it's a huge impact. And we did look at that and it just was

856
00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:22,639
centered on the

857
00:42:22,639 --> 00:42:26,340
bringing in those commercial type uses within the

858
00:42:26,340 --> 00:42:28,320
neighborhood so sure. Commissioner

859
00:42:28,320 --> 00:42:33,340
Beck. Thank you chair and that's in reference to what you

860
00:42:33,340 --> 00:42:33,760
're talking about

861
00:42:33,760 --> 00:42:37,389
that's why I asked if the local residents had been made

862
00:42:37,389 --> 00:42:38,280
aware of all

863
00:42:38,280 --> 00:42:41,909
these details because I see where you're going that and I'm

864
00:42:41,909 --> 00:42:43,159
okay with it to a

865
00:42:43,159 --> 00:42:46,780
certain point but I would like the people that live in that

866
00:42:46,780 --> 00:42:47,800
area to see

867
00:42:47,800 --> 00:42:50,599
that and respond to that and they're still objected to it

868
00:42:50,599 --> 00:42:51,440
then that would

869
00:42:51,440 --> 00:42:55,110
definitely have an impact on my decision. Commissioner Rose

870
00:42:55,110 --> 00:42:56,559
lle. Thank you chair

871
00:42:56,559 --> 00:43:00,519
sounds like you opened up a can here but I appreciate the

872
00:43:00,519 --> 00:43:03,199
symptoms. When I

873
00:43:03,199 --> 00:43:06,610
first saw this I thought initially of individual you might

874
00:43:06,610 --> 00:43:07,880
recall this but

875
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:12,869
right north of Chase Bank on University at Hinkle there are

876
00:43:12,869 --> 00:43:14,239
single-story office

877
00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:19,650
buildings that abut in our sixth neighborhood I believe it

878
00:43:19,650 --> 00:43:20,199
's right across

879
00:43:20,199 --> 00:43:25,949
the street from the church there and it seems to be that is

880
00:43:25,949 --> 00:43:26,760
a workable

881
00:43:26,760 --> 00:43:30,559
situation which is not to impose on the neighbors it they

882
00:43:30,559 --> 00:43:31,780
have looks like

883
00:43:31,780 --> 00:43:35,139
parking all across the fence line but it's a workable

884
00:43:35,139 --> 00:43:37,119
solution that that's

885
00:43:37,119 --> 00:43:40,269
okay it's not like a peninsula in a neighborhood over on H

886
00:43:40,269 --> 00:43:41,239
inkle but it's

887
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:46,039
certainly adjacent to a pretty dense neighborhood for

888
00:43:46,039 --> 00:43:47,119
single-story commercial

889
00:43:47,119 --> 00:43:53,519
structures food for thought more than anything.

890
00:43:53,519 --> 00:43:55,880
Commissioner Ellis. Thank you

891
00:43:55,880 --> 00:44:00,739
chair. Yeah it's a really incredibly generous overlay to be

892
00:44:00,739 --> 00:44:02,480
certain so I'm

893
00:44:02,480 --> 00:44:07,449
wondering yeah if if we wonder maybe ask the applicant to

894
00:44:07,449 --> 00:44:09,119
re-look at discussing

895
00:44:09,119 --> 00:44:11,480
it with the neighborhood I mean they they certainly should

896
00:44:11,480 --> 00:44:11,960
have that

897
00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:16,460
knowledge because it's it's it's very generous but I'm also

898
00:44:16,460 --> 00:44:17,760
wondering too if

899
00:44:17,760 --> 00:44:22,019
one of the concerns for denial is the area and what the

900
00:44:22,019 --> 00:44:23,639
office building might

901
00:44:23,639 --> 00:44:27,739
be what businesses might come in there because the spot is

902
00:44:27,739 --> 00:44:29,000
very imposing on the

903
00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:33,679
neighborhood I mean the houses are right there so I guess

904
00:44:33,679 --> 00:44:34,960
that's the one thing

905
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:40,219
the overlay can't do is is eliminate types of businesses I

906
00:44:40,219 --> 00:44:41,159
mean some to some

907
00:44:41,159 --> 00:44:44,630
degree they did but I mean we're still gonna law offices

908
00:44:44,630 --> 00:44:45,880
which we don't know

909
00:44:45,880 --> 00:44:49,039
necessarily what they're going to be there's bail bonds

910
00:44:49,039 --> 00:44:50,039
offices all over

911
00:44:50,039 --> 00:44:53,079
there could be that right in the neighborhood not ideal so

912
00:44:53,079 --> 00:44:54,519
I mean that's

913
00:44:54,519 --> 00:44:58,679
certainly a concern for just the location.

914
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:10,039
Any other questions for staff? Thank you Julie.

915
00:45:11,159 --> 00:45:23,480
So one more item. So next item is the development code

916
00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:25,559
amendment that you guys

917
00:45:25,559 --> 00:45:30,440
heard last meeting and Jim is Jim's gonna come up and

918
00:45:30,440 --> 00:45:32,119
present a quick update

919
00:45:32,119 --> 00:45:37,449
and provide a little more additional information on this

920
00:45:37,449 --> 00:45:37,960
item.

921
00:45:41,159 --> 00:45:48,920
Jim as you're getting ready for your presentation do you

922
00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:49,679
know about how long

923
00:45:49,679 --> 00:45:51,699
it's gonna be because I know we have food so I don't know

924
00:45:51,699 --> 00:45:52,519
where we should take

925
00:45:52,519 --> 00:45:58,599
a break and give you time to get ready or? I was envision

926
00:45:58,599 --> 00:46:00,480
ing something on the

927
00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:03,400
order of ten minutes.

928
00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:11,719
It's really just an update and just talking about some of

929
00:46:11,719 --> 00:46:13,159
answers to some of

930
00:46:13,159 --> 00:46:15,219
the questions that were raised last time. Okay if I ask one

931
00:46:15,219 --> 00:46:16,559
question before you start your

932
00:46:16,559 --> 00:46:19,360
presentation are you gonna be asking for us to move

933
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:20,360
something tonight or is this

934
00:46:20,360 --> 00:46:22,409
something that's gonna probably need to come back like we

935
00:46:22,409 --> 00:46:23,360
talked last time and do

936
00:46:23,360 --> 00:46:26,449
a little more work on that? I think the in my opinion the

937
00:46:26,449 --> 00:46:27,599
logical thing would be

938
00:46:27,599 --> 00:46:37,639
to postpone action until the next P&Z. We have done a

939
00:46:37,639 --> 00:46:38,679
public hearing

940
00:46:38,679 --> 00:46:42,050
public notice for the council meeting on the 11th or excuse

941
00:46:42,050 --> 00:46:43,639
me the 17th of

942
00:46:43,639 --> 00:46:49,320
October and we would still have time following the 11th the

943
00:46:49,320 --> 00:46:50,639
October 11th P&Z

944
00:46:50,639 --> 00:46:54,050
to revise whatever documents would go before council then.

945
00:46:54,050 --> 00:46:55,599
Right if the

946
00:46:55,599 --> 00:46:58,190
Commission's fine let's go ahead since we're gonna this is

947
00:46:58,190 --> 00:46:58,960
gonna come back

948
00:46:58,960 --> 00:47:02,369
rather than this is the final look and we're gonna go vote

949
00:47:02,369 --> 00:47:03,119
on it. If the

950
00:47:03,119 --> 00:47:05,239
Commission's pleasure let's go ahead and do the

951
00:47:05,239 --> 00:47:06,599
presentation and we'll we'll eat

952
00:47:06,599 --> 00:47:13,559
afterwards. Thank you. Good evening everyone.

953
00:47:17,679 --> 00:47:20,309
This is intended to be to be like I said kind of an update

954
00:47:20,309 --> 00:47:22,159
from from the last

955
00:47:22,159 --> 00:47:25,639
time. I know not all of you were could be present at the

956
00:47:25,639 --> 00:47:27,000
last meeting. What I was

957
00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:30,559
going to do is do a very brief recap of what I discussed

958
00:47:30,559 --> 00:47:31,519
before what I

959
00:47:31,519 --> 00:47:35,199
introduced and then like I said get into some of the

960
00:47:35,199 --> 00:47:37,000
questions that were brought

961
00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:40,159
up from the Commission and from the public and the research

962
00:47:40,159 --> 00:47:40,800
we've done

963
00:47:40,800 --> 00:47:45,860
following that to answer those. As you all know that the

964
00:47:45,860 --> 00:47:47,920
city is making a major

965
00:47:47,920 --> 00:47:54,070
thorough effort to reevaluate and improve our processes,

966
00:47:54,070 --> 00:47:55,119
our codes,

967
00:47:55,119 --> 00:48:00,380
agreements in an effort to better serve the development

968
00:48:00,380 --> 00:48:01,960
community to streamline

969
00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:08,039
processes to protect the interests of the city. One

970
00:48:08,039 --> 00:48:11,199
component of that is the

971
00:48:11,199 --> 00:48:16,110
development contract process and this is specifically what

972
00:48:16,110 --> 00:48:17,840
I'm referring to is

973
00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:21,880
the stage between when P&Z approves a plat and when a

974
00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:23,400
project is actually

975
00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:26,179
authorized to go into construction and we can start turning

976
00:48:26,179 --> 00:48:27,079
dirt. That's that's

977
00:48:27,079 --> 00:48:32,159
been a historically a source of frustration from the

978
00:48:32,159 --> 00:48:32,519
development

979
00:48:32,519 --> 00:48:36,480
community as far as the time and the steps involved there

980
00:48:36,480 --> 00:48:37,800
so we're looking to

981
00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:44,090
streamline that and this this is part of that effort. A

982
00:48:44,090 --> 00:48:47,199
request that Development

983
00:48:47,199 --> 00:48:54,320
Services frequently receives is that the city file a plat

984
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:56,519
following approval by

985
00:48:56,519 --> 00:49:00,119
P&Z and our code right now precludes us from doing that

986
00:49:00,119 --> 00:49:01,480
until we get a

987
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:04,780
development contract. We call them two-way development

988
00:49:04,780 --> 00:49:05,920
contracts because

989
00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:11,429
the three parties named are the city, the developer, and

990
00:49:11,429 --> 00:49:15,440
the contractor. It can

991
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:22,239
often take, typically it takes six or seven weeks or more,

992
00:49:22,239 --> 00:49:23,480
well no about four

993
00:49:23,480 --> 00:49:28,079
to six weeks for a developer to enter the contract with a

994
00:49:28,079 --> 00:49:30,320
contractor and get

995
00:49:30,320 --> 00:49:35,190
all the bonds ready, turn into the city, and reviewed and

996
00:49:35,190 --> 00:49:39,159
approved. So in very

997
00:49:39,159 --> 00:49:43,300
often developers want, we find they often want to file

998
00:49:43,300 --> 00:49:45,400
their plat before they get

999
00:49:45,400 --> 00:49:52,849
a contractor on board. Often I believe often that milestone

1000
00:49:52,849 --> 00:49:53,920
is tied to project

1001
00:49:53,920 --> 00:49:57,570
financing so we are trying to find a way to safely

1002
00:49:57,570 --> 00:50:00,019
accommodate that and then as I

1003
00:50:00,019 --> 00:50:03,219
mentioned we're also trying to streamline our overall pre-

1004
00:50:03,219 --> 00:50:03,800
construction

1005
00:50:03,800 --> 00:50:12,500
process. Very briefly this is our current process I showed

1006
00:50:12,500 --> 00:50:13,480
last time and as I

1007
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:18,159
mentioned from final plat approval down the next line of

1008
00:50:18,159 --> 00:50:19,440
the three-way contracts

1009
00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:26,440
being executed typically a realistic best case is on the

1010
00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:27,199
order of six weeks

1011
00:50:27,199 --> 00:50:31,449
sometimes it can be much longer and you can see in the next

1012
00:50:31,449 --> 00:50:33,440
line after that the

1013
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:38,519
plat filing there in yellow, the plat filing milestone

1014
00:50:38,519 --> 00:50:40,199
cannot be reached until

1015
00:50:40,199 --> 00:50:46,360
those contracts are processed and then I mentioned the hold

1016
00:50:46,360 --> 00:50:47,159
harmless agreements

1017
00:50:47,159 --> 00:50:52,199
last time that's a separate agreement it basically our code

1018
00:50:52,199 --> 00:50:54,639
as written does not

1019
00:50:54,639 --> 00:51:00,400
allow construction of private improvements to begin until

1020
00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:01,239
construction

1021
00:51:01,239 --> 00:51:05,679
of public improvements has been completed unless there is a

1022
00:51:05,679 --> 00:51:08,760
hold harmless

1023
00:51:09,320 --> 00:51:14,710
agreement that's executed it's a standard form and we see

1024
00:51:14,710 --> 00:51:16,079
we allow those

1025
00:51:16,079 --> 00:51:18,480
on everything but single-family residential so any multif

1026
00:51:18,480 --> 00:51:18,800
amily

1027
00:51:18,800 --> 00:51:22,440
commercial we offer that and it's almost always requested

1028
00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:23,800
so it's almost an

1029
00:51:23,800 --> 00:51:26,250
automatic step we're looking to fold that into this

1030
00:51:26,250 --> 00:51:28,159
agreement. After those steps

1031
00:51:28,159 --> 00:51:35,829
are done the permit can be issued. What I've got here shown

1032
00:51:35,829 --> 00:51:37,280
as the proposed

1033
00:51:37,280 --> 00:51:43,360
process is basically you'll see the plat filing would occur

1034
00:51:43,360 --> 00:51:45,000
much sooner we're

1035
00:51:45,000 --> 00:51:47,599
talking about breaking up the current three-way development

1036
00:51:47,599 --> 00:51:48,480
agreement into two

1037
00:51:48,480 --> 00:51:50,900
two-way agreements the first one being with just between

1038
00:51:50,900 --> 00:51:51,639
the city and the

1039
00:51:51,639 --> 00:51:57,030
developer and that would facilitate us following the plat

1040
00:51:57,030 --> 00:51:58,559
that can be even

1041
00:51:58,559 --> 00:52:01,769
before the developer enters into an agreement with a

1042
00:52:01,769 --> 00:52:03,159
contractor use so you

1043
00:52:03,159 --> 00:52:07,110
can see that would be the next step following that and we

1044
00:52:07,110 --> 00:52:08,320
will talk I'm

1045
00:52:08,320 --> 00:52:11,559
running through this quickly this is a recap from last time

1046
00:52:11,559 --> 00:52:12,400
we talked about

1047
00:52:12,400 --> 00:52:15,400
the standard note

1048
00:52:20,840 --> 00:52:25,900
Julie this is my last presentation from the first time is

1049
00:52:25,900 --> 00:52:31,000
Julie here I mean

1050
00:52:31,000 --> 00:52:35,690
these first slides were almost identical but the rest are

1051
00:52:35,690 --> 00:52:44,360
not okay it should say

1052
00:52:55,360 --> 00:53:00,889
maybe it's a good time to break for dinner I'm sorry I'm

1053
00:53:00,889 --> 00:53:02,079
gonna call a

1054
00:53:02,079 --> 00:53:08,480
recess at 555 and we'll reconvene as quickly as we can

1055
00:53:25,960 --> 00:53:28,000
you

1056
00:53:55,360 --> 00:54:14,320
okay welcome back and I will call us back to order at 602

1057
00:54:14,320 --> 00:54:17,559
all right thank you

1058
00:54:17,559 --> 00:54:20,170
sorry sorry about the interruption no problem I think it

1059
00:54:20,170 --> 00:54:21,119
was my fault I think I

1060
00:54:21,119 --> 00:54:25,960
may have sent Julie the wrong version of the we have the

1061
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:27,400
right one now we're good

1062
00:54:27,400 --> 00:54:34,599
but basically I'll pick up where I left off I'd like to use

1063
00:54:34,599 --> 00:54:38,960
the pointer though

1064
00:54:42,239 --> 00:54:45,230
so some of the questions that were raised at the last

1065
00:54:45,230 --> 00:54:47,360
meeting from the

1066
00:54:47,360 --> 00:54:51,829
public and from the commissioners included what's a

1067
00:54:51,829 --> 00:54:53,840
developer's capacity

1068
00:54:53,840 --> 00:54:58,369
to get bonded as opposed to a contractor what do other

1069
00:54:58,369 --> 00:55:00,440
cities require could

1070
00:55:00,440 --> 00:55:04,829
guarantees be issued to the developer and the contractor

1071
00:55:04,829 --> 00:55:06,559
such that the relates

1072
00:55:06,559 --> 00:55:10,239
expense of the bond or the guarantee is not doubled because

1073
00:55:10,239 --> 00:55:11,280
that can be a

1074
00:55:11,280 --> 00:55:14,969
considerable expense and would the city consider allowing

1075
00:55:14,969 --> 00:55:15,960
single-family

1076
00:55:15,960 --> 00:55:22,599
residential houses to be constructed prior to completion of

1077
00:55:22,599 --> 00:55:23,880
the right public

1078
00:55:23,880 --> 00:55:29,449
improvements so we've contacted numerous surety companies

1079
00:55:29,449 --> 00:55:30,960
there was at least eight

1080
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:38,190
talked to many agents and vice presidents underwriters were

1081
00:55:38,190 --> 00:55:39,079
we made

1082
00:55:39,079 --> 00:55:43,610
attempts to contact you yes media is asking if you can make

1083
00:55:43,610 --> 00:55:44,440
it full screen

1084
00:55:44,440 --> 00:55:47,530
I guess it has something to do with their ability to to

1085
00:55:47,530 --> 00:55:50,519
show it to the public

1086
00:55:50,599 --> 00:55:58,639
there we go okay thank you we have we found that it's it's

1087
00:55:58,639 --> 00:55:59,760
extremely difficult

1088
00:55:59,760 --> 00:56:02,920
to get access to the the underwriters themselves but we did

1089
00:56:02,920 --> 00:56:04,079
talk to numerous

1090
00:56:04,079 --> 00:56:10,739
agents and vice presidents of these these companies we have

1091
00:56:10,739 --> 00:56:12,719
also contacted

1092
00:56:12,719 --> 00:56:18,800
several cities in the Metroplex and across the state and I

1093
00:56:18,800 --> 00:56:21,119
'll get into what

1094
00:56:21,119 --> 00:56:27,760
what kind of responses we're getting the sureties having

1095
00:56:27,760 --> 00:56:29,159
the the companies that

1096
00:56:29,159 --> 00:56:33,820
issue the bonds or the policies they've informed us and as

1097
00:56:33,820 --> 00:56:35,000
I mentioned an

1098
00:56:35,000 --> 00:56:39,559
example last time I talked to you the one I had talked to

1099
00:56:39,559 --> 00:56:41,280
said that in many

1100
00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:45,929
cases they they do issue bonds these sorts of bonds to

1101
00:56:45,929 --> 00:56:47,239
developers but it is

1102
00:56:47,239 --> 00:56:51,030
more typical for them to issue them to contractors for a

1103
00:56:51,030 --> 00:56:52,679
surety to issue a

1104
00:56:52,679 --> 00:56:57,340
performance bond to a developer they they typically require

1105
00:56:57,340 --> 00:56:58,480
that developer to

1106
00:56:58,480 --> 00:57:03,829
sign personally and not as a newly formed LLC for instance

1107
00:57:03,829 --> 00:57:05,079
to demonstrate a

1108
00:57:05,079 --> 00:57:14,329
track record a good fiscal track record and more commonly

1109
00:57:14,329 --> 00:57:15,280
cities allow

1110
00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:21,360
developers to provide a alternative fiscal guarantee other

1111
00:57:21,360 --> 00:57:21,599
than a

1112
00:57:21,599 --> 00:57:26,800
performance bond and it could take many forms it could be a

1113
00:57:26,800 --> 00:57:28,079
irrevocable letter

1114
00:57:28,079 --> 00:57:33,110
of credit like from a bank what we found to be called a

1115
00:57:33,110 --> 00:57:34,599
subdivision in

1116
00:57:34,599 --> 00:57:37,380
maintenance bond some cities do something like that it's

1117
00:57:37,380 --> 00:57:38,079
very similar

1118
00:57:38,079 --> 00:57:41,760
to performance bond it's just with the developer named or

1119
00:57:41,760 --> 00:57:44,079
an escrow agreement

1120
00:57:44,079 --> 00:57:47,719
held by in which the funds are held by a third party and we

1121
00:57:47,719 --> 00:57:49,320
find the feedback

1122
00:57:49,320 --> 00:57:52,539
we're getting is the sureties recommend that cities require

1123
00:57:52,539 --> 00:57:53,719
that the developers

1124
00:57:53,719 --> 00:58:01,170
provide such fiscal guarantees they're not or they are and

1125
00:58:01,170 --> 00:58:01,880
that those

1126
00:58:01,880 --> 00:58:05,889
alternative guarantees are tend to be more readily

1127
00:58:05,889 --> 00:58:07,920
available to developers

1128
00:58:07,920 --> 00:58:12,070
than simply performance bonds some can get performance

1129
00:58:12,070 --> 00:58:13,480
bonds but for many

1130
00:58:13,480 --> 00:58:18,059
especially the smaller or perhaps newer developments it's

1131
00:58:18,059 --> 00:58:19,599
more of a challenge

1132
00:58:23,719 --> 00:58:28,230
as far as our feedback we've got from cities it's kind of

1133
00:58:28,230 --> 00:58:30,079
interesting because

1134
00:58:30,079 --> 00:58:34,050
we contact a lot of cities you know around the size of Dent

1135
00:58:34,050 --> 00:58:36,159
on or larger and

1136
00:58:36,159 --> 00:58:40,590
there's it varies greatly the requirements in contracting

1137
00:58:40,590 --> 00:58:41,400
and bonding

1138
00:58:41,400 --> 00:58:44,889
and timing of when they file a plat varies greatly from

1139
00:58:44,889 --> 00:58:45,960
city to city there

1140
00:58:45,960 --> 00:58:55,000
does not appear to be a typical process or protocol there's

1141
00:58:55,000 --> 00:58:56,440
there's it's quite a

1142
00:58:56,440 --> 00:59:03,210
bit of variance for instance some cities will not file the

1143
00:59:03,210 --> 00:59:04,760
plat until the

1144
00:59:04,760 --> 00:59:08,400
developer has constructed not just bonded but constructed

1145
00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:09,480
all related public

1146
00:59:09,480 --> 00:59:14,670
improvements you know some cities don't require development

1147
00:59:14,670 --> 00:59:15,840
contracts at all

1148
00:59:15,840 --> 00:59:22,280
just simply bonds we're not necessarily recommending those

1149
00:59:22,280 --> 00:59:23,920
I'm just I include

1150
00:59:23,920 --> 00:59:30,000
those as an example of how different cities can be we do

1151
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:31,519
find that a lot of

1152
00:59:31,519 --> 00:59:35,119
the cities do offer several options as to what form the

1153
00:59:35,119 --> 00:59:36,719
developers guarantee

1154
00:59:36,719 --> 00:59:41,389
takes so as I mentioned before performance bond or

1155
00:59:41,389 --> 00:59:42,880
alternatively

1156
00:59:42,880 --> 00:59:47,280
subdivision development bond irrevocable letter of credit

1157
00:59:47,280 --> 00:59:48,840
and escrow agreement

1158
00:59:48,840 --> 00:59:53,780
or something like that and a couple examples of note that I

1159
00:59:53,780 --> 00:59:54,679
've included

1160
00:59:54,679 --> 01:00:01,110
because they are along similar lines as what staff is

1161
01:00:01,110 --> 01:00:04,119
exploring and pursuing here

1162
01:00:04,119 --> 01:00:10,199
as far as procedure changes and allowing plat filing

1163
01:00:10,199 --> 01:00:13,599
earlier one is Georgetown

1164
01:00:13,599 --> 01:00:18,179
it's about 64,000 people but it is growing rapidly and San

1165
01:00:18,179 --> 01:00:19,400
Antonio which of

1166
01:00:19,400 --> 01:00:25,480
course is a large city Georgetown in the Austin area they

1167
01:00:25,480 --> 01:00:27,280
allow the plat to be

1168
01:00:27,280 --> 01:00:31,420
filed prior to completion of the public's improvements once

1169
01:00:31,420 --> 01:00:32,320
a fiscal

1170
01:00:32,320 --> 01:00:38,719
surety or guarantee has been issued and again this can be a

1171
01:00:38,719 --> 01:00:40,800
trust agreement I

1172
01:00:40,800 --> 01:00:43,199
believe that's similar to an escrow agreement that can be

1173
01:00:43,199 --> 01:00:43,920
drawn from by the

1174
01:00:43,920 --> 01:00:48,409
city if need be an irrevocable letter of credit or you know

1175
01:00:48,409 --> 01:00:49,239
back to the

1176
01:00:49,239 --> 01:00:56,159
performance bond and I know one request that was mentioned

1177
01:00:56,159 --> 01:00:57,679
or a suggestion or a

1178
01:00:57,679 --> 01:01:04,679
concern raised last time was structuring this in a way that

1179
01:01:04,679 --> 01:01:06,480
homes could be lots

1180
01:01:06,480 --> 01:01:09,579
could be sold prior to the completion of public

1181
01:01:09,579 --> 01:01:11,800
improvements and apparently that

1182
01:01:11,800 --> 01:01:16,010
that is that is feasible with this arrangement that

1183
01:01:16,010 --> 01:01:18,400
Georgetown does San

1184
01:01:18,400 --> 01:01:24,010
Antonio is the only one I mentioned they will not approve a

1185
01:01:24,010 --> 01:01:25,719
plat until the

1186
01:01:25,719 --> 01:01:29,090
developer signs the three pages only three pages shorter

1187
01:01:29,090 --> 01:01:30,639
than ours the

1188
01:01:30,639 --> 01:01:36,099
performance agreement that ensures they complete the public

1189
01:01:36,099 --> 01:01:38,480
improvements but as

1190
01:01:38,480 --> 01:01:41,710
far as as far and we're not necessarily recommending

1191
01:01:41,710 --> 01:01:43,480
holding approval like that

1192
01:01:43,480 --> 01:01:48,639
but they do allow for an approved plat to be filed before

1193
01:01:48,639 --> 01:01:49,719
the public

1194
01:01:49,719 --> 01:01:52,670
improvements are completed if the developer provides the

1195
01:01:52,670 --> 01:01:54,039
fiscal guarantee

1196
01:01:54,039 --> 01:01:58,449
within three years of plat approval and again they they

1197
01:01:58,449 --> 01:02:00,400
give options performance

1198
01:02:00,400 --> 01:02:04,880
bond the irrevocable trust agreement or standby letter of

1199
01:02:04,880 --> 01:02:05,719
credit like from a

1200
01:02:05,719 --> 01:02:17,860
bank or a cashier's check. So before I head into that this

1201
01:02:17,860 --> 01:02:19,440
is in a nutshell

1202
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:25,159
what we're finding is while there are cases that we had

1203
01:02:25,159 --> 01:02:27,199
found and are still

1204
01:02:27,199 --> 01:02:33,400
finding of developers being able to in some cases being

1205
01:02:33,400 --> 01:02:35,760
required to provide

1206
01:02:35,760 --> 01:02:42,960
performance bonds it is we do find that it is more

1207
01:02:42,960 --> 01:02:44,320
difficult for many of them

1208
01:02:44,320 --> 01:02:48,280
especially the smaller ones to acquire that sort of

1209
01:02:48,280 --> 01:02:50,360
guarantee but there are

1210
01:02:50,360 --> 01:02:54,460
other avenues to achieve that that sort of protection for

1211
01:02:54,460 --> 01:02:56,519
the city and that's

1212
01:02:56,519 --> 01:03:03,000
I should I should tonight say and again we will bring this

1213
01:03:03,000 --> 01:03:05,639
to you again on the

1214
01:03:05,639 --> 01:03:11,789
11th we are staff is continuing to to what we've gathered

1215
01:03:11,789 --> 01:03:13,599
this research now

1216
01:03:13,599 --> 01:03:17,159
we're having a lot of discussions internally we're working

1217
01:03:17,159 --> 01:03:17,880
with legal

1218
01:03:17,880 --> 01:03:24,170
department we are and other departments we are still in the

1219
01:03:24,170 --> 01:03:25,280
process of drafting

1220
01:03:25,280 --> 01:03:28,340
the agreements the two two-way agreements that we mentioned

1221
01:03:28,340 --> 01:03:28,880
last time

1222
01:03:28,880 --> 01:03:34,610
so we we are we're still this is still a high level

1223
01:03:34,610 --> 01:03:37,199
presentation but I did want

1224
01:03:37,199 --> 01:03:40,440
to show you our findings hopefully answer some of your

1225
01:03:40,440 --> 01:03:43,039
questions and you

1226
01:03:43,039 --> 01:03:47,429
know all this being said with some tweaks that I've

1227
01:03:47,429 --> 01:03:49,159
described here we are

1228
01:03:49,159 --> 01:03:54,039
hopeful that we can still pursue the same direction again

1229
01:03:54,039 --> 01:03:55,320
we think it was

1230
01:03:55,320 --> 01:03:58,219
streamlined things and we think it would accommodate the

1231
01:03:58,219 --> 01:03:59,559
frequent requests to file

1232
01:03:59,559 --> 01:04:08,260
plots earlier there was a also a request in the last public

1233
01:04:08,260 --> 01:04:12,360
hearing about allowing

1234
01:04:12,360 --> 01:04:18,860
or changing our code amending our code to allow for the

1235
01:04:18,860 --> 01:04:20,880
sort of hold harmless

1236
01:04:20,880 --> 01:04:26,579
language that we allow for multifamily or commercial that

1237
01:04:26,579 --> 01:04:28,400
is to say allowing

1238
01:04:28,400 --> 01:04:31,150
private improvements to start before the public

1239
01:04:31,150 --> 01:04:33,800
improvements are completed and I

1240
01:04:33,800 --> 01:04:36,150
want to address that a little bit and I think also I'd like

1241
01:04:36,150 --> 01:04:36,960
more than anything

1242
01:04:36,960 --> 01:04:39,829
like to just kind of discuss that a little more in the

1243
01:04:39,829 --> 01:04:41,960
public hearing we in

1244
01:04:41,960 --> 01:04:47,690
talking with with managers in in both our our building

1245
01:04:47,690 --> 01:04:49,519
inspections department

1246
01:04:49,519 --> 01:04:52,900
and our public works inspection department it's we it's I'm

1247
01:04:52,900 --> 01:04:53,559
told it's

1248
01:04:53,559 --> 01:04:57,199
not a request we frequently get certainly doesn't mean that

1249
01:04:57,199 --> 01:04:57,599
it's it's

1250
01:04:57,599 --> 01:05:02,539
not worth discussing and considering but I think one to

1251
01:05:02,539 --> 01:05:04,679
better understand the

1252
01:05:04,679 --> 01:05:09,519
request or the concern one one one kind of common response

1253
01:05:09,519 --> 01:05:11,760
it has been it's

1254
01:05:11,760 --> 01:05:18,480
say for a subdivision until the until the streets are grad

1255
01:05:18,480 --> 01:05:19,679
ed the utilities

1256
01:05:19,679 --> 01:05:24,829
installed the streets poured and cured it's going to be

1257
01:05:24,829 --> 01:05:27,039
very very difficult to

1258
01:05:27,039 --> 01:05:30,699
even get to the lot and of course there would be

1259
01:05:30,699 --> 01:05:33,760
coordination issues between the

1260
01:05:33,760 --> 01:05:38,269
contractors but perhaps that wasn't quite the scenario you

1261
01:05:38,269 --> 01:05:40,239
had in mind and I just

1262
01:05:40,239 --> 01:05:45,230
was what it would ask you I guess for further input or

1263
01:05:45,230 --> 01:05:47,559
discussion sure be

1264
01:05:47,559 --> 01:05:49,679
happy to that you want to do it in the public session

1265
01:05:49,679 --> 01:05:53,639
probably sure sure

1266
01:05:53,880 --> 01:05:58,829
next steps for staff as I mentioned will be continuing to

1267
01:05:58,829 --> 01:06:02,880
work with with legal on

1268
01:06:02,880 --> 01:06:10,789
generating revised development contract forms deciding upon

1269
01:06:10,789 --> 01:06:12,159
the allowable forms

1270
01:06:12,159 --> 01:06:18,239
of guarantee which options that the city of Denton would be

1271
01:06:18,239 --> 01:06:20,280
well served in in

1272
01:06:20,280 --> 01:06:25,750
allowing we will present this again in more detail at the

1273
01:06:25,750 --> 01:06:27,800
public hearing I

1274
01:06:27,800 --> 01:06:32,630
think we're talking about the the 11th of October for P&Z

1275
01:06:32,630 --> 01:06:33,960
and then the one

1276
01:06:33,960 --> 01:06:38,519
that's been advertised for October 17th for City Council

1277
01:06:38,519 --> 01:06:39,719
and that's the extent

1278
01:06:39,719 --> 01:06:42,300
of my presentation I apologize for the technical

1279
01:06:42,300 --> 01:06:43,699
difficulties thank you for

1280
01:06:43,699 --> 01:06:46,400
bearing with me I'd be happy to answer any questions

1281
01:06:46,400 --> 01:06:49,349
Commissioner Roselle I just one question I can re-ask in

1282
01:06:49,349 --> 01:06:51,000
the public but the

1283
01:06:51,000 --> 01:06:54,159
previous slide you had mentioned talking about allowable

1284
01:06:54,159 --> 01:06:55,599
forms of guarantee the

1285
01:06:55,599 --> 01:06:58,750
staff also including the development community to

1286
01:06:58,750 --> 01:07:00,199
understand what their

1287
01:07:00,199 --> 01:07:04,900
thoughts are on forms of guarantee whether it be a your

1288
01:07:04,900 --> 01:07:05,960
vocal trust or letter

1289
01:07:05,960 --> 01:07:08,300
of credit are those conversations happening internally and

1290
01:07:08,300 --> 01:07:09,719
externally I

1291
01:07:09,719 --> 01:07:16,019
know that internally for sure externally I know that mr.

1292
01:07:16,019 --> 01:07:17,400
Lee Allison who's here

1293
01:07:17,400 --> 01:07:23,130
tonight is has been in frequent contact with our legal

1294
01:07:23,130 --> 01:07:25,079
department as we are

1295
01:07:25,079 --> 01:07:30,840
going through this process and I believe legal has

1296
01:07:30,840 --> 01:07:33,159
addressed all your questions

1297
01:07:33,159 --> 01:07:39,030
thus far I realize what I'm presenting tonight no okay well

1298
01:07:39,030 --> 01:07:42,559
we will we will the

1299
01:07:42,559 --> 01:07:47,320
city will now I realize what I'm presenting tonight as far

1300
01:07:47,320 --> 01:07:47,579
as these

1301
01:07:47,579 --> 01:07:55,079
alternative guarantee forms are is new and and we certainly

1302
01:07:55,079 --> 01:07:58,320
can thank you

1303
01:07:58,320 --> 01:08:02,639
Commissioner Beck thank you just real quick Jim if you

1304
01:08:02,639 --> 01:08:03,440
could go back to those

1305
01:08:03,440 --> 01:08:06,630
slides that show the difference in the timeline from the

1306
01:08:06,630 --> 01:08:08,039
three-way contract to

1307
01:08:08,039 --> 01:08:12,360
the two-way contract sure you've got a total of looks like

1308
01:08:12,360 --> 01:08:15,320
13 weeks there oh no

1309
01:08:15,320 --> 01:08:20,340
that's cumulative so that's what I'm saying yeah from final

1310
01:08:20,340 --> 01:08:21,079
plan the

1311
01:08:21,079 --> 01:08:25,340
three-way agreement once you're at the three way the way it

1312
01:08:25,340 --> 01:08:26,800
is now it's about

1313
01:08:26,800 --> 01:08:31,550
six weeks before the plat can be filed is that correct yes

1314
01:08:31,550 --> 01:08:33,279
six six to seven

1315
01:08:33,279 --> 01:08:35,960
weeks okay and then that following process which includes

1316
01:08:35,960 --> 01:08:36,680
pre-construction

1317
01:08:36,680 --> 01:08:43,819
meeting and HHA is looking at seven so you had a total of

1318
01:08:43,819 --> 01:08:47,199
13 there right no no

1319
01:08:47,199 --> 01:08:58,640
yeah okay okay so I now go to the future so how how is the

1320
01:08:58,640 --> 01:09:01,119
developer served if

1321
01:09:01,119 --> 01:09:04,550
if essentially we're looking at seven weeks before permit

1322
01:09:04,550 --> 01:09:06,039
can be issued and

1323
01:09:06,039 --> 01:09:09,079
I'm sure I may be the only one who didn't understand that

1324
01:09:09,079 --> 01:09:10,000
but they get

1325
01:09:10,000 --> 01:09:13,489
their agreement signed earlier now the plan is filed

1326
01:09:13,489 --> 01:09:16,279
earlier so how does that

1327
01:09:16,279 --> 01:09:24,260
help overall with the project as far as building yeah yeah

1328
01:09:24,260 --> 01:09:25,000
that's a good

1329
01:09:25,000 --> 01:09:31,079
question well we we all can hear I guess when I'm at let me

1330
01:09:31,079 --> 01:09:32,119
try and rephrase it

1331
01:09:32,119 --> 01:09:34,960
from can they actually even though the plants been filed

1332
01:09:34,960 --> 01:09:35,920
can anything be done

1333
01:09:35,920 --> 01:09:41,119
on the ground yet before for these other processes are done

1334
01:09:41,119 --> 01:09:44,000
no okay so how are

1335
01:09:44,000 --> 01:09:49,109
they benefiting through this measure we get frequent

1336
01:09:49,109 --> 01:09:51,439
requests that to to file

1337
01:09:51,439 --> 01:10:01,220
the plant after approval by PNC and I think the most common

1338
01:10:01,220 --> 01:10:02,600
reason for that is

1339
01:10:02,600 --> 01:10:06,100
that developers often have financing for their project how

1340
01:10:06,100 --> 01:10:07,239
tied to the milestone

1341
01:10:07,239 --> 01:10:11,159
of plat filing but now oftentimes they're not necessarily

1342
01:10:11,159 --> 01:10:13,199
ready to hire a

1343
01:10:13,199 --> 01:10:18,920
contractor and start building a project we do see that but

1344
01:10:18,920 --> 01:10:21,760
it this change would

1345
01:10:21,760 --> 01:10:25,260
allow them to get the plat file earlier and give them more

1346
01:10:25,260 --> 01:10:26,600
flexibility is when

1347
01:10:26,600 --> 01:10:31,279
they can bring the contractor on board for that you know it

1348
01:10:31,279 --> 01:10:32,520
's I think it

1349
01:10:32,520 --> 01:10:38,229
was the response we got from I think it was San Antonio

1350
01:10:38,229 --> 01:10:41,239
they're saying it's very

1351
01:10:41,239 --> 01:10:45,789
common almost half the time the developers would rather

1352
01:10:45,789 --> 01:10:46,960
just bond or put

1353
01:10:46,960 --> 01:10:51,359
up a guarantee and not build right away we want to defer

1354
01:10:51,359 --> 01:10:52,319
that I guess what I'm

1355
01:10:52,319 --> 01:10:55,270
having fusion and maybe Jim can help with this is why would

1356
01:10:55,270 --> 01:10:56,199
a developer want

1357
01:10:56,199 --> 01:10:59,029
to get started if he didn't already have contractors lying

1358
01:10:59,029 --> 01:11:02,199
down is how is that if

1359
01:11:02,199 --> 01:11:05,220
you get your plan followed and you don't have contracts I

1360
01:11:05,220 --> 01:11:05,760
don't understand why

1361
01:11:05,760 --> 01:11:08,260
you don't already have them in place so can you help me

1362
01:11:08,260 --> 01:11:11,039
with that well someone's

1363
01:11:11,039 --> 01:11:14,779
gonna be the time frame and to Jim's point you're as a

1364
01:11:14,779 --> 01:11:16,399
condition depending on

1365
01:11:16,399 --> 01:11:20,609
each individual developers project the deal the drill

1366
01:11:20,609 --> 01:11:21,760
structure the business

1367
01:11:21,760 --> 01:11:25,039
structure right the filing of the plat may be a condition

1368
01:11:25,039 --> 01:11:25,800
of their loan to

1369
01:11:25,800 --> 01:11:30,760
fund for example and it's difficult to go start signing

1370
01:11:30,760 --> 01:11:31,680
contracts when you don't

1371
01:11:31,680 --> 01:11:34,880
have the funds in place and the letter of credit saying

1372
01:11:34,880 --> 01:11:37,039
okay yes we'll loan you

1373
01:11:37,039 --> 01:11:39,750
ten million dollars you're gonna go sign the ten million

1374
01:11:39,750 --> 01:11:41,000
dollar contract without

1375
01:11:41,000 --> 01:11:45,039
having that done for example so that's one thing another

1376
01:11:45,039 --> 01:11:47,439
reason would be it

1377
01:11:47,439 --> 01:11:50,680
may be as I mentioned I think last time was called paper

1378
01:11:50,680 --> 01:11:52,479
lots that they are done

1379
01:11:52,479 --> 01:11:54,939
they're they're ready to go and maybe the developer is not

1380
01:11:54,939 --> 01:11:55,800
going to actually

1381
01:11:55,800 --> 01:11:59,689
move the dirt and take them from a piece of paper lot to a

1382
01:11:59,689 --> 01:12:01,319
on the ground dirt lot

1383
01:12:01,319 --> 01:12:05,180
that they're gonna sell those lots as papers called a fully

1384
01:12:05,180 --> 01:12:06,039
entitled that you

1385
01:12:06,039 --> 01:12:08,380
can go out there and actually begin construction whenever

1386
01:12:08,380 --> 01:12:09,760
you would like as

1387
01:12:09,760 --> 01:12:12,359
long as that plat is still in full force to have a time

1388
01:12:12,359 --> 01:12:13,880
frame on them you would

1389
01:12:13,880 --> 01:12:18,479
then go over at whatever time that it is due to the market

1390
01:12:18,479 --> 01:12:19,520
conditions or

1391
01:12:19,520 --> 01:12:23,619
whatever external factors there may be there may be a sale

1392
01:12:23,619 --> 01:12:24,659
prior to actual

1393
01:12:24,659 --> 01:12:27,439
development so it's just more flexibility versus all of

1394
01:12:27,439 --> 01:12:28,079
these other

1395
01:12:28,079 --> 01:12:31,239
issues sometimes and things happen to go in and having

1396
01:12:31,239 --> 01:12:33,119
bonds in place they may

1397
01:12:33,119 --> 01:12:38,579
not even be ready to go to work but those are those are a

1398
01:12:38,579 --> 01:12:39,720
few scenarios maybe

1399
01:12:39,720 --> 01:12:42,880
not all but just some that come to mind right quick thank

1400
01:12:42,880 --> 01:12:46,239
you thank you

1401
01:12:49,520 --> 01:12:58,039
any other questions okay thank you Jim I think that's gonna

1402
01:12:58,039 --> 01:13:00,239
end our work session

1403
01:13:00,239 --> 01:13:05,840
so I'll close work session here at 620 we'll try to eat

1404
01:13:05,840 --> 01:13:07,479
really quick and then

1405
01:13:07,479 --> 01:13:11,720
reconvene at 630 thank you

1406
01:13:15,840 --> 01:13:18,300
good evening and welcome to the city of Denton planning and

1407
01:13:18,300 --> 01:13:19,479
zoning Commission

1408
01:13:19,479 --> 01:13:24,989
meeting for September 27 2017 this meeting has been duly

1409
01:13:24,989 --> 01:13:26,039
posted we do have

1410
01:13:26,039 --> 01:13:30,779
a quorum present and I will call us to order at 642 our

1411
01:13:30,779 --> 01:13:31,920
first order of business

1412
01:13:31,920 --> 01:13:36,060
will be to stand and give the pledge to us in the Texas

1413
01:13:36,060 --> 01:13:36,479
flag

1414
01:13:49,479 --> 01:13:52,479
invisible

1415
01:14:10,760 --> 01:14:13,159
our next order of business will be to have a motion for our

1416
01:14:13,159 --> 01:14:17,439
minutes unless we

1417
01:14:17,439 --> 01:14:22,609
have anybody has a change we'll just take those as one

1418
01:14:22,609 --> 01:14:26,960
motion okay a vote

1419
01:14:26,960 --> 01:14:31,220
individually okay we'll take a motion then for the August 9

1420
01:14:31,220 --> 01:14:32,720
th minutes

1421
01:14:32,720 --> 01:14:36,600
Commissioner Rizel I move to approve August 9th okay

1422
01:14:36,600 --> 01:14:37,760
Commissioner Beck

1423
01:14:37,760 --> 01:14:42,779
second okay I have a first and a second any discussion or

1424
01:14:42,779 --> 01:14:46,199
any changes seeing

1425
01:14:46,199 --> 01:14:49,479
none will call for a vote on board

1426
01:15:00,680 --> 01:15:02,109
motion is going to carry 4-0 with two recuse for not being

1427
01:15:02,109 --> 01:15:05,399
attendance for

1428
01:15:05,399 --> 01:15:09,079
those meetings and we'll move us to a motion for the

1429
01:15:09,079 --> 01:15:12,479
September 13th minutes

1430
01:15:16,239 --> 01:15:20,029
Commissioner Smith a motion to accept okay Commissioner Riz

1431
01:15:20,029 --> 01:15:22,159
el second okay we

1432
01:15:22,159 --> 01:15:28,270
have a first and a second for approval any discussion or

1433
01:15:28,270 --> 01:15:30,600
changes seeing none

1434
01:15:30,600 --> 01:15:33,680
a call for a vote on the board

1435
01:15:45,760 --> 01:15:52,159
that motion will carry 4-0 with three recuse for not being

1436
01:15:52,159 --> 01:15:52,960
attendance of that

1437
01:15:52,960 --> 01:15:58,300
particular meeting before we get started on the consent

1438
01:15:58,300 --> 01:15:59,840
agenda the chair is going

1439
01:15:59,840 --> 01:16:04,210
to change the order of the public hearings I'm going to

1440
01:16:04,210 --> 01:16:05,640
move item B to be

1441
01:16:05,640 --> 01:16:10,229
the first item that we will hear during our public hearing

1442
01:16:10,229 --> 01:16:11,880
section and the reason

1443
01:16:11,880 --> 01:16:17,000
for that is I have a conflict of interest on one of the

1444
01:16:17,000 --> 01:16:17,880
consent agenda

1445
01:16:17,880 --> 01:16:22,220
items and then I have a conflict of interest on item B and

1446
01:16:22,220 --> 01:16:23,399
so I'm going to

1447
01:16:23,399 --> 01:16:27,000
recuse myself on both of those items and I will turn the

1448
01:16:27,000 --> 01:16:28,640
chair over to our vice

1449
01:16:28,640 --> 01:16:32,720
chair Commissioner Rizel thank you

1450
01:16:42,119 --> 01:16:45,399
the next item on the agenda is the consent agenda and the

1451
01:16:45,399 --> 01:16:49,039
vice chair will

1452
01:16:49,039 --> 01:16:53,850
hear any votes or discussion on the consent agenda

1453
01:16:53,850 --> 01:16:56,439
Commissioner Ellis thank

1454
01:16:56,439 --> 01:16:59,140
you vice chair I move to approve the consent agenda and

1455
01:16:59,140 --> 01:17:00,359
Commissioner Sullivan

1456
01:17:00,359 --> 01:17:00,359
a second we have a first and a second any discussion you

1457
01:17:00,359 --> 01:17:08,359
vote on the board

1458
01:17:11,880 --> 01:17:29,680
the consent agenda passes 6-0 with one recusal the next

1459
01:17:29,680 --> 01:17:31,479
item on the agenda is

1460
01:17:31,479 --> 01:17:35,520
our public hearing item Z 1700 13 a this is a public

1461
01:17:35,520 --> 01:17:36,720
hearing so I'll open up the

1462
01:17:36,720 --> 01:17:41,850
public hearing and invite Julie Wyatt presentation vice

1463
01:17:41,850 --> 01:17:42,520
chair we're gonna move

1464
01:17:42,520 --> 01:17:48,659
item be it at the same thing work session Z 1700 15 still

1465
01:17:48,659 --> 01:17:49,760
miss Wyatt

1466
01:17:57,439 --> 01:17:58,510
all right did y'all want me to go through the end the whole

1467
01:17:58,510 --> 01:18:00,840
presentation

1468
01:18:00,840 --> 01:18:05,100
again or just do a summary it just fits up to you I think

1469
01:18:05,100 --> 01:18:05,880
we do the full

1470
01:18:05,880 --> 01:18:10,199
presentation great all right so the request before you is Z

1471
01:18:10,199 --> 01:18:11,560
1715 McKinney

1472
01:18:11,560 --> 01:18:17,640
Mayhill and this is to hold a public hearing and consider

1473
01:18:17,640 --> 01:18:17,880
making a

1474
01:18:17,880 --> 01:18:21,189
recommendation regarding a request to rezone approximately

1475
01:18:21,189 --> 01:18:22,399
73 acres from the

1476
01:18:22,399 --> 01:18:26,310
ECI zoning district to CMG zoning district just to orient

1477
01:18:26,310 --> 01:18:27,359
you the site is

1478
01:18:27,359 --> 01:18:32,149
generally located at the at the northeast corner of loop 28

1479
01:18:32,149 --> 01:18:32,720
8 and

1480
01:18:32,720 --> 01:18:38,050
McKinney currently the property has a zoning designation of

1481
01:18:38,050 --> 01:18:40,079
ECI it also has

1482
01:18:40,079 --> 01:18:45,760
frontage on on several major roads loop 288 McKinney and

1483
01:18:45,760 --> 01:18:47,439
then also the future

1484
01:18:47,439 --> 01:18:53,159
alignment of Mayhill it also has some frontage on market

1485
01:18:53,159 --> 01:18:55,199
and just to kind of

1486
01:18:55,199 --> 01:18:58,670
discuss what's existing on the site because there are a few

1487
01:18:58,670 --> 01:18:59,640
uses existing on

1488
01:18:59,640 --> 01:19:02,859
the site first of all on the north side of the property is

1489
01:19:02,859 --> 01:19:04,199
an existing building

1490
01:19:04,199 --> 01:19:07,140
it is come recently come to my attention that that that

1491
01:19:07,140 --> 01:19:08,319
property has actually

1492
01:19:08,319 --> 01:19:11,369
sold and I believe the property owner for that for that

1493
01:19:11,369 --> 01:19:12,640
piece of property is

1494
01:19:12,640 --> 01:19:15,420
here tonight and we'll be able to speak to you after my

1495
01:19:15,420 --> 01:19:17,840
presentation and I

1496
01:19:17,840 --> 01:19:21,409
believe that as it is currently being used as a community

1497
01:19:21,409 --> 01:19:22,640
service facility

1498
01:19:22,640 --> 01:19:26,890
there's also some warehouses on the property as well as

1499
01:19:26,890 --> 01:19:28,239
some single-family

1500
01:19:28,239 --> 01:19:32,970
homes there was once a lumberyard at the corner of loop 288

1501
01:19:32,970 --> 01:19:33,800
and McKinney that is

1502
01:19:33,800 --> 01:19:37,090
no longer there and then there's some there's quite a few

1503
01:19:37,090 --> 01:19:38,000
trees within the

1504
01:19:38,000 --> 01:19:40,760
center of the property so just to let you know prior to

1505
01:19:40,760 --> 01:19:42,319
development they will

1506
01:19:42,319 --> 01:19:45,239
have there will be an environmental sensitive area

1507
01:19:45,239 --> 01:19:46,199
assessment that will need

1508
01:19:46,199 --> 01:19:49,800
to be done in order to determine if this is upland habitat

1509
01:19:49,800 --> 01:19:50,840
if it is an additional

1510
01:19:50,840 --> 01:19:54,760
tree preservation requirements may apply

1511
01:19:55,600 --> 01:19:58,109
so to begin our analysis we first look at what the

1512
01:19:58,109 --> 01:19:59,720
properties are immediately

1513
01:19:59,720 --> 01:20:03,310
adjacent to the site so within about 200 feet so you can

1514
01:20:03,310 --> 01:20:04,920
see there is adjacent

1515
01:20:04,920 --> 01:20:08,189
ECI which includes some self-storage uses some office uses

1516
01:20:08,189 --> 01:20:09,079
as well as some

1517
01:20:09,079 --> 01:20:14,100
vehicle repair to the north there's also CMG and CME across

1518
01:20:14,100 --> 01:20:15,199
loop 288 and

1519
01:20:15,199 --> 01:20:18,930
McKinney which includes commercial development as well as

1520
01:20:18,930 --> 01:20:20,119
multifamily in

1521
01:20:20,119 --> 01:20:24,520
our MU is across loop 288 to the north which has developed

1522
01:20:24,520 --> 01:20:25,920
with a multifamily

1523
01:20:25,920 --> 01:20:30,800
use if we zoom out a little further we see that further

1524
01:20:30,800 --> 01:20:31,600
further west you've

1525
01:20:31,600 --> 01:20:34,170
got a single-family residential neighborhood that has an NR

1526
01:20:34,170 --> 01:20:34,720
for zoning

1527
01:20:34,720 --> 01:20:39,159
district some NR MU 12 in this area which has multifamily

1528
01:20:39,159 --> 01:20:40,920
development RD 5x

1529
01:20:40,920 --> 01:20:45,329
off to the east which includes office single-family office

1530
01:20:45,329 --> 01:20:46,159
and single-family

1531
01:20:46,159 --> 01:20:49,319
development as well as some agriculture and then in our in

1532
01:20:49,319 --> 01:20:50,359
our two which has a

1533
01:20:50,359 --> 01:20:55,750
high school on it so it has quite a few mix of uses one of

1534
01:20:55,750 --> 01:20:57,199
the large factors in

1535
01:20:57,199 --> 01:21:01,520
our analysis of this request was the mobility of the area

1536
01:21:01,520 --> 01:21:03,479
in terms of the

1537
01:21:03,479 --> 01:21:06,729
access to the site and that will the final access will be

1538
01:21:06,729 --> 01:21:07,680
done upon site

1539
01:21:07,680 --> 01:21:11,869
planning and platting but in terms of what what the nearby

1540
01:21:11,869 --> 01:21:13,079
road network is

1541
01:21:13,079 --> 01:21:16,340
first of all we've got a secondary arterial which is McKin

1542
01:21:16,340 --> 01:21:17,800
ney the intent of

1543
01:21:17,800 --> 01:21:21,229
a secondary arterial is to move our residents through the

1544
01:21:21,229 --> 01:21:22,039
city to different

1545
01:21:22,039 --> 01:21:28,159
parts of the city it also has an existing arterial loop 288

1546
01:21:28,159 --> 01:21:28,880
we probably

1547
01:21:28,880 --> 01:21:32,189
are all familiar with in this area it's it's a commercial

1548
01:21:32,189 --> 01:21:33,880
corridor and the

1549
01:21:33,880 --> 01:21:36,409
intent of an arterial is to move people not only through

1550
01:21:36,409 --> 01:21:37,439
the city but into and

1551
01:21:37,439 --> 01:21:42,500
out of the city and then we also have a an arterial that is

1552
01:21:42,500 --> 01:21:43,680
is soon to be

1553
01:21:43,680 --> 01:21:47,250
constructed and that is the realignment of May Hill and I

1554
01:21:47,250 --> 01:21:48,600
will go into that a

1555
01:21:48,600 --> 01:21:50,869
little further on the next slide but but that is also

1556
01:21:50,869 --> 01:21:52,239
functioning functioning as

1557
01:21:52,239 --> 01:21:54,510
an arterial to move people into the city as well as through

1558
01:21:54,510 --> 01:21:55,319
through the city

1559
01:21:55,319 --> 01:21:58,539
there's also some collectors Mills Road as well as some

1560
01:21:58,539 --> 01:22:00,039
collectors to the north

1561
01:22:00,039 --> 01:22:03,510
of the subject property and then let's take a little closer

1562
01:22:03,510 --> 01:22:04,479
look at or a little

1563
01:22:04,479 --> 01:22:08,239
further outlook zoomed outlook of May Hill so right now you

1564
01:22:08,239 --> 01:22:09,439
can see the subject

1565
01:22:09,439 --> 01:22:14,510
property is here in that yellow star and this this dot dash

1566
01:22:14,510 --> 01:22:16,119
ed line is is a a

1567
01:22:16,119 --> 01:22:20,479
schematic of the future of May Hill alignment and that is

1568
01:22:20,479 --> 01:22:21,479
intended to

1569
01:22:21,479 --> 01:22:25,159
connect to go to go north of the city as well as connect to

1570
01:22:25,159 --> 01:22:27,439
the south to 2499 at

1571
01:22:27,439 --> 01:22:31,359
Teasley and that goes all the way to DFW Airport so this is

1572
01:22:31,359 --> 01:22:32,680
going to be quite a

1573
01:22:32,680 --> 01:22:35,760
regional connection that will affect not only the

1574
01:22:35,760 --> 01:22:37,520
development of the subject

1575
01:22:37,520 --> 01:22:42,869
property but but a lot of the property along that corridor

1576
01:22:42,869 --> 01:22:44,760
didn't plan 2030

1577
01:22:44,760 --> 01:22:48,649
identifies this area as as in terms of future land use and

1578
01:22:48,649 --> 01:22:49,560
what type of

1579
01:22:49,560 --> 01:22:52,489
development we want to see as community mixed use the

1580
01:22:52,489 --> 01:22:53,960
intent of community mixed

1581
01:22:53,960 --> 01:22:56,380
use is to promote a mix of uses but predominantly

1582
01:22:56,380 --> 01:22:57,800
commercial commercial

1583
01:22:57,800 --> 01:23:02,380
development with some possible residential service or other

1584
01:23:02,380 --> 01:23:03,319
office uses

1585
01:23:03,319 --> 01:23:06,439
employment uses this development should complement the

1586
01:23:06,439 --> 01:23:08,239
existing development use

1587
01:23:08,239 --> 01:23:11,600
pattern and and design and should raise that standard of

1588
01:23:11,600 --> 01:23:12,720
design and have it

1589
01:23:12,720 --> 01:23:16,670
develop in a commercial way typical development it would be

1590
01:23:16,670 --> 01:23:16,960
the the

1591
01:23:16,960 --> 01:23:21,159
supermarkets drugstores specialty shops maybe midsize

1592
01:23:21,159 --> 01:23:23,000
offices and and possibly

1593
01:23:23,000 --> 01:23:27,279
higher density housing the uses within the proposed CMG

1594
01:23:27,279 --> 01:23:29,079
district do align with

1595
01:23:29,079 --> 01:23:32,960
the future land use so it is compatible and conforms to the

1596
01:23:32,960 --> 01:23:33,840
the goals of the

1597
01:23:33,840 --> 01:23:40,560
area per the Denton plan 2030 so when we look at a case we

1598
01:23:40,560 --> 01:23:41,720
we look at the

1599
01:23:41,720 --> 01:23:44,239
comprehensive plan but we also want to take a look at the

1600
01:23:44,239 --> 01:23:45,159
at the surrounding

1601
01:23:45,159 --> 01:23:48,119
properties and what the compatibility is and how we want to

1602
01:23:48,119 --> 01:23:49,039
see it develop so

1603
01:23:49,039 --> 01:23:52,890
staff does believe that CMG district is appropriate in this

1604
01:23:52,890 --> 01:23:53,880
location as we

1605
01:23:53,880 --> 01:23:57,880
typically want to see commercial type development on arter

1606
01:23:57,880 --> 01:23:59,199
ial roadways right

1607
01:23:59,199 --> 01:24:02,170
now under current zoning it is one of our more industrial

1608
01:24:02,170 --> 01:24:03,079
districts that

1609
01:24:03,079 --> 01:24:06,270
allows more some some industrial uses and allows us to

1610
01:24:06,270 --> 01:24:07,720
develop in an industrial

1611
01:24:07,720 --> 01:24:14,149
way and so staff feels like this is at this rezoning to CMG

1612
01:24:14,149 --> 01:24:14,960
would would would

1613
01:24:14,960 --> 01:24:17,390
not only get this property in conformance with the future

1614
01:24:17,390 --> 01:24:18,000
land use but

1615
01:24:18,000 --> 01:24:22,840
also would align with the the types of uses we typically

1616
01:24:22,840 --> 01:24:24,479
want to see when when

1617
01:24:24,479 --> 01:24:27,109
you've got this kind of access in terms of the Mayhill the

1618
01:24:27,109 --> 01:24:28,640
loop 288 and even

1619
01:24:28,640 --> 01:24:32,659
McKinney it is a logical extension of the existing zoning

1620
01:24:32,659 --> 01:24:34,319
pattern if you just

1621
01:24:34,319 --> 01:24:38,579
take a look on the bottom picture map you've got CMG on

1622
01:24:38,579 --> 01:24:40,199
three corners of that

1623
01:24:40,199 --> 01:24:44,680
loop 288 McKinney intersection so this really is just a

1624
01:24:44,680 --> 01:24:45,319
completion of that

1625
01:24:45,319 --> 01:24:49,210
intersection and as I said the future and existing road

1626
01:24:49,210 --> 01:24:50,560
network provides

1627
01:24:50,560 --> 01:24:54,310
adequate access and is appropriate for that CMG we do we do

1628
01:24:54,310 --> 01:24:55,039
want to be sensitive

1629
01:24:55,039 --> 01:24:58,229
to the adjacent residential and the nearby residential and

1630
01:24:58,229 --> 01:24:59,119
so in looking at

1631
01:24:59,119 --> 01:25:03,390
this that that existing roadway network does provide some

1632
01:25:03,390 --> 01:25:04,399
separation from these

1633
01:25:04,399 --> 01:25:07,960
commercial uses to those residential neighborhoods nearby

1634
01:25:07,960 --> 01:25:08,720
provides a little

1635
01:25:08,720 --> 01:25:12,930
bit of buffer a little bit of nuisance mitigation there was

1636
01:25:12,930 --> 01:25:13,760
a public

1637
01:25:13,760 --> 01:25:17,500
notification sent out and we received two notices in favor

1638
01:25:17,500 --> 01:25:18,479
and I believe I

1639
01:25:18,479 --> 01:25:23,010
provided those to you at the work session so based upon the

1640
01:25:23,010 --> 01:25:23,680
the criteria

1641
01:25:23,680 --> 01:25:26,710
for approval for that it must meet the future land use and

1642
01:25:26,710 --> 01:25:27,479
then also the

1643
01:25:27,479 --> 01:25:30,479
character of the area staff does recommend approval of the

1644
01:25:30,479 --> 01:25:31,079
request I'll

1645
01:25:31,079 --> 01:25:33,770
stand for any questions and the applicant is here to answer

1646
01:25:33,770 --> 01:25:34,279
any further

1647
01:25:34,279 --> 01:25:37,479
questions you have thank you Julie any questions for staff

1648
01:25:37,479 --> 01:25:38,039
at this time

1649
01:25:38,039 --> 01:25:42,319
Commissioner Beck thank you vice chair this probably isn't

1650
01:25:42,319 --> 01:25:43,119
necessarily

1651
01:25:43,119 --> 01:25:47,810
appropriate question for zone chain thing but the expansion

1652
01:25:47,810 --> 01:25:48,840
of McKinney

1653
01:25:48,840 --> 01:25:51,180
obviously if we're going to make the second arterial has to

1654
01:25:51,180 --> 01:25:51,760
be four lanes

1655
01:25:51,760 --> 01:25:56,140
correct two lanes going each way if this plan goes through

1656
01:25:56,140 --> 01:25:58,119
all the way can we

1657
01:25:58,119 --> 01:26:02,420
expect McKinney to be widened by the time completion of

1658
01:26:02,420 --> 01:26:03,399
construction or maybe

1659
01:26:03,399 --> 01:26:07,149
even prior to well I don't know about any city projects

1660
01:26:07,149 --> 01:26:07,840
associated with

1661
01:26:07,840 --> 01:26:10,380
McKinney but in terms of the current requirements for

1662
01:26:10,380 --> 01:26:11,560
development within the

1663
01:26:11,560 --> 01:26:17,319
city at the time of development a developer would have to

1664
01:26:17,319 --> 01:26:18,000
improve their

1665
01:26:18,000 --> 01:26:22,050
section of that road for their half so there would be right

1666
01:26:22,050 --> 01:26:23,199
of way dedication

1667
01:26:23,199 --> 01:26:27,050
associated with the plat so if there's not if there's if we

1668
01:26:27,050 --> 01:26:27,920
if the existing

1669
01:26:27,920 --> 01:26:30,260
right away doesn't match what with the future expansion of

1670
01:26:30,260 --> 01:26:31,079
McKinney is then

1671
01:26:31,079 --> 01:26:33,439
then if that would have to be dedicated at the time of plat

1672
01:26:33,439 --> 01:26:34,680
ting and then during

1673
01:26:34,680 --> 01:26:37,560
site planning construction any public perimeter

1674
01:26:37,560 --> 01:26:39,479
improvements would on those

1675
01:26:39,479 --> 01:26:42,430
streets would have to be completed so the developer would

1676
01:26:42,430 --> 01:26:43,199
be responsible for

1677
01:26:43,199 --> 01:26:47,000
at least two lanes that about their property on the Kennedy

1678
01:26:47,000 --> 01:26:48,880
well in terms of

1679
01:26:48,880 --> 01:26:54,000
I could why don't I call Jim jinx out and he can be a

1680
01:26:54,000 --> 01:26:55,039
little more specificity

1681
01:26:55,039 --> 01:26:58,439
so I'll have Jim come up

1682
01:27:05,720 --> 01:27:09,819
so the question was required improvements to McKinney

1683
01:27:09,819 --> 01:27:10,720
Street itself

1684
01:27:10,720 --> 01:27:19,720
right okay at the time of construction right right I don't

1685
01:27:19,720 --> 01:27:20,359
think on this

1686
01:27:20,359 --> 01:27:26,439
project I don't think a plat has been submitted yet right

1687
01:27:26,439 --> 01:27:27,439
so we really haven't

1688
01:27:27,439 --> 01:27:33,159
gotten to those issues yet okay however I mean our typical

1689
01:27:33,159 --> 01:27:35,439
exactions would be

1690
01:27:35,439 --> 01:27:39,640
right away along the applicants frontage McKinney is a

1691
01:27:39,640 --> 01:27:42,800
secondary arterial so

1692
01:27:42,800 --> 01:27:48,399
typical exaction there would be half the ultimate 110 foot

1693
01:27:48,399 --> 01:27:50,239
section 55 foot in

1694
01:27:50,239 --> 01:27:55,970
this case beyond that like I said we those sorts of things

1695
01:27:55,970 --> 01:27:57,279
usually are

1696
01:27:57,279 --> 01:28:01,210
determined upon platting okay and McKinney is still a text

1697
01:28:01,210 --> 01:28:03,720
dot no no sir

1698
01:28:03,720 --> 01:28:07,520
not anymore I believe last year it converted over to the

1699
01:28:07,520 --> 01:28:08,720
city okay I knew

1700
01:28:08,720 --> 01:28:15,800
that that was in the plans okay great thank you Jim any

1701
01:28:15,800 --> 01:28:16,640
other questions for

1702
01:28:16,640 --> 01:28:20,050
stuff Commissioner Ellis thank you vice-chair Julie did we

1703
01:28:20,050 --> 01:28:21,199
ever clarify if

1704
01:28:21,199 --> 01:28:25,680
there were private homeowners on that side of the property

1705
01:28:25,680 --> 01:28:26,800
I think the

1706
01:28:26,800 --> 01:28:29,399
applicant would be able to answer that a little more fully

1707
01:28:29,399 --> 01:28:30,319
I did speak with him

1708
01:28:30,319 --> 01:28:32,800
before this meeting and he said those houses were vacant

1709
01:28:32,800 --> 01:28:33,680
but you may want to

1710
01:28:33,680 --> 01:28:36,920
confirm it with him and make sure that we're all talking

1711
01:28:36,920 --> 01:28:38,199
about the same thing

1712
01:28:38,560 --> 01:28:40,729
thank you Julie I think that's all the questions we have

1713
01:28:40,729 --> 01:28:41,520
this is a public

1714
01:28:41,520 --> 01:28:44,109
hearing anyone wishing to speak can do so I have two cards

1715
01:28:44,109 --> 01:28:44,960
for individuals

1716
01:28:44,960 --> 01:28:49,359
wanting to speak the first would be Pat Smith if you would

1717
01:28:49,359 --> 01:28:52,079
like to come down if

1718
01:28:52,079 --> 01:28:55,840
you're wishing to speak if you just say your name and

1719
01:28:55,840 --> 01:28:57,600
address and you have four

1720
01:28:57,600 --> 01:29:03,329
minutes good evening I'm Pat Smith 1417 Cambridge Lane I

1721
01:29:03,329 --> 01:29:04,880
represent that an

1722
01:29:04,880 --> 01:29:07,930
assistant center also known as served in we are currently

1723
01:29:07,930 --> 01:29:08,840
the owners of the

1724
01:29:08,840 --> 01:29:13,420
building at 306 North Loop 288 we acquired that as of

1725
01:29:13,420 --> 01:29:16,479
September 1st just

1726
01:29:16,479 --> 01:29:20,779
simply to state that we fully support this request this

1727
01:29:20,779 --> 01:29:23,039
will become a

1728
01:29:23,039 --> 01:29:28,500
multi-tenant facility for nonprofits to include a health

1729
01:29:28,500 --> 01:29:30,359
clinic offices for

1730
01:29:30,359 --> 01:29:33,409
about nine different agencies as of right now with the

1731
01:29:33,409 --> 01:29:34,640
capability to serve

1732
01:29:34,640 --> 01:29:38,640
several other agencies and we're very excited about the

1733
01:29:38,640 --> 01:29:40,840
opportunity to begin

1734
01:29:40,840 --> 01:29:43,810
construction in the next couple weeks and we'll keep you

1735
01:29:43,810 --> 01:29:45,600
updated as we go any

1736
01:29:45,600 --> 01:29:50,399
questions Commissioner Smith Mr. Smith for clarification

1737
01:29:50,399 --> 01:29:51,640
just for any ethical

1738
01:29:51,640 --> 01:29:54,159
issues that I may fall into can you clarify your role

1739
01:29:54,159 --> 01:29:55,119
currently with serve

1740
01:29:55,119 --> 01:29:59,159
Denton yes I am a board member I am not executive director

1741
01:29:59,159 --> 01:29:59,880
you receive no

1742
01:29:59,880 --> 01:30:01,930
compensation whatsoever from the organization right now

1743
01:30:01,930 --> 01:30:04,079
correct thank you

1744
01:30:04,079 --> 01:30:08,439
I sure I do have a comment yes our question for mr. Smith

1745
01:30:08,439 --> 01:30:10,000
mr. Smith it's my

1746
01:30:10,000 --> 01:30:13,000
understanding you purchased the property in September or

1747
01:30:13,000 --> 01:30:14,760
closed or not not you

1748
01:30:14,760 --> 01:30:18,449
person but served in at the time of submittal of the

1749
01:30:18,449 --> 01:30:19,760
application it was

1750
01:30:19,760 --> 01:30:22,520
under a different ownership and so the application was

1751
01:30:22,520 --> 01:30:23,960
submitted under that

1752
01:30:23,960 --> 01:30:28,720
understanding however now that the served in owns the

1753
01:30:28,720 --> 01:30:30,720
property are you okay

1754
01:30:30,720 --> 01:30:33,439
with the zoning district because it is going to be included

1755
01:30:33,439 --> 01:30:35,159
the property is as

1756
01:30:35,159 --> 01:30:41,239
long as the current property owner is in agreement with the

1757
01:30:41,239 --> 01:30:43,239
application moving

1758
01:30:43,239 --> 01:30:47,039
forward and is this yes okay we've checked the

1759
01:30:47,039 --> 01:30:48,800
compatibility code there's

1760
01:30:48,800 --> 01:30:54,189
no issues for our perspective and so that to close the loop

1761
01:30:54,189 --> 01:30:55,640
we will require

1762
01:30:55,640 --> 01:31:01,149
served in the representative of served in to help clarify

1763
01:31:01,149 --> 01:31:02,600
the issue fill out

1764
01:31:02,600 --> 01:31:06,960
and sign the application so that it's in our records to

1765
01:31:06,960 --> 01:31:08,920
show that the property

1766
01:31:08,920 --> 01:31:12,470
owner is in agreement of the zoning change we'll be happy

1767
01:31:12,470 --> 01:31:15,199
to do that see no

1768
01:31:15,199 --> 01:31:18,149
other questions thank you mr. Smith the next card I have is

1769
01:31:18,149 --> 01:31:19,680
for Greg Johnson so

1770
01:31:19,680 --> 01:31:22,500
you can just state your name and address for the record and

1771
01:31:22,500 --> 01:31:23,800
you got four minutes

1772
01:31:23,800 --> 01:31:27,899
as well shocker but I actually won't take my four minutes

1773
01:31:27,899 --> 01:31:28,359
it'd be the first

1774
01:31:28,359 --> 01:31:31,439
time ever thank you all for your service I just want to

1775
01:31:31,439 --> 01:31:32,239
speak in favor of this

1776
01:31:32,239 --> 01:31:36,739
project our firm leases and sells a lot of property on loop

1777
01:31:36,739 --> 01:31:39,279
288 corridor I think

1778
01:31:39,279 --> 01:31:42,039
it's safe to say that that corner is rather blighted today

1779
01:31:42,039 --> 01:31:43,399
mr. strange has

1780
01:31:43,399 --> 01:31:45,739
assembled a lot of property there with the opportunity to

1781
01:31:45,739 --> 01:31:46,520
create a real true

1782
01:31:46,520 --> 01:31:50,659
quality mixed-use project I think we'd be really proud of

1783
01:31:50,659 --> 01:31:51,800
and that would

1784
01:31:51,800 --> 01:31:54,899
continue that quality development going to the north it's

1785
01:31:54,899 --> 01:31:56,359
kind of stopped you

1786
01:31:56,359 --> 01:31:59,090
know down there south of the county annex right now and I

1787
01:31:59,090 --> 01:31:59,960
think this project

1788
01:31:59,960 --> 01:32:03,920
would continue and and and really we'd love to see a

1789
01:32:03,920 --> 01:32:05,800
quality grocery store

1790
01:32:05,800 --> 01:32:10,289
there and I think that once this thing kicks off I think we

1791
01:32:10,289 --> 01:32:10,800
'll be able to

1792
01:32:10,800 --> 01:32:13,880
attract a lot higher quality tenants that have been a

1793
01:32:13,880 --> 01:32:15,079
little bit scared of

1794
01:32:15,079 --> 01:32:18,020
that part of town that all seem to want to be close to

1795
01:32:18,020 --> 01:32:19,439
raise a ranch and group

1796
01:32:19,439 --> 01:32:21,800
together up there and so I would highly encourage you to

1797
01:32:21,800 --> 01:32:22,560
recommend approval of

1798
01:32:22,560 --> 01:32:24,630
this project because I think it's really going to help that

1799
01:32:24,630 --> 01:32:25,600
part of town thank

1800
01:32:25,600 --> 01:32:29,260
you see any other questions I have one more card mr. JV

1801
01:32:29,260 --> 01:32:31,319
strange if you just

1802
01:32:31,319 --> 01:32:35,819
state your name and address you have four minutes good

1803
01:32:35,819 --> 01:32:36,760
evening ladies and

1804
01:32:36,760 --> 01:32:40,800
gentlemen my name is JV strange my office address is 531

1805
01:32:40,800 --> 01:32:42,079
North Locust in

1806
01:32:42,079 --> 01:32:46,039
Texas 76201 appreciate the opportunity to come before you

1807
01:32:46,039 --> 01:32:50,279
tonight I think that

1808
01:32:50,279 --> 01:32:53,920
mrs. white made a very comprehensive presentation both as a

1809
01:32:53,920 --> 01:32:54,760
work session and

1810
01:32:54,760 --> 01:32:57,989
tonight as to what the merits of this zoning case are

1811
01:32:57,989 --> 01:32:59,640
appreciate mr. Johnson

1812
01:32:59,640 --> 01:33:02,529
- he pretty much stole my thunder so probably could give

1813
01:33:02,529 --> 01:33:03,600
him giving him part

1814
01:33:03,600 --> 01:33:07,770
of my four minutes but I did want to reiterate a couple

1815
01:33:07,770 --> 01:33:09,479
things as I mentioned

1816
01:33:09,479 --> 01:33:11,880
except through your work session this afternoon and I heard

1817
01:33:11,880 --> 01:33:12,399
a couple of

1818
01:33:12,399 --> 01:33:16,220
questions and to clarify where we are when you look at the

1819
01:33:16,220 --> 01:33:17,680
property bounded in

1820
01:33:17,680 --> 01:33:23,010
yellow we owned on or owned all that property when we

1821
01:33:23,010 --> 01:33:24,239
applied for our zoning

1822
01:33:24,239 --> 01:33:29,199
back in I think was May 17th we did own the county building

1823
01:33:29,199 --> 01:33:30,159
we didn't go into

1824
01:33:30,159 --> 01:33:34,840
contract to sell that to them until July 7th and then as mr

1825
01:33:34,840 --> 01:33:36,640
. Smith indicated that

1826
01:33:36,640 --> 01:33:40,109
property was closed near the end of August 1st September so

1827
01:33:40,109 --> 01:33:41,199
we were well into

1828
01:33:41,199 --> 01:33:44,359
the zoning at the point in time that that sale was contempl

1829
01:33:44,359 --> 01:33:46,000
ated I would take

1830
01:33:46,000 --> 01:33:49,420
it oversight by having not made sure with city that we

1831
01:33:49,420 --> 01:33:50,720
needed him included

1832
01:33:50,720 --> 01:33:52,909
but I think you've heard tonight he is willing to be

1833
01:33:52,909 --> 01:33:55,079
included we do not own the

1834
01:33:55,079 --> 01:33:59,220
2.157 acres at the southeast corner down at the

1835
01:33:59,220 --> 01:34:01,520
intersection of McKinney and Luke

1836
01:34:01,520 --> 01:34:06,359
288 we sold that to 7-eleven corporation we did go back to

1837
01:34:06,359 --> 01:34:07,060
them and they

1838
01:34:07,060 --> 01:34:10,960
submitted a letter a letter of consent that they wish to be

1839
01:34:10,960 --> 01:34:12,399
included it's more

1840
01:34:12,399 --> 01:34:16,850
compatible with what they intend to do with the property so

1841
01:34:16,850 --> 01:34:19,119
that with the

1842
01:34:19,119 --> 01:34:21,939
exception of served in which we did own but we now don't

1843
01:34:21,939 --> 01:34:22,840
own and with the

1844
01:34:22,840 --> 01:34:25,859
exception of 7-eleven which we did own and sold but have

1845
01:34:25,859 --> 01:34:26,760
their letter of

1846
01:34:26,760 --> 01:34:30,119
consent we do have title to all of the other properties

1847
01:34:30,119 --> 01:34:31,359
that were within that

1848
01:34:31,359 --> 01:34:36,520
yellow just to be clear on it the properties along McKinney

1849
01:34:36,520 --> 01:34:38,279
Street don't

1850
01:34:38,279 --> 01:34:41,970
have a pointer but where that loop is where the small Oak

1851
01:34:41,970 --> 01:34:44,119
Hill office park is

1852
01:34:44,119 --> 01:34:49,010
that we acquired back in September of 16 the adjacent

1853
01:34:49,010 --> 01:34:51,000
property to it that runs

1854
01:34:51,000 --> 01:34:56,170
the entire length of the property along that kind of a gray

1855
01:34:56,170 --> 01:34:57,020
line we also

1856
01:34:57,020 --> 01:35:02,060
acquired back in September of last year then we acquired

1857
01:35:02,060 --> 01:35:03,920
several individual

1858
01:35:03,920 --> 01:35:08,689
tracks along McKinney Street there is one if you went out

1859
01:35:08,689 --> 01:35:09,680
there today there's

1860
01:35:09,680 --> 01:35:13,149
one little tiny tiny house there that in another good wind

1861
01:35:13,149 --> 01:35:14,239
will fall down and

1862
01:35:14,239 --> 01:35:17,850
we'll hold it off there is nobody living there there is a

1863
01:35:17,850 --> 01:35:19,239
nicer home up to the

1864
01:35:19,239 --> 01:35:22,899
north toward the northeast corner belong to Mrs. Fonny

1865
01:35:22,899 --> 01:35:24,800
George we bought that

1866
01:35:24,800 --> 01:35:27,560
property last September we allowed miss George to continue

1867
01:35:27,560 --> 01:35:28,319
living there for six

1868
01:35:28,319 --> 01:35:32,060
months rent free to give her time to find another home she

1869
01:35:32,060 --> 01:35:32,880
has something

1870
01:35:32,880 --> 01:35:37,300
moved out we did have a temporary renter in there they have

1871
01:35:37,300 --> 01:35:38,560
moved out in any

1872
01:35:38,560 --> 01:35:41,079
tenants that go in there will be our tenants and will be

1873
01:35:41,079 --> 01:35:41,720
subject to a

1874
01:35:41,720 --> 01:35:46,170
short-term lease so just to clarify those those points we

1875
01:35:46,170 --> 01:35:46,640
do on the

1876
01:35:46,640 --> 01:35:51,449
property I know that it came before PNZ and the council

1877
01:35:51,449 --> 01:35:53,319
previously but this area

1878
01:35:53,319 --> 01:35:56,960
was to be a CMG zoning it was in the Denton 2030 plan with

1879
01:35:56,960 --> 01:35:57,520
both which were

1880
01:35:57,520 --> 01:36:01,180
approved here at its City Council so we bought the property

1881
01:36:01,180 --> 01:36:02,279
felt like we felt

1882
01:36:02,279 --> 01:36:05,289
like that we were in compliance with the zoning that was in

1883
01:36:05,289 --> 01:36:06,439
place or the zoning

1884
01:36:06,439 --> 01:36:10,850
designations that were in place in working with staff we

1885
01:36:10,850 --> 01:36:12,640
have assured that

1886
01:36:12,640 --> 01:36:14,640
anything we plan to do out there hopefully will be covered

1887
01:36:14,640 --> 01:36:15,119
aren't this

1888
01:36:15,119 --> 01:36:19,050
zoning we just want to get this is owned at this time then

1889
01:36:19,050 --> 01:36:19,680
we will commence

1890
01:36:19,680 --> 01:36:23,520
working on plans to further develop a property but zoning

1891
01:36:23,520 --> 01:36:24,800
is a first step no

1892
01:36:24,800 --> 01:36:27,770
need take any steps out there beyond this until we are

1893
01:36:27,770 --> 01:36:28,760
zones that window

1894
01:36:28,760 --> 01:36:32,229
exactly what uses we can and cannot have but I will tell

1895
01:36:32,229 --> 01:36:33,199
you anything that we're

1896
01:36:33,199 --> 01:36:37,449
contemplating doing on the property will confront will

1897
01:36:37,449 --> 01:36:40,239
conform to CMG zoning if

1898
01:36:40,239 --> 01:36:43,989
you haven't been out there I would also tell you that as of

1899
01:36:43,989 --> 01:36:45,239
today the ME is out

1900
01:36:45,239 --> 01:36:48,289
there putting telephone or putting the new power lines up

1901
01:36:48,289 --> 01:36:49,359
along the west side

1902
01:36:49,359 --> 01:36:52,970
of Mayhill the gas line is gas companies already completed

1903
01:36:52,970 --> 01:36:54,460
their gas line so the

1904
01:36:54,460 --> 01:36:57,979
widening of Mayhill is underway thank goodness and one

1905
01:36:57,979 --> 01:36:59,880
question came up I think

1906
01:36:59,880 --> 01:37:03,590
earlier there's a little strip between our yellow line and

1907
01:37:03,590 --> 01:37:06,319
Mayhill and that is

1908
01:37:06,319 --> 01:37:09,470
right of way that has already been taken by the city of

1909
01:37:09,470 --> 01:37:10,720
Denton so we have no

1910
01:37:10,720 --> 01:37:13,130
further right of way requirements along Mayhill that has

1911
01:37:13,130 --> 01:37:14,560
already all been taken

1912
01:37:14,560 --> 01:37:18,270
in consideration and I think a portion of the right right

1913
01:37:18,270 --> 01:37:19,439
away alone McKinney

1914
01:37:19,439 --> 01:37:22,819
but my understanding has also been taken account if not as

1915
01:37:22,819 --> 01:37:23,880
it was mentioned

1916
01:37:23,880 --> 01:37:27,060
earlier as it comes down to the platting stages we will

1917
01:37:27,060 --> 01:37:28,119
consider a lot of

1918
01:37:28,119 --> 01:37:33,359
requirements are there so anyway I would ask you if there

1919
01:37:33,359 --> 01:37:34,800
are any questions or

1920
01:37:34,800 --> 01:37:37,350
anything and get was not clear to you and either either the

1921
01:37:37,350 --> 01:37:38,279
presentations or

1922
01:37:38,279 --> 01:37:42,039
if there's any other questions that you would have of me I

1923
01:37:42,039 --> 01:37:43,479
do not see any

1924
01:37:43,479 --> 01:37:49,920
questions thank you mr. strange I just want to say just you

1925
01:37:49,920 --> 01:37:50,720
clarified a lot of

1926
01:37:50,720 --> 01:37:53,800
the questions we had and those are some of the questions we

1927
01:37:53,800 --> 01:37:54,560
that I had was

1928
01:37:54,560 --> 01:37:59,149
ownership so I appreciate that yeah we also had letters

1929
01:37:59,149 --> 01:37:59,880
that we gave to see

1930
01:37:59,880 --> 01:38:02,239
the staff on all I appreciate you going to such detail

1931
01:38:02,239 --> 01:38:03,880
thank you very much any

1932
01:38:03,880 --> 01:38:07,810
other questions I do not see any thank you this is a public

1933
01:38:07,810 --> 01:38:08,399
hearing anyone

1934
01:38:08,399 --> 01:38:13,859
wishing to speak may do so seeing none I will close the

1935
01:38:13,859 --> 01:38:15,159
public hearing and open

1936
01:38:15,159 --> 01:38:19,479
the floor for discussion and or motion Commissioner Ellis

1937
01:38:19,479 --> 01:38:21,359
thank you vice chair

1938
01:38:21,359 --> 01:38:24,939
I think this is an ideal request for this property I think

1939
01:38:24,939 --> 01:38:25,560
this has been a

1940
01:38:25,560 --> 01:38:28,210
long-forgotten part of town as it was stated before and I

1941
01:38:28,210 --> 01:38:29,560
think it's going to

1942
01:38:29,560 --> 01:38:32,100
be a great development great for the town so I will motion

1943
01:38:32,100 --> 01:38:33,079
to approve thank

1944
01:38:33,079 --> 01:38:35,840
you commissioner Smith I will second that motion we have a

1945
01:38:35,840 --> 01:38:36,640
first and a second

1946
01:38:36,640 --> 01:38:42,180
any further discussion seeing none I'll call for a vote on

1947
01:38:42,180 --> 01:38:43,199
the board

1948
01:38:54,239 --> 01:39:03,720
motion carries six zero one refusal thank you

1949
01:39:24,239 --> 01:39:38,279
a couple minutes clear to our item a public hearing for a

1950
01:39:38,279 --> 01:39:51,319
dash zero zero good evening I'm

1951
01:39:51,319 --> 01:39:54,439
Julie Wyatt senior planner with the city of Denton and I'm

1952
01:39:54,439 --> 01:39:55,880
presenting Z 1713

1953
01:39:55,880 --> 01:39:59,170
Justice Plaza the request is to hold a public hearing and

1954
01:39:59,170 --> 01:40:00,239
consider making a

1955
01:40:00,239 --> 01:40:05,840
recommendation regarding a rezoning on 3.2 acres from an NR

1956
01:40:05,840 --> 01:40:07,159
6 zoning district to

1957
01:40:07,159 --> 01:40:11,430
an NR MU 12 zoning district just to orient to orient you to

1958
01:40:11,430 --> 01:40:12,560
the site it is

1959
01:40:12,560 --> 01:40:16,159
it is located on the eastern part of town north of McKinney

1960
01:40:16,159 --> 01:40:17,600
about 420 feet

1961
01:40:17,600 --> 01:40:22,189
north of McKinney on Janney Street or I'm sorry east of Jan

1962
01:40:22,189 --> 01:40:24,840
ney Street a little

1963
01:40:24,840 --> 01:40:27,680
bit of background the property is part of a seven acre

1964
01:40:27,680 --> 01:40:29,439
tract which was rezoned

1965
01:40:29,439 --> 01:40:33,899
in in 2014 to include of mixes zoning districts the intent

1966
01:40:33,899 --> 01:40:34,760
at that time the

1967
01:40:34,760 --> 01:40:39,439
concept of that time excuse me included retail and office

1968
01:40:39,439 --> 01:40:40,079
and commercial

1969
01:40:40,079 --> 01:40:44,220
development along along McKinney in the in the in the NR MU

1970
01:40:44,220 --> 01:40:45,439
zoning district

1971
01:40:45,439 --> 01:40:49,880
transition transitioning to office uses in the NR MU 12 and

1972
01:40:49,880 --> 01:40:51,119
then finally in the

1973
01:40:51,119 --> 01:40:55,479
subject property some moderate density cluster type housing

1974
01:40:55,479 --> 01:40:56,760
so it was intended

1975
01:40:56,760 --> 01:41:00,520
to be kind of a comprehensively planned mixed-use

1976
01:41:00,520 --> 01:41:04,159
development so today we're

1977
01:41:04,159 --> 01:41:08,079
looking at that portion that was rezoned to NR 6 and so the

1978
01:41:08,079 --> 01:41:09,359
first step we do and

1979
01:41:09,359 --> 01:41:11,979
we analyze the project is to look at what's immediately

1980
01:41:11,979 --> 01:41:13,039
adjacent to it and and

1981
01:41:13,039 --> 01:41:17,039
in this instance in our four is is to the north the east

1982
01:41:17,039 --> 01:41:19,840
and the west and and

1983
01:41:19,840 --> 01:41:23,939
it is developed with with single-family residential uses so

1984
01:41:23,939 --> 01:41:24,880
that's a an

1985
01:41:24,880 --> 01:41:27,869
established neighborhood to the north and east and west of

1986
01:41:27,869 --> 01:41:28,560
the subject

1987
01:41:28,560 --> 01:41:31,369
property to the south of course is the NR MU 12 which was

1988
01:41:31,369 --> 01:41:32,399
part of the subject

1989
01:41:32,399 --> 01:41:35,869
tract it is developed with a single-family home and then

1990
01:41:35,869 --> 01:41:36,800
along

1991
01:41:36,800 --> 01:41:41,500
McKinney that NR MU is developed with office uses across

1992
01:41:41,500 --> 01:41:43,159
McKinney is CMG and

1993
01:41:43,159 --> 01:41:46,680
that has government offices the Denton County courthouse

1994
01:41:46,680 --> 01:41:48,600
building if we zoom

1995
01:41:48,600 --> 01:41:50,949
out a little further than you can see the neighborhood to

1996
01:41:50,949 --> 01:41:52,199
the north coming into

1997
01:41:52,199 --> 01:41:55,689
focus it's a rather large single-family neighborhood and

1998
01:41:55,689 --> 01:41:58,079
and it it surrounds the

1999
01:41:58,079 --> 01:42:03,199
property along NRM along McKinney that NR MU section you

2000
01:42:03,199 --> 01:42:03,680
bring in some

2001
01:42:03,680 --> 01:42:07,359
commercial uses as you zoom out and then the CMG you've got

2002
01:42:07,359 --> 01:42:08,359
some multifamily

2003
01:42:08,359 --> 01:42:11,739
here's also some commercial uses in the continued

2004
01:42:11,739 --> 01:42:14,159
government offices the

2005
01:42:14,159 --> 01:42:17,890
mobility of the area includes two secondary arterials and

2006
01:42:17,890 --> 01:42:18,960
some collector

2007
01:42:18,960 --> 01:42:22,930
streets the secondary arterials include McKinney and then

2008
01:42:22,930 --> 01:42:24,880
the Woodrow Audra and

2009
01:42:24,880 --> 01:42:29,149
and as I said before the intent of a secondary arterial is

2010
01:42:29,149 --> 01:42:31,359
to move people to

2011
01:42:31,359 --> 01:42:34,420
different parts within the city there are also collector

2012
01:42:34,420 --> 01:42:35,880
streets adjacent to

2013
01:42:35,880 --> 01:42:38,479
and north of the subject property to the north of the

2014
01:42:38,479 --> 01:42:39,880
property you have Paisley

2015
01:42:39,880 --> 01:42:43,659
it connects to Audra you all and and then goes and then

2016
01:42:43,659 --> 01:42:45,600
also continues east

2017
01:42:45,600 --> 01:42:49,489
there's also Riddell which which starts in McKinney and

2018
01:42:49,489 --> 01:42:51,279
then continues up to

2019
01:42:51,279 --> 01:42:54,380
Mingo and then you have Janney Street which is adjacent to

2020
01:42:54,380 --> 01:42:55,119
the subject

2021
01:42:55,119 --> 01:42:59,109
property it is classified as a collector Street due to the

2022
01:42:59,109 --> 01:43:00,239
number of single-family

2023
01:43:00,239 --> 01:43:03,710
homes that are that have access to that Street also because

2024
01:43:03,710 --> 01:43:04,560
of some of the

2025
01:43:04,560 --> 01:43:07,920
because of the commercial zoning that is on the subject

2026
01:43:07,920 --> 01:43:09,319
property but as you can

2027
01:43:09,319 --> 01:43:12,680
see it really functions as a neighborhood Street so you've

2028
01:43:12,680 --> 01:43:13,439
got you've

2029
01:43:13,439 --> 01:43:15,939
got these to the north these single-family homes and that

2030
01:43:15,939 --> 01:43:16,859
really it's

2031
01:43:16,859 --> 01:43:20,600
used as their neighborhood Street to get to their homes it

2032
01:43:20,600 --> 01:43:22,359
also Janney Street

2033
01:43:22,359 --> 01:43:26,750
doesn't really provide any connect access or I'm sorry

2034
01:43:26,750 --> 01:43:28,199
direct access to to

2035
01:43:28,199 --> 01:43:34,840
the broader network to the north that it stops at Paisley

2036
01:43:34,840 --> 01:43:37,079
so we looked at the

2037
01:43:37,079 --> 01:43:40,800
Denton plan 2030 and this area is designated as low

2038
01:43:40,800 --> 01:43:43,359
residential per the

2039
01:43:43,359 --> 01:43:46,880
Denton plan low residential is intended to be single-family

2040
01:43:46,880 --> 01:43:48,279
neighborhoods very

2041
01:43:48,279 --> 01:43:51,779
low density same one to four dwelling units per acre when

2042
01:43:51,779 --> 01:43:52,760
you think a load at

2043
01:43:52,760 --> 01:43:56,260
low residential you think suburban development these these

2044
01:43:56,260 --> 01:43:57,159
individual

2045
01:43:57,159 --> 01:44:00,020
neighborhoods that are distinct they have edges and that

2046
01:44:00,020 --> 01:44:01,359
they they do have

2047
01:44:01,359 --> 01:44:06,560
access to major arterials NRMU 12 does not conform to this

2048
01:44:06,560 --> 01:44:07,720
to this future land

2049
01:44:07,720 --> 01:44:10,409
use designation because of the commercial uses embedded

2050
01:44:10,409 --> 01:44:11,079
within it and

2051
01:44:11,079 --> 01:44:14,510
then the the maximum 12 dwelling units per acre it's it's a

2052
01:44:14,510 --> 01:44:15,920
little too dense to

2053
01:44:15,920 --> 01:44:22,069
be considered low residential so so because the requested

2054
01:44:22,069 --> 01:44:22,880
zoning district

2055
01:44:22,880 --> 01:44:25,220
does not conform to the future land use per the Denton

2056
01:44:25,220 --> 01:44:26,239
development code the

2057
01:44:26,239 --> 01:44:28,840
criteria for approval we have to take a little extra look

2058
01:44:28,840 --> 01:44:29,800
at it a little extra

2059
01:44:29,800 --> 01:44:33,489
scrutiny is is required in order to determine whether it is

2060
01:44:33,489 --> 01:44:34,520
an appropriate

2061
01:44:34,520 --> 01:44:39,100
zoning rezoning so when we look at the site and we look at

2062
01:44:39,100 --> 01:44:39,800
where it is it's

2063
01:44:39,800 --> 01:44:43,020
situated in the center of a neighborhood it's it it goes

2064
01:44:43,020 --> 01:44:44,079
pretty far into the

2065
01:44:44,079 --> 01:44:47,319
neighborhood and this this neighborhood is a very

2066
01:44:47,319 --> 01:44:48,720
consistent development

2067
01:44:48,720 --> 01:44:53,239
pattern of single-family low density residential and this

2068
01:44:53,239 --> 01:44:54,079
this neighborhood

2069
01:44:54,079 --> 01:44:57,020
gets that protection it's those single-family uses are

2070
01:44:57,020 --> 01:44:57,840
protected in the

2071
01:44:57,840 --> 01:45:00,659
character of that neighborhood is protected because of the

2072
01:45:00,659 --> 01:45:01,399
zoning that it

2073
01:45:01,399 --> 01:45:04,649
has because the NR for zoning on the single-family

2074
01:45:04,649 --> 01:45:06,680
neighborhood with any

2075
01:45:06,680 --> 01:45:10,880
redevelopment would require single-family homes to go back

2076
01:45:10,880 --> 01:45:12,079
into those areas or or

2077
01:45:12,079 --> 01:45:15,119
or residential uses that are compatible with what's there

2078
01:45:15,119 --> 01:45:16,600
that in our cert six

2079
01:45:16,600 --> 01:45:19,489
also serves to kind of protect that neighborhood because it

2080
01:45:19,489 --> 01:45:20,560
keeps that it

2081
01:45:20,560 --> 01:45:24,090
keeps that commercial development from encroaching further

2082
01:45:24,090 --> 01:45:24,680
into that

2083
01:45:24,680 --> 01:45:30,010
neighborhood it provides a boundary and allows a transition

2084
01:45:30,010 --> 01:45:31,119
between the the

2085
01:45:31,119 --> 01:45:33,640
commercial development along McKinney and then the

2086
01:45:33,640 --> 01:45:35,479
residential and so the the

2087
01:45:35,479 --> 01:45:38,739
further extension of that NR MU would introduce some more

2088
01:45:38,739 --> 01:45:40,079
commercial uses and

2089
01:45:40,079 --> 01:45:43,800
potentially impact that single-family residential

2090
01:45:43,800 --> 01:45:46,399
neighborhood as I said

2091
01:45:46,399 --> 01:45:49,529
before that NR six provides the a transition between the

2092
01:45:49,529 --> 01:45:50,520
lower densities

2093
01:45:50,520 --> 01:45:53,880
and I would say even the whole the whole seven acres

2094
01:45:53,880 --> 01:45:56,000
provides a logical

2095
01:45:56,000 --> 01:45:58,970
transition between that in our for the low density

2096
01:45:58,970 --> 01:46:00,520
residential and then the

2097
01:46:00,520 --> 01:46:03,899
development that you typically see on an arterial light McK

2098
01:46:03,899 --> 01:46:05,800
inney and we believe

2099
01:46:05,800 --> 01:46:08,430
that that current zoning pattern could encourage some

2100
01:46:08,430 --> 01:46:09,119
thoughtful redevelopment

2101
01:46:09,119 --> 01:46:12,050
thoughtful development of the property of a kind of mix of

2102
01:46:12,050 --> 01:46:13,640
uses the applicant

2103
01:46:13,640 --> 01:46:17,159
has proposed a residential mixed-use protection overlay and

2104
01:46:17,159 --> 01:46:18,119
their proposal

2105
01:46:18,119 --> 01:46:22,470
does address them some design considerations but however

2106
01:46:22,470 --> 01:46:23,159
staff feels

2107
01:46:23,159 --> 01:46:26,380
that that the incompatibilities are really centered on the

2108
01:46:26,380 --> 01:46:27,000
uses those

2109
01:46:27,000 --> 01:46:30,609
commercial and office and retail uses and less to do with

2110
01:46:30,609 --> 01:46:31,680
the cut with the

2111
01:46:31,680 --> 01:46:37,329
design considerations public notification was sent out we

2112
01:46:37,329 --> 01:46:38,479
have received eight

2113
01:46:38,479 --> 01:46:42,189
notices and opposition in two in favor I passed those out

2114
01:46:42,189 --> 01:46:43,560
during work session as

2115
01:46:43,560 --> 01:46:46,449
we as I said before three of those opposition letters were

2116
01:46:46,449 --> 01:46:47,359
from the 200

2117
01:46:47,359 --> 01:46:54,119
foot boundary which which is 5.8% so based upon the future

2118
01:46:54,119 --> 01:46:54,479
land use

2119
01:46:54,479 --> 01:46:57,949
designation of the property and the considerations that I

2120
01:46:57,949 --> 01:46:59,079
have presented in

2121
01:46:59,079 --> 01:47:02,600
the character of the area staff recommends denial of the

2122
01:47:02,600 --> 01:47:03,479
request I'll

2123
01:47:03,479 --> 01:47:07,250
stand for any questions and the applicant is here if you if

2124
01:47:07,250 --> 01:47:08,479
you to

2125
01:47:08,479 --> 01:47:11,119
present as well

2126
01:47:14,479 --> 01:47:17,770
I have a question for you Julie we talked a little bit

2127
01:47:17,770 --> 01:47:20,199
about this in work

2128
01:47:20,199 --> 01:47:24,189
session just was reviewing one of the other handouts you

2129
01:47:24,189 --> 01:47:25,560
said that the main

2130
01:47:25,560 --> 01:47:29,189
objection that staff has centered on the uses and you've

2131
01:47:29,189 --> 01:47:30,720
got a table that you've

2132
01:47:30,720 --> 01:47:34,739
prepared for us in our backup that lists the uses and the

2133
01:47:34,739 --> 01:47:36,640
different uses between

2134
01:47:36,640 --> 01:47:36,640
an NR six and an NR MU 12 will you tell us based on the

2135
01:47:36,640 --> 01:47:42,779
things that they have

2136
01:47:42,779 --> 01:47:46,720
limited that through their overlay that will not be

2137
01:47:46,720 --> 01:47:49,319
permitted in here I only see

2138
01:47:49,319 --> 01:47:54,689
three that are different from the NR six is that what you

2139
01:47:54,689 --> 01:47:55,319
have

2140
01:47:55,319 --> 01:47:58,170
that's my understanding that they're there I believe they

2141
01:47:58,170 --> 01:47:59,079
're limiting it back

2142
01:47:59,079 --> 01:48:03,260
to the to maintain the office and the retail uses and the

2143
01:48:03,260 --> 01:48:04,439
ones that I see that

2144
01:48:04,439 --> 01:48:08,970
are different or live work units community service and

2145
01:48:08,970 --> 01:48:10,319
adult or child care

2146
01:48:10,319 --> 01:48:16,029
and all the other ones they have limited in their overlay

2147
01:48:16,029 --> 01:48:17,760
is that fair

2148
01:48:17,760 --> 01:48:22,930
statement well I don't know that is that in the applicants

2149
01:48:22,930 --> 01:48:23,760
here and they may be

2150
01:48:23,760 --> 01:48:26,279
able to better okay because I know they've made some

2151
01:48:26,279 --> 01:48:27,000
changes to the

2152
01:48:27,000 --> 01:48:29,390
proposed overlay it was my understanding that they were

2153
01:48:29,390 --> 01:48:30,399
still maintaining those

2154
01:48:30,399 --> 01:48:34,380
office and retail uses but they may have made some changes

2155
01:48:34,380 --> 01:48:35,560
to it so so but

2156
01:48:35,560 --> 01:48:37,899
they're here and they can they can talk to you about what

2157
01:48:37,899 --> 01:48:38,800
they're proposing in

2158
01:48:38,800 --> 01:48:44,560
terms of that what were some of the other things I see

2159
01:48:44,560 --> 01:48:45,479
staff is going to be

2160
01:48:45,479 --> 01:48:51,529
in denial of this reason what were the other main concerns

2161
01:48:51,529 --> 01:48:52,279
that you all have on

2162
01:48:52,279 --> 01:48:56,590
this really had to do with the compatibility of uses within

2163
01:48:56,590 --> 01:48:57,880
NR MU 12 and

2164
01:48:57,880 --> 01:49:03,649
we wanted to to in and by further by furthering the

2165
01:49:03,649 --> 01:49:07,000
commercial zoning into

2166
01:49:07,000 --> 01:49:10,000
the neighborhood it could potentially compromise that

2167
01:49:10,000 --> 01:49:11,600
neighborhood it could

2168
01:49:11,600 --> 01:49:15,859
introduce new uses that may may prove to be incompatible

2169
01:49:15,859 --> 01:49:17,319
with the existing

2170
01:49:17,319 --> 01:49:20,359
development I think I think it was mentioned at work

2171
01:49:20,359 --> 01:49:21,039
session I think it's

2172
01:49:21,039 --> 01:49:24,329
it's a good point that you know some of these single-family

2173
01:49:24,329 --> 01:49:25,600
residential uses are

2174
01:49:25,600 --> 01:49:29,590
are next to and across the street from what could be a

2175
01:49:29,590 --> 01:49:31,640
commercial development

2176
01:49:31,640 --> 01:49:36,020
and I think that has a different feel than having you know

2177
01:49:36,020 --> 01:49:36,920
we often like to

2178
01:49:36,920 --> 01:49:40,010
see commercial development near neighborhoods because that

2179
01:49:40,010 --> 01:49:41,119
provides it

2180
01:49:41,119 --> 01:49:44,810
provides allows people to walk and it's a it's a good thing

2181
01:49:44,810 --> 01:49:46,399
but when you're but

2182
01:49:46,399 --> 01:49:50,319
typically we like to see that along at intersections along

2183
01:49:50,319 --> 01:49:51,520
maybe the arterials

2184
01:49:51,520 --> 01:49:55,069
and that's why this this current zoning actually it works

2185
01:49:55,069 --> 01:49:56,319
in our mind and that

2186
01:49:56,319 --> 01:49:59,920
as you move toward McKinney you do fold in some of those

2187
01:49:59,920 --> 01:50:01,319
commercial uses and

2188
01:50:01,319 --> 01:50:05,500
office uses and and that way you get that mix and that by

2189
01:50:05,500 --> 01:50:06,720
bikes further

2190
01:50:06,720 --> 01:50:11,699
extending that NR MU 12 into the neighborhood it then it

2191
01:50:11,699 --> 01:50:12,920
then could

2192
01:50:12,920 --> 01:50:15,710
compromise that single-family it's going further into the

2193
01:50:15,710 --> 01:50:16,800
neighborhood and

2194
01:50:16,800 --> 01:50:21,420
potentially impacting it so that's why staff really is has

2195
01:50:21,420 --> 01:50:23,079
concerns about this

2196
01:50:23,079 --> 01:50:26,869
case and it just and it it doesn't meet that future land

2197
01:50:26,869 --> 01:50:27,960
use which was the the

2198
01:50:27,960 --> 01:50:31,960
intent of what was in you know what that's the the vision

2199
01:50:31,960 --> 01:50:33,079
for this area is

2200
01:50:33,079 --> 01:50:38,920
to maintain it as that single-family residential thank you

2201
01:50:38,920 --> 01:50:39,840
any other questions

2202
01:50:39,840 --> 01:50:48,239
for staff okay thank you Julie this is a public hearing the

2203
01:50:48,239 --> 01:50:49,760
next card that we have

2204
01:50:49,760 --> 01:50:52,880
is Lawrence Holder if I send you're speaking for the

2205
01:50:52,880 --> 01:50:55,199
applicant okay you'll

2206
01:50:55,199 --> 01:50:58,039
give your name and address for the record I'd appreciate it

2207
01:50:58,039 --> 01:50:59,399
name is Lawrence

2208
01:50:59,399 --> 01:51:05,479
Holder I am at 2104 East

2209
01:51:06,640 --> 01:51:14,720
yeah that work 2405 that's it's a new one put the

2210
01:51:14,720 --> 01:51:16,520
presentation

2211
01:51:16,520 --> 01:51:25,520
sorry about that is that you yes there you are thank you

2212
01:51:25,520 --> 01:51:26,000
sure Commissioner back

2213
01:51:26,000 --> 01:51:31,560
I didn't get the last name clear Holder Holder yes sir okay

2214
01:51:31,560 --> 01:51:34,720
thank you thank you

2215
01:51:35,159 --> 01:51:41,960
okay it is the goal of Denton Justice Plaza LLC to go ahead

2216
01:51:41,960 --> 01:51:43,199
and rezone three

2217
01:51:43,199 --> 01:51:46,579
point one two five acres of a property off of North McKin

2218
01:51:46,579 --> 01:51:48,000
ney Street East McKinney

2219
01:51:48,000 --> 01:51:54,800
Street from NR six to NR MU 12 we have come against a few

2220
01:51:54,800 --> 01:51:56,079
oppositions for that

2221
01:51:56,079 --> 01:51:59,829
and we are basically coming up with an overlay restriction

2222
01:51:59,829 --> 01:52:01,239
for that but again we

2223
01:52:01,239 --> 01:52:04,130
are doing commercial development zoning change requests

2224
01:52:04,130 --> 01:52:05,520
from NR six to NR MU 12

2225
01:52:05,520 --> 01:52:11,850
our site location is is here kind of off of Jane Street and

2226
01:52:11,850 --> 01:52:13,920
North McKinney Street

2227
01:52:13,920 --> 01:52:18,180
the surrounding property uses is residential to the north

2228
01:52:18,180 --> 01:52:19,239
and to the west

2229
01:52:19,239 --> 01:52:21,770
but if you can see that there is the courthouse to the

2230
01:52:21,770 --> 01:52:23,039
directly to the south

2231
01:52:23,039 --> 01:52:27,770
and the Mary and Jim Horne Center to the east as well so

2232
01:52:27,770 --> 01:52:29,720
there are other

2233
01:52:29,720 --> 01:52:34,279
compatible developments within the area what we are

2234
01:52:34,279 --> 01:52:36,319
proposing our general

2235
01:52:36,319 --> 01:52:40,460
offices and closer to the McKinney Street which is not what

2236
01:52:40,460 --> 01:52:41,119
is being

2237
01:52:41,119 --> 01:52:44,000
considered for the zoning change but closer to this to the

2238
01:52:44,000 --> 01:52:44,760
street on this

2239
01:52:44,760 --> 01:52:52,210
property will be retail as well as offices per the zoning

2240
01:52:52,210 --> 01:52:53,399
requirements on

2241
01:52:53,399 --> 01:52:59,510
that so the current zoning is NR six there is an awkward

2242
01:52:59,510 --> 01:53:01,680
boundary line that

2243
01:53:01,680 --> 01:53:05,779
splits the NR six between the NR MU 12 I believe that was

2244
01:53:05,779 --> 01:53:07,880
developed originally

2245
01:53:07,880 --> 01:53:13,960
for the applicant who came in well something along those

2246
01:53:13,960 --> 01:53:16,600
lines and for

2247
01:53:16,600 --> 01:53:20,609
specific use and that plan didn't come to fruition so we're

2248
01:53:20,609 --> 01:53:21,800
now stuck with this

2249
01:53:21,800 --> 01:53:25,479
awkward zoning line between the NR six the NR MU 12 and we

2250
01:53:25,479 --> 01:53:27,000
are hoping to go

2251
01:53:27,000 --> 01:53:31,310
ahead and bring that NR 12 all the way through to the

2252
01:53:31,310 --> 01:53:34,520
property the proposed use

2253
01:53:34,520 --> 01:53:38,619
is general offices of that site of that northern part the

2254
01:53:38,619 --> 01:53:39,800
part that we are

2255
01:53:39,800 --> 01:53:43,029
requesting to be rezoned which is in conformance with the

2256
01:53:43,029 --> 01:53:46,199
NR MU 12 zoning

2257
01:53:46,199 --> 01:53:50,449
we're hoping to rezone this location so that we can have

2258
01:53:50,449 --> 01:53:52,039
one uniform single

2259
01:53:52,039 --> 01:53:56,010
comprehensive site as opposed to a bunch of broken uses so

2260
01:53:56,010 --> 01:53:57,760
we are hoping to

2261
01:53:57,760 --> 01:54:01,960
construct this site in a manner that is both appeasing for

2262
01:54:01,960 --> 01:54:03,560
the neighborhood as

2263
01:54:03,560 --> 01:54:11,510
well as comprehensively throughout itself so one cohesive

2264
01:54:11,510 --> 01:54:14,640
development the

2265
01:54:14,640 --> 01:54:18,899
zoning restrictions between the NR six and the NRI 12 don't

2266
01:54:18,899 --> 01:54:21,159
change very much if

2267
01:54:21,159 --> 01:54:24,720
really at all from the standpoint that there is the same

2268
01:54:24,720 --> 01:54:26,279
lot coverage you still

2269
01:54:26,279 --> 01:54:29,640
have a 60% lot coverage maximum you still have a minimum

2270
01:54:29,640 --> 01:54:30,439
landscape area of

2271
01:54:30,439 --> 01:54:33,640
40% and you still have a maximum building height

2272
01:54:33,640 --> 01:54:35,600
restriction of 40 feet so

2273
01:54:35,600 --> 01:54:42,630
the same type of overall coverage building to pavement to

2274
01:54:42,630 --> 01:54:44,079
landscaping will

2275
01:54:44,079 --> 01:54:48,189
be the same as though it was developed with the NR six even

2276
01:54:48,189 --> 01:54:49,279
though it's owned

2277
01:54:49,279 --> 01:54:55,329
in our 12 again we are proposing offices in this location

2278
01:54:55,329 --> 01:54:56,119
as opposed to

2279
01:54:56,119 --> 01:55:01,229
neighborhood unit dwelling units two of the other

2280
01:55:01,229 --> 01:55:02,720
restrictions general

2281
01:55:02,720 --> 01:55:06,149
restrictions actually go up for the rezoning minimum side

2282
01:55:06,149 --> 01:55:07,279
yards about it not

2283
01:55:07,279 --> 01:55:10,079
abutting it attached buildings goes up from four to ten

2284
01:55:10,079 --> 01:55:12,239
feet minimum yards when

2285
01:55:12,239 --> 01:55:14,449
abutting a single-family use actually goes from 10 feet to

2286
01:55:14,449 --> 01:55:15,079
15 so we're

2287
01:55:15,079 --> 01:55:18,680
actually becoming more restrictive on those two general

2288
01:55:18,680 --> 01:55:20,920
regulations we held a

2289
01:55:20,920 --> 01:55:25,189
neighborhood meeting and the concerns that were brought up

2290
01:55:25,189 --> 01:55:25,760
in that

2291
01:55:25,760 --> 01:55:29,699
neighborhood meeting brought us to propose an overlay

2292
01:55:29,699 --> 01:55:30,840
restriction we

2293
01:55:30,840 --> 01:55:36,920
discussed this with the residents at the time and I believe

2294
01:55:36,920 --> 01:55:38,119
we specifically

2295
01:55:38,119 --> 01:55:41,199
address them and what we would do specifically for

2296
01:55:41,199 --> 01:55:42,359
addressing their

2297
01:55:42,359 --> 01:55:45,079
concerns however there was not a follow-up neighborhood

2298
01:55:45,079 --> 01:55:45,760
residential

2299
01:55:45,760 --> 01:55:49,649
meeting that had been brought back that was because we felt

2300
01:55:49,649 --> 01:55:50,720
as though we had

2301
01:55:50,720 --> 01:55:54,319
received their input we did address their concerns and they

2302
01:55:54,319 --> 01:55:54,960
seemed to

2303
01:55:54,960 --> 01:56:00,149
reciprocate that their concerns basically are these eight

2304
01:56:00,149 --> 01:56:01,239
concerns of

2305
01:56:01,239 --> 01:56:04,300
stories the number of stories of the proposed buildings the

2306
01:56:04,300 --> 01:56:05,520
restrictions of

2307
01:56:05,520 --> 01:56:08,729
bars and late-night activity facilities preservation of

2308
01:56:08,729 --> 01:56:10,319
existing trees the

2309
01:56:10,319 --> 01:56:13,850
improvement to Janie Street was a another interesting

2310
01:56:13,850 --> 01:56:15,039
bigger issue that

2311
01:56:15,039 --> 01:56:18,279
was brought up and then again aesthetically congruent

2312
01:56:18,279 --> 01:56:18,800
development in

2313
01:56:18,800 --> 01:56:22,220
existing structures they didn't want something that was

2314
01:56:22,220 --> 01:56:24,920
going to completely

2315
01:56:24,920 --> 01:56:29,239
outdo their buildings or be something that was an eyesore

2316
01:56:29,239 --> 01:56:31,359
to that area fixture

2317
01:56:31,359 --> 01:56:34,500
drainage features to fix the current and future issues they

2318
01:56:34,500 --> 01:56:35,359
didn't want any

2319
01:56:35,359 --> 01:56:38,869
additional drainage they don't want any additional flooding

2320
01:56:38,869 --> 01:56:39,920
to their properties

2321
01:56:39,920 --> 01:56:44,109
with the development the property values was a concern and

2322
01:56:44,109 --> 01:56:45,600
then time of the

2323
01:56:45,600 --> 01:56:47,369
construction again they didn't want something that was

2324
01:56:47,369 --> 01:56:48,039
gonna like that was

2325
01:56:48,039 --> 01:56:50,380
gonna take 20 years to construct and they were going to

2326
01:56:50,380 --> 01:56:50,880
live next to

2327
01:56:50,880 --> 01:56:54,779
something that was being constructed for a very long period

2328
01:56:54,779 --> 01:56:56,920
of time the overlay

2329
01:56:56,920 --> 01:57:00,189
restrictions that we're proposing would be on the non-

2330
01:57:00,189 --> 01:57:01,840
residential buildings to

2331
01:57:01,840 --> 01:57:06,090
limit to one story and then 35 foot maximum height on that

2332
01:57:06,090 --> 01:57:07,119
as well so we were

2333
01:57:07,119 --> 01:57:11,649
willing to drop down the 40 foot maximum building height to

2334
01:57:11,649 --> 01:57:13,560
35 feet and limit

2335
01:57:13,560 --> 01:57:17,500
that to one story for non-residential buildings the

2336
01:57:17,500 --> 01:57:19,760
mechanical units that are

2337
01:57:19,760 --> 01:57:24,460
within 100 feet of adjacent properties we would limit to

2338
01:57:24,460 --> 01:57:26,600
five ton units there

2339
01:57:26,600 --> 01:57:28,750
they we would limit those so that would they would be

2340
01:57:28,750 --> 01:57:29,760
placed on the side of the

2341
01:57:29,760 --> 01:57:32,430
building such that there would not be more than two units

2342
01:57:32,430 --> 01:57:33,319
on both sides of the

2343
01:57:33,319 --> 01:57:36,600
building limiting the total units to four units if required

2344
01:57:36,600 --> 01:57:38,000
for a building

2345
01:57:38,000 --> 01:57:40,810
units then would be screened from the adjacent properties

2346
01:57:40,810 --> 01:57:41,720
for both noise and

2347
01:57:41,720 --> 01:57:46,510
aesthetics a screening wall is also being proposed along

2348
01:57:46,510 --> 01:57:47,840
the surrounding

2349
01:57:47,840 --> 01:57:52,920
property to help facilitate with any additional measures

2350
01:57:52,920 --> 01:57:55,439
mitigation measures

2351
01:57:55,439 --> 01:57:59,420
that the residents might feel necessary we also then

2352
01:57:59,420 --> 01:58:01,720
propose limited allowable

2353
01:58:01,720 --> 01:58:07,399
uses those uses we would like stricken from the allowable

2354
01:58:07,399 --> 01:58:08,680
uses would be the

2355
01:58:08,680 --> 01:58:12,060
dwelling above businesses group homes multifamily dwellings

2356
01:58:12,060 --> 01:58:12,800
fraternity and

2357
01:58:12,800 --> 01:58:15,800
sorority homes dormitories beds and breakfasts laundry

2358
01:58:15,800 --> 01:58:17,720
facilities semi-public

2359
01:58:17,720 --> 01:58:20,520
halls clubs or lodges kindergarten or elementary schools

2360
01:58:20,520 --> 01:58:21,079
middle schools

2361
01:58:21,079 --> 01:58:25,720
elderly housing and elderly housing

2362
01:58:33,479 --> 01:58:39,600
we feel that the applicant we feel that the opinion that

2363
01:58:39,600 --> 01:58:40,560
the impact of

2364
01:58:40,560 --> 01:58:42,560
the proposed development will be compatible to the

2365
01:58:42,560 --> 01:58:43,560
surrounding development

2366
01:58:43,560 --> 01:58:45,979
as the existing zoning regulations for inner six are very

2367
01:58:45,979 --> 01:58:47,039
similar to inner 12

2368
01:58:47,039 --> 01:58:50,750
as they require the same 60% or less lot coverage 40% or

2369
01:58:50,750 --> 01:58:52,560
more landscape area the

2370
01:58:52,560 --> 01:58:55,270
maximum building height restriction of 40 feet and we're

2371
01:58:55,270 --> 01:58:56,239
also again trying to

2372
01:58:56,239 --> 01:59:00,060
limit that down to 35 feet and one story and for non-

2373
01:59:00,060 --> 01:59:01,960
residential buildings and

2374
01:59:01,960 --> 01:59:07,039
the same minimum frontside and rear yard regulations the

2375
01:59:07,039 --> 01:59:08,760
proposed zoning

2376
01:59:08,760 --> 01:59:14,010
currently and the existing zoning regulates prohibits the

2377
01:59:14,010 --> 01:59:15,479
construction of

2378
01:59:15,479 --> 01:59:20,039
bars which was a concern for late-night bars and late-night

2379
01:59:20,039 --> 01:59:20,880
activity facilities

2380
01:59:20,880 --> 01:59:24,699
within the inner mutual so that concern is no longer or is

2381
01:59:24,699 --> 01:59:26,079
not a valid concern

2382
01:59:26,079 --> 01:59:29,720
at this time applicant will preserve and mitigate the

2383
01:59:29,720 --> 01:59:31,880
required trees per the DDC

2384
01:59:31,880 --> 01:59:36,020
we will provide the building materials per the DDC which

2385
01:59:36,020 --> 01:59:37,239
had to be compatible

2386
01:59:37,239 --> 01:59:41,189
have to be aesthetically pleasing and has to be in conform

2387
01:59:41,189 --> 01:59:42,180
ance with the

2388
01:59:42,180 --> 01:59:48,260
surrounding area the applicant will also provide drainage

2389
01:59:48,260 --> 01:59:48,640
improvements as

2390
01:59:48,640 --> 01:59:52,270
required by the DDC which we are not allowed to drain any

2391
01:59:52,270 --> 01:59:53,119
extra to the

2392
01:59:53,119 --> 01:59:57,090
surrounding properties we cannot negatively impact any

2393
01:59:57,090 --> 01:59:58,239
properties around

2394
01:59:58,239 --> 02:00:02,829
us so we will be taking on all of our proposed drainage and

2395
02:00:02,829 --> 02:00:03,720
either detaining

2396
02:00:03,720 --> 02:00:11,220
or releasing as required by the same these restrictions and

2397
02:00:11,220 --> 02:00:12,279
overlay

2398
02:00:12,279 --> 02:00:15,369
basically covered all of the concerns that the

2399
02:00:15,369 --> 02:00:18,199
neighborhoods residents brought

2400
02:00:18,199 --> 02:00:24,359
up in both their letters and that we received their letters

2401
02:00:24,359 --> 02:00:25,159
that we received

2402
02:00:25,159 --> 02:00:32,239
and phone calls and at the neighborhood meeting a hesitate

2403
02:00:32,239 --> 02:00:34,720
to bring this up but

2404
02:00:34,720 --> 02:00:41,920
if necessary the applicant is willing to suggest a

2405
02:00:41,920 --> 02:00:43,520
compromise if they cannot get

2406
02:00:43,520 --> 02:00:49,600
if a denial of the zoning in its entirety is proposed we

2407
02:00:49,600 --> 02:00:50,720
would like to

2408
02:00:50,720 --> 02:00:54,989
suggest adjusting that awkward line at the minimum pulling

2409
02:00:54,989 --> 02:00:56,239
that up so that that

2410
02:00:56,239 --> 02:01:00,920
NRMU 12 area can be used more effectively more efficiently

2411
02:01:00,920 --> 02:01:01,520
and that

2412
02:01:01,520 --> 02:01:08,760
in our six area can then be again also used effectively

2413
02:01:08,760 --> 02:01:11,920
again we're just doing

2414
02:01:11,920 --> 02:01:15,590
a typical general office use this is the general typical

2415
02:01:15,590 --> 02:01:17,079
office use rendering

2416
02:01:17,079 --> 02:01:22,090
from the architect at the time that we are proposing so at

2417
02:01:22,090 --> 02:01:23,600
this time I can take

2418
02:01:23,600 --> 02:01:28,399
any questions quite a few questions Commissioner Beck thank

2419
02:01:28,399 --> 02:01:29,439
you chair thank

2420
02:01:29,439 --> 02:01:33,689
you mr. Holford for your presentation and I must admit I

2421
02:01:33,689 --> 02:01:34,760
must admit and I think

2422
02:01:34,760 --> 02:01:37,970
every other Commissioner here will to that your overlay is

2423
02:01:37,970 --> 02:01:39,119
very generous and

2424
02:01:39,119 --> 02:01:45,479
and does appear to answer the concerns you indicated though

2425
02:01:45,479 --> 02:01:46,680
and it wasn't

2426
02:01:46,680 --> 02:01:50,630
clear to me before you said this that you've talked to the

2427
02:01:50,630 --> 02:01:52,439
residents explaining

2428
02:01:52,439 --> 02:01:56,039
the details of the overlay and they were essentially okay

2429
02:01:56,039 --> 02:01:58,000
with that yet we some

2430
02:01:58,000 --> 02:02:01,380
of the statements we get back are still in opposition to it

2431
02:02:01,380 --> 02:02:02,359
so I'm not clear

2432
02:02:02,359 --> 02:02:06,800
that they've had a clear presentation of this overlay is am

2433
02:02:06,800 --> 02:02:07,760
I wrong in assuming

2434
02:02:07,760 --> 02:02:11,619
that those that we talked to you were at the neighborhood

2435
02:02:11,619 --> 02:02:13,199
meeting as well as those

2436
02:02:13,199 --> 02:02:16,949
who would call in those who didn't participate in the

2437
02:02:16,949 --> 02:02:17,640
neighborhood meeting

2438
02:02:17,640 --> 02:02:22,079
or didn't contact us when we have sent out the notification

2439
02:02:22,079 --> 02:02:23,680
would not have

2440
02:02:23,680 --> 02:02:28,619
received any additional information so I don't know what

2441
02:02:28,619 --> 02:02:30,479
the comments are wasn't

2442
02:02:30,479 --> 02:02:34,250
provided with the eight comments that are in opposition to

2443
02:02:34,250 --> 02:02:36,960
the project so I can

2444
02:02:36,960 --> 02:02:40,840
specifically say to those eight whether or not they are in

2445
02:02:40,840 --> 02:02:42,279
opposition to

2446
02:02:42,279 --> 02:02:47,279
anything that that was already said okay and by the looks

2447
02:02:47,279 --> 02:02:47,560
of them I don't think

2448
02:02:47,560 --> 02:02:49,960
there is anything there but do you think you might not be

2449
02:02:49,960 --> 02:02:51,520
better served if you

2450
02:02:51,520 --> 02:02:55,720
perhaps went back and did a more complete presentation

2451
02:02:55,720 --> 02:02:57,239
tried to encourage

2452
02:02:57,239 --> 02:03:00,329
more input from the residents that would get them on your

2453
02:03:00,329 --> 02:03:01,600
side with this overlay

2454
02:03:01,600 --> 02:03:04,800
because I as the staff mentioned I would encourage

2455
02:03:04,800 --> 02:03:06,359
commercial development along

2456
02:03:06,359 --> 02:03:09,960
this area to McKinney that would allow people to walk

2457
02:03:09,960 --> 02:03:11,199
distance but your

2458
02:03:11,199 --> 02:03:16,159
development encroaches very deep into that community you're

2459
02:03:16,159 --> 02:03:16,760
surrounded on

2460
02:03:16,760 --> 02:03:20,180
three sides by residential homes and even with all your

2461
02:03:20,180 --> 02:03:21,680
efforts it does

2462
02:03:21,680 --> 02:03:25,470
detract it diminishes a single-family neighborhood and I

2463
02:03:25,470 --> 02:03:26,520
worry about that I

2464
02:03:26,520 --> 02:03:29,680
worry about it setting a precedent for not only this area

2465
02:03:29,680 --> 02:03:30,760
but other areas to

2466
02:03:30,760 --> 02:03:34,970
see where low-density housing is and how it can impact

2467
02:03:34,970 --> 02:03:36,600
things down the road so I

2468
02:03:36,600 --> 02:03:40,909
like your idea of maybe your alternate solution that seems

2469
02:03:40,909 --> 02:03:41,880
viable to me

2470
02:03:41,880 --> 02:03:47,659
straightening that line a little bit but again I just there

2471
02:03:47,659 --> 02:03:49,479
's a need in the city

2472
02:03:49,479 --> 02:03:52,649
as everybody knows for affordable housing and this is an

2473
02:03:52,649 --> 02:03:53,479
ideal spot to

2474
02:03:53,479 --> 02:04:01,100
build at least 18 units for that could serve this need

2475
02:04:01,100 --> 02:04:03,079
greatly I'd like to see

2476
02:04:03,079 --> 02:04:05,779
that this is an infill area we definitely want to get it

2477
02:04:05,779 --> 02:04:07,359
taken care of too so

2478
02:04:07,359 --> 02:04:10,029
we'd be willing to work with you but I'm just having a

2479
02:04:10,029 --> 02:04:11,239
problem how deep this

2480
02:04:11,239 --> 02:04:15,090
development goes into there and think you might be better

2481
02:04:15,090 --> 02:04:16,520
served if you went

2482
02:04:16,520 --> 02:04:18,699
back to the community with your overlay plan and laid it

2483
02:04:18,699 --> 02:04:19,760
out and got some input

2484
02:04:19,760 --> 02:04:22,470
some more feedback from them that we could see that would

2485
02:04:22,470 --> 02:04:23,159
make us feel

2486
02:04:23,159 --> 02:04:30,260
comfortable if we were to support your project any comment

2487
02:04:30,260 --> 02:04:31,760
on going back and

2488
02:04:31,760 --> 02:04:34,979
doing it well I know the applicant is hesitant to slow

2489
02:04:34,979 --> 02:04:36,359
things down at this

2490
02:04:36,359 --> 02:04:40,850
time however we could hold another neighborhood meeting and

2491
02:04:40,850 --> 02:04:41,960
discuss these

2492
02:04:41,960 --> 02:04:44,859
overlay restrictions with the neighbor the surrounding

2493
02:04:44,859 --> 02:04:46,239
neighbors I do know

2494
02:04:46,239 --> 02:04:52,319
that this area being across from the courthouse is turning

2495
02:04:52,319 --> 02:04:55,239
over more to red

2496
02:04:55,239 --> 02:04:58,880
offices the homes are being renovated into those the need

2497
02:04:58,880 --> 02:04:59,960
for offices in this

2498
02:04:59,960 --> 02:05:07,590
area for lawyers or for other facilities that facilitate

2499
02:05:07,590 --> 02:05:09,159
the courthouse is

2500
02:05:09,159 --> 02:05:14,489
greatly desired in this area don't disagree with that but

2501
02:05:14,489 --> 02:05:15,319
you do have that

2502
02:05:15,319 --> 02:05:18,699
front part of the track there at 3.8 acres that you could

2503
02:05:18,699 --> 02:05:20,079
use it for so I can

2504
02:05:20,079 --> 02:05:22,590
understand you want more but you can still do something

2505
02:05:22,590 --> 02:05:23,479
along those lines

2506
02:05:23,479 --> 02:05:27,319
with that without going that deep into the community and

2507
02:05:27,319 --> 02:05:29,079
perhaps disrupting it

2508
02:05:29,079 --> 02:05:34,079
too much and staff is mentioning just my two cents worth

2509
02:05:38,079 --> 02:05:42,119
commissioner Ellis thank you chair thank you mr. Holder for

2510
02:05:42,119 --> 02:05:44,079
your presentation so

2511
02:05:44,079 --> 02:05:46,750
I think you're very generous overlay addresses a lot of the

2512
02:05:46,750 --> 02:05:47,880
restriction issues

2513
02:05:47,880 --> 02:05:51,989
to make it more compatible but as staff presented it's the

2514
02:05:51,989 --> 02:05:53,359
use that makes it

2515
02:05:53,359 --> 02:05:57,960
incompatible because the way that tract of land goes so

2516
02:05:57,960 --> 02:05:59,279
deeply into the

2517
02:05:59,279 --> 02:06:03,210
neighborhood can you address how the use how you feel the

2518
02:06:03,210 --> 02:06:04,399
use is compatible

2519
02:06:04,399 --> 02:06:09,579
absolutely so the use that we're proposing at this time

2520
02:06:09,579 --> 02:06:10,880
does not have

2521
02:06:10,880 --> 02:06:14,869
any greater impact than what the existing zoning has in the

2522
02:06:14,869 --> 02:06:15,680
size of the

2523
02:06:15,680 --> 02:06:18,020
facilities that are being provided so in other words the

2524
02:06:18,020 --> 02:06:19,079
your landscape area so

2525
02:06:19,079 --> 02:06:24,550
has to be a minimum of 40% so right now anybody who were to

2526
02:06:24,550 --> 02:06:25,279
develop that area

2527
02:06:25,279 --> 02:06:28,869
would have to adhere to the landscape and the lot coverage

2528
02:06:28,869 --> 02:06:30,079
requirements the

2529
02:06:30,079 --> 02:06:35,130
new zoning has the same requirement so the construction of

2530
02:06:35,130 --> 02:06:36,279
anything going there

2531
02:06:36,279 --> 02:06:42,380
would have the same footprint if not the same overall use

2532
02:06:42,380 --> 02:06:44,600
going into that that

2533
02:06:44,600 --> 02:06:51,399
building so we feel that we're providing general offices

2534
02:06:51,399 --> 02:06:53,000
that look similar to

2535
02:06:53,000 --> 02:06:57,579
what we have provided in our rendering it has that

2536
02:06:57,579 --> 02:06:58,760
residential appeal that

2537
02:06:58,760 --> 02:07:03,189
residential kind of look but is not a residence it is a an

2538
02:07:03,189 --> 02:07:04,520
office that the

2539
02:07:04,520 --> 02:07:08,399
community can use a good example would be the child care

2540
02:07:08,399 --> 02:07:09,920
that can be provided

2541
02:07:09,920 --> 02:07:13,210
for the residents as well as for those who are going to the

2542
02:07:13,210 --> 02:07:14,359
courthouse the

2543
02:07:14,359 --> 02:07:20,090
whole desire of this area is to go ahead and construct a

2544
02:07:20,090 --> 02:07:22,159
cohesive construction

2545
02:07:22,159 --> 02:07:27,880
that is both needed in this area and appeasing and to the

2546
02:07:27,880 --> 02:07:29,520
residents of the

2547
02:07:29,520 --> 02:07:32,779
area that both help facilitate needs of the residents as

2548
02:07:32,779 --> 02:07:34,000
well as those across

2549
02:07:34,000 --> 02:07:38,199
the street right and again I think you've addressed the

2550
02:07:38,199 --> 02:07:39,359
restriction part I

2551
02:07:39,359 --> 02:07:42,579
mean you know offices that look like homes and and and that

2552
02:07:42,579 --> 02:07:43,600
's great but again

2553
02:07:43,600 --> 02:07:48,399
it's the use that is the issue in this deep part of the lot

2554
02:07:48,399 --> 02:07:49,359
that that's where I

2555
02:07:49,359 --> 02:07:51,310
think everybody's getting stuck I think everybody would

2556
02:07:51,310 --> 02:07:52,119
love to see that piece

2557
02:07:52,119 --> 02:07:54,590
of land developed along McKinney and I think it's

2558
02:07:54,590 --> 02:07:56,680
definitely needed it's it's

2559
02:07:56,680 --> 02:07:59,850
that part that encroaches so deeply it's literally across

2560
02:07:59,850 --> 02:08:01,000
the street next to

2561
02:08:01,000 --> 02:08:04,880
behind single-family neighborhoods and a single-family

2562
02:08:04,880 --> 02:08:05,680
neighborhood that's one of

2563
02:08:05,680 --> 02:08:09,180
our most affordable dense single-family neighborhoods in

2564
02:08:09,180 --> 02:08:11,159
the city we have to be

2565
02:08:11,159 --> 02:08:16,010
careful not to negatively impact and destroy that since we

2566
02:08:16,010 --> 02:08:17,319
are running short

2567
02:08:17,319 --> 02:08:20,350
on affordable housing in our area sure so I must not quite

2568
02:08:20,350 --> 02:08:21,319
understand that

2569
02:08:21,319 --> 02:08:25,229
question as stated I'll go ahead and pitch it over to the

2570
02:08:25,229 --> 02:08:25,800
house and I'll

2571
02:08:25,800 --> 02:08:28,579
actually ask him to come up here to go ahead and possibly

2572
02:08:28,579 --> 02:08:29,760
answer that question

2573
02:08:29,760 --> 02:08:35,359
for for you okay or I can restate it if needed thanks

2574
02:08:38,359 --> 02:08:43,060
good evening Lee Allison with Allison engineering group 24

2575
02:08:43,060 --> 02:08:44,560
15 North Elm Street

2576
02:08:44,560 --> 02:08:48,430
I think we're trying to learn our new address sorry about

2577
02:08:48,430 --> 02:08:49,960
that in response to

2578
02:08:49,960 --> 02:08:53,960
a couple of questions obviously we'd like to avoid having a

2579
02:08:53,960 --> 02:08:54,399
another

2580
02:08:54,399 --> 02:08:56,789
neighborhood meeting we felt like we did a good job

2581
02:08:56,789 --> 02:08:59,199
responding to others the three

2582
02:08:59,199 --> 02:09:02,430
that are in opposition within the 200 feet I can't say

2583
02:09:02,430 --> 02:09:03,520
tonight whether they

2584
02:09:03,520 --> 02:09:07,000
were at our meetings or not if the Commission as a whole

2585
02:09:07,000 --> 02:09:07,939
felt like that we

2586
02:09:07,939 --> 02:09:10,289
really needed to go back and have another meeting I think

2587
02:09:10,289 --> 02:09:11,119
we're willing to

2588
02:09:11,119 --> 02:09:14,590
do that that's certainly not objectionable to us when it

2589
02:09:14,590 --> 02:09:15,399
comes to the

2590
02:09:15,399 --> 02:09:18,880
uses the one thing we've done is limit them to one stories

2591
02:09:18,880 --> 02:09:20,479
35 feet more to

2592
02:09:20,479 --> 02:09:23,380
allow for roofs so you're not going to have a taller even

2593
02:09:23,380 --> 02:09:24,479
two-story homes or

2594
02:09:24,479 --> 02:09:27,840
anybody looking into the area they again are intended to be

2595
02:09:27,840 --> 02:09:28,560
more of your

2596
02:09:28,560 --> 02:09:32,220
residential type buildings the type of offices that we go

2597
02:09:32,220 --> 02:09:33,439
there more likely

2598
02:09:33,439 --> 02:09:37,170
would operate during the days possibly on Saturdays mostly

2599
02:09:37,170 --> 02:09:38,359
during the week so

2600
02:09:38,359 --> 02:09:40,520
you're not going to have the nighttime evening when most

2601
02:09:40,520 --> 02:09:41,279
people are at home

2602
02:09:41,279 --> 02:09:44,229
when it comes to affordable housing the biggest problem is

2603
02:09:44,229 --> 02:09:44,840
the cost of

2604
02:09:44,840 --> 02:09:47,729
construction not the size of the home or where they are a

2605
02:09:47,729 --> 02:09:48,880
lot of these homes are

2606
02:09:48,880 --> 02:09:52,640
affordable in this area because they're older homes depreci

2607
02:09:52,640 --> 02:09:54,640
ated quite a bit not

2608
02:09:54,640 --> 02:10:01,159
quite as desirable in the marketplace today and they just

2609
02:10:01,159 --> 02:10:02,239
that's what keeps

2610
02:10:02,239 --> 02:10:04,960
them affordable at this point in time to think that we

2611
02:10:04,960 --> 02:10:06,279
could come in and put down

2612
02:10:06,279 --> 02:10:09,359
new lots at today's land prices and come in with a

2613
02:10:09,359 --> 02:10:10,760
competitive home as

2614
02:10:10,760 --> 02:10:14,640
affordable that was not really possible we're seeing homes

2615
02:10:14,640 --> 02:10:16,319
entry-level homes in

2616
02:10:16,319 --> 02:10:18,369
the hundred and twenty five to hundred and fifty dollars

2617
02:10:18,369 --> 02:10:19,439
square foot range and

2618
02:10:19,439 --> 02:10:22,329
these wouldn't be in that range you're not going to see the

2619
02:10:22,329 --> 02:10:23,079
big commercial

2620
02:10:23,079 --> 02:10:25,430
lights and things it'll be more similar to what you would

2621
02:10:25,430 --> 02:10:25,920
in another

2622
02:10:25,920 --> 02:10:32,000
neighborhood and in good separation distance between the

2623
02:10:32,000 --> 02:10:34,319
properties privacy

2624
02:10:34,319 --> 02:10:37,430
fence between the two that's been promised to practically

2625
02:10:37,430 --> 02:10:38,359
replace all the

2626
02:10:38,359 --> 02:10:40,920
neighbors existing fences and we're going with a taller

2627
02:10:40,920 --> 02:10:42,199
fence so that's where I

2628
02:10:42,199 --> 02:10:45,810
think the uses would make some difference the biggest

2629
02:10:45,810 --> 02:10:46,960
challenge might be

2630
02:10:46,960 --> 02:10:51,810
on on Janey Street as far as some commercial traffic but

2631
02:10:51,810 --> 02:10:52,420
that's why we're

2632
02:10:52,420 --> 02:10:55,949
proposing the access on McKinney Street at the front I

2633
02:10:55,949 --> 02:10:57,079
think it's interesting

2634
02:10:57,079 --> 02:11:01,180
that this is classified as a collector because of all the

2635
02:11:01,180 --> 02:11:02,359
houses on the front of

2636
02:11:02,359 --> 02:11:05,180
the street but when I look at the area all those streets

2637
02:11:05,180 --> 02:11:06,359
are collector streets

2638
02:11:06,359 --> 02:11:09,100
because of the number of houses on them so that's it's kind

2639
02:11:09,100 --> 02:11:10,119
of an interesting

2640
02:11:10,119 --> 02:11:14,579
facet of our development code in the way we classify

2641
02:11:14,579 --> 02:11:16,159
streets is there anything

2642
02:11:16,159 --> 02:11:20,100
else related to land use I you know granted you'll have

2643
02:11:20,100 --> 02:11:21,239
people coming in and

2644
02:11:21,239 --> 02:11:23,119
out but it's not just because of the zoning you're not

2645
02:11:23,119 --> 02:11:23,760
gonna have a big

2646
02:11:23,760 --> 02:11:28,079
shopping center with the massive parking lots and and the

2647
02:11:28,079 --> 02:11:29,600
huge crowds coming in

2648
02:11:29,600 --> 02:11:32,729
at Christmas or whatever for shopping events or things like

2649
02:11:32,729 --> 02:11:33,760
that right and I

2650
02:11:33,760 --> 02:11:37,760
guess if I can continue I think what's getting lost is my

2651
02:11:37,760 --> 02:11:39,399
question okay so what

2652
02:11:39,399 --> 02:11:42,869
I wanted from you is is you've you've definitely addressed

2653
02:11:42,869 --> 02:11:43,680
the issues the

2654
02:11:43,680 --> 02:11:46,340
neighborhood at least brought to you in the meeting with

2655
02:11:46,340 --> 02:11:48,239
your your overlay and

2656
02:11:48,239 --> 02:11:54,319
eliminating you know types of uses and and and great

2657
02:11:54,319 --> 02:11:54,960
restrictions on that

2658
02:11:54,960 --> 02:11:59,420
overlay but what I wanted from you is why do you think this

2659
02:11:59,420 --> 02:12:02,239
three acres in the

2660
02:12:02,239 --> 02:12:06,739
use that you're proposing is compatible with with the

2661
02:12:06,739 --> 02:12:09,199
neighborhood because with

2662
02:12:09,199 --> 02:12:12,699
the restrictions we're gonna see things like bail bonds on

2663
02:12:12,699 --> 02:12:13,520
the front they want

2664
02:12:13,520 --> 02:12:16,079
to be on McKinney Street what we can see in the back is

2665
02:12:16,079 --> 02:12:17,600
compatible uses such as

2666
02:12:17,600 --> 02:12:22,130
child care centers doctors offices people that would serve

2667
02:12:22,130 --> 02:12:24,199
those I don't know it's

2668
02:12:24,199 --> 02:12:27,000
hard to get businesses that can be supported within walking

2669
02:12:27,000 --> 02:12:27,680
distance because

2670
02:12:27,680 --> 02:12:30,619
usually with single-family home districts you can't hardly

2671
02:12:30,619 --> 02:12:31,239
support a

2672
02:12:31,239 --> 02:12:33,970
snow cone stand within walking distance it's just hard to

2673
02:12:33,970 --> 02:12:34,680
do you have to have

2674
02:12:34,680 --> 02:12:40,510
driving but it would be uses that were compatible I think

2675
02:12:40,510 --> 02:12:41,960
the marketplace would

2676
02:12:41,960 --> 02:12:44,779
drive uses that are compatible with the residents as far as

2677
02:12:44,779 --> 02:12:45,920
things like daycare

2678
02:12:45,920 --> 02:12:48,170
centers that could serve those residents over there it's

2679
02:12:48,170 --> 02:12:49,640
not going to really being

2680
02:12:49,640 --> 02:12:51,979
that far back in there just because of where it is it's not

2681
02:12:51,979 --> 02:12:52,640
going to really

2682
02:12:52,640 --> 02:12:56,319
attract the type of businesses that want to be on McKinney

2683
02:12:56,319 --> 02:12:57,319
per se it's going to

2684
02:12:57,319 --> 02:12:59,520
attract the type of businesses that want to be in that

2685
02:12:59,520 --> 02:13:00,760
neighborhood and I think

2686
02:13:00,760 --> 02:13:04,279
it works well with your neighborhood residential mixed use

2687
02:13:04,279 --> 02:13:05,279
and the ability to

2688
02:13:05,279 --> 02:13:08,500
provide the services within walking distance or short

2689
02:13:08,500 --> 02:13:09,760
driving distance so

2690
02:13:09,760 --> 02:13:14,560
they don't have to go across town to get to them well you

2691
02:13:14,560 --> 02:13:16,119
're at the mic if you

2692
02:13:16,119 --> 02:13:19,600
don't mind looking at the overhead map and we're talking

2693
02:13:19,600 --> 02:13:20,319
about affordable

2694
02:13:20,319 --> 02:13:23,520
housing and availability it appears that right across the

2695
02:13:23,520 --> 02:13:24,680
street to the west of

2696
02:13:24,680 --> 02:13:29,479
this site on Janey is a vacant lot it looks like on Hedda

2697
02:13:29,479 --> 02:13:31,520
Street there are two

2698
02:13:31,520 --> 02:13:37,060
vacant lots that are available on Riddell Street there's

2699
02:13:37,060 --> 02:13:38,159
vacant lot available

2700
02:13:38,159 --> 02:13:42,119
so there is single-family residential lots that are

2701
02:13:42,119 --> 02:13:43,800
available that are still

2702
02:13:43,800 --> 02:13:47,210
sitting there vacant even across from what is here a larger

2703
02:13:47,210 --> 02:13:48,880
track so this will

2704
02:13:48,880 --> 02:13:51,779
bring that to the Commission detention while we're talking

2705
02:13:51,779 --> 02:13:52,640
about that that

2706
02:13:52,640 --> 02:13:55,640
there are available vacant lots right across the street and

2707
02:13:55,640 --> 02:13:56,439
on neighboring

2708
02:13:56,439 --> 02:14:02,600
streets that are still vacant so talking about demand and

2709
02:14:02,600 --> 02:14:05,199
availability so

2710
02:14:05,199 --> 02:14:12,079
I recognize that next speaker am I allowed to respond sure

2711
02:14:12,079 --> 02:14:13,359
my issue with

2712
02:14:13,359 --> 02:14:16,260
affordable housing was not that we need to build more right

2713
02:14:16,260 --> 02:14:17,520
there it was I don't

2714
02:14:17,520 --> 02:14:20,600
want to see the demise of what is affordable there's a lot

2715
02:14:20,600 --> 02:14:21,359
of investors in

2716
02:14:21,359 --> 02:14:23,750
that neighborhood who would just love this to turn all

2717
02:14:23,750 --> 02:14:24,760
commercial there so

2718
02:14:24,760 --> 02:14:27,920
they can sell their property and we have now eliminated

2719
02:14:27,920 --> 02:14:29,199
affordable leasing and

2720
02:14:29,199 --> 02:14:33,159
affordable housing options that was my point okay thank you

2721
02:14:33,159 --> 02:14:34,680
well-said

2722
02:14:34,680 --> 02:14:37,170
lady did you have something else you wanted to add for our

2723
02:14:37,170 --> 02:14:37,960
recognize next

2724
02:14:37,960 --> 02:14:41,039
speaker related to that I was here the night the prior

2725
02:14:41,039 --> 02:14:43,000
zoning was approved and

2726
02:14:43,000 --> 02:14:46,029
saw the concept plans and I think the primary reason that

2727
02:14:46,029 --> 02:14:47,079
that development

2728
02:14:47,079 --> 02:14:50,079
didn't occur because it was not economically sustainable

2729
02:14:50,079 --> 02:14:51,439
yeah even for

2730
02:14:51,439 --> 02:14:54,979
the tiny houses it would be very affordable it just didn't

2731
02:14:54,979 --> 02:14:56,159
happen for I

2732
02:14:56,159 --> 02:15:01,979
think obvious reasons any other question yes Commissioner

2733
02:15:01,979 --> 02:15:02,560
Sullivan

2734
02:15:02,560 --> 02:15:07,359
thanks chair first I guess to staff I'm confused because

2735
02:15:07,359 --> 02:15:08,920
you had in your chart

2736
02:15:08,920 --> 02:15:12,680
that the building height was 40 feet on both and yet and

2737
02:15:12,680 --> 02:15:14,199
what I'm looking at it's

2738
02:15:14,199 --> 02:15:21,880
65 feet for the NR MU 12 is it 40 or 65

2739
02:15:29,000 --> 02:15:34,760
in our six is 40 did I show NR MU 12 is a maximum building

2740
02:15:34,760 --> 02:15:36,840
height the 40 feet in

2741
02:15:36,840 --> 02:15:41,090
our MU has a maximum building height of 65 feet okay wrong

2742
02:15:41,090 --> 02:15:42,760
in my chart no I

2743
02:15:42,760 --> 02:15:44,829
think they had it wrong in their chart that's why I was

2744
02:15:44,829 --> 02:15:45,720
asking is that you had

2745
02:15:45,720 --> 02:15:52,720
both heights were 40 yes okay well I've got NR MU 12 is it

2746
02:15:52,720 --> 02:15:54,720
's 65 feet in our

2747
02:15:54,720 --> 02:15:59,359
backup oh I apologize that I that I may have okay so that's

2748
02:15:59,359 --> 02:16:00,079
what it is so it is

2749
02:16:00,079 --> 02:16:06,439
40 yes okay I got that's fine I'm struggling with if when I

2750
02:16:06,439 --> 02:16:06,960
look at the

2751
02:16:06,960 --> 02:16:13,619
things that you strike from the district and all the thing

2752
02:16:13,619 --> 02:16:14,520
all the restrictions

2753
02:16:14,520 --> 02:16:20,239
the height from 40 to 35 one story what's the difference

2754
02:16:20,239 --> 02:16:21,640
between just having

2755
02:16:21,640 --> 02:16:27,720
an NR 6 I mean you're basically building an NR 6 from the

2756
02:16:27,720 --> 02:16:30,439
NR MU 12 with the

2757
02:16:30,439 --> 02:16:35,559
restrictions that you're placing in that zoning I'm

2758
02:16:35,559 --> 02:16:37,760
confused as to why the

2759
02:16:37,760 --> 02:16:43,069
why the restrictions that ends up looking like in our six

2760
02:16:43,069 --> 02:16:44,559
the primary

2761
02:16:44,559 --> 02:16:48,819
reason is because of the garden office type facilities that

2762
02:16:48,819 --> 02:16:50,000
we can have in some

2763
02:16:50,000 --> 02:16:52,920
retail and small restaurants and things that can go there

2764
02:16:52,920 --> 02:16:54,159
there's very limited

2765
02:16:54,159 --> 02:16:57,719
size of them so it does make them neighborhood residential

2766
02:16:57,719 --> 02:16:58,520
friendly if

2767
02:16:58,520 --> 02:17:00,780
somebody would come in and put a small restaurant it'd be a

2768
02:17:00,780 --> 02:17:01,520
good place to walk

2769
02:17:01,520 --> 02:17:05,329
to from within the neighborhood so it allows the primary

2770
02:17:05,329 --> 02:17:07,120
uses that this client

2771
02:17:07,120 --> 02:17:10,590
is looking at developing in that area I guess it doesn't

2772
02:17:10,590 --> 02:17:12,239
include everything but

2773
02:17:12,239 --> 02:17:15,479
we think it makes it even more neighborhood compatible than

2774
02:17:15,479 --> 02:17:16,040
then what

2775
02:17:16,040 --> 02:17:20,250
the neighborhood residential district allows for and it

2776
02:17:20,250 --> 02:17:21,799
just takes away some

2777
02:17:21,799 --> 02:17:26,479
of the taller higher people use activities such as

2778
02:17:26,479 --> 02:17:28,000
apartments and

2779
02:17:28,000 --> 02:17:31,899
schools and things of that nature but mean what and what do

2780
02:17:31,899 --> 02:17:32,479
you say you're

2781
02:17:32,479 --> 02:17:35,909
gonna do with about the density you were to keep that at at

2782
02:17:35,909 --> 02:17:39,479
the at 6 or 12

2783
02:17:39,479 --> 02:17:46,209
six actually I'd have to talk to our applicant here Nathan

2784
02:17:46,209 --> 02:17:48,440
iel Johnson I don't

2785
02:17:48,440 --> 02:17:51,959
see a problem with keep reducing the density from 12 to 6

2786
02:17:51,959 --> 02:17:52,959
because we're not

2787
02:17:52,959 --> 02:17:55,989
planning on building single-family residential anyway in

2788
02:17:55,989 --> 02:17:56,840
there so I don't

2789
02:17:56,840 --> 02:17:59,840
see that that would make a difference I didn't even think

2790
02:17:59,840 --> 02:18:00,559
about adding that

2791
02:18:00,559 --> 02:18:05,829
restriction I need Dodson Dodson legal group developing

2792
02:18:05,829 --> 02:18:07,879
this the Davis your

2793
02:18:07,879 --> 02:18:11,520
address please sir for the record 109 South Woodrow thank

2794
02:18:11,520 --> 02:18:14,440
you the big use and

2795
02:18:14,440 --> 02:18:18,399
restriction as far as I understood is professional space

2796
02:18:18,399 --> 02:18:20,760
the property itself

2797
02:18:20,760 --> 02:18:25,659
being just adjacent from the court building is really ideal

2798
02:18:25,659 --> 02:18:26,840
for the legal

2799
02:18:26,840 --> 02:18:31,510
community and the legal needs surrounding there's just not

2800
02:18:31,510 --> 02:18:32,120
a lot of

2801
02:18:32,120 --> 02:18:36,739
office space or any place for the legal community to get

2802
02:18:36,739 --> 02:18:38,680
housed in fact that some

2803
02:18:38,680 --> 02:18:41,659
of the buildings are being acquired by the county it's

2804
02:18:41,659 --> 02:18:43,239
actually a shrinking

2805
02:18:43,239 --> 02:18:51,030
area for people that are exactly in my position and other

2806
02:18:51,030 --> 02:18:52,479
of the legal

2807
02:18:52,479 --> 02:18:56,280
communities position that we're getting kicked farther and

2808
02:18:56,280 --> 02:18:58,079
farther out which is

2809
02:18:58,079 --> 02:19:03,049
not ideal the entire purpose of the development is to kind

2810
02:19:03,049 --> 02:19:04,120
of create a home

2811
02:19:04,120 --> 02:19:10,200
and an epicenter for people within the legal community to

2812
02:19:10,200 --> 02:19:11,799
kind of glom onto

2813
02:19:11,799 --> 02:19:17,409
being walking distance for restaurants being where I'm sure

2814
02:19:17,409 --> 02:19:18,959
there's a gun in the

2815
02:19:18,959 --> 02:19:23,309
effects or kinkos if there were still around as well as

2816
02:19:23,309 --> 02:19:24,959
being able to house

2817
02:19:24,959 --> 02:19:30,069
attorneys bail bonds towards the front and have a easy

2818
02:19:30,069 --> 02:19:32,200
access area that just

2819
02:19:32,200 --> 02:19:39,120
simply is not existent in the current area in terms of the

2820
02:19:39,120 --> 02:19:40,440
neighborhood itself

2821
02:19:40,440 --> 02:19:44,860
I understand the concern brought up about being such a

2822
02:19:44,860 --> 02:19:46,719
striking difference

2823
02:19:46,719 --> 02:19:51,250
from commercial to residential but in fact we're trying to

2824
02:19:51,250 --> 02:19:52,479
work appearance

2825
02:19:52,479 --> 02:19:57,670
wise into the neighborhood which pitched roof smaller

2826
02:19:57,670 --> 02:19:59,840
buildings so it won't be

2827
02:19:59,840 --> 02:20:02,950
that glaring difference between having a Kroger's right in

2828
02:20:02,950 --> 02:20:04,799
front of your house and

2829
02:20:04,799 --> 02:20:09,579
a neighborhood so all the the things that are being brought

2830
02:20:09,579 --> 02:20:10,920
up are considered

2831
02:20:10,920 --> 02:20:13,170
and very important and we don't want to have a problem with

2832
02:20:13,170 --> 02:20:14,200
the neighborhood at

2833
02:20:14,200 --> 02:20:18,450
the same time when you talk about affordable housing new

2834
02:20:18,450 --> 02:20:19,600
construction

2835
02:20:19,600 --> 02:20:23,899
isn't very affordable regardless of where you go and I

2836
02:20:23,899 --> 02:20:25,520
understand and agree with

2837
02:20:25,520 --> 02:20:30,559
what Lee was talking about previously of most likely the

2838
02:20:30,559 --> 02:20:32,200
last project for the

2839
02:20:32,200 --> 02:20:37,040
rezoning failed ultimately because the neighborhood couldn

2840
02:20:37,040 --> 02:20:38,600
't sell a new

2841
02:20:38,600 --> 02:20:42,520
construction is doesn't fit with the current neighborhood

2842
02:20:42,520 --> 02:20:44,879
either and my biggest

2843
02:20:44,879 --> 02:20:50,389
concern is is that would end up being empty raw land in the

2844
02:20:50,389 --> 02:20:52,440
long term because

2845
02:20:52,440 --> 02:20:56,969
until there's a change within the neighborhood which would

2846
02:20:56,969 --> 02:20:57,479
absolutely

2847
02:20:57,479 --> 02:21:02,280
destroy the affordable housing there's not too much that

2848
02:21:02,280 --> 02:21:04,360
can be done with that

2849
02:21:04,360 --> 02:21:08,799
property itself so really all I'm trying to do is increase

2850
02:21:08,799 --> 02:21:11,000
the value of the

2851
02:21:11,000 --> 02:21:15,909
surrounding community we'd be improving the road itself as

2852
02:21:15,909 --> 02:21:17,760
well as creating an

2853
02:21:17,760 --> 02:21:22,149
actual use for a property that may end up remaining raw

2854
02:21:22,149 --> 02:21:24,920
land for decades because

2855
02:21:24,920 --> 02:21:28,840
you can't build residential within that current community

2856
02:21:28,840 --> 02:21:29,600
although it's

2857
02:21:29,600 --> 02:21:32,409
understandable that you don't want to have a striking

2858
02:21:32,409 --> 02:21:33,600
difference between a

2859
02:21:33,600 --> 02:21:38,719
commercial space you know the the CVS and the residential

2860
02:21:38,719 --> 02:21:39,500
neighborhood it

2861
02:21:39,500 --> 02:21:44,360
occurs all the time everywhere but we are trying to our

2862
02:21:44,360 --> 02:21:45,719
best to work within the

2863
02:21:45,719 --> 02:21:50,180
community keep everybody happy not be a striking difference

2864
02:21:50,180 --> 02:21:52,920
between the office

2865
02:21:52,920 --> 02:21:56,760
space as well as the neighborhood itself

2866
02:21:57,120 --> 02:22:05,379
thank you commissioner Smith thank you chair before I move

2867
02:22:05,379 --> 02:22:06,760
on mr. Dotson thank

2868
02:22:06,760 --> 02:22:09,520
you very much for your words one of the things I brought up

2869
02:22:09,520 --> 02:22:10,479
today on the

2870
02:22:10,479 --> 02:22:13,700
Commission was the idea of valuation changing and the

2871
02:22:13,700 --> 02:22:15,280
affordable housing area

2872
02:22:15,280 --> 02:22:18,750
that surrounds the plot of land that we're talking about in

2873
02:22:18,750 --> 02:22:19,799
my own personal

2874
02:22:19,799 --> 02:22:21,799
experience to doing research on affordable housing

2875
02:22:21,799 --> 02:22:23,000
commercial property

2876
02:22:23,000 --> 02:22:25,870
purchases and development of commercial property doesn't

2877
02:22:25,870 --> 02:22:26,600
nearly affect

2878
02:22:26,600 --> 02:22:30,700
residential home values as much as being people think in

2879
02:22:30,700 --> 02:22:32,280
actuality a lot of times

2880
02:22:32,280 --> 02:22:35,530
you lose the demand for residential property when you're

2881
02:22:35,530 --> 02:22:36,760
getting when you have

2882
02:22:36,760 --> 02:22:40,420
it closer to commercial so if anything it might actually

2883
02:22:40,420 --> 02:22:42,319
keep home values less

2884
02:22:42,319 --> 02:22:44,950
if you see investors want to come in and buy a nice

2885
02:22:44,950 --> 02:22:46,360
residential home in the

2886
02:22:46,360 --> 02:22:49,040
middle of a nice residential neighborhood now if they have

2887
02:22:49,040 --> 02:22:49,559
possibly a

2888
02:22:49,559 --> 02:22:52,780
commercial space across the way it may be less of desire

2889
02:22:52,780 --> 02:22:54,159
keeping that value low

2890
02:22:54,159 --> 02:22:56,600
is what is what the way I perceive it so I just wouldn't

2891
02:22:56,600 --> 02:22:58,340
have that there on record

2892
02:22:58,340 --> 02:23:04,420
to mr. Allison and his associates the the genie Street

2893
02:23:04,420 --> 02:23:06,639
condition it was

2894
02:23:06,639 --> 02:23:08,620
something that was brought up during the neighborhood

2895
02:23:08,620 --> 02:23:10,360
community meeting is that

2896
02:23:10,360 --> 02:23:12,540
something and I'm asking a lot of the questions I'm gonna

2897
02:23:12,540 --> 02:23:13,239
ask you here are

2898
02:23:13,239 --> 02:23:17,209
dependent upon the platting process once we get to that is

2899
02:23:17,209 --> 02:23:19,719
the discussion of the

2900
02:23:19,719 --> 02:23:23,299
development bringing improvements to genie Street on the

2901
02:23:23,299 --> 02:23:24,159
table is that

2902
02:23:24,159 --> 02:23:26,620
something that is going to be addressed because that Street

2903
02:23:26,620 --> 02:23:27,440
is terrible the

2904
02:23:27,440 --> 02:23:31,600
condition of genie Street is deplorable and in accordance

2905
02:23:31,600 --> 02:23:32,360
with the city

2906
02:23:32,360 --> 02:23:35,579
requirements for development and perimeter street

2907
02:23:35,579 --> 02:23:37,079
requirements we will be

2908
02:23:37,079 --> 02:23:40,590
working with the city to accomplish that we are already in

2909
02:23:40,590 --> 02:23:42,000
the process of laying

2910
02:23:42,000 --> 02:23:45,559
it out one of our big challenges is to try and come up with

2911
02:23:45,559 --> 02:23:46,479
an alternate design

2912
02:23:46,479 --> 02:23:49,100
so we can try and keep those trees in the median where gen

2913
02:23:49,100 --> 02:23:49,920
ie is going to go

2914
02:23:49,920 --> 02:23:53,639
people really like those but if that Street gets rebuilt to

2915
02:23:53,639 --> 02:23:54,559
city standards

2916
02:23:54,559 --> 02:23:57,989
without some kind of exception by the city those trees will

2917
02:23:57,989 --> 02:23:58,760
have to go but

2918
02:23:58,760 --> 02:24:03,680
we're yes that was Street will be will be improved will be

2919
02:24:03,680 --> 02:24:05,559
upgraded as the site

2920
02:24:05,559 --> 02:24:09,180
is platted and only in portion of the part that is platted

2921
02:24:09,180 --> 02:24:10,239
so it may if the

2922
02:24:10,239 --> 02:24:12,989
site gets platted in three pieces it'll be three pieces is

2923
02:24:12,989 --> 02:24:13,879
that Street gets

2924
02:24:13,879 --> 02:24:17,059
does that mean the concept and the concept for the planning

2925
02:24:17,059 --> 02:24:17,799
that your

2926
02:24:17,799 --> 02:24:20,909
associate showed us a little while ago was there going to

2927
02:24:20,909 --> 02:24:22,260
be an entrance to the

2928
02:24:22,260 --> 02:24:24,729
property from genie Street or was it only be from the front

2929
02:24:24,729 --> 02:24:26,040
of McKinney that

2930
02:24:26,040 --> 02:24:31,239
concept was the concept whoops I need to find the word our

2931
02:24:31,239 --> 02:24:32,760
first one go there we

2932
02:24:32,760 --> 02:24:35,549
go I know it's small and hard to see there would actually

2933
02:24:35,549 --> 02:24:36,559
be two accesses to

2934
02:24:36,559 --> 02:24:39,579
genie Street we're proposing another access from McKinney

2935
02:24:39,579 --> 02:24:40,200
Street as well

2936
02:24:40,200 --> 02:24:42,940
didn't touch on the first presentation there last two

2937
02:24:42,940 --> 02:24:44,159
things specifically

2938
02:24:44,159 --> 02:24:47,399
talking about concept first of all there is an existing

2939
02:24:47,399 --> 02:24:48,879
tree wall that surrounds

2940
02:24:48,879 --> 02:24:51,280
the entire property that does shield it from the

2941
02:24:51,280 --> 02:24:52,799
neighborhood as it sits now so

2942
02:24:52,799 --> 02:24:56,520
it isn't like looking over raw land from the neighborhood

2943
02:24:56,520 --> 02:24:58,120
side is the idea you've

2944
02:24:58,120 --> 02:25:01,079
talked about a proposed screen is the idea to keep the

2945
02:25:01,079 --> 02:25:02,440
original facade of the

2946
02:25:02,440 --> 02:25:07,860
trees or to put up a brand new brick wall or I don't know a

2947
02:25:07,860 --> 02:25:09,520
lumber eight foot

2948
02:25:09,520 --> 02:25:12,530
fence what's the idea here on generally the idea is to work

2949
02:25:12,530 --> 02:25:13,360
with the neighbors

2950
02:25:13,360 --> 02:25:16,719
and replace their fences in place with a newer better fence

2951
02:25:16,719 --> 02:25:17,559
that would be a

2952
02:25:17,559 --> 02:25:20,219
privacy fence instead of trying to build a second one right

2953
02:25:20,219 --> 02:25:21,959
next to theirs and

2954
02:25:21,959 --> 02:25:24,540
that would give us better opportunity to maintain the tree

2955
02:25:24,540 --> 02:25:25,399
lines and we do have a

2956
02:25:25,399 --> 02:25:28,360
pretty good sized landscape buffer there and with the top

2957
02:25:28,360 --> 02:25:29,639
ography of the land it'll

2958
02:25:29,639 --> 02:25:32,469
be a lot easier to maintain the existing trees along the

2959
02:25:32,469 --> 02:25:33,600
edges of the property

2960
02:25:33,600 --> 02:25:38,049
will that pertain to the long the edges of genie Street as

2961
02:25:38,049 --> 02:25:40,040
well probably not

2962
02:25:40,040 --> 02:25:43,059
because of the city standard Street sections and the reason

2963
02:25:43,059 --> 02:25:44,479
need to dedicate

2964
02:25:44,479 --> 02:25:46,930
additional right away and widen everything in there and

2965
02:25:46,930 --> 02:25:47,559
utilities go

2966
02:25:47,559 --> 02:25:50,840
it's just almost impossible to save those great and the

2967
02:25:50,840 --> 02:25:51,639
last thing I think

2968
02:25:51,639 --> 02:25:55,120
to to you mr. Allison as well as you mr. Dotson number of

2969
02:25:55,120 --> 02:25:56,760
dwellings that we could

2970
02:25:56,760 --> 02:26:00,120
possibly project when it comes to the plotting process you

2971
02:26:00,120 --> 02:26:01,399
mentioned that even

2972
02:26:01,399 --> 02:26:07,219
though and the the new use that we're looking for from NR

2973
02:26:07,219 --> 02:26:09,360
six to NR MU 12 in

2974
02:26:09,360 --> 02:26:13,639
our unit 12 requests or has the allowance of 12 dwellings

2975
02:26:13,639 --> 02:26:14,440
per acre in

2976
02:26:14,440 --> 02:26:18,079
our six is six dwellings breaker you guys thinking that the

2977
02:26:18,079 --> 02:26:19,040
platting is going

2978
02:26:19,040 --> 02:26:22,600
to be looking more like six dwellings per acre versus 12

2979
02:26:22,600 --> 02:26:23,520
well if we get the

2980
02:26:23,520 --> 02:26:27,479
zoning approved there won't be any dwellings and sorry I

2981
02:26:27,479 --> 02:26:27,840
should I should

2982
02:26:27,840 --> 02:26:31,200
rephrase it units the ability for if you're talking about

2983
02:26:31,200 --> 02:26:31,920
talking about

2984
02:26:31,920 --> 02:26:35,090
building these as professional offices units per acre is

2985
02:26:35,090 --> 02:26:36,440
dwelling units it is

2986
02:26:36,440 --> 02:26:40,479
not building units okay and you can see in this plan we're

2987
02:26:40,479 --> 02:26:42,559
looking at on that

2988
02:26:42,559 --> 02:26:47,950
upper portion probably six buildings total okay that's what

2989
02:26:47,950 --> 02:26:49,079
I get 7500 square

2990
02:26:49,079 --> 02:26:52,440
yeah vernacular vernacular wrong but that the same in end

2991
02:26:52,440 --> 02:26:53,600
goal six total

2992
02:26:53,600 --> 02:26:57,340
buildings essentially as we're looking at and what we have

2993
02:26:57,340 --> 02:26:58,520
on this plan is

2994
02:26:58,520 --> 02:27:02,290
basically what we're anticipating in that upper area okay

2995
02:27:02,290 --> 02:27:03,200
no other questions

2996
02:27:03,200 --> 02:27:07,200
Commissioner a couple more questions still Commissioner

2997
02:27:07,200 --> 02:27:08,120
Roselle thank you

2998
02:27:08,120 --> 02:27:10,530
chair I've been taking notes this entire time so if this

2999
02:27:10,530 --> 02:27:11,399
seems like a stream of

3000
02:27:11,399 --> 02:27:15,059
consciousness and my questioning I apologize the overlay

3001
02:27:15,059 --> 02:27:16,000
that you submitted

3002
02:27:16,000 --> 02:27:18,629
to us was that completed before the neighborhood meeting or

3003
02:27:18,629 --> 02:27:19,280
in response to

3004
02:27:19,280 --> 02:27:21,719
the neighborhood meeting in response to the meeting okay

3005
02:27:21,719 --> 02:27:22,200
and they were

3006
02:27:22,200 --> 02:27:25,000
specifically discussed with those present at the meeting

3007
02:27:25,000 --> 02:27:26,719
line by line we

3008
02:27:26,719 --> 02:27:29,540
said we could do those and we did I think echoing other

3009
02:27:29,540 --> 02:27:30,680
commissioners I think

3010
02:27:30,680 --> 02:27:34,879
the overlay is gracious I think it's a it's a pretty good

3011
02:27:34,879 --> 02:27:36,920
attempt to mitigate

3012
02:27:36,920 --> 02:27:40,389
some of the concerns city staff brought up several times

3013
02:27:40,389 --> 02:27:42,120
that the main issue is

3014
02:27:42,120 --> 02:27:46,879
use that they don't want the use there was was used talked

3015
02:27:46,879 --> 02:27:48,000
about in the

3016
02:27:48,000 --> 02:27:52,409
community meeting did they bring up the opposition to a

3017
02:27:52,409 --> 02:27:54,399
office use no they

3018
02:27:54,399 --> 02:27:57,069
brought up an opposition to bars and clubs and things that

3019
02:27:57,069 --> 02:27:58,000
might operate late

3020
02:27:58,000 --> 02:28:01,620
at night which NRMU 12 does not allow at all they were

3021
02:28:01,620 --> 02:28:04,239
concerned about bail bonds

3022
02:28:04,239 --> 02:28:08,829
type facilities and while there's no restrictive of the use

3023
02:28:08,829 --> 02:28:09,920
of those that

3024
02:28:09,920 --> 02:28:14,879
specific those facilities tended locate on-street frontages

3025
02:28:14,879 --> 02:28:16,440
closer to the jail

3026
02:28:16,440 --> 02:28:19,000
the better because people walk out of there and go straight

3027
02:28:19,000 --> 02:28:19,799
to the bail bonds

3028
02:28:19,799 --> 02:28:24,159
but they need the the road visit main road visibility not

3029
02:28:24,159 --> 02:28:25,040
the background

3030
02:28:25,040 --> 02:28:28,510
visibility did you bring up the general office use in the

3031
02:28:28,510 --> 02:28:29,159
community being as

3032
02:28:29,159 --> 02:28:32,399
your intention yes we basically brought up this concept

3033
02:28:32,399 --> 02:28:33,520
site type plan and

3034
02:28:33,520 --> 02:28:36,940
there was no opposition stated at that time they were

3035
02:28:36,940 --> 02:28:38,520
against the office use

3036
02:28:38,520 --> 02:28:42,959
none had stated at that time no okay I have a question for

3037
02:28:42,959 --> 02:28:44,600
Julie why before I do

3038
02:28:44,600 --> 02:28:49,290
that I had one comment this this has no bearing on this but

3039
02:28:49,290 --> 02:28:50,559
as I'm looking at

3040
02:28:50,559 --> 02:28:52,559
the site plan I wrote up in the work session mr. Allison

3041
02:28:52,559 --> 02:28:53,799
you were there that

3042
02:28:53,799 --> 02:28:57,760
there's a very similar development like this off Hinkle

3043
02:28:57,760 --> 02:28:58,920
just north of University

3044
02:28:58,920 --> 02:29:01,479
across from the church behind the chase building and they

3045
02:29:01,479 --> 02:29:02,440
structured it where

3046
02:29:02,440 --> 02:29:06,579
the drive and parking abutted the adjacent properties

3047
02:29:06,579 --> 02:29:07,639
providing a little

3048
02:29:07,639 --> 02:29:10,510
bit more buffer from the fence lines the actual building so

3049
02:29:10,510 --> 02:29:11,719
I don't know if that

3050
02:29:11,719 --> 02:29:14,930
is possible or if that's desired I'm not sure I don't know

3051
02:29:14,930 --> 02:29:16,319
how to plan that but

3052
02:29:16,319 --> 02:29:18,659
I'm wondering if the drive on the east side and the

3053
02:29:18,659 --> 02:29:20,680
buildings were flipped if it

3054
02:29:20,680 --> 02:29:23,409
actually would provide more buffer if there's an issue with

3055
02:29:23,409 --> 02:29:24,120
cars driving I

3056
02:29:24,120 --> 02:29:27,340
don't know but I just it works in the other development in

3057
02:29:27,340 --> 02:29:28,120
terms of spacing

3058
02:29:28,120 --> 02:29:31,409
sight lines from the back door of the house the buildings

3059
02:29:31,409 --> 02:29:32,440
are pushed for

3060
02:29:32,440 --> 02:29:36,629
further away from the property line again that that's not

3061
02:29:36,629 --> 02:29:37,920
relevant to this

3062
02:29:37,920 --> 02:29:41,469
but in this weekend this I wonder if I didn't be more

3063
02:29:41,469 --> 02:29:43,120
manual to residents to

3064
02:29:43,120 --> 02:29:47,309
flip that I am very familiar with the facility you're

3065
02:29:47,309 --> 02:29:50,040
speaking of my personal

3066
02:29:50,040 --> 02:29:52,690
opinion is that this is a better layout because you have

3067
02:29:52,690 --> 02:29:53,879
landscaping in the back

3068
02:29:53,879 --> 02:29:59,069
we have any large mechanical type equipment has to be at

3069
02:29:59,069 --> 02:30:01,200
least 100 feet

3070
02:30:01,200 --> 02:30:03,329
from the property line which would kind of put it out in

3071
02:30:03,329 --> 02:30:04,399
the middle of everything

3072
02:30:04,399 --> 02:30:07,870
we've limited the units to residential style units and

3073
02:30:07,870 --> 02:30:09,200
requiring them to be

3074
02:30:09,200 --> 02:30:12,299
screened with screening walls there's more opportunity for

3075
02:30:12,299 --> 02:30:13,879
landscaping and you

3076
02:30:13,879 --> 02:30:18,620
have you just don't have the lights from cars pushing into

3077
02:30:18,620 --> 02:30:19,959
backyards etc so we

3078
02:30:19,959 --> 02:30:23,590
we feel like this is better I haven't heard anything from

3079
02:30:23,590 --> 02:30:24,399
the residents

3080
02:30:24,399 --> 02:30:30,450
directly related to that I leave it up to the professional

3081
02:30:30,450 --> 02:30:31,479
to decide that just

3082
02:30:31,479 --> 02:30:41,120
my thoughts miss why can I shoot two questions please you

3083
02:30:41,120 --> 02:30:41,879
had mentioned that

3084
02:30:41,879 --> 02:30:44,530
there's opposition because of the office use but it doesn't

3085
02:30:44,530 --> 02:30:45,239
sound like the

3086
02:30:45,239 --> 02:30:47,680
community was advocating that can you tell me about the

3087
02:30:47,680 --> 02:30:49,120
background from staff

3088
02:30:49,120 --> 02:30:56,569
having an issue with the use of office sure so so in terms

3089
02:30:56,569 --> 02:30:58,239
of these infill

3090
02:30:58,239 --> 02:31:01,459
areas where you've got established neighborhoods and then

3091
02:31:01,459 --> 02:31:02,120
you've got

3092
02:31:02,120 --> 02:31:05,700
development opportunities adjacent to it and I know we've

3093
02:31:05,700 --> 02:31:07,079
seen cases like these

3094
02:31:07,079 --> 02:31:10,840
come before come before this Commission in the last year we

3095
02:31:10,840 --> 02:31:11,920
have to look at

3096
02:31:11,920 --> 02:31:17,510
those neighborhoods and and and and ensure that often when

3097
02:31:17,510 --> 02:31:18,200
we have these

3098
02:31:18,200 --> 02:31:20,610
cases where commercial development starts encroaching in

3099
02:31:20,610 --> 02:31:21,520
those neighborhoods

3100
02:31:21,520 --> 02:31:25,489
it nibbles away it nibbles away at the edges of it and that

3101
02:31:25,489 --> 02:31:27,239
and that when it

3102
02:31:27,239 --> 02:31:30,389
nibbles too much then it compromises that cohesive

3103
02:31:30,389 --> 02:31:32,479
development pattern pattern

3104
02:31:32,479 --> 02:31:36,620
of that neighborhood and so we often need to in often in

3105
02:31:36,620 --> 02:31:38,280
some instances like

3106
02:31:38,280 --> 02:31:42,270
this one where it's really it's in it's it's centered in

3107
02:31:42,270 --> 02:31:44,079
that neighborhood we

3108
02:31:44,079 --> 02:31:46,870
want to hold the line to ensure that that neighborhood

3109
02:31:46,870 --> 02:31:48,000
stays protected and

3110
02:31:48,000 --> 02:31:54,510
that it and that those those those residents are that their

3111
02:31:54,510 --> 02:31:55,440
existing

3112
02:31:55,440 --> 02:31:58,930
development pattern and the uses that are in the area are

3113
02:31:58,930 --> 02:31:59,959
maintained and and

3114
02:31:59,959 --> 02:32:03,379
that there isn't that nibbling away so that one property

3115
02:32:03,379 --> 02:32:04,639
falls and the next one

3116
02:32:04,639 --> 02:32:08,739
falls and so that that's really our intent and in terms of

3117
02:32:08,739 --> 02:32:10,360
of a mix of uses

3118
02:32:10,360 --> 02:32:15,590
and an office yes often those things can be compatible but

3119
02:32:15,590 --> 02:32:16,799
we have to look at it

3120
02:32:16,799 --> 02:32:23,159
in a situational setting so in terms of this one you know I

3121
02:32:23,159 --> 02:32:24,799
we we looked at the

3122
02:32:24,799 --> 02:32:27,590
existing zoning pattern think you know that NRM U12 and

3123
02:32:27,590 --> 02:32:28,600
that NRMU the way it's

3124
02:32:28,600 --> 02:32:30,889
existing kind of makes sense in this area because there is

3125
02:32:30,889 --> 02:32:31,639
a need for office

3126
02:32:31,639 --> 02:32:35,739
space and we want to ensure that that those that it

3127
02:32:35,739 --> 02:32:37,440
develops in a way that's

3128
02:32:37,440 --> 02:32:42,399
appropriate for the area but but in this situation when it

3129
02:32:42,399 --> 02:32:44,719
's it's so far into the

3130
02:32:44,719 --> 02:32:47,479
neighborhood that's when it becomes problematic that you're

3131
02:32:47,479 --> 02:32:48,079
bringing in that

3132
02:32:48,079 --> 02:32:52,000
office use so so really that was our intent was to just

3133
02:32:52,000 --> 02:32:52,760
hold the line

3134
02:32:52,760 --> 02:32:56,120
maintain and protect that neighborhood against encroachment

3135
02:32:56,120 --> 02:32:56,840
and against the

3136
02:32:56,840 --> 02:33:00,600
nibbling away at the edges to that it's compromised to a

3137
02:33:00,600 --> 02:33:02,000
point where it would

3138
02:33:02,000 --> 02:33:05,219
change the character of the neighborhood and sure if I can

3139
02:33:05,219 --> 02:33:06,000
just add to that

3140
02:33:06,000 --> 02:33:09,780
really quickly I know we reference the development on H

3141
02:33:09,780 --> 02:33:11,520
inkle and University I'm

3142
02:33:11,520 --> 02:33:17,149
looking at the aerial and the the line is straight across

3143
02:33:17,149 --> 02:33:19,040
as far as residential

3144
02:33:19,040 --> 02:33:21,739
versus commercial so as Julie was talking about encro

3145
02:33:21,739 --> 02:33:23,079
achment there is Lee

3146
02:33:23,079 --> 02:33:28,569
there isn't any in this area specifically as we compare it

3147
02:33:28,569 --> 02:33:29,319
to this

3148
02:33:29,319 --> 02:33:31,569
particular one you're talking about like they haven't this

3149
02:33:31,569 --> 02:33:32,000
is more like a

3150
02:33:32,000 --> 02:33:34,719
peninsula in correct okay now that was one of our

3151
02:33:34,719 --> 02:33:35,479
considerations

3152
02:33:35,479 --> 02:33:42,389
thanks so I have two more questions do you know of the

3153
02:33:42,389 --> 02:33:44,639
eight oppositions we

3154
02:33:44,639 --> 02:33:48,059
have four of them are not homeowners their investment

3155
02:33:48,059 --> 02:33:49,079
properties do you know

3156
02:33:49,079 --> 02:33:51,659
of the ones within the 200 foot boundary which one of those

3157
02:33:51,659 --> 02:33:52,319
are those were

3158
02:33:52,319 --> 02:33:54,520
homeowners or investment properties do you know the

3159
02:33:54,520 --> 02:33:56,479
breakdown I don't in terms

3160
02:33:56,479 --> 02:33:59,840
of we sent out you know we send out notifications for

3161
02:33:59,840 --> 02:34:01,239
property owners within

3162
02:34:01,239 --> 02:34:07,430
200 feet and then residents within 500 feet property owners

3163
02:34:07,430 --> 02:34:08,399
are the only ones

3164
02:34:08,399 --> 02:34:12,600
who get that notice that allows them to submit for a

3165
02:34:12,600 --> 02:34:14,520
response now we did we did

3166
02:34:14,520 --> 02:34:18,159
have some response from outside that 200 boundary so they

3167
02:34:18,159 --> 02:34:19,280
got the notice somehow

3168
02:34:19,280 --> 02:34:24,750
but but in terms of who resides in that property I don't

3169
02:34:24,750 --> 02:34:26,200
know what the breakdown

3170
02:34:26,200 --> 02:34:29,219
is is whether they're who's residing there if they're

3171
02:34:29,219 --> 02:34:30,600
homeowners or if

3172
02:34:30,600 --> 02:34:33,440
that's a rental property is that your question did I answer

3173
02:34:33,440 --> 02:34:34,399
it is and I could

3174
02:34:34,399 --> 02:34:37,420
look up the addresses and with that is there follow-up from

3175
02:34:37,420 --> 02:34:38,520
these responses one

3176
02:34:38,520 --> 02:34:40,200
individual said they didn't want to sell the property it

3177
02:34:40,200 --> 02:34:40,879
sounds like they might

3178
02:34:40,879 --> 02:34:45,319
have been confused yeah we sometimes get responses back

3179
02:34:45,319 --> 02:34:46,100
from neighborhood where

3180
02:34:46,100 --> 02:34:49,290
there's some confusion on what the actual request is and so

3181
02:34:49,290 --> 02:34:49,840
yeah did you

3182
02:34:49,840 --> 02:34:52,200
did you follow without I haven't followed up with them now

3183
02:34:52,200 --> 02:34:53,479
so my last

3184
02:34:53,479 --> 02:34:57,879
question is this yes sir on the use case of retail sales

3185
02:34:57,879 --> 02:34:59,000
and service as well as

3186
02:34:59,000 --> 02:35:01,760
professional services and offices on those two uses is

3187
02:35:01,760 --> 02:35:02,760
there hours of

3188
02:35:02,760 --> 02:35:05,680
operation limitations we don't have our we don't have

3189
02:35:05,680 --> 02:35:06,799
limitations on the hours

3190
02:35:06,799 --> 02:35:09,879
of operation what we do have is a limitation on the gross

3191
02:35:09,879 --> 02:35:10,840
square foot per

3192
02:35:10,840 --> 02:35:17,760
lot so each lot I believe that's 5,000 for the retail and

3193
02:35:17,760 --> 02:35:20,000
10,000 for the office

3194
02:35:20,000 --> 02:35:27,000
space thank you per acre per lot per lot and there's three

3195
02:35:27,000 --> 02:35:28,360
lots here well it

3196
02:35:28,360 --> 02:35:34,440
depends on how they end up eventually flat property thank

3197
02:35:34,440 --> 02:35:35,239
you Julie's are my

3198
02:35:35,239 --> 02:35:39,520
questions sure commissioner back thank you chair my

3199
02:35:39,520 --> 02:35:40,959
questions will go back to

3200
02:35:40,959 --> 02:35:43,920
the applicant but as they approach I would just like to

3201
02:35:43,920 --> 02:35:45,040
make comment about

3202
02:35:45,040 --> 02:35:48,879
that 200 foot versus 500 foot those are kind of arbitrary

3203
02:35:48,879 --> 02:35:50,319
limits it's not that

3204
02:35:50,319 --> 02:35:54,200
the people outside the 200 foot within the 500 foot aren't

3205
02:35:54,200 --> 02:35:55,780
impacted negatively

3206
02:35:55,780 --> 02:35:59,030
or positively either way so I just want to you know don't

3207
02:35:59,030 --> 02:36:00,040
want that to be a

3208
02:36:00,040 --> 02:36:03,309
factor thinking it's not important people in the 500 what

3209
02:36:03,309 --> 02:36:04,559
was people beyond

3210
02:36:04,559 --> 02:36:10,120
the 200 foot limit thing now it was mentioned and I admit I

3211
02:36:10,120 --> 02:36:10,899
'm not the expert

3212
02:36:10,899 --> 02:36:13,719
here on what's affordable when you build and what you can

3213
02:36:13,719 --> 02:36:15,239
build there so I defer

3214
02:36:15,239 --> 02:36:19,829
to the developers here but affordable housing as

3215
02:36:19,829 --> 02:36:21,840
Commissioner Ellis pointed

3216
02:36:21,840 --> 02:36:25,620
out is affected when you do encroach and as Julie pointed

3217
02:36:25,620 --> 02:36:27,000
out it nibbles away

3218
02:36:27,000 --> 02:36:29,350
where people tend to sell their property and we lose that

3219
02:36:29,350 --> 02:36:30,280
existing housing there

3220
02:36:30,280 --> 02:36:36,059
but I mean you can build 18 lots 18 dwellings there and

3221
02:36:36,059 --> 02:36:37,280
that includes

3222
02:36:37,280 --> 02:36:41,840
duplexes is that not an affordable development that you

3223
02:36:41,840 --> 02:36:42,440
build and make

3224
02:36:42,440 --> 02:36:45,149
money off of that would benefit that would serve our need

3225
02:36:45,149 --> 02:36:45,959
for affordable

3226
02:36:45,959 --> 02:36:55,930
housing in your opinion with the NRMU 12 on that remaining

3227
02:36:55,930 --> 02:36:57,280
acres there could be

3228
02:36:57,280 --> 02:37:02,959
no with the NR6 the right 18 units where there's not can't

3229
02:37:02,959 --> 02:37:06,559
be 18 duplexes no

3230
02:37:06,559 --> 02:37:10,040
but you're talking about what would people buy they might

3231
02:37:10,040 --> 02:37:10,600
not buy a house

3232
02:37:10,600 --> 02:37:15,850
but you could build duplexes that people could buy and rent

3233
02:37:15,850 --> 02:37:17,040
out as affordable

3234
02:37:17,040 --> 02:37:22,760
housing no am I again not being the expert here is that we

3235
02:37:22,760 --> 02:37:25,840
are seeing more

3236
02:37:25,840 --> 02:37:30,290
rental property coming up in the forms of apartments and du

3237
02:37:30,290 --> 02:37:31,399
plexes in different

3238
02:37:31,399 --> 02:37:35,649
places I would have to refer to someone else as my

3239
02:37:35,649 --> 02:37:37,959
understanding that rental

3240
02:37:37,959 --> 02:37:41,520
property such as duplexes and apartments do more to reduce

3241
02:37:41,520 --> 02:37:42,440
the neighboring

3242
02:37:42,440 --> 02:37:47,540
property values and then apartments I could see I'm not

3243
02:37:47,540 --> 02:37:48,719
sure about duplexes

3244
02:37:48,719 --> 02:37:51,440
especially when you're only talking about a small number we

3245
02:37:51,440 --> 02:37:52,680
were agreeable

3246
02:37:52,680 --> 02:37:55,780
to something it's been months back where we allowed duplex

3247
02:37:55,780 --> 02:37:57,200
es to come in and on a

3248
02:37:57,200 --> 02:38:01,459
corner out on the front right was the gateway to single-

3249
02:38:01,459 --> 02:38:02,520
family I didn't have a

3250
02:38:02,520 --> 02:38:06,520
problem with that so there's there's some limits there that

3251
02:38:06,520 --> 02:38:07,239
could allow that

3252
02:38:07,239 --> 02:38:10,389
the other thing that you made a point of and I don't

3253
02:38:10,389 --> 02:38:12,040
disagree with and it's

3254
02:38:12,040 --> 02:38:15,530
shown in your concept layout is how this can look like it

3255
02:38:15,530 --> 02:38:16,799
can assimilate into

3256
02:38:16,799 --> 02:38:22,190
this neighborhood the only major impact that this

3257
02:38:22,190 --> 02:38:24,040
development have that sets it

3258
02:38:24,040 --> 02:38:27,520
apart from a residential setting is the extra traffic it's

3259
02:38:27,520 --> 02:38:28,600
going to bring in and

3260
02:38:28,600 --> 02:38:32,479
it's it's it's an unstable effect on a neighborhood where

3261
02:38:32,479 --> 02:38:33,399
it's going to be

3262
02:38:33,399 --> 02:38:38,069
people that are never the same so that has several

3263
02:38:38,069 --> 02:38:39,760
different effects on the

3264
02:38:39,760 --> 02:38:44,090
existing neighborhood and I worry about that too but other

3265
02:38:44,090 --> 02:38:45,319
than that again I

3266
02:38:45,319 --> 02:38:50,219
just think you know bottom line is we seem to have still I

3267
02:38:50,219 --> 02:38:51,799
'm not convinced

3268
02:38:51,799 --> 02:38:55,280
that the residents in that area are really for this enough

3269
02:38:55,280 --> 02:38:55,760
that's why I

3270
02:38:55,760 --> 02:38:59,149
would I would probably have less of a problem if you did go

3271
02:38:59,149 --> 02:39:00,159
back and talk to

3272
02:39:00,159 --> 02:39:01,760
them show them what you're going to do and make these

3273
02:39:01,760 --> 02:39:02,600
people feel comfortable

3274
02:39:02,600 --> 02:39:05,690
because this is their home this is where they live but then

3275
02:39:05,690 --> 02:39:07,479
again along the same

3276
02:39:07,479 --> 02:39:11,190
lines that the city's pointing out this is something that

3277
02:39:11,190 --> 02:39:12,639
will diminish that

3278
02:39:12,639 --> 02:39:14,860
neighborhood could diminish that neighborhood over time I

3279
02:39:14,860 --> 02:39:15,399
just never

3280
02:39:15,399 --> 02:39:19,280
went away and so anyway those are my comments thanks a

3281
02:39:19,280 --> 02:39:22,959
question for staff

3282
02:39:25,319 --> 02:39:28,860
Julie on the notification map that we have in our backup it

3283
02:39:28,860 --> 02:39:30,680
doesn't show any

3284
02:39:30,680 --> 02:39:35,270
of these properties whether they're for or against this

3285
02:39:35,270 --> 02:39:37,360
proposal so I did my

3286
02:39:37,360 --> 02:39:41,680
own due diligence while we were listening and our on the

3287
02:39:41,680 --> 02:39:42,959
paperwork that

3288
02:39:42,959 --> 02:39:46,829
you've provided for us here one of the homes is at 1427

3289
02:39:46,829 --> 02:39:48,799
Woodford that home

3290
02:39:48,799 --> 02:39:52,649
actually is the only home that backs or butts this piece of

3291
02:39:52,649 --> 02:39:54,520
property they're in

3292
02:39:54,520 --> 02:40:01,360
favor of this request the other homes that I looked up the

3293
02:40:01,360 --> 02:40:02,280
Hedy Street is a

3294
02:40:02,280 --> 02:40:06,459
street over and I don't know that it's within the 200 the

3295
02:40:06,459 --> 02:40:09,879
other ones at Campbell

3296
02:40:09,879 --> 02:40:13,690
another one at Campbell another one at Campbell those are

3297
02:40:13,690 --> 02:40:14,799
all at the very front

3298
02:40:14,799 --> 02:40:18,639
part that a back that a but to what is already existing the

3299
02:40:18,639 --> 02:40:21,079
NRMU 12 not abutting

3300
02:40:21,079 --> 02:40:24,649
this piece of property so they're already against in NRMU

3301
02:40:24,649 --> 02:40:28,040
12 not against NR6

3302
02:40:28,040 --> 02:40:31,180
and we're changing it so that they would be instead of abut

3303
02:40:31,180 --> 02:40:32,079
ting NR6 they

3304
02:40:32,079 --> 02:40:38,559
would be abutting NRMU 12 they already abut that so I guess

3305
02:40:38,559 --> 02:40:40,959
my point where I'm

3306
02:40:40,959 --> 02:40:44,500
going here is we've had a lot of conversation here so far

3307
02:40:44,500 --> 02:40:45,680
on this item

3308
02:40:45,680 --> 02:40:49,680
about the neighborhood and the neighbors and what their

3309
02:40:49,680 --> 02:40:51,200
thoughts are the one

3310
02:40:51,200 --> 02:40:54,760
neighbor that actually abuts this property is for it the

3311
02:40:54,760 --> 02:40:55,799
other ones that

3312
02:40:55,799 --> 02:40:59,540
are opposed to it are actually already abutting NRMU 12 is

3313
02:40:59,540 --> 02:41:02,440
that correct at

3314
02:41:02,440 --> 02:41:05,200
least that's what it looks like on my starting to Google

3315
02:41:05,200 --> 02:41:06,280
addresses while we're

3316
02:41:06,280 --> 02:41:09,879
up here looking and talking about this I had our GIS do

3317
02:41:09,879 --> 02:41:12,719
this map today based upon

3318
02:41:12,719 --> 02:41:16,319
that the responses we've received and I was looking to see

3319
02:41:16,319 --> 02:41:17,399
I'm showing the one

3320
02:41:17,399 --> 02:41:22,440
on wood Woodford here and I was but I don't have any

3321
02:41:22,440 --> 02:41:24,000
addresses on it so let me

3322
02:41:24,000 --> 02:41:28,959
see if I can the Woodford is in support 1427 Woodford at

3323
02:41:28,959 --> 02:41:30,319
least on this paperwork

3324
02:41:30,319 --> 02:41:33,360
says it's in support

3325
02:41:41,040 --> 02:41:44,959
so I guess more of a housekeeping thing if it's possible as

3326
02:41:44,959 --> 02:41:46,120
we go forward on

3327
02:41:46,120 --> 02:41:50,680
future meetings if we can have these opposition or support

3328
02:41:50,680 --> 02:41:51,959
letters that we

3329
02:41:51,959 --> 02:41:55,659
can get a better idea of where are they and are they within

3330
02:41:55,659 --> 02:41:56,440
the area are they

3331
02:41:56,440 --> 02:41:59,719
halfway across town or where are we so we have a little

3332
02:41:59,719 --> 02:42:01,040
more perspective as

3333
02:42:01,040 --> 02:42:04,860
commissioners as to who's in support who's opposed and

3334
02:42:04,860 --> 02:42:05,899
where are they in

3335
02:42:05,899 --> 02:42:08,629
relation to the property I think it'd be advantageous for

3336
02:42:08,629 --> 02:42:09,840
all of us up here

3337
02:42:09,840 --> 02:42:15,409
yeah I apologize my map doesn't have the addresses on it so

3338
02:42:15,409 --> 02:42:16,600
I see what you're

3339
02:42:16,600 --> 02:42:18,969
saying on the Woodford and I just have to check with our

3340
02:42:18,969 --> 02:42:21,399
GIS department okay

3341
02:42:21,399 --> 02:42:24,649
well I want to just clarify that because in our backup it

3342
02:42:24,649 --> 02:42:25,680
doesn't have anything

3343
02:42:25,680 --> 02:42:29,370
but we've got a whole stack and when you look at them I

3344
02:42:29,370 --> 02:42:31,079
think the one that's in

3345
02:42:31,079 --> 02:42:34,049
support is the one actually backs the property so thank you

3346
02:42:34,049 --> 02:42:35,159
for clarification

3347
02:42:35,159 --> 02:42:42,280
Commissioner Sullivan thank you on the concept that was up

3348
02:42:42,280 --> 02:42:43,780
there are y'all

3349
02:42:43,780 --> 02:42:49,860
proposed proposing just one entrance and exit onto McKinney

3350
02:42:49,860 --> 02:42:51,159
Street onto McKinney

3351
02:42:51,159 --> 02:42:53,959
Street yes sir there's only one entrance on McKinney Street

3352
02:42:53,959 --> 02:42:54,680
McKinney Street being

3353
02:42:54,680 --> 02:42:58,360
an arterial I'm sorry a collector

3354
02:43:00,360 --> 02:43:05,079
minor arterial we are proposing but we're having to beg for

3355
02:43:05,079 --> 02:43:06,520
it TIA is another

3356
02:43:06,520 --> 02:43:09,360
information with staff to get permission to have that on

3357
02:43:09,360 --> 02:43:11,799
McKinney otherwise

3358
02:43:11,799 --> 02:43:17,479
currently staff well until they finish reviewing our TIA

3359
02:43:17,479 --> 02:43:18,920
staff is only one is

3360
02:43:18,920 --> 02:43:23,840
to have two entries off of Jamie Street and from McKinney

3361
02:43:23,840 --> 02:43:25,280
and in your

3362
02:43:25,280 --> 02:43:28,500
wildest imaginations it becomes more successful than you

3363
02:43:28,500 --> 02:43:29,639
could ever hope for

3364
02:43:29,639 --> 02:43:33,959
how many parking spaces and how many people are going to be

3365
02:43:33,959 --> 02:43:35,200
going into that

3366
02:43:35,200 --> 02:43:42,399
space on any given day I can't answer that at this moment

3367
02:43:42,399 --> 02:43:43,079
and we haven't gone

3368
02:43:43,079 --> 02:43:48,100
to that level of study you know we've done that concept lay

3369
02:43:48,100 --> 02:43:48,959
out I can't get

3370
02:43:48,959 --> 02:43:52,399
back to it real quick

3371
02:43:59,639 --> 02:44:09,000
there it is that shows the the one driveway off of McKinney

3372
02:44:09,000 --> 02:44:09,840
one off of

3373
02:44:09,840 --> 02:44:12,340
McKinney that we're we've submitted to the city and trying

3374
02:44:12,340 --> 02:44:13,200
to get permission

3375
02:44:13,200 --> 02:44:17,479
to have and then it shows the two off Jamie Street that is

3376
02:44:17,479 --> 02:44:18,719
proportional

3377
02:44:18,719 --> 02:44:22,399
regarding the number of parking spaces and buildings we did

3378
02:44:22,399 --> 02:44:25,200
look at the sizes

3379
02:44:26,040 --> 02:44:30,909
gosh what a hundred and fifty two okay so so the two looks

3380
02:44:30,909 --> 02:44:32,760
like parking lots I

3381
02:44:32,760 --> 02:44:37,469
guess right those two spaces on Jamie or those are entrants

3382
02:44:37,469 --> 02:44:38,719
and exits yeah it's

3383
02:44:38,719 --> 02:44:42,149
not it's not shown that way in our or I can't see it in

3384
02:44:42,149 --> 02:44:44,440
that drawing but okay so

3385
02:44:44,440 --> 02:44:48,540
and so so what's your your preference would be one off of

3386
02:44:48,540 --> 02:44:49,360
McKinney and to

3387
02:44:49,360 --> 02:44:52,659
Jamie is that yes and that's what you're looking for and

3388
02:44:52,659 --> 02:44:54,920
meet the requirements we

3389
02:44:54,920 --> 02:44:59,629
could possibly eliminate the northern one to Jamie I would

3390
02:44:59,629 --> 02:45:01,159
like to point out

3391
02:45:01,159 --> 02:45:05,260
to we're just zoning an additional three acres to the NR me

3392
02:45:05,260 --> 02:45:06,600
12 so all that

3393
02:45:06,600 --> 02:45:09,760
other is gonna happen understand understand I would just

3394
02:45:09,760 --> 02:45:10,719
look at them

3395
02:45:10,719 --> 02:45:14,729
or number of parking spaces and I just saw the one entrance

3396
02:45:14,729 --> 02:45:15,799
and exit off of

3397
02:45:15,799 --> 02:45:19,340
McKinney I didn't realize there were two more on Jamie so

3398
02:45:19,340 --> 02:45:20,319
okay thank you

3399
02:45:20,319 --> 02:45:24,600
Commissioner Ellis thank you chair I just wanted to clarify

3400
02:45:24,600 --> 02:45:26,559
the Woodford in

3401
02:45:26,559 --> 02:45:30,840
favor of request that's a non owner occupant that homeowner

3402
02:45:30,840 --> 02:45:31,239
lives in

3403
02:45:31,239 --> 02:45:34,489
Lantana that property owner lives in Lantana that's a

3404
02:45:34,489 --> 02:45:39,000
rental property the

3405
02:45:39,000 --> 02:45:44,760
rental property the Woodford property who said is in favor

3406
02:45:44,760 --> 02:45:46,639
of requests yes but

3407
02:45:46,639 --> 02:45:51,030
that is a non owner occupant the person who owns that lives

3408
02:45:51,030 --> 02:45:52,440
in Lantana so that's

3409
02:45:52,440 --> 02:45:56,440
a tenant in that it's not property owner who's in favor of

3410
02:45:56,440 --> 02:45:57,120
it but it's an

3411
02:45:57,120 --> 02:46:02,319
investor okay okay so the actual property owners in favor

3412
02:46:02,319 --> 02:46:04,559
of it correct

3413
02:46:04,559 --> 02:46:11,360
okay thank you for the clarification Commissioner Sanchez

3414
02:46:14,159 --> 02:46:16,920
I just have one question when you had your your

3415
02:46:16,920 --> 02:46:18,840
neighborhood meeting what kind

3416
02:46:18,840 --> 02:46:23,030
of attendants did you get did you get quite a few people

3417
02:46:23,030 --> 02:46:24,040
from the neighborhood

3418
02:46:24,040 --> 02:46:29,159
or was just one or two if I remember correctly about 30

3419
02:46:29,159 --> 02:46:31,879
that's I'm gonna air

3420
02:46:31,879 --> 02:46:37,190
towards 20 just conservative so you think you got a pretty

3421
02:46:37,190 --> 02:46:38,280
good response is

3422
02:46:38,280 --> 02:46:40,620
that considered a good response from a neighborhood when

3423
02:46:40,620 --> 02:46:41,959
you do work like that I

3424
02:46:41,959 --> 02:46:47,379
don't know I've had responses anywhere from zero to 400

3425
02:46:47,379 --> 02:46:49,360
like that but I think

3426
02:46:49,360 --> 02:46:52,420
that's a pretty good I would think that you know 20 to 30

3427
02:46:52,420 --> 02:46:53,799
would seem a pretty

3428
02:46:53,799 --> 02:46:56,969
good response and even though we had sign-in sheets we didn

3429
02:46:56,969 --> 02:46:57,680
't go back to

3430
02:46:57,680 --> 02:47:00,319
look at their addresses I don't know if they were from

3431
02:47:00,319 --> 02:47:01,799
right next door or if

3432
02:47:01,799 --> 02:47:09,250
they were across town okay Commissioner back thanks chair

3433
02:47:09,250 --> 02:47:09,799
one quick question

3434
02:47:09,799 --> 02:47:15,270
for thanks Lee thank you Julie mentioned and did I hear

3435
02:47:15,270 --> 02:47:16,239
wrong that when the

3436
02:47:16,239 --> 02:47:19,250
notifications went out they went to property owners only I

3437
02:47:19,250 --> 02:47:20,600
'm sorry say again

3438
02:47:20,600 --> 02:47:23,129
I thought I heard you say a while ago when notifications

3439
02:47:23,129 --> 02:47:24,159
went out they went to

3440
02:47:24,159 --> 02:47:27,569
property owners only property owners within 200 feet and

3441
02:47:27,569 --> 02:47:29,000
residents within 500

3442
02:47:29,000 --> 02:47:34,510
okay but I thought the new change would we'd be sending it

3443
02:47:34,510 --> 02:47:36,520
to property owners

3444
02:47:36,520 --> 02:47:40,530
wherever they live one lives in Lantana but that all the

3445
02:47:40,530 --> 02:47:42,040
houses in that area

3446
02:47:42,040 --> 02:47:46,000
would get one and that means that if they were property

3447
02:47:46,000 --> 02:47:47,079
owner good if they

3448
02:47:47,079 --> 02:47:49,930
weren't probably they'd still get that notification you do

3449
02:47:49,930 --> 02:47:50,760
get a notification

3450
02:47:50,760 --> 02:47:54,530
as a resident you get a different and Ron may may correct

3451
02:47:54,530 --> 02:47:55,360
me on this because

3452
02:47:55,360 --> 02:47:58,250
there's been some changes but how this was noticed and how

3453
02:47:58,250 --> 02:47:59,159
we've typically

3454
02:47:59,159 --> 02:48:03,479
noticed based upon direction is a postcard to residents

3455
02:48:03,479 --> 02:48:05,079
okay and then a

3456
02:48:05,079 --> 02:48:09,959
letter to property owners the letter that property owners

3457
02:48:09,959 --> 02:48:11,520
get is this okay and

3458
02:48:11,520 --> 02:48:14,610
then the and then residents get that postcard to notify

3459
02:48:14,610 --> 02:48:15,680
them of the case okay

3460
02:48:15,680 --> 02:48:18,159
that's my concern not so much what it looks like but that

3461
02:48:18,159 --> 02:48:19,520
everybody that lives

3462
02:48:19,520 --> 02:48:22,600
within that 200 feet whether they're on a house or not we

3463
02:48:22,600 --> 02:48:23,440
'll get some kind of

3464
02:48:23,440 --> 02:48:26,950
notification from the 500 feet for residents and up to 500

3465
02:48:26,950 --> 02:48:27,959
feet - yes okay

3466
02:48:27,959 --> 02:48:31,950
great great thank you Commissioner Smith thank you chair mr

3467
02:48:31,950 --> 02:48:32,799
. Allison the

3468
02:48:32,799 --> 02:48:36,559
invitation to everyone to come to the community meeting how

3469
02:48:36,559 --> 02:48:38,159
the process of

3470
02:48:38,159 --> 02:48:41,379
inviting folks out there was that just a blanket postcard

3471
02:48:41,379 --> 02:48:42,760
was there a 200 foot

3472
02:48:42,760 --> 02:48:45,520
500 foot what was the what was the thought process on that

3473
02:48:45,520 --> 02:48:46,600
we contact the

3474
02:48:46,600 --> 02:48:50,440
city of Denton obtained the mailing list for property

3475
02:48:50,440 --> 02:48:52,299
owners and for residents

3476
02:48:52,299 --> 02:48:57,600
within 500 feet we send out a one-page flyer with a map

3477
02:48:57,600 --> 02:48:59,159
description of the

3478
02:48:59,159 --> 02:49:02,129
project and what's about to occur what we're considering

3479
02:49:02,129 --> 02:49:03,000
and where we're

3480
02:49:03,000 --> 02:49:07,700
meeting great awesome thank you okay this is a public

3481
02:49:07,700 --> 02:49:09,719
hearing I have two

3482
02:49:09,719 --> 02:49:14,879
other cards requesting to speak first will be Greg Johnson

3483
02:49:14,879 --> 02:49:20,479
in support thank

3484
02:49:20,479 --> 02:49:22,559
you mr. chairman for my time starts

3485
02:49:29,159 --> 02:49:31,159
Matt

3486
02:49:39,959 --> 02:49:43,430
my name is Greg Johnson 319 West Oak Street here in Denton

3487
02:49:43,430 --> 02:49:46,479
and a couple

3488
02:49:46,479 --> 02:49:49,760
comments first one I love Julie Julie is awesome we love

3489
02:49:49,760 --> 02:49:51,399
working with her Julie

3490
02:49:51,399 --> 02:49:54,409
and I unlike some people in this country can civilly

3491
02:49:54,409 --> 02:49:55,739
disagree and I'm gonna do

3492
02:49:55,739 --> 02:50:00,299
that tonight what a dream applicant I've sat up there for

3493
02:50:00,299 --> 02:50:01,079
many nights and I don't

3494
02:50:01,079 --> 02:50:03,170
recall ever seeing an applicant who would come up and

3495
02:50:03,170 --> 02:50:04,159
expose and impose all

3496
02:50:04,159 --> 02:50:08,360
of these restrictions on themselves which proves which is

3497
02:50:08,360 --> 02:50:09,440
not always the

3498
02:50:09,440 --> 02:50:15,590
case he really intends to build office the current zoning

3499
02:50:15,590 --> 02:50:16,520
that is on the

3500
02:50:16,520 --> 02:50:19,350
property today I actually voted to approve and I remember

3501
02:50:19,350 --> 02:50:19,879
sitting right

3502
02:50:19,879 --> 02:50:23,159
there saying why in the heck are they proposing it this way

3503
02:50:23,159 --> 02:50:24,200
these three

3504
02:50:24,200 --> 02:50:27,200
different zoning's on one parcel it made no sense to me

3505
02:50:27,200 --> 02:50:28,479
when I looked at this

3506
02:50:28,479 --> 02:50:31,600
jagged line and the deal across the back what was proposed

3507
02:50:31,600 --> 02:50:33,159
I knew the day I looked

3508
02:50:33,159 --> 02:50:36,379
at it it would never work mathematically and so

3509
02:50:36,379 --> 02:50:37,520
Commissioner Beck to your point

3510
02:50:37,520 --> 02:50:40,250
you're so right we need more affordable housing the

3511
02:50:40,250 --> 02:50:42,239
challenge with dropping in

3512
02:50:42,239 --> 02:50:45,079
18 you couldn't fit 18 lots anyway because you have the

3513
02:50:45,079 --> 02:50:45,760
street in the

3514
02:50:45,760 --> 02:50:47,700
middle but whatever number of lots you could fit by the

3515
02:50:47,700 --> 02:50:48,399
time you pay for a

3516
02:50:48,399 --> 02:50:52,170
public street to our city specs all the utilities the cost

3517
02:50:52,170 --> 02:50:53,000
of a lot would be

3518
02:50:53,000 --> 02:50:55,760
more than half the house so the math just doesn't work

3519
02:50:55,760 --> 02:50:56,559
which is why it didn't

3520
02:50:56,559 --> 02:51:00,370
happen and the truth of the matter is now I know why it was

3521
02:51:00,370 --> 02:51:01,239
proposed that way

3522
02:51:01,239 --> 02:51:04,469
I think if it would have been proposed in our NU 12 in the

3523
02:51:04,469 --> 02:51:05,399
back it would have

3524
02:51:05,399 --> 02:51:09,020
passed mr. Gene Hartman owns this property he's been saving

3525
02:51:09,020 --> 02:51:09,600
this property

3526
02:51:09,600 --> 02:51:12,020
for many many years he wanted something great to happen

3527
02:51:12,020 --> 02:51:13,200
with it and frankly he

3528
02:51:13,200 --> 02:51:16,360
just had bad advice he had somebody advising him on what

3529
02:51:16,360 --> 02:51:16,879
they thought they

3530
02:51:16,879 --> 02:51:19,239
could do with the property they wanted to buy it and what

3531
02:51:19,239 --> 02:51:20,280
was proposed would

3532
02:51:20,280 --> 02:51:24,819
never work a couple of points there are properties all over

3533
02:51:24,819 --> 02:51:26,200
this city larger

3534
02:51:26,200 --> 02:51:30,299
than this one up against and into neighborhoods that are z

3535
02:51:30,299 --> 02:51:31,079
oned in our MU

3536
02:51:31,079 --> 02:51:35,030
12 in our M use neighborhood residential mixed use as you

3537
02:51:35,030 --> 02:51:36,280
know it's made to

3538
02:51:36,280 --> 02:51:38,690
provide those uses that serve the neighborhoods daycare

3539
02:51:38,690 --> 02:51:39,440
centers offices

3540
02:51:39,440 --> 02:51:45,520
etc the reason I wanted to pull this up is so here is here

3541
02:51:45,520 --> 02:51:47,440
's the houses we're

3542
02:51:47,440 --> 02:51:51,479
talking about being affected okay well really these about

3543
02:51:51,479 --> 02:51:53,840
the property these

3544
02:51:53,840 --> 02:51:57,209
for you know it was okay for NRM you for these to be up

3545
02:51:57,209 --> 02:51:58,399
against it these are

3546
02:51:58,399 --> 02:52:01,170
houses in the neighborhood these people over here back up

3547
02:52:01,170 --> 02:52:02,600
to a huge box that is

3548
02:52:02,600 --> 02:52:04,739
the county government office that used to be a grocery

3549
02:52:04,739 --> 02:52:06,600
store these houses over

3550
02:52:06,600 --> 02:52:09,110
here back up to the parking lot for the courthouse which is

3551
02:52:09,110 --> 02:52:09,760
a heck of a lot

3552
02:52:09,760 --> 02:52:15,840
taller than a single family or a single-story office and so

3553
02:52:15,840 --> 02:52:17,040
while I love

3554
02:52:17,040 --> 02:52:21,920
Julie the bubble plan the 2030 plan is a bubble plan it

3555
02:52:21,920 --> 02:52:23,360
doesn't get down to exact

3556
02:52:23,360 --> 02:52:26,149
property lines and so you know to say that this property

3557
02:52:26,149 --> 02:52:27,280
isn't compatible with

3558
02:52:27,280 --> 02:52:32,079
the future land use I'm not so sure but but our planning

3559
02:52:32,079 --> 02:52:33,440
staff has said for

3560
02:52:33,440 --> 02:52:38,100
years that offices are the most compatible buffer use

3561
02:52:38,100 --> 02:52:39,319
between single

3562
02:52:39,319 --> 02:52:42,680
family residential and retail commercial uses and that's

3563
02:52:42,680 --> 02:52:44,000
what is being proposed

3564
02:52:44,000 --> 02:52:49,719
here so I find it odd that that office is okay for these

3565
02:52:49,719 --> 02:52:51,319
guys to back up to but

3566
02:52:51,319 --> 02:52:54,079
office isn't okay for these guys to back up to it doesn't

3567
02:52:54,079 --> 02:52:56,000
it doesn't jive for me

3568
02:52:56,000 --> 02:53:00,549
there are tracks all over our city like this one and larger

3569
02:53:00,549 --> 02:53:01,440
that are zoned in

3570
02:53:01,440 --> 02:53:04,350
our MU 12 with houses backed up to it we have Kroger

3571
02:53:04,350 --> 02:53:05,840
shopping centers that back

3572
02:53:05,840 --> 02:53:11,149
up to houses we have self storage that backs up to houses

3573
02:53:11,149 --> 02:53:12,520
what I have always

3574
02:53:12,520 --> 02:53:16,069
liked about putting office next to residential is that

3575
02:53:16,069 --> 02:53:17,360
office people come

3576
02:53:17,360 --> 02:53:20,719
to work when the residents left and went to work and the

3577
02:53:20,719 --> 02:53:22,600
office people leave and

3578
02:53:22,600 --> 02:53:25,840
go home when these people come home and so these offices

3579
02:53:25,840 --> 02:53:27,280
aren't being used when

3580
02:53:27,280 --> 02:53:30,379
the homeowners are home but what do office people do they

3581
02:53:30,379 --> 02:53:31,319
drive up they get

3582
02:53:31,319 --> 02:53:33,280
out they go in their office they work all day and they

3583
02:53:33,280 --> 02:53:34,079
leave it's not like a

3584
02:53:34,079 --> 02:53:37,440
donut shop or dry cleaners and these sort of things which

3585
02:53:37,440 --> 02:53:38,479
by the way we have

3586
02:53:38,479 --> 02:53:40,969
dry cleaners and donut shops that back right up to single-

3587
02:53:40,969 --> 02:53:41,920
family residential

3588
02:53:41,920 --> 02:53:44,709
that we've approved for years and so I think it's just a

3589
02:53:44,709 --> 02:53:45,159
bit of a

3590
02:53:45,159 --> 02:53:49,120
mischaracterization to say that the back of this property

3591
02:53:49,120 --> 02:53:50,959
shouldn't allow for

3592
02:53:50,959 --> 02:53:54,430
office so I would respectfully press request that you

3593
02:53:54,430 --> 02:53:55,319
approve this

3594
02:53:55,319 --> 02:53:57,940
application and recommend approval of the council a couple

3595
02:53:57,940 --> 02:53:58,799
questions for you

3596
02:53:58,799 --> 02:54:02,709
Commissioner back thank you chair thank you Greg for

3597
02:54:02,709 --> 02:54:05,239
enlightening me I mean that

3598
02:54:05,239 --> 02:54:08,950
see I have some insights there that I haven't picked up on

3599
02:54:08,950 --> 02:54:09,879
but nobody's

3600
02:54:09,879 --> 02:54:14,440
really disputing the benefit of commercial areas next to

3601
02:54:14,440 --> 02:54:15,079
neighborhoods

3602
02:54:15,079 --> 02:54:18,389
when you look at this configuration there the depth of this

3603
02:54:18,389 --> 02:54:19,440
thing going into

3604
02:54:19,440 --> 02:54:21,989
that neighborhood is what's a little disturbing and I can't

3605
02:54:21,989 --> 02:54:23,200
help but feel you

3606
02:54:23,200 --> 02:54:26,559
know again that the argument that it will pick away at this

3607
02:54:26,559 --> 02:54:27,600
neighborhood is

3608
02:54:27,600 --> 02:54:31,110
other property owners sell those houses that are affordable

3609
02:54:31,110 --> 02:54:32,159
now and we lose that

3610
02:54:32,159 --> 02:54:35,879
all these areas that are non-residential now probably at

3611
02:54:35,879 --> 02:54:37,040
one time I'm sure were

3612
02:54:37,040 --> 02:54:41,979
residential and just slowly diminished over time so it's

3613
02:54:41,979 --> 02:54:44,000
not that I or anybody

3614
02:54:44,000 --> 02:54:47,209
else is opposed to commercial around a neighborhood area

3615
02:54:47,209 --> 02:54:48,799
and up against it but

3616
02:54:48,799 --> 02:54:52,639
this configuration here is is beyond you know just simple

3617
02:54:52,639 --> 02:54:55,399
next to it's deep into

3618
02:54:55,399 --> 02:54:59,090
the neighborhood itself so sure and I would offer that

3619
02:54:59,090 --> 02:55:00,120
maybe you look at if

3620
02:55:00,120 --> 02:55:02,729
you know we're dr. co everybody knows dr. Cobos I think F

3621
02:55:02,729 --> 02:55:04,280
ulton Street very

3622
02:55:04,280 --> 02:55:09,549
similar project it's a office complex on Fulton Street back

3623
02:55:09,549 --> 02:55:10,360
off of the

3624
02:55:10,360 --> 02:55:14,760
University Drive you got a residential all around it right

3625
02:55:14,760 --> 02:55:15,680
it's a very garden

3626
02:55:15,680 --> 02:55:18,770
office setting single-story to try their christen been

3627
02:55:18,770 --> 02:55:20,319
there forever to try to

3628
02:55:20,319 --> 02:55:24,520
off-crescent no I think maybe I can't remember what that

3629
02:55:24,520 --> 02:55:25,360
other side street is

3630
02:55:25,360 --> 02:55:28,399
but but you know it's right there off of Fulton Street

3631
02:55:28,399 --> 02:55:29,319
neighborhood surrounding

3632
02:55:29,319 --> 02:55:32,540
it and so I agree with what you're saying which is this is

3633
02:55:32,540 --> 02:55:33,879
an odd-shaped lot

3634
02:55:33,879 --> 02:55:39,930
okay the but you could certainly go build you could build

3635
02:55:39,930 --> 02:55:40,559
there's all kinds

3636
02:55:40,559 --> 02:55:43,559
of things you could build an nr6 that some neighbors might

3637
02:55:43,559 --> 02:55:44,360
say that seems a

3638
02:55:44,360 --> 02:55:48,469
little too dense to me and so you know to me again I just

3639
02:55:48,469 --> 02:55:50,600
think about if I if I

3640
02:55:50,600 --> 02:55:53,959
look at these why are these lots any different than these

3641
02:55:53,959 --> 02:55:56,000
lots and and and

3642
02:55:56,000 --> 02:55:59,930
and the other benefit that I see is well the city hasn't

3643
02:55:59,930 --> 02:56:01,440
chosen to go improve

3644
02:56:01,440 --> 02:56:05,690
Janey Street which is deplorable this project it would

3645
02:56:05,690 --> 02:56:07,440
force them to go build

3646
02:56:07,440 --> 02:56:10,540
a new street to new city specs which is going to provide

3647
02:56:10,540 --> 02:56:11,799
those residents a much

3648
02:56:11,799 --> 02:56:15,639
better access into their neighborhood

3649
02:56:17,120 --> 02:56:20,399
Commissioner else thank you Jim thank you mr. Johnson for

3650
02:56:20,399 --> 02:56:22,120
speaking don't you

3651
02:56:22,120 --> 02:56:24,770
think the house is on Janey Street will be negatively

3652
02:56:24,770 --> 02:56:26,280
affected they are directly

3653
02:56:26,280 --> 02:56:30,270
across the street staring at this plot of land you didn't

3654
02:56:30,270 --> 02:56:31,799
mention those when you

3655
02:56:31,799 --> 02:56:34,610
were pointing out around there yeah so so well you know

3656
02:56:34,610 --> 02:56:36,319
typically those who

3657
02:56:36,319 --> 02:56:39,379
back up is who you know folks are most concerned about you

3658
02:56:39,379 --> 02:56:40,399
know these over here

3659
02:56:40,399 --> 02:56:44,360
across the street again you've got you've got single-family

3660
02:56:44,360 --> 02:56:44,959
residential

3661
02:56:44,959 --> 02:56:48,610
across the street from office all over this this town and

3662
02:56:48,610 --> 02:56:49,840
so it's typically

3663
02:56:49,840 --> 02:56:53,479
when you have a street separating the front of a house you

3664
02:56:53,479 --> 02:56:54,680
've got your your

3665
02:56:54,680 --> 02:56:57,309
site your front yard setback and you got a setback on the

3666
02:56:57,309 --> 02:56:58,639
other side a screen

3667
02:56:58,639 --> 02:57:02,780
wall this is not uncommon to see about the city no I just

3668
02:57:02,780 --> 02:57:03,639
think I mean I think

3669
02:57:03,639 --> 02:57:06,389
the biggest issue here is the configuration of this land we

3670
02:57:06,389 --> 02:57:06,680
keep

3671
02:57:06,680 --> 02:57:09,930
talking about how we have commercial abutting neighborhoods

3672
02:57:09,930 --> 02:57:10,799
yeah all over the

3673
02:57:10,799 --> 02:57:15,120
place they're usually a horizontal plot of land and not

3674
02:57:15,120 --> 02:57:16,680
this vertical vertical

3675
02:57:16,680 --> 02:57:20,370
piece that cuts right into the subdivision and so in

3676
02:57:20,370 --> 02:57:21,639
driving this you

3677
02:57:21,639 --> 02:57:24,590
know when you go down Janney Street and you get to this

3678
02:57:24,590 --> 02:57:26,040
part of the lot I mean

3679
02:57:26,040 --> 02:57:29,670
all that's staring at you all around you are residential

3680
02:57:29,670 --> 02:57:31,959
homes so it's that's

3681
02:57:31,959 --> 02:57:35,809
that's the big difficulty and I'm sure that's where staff

3682
02:57:35,809 --> 02:57:37,000
was was as well in

3683
02:57:37,000 --> 02:57:42,030
denying this is is you're cutting deep into a subdivision

3684
02:57:42,030 --> 02:57:43,600
not not across the

3685
02:57:43,600 --> 02:57:46,379
subdivision where you're just cutting this straight line on

3686
02:57:46,379 --> 02:57:46,959
a handful of

3687
02:57:46,959 --> 02:57:50,370
houses but you're literally going into the neighborhood

3688
02:57:50,370 --> 02:57:51,200
yeah and actually I

3689
02:57:51,200 --> 02:57:54,319
would agree with you if you were talking about a two-story

3690
02:57:54,319 --> 02:57:55,719
anything apartments

3691
02:57:55,719 --> 02:57:58,120
you can build two-story duplexes right here you can go 40

3692
02:57:58,120 --> 02:58:00,559
feet by right and so

3693
02:58:00,559 --> 02:58:03,860
when I think about the use I think all these restrictions

3694
02:58:03,860 --> 02:58:05,200
the applicant has put

3695
02:58:05,200 --> 02:58:08,440
imposed upon themselves it's a very residential looking

3696
02:58:08,440 --> 02:58:10,239
product and so when

3697
02:58:10,239 --> 02:58:13,159
I think about what's the resident going to be looking at

3698
02:58:13,159 --> 02:58:13,940
well they could be

3699
02:58:13,940 --> 02:58:16,520
looking at a two-story something across the street and we

3700
02:58:16,520 --> 02:58:17,200
have a lot of

3701
02:58:17,200 --> 02:58:19,450
neighborhoods that have apartments that cut up into the

3702
02:58:19,450 --> 02:58:20,399
neighborhood that are

3703
02:58:20,399 --> 02:58:23,899
two stories and we wouldn't do that today we'd make them

3704
02:58:23,899 --> 02:58:24,600
have a setback

3705
02:58:24,600 --> 02:58:26,750
where they couldn't look down into somebody's house but

3706
02:58:26,750 --> 02:58:27,639
they're there and

3707
02:58:27,639 --> 02:58:32,579
and so again with him agreeing to single story with the 40%

3708
02:58:32,579 --> 02:58:34,319
landscaping I think

3709
02:58:34,319 --> 02:58:37,489
it's a great use because the reality is that 3.2 acres will

3710
02:58:37,489 --> 02:58:38,600
never develop for

3711
02:58:38,600 --> 02:58:44,399
single-family the math doesn't work thanks for asking I had

3712
02:58:44,399 --> 02:58:45,520
a question for

3713
02:58:45,520 --> 02:58:50,829
you I agree with what you're saying I also remember when

3714
02:58:50,829 --> 02:58:51,520
this track came

3715
02:58:51,520 --> 02:58:56,129
before us a number of years ago and it hasn't developed and

3716
02:58:56,129 --> 02:58:57,360
so to your point

3717
02:58:57,360 --> 02:59:01,000
the plan doesn't work it it was going to work it would have

3718
02:59:01,000 --> 02:59:01,799
already worked I

3719
02:59:01,799 --> 02:59:05,629
think one of the other issues that I would bring up or just

3720
02:59:05,629 --> 02:59:06,920
an observation is

3721
02:59:06,920 --> 02:59:09,750
I can't remember exactly when the courthouse was built

3722
02:59:09,750 --> 02:59:13,000
there it's been I

3723
02:59:13,000 --> 02:59:17,459
was gonna say I was gonna guess 20 years so it's been there

3724
02:59:17,459 --> 02:59:19,680
20 years and that

3725
02:59:19,680 --> 02:59:22,989
piece of property has been vacant for 20 years and we're

3726
02:59:22,989 --> 02:59:24,399
talking about chipping

3727
02:59:24,399 --> 02:59:28,649
away at the neighborhood if there was such a huge demand

3728
02:59:28,649 --> 02:59:30,000
and that this was

3729
02:59:30,000 --> 02:59:32,190
going to be developed overnight and then the neighborhoods

3730
02:59:32,190 --> 02:59:33,100
going to be raised it

3731
02:59:33,100 --> 02:59:35,469
would have happened a long time ago we're talking about a

3732
02:59:35,469 --> 02:59:36,399
parcel that's been

3733
02:59:36,399 --> 02:59:39,489
vacant never been developed it's been right across the cour

3734
02:59:39,489 --> 02:59:40,280
thouse for 20

3735
02:59:40,280 --> 02:59:45,110
years my guess is it'll be quite some time before this is

3736
02:59:45,110 --> 02:59:46,159
built out before

3737
02:59:46,159 --> 02:59:48,500
there's ever going to be demand to try to go and take any

3738
02:59:48,500 --> 02:59:49,559
of these other homes

3739
02:59:49,559 --> 02:59:53,659
and so the reality is there's a vacant piece of property it

3740
02:59:53,659 --> 02:59:55,120
's been zoned before

3741
02:59:55,120 --> 03:00:00,340
it didn't work and we have an opportunity tonight to take a

3742
03:00:00,340 --> 03:00:00,680
look at

3743
03:00:00,680 --> 03:00:05,000
someone else this idea and vision for this tract to see it

3744
03:00:05,000 --> 03:00:06,319
actually move in to

3745
03:00:06,319 --> 03:00:09,989
be developed and become productive versus I believe it's

3746
03:00:09,989 --> 03:00:11,120
had cows on it for

3747
03:00:11,120 --> 03:00:15,690
many years may not anymore but I know it has so I'm looking

3748
03:00:15,690 --> 03:00:16,799
forward to getting to

3749
03:00:16,799 --> 03:00:19,639
vote on that this evening and if you have any comments I'd

3750
03:00:19,639 --> 03:00:20,559
welcome those yeah

3751
03:00:20,559 --> 03:00:23,590
I just want to Mr. Dodson's horn for a second because he

3752
03:00:23,590 --> 03:00:24,559
has set with us we

3753
03:00:24,559 --> 03:00:28,229
represent mr. Hartman he owns the land mr. Jean is a icon

3754
03:00:28,229 --> 03:00:29,159
in our community

3755
03:00:29,159 --> 03:00:32,059
even cutting hair at the campus barbershop for I won't say

3756
03:00:32,059 --> 03:00:32,959
how long mr.

3757
03:00:32,959 --> 03:00:36,430
Jean but he came to us with this property and said what do

3758
03:00:36,430 --> 03:00:37,159
I do this guy

3759
03:00:37,159 --> 03:00:40,780
gave me a story he was going to buy it he was going to do

3760
03:00:40,780 --> 03:00:41,799
this thing it never

3761
03:00:41,799 --> 03:00:46,600
worked it never happened what do I do and and we sold the

3762
03:00:46,600 --> 03:00:47,879
we represented the

3763
03:00:47,879 --> 03:00:50,219
seller selling the law building to the county and as you

3764
03:00:50,219 --> 03:00:51,159
guys probably know the

3765
03:00:51,159 --> 03:00:53,569
county is buying everything on that side and when the

3766
03:00:53,569 --> 03:00:54,799
county comes says I'd like

3767
03:00:54,799 --> 03:00:57,690
to buy your property you can't sell it because they can get

3768
03:00:57,690 --> 03:01:00,319
it later anyway but

3769
03:01:00,319 --> 03:01:03,340
but mr. Dodson came to us and he said you know I want to do

3770
03:01:03,340 --> 03:01:04,840
something first

3771
03:01:04,840 --> 03:01:07,979
class and I want to create an office space and if you've

3772
03:01:07,979 --> 03:01:08,959
ever been on jury

3773
03:01:08,959 --> 03:01:11,020
duty and you want something to eat you got to go to Luke 28

3774
03:01:11,020 --> 03:01:11,719
8 you got to come

3775
03:01:11,719 --> 03:01:14,280
all the way downtown you have an hour and so he said I want

3776
03:01:14,280 --> 03:01:14,879
to provide

3777
03:01:14,879 --> 03:01:16,659
something for jurors where they can walk across the street

3778
03:01:16,659 --> 03:01:17,440
and grab something to eat

3779
03:01:17,440 --> 03:01:20,000
there was some comments earlier about bail bonds or

3780
03:01:20,000 --> 03:01:21,840
restaurants or whatever I

3781
03:01:21,840 --> 03:01:24,989
can tell you that no retail business of any sort will go

3782
03:01:24,989 --> 03:01:26,200
anywhere but fronting

3783
03:01:26,200 --> 03:01:29,559
McKinney because they can't make it if they if they don't

3784
03:01:29,559 --> 03:01:30,120
have frontage on

3785
03:01:30,120 --> 03:01:35,079
McKinney so what he has laid out is truly first class he

3786
03:01:35,079 --> 03:01:36,079
didn't lay out

3787
03:01:36,079 --> 03:01:38,340
something that would make him the most money it's he's

3788
03:01:38,340 --> 03:01:39,440
gonna have his own office

3789
03:01:39,440 --> 03:01:43,190
there and he wants to have others like him come in office

3790
03:01:43,190 --> 03:01:44,559
there and you know I

3791
03:01:44,559 --> 03:01:46,809
think this this is one of those where I think sometimes we

3792
03:01:46,809 --> 03:01:47,799
can get really caught

3793
03:01:47,799 --> 03:01:52,659
up and worrying about things that aren't real worries and

3794
03:01:52,659 --> 03:01:54,639
well I think it's

3795
03:01:54,639 --> 03:01:58,229
important to vet it and you guys have we're talking about a

3796
03:01:58,229 --> 03:01:59,280
class a project

3797
03:01:59,280 --> 03:02:03,639
that will do nothing but make I think the neighbors happy

3798
03:02:03,639 --> 03:02:04,399
they'll have a new

3799
03:02:04,399 --> 03:02:07,760
street and you'll have single family or single story

3800
03:02:07,760 --> 03:02:09,120
offices that aren't

3801
03:02:09,120 --> 03:02:12,979
intrusive in any way to a neighborhood and and you'll have

3802
03:02:12,979 --> 03:02:14,479
people that are when

3803
03:02:14,479 --> 03:02:17,840
they're home nobody's there and when the people are in

3804
03:02:17,840 --> 03:02:18,920
these offices nobody's

3805
03:02:18,920 --> 03:02:23,530
home and so I think when you look at this property again I

3806
03:02:23,530 --> 03:02:24,879
can't think of a

3807
03:02:24,879 --> 03:02:27,229
better project that could ever be presented because the

3808
03:02:27,229 --> 03:02:28,000
only other thing

3809
03:02:28,000 --> 03:02:30,950
that's going to work here is apartments you can't develop

3810
03:02:30,950 --> 03:02:31,879
it for single-family

3811
03:02:31,879 --> 03:02:36,389
residential and make the math work agree thank you thank

3812
03:02:36,389 --> 03:02:37,399
you guys for listening

3813
03:02:37,399 --> 03:02:40,959
thank you for your comments and your time I have another

3814
03:02:40,959 --> 03:02:42,000
card and again this

3815
03:02:42,000 --> 03:02:45,159
is a public hearing Greg price I have no other cards

3816
03:02:45,159 --> 03:02:46,440
wishing to speak on this

3817
03:02:46,440 --> 03:02:51,520
item this time thank you I'm Greg price I live at 2216

3818
03:02:51,520 --> 03:02:52,479
Great Bear Lane here in

3819
03:02:52,479 --> 03:02:55,719
Denton and one of the things that I want to say in support

3820
03:02:55,719 --> 03:02:57,399
of the project is the

3821
03:02:57,399 --> 03:03:00,229
number I'm also a commercial real estate agent and I have

3822
03:03:00,229 --> 03:03:01,799
met with probably a

3823
03:03:01,799 --> 03:03:05,559
dozen attorneys looking for office and didn't Texas and

3824
03:03:05,559 --> 03:03:06,440
there's two

3825
03:03:06,440 --> 03:03:08,879
requirements that they want I want to be close to the cour

3826
03:03:08,879 --> 03:03:09,760
thouse and close to

3827
03:03:09,760 --> 03:03:14,350
downtown and what's available is shrinking the law building

3828
03:03:14,350 --> 03:03:15,000
sold and

3829
03:03:15,000 --> 03:03:17,110
every one of those attorneys are going to have to go find

3830
03:03:17,110 --> 03:03:17,959
new offices because

3831
03:03:17,959 --> 03:03:21,270
the county district attorney's office is moving into those

3832
03:03:21,270 --> 03:03:22,319
and they want to be

3833
03:03:22,319 --> 03:03:25,790
close to the courthouse and this property being directly

3834
03:03:25,790 --> 03:03:26,680
across serves

3835
03:03:26,680 --> 03:03:31,370
that currently this property is ag exempt there are cows on

3836
03:03:31,370 --> 03:03:32,120
the property and

3837
03:03:32,120 --> 03:03:35,270
it's not producing tax dollars with what mr. Dotson is

3838
03:03:35,270 --> 03:03:36,559
producing is only going to

3839
03:03:36,559 --> 03:03:40,219
help the city of Denton I go to an office every day every

3840
03:03:40,219 --> 03:03:41,319
day I go in there

3841
03:03:41,319 --> 03:03:44,940
and I go sit down at my desk and everybody's looking at

3842
03:03:44,940 --> 03:03:46,120
email and it's a

3843
03:03:46,120 --> 03:03:50,370
very quiet use it's not disruptive I've not seen an office

3844
03:03:50,370 --> 03:03:50,860
that's really

3845
03:03:50,860 --> 03:03:53,879
disruptive to a neighborhood matter of fact just like mr.

3846
03:03:53,879 --> 03:03:55,479
Johnson said that when

3847
03:03:55,479 --> 03:03:59,620
you go in most of the folks have gone for the day you go

3848
03:03:59,620 --> 03:04:00,719
into your office and

3849
03:04:00,719 --> 03:04:04,770
you go home if you keep the current zoning and it gets

3850
03:04:04,770 --> 03:04:05,399
developed you

3851
03:04:05,399 --> 03:04:09,260
increase the density of the neighborhood I don't think that

3852
03:04:09,260 --> 03:04:10,299
helps the

3853
03:04:10,299 --> 03:04:15,190
neighborhood office is a quieter use it has a less dense

3854
03:04:15,190 --> 03:04:17,079
use and the timing of

3855
03:04:17,079 --> 03:04:22,120
folks using the property only makes sense plus the text the

3856
03:04:22,120 --> 03:04:23,000
tax incentive

3857
03:04:23,000 --> 03:04:27,420
that'll benefit the city also increases so just want to say

3858
03:04:27,420 --> 03:04:28,680
that I'm in favor of

3859
03:04:28,680 --> 03:04:32,959
the use and I commend mr. Dotson for his his project and

3860
03:04:32,959 --> 03:04:34,079
his plan and that I do

3861
03:04:34,079 --> 03:04:37,440
know that I represent mr. Hartman as well as far as selling

3862
03:04:37,440 --> 03:04:38,440
the property and

3863
03:04:38,440 --> 03:04:40,450
I know where his heart is on what he'd like to see take

3864
03:04:40,450 --> 03:04:41,360
place and he wants to

3865
03:04:41,360 --> 03:04:46,430
serve the community for the good I have no questions thank

3866
03:04:46,430 --> 03:04:48,280
you again this is a

3867
03:04:48,280 --> 03:04:50,479
public hearing anyone who would like to speak on this item

3868
03:04:50,479 --> 03:04:51,319
please come forward

3869
03:04:51,319 --> 03:04:56,079
this time seeing none will close the public hearing and

3870
03:04:56,079 --> 03:04:56,920
open the floor for

3871
03:04:56,920 --> 03:05:04,600
discussion or emotion commissioner Roselle thank you chair

3872
03:05:04,600 --> 03:05:06,159
as I'm gonna

3873
03:05:06,159 --> 03:05:09,700
motion to approve this before I do I just I was just

3874
03:05:09,700 --> 03:05:10,840
thinking through

3875
03:05:10,840 --> 03:05:13,950
everything that's been stated tonight on both both sides

3876
03:05:13,950 --> 03:05:14,840
and I certainly

3877
03:05:14,840 --> 03:05:17,719
appreciate the work city does and I can courage Julia is

3878
03:05:17,719 --> 03:05:18,639
awesome she's a work

3879
03:05:18,639 --> 03:05:22,649
course and I appreciate the perspective they're bringing

3880
03:05:22,649 --> 03:05:24,040
but I also hear a lot

3881
03:05:24,040 --> 03:05:27,700
of positive things from the applicant in terms of trying to

3882
03:05:27,700 --> 03:05:28,639
respond to the

3883
03:05:28,639 --> 03:05:31,469
community both in what they've stated as concerns but also

3884
03:05:31,469 --> 03:05:32,120
needs of the

3885
03:05:32,120 --> 03:05:36,219
community and as we looked at the the aerial there is I

3886
03:05:36,219 --> 03:05:37,879
think Councilman

3887
03:05:37,879 --> 03:05:41,360
Johnson pointed this out there is development everywhere

3888
03:05:41,360 --> 03:05:42,840
except that plot

3889
03:05:42,840 --> 03:05:47,399
which is odd because if you go out further there's even

3890
03:05:47,399 --> 03:05:48,319
more development

3891
03:05:48,319 --> 03:05:52,079
which leads me to the conclusion that the current zoning or

3892
03:05:52,079 --> 03:05:53,239
uses is simply not

3893
03:05:53,239 --> 03:05:56,129
marketable that or something would have been done there so

3894
03:05:56,129 --> 03:05:57,280
what what the current

3895
03:05:57,280 --> 03:06:02,049
situation seems in my opinion a little broke if there's not

3896
03:06:02,049 --> 03:06:02,719
instead of

3897
03:06:02,719 --> 03:06:06,909
developed so and I don't think this is too far-fetched from

3898
03:06:06,909 --> 03:06:07,680
what this

3899
03:06:07,680 --> 03:06:10,530
commission I know what I have approved sitting here I can

3900
03:06:10,530 --> 03:06:11,520
think back to this

3901
03:06:11,520 --> 03:06:14,930
commission me included voted to approve a rezoning on

3902
03:06:14,930 --> 03:06:16,360
University where an Aldi

3903
03:06:16,360 --> 03:06:21,239
now sits that backs up to neighborhood we also recently

3904
03:06:21,239 --> 03:06:23,479
approved a rezoning for

3905
03:06:23,479 --> 03:06:26,479
self storage to go to university and they'll back up to

3906
03:06:26,479 --> 03:06:27,559
neighborhoods on

3907
03:06:27,559 --> 03:06:30,290
University I understand it's not a peninsula type situation

3908
03:06:30,290 --> 03:06:30,920
with the self

3909
03:06:30,920 --> 03:06:33,959
storage but the Aldi's are certainly right in the middle of

3910
03:06:33,959 --> 03:06:35,239
a neighborhood and

3911
03:06:35,239 --> 03:06:40,620
yet this commission deemed those two things appropriate and

3912
03:06:40,620 --> 03:06:43,360
so with that the

3913
03:06:43,360 --> 03:06:48,200
applicant has reached out to the community and not only has

3914
03:06:48,200 --> 03:06:49,680
been willing

3915
03:06:49,680 --> 03:06:54,020
to abide by restricted uses on the property they actually

3916
03:06:54,020 --> 03:06:55,159
created restricted

3917
03:06:55,159 --> 03:06:59,360
uses on the property in response to the communities

3918
03:06:59,360 --> 03:07:01,600
concerns so all that to say

3919
03:07:01,600 --> 03:07:04,149
I'm in favor of this project I think it'd be good for the

3920
03:07:04,149 --> 03:07:04,920
city to have this

3921
03:07:04,920 --> 03:07:07,799
developed and I think overall the concerns that have been

3922
03:07:07,799 --> 03:07:08,520
stated by the

3923
03:07:08,520 --> 03:07:12,629
community have been addressed by the restrictive uses in my

3924
03:07:12,629 --> 03:07:14,280
experience Lee

3925
03:07:14,280 --> 03:07:18,780
Allison his group do quality work and so I see no reason

3926
03:07:18,780 --> 03:07:20,280
that this also too

3927
03:07:20,280 --> 03:07:23,399
wouldn't be a high quality establishment that's generating

3928
03:07:23,399 --> 03:07:24,159
income for the city

3929
03:07:24,159 --> 03:07:27,729
and also productive for the community around it so for that

3930
03:07:27,729 --> 03:07:28,440
I motion to

3931
03:07:28,440 --> 03:07:33,030
approve this Commissioner Smith Commissioner Osella pretty

3932
03:07:33,030 --> 03:07:33,479
much got all

3933
03:07:33,479 --> 03:07:36,709
the hot of the hot air out of the room for us on that one

3934
03:07:36,709 --> 03:07:38,120
the thing I'll just

3935
03:07:38,120 --> 03:07:41,329
say to this is that if I was a developer and I was looking

3936
03:07:41,329 --> 03:07:42,639
to build a residential

3937
03:07:42,639 --> 03:07:46,229
development on a piece of land that would be a perfect one

3938
03:07:46,229 --> 03:07:46,840
for the for the

3939
03:07:46,840 --> 03:07:50,020
proximity that would be to downtown as well as just where

3940
03:07:50,020 --> 03:07:51,159
it sits within the

3941
03:07:51,159 --> 03:07:54,760
city of Denton that would be a prime location for a multif

3942
03:07:54,760 --> 03:07:56,600
amily usage if of

3943
03:07:56,600 --> 03:07:58,590
course we've talked about single-family not being

3944
03:07:58,590 --> 03:08:00,879
mathematically feasible so why

3945
03:08:00,879 --> 03:08:04,149
is it sat vacant for 20 years so I will say that I'll

3946
03:08:04,149 --> 03:08:05,680
second this motion

3947
03:08:05,680 --> 03:08:09,100
especially since that this is the next best option to

3948
03:08:09,100 --> 03:08:10,639
create this plot of land

3949
03:08:10,639 --> 03:08:15,299
and so they actually used by our citizens okay we have a

3950
03:08:15,299 --> 03:08:16,200
first and a

3951
03:08:16,200 --> 03:08:20,549
second Commissioner Beck thank you chair well before we

3952
03:08:20,549 --> 03:08:20,959
vote on it yeah I'd like

3953
03:08:20,959 --> 03:08:24,100
to comment and this is a tough vote it really is I don't

3954
03:08:24,100 --> 03:08:25,399
disagree at all that

3955
03:08:25,399 --> 03:08:29,159
the developers come in and has a good project is bending

3956
03:08:29,159 --> 03:08:30,239
over backwards to

3957
03:08:30,239 --> 03:08:32,989
accommodate the neighborhood and my heart goes out to mr.

3958
03:08:32,989 --> 03:08:33,920
Hartman for having

3959
03:08:33,920 --> 03:08:37,600
property that sit there for that long and having a tough

3960
03:08:37,600 --> 03:08:39,479
time finding a good

3961
03:08:39,479 --> 03:08:43,280
use for this that wouldn't negatively impact the

3962
03:08:43,280 --> 03:08:44,299
neighborhood and I'm not

3963
03:08:44,299 --> 03:08:51,069
sure that this project will but I lean on the side of going

3964
03:08:51,069 --> 03:08:52,280
into a neighborhood

3965
03:08:52,280 --> 03:08:57,180
in this manner with the depth that goes into it it encro

3966
03:08:57,180 --> 03:08:58,819
aches deeper than

3967
03:08:58,819 --> 03:09:02,819
anything I've seen the need for affordable housing is going

3968
03:09:02,819 --> 03:09:03,959
to be diminished

3969
03:09:03,959 --> 03:09:08,360
I still believe as it nibbles away and other people in that

3970
03:09:08,360 --> 03:09:09,440
area sell off that

3971
03:09:09,440 --> 03:09:13,860
property I think a code change of this sort sets a

3972
03:09:13,860 --> 03:09:16,280
precedent for other

3973
03:09:16,280 --> 03:09:19,420
commercial properties to come in and encroach on

3974
03:09:19,420 --> 03:09:21,159
residential low-density

3975
03:09:21,159 --> 03:09:23,940
neighborhoods like this and not only in that area but in

3976
03:09:23,940 --> 03:09:25,079
other areas of the city

3977
03:09:25,079 --> 03:09:29,639
and I worry about that and the opposition to to me still

3978
03:09:29,639 --> 03:09:30,920
doesn't seem

3979
03:09:30,920 --> 03:09:34,559
like it favors this I bet that's probably the biggest

3980
03:09:34,559 --> 03:09:35,680
sticker for me I

3981
03:09:35,680 --> 03:09:38,659
wish I had a better feel how the residents of this

3982
03:09:38,659 --> 03:09:40,120
neighborhood really

3983
03:09:40,120 --> 03:09:42,489
felt I'm not sure we've got that that's why I kind of

3984
03:09:42,489 --> 03:09:43,799
encourage you know going

3985
03:09:43,799 --> 03:09:47,750
back out one more time and getting people more involved in

3986
03:09:47,750 --> 03:09:48,879
this and then if

3987
03:09:48,879 --> 03:09:52,170
we had that kind of positive feedback I would have less of

3988
03:09:52,170 --> 03:09:54,200
concern for this

3989
03:09:54,200 --> 03:09:59,379
property shares the front part of it with an NRMU 12 where

3990
03:09:59,379 --> 03:10:00,600
you can get some

3991
03:10:00,600 --> 03:10:05,280
benefit out of it office space and serve that purpose

3992
03:10:05,280 --> 03:10:07,159
without going too deep into

3993
03:10:07,159 --> 03:10:13,559
the area but again the one thing that this will impact that

3994
03:10:13,559 --> 03:10:14,520
residential

3995
03:10:14,520 --> 03:10:17,739
housing doesn't or anything that looks like it is the infl

3996
03:10:17,739 --> 03:10:19,159
ux of traffic comes

3997
03:10:19,159 --> 03:10:21,209
in these are gonna be people that don't live there it's

3998
03:10:21,209 --> 03:10:21,920
gonna be different

3999
03:10:21,920 --> 03:10:25,280
people every day and I'm not sure it's gonna be all that

4000
03:10:25,280 --> 03:10:27,239
bad so I would be more

4001
03:10:27,239 --> 03:10:30,659
in favor of it if I felt like the neighborhood residents

4002
03:10:30,659 --> 03:10:31,520
were more for

4003
03:10:31,520 --> 03:10:36,909
this and we had a TIA that demonstrated the traffic wasn't

4004
03:10:36,909 --> 03:10:37,719
gonna be the issue it

4005
03:10:37,719 --> 03:10:41,559
is so I'm gonna I'm gonna vote against this before I

4006
03:10:41,559 --> 03:10:43,280
recognize the next speaker

4007
03:10:43,280 --> 03:10:46,440
I want a clarification from Commissioner Roselle and your

4008
03:10:46,440 --> 03:10:47,479
motion for approval

4009
03:10:47,479 --> 03:10:50,649
did you include or mean to include all of the restrictions

4010
03:10:50,649 --> 03:10:51,760
that the applicant

4011
03:10:51,760 --> 03:10:54,399
had presented for us yes it would include the overlay

4012
03:10:54,399 --> 03:10:55,440
presented to us all

4013
03:10:55,440 --> 03:10:58,399
of the all the restrictions here on the overlay provided in

4014
03:10:58,399 --> 03:10:59,559
the backup or part

4015
03:10:59,559 --> 03:11:03,299
of your motion yes don't need to restate my motion I don't

4016
03:11:03,299 --> 03:11:04,360
think so we just want

4017
03:11:04,360 --> 03:11:06,850
a clarification for staff and for the record that it did

4018
03:11:06,850 --> 03:11:07,840
include all of these

4019
03:11:07,840 --> 03:11:11,979
conditions yes so thank you for that and Commissioner Smith

4020
03:11:11,979 --> 03:11:12,920
us and you are

4021
03:11:12,920 --> 03:11:16,280
friendly to that clarification on your second okay

4022
03:11:16,280 --> 03:11:18,479
Commissioner Ellis thank you

4023
03:11:18,479 --> 03:11:22,959
so I'm just having a difficult time approving this I do

4024
03:11:22,959 --> 03:11:25,079
appreciate Allison

4025
03:11:25,079 --> 03:11:27,969
engineering groups great presentation and all the speakers

4026
03:11:27,969 --> 03:11:29,040
I just can't

4027
03:11:29,040 --> 03:11:33,319
discount the opposition that that I've read I can't

4028
03:11:33,319 --> 03:11:34,360
discount the fact that it

4029
03:11:34,360 --> 03:11:38,459
doesn't comply with a future land use I can't discount

4030
03:11:38,459 --> 03:11:40,399
staff's expertise on this

4031
03:11:40,399 --> 03:11:44,760
I love the earlier thought of a hybrid development on this

4032
03:11:44,760 --> 03:11:46,000
where we cannot

4033
03:11:46,000 --> 03:11:48,649
include those back three acres that encroaches so deeply

4034
03:11:48,649 --> 03:11:49,079
into the

4035
03:11:49,079 --> 03:11:51,440
neighborhood I would love to see this piece of land

4036
03:11:51,440 --> 03:11:52,680
developed it needs to be

4037
03:11:52,680 --> 03:11:56,450
developed I am very concerned about being developed as deep

4038
03:11:56,450 --> 03:11:57,280
into a single

4039
03:11:57,280 --> 03:12:00,639
family neighborhood we cannot regulate who is going to

4040
03:12:00,639 --> 03:12:01,840
office there we can

4041
03:12:01,840 --> 03:12:05,329
conceptualize it but we don't know what's going to be in

4042
03:12:05,329 --> 03:12:06,559
those offices and

4043
03:12:06,559 --> 03:12:14,399
where so with that I just don't think we've we've dealt

4044
03:12:14,399 --> 03:12:14,719
with the

4045
03:12:14,719 --> 03:12:17,479
incompatibility issue on that back piece of the land so I'm

4046
03:12:17,479 --> 03:12:17,959
just not

4047
03:12:17,959 --> 03:12:22,319
comfortable voting yes Commissioner Sullivan thank you

4048
03:12:22,319 --> 03:12:23,840
chair I'm having an

4049
03:12:23,840 --> 03:12:27,649
issue still understanding why you're gonna put more

4050
03:12:27,649 --> 03:12:29,440
restrictions in the nr6

4051
03:12:29,440 --> 03:12:35,520
has to begin with I just I can't get beyond that part of it

4052
03:12:35,520 --> 03:12:37,200
and when I think

4053
03:12:37,200 --> 03:12:39,850
of neighborhood restaurants and people walking to the

4054
03:12:39,850 --> 03:12:41,040
restaurants I think of

4055
03:12:41,040 --> 03:12:45,680
Locus Street now where we have a lot of neighborhood

4056
03:12:45,680 --> 03:12:47,520
restaurants and I don't see

4057
03:12:47,520 --> 03:12:50,760
anybody walking there because there's no place to park ever

4058
03:12:50,760 --> 03:12:52,959
and so I don't know

4059
03:12:52,959 --> 03:12:57,559
if that's if that's what is meant to be in a neighborhood

4060
03:12:57,559 --> 03:12:59,079
and so what I see is

4061
03:12:59,079 --> 03:13:03,260
commercial creep that soon we'll be hearing people across

4062
03:13:03,260 --> 03:13:04,319
the street saying

4063
03:13:04,319 --> 03:13:07,500
hey I want to sell my house and turn it into a an Italian

4064
03:13:07,500 --> 03:13:08,840
restaurant or something

4065
03:13:08,840 --> 03:13:12,360
I mean I just that's all I can see going in here and

4066
03:13:12,360 --> 03:13:14,440
especially because of the

4067
03:13:14,440 --> 03:13:18,540
restrictions that you all have agreed to that are more

4068
03:13:18,540 --> 03:13:20,120
restrictive than the

4069
03:13:20,120 --> 03:13:23,879
our six that it's zoned as now I just something is doesn't

4070
03:13:23,879 --> 03:13:25,079
ring right to me so

4071
03:13:25,079 --> 03:13:29,600
that's I can't support what y'all are requesting I mean

4072
03:13:29,600 --> 03:13:30,760
under different

4073
03:13:30,760 --> 03:13:33,319
circumstances it might be a great idea but I just can't do

4074
03:13:33,319 --> 03:13:34,239
it the way it's been

4075
03:13:34,239 --> 03:13:41,040
presented today okay Commissioner Sanchez I think you've

4076
03:13:41,040 --> 03:13:41,479
done a great

4077
03:13:41,479 --> 03:13:47,559
presentation on on why we should allow it and at first I

4078
03:13:47,559 --> 03:13:49,840
was against it but I

4079
03:13:49,840 --> 03:13:52,459
think the more I thought about it and the more I listened

4080
03:13:52,459 --> 03:13:53,879
to you all I I

4081
03:13:53,879 --> 03:13:57,370
changed my mind and the reason is I personally have an

4082
03:13:57,370 --> 03:13:58,920
interest in that area

4083
03:13:58,920 --> 03:14:02,920
and and like everybody else I've seen years and years where

4084
03:14:02,920 --> 03:14:04,079
that lot has just

4085
03:14:04,079 --> 03:14:09,670
sat there and and I don't think and across the street on on

4086
03:14:09,670 --> 03:14:10,920
on Janey if you

4087
03:14:10,920 --> 03:14:14,739
look at that was on the west side of Janey Street many of

4088
03:14:14,739 --> 03:14:16,639
those houses are in

4089
03:14:16,639 --> 03:14:20,239
really poor condition and I would think that one day

4090
03:14:20,239 --> 03:14:22,239
somebody might buy those and

4091
03:14:22,239 --> 03:14:25,790
maybe make make an offer make offices out of them but McKin

4092
03:14:25,790 --> 03:14:26,920
ney Street is a very

4093
03:14:26,920 --> 03:14:30,420
important because that area because it's close to the to

4094
03:14:30,420 --> 03:14:31,959
the courthouse I think

4095
03:14:31,959 --> 03:14:36,620
it's very important to like you mentioned is put offices in

4096
03:14:36,620 --> 03:14:37,440
that area

4097
03:14:37,440 --> 03:14:41,709
it's a big neighborhood so that's just those houses were

4098
03:14:41,709 --> 03:14:44,799
built years ago the

4099
03:14:44,799 --> 03:14:47,920
area has changed has changed drastically and I think we

4100
03:14:47,920 --> 03:14:49,079
have to meet those

4101
03:14:49,079 --> 03:14:51,280
changes and it's not going to hurt that neighborhood

4102
03:14:51,280 --> 03:14:52,239
because that neighborhood

4103
03:14:52,239 --> 03:14:57,219
overall is pretty good size I believe and so I'd like to

4104
03:14:57,219 --> 03:14:59,000
say I'm with I support

4105
03:14:59,000 --> 03:15:03,440
the project Commissioner Roseau thank you chair just wanted

4106
03:15:03,440 --> 03:15:06,120
to respond or maybe

4107
03:15:06,120 --> 03:15:11,159
bring up some points if I understood this correctly I

4108
03:15:11,159 --> 03:15:13,040
believe I did the

4109
03:15:13,040 --> 03:15:16,959
applicant held a community meeting which I don't think is

4110
03:15:16,959 --> 03:15:18,239
required to do so they

4111
03:15:18,239 --> 03:15:21,600
voluntarily had a community meeting based on the reaction

4112
03:15:21,600 --> 03:15:22,280
when Commissioner

4113
03:15:22,280 --> 03:15:24,430
Ellis asked if it was a good turnout or maybe it's

4114
03:15:24,430 --> 03:15:26,000
Commissioner Sanchez asked

4115
03:15:26,000 --> 03:15:27,729
is a good turnout the response I got it seemed to

4116
03:15:27,729 --> 03:15:28,920
communicate to me that that is

4117
03:15:28,920 --> 03:15:33,190
a great turnout for a community meeting they brought up

4118
03:15:33,190 --> 03:15:35,040
eight items of concern

4119
03:15:35,040 --> 03:15:38,879
that the applicant noted and brought to our presentation

4120
03:15:38,879 --> 03:15:40,520
those eight items so I

4121
03:15:40,520 --> 03:15:44,659
believe they listened to the concerns that the community 20

4122
03:15:44,659 --> 03:15:45,760
plus brought out

4123
03:15:45,760 --> 03:15:49,120
and responded to each of them and they even put a table on

4124
03:15:49,120 --> 03:15:49,799
how they're gonna

4125
03:15:49,799 --> 03:15:52,870
respond to each one of them and so it's hard for me to hear

4126
03:15:52,870 --> 03:15:54,000
that we don't know

4127
03:15:54,000 --> 03:15:57,420
what the community thinks because I don't know what more

4128
03:15:57,420 --> 03:15:58,479
the applicant could

4129
03:15:58,479 --> 03:16:01,700
have done or the Commission could have done and having this

4130
03:16:01,700 --> 03:16:02,840
meeting tonight to

4131
03:16:02,840 --> 03:16:06,590
acquire the opinions of the community they did acquire the

4132
03:16:06,590 --> 03:16:07,639
opinions of the

4133
03:16:07,639 --> 03:16:11,069
community that that desired to be vocal and they responded

4134
03:16:11,069 --> 03:16:12,159
to all of them and

4135
03:16:12,159 --> 03:16:18,239
answered all their concerns and so with that we also have

4136
03:16:18,239 --> 03:16:20,680
looks like seven

4137
03:16:20,680 --> 03:16:26,170
oppositions three from homeowners when including the people

4138
03:16:26,170 --> 03:16:26,680
that were spoke

4139
03:16:26,680 --> 03:16:28,829
tonight we have eight in favor so if we want to look at

4140
03:16:28,829 --> 03:16:30,000
that there's more in

4141
03:16:30,000 --> 03:16:35,719
favor than an opposition if we just look at respondents I

4142
03:16:35,719 --> 03:16:37,280
want to be correct in

4143
03:16:37,280 --> 03:16:45,079
me saying how many in favor in the response yes we have the

4144
03:16:45,079 --> 03:16:45,520
applicants

4145
03:16:45,520 --> 03:16:49,360
included yes so in total the people that we've gotten

4146
03:16:49,360 --> 03:16:51,120
feedback from who decided

4147
03:16:51,120 --> 03:16:55,000
to come here tonight and the responses mailed in are in

4148
03:16:55,000 --> 03:16:57,959
favor and so the

4149
03:16:57,959 --> 03:17:00,149
community issue that Commissioner Beck brought up I just it

4150
03:17:00,149 --> 03:17:00,879
doesn't resonate

4151
03:17:00,879 --> 03:17:04,239
with me considering the work that's been put in and then

4152
03:17:04,239 --> 03:17:05,239
Christian Sullivan

4153
03:17:05,239 --> 03:17:07,959
brought up the idea of he doesn't understand maybe

4154
03:17:07,959 --> 03:17:09,120
understand the

4155
03:17:09,120 --> 03:17:12,290
requirement of buddy putting the more restriction is so

4156
03:17:12,290 --> 03:17:13,360
they cannot build

4157
03:17:13,360 --> 03:17:17,290
offices in an R6 it's not possible they have to have a

4158
03:17:17,290 --> 03:17:19,079
zoning change to build

4159
03:17:19,079 --> 03:17:22,770
offices so that's why they're asking for a zoning change is

4160
03:17:22,770 --> 03:17:23,639
they want to put an

4161
03:17:23,639 --> 03:17:26,860
office instead of duplexes back there but with that

4162
03:17:26,860 --> 03:17:28,239
restriction they can't put

4163
03:17:28,239 --> 03:17:32,559
restaurants in the back that's prohibited by NRM U12 the

4164
03:17:32,559 --> 03:17:33,000
restaurants

4165
03:17:33,000 --> 03:17:37,250
could only go on the front MRM you so the zoning change is

4166
03:17:37,250 --> 03:17:38,120
going to provide

4167
03:17:38,120 --> 03:17:41,680
them the option to do offices only not restaurants back

4168
03:17:41,680 --> 03:17:42,600
there the restaurants

4169
03:17:42,600 --> 03:17:45,110
would be up on McKinney which McKinney area has a couple

4170
03:17:45,110 --> 03:17:46,079
restaurants to the

4171
03:17:46,079 --> 03:17:49,340
West but certainly none convenient for the individuals

4172
03:17:49,340 --> 03:17:50,120
working at the courthouse

4173
03:17:50,120 --> 03:17:55,420
or I just served jury duty and good luck finding food so

4174
03:17:55,420 --> 03:17:58,280
that I understand what

4175
03:17:58,280 --> 03:18:01,469
the need is in the community and so again I've already

4176
03:18:01,469 --> 03:18:02,639
motion to approve

4177
03:18:02,639 --> 03:18:06,159
this but I think there's a lot of good reasons for this

4178
03:18:06,159 --> 03:18:07,639
Commission to send this

4179
03:18:07,639 --> 03:18:12,139
forth to the council for approval Commissioner Ellis thank

4180
03:18:12,139 --> 03:18:13,479
you chair okay

4181
03:18:13,479 --> 03:18:17,239
so into in response to Commissioner Rozelle as far as

4182
03:18:17,239 --> 03:18:18,840
requests and support I

4183
03:18:18,840 --> 03:18:23,959
mean in favor of this I mean it's the broker for the

4184
03:18:23,959 --> 03:18:25,239
property and the two in

4185
03:18:25,239 --> 03:18:29,629
favor we're the property owner and an investor in the area

4186
03:18:29,629 --> 03:18:30,760
so we have all

4187
03:18:30,760 --> 03:18:34,590
opposition who as far as people who live there so nobody

4188
03:18:34,590 --> 03:18:36,399
who lives there in the

4189
03:18:36,399 --> 03:18:39,760
area is in favor we don't have any of that except for the

4190
03:18:39,760 --> 03:18:40,879
one investor who

4191
03:18:40,879 --> 03:18:44,420
lives in Lantana and bought his property this year also

4192
03:18:44,420 --> 03:18:45,520
wanted to state that

4193
03:18:45,520 --> 03:18:49,170
Commissioner Sanchez pointed out my concern beautifully

4194
03:18:49,170 --> 03:18:50,520
when he said perhaps

4195
03:18:50,520 --> 03:18:53,489
those properties on Janney Street will sell and become

4196
03:18:53,489 --> 03:18:55,040
offices that's exactly

4197
03:18:55,040 --> 03:18:58,590
the point I'm trying to illustrate not to necessarily make

4198
03:18:58,590 --> 03:18:59,600
this lot single

4199
03:18:59,600 --> 03:19:03,430
family homes but that the existing single-family homes that

4200
03:19:03,430 --> 03:19:04,360
are affordable

4201
03:19:04,360 --> 03:19:09,629
albeit not pretty but affordable either to rent or to own

4202
03:19:09,629 --> 03:19:11,479
by encroaching like

4203
03:19:11,479 --> 03:19:14,950
this with commercial property you absolutely introduce the

4204
03:19:14,950 --> 03:19:15,639
demise of those

4205
03:19:15,639 --> 03:19:20,309
single-family homes to become commercial property which is

4206
03:19:20,309 --> 03:19:21,239
great if you're an

4207
03:19:21,239 --> 03:19:25,489
investor owning one of those properties but not great to

4208
03:19:25,489 --> 03:19:26,600
creating less

4209
03:19:26,600 --> 03:19:32,680
single-family options in our city that's what we don't need

4210
03:19:32,680 --> 03:19:33,000
here

4211
03:19:33,239 --> 03:19:36,840
Commissioner Beck. Thank you Chair. I would just like to

4212
03:19:36,840 --> 03:19:39,159
point out the obvious thing that we

4213
03:19:39,159 --> 03:19:43,350
have parameters set for us through decisions made by

4214
03:19:43,350 --> 03:19:45,040
citizens city staff

4215
03:19:45,040 --> 03:19:47,569
and others that protect neighborhoods like this for a

4216
03:19:47,569 --> 03:19:48,840
reason and it's to help

4217
03:19:48,840 --> 03:19:51,899
guide growth if we dismiss these without deeper

4218
03:19:51,899 --> 03:19:54,079
consideration about neighborhood

4219
03:19:54,079 --> 03:19:57,879
consensus for such a change I think we do a disservice to

4220
03:19:57,879 --> 03:19:59,520
the 2030 plan and the

4221
03:19:59,520 --> 03:20:02,569
other efforts the future land use map and all those other

4222
03:20:02,569 --> 03:20:04,319
things I again you

4223
03:20:04,319 --> 03:20:08,010
know this is an excellent plan but it encroaches too much

4224
03:20:08,010 --> 03:20:09,639
in my opinion and I

4225
03:20:09,639 --> 03:20:12,399
just wish there was some other way we could work with the

4226
03:20:12,399 --> 03:20:13,360
developer and the

4227
03:20:13,360 --> 03:20:18,829
owner that would benefit us all but again the sense that we

4228
03:20:18,829 --> 03:20:20,399
're going in here

4229
03:20:20,399 --> 03:20:23,870
and I'm just not thoroughly convinced that the people who

4230
03:20:23,870 --> 03:20:24,920
live in this area

4231
03:20:24,920 --> 03:20:31,799
would thoroughly approve it. Commissioner Sanchez. I would

4232
03:20:31,799 --> 03:20:32,959
just like I would just

4233
03:20:32,959 --> 03:20:35,850
like to state that some of these older neighborhoods like

4234
03:20:35,850 --> 03:20:36,899
that like the one on

4235
03:20:36,899 --> 03:20:42,370
Janie especially on the west side of Janie Street a lot of

4236
03:20:42,370 --> 03:20:43,840
those houses are

4237
03:20:43,840 --> 03:20:46,729
pretty much falling apart and there I believe there it won

4238
03:20:46,729 --> 03:20:47,479
't be long before

4239
03:20:47,479 --> 03:20:51,799
those houses have to be replaced and those neighborhoods

4240
03:20:51,799 --> 03:20:53,079
have to have they

4241
03:20:53,079 --> 03:20:57,079
have to be renovated and some of this new ideas have to be

4242
03:20:57,079 --> 03:20:58,440
brought into the

4243
03:20:58,440 --> 03:21:01,069
neighborhoods and not just let them well this is the way it

4244
03:21:01,069 --> 03:21:02,040
's been for 50 years

4245
03:21:02,040 --> 03:21:05,639
or a hundred years because those those neighborhoods are

4246
03:21:05,639 --> 03:21:06,479
going to deteriorate

4247
03:21:06,479 --> 03:21:11,059
and that's why I think projects like this will help the

4248
03:21:11,059 --> 03:21:13,799
neighborhood. Okay I'm

4249
03:21:13,799 --> 03:21:15,969
going to call the question I don't see anybody else wishing

4250
03:21:15,969 --> 03:21:16,680
to speak we have a

4251
03:21:16,680 --> 03:21:21,399
first and a second before us for approval with all of the

4252
03:21:21,399 --> 03:21:22,120
conditions as

4253
03:21:22,120 --> 03:21:28,200
proposed by the applicant so I will call for a vote on the

4254
03:21:28,200 --> 03:21:28,680
board.

4255
03:21:41,959 --> 03:21:49,409
Motion carries four to three. We have one final item I don

4256
03:21:49,409 --> 03:21:51,760
't know if folks want

4257
03:21:51,760 --> 03:21:54,459
to stay or if they want to clear the room and if we need to

4258
03:21:54,459 --> 03:21:55,239
take a break or

4259
03:21:55,239 --> 03:21:58,600
if we want to try to press through our last item this

4260
03:21:58,600 --> 03:22:00,639
evening. Okay we'll take a

4261
03:22:00,639 --> 03:22:06,440
quick break at 850.

4262
03:22:21,760 --> 03:22:34,840
Okay we are back from our break and we'll call us back into

4263
03:22:34,840 --> 03:22:35,959
session at 9

4264
03:22:35,959 --> 03:22:40,920
o'clock and at this time I'm going to reopen the public

4265
03:22:40,920 --> 03:22:42,200
hearing for item C

4266
03:22:42,200 --> 03:22:48,600
which is DCA 17-0010 and I believe Jim Jenks is going to

4267
03:22:48,600 --> 03:22:48,920
make this

4268
03:22:48,920 --> 03:22:55,440
presentation. Good evening this is a follow-up presentation

4269
03:22:55,440 --> 03:22:56,440
to the one that I

4270
03:22:56,440 --> 03:23:02,159
made a couple weeks ago and I will start by saying I will

4271
03:23:02,159 --> 03:23:03,959
just very quickly

4272
03:23:03,959 --> 03:23:10,989
recap what I presented on the 13th and then show the

4273
03:23:10,989 --> 03:23:12,719
discuss the issues that

4274
03:23:12,719 --> 03:23:16,700
came up questions that were raised and research that we've

4275
03:23:16,700 --> 03:23:17,639
done and findings

4276
03:23:17,639 --> 03:23:21,780
that we've come across. As you all know the city is in the

4277
03:23:21,780 --> 03:23:23,040
process of a very

4278
03:23:23,040 --> 03:23:29,120
thorough analysis reevaluation of our codes our criteria

4279
03:23:29,120 --> 03:23:29,639
manuals our

4280
03:23:29,639 --> 03:23:34,809
development processes and our processes to get into

4281
03:23:34,809 --> 03:23:37,079
construction we are trying

4282
03:23:37,079 --> 03:23:46,239
to update them streamline them make them just better as far

4283
03:23:46,239 --> 03:23:48,079
as serving the

4284
03:23:48,079 --> 03:23:50,340
development community while still protecting the city's

4285
03:23:50,340 --> 03:23:51,440
interests this is

4286
03:23:51,440 --> 03:23:57,159
a part of that effort. The objectives again what we're

4287
03:23:57,159 --> 03:23:59,719
looking to do here we

4288
03:23:59,719 --> 03:24:05,799
get frequent requests that we file plats earlier and I can

4289
03:24:05,799 --> 03:24:07,280
talk about the

4290
03:24:07,280 --> 03:24:10,530
particulars of that we think that this may be a way to

4291
03:24:10,530 --> 03:24:13,879
achieve that also we get

4292
03:24:13,879 --> 03:24:17,559
frequent requests from the development community to file

4293
03:24:17,559 --> 03:24:18,719
plats prior to the

4294
03:24:18,719 --> 03:24:23,840
developer having to enter a contract with a contractor and

4295
03:24:23,840 --> 03:24:24,040
then

4296
03:24:24,040 --> 03:24:28,750
also we're seeking to eliminate separate whole harmless

4297
03:24:28,750 --> 03:24:30,920
agreements which would

4298
03:24:30,920 --> 03:24:38,000
simplify the process and also as we discussed some a couple

4299
03:24:38,000 --> 03:24:40,200
weeks ago this is

4300
03:24:40,200 --> 03:24:45,149
to help us get into compliance with the section of the

4301
03:24:45,149 --> 03:24:47,479
Texas local government

4302
03:24:47,479 --> 03:24:52,409
code that that I've quoted here that states that the

4303
03:24:52,409 --> 03:24:54,959
developer must execute a

4304
03:24:54,959 --> 03:24:58,149
performance bond for the construction of the improvements

4305
03:24:58,149 --> 03:24:59,440
to ensure completion of

4306
03:24:59,440 --> 03:25:03,739
the project. Right now while the developer is one of the

4307
03:25:03,739 --> 03:25:04,319
three parties

4308
03:25:04,319 --> 03:25:07,889
named in our what we call our three-way development

4309
03:25:07,889 --> 03:25:09,680
contracts it's almost always

4310
03:25:09,680 --> 03:25:16,479
the contractor who is named on the bond. This is our

4311
03:25:16,479 --> 03:25:20,319
current process if you can

4312
03:25:20,319 --> 03:25:27,309
see here the point at which we can current and this is this

4313
03:25:27,309 --> 03:25:28,840
is per the way

4314
03:25:28,840 --> 03:25:33,809
our development code is currently written we cannot file

4315
03:25:33,809 --> 03:25:35,520
the plat until the

4316
03:25:35,520 --> 03:25:41,600
developer has got his plat approved by PNZ and has executed

4317
03:25:41,600 --> 03:25:42,239
the three-way

4318
03:25:42,239 --> 03:25:48,049
development contract with the city and his contractor. Also

4319
03:25:48,049 --> 03:25:49,559
I have shown on here

4320
03:25:49,559 --> 03:25:53,659
following that stage following that step is when they can

4321
03:25:53,659 --> 03:25:54,520
get their whole

4322
03:25:54,520 --> 03:25:58,659
harmless agreement executed and by whole harmless agreement

4323
03:25:58,659 --> 03:26:00,319
I'll explain that

4324
03:26:00,319 --> 03:26:04,719
basically our code stipulates that no private improvements

4325
03:26:04,719 --> 03:26:06,360
construction can be

4326
03:26:06,360 --> 03:26:10,760
started before all the public improvements that are

4327
03:26:10,760 --> 03:26:11,959
associated with a

4328
03:26:11,959 --> 03:26:17,319
development project have been completed. Our code does

4329
03:26:17,319 --> 03:26:19,559
allow in the case of

4330
03:26:19,559 --> 03:26:25,760
multifamily or commercial it does or industrial it does

4331
03:26:25,760 --> 03:26:28,600
allow a developer to

4332
03:26:28,600 --> 03:26:32,649
enter into a whole harmless agreement basically allowing

4333
03:26:32,649 --> 03:26:34,120
concurrent private

4334
03:26:34,120 --> 03:26:37,989
and public improvements construction. The agreement

4335
03:26:37,989 --> 03:26:40,600
basically which is signed and

4336
03:26:40,600 --> 03:26:45,590
filed at the county basically formalizes that the developer

4337
03:26:45,590 --> 03:26:46,520
will hold the city

4338
03:26:46,520 --> 03:26:51,829
harmless if we were to hold withhold a CEO certificate of

4339
03:26:51,829 --> 03:26:54,319
occupancy because his

4340
03:26:54,319 --> 03:27:00,069
public improvements have not been completed. What we are

4341
03:27:00,069 --> 03:27:01,840
looking at moving

4342
03:27:01,840 --> 03:27:07,920
toward is basically splitting our current three-way

4343
03:27:07,920 --> 03:27:09,440
development agreement

4344
03:27:09,440 --> 03:27:15,520
into two-way development agreements. One being between the

4345
03:27:15,520 --> 03:27:16,680
city and the

4346
03:27:16,680 --> 03:27:24,760
developer after which we could file the plat. The next one

4347
03:27:24,760 --> 03:27:28,319
you can see filing we

4348
03:27:28,319 --> 03:27:31,229
think we would be able to file that plat much sooner

4349
03:27:31,229 --> 03:27:33,479
several weeks sooner than we

4350
03:27:33,479 --> 03:27:37,579
would if we were to hold plat filing till the developer

4351
03:27:37,579 --> 03:27:39,840
entered into an agreement

4352
03:27:39,840 --> 03:27:42,799
with a contractor. What we would propose is having a

4353
03:27:42,799 --> 03:27:44,319
separate agreement between

4354
03:27:44,319 --> 03:27:49,079
the contractor and the city after which we can have the pre

4355
03:27:49,079 --> 03:27:49,639
-construction

4356
03:27:49,639 --> 03:27:54,829
meetings and get into construction. So that's a recap of

4357
03:27:54,829 --> 03:27:56,760
what we've discussed

4358
03:27:56,760 --> 03:28:00,920
before and so there are some very good questions raised by

4359
03:28:00,920 --> 03:28:02,239
the commissioners at

4360
03:28:02,239 --> 03:28:05,860
the last meeting as well as by the public and I'll list

4361
03:28:05,860 --> 03:28:07,079
some of them here.

4362
03:28:07,079 --> 03:28:13,420
What is a developer's capacity to get bonded? Contractors

4363
03:28:13,420 --> 03:28:14,840
typically do.

4364
03:28:14,840 --> 03:28:18,670
Developers you know there's often smaller entities how

4365
03:28:18,670 --> 03:28:20,200
likely are they able to get

4366
03:28:20,200 --> 03:28:25,930
a bond. What do other cities require and could there be

4367
03:28:25,930 --> 03:28:28,639
guarantees issued to the

4368
03:28:28,639 --> 03:28:33,190
developer and contractors such that the related expense of

4369
03:28:33,190 --> 03:28:34,200
the bond or the

4370
03:28:34,200 --> 03:28:38,450
guarantee is not doubled so it's not redundant because that

4371
03:28:38,450 --> 03:28:38,879
can be an

4372
03:28:38,879 --> 03:28:44,510
appreciable cost. Also would the city consider allowing

4373
03:28:44,510 --> 03:28:45,680
single-family

4374
03:28:45,680 --> 03:28:49,329
residential i.e. houses to be constructed prior to

4375
03:28:49,329 --> 03:28:51,360
completion of the related

4376
03:28:51,360 --> 03:28:56,299
public improvements i.e. would we be willing to issue a

4377
03:28:56,299 --> 03:28:57,319
hold harmless agreement

4378
03:28:57,319 --> 03:29:01,010
for single-family residential as we do for other

4379
03:29:01,010 --> 03:29:03,879
development types. We've done

4380
03:29:03,879 --> 03:29:08,709
quite a bit of research since our last meeting and it's

4381
03:29:08,709 --> 03:29:10,399
still ongoing but we've

4382
03:29:10,399 --> 03:29:13,959
done quite a bit thus far. We've contacted about eight sure

4383
03:29:13,959 --> 03:29:15,600
ty companies,

4384
03:29:15,600 --> 03:29:19,930
various agents, vice presidents of companies got a lot of

4385
03:29:19,930 --> 03:29:20,559
good information

4386
03:29:20,559 --> 03:29:24,709
from them. We've contacted at least nine cities throughout

4387
03:29:24,709 --> 03:29:25,680
the Metroplex and

4388
03:29:25,680 --> 03:29:32,989
Texas and what the surety companies have told us there are

4389
03:29:32,989 --> 03:29:35,040
cases such as the one

4390
03:29:35,040 --> 03:29:41,250
I mentioned a couple weeks ago at our meeting. We do hear

4391
03:29:41,250 --> 03:29:42,959
of cases in

4392
03:29:42,959 --> 03:29:50,670
which sureties issue performance bonds to developers. That

4393
03:29:50,670 --> 03:29:51,799
seems to be less

4394
03:29:51,799 --> 03:29:56,940
common than the case of them issuing those bonds to

4395
03:29:56,940 --> 03:30:00,319
contractors. Basically for

4396
03:30:00,319 --> 03:30:04,600
a surety to issue a performance bond to a developer they

4397
03:30:04,600 --> 03:30:05,920
typically require that

4398
03:30:05,920 --> 03:30:10,719
the developer signs personally. In other words not as a

4399
03:30:10,719 --> 03:30:13,639
newly formed LLC. They've

4400
03:30:13,639 --> 03:30:19,739
got to demonstrate a good fiscal track record. We are

4401
03:30:19,739 --> 03:30:22,200
finding, well we're

4402
03:30:22,200 --> 03:30:25,840
finding from cities and from the surety companies, many

4403
03:30:25,840 --> 03:30:26,959
cities are now

4404
03:30:26,959 --> 03:30:30,770
allowing developers to provide a fiscal guarantee in a form

4405
03:30:30,770 --> 03:30:31,760
other than the

4406
03:30:31,760 --> 03:30:36,020
performance bond. For example in the form of the irrevoc

4407
03:30:36,020 --> 03:30:37,280
able letter of credit from

4408
03:30:37,280 --> 03:30:42,219
a bank or what some cities call a subdivision and

4409
03:30:42,219 --> 03:30:43,319
maintenance bond which

4410
03:30:43,319 --> 03:30:46,950
is similar to performance bonds just names the developer or

4411
03:30:46,950 --> 03:30:47,600
an escrow

4412
03:30:47,600 --> 03:30:51,559
agreement where they put up the money and it's held in

4413
03:30:51,559 --> 03:30:53,520
third-party escrow and

4414
03:30:53,520 --> 03:30:56,639
some many of the sureties actually recommend that the

4415
03:30:56,639 --> 03:30:58,959
cities require that

4416
03:30:58,959 --> 03:31:03,639
the developer provides such a guarantee and they are more

4417
03:31:03,639 --> 03:31:05,239
readily available to

4418
03:31:05,239 --> 03:31:10,750
developers than performance bonds are. That's and that's

4419
03:31:10,750 --> 03:31:12,399
not to say that every

4420
03:31:12,399 --> 03:31:18,479
developer would be able to acquire every such guarantee but

4421
03:31:18,479 --> 03:31:20,079
they they have a

4422
03:31:20,079 --> 03:31:23,340
better chance many of them especially the smaller ones or

4423
03:31:23,340 --> 03:31:24,799
the newer ones have

4424
03:31:24,799 --> 03:31:28,719
more access to these types of alternative guarantees than a

4425
03:31:28,719 --> 03:31:29,239
performance

4426
03:31:29,239 --> 03:31:35,319
bonds. And as far as the feedback we got from other cities

4427
03:31:35,319 --> 03:31:36,840
it's kind of interesting

4428
03:31:36,840 --> 03:31:44,399
there there is no sort of typical sequence or procedure or

4429
03:31:44,399 --> 03:31:46,200
protocol that

4430
03:31:46,200 --> 03:31:49,840
we have encountered. The requirements can vary quite a bit

4431
03:31:49,840 --> 03:31:51,399
from city to city.

4432
03:31:51,399 --> 03:31:55,649
For instance some cities will not file the plat until the

4433
03:31:55,649 --> 03:31:56,760
developer has

4434
03:31:56,760 --> 03:32:03,219
constructed all Israeli public improvements. Some cities do

4435
03:32:03,219 --> 03:32:04,000
not require

4436
03:32:04,000 --> 03:32:07,299
development contracts at all they just simply require the

4437
03:32:07,299 --> 03:32:08,440
developer puts up a

4438
03:32:08,440 --> 03:32:12,579
bond. We're not recommending Denton go down that path but

4439
03:32:12,579 --> 03:32:13,719
it's just kind of

4440
03:32:13,719 --> 03:32:18,709
interesting how different some cities are from each other.

4441
03:32:18,709 --> 03:32:20,680
Many do in our

4442
03:32:20,680 --> 03:32:22,770
research we found many of these cities do offer these

4443
03:32:22,770 --> 03:32:23,959
options that I mentioned

4444
03:32:23,959 --> 03:32:30,040
as to what form the developer guarantee takes.

4445
03:32:30,040 --> 03:32:34,879
Performance bond or subdivision development bond, letter of

4446
03:32:34,879 --> 03:32:36,520
credit, escrow

4447
03:32:36,520 --> 03:32:41,989
account and there's others. There's a couple notable

4448
03:32:41,989 --> 03:32:43,959
examples that I wanted to

4449
03:32:43,959 --> 03:32:52,000
share because they are they are from cities that have some

4450
03:32:52,000 --> 03:32:52,879
some policies that

4451
03:32:52,879 --> 03:32:57,739
are similar to what we're exploring and we're trying to

4452
03:32:57,739 --> 03:32:59,600
make we're hoping could

4453
03:32:59,600 --> 03:33:03,450
work here in Denton and trying to Institute. One is

4454
03:33:03,450 --> 03:33:05,680
Georgetown it's a

4455
03:33:05,680 --> 03:33:08,379
smaller city than Denton but it's growing very quickly and

4456
03:33:08,379 --> 03:33:09,120
the other is

4457
03:33:09,120 --> 03:33:13,219
San Antonio a large city. Georgetown in the Austin area

4458
03:33:13,219 --> 03:33:14,799
they allow the plat to

4459
03:33:14,799 --> 03:33:18,159
be filed prior to the completion of public improvements

4460
03:33:18,159 --> 03:33:20,239
once a fiscal surety

4461
03:33:20,239 --> 03:33:25,399
has been issued. So that can be not just the performance

4462
03:33:25,399 --> 03:33:26,520
bond board that could be

4463
03:33:26,520 --> 03:33:30,049
a trust agreement which I believe is similar to an escrow

4464
03:33:30,049 --> 03:33:30,840
agreement.

4465
03:33:30,840 --> 03:33:35,860
Irrevocable letter of credit or like as I mentioned

4466
03:33:35,860 --> 03:33:40,479
performance bond. This one

4467
03:33:40,479 --> 03:33:46,979
issue or concern or request that was stated at the last

4468
03:33:46,979 --> 03:33:49,319
meeting was would

4469
03:33:49,319 --> 03:33:55,610
there be a way in which the lot home lots could be sold

4470
03:33:55,610 --> 03:33:57,040
this could could this

4471
03:33:57,040 --> 03:33:59,430
be structured such that home lots could be sold prior to

4472
03:33:59,430 --> 03:34:00,399
completion of public

4473
03:34:00,399 --> 03:34:04,879
improvements and this would help facilitate that. In San

4474
03:34:04,879 --> 03:34:07,600
Antonio they

4475
03:34:07,600 --> 03:34:10,399
won't approve the plat until the developer signs the

4476
03:34:10,399 --> 03:34:12,360
performance agreement.

4477
03:34:12,360 --> 03:34:15,659
It's a it's just a short three page agreement and again it

4478
03:34:15,659 --> 03:34:16,239
's by the

4479
03:34:16,239 --> 03:34:19,209
developer and it ensures that they complete the public

4480
03:34:19,209 --> 03:34:21,840
improvements. They

4481
03:34:21,840 --> 03:34:25,489
will allow for an approved plat to be filed before the

4482
03:34:25,489 --> 03:34:27,159
public improvements are

4483
03:34:27,159 --> 03:34:29,940
completed if the developer provides his guarantee within

4484
03:34:29,940 --> 03:34:30,920
three years of plat

4485
03:34:30,920 --> 03:34:34,649
approval. So again that's and they like Georgetown and

4486
03:34:34,649 --> 03:34:36,479
others allow options

4487
03:34:36,479 --> 03:34:40,719
performance bonds, irrevocable trust agreement,

4488
03:34:40,719 --> 03:34:45,319
standby letter of credit, cashier's check being some

4489
03:34:45,319 --> 03:34:48,079
examples. And they

4490
03:34:48,079 --> 03:34:56,340
informed us that they they get the developers that they

4491
03:34:56,340 --> 03:34:57,600
deal with they

4492
03:34:57,600 --> 03:35:01,200
find that about half the time the developers prefer to the

4493
03:35:01,200 --> 03:35:01,879
defer the

4494
03:35:01,879 --> 03:35:07,280
construction a little bit and but are anxious to get the

4495
03:35:07,280 --> 03:35:09,200
plat filed and I

4496
03:35:09,200 --> 03:35:13,120
think mainly that's for two reasons. One is because often a

4497
03:35:13,120 --> 03:35:14,600
developers financing

4498
03:35:14,600 --> 03:35:19,659
is tied to the milestone of plat approval or plat filing

4499
03:35:19,659 --> 03:35:22,040
and then also in

4500
03:35:22,040 --> 03:35:28,969
many cases they would like to start selling lots that are

4501
03:35:28,969 --> 03:35:31,719
that are planted.

4502
03:35:31,719 --> 03:35:41,200
So basically I wanted to I propose coming back to you one

4503
03:35:41,200 --> 03:35:42,280
more time if that

4504
03:35:42,280 --> 03:35:46,530
would be all right on October 11th so maybe we could I

4505
03:35:46,530 --> 03:35:48,040
suggest a continuance

4506
03:35:48,040 --> 03:35:52,520
tonight. I wanted to give you a high-level

4507
03:35:53,000 --> 03:35:58,420
presentation on responses to your questions what we found

4508
03:35:58,420 --> 03:35:59,879
in our research

4509
03:35:59,879 --> 03:36:06,520
in a nutshell we do our findings are such that I think we

4510
03:36:06,520 --> 03:36:08,840
can I think we can

4511
03:36:08,840 --> 03:36:11,819
and should continue on the path we're on as far as what we

4512
03:36:11,819 --> 03:36:12,959
're looking to do it

4513
03:36:12,959 --> 03:36:18,340
does appear to be feasible. We will be working very closely

4514
03:36:18,340 --> 03:36:19,479
with legal and

4515
03:36:19,479 --> 03:36:25,690
others as we finalize this and the actual contract and bond

4516
03:36:25,690 --> 03:36:26,760
forms are

4517
03:36:26,760 --> 03:36:32,840
prepared and revised and I I would ask that I be able to

4518
03:36:32,840 --> 03:36:33,879
make one more

4519
03:36:33,879 --> 03:36:37,069
presentation to you in another continuance to the public

4520
03:36:37,069 --> 03:36:37,959
hearing at the

4521
03:36:37,959 --> 03:36:46,319
October 11th meeting. One other issue or question I wanted

4522
03:36:46,319 --> 03:36:47,719
to address or perhaps

4523
03:36:47,719 --> 03:36:50,940
more than anything tonight just discuss and explore a bit

4524
03:36:50,940 --> 03:36:52,879
more is there was a

4525
03:36:52,879 --> 03:36:57,459
there's a question from from the PNZ at the last at the

4526
03:36:57,459 --> 03:36:59,760
last meeting about or a

4527
03:36:59,760 --> 03:37:05,030
request that we consider in our amending in our process of

4528
03:37:05,030 --> 03:37:07,079
amending the code that

4529
03:37:07,079 --> 03:37:12,790
we consider allowing or issuing hold harmless agreements

4530
03:37:12,790 --> 03:37:13,520
again that's the

4531
03:37:13,520 --> 03:37:18,440
allowing the simultaneous private and public improvements

4532
03:37:18,440 --> 03:37:20,760
to be constructed

4533
03:37:20,760 --> 03:37:24,319
for single-family residential which is currently the type

4534
03:37:24,319 --> 03:37:25,440
of development we

4535
03:37:25,440 --> 03:37:29,069
don't allow it for per our code. I've discussed that some

4536
03:37:29,069 --> 03:37:30,479
here internally with

4537
03:37:30,479 --> 03:37:34,299
our managers in our building inspections department in our

4538
03:37:34,299 --> 03:37:34,959
public works

4539
03:37:34,959 --> 03:37:39,059
inspection department it hasn't been has it doesn't seem

4540
03:37:39,059 --> 03:37:40,200
like it's been a

4541
03:37:40,200 --> 03:37:45,909
request that we receive frequently but I wanted to hear in

4542
03:37:45,909 --> 03:37:47,440
our public hearing

4543
03:37:47,440 --> 03:37:51,129
maybe can request that we open up for a little more

4544
03:37:51,129 --> 03:37:54,360
discussion tonight as to what

4545
03:37:54,360 --> 03:38:01,120
the concerns are there or what what is hoped to be achieved

4546
03:38:01,120 --> 03:38:04,200
. I'll take the help

4547
03:38:04,200 --> 03:38:11,110
in the room. My question was just simply in bringing this

4548
03:38:11,110 --> 03:38:12,159
question up is we allow

4549
03:38:12,159 --> 03:38:15,629
it in other applications we allow it in commercial projects

4550
03:38:15,629 --> 03:38:16,120
we allow it

4551
03:38:16,120 --> 03:38:18,959
multifamily and the question is why don't we allow it in

4552
03:38:18,959 --> 03:38:19,360
single-family

4553
03:38:19,360 --> 03:38:24,989
residential. I think there was some initial conversation

4554
03:38:24,989 --> 03:38:26,440
about the timing of

4555
03:38:26,440 --> 03:38:29,870
it and and I think it if it's going to be considered it

4556
03:38:29,870 --> 03:38:30,760
would be under and

4557
03:38:30,760 --> 03:38:33,229
fall under the same exact rules that it applies with

4558
03:38:33,229 --> 03:38:34,719
commercial and multifamily

4559
03:38:34,719 --> 03:38:39,479
is until the streets or concrete or asphalt whatever they

4560
03:38:39,479 --> 03:38:41,079
are just like with

4561
03:38:41,079 --> 03:38:44,440
multifamily and commercial you can't go out there and begin

4562
03:38:44,440 --> 03:38:45,319
doing construction

4563
03:38:45,319 --> 03:38:49,370
that it's a fire ingress egress fire marshal type of an

4564
03:38:49,370 --> 03:38:51,319
issue and it just

4565
03:38:51,319 --> 03:38:54,319
looks to me like there's an opportunity if the city is open

4566
03:38:54,319 --> 03:38:55,280
to that and feels

4567
03:38:55,280 --> 03:38:59,559
comfortable with it that as residential subdivisions are

4568
03:38:59,559 --> 03:39:00,600
finishing up just like

4569
03:39:00,600 --> 03:39:04,579
with commercial and multifamily developments that there

4570
03:39:04,579 --> 03:39:05,360
would be an

4571
03:39:05,360 --> 03:39:08,950
opportunity for the builders that are going to be building

4572
03:39:08,950 --> 03:39:10,040
those homes to come

4573
03:39:10,040 --> 03:39:12,629
in and pull permits and begin construction while you're

4574
03:39:12,629 --> 03:39:13,319
finishing up

4575
03:39:13,319 --> 03:39:18,059
the last items that are on the punch list for substantial

4576
03:39:18,059 --> 03:39:20,399
completion the city

4577
03:39:20,399 --> 03:39:23,579
gets all the funds for the building permits all the impact

4578
03:39:23,579 --> 03:39:24,159
fees upon

4579
03:39:24,159 --> 03:39:28,620
permitting so instead of the city having to wait another

4580
03:39:28,620 --> 03:39:30,639
number of months for

4581
03:39:30,639 --> 03:39:34,840
those substantial completion punch list to be completed

4582
03:39:34,840 --> 03:39:36,360
permits can be issued

4583
03:39:36,360 --> 03:39:40,610
city collects the fees the revenue builders get started the

4584
03:39:40,610 --> 03:39:41,239
homes aren't

4585
03:39:41,239 --> 03:39:44,920
ready to be occupied typically for four to six months

4586
03:39:44,920 --> 03:39:46,120
construction depending on

4587
03:39:46,120 --> 03:39:48,819
what time you know how large the home is and how long it

4588
03:39:48,819 --> 03:39:50,799
takes to build it so it

4589
03:39:50,799 --> 03:39:53,489
just seemed like it's a little bit of an efficiency area

4590
03:39:53,489 --> 03:39:54,680
that we could take a

4591
03:39:54,680 --> 03:39:59,850
look at that city gets revenue sooner homes start being

4592
03:39:59,850 --> 03:40:02,040
built sooner and you

4593
03:40:02,040 --> 03:40:05,329
have a time frame instead of residential dirt is sitting

4594
03:40:05,329 --> 03:40:06,600
there trying to get

4595
03:40:06,600 --> 03:40:09,159
completed before you can ever begin and then you've got a

4596
03:40:09,159 --> 03:40:10,040
four or six month

4597
03:40:10,040 --> 03:40:14,180
construction period to even ask for a final inspection or

4598
03:40:14,180 --> 03:40:15,559
CEO that some of that

4599
03:40:15,559 --> 03:40:19,290
can be done concurrently so it was just a question because

4600
03:40:19,290 --> 03:40:20,319
I know we allow it in

4601
03:40:20,319 --> 03:40:24,520
other areas is if there was a particular concern or reason

4602
03:40:24,520 --> 03:40:26,760
why single family is

4603
03:40:26,760 --> 03:40:30,639
singled out and not allowed to do that when we allow it in

4604
03:40:30,639 --> 03:40:32,239
other places as long

4605
03:40:32,239 --> 03:40:35,610
as under the same rules as far as fire safety and access

4606
03:40:35,610 --> 03:40:36,840
and all those same

4607
03:40:36,840 --> 03:40:39,959
types of things that have to be in place for commercial and

4608
03:40:39,959 --> 03:40:41,159
multifamily so it was

4609
03:40:41,159 --> 03:40:44,590
more of a question and a suggestion looking at all parties

4610
03:40:44,590 --> 03:40:45,639
involved city

4611
03:40:45,639 --> 03:40:50,950
revenue piece of it developer home builder as to how those

4612
03:40:50,950 --> 03:40:52,760
things might be

4613
03:40:52,760 --> 03:40:56,739
looked at from an efficiency standpoint is how can we make

4614
03:40:56,739 --> 03:40:58,200
it more efficient and

4615
03:40:58,200 --> 03:41:01,360
it's still a win-win for everybody that was my point in

4616
03:41:01,360 --> 03:41:02,719
bringing it up thank you

4617
03:41:02,719 --> 03:41:06,479
chairman that's that's very helpful we will we will

4618
03:41:06,479 --> 03:41:08,440
continue to explore that

4619
03:41:08,440 --> 03:41:13,709
internally and report back to you to the Commission on that

4620
03:41:13,709 --> 03:41:16,200
I think our initial

4621
03:41:16,200 --> 03:41:20,590
thought or I guess the thing that first comes to mind is

4622
03:41:20,590 --> 03:41:22,719
thinking of say a

4623
03:41:22,719 --> 03:41:26,190
subdivision a large subdivision with a network of streets

4624
03:41:26,190 --> 03:41:27,479
and our utilities are

4625
03:41:27,479 --> 03:41:31,579
under the streets that typically typically the sequence of

4626
03:41:31,579 --> 03:41:32,600
construction

4627
03:41:32,600 --> 03:41:35,719
for the public improvements would typically be the grading

4628
03:41:35,719 --> 03:41:36,399
of the streets

4629
03:41:36,399 --> 03:41:40,000
the utility installation the then the pouring of the

4630
03:41:40,000 --> 03:41:41,760
streets and the curing of

4631
03:41:41,760 --> 03:41:48,399
the streets and not and fairly in fairly soon after that

4632
03:41:48,399 --> 03:41:50,079
the project would

4633
03:41:50,079 --> 03:41:54,559
typically be accepted but I understand your point about

4634
03:41:54,559 --> 03:41:56,440
there is always with

4635
03:41:56,440 --> 03:42:02,520
every project a time period of sort of finish up takes

4636
03:42:02,520 --> 03:42:04,040
longer for some yeah

4637
03:42:04,040 --> 03:42:08,600
longer than everyone wants I realize that and in that time

4638
03:42:08,600 --> 03:42:09,799
being that the

4639
03:42:09,799 --> 03:42:15,879
streets are be poured and cured and everything just I you

4640
03:42:15,879 --> 03:42:16,719
know I could see

4641
03:42:16,719 --> 03:42:21,120
how this the lots could be accessed for private

4642
03:42:21,120 --> 03:42:22,440
construction so we will continue

4643
03:42:22,440 --> 03:42:25,329
to explore that and get back to you and again I appreciate

4644
03:42:25,329 --> 03:42:26,399
the clarification

4645
03:42:26,399 --> 03:42:30,719
thanks for entertaining the question and doing some

4646
03:42:30,719 --> 03:42:34,159
research on it the next steps

4647
03:42:34,159 --> 03:42:39,620
for for the staff is to generate the revised development

4648
03:42:39,620 --> 03:42:42,000
contract forms and

4649
03:42:42,000 --> 03:42:46,450
related bond forms or forms of the guarantee I'll be

4650
03:42:46,450 --> 03:42:47,399
working with closely

4651
03:42:47,399 --> 03:42:52,840
with legal department as we as we finalize those and to

4652
03:42:52,840 --> 03:42:54,479
decide upon the

4653
03:42:54,479 --> 03:42:57,389
allowable forms the guarantee would we allow all the

4654
03:42:57,389 --> 03:42:59,000
options that mentioned that

4655
03:42:59,000 --> 03:43:04,270
that other cities allow that's something we'll be looking

4656
03:43:04,270 --> 03:43:07,200
at in depth and then as

4657
03:43:07,200 --> 03:43:10,040
I mentioned we will be presenting that at a future public

4658
03:43:10,040 --> 03:43:10,639
hearing they'll be

4659
03:43:10,639 --> 03:43:15,860
you know the one on anticipating on the 11th for PNC we

4660
03:43:15,860 --> 03:43:16,799
have one that's

4661
03:43:16,799 --> 03:43:22,299
currently been advertised on October 17th for City Council

4662
03:43:22,299 --> 03:43:23,920
that's the extent

4663
03:43:23,920 --> 03:43:27,739
of my presentation I'd be happy to answer any further

4664
03:43:27,739 --> 03:43:29,319
questions

4665
03:43:31,000 --> 03:43:35,739
okay well I know we're gonna need to get a motion on the

4666
03:43:35,739 --> 03:43:37,159
floor and I just make a

4667
03:43:37,159 --> 03:43:42,790
quick comment before we get a motion I'm like the fact that

4668
03:43:42,790 --> 03:43:44,680
city staff has taken

4669
03:43:44,680 --> 03:43:50,149
a look of adding flexibility I think that's a great

4670
03:43:50,149 --> 03:43:51,799
attribute that we should

4671
03:43:51,799 --> 03:43:55,459
take a look at is trying to figure out ways and giving

4672
03:43:55,459 --> 03:43:57,760
people options to be to

4673
03:43:57,760 --> 03:44:01,409
meet and be compliant with our code rather than there's one

4674
03:44:01,409 --> 03:44:02,440
way that you can

4675
03:44:02,440 --> 03:44:06,840
do it because one way doesn't work for every project and so

4676
03:44:06,840 --> 03:44:08,399
I want to come in

4677
03:44:08,399 --> 03:44:11,690
staff or take a look at the options and doing the research

4678
03:44:11,690 --> 03:44:12,920
and trying to come up

4679
03:44:12,920 --> 03:44:17,870
with a plan that's not a one-size-fits-all that gives

4680
03:44:17,870 --> 03:44:18,559
people some

4681
03:44:18,559 --> 03:44:22,299
flexibility and some opportunity to look at other ways to

4682
03:44:22,299 --> 03:44:23,799
meet our code so I

4683
03:44:23,799 --> 03:44:27,700
appreciate the effort because I think that's the direction

4684
03:44:27,700 --> 03:44:28,639
that our city

4685
03:44:28,639 --> 03:44:32,920
should go in is finding ways to be creative and flexibility

4686
03:44:32,920 --> 03:44:34,040
in working with

4687
03:44:34,040 --> 03:44:37,569
the development community just to be able to make some of

4688
03:44:37,569 --> 03:44:38,760
these projects go

4689
03:44:38,760 --> 03:44:41,870
a little smoother get done quicker less costly for people

4690
03:44:41,870 --> 03:44:43,120
and then there's more

4691
03:44:43,120 --> 03:44:46,100
room sometimes in those projects to provide amenities to

4692
03:44:46,100 --> 03:44:48,200
our city versus

4693
03:44:48,200 --> 03:44:51,579
some of those opportunities get lost because of ineffic

4694
03:44:51,579 --> 03:44:52,360
iencies and

4695
03:44:52,360 --> 03:44:57,149
additional cost that that money could be better used it

4696
03:44:57,149 --> 03:44:59,159
benefits other parties

4697
03:44:59,159 --> 03:45:04,450
and specifically the city that those funds get freed up so

4698
03:45:04,450 --> 03:45:05,719
with that I'm

4699
03:45:05,719 --> 03:45:09,819
gonna look for a motion for continuance Commissioner Smith

4700
03:45:09,819 --> 03:45:11,159
thank you chair thank

4701
03:45:11,159 --> 03:45:13,129
you mr. Jinks for your presentation and thank you for the

4702
03:45:13,129 --> 03:45:13,879
hard work on this I

4703
03:45:13,879 --> 03:45:17,459
make a motion to accept the request for the city staff for

4704
03:45:17,459 --> 03:45:18,739
a continuance on the

4705
03:45:18,739 --> 03:45:24,010
subject to the October 11th P&Z meeting okay commissioner

4706
03:45:24,010 --> 03:45:27,159
back approved second

4707
03:45:29,040 --> 03:45:34,799
we we have a first and a second for continuance to October

4708
03:45:34,799 --> 03:45:36,680
11th seeing no

4709
03:45:36,680 --> 03:45:41,829
further discussion we'll call for a vote on board the

4710
03:45:41,829 --> 03:45:49,200
motion to continue carry

4711
03:45:49,200 --> 03:45:53,709
seven to zero that will take us to our final item this

4712
03:45:53,709 --> 03:45:55,979
evening our project

4713
03:45:55,979 --> 03:46:04,700
matrix mr. chair yes I just want to keep can we get a

4714
03:46:04,700 --> 03:46:05,879
clarification in the

4715
03:46:05,879 --> 03:46:09,750
minutes that it's not a motion to approve as stated on the

4716
03:46:09,750 --> 03:46:10,739
agenda it's a

4717
03:46:10,739 --> 03:46:14,500
motion to approve the continuance and we'll have to modify

4718
03:46:14,500 --> 03:46:15,559
that in the minute

4719
03:46:15,559 --> 03:46:21,309
okay thank you legal for the clarification commissioner

4720
03:46:21,309 --> 03:46:22,799
Ellis thank

4721
03:46:22,799 --> 03:46:25,739
you chair we're on the matrix right yes okay thank you that

4722
03:46:25,739 --> 03:46:28,500
's what I figured so

4723
03:46:28,500 --> 03:46:30,930
I'm just gonna be a broken record and talk about signage

4724
03:46:30,930 --> 03:46:31,440
and these

4725
03:46:31,440 --> 03:46:37,040
notifications and that did we change anything I mean when I

4726
03:46:37,040 --> 03:46:38,600
drove by the lot

4727
03:46:38,600 --> 03:46:42,350
that we had a lot of discussion on today on Janney Street

4728
03:46:42,350 --> 03:46:43,479
there was no sign

4729
03:46:43,479 --> 03:46:46,840
anywhere on that piece of property that talked about a

4730
03:46:46,840 --> 03:46:48,079
public hearing for a

4731
03:46:48,079 --> 03:46:51,950
zoning change with regard to the property on McKinney still

4732
03:46:51,950 --> 03:46:52,639
the teeny

4733
03:46:52,639 --> 03:46:55,780
tiny little sign that you can't read so where are we

4734
03:46:55,780 --> 03:46:58,079
particularly with creating

4735
03:46:58,079 --> 03:47:01,610
some kind of a notice on this property that can be read

4736
03:47:01,610 --> 03:47:03,280
when you're going 50

4737
03:47:03,280 --> 03:47:09,000
miles an hour down a road I'll address that sure the

4738
03:47:09,000 --> 03:47:11,399
schedule is starting on

4739
03:47:11,399 --> 03:47:17,120
October 1st we went to City Council and we adopted an

4740
03:47:17,120 --> 03:47:19,479
ordinance to adjust the

4741
03:47:19,479 --> 03:47:23,680
fee so that was first and then with that we wanted to

4742
03:47:23,680 --> 03:47:25,799
market the fee change and

4743
03:47:25,799 --> 03:47:31,219
also the sign posting new sign size and where they posted

4744
03:47:31,219 --> 03:47:32,639
as well so we can do

4745
03:47:32,639 --> 03:47:36,299
that concurrently with the sign ordinance that was just

4746
03:47:36,299 --> 03:47:37,159
passed or the

4747
03:47:37,159 --> 03:47:41,129
fee ordinance that was just passed so starting October 1st

4748
03:47:41,129 --> 03:47:42,239
we see new signs

4749
03:47:42,239 --> 03:47:44,809
this we have to do something right so we right now we're

4750
03:47:44,809 --> 03:47:46,440
currently advertising

4751
03:47:46,440 --> 03:47:49,649
this to applicants so that they know in advance and so that

4752
03:47:49,649 --> 03:47:50,600
they're not caught

4753
03:47:50,600 --> 03:47:53,629
off guard that they have to post these signs they are going

4754
03:47:53,629 --> 03:47:54,200
to be responsible

4755
03:47:54,200 --> 03:47:58,600
for obtaining as well as posting these signs from here

4756
03:47:58,600 --> 03:48:00,559
forward from October 1st

4757
03:48:00,559 --> 03:48:05,090
forward of anything that is correct so so what are

4758
03:48:05,090 --> 03:48:06,399
applications we get you know

4759
03:48:06,399 --> 03:48:10,319
starting October 1st these individuals will know in advance

4760
03:48:10,319 --> 03:48:11,559
that they will have

4761
03:48:11,559 --> 03:48:13,920
to post signs with that's hopefully you'll see okay so

4762
03:48:13,920 --> 03:48:14,959
anything prior is

4763
03:48:14,959 --> 03:48:18,500
correct would not so hopefully in a month you'll see some

4764
03:48:18,500 --> 03:48:19,760
signs that are much

4765
03:48:19,760 --> 03:48:23,440
larger than what we currently have okay excellent thank you

4766
03:48:23,440 --> 03:48:25,959
good question

4767
03:48:26,079 --> 03:48:34,420
anybody else okay thank you everyone with that I will close

4768
03:48:34,420 --> 03:48:35,040
our meeting this

4769
03:48:35,040 --> 03:48:39,840
evening at 925 thank you everyone