1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,350
Good afternoon and welcome to the City of Denton Planning

2
00:00:03,350 --> 00:00:04,259
and Zoning Commission

3
00:00:04,259 --> 00:00:11,240
work session for March the 8th 2017. This meeting has been

4
00:00:11,240 --> 00:00:12,359
duly posted and we

5
00:00:12,359 --> 00:00:15,849
have a quorum present and I will call our meeting to order

6
00:00:15,849 --> 00:00:17,960
at 5 o 7 and at

7
00:00:17,960 --> 00:00:20,739
this time I will turn the meeting over to Manal for

8
00:00:20,739 --> 00:00:22,280
clarification of agenda

9
00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:28,079
items. Thank You Chairperson Strange. If it's the wish of

10
00:00:28,079 --> 00:00:28,600
the Commission,

11
00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:32,380
Chairperson Strange would we like to go ahead and announce

12
00:00:32,380 --> 00:00:33,460
the order of the

13
00:00:33,460 --> 00:00:36,990
agenda items for just discussion tonight at the work

14
00:00:36,990 --> 00:00:39,079
session? Sure. And to move

15
00:00:39,079 --> 00:00:45,149
item 5A to the bottom to the last item on as part of the

16
00:00:45,149 --> 00:00:46,920
discussion so A would

17
00:00:46,920 --> 00:00:54,710
move and be heard or discussed and presented after E, 5E.

18
00:00:54,710 --> 00:00:57,479
And with that we

19
00:00:57,479 --> 00:01:00,750
can dive into the first item of the agenda which are the

20
00:01:00,750 --> 00:01:01,920
plots. We have a

21
00:01:01,920 --> 00:01:09,400
preliminary plot for the Mission Street offices and if

22
00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:11,000
there are any questions

23
00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:14,579
of the Commission of staff from the Commission I'd be happy

24
00:01:14,579 --> 00:01:15,400
to call upon

25
00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:18,980
Hayley to come and address that. If none we can dive into

26
00:01:18,980 --> 00:01:20,439
the next item which is

27
00:01:20,439 --> 00:01:27,329
a plant Eagle Farms, a final plant. Any questions related

28
00:01:27,329 --> 00:01:29,680
to that? Seeing none

29
00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:33,099
we'll go ahead and move on to item for items for individual

30
00:01:33,099 --> 00:01:34,519
consideration. We do

31
00:01:34,519 --> 00:01:37,680
have an ADP request and I'm going to ask Hayley to come up

32
00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:38,920
and present that for

33
00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:42,920
us tonight or this afternoon rather.

34
00:01:50,599 --> 00:01:55,370
Good evening. So this is item ADP 1620 for the Mission

35
00:01:55,370 --> 00:01:59,840
Street offices and the

36
00:01:59,840 --> 00:02:02,489
request is to consider approval of an alternative

37
00:02:02,489 --> 00:02:03,840
development plan for an

38
00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:07,750
initial phase of a proposed office park development and the

39
00:02:07,750 --> 00:02:09,159
property is located

40
00:02:09,159 --> 00:02:09,159
at the yeah at the southeast corner of Fort Worth Drive and

41
00:02:09,159 --> 00:02:16,120
Mission Street. The

42
00:02:16,120 --> 00:02:19,689
overall project encompasses all three parcels there at that

43
00:02:19,689 --> 00:02:20,840
corner. The area

44
00:02:20,840 --> 00:02:24,000
in yellow is the boundaries of this ADP request for tonight

45
00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:25,360
though and yeah

46
00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:27,949
there in red is the entire property that they're looking at

47
00:02:27,949 --> 00:02:28,560
which is the

48
00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:31,449
preliminary plot that you all have on your agenda tonight

49
00:02:31,449 --> 00:02:33,159
as well. So the

50
00:02:33,159 --> 00:02:36,469
current zoning for this property is a Community Mixed Use

51
00:02:36,469 --> 00:02:37,599
General or CMG and

52
00:02:37,599 --> 00:02:41,969
the future land use designation is also Community Mixed Use

53
00:02:41,969 --> 00:02:43,120
and you may remember

54
00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:45,750
from some of our other discussions Community Mixed Use is

55
00:02:45,750 --> 00:02:46,360
intended to

56
00:02:46,360 --> 00:02:50,449
promote a mix of residential commercial and institutional

57
00:02:50,449 --> 00:02:51,520
uses but commercial

58
00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:55,949
would be the predominant use intended there. So here's the

59
00:02:55,949 --> 00:02:57,639
the site plan and

60
00:02:57,639 --> 00:02:59,939
there was a small change made to the site plan that was in

61
00:02:59,939 --> 00:03:00,599
your backup so I

62
00:03:00,599 --> 00:03:03,889
passed out a revised copy of that for you all before the

63
00:03:03,889 --> 00:03:06,159
meeting and the only

64
00:03:06,159 --> 00:03:09,400
change that was made well there were two actually they

65
00:03:09,400 --> 00:03:10,919
added this label here on

66
00:03:10,919 --> 00:03:13,120
these parking spaces north of the detention pond to

67
00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:14,039
indicate that those

68
00:03:14,039 --> 00:03:17,729
will be part of a future development and then they made one

69
00:03:17,729 --> 00:03:19,159
change to this table

70
00:03:19,159 --> 00:03:23,960
here to take out a provision that was no longer necessary.

71
00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:25,639
So as far as staff

72
00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:29,520
considerations they had four requested deviations from the

73
00:03:29,520 --> 00:03:30,800
subchapter 13

74
00:03:30,800 --> 00:03:34,000
design standards. The first of those and one of the most

75
00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:36,360
significant was for the

76
00:03:36,360 --> 00:03:41,819
provision in 35 13 13 a for our non-residential standards

77
00:03:41,819 --> 00:03:42,319
that requires

78
00:03:42,319 --> 00:03:46,189
the buildings to be primarily oriented towards the street

79
00:03:46,189 --> 00:03:47,360
and the intent of

80
00:03:47,360 --> 00:03:49,509
that as you can imagine is to make sure that our buildings

81
00:03:49,509 --> 00:03:50,319
present well to the

82
00:03:50,319 --> 00:03:53,789
street and we have clearly designated entrances from the

83
00:03:53,789 --> 00:03:55,439
street for people

84
00:03:55,439 --> 00:03:59,120
seeking that use. So as you can see from their site plan

85
00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:00,240
here this is more of a

86
00:04:00,240 --> 00:04:03,419
office park or campus type feel that they're going for here

87
00:04:03,419 --> 00:04:04,139
with all the

88
00:04:04,139 --> 00:04:07,050
buildings oriented inward towards the parking lot and what

89
00:04:07,050 --> 00:04:07,840
will be future

90
00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:11,879
buildings as well. So this phase includes three buildings

91
00:04:11,879 --> 00:04:13,280
here located on lots one

92
00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:17,800
through three and as you can see lot this building on lot

93
00:04:17,800 --> 00:04:18,639
one and this

94
00:04:18,639 --> 00:04:21,519
building here would be the two that are primary we're

95
00:04:21,519 --> 00:04:22,399
primarily concerned with

96
00:04:22,399 --> 00:04:24,490
that are oriented away from the street and would have a

97
00:04:24,490 --> 00:04:25,360
rear or side facing

98
00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:30,740
the street. So as part of our considerations for that we

99
00:04:30,740 --> 00:04:31,600
requested

100
00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:34,759
that the buildings still have a you know a very cohesive

101
00:04:34,759 --> 00:04:35,839
feeling to all of them

102
00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:38,230
throughout the office park is one of our considerations and

103
00:04:38,230 --> 00:04:39,120
we wanted to see that

104
00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:41,759
the buildings would have some architectural interest in

105
00:04:41,759 --> 00:04:42,360
design from

106
00:04:42,360 --> 00:04:45,209
all sides so that you still get a good feel for the

107
00:04:45,209 --> 00:04:46,439
building and a good

108
00:04:46,439 --> 00:04:49,600
presentation to the street. So the top here is their front

109
00:04:49,600 --> 00:04:50,959
elevation that would

110
00:04:50,959 --> 00:04:53,110
be oriented inwards to the towards the middle of the

111
00:04:53,110 --> 00:04:55,040
property. We have the right

112
00:04:55,040 --> 00:04:58,060
elevation there on the bottom and then here you can see

113
00:04:58,060 --> 00:04:59,399
what they've proposed

114
00:04:59,399 --> 00:05:03,269
for the rear of the building. So you know it is a masonry

115
00:05:03,269 --> 00:05:04,560
materials that they're

116
00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:07,029
proposing it does use windows and awnings to create some

117
00:05:07,029 --> 00:05:07,800
architectural

118
00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:13,180
interest from the street rather than just a solid wall. And

119
00:05:13,180 --> 00:05:14,720
they're also

120
00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:18,250
proposing the use of what appears to be five shrubs and a

121
00:05:18,250 --> 00:05:19,620
tree that would be in

122
00:05:19,620 --> 00:05:21,879
front of the building to kind of break up the spans from

123
00:05:21,879 --> 00:05:22,680
the street to the

124
00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:27,319
building there. And as I'm sure you're familiar with Fort

125
00:05:27,319 --> 00:05:27,959
Worth Drive one of

126
00:05:27,959 --> 00:05:31,209
staff's other considerations was that this orientation away

127
00:05:31,209 --> 00:05:32,079
from the street

128
00:05:32,079 --> 00:05:35,069
may not be wholeheartedly you know breaking the intent of

129
00:05:35,069 --> 00:05:35,879
the code per se

130
00:05:35,879 --> 00:05:39,269
because this isn't a pedestrian oriented area predominantly

131
00:05:39,269 --> 00:05:40,160
on Fort Worth Drive.

132
00:05:40,160 --> 00:05:42,370
You know we have sidewalks but there aren't a whole lot of

133
00:05:42,370 --> 00:05:43,040
customers for

134
00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:45,839
these potential uses probably that would be walking there.

135
00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:46,879
So having that

136
00:05:46,879 --> 00:05:50,040
orientation towards the inside makes sense for the veh

137
00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:50,920
icular traffic that

138
00:05:50,920 --> 00:05:55,720
would be the predominant users here. And one of their other

139
00:05:55,720 --> 00:05:57,480
requests is related

140
00:05:57,480 --> 00:06:01,310
to parking. So the DDC requirement for general office use

141
00:06:01,310 --> 00:06:03,160
is one space per 450

142
00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:05,939
square feet of building. So for the size of buildings they

143
00:06:05,939 --> 00:06:06,759
're proposing at this

144
00:06:06,759 --> 00:06:11,189
time 27 spaces would be required. And subchapter 13 goes on

145
00:06:11,189 --> 00:06:12,360
to state that any

146
00:06:12,360 --> 00:06:15,620
parking in excess of that number should be constructed of

147
00:06:15,620 --> 00:06:18,000
pervious material. What

148
00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:21,519
they're proposing is actually 39 spaces total so they're

149
00:06:21,519 --> 00:06:23,079
over that required

150
00:06:23,079 --> 00:06:27,019
number by 12 for this phase. And in lieu of using permeable

151
00:06:27,019 --> 00:06:28,120
paving of some sort

152
00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:31,860
they've proposed a detention pond located here in red. And

153
00:06:31,860 --> 00:06:33,000
that pond would

154
00:06:33,000 --> 00:06:36,379
be designed to I swim standards and that would mean that it

155
00:06:36,379 --> 00:06:37,439
would be required to

156
00:06:37,439 --> 00:06:40,829
hold the water quality volume of this parking lot for up to

157
00:06:40,829 --> 00:06:41,759
24 hours.

158
00:06:41,759 --> 00:06:45,569
Commissioner Beck. Thank you Chair. Haley is that an open

159
00:06:45,569 --> 00:06:48,160
pond or is it underground outside?

160
00:06:48,160 --> 00:06:50,920
My understanding is it would be an open pond. I spoke with

161
00:06:50,920 --> 00:06:51,839
Deborah Viera about it

162
00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:54,240
this morning and she said at this point she would be

163
00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:55,680
looking for their final pond

164
00:06:55,680 --> 00:06:58,220
designs at the final platting stage so they're not quite

165
00:06:58,220 --> 00:06:59,040
there to the full

166
00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:01,389
design yet but I believe it would be an open pond. The fact

167
00:07:01,389 --> 00:07:02,399
that that's gonna back

168
00:07:02,399 --> 00:07:06,120
up to a residential area there's no concern about odors or

169
00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:07,000
anything like

170
00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:10,160
that or flooding. There actually are some buffering

171
00:07:10,160 --> 00:07:11,579
requirements and we'll get to

172
00:07:11,579 --> 00:07:18,040
those here in a minute. So that's their proposed mitigation

173
00:07:18,040 --> 00:07:18,639
for the excess

174
00:07:18,639 --> 00:07:22,129
parking is the use of this detention pond to treat the

175
00:07:22,129 --> 00:07:24,680
water quality. And then

176
00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:27,839
because of the size of this overall full development once

177
00:07:27,839 --> 00:07:29,040
they get all of those

178
00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:32,920
future phases built out exceeds 40,000 square feet that

179
00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:33,639
does trigger some

180
00:07:33,639 --> 00:07:36,480
large-scale development standards in the DDC and those

181
00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:37,759
requirements are meant to

182
00:07:37,759 --> 00:07:40,480
help mitigate potential nuisances from large-scale

183
00:07:40,480 --> 00:07:41,839
developments in terms of

184
00:07:41,839 --> 00:07:45,279
visuals and especially their compatibility when they adjoin

185
00:07:45,279 --> 00:07:45,800
single

186
00:07:45,800 --> 00:07:49,439
family residential uses. One of those provisions is for an

187
00:07:49,439 --> 00:07:51,160
8-foot masonry wall

188
00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:55,019
constructed of brick, stone, split block or concrete that

189
00:07:55,019 --> 00:07:56,439
has to run the entire

190
00:07:56,439 --> 00:07:59,019
common boundary line between the large-scale development

191
00:07:59,019 --> 00:07:59,639
and the single

192
00:07:59,639 --> 00:08:02,810
family use and there's also a provision that mechanical

193
00:08:02,810 --> 00:08:04,160
equipment located within

194
00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:07,100
these developments cannot be within a hundred feet of

195
00:08:07,100 --> 00:08:08,720
residential properties.

196
00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:14,050
So if we go back to our site plan here to address the

197
00:08:14,050 --> 00:08:17,439
requirement for this 8-foot

198
00:08:17,439 --> 00:08:21,029
wall they are proposing to construct a type C buffer that

199
00:08:21,029 --> 00:08:22,240
is slightly enhanced.

200
00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:25,100
The type C buffer would be required anyway between a

201
00:08:25,100 --> 00:08:26,319
commercial and single

202
00:08:26,319 --> 00:08:29,480
family use and there is a single family residence on the

203
00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:30,680
property to the south

204
00:08:30,680 --> 00:08:34,679
of them and so the type C buffer is a requirement already.

205
00:08:34,679 --> 00:08:35,559
They're proposing to

206
00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:38,440
provide some additional plantings, trees and shrubs to

207
00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:39,600
enhance that in lieu of

208
00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:44,519
providing the buffer plus a masonry wall. And in terms of

209
00:08:44,519 --> 00:08:45,919
mechanical equipment

210
00:08:45,919 --> 00:08:51,129
marked in red there, there are proposed air conditioners

211
00:08:51,129 --> 00:08:51,879
and other mechanical

212
00:08:51,879 --> 00:08:53,899
equipment for these buildings that would be located

213
00:08:53,899 --> 00:08:55,679
approximately 30 feet from

214
00:08:55,679 --> 00:08:59,539
that property line with the single family use and so as

215
00:08:59,539 --> 00:09:01,120
their mitigation for

216
00:09:01,120 --> 00:09:04,559
those being closer than required by code they're proposing

217
00:09:04,559 --> 00:09:05,200
architecturally

218
00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:08,190
compatible screening as well as plantings. They didn't

219
00:09:08,190 --> 00:09:08,840
specify at this

220
00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:11,860
time what those plantings would be but it was part of their

221
00:09:11,860 --> 00:09:13,000
description there.

222
00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:16,159
Commissioner Beck. Thank you Chair. So there's nothing no

223
00:09:16,159 --> 00:09:17,279
easier than an ICU

224
00:09:17,279 --> 00:09:19,940
unit in that area? I don't believe so. I believe this is

225
00:09:19,940 --> 00:09:23,120
intended just for offices.

226
00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:35,600
Go ahead. So the parking requirements based on 12,000

227
00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:37,080
square feet but you're

228
00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:42,570
we're going over conditions for a 40,000 large scale. Why

229
00:09:42,570 --> 00:09:43,600
are we not requiring

230
00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:47,480
parking for 40,000 or why are we requiring large scale for

231
00:09:47,480 --> 00:09:48,519
12,000 square

232
00:09:48,519 --> 00:09:51,259
feet? It's because when they originally proposed this it

233
00:09:51,259 --> 00:09:52,320
was brought in that

234
00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:55,330
their intent is for over 40,000 square feet of building but

235
00:09:55,330 --> 00:09:56,159
they want to do that

236
00:09:56,159 --> 00:09:57,940
in phases so we wanted to make sure that all those

237
00:09:57,940 --> 00:09:59,039
requirements were addressed

238
00:09:59,039 --> 00:10:03,549
as each phase comes in. If I can chime in Commissioner Riz

239
00:10:03,549 --> 00:10:04,799
al, one of the

240
00:10:04,799 --> 00:10:07,399
elements associated with this is that it is going to be an

241
00:10:07,399 --> 00:10:08,120
office campus

242
00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:10,899
development or an office style development and as a result

243
00:10:10,899 --> 00:10:11,240
we're

244
00:10:11,240 --> 00:10:15,409
looking at it comprehensively and that is why even though

245
00:10:15,409 --> 00:10:16,840
it might come in as a

246
00:10:16,840 --> 00:10:19,519
phased program we want to ultimately review this as a

247
00:10:19,519 --> 00:10:21,059
comprehensive. So parking

248
00:10:21,059 --> 00:10:25,529
will be done on a phase by phase requirement? Okay thank

249
00:10:25,529 --> 00:10:28,879
you. There are

250
00:10:28,879 --> 00:10:33,360
criteria for approval of an ADP outlined in subchapter 13.

251
00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:34,840
Those were outlined in

252
00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:38,000
your backup and overall staff felt that this meets those

253
00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:39,320
criteria. It seems a

254
00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:43,179
logical location at this hard corner for an office park or

255
00:10:43,179 --> 00:10:44,399
campus with multiple

256
00:10:44,399 --> 00:10:47,399
offices like this that would be condensed into one area as

257
00:10:47,399 --> 00:10:48,039
is keeping

258
00:10:48,039 --> 00:10:51,279
with the future land use plan and that community mixed use

259
00:10:51,279 --> 00:10:53,879
desire for this area.

260
00:10:53,879 --> 00:10:57,450
So staff is recommending approval of this with a few

261
00:10:57,450 --> 00:10:59,279
conditions. The first of

262
00:10:59,279 --> 00:11:02,100
those is that the proposed development would substantially

263
00:11:02,100 --> 00:11:02,960
conform to the site

264
00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:06,120
plan that was provided this evening. The second is that the

265
00:11:06,120 --> 00:11:07,080
development would

266
00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:09,860
also substantially comply with the landscape plan with a

267
00:11:09,860 --> 00:11:10,360
couple of

268
00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:13,519
modifications that we think would enhance the development.

269
00:11:13,519 --> 00:11:14,159
The first of

270
00:11:14,159 --> 00:11:17,100
those being that in addition to those five shrubs that they

271
00:11:17,100 --> 00:11:17,679
show on the

272
00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:20,110
landscape plan in front of the building we would like to

273
00:11:20,110 --> 00:11:21,279
see that large spans.

274
00:11:21,279 --> 00:11:26,710
Go to the site plan. Yeah so these five shrubs we'd like to

275
00:11:26,710 --> 00:11:29,759
see this large area broken up with some more

276
00:11:29,759 --> 00:11:32,700
landscaping so we're proposing about a five foot wide area

277
00:11:32,700 --> 00:11:33,639
that would contain

278
00:11:33,639 --> 00:11:37,059
tall grasses as well as the proposed shrubs and kind of an

279
00:11:37,059 --> 00:11:38,240
undulating pattern

280
00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:41,399
to provide some some interest and a little bit of softening

281
00:11:41,399 --> 00:11:42,759
between just the

282
00:11:42,759 --> 00:11:45,759
street and the building. Since the orientation is a way we

283
00:11:45,759 --> 00:11:46,159
want to make

284
00:11:46,159 --> 00:11:48,379
sure that that does present as well from the street as

285
00:11:48,379 --> 00:11:49,480
possible and that would

286
00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:53,950
include in our mind breaking up this large area of just

287
00:11:53,950 --> 00:11:55,480
grass in this case.

288
00:11:55,480 --> 00:12:00,779
And our other requirement on the landscape plan is that we

289
00:12:00,779 --> 00:12:01,720
feel that

290
00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:04,879
simply enhancing the buffer as they've proposed doesn't

291
00:12:04,879 --> 00:12:06,000
necessarily meet the

292
00:12:06,000 --> 00:12:08,870
intent of that large-scale development requirement for a m

293
00:12:08,870 --> 00:12:09,960
asonry wall because

294
00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:13,320
as we all know vegetation does tend to die back at certain

295
00:12:13,320 --> 00:12:14,600
times of year and so

296
00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:17,840
seasonally there would be the chance for this development

297
00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:19,039
to be visible and the

298
00:12:19,039 --> 00:12:21,799
noises and odors and things like that from it to carry to

299
00:12:21,799 --> 00:12:22,919
that residence next

300
00:12:22,919 --> 00:12:25,440
door. We feel that adding back in the requirement for that

301
00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:26,240
masonry wall would

302
00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:28,799
help address that as it would provide year-round screening

303
00:12:28,799 --> 00:12:29,639
between these two

304
00:12:29,639 --> 00:12:34,720
and help enhance the buffering between the two uses.

305
00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:37,840
Commissioner Beck. Thank you

306
00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:41,720
Chair. Did John drop when the requirement for an eight foot

307
00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:42,960
wall in that location

308
00:12:42,960 --> 00:12:45,740
and so why are we going from eight foot to six foot? We

309
00:12:45,740 --> 00:12:47,480
felt that six foot would be

310
00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:50,470
appropriate enough in this case. It's not necessarily a

311
00:12:50,470 --> 00:12:51,679
large-scale development in

312
00:12:51,679 --> 00:12:54,440
terms of a large warehouse or like a big box store or

313
00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:56,039
something like that. It is

314
00:12:56,039 --> 00:12:58,639
smaller buildings but overall in scale wouldn't be as

315
00:12:58,639 --> 00:13:00,919
imposing. So we reduced

316
00:13:00,919 --> 00:13:06,529
that to a six foot requirement just because we felt it

317
00:13:06,529 --> 00:13:07,639
would be appropriate

318
00:13:07,639 --> 00:13:13,639
in this case between the two uses. I'm having trouble with

319
00:13:13,639 --> 00:13:14,960
names. Commissioner Taylor.

320
00:13:14,960 --> 00:13:19,950
Thank you Chair. So I'm just trying to understand the the

321
00:13:19,950 --> 00:13:21,679
phasing I guess in

322
00:13:21,679 --> 00:13:28,179
this. The lot four it appears that the retention the

323
00:13:28,179 --> 00:13:30,320
detention pond is the only

324
00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:33,559
half of it's going to be built? They are intending a larger

325
00:13:33,559 --> 00:13:34,840
detention pond as the

326
00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:37,309
future phases come in I believe. At this point they're

327
00:13:37,309 --> 00:13:38,559
proposing just to construct

328
00:13:38,559 --> 00:13:41,440
a pond that would treat the water quality volume from this

329
00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:42,240
portion of the

330
00:13:42,240 --> 00:13:46,009
site. Okay and then the rest of the development it's still

331
00:13:46,009 --> 00:13:46,379
going to be

332
00:13:46,379 --> 00:13:51,350
facing away from the street. It has 75 more parking spaces

333
00:13:51,350 --> 00:13:52,919
for 26,000 more

334
00:13:52,919 --> 00:13:57,210
square feet so it's going to still need additional ADPs as

335
00:13:57,210 --> 00:13:59,840
it builds out. Yes.

336
00:13:59,840 --> 00:14:04,289
And so okay and the decision not to just do one ADP now for

337
00:14:04,289 --> 00:14:07,240
the whole thing? So at

338
00:14:07,240 --> 00:14:12,919
this, sorry Haley. At this point the intent is we know that

339
00:14:12,919 --> 00:14:13,240
there is a

340
00:14:13,240 --> 00:14:17,840
potential or a possibility that this may be developed as a

341
00:14:17,840 --> 00:14:19,559
office campus style

342
00:14:19,559 --> 00:14:21,929
development and that's why we were looking at it

343
00:14:21,929 --> 00:14:23,480
comprehensively. Our first

344
00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:25,779
thought was let's bring this all together but there was

345
00:14:25,779 --> 00:14:26,519
discussion with

346
00:14:26,519 --> 00:14:28,990
the applicant who said well I'm not you know they might not

347
00:14:28,990 --> 00:14:29,960
be a hundred percent

348
00:14:29,960 --> 00:14:32,440
sure this is potentially their build out. They might change

349
00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:33,200
there might be some

350
00:14:33,200 --> 00:14:35,429
changes in the future as it relates but there's certain on

351
00:14:35,429 --> 00:14:36,639
these buildings and

352
00:14:36,639 --> 00:14:40,559
therefore the goal is to make sure that if that doesn't

353
00:14:40,559 --> 00:14:42,519
happen then we're at

354
00:14:42,519 --> 00:14:45,679
least accommodating with the masonry wall requirement and

355
00:14:45,679 --> 00:14:46,519
what have you that

356
00:14:46,519 --> 00:14:49,480
we look at it in this cohesive manner but also have the

357
00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:50,840
ability to expand that

358
00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:56,090
focus. And the speaking of the masonry wall would that

359
00:14:56,090 --> 00:14:57,720
follow the entire lot

360
00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:02,480
line? Yes. Yes for now it would follow the southern

361
00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:04,440
property line for the portion that

362
00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:09,190
they're developing at this point. And then if it it would

363
00:15:09,190 --> 00:15:11,039
be likely in the

364
00:15:11,039 --> 00:15:14,409
next phase that it would also continue along the east side

365
00:15:14,409 --> 00:15:16,000
as well? Yes there

366
00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:22,360
are also single-family residences to the east. Okay thank

367
00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:23,600
you. Commissioner Ellis.

368
00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:27,679
Thank you chair. Haley I know you and I briefed this a

369
00:15:27,679 --> 00:15:28,600
little bit but I guess to

370
00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:32,429
get it on record so the site plan and the prelim plan don't

371
00:15:32,429 --> 00:15:33,720
go together with

372
00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,500
with the labeling of lot four right so that I mean that's

373
00:15:36,500 --> 00:15:37,559
not really lot four

374
00:15:37,559 --> 00:15:40,919
according to the prelim plan right that's that's a common

375
00:15:40,919 --> 00:15:42,519
area. Yes there is

376
00:15:42,519 --> 00:15:45,679
the discrepancy in the labeling on the preliminary plat

377
00:15:45,679 --> 00:15:46,759
this area called lot

378
00:15:46,759 --> 00:15:49,639
four on the site plan is addressed as common area lot one

379
00:15:49,639 --> 00:15:51,960
so that label. So the

380
00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:55,820
prelim plat is correct? Yes. This is wrong? Yeah that would

381
00:15:55,820 --> 00:15:56,799
be a common area lot

382
00:15:56,799 --> 00:16:02,159
with the detention pond on it. Right okay okay thanks.

383
00:16:02,159 --> 00:16:08,480
Commissioner Hatchbeth. I may

384
00:16:08,480 --> 00:16:12,720
be missing it. I'm assuming they're gonna have some signage

385
00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:17,080
on forward drop. I'm

386
00:16:17,080 --> 00:16:19,480
not sure what their intent for signage for the entire

387
00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:20,440
campuses I know the

388
00:16:20,440 --> 00:16:23,799
building elevation showed signage on building one which is

389
00:16:23,799 --> 00:16:24,320
the only

390
00:16:24,320 --> 00:16:27,950
elevation they've completed at this point. So as far as we

391
00:16:27,950 --> 00:16:28,879
know all the

392
00:16:28,879 --> 00:16:32,039
signage will be on the buildings itself nothing in the. I'm

393
00:16:32,039 --> 00:16:33,000
not aware of what

394
00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:34,779
their intent is for signage I think the applicant will be

395
00:16:34,779 --> 00:16:35,679
here tonight though if

396
00:16:35,679 --> 00:16:39,059
you would like to address that question with him. Okay and

397
00:16:39,059 --> 00:16:40,480
then if I may. Thank

398
00:16:40,480 --> 00:16:45,559
you. Sure. Same question lot four are there any

399
00:16:45,559 --> 00:16:47,639
calculations based on how they

400
00:16:47,639 --> 00:16:54,080
drew their lines so for example are the parking spaces

401
00:16:54,080 --> 00:16:56,200
calculated or the is

402
00:16:56,200 --> 00:17:00,009
there any calculations based on they only drew this line in

403
00:17:00,009 --> 00:17:00,919
the middle of

404
00:17:00,919 --> 00:17:05,349
this area? They did present preliminary calculations that

405
00:17:05,349 --> 00:17:06,480
Deborah Vieira

406
00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:09,640
reviewed and she couldn't be here tonight so I'm not sure

407
00:17:09,640 --> 00:17:10,319
that I could

408
00:17:10,319 --> 00:17:13,480
speak to how she calculated that water quality volume in

409
00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:14,559
the size of the pond

410
00:17:14,559 --> 00:17:17,890
but I know they did present those and Deborah reviewed them

411
00:17:17,890 --> 00:17:19,759
as well and so I

412
00:17:19,759 --> 00:17:23,250
believe this lot line or this line that they've drawn here

413
00:17:23,250 --> 00:17:24,400
is surrounding the

414
00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:27,759
area that it would be required to treat that water quality

415
00:17:27,759 --> 00:17:30,039
volume. Right but my

416
00:17:30,039 --> 00:17:35,529
question is are they just drawing a line arbitrarily to get

417
00:17:35,529 --> 00:17:36,599
a number that's

418
00:17:36,599 --> 00:17:42,950
favorable does that make sense? Maybe they can do that by

419
00:17:42,950 --> 00:17:43,920
right I just want to

420
00:17:43,920 --> 00:17:49,359
know is that. I'll try and tackle that question. Appreciate

421
00:17:49,359 --> 00:17:50,119
it. I don't believe it's

422
00:17:50,119 --> 00:17:52,339
an arbitrary line I think if you look at what they're

423
00:17:52,339 --> 00:17:53,599
proposing they've got their

424
00:17:53,599 --> 00:17:57,150
prelims and in terms of their CEPs and what have you we

425
00:17:57,150 --> 00:17:58,319
should they should

426
00:17:58,319 --> 00:18:01,019
have calculated what they're trying to show you is the

427
00:18:01,019 --> 00:18:02,480
extent of that building

428
00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:06,930
footprint itself lot four could potentially accommodate as

429
00:18:06,930 --> 00:18:07,559
a drain

430
00:18:07,559 --> 00:18:10,559
adhesion additional water or what have you as the rest of

431
00:18:10,559 --> 00:18:11,599
the phase builds out

432
00:18:11,599 --> 00:18:14,569
it could potentially accommodate that and be in keeping

433
00:18:14,569 --> 00:18:15,799
with our environmental

434
00:18:15,799 --> 00:18:19,400
teams concept of being you know as the future ADP comes

435
00:18:19,400 --> 00:18:21,000
forward so when we look

436
00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:24,609
at that line let's not look at it as a solid lot line dem

437
00:18:24,609 --> 00:18:26,119
arcation but mainly

438
00:18:26,119 --> 00:18:29,549
the intent or the area that is being encompassed under this

439
00:18:29,549 --> 00:18:30,519
ADP at this point

440
00:18:30,519 --> 00:18:33,680
in terms of compromising any engineering requirements

441
00:18:33,680 --> 00:18:34,720
obviously that would not

442
00:18:34,720 --> 00:18:37,910
occur because prior to issues of building permit all the

443
00:18:37,910 --> 00:18:38,839
plans would have

444
00:18:38,839 --> 00:18:41,420
to be reviewed for all the engineering infrastructure and

445
00:18:41,420 --> 00:18:42,200
infrastructure

446
00:18:42,200 --> 00:18:48,269
requirements. Thank you. Yeah and the specific pond design

447
00:18:48,269 --> 00:18:48,799
requirements I was

448
00:18:48,799 --> 00:18:51,799
told Deborah reviews those with the final plat. Correct.

449
00:18:51,799 --> 00:18:53,119
Commissioner Sullivan.

450
00:18:53,119 --> 00:18:57,200
Thank you sir. Is the retention pond being built to

451
00:18:57,200 --> 00:18:59,200
accommodate the future use

452
00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:04,250
along that side or just what's being built currently? This

453
00:19:04,250 --> 00:19:05,720
time it is just for

454
00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:07,799
this current phase with these three buildings and their

455
00:19:07,799 --> 00:19:08,599
associated parking.

456
00:19:08,599 --> 00:19:14,750
So where they have currently future design ideas may end up

457
00:19:14,750 --> 00:19:16,240
being another

458
00:19:16,240 --> 00:19:20,839
retention pond or how is that going to be handled at that?

459
00:19:20,839 --> 00:19:22,000
From what I've

460
00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:25,829
discussed with the applicant the boundaries shown here are

461
00:19:25,829 --> 00:19:26,319
a rough

462
00:19:26,319 --> 00:19:28,480
estimate of the area that they would use for detention for

463
00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:29,960
the entire development.

464
00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:33,880
The pond would be expanded with those future phases. So the

465
00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:35,440
entire lot for maybe

466
00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:40,750
a retention pond? The entire common area lot. Gotcha. Okay.

467
00:19:40,750 --> 00:19:40,799
Thank you.

468
00:19:46,720 --> 00:19:51,099
So staff's other recommendations we propose that all the

469
00:19:51,099 --> 00:19:52,720
screening walls for

470
00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:54,799
the mechanical equipment be constructed of masonry

471
00:19:54,799 --> 00:19:56,079
materials that are compatible

472
00:19:56,079 --> 00:19:59,240
with the building facade and in addition we propose they

473
00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:00,039
plant a mixture of

474
00:20:00,039 --> 00:20:03,309
shrubs and tall grasses around the outsides of those to you

475
00:20:03,309 --> 00:20:04,279
know accentuate

476
00:20:04,279 --> 00:20:08,750
the walls and enhance the campus feel. We also propose that

477
00:20:08,750 --> 00:20:09,960
building one as

478
00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:12,480
identified on the site plan should substantially comply

479
00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:13,319
with the attached

480
00:20:13,319 --> 00:20:16,000
elevations at this time those are the only elevations they

481
00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:16,700
've developed so

482
00:20:16,700 --> 00:20:19,859
we're also proposing that buildings two and three be

483
00:20:19,859 --> 00:20:21,400
constructed of masonry

484
00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:24,589
materials and be similar in design and concept to that

485
00:20:24,589 --> 00:20:25,799
elevation for building

486
00:20:25,799 --> 00:20:29,880
one. Just to help create a cohesive sense across the office

487
00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:31,000
park as it develops.

488
00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:34,960
And we also suggest that any future phases be uniform

489
00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:36,359
relating to frontage

490
00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:38,880
setbacks building materials and landscaping along Fort

491
00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:39,559
Worth Drive to

492
00:20:39,559 --> 00:20:44,559
help create a cohesive feel for the campus from the street.

493
00:20:44,559 --> 00:20:46,559
And that's all I

494
00:20:46,559 --> 00:20:50,000
have so I can answer any other questions at this time.

495
00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:51,880
Commissioner Beck. Thank you

496
00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:55,400
Chair. Just real quick stuff I think you mentioned that

497
00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:56,759
though this is not a

498
00:20:56,759 --> 00:21:00,359
typical pedestrian area there were sidewalks that run along

499
00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:02,000
Fort Worth. Yes so they are

500
00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:06,220
proposing I believe they're required to build the sidewalk

501
00:21:06,220 --> 00:21:07,079
along Fort Worth

502
00:21:07,079 --> 00:21:10,369
Drive and they're proposing sidewalk connectivity in front

503
00:21:10,369 --> 00:21:11,319
of the buildings

504
00:21:11,319 --> 00:21:13,660
that would go out to that sidewalk and they've also

505
00:21:13,660 --> 00:21:14,920
proposed some bike racks

506
00:21:14,920 --> 00:21:18,079
here to allow for alternative means of access for employees

507
00:21:18,079 --> 00:21:19,240
and users. So the

508
00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:21,819
sidewalk they're building will connect with existing

509
00:21:21,819 --> 00:21:23,519
sidewalk or in anticipation

510
00:21:23,519 --> 00:21:27,250
of future sidewalk? Earl are you familiar with the sidewalk

511
00:21:27,250 --> 00:21:28,000
s that are developed

512
00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:31,809
along Fort Worth Drive currently? Is it connecting to an

513
00:21:31,809 --> 00:21:33,519
existing sidewalk? No.

514
00:21:33,519 --> 00:21:37,079
There is no sidewalk.

515
00:21:37,079 --> 00:21:39,079
Yeah.

516
00:21:39,079 --> 00:21:47,839
Are those pervious or impervious? Well I know as part of

517
00:21:47,839 --> 00:21:48,799
the Tech Stop project

518
00:21:48,799 --> 00:21:52,200
of the widening of US 377 they are constructing sidewalk on

519
00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:53,000
both sides so

520
00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:57,829
this I believe this five foot sidewalk. That was my next

521
00:21:57,829 --> 00:21:58,920
question. That's being

522
00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:02,119
built by the development and will connect to them. Okay so

523
00:22:02,119 --> 00:22:03,019
they are going to be

524
00:22:03,019 --> 00:22:06,930
widening Fort Worth Drive? To six lanes. Any dates on that

525
00:22:06,930 --> 00:22:08,680
yet? Just uh they're

526
00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:12,680
actually relocating utilities as we speak and the pavement

527
00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:14,079
portion should

528
00:22:14,079 --> 00:22:20,150
occur sometime hopefully summer of this year. Cool. Thank

529
00:22:20,150 --> 00:22:20,720
you.

530
00:22:27,000 --> 00:22:33,079
Now that'd be different in the future. Moving on to our

531
00:22:33,079 --> 00:22:34,799
next item.

532
00:22:36,079 --> 00:22:41,839
It's going to be public hearing. It's a final replant. Okay

533
00:22:41,839 --> 00:22:41,839
.

534
00:22:43,839 --> 00:22:46,359
Hayley might want to stay back if there any questions

535
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:48,680
regarding item 5B which

536
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:54,039
is the final replant for the Roberts addition. If there any

537
00:22:54,039 --> 00:22:54,680
questions we can

538
00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:57,119
talk about those.

539
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:08,799
Hayley would you pull that up please?

540
00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:16,680
There yes it is. Yes it's a splitting of one lot into two

541
00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:17,359
lots for commercial

542
00:23:17,359 --> 00:23:22,359
development at the corner of Ector and Emory. Okay so that

543
00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:24,119
was. Commissioner

544
00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:27,279
Tyler. Thank you chair. Yeah my question was I thought this

545
00:23:27,279 --> 00:23:28,039
was zone commercial

546
00:23:28,039 --> 00:23:30,119
and it looked almost like these would be residential lots

547
00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:31,079
like a third acre lot

548
00:23:31,079 --> 00:23:34,450
with a you know 80 foot road front edge or something so is

549
00:23:34,450 --> 00:23:35,359
the plan is for

550
00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:37,599
commercial development? Yes yeah these are commercial

551
00:23:37,599 --> 00:23:38,960
commercial lots. Thank

552
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:45,029
you. Commissioner Sullivan. Last year we talked about Aldi

553
00:23:45,029 --> 00:23:46,400
going in to the north

554
00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:50,369
of this on the same in the same area there was a lot of

555
00:23:50,369 --> 00:23:52,640
concern about traffic

556
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:56,700
on Emory and all the things it was going to do to interrupt

557
00:23:56,700 --> 00:23:57,680
the the neighborhood

558
00:23:57,680 --> 00:24:01,680
flow and so forth and I think Aldi did a good job of

559
00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:04,599
providing screenage on the

560
00:24:04,599 --> 00:24:09,430
south part of their lot in order to take care of that issue

561
00:24:09,430 --> 00:24:10,640
and with the you know

562
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:15,170
the truck offloading ramp and so forth. What's the plan for

563
00:24:15,170 --> 00:24:16,400
any commercial

564
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:20,829
building going in here to provide the same screening that

565
00:24:20,829 --> 00:24:22,079
the people were

566
00:24:22,079 --> 00:24:25,940
concerned about with Aldi's before that now is going to be

567
00:24:25,940 --> 00:24:26,640
transferred to the

568
00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:30,809
south to this new area? Yeah so any development would be

569
00:24:30,809 --> 00:24:31,440
required to meet

570
00:24:31,440 --> 00:24:35,109
the DDC requirements for screening landscaping street trees

571
00:24:35,109 --> 00:24:35,880
all of those

572
00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:40,849
things. I'm not sure about the second lot the lot at the

573
00:24:40,849 --> 00:24:42,200
hard corner there I

574
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:45,089
believe is intended for a medical office they've submitted

575
00:24:45,089 --> 00:24:46,119
a site plan request

576
00:24:46,119 --> 00:24:58,440
for that lot. Okay thank you. More questions? Moves to C.

577
00:24:58,440 --> 00:24:59,759
Moves us to item C and

578
00:24:59,759 --> 00:25:10,670
Haley's gonna present this one as well. Andy. I believe C

579
00:25:10,670 --> 00:25:14,279
is the zoning case. Yes.

580
00:25:14,279 --> 00:25:17,289
These two go together as owning in an SUP for the same

581
00:25:17,289 --> 00:25:19,240
property. So this case

582
00:25:19,240 --> 00:25:24,130
as E 1627 is for the standard and Hudson at Med Park. The

583
00:25:24,130 --> 00:25:25,799
request is to hold a

584
00:25:25,799 --> 00:25:28,309
public hearing and consider a request for a rezoning of

585
00:25:28,309 --> 00:25:29,759
approximately 20 acres

586
00:25:29,759 --> 00:25:32,940
from regional center commercial downtown district to

587
00:25:32,940 --> 00:25:34,480
regional center residential

588
00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:41,509
2. The property is the western portion of a larger property

589
00:25:41,509 --> 00:25:42,160
that's located at

590
00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:46,039
2100 South May Hill. The property is outlined in yellow and

591
00:25:46,039 --> 00:25:46,599
it sits at the

592
00:25:46,599 --> 00:25:50,960
end of Hudson Wood Drive here and Somerset Road to the

593
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:52,799
south. The Providence

594
00:25:52,799 --> 00:25:56,240
Place Apartments is this development that is to the east

595
00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:57,279
and south of the

596
00:25:57,279 --> 00:26:01,150
property and then the Med Park station is actually here

597
00:26:01,150 --> 00:26:04,559
just south of that. So

598
00:26:04,559 --> 00:26:07,480
the current zoning for the property as I mentioned is RCCD

599
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:08,839
their proposal is for

600
00:26:08,839 --> 00:26:14,299
RCR 2. This property is located within a regional mixed-use

601
00:26:14,299 --> 00:26:15,119
future land use

602
00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:18,599
designation. This designation is applied to areas that are

603
00:26:18,599 --> 00:26:20,839
primarily along the I

604
00:26:20,839 --> 00:26:24,059
35 interchanges primary arterials. They're intended to be

605
00:26:24,059 --> 00:26:24,599
regional

606
00:26:24,599 --> 00:26:27,359
destinations for commercial and mixed-use development which

607
00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:27,839
includes

608
00:26:27,839 --> 00:26:32,200
moderate to high density residential. Just to give you an

609
00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:33,599
idea of where this

610
00:26:33,599 --> 00:26:36,400
sits that reach that particular regional mixed-use center

611
00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:37,440
encompasses a large

612
00:26:37,440 --> 00:26:41,250
area along I 35 and this property is located just here

613
00:26:41,250 --> 00:26:42,079
where the yellow star

614
00:26:42,079 --> 00:26:47,250
is kind of on the outer fringe of that designation. So

615
00:26:47,250 --> 00:26:49,240
staff's considerations

616
00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:53,170
for this one of those was that rezoning to RCR 2 while

617
00:26:53,170 --> 00:26:54,759
there isn't any other

618
00:26:54,759 --> 00:26:58,799
instance of RCR 2 immediately adjoining this is consistent

619
00:26:58,799 --> 00:26:59,759
with the zoning

620
00:26:59,759 --> 00:27:03,200
pattern in this area because all of these districts RCR 2,

621
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:04,920
RCR 1, RCCD all of

622
00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:08,089
those are within the same regional mixed-use center family

623
00:27:08,089 --> 00:27:08,680
of zoning

624
00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:11,839
districts that all fit within that regional mixed-use

625
00:27:11,839 --> 00:27:12,880
future land use

626
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:16,240
designation. This request is actually for a down zoning to

627
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:17,240
a less intensive

628
00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:21,599
zoning district and staff felt that the RCR 2 designation

629
00:27:21,599 --> 00:27:22,880
on this property could

630
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:27,019
provide us kind of a transition and scale of development

631
00:27:27,019 --> 00:27:28,319
and use between the

632
00:27:28,319 --> 00:27:31,480
surrounding RCR 1 and what is likely to be more intensive

633
00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:32,319
commercialized

634
00:27:32,319 --> 00:27:35,609
development here along May Hill Road within the RCCD

635
00:27:35,609 --> 00:27:37,960
district. And just to

636
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:40,200
give you an idea of what I'm talking about here this entire

637
00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:40,960
area that kind of

638
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,559
matches with that future land use designation that regional

639
00:27:43,559 --> 00:27:44,079
mixed-use

640
00:27:44,079 --> 00:27:46,779
center you can see has this family of zoning districts

641
00:27:46,779 --> 00:27:48,160
applied to it RCR 1,

642
00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:55,920
RCR 2, and then RCCD in and RCCD. And that RCR 2 is

643
00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:56,720
actually not a very

644
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:59,390
common zoning designation in this area you can see there's

645
00:27:59,390 --> 00:28:00,880
only a few instances

646
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:08,220
of that throughout here. The RCCD district requires that

647
00:28:08,220 --> 00:28:09,160
multifamily as a

648
00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:13,150
use be part of a mixed-use development along any collector

649
00:28:13,150 --> 00:28:14,440
or arterial and so

650
00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:17,640
in this case Hudson Wood Drive if I remembering correctly

651
00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:18,359
is actually

652
00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:21,690
classified as a collector street or will be once it's

653
00:28:21,690 --> 00:28:23,160
extended across so there

654
00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:26,130
would be a requirement for mixed-use and commercial

655
00:28:26,130 --> 00:28:27,599
development specifically on

656
00:28:27,599 --> 00:28:30,259
the ground floor of any multifamily development under the

657
00:28:30,259 --> 00:28:31,240
existing zoning.

658
00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:35,450
Within RCR 2 multifamily can be developed without that

659
00:28:35,450 --> 00:28:36,319
mixed-use

660
00:28:36,319 --> 00:28:39,099
component if it is approved with an SUP which is the next

661
00:28:39,099 --> 00:28:40,079
case that we'll go

662
00:28:40,079 --> 00:28:44,599
over. And staff felt that given the substantial offset from

663
00:28:44,599 --> 00:28:45,680
this property

664
00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:48,259
that they're looking at from May Hill Road here this

665
00:28:48,259 --> 00:28:50,240
primary arterial commercial

666
00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:54,119
uses may not be supported necessarily this far off of that

667
00:28:54,119 --> 00:28:54,839
primary road

668
00:28:54,839 --> 00:28:57,799
because this is largely a neighborhood development that's

669
00:28:57,799 --> 00:28:58,640
occurred back here on

670
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:04,200
Hudson Wood so far. Just to give you a comparison this is

671
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:05,599
pretty substantial

672
00:29:05,599 --> 00:29:07,740
down zoning in terms of the scale of what can be developed

673
00:29:07,740 --> 00:29:08,519
on the property if

674
00:29:08,519 --> 00:29:11,400
this rezoning is approved so the density would be reduced

675
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:12,720
from 100 dwelling units

676
00:29:12,720 --> 00:29:17,160
per acre to 40. The maximum lot coverage would drop from 90

677
00:29:17,160 --> 00:29:17,920
% to 75%

678
00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:22,380
thereby increasing the landscaping to 25% and the building

679
00:29:22,380 --> 00:29:23,200
height as well would

680
00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:27,799
drop by half from 100 feet to 50 feet.

681
00:29:28,319 --> 00:29:32,660
Notifications were sent and one neutral response was

682
00:29:32,660 --> 00:29:34,359
received and I passed that

683
00:29:34,359 --> 00:29:38,279
out before the meeting here and staff is recommending

684
00:29:38,279 --> 00:29:39,720
approval of this request

685
00:29:39,720 --> 00:29:42,440
because of its compatibility with the surrounding land use

686
00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:43,359
and zoning pattern

687
00:29:43,359 --> 00:29:46,539
and its compatibility with the goals of the DIN plan 2030

688
00:29:46,539 --> 00:29:47,519
and I can answer any

689
00:29:47,519 --> 00:29:52,029
questions. Commissioner Beck. Thank you Chair. One quick

690
00:29:52,029 --> 00:29:54,079
one. The extension of Hudson

691
00:29:54,079 --> 00:29:58,200
Wood Drive that wouldn't actually go to May Hill we have to

692
00:29:58,200 --> 00:29:59,359
rely upon the city

693
00:29:59,359 --> 00:30:02,519
because they own another property is that right? I know

694
00:30:02,519 --> 00:30:03,720
they're intending to

695
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:06,440
extend it through their property but I will let Earl answer

696
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:07,319
the question about

697
00:30:07,319 --> 00:30:11,900
its extension. All the way to May Hill? Yeah let me pull an

698
00:30:11,900 --> 00:30:14,119
aerial for you there.

699
00:30:14,119 --> 00:30:18,599
That's perfect. This is Hudson Wood I believe. Yes as part

700
00:30:18,599 --> 00:30:20,319
of the development Hudson

701
00:30:20,319 --> 00:30:27,190
Wood will extend from through their property off-site and

702
00:30:27,190 --> 00:30:27,920
tie into

703
00:30:27,920 --> 00:30:32,200
May Hill both the existing May Hill and ultimately the

704
00:30:32,200 --> 00:30:33,680
proposed new May Hill

705
00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:36,839
ones that's widened. So it will carry all the way through?

706
00:30:36,839 --> 00:30:38,720
Yes it has to by fire code

707
00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:41,569
requirements because the fire code requires two points of

708
00:30:41,569 --> 00:30:42,400
access to serve

709
00:30:42,400 --> 00:30:45,069
this development and right now there's only one and that's

710
00:30:45,069 --> 00:30:45,960
off of Quail Creek

711
00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:50,440
and Brinker. Okay while you're up there the white lines

712
00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:52,160
over towards May Hill

713
00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:56,450
that look like this one yes what is that? That was the old

714
00:30:56,450 --> 00:30:57,759
alignment of the

715
00:30:57,759 --> 00:31:00,789
widening of May Hill Road however what happened was the

716
00:31:00,789 --> 00:31:02,119
city could not acquire

717
00:31:02,119 --> 00:31:08,190
the right away south of this curve and so what we had to do

718
00:31:08,190 --> 00:31:09,920
is realign May Hill

719
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:13,779
back to its original alignment and acquire right away off

720
00:31:13,779 --> 00:31:17,519
of that. Okay thank you.

721
00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:40,579
Okay so the second part of this request is for the SUP for

722
00:31:40,579 --> 00:31:43,640
that multifamily use.

723
00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:46,349
So as I mentioned the request is to hold this public

724
00:31:46,349 --> 00:31:47,640
hearing and consider a

725
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,400
request for a specific use permit to allow multifamily

726
00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:51,480
development on that

727
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:55,339
approximate 20 acres of property. We're familiar with the

728
00:31:55,339 --> 00:31:56,640
property location now

729
00:31:56,640 --> 00:31:59,799
just off of May Hill Road at the end of Hudson Wood and Som

730
00:31:59,799 --> 00:32:01,559
erset and as I

731
00:32:01,559 --> 00:32:04,359
mentioned current zoning is our CCD which would require

732
00:32:04,359 --> 00:32:05,000
that mixed use

733
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:08,299
component. Their proposal as we just saw was to take this

734
00:32:08,299 --> 00:32:09,079
to an RCR 2

735
00:32:09,079 --> 00:32:12,759
designation. As I mentioned before it is within this

736
00:32:12,759 --> 00:32:14,400
regional mixed use future

737
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:17,710
land use designation which encourages moderate to high

738
00:32:17,710 --> 00:32:18,799
density residential

739
00:32:18,799 --> 00:32:24,210
development. So pending the approval of this rezoning the

740
00:32:24,210 --> 00:32:24,839
applicant is

741
00:32:24,839 --> 00:32:28,160
proposing a multifamily development that is not part of a

742
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:28,759
mixed use

743
00:32:28,759 --> 00:32:31,369
development therefore they're seeking the approval of this

744
00:32:31,369 --> 00:32:33,279
ADP. The multifamily

745
00:32:33,279 --> 00:32:36,490
development is consistent with that future land use

746
00:32:36,490 --> 00:32:37,880
designation which like

747
00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:41,559
I said does encourage that mixture of residential and

748
00:32:41,559 --> 00:32:43,000
commercial uses. This

749
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:46,880
also complies with all the criteria within subchapter 6 of

750
00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:48,720
the DDC for SUP

751
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:53,460
and those criteria are all outlined in your backup. So to

752
00:32:53,460 --> 00:32:55,519
go over their site

753
00:32:55,519 --> 00:33:01,079
plan briefly here did provide a actually I think that North

754
00:33:01,079 --> 00:33:02,119
area was incorrect so

755
00:33:02,119 --> 00:33:06,609
we have what they're proposing is two multifamily

756
00:33:06,609 --> 00:33:07,400
developments that would

757
00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:09,920
be separated by Hudson Wood Road. The top portion they

758
00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:11,039
refer to as the standard

759
00:33:11,039 --> 00:33:15,799
the southern portion would be the Hudson and this third lot

760
00:33:15,799 --> 00:33:16,759
here that they're

761
00:33:16,759 --> 00:33:19,210
proposing to develop as a part of this would provide a

762
00:33:19,210 --> 00:33:20,839
detention pond for these

763
00:33:20,839 --> 00:33:26,549
two developments. So looking at the the northern portion of

764
00:33:26,549 --> 00:33:29,160
it first we have four

765
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,450
buildings within the standard it's a total of 263

766
00:33:32,450 --> 00:33:34,039
residential units breaks

767
00:33:34,039 --> 00:33:38,670
down into 43 one-bedroom units 135 two-bedroom and 85 three

768
00:33:38,670 --> 00:33:39,799
-bedroom. All

769
00:33:39,799 --> 00:33:42,289
four of these buildings they're proposing would be three

770
00:33:42,289 --> 00:33:42,920
stories tall

771
00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:46,650
approximately 34 feet in height. The total lot coverage

772
00:33:46,650 --> 00:33:48,200
would be around 69%

773
00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:52,369
and they're proposing a total of 472 parking spaces

774
00:33:52,369 --> 00:33:53,200
throughout the

775
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:55,940
development along these private streets as well as I

776
00:33:55,940 --> 00:33:57,160
believe a few parking

777
00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:00,599
spaces on Hudson Wood Drive and they are also proposing to

778
00:34:00,599 --> 00:34:02,119
provide 30 bicycle

779
00:34:02,119 --> 00:34:07,089
parking spaces within this development. On the south side

780
00:34:07,089 --> 00:34:08,519
of Hudson Wood we have

781
00:34:08,519 --> 00:34:11,150
the development they're calling the Hudson which would be

782
00:34:11,150 --> 00:34:12,119
independent senior

783
00:34:12,119 --> 00:34:15,980
living so still multifamily but age restricted to senior

784
00:34:15,980 --> 00:34:17,440
citizens and this

785
00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:22,679
would contain two buildings with a total of 160 units 112

786
00:34:22,679 --> 00:34:24,280
one bedrooms 48 two

787
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:28,239
bedrooms in keeping with the same scale of development also

788
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:29,000
three stories

789
00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:32,659
approximately 34 feet in height and this development would

790
00:34:32,659 --> 00:34:34,320
have a total of 160

791
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:37,590
parking spaces no bicycle spaces are provided because of

792
00:34:37,590 --> 00:34:38,760
the intended users

793
00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:42,849
however they do provide a network of sidewalks throughout

794
00:34:42,849 --> 00:34:43,440
the development

795
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:45,760
and they're providing sidewalk connectivity down here to

796
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:46,039
allow

797
00:34:46,039 --> 00:34:49,489
connectivity to Somerset Drive for residents to be able to

798
00:34:49,489 --> 00:34:50,360
get to that Med

799
00:34:50,360 --> 00:34:56,880
Park station. Their landscape plan one component of that is

800
00:34:56,880 --> 00:34:57,840
this detention area

801
00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:00,849
they are intending to provide screening through by use of

802
00:35:00,849 --> 00:35:01,800
trees all the way

803
00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,309
around the detention pond to screen it from the right of

804
00:35:04,309 --> 00:35:05,239
way there at Hudson

805
00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:08,820
Wood and from you know any residents to the south or in

806
00:35:08,820 --> 00:35:10,280
future phases to the

807
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:15,750
west. There are existing single-family homes on property to

808
00:35:15,750 --> 00:35:17,199
the west and north

809
00:35:17,199 --> 00:35:21,110
of this development so that does require a type B buffer

810
00:35:21,110 --> 00:35:22,480
between multifamily and

811
00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:24,909
single-family they're proposing that along the entire

812
00:35:24,909 --> 00:35:25,920
property line here on

813
00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:30,300
the north and west sides of this as well as street trees

814
00:35:30,300 --> 00:35:31,679
throughout the

815
00:35:31,679 --> 00:35:35,340
development along these private drives and street trees

816
00:35:35,340 --> 00:35:38,079
along Hudson Wood. On

817
00:35:38,079 --> 00:35:41,679
the south side very similar concept they're proposing

818
00:35:41,679 --> 00:35:42,719
street trees throughout

819
00:35:42,719 --> 00:35:47,389
as well as along Hudson Wood. At this point the applicant

820
00:35:47,389 --> 00:35:48,400
had not developed

821
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:51,610
elevations for these buildings that they did state their

822
00:35:51,610 --> 00:35:52,880
intent to comply with

823
00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:55,440
the architectural requirements outlined in the DDC for

824
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:57,800
multifamily development.

825
00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:01,250
Again notifications were sent we received the one neutral

826
00:36:01,250 --> 00:36:02,000
request or

827
00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:06,239
neutral response and in this case staff is recommending

828
00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:08,480
approval of this because

829
00:36:08,480 --> 00:36:11,079
we feel it is consistent with the existing land use pattern

830
00:36:11,079 --> 00:36:11,360
it's

831
00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:13,440
consistent with the zoning designations in the area as well

832
00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:14,159
as the future land

833
00:36:14,159 --> 00:36:18,329
use plan however we do suggest a few conditions as part of

834
00:36:18,329 --> 00:36:19,920
this approval. One

835
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:22,150
of those would be that the development substantially comply

836
00:36:22,150 --> 00:36:22,880
with the approved

837
00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:25,440
site plan and landscape plans that have been attached. We

838
00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:27,679
also propose that the

839
00:36:27,679 --> 00:36:30,840
development since we didn't have elevations to look at we

840
00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:31,719
're requiring

841
00:36:31,719 --> 00:36:34,639
that they do meet or exceed the requirements of the DDC. We

842
00:36:34,639 --> 00:36:35,719
do feel the

843
00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:39,199
need to place restrictions to limit certain materials in

844
00:36:39,199 --> 00:36:40,639
this case EFAS and

845
00:36:40,639 --> 00:36:47,420
HDO board to a maximum of 10% because that we feel that m

846
00:36:47,420 --> 00:36:47,719
asonry

847
00:36:47,719 --> 00:36:50,409
materials provide a more long-lasting and durable product

848
00:36:50,409 --> 00:36:51,280
so we would like to

849
00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:55,480
see that limitation and we also propose we don't know what

850
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:56,800
their signage would

851
00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:59,079
be at this point but we're proposing that they only use

852
00:36:59,079 --> 00:37:00,000
monument signs and

853
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:02,760
building signs for these developments to limit the use of

854
00:37:02,760 --> 00:37:03,960
any large pole signs or

855
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:07,460
anything on Hudson Wood Drive to keep with that residential

856
00:37:07,460 --> 00:37:08,219
feel. And at this

857
00:37:08,219 --> 00:37:12,420
point I can answer any questions. Commissioner Rossell.

858
00:37:12,420 --> 00:37:15,039
Thank you chair. This might be

859
00:37:15,039 --> 00:37:19,880
moving for my clarification the rezoning from RCCD to RCR2

860
00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:21,599
was to eliminate the

861
00:37:21,599 --> 00:37:25,239
need for the commercial requirements but the SUP is to

862
00:37:25,239 --> 00:37:26,480
eliminate these for

863
00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:30,389
multi- eliminate the need for multi-use. Can you help me

864
00:37:30,389 --> 00:37:31,559
understand the

865
00:37:31,559 --> 00:37:35,809
differences between the rezoning the SUP? Certainly. Go

866
00:37:35,809 --> 00:37:37,519
ahead Tatey. So the reason

867
00:37:37,519 --> 00:37:40,679
there's two limitations that are applied under RCCD one of

868
00:37:40,679 --> 00:37:42,360
those states that

869
00:37:42,360 --> 00:37:45,239
there be ground floor commercial development as part of a

870
00:37:45,239 --> 00:37:45,800
mixed-use

871
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:48,230
development to get multifamily on the upper stories of a

872
00:37:48,230 --> 00:37:49,639
building the second

873
00:37:49,639 --> 00:37:52,400
limitation requires that it either be part of a mixed-use

874
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:53,480
development or with

875
00:37:53,480 --> 00:37:57,960
an SUP. One of those limitations carries over into RCR2 and

876
00:37:57,960 --> 00:37:58,239
it's the

877
00:37:58,239 --> 00:38:01,000
second that allows either a mixed-use development or

878
00:38:01,000 --> 00:38:02,940
approval of an SUP and so

879
00:38:02,940 --> 00:38:06,650
in this case they chose not to provide that commercial and

880
00:38:06,650 --> 00:38:08,079
sought the SUP. That

881
00:38:08,079 --> 00:38:11,519
makes sense. Is the second question to have is the parking

882
00:38:11,519 --> 00:38:12,280
requirement one to

883
00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:18,349
one unit to parking spot? For so for the northern property

884
00:38:18,349 --> 00:38:21,119
that you see here the

885
00:38:21,119 --> 00:38:23,360
parking requirement is broken down based on the number of

886
00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:24,280
bedrooms there is a

887
00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:28,230
provision in the DDC for senior housing to be able to one

888
00:38:28,230 --> 00:38:29,679
to one ratio so that

889
00:38:29,679 --> 00:38:33,159
would apply to the southern portion of the development. I

890
00:38:33,159 --> 00:38:33,239
didn't do the calculations but is

891
00:38:33,239 --> 00:38:37,980
the calculations for the the northern I guess the stand it

892
00:38:37,980 --> 00:38:39,559
's the standard one

893
00:38:39,559 --> 00:38:43,750
it's 462 spots is that how many beds they have? No the

894
00:38:43,750 --> 00:38:45,960
ratios depend on the

895
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:48,829
number of bedrooms so a one bedroom unit I believe is

896
00:38:48,829 --> 00:38:51,280
parked at 1.25 one and a

897
00:38:51,280 --> 00:38:54,809
half spaces and then that number changes based on the

898
00:38:54,809 --> 00:38:56,880
number of bedrooms. So my

899
00:38:56,880 --> 00:39:00,360
question is the 472 the minimum does it meet it is it above

900
00:39:00,360 --> 00:39:01,400
where does that the

901
00:39:01,400 --> 00:39:05,639
472 parking spaces? That is the correct number of spaces.

902
00:39:05,639 --> 00:39:06,559
It's the minimum? Yes

903
00:39:06,559 --> 00:39:11,219
yeah it meets the requirement. Okay perfect okay thanks. Mr

904
00:39:11,219 --> 00:39:12,679
. Beck. Thank you

905
00:39:12,679 --> 00:39:16,539
chair. First just let me state as a senior who likes to

906
00:39:16,539 --> 00:39:17,400
ride his bike I'm

907
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:21,000
sorely disappointed that they are not planning on putting

908
00:39:21,000 --> 00:39:22,519
bicycle lanes and

909
00:39:22,519 --> 00:39:29,409
racks in there. To be clear these are not SROs. No. Okay.

910
00:39:29,409 --> 00:39:31,400
Information provided that

911
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:35,960
there will be 40 on-street parking spaces allotted I'm

912
00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:36,639
assuming these will

913
00:39:36,639 --> 00:39:41,480
be on Hudson Wood that being the only street there. Yes

914
00:39:41,480 --> 00:39:42,760
yeah there are parking

915
00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:44,840
spaces shown here along Hudson Wood on the north and south

916
00:39:44,840 --> 00:39:45,480
side of the drive.

917
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:53,159
North and south okay. Would the and you talked about in the

918
00:39:53,159 --> 00:39:55,079
backup background

919
00:39:55,079 --> 00:39:58,889
information talked about 8% of the area would be open space

920
00:39:58,889 --> 00:40:00,239
is that what the the

921
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:02,960
pool courtyard area? The pool can count towards that open

922
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:04,000
space it's intended to

923
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:07,019
be any recreational space so here on the northern side you

924
00:40:07,019 --> 00:40:08,079
can see I did circle

925
00:40:08,079 --> 00:40:10,329
in blue and forgot to mention they have open spaces kind of

926
00:40:10,329 --> 00:40:11,840
courtyards intended

927
00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:16,519
between the buildings and that does include a pool. Okay.

928
00:40:22,519 --> 00:40:26,530
Also in the illustrations I had it indicated there was a

929
00:40:26,530 --> 00:40:28,559
retention

930
00:40:28,559 --> 00:40:34,730
detention pond inside the Hudson compound. Yeah. Yes they

931
00:40:34,730 --> 00:40:36,480
are proposing a pond on

932
00:40:36,480 --> 00:40:39,500
the interior of this development as well as that separate

933
00:40:39,500 --> 00:40:40,440
detention pond I

934
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:44,110
believe the amount of volume they needed to treat required

935
00:40:44,110 --> 00:40:45,400
both of those areas.

936
00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:49,039
Okay so I'm assuming this is probably gonna be decorated up

937
00:40:49,039 --> 00:40:50,800
to have the appeal of a park or something.

938
00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:54,630
I would assume so and I don't think they show a little bit

939
00:40:54,630 --> 00:40:55,559
of landscaping on here

940
00:40:55,559 --> 00:40:58,250
but I'm not sure what their exact aesthetic plans are for

941
00:40:58,250 --> 00:41:00,000
that pond. Okay

942
00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:03,199
and appreciate the fact that the developers proposing a

943
00:41:03,199 --> 00:41:04,000
type B 10-foot

944
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:09,070
landscape barrier on the north end but can you go back to

945
00:41:09,070 --> 00:41:10,800
your Google shot of

946
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:15,880
what the property actually looks like? If you I don't know

947
00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:17,119
if you can get any close up but on the

948
00:41:17,119 --> 00:41:21,150
north side on that other lot that's not part of this there

949
00:41:21,150 --> 00:41:21,719
's a lot of

950
00:41:21,719 --> 00:41:28,070
trees there so do we need that 10-foot barrier at this time

951
00:41:28,070 --> 00:41:29,559
? I'm not certain if

952
00:41:29,559 --> 00:41:34,559
those trees fall on their property or on the other property

953
00:41:34,559 --> 00:41:35,480
but at this time

954
00:41:35,480 --> 00:41:38,639
because this has an existing residential use as does this

955
00:41:38,639 --> 00:41:40,039
they're proposing that

956
00:41:40,039 --> 00:41:43,260
buffer to provide that in case those trees go away with any

957
00:41:43,260 --> 00:41:44,280
future development

958
00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:46,690
on the northern property. Okay and I raise it a little bit

959
00:41:46,690 --> 00:41:47,679
I gotta let me just

960
00:41:47,679 --> 00:41:49,559
make a brief statement here I'm worried about how this

961
00:41:49,559 --> 00:41:51,039
development will impact

962
00:41:51,039 --> 00:41:55,159
the land immediately north of it the dense cluster of trees

963
00:41:55,159 --> 00:41:56,199
there will surely

964
00:41:56,199 --> 00:42:02,269
be impacted if this sort of development is expanded as per

965
00:42:02,269 --> 00:42:03,639
our future land use

966
00:42:03,639 --> 00:42:08,000
map that's quite possible. As we prepare to update our tree

967
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:08,920
code that seeks to

968
00:42:08,920 --> 00:42:12,519
preserve at least 30% tree canopy this is one of those

969
00:42:12,519 --> 00:42:14,559
areas that Haywood

970
00:42:14,559 --> 00:42:17,380
talked about that's in an undeveloped area that we could

971
00:42:17,380 --> 00:42:18,519
lose that and I would

972
00:42:18,519 --> 00:42:24,940
seriously hope that city planning somebody within the city

973
00:42:24,940 --> 00:42:26,440
playing part

974
00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:29,300
maybe even parks and recreation would recognize this

975
00:42:29,300 --> 00:42:30,920
potential problem as we

976
00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:33,610
move forward and seek ways to some of this land aside from

977
00:42:33,610 --> 00:42:35,480
green space and/or

978
00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:38,000
a park area that would benefit the expanding communities

979
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:38,840
that are going up

980
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:41,440
there because if you realize if you take a look at this

981
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:42,639
there isn't any park area

982
00:42:42,639 --> 00:42:45,800
over there at all no real green open space and if we're

983
00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:46,559
going to open this up

984
00:42:46,559 --> 00:42:49,440
to this kind of development it seems like a real good place

985
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:50,360
to put a park and

986
00:42:50,360 --> 00:42:53,670
kind of kill two birds with one stone preserve those trees

987
00:42:53,670 --> 00:42:55,280
as best we can so I

988
00:42:55,280 --> 00:42:59,139
just wanted that to go into the record and that we don't

989
00:42:59,139 --> 00:43:00,599
overlook that as we

990
00:43:00,599 --> 00:43:04,280
move forward and developers come in and want to build

991
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:06,639
something there okay thank

992
00:43:06,639 --> 00:43:08,719
you

993
00:43:11,480 --> 00:43:21,900
any other questions for staff? I think we're going to call

994
00:43:21,900 --> 00:43:24,239
a recess here at 5 50

995
00:43:24,239 --> 00:43:28,000
and get food right quick and then get back in here as quick

996
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:28,880
as we can but I

997
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:32,039
know we've got two big items to still try to get in and

998
00:43:32,039 --> 00:43:33,079
done before work

999
00:43:33,079 --> 00:43:40,519
sessions over recess 5 50. Good afternoon and welcome back

1000
00:43:40,519 --> 00:43:42,280
to our work session I

1001
00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:47,690
might call us back in order at 5 57 I think our next order

1002
00:43:47,690 --> 00:43:49,360
of business will be

1003
00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:55,650
to get an update on our public hearing or it's gonna be

1004
00:43:55,650 --> 00:43:58,039
item Z 16 - 0 0 2 3

1005
00:43:58,039 --> 00:44:05,480
part 7 I believe. I'm gonna call on Julie Wyatt for

1006
00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:11,360
presentation of that. Good

1007
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:13,610
evening I'm Julie Wyatt senior planner with the city of

1008
00:44:13,610 --> 00:44:14,440
Denton I know we've

1009
00:44:14,440 --> 00:44:16,650
been over some of this so I'll go quickly on some parts

1010
00:44:16,650 --> 00:44:17,280
some parts we

1011
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:19,420
didn't actually get to you in the last work session we'll

1012
00:44:19,420 --> 00:44:20,119
take a little more

1013
00:44:20,119 --> 00:44:22,739
time with that I know we're we're bumping up against the

1014
00:44:22,739 --> 00:44:25,940
clock but so the

1015
00:44:25,940 --> 00:44:30,030
location to remind you the location of the subject property

1016
00:44:30,030 --> 00:44:30,840
is south of

1017
00:44:30,840 --> 00:44:36,579
Scripture between normal and Bryan it's about 1250 feet

1018
00:44:36,579 --> 00:44:38,039
north of the UNT campus

1019
00:44:38,039 --> 00:44:42,469
which is about a five to ten minute walk. I should also

1020
00:44:42,469 --> 00:44:44,420
mention that the request

1021
00:44:44,420 --> 00:44:48,320
includes three parcels there's one larger parcel here and

1022
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:49,360
then two smaller

1023
00:44:49,360 --> 00:44:52,190
parcels you can see that my yellow line that shows the

1024
00:44:52,190 --> 00:44:53,480
subject property cuts

1025
00:44:53,480 --> 00:44:56,309
through this larger parcel that one has split zoning and we

1026
00:44:56,309 --> 00:44:57,320
'll see that in just

1027
00:44:57,320 --> 00:45:01,630
a minute. So the request before you is to consider rezoning

1028
00:45:01,630 --> 00:45:03,320
approximately 1.39

1029
00:45:03,320 --> 00:45:06,559
acres from downtown residential to district to downtown

1030
00:45:06,559 --> 00:45:08,119
commercial general

1031
00:45:08,119 --> 00:45:13,440
district. So we'll take at the current current zoning and

1032
00:45:13,440 --> 00:45:14,800
land use pattern if

1033
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:17,420
you remember my busy map from two weeks ago we're gonna go

1034
00:45:17,420 --> 00:45:18,199
over it briefly

1035
00:45:18,199 --> 00:45:23,230
again. So here is the subject property again it's outlined

1036
00:45:23,230 --> 00:45:25,000
in black this this

1037
00:45:25,000 --> 00:45:28,679
large parcel here's where that split zoning comes into play

1038
00:45:28,679 --> 00:45:30,320
the north part of

1039
00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:34,239
this large parcel already has the DCG zoning district the

1040
00:45:34,239 --> 00:45:35,559
southern part is

1041
00:45:35,559 --> 00:45:40,039
that dr2 it is the subject property is situated in about a

1042
00:45:40,039 --> 00:45:41,119
four block area

1043
00:45:41,119 --> 00:45:45,079
that's north of the UNT campus that's a real mixed use area

1044
00:45:45,079 --> 00:45:46,599
it includes single

1045
00:45:46,599 --> 00:45:50,710
family single family that functions as multifamily multif

1046
00:45:50,710 --> 00:45:52,559
amily dwellings and

1047
00:45:52,559 --> 00:45:55,719
commercial development so there's a lot going on in that

1048
00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:56,360
four block four block

1049
00:45:56,360 --> 00:46:00,530
area and the subject property is actually developed with a

1050
00:46:00,530 --> 00:46:01,300
commercial

1051
00:46:01,300 --> 00:46:03,949
building or an institutional building that's been vacant

1052
00:46:03,949 --> 00:46:05,519
for some time and

1053
00:46:05,519 --> 00:46:08,679
then also there's two single family dwellings on the on the

1054
00:46:08,679 --> 00:46:09,519
additional two

1055
00:46:09,519 --> 00:46:13,409
parcels. If we'll look if we'll take a broader look at the

1056
00:46:13,409 --> 00:46:14,880
area and look at the

1057
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:18,250
surrounding neighborhoods from that from the from the

1058
00:46:18,250 --> 00:46:20,360
adjacent properties you'll

1059
00:46:20,360 --> 00:46:23,960
see that there the surrounding neighborhoods are

1060
00:46:23,960 --> 00:46:24,559
traditional

1061
00:46:24,559 --> 00:46:28,760
established neighborhoods they have a zoning designation of

1062
00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:30,079
primarily in our

1063
00:46:30,079 --> 00:46:33,960
three that doesn't permit multifamily it's it's one of our

1064
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:34,639
low density

1065
00:46:34,639 --> 00:46:38,130
residential zoning districts it doesn't permit commercial

1066
00:46:38,130 --> 00:46:38,920
or multifamily

1067
00:46:38,920 --> 00:46:42,989
development. If you'll look just to the north of the of the

1068
00:46:42,989 --> 00:46:44,400
request across

1069
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:48,829
scripture you'll see you've got NRMU 12 as well as NRMU

1070
00:46:48,829 --> 00:46:50,119
these areas are

1071
00:46:50,119 --> 00:46:53,929
developed with multifamily uses also some single family and

1072
00:46:53,929 --> 00:46:55,159
some office uses

1073
00:46:55,159 --> 00:46:59,280
so there's there's mixed use in this area as well and then

1074
00:46:59,280 --> 00:47:01,239
in those areas that

1075
00:47:01,239 --> 00:47:04,119
have that in our three zoning district designation those

1076
00:47:04,119 --> 00:47:04,840
established

1077
00:47:04,840 --> 00:47:08,019
neighborhoods we have an additional layer on some of those

1078
00:47:08,019 --> 00:47:08,840
and that's our

1079
00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:12,000
historic districts we have the West Oak Historic District

1080
00:47:12,000 --> 00:47:13,039
here and then the Oak

1081
00:47:13,039 --> 00:47:16,510
Hickory Historic District here those if there are any

1082
00:47:16,510 --> 00:47:18,079
facade changes proposed

1083
00:47:18,079 --> 00:47:22,510
for any structures within those districts they would be

1084
00:47:22,510 --> 00:47:23,480
required to

1085
00:47:23,480 --> 00:47:26,980
obtain approval for a certificate of appropriateness from

1086
00:47:26,980 --> 00:47:27,760
the Historic

1087
00:47:27,760 --> 00:47:31,260
Landmark Commission so that's an additional layer on those

1088
00:47:31,260 --> 00:47:32,199
areas and then

1089
00:47:32,199 --> 00:47:39,349
to the south here we have the UNT campus any questions on

1090
00:47:39,349 --> 00:47:41,079
that okay so the future

1091
00:47:41,079 --> 00:47:44,239
land use is neighborhood university compatibility area and

1092
00:47:44,239 --> 00:47:45,119
that encompasses

1093
00:47:45,119 --> 00:47:50,500
kind of this this four block area north of UNT and these

1094
00:47:50,500 --> 00:47:51,559
are areas that are

1095
00:47:51,559 --> 00:47:55,130
affected by the universities within our city and in this

1096
00:47:55,130 --> 00:47:56,719
instance it's UNT but

1097
00:47:56,719 --> 00:48:02,789
this also affects TWU in some instances the intent is to

1098
00:48:02,789 --> 00:48:03,960
create compatible form

1099
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:07,119
and land uses for areas that serve both the established

1100
00:48:07,119 --> 00:48:08,679
neighborhoods as well as

1101
00:48:08,679 --> 00:48:13,880
the universities UNT is growing they intend to grow they're

1102
00:48:13,880 --> 00:48:14,239
planning on

1103
00:48:14,239 --> 00:48:17,610
growing and so this is these areas are intended to serve

1104
00:48:17,610 --> 00:48:18,880
those university as

1105
00:48:18,880 --> 00:48:23,199
well as neighborhood areas the intent is to provide gradual

1106
00:48:23,199 --> 00:48:24,800
transition in scale

1107
00:48:24,800 --> 00:48:28,329
use and character and also to encourage uses in close

1108
00:48:28,329 --> 00:48:30,599
proximity to encourage

1109
00:48:30,599 --> 00:48:35,570
walking bicycling the multimodal transportation so you can

1110
00:48:35,570 --> 00:48:36,199
see that the

1111
00:48:36,199 --> 00:48:39,150
the future land use map kind of coincides with some of the

1112
00:48:39,150 --> 00:48:40,039
zoning that we

1113
00:48:40,039 --> 00:48:42,860
have and that those areas that have that in our three

1114
00:48:42,860 --> 00:48:45,800
zoning designation are our

1115
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:49,070
the future land use designation is that low density

1116
00:48:49,070 --> 00:48:50,800
residential and then that

1117
00:48:50,800 --> 00:48:55,400
area with the NRMU and NRMU 12 is community or I'm sorry

1118
00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:55,880
neighborhood

1119
00:48:55,880 --> 00:48:58,769
mixed use so that coincides with some of the zoning that's

1120
00:48:58,769 --> 00:49:00,719
already in place so

1121
00:49:00,719 --> 00:49:02,889
the considerations that we looked at when we analyzed the

1122
00:49:02,889 --> 00:49:03,719
request first of all

1123
00:49:03,719 --> 00:49:06,239
we looked at subchapter three of the Denton development

1124
00:49:06,239 --> 00:49:07,320
code the criteria for

1125
00:49:07,320 --> 00:49:10,579
approval the first does it meet does the request meet the

1126
00:49:10,579 --> 00:49:11,360
future land use

1127
00:49:11,360 --> 00:49:16,559
designation of neighborhood university compatibility DCG

1128
00:49:16,559 --> 00:49:19,300
and does have the

1129
00:49:19,300 --> 00:49:24,320
density and the types of uses that that you typically see

1130
00:49:24,320 --> 00:49:26,119
within a university

1131
00:49:26,119 --> 00:49:28,800
area so it provides that density and commercial development

1132
00:49:28,800 --> 00:49:29,320
within the

1133
00:49:29,320 --> 00:49:33,079
proximity of DCG because of the uses and the density f

1134
00:49:33,079 --> 00:49:34,599
osters walkability

1135
00:49:34,599 --> 00:49:39,989
livability and a vibrancy on a track that's been in disuse

1136
00:49:39,989 --> 00:49:41,400
for several years

1137
00:49:41,400 --> 00:49:44,960
staff looked at it as potentially a catalyst for revital

1138
00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:46,000
ization in that

1139
00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:50,210
area between UNT and those established neighborhoods and

1140
00:49:50,210 --> 00:49:51,440
this current zoning

1141
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:54,869
pattern provides the physical barriers necessary to

1142
00:49:54,869 --> 00:49:56,440
transition between the

1143
00:49:56,440 --> 00:50:00,670
higher intensity and density development that DCG has and

1144
00:50:00,670 --> 00:50:01,639
then the lower

1145
00:50:01,639 --> 00:50:04,989
intensity development in the surrounding neighborhoods let

1146
00:50:04,989 --> 00:50:06,119
's look at a map so

1147
00:50:06,119 --> 00:50:10,760
show you what I mean so for instance this existing DCG

1148
00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:12,719
permits development to

1149
00:50:12,719 --> 00:50:17,599
a height of 100 feet however the the dr2 that's adjacent to

1150
00:50:17,599 --> 00:50:18,920
the those in our three

1151
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:22,460
neighborhoods only permits development to a height of 45

1152
00:50:22,460 --> 00:50:25,239
feet the NRMU and NRMU

1153
00:50:25,239 --> 00:50:28,630
12 also stepped down the development I believe NRMU permits

1154
00:50:28,630 --> 00:50:29,679
a maximum height of

1155
00:50:29,679 --> 00:50:34,480
65 feet so it it scales down the development from that DCG

1156
00:50:34,480 --> 00:50:35,760
to those those

1157
00:50:35,760 --> 00:50:40,909
neighborhoods surrounding the other criteria for approval

1158
00:50:40,909 --> 00:50:42,360
is as is there

1159
00:50:42,360 --> 00:50:46,719
adequate infrastructure to support development in the area

1160
00:50:46,719 --> 00:50:47,679
infrastructure

1161
00:50:47,679 --> 00:50:50,980
needs assessment will be done at the time of platting and

1162
00:50:50,980 --> 00:50:52,119
also site plan and

1163
00:50:52,119 --> 00:50:56,369
of course it comes without saying that any development that

1164
00:50:56,369 --> 00:50:57,360
wants to get a

1165
00:50:57,360 --> 00:51:00,150
building permit or site plan approval must meet the

1166
00:51:00,150 --> 00:51:01,119
infrastructure

1167
00:51:01,119 --> 00:51:04,039
requirements within the Denton Development Code in order to

1168
00:51:04,039 --> 00:51:04,360
obtain

1169
00:51:04,360 --> 00:51:10,429
those permits other considerations we looked at the

1170
00:51:10,429 --> 00:51:11,320
proposed rezoning does

1171
00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:14,570
include the three tracks the one larger which has the split

1172
00:51:14,570 --> 00:51:15,679
zoning and then the

1173
00:51:15,679 --> 00:51:20,679
two smaller ones the and the intent of this rezoning is to

1174
00:51:20,679 --> 00:51:21,599
consolidate the

1175
00:51:21,599 --> 00:51:25,460
zoning designation in this area and that the site is

1176
00:51:25,460 --> 00:51:27,440
currently underutilized with

1177
00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:31,320
the vacant building on the site and the rezoning would

1178
00:51:31,320 --> 00:51:33,719
permit the entire property

1179
00:51:33,719 --> 00:51:37,289
to redevelop under consistent zoning regulations resulting

1180
00:51:37,289 --> 00:51:38,159
in a more cohesive

1181
00:51:38,159 --> 00:51:42,159
development and we'll look at a map so the applicant has

1182
00:51:42,159 --> 00:51:43,639
expressed an interest

1183
00:51:43,639 --> 00:51:46,869
to develop a total of three acres so it would be the

1184
00:51:46,869 --> 00:51:48,679
subject property which is

1185
00:51:48,679 --> 00:51:52,239
in red and then and then the property to the north so

1186
00:51:52,239 --> 00:51:53,920
encompasses a total of three

1187
00:51:53,920 --> 00:51:58,639
acres so the rezoning to DCG would allow this to develop

1188
00:51:58,639 --> 00:51:59,719
under those consistent

1189
00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:06,250
DCG zoning regulations to allow consistent development I've

1190
00:52:06,250 --> 00:52:06,880
got site

1191
00:52:06,880 --> 00:52:09,400
photos once again I've used some of Google because they do

1192
00:52:09,400 --> 00:52:09,960
better job than

1193
00:52:09,960 --> 00:52:14,389
me so here is normal Street looking north towards Scripture

1194
00:52:14,389 --> 00:52:15,599
here is one of

1195
00:52:15,599 --> 00:52:18,780
those what here's one of the subject property and one is

1196
00:52:18,780 --> 00:52:20,000
off-camera here's

1197
00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:24,730
here's that use that's adjacent to Scripture this is on

1198
00:52:24,730 --> 00:52:26,440
Bryan Street looking

1199
00:52:26,440 --> 00:52:30,570
north once again there's the subject property and then here

1200
00:52:30,570 --> 00:52:31,440
's some of the

1201
00:52:31,440 --> 00:52:34,880
photos of development that's across the street I believe

1202
00:52:34,880 --> 00:52:36,039
this is on normal and

1203
00:52:36,039 --> 00:52:38,539
then these two are on Scripture so just shows you kind of

1204
00:52:38,539 --> 00:52:39,760
what what the area is

1205
00:52:39,760 --> 00:52:44,380
like additional considerations we looked at there were two

1206
00:52:44,380 --> 00:52:45,280
neighborhood meetings

1207
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:48,269
associated with this request and one of the one of the

1208
00:52:48,269 --> 00:52:49,119
concerns was

1209
00:52:49,119 --> 00:52:52,320
compatibility in scale and that's something that the future

1210
00:52:52,320 --> 00:52:52,800
land use

1211
00:52:52,800 --> 00:52:58,030
designation also talks about and so staff looked at that

1212
00:52:58,030 --> 00:52:58,860
and the DIN

1213
00:52:58,860 --> 00:53:02,760
development code does have some requirements in it that

1214
00:53:02,760 --> 00:53:05,719
that work to

1215
00:53:05,719 --> 00:53:09,440
address differences in scale and to address compatibility

1216
00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:10,400
issues in site

1217
00:53:10,400 --> 00:53:14,010
design so one of those is the residential proximity slope

1218
00:53:14,010 --> 00:53:14,360
so if

1219
00:53:14,360 --> 00:53:19,400
someone is is proposing a multifamily development and it's

1220
00:53:19,400 --> 00:53:21,840
adjacent to to a

1221
00:53:21,840 --> 00:53:25,139
single-family residential development either by property

1222
00:53:25,139 --> 00:53:26,159
line or across the

1223
00:53:26,159 --> 00:53:29,599
street so across the right-of-way that multifamily

1224
00:53:29,599 --> 00:53:30,880
development would have to

1225
00:53:30,880 --> 00:53:34,119
comply with the residential proximity slope the intent of

1226
00:53:34,119 --> 00:53:35,159
this is to ensure

1227
00:53:35,159 --> 00:53:39,829
that the that development maintains a human scale on this

1228
00:53:39,829 --> 00:53:41,360
on the street on the

1229
00:53:41,360 --> 00:53:44,989
sidewalk and the adjacent property so here's how it's

1230
00:53:44,989 --> 00:53:47,639
calculated you go up 40

1231
00:53:47,639 --> 00:53:51,940
feet and then you step the development back at an angle of

1232
00:53:51,940 --> 00:53:53,960
35 degrees from that

1233
00:53:53,960 --> 00:53:59,519
40 feet so it not only is is used at the property line it's

1234
00:53:59,519 --> 00:54:01,639
also used when when

1235
00:54:01,639 --> 00:54:04,840
abutting a single-family use or district across the street

1236
00:54:04,840 --> 00:54:06,679
so it's in order to

1237
00:54:06,679 --> 00:54:10,409
maintain or to minimize the visual impact of that

1238
00:54:10,409 --> 00:54:12,480
development on the street

1239
00:54:12,480 --> 00:54:16,239
also I know this was this was a big question at the last

1240
00:54:16,239 --> 00:54:17,079
meeting so

1241
00:54:17,079 --> 00:54:20,369
hopefully I will say it better this time so there are also

1242
00:54:20,369 --> 00:54:21,760
minimum setbacks and

1243
00:54:21,760 --> 00:54:24,679
buffers within the didn't development code now after our

1244
00:54:24,679 --> 00:54:25,679
discussion at the

1245
00:54:25,679 --> 00:54:28,840
last meeting we went back and looked at it and these don't

1246
00:54:28,840 --> 00:54:29,800
actually apply to

1247
00:54:29,800 --> 00:54:33,460
this development because there's no single-family use

1248
00:54:33,460 --> 00:54:34,800
adjacent to this to

1249
00:54:34,800 --> 00:54:39,059
this property within the area but it's part of a larger

1250
00:54:39,059 --> 00:54:40,920
discussion and how our

1251
00:54:40,920 --> 00:54:44,869
mixed-use districts and how a mix of uses actually can can

1252
00:54:44,869 --> 00:54:46,079
be placed next to

1253
00:54:46,079 --> 00:54:50,440
each other and be compatible and form commissioner back

1254
00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:51,679
thank you chair Judy

1255
00:54:51,679 --> 00:54:56,639
said there's no residential dwelling that butts up against

1256
00:54:56,639 --> 00:54:58,559
this it is actually it

1257
00:54:58,559 --> 00:55:05,880
functions as a multifamily okay because that that is the

1258
00:55:05,880 --> 00:55:08,519
one on the south side

1259
00:55:08,519 --> 00:55:13,039
of the yes sir yes sir thanks so so we I just wanted to be

1260
00:55:13,039 --> 00:55:15,559
sure that's good

1261
00:55:19,639 --> 00:55:30,960
I'm calculating okay no I that's troublesome the it's a

1262
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:33,559
house and it's

1263
00:55:33,559 --> 00:55:38,719
not mandated how it function I would think and and so I

1264
00:55:38,719 --> 00:55:39,599
think when you're

1265
00:55:39,599 --> 00:55:43,139
talking about it's functioning as a multifamily now that

1266
00:55:43,139 --> 00:55:44,639
doesn't carry on in

1267
00:55:44,639 --> 00:55:50,050
perpetuity I would think am I right that that that could

1268
00:55:50,050 --> 00:55:52,559
vacillate so then we're

1269
00:55:52,559 --> 00:55:56,780
using something that could vacillate by lease to make a

1270
00:55:56,780 --> 00:55:58,440
decision that won't

1271
00:55:58,440 --> 00:56:02,480
vacillate am I that they're not gonna move their building

1272
00:56:02,480 --> 00:56:03,960
but we're gonna base

1273
00:56:03,960 --> 00:56:08,280
what they do with their building on something that that's

1274
00:56:08,280 --> 00:56:10,000
kit it's governed

1275
00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:14,130
by a lease am I right I guess I'll try to respond to that

1276
00:56:14,130 --> 00:56:15,519
and I'm an all-main

1277
00:56:15,519 --> 00:56:18,880
say but we do look at that use at that point in time at

1278
00:56:18,880 --> 00:56:20,559
time of development and

1279
00:56:20,559 --> 00:56:25,159
and these setbacks as well as buffers talk about use and

1280
00:56:25,159 --> 00:56:27,000
not zoning districts

1281
00:56:27,000 --> 00:56:31,449
so you're actually budding so you're actually your those

1282
00:56:31,449 --> 00:56:32,760
design guidelines

1283
00:56:32,760 --> 00:56:36,500
are applied in terms of the use which is merely a

1284
00:56:36,500 --> 00:56:38,679
requirement of the Denton

1285
00:56:38,679 --> 00:56:42,539
Development Code that we would be implementing right I

1286
00:56:42,539 --> 00:56:43,840
guess I guess my

1287
00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:49,909
point would be I just I mean just overall I have a problem

1288
00:56:49,909 --> 00:56:50,480
governing

1289
00:56:50,480 --> 00:56:54,599
something that won't move by something I mean because I'm

1290
00:56:54,599 --> 00:56:56,719
certain you tip your

1291
00:56:56,719 --> 00:57:00,039
hand almost to where that person says okay well now there's

1292
00:57:00,039 --> 00:57:01,079
one person I mean

1293
00:57:01,079 --> 00:57:03,010
I just don't even know how we go about getting that

1294
00:57:03,010 --> 00:57:04,119
information I think the

1295
00:57:04,119 --> 00:57:07,010
intent and I'm sorry to interrupt no I apologize that was

1296
00:57:07,010 --> 00:57:08,639
rude the intent of

1297
00:57:08,639 --> 00:57:13,010
that requirement if we use another example to explain why

1298
00:57:13,010 --> 00:57:13,880
it's being

1299
00:57:13,880 --> 00:57:18,949
implemented here is because it it's not specific to just a

1300
00:57:18,949 --> 00:57:20,400
certain zoning

1301
00:57:20,400 --> 00:57:24,840
district so if we look at our industrial or non residential

1302
00:57:24,840 --> 00:57:25,880
zoning districts

1303
00:57:25,880 --> 00:57:29,039
because of the way the build out or the built-out

1304
00:57:29,039 --> 00:57:30,820
environment is we have a lot

1305
00:57:30,820 --> 00:57:34,579
of residential uses that may not be in a residential zoning

1306
00:57:34,579 --> 00:57:36,360
district however the

1307
00:57:36,360 --> 00:57:40,019
abutting zoning and use is not residential so in an effort

1308
00:57:40,019 --> 00:57:41,840
to protect

1309
00:57:41,840 --> 00:57:46,119
residential structures or loan residential structures in

1310
00:57:46,119 --> 00:57:46,800
non

1311
00:57:46,800 --> 00:57:50,989
residential zoning districts to visually screen or provide

1312
00:57:50,989 --> 00:57:52,559
some kind of mechanism

1313
00:57:52,559 --> 00:57:56,590
physical mechanism to be a good neighbor so to speak for

1314
00:57:56,590 --> 00:57:57,719
the lack of a better

1315
00:57:57,719 --> 00:58:01,889
phrase is why it would why that intent was built into the

1316
00:58:01,889 --> 00:58:03,320
Development Code

1317
00:58:03,320 --> 00:58:08,000
Commissioner Ozil thank you I just wanted to maybe add on

1318
00:58:08,000 --> 00:58:09,079
to Commissioner

1319
00:58:09,079 --> 00:58:13,730
Hesbeth just so I understand if that single family detached

1320
00:58:13,730 --> 00:58:14,360
home had one

1321
00:58:14,360 --> 00:58:18,920
family living in it it would be 20 feet that's setback

1322
00:58:18,920 --> 00:58:20,079
right 20 foot setback

1323
00:58:20,079 --> 00:58:23,239
not a buffer right yes sir so it'd be a 20 foot setback and

1324
00:58:23,239 --> 00:58:24,679
they can build 10

1325
00:58:24,679 --> 00:58:29,789
stories so that could be 70 feet above 30 so if that to

1326
00:58:29,789 --> 00:58:31,119
Commissioner's point if

1327
00:58:31,119 --> 00:58:35,699
it was a single family living there that setback would be

1328
00:58:35,699 --> 00:58:38,079
90 feet but because

1329
00:58:38,079 --> 00:58:41,619
there's two people living there there's no setback above

1330
00:58:41,619 --> 00:58:43,039
and beyond currently

1331
00:58:43,039 --> 00:58:47,360
that's my understanding so let's let's talk about if I can

1332
00:58:47,360 --> 00:58:48,880
attack your question

1333
00:58:48,880 --> 00:58:54,949
differently to answer it the reason why the use is not

1334
00:58:54,949 --> 00:58:56,800
being classified as a

1335
00:58:56,800 --> 00:59:00,900
single-family residence is because there are multiple

1336
00:59:00,900 --> 00:59:02,559
meters so in terms of how

1337
00:59:02,559 --> 00:59:05,199
many people are living there I don't know but that

1338
00:59:05,199 --> 00:59:06,280
structure has been

1339
00:59:06,280 --> 00:59:09,989
converted from a single-family dwelling unit to use of

1340
00:59:09,989 --> 00:59:11,840
multiple bedrooms within

1341
00:59:11,840 --> 00:59:15,030
that dwelling in it which then changes its use as it

1342
00:59:15,030 --> 00:59:16,800
relates to the setback I

1343
00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:19,530
believe you are correct when we do the calculation but the

1344
00:59:19,530 --> 00:59:20,519
setback is from the

1345
00:59:20,519 --> 00:59:24,079
use so we would actually determine and Julie correct me if

1346
00:59:24,079 --> 00:59:25,460
I'm wrong please we

1347
00:59:25,460 --> 00:59:29,059
would actually determine the setback from the structure

1348
00:59:29,059 --> 00:59:30,400
itself and you would

1349
00:59:30,400 --> 00:59:34,389
work backwards 20 feet and then from there start adding on

1350
00:59:34,389 --> 00:59:35,519
depending on the

1351
00:59:35,519 --> 00:59:38,320
height of your building and of course the height of your

1352
00:59:38,320 --> 00:59:39,360
building depending on

1353
00:59:39,360 --> 00:59:43,679
the zoning district would then dictate so yes would it imp

1354
00:59:43,679 --> 00:59:44,760
ede potentially I

1355
00:59:44,760 --> 00:59:48,000
believe impede is an incorrect word but would it impact the

1356
00:59:48,000 --> 00:59:49,000
height of a building

1357
00:59:49,000 --> 00:59:52,670
or a structure adjacent to a single-family use it could

1358
00:59:52,670 --> 00:59:53,440
potentially is

1359
00:59:53,440 --> 00:59:56,599
depending on the size of the lot too okay and that's all

1360
00:59:56,599 --> 00:59:57,599
governed by the

1361
00:59:57,599 --> 01:00:01,260
development yes and just for my identification this is

1362
01:00:01,260 --> 01:00:01,920
slightly

1363
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:04,829
opt-out fix it'll be a quick question if there is a shed or

1364
01:00:04,829 --> 01:00:06,480
detached garage then

1365
01:00:06,480 --> 01:00:10,909
the setback would be for that building so if it was a

1366
01:00:10,909 --> 01:00:12,880
residential use so a shed

1367
01:00:12,880 --> 01:00:15,659
or a detached garage would not then it would be the

1368
01:00:15,659 --> 01:00:17,519
residential use itself okay

1369
01:00:17,519 --> 01:00:23,760
thank you and then also landscape by person yes mr. Taylor

1370
01:00:23,760 --> 01:00:24,119
so I just want to

1371
01:00:24,119 --> 01:00:26,500
I'm gonna clarify this because I I haven't heard this

1372
01:00:26,500 --> 01:00:27,239
definition of

1373
01:00:27,239 --> 01:00:31,139
multi-family before and the other commissioners were

1374
01:00:31,139 --> 01:00:32,519
talking about leases

1375
01:00:32,519 --> 01:00:35,159
but you're saying it's because there are two meters two

1376
01:00:35,159 --> 01:00:37,159
electric meters I believe

1377
01:00:37,159 --> 01:00:41,059
there more than two meters on the side which then begs the

1378
01:00:41,059 --> 01:00:42,320
question is it being

1379
01:00:42,320 --> 01:00:46,329
used as a single-family residence or is it being used as

1380
01:00:46,329 --> 01:00:47,840
not a multi-family

1381
01:00:47,840 --> 01:00:51,280
complex but is it used being used for multiple residents

1382
01:00:51,280 --> 01:00:52,000
use yeah and so I

1383
01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:54,519
think this is this is a I'm almost certain that that

1384
01:00:54,519 --> 01:00:55,480
definition isn't

1385
01:00:55,480 --> 01:00:59,039
outlined in the DDC that that was one we're trying to find

1386
01:00:59,039 --> 01:01:00,039
a good definition

1387
01:01:00,039 --> 01:01:04,039
for the use and I have concerns about the murkiness here

1388
01:01:04,039 --> 01:01:06,199
because somebody could

1389
01:01:06,199 --> 01:01:09,010
own their home and they could rent out a bedroom and they

1390
01:01:09,010 --> 01:01:10,440
would or two bedrooms

1391
01:01:10,440 --> 01:01:12,679
to two separate college students I have a friend who does

1392
01:01:12,679 --> 01:01:13,800
that pays his mortgage

1393
01:01:13,800 --> 01:01:17,920
by by having roommates basically yes and that wouldn't be

1394
01:01:17,920 --> 01:01:18,679
multi-family so

1395
01:01:18,679 --> 01:01:22,559
let's assume let's take your example into consideration

1396
01:01:22,559 --> 01:01:23,719
then the question is

1397
01:01:23,719 --> 01:01:26,900
do each one of those rooms have their own separate meters

1398
01:01:26,900 --> 01:01:28,519
and utilities right

1399
01:01:28,519 --> 01:01:32,219
then it is no longer functioning as a residential use so we

1400
01:01:32,219 --> 01:01:33,119
've got two issues

1401
01:01:33,119 --> 01:01:37,309
happening one is the definition of specific uses and then

1402
01:01:37,309 --> 01:01:38,079
how do you

1403
01:01:38,079 --> 01:01:41,360
interpret or determine intent of an existing structure in

1404
01:01:41,360 --> 01:01:42,440
this case I

1405
01:01:42,440 --> 01:01:46,309
wouldn't be in a position to say categorically that that is

1406
01:01:46,309 --> 01:01:46,440
a

1407
01:01:46,440 --> 01:01:49,739
residential use it may look like a residential structure to

1408
01:01:49,739 --> 01:01:50,519
the south but

1409
01:01:50,519 --> 01:01:54,579
it's actually being utilized for non-residential use so I

1410
01:01:54,579 --> 01:01:55,719
can then make

1411
01:01:55,719 --> 01:01:58,750
that determination and another challenge here is these are

1412
01:01:58,750 --> 01:02:00,480
both residential uses

1413
01:02:00,480 --> 01:02:03,840
there might be four people sleeping in this house and four

1414
01:02:03,840 --> 01:02:05,000
people sleeping in

1415
01:02:05,000 --> 01:02:08,019
the house next door the house next door only has one meter

1416
01:02:08,019 --> 01:02:09,039
there might be four

1417
01:02:09,039 --> 01:02:12,000
leases on each because it's college area a lot of times

1418
01:02:12,000 --> 01:02:13,159
rooms rented by the room

1419
01:02:13,159 --> 01:02:16,320
exactly and it addresses building code the building code

1420
01:02:16,320 --> 01:02:17,840
criteria also then

1421
01:02:17,840 --> 01:02:21,320
bleed into this so in terms of is there a clear-cut

1422
01:02:21,320 --> 01:02:23,079
definition saying should

1423
01:02:23,079 --> 01:02:26,030
there be if there is more than one meter on a property what

1424
01:02:26,030 --> 01:02:28,079
is that use that has

1425
01:02:28,079 --> 01:02:31,889
not been clearly identified in the Denton Development Code

1426
01:02:31,889 --> 01:02:34,199
yet so the goal

1427
01:02:34,199 --> 01:02:37,389
then is to look at and again we're deviant a little bit

1428
01:02:37,389 --> 01:02:38,360
because we're

1429
01:02:38,360 --> 01:02:41,659
talking about zoning and the zoning on the property not the

1430
01:02:41,659 --> 01:02:42,599
specific use or

1431
01:02:42,599 --> 01:02:47,119
development of so if I do digress legal please tell me

1432
01:02:47,119 --> 01:02:49,639
nicely no no stop my

1433
01:02:49,639 --> 01:02:54,159
questions and we can do this later because we're running

1434
01:02:54,159 --> 01:02:55,719
out of time well just for

1435
01:02:55,719 --> 01:02:59,099
clarification so currently for this particular project that

1436
01:02:59,099 --> 01:03:00,400
property as use

1437
01:03:00,400 --> 01:03:04,659
is multifamily and not single-family for this particular

1438
01:03:04,659 --> 01:03:06,599
item correct it's not

1439
01:03:06,599 --> 01:03:11,599
being used as a single-family residence correct let me

1440
01:03:11,599 --> 01:03:13,679
repeat to put it in those

1441
01:03:13,679 --> 01:03:16,840
terms would be easier okay just just like I'm gonna

1442
01:03:16,840 --> 01:03:18,519
continue briefly it's

1443
01:03:18,519 --> 01:03:21,889
just like we have house houses single-family people operate

1444
01:03:21,889 --> 01:03:22,400
a business

1445
01:03:22,400 --> 01:03:27,679
under out of all up and down on Elm Street local Street

1446
01:03:27,679 --> 01:03:28,960
those uses are no

1447
01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:32,820
longer single-family it may look like a house but it's now

1448
01:03:32,820 --> 01:03:34,320
a business so we have

1449
01:03:34,320 --> 01:03:37,690
a similar type situation that this looks like a single-

1450
01:03:37,690 --> 01:03:39,519
family house has four

1451
01:03:39,519 --> 01:03:43,960
meters on it it is a functioning and used as a multifamily

1452
01:03:43,960 --> 01:03:46,119
use at this time

1453
01:03:46,119 --> 01:03:49,900
okay Commissioner that's good briefly my point is that that

1454
01:03:49,900 --> 01:03:51,219
's that's one

1455
01:03:51,219 --> 01:03:54,380
flexible that it could they they could pull the meters off

1456
01:03:54,380 --> 01:03:55,360
tomorrow and we

1457
01:03:55,360 --> 01:03:58,820
have a giant building next to it and in two I think it's

1458
01:03:58,820 --> 01:04:02,280
important to note that

1459
01:04:03,239 --> 01:04:06,179
who makes that determination who's the final say if it's

1460
01:04:06,179 --> 01:04:07,440
not in the deed if

1461
01:04:07,440 --> 01:04:10,039
it's not in the development code who makes that final

1462
01:04:10,039 --> 01:04:11,320
determination I mean

1463
01:04:11,320 --> 01:04:14,340
because I don't know that I want to make the logical leap

1464
01:04:14,340 --> 01:04:15,480
that just because you

1465
01:04:15,480 --> 01:04:18,429
want to divide your utility bill up however you want to

1466
01:04:18,429 --> 01:04:19,280
divide it and and

1467
01:04:19,280 --> 01:04:21,869
you want to have as many meters as you want you want to

1468
01:04:21,869 --> 01:04:23,119
take an extension cord

1469
01:04:23,119 --> 01:04:25,690
and run it to your neighbor's house I don't know that I

1470
01:04:25,690 --> 01:04:26,400
want to make a

1471
01:04:26,400 --> 01:04:29,760
determination on any of those things on how people govern

1472
01:04:29,760 --> 01:04:30,920
their finances so I

1473
01:04:30,920 --> 01:04:33,719
want to know who's the final say so in making that

1474
01:04:33,719 --> 01:04:35,519
determination that that's

1475
01:04:35,519 --> 01:04:37,849
multifamily and that's what we're gonna apply because if it

1476
01:04:37,849 --> 01:04:38,719
comes to this board

1477
01:04:38,719 --> 01:04:41,880
let us vote on it if it's if someone arbitrarily it's gonna

1478
01:04:41,880 --> 01:04:42,599
hand that down

1479
01:04:42,599 --> 01:04:45,280
who is that I just want to make it clear for the record is

1480
01:04:45,280 --> 01:04:46,639
the property that the

1481
01:04:46,639 --> 01:04:50,920
house is sitting on how is that zoned DR2 and that allows

1482
01:04:50,920 --> 01:04:52,360
single-family it does

1483
01:04:52,360 --> 01:04:56,360
it does so it's not a non-conforming structure no it's just

1484
01:04:56,360 --> 01:04:57,400
being converted

1485
01:04:57,400 --> 01:05:03,469
it's not even related as we we don't know we don't know we

1486
01:05:03,469 --> 01:05:04,119
hadn't talked to

1487
01:05:04,119 --> 01:05:07,780
him I don't think anybody if someone has looked at the

1488
01:05:07,780 --> 01:05:08,519
outside of their house

1489
01:05:08,519 --> 01:05:12,199
when they drove by because they're opportunist and and and

1490
01:05:12,199 --> 01:05:14,400
have not talked

1491
01:05:14,400 --> 01:05:18,260
to that I'd love to hear who we talked to so what she's

1492
01:05:18,260 --> 01:05:19,400
saying is because it's

1493
01:05:19,400 --> 01:05:21,929
not clear and they didn't development code the director of

1494
01:05:21,929 --> 01:05:22,960
development services

1495
01:05:22,960 --> 01:05:27,440
has the discretion in order to determine what the use is

1496
01:05:27,440 --> 01:05:29,199
and so they determine

1497
01:05:29,199 --> 01:05:32,039
that many times through a reasonable method and the

1498
01:05:32,039 --> 01:05:32,920
reasonable method is

1499
01:05:32,920 --> 01:05:35,510
looking to see if there are multiple meters on the property

1500
01:05:35,510 --> 01:05:36,280
that's something

1501
01:05:36,280 --> 01:05:39,960
that happens quite often right director services

1502
01:05:39,960 --> 01:05:43,650
manal made that you just happen to have her here at the the

1503
01:05:43,650 --> 01:05:45,679
dais okay I want to

1504
01:05:45,679 --> 01:05:49,510
pull us back on topic because what we're talking about is a

1505
01:05:49,510 --> 01:05:50,719
zoning issue tonight

1506
01:05:50,719 --> 01:05:53,929
and the whole place of where we've gotten off to is how

1507
01:05:53,929 --> 01:05:55,119
this the step back

1508
01:05:55,119 --> 01:05:58,750
would be if it was a single family we're not even in here

1509
01:05:58,750 --> 01:06:00,719
talking about a site

1510
01:06:00,719 --> 01:06:04,789
plan building we're talking about zoning only and we're way

1511
01:06:04,789 --> 01:06:05,920
off in what the use

1512
01:06:05,920 --> 01:06:09,079
is next door and how that may or may not trigger

1513
01:06:09,079 --> 01:06:10,320
residential slopes I want to

1514
01:06:10,320 --> 01:06:13,679
bring our Commission back to the issue at hand which is a

1515
01:06:13,679 --> 01:06:15,199
zoning issue and that

1516
01:06:15,199 --> 01:06:19,250
issue can be in more detail when it comes back before us so

1517
01:06:19,250 --> 01:06:21,639
anything else if

1518
01:06:21,639 --> 01:06:24,320
it's about what we just talked about let's try to get done

1519
01:06:24,320 --> 01:06:24,840
if it's a

1520
01:06:24,840 --> 01:06:27,480
different subject

1521
01:06:30,400 --> 01:06:33,039
what is the year the parking requirements between the

1522
01:06:33,039 --> 01:06:34,199
different

1523
01:06:34,199 --> 01:06:39,389
options available for different zoning you know for multif

1524
01:06:39,389 --> 01:06:41,719
amily because on the

1525
01:06:41,719 --> 01:06:46,320
one hand I see the word walkability look at the map and if

1526
01:06:46,320 --> 01:06:47,559
somebody's gonna be in

1527
01:06:47,559 --> 01:06:49,949
the school of music or the school of business or even to go

1528
01:06:49,949 --> 01:06:50,639
to the student

1529
01:06:50,639 --> 01:06:54,179
union building that's not walkability that's either gonna

1530
01:06:54,179 --> 01:06:55,579
be bus or car or

1531
01:06:55,579 --> 01:06:58,889
something and so I'm just wondering you know will the

1532
01:06:58,889 --> 01:07:00,239
parking requirements

1533
01:07:00,239 --> 01:07:07,400
change what size we're kind of same thing we're off on site

1534
01:07:07,400 --> 01:07:08,480
anti stuff and

1535
01:07:08,480 --> 01:07:10,929
we need to stick to zoning because we're about out of time

1536
01:07:10,929 --> 01:07:12,000
have you got a zoning

1537
01:07:12,000 --> 01:07:14,679
question absolutely Commissioner Hitsmith so zoning

1538
01:07:14,679 --> 01:07:17,190
wires because I'm not gonna be here in a little bit I don't

1539
01:07:17,190 --> 01:07:18,719
think I don't see

1540
01:07:18,719 --> 01:07:22,800
when I looked I pinned out Google Earth I think that the

1541
01:07:22,800 --> 01:07:24,320
zoning is what it is

1542
01:07:24,320 --> 01:07:26,550
there's nothing we can do to roll that back but I don't

1543
01:07:26,550 --> 01:07:27,920
find any structure in

1544
01:07:27,920 --> 01:07:31,869
anywhere near that but for if I use their radius that 10

1545
01:07:31,869 --> 01:07:33,480
that 10 mile radius

1546
01:07:33,480 --> 01:07:38,780
I do believe the only thing that would possibly purport to

1547
01:07:38,780 --> 01:07:40,159
be the same size is

1548
01:07:40,159 --> 01:07:44,880
on Fry Street and that's the whatever the name of those

1549
01:07:44,880 --> 01:07:46,400
those apartments are

1550
01:07:46,400 --> 01:07:50,829
but there's nothing else in in in anything in sight in

1551
01:07:50,829 --> 01:07:52,159
Google I mean pan

1552
01:07:52,159 --> 01:07:57,159
out as far as you want so zoning wise I think it's zoned as

1553
01:07:57,159 --> 01:07:57,760
is there's nothing

1554
01:07:57,760 --> 01:08:02,079
we can do about that and I think to up zone any part of

1555
01:08:02,079 --> 01:08:03,239
that so that they can

1556
01:08:03,239 --> 01:08:09,340
then have a structure that's that trumps anything in that

1557
01:08:09,340 --> 01:08:12,280
in that area is is just

1558
01:08:12,280 --> 01:08:15,179
not it's not productive I just don't think I've driven it I

1559
01:08:15,179 --> 01:08:15,719
've driven it four

1560
01:08:15,719 --> 01:08:18,739
or five times and that zoning as is there's nothing you can

1561
01:08:18,739 --> 01:08:19,520
do about that

1562
01:08:19,520 --> 01:08:23,050
but to up zone that that area by the houses and you kind of

1563
01:08:23,050 --> 01:08:24,000
you're going

1564
01:08:24,000 --> 01:08:27,829
downhill and those are two-story apartments all day long

1565
01:08:27,829 --> 01:08:28,399
two-story

1566
01:08:28,399 --> 01:08:30,760
apartments all the way to boardmans and then you got to go

1567
01:08:30,760 --> 01:08:31,600
down the street to

1568
01:08:31,600 --> 01:08:34,119
get to something that purports to be the size even city

1569
01:08:34,119 --> 01:08:35,199
place or whatever that is

1570
01:08:35,199 --> 01:08:38,090
where flow hospital used to be does not it doesn't wear the

1571
01:08:38,090 --> 01:08:39,000
same because it's on

1572
01:08:39,000 --> 01:08:41,289
the slope if they're willing to dig a hole and make it

1573
01:08:41,289 --> 01:08:43,960
lower then that I think

1574
01:08:43,960 --> 01:08:47,840
that that matters but just on its face as it's structured

1575
01:08:47,840 --> 01:08:48,800
it would it would

1576
01:08:48,800 --> 01:08:53,569
absolutely bury anything in that area and it just it would

1577
01:08:53,569 --> 01:08:54,699
it I don't think

1578
01:08:54,699 --> 01:09:00,770
zoning wise to change it that puts it on us versus as is

1579
01:09:00,770 --> 01:09:01,560
that's not our fault

1580
01:09:01,560 --> 01:09:04,439
it'd be in a hundred feet or if it's less than a hundred

1581
01:09:04,439 --> 01:09:05,680
feet well if I read

1582
01:09:05,680 --> 01:09:11,140
that I read the the narrative and if if if they want to put

1583
01:09:11,140 --> 01:09:12,000
a hundred feet on the

1584
01:09:12,000 --> 01:09:15,439
front of that making and that that by code is that that is

1585
01:09:15,439 --> 01:09:16,279
fine but I don't

1586
01:09:16,279 --> 01:09:20,880
think in good faith that it's it's right to then bury the

1587
01:09:20,880 --> 01:09:22,560
house down the hill

1588
01:09:22,560 --> 01:09:26,739
because I'm trying to negotiate with a gun to my head I

1589
01:09:26,739 --> 01:09:27,960
just don't I don't like

1590
01:09:27,960 --> 01:09:30,180
it well I'll throw something at you and maybe it's a

1591
01:09:30,180 --> 01:09:31,359
different point of view

1592
01:09:31,359 --> 01:09:33,899
maybe they're not doing a gun to their head maybe they've

1593
01:09:33,899 --> 01:09:35,159
heard the neighbors

1594
01:09:35,159 --> 01:09:38,789
concerns about it and maybe they've asked for a zone to the

1595
01:09:38,789 --> 01:09:39,680
other to drop

1596
01:09:39,680 --> 01:09:43,039
the building to make it more consistent and it has less of

1597
01:09:43,039 --> 01:09:44,199
an impact over the

1598
01:09:44,199 --> 01:09:47,359
whole neighborhood versus saying we can build what we want

1599
01:09:47,359 --> 01:09:48,279
and we're gonna do a

1600
01:09:48,279 --> 01:09:52,210
hundred foot here versus saying you know what people are

1601
01:09:52,210 --> 01:09:53,560
concerned about it we'll

1602
01:09:53,560 --> 01:09:56,130
we'll drop the thing and help us with some zoning on the

1603
01:09:56,130 --> 01:09:57,239
other and make a less

1604
01:09:57,239 --> 01:10:00,600
impact versus somebody's here saying we're gonna do this

1605
01:10:00,600 --> 01:10:01,479
one way or the other

1606
01:10:01,479 --> 01:10:05,079
so I think for from my point of view I think that's

1607
01:10:05,079 --> 01:10:06,960
something for us to talk

1608
01:10:06,960 --> 01:10:10,539
about as far as the zoning is concerned is whether we want

1609
01:10:10,539 --> 01:10:11,760
to rezone it or not

1610
01:10:11,760 --> 01:10:15,130
and give them an opportunity to do something of a less

1611
01:10:15,130 --> 01:10:16,319
impact versus saying

1612
01:10:16,319 --> 01:10:18,670
we're not going to rezone it and then they go build it and

1613
01:10:18,670 --> 01:10:19,560
it's a hundred feet

1614
01:10:19,560 --> 01:10:21,909
tall and everybody goes well maybe we should have done

1615
01:10:21,909 --> 01:10:23,199
something different and

1616
01:10:23,199 --> 01:10:26,359
so that's just my point of view on that so I want to stick

1617
01:10:26,359 --> 01:10:27,439
with zoning is there

1618
01:10:27,439 --> 01:10:30,600
anything else is owning that we want to talk about on this

1619
01:10:30,600 --> 01:10:31,239
to keep going

1620
01:10:31,239 --> 01:10:35,189
Commissioner Beck thank you chair and I hear what you're

1621
01:10:35,189 --> 01:10:38,840
saying chair but even

1622
01:10:38,840 --> 01:10:42,329
though it's not a 10 or 11 story it's it's proposed to be a

1623
01:10:42,329 --> 01:10:43,920
five story and the

1624
01:10:43,920 --> 01:10:49,479
footprint for this building still is is quite dramatically

1625
01:10:49,479 --> 01:10:51,039
different than what's

1626
01:10:51,039 --> 01:10:55,390
there I don't fully agree with the assessment that says in

1627
01:10:55,390 --> 01:10:56,880
our background

1628
01:10:56,880 --> 01:11:00,039
material that mixed-use character of this area is

1629
01:11:00,039 --> 01:11:01,600
compatible with DCG along

1630
01:11:01,600 --> 01:11:05,539
scripture I mean if you look at this building it sticks out

1631
01:11:05,539 --> 01:11:06,319
even when we do

1632
01:11:06,319 --> 01:11:10,250
the residential slope thing I mean it's a it's a David and

1633
01:11:10,250 --> 01:11:12,119
Goliath thing it may

1634
01:11:12,119 --> 01:11:15,550
technically sound good but visually it's gonna it's gonna

1635
01:11:15,550 --> 01:11:17,039
stick out there and I

1636
01:11:17,039 --> 01:11:22,100
think we're here for zoning issue simply what happened in

1637
01:11:22,100 --> 01:11:24,119
2002 what were the city

1638
01:11:24,119 --> 01:11:27,279
people thinking when they zone that area of scripture DCG

1639
01:11:27,279 --> 01:11:28,560
in the first place I

1640
01:11:28,560 --> 01:11:31,520
think it had something to do with flow we don't get into

1641
01:11:31,520 --> 01:11:32,939
detail on that but the

1642
01:11:32,939 --> 01:11:36,170
fact that flow isn't there anymore it seems like the proper

1643
01:11:36,170 --> 01:11:37,039
thing would have

1644
01:11:37,039 --> 01:11:39,649
been to revert this thing back to dr2 which is probably

1645
01:11:39,649 --> 01:11:40,960
what it was so I'm

1646
01:11:40,960 --> 01:11:45,079
gonna stop there and interrupt just a second to be the

1647
01:11:45,079 --> 01:11:45,920
point of the matter is

1648
01:11:45,920 --> 01:11:51,699
it is zoned that and we're not in a position to down zone

1649
01:11:51,699 --> 01:11:53,039
it and so I think

1650
01:11:53,039 --> 01:11:55,819
we're left with the practicality of that is what the zoning

1651
01:11:55,819 --> 01:11:56,680
is there and the

1652
01:11:56,680 --> 01:12:00,039
piece next to it or what are we or aren't gonna do with

1653
01:12:00,039 --> 01:12:03,609
that and I was gonna build up to it but I'll go ahead okay

1654
01:12:03,609 --> 01:12:03,920
we're short on time

1655
01:12:03,920 --> 01:12:06,369
and I know we still have a whole nother item we haven't got

1656
01:12:06,369 --> 01:12:07,239
to and it's almost

1657
01:12:07,239 --> 01:12:10,710
630 right our options are to approve it and they build this

1658
01:12:10,710 --> 01:12:11,960
thing or we deny it

1659
01:12:11,960 --> 01:12:15,520
and they build the monstrosity everybody's worried about

1660
01:12:15,520 --> 01:12:16,239
but I think

1661
01:12:16,239 --> 01:12:19,880
there is an option that we need to bring up and it's called

1662
01:12:19,880 --> 01:12:21,359
that I would approve

1663
01:12:21,359 --> 01:12:25,000
it with an amendment to it to recommend approval subject to

1664
01:12:25,000 --> 01:12:26,439
conditions with a

1665
01:12:26,439 --> 01:12:32,510
mixed-use residential overlay that's in the DCC DDC and I

1666
01:12:32,510 --> 01:12:33,079
think it's something

1667
01:12:33,079 --> 01:12:35,689
that will serve both purposes allow somebody to build

1668
01:12:35,689 --> 01:12:37,520
something there but at

1669
01:12:37,520 --> 01:12:40,760
a level that's compatible for that neighborhood that the

1670
01:12:40,760 --> 01:12:41,460
residents can

1671
01:12:41,460 --> 01:12:46,020
accept and yet we can still have some population so if we

1672
01:12:46,020 --> 01:12:47,359
don't have time to

1673
01:12:47,359 --> 01:12:50,569
discuss that further I would like to bring that up well I

1674
01:12:50,569 --> 01:12:51,359
think you might

1675
01:12:51,359 --> 01:12:54,619
find some consensus to at least from me as a commissioner

1676
01:12:54,619 --> 01:12:55,880
to talk about that in

1677
01:12:55,880 --> 01:13:00,510
our in our next meeting so Julie would you like to continue

1678
01:13:00,510 --> 01:13:01,079
on your

1679
01:13:01,079 --> 01:13:14,039
going or yeah I'm gonna announce I'm gonna have to recuse

1680
01:13:14,039 --> 01:13:14,800
myself from this

1681
01:13:14,800 --> 01:13:17,960
I'm an and for those that are listening in our public

1682
01:13:17,960 --> 01:13:19,159
meeting in council

1683
01:13:19,159 --> 01:13:24,670
chambers we're gonna run 15 minutes 15 minutes late so we

1684
01:13:24,670 --> 01:13:26,039
will try to get our

1685
01:13:26,039 --> 01:13:30,920
meeting reconvened and starting council chambers about

1686
01:13:30,920 --> 01:13:33,720
hopefully about 645 and

1687
01:13:33,720 --> 01:13:36,670
I'm going to turn the meeting over to the vice chair

1688
01:13:36,670 --> 01:13:38,119
Commissioner Taylor at

1689
01:13:38,119 --> 01:13:48,119
this time thank you chair so now we're going to item FR 16

1690
01:13:48,479 --> 01:13:55,649
residential reply and blocks one two block B of Hale Est

1691
01:13:55,649 --> 01:13:56,399
ates and vice chair

1692
01:13:56,399 --> 01:13:59,819
Taylor I would ask legal to chime in and give us some

1693
01:13:59,819 --> 01:14:01,560
discussion points as it

1694
01:14:01,560 --> 01:14:07,119
relates to this at reply the interest in this particular

1695
01:14:07,119 --> 01:14:08,439
item and so I wanted to

1696
01:14:08,439 --> 01:14:12,439
go over some legal points with you all on the Commission I

1697
01:14:12,439 --> 01:14:13,840
've received a lot of

1698
01:14:13,840 --> 01:14:17,489
questions especially that are legal oriented regarding this

1699
01:14:17,489 --> 01:14:18,399
item so I just

1700
01:14:18,399 --> 01:14:21,229
want to put it out there on the record so that we're all

1701
01:14:21,229 --> 01:14:22,199
aware of what our

1702
01:14:22,199 --> 01:14:27,279
position is the first question was why is this replat on

1703
01:14:27,279 --> 01:14:29,279
not on consent agenda

1704
01:14:29,279 --> 01:14:32,140
and why does it require a public hearing and the answer to

1705
01:14:32,140 --> 01:14:33,319
that is that the local

1706
01:14:33,319 --> 01:14:36,560
government code does require a residential replat to have a

1707
01:14:36,560 --> 01:14:37,000
public

1708
01:14:37,000 --> 01:14:41,329
hearing it used to previously in a previous version of the

1709
01:14:41,329 --> 01:14:42,800
statute require

1710
01:14:42,800 --> 01:14:47,529
or allow for a 20% objection trigger I don't I don't know

1711
01:14:47,529 --> 01:14:49,039
if you all recall but

1712
01:14:49,039 --> 01:14:56,069
on on zoning on zoning items you have that 20% objection

1713
01:14:56,069 --> 01:14:57,079
and it triggers a

1714
01:14:57,079 --> 01:15:02,539
super majority requirement at council this trigger was a 20

1715
01:15:02,539 --> 01:15:03,359
% objection that

1716
01:15:03,359 --> 01:15:10,210
triggered a sort of a method for neighbors to object in

1717
01:15:10,210 --> 01:15:11,460
writing and if

1718
01:15:11,460 --> 01:15:18,649
66% of those objected then the item would not be able to be

1719
01:15:18,649 --> 01:15:19,880
passed that was

1720
01:15:19,880 --> 01:15:22,710
found to be unconstitutional by the Fort Worth Court of

1721
01:15:22,710 --> 01:15:24,840
Appeals and that portion

1722
01:15:24,840 --> 01:15:28,800
was removed the objection portion but they kept the public

1723
01:15:28,800 --> 01:15:30,159
hearing portion in

1724
01:15:30,159 --> 01:15:34,079
the statute so it's a public hearing without a real

1725
01:15:34,079 --> 01:15:35,680
consequence or a way for

1726
01:15:35,680 --> 01:15:41,520
neighbors to move forward through objection however this is

1727
01:15:41,520 --> 01:15:43,119
a plat so the

1728
01:15:43,119 --> 01:15:46,279
the law does state that you have very little discretion

1729
01:15:46,279 --> 01:15:47,159
when you review a

1730
01:15:47,159 --> 01:15:51,510
plat even a replat and what the law states is that so long

1731
01:15:51,510 --> 01:15:52,720
as it meets all

1732
01:15:52,720 --> 01:15:55,550
the requirements of state law and meets the technical

1733
01:15:55,550 --> 01:15:56,920
requirements of the city

1734
01:15:56,920 --> 01:16:01,659
then we cannot deny it because it's a ministerial not a

1735
01:16:01,659 --> 01:16:03,520
discretionary type

1736
01:16:03,520 --> 01:16:08,920
action so I wanted you all to be aware that there's very

1737
01:16:08,920 --> 01:16:09,600
little room you can

1738
01:16:09,600 --> 01:16:13,300
look at your job is to double-check staff to make sure that

1739
01:16:13,300 --> 01:16:14,319
it did meet all

1740
01:16:14,319 --> 01:16:17,350
the technical requirements as they present them to you but

1741
01:16:17,350 --> 01:16:18,279
you can't really

1742
01:16:18,279 --> 01:16:22,880
look at anything beyond that when it comes to a plat the

1743
01:16:22,880 --> 01:16:24,399
other item that I

1744
01:16:24,399 --> 01:16:29,779
wanted to talk about was this restrictive covenant issue

1745
01:16:29,779 --> 01:16:30,800
and I know

1746
01:16:30,800 --> 01:16:34,329
last time we had talked on the record and I let you know

1747
01:16:34,329 --> 01:16:35,560
that restrictive

1748
01:16:35,560 --> 01:16:39,050
covenants we cannot enforce them as a government body the

1749
01:16:39,050 --> 01:16:39,920
only person or the

1750
01:16:39,920 --> 01:16:42,359
only city that can do that in the state of Texas is Houston

1751
01:16:42,359 --> 01:16:43,800
they were given this

1752
01:16:43,800 --> 01:16:48,750
special authority to do that but we can't in fact case law

1753
01:16:48,750 --> 01:16:52,279
shows that we the

1754
01:16:52,279 --> 01:16:56,869
platting is completely irrelevant to the restrictive

1755
01:16:56,869 --> 01:16:58,920
covenant and the platting is

1756
01:16:58,920 --> 01:17:03,060
not a properly plotted law does not affect any kind of

1757
01:17:03,060 --> 01:17:05,239
amendment or removal

1758
01:17:05,239 --> 01:17:11,310
of a restrictive covenant for those purposes because we

1759
01:17:11,310 --> 01:17:12,399
were able to act

1760
01:17:12,399 --> 01:17:15,369
outside of that and just look at the application that's

1761
01:17:15,369 --> 01:17:17,720
before us we moved in

1762
01:17:17,720 --> 01:17:22,390
that direction last time between last time and this time I

1763
01:17:22,390 --> 01:17:23,640
did just out of

1764
01:17:23,640 --> 01:17:26,210
sort of a gesture to the neighbors look at their

1765
01:17:26,210 --> 01:17:28,079
restrictive covenant that they

1766
01:17:28,079 --> 01:17:33,210
were provided to us and I did note that I do not believe

1767
01:17:33,210 --> 01:17:35,439
that it is a violation

1768
01:17:35,439 --> 01:17:38,600
of the restrictive covenant the way that the wording is

1769
01:17:38,600 --> 01:17:40,520
written there's a section

1770
01:17:40,520 --> 01:17:44,029
basically saying that it cannot be subdivided if the

1771
01:17:44,029 --> 01:17:45,560
resulting lots are

1772
01:17:45,560 --> 01:17:50,920
less than an acre or if they're less than 150 feet frontage

1773
01:17:50,920 --> 01:17:52,880
and both of these

1774
01:17:52,880 --> 01:17:57,130
lots separately meet those requirements so in my legal

1775
01:17:57,130 --> 01:17:59,159
opinion there was no even

1776
01:17:59,159 --> 01:18:01,920
though I can't give outside legal advice I'm giving the

1777
01:18:01,920 --> 01:18:03,279
advice to you there was

1778
01:18:03,279 --> 01:18:06,560
no violation of those restrictive covenants in my view

1779
01:18:06,560 --> 01:18:07,760
there's also a

1780
01:18:07,760 --> 01:18:10,949
provision where it has to be used for residential use since

1781
01:18:10,949 --> 01:18:11,520
we're not

1782
01:18:11,520 --> 01:18:14,680
rezoning it there is no effect to the restrictive covenants

1783
01:18:14,680 --> 01:18:15,439
that are currently

1784
01:18:15,439 --> 01:18:20,739
existing on the property another item that was requested a

1785
01:18:20,739 --> 01:18:22,239
lot was information

1786
01:18:22,239 --> 01:18:25,170
concerning the dam that's on the property the restricted

1787
01:18:25,170 --> 01:18:26,159
covenant actually

1788
01:18:26,159 --> 01:18:29,489
says if the dam is existing on private property that the

1789
01:18:29,489 --> 01:18:30,880
other neighbors have

1790
01:18:30,880 --> 01:18:36,170
no interest or access to the dam however despite that I did

1791
01:18:36,170 --> 01:18:38,039
look into it and it

1792
01:18:38,039 --> 01:18:42,239
looks like when the plat was originally done in the 1960s

1793
01:18:42,239 --> 01:18:43,439
the dam was a very

1794
01:18:43,439 --> 01:18:47,210
much a part of the drainage for the subdivision and in fact

1795
01:18:47,210 --> 01:18:48,479
the street

1796
01:18:48,479 --> 01:18:53,460
drainage goes all into that particular retaining area and

1797
01:18:53,460 --> 01:18:55,000
it is in our drain

1798
01:18:55,000 --> 01:18:59,479
adjudgment so any kind of attempted removal of that dam

1799
01:18:59,479 --> 01:19:01,000
that's going to have

1800
01:19:01,000 --> 01:19:03,460
to go through the city and if it affects the drainage they

1801
01:19:03,460 --> 01:19:04,319
would have to show

1802
01:19:04,319 --> 01:19:08,439
some sort of major mitigation downstream that would provide

1803
01:19:08,439 --> 01:19:11,119
a replacement in lieu

1804
01:19:11,119 --> 01:19:13,680
of having that dam in that location in addition to that

1805
01:19:13,680 --> 01:19:14,579
there is it what's

1806
01:19:14,579 --> 01:19:18,300
called a riparian buffer as you are aware what those are so

1807
01:19:18,300 --> 01:19:19,439
any disturbance

1808
01:19:19,439 --> 01:19:23,630
on the perimeter of the water body is going to require also

1809
01:19:23,630 --> 01:19:24,840
a permit or an a

1810
01:19:24,840 --> 01:19:28,649
essay that would come before this Commission so I don't

1811
01:19:28,649 --> 01:19:30,800
know to what extent

1812
01:19:30,800 --> 01:19:33,380
we may share that in the regular session I think we have

1813
01:19:33,380 --> 01:19:37,079
some neighbors here but

1814
01:19:37,079 --> 01:19:39,960
I wanted to go ahead and talk about those legal issues put

1815
01:19:39,960 --> 01:19:40,880
him out there for

1816
01:19:40,880 --> 01:19:43,569
the Commission I wanted to do it in an open session so that

1817
01:19:43,569 --> 01:19:45,039
everybody knows what

1818
01:19:45,039 --> 01:19:47,859
advice that I'm providing to you because I know it's very

1819
01:19:47,859 --> 01:19:48,880
very important for the

1820
01:19:48,880 --> 01:19:54,949
neighbors and given that does anybody have any questions

1821
01:19:54,949 --> 01:19:55,560
Commissioner Roselle

1822
01:19:55,560 --> 01:19:59,479
thank you vice chair we have a letter email from Jason

1823
01:19:59,479 --> 01:20:00,920
Denise Thomas saying

1824
01:20:00,920 --> 01:20:03,909
that they weren't notified what's the repercussion I mean

1825
01:20:03,909 --> 01:20:05,399
that's a state rule

1826
01:20:05,399 --> 01:20:08,159
that they have to be notified if they didn't get notified

1827
01:20:08,159 --> 01:20:08,479
what's the

1828
01:20:08,479 --> 01:20:11,800
consequence of that where's the burden of proof for

1829
01:20:11,800 --> 01:20:12,760
notification I know we

1830
01:20:12,760 --> 01:20:16,710
talked about this a lot because you're back enjoys the

1831
01:20:16,710 --> 01:20:20,760
topic so I'm curious where

1832
01:20:20,760 --> 01:20:22,850
has the city proven that there was a certified notice can

1833
01:20:22,850 --> 01:20:23,359
you tell me more

1834
01:20:23,359 --> 01:20:27,720
about what this is regarding sure if I can dive in just to

1835
01:20:27,720 --> 01:20:28,520
process of

1836
01:20:28,520 --> 01:20:32,270
notification we you know we're all aware on this Commission

1837
01:20:32,270 --> 01:20:33,720
that we have to mail

1838
01:20:33,720 --> 01:20:37,819
out a notice within 200 feet of the request that being said

1839
01:20:37,819 --> 01:20:38,720
we use the tax

1840
01:20:38,720 --> 01:20:41,479
rolls that are provided to us from our Department of

1841
01:20:41,479 --> 01:20:42,880
Technical Services that

1842
01:20:42,880 --> 01:20:47,479
gets those from the from DCOT and then we take those parc

1843
01:20:47,479 --> 01:20:48,760
els they provide us

1844
01:20:48,760 --> 01:20:52,449
those parcels and we use that data so whatever info that we

1845
01:20:52,449 --> 01:20:53,439
do receive now

1846
01:20:53,439 --> 01:20:56,659
there are instances where because those tax rules are

1847
01:20:56,659 --> 01:20:58,159
updated once a year that

1848
01:20:58,159 --> 01:21:01,340
we get that information there is a bit of a lag time so

1849
01:21:01,340 --> 01:21:03,159
when we do send out the

1850
01:21:03,159 --> 01:21:05,739
certified mail let's assume that there's change of

1851
01:21:05,739 --> 01:21:07,039
ownership and it goes to the

1852
01:21:07,039 --> 01:21:11,000
old owner then that is something we've still followed the

1853
01:21:11,000 --> 01:21:11,840
tax roll we've still

1854
01:21:11,840 --> 01:21:14,359
followed what's on DCOT and that does happen occasionally

1855
01:21:14,359 --> 01:21:16,239
so it's not that we

1856
01:21:16,239 --> 01:21:19,840
didn't that we notified in error it's just that we sent

1857
01:21:19,840 --> 01:21:21,000
notice to whatever's

1858
01:21:21,000 --> 01:21:24,710
latest on the record and that being said I think we did

1859
01:21:24,710 --> 01:21:26,319
check and we did see that

1860
01:21:26,319 --> 01:21:29,100
that was sent but not to the most recent property owner so

1861
01:21:29,100 --> 01:21:30,220
if they've been there

1862
01:21:30,220 --> 01:21:34,909
because we update once a year so to speak that is why that

1863
01:21:34,909 --> 01:21:35,840
we received the

1864
01:21:35,840 --> 01:21:40,199
certified tax roll that is why there's sometimes a lag I

1865
01:21:40,199 --> 01:21:40,800
appreciate that

1866
01:21:40,800 --> 01:21:44,090
explanation but wouldn't the address of 3,400 Montecito not

1867
01:21:44,090 --> 01:21:45,960
have changed no but

1868
01:21:45,960 --> 01:21:48,579
the owner the owner address might be different from what

1869
01:21:48,579 --> 01:21:49,960
who's residing there

1870
01:21:49,960 --> 01:21:54,069
so when so just as an example you can have several

1871
01:21:54,069 --> 01:21:56,239
properties and have one

1872
01:21:56,239 --> 01:21:58,930
single address which is either one of those properties or

1873
01:21:58,930 --> 01:21:59,720
it's a separate

1874
01:21:59,720 --> 01:22:03,220
address altogether so there is there are often this is we

1875
01:22:03,220 --> 01:22:04,680
've seen this often not

1876
01:22:04,680 --> 01:22:06,489
just in Denton but in other communities that I've

1877
01:22:06,489 --> 01:22:08,520
experienced where you have the

1878
01:22:08,520 --> 01:22:11,500
ownership address might not be the physical address of the

1879
01:22:11,500 --> 01:22:12,319
site okay thank

1880
01:22:12,319 --> 01:22:18,529
you and it just just as a side matter there there really is

1881
01:22:18,529 --> 01:22:19,680
no defect so long

1882
01:22:19,680 --> 01:22:22,510
as we follow the statute and the statute requires that we

1883
01:22:22,510 --> 01:22:23,359
go by the latest

1884
01:22:23,359 --> 01:22:28,020
certified role so as long as we've done that then even if

1885
01:22:28,020 --> 01:22:29,520
there are some that

1886
01:22:29,520 --> 01:22:33,000
did not get it although we want everybody to be made aware

1887
01:22:33,000 --> 01:22:34,079
and noticed

1888
01:22:34,079 --> 01:22:38,130
it's not going to be a defect or fatal to any vote that we

1889
01:22:38,130 --> 01:22:40,600
have this evening

1890
01:22:40,600 --> 01:22:44,000
the daily per the requirement so we have to put notice

1891
01:22:44,000 --> 01:22:45,239
within the daily as well

1892
01:22:45,239 --> 01:22:49,039
okay thank you Commissioner Sullivan thank you Commissioner

1893
01:22:49,039 --> 01:22:52,239
Roselle what was the last name of the people that you

1894
01:22:52,239 --> 01:22:53,760
mentioned this letters

1895
01:22:53,760 --> 01:22:56,920
from Jason and Denise Thomas's pay is the second letter on

1896
01:22:56,920 --> 01:22:58,239
here is kind of three

1897
01:22:58,239 --> 01:23:02,260
paragraphs there's another one from the bulls to say that

1898
01:23:02,260 --> 01:23:03,399
they were not notified

1899
01:23:03,399 --> 01:23:12,579
either within 200 feet so I don't know again hey the answer

1900
01:23:12,579 --> 01:23:14,000
no and again you

1901
01:23:14,000 --> 01:23:18,119
know sometimes let's work backwards a little bit sometimes

1902
01:23:18,119 --> 01:23:19,640
we do receive the

1903
01:23:19,640 --> 01:23:23,350
certified mail comes back to us where it's not been picked

1904
01:23:23,350 --> 01:23:24,439
up so that that

1905
01:23:24,439 --> 01:23:27,149
has occurred I'm not saying that occurred with this

1906
01:23:27,149 --> 01:23:28,399
specific application

1907
01:23:28,399 --> 01:23:31,279
those are one of the flaws with certified mail which we've

1908
01:23:31,279 --> 01:23:31,800
talked at at

1909
01:23:31,800 --> 01:23:36,079
length about and then secondly what Haley did is she went

1910
01:23:36,079 --> 01:23:36,840
she tried to

1911
01:23:36,840 --> 01:23:40,079
discern what actually came back and where there were disc

1912
01:23:40,079 --> 01:23:41,199
repancies with the

1913
01:23:41,199 --> 01:23:44,359
most recent tax certified tax roll that we have given the

1914
01:23:44,359 --> 01:23:45,680
lag I've just discussed

1915
01:23:45,680 --> 01:23:51,239
and as a result there were some that possibly went to a

1916
01:23:51,239 --> 01:23:53,000
previous owner of the

1917
01:23:53,000 --> 01:23:57,039
property and the intent obviously is to try and notify as

1918
01:23:57,039 --> 01:23:58,159
Jennifer has indicated

1919
01:23:58,159 --> 01:24:03,020
to everybody and to have the most current so unfortunately

1920
01:24:03,020 --> 01:24:03,800
we just and we

1921
01:24:03,800 --> 01:24:07,880
are following the state I just didn't know if there were

1922
01:24:07,880 --> 01:24:09,439
two people or you

1923
01:24:09,439 --> 01:24:13,039
know what have you so look at these two okay thank you

1924
01:24:13,039 --> 01:24:17,699
Commissioner Beck thank you Vice Chair speaking hypoth

1925
01:24:17,699 --> 01:24:19,119
etically just throwing

1926
01:24:19,119 --> 01:24:23,789
information out there for my edification when we go in and

1927
01:24:23,789 --> 01:24:25,520
we have to cast a boat

1928
01:24:25,520 --> 01:24:32,079
on this it seems like the concern of some citizens is that

1929
01:24:32,079 --> 01:24:34,159
if we approve that

1930
01:24:34,159 --> 01:24:40,229
replant that the condition of that dam will deteriorate and

1931
01:24:40,229 --> 01:24:40,939
affect the

1932
01:24:40,939 --> 01:24:45,369
character of the neighborhood but it seems clear that that

1933
01:24:45,369 --> 01:24:46,079
has to be

1934
01:24:46,079 --> 01:24:48,979
maintained as part of the drainage there so that's a

1935
01:24:48,979 --> 01:24:50,680
concern that's probably gone

1936
01:24:50,680 --> 01:24:56,720
by the wayside I'm thinking I empathize on both sides the

1937
01:24:56,720 --> 01:24:57,439
right the proper owner

1938
01:24:57,439 --> 01:25:01,399
to split his property and the concern of the area residents

1939
01:25:01,399 --> 01:25:03,000
there that move there

1940
01:25:03,000 --> 01:25:06,020
for a purpose enjoy the benefits of that lake and all that

1941
01:25:06,020 --> 01:25:07,479
but it seems like

1942
01:25:07,479 --> 01:25:12,119
technically and legally we you know we we can't if we vote

1943
01:25:12,119 --> 01:25:13,760
in favor of one or

1944
01:25:13,760 --> 01:25:19,250
the other at that point they take their concerns to a court

1945
01:25:19,250 --> 01:25:22,079
is that correct you

1946
01:25:22,079 --> 01:25:26,680
mean if we were to approve it right or deny it or to my

1947
01:25:26,680 --> 01:25:27,840
party or the other then

1948
01:25:27,840 --> 01:25:32,640
their only recourse at that point would be right if we deny

1949
01:25:32,640 --> 01:25:34,199
it then we're

1950
01:25:34,199 --> 01:25:38,560
potentially at risk for a writ of mandamus if we approve it

1951
01:25:38,560 --> 01:25:39,159
then the

1952
01:25:39,159 --> 01:25:41,989
neighbors may sue the other neighbor I don't think the city

1953
01:25:41,989 --> 01:25:42,760
is liable for

1954
01:25:42,760 --> 01:25:45,760
okay thank you

1955
01:25:58,800 --> 01:26:00,369
Commissioner Sullivan is the is the dam maintained by the

1956
01:26:00,369 --> 01:26:04,159
homeowners association

1957
01:26:04,159 --> 01:26:07,800
or the owner there is no homeowners Association in this

1958
01:26:07,800 --> 01:26:08,720
case so the owner

1959
01:26:08,720 --> 01:26:11,550
which private property the owners been maintaining it and

1960
01:26:11,550 --> 01:26:12,479
that's really the

1961
01:26:12,479 --> 01:26:15,079
reason I think he said last time in the record that he

1962
01:26:15,079 --> 01:26:16,319
wanted to sell because

1963
01:26:16,319 --> 01:26:19,319
there's a gentleman behind him that would like to maintain

1964
01:26:19,319 --> 01:26:20,000
it because I

1965
01:26:20,000 --> 01:26:22,250
guess his grandchildren playing back there something like

1966
01:26:22,250 --> 01:26:23,119
that but whoever

1967
01:26:23,119 --> 01:26:25,989
gains ownership of it will be responsible for the

1968
01:26:25,989 --> 01:26:27,079
maintenance of it

1969
01:26:27,079 --> 01:26:30,449
and we would be the responsible for enforcing I thought

1970
01:26:30,449 --> 01:26:30,960
that was still part

1971
01:26:30,960 --> 01:26:35,039
of Southridge that's not it's part of yeah for strange it's

1972
01:26:35,039 --> 01:26:37,000
for strange I'm

1973
01:26:37,000 --> 01:26:43,640
sorry for actually Montecito actually yes all right and

1974
01:26:43,640 --> 01:26:44,359
with that we will

1975
01:26:44,359 --> 01:26:47,300
close our work session or end our work session and we will

1976
01:26:47,300 --> 01:26:48,319
reconvene in five

1977
01:26:48,319 --> 01:26:53,680
minutes in the council chambers and the time at six we will

1978
01:26:53,680 --> 01:26:54,760
close our work

1979
01:26:54,760 --> 01:26:57,800
session at 640

1980
01:27:07,000 --> 01:27:23,680
good evening and welcome to the city of Denton planning and

1981
01:27:23,680 --> 01:27:24,439
zoning Commission

1982
01:27:24,439 --> 01:27:29,479
meeting for March the 8th 2017 this meeting has been duly

1983
01:27:29,479 --> 01:27:30,359
posted and a

1984
01:27:30,359 --> 01:27:33,850
quorum is present and I'm gonna call our meeting to order

1985
01:27:33,850 --> 01:27:35,520
at 650 our first

1986
01:27:35,520 --> 01:27:37,739
order of business will be to stand and give the pledge the

1987
01:27:37,739 --> 01:27:38,439
US and the Texas

1988
01:27:38,439 --> 01:27:40,640
flag

1989
01:28:05,520 --> 01:28:14,960
before we get started I apologize that we're running a

1990
01:28:14,960 --> 01:28:17,199
little bit late we

1991
01:28:17,199 --> 01:28:20,470
obviously by the room count and also in our work session we

1992
01:28:20,470 --> 01:28:21,600
've got a couple of

1993
01:28:21,600 --> 01:28:24,229
items with a lot of discussion and took a little longer in

1994
01:28:24,229 --> 01:28:25,039
work session so

1995
01:28:25,039 --> 01:28:28,659
apologize that we ran late to get started this evening in

1996
01:28:28,659 --> 01:28:29,960
that vein we

1997
01:28:29,960 --> 01:28:32,590
also have one change to the order that will announce at the

1998
01:28:32,590 --> 01:28:33,439
beginning of our

1999
01:28:33,439 --> 01:28:37,439
meeting on our public hearing section our item a is going

2000
01:28:37,439 --> 01:28:38,720
to be moved to the

2001
01:28:38,720 --> 01:28:43,869
very end of our meeting after item E so we will go in order

2002
01:28:43,869 --> 01:28:45,159
of B C D E and then

2003
01:28:45,159 --> 01:28:52,939
come back and finish with a with that announcement I'm

2004
01:28:52,939 --> 01:28:55,199
going to move us on to

2005
01:28:55,199 --> 01:28:59,819
our item 2 on our agenda which will be consider approval of

2006
01:28:59,819 --> 01:29:01,199
the planning and

2007
01:29:01,199 --> 01:29:05,739
zoning Commission meetings minutes and I will take those

2008
01:29:05,739 --> 01:29:07,840
two in separate motions

2009
01:29:07,840 --> 01:29:11,840
Commissioner Taylor I move approval of the February 15 2017

2010
01:29:11,840 --> 01:29:12,279
minutes

2011
01:29:12,279 --> 01:29:18,989
Commissioner back second any discussion or comments seeing

2012
01:29:18,989 --> 01:29:20,159
none I'll call for a

2013
01:29:20,159 --> 01:29:22,640
vote on board

2014
01:29:31,239 --> 01:29:34,420
issue on the February 15th meeting because he was not here

2015
01:29:34,420 --> 01:29:37,439
for the special

2016
01:29:37,439 --> 01:29:39,920
call meeting

2017
01:29:42,119 --> 01:29:44,729
I'm sorry that special called I'm sorry that was I was I

2018
01:29:44,729 --> 01:29:46,880
chose the wrong date to

2019
01:29:46,880 --> 01:29:46,880
move withdraw my motion withdraw your motion I'll move

2020
01:29:46,880 --> 01:29:54,479
approval on 15th

2021
01:29:54,479 --> 01:30:00,609
Commissioner Ellis I will second second any discussion

2022
01:30:00,609 --> 01:30:02,520
seeing none I'll call for

2023
01:30:02,520 --> 01:30:05,199
a vote on the board

2024
01:30:25,479 --> 01:30:29,100
motion carries 4-0 with two recuse Commissioner Taylor try

2025
01:30:29,100 --> 01:30:33,600
this again I

2026
01:30:33,600 --> 01:30:33,600
move approval of the February 22nd 2017 minutes okay you

2027
01:30:33,600 --> 01:30:38,720
sure you can do that

2028
01:30:38,720 --> 01:30:38,720
okay good Commissioner Beck second okay we have a first and

2029
01:30:38,720 --> 01:30:44,399
second for approval

2030
01:30:44,399 --> 01:30:58,640
any discussion seeing none a call for a vote on board

2031
01:30:58,640 --> 01:31:09,880
motion carries 4-0 with two

2032
01:31:09,880 --> 01:31:19,720
recuse now move us to our consent agenda Commissioner Beck

2033
01:31:19,720 --> 01:31:22,399
okay Commissioner

2034
01:31:22,399 --> 01:31:26,880
Roselle second okay we have a we have a first and a second

2035
01:31:26,880 --> 01:31:28,680
for approval any

2036
01:31:28,680 --> 01:31:42,390
discussion seeing none will call for a vote on board motion

2037
01:31:42,390 --> 01:31:51,079
carries 6-0 that

2038
01:31:51,079 --> 01:31:55,159
will move us to our items of individual consideration and I

2039
01:31:55,159 --> 01:31:57,159
will call on Haley

2040
01:31:57,159 --> 01:32:00,359
for presentation

2041
01:32:19,640 --> 01:32:24,140
good evening this is case ADP 1620 from the Mission Street

2042
01:32:24,140 --> 01:32:26,079
offices the request

2043
01:32:26,079 --> 01:32:29,420
is consider approval approval of an alternative development

2044
01:32:29,420 --> 01:32:30,039
plan for an

2045
01:32:30,039 --> 01:32:32,920
initial phase of a proposed office park development on

2046
01:32:32,920 --> 01:32:35,520
approximately 1.65 acres

2047
01:32:35,520 --> 01:32:38,680
the property is located at the corner of Fort Worth Drive

2048
01:32:38,680 --> 01:32:40,399
and Mission Street you

2049
01:32:40,399 --> 01:32:43,689
can see outlined in yellow the initial phase that is part

2050
01:32:43,689 --> 01:32:44,720
of this ADP request

2051
01:32:44,720 --> 01:32:49,000
the area outlined in red represents all three parcels that

2052
01:32:49,000 --> 01:32:50,359
are intended to be

2053
01:32:50,359 --> 01:32:54,859
involved in the full development currently the property is

2054
01:32:54,859 --> 01:32:55,359
zoned

2055
01:32:55,359 --> 01:32:58,869
community mixed-use general the future land use for this

2056
01:32:58,869 --> 01:32:59,880
area is community

2057
01:32:59,880 --> 01:33:03,109
mixed-use which allows for predominantly commercial uses

2058
01:33:03,109 --> 01:33:04,279
that are clustered in

2059
01:33:04,279 --> 01:33:07,810
close proximity as well as a mix of institutional and

2060
01:33:07,810 --> 01:33:10,039
residential uses this

2061
01:33:10,039 --> 01:33:13,680
represents the site plan for the development you can see

2062
01:33:13,680 --> 01:33:14,680
the phase that

2063
01:33:14,680 --> 01:33:18,069
we're looking at here involves three buildings as well as

2064
01:33:18,069 --> 01:33:19,119
an area off to the

2065
01:33:19,119 --> 01:33:24,279
side that is going to be used as a detention pond so as

2066
01:33:24,279 --> 01:33:25,880
part of this ADP

2067
01:33:25,880 --> 01:33:29,039
request the applicant has multiple areas of the Denton

2068
01:33:29,039 --> 01:33:30,359
development code site

2069
01:33:30,359 --> 01:33:33,300
design standards that they are requesting to deviate from

2070
01:33:33,300 --> 01:33:34,000
the first of

2071
01:33:34,000 --> 01:33:38,079
those is a requirement for non-residential buildings that

2072
01:33:38,079 --> 01:33:38,760
the primary

2073
01:33:38,760 --> 01:33:41,250
orientation of the building be towards the street the

2074
01:33:41,250 --> 01:33:42,399
intent of this is to

2075
01:33:42,399 --> 01:33:44,279
provide buildings that present well to the street with

2076
01:33:44,279 --> 01:33:44,920
clearly defined

2077
01:33:44,920 --> 01:33:49,909
entrances for vehicular and pedestrian traffic so as you

2078
01:33:49,909 --> 01:33:51,359
can see looking back

2079
01:33:51,359 --> 01:33:54,039
at the site plan these buildings are intended to be

2080
01:33:54,039 --> 01:33:55,399
oriented inwards towards

2081
01:33:55,399 --> 01:33:58,560
this campus feel that they're trying to create with the

2082
01:33:58,560 --> 01:33:59,920
larger development so

2083
01:33:59,920 --> 01:34:04,300
especially the buildings on lot one and lot two would have

2084
01:34:04,300 --> 01:34:05,680
their rear and side

2085
01:34:05,680 --> 01:34:11,750
spacing towards the street in this case the applicant

2086
01:34:11,750 --> 01:34:13,199
provided elevations

2087
01:34:13,199 --> 01:34:15,960
for the first building the one that was located with its

2088
01:34:15,960 --> 01:34:17,000
rear-facing Fort Worth

2089
01:34:17,000 --> 01:34:20,399
Drive so we can see here the front elevation on the top

2090
01:34:20,399 --> 01:34:21,359
that would be

2091
01:34:21,359 --> 01:34:24,310
facing towards the inside of the development as well as one

2092
01:34:24,310 --> 01:34:24,920
of the side

2093
01:34:24,920 --> 01:34:29,100
elevations and on the second page we can see the rear

2094
01:34:29,100 --> 01:34:31,239
elevation they are proposing

2095
01:34:31,239 --> 01:34:34,250
architectural enhancements it's a masonry constructed

2096
01:34:34,250 --> 01:34:35,399
building and they're

2097
01:34:35,399 --> 01:34:38,630
using windows and awnings and some repeating architectural

2098
01:34:38,630 --> 01:34:39,319
features to

2099
01:34:39,319 --> 01:34:45,390
provide visual interest and you know it visibly interesting

2100
01:34:45,390 --> 01:34:46,359
building from the

2101
01:34:46,359 --> 01:34:50,840
street rather than just a solid wall we can also see from

2102
01:34:50,840 --> 01:34:52,680
their landscape plan

2103
01:34:52,680 --> 01:34:56,380
they intend to provide at least five shrubs in this area as

2104
01:34:56,380 --> 01:34:57,000
well as a

2105
01:34:57,000 --> 01:35:00,819
sidewalk there would also be sidewalk running along Fort

2106
01:35:00,819 --> 01:35:01,680
Worth Drive here that

2107
01:35:01,680 --> 01:35:04,539
they're providing connectivity to throughout the

2108
01:35:04,539 --> 01:35:06,720
development as well one

2109
01:35:06,720 --> 01:35:09,600
of their other requested deviations is from the parking

2110
01:35:09,600 --> 01:35:11,680
requirements so for a

2111
01:35:11,680 --> 01:35:14,590
general office use as they're proposing here the DDC

2112
01:35:14,590 --> 01:35:16,239
requires one space for every

2113
01:35:16,239 --> 01:35:20,409
450 square feet of floor area that would be a total of 30

2114
01:35:20,409 --> 01:35:22,119
or 27 spaces for the

2115
01:35:22,119 --> 01:35:24,949
three buildings that they're proposing at this point the

2116
01:35:24,949 --> 01:35:26,720
site plan shows that

2117
01:35:26,720 --> 01:35:30,020
they're intending to provide 39 spaces so 12 over what is

2118
01:35:30,020 --> 01:35:31,039
required there and

2119
01:35:31,039 --> 01:35:34,550
that triggers the requirement in sub chapter 13 that excess

2120
01:35:34,550 --> 01:35:35,560
parking above the

2121
01:35:35,560 --> 01:35:39,750
required number be constructed of pervious surface in lieu

2122
01:35:39,750 --> 01:35:40,800
of providing

2123
01:35:40,800 --> 01:35:43,960
pervious surface for those extra spaces the applicant is

2124
01:35:43,960 --> 01:35:45,159
proposing to provide a

2125
01:35:45,159 --> 01:35:48,319
detention pond here off to the side of these buildings that

2126
01:35:48,319 --> 01:35:48,720
would be

2127
01:35:48,720 --> 01:35:51,539
constructed to I swim standards so when they get to the

2128
01:35:51,539 --> 01:35:53,439
final plotting phase the

2129
01:35:53,439 --> 01:35:56,869
exact calculations for the volume and sizing of that pond

2130
01:35:56,869 --> 01:35:58,079
will be determined

2131
01:35:58,079 --> 01:36:00,810
and the pond will have to be designed to hold the water

2132
01:36:00,810 --> 01:36:02,279
quality volume generated

2133
01:36:02,279 --> 01:36:06,840
by this parking lot and the excess spaces for 24 hours

2134
01:36:06,840 --> 01:36:08,479
because the overall

2135
01:36:08,479 --> 01:36:12,039
size of the full office park campus that they've shown us

2136
01:36:12,039 --> 01:36:13,439
is over 40,000 square

2137
01:36:13,439 --> 01:36:16,380
feet even at this initial phase we're trying to make sure

2138
01:36:16,380 --> 01:36:17,159
that the site

2139
01:36:17,159 --> 01:36:19,560
addresses all of the large-scale development standards in

2140
01:36:19,560 --> 01:36:20,079
the Denton

2141
01:36:20,079 --> 01:36:22,239
Development Code which are triggered when a development is

2142
01:36:22,239 --> 01:36:23,340
over 40,000 square

2143
01:36:23,340 --> 01:36:26,600
feet two of the requirements there the applicant is

2144
01:36:26,600 --> 01:36:28,319
proposing to deviate from

2145
01:36:28,319 --> 01:36:32,090
one is the requirement for a masonry wall around or on any

2146
01:36:32,090 --> 01:36:33,439
common boundary line

2147
01:36:33,439 --> 01:36:36,930
between the development and a single-family property and

2148
01:36:36,930 --> 01:36:37,760
the second is

2149
01:36:37,760 --> 01:36:40,640
that mechanical equipment be located greater than a hundred

2150
01:36:40,640 --> 01:36:41,319
feet from any

2151
01:36:41,319 --> 01:36:45,340
residential property in this case the property adjoining

2152
01:36:45,340 --> 01:36:46,560
this to the south

2153
01:36:46,560 --> 01:36:49,399
does have a single-family residence on it and another

2154
01:36:49,399 --> 01:36:50,760
requirement within the

2155
01:36:50,760 --> 01:36:54,899
DDC is that a type C buffer which is a 15 foot planted area

2156
01:36:54,899 --> 01:36:56,279
with six trees and

2157
01:36:56,279 --> 01:36:59,439
25 shrubs per 100 feet of length be provided between a

2158
01:36:59,439 --> 01:37:00,119
commercial and

2159
01:37:00,119 --> 01:37:04,510
single-family use in this case that because it is a large-

2160
01:37:04,510 --> 01:37:05,479
scale development

2161
01:37:05,479 --> 01:37:08,390
would require that buffer as well as that masonry wall the

2162
01:37:08,390 --> 01:37:09,479
applicant has

2163
01:37:09,479 --> 01:37:12,069
proposed instead of providing the wall to provide the

2164
01:37:12,069 --> 01:37:13,119
required buffer and

2165
01:37:13,119 --> 01:37:16,279
intensify it with at this case their calculation showed

2166
01:37:16,279 --> 01:37:17,439
five additional trees

2167
01:37:17,439 --> 01:37:22,590
and 19 additional shrubs in lieu of that wall I've circled

2168
01:37:22,590 --> 01:37:24,079
in red here an area

2169
01:37:24,079 --> 01:37:27,680
where mechanical equipment primarily air conditioning units

2170
01:37:27,680 --> 01:37:28,760
would be located

2171
01:37:28,760 --> 01:37:32,119
within approximately 30 feet of the property line with that

2172
01:37:32,119 --> 01:37:32,680
single-family

2173
01:37:32,680 --> 01:37:34,960
residential use so well within that hundred feet limb

2174
01:37:34,960 --> 01:37:36,800
hundred foot limit and

2175
01:37:36,800 --> 01:37:40,090
the applicant has proposed to screen all of that equipment

2176
01:37:40,090 --> 01:37:40,399
with

2177
01:37:40,399 --> 01:37:43,060
architecturally compatible materials and plantings which

2178
01:37:43,060 --> 01:37:44,060
were not specified at

2179
01:37:44,060 --> 01:37:50,130
this time this ADP does satisfy the criteria for approval

2180
01:37:50,130 --> 01:37:50,560
of an ADP

2181
01:37:50,560 --> 01:37:55,350
outlined in subchapter 13 it is a logical location at this

2182
01:37:55,350 --> 01:37:56,520
hard corner of

2183
01:37:56,520 --> 01:38:01,489
highway and Mission Street for an office park campus as

2184
01:38:01,489 --> 01:38:02,399
well as it's

2185
01:38:02,399 --> 01:38:06,050
compatible with that community mixed-use future land use

2186
01:38:06,050 --> 01:38:08,199
designation so staff

2187
01:38:08,199 --> 01:38:10,960
does recommend all of the recommend approval of this ADP

2188
01:38:10,960 --> 01:38:11,520
with several

2189
01:38:11,520 --> 01:38:14,359
conditions the first of those is that the development

2190
01:38:14,359 --> 01:38:15,359
substantially conformed

2191
01:38:15,359 --> 01:38:19,079
to the attached site plan the second is that we require it

2192
01:38:19,079 --> 01:38:20,000
substantially comply

2193
01:38:20,000 --> 01:38:24,010
with the landscape plan with two modifications the first of

2194
01:38:24,010 --> 01:38:25,119
those is in

2195
01:38:25,119 --> 01:38:28,760
front of the building on Fort Worth Drive in lieu of

2196
01:38:28,760 --> 01:38:30,439
strictly these shrubs

2197
01:38:30,439 --> 01:38:34,489
shown here staff recommends they provide a five foot width

2198
01:38:34,489 --> 01:38:35,479
of planting area that

2199
01:38:35,479 --> 01:38:38,760
could feature tall grasses as well as the shrubs to provide

2200
01:38:38,760 --> 01:38:39,640
variation and

2201
01:38:39,640 --> 01:38:43,399
soften the transition between the street and the building

2202
01:38:43,399 --> 01:38:45,399
frontage the second

2203
01:38:45,399 --> 01:38:49,069
requirement is that we recommend a six foot opaque masonry

2204
01:38:49,069 --> 01:38:50,399
screening wall be

2205
01:38:50,399 --> 01:38:53,560
provided on that southern boundary in addition to the

2206
01:38:53,560 --> 01:38:54,600
required buffer the

2207
01:38:54,600 --> 01:38:58,609
intent of the requirement for a masonry wall is to provide

2208
01:38:58,609 --> 01:39:00,279
a permanent screening

2209
01:39:00,279 --> 01:39:04,319
and buffer between two seemingly incompatible uses in this

2210
01:39:04,319 --> 01:39:05,119
case because

2211
01:39:05,119 --> 01:39:08,409
this is smaller buildings broken up over this larger lot

2212
01:39:08,409 --> 01:39:10,039
staff felt that six feet

2213
01:39:10,039 --> 01:39:13,329
would could be sufficient as the screening rather than

2214
01:39:13,329 --> 01:39:15,039
eight feet but the

2215
01:39:15,039 --> 01:39:17,300
landscaping buffer would not provide that screening year-

2216
01:39:17,300 --> 01:39:18,039
round that was the

2217
01:39:18,039 --> 01:39:22,100
intent of this so we recommend the wall be added back in as

2218
01:39:22,100 --> 01:39:24,079
part of this the

2219
01:39:24,079 --> 01:39:26,239
other recommendations are that the screening for the

2220
01:39:26,239 --> 01:39:27,840
mechanical equipment be

2221
01:39:27,840 --> 01:39:30,210
constructed of masonry materials that are compatible with

2222
01:39:30,210 --> 01:39:30,920
the building's

2223
01:39:30,920 --> 01:39:34,409
design and in addition to that we recommend planting of shr

2224
01:39:34,409 --> 01:39:35,199
ubs and tall

2225
01:39:35,199 --> 01:39:37,600
grasses around the perimeter of those screening walls to

2226
01:39:37,600 --> 01:39:38,680
add an extra layer of

2227
01:39:38,680 --> 01:39:42,319
buffering between those mechanical equipment and the single

2228
01:39:42,319 --> 01:39:43,119
-family homes

2229
01:39:43,119 --> 01:39:47,289
staff also recommends that building one as was identified

2230
01:39:47,289 --> 01:39:48,520
here substantially

2231
01:39:48,520 --> 01:39:51,699
comply with the elevations that were shown as well because

2232
01:39:51,699 --> 01:39:52,560
we did not receive

2233
01:39:52,560 --> 01:39:55,920
elevations for buildings two and three we recommend that

2234
01:39:55,920 --> 01:39:57,479
those be constructed of

2235
01:39:57,479 --> 01:40:00,210
masonry materials that are similar in design and

2236
01:40:00,210 --> 01:40:01,960
construction to building one

2237
01:40:01,960 --> 01:40:05,439
that we saw here so as to create a cohesive development

2238
01:40:05,439 --> 01:40:05,840
throughout this

2239
01:40:05,840 --> 01:40:09,340
office park we also recommend that any future phases be

2240
01:40:09,340 --> 01:40:11,000
uniform as it relates

2241
01:40:11,000 --> 01:40:13,840
to the frontage setbacks building materials and landscaping

2242
01:40:13,840 --> 01:40:14,479
used on Fort

2243
01:40:14,479 --> 01:40:17,039
Worth Drive to further that cohesive development as the

2244
01:40:17,039 --> 01:40:18,119
future phases come in

2245
01:40:18,119 --> 01:40:23,489
and at that this time I can answer any questions you might

2246
01:40:23,489 --> 01:40:25,039
have I have a

2247
01:40:25,039 --> 01:40:29,760
question on item three the masonry screening for the

2248
01:40:29,760 --> 01:40:32,079
mechanical equipment is

2249
01:40:32,079 --> 01:40:35,989
there a concern that a masonry wall may affect the

2250
01:40:35,989 --> 01:40:38,279
performance and efficiency of

2251
01:40:38,279 --> 01:40:43,890
those air conditioning equipment and maybe could look at

2252
01:40:43,890 --> 01:40:44,960
just doing shrubs

2253
01:40:44,960 --> 01:40:48,359
and grasses screening so that those can work efficiently

2254
01:40:48,359 --> 01:40:49,760
that's not something

2255
01:40:49,760 --> 01:40:52,739
that we looked at specifically we didn't get into the exact

2256
01:40:52,739 --> 01:40:53,479
design of that

2257
01:40:53,479 --> 01:40:55,569
screening around those I believe the applicant is here

2258
01:40:55,569 --> 01:40:56,159
though if you would

2259
01:40:56,159 --> 01:40:58,989
like to address some of those questions with him if if I

2260
01:40:58,989 --> 01:41:01,159
may interject if the

2261
01:41:01,159 --> 01:41:03,890
Commission does recommend consistent with staff's

2262
01:41:03,890 --> 01:41:05,399
recommendation as it relates

2263
01:41:05,399 --> 01:41:08,560
to the screen wall then perhaps we can revisit the

2264
01:41:08,560 --> 01:41:09,479
recommendation for the

2265
01:41:09,479 --> 01:41:17,239
screening mechanisms for the HVAC systems thank you

2266
01:41:20,680 --> 01:41:28,800
thank you Haley have one card on this item request to speak

2267
01:41:28,800 --> 01:41:31,159
says Lawrence

2268
01:41:31,159 --> 01:41:36,720
Holder and I think applicant maybe in Lee Allison speaking

2269
01:41:36,720 --> 01:41:49,960
in lieu of okay I'm

2270
01:41:49,960 --> 01:41:55,399
Lawrence Holder I'm gonna be speaking ten minutes for your

2271
01:41:55,399 --> 01:41:56,119
presentation if

2272
01:41:56,119 --> 01:42:00,439
you that much time perfect we appreciate the recommendation

2273
01:42:00,439 --> 01:42:01,359
by the engineering

2274
01:42:01,359 --> 01:42:04,729
development review division for approval however we do not

2275
01:42:04,729 --> 01:42:05,880
agree with the second

2276
01:42:05,880 --> 01:42:09,420
condition that the six-foot masonry screening won't be

2277
01:42:09,420 --> 01:42:10,239
constructed along the

2278
01:42:10,239 --> 01:42:14,960
common boundary line of the adjacent residential property

2279
01:42:14,960 --> 01:42:16,239
we are proposing a

2280
01:42:16,239 --> 01:42:19,220
garden style office that has highly compatible that is

2281
01:42:19,220 --> 01:42:19,800
highly compatible

2282
01:42:19,800 --> 01:42:25,100
with the residential appearances we are proposing an intens

2283
01:42:25,100 --> 01:42:26,000
ified type-c

2284
01:42:26,000 --> 01:42:28,869
buffer and my understanding whenever we were putting it

2285
01:42:28,869 --> 01:42:30,199
together that

2286
01:42:30,199 --> 01:42:34,260
intensifying that type-c buffer would be in lieu of that

2287
01:42:34,260 --> 01:42:37,000
wall if we don't have if

2288
01:42:37,000 --> 01:42:40,159
we have to put in that wall we don't want to intensify the

2289
01:42:40,159 --> 01:42:44,119
buffer so so we

2290
01:42:44,119 --> 01:42:47,350
were intensifying that buffer for the nuanced mitigation as

2291
01:42:47,350 --> 01:42:48,319
explained in the

2292
01:42:48,319 --> 01:42:51,159
ADP table and the tree canopy table and the comments on

2293
01:42:51,159 --> 01:42:52,800
that sheet as well the

2294
01:42:52,800 --> 01:43:00,000
existing zoning of the property is CMG as it was earlier

2295
01:43:00,000 --> 01:43:03,680
the adjacent properties

2296
01:43:03,680 --> 01:43:07,050
are zoned in our six which is a which is considered a

2297
01:43:07,050 --> 01:43:08,600
highly dense residential

2298
01:43:08,600 --> 01:43:16,090
zoning based on the future land use we were making sure

2299
01:43:16,090 --> 01:43:17,279
that's pointing north

2300
01:43:17,279 --> 01:43:21,340
for you based on the future land use plan this side is a

2301
01:43:21,340 --> 01:43:23,159
transitional area for

2302
01:43:23,159 --> 01:43:26,319
the whole area to become a CMG or equal in the future by

2303
01:43:26,319 --> 01:43:28,439
putting up a wall we

2304
01:43:28,439 --> 01:43:31,119
feel as though we're going to end up with the same

2305
01:43:31,119 --> 01:43:32,880
development stuff next to it

2306
01:43:32,880 --> 01:43:34,720
and then we're just going to end up with the wall that has

2307
01:43:34,720 --> 01:43:35,880
no value or any any

2308
01:43:35,880 --> 01:43:41,260
additional the proposed buildings must conform to the

2309
01:43:41,260 --> 01:43:42,680
building elevations

2310
01:43:42,680 --> 01:43:46,539
provided in the ADP if it gets approved and any additional

2311
01:43:46,539 --> 01:43:47,479
buildings will

2312
01:43:47,479 --> 01:43:50,699
require an ADP to be submitted and brought to the planning

2313
01:43:50,699 --> 01:43:51,399
and zoning

2314
01:43:51,399 --> 01:43:56,369
commission for future expansion so approving this ADP doesn

2315
01:43:56,369 --> 01:43:57,439
't affect the

2316
01:43:57,439 --> 01:44:02,439
future buildings if this were a typical convenience store

2317
01:44:02,439 --> 01:44:04,640
or retail center we

2318
01:44:04,640 --> 01:44:07,270
would we could understand and agree with the conditions for

2319
01:44:07,270 --> 01:44:08,680
a wall however given

2320
01:44:08,680 --> 01:44:11,840
the reasons I just expressed we did not feel that a wall

2321
01:44:11,840 --> 01:44:13,399
would be needed or add

2322
01:44:13,399 --> 01:44:20,760
any value now or in the future a couple questions for you

2323
01:44:20,760 --> 01:44:21,840
Commissioner Roselle

2324
01:44:21,840 --> 01:44:24,239
thank you for being here and presenting I have a question

2325
01:44:24,239 --> 01:44:24,720
for staff

2326
01:44:24,720 --> 01:44:27,319
clarification it was my understanding that because it's a

2327
01:44:27,319 --> 01:44:29,600
large-scale project

2328
01:44:29,600 --> 01:44:32,800
at its conclusion the southern buffer would have to be

2329
01:44:32,800 --> 01:44:34,640
eight feet and that

2330
01:44:34,640 --> 01:44:38,949
staff had reduced it to six feet can you clarify that it

2331
01:44:38,949 --> 01:44:40,479
was to be eight feet and

2332
01:44:40,479 --> 01:44:42,909
there's already been a concession to remove those two feet

2333
01:44:42,909 --> 01:44:44,000
yes the

2334
01:44:44,000 --> 01:44:46,159
requirement in the code is for an eight foot masonry

2335
01:44:46,159 --> 01:44:47,319
screening wall and staff

2336
01:44:47,319 --> 01:44:50,229
recommended six because of the smaller individual scale of

2337
01:44:50,229 --> 01:44:51,279
the building so over

2338
01:44:51,279 --> 01:44:55,500
the larger development would still trigger that eight foot

2339
01:44:55,500 --> 01:44:57,359
requirement and

2340
01:44:57,359 --> 01:44:59,880
so just to clarify thank you for the applicant you're

2341
01:44:59,880 --> 01:45:01,039
wanting a further

2342
01:45:01,039 --> 01:45:04,899
reduction of what would be codified for the southern border

2343
01:45:04,899 --> 01:45:06,680
from eight then we

2344
01:45:06,680 --> 01:45:13,449
did six and you want less is that correct correct okay

2345
01:45:13,449 --> 01:45:14,680
thank you

2346
01:45:14,680 --> 01:45:19,649
Commissioner back thank you chair following up on that last

2347
01:45:19,649 --> 01:45:20,000
part of

2348
01:45:20,000 --> 01:45:24,560
Commissioner Roselle's question you don't want a wall at

2349
01:45:24,560 --> 01:45:26,399
all or you don't

2350
01:45:26,399 --> 01:45:32,090
want a wall plus and the landscape barriers that what I

2351
01:45:32,090 --> 01:45:33,239
heard no we want to

2352
01:45:33,239 --> 01:45:36,600
intensify the landscape buffer added additional trees add

2353
01:45:36,600 --> 01:45:37,680
additional shrubs

2354
01:45:37,680 --> 01:45:42,500
make that landscape area really nice in lieu of the

2355
01:45:42,500 --> 01:45:44,520
retaining wall arm not

2356
01:45:44,520 --> 01:45:49,909
retained but in lieu of the wall again we're looking at

2357
01:45:49,909 --> 01:45:52,119
what is good now and in

2358
01:45:52,119 --> 01:45:57,359
the future by having a wall separating what is essentially

2359
01:45:57,359 --> 01:45:59,560
high residential and

2360
01:45:59,560 --> 01:46:04,189
eventually going to be CMG which will be commercial or

2361
01:46:04,189 --> 01:46:06,760
moving forward it's going

2362
01:46:06,760 --> 01:46:13,909
to be on uniform what kind of equipment are we talking

2363
01:46:13,909 --> 01:46:15,319
about there is just AC

2364
01:46:15,319 --> 01:46:20,319
units yes and these offices are four thousand eight hundred

2365
01:46:20,319 --> 01:46:21,880
and thirty five I

2366
01:46:21,880 --> 01:46:24,039
think square feet less than five thousand square foot so

2367
01:46:24,039 --> 01:46:25,640
these offices are

2368
01:46:25,640 --> 01:46:29,710
relatively bigger homes so these AC units even though it is

2369
01:46:29,710 --> 01:46:31,000
for office would

2370
01:46:31,000 --> 01:46:35,850
be basically to residential sized ish I don't I'm not the H

2371
01:46:35,850 --> 01:46:37,039
VAC guy but they're

2372
01:46:37,039 --> 01:46:41,560
going to be the same relative size as a residential unit so

2373
01:46:41,560 --> 01:46:43,960
we don't have to

2374
01:46:43,960 --> 01:46:49,189
screen from the residents a residence HVAC unit but we

2375
01:46:49,189 --> 01:46:51,000
understand screening

2376
01:46:51,000 --> 01:46:55,199
because this is a commercial we're adhering to the DDC code

2377
01:46:55,199 --> 01:46:56,319
for the

2378
01:46:56,319 --> 01:46:59,479
residents but in all reality the units aren't going to be

2379
01:46:59,479 --> 01:47:00,520
much bigger than a

2380
01:47:00,520 --> 01:47:05,039
residence's unit which could be placed five feet away from

2381
01:47:05,039 --> 01:47:06,479
another house so and

2382
01:47:06,479 --> 01:47:10,710
what was your consideration for a landscape barrier what

2383
01:47:10,710 --> 01:47:11,640
are we looking at

2384
01:47:11,640 --> 01:47:15,310
what were you suggesting we were intensifying it so we were

2385
01:47:15,310 --> 01:47:16,039
going to be

2386
01:47:16,039 --> 01:47:19,500
adding additional trees and shrubs we're looking at a 10

2387
01:47:19,500 --> 01:47:21,399
foot width on this it is

2388
01:47:21,399 --> 01:47:25,640
it is the type C buffer okay we weren't shrinking the size

2389
01:47:25,640 --> 01:47:26,720
of the type C buffer

2390
01:47:26,720 --> 01:47:31,960
it was going to be the DDC size which I believe is 10 feet

2391
01:47:31,960 --> 01:47:35,800
correct 15 15 15 feet

2392
01:47:35,800 --> 01:47:40,130
that's 15 on your site plan okay I should know that that's

2393
01:47:40,130 --> 01:47:41,800
okay we're here to help

2394
01:47:41,800 --> 01:47:47,260
just one last thing how will you identify these buildings

2395
01:47:47,260 --> 01:47:47,880
for the people

2396
01:47:47,880 --> 01:47:50,180
driving down Fort Worth where you can put your signs for

2397
01:47:50,180 --> 01:47:50,800
this for these

2398
01:47:50,800 --> 01:47:53,960
buildings to identify them somebody's driving down Fort

2399
01:47:53,960 --> 01:47:54,600
Worth see these

2400
01:47:54,600 --> 01:48:01,119
buildings are you by all means Lee pardon me Lee Allison

2401
01:48:01,119 --> 01:48:01,640
with Allison

2402
01:48:01,640 --> 01:48:04,079
engineering group I hope it's okay to speak I was on the

2403
01:48:04,079 --> 01:48:05,079
car looking at staff

2404
01:48:05,079 --> 01:48:08,239
they haven't legal happens anything so I guess we're good

2405
01:48:08,239 --> 01:48:11,279
4401 north 35 35 didn't

2406
01:48:11,279 --> 01:48:15,220
Texas the signage will be on the buildings where these are

2407
01:48:15,220 --> 01:48:15,760
going to be

2408
01:48:15,760 --> 01:48:20,729
places to where their destinations we're not going to need

2409
01:48:20,729 --> 01:48:22,119
signs like a Taco Bell

2410
01:48:22,119 --> 01:48:25,119
or restaurant or something would so there's no need for

2411
01:48:25,119 --> 01:48:25,880
that but that be on

2412
01:48:25,880 --> 01:48:30,600
that wall that faces for it would be on the wall facing

2413
01:48:30,600 --> 01:48:31,840
well I don't know to be

2414
01:48:31,840 --> 01:48:35,489
honest with that because again depends on who the tenant is

2415
01:48:35,489 --> 01:48:36,760
Kent keys office is

2416
01:48:36,760 --> 01:48:38,710
going to be one of those and I don't even know if he's

2417
01:48:38,710 --> 01:48:39,560
gonna have a sign on

2418
01:48:39,560 --> 01:48:42,270
it at all or be small monument sign or sign on the side of

2419
01:48:42,270 --> 01:48:43,159
the building but

2420
01:48:43,159 --> 01:48:46,399
he'll deal with sign for that in accordance with the code

2421
01:48:46,399 --> 01:48:47,399
well if people

2422
01:48:47,399 --> 01:48:49,819
are looking for you place and you wanted to look for your

2423
01:48:49,819 --> 01:48:51,439
place that's what I was

2424
01:48:51,439 --> 01:48:55,319
curious about is how you're gonna designate that there'll

2425
01:48:55,319 --> 01:48:55,760
be some of that

2426
01:48:55,760 --> 01:49:01,930
and I might add is Lance was trying to point out in order

2427
01:49:01,930 --> 01:49:03,560
to mitigate the

2428
01:49:03,560 --> 01:49:07,000
requirement for the wall around the perimeter we were

2429
01:49:07,000 --> 01:49:08,920
offering the standard

2430
01:49:08,920 --> 01:49:14,989
required landscape buffer plus additional plantings and we

2431
01:49:14,989 --> 01:49:15,399
were

2432
01:49:15,399 --> 01:49:19,590
offering up screening adjacent for the mechanical equipment

2433
01:49:19,590 --> 01:49:20,520
and we put the

2434
01:49:20,520 --> 01:49:23,239
mechanical equipment person personally on the side of the

2435
01:49:23,239 --> 01:49:24,079
buildings instead of

2436
01:49:24,079 --> 01:49:30,949
the back of the buildings to help attenuate that we're not

2437
01:49:30,949 --> 01:49:32,800
a big corner

2438
01:49:32,800 --> 01:49:36,520
commercial convenience store or supermarket or something

2439
01:49:36,520 --> 01:49:37,439
like that with

2440
01:49:37,439 --> 01:49:40,329
the big heavy mechanical equipment and so forth they

2441
01:49:40,329 --> 01:49:42,880
typically have if the

2442
01:49:42,880 --> 01:49:45,529
walls going to be required I mean certainly we appreciate

2443
01:49:45,529 --> 01:49:46,520
staff's efforts

2444
01:49:46,520 --> 01:49:49,220
to shorten the wall but we would not want to do the extra

2445
01:49:49,220 --> 01:49:50,239
landscaping and we

2446
01:49:50,239 --> 01:49:53,090
would ask that definitely the masonry screening wall

2447
01:49:53,090 --> 01:49:54,439
against the mechanical

2448
01:49:54,439 --> 01:49:57,840
equipment be pulled away don't have any problem with

2449
01:49:57,840 --> 01:50:00,079
vegetation and we didn't put

2450
01:50:00,079 --> 01:50:02,789
dimensions but obviously we'd want those screening to be

2451
01:50:02,789 --> 01:50:04,119
far enough away so that

2452
01:50:04,119 --> 01:50:07,930
the equipment will operate properly and we can access it

2453
01:50:07,930 --> 01:50:08,960
and maintain it

2454
01:50:08,960 --> 01:50:13,319
properly okay thank you so we're bargaining I guess thank

2455
01:50:13,319 --> 01:50:14,600
you and while

2456
01:50:14,600 --> 01:50:17,840
you're there Lee I have a question for you that I've got a

2457
01:50:17,840 --> 01:50:19,880
couple more on the

2458
01:50:19,880 --> 01:50:24,590
property to the east it's owned in our six and I think the

2459
01:50:24,590 --> 01:50:26,119
setback on in our

2460
01:50:26,119 --> 01:50:29,819
six is four feet off the property lines that correct I

2461
01:50:29,819 --> 01:50:31,600
think and we're looking

2462
01:50:31,600 --> 01:50:33,899
at the top of my head I'm sorry I think that's correct on

2463
01:50:33,899 --> 01:50:35,640
in our six and so to

2464
01:50:35,640 --> 01:50:40,350
the south they've got a 20-foot building line between the

2465
01:50:40,350 --> 01:50:41,640
property in the back of

2466
01:50:41,640 --> 01:50:45,029
the buildings the parking lots are on the north side of the

2467
01:50:45,029 --> 01:50:46,159
buildings and so I

2468
01:50:46,159 --> 01:50:50,090
understand maybe some of the concern for a screening wall

2469
01:50:50,090 --> 01:50:51,720
if there was parking on

2470
01:50:51,720 --> 01:50:54,880
the south side of buildings where there'd be traffic but

2471
01:50:54,880 --> 01:50:56,039
with the parking on the

2472
01:50:56,039 --> 01:50:58,430
north side of the buildings with the buildings being 20

2473
01:50:58,430 --> 01:50:59,359
feet off the property

2474
01:50:59,359 --> 01:51:03,680
line they're mostly like houses I mean I I can see your

2475
01:51:03,680 --> 01:51:05,079
point that some nice

2476
01:51:05,079 --> 01:51:09,350
landscaping and screening is I think appropriate I would

2477
01:51:09,350 --> 01:51:10,920
think it as this

2478
01:51:10,920 --> 01:51:14,630
comes before our Commission in the future on the east side

2479
01:51:14,630 --> 01:51:16,119
that does back up to

2480
01:51:16,119 --> 01:51:20,029
in our six I could see where a masonry screening wall would

2481
01:51:20,029 --> 01:51:21,359
would probably be

2482
01:51:21,359 --> 01:51:24,890
not only beneficial for residents but also for the

2483
01:51:24,890 --> 01:51:26,840
development itself but to

2484
01:51:26,840 --> 01:51:30,479
the to the south I can see where that would be more of a

2485
01:51:30,479 --> 01:51:32,000
commercial type feel

2486
01:51:32,000 --> 01:51:35,760
and having it open versus a masonry wall there because of

2487
01:51:35,760 --> 01:51:37,000
the way that you have

2488
01:51:37,000 --> 01:51:40,159
your site plan and the way the buildings are oriented so

2489
01:51:40,159 --> 01:51:41,960
beyond that the only

2490
01:51:41,960 --> 01:51:44,539
other concern you all have is on the screening on the mason

2491
01:51:44,539 --> 01:51:45,399
ry and you're fine

2492
01:51:45,399 --> 01:51:48,340
with all the other conditions and extra things that you all

2493
01:51:48,340 --> 01:51:49,199
have agreed to do

2494
01:51:49,199 --> 01:51:52,909
or that our staff has asked you're willing to do those yes

2495
01:51:52,909 --> 01:51:53,960
that is correct

2496
01:51:53,960 --> 01:51:57,930
and I appreciate your observation and that the part of the

2497
01:51:57,930 --> 01:51:59,399
building adjacent

2498
01:51:59,399 --> 01:52:02,350
to properties either on the south or the east will be back

2499
01:52:02,350 --> 01:52:03,640
yards not parking lots

2500
01:52:03,640 --> 01:52:08,000
and sure and mechanical access and things and that nature

2501
01:52:08,000 --> 01:52:08,439
from their cars

2502
01:52:08,439 --> 01:52:12,689
also after this phase any future phases we do have to come

2503
01:52:12,689 --> 01:52:14,239
back with an ADP for

2504
01:52:14,239 --> 01:52:18,460
this site and I think there'd be opportunities then and I

2505
01:52:18,460 --> 01:52:19,920
would assume and

2506
01:52:19,920 --> 01:52:22,800
not know that even if we put a building somewhere else if

2507
01:52:22,800 --> 01:52:24,039
it could create a need

2508
01:52:24,039 --> 01:52:26,520
for additional screening on the sites we already have that

2509
01:52:26,520 --> 01:52:27,399
could be imposed at

2510
01:52:27,399 --> 01:52:32,239
that time as well I think it's an assumption okay a couple

2511
01:52:32,239 --> 01:52:33,279
more questions

2512
01:52:33,279 --> 01:52:39,750
Commissioner Taylor thank you chair so first my first

2513
01:52:39,750 --> 01:52:40,920
question I think you just

2514
01:52:40,920 --> 01:52:43,890
answered by saying that you you would the mechanical

2515
01:52:43,890 --> 01:52:45,319
screening with masonry

2516
01:52:45,319 --> 01:52:48,300
wouldn't be a problem at all is that correct not if we don

2517
01:52:48,300 --> 01:52:49,159
't have a fence

2518
01:52:49,159 --> 01:52:52,600
right we're gonna put a fence up there then we'd like to

2519
01:52:52,600 --> 01:52:53,640
not have we can still

2520
01:52:53,640 --> 01:52:56,800
do vegetative screening but would not want to do masonry

2521
01:52:56,800 --> 01:52:58,279
screening animation

2522
01:52:58,279 --> 01:53:01,439
refinance right now I have another question I'm looking at

2523
01:53:01,439 --> 01:53:02,319
going back to

2524
01:53:02,319 --> 01:53:06,359
the preliminary plot excuse me the preliminary plot it

2525
01:53:06,359 --> 01:53:10,479
appears that I'm

2526
01:53:10,479 --> 01:53:13,640
trying to get my head around lot for or the common area the

2527
01:53:13,640 --> 01:53:14,680
detention pond all

2528
01:53:14,680 --> 01:53:18,850
right what happened is we started the ADP process before we

2529
01:53:18,850 --> 01:53:19,800
ever started

2530
01:53:19,800 --> 01:53:23,920
platting thinking we could do that then we were informed we

2531
01:53:23,920 --> 01:53:25,180
couldn't do an ADP

2532
01:53:25,180 --> 01:53:28,340
until we had an approved preliminary plat so we went and

2533
01:53:28,340 --> 01:53:29,119
prepared the

2534
01:53:29,119 --> 01:53:32,489
preliminary plat and typically areas that are going to be

2535
01:53:32,489 --> 01:53:33,600
maintained by all

2536
01:53:33,600 --> 01:53:36,800
the property owners together are labeled common areas so

2537
01:53:36,800 --> 01:53:38,399
when our ADP we labeled

2538
01:53:38,399 --> 01:53:40,760
lot number four because there was going to be four lots

2539
01:53:40,760 --> 01:53:42,039
there and in our formal

2540
01:53:42,039 --> 01:53:45,020
preliminary plat we got a common area so then we got it on

2541
01:53:45,020 --> 01:53:45,840
the consent agenda

2542
01:53:45,840 --> 01:53:48,630
tonight so we've got an approved preliminary plat so we can

2543
01:53:48,630 --> 01:53:49,319
now consider

2544
01:53:49,319 --> 01:53:55,479
an ADP so that's the circle we've been running in right and

2545
01:53:55,479 --> 01:53:56,279
actually my

2546
01:53:56,279 --> 01:53:59,439
question there wasn't so much on the label it's the shape

2547
01:53:59,439 --> 01:54:00,279
of the shape of

2548
01:54:00,279 --> 01:54:04,869
whatever that is lot for common area it seems to indicate

2549
01:54:04,869 --> 01:54:07,000
in the site plan the

2550
01:54:07,000 --> 01:54:10,340
detention pond will eventually go north does that stay

2551
01:54:10,340 --> 01:54:11,760
completely in the common

2552
01:54:11,760 --> 01:54:15,380
area or does that extend into what is labeled not for the

2553
01:54:15,380 --> 01:54:17,079
replanting also when

2554
01:54:17,079 --> 01:54:21,079
we add more lots or more phases right now and to be

2555
01:54:21,079 --> 01:54:23,279
technically correct we are

2556
01:54:23,279 --> 01:54:28,039
not proposing a detention pond we are strictly proposing a

2557
01:54:28,039 --> 01:54:28,880
water quality

2558
01:54:28,880 --> 01:54:32,600
treatment facility and that facility is not rectangular

2559
01:54:32,600 --> 01:54:34,079
even though the lot is

2560
01:54:34,079 --> 01:54:36,899
it's kind of moon-shaped but it fits within there and we

2561
01:54:36,899 --> 01:54:37,920
just planted that

2562
01:54:37,920 --> 01:54:41,909
lot big enough to accommodate that when we get around to

2563
01:54:41,909 --> 01:54:43,640
doing more and needing

2564
01:54:43,640 --> 01:54:46,420
to provide detention because we're not creating any more

2565
01:54:46,420 --> 01:54:47,520
runoff is coming off

2566
01:54:47,520 --> 01:54:50,399
today when we have to do detention will shape that

2567
01:54:50,399 --> 01:54:52,039
detention pond it could be

2568
01:54:52,039 --> 01:54:55,689
L shaped around that corner and we'll have a different

2569
01:54:55,689 --> 01:54:56,760
common area lot a

2570
01:54:56,760 --> 01:54:59,460
replanted common area lot that will accommodate that

2571
01:54:59,460 --> 01:55:01,079
particular facility and

2572
01:55:01,079 --> 01:55:04,489
so this would really what goes in on lot for will be a

2573
01:55:04,489 --> 01:55:06,560
temporary yes ice and

2574
01:55:06,560 --> 01:55:10,680
water treatment kind of still detained detaining water and

2575
01:55:10,680 --> 01:55:11,760
nobody likes to call

2576
01:55:11,760 --> 01:55:15,159
it temporary because who knows how long it'll be there but

2577
01:55:15,159 --> 01:55:16,239
our intention is

2578
01:55:16,239 --> 01:55:18,899
temporary until we can fully develop the balance of the

2579
01:55:18,899 --> 01:55:20,159
site okay and looking at

2580
01:55:20,159 --> 01:55:23,430
I was trying to measure distance because this this is about

2581
01:55:23,430 --> 01:55:24,880
500 or so feet wide

2582
01:55:24,880 --> 01:55:28,479
on the south end and the buffer was indicated as like 300

2583
01:55:28,479 --> 01:55:29,880
feet does that end

2584
01:55:29,880 --> 01:55:34,310
at the edge of lot three or does that continue on into

2585
01:55:34,310 --> 01:55:35,640
whatever you want to

2586
01:55:35,640 --> 01:55:38,840
call it lot floor common area I'd have to look at the

2587
01:55:38,840 --> 01:55:41,600
drawings my recollection is

2588
01:55:41,600 --> 01:55:45,050
it goes all the way across lot for the common area and we

2589
01:55:45,050 --> 01:55:46,159
would be doing that

2590
01:55:46,159 --> 01:55:49,970
anyway thank you they just so on the preliminary plot I

2591
01:55:49,970 --> 01:55:50,760
think it shows it

2592
01:55:50,760 --> 01:55:54,729
like 487 feet total depth and it so it's here it's

2593
01:55:54,729 --> 01:55:56,600
indicated as all the way back

2594
01:55:56,600 --> 01:56:00,560
so almost 500 feet well this has the concept or elements of

2595
01:56:00,560 --> 01:56:01,319
the concept in

2596
01:56:01,319 --> 01:56:05,399
existing facilities on there because of the ADP our

2597
01:56:05,399 --> 01:56:06,800
landscape buffer will go

2598
01:56:06,800 --> 01:56:10,760
back to the to the edge of the ADP which is to the limits

2599
01:56:10,760 --> 01:56:12,640
of the okay water

2600
01:56:12,640 --> 01:56:15,369
quality pond yeah that really that was my final point was

2601
01:56:15,369 --> 01:56:16,560
that this would also

2602
01:56:16,560 --> 01:56:20,760
buffer the pond right and mr. Beck to address the question

2603
01:56:20,760 --> 01:56:21,279
you brought up

2604
01:56:21,279 --> 01:56:26,739
during workshop these ponds are designed to drain out in 24

2605
01:56:26,739 --> 01:56:28,479
hours and because of

2606
01:56:28,479 --> 01:56:30,989
the vegetative nature and the natural treatments we're not

2607
01:56:30,989 --> 01:56:31,720
going to have an

2608
01:56:31,720 --> 01:56:35,399
odor problem or mosquito problem or anything of that great

2609
01:56:35,399 --> 01:56:37,920
thank you

2610
01:56:39,840 --> 01:56:43,670
Commissioner Ellis thank you chair thank you for being here

2611
01:56:43,670 --> 01:56:46,680
in presenting okay I

2612
01:56:46,680 --> 01:56:50,300
got my questions about the detention area answered I guess

2613
01:56:50,300 --> 01:56:51,319
now I'm I'm just

2614
01:56:51,319 --> 01:56:56,590
confused so we can move forward with a motion as to what we

2615
01:56:56,590 --> 01:56:58,880
are removing per

2616
01:56:58,880 --> 01:57:03,760
staff's approval and their recommended amendments to your

2617
01:57:03,760 --> 01:57:05,079
plan so if you could

2618
01:57:05,079 --> 01:57:08,039
well at the risk of telling you what I'd like you to do

2619
01:57:08,039 --> 01:57:10,119
well we hope that you

2620
01:57:10,119 --> 01:57:14,720
will remove the staff requirement for a masonry screening

2621
01:57:14,720 --> 01:57:16,520
wall if that goes

2622
01:57:16,520 --> 01:57:19,680
away all the other things would stay in place but okay if

2623
01:57:19,680 --> 01:57:20,720
the screening wall

2624
01:57:20,720 --> 01:57:24,319
stays in place we're asking that you remove our offer of

2625
01:57:24,319 --> 01:57:25,640
the intensified

2626
01:57:25,640 --> 01:57:30,649
landscaping and the masonry screening on the mechanical

2627
01:57:30,649 --> 01:57:32,640
units themselves okay so

2628
01:57:32,640 --> 01:57:37,069
if the masonry wall buffer is removed the six-foot wall

2629
01:57:37,069 --> 01:57:39,119
recommended

2630
01:57:39,119 --> 01:57:43,350
recommendation if that is removed then you'll leave the

2631
01:57:43,350 --> 01:57:44,279
mechanical

2632
01:57:44,279 --> 01:57:47,470
screening stays in place okay as well as the enhanced

2633
01:57:47,470 --> 01:57:48,880
landscape okay that's where

2634
01:57:48,880 --> 01:57:52,119
I was confused thank you okay

2635
01:57:52,800 --> 01:57:56,210
Commissioner Roselle thank you chair I'd like to go ahead

2636
01:57:56,210 --> 01:57:57,560
and make a motion I

2637
01:57:57,560 --> 01:58:01,800
move approval of this agenda item

2638
01:58:04,359 --> 01:58:08,960
you can try this again a clarification I move approval for

2639
01:58:08,960 --> 01:58:10,840
the agenda item ADP 1620

2640
01:58:10,840 --> 01:58:15,800
with the staff recommendations point one point two a three

2641
01:58:15,800 --> 01:58:16,920
four and five

2642
01:58:16,920 --> 01:58:21,239
excluding point two B

2643
01:58:33,239 --> 01:58:38,050
Commissioner Tadden a second and I'd also like to add that

2644
01:58:38,050 --> 01:58:39,680
normally I am a

2645
01:58:39,680 --> 01:58:42,840
fan of the masonry walls whenever we have conflicting uses

2646
01:58:42,840 --> 01:58:44,680
they kill sound

2647
01:58:44,680 --> 01:58:48,600
they block light prevent headlights make it hard for

2648
01:58:48,600 --> 01:58:50,239
somebody in a parking lot to

2649
01:58:50,239 --> 01:58:53,079
wander into somebody's yard that kind of stuff but in this

2650
01:58:53,079 --> 01:58:54,560
case your development

2651
01:58:54,560 --> 01:58:58,529
is to scale with the surrounding area and this this veget

2652
01:58:58,529 --> 01:58:59,840
ative buffer will

2653
01:58:59,840 --> 01:59:02,569
actually probably provide a better amenity to the house

2654
01:59:02,569 --> 01:59:03,600
immediately to the

2655
01:59:03,600 --> 01:59:07,380
south concrete wall would concrete wall would be right on

2656
01:59:07,380 --> 01:59:09,119
the property line and

2657
01:59:09,119 --> 01:59:11,819
you know they would they would go from having a view of a

2658
01:59:11,819 --> 01:59:12,800
field having a view

2659
01:59:12,800 --> 01:59:17,960
of concrete blocks so I do feel that a 15 foot buffer with

2660
01:59:17,960 --> 01:59:20,399
as you outlined red

2661
01:59:20,399 --> 01:59:24,270
buds and I just tore out about a dozen nandinas I'm not a

2662
01:59:24,270 --> 01:59:25,199
fan of nandina but

2663
01:59:25,199 --> 01:59:29,119
nandina is in boxwoods and so forth it would would provide

2664
01:59:29,119 --> 01:59:30,539
a better amenity to

2665
01:59:30,539 --> 01:59:34,069
the neighbor and the mechanical screening the screening

2666
01:59:34,069 --> 01:59:34,359
around the

2667
01:59:34,359 --> 01:59:39,060
mechanical also prevents noise and heat and that type of

2668
01:59:39,060 --> 01:59:40,880
problem and that you

2669
01:59:40,880 --> 01:59:44,039
know that might occur so for those reasons I I think the

2670
01:59:44,039 --> 01:59:44,800
vegetative buffer

2671
01:59:44,800 --> 01:59:52,560
is superior to the masonry screening okay I was going to

2672
01:59:52,560 --> 01:59:53,640
ask if you could do a

2673
01:59:53,640 --> 01:59:58,000
friendly amendment I like the masonry wall I also think

2674
01:59:58,000 --> 01:59:59,800
just from for the type

2675
01:59:59,800 --> 02:00:03,579
of project it is and then the size that the masonry

2676
02:00:03,579 --> 02:00:05,439
screening around the air

2677
02:00:05,439 --> 02:00:10,149
conditioning units is a is a non-necessity I think the

2678
02:00:10,149 --> 02:00:11,399
landscaping

2679
02:00:11,399 --> 02:00:14,560
there and where they're located is not necessary so I don't

2680
02:00:14,560 --> 02:00:15,239
know if you would

2681
02:00:15,239 --> 02:00:17,260
entertain that I would entertain that but it was my

2682
02:00:17,260 --> 02:00:18,640
understanding from Manal

2683
02:00:18,640 --> 02:00:22,359
that once this gets approved with they could come back and

2684
02:00:22,359 --> 02:00:23,560
if we recommend with

2685
02:00:23,560 --> 02:00:27,560
staff recommendations does it bind them to the masonry wall

2686
02:00:27,560 --> 02:00:28,159
around the mechanical

2687
02:00:28,159 --> 02:00:33,489
equipment what I was explaining was should the commission

2688
02:00:33,489 --> 02:00:34,079
choose to follow

2689
02:00:34,079 --> 02:00:37,520
staff's recommendation we would be willing to amend if the

2690
02:00:37,520 --> 02:00:38,640
masonry wall was

2691
02:00:38,640 --> 02:00:43,189
put in place the screening mechanism requirement for the HV

2692
02:00:43,189 --> 02:00:45,000
AC systems okay

2693
02:00:45,000 --> 02:00:52,319
then I would amend that vegetation be used for screening

2694
02:00:52,319 --> 02:00:53,680
for the mechanical

2695
02:00:53,680 --> 02:01:00,829
equipment also yes Commissioner Tyler I'm a real fan of the

2696
02:01:00,829 --> 02:01:01,880
the sound deadening

2697
02:01:01,880 --> 02:01:05,189
of the of the masonry so I don't know if I need to withdraw

2698
02:01:05,189 --> 02:01:06,720
my second legal or

2699
02:01:06,720 --> 02:01:10,390
so I do think you don't agree with it to keep the to keep

2700
02:01:10,390 --> 02:01:12,560
the stonewall there

2701
02:01:12,560 --> 02:01:15,050
so I don't know what draw your second is that is that the

2702
02:01:15,050 --> 02:01:16,039
correct procedure

2703
02:01:16,039 --> 02:01:19,479
yes you withdraw your second and just so I understand

2704
02:01:19,479 --> 02:01:20,279
Commissioner Taylor your

2705
02:01:20,279 --> 02:01:26,479
your it seems as though the the mechanical AC which is

2706
02:01:26,479 --> 02:01:27,720
residential size

2707
02:01:27,720 --> 02:01:33,989
is 30 feet plus off the boundary of the property and you're

2708
02:01:33,989 --> 02:01:35,159
still very concerned

2709
02:01:35,159 --> 02:01:38,859
about it carrying the noise carrying that 40 50 feet to the

2710
02:01:38,859 --> 02:01:39,779
neighbor to the

2711
02:01:39,779 --> 02:01:44,829
south I understand that they're a 4,000 square foot unit

2712
02:01:44,829 --> 02:01:46,199
commercial units might

2713
02:01:46,199 --> 02:01:49,359
have higher demand they might have more more doors opening

2714
02:01:49,359 --> 02:01:50,359
and closing might

2715
02:01:50,359 --> 02:01:52,439
have a bigger unit so that they can cool down more

2716
02:01:52,439 --> 02:01:54,140
effectively you know a six

2717
02:01:54,140 --> 02:01:56,680
foot wide three foot tall or two and a half foot tall

2718
02:01:56,680 --> 02:01:58,760
little brick wall right

2719
02:01:58,760 --> 02:02:01,920
there doesn't seem like much of an imposition to me and it

2720
02:02:01,920 --> 02:02:03,439
really might it

2721
02:02:03,439 --> 02:02:06,649
might have impact so that's I don't I don't see it as we're

2722
02:02:06,649 --> 02:02:07,720
making them put in

2723
02:02:07,720 --> 02:02:10,069
a 600 foot wall or something like that it's it's gonna be

2724
02:02:10,069 --> 02:02:10,960
something that's like

2725
02:02:10,960 --> 02:02:15,810
this big you know waist-high so I don't think it's worth

2726
02:02:15,810 --> 02:02:17,239
removing especially if

2727
02:02:17,239 --> 02:02:26,399
they're okay with it I'm gonna make a second first and a

2728
02:02:26,399 --> 02:02:28,359
second and open the

2729
02:02:28,359 --> 02:02:31,800
floor to discussion Commissioner Ellis yeah thank you chair

2730
02:02:31,800 --> 02:02:32,319
I have to echo

2731
02:02:32,319 --> 02:02:35,489
Commissioner Taylor's remarks I mean number one they're

2732
02:02:35,489 --> 02:02:37,079
agreeing to do it it

2733
02:02:37,079 --> 02:02:40,869
is for buffering sound in which we're not going to get with

2734
02:02:40,869 --> 02:02:42,359
vegetation and even

2735
02:02:42,359 --> 02:02:45,760
though I understand that it might be the size of a you know

2736
02:02:45,760 --> 02:02:47,079
household unit it's

2737
02:02:47,079 --> 02:02:49,970
going to be multiple of them and there will be higher

2738
02:02:49,970 --> 02:02:51,399
demand just because of

2739
02:02:51,399 --> 02:02:53,539
commercial building and what will be going on in there and

2740
02:02:53,539 --> 02:02:54,159
most likely the

2741
02:02:54,159 --> 02:02:57,380
degrees that one operates in their home it's going to be

2742
02:02:57,380 --> 02:02:58,600
much cooler in these

2743
02:02:58,600 --> 02:03:05,189
commercial buildings so I don't like that amendment okay

2744
02:03:05,189 --> 02:03:07,479
well as I recognize

2745
02:03:07,479 --> 02:03:10,640
Commissioner back forever thank you chair okay just so I'm

2746
02:03:10,640 --> 02:03:11,319
clear I've gotten

2747
02:03:11,319 --> 02:03:17,390
confused here what we're voting on is there'll be a

2748
02:03:17,390 --> 02:03:19,279
landscape buffer up to the

2749
02:03:19,279 --> 02:03:22,600
mechanicals then we put a then we stop it there put a wall

2750
02:03:22,600 --> 02:03:23,720
then go back to the

2751
02:03:23,720 --> 02:03:28,199
landscape or is there gonna are we talking about a wall the

2752
02:03:28,199 --> 02:03:29,399
full length of

2753
02:03:29,399 --> 02:03:37,000
the south end no okay then clarify my my my my motion was

2754
02:03:37,000 --> 02:03:38,359
as staff recommended

2755
02:03:38,359 --> 02:03:42,119
removing point to be which is the six foot opaque masonry

2756
02:03:42,119 --> 02:03:43,600
screening as well as

2757
02:03:43,600 --> 02:03:46,909
point three where it says the mechanical equipment must be

2758
02:03:46,909 --> 02:03:47,720
construct out of

2759
02:03:47,720 --> 02:03:52,720
masonry materials I amended that to include vegetation okay

2760
02:03:52,720 --> 02:03:53,600
so remove that

2761
02:03:53,600 --> 02:03:56,310
six-foot wall the whole length of the south side of the

2762
02:03:56,310 --> 02:03:57,840
property line correct

2763
02:03:57,840 --> 02:04:03,909
and okay and then a 15-foot buffer is what's there right

2764
02:04:03,909 --> 02:04:07,199
okay okay but that

2765
02:04:07,199 --> 02:04:16,000
hadn't been seconded yet has it it has it is okay sure

2766
02:04:16,000 --> 02:04:25,989
go on Haley to pull the site plan up shows here on the

2767
02:04:25,989 --> 02:04:28,560
south side this area

2768
02:04:28,560 --> 02:04:32,989
represents the 15-foot type C buffer that would be required

2769
02:04:32,989 --> 02:04:34,039
which if I

2770
02:04:34,039 --> 02:04:37,050
understand correctly is to remain with their added

2771
02:04:37,050 --> 02:04:40,720
vegetation and then these

2772
02:04:40,720 --> 02:04:43,460
squares here represent the proposed mechanical equipment

2773
02:04:43,460 --> 02:04:44,279
which would have

2774
02:04:44,279 --> 02:04:48,600
the masonry wall and vegetative screening around them

2775
02:04:54,600 --> 02:05:01,079
yes back to your question the elements of the last

2776
02:05:01,079 --> 02:05:06,319
comprise a 15-foot wide landscape microphone that extends

2777
02:05:06,319 --> 02:05:07,720
from that

2778
02:05:07,720 --> 02:05:13,930
extends from the southern property line 15 feet in and it

2779
02:05:13,930 --> 02:05:18,119
would have landscaping

2780
02:05:18,119 --> 02:05:22,920
live landscaping within that in the form of if I'm not

2781
02:05:22,920 --> 02:05:27,000
mistaken shrubs and five

2782
02:05:27,000 --> 02:05:32,739
trees six trees and 25 shrubs are required that being said

2783
02:05:32,739 --> 02:05:33,439
as it relates

2784
02:05:33,439 --> 02:05:36,939
to the HVA system so there are two separate requirements in

2785
02:05:36,939 --> 02:05:37,760
play but the

2786
02:05:37,760 --> 02:05:41,619
motion is then saying if I'm understand it correctly that

2787
02:05:41,619 --> 02:05:43,600
it only the 15-foot

2788
02:05:43,600 --> 02:05:47,729
landscape buffer would be required with the associated tree

2789
02:05:47,729 --> 02:05:49,439
plantings reflected

2790
02:05:49,439 --> 02:05:54,640
by the applicant for the entire length of the cell yeah as

2791
02:05:54,640 --> 02:05:55,640
it relates to this

2792
02:05:55,640 --> 02:06:00,319
request okay not now the wall we were talking about that

2793
02:06:00,319 --> 02:06:01,239
was also running along

2794
02:06:01,239 --> 02:06:06,039
the south border to not in between correct those two

2795
02:06:06,039 --> 02:06:07,479
buildings there correct

2796
02:06:07,479 --> 02:06:13,850
so staff's recommendation was that a masonry wall would be

2797
02:06:13,850 --> 02:06:15,279
required along

2798
02:06:15,279 --> 02:06:18,760
the southern property line six feet in height opposed to

2799
02:06:18,760 --> 02:06:19,760
the eight foot height

2800
02:06:19,760 --> 02:06:23,430
requirement and that the rectangles or the squares that H

2801
02:06:23,430 --> 02:06:24,800
aley points out on this

2802
02:06:24,800 --> 02:06:28,810
landscape plan would also or should also it is recommended

2803
02:06:28,810 --> 02:06:30,079
be screened with a

2804
02:06:30,079 --> 02:06:35,439
masonry cap around those so to speak those are the two

2805
02:06:35,439 --> 02:06:36,680
separate requirements

2806
02:06:36,680 --> 02:06:40,430
and then the motion that's come forward is simply requiring

2807
02:06:40,430 --> 02:06:41,800
or recommending that

2808
02:06:41,800 --> 02:06:50,420
the 15 foot wide landscape buffer remain no wall remove

2809
02:06:50,420 --> 02:06:50,479
okay no wall just so that

2810
02:06:50,479 --> 02:06:54,670
everyone is clear on the Commission since we're down a

2811
02:06:54,670 --> 02:06:55,960
member for this

2812
02:06:55,960 --> 02:07:00,720
session it will require affirmative vote of four in order

2813
02:07:00,720 --> 02:07:02,000
to pass yes this

2814
02:07:02,000 --> 02:07:04,399
motion

2815
02:07:05,359 --> 02:07:12,800
Commissioner Tyner I move we amend our the the motion to

2816
02:07:12,800 --> 02:07:14,239
reinstate staff's

2817
02:07:14,239 --> 02:07:18,270
recommendation of three in requiring the masonry screening

2818
02:07:18,270 --> 02:07:19,359
around the air

2819
02:07:19,359 --> 02:07:21,880
conditioning units

2820
02:07:26,960 --> 02:07:29,989
you asking for a friendly amendment when I was I was just

2821
02:07:29,989 --> 02:07:32,720
gonna I think he's

2822
02:07:32,720 --> 02:07:36,899
moved for an amendment so we have an official amendment we

2823
02:07:36,899 --> 02:07:38,279
need a second okay

2824
02:07:38,279 --> 02:07:42,050
Commissioner Roselle you're next I wasn't going to second

2825
02:07:42,050 --> 02:07:43,199
it I don't know if

2826
02:07:43,199 --> 02:07:45,810
Commissioner Ellis was playing on doing that I'm sure after

2827
02:07:45,810 --> 02:07:46,720
I would definitely

2828
02:07:46,720 --> 02:07:46,720
second that okay first and second to add the mechanical

2829
02:07:46,720 --> 02:07:55,199
screenings back in okay

2830
02:07:55,199 --> 02:07:59,329
Commissioner Roselle thank you chair is it applicable to

2831
02:07:59,329 --> 02:08:00,680
bring up the applicant

2832
02:08:00,680 --> 02:08:03,130
and just that it seems like there might be a commission

2833
02:08:03,130 --> 02:08:04,199
that split just to get

2834
02:08:04,199 --> 02:08:06,649
their understanding of how important the mechanical

2835
02:08:06,649 --> 02:08:08,000
screening is to this project

2836
02:08:08,000 --> 02:08:13,239
in terms of masonry verse vegetation seems to be the

2837
02:08:13,239 --> 02:08:16,439
sticking point here yes

2838
02:08:16,439 --> 02:08:21,250
we're basically okay with doing screening around the units

2839
02:08:21,250 --> 02:08:22,159
we can put a

2840
02:08:22,159 --> 02:08:25,100
wall there we can put shrubs there and whatever you would

2841
02:08:25,100 --> 02:08:26,000
like we just don't

2842
02:08:26,000 --> 02:08:30,960
want to do the wall along the buffer that's very helpful

2843
02:08:30,960 --> 02:08:31,840
thank you

2844
02:08:34,479 --> 02:08:38,529
oh with that I would like to go back to the original motion

2845
02:08:38,529 --> 02:08:40,479
that was placed

2846
02:08:40,479 --> 02:08:45,510
apologies to the chair and move that we approve this with

2847
02:08:45,510 --> 02:08:47,399
all five points minus

2848
02:08:47,399 --> 02:08:59,189
to be you know and I apologize for this because I was sort

2849
02:08:59,189 --> 02:09:00,239
of encouraged here

2850
02:09:00,239 --> 02:09:04,430
but since we have an official motion for amendment that's

2851
02:09:04,430 --> 02:09:05,840
going to take precedent

2852
02:09:05,840 --> 02:09:08,449
over the main motion we can't go back and modify the main

2853
02:09:08,449 --> 02:09:09,439
motion with that on

2854
02:09:09,439 --> 02:09:15,869
the table so since it's as is then we can vote on that or

2855
02:09:15,869 --> 02:09:16,760
you can entertain a

2856
02:09:16,760 --> 02:09:25,159
friendly amendment as Mr. Roselle has indicated so let me

2857
02:09:25,159 --> 02:09:26,279
get clear we can

2858
02:09:26,279 --> 02:09:29,439
vote on the motion that we have and if it fails then we

2859
02:09:29,439 --> 02:09:31,199
would come back and

2860
02:09:31,199 --> 02:09:34,829
make a new motion to go and add the screening back in is

2861
02:09:34,829 --> 02:09:36,000
that correct so if

2862
02:09:36,000 --> 02:09:38,630
we have a motion on the floor right now our motion that we

2863
02:09:38,630 --> 02:09:39,600
have to take up is

2864
02:09:39,600 --> 02:09:42,850
the one where staffs recommendations are put back in and he

2865
02:09:42,850 --> 02:09:44,720
had indicated that

2866
02:09:44,720 --> 02:09:48,859
he would be willing to put back in the second is it number

2867
02:09:48,859 --> 02:09:50,600
three but we'd still

2868
02:09:50,600 --> 02:09:53,890
like to leave out number to be and so if you're amenable to

2869
02:09:53,890 --> 02:09:54,880
that then we can

2870
02:09:54,880 --> 02:09:59,920
change the amended the motion for modification okay so

2871
02:09:59,920 --> 02:10:00,960
would it be easier

2872
02:10:00,960 --> 02:10:06,340
just to vote twice or I'm so I withdraw my motion then are

2873
02:10:06,340 --> 02:10:07,720
you amenable to

2874
02:10:07,720 --> 02:10:11,579
change your motion to that and Commissioner Ellis are you

2875
02:10:11,579 --> 02:10:12,199
an amendment

2876
02:10:12,199 --> 02:10:18,359
amenable to seconding that change if I could clarify what

2877
02:10:18,359 --> 02:10:20,680
we're okay what we're

2878
02:10:20,680 --> 02:10:25,210
taking up is the motion to amend the main motion and I'm

2879
02:10:25,210 --> 02:10:26,239
sorry this gets

2880
02:10:26,239 --> 02:10:29,640
complex for the audience but it's Robert's rules it we're

2881
02:10:29,640 --> 02:10:30,640
taking up the

2882
02:10:30,640 --> 02:10:33,840
motion to amend the main motion in order to put the staff

2883
02:10:33,840 --> 02:10:35,520
recommendations back in

2884
02:10:35,520 --> 02:10:40,149
mr. Roselle has indicated that he would go ahead and

2885
02:10:40,149 --> 02:10:42,600
entertain having three put

2886
02:10:42,600 --> 02:10:46,159
back in but would still like to see to be removed which is

2887
02:10:46,159 --> 02:10:47,079
in line with what

2888
02:10:47,079 --> 02:10:51,869
with what the developer has asked for so I asked if mr.

2889
02:10:51,869 --> 02:10:53,800
Taylor would be amenable

2890
02:10:53,800 --> 02:10:57,850
to a friendly modification of his motion to amend and

2891
02:10:57,850 --> 02:10:59,039
whether or not you would

2892
02:10:59,039 --> 02:11:03,880
agree to second that yes I would okay so now we have a

2893
02:11:03,880 --> 02:11:05,239
motion we can vote on

2894
02:11:05,239 --> 02:11:11,779
thank you I'm gonna call on Commissioner Roselle to restate

2895
02:11:11,779 --> 02:11:13,199
his amended motion so

2896
02:11:13,199 --> 02:11:18,390
everybody's clear and then we'll vote so my motion is to

2897
02:11:18,390 --> 02:11:19,920
approve agenda item

2898
02:11:19,920 --> 02:11:24,880
ADP 1620 with staff recommendations of point 1 point 2 a

2899
02:11:24,880 --> 02:11:26,960
point 3 point 4 and

2900
02:11:26,960 --> 02:11:36,119
point 5 with the specific exclusion of 4b 2b okay so all

2901
02:11:36,119 --> 02:11:41,359
but 2b okay and I'm

2902
02:11:41,359 --> 02:11:47,430
already got a second on that so any further discussion on

2903
02:11:47,430 --> 02:11:50,479
this item seeing

2904
02:11:50,479 --> 02:11:53,880
none I'll call for a vote on the board

2905
02:11:56,960 --> 02:12:12,359
motion carries 6 to 0 that will move us to our public

2906
02:12:12,359 --> 02:12:14,800
hearing section again our

2907
02:12:14,800 --> 02:12:18,420
item a has been moved to the end of our agenda so we will

2908
02:12:18,420 --> 02:12:20,000
move to item B at

2909
02:12:20,000 --> 02:12:24,819
this time I'm going to open the public hearing for fr 16 -

2910
02:12:24,819 --> 02:12:26,960
0 0 2 8 and call on

2911
02:12:26,960 --> 02:12:30,399
Haley for presentation

2912
02:12:43,800 --> 02:12:49,869
good evening so this is fr 16 - 0 0 2 8 it is a replat of

2913
02:12:49,869 --> 02:12:51,279
the revised Roberts

2914
02:12:51,279 --> 02:12:58,050
edition and this is a replat to break the original lot 3r 2

2915
02:12:58,050 --> 02:13:00,560
into lots 3r 2r 1

2916
02:13:00,560 --> 02:13:05,319
and 3r 2r 2 the property is located at the corner of Ector

2917
02:13:05,319 --> 02:13:06,199
and Emory Street

2918
02:13:06,199 --> 02:13:09,359
and the lots are intended for commercial development and I

2919
02:13:09,359 --> 02:13:10,000
can answer any

2920
02:13:10,000 --> 02:13:20,880
questions about the plot any questions for staff thank you

2921
02:13:20,880 --> 02:13:29,949
Commissioner back I move we approve of our 16 0 2 8 we've

2922
02:13:29,949 --> 02:13:30,600
opened the public

2923
02:13:30,600 --> 02:13:36,670
hearing on this item we cannot take a motion did you okay

2924
02:13:36,670 --> 02:13:39,460
that's okay this is

2925
02:13:39,460 --> 02:13:41,609
the public hearing item so we can't do the motion until the

2926
02:13:41,609 --> 02:13:42,279
public hearing is

2927
02:13:42,279 --> 02:13:45,739
closed so we just need to make a call to make sure anybody

2928
02:13:45,739 --> 02:13:46,319
else wants to speak on

2929
02:13:46,319 --> 02:13:51,199
this item yep sorry so Haley's finished her presentation no

2930
02:13:51,199 --> 02:13:53,920
questions for staff

2931
02:13:53,920 --> 02:13:57,270
this is a public hearing is there anyone else who would

2932
02:13:57,270 --> 02:13:58,600
like to speak on this

2933
02:13:58,600 --> 02:14:04,670
item at this time anyone that would like to speak on this

2934
02:14:04,670 --> 02:14:07,279
item seeing none I will

2935
02:14:07,279 --> 02:14:09,729
close the public hearing and I will open the floor for

2936
02:14:09,729 --> 02:14:10,880
discussion or emotion

2937
02:14:10,880 --> 02:14:20,279
Commissioner back I move we approve if our 16 0 2 8

2938
02:14:25,600 --> 02:14:30,720
Commissioner Sullivan a second a motion okay we have a

2939
02:14:30,720 --> 02:14:32,000
first and a second for

2940
02:14:32,000 --> 02:14:36,079
approval any discussion

2941
02:14:37,279 --> 02:14:41,439
seeing none I'll call for a vote on the board

2942
02:14:49,399 --> 02:15:01,739
motion carries six to zero I will move us to item C and I

2943
02:15:01,739 --> 02:15:04,039
will open the public

2944
02:15:04,039 --> 02:15:10,109
hearing for z 16 - 0 0 2 7 a and Colin Haley for

2945
02:15:10,109 --> 02:15:12,359
presentation

2946
02:15:25,079 --> 02:15:30,119
good evening again this is case z 1627 for the standard and

2947
02:15:30,119 --> 02:15:31,960
Hudson at Med Park

2948
02:15:31,960 --> 02:15:36,029
the request was to hold this public hearing and consider a

2949
02:15:36,029 --> 02:15:37,039
request for a

2950
02:15:37,039 --> 02:15:40,199
rezoning of approximately 20 acres from a regional center

2951
02:15:40,199 --> 02:15:41,119
commercial downtown

2952
02:15:41,119 --> 02:15:45,659
district to a regional center residential to district this

2953
02:15:45,659 --> 02:15:46,840
property is

2954
02:15:46,840 --> 02:15:49,800
located on the western portion of a larger tract that is

2955
02:15:49,800 --> 02:15:51,159
addressed as 2100

2956
02:15:51,159 --> 02:15:53,859
Mayhill Road and it is located at the end of Hudson Wood

2957
02:15:53,859 --> 02:15:54,880
and Somerset Drive

2958
02:15:54,880 --> 02:15:58,600
the adjoining property uses we have the Providence Place

2959
02:15:58,600 --> 02:16:00,159
apartments to the east

2960
02:16:00,159 --> 02:16:04,149
and the south and the Med Park station is a little bit

2961
02:16:04,149 --> 02:16:05,800
further to the south

2962
02:16:05,800 --> 02:16:10,439
currently the property is zoned RC CD the proposal would be

2963
02:16:10,439 --> 02:16:12,479
a rezoning to RC r2

2964
02:16:12,479 --> 02:16:16,590
the future land use for the area is regional mixed use

2965
02:16:16,590 --> 02:16:17,359
which is a

2966
02:16:17,359 --> 02:16:21,180
designation applied as you can see here primarily to

2967
02:16:21,180 --> 02:16:22,520
properties along

2968
02:16:22,520 --> 02:16:26,880
interchanges on I-35 and primary arterials it promotes

2969
02:16:26,880 --> 02:16:28,159
these as regional

2970
02:16:28,159 --> 02:16:31,319
destinations for a mixture of commercial and institutional

2971
02:16:31,319 --> 02:16:32,280
uses as well as

2972
02:16:32,280 --> 02:16:36,600
promoting a moderate to high density residential use so

2973
02:16:36,600 --> 02:16:38,360
staff's considerations

2974
02:16:38,360 --> 02:16:43,200
for this case the rezoning to RC r2 is consistent with the

2975
02:16:43,200 --> 02:16:43,959
surrounding zoning

2976
02:16:43,959 --> 02:16:47,879
pattern there is no immediate adjacency of RC r2

2977
02:16:47,879 --> 02:16:49,799
designation as you can see here

2978
02:16:49,799 --> 02:16:54,770
the RC r2 designation in this light pink is a rather spars

2979
02:16:54,770 --> 02:16:56,399
ely used but all of

2980
02:16:56,399 --> 02:17:01,680
these designations RC r1 RC r2 as well as the RCC districts

2981
02:17:01,680 --> 02:17:02,680
are all within the

2982
02:17:02,680 --> 02:17:06,000
same family of regional mixed use zoning designations so

2983
02:17:06,000 --> 02:17:07,000
staff considers that

2984
02:17:07,000 --> 02:17:10,530
compatible this request is a down zoning to a less

2985
02:17:10,530 --> 02:17:12,719
intensive district and the RC

2986
02:17:12,719 --> 02:17:15,440
r2 district could provide a transition between the

2987
02:17:15,440 --> 02:17:16,520
surrounding RC r1

2988
02:17:16,520 --> 02:17:19,479
properties which is the least intensive of this family of

2989
02:17:19,479 --> 02:17:20,600
districts to the most

2990
02:17:20,600 --> 02:17:27,930
intensive RCCD that's located along Mayhill so our CCD has

2991
02:17:27,930 --> 02:17:29,239
limitations

2992
02:17:29,239 --> 02:17:32,100
within it for multifamily development that requires they be

2993
02:17:32,100 --> 02:17:32,840
a part of a mixed

2994
02:17:32,840 --> 02:17:36,500
use development with ground floor commercial uses along any

2995
02:17:36,500 --> 02:17:37,360
collector or

2996
02:17:37,360 --> 02:17:42,110
arterial road as a part of this Hudson Wood Road would be

2997
02:17:42,110 --> 02:17:43,559
continued across this

2998
02:17:43,559 --> 02:17:46,719
property towards Mayhill and it is classified as a

2999
02:17:46,719 --> 02:17:48,120
collector so ground

3000
02:17:48,120 --> 02:17:51,840
floor commercial would be required with the rezoning to RC

3001
02:17:51,840 --> 02:17:53,200
r2 multifamily can be

3002
02:17:53,200 --> 02:17:56,170
developed without that mixed use component with the

3003
02:17:56,170 --> 02:17:57,479
approval of an SUP

3004
02:17:57,479 --> 02:18:02,440
and staff felt that given this substantial offset from May

3005
02:18:02,440 --> 02:18:03,520
hill Road of

3006
02:18:03,520 --> 02:18:06,489
this property those commercial uses required under RCCD may

3007
02:18:06,489 --> 02:18:07,440
not be supported

3008
02:18:07,440 --> 02:18:11,260
in this area along a primarily residential street as I

3009
02:18:11,260 --> 02:18:12,479
mentioned this

3010
02:18:12,479 --> 02:18:15,370
is a down zoning RC r2 is much less intensive in terms of

3011
02:18:15,370 --> 02:18:16,079
the scale of

3012
02:18:16,079 --> 02:18:19,239
development with a maximum density of 40 units per acre as

3013
02:18:19,239 --> 02:18:20,639
opposed to 100 under

3014
02:18:20,639 --> 02:18:25,200
the current zoning as well the maximum lot coverage is

3015
02:18:25,200 --> 02:18:26,440
decreased from 90% to

3016
02:18:26,440 --> 02:18:29,930
75 which increases the landscaping area required and it

3017
02:18:29,930 --> 02:18:31,120
limits the maximum

3018
02:18:31,120 --> 02:18:35,069
building height to 50 feet as opposed to 100 notice was

3019
02:18:35,069 --> 02:18:36,600
sent we received one

3020
02:18:36,600 --> 02:18:40,540
neutral response to that and staff is recommending approval

3021
02:18:40,540 --> 02:18:41,600
of this request

3022
02:18:41,600 --> 02:18:44,180
because of its compatibility with the surrounding land uses

3023
02:18:44,180 --> 02:18:45,000
and zoning as well

3024
02:18:45,000 --> 02:18:48,639
as its consistency with the future land use designation and

3025
02:18:48,639 --> 02:18:49,639
I can answer any

3026
02:18:49,639 --> 02:18:58,430
questions at this time questions for staff thank you again

3027
02:18:58,430 --> 02:18:59,479
this is a public

3028
02:18:59,479 --> 02:19:02,010
hearing anyone who would like to speak on this item please

3029
02:19:02,010 --> 02:19:02,680
come forward at this

3030
02:19:02,680 --> 02:19:04,840
time

3031
02:19:11,280 --> 02:19:15,309
please give your name and address my name is Brandon Han

3032
02:19:15,309 --> 02:19:16,680
cock I'm with the

3033
02:19:16,680 --> 02:19:22,040
applicant my address is 6440 North Central Expressway Suite

3034
02:19:22,040 --> 02:19:23,120
900 Dallas

3035
02:19:23,120 --> 02:19:28,680
Texas did you fill out a card for us I did okay put it over

3036
02:19:28,680 --> 02:19:32,479
there no problem

3037
02:19:32,479 --> 02:19:35,350
we'll make sure we've got okay I can do another one I've

3038
02:19:35,350 --> 02:19:36,360
got a hundred of them

3039
02:19:36,360 --> 02:19:41,239
I'm doing the best I can keep up with tonight apologize

3040
02:19:41,239 --> 02:19:44,600
sorry

3041
02:19:56,040 --> 02:19:59,469
thank you Chairman strange and committee members appreciate

3042
02:19:59,469 --> 02:20:00,120
it I also like to

3043
02:20:00,120 --> 02:20:03,280
thank the staff for their help the last few months we've

3044
02:20:03,280 --> 02:20:04,520
been trying to get this

3045
02:20:04,520 --> 02:20:06,299
to the public hearing for a long time and they've been

3046
02:20:06,299 --> 02:20:06,920
really helpful so I

3047
02:20:06,920 --> 02:20:11,760
appreciate that as staff presentation said we are looking

3048
02:20:11,760 --> 02:20:13,680
to zone this site to

3049
02:20:13,680 --> 02:20:17,850
RCR 2 you can see kind of an overall plan here we are

3050
02:20:17,850 --> 02:20:20,200
planning to do two

3051
02:20:20,200 --> 02:20:25,430
projects a family multifamily project 263 units as well as

3052
02:20:25,430 --> 02:20:25,879
a age-restricted

3053
02:20:25,879 --> 02:20:32,000
senior living 160 unit project the site size is just about

3054
02:20:32,000 --> 02:20:34,360
20 acres

3055
02:20:34,360 --> 02:20:38,950
and within that we have a six six point six acre senior

3056
02:20:38,950 --> 02:20:41,079
site and a ten point two

3057
02:20:41,079 --> 02:20:45,209
nine acre family multifamily site and then roughly three

3058
02:20:45,209 --> 02:20:46,959
acre detention site

3059
02:20:46,959 --> 02:20:49,809
some of the amenities we typically offer in our projects

3060
02:20:49,809 --> 02:20:51,120
and will offer here our

3061
02:20:51,120 --> 02:20:56,200
clubhouse with a cyber cafe computer lab a fitness facility

3062
02:20:56,200 --> 02:20:57,959
on both projects each

3063
02:20:57,959 --> 02:21:01,120
of these projects will have their own facilities within

3064
02:21:01,120 --> 02:21:01,879
that the family

3065
02:21:01,879 --> 02:21:05,799
project will have a pool both of them will have dog parks

3066
02:21:05,799 --> 02:21:07,319
and as you'll see

3067
02:21:07,319 --> 02:21:10,780
here we get to the site plan the seniors will have a

3068
02:21:10,780 --> 02:21:12,520
retention pond is kind of a

3069
02:21:12,520 --> 02:21:15,809
main driver amenity area one of the things we love about

3070
02:21:15,809 --> 02:21:16,879
this project is

3071
02:21:16,879 --> 02:21:19,909
it's a true transit oriented development we are right at

3072
02:21:19,909 --> 02:21:21,959
the Med Park station for

3073
02:21:21,959 --> 02:21:26,399
the DCTA a train so we will have a direct connection for

3074
02:21:26,399 --> 02:21:28,319
the family walkway

3075
02:21:28,319 --> 02:21:32,309
through the senior senior development to get to that train

3076
02:21:32,309 --> 02:21:33,440
station and the

3077
02:21:33,440 --> 02:21:37,809
seniors will have direct access off of the project to it we

3078
02:21:37,809 --> 02:21:38,799
also have bus

3079
02:21:38,799 --> 02:21:42,229
transit within a tenth of a mile of the project and we're

3080
02:21:42,229 --> 02:21:43,360
also located right

3081
02:21:43,360 --> 02:21:47,979
adjacent to the medical facilities at Denton regional here

3082
02:21:47,979 --> 02:21:49,040
's kind of the

3083
02:21:49,040 --> 02:21:53,280
general zoning around our project it's all regional it's

3084
02:21:53,280 --> 02:21:54,799
all mostly regional

3085
02:21:54,799 --> 02:22:03,659
RCC downtown or neighborhood or residential so currently we

3086
02:22:03,659 --> 02:22:04,200
're RCCD

3087
02:22:04,200 --> 02:22:08,059
which at our acreage we could do 2,000 units we can build

3088
02:22:08,059 --> 02:22:10,040
up to 100 feet we

3089
02:22:10,040 --> 02:22:14,649
can do max lot coverage of 90 90 percent we're proposing 4

3090
02:22:14,649 --> 02:22:17,000
23 units building

3091
02:22:17,000 --> 02:22:19,149
height is going to be less than 50 feet but that's what

3092
02:22:19,149 --> 02:22:20,719
would be allowed at our

3093
02:22:20,719 --> 02:22:26,040
max lot coverage is 75% here's a site plan you can see the

3094
02:22:26,040 --> 02:22:26,799
southern portion

3095
02:22:26,799 --> 02:22:29,239
that's where our connection to the a train station is we

3096
02:22:29,239 --> 02:22:30,120
don't have a fully

3097
02:22:30,120 --> 02:22:33,120
developed in this site plan but that'll be a nice plaza

3098
02:22:33,120 --> 02:22:35,319
connecting to stock

3099
02:22:35,319 --> 02:22:38,659
bridge which will connect to the a train and here on the

3100
02:22:38,659 --> 02:22:39,639
left sorry I don't have

3101
02:22:39,639 --> 02:22:42,950
a pointer but there will be a direct connection from Hudson

3102
02:22:42,950 --> 02:22:44,020
would for the

3103
02:22:44,020 --> 02:22:46,909
public and for the the the residents of our northern

3104
02:22:46,909 --> 02:22:48,719
property to get through get

3105
02:22:48,719 --> 02:22:52,360
to that connection to the a train station here are some of

3106
02:22:52,360 --> 02:22:53,159
the general

3107
02:22:53,159 --> 02:22:58,120
amenities in the area that we're hoping to play off of and

3108
02:22:58,120 --> 02:22:59,520
just to conclude

3109
02:22:59,520 --> 02:23:03,340
here's some projects we've done in Baton Rouge and other

3110
02:23:03,340 --> 02:23:05,399
cities in Texas that

3111
02:23:05,399 --> 02:23:08,559
kind of show what we've done our track record and typical

3112
02:23:08,559 --> 02:23:09,520
amenity areas and

3113
02:23:09,520 --> 02:23:16,959
unit finishes for our projects any questions thank you

3114
02:23:16,959 --> 02:23:17,920
questions for the

3115
02:23:17,920 --> 02:23:27,860
applicant thank you for your presentation again this is a

3116
02:23:27,860 --> 02:23:28,239
public

3117
02:23:28,239 --> 02:23:31,569
hearing anyone who would like to speak on this item please

3118
02:23:31,569 --> 02:23:32,159
come forward at this

3119
02:23:32,159 --> 02:23:34,319
time

3120
02:23:36,719 --> 02:23:40,319
seeing none I will close the public hearing and open the

3121
02:23:40,319 --> 02:23:41,600
floor for discussion

3122
02:23:41,600 --> 02:23:44,040
or emotion

3123
02:23:47,920 --> 02:24:01,440
Commissioner Beck thank you chair I move approval approval

3124
02:24:01,440 --> 02:24:06,040
of z160027 a

3125
02:24:06,040 --> 02:24:11,239
mr. Roselle second I have a first and a second for approval

3126
02:24:11,239 --> 02:24:14,760
any discussion

3127
02:24:16,520 --> 02:24:20,799
seeing none a call for a vote on the board

3128
02:24:25,280 --> 02:24:32,149
motion carries six to zero we'll move us to our agenda item

3129
02:24:32,149 --> 02:24:33,639
D and I will open

3130
02:24:33,639 --> 02:24:40,670
the public hearing for s 16 - 0008 a and call on Haley for

3131
02:24:40,670 --> 02:24:43,280
presentation

3132
02:24:46,520 --> 02:24:59,559
all right good evening again so this is case sts 16 0008

3133
02:24:59,559 --> 02:25:00,799
also from standard in

3134
02:25:00,799 --> 02:25:05,760
Hudson at Med Park this request is for the specific use

3135
02:25:05,760 --> 02:25:06,520
permit to allow

3136
02:25:06,520 --> 02:25:09,709
multifamily development on the 20 acres that we just saw in

3137
02:25:09,709 --> 02:25:11,639
the rezoning case so

3138
02:25:11,639 --> 02:25:14,069
I've reached through some of this same location at the end

3139
02:25:14,069 --> 02:25:14,840
of Hudson Wooded

3140
02:25:14,840 --> 02:25:18,100
Somerset Road the current zoning as you know is our CCD

3141
02:25:18,100 --> 02:25:19,399
with the request that

3142
02:25:19,399 --> 02:25:23,670
was just recommended for approval for our CR2 again this is

3143
02:25:23,670 --> 02:25:24,600
a regional mixed

3144
02:25:24,600 --> 02:25:28,659
use center as designated by the future land use plan and as

3145
02:25:28,659 --> 02:25:30,000
some of staff's

3146
02:25:30,000 --> 02:25:33,780
considerations as part of this SUP is that pending approval

3147
02:25:33,780 --> 02:25:34,920
of that rezoning

3148
02:25:34,920 --> 02:25:37,930
the applicant is proposing multifamily development that is

3149
02:25:37,930 --> 02:25:38,639
not a part of a

3150
02:25:38,639 --> 02:25:41,920
mixed-use development so the SUP would be the ultimate

3151
02:25:41,920 --> 02:25:43,000
approval for that

3152
02:25:43,000 --> 02:25:47,430
multifamily development this multifamily is consistent with

3153
02:25:47,430 --> 02:25:48,200
the future land use

3154
02:25:48,200 --> 02:25:51,670
designation of regional mixed use that includes the mixture

3155
02:25:51,670 --> 02:25:52,680
residential and

3156
02:25:52,680 --> 02:25:56,209
commercial uses specifically moderate to high density

3157
02:25:56,209 --> 02:25:58,360
residential this SUP does

3158
02:25:58,360 --> 02:26:01,040
comply with the criteria for approval of an SUP which are

3159
02:26:01,040 --> 02:26:02,120
all outlined in your

3160
02:26:02,120 --> 02:26:06,840
backup and just to go through their site plan really

3161
02:26:06,840 --> 02:26:08,399
quickly as we saw they have

3162
02:26:08,399 --> 02:26:12,079
two components the standard on the north side of Hudson

3163
02:26:12,079 --> 02:26:13,520
Wood and the Hudson which

3164
02:26:13,520 --> 02:26:16,680
is the age-restricted portion on the south side as well as

3165
02:26:16,680 --> 02:26:17,760
the approximately

3166
02:26:17,760 --> 02:26:22,129
three acre detention pond so looking specifically at the

3167
02:26:22,129 --> 02:26:23,760
northern development

3168
02:26:23,760 --> 02:26:28,729
the standard it is a 263 units total or is what is proposed

3169
02:26:28,729 --> 02:26:29,239
those are spread

3170
02:26:29,239 --> 02:26:32,559
across four buildings the buildings I've outlined in orange

3171
02:26:32,559 --> 02:26:33,719
here and then in blue

3172
02:26:33,719 --> 02:26:37,079
you can see the open space kind of courtyard areas as well

3173
02:26:37,079 --> 02:26:38,159
as a swimming pool

3174
02:26:38,159 --> 02:26:41,559
that they've proposed in between these buildings the

3175
02:26:41,559 --> 02:26:43,200
breakdown would be 43 one

3176
02:26:43,200 --> 02:26:47,520
bedroom units 135 two-bedroom and 85 three-bedroom all

3177
02:26:47,520 --> 02:26:48,840
buildings are proposed

3178
02:26:48,840 --> 02:26:52,200
to be three stories which approximately 34 feet in height

3179
02:26:52,200 --> 02:26:54,399
and this current site

3180
02:26:54,399 --> 02:26:58,639
plan has approximately 69% lot coverage and there would be

3181
02:26:58,639 --> 02:27:01,079
472 spaces those are

3182
02:27:01,079 --> 02:27:05,040
provided in keeping with the calculations required for

3183
02:27:05,040 --> 02:27:05,579
multifamily

3184
02:27:05,579 --> 02:27:08,840
development and those are provided along an interior

3185
02:27:08,840 --> 02:27:10,600
private street system as well

3186
02:27:10,600 --> 02:27:13,760
as a few spaces on Hudson Wood Drive and they're also

3187
02:27:13,760 --> 02:27:15,479
proposing bicycle parking

3188
02:27:15,479 --> 02:27:19,940
for this portion of the development on the south side we

3189
02:27:19,940 --> 02:27:21,399
have the independent

3190
02:27:21,399 --> 02:27:24,559
senior living or age-restricted multifamily component known

3191
02:27:24,559 --> 02:27:24,799
as the

3192
02:27:24,799 --> 02:27:28,659
Hudson it is two buildings outlined in orange there

3193
02:27:28,659 --> 02:27:30,600
approximately 160 units

3194
02:27:30,600 --> 02:27:34,799
112 one bedrooms 48 two bedrooms the buildings are proposed

3195
02:27:34,799 --> 02:27:35,799
at the same scale

3196
02:27:35,799 --> 02:27:39,120
three stories or approximately 34 feet tall and this

3197
02:27:39,120 --> 02:27:41,639
property does feature this

3198
02:27:41,639 --> 02:27:45,430
retention or detention pond and as a central feature of the

3199
02:27:45,430 --> 02:27:46,559
development and

3200
02:27:46,559 --> 02:27:50,379
they're providing 160 parking spaces for the senior living

3201
02:27:50,379 --> 02:27:52,760
portion and no bicycle

3202
02:27:52,760 --> 02:27:57,270
parking was shown on the site plan for this portion moving

3203
02:27:57,270 --> 02:27:58,040
into their

3204
02:27:58,040 --> 02:28:03,010
landscaping plan they are proposing landscape screening on

3205
02:28:03,010 --> 02:28:04,280
all four sides of

3206
02:28:04,280 --> 02:28:09,239
this larger three acre detention pond shown in green on the

3207
02:28:09,239 --> 02:28:10,559
north side they've

3208
02:28:10,559 --> 02:28:12,850
proposed landscaping that meets the street tree

3209
02:28:12,850 --> 02:28:13,920
requirements for the

3210
02:28:13,920 --> 02:28:17,430
internal street system as well as a type B buffer which is

3211
02:28:17,430 --> 02:28:18,600
required between

3212
02:28:18,600 --> 02:28:21,760
multifamily and single-family uses there are existing

3213
02:28:21,760 --> 02:28:22,879
single-family homes on

3214
02:28:22,879 --> 02:28:28,950
properties to both the north and the east on the south side

3215
02:28:28,950 --> 02:28:29,959
of similar

3216
02:28:29,959 --> 02:28:32,250
landscaping plan again that meets the street tree and

3217
02:28:32,250 --> 02:28:33,479
landscaping requirements

3218
02:28:33,479 --> 02:28:38,760
of the DDC elevations were not provided to staff at this

3219
02:28:38,760 --> 02:28:40,020
time however the

3220
02:28:40,020 --> 02:28:42,879
applicant did indicate their intent is to comply with

3221
02:28:42,879 --> 02:28:44,399
architectural requirements

3222
02:28:44,399 --> 02:28:48,959
of the DDC for multifamily again notification was sent we

3223
02:28:48,959 --> 02:28:50,000
received one

3224
02:28:50,000 --> 02:28:53,719
neutral response and staff is recommending approval of this

3225
02:28:53,719 --> 02:28:54,280
request

3226
02:28:54,280 --> 02:28:58,600
with a few conditions the first being that the developments

3227
02:28:58,600 --> 02:28:59,200
substantially

3228
02:28:59,200 --> 02:29:02,360
comply with the landscaping and site plans that we've shown

3229
02:29:02,360 --> 02:29:03,959
here the second

3230
02:29:03,959 --> 02:29:07,139
being that the proposed multifamily development meet or

3231
02:29:07,139 --> 02:29:07,799
exceed the

3232
02:29:07,799 --> 02:29:12,040
requirements for architectural requirements for multifamily

3233
02:29:12,040 --> 02:29:12,840
outlined in

3234
02:29:12,840 --> 02:29:17,399
the DDC we are proposing to limit the use of certain

3235
02:29:17,399 --> 02:29:19,159
materials EFAS and HDO

3236
02:29:19,159 --> 02:29:24,719
board to only 10% or as accent materials on these buildings

3237
02:29:24,719 --> 02:29:25,440
because for

3238
02:29:25,440 --> 02:29:29,959
multifamily developments staff recommends typically masonry

3239
02:29:29,959 --> 02:29:30,440
materials

3240
02:29:30,440 --> 02:29:34,350
to propose to provide a durability and you know longevity

3241
02:29:34,350 --> 02:29:35,639
of the product and

3242
02:29:35,639 --> 02:29:38,840
our third requirement would be that only monument or

3243
02:29:38,840 --> 02:29:40,440
building signage be used

3244
02:29:40,440 --> 02:29:43,889
along Hudson Wood Drive the applicant did not show any

3245
02:29:43,889 --> 02:29:45,799
signs on their plan but

3246
02:29:45,799 --> 02:29:47,959
we'd like to prohibit the use of pole signs or something

3247
02:29:47,959 --> 02:29:48,920
similar on this drive

3248
02:29:48,920 --> 02:29:52,559
since it is a residential collector Street and with that I

3249
02:29:52,559 --> 02:29:53,559
can answer any

3250
02:29:53,559 --> 02:29:57,159
questions you might have Commissioner Roselle thank you H

3251
02:29:57,159 --> 02:29:57,760
aley for the

3252
02:29:57,760 --> 02:30:00,590
presentation I have a question about the second point for

3253
02:30:00,590 --> 02:30:01,120
the staff

3254
02:30:01,120 --> 02:30:05,959
recommendation it says EIFS and HDO boards the didn't

3255
02:30:05,959 --> 02:30:07,479
development code says

3256
02:30:07,479 --> 02:30:12,319
wood clapping siding would be did siding stucco masonry HDO

3257
02:30:12,319 --> 02:30:14,440
board or other high

3258
02:30:14,440 --> 02:30:20,510
quality material it doesn't mention the IEFS what is of

3259
02:30:20,510 --> 02:30:22,280
those materials listed

3260
02:30:22,280 --> 02:30:25,250
in the development code would be classified under that

3261
02:30:25,250 --> 02:30:27,319
category so if it

3262
02:30:27,319 --> 02:30:29,680
is not specifically called out in the code however it is a

3263
02:30:29,680 --> 02:30:30,680
material that is

3264
02:30:30,680 --> 02:30:33,979
frequently requested to be used on buildings it's a stucco

3265
02:30:33,979 --> 02:30:34,840
like product

3266
02:30:34,840 --> 02:30:38,000
that doesn't have quite the durability of traditional stuc

3267
02:30:38,000 --> 02:30:39,959
co so since it is

3268
02:30:39,959 --> 02:30:42,350
traditionally requested with a lot of developments we felt

3269
02:30:42,350 --> 02:30:43,040
the need to call

3270
02:30:43,040 --> 02:30:45,879
out that that be limited because my understanding is it

3271
02:30:45,879 --> 02:30:46,840
does potentially

3272
02:30:46,840 --> 02:30:49,829
cause some durability problems when it's used on the lower

3273
02:30:49,829 --> 02:30:50,520
portions of

3274
02:30:50,520 --> 02:30:52,950
buildings and things like that over time so within the

3275
02:30:52,950 --> 02:30:54,239
recommendation they would

3276
02:30:54,239 --> 02:30:57,590
still be able to use wood clapboard siding would be did s

3277
02:30:57,590 --> 02:30:59,079
iding stucco is

3278
02:30:59,079 --> 02:31:01,530
that correct yes we're proposing that they meet or exceed

3279
02:31:01,530 --> 02:31:01,920
the other

3280
02:31:01,920 --> 02:31:05,399
requirements which I believe for multifamily requires 40% m

3281
02:31:05,399 --> 02:31:06,159
asonry and then

3282
02:31:06,159 --> 02:31:11,209
the other materials could be from the list that you've seen

3283
02:31:11,209 --> 02:31:12,920
there just so I

3284
02:31:12,920 --> 02:31:16,750
understand generally speaking they an individual could use

3285
02:31:16,750 --> 02:31:18,600
up to 60% HDO

3286
02:31:18,600 --> 02:31:22,129
materials according to code yes and you're wanting to limit

3287
02:31:22,129 --> 02:31:23,159
it to 10% can I

3288
02:31:23,159 --> 02:31:27,250
ask why such a drastic reduction in that ability given the

3289
02:31:27,250 --> 02:31:29,520
code provides 60%

3290
02:31:29,520 --> 02:31:33,159
it's something that staff recommends because of the long-

3291
02:31:33,159 --> 02:31:34,399
term durability of

3292
02:31:34,399 --> 02:31:37,340
the products we feel that traditional masonry as required

3293
02:31:37,340 --> 02:31:38,479
for up to 40% of

3294
02:31:38,479 --> 02:31:41,049
the buildings provides for better longevity of the product

3295
02:31:41,049 --> 02:31:41,920
over time and

3296
02:31:41,920 --> 02:31:45,670
who over the course of the the building would be

3297
02:31:45,670 --> 02:31:48,280
responsible for any durability

3298
02:31:48,280 --> 02:31:51,129
issues that would fall to the property owner for

3299
02:31:51,129 --> 02:31:52,280
maintenance of the property of

3300
02:31:52,280 --> 02:32:01,280
the buildings okay we'll speak more later any other

3301
02:32:01,280 --> 02:32:04,399
questions for staff thank

3302
02:32:04,399 --> 02:32:07,340
you I believe the applicant also has a presentation for

3303
02:32:07,340 --> 02:32:10,479
this okay I don't have

3304
02:32:10,479 --> 02:32:20,319
a card it's a public hearing so please come forward if you

3305
02:32:20,319 --> 02:32:21,399
get some of this you

3306
02:32:21,399 --> 02:32:24,000
know I see it now you've got a second on the same card

3307
02:32:24,000 --> 02:32:26,479
apologize

3308
02:32:34,200 --> 02:32:41,239
address again Brandon Hancock 6440 North Central Expressway

3309
02:32:41,239 --> 02:32:42,840
Suite 900 Dallas

3310
02:32:42,840 --> 02:32:45,159
Texas

3311
02:32:47,559 --> 02:32:50,290
flip through some of these we've already seen just real

3312
02:32:50,290 --> 02:32:54,200
quick on the site plan

3313
02:32:54,600 --> 02:32:57,459
some of the things I wanted to point out you can see it a

3314
02:32:57,459 --> 02:32:58,959
little bit better here

3315
02:32:58,959 --> 02:33:03,760
we have the walkway connecting to the a train station this

3316
02:33:03,760 --> 02:33:05,280
detention pond is

3317
02:33:05,280 --> 02:33:09,229
probably going to be if we can make it work a wet retention

3318
02:33:09,229 --> 02:33:09,879
so the cult

3319
02:33:09,879 --> 02:33:13,799
retention is a detention so a wet pond if you go to the

3320
02:33:13,799 --> 02:33:15,719
Hudson it's it's going

3321
02:33:15,719 --> 02:33:19,719
to be a retention pond the water feature I wanted to point

3322
02:33:19,719 --> 02:33:21,959
out I know that

3323
02:33:21,959 --> 02:33:25,819
Commissioner Beck you had a question about bicycle that was

3324
02:33:25,819 --> 02:33:27,280
a mistake by the

3325
02:33:27,280 --> 02:33:30,569
the architect we will have bike parking that's that's an

3326
02:33:30,569 --> 02:33:32,440
amenity on all our

3327
02:33:32,440 --> 02:33:37,149
projects from so that was a overlook on my part I didn't

3328
02:33:37,149 --> 02:33:37,920
catch that they missed

3329
02:33:37,920 --> 02:33:41,680
that so let me ask what are the bike mission back thank you

3330
02:33:41,680 --> 02:33:42,879
chair sorry what

3331
02:33:42,879 --> 02:33:44,959
are the bike amenities that you're providing in the

3332
02:33:44,959 --> 02:33:46,360
standard that you weren't

3333
02:33:46,360 --> 02:33:49,959
until now I'm gonna fit what I'm sorry what are the bike

3334
02:33:49,959 --> 02:33:51,159
amenities that you're

3335
02:33:51,159 --> 02:33:54,450
providing in the standard that you were up until now not

3336
02:33:54,450 --> 02:33:55,920
providing in the Hudson

3337
02:33:55,920 --> 02:33:59,379
I mean it hasn't been fully flushed out but it's either

3338
02:33:59,379 --> 02:34:01,440
gonna be interior a lot

3339
02:34:01,440 --> 02:34:04,329
of what we do now are interior bike storage rooms if we

3340
02:34:04,329 --> 02:34:05,440
have the space to do

3341
02:34:05,440 --> 02:34:10,430
it if not we'll have secure bike parking within the parking

3342
02:34:10,430 --> 02:34:12,040
areas behind the

3343
02:34:12,040 --> 02:34:15,920
fences behind the vehicle access gates we try to have a for

3344
02:34:15,920 --> 02:34:17,040
lack of a better

3345
02:34:17,040 --> 02:34:20,399
term a big room with part with with secure bike parking

3346
02:34:20,399 --> 02:34:21,600
indoors okay thank

3347
02:34:21,600 --> 02:34:26,600
you Mr. Hancock and I will now remove the ages label from

3348
02:34:26,600 --> 02:34:32,159
you that I did we do we

3349
02:34:32,159 --> 02:34:36,120
do have one ask on the staff recommendations until I saw

3350
02:34:36,120 --> 02:34:37,000
the staff

3351
02:34:37,000 --> 02:34:40,280
report we had not heard about the recommendation for no

3352
02:34:40,280 --> 02:34:41,920
more than 10% of

3353
02:34:41,920 --> 02:34:47,989
the HDO and the EIFS and maybe it's a clarification issue

3354
02:34:47,989 --> 02:34:49,559
we intend to

3355
02:34:49,559 --> 02:34:53,670
definitely do 40% masonry and in our case I know the the

3356
02:34:53,670 --> 02:34:54,840
code calls out

3357
02:34:54,840 --> 02:35:00,409
stucco masonry I'm sorry brick and stone is considered m

3358
02:35:00,409 --> 02:35:02,479
asonry as a company we

3359
02:35:02,479 --> 02:35:05,879
don't do stucco we've all done stucco projects in Texas

3360
02:35:05,879 --> 02:35:06,719
Louisiana Arizona

3361
02:35:06,719 --> 02:35:09,079
California they don't turn out well they leak they're

3362
02:35:09,079 --> 02:35:11,319
horrible so we do brick and

3363
02:35:11,319 --> 02:35:17,559
so for that 10% means 90% brick and if that's the case the

3364
02:35:17,559 --> 02:35:18,680
project just doesn't

3365
02:35:18,680 --> 02:35:24,840
work financially so we would propose meeting the code as

3366
02:35:24,840 --> 02:35:26,719
stated in 35 13 13

3367
02:35:26,719 --> 02:35:31,079
- a minimum 40% if the budget allows we obviously amp that

3368
02:35:31,079 --> 02:35:32,079
up I have some

3369
02:35:32,079 --> 02:35:36,120
examples here so you can see the development code versus

3370
02:35:36,120 --> 02:35:36,479
the staff

3371
02:35:36,479 --> 02:35:41,479
recommendation this is a project we built it's

3372
02:35:41,479 --> 02:35:44,399
approximately 40% and so it's

3373
02:35:44,399 --> 02:35:47,219
not an exact science because of the windows and the way it

3374
02:35:47,219 --> 02:35:48,120
's calculated with

3375
02:35:48,120 --> 02:35:51,040
the net openings but if you look it's typically the first

3376
02:35:51,040 --> 02:35:51,840
story would be all

3377
02:35:51,840 --> 02:35:54,840
brick and then you obviously have vertical accents or you

3378
02:35:54,840 --> 02:35:55,680
know however the

3379
02:35:55,680 --> 02:36:00,680
architect does it to achieve that 40% masonry here's

3380
02:36:00,680 --> 02:36:02,399
another project so we

3381
02:36:02,399 --> 02:36:06,860
would probably be doing these panelized Hardy systems on to

3382
02:36:06,860 --> 02:36:08,559
give it that kind of

3383
02:36:08,559 --> 02:36:11,319
that's a newer product it gives a kind of more of a modern

3384
02:36:11,319 --> 02:36:12,420
look you also have

3385
02:36:12,420 --> 02:36:15,180
this siding product so if you're not familiar Hardy is a

3386
02:36:15,180 --> 02:36:16,200
brand name but it's

3387
02:36:16,200 --> 02:36:20,969
a cement fiber cement board and it is durable it's got a

3388
02:36:20,969 --> 02:36:22,840
warranty it's a newer

3389
02:36:22,840 --> 02:36:27,389
product that's come out and been more widely used last 10

3390
02:36:27,389 --> 02:36:28,680
years in our opinion

3391
02:36:28,680 --> 02:36:32,760
it's vastly superior to stucco here's another project where

3392
02:36:32,760 --> 02:36:33,639
you'll see the

3393
02:36:33,639 --> 02:36:36,600
the brick veneer I'm sorry the brick base and then you see

3394
02:36:36,600 --> 02:36:37,059
the vertical

3395
02:36:37,059 --> 02:36:40,920
accents of brick and then the rest of it's the Hardy

3396
02:36:40,920 --> 02:36:43,440
product type paneling and

3397
02:36:43,440 --> 02:36:46,200
again so we think this is a quality product it gives you a

3398
02:36:46,200 --> 02:36:47,000
quality approach

3399
02:36:47,000 --> 02:36:51,440
it's long-lasting and it's really the industry standard

3400
02:36:51,440 --> 02:36:54,680
here's the elevations

3401
02:36:54,680 --> 02:36:57,930
are not fully developed these are conceptual renderings

3402
02:36:57,930 --> 02:36:58,799
that we've the

3403
02:36:58,799 --> 02:37:02,389
design approach we're going to take this has brick and I'm

3404
02:37:02,389 --> 02:37:03,760
sorry you can't zoom

3405
02:37:03,760 --> 02:37:07,879
in on it I don't think this has brick accents it has Hardy

3406
02:37:07,879 --> 02:37:09,479
paneling for the

3407
02:37:09,479 --> 02:37:12,670
standard and for the Hudson a more traditional look with

3408
02:37:12,670 --> 02:37:13,799
brick and again the

3409
02:37:13,799 --> 02:37:19,870
Hardy paneling to round it out again these are the pictures

3410
02:37:19,870 --> 02:37:20,280
you've already

3411
02:37:20,280 --> 02:37:25,120
seen of other projects we've built so that would be my

3412
02:37:25,120 --> 02:37:26,719
request that that we

3413
02:37:26,719 --> 02:37:30,709
for number two it's per code and I guess my other question

3414
02:37:30,709 --> 02:37:32,040
is just on the on the

3415
02:37:32,040 --> 02:37:34,219
number three on the signage I don't have an issue with that

3416
02:37:34,219 --> 02:37:35,120
I guess I just would

3417
02:37:35,120 --> 02:37:39,500
like maybe some clarification on you know sign shall be

3418
02:37:39,500 --> 02:37:41,559
designed in our only

3419
02:37:41,559 --> 02:37:45,420
monument and building signage I think there might be some

3420
02:37:45,420 --> 02:37:46,239
issues with

3421
02:37:46,239 --> 02:37:49,399
interpretation when we get down to it so if we can just say

3422
02:37:49,399 --> 02:37:50,200
no pole signs or

3423
02:37:50,200 --> 02:37:55,440
where are you after instead of so that would be my request

3424
02:37:55,440 --> 02:37:58,319
I call on staff to answer the question thank you as it

3425
02:37:58,319 --> 02:37:59,479
relates to the signage

3426
02:37:59,479 --> 02:38:01,879
pretty much when we're talking about sign you wanted

3427
02:38:01,879 --> 02:38:02,840
monuments of no pole

3428
02:38:02,840 --> 02:38:06,309
sign so we would acquiesce to that that's not an issue and

3429
02:38:06,309 --> 02:38:07,680
just as it

3430
02:38:07,680 --> 02:38:10,840
relates to the elevations I just wanted to point out that

3431
02:38:10,840 --> 02:38:11,799
there was little very

3432
02:38:11,799 --> 02:38:14,969
little clarity on what elevations would be provided so we

3433
02:38:14,969 --> 02:38:16,239
wanted to ensure that

3434
02:38:16,239 --> 02:38:18,819
we weren't compromising the style of the development but we

3435
02:38:18,819 --> 02:38:19,799
would be willing to

3436
02:38:19,799 --> 02:38:25,200
discuss the elevations proposed by the applicant

3437
02:38:26,840 --> 02:38:31,309
Commissioner Taylor thank you chair so I was just trying to

3438
02:38:31,309 --> 02:38:32,920
clarify I'm not very

3439
02:38:32,920 --> 02:38:37,180
familiar with these acronyms HDO are you saying Hardy is is

3440
02:38:37,180 --> 02:38:42,000
a type of HDO so I'm

3441
02:38:42,000 --> 02:38:45,159
sorry I don't have the acronym on top but I believe HDO is

3442
02:38:45,159 --> 02:38:45,920
meaning fiber

3443
02:38:45,920 --> 02:38:48,940
cement board if that's not the case then I would love to

3444
02:38:48,940 --> 02:38:51,000
talk about that but my

3445
02:38:51,000 --> 02:38:53,370
understanding is that is a another word for fiber cement

3446
02:38:53,370 --> 02:38:54,639
board Hardy is a brand

3447
02:38:54,639 --> 02:38:58,559
name Niche ha is another I mean it's okay yeah and I'm

3448
02:38:58,559 --> 02:38:59,280
familiar with Hardy

3449
02:38:59,280 --> 02:39:01,219
that but I'm not familiar with HD that's what I'm trying to

3450
02:39:01,219 --> 02:39:02,079
understand like that

3451
02:39:02,079 --> 02:39:08,540
so the if the restriction on number two was to restrict EIF

3452
02:39:08,540 --> 02:39:11,319
s to 10% or less and

3453
02:39:11,319 --> 02:39:15,799
not mention HDO would that still be acceptable or would

3454
02:39:15,799 --> 02:39:16,600
that be acceptable

3455
02:39:16,600 --> 02:39:22,389
to you I believe so that yeah yes what I mean that's that

3456
02:39:22,389 --> 02:39:23,200
can you what kind of

3457
02:39:23,200 --> 02:39:27,909
type of product is that if it's your information she's

3458
02:39:27,909 --> 02:39:29,799
right yeah I don't

3459
02:39:29,799 --> 02:39:33,889
think we'd use a sheening as an exterior product it's a st

3460
02:39:33,889 --> 02:39:35,399
ucco it's like a stucco

3461
02:39:35,399 --> 02:39:38,860
which you don't use it's styrofoam with concrete over the

3462
02:39:38,860 --> 02:39:40,319
top yeah so I would be

3463
02:39:40,319 --> 02:39:45,079
acceptable okay so you would want a first or would not

3464
02:39:45,079 --> 02:39:50,559
leave us I'm fine

3465
02:39:50,559 --> 02:39:57,709
with just the EIF is being 10% okay got you okay

3466
02:39:57,709 --> 02:40:00,399
commissioner Beck thank you

3467
02:40:00,399 --> 02:40:06,600
chair and I would support the use of a Hardy material I

3468
02:40:06,600 --> 02:40:07,799
worked with new housing

3469
02:40:07,799 --> 02:40:12,239
for 20 years and they used it and it is a very fine product

3470
02:40:12,239 --> 02:40:13,280
long-lasting durable

3471
02:40:13,280 --> 02:40:16,920
I think chairman strange would agreement I'm sure he's used

3472
02:40:16,920 --> 02:40:17,959
it in a lot of his

3473
02:40:17,959 --> 02:40:26,000
building so I don't have a problem with the HDO I was gonna

3474
02:40:26,000 --> 02:40:27,680
echo Commissioner

3475
02:40:27,680 --> 02:40:30,579
Roselle stole my thunder on my note for item 2 and so I

3476
02:40:30,579 --> 02:40:31,920
would definitely picked

3477
02:40:31,920 --> 02:40:35,190
up on that and I appreciate you coming forth so all the

3478
02:40:35,190 --> 02:40:37,280
other conditions are

3479
02:40:37,280 --> 02:40:41,090
fine except for on item 2 we just want to remove the EIF us

3480
02:40:41,090 --> 02:40:41,959
I mean excuse me

3481
02:40:41,959 --> 02:40:45,520
keep the EIF us and remove the HDO requirement and

3482
02:40:45,520 --> 02:40:47,399
everything else is fine

3483
02:40:47,399 --> 02:40:50,219
I think they were gonna clarify the number three would be

3484
02:40:50,219 --> 02:40:50,879
no pulse sign

3485
02:40:50,879 --> 02:41:01,430
instead of the way it's working okay I do now commissioner

3486
02:41:01,430 --> 02:41:03,399
Sullivan just to

3487
02:41:03,399 --> 02:41:09,520
clarify so that the HEO would to go back to the 40% limit

3488
02:41:09,520 --> 02:41:10,879
is that correct

3489
02:41:10,879 --> 02:41:18,030
maybe six sixty sixty percent oh sixty percent okay perfect

3490
02:41:18,030 --> 02:41:19,360
thank you sure

3491
02:41:21,719 --> 02:41:25,920
any other questions for the applicant

3492
02:41:26,000 --> 02:41:29,159
seen him thank you sir I appreciate the clarifications

3493
02:41:29,159 --> 02:41:30,879
again this is a public

3494
02:41:30,879 --> 02:41:37,649
hearing I have one card from Kevin Nelms not wishing to

3495
02:41:37,649 --> 02:41:38,719
speak in support of the

3496
02:41:38,719 --> 02:41:45,510
project anybody else to speak on this item it is a public

3497
02:41:45,510 --> 02:41:48,200
hearing seeing none

3498
02:41:48,200 --> 02:41:50,840
I will close the public hearing and open the floor for

3499
02:41:50,840 --> 02:41:52,040
discussion or a motion

3500
02:41:52,040 --> 02:41:56,559
Commissioner Taylor thank you chair I move approval with

3501
02:41:56,559 --> 02:41:57,840
some of staff

3502
02:41:57,840 --> 02:42:01,319
recommendations staff recommendation one as written staff

3503
02:42:01,319 --> 02:42:02,399
recommendation two

3504
02:42:02,399 --> 02:42:06,690
striking the word HDO board and changing staff

3505
02:42:06,690 --> 02:42:11,600
recommendation three to be no pull

3506
02:42:11,600 --> 02:42:14,850
signage shall be used along Hudson would drive sign shall

3507
02:42:14,850 --> 02:42:16,120
be in accordance with

3508
02:42:16,120 --> 02:42:20,799
the dimensional requirements in chapter 33 of code of ordin

3509
02:42:20,799 --> 02:42:22,680
ances Commissioner

3510
02:42:22,680 --> 02:42:27,159
Ellis I will second as stated okay we have a first and a

3511
02:42:27,159 --> 02:42:28,559
second for approval

3512
02:42:28,559 --> 02:42:38,000
with conditions any discussion seeing none will call for a

3513
02:42:38,000 --> 02:42:40,399
vote on board

3514
02:42:47,200 --> 02:42:59,639
motion carries six to zero that will move us to item II I

3515
02:42:59,639 --> 02:43:01,680
think since we've

3516
02:43:01,680 --> 02:43:04,510
been going for a while it is and I think our next item two

3517
02:43:04,510 --> 02:43:05,680
items we're going to

3518
02:43:05,680 --> 02:43:10,829
go for quite some time at 8 o 6 I'm going to call a recess

3519
02:43:10,829 --> 02:43:12,159
and we will take

3520
02:43:12,159 --> 02:43:16,319
a recess maximum of ten minutes

3521
02:43:17,200 --> 02:43:33,430
good evening and welcome back I'm going to call us back to

3522
02:43:33,430 --> 02:43:37,559
order at 820 the next

3523
02:43:37,559 --> 02:43:41,280
item we have on our agenda is item E and at this time I'm

3524
02:43:41,280 --> 02:43:42,559
going to open the

3525
02:43:42,559 --> 02:43:49,340
public hearing for z16 - 0 0 2 3 a and I will call on Julie

3526
02:43:49,340 --> 02:43:50,360
Wyatt for

3527
02:43:50,360 --> 02:43:53,520
presentation and just as a housekeeping item I've got

3528
02:43:53,520 --> 02:43:55,280
received one card from an

3529
02:43:55,280 --> 02:43:59,260
Eleanor Swan but it's not marked for which agenda item you

3530
02:43:59,260 --> 02:44:00,600
wish to speak for

3531
02:44:00,600 --> 02:44:05,750
so enough it's this one or the next one Eleanor Swan Ele

3532
02:44:05,750 --> 02:44:07,760
anor Swan you want to

3533
02:44:07,760 --> 02:44:12,579
speak on this item or the next item well I apologize you

3534
02:44:12,579 --> 02:44:14,120
don't want to be in

3535
02:44:14,120 --> 02:44:19,040
support but which item would it be this item okay

3536
02:44:25,000 --> 02:44:28,600
thank you sorry hold you up no that's all right good

3537
02:44:28,600 --> 02:44:29,520
evening I'm Julie Wyatt

3538
02:44:29,520 --> 02:44:33,290
senior planner with the city of Denton I'm presenting z 16

3539
02:44:33,290 --> 02:44:34,799
23 park 7 to you this

3540
02:44:34,799 --> 02:44:38,760
evening the location of the request is south of scripture

3541
02:44:38,760 --> 02:44:40,719
it is between normal

3542
02:44:40,719 --> 02:44:46,100
and Bryan it's about 1250 feet north of the UNT campus that

3543
02:44:46,100 --> 02:44:47,520
's about a five to

3544
02:44:47,520 --> 02:44:51,709
ten minute walk so just to orient you to the site also

3545
02:44:51,709 --> 02:44:53,040
wanted to let you know the

3546
02:44:53,040 --> 02:44:58,500
request involves three tracks one of the tracks the largest

3547
02:44:58,500 --> 02:45:00,120
and I'm indicating

3548
02:45:00,120 --> 02:45:04,450
it here has split zoning on it a portion of it is DCG and a

3549
02:45:04,450 --> 02:45:05,959
portion of its dr2

3550
02:45:05,959 --> 02:45:08,840
we'll go over that in a minute and then it includes two two

3551
02:45:08,840 --> 02:45:09,879
other tracks to the

3552
02:45:09,879 --> 02:45:14,459
south of that so the request before you is to consider a

3553
02:45:14,459 --> 02:45:16,479
rezoning for

3554
02:45:16,479 --> 02:45:20,719
approximately 1.39 acres from downtown residential to

3555
02:45:20,719 --> 02:45:21,920
district to D

3556
02:45:21,920 --> 02:45:25,940
downtown commercial general district the applicant has

3557
02:45:25,940 --> 02:45:27,600
indicated that they would

3558
02:45:27,600 --> 02:45:35,440
like to develop the site with multifamily development so so

3559
02:45:35,440 --> 02:45:36,639
well first

3560
02:45:36,639 --> 02:45:41,600
go over the the existing zoning pattern as well as the

3561
02:45:41,600 --> 02:45:44,159
existing land uses so

3562
02:45:44,159 --> 02:45:47,760
here in black is the subject property and here it's not

3563
02:45:47,760 --> 02:45:49,200
very clear but you can

3564
02:45:49,200 --> 02:45:52,420
see that here's the larger tract the the portion of it to

3565
02:45:52,420 --> 02:45:53,639
the north has the the

3566
02:45:53,639 --> 02:45:57,569
existing DCG zoning and then this is the subject property

3567
02:45:57,569 --> 02:45:58,959
that we're talking

3568
02:45:58,959 --> 02:46:05,159
about today the subject site is developed with a it was an

3569
02:46:05,159 --> 02:46:05,920
institutional

3570
02:46:05,920 --> 02:46:11,280
use that has been vacant for for a few years there's also

3571
02:46:11,280 --> 02:46:12,479
two single-family

3572
02:46:12,479 --> 02:46:18,549
homes on the subject property it is it is situated in a

3573
02:46:18,549 --> 02:46:20,280
four block area that's

3574
02:46:20,280 --> 02:46:24,280
north of the UNT campus this area has a primary zoning

3575
02:46:24,280 --> 02:46:26,559
designation of dr2 it's

3576
02:46:26,559 --> 02:46:30,440
developed with single-family uses with single-family dwell

3577
02:46:30,440 --> 02:46:32,040
ings that are used as

3578
02:46:32,040 --> 02:46:36,159
multifamily it's also developed with multifamily and some

3579
02:46:36,159 --> 02:46:37,079
commercial uses

3580
02:46:37,079 --> 02:46:39,930
within it so it's a mixed-use area to the north of the

3581
02:46:39,930 --> 02:46:41,440
subject property across

3582
02:46:41,440 --> 02:46:45,879
across from stricture scripture you have NRM U12 and NRM

3583
02:46:45,879 --> 02:46:48,120
you those areas are

3584
02:46:48,120 --> 02:46:52,649
developed with with multifamily dwellings with some single-

3585
02:46:52,649 --> 02:46:52,979
family

3586
02:46:52,979 --> 02:46:57,680
dwellings and some office uses to the south of the property

3587
02:46:57,680 --> 02:46:59,440
once once again

3588
02:46:59,440 --> 02:47:05,540
is the UNT campus and then I'm surrounding the area is is

3589
02:47:05,540 --> 02:47:07,120
an area of

3590
02:47:07,120 --> 02:47:10,030
established single-family traditional neighborhoods and

3591
02:47:10,030 --> 02:47:11,239
those all have an NR

3592
02:47:11,239 --> 02:47:15,180
3 zoning designation and our three does not permit multif

3593
02:47:15,180 --> 02:47:16,319
amily it doesn't permit

3594
02:47:16,319 --> 02:47:19,129
commercial development it is one of our lower density

3595
02:47:19,129 --> 02:47:21,760
zoning districts and then

3596
02:47:21,760 --> 02:47:25,729
and then there are two areas in in the vicinity of the

3597
02:47:25,729 --> 02:47:28,079
subject property that

3598
02:47:28,079 --> 02:47:30,860
have historic district overlays we have the West Oak

3599
02:47:30,860 --> 02:47:32,399
historic district and then

3600
02:47:32,399 --> 02:47:36,319
the Oak history historic district any properties within

3601
02:47:36,319 --> 02:47:38,280
those areas if they

3602
02:47:38,280 --> 02:47:41,440
wanted to make changes to the facade of those properties

3603
02:47:41,440 --> 02:47:42,799
would have to obtain a

3604
02:47:42,799 --> 02:47:45,459
certificate of appropriateness either through our historic

3605
02:47:45,459 --> 02:47:46,520
preservation officer

3606
02:47:46,520 --> 02:47:50,170
or through the historic Landmark Commission and then and

3607
02:47:50,170 --> 02:47:50,760
then the

3608
02:47:50,760 --> 02:47:53,639
properties in the hot pink those actually have historic

3609
02:47:53,639 --> 02:47:54,879
designations on

3610
02:47:54,879 --> 02:47:59,270
those individual properties so there's a lot of layers in

3611
02:47:59,270 --> 02:48:02,440
this area so yeah all

3612
02:48:02,440 --> 02:48:06,209
right so the future land use of the subject property is

3613
02:48:06,209 --> 02:48:06,879
neighborhood

3614
02:48:06,879 --> 02:48:10,479
university compatibility area these are areas within the

3615
02:48:10,479 --> 02:48:11,840
city that are affected

3616
02:48:11,840 --> 02:48:15,649
by their proximity to the universities so TWU and UNT in

3617
02:48:15,649 --> 02:48:17,959
this case it's UNT the

3618
02:48:17,959 --> 02:48:21,200
intent is to create compatible form and land uses for areas

3619
02:48:21,200 --> 02:48:22,120
that serve both

3620
02:48:22,120 --> 02:48:25,530
those established neighborhoods that we talked about and

3621
02:48:25,530 --> 02:48:27,479
the universities you

3622
02:48:27,479 --> 02:48:30,639
want to have a gradual transition in scale use and

3623
02:48:30,639 --> 02:48:32,079
character and you want to

3624
02:48:32,079 --> 02:48:36,920
encourage uses in close proximity to encourage a multimodal

3625
02:48:36,920 --> 02:48:37,840
transportation

3626
02:48:37,840 --> 02:48:42,079
pattern that that encourages walking and biking just to

3627
02:48:42,079 --> 02:48:43,600
stay on this map a little

3628
02:48:43,600 --> 02:48:47,899
bit so so here is the subject property this sort of light

3629
02:48:47,899 --> 02:48:49,000
hatch blue that's

3630
02:48:49,000 --> 02:48:53,290
the neighborhood university compatibility area to just to

3631
02:48:53,290 --> 02:48:54,040
the north of

3632
02:48:54,040 --> 02:48:58,120
that this is that area that has the NRMU and NRMU 12 zoning

3633
02:48:58,120 --> 02:49:00,079
and that has a future

3634
02:49:00,079 --> 02:49:02,950
land use designation of neighborhood mixed use it's kind of

3635
02:49:02,950 --> 02:49:04,239
the commercial to

3636
02:49:04,239 --> 02:49:07,430
neighborhood serving commercial and then you have the low

3637
02:49:07,430 --> 02:49:08,799
density residential and

3638
02:49:08,799 --> 02:49:14,159
that that is on those those traditional established single-

3639
02:49:14,159 --> 02:49:15,760
family neighborhoods

3640
02:49:15,760 --> 02:49:19,840
so the considerations that staff looked at when we analyzed

3641
02:49:19,840 --> 02:49:20,959
the request was

3642
02:49:20,959 --> 02:49:23,250
first we looked to sub chapter 3 of the Denton Development

3643
02:49:23,250 --> 02:49:24,159
Code and the criteria

3644
02:49:24,159 --> 02:49:27,319
for approval the first criteria being does it meet the

3645
02:49:27,319 --> 02:49:28,000
future land use

3646
02:49:28,000 --> 02:49:33,319
designation in this instance the density and commercial

3647
02:49:33,319 --> 02:49:35,559
development are something

3648
02:49:35,559 --> 02:49:40,530
that is desired near a university area and DCG it permits

3649
02:49:40,530 --> 02:49:41,440
both you know a

3650
02:49:41,440 --> 02:49:45,670
density that that is appropriate for this area as well as

3651
02:49:45,670 --> 02:49:47,840
some commercial uses

3652
02:49:47,840 --> 02:49:51,909
DCG it because of the commercial uses because of the mixed

3653
02:49:51,909 --> 02:49:53,159
use nature in the

3654
02:49:53,159 --> 02:49:56,639
density and permitted with it it fosters the walkability

3655
02:49:56,639 --> 02:49:57,879
the livability and the

3656
02:49:57,879 --> 02:50:02,059
vibrancy on a track that has been in disuse for several

3657
02:50:02,059 --> 02:50:03,879
years staff looked at

3658
02:50:03,879 --> 02:50:07,040
it as a potential catalyst for revitalization an area

3659
02:50:07,040 --> 02:50:07,959
between UNT and

3660
02:50:07,959 --> 02:50:12,729
those established neighborhoods and the existing zoning

3661
02:50:12,729 --> 02:50:14,239
pattern and those

3662
02:50:14,239 --> 02:50:17,920
physical barriers scripture Street those those that grid

3663
02:50:17,920 --> 02:50:19,399
Street pattern does

3664
02:50:19,399 --> 02:50:23,340
provide unnecessary transition between the request and

3665
02:50:23,340 --> 02:50:24,799
those single-family

3666
02:50:24,799 --> 02:50:27,959
neighborhoods that we want to protect so let's go back to

3667
02:50:27,959 --> 02:50:29,159
that zoning map so you

3668
02:50:29,159 --> 02:50:33,120
can say here's the request the adjacent zoning allows that

3669
02:50:33,120 --> 02:50:34,120
the development

3670
02:50:34,120 --> 02:50:38,020
pattern to transition to get to that lower density and the

3671
02:50:38,020 --> 02:50:39,079
lower scale of

3672
02:50:39,079 --> 02:50:45,149
development in the nr3 another criteria for approval is

3673
02:50:45,149 --> 02:50:46,159
adequate infrastructure

3674
02:50:46,159 --> 02:50:50,299
a thorough infrastructure needs assessment will be done at

3675
02:50:50,299 --> 02:50:51,280
platting and

3676
02:50:51,280 --> 02:50:56,079
at site plan and and prior to a site plan being approved or

3677
02:50:56,079 --> 02:50:57,280
plotting be our

3678
02:50:57,280 --> 02:51:00,809
a plat being approved any development would have to meet

3679
02:51:00,809 --> 02:51:01,520
the infrastructure

3680
02:51:01,520 --> 02:51:06,059
requirements within the city of Denton the proposed rez

3681
02:51:06,059 --> 02:51:07,680
oning includes the three

3682
02:51:07,680 --> 02:51:12,530
tracks the largest of which has a split zoning and so by by

3683
02:51:12,530 --> 02:51:14,760
rezoning the entire

3684
02:51:14,760 --> 02:51:18,159
track to the DCG's district it would consolidate the zoning

3685
02:51:18,159 --> 02:51:19,079
designation and

3686
02:51:19,079 --> 02:51:22,350
that would permit the entire subject property to develop to

3687
02:51:22,350 --> 02:51:23,200
develop under

3688
02:51:23,200 --> 02:51:26,020
consistent zoning regulations can resulting in a more

3689
02:51:26,020 --> 02:51:27,319
cohesive development

3690
02:51:27,319 --> 02:51:31,680
and let's look at that so the actual proposed development

3691
02:51:31,680 --> 02:51:32,639
that the applicant

3692
02:51:32,639 --> 02:51:36,370
has indicated would include a total of three acres which is

3693
02:51:36,370 --> 02:51:37,440
outlined in the

3694
02:51:37,440 --> 02:51:42,680
black part of it already has that DCG zoning this is

3695
02:51:42,680 --> 02:51:43,739
actually subject the

3696
02:51:43,739 --> 02:51:48,290
subject to the request and by by rezoning to the DCG and

3697
02:51:48,290 --> 02:51:49,719
consolidating

3698
02:51:49,719 --> 02:51:51,940
that zoning it would provide consistent development

3699
02:51:51,940 --> 02:51:53,120
patterns throughout there

3700
02:51:53,120 --> 02:52:01,379
I'm here some site fight photos the Denton Development Code

3701
02:52:01,379 --> 02:52:02,760
does have

3702
02:52:02,760 --> 02:52:05,649
provisions in it that do address scale and those will come

3703
02:52:05,649 --> 02:52:06,959
into play during the

3704
02:52:06,959 --> 02:52:11,030
site plan and the building permit portion if if the zoning

3705
02:52:11,030 --> 02:52:12,000
would be approved

3706
02:52:12,000 --> 02:52:15,809
that would come in during the site plan and one of those

3707
02:52:15,809 --> 02:52:17,280
things includes the

3708
02:52:17,280 --> 02:52:21,090
residential proximity slope which allows which requires

3709
02:52:21,090 --> 02:52:22,600
multifamily development

3710
02:52:22,600 --> 02:52:29,120
to step back development over over 40 feet in order to

3711
02:52:29,120 --> 02:52:30,840
maintain a human scale

3712
02:52:30,840 --> 02:52:34,979
on at the street level and reduce the visual impacts for

3713
02:52:34,979 --> 02:52:36,360
adjacent single-family

3714
02:52:36,360 --> 02:52:43,010
uses it's not it's not applicable to this project but there

3715
02:52:43,010 --> 02:52:43,719
are also

3716
02:52:43,719 --> 02:52:47,090
potentially minimum setbacks and buffers when you do have a

3717
02:52:47,090 --> 02:52:48,000
mix of uses in a

3718
02:52:48,000 --> 02:52:52,620
zoning district or in an area and one thing that the

3719
02:52:52,620 --> 02:52:55,040
neighborhood and that that

3720
02:52:55,040 --> 02:52:57,440
we heard during the neighborhood meetings were concerns

3721
02:52:57,440 --> 02:52:58,360
about traffic and

3722
02:52:58,360 --> 02:53:03,200
I know that's a really big issue in that area because of

3723
02:53:03,200 --> 02:53:05,639
the University so

3724
02:53:05,639 --> 02:53:08,629
typically when we think of traffic and we think of too many

3725
02:53:08,629 --> 02:53:09,600
cars on the roads

3726
02:53:09,600 --> 02:53:12,000
we think well build bigger roads right that's that's

3727
02:53:12,000 --> 02:53:13,260
typically how cities have

3728
02:53:13,260 --> 02:53:16,790
addressed that but there is a concept called neighbor

3729
02:53:16,790 --> 02:53:18,079
transportation efficient

3730
02:53:18,079 --> 02:53:23,600
development and studies have shown that when you broaden

3731
02:53:23,600 --> 02:53:25,620
your your scope when

3732
02:53:25,620 --> 02:53:28,639
you're talking about transportation we're talking about

3733
02:53:28,639 --> 02:53:30,040
traffic to not only

3734
02:53:30,040 --> 02:53:33,360
include the roadways and that signals and all the things

3735
02:53:33,360 --> 02:53:34,520
that we do in order

3736
02:53:34,520 --> 02:53:37,459
for cars to move through streets more efficiently but also

3737
02:53:37,459 --> 02:53:38,280
look at the land

3738
02:53:38,280 --> 02:53:43,040
uses within a city and and and look at how those affect the

3739
02:53:43,040 --> 02:53:44,719
amount of cars and

3740
02:53:44,719 --> 02:53:49,479
the amount of vehicle trips per day that that our citizens

3741
02:53:49,479 --> 02:53:52,879
have or undertake so

3742
02:53:52,879 --> 02:53:57,670
so so studies have shown that compact mixed-use development

3743
02:53:57,670 --> 02:53:58,760
near desired

3744
02:53:58,760 --> 02:54:02,569
destinations such as employment centers such as university

3745
02:54:02,569 --> 02:54:03,559
schools such as

3746
02:54:03,559 --> 02:54:07,690
transit oriented developments that they that they result in

3747
02:54:07,690 --> 02:54:09,159
fewer vehicle trips

3748
02:54:09,159 --> 02:54:12,590
because when you place people within a walkable distance

3749
02:54:12,590 --> 02:54:13,920
when you place them in

3750
02:54:13,920 --> 02:54:18,399
places that they can have other options for for for moving

3751
02:54:18,399 --> 02:54:19,959
about the city that

3752
02:54:19,959 --> 02:54:23,450
they would they would potentially choose those and reduce

3753
02:54:23,450 --> 02:54:24,239
the number of daily

3754
02:54:24,239 --> 02:54:29,129
trips conversely when you maintain lower densities you

3755
02:54:29,129 --> 02:54:30,840
actually end up spreading

3756
02:54:30,840 --> 02:54:34,280
things out and you sprawl the students in this case

3757
02:54:34,280 --> 02:54:35,399
throughout the city I'm

3758
02:54:35,399 --> 02:54:39,459
inducing them to to get in the car to drive so by by

3759
02:54:39,459 --> 02:54:41,840
getting the density near

3760
02:54:41,840 --> 02:54:45,600
places like UNT places that are the dot desire destination

3761
02:54:45,600 --> 02:54:47,000
actually takes the

3762
02:54:47,000 --> 02:54:49,219
cars off the road because they park their car and they

3763
02:54:49,219 --> 02:54:50,200
actually walk or bike

3764
02:54:50,200 --> 02:54:56,270
to the destination and then here is a map that that looks

3765
02:54:56,270 --> 02:54:58,000
at that so I just

3766
02:54:58,000 --> 02:55:03,229
so I just chose the middle parcel and so here's here's a

3767
02:55:03,229 --> 02:55:04,879
portion of the of the

3768
02:55:04,879 --> 02:55:08,889
request and then this is the quarter mile buffer so you can

3769
02:55:08,889 --> 02:55:09,879
see a quarter

3770
02:55:09,879 --> 02:55:15,239
mile is about you know a five to ten minute walk so you can

3771
02:55:15,239 --> 02:55:17,719
see that this area

3772
02:55:17,719 --> 02:55:22,690
is within that that buffer zone that would induce residents

3773
02:55:22,690 --> 02:55:23,920
to walk or bike

3774
02:55:23,920 --> 02:55:29,479
to that desired location to that University area public

3775
02:55:29,479 --> 02:55:30,399
notification was

3776
02:55:30,399 --> 02:55:36,690
sent out we have received within the 200 foot buffer one in

3777
02:55:36,690 --> 02:55:39,319
opposition and three

3778
02:55:39,319 --> 02:55:44,569
in favor so based upon the criteria for approval or their

3779
02:55:44,569 --> 02:55:45,559
consideration staff

3780
02:55:45,559 --> 02:55:49,120
does recommend approval of the request and I'll stand for

3781
02:55:49,120 --> 02:55:50,399
any questions and the

3782
02:55:50,399 --> 02:55:57,159
applicant is here questions for staff

3783
02:55:59,559 --> 02:56:04,879
thank you Julie hold on Commissioner Roselle thank you

3784
02:56:04,879 --> 02:56:06,600
chair thank you for

3785
02:56:06,600 --> 02:56:09,909
your presentation Julie can you just help me contextualize

3786
02:56:09,909 --> 02:56:10,920
the zoning it

3787
02:56:10,920 --> 02:56:14,280
seems like there's like a peninsula that pops up of DCG but

3788
02:56:14,280 --> 02:56:15,399
to the east and west

3789
02:56:15,399 --> 02:56:19,920
and maintains and in our three do you have any context that

3790
02:56:19,920 --> 02:56:22,159
you provide of why

3791
02:56:22,159 --> 02:56:27,549
that is even dr2 on the pencil it just seems like more

3792
02:56:27,549 --> 02:56:28,600
natural that that should

3793
02:56:28,600 --> 02:56:31,989
have all remained yellow in color instead of this little

3794
02:56:31,989 --> 02:56:33,959
pop-up of green do

3795
02:56:33,959 --> 02:56:39,239
you know why I don't understand whether there's that

3796
02:56:39,239 --> 02:56:41,479
inclusion of green to the

3797
02:56:41,479 --> 02:56:45,000
north there unlike the neighborhoods left and right this

3798
02:56:45,000 --> 02:56:46,479
was all zone during

3799
02:56:46,479 --> 02:56:50,200
the citywide rezoning in 2002 and and I don't have that

3800
02:56:50,200 --> 02:56:51,639
that knowledge as to why

3801
02:56:51,639 --> 02:56:54,670
they chose the zoning districts that they did this is a

3802
02:56:54,670 --> 02:56:56,239
mixed-use area so

3803
02:56:56,239 --> 02:56:59,770
there were in 2002 a lot of multifamily dwellings and some

3804
02:56:59,770 --> 02:57:00,719
commercial uses

3805
02:57:00,719 --> 02:57:04,049
within there so I don't know if it would have met you know

3806
02:57:04,049 --> 02:57:05,319
it wouldn't have been

3807
02:57:05,319 --> 02:57:11,840
necessarily that single-family those more intact

3808
02:57:11,840 --> 02:57:13,280
established neighborhoods

3809
02:57:13,280 --> 02:57:15,889
they were at that time there were already some multifamily

3810
02:57:15,889 --> 02:57:16,520
in there so I

3811
02:57:16,520 --> 02:57:21,489
don't know if that played a role in that just curious thing

3812
02:57:21,489 --> 02:57:21,520
sure

3813
02:57:21,520 --> 02:57:26,139
Commissioner Sullivan thank you Judy what exactly is a walk

3814
02:57:26,139 --> 02:57:29,440
able distance well

3815
02:57:29,440 --> 02:57:33,610
I know for me it's not going to be very far it probably

3816
02:57:33,610 --> 02:57:35,399
does depend on on the

3817
02:57:35,399 --> 02:57:40,159
person but you know in planning we tend to think of about a

3818
02:57:40,159 --> 02:57:41,559
15-minute walk is a

3819
02:57:41,559 --> 02:57:44,889
plate is you know a distance somebody would walk I mean it

3820
02:57:44,889 --> 02:57:45,280
would probably

3821
02:57:45,280 --> 02:57:50,290
depend on the destination but you know a five or ten minute

3822
02:57:50,290 --> 02:57:53,159
walk in from a

3823
02:57:53,159 --> 02:57:58,090
planning perspective is definitely a walkable distance

3824
02:57:58,090 --> 02:58:00,000
because when I look at

3825
02:58:00,000 --> 02:58:04,639
the University and where this is to say that it's a short

3826
02:58:04,639 --> 02:58:06,719
distance to UNT is

3827
02:58:06,719 --> 02:58:10,670
somewhat misleading is that it's on the very northern edge

3828
02:58:10,670 --> 02:58:11,520
of where the

3829
02:58:11,520 --> 02:58:15,450
chemistry building is when you go down to where the library

3830
02:58:15,450 --> 02:58:16,559
is it's more of a

3831
02:58:16,559 --> 02:58:20,120
20-minute walk according to Google map I don't know how

3832
02:58:20,120 --> 02:58:22,719
fast they walk to get

3833
02:58:22,719 --> 02:58:26,899
over to fast field or to go across to apache nobody's gonna

3834
02:58:26,899 --> 02:58:28,760
walk from these

3835
02:58:28,760 --> 02:58:32,770
apartments and so I was just curious what a walkable

3836
02:58:32,770 --> 02:58:34,760
distance is and how far

3837
02:58:34,760 --> 02:58:38,530
do you stray from that walkable distance before it becomes

3838
02:58:38,530 --> 02:58:40,760
a bussable distance or

3839
02:58:40,760 --> 02:58:44,370
something of that nature I don't know but let me add one

3840
02:58:44,370 --> 02:58:45,360
one thing to what I

3841
02:58:45,360 --> 02:58:48,889
said it also has to do with context so if if a place has

3842
02:58:48,889 --> 02:58:50,280
good sidewalks and

3843
02:58:50,280 --> 02:58:52,780
street trees and it's an interesting walk people will tend

3844
02:58:52,780 --> 02:58:53,520
to walk farther

3845
02:58:53,520 --> 02:58:57,600
than across maybe a sea of concrete so so it probably

3846
02:58:57,600 --> 02:58:59,479
depends on context and

3847
02:58:59,479 --> 02:59:04,280
and then and then you know how how difficult it is to park

3848
02:59:04,280 --> 02:59:04,840
at the

3849
02:59:04,840 --> 02:59:09,809
destination or how or you know if that person likes to walk

3850
02:59:09,809 --> 02:59:11,319
so but in general

3851
02:59:11,319 --> 02:59:14,479
in planning we tend to think of a 10 to 15 minute walk as

3852
02:59:14,479 --> 02:59:15,280
being something that's

3853
02:59:15,280 --> 02:59:21,350
walkable is this a time where any kind of a traffic study

3854
02:59:21,350 --> 02:59:22,879
would be done or is

3855
02:59:22,879 --> 02:59:26,309
that is that more of the site plan issue a full time to get

3856
02:59:26,309 --> 02:59:27,120
into the other

3857
02:59:27,120 --> 02:59:31,899
discussion a full traffic study would be done during clad

3858
02:59:31,899 --> 02:59:32,600
ding or

3859
02:59:32,600 --> 02:59:37,979
site plan and answer more about timing I know the applicant

3860
02:59:37,979 --> 02:59:38,959
has turned in some

3861
02:59:38,959 --> 02:59:41,940
preliminary numbers but really that would take we would

3862
02:59:41,940 --> 02:59:42,959
take a hard look at

3863
02:59:42,959 --> 02:59:47,840
that during the planning and site plan okay thank you sure

3864
02:59:47,840 --> 02:59:49,799
any other questions

3865
02:59:49,799 --> 02:59:55,200
for staff thank you Julie sure

3866
02:59:59,639 --> 03:00:06,420
have a lot of cards on this item first will be Lee Allison

3867
03:00:06,420 --> 03:00:09,120
as the applicant

3868
03:00:12,959 --> 03:00:42,680
, good evening commissioners I'm Paul

3869
03:00:42,680 --> 03:00:49,309
Levine from Park 7 461 Park Avenue South New York and thank

3870
03:00:49,309 --> 03:00:52,479
you for hearing our

3871
03:00:52,479 --> 03:00:57,120
application this evening with me I have a few members of

3872
03:00:57,120 --> 03:00:59,079
our team Mike Dallas

3873
03:00:59,079 --> 03:01:03,690
who's our JV partner and landowner on this Mike resides in

3874
03:01:03,690 --> 03:01:04,959
Austin we have Lee

3875
03:01:04,959 --> 03:01:08,120
Allison from Allison engineering from here in Denton and

3876
03:01:08,120 --> 03:01:09,559
Ron Butler from our

3877
03:01:09,559 --> 03:01:14,129
architectural firm Humphries and Partners out of Dallas we

3878
03:01:14,129 --> 03:01:15,559
'd like to pool

3879
03:01:15,559 --> 03:01:20,959
our time together if we made to take the 20 minutes

3880
03:01:21,360 --> 03:01:25,579
10 for each of you representing the applicant a total of 20

3881
03:01:25,579 --> 03:01:26,280
for everyone

3882
03:01:26,280 --> 03:01:32,620
representing the applicant okay great thank you first I'd

3883
03:01:32,620 --> 03:01:34,280
like to give you

3884
03:01:34,280 --> 03:01:38,819
just a brief background on Park 7 we're a national multif

3885
03:01:38,819 --> 03:01:41,200
amily developer we

3886
03:01:41,200 --> 03:01:47,270
primarily target the student market we also do retail that

3887
03:01:47,270 --> 03:01:49,520
is built in in

3888
03:01:49,520 --> 03:01:53,659
conjunction with the multifamily development where it's

3889
03:01:53,659 --> 03:01:55,639
appropriate over

3890
03:01:55,639 --> 03:02:00,069
the past 15 years we've we've developed owned and operated

3891
03:02:00,069 --> 03:02:02,239
over 8,000 units in

3892
03:02:02,239 --> 03:02:07,799
15 states around the country typically in a project like

3893
03:02:07,799 --> 03:02:09,600
this will have five

3894
03:02:09,600 --> 03:02:13,479
full-time staff on site as well as 10 part-time employees

3895
03:02:13,479 --> 03:02:14,639
to help with leasing

3896
03:02:14,639 --> 03:02:21,790
and so forth we certainly like Denton and you know what

3897
03:02:21,790 --> 03:02:22,680
really has drawn us

3898
03:02:22,680 --> 03:02:28,139
here is you know it's a great town for local food art you

3899
03:02:28,139 --> 03:02:29,639
've got young growing

3900
03:02:29,639 --> 03:02:34,159
population to two great universities that are growing

3901
03:02:34,159 --> 03:02:36,200
rapidly certainly a

3902
03:02:36,200 --> 03:02:41,479
need for for student housing within a walkable distance to

3903
03:02:41,479 --> 03:02:43,159
campus there's very

3904
03:02:43,159 --> 03:02:47,979
limited opportunities here at the time for that what we're

3905
03:02:47,979 --> 03:02:49,840
here for today is to

3906
03:02:49,840 --> 03:02:54,010
Julie mentioned we really would like to spread out the

3907
03:02:54,010 --> 03:02:55,920
zoning the density that

3908
03:02:55,920 --> 03:03:00,270
we have over a large area as opposed to concentrating it on

3909
03:03:00,270 --> 03:03:02,000
the 1.4 or 5 acre

3910
03:03:02,000 --> 03:03:05,229
DCG portion of the site we'd like to spread it out over a

3911
03:03:05,229 --> 03:03:06,399
larger footprint

3912
03:03:06,399 --> 03:03:13,440
and bring the the average height of the building down this

3913
03:03:13,440 --> 03:03:17,600
slide here basically

3914
03:03:17,600 --> 03:03:21,850
shows the the side in yellow and just to give you an idea

3915
03:03:21,850 --> 03:03:23,440
of proximity to the

3916
03:03:23,440 --> 03:03:27,709
right and red is the okay Hickory historic district and

3917
03:03:27,709 --> 03:03:29,120
West Oak historic

3918
03:03:29,120 --> 03:03:34,399
district in purple and the blue is the University outline

3919
03:03:34,399 --> 03:03:36,159
and if you look at

3920
03:03:36,159 --> 03:03:40,139
the university's master plan it has this site included in

3921
03:03:40,139 --> 03:03:42,040
its walking ring it's

3922
03:03:42,040 --> 03:03:46,290
within the 10 minute to the center of the academic core

3923
03:03:46,290 --> 03:03:47,959
which is located down

3924
03:03:47,959 --> 03:03:52,719
just below the sea there on the slide and what's what's

3925
03:03:52,719 --> 03:03:54,680
really good about this

3926
03:03:54,680 --> 03:03:59,920
site is that is certainly going to reduce the need the

3927
03:03:59,920 --> 03:04:02,000
demand for students

3928
03:04:02,000 --> 03:04:04,639
to come from outlying areas you know two miles away from

3929
03:04:04,639 --> 03:04:05,760
campus where they're

3930
03:04:05,760 --> 03:04:09,170
either driving and parking in these neighborhoods or are

3931
03:04:09,170 --> 03:04:09,840
taking a shuttle

3932
03:04:09,840 --> 03:04:14,059
bus and I'll certainly reduce the pressure on the

3933
03:04:14,059 --> 03:04:15,040
conversion of some

3934
03:04:15,040 --> 03:04:20,690
single-family homes in these areas to multifamily student

3935
03:04:20,690 --> 03:04:23,680
rentals to give you

3936
03:04:23,680 --> 03:04:27,120
just a quick few slides on some sample projects we've done

3937
03:04:27,120 --> 03:04:28,360
around the country

3938
03:04:28,360 --> 03:04:36,000
this is an LSU it's a six-story project 277 units rat

3939
03:04:36,000 --> 03:04:40,840
parking garage the next

3940
03:04:40,840 --> 03:04:45,520
one is in Columbia South Carolina same thing six stories 22

3941
03:04:45,520 --> 03:04:46,719
7 units the

3942
03:04:46,719 --> 03:04:52,790
materials here mix stucco fiber cement panels masonry and

3943
03:04:52,790 --> 03:04:54,440
some metal panels

3944
03:04:54,440 --> 03:04:58,940
next is in Lubbock six-story project and also walking

3945
03:04:58,940 --> 03:05:01,719
distance to campus here we

3946
03:05:01,719 --> 03:05:06,149
have a lot of masonry and stucco here are a few photos of

3947
03:05:06,149 --> 03:05:08,079
interiors kitchen

3948
03:05:08,079 --> 03:05:14,850
area with coffee bar game room ping-pong and pool there's a

3949
03:05:14,850 --> 03:05:17,399
movie theater this is

3950
03:05:17,399 --> 03:05:21,540
an internal courtyard that's fully enclosed for act or

3951
03:05:21,540 --> 03:05:23,559
activities there's

3952
03:05:23,559 --> 03:05:27,459
another lounge area and this is the many area that we put

3953
03:05:27,459 --> 03:05:28,719
on top of the parking

3954
03:05:28,719 --> 03:05:32,790
garage with a fitness center that overlooks this one this

3955
03:05:32,790 --> 03:05:34,760
is a property

3956
03:05:34,760 --> 03:05:39,399
that we have under construction in Waco at Baylor this is a

3957
03:05:39,399 --> 03:05:40,760
five-story

3958
03:05:40,760 --> 03:05:46,829
development and this is a rendering I brought to our first

3959
03:05:46,829 --> 03:05:48,120
meeting community

3960
03:05:48,120 --> 03:05:52,319
meeting back in September to get some input from the

3961
03:05:52,319 --> 03:05:54,200
community on you know

3962
03:05:54,200 --> 03:05:59,270
materials massing and so forth and after taking what we

3963
03:05:59,270 --> 03:06:00,920
heard back to the

3964
03:06:00,920 --> 03:06:05,879
architect we came up with the following plan here on this

3965
03:06:05,879 --> 03:06:07,559
next slide and what

3966
03:06:07,559 --> 03:06:09,860
we were able to do is incorporate some of the things we

3967
03:06:09,860 --> 03:06:10,600
heard from the

3968
03:06:10,600 --> 03:06:14,229
community which was to get the massing down we lowered the

3969
03:06:14,229 --> 03:06:15,280
to four stories

3970
03:06:15,280 --> 03:06:19,100
everything along the scripture and normal Street and at the

3971
03:06:19,100 --> 03:06:20,680
corner of Brian

3972
03:06:20,680 --> 03:06:26,280
and the height of that's about 46 feet to the peak and we

3973
03:06:26,280 --> 03:06:28,079
were able to bring in

3974
03:06:28,079 --> 03:06:33,319
some elements working with Roman as well here at the city

3975
03:06:33,319 --> 03:06:34,200
some of the elements

3976
03:06:34,200 --> 03:06:37,120
that we found in the buildings in the neighborhood mostly m

3977
03:06:37,120 --> 03:06:38,600
asonry lap siding

3978
03:06:38,600 --> 03:06:44,670
and some of the the trim work that you see there another

3979
03:06:44,670 --> 03:06:45,959
thing we heard from

3980
03:06:45,959 --> 03:06:50,059
the community was to try and push it back off the street so

3981
03:06:50,059 --> 03:06:51,280
what we've done

3982
03:06:51,280 --> 03:06:54,989
here is created large courtyard areas particularly off of

3983
03:06:54,989 --> 03:06:56,420
scripture those go

3984
03:06:56,420 --> 03:07:01,280
as deep as 60 feet from the back of the curb and they're 40

3985
03:07:01,280 --> 03:07:03,600
to 60 feet wide along

3986
03:07:03,600 --> 03:07:08,420
normal they go as deep as 35 feet and they're about 40 feet

3987
03:07:08,420 --> 03:07:11,200
wide there as well

3988
03:07:11,920 --> 03:07:15,340
see feel that you know the the revisions we've made here

3989
03:07:15,340 --> 03:07:17,000
certainly have have

3990
03:07:17,000 --> 03:07:24,610
helped with with the issue of massing at the site to put it

3991
03:07:24,610 --> 03:07:26,920
in context with you

3992
03:07:26,920 --> 03:07:29,639
know some of the other multifamily properties in the area

3993
03:07:29,639 --> 03:07:30,520
we've got City

3994
03:07:30,520 --> 03:07:34,229
Park which is diagonally across the site and to the peak of

3995
03:07:34,229 --> 03:07:36,200
their roof is roughly

3996
03:07:36,200 --> 03:07:40,290
varies from 40 feet to gets up as high as probably 55 feet

3997
03:07:40,290 --> 03:07:41,360
as you go down to

3998
03:07:41,360 --> 03:07:44,520
ponders you start going down the hill from the sidewalk so

3999
03:07:44,520 --> 03:07:45,520
we're talking

4000
03:07:45,520 --> 03:07:49,229
comparable heights and fry Street even though it's a four-

4001
03:07:49,229 --> 03:07:51,799
story building is 57

4002
03:07:51,799 --> 03:07:55,719
feet tall our fifth story would be 56 just one foot under

4003
03:07:55,719 --> 03:07:57,520
that we are proposing

4004
03:07:57,520 --> 03:08:02,370
however on top of the garage which you can see on this

4005
03:08:02,370 --> 03:08:04,360
slide that's the the

4006
03:08:04,360 --> 03:08:08,110
parking garage the center which is completely wrapped by

4007
03:08:08,110 --> 03:08:09,200
units so it will

4008
03:08:09,200 --> 03:08:12,639
not be seen from the street but we're proposing to put a

4009
03:08:12,639 --> 03:08:14,280
small amenity area on

4010
03:08:14,280 --> 03:08:17,139
top of that parking garage which would not be be able to be

4011
03:08:17,139 --> 03:08:17,879
seen from the

4012
03:08:17,879 --> 03:08:20,719
street like I showed you in that other rendering where a

4013
03:08:20,719 --> 03:08:21,879
small fitness center

4014
03:08:21,879 --> 03:08:27,120
that would look over a swimming pool. I'd like to point out

4015
03:08:27,120 --> 03:08:28,360
the sustainable design

4016
03:08:28,360 --> 03:08:33,389
practice we use we put you know we use recycled materials

4017
03:08:33,389 --> 03:08:34,799
you know the hardening

4018
03:08:34,799 --> 03:08:39,479
board has a lot of recycled wood fiber and so forth we do

4019
03:08:39,479 --> 03:08:40,680
light colored roofs

4020
03:08:40,680 --> 03:08:44,459
for less solar heat water source heat pumps low emitting em

4021
03:08:44,459 --> 03:08:44,799
itting paint

4022
03:08:44,799 --> 03:08:49,120
energy star appliances low flow fixtures LED lighting

4023
03:08:49,120 --> 03:08:50,920
bicycle parking

4024
03:08:50,920 --> 03:08:55,170
electrical vehicle charging stations inside the parking

4025
03:08:55,170 --> 03:08:57,200
garage and we do

4026
03:08:57,200 --> 03:09:00,360
sustainable landscape where we'll capture the rainwater and

4027
03:09:00,360 --> 03:09:01,200
recycle it for

4028
03:09:01,200 --> 03:09:18,799
irrigation. These are just the list of items that we feel

4029
03:09:18,799 --> 03:09:19,840
that this project is

4030
03:09:19,840 --> 03:09:23,600
bringing to the area as I've covered most of these already

4031
03:09:23,600 --> 03:09:24,120
have already spoken

4032
03:09:24,120 --> 03:09:30,889
I'll just leave those up there and the next thing I want to

4033
03:09:30,889 --> 03:09:33,479
talk about is when

4034
03:09:33,479 --> 03:09:36,819
we you know we're invested in this property already we own

4035
03:09:36,819 --> 03:09:37,520
it with with our

4036
03:09:37,520 --> 03:09:42,350
partner and we we needed to know what alternative plans

4037
03:09:42,350 --> 03:09:43,360
were in the event that

4038
03:09:43,360 --> 03:09:47,450
rezoning the property was not successful so we had a mass

4039
03:09:47,450 --> 03:09:49,159
ing study done to know

4040
03:09:49,159 --> 03:09:55,229
what is permitted under the current zoning and this is what

4041
03:09:55,229 --> 03:09:56,360
adheres to

4042
03:09:56,360 --> 03:10:00,690
residential proximity slopes and all the things that govern

4043
03:10:00,690 --> 03:10:02,760
the massing you know

4044
03:10:02,760 --> 03:10:07,559
this is while it's it's you know it's economically feasible

4045
03:10:07,559 --> 03:10:08,799
we certainly don't

4046
03:10:08,799 --> 03:10:13,920
feel that this is the best design for the neighborhood or

4047
03:10:13,920 --> 03:10:16,280
for us either and

4048
03:10:16,280 --> 03:10:22,350
we're hoping that we can through what we've incorporated

4049
03:10:22,350 --> 03:10:23,959
into our initial

4050
03:10:23,959 --> 03:10:28,940
designs and reducing the massing and landscape areas that

4051
03:10:28,940 --> 03:10:31,079
we're able to do

4052
03:10:31,079 --> 03:10:34,989
you know move forward with the plan that we have in front

4053
03:10:34,989 --> 03:10:40,360
of you today. This is a

4054
03:10:40,360 --> 03:10:44,590
slide that that just has that shows what's what's around

4055
03:10:44,590 --> 03:10:46,000
the areas I talked

4056
03:10:46,000 --> 03:10:53,319
about the different heights. Am I at ten minutes or is that

4057
03:10:53,319 --> 03:10:54,600
okay I'll just wrap

4058
03:10:54,600 --> 03:11:00,159
this up that these are properties that are located in

4059
03:11:00,159 --> 03:11:01,520
proximity you see you

4060
03:11:01,520 --> 03:11:05,559
Center Fry Street again and City Park you know both those

4061
03:11:05,559 --> 03:11:07,000
are heights of up to

4062
03:11:07,000 --> 03:11:14,620
57 feet. Here is that a slide that just shows the cross

4063
03:11:14,620 --> 03:11:16,559
section of why you

4064
03:11:16,559 --> 03:11:19,969
Center and our proposed project at the fifth story level

4065
03:11:19,969 --> 03:11:21,200
are the same height

4066
03:11:21,200 --> 03:11:25,239
that has to do with a large height in the retail section.

4067
03:11:25,239 --> 03:11:28,799
Here's a slide from

4068
03:11:28,799 --> 03:11:32,940
Scripture Street driving towards Bryan you see on the right

4069
03:11:32,940 --> 03:11:34,280
of City Park on the

4070
03:11:34,280 --> 03:11:37,190
left would be on the left-hand side of the screen is what

4071
03:11:37,190 --> 03:11:38,120
the four and five

4072
03:11:38,120 --> 03:11:41,870
story building would look like it's it's it's fairly

4073
03:11:41,870 --> 03:11:43,520
covered by by an existing

4074
03:11:43,520 --> 03:11:47,239
tree at the corner there however the slide on the right is

4075
03:11:47,239 --> 03:11:48,040
what the ten story

4076
03:11:48,040 --> 03:11:54,639
massing would look like. This slide just as far as the the

4077
03:11:54,639 --> 03:11:56,959
issue of zoning as you

4078
03:11:56,959 --> 03:12:02,520
move away from UNT we've got DCG and then DR2 and then DCG

4079
03:12:02,520 --> 03:12:04,639
again and then MRMU

4080
03:12:04,639 --> 03:12:10,709
which allows up to 65 feet. We're proposing to offer an

4081
03:12:10,709 --> 03:12:11,520
overlay that would

4082
03:12:11,520 --> 03:12:14,729
limit the height of our building the maximum height to 70

4083
03:12:14,729 --> 03:12:16,719
less than 70 feet so

4084
03:12:16,719 --> 03:12:23,420
that was more even out the the zoning heights as you move

4085
03:12:23,420 --> 03:12:26,840
away from UNT. At

4086
03:12:26,840 --> 03:12:31,500
this point I'll bring up Lee to talk about the neighborhood

4087
03:12:31,500 --> 03:12:32,360
process.

4088
03:12:40,360 --> 03:12:41,620
For your presentation that you've got a good product here

4089
03:12:41,620 --> 03:12:44,959
and it's something we

4090
03:12:44,959 --> 03:12:48,239
can use in Denton. I'm having a hard time with it in this

4091
03:12:48,239 --> 03:12:49,399
location for a variety

4092
03:12:49,399 --> 03:12:56,040
of reasons but an overlay of 70 feet in in this particular

4093
03:12:56,040 --> 03:12:57,879
area is unacceptable

4094
03:12:57,879 --> 03:13:02,270
to me. This is a well-established neighborhood classic

4095
03:13:02,270 --> 03:13:03,559
homes homeowners

4096
03:13:03,559 --> 03:13:07,059
live in it have taken care of it where just about any other

4097
03:13:07,059 --> 03:13:09,360
place around UNT

4098
03:13:09,360 --> 03:13:13,399
this product would work very well around TW and other parts

4099
03:13:13,399 --> 03:13:17,239
of the city but as

4100
03:13:17,239 --> 03:13:20,579
well as you've made it look and again I'm not picking on

4101
03:13:20,579 --> 03:13:21,680
you here but this

4102
03:13:21,680 --> 03:13:24,840
this thing is still huge by comparison to what's in the

4103
03:13:24,840 --> 03:13:26,000
neighborhood and its

4104
03:13:26,000 --> 03:13:30,520
footprint is big to me it just it doesn't seem compatible

4105
03:13:30,520 --> 03:13:31,440
with the

4106
03:13:31,440 --> 03:13:35,579
neighborhood it's in. We're dealing with a product that's S

4107
03:13:35,579 --> 03:13:37,120
ROs or we're dealing

4108
03:13:37,120 --> 03:13:41,549
with a transient student population as opposed to a more

4109
03:13:41,549 --> 03:13:42,719
stable family

4110
03:13:42,719 --> 03:13:46,360
population. The scale conflicts with the neighborhood and

4111
03:13:46,360 --> 03:13:47,639
violates concept I

4112
03:13:47,639 --> 03:13:51,520
think of gradual transition because this thing is just boom

4113
03:13:51,520 --> 03:13:52,760
set in there and it

4114
03:13:52,760 --> 03:13:59,909
sets apart from other things so you commented that the

4115
03:13:59,909 --> 03:14:00,959
student population

4116
03:14:00,959 --> 03:14:04,540
North Texas is growing and requires student housing but it

4117
03:14:04,540 --> 03:14:05,719
's really not up

4118
03:14:05,719 --> 03:14:10,760
to the city to provide the student housing and I'm not sure

4119
03:14:10,760 --> 03:14:11,440
it seems like

4120
03:14:11,440 --> 03:14:14,399
every time we've had this kind of development here not sure

4121
03:14:14,399 --> 03:14:15,680
but we had one

4122
03:14:15,680 --> 03:14:19,290
other one over and one the historic district nobody from UN

4123
03:14:19,290 --> 03:14:20,280
T has ever come

4124
03:14:20,280 --> 03:14:23,590
to support the notion for these kind of developments there

4125
03:14:23,590 --> 03:14:24,600
in fact they just

4126
03:14:24,600 --> 03:14:28,879
broke ground recently I think near Kerr Hall which is near

4127
03:14:28,879 --> 03:14:30,959
Eagle for 500 unit

4128
03:14:30,959 --> 03:14:34,489
apartments so it sounds like they're trying to answer their

4129
03:14:34,489 --> 03:14:35,680
problem but this

4130
03:14:35,680 --> 03:14:39,299
development is nice as it is in a lot of ways and it would

4131
03:14:39,299 --> 03:14:40,639
be again acceptable

4132
03:14:40,639 --> 03:14:46,709
anywhere else but in this this this older area that's

4133
03:14:46,709 --> 03:14:47,600
really kind of

4134
03:14:47,600 --> 03:14:51,020
reflective of our heritage over the last hundred years it's

4135
03:14:51,020 --> 03:14:52,440
just it would in my

4136
03:14:52,440 --> 03:14:55,850
opinion create a slippery slope situation where more of

4137
03:14:55,850 --> 03:14:56,680
these type of

4138
03:14:56,680 --> 03:14:58,780
developments would come in and then we would see this

4139
03:14:58,780 --> 03:14:59,799
neighborhood start to

4140
03:14:59,799 --> 03:15:05,549
diminish so I are you open to an overlay district in fact

4141
03:15:05,549 --> 03:15:09,079
we have something in our

4142
03:15:09,079 --> 03:15:15,149
development code that does suggest a mixed neighborhood

4143
03:15:15,149 --> 03:15:16,920
residential overlay

4144
03:15:16,920 --> 03:15:22,989
that I would like to see shorter heights on something no

4145
03:15:22,989 --> 03:15:25,120
more than three stories

4146
03:15:25,120 --> 03:15:28,280
something that had less density greater setbacks and

4147
03:15:28,280 --> 03:15:29,520
everything this gives you a

4148
03:15:29,520 --> 03:15:33,139
chance to build a product that we can use again I would

4149
03:15:33,139 --> 03:15:34,000
rather see a product

4150
03:15:34,000 --> 03:15:36,780
that accommodates families as opposed to students but it

4151
03:15:36,780 --> 03:15:38,040
could accommodate both

4152
03:15:38,040 --> 03:15:41,409
of them and at the same time helps maintain the character

4153
03:15:41,409 --> 03:15:41,920
of that

4154
03:15:41,920 --> 03:15:46,879
neighborhood so what are your thoughts on something along

4155
03:15:46,879 --> 03:15:48,760
those lines well

4156
03:15:48,760 --> 03:15:53,450
something certainly at the three-story level in terms of

4157
03:15:53,450 --> 03:15:55,440
density with their

4158
03:15:55,440 --> 03:16:00,129
parking requirements that won't work in terms of economic

4159
03:16:00,129 --> 03:16:01,680
feasibility I mean

4160
03:16:01,680 --> 03:16:06,500
that's really the issue here is it wouldn't be worth

4161
03:16:06,500 --> 03:16:10,000
building for you okay

4162
03:16:10,000 --> 03:16:14,170
how are you not gaining by building something a little bit

4163
03:16:14,170 --> 03:16:15,280
smaller scale

4164
03:16:15,280 --> 03:16:21,350
than what you're proposing here it's not only can you not

4165
03:16:21,350 --> 03:16:23,159
get a bank to finance

4166
03:16:23,159 --> 03:16:26,510
it you can't get the investors to invest in it it's the the

4167
03:16:26,510 --> 03:16:28,020
cost to build the

4168
03:16:28,020 --> 03:16:32,250
project and the income you take in it's all based on how

4169
03:16:32,250 --> 03:16:33,719
many units are in the

4170
03:16:33,719 --> 03:16:36,500
project right so fixed costs are still the same your

4171
03:16:36,500 --> 03:16:38,079
architects all your

4172
03:16:38,079 --> 03:16:42,200
studies your engineers I've been doing this for a long time

4173
03:16:42,200 --> 03:16:45,799
and unfortunately

4174
03:16:45,799 --> 03:16:51,040
at a three-story project it wouldn't be feasible I know

4175
03:16:51,040 --> 03:16:53,479
that well again I was

4176
03:16:53,479 --> 03:16:56,760
like answers for you but I don't know being honest no I

4177
03:16:56,760 --> 03:16:58,840
appreciate that my

4178
03:16:58,840 --> 03:17:02,270
main concern here and I'm sure you and the other developers

4179
03:17:02,270 --> 03:17:04,120
are aware that the

4180
03:17:04,120 --> 03:17:06,329
neighborhood is really opposed to this project for

4181
03:17:06,329 --> 03:17:08,079
understandable reasons this

4182
03:17:08,079 --> 03:17:12,819
is again a settled established neighborhood and this kind

4183
03:17:12,819 --> 03:17:13,120
of

4184
03:17:13,120 --> 03:17:18,159
development we need dense right I mean I guess it's similar

4185
03:17:18,159 --> 03:17:19,360
to you know a

4186
03:17:19,360 --> 03:17:22,940
single-family developers not gonna build a house if he's

4187
03:17:22,940 --> 03:17:23,239
gonna lose money

4188
03:17:23,239 --> 03:17:27,479
doing that it's no different no no I agree that's not going

4189
03:17:27,479 --> 03:17:27,920
to give us what

4190
03:17:27,920 --> 03:17:31,479
we need we do need low-income housing more affordable

4191
03:17:31,479 --> 03:17:32,879
housing I should say

4192
03:17:32,879 --> 03:17:37,159
right but again it there are just places like developments

4193
03:17:37,159 --> 03:17:38,479
are yours in my opinion

4194
03:17:38,479 --> 03:17:43,000
respectfully or just off-limits and the north side of the

4195
03:17:43,000 --> 03:17:44,600
UNT campus is that

4196
03:17:44,600 --> 03:17:47,409
area it's frustrating to me to see these type developments

4197
03:17:47,409 --> 03:17:48,280
come in and I can

4198
03:17:48,280 --> 03:17:52,159
understand the appeal of it because of the the charm that

4199
03:17:52,159 --> 03:17:53,379
area has but have

4200
03:17:53,379 --> 03:17:58,750
y'all look seriously at any other area the West Side would

4201
03:17:58,750 --> 03:17:59,719
be appropriate for

4202
03:17:59,719 --> 03:18:03,440
this type of development all along Eagle on the south side

4203
03:18:03,440 --> 03:18:05,440
yeah sure we have

4204
03:18:05,440 --> 03:18:10,450
looked around and we were not able to locate a site and a

4205
03:18:10,450 --> 03:18:11,879
lot of it has to do

4206
03:18:11,879 --> 03:18:16,829
with the economics too of trying to acquire an existing

4207
03:18:16,829 --> 03:18:18,520
running property

4208
03:18:18,520 --> 03:18:21,450
there are not sellers over there that are willing to not at

4209
03:18:21,450 --> 03:18:22,719
prices where you

4210
03:18:22,719 --> 03:18:25,600
can still build a project I mean there you're basically

4211
03:18:25,600 --> 03:18:26,559
having to buy their

4212
03:18:26,559 --> 03:18:33,000
cash flow stream and it doesn't work unless you're talking

4213
03:18:33,000 --> 03:18:33,680
about a

4214
03:18:33,680 --> 03:18:43,809
significant change in density anyway thank you yeah any

4215
03:18:43,809 --> 03:18:43,879
other questions I can

4216
03:18:43,879 --> 03:18:47,799
answer any other questions

4217
03:18:47,799 --> 03:18:53,129
mr. Solomon going back to the idea of walkability and you

4218
03:18:53,129 --> 03:18:54,280
've got the eight

4219
03:18:54,280 --> 03:18:58,239
eight-foot sidewalks around your property yes how's that

4220
03:18:58,239 --> 03:18:58,840
going to be

4221
03:18:58,840 --> 03:19:03,270
impacted whatever they then walk on to didn't city of didn

4222
03:19:03,270 --> 03:19:04,840
't maintain sidewalks

4223
03:19:04,840 --> 03:19:08,540
that are not eight foot that are not nice and new and clean

4224
03:19:08,540 --> 03:19:09,479
and level and

4225
03:19:09,479 --> 03:19:12,920
and what have you is that you think that's going to

4226
03:19:12,920 --> 03:19:15,799
encourage or discourage

4227
03:19:15,799 --> 03:19:22,479
walkers from their 20 minutes down to the library I'm going

4228
03:19:22,479 --> 03:19:22,600
to be an

4229
03:19:22,600 --> 03:19:27,389
improvement as to what's there as as properties develop in

4230
03:19:27,389 --> 03:19:28,879
the future it'll

4231
03:19:28,879 --> 03:19:31,059
be their responsibility to pick it up from there just like

4232
03:19:31,059 --> 03:19:33,959
any other I do

4233
03:19:33,959 --> 03:19:39,000
think that certainly creating a hardscape around the

4234
03:19:39,000 --> 03:19:39,940
perimeter of the

4235
03:19:39,940 --> 03:19:42,940
property with better lighting and you're just going to have

4236
03:19:42,940 --> 03:19:44,280
a lot more foot

4237
03:19:44,280 --> 03:19:48,520
traffic that's going to make more vibrant area safer area

4238
03:19:48,520 --> 03:19:49,600
you know I sit

4239
03:19:49,600 --> 03:19:52,610
there now and I watch this flows the kids coming from

4240
03:19:52,610 --> 03:19:54,000
further away from a

4241
03:19:54,000 --> 03:19:56,959
cross-strait so they're going to walk for sure it's a lot

4242
03:19:56,959 --> 03:19:58,040
easier to walk and

4243
03:19:58,040 --> 03:20:01,819
it is to try and park your car you know even shuttles where

4244
03:20:01,819 --> 03:20:02,600
they drop me off

4245
03:20:02,600 --> 03:20:06,840
we'll walk this five minutes the edge of the academic core

4246
03:20:06,840 --> 03:20:07,479
and then you can take

4247
03:20:07,479 --> 03:20:10,639
you know the shuttle from there if you want to go all the

4248
03:20:10,639 --> 03:20:11,319
way to the other side

4249
03:20:11,319 --> 03:20:15,770
of campus have y'all inquired with North Texas as far as

4250
03:20:15,770 --> 03:20:18,319
buses running or DCT 8

4251
03:20:18,319 --> 03:20:23,280
buses running from the apartment complex to the campus we

4252
03:20:23,280 --> 03:20:25,399
haven't talked about a

4253
03:20:25,399 --> 03:20:32,950
direct route but that we always do when we get closer to

4254
03:20:32,950 --> 03:20:36,559
opening okay thank you

4255
03:20:36,559 --> 03:20:41,760
yeah Commissioner Taylor thank you chair could you go back

4256
03:20:41,760 --> 03:20:43,000
to the the site

4257
03:20:43,000 --> 03:20:51,440
rendering I'm just trying to wrap my head around what what

4258
03:20:51,440 --> 03:20:52,520
dimensional things

4259
03:20:52,520 --> 03:20:55,530
create this look here so that's you said that's that's an

4260
03:20:55,530 --> 03:20:56,520
eight foot sidewalk

4261
03:20:56,520 --> 03:21:08,579
there so then you so it's a like an eight foot sidewalk and

4262
03:21:08,579 --> 03:21:09,239
about is that

4263
03:21:09,239 --> 03:21:13,239
like a 20-foot side yard front yard yeah it varies in size

4264
03:21:13,239 --> 03:21:15,719
but like the one like

4265
03:21:15,719 --> 03:21:18,670
the the shortest distance not not understand you have for

4266
03:21:18,670 --> 03:21:19,440
those pavilion

4267
03:21:19,440 --> 03:21:24,159
back in the curves by 20 feet back

4268
03:21:31,360 --> 03:21:35,239
this is an architectural rendering but having looked at the

4269
03:21:35,239 --> 03:21:35,600
here's name and

4270
03:21:35,600 --> 03:21:39,149
address please Lee Allison with Allison engineering group 4

4271
03:21:39,149 --> 03:21:41,559
401 North I 35 Denton

4272
03:21:41,559 --> 03:21:48,459
Texas basically the code requires an eight foot sidewalk on

4273
03:21:48,459 --> 03:21:49,319
Scripture but

4274
03:21:49,319 --> 03:21:52,030
knowing the pedestrian interest around here we've proposed

4275
03:21:52,030 --> 03:21:53,000
eight foot sidewalks

4276
03:21:53,000 --> 03:21:56,920
all the way around the parkway in this section behind the

4277
03:21:56,920 --> 03:21:58,360
curb is about eleven

4278
03:21:58,360 --> 03:22:01,299
and a half feet and in working with the architect we've put

4279
03:22:01,299 --> 03:22:02,319
the buildings ten

4280
03:22:02,319 --> 03:22:06,180
feet behind the property line even though it's not there's

4281
03:22:06,180 --> 03:22:06,959
no setback

4282
03:22:06,959 --> 03:22:09,719
requirement here but we've put it ten feet back so we're

4283
03:22:09,719 --> 03:22:10,920
about to the closest

4284
03:22:10,920 --> 03:22:13,500
part of the building about 20 feet from the back of curb to

4285
03:22:13,500 --> 03:22:14,840
the building long

4286
03:22:14,840 --> 03:22:19,479
answer I hope that gave it yes so curb curb to building

4287
03:22:19,479 --> 03:22:20,479
approximately 20 feet

4288
03:22:20,479 --> 03:22:23,440
in this is the closest portion of the building yes as Paul

4289
03:22:23,440 --> 03:22:24,200
mentioned in these

4290
03:22:24,200 --> 03:22:29,760
deep recesses maybe as much as 60 feet from the curb to the

4291
03:22:29,760 --> 03:22:31,239
and then this this

4292
03:22:31,239 --> 03:22:36,200
is 46 foot top of the edge at front edge of the building

4293
03:22:36,200 --> 03:22:38,000
there and that great

4294
03:22:38,000 --> 03:22:42,729
Ron 46 feet for the front facade of the building so does

4295
03:22:42,729 --> 03:22:44,879
that does that comply

4296
03:22:44,879 --> 03:22:47,489
so if you're 10 feet off the property line and you have

4297
03:22:47,489 --> 03:22:48,719
that 35 degree slope

4298
03:22:48,719 --> 03:22:54,790
from 40 would that wouldn't that be below 46 feet wouldn't

4299
03:22:54,790 --> 03:22:55,600
you be looking at

4300
03:22:55,600 --> 03:22:59,530
like a 43 or 44 foot max at 10 feet off the property line

4301
03:22:59,530 --> 03:23:00,760
across from a house

4302
03:23:00,760 --> 03:23:05,079
if there's a house across the street from there we're very

4303
03:23:05,079 --> 03:23:06,200
close to it but

4304
03:23:06,200 --> 03:23:08,930
this has been set up so where there are houses we have met

4305
03:23:08,930 --> 03:23:09,799
the residential

4306
03:23:09,799 --> 03:23:14,000
proximity slopes so basically you'll push back the building

4307
03:23:14,000 --> 03:23:15,280
yes across from

4308
03:23:15,280 --> 03:23:22,110
the last and basically so that your building is underneath

4309
03:23:22,110 --> 03:23:22,600
that line right

4310
03:23:22,600 --> 03:23:27,670
and you and you did list you said a front front edge 50 46

4311
03:23:27,670 --> 03:23:28,879
feet and top of

4312
03:23:28,879 --> 03:23:34,309
the building 56 feet yeah then you said you would need you

4313
03:23:34,309 --> 03:23:35,319
would be comfortable

4314
03:23:35,319 --> 03:23:39,399
with a 70 foot elevation that's 14 feet higher than your

4315
03:23:39,399 --> 03:23:42,079
let me explain that see

4316
03:23:42,079 --> 03:23:48,200
this is the parking garage and just you know mad basically

4317
03:23:48,200 --> 03:23:49,239
a 10,000 square foot

4318
03:23:49,239 --> 03:23:52,600
rectangle would sit on top of there

4319
03:23:57,719 --> 03:24:02,280
yeah right up we were going to locate it right about here

4320
03:24:02,280 --> 03:24:03,520
you'd have a rectangle

4321
03:24:03,520 --> 03:24:06,250
that would sit up here that would have a fitness center in

4322
03:24:06,250 --> 03:24:07,360
it that would overlook

4323
03:24:07,360 --> 03:24:11,059
the swimming pool that would be in the top of the parking

4324
03:24:11,059 --> 03:24:12,200
garage so that's the

4325
03:24:12,200 --> 03:24:16,079
difference okay so that would be an extra 12 or something

4326
03:24:16,079 --> 03:24:16,840
feet above the

4327
03:24:16,840 --> 03:24:20,760
fifth floor right and what we're saying here is that when

4328
03:24:20,760 --> 03:24:22,040
you from a sight line

4329
03:24:22,040 --> 03:24:26,469
from the street view the front portions of the building

4330
03:24:26,469 --> 03:24:28,239
because it's so set so

4331
03:24:28,239 --> 03:24:31,649
far back you won't be able to see that part of the building

4332
03:24:31,649 --> 03:24:32,719
from the ground

4333
03:24:32,719 --> 03:24:36,959
right yeah and so now looking at this the view you kind of

4334
03:24:36,959 --> 03:24:38,159
I know this site

4335
03:24:38,159 --> 03:24:39,969
plans are non-binding we're not really evaluating site

4336
03:24:39,969 --> 03:24:40,799
plans but just to get an

4337
03:24:40,799 --> 03:24:47,389
idea of scale here it looks like you've got 40 units of

4338
03:24:47,389 --> 03:24:49,959
floor is that so you'd

4339
03:24:49,959 --> 03:24:58,319
be looking at what is that 250 229 okay and I'm assuming

4340
03:24:58,319 --> 03:24:59,959
that's that's your

4341
03:24:59,959 --> 03:25:03,129
whatever profit point that's the that's the market point

4342
03:25:03,129 --> 03:25:04,280
you need to reach that's

4343
03:25:04,280 --> 03:25:07,280
when we talk about restricting the height you lose units

4344
03:25:07,280 --> 03:25:08,440
can't can't make it

4345
03:25:08,440 --> 03:25:13,200
work at 130 units you need your 200 or whatever it is so

4346
03:25:13,200 --> 03:25:14,719
yeah I think those were

4347
03:25:14,719 --> 03:25:16,170
all the dimensional things like I said I'm just trying to

4348
03:25:16,170 --> 03:25:16,719
get my head around

4349
03:25:16,719 --> 03:25:21,149
what all what else is going to hear thank you another

4350
03:25:21,149 --> 03:25:22,360
question Commissioner

4351
03:25:22,360 --> 03:25:24,840
Roseau thank you chair thank you for the presentation yeah

4352
03:25:24,840 --> 03:25:26,079
I just wanted to maybe

4353
03:25:26,079 --> 03:25:28,879
clarify for myself as well as maybe for the edification for

4354
03:25:28,879 --> 03:25:29,680
anyone else can you

4355
03:25:29,680 --> 03:25:34,959
show us the 10-story option that you had

4356
03:25:37,239 --> 03:25:41,180
it's your understanding that this option more or less

4357
03:25:41,180 --> 03:25:43,760
presented here if our

4358
03:25:43,760 --> 03:25:48,559
Commission tonight does not approve the rezoning this

4359
03:25:48,559 --> 03:25:49,799
project is economically

4360
03:25:49,799 --> 03:25:53,090
feasible and able to be built by right correct and so what

4361
03:25:53,090 --> 03:25:54,159
you're asking is

4362
03:25:54,159 --> 03:25:59,049
instead of building this to disperse the density that this

4363
03:25:59,049 --> 03:26:01,000
provides right over

4364
03:26:01,000 --> 03:26:05,520
the course of larger property that's right so I feel

4365
03:26:05,520 --> 03:26:07,000
compelled to think back

4366
03:26:07,000 --> 03:26:10,459
over a recent case that some of the commissioners held here

4367
03:26:10,459 --> 03:26:11,440
as well and in

4368
03:26:11,440 --> 03:26:14,040
Buc-Ease I'm not sure if you're familiar with Buc-Ease case

4369
03:26:14,040 --> 03:26:15,479
but it was a similar

4370
03:26:15,479 --> 03:26:19,360
situation in which an applicant was asking for something

4371
03:26:19,360 --> 03:26:20,879
and if denied they

4372
03:26:20,879 --> 03:26:25,000
could build whatever they know we've got a commissioner

4373
03:26:25,000 --> 03:26:26,000
that's been in another

4374
03:26:26,000 --> 03:26:29,829
meeting who's gonna rejoin us Commissioner Hesbeth welcome

4375
03:26:29,829 --> 03:26:30,479
back okay

4376
03:26:30,479 --> 03:26:34,770
Mr. Roseau please continue anyways to shorten the story we

4377
03:26:34,770 --> 03:26:35,079
had an opportunity

4378
03:26:35,079 --> 03:26:38,680
to ask Buc-Ease to do certain things because they were

4379
03:26:38,680 --> 03:26:39,840
asking for something I

4380
03:26:39,840 --> 03:26:43,309
feel like this is a very similar situation in which the

4381
03:26:43,309 --> 03:26:44,600
Commission has an

4382
03:26:44,600 --> 03:26:48,100
opportunity to think through an option that's less intrus

4383
03:26:48,100 --> 03:26:49,319
ive than what y'all

4384
03:26:49,319 --> 03:26:51,829
can build by right and what my concern is initially and I

4385
03:26:51,829 --> 03:26:52,840
obviously I'm gonna

4386
03:26:52,840 --> 03:26:56,440
listen to the public and and process through this but my

4387
03:26:56,440 --> 03:26:58,639
concern is is that if

4388
03:26:58,639 --> 03:27:05,149
we deny the agenda item tonight that although that would be

4389
03:27:05,149 --> 03:27:06,840
a win per se for

4390
03:27:06,840 --> 03:27:09,350
the neighbors to deny something it might be ultimately a

4391
03:27:09,350 --> 03:27:10,159
loss if they have a

4392
03:27:10,159 --> 03:27:12,940
hundred foot building in their backyard and so it might be

4393
03:27:12,940 --> 03:27:14,360
worth considering for

4394
03:27:14,360 --> 03:27:17,239
individuals in the audience as well as this Commission to

4395
03:27:17,239 --> 03:27:18,399
think through the two

4396
03:27:18,399 --> 03:27:23,600
options on the table is potentially a 70 foot dispersed

4397
03:27:23,600 --> 03:27:26,760
building or or this which

4398
03:27:26,760 --> 03:27:30,090
to me I call monstrosity and so that's something to be

4399
03:27:30,090 --> 03:27:32,200
thoughtful of right

4400
03:27:32,200 --> 03:27:38,270
and I have one more thing I just want to add for the record

4401
03:27:38,270 --> 03:27:40,559
that we obviously

4402
03:27:40,559 --> 03:27:43,190
can't tie to a site plan when we're talking about the

4403
03:27:43,190 --> 03:27:44,319
zoning so since he's

4404
03:27:44,319 --> 03:27:47,209
offering to do it at a lower level than what the zoning

4405
03:27:47,209 --> 03:27:48,639
that zoning change would

4406
03:27:48,639 --> 03:27:51,319
allow we would still have to entertain something similar to

4407
03:27:51,319 --> 03:27:52,319
it the mixed use

4408
03:27:52,319 --> 03:27:55,879
residential district that Commissioner Beck had indicated

4409
03:27:55,879 --> 03:27:56,920
and that's under 35

4410
03:27:56,920 --> 03:28:00,889
point five point two four of the didn't development code

4411
03:28:00,889 --> 03:28:02,520
and typically that's for

4412
03:28:02,520 --> 03:28:07,770
in our MU properties that are your residential properties

4413
03:28:07,770 --> 03:28:09,159
like in our two

4414
03:28:09,159 --> 03:28:14,110
or in our one but in this case the wording of that

4415
03:28:14,110 --> 03:28:15,959
particular section of

4416
03:28:15,959 --> 03:28:19,729
our ordinances will allow us to do it in this case so you

4417
03:28:19,729 --> 03:28:21,399
have that available to

4418
03:28:21,399 --> 03:28:25,010
you where we could do a mix use overlay in this case over

4419
03:28:25,010 --> 03:28:26,399
the zoning layer in

4420
03:28:26,399 --> 03:28:30,629
order to top it out at 70 feet or whatever height that you

4421
03:28:30,629 --> 03:28:32,120
wanted to be

4422
03:28:32,120 --> 03:28:36,200
thank you you want to respond one more point but one years

4423
03:28:36,200 --> 03:28:41,799
on as far as you

4424
03:28:41,799 --> 03:28:45,350
know that additional height that I think might be you know

4425
03:28:45,350 --> 03:28:47,360
concerning a way to

4426
03:28:47,360 --> 03:28:51,170
restrict that would be you know to say you know not more

4427
03:28:51,170 --> 03:28:52,600
than 15% of the

4428
03:28:52,600 --> 03:28:56,649
footprint could be above you know the whatever our fifth

4429
03:28:56,649 --> 03:28:58,399
floor is 57 feet or

4430
03:28:58,399 --> 03:29:01,979
60 feet let's say would not be above it so it's clearly the

4431
03:29:01,979 --> 03:29:03,120
intent is for that

4432
03:29:03,120 --> 03:29:06,840
amenity area and not from for some larger area at that

4433
03:29:06,840 --> 03:29:08,959
height we can do that as

4434
03:29:08,959 --> 03:29:14,139
well so the last thing I wanted to say at this point was it

4435
03:29:14,139 --> 03:29:15,319
's been brought up a

4436
03:29:15,319 --> 03:29:18,159
couple times and I believe two weeks goes brought up in my

4437
03:29:18,159 --> 03:29:19,920
absence about it's

4438
03:29:19,920 --> 03:29:23,079
not the city's responsibility to provide housing for the

4439
03:29:23,079 --> 03:29:23,879
University of North

4440
03:29:23,879 --> 03:29:27,840
Texas which I agree with however every time there's a

4441
03:29:27,840 --> 03:29:29,639
housing need fulfilled by

4442
03:29:29,639 --> 03:29:32,340
the University of North Texas the city didn't receive no

4443
03:29:32,340 --> 03:29:33,559
taxes for that and so

4444
03:29:33,559 --> 03:29:38,270
in terms of tax revenue and a basis for that it's not

4445
03:29:38,270 --> 03:29:40,159
necessarily not that it's

4446
03:29:40,159 --> 03:29:43,479
our obligation as a city to provide housing for North Texas

4447
03:29:43,479 --> 03:29:44,719
however providing

4448
03:29:44,719 --> 03:29:48,010
housing period is taxes that you know Texas will not give

4449
03:29:48,010 --> 03:29:49,200
us when they build a

4450
03:29:49,200 --> 03:29:53,229
dorm right and I think that and I think that's on a later

4451
03:29:53,229 --> 03:29:54,840
slide but the increase

4452
03:29:54,840 --> 03:29:58,000
in the assessed value I think it's 30 fold it's something

4453
03:29:58,000 --> 03:29:59,319
like 1.3 million up

4454
03:29:59,319 --> 03:30:03,840
to 33 million in terms of the tax would be generated

4455
03:30:03,840 --> 03:30:06,280
property tax right yeah

4456
03:30:06,280 --> 03:30:10,959
thank you Commissioner Beck thank you chair just a quick

4457
03:30:10,959 --> 03:30:11,559
response to

4458
03:30:11,559 --> 03:30:14,950
Commissioner Roselle's statement about a loss of property

4459
03:30:14,950 --> 03:30:16,440
tax and that's true but

4460
03:30:16,440 --> 03:30:22,000
it's not like it would be revenue void with extra students

4461
03:30:22,000 --> 03:30:23,040
coming in they buy

4462
03:30:23,040 --> 03:30:25,979
products they go to restaurants and movies and stuff like

4463
03:30:25,979 --> 03:30:26,760
that so we still

4464
03:30:26,760 --> 03:30:33,270
gain some revenue from that in relationship to our legal

4465
03:30:33,270 --> 03:30:34,479
attorney here

4466
03:30:34,479 --> 03:30:38,399
Jennifer Curtis pointing out that we do have more than the

4467
03:30:38,399 --> 03:30:40,159
option of approving

4468
03:30:40,159 --> 03:30:45,309
this as is or denying it as is we can approve this project

4469
03:30:45,309 --> 03:30:47,120
with an amendment

4470
03:30:47,120 --> 03:30:52,280
that would bring in this mixed-use residential overlay and

4471
03:30:52,280 --> 03:30:53,520
substantially

4472
03:30:53,520 --> 03:30:56,299
reduce the footprint here and I understand the concern

4473
03:30:56,299 --> 03:30:57,079
about it being

4474
03:30:57,079 --> 03:31:01,120
profitable and all that and this area does need to be

4475
03:31:01,120 --> 03:31:03,200
cleaned up okay there's

4476
03:31:03,200 --> 03:31:06,379
some there's some messy areas in there but again I think

4477
03:31:06,379 --> 03:31:08,159
overriding all this is

4478
03:31:08,159 --> 03:31:11,360
we have to keep in mind the character of the neighborhood

4479
03:31:11,360 --> 03:31:12,520
that's very important

4480
03:31:12,520 --> 03:31:15,750
to that that weighs more heavily than a lot of the other

4481
03:31:15,750 --> 03:31:16,840
things that are of

4482
03:31:16,840 --> 03:31:19,819
economic value to you and I think if we can create an

4483
03:31:19,819 --> 03:31:21,280
overlay district that will

4484
03:31:21,280 --> 03:31:24,110
allow you to build something that will fulfill the needs of

4485
03:31:24,110 --> 03:31:24,760
the student

4486
03:31:24,760 --> 03:31:30,319
population creating low-income housing and again keep this

4487
03:31:30,319 --> 03:31:32,840
neighborhood in a

4488
03:31:32,840 --> 03:31:35,450
state that it's been for virtually a hundred years that

4489
03:31:35,450 --> 03:31:36,319
that's a win-win

4490
03:31:36,319 --> 03:31:40,319
situation it's not a win-win situation if if you're

4491
03:31:40,319 --> 03:31:42,840
building something any

4492
03:31:42,840 --> 03:31:46,920
anything above five stories seven stories ten stories

4493
03:31:46,920 --> 03:31:47,879
because eventually

4494
03:31:47,879 --> 03:31:50,329
it's going to diminish the value the property around there

4495
03:31:50,329 --> 03:31:51,079
that'll sell off

4496
03:31:51,079 --> 03:31:53,899
more these type of developments will come in and then we've

4497
03:31:53,899 --> 03:31:55,159
lost exactly what

4498
03:31:55,159 --> 03:32:00,719
we want to preserve here an important part of Denton's

4499
03:32:00,719 --> 03:32:01,920
heritage right right I

4500
03:32:01,920 --> 03:32:07,379
think Lee's going to continue the presentation and how much

4501
03:32:07,379 --> 03:32:08,079
time does Lee

4502
03:32:08,079 --> 03:32:09,979
have we've had a lot of questions and I don't know how much

4503
03:32:09,979 --> 03:32:10,559
he has an additional

4504
03:32:10,559 --> 03:32:13,920
ten minutes ten minutes ten minutes okay I was wondering

4505
03:32:13,920 --> 03:32:14,959
how much time we had

4506
03:32:14,959 --> 03:32:18,319
left I do want to back up to this particular slide we

4507
03:32:18,319 --> 03:32:19,520
prepared this as a

4508
03:32:19,520 --> 03:32:24,809
result of miss Ellis's question last session regarding the

4509
03:32:24,809 --> 03:32:25,639
changes in

4510
03:32:25,639 --> 03:32:29,450
densities etc and how things get zoned the way they do and

4511
03:32:29,450 --> 03:32:30,559
and why things

4512
03:32:30,559 --> 03:32:34,340
change and in a very small city you might like saying where

4513
03:32:34,340 --> 03:32:35,120
I'm from you

4514
03:32:35,120 --> 03:32:38,889
might expect an umbrella type pattern where you got high

4515
03:32:38,889 --> 03:32:40,159
density in the middle

4516
03:32:40,159 --> 03:32:42,940
and things thin out as you go away as you get larger cities

4517
03:32:42,940 --> 03:32:43,760
you're going to

4518
03:32:43,760 --> 03:32:46,450
have different use areas and as a result you'll have

4519
03:32:46,450 --> 03:32:47,639
changes and we cut this

4520
03:32:47,639 --> 03:32:50,979
section right through our site with the University of North

4521
03:32:50,979 --> 03:32:52,319
Texas on the left it

4522
03:32:52,319 --> 03:32:55,010
is not subject to zoning restrictions so there are no

4523
03:32:55,010 --> 03:32:56,799
height limits it steps down

4524
03:32:56,799 --> 03:33:00,709
to a DCG which has a hundred foot limit then it steps down

4525
03:33:00,709 --> 03:33:02,000
to a dr2 that has a

4526
03:33:02,000 --> 03:33:06,000
45 foot limit then it steps back up for another service

4527
03:33:06,000 --> 03:33:07,920
area that has a DCG with

4528
03:33:07,920 --> 03:33:11,149
a hundred foot limit which is part of our site and then it

4529
03:33:11,149 --> 03:33:12,559
has a cross from

4530
03:33:12,559 --> 03:33:16,129
our site there's both NRMU which is a 65 foot limit and NRM

4531
03:33:16,129 --> 03:33:17,520
U 12 which has a 40

4532
03:33:17,520 --> 03:33:21,379
foot limit and behind that is the NR3 that has a 40 foot

4533
03:33:21,379 --> 03:33:23,040
limit as well as the

4534
03:33:23,040 --> 03:33:27,229
NRMU 12 the crossed hatch area where I proposed site is we

4535
03:33:27,229 --> 03:33:28,959
're looking at a 70

4536
03:33:28,959 --> 03:33:31,950
foot height maximum but that includes the recreation area

4537
03:33:31,950 --> 03:33:32,799
that mr. Taylor

4538
03:33:32,799 --> 03:33:37,440
discussed earlier down from that we got the five stories

4539
03:33:37,440 --> 03:33:39,040
set in some and then out

4540
03:33:39,040 --> 03:33:41,979
in the immediate fronts where it four stories or about 45

4541
03:33:41,979 --> 03:33:42,920
feet which is very

4542
03:33:42,920 --> 03:33:48,399
comparable to the dr2 and the NRMU 12 that are adjacent to

4543
03:33:48,399 --> 03:33:50,040
it see if I'm going

4544
03:33:50,040 --> 03:33:53,280
the right next direction October 5th we had an initial

4545
03:33:53,280 --> 03:33:54,840
neighborhood meeting this

4546
03:33:54,840 --> 03:33:58,920
was before well we got our application into the city before

4547
03:33:58,920 --> 03:33:59,680
official meetings

4548
03:33:59,680 --> 03:34:03,159
with the city we brought the project from Waco to use as a

4549
03:34:03,159 --> 03:34:04,079
talking point to

4550
03:34:04,079 --> 03:34:08,280
get neighborhood comments and feedback after that we

4551
03:34:08,280 --> 03:34:10,500
contacted Roman McAllen

4552
03:34:10,500 --> 03:34:13,659
and Ron and I the architect made a walk around the area to

4553
03:34:13,659 --> 03:34:14,639
see what we could

4554
03:34:14,639 --> 03:34:20,100
find in the way of themes what's going on there pretty ec

4555
03:34:20,100 --> 03:34:22,000
lectic there are

4556
03:34:22,000 --> 03:34:25,399
tree-lined streets everywhere except on our current site so

4557
03:34:25,399 --> 03:34:26,399
we're looking at

4558
03:34:26,399 --> 03:34:28,860
getting ridding some of the driveways and adding trees

4559
03:34:28,860 --> 03:34:30,040
there we're not going to

4560
03:34:30,040 --> 03:34:32,309
put more dumpsters on the streets like there and we're not

4561
03:34:32,309 --> 03:34:32,840
going to add

4562
03:34:32,840 --> 03:34:36,649
overhead electric lines we think we've made it attractive

4563
03:34:36,649 --> 03:34:37,760
and tried to find

4564
03:34:37,760 --> 03:34:41,889
ways to architecturally be respectful of and even blend and

4565
03:34:41,889 --> 03:34:42,719
work with the

4566
03:34:42,719 --> 03:34:46,430
community after that we came back for another neighborhood

4567
03:34:46,430 --> 03:34:47,479
meeting on December

4568
03:34:47,479 --> 03:34:51,860
7th I showed what we had come up with after the meeting

4569
03:34:51,860 --> 03:34:53,639
with them some people

4570
03:34:53,639 --> 03:34:57,280
were pleased some were just glad we did what we did but

4571
03:34:57,280 --> 03:34:58,079
like a little different

4572
03:34:58,079 --> 03:35:02,840
some people still didn't like it at all to be honest

4573
03:35:02,840 --> 03:35:05,120
neighborhood concerns

4574
03:35:05,120 --> 03:35:08,930
proximity to historical districts were 660 feet from the

4575
03:35:08,930 --> 03:35:10,680
closest one and the

4576
03:35:10,680 --> 03:35:14,459
code puts in protections against those such as the

4577
03:35:14,459 --> 03:35:16,840
residential proximity slopes

4578
03:35:16,840 --> 03:35:20,159
insufficient parking we're meeting the code and right now

4579
03:35:20,159 --> 03:35:21,120
there's a lot of

4580
03:35:21,120 --> 03:35:23,899
people walking from even further north than where we are on

4581
03:35:23,899 --> 03:35:24,799
the existing city

4582
03:35:24,799 --> 03:35:27,969
sidewalks because they're parking way out there to try and

4583
03:35:27,969 --> 03:35:28,959
find a place to get

4584
03:35:28,959 --> 03:35:33,139
to campus so there's a lot of walking going on enforcement

4585
03:35:33,139 --> 03:35:34,879
of parking we're

4586
03:35:34,879 --> 03:35:37,030
having an on-site wrapped garage that doesn't help

4587
03:35:37,030 --> 03:35:38,040
enforcement of parking

4588
03:35:38,040 --> 03:35:40,340
that's an issue out there it's going to be an issue after

4589
03:35:40,340 --> 03:35:41,600
this complex is there

4590
03:35:41,600 --> 03:35:45,000
we're not going to meet that much of the university's needs

4591
03:35:45,000 --> 03:35:46,879
building height we're

4592
03:35:46,879 --> 03:35:49,659
proposing less than code and we're certainly willing to

4593
03:35:49,659 --> 03:35:50,479
have an overlay

4594
03:35:50,479 --> 03:35:53,360
restriction to help make sure that limit is enforced even

4595
03:35:53,360 --> 03:35:54,319
after the zoning is

4596
03:35:54,319 --> 03:35:59,700
approved if we're so fortunate parking block solid waste we

4597
03:35:59,700 --> 03:36:00,239
're going to have

4598
03:36:00,239 --> 03:36:02,479
on-site facilities we're not going to add to that

4599
03:36:02,479 --> 03:36:03,920
neighborhoods concerned about

4600
03:36:03,920 --> 03:36:07,329
traffic we're paying our impact fees we did accomplish a

4601
03:36:07,329 --> 03:36:09,079
traffic impact analysis

4602
03:36:09,079 --> 03:36:12,760
preliminary traffic counts I'll just mention more in a

4603
03:36:12,760 --> 03:36:13,879
minute future

4604
03:36:13,879 --> 03:36:16,559
improvements to scripture the neighborhood asked about that

4605
03:36:16,559 --> 03:36:16,760
and

4606
03:36:16,760 --> 03:36:19,430
there's not any in the city's capital improvements program

4607
03:36:19,430 --> 03:36:20,280
at this time it is

4608
03:36:20,280 --> 03:36:25,079
classified as a commercial collector dust and noise

4609
03:36:25,079 --> 03:36:26,760
building permit process

4610
03:36:26,760 --> 03:36:28,959
we're not any different than any other construction

4611
03:36:28,959 --> 03:36:30,600
capacity of existing

4612
03:36:30,600 --> 03:36:33,459
infrastructure it appears to be okay but we'll put a

4613
03:36:33,459 --> 03:36:34,760
detailed analysis together

4614
03:36:34,760 --> 03:36:38,360
as we proceed with site planning and planning impact upon

4615
03:36:38,360 --> 03:36:39,239
surrounding

4616
03:36:39,239 --> 03:36:45,540
businesses we think as those on Fry Street have have done

4617
03:36:45,540 --> 03:36:46,680
better as a

4618
03:36:46,680 --> 03:36:49,459
result of the increased density there we think with these

4619
03:36:49,459 --> 03:36:50,600
housing that'll help

4620
03:36:50,600 --> 03:36:54,799
the businesses in the area to some degree demand for

4621
03:36:54,799 --> 03:36:55,840
housing still

4622
03:36:55,840 --> 03:36:58,149
extraordinarily high and we're not really going to address

4623
03:36:58,149 --> 03:36:58,760
a large part of

4624
03:36:58,760 --> 03:37:06,129
UNT's demand for housing some of the ways we think it helps

4625
03:37:06,129 --> 03:37:06,959
work together

4626
03:37:06,959 --> 03:37:09,319
with the communities that are dresses some of the demand

4627
03:37:09,319 --> 03:37:10,239
for student housing

4628
03:37:10,239 --> 03:37:13,540
keeps it off on the tax rolls rather than off property

4629
03:37:13,540 --> 03:37:16,040
value around 33 million

4630
03:37:16,040 --> 03:37:20,110
reduces the need for student occupied home rentals I did an

4631
03:37:20,110 --> 03:37:21,719
analysis based on

4632
03:37:21,719 --> 03:37:27,920
UNT's projection of 2025 having a population of 45,000

4633
03:37:27,920 --> 03:37:29,319
students their

4634
03:37:29,319 --> 03:37:35,000
master plan says they're going to house 9,600 and 83 53 of

4635
03:37:35,000 --> 03:37:36,280
those students

4636
03:37:36,280 --> 03:37:41,840
basically that leaves 35,000 students unhoused if we assume

4637
03:37:41,840 --> 03:37:43,079
that 60% of those

4638
03:37:43,079 --> 03:37:46,760
will live in the area and the other 40% will commute that's

4639
03:37:46,760 --> 03:37:49,040
21,200 beds but

4640
03:37:49,040 --> 03:37:53,319
that's still generating 28,000 trips per day and commuters

4641
03:37:53,319 --> 03:37:54,479
coming into the area

4642
03:37:54,479 --> 03:38:00,549
to attend UNT if that entire area was owned in our four and

4643
03:38:00,549 --> 03:38:01,840
all the students

4644
03:38:01,840 --> 03:38:08,709
rented houses it would require 1,325 acres of NR for to

4645
03:38:08,709 --> 03:38:09,479
accommodate those

4646
03:38:09,479 --> 03:38:12,649
students I think that helps explain why there's the high

4647
03:38:12,649 --> 03:38:13,600
pressure the high

4648
03:38:13,600 --> 03:38:17,600
demand for student rentals in that area that seemed like a

4649
03:38:17,600 --> 03:38:19,000
fast ten minutes I

4650
03:38:19,000 --> 03:38:25,340
'm sorry that's I want to honor that okay you know if it was

4651
03:38:25,340 --> 03:38:28,360
all dr2 with the

4652
03:38:28,360 --> 03:38:31,860
two-story type apartments it would take 440 acres to

4653
03:38:31,860 --> 03:38:33,319
accommodate those same

4654
03:38:33,319 --> 03:38:37,790
number of students DCG with 150 units per acre which is

4655
03:38:37,790 --> 03:38:40,040
what we're asking for it

4656
03:38:40,040 --> 03:38:45,239
would take 88 acres what we're proposing in our 620 beds it

4657
03:38:45,239 --> 03:38:46,479
would take about 120

4658
03:38:46,479 --> 03:38:48,750
acres to accommodate all those and those are just for

4659
03:38:48,750 --> 03:38:49,959
perspective you got to look

4660
03:38:49,959 --> 03:38:52,590
at other things like what's already out there and and how

4661
03:38:52,590 --> 03:38:53,600
it's going to change

4662
03:38:53,600 --> 03:38:57,739
around but there would be some overlap but we are trying to

4663
03:38:57,739 --> 03:38:58,959
meet some of the

4664
03:38:58,959 --> 03:39:02,250
university needs there reduces the number of commuters yeah

4665
03:39:02,250 --> 03:39:02,680
we're gonna

4666
03:39:02,680 --> 03:39:07,840
take our 28,000 down to 27,600 you know it's not gonna make

4667
03:39:07,840 --> 03:39:08,520
a huge difference

4668
03:39:08,520 --> 03:39:12,430
we're not asking for any public assistance there's some

4669
03:39:12,430 --> 03:39:13,680
crime issues

4670
03:39:13,680 --> 03:39:17,170
around the building right now with vagrants entitlement

4671
03:39:17,170 --> 03:39:18,159
allows for 100

4672
03:39:18,159 --> 03:39:21,989
foot we're looking at 68 parking meeting code wrapped

4673
03:39:21,989 --> 03:39:23,879
garage etc we looked at

4674
03:39:23,879 --> 03:39:27,459
the existing don't zoning the city's only documents tell us

4675
03:39:27,459 --> 03:39:28,319
this is a good

4676
03:39:28,319 --> 03:39:31,989
place to put this facility we looked at the Denton plan

4677
03:39:31,989 --> 03:39:34,200
2030 it says that that's

4678
03:39:34,200 --> 03:39:36,719
what's supposed to be going here we looked at the Denton

4679
03:39:36,719 --> 03:39:37,799
development code and

4680
03:39:37,799 --> 03:39:40,209
we looked at the residential setbacks and other things to

4681
03:39:40,209 --> 03:39:41,040
see what we can put

4682
03:39:41,040 --> 03:39:43,829
in there we looked at the didn't criteria manuals we're

4683
03:39:43,829 --> 03:39:44,760
exceeding some of

4684
03:39:44,760 --> 03:39:47,629
the requirements as far as some of the setbacks we've

4685
03:39:47,629 --> 03:39:48,799
looked at historical

4686
03:39:48,799 --> 03:39:52,229
districts and landmarks and stayed a decent distance away

4687
03:39:52,229 --> 03:39:53,399
from those this the

4688
03:39:53,399 --> 03:39:57,600
zoning allows for all that we went through the UNT master

4689
03:39:57,600 --> 03:39:59,680
plan in detail to

4690
03:39:59,680 --> 03:40:02,979
see how we would work together with them in that area and I

4691
03:40:02,979 --> 03:40:04,079
agree the city of

4692
03:40:04,079 --> 03:40:07,049
Denton is not responsible to provide housing for UNT

4693
03:40:07,049 --> 03:40:08,559
students on the other

4694
03:40:08,559 --> 03:40:12,549
hand the UNT students are there UNT is the gorilla in the

4695
03:40:12,549 --> 03:40:14,399
room and that demand

4696
03:40:14,399 --> 03:40:17,829
for for housing is going to be there the demand for parking

4697
03:40:17,829 --> 03:40:19,000
and the demand for

4698
03:40:19,000 --> 03:40:22,360
transportation it's all going to be there regardless the

4699
03:40:22,360 --> 03:40:23,239
question is are

4700
03:40:23,239 --> 03:40:25,120
they going to live there are they going to commute there

4701
03:40:25,120 --> 03:40:25,760
are they going to live

4702
03:40:25,760 --> 03:40:29,520
in houses over 500 acres or more they're going to live in

4703
03:40:29,520 --> 03:40:31,399
apartments over 50 to

4704
03:40:31,399 --> 03:40:35,030
100 acres or 200 acres and that's the kind of planning that

4705
03:40:35,030 --> 03:40:36,120
the city has to

4706
03:40:36,120 --> 03:40:39,360
grapple with I just get to come up here and challenge you

4707
03:40:39,360 --> 03:40:40,479
with it all that's a

4708
03:40:40,479 --> 03:40:44,680
little easier we did do the TIA as far as running the

4709
03:40:44,680 --> 03:40:47,319
numbers there's not any

4710
03:40:47,319 --> 03:40:51,280
curves in the transportation of Institute of Transportation

4711
03:40:51,280 --> 03:40:51,879
Engineers

4712
03:40:51,879 --> 03:40:55,040
manual so we went out and found some independent studies

4713
03:40:55,040 --> 03:40:56,079
that had been done

4714
03:40:56,079 --> 03:41:02,459
on apartments we show for our side is we're proposing it we

4715
03:41:02,459 --> 03:41:03,840
do not trigger the

4716
03:41:03,840 --> 03:41:06,250
requirements for a TIA but we're still going to do one

4717
03:41:06,250 --> 03:41:07,399
anyway when we get into

4718
03:41:07,399 --> 03:41:12,479
the planning process we presented that report to the city

4719
03:41:12,479 --> 03:41:13,399
and the staff went

4720
03:41:13,399 --> 03:41:16,600
out and ran some traffic council an existing apartment

4721
03:41:16,600 --> 03:41:17,600
complex of student

4722
03:41:17,600 --> 03:41:20,549
housing and found that our studies were in line with what

4723
03:41:20,549 --> 03:41:21,639
they're finding in

4724
03:41:21,639 --> 03:41:26,610
the in the local areas we found a number of studies that

4725
03:41:26,610 --> 03:41:27,280
show if you're within

4726
03:41:27,280 --> 03:41:30,520
walking distance of a university that student housing

4727
03:41:30,520 --> 03:41:31,920
typically parks about

4728
03:41:31,920 --> 03:41:36,959
70% of the number of bedrooms if you're within public

4729
03:41:36,959 --> 03:41:38,239
transportation is within

4730
03:41:38,239 --> 03:41:41,770
about 80% 85 and as you get away from all of that you

4731
03:41:41,770 --> 03:41:42,760
probably needing to be

4732
03:41:42,760 --> 03:41:46,930
on a one-to-one we're still following the code and this

4733
03:41:46,930 --> 03:41:48,520
will be quoted parked

4734
03:41:48,520 --> 03:41:52,659
essentially at the one-to-one this shows the surrounding

4735
03:41:52,659 --> 03:41:54,040
area and what the uses

4736
03:41:54,040 --> 03:41:58,680
are by the type we've got businesses we got houses in

4737
03:41:58,680 --> 03:41:59,799
yellow that have been

4738
03:41:59,799 --> 03:42:03,040
converted to businesses we've got existing apartments in

4739
03:42:03,040 --> 03:42:03,840
the area that may

4740
03:42:03,840 --> 03:42:07,510
explain why the type of zoning that's in this area mr. Rose

4741
03:42:07,510 --> 03:42:08,600
lle is and how it got

4742
03:42:08,600 --> 03:42:14,059
there blue houses are single-family we did find one house

4743
03:42:14,059 --> 03:42:14,959
we say it's owner

4744
03:42:14,959 --> 03:42:18,790
occupied and that's because we saw that they have a homest

4745
03:42:18,790 --> 03:42:19,840
ead exemption and a

4746
03:42:19,840 --> 03:42:24,170
vacant lot that's the real ten minutes all right we're out

4747
03:42:24,170 --> 03:42:25,239
of here appreciate

4748
03:42:25,239 --> 03:42:27,639
it thank you very much some questions for you yes

4749
03:42:27,639 --> 03:42:33,719
Commissioner back here in response to your statement about

4750
03:42:33,719 --> 03:42:35,239
expectation student

4751
03:42:35,239 --> 03:42:38,850
population growth I understand that I'm not one to you know

4752
03:42:38,850 --> 03:42:40,040
put a roadblock up

4753
03:42:40,040 --> 03:42:43,270
for growth but the fact that the expectation is there doesn

4754
03:42:43,270 --> 03:42:43,840
't mean we

4755
03:42:43,840 --> 03:42:47,399
have to meet it at the highest level we control growth and

4756
03:42:47,399 --> 03:42:48,600
we should control

4757
03:42:48,600 --> 03:42:51,540
growth we won't set the city of Denton to grow but we want

4758
03:42:51,540 --> 03:42:52,520
to go to steady rate

4759
03:42:52,520 --> 03:42:56,030
and we wanted to grow in ways that negatively impact

4760
03:42:56,030 --> 03:42:57,520
important areas like

4761
03:42:57,520 --> 03:43:05,510
this neighborhood north of UNT you mentioned that city

4762
03:43:05,510 --> 03:43:07,200
future land use map

4763
03:43:07,200 --> 03:43:09,370
and everything indicate this was a good place to build but

4764
03:43:09,370 --> 03:43:10,319
I would just bring up

4765
03:43:10,319 --> 03:43:14,000
the point that maybe we should discuss in more detail that

4766
03:43:14,000 --> 03:43:15,280
this attraction to

4767
03:43:15,280 --> 03:43:19,180
this area is partly due to the fact that this DCG

4768
03:43:19,180 --> 03:43:22,719
designation along Scripture was

4769
03:43:22,719 --> 03:43:27,879
part of some city planning back in part of city back in

4770
03:43:27,879 --> 03:43:30,920
2002 and for the life of

4771
03:43:30,920 --> 03:43:34,309
me I can't understand why they thought DCG would be

4772
03:43:34,309 --> 03:43:36,159
appropriate there I don't

4773
03:43:36,159 --> 03:43:39,319
think everybody fully understood what that entailed now

4774
03:43:39,319 --> 03:43:40,639
Commissioner Taylor and

4775
03:43:40,639 --> 03:43:44,319
I talked briefly he thinks he understands why that was put

4776
03:43:44,319 --> 03:43:45,000
there and

4777
03:43:45,000 --> 03:43:48,540
I'd be glad for him to share that but that was probably a

4778
03:43:48,540 --> 03:43:49,760
mistake and that's

4779
03:43:49,760 --> 03:43:52,920
maybe neither here there but it maybe is something that we

4780
03:43:52,920 --> 03:43:54,079
need to revisit

4781
03:43:54,079 --> 03:43:58,510
depending on where this goes and why they never considered

4782
03:43:58,510 --> 03:43:59,399
to put it back to

4783
03:43:59,399 --> 03:44:02,229
DR - I don't know but that's part of the reason why this

4784
03:44:02,229 --> 03:44:03,719
particular area has a

4785
03:44:03,719 --> 03:44:06,329
certain pill for you because you've got a foothold in there

4786
03:44:06,329 --> 03:44:07,360
with that DCG so

4787
03:44:07,360 --> 03:44:11,389
again you guys build a great product I'm always pleased

4788
03:44:11,389 --> 03:44:12,879
when you come up and

4789
03:44:12,879 --> 03:44:14,760
present your stuff and you've done a lot of great things

4790
03:44:14,760 --> 03:44:16,079
around the city but the

4791
03:44:16,079 --> 03:44:19,370
bottom line it just there's areas where you should build

4792
03:44:19,370 --> 03:44:20,079
this and there's areas

4793
03:44:20,079 --> 03:44:22,459
where you shouldn't and this is just one of them in my

4794
03:44:22,459 --> 03:44:23,319
opinion it should

4795
03:44:23,319 --> 03:44:25,930
I understand what you're saying and that's why you're there

4796
03:44:25,930 --> 03:44:26,520
and I'm here

4797
03:44:26,520 --> 03:44:30,729
and I'd also suggest related to that one of the issues in

4798
03:44:30,729 --> 03:44:32,280
finding sites is

4799
03:44:32,280 --> 03:44:36,479
concrete city is zone DR - who wants to go and redevelop

4800
03:44:36,479 --> 03:44:37,680
concrete city from two

4801
03:44:37,680 --> 03:44:41,020
story apartments to higher density when the density zoning

4802
03:44:41,020 --> 03:44:42,200
is not there yet so

4803
03:44:42,200 --> 03:44:46,959
well it's possible the Commission may be more receptive to

4804
03:44:46,959 --> 03:44:48,760
rezoning that area to

4805
03:44:48,760 --> 03:44:51,760
the city so

4806
03:44:52,360 --> 03:44:57,280
thank you any other questions for the applicant

4807
03:44:57,280 --> 03:45:01,709
all right Commissioner Husbeth well I have another are

4808
03:45:01,709 --> 03:45:03,360
there more cards to

4809
03:45:03,360 --> 03:45:09,479
speak we haven't started yet then I'm gonna I'm gonna take

4810
03:45:09,479 --> 03:45:10,639
notes and then I

4811
03:45:10,639 --> 03:45:16,040
ask you back up but and I'll if I may thank you chair

4812
03:45:16,040 --> 03:45:19,200
continue I think when I

4813
03:45:19,200 --> 03:45:26,719
listen to the citizens speak and I take in your perspective

4814
03:45:26,719 --> 03:45:28,159
really what I have

4815
03:45:28,159 --> 03:45:31,479
to reconcile and what I'm gonna ask you afterwards is this

4816
03:45:31,479 --> 03:45:33,280
how do you how are

4817
03:45:33,280 --> 03:45:38,319
you if you counterbalance the neighborhood wants certain

4818
03:45:38,319 --> 03:45:39,079
things that

4819
03:45:39,079 --> 03:45:43,370
don't fit your business plan right so we have there's there

4820
03:45:43,370 --> 03:45:46,200
's an impasse how do

4821
03:45:46,200 --> 03:45:49,139
you how do I know how to process that but I want to I'm

4822
03:45:49,139 --> 03:45:50,360
gonna ask you how you

4823
03:45:50,360 --> 03:45:54,040
process that how do you get to where you where you are I

4824
03:45:54,040 --> 03:45:55,959
don't think I think

4825
03:45:55,959 --> 03:46:00,319
there's some real challenges with that on the edge of a

4826
03:46:00,319 --> 03:46:01,120
transit transitional

4827
03:46:01,120 --> 03:46:03,549
district and so I'll just I'm just giving you time to think

4828
03:46:03,549 --> 03:46:05,079
as they speak I

4829
03:46:05,079 --> 03:46:11,229
personally have to weigh their concerns and yours and the

4830
03:46:11,229 --> 03:46:13,159
rights but I and I'll

4831
03:46:13,159 --> 03:46:19,229
tell you I'm biased with respect to the the narrative and

4832
03:46:19,229 --> 03:46:21,280
that I will ask you

4833
03:46:21,280 --> 03:46:27,059
about the if then if this than that that you that's in your

4834
03:46:27,059 --> 03:46:27,639
narrative I've never

4835
03:46:27,639 --> 03:46:30,840
seen that before and I don't I mean it rubs me different

4836
03:46:30,840 --> 03:46:32,399
and so I'll ask you

4837
03:46:32,399 --> 03:46:34,889
about that but I want to I want to hear what the citizens

4838
03:46:34,889 --> 03:46:35,959
in the neighborhood

4839
03:46:35,959 --> 03:46:38,840
have to say but but I wanted to give you a head start so

4840
03:46:38,840 --> 03:46:39,299
that I'm not not

4841
03:46:39,299 --> 03:46:42,659
blindside we'll be here tonight we're not going away sure

4842
03:46:42,659 --> 03:46:43,280
some of that I'll

4843
03:46:43,280 --> 03:46:46,200
have to refer to Paul but sure we'll get your questions and

4844
03:46:46,200 --> 03:46:46,760
appreciate it

4845
03:46:46,760 --> 03:46:49,920
thank you sir anything else and see none thank you I thank

4846
03:46:49,920 --> 03:46:51,620
you and this is a

4847
03:46:51,620 --> 03:46:55,159
public hearing I've got a number of cards requesting to

4848
03:46:55,159 --> 03:46:56,420
speak first of which

4849
03:46:56,420 --> 03:47:00,360
is Mary Anderson at 924 West Oak if you'll state your name

4850
03:47:00,360 --> 03:47:02,120
address and

4851
03:47:02,120 --> 03:47:06,260
thank you all for being here again and your cards marked in

4852
03:47:06,260 --> 03:47:06,840
opposition you know

4853
03:47:06,840 --> 03:47:10,370
yes Mary Anderson as you said 924 West Oak there are so

4854
03:47:10,370 --> 03:47:11,239
many things wrong with

4855
03:47:11,239 --> 03:47:17,309
this I'm not sure where to start what is D CG zoning is

4856
03:47:17,309 --> 03:47:18,680
that multifamily this is

4857
03:47:18,680 --> 03:47:21,920
an SRO it is not a multifamily operation so that's already

4858
03:47:21,920 --> 03:47:25,020
wrong the

4859
03:47:25,020 --> 03:47:27,430
traffic is horrible the roads are way too small to handle

4860
03:47:27,430 --> 03:47:28,340
all these units and

4861
03:47:28,340 --> 03:47:32,030
I hear words but no data I don't see real hard references

4862
03:47:32,030 --> 03:47:33,440
about parking well

4863
03:47:33,440 --> 03:47:35,709
the cars got to get there and they got to get out this

4864
03:47:35,709 --> 03:47:37,879
overlays a very close to

4865
03:47:37,879 --> 03:47:40,680
Oak Street which nobody bothers to show that Denton

4866
03:47:40,680 --> 03:47:42,040
Regional or whatever it's

4867
03:47:42,040 --> 03:47:45,209
currently called now no Denton Presby is on the ambulance

4868
03:47:45,209 --> 03:47:46,280
route while you guys

4869
03:47:46,280 --> 03:47:48,899
were talking on something else I was outside hearing six

4870
03:47:48,899 --> 03:47:49,959
fire trucks go up

4871
03:47:49,959 --> 03:47:52,540
Oak Street texting my husband is everything there no they

4872
03:47:52,540 --> 03:47:53,079
're going past

4873
03:47:53,079 --> 03:47:55,649
they're gonna roll right past there how are the ambulances

4874
03:47:55,649 --> 03:47:56,600
and fire trucks gonna

4875
03:47:56,600 --> 03:47:59,229
get to any of these buildings this is a real safety issue

4876
03:47:59,229 --> 03:48:00,079
the roads on Oak

4877
03:48:00,079 --> 03:48:03,420
Hickory and scripture have you been down them lately oh my

4878
03:48:03,420 --> 03:48:04,399
gosh I don't want to

4879
03:48:04,399 --> 03:48:08,680
start it's horrible what are 229 units they are not

4880
03:48:08,680 --> 03:48:10,100
apartments they are not

4881
03:48:10,100 --> 03:48:14,319
family places they are transient places where eventually

4882
03:48:14,319 --> 03:48:15,399
homeless they live and

4883
03:48:15,399 --> 03:48:20,040
I hope we find places for them to live I don't know what is

4884
03:48:20,040 --> 03:48:21,559
about anybody having

4885
03:48:21,559 --> 03:48:23,760
a community meeting I never got notice of a community

4886
03:48:23,760 --> 03:48:24,719
meeting when was this

4887
03:48:24,719 --> 03:48:28,829
nobody sent it around to the community who was this and

4888
03:48:28,829 --> 03:48:30,280
walking around those

4889
03:48:30,280 --> 03:48:32,690
none of those ever got to me I'd be there telling you this

4890
03:48:32,690 --> 03:48:33,479
is kind of crazy

4891
03:48:33,479 --> 03:48:37,579
and finally I looked at what the applicant has here or

4892
03:48:37,579 --> 03:48:38,600
close to finally

4893
03:48:38,600 --> 03:48:42,879
it says that the applicant is beta mu somebody's name Paul

4894
03:48:42,879 --> 03:48:44,159
Levine says he's

4895
03:48:44,159 --> 03:48:47,280
the owner is D the applicant isn't this all mute I mean he

4896
03:48:47,280 --> 03:48:48,760
's not the person that

4897
03:48:48,760 --> 03:48:51,159
actually asked for this so why are we listening to Paul Lev

4898
03:48:51,159 --> 03:48:51,840
ine if beta mu is

4899
03:48:51,840 --> 03:48:56,600
doing the request one of my questions and frankly can we

4900
03:48:56,600 --> 03:48:57,600
send carpet baggers

4901
03:48:57,600 --> 03:49:00,379
going away from my neighborhood they don't want this in

4902
03:49:00,379 --> 03:49:01,399
your neighborhood you

4903
03:49:01,399 --> 03:49:03,209
don't want them building 10-story buildings in your

4904
03:49:03,209 --> 03:49:04,000
neighborhood please

4905
03:49:04,000 --> 03:49:06,799
give us a little respect treat us right thank you mr. Beck

4906
03:49:06,799 --> 03:49:07,799
we need a little bit

4907
03:49:07,799 --> 03:49:10,959
of respect before you come in say oh we're just gonna throw

4908
03:49:10,959 --> 03:49:11,920
this up there's

4909
03:49:11,920 --> 03:49:15,750
services of water sewer all downhill you know you can build

4910
03:49:15,750 --> 03:49:16,600
it you just want to

4911
03:49:16,600 --> 03:49:24,940
be greedy no carpet baggers thank you Randy hunt 722 West

4912
03:49:24,940 --> 03:49:25,920
Oak to be followed

4913
03:49:25,920 --> 03:49:29,399
by John Warren

4914
03:49:46,600 --> 03:49:55,399
so I wanted to follow up with a sorry I'm Randy hunt 722

4915
03:49:55,399 --> 03:49:58,000
West Oak and there's

4916
03:49:58,000 --> 03:50:01,159
probably at least 10 more people it should be here but they

4917
03:50:01,159 --> 03:50:02,079
're all sick like

4918
03:50:02,079 --> 03:50:07,260
I am but we're toughening out because we respect a

4919
03:50:07,260 --> 03:50:08,760
neighborhood and we

4920
03:50:08,760 --> 03:50:12,530
appreciate the fact that y'all do too so you asked me a

4921
03:50:12,530 --> 03:50:14,280
good question last time

4922
03:50:14,280 --> 03:50:17,159
and the question was when was the last time you talked with

4923
03:50:17,159 --> 03:50:18,079
the Texas Historic

4924
03:50:18,079 --> 03:50:22,069
Commission why I can give you an update I did on Monday and

4925
03:50:22,069 --> 03:50:23,600
what I found out is

4926
03:50:23,600 --> 03:50:28,030
that they've given us staff approval for us to have a

4927
03:50:28,030 --> 03:50:29,600
National Register District

4928
03:50:29,600 --> 03:50:34,090
with about 350 structures in it so the map that we're

4929
03:50:34,090 --> 03:50:37,520
showing right here

4930
03:50:40,399 --> 03:50:45,540
this is around Calhoun and this is the area that we're

4931
03:50:45,540 --> 03:50:48,000
talking about right now

4932
03:50:48,000 --> 03:50:52,709
now I don't know why in the world this area between our

4933
03:50:52,709 --> 03:50:54,860
historic district and

4934
03:50:54,860 --> 03:50:58,899
the West Oak Historic District was written off we can't

4935
03:50:58,899 --> 03:51:00,959
allow that I want

4936
03:51:00,959 --> 03:51:06,120
to show you a map of what it didn't look like in 1917

4937
03:51:06,120 --> 03:51:10,159
hundred years ago so here

4938
03:51:10,159 --> 03:51:16,639
it is and this is our core this is our culture this is why

4939
03:51:16,639 --> 03:51:17,600
people come to

4940
03:51:17,600 --> 03:51:22,979
Denton this is why they're proud of it this is our downtown

4941
03:51:22,979 --> 03:51:25,200
core area and these

4942
03:51:25,200 --> 03:51:31,270
jokers want to put a 10-story structure in it oh this is a

4943
03:51:31,270 --> 03:51:33,639
residential area has

4944
03:51:33,639 --> 03:51:37,090
been for over a hundred years and we need to respect that

4945
03:51:37,090 --> 03:51:38,360
that's a residential

4946
03:51:38,360 --> 03:51:46,239
area now you know I hear this argument about the you know

4947
03:51:46,239 --> 03:51:47,520
they can't make money

4948
03:51:47,520 --> 03:51:52,479
on it well you know what I you asked a good question last

4949
03:51:52,479 --> 03:51:53,840
time you asked about

4950
03:51:53,840 --> 03:51:58,549
compromises I would compromise and have the Med Park people

4951
03:51:58,549 --> 03:51:59,399
put something in

4952
03:51:59,399 --> 03:52:07,629
over here but you know when when there was a public meeting

4953
03:52:07,629 --> 03:52:09,760
per se that these

4954
03:52:09,760 --> 03:52:15,149
guys called it wasn't a city called meeting one of the

4955
03:52:15,149 --> 03:52:16,399
people that was there

4956
03:52:16,399 --> 03:52:20,840
lives in the area his name is Craig Clifton he's in the

4957
03:52:20,840 --> 03:52:21,840
hospital right now

4958
03:52:21,840 --> 03:52:26,520
but he was told well you know if you don't like this we'll

4959
03:52:26,520 --> 03:52:28,000
just put seven to

4960
03:52:28,000 --> 03:52:34,520
ten stories there so I would say to y'all fine if that's

4961
03:52:34,520 --> 03:52:35,200
what they want to

4962
03:52:35,200 --> 03:52:41,860
try to do let them but respect our neighborhood and give us

4963
03:52:41,860 --> 03:52:43,420
a chance to

4964
03:52:43,420 --> 03:52:48,000
create a national register district over here so I asked

4965
03:52:48,000 --> 03:52:49,479
the Texas Historic

4966
03:52:49,479 --> 03:52:53,680
Commission as well as another state agency what would

4967
03:52:53,680 --> 03:52:55,360
happen if if there was

4968
03:52:55,360 --> 03:52:59,010
a structure there and they say you ever been to around

4969
03:52:59,010 --> 03:53:00,360
Texas Tech you ever been

4970
03:53:00,360 --> 03:53:05,069
to Lubbock it said you know why would the people and didn't

4971
03:53:05,069 --> 03:53:05,840
want to write off

4972
03:53:05,840 --> 03:53:09,959
a neighborhood like that so that's what we're up against

4973
03:53:09,959 --> 03:53:12,280
and you know there is

4974
03:53:12,280 --> 03:53:16,469
no compromise that's what you're hearing and I would dare

4975
03:53:16,469 --> 03:53:17,680
venture to you that the

4976
03:53:17,680 --> 03:53:21,989
reason that Lee asked for a two-week delay is because he

4977
03:53:21,989 --> 03:53:23,440
was doing an AMA

4978
03:53:23,440 --> 03:53:29,479
visit you know management style and he went around to talk

4979
03:53:29,479 --> 03:53:30,479
to city council

4980
03:53:30,479 --> 03:53:34,379
members to see if he could get their support that's not

4981
03:53:34,379 --> 03:53:36,600
compromise that's

4982
03:53:36,600 --> 03:53:42,700
manipulation we need to protect a historic area that's been

4983
03:53:42,700 --> 03:53:43,360
there for over

4984
03:53:43,360 --> 03:53:47,530
a hundred years this was the area that was built up by the

4985
03:53:47,530 --> 03:53:49,280
by the faculty that

4986
03:53:49,280 --> 03:53:55,680
started the North Texas Normal College give us a chance

4987
03:53:55,680 --> 03:53:57,000
thank you have a

4988
03:53:57,000 --> 03:54:00,639
question for you Commissioner Beck thank you chair

4989
03:54:00,639 --> 03:54:05,860
thanks for your presentation you do so eloquently would you

4990
03:54:05,860 --> 03:54:07,440
be opposed you

4991
03:54:07,440 --> 03:54:10,770
mentioned that either voted up or voted down but if we

4992
03:54:10,770 --> 03:54:12,360
voted down then it runs

4993
03:54:12,360 --> 03:54:15,540
the risk of them bringing in that ten foot would you be

4994
03:54:15,540 --> 03:54:16,760
opposed to the idea

4995
03:54:16,760 --> 03:54:21,600
of this this overlay district that I suggested to keep it

4996
03:54:21,600 --> 03:54:23,520
from exceeding

4997
03:54:23,520 --> 03:54:27,329
certain limits I would propose heights that wouldn't go

4998
03:54:27,329 --> 03:54:28,840
beyond three stories

4999
03:54:28,840 --> 03:54:32,440
lower densities more closely related to what DR2 is would

5000
03:54:32,440 --> 03:54:33,520
you be opposed to

5001
03:54:33,520 --> 03:54:37,000
something like that no I'm all about compromise okay you

5002
03:54:37,000 --> 03:54:37,879
know we don't have

5003
03:54:37,879 --> 03:54:42,239
to have it a particular way but make it look like the rest

5004
03:54:42,239 --> 03:54:42,739
you know there's

5005
03:54:42,739 --> 03:54:46,250
already a three-story structure there that was on you know

5006
03:54:46,250 --> 03:54:47,040
the old flow

5007
03:54:47,040 --> 03:54:52,159
hospital three stories okay because we want to think

5008
03:54:52,159 --> 03:54:53,559
ultimately the idea here

5009
03:54:53,559 --> 03:54:58,049
is to protect this area long term and not exactly right you

5010
03:54:58,049 --> 03:54:58,879
know what we all

5011
03:54:58,879 --> 03:55:02,809
saw from Med Park that was three stories these guys want to

5012
03:55:02,809 --> 03:55:04,120
say it has to be

5013
03:55:04,120 --> 03:55:09,680
their way or the highway I'm saying go hit the highway okay

5014
03:55:09,680 --> 03:55:11,159
thank you sir

5015
03:55:11,159 --> 03:55:15,969
another couple questions for you Commissioner Roselle thank

5016
03:55:15,969 --> 03:55:16,879
you sir thank

5017
03:55:16,879 --> 03:55:19,299
you mr. Hahn for your presentation I wasn't here last

5018
03:55:19,299 --> 03:55:20,200
meeting and maybe I

5019
03:55:20,200 --> 03:55:23,200
missed this what are the dots represent those are

5020
03:55:23,200 --> 03:55:24,319
structures that were already

5021
03:55:24,319 --> 03:55:29,520
identified by the Texas Historic Commission as contributing

5022
03:55:29,520 --> 03:55:30,680
houses so all

5023
03:55:30,680 --> 03:55:34,090
of those black dots are things that make an area

5024
03:55:34,090 --> 03:55:36,319
contributing so to get a

5025
03:55:36,319 --> 03:55:39,739
national register area you have to have at least 50% of all

5026
03:55:39,739 --> 03:55:40,659
the structures

5027
03:55:40,659 --> 03:55:46,000
within an area to be contributing you know to have

5028
03:55:46,000 --> 03:55:47,600
integrity of how it looked

5029
03:55:47,600 --> 03:55:51,459
like when it was first built okay so it looks like on the

5030
03:55:51,459 --> 03:55:53,040
block and in question

5031
03:55:53,040 --> 03:55:56,799
between normal Brian between oak and scripture you have 14

5032
03:55:56,799 --> 03:55:57,600
contributing

5033
03:55:57,600 --> 03:56:02,639
structures I see nine multifamily complexes and some of

5034
03:56:02,639 --> 03:56:03,239
these dots that

5035
03:56:03,239 --> 03:56:07,170
you have listed here are in fact look like multi-story

5036
03:56:07,170 --> 03:56:09,239
building some it was is

5037
03:56:09,239 --> 03:56:14,239
this recent or these apartments this was back in 1995 these

5038
03:56:14,239 --> 03:56:15,319
dogs are was in 95

5039
03:56:15,319 --> 03:56:18,879
when the survey was done okay and the survey hasn't been

5040
03:56:18,879 --> 03:56:19,959
updated that's what

5041
03:56:19,959 --> 03:56:23,370
we're currently doing we're asking the Texas Historic

5042
03:56:23,370 --> 03:56:24,440
Commission would they

5043
03:56:24,440 --> 03:56:28,709
also consider this area as you know an extension of the

5044
03:56:28,709 --> 03:56:30,280
National Register

5045
03:56:30,280 --> 03:56:33,010
District that they've already approved by staff that we're

5046
03:56:33,010 --> 03:56:34,040
working on right now

5047
03:56:34,040 --> 03:56:37,870
and they're like if you get busy is the process once the

5048
03:56:37,870 --> 03:56:39,520
staff approves that at

5049
03:56:39,520 --> 03:56:42,000
Texas Store Commission will they resurvey this to see these

5050
03:56:42,000 --> 03:56:42,639
apartments or

5051
03:56:42,639 --> 03:56:45,799
what's the process do you know yeah we we have to go out

5052
03:56:45,799 --> 03:56:47,280
and do the footwork we

5053
03:56:47,280 --> 03:56:52,620
take pictures we we do the ownership we do the research for

5054
03:56:52,620 --> 03:56:53,959
it and then we let

5055
03:56:53,959 --> 03:56:57,299
the Texas Historic Commission define if it's contributing

5056
03:56:57,299 --> 03:56:58,399
or not and that has

5057
03:56:58,399 --> 03:57:01,959
not been done yet not for this area okay for the area on

5058
03:57:01,959 --> 03:57:03,520
that side of the green

5059
03:57:03,520 --> 03:57:07,520
line it all has there's about 350 structures in there okay

5060
03:57:07,520 --> 03:57:09,920
thank you

5061
03:57:10,760 --> 03:57:16,829
okay no more questions thank you John Warren to be followed

5062
03:57:16,829 --> 03:57:20,079
by Anita Ramsey

5063
03:57:20,079 --> 03:57:23,239
I'm John Warren I live with my wife and four children at 11

5064
03:57:23,239 --> 03:57:25,399
09 West Congress and

5065
03:57:25,399 --> 03:57:27,729
I think I originally put in opposition to this project I

5066
03:57:27,729 --> 03:57:28,719
still would probably

5067
03:57:28,719 --> 03:57:32,139
land there living in the neighborhood my primary concern

5068
03:57:32,139 --> 03:57:33,479
though more than what

5069
03:57:33,479 --> 03:57:37,729
the structure looks like because I feel like this this

5070
03:57:37,729 --> 03:57:39,520
portion of the peninsula

5071
03:57:39,520 --> 03:57:44,930
as mr. Ozel mentioned it it sort of was the historicity of

5072
03:57:44,930 --> 03:57:46,200
it sort of way by by

5073
03:57:46,200 --> 03:57:48,649
long ago when they were allowed to build all these

5074
03:57:48,649 --> 03:57:50,159
apartments on it I drove up

5075
03:57:50,159 --> 03:57:53,319
and down the streets today there's 18 apartment complexes

5076
03:57:53,319 --> 03:57:54,959
on between those two

5077
03:57:54,959 --> 03:57:58,579
streets and all the houses are just dwarfed by those

5078
03:57:58,579 --> 03:57:59,920
apartments and so

5079
03:57:59,920 --> 03:58:04,250
that's less of a concern to me the greater concern living

5080
03:58:04,250 --> 03:58:05,520
and and having a

5081
03:58:05,520 --> 03:58:09,600
family close to this prop this project is is the traffic

5082
03:58:09,600 --> 03:58:10,879
and I don't know what

5083
03:58:10,879 --> 03:58:14,840
PNZ has in terms of your decision-making regarding how you

5084
03:58:14,840 --> 03:58:15,719
think about the

5085
03:58:15,719 --> 03:58:18,530
traffic in the neighborhood but it's already terrible the

5086
03:58:18,530 --> 03:58:19,760
students will walk

5087
03:58:19,760 --> 03:58:22,940
to campus but they're gonna drive to Kroger which means

5088
03:58:22,940 --> 03:58:23,600
they're gonna drive

5089
03:58:23,600 --> 03:58:27,059
down scripture on to ponder and then on to my street where

5090
03:58:27,059 --> 03:58:27,879
there was a hit and

5091
03:58:27,879 --> 03:58:31,040
run last week and it happens consistently and so I don't

5092
03:58:31,040 --> 03:58:31,559
know how

5093
03:58:31,559 --> 03:58:36,059
that plays into again your guys's decision to rezone it but

5094
03:58:36,059 --> 03:58:36,479
that that

5095
03:58:36,479 --> 03:58:39,760
becomes my primary concern living in the neighborhood and I

5096
03:58:39,760 --> 03:58:40,799
just want to thank you

5097
03:58:40,799 --> 03:58:44,579
guys for your voluntary service I think sometimes we can be

5098
03:58:44,579 --> 03:58:47,399
pretty angry and

5099
03:58:47,399 --> 03:58:50,809
emotional in our presentations but you guys are voluntarily

5100
03:58:50,809 --> 03:58:51,799
giving your time

5101
03:58:51,799 --> 03:58:54,780
and so I think you're to be commended for that and we

5102
03:58:54,780 --> 03:58:56,600
should exercise restraint

5103
03:58:56,600 --> 03:58:59,760
and patience as we address you and so I appreciate what you

5104
03:58:59,760 --> 03:59:00,520
guys do thank you

5105
03:59:00,520 --> 03:59:04,639
thank you have a question for you Commissioner Hussbett so

5106
03:59:04,639 --> 03:59:06,040
John I'm gonna

5107
03:59:06,040 --> 03:59:09,959
use you as a case study okay right so if the size doesn't

5108
03:59:09,959 --> 03:59:11,520
bother you that that's

5109
03:59:11,520 --> 03:59:15,030
great but so the other apartments there because I've driven

5110
03:59:15,030 --> 03:59:15,879
it and best I can

5111
03:59:15,879 --> 03:59:19,420
tell they're about two two stories and again I forget we're

5112
03:59:19,420 --> 03:59:20,479
flow hospital that

5113
03:59:20,479 --> 03:59:24,809
might be three how do you when you when you're driving let

5114
03:59:24,809 --> 03:59:25,280
's say you're driving

5115
03:59:25,280 --> 03:59:27,750
up up scripture or whatever so that's uphill so that's kind

5116
03:59:27,750 --> 03:59:28,479
of different so

5117
03:59:28,479 --> 03:59:30,879
let's say we're leaving chopsticks going the other way yeah

5118
03:59:30,879 --> 03:59:33,239
I the fact that it

5119
03:59:33,239 --> 03:59:38,639
would double everything else for I mean it'll be like 10

5120
03:59:38,639 --> 03:59:41,319
miles I mean that I

5121
03:59:41,319 --> 03:59:45,180
mean I get I get the traffic thing but the aesthetics thing

5122
03:59:45,180 --> 03:59:46,280
doesn't really

5123
03:59:46,280 --> 03:59:49,879
affect you yeah well there's city park apartments right

5124
03:59:49,879 --> 03:59:51,319
across the street that

5125
03:59:51,319 --> 03:59:54,200
I mean this rendering is much more aesthetically beautiful

5126
03:59:54,200 --> 03:59:54,959
than City Park

5127
03:59:54,959 --> 03:59:59,190
that's this gigantic yellow stucco right monstrosity that's

5128
03:59:59,190 --> 04:00:00,239
across the street

5129
04:00:00,239 --> 04:00:04,159
from this so right this looks better to me than City Park

5130
04:00:04,159 --> 04:00:05,079
which is right next

5131
04:00:05,079 --> 04:00:10,440
door and much better than what's what's currently there I I

5132
04:00:10,440 --> 04:00:11,760
don't however love

5133
04:00:11,760 --> 04:00:14,920
the sort of veiled kind of threat I won't call it I mean

5134
04:00:14,920 --> 04:00:15,600
maybe that's not

5135
04:00:15,600 --> 04:00:18,120
what they're doing I'm with you that doesn't feel great it

5136
04:00:18,120 --> 04:00:18,840
's it's accurate

5137
04:00:18,840 --> 04:00:25,639
yeah okay thank you thank you sir

5138
04:00:25,639 --> 04:00:32,620
Annetta Ramsey to be followed by Patrice like my name is an

5139
04:00:32,620 --> 04:00:33,959
ad Ramsey I live at

5140
04:00:33,959 --> 04:00:38,559
722 West Oak Street I am opposed to another single

5141
04:00:38,559 --> 04:00:40,000
residence occupancy unit

5142
04:00:40,000 --> 04:00:46,069
in a historic neighborhood where the norm is one story I'm

5143
04:00:46,069 --> 04:00:47,440
concerned that

5144
04:00:47,440 --> 04:00:50,680
the compromise has been asked for and the only compromise

5145
04:00:50,680 --> 04:00:51,799
that's been offered

5146
04:00:51,799 --> 04:00:54,639
is you can have something you don't like or something you

5147
04:00:54,639 --> 04:00:56,479
really don't like that

5148
04:00:56,479 --> 04:01:04,000
is not compromise UNT and TWU have 45,000 students and not

5149
04:01:04,000 --> 04:01:04,559
all of those

5150
04:01:04,559 --> 04:01:09,360
students live in town many of them commute and they're

5151
04:01:09,360 --> 04:01:10,319
happy doing that many

5152
04:01:10,319 --> 04:01:14,200
of them commute with public transportation which is what I

5153
04:01:14,200 --> 04:01:14,719
did when I

5154
04:01:14,719 --> 04:01:17,879
first started graduate school many of these students are

5155
04:01:17,879 --> 04:01:18,920
graduate students

5156
04:01:18,920 --> 04:01:21,799
they're married they're not in a place where they would be

5157
04:01:21,799 --> 04:01:22,920
candidates for these

5158
04:01:22,920 --> 04:01:27,290
housing units but by the city's own estimate last year you

5159
04:01:27,290 --> 04:01:29,479
have 9,400 rent by

5160
04:01:29,479 --> 04:01:35,549
the room things and so if you do the math that's 20% of the

5161
04:01:35,549 --> 04:01:36,520
students I think

5162
04:01:36,520 --> 04:01:42,049
you're already pushing maximum density if this is a service

5163
04:01:42,049 --> 04:01:44,000
to UNT why is

5164
04:01:44,000 --> 04:01:48,040
UNT not speaking about that don't you think their silence

5165
04:01:48,040 --> 04:01:49,200
is kind of deafening

5166
04:01:49,200 --> 04:01:52,649
I do I think they would speak up if they thought it was a

5167
04:01:52,649 --> 04:01:54,799
good thing I have

5168
04:01:54,799 --> 04:02:01,250
spoken with them and I just I think that these units do not

5169
04:02:01,250 --> 04:02:03,120
do a good job for

5170
04:02:03,120 --> 04:02:06,350
students I work with a lot of college students and the

5171
04:02:06,350 --> 04:02:07,920
students that I work

5172
04:02:07,920 --> 04:02:11,780
with who were in residence halls make good grades and they

5173
04:02:11,780 --> 04:02:13,000
graduate on time

5174
04:02:13,000 --> 04:02:16,670
because they have a lot of support from the university the

5175
04:02:16,670 --> 04:02:17,799
students who live in

5176
04:02:17,799 --> 04:02:22,229
these units are in a party atmosphere the SRO units cannot

5177
04:02:22,229 --> 04:02:23,399
because of the

5178
04:02:23,399 --> 04:02:26,989
fair housing act turn people away because they're not UNT

5179
04:02:26,989 --> 04:02:27,879
or TW students

5180
04:02:27,879 --> 04:02:30,680
so they get some people in there who want a party and it's

5181
04:02:30,680 --> 04:02:31,959
not in their best

5182
04:02:31,959 --> 04:02:34,739
interest and so a lot of the students that I have worked

5183
04:02:34,739 --> 04:02:35,719
with have ended up

5184
04:02:35,719 --> 04:02:40,719
leaving UNT and going on to another university because they

5185
04:02:40,719 --> 04:02:42,520
failed out but I

5186
04:02:42,520 --> 04:02:46,590
hear a lot of awful stories and the most common one is

5187
04:02:46,590 --> 04:02:48,120
where a roommate decides

5188
04:02:48,120 --> 04:02:51,049
to move in a boyfriend or a girlfriend and nobody wants to

5189
04:02:51,049 --> 04:02:52,200
say anything because

5190
04:02:52,200 --> 04:02:55,360
they don't want any drama about that or someone gets a pet

5191
04:02:55,360 --> 04:02:56,399
and then they're

5192
04:02:56,399 --> 04:02:59,709
never around to care for the pet pet damages the property

5193
04:02:59,709 --> 04:03:00,840
and then all of the

5194
04:03:00,840 --> 04:03:04,250
roommates have to pay for it but the saddest story I heard

5195
04:03:04,250 --> 04:03:05,280
happened in City

5196
04:03:05,280 --> 04:03:10,159
Park and it was where a client got raped in her own bedroom

5197
04:03:10,159 --> 04:03:11,879
and it was some guy

5198
04:03:11,879 --> 04:03:15,319
who showed up at a party that her roommates threw they were

5199
04:03:15,319 --> 04:03:16,879
all underage he

5200
04:03:16,879 --> 04:03:20,799
had alcohol he was 21 so he brought alcohol to the party

5201
04:03:20,799 --> 04:03:21,719
they all got drunk

5202
04:03:21,719 --> 04:03:25,260
I think she got drugged he dragged her into her room and

5203
04:03:25,260 --> 04:03:28,920
raped her and her

5204
04:03:28,920 --> 04:03:31,649
roommate saw what was going on but they didn't want to call

5205
04:03:31,649 --> 04:03:32,600
the police because

5206
04:03:32,600 --> 04:03:36,719
they were drinking underage they were doing something bad

5207
04:03:36,719 --> 04:03:37,799
to be sure there are

5208
04:03:37,799 --> 04:03:41,829
some students who are happy in these units but they're very

5209
04:03:41,829 --> 04:03:42,799
expensive it's

5210
04:03:42,799 --> 04:03:46,110
eight hundred to a thousand dollars a room so it's not

5211
04:03:46,110 --> 04:03:47,079
cheap it's not

5212
04:03:47,079 --> 04:03:50,639
something that many families can afford I have two sons

5213
04:03:50,639 --> 04:03:52,159
they live at home they go

5214
04:03:52,159 --> 04:03:54,450
to UNT but they live at home and I think that there are a

5215
04:03:54,450 --> 04:03:55,920
lot of people like me

5216
04:03:55,920 --> 04:03:58,739
and Denton who want to get their kids out of college

5217
04:03:58,739 --> 04:04:00,479
without debt so I am

5218
04:04:00,479 --> 04:04:05,600
begging you please please do not let UNT encroach anymore I

5219
04:04:05,600 --> 04:04:06,680
love the university

5220
04:04:06,680 --> 04:04:09,879
but they've already encroached in every direction please

5221
04:04:09,879 --> 04:04:11,239
don't let them go north

5222
04:04:11,239 --> 04:04:15,319
thank you thank you

5223
04:04:16,440 --> 04:04:23,680
Patrice like we're lucky followed by Deb Armenter

5224
04:04:27,000 --> 04:04:31,479
I was after adjust okay I'm Patrice like 1109 Egan so I

5225
04:04:31,479 --> 04:04:32,440
live in the Pecan

5226
04:04:32,440 --> 04:04:36,209
neighborhood that is just right near the site that we're

5227
04:04:36,209 --> 04:04:38,280
talking about I first

5228
04:04:38,280 --> 04:04:42,600
have a question about the historical preservation officers

5229
04:04:42,600 --> 04:04:44,040
visit to this site

5230
04:04:44,040 --> 04:04:50,809
it's a question I guess for staff is this protocol for the

5231
04:04:50,809 --> 04:04:52,719
HPO to visit sites

5232
04:04:52,719 --> 04:04:59,569
and did our HPO indicate that this area has no historical

5233
04:04:59,569 --> 04:05:01,639
significance is like

5234
04:05:01,639 --> 04:05:04,969
our HPO is present and I will ask Roman to come down and

5235
04:05:04,969 --> 04:05:07,000
address his site visit

5236
04:05:07,000 --> 04:05:10,159
with the applicant and answer some of the questions that

5237
04:05:10,159 --> 04:05:11,479
you've just asked okay

5238
04:05:11,479 --> 04:05:15,159
I'll remember where my time was

5239
04:05:22,200 --> 04:05:24,329
thank you thank you for let me come up my name is Roman Mc

5240
04:05:24,329 --> 04:05:26,319
Allen I'm the

5241
04:05:26,319 --> 04:05:28,809
historic preservation officer for the city of Denton and

5242
04:05:28,809 --> 04:05:29,559
this is my first

5243
04:05:29,559 --> 04:05:33,690
opportunity to talk about this but I want to make sure I

5244
04:05:33,690 --> 04:05:35,280
just directly answer

5245
04:05:35,280 --> 04:05:41,350
your question on protocol I don't this is I try to be very

5246
04:05:41,350 --> 04:05:42,680
customer service

5247
04:05:42,680 --> 04:05:45,520
oriented when I work as a preservation officer for the city

5248
04:05:45,520 --> 04:05:46,360
I had the same role

5249
04:05:46,360 --> 04:05:51,319
the city of Brownsville and that I was just called to come

5250
04:05:51,319 --> 04:05:52,399
out and consider

5251
04:05:52,399 --> 04:05:55,340
this property and the project that was going on here and I

5252
04:05:55,340 --> 04:05:55,959
knew it was

5253
04:05:55,959 --> 04:05:59,309
situated between two historic districts and I knew was

5254
04:05:59,309 --> 04:06:00,680
surrounded by a lot of

5255
04:06:00,680 --> 04:06:06,079
historic resources that if if one were able to if we were

5256
04:06:06,079 --> 04:06:07,360
to move forward with

5257
04:06:07,360 --> 04:06:12,360
creating a historic district in this area that there were

5258
04:06:12,360 --> 04:06:13,559
potentially

5259
04:06:13,559 --> 04:06:16,079
contributing resources there so whenever I have the

5260
04:06:16,079 --> 04:06:19,159
opportunity really to get

5261
04:06:19,159 --> 04:06:23,340
involved early in anything and I to answer your question I

5262
04:06:23,340 --> 04:06:24,440
didn't say I

5263
04:06:24,440 --> 04:06:26,950
didn't support this and I think Lee will support me on this

5264
04:06:26,950 --> 04:06:27,760
I just walked around

5265
04:06:27,760 --> 04:06:30,729
with the architects and with them and pointed out what I

5266
04:06:30,729 --> 04:06:31,559
saw is contributing

5267
04:06:31,559 --> 04:06:36,420
for example there are two houses on this proposed site that

5268
04:06:36,420 --> 04:06:37,159
would be

5269
04:06:37,159 --> 04:06:39,719
contributing resources if there were a historic district

5270
04:06:39,719 --> 04:06:40,680
but you might have to

5271
04:06:40,680 --> 04:06:44,510
gerrymandered around the large number of apartment units

5272
04:06:44,510 --> 04:06:45,959
unless they're over 50

5273
04:06:45,959 --> 04:06:49,959
years of age and get into all that but I visited as just as

5274
04:06:49,959 --> 04:06:51,239
I always will with

5275
04:06:51,239 --> 04:06:54,770
anyone anyone in the city who calls me unless you know my

5276
04:06:54,770 --> 04:06:56,200
supervisor would say

5277
04:06:56,200 --> 04:06:59,950
don't do that or something I tend to just come out not pass

5278
04:06:59,950 --> 04:07:01,159
judgment but offer

5279
04:07:01,159 --> 04:07:05,190
my knowledge about preservation when that happens I don't

5280
04:07:05,190 --> 04:07:05,639
know question for

5281
04:07:05,639 --> 04:07:08,799
you Commissioner Rizzo thank you I appreciate you being

5282
04:07:08,799 --> 04:07:09,239
here I have one

5283
04:07:09,239 --> 04:07:13,760
question this site currently is vacant is to your

5284
04:07:13,760 --> 04:07:15,479
understanding correct and so it

5285
04:07:15,479 --> 04:07:19,209
doesn't contribute historically in any measurable way to

5286
04:07:19,209 --> 04:07:20,399
the neighborhood

5287
04:07:20,399 --> 04:07:27,170
currently well I'm sorry I mean no no that's part a well it

5288
04:07:27,170 --> 04:07:28,360
's its vacancy

5289
04:07:28,360 --> 04:07:32,969
doesn't make it non-contributing it's the building that's

5290
04:07:32,969 --> 04:07:35,280
there so and your

5291
04:07:35,280 --> 04:07:39,379
estimation is part B of this question is there any project

5292
04:07:39,379 --> 04:07:40,559
or development that

5293
04:07:40,559 --> 04:07:44,000
would contribute to an historical neighborhood if it's

5294
04:07:44,000 --> 04:07:45,479
built in 2017

5295
04:07:45,479 --> 04:07:49,239
meaning if we were to construct an old craftsman style home

5296
04:07:49,239 --> 04:07:50,319
would that in your

5297
04:07:50,319 --> 04:07:52,229
estimation now contribute to the historicity of the

5298
04:07:52,229 --> 04:07:53,840
neighborhood or is

5299
04:07:53,840 --> 04:07:57,079
there anything there that could increase the function of

5300
04:07:57,079 --> 04:07:59,719
that property well the

5301
04:07:59,719 --> 04:08:03,440
short answer is no you could build something that for

5302
04:08:03,440 --> 04:08:05,040
example in the other

5303
04:08:05,040 --> 04:08:08,430
three districts we have designed architectural guidelines

5304
04:08:08,430 --> 04:08:09,399
there so most of

5305
04:08:09,399 --> 04:08:13,260
our districts are almost completely full so if you look at

5306
04:08:13,260 --> 04:08:14,879
West Oak okay Korean

5307
04:08:14,879 --> 04:08:18,979
the Bell Avenue there aren't a lot of vacant lots there so

5308
04:08:18,979 --> 04:08:20,399
but there's still

5309
04:08:20,399 --> 04:08:23,819
architectural regulations in each of those districts and if

5310
04:08:23,819 --> 04:08:25,159
someone chose to

5311
04:08:25,159 --> 04:08:28,000
build in there they would have to comply with those

5312
04:08:28,000 --> 04:08:29,639
regulations and the landmark

5313
04:08:29,639 --> 04:08:32,469
Commission would consider the project and see if it fits in

5314
04:08:32,469 --> 04:08:33,200
well with the

5315
04:08:33,200 --> 04:08:36,700
district but that particular building that you build would

5316
04:08:36,700 --> 04:08:37,959
not be contributing

5317
04:08:37,959 --> 04:08:42,059
and it's just due to its being new typically though not

5318
04:08:42,059 --> 04:08:43,879
always 50 years is

5319
04:08:43,879 --> 04:08:46,639
the mark but you might have especially today with the

5320
04:08:46,639 --> 04:08:47,680
popularity and the

5321
04:08:47,680 --> 04:08:51,659
recognition of mid-century architecture where that line

5322
04:08:51,659 --> 04:08:53,200
moves along for example

5323
04:08:53,200 --> 04:08:56,360
here in Denton we have the so-called idiot seal area. More

5324
04:08:56,360 --> 04:08:56,959
question and I've been

5325
04:08:56,959 --> 04:08:59,450
tapped told we need to kind of move for this. Commissioner

5326
04:08:59,450 --> 04:09:00,799
back. Thank you chair

5327
04:09:00,799 --> 04:09:05,440
thank you Roman. What you evaluated was the specific

5328
04:09:05,440 --> 04:09:06,440
property that we're talking

5329
04:09:06,440 --> 04:09:09,879
about rezoning you didn't evaluate anything outside the

5330
04:09:09,879 --> 04:09:11,520
parameters of that

5331
04:09:11,520 --> 04:09:16,250
we walked the street and and we noted I think together but

5332
04:09:16,250 --> 04:09:17,319
I mean I was put it

5333
04:09:17,319 --> 04:09:20,260
mainly pointing out what would be a contributing building

5334
04:09:20,260 --> 04:09:21,000
if there were a

5335
04:09:21,000 --> 04:09:23,229
district buildings that obviously and anyone who goes down

5336
04:09:23,229 --> 04:09:24,000
the street can kind

5337
04:09:24,000 --> 04:09:26,829
of tell the the wooden structures with the double hung

5338
04:09:26,829 --> 04:09:28,079
windows or things like

5339
04:09:28,079 --> 04:09:31,950
that so we did point out on the facing streets there that

5340
04:09:31,950 --> 04:09:33,079
day we just walked

5341
04:09:33,079 --> 04:09:36,250
around the three sides of the property. So roughly in a say

5342
04:09:36,250 --> 04:09:37,040
two or three hundred

5343
04:09:37,040 --> 04:09:40,680
foot circumference of the area that might be historical

5344
04:09:40,680 --> 04:09:41,760
value to some of the

5345
04:09:41,760 --> 04:09:48,559
buildings there? Well yes. Okay okay thank you. No thank

5346
04:09:48,559 --> 04:09:49,600
you I have no further

5347
04:09:49,600 --> 04:09:52,299
questions appreciate it. Thank you. Miss like you think you

5348
04:09:52,299 --> 04:09:53,600
had three minutes or

5349
04:09:53,600 --> 04:10:01,479
so left to go? 320. 320. All right thank you okay so thank

5350
04:10:01,479 --> 04:10:01,840
you for

5351
04:10:01,840 --> 04:10:09,959
cleaning that up Roman. Now so I got up and spoke two weeks

5352
04:10:09,959 --> 04:10:11,440
ago I missed

5353
04:10:11,440 --> 04:10:17,180
Commissioner Rizel I missed Commissioner Sullivan but again

5354
04:10:17,180 --> 04:10:18,239
as somebody who lives

5355
04:10:18,239 --> 04:10:23,879
very very close to this site I understand I'm a new I'm a

5356
04:10:23,879 --> 04:10:24,579
lover of the new

5357
04:10:24,579 --> 04:10:29,540
urbanist style and I do agree that in particularly in the

5358
04:10:29,540 --> 04:10:30,840
core of Denton

5359
04:10:30,840 --> 04:10:36,129
density well managed and well situated density is going to

5360
04:10:36,129 --> 04:10:37,120
be important for a

5361
04:10:37,120 --> 04:10:42,680
sustainable Denton. Now part of I noticed that the

5362
04:10:42,680 --> 04:10:44,520
apartment complex that was

5363
04:10:44,520 --> 04:10:47,899
approved I understand it was a different zoning district

5364
04:10:47,899 --> 04:10:49,280
but the early apartment

5365
04:10:49,280 --> 04:10:52,760
complex that was approved first of all apartments not SROs

5366
04:10:52,760 --> 04:10:54,860
and I do I do agree

5367
04:10:54,860 --> 04:10:58,860
with Ms. Anderson that SROs are not multifamily they are

5368
04:10:58,860 --> 04:11:00,799
glorified dorms but

5369
04:11:00,799 --> 04:11:05,309
the other apartment complex required an SUP to do

5370
04:11:05,309 --> 04:11:07,719
residential only and one of

5371
04:11:07,719 --> 04:11:11,860
the problems I think with this proposed development and of

5372
04:11:11,860 --> 04:11:13,200
course we all know

5373
04:11:13,200 --> 04:11:16,799
that this the zoning could change they could flip this

5374
04:11:16,799 --> 04:11:18,559
property tomorrow there

5375
04:11:18,559 --> 04:11:23,530
is nothing tying any of these site plans these elevations

5376
04:11:23,530 --> 04:11:24,879
any of this landscaping

5377
04:11:24,879 --> 04:11:30,440
to the zoning request we all know that but there's no

5378
04:11:30,440 --> 04:11:32,280
commercial there's no

5379
04:11:32,280 --> 04:11:36,139
mixed-use proposed thus far the zoning category that's

5380
04:11:36,139 --> 04:11:37,600
being requested wouldn't

5381
04:11:37,600 --> 04:11:42,569
require that right and yes these people are going to have

5382
04:11:42,569 --> 04:11:44,440
to get in the car and

5383
04:11:44,440 --> 04:11:48,430
go buy head of lettuce now it's true you can get to walk to

5384
04:11:48,430 --> 04:11:49,520
CVS you can get your

5385
04:11:49,520 --> 04:11:53,659
shampoo there are no groceries to be found nearby all of

5386
04:11:53,659 --> 04:11:55,040
these people they

5387
04:11:55,040 --> 04:11:57,649
may be walking they may be taking their bike but they're

5388
04:11:57,649 --> 04:11:58,520
going to be on our

5389
04:11:58,520 --> 04:12:01,680
streets they are going to be driving down Congress Street

5390
04:12:01,680 --> 04:12:02,760
past mr. Warren's

5391
04:12:02,760 --> 04:12:05,780
house they're going to be driving down oak they're going to

5392
04:12:05,780 --> 04:12:06,399
be driving down

5393
04:12:06,399 --> 04:12:11,680
Hickory the north and north side of campus is really not

5394
04:12:11,680 --> 04:12:13,760
meant to house

5395
04:12:13,760 --> 04:12:17,840
students it will always be on the tax rolls Commissioner

5396
04:12:17,840 --> 04:12:19,319
Roselle I'm if we put

5397
04:12:19,319 --> 04:12:24,600
500 bodies on the UNT site it's not going to make any

5398
04:12:24,600 --> 04:12:25,479
difference if we put

5399
04:12:25,479 --> 04:12:28,639
those bodies on scripture because the development there

5400
04:12:28,639 --> 04:12:29,360
whatever that

5401
04:12:29,360 --> 04:12:32,590
development is is going to generate taxes we don't lose

5402
04:12:32,590 --> 04:12:34,440
anything UNT has

5403
04:12:34,440 --> 04:12:37,920
500 beds coming online they have they've been approved for

5404
04:12:37,920 --> 04:12:40,559
500 more beds UNT

5405
04:12:40,559 --> 04:12:44,090
wants their students on campus right now there are

5406
04:12:44,090 --> 04:12:47,239
approximately 37,000 students

5407
04:12:47,239 --> 04:12:52,000
enrolled at UNT about 31,000 of them are undergraduate

5408
04:12:52,000 --> 04:12:54,680
students but 3,000 students

5409
04:12:54,680 --> 04:12:58,399
are a hundred percent online and that includes students who

5410
04:12:58,399 --> 04:12:59,200
are also the

5411
04:12:59,200 --> 04:13:02,090
current count includes students who are part-time students

5412
04:13:02,090 --> 04:13:03,600
as well so when we're

5413
04:13:03,600 --> 04:13:10,120
looking at 9,000 SRO beds right now this is not necessary

5414
04:13:10,120 --> 04:13:12,239
for Denton not

5415
04:13:12,239 --> 04:13:16,559
necessary for UNT and it's completely contextually

5416
04:13:16,559 --> 04:13:18,879
inappropriate for the

5417
04:13:18,879 --> 04:13:22,920
neighborhoods to the north

5418
04:13:24,120 --> 04:13:27,940
another question for you one more question Commissioner

5419
04:13:27,940 --> 04:13:29,840
Taylor thank you

5420
04:13:29,840 --> 04:13:35,120
dr. like I have have a few questions I think I have one

5421
04:13:35,120 --> 04:13:36,120
question if I wrap it up

5422
04:13:36,120 --> 04:13:39,479
altogether okay so I'm going to try and do that you

5423
04:13:39,479 --> 04:13:40,280
obviously have an interest

5424
04:13:40,280 --> 04:13:43,600
in the historic area the historic nature of the area and

5425
04:13:43,600 --> 04:13:45,559
you said you have a

5426
04:13:45,559 --> 04:13:50,440
preference for new urban new urbanist design I do and how

5427
04:13:50,440 --> 04:13:52,600
do we balance those

5428
04:13:52,600 --> 04:13:56,420
two things in a contextual design that would be appropriate

5429
04:13:56,420 --> 04:13:57,440
for this area I

5430
04:13:57,440 --> 04:14:02,639
think that the density does have to decrease for one thing

5431
04:14:02,639 --> 04:14:04,040
the body the

5432
04:14:04,040 --> 04:14:09,209
beating heart density but it also needs to have some type

5433
04:14:09,209 --> 04:14:10,600
of commercial

5434
04:14:10,600 --> 04:14:14,909
opportunities that the neighborhood can partake in it is a

5435
04:14:14,909 --> 04:14:15,959
very we're a walkie

5436
04:14:15,959 --> 04:14:19,819
neighborhood my neighbors walk to chopsticks all the time

5437
04:14:19,819 --> 04:14:21,559
and we you know

5438
04:14:21,559 --> 04:14:26,170
walk to CVS the CVS really has been an amenity up there

5439
04:14:26,170 --> 04:14:28,360
near Fry Street but as

5440
04:14:28,360 --> 04:14:34,469
it is you know we're not you know we would appreciate more

5441
04:14:34,469 --> 04:14:36,360
commercial more

5442
04:14:36,360 --> 04:14:42,430
retail more neighborhood scaled services in that area

5443
04:14:42,430 --> 04:14:43,360
remembering that when I

5444
04:14:43,360 --> 04:14:46,309
moved to the neighborhood flow hospital still stood and

5445
04:14:46,309 --> 04:14:47,559
that's how a lot of that

5446
04:14:47,559 --> 04:14:51,639
zoning came about by the way over on scripture in that area

5447
04:14:51,639 --> 04:14:52,639
is because we

5448
04:14:52,639 --> 04:14:57,180
supported a hospital and the hospitals gone you know you

5449
04:14:57,180 --> 04:14:58,079
don't expect your

5450
04:14:58,079 --> 04:15:02,049
institutions to just pack up leave and get bulldozed but it

5451
04:15:02,049 --> 04:15:03,920
was but a lot of

5452
04:15:03,920 --> 04:15:09,329
the again the good services amenities and just things that

5453
04:15:09,329 --> 04:15:10,440
were available to

5454
04:15:10,440 --> 04:15:14,159
the neighborhood were things we would have welcome back

5455
04:15:14,159 --> 04:15:15,879
okay and to follow up

5456
04:15:15,879 --> 04:15:20,360
you said fewer like as you put it fewer bodies like a lower

5457
04:15:20,360 --> 04:15:21,600
lower person density

5458
04:15:21,600 --> 04:15:26,040
right I know you've got some experience with the the

5459
04:15:26,040 --> 04:15:28,520
dimensional and technical

5460
04:15:28,520 --> 04:15:33,760
aspects of zoning what what would that be in units an acre

5461
04:15:33,760 --> 04:15:35,639
height or something

5462
04:15:35,639 --> 04:15:38,250
like that what is your what is your number well part of it

5463
04:15:38,250 --> 04:15:39,040
I think is mass

5464
04:15:39,040 --> 04:15:45,159
because there are yes many apartment complexes they're low

5465
04:15:45,159 --> 04:15:47,200
intensity both in

5466
04:15:47,200 --> 04:15:52,979
scale height their apartments and so and that's one of the

5467
04:15:52,979 --> 04:15:54,040
things about the SRO

5468
04:15:54,040 --> 04:15:58,180
is to be honest with you and again I do I teach at UNT I

5469
04:15:58,180 --> 04:15:59,239
teach these people I

5470
04:15:59,239 --> 04:16:01,670
like them I'm not saying I don't want to live near my

5471
04:16:01,670 --> 04:16:04,079
students but we have a lot

5472
04:16:04,079 --> 04:16:08,079
of faculty who would like to live near campus they were we

5473
04:16:08,079 --> 04:16:09,040
have a lot of staff

5474
04:16:09,040 --> 04:16:12,329
who would like to live near campus and the faculty and

5475
04:16:12,329 --> 04:16:13,760
staff whom I've known

5476
04:16:13,760 --> 04:16:17,649
who've lived near the university have chosen to live if

5477
04:16:17,649 --> 04:16:19,159
they can find a place

5478
04:16:19,159 --> 04:16:24,440
in low intensity two-story apartment complexes that are

5479
04:16:24,440 --> 04:16:26,719
nearby so it is a

5480
04:16:26,719 --> 04:16:32,040
matter of mass it's a matter of scale I can't say okay I

5481
04:16:32,040 --> 04:16:33,120
think it should be this

5482
04:16:33,120 --> 04:16:37,879
many beating hearts per acre but something that again is

5483
04:16:37,879 --> 04:16:39,079
contextually this

5484
04:16:39,079 --> 04:16:45,319
is so contextually insensitive both in scale and in usage

5485
04:16:45,319 --> 04:16:48,920
that it's I find it

5486
04:16:48,920 --> 04:16:52,319
just inappropriate button up against my neighborhood and

5487
04:16:52,319 --> 04:16:54,600
you know being to both

5488
04:16:54,600 --> 04:16:57,590
the east and to the west of two other historical

5489
04:16:57,590 --> 04:17:00,559
neighborhoods thank you one

5490
04:17:00,559 --> 04:17:02,920
more question Commissioner Roselle thank you chair thank

5491
04:17:02,920 --> 04:17:04,239
you for speaking out and

5492
04:17:04,239 --> 04:17:10,309
nailing the time well done some individuals have talked

5493
04:17:10,309 --> 04:17:10,959
about not having

5494
04:17:10,959 --> 04:17:13,600
a need for this type of development but you mentioned

5495
04:17:13,600 --> 04:17:14,879
something in your answer

5496
04:17:14,879 --> 04:17:18,639
you said that if your fellow professors can find a place

5497
04:17:18,639 --> 04:17:19,799
are you hearing that

5498
04:17:19,799 --> 04:17:23,260
it's difficult to find a place to live near campus it is

5499
04:17:23,260 --> 04:17:25,079
right for people who

5500
04:17:25,079 --> 04:17:29,090
move to town their new faculty and who would like to get a

5501
04:17:29,090 --> 04:17:30,319
feel for Denton

5502
04:17:30,319 --> 04:17:35,680
before they commit long term to a neighborhood or to a

5503
04:17:35,680 --> 04:17:37,440
house many people

5504
04:17:37,440 --> 04:17:42,760
would like to be closer to campus we have a couple of my

5505
04:17:42,760 --> 04:17:45,280
colleagues spend part

5506
04:17:45,280 --> 04:17:48,670
of their year in another state they don't want to own a

5507
04:17:48,670 --> 04:17:50,000
house but they sure

5508
04:17:50,000 --> 04:17:54,569
would like to live close to campus a lot of the time my

5509
04:17:54,569 --> 04:17:56,559
students will graduate

5510
04:17:56,559 --> 04:18:00,559
and be interested they start like leading real adult lives

5511
04:18:00,559 --> 04:18:02,239
but they can't

5512
04:18:02,239 --> 04:18:05,610
continue to lead them right and living right where they

5513
04:18:05,610 --> 04:18:07,040
would like to live so

5514
04:18:07,040 --> 04:18:09,649
there really is a market for people who would be interested

5515
04:18:09,649 --> 04:18:11,079
in maintaining I like

5516
04:18:11,079 --> 04:18:16,280
living close to UNT I have lived in apartment close to UNT

5517
04:18:16,280 --> 04:18:18,520
and I think

5518
04:18:18,520 --> 04:18:23,920
there's a there's a market for for this sure thank you

5519
04:18:23,920 --> 04:18:28,639
Commissioner Beck thank you chair do you think it's our

5520
04:18:28,639 --> 04:18:30,079
oaths are the type of

5521
04:18:30,079 --> 04:18:33,799
dwellings that would meet their needs I have a really hard

5522
04:18:33,799 --> 04:18:35,200
time supporting as

5523
04:18:35,200 --> 04:18:38,799
our oaths for one thing it is it's a in my opinion a

5524
04:18:38,799 --> 04:18:41,079
different usage you know an

5525
04:18:41,079 --> 04:18:45,059
apartment is meant to house people who have you know have a

5526
04:18:45,059 --> 04:18:46,840
community once you

5527
04:18:46,840 --> 04:18:52,159
develop build an SRO the possibilities in my opinion and I

5528
04:18:52,159 --> 04:18:52,799
don't I'm not an

5529
04:18:52,799 --> 04:18:58,260
interior designer but you'd never be able to return that

5530
04:18:58,260 --> 04:18:59,280
dot that

5531
04:18:59,280 --> 04:19:03,969
configuration to an apartment where somebody may say I'm

5532
04:19:03,969 --> 04:19:05,520
going to live here

5533
04:19:05,520 --> 04:19:08,399
with my wife and children for a couple of years while I'm

5534
04:19:08,399 --> 04:19:09,079
you know getting a

5535
04:19:09,079 --> 04:19:15,149
feel for Denton and you know the SRO is sold some of the

5536
04:19:15,149 --> 04:19:17,040
time as an inexpensive

5537
04:19:17,040 --> 04:19:23,110
alternative there are dorm the high that the priciest dorm

5538
04:19:23,110 --> 04:19:25,040
itory on UNT's campus

5539
04:19:25,040 --> 04:19:32,680
is about $790 a month and the lowest is about $440 a month

5540
04:19:32,680 --> 04:19:35,079
there as we become

5541
04:19:35,079 --> 04:19:38,989
find more places on campus since we've got the potential

5542
04:19:38,989 --> 04:19:41,600
for a thousand beds we

5543
04:19:41,600 --> 04:19:46,100
will you know be able to house people on campus you know

5544
04:19:46,100 --> 04:19:47,600
keep them closer

5545
04:19:47,600 --> 04:19:53,780
potentially save them money this way and no I don't think

5546
04:19:53,780 --> 04:19:55,159
the SROs are

5547
04:19:55,159 --> 04:20:00,920
compatible with neighborhoods again I like my students but

5548
04:20:00,920 --> 04:20:02,280
I know that their

5549
04:20:02,280 --> 04:20:08,969
investment in you know a community in an SRO is scanty I

5550
04:20:08,969 --> 04:20:11,799
drive I walk by you center

5551
04:20:11,799 --> 04:20:16,440
at the end of every semester and they bring open dumpsters

5552
04:20:16,440 --> 04:20:17,760
and park them in

5553
04:20:17,760 --> 04:20:21,329
Oak Street and just throw stuff in and I'm not talking

5554
04:20:21,329 --> 04:20:22,920
clothes they didn't take

5555
04:20:22,920 --> 04:20:26,239
to the goodwill I'm talking they're throwing toilets away

5556
04:20:26,239 --> 04:20:27,120
they're throwing

5557
04:20:27,120 --> 04:20:34,079
drywall away I mean it must be a pricey venture to refurb

5558
04:20:34,079 --> 04:20:36,479
after every move out

5559
04:20:36,479 --> 04:20:39,989
at the end of every semester but they've got big roll away

5560
04:20:39,989 --> 04:20:42,120
dumpsters out there so

5561
04:20:42,120 --> 04:20:49,290
it can't be that much more keeping up an apartment thank

5562
04:20:49,290 --> 04:20:50,479
you

5563
04:20:50,479 --> 04:21:08,010
Deb Armentar hi Deb Armentar do I need to say my address

5564
04:21:08,010 --> 04:21:09,879
yeah 2003 Misty Woodlane

5565
04:21:09,879 --> 04:21:16,229
I really appreciate the comments that others have made and

5566
04:21:16,229 --> 04:21:17,760
I want to try not

5567
04:21:17,760 --> 04:21:23,010
to repeat things that others have said I too am opposed to

5568
04:21:23,010 --> 04:21:24,799
this SRO I too believe

5569
04:21:24,799 --> 04:21:32,000
that a private dorm like this does not belong in a hundred-

5570
04:21:32,000 --> 04:21:34,280
year-old historic

5571
04:21:34,280 --> 04:21:38,709
neighborhood especially one that is so important to the

5572
04:21:38,709 --> 04:21:41,079
very identity of this

5573
04:21:41,079 --> 04:21:49,450
town I want to say a couple of things about the process by

5574
04:21:49,450 --> 04:21:51,159
which this

5575
04:21:51,159 --> 04:21:55,159
development has has come up for discussion number one I

5576
04:21:55,159 --> 04:21:56,159
just want to

5577
04:21:56,159 --> 04:22:00,290
express just how surprised and I must say disappointed I

5578
04:22:00,290 --> 04:22:02,000
was to hear that

5579
04:22:02,000 --> 04:22:10,120
staff approved this incompatible building in such an

5580
04:22:10,120 --> 04:22:11,920
obviously his

5581
04:22:11,920 --> 04:22:17,989
historic neighborhood that we hear spoken of so often as

5582
04:22:17,989 --> 04:22:19,000
part of our

5583
04:22:19,000 --> 04:22:24,469
historic downtown the the pride and joy of Denton and I

5584
04:22:24,469 --> 04:22:26,200
also want to speak kind

5585
04:22:26,200 --> 04:22:28,709
of forward in the process even though I know you're not

5586
04:22:28,709 --> 04:22:31,159
counsel you're your P&Z

5587
04:22:31,159 --> 04:22:37,229
but that when this goes forward and I I hope that you all

5588
04:22:37,229 --> 04:22:38,520
vote vote no to this

5589
04:22:38,520 --> 04:22:43,159
and vote with the people and instead of with the the

5590
04:22:43,159 --> 04:22:47,360
developer who is in this

5591
04:22:47,360 --> 04:22:52,920
for-profit and doesn't have to to live with all this I hope

5592
04:22:52,920 --> 04:22:55,120
the council

5593
04:22:55,120 --> 04:22:58,639
remembers that this this wonderful city that we have that

5594
04:22:58,639 --> 04:23:00,000
they keep touting as

5595
04:23:00,000 --> 04:23:08,200
such a filled with so much charm such a so unique so unlike

5596
04:23:08,200 --> 04:23:10,440
Plano Arlington and

5597
04:23:10,440 --> 04:23:16,000
in some of the newer cities around us that when they if

5598
04:23:16,000 --> 04:23:18,979
they say yes one by

5599
04:23:18,979 --> 04:23:24,219
one to proposals like this they're essentially killing the

5600
04:23:24,219 --> 04:23:24,920
thing that they

5601
04:23:24,920 --> 04:23:31,549
love and Denton will no longer be Denton if it gets taken

5602
04:23:31,549 --> 04:23:33,639
over piecemeal by

5603
04:23:33,639 --> 04:23:38,729
developments that request an inter granted exceptions and

5604
04:23:38,729 --> 04:23:40,479
exemptions one

5605
04:23:40,479 --> 04:23:43,639
after the other we need long-term city planning that

5606
04:23:43,639 --> 04:23:45,840
respects neighborhoods

5607
04:23:45,840 --> 04:23:50,350
and when change does come and I believe in in change there

5608
04:23:50,350 --> 04:23:52,200
's always I mean

5609
04:23:52,200 --> 04:23:54,430
change is always good we don't want to resist changes for

5610
04:23:54,430 --> 04:23:55,239
the sake of change

5611
04:23:55,239 --> 04:23:58,829
for the sake of resisting change but change the best change

5612
04:23:58,829 --> 04:23:59,799
comes from the

5613
04:23:59,799 --> 04:24:03,760
grassroots the best change comes from the people so if

5614
04:24:03,760 --> 04:24:04,840
there were people if

5615
04:24:04,840 --> 04:24:08,899
there were students at UNT who were just begging for

5616
04:24:08,899 --> 04:24:10,559
another one of these

5617
04:24:10,559 --> 04:24:13,780
expensive private dorms you know then at least we could say

5618
04:24:13,780 --> 04:24:14,840
there's a need for

5619
04:24:14,840 --> 04:24:19,840
that if UNT was asking for this we could say there's a need

5620
04:24:19,840 --> 04:24:20,719
the best way to

5621
04:24:20,719 --> 04:24:24,319
establish need is really to see if people are asking for it

5622
04:24:24,319 --> 04:24:25,520
and if people

5623
04:24:25,520 --> 04:24:28,520
aren't asking for it and I don't hear anyone asking for it

5624
04:24:28,520 --> 04:24:30,399
except the the

5625
04:24:30,399 --> 04:24:35,440
developer and and again I was surprised that that our staff

5626
04:24:35,440 --> 04:24:36,559
planning staff

5627
04:24:36,559 --> 04:24:40,420
recommended it then that says there's not a need for it so

5628
04:24:40,420 --> 04:24:41,479
anyway it just

5629
04:24:41,479 --> 04:24:45,139
seems like a no-brainer to me so anyway thank you very much

5630
04:24:45,139 --> 04:24:45,959
all of you for

5631
04:24:45,959 --> 04:24:49,620
volunteering for your time and thanks for the neighborhood

5632
04:24:49,620 --> 04:24:50,440
who came out I

5633
04:24:50,440 --> 04:24:53,840
don't live in this neighborhood but I happen to work at UNT

5634
04:24:53,840 --> 04:24:56,319
I teach at UNT I

5635
04:24:56,319 --> 04:25:00,700
love my students my the students I teach can't afford to

5636
04:25:00,700 --> 04:25:02,200
live in a place like

5637
04:25:02,200 --> 04:25:06,280
this I know there's some who can but I know that there are

5638
04:25:06,280 --> 04:25:07,120
none who are crying

5639
04:25:07,120 --> 04:25:11,239
out for this so anyway thank you very much thank you we

5640
04:25:11,239 --> 04:25:13,840
have a lot of cards I

5641
04:25:13,840 --> 04:25:18,520
have actually just for the record I've got 21 in opposition

5642
04:25:18,520 --> 04:25:19,520
and I have two in

5643
04:25:19,520 --> 04:25:23,790
support and I'm going to just read the ones that I have

5644
04:25:23,790 --> 04:25:24,840
that have notes on them

5645
04:25:24,840 --> 04:25:27,790
but just for the record that's what we have in opposition

5646
04:25:27,790 --> 04:25:29,520
and support I have

5647
04:25:29,520 --> 04:25:34,360
Christy Woods opposed this area is an older community

5648
04:25:34,360 --> 04:25:35,799
single family it does

5649
04:25:35,799 --> 04:25:42,569
not lend itself to absorbing the proposed change in zoning

5650
04:25:42,569 --> 04:25:44,120
John Bennett

5651
04:25:44,120 --> 04:25:50,190
who is opposed SRO is not the best type of use in our

5652
04:25:50,190 --> 04:25:52,120
neighborhood

5653
04:25:55,120 --> 04:25:59,309
have a net of Ramsey opposed there's no comments on that

5654
04:25:59,309 --> 04:26:02,479
one Warren Hunt is

5655
04:26:02,479 --> 04:26:05,760
opposed not in keeping with neighborhood traffic problems

5656
04:26:05,760 --> 04:26:07,399
and then John Morris

5657
04:26:07,399 --> 04:26:12,750
opposed not an apartment complex it's a dormitory those are

5658
04:26:12,750 --> 04:26:14,040
all the cards that

5659
04:26:14,040 --> 04:26:18,670
we have this is a public hearing anyone who would like to

5660
04:26:18,670 --> 04:26:19,799
speak on this item

5661
04:26:19,799 --> 04:26:22,840
please come forward at this time

5662
04:26:23,559 --> 04:26:28,799
my name is Paul Meltzer at 1914 West Oak Street first I'd

5663
04:26:28,799 --> 04:26:29,600
like to express

5664
04:26:29,600 --> 04:26:33,200
appreciation to Randy Hunt for the work he has done to get

5665
04:26:33,200 --> 04:26:34,639
recognition for this

5666
04:26:34,639 --> 04:26:38,940
historic area I would also like to express appreciation to

5667
04:26:38,940 --> 04:26:40,319
the developer

5668
04:26:40,319 --> 04:26:45,850
who actually did listen to a degree made some modifications

5669
04:26:45,850 --> 04:26:47,440
in response to what

5670
04:26:47,440 --> 04:26:50,399
was heard obviously what you're hearing tonight it's

5671
04:26:50,399 --> 04:26:53,200
clearly not far enough and

5672
04:26:53,200 --> 04:26:57,530
and where we are now where you know we're looking at kind

5673
04:26:57,530 --> 04:26:58,719
of a blackmail

5674
04:26:58,719 --> 04:27:01,579
maneuver I don't I think that's beneath you and I don't

5675
04:27:01,579 --> 04:27:02,200
think you want to do

5676
04:27:02,200 --> 04:27:05,120
that I don't think you truly want to do that especially

5677
04:27:05,120 --> 04:27:06,120
when there's so

5678
04:27:06,120 --> 04:27:09,280
evidently a deal to be had here I mean can we just have

5679
04:27:09,280 --> 04:27:10,840
some common sense can

5680
04:27:10,840 --> 04:27:14,809
we creatively recognize the very obvious solution to this

5681
04:27:14,809 --> 04:27:16,600
problem the developer

5682
04:27:16,600 --> 04:27:20,930
said he sort of expressed interest but doubt about the

5683
04:27:20,930 --> 04:27:21,680
possibility of

5684
04:27:21,680 --> 04:27:24,159
developing on the West Side he said well you know I couldn

5685
04:27:24,159 --> 04:27:24,959
't do it there because

5686
04:27:24,959 --> 04:27:29,680
it's it's dr2 can we not make a deal can we not have a

5687
04:27:29,680 --> 04:27:33,000
continuance and and if he

5688
04:27:33,000 --> 04:27:37,469
backs off of the historic area where he's it's clearly not

5689
04:27:37,469 --> 04:27:39,479
welcome can we open up

5690
04:27:39,479 --> 04:27:44,290
the opportunity for cement city to become University City

5691
04:27:44,290 --> 04:27:45,840
to go from dr2 to

5692
04:27:45,840 --> 04:27:49,860
DCG I would personally stand here and advocate and testify

5693
04:27:49,860 --> 04:27:51,040
in support of this

5694
04:27:51,040 --> 04:27:53,770
concept in support of this developer if they were to go

5695
04:27:53,770 --> 04:27:55,120
down this route it would

5696
04:27:55,120 --> 04:27:58,280
open up tremendous economic opportunity the city is not

5697
04:27:58,280 --> 04:27:59,239
anti development we're

5698
04:27:59,239 --> 04:28:04,239
anti destroying the things we value and that you value so I

5699
04:28:04,239 --> 04:28:05,600
encourage your

5700
04:28:05,600 --> 04:28:11,979
creativity to make this deal thank you again this is a

5701
04:28:11,979 --> 04:28:13,559
public hearing anyone

5702
04:28:13,559 --> 04:28:18,399
who would like to speak on this item please come forward at

5703
04:28:18,399 --> 04:28:22,920
this time on that

5704
04:28:22,920 --> 04:28:32,500
item yes sir we'd like another one that's all the cards

5705
04:28:32,500 --> 04:28:36,559
need to get a card

5706
04:28:37,719 --> 04:28:44,719
if you could fill out a card thank you

5707
04:28:47,680 --> 04:28:56,129
Kevin Bradshaw 2052 Collins Road I'm usually opposed to

5708
04:28:56,129 --> 04:28:58,360
everything that goes

5709
04:28:58,360 --> 04:29:03,719
on in the city being a native I hate to see things torn up

5710
04:29:03,719 --> 04:29:10,559
but rather than tell

5711
04:29:10,559 --> 04:29:14,799
you a lot of things I'd ask questions that come to my mind

5712
04:29:14,799 --> 04:29:16,559
I heard the lady

5713
04:29:16,559 --> 04:29:20,110
want to go mention flow and what a foolish thing it was

5714
04:29:20,110 --> 04:29:21,360
when they tore that

5715
04:29:21,360 --> 04:29:26,680
down as I recall that building was six stories tall

5716
04:29:26,680 --> 04:29:31,340
sat in on the highest piece of real estate over there didn

5717
04:29:31,340 --> 04:29:32,600
't cause a real

5718
04:29:32,600 --> 04:29:39,040
big problem but what I'm wondering is that it seems the

5719
04:29:39,040 --> 04:29:40,360
most of the people that

5720
04:29:40,360 --> 04:29:44,950
live close to the college are not students and the people

5721
04:29:44,950 --> 04:29:46,200
that live away

5722
04:29:46,200 --> 04:29:49,930
from the college are students so if you could move the

5723
04:29:49,930 --> 04:29:51,319
students closer to the

5724
04:29:51,319 --> 04:29:55,180
college it cut down on them out of traffic then the people

5725
04:29:55,180 --> 04:29:55,840
that aren't

5726
04:29:55,840 --> 04:29:59,489
students can go somewhere else to live where the students

5727
04:29:59,489 --> 04:30:01,360
come from that would

5728
04:30:01,360 --> 04:30:05,840
help or maybe don't know think about that

5729
04:30:07,799 --> 04:30:13,360
what's over there maybe something nice left but they ain't

5730
04:30:13,360 --> 04:30:15,120
much of it you know

5731
04:30:15,120 --> 04:30:18,399
I was listening to that man and I thought man that'd be a

5732
04:30:18,399 --> 04:30:19,479
good deal just go

5733
04:30:19,479 --> 04:30:26,440
south all the way down to 35 be a pretty good deal but I

5734
04:30:26,440 --> 04:30:30,280
believe it was 65 or 6

5735
04:30:30,280 --> 04:30:34,450
when they built the first of the tall buildings over at TW

5736
04:30:34,450 --> 04:30:37,000
and of course the

5737
04:30:37,000 --> 04:30:42,370
world hasn't ended yet from it and it saved an awful lot of

5738
04:30:42,370 --> 04:30:44,280
real estate it

5739
04:30:44,280 --> 04:30:48,600
gets cheaper as you go up and why not take advantage of it

5740
04:30:48,600 --> 04:30:50,600
but and now these

5741
04:30:50,600 --> 04:30:56,709
SROs is a new new idea to me and I understood the one's

5742
04:30:56,709 --> 04:30:58,000
point that by

5743
04:30:58,000 --> 04:31:01,000
having that you don't establish a community one of the

5744
04:31:01,000 --> 04:31:01,959
benefits of not

5745
04:31:01,959 --> 04:31:06,209
establishing a community there is maybe they won't stay

5746
04:31:06,209 --> 04:31:07,520
here when they get out

5747
04:31:07,520 --> 04:31:15,350
of school then that will be a tremendous improvement to to

5748
04:31:15,350 --> 04:31:17,600
the density of our

5749
04:31:17,600 --> 04:31:24,750
problems but so I opinions for what I mean you obviously

5750
04:31:24,750 --> 04:31:25,559
all think that's a

5751
04:31:25,559 --> 04:31:32,879
wonderful idea but y'all are all me so you know but I as I

5752
04:31:32,879 --> 04:31:33,520
was telling a man

5753
04:31:33,520 --> 04:31:37,690
earlier at forum I'm founding the anti chamber of commerce

5754
04:31:37,690 --> 04:31:41,079
so I'm ready I'm

5755
04:31:41,079 --> 04:31:43,959
ready for some changes in debt I mean what what's been

5756
04:31:43,959 --> 04:31:45,319
going on the past 30

5757
04:31:45,319 --> 04:31:48,879
years ain't working so let's try something different and

5758
04:31:48,879 --> 04:31:49,920
this sound like

5759
04:31:49,920 --> 04:31:53,440
pretty good deal not very pretty but not as ugly as what

5760
04:31:53,440 --> 04:31:55,440
over there now evening

5761
04:31:55,440 --> 04:32:04,840
thank you sir so are you opposed or you you're in support

5762
04:32:04,840 --> 04:32:06,159
you're in support thank

5763
04:32:06,159 --> 04:32:12,229
you for the record great perfect timing for a little humor

5764
04:32:12,229 --> 04:32:14,760
this evening again

5765
04:32:14,760 --> 04:32:17,579
this is still a public hearing anyone else who would like

5766
04:32:17,579 --> 04:32:18,440
to speak on this

5767
04:32:18,440 --> 04:32:29,239
item don't have an item number this one okay Jennifer Lane

5768
04:32:29,239 --> 04:32:32,280
opposition

5769
04:32:32,280 --> 04:32:36,799
1526 Willow Street in Denton and I'm here to speak out

5770
04:32:36,799 --> 04:32:38,440
about this in large

5771
04:32:38,440 --> 04:32:43,500
part to add my name and opposition to the list and just the

5772
04:32:43,500 --> 04:32:44,639
other day I saw a

5773
04:32:44,639 --> 04:32:48,420
film of the UNT president who was talking about building

5774
04:32:48,420 --> 04:32:49,520
some on-campus

5775
04:32:49,520 --> 04:32:53,469
dormitories and he was talking about the not so much the

5776
04:32:53,469 --> 04:32:55,079
need for this but that

5777
04:32:55,079 --> 04:32:59,579
it creates a university community on campus and the details

5778
04:32:59,579 --> 04:33:00,719
of this I don't

5779
04:33:00,719 --> 04:33:03,940
have an it's not entirely fleshed out but I have lived in

5780
04:33:03,940 --> 04:33:05,119
areas and taught at

5781
04:33:05,119 --> 04:33:08,290
universities where it's much too expensive for students to

5782
04:33:08,290 --> 04:33:08,799
live off

5783
04:33:08,799 --> 04:33:12,369
campus and there is great effort spent on creating an on-

5784
04:33:12,369 --> 04:33:13,799
campus community one

5785
04:33:13,799 --> 04:33:16,959
of those was Stanford University and I got involved with it

5786
04:33:16,959 --> 04:33:17,759
as a resident

5787
04:33:17,759 --> 04:33:21,189
fellow which is another term for house master and lived in

5788
04:33:21,189 --> 04:33:22,400
those communities

5789
04:33:22,400 --> 04:33:26,159
and worked with the residents deans and so on so forth and

5790
04:33:26,159 --> 04:33:27,479
it's really a great

5791
04:33:27,479 --> 04:33:32,900
way to go as our community grows and people want to live

5792
04:33:32,900 --> 04:33:34,080
near and around the

5793
04:33:34,080 --> 04:33:38,400
university as the professor was talking about we should

5794
04:33:38,400 --> 04:33:39,720
protect the area right

5795
04:33:39,720 --> 04:33:42,930
around the university and we should encourage on-campus

5796
04:33:42,930 --> 04:33:43,880
dormitory life

5797
04:33:43,880 --> 04:33:47,459
because there's more than just SRO life there's resident

5798
04:33:47,459 --> 04:33:48,799
assistants there's

5799
04:33:48,799 --> 04:33:53,040
other students staffers living there there's an entire

5800
04:33:53,040 --> 04:33:54,939
culture of residential

5801
04:33:54,939 --> 04:33:59,169
education that already exists at UNT but can be built and

5802
04:33:59,169 --> 04:34:00,680
in order to encourage

5803
04:34:00,680 --> 04:34:03,939
that we have to also encourage that the neighborhood around

5804
04:34:03,939 --> 04:34:05,000
the school be more

5805
04:34:05,000 --> 04:34:08,869
of a residential neighborhood and not really SROs also as a

5806
04:34:08,869 --> 04:34:10,040
New Yorker I lived

5807
04:34:10,040 --> 04:34:13,919
where there were many SROs and these really in that

5808
04:34:13,919 --> 04:34:16,040
environment had very sad

5809
04:34:16,040 --> 04:34:20,619
history also became quite contentious in tenant landlord

5810
04:34:20,619 --> 04:34:22,200
battles and so on and so

5811
04:34:22,200 --> 04:34:24,650
forth which is a subject that I haven't been here for the

5812
04:34:24,650 --> 04:34:25,159
whole meeting but

5813
04:34:25,159 --> 04:34:27,720
that's something that's down the road for Denton and we

5814
04:34:27,720 --> 04:34:28,840
should be a little bit

5815
04:34:28,840 --> 04:34:33,040
careful about the kinds of buildings that we build that

5816
04:34:33,040 --> 04:34:34,680
people don't have that

5817
04:34:34,680 --> 04:34:37,669
kind of distance between themselves their living

5818
04:34:37,669 --> 04:34:39,000
arrangements and who

5819
04:34:39,000 --> 04:34:42,869
actually owns the property it makes for an uncomfortable

5820
04:34:42,869 --> 04:34:44,759
environment unpleasant

5821
04:34:44,759 --> 04:34:47,979
environment and I think we would be best off avoiding it so

5822
04:34:47,979 --> 04:34:49,439
that's the basis of

5823
04:34:49,439 --> 04:34:52,759
my opposition okay thank you for your comments welcome

5824
04:34:52,759 --> 04:34:53,939
again this is a public

5825
04:34:53,939 --> 04:34:56,759
hearing anyone else who would like to speak on this item

5826
04:34:56,759 --> 04:34:57,919
please come down at

5827
04:34:57,919 --> 04:35:02,790
this time if you haven't filled out a card after you give

5828
04:35:02,790 --> 04:35:03,680
us your comments

5829
04:35:03,680 --> 04:35:16,500
please fill out a card I'm the unknown Bob Clifton I don't

5830
04:35:16,500 --> 04:35:17,240
know what my address

5831
04:35:17,240 --> 04:35:25,560
is it's out side of town here I have to agree brother Brad

5832
04:35:25,560 --> 04:35:26,240
shaw

5833
04:35:28,200 --> 04:35:32,029
Denton has changed immensely when I was a child I used to

5834
04:35:32,029 --> 04:35:33,720
sled on Scripture Hill

5835
04:35:33,720 --> 04:35:40,349
as before the hospital was over built and I've watched this

5836
04:35:40,349 --> 04:35:41,959
town become

5837
04:35:41,959 --> 04:35:46,860
basically decimated by one university the other one's

5838
04:35:46,860 --> 04:35:49,840
pretty good neighbor and

5839
04:35:49,840 --> 04:35:54,220
once one time in my hot rod political career I told some

5840
04:35:54,220 --> 04:35:56,080
people at North Texas

5841
04:35:56,080 --> 04:36:00,759
either go up or go away they've encroached throughout this

5842
04:36:00,759 --> 04:36:02,319
town they've

5843
04:36:02,319 --> 04:36:07,319
taken lots of buildings lots of property off the tax rolls

5844
04:36:07,319 --> 04:36:09,040
the latest I think

5845
04:36:09,040 --> 04:36:13,209
being there whatever that hill is called over there on Teas

5846
04:36:13,209 --> 04:36:14,880
ley and Dallas Drive

5847
04:36:14,880 --> 04:36:20,950
it took nine million dollars off the tax rolls this thing

5848
04:36:20,950 --> 04:36:23,080
here is such a ticky

5849
04:36:23,080 --> 04:36:26,360
tacky looking thing I can't believe they're doing it over

5850
04:36:26,360 --> 04:36:26,759
there in that

5851
04:36:26,759 --> 04:36:31,770
neighborhood I saw one of the City Council members was here

5852
04:36:31,770 --> 04:36:33,040
this evening

5853
04:36:33,040 --> 04:36:35,610
and I see another one sitting there probably be the next

5854
04:36:35,610 --> 04:36:36,279
City Council

5855
04:36:36,279 --> 04:36:48,259
member and I think that probably from Bonnie Bray to Winds

5856
04:36:48,259 --> 04:36:52,639
or on the north and

5857
04:36:52,639 --> 04:37:01,000
Woodrow on the east and probably 35 on the south with Dena

5858
04:37:01,000 --> 04:37:03,840
should be some kind

5859
04:37:03,840 --> 04:37:08,349
of a historic preserve if nothing else but these people

5860
04:37:08,349 --> 04:37:10,119
coming in from out of

5861
04:37:10,119 --> 04:37:15,479
town dangling money in front of everybody is crazy this is

5862
04:37:15,479 --> 04:37:16,200
a town to

5863
04:37:16,200 --> 04:37:22,880
live in I can't even breathe because of the damn pollution

5864
04:37:22,880 --> 04:37:24,959
this is this is a

5865
04:37:24,959 --> 04:37:30,340
this is a town with residents it's known as a college town

5866
04:37:30,340 --> 04:37:34,200
and it used to be and

5867
04:37:34,200 --> 04:37:38,310
administrators kind of fit in instead of running big

5868
04:37:38,310 --> 04:37:40,040
businesses that they think

5869
04:37:40,040 --> 04:37:42,819
they're running and I'm just rambling I just wanted to take

5870
04:37:42,819 --> 04:37:43,959
up time like Bradshaw

5871
04:37:43,959 --> 04:37:54,330
did but I know more than he does but I think this this spot

5872
04:37:54,330 --> 04:37:56,080
ty it broke my heart

5873
04:37:56,080 --> 04:38:01,040
when they tore down the hospital to build that crap from a

5874
04:38:01,040 --> 04:38:01,880
group of

5875
04:38:01,880 --> 04:38:05,590
California but that was our mayor Julian Brock's do it and

5876
04:38:05,590 --> 04:38:08,360
she had no roots in

5877
04:38:08,360 --> 04:38:12,880
this town she's hillbilly from over there and Van Alstine

5878
04:38:12,880 --> 04:38:13,919
or Van or wherever

5879
04:38:13,919 --> 04:38:19,490
she came from and they have no they have no interest in

5880
04:38:19,490 --> 04:38:21,200
this town other than can

5881
04:38:21,200 --> 04:38:25,810
they flip it for some money and this has got this it's got

5882
04:38:25,810 --> 04:38:26,759
to stop it's

5883
04:38:26,759 --> 04:38:30,290
nationwide it's just not dead it's everywhere but this

5884
04:38:30,290 --> 04:38:31,400
chasing the almighty

5885
04:38:31,400 --> 04:38:36,060
buck has nothing to do with little mobility I've still got

5886
04:38:36,060 --> 04:38:37,240
a minute left so

5887
04:38:37,240 --> 04:38:40,950
what do you want to talk about if we could just clarify for

5888
04:38:40,950 --> 04:38:42,080
the record are

5889
04:38:42,080 --> 04:38:45,840
you living in the city of Denton not yet but I could at any

5890
04:38:45,840 --> 04:38:47,000
given moment all I

5891
04:38:47,000 --> 04:38:50,990
got to do is go across I don't it's in the county all I got

5892
04:38:50,990 --> 04:38:51,560
to do is go across

5893
04:38:51,560 --> 04:38:53,700
the barbed wire fence and I'll be in didn't we just want to

5894
04:38:53,700 --> 04:38:54,159
be able to

5895
04:38:54,159 --> 04:38:57,970
identify I will fill out a card for you so that you'll be

5896
04:38:57,970 --> 04:38:59,279
very happy thank you

5897
04:38:59,279 --> 04:39:05,349
sir I guess I've lived in didn't too long went out but

5898
04:39:05,349 --> 04:39:06,279
anyway that's another

5899
04:39:06,279 --> 04:39:12,349
story so what else can you be entertained with guess we

5900
04:39:12,349 --> 04:39:13,439
talk about old

5901
04:39:13,439 --> 04:39:17,479
folks and tax freezes and that silliness but anyway that

5902
04:39:17,479 --> 04:39:18,599
has nothing to do with

5903
04:39:18,599 --> 04:39:22,029
P&Z I can't really think of anything else I do admire you

5904
04:39:22,029 --> 04:39:23,360
people for putting

5905
04:39:23,360 --> 04:39:29,900
up with all this stuff yeah but I can't see the traffic I

5906
04:39:29,900 --> 04:39:31,479
do have an idea that

5907
04:39:31,479 --> 04:39:35,470
I'm going to present to council yes probably I'll take it

5908
04:39:35,470 --> 04:39:36,680
to P&Z first but

5909
04:39:36,680 --> 04:39:39,599
we'll talk about that at a later date thank you for your

5910
04:39:39,599 --> 04:39:40,479
time thank you for

5911
04:39:40,479 --> 04:39:47,439
your comments again this is a public hearing anyone else

5912
04:39:47,439 --> 04:39:48,040
who would like to

5913
04:39:48,040 --> 04:39:56,880
speak on this item please give us your name and address and

5914
04:39:56,880 --> 04:39:57,319
then fill out a

5915
04:39:57,319 --> 04:40:01,799
card for us please sir Tim Garenger 1108 West Congress

5916
04:40:01,799 --> 04:40:03,959
Street I'd like to speak in

5917
04:40:03,959 --> 04:40:06,549
opposition to this and I'll be brief because people have

5918
04:40:06,549 --> 04:40:07,400
said pretty much

5919
04:40:07,400 --> 04:40:10,560
the same things I'm gonna say and it's getting late I live

5920
04:40:10,560 --> 04:40:11,840
very close to the

5921
04:40:11,840 --> 04:40:14,659
site not close enough to get a notification also it's not

5922
04:40:14,659 --> 04:40:15,279
involved in

5923
04:40:15,279 --> 04:40:18,849
any type of community meetings with the developer two main

5924
04:40:18,849 --> 04:40:20,159
reasons I'm against

5925
04:40:20,159 --> 04:40:23,490
this are it just doesn't fit the neighborhood I moved in

5926
04:40:23,490 --> 04:40:24,360
neighborhood

5927
04:40:24,360 --> 04:40:26,939
full understanding that the current use is not idea it's

5928
04:40:26,939 --> 04:40:28,520
not a pretty place it's

5929
04:40:28,520 --> 04:40:32,049
probably gonna be developed but this proposal here looks

5930
04:40:32,049 --> 04:40:33,200
completely out of

5931
04:40:33,200 --> 04:40:35,500
place it's just too big for the neighborhood it also doesn

5932
04:40:35,500 --> 04:40:35,959
't really

5933
04:40:35,959 --> 04:40:38,560
provide anything for the people that live there that aren't

5934
04:40:38,560 --> 04:40:39,360
students you know

5935
04:40:39,360 --> 04:40:42,909
it'd be nice if there's some mixed use some restaurants

5936
04:40:42,909 --> 04:40:44,360
whatever my other main

5937
04:40:44,360 --> 04:40:48,040
concern is the traffic now I came to the last meeting and I

5938
04:40:48,040 --> 04:40:48,680
remember some of the

5939
04:40:48,680 --> 04:40:51,500
commission asked if they had done any traffic studies or

5940
04:40:51,500 --> 04:40:53,680
numbers and a member

5941
04:40:53,680 --> 04:40:56,869
of the city staff came up and said yes but it was a very

5942
04:40:56,869 --> 04:40:57,959
weak study and it

5943
04:40:57,959 --> 04:41:01,990
didn't really hold much weight I can tell you that the

5944
04:41:01,990 --> 04:41:03,360
traffic there is

5945
04:41:03,360 --> 04:41:07,349
getting worse and worse every year it's probably the most

5946
04:41:07,349 --> 04:41:08,759
popular place in Denton

5947
04:41:08,759 --> 04:41:14,400
to run a stop sign or to peel out I can't imagine I don't

5948
04:41:14,400 --> 04:41:15,400
buy this idea that

5949
04:41:15,400 --> 04:41:19,840
this is gonna make this a completely walkable situation I

5950
04:41:19,840 --> 04:41:21,099
fully support that

5951
04:41:21,099 --> 04:41:24,810
want people to walk and bike but as someone who has to go

5952
04:41:24,810 --> 04:41:25,959
by youth center

5953
04:41:25,959 --> 04:41:29,619
and Fry's our city park every day I could tell you there

5954
04:41:29,619 --> 04:41:30,319
are plenty of cars

5955
04:41:30,319 --> 04:41:34,189
coming in and out of those buildings and because Oak Street

5956
04:41:34,189 --> 04:41:35,479
is one way going west

5957
04:41:35,479 --> 04:41:37,880
anybody needs to go east it's coming down Congress Street

5958
04:41:37,880 --> 04:41:38,639
if you look at the

5959
04:41:38,639 --> 04:41:41,560
map and yeah there's nowhere to buy groceries around there

5960
04:41:41,560 --> 04:41:42,759
anyone was go

5961
04:41:42,759 --> 04:41:46,619
downtown not everybody's gonna walk a lot of people we

5962
04:41:46,619 --> 04:41:47,319
drive down Congress

5963
04:41:47,319 --> 04:41:51,520
Street so that's why I'm opposed thank you thank you for

5964
04:41:51,520 --> 04:41:54,159
your comments okay

5965
04:41:54,159 --> 04:41:57,450
and this is a public hearing anyone else who would like to

5966
04:41:57,450 --> 04:41:59,639
speak on this item

5967
04:41:59,639 --> 04:42:04,680
anyone else seeing none we will close the public hearing

5968
04:42:04,680 --> 04:42:06,599
and open the floor

5969
04:42:06,599 --> 04:42:13,400
for discussion Commissioner Taylor thank you chair so to to

5970
04:42:13,400 --> 04:42:14,159
answer

5971
04:42:14,159 --> 04:42:18,909
Commissioner Beck's heed from earlier I've been trying to

5972
04:42:18,909 --> 04:42:20,400
figure out why this

5973
04:42:20,400 --> 04:42:26,979
little strip got DCG got zone DCG in 2002 and 1999 there

5974
04:42:26,979 --> 04:42:27,799
was a citywide

5975
04:42:27,799 --> 04:42:32,360
planning you know organ planning called the Denton plan

5976
04:42:32,360 --> 04:42:34,400
2020 and then it took a

5977
04:42:34,400 --> 04:42:38,090
few years for citywide rezoning to roll down from that and

5978
04:42:38,090 --> 04:42:38,840
a lot of the

5979
04:42:38,840 --> 04:42:42,409
rezoning was to to match existing use especially in these

5980
04:42:42,409 --> 04:42:43,319
established

5981
04:42:43,319 --> 04:42:45,599
neighborhoods and so I was trying to figure out what

5982
04:42:45,599 --> 04:42:46,560
existing uses would

5983
04:42:46,560 --> 04:42:51,000
drive DCG which is our most intensive zoning category in

5984
04:42:51,000 --> 04:42:52,119
our in the downtown

5985
04:42:52,119 --> 04:42:56,939
area and I think I found the three things that that caused

5986
04:42:56,939 --> 04:42:58,040
this first is

5987
04:42:58,040 --> 04:43:01,200
drive-thrus drive-thrus aren't allowed in any other

5988
04:43:01,200 --> 04:43:04,439
downtown zoning district so

5989
04:43:04,439 --> 04:43:08,479
you had what was the quick stir and before that another

5990
04:43:08,479 --> 04:43:09,360
restaurant that has

5991
04:43:09,360 --> 04:43:13,400
a drive-thru at the corner of Jago and scripture so that

5992
04:43:13,400 --> 04:43:15,240
had to be the only

5993
04:43:15,240 --> 04:43:19,360
zoning category and that had that allowed drive-thrus was

5994
04:43:19,360 --> 04:43:21,200
DCG and then you

5995
04:43:21,200 --> 04:43:24,720
had it pharmacies again a pharmacy if you have a drive-thru

5996
04:43:24,720 --> 04:43:25,159
window at a

5997
04:43:25,159 --> 04:43:33,040
pharmacy requires DCG then this specific building is that

5998
04:43:33,040 --> 04:43:33,880
exists there on the

5999
04:43:33,880 --> 04:43:39,950
site today is 32,000 square feet in there's there was a

6000
04:43:39,950 --> 04:43:42,080
limitation l-17 that

6001
04:43:42,080 --> 04:43:45,709
was amended in 2013 and that's why I know because it was a

6002
04:43:45,709 --> 04:43:46,560
contentious

6003
04:43:46,560 --> 04:43:52,630
amendment whenever I first joined this commission but until

6004
04:43:52,630 --> 04:43:56,000
2013 l-17

6005
04:43:56,000 --> 04:44:00,810
restricted the maximum use of a professional or office

6006
04:44:00,810 --> 04:44:02,439
space to 25,000

6007
04:44:02,439 --> 04:44:08,000
square feet and so l-17 prevented this from being DCN or dr

6008
04:44:08,000 --> 04:44:09,599
2 so the only

6009
04:44:09,599 --> 04:44:13,459
category where you could have a 30,000 square foot office

6010
04:44:13,459 --> 04:44:15,479
building was in DCG

6011
04:44:15,479 --> 04:44:19,909
so I think that's why there's this little strip basically

6012
04:44:19,909 --> 04:44:21,560
three of the six lots

6013
04:44:21,560 --> 04:44:25,659
required this zoning and so they just the gap the gap lots

6014
04:44:25,659 --> 04:44:26,799
got zoned in as

6015
04:44:26,799 --> 04:44:31,080
well and this is kind of a flaw with the DCG zoning

6016
04:44:31,080 --> 04:44:33,520
category it's a huge jump from

6017
04:44:33,520 --> 04:44:38,909
DC and DCG it's you know a massive it goes multi basically

6018
04:44:38,909 --> 04:44:40,240
multi-use with any

6019
04:44:40,240 --> 04:44:44,849
possible use you can have you know nightclubs and office

6020
04:44:44,849 --> 04:44:46,040
buildings and a

6021
04:44:46,040 --> 04:44:49,000
hundred foot tall buildings and some hundred and something

6022
04:44:49,000 --> 04:44:49,759
hundred fifty

6023
04:44:49,759 --> 04:44:54,750
units per acre you know this really high density and that's

6024
04:44:54,750 --> 04:44:56,360
a jump up from 45

6025
04:44:56,360 --> 04:45:00,680
feet and you know 50 units per acre and lots and lots of

6026
04:45:00,680 --> 04:45:02,000
restrictions on

6027
04:45:02,000 --> 04:45:04,779
restaurants can't be bigger than 5,000 square feet no drive

6028
04:45:04,779 --> 04:45:05,560
-throughs no gas

6029
04:45:05,560 --> 04:45:10,630
stations no all of these other uses and so the bucket that

6030
04:45:10,630 --> 04:45:11,959
everything lands in

6031
04:45:11,959 --> 04:45:18,669
is DCG since that was a mistake I don't think we need to

6032
04:45:18,669 --> 04:45:19,560
make two mistakes by

6033
04:45:19,560 --> 04:45:24,569
expanding DCG another two or three hundred feet into this

6034
04:45:24,569 --> 04:45:26,279
into this area this

6035
04:45:26,279 --> 04:45:32,349
is a it doesn't really meet the context of the area even

6036
04:45:32,349 --> 04:45:34,680
City Park has 35 foot

6037
04:45:34,680 --> 04:45:38,639
setbacks from the curb to the to the buildings is 35 feet

6038
04:45:38,639 --> 04:45:39,919
this would be 20

6039
04:45:39,919 --> 04:45:44,520
feet at that 46 foot height never minding anything higher

6040
04:45:44,520 --> 04:45:45,520
46 foot height

6041
04:45:45,520 --> 04:45:51,240
20 feet from Scripture it in on December 25th the shadow

6042
04:45:51,240 --> 04:45:52,560
that's cast will reach

6043
04:45:52,560 --> 04:45:56,549
all the way across the entire street and cast the shadow on

6044
04:45:56,549 --> 04:45:57,520
the north side of

6045
04:45:57,520 --> 04:46:00,409
Scripture from the height of the buildings and everything

6046
04:46:00,409 --> 04:46:01,119
else south of

6047
04:46:01,119 --> 04:46:05,240
Scripture and north of oak is about two stories you might

6048
04:46:05,240 --> 04:46:07,080
hit 30 35 feet at the

6049
04:46:07,080 --> 04:46:11,259
tops of the gables of the apartment buildings over there so

6050
04:46:11,259 --> 04:46:13,319
how do we fit in

6051
04:46:13,319 --> 04:46:17,200
that context we don't this is not a really a historic

6052
04:46:17,200 --> 04:46:17,959
district there might

6053
04:46:17,959 --> 04:46:21,189
be some historic homes but at least half of its apartments

6054
04:46:21,189 --> 04:46:22,560
built in the 60s or

6055
04:46:22,560 --> 04:46:26,599
70s or 80s or some what could have been a historic home

6056
04:46:26,599 --> 04:46:28,720
that's been cut into

6057
04:46:28,720 --> 04:46:32,669
four apartments or things like that but we still I feel

6058
04:46:32,669 --> 04:46:34,560
need to keep the context

6059
04:46:34,560 --> 04:46:40,119
of this neighborhood and whenever we talk about context

6060
04:46:40,119 --> 04:46:41,000
usually we talk about

6061
04:46:41,000 --> 04:46:44,259
zoning in terms of use and so this use is allowed and you

6062
04:46:44,259 --> 04:46:45,319
know we've got some

6063
04:46:45,319 --> 04:46:48,520
minor dimensional requirements another important aspect of

6064
04:46:48,520 --> 04:46:50,360
zoning is form we

6065
04:46:50,360 --> 04:46:54,119
especially apply form in our residential areas we have side

6066
04:46:54,119 --> 04:46:55,520
yards must be 20 feet

6067
04:46:55,520 --> 04:46:59,330
houses must be this far apart away from the street and from

6068
04:46:59,330 --> 04:47:00,840
alleys and fences so

6069
04:47:00,840 --> 04:47:04,409
forth in and that forms the neighborhood it gives gives us

6070
04:47:04,409 --> 04:47:05,040
the neighborhood of

6071
04:47:05,040 --> 04:47:08,919
shape like it has to look a certain way and our commercial

6072
04:47:08,919 --> 04:47:10,279
zonings really lack a

6073
04:47:10,279 --> 04:47:14,250
lot of form guidance we we just have some really basic

6074
04:47:14,250 --> 04:47:15,919
dimensional rules and

6075
04:47:15,919 --> 04:47:18,790
we don't you know you can have it a brick building or a

6076
04:47:18,790 --> 04:47:20,119
concrete building or

6077
04:47:20,119 --> 04:47:25,500
whatever but this area with this residential mixed in if we

6078
04:47:25,500 --> 04:47:26,680
had something

6079
04:47:26,680 --> 04:47:29,880
that matched the form it would fit the context

6080
04:47:29,880 --> 04:47:31,479
unfortunately we don't have form

6081
04:47:31,479 --> 04:47:35,790
based zoning but I think this would be a prime little area

6082
04:47:35,790 --> 04:47:37,520
this dr2 block from

6083
04:47:37,520 --> 04:47:39,909
oak to scripture would be a perfect place to have form-

6084
04:47:39,909 --> 04:47:40,799
based zoning that

6085
04:47:40,799 --> 04:47:44,490
would allow two or maybe even three story apartments with

6086
04:47:44,490 --> 04:47:46,240
enough buffer to

6087
04:47:46,240 --> 04:47:50,099
the single-family existing homes it would allow infill one

6088
04:47:50,099 --> 04:47:51,119
to four lots at a

6089
04:47:51,119 --> 04:47:54,409
time we could have you could convert the houses that need

6090
04:47:54,409 --> 04:47:55,680
to be demolished into

6091
04:47:55,680 --> 04:47:59,540
something else but that that doesn't help us tonight

6092
04:47:59,540 --> 04:48:00,720
because we can't enact

6093
04:48:00,720 --> 04:48:04,400
form-based zoning tonight however that I think that's the

6094
04:48:04,400 --> 04:48:05,200
direction we need to go

6095
04:48:05,200 --> 04:48:11,619
with this if this were in West Campus cement city I think

6096
04:48:11,619 --> 04:48:12,680
we do need to

6097
04:48:12,680 --> 04:48:16,119
rezone cement city to DCG that's a place that needs

6098
04:48:16,119 --> 04:48:18,360
commercial it needs the

6099
04:48:18,360 --> 04:48:21,119
retail on the ground level and it'd be a great place to

6100
04:48:21,119 --> 04:48:22,840
build a 30 or 40 or 50

6101
04:48:22,840 --> 04:48:26,799
foot apartment you're not gonna know trees to shed to shade

6102
04:48:26,799 --> 04:48:28,240
there's no

6103
04:48:28,240 --> 04:48:31,669
historic homes that will be overwhelmed by a 40 or 60 foot

6104
04:48:31,669 --> 04:48:32,919
building or 70 foot

6105
04:48:32,919 --> 04:48:36,200
building same on South Campus we already have a large area

6106
04:48:36,200 --> 04:48:37,360
of South Campus zone

6107
04:48:37,360 --> 04:48:42,400
DCG and I think we could even use more down there because

6108
04:48:42,400 --> 04:48:43,159
there isn't a

6109
04:48:43,159 --> 04:48:46,319
historic neighborhood to protect there isn't there aren't a

6110
04:48:46,319 --> 04:48:47,520
lot of historical

6111
04:48:47,520 --> 04:48:51,090
assets and cultural assets there and it's still a three-

6112
04:48:51,090 --> 04:48:52,479
block walk to campus

6113
04:48:52,479 --> 04:48:56,380
so it's a great student housing area but I just can't see

6114
04:48:56,380 --> 04:48:57,759
this being appropriate

6115
04:48:57,759 --> 04:49:01,299
on the north side of town and I don't think we should take

6116
04:49:01,299 --> 04:49:02,680
a veiled threat of

6117
04:49:02,680 --> 04:49:06,279
something worse and double down and make two mistakes

6118
04:49:06,279 --> 04:49:08,720
instead of one

6119
04:49:10,159 --> 04:49:18,279
Commissioner Hespeth I didn't call Lee back up because I

6120
04:49:18,279 --> 04:49:19,119
didn't have a question

6121
04:49:19,119 --> 04:49:22,310
I was just going to be a long soliloquy so that that's

6122
04:49:22,310 --> 04:49:24,400
pointless but I'll just

6123
04:49:24,400 --> 04:49:30,520
tell you I echo everything Commissioner Taylor said I can't

6124
04:49:30,520 --> 04:49:32,159
and I hope it's

6125
04:49:32,159 --> 04:49:35,970
everyone's good at whole numbers and I'm really excited

6126
04:49:35,970 --> 04:49:39,119
about Devin Taylor's

6127
04:49:39,119 --> 04:49:42,409
Commissioner Taylor's perspective I'm excited about Larry's

6128
04:49:42,409 --> 04:49:43,400
perspective and

6129
04:49:43,400 --> 04:49:48,650
and I'm looking for more perspective to send a clear

6130
04:49:48,650 --> 04:49:51,560
message the the residents

6131
04:49:51,560 --> 04:49:56,040
in this community I think it's it's not right to take

6132
04:49:56,040 --> 04:49:58,639
someone that is visited

6133
04:49:58,639 --> 04:50:04,840
our area who has 100% control right it's rare that someone

6134
04:50:04,840 --> 04:50:06,799
comes to us that has

6135
04:50:06,799 --> 04:50:11,229
absolute autonomy they can go from meeting every need that

6136
04:50:11,229 --> 04:50:11,799
the citizens

6137
04:50:11,799 --> 04:50:15,479
want to absolutely ignoring every need the citizens want it

6138
04:50:15,479 --> 04:50:16,599
never happens that

6139
04:50:16,599 --> 04:50:22,669
way and given that opportunity they said love it or hate it

6140
04:50:22,669 --> 04:50:25,159
if you love it we'll

6141
04:50:25,159 --> 04:50:28,900
start at hate and if you hate it we'll start it egregious

6142
04:50:28,900 --> 04:50:30,319
and and said take it

6143
04:50:30,319 --> 04:50:35,049
you know and and that to me is insensitive it's

6144
04:50:35,049 --> 04:50:37,240
disconnected to the

6145
04:50:37,240 --> 04:50:43,549
area it's it lacks empathy for the area it lacks insight I

6146
04:50:43,549 --> 04:50:44,599
mean I grew up on

6147
04:50:44,599 --> 04:50:48,220
Bonnie Bray Street and I was up and down scripture all the

6148
04:50:48,220 --> 04:50:49,159
time I went to that

6149
04:50:49,159 --> 04:50:51,880
howdy duty a million times I don't know that howdy duty

6150
04:50:51,880 --> 04:50:53,119
would live in any other

6151
04:50:53,119 --> 04:50:55,389
neighborhood I mean I just don't think it would survive I

6152
04:50:55,389 --> 04:50:56,560
mean but so I think

6153
04:50:56,560 --> 04:51:00,029
there's just so much history in that area that has just

6154
04:51:00,029 --> 04:51:01,119
been discarded

6155
04:51:01,119 --> 04:51:04,029
because maybe you don't want to pay a premium for somebody

6156
04:51:04,029 --> 04:51:05,000
else to buy from a

6157
04:51:05,000 --> 04:51:10,080
realtor maybe you want to take advantage of some creative

6158
04:51:10,080 --> 04:51:12,720
zoning but I really do

6159
04:51:12,720 --> 04:51:17,479
take it as it's just disingenuous given the offer given the

6160
04:51:17,479 --> 04:51:18,680
world given the

6161
04:51:18,680 --> 04:51:23,319
opportunity to meet and you have complete autonomy you can

6162
04:51:23,319 --> 04:51:24,240
meet every

6163
04:51:24,240 --> 04:51:30,310
need or ignore every wish and you choose to come as come as

6164
04:51:30,310 --> 04:51:31,479
far as your budget

6165
04:51:31,479 --> 04:51:36,099
will let you and and knots and stop there and so to my

6166
04:51:36,099 --> 04:51:38,439
earlier point when

6167
04:51:38,439 --> 04:51:45,689
you leave 21 cards in opposition when you have one two

6168
04:51:45,689 --> 04:51:48,959
three four five six seven

6169
04:51:48,959 --> 04:51:56,569
eight nine I'll give Bob Clifton half ten and a half so

6170
04:51:56,569 --> 04:51:59,400
that's 31 people in

6171
04:51:59,400 --> 04:52:03,950
opposition and two in support and you don't I have to

6172
04:52:03,950 --> 04:52:05,880
reconcile that with the

6173
04:52:05,880 --> 04:52:08,700
people that live here not the people that invest here not

6174
04:52:08,700 --> 04:52:09,439
the people that

6175
04:52:09,439 --> 04:52:12,049
design here the people that live here and I've been in the

6176
04:52:12,049 --> 04:52:13,119
neighborhood and I'm

6177
04:52:13,119 --> 04:52:16,639
telling you I know it doesn't fit it does not fit at all

6178
04:52:16,639 --> 04:52:18,040
and so I think it's

6179
04:52:18,040 --> 04:52:22,209
just for me that that's that's what I have to reconcile and

6180
04:52:22,209 --> 04:52:23,439
I don't think it's

6181
04:52:23,439 --> 04:52:27,880
again the most glaring thing is they did not there's no

6182
04:52:27,880 --> 04:52:30,080
restrictions they could

6183
04:52:30,080 --> 04:52:33,689
meet every need that the citizens want and put a three-

6184
04:52:33,689 --> 04:52:34,959
story building and

6185
04:52:34,959 --> 04:52:38,119
sprawl it across that entire lot they could buy the house

6186
04:52:38,119 --> 04:52:39,080
at the end they could

6187
04:52:39,080 --> 04:52:41,950
buy the apartments at the end they could I'll tell you you

6188
04:52:41,950 --> 04:52:43,119
don't need the swimming

6189
04:52:43,119 --> 04:52:46,279
pool if you want to get creative and show some empathy show

6190
04:52:46,279 --> 04:52:47,319
some compassion

6191
04:52:47,319 --> 04:52:49,770
take the swimming pool out and give out an auditorium

6192
04:52:49,770 --> 04:52:50,720
tickets now you're

6193
04:52:50,720 --> 04:52:53,889
investing in our city you're invested in an auditorium you

6194
04:52:53,889 --> 04:52:55,279
're saying hey kids

6195
04:52:55,279 --> 04:52:58,020
we're not going to build a swimming pool because we want to

6196
04:52:58,020 --> 04:52:59,240
be sensitive to the

6197
04:52:59,240 --> 04:53:02,599
neighborhood and we're guests here but we're also going to

6198
04:53:02,599 --> 04:53:03,560
invest in Denton and

6199
04:53:03,560 --> 04:53:07,200
say here's season passes for everyone to go to the natatory

6200
04:53:07,200 --> 04:53:08,319
just like different

6201
04:53:08,319 --> 04:53:12,000
different apartment complexes give season to give a tickets

6202
04:53:12,000 --> 04:53:12,919
to the gym or

6203
04:53:12,919 --> 04:53:16,119
memberships to the gym that's empathy that's caring that's

6204
04:53:16,119 --> 04:53:17,720
understanding that

6205
04:53:17,720 --> 04:53:22,090
you bumped up against the wrong neighborhood and so there's

6206
04:53:22,090 --> 04:53:22,840
other

6207
04:53:22,840 --> 04:53:25,110
neighborhood and I'm absolutely I think we need to move on

6208
04:53:25,110 --> 04:53:26,240
that post haste for

6209
04:53:26,240 --> 04:53:29,639
cement city I mean I think that absolutely needs upgrade

6210
04:53:29,639 --> 04:53:31,439
and so with

6211
04:53:31,439 --> 04:53:38,400
that I'll I'll sit back in and watch commissioner Sullivan

6212
04:53:38,400 --> 04:53:39,799
when I was going

6213
04:53:39,799 --> 04:53:43,790
through all of this I looked at and I thought that doesn't

6214
04:53:43,790 --> 04:53:45,080
look too good and

6215
04:53:45,080 --> 04:53:46,979
then the more I looked I thought well maybe the

6216
04:53:46,979 --> 04:53:49,000
neighborhood needs upgrading

6217
04:53:49,000 --> 04:53:55,150
and then I started looking some of these letters and looked

6218
04:53:55,150 --> 04:53:57,080
again on the maps and

6219
04:53:57,080 --> 04:54:02,119
I'm thinking we've been told we've got two options we can

6220
04:54:02,119 --> 04:54:03,959
vote for the change

6221
04:54:03,959 --> 04:54:11,279
and they're proposing a 70 foot height which nobody you

6222
04:54:11,279 --> 04:54:12,200
know none of the people

6223
04:54:12,200 --> 04:54:17,580
want in this overlay thing 45 feet 70 feet 100 feet we

6224
04:54:17,580 --> 04:54:19,279
could vote against it

6225
04:54:19,279 --> 04:54:22,090
and they'll go all the way to 100 feet well my

6226
04:54:22,090 --> 04:54:23,720
understanding is the third

6227
04:54:23,720 --> 04:54:27,889
option is we vote against it and when they bring 100 feet

6228
04:54:27,889 --> 04:54:29,880
we deny that and we

6229
04:54:29,880 --> 04:54:33,360
put it back where it ought to be at whatever level we feel

6230
04:54:33,360 --> 04:54:35,119
it's necessary or

6231
04:54:35,119 --> 04:54:38,770
prudent or proper at that point in time so that just

6232
04:54:38,770 --> 04:54:40,599
because we vote against

6233
04:54:40,599 --> 04:54:45,799
this doesn't necessarily mean that we're going to do

6234
04:54:45,799 --> 04:54:47,080
something that's against

6235
04:54:47,080 --> 04:54:50,639
what the neighborhood wants that we still have another

6236
04:54:50,639 --> 04:54:52,000
option down the road

6237
04:54:52,000 --> 04:54:55,439
and that is to deny whatever plan they bring to us at that

6238
04:54:55,439 --> 04:54:57,319
point in time am I

6239
04:54:57,319 --> 04:55:05,759
correct in that I'll let staff address that question should

6240
04:55:05,759 --> 04:55:06,880
the Planning and

6241
04:55:06,880 --> 04:55:11,159
Zoning Commission recommend denial and depending on what

6242
04:55:11,159 --> 04:55:12,720
the outcome is at City

6243
04:55:12,720 --> 04:55:15,880
Council let's assume zoning change does not occur the

6244
04:55:15,880 --> 04:55:17,439
applicant under both

6245
04:55:17,439 --> 04:55:20,180
zoning districts with a split zoning district is actually

6246
04:55:20,180 --> 04:55:20,959
able to develop

6247
04:55:20,959 --> 04:55:25,080
with multifamily use it is a use that is permitted by right

6248
04:55:25,080 --> 04:55:26,279
in the DCG district

6249
04:55:26,279 --> 04:55:31,330
and the DR2 district as it relates to the height and my

6250
04:55:31,330 --> 04:55:33,000
understanding or

6251
04:55:33,000 --> 04:55:36,610
inference from the Commission tonight was to talk about

6252
04:55:36,610 --> 04:55:37,959
perhaps some type of

6253
04:55:37,959 --> 04:55:41,520
overlay that would restrict potentially the building height

6254
04:55:41,520 --> 04:55:43,479
one of the

6255
04:55:43,479 --> 04:55:46,680
restrictions that I believe based on what I've heard this

6256
04:55:46,680 --> 04:55:47,680
evening from the

6257
04:55:47,680 --> 04:55:51,369
applicant was to limit the height of the building to for

6258
04:55:51,369 --> 04:55:53,560
example 70 story now

6259
04:55:53,560 --> 04:55:57,169
going back to the split zoning the front half of the

6260
04:55:57,169 --> 04:55:59,759
development which fronts

6261
04:55:59,759 --> 04:56:04,080
scripture the building height the maximum building height

6262
04:56:04,080 --> 04:56:05,400
is 100 feet

6263
04:56:05,400 --> 04:56:08,200
however the DR2 district to the south which they abide

6264
04:56:08,200 --> 04:56:09,119
which they have the

6265
04:56:09,119 --> 04:56:13,669
ownership to if I'm not mistaken that height is capped at

6266
04:56:13,669 --> 04:56:15,279
45 feet if I'm not

6267
04:56:15,279 --> 04:56:19,450
mistaken thanks Julie and so they can they can you know if

6268
04:56:19,450 --> 04:56:20,200
they can accommodate

6269
04:56:20,200 --> 04:56:23,630
the two zoning districts and the associated development

6270
04:56:23,630 --> 04:56:24,599
criteria for these

6271
04:56:24,599 --> 04:56:27,810
two zoning districts technically they could develop the

6272
04:56:27,810 --> 04:56:29,360
site now if the

6273
04:56:29,360 --> 04:56:32,750
zoning change is approved then they have consolidated the

6274
04:56:32,750 --> 04:56:33,959
zoning on the entire

6275
04:56:33,959 --> 04:56:38,150
three acres and they have the ability to develop under the

6276
04:56:38,150 --> 04:56:39,720
DCG parameters which

6277
04:56:39,720 --> 04:56:44,119
would permit a maximum building height of 100 feet

6278
04:56:45,279 --> 04:56:51,909
something not right it's all I gotta say okay Commissioner

6279
04:56:51,909 --> 04:56:53,560
Beck thank you chair

6280
04:56:53,560 --> 04:56:59,000
and all I've got a something I can add to what Commissioner

6281
04:56:59,000 --> 04:57:01,319
Sullivan's saying as

6282
04:57:01,319 --> 04:57:04,099
far as an understatement I've mentioned already but just

6283
04:57:04,099 --> 04:57:05,840
you know a few comments

6284
04:57:05,840 --> 04:57:13,520
here as I mentioned earlier in the work session the mixed-

6285
04:57:13,520 --> 04:57:16,119
use character this

6286
04:57:16,119 --> 04:57:20,610
area is not compatible with the DCD district along

6287
04:57:20,610 --> 04:57:23,080
scripture that's there's

6288
04:57:23,080 --> 04:57:26,279
no doubt about that thanks to Commissioner Tater for

6289
04:57:26,279 --> 04:57:29,189
informing us why we got DCG in the first place and I

6290
04:57:29,189 --> 04:57:31,040
appreciate that but clearly

6291
04:57:31,040 --> 04:57:35,689
rather than and you know not to accuse anybody back then in

6292
04:57:35,689 --> 04:57:37,919
2002 but why they

6293
04:57:37,919 --> 04:57:41,490
didn't see the writing on the wall with what we're

6294
04:57:41,490 --> 04:57:44,360
confronted with today it's a

6295
04:57:44,360 --> 04:57:48,139
shame that they didn't revert it back to DR2 and that puts

6296
04:57:48,139 --> 04:57:49,200
us in this position

6297
04:57:49,200 --> 04:57:57,220
today I think the African has a wonderful product I've said

6298
04:57:57,220 --> 04:57:58,240
that I'd be glad to

6299
04:57:58,240 --> 04:58:01,400
see them build anywhere else around there again the idea

6300
04:58:01,400 --> 04:58:02,159
that we could

6301
04:58:02,159 --> 04:58:07,040
rezone cement city to DCG is great that would open that up

6302
04:58:07,040 --> 04:58:08,959
for not only this

6303
04:58:08,959 --> 04:58:13,009
developer but other developer the idea that we need to

6304
04:58:13,009 --> 04:58:14,919
build this for a growing

6305
04:58:14,919 --> 04:58:18,080
student population again I think has been reviewed by the

6306
04:58:18,080 --> 04:58:19,119
fact by several

6307
04:58:19,119 --> 04:58:22,080
statements here that and I guess the most glaring one is

6308
04:58:22,080 --> 04:58:23,599
the fact that UNT is

6309
04:58:23,599 --> 04:58:28,560
never here to support that notion the footprint that the

6310
04:58:28,560 --> 04:58:30,000
part 7 development

6311
04:58:30,000 --> 04:58:33,259
with its hundred and fifty dwellings per acre just simply

6312
04:58:33,259 --> 04:58:34,479
doesn't represent a

6313
04:58:34,479 --> 04:58:39,080
gradual transition I just don't see that it will stick out

6314
04:58:39,080 --> 04:58:40,959
and this will diminish

6315
04:58:40,959 --> 04:58:44,860
the neighborhood that we all really are fond of and have

6316
04:58:44,860 --> 04:58:46,200
been for quite a while

6317
04:58:46,200 --> 04:58:51,240
so what I would consider doing and for everybody to think

6318
04:58:51,240 --> 04:58:52,959
about here is make a

6319
04:58:52,959 --> 04:58:56,569
motion because we want to protect this area again from

6320
04:58:56,569 --> 04:58:58,240
future encroachments

6321
04:58:58,240 --> 04:59:01,159
again because this is not gonna end it's going to come back

6322
04:59:01,159 --> 04:59:04,080
up and I don't think

6323
04:59:04,080 --> 04:59:11,279
denial is gonna work like we want this Manal said that this

6324
04:59:11,279 --> 04:59:13,279
could not they

6325
04:59:13,279 --> 04:59:17,709
could work against it so my suggestion is we approve the

6326
04:59:17,709 --> 04:59:18,560
applicant's request

6327
04:59:18,560 --> 04:59:23,330
with the amendment that we attach a mixed-use residential

6328
04:59:23,330 --> 04:59:24,479
overlay that

6329
04:59:24,479 --> 04:59:27,639
limits building heights and a few other things and I would

6330
04:59:27,639 --> 04:59:29,080
limit the building

6331
04:59:29,080 --> 04:59:34,459
height to 40 feet I'd keep it at what dr4 is we I want to

6332
04:59:34,459 --> 04:59:36,000
keep it at three

6333
04:59:36,000 --> 04:59:42,069
stories if that's 40 feet fine if it's 35 feet pardon me is

6334
04:59:42,069 --> 04:59:46,159
three story right

6335
04:59:46,159 --> 04:59:48,919
right but that might we might squeeze it four story in that

6336
04:59:48,919 --> 04:59:49,880
so I want to keep it

6337
04:59:49,880 --> 04:59:54,849
at three stories keep it at now I'm okay with the 30 dwell

6338
04:59:54,849 --> 04:59:57,599
ings per acre that's in

6339
04:59:57,599 --> 05:00:02,840
the dr4 and the if I could just make a note for the

6340
05:00:02,840 --> 05:00:04,560
Commission you don't want

6341
05:00:04,560 --> 05:00:09,520
to down zone so the minimum that they would have to or the

6342
05:00:09,520 --> 05:00:10,360
maximum they would

6343
05:00:10,360 --> 05:00:13,040
have to do if they did the most restrictive zoning

6344
05:00:13,040 --> 05:00:13,799
according to their

6345
05:00:13,799 --> 05:00:18,939
law it would be 45 you don't want to go below that on your

6346
05:00:18,939 --> 05:00:22,279
overlay okay I

6347
05:00:22,279 --> 05:00:28,799
wouldn't or I could do not all right then let's say the

6348
05:00:28,799 --> 05:00:30,319
requirements that

6349
05:00:30,319 --> 05:00:36,380
allow heights and setbacks and everything in the dr2 would

6350
05:00:36,380 --> 05:00:37,360
be what this overlay

6351
05:00:37,360 --> 05:00:41,680
would consist of in we could start with this area that this

6352
05:00:41,680 --> 05:00:42,959
project wants to

6353
05:00:42,959 --> 05:00:47,270
build on but I see this expanding even further going up to

6354
05:00:47,270 --> 05:00:49,119
Oak Street to

6355
05:00:49,119 --> 05:00:52,279
scripture maybe a little bit further south and as far west

6356
05:00:52,279 --> 05:00:53,119
as Bonnie Bray

6357
05:00:53,119 --> 05:00:59,490
this is not the mentor harassed developers we need we need

6358
05:00:59,490 --> 05:01:00,119
good

6359
05:01:00,119 --> 05:01:04,439
dwellings for families to live in and grow at a steady rate

6360
05:01:04,439 --> 05:01:05,639
but we need to do

6361
05:01:05,639 --> 05:01:09,279
it that doesn't diminish this area and we lose it in the

6362
05:01:09,279 --> 05:01:11,799
long run so I would I

6363
05:01:11,799 --> 05:01:15,939
wouldn't make that move that we approve it with the overlay

6364
05:01:15,939 --> 05:01:16,680
district

6365
05:01:16,680 --> 05:01:25,119
restrictions you make an emotion are we still doing

6366
05:01:25,119 --> 05:01:26,680
discussion well let's do

6367
05:01:26,680 --> 05:01:29,840
discussion then I can make a motion Commissioner Ellis

6368
05:01:29,840 --> 05:01:32,279
thank you chair thank

6369
05:01:32,279 --> 05:01:35,840
you everyone for speaking and thank you the applicants for

6370
05:01:35,840 --> 05:01:39,279
for presenting first

6371
05:01:39,279 --> 05:01:42,509
off I guess I'd like to say I'm what a missed opportunity

6372
05:01:42,509 --> 05:01:43,919
our city has had with

6373
05:01:43,919 --> 05:01:47,080
putting us in this position this was clearly a lot that

6374
05:01:47,080 --> 05:01:48,119
should have been

6375
05:01:48,119 --> 05:01:52,360
rezoned a long time ago it is a mess of a zoning and it's

6376
05:01:52,360 --> 05:01:53,840
what puts us in this

6377
05:01:53,840 --> 05:01:58,040
position today I'm sure the reason staff is recommending it

6378
05:01:58,040 --> 05:02:00,040
is is so we can we

6379
05:02:00,040 --> 05:02:03,720
can collectively put one zoning on this property which

6380
05:02:03,720 --> 05:02:05,040
makes no sense to be

6381
05:02:05,040 --> 05:02:11,400
divided in half and while I understand that this

6382
05:02:11,400 --> 05:02:13,680
development does not fit in

6383
05:02:13,680 --> 05:02:20,610
this area I know we take the gamble by denying this and

6384
05:02:20,610 --> 05:02:22,040
allowing that front

6385
05:02:22,040 --> 05:02:25,740
portion to be up to a hundred feet I would have to say that

6386
05:02:25,740 --> 05:02:26,799
's a gamble I'm

6387
05:02:26,799 --> 05:02:32,869
willing to take versus rezoning this setting it up for if

6388
05:02:32,869 --> 05:02:33,840
this project

6389
05:02:33,840 --> 05:02:38,560
doesn't work setting it up for a hundred store a hundred

6390
05:02:38,560 --> 05:02:40,360
feet you know throughout

6391
05:02:40,360 --> 05:02:43,090
this entire footprint you are taking two residential

6392
05:02:43,090 --> 05:02:44,560
properties along with this

6393
05:02:44,560 --> 05:02:49,560
request there's two single-family properties involved my

6394
05:02:49,560 --> 05:02:51,000
fear is this

6395
05:02:51,000 --> 05:02:55,029
happens it collapses the rest of the street the streets on

6396
05:02:55,029 --> 05:02:55,959
either side of it

6397
05:02:55,959 --> 05:02:58,840
it goes towards Hickory and towards the University and

6398
05:02:58,840 --> 05:03:00,000
takes that we've already

6399
05:03:00,000 --> 05:03:04,229
denied an SRO that that came before us although I do think

6400
05:03:04,229 --> 05:03:05,639
the project still

6401
05:03:05,639 --> 05:03:10,069
alive in council but that was the Vertmans property that

6402
05:03:10,069 --> 05:03:11,000
would clearly

6403
05:03:11,000 --> 05:03:15,610
come back if this happens now you've got this basically

6404
05:03:15,610 --> 05:03:17,400
student housing project

6405
05:03:17,400 --> 05:03:23,470
in the middle of two historic districts it does not fit I

6406
05:03:23,470 --> 05:03:24,720
understand the SRO

6407
05:03:24,720 --> 05:03:30,090
type building is the way to develop today in university

6408
05:03:30,090 --> 05:03:31,919
cities I don't blame

6409
05:03:31,919 --> 05:03:35,240
a developer for putting numbers together that makes sense

6410
05:03:35,240 --> 05:03:36,319
obviously that's what

6411
05:03:36,319 --> 05:03:39,150
every developer wants the money has to make sense or why do

6412
05:03:39,150 --> 05:03:40,040
the development

6413
05:03:40,040 --> 05:03:44,880
this is not the place to do this we have places to do this

6414
05:03:44,880 --> 05:03:46,759
if we work together as

6415
05:03:46,759 --> 05:03:50,490
a city as has been talked about today we can make these

6416
05:03:50,490 --> 05:03:51,919
developments work in our

6417
05:03:51,919 --> 05:03:55,990
city to where it is profitable for the developer and it

6418
05:03:55,990 --> 05:03:57,880
works better not only

6419
05:03:57,880 --> 05:04:01,450
for the student population but for the people who are

6420
05:04:01,450 --> 05:04:03,360
living here this piece of

6421
05:04:03,360 --> 05:04:06,540
property needs development it really does it just doesn't

6422
05:04:06,540 --> 05:04:06,959
need this

6423
05:04:06,959 --> 05:04:10,880
development and and just because we have done things wrong

6424
05:04:10,880 --> 05:04:12,240
in the past by

6425
05:04:12,240 --> 05:04:16,919
rezoning this the way it was rezoned to which I will not

6426
05:04:16,919 --> 05:04:18,880
understand but just

6427
05:04:18,880 --> 05:04:21,069
because we've done that wrong in the past doesn't mean we

6428
05:04:21,069 --> 05:04:21,799
have to continue

6429
05:04:21,799 --> 05:04:25,459
doing it wrong in the future I think we have to start

6430
05:04:25,459 --> 05:04:26,599
fixing things

6431
05:04:27,639 --> 05:04:33,950
well sitting on this Commission for a number of years and

6432
05:04:33,950 --> 05:04:34,799
seeing lots of

6433
05:04:34,799 --> 05:04:39,639
different cases come before us I know a lot of times we

6434
05:04:39,639 --> 05:04:41,200
have opportunities to

6435
05:04:41,200 --> 05:04:45,110
speak our opinions about what we'd like to see there in the

6436
05:04:45,110 --> 05:04:46,240
fact that we are

6437
05:04:46,240 --> 05:04:49,229
faced with tonight is what the zoning is whether it was a

6438
05:04:49,229 --> 05:04:51,720
mistake or not that is

6439
05:04:51,720 --> 05:04:55,669
the zoning that's there and so really to me it boils back

6440
05:04:55,669 --> 05:04:58,759
down to the facts that

6441
05:04:58,759 --> 05:05:03,310
we have which is a strictly a zoning case I do appreciate

6442
05:05:03,310 --> 05:05:04,799
the developers doing

6443
05:05:04,799 --> 05:05:08,180
some neighborhood meetings I saw the project that you

6444
05:05:08,180 --> 05:05:09,919
presented the Waco

6445
05:05:09,919 --> 05:05:13,959
project and I think the project that you have taken from

6446
05:05:13,959 --> 05:05:15,479
your neighborhood

6447
05:05:15,479 --> 05:05:19,650
meetings to do a very different design from what you built

6448
05:05:19,650 --> 05:05:21,560
in the past are the

6449
05:05:21,560 --> 05:05:23,840
types of things that we've talked about and had people say

6450
05:05:23,840 --> 05:05:26,279
about compromise that

6451
05:05:26,279 --> 05:05:30,799
you've listened you've made changes to your project I don't

6452
05:05:30,799 --> 05:05:31,319
know what you've

6453
05:05:31,319 --> 05:05:34,520
invested in it to this point I'm sure a considerable amount

6454
05:05:34,520 --> 05:05:35,279
to get it to this

6455
05:05:35,279 --> 05:05:43,119
point me personally you may choose with the zoning to do

6456
05:05:43,119 --> 05:05:44,959
the one option that you

6457
05:05:44,959 --> 05:05:48,959
have which is a hundred foot tall building if you want I

6458
05:05:48,959 --> 05:05:50,040
appreciate you

6459
05:05:50,040 --> 05:05:53,200
not coming in and saying it as a veiled threat I love some

6460
05:05:53,200 --> 05:05:54,119
people might take it

6461
05:05:54,119 --> 05:05:57,290
that way that you've at least approached this that you've

6462
05:05:57,290 --> 05:05:58,080
presented an

6463
05:05:58,080 --> 05:06:02,700
opportunity to us to do something at a lesser density I

6464
05:06:02,700 --> 05:06:03,799
think a more

6465
05:06:03,799 --> 05:06:07,009
aesthetically pleasing project than what could be built

6466
05:06:07,009 --> 05:06:08,759
there and I think it's

6467
05:06:08,759 --> 05:06:12,180
difficult sometimes to have to face the facts of what can

6468
05:06:12,180 --> 05:06:13,599
be built there versus

6469
05:06:13,599 --> 05:06:17,330
what somebody's proposing to build there that is a lesser

6470
05:06:17,330 --> 05:06:18,840
than what could be done

6471
05:06:18,840 --> 05:06:23,799
and so I have the opinion and I'm gonna make a motion to

6472
05:06:23,799 --> 05:06:25,479
such that we do go

6473
05:06:25,479 --> 05:06:30,049
ahead and rezone this property and take the opportunity

6474
05:06:30,049 --> 05:06:31,759
that we have to put an

6475
05:06:31,759 --> 05:06:34,419
overlay on the part that can be a hundred feet tall and

6476
05:06:34,419 --> 05:06:35,319
bring that down

6477
05:06:35,319 --> 05:06:39,639
because the part that is not to be rezoned can already have

6478
05:06:39,639 --> 05:06:40,900
a 45 foot tall

6479
05:06:40,900 --> 05:06:43,900
building on it and you're essentially I believe from your

6480
05:06:43,900 --> 05:06:45,159
drawings proposing a

6481
05:06:45,159 --> 05:06:48,799
essentially a 45 foot building around the perimeter which

6482
05:06:48,799 --> 05:06:49,959
you can build by

6483
05:06:49,959 --> 05:06:57,990
right as is so I'm going to go ahead and I'm going to make

6484
05:06:57,990 --> 05:06:58,799
a motion that we're

6485
05:06:58,799 --> 05:07:04,340
going to approve this with an overlay on it and I'd like to

6486
05:07:04,340 --> 05:07:05,599
have I'm gonna make

6487
05:07:05,599 --> 05:07:19,520
the motion and we'll have probably some discussion about

6488
05:07:19,520 --> 05:07:20,439
the

6489
05:07:27,200 --> 05:07:34,349
although we're having obviously some discussion of some

6490
05:07:34,349 --> 05:07:36,040
legal issues

6491
05:07:57,200 --> 05:08:00,200
yeah

6492
05:08:27,200 --> 05:08:30,200
, sorry.

6493
05:08:57,200 --> 05:09:00,200
[inaudible]

6494
05:09:27,200 --> 05:09:38,349
Lee, would you please come up we're having some discussion

6495
05:09:38,349 --> 05:09:39,759
here on notice and

6496
05:09:39,759 --> 05:09:45,369
our ability to do at the mic please sir. I'm gonna turn

6497
05:09:45,369 --> 05:09:49,119
this over to Jennifer and

6498
05:09:49,119 --> 05:09:52,799
let her explain what the issue is. I'll give a little bit

6499
05:09:52,799 --> 05:09:53,959
of introduction and

6500
05:09:53,959 --> 05:09:57,819
then I'll ask Jennifer to step down the legal part. The

6501
05:09:57,819 --> 05:09:59,479
issue in being able to

6502
05:09:59,479 --> 05:10:04,020
put an overlay on the property is that currently the notice

6503
05:10:04,020 --> 05:10:05,319
that we have in the

6504
05:10:05,319 --> 05:10:10,470
zoning case that we have is on the DR2 property. There is

6505
05:10:10,470 --> 05:10:12,119
no notice in regards

6506
05:10:12,119 --> 05:10:17,520
to the DCG property that's in the front and so the problem

6507
05:10:17,520 --> 05:10:18,200
that I think

6508
05:10:18,200 --> 05:10:21,169
Jennifer may clarify a little bit and we may want to have

6509
05:10:21,169 --> 05:10:22,479
some discussion here

6510
05:10:22,479 --> 05:10:26,250
just free mic back and forth to you about continuing this

6511
05:10:26,250 --> 05:10:27,479
is in order for us

6512
05:10:27,479 --> 05:10:31,529
to put an overlay over the entire property the front piece

6513
05:10:31,529 --> 05:10:32,520
would have to

6514
05:10:32,520 --> 05:10:37,080
be included in the notice and since it wasn't noticed we

6515
05:10:37,080 --> 05:10:39,119
can't legally put an

6516
05:10:39,119 --> 05:10:45,189
overlay over the DCG portion we could go ahead and up zone

6517
05:10:45,189 --> 05:10:46,639
the back part and put

6518
05:10:46,639 --> 05:10:49,290
the overlay on it but I don't think the Commission here is

6519
05:10:49,290 --> 05:10:50,360
going to support that

6520
05:10:50,360 --> 05:10:55,599
because we have no ability to do anything on the DCG when

6521
05:10:55,599 --> 05:10:56,799
we if we were

6522
05:10:56,799 --> 05:11:00,799
to move that forward to an it DCG on the back put an

6523
05:11:00,799 --> 05:11:02,479
overlay then we have 70 on

6524
05:11:02,479 --> 05:11:05,990
the back and still 100 on the front versus I think what

6525
05:11:05,990 --> 05:11:07,000
trying to be some

6526
05:11:07,000 --> 05:11:10,479
compromise is allow you to have some up zone on the back

6527
05:11:10,479 --> 05:11:12,520
portion and overlay the

6528
05:11:12,520 --> 05:11:15,770
whole thing so that you have a cap project so that's the

6529
05:11:15,770 --> 05:11:16,799
dilemma that we

6530
05:11:16,799 --> 05:11:22,180
have in our ability I think to try to find some compromise

6531
05:11:22,180 --> 05:11:24,639
on the side to put

6532
05:11:24,639 --> 05:11:28,520
an overlay on the top that's our issue and so I'm going to

6533
05:11:28,520 --> 05:11:29,340
throw it to you and

6534
05:11:29,340 --> 05:11:33,200
see how you would respond to wanted to do a continuance and

6535
05:11:33,200 --> 05:11:34,439
re-notice and come

6536
05:11:34,439 --> 05:11:39,819
back or if you want to up and down vote this evening and

6537
05:11:39,819 --> 05:11:43,439
see where this goes if

6538
05:11:43,439 --> 05:11:49,509
I understand correctly and I think I do any kind of an

6539
05:11:49,509 --> 05:11:50,720
overlay that would be

6540
05:11:50,720 --> 05:11:54,389
imposed tonight as a recommendation the P&Z does not

6541
05:11:54,389 --> 05:11:56,279
approve the zoning nor do

6542
05:11:56,279 --> 05:11:59,119
they establish any overlays they only recommend to City

6543
05:11:59,119 --> 05:12:00,639
Council but it can

6544
05:12:00,639 --> 05:12:03,380
only be for that portion that is in the zoning request

6545
05:12:03,380 --> 05:12:04,639
tonight it could not be

6546
05:12:04,639 --> 05:12:11,900
for the entire piece of property which makes sense I'd like

6547
05:12:11,900 --> 05:12:13,080
a minute to

6548
05:12:13,080 --> 05:12:19,150
discuss with Paul but to be quite frank and unless I'm

6549
05:12:19,150 --> 05:12:24,599
totally ignorant let me

6550
05:12:24,599 --> 05:12:27,819
visit with Paul because I'm not sure that even if the 70

6551
05:12:27,819 --> 05:12:28,959
foot could be put on

6552
05:12:28,959 --> 05:12:34,580
the whole thing that the P&Z would be amenable to that and

6553
05:12:34,580 --> 05:12:35,240
I'm not sure that

6554
05:12:35,240 --> 05:12:48,060
that's a good reason to continue so okay would ask speak to

6555
05:12:48,060 --> 05:12:49,639
the timing of

6556
05:12:49,639 --> 05:12:55,709
re-noticing and bringing this back depending on the next

6557
05:12:55,709 --> 05:12:56,360
meeting schedule

6558
05:12:56,360 --> 05:13:03,139
it's at least 30 to 45 days out to come back to maximum as

6559
05:13:03,139 --> 05:13:04,319
it relates coming

6560
05:13:04,319 --> 05:13:08,599
back to the planning and zoning Commission so about 30 days

6561
05:13:08,599 --> 05:13:09,119
because we

6562
05:13:09,119 --> 05:13:16,270
have to do notice Jennifer you looking at the calendar we

6563
05:13:16,270 --> 05:13:18,720
don't have our next

6564
05:13:18,720 --> 05:13:22,639
would be April the 12th

6565
05:13:28,720 --> 05:13:34,279
April the 12th would be the soonest that we could get to it

6566
05:13:34,279 --> 05:13:36,599
April 12th would be a

6567
05:13:36,599 --> 05:13:42,700
planning Commission and then City Council would be it would

6568
05:13:42,700 --> 05:13:43,680
be the

6569
05:13:43,680 --> 05:13:48,200
following well the following Tuesday is the fourth Tuesday

6570
05:13:48,200 --> 05:13:50,520
of the month so that

6571
05:13:50,520 --> 05:13:54,549
would be up to the agenda committee whether or not they put

6572
05:13:54,549 --> 05:13:55,279
it on that

6573
05:13:55,279 --> 05:14:02,639
particular agenda but we would try for the following week

6574
05:14:02,639 --> 05:14:09,639
so April the 12th

6575
05:14:10,720 --> 05:14:13,880
well so long as the agenda committee allows us to put it on

6576
05:14:13,880 --> 05:14:14,599
for the 18th

6577
05:14:14,599 --> 05:14:18,139
right exactly and we're just double checking the notice to

6578
05:14:18,139 --> 05:14:19,479
make sure that

6579
05:14:19,479 --> 05:14:22,209
that we don't have the ability to do that now but we're

6580
05:14:22,209 --> 05:14:23,119
just double checking

6581
05:14:23,119 --> 05:14:26,599
that notice to see what was published because I have an

6582
05:14:26,599 --> 05:14:27,319
opportunity to address

6583
05:14:27,319 --> 05:14:33,040
that tonight actually bear with us well

6584
05:14:53,119 --> 05:14:53,119
, I don't think we have a motion on the table. I don't know

6585
05:14:53,119 --> 05:14:53,119
if I finished stating the motion. Yeah, okay. That's fine.

6586
05:14:53,119 --> 05:14:59,189
We're going to take a recess just for you so that we can

6587
05:14:59,189 --> 05:15:07,090
find a way to do this tonight. It's not going to be real

6588
05:15:07,090 --> 05:15:15,840
quick. We have a staff of people to speak. I think what we

6589
05:15:15,840 --> 05:15:22,919
're going to do, I think what we're going to do

6590
05:15:22,919 --> 05:15:27,840
in respect to the time and your project is I'm going to

6591
05:15:27,840 --> 05:15:29,639
withdraw the motion that

6592
05:15:29,639 --> 05:15:34,279
I was beginning to state and we're going to take a recess,

6593
05:15:34,279 --> 05:15:36,080
let staff have a few

6594
05:15:36,080 --> 05:15:39,650
minutes to gather their facts on their calendars and then

6595
05:15:39,650 --> 05:15:40,959
come back we'll reopen

6596
05:15:40,959 --> 05:15:43,159
the meeting and then we'll see what we've been able to

6597
05:15:43,159 --> 05:15:44,040
gather give you all

6598
05:15:44,040 --> 05:15:47,299
an opportunity to discuss how you would like to go and then

6599
05:15:47,299 --> 05:15:48,479
I think maybe an

6600
05:15:48,479 --> 05:15:52,619
appropriate thing for us to do is a commission when we come

6601
05:15:52,619 --> 05:15:53,560
back is have

6602
05:15:53,560 --> 05:15:56,209
maybe a little more discussion to see if there would even

6603
05:15:56,209 --> 05:15:57,919
be enough consensus if

6604
05:15:57,919 --> 05:16:02,790
we re-noticed brought your project back that the Commission

6605
05:16:02,790 --> 05:16:04,439
has a consensus that

6606
05:16:04,439 --> 05:16:07,599
they would support that then it would be worthwhile doing

6607
05:16:07,599 --> 05:16:08,439
the continuous and if

6608
05:16:08,439 --> 05:16:10,740
there's not going to be support you would at least know

6609
05:16:10,740 --> 05:16:11,720
kind of where you are

6610
05:16:11,720 --> 05:16:15,209
this evening and we can see where the project goes from

6611
05:16:15,209 --> 05:16:16,360
here and I think that's

6612
05:16:16,360 --> 05:16:29,180
probably the sure the question I have is if we go with the

6613
05:16:29,180 --> 05:16:31,599
continuance that will

6614
05:16:31,599 --> 05:16:36,560
allow the re-noticing so the overlay could be on the entire

6615
05:16:36,560 --> 05:16:38,439
site regardless of

6616
05:16:38,439 --> 05:16:42,720
the P&Z decision when we go to council we wouldn't have to

6617
05:16:42,720 --> 05:16:44,040
re-notice to put

6618
05:16:44,040 --> 05:16:47,680
that I know for the council to actually put the overlay on

6619
05:16:47,680 --> 05:16:48,599
the whole side if

6620
05:16:48,599 --> 05:16:51,139
that's what they wanted to do we could do it both at the

6621
05:16:51,139 --> 05:16:51,959
same time all right

6622
05:16:51,959 --> 05:16:59,279
thank you so with that at 1055 and we call a 10 minute

6623
05:16:59,279 --> 05:17:00,880
recess and then we'll

6624
05:17:00,880 --> 05:17:03,319
reconvene

6625
05:17:10,680 --> 05:17:14,669
good evening and welcome back from break I'm gonna call us

6626
05:17:14,669 --> 05:17:16,919
back into order at 10

6627
05:17:16,919 --> 05:17:25,240
after 11 and I'm gonna ask Lee to come back up and I think

6628
05:17:25,240 --> 05:17:27,240
we're gonna clarify

6629
05:17:27,240 --> 05:17:30,750
our notice and then have some discussion with you all then

6630
05:17:30,750 --> 05:17:32,040
we'll continue so I'm

6631
05:17:32,040 --> 05:17:35,610
gonna turn it over to Manal for explanation of where we are

6632
05:17:35,610 --> 05:17:36,720
on the notice

6633
05:17:36,720 --> 05:17:40,830
thank you chairperson strange I would like to clarify for

6634
05:17:40,830 --> 05:17:42,560
the audience and our

6635
05:17:42,560 --> 05:17:45,470
viewing audience as well as the Commission that I have

6636
05:17:45,470 --> 05:17:46,240
looked at the

6637
05:17:46,240 --> 05:17:49,400
notification that we sent out to property owners within 200

6638
05:17:49,400 --> 05:17:50,279
and 500 feet

6639
05:17:50,279 --> 05:17:52,919
as well as the notification that was published in the

6640
05:17:52,919 --> 05:17:54,159
newspaper or the daily

6641
05:17:54,159 --> 05:17:58,950
and based on that notification we have over notified the

6642
05:17:58,950 --> 05:18:00,639
request which does

6643
05:18:00,639 --> 05:18:04,599
indeed incorporate the property to the north that fronts or

6644
05:18:04,599 --> 05:18:05,919
abuts scripture so

6645
05:18:05,919 --> 05:18:10,159
if there is if there are suggestions or discussion as it

6646
05:18:10,159 --> 05:18:11,360
relates to the

6647
05:18:11,360 --> 05:18:15,419
creation of an overly district then that is an opportunity

6648
05:18:15,419 --> 05:18:16,479
that the Commission

6649
05:18:16,479 --> 05:18:20,000
has before them tonight and just so that we can be clear

6650
05:18:20,000 --> 05:18:21,520
for the record we had

6651
05:18:21,520 --> 05:18:26,220
noticed both in the paper and in the agenda for three acres

6652
05:18:26,220 --> 05:18:27,319
and the breakdown

6653
05:18:27,319 --> 05:18:30,599
of the property as I understand it is that the current

6654
05:18:30,599 --> 05:18:32,880
zoning of dr2 is on 1.3

6655
05:18:32,880 --> 05:18:36,740
acres and the current zoning of DCG is on 1.7 acres

6656
05:18:36,740 --> 05:18:37,919
approximately as so

6657
05:18:37,919 --> 05:18:42,090
altogether we've noticed both parcels so what we would do

6658
05:18:42,090 --> 05:18:42,759
if if the

6659
05:18:42,759 --> 05:18:46,630
Commission's inclined to make a motion is to consider the

6660
05:18:46,630 --> 05:18:48,240
zoning the rezone on

6661
05:18:48,240 --> 05:18:54,680
the one acreage and then the overlay on all of the acreage

6662
05:18:54,680 --> 05:18:57,919
so we do have it

6663
05:18:57,919 --> 05:19:01,700
noticed and I still had the floor I had a motion and I

6664
05:19:01,700 --> 05:19:03,279
withdrawn it and I have a

6665
05:19:03,279 --> 05:19:06,560
couple of questions it's now that we have a clarification

6666
05:19:06,560 --> 05:19:08,520
that we can do an

6667
05:19:08,520 --> 05:19:13,209
overlay the direction that I was started with on my motion

6668
05:19:13,209 --> 05:19:14,959
was to put an overlay

6669
05:19:14,959 --> 05:19:18,290
at a cap on the maximum height of the building and I

6670
05:19:18,290 --> 05:19:20,520
believe you have two or

6671
05:19:20,520 --> 05:19:23,400
three levels on your building and I'd like for you all to

6672
05:19:23,400 --> 05:19:24,479
clarify what those

6673
05:19:24,479 --> 05:19:27,459
heights are and the percentage of the building because I'd

6674
05:19:27,459 --> 05:19:28,240
like to make my

6675
05:19:28,240 --> 05:19:31,400
motion to where we can put a cap on it and give you the

6676
05:19:31,400 --> 05:19:32,680
levels that you're

6677
05:19:32,680 --> 05:19:36,959
looking for minimize the exterior portion of the building

6678
05:19:36,959 --> 05:19:37,520
and so the

6679
05:19:37,520 --> 05:19:40,680
questions I'm going to ask is I want to know the outside

6680
05:19:40,680 --> 05:19:42,000
perimeter height the

6681
05:19:42,000 --> 05:19:51,560
building I think was 46 46 okay so if we gave maybe a

6682
05:19:51,560 --> 05:19:53,159
couple of feet just for

6683
05:19:53,159 --> 05:19:59,529
plus or minus error 48 feet and then you have a another

6684
05:19:59,529 --> 05:20:01,200
section that steps up and

6685
05:20:01,200 --> 05:20:06,509
what is the height of it that's 56 yeah that's the top of

6686
05:20:06,509 --> 05:20:07,919
the parapet yeah okay

6687
05:20:07,919 --> 05:20:12,290
do you know about what the percentage is of that part of

6688
05:20:12,290 --> 05:20:18,000
your building approximately

6689
05:20:18,000 --> 05:20:22,130
footprint and and then the highest point that you have for

6690
05:20:22,130 --> 05:20:23,639
your amenity center

6691
05:20:23,639 --> 05:20:29,500
that you'd like to do yeah that is 68 feet 11 inches there

6692
05:20:29,500 --> 05:20:36,599
's 67 11 or 67 11

6693
05:20:41,080 --> 05:20:45,770
67 feet 11 inches at the highest point of the building so

6694
05:20:45,770 --> 05:20:48,159
70 gives you trying to be

6695
05:20:48,159 --> 05:20:51,119
a little bit of plus or minus 2 feet on what you think in

6696
05:20:51,119 --> 05:20:52,159
case there's some

6697
05:20:52,159 --> 05:20:56,299
variation in topography or something like that and then

6698
05:20:56,299 --> 05:20:57,159
they would like to

6699
05:20:57,159 --> 05:21:01,630
get the percentages of those in the direction that I was

6700
05:21:01,630 --> 05:21:03,000
going to go is to

6701
05:21:03,000 --> 05:21:06,569
take a 35 degree the slope that we've talked about in our

6702
05:21:06,569 --> 05:21:07,680
work session two

6703
05:21:07,680 --> 05:21:11,799
weeks ago and again tonight if we kept that that and did a

6704
05:21:11,799 --> 05:21:13,479
percentage so if you

6705
05:21:13,479 --> 05:21:16,790
can give me the percentage of your 58 feet area if you

6706
05:21:16,790 --> 05:21:17,560
could come up to the

6707
05:21:17,560 --> 05:21:26,990
microphone that would be helpful so that's 58 feet for the

6708
05:21:26,990 --> 05:21:28,639
five-story and

6709
05:21:28,639 --> 05:21:38,880
the five-story is I do not have that square footage here at

6710
05:21:38,880 --> 05:21:41,360
hand today but if

6711
05:21:41,360 --> 05:21:44,360
we were to

6712
05:21:57,159 --> 05:22:02,470
could this drawing be used as an exhibit to represent the

6713
05:22:02,470 --> 05:22:04,279
limits I hate I know

6714
05:22:04,279 --> 05:22:10,880
it's not an ADP or an SUV or something. We'd need more

6715
05:22:10,880 --> 05:22:13,880
specificity as it relates to so the

6716
05:22:13,880 --> 05:22:18,049
elevations and the heights and the staggering that sure you

6717
05:22:18,049 --> 05:22:18,680
have the square

6718
05:22:18,680 --> 05:22:24,930
footage of the five-story of the fifth story. Let me see if

6719
05:22:24,930 --> 05:22:25,400
I have anything

6720
05:22:25,400 --> 05:22:30,400
additional to add to this.

6721
05:22:39,279 --> 05:22:46,319
Try and scale it. Do you have a scaler?

6722
05:22:55,400 --> 05:22:58,400
[inaudible]

6723
05:23:26,080 --> 05:23:26,080
I appreciate where you're headed we just don't have those

6724
05:23:26,080 --> 05:23:30,919
numbers and we weren't

6725
05:23:30,919 --> 05:23:33,919
prepared for that.

6726
05:23:41,119 --> 05:23:44,119
Try that.

6727
05:23:55,400 --> 05:24:05,319
Can I ask what what your height you're trying to achieve?

6728
05:24:05,319 --> 05:24:06,360
What do you this

6729
05:24:06,360 --> 05:24:09,729
overlay that you're considering? Just trying to do a multi-

6730
05:24:09,729 --> 05:24:11,000
stage overlay and

6731
05:24:11,000 --> 05:24:14,159
the perimeter of the building can be a maximum height. It

6732
05:24:14,159 --> 05:24:15,360
would have to conform

6733
05:24:15,360 --> 05:24:19,080
to the building slope that we've talked about the 35 degree

6734
05:24:19,080 --> 05:24:21,119
and so the fifth

6735
05:24:21,119 --> 05:24:24,770
story could be a 58 feet but it would only be a percentage

6736
05:24:24,770 --> 05:24:26,040
of the whole thing

6737
05:24:26,040 --> 05:24:29,520
couldn't get bigger would be pretty much what they have

6738
05:24:29,520 --> 05:24:32,639
proposed and then the

6739
05:24:32,639 --> 05:24:36,509
amenity center would be at 70 and be it has to be within

6740
05:24:36,509 --> 05:24:38,200
the 35 and then it has

6741
05:24:38,200 --> 05:24:42,729
to be the size that they're talking about that the building

6742
05:24:42,729 --> 05:24:43,919
can't grow out

6743
05:24:43,919 --> 05:24:49,040
to the 35 it's pretty much capped at the 48 feet sloping at

6744
05:24:49,040 --> 05:24:50,360
35 and then the

6745
05:24:50,360 --> 05:24:53,279
square footage that they have a fifth five story is capped

6746
05:24:53,279 --> 05:24:54,159
and then the square

6747
05:24:54,159 --> 05:24:58,139
footage at the essentially 70 foot would be capped by a

6748
05:24:58,139 --> 05:24:59,759
square footage number as

6749
05:24:59,759 --> 05:25:02,419
well that they can't exceed so the building can't get

6750
05:25:02,419 --> 05:25:03,360
bigger than what

6751
05:25:03,360 --> 05:25:06,709
they've proposed and shown. But we would be looking at

6752
05:25:06,709 --> 05:25:08,639
something four stories or

6753
05:25:08,639 --> 05:25:16,360
higher. On the perimeter. Well in the middle though it

6754
05:25:16,360 --> 05:25:17,520
would be higher. The

6755
05:25:17,520 --> 05:25:21,970
amenity center whatever that small amount is in the park

6756
05:25:21,970 --> 05:25:22,959
and garage.

6757
05:25:32,360 --> 05:25:41,759
Approximately 80,000. Can we do percentages? 10% in the top

6758
05:25:41,759 --> 05:25:41,840
and

6759
05:25:42,360 --> 05:25:49,150
he's calculating a percentage now for the story. Okay. Okay

6760
05:25:49,150 --> 05:25:49,319
. I go ahead and

6761
05:25:49,319 --> 05:25:53,799
start to make the motion and then fill in the percentages.

6762
05:25:53,799 --> 05:25:56,400
Can we do that? So we

6763
05:25:56,400 --> 05:25:58,799
can get going?

6764
05:26:04,159 --> 05:26:08,959
Okay. Well can we do a friendly amendment once we get the

6765
05:26:08,959 --> 05:26:11,759
percentages or not?

6766
05:26:11,759 --> 05:26:16,189
And then gives us how much can be at 58 and how much can be

6767
05:26:16,189 --> 05:26:18,040
at 70?

6768
05:26:36,040 --> 05:26:42,110
No we take the footprint of the entire building which is

6769
05:26:42,110 --> 05:26:42,639
this entire

6770
05:26:42,639 --> 05:26:48,779
footprint and then we're reducing basically that right

6771
05:26:48,779 --> 05:26:49,599
there.

6772
05:27:03,080 --> 05:27:06,509
Hey Lee. I'm gonna go ahead and get started with motion if

6773
05:27:06,509 --> 05:27:07,479
you guys can get

6774
05:27:07,479 --> 05:27:11,020
the percentage on the 58 foot and then the final percentage

6775
05:27:11,020 --> 05:27:11,880
hopefully by the

6776
05:27:11,880 --> 05:27:17,009
time we get the motion out we can put the numbers in. Okay

6777
05:27:17,009 --> 05:27:19,240
after a lot of

6778
05:27:19,240 --> 05:27:25,680
discussion and clarifying the notice and I had made some

6779
05:27:25,680 --> 05:27:27,400
comments about my

6780
05:27:27,400 --> 05:27:31,090
feelings about where we stood and the facts that we have

6781
05:27:31,090 --> 05:27:32,680
and so I was going to

6782
05:27:32,680 --> 05:27:36,610
make a motion and I am going to make a motion to rezone the

6783
05:27:36,610 --> 05:27:39,159
1.3 acres from DR2

6784
05:27:39,159 --> 05:27:44,720
to DCG so the entire three acre site would be DCG and based

6785
05:27:44,720 --> 05:27:46,119
on what the

6786
05:27:46,119 --> 05:27:53,270
current heights are that they can do and the DR2 I'm going

6787
05:27:53,270 --> 05:27:56,400
to put an overlay over

6788
05:27:56,400 --> 05:28:00,639
the entire site on the perimeter of the building to be 48

6789
05:28:00,639 --> 05:28:02,159
feet. So on the

6790
05:28:02,159 --> 05:28:06,240
perimeter of the building it cannot be taller than 48 feet.

6791
05:28:06,240 --> 05:28:08,159
For the next overlay

6792
05:28:08,159 --> 05:28:11,520
it will have to be within the 35 degree slope that's in our

6793
05:28:11,520 --> 05:28:14,720
design criteria. That

6794
05:28:14,720 --> 05:28:22,439
next staggered cap would be at 58 feet. It would continue

6795
05:28:22,439 --> 05:28:24,319
on the 35 degree slope

6796
05:28:24,319 --> 05:28:28,299
up to a maximum height of 70 feet and I'd like the

6797
05:28:28,299 --> 05:28:30,240
percentage that you need

6798
05:28:30,240 --> 05:28:34,819
for the 70 and the percentage that you need for the 58 foot

6799
05:28:34,819 --> 05:28:35,919
height of your

6800
05:28:35,919 --> 05:28:38,319
building.

6801
05:28:45,560 --> 05:28:47,220
Is that good enough here or do we need the actual two

6802
05:28:47,220 --> 05:28:50,439
numbers to put in there

6803
05:28:50,439 --> 05:28:55,639
for the percentage? Okay.

6804
05:29:00,240 --> 05:29:10,319
For the purposes of giving the applicant the opportunity to

6805
05:29:10,319 --> 05:29:10,599
get the

6806
05:29:10,599 --> 05:29:13,759
numbers I want to go ahead and do this and explain that

6807
05:29:13,759 --> 05:29:14,880
what trying to do is

6808
05:29:14,880 --> 05:29:18,990
to within the staggered and even limit within those stag

6809
05:29:18,990 --> 05:29:20,400
gers even more the

6810
05:29:20,400 --> 05:29:23,040
square footage of what they do so they can't build a larger

6811
05:29:23,040 --> 05:29:24,000
building it will be

6812
05:29:24,000 --> 05:29:27,159
inside and it will be a smaller amount at 58 and then

6813
05:29:27,159 --> 05:29:28,560
whatever the small amount

6814
05:29:28,560 --> 05:29:31,139
they need for the amenity center. So we get the numbers we

6815
05:29:31,139 --> 05:29:32,279
'll put those in here

6816
05:29:32,279 --> 05:29:38,549
at 58 and 70 foot and that's my motion and Commissioner R

6817
05:29:38,549 --> 05:29:40,279
oussel. Thank you

6818
05:29:40,279 --> 05:29:45,840
chair. The motion is not done. I was actually wanting to

6819
05:29:45,840 --> 05:29:47,279
officially second

6820
05:29:47,279 --> 05:29:49,430
this but I want to say a couple things before I went on

6821
05:29:49,430 --> 05:29:50,360
record with a second.

6822
05:29:50,360 --> 05:29:56,430
First it's 1125 at night and so I appreciate everyone

6823
05:29:56,430 --> 05:29:57,319
staying here and

6824
05:29:57,319 --> 05:30:02,029
listening to us discuss and listening to fellow citizens

6825
05:30:02,029 --> 05:30:04,479
talk and it's it's most

6826
05:30:04,479 --> 05:30:06,880
helpful to the Commission to actually have individuals from

6827
05:30:06,880 --> 05:30:07,639
the community come

6828
05:30:07,639 --> 05:30:10,259
out and speak and so I thank you for that and those who

6829
05:30:10,259 --> 05:30:11,360
have party already

6830
05:30:11,360 --> 05:30:14,520
left and fell asleep I thank them as well for staying as

6831
05:30:14,520 --> 05:30:15,159
long as possible.

6832
05:30:15,159 --> 05:30:19,439
Given that the lower the two zoning's here the DCG and the

6833
05:30:19,439 --> 05:30:21,000
DR2 the lower the

6834
05:30:21,000 --> 05:30:26,619
two zoning's DR2 allows for 45 foot high structure I feel

6835
05:30:26,619 --> 05:30:28,639
that the chairs motion

6836
05:30:28,639 --> 05:30:32,200
to limit the perimeter of the entire structure to the

6837
05:30:32,200 --> 05:30:33,599
basically the DR2

6838
05:30:33,599 --> 05:30:39,720
level give three feet is a reasonable solution to what's

6839
05:30:39,720 --> 05:30:41,240
been presented. I feel

6840
05:30:41,240 --> 05:30:45,150
that there is a unique character on the east and west of

6841
05:30:45,150 --> 05:30:46,799
this of this property

6842
05:30:46,799 --> 05:30:50,259
in the West Oak and the Oak Hickory district. I do feel

6843
05:30:50,259 --> 05:30:51,400
that this little

6844
05:30:51,400 --> 05:30:54,680
peninsula is kind of on its own and in a lot of ways kind

6845
05:30:54,680 --> 05:30:56,040
of forgotten in terms

6846
05:30:56,040 --> 05:30:58,459
of maintenance if you drive on that I don't think the roads

6847
05:30:58,459 --> 05:30:59,520
are that great the

6848
05:30:59,520 --> 05:31:03,400
structures there are dilapidated in a lot of ways and so I

6849
05:31:03,400 --> 05:31:04,759
feel like someone

6850
05:31:04,759 --> 05:31:07,380
coming in and maybe revitalizing it although it's not the

6851
05:31:07,380 --> 05:31:09,119
perfect solution I

6852
05:31:09,119 --> 05:31:13,500
feel like it is a move forward to have that property start

6853
05:31:13,500 --> 05:31:14,919
contributing to the

6854
05:31:14,919 --> 05:31:17,889
neighborhood hopefully in a productive way and so I say all

6855
05:31:17,889 --> 05:31:18,479
that to say I

6856
05:31:18,479 --> 05:31:22,740
appreciate your feedback I understand that you don't want

6857
05:31:22,740 --> 05:31:25,400
it in so so many ways

6858
05:31:25,400 --> 05:31:28,409
but I feel it's a it's it's a good move for the overall

6859
05:31:28,409 --> 05:31:30,200
city and then with that

6860
05:31:30,200 --> 05:31:36,439
I would charge Earl Escobar personally to look at traffic

6861
05:31:36,439 --> 05:31:37,439
and infrastructure

6862
05:31:37,439 --> 05:31:41,490
because I feel like in my mind the biggest issue of this

6863
05:31:41,490 --> 05:31:42,599
going in is the

6864
05:31:42,599 --> 05:31:46,919
impact on the thoroughfares out I know just from experience

6865
05:31:46,919 --> 05:31:47,560
Congress is the

6866
05:31:47,560 --> 05:31:50,720
quickest way down to Carroll so if you're at scripture to

6867
05:31:50,720 --> 05:31:51,560
get to Carroll

6868
05:31:51,560 --> 05:31:54,069
the quickest way is Congress and that is a quiet

6869
05:31:54,069 --> 05:31:55,520
neighborhood street and so I

6870
05:31:55,520 --> 05:31:58,360
don't I don't know the future of scripture but I just want

6871
05:31:58,360 --> 05:31:59,040
to make sure

6872
05:31:59,040 --> 05:32:03,240
that the roads are being redone and rebuilt and maybe even

6873
05:32:03,240 --> 05:32:04,599
expanded to make

6874
05:32:04,599 --> 05:32:07,900
sure that the traffic flow that this would create and

6875
05:32:07,900 --> 05:32:09,400
trying to get to Kroger

6876
05:32:09,400 --> 05:32:12,619
wherever else would be hopefully mitigated to surrounding

6877
05:32:12,619 --> 05:32:14,119
neighbors and

6878
05:32:14,119 --> 05:32:17,630
with that I second the motion before open for discussion if

6879
05:32:17,630 --> 05:32:18,279
you all had

6880
05:32:18,279 --> 05:32:21,520
opportunity to get your percentage

6881
05:32:23,040 --> 05:32:28,529
five story 70% which includes the parking garage and then

6882
05:32:28,529 --> 05:32:29,680
the amenity space

6883
05:32:29,680 --> 05:32:35,529
call it 15% so 15% at 70 what was the percentage on the 58

6884
05:32:35,529 --> 05:32:36,680
to 5 story parking

6885
05:32:36,680 --> 05:32:47,520
garage 70% 70 yes and those are all inside the 35 degree

6886
05:32:47,520 --> 05:32:49,240
slope okay from the

6887
05:32:49,240 --> 05:32:54,209
perimeter looking at your building 46 four story building

6888
05:32:54,209 --> 05:32:55,400
the interior portion

6889
05:32:55,400 --> 05:32:58,610
of it as it comes inside from Street View you won't see

6890
05:32:58,610 --> 05:32:59,479
those will stay

6891
05:32:59,479 --> 05:33:04,479
inside the 35 degree slope yes the residential proximity

6892
05:33:04,479 --> 05:33:05,439
slope okay

6893
05:33:05,439 --> 05:33:10,409
perfect okay we have a first and a second and open the

6894
05:33:10,409 --> 05:33:11,119
floor for discussion

6895
05:33:11,119 --> 05:33:14,759
Commissioner Beck thank you chair and I appreciate your

6896
05:33:14,759 --> 05:33:16,959
efforts to get this down

6897
05:33:16,959 --> 05:33:21,409
to what you consider more reasonable size but I still can't

6898
05:33:21,409 --> 05:33:23,880
go along with it I to

6899
05:33:23,880 --> 05:33:27,689
me it seems like a sellout I think what the neighborhood is

6900
05:33:27,689 --> 05:33:28,599
asking is for

6901
05:33:28,599 --> 05:33:33,389
something much less three stories is probably the limit I

6902
05:33:33,389 --> 05:33:34,479
would go on that I

6903
05:33:34,479 --> 05:33:38,959
would have a hard time voting on this just simply because

6904
05:33:38,959 --> 05:33:40,479
this isn't really

6905
05:33:40,479 --> 05:33:43,959
where we wanted to go it may seem like a good compromise

6906
05:33:43,959 --> 05:33:46,240
but to me it's it's I

6907
05:33:46,240 --> 05:33:50,290
don't see the neighborhood buying into this at all and

6908
05:33:50,290 --> 05:33:52,080
feeling like we sold out

6909
05:33:52,080 --> 05:33:58,270
on them so I would vote no on this Commissioner Ellis thank

6910
05:33:58,270 --> 05:33:59,759
you chair and I

6911
05:33:59,759 --> 05:34:03,479
appreciate the efforts of everyone to my concern is you

6912
05:34:03,479 --> 05:34:05,040
know an overlays in place

6913
05:34:05,040 --> 05:34:08,400
to protect the area and trying to write this after being at

6914
05:34:08,400 --> 05:34:10,080
a meeting for six

6915
05:34:10,080 --> 05:34:13,529
plus hours now is dangerous not only for the city but even

6916
05:34:13,529 --> 05:34:14,720
for the developer

6917
05:34:14,720 --> 05:34:19,959
trying to you know willy-nilly numbers like that and and

6918
05:34:19,959 --> 05:34:21,799
and and so no I'm I

6919
05:34:21,799 --> 05:34:30,319
can't support it Commissioner Tyler thank you chair yeah I

6920
05:34:30,319 --> 05:34:33,549
should have the same concerns this is you know the this

6921
05:34:33,549 --> 05:34:35,000
doesn't really change

6922
05:34:35,000 --> 05:34:39,430
the the scale or mass of the building 70% at 58 feet

6923
05:34:39,430 --> 05:34:41,799
basically 60 feet that's

6924
05:34:41,799 --> 05:34:46,500
you know basically three-quarters you know is still going

6925
05:34:46,500 --> 05:34:47,799
to be much taller

6926
05:34:47,799 --> 05:34:50,799
than anything else around it's going to dwarf the two-story

6927
05:34:50,799 --> 05:34:51,759
apartments that are

6928
05:34:51,759 --> 05:34:55,080
right next door it's going to be you know a lot more

6929
05:34:55,080 --> 05:34:56,680
massive than the

6930
05:34:56,680 --> 05:34:59,479
apartments across the street it's still going to cast that

6931
05:34:59,479 --> 05:35:00,560
shadow you know in

6932
05:35:00,560 --> 05:35:06,450
December noon day Sun all the way across scripture and and

6933
05:35:06,450 --> 05:35:07,599
I do think it doesn't

6934
05:35:07,599 --> 05:35:10,610
fit the context and I don't know what overlay we could put

6935
05:35:10,610 --> 05:35:11,880
on you know

6936
05:35:11,880 --> 05:35:15,500
something like a straight 45 foot overlay aiming for about

6937
05:35:15,500 --> 05:35:16,400
three maybe a

6938
05:35:16,400 --> 05:35:20,080
short four stories but I don't think that the developer

6939
05:35:20,080 --> 05:35:21,479
would be amenable to

6940
05:35:21,479 --> 05:35:25,069
that and so so I can't I can't even think of an overlay

6941
05:35:25,069 --> 05:35:25,799
that would work and

6942
05:35:25,799 --> 05:35:29,799
trying to trying to write it right now at 1130 at night

6943
05:35:29,799 --> 05:35:32,759
also isn't good so for

6944
05:35:32,759 --> 05:35:36,080
those reasons I really think we need to at this point I

6945
05:35:36,080 --> 05:35:37,279
think the only only

6946
05:35:37,279 --> 05:35:41,959
thing we can do is deny and if they're if if the developer

6947
05:35:41,959 --> 05:35:43,479
comes up with the

6948
05:35:43,479 --> 05:35:46,680
solution between now and City Council and City Council can

6949
05:35:46,680 --> 05:35:48,119
take into you know

6950
05:35:48,119 --> 05:35:50,880
into consideration the context and the concern of the

6951
05:35:50,880 --> 05:35:52,639
neighborhood then they

6952
05:35:52,639 --> 05:35:57,279
can override or denial but trying to write it at midnight

6953
05:35:57,279 --> 05:35:58,680
it's not going to

6954
05:35:58,680 --> 05:36:05,659
work okay well I put a motion out and I'm gonna be calling

6955
05:36:05,659 --> 05:36:06,319
for a vote on it

6956
05:36:06,319 --> 05:36:09,189
and the last thing I'm gonna say is as servant on this

6957
05:36:09,189 --> 05:36:10,560
Commission for a long

6958
05:36:10,560 --> 05:36:15,090
time like yourself we had a project similar to this on Fry

6959
05:36:15,090 --> 05:36:16,119
Street and I

6960
05:36:16,119 --> 05:36:18,590
think they wanted an extra two feet and it didn't go and so

6961
05:36:18,590 --> 05:36:19,240
now we have a

6962
05:36:19,240 --> 05:36:23,069
project that's even farther away they can build a 45 foot

6963
05:36:23,069 --> 05:36:24,319
tall building on it

6964
05:36:24,319 --> 05:36:26,930
and they can build a hundred foot tall on portion of it and

6965
05:36:26,930 --> 05:36:28,400
I think sometimes

6966
05:36:28,400 --> 05:36:31,799
when we have opportunities to do something even though it

6967
05:36:31,799 --> 05:36:32,880
is late this

6968
05:36:32,880 --> 05:36:36,409
has been talked about now for two weeks and we've all had

6969
05:36:36,409 --> 05:36:37,880
discussions about it

6970
05:36:37,880 --> 05:36:40,290
and we're gonna take action on it one way or the other

6971
05:36:40,290 --> 05:36:41,360
tonight and it will move

6972
05:36:41,360 --> 05:36:43,740
forward and then we will have had our opportunity to do

6973
05:36:43,740 --> 05:36:44,799
something with it and

6974
05:36:44,799 --> 05:36:47,139
then they will move forward with whatever they choose to do

6975
05:36:47,139 --> 05:36:47,680
with their

6976
05:36:47,680 --> 05:36:51,229
project that's why I've made the motion that I have I know

6977
05:36:51,229 --> 05:36:52,439
there are neighbors

6978
05:36:52,439 --> 05:36:56,880
that do not want it and also recognize that the people that

6979
05:36:56,880 --> 05:36:57,599
own the property

6980
05:36:57,599 --> 05:37:01,459
by right can build what they've shown us that they can

6981
05:37:01,459 --> 05:37:03,040
build and so for those

6982
05:37:03,040 --> 05:37:06,290
reasons I think it's a good compromise to try to maintain

6983
05:37:06,290 --> 05:37:07,720
as close as we can on

6984
05:37:07,720 --> 05:37:10,950
the exterior of the building of what they can do and be

6985
05:37:10,950 --> 05:37:12,439
somewhat of a

6986
05:37:12,439 --> 05:37:15,599
compromise on that particular site and so with that I'm

6987
05:37:15,599 --> 05:37:16,680
going to call for a

6988
05:37:16,680 --> 05:37:21,360
vote on the motion that is stated and we'll see where we

6989
05:37:21,360 --> 05:37:22,159
end up this evening

6990
05:37:22,159 --> 05:37:25,959
I'll call for a vote on the board

6991
05:37:42,439 --> 05:37:48,840
the motion will fail five to two

6992
05:37:54,919 --> 05:37:59,159
Commissioner Tyler I move we recommend denial to City

6993
05:37:59,159 --> 05:38:03,560
Council Commissioner Beck

6994
05:38:05,000 --> 05:38:11,069
question first so the option of doing another type of

6995
05:38:11,069 --> 05:38:12,959
overlay that keeps us

6996
05:38:12,959 --> 05:38:17,000
below three stories is probably you think is gonna hurt us

6997
05:38:17,000 --> 05:38:20,080
more than help us

6998
05:38:21,759 --> 05:38:28,099
sorry are you asking below the dr2 well I understand I have

6999
05:38:28,099 --> 05:38:28,720
to keep it at the

7000
05:38:28,720 --> 05:38:35,200
yard yeah 45 again my concern is to protect this area down

7001
05:38:35,200 --> 05:38:35,240
the road and if

7002
05:38:35,240 --> 05:38:38,610
we deny and it goes to council yeah I'll miss her I but I

7003
05:38:38,610 --> 05:38:40,119
can't hear you okay my

7004
05:38:40,119 --> 05:38:44,740
my concern is to protect this area in the long term that's

7005
05:38:44,740 --> 05:38:46,040
why I wanted to try

7006
05:38:46,040 --> 05:38:51,599
and create an overlay that would keep it at a minimum for a

7007
05:38:51,599 --> 05:38:53,080
long time it's not

7008
05:38:53,080 --> 05:38:56,439
permanent there's probably some other things we can do down

7009
05:38:56,439 --> 05:38:57,680
the road but if we

7010
05:38:57,680 --> 05:39:00,639
deny tonight and it goes to council then there's that risk

7011
05:39:00,639 --> 05:39:03,360
that this thing could

7012
05:39:03,360 --> 05:39:07,689
get built anyway and I'm just trying to avoid that so I

7013
05:39:07,689 --> 05:39:09,560
guess I'm just asking

7014
05:39:09,560 --> 05:39:17,759
the question is it worth the risk of voting denial or

7015
05:39:17,759 --> 05:39:19,159
considering a motion

7016
05:39:19,159 --> 05:39:24,279
for an overlay that's equivalent to dr2 I can't basically

7017
05:39:24,279 --> 05:39:26,560
recommend which motion

7018
05:39:26,560 --> 05:39:32,630
you should make but I can clarify the initial we took a

7019
05:39:32,630 --> 05:39:33,479
recess just to

7020
05:39:33,479 --> 05:39:37,979
discern what the notification parameters were and based on

7021
05:39:37,979 --> 05:39:39,479
that it was evident

7022
05:39:39,479 --> 05:39:43,290
that because of the over notification that an overlay

7023
05:39:43,290 --> 05:39:44,919
district can be placed

7024
05:39:44,919 --> 05:39:49,090
on the entire three acres even though the request before

7025
05:39:49,090 --> 05:39:50,000
you is for an

7026
05:39:50,000 --> 05:39:52,459
application for a change in zoning for the sudden portion

7027
05:39:52,459 --> 05:39:53,319
of the property which

7028
05:39:53,319 --> 05:39:59,639
I believe is 1.3 acre acres that being said it you know if

7029
05:39:59,639 --> 05:40:01,119
if you're looking at

7030
05:40:01,119 --> 05:40:04,830
this protection overlay district and you're looking at

7031
05:40:04,830 --> 05:40:05,939
parameters that have

7032
05:40:05,939 --> 05:40:09,750
consistency you can't go below the base zoning of that

7033
05:40:09,750 --> 05:40:11,080
district as legal

7034
05:40:11,080 --> 05:40:13,889
indicated so if you're looking at the parameters or the

7035
05:40:13,889 --> 05:40:15,159
development criteria

7036
05:40:15,159 --> 05:40:19,240
associated with the dr2 zoning district then for instance

7037
05:40:19,240 --> 05:40:20,680
you could visit the

7038
05:40:20,680 --> 05:40:23,400
building height you could visit the setbacks now the only

7039
05:40:23,400 --> 05:40:24,040
additional

7040
05:40:24,040 --> 05:40:26,869
opportunity you have with the overlay district opposed to

7041
05:40:26,869 --> 05:40:27,560
the physical

7042
05:40:27,560 --> 05:40:31,430
parameters is looking at enhanced screening or landscaping

7043
05:40:31,430 --> 05:40:32,400
mechanisms as

7044
05:40:32,400 --> 05:40:37,639
well so that's what you have before you is to provide a

7045
05:40:37,639 --> 05:40:39,000
recommendation on the

7046
05:40:39,000 --> 05:40:41,419
on the request itself was it which is a change in zoning

7047
05:40:41,419 --> 05:40:42,439
and one of the elements

7048
05:40:42,439 --> 05:40:45,599
that was brought up by the Commission as a discussion point

7049
05:40:45,599 --> 05:40:46,520
was if there is an

7050
05:40:46,520 --> 05:40:51,490
overlay district what does it encompass or what is the what

7051
05:40:51,490 --> 05:40:52,400
are the meets and

7052
05:40:52,400 --> 05:40:57,369
bounds of it and what are the associated hard criteria that

7053
05:40:57,369 --> 05:40:58,200
can be established

7054
05:40:58,200 --> 05:41:03,560
with it just to clarify for you to Commissioner back they

7055
05:41:03,560 --> 05:41:04,360
have the ability

7056
05:41:04,360 --> 05:41:11,520
to put 45 45 foot tall building throughout the entire three

7057
05:41:11,520 --> 05:41:12,880
acres

7058
05:41:12,880 --> 05:41:16,750
currently so your overlay if you put it at 45 would it be

7059
05:41:16,750 --> 05:41:17,799
of no effect because

7060
05:41:17,799 --> 05:41:21,200
they can do that now okay that helps thank you and I'll

7061
05:41:21,200 --> 05:41:21,520
trust the

7062
05:41:21,520 --> 05:41:26,810
Commissioner taters judgment and second the motion we have

7063
05:41:26,810 --> 05:41:28,599
a first and a second

7064
05:41:28,599 --> 05:41:31,040
for denial

7065
05:41:36,119 --> 05:41:42,479
any any discussion none well I'll make comment and then we

7066
05:41:42,479 --> 05:41:43,639
're a call for a vote

7067
05:41:43,639 --> 05:41:49,200
I think we had an opportunity to do something tonight and

7068
05:41:49,200 --> 05:41:50,840
we'll see what

7069
05:41:50,840 --> 05:41:57,990
happens I don't agree with the now because I think the

7070
05:41:57,990 --> 05:41:58,720
opportunity for us

7071
05:41:58,720 --> 05:42:03,830
to do some restrictions on it will go out the window and we

7072
05:42:03,830 --> 05:42:04,479
'll lose the

7073
05:42:04,479 --> 05:42:09,299
ability to have some say in what this project is so because

7074
05:42:09,299 --> 05:42:10,880
of that I will not

7075
05:42:10,880 --> 05:42:14,799
support the demand denial and now have a couple other

7076
05:42:14,799 --> 05:42:15,520
people that would like to

7077
05:42:15,520 --> 05:42:19,959
speak Commissioner Hudson yeah briefly out of respect for

7078
05:42:19,959 --> 05:42:21,560
the next item I'll be

7079
05:42:21,560 --> 05:42:29,369
super brief again I reiterate if they if they it's zoned

7080
05:42:29,369 --> 05:42:31,240
what it is that's at our

7081
05:42:31,240 --> 05:42:37,310
hands if they they had an opportunity to tailor-make it as

7082
05:42:37,310 --> 05:42:38,520
well as we had an

7083
05:42:38,520 --> 05:42:43,080
opportunity to tailor-make it I'm going to side with the

7084
05:42:43,080 --> 05:42:44,560
people that live in

7085
05:42:44,560 --> 05:42:49,360
that neighborhood even that aside I'm going to side with

7086
05:42:49,360 --> 05:42:50,439
the majority of the

7087
05:42:50,439 --> 05:42:54,119
people that have spoken against this and I'm going to go

7088
05:42:54,119 --> 05:42:55,560
with my common sense

7089
05:42:55,560 --> 05:42:59,310
that looks at it and says it doesn't fit and I'm going to

7090
05:42:59,310 --> 05:43:00,479
go with the fact

7091
05:43:00,479 --> 05:43:03,639
that I've noticed very little traction and I and I and I

7092
05:43:03,639 --> 05:43:04,720
take a dissenting

7093
05:43:04,720 --> 05:43:08,119
opinion to the other property reference on on Frost Street

7094
05:43:08,119 --> 05:43:09,159
they didn't want to

7095
05:43:09,159 --> 05:43:13,169
match the parking requirements was the at issue there they

7096
05:43:13,169 --> 05:43:14,200
had by right the

7097
05:43:14,200 --> 05:43:18,080
opportunity to do that and and Commissioner Roselle points

7098
05:43:18,080 --> 05:43:18,439
out they

7099
05:43:18,439 --> 05:43:21,150
came back with the exact same plan six months ago and I

7100
05:43:21,150 --> 05:43:22,200
think we're at this

7101
05:43:22,200 --> 05:43:26,669
impasse as well where it does not fit it's I'm looking for

7102
05:43:26,669 --> 05:43:28,200
someone to say that

7103
05:43:28,200 --> 05:43:30,270
they're going to be in an apartment they're going to build

7104
05:43:30,270 --> 05:43:30,840
an apartment it's

7105
05:43:30,840 --> 05:43:33,209
an investment and so you're going to have to pay a premium

7106
05:43:33,209 --> 05:43:34,080
but you're going to

7107
05:43:34,080 --> 05:43:36,959
get a premium back and that is you like you don't like

7108
05:43:36,959 --> 05:43:37,959
those two story

7109
05:43:37,959 --> 05:43:40,080
apartments go by those but you don't want to go by those

7110
05:43:40,080 --> 05:43:40,919
because those are

7111
05:43:40,919 --> 05:43:44,110
costs those cost more in my humble opinion and and so I

7112
05:43:44,110 --> 05:43:45,319
just think where

7113
05:43:45,319 --> 05:43:49,009
we're at a point where I'm not going to ignore the citizens

7114
05:43:49,009 --> 05:43:49,959
that live in a

7115
05:43:49,959 --> 05:43:54,439
district for the betterment of a profit of someone that

7116
05:43:54,439 --> 05:43:55,799
doesn't live in the city

7117
05:43:55,799 --> 05:43:59,630
I'm just not going to I just can't in in my right mind do

7118
05:43:59,630 --> 05:44:00,880
that because that's

7119
05:44:00,880 --> 05:44:04,340
that's that's not right and so just as much as you point

7120
05:44:04,340 --> 05:44:05,560
out that we had an

7121
05:44:05,560 --> 05:44:12,709
opportunity to make an adjustment I'm so excited that we

7122
05:44:12,709 --> 05:44:14,400
send a clearer message

7123
05:44:14,400 --> 05:44:17,080
in my humble opinion that when I get a narrative that says

7124
05:44:17,080 --> 05:44:18,080
either this or that

7125
05:44:18,080 --> 05:44:22,000
I'm not going to respond well to that and that's just and

7126
05:44:22,000 --> 05:44:23,759
and and that's that

7127
05:44:23,759 --> 05:44:26,720
may be that may be something that I need to work on but

7128
05:44:26,720 --> 05:44:28,240
that's where I stand and

7129
05:44:28,240 --> 05:44:31,639
I and I feel supported in that and that we had citizen

7130
05:44:31,639 --> 05:44:34,319
comments that picked up

7131
05:44:34,319 --> 05:44:37,580
on the same thing so I didn't stand alone in my perception

7132
05:44:37,580 --> 05:44:38,599
of reading that

7133
05:44:38,599 --> 05:44:44,060
document so I look forward to this and I think it it I don

7134
05:44:44,060 --> 05:44:45,279
't look at as an

7135
05:44:45,279 --> 05:44:48,110
opportunity missed on our end I think it is consistent with

7136
05:44:48,110 --> 05:44:48,959
how we approach

7137
05:44:48,959 --> 05:44:54,689
things and and I think it is encouraging Commissioner Ose

7138
05:44:54,689 --> 05:44:57,240
llo thank you chair so I

7139
05:44:57,240 --> 05:45:00,909
just as I'm trying to think through what the vote of denial

7140
05:45:00,909 --> 05:45:02,639
that we just had the

7141
05:45:02,639 --> 05:45:06,520
implications of it and now this vote means and it's coming

7142
05:45:06,520 --> 05:45:07,479
to they could

7143
05:45:07,479 --> 05:45:11,340
start after plats get done to build three acres at 45 feet

7144
05:45:11,340 --> 05:45:12,159
and what the

7145
05:45:12,159 --> 05:45:16,840
chair put forth was let's let him build 48 feet and let's

7146
05:45:16,840 --> 05:45:18,080
let a fifth story be

7147
05:45:18,080 --> 05:45:22,779
allowed with a setback so it's not even that visual from a

7148
05:45:22,779 --> 05:45:24,439
walking area yet it

7149
05:45:24,439 --> 05:45:27,349
seems like the Commission by voting a denial to this is not

7150
05:45:27,349 --> 05:45:28,439
okay with a setback

7151
05:45:28,439 --> 05:45:32,299
for a fifth story but we are okay in them building 60 feet

7152
05:45:32,299 --> 05:45:34,319
70 feet 80 feet 90

7153
05:45:34,319 --> 05:45:39,220
feet 100 feet on the property so it doesn't compute fully

7154
05:45:39,220 --> 05:45:40,919
with a motion to

7155
05:45:40,919 --> 05:45:44,159
say we're gonna limit perimeters at 48 feet we're gonna

7156
05:45:44,159 --> 05:45:45,240
force them to set back a

7157
05:45:45,240 --> 05:45:48,869
fifth story so it's really hard to see that's not okay but

7158
05:45:48,869 --> 05:45:49,639
the Commission is

7159
05:45:49,639 --> 05:45:54,279
perfectly fine saying 45 feet on the dr2 perfect and we're

7160
05:45:54,279 --> 05:45:55,080
okay with putting a

7161
05:45:55,080 --> 05:45:59,319
hundred feet on the DCG it just doesn't seem to make sense

7162
05:45:59,319 --> 05:45:59,919
and I feel like the

7163
05:45:59,919 --> 05:46:03,299
chair put forth the motion that was a reasonable compromise

7164
05:46:03,299 --> 05:46:04,319
to have some kind

7165
05:46:04,319 --> 05:46:07,259
of control over the cap of this project because in all

7166
05:46:07,259 --> 05:46:08,639
honesty they might not

7167
05:46:08,639 --> 05:46:10,560
build a hundred stories maybe they don't want that in

7168
05:46:10,560 --> 05:46:12,159
portfolio but why wouldn't

7169
05:46:12,159 --> 05:46:14,900
they build 60 70 feet they can make that probably look

7170
05:46:14,900 --> 05:46:16,200
pretty for their portfolio

7171
05:46:16,200 --> 05:46:19,360
and a denial tonight would give them incentive to even

7172
05:46:19,360 --> 05:46:20,560
start that process

7173
05:46:20,560 --> 05:46:23,119
even sooner and additionally we've talked about the

7174
05:46:23,119 --> 05:46:23,919
neighbors coming out and I

7175
05:46:23,919 --> 05:46:26,450
appreciate them taking time to come out but we had one

7176
05:46:26,450 --> 05:46:27,740
individual from county

7177
05:46:27,740 --> 05:46:31,319
property speak we had one individual from Misty wood lane

7178
05:46:31,319 --> 05:46:32,439
which is several

7179
05:46:32,439 --> 05:46:36,790
miles away the closest I can see was on Congress Street in

7180
05:46:36,790 --> 05:46:39,299
opposition but no one

7181
05:46:39,299 --> 05:46:41,990
from that block opposed tonight no one from the 200 feet

7182
05:46:41,990 --> 05:46:42,959
came out tonight and

7183
05:46:42,959 --> 05:46:47,069
so yes there has been vocal opposition from it but it's

7184
05:46:47,069 --> 05:46:48,720
been from Oak Street

7185
05:46:48,720 --> 05:46:51,299
that come out for any project near campus because of

7186
05:46:51,299 --> 05:46:52,400
traffic concerns and

7187
05:46:52,400 --> 05:46:55,310
so I want to validate individuals coming out and speaking

7188
05:46:55,310 --> 05:46:56,520
tonight but I also want

7189
05:46:56,520 --> 05:46:58,439
to understand that the proximity to this that has been

7190
05:46:58,439 --> 05:46:59,720
spoken about tonight hasn't

7191
05:46:59,720 --> 05:47:04,319
really been there and so I'm kind of astonished by the

7192
05:47:04,319 --> 05:47:05,360
rationalization of

7193
05:47:05,360 --> 05:47:10,080
voting to deny this when it produces an outcome that's less

7194
05:47:10,080 --> 05:47:11,240
controlled than what

7195
05:47:11,240 --> 05:47:16,240
was just voted against and so I'm certainly voting to not

7196
05:47:16,240 --> 05:47:17,479
approve a denial

7197
05:47:17,479 --> 05:47:21,400
of this based on my desire to have some control over the

7198
05:47:21,400 --> 05:47:24,040
project being presented

7199
05:47:24,040 --> 05:47:28,560
Commissioner Ellis thank you chair all I'll what I'd like

7200
05:47:28,560 --> 05:47:29,180
to add to that

7201
05:47:29,180 --> 05:47:33,729
Commissioner Oselle is that what was put forth before us

7202
05:47:33,729 --> 05:47:35,560
with with the overlay

7203
05:47:35,560 --> 05:47:38,909
didn't address the concern of density and what this project

7204
05:47:38,909 --> 05:47:40,040
brings to the area

7205
05:47:40,040 --> 05:47:43,259
it just it just talked about the aesthetics which is one

7206
05:47:43,259 --> 05:47:44,680
thing but density

7207
05:47:44,680 --> 05:47:47,840
was a huge problem the traffic the amount of people that's

7208
05:47:47,840 --> 05:47:48,599
going to bring

7209
05:47:48,599 --> 05:47:51,450
it that area and what it's going to do to the rest of the

7210
05:47:51,450 --> 05:47:52,759
area and then also to

7211
05:47:52,759 --> 05:47:56,569
address the 200 and 500 feet decisions that we make affect

7212
05:47:56,569 --> 05:47:57,360
more than that in

7213
05:47:57,360 --> 05:48:00,279
the city and just because we didn't get those people here

7214
05:48:00,279 --> 05:48:01,360
who talked about it

7215
05:48:01,360 --> 05:48:03,909
the people who did come out they do have a right because

7216
05:48:03,909 --> 05:48:05,000
that will affect them

7217
05:48:05,000 --> 05:48:09,639
and how we all travel through that area I absolutely agree

7218
05:48:09,639 --> 05:48:10,880
it was just

7219
05:48:10,880 --> 05:48:13,250
mentioned on the Commission that neighbors have come out to

7220
05:48:13,250 --> 05:48:13,619
speak in

7221
05:48:13,619 --> 05:48:16,040
opposition and I think it's worth contextualizing who those

7222
05:48:16,040 --> 05:48:17,400
neighbors are

7223
05:48:17,400 --> 05:48:22,139
and again to the point I feel I've already made is in terms

7224
05:48:22,139 --> 05:48:23,639
of density we

7225
05:48:23,639 --> 05:48:26,799
deny this we've provided them ability to be more dense than

7226
05:48:26,799 --> 05:48:27,240
it seems like

7227
05:48:27,240 --> 05:48:30,849
you desire because they can go higher up and produce more

7228
05:48:30,849 --> 05:48:32,080
beds more units more

7229
05:48:32,080 --> 05:48:36,159
density and further I charged Earl and I hate to keep

7230
05:48:36,159 --> 05:48:37,200
bringing him out by name I

7231
05:48:37,200 --> 05:48:40,360
apologize but there needs to be some infrastructure in

7232
05:48:40,360 --> 05:48:42,000
there I agree that the

7233
05:48:42,000 --> 05:48:44,560
traffic and roads I 100% agree with you that needs to be

7234
05:48:44,560 --> 05:48:46,439
addressed but I don't

7235
05:48:46,439 --> 05:48:51,159
know if that's cause to change from a 48 foot cap or

7236
05:48:51,159 --> 05:48:56,240
letting them build 100 feet

7237
05:48:57,799 --> 05:49:03,209
any other comments or Commissioner Tyler thank you chair so

7238
05:49:03,209 --> 05:49:05,240
to address your

7239
05:49:05,240 --> 05:49:09,669
concerns Commissioner Rozelle regarding regarding trying to

7240
05:49:09,669 --> 05:49:11,000
work out a solution

7241
05:49:11,000 --> 05:49:15,319
here the solution that that was proposed in the overlay is

7242
05:49:15,319 --> 05:49:17,040
exactly the thing that

7243
05:49:17,040 --> 05:49:20,990
the neighborhood did not want it's exactly that no we have

7244
05:49:20,990 --> 05:49:22,119
gotten letters

7245
05:49:22,119 --> 05:49:25,279
from property owners directly across the street they were

7246
05:49:25,279 --> 05:49:26,400
in our last meeting and

7247
05:49:26,400 --> 05:49:31,599
I'm sure they're somewhere in the record and this this 70%

7248
05:49:31,599 --> 05:49:33,959
at 58 feet and 15% at

7249
05:49:33,959 --> 05:49:39,159
48 feet and 15% at 70 feet that that isn't any protection

7250
05:49:39,159 --> 05:49:40,560
that's that's

7251
05:49:40,560 --> 05:49:45,119
exactly what the plan is so so there isn't any there isn't

7252
05:49:45,119 --> 05:49:46,939
any like benefit

7253
05:49:46,939 --> 05:49:51,369
from to the neighborhood from that overlay which is exactly

7254
05:49:51,369 --> 05:49:52,040
what the

7255
05:49:52,040 --> 05:49:54,520
developer said they were going to build and drew the

7256
05:49:54,520 --> 05:49:55,799
picture of they're also

7257
05:49:55,799 --> 05:50:00,229
already limited by the the proximity the residential

7258
05:50:00,229 --> 05:50:02,400
proximity rule so they can't

7259
05:50:02,400 --> 05:50:05,110
even start at 48 feet they have to start at 46 feet 10 feet

7260
05:50:05,110 --> 05:50:06,000
off the property line

7261
05:50:06,000 --> 05:50:11,340
so even though it was a world our overlay is weaker than

7262
05:50:11,340 --> 05:50:13,680
our laws and then

7263
05:50:13,680 --> 05:50:17,279
to go to a hundred feet tall which they could do they start

7264
05:50:17,279 --> 05:50:19,560
running into fire

7265
05:50:19,560 --> 05:50:22,869
protection issues when they get above about 60 feet so the

7266
05:50:22,869 --> 05:50:24,360
feasibility of them

7267
05:50:24,360 --> 05:50:28,630
building a hundred foot tower to punish the neighborhood or

7268
05:50:28,630 --> 05:50:29,799
to make their profit

7269
05:50:29,799 --> 05:50:35,869
is is pretty unlikely so I I wish we could have crafted an

7270
05:50:35,869 --> 05:50:37,040
overlay that that

7271
05:50:37,040 --> 05:50:40,200
addressed the concerns of context and size and scale but if

7272
05:50:40,200 --> 05:50:41,479
you're across the

7273
05:50:41,479 --> 05:50:45,259
street or you're a hundred feet down scripture that 70 foot

7274
05:50:45,259 --> 05:50:46,080
portion of the

7275
05:50:46,080 --> 05:50:49,240
building is going to be very visible it's going to be lo

7276
05:50:49,240 --> 05:50:50,159
oming above the

7277
05:50:50,159 --> 05:50:55,490
street so it we're not the 70 foot overlay with the 50 foot

7278
05:50:55,490 --> 05:50:56,279
step down so

7279
05:50:56,279 --> 05:51:01,279
forth isn't protecting anything I think maybe something

7280
05:51:01,279 --> 05:51:02,599
like a 45 foot flat

7281
05:51:02,599 --> 05:51:07,119
overlay might be amenable to the neighborhood at the edge

7282
05:51:07,119 --> 05:51:07,840
like just

7283
05:51:07,840 --> 05:51:10,560
barely acceptable but that would absolutely not be

7284
05:51:10,560 --> 05:51:11,680
acceptable to the

7285
05:51:11,680 --> 05:51:13,799
developer and if we try to do something like that at

7286
05:51:13,799 --> 05:51:15,040
midnight you know on a

7287
05:51:15,040 --> 05:51:20,200
Wednesday night it's we may as well just not do anything

7288
05:51:20,200 --> 05:51:22,520
and let something get

7289
05:51:22,520 --> 05:51:24,939
worked out on the way to City Council when they have time

7290
05:51:24,939 --> 05:51:25,799
to do research and

7291
05:51:25,799 --> 05:51:29,919
do the math and figure out exactly what compromise they can

7292
05:51:29,919 --> 05:51:31,400
reach and bring it

7293
05:51:31,400 --> 05:51:36,240
forth to the actual deciders on this at City Council that's

7294
05:51:36,240 --> 05:51:37,279
why I think a

7295
05:51:37,279 --> 05:51:43,349
denial now is better than a really kind of hastily crafted

7296
05:51:43,349 --> 05:51:45,000
overlay I appreciate

7297
05:51:45,000 --> 05:51:49,000
thank you that information correct me if I'm wrong it's my

7298
05:51:49,000 --> 05:51:49,560
understanding that

7299
05:51:49,560 --> 05:51:51,950
this zoning request is not tied to a site plan so the

7300
05:51:51,950 --> 05:51:53,240
overlay would actually

7301
05:51:53,240 --> 05:52:00,159
protect what gets built. Commissioner Tyler. That is true

7302
05:52:00,159 --> 05:52:02,040
but it it doesn't

7303
05:52:02,040 --> 05:52:04,830
give any benefit to the neighborhood over the proposal in

7304
05:52:04,830 --> 05:52:05,919
fact it actually

7305
05:52:05,919 --> 05:52:08,590
gives them a little wiggle room which you know we generally

7306
05:52:08,590 --> 05:52:09,279
do in overlays

7307
05:52:09,279 --> 05:52:13,419
because we don't want to whenever we reach a negotiated

7308
05:52:13,419 --> 05:52:14,799
solution we don't

7309
05:52:14,799 --> 05:52:18,139
want to accidentally have something that was one foot too

7310
05:52:18,139 --> 05:52:19,279
low and just kills a

7311
05:52:19,279 --> 05:52:21,650
project that we have negotiated to the end but we haven't

7312
05:52:21,650 --> 05:52:22,639
negotiated anything

7313
05:52:22,639 --> 05:52:25,799
here we've basically designed an overlay that lets them do

7314
05:52:25,799 --> 05:52:27,639
exactly what they want

7315
05:52:27,639 --> 05:52:30,830
I'm gonna make a final comment and then we're gonna call

7316
05:52:30,830 --> 05:52:31,639
for a vote and get on

7317
05:52:31,639 --> 05:52:35,680
to our next item I don't think it was exactly what they

7318
05:52:35,680 --> 05:52:36,400
wanted I think they

7319
05:52:36,400 --> 05:52:39,049
came and did a neighborhood meeting with a project that

7320
05:52:39,049 --> 05:52:40,919
they built in Waco they

7321
05:52:40,919 --> 05:52:44,240
did this project that was farther setbacks from the street

7322
05:52:44,240 --> 05:52:44,959
they did it

7323
05:52:44,959 --> 05:52:47,909
with relief with setbacks that were as far as 15-60 feet

7324
05:52:47,909 --> 05:52:48,959
from the back of the curb

7325
05:52:48,959 --> 05:52:52,409
versus right up on the curb so I don't think it's correct

7326
05:52:52,409 --> 05:52:53,319
to sit here and say

7327
05:52:53,319 --> 05:52:55,590
that they've made no compromise they didn't listen to the

7328
05:52:55,590 --> 05:52:56,479
neighborhood they

7329
05:52:56,479 --> 05:52:58,790
didn't respond and they just built what they did I saw a

7330
05:52:58,790 --> 05:53:00,360
very different building

7331
05:53:00,360 --> 05:53:05,819
facade what they showed versus what they originally showed

7332
05:53:05,819 --> 05:53:06,799
at the neighborhood

7333
05:53:06,799 --> 05:53:09,560
meetings the second final thing I will say is that the

7334
05:53:09,560 --> 05:53:10,159
property that we're

7335
05:53:10,159 --> 05:53:13,119
talking about this the historic and all this stuff is a

7336
05:53:13,119 --> 05:53:14,400
vacant assisted living

7337
05:53:14,400 --> 05:53:17,560
center that has been vacant for many years a vacant

7338
05:53:17,560 --> 05:53:19,240
pharmacy building on the

7339
05:53:19,240 --> 05:53:23,799
corner there are old apartments all around it and they're

7340
05:53:23,799 --> 05:53:24,159
talking about

7341
05:53:24,159 --> 05:53:26,240
building a building that's probably at least a forty

7342
05:53:26,240 --> 05:53:27,400
million dollar building in

7343
05:53:27,400 --> 05:53:30,560
our city they chose to come build it here they're gonna pay

7344
05:53:30,560 --> 05:53:31,319
taxes on it

7345
05:53:31,319 --> 05:53:34,169
they're gonna pay impact fees on it they're gonna pay

7346
05:53:34,169 --> 05:53:35,599
traffic impact fees so

7347
05:53:35,599 --> 05:53:38,099
go to support all the roads that people say we need to get

7348
05:53:38,099 --> 05:53:39,119
the roads fixed and

7349
05:53:39,119 --> 05:53:42,840
people keep bringing projects to our city like this and

7350
05:53:42,840 --> 05:53:44,240
this commission says

7351
05:53:44,240 --> 05:53:48,099
no and then we turn around and say we don't have any money

7352
05:53:48,099 --> 05:53:48,759
to fix the streets

7353
05:53:48,759 --> 05:53:51,430
we don't have any money to do this and these are the people

7354
05:53:51,430 --> 05:53:52,200
that write the

7355
05:53:52,200 --> 05:53:55,150
checks to fix that stuff and so with that I'm gonna make

7356
05:53:55,150 --> 05:53:56,080
that's my final

7357
05:53:56,080 --> 05:53:58,680
comment I don't agree with the motion we're making I'm

7358
05:53:58,680 --> 05:53:59,439
gonna call for a vote

7359
05:53:59,439 --> 05:54:02,159
on it and then it can move on to City Council so with that

7360
05:54:02,159 --> 05:54:03,119
I'm gonna call for a

7361
05:54:03,119 --> 05:54:07,450
vote on the board and we'll move forward and get on to the

7362
05:54:07,450 --> 05:54:08,840
next people here

7363
05:54:09,119 --> 05:54:28,880
the motion to deny carries five to two

7364
05:54:39,119 --> 05:54:51,779
just a second I have a request from a commissioner to the

7365
05:54:51,779 --> 05:54:52,479
applicant and then

7366
05:54:52,479 --> 05:54:55,400
we're gonna move on to our next item if you could bring

7367
05:54:55,400 --> 05:54:56,759
this project on Stella

7368
05:54:56,759 --> 05:55:00,159
Street or Eagle there wouldn't be any overlays there wouldn

7369
05:55:00,159 --> 05:55:00,360
't be any

7370
05:55:00,360 --> 05:55:03,200
resistance and I know that you're challenged by where the

7371
05:55:03,200 --> 05:55:03,840
what land is

7372
05:55:03,840 --> 05:55:07,409
available for sale right now but this isn't we don't want

7373
05:55:07,409 --> 05:55:08,520
business in Denton

7374
05:55:08,520 --> 05:55:16,259
this is not on that's not in this exact location I have got

7375
05:55:16,259 --> 05:55:19,000
a conflict of

7376
05:55:19,000 --> 05:55:23,840
interest in regards to item 5a I own property across the

7377
05:55:23,840 --> 05:55:24,959
street or an owner

7378
05:55:24,959 --> 05:55:28,119
ownership interest in and real property across the street

7379
05:55:28,119 --> 05:55:28,919
so at this time I'm

7380
05:55:28,919 --> 05:55:31,740
going to recuse myself for a conflict of interest on this

7381
05:55:31,740 --> 05:55:32,959
item and I'm going to

7382
05:55:32,959 --> 05:55:37,150
turn the meeting over to vice-chair Devin Taylor for like

7383
05:55:37,150 --> 05:55:38,599
this item and also

7384
05:55:38,599 --> 05:55:46,959
thank you all thank you chair

7385
05:55:49,360 --> 05:55:56,299
so our next agenda item is listed as item 5a case number fr

7386
05:55:56,299 --> 05:56:00,040
16 - 0023 a hold a

7387
05:56:00,040 --> 05:56:02,669
public hearing and consider a request by Stephen and Karen

7388
05:56:02,669 --> 05:56:03,680
Hale for approval of a

7389
05:56:03,680 --> 05:56:07,400
final replant of lots one and two block B of Hale Estates

7390
05:56:07,400 --> 05:56:08,439
do we have a

7391
05:56:08,439 --> 05:56:12,610
presentation on this yes absolutely we have Haley who can

7392
05:56:12,610 --> 05:56:13,479
go through the

7393
05:56:13,479 --> 05:56:17,740
proposed replant the subdivision of a lot into two lots of

7394
05:56:17,740 --> 05:56:19,599
record

7395
05:56:30,680 --> 05:56:34,209
good evening so this is a fr 1623 it's a replant of the H

7396
05:56:34,209 --> 05:56:39,680
ale Estates lot one and

7397
05:56:39,680 --> 05:56:43,569
two of block B this was originally plotted as part of the

7398
05:56:43,569 --> 05:56:44,400
Montecito

7399
05:56:44,400 --> 05:56:48,909
subdivision believe it was originally lot 13 of block B and

7400
05:56:48,909 --> 05:56:50,200
so the request is

7401
05:56:50,200 --> 05:56:50,200
to subdivide this into two residential lots the zoning for

7402
05:56:50,200 --> 05:56:55,720
the properties in our

7403
05:56:55,720 --> 05:57:01,099
two and with this a lot two is encumbered by a significant

7404
05:57:01,099 --> 05:57:01,560
amount of

7405
05:57:01,560 --> 05:57:04,979
drainage easements floodplain there's some ESA on the

7406
05:57:04,979 --> 05:57:07,000
property as well that is

7407
05:57:07,000 --> 05:57:11,139
all encompassed in the easements that you see here and

7408
05:57:11,139 --> 05:57:12,639
there any other

7409
05:57:12,639 --> 05:57:16,240
questions I can answer those at this time

7410
05:57:20,680 --> 05:57:26,750
I don't see any questions for staff would the applicant

7411
05:57:26,750 --> 05:57:28,119
like to present

7412
05:57:39,680 --> 05:57:41,939
thank you commissioners and thank y'all for staying up here

7413
05:57:41,939 --> 05:57:44,119
late working with

7414
05:57:44,119 --> 05:57:47,979
us on this thing we were here a couple of weeks ago I

7415
05:57:47,979 --> 05:57:48,799
thought I would just

7416
05:57:48,799 --> 05:57:51,029
write out my remarks this time so I can go a lot quicker

7417
05:57:51,029 --> 05:57:52,000
instead of him and and

7418
05:57:52,000 --> 05:57:54,119
hauling around I could did last time and we can get through

7419
05:57:54,119 --> 05:57:54,759
this thing if you

7420
05:57:54,759 --> 05:57:58,000
just so I apologize for just reading it but when we ended

7421
05:57:58,000 --> 05:57:59,360
our session two weeks

7422
05:57:59,360 --> 05:58:02,380
ago I thought we were at a point where there were no

7423
05:58:02,380 --> 05:58:04,000
technical challenges to

7424
05:58:04,000 --> 05:58:07,159
our application but as some of my neighbors had appeared

7425
05:58:07,159 --> 05:58:08,080
and challenged on

7426
05:58:08,080 --> 05:58:11,240
other grounds we agreed to table the matter until tonight

7427
05:58:11,240 --> 05:58:12,639
as I explained at

7428
05:58:12,639 --> 05:58:16,209
the last meeting we were wanting to subdivide our three and

7429
05:58:16,209 --> 05:58:17,639
a half acres

7430
05:58:17,639 --> 05:58:23,709
into two lots so we can sell the lot to the east and being

7431
05:58:23,709 --> 05:58:25,159
lot to to our to our

7432
05:58:25,159 --> 05:58:30,669
neighbor Kevin Nelms who lives across from us on El Paso

7433
05:58:30,669 --> 05:58:32,159
one of the other

7434
05:58:32,159 --> 05:58:35,909
reasons I want to sell to Kevin is because he asked me a

7435
05:58:35,909 --> 05:58:37,080
long time ago if

7436
05:58:37,080 --> 05:58:39,599
I ever wanted to sell the property to give him right of

7437
05:58:39,599 --> 05:58:40,880
first refusal which I

7438
05:58:40,880 --> 05:58:44,139
did in this case and that's and that's why I'm honoring

7439
05:58:44,139 --> 05:58:46,180
that most of a lot too

7440
05:58:46,180 --> 05:58:49,990
is in is in a pond stream bed and damn and all of a lot too

7441
05:58:49,990 --> 05:58:51,560
has been designated

7442
05:58:51,560 --> 05:58:58,119
as floodplain pardon me in the course of this replatting

7443
05:58:58,119 --> 05:58:59,759
Kevin and his family

7444
05:58:59,759 --> 05:59:02,720
live in the first house downstream from the pond as it

7445
05:59:02,720 --> 05:59:04,400
flows through the dam and

7446
05:59:04,400 --> 05:59:08,830
as such he has the greatest vested interest of anyone in

7447
05:59:08,830 --> 05:59:09,799
the area in the

7448
05:59:09,799 --> 05:59:12,959
maintenance and stability of the dam as I've tried to

7449
05:59:12,959 --> 05:59:14,520
explain my greatest duty

7450
05:59:14,520 --> 05:59:18,119
is not to the people who live in Montecito I'm sorry as

7451
05:59:18,119 --> 05:59:19,479
they all live

7452
05:59:19,479 --> 05:59:22,909
upstream and will not be adversely affected should the dam

7453
05:59:22,909 --> 05:59:24,319
break my primary

7454
05:59:24,319 --> 05:59:27,319
duty is to those who live downstream and especially to

7455
05:59:27,319 --> 05:59:28,319
those who live in

7456
05:59:28,319 --> 05:59:31,669
Shadowbrook to the Southville sale that's not only my

7457
05:59:31,669 --> 05:59:32,959
opinion but it's also

7458
05:59:32,959 --> 05:59:35,930
the opinion of the TCEQ the Texas Commission on

7459
05:59:35,930 --> 05:59:38,520
Environmental Quality my

7460
05:59:38,520 --> 05:59:41,360
primary concern is with their safety and security and I

7461
05:59:41,360 --> 05:59:42,599
believe Kevin is the most

7462
05:59:42,599 --> 05:59:47,479
reliable person to take on that task at the last hearing

7463
05:59:47,479 --> 05:59:49,200
there were questions as

7464
05:59:49,200 --> 05:59:52,119
to whether subdividing our lot was allowed by the Montecito

7465
05:59:52,119 --> 05:59:52,680
restrictive

7466
05:59:52,680 --> 05:59:56,279
covenants paragraph 8 of the restrictions which deals with

7467
05:59:56,279 --> 05:59:56,959
subdividing

7468
05:59:56,959 --> 06:00:02,020
of lots requires the replatted lot have a minimum area of

7469
06:00:02,020 --> 06:00:04,139
one acre and 150 feet

7470
06:00:04,139 --> 06:00:09,700
of frontage and our replat meets those requirements looking

7471
06:00:09,700 --> 06:00:10,720
at the plate of

7472
06:00:10,720 --> 06:00:14,310
Montecito it appears that out of the 60 odd lots there are

7473
06:00:14,310 --> 06:00:15,439
only about five or six

7474
06:00:15,439 --> 06:00:18,909
lots that would be able to subdivide within these

7475
06:00:18,909 --> 06:00:21,080
restrictions those being

7476
06:00:21,080 --> 06:00:25,759
those lots at the north and the south ends of Montecito one

7477
06:00:25,759 --> 06:00:27,279
another point on

7478
06:00:27,279 --> 06:00:34,150
the as to what constitutes frontage our house fronts on

7479
06:00:34,150 --> 06:00:36,400
Santa Monica this house

7480
06:00:36,400 --> 06:00:42,470
not this house this property would front on El Paseo I was

7481
06:00:42,470 --> 06:00:44,080
unsure about that and

7482
06:00:44,080 --> 06:00:46,650
so I contacted a civil engineer who handles these kind of

7483
06:00:46,650 --> 06:00:47,439
matters all the

7484
06:00:47,439 --> 06:00:51,340
time and he assured me that frontage means only to the

7485
06:00:51,340 --> 06:00:53,080
nearest public road

7486
06:00:53,080 --> 06:00:58,400
roadway or street and also fronting to monitor fronting to

7487
06:00:58,400 --> 06:00:59,959
El Paseo El Paseo

7488
06:00:59,959 --> 06:01:03,950
this portion of El Paseo that's at the south end of Santa

7489
06:01:03,950 --> 06:01:05,479
Monica pardon me at

7490
06:01:05,479 --> 06:01:11,549
south end of the Montecito addition was dedicated what is a

7491
06:01:11,549 --> 06:01:12,279
dedicated street

7492
06:01:12,279 --> 06:01:19,430
within the Montecito dedication I realized that this matter

7493
06:01:19,430 --> 06:01:21,080
of restrictive

7494
06:01:21,080 --> 06:01:23,659
covenants is not within this board's purview but I want the

7495
06:01:23,659 --> 06:01:24,360
board to know

7496
06:01:24,360 --> 06:01:27,909
that I did not disregard such matters in filing for this

7497
06:01:27,909 --> 06:01:29,200
replat I consulted with

7498
06:01:29,200 --> 06:01:32,360
an engineer as well as our survey before filing our

7499
06:01:32,360 --> 06:01:34,680
application also since our

7500
06:01:34,680 --> 06:01:37,459
last hearing I did meet with two of my neighbors who were

7501
06:01:37,459 --> 06:01:38,479
back to who who back

7502
06:01:38,479 --> 06:01:43,229
to the pond as we had a very frank discussion as they say

7503
06:01:43,229 --> 06:01:44,000
in political

7504
06:01:44,000 --> 06:01:48,819
circles I as I explained to them it is my belief that Kevin

7505
06:01:48,819 --> 06:01:49,680
more so than any

7506
06:01:49,680 --> 06:01:53,430
other owner in the area is the best person to take care of

7507
06:01:53,430 --> 06:01:54,639
this property to

7508
06:01:54,639 --> 06:02:00,770
ensure the safety of those downstream many of those who are

7509
06:02:00,770 --> 06:02:03,279
here tonight who

7510
06:02:03,279 --> 06:02:05,959
are in opposition to our application did I know Kevin Kevin

7511
06:02:05,959 --> 06:02:06,880
is here and Kevin's

7512
06:02:06,880 --> 06:02:10,209
going to speak by the way I suggest that when they see him

7513
06:02:10,209 --> 06:02:11,080
and his crews out

7514
06:02:11,080 --> 06:02:14,240
there out there working they'd be good neighbors and stop

7515
06:02:14,240 --> 06:02:15,080
an offer to lend a

7516
06:02:15,080 --> 06:02:19,250
hand again it's my understanding that our application is

7517
06:02:19,250 --> 06:02:20,639
mature requirements so

7518
06:02:20,639 --> 06:02:23,490
I asked the board to prove our application do you have any

7519
06:02:23,490 --> 06:02:24,360
questions of

7520
06:02:24,360 --> 06:02:29,759
me at this time it's getting late thank you very much

7521
06:02:29,759 --> 06:02:37,959
questions thank you and this is a public hearing if anybody

7522
06:02:37,959 --> 06:02:40,599
would like to speak

7523
06:02:40,599 --> 06:02:45,069
this is a public hearing if anybody I will open the public

7524
06:02:45,069 --> 06:02:46,400
hearing at this

7525
06:02:46,400 --> 06:02:49,220
time if anybody would like to speak please fill out a blue

7526
06:02:49,220 --> 06:02:49,840
card I have

7527
06:02:49,840 --> 06:02:56,270
several cards here at this time I will call on Kevin Nelms

7528
06:02:56,270 --> 06:02:59,360
to speak please state

7529
06:02:59,360 --> 06:03:02,799
your name and address when you reach the podium

7530
06:03:03,479 --> 06:03:11,750
I'm Kevin Nelms I live at 3403 Shadowbrook Court in Denton

7531
06:03:11,750 --> 06:03:12,680
across

7532
06:03:12,680 --> 06:03:19,830
street from Steve and I met with a few of the neighbors in

7533
06:03:19,830 --> 06:03:20,319
the last few days

7534
06:03:20,319 --> 06:03:24,919
and some of them were concerned that I wanted to tear the

7535
06:03:24,919 --> 06:03:26,319
dam down which I

7536
06:03:26,319 --> 06:03:34,590
don't I'd like to fix the dam they it's on a beautiful lake

7537
06:03:34,590 --> 06:03:37,240
and all the lots

7538
06:03:37,240 --> 06:03:40,979
are beautiful except one it's the one right across the

7539
06:03:40,979 --> 06:03:42,479
street from me that I

7540
06:03:42,479 --> 06:03:45,700
look out my window when I eat breakfast and I've got some

7541
06:03:45,700 --> 06:03:47,000
pictures if you'd like

7542
06:03:47,000 --> 06:04:00,919
to look there's a first one that's the dam and these are

7543
06:04:00,919 --> 06:04:02,400
these are logs that

7544
06:04:02,400 --> 06:04:04,610
float downstream if you look at the house in the back I

7545
06:04:04,610 --> 06:04:05,400
talked that lady

7546
06:04:05,400 --> 06:04:10,909
last night and she's she indicated she was for me getting

7547
06:04:10,909 --> 06:04:12,520
this place cleaned up

7548
06:04:12,520 --> 06:04:15,939
all the other houses are real nice but all the junks got to

7549
06:04:15,939 --> 06:04:16,599
go out somewhere

7550
06:04:16,599 --> 06:04:25,040
and it all flows over there and then this is on the other

7551
06:04:25,040 --> 06:04:28,200
side of the dam

7552
06:04:29,040 --> 06:04:34,000
it's kind of a swamp area for mosquitoes it's right across

7553
06:04:34,000 --> 06:04:37,639
from my house here's

7554
06:04:37,639 --> 06:04:47,680
another picture of the dam getting jammed up this is the

7555
06:04:47,680 --> 06:04:50,880
there's a drainage

7556
06:04:50,880 --> 06:04:54,069
thing that goes underneath the street to right behind my

7557
06:04:54,069 --> 06:04:55,840
house that's it if you

7558
06:04:55,840 --> 06:05:00,040
notice there's logs here as Steve said he's seen it where

7559
06:05:00,040 --> 06:05:00,759
it's all the way up

7560
06:05:00,759 --> 06:05:06,889
to like this area with logs which would flood over the

7561
06:05:06,889 --> 06:05:09,479
street the dam has about a

7562
06:05:09,479 --> 06:05:13,000
four inch crack there's my tennis shoe there but the four

7563
06:05:13,000 --> 06:05:13,919
inch crack down here

7564
06:05:13,919 --> 06:05:17,450
and I'm kind of taking a picture straight down on it that

7565
06:05:17,450 --> 06:05:20,639
needs repaired

7566
06:05:20,639 --> 06:05:28,599
all the trees along the the lake there look like that and

7567
06:05:28,599 --> 06:05:31,639
then there's a bunch

7568
06:05:31,639 --> 06:05:36,720
of concrete thrown on the other side of the dam that needs

7569
06:05:36,720 --> 06:05:39,520
cleaned up and covered

7570
06:05:39,520 --> 06:05:44,639
with gravel and concrete there's another one of the trees

7571
06:05:44,639 --> 06:05:48,319
on the on the edge of

7572
06:05:48,319 --> 06:05:53,880
the lake on the property and then another one and then this

7573
06:05:53,880 --> 06:05:55,080
is looking back

7574
06:05:55,080 --> 06:06:02,599
from my my window of my house to all these trees that are

7575
06:06:02,599 --> 06:06:04,360
dead and all the

7576
06:06:04,360 --> 06:06:08,310
piles of things which I would like to clean up because it

7577
06:06:08,310 --> 06:06:09,680
looks nice and

7578
06:06:09,680 --> 06:06:15,750
there's some more dead trees on the property more dead

7579
06:06:15,750 --> 06:06:17,040
trees on the property

7580
06:06:17,040 --> 06:06:26,020
and here's another picture of this is the basic main part

7581
06:06:26,020 --> 06:06:27,240
of the property

7582
06:06:27,240 --> 06:06:32,569
which I could really clean up and make look nice I live on

7583
06:06:32,569 --> 06:06:34,119
a basically a zero

7584
06:06:34,119 --> 06:06:40,220
lot line house and I have a driveway that enters from the

7585
06:06:40,220 --> 06:06:41,479
rear I have a front

7586
06:06:41,479 --> 06:06:46,819
yard but my son kind of has nowhere to play so this would

7587
06:06:46,819 --> 06:06:48,360
give an area we could

7588
06:06:48,360 --> 06:06:51,040
put a basketball court or something over here I have no

7589
06:06:51,040 --> 06:06:53,080
intention of building

7590
06:06:53,080 --> 06:06:56,720
anything just basically clean it up make it look nice at my

7591
06:06:56,720 --> 06:06:59,759
expense and from the

7592
06:06:59,759 --> 06:07:02,720
discussion tonight maybe the city doesn't have enough money

7593
06:07:02,720 --> 06:07:04,479
to fix up the

7594
06:07:04,479 --> 06:07:07,860
dam and I do so and I've got the equipment and I've got the

7595
06:07:07,860 --> 06:07:08,680
people to do

7596
06:07:08,680 --> 06:07:13,000
it and thank you very much for your consideration we do

7597
06:07:13,000 --> 06:07:14,439
have one question

7598
06:07:14,439 --> 06:07:19,520
Commissioner Beck thank you by sure thank you sir Kevin for

7599
06:07:19,520 --> 06:07:20,040
coming down and

7600
06:07:20,040 --> 06:07:23,569
speaking so if I understand you right you have no intention

7601
06:07:23,569 --> 06:07:24,159
of letting this

7602
06:07:24,159 --> 06:07:29,430
damn deteriorate and any repairs that it would take to keep

7603
06:07:29,430 --> 06:07:31,360
it intact will come

7604
06:07:31,360 --> 06:07:34,880
out of your own pocket is that correct that's correct okay

7605
06:07:34,880 --> 06:07:35,919
have you any offers

7606
06:07:35,919 --> 06:07:40,709
from any of the neighbors to help you with this now I had I

7607
06:07:40,709 --> 06:07:42,880
had two neighbors

7608
06:07:42,880 --> 06:07:48,009
come out come by the lady I showed you her house I think

7609
06:07:48,009 --> 06:07:50,799
she came by last night

7610
06:07:50,799 --> 06:07:54,009
and then the gentleman next door that lives you know not on

7611
06:07:54,009 --> 06:07:54,919
the lake he came

7612
06:07:54,919 --> 06:08:03,240
by and then I met Peter I met Peter tonight and he's he

7613
06:08:03,240 --> 06:08:04,400
seems to be in

7614
06:08:04,400 --> 06:08:07,180
agreement and of course Steve and everybody so that's a

7615
06:08:07,180 --> 06:08:08,520
start pardon me

7616
06:08:08,520 --> 06:08:12,799
that's a start then that's a start you've got yeah some

7617
06:08:12,799 --> 06:08:13,479
people on your side

7618
06:08:13,479 --> 06:08:21,959
yeah okay every I've lived in it since 92 and I took a 50-

7619
06:08:21,959 --> 06:08:23,599
acre lot that was

7620
06:08:23,599 --> 06:08:27,290
really terrible is I realized my Hill roads not the nicest

7621
06:08:27,290 --> 06:08:28,439
looking place in

7622
06:08:28,439 --> 06:08:31,729
the world but this place was really a showplace when I got

7623
06:08:31,729 --> 06:08:32,919
done with it and

7624
06:08:32,919 --> 06:08:37,209
my house is well kept and I have another house that I ran

7625
06:08:37,209 --> 06:08:39,400
out over on the north

7626
06:08:39,400 --> 06:08:45,599
side of town and I keep it well and I've got other houses

7627
06:08:45,599 --> 06:08:47,119
in other countries and

7628
06:08:47,119 --> 06:08:50,840
I keep them well so I just like something nice that's all

7629
06:08:50,840 --> 06:08:51,599
all right thank

7630
06:08:51,599 --> 06:08:55,840
you sir okay any other questions no thank you okay thank

7631
06:08:55,840 --> 06:08:57,840
you our next speaker

7632
06:08:57,840 --> 06:09:03,880
is Douglas Ebersole to be followed by John Wright

7633
06:09:14,880 --> 06:09:19,169
I'd like to just clarify a couple of things that I heard in

7634
06:09:19,169 --> 06:09:22,639
the work session

7635
06:09:22,639 --> 06:09:29,080
about the covenants the covenant has an amendment covenants

7636
06:09:29,080 --> 06:09:29,959
the restrictions

7637
06:09:29,959 --> 06:09:34,959
were written in 1965 when Bob Nichols developed this place

7638
06:09:34,959 --> 06:09:41,959
and this along here

7639
06:09:41,959 --> 06:09:47,340
this line is block a all those lots here and the rest of

7640
06:09:47,340 --> 06:09:48,680
this over here is block

7641
06:09:48,680 --> 06:09:55,830
B and C D&E the amendment was written in 1966 and it was

7642
06:09:55,830 --> 06:09:58,119
clarified item number

7643
06:09:58,119 --> 06:10:04,439
eight and what it says it says except for lots and block a

7644
06:10:04,439 --> 06:10:04,919
except for all

7645
06:10:04,919 --> 06:10:13,680
these lots here no lot shall be resubdivided into no lot

7646
06:10:13,680 --> 06:10:14,119
sub is

7647
06:10:14,119 --> 06:10:17,889
resubdivided into that's old legal language for just subd

7648
06:10:17,889 --> 06:10:19,200
ivided the neck and

7649
06:10:19,200 --> 06:10:22,770
the next restriction says it continues it says nor shall

7650
06:10:22,770 --> 06:10:24,319
any dwelling be erected

7651
06:10:24,319 --> 06:10:28,459
or placed on any portion of any lot having a frontage of

7652
06:10:28,459 --> 06:10:30,360
less than 150 feet

7653
06:10:30,360 --> 06:10:34,319
and less than one acre the reason he did that is because

7654
06:10:34,319 --> 06:10:37,080
these lots originally

7655
06:10:37,080 --> 06:10:41,720
were platted the same size as these over here okay they're

7656
06:10:41,720 --> 06:10:43,159
all the same size you

7657
06:10:43,159 --> 06:10:47,799
can see down here these two lots are still the same size

7658
06:10:47,799 --> 06:10:50,360
but lots across 11

7659
06:10:50,360 --> 06:10:56,430
number 18 what he did is he turned 11 lots into 18 over

7660
06:10:56,430 --> 06:10:57,319
here in other words he

7661
06:10:57,319 --> 06:11:00,639
and you can see right here he halves the size of the loss

7662
06:11:00,639 --> 06:11:02,319
and that was because

7663
06:11:02,319 --> 06:11:06,830
these these were not selling over here and so he had those

7664
06:11:06,830 --> 06:11:08,279
lots almost all of

7665
06:11:08,279 --> 06:11:13,529
them and then that's how he moved the project and those

7666
06:11:13,529 --> 06:11:14,959
sold so this

7667
06:11:14,959 --> 06:11:21,029
restriction except for lots and block a no lot shall be

7668
06:11:21,029 --> 06:11:23,279
subdivided into nor shall

7669
06:11:23,279 --> 06:11:26,599
any dwelling be erected then it continues on after that

7670
06:11:26,599 --> 06:11:28,759
lots and block a may be

7671
06:11:28,759 --> 06:11:31,459
subdivided provided said lot shall have frontage of not

7672
06:11:31,459 --> 06:11:32,959
less than 100 feet and

7673
06:11:32,959 --> 06:11:39,590
25,000 squeak feet an area so that's why he did that he

7674
06:11:39,590 --> 06:11:40,599
wrote that in there so he

7675
06:11:40,599 --> 06:11:44,240
could subdivide those lots but that doesn't apply to Mont

7676
06:11:44,240 --> 06:11:45,639
icello the red to

7677
06:11:45,639 --> 06:11:52,790
block B C D and E that that exception only applies to block

7678
06:11:52,790 --> 06:11:54,619
a so what that

7679
06:11:54,619 --> 06:11:59,450
says is no lots can be subdivided into that and that the

7680
06:11:59,450 --> 06:12:00,479
whole place is

7681
06:12:00,479 --> 06:12:05,000
developed out now and this ignoring our covenants which

7682
06:12:05,000 --> 06:12:06,200
that best a bad

7683
06:12:06,200 --> 06:12:10,080
precedent for subdivision in there when it is against our

7684
06:12:10,080 --> 06:12:11,599
our covenants I've

7685
06:12:11,599 --> 06:12:14,979
heard a lot of talk tonight and previous issues about

7686
06:12:14,979 --> 06:12:17,880
neighborhood integrity about

7687
06:12:17,880 --> 06:12:22,979
character of neighborhoods and there are departments in the

7688
06:12:22,979 --> 06:12:24,000
city that are

7689
06:12:24,000 --> 06:12:27,400
concerned and talked a lot about neighborhood harmony cohes

7690
06:12:27,400 --> 06:12:27,919
iveness

7691
06:12:27,919 --> 06:12:33,990
security and character and safety and beauty and what's

7692
06:12:33,990 --> 06:12:35,159
happened to Monticello

7693
06:12:35,159 --> 06:12:41,229
whereas there are no regard for 52 year old restrictions

7694
06:12:41,229 --> 06:12:43,119
that are still valid

7695
06:12:44,799 --> 06:12:50,029
it would set a bad precedent and as far as the safety

7696
06:12:50,029 --> 06:12:53,279
downstream the last meeting

7697
06:12:53,279 --> 06:12:56,750
I tried to talk a little bit about history and the other

7698
06:12:56,750 --> 06:12:57,959
thing that was said

7699
06:12:57,959 --> 06:13:01,490
in the work session that was I need to clarify is it was

7700
06:13:01,490 --> 06:13:03,000
said that there was no

7701
06:13:03,000 --> 06:13:06,880
homeless homeless Association I was president of a homeless

7702
06:13:06,880 --> 06:13:07,500
Association

7703
06:13:07,500 --> 06:13:11,560
right there for 20 years there was and has been a homeless

7704
06:13:11,560 --> 06:13:15,080
Association okay and

7705
06:13:15,080 --> 06:13:19,250
we have come together over all those years of decades to

7706
06:13:19,250 --> 06:13:20,560
keep that dam in

7707
06:13:20,560 --> 06:13:24,389
repair we built the whole thing once and then rebuild it

7708
06:13:24,389 --> 06:13:25,959
again two or three times

7709
06:13:25,959 --> 06:13:29,970
and we have what we have as far as that the concrete below

7710
06:13:29,970 --> 06:13:31,299
the dam that's there

7711
06:13:31,299 --> 06:13:36,610
purposefully and that was given that that's a suggestion

7712
06:13:36,610 --> 06:13:37,919
was later on because

7713
06:13:37,919 --> 06:13:41,569
the dam kept washing out underneath it so he said put a

7714
06:13:41,569 --> 06:13:43,080
catchment pace in there

7715
06:13:43,080 --> 06:13:46,700
a detention pond below that dam to keep it from washing

7716
06:13:46,700 --> 06:13:48,040
under so that's why we

7717
06:13:48,040 --> 06:13:50,490
put those concrete there it's not junk it's not dumped it's

7718
06:13:50,490 --> 06:13:50,959
put there

7719
06:13:50,959 --> 06:13:55,130
purposely and that pond which he calls a mosquito nest is a

7720
06:13:55,130 --> 06:13:56,680
pond as the catchment

7721
06:13:56,680 --> 06:13:59,250
pond so when the water comes over the dam it doesn't wash

7722
06:13:59,250 --> 06:14:00,520
underneath it it's

7723
06:14:00,520 --> 06:14:04,479
happened and we know before we got that and now that works

7724
06:14:04,479 --> 06:14:05,439
and we and those

7725
06:14:05,439 --> 06:14:09,259
things are full of concrete those cracks they're on the

7726
06:14:09,259 --> 06:14:11,080
outside because we filled

7727
06:14:11,080 --> 06:14:15,209
those those two sides and so spillway full of concrete I'm

7728
06:14:15,209 --> 06:14:16,479
on my time is up

7729
06:14:16,479 --> 06:14:20,240
that's I'm opposed to the I'm opposed to this on principle

7730
06:14:20,240 --> 06:14:21,400
because it's violates

7731
06:14:21,400 --> 06:14:24,880
our covenants sir could you state your name and address I'm

7732
06:14:24,880 --> 06:14:26,000
sorry Doug

7733
06:14:26,000 --> 06:14:31,319
Ebersole 3210 Montecito Road thank you

7734
06:14:32,439 --> 06:14:37,430
our next speaker is John Wright to be followed by Weaver Mc

7735
06:14:37,430 --> 06:14:41,479
Clure is is John

7736
06:14:41,479 --> 06:14:44,919
Wright in the audience they might have already gone home at

7737
06:14:44,919 --> 06:14:45,880
this late hour they

7738
06:14:45,880 --> 06:14:50,599
marked that they did wish to speak in opposition Weaver Mc

7739
06:14:50,599 --> 06:14:52,119
Clure is weaver here

7740
06:14:52,119 --> 06:14:58,439
to be followed by Michael Doransky

7741
06:15:07,319 --> 06:15:14,139
my name is Weaver McClure I live at 3100 Carmel Denton

7742
06:15:14,139 --> 06:15:16,919
block C lot 7 I've been

7743
06:15:16,919 --> 06:15:21,959
there since 1989 so I've been there about 28 years Doug

7744
06:15:21,959 --> 06:15:22,759
said a lot of the

7745
06:15:22,759 --> 06:15:25,569
same things that I'm going to go over when I first when I

7746
06:15:25,569 --> 06:15:26,919
bought my house and

7747
06:15:26,919 --> 06:15:32,990
paid for the house they gave me a deed restrictions and

7748
06:15:32,990 --> 06:15:33,759
said you know you have

7749
06:15:33,759 --> 06:15:37,619
to follow these and so we've done that and there's been

7750
06:15:37,619 --> 06:15:39,240
times where we've had

7751
06:15:39,240 --> 06:15:43,299
to come back together to let some of the lot owners there's

7752
06:15:43,299 --> 06:15:45,240
a bankers 83 lots in

7753
06:15:45,240 --> 06:15:49,470
Montecito understand that they do have deed restriction

7754
06:15:49,470 --> 06:15:50,840
have to follow and if

7755
06:15:50,840 --> 06:15:55,189
you'll look at that little dot we had somebody move in a

7756
06:15:55,189 --> 06:15:57,680
farmhouse and so we

7757
06:15:57,680 --> 06:16:01,419
had you know deal with that and that got straightened out

7758
06:16:01,419 --> 06:16:03,599
and taken care of so if

7759
06:16:03,599 --> 06:16:09,669
you'll look in like in 1965 when the deed restrictions

7760
06:16:09,669 --> 06:16:11,479
passed Bob Nichols

7761
06:16:11,479 --> 06:16:14,970
course started this and that's the name of the streets

7762
06:16:14,970 --> 06:16:17,919
after California but this

7763
06:16:17,919 --> 06:16:20,740
lot that's right next to here of the way you're thinking

7764
06:16:20,740 --> 06:16:22,119
about replating this

7765
06:16:22,119 --> 06:16:27,119
this man that helped write these and signed off on these

7766
06:16:27,119 --> 06:16:28,000
deed restrictions

7767
06:16:28,000 --> 06:16:35,990
was Mark clearman and so he is not there anymore he almost

7768
06:16:35,990 --> 06:16:36,840
passed away there I

7769
06:16:36,840 --> 06:16:39,799
guess for his soul is house and left so these deed

7770
06:16:39,799 --> 06:16:41,080
restrictions are there and I

7771
06:16:41,080 --> 06:16:43,340
know the staff does not have to follow the deed

7772
06:16:43,340 --> 06:16:44,799
restrictions I keep hearing

7773
06:16:44,799 --> 06:16:48,810
that a lot but I would make a suggestion that anytime you

7774
06:16:48,810 --> 06:16:49,840
have anything that's

7775
06:16:49,840 --> 06:16:53,000
going to be changed that you put that on top of the form

7776
06:16:53,000 --> 06:16:53,840
does this comply with

7777
06:16:53,840 --> 06:16:57,150
the deed restriction so everybody will know in the very

7778
06:16:57,150 --> 06:16:58,360
beginning I'm very

7779
06:16:58,360 --> 06:17:06,560
opposed to this this lot block B lot 13 has been there

7780
06:17:06,560 --> 06:17:09,159
since forever that this

7781
06:17:09,159 --> 06:17:13,799
addition has been there I really resent changing the name

7782
06:17:13,799 --> 06:17:15,880
to a different name so

7783
06:17:15,880 --> 06:17:20,400
in the future when this property is resold again that it

7784
06:17:20,400 --> 06:17:20,919
will be called

7785
06:17:20,919 --> 06:17:26,990
something different than the Montecito edition and far as

7786
06:17:26,990 --> 06:17:28,479
dividing it up and

7787
06:17:28,479 --> 06:17:31,889
replating it some of the covenants that we have now the

7788
06:17:31,889 --> 06:17:33,759
deed restrictions say

7789
06:17:33,759 --> 06:17:37,049
that you can't you have to build a resident none of the

7790
06:17:37,049 --> 06:17:38,119
laws can be used

7791
06:17:38,119 --> 06:17:41,639
but for residents so this property would have to have by

7792
06:17:41,639 --> 06:17:42,720
the deed restrictions

7793
06:17:42,720 --> 06:17:47,110
would have to have a resident put on it a house and so what

7794
06:17:47,110 --> 06:17:49,180
by voting yes for

7795
06:17:49,180 --> 06:17:52,400
this what you're putting is all the lot owners now are

7796
06:17:52,400 --> 06:17:53,439
going to put in a

7797
06:17:53,439 --> 06:17:57,740
position that our only solution is civil litigation and you

7798
06:17:57,740 --> 06:17:59,240
know nobody wants to

7799
06:17:59,240 --> 06:18:02,650
go there but that that's probably words had it if if you

7800
06:18:02,650 --> 06:18:05,439
vote yes on this and

7801
06:18:05,439 --> 06:18:10,659
that's about all I got to say any questions I have no

7802
06:18:10,659 --> 06:18:11,720
questions at this

7803
06:18:11,720 --> 06:18:21,159
time Commissioner Roselle thank you mr. McClure for your

7804
06:18:21,159 --> 06:18:22,400
thoughtful presentation

7805
06:18:22,400 --> 06:18:24,889
I do have a question that sure it might be reoccurring that

7806
06:18:24,889 --> 06:18:25,560
anyone who's

7807
06:18:25,560 --> 06:18:29,509
presenting could answer but it seems to me that mr. Hale

7808
06:18:29,509 --> 06:18:30,919
has not up kept that

7809
06:18:30,919 --> 06:18:34,750
the dam in terms of aesthetics cracks look like there's

7810
06:18:34,750 --> 06:18:36,119
rocks in that creek

7811
06:18:36,119 --> 06:18:39,290
bed and I don't know even his ability because it's riparian

7812
06:18:39,290 --> 06:18:40,159
buffer to do so

7813
06:18:40,159 --> 06:18:44,950
okay so that being said we have an individual who has said

7814
06:18:44,950 --> 06:18:45,840
that he would

7815
06:18:45,840 --> 06:18:50,860
like to bring up the aesthetics of the area within his his

7816
06:18:50,860 --> 06:18:53,279
ability I'm trying

7817
06:18:53,279 --> 06:18:55,540
to understand if you have an individual who's not doing

7818
06:18:55,540 --> 06:18:56,240
that but you have an

7819
06:18:56,240 --> 06:18:59,779
individual who now wants to is that not good for the

7820
06:18:59,779 --> 06:19:01,639
overall Monticello addition

7821
06:19:01,639 --> 06:19:03,849
well not not really because we're gonna have to have

7822
06:19:03,849 --> 06:19:05,200
another resident there and

7823
06:19:05,200 --> 06:19:08,200
you can't really have a lot without a resident on it

7824
06:19:08,200 --> 06:19:10,080
residents on it so my

7825
06:19:10,080 --> 06:19:13,700
suggestion in that situation is is that mr. Nims wants the

7826
06:19:13,700 --> 06:19:14,939
property by the whole

7827
06:19:14,939 --> 06:19:17,900
property and fix the dam and then he then he controls the

7828
06:19:17,900 --> 06:19:18,759
whole thing and

7829
06:19:18,759 --> 06:19:22,049
stays as one lot which that's where our covenants are you

7830
06:19:22,049 --> 06:19:23,360
can't subdivide it

7831
06:19:23,360 --> 06:19:27,369
Hank mr. Hale I misrepresented that because the first part

7832
06:19:27,369 --> 06:19:28,000
of that says it

7833
06:19:28,000 --> 06:19:31,159
can't be subdivided the second part talks about how big the

7834
06:19:31,159 --> 06:19:32,000
lot has to be

7835
06:19:32,000 --> 06:19:36,200
that you have to have a you know piece of a house on it I

7836
06:19:36,200 --> 06:19:37,479
think that's where

7837
06:19:37,479 --> 06:19:40,080
we're at and I've looked at this for a long time I've been

7838
06:19:40,080 --> 06:19:41,240
on the deed

7839
06:19:41,240 --> 06:19:44,240
restrictions committee in the past and so most people

7840
06:19:44,240 --> 06:19:45,560
comply we really don't

7841
06:19:45,560 --> 06:19:48,119
have much problems nobody wants to go talk to your neighbor

7842
06:19:48,119 --> 06:19:48,880
and say look you

7843
06:19:48,880 --> 06:19:52,139
know what are you building now without getting approval and

7844
06:19:52,139 --> 06:19:52,779
it doesn't fit our

7845
06:19:52,779 --> 06:19:55,360
covenants sure everybody got these when they bought the

7846
06:19:55,360 --> 06:19:58,080
property so thank you

7847
06:19:58,080 --> 06:20:02,119
you bet thank you one more question Commissioner Beck thank

7848
06:20:02,119 --> 06:20:02,680
you vice chair

7849
06:20:02,680 --> 06:20:06,689
thank you for your comments so am I understand you right

7850
06:20:06,689 --> 06:20:07,799
then that whoever

7851
06:20:07,799 --> 06:20:11,310
owns that lot where the dam is it's solely their

7852
06:20:11,310 --> 06:20:13,560
responsibility to make not

7853
06:20:13,560 --> 06:20:18,680
sure about that that part I haven't looked at okay because

7854
06:20:18,680 --> 06:20:19,200
I think that's

7855
06:20:19,200 --> 06:20:21,650
but if it's on your property I mean like if any of us has a

7856
06:20:21,650 --> 06:20:22,720
piece of property I

7857
06:20:22,720 --> 06:20:26,119
mean what's on your property here you know that's your deal

7858
06:20:26,119 --> 06:20:27,240
and if it's not

7859
06:20:27,240 --> 06:20:29,799
where you can take care of it maybe you need to do

7860
06:20:29,799 --> 06:20:30,919
something different with the

7861
06:20:30,919 --> 06:20:35,290
property well and I agree with that I do but if this

7862
06:20:35,290 --> 06:20:37,680
impacts something that the

7863
06:20:37,680 --> 06:20:41,580
whole neighborhood benefits from it seems like to put the

7864
06:20:41,580 --> 06:20:42,520
onus on him to

7865
06:20:42,520 --> 06:20:45,169
take care of something that everybody benefits from well my

7866
06:20:45,169 --> 06:20:45,959
suggestion is

7867
06:20:45,959 --> 06:20:48,319
there's a lot of people that back up to that in part of the

7868
06:20:48,319 --> 06:20:48,959
covenants is

7869
06:20:48,959 --> 06:20:51,259
everybody has a right to the waterways or any streams or

7870
06:20:51,259 --> 06:20:52,279
anything that's there

7871
06:20:52,279 --> 06:20:55,849
so it backs up to the property so really we ought to

7872
06:20:55,849 --> 06:20:58,000
probably get those people to

7873
06:20:58,000 --> 06:21:00,200
say look you know we'll pay for it I mean even maybe as a

7874
06:21:00,200 --> 06:21:00,959
deed restriction

7875
06:21:00,959 --> 06:21:04,380
committee we put in fees and things to cover that does

7876
06:21:04,380 --> 06:21:05,919
anybody propose it not

7877
06:21:05,919 --> 06:21:08,000
yet this is the first time this has really come up I didn't

7878
06:21:08,000 --> 06:21:08,759
know about this

7879
06:21:08,759 --> 06:21:19,549
till about three weeks ago okay okay thank you sir okay our

7880
06:21:19,549 --> 06:21:20,159
next speaker is

7881
06:21:20,159 --> 06:21:24,419
Michael Doransky to be followed by Jim Keffer and please

7882
06:21:24,419 --> 06:21:25,599
state your name and

7883
06:21:25,599 --> 06:21:29,430
address for the record my name is Michael Doransky I'm at

7884
06:21:29,430 --> 06:21:31,439
2111 Montecito

7885
06:21:31,439 --> 06:21:34,599
for what I've heard tonight the council cares about the

7886
06:21:34,599 --> 06:21:35,639
majority of the citizens

7887
06:21:35,639 --> 06:21:38,520
in the history of the city and I think that this case of

7888
06:21:38,520 --> 06:21:39,560
this is just as well

7889
06:21:39,560 --> 06:21:42,500
in this neighborhood as this neighborhood is also 50 years

7890
06:21:42,500 --> 06:21:43,240
old and

7891
06:21:43,240 --> 06:21:47,099
just as much care that was made for the historic area this

7892
06:21:47,099 --> 06:21:48,520
area is just as is

7893
06:21:48,520 --> 06:21:51,389
just as old by standards to be historic even though it

7894
06:21:51,389 --> 06:21:52,439
doesn't have that

7895
06:21:52,439 --> 06:21:56,000
designation and as people people speaking tonight do live

7896
06:21:56,000 --> 06:21:56,479
in this

7897
06:21:56,479 --> 06:21:58,849
neighborhood they're not from around the county they're not

7898
06:21:58,849 --> 06:21:59,840
from random places

7899
06:21:59,840 --> 06:22:03,509
these are people who actually do live on these streets and

7900
06:22:03,509 --> 06:22:05,639
from we left off two

7901
06:22:05,639 --> 06:22:09,349
weeks ago you know there was basically one or two

7902
06:22:09,349 --> 06:22:10,240
homeowners that are in favor

7903
06:22:10,240 --> 06:22:13,400
of this piece and for the project of subdividing their

7904
06:22:13,400 --> 06:22:15,520
property and a couple

7905
06:22:15,520 --> 06:22:18,209
weeks later we're probably still at that same point and

7906
06:22:18,209 --> 06:22:21,560
basically I know that you

7907
06:22:21,560 --> 06:22:23,759
all instructed us to say hey you need to have a neighbor

7908
06:22:23,759 --> 06:22:25,040
the seller should have a

7909
06:22:25,040 --> 06:22:29,919
a hosted meeting with the neighborhood well they didn't do

7910
06:22:29,919 --> 06:22:30,759
that in fact

7911
06:22:30,759 --> 06:22:32,889
basically some of the neighbors reached out to him and

7912
06:22:32,889 --> 06:22:33,919
begged for a meeting for

7913
06:22:33,919 --> 06:22:38,119
this Frank meeting I guess as he was saying to typically

7914
06:22:38,119 --> 06:22:39,680
you know get their

7915
06:22:39,680 --> 06:22:44,240
own input and he simply just took the suggestion just

7916
06:22:44,240 --> 06:22:44,919
basically didn't do

7917
06:22:44,919 --> 06:22:47,040
anything with it and maybe the reason why it is because

7918
06:22:47,040 --> 06:22:48,119
maybe the properties

7919
06:22:48,119 --> 06:22:52,400
already changed hands monetarily but just not on paper but

7920
06:22:52,400 --> 06:22:53,400
some of the

7921
06:22:53,400 --> 06:22:56,130
neighbors around the lake did beg for the meeting and they

7922
06:22:56,130 --> 06:22:58,919
did get one and at

7923
06:22:58,919 --> 06:23:02,400
this meeting for I understand it was basically you know

7924
06:23:02,400 --> 06:23:03,799
trying to work out

7925
06:23:03,799 --> 06:23:07,659
some sort of compromise but that really didn't occur it

7926
06:23:07,659 --> 06:23:08,759
basically was saying hey

7927
06:23:08,759 --> 06:23:12,000
you guys better get on board or there could be you know

7928
06:23:12,000 --> 06:23:12,720
there could be

7929
06:23:12,720 --> 06:23:15,229
consequences to the sort and basically I wasn't at this

7930
06:23:15,229 --> 06:23:16,319
meeting but that's just

7931
06:23:16,319 --> 06:23:18,560
basically from what I've heard from the other pieces of it

7932
06:23:18,560 --> 06:23:19,919
and back to the

7933
06:23:19,919 --> 06:23:22,250
meaning of before is hey if you don't like this project I

7934
06:23:22,250 --> 06:23:23,000
got a much worse

7935
06:23:23,000 --> 06:23:24,950
project for you if you want to get on board with if you don

7936
06:23:24,950 --> 06:23:25,599
't get on board with

7937
06:23:25,599 --> 06:23:30,180
this one that's kind of how I'm taking it as well and he

7938
06:23:30,180 --> 06:23:32,319
knows maybe he drains

7939
06:23:32,319 --> 06:23:35,479
the lake takes out the dam to punish us all for those

7940
06:23:35,479 --> 06:23:36,959
pieces and you know being

7941
06:23:36,959 --> 06:23:40,689
an insurance in those pieces flooding could be an issue it

7942
06:23:40,689 --> 06:23:41,759
could cause damage

7943
06:23:41,759 --> 06:23:44,729
downstream just to make us all pay for us standing up for

7944
06:23:44,729 --> 06:23:46,080
what we don't want or

7945
06:23:46,080 --> 06:23:50,840
what we believe in and for I understand the neighbors were

7946
06:23:50,840 --> 06:23:51,599
interested in trying

7947
06:23:51,599 --> 06:23:53,900
to see what the price was of this property to cheap out if

7948
06:23:53,900 --> 06:23:54,560
we could match

7949
06:23:54,560 --> 06:23:57,369
the price and then make it more of a HOA or community

7950
06:23:57,369 --> 06:23:58,799
property that we all would

7951
06:23:58,799 --> 06:24:01,979
be responsible for for this piece of property but for

7952
06:24:01,979 --> 06:24:03,639
whatever reason that

7953
06:24:03,639 --> 06:24:08,290
was not something that was that was entertaining instead

7954
06:24:08,290 --> 06:24:09,799
you know basically

7955
06:24:09,799 --> 06:24:12,060
they told us that hey it's gonna cost fifty to a hundred

7956
06:24:12,060 --> 06:24:13,000
grand for this piece

7957
06:24:13,000 --> 06:24:15,639
I've seen no estimates I don't know if you all have the

7958
06:24:15,639 --> 06:24:16,959
estimates for this fifty

7959
06:24:16,959 --> 06:24:20,159
to a hundred grand but basically I think that's just more

7960
06:24:20,159 --> 06:24:21,159
of a scare tactic as

7961
06:24:21,159 --> 06:24:23,759
well to try to get people on board of please let me do this

7962
06:24:23,759 --> 06:24:24,599
because it's gonna

7963
06:24:24,599 --> 06:24:27,180
cost a lot of money to clean out some dead trees was the

7964
06:24:27,180 --> 06:24:28,200
guys already willing

7965
06:24:28,200 --> 06:24:30,409
to do I don't know why he has to own the property to do if

7966
06:24:30,409 --> 06:24:31,360
he's just want to be a

7967
06:24:31,360 --> 06:24:34,520
good neighbor he could do it himself as well as people have

7968
06:24:34,520 --> 06:24:35,139
said hey the

7969
06:24:35,139 --> 06:24:37,220
neighbors were willing to help and get together but again

7970
06:24:37,220 --> 06:24:37,919
this is the way we've

7971
06:24:37,919 --> 06:24:42,610
we're handling it I guess you would say and basically with

7972
06:24:42,610 --> 06:24:44,400
a requirement I would

7973
06:24:44,400 --> 06:24:46,650
say if this is gonna happen if it's gonna cost fifty to a

7974
06:24:46,650 --> 06:24:47,439
hundred why don't

7975
06:24:47,439 --> 06:24:49,310
we just put a stipulation that there's a hundred thousand

7976
06:24:49,310 --> 06:24:50,000
dollars put into an

7977
06:24:50,000 --> 06:24:52,740
escrow account and basically it has to spend a minimum of a

7978
06:24:52,740 --> 06:24:53,599
fifty thousand

7979
06:24:53,599 --> 06:24:56,189
dollars over a course of a year if this is a true number of

7980
06:24:56,189 --> 06:24:57,040
what it takes to

7981
06:24:57,040 --> 06:25:00,360
repair this dam or engineering reports because as it is

7982
06:25:00,360 --> 06:25:01,520
from I've talked to

7983
06:25:01,520 --> 06:25:04,119
people the dam that's washed out hasn't even those numbers

7984
06:25:04,119 --> 06:25:04,919
in all the years

7985
06:25:04,919 --> 06:25:07,950
over all the time but basically those are the numbers that

7986
06:25:07,950 --> 06:25:08,840
were given to us

7987
06:25:08,840 --> 06:25:13,479
so to me it'd be easier just to deny this piece given that

7988
06:25:13,479 --> 06:25:14,919
basically only one

7989
06:25:14,919 --> 06:25:17,049
or two people are for it and the rest of the neighborhood

7990
06:25:17,049 --> 06:25:18,639
is against it and being

7991
06:25:18,639 --> 06:25:21,159
that many people here seem to take value in what the

7992
06:25:21,159 --> 06:25:22,560
neighborhood wants and what

7993
06:25:22,560 --> 06:25:26,130
our input is that is my input is basically is the majority

7994
06:25:26,130 --> 06:25:27,200
of us do not

7995
06:25:27,200 --> 06:25:30,360
want that except for the people who are benefiting from

7996
06:25:30,360 --> 06:25:31,759
this piece financially

7997
06:25:35,200 --> 06:25:41,750
Jim Keffer is our next speaker to be followed by Diane H

7998
06:25:41,750 --> 06:25:45,200
uber so Jim Jim has

7999
06:25:45,200 --> 06:25:50,040
left he did mark that he is in opposition Diane will be

8000
06:25:50,040 --> 06:25:51,159
followed by

8001
06:25:51,159 --> 06:26:00,840
Jason Thomas I'm sorry yeah I can move you down the list

8002
06:26:00,840 --> 06:26:08,849
Jason Thomas is Jason Thomas here and then to be followed

8003
06:26:08,849 --> 06:26:10,759
by Cortland

8004
06:26:10,759 --> 06:26:20,080
Christopherson good March 9th to you

8005
06:26:22,080 --> 06:26:25,799
I'm at 3400 Montecito I'm actually the property that abuts

8006
06:26:25,799 --> 06:26:26,759
right back up to the

8007
06:26:26,759 --> 06:26:31,029
other side of Steve Hale and a couple people have said that

8008
06:26:31,029 --> 06:26:31,840
we've had you know

8009
06:26:31,840 --> 06:26:34,450
other neighbors have had conversations with Steve I

8010
06:26:34,450 --> 06:26:35,400
actually did have the

8011
06:26:35,400 --> 06:26:37,610
conversation with Steve so Steve and I talked a little bit

8012
06:26:37,610 --> 06:26:38,520
we actually talked a

8013
06:26:38,520 --> 06:26:41,459
couple of times he expressed a lot of concerns about

8014
06:26:41,459 --> 06:26:42,560
liability of the dam

8015
06:26:42,560 --> 06:26:46,000
which is totally understandable I understand the situation

8016
06:26:46,000 --> 06:26:46,919
we did also

8017
06:26:46,919 --> 06:26:50,119
talk about possible resolutions to the sale if the

8018
06:26:50,119 --> 06:26:51,520
committee is saying you know

8019
06:26:51,520 --> 06:26:53,650
you're absolutely is going to approve this because there

8020
06:26:53,650 --> 06:26:54,520
are two stipulations

8021
06:26:54,520 --> 06:26:57,369
to meet and it's been met so that's kind of what we talked

8022
06:26:57,369 --> 06:26:59,680
about so when I was

8023
06:26:59,680 --> 06:27:01,500
talking to him I just said look you know we are all

8024
06:27:01,500 --> 06:27:02,880
interested in protecting the

8025
06:27:02,880 --> 06:27:05,150
dam and one of the things that I heard in the planning

8026
06:27:05,150 --> 06:27:06,119
session earlier was

8027
06:27:06,119 --> 06:27:08,400
something the council was saying about the easement of the

8028
06:27:08,400 --> 06:27:09,159
waterways and stuff

8029
06:27:09,159 --> 06:27:12,159
that the dam cannot be affected in any way shape or form by

8030
06:27:12,159 --> 06:27:12,880
whoever owns a

8031
06:27:12,880 --> 06:27:16,040
property now or is there some is there a way you can repeat

8032
06:27:16,040 --> 06:27:17,080
what you said in the

8033
06:27:17,080 --> 06:27:19,840
planning session and not have it a basically affect my time

8034
06:27:19,840 --> 06:27:20,840
with regards to

8035
06:27:20,840 --> 06:27:23,779
the actual dam and doing anything to affect the dam

8036
06:27:23,779 --> 06:27:25,319
specifically on the dam

8037
06:27:25,319 --> 06:27:29,310
we determined that it was in place at the time of the

8038
06:27:29,310 --> 06:27:31,200
subdivision being put

8039
06:27:31,200 --> 06:27:38,069
into place so it it impacted or contributed to the

8040
06:27:38,069 --> 06:27:38,799
mitigation for the

8041
06:27:38,799 --> 06:27:42,150
drainage on the subdivision and it looks like a lot of the

8042
06:27:42,150 --> 06:27:43,520
street drainage goes

8043
06:27:43,520 --> 06:27:49,599
into that particular area so to remove something like that

8044
06:27:49,599 --> 06:27:50,799
you would have to go

8045
06:27:50,799 --> 06:27:54,689
through the city because it would affect all of the

8046
06:27:54,689 --> 06:27:57,119
drainage on the property and

8047
06:27:57,119 --> 06:28:00,639
you would have to show some sort of other alternative

8048
06:28:00,639 --> 06:28:02,279
mitigation downstream

8049
06:28:02,279 --> 06:28:05,880
in order to get an approval on something like that in

8050
06:28:05,880 --> 06:28:07,880
addition there is a riparian

8051
06:28:07,880 --> 06:28:11,990
buffer there because of the waterway so anything along the

8052
06:28:11,990 --> 06:28:12,919
perimeter of the

8053
06:28:12,919 --> 06:28:17,439
waterway would be considered a protected area that would

8054
06:28:17,439 --> 06:28:19,000
require a permit in

8055
06:28:19,000 --> 06:28:26,319
order to remove it so at any point that he tries to remove

8056
06:28:26,319 --> 06:28:27,599
any of that

8057
06:28:27,599 --> 06:28:32,750
vegetation around the waterway or if there is a potential

8058
06:28:32,750 --> 06:28:34,439
attempt to remove

8059
06:28:34,439 --> 06:28:38,169
the dam that would all go through the city and we would

8060
06:28:38,169 --> 06:28:40,479
have to approve it the

8061
06:28:40,479 --> 06:28:43,310
reason why I was asking is not to say that you know mr. Nel

8062
06:28:43,310 --> 06:28:44,200
ms would do that

8063
06:28:44,200 --> 06:28:47,200
because obviously he's you know wants to improve the land

8064
06:28:47,200 --> 06:28:48,599
but as far as being

8065
06:28:48,599 --> 06:28:51,319
owner of the property that butts right to it I have no

8066
06:28:51,319 --> 06:28:52,799
guarantee of any way

8067
06:28:52,799 --> 06:28:55,830
shape or form so believe me if you purchase the land and

8068
06:28:55,830 --> 06:28:56,639
that's what they

8069
06:28:56,639 --> 06:28:59,369
wanted to do then that's great and he's got good intentions

8070
06:28:59,369 --> 06:29:00,279
but the next buyer

8071
06:29:00,279 --> 06:29:03,819
who gets sold to what I am trying to figure out is how do

8072
06:29:03,819 --> 06:29:04,799
we protect my

8073
06:29:04,799 --> 06:29:06,700
investment that I made I'm very new to the community

8074
06:29:06,700 --> 06:29:07,639
probably newest member

8075
06:29:07,639 --> 06:29:11,520
besides Brandon and you know we're making that investment

8076
06:29:11,520 --> 06:29:12,040
to keep that

8077
06:29:12,040 --> 06:29:15,200
that whole neighborhood up and going and obviously mr. Nel

8078
06:29:15,200 --> 06:29:15,840
ms seems wants to do

8079
06:29:15,840 --> 06:29:19,459
the same thing I see the same one so you know my concern is

8080
06:29:19,459 --> 06:29:20,919
purely protection of

8081
06:29:20,919 --> 06:29:24,090
our neighborhood so if that means you know not approving

8082
06:29:24,090 --> 06:29:25,319
the subdivision now

8083
06:29:25,319 --> 06:29:28,849
of the lot because of certain restrictions and the deeds

8084
06:29:28,849 --> 06:29:29,680
then that's

8085
06:29:29,680 --> 06:29:33,970
fine if that exact means that we table this matter because

8086
06:29:33,970 --> 06:29:34,560
I wasn't actually

8087
06:29:34,560 --> 06:29:37,560
physically notified via certified mail even though I am on

8088
06:29:37,560 --> 06:29:38,400
the tax rolls and

8089
06:29:38,400 --> 06:29:42,360
been for 16 months I got no certified letter I work at home

8090
06:29:42,360 --> 06:29:43,319
every day my wife

8091
06:29:43,319 --> 06:29:45,919
works at home every day we never got we never got the

8092
06:29:45,919 --> 06:29:47,799
letter so I didn't find

8093
06:29:47,799 --> 06:29:50,669
out about this until about eight days ago and during that

8094
06:29:50,669 --> 06:29:51,720
eight days I've had

8095
06:29:51,720 --> 06:29:54,689
conversations with the neighbors so today my my perspective

8096
06:29:54,689 --> 06:29:55,479
to you guys would

8097
06:29:55,479 --> 06:29:58,360
be this needs to be tabled and let us have a discussion I

8098
06:29:58,360 --> 06:29:59,200
would actually like

8099
06:29:59,200 --> 06:30:01,279
to have a discussion with mr. Helms you know and just say

8100
06:30:01,279 --> 06:30:02,040
look you know what is

8101
06:30:02,040 --> 06:30:04,919
what is the plan how can we help I have neighbors that have

8102
06:30:04,919 --> 06:30:05,799
continually come to

8103
06:30:05,799 --> 06:30:09,759
us and say look we can we want to support the cleanup of

8104
06:30:09,759 --> 06:30:11,080
the dam everybody

8105
06:30:11,080 --> 06:30:14,299
knows I think that's the common you know factor of this

8106
06:30:14,299 --> 06:30:16,000
whole situation nobody

8107
06:30:16,000 --> 06:30:18,729
wants to let that thing go away the city can't let it go

8108
06:30:18,729 --> 06:30:20,119
away without permits

8109
06:30:20,119 --> 06:30:22,770
there's a lot of obstruction there so I just want to make

8110
06:30:22,770 --> 06:30:23,840
sure my point is heard

8111
06:30:23,840 --> 06:30:26,409
to the council that I wasn't notified I'd love the chance

8112
06:30:26,409 --> 06:30:27,439
to have this table to

8113
06:30:27,439 --> 06:30:30,470
discuss some really clean opportunity to fix the fix the

8114
06:30:30,470 --> 06:30:31,639
dam together as a whole

8115
06:30:31,639 --> 06:30:35,200
neighborhood that's my position I do have a question

8116
06:30:35,200 --> 06:30:41,270
sure Commissioner Sullivan thank you what is the status of

8117
06:30:41,270 --> 06:30:43,159
the HOA is there

8118
06:30:43,159 --> 06:30:48,759
one does anybody pay fees is it official unofficial I do

8119
06:30:48,759 --> 06:30:50,360
not know that there's

8120
06:30:50,360 --> 06:30:52,240
other folks who have been in the neighborhood a lot longer

8121
06:30:52,240 --> 06:30:52,680
who have had

8122
06:30:52,680 --> 06:31:00,099
more control over that I can't answer that closing closing

8123
06:31:00,099 --> 06:31:00,680
you didn't have to

8124
06:31:00,680 --> 06:31:05,740
pay HOA fees or anything at that point okay that's since

8125
06:31:05,740 --> 06:31:07,680
you were newer you

8126
06:31:07,680 --> 06:31:12,659
might have encountered that or not so okay thank you very

8127
06:31:12,659 --> 06:31:14,080
much appreciate so

8128
06:31:14,080 --> 06:31:17,819
our next speaker is Cortland Christopherson to be followed

8129
06:31:17,819 --> 06:31:18,400
by Diane

8130
06:31:18,400 --> 06:31:26,639
Huber I would like to clarify the matter I am

8131
06:31:26,639 --> 06:31:29,419
Coraline Christopherson I'm an attorney with the schnall

8132
06:31:29,419 --> 06:31:30,479
offering and file on

8133
06:31:30,479 --> 06:31:36,959
Texas I do by happenstance actually have lived in this area

8134
06:31:36,959 --> 06:31:37,919
I lived

8135
06:31:37,919 --> 06:31:41,970
essentially across the street or up the street from mr. Mc

8136
06:31:41,970 --> 06:31:43,360
Clure for the majority

8137
06:31:43,360 --> 06:31:46,000
of my life and before that I lived in a high view circle so

8138
06:31:46,000 --> 06:31:47,000
I'm very familiar

8139
06:31:47,000 --> 06:31:54,439
with this area I was brought in on very short notice on

8140
06:31:54,439 --> 06:31:56,159
this matter

8141
06:31:56,159 --> 06:32:03,029
last Thursday got a somewhat panic call from miss Cassandra

8142
06:32:03,029 --> 06:32:04,279
Cornell who was

8143
06:32:04,279 --> 06:32:10,639
concerned about the impact of the property values and the

8144
06:32:10,639 --> 06:32:11,880
potential

8145
06:32:11,880 --> 06:32:15,869
ramifications for this neighborhood if this subdivision was

8146
06:32:15,869 --> 06:32:17,639
to go through in

8147
06:32:17,639 --> 06:32:22,069
the midst of trying to somehow learn more about this matter

8148
06:32:22,069 --> 06:32:23,159
I've kind of been

8149
06:32:23,159 --> 06:32:27,479
stonewalled a little bit I was not able to get in touch

8150
06:32:27,479 --> 06:32:28,520
with the department I'm

8151
06:32:28,520 --> 06:32:31,939
sure you all are very busy and sounds like the matter

8152
06:32:31,939 --> 06:32:34,040
before this was rather

8153
06:32:34,040 --> 06:32:37,700
large I'm sure you're working on very hard but nonetheless

8154
06:32:37,700 --> 06:32:38,400
I'll never get in

8155
06:32:38,400 --> 06:32:42,069
touch with them and then I also tried to get a copy of the

8156
06:32:42,069 --> 06:32:42,959
underlying

8157
06:32:42,959 --> 06:32:46,400
application documents and the master list of all people

8158
06:32:46,400 --> 06:32:47,720
that notice was sent

8159
06:32:47,720 --> 06:32:51,580
to I was informed that that was an open records request and

8160
06:32:51,580 --> 06:32:52,720
they had at least

8161
06:32:52,720 --> 06:32:57,549
ten days to respond to that so I haven't been able to make

8162
06:32:57,549 --> 06:32:59,840
a fully-fledged

8163
06:32:59,840 --> 06:33:04,799
investigation in this matter I don't think that as such

8164
06:33:04,799 --> 06:33:06,720
this commission

8165
06:33:06,720 --> 06:33:12,869
should approve this application just for the Mac the the

8166
06:33:12,869 --> 06:33:16,720
fact that they tabled

8167
06:33:16,720 --> 06:33:20,759
this discussion at the last hearing and in the intervening

8168
06:33:20,759 --> 06:33:22,599
period more homeowners

8169
06:33:22,599 --> 06:33:25,259
have discovered that this is going on a number of

8170
06:33:25,259 --> 06:33:27,639
homeowners themselves have not

8171
06:33:27,639 --> 06:33:30,560
received notice I know Jason said that he didn't get notice

8172
06:33:30,560 --> 06:33:32,200
Brandon also

8173
06:33:32,200 --> 06:33:34,650
mentioned they did get they did not get notice they were

8174
06:33:34,650 --> 06:33:35,799
both on the tax rolls

8175
06:33:35,799 --> 06:33:40,610
in 2015 and they've had tax assessments for 2016 and they

8176
06:33:40,610 --> 06:33:42,040
've also had certified

8177
06:33:42,040 --> 06:33:46,119
notice of previous proceedings in this matter leave Brandon

8178
06:33:46,119 --> 06:33:46,840
filed an

8179
06:33:46,840 --> 06:33:51,569
application for some amendment for this court and they

8180
06:33:51,569 --> 06:33:53,680
received in that matter

8181
06:33:53,680 --> 06:33:55,930
but they didn't get in this one so I don't know what the

8182
06:33:55,930 --> 06:33:56,599
issue was but

8183
06:33:56,599 --> 06:34:00,770
there's a defect in the notice I believe and I'd like to

8184
06:34:00,770 --> 06:34:02,119
just point out to the

8185
06:34:02,119 --> 06:34:09,270
court that I think the city attorney stated well that this

8186
06:34:09,270 --> 06:34:11,040
application is

8187
06:34:11,040 --> 06:34:16,819
final and not appeal so that the only remedy for homeowners

8188
06:34:16,819 --> 06:34:17,880
in the subdivision

8189
06:34:17,880 --> 06:34:23,950
from now is suit and whether that is against mr. Nelms or

8190
06:34:23,950 --> 06:34:25,560
against mr. Hale

8191
06:34:25,560 --> 06:34:32,959
will frankly not matter much it will be a time-consuming

8192
06:34:32,959 --> 06:34:35,119
and expensive procedure

8193
06:34:35,119 --> 06:34:39,630
which could easily be avoided I believe that this

8194
06:34:39,630 --> 06:34:42,000
Commission should grant

8195
06:34:42,000 --> 06:34:45,430
another continuance in this matter for a significantly

8196
06:34:45,430 --> 06:34:47,720
longer period in order for

8197
06:34:47,720 --> 06:34:53,790
members of this community and mr. Hale and mr. Nelms to

8198
06:34:53,790 --> 06:34:55,040
work together to find a

8199
06:34:55,040 --> 06:35:01,810
mutually beneficial decision and to remedy the situation

8200
06:35:01,810 --> 06:35:03,159
you know whether

8201
06:35:03,159 --> 06:35:07,330
that needs to be through a deed amendment or you know

8202
06:35:07,330 --> 06:35:08,759
mutual leases on

8203
06:35:08,759 --> 06:35:15,669
all parties that that remains to be decided but as of now I

8204
06:35:15,669 --> 06:35:18,040
think that this

8205
06:35:18,040 --> 06:35:22,770
panel had a made a very smart decision 15 days ago or so

8206
06:35:22,770 --> 06:35:24,279
and they noticed that

8207
06:35:24,279 --> 06:35:26,119
there was a bunch of conflict here and they made a very

8208
06:35:26,119 --> 06:35:27,000
smart decision to push

8209
06:35:27,000 --> 06:35:33,069
it and I would say that this Commission should push this

8210
06:35:33,069 --> 06:35:34,360
matter again for

8211
06:35:34,360 --> 06:35:40,020
another longer period in order to find a solution that does

8212
06:35:40,020 --> 06:35:41,840
not entail future

8213
06:35:41,840 --> 06:35:48,479
litigation in terms of I guess the professor from earlier

8214
06:35:48,479 --> 06:35:50,000
but yeah I think

8215
06:35:50,000 --> 06:35:56,069
but I'd like to say that this Commission's stamina is very

8216
06:35:56,069 --> 06:35:57,040
impressive I

8217
06:35:57,040 --> 06:36:01,409
think this is coming along by eight hour workday and now

8218
06:36:01,409 --> 06:36:03,799
coming up on eight hours

8219
06:36:03,799 --> 06:36:07,369
here between this hearing and the earlier meeting so very

8220
06:36:07,369 --> 06:36:08,400
impressive and

8221
06:36:08,400 --> 06:36:12,400
thank you for your service thank you oh we do have one

8222
06:36:12,400 --> 06:36:13,080
question

8223
06:36:13,080 --> 06:36:20,610
Commissioner Hudson yes sir stuff Christopherson Christoph

8224
06:36:20,610 --> 06:36:21,360
erson thank you

8225
06:36:21,360 --> 06:36:25,360
Christopherson mr. Christopherson I'd be interested to get

8226
06:36:25,360 --> 06:36:27,840
your take on this body

8227
06:36:27,840 --> 06:36:31,130
how do you connect this body and so understanding the

8228
06:36:31,130 --> 06:36:32,400
decision to me bait

8229
06:36:32,400 --> 06:36:35,560
understanding the the the kind of the parameters because

8230
06:36:35,560 --> 06:36:36,479
regardless of if

8231
06:36:36,479 --> 06:36:40,340
you've been able to receive the documents you you need the

8232
06:36:40,340 --> 06:36:41,000
charters

8233
06:36:41,000 --> 06:36:47,240
online and then kind of the the codes are online it doesn't

8234
06:36:47,240 --> 06:36:49,319
really how do you

8235
06:36:49,319 --> 06:36:55,389
connect those two like our option to ignore our call or not

8236
06:36:55,389 --> 06:36:56,599
execute our call

8237
06:36:56,599 --> 06:37:00,459
versus a deed restriction which doesn't come into our pur

8238
06:37:00,459 --> 06:37:02,759
view you know I think

8239
06:37:02,759 --> 06:37:07,639
that's a very fair question I know that deed restriction

8240
06:37:07,639 --> 06:37:08,599
and interpretation is

8241
06:37:08,599 --> 06:37:15,259
not under the jurisdiction of this panel but overarching

8242
06:37:15,259 --> 06:37:17,599
ways I think this court

8243
06:37:17,599 --> 06:37:20,759
can take it into account in deciding whether something

8244
06:37:20,759 --> 06:37:22,080
should be approved or

8245
06:37:22,080 --> 06:37:29,689
not in the fact that while while this Commission cannot

8246
06:37:29,689 --> 06:37:31,520
enforce them or you

8247
06:37:31,520 --> 06:37:37,630
know amend alter or evoke them they can say you can see the

8248
06:37:37,630 --> 06:37:39,680
ramifications of

8249
06:37:39,680 --> 06:37:43,209
this matter you know you approve this what happens well

8250
06:37:43,209 --> 06:37:43,919
they're left without a

8251
06:37:43,919 --> 06:37:46,270
remedy so they got to go somewhere they're gonna go to the

8252
06:37:46,270 --> 06:37:47,680
court you can

8253
06:37:47,680 --> 06:37:50,259
prevent that you can stop that from giving them an

8254
06:37:50,259 --> 06:37:51,680
opportunity just kind of

8255
06:37:51,680 --> 06:37:56,680
take a step back cool down and think with level head rather

8256
06:37:56,680 --> 06:37:57,919
than rushing from

8257
06:37:57,919 --> 06:38:00,680
step to step to step trying to get this application this

8258
06:38:00,680 --> 06:38:02,040
information this notice

8259
06:38:02,040 --> 06:38:08,560
throwing it all together it's it's been a very rushed a few

8260
06:38:08,560 --> 06:38:11,599
days all right thank

8261
06:38:11,599 --> 06:38:13,840
you sir

8262
06:38:14,319 --> 06:38:20,389
Diane Huber Huber to be followed by Cassandra Cornell I'm

8263
06:38:20,389 --> 06:38:21,599
dr. Diane Huber

8264
06:38:21,599 --> 06:38:26,549
and I reside at 3310 my seat oh there's so many things

8265
06:38:26,549 --> 06:38:28,599
floating around I'd like

8266
06:38:28,599 --> 06:38:31,830
to try to pull some things together thank you for allowing

8267
06:38:31,830 --> 06:38:33,520
me to speak first

8268
06:38:33,520 --> 06:38:36,880
I want to address you Commissioner back you asked had

8269
06:38:36,880 --> 06:38:39,599
anyone approached mr.

8270
06:38:39,599 --> 06:38:43,220
Nelms about offering to put money up and last night I went

8271
06:38:43,220 --> 06:38:44,799
and I knocked on mr.

8272
06:38:44,799 --> 06:38:50,979
Nelms his door and I did agree that his view of the lake is

8273
06:38:50,979 --> 06:38:52,680
is not as attractive

8274
06:38:52,680 --> 06:38:58,750
as others and I offered to buy the lot to pay for the

8275
06:38:58,750 --> 06:38:59,840
complete reconstruction

8276
06:38:59,840 --> 06:39:03,849
of the dam to take care of any cost he said no he had it

8277
06:39:03,849 --> 06:39:05,840
all taken care of but

8278
06:39:05,840 --> 06:39:11,909
I did offer the other thing I want to commend you is when

8279
06:39:11,909 --> 06:39:12,680
you made this

8280
06:39:12,680 --> 06:39:17,180
statement earlier this evening that we needed to protect

8281
06:39:17,180 --> 06:39:18,279
our neighborhood

8282
06:39:18,279 --> 06:39:23,040
heritage over 25 years ago I had the privilege of living on

8283
06:39:23,040 --> 06:39:24,360
Montecito and

8284
06:39:24,360 --> 06:39:29,229
raising four sons who enjoyed playing in this lake today I

8285
06:39:29,229 --> 06:39:30,520
have the great

8286
06:39:30,520 --> 06:39:34,330
privilege because of that neighborhood heritage to watch my

8287
06:39:34,330 --> 06:39:35,799
12 grandchildren

8288
06:39:35,799 --> 06:39:41,869
play in that lake I have heard said tonight that you don't

8289
06:39:41,869 --> 06:39:43,560
have control over

8290
06:39:43,560 --> 06:39:48,520
deed restrictions however according to your code you must

8291
06:39:48,520 --> 06:39:50,599
divide by Texas code

8292
06:39:50,599 --> 06:39:56,840
2 1 2 and if we look at Texas code 2 1 2 point 0 1 4

8293
06:39:56,840 --> 06:39:58,959
regarding replating without

8294
06:39:58,959 --> 06:40:04,150
vacating preceding plat you have the authority a replat of

8295
06:40:04,150 --> 06:40:05,680
a subdivision or

8296
06:40:05,680 --> 06:40:09,950
part of a subdivision may be recorded and is controlling

8297
06:40:09,950 --> 06:40:11,479
over the preceding

8298
06:40:11,479 --> 06:40:16,330
plat without vacation of that plat if the replat one is

8299
06:40:16,330 --> 06:40:18,159
signed and acknowledged

8300
06:40:18,159 --> 06:40:23,720
two is approved in a public hearing and three does not

8301
06:40:23,720 --> 06:40:26,319
attempt to amend or

8302
06:40:26,319 --> 06:40:33,639
remove any covenant or restrictions I believe the Montecito

8303
06:40:33,639 --> 06:40:35,500
area is covered by

8304
06:40:35,500 --> 06:40:40,130
deed restrictions that you've seen tonight that have been

8305
06:40:40,130 --> 06:40:41,200
amended and I

8306
06:40:41,200 --> 06:40:46,290
believe that this Commission does have the right the

8307
06:40:46,290 --> 06:40:48,319
opportunity and the

8308
06:40:48,319 --> 06:40:56,720
responsibility to deny this request thank you thank you our

8309
06:40:56,720 --> 06:40:58,360
last the last

8310
06:40:58,360 --> 06:41:01,119
card I have is for Cassandra Cornell if anybody else would

8311
06:41:01,119 --> 06:41:02,240
like to speak please

8312
06:41:02,240 --> 06:41:16,369
fill out a blue card hi I'm Cassandra Cornell at 3200 Mont

8313
06:41:16,369 --> 06:41:17,919
ecito thank you very

8314
06:41:17,919 --> 06:41:21,799
much for PNC for staying so late and also for granting us

8315
06:41:21,799 --> 06:41:23,000
the two weeks to

8316
06:41:23,000 --> 06:41:26,459
try to digest and take care of this issue as neighbors when

8317
06:41:26,459 --> 06:41:27,439
we last spoke we

8318
06:41:27,439 --> 06:41:30,240
were asked to work together as neighbors to find a solution

8319
06:41:30,240 --> 06:41:31,319
and during that time

8320
06:41:31,319 --> 06:41:34,619
it came to our attention that the Thomases who would join

8321
06:41:34,619 --> 06:41:35,560
roughly at the

8322
06:41:35,560 --> 06:41:38,779
dam area were one of the many people who did not receive a

8323
06:41:38,779 --> 06:41:39,919
letter in the meeting

8324
06:41:39,919 --> 06:41:43,130
before this you posted how many people got letters or said

8325
06:41:43,130 --> 06:41:44,040
they didn't get

8326
06:41:44,040 --> 06:41:46,680
letters but we didn't see it for this particular group we

8327
06:41:46,680 --> 06:41:47,400
've heard from

8328
06:41:47,400 --> 06:41:50,229
countless amounts of people that are opposed to this and

8329
06:41:50,229 --> 06:41:51,319
have expressed that

8330
06:41:51,319 --> 06:41:54,110
we would like to share that with everyone who's in

8331
06:41:54,110 --> 06:41:55,439
attendance and who is

8332
06:41:55,439 --> 06:41:59,040
listening the Thomas's have lived there for 16 months and

8333
06:41:59,040 --> 06:42:00,119
they have received

8334
06:42:00,119 --> 06:42:03,319
letters from for other city issues regathering other

8335
06:42:03,319 --> 06:42:04,919
properties recently and

8336
06:42:04,919 --> 06:42:08,209
three and also three months ago but they did not receive a

8337
06:42:08,209 --> 06:42:09,360
letter regarding their

8338
06:42:09,360 --> 06:42:13,090
own issue we also have come up with several ideas to solve

8339
06:42:13,090 --> 06:42:13,919
what we were told

8340
06:42:13,919 --> 06:42:16,900
was the issue of the dam liability but we were not given

8341
06:42:16,900 --> 06:42:18,119
the opportunity and

8342
06:42:18,119 --> 06:42:20,430
were informed that the seller and buyer have already

8343
06:42:20,430 --> 06:42:22,000
completed this transaction

8344
06:42:22,000 --> 06:42:25,380
with the sellers being the real estate attorney and realtor

8345
06:42:25,380 --> 06:42:26,400
and that was that

8346
06:42:26,400 --> 06:42:29,619
and that they're just waiting to actually kept the funds go

8347
06:42:29,619 --> 06:42:31,240
through tomorrow so

8348
06:42:31,240 --> 06:42:34,930
there was no discussions to be had we were also asked to

8349
06:42:34,930 --> 06:42:36,159
find a technical

8350
06:42:36,159 --> 06:42:39,319
issue and that we needed to talk to you about that but we

8351
06:42:39,319 --> 06:42:40,159
were not allowed to

8352
06:42:40,159 --> 06:42:45,330
see the replat to evaluate and just because there are so

8353
06:42:45,330 --> 06:42:46,360
many people who were

8354
06:42:46,360 --> 06:42:49,540
not given proper notice and we are very worried about the

8355
06:42:49,540 --> 06:42:50,840
future impact future

8356
06:42:50,840 --> 06:42:53,020
owners of this property might have on our beloved

8357
06:42:53,020 --> 06:42:54,599
neighborhood and after

8358
06:42:54,599 --> 06:42:57,529
listening to the other properties being rezoned and

8359
06:42:57,529 --> 06:42:59,000
developed by mr. Nelms

8360
06:42:59,000 --> 06:43:01,909
tonight I feel neighbors who did not receive a notice must

8361
06:43:01,909 --> 06:43:02,759
simply just have

8362
06:43:02,759 --> 06:43:07,060
more time to investigate the situation further according to

8363
06:43:07,060 --> 06:43:08,400
our covenants he

8364
06:43:08,400 --> 06:43:11,049
mentioned something about putting a basketball court up and

8365
06:43:11,049 --> 06:43:11,520
that also

8366
06:43:11,520 --> 06:43:18,080
violates a covenant and according to 212.04 if a proposed

8367
06:43:18,080 --> 06:43:19,119
plot arguably

8368
06:43:19,119 --> 06:43:24,680
violates restricted codes it must be disapproved by 212.04

8369
06:43:24,680 --> 06:43:25,240
and this also

8370
06:43:25,240 --> 06:43:28,840
this violates that so what I'm saying is we just simply

8371
06:43:28,840 --> 06:43:30,479
haven't had time to work

8372
06:43:30,479 --> 06:43:33,720
together and we really need to have just a little more time

8373
06:43:33,720 --> 06:43:34,840
so that we can come

8374
06:43:34,840 --> 06:43:38,919
together as a community I just don't think that this should

8375
06:43:38,919 --> 06:43:39,639
have ever gotten

8376
06:43:39,639 --> 06:43:42,400
here in the first place I think there should have been more

8377
06:43:42,400 --> 06:43:43,439
investigation more

8378
06:43:43,439 --> 06:43:46,970
communication with the whole situation and it's been done

8379
06:43:46,970 --> 06:43:48,240
so quickly and behind

8380
06:43:48,240 --> 06:43:51,159
our backs and nobody wants to talk to us about it one of

8381
06:43:51,159 --> 06:43:52,439
the proposed things that

8382
06:43:52,439 --> 06:43:55,759
we had come up with as a compromise is the Thomas property

8383
06:43:55,759 --> 06:43:56,840
that joins the hill

8384
06:43:56,840 --> 06:43:59,759
property is joined by an easement where the dam is located

8385
06:43:59,759 --> 06:44:01,040
and since mr. Hale

8386
06:44:01,040 --> 06:44:03,990
stated at the hearing and to mr. Ebersole and to mr. Thomas

8387
06:44:03,990 --> 06:44:04,439
that he

8388
06:44:04,439 --> 06:44:07,599
simply does not want the liability of the dam we wanted to

8389
06:44:07,599 --> 06:44:08,520
propose a replat

8390
06:44:08,520 --> 06:44:11,229
which would not involve subdividing it would not be in

8391
06:44:11,229 --> 06:44:12,240
violation of deed

8392
06:44:12,240 --> 06:44:15,270
restrictions but simply moving the property line to cover

8393
06:44:15,270 --> 06:44:15,919
the dam to be

8394
06:44:15,919 --> 06:44:18,630
part of the Thomas property removing the burden he is

8395
06:44:18,630 --> 06:44:19,680
trying to get rid of

8396
06:44:19,680 --> 06:44:22,689
therefore mr. Hale would be able to enjoy his property no

8397
06:44:22,689 --> 06:44:23,720
restrictions are

8398
06:44:23,720 --> 06:44:26,159
violated and the Thomas's and neighbors contend to the

8399
06:44:26,159 --> 06:44:27,840
carrot to the dam care

8400
06:44:27,840 --> 06:44:31,380
for the dam this is just one of many different kinds of

8401
06:44:31,380 --> 06:44:32,040
things we've come up

8402
06:44:32,040 --> 06:44:35,279
with but we haven't been able to discuss as a neighborhood

8403
06:44:35,279 --> 06:44:36,319
we just feel very

8404
06:44:36,319 --> 06:44:38,860
vulnerable because this would be a person that does not

8405
06:44:38,860 --> 06:44:39,639
live on the lake

8406
06:44:39,639 --> 06:44:43,049
who would essentially be in great control of the lake and

8407
06:44:43,049 --> 06:44:44,419
also when I read

8408
06:44:44,419 --> 06:44:46,729
in the deed restrictions it has to be for residential

8409
06:44:46,729 --> 06:44:47,840
purposes where you have

8410
06:44:47,840 --> 06:44:51,250
to put a house and I don't see on a floodplain how you can

8411
06:44:51,250 --> 06:44:52,439
possibly build a

8412
06:44:52,439 --> 06:44:55,060
house and it also has to be a certain amount of square feet

8413
06:44:55,060 --> 06:44:56,560
there are many many

8414
06:44:56,560 --> 06:44:59,720
other restrictions and so I think that we really need to

8415
06:44:59,720 --> 06:45:01,000
have this more time to

8416
06:45:01,000 --> 06:45:06,560
go over this thank you very much we do have a question

8417
06:45:06,560 --> 06:45:09,159
commissioner Rosal thank

8418
06:45:09,159 --> 06:45:12,159
you for your time the question is not actually directed at

8419
06:45:12,159 --> 06:45:12,959
you but rather a

8420
06:45:12,959 --> 06:45:15,959
point that you've brought up as well as other individuals

8421
06:45:15,959 --> 06:45:17,000
we talked in work

8422
06:45:17,000 --> 06:45:19,340
session about the notice of certified mail going out to the

8423
06:45:19,340 --> 06:45:21,000
tax rolls it seems

8424
06:45:21,000 --> 06:45:23,680
like mr. Thomas he's been there for 16 months and but you

8425
06:45:23,680 --> 06:45:24,439
mentioned the tax

8426
06:45:24,439 --> 06:45:29,029
rolls get updated as at most once a year so I have some

8427
06:45:29,029 --> 06:45:31,200
concern about how a stay

8428
06:45:31,200 --> 06:45:35,419
at home individual who's working at the house well I guess

8429
06:45:35,419 --> 06:45:36,639
here's our question

8430
06:45:36,639 --> 06:45:40,610
is there any evidence that we can provide that a certified

8431
06:45:40,610 --> 06:45:41,680
letter went to

8432
06:45:41,680 --> 06:45:45,759
that property owner and the address it went to the

8433
06:45:45,759 --> 06:45:47,919
information that we have on

8434
06:45:47,919 --> 06:45:50,549
our certified tax roll that we receive from our technical

8435
06:45:50,549 --> 06:45:51,599
services department

8436
06:45:51,599 --> 06:45:55,330
we can cross reference that with these addresses and check

8437
06:45:55,330 --> 06:45:56,599
as you're aware and

8438
06:45:56,599 --> 06:45:59,049
I've mentioned this previously and this has occurred with

8439
06:45:59,049 --> 06:45:59,880
past cases to where

8440
06:45:59,880 --> 06:46:02,560
certified mail goes out and just doesn't get collected and

8441
06:46:02,560 --> 06:46:03,400
comes back so we'll

8442
06:46:03,400 --> 06:46:06,560
cross-reference with that as well and verify what the issue

8443
06:46:06,560 --> 06:46:07,639
is secondly we did

8444
06:46:07,639 --> 06:46:11,270
publish in the paper and again the agenda is posted too so

8445
06:46:11,270 --> 06:46:12,200
we can verify

8446
06:46:12,200 --> 06:46:15,360
and see where that disconnect was as it relates to the tax

8447
06:46:15,360 --> 06:46:16,319
roll we can see if

8448
06:46:16,319 --> 06:46:19,119
there were other notices apparently that were received with

8449
06:46:19,119 --> 06:46:19,919
other items or

8450
06:46:19,919 --> 06:46:23,590
elements associated with but we can check and see what

8451
06:46:23,590 --> 06:46:24,759
happened there I

8452
06:46:24,759 --> 06:46:28,650
think you would be pertinent to do that regardless of what

8453
06:46:28,650 --> 06:46:30,200
happens this evening

8454
06:46:30,200 --> 06:46:34,520
but one of my concern is is what is the implications for

8455
06:46:34,520 --> 06:46:36,400
legal posting if in fact

8456
06:46:36,400 --> 06:46:40,040
there was a missed notice that actually didn't go out so we

8457
06:46:40,040 --> 06:46:41,200
we after the fact

8458
06:46:41,200 --> 06:46:45,880
look and say 3,400 Montecito actually no property owner

8459
06:46:45,880 --> 06:46:47,400
current owner received

8460
06:46:47,400 --> 06:46:49,919
notification is there implications to public notice in

8461
06:46:49,919 --> 06:46:51,560
terms of actually moving

8462
06:46:51,560 --> 06:46:53,680
on this item tonight Commissioner Rizal I would actually

8463
06:46:53,680 --> 06:46:55,040
have to pull up the GIS

8464
06:46:55,040 --> 06:46:57,979
map and look at all the mapping and all the addresses and

8465
06:46:57,979 --> 06:46:59,240
cross-reference and

8466
06:46:59,240 --> 06:47:02,459
see if that fell within or was shy off or within the 200

8467
06:47:02,459 --> 06:47:04,000
foot notification area

8468
06:47:04,000 --> 06:47:07,290
first of all so sitting here I can't categorically state

8469
06:47:07,290 --> 06:47:08,279
whether it was an

8470
06:47:08,279 --> 06:47:13,580
error or not I hope it was not an error and I think we

8471
06:47:13,580 --> 06:47:15,000
touched upon this at the

8472
06:47:15,000 --> 06:47:17,880
at the work session to Jennifer if I can lean on you please

8473
06:47:17,880 --> 06:47:18,759
to address that

8474
06:47:18,759 --> 06:47:22,709
issue that Commissioner Rizal has brought up sure so what

8475
06:47:22,709 --> 06:47:24,479
would cause a

8476
06:47:24,479 --> 06:47:27,509
problem would be our non-compliance with the statutory

8477
06:47:27,509 --> 06:47:28,639
requirements and the

8478
06:47:28,639 --> 06:47:32,029
statutory requirement state that we have to send notice

8479
06:47:32,029 --> 06:47:33,840
within 200 feet of the

8480
06:47:33,840 --> 06:47:38,369
affected property to individuals on the latest tax roll and

8481
06:47:38,369 --> 06:47:39,520
so as long as we

8482
06:47:39,520 --> 06:47:43,409
fulfilled that then we fulfilled our obligation under the

8483
06:47:43,409 --> 06:47:45,319
statute there is no

8484
06:47:45,319 --> 06:47:50,759
defect yeah I definitely understand that Mike Mike and

8485
06:47:54,759 --> 06:47:58,310
there was an opportunity for a different case that required

8486
06:47:58,310 --> 06:48:01,080
a public hearing as

8487
06:48:01,080 --> 06:48:05,400
you know our notification process as it relates to zoning

8488
06:48:05,400 --> 06:48:06,759
or ZBA cases only

8489
06:48:06,759 --> 06:48:09,639
board of adjustment cases we have a 200 foot notification

8490
06:48:09,639 --> 06:48:10,720
area we also have a

8491
06:48:10,720 --> 06:48:14,229
500 foot enhanced notification area which goes directly to

8492
06:48:14,229 --> 06:48:14,759
the property

8493
06:48:14,759 --> 06:48:17,389
address and not to the property owner so that's why some

8494
06:48:17,389 --> 06:48:18,520
people have received

8495
06:48:18,520 --> 06:48:22,599
notices in the past which goes back to perhaps clarifying

8496
06:48:22,599 --> 06:48:23,759
why the 200 foot

8497
06:48:23,759 --> 06:48:26,669
notification wasn't received which is associated with the

8498
06:48:26,669 --> 06:48:27,680
certified tax roll

8499
06:48:27,680 --> 06:48:30,639
which comes out once a year in in August and then it takes

8500
06:48:30,639 --> 06:48:31,680
some time for TS to

8501
06:48:31,680 --> 06:48:35,389
then look at those shapefiles and modify them accordingly

8502
06:48:35,389 --> 06:48:36,520
so I can I will still

8503
06:48:36,520 --> 06:48:41,240
look into that to verify where that disconnect was there

8504
06:48:41,240 --> 06:48:42,479
person that lives

8505
06:48:42,479 --> 06:48:47,180
within 200 feet that did not receive a letter as well and

8506
06:48:47,180 --> 06:48:47,560
what is their name so

8507
06:48:47,560 --> 06:48:51,520
that we can have it for the record I'm sorry

8508
06:48:53,840 --> 06:48:59,909
it's Brandon Poles at 508 El Paseo Street and we've

8509
06:48:59,909 --> 06:49:01,360
actually applied for a

8510
06:49:01,360 --> 06:49:05,479
ZBA before unfortunately our house burned down and we were

8511
06:49:05,479 --> 06:49:06,080
gonna do a

8512
06:49:06,080 --> 06:49:09,020
small modification on our pool house to add a bedroom we

8513
06:49:09,020 --> 06:49:10,639
decided not to do that

8514
06:49:10,639 --> 06:49:14,650
but anyway my point here is we received all the mailings

8515
06:49:14,650 --> 06:49:16,119
for that so I know a

8516
06:49:16,119 --> 06:49:19,340
hundred percent that you'll have the correct address to do

8517
06:49:19,340 --> 06:49:20,279
that because we

8518
06:49:20,279 --> 06:49:23,069
received past notifications on our own property that we

8519
06:49:23,069 --> 06:49:24,119
applied for I'm just

8520
06:49:24,119 --> 06:49:27,009
concerned because we did not receive any notification of

8521
06:49:27,009 --> 06:49:28,279
this except for you know

8522
06:49:28,279 --> 06:49:31,439
a phone call from a neighbor last minute and you know we

8523
06:49:31,439 --> 06:49:32,400
started digging into

8524
06:49:32,400 --> 06:49:36,310
this today to try to figure out what's going on you didn't

8525
06:49:36,310 --> 06:49:37,520
receive a certified

8526
06:49:37,520 --> 06:49:41,080
or courtesy no you neither neither one and we have

8527
06:49:41,080 --> 06:49:42,000
absolutely received them

8528
06:49:42,000 --> 06:49:46,169
before there's multiple people in the neighborhood who have

8529
06:49:46,169 --> 06:49:47,560
expressed this it's

8530
06:49:47,560 --> 06:49:51,880
this wasn't just a one-person thing I know several people

8531
06:49:51,880 --> 06:49:53,880
sent in in emails

8532
06:49:53,880 --> 06:49:58,419
they were very very very upset that this was happening and

8533
06:49:58,419 --> 06:49:59,959
this there they did

8534
06:49:59,959 --> 06:50:04,009
not get letters and so I'm just asking for more time that's

8535
06:50:04,009 --> 06:50:05,279
we just need we

8536
06:50:05,279 --> 06:50:09,419
just needed a little more time it just wasn't it wasn't

8537
06:50:09,419 --> 06:50:11,919
done right and so we

8538
06:50:11,919 --> 06:50:19,159
just we're just kind of stuck well all I can say from a

8539
06:50:19,159 --> 06:50:21,400
legal standpoint is that

8540
06:50:21,400 --> 06:50:25,380
it's our mailing of the notice that allows it to be

8541
06:50:25,380 --> 06:50:27,279
sufficient for legal

8542
06:50:27,279 --> 06:50:33,349
purposes it's not the actual receipt of the notice

8543
06:50:33,349 --> 06:50:35,159
unfortunately in this case

8544
06:50:35,159 --> 06:50:38,409
we're dealing with a plat plat to have very strict

8545
06:50:38,409 --> 06:50:40,520
timelines in normal cases

8546
06:50:40,520 --> 06:50:44,389
normal cases you have 30 days in which you have to approve

8547
06:50:44,389 --> 06:50:45,439
or deny a plat or

8548
06:50:45,439 --> 06:50:50,520
it's it's deemed approved and we typically have an

8549
06:50:50,520 --> 06:50:52,799
applicant waive those

8550
06:50:52,799 --> 06:50:57,250
provisions on the face of the application they're consens

8551
06:50:57,250 --> 06:50:59,200
ual if he does

8552
06:50:59,200 --> 06:51:04,759
not agree to a move of this particular item then at which

8553
06:51:04,759 --> 06:51:06,799
we did last time if

8554
06:51:06,799 --> 06:51:09,459
you recall we got his consent on the record I would feel

8555
06:51:09,459 --> 06:51:10,639
highly uncomfortable

8556
06:51:10,639 --> 06:51:14,560
and I would have to recommend against postponing it again

8557
06:51:14,560 --> 06:51:15,759
because of those

8558
06:51:15,759 --> 06:51:20,529
strict timelines that are in place by statute another

8559
06:51:20,529 --> 06:51:22,639
problem that we have is

8560
06:51:22,639 --> 06:51:28,319
that and in response to the 212 014 provision and that

8561
06:51:28,319 --> 06:51:29,040
keeps being thrown

8562
06:51:29,040 --> 06:51:32,200
out there is a provision that states that we cannot amend

8563
06:51:32,200 --> 06:51:33,000
or remove any

8564
06:51:33,000 --> 06:51:36,229
restrictions and those are specifically plat notes that we

8565
06:51:36,229 --> 06:51:37,279
would put on a plat

8566
06:51:37,279 --> 06:51:41,090
that changed the nature of the restriction or say all

8567
06:51:41,090 --> 06:51:42,439
restrictions are

8568
06:51:42,439 --> 06:51:48,049
hereby removed the courts have are interpreted the properly

8569
06:51:48,049 --> 06:51:50,240
platted lot

8570
06:51:50,240 --> 06:51:56,310
that has gone in front of PNC Commission to not amend or

8571
06:51:56,310 --> 06:51:57,119
remove those

8572
06:51:57,119 --> 06:52:00,450
restrictions so it has been interpreted by a court of law

8573
06:52:00,450 --> 06:52:01,599
that that particular

8574
06:52:01,599 --> 06:52:05,709
provision doesn't apply in this case in this case we have

8575
06:52:05,709 --> 06:52:06,680
very little

8576
06:52:06,680 --> 06:52:10,180
discretion that the law provides us as and this is just for

8577
06:52:10,180 --> 06:52:11,360
the benefit of all

8578
06:52:11,360 --> 06:52:19,490
neighbors if we have a plat in front of us it's considered

8579
06:52:19,490 --> 06:52:20,279
it was called a

8580
06:52:20,279 --> 06:52:25,680
ministerial duty it is not a discretionary duty and what

8581
06:52:25,680 --> 06:52:26,680
that means is

8582
06:52:26,680 --> 06:52:31,220
that the law clearly spells out what the extent of our duty

8583
06:52:31,220 --> 06:52:32,639
is in the statute

8584
06:52:32,639 --> 06:52:36,909
and what the statute says is that so long as a plat meets

8585
06:52:36,909 --> 06:52:37,759
all of the

8586
06:52:37,759 --> 06:52:41,930
technical requirements that are laid out in our code or the

8587
06:52:41,930 --> 06:52:44,279
statute then we more

8588
06:52:44,279 --> 06:52:48,250
or less have to approve it there is no discretion the

8589
06:52:48,250 --> 06:52:49,840
purpose of it going in

8590
06:52:49,840 --> 06:52:54,130
front of this body is to review what staff has already

8591
06:52:54,130 --> 06:52:55,759
looked at to determine

8592
06:52:55,759 --> 06:52:59,659
that staff was correct and that it meets the technical

8593
06:52:59,659 --> 06:53:03,639
requirements I did as a

8594
06:53:03,639 --> 06:53:08,069
courtesy look at your restrictive covenants and in my

8595
06:53:08,069 --> 06:53:09,400
opinion and what

8596
06:53:09,400 --> 06:53:13,049
I've and of course I can't give you all legal advice but I

8597
06:53:13,049 --> 06:53:14,919
did advise the board

8598
06:53:14,919 --> 06:53:17,340
and I did it in open session I could have done it in closed

8599
06:53:17,340 --> 06:53:18,040
session but I

8600
06:53:18,040 --> 06:53:21,619
wanted everybody to be aware of what we had determined and

8601
06:53:21,619 --> 06:53:22,639
looking at your

8602
06:53:22,639 --> 06:53:26,279
restrictive covenants the way mr. Ebersol reads them is not

8603
06:53:26,279 --> 06:53:26,919
the way that

8604
06:53:26,919 --> 06:53:30,729
I read them the way that I read them is that so long as you

8605
06:53:30,729 --> 06:53:32,040
end up with two lots

8606
06:53:32,040 --> 06:53:37,779
that are meeting those 150 feet and I think it was the one

8607
06:53:37,779 --> 06:53:39,040
acre requirements

8608
06:53:39,040 --> 06:53:42,470
that so long as each lot meets those requirements that it

8609
06:53:42,470 --> 06:53:43,639
can be subdivided

8610
06:53:43,639 --> 06:53:47,810
and I think that the way the statutory construction works

8611
06:53:47,810 --> 06:53:49,360
that any court of law

8612
06:53:49,360 --> 06:53:53,319
is going to find that as well as far as the residential

8613
06:53:53,319 --> 06:53:54,880
requirement that's been

8614
06:53:54,880 --> 06:53:58,270
brought up and I might as well just go ahead and continue

8615
06:53:58,270 --> 06:53:59,319
since I'm on on this

8616
06:53:59,319 --> 06:54:05,389
role the only thing that would affect that would be the

8617
06:54:05,389 --> 06:54:06,319
zoning of the property

8618
06:54:06,319 --> 06:54:09,259
because we have no control over what people actually build

8619
06:54:09,259 --> 06:54:10,000
or not build on

8620
06:54:10,000 --> 06:54:13,779
their property if we if he has the ability to build a

8621
06:54:13,779 --> 06:54:15,479
single-family dwelling

8622
06:54:15,479 --> 06:54:18,209
which we're not changing the zoning then that's out of our

8623
06:54:18,209 --> 06:54:18,680
hands you know

8624
06:54:18,680 --> 06:54:21,639
somebody could come in and fill in the floodplain and

8625
06:54:21,639 --> 06:54:22,880
decide to build something

8626
06:54:22,880 --> 06:54:26,319
at a later time of course it would have to come back but

8627
06:54:26,319 --> 06:54:28,840
that's not us affecting

8628
06:54:28,840 --> 06:54:34,220
the restrictions at all and so in my opinion none of this

8629
06:54:34,220 --> 06:54:35,400
violated your

8630
06:54:35,400 --> 06:54:39,659
restrictive covenants anyway but regardless of that we can

8631
06:54:39,659 --> 06:54:40,279
't look at

8632
06:54:40,279 --> 06:54:43,799
those and we can't enforce them and as a body as the

8633
06:54:43,799 --> 06:54:46,400
government body what we do

8634
06:54:46,400 --> 06:54:49,689
have to do is we have to exercise our limited authority to

8635
06:54:49,689 --> 06:54:50,520
determine whether

8636
06:54:50,520 --> 06:54:53,439
or not technical requirements have been met for the plat so

8637
06:54:53,439 --> 06:54:54,360
that's what we're

8638
06:54:54,360 --> 06:55:00,220
tasked with here today we haven't been able to see what it

8639
06:55:00,220 --> 06:55:00,919
looked with the plat

8640
06:55:00,919 --> 06:55:03,889
even looks like and the measurements to see if we think

8641
06:55:03,889 --> 06:55:05,159
that so we just really

8642
06:55:05,159 --> 06:55:08,909
needed to have more time yeah I think it's on the online is

8643
06:55:08,909 --> 06:55:09,360
it not yeah the

8644
06:55:09,360 --> 06:55:12,849
plan is available with the meeting at the agenda of the

8645
06:55:12,849 --> 06:55:15,000
meeting if you if you

8646
06:55:15,000 --> 06:55:18,919
go to the agenda for this meeting you can click on a link

8647
06:55:18,919 --> 06:55:20,000
the link to download

8648
06:55:20,000 --> 06:55:24,840
the plot all of our even we were asking about how to get

8649
06:55:24,840 --> 06:55:25,720
the plat and they told

8650
06:55:25,720 --> 06:55:29,229
us it would take ten days that's what I'm saying it just it

8651
06:55:29,229 --> 06:55:30,599
's been so rushy I

8652
06:55:30,599 --> 06:55:34,080
just feel like we just have not been able to have enough

8653
06:55:34,080 --> 06:55:35,080
time to get together

8654
06:55:35,080 --> 06:55:38,569
and and resolve this issue it's just and it's late and it

8655
06:55:38,569 --> 06:55:39,639
just seems like

8656
06:55:39,639 --> 06:55:43,240
everything that we go to do we just keep getting a negative

8657
06:55:43,240 --> 06:55:44,400
you just keep hitting

8658
06:55:44,400 --> 06:55:46,729
these negative things and we're just trying to come to a

8659
06:55:46,729 --> 06:55:47,400
very positive

8660
06:55:47,400 --> 06:55:51,040
neighborly happy solution we were hopeful that you were

8661
06:55:51,040 --> 06:55:52,040
able to do that

8662
06:55:52,040 --> 06:55:55,900
the last time we postponed it and and I'm sorry that you

8663
06:55:55,900 --> 06:55:57,400
weren't able to get a

8664
06:55:57,400 --> 06:56:01,509
resolution I feel like we're boxed in here legally and that

8665
06:56:01,509 --> 06:56:02,959
we have a time

8666
06:56:02,959 --> 06:56:06,569
frame problem and so I don't think that we're going to be

8667
06:56:06,569 --> 06:56:07,919
able to postpone it

8668
06:56:07,919 --> 06:56:12,700
again now if any of you do have a problem with some of the

8669
06:56:12,700 --> 06:56:13,119
technical

8670
06:56:13,119 --> 06:56:16,369
requirements that like we said you can bring it forward but

8671
06:56:16,369 --> 06:56:17,959
the restrictive

8672
06:56:17,959 --> 06:56:24,029
covenant we cannot we cannot even really discuss it so I do

8673
06:56:24,029 --> 06:56:25,279
have some additional

8674
06:56:25,279 --> 06:56:29,200
commissioners do you all have questions or okay

8675
06:56:29,200 --> 06:56:30,799
Commissioner Sullivan thank you

8676
06:56:30,799 --> 06:56:33,240
I and I think my question may have been answered I was

8677
06:56:33,240 --> 06:56:35,080
gonna ask you or someone

8678
06:56:35,080 --> 06:56:38,759
you know what is the minimum size lots in that neighborhood

8679
06:56:38,759 --> 06:56:39,560
well apparently

8680
06:56:39,560 --> 06:56:44,259
according to the covenants it's one acre what can arguably

8681
06:56:44,259 --> 06:56:46,240
be one acre but on that

8682
06:56:46,240 --> 06:56:49,939
entire section there are about two and a half to three

8683
06:56:49,939 --> 06:56:51,279
acres nothing is smaller

8684
06:56:51,279 --> 06:56:56,400
than that be the one oddball sized one acre floodplain lot

8685
06:56:56,400 --> 06:56:57,520
there it just doesn't

8686
06:56:57,520 --> 06:57:00,720
make sense is what I'm saying and like I said I'm not

8687
06:57:00,720 --> 06:57:02,119
saying that anybody is is

8688
06:57:02,119 --> 06:57:05,979
up to anything funny or anything like that I just don't

8689
06:57:05,979 --> 06:57:06,880
know what would happen

8690
06:57:06,880 --> 06:57:09,889
as time goes on then what would happen and it's in a very

8691
06:57:09,889 --> 06:57:10,880
vulnerable position

8692
06:57:10,880 --> 06:57:15,049
because they're not on the lake and so if if they don't

8693
06:57:15,049 --> 06:57:16,520
want the responsibility

8694
06:57:16,520 --> 06:57:19,680
then just to sell the whole property is what I'm saying it

8695
06:57:19,680 --> 06:57:20,959
's just it's just a

8696
06:57:20,959 --> 06:57:24,119
putting it in a bad spot let me give you some unsolicited

8697
06:57:24,119 --> 06:57:25,959
advice from someone who

8698
06:57:25,959 --> 06:57:32,439
just finished in a neighborhood squabble that is

8699
06:57:32,439 --> 06:57:36,799
specifically outlined in law and

8700
06:57:36,799 --> 06:57:40,790
after five years four judges and a total of almost a

8701
06:57:40,790 --> 06:57:42,799
million dollars in legal

8702
06:57:42,799 --> 06:57:46,130
fees you don't want to bring a lawyer into this

8703
06:57:46,130 --> 06:57:48,319
neighborhood squabble y'all

8704
06:57:48,319 --> 06:57:52,490
need to settle it on your own because no good things is

8705
06:57:52,490 --> 06:57:53,520
gonna come out of the

8706
06:57:53,520 --> 06:57:56,790
lawsuit trust me that's that's why I've just if we could

8707
06:57:56,790 --> 06:57:57,680
just have a little more

8708
06:57:57,680 --> 06:58:00,619
time to just be able to get that and to sit down and work

8709
06:58:00,619 --> 06:58:02,119
it out together I just

8710
06:58:02,119 --> 06:58:05,310
think that would just be the best solution commissioner

8711
06:58:05,310 --> 06:58:05,919
Ellis do you have

8712
06:58:05,919 --> 06:58:09,450
any questions thank you vice chair I have a question I

8713
06:58:09,450 --> 06:58:11,000
guess just real quick for

8714
06:58:11,000 --> 06:58:15,209
staff going back to notification in that question with

8715
06:58:15,209 --> 06:58:16,720
regard to this particular

8716
06:58:16,720 --> 06:58:21,040
property are we where are we starting that that that making

8717
06:58:21,040 --> 06:58:22,639
that circle of 200

8718
06:58:22,639 --> 06:58:28,759
feet at their address right and I think that might be worse

8719
06:58:28,759 --> 06:58:29,799
for you so you you

8720
06:58:29,799 --> 06:58:41,200
can you have an opportunity to look at that thanks I

8721
06:58:41,200 --> 06:58:42,720
actually don't have that

8722
06:58:42,720 --> 06:58:45,040
map available because I don't think I can access the s

8723
06:58:45,040 --> 06:58:46,240
drive from here but I can

8724
06:58:46,240 --> 06:58:49,680
inform you it was I think it's mentioned in your backup I

8725
06:58:49,680 --> 06:58:51,319
believe it was 133

8726
06:58:51,319 --> 06:58:55,750
notices were sent and we kind of conservatively interpret

8727
06:58:55,750 --> 06:58:56,720
what state law

8728
06:58:56,720 --> 06:59:00,919
requires which is the original subdivision be notified as

8729
06:59:00,919 --> 06:59:01,959
well as 200

8730
06:59:01,959 --> 06:59:04,610
feet around the property what we do is the original subdiv

8731
06:59:04,610 --> 06:59:05,919
ision plus a 200 foot

8732
06:59:05,919 --> 06:59:09,299
buffer around the subdivision boundaries so that's where we

8733
06:59:09,299 --> 06:59:10,040
came up with that

8734
06:59:10,040 --> 06:59:13,759
hundred and thirty three notices and those do go to the

8735
06:59:13,759 --> 06:59:15,080
certified based on

8736
06:59:15,080 --> 06:59:17,450
the certified tax roll to the property owner that we have

8737
06:59:17,450 --> 06:59:18,639
on record right in is

8738
06:59:18,639 --> 06:59:22,209
it it's from their address which is the Santa Monica

8739
06:59:22,209 --> 06:59:23,919
address or because I think

8740
06:59:23,919 --> 06:59:28,060
maybe some confusion with with with just is coming from

8741
06:59:28,060 --> 06:59:29,840
where this this replat is

8742
06:59:29,840 --> 06:59:34,680
on that corner on Alpacaio which would not have been your

8743
06:59:34,680 --> 06:59:35,560
buffer I don't think

8744
06:59:35,560 --> 06:59:38,400
no sending it out it would have been the address on Santa

8745
06:59:38,400 --> 06:59:40,000
Monica right the

8746
06:59:40,000 --> 06:59:42,380
buffer is formed from the subdivision boundary so that

8747
06:59:42,380 --> 06:59:43,400
original Montecito

8748
06:59:43,400 --> 06:59:46,349
subdivision that was shown up here earlier we put the 200

8749
06:59:46,349 --> 06:59:47,360
foot buffer around

8750
06:59:47,360 --> 06:59:54,680
that that is all of the cards I have that wish to speak if

8751
06:59:54,680 --> 06:59:55,400
anybody else in

8752
06:59:55,400 --> 06:59:59,540
the audience would wish to speak in favor or against please

8753
06:59:59,540 --> 07:00:02,159
come forward now

8754
07:00:03,240 --> 07:00:07,240
if anybody else would like to speak please come forward now

8755
07:00:07,240 --> 07:00:08,560
and state your

8756
07:00:08,560 --> 07:00:11,250
name and address and then fill out a blue card after you've

8757
07:00:11,250 --> 07:00:12,560
spoken sure so

8758
07:00:12,560 --> 07:00:16,549
again I'm Brandon Bulls at 508 Alpacaio Street I'm just

8759
07:00:16,549 --> 07:00:17,840
gonna be real brief I

8760
07:00:17,840 --> 07:00:21,790
don't need four minutes I'm just gonna ask y'all you know

8761
07:00:21,790 --> 07:00:22,959
as a planning and

8762
07:00:22,959 --> 07:00:26,950
zoning board to look at this situation a lot is being

8763
07:00:26,950 --> 07:00:28,919
broken up that's for a dam

8764
07:00:28,919 --> 07:00:33,919
and that dam is being sold that affects several neighbors

8765
07:00:33,919 --> 07:00:35,159
and I don't know if

8766
07:00:35,159 --> 07:00:37,680
any of you have really just looked at this on maybe a

8767
07:00:37,680 --> 07:00:38,720
Google Earth view to

8768
07:00:38,720 --> 07:00:42,549
understand this map or how much time you spent on this you

8769
07:00:42,549 --> 07:00:43,680
know I'm sure you

8770
07:00:43,680 --> 07:00:45,569
spent time on it I appreciate that I was at the earlier

8771
07:00:45,569 --> 07:00:47,319
planning session but it

8772
07:00:47,319 --> 07:00:50,540
just kind of amazes me that we ended up in this situation

8773
07:00:50,540 --> 07:00:52,040
with neighbors arguing

8774
07:00:52,040 --> 07:00:57,000
over what shouldn't be an issue how does a dam get owned by

8775
07:00:57,000 --> 07:00:58,479
one individual that

8776
07:00:58,479 --> 07:01:02,080
affects so many people so what I would ask you tonight is

8777
07:01:02,080 --> 07:01:04,639
please be thinking

8778
07:01:04,639 --> 07:01:07,990
about that in future developments and planning and zoning

8779
07:01:07,990 --> 07:01:09,040
to make sure this

8780
07:01:09,040 --> 07:01:12,200
never happens again because it's just it's a really bad

8781
07:01:12,200 --> 07:01:15,560
situation you know I

8782
07:01:15,560 --> 07:01:19,840
think the buyer has the best of intentions hopefully he'll

8783
07:01:19,840 --> 07:01:20,680
you know do

8784
07:01:20,680 --> 07:01:24,400
wonderful things with the property but it just kind of amaz

8785
07:01:24,400 --> 07:01:25,599
es me that we're in

8786
07:01:25,599 --> 07:01:29,200
the situation and how we got here it's pretty unbelievable

8787
07:01:29,200 --> 07:01:30,479
and talking with

8788
07:01:30,479 --> 07:01:34,069
planning and zoning today you know that's the staff agreed

8789
07:01:34,069 --> 07:01:35,119
with the people

8790
07:01:35,119 --> 07:01:38,590
I talked to that it's kind of crazy that one person owns

8791
07:01:38,590 --> 07:01:39,880
the dam that affects so

8792
07:01:39,880 --> 07:01:42,830
many people so anyway thank you for time I do appreciate

8793
07:01:42,830 --> 07:01:44,119
you'll stay in like thank

8794
07:01:44,119 --> 07:01:51,740
you is there anybody else that would like to speak we we've

8795
07:01:51,740 --> 07:01:54,720
already received

8796
07:01:54,720 --> 07:02:09,119
your input unless there's a question for for you I'm sorry

8797
07:02:09,119 --> 07:02:11,759
so I do have I do have

8798
07:02:11,759 --> 07:02:14,990
numerous cards that did not wish to speak I have one that

8799
07:02:14,990 --> 07:02:16,080
has a comment and

8800
07:02:16,080 --> 07:02:23,439
the rest I'll read in his account Jane Piper Lunt at 42 11

8801
07:02:23,439 --> 07:02:26,799
north I 35 is did

8802
07:02:26,799 --> 07:02:30,799
not wish to speak is in opposition and wrote that this is

8803
07:02:30,799 --> 07:02:31,520
not in keeping with

8804
07:02:31,520 --> 07:02:35,060
the neighborhood and traffic problems that might have been

8805
07:02:35,060 --> 07:02:36,919
for the other case

8806
07:02:36,919 --> 07:02:46,459
I do have three cards that did not wish to speak in support

8807
07:02:46,459 --> 07:02:50,119
and 11 cards that

8808
07:02:50,119 --> 07:02:55,330
did not wish to speak in opposition and if anybody else

8809
07:02:55,330 --> 07:02:57,240
would like to speak on

8810
07:02:57,240 --> 07:03:01,250
this matter please come forward now please come to the

8811
07:03:01,250 --> 07:03:02,319
microphone and state

8812
07:03:02,319 --> 07:03:07,349
your name and address and then fill out a blue card I have

8813
07:03:07,349 --> 07:03:07,560
laryngitis so I can't

8814
07:03:07,560 --> 07:03:12,840
talk very loud we just wanted to understand to the council

8815
07:03:12,840 --> 07:03:13,680
could we

8816
07:03:13,680 --> 07:03:20,720
request another date if we chose to to extend this you

8817
07:03:20,720 --> 07:03:27,799
could withdraw it and

8818
07:03:27,799 --> 07:03:41,080
refile it does anybody else wish to speak seeing nobody

8819
07:03:41,080 --> 07:03:41,599
else wishing to

8820
07:03:41,599 --> 07:03:45,040
speak we will close the public hearing

8821
07:03:45,759 --> 07:03:51,000
Commissioner Roselle I'll keep this brief because it's one

8822
07:03:51,000 --> 07:03:51,639
o'clock in the

8823
07:03:51,639 --> 07:03:54,069
morning but I just wanted to go on record to thank everyone

8824
07:03:54,069 --> 07:03:54,599
for coming out

8825
07:03:54,599 --> 07:03:57,409
it's really unfortunate and it's frustrating to me as a

8826
07:03:57,409 --> 07:03:58,360
commissioner just

8827
07:03:58,360 --> 07:04:01,349
lets you know that this is a public hearing item in which

8828
07:04:01,349 --> 07:04:02,080
you have the

8829
07:04:02,080 --> 07:04:05,630
ability to speak your opinions and your thoughts about the

8830
07:04:05,630 --> 07:04:07,040
issue yet as a

8831
07:04:07,040 --> 07:04:10,869
commission it's a ministerial act and we have as legal has

8832
07:04:10,869 --> 07:04:11,479
said we have no

8833
07:04:11,479 --> 07:04:16,119
discretion on the matter and so I I'd surely hope that mr.

8834
07:04:16,119 --> 07:04:17,680
Nelms protects the

8835
07:04:17,680 --> 07:04:19,779
dam for the sake of the neighborhood I grew up in the

8836
07:04:19,779 --> 07:04:20,880
neighborhood and so I'd

8837
07:04:20,880 --> 07:04:25,270
love to see that pond persist but I just want to before a

8838
07:04:25,270 --> 07:04:27,880
vote happens that seems

8839
07:04:27,880 --> 07:04:30,689
to happen into the affirmative this evening to thank you

8840
07:04:30,689 --> 07:04:31,919
for coming out we

8841
07:04:31,919 --> 07:04:35,549
have heard you and we appreciate the feedback regardless of

8842
07:04:35,549 --> 07:04:36,720
our ability to

8843
07:04:36,720 --> 07:04:42,880
actually act upon it Commissioner Beck thank you both here

8844
07:04:42,880 --> 07:04:44,040
and I too want to

8845
07:04:44,040 --> 07:04:47,599
thank you're wanting to come out and staying up with us we

8846
07:04:47,599 --> 07:04:48,639
were commended for

8847
07:04:48,639 --> 07:04:52,639
staying up but it you guys have been here as long as we

8848
07:04:52,639 --> 07:04:53,639
have I think all of us

8849
07:04:53,639 --> 07:04:56,299
here on the commission were disappointed that we're seeing

8850
07:04:56,299 --> 07:04:57,240
y'all again we were

8851
07:04:57,240 --> 07:05:00,619
hoping this would get resolved too so again as Commissioner

8852
07:05:00,619 --> 07:05:01,680
Rizel said despite

8853
07:05:01,680 --> 07:05:09,319
where this goes we hope that some satisfactory completion

8854
07:05:09,319 --> 07:05:09,880
comes to this

8855
07:05:09,880 --> 07:05:15,119
without court cases or anything like that

8856
07:05:18,639 --> 07:05:34,860
Commissioner Hudson move approval item fr 16 - 0 0 we haven

8857
07:05:34,860 --> 07:05:35,759
't closed the public

8858
07:05:35,759 --> 07:05:48,619
hearing yet did you okay I'm sorry I move Devon closes up

8859
07:05:48,619 --> 07:05:52,880
so no I so I move we we approve fr 16 0 2 0 0 2 3 a

8860
07:05:53,240 --> 07:05:57,069
because in ministerially that's the only thing to do we

8861
07:05:57,069 --> 07:05:58,680
have a motion do we have

8862
07:05:58,680 --> 07:06:14,599
a second Commissioner Beck because I reluctantly say I

8863
07:06:14,599 --> 07:06:15,560
understand the problem

8864
07:06:15,560 --> 07:06:20,689
here but yes I second the motion we have a motion and a

8865
07:06:20,689 --> 07:06:22,159
second is there any

8866
07:06:22,159 --> 07:06:27,240
further discussion Commissioner Ellis thank you vice-chair

8867
07:06:27,240 --> 07:06:28,560
just real quick

8868
07:06:28,560 --> 07:06:32,389
thank you everybody for your input it does feel like our

8869
07:06:32,389 --> 07:06:33,799
hands are tied here

8870
07:06:33,799 --> 07:06:38,029
with with what council has told us and and I wish that wasn

8871
07:06:38,029 --> 07:06:39,520
't the case and and

8872
07:06:39,520 --> 07:06:43,119
I wish you going forward in the future that you will all

8873
07:06:43,119 --> 07:06:44,119
continue to be

8874
07:06:44,119 --> 07:06:51,270
neighbors and and to work together and I would like to say

8875
07:06:51,270 --> 07:06:54,119
in a to address mr.

8876
07:06:54,119 --> 07:07:00,189
Bell's comment bulls comment in probably the last 30 years

8877
07:07:00,189 --> 07:07:01,319
this type of thing

8878
07:07:01,319 --> 07:07:03,880
would not not have been allowed we as you might have seen

8879
07:07:03,880 --> 07:07:04,880
earlier tonight we

8880
07:07:04,880 --> 07:07:07,330
had an ADP and there was this detention pond it was

8881
07:07:07,330 --> 07:07:09,180
community lot and that's a

8882
07:07:09,180 --> 07:07:12,340
really common thing in subdivisions now there will be and

8883
07:07:12,340 --> 07:07:13,400
the city won't even

8884
07:07:13,400 --> 07:07:17,759
allow a community a lot unless there is an HOA or some

8885
07:07:17,759 --> 07:07:19,880
owner that will that has

8886
07:07:19,880 --> 07:07:23,590
clear responsibility to maintain it you know this subdiv

8887
07:07:23,590 --> 07:07:25,200
ision is 50 plus years

8888
07:07:25,200 --> 07:07:28,360
old you know and it and I don't know who I don't know if

8889
07:07:28,360 --> 07:07:28,919
they originally built

8890
07:07:28,919 --> 07:07:31,000
the lakes or the lakes were already there whenever they

8891
07:07:31,000 --> 07:07:33,080
built the subdivision but

8892
07:07:33,080 --> 07:07:37,040
this was an artifact of the history and you know a city

8893
07:07:37,040 --> 07:07:38,220
that at the time

8894
07:07:38,220 --> 07:07:42,689
probably was was barely a town or you know as a small town

8895
07:07:42,689 --> 07:07:44,720
and so today this

8896
07:07:44,720 --> 07:07:47,369
type of thing wouldn't happen the entire lake would be an

8897
07:07:47,369 --> 07:07:48,439
HOA lot and all of y'all

8898
07:07:48,439 --> 07:07:50,650
would be members of the HOA and responsible for maintaining

8899
07:07:50,650 --> 07:07:51,720
it and I

8900
07:07:51,720 --> 07:07:55,479
don't know if there would be some way that y'all could get

8901
07:07:55,479 --> 07:07:56,680
to that point or if

8902
07:07:56,680 --> 07:08:00,229
that's something you desire you know it's it's beyond us it

8903
07:08:00,229 --> 07:08:00,799
'd have to be

8904
07:08:00,799 --> 07:08:05,290
something the entire community decides to do together we

8905
07:08:05,290 --> 07:08:06,799
have a motion in a

8906
07:08:06,799 --> 07:08:11,060
second and I don't think we can vote on the board so we'll

8907
07:08:11,060 --> 07:08:12,959
vote by show of hands

8908
07:08:12,959 --> 07:08:21,770
all in favor please write raise your right hand how do I do

8909
07:08:21,770 --> 07:08:25,279
motion carries

8910
07:08:25,279 --> 07:08:35,040
6-0 and one recusal and one recusal our next item on our

8911
07:08:35,040 --> 07:08:37,639
agenda is our planning

8912
07:08:37,639 --> 07:08:43,709
and zoning Commission matrix do we have any updates

8913
07:08:43,709 --> 07:08:47,080
Commissioner Ellis okay not

8914
07:08:47,080 --> 07:08:49,799
that anyone wants to talk matrix right now but it's the

8915
07:08:49,799 --> 07:08:51,080
right night to bring up

8916
07:08:51,080 --> 07:08:57,150
this topic which is can we start some discussion over city

8917
07:08:57,150 --> 07:08:59,919
initiated zoning I

8918
07:08:59,919 --> 07:09:04,349
don't want another lot like we had to deal with and I don't

8919
07:09:04,349 --> 07:09:05,759
know if that's in

8920
07:09:05,759 --> 07:09:12,430
a PNZ purview that we have that discussion so if you could

8921
07:09:12,430 --> 07:09:13,959
if you're

8922
07:09:13,959 --> 07:09:19,250
going to have a conversation could you move outside of the

8923
07:09:19,250 --> 07:09:20,080
the hall

8924
07:09:21,080 --> 07:09:27,319
we are still having our meeting if you have any additional

8925
07:09:27,319 --> 07:09:28,200
discussion please

8926
07:09:28,200 --> 07:09:31,080
move it to the hallway

8927
07:09:33,560 --> 07:09:40,119
Commissioner Ellis shall I start that again okay I feel

8928
07:09:40,119 --> 07:09:40,919
like this is the right

8929
07:09:40,919 --> 07:09:45,349
night to bring this up a discussion on city initiated

8930
07:09:45,349 --> 07:09:47,240
zoning so that we do not

8931
07:09:47,240 --> 07:09:51,099
end up with a lot discussion like we did today on scripture

8932
07:09:51,099 --> 07:09:52,479
Street so I don't know

8933
07:09:52,479 --> 07:09:55,450
where that falls to us as PNZ if we can have that

8934
07:09:55,450 --> 07:09:57,439
discussion but that's what I'm

8935
07:09:57,439 --> 07:10:01,580
asking Commissioner Ellis if you recall I'm not sure if you

8936
07:10:01,580 --> 07:10:02,759
recall I'm trying to

8937
07:10:02,759 --> 07:10:06,229
verify we have created a PNZ subcommittee that is

8938
07:10:06,229 --> 07:10:08,520
responsible for city initiated

8939
07:10:08,520 --> 07:10:13,060
zoning review and application there were three cases that

8940
07:10:13,060 --> 07:10:14,779
or maybe four that the

8941
07:10:14,779 --> 07:10:19,139
committee was amenable to moving forward the council at

8942
07:10:19,139 --> 07:10:20,599
that point had some

8943
07:10:20,599 --> 07:10:25,360
questions and was keen to have a joint session with the PNZ

8944
07:10:25,360 --> 07:10:26,279
or slash this sub

8945
07:10:26,279 --> 07:10:31,270
committee and what I will do is I will visit and discern

8946
07:10:31,270 --> 07:10:32,279
where that is on the

8947
07:10:32,279 --> 07:10:38,369
schedule with them I believe it got pushed out but we we

8948
07:10:38,369 --> 07:10:40,360
can definitely

8949
07:10:40,360 --> 07:10:43,700
reinitiate for the lack of a better word and start working

8950
07:10:43,700 --> 07:10:44,919
on this and come back

8951
07:10:44,919 --> 07:10:47,930
with some of the program priorities we had actually

8952
07:10:47,930 --> 07:10:49,520
presented some items that

8953
07:10:49,520 --> 07:10:56,060
were relatively simple consolidation of zoning and I think

8954
07:10:56,060 --> 07:10:57,959
it would this would

8955
07:10:57,959 --> 07:11:00,799
be a good opportunity to use those once again as an example

8956
07:11:00,799 --> 07:11:02,080
we did have a work

8957
07:11:02,080 --> 07:11:05,549
session with City Council explaining to them what this

8958
07:11:05,549 --> 07:11:07,159
committee does what its

8959
07:11:07,159 --> 07:11:11,020
intent is and what the intent of city initiated zoning was

8960
07:11:11,020 --> 07:11:12,200
the council felt

8961
07:11:12,200 --> 07:11:16,020
that they needed a little more time to digest the

8962
07:11:16,020 --> 07:11:17,919
information but I will

8963
07:11:17,919 --> 07:11:21,419
definitely come back to the Commission with some answers on

8964
07:11:21,419 --> 07:11:23,040
this okay if I may

8965
07:11:23,040 --> 07:11:26,299
so is that subcommittee still active you mean that yes it

8966
07:11:26,299 --> 07:11:27,720
is in existence yes it

8967
07:11:27,720 --> 07:11:32,270
is I believe Commissioner Roselle we suspended the meetings

8968
07:11:32,270 --> 07:11:32,560
we've just

8969
07:11:32,560 --> 07:11:36,310
suspended pending outcome of what council decided on the

8970
07:11:36,310 --> 07:11:38,279
the first properties and

8971
07:11:38,279 --> 07:11:41,939
they determined that we would not go forward on properties

8972
07:11:41,939 --> 07:11:43,040
unless they were

8973
07:11:43,040 --> 07:11:48,159
consented to by the owner I had one more thing if I'm still

8974
07:11:48,159 --> 07:11:53,040
on the clock okay is

8975
07:11:53,040 --> 07:11:59,380
there any room for PNZ to discuss SROs at any time because

8976
07:11:59,380 --> 07:12:00,560
clearly this is

8977
07:12:00,560 --> 07:12:03,900
coming up time and time again because it's the development

8978
07:12:03,900 --> 07:12:05,520
de jour it's going

8979
07:12:05,520 --> 07:12:10,279
to keep happening it's commissionerless the City Council

8980
07:12:10,279 --> 07:12:11,520
had requested the

8981
07:12:11,520 --> 07:12:15,950
planning division to review or discern or have discussion

8982
07:12:15,950 --> 07:12:17,319
at work session about

8983
07:12:17,319 --> 07:12:23,659
SROs we did provide some information to the council as it

8984
07:12:23,659 --> 07:12:25,040
relates to definition

8985
07:12:25,040 --> 07:12:28,479
of their SROs as it relates to benchmarking in other

8986
07:12:28,479 --> 07:12:29,000
communities

8987
07:12:29,000 --> 07:12:33,430
especially in college towns as it relates to SROs and we

8988
07:12:33,430 --> 07:12:35,680
also provided some draft

8989
07:12:35,680 --> 07:12:41,750
language that would have more restriction or have

8990
07:12:41,750 --> 07:12:43,520
restrictions associated with it

8991
07:12:43,520 --> 07:12:46,680
as it relates to development at that time at work session

8992
07:12:46,680 --> 07:12:47,599
the City Council

8993
07:12:47,599 --> 07:12:51,689
directed that perhaps the issue is more likely attached to

8994
07:12:51,689 --> 07:12:52,840
the development

8995
07:12:52,840 --> 07:12:55,099
criterion the multifamily development standards as it

8996
07:12:55,099 --> 07:12:56,080
relates to the parking

8997
07:12:56,080 --> 07:12:59,810
ratio requirements building heights basically massing of

8998
07:12:59,810 --> 07:13:02,720
the structure and

8999
07:13:02,720 --> 07:13:06,919
based on that outcome they we presented back at work

9000
07:13:06,919 --> 07:13:08,799
session with City Council I

9001
07:13:08,799 --> 07:13:15,430
would say at the most one month back and we provided some

9002
07:13:15,430 --> 07:13:17,200
added information as it

9003
07:13:17,200 --> 07:13:20,540
relates to the core of downtown which is your DR2s your DCG

9004
07:13:20,540 --> 07:13:21,720
's your DCN zoning

9005
07:13:21,720 --> 07:13:25,250
districts which is really what you've seen at tonight's

9006
07:13:25,250 --> 07:13:27,439
discussion to requiring

9007
07:13:27,439 --> 07:13:33,000
a specific use permit for any multifamily development

9008
07:13:33,000 --> 07:13:34,279
within those

9009
07:13:34,279 --> 07:13:36,900
zoning districts especially the core and given the small

9010
07:13:36,900 --> 07:13:38,159
area plan initiative and

9011
07:13:38,159 --> 07:13:44,229
given the historic districts that we have we received a

9012
07:13:44,229 --> 07:13:46,200
favorable it was a

9013
07:13:46,200 --> 07:13:48,430
very favorable discussion in the sense it was very positive

9014
07:13:48,430 --> 07:13:49,599
and productive and

9015
07:13:49,599 --> 07:13:52,759
council has now directed that we proceed with an ordinance

9016
07:13:52,759 --> 07:13:54,799
for that because that

9017
07:13:54,799 --> 07:13:57,330
is an amendment to the Denton Development Code it is a dual

9018
07:13:57,330 --> 07:13:57,759
public

9019
07:13:57,759 --> 07:14:02,209
hearing process so we have to initiate that and that item

9020
07:14:02,209 --> 07:14:03,560
will be coming before

9021
07:14:03,560 --> 07:14:07,799
you we actually decided to do a work session with you first

9022
07:14:07,799 --> 07:14:09,240
however I am

9023
07:14:09,240 --> 07:14:11,680
going to pull the Commission now if I have that opportunity

9024
07:14:11,680 --> 07:14:12,400
if you would

9025
07:14:12,400 --> 07:14:14,819
prefer we can actually do the public the work session and

9026
07:14:14,819 --> 07:14:15,840
the public hearing on

9027
07:14:15,840 --> 07:14:22,610
the same date to to move a little faster opposed to doing a

9028
07:14:22,610 --> 07:14:23,919
work session and then

9029
07:14:23,919 --> 07:14:27,849
coming back with public hearings so if you choose you know

9030
07:14:27,849 --> 07:14:29,200
if you want to give

9031
07:14:29,200 --> 07:14:32,849
me direction and say let's proceed and do the item I

9032
07:14:32,849 --> 07:14:34,639
received direction yes

9033
07:14:34,639 --> 07:14:38,200
super okay so we'll go ahead and do the notification

9034
07:14:38,200 --> 07:14:39,119
procedure and just bring it

9035
07:14:39,119 --> 07:14:44,680
to the to the put it placed on it on a very near pansy and

9036
07:14:44,680 --> 07:14:46,720
if you could slip in

9037
07:14:46,720 --> 07:14:51,909
a definition of dorm that includes SROs or any place where

9038
07:14:51,909 --> 07:14:52,720
we would have to change

9039
07:14:52,720 --> 07:14:56,529
that rooms are leased separately from kitchen collegiate

9040
07:14:56,529 --> 07:14:57,720
housing collegiate

9041
07:14:57,720 --> 07:15:00,560
housing dormitory something along those lines like some

9042
07:15:00,560 --> 07:15:01,360
definition like that

9043
07:15:01,360 --> 07:15:05,119
that would be wonderful what we what we can do is and

9044
07:15:05,119 --> 07:15:06,720
provide some draft

9045
07:15:06,720 --> 07:15:09,509
language which the planning and zoning Commission is

9046
07:15:09,509 --> 07:15:11,119
welcome to then recommend

9047
07:15:11,119 --> 07:15:16,330
that that be incorporated in the language Commissioner

9048
07:15:16,330 --> 07:15:18,400
Hudson so real

9049
07:15:18,400 --> 07:15:21,369
quick I just want to follow back up on Commissioner Rozelle

9050
07:15:21,369 --> 07:15:22,200
's question about

9051
07:15:22,200 --> 07:15:26,700
historic markers that fee the $200 fee or whatever and we

9052
07:15:26,700 --> 07:15:27,639
're going to look at

9053
07:15:27,639 --> 07:15:31,759
maybe what goes into that and potentially waiving that

9054
07:15:31,759 --> 07:15:32,840
because all the

9055
07:15:32,840 --> 07:15:35,830
other work they do with that and so can we get a can we

9056
07:15:35,830 --> 07:15:37,520
kick that around at some

9057
07:15:37,520 --> 07:15:41,840
point in the future Commissioner Hatsbeth and Commissioner

9058
07:15:41,840 --> 07:15:46,389
Rozelle we do have that we have an application fee which as

9059
07:15:46,389 --> 07:15:47,080
it relates to

9060
07:15:47,080 --> 07:15:50,569
historic landmark designation in the public hearing

9061
07:15:50,569 --> 07:15:52,240
processes obviously

9062
07:15:52,240 --> 07:15:55,400
having a historic landmark designation is indeed a positive

9063
07:15:55,400 --> 07:15:56,400
attribute that you

9064
07:15:56,400 --> 07:15:59,889
know we should look upon favorably I would like to add that

9065
07:15:59,889 --> 07:16:01,279
we are hopeful in

9066
07:16:01,279 --> 07:16:04,000
the very near future to address our fee schedule because

9067
07:16:04,000 --> 07:16:05,000
our fee schedule is

9068
07:16:05,000 --> 07:16:08,169
adopted by ordinance that fee is referenced in there we

9069
07:16:08,169 --> 07:16:09,319
were hopeful to

9070
07:16:09,319 --> 07:16:12,750
actually do a cost-benefit analysis on all the fees that we

9071
07:16:12,750 --> 07:16:13,880
have and possibly

9072
07:16:13,880 --> 07:16:17,049
look at potentially eliminating or reducing the fee

9073
07:16:17,049 --> 07:16:18,400
associated with that

9074
07:16:18,400 --> 07:16:22,159
element or component hand-in-hand with that the historic

9075
07:16:22,159 --> 07:16:23,400
preservation ordinance

9076
07:16:23,400 --> 07:16:26,220
is we're looking at making some minor amendments to that

9077
07:16:26,220 --> 07:16:27,159
from a procedural

9078
07:16:27,159 --> 07:16:32,270
aspect so it will be a few months but I think we will be

9079
07:16:32,270 --> 07:16:34,520
able to review and do

9080
07:16:34,520 --> 07:16:38,430
an analysis on the fees and bring that forward before you

9081
07:16:38,430 --> 07:16:39,000
as well

9082
07:16:39,000 --> 07:16:43,040
Commissioner Beck last thing I was disappointed to hear

9083
07:16:43,040 --> 07:16:43,479
that we're still

9084
07:16:43,479 --> 07:16:46,069
having problems with notification issues I thought we had

9085
07:16:46,069 --> 07:16:47,200
resolved it where they

9086
07:16:47,200 --> 07:16:53,270
would go out to not only the address it's on the city rolls

9087
07:16:53,270 --> 07:16:54,720
but to the actual

9088
07:16:54,720 --> 07:16:59,189
address itself so there wouldn't so we're we again to talk

9089
07:16:59,189 --> 07:17:00,279
about the

9090
07:17:00,279 --> 07:17:02,720
notification we had conversation with the planning and

9091
07:17:02,720 --> 07:17:03,720
zoning Commission we

9092
07:17:03,720 --> 07:17:06,880
floated some draft ideas we talked about postcards we

9093
07:17:06,880 --> 07:17:08,200
talked about refining the

9094
07:17:08,200 --> 07:17:10,979
language there was quite there were some questions as it

9095
07:17:10,979 --> 07:17:12,240
relates to the

9096
07:17:12,240 --> 07:17:15,720
enhancement of the notification process can we do something

9097
07:17:15,720 --> 07:17:16,880
with our technical

9098
07:17:16,880 --> 07:17:23,799
tools and what have you we then presented we also prior to

9099
07:17:23,799 --> 07:17:24,159
that had

9100
07:17:24,159 --> 07:17:29,549
conversation with the City Council and the City Council has

9101
07:17:29,549 --> 07:17:31,279
also requested that

9102
07:17:31,279 --> 07:17:35,150
what can we do with the notification process I would like

9103
07:17:35,150 --> 07:17:36,279
to add that we go

9104
07:17:36,279 --> 07:17:38,849
above and beyond the state requirement right now as it

9105
07:17:38,849 --> 07:17:40,080
relates to where and whom

9106
07:17:40,080 --> 07:17:43,729
it goes to I will verify the tax roll issues and make sure

9107
07:17:43,729 --> 07:17:44,560
that all that is

9108
07:17:44,560 --> 07:17:47,819
current and and lean on another department we collaborate

9109
07:17:47,819 --> 07:17:48,240
really well

9110
07:17:48,240 --> 07:17:50,319
together so I'll lean on them and make sure we have the

9111
07:17:50,319 --> 07:17:51,479
correct information I

9112
07:17:51,479 --> 07:17:54,330
do anticipate that we will come back with some

9113
07:17:54,330 --> 07:17:56,400
recommendation for the 500

9114
07:17:56,400 --> 07:17:58,990
foot notification and perhaps use a postcard and also

9115
07:17:58,990 --> 07:17:59,759
eliminate the

9116
07:17:59,759 --> 07:18:02,650
certified mailing procedures as you know the certified

9117
07:18:02,650 --> 07:18:03,959
mailing procedure it is

9118
07:18:03,959 --> 07:18:06,040
cumbersome for a property owner to want to go to the post

9119
07:18:06,040 --> 07:18:06,840
office and pick that

9120
07:18:06,840 --> 07:18:10,830
up and it's also very expensive which you know we gave you

9121
07:18:10,830 --> 07:18:12,119
an analysis on that

9122
07:18:12,119 --> 07:18:17,240
so if you would bear with us we we will bring that to the

9123
07:18:17,240 --> 07:18:19,080
forefront as well

9124
07:18:19,080 --> 07:18:24,639
Commissioner Sullivan real quickly because I'm sleepy could

9125
07:18:24,639 --> 07:18:25,680
you just simply

9126
07:18:25,680 --> 07:18:32,040
add our current resident and just put on a postcard I mean

9127
07:18:32,040 --> 07:18:33,279
I get junk mail all the time

9128
07:18:33,279 --> 07:18:36,240
from the current residents. Right and we'll bring that

9129
07:18:36,240 --> 07:18:39,759
before you now we really do not need to codify anything as

9130
07:18:39,759 --> 07:18:39,919
it

9131
07:18:39,919 --> 07:18:42,709
relates with the notification procedure because that's

9132
07:18:42,709 --> 07:18:44,599
already in play we will

9133
07:18:44,599 --> 07:18:47,779
just refine tune or refine the language that comes that

9134
07:18:47,779 --> 07:18:50,040
goes to the community so

9135
07:18:50,040 --> 07:18:52,729
it wouldn't be any it's not a difficult task it's just

9136
07:18:52,729 --> 07:18:54,040
something that we need to

9137
07:18:54,040 --> 07:19:03,580
bring forward to you expeditiously. And with that we will

9138
07:19:03,580 --> 07:19:05,439
end our planning and

9139
07:19:05,439 --> 07:19:12,799
zoning meeting at 1 on March 9th.

9140
07:19:14,720 --> 07:19:16,779
you