1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:05,000 Five, four, three. 2 00:00:05,000 --> 00:00:07,500 Welcome to the Planning and Zoning Commission regular 3 00:00:07,500 --> 00:00:10,000 meeting for May 24th, 2017. 4 00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:13,119 This meeting has been duly posted and has a quorum present, 5 00:00:13,119 --> 00:00:16,000 and I call the meeting to order at 6.30 p.m. 6 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:19,149 Our first order of business is the pledge to the U.S. and 7 00:00:19,149 --> 00:00:25,000 Texas flag. Please rise. 8 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:29,269 I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of 9 00:00:29,269 --> 00:00:33,539 America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation 10 00:00:33,539 --> 00:00:40,000 under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. 11 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:48,390 I honor the Texas flag. I pledge allegiance to the Texas, 12 00:00:48,390 --> 00:00:55,000 one state, under God, one, indivisible. 13 00:00:55,000 --> 00:01:00,759 Our next order of business is the approval of the Planning 14 00:01:00,759 --> 00:01:06,000 and Zoning Commission minutes for our last meeting. 15 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:11,560 Commissioner Ellis. Thank you. Commissioner Rossell. No, I 16 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:14,000 'm Commissioner Taylor. Sorry. 17 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:20,000 I make a motion to approve the minutes from May 10th, 2017. 18 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:23,000 Commissioner Beck. Second. 19 00:01:23,000 --> 00:01:27,000 We have a motion and a second. Any discussion? 20 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:42,000 We'll vote on the board. 21 00:01:42,000 --> 00:01:50,000 The motion passes 4 to 0 with one refusal. 22 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:57,000 Our next item for consideration is the consent agenda. 23 00:01:57,000 --> 00:02:02,000 Commissioner Beck. I move we approve the consent agenda. 24 00:02:02,000 --> 00:02:05,000 Commissioner Rossell. Second. 25 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:21,000 We have a motion and a second. We'll vote on the board. 26 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:25,000 The consent agenda passes 5 to 0. 27 00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:29,639 Now we move on to our public hearings portion of the agenda 28 00:02:29,639 --> 00:02:30,000 . 29 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:35,379 Our first public hearing is HL17-0001, a public hearing 30 00:02:35,379 --> 00:02:37,520 making a recommendation to city council regarding the 31 00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:40,490 designation of O'Neill Ford Civic Complex as a local 32 00:02:40,490 --> 00:02:42,000 historic landmark. 33 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:48,000 And I will open the public hearing at this time. 34 00:02:48,000 --> 00:02:54,000 Chandra. Can you introduce the presenter? 35 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:59,000 I will introduce Roman McCallan up to do the presentation. 36 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:06,000 Thank you. Thank you, commissioners. 37 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:12,000 This item is a request to 38 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:32,490 HL17-0001, a public hearing making a recommendation to city 39 00:03:32,490 --> 00:03:33,340 council regarding the designation of the O'Neill Ford Civic 40 00:03:33,340 --> 00:03:34,000 Complex as a local historic landmark. 41 00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:41,520 This item is a request to HL17-0001, a public hearing 42 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:43,409 making a recommendation to city council regarding the 43 00:03:43,409 --> 00:03:45,280 designation of O'Neill Ford Civic Complex as a local 44 00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:46,000 historic landmark. 45 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:48,000 And I will open the public hearing at this time. 46 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:54,000 I will introduce Roman McCallan up to do the presentation. 47 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:57,469 In this particular situation with this historic landmark, 48 00:03:57,469 --> 00:04:01,310 the first one of 2017, I'm completely not worthy to loosen 49 00:04:01,310 --> 00:04:04,000 the straps of this landmark designation. 50 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:08,919 It was really begun in 1993 by Mike Cochran, Peggy Capps, 51 00:04:08,919 --> 00:04:13,039 and many of Denton's early preservationists who got this 52 00:04:13,039 --> 00:04:14,000 started. 53 00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:17,959 There's a landmark out in the courtyard here that was put 54 00:04:17,959 --> 00:04:22,779 in the ground in 1993 that appears to designate the complex 55 00:04:22,779 --> 00:04:25,000 as a landmark, but there was never an ordinance passed. 56 00:04:25,000 --> 00:04:28,040 And what we're doing now is just formally going back 57 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:31,110 through the process once more, make sure we have an 58 00:04:31,110 --> 00:04:34,000 ordinance attached with that designation. 59 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:38,449 This will assure that what is destroyed or what is built 60 00:04:38,449 --> 00:04:43,300 within these boundaries in this historically significant 61 00:04:43,300 --> 00:04:47,000 area will have an added level of security. 62 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:52,720 At 23 years old, in 1929, O'Neill Ford designed a home on 63 00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:56,000 North Bell Street for Mary Marshall. 64 00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:59,430 It's now known as the Gertrude Gibson House, and that name 65 00:04:59,430 --> 00:05:02,860 was subsequent to the home being bequeathed to Texas Women 66 00:05:02,860 --> 00:05:04,000 's University. 67 00:05:04,000 --> 00:05:07,949 Thirty-eight years later, this structure was designed, the 68 00:05:07,949 --> 00:05:10,000 building we're in right now. 69 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:15,279 So again, it's really difficult to overplay the 70 00:05:15,279 --> 00:05:17,000 significance of it. 71 00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:20,620 This is the Tower of the Americas in San Antonio, 750 feet 72 00:05:20,620 --> 00:05:23,000 tall, also designed by O'Neill Ford. 73 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:26,000 He was an advocate for historic preservation. 74 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:29,000 This is a note from his obituary in the New York Times. 75 00:05:29,000 --> 00:05:33,149 I didn't realize he had done significant work on the Paseo 76 00:05:33,149 --> 00:05:37,009 del Rio in San Antonio, which is known otherwise as the 77 00:05:37,009 --> 00:05:38,000 River Walk. 78 00:05:38,000 --> 00:05:41,660 He also worked on the La Vijita structures, which are now a 79 00:05:41,660 --> 00:05:45,600 national landmark, and those structures were built between 80 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:48,000 1818 and 1880. 81 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:50,649 Then there's this other list of buildings, the Skidmore 82 00:05:50,649 --> 00:05:53,290 College in New York, buildings for Texas Instrument and 83 00:05:53,290 --> 00:05:55,000 many homes for their executives, 84 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:57,680 campus of Trinity University's Master Plan and many of the 85 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:00,680 buildings on that campus, buildings at the University of 86 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:02,000 Dallas campus in Irving, 87 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:04,579 and the Selwyn School here, just to name a few of the 88 00:06:04,579 --> 00:06:06,000 properties we worked on. 89 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:09,300 Here is the dining hall of the Selwyn School, here located 90 00:06:09,300 --> 00:06:11,000 off of University Drive. 91 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:13,170 This is actually an endangered structure in my mind. I don 92 00:06:13,170 --> 00:06:15,000 't think we'll be able to have it much longer. 93 00:06:15,000 --> 00:06:18,000 The Selwyn School is relocating. It's unknown where that 94 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:22,000 property will go, but just an example of a fine building. 95 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:24,680 There was a fire in that building. You often hear there's 96 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:26,000 not much left of those buildings to save, 97 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:29,610 but that smoke damage you see over the doors in the back 98 00:06:29,610 --> 00:06:32,509 there is the only -- there's a kitchen back there, and that 99 00:06:32,509 --> 00:06:34,000 's really what was damaged. 100 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:37,000 The structures weren't damaged much. 101 00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:39,079 This is just an interesting photo. You can't overplay the 102 00:06:39,079 --> 00:06:41,000 woodwork of his brother, Lynn Ford. 103 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:44,389 This is just a home I saw listed either in Houston or 104 00:06:44,389 --> 00:06:47,000 Dallas recently for $2 million. 105 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:52,860 His homes are really popular. This is a home in Dallas done 106 00:06:52,860 --> 00:06:57,000 for the Brombergs, still in existence today. 107 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,600 This is a home in San Antonio, which I sold. This is an 108 00:06:59,600 --> 00:07:04,000 article in the San Antonio Express, the Dr. Wong residence, 109 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:07,000 which was bought and then on an AIA home tour. 110 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:11,529 The archives of O'Neill Ford are kept at the University of 111 00:07:11,529 --> 00:07:15,000 Texas School of Architecture in Austin. 112 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:18,149 There's a chair, an endowed chair. The first endowed chair 113 00:07:18,149 --> 00:07:21,000 of that architecture school is named for O'Neill Ford. 114 00:07:21,000 --> 00:07:24,000 This is the current professor holding that position. 115 00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:27,709 The best known structure that we -- that people know of 116 00:07:27,709 --> 00:07:31,500 when they think of O'Neill Ford is the little chapel in the 117 00:07:31,500 --> 00:07:32,000 woods here 118 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:34,860 of Texas Women's University campus, which was dedicated in 119 00:07:34,860 --> 00:07:37,000 1939, just 10 years again. 120 00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:40,709 So then he would have been only 33 years old and at that 121 00:07:40,709 --> 00:07:44,000 point working with a man by the name of Arch Swank. 122 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:47,689 And he designed -- this is Arch Swank, a photo of Arch Sw 123 00:07:47,689 --> 00:07:51,000 ank and a professor of art who worked on that window 124 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:53,470 that's right above her head with students. This was 125 00:07:53,470 --> 00:07:56,000 actually built as a WPA project for the youth. 126 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:59,000 So many youth worked on this project. 127 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:01,600 I think O'Neill Ford must have been quite industrious at 128 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:03,000 seeking those projects. 129 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:06,279 Lava Hitta in San Antonio was also a WPA project. So he was 130 00:08:06,279 --> 00:08:07,000 looking for work. 131 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:11,639 He wasn't unlike -- well, he was an architect that didn't 132 00:08:11,639 --> 00:08:13,000 come from means. 133 00:08:13,000 --> 00:08:14,980 And as you probably already know, he doesn't have an 134 00:08:14,980 --> 00:08:16,000 architecture degree. 135 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:19,180 He studied two years at the University of North Texas and 136 00:08:19,180 --> 00:08:21,000 then didn't have the money to finish 137 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:24,829 and went to international correspondence school or did his 138 00:08:24,829 --> 00:08:28,000 certificate of architecture through the mail 139 00:08:28,000 --> 00:08:31,000 through an international correspondence school in Chicago 140 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:34,000 and became really just one of the most prominent architects 141 00:08:34,000 --> 00:08:38,000 in the country or certainly in the southern states. 142 00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:41,710 Here, what we're talking about, land marking, all these 143 00:08:41,710 --> 00:08:44,000 markers are on the site already. 144 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:47,370 The two state markers for Quaker Town, one state marker for 145 00:08:47,370 --> 00:08:50,000 O'Neill Ford himself over by the library. 146 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:53,690 We have the Quaker Town historic landmark. It is a local 147 00:08:53,690 --> 00:08:55,000 landmark already. 148 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:58,970 This beautiful fountain, I don't even know, in 1911 149 00:08:58,970 --> 00:09:02,000 presented by the National Humane Alliance. 150 00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:05,000 I'm not familiar with that group. 151 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:09,269 Pay no attention to Gerard Ford's 1976. I thought this 152 00:09:09,269 --> 00:09:13,000 district picked up the big post office, 153 00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:16,000 but it doesn't pick up that district. 154 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:19,320 So what it does pick up is the Emily Fowler Library, which 155 00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:23,000 was designed by Wyatt Hendrick in 1949. 156 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:26,299 Ford himself designed the first edition in 1969 and then 157 00:09:26,299 --> 00:09:31,000 the second edition was completed by the Ford-Powell-Carson 158 00:09:31,000 --> 00:09:34,509 architecture firm, which still exists. It's in San Antonio 159 00:09:34,509 --> 00:09:36,000 today. 160 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:38,000 You kind of see his work anywhere you go. 161 00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:40,460 There you have the ceramic light fixtures, which are so 162 00:09:40,460 --> 00:09:43,549 significant that were designed, probably made by his 163 00:09:43,549 --> 00:09:46,000 brother, Lin Ford. 164 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:49,950 Then you have this building, of course, the Civic Center, 165 00:09:49,950 --> 00:09:52,000 designed in 1966. 166 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:54,440 I'm leaving out so much. That building has a sister 167 00:09:54,440 --> 00:09:58,000 building exactly like it in San Antonio with the same 168 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:00,000 spiral structure on the interior. 169 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:02,000 It's a civic complex there. 170 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:06,000 Of the pool structures, I believe this is all that's left, 171 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:08,419 these light fixtures that are on the perimeter of the pool 172 00:10:08,419 --> 00:10:09,000 structure. 173 00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:12,000 There may be some other element there within the property, 174 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:15,000 but I'm sorry Mike didn't come in tonight. 175 00:10:15,000 --> 00:10:17,149 He was going to come and present to you all tonight. I'm 176 00:10:17,149 --> 00:10:19,000 not sure what happened, but who began? 177 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:22,720 Mike was really, if you go back to your packets, when the 178 00:10:22,720 --> 00:10:27,409 swimming pool structures were demolished, it really created 179 00:10:27,409 --> 00:10:28,000 quite a stir 180 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:31,200 and people were very concerned about that. There were some 181 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:33,000 letters about that. 182 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:36,159 This building, I don't know who designed it, but it's our 183 00:10:36,159 --> 00:10:44,000 senior center, which clearly kept in the modern style with 184 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:48,000 the low diminished structure within the landscape. 185 00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:50,409 It has the ceramic light fixtures that you can see on the 186 00:10:50,409 --> 00:10:53,309 left on the side of the building. I think it fits well 187 00:10:53,309 --> 00:10:55,000 within the property. 188 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:57,870 The Denton Women's Club is a local landmark, and I don't 189 00:10:57,870 --> 00:11:00,289 know its history. I can look at it and guess it was 190 00:11:00,289 --> 00:11:02,000 probably built around 1930. 191 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:07,350 It is itself a designated landmark. In your packets, there 192 00:11:07,350 --> 00:11:11,000 was a letter from the lawyer from the Denton Women's Club 193 00:11:11,000 --> 00:11:14,120 that they wanted to make sure their property was a part of 194 00:11:14,120 --> 00:11:16,000 the O'Neill-Ford Civic Complex. 195 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:19,559 That's why we've kept that in there. There's a picture of 196 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:28,000 that landmark. If this historic landmark passes through, 197 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:30,000 everything on the site will be protected. 198 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:33,149 Any work done in this area will have to go before Landmark 199 00:11:33,149 --> 00:11:36,799 Commission, so this beautiful sculpture that's on the site 200 00:11:36,799 --> 00:11:41,000 would be protected, as well as the Pops Carter site. 201 00:11:41,000 --> 00:11:44,690 Everything that goes on there would have to go through that 202 00:11:44,690 --> 00:11:47,210 review process. The Historic Landmark Commission met and 203 00:11:47,210 --> 00:11:52,000 recommended approval, and we recommend approval as well. 204 00:11:52,000 --> 00:11:59,000 Do you all have any questions about this? 205 00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:01,000 Commissioner Sullivan. 206 00:12:01,000 --> 00:12:04,000 Thank you. 207 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:09,279 My big concern is with the number of government buildings 208 00:12:09,279 --> 00:12:14,120 that are involved. How does that work with, as you say, if 209 00:12:14,120 --> 00:12:17,450 any renovation needs to be done, it has to go through the 210 00:12:17,450 --> 00:12:19,000 Historic District. 211 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:22,919 What would that involve and how much additional cost would 212 00:12:22,919 --> 00:12:26,210 that incur for a governmental, you know, like whether it's 213 00:12:26,210 --> 00:12:31,000 the Civic Center, the swimming pool, all these things. 214 00:12:31,000 --> 00:12:36,279 What is the time and dollars necessary to go through that 215 00:12:36,279 --> 00:12:41,000 process and the possible saying, "Y'all can't do that." 216 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:43,000 That's my concern. 217 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:46,419 Sure. That's a good question. So we're making a local, we 218 00:12:46,419 --> 00:12:49,720 're making a historic landmark designation. If this goes 219 00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:53,000 through, the city is designating this property. 220 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:55,519 It's a little different. It is the city's property, 221 00:12:55,519 --> 00:12:58,480 essentially, except for, I believe, the Denton Women's Club 222 00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:01,190 , and I don't know if that's on a long-term lease. I'm not 223 00:13:01,190 --> 00:13:02,000 even positive about that. 224 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:04,879 But it would be that any work would be reviewed by the Land 225 00:13:04,879 --> 00:13:08,330 mark Commission. There's no fee to have the work reviewed by 226 00:13:08,330 --> 00:13:10,000 the Landmark Commission. 227 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:12,830 But the Landmark Commission would have to approve 228 00:13:12,830 --> 00:13:14,000 modifications. 229 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:17,190 For example, we kind of had a little bit of a flare-up when 230 00:13:17,190 --> 00:13:20,549 the doors here to this facility recently were removed, the 231 00:13:20,549 --> 00:13:24,000 wooden carved doors that were just down this corridor. 232 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:26,850 Some work was done, and the old preservationists of Denton 233 00:13:26,850 --> 00:13:29,639 and Mike Cochran and the people who appreciate Neil Ford's 234 00:13:29,639 --> 00:13:33,039 work and know that his brother carved those doors and 235 00:13:33,039 --> 00:13:36,620 probably worked on the different beads of carving that you 236 00:13:36,620 --> 00:13:39,000 see in her space between here and this. 237 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:44,000 I don't know about that piece. It looks a little newer. But 238 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:44,000 the whole, all the woodwork, so that raised a little bit of 239 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:44,000 a stir. 240 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:47,279 And normally that work of exterior work, typically you're 241 00:13:47,279 --> 00:13:50,500 just dealing with exterior work, has to be reviewed by the 242 00:13:50,500 --> 00:13:52,000 Landmark Commission. 243 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:55,929 For example, we have some work that's going to be done here 244 00:13:55,929 --> 00:13:59,639 in the lobby, and that work would probably just be approved 245 00:13:59,639 --> 00:14:02,899 by the Historic Preservation Officer because it's just 246 00:14:02,899 --> 00:14:04,000 interior work. 247 00:14:04,000 --> 00:14:10,000 But not really any added cost. Time-wise, it's a local, it 248 00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:12,000 doesn't go to the state, it doesn't go to the federal. 249 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:15,789 It's something we do here internally. We can expedite, we 250 00:14:15,789 --> 00:14:18,830 can hold a special meeting, we can have our Landmark 251 00:14:18,830 --> 00:14:23,470 Commission come together quickly to make a decision if it's 252 00:14:23,470 --> 00:14:25,000 ever necessary. 253 00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:28,330 If this had been done, for example, a little earlier, the 254 00:14:28,330 --> 00:14:31,320 Denton County Jail was demolished here that was in the 255 00:14:31,320 --> 00:14:34,000 parking lot, and I hadn't been here very long. 256 00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:37,059 I couldn't find a true ordinance that protected that. I 257 00:14:37,059 --> 00:14:39,899 would have liked to have a little bit broader discussion 258 00:14:39,899 --> 00:14:42,850 about that building and its possibility of being repurposed 259 00:14:42,850 --> 00:14:44,000 , but we weren't able to do that. 260 00:14:44,000 --> 00:14:47,940 But from here forward, if someone wants to raise this 261 00:14:47,940 --> 00:14:52,129 building or any of the buildings, then it would have to go 262 00:14:52,129 --> 00:14:55,549 before the Landmark Commission. Now, the Landmark 263 00:14:55,549 --> 00:14:57,399 Commission, say, denied something that the city or somebody 264 00:14:57,399 --> 00:14:58,000 wanted to do. 265 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:02,320 Well, the decisions of that commission are appealable. They 266 00:15:02,320 --> 00:15:06,399 would be appealable, I believe, to this body first and then 267 00:15:06,399 --> 00:15:10,080 to the City Council or straight to the City Council to be 268 00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:11,000 reviewed. 269 00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:15,320 So not a lot of cost, a little bit of layer of prevention, 270 00:15:15,320 --> 00:15:18,960 but then this is pretty hallowed ground from what I know in 271 00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:23,230 my little time here in Denton. It includes the Quaker Town 272 00:15:23,230 --> 00:15:26,000 Park area with its history too. 273 00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:29,710 It just allows us to take a little breath when we're 274 00:15:29,710 --> 00:15:33,669 dealing with this large sort of public land here in the 275 00:15:33,669 --> 00:15:37,950 middle of the city with these structures, three of which 276 00:15:37,950 --> 00:15:42,000 were affected by this very prominent architect. 277 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:45,870 So just to continue. So the Quaker Town does not have its 278 00:15:45,870 --> 00:15:47,000 own designation? 279 00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:48,000 It is. 280 00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:49,000 Because I thought it did. 281 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:52,460 The park itself is a historic landmark. That's right. It's 282 00:15:52,460 --> 00:15:56,000 kind of overlapping that. That's a good point to call out. 283 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:58,309 That park already, any work that's done on the park would 284 00:15:58,309 --> 00:15:59,000 have that. 285 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:02,529 Now, I think it's important. It's probably not bad. You're 286 00:16:02,529 --> 00:16:05,000 overlapping it. The boundaries overlap that boundary. 287 00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:09,000 But then it's, we had in your backup plan that in the 90s 288 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:12,919 where the O'Neill Ford Civic Complex was designated and it 289 00:16:12,919 --> 00:16:15,000 overlapped in that regard. 290 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:17,000 Thank you. Appreciate it. 291 00:16:17,000 --> 00:16:20,000 Commissioner Roselle. Thank you Commissioner Taylor. 292 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:22,750 First, I have a couple questions but I first want to say 293 00:16:22,750 --> 00:16:25,519 that this was really interesting to come through and be 294 00:16:25,519 --> 00:16:27,000 able to read and research. 295 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:29,120 You and I had a lot of discussions about historic 296 00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:31,750 preservation so this one's more even more enjoyable to kind 297 00:16:31,750 --> 00:16:34,500 of proceed forward and know his recognition. I was a 298 00:16:34,500 --> 00:16:38,090 student at Selwyn and actually by circumstances lived at 299 00:16:38,090 --> 00:16:41,029 Selwyn for a little bit so it's really cool to see that 300 00:16:41,029 --> 00:16:43,000 kind of talked about in this discussion as well. 301 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:45,870 So thanks for being here and bringing this forth. I had two 302 00:16:45,870 --> 00:16:49,299 questions just so I knew how it got here. Was this, how did 303 00:16:49,299 --> 00:16:52,679 this get initiated? Was this all the way from 93? How did 304 00:16:52,679 --> 00:16:55,000 it kind of resurface? 305 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:58,549 Well, I don't, I read a lot of what we had available, the 306 00:16:58,549 --> 00:17:02,049 emails, not emails, but the letters that went back and 307 00:17:02,049 --> 00:17:05,880 forth. And I really wish Mike had shown up. He was going to 308 00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:09,569 be here tonight. I'm sure he's going to, so wherever he is 309 00:17:09,569 --> 00:17:13,000 he's thinking, I forgot to come to the planning. 310 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:16,589 But those people, there were early preservationists here 311 00:17:16,589 --> 00:17:20,049 and for example Peggy Capswell and Mike Cochran is another 312 00:17:20,049 --> 00:17:23,630 layer. You might remember some of the other names but some 313 00:17:23,630 --> 00:17:28,559 of those early preservationists, Mike really, Mr. Cochran 314 00:17:28,559 --> 00:17:32,670 really spearheaded the effort to create the historic 315 00:17:32,670 --> 00:17:33,000 landmark. 316 00:17:33,000 --> 00:17:36,440 And I know that marker is out there in the courtyard today 317 00:17:36,440 --> 00:17:39,630 because of him and he sent me an email to say I'm really 318 00:17:39,630 --> 00:17:43,880 glad you're kind of putting, finishing the job. I don't, 319 00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:48,259 and I asked everyone, our city secretary for records, every 320 00:17:48,259 --> 00:17:49,000 record we had. 321 00:17:49,000 --> 00:17:53,420 I couldn't figure out why this last step didn't go through 322 00:17:53,420 --> 00:17:58,039 or, you know, if it was just maybe the planning department 323 00:17:58,039 --> 00:18:03,029 was very busy and it just, somebody, the ball got dropped. 324 00:18:03,029 --> 00:18:04,000 But it was begun by early preservation. 325 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:07,130 Why for you now is a little bit of a mixture of things. It 326 00:18:07,130 --> 00:18:09,859 was talked about by the current historic landmark 327 00:18:09,859 --> 00:18:12,930 commission but also an assistant city manager actually 328 00:18:12,930 --> 00:18:15,000 brought it to my attention again. 329 00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:17,900 Hey, is that, is, the question was asked, is the property 330 00:18:17,900 --> 00:18:20,990 landmark or not? Is there, and the answer is there was no 331 00:18:20,990 --> 00:18:24,000 formal ordinance that passed so we brought it forward. 332 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:27,750 Gotcha. That's hopefully the only other question I have is 333 00:18:27,750 --> 00:18:30,769 in my architectural ignorance, it seems like the post 334 00:18:30,769 --> 00:18:34,119 office does resemblance, resemble some of the architectural 335 00:18:34,119 --> 00:18:38,000 themes. Why is that not included in this parcel and kind of 336 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:38,000 not. 337 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:41,119 That's a good question, Andrew. I actually just earlier 338 00:18:41,119 --> 00:18:43,990 today was thinking that was that we, the boundary went 339 00:18:43,990 --> 00:18:46,299 around there. I hadn't really, so what happens, I 340 00:18:46,299 --> 00:18:48,259 photographed the area this morning and I thought it's a 341 00:18:48,259 --> 00:18:50,000 good thing we're picking up the post office. 342 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:56,109 And then I was just reminded that the map doesn't go that 343 00:18:56,109 --> 00:18:59,490 far. What I do know is that the city owns almost all the 344 00:18:59,490 --> 00:19:02,000 property we're looking at designating now. 345 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:05,589 And when we do historic landmarks in Denton, I don't think 346 00:19:05,589 --> 00:19:09,359 there's any precedent for doing a historic landmark without 347 00:19:09,359 --> 00:19:11,000 the owner's consent. 348 00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:14,849 And I don't know but it might be a federal, federally owned 349 00:19:14,849 --> 00:19:18,440 property, the post office. And so it's not owned by so I 350 00:19:18,440 --> 00:19:21,880 rather than dig into that question too deeply I thought to 351 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:26,180 myself well, getting, getting that approval or consent of 352 00:19:26,180 --> 00:19:29,720 that owner to Dan who designated might be a challenge 353 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:31,000 anyway. 354 00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:33,779 I'm glad you appreciate the bill. A lot of people don't 355 00:19:33,779 --> 00:19:36,109 appreciate, I think that bill is pretty fantastic and in 356 00:19:36,109 --> 00:19:38,410 about 100 years if it's still here it's really going to be 357 00:19:38,410 --> 00:19:39,000 special. 358 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:41,869 But it's got to get there first. And so right now it doesn 359 00:19:41,869 --> 00:19:46,420 't look that appealing but you when you land on that with it 360 00:19:46,420 --> 00:19:51,069 's probably when you land on that with your personal flying 361 00:19:51,069 --> 00:19:54,000 device it's going to fit right in. 362 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:58,200 It looks like the Jetsons, you know, the doors slide up and 363 00:19:58,200 --> 00:20:01,819 fly out of it or something like that. I mean it, it, it 364 00:20:01,819 --> 00:20:04,509 happens and then it's right across of course from the much 365 00:20:04,509 --> 00:20:07,150 older old federal post office which is in private hands I 366 00:20:07,150 --> 00:20:08,000 believe today. 367 00:20:08,000 --> 00:20:12,660 Another fantastic building. So this to me was, I would love 368 00:20:12,660 --> 00:20:15,319 to have that boundary pushed over but boy, I don't think T 369 00:20:15,319 --> 00:20:18,210 rey would, I mean, consent, you know, getting consent from 370 00:20:18,210 --> 00:20:21,349 the federal government how would we have gotten that, and 371 00:20:21,349 --> 00:20:22,000 we can. 372 00:20:22,000 --> 00:20:25,500 Certainly something could be brushed when time allows to 373 00:20:25,500 --> 00:20:28,000 see. I don't know. Sure. 374 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:31,019 Well I'm excited nonetheless of what we have what you've 375 00:20:31,019 --> 00:20:34,109 done and the historic commission, putting this through 376 00:20:34,109 --> 00:20:37,000 unanimously to us so thank you. Okay. 377 00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:41,000 Thank you. Any further questions for. 378 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:45,000 Thank you. Thank you. 379 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:51,950 This is a public hearing. Anybody who wishes to speak in 380 00:20:51,950 --> 00:20:58,000 favor or opposition can come forward at this time. 381 00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:01,089 And please state your name and address when you get to the 382 00:21:01,089 --> 00:21:02,000 microphone. 383 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:06,000 You'll have three minutes to speak. 384 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:07,000 Hello. 385 00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:11,559 My name is Masood Ibrahim. I own the property at 406 North 386 00:21:11,559 --> 00:21:15,000 Bell. I've been there since 1994. 387 00:21:15,000 --> 00:21:20,539 And the question that I have is what restriction is going 388 00:21:20,539 --> 00:21:26,000 to put on the property owners once you pass this zoning. 389 00:21:26,000 --> 00:21:30,420 So, the, you're asking about restrictions on your property 390 00:21:30,420 --> 00:21:34,390 on both to build or to tear building down or something like 391 00:21:34,390 --> 00:21:35,000 that. 392 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:42,819 This is all of that zoning that we can we can have staff 393 00:21:42,819 --> 00:21:47,000 answer that question. 394 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:52,000 Hello sir, if you're, if you're not in that area. 395 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:55,000 You have really no effect. 396 00:21:55,000 --> 00:22:01,440 Any permitting you do or anything you do with your 397 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:05,309 structure just adapts. There's no. Yes, it's a good 398 00:22:05,309 --> 00:22:07,109 question. Sometimes when you have some cities have a have a 399 00:22:07,109 --> 00:22:11,380 boundary that they say if you have a local landmark, then 400 00:22:11,380 --> 00:22:13,000 within a certain number of feet around it. 401 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:20,000 But we don't have that. 402 00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:29,000 This is a public hearing. Does anybody else wish to speak 403 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:29,000 in favor or against. 404 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:32,859 Seeing no further interest I will close the public hearing 405 00:22:32,859 --> 00:22:35,000 and open this to discussion. 406 00:22:35,000 --> 00:22:43,000 Commissioner Beck. 407 00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:49,000 I move we approve HL 170001. 408 00:22:49,000 --> 00:22:52,000 Commissioner is out. I second that. 409 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:57,000 Is there any further discussion. 410 00:22:57,000 --> 00:23:07,900 Seeing no further discussion I'll call for a vote on the 411 00:23:07,900 --> 00:23:09,000 board. 412 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:14,000 And the motion passes five to zero. 413 00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:19,250 Our final item of business tonight is the planning and 414 00:23:19,250 --> 00:23:22,000 zoning Commission project matrix. 415 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:25,000 Does anybody have anything that I have to add or review. 416 00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:28,000 Commissioner Ellis. Thank you, Vice Chair. 417 00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:31,430 Question on where we stand with the tree ordinance. I kind 418 00:23:31,430 --> 00:23:36,519 of I'm confused at where that is now out there. So can we 419 00:23:36,519 --> 00:23:38,000 get an update. 420 00:23:38,000 --> 00:23:45,569 We actually postponed. Well, we we postponed moving forward 421 00:23:45,569 --> 00:23:47,569 on that until the state legislature could wrap up this 422 00:23:47,569 --> 00:23:52,369 session because there was some bills that would affect the 423 00:23:52,369 --> 00:23:56,160 way we calculate and implement tree mitigation and 424 00:23:56,160 --> 00:23:57,000 preservation. 425 00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:02,279 So after they close at the end of this month, we do hope to 426 00:24:02,279 --> 00:24:06,519 present a schedule for how we will resume with the tree 427 00:24:06,519 --> 00:24:11,000 code update. But it's we should read restart that in June. 428 00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:16,289 And do you know just you're just going to start from the 429 00:24:16,289 --> 00:24:18,000 beginning again or okay. 430 00:24:18,000 --> 00:24:25,000 Okay. Okay. That's what I want to know. Thank you. 431 00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:29,720 Commissioner is out. Thank you. And we shouldn't start over 432 00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:32,000 on that. Just keep going. 433 00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:34,440 I had a question about and I think there's my name and 434 00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:37,680 email. So forgive me if I am missing an email. But what's 435 00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:41,660 going on with the staff initiated subcommittee for rezoning 436 00:24:41,660 --> 00:24:42,000 . 437 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:45,210 There was we had that subcommittee planned and then there's 438 00:24:45,210 --> 00:24:47,500 got table. Then there's gonna be a city council meeting 439 00:24:47,500 --> 00:24:50,000 together. Then that got pushed. 440 00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:52,700 And so I just wanted to see where that stands. I think 441 00:24:52,700 --> 00:24:55,869 there's a subcommittee meeting coming up. But if I could 442 00:24:55,869 --> 00:25:06,000 just get a status to address that question. 443 00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:12,329 Commissioner result that committee is still in place. 444 00:25:12,329 --> 00:25:15,509 Unfortunately, we are directed to not conclude a meeting 445 00:25:15,509 --> 00:25:18,289 until or commence a meeting until we have that joint 446 00:25:18,289 --> 00:25:20,000 meeting with the council. 447 00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:24,259 That being said, we have also the development code update 448 00:25:24,259 --> 00:25:27,910 that's that's up and going as well. So a lot of that's 449 00:25:27,910 --> 00:25:30,000 pending that that process as well. 450 00:25:30,000 --> 00:25:33,539 So really, we've got some items that we want to take 451 00:25:33,539 --> 00:25:37,589 forward, but not ready to do so until after that meeting is 452 00:25:37,589 --> 00:25:40,000 scheduled with the city council. 453 00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:43,000 And there's been no set definitive time on that meeting. 454 00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:48,000 Not not yet. It's time now. Okay. Yeah. Thanks. 455 00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:51,460 I did want to remind you guys that we do have the open 456 00:25:51,460 --> 00:25:55,289 house, the public kickoff meeting for the DDC rewrite 457 00:25:55,289 --> 00:25:59,650 coming up on June 6th. I think is a Wednesday, June 7th is 458 00:25:59,650 --> 00:26:01,000 a Wednesday. 459 00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:04,549 And then we also will meet that week with the for the first 460 00:26:04,549 --> 00:26:08,630 time with the PNC subcommittee on the DDC rewrite. So just 461 00:26:08,630 --> 00:26:11,000 that's on the 13th. 462 00:26:11,000 --> 00:26:15,410 So committee or is the seventh. It's that week is the week 463 00:26:15,410 --> 00:26:19,740 of the fifth. So I have an email about that. Okay. I'll see 464 00:26:19,740 --> 00:26:22,000 . I'll send that out just to remind everybody. 465 00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:27,000 That sounds awesome. Thank you. 466 00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:33,000 Seeing no other request to speak. I will close. 467 00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:42,380 The planning and zoning commission concludes its meeting at 468 00:26:42,380 --> 00:26:45,000 7 p.m..