WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:04.200 Planning and Zoning Commission Work Session for October the 00:00:04.200 --> 00:00:06.419 26th. This 00:00:06.419 --> 00:00:08.529 meeting has been duly posted and we do have a quorum 00:00:08.529 --> 00:00:09.839 present. I'm gonna call it 00:00:09.839 --> 00:00:14.419 to order at 435. Our first order of business is going to 00:00:14.419 --> 00:00:14.880 receive 00:00:14.880 --> 00:00:17.510 clarification on agenda items this evening and I will turn 00:00:17.510 --> 00:00:18.120 that over to 00:00:18.120 --> 00:00:22.280 Manal for presentation. Thank you Chairperson Strange. I 00:00:22.280 --> 00:00:24.000 was wanting to seek 00:00:24.000 --> 00:00:27.649 the opinion of the Commission tonight to see if the items 00:00:27.649 --> 00:00:29.320 for public hearing for 00:00:29.320 --> 00:00:33.990 A and for B could be flipped please in the interest of 00:00:33.990 --> 00:00:36.439 anticipated viewers and 00:00:36.439 --> 00:00:39.570 audience. Maybe we could flip the two items so just wanted 00:00:39.570 --> 00:00:40.039 to bring that 00:00:40.039 --> 00:00:43.259 forward and from here we can proceed with our first item 00:00:43.259 --> 00:00:44.240 which is going to be 00:00:44.240 --> 00:00:47.799 the preliminary plat for Ranchview Surgical Hospital. I'll 00:00:47.799 --> 00:00:48.679 ask Julie Wyatt to 00:00:48.679 --> 00:00:52.679 come and present that or answer any questions since it's 00:00:52.679 --> 00:00:53.600 relatively 00:00:53.600 --> 00:00:56.600 self-explanatory. 00:01:00.159 --> 00:01:03.340 I'll answer any questions. I know you all have seen this 00:01:03.340 --> 00:01:06.280 site a few times but I'll 00:01:06.280 --> 00:01:14.709 be happy to show you anything or okay thank you. Thank you 00:01:14.709 --> 00:01:16.159 Julie. 00:01:16.159 --> 00:01:22.430 That was easy. We have another preliminary plat and Mike 00:01:22.430 --> 00:01:25.120 Bell is handling this for 00:01:25.120 --> 00:01:28.989 Eagle Heights. If there are any questions I'll ask Mike to 00:01:28.989 --> 00:01:30.000 come forward. 00:01:30.000 --> 00:01:32.890 Commissioner Begg. Thank you Chair. The only question I 00:01:32.890 --> 00:01:35.200 have is we're approving the plat but is it 00:01:35.200 --> 00:01:39.370 established that there will be multifamily dwelling built 00:01:39.370 --> 00:01:41.079 there? That's 00:01:41.079 --> 00:01:44.599 what the Alkin has expressed their intent to develop. Okay 00:01:44.599 --> 00:01:44.959 but there's 00:01:44.959 --> 00:01:50.159 nothing in stone on that. Okay that's all. Thank you. 00:01:51.280 --> 00:01:57.319 Moving along to the public hearing items. As I mentioned we 00:01:57.319 --> 00:01:58.200 'll deal with 00:01:58.200 --> 00:02:01.959 item 4B first which is an alternative ESA for Ryan Meadows 00:02:01.959 --> 00:02:03.239 edition and Mike 00:02:03.239 --> 00:02:08.039 Bell is going to walk us through this. 00:02:21.280 --> 00:02:29.159 Thank you Mike Bell, senior planner. Also have Debra of 00:02:29.159 --> 00:02:29.639 Environmental 00:02:29.639 --> 00:02:32.659 Services who will be supportive on this case since it's 00:02:32.659 --> 00:02:34.000 environmentally sensitive 00:02:34.000 --> 00:02:39.159 area. The case is to consider recommendation to City 00:02:39.159 --> 00:02:40.080 Council regarding 00:02:40.080 --> 00:02:42.750 an environment and alternative environmentally sensitive 00:02:42.750 --> 00:02:43.439 area plan for 00:02:43.439 --> 00:02:47.689 Ryan Meadows phase two. The property is shown here in 00:02:47.689 --> 00:02:49.280 yellow it's south of Ryan 00:02:49.280 --> 00:02:54.719 Elementary, south side of Ryan Road, east of Country Club 00:02:54.719 --> 00:02:56.319 and to show you on the 00:02:56.319 --> 00:02:58.430 right side this is the lot layout that was approved with 00:02:58.430 --> 00:02:59.400 the preliminary plat. 00:02:59.400 --> 00:03:03.960 So we're really just talking about the southern half. 00:03:03.960 --> 00:03:07.759 Commissioner Begg. Thank 00:03:07.759 --> 00:03:11.360 you Chair. So that road maybe you do it with your cursor 00:03:11.360 --> 00:03:12.520 down there in Creekdale is 00:03:12.520 --> 00:03:17.120 going to do an arc through that subdivision? Right well 00:03:17.120 --> 00:03:18.360 this is Creekdale 00:03:18.360 --> 00:03:21.250 here. Right. I'll show you how it relates to the mobility 00:03:21.250 --> 00:03:22.439 plan and just a right 00:03:22.439 --> 00:03:28.810 okay I'm just trying to a couple slides. Okay thanks. So it 00:03:28.810 --> 00:03:29.400 is just the south 00:03:29.400 --> 00:03:34.169 side of the subdivision. This is the combination of the ESA 00:03:34.169 --> 00:03:35.479 map and our 00:03:35.479 --> 00:03:37.629 city's mobility plan. You can see this is Creekdale Drive 00:03:37.629 --> 00:03:38.599 which you were referring 00:03:38.599 --> 00:03:41.860 to. That's our mobility plan as a collector street on the 00:03:41.860 --> 00:03:42.800 developers 00:03:42.800 --> 00:03:45.879 required to construct it. This is all of Ryan Meadows 00:03:45.879 --> 00:03:47.120 outlined in yellow so you 00:03:47.120 --> 00:03:49.719 can see where it comes through and eventually continue on 00:03:49.719 --> 00:03:50.280 east to the 00:03:50.280 --> 00:03:53.120 existing Creekdale and further on all the way to Teasley. 00:03:53.120 --> 00:03:55.039 There are also three 00:03:55.039 --> 00:03:58.240 environmentally sensitive areas in this tract. There's unde 00:03:58.240 --> 00:03:59.120 veloped floodplain, 00:03:59.120 --> 00:04:03.189 there's some riparian buffer and embedded within that rip 00:04:03.189 --> 00:04:04.280 arian buffer is 00:04:04.280 --> 00:04:08.500 also some water related ESA. I'll be happy to let Debra go 00:04:08.500 --> 00:04:09.400 over those in more 00:04:09.400 --> 00:04:14.020 detail if you have questions about what those entail. But 00:04:14.020 --> 00:04:15.120 you can see the mobility 00:04:15.120 --> 00:04:18.279 plan cut straight through them and there's really no there 00:04:18.279 --> 00:04:19.079 's no way around 00:04:19.079 --> 00:04:24.490 that. So that's the purpose of this request and again I'll 00:04:24.490 --> 00:04:25.680 show you the 00:04:25.680 --> 00:04:29.069 highlighted in white here is Creekdale Drive from that 00:04:29.069 --> 00:04:31.160 mobility plan and we'll 00:04:31.160 --> 00:04:35.819 focus in on this southern part here which you'll see is the 00:04:35.819 --> 00:04:37.759 actual ESAs and 00:04:37.759 --> 00:04:41.110 there are two areas of encroachment shown in red here and 00:04:41.110 --> 00:04:42.959 then where the road 00:04:42.959 --> 00:04:47.620 crosses down at the south part. It encapsulates 0.36 acres 00:04:47.620 --> 00:04:48.319 of floodplain, 00:04:48.319 --> 00:04:53.319 0.07 of water related and 0.39 of riparian buffer. So for 00:04:53.319 --> 00:04:54.000 mitigation of 00:04:54.000 --> 00:04:56.569 that, the encroachment of those areas the African is 00:04:56.569 --> 00:04:58.040 proposing to plant 25 trees 00:04:58.040 --> 00:05:03.000 which are those trees shown right there. 00:05:03.839 --> 00:05:07.459 Again we did send notification it is a public hearing we 00:05:07.459 --> 00:05:08.480 received nothing in 00:05:08.480 --> 00:05:13.480 favor or in opposition. Staff is supportive of the request 00:05:13.480 --> 00:05:14.360 as for the 00:05:14.360 --> 00:05:17.139 considerations in your backup but we do have three 00:05:17.139 --> 00:05:18.800 recommended conditions. One 00:05:18.800 --> 00:05:22.379 that we you know kind of specify the limitations so that it 00:05:22.379 --> 00:05:23.720 's not exceed 0.45 00:05:23.720 --> 00:05:26.920 acres is that was subject to the alternative ESA plan that 00:05:26.920 --> 00:05:27.319 's in your 00:05:27.319 --> 00:05:32.329 backup. There will be 25 trees planted to mitigate the 00:05:32.329 --> 00:05:33.759 removal of the ESAs and 00:05:33.759 --> 00:05:36.720 those shall be three inches diameter at planning and lastly 00:05:36.720 --> 00:05:37.720 that all disturbed 00:05:37.720 --> 00:05:40.899 areas shall be revegetated using native plants and with 00:05:40.899 --> 00:05:41.959 that I'll be happy to 00:05:41.959 --> 00:05:47.639 answer any questions. Commissioner Rossell. Thank you chair 00:05:47.639 --> 00:05:49.680 . I think I have two questions to 00:05:49.680 --> 00:05:56.600 start. First question is this is can you walk me through 00:05:56.600 --> 00:05:57.519 the the balance between 00:05:57.519 --> 00:06:01.040 this being a city road and them being required to mitigate 00:06:01.040 --> 00:06:01.759 if they're 00:06:01.759 --> 00:06:05.459 providing the road on our mobility plan? Right so the the 00:06:05.459 --> 00:06:07.480 alignment of Creekdale 00:06:07.480 --> 00:06:11.529 is conceptually drawn on the mobility plan. Does not 00:06:11.529 --> 00:06:12.920 necessarily have to be 00:06:12.920 --> 00:06:14.990 this curve but generally they have to get from up here to 00:06:14.990 --> 00:06:15.759 down here through 00:06:15.759 --> 00:06:18.720 their property and that's required of them by the city 00:06:18.720 --> 00:06:20.959 mobility plan. The exact 00:06:20.959 --> 00:06:26.920 alignment is not deterrent so essentially they could you 00:06:26.920 --> 00:06:28.079 know curve it 00:06:28.079 --> 00:06:30.560 through the side how they please as long as they get to the 00:06:30.560 --> 00:06:31.040 to the southern half 00:06:31.040 --> 00:06:34.379 and it meets our requirements and there is nothing that 00:06:34.379 --> 00:06:35.680 exempts city roads from 00:06:35.680 --> 00:06:39.129 not having to do an alternative ESA plan. Okay. So that's 00:06:39.129 --> 00:06:39.879 really why we're here 00:06:39.879 --> 00:06:42.990 there's no exemption from that and I think there could be 00:06:42.990 --> 00:06:43.759 why are we making 00:06:43.759 --> 00:06:47.139 them do an ESA plan if we're making them put the road in 00:06:47.139 --> 00:06:47.800 but because that 00:06:47.800 --> 00:06:49.990 alignments not fixed I think there could be an argument 00:06:49.990 --> 00:06:50.839 made that if we didn't 00:06:50.839 --> 00:06:52.899 require these so they could run their road straight through 00:06:52.899 --> 00:06:54.600 it. Sure. And not 00:06:54.600 --> 00:06:58.230 have to do any mitigation. That makes sense. The other 00:06:58.230 --> 00:07:00.680 question I had was it's 00:07:00.680 --> 00:07:04.810 almost a point four acres of riparian buffer. Last time I 00:07:04.810 --> 00:07:06.079 saw the riparian 00:07:06.079 --> 00:07:08.149 buffer come into question we actually had photographs of 00:07:08.149 --> 00:07:08.879 the condition of the 00:07:08.879 --> 00:07:12.680 riparian buffer. Has anyone walked the area to know what 00:07:12.680 --> 00:07:14.519 condition the riparian 00:07:14.519 --> 00:07:19.079 buffer is in or health of it? 00:07:21.839 --> 00:07:27.199 Good evening Commission. We did an assessment in 2014 for 00:07:27.199 --> 00:07:29.079 those four three 00:07:29.079 --> 00:07:34.730 ESAs and the riparian buffer ranked as a fair. Okay so it 00:07:34.730 --> 00:07:37.519 is heavily vegetated. We 00:07:37.519 --> 00:07:40.339 only provide protection to the first hundred feet of the 00:07:40.339 --> 00:07:41.240 riparian buffer 00:07:41.240 --> 00:07:44.980 however the actual buffer extends 200 feet wide. So we 00:07:44.980 --> 00:07:47.040 wanted to make that the 00:07:47.040 --> 00:07:49.589 distinction of what is being protected under the ESA 00:07:49.589 --> 00:07:50.800 regulation what is out 00:07:50.800 --> 00:07:55.139 there. So it is a fair condition it is an undeveloped flood 00:07:55.139 --> 00:07:56.160 plain the water 00:07:56.160 --> 00:08:00.569 related was confirmed so we have a better understanding of 00:08:00.569 --> 00:08:01.759 what is out there 00:08:01.759 --> 00:08:05.730 based on the field assessments. Is there any creek or water 00:08:05.730 --> 00:08:06.639 to your knowledge 00:08:06.639 --> 00:08:10.879 standing there right now? Well I went to the site and 00:08:10.879 --> 00:08:12.480 actually there were 00:08:12.480 --> 00:08:16.129 there was no evidence of water flowing but definitely some 00:08:16.129 --> 00:08:17.360 stagnant water so I 00:08:17.360 --> 00:08:20.470 think that is intermittent type of a stream where flows 00:08:20.470 --> 00:08:22.160 only to certain times 00:08:22.160 --> 00:08:27.759 of the year. Thank you. Commissioner Black. Thank you Chair 00:08:27.759 --> 00:08:29.120 . So you feel 00:08:29.120 --> 00:08:31.800 comfortable with what little work they're going to be doing 00:08:31.800 --> 00:08:32.519 through which 00:08:32.519 --> 00:08:39.379 is again less than 0.4 that there's not going to be any 00:08:39.379 --> 00:08:40.279 loss of any 00:08:40.279 --> 00:08:45.190 significant wildlife there is there any there to lose? Well 00:08:45.190 --> 00:08:46.879 the this request is a 00:08:46.879 --> 00:08:51.360 little bit compound. First we have the ESA the disturbance 00:08:51.360 --> 00:08:52.120 to the ESA that 00:08:52.120 --> 00:08:55.360 they are doing okay and also we look into what they are 00:08:55.360 --> 00:08:56.039 offering as a 00:08:56.039 --> 00:09:00.279 mitigation. In this case they have offered to provide 00:09:00.279 --> 00:09:01.960 additional planting 00:09:01.960 --> 00:09:06.690 adjacent to the ESA not within the ESA but adjacent to the 00:09:06.690 --> 00:09:08.279 ESA and the reason 00:09:08.279 --> 00:09:11.279 is because they went through a conditional letter of my 00:09:11.279 --> 00:09:11.840 revision 00:09:11.840 --> 00:09:16.000 through FEMA which allows them to modify that floodplain 00:09:16.000 --> 00:09:19.559 okay and that have been 00:09:19.559 --> 00:09:23.450 already approved by FEMA subject to work start being done 00:09:23.450 --> 00:09:24.320 and then the 00:09:24.320 --> 00:09:26.700 conditional letter of my revision becomes a permanent 00:09:26.700 --> 00:09:27.600 through a letter of 00:09:27.600 --> 00:09:32.720 my revision. If they start putting more trees within the 00:09:32.720 --> 00:09:34.240 floodplain that 00:09:34.240 --> 00:09:38.639 actually invalid all the parameters that they have modeled 00:09:38.639 --> 00:09:40.320 the floodplain 00:09:40.320 --> 00:09:45.330 and have determined the boundary of the new floodplain so 00:09:45.330 --> 00:09:47.240 what they're doing is 00:09:47.240 --> 00:09:50.759 they understand that mitigation is needed but they are 00:09:50.759 --> 00:09:52.039 willing to provide 00:09:52.039 --> 00:09:55.759 that mitigation adjacent to it. Just keep in mind the same 00:09:55.759 --> 00:09:57.200 as this riparian buffer 00:09:57.200 --> 00:10:00.860 is 200 feet even though only the first hundred feet is 00:10:00.860 --> 00:10:02.559 protected the same 00:10:02.559 --> 00:10:05.950 happened with that year is heavily vegetated so adding to 00:10:05.950 --> 00:10:06.919 it adding the 00:10:06.919 --> 00:10:11.659 mitigation next to it you will make the area greater. I don 00:10:11.659 --> 00:10:12.639 't think that exactly 00:10:12.639 --> 00:10:16.159 answer my question though is there any essential wildlife 00:10:16.159 --> 00:10:17.960 there that would lose 00:10:17.960 --> 00:10:21.039 from this? Well we don't have any endangered species 00:10:21.039 --> 00:10:22.399 identified by 00:10:22.399 --> 00:10:27.710 parks and wildlife in that area. Wildlife yes definitely 00:10:27.710 --> 00:10:28.799 there would be when 00:10:28.799 --> 00:10:31.480 when you have those urban forests and those riparian buffer 00:10:31.480 --> 00:10:32.440 they're definitely 00:10:32.440 --> 00:10:39.840 refuge for wildlife so they there would still be a riparian 00:10:39.840 --> 00:10:42.039 buffer there and the 00:10:42.039 --> 00:10:45.519 disturbance might made those species to relocate 00:10:45.519 --> 00:10:47.600 temporarily but hopefully they 00:10:47.600 --> 00:10:51.360 will come back. Okay now you mentioned and I realize this 00:10:51.360 --> 00:10:55.039 cloner CLOMR when 00:10:55.039 --> 00:10:57.700 they can't do you're talking about the trees the mitigation 00:10:57.700 --> 00:10:58.340 part with the 00:10:58.340 --> 00:11:01.289 trees that's outside of this area but you also mentioned 00:11:01.289 --> 00:11:02.279 that the applicant 00:11:02.279 --> 00:11:06.700 offers as mitigation revegetating all disturbed areas with 00:11:06.700 --> 00:11:08.320 native vegetation so 00:11:08.320 --> 00:11:11.549 is that going to be within that cloner region and what kind 00:11:11.549 --> 00:11:12.840 of vegetation? Well 00:11:12.840 --> 00:11:17.000 mainly would be grasses and what we are looking is we 00:11:17.000 --> 00:11:18.679 specify native because 00:11:18.679 --> 00:11:22.820 they have a better chance to acclimate and get established 00:11:22.820 --> 00:11:24.159 faster just keep in 00:11:24.159 --> 00:11:27.309 mind that we are close to a creek so any area that get und 00:11:27.309 --> 00:11:28.759 isturbed that means that 00:11:28.759 --> 00:11:32.340 that soil have a chance to reach to the creek in a rain 00:11:32.340 --> 00:11:33.559 event so we're looking 00:11:33.559 --> 00:11:38.870 for primarily grasses who keep the soil in place and 00:11:38.870 --> 00:11:41.720 protected. Thank you. 00:11:41.720 --> 00:11:47.620 Commissioner Rosale. Thank you one more question the the ph 00:11:47.620 --> 00:11:48.600 asing chart that I 00:11:48.600 --> 00:11:53.559 have here lots 142 and 143 is where they're planning on 00:11:53.559 --> 00:11:54.519 putting trees is 00:11:54.519 --> 00:12:00.519 lots 142 and 143 going away or are they actually mitigating 00:12:00.519 --> 00:12:01.440 in an area that a 00:12:01.440 --> 00:12:04.840 house is going to be built? Those are common area lots the 00:12:04.840 --> 00:12:06.120 HOA maintenance. 00:12:06.120 --> 00:12:11.679 Okay okay thank you. Commissioner Sullivan. Thank you I'm 00:12:11.679 --> 00:12:13.399 concerned that how 00:12:13.399 --> 00:12:16.879 much water is gonna be coming through that area because 00:12:16.879 --> 00:12:18.080 right now anytime it's 00:12:18.080 --> 00:12:21.639 a heavy rain Hickory Creek is pretty well closed most of 00:12:21.639 --> 00:12:24.000 the time both from River 00:12:24.000 --> 00:12:30.159 Pass and off of 1830 and we've got a street that's coming 00:12:30.159 --> 00:12:31.039 from Creekdale on 00:12:31.039 --> 00:12:34.399 to Hickory Creek and then we have Creekdale coming through 00:12:34.399 --> 00:12:35.440 here plus a lot 00:12:35.440 --> 00:12:38.919 of houses being built with a lot of concrete is all that 00:12:38.919 --> 00:12:39.840 gonna be draining 00:12:39.840 --> 00:12:43.750 into that floodplain area that's then gonna flood Hickory 00:12:43.750 --> 00:12:45.360 Creek even more or 00:12:45.360 --> 00:12:49.279 are there plans to do something with Hickory Creek Road to 00:12:49.279 --> 00:12:50.919 make it not flood 00:12:50.919 --> 00:12:55.600 as often? Earl would you care to address that one? 00:12:58.679 --> 00:13:01.879 Earl Escobar engineering. What the intent with Hickory 00:13:01.879 --> 00:13:05.399 Creek Road oops is to 00:13:05.399 --> 00:13:15.120 realign it. Currently Hickory Road is within the floodplain 00:13:15.120 --> 00:13:16.480 itself and so it 00:13:16.480 --> 00:13:21.169 does flood during heavy rain events and so there should be 00:13:21.169 --> 00:13:22.519 a CIP project in the 00:13:22.519 --> 00:13:28.899 future that realigns it outside the floodplain here in red. 00:13:28.899 --> 00:13:30.440 Okay I thought 00:13:30.440 --> 00:13:34.600 that's where it was now. No no no it right now it goes 00:13:34.600 --> 00:13:35.879 straight. Okay where's 00:13:35.879 --> 00:13:38.179 this Hickory Creek? Right. That's the road and that's the 00:13:38.179 --> 00:13:39.440 road. Okay somewhere in this area. 00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:44.799 Okay I see so that is a change to Hickory Creek. Yes. 00:13:44.799 --> 00:13:48.279 Gotcha okay thank you. 00:13:51.159 --> 00:13:55.279 I have a couple questions. Do we have a map without the ESA 00:13:55.279 --> 00:13:56.080 on it that we can 00:13:56.080 --> 00:13:58.759 zoom in on what that area currently is? I know that's been 00:13:58.759 --> 00:14:00.480 farmland I think for 00:14:00.480 --> 00:14:03.960 many years back and behind the school. 00:14:08.679 --> 00:14:13.000 Well maybe I have one aerial here. 00:14:18.440 --> 00:14:23.600 Does that work for what you need? I guess as close as we 00:14:23.600 --> 00:14:27.399 can get. Can you turn ESA on 00:14:27.399 --> 00:14:29.879 that or not? Let me just go ahead and get the interactive 00:14:29.879 --> 00:14:32.840 maps I'll pull that up real quick. 00:14:48.440 --> 00:15:04.399 I apparently not. Well I was hoping to be able to look and 00:15:04.399 --> 00:15:06.879 see what the current 00:15:06.879 --> 00:15:09.769 conditions and what it's been because I know and and the 00:15:09.769 --> 00:15:10.720 reason I know is my 00:15:10.720 --> 00:15:13.620 kids went to school there at that elementary school so Fall 00:15:13.620 --> 00:15:14.320 Festival and 00:15:14.320 --> 00:15:17.669 all the things that went on and out in that field just to 00:15:17.669 --> 00:15:18.960 get an idea of and for 00:15:18.960 --> 00:15:20.899 the rest of Commission an idea of what the current 00:15:20.899 --> 00:15:22.000 conditions are out there 00:15:22.000 --> 00:15:25.559 that that's mostly been just a plowed and farmland for many 00:15:25.559 --> 00:15:26.519 years versus I 00:15:26.519 --> 00:15:31.179 don't know when the ESA got established on there and then 00:15:31.179 --> 00:15:33.120 the second point which 00:15:33.120 --> 00:15:37.000 goes back to the map that you had up that does show the ESA 00:15:37.000 --> 00:15:38.159 I know we've had 00:15:38.159 --> 00:15:42.360 quite a bit of conversation in the past about roads 00:15:42.360 --> 00:15:44.519 impacting the essays and 00:15:44.519 --> 00:15:48.250 when you look at that map right there Ryan already impacts 00:15:48.250 --> 00:15:49.919 it in at least two 00:15:49.919 --> 00:15:55.120 or three places Hickory Creek is through it 1830 is through 00:15:55.120 --> 00:15:57.480 it we have this all 00:15:57.480 --> 00:15:59.980 over town and I know we've had a lot of discussions in the 00:15:59.980 --> 00:16:00.879 past that we can't 00:16:00.879 --> 00:16:04.690 put any roads or we don't want roads crossing ESA's and 00:16:04.690 --> 00:16:05.960 they are all over 00:16:05.960 --> 00:16:09.450 already and that's just a fact of mobility and getting 00:16:09.450 --> 00:16:10.840 around our city and 00:16:10.840 --> 00:16:14.360 so I just want to draw that to attention because we've had 00:16:14.360 --> 00:16:14.879 a lot of 00:16:14.879 --> 00:16:18.509 conversation the past about it and we see it in this map 00:16:18.509 --> 00:16:19.519 that it exists 00:16:19.519 --> 00:16:23.929 probably in at least 20 30 places just in this one area 00:16:23.929 --> 00:16:25.480 that this happens all 00:16:25.480 --> 00:16:30.100 the time and it's not a very oddball thing that comes 00:16:30.100 --> 00:16:32.480 before us it's pretty 00:16:32.480 --> 00:16:35.620 normal and so those are just my two comments on this 00:16:35.620 --> 00:16:37.200 particular one and then 00:16:37.200 --> 00:16:40.460 the other one that final comment is on Commissioner Roselle 00:16:40.460 --> 00:16:41.799 's point which was 00:16:41.799 --> 00:16:45.149 going to be my question about when it's on the mobility and 00:16:45.149 --> 00:16:45.960 it has to go in 00:16:45.960 --> 00:16:49.679 there why a developer has to come in and mitigate that when 00:16:49.679 --> 00:16:50.600 they have to put that 00:16:50.600 --> 00:16:54.629 roadway in there's really not a place for them to put Creek 00:16:54.629 --> 00:16:55.879 dale in that it's 00:16:55.879 --> 00:16:59.039 not going to end up impacting the essay certainly I think 00:16:59.039 --> 00:16:59.799 that's a fair point 00:16:59.799 --> 00:17:02.100 something we discussed internally but ultimately there's 00:17:02.100 --> 00:17:02.840 nothing in the code 00:17:02.840 --> 00:17:06.410 that exempts those requirements and so that's what the ESA 00:17:06.410 --> 00:17:07.559 plan came into about 00:17:07.559 --> 00:17:10.690 what's it take to make it exempt because if they've got to 00:17:10.690 --> 00:17:11.559 go expense of 00:17:11.559 --> 00:17:15.049 putting it in things like it's kind of somewhat punitive to 00:17:15.049 --> 00:17:15.839 then have to 00:17:15.839 --> 00:17:20.529 mitigate for a road that's being told you're going to put 00:17:20.529 --> 00:17:23.559 it here when this 00:17:23.559 --> 00:17:26.319 application came forward it's one of the issues that we 00:17:26.319 --> 00:17:27.559 grappled with saying that 00:17:27.559 --> 00:17:29.720 there is a right of way that's required based on our 00:17:29.720 --> 00:17:31.000 thoroughfare plan slash 00:17:31.000 --> 00:17:36.049 mobility plan and we looked we also weighed the the concern 00:17:36.049 --> 00:17:37.039 on what do we do 00:17:37.039 --> 00:17:39.509 as it relates to mitigation even though we've seen the 00:17:39.509 --> 00:17:40.480 scenario in multiple 00:17:40.480 --> 00:17:44.240 areas within our city and as a result it is something that 00:17:44.240 --> 00:17:45.640 we've pinpointed or 00:17:45.640 --> 00:17:49.039 highlighted and are keen to work internally with our teams 00:17:49.039 --> 00:17:50.279 our engineering 00:17:50.279 --> 00:17:53.400 our environmental team and ourselves to see if there's an 00:17:53.400 --> 00:17:54.759 opportunity where do we 00:17:54.759 --> 00:17:57.440 revisit the mobility plan or do we then figure out an 00:17:57.440 --> 00:17:58.960 alternative solution as it 00:17:58.960 --> 00:18:04.400 relates to public right-of-way requirements so where does 00:18:04.400 --> 00:18:05.160 that stand 00:18:05.160 --> 00:18:08.809 so at this point hopefully we do intend within the next few 00:18:08.809 --> 00:18:09.880 months is to get 00:18:09.880 --> 00:18:13.269 some working groups together to understand what the 00:18:13.269 --> 00:18:14.559 opportunities are 00:18:14.559 --> 00:18:17.680 that are available to us again the Commission also has the 00:18:17.680 --> 00:18:18.480 opportunity to 00:18:18.480 --> 00:18:21.650 make a request if I'm not mistaken to have this evaluated 00:18:21.650 --> 00:18:22.759 or reevaluated or 00:18:22.759 --> 00:18:28.019 assessed that broad question or this particular broad 00:18:28.019 --> 00:18:30.480 question well I'll make 00:18:30.480 --> 00:18:33.369 that recommendation that we look at that because I know 00:18:33.369 --> 00:18:35.240 this happens in multiple 00:18:35.240 --> 00:18:41.099 places and any time that these impacts that's basically on 00:18:41.099 --> 00:18:42.440 the not only is the 00:18:42.440 --> 00:18:45.789 developer having to put the the utilities or the road or 00:18:45.789 --> 00:18:47.240 whatever in but 00:18:47.240 --> 00:18:51.529 if it does then impact an ESA then they have to mitigate it 00:18:51.529 --> 00:18:52.400 and have the 00:18:52.400 --> 00:18:56.480 additional expense based on being said this is where it has 00:18:56.480 --> 00:18:57.480 to go and got to 00:18:57.480 --> 00:19:00.799 mitigate it also so I don't know if we need a first or a 00:19:00.799 --> 00:19:01.799 second or just a 00:19:01.799 --> 00:19:05.400 general effect comes on at the very end of the very end is 00:19:05.400 --> 00:19:05.720 an item that needs 00:19:05.720 --> 00:19:12.359 to be addressed matrix anybody else have any questions on 00:19:12.359 --> 00:19:13.720 this item is a great 00:19:13.720 --> 00:19:17.839 presentation thank you Mike 00:19:22.440 --> 00:19:26.859 I'm going to ask Ron Menguita our long-range planning 00:19:26.859 --> 00:19:29.960 administrator to 00:19:29.960 --> 00:19:36.539 make the next presentation for z16 0 0 0 7 thank you chair 00:19:36.539 --> 00:19:38.000 members of the 00:19:38.000 --> 00:19:41.880 Commission this item brought forward to you today is a code 00:19:41.880 --> 00:19:43.039 amendment to our 00:19:43.039 --> 00:19:43.039 development code regarding a fry overlay district the 00:19:43.039 --> 00:19:50.599 request by the 00:19:50.599 --> 00:19:55.500 applicant is to amend the overlay district to create a 00:19:55.500 --> 00:19:57.200 separate sub area 00:19:57.200 --> 00:20:00.809 which is what they're calling sub area C and also provide 00:20:00.809 --> 00:20:02.319 additional associated 00:20:02.319 --> 00:20:06.990 development standards that would only apply to that 00:20:06.990 --> 00:20:09.960 particular sub area as a 00:20:09.960 --> 00:20:14.220 way of reference this is the fry Street overlay district it 00:20:14.220 --> 00:20:17.359 's possibly 12.8 0 00:20:17.359 --> 00:20:23.059 acres or so the youth center which is here and shown in sub 00:20:23.059 --> 00:20:25.640 area B was carved 00:20:25.640 --> 00:20:30.799 out for a lack of better term in 2010 to allow for that 00:20:30.799 --> 00:20:32.839 development to occur they 00:20:32.839 --> 00:20:36.849 proposed again a sub area they proposed development 00:20:36.849 --> 00:20:39.440 standards again to allow 00:20:39.440 --> 00:20:43.940 them to build their development the same similar request is 00:20:43.940 --> 00:20:45.680 being asked of this 00:20:45.680 --> 00:20:49.799 particular area which is shown in red and this is again sub 00:20:49.799 --> 00:20:50.799 area C and the 00:20:50.799 --> 00:20:55.400 applicant has proposed certain criteria or design standards 00:20:55.400 --> 00:20:56.599 that will allow 00:20:56.599 --> 00:21:00.289 their development to occur if this were to move forward and 00:21:00.289 --> 00:21:01.559 get approved by City 00:21:01.559 --> 00:21:07.500 Council look closer look of the area this is the area 00:21:07.500 --> 00:21:10.559 approximately 4.7 acres 00:21:10.559 --> 00:21:16.319 I'm sorry 1.75 acres I stand corrected of the area where 00:21:16.319 --> 00:21:18.119 currently Vortmans 00:21:18.119 --> 00:21:22.710 bookstore is located as well as the subway along Hickory 00:21:22.710 --> 00:21:24.400 Street the 00:21:24.400 --> 00:21:28.970 applicant is proposing to construct a five-story multi- 00:21:28.970 --> 00:21:30.559 level mixed-use 00:21:30.559 --> 00:21:34.930 development that will include again the retail Vortmans 00:21:34.930 --> 00:21:36.640 bookstore as well as a 00:21:36.640 --> 00:21:40.000 restaurant it's my understanding that subway will be occup 00:21:40.000 --> 00:21:41.079 ying that space it 00:21:41.079 --> 00:21:44.240 may not necessarily be subway but it will be a restaurant 00:21:44.240 --> 00:21:45.599 in addition to that 00:21:45.599 --> 00:21:52.470 student living apartments above those commercial uses quick 00:21:52.470 --> 00:21:54.599 background of the 00:21:54.599 --> 00:21:59.579 project in 2015 there was an application that was submitted 00:21:59.579 --> 00:22:02.440 z-15 29 that went 00:22:02.440 --> 00:22:06.359 through development review committee it was then forwarded 00:22:06.359 --> 00:22:07.599 to the planning zoning 00:22:07.599 --> 00:22:11.470 Commission for their consider your consideration at that 00:22:11.470 --> 00:22:12.359 meeting with the 00:22:12.359 --> 00:22:15.450 planning zoning Commission the Commission recommended 00:22:15.450 --> 00:22:17.039 denial 6 to 1 of 00:22:17.039 --> 00:22:21.470 that request following that planning zoning Commission it 00:22:21.470 --> 00:22:22.359 was then scheduled 00:22:22.359 --> 00:22:26.990 to go to City Council and after several meetings of postpon 00:22:26.990 --> 00:22:28.240 ement of the 00:22:28.240 --> 00:22:34.410 applicant requested that the item be withdrawn on April 8th 00:22:34.410 --> 00:22:36.279 of 2016 earlier 00:22:36.279 --> 00:22:40.880 this year the applicant chose to reapply for another 00:22:40.880 --> 00:22:42.920 amendment requests of the 00:22:42.920 --> 00:22:47.029 overlay and that occurred on April 8th of 2016 and that new 00:22:47.029 --> 00:22:49.160 case number is z-16 7 00:22:49.160 --> 00:22:51.970 which is in front of you today for your consideration the 00:22:51.970 --> 00:22:53.119 only difference 00:22:53.119 --> 00:22:56.160 between the first submittal and the second submittal is 00:22:56.160 --> 00:22:57.279 that the applicant 00:22:57.279 --> 00:23:01.670 has identified an additional 36 parking spaces which is 00:23:01.670 --> 00:23:03.279 located just north of 00:23:03.279 --> 00:23:08.099 the subject property north of Oak Street on this on the 00:23:08.099 --> 00:23:10.000 north east corner of 00:23:10.000 --> 00:23:16.269 Bryan and Oak Street so what does this mixed-use 00:23:16.269 --> 00:23:18.160 development comprise of it's 00:23:18.160 --> 00:23:21.619 a five-story mixed-use development it has student living 00:23:21.619 --> 00:23:22.759 apartments as you 00:23:22.759 --> 00:23:29.029 can see here just above the the commercial uses it compr 00:23:29.029 --> 00:23:29.680 ises of 00:23:29.680 --> 00:23:34.190 approximately 111,000 square feet each bedroom will be le 00:23:34.190 --> 00:23:35.160 ased out to 00:23:35.160 --> 00:23:39.440 individual students there are a total of 83 dwelling units 00:23:39.440 --> 00:23:42.279 nine two bedrooms 14 00:23:42.279 --> 00:23:48.410 three bedrooms and 64 bedroom units if you were to multiply 00:23:48.410 --> 00:23:49.160 that and add that 00:23:49.160 --> 00:23:53.250 all up that that calculates up to 300 bedrooms is what this 00:23:53.250 --> 00:23:53.960 proposed 00:23:53.960 --> 00:23:58.410 development is going to have the building height of the 00:23:58.410 --> 00:24:00.799 development is 62 00:24:00.799 --> 00:24:06.619 feet roughly from ground level to the top of the main 00:24:06.619 --> 00:24:09.000 building they're also 00:24:09.000 --> 00:24:12.579 proposing a parking garage which is going to be wrapped 00:24:12.579 --> 00:24:14.319 around except for an 00:24:14.319 --> 00:24:18.880 area to the west this area here will be visible it will not 00:24:18.880 --> 00:24:20.279 have anything in 00:24:20.279 --> 00:24:22.849 front of it so this is again the parking structure and the 00:24:22.849 --> 00:24:23.839 height of the parking 00:24:23.839 --> 00:24:27.660 commissioner that is 69 feet tall thank you chair I noticed 00:24:27.660 --> 00:24:29.839 it said that if this 00:24:29.839 --> 00:24:32.869 sub area see is approved that it could be up to six stories 00:24:32.869 --> 00:24:34.039 for the garage is 00:24:34.039 --> 00:24:37.960 that correct five stories at six stories you're correct for 00:24:37.960 --> 00:24:38.799 the garage oh yeah 00:24:38.799 --> 00:24:42.079 just for the garage okay so that options there later if 00:24:42.079 --> 00:24:43.119 they want to stack on 00:24:43.119 --> 00:24:46.319 that is what they're proposing now is my understanding so 00:24:46.319 --> 00:24:48.160 five story six story 00:24:48.160 --> 00:24:52.579 for the garage for the garage okay thank you so again the 00:24:52.579 --> 00:24:55.200 parking garage will 00:24:55.200 --> 00:25:00.609 have 217 parking spaces and the height of that garage will 00:25:00.609 --> 00:25:02.799 be 69.2 feet and 00:25:02.799 --> 00:25:06.039 that's measured right here where the people will be able 00:25:06.039 --> 00:25:07.440 students and other 00:25:07.440 --> 00:25:12.160 folks will be able to access an elevator 00:25:13.119 --> 00:25:16.990 as mentioned earlier retail will be allowed or not allowed 00:25:16.990 --> 00:25:17.920 but be part of 00:25:17.920 --> 00:25:21.230 this development boardman's as shown here will be located 00:25:21.230 --> 00:25:22.480 on the ground floor 00:25:22.480 --> 00:25:28.240 along Hickory Street this is Hickory here also subway or a 00:25:28.240 --> 00:25:29.119 restaurant will be 00:25:29.119 --> 00:25:34.980 part of this development that's approximately 1600 square 00:25:34.980 --> 00:25:35.640 feet of 00:25:35.640 --> 00:25:39.869 restaurant space in addition there will be five surface 00:25:39.869 --> 00:25:41.599 parking which is in just 00:25:41.599 --> 00:25:45.509 general area here just to the east of development and then 00:25:45.509 --> 00:25:46.400 again mentioned 00:25:46.400 --> 00:25:50.279 earlier 36 surface parking to the north of the project 00:25:50.279 --> 00:25:52.240 along north of Oak Street 00:25:52.240 --> 00:26:00.980 off-site so here are the standards that is being proposed 00:26:00.980 --> 00:26:03.119 currently we have two 00:26:03.119 --> 00:26:08.609 sub areas we have a sub area a which is everything outside 00:26:08.609 --> 00:26:10.160 of sub area B so 00:26:10.160 --> 00:26:14.619 anything that was in place with the five Street area is sub 00:26:14.619 --> 00:26:16.279 area a and then again 00:26:16.279 --> 00:26:20.019 in 2010 with the creation of sub area B they came up with 00:26:20.019 --> 00:26:21.480 their own standards 00:26:21.480 --> 00:26:25.369 and that's reflected here in this column what the applicant 00:26:25.369 --> 00:26:26.480 is proposing is 00:26:26.480 --> 00:26:31.779 sub area C and we'll start from left to right maximum 00:26:31.779 --> 00:26:34.000 building height sub area 00:26:34.000 --> 00:26:37.319 B I'm sorry sub area A is three stories with a maximum 00:26:37.319 --> 00:26:39.720 height of 45 feet the 00:26:39.720 --> 00:26:43.599 applicant is proposing five stories with the maximum height 00:26:43.599 --> 00:26:46.200 of 62.05 feet. Ron 00:26:46.200 --> 00:26:50.119 question for you please sir when was sub area A originally 00:26:50.119 --> 00:26:52.039 done? I want to say 00:26:52.039 --> 00:26:57.069 2000 around the update of the development code okay I know 00:26:57.069 --> 00:26:57.519 there was a 00:26:57.519 --> 00:27:00.539 small area plan in 99 and I believe that the overlay 00:27:00.539 --> 00:27:02.200 district followed soon after 00:27:02.200 --> 00:27:07.960 okay and then B was done when? 2010. 2010 okay so we're 15 00:27:07.960 --> 00:27:09.160 years down the road and 00:27:09.160 --> 00:27:13.799 five years after B and we're getting taller each time 00:27:13.799 --> 00:27:17.119 correct okay the parking 00:27:17.119 --> 00:27:21.789 garage for sub area A is 45 feet the applicant is proposing 00:27:21.789 --> 00:27:23.039 six stories as 00:27:23.039 --> 00:27:30.119 Commissioner Beck alluded up to 69.2 feet the the density 00:27:30.119 --> 00:27:34.279 as calculated in sub area A. Commissioner Ellis. Thank you 00:27:34.279 --> 00:27:35.240 chair. Hi Ron 00:27:35.240 --> 00:27:39.400 thanks quick question just so I understand is sub area B 00:27:39.400 --> 00:27:40.720 simply that 00:27:40.720 --> 00:27:43.710 youth center development? Correct. That is that outline 00:27:43.710 --> 00:27:45.000 that I showed earlier is 00:27:45.000 --> 00:27:48.660 the youth center development. Is sub area B? Correct. And 00:27:48.660 --> 00:27:50.059 there is no sub area C? 00:27:50.059 --> 00:27:53.079 There is not. They're trying to create sub area C with this 00:27:53.079 --> 00:27:53.960 proposal? That's 00:27:53.960 --> 00:27:58.000 correct. Okay thank you thank you. Maximum density for sub 00:27:58.000 --> 00:27:58.960 area A is based on 00:27:58.960 --> 00:28:02.240 development standards you know meeting parking requirements 00:28:02.240 --> 00:28:03.359 the lock coverage 00:28:03.359 --> 00:28:07.279 all that and that will dictate what that dwelling per acre 00:28:07.279 --> 00:28:09.400 unit count would be. 00:28:09.400 --> 00:28:14.130 Sub area proposed sub area C is proposing up to 86 dwelling 00:28:14.130 --> 00:28:16.319 units per acre. Again the 00:28:16.319 --> 00:28:21.440 the total acreage for that development is 1.75 acres with 00:28:21.440 --> 00:28:23.519 roughly a 00:28:23.519 --> 00:28:27.440 number of dwelling units associated with that project. Park 00:28:27.440 --> 00:28:29.440 ing ratio the parking 00:28:29.440 --> 00:28:34.309 ratio for sub area A is one space per bedroom for units 00:28:34.309 --> 00:28:36.079 that have two bedrooms 00:28:36.079 --> 00:28:39.779 or more so if they have a two-bedroom unit they need to 00:28:39.779 --> 00:28:40.640 provide two parking 00:28:40.640 --> 00:28:43.450 spaces if they have a three-bedroom unit they would have to 00:28:43.450 --> 00:28:44.559 provide three parking 00:28:44.559 --> 00:28:48.240 spaces up to four and four units of course would have to 00:28:48.240 --> 00:28:48.680 provide four 00:28:48.680 --> 00:28:53.039 parking spaces. The applicant is proposing that that ratio 00:28:53.039 --> 00:28:54.799 be reduced to 00:28:54.799 --> 00:29:03.240 0.76 spaces per bedroom. Commissioner Rossell. Is there a 00:29:03.240 --> 00:29:04.960 parking ratio for one 00:29:04.960 --> 00:29:07.880 bedrooms there's no one bedrooms allowed? There is one 00:29:07.880 --> 00:29:09.880 bedroom in the current 00:29:09.880 --> 00:29:16.500 standards and let me see if I can find that for you. It's 00:29:16.500 --> 00:29:18.279 one bedroom would be 00:29:18.279 --> 00:29:24.799 1.5 space per unit. Okay thank you. One other question on 00:29:24.799 --> 00:29:25.640 the parking room is 00:29:25.640 --> 00:29:29.509 the parking figured on all of the surface parking so the 00:29:29.509 --> 00:29:30.640 five spaces the 00:29:30.640 --> 00:29:34.240 36 spaces and then whatever is internal as well? Correct 00:29:34.240 --> 00:29:35.720 whatever total they have 00:29:35.720 --> 00:29:37.500 that they're providing would be a factor in that 00:29:37.500 --> 00:29:38.720 calculation. So even though the 00:29:38.720 --> 00:29:42.490 five spaces are more than likely kind of serving the retail 00:29:42.490 --> 00:29:43.680 they're including 00:29:43.680 --> 00:29:46.359 that in this calculation? Correct and I've got a slide that 00:29:46.359 --> 00:29:47.359 explains how that's all broken. 00:29:47.359 --> 00:29:49.670 It's hard to get ahead of you. No that's fine. Commissioner 00:29:49.670 --> 00:29:50.799 Sullivan. Will the 00:29:50.799 --> 00:29:54.240 off-site parking be somewhat restricted? I mean would it be 00:29:54.240 --> 00:29:55.039 restricted to 00:29:55.039 --> 00:29:59.200 apartment people only? That is. Or will it be open for 00:29:59.200 --> 00:30:00.720 anyone like on the surface 00:30:00.720 --> 00:30:03.980 the five lots how are they going to regulate that? That is 00:30:03.980 --> 00:30:04.680 a question I had 00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:06.670 with the applicant and they may want to clarify that during 00:30:06.670 --> 00:30:07.400 the public hearing 00:30:07.400 --> 00:30:11.420 but my understanding is it's going to be gated and there'll 00:30:11.420 --> 00:30:13.480 be only used by the 00:30:13.480 --> 00:30:19.750 people that occupy that space or that development. A couple 00:30:19.750 --> 00:30:21.079 other things that 00:30:21.079 --> 00:30:24.640 they're proposing either increase or decrease. Building 00:30:24.640 --> 00:30:26.240 coverage going from 50 00:30:26.240 --> 00:30:31.440 to 70 for residential mixed-use building coverage 80 to 81. 00:30:31.440 --> 00:30:33.200 Minimum landscape area. 00:30:33.200 --> 00:30:37.740 The requirement for the sub area A is 15 percent. They're 00:30:37.740 --> 00:30:39.460 proposing a 10.7 00:30:39.460 --> 00:30:45.099 percent landscape area and then a rear set backyard would 00:30:45.099 --> 00:30:46.279 be a reduction from 00:30:46.279 --> 00:30:55.349 10 to 5 feet for sub area C. So this is the parking slide. 00:30:55.349 --> 00:30:56.759 Commissioner 00:30:56.759 --> 00:31:00.740 Strange regarding what is going to be required for each 00:31:00.740 --> 00:31:02.799 type of use. The first 00:31:02.799 --> 00:31:08.509 one is what's currently required as part of sub area A. 00:31:08.509 --> 00:31:10.839 With retail at four one 00:31:10.839 --> 00:31:14.599 space per 400 they're required 27. With the restaurant 00:31:14.599 --> 00:31:15.880 again one space per 400 00:31:15.880 --> 00:31:21.160 that's five and then the 300 bedrooms would require one 00:31:21.160 --> 00:31:22.400 space per bedroom and 00:31:22.400 --> 00:31:27.319 obviously that would be 300 so a total 332. With the 00:31:27.319 --> 00:31:29.160 proposed changes in the 00:31:29.160 --> 00:31:32.509 parking requirement similar they're not proposing to change 00:31:32.509 --> 00:31:33.480 anything with 00:31:33.480 --> 00:31:36.930 regards to retail or restaurant but they are dropping the 00:31:36.930 --> 00:31:38.400 requirement for 00:31:38.400 --> 00:31:44.779 bedrooms again two bedrooms or more from 1 to 0.76 space 00:31:44.779 --> 00:31:45.839 per bedroom that will 00:31:45.839 --> 00:31:52.250 equates to 100 I'm sorry 228. You total that up that's 62 I 00:31:52.250 --> 00:31:54.319 'm sorry 260 spaces 00:31:54.319 --> 00:32:00.589 and the difference there is 72 spaces from the two 00:32:00.589 --> 00:32:04.680 requirements. Does anybody 00:32:04.680 --> 00:32:07.359 have any questions on the parking requirements before I 00:32:07.359 --> 00:32:07.880 move on to 00:32:07.880 --> 00:32:11.069 consideration? I have one other follow-up. Do we know and 00:32:11.069 --> 00:32:12.279 this may be need to go 00:32:12.279 --> 00:32:15.759 to the applicant are the parking spaces included in their 00:32:15.759 --> 00:32:16.640 standard rental 00:32:16.640 --> 00:32:19.809 agreement or parking space is going to be an additional 00:32:19.809 --> 00:32:23.440 charge? I don't know that. 00:32:23.440 --> 00:32:26.440 If not we can wait till public hearing I'll ask that 00:32:26.440 --> 00:32:27.880 question. Sounds good. 00:32:27.880 --> 00:32:35.599 Thank you. Back to the availability of the parking area so 00:32:35.599 --> 00:32:36.319 the retail and 00:32:36.319 --> 00:32:39.200 restaurant are going to be able to use the parking garage 00:32:39.200 --> 00:32:40.960 just like the 00:32:40.960 --> 00:32:45.119 occupants of the apartments. That's correct. So that anyone 00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:46.440 basically could go 00:32:46.440 --> 00:32:49.210 in park and say I'm gonna go to the bookstore go to the 00:32:49.210 --> 00:32:50.319 bookstore and then 00:32:50.319 --> 00:32:52.980 have all four classes for four or five hours. That's 00:32:52.980 --> 00:32:54.200 something we can ask the 00:32:54.200 --> 00:32:58.319 applicant I know another student living apartments 00:32:58.319 --> 00:32:59.960 especially that have parking 00:32:59.960 --> 00:33:03.369 garages they limit the use of that from just for the first 00:33:03.369 --> 00:33:04.480 floor and then maybe 00:33:04.480 --> 00:33:08.079 the upper floor parking garage is allowed it's gated so 00:33:08.079 --> 00:33:08.960 that it would only 00:33:08.960 --> 00:33:12.640 be allowed to the residents but you're correct if it is 00:33:12.640 --> 00:33:13.359 available for the 00:33:13.359 --> 00:33:17.059 public that could be a possibility but we certainly can ask 00:33:17.059 --> 00:33:17.799 and verify that 00:33:17.799 --> 00:33:24.400 with the applicant. Okay. So as far as consideration the 00:33:24.400 --> 00:33:25.799 development does 00:33:25.799 --> 00:33:29.200 encourage you know walking and bicycling it's it's 00:33:29.200 --> 00:33:30.799 obviously improving the the 00:33:30.799 --> 00:33:34.319 site what it is currently it's also providing extended 00:33:34.319 --> 00:33:35.319 building setbacks 00:33:35.319 --> 00:33:39.359 from Oak and Hickory so they're setting back the building I 00:33:39.359 --> 00:33:40.599 think they were 00:33:40.599 --> 00:33:46.869 trying to mimic what the youth center did in Hickory. The 00:33:46.869 --> 00:33:47.559 proposed development 00:33:47.559 --> 00:33:50.720 would keep some commercial uses which is something that's a 00:33:50.720 --> 00:33:52.079 positive thing again 00:33:52.079 --> 00:33:54.769 board members would be on Hickory as well as the the 00:33:54.769 --> 00:33:56.119 restaurant use would be 00:33:56.119 --> 00:34:01.289 adjacent to Hickory Street as well. However the height and 00:34:01.289 --> 00:34:02.799 density of the 00:34:02.799 --> 00:34:06.250 development it's not compatible with surrounding areas the 00:34:06.250 --> 00:34:07.039 height of the 00:34:07.039 --> 00:34:11.699 youth center is at 55 it's four stories other developments 00:34:11.699 --> 00:34:12.719 in the area are 00:34:12.719 --> 00:34:15.750 roughly three stories you know so less than what they're 00:34:15.750 --> 00:34:17.400 proposing. Parking 00:34:17.400 --> 00:34:24.280 requirements in the Fry overlay overlay street district is 00:34:24.280 --> 00:34:26.239 purposely and 00:34:26.239 --> 00:34:30.340 purpose and intent is to have parking for residents and so 00:34:30.340 --> 00:34:31.800 that was an increase 00:34:31.800 --> 00:34:38.320 compared to other areas in the city. It also the purpose of 00:34:38.320 --> 00:34:38.400 the 00:34:38.400 --> 00:34:41.179 Fry Street overlay district is also to reduce the parking 00:34:41.179 --> 00:34:42.119 requirements for 00:34:42.119 --> 00:34:46.780 retail and restaurant and it is compared to other parts of 00:34:46.780 --> 00:34:48.960 the city. As far as 00:34:48.960 --> 00:34:53.559 solid waste there is a requirement that the solid waste 00:34:53.559 --> 00:34:56.440 trucks be access the 00:34:56.440 --> 00:35:01.760 either the containers themselves or if it's a compactor 00:35:01.760 --> 00:35:04.199 without having to have 00:35:04.199 --> 00:35:09.420 any assistance by the management. We haven't gone to a 00:35:09.420 --> 00:35:10.840 solution or gone a 00:35:10.840 --> 00:35:14.860 solution yet the site plan does not reflect a solution and 00:35:14.860 --> 00:35:15.719 that's that's 00:35:15.719 --> 00:35:19.760 one consideration we need to be mindful of. Ron I'm sorry 00:35:19.760 --> 00:35:20.480 to interject would 00:35:20.480 --> 00:35:24.090 you just specify what they're proposing in terms of their 00:35:24.090 --> 00:35:25.719 rollout carts? Yes it 00:35:25.719 --> 00:35:28.809 is my understanding that they're proposing containers and 00:35:28.809 --> 00:35:29.559 that they're 00:35:29.559 --> 00:35:32.840 going to be stored in the parking garage. The amount I'm 00:35:32.840 --> 00:35:34.000 not sure I can I can 00:35:34.000 --> 00:35:37.389 verify that I think it's four containers and what they're 00:35:37.389 --> 00:35:38.599 proposing is they would 00:35:38.599 --> 00:35:43.519 roll those out to the either the driveway or the fire lane 00:35:43.519 --> 00:35:44.559 or parking 00:35:44.559 --> 00:35:49.250 space and during the hours of when the park of when the 00:35:49.250 --> 00:35:51.280 trash trucks would be 00:35:51.280 --> 00:35:54.980 servicing that development and then rolling them back in 00:35:54.980 --> 00:35:56.280 after they have been 00:35:56.280 --> 00:36:01.170 emptied. That is currently what's proposed our solid waste 00:36:01.170 --> 00:36:02.199 department has 00:36:02.199 --> 00:36:06.539 reviewed that and is still considering other options but 00:36:06.539 --> 00:36:07.719 again there's solid 00:36:07.719 --> 00:36:11.110 waste requirements have not been met at this point. 00:36:11.110 --> 00:36:12.559 Commissioner Bec. Thank you 00:36:12.559 --> 00:36:15.369 Chair. Dimensionally how big are these rollout trash 00:36:15.369 --> 00:36:17.440 barrels are they for the 00:36:17.440 --> 00:36:22.039 whole apartment complex? Correct. Do we know how big they 00:36:22.039 --> 00:36:23.920 are? I know they fit in 00:36:23.920 --> 00:36:27.960 an integral do you correct me if I'm wrong they're roughly 00:36:27.960 --> 00:36:29.719 four by six. I 00:36:29.719 --> 00:36:33.159 guess where I'm going with this too would they sit out on 00:36:33.159 --> 00:36:33.800 the street easily 00:36:33.800 --> 00:36:37.269 without being an obstruction of any kind? The ones that I 00:36:37.269 --> 00:36:38.760 've seen of the Frye 00:36:38.760 --> 00:36:42.329 Street development one block over has a similar concept 00:36:42.329 --> 00:36:43.880 where they have the 00:36:43.880 --> 00:36:46.460 apartments themselves have chutes that drop down to the 00:36:46.460 --> 00:36:49.480 garage level and into a 00:36:49.480 --> 00:36:55.530 rollout dumpster container and they're about two to maybe 00:36:55.530 --> 00:36:57.559 two cubic yards at the 00:36:57.559 --> 00:36:59.710 most or not too big because you know they're not going to 00:36:59.710 --> 00:37:00.440 be able to roll it 00:37:00.440 --> 00:37:05.840 out to the compactor that they do have on site to unload 00:37:05.840 --> 00:37:08.599 onto that but solid 00:37:08.599 --> 00:37:14.869 waste is concerned is that they're not adequate to 00:37:14.869 --> 00:37:16.559 withstand abuse that the 00:37:16.559 --> 00:37:22.989 dumpster vehicles can can apply on to them. I actually I 00:37:22.989 --> 00:37:24.599 noticed at the Frye 00:37:24.599 --> 00:37:28.280 Street apartment site this morning was that they have a 00:37:28.280 --> 00:37:29.800 little area that's like 00:37:29.800 --> 00:37:32.969 we call it the dumpster graveyard where there's a bunch of 00:37:32.969 --> 00:37:34.199 rollout containers 00:37:34.199 --> 00:37:38.800 that are damaged the wheels are missing they're damaged and 00:37:38.800 --> 00:37:39.639 they just 00:37:39.639 --> 00:37:43.320 lay it on the side so and that's just you know damage from 00:37:43.320 --> 00:37:45.119 rolling it out to 00:37:45.119 --> 00:37:48.360 their compactor and unloading it doesn't even account for. 00:37:48.360 --> 00:37:48.960 Are they metal or 00:37:48.960 --> 00:37:52.400 plastic? They're metal. Okay but again are they and they're 00:37:52.400 --> 00:37:53.239 going to be rolled out 00:37:53.239 --> 00:37:56.340 to the street for the trucks to pick up? I believe that's 00:37:56.340 --> 00:37:57.440 their intent. And you 00:37:57.440 --> 00:38:02.510 don't think they're gonna they're too big? The issue that 00:38:02.510 --> 00:38:03.880 we have is that if 00:38:03.880 --> 00:38:06.849 they do roll it out well that's the primary access to the 00:38:06.849 --> 00:38:07.880 parking garage so 00:38:07.880 --> 00:38:10.460 there's gonna be a lot of traffic having to weave around 00:38:10.460 --> 00:38:11.400 there and you know it's 00:38:11.400 --> 00:38:14.389 a coordination nightmare with solid waste because there 00:38:14.389 --> 00:38:15.440 could be instances 00:38:15.440 --> 00:38:18.019 where there's issues with the dumpster vehicle and they can 00:38:18.019 --> 00:38:19.000 't you know service 00:38:19.000 --> 00:38:21.190 it at that time well for whatever reason or they're running 00:38:21.190 --> 00:38:21.960 behind schedule or 00:38:21.960 --> 00:38:25.690 not and then there's also potential damage to the container 00:38:25.690 --> 00:38:26.280 themselves and 00:38:26.280 --> 00:38:30.539 who's liable to replace them. Is it the city or is it you 00:38:30.539 --> 00:38:31.280 know the management company? 00:38:31.280 --> 00:38:35.199 Thank you. And Commissioner Beck just to add on to that 00:38:35.199 --> 00:38:36.800 again this whole site 00:38:36.800 --> 00:38:40.090 plan has been routed through the relevant department such 00:38:40.090 --> 00:38:40.840 as solid waste 00:38:40.840 --> 00:38:43.429 engineering. Earl has been kind enough to fill that 00:38:43.429 --> 00:38:45.039 information in but again the 00:38:45.039 --> 00:38:47.960 the resolution to that has to come from the solid waste 00:38:47.960 --> 00:38:49.199 department as well so 00:38:49.199 --> 00:38:51.909 there are some contingencies that would have to be 00:38:51.909 --> 00:38:53.400 evaluated should the site 00:38:53.400 --> 00:38:59.239 plan move forward. Just to clarify Commissioner Beck the 00:38:59.239 --> 00:39:00.000 proposal is to 00:39:00.000 --> 00:39:04.289 roll those containers to the drive aisle that's just east 00:39:04.289 --> 00:39:05.440 of the property not on 00:39:05.440 --> 00:39:10.800 to Hickory or Oak it's the drive out next to the on the 00:39:10.800 --> 00:39:14.159 property. Correct. 00:39:14.519 --> 00:39:20.389 Another consideration is the need for a 10-foot clearance 00:39:20.389 --> 00:39:21.800 around the entire 00:39:21.800 --> 00:39:26.019 building. Right now the building as it is proposed on the 00:39:26.019 --> 00:39:27.719 site plan sits five feet 00:39:27.719 --> 00:39:31.480 from the property line to the west and that is something 00:39:31.480 --> 00:39:32.440 that the fire 00:39:32.440 --> 00:39:35.679 department needs is a 10-foot clearance. Now the fire 00:39:35.679 --> 00:39:36.920 department has allowed 00:39:36.920 --> 00:39:39.989 developments occur five feet but with some sort of 00:39:39.989 --> 00:39:41.519 agreement by the property 00:39:41.519 --> 00:39:45.510 adjacent stating that they will not build up to that 00:39:45.510 --> 00:39:46.800 property so that again 00:39:46.800 --> 00:39:50.489 the purpose is to make sure that the fire department has 00:39:50.489 --> 00:39:51.840 adequate access to 00:39:51.840 --> 00:39:56.300 all sides of the building and that still has not been a 00:39:56.300 --> 00:39:58.440 receiver obtained as of 00:39:58.440 --> 00:40:03.260 today and that's my understanding. Commissioner Beck. Thank 00:40:03.260 --> 00:40:04.559 you Chair. Are 00:40:04.559 --> 00:40:08.280 these particular problems inherent with this particular 00:40:08.280 --> 00:40:09.679 building its size and 00:40:09.679 --> 00:40:14.530 dimensions or would sub area A and B run into similar 00:40:14.530 --> 00:40:17.360 problems? I don't think sub 00:40:17.360 --> 00:40:21.559 area A I'm sorry sub area B that development had this issue 00:40:21.559 --> 00:40:23.679 with with the 00:40:23.679 --> 00:40:26.789 the property because it obviously surround and the whole 00:40:26.789 --> 00:40:27.639 development is 00:40:27.639 --> 00:40:32.960 surrounded by streets. The as far as the solid waste I 00:40:32.960 --> 00:40:34.800 think they designed their 00:40:34.800 --> 00:40:37.690 development to have adequate access so that was not a 00:40:37.690 --> 00:40:39.119 concern or an issue at 00:40:39.119 --> 00:40:43.940 that time of that review of that property. So in part these 00:40:43.940 --> 00:40:44.599 problems are 00:40:44.599 --> 00:40:48.079 inherent with this design? I would say that's a fair 00:40:48.079 --> 00:40:53.000 assessment. Thank you. Some 00:40:53.000 --> 00:40:57.510 other considerations is that the the continuous amendment 00:40:57.510 --> 00:40:58.840 of the Fry Street 00:40:58.840 --> 00:41:01.900 overlay district would compromise the compatibility of 00:41:01.900 --> 00:41:03.960 adjacent land uses but 00:41:03.960 --> 00:41:06.969 also would compromise really the purpose and intent of the 00:41:06.969 --> 00:41:08.440 the district itself 00:41:08.440 --> 00:41:14.710 I think it was done back in 2000 however you know we we 00:41:14.710 --> 00:41:16.639 recognize that there is 00:41:16.639 --> 00:41:20.320 change in the market but again the district was established 00:41:20.320 --> 00:41:21.239 back then and I 00:41:21.239 --> 00:41:24.239 think there's some merits to keeping the purpose and intent 00:41:24.239 --> 00:41:26.760 . The proposed amendment 00:41:26.760 --> 00:41:29.280 and associate development standards are not consistent with 00:41:29.280 --> 00:41:30.559 the Denham plan 2030 00:41:30.559 --> 00:41:35.130 in regards to gradual transition the scale and character of 00:41:35.130 --> 00:41:36.800 the area. Again 00:41:36.800 --> 00:41:41.170 addressing potential impacts adjacent neighborhood such as 00:41:41.170 --> 00:41:43.239 parking or shade 00:41:43.239 --> 00:41:48.889 issues that may arise from the proposed development. Not 00:41:48.889 --> 00:41:51.039 ifications were sent out 00:41:51.039 --> 00:41:57.309 to property owners 200 feet and 500 feet from the overlay 00:41:57.309 --> 00:41:59.440 district boundary. We 00:41:59.440 --> 00:42:02.489 felt that it was important to notify the entire overlay 00:42:02.489 --> 00:42:03.840 district because it does 00:42:03.840 --> 00:42:08.570 impact them. We sent out 51 notification through certified 00:42:08.570 --> 00:42:11.199 and 124 through regular 00:42:11.199 --> 00:42:15.590 mail. As of this afternoon we received two in favor and two 00:42:15.590 --> 00:42:16.800 in opposition and 00:42:16.800 --> 00:42:21.150 you should have copies of the responses in front of you for 00:42:21.150 --> 00:42:23.239 consideration. Ron 00:42:23.239 --> 00:42:27.000 could I stop you? Will you go back one slide on the where 00:42:27.000 --> 00:42:28.480 this is not 00:42:28.480 --> 00:42:32.199 consistent with Denham 2030? Yes sir. Do we have any 00:42:32.199 --> 00:42:33.920 specifics of where it's not 00:42:33.920 --> 00:42:39.400 consistent with 2030? Well the maintaining of the character 00:42:39.400 --> 00:42:39.679 of the 00:42:39.679 --> 00:42:43.119 area I think there's language in the Denham plan 2030 that 00:42:43.119 --> 00:42:43.519 talks about 00:42:43.519 --> 00:42:47.960 compatibility of an area and this area is actually 00:42:47.960 --> 00:42:50.159 designated as the neighborhood 00:42:50.159 --> 00:42:54.889 and university compatibility area and it calls out for 00:42:54.889 --> 00:42:57.420 certain guidelines to to 00:42:57.420 --> 00:43:00.849 make sure that the area is compatible with the surrounding 00:43:00.849 --> 00:43:01.800 areas and I felt 00:43:01.800 --> 00:43:05.429 that this was a little bit over what the compatibility 00:43:05.429 --> 00:43:07.360 should be for a project 00:43:07.360 --> 00:43:12.750 in this area. Okay well let me follow up a little more then 00:43:12.750 --> 00:43:14.760 . Area B is in place 00:43:14.760 --> 00:43:20.840 prior to 2030 being adopted. Correct. I mean this is it's 00:43:20.840 --> 00:43:21.840 not exactly the same 00:43:21.840 --> 00:43:24.730 but it's very similar we're talking a few feet height 00:43:24.730 --> 00:43:26.000 differences and maybe 00:43:26.000 --> 00:43:30.730 some other things on parking percentages so if it's okay in 00:43:30.730 --> 00:43:32.599 sub area B and we 00:43:32.599 --> 00:43:36.539 have that in place and we do 2030 why is this such a 00:43:36.539 --> 00:43:38.519 difference or what is 00:43:38.519 --> 00:43:42.500 the main difference between this and B that makes it such a 00:43:42.500 --> 00:43:43.960 no longer consistent 00:43:43.960 --> 00:43:47.360 with Denham plan 2030? Well that that youth center is just 00:43:47.360 --> 00:43:48.559 one development 00:43:48.559 --> 00:43:52.889 obviously that was approved and recommended approval for 00:43:52.889 --> 00:43:53.300 that 00:43:53.300 --> 00:43:55.900 development occur. We also have to look at the other areas 00:43:55.900 --> 00:43:57.519 around there. Now the 00:43:57.519 --> 00:44:01.949 difference between the two one is four stories this is five 00:44:01.949 --> 00:44:03.719 stories you know 00:44:03.719 --> 00:44:07.900 the parking that they have there is one to one this is not 00:44:07.900 --> 00:44:09.760 so there's some 00:44:09.760 --> 00:44:12.599 differences may not be significant but there's enough 00:44:12.599 --> 00:44:13.800 significance that warrants 00:44:13.800 --> 00:44:18.260 the difference between the two is significant to not meet 00:44:18.260 --> 00:44:18.920 the character of 00:44:18.920 --> 00:44:26.079 the area. Okay thank you. Yes I'm sorry Commissioner Rosse 00:44:26.079 --> 00:44:27.360 au. I think I have 00:44:27.360 --> 00:44:31.090 several questions and I hope I get them all straight so 00:44:31.090 --> 00:44:32.679 forgive me if I don't 00:44:32.679 --> 00:44:40.760 but a couple things part of this proposal includes area 00:44:40.760 --> 00:44:42.239 outside the 00:44:42.239 --> 00:44:46.960 Fry Street overlay district correct? Does that correct? Yes 00:44:46.960 --> 00:44:49.119 to the north. Are we able to 00:44:49.119 --> 00:44:52.849 what's the implications of something outside the district 00:44:52.849 --> 00:44:54.159 overlay being part 00:44:54.159 --> 00:44:56.530 of a sub area of that district overlay? Are we now 00:44:56.530 --> 00:44:57.719 including that in the district? 00:44:57.719 --> 00:45:04.159 No the the the overlay district itself has built in a 00:45:04.159 --> 00:45:05.559 requirement or a 00:45:05.559 --> 00:45:09.889 standard that allows for additional parking to be off site 00:45:09.889 --> 00:45:11.239 of the project and 00:45:11.239 --> 00:45:13.800 it has to be within a thousand feet so it meets that 00:45:13.800 --> 00:45:14.920 requirement so any 00:45:14.920 --> 00:45:18.070 additional parking could be located outside the subject 00:45:18.070 --> 00:45:19.119 area. Okay. 00:45:19.119 --> 00:45:25.500 Why was it not included in the notification map? Should 00:45:25.500 --> 00:45:26.119 that off-site 00:45:26.119 --> 00:45:29.340 parking should the neighbors of that not be told that that 00:45:29.340 --> 00:45:31.519 could be parking? Well 00:45:31.519 --> 00:45:34.940 they well they're they're kind of but you're again we're 00:45:34.940 --> 00:45:36.199 looking at the overlay 00:45:36.199 --> 00:45:38.980 we're mending the overlay district and again any 00:45:38.980 --> 00:45:40.760 development within the overlay 00:45:40.760 --> 00:45:44.280 district if they were required parking spaces and they 00:45:44.280 --> 00:45:45.199 needed additional 00:45:45.199 --> 00:45:48.409 parking spaces they can get parking spaces again as far as 00:45:48.409 --> 00:45:49.519 a thousand feet 00:45:49.519 --> 00:45:53.440 from that subject parcel. So if they did move it a thousand 00:45:53.440 --> 00:45:55.719 feet away that 00:45:55.719 --> 00:45:59.800 surrounding area the 200 feet around that parking spot 00:45:59.800 --> 00:46:01.360 would not be notified 00:46:01.360 --> 00:46:07.570 within this proposal? Correct. They all we're all we're 00:46:07.570 --> 00:46:09.079 trying to do is what's 00:46:09.079 --> 00:46:12.230 being proposed that is is an amendment to the overlay 00:46:12.230 --> 00:46:13.519 district and what's 00:46:13.519 --> 00:46:16.760 required of this area here and again in the overlay 00:46:16.760 --> 00:46:18.559 district there is language 00:46:18.559 --> 00:46:22.079 that speaks to that additional parking spaces can be from 00:46:22.079 --> 00:46:23.400 any property as long 00:46:23.400 --> 00:46:26.400 as it's within a thousand feet of that subject project. 00:46:26.400 --> 00:46:28.719 Okay I understand 00:46:28.719 --> 00:46:31.239 you're saying that it doesn't resonate with me necessarily 00:46:31.239 --> 00:46:32.199 that the notification 00:46:32.199 --> 00:46:35.420 map doesn't get bumped out a little bit for land being 00:46:35.420 --> 00:46:37.519 changed. Right let me try 00:46:37.519 --> 00:46:40.650 and address that that's because the overlay district the 00:46:40.650 --> 00:46:41.679 Fry Street overlay 00:46:41.679 --> 00:46:44.900 district is a zoning category in itself. Okay. The parking 00:46:44.900 --> 00:46:46.119 the proposed off-site 00:46:46.119 --> 00:46:50.969 parking that is shown or reflected the additional 36 wrong 00:46:50.969 --> 00:46:52.559 spaces. 36 yes. That 00:46:52.559 --> 00:46:55.800 the one the use is permitted off-site regardless so there's 00:46:55.800 --> 00:46:56.639 no issue with that 00:46:56.639 --> 00:46:59.750 there is no change to the boundary of that zoning district 00:46:59.750 --> 00:47:00.559 of the overlay 00:47:00.559 --> 00:47:03.550 district so let's use an example where there wasn't an 00:47:03.550 --> 00:47:05.159 overlay district and an 00:47:05.159 --> 00:47:08.780 applicant came in to change a zoning on a property and the 00:47:08.780 --> 00:47:09.960 zoning was permitted 00:47:09.960 --> 00:47:12.630 but they also needed X amount of parking and they located 00:47:12.630 --> 00:47:13.760 an off-site if that 00:47:13.760 --> 00:47:16.840 off-site parking area was permitted by the existing zoning 00:47:16.840 --> 00:47:18.079 district it wouldn't 00:47:18.079 --> 00:47:21.280 warrant any type of notification. I got you thank you and 00:47:21.280 --> 00:47:23.639 then separately from 00:47:23.639 --> 00:47:28.280 this can you go back to the proposed ratio of parking that 00:47:28.280 --> 00:47:29.079 they're wanting to 00:47:29.079 --> 00:47:36.289 amend to or proposed to. This bottom right bottom row here? 00:47:36.289 --> 00:47:38.239 Yes that's 76 so 00:47:38.239 --> 00:47:41.699 this is a good slide because on their narrative they 00:47:41.699 --> 00:47:43.320 identify two main 00:47:43.320 --> 00:47:47.579 components but the city has nine changes and so it seems 00:47:47.579 --> 00:47:49.079 like they simplified it 00:47:49.079 --> 00:47:52.530 to two main components but the two main components say that 00:47:52.530 --> 00:47:53.360 they're wanting to 00:47:53.360 --> 00:47:55.960 increase the permitted height to 58 feet which is not what 00:47:55.960 --> 00:47:57.239 's up here and it says 00:47:57.239 --> 00:48:00.030 they want to reduce their off-site parking or the required 00:48:00.030 --> 00:48:00.679 off-street 00:48:00.679 --> 00:48:06.119 parking to 0.84% which is not right here so can where's the 00:48:06.119 --> 00:48:09.840 discrepancy between these two reports? That and they'll 00:48:09.840 --> 00:48:11.119 probably be able to 00:48:11.119 --> 00:48:13.800 answer that during the public hearing the the submittal 00:48:13.800 --> 00:48:15.960 changed obviously with 00:48:15.960 --> 00:48:21.400 with the the addition of the 36 parking spaces and they 00:48:21.400 --> 00:48:22.679 happen to upload 00:48:22.679 --> 00:48:26.199 probably the same narrative that may be the reason why you 00:48:26.199 --> 00:48:26.840 have that 00:48:26.840 --> 00:48:31.260 discrepancy but the actual code amendment that they supply 00:48:31.260 --> 00:48:31.760 and that we 00:48:31.760 --> 00:48:34.809 reviewed is reflected in this slide here and that's what's 00:48:34.809 --> 00:48:35.960 being proposed. So they 00:48:35.960 --> 00:48:38.460 just submitted the same narrative? That's something maybe 00:48:38.460 --> 00:48:39.400 we can clarify but 00:48:39.400 --> 00:48:42.559 that's okay that could be the case. Okay thank you. 00:48:42.559 --> 00:48:44.639 Commissioner Sullivan back to 00:48:44.639 --> 00:48:49.840 the parking it appears that Bryan and Oak Street there's 00:48:49.840 --> 00:48:50.719 already a parking lot 00:48:50.719 --> 00:48:54.070 there correct is that you understand that is correct that 00:48:54.070 --> 00:48:54.679 is so they're just 00:48:54.679 --> 00:48:57.780 going to be buying using leasing whatever is that parking 00:48:57.780 --> 00:48:58.519 space that's 00:48:58.519 --> 00:49:01.480 already there? They've actually yes I've checked the 00:49:01.480 --> 00:49:05.639 then Parasol district and the property owner that owns that 00:49:05.639 --> 00:49:06.280 sub the sub 00:49:06.280 --> 00:49:09.239 property also owns that property. Okay so Mr. Roselle's 00:49:09.239 --> 00:49:11.000 point probably why they 00:49:11.000 --> 00:49:13.440 didn't need to have the notification is that it's already 00:49:13.440 --> 00:49:15.480 parking lot. Does that make sense? 00:49:15.480 --> 00:49:20.119 That's part of it yes. But as Manal mentioned you know it's 00:49:20.119 --> 00:49:21.559 a 00:49:21.559 --> 00:49:25.219 requirement not a requirement but rather an opportunity to 00:49:25.219 --> 00:49:26.239 to look at additional 00:49:26.239 --> 00:49:30.760 parking it can be as far as a thousand feet. Okay just 00:49:30.760 --> 00:49:31.760 wanted to clarify that. Commissioner Ellis. 00:49:31.760 --> 00:49:35.820 Thank you chair okay so the additional parking lot is a 00:49:35.820 --> 00:49:37.719 parking lot now used 00:49:37.719 --> 00:49:42.389 for whom? My understanding it's used by Fortman's bookstore 00:49:42.389 --> 00:49:42.800 that's my 00:49:42.800 --> 00:49:45.099 understanding we can certainly clarify that with the 00:49:45.099 --> 00:49:46.199 applicant. Right because 00:49:46.199 --> 00:49:48.510 if we're taking away a parking lot and dedicating it to 00:49:48.510 --> 00:49:49.519 this development then 00:49:49.519 --> 00:49:52.269 we're taking away parking right we're actually not adding 00:49:52.269 --> 00:49:54.000 parking. Right well 00:49:54.000 --> 00:49:58.000 yes I mean it's it's it's parking now and it's being used 00:49:58.000 --> 00:49:59.119 by Fortman employees 00:49:59.119 --> 00:50:02.429 is my understanding and that would then be again part of 00:50:02.429 --> 00:50:03.719 the parking lot. It's only 00:50:03.719 --> 00:50:06.960 being used by Fortman employees now? That's my 00:50:06.960 --> 00:50:08.679 understanding there may be 00:50:08.679 --> 00:50:13.750 some other users of that but we can clarify that again with 00:50:13.750 --> 00:50:14.599 the applicant 00:50:14.599 --> 00:50:24.429 during the public hearing. Okay thank you. So with that 00:50:24.429 --> 00:50:28.199 staff's recommending denial of the 00:50:28.199 --> 00:50:32.510 subject request for the following reasons again not meeting 00:50:32.510 --> 00:50:32.960 the deadline 00:50:32.960 --> 00:50:36.980 2030 it compromises the effectiveness of the existing 00:50:36.980 --> 00:50:38.440 overlay district 00:50:38.440 --> 00:50:42.440 compatibility with the surrounding area there are certain 00:50:42.440 --> 00:50:43.519 things in their 00:50:43.519 --> 00:50:47.599 proposed code amendment that is not consistent with their 00:50:47.599 --> 00:50:48.800 site plan and 00:50:48.800 --> 00:50:52.070 those are something that we need to address of course solid 00:50:52.070 --> 00:50:52.960 waste approval 00:50:52.960 --> 00:50:56.280 is still pending and the boundary agreement with the 00:50:56.280 --> 00:50:57.079 property owner to the 00:50:57.079 --> 00:51:00.469 West has not yet been obtained and for those reasons staff 00:51:00.469 --> 00:51:01.480 is recommending 00:51:01.480 --> 00:51:07.750 denial of this proposed amendment. Commissioner Rossell. I 00:51:07.750 --> 00:51:09.239 think this will be my last one I 00:51:09.239 --> 00:51:15.039 appreciate this is more work session so yes this is more 00:51:15.039 --> 00:51:15.039 this is more 00:51:15.039 --> 00:51:17.969 information about the process of what happens behind the 00:51:17.969 --> 00:51:19.039 scenes before it gets 00:51:19.039 --> 00:51:21.780 here you've had a conversation with the applicant that you 00:51:21.780 --> 00:51:22.239 are going to 00:51:22.239 --> 00:51:25.480 recommend denial they knew that coming in can you talk 00:51:25.480 --> 00:51:27.159 about what happens to 00:51:27.159 --> 00:51:29.199 get this point where I don't make any assumptions but it 00:51:29.199 --> 00:51:30.000 sounds like you sit 00:51:30.000 --> 00:51:32.630 down with them you outline your issues and they make the 00:51:32.630 --> 00:51:33.719 decision to go forward 00:51:33.719 --> 00:51:37.500 or keep talking about that yes so we've met with the 00:51:37.500 --> 00:51:39.440 applicant either face to 00:51:39.440 --> 00:51:43.079 face or over the phone and have several discussions with 00:51:43.079 --> 00:51:45.000 them we were just not 00:51:45.000 --> 00:51:49.570 able to address everything and you know they chose to move 00:51:49.570 --> 00:51:50.960 forward with the 00:51:50.960 --> 00:51:54.190 application we we really wanted to you know get it to where 00:51:54.190 --> 00:51:55.239 we can recommend 00:51:55.239 --> 00:51:58.400 approval but we were just not able to they chose to move 00:51:58.400 --> 00:51:58.960 forward with the 00:51:58.960 --> 00:52:05.230 application as is okay thank you I'll follow up on that I 00:52:05.230 --> 00:52:06.119 know sometimes these 00:52:06.119 --> 00:52:11.619 things are timing issues if this was to move forward from P 00:52:11.619 --> 00:52:13.199 &Z this these issues 00:52:13.199 --> 00:52:16.849 are still going to then be addressed by City Council and if 00:52:16.849 --> 00:52:17.840 solid waste is 00:52:17.840 --> 00:52:20.909 enabled to address them the boundary agreement is enabled 00:52:20.909 --> 00:52:22.159 to be obtained it 00:52:22.159 --> 00:52:25.190 doesn't really matter so what may be going on is they're 00:52:25.190 --> 00:52:26.320 aware of the issues 00:52:26.320 --> 00:52:28.809 and they are just in the process of still trying to get 00:52:28.809 --> 00:52:30.000 those ironed out and 00:52:30.000 --> 00:52:33.829 trying to keep their project on a whatever timeline self- 00:52:33.829 --> 00:52:34.800 imposed or not 00:52:34.800 --> 00:52:39.230 right but until these things get addressed City Council 00:52:39.230 --> 00:52:40.480 more than likely 00:52:40.480 --> 00:52:46.280 will not move this forward is essentially where we are at 00:52:46.280 --> 00:52:46.440 this 00:52:46.440 --> 00:52:49.639 particular point in time as I recall when this came before 00:52:49.639 --> 00:52:50.880 us before there 00:52:50.880 --> 00:52:54.230 were a lot more issues than this that were outstanding at 00:52:54.230 --> 00:52:55.519 that time I think 00:52:55.519 --> 00:53:00.760 there were issues with the fire lane and ladder trucks not 00:53:00.760 --> 00:53:01.639 being able to get in 00:53:01.639 --> 00:53:05.400 there were some other issues I think the height was still 00:53:05.400 --> 00:53:06.599 roughly about it was 00:53:06.599 --> 00:53:09.500 yeah just to recap real quick for the commissioners that 00:53:09.500 --> 00:53:10.679 weren't at the prior 00:53:10.679 --> 00:53:14.840 meeting the TIA traffic impact analysis was something that 00:53:14.840 --> 00:53:16.880 staff requested since 00:53:16.880 --> 00:53:20.440 then they've submitted it's been reviewed and accepted by 00:53:20.440 --> 00:53:21.340 engineering 00:53:21.340 --> 00:53:27.519 department the fire lane separation distance that also was 00:53:27.519 --> 00:53:28.159 an item that was 00:53:28.159 --> 00:53:31.989 not addressed at the time of January 27th however that has 00:53:31.989 --> 00:53:33.280 been addressed now 00:53:33.280 --> 00:53:37.050 and they have the appropriate distance for their fire lane 00:53:37.050 --> 00:53:38.239 to be placed where 00:53:38.239 --> 00:53:42.690 it is so you're correct Chair strange we we've addressed 00:53:42.690 --> 00:53:43.920 some but we have not 00:53:43.920 --> 00:53:48.199 addressed all were there a follow-up what were some of the 00:53:48.199 --> 00:53:48.960 other issues seem 00:53:48.960 --> 00:53:52.829 like there was a pretty good list and I think I think it 00:53:52.829 --> 00:53:54.159 was the it was the 00:53:54.159 --> 00:53:56.809 parking the main thing and I know traffic was the big 00:53:56.809 --> 00:53:57.760 question now is a 00:53:57.760 --> 00:53:59.960 big discussion during the public hearing but because we 00:53:59.960 --> 00:54:01.320 didn't have a TIA we were 00:54:01.320 --> 00:54:05.469 not able to address those certain concerns but we do have 00:54:05.469 --> 00:54:06.440 that now and 00:54:06.440 --> 00:54:10.630 obviously that's something that some answers to we can 00:54:10.630 --> 00:54:12.119 certainly discuss it 00:54:12.119 --> 00:54:16.510 but they do have a TIA traffic impact analysis that has 00:54:16.510 --> 00:54:17.480 been accepted by a 00:54:17.480 --> 00:54:21.000 city engineers do you remember what the parking was before 00:54:21.000 --> 00:54:21.760 the first time it 00:54:21.760 --> 00:54:26.969 came it seemed like it was even lower than this well I 00:54:26.969 --> 00:54:30.920 think it was it was it 00:54:30.920 --> 00:54:36.559 was 0.7 maybe it was just slightly lower by by by adding 00:54:36.559 --> 00:54:37.880 the 36 it bumped it up a 00:54:37.880 --> 00:54:41.440 little bit more all right okay great thank you 00:54:41.440 --> 00:54:44.889 Commissioner Ellis I'm sorry thank you chair okay last one 00:54:44.889 --> 00:54:46.760 I think okay so just 00:54:46.760 --> 00:54:50.000 for some background this was denied last time by a 00:54:50.000 --> 00:54:51.239 different Commission so I'm 00:54:51.239 --> 00:54:56.780 trying to get some history here what is different with this 00:54:56.780 --> 00:54:58.880 proposal today than 00:54:58.880 --> 00:55:02.710 the last time that you all saw it essentially it's the 00:55:02.710 --> 00:55:04.199 additional 36 00:55:04.199 --> 00:55:07.219 parking spaces which is the parking lot the parking lot we 00:55:07.219 --> 00:55:08.519 don't know what it's 00:55:08.519 --> 00:55:11.409 currently used for that we're gonna clarify that's the 00:55:11.409 --> 00:55:13.159 biggest yes yes okay 00:55:13.159 --> 00:55:17.440 okay thank you I will follow up I was on the Commission at 00:55:17.440 --> 00:55:18.480 that time and I voted 00:55:18.480 --> 00:55:21.469 against it at that time because the TIA wasn't done the 00:55:21.469 --> 00:55:22.679 issues with the fire 00:55:22.679 --> 00:55:25.590 lane weren't even addressed yet and it got to be kind of 00:55:25.590 --> 00:55:27.159 that snowball of there 00:55:27.159 --> 00:55:30.230 are so many issues that are outstanding it kind of for me 00:55:30.230 --> 00:55:31.960 broke the place of hey 00:55:31.960 --> 00:55:34.849 there's a couple that probably are reasonably done these 00:55:34.849 --> 00:55:35.440 are some biggies 00:55:35.440 --> 00:55:38.250 and I wasn't comfortable in voting for it at that time 00:55:38.250 --> 00:55:39.320 because those were some 00:55:39.320 --> 00:55:41.949 big issues that I felt like should have been addressed 00:55:41.949 --> 00:55:43.039 before it got to our 00:55:43.039 --> 00:55:45.489 Commission so that's why I voted against it at that time I 00:55:45.489 --> 00:55:47.639 don't know if I guess 00:55:47.639 --> 00:55:50.269 Devin would have been here to have been nobody else is 00:55:50.269 --> 00:55:51.639 gonna be able to chime in 00:55:51.639 --> 00:55:57.460 here but Devin so okay great that's why I voted against it 00:55:57.460 --> 00:55:59.119 just to provide some 00:55:59.119 --> 00:56:01.900 clarification on the fire lane issue they are still 00:56:01.900 --> 00:56:03.480 researching the ability to 00:56:03.480 --> 00:56:06.289 secure an additional five feet from the adjacent property 00:56:06.289 --> 00:56:08.000 correct not not for 00:56:08.000 --> 00:56:14.440 the fire lane but for access and that's still under review 00:56:14.440 --> 00:56:16.000 by them to by the 00:56:16.000 --> 00:56:19.519 applicant to ascertain if they either secure it and provide 00:56:19.519 --> 00:56:20.639 us copy so that we 00:56:20.639 --> 00:56:24.199 are sure that that site plan the way it's currently 00:56:24.199 --> 00:56:25.920 designed meets the fire 00:56:25.920 --> 00:56:33.400 department's requirements Commissioner Alice work session 00:56:33.400 --> 00:56:35.599 thank you chair there 00:56:35.599 --> 00:56:39.650 was discussion I believe I remember hearing about the 00:56:39.650 --> 00:56:40.960 building itself 00:56:40.960 --> 00:56:46.199 Bortman's and and it being historical in some nature was 00:56:46.199 --> 00:56:47.400 that ever addressed I 00:56:47.400 --> 00:56:50.599 don't with anybody I don't recall that discussion with this 00:56:50.599 --> 00:56:53.199 Commission okay I 00:56:53.199 --> 00:56:55.570 might be making that up or it was just being talked about 00:56:55.570 --> 00:56:56.360 out and out in public 00:56:56.360 --> 00:57:00.130 maybe because I think it's a it's a Mount Miller build isn 00:57:00.130 --> 00:57:03.599 't it it's not okay 00:57:03.599 --> 00:57:06.030 we don't know we'll try and get you some info if we can 00:57:06.030 --> 00:57:07.159 prior to but otherwise it 00:57:07.159 --> 00:57:13.719 would have to follow the meeting correct 00:57:16.800 --> 00:57:20.400 all right that's it that concludes my presentation okay any 00:57:20.400 --> 00:57:21.239 other questions for 00:57:21.239 --> 00:57:25.119 Ron thank you very good presentation and lots of 00:57:25.119 --> 00:57:26.800 information and lots of 00:57:26.800 --> 00:57:32.480 questions thank you I know we have one other item for our 00:57:32.480 --> 00:57:33.320 work session it's 00:57:33.320 --> 00:57:36.300 going to be to continue on notifications I think at this 00:57:36.300 --> 00:57:39.159 time just in essence of 00:57:39.159 --> 00:57:42.460 time that we can have as much as we need on notifications I 00:57:42.460 --> 00:57:43.280 'm gonna call a 00:57:43.280 --> 00:57:47.789 recess and let's go ahead and get food at 533 and then we 00:57:47.789 --> 00:57:49.360 'll reconvene here and 00:57:49.360 --> 00:57:55.630 here our next item which will be the notifications good 00:57:55.630 --> 00:58:02.519 evening and welcome 00:58:02.519 --> 00:58:07.190 back to our work session I'll call it back to order at 540 00:58:07.190 --> 00:58:08.719 and I think our 00:58:08.719 --> 00:58:12.690 next item is going to be to receive a report and hold 00:58:12.690 --> 00:58:14.159 discussion on our 00:58:14.159 --> 00:58:17.929 current notification practices and that's gonna be Cindy 00:58:17.929 --> 00:58:19.179 Jackson and Ron 00:58:19.179 --> 00:58:28.159 Magida thank you Commissioners as you'll recall at our last 00:58:28.159 --> 00:58:31.000 meeting we held a 00:58:31.000 --> 00:58:36.590 discussion regarding the proposed notification hearing 00:58:36.590 --> 00:58:38.119 changes and the 00:58:38.119 --> 00:58:40.340 Commission had a lot of questions and a lot of good 00:58:40.340 --> 00:58:41.639 suggestions this is a 00:58:41.639 --> 00:58:47.639 follow-up to that meeting to talk about the feedback that 00:58:47.639 --> 00:58:50.719 we received just to 00:58:50.719 --> 00:58:55.360 cut to recap currently City of Denton follows the 00:58:55.360 --> 00:58:58.199 procedures of the ordinance 00:58:58.199 --> 00:59:04.159 which was repealed in 2002 which require public notice of 00:59:04.159 --> 00:59:04.760 the 00:59:04.760 --> 00:59:07.980 scheduled public hearing in the official newspaper a legal 00:59:07.980 --> 00:59:09.199 notice sent to 00:59:09.199 --> 00:59:13.079 property owners within 200 feet of the site sent via 00:59:13.079 --> 00:59:15.079 certified mail courtesy 00:59:15.079 --> 00:59:18.510 notice of the public hearing sent to residents living 00:59:18.510 --> 00:59:20.199 within 500 feet of the 00:59:20.199 --> 00:59:24.639 subject site and a post notice in the form of a sign posted 00:59:24.639 --> 00:59:25.880 by the city on the 00:59:25.880 --> 00:59:32.090 subject property the proposed revisions that we talked 00:59:32.090 --> 00:59:34.599 about were to mail out 00:59:34.599 --> 00:59:40.010 public hearing notices to property owners within 200 feet 00:59:40.010 --> 00:59:41.000 of the property 00:59:41.000 --> 00:59:44.920 via regular mail instead of certified mail mail out 00:59:44.920 --> 00:59:46.760 courtesy notices within 00:59:46.760 --> 00:59:51.800 500 feet to residents within the 500 foot radius of the 00:59:51.800 --> 00:59:53.800 site via postcard and 00:59:53.800 --> 00:59:57.900 to track public notices and courtesy notices that are 00:59:57.900 --> 01:00:00.519 returned to the city in 01:00:00.519 --> 01:00:04.119 addition we were going to enlarge the sign that we post on 01:00:04.119 --> 01:00:05.559 the site from 2 01:00:05.559 --> 01:00:09.900 feet by 3 feet to 4 by 4 feet we are also going to require 01:00:09.900 --> 01:00:11.039 the applicant to 01:00:11.039 --> 01:00:15.030 purchase post maintain and remove the notification signs 01:00:15.030 --> 01:00:16.400 from the site and we 01:00:16.400 --> 01:00:19.860 are going to create a link on the planning division web 01:00:19.860 --> 01:00:21.159 page dedicated for 01:00:21.159 --> 01:00:27.599 public hearing notices questions any thank you go back to 01:00:27.599 --> 01:00:28.119 me Commissioner 01:00:28.119 --> 01:00:40.010 back okay so that I'm clear here the 200 foot notice and 01:00:40.010 --> 01:00:42.039 the 500 foot notice both 01:00:42.039 --> 01:00:46.730 of those could go to one individual the owner and the 10th 01:00:46.730 --> 01:00:48.440 as well yes okay 01:00:48.440 --> 01:00:51.579 because the object here is to make sure who's ever living 01:00:51.579 --> 01:00:52.840 in that house gets a 01:00:52.840 --> 01:00:56.440 notice on but that you couldn't duplicate it which would be 01:00:56.440 --> 01:00:56.960 okay that 01:00:56.960 --> 01:01:00.909 is correct if the property owner lives on the property they 01:01:00.909 --> 01:01:01.599 'll get you know 01:01:01.599 --> 01:01:05.039 okay good deal thank you 01:01:08.440 --> 01:01:14.159 Commissioner Sullivan since it seems like other cities do 01:01:14.159 --> 01:01:16.079 things different 01:01:16.079 --> 01:01:20.400 and you said this was a legal issue I mean what are the 01:01:20.400 --> 01:01:21.920 minimums and the 01:01:21.920 --> 01:01:27.760 maximums and I guess I'm trying to decide where it says Fr 01:01:27.760 --> 01:01:29.079 isco they send out 01:01:29.079 --> 01:01:33.590 mail notices regular mail yes courtesy notices no do they 01:01:33.590 --> 01:01:34.599 go by different law 01:01:34.599 --> 01:01:39.039 is it their law or and this is our law or is there some 01:01:39.039 --> 01:01:40.760 overriding state law 01:01:40.760 --> 01:01:45.039 there is an overriding state law that actually dictates the 01:01:45.039 --> 01:01:46.239 public hearing 01:01:46.239 --> 01:01:50.719 notification process and that requires the 200 foot notice 01:01:50.719 --> 01:01:51.920 sent via regular 01:01:51.920 --> 01:01:56.159 mail and a legal notice put published in the newspaper 01:01:56.159 --> 01:01:57.760 signs are not included 01:01:57.760 --> 01:02:01.460 and courtesy notices aren't included each city then decides 01:02:01.460 --> 01:02:02.239 if they want to 01:02:02.239 --> 01:02:06.639 go beyond what's required so the 500 feet isn't required it 01:02:06.639 --> 01:02:07.239 's just something 01:02:07.239 --> 01:02:11.750 that the city of Denton does the city of Plano does that 01:02:11.750 --> 01:02:14.440 and the city of Fort 01:02:14.440 --> 01:02:18.360 Worth does that right right I would just want to if we were 01:02:18.360 --> 01:02:19.320 following some legal 01:02:19.320 --> 01:02:22.329 issue how come now other ones aren't following the same we 01:02:22.329 --> 01:02:22.960 're going above 01:02:22.960 --> 01:02:29.340 and beyond what's required gotcha that's all I needed okay 01:02:29.340 --> 01:02:31.719 okay now we received 01:02:31.719 --> 01:02:34.610 some some good feedback from the planning and zoning 01:02:34.610 --> 01:02:35.679 Commission both at 01:02:35.679 --> 01:02:39.960 the meeting and via email subsequent to the meeting I'm 01:02:39.960 --> 01:02:40.880 going to go through these 01:02:40.880 --> 01:02:45.000 one by one the next few slides will cover these suggestions 01:02:45.000 --> 01:02:46.320 the first one is 01:02:46.320 --> 01:02:49.579 to provide a self-addressed stamped envelope with the 20 01:02:49.579 --> 01:02:51.079 for 200 foot mailing 01:02:51.079 --> 01:02:59.199 notice now it's possible to send a envelope a return 01:02:59.199 --> 01:03:00.599 envelope right now via 01:03:00.599 --> 01:03:07.400 our mail service however we cannot have it stamped if that 01:03:07.400 --> 01:03:09.000 's not possible right 01:03:09.000 --> 01:03:13.289 now the the city's mailing service click to net to mail has 01:03:13.289 --> 01:03:14.280 it has indicated 01:03:14.280 --> 01:03:16.929 they are working on that they hope to provide that service 01:03:16.929 --> 01:03:17.599 in the future 01:03:17.599 --> 01:03:25.300 however we don't have that available right now the create a 01:03:25.300 --> 01:03:28.039 link on the city 01:03:28.039 --> 01:03:30.760 of Denton home page to the planning division web page 01:03:30.760 --> 01:03:31.880 dedicated to public 01:03:31.880 --> 01:03:34.840 hearing notices now we've been working with the public 01:03:34.840 --> 01:03:36.000 communications office 01:03:36.000 --> 01:03:38.889 and they have indicated to us that they are in the process 01:03:38.889 --> 01:03:39.920 of redesigning the 01:03:39.920 --> 01:03:44.460 city's website they have told us that the city's website 01:03:44.460 --> 01:03:45.480 the home page of the 01:03:45.480 --> 01:03:48.920 city's website will only be utilized for announcements 01:03:48.920 --> 01:03:50.119 there's going to be no 01:03:50.119 --> 01:03:54.380 links on it to to link to other pages at this time from my 01:03:54.380 --> 01:03:57.119 understanding so what 01:03:57.119 --> 01:04:00.550 they suggested that we place the link to the notices on the 01:04:00.550 --> 01:04:01.840 planning divisions 01:04:01.840 --> 01:04:07.230 home page instead and that would link directly to the 01:04:07.230 --> 01:04:10.280 public hearing page we're 01:04:10.280 --> 01:04:13.090 going to keep working with with the public communications 01:04:13.090 --> 01:04:13.760 office or PCO 01:04:13.760 --> 01:04:17.469 office however to to see what we can do about increasing 01:04:17.469 --> 01:04:18.480 the visibility of that 01:04:18.480 --> 01:04:24.530 that site commissioner Ellis thank you chair question 01:04:24.530 --> 01:04:26.039 regarding though the new 01:04:26.039 --> 01:04:29.980 website are you I noticed the agenda for the committee on 01:04:29.980 --> 01:04:31.920 citizen engagement came 01:04:31.920 --> 01:04:35.639 up in the website is on that are you attending that meeting 01:04:35.639 --> 01:04:36.639 I actually I was 01:04:36.639 --> 01:04:39.750 not aware of that meeting but now that I'm aware of it I 01:04:39.750 --> 01:04:41.239 will I will make the 01:04:41.239 --> 01:04:46.090 point to attend that thank you I'll look into that thank 01:04:46.090 --> 01:04:46.960 you 01:04:49.039 --> 01:04:52.420 another suggestion was to include City Council notice on on 01:04:52.420 --> 01:04:54.000 the same web page 01:04:54.000 --> 01:04:56.889 as the planning and zoning Commission public hearings and 01:04:56.889 --> 01:04:57.960 that's not that's no 01:04:57.960 --> 01:05:01.429 problem we can easily put them both on to all active 01:05:01.429 --> 01:05:03.000 notices for PNC and City 01:05:03.000 --> 01:05:07.039 Council onto a public notice page 01:05:09.519 --> 01:05:12.230 another one was to start an email notification list by 01:05:12.230 --> 01:05:14.000 neighborhood for 01:05:14.000 --> 01:05:16.900 residents to sign up for notifications of activity in their 01:05:16.900 --> 01:05:18.199 neighborhood we 01:05:18.199 --> 01:05:21.239 looked at this and determined that the creation and 01:05:21.239 --> 01:05:22.920 maintenance of this kind of 01:05:22.920 --> 01:05:26.929 proposed list it would take up a great deal of staff time 01:05:26.929 --> 01:05:28.159 and wouldn't be 01:05:28.159 --> 01:05:31.880 possible because of that additional time would also be 01:05:31.880 --> 01:05:33.119 needed to generate an 01:05:33.119 --> 01:05:37.360 email for each individual request received by the city 01:05:37.360 --> 01:05:37.920 development 01:05:37.920 --> 01:05:44.019 request the proposal to create a public notice page on our 01:05:44.019 --> 01:05:46.400 on the planning 01:05:46.400 --> 01:05:50.400 department's website is actually a more efficient way to 01:05:50.400 --> 01:05:51.920 have all of the notices 01:05:51.920 --> 01:05:55.119 in one place easily visible and interested citizens can 01:05:55.119 --> 01:05:55.960 just click on 01:05:55.960 --> 01:05:58.420 that and see if there's anything happening in their 01:05:58.420 --> 01:06:02.280 neighborhood that way 01:06:03.800 --> 01:06:08.619 utilize electronic text alerts well we have been working 01:06:08.619 --> 01:06:10.440 with PCO or public 01:06:10.440 --> 01:06:13.889 communications office on this too and currently the city 01:06:13.889 --> 01:06:15.039 does not have this 01:06:15.039 --> 01:06:19.030 this kind of technology available we have asked them to 01:06:19.030 --> 01:06:20.380 research it and we 01:06:20.380 --> 01:06:23.690 will consider continue to discuss this with the PCO and see 01:06:23.690 --> 01:06:24.760 what we need to do 01:06:24.760 --> 01:06:30.510 in order to develop this feature commissioner back thank 01:06:30.510 --> 01:06:31.239 you chair this 01:06:31.239 --> 01:06:38.039 would relate to the sign on the property 01:06:38.039 --> 01:06:43.719 number that's correct okay thanks the use of postcards for 01:06:43.719 --> 01:06:44.760 both the 200 and 01:06:44.760 --> 01:06:49.309 500 foot mailing using the template from the mail service I 01:06:49.309 --> 01:06:50.519 would prepared a 01:06:50.519 --> 01:06:55.190 mock-up of the 200 foot notice as a postcard and the letter 01:06:55.190 --> 01:06:56.639 notice cost the 01:06:56.639 --> 01:07:00.510 city 242 to mail out and the postcard with a perforated 01:07:00.510 --> 01:07:01.679 reply card would cost 01:07:01.679 --> 01:07:07.000 227 which be a savings of approximately 15 cents here you 01:07:07.000 --> 01:07:09.119 can see a standard 01:07:09.119 --> 01:07:18.679 notification letter for comparison 01:07:23.519 --> 01:07:25.820 and here you can see how it would look before we put it 01:07:25.820 --> 01:07:27.639 together this is why I 01:07:27.639 --> 01:07:31.659 made a mock-up looking like this it doesn't really it's not 01:07:31.659 --> 01:07:32.840 too impressive 01:07:32.840 --> 01:07:36.400 and this is a standard courtesy notice that we mail to 01:07:36.400 --> 01:07:38.400 residents within 500 01:07:38.400 --> 01:07:41.519 feet of the subject site we actually received a courtesy 01:07:41.519 --> 01:07:42.760 notice from the city 01:07:42.760 --> 01:07:47.269 of Fort Worth so we were using that as an example of a post 01:07:47.269 --> 01:07:47.760 card 01:07:47.760 --> 01:07:52.260 notification and then here's our standard courtesy notice 01:07:52.260 --> 01:07:53.760 notification so you can see the differences 01:07:53.760 --> 01:07:59.710 again the letter notice cost the city 242 to mail out and 01:07:59.710 --> 01:08:03.159 the postcard 01:08:07.480 --> 01:08:11.530 I'm sorry I don't have that let me look that up standard 01:08:11.530 --> 01:08:15.719 postcard is 227 as well 01:08:17.800 --> 01:08:24.819 okay based on the comments at the last meeting regarding 01:08:24.819 --> 01:08:26.560 how we would track the 01:08:26.560 --> 01:08:29.220 posting of the signs and who would be responsible for 01:08:29.220 --> 01:08:30.319 paying for the signs I 01:08:30.319 --> 01:08:33.020 went ahead and and I contacted the cities that I had 01:08:33.020 --> 01:08:34.680 researched previously to find 01:08:34.680 --> 01:08:41.050 out how they did that and Fort Worth of course they have 01:08:41.050 --> 01:08:42.199 and didn't we we 01:08:42.199 --> 01:08:44.680 actually have put out the signs ourselves we don't have the 01:08:44.680 --> 01:08:45.039 applicants 01:08:45.039 --> 01:08:49.399 put out the signs Frisco requires his date stamped 01:08:49.399 --> 01:08:51.239 photograph be submitted and 01:08:51.239 --> 01:08:57.189 it can be submitted via either email or fax or it can be 01:08:57.189 --> 01:08:59.119 brought in by the 01:08:59.119 --> 01:09:04.409 applicant individually the signs are all purchased by the 01:09:04.409 --> 01:09:07.000 applicant Lewisville 01:09:07.000 --> 01:09:10.520 excuse me requires a date stamp photograph submitted 01:09:10.520 --> 01:09:11.600 actually all of 01:09:11.600 --> 01:09:16.010 them requires date stamp photograph submitted either via 01:09:16.010 --> 01:09:21.520 email via via fax 01:09:21.520 --> 01:09:26.760 via in person bringing it in as well as the sign affidavit 01:09:26.760 --> 01:09:27.640 really the only 01:09:27.640 --> 01:09:32.600 difference would be Plano Plano requires the applicant to 01:09:32.600 --> 01:09:34.079 actually post the sign 01:09:34.079 --> 01:09:37.899 28 days before the public hearing so the applicant 01:09:37.899 --> 01:09:40.479 purchases the sign and posts 01:09:40.479 --> 01:09:44.789 it and then brings in the affidavit and the photograph with 01:09:44.789 --> 01:09:45.560 their their zoning 01:09:45.560 --> 01:09:47.770 application so it's actually posted before they've even 01:09:47.770 --> 01:09:48.479 submitted their 01:09:48.479 --> 01:09:55.699 application typically with regards to who posted signs the 01:09:55.699 --> 01:09:57.880 applicant will have a 01:09:57.880 --> 01:10:01.819 choice of either having the sign made and posting it 01:10:01.819 --> 01:10:03.840 themselves or having the 01:10:03.840 --> 01:10:06.020 sign company post the sign that sign company will offer 01:10:06.020 --> 01:10:06.680 that service of 01:10:06.680 --> 01:10:12.380 installing the sign as well these are some examples of sign 01:10:12.380 --> 01:10:13.319 specification 01:10:13.319 --> 01:10:17.300 sheets from other cities the city of Denton of course we 01:10:17.300 --> 01:10:18.600 will prepare the 01:10:18.600 --> 01:10:23.510 same type of specifications sheet once we've determined the 01:10:23.510 --> 01:10:25.479 new sign design 01:10:25.479 --> 01:10:31.430 and the size it will be included along with a list of sign 01:10:31.430 --> 01:10:32.840 contractors that 01:10:32.840 --> 01:10:36.039 they can't the applicant can go to to have the sign 01:10:36.039 --> 01:10:38.479 actually manufactured I 01:10:38.479 --> 01:10:42.939 put these two on to point out to you that if you look right 01:10:42.939 --> 01:10:44.119 here it actually 01:10:44.119 --> 01:10:47.680 these two actually require a double-sided sign and they 01:10:47.680 --> 01:10:48.560 post the sign 01:10:48.560 --> 01:10:51.569 perpendicular to the street that makes it easier for people 01:10:51.569 --> 01:10:52.520 who are driving by 01:10:52.520 --> 01:10:57.289 to see the sign rather than having the sign parallel to the 01:10:57.289 --> 01:11:03.319 street some of the 01:11:03.319 --> 01:11:07.369 cities I saw actually did not require this being posted 01:11:07.369 --> 01:11:08.840 perpendicular they 01:11:08.840 --> 01:11:13.350 just wanted it visible from the street that was their 01:11:13.350 --> 01:11:16.960 criteria well that 01:11:16.960 --> 01:11:20.460 concludes my presentation we will be moving this forward to 01:11:20.460 --> 01:11:21.399 City Council in 01:11:21.399 --> 01:11:26.600 the near future and I'll answer any questions you have 01:11:26.600 --> 01:11:28.560 Commissioner back 01:11:28.560 --> 01:11:35.779 that postcard for the 200 foot notice did it have postage 01:11:35.779 --> 01:11:37.880 on it it would it 01:11:37.880 --> 01:11:41.199 would okay so that's not a problem with the postcard that 01:11:41.199 --> 01:11:42.600 that that the top part 01:11:42.600 --> 01:11:45.680 of that would be the reply and it would be a postage page 01:11:45.680 --> 01:11:46.800 page the business 01:11:46.800 --> 01:11:50.050 reply postcard but we have problems putting a self-add 01:11:50.050 --> 01:11:51.479 ressed stamped envelope 01:11:51.479 --> 01:11:56.720 in notices well because of the fact that the mail service 01:11:56.720 --> 01:11:57.640 that we use they don't 01:11:57.640 --> 01:12:00.449 provide that service right now okay they hope to in the 01:12:00.449 --> 01:12:01.760 future and they're 01:12:01.760 --> 01:12:07.560 working on it but it's not provided right now okay the 01:12:07.560 --> 01:12:09.159 signs right now the 01:12:09.159 --> 01:12:13.029 city of Denton is putting the signs up this we are okay do 01:12:13.029 --> 01:12:15.479 we have any idea what 01:12:15.479 --> 01:12:19.640 developers cost what kind of costs they will incur at this 01:12:19.640 --> 01:12:21.399 time we have not gone 01:12:21.399 --> 01:12:24.380 to the point of actually calling sign companies in the city 01:12:24.380 --> 01:12:25.199 to find out how 01:12:25.199 --> 01:12:28.199 much they would cost we're first going to need to develop 01:12:28.199 --> 01:12:29.199 the specs for the 01:12:29.199 --> 01:12:33.479 sign exactly and to get a good idea of what they would cost 01:12:33.479 --> 01:12:35.840 okay thank you 01:12:35.840 --> 01:12:40.439 Commissioner Hatchbeth thank you chair yeah no I'm 01:12:40.439 --> 01:12:42.840 perfectly fine more than 01:12:42.840 --> 01:12:46.729 fine just me I don't know if we need to kick it around but 01:12:46.729 --> 01:12:48.119 there's no need to 01:12:48.119 --> 01:12:53.979 ever add a self-addressed stamp the just the losses on a 01:12:53.979 --> 01:12:56.079 stamp that would never 01:12:56.079 --> 01:13:00.819 be used are monumental I mean it just I mean not to say 01:13:00.819 --> 01:13:02.199 that someone wouldn't 01:13:02.199 --> 01:13:07.119 get used not to say that someone wouldn't appreciate the 01:13:07.119 --> 01:13:08.479 the the effort 01:13:08.479 --> 01:13:14.140 right but the bad outweighs the good in that so I'm I'm I'm 01:13:14.140 --> 01:13:15.279 happy with and I 01:13:15.279 --> 01:13:19.710 think you'll see an increase in response with the postcard 01:13:19.710 --> 01:13:21.520 just because you see 01:13:21.520 --> 01:13:23.609 what it is you don't you know you you kind of it 01:13:23.609 --> 01:13:25.000 automatically engages you 01:13:25.000 --> 01:13:29.659 versus I see it's from the city and I just toss it or you 01:13:29.659 --> 01:13:30.800 know that that sort 01:13:30.800 --> 01:13:34.939 of thing so I think it'll immediately at least get some 01:13:34.939 --> 01:13:36.819 extra attention this way 01:13:36.819 --> 01:13:39.720 so that's our hope very well done thank you thank you 01:13:39.720 --> 01:13:44.930 Commissioner Sullivan the regarding the postage on the on 01:13:44.930 --> 01:13:46.479 the postcard this is 01:13:46.479 --> 01:13:49.489 only paid if they send it back that's correct and I'm 01:13:49.489 --> 01:13:50.159 assuming that'd be the 01:13:50.159 --> 01:13:53.250 same thing with the envelope that would only be paid if 01:13:53.250 --> 01:13:54.760 that yes what they're 01:13:54.760 --> 01:13:57.220 developing is the same kind of system where it would be 01:13:57.220 --> 01:13:59.039 business reply post its 01:13:59.039 --> 01:14:03.810 page only if they respond and send it back well having gone 01:14:03.810 --> 01:14:04.239 to a public 01:14:04.239 --> 01:14:08.890 meeting today out at the the ranch there was a lot of talk 01:14:08.890 --> 01:14:10.479 about the the notices 01:14:10.479 --> 01:14:14.939 and I think most people were very upset over having go to 01:14:14.939 --> 01:14:16.680 the post office to get 01:14:16.680 --> 01:14:19.569 their certified mail only to find out that they still didn 01:14:19.569 --> 01:14:20.439 't know what was 01:14:20.439 --> 01:14:24.869 going on so I think the postcards if we can eliminate the 01:14:24.869 --> 01:14:26.199 certified mail and 01:14:26.199 --> 01:14:29.489 just do everything postcard I think that would be a great 01:14:29.489 --> 01:14:31.680 help for people just to 01:14:31.680 --> 01:14:35.069 at least get the notice my other question is is there a 01:14:35.069 --> 01:14:37.119 time limit where 01:14:37.119 --> 01:14:40.510 information is available to see what's going on because 01:14:40.510 --> 01:14:41.720 that's you know that's 01:14:41.720 --> 01:14:45.510 really that was my frustration when I got my notice is that 01:14:45.510 --> 01:14:46.760 I couldn't go to 01:14:46.760 --> 01:14:50.579 the website to see exactly what was going on right and so 01:14:50.579 --> 01:14:52.520 you know having it 01:14:52.520 --> 01:14:57.720 available after Friday 5 o'clock for the meeting Wednesday 01:14:57.720 --> 01:14:59.100 really is not much 01:14:59.100 --> 01:15:03.109 time for a person to find out more about sure this hearing 01:15:03.109 --> 01:15:05.119 is all about what one 01:15:05.119 --> 01:15:08.399 option would be what most people do is they call the city 01:15:08.399 --> 01:15:09.720 if they get a nose 01:15:09.720 --> 01:15:12.840 they call the city if they don't understand what what is in 01:15:12.840 --> 01:15:13.880 their letter 01:15:13.880 --> 01:15:17.310 they just call the city and talk to the project manager and 01:15:17.310 --> 01:15:18.439 the project managers 01:15:18.439 --> 01:15:21.680 more than happy to tell them what the request is wouldn't 01:15:21.680 --> 01:15:22.680 be more efficient 01:15:22.680 --> 01:15:27.409 though to put all that on the website earlier than the 01:15:27.409 --> 01:15:28.800 Friday after five o'clock 01:15:28.800 --> 01:15:34.680 before the meeting well typically that that is when the the 01:15:34.680 --> 01:15:35.760 staff reports are 01:15:35.760 --> 01:15:40.100 ready they're not ready before that time it could be if 01:15:40.100 --> 01:15:43.880 somebody said now shout 01:15:43.880 --> 01:15:47.670 and I'm just wondering you know is there other than that's 01:15:47.670 --> 01:15:48.840 just the way it's 01:15:48.840 --> 01:15:52.819 always been done but because people I think want more 01:15:52.819 --> 01:15:54.079 information than just 01:15:54.079 --> 01:15:57.909 what you know what they get in this obviously you can't go 01:15:57.909 --> 01:15:58.600 into much detail 01:15:58.600 --> 01:16:03.529 and so I'm just curious to give people more time to look at 01:16:03.529 --> 01:16:05.079 what it is that's 01:16:05.079 --> 01:16:10.880 being proposed just curious thank you 01:16:12.920 --> 01:16:19.560 Commissioner Roselle sorry got you a couple questions I 01:16:19.560 --> 01:16:20.840 think maybe to be 01:16:20.840 --> 01:16:25.000 helpful for me to better understand the purpose of the 01:16:25.000 --> 01:16:26.699 notification at a high 01:16:26.699 --> 01:16:31.869 level is it to notify the public or is it to get a response 01:16:31.869 --> 01:16:32.920 of how they feel 01:16:32.920 --> 01:16:39.500 about the change there is a we do want them to respond yay 01:16:39.500 --> 01:16:40.560 or nay that is an 01:16:40.560 --> 01:16:44.640 intense of the notice actually they and and according to 01:16:44.640 --> 01:16:46.760 the the state law the 01:16:46.760 --> 01:16:51.630 response has to be in writing so that it can be calculated 01:16:51.630 --> 01:16:52.920 so that is why we 01:16:52.920 --> 01:16:58.220 provide a return notification for them to fill out and send 01:16:58.220 --> 01:16:59.840 back to a stating 01:16:59.840 --> 01:17:05.399 yes I'm for it yes I'm no I'm not for it and why sure legal 01:17:05.399 --> 01:17:06.279 purpose for that is 01:17:06.279 --> 01:17:10.789 because if 20% or more of Jack that it requires super enjoy 01:17:10.789 --> 01:17:11.199 perfect that's 01:17:11.199 --> 01:17:14.859 helpful so I have a couple more questions the legal notice 01:17:14.859 --> 01:17:15.279 that has to be 01:17:15.279 --> 01:17:19.390 sent to the 200 obviously it's legally demanded or required 01:17:19.390 --> 01:17:22.239 of us within that 01:17:22.239 --> 01:17:27.359 requirement it does not say it has to be certified it just 01:17:27.359 --> 01:17:28.359 says that we notice 01:17:28.359 --> 01:17:31.760 there's not any further it actually says via regular mail 01:17:31.760 --> 01:17:32.760 dropped in a post off 01:17:32.760 --> 01:17:36.439 in the post the mailbox okay that's the minimum requirement 01:17:36.439 --> 01:17:37.479 there okay perfect 01:17:37.479 --> 01:17:42.840 other thing that Fort Worth postcard has a cue card reader 01:17:42.840 --> 01:17:43.479 on the front do you 01:17:43.479 --> 01:17:48.340 know where that goes to no I don't I tried to scan it and 01:17:48.340 --> 01:17:49.479 it didn't nothing 01:17:49.479 --> 01:17:54.210 came up so great that makes perfect I was curious if there 01:17:54.210 --> 01:17:54.640 's like a website 01:17:54.640 --> 01:17:57.159 that that actually scans to it's that's actually not a bad 01:17:57.159 --> 01:17:58.039 idea that they're 01:17:58.039 --> 01:18:02.079 putting on there third along with information gathering 01:18:02.079 --> 01:18:03.119 Facebook's free 01:18:03.119 --> 01:18:06.449 and we talked about the last time but they didn't come up 01:18:06.449 --> 01:18:07.680 here why there's not 01:18:07.680 --> 01:18:10.029 a dent in planning and zoning Facebook and when we post on 01:18:10.029 --> 01:18:11.000 the website you 01:18:11.000 --> 01:18:13.890 know that automatically pushed to Facebook or that person 01:18:13.890 --> 01:18:14.739 logs in and puts 01:18:14.739 --> 01:18:16.960 a notice on Facebook people can subscribe to see it on the 01:18:16.960 --> 01:18:17.520 timeline they 01:18:17.520 --> 01:18:19.829 could prioritize it on the timeline they would actually 01:18:19.829 --> 01:18:20.720 have the empowerment 01:18:20.720 --> 01:18:24.630 apart from neighborhood newsletters or anything like that 01:18:24.630 --> 01:18:25.880 which is a time for 01:18:25.880 --> 01:18:29.560 the staff and a cost it seems like Facebook is a low-h 01:18:29.560 --> 01:18:30.600 anging fruit in terms 01:18:30.600 --> 01:18:32.930 of notifications there are some Facebook groups out there 01:18:32.930 --> 01:18:33.840 that that do very well 01:18:33.840 --> 01:18:37.439 and I know one particular Commissioner on this Commission 01:18:37.439 --> 01:18:38.600 tries to push that 01:18:38.600 --> 01:18:41.819 information out there but there could be a centralized 01:18:41.819 --> 01:18:43.880 planning zoning page that 01:18:43.880 --> 01:18:47.699 people could like and so I'm in favor of of the effort that 01:18:47.699 --> 01:18:49.039 that might take to 01:18:49.039 --> 01:18:53.640 start lastly and I brought this up last time not me last 01:18:53.640 --> 01:18:54.520 time but the first time 01:18:54.520 --> 01:18:59.130 this came up in terms of postcard verse letters I find post 01:18:59.130 --> 01:19:00.279 cards to be super 01:19:00.279 --> 01:19:05.260 convenient I think a lot of us do however I have intimate 01:19:05.260 --> 01:19:05.920 knowledge my 01:19:05.920 --> 01:19:08.810 brother owns a company that sends out tens of thousands of 01:19:08.810 --> 01:19:09.760 mailers across the 01:19:09.760 --> 01:19:13.279 state of Texas throughout the year and he's done a be 01:19:13.279 --> 01:19:14.720 testing on postcard 01:19:14.720 --> 01:19:17.970 responses verse letter responses and there is such a 01:19:17.970 --> 01:19:19.359 massive significant 01:19:19.359 --> 01:19:22.319 difference on the number of responses he gets from sending 01:19:22.319 --> 01:19:23.399 a letter out verse a 01:19:23.399 --> 01:19:27.800 postcard and so if the intent is to get a response and if I 01:19:27.800 --> 01:19:29.359 could look into his 01:19:29.359 --> 01:19:32.250 data and bring it to y'all it the response comes from a 01:19:32.250 --> 01:19:33.119 letter there's a 01:19:33.119 --> 01:19:36.060 there's a buy-in to opening or taking off the little 01:19:36.060 --> 01:19:37.600 sticker that encloses it 01:19:37.600 --> 01:19:40.409 there's there's some sort of perceived okay I'm committed 01:19:40.409 --> 01:19:41.439 to figuring out what 01:19:41.439 --> 01:19:44.609 this is and once they're in there it seems like there's a 01:19:44.609 --> 01:19:45.439 mental process to 01:19:45.439 --> 01:19:48.170 continue that step where postcard is flip it over throw it 01:19:48.170 --> 01:19:49.439 away and so as 01:19:49.439 --> 01:19:52.600 much as a postcard is convenient it allows for that 01:19:52.600 --> 01:19:55.239 business reply which is 01:19:55.239 --> 01:19:59.949 is great I'm still hesitant if the intent as stated is to 01:19:59.949 --> 01:20:01.720 get a response is 01:20:01.720 --> 01:20:04.090 if there's if there's been research to know what would 01:20:04.090 --> 01:20:05.319 better get as a response 01:20:05.319 --> 01:20:07.800 and I'm not sure if the staff's looked into that there has 01:20:07.800 --> 01:20:08.720 to be without with 01:20:08.720 --> 01:20:11.199 the number of mailers that go out politically or otherwise 01:20:11.199 --> 01:20:11.800 there's got to 01:20:11.800 --> 01:20:15.399 be research out there for conversion rates from letters to 01:20:15.399 --> 01:20:16.680 postcards and so 01:20:16.680 --> 01:20:19.069 I'd be interested in seeing that to make a the best 01:20:19.069 --> 01:20:20.840 intellectual decisions about 01:20:20.840 --> 01:20:23.390 what would be more effective in getting their response 01:20:23.390 --> 01:20:24.520 because I agree I want 01:20:24.520 --> 01:20:26.880 the response day or nades it's helpful for our discussions 01:20:26.880 --> 01:20:28.359 and if a postcard is 01:20:28.359 --> 01:20:31.880 not the best way of doing that that I wouldn't be in favor 01:20:31.880 --> 01:20:32.739 of it if we know 01:20:32.739 --> 01:20:38.689 that it's not gonna yield good responses. Sure, thank you. 01:20:38.689 --> 01:20:40.319 Commissioner Beck. Thank 01:20:40.319 --> 01:20:44.289 you chair. Chicken or egg question here. What is the 01:20:44.289 --> 01:20:45.479 individual out there in the 01:20:45.479 --> 01:20:49.659 community see first the sign or the notice? That's really 01:20:49.659 --> 01:20:51.220 hard to say we get 01:20:51.220 --> 01:20:55.670 calls on all of them. Well I guess what's the intent do we 01:20:55.670 --> 01:20:57.000 try and get the sign up 01:20:57.000 --> 01:20:59.449 before they get their notices? They get they usually get 01:20:59.449 --> 01:21:00.319 posted around the same 01:21:00.319 --> 01:21:04.340 the sign gets posted a few days after the notice goes out 01:21:04.340 --> 01:21:05.880 so that they're 01:21:05.880 --> 01:21:10.439 received hopefully at the same time the sign goes out. Well 01:21:10.439 --> 01:21:10.960 I'm wondering 01:21:10.960 --> 01:21:15.050 if it wouldn't in part answer our address Commissioner Rose 01:21:15.050 --> 01:21:16.239 ll's concern 01:21:16.239 --> 01:21:21.109 about if the sign went up early enough then the homeowners 01:21:21.109 --> 01:21:21.760 would be in 01:21:21.760 --> 01:21:24.720 anticipation of some kind of mailing from the city and 01:21:24.720 --> 01:21:26.399 would be less inclined to throw it away. 01:21:26.399 --> 01:21:43.010 Sure. Okay. Commissioner Ellis. Thank you chair. 01:21:43.010 --> 01:21:44.680 Commissioner Rosell I just wanted 01:21:44.680 --> 01:21:48.750 to ask you if what kind of what was the data that your 01:21:48.750 --> 01:21:50.720 brother had I mean what 01:21:50.720 --> 01:21:57.920 kind of mailers was it marketing or? Yeah I mean solicited 01:21:57.920 --> 01:21:58.800 marketing mailers 01:21:58.800 --> 01:22:03.079 and he's done closed envelope with a loose leaf inside he's 01:22:03.079 --> 01:22:03.920 done brochures 01:22:03.920 --> 01:22:06.760 double tabbed where the address is printed right on the 01:22:06.760 --> 01:22:07.800 actual collateral 01:22:07.800 --> 01:22:12.189 and he's also done postcards and measured conversion rates 01:22:12.189 --> 01:22:13.000 from that 01:22:13.000 --> 01:22:17.319 solicited material. So I guess my my question is we're 01:22:17.319 --> 01:22:19.000 trying to get things 01:22:19.000 --> 01:22:23.659 noticed so I'm wondering to me a postcard is more 01:22:23.659 --> 01:22:26.000 noticeable in the mail 01:22:26.000 --> 01:22:28.250 especially with that Fort Worth one where it's kind of 01:22:28.250 --> 01:22:29.399 printed on that so I 01:22:29.399 --> 01:22:34.130 don't know you know I don't know how that data interprets 01:22:34.130 --> 01:22:35.399 to a public notice. 01:22:35.399 --> 01:22:39.600 I don't know either I think a postcard is definitely easier 01:22:39.600 --> 01:22:40.279 to be noticed I 01:22:40.279 --> 01:22:44.039 think more eyes would see that but if part of the intent is 01:22:44.039 --> 01:22:44.640 to actually get a 01:22:44.640 --> 01:22:49.409 response from what I've learned and read postcards aren't 01:22:49.409 --> 01:22:50.800 the best avenue to get 01:22:50.800 --> 01:22:53.699 a response so that's why I was asking the question about 01:22:53.699 --> 01:22:54.920 notice versus response. 01:22:54.920 --> 01:23:00.470 A postcard is very easy to throw away. Yeah I suppose that 01:23:00.470 --> 01:23:01.520 's true. 01:23:04.199 --> 01:23:09.880 Commissioner Sullivan. I'm curious about the main issue 01:23:09.880 --> 01:23:10.720 being getting a 01:23:10.720 --> 01:23:15.279 response. Yes. Because what we currently get what I got 01:23:15.279 --> 01:23:16.720 there's nothing to 01:23:16.720 --> 01:23:21.979 respond to. What you had was a courtesy notice. If you look 01:23:21.979 --> 01:23:22.699 at what we've got 01:23:22.699 --> 01:23:27.560 what I handed out there is you got a courtesy notice and 01:23:27.560 --> 01:23:28.319 you got the 01:23:28.319 --> 01:23:32.119 regular 200 foot required notice. The 200 foot required 01:23:32.119 --> 01:23:33.100 notice does have a 01:23:33.100 --> 01:23:39.880 response sheet on it. Okay but if we don't know what it's 01:23:39.880 --> 01:23:41.760 about how are 01:23:41.760 --> 01:23:44.659 people going to respond? I get back to the same thing. That 01:23:44.659 --> 01:23:46.079 's when they call the city. 01:23:46.079 --> 01:23:50.680 The information and not just the notice but the real 01:23:50.680 --> 01:23:52.720 information. Yeah. Even with 01:23:52.720 --> 01:23:56.069 something like this where you have a map that you really 01:23:56.069 --> 01:23:57.279 can't read. Mm-hmm. 01:23:57.279 --> 01:24:01.359 Spend more less time on a map and more time on verbiage. 01:24:01.359 --> 01:24:02.880 Right and see and you 01:24:02.880 --> 01:24:06.640 with the postcards we don't have room for a map so it's all 01:24:06.640 --> 01:24:08.079 verbiage. Well I did 01:24:08.079 --> 01:24:12.739 notice on the Fort Worth they said the side in request 15 01:24:12.739 --> 01:24:14.159 800 block of double 01:24:14.159 --> 01:24:17.399 eagle boulevard variants to model home within 300 feet of 01:24:17.399 --> 01:24:18.640 occupied residents. 01:24:18.640 --> 01:24:22.539 Mm-hmm. I've got an idea what that's about. Right. But we 01:24:22.539 --> 01:24:23.439 don't even have that 01:24:23.439 --> 01:24:26.670 kind of a description. It can be something real specific 01:24:26.670 --> 01:24:29.000 and very short just to let 01:24:29.000 --> 01:24:31.689 people know what's going on so they know whether or not to 01:24:31.689 --> 01:24:33.720 be concerned. Right and we try 01:24:33.720 --> 01:24:38.539 to be as specific as we can. It's just sometimes people 01:24:38.539 --> 01:24:39.920 just don't understand 01:24:39.920 --> 01:24:44.340 what we're trying to say. I understand. Okay thank you. I 01:24:44.340 --> 01:24:45.760 may have missed this in the 01:24:45.760 --> 01:24:48.720 presentation. Are we taking a step back from the certified 01:24:48.720 --> 01:24:49.600 mailers to just 01:24:49.600 --> 01:24:52.159 regular mail now? Is that correct? Yes. That's what our 01:24:52.159 --> 01:24:53.359 proposal is. The 01:24:53.359 --> 01:24:56.319 certified if I remember I were six something dollars a 01:24:56.319 --> 01:24:58.560 piece. You were five 01:24:58.560 --> 01:25:02.720 seventy-seven. Okay so I'm on six and we're gonna be down 01:25:02.720 --> 01:25:04.319 around 242. 01:25:04.319 --> 01:25:21.680 Yeah. Any other questions? Thank you. 01:25:28.680 --> 01:25:32.729 Okay that's our last item on our work session. So at this 01:25:32.729 --> 01:25:36.520 time unless we have 01:25:36.520 --> 01:25:41.609 any other questions or any other housekeeping I'm going to 01:25:41.609 --> 01:25:42.920 close our work 01:25:42.920 --> 01:25:48.140 session at 6 0 7 and we'll reconvene in council chambers at 01:25:48.140 --> 01:25:50.479 6 30. Thank you. 01:25:59.279 --> 01:26:01.250 Good evening and welcome to the City of Denton Planning and 01:26:01.250 --> 01:26:04.800 Zoning Commission 01:26:04.800 --> 01:26:09.180 meeting for October the 26th. This meeting has been duly 01:26:09.180 --> 01:26:10.359 posted and we do 01:26:10.359 --> 01:26:13.920 have a quorum present and I will call our meeting to order 01:26:13.920 --> 01:26:15.680 at 6 32. Our first 01:26:15.680 --> 01:26:18.020 order of business will be to stand and give the pledge to 01:26:18.020 --> 01:26:18.920 the US and the Texas 01:26:18.920 --> 01:26:21.159 flag. 01:26:28.560 --> 01:26:31.560 [Pledge of Allegiance] 01:26:59.119 --> 01:26:59.119 The next item on our agenda this evening will be to 01:26:59.119 --> 01:27:06.560 consider our minutes of a 01:27:06.560 --> 01:27:06.560 meeting for October the 12th. The chair will entertain a 01:27:06.560 --> 01:27:12.319 motion. 01:27:15.880 --> 01:27:15.880 Commissioner Rizel. I move to accept the minutes. 01:27:15.880 --> 01:27:22.199 Commissioner Beck. Okay. The first 01:27:22.199 --> 01:27:27.810 and a second any discussion? Seeing none we'll call for a 01:27:27.810 --> 01:27:30.840 vote on the board. 01:27:42.479 --> 01:27:49.340 Motion carries 6 to 0. Next item on our agenda will be our 01:27:49.340 --> 01:27:51.520 consent agenda. 01:27:54.000 --> 01:27:58.460 Commissioner Beck. I move we approve consent. Okay. 01:27:58.460 --> 01:27:59.560 Commissioner Hudspeth. 01:27:59.560 --> 01:28:03.720 Second. Okay. We have a first and a second for approval. 01:28:03.720 --> 01:28:09.079 Any discussion? Seeing 01:28:09.079 --> 01:28:16.340 none we'll call for a vote on the board. That motion 01:28:16.340 --> 01:28:24.399 carries 6 to 0. That will 01:28:24.399 --> 01:28:27.760 take us to our public hearing section this evening. As a 01:28:27.760 --> 01:28:28.920 point of order 01:28:28.920 --> 01:28:31.390 because of the number of cards that we have this evening we 01:28:31.390 --> 01:28:32.199 are going to make 01:28:32.199 --> 01:28:34.500 or the chair is going to make a change in order and we're 01:28:34.500 --> 01:28:35.640 going to hear item B 01:28:35.640 --> 01:28:41.109 first. That is going to be so I'm going to open the public 01:28:41.109 --> 01:28:42.000 hearing for item B 01:28:42.000 --> 01:28:48.369 which will be AESA 16-0002 and I will call on Mike Bell for 01:28:48.369 --> 01:28:49.880 that presentation. 01:28:49.880 --> 01:28:53.479 Thank you chair, members of the Commission. This request is 01:28:53.479 --> 01:28:53.920 for an 01:28:53.920 --> 01:28:57.239 alternative environmentally sensitive area plan for the 01:28:57.239 --> 01:28:58.479 Ryan Meadows edition 01:28:58.479 --> 01:29:03.390 phase 2. In a nutshell there is a roadway Creekdale Drive 01:29:03.390 --> 01:29:04.760 that is on the city of 01:29:04.760 --> 01:29:07.770 Denton mobility plan that the developers is required to 01:29:07.770 --> 01:29:09.279 construct and that roadway 01:29:09.279 --> 01:29:12.460 cuts across some environmentally sensitive areas about a 01:29:12.460 --> 01:29:13.279 little less than 01:29:13.279 --> 01:29:17.880 half an acre. There is no exemption for our mobility plan 01:29:17.880 --> 01:29:19.279 roadways from our ESA 01:29:19.279 --> 01:29:21.840 regulations therefore that's why this plan is required. 01:29:21.840 --> 01:29:24.199 They are proposing some 01:29:24.199 --> 01:29:27.399 mitigation to plan additional 25 trees just outside the 01:29:27.399 --> 01:29:28.600 boundaries of the ESA 01:29:28.600 --> 01:29:33.029 to mitigate for for that disturbance. Staff does recommend 01:29:33.029 --> 01:29:33.640 approval with 01:29:33.640 --> 01:29:38.119 conditions 1 through 3 that the limit that the disturbance 01:29:38.119 --> 01:29:38.720 shall not exceed 01:29:38.720 --> 01:29:41.770 0.45 acres and shall be consistent with the alternative ESA 01:29:41.770 --> 01:29:43.720 plan. That 25 trees 01:29:43.720 --> 01:29:47.689 shall be planted 3 inch diameters at planting and then all 01:29:47.689 --> 01:29:48.520 areas disturbed 01:29:48.520 --> 01:29:51.409 shall be re-vegetated using native plants. With that I'll 01:29:51.409 --> 01:29:52.039 be happy to answer 01:29:52.039 --> 01:29:54.520 any questions. 01:29:55.000 --> 01:30:03.140 Any questions for staff? Thank you Mike. I have one card on 01:30:03.140 --> 01:30:05.319 this item Thomas 01:30:05.319 --> 01:30:11.199 Fletcher speaking in support. Good evening my name is 01:30:11.199 --> 01:30:13.000 Thomas Fletcher 5750 01:30:13.000 --> 01:30:17.680 Genesis Court Frisco Texas 75034. I'm the engineer for the 01:30:17.680 --> 01:30:18.479 applicant and 01:30:18.479 --> 01:30:22.039 really just here to answer any questions if there are any. 01:30:22.039 --> 01:30:23.760 As Mike has pointed out 01:30:23.760 --> 01:30:27.399 the the request is for the construction of Creekdale Drive 01:30:27.399 --> 01:30:28.239 which is on the 01:30:28.239 --> 01:30:31.840 mobility plan. As part of that we've gone through and done 01:30:31.840 --> 01:30:33.399 engineering plans to 01:30:33.399 --> 01:30:36.079 look at the disturbances in order to calculate that. 01:30:36.079 --> 01:30:37.239 Because there's 01:30:37.239 --> 01:30:42.520 undeveloped floodplain we've also gone through the drainage 01:30:42.520 --> 01:30:43.199 analysis. 01:30:43.199 --> 01:30:46.220 We've done a flood study on the project. We've also done a 01:30:46.220 --> 01:30:47.239 clomer conditional 01:30:47.239 --> 01:30:50.880 letter of map revision that has also been approved by FEMA. 01:30:50.880 --> 01:30:52.279 So just give you 01:30:52.279 --> 01:30:55.189 some additional background and would be glad to answer any 01:30:55.189 --> 01:30:56.319 questions on behalf of 01:30:56.319 --> 01:31:03.630 the owner. I've got a question for you. You may or may not 01:31:03.630 --> 01:31:04.359 have been in our work 01:31:04.359 --> 01:31:07.279 session there was a little discussion about some of the ESA 01:31:07.279 --> 01:31:07.920 requirements 01:31:07.920 --> 01:31:11.439 because this road is required at part of mobility plan. 01:31:11.439 --> 01:31:13.680 Just for my own purposes 01:31:13.680 --> 01:31:16.550 as we look at this a little bit deeper in some future work 01:31:16.550 --> 01:31:17.640 sessions can you 01:31:17.640 --> 01:31:21.319 give me an idea how much time and cost y'all have spent 01:31:21.319 --> 01:31:22.260 dealing with this 01:31:22.260 --> 01:31:26.720 particular issue and what the 25 trees and the native 01:31:26.720 --> 01:31:28.239 planting and all those 01:31:28.239 --> 01:31:32.600 things just a ballpark. So the the 25 trees you're probably 01:31:32.600 --> 01:31:33.479 looking at with a 01:31:33.479 --> 01:31:36.470 three-inch tree probably five to six hundred dollars a 01:31:36.470 --> 01:31:37.760 piece installed so 01:31:37.760 --> 01:31:40.430 you're looking at probably twelve to fifteen thousand 01:31:40.430 --> 01:31:41.720 dollars for the trees. 01:31:41.720 --> 01:31:45.399 As part of the city's requirement we have to go through and 01:31:45.399 --> 01:31:46.000 do an ESA 01:31:46.000 --> 01:31:49.680 assessment assessment anyway. So whether we had to come 01:31:49.680 --> 01:31:51.840 before you with a with an 01:31:51.840 --> 01:31:55.720 alternate ESA plan or not we we had to go through that 01:31:55.720 --> 01:31:57.600 process. Through the 01:31:57.600 --> 01:32:01.069 process of making the submittal and so forth I think we've 01:32:01.069 --> 01:32:02.359 been working with the 01:32:02.359 --> 01:32:06.250 city city staff for probably the last three months just 01:32:06.250 --> 01:32:07.479 kind of going through 01:32:07.479 --> 01:32:11.369 going through the assessment kind of looking at the impacts 01:32:11.369 --> 01:32:12.119 and how the 01:32:12.119 --> 01:32:16.180 impacts affect the ESA with the road the design of the road 01:32:16.180 --> 01:32:17.680 how it impacts or how 01:32:17.680 --> 01:32:21.329 it interacts with the clomer and showing that it meets the 01:32:21.329 --> 01:32:22.640 clomer but as far as 01:32:22.640 --> 01:32:26.270 the impacts to the development really the only additional 01:32:26.270 --> 01:32:27.199 impacts because 01:32:27.199 --> 01:32:31.119 since the road is a requirement everything associated with 01:32:31.119 --> 01:32:31.199 the 01:32:31.199 --> 01:32:34.989 construction of the road is already required by the city so 01:32:34.989 --> 01:32:36.079 really looking 01:32:36.079 --> 01:32:39.720 at maybe an additional fifteen thousand dollars for the 01:32:39.720 --> 01:32:40.920 additional plantings in 01:32:40.920 --> 01:32:45.159 the open space. Plus the time. Plus the time correct. How 01:32:45.159 --> 01:32:46.199 much is the engineering 01:32:46.199 --> 01:32:49.850 time approximately for the alternate ESA if you didn't have 01:32:49.850 --> 01:32:50.840 to deal with that 01:32:50.840 --> 01:32:55.659 issue? For the alternate ESA I would say that are you 01:32:55.659 --> 01:32:57.399 asking as far as hours or 01:32:57.399 --> 01:33:01.279 fees or dollars? Dollars I mean I would say it's under a 01:33:01.279 --> 01:33:03.039 ten thousand dollar fee 01:33:03.039 --> 01:33:05.539 expense. So somewhere twenty twenty five thousand dollars 01:33:05.539 --> 01:33:06.159 for this particular 01:33:06.159 --> 01:33:09.600 issue on this project. That's correct. Great that's correct 01:33:09.600 --> 01:33:10.439 . Thank you. Any other 01:33:10.439 --> 01:33:15.260 questions for the applicant? Thank you. Appreciate it. 01:33:15.260 --> 01:33:16.880 Again this is a public 01:33:16.880 --> 01:33:19.920 hearing so anyone who would like to speak on this item 01:33:19.920 --> 01:33:21.039 please come forward 01:33:21.039 --> 01:33:27.750 at this time and give your name and address. Seeing none we 01:33:27.750 --> 01:33:29.760 will close the 01:33:29.760 --> 01:33:34.039 public hearing on this item and open the floor for 01:33:34.039 --> 01:33:36.119 discussion or a motion. 01:33:36.800 --> 01:33:42.439 Commissioner Hudspeth. I move approval with the three 01:33:42.439 --> 01:33:44.119 bullets that staff 01:33:44.119 --> 01:33:49.789 identified as requirements. Okay. Commissioner Beck. I 01:33:49.789 --> 01:33:52.359 second. Okay. We have a 01:33:52.359 --> 01:33:54.880 first and second for approval with the three conditions 01:33:54.880 --> 01:33:56.000 that are in our backup 01:33:56.000 --> 01:34:02.380 as part of this project. Any other discussion or comments? 01:34:02.380 --> 01:34:05.479 Seeing none I'll 01:34:05.479 --> 01:34:08.600 call for a vote on the board. 01:34:15.840 --> 01:34:25.779 Motion carries six to zero. We will now hear item A. So I'm 01:34:25.779 --> 01:34:26.680 going to open the 01:34:26.680 --> 01:34:34.279 public hearing to Z16-0007 and we'll call on Ron Magida to 01:34:34.279 --> 01:34:34.560 make this 01:34:34.560 --> 01:34:37.119 presentation. 01:34:52.279 --> 01:34:53.079 Thank you chair, members of the Commission, members of 01:34:53.079 --> 01:34:56.520 staff. This item 01:34:56.520 --> 01:35:00.630 brought forward to you today is a consideration for a code 01:35:00.630 --> 01:35:01.640 amendment to 01:35:01.640 --> 01:35:05.920 the Fry Street overlay district which is in sub chapter 357 01:35:05.920 --> 01:35:07.039 of the Denton 01:35:07.039 --> 01:35:11.399 Development Code. The request brought forward is to amend 01:35:11.399 --> 01:35:13.319 the overlay district 01:35:13.319 --> 01:35:17.880 to create a new sub area which is sub area C and associated 01:35:17.880 --> 01:35:18.279 development 01:35:18.279 --> 01:35:22.949 standards that go along with just that sub area. For 01:35:22.949 --> 01:35:25.199 reference this is the 01:35:25.199 --> 01:35:31.779 entire Fry Street overlay district outlined here in orange. 01:35:31.779 --> 01:35:32.960 As you recall or 01:35:32.960 --> 01:35:37.560 as you are familiar with the sub area B is an area that was 01:35:37.560 --> 01:35:41.399 carved out in 2010 to 01:35:41.399 --> 01:35:45.779 allow for the development of a student housing or student 01:35:45.779 --> 01:35:47.479 living apartment the 01:35:47.479 --> 01:35:51.250 youth center and associated commercial uses and again this 01:35:51.250 --> 01:35:54.800 was approved in 2010. 01:35:54.800 --> 01:35:59.470 The area here in red identifies the area that the current 01:35:59.470 --> 01:36:01.479 proposal to amend the 01:36:01.479 --> 01:36:05.619 Fry Street overlay district again sub area C and this is 01:36:05.619 --> 01:36:06.960 the subject area 01:36:06.960 --> 01:36:11.579 where this particular project will go if the code amendment 01:36:11.579 --> 01:36:13.279 was to be approved. A 01:36:13.279 --> 01:36:18.149 little closer look of what the area looks like currently 01:36:18.149 --> 01:36:19.760 there's an 01:36:19.760 --> 01:36:22.569 existing bookstore, Wortmans bookstore is located in this 01:36:22.569 --> 01:36:23.960 area as well as a 01:36:23.960 --> 01:36:28.829 subway restaurant and parking. The applicant is proposing 01:36:28.829 --> 01:36:29.840 to construct a 01:36:29.840 --> 01:36:35.159 multi-level mixed-use development five stories to be exact. 01:36:35.159 --> 01:36:36.279 The area use or the 01:36:36.279 --> 01:36:39.680 illustration you see here shows landscaping along both Oak 01:36:39.680 --> 01:36:40.439 and Hickory 01:36:40.439 --> 01:36:47.539 and associated parking spaces with this project. By way of 01:36:47.539 --> 01:36:50.239 background for those 01:36:50.239 --> 01:36:55.479 commissioners that work here on January 27th of this year 01:36:55.479 --> 01:36:56.600 the Planning Zoning 01:36:56.600 --> 01:37:00.470 Commission considered this similar project it was a prior 01:37:00.470 --> 01:37:03.199 project Z1529 01:37:03.199 --> 01:37:06.680 for this project. The Planning Zoning Commission at that 01:37:06.680 --> 01:37:08.239 time recommended 01:37:08.239 --> 01:37:14.760 denial of this request to amend the code 621. It then was 01:37:14.760 --> 01:37:15.439 forwarded to City 01:37:15.439 --> 01:37:19.500 Council for their consideration following that meeting. It 01:37:19.500 --> 01:37:20.279 was put on the 01:37:20.279 --> 01:37:24.500 agenda several times and at one point the applicant withd 01:37:24.500 --> 01:37:25.600 rew the application 01:37:25.600 --> 01:37:30.800 and so that application was withdrawn. On April 8th of this 01:37:30.800 --> 01:37:31.520 year the 01:37:31.520 --> 01:37:36.039 applicant resubmitted a new application which is Z167 which 01:37:36.039 --> 01:37:36.520 is what we're 01:37:36.520 --> 01:37:39.840 considering tonight. The difference between the previous 01:37:39.840 --> 01:37:41.039 application and the 01:37:41.039 --> 01:37:45.239 current application is an additional 36 additional parking 01:37:45.239 --> 01:37:46.680 spaces which you see 01:37:46.680 --> 01:37:55.159 shown here just north of the subject property. The subject 01:37:55.159 --> 01:37:56.159 development the 01:37:56.159 --> 01:37:58.789 five-story mixed-use development comprises of the following 01:37:58.789 --> 01:37:59.720 . It mainly 01:37:59.720 --> 01:38:04.000 comprises of a student living apartment which is 01:38:04.000 --> 01:38:07.640 approximately 111,000 01:38:07.640 --> 01:38:14.020 square feet. The rooms will be leased out individually to 01:38:14.020 --> 01:38:15.920 students. The 01:38:15.920 --> 01:38:22.189 development comprises of 83 dwelling units, 9 two bedrooms, 01:38:22.189 --> 01:38:23.760 14 three bedrooms, 01:38:23.760 --> 01:38:27.520 and 64 bedroom units. If you were to multiply that and add 01:38:27.520 --> 01:38:28.279 that all together 01:38:28.279 --> 01:38:33.279 that comes up to 300 bedrooms in total. The building height 01:38:33.279 --> 01:38:35.039 as proposed will be 01:38:35.039 --> 01:38:38.960 approximately 62.05 feet. The development also has a 01:38:38.960 --> 01:38:39.840 parking garage 01:38:39.840 --> 01:38:44.079 that is proposed that will be completely wrapped except for 01:38:44.079 --> 01:38:45.720 an area to the west 01:38:45.720 --> 01:38:51.989 which will still be able to see the parking garage. The 01:38:51.989 --> 01:38:52.680 parking 01:38:52.680 --> 01:38:57.699 garage has 217 spaces and the height of that parking garage 01:38:57.699 --> 01:38:58.720 is approximately 01:38:58.720 --> 01:39:06.640 69.2 feet. In addition to the student living apartment it 01:39:06.640 --> 01:39:07.840 will also include 01:39:07.840 --> 01:39:12.119 some commercial uses a retail development of approximately 01:39:12.119 --> 01:39:13.079 10,766 01:39:13.079 --> 01:39:17.319 square feet which will be the Vortman bookstore location. 01:39:17.319 --> 01:39:19.279 In addition there is 01:39:19.279 --> 01:39:23.720 a restaurant proposed of approximately 1,600. Currently Sub 01:39:23.720 --> 01:39:25.520 way is the proposed 01:39:25.520 --> 01:39:30.539 user however that's not been confirmed. There is also 01:39:30.539 --> 01:39:32.840 parking on site five 01:39:32.840 --> 01:39:36.329 parking spaces to be exact and that's just going to be just 01:39:36.329 --> 01:39:37.079 east of the 01:39:37.079 --> 01:39:41.250 property and again as mentioned earlier there will be an 01:39:41.250 --> 01:39:42.439 additional 36 parking 01:39:42.439 --> 01:39:48.710 spaces which is off-site and that's across Oak Street. The 01:39:48.710 --> 01:39:50.319 table that you see 01:39:50.319 --> 01:39:56.039 here is a summary of what is required in each of the zoning 01:39:56.039 --> 01:39:56.920 I'm sorry each of the 01:39:56.920 --> 01:40:01.739 sub areas sub area A as I'm sorry Mr. Benguita if we could 01:40:01.739 --> 01:40:02.399 just pause for a 01:40:02.399 --> 01:40:05.449 moment I think that we had a member here who was going to 01:40:05.449 --> 01:40:06.439 recuse himself on this 01:40:06.439 --> 01:40:10.130 matter due to a conflict so he'll be leaving the room while 01:40:10.130 --> 01:40:11.319 we discuss this 01:40:11.319 --> 01:40:15.920 and then we'll invite him back in after this item is over. 01:40:15.920 --> 01:40:18.399 Thank you. This chart 01:40:18.399 --> 01:40:23.069 here illustrates the requirements per the sub areas sub 01:40:23.069 --> 01:40:24.560 area A as illustrated 01:40:24.560 --> 01:40:27.850 earlier is everything that is not sub area B which was 01:40:27.850 --> 01:40:29.760 created again in 2002 01:40:29.760 --> 01:40:33.880 I'm sorry 2010. So I'm going to go through these through 01:40:33.880 --> 01:40:34.920 these requirements 01:40:34.920 --> 01:40:38.800 one by one. The first one is the maximum building height in 01:40:38.800 --> 01:40:40.840 the current sub area 01:40:40.840 --> 01:40:44.760 where this property is located the maximum height is three 01:40:44.760 --> 01:40:46.520 stories 45 feet 01:40:46.520 --> 01:40:53.100 they are proposing a maximum height of five stories 62.05 01:40:53.100 --> 01:40:54.920 feet. The parking 01:40:54.920 --> 01:41:01.189 garage in sub area A is 45 feet they are proposing a six- 01:41:01.189 --> 01:41:03.680 story 69.2 feet tall 01:41:03.680 --> 01:41:08.659 parking garage. Maximum density for sub area A is based on 01:41:08.659 --> 01:41:09.399 the development 01:41:09.399 --> 01:41:13.960 standards parking lot coverage all that that will dictate 01:41:13.960 --> 01:41:15.439 the amount of dwelling 01:41:15.439 --> 01:41:19.409 units per acre. The applicant is proposing that there be a 01:41:19.409 --> 01:41:20.560 set amount up 01:41:20.560 --> 01:41:25.250 to 86 dwelling units per acre for the proposed sub area C. 01:41:25.250 --> 01:41:26.960 Parking ratio for 01:41:26.960 --> 01:41:33.720 two bedrooms or more in sub area A it's one space per 01:41:33.720 --> 01:41:34.800 bedroom in 01:41:34.800 --> 01:41:38.859 proposed sub area C the applicant is proposing 0.76 parking 01:41:38.859 --> 01:41:40.079 space per bedroom. 01:41:40.079 --> 01:41:47.279 A couple other standards that are different from sub area A 01:41:47.279 --> 01:41:48.199 building 01:41:48.199 --> 01:41:53.720 coverage an increase up to 20% from 50 to 70 building 01:41:53.720 --> 01:41:55.279 coverage for mixed use a 01:41:55.279 --> 01:41:59.340 1% increase. Minimal landscape area they're requesting that 01:41:59.340 --> 01:41:59.680 that be 01:41:59.680 --> 01:42:04.569 decreased from 15% to 10.7 and a rear yard setback a 01:42:04.569 --> 01:42:05.880 decrease from 10 foot to 01:42:05.880 --> 01:42:12.960 5 foot of setback. For the benefit of the public the 01:42:12.960 --> 01:42:15.520 subject parking requirements 01:42:15.520 --> 01:42:19.569 as it's currently required under sub area A would require 01:42:19.569 --> 01:42:20.840 that the property 01:42:20.840 --> 01:42:27.720 provide 332 parking spaces that's with one space per 01:42:27.720 --> 01:42:30.279 bedroom for the units that 01:42:30.279 --> 01:42:33.460 have two bedrooms or more as opposed to what's currently 01:42:33.460 --> 01:42:35.479 being proposed which 01:42:35.479 --> 01:42:39.369 they're reducing that parking requirement or parking ratio 01:42:39.369 --> 01:42:40.600 down to 0.76 01:42:40.600 --> 01:42:44.989 that equates to approximately 228 parking spaces and if 01:42:44.989 --> 01:42:46.239 they were to be 01:42:46.239 --> 01:42:49.560 approved under the current proposal they would only be 01:42:49.560 --> 01:42:51.760 required to provide 260 01:42:51.760 --> 01:43:00.810 spaces a difference of 72 spaces. For your consideration 01:43:00.810 --> 01:43:01.840 the following 01:43:01.840 --> 01:43:06.300 development does encourage walk walking as well as biking 01:43:06.300 --> 01:43:08.359 it also provides 01:43:08.359 --> 01:43:12.920 extended building setbacks from Oak and Hickory as well as 01:43:12.920 --> 01:43:13.960 it does provide 01:43:13.960 --> 01:43:18.000 commercial uses along Hickory in the form of the retail V 01:43:18.000 --> 01:43:19.560 ortman bookstore as 01:43:19.560 --> 01:43:24.539 well as the restaurant which in this current state is Sub 01:43:24.539 --> 01:43:26.920 way. Also other 01:43:26.920 --> 01:43:30.920 consideration to consider is that the height and density 01:43:30.920 --> 01:43:32.680 the development is not 01:43:32.680 --> 01:43:35.890 compatible with surrounding area there are other buildings 01:43:35.890 --> 01:43:37.159 in the area that are 01:43:37.159 --> 01:43:42.430 much less. The Friday Street overlay district was put in 01:43:42.430 --> 01:43:44.359 place and when it was 01:43:44.359 --> 01:43:48.720 put in place there was an intent to relax I'm sorry to 01:43:48.720 --> 01:43:50.000 provide adequate 01:43:50.000 --> 01:43:53.079 parking for residents in fact the parking requirements for 01:43:53.079 --> 01:43:53.760 two units or 01:43:53.760 --> 01:43:57.550 more in this overlay district is much higher than any parts 01:43:57.550 --> 01:43:58.439 of the others other 01:43:58.439 --> 01:44:02.359 parts of the city it also relaxes parking for the retail 01:44:02.359 --> 01:44:03.800 and residential 01:44:03.800 --> 01:44:08.260 uses the requirements for the overlay district is less here 01:44:08.260 --> 01:44:09.640 than it is for 01:44:09.640 --> 01:44:14.310 other parts of the city. Other consideration the solid 01:44:14.310 --> 01:44:15.399 waste requirement 01:44:15.399 --> 01:44:18.550 that is required by our solid waste department is still 01:44:18.550 --> 01:44:20.119 being discussed and a 01:44:20.119 --> 01:44:24.789 resolution has not yet been reached. An approved agreement 01:44:24.789 --> 01:44:26.119 has not been received 01:44:26.119 --> 01:44:30.890 from the applicant this agreement is to ensure that there 01:44:30.890 --> 01:44:32.880 is a 10-foot clearance 01:44:32.880 --> 01:44:36.510 around the entire building as it is currently proposed on 01:44:36.510 --> 01:44:38.039 the site plan they 01:44:38.039 --> 01:44:42.949 are five feet from the property line on the west they can 01:44:42.949 --> 01:44:44.779 propose that as long 01:44:44.779 --> 01:44:47.890 as there's an agreement with the property owner adjacent to 01:44:47.890 --> 01:44:48.760 the site if 01:44:48.760 --> 01:44:51.449 they were to get that agreement then our fire department 01:44:51.449 --> 01:44:52.439 would accept that but 01:44:52.439 --> 01:44:57.210 again we would have to have an agreement in order to 01:44:57.210 --> 01:45:00.760 confirm that. The continuous 01:45:00.760 --> 01:45:04.829 amendment to the Fry Street overlay district compromises 01:45:04.829 --> 01:45:05.840 the compatibility 01:45:05.840 --> 01:45:09.899 of the uses around the area and also really compromises the 01:45:09.899 --> 01:45:10.800 purpose and 01:45:10.800 --> 01:45:15.529 intent of the district as it was first proposed or first 01:45:15.529 --> 01:45:17.659 adopted. Lastly the 01:45:17.659 --> 01:45:21.050 proposed amendment and associate development standards is 01:45:21.050 --> 01:45:21.800 not consistent 01:45:21.800 --> 01:45:25.600 with the dam plan 2030 in regards to scale character and as 01:45:25.600 --> 01:45:26.479 well as the 01:45:26.479 --> 01:45:31.390 potential impact to adjacent neighborhoods. Notifications 01:45:31.390 --> 01:45:32.199 were sent out 01:45:32.199 --> 01:45:37.520 to property owners within 200 and 500 foot there were 51 01:45:37.520 --> 01:45:38.279 male certified 01:45:38.279 --> 01:45:42.090 males that were sent out and 124 regular male within 01:45:42.090 --> 01:45:44.319 properties within 500. We've 01:45:44.319 --> 01:45:51.039 received four responses two in favor and in tune opposition 01:45:51.039 --> 01:45:53.119 . With that staff is 01:45:53.119 --> 01:45:56.539 recommending denial of the subject requests for the 01:45:56.539 --> 01:45:58.720 following reason the 01:45:58.720 --> 01:46:01.199 proposed development or proposed code amendment is not 01:46:01.199 --> 01:46:02.159 consistent with the 01:46:02.159 --> 01:46:05.560 dam plan 2030 it compromises the effectiveness of the 01:46:05.560 --> 01:46:06.560 overlay district 01:46:06.560 --> 01:46:09.729 it's not compatible with the surrounding area and the 01:46:09.729 --> 01:46:11.439 development standards are 01:46:11.439 --> 01:46:15.939 inconsistent with the proposed site plan. I just want to 01:46:15.939 --> 01:46:17.479 state that we've been 01:46:17.479 --> 01:46:21.369 working with the applicant for several months now trying to 01:46:21.369 --> 01:46:22.520 get a product or a 01:46:22.520 --> 01:46:26.350 code amendment that is acceptable by staff we've been 01:46:26.350 --> 01:46:27.600 working on it for 01:46:27.600 --> 01:46:32.720 several times we were just not able to get there and the 01:46:32.720 --> 01:46:34.680 applicant chose to move 01:46:34.680 --> 01:46:37.670 forward with the application as is and that's why you're 01:46:37.670 --> 01:46:39.239 hearing it today. A 01:46:39.239 --> 01:46:43.640 couple other reasons again our solid waste requirement has 01:46:43.640 --> 01:46:45.279 not been met and a 01:46:45.279 --> 01:46:49.869 pending solution is still being worked out as well as the 01:46:49.869 --> 01:46:51.079 boundary adjustment 01:46:51.079 --> 01:46:53.510 which I described earlier has not yet been obtained and 01:46:53.510 --> 01:46:54.560 that's something that 01:46:54.560 --> 01:46:59.579 we look forward to getting soon. With that that concludes 01:46:59.579 --> 01:47:00.760 my presentation I 01:47:00.760 --> 01:47:03.930 will be happy to answer any question that the Commission 01:47:03.930 --> 01:47:05.159 may have. A couple 01:47:05.159 --> 01:47:08.310 questions Commissioner Roselle. Thank you chair appreciate 01:47:08.310 --> 01:47:09.439 the presentation I have 01:47:09.439 --> 01:47:12.159 a couple questions you mentioned that the parking 01:47:12.159 --> 01:47:13.439 requirements for the Frye 01:47:13.439 --> 01:47:16.479 Street overlay district are less than other parts of the 01:47:16.479 --> 01:47:17.479 city what is the 01:47:17.479 --> 01:47:20.079 general parking requirement ratio for two-bedroom or more 01:47:20.079 --> 01:47:20.920 apartments in the 01:47:20.920 --> 01:47:26.449 city? Let me clarify that for the residential it's actually 01:47:26.449 --> 01:47:27.640 more than 01:47:27.640 --> 01:47:30.329 other parts of the city where it is less it's in the 01:47:30.329 --> 01:47:31.840 commercial uses the retail 01:47:31.840 --> 01:47:35.989 and the restaurant so for example a two-bedroom we'll go 01:47:35.989 --> 01:47:36.840 back to residential 01:47:36.840 --> 01:47:46.439 a two-bedroom unit would require 1.75 spaces where in this 01:47:46.439 --> 01:47:47.840 is this area is 01:47:47.840 --> 01:47:51.960 it's one space per bedroom. So it's already been lowered a 01:47:51.960 --> 01:47:53.039 little bit almost 01:47:53.039 --> 01:47:55.760 by half for this overlay already for residential? It's 01:47:55.760 --> 01:47:56.800 actually I'm sorry if I 01:47:56.800 --> 01:48:00.439 didn't clarify that it actually increased because the 1.75 01:48:00.439 --> 01:48:01.760 is per unit 01:48:01.760 --> 01:48:05.770 I didn't clarify that so a two-bedroom would be required 1. 01:48:05.770 --> 01:48:07.840 75 parking spaces 01:48:07.840 --> 01:48:11.119 outside the overlay but because this is in the overlay a 01:48:11.119 --> 01:48:13.560 two-bedroom unit would 01:48:13.560 --> 01:48:16.560 require two parking spaces so it's higher in the overlay 01:48:16.560 --> 01:48:17.520 district for the 01:48:17.520 --> 01:48:20.920 residential component. Perfect I appreciate the 01:48:20.920 --> 01:48:22.439 clarification and then on 01:48:22.439 --> 01:48:25.470 your slide that was actually providing background there is 01:48:25.470 --> 01:48:26.399 a image and it was 01:48:26.399 --> 01:48:30.000 entitled UNT student housing at the bottom is that an 01:48:30.000 --> 01:48:31.680 official designation 01:48:31.680 --> 01:48:34.199 that they have to get approved by UNT to be a student 01:48:34.199 --> 01:48:36.279 housing king? I'm not sure if 01:48:36.279 --> 01:48:40.329 that is intended I think that was just for either purpose 01:48:40.329 --> 01:48:41.600 of putting together 01:48:41.600 --> 01:48:44.989 the rendering I don't think that's something that they have 01:48:44.989 --> 01:48:45.840 obtained 01:48:45.840 --> 01:48:48.109 through the University but we can certainly ask the 01:48:48.109 --> 01:48:49.039 applicant if that's 01:48:49.039 --> 01:48:53.399 the case. Perfect thank you. Commissioner Beck. Thank you 01:48:53.399 --> 01:48:53.840 chair. 01:48:53.840 --> 01:49:00.359 Thanks for your presentation. There were about four items I 01:49:00.359 --> 01:49:01.359 think you mentioned 01:49:01.359 --> 01:49:03.989 they're still not resolved with this there was a list of 01:49:03.989 --> 01:49:04.800 things back in 01:49:04.800 --> 01:49:09.760 January we dealt with that hadn't been resolved then so for 01:49:09.760 --> 01:49:10.439 the benefit of our 01:49:10.439 --> 01:49:16.439 audience could you convey what EDR has addressed? Sure back 01:49:16.439 --> 01:49:17.680 in January of this 01:49:17.680 --> 01:49:21.279 year one of the things that wasn't addressed at the time 01:49:21.279 --> 01:49:22.560 was the submittal 01:49:22.560 --> 01:49:26.560 and review of a traffic impact analysis a TIA that has 01:49:26.560 --> 01:49:28.479 since been submitted and 01:49:28.479 --> 01:49:33.659 reviewed and accepted by our engineering department. The 01:49:33.659 --> 01:49:35.479 other item that we 01:49:35.479 --> 01:49:39.600 discussed at the January 27th meeting was the fire lane 01:49:39.600 --> 01:49:41.199 separation from the 01:49:41.199 --> 01:49:44.550 building the applicant was able to address that and they do 01:49:44.550 --> 01:49:45.439 now meet the 01:49:45.439 --> 01:49:50.170 requirements of the fire department. Thank you. Any other 01:49:50.170 --> 01:49:52.880 questions for staff? 01:49:52.880 --> 01:49:59.560 Thank you Ron. Got quite a few cards wishing to speak I'm 01:49:59.560 --> 01:50:02.119 gonna start with 01:50:02.399 --> 01:50:06.170 I'm gonna start with the applicant I have actually two 01:50:06.170 --> 01:50:07.079 cards I don't know who 01:50:07.079 --> 01:50:12.560 would like to go first. Thank you very much Mr. Chair 01:50:12.560 --> 01:50:13.319 ladies and gentlemen my 01:50:13.319 --> 01:50:17.319 name is Rob Baldwin I was at 3904 Elm Street Suite B here 01:50:17.319 --> 01:50:18.800 in Dallas and I'm 01:50:18.800 --> 01:50:23.000 I'm representing EDR in this in processing this application 01:50:23.000 --> 01:50:23.800 . Thank you 01:50:23.800 --> 01:50:26.609 very much for your time I know some of you it's deja vu 01:50:26.609 --> 01:50:27.800 again because you saw 01:50:27.800 --> 01:50:33.359 us here in January. There is we were back in the process 01:50:33.359 --> 01:50:34.479 because we secured more 01:50:34.479 --> 01:50:38.260 parking and then when we resubmitted we thought that we 01:50:38.260 --> 01:50:39.880 tried to take an avenue 01:50:39.880 --> 01:50:42.789 of reducing parking administratively through to the 01:50:42.789 --> 01:50:44.079 planning department which 01:50:44.079 --> 01:50:49.279 did not work out so we our application is about the same as 01:50:49.279 --> 01:50:50.439 it was but with 01:50:50.439 --> 01:50:54.359 additional parking the the heights are actually the same as 01:50:54.359 --> 01:50:55.239 they were when you 01:50:55.239 --> 01:50:58.909 saw in January the difference was we were in our initial 01:50:58.909 --> 01:50:59.920 submittal we were 01:50:59.920 --> 01:51:04.380 to talk about average grade for measuring our heights as 01:51:04.380 --> 01:51:05.520 the city code 01:51:05.520 --> 01:51:09.880 requires but when working through Ron Ron wanted us to add 01:51:09.880 --> 01:51:11.079 the maximum height 01:51:11.079 --> 01:51:13.750 that it would be from existing grade rather than average 01:51:13.750 --> 01:51:14.720 grade so that's why 01:51:14.720 --> 01:51:17.699 it looks like we've increased the height but we really 01:51:17.699 --> 01:51:19.840 haven't. The two items that 01:51:19.840 --> 01:51:25.609 are really outstanding that the last two items one the the 01:51:25.609 --> 01:51:28.239 part of solid waste I 01:51:28.239 --> 01:51:31.220 do a lot of zoning for apartments and a lot of most of the 01:51:31.220 --> 01:51:32.439 apartments that I do 01:51:32.439 --> 01:51:37.310 right now they do have the system where the garbage is 01:51:37.310 --> 01:51:38.520 wheeled out during 01:51:38.520 --> 01:51:41.489 collection days and wheeled back in that way they don't 01:51:41.489 --> 01:51:42.640 have a dumpster area 01:51:42.640 --> 01:51:46.140 which attracts rodents and and smells and everything and it 01:51:46.140 --> 01:51:47.239 works really fine 01:51:47.239 --> 01:51:49.920 and it works well and I'm confident we can work something 01:51:49.920 --> 01:51:51.039 out with the city but 01:51:51.039 --> 01:51:54.479 until we get the issue with the zoning solved we didn't 01:51:54.479 --> 01:51:55.560 want to spend a whole 01:51:55.560 --> 01:51:58.109 lot of time and aggravation going through that. The same 01:51:58.109 --> 01:51:59.079 thing with the 01:51:59.079 --> 01:52:02.140 five-foot boundary agreement we've met with our neighboring 01:52:02.140 --> 01:52:03.079 property owners and 01:52:03.079 --> 01:52:06.560 we're we're confident we can reach an agreement on that but 01:52:06.560 --> 01:52:07.079 they would be in a 01:52:07.079 --> 01:52:09.750 form of a deed restriction to get recorded in the deed 01:52:09.750 --> 01:52:11.119 records and until 01:52:11.119 --> 01:52:15.149 we get zoning in place we didn't want to go through the all 01:52:15.149 --> 01:52:16.640 that exercise as well. 01:52:16.640 --> 01:52:20.439 We fully understand that until those two things get solved 01:52:20.439 --> 01:52:21.880 even if this gets 01:52:21.880 --> 01:52:24.770 approved we couldn't move forward until those were solved 01:52:24.770 --> 01:52:25.520 and and we're 01:52:25.520 --> 01:52:29.039 confident we can get those solved so that's two things. Can 01:52:29.039 --> 01:52:29.600 I stop you a sec? 01:52:29.600 --> 01:52:32.539 Did you say you do have an agreement reached with the 01:52:32.539 --> 01:52:33.279 neighbor? We're 01:52:33.279 --> 01:52:36.840 confident we're going to be able to get one. We've met with 01:52:36.840 --> 01:52:37.479 them and they've 01:52:37.479 --> 01:52:41.159 showed interest in entering into an agreement with us. Okay 01:52:41.159 --> 01:52:41.920 great thank you. 01:52:41.920 --> 01:52:49.010 Okay this really boils down to parking I think. Our heights 01:52:49.010 --> 01:52:49.680 really not any 01:52:49.680 --> 01:52:53.090 different from from Fry the U Center Fry Street. The 01:52:53.090 --> 01:52:54.800 difference between those two 01:52:54.800 --> 01:53:00.199 is that we're proposing less parking for the residential 01:53:00.199 --> 01:53:02.920 portion of 0.7 parking 01:53:02.920 --> 01:53:07.880 spaces per bed versus the one per bed that they do. Rodney 01:53:07.880 --> 01:53:09.079 King will who's my 01:53:09.079 --> 01:53:11.039 client will come up and go through this whole presentation. 01:53:11.039 --> 01:53:11.600 I'll just take a 01:53:11.600 --> 01:53:15.470 minute though. What we're proposing is actually consistent 01:53:15.470 --> 01:53:16.359 in our mind with the 01:53:16.359 --> 01:53:19.739 comprehensive plan. There's a provision of the Denton 2030 01:53:19.739 --> 01:53:20.720 plan that says if 01:53:20.720 --> 01:53:23.479 you're adjacent to the University you you're a good 01:53:23.479 --> 01:53:24.840 candidate to have reduced 01:53:24.840 --> 01:53:27.729 parking because you're putting students right across the 01:53:27.729 --> 01:53:28.600 street from where 01:53:28.600 --> 01:53:32.090 they're going to school. I am a father of one daughter who 01:53:32.090 --> 01:53:33.319 's in college and one 01:53:33.319 --> 01:53:35.630 is about and the son is about to go to college and I've 01:53:35.630 --> 01:53:36.600 been to the colleges 01:53:36.600 --> 01:53:39.819 and kids don't drive as much as they did when I was a kid. 01:53:39.819 --> 01:53:41.800 It's too convenient to 01:53:41.800 --> 01:53:46.840 take uber bicycles other ways to get around especially in a 01:53:46.840 --> 01:53:47.560 college town and 01:53:47.560 --> 01:53:51.560 we're confident that that would be recognized by the 01:53:51.560 --> 01:53:53.199 students who live here. 01:53:53.199 --> 01:53:56.720 Rodney will go into more details on that but I do think 01:53:56.720 --> 01:53:57.880 that in the state of the 01:53:57.880 --> 01:54:02.159 art planning in the United States right now increasing 01:54:02.159 --> 01:54:03.600 density next to colleges 01:54:03.600 --> 01:54:08.039 and reducing parking is is common and accepted and it's 01:54:08.039 --> 01:54:09.359 something Rodney will 01:54:09.359 --> 01:54:11.710 go into a little bit more detail with. I do thank you for 01:54:11.710 --> 01:54:12.560 your time I'll turn 01:54:12.560 --> 01:54:16.039 over Rodney. Yes sir. One other question have you 01:54:16.039 --> 01:54:18.239 considered what DCTA services 01:54:18.239 --> 01:54:20.930 would be providing for this facility possibly as well as 01:54:20.930 --> 01:54:21.800 another means of 01:54:21.800 --> 01:54:24.739 transportation for students? Yes sir Rodney had spoken to 01:54:24.739 --> 01:54:27.600 some folks over DCTA to talk 01:54:27.600 --> 01:54:32.199 about altering schedules to accommodate and none of this is 01:54:32.199 --> 01:54:33.479 gonna be zip cars 01:54:33.479 --> 01:54:36.470 here on campus if you know what a zip car is where you 01:54:36.470 --> 01:54:37.760 people can get like a 01:54:37.760 --> 01:54:41.060 fractional ownership of car just use it when they need it. 01:54:41.060 --> 01:54:42.479 So he will go into 01:54:42.479 --> 01:54:46.350 that a little more detail but it's not it's not like it was 01:54:46.350 --> 01:54:47.239 when I was in 01:54:47.239 --> 01:54:49.550 college there's a lot more options. May have one other 01:54:49.550 --> 01:54:50.399 question. Commissioner Beck 01:54:50.399 --> 01:54:53.479 did you have a question? Yes thank you chair thank you Mr. 01:54:53.479 --> 01:54:54.840 Baldwin for your presentation. 01:54:54.840 --> 01:54:58.710 I would beg to disagree with you though on the height issue 01:54:58.710 --> 01:55:00.000 probably nothing's 01:55:00.000 --> 01:55:03.289 changed but that would mean that the taller height was 01:55:03.289 --> 01:55:04.520 always there in the 01:55:04.520 --> 01:55:08.760 first place in my opinion. Well I was I was at the briefing 01:55:08.760 --> 01:55:09.319 session we talked 01:55:09.319 --> 01:55:12.069 about the sixth floor the sixth floor of a parking garage 01:55:12.069 --> 01:55:13.000 is the same height as a 01:55:13.000 --> 01:55:15.439 five-story a six-story parking garage the same height as a 01:55:15.439 --> 01:55:16.920 five-story residential 01:55:16.920 --> 01:55:20.439 structure because they have lower heights between floors. 01:55:20.439 --> 01:55:22.000 Okay but standing 01:55:22.000 --> 01:55:26.510 side-by-side to sub area A and B are you saying we wouldn't 01:55:26.510 --> 01:55:27.520 see any difference 01:55:27.520 --> 01:55:31.180 in height? Not with A because A has a much shorter height A 01:55:31.180 --> 01:55:32.560 is 35 feet I 01:55:32.560 --> 01:55:35.789 believe between us and the youth center we're within two 01:55:35.789 --> 01:55:37.079 feet of each other. Okay 01:55:37.079 --> 01:55:39.869 let me put you on the spot a little bit here. Okay that's 01:55:39.869 --> 01:55:45.319 what I'm here for. You in your opinion what do you think 01:55:45.319 --> 01:55:51.359 were the top two things that the residents were opposed to? 01:55:51.359 --> 01:55:55.920 Could you? Parking and height. Okay yeah and you've made it 01:55:55.920 --> 01:55:57.039 advance a little bit on the 01:55:57.039 --> 01:55:59.760 parking yet you're still under that and the height really 01:55:59.760 --> 01:56:00.840 hasn't changed at all 01:56:00.840 --> 01:56:05.439 so I'm just curious other than you made a couple of changes 01:56:05.439 --> 01:56:07.439 what brings you back 01:56:07.439 --> 01:56:11.029 here thinking that there's going to be a change of? We 01:56:11.029 --> 01:56:12.920 really believe this is a 01:56:12.920 --> 01:56:16.930 good project and I understand the position you're in it's 01:56:16.930 --> 01:56:17.840 hard to to go 01:56:17.840 --> 01:56:21.539 against neighborhood opposition but we think from a an 01:56:21.539 --> 01:56:23.319 urban design standpoint 01:56:23.319 --> 01:56:27.109 this project makes sense and it made sense for the youth 01:56:27.109 --> 01:56:28.239 center to go there 01:56:28.239 --> 01:56:32.279 and at that height I don't see why it would make less sense 01:56:32.279 --> 01:56:33.399 for us to come in 01:56:33.399 --> 01:56:37.649 so it really boils down in my mind to parking and Rodney 01:56:37.649 --> 01:56:39.600 will go into research 01:56:39.600 --> 01:56:44.869 he's done where the youth center parking is not utilized at 01:56:44.869 --> 01:56:46.640 100%. There's 01:56:46.640 --> 01:56:50.800 there's plenty of extra spaces as are the 33 degrees north 01:56:50.800 --> 01:56:51.920 there's lots of 01:56:51.920 --> 01:56:55.000 spaces in their parking garages that are not used because 01:56:55.000 --> 01:56:56.000 the students just don't 01:56:56.000 --> 01:56:59.880 bring the cars in it so to speak to your point I thought 01:56:59.880 --> 01:57:02.239 that when we resubmitted 01:57:02.239 --> 01:57:06.039 I thought that we're gonna get a lot closer to meeting the 01:57:06.039 --> 01:57:07.479 parking requirement 01:57:07.479 --> 01:57:09.979 based on a administrative reduction in parking that we 01:57:09.979 --> 01:57:11.079 thought we were going to 01:57:11.079 --> 01:57:13.760 get which we didn't but when we were in the system we still 01:57:13.760 --> 01:57:14.479 think it's a good 01:57:14.479 --> 01:57:17.869 project. Thank you sir. You're welcome. One more question. 01:57:17.869 --> 01:57:19.239 Commissioner Ellis. Thank 01:57:19.239 --> 01:57:22.640 you chair. Good evening. Question with regard to the 01:57:22.640 --> 01:57:24.399 securing of the extra 01:57:24.399 --> 01:57:27.729 parking spaces which I understand is now a current parking 01:57:27.729 --> 01:57:28.680 lot is that correct? 01:57:28.680 --> 01:57:32.239 Yes ma'am. And what is it being used for now? I'm sorry? 01:57:32.239 --> 01:57:33.279 What is it currently 01:57:33.279 --> 01:57:35.960 being used for now? I understand it's being used I'll let 01:57:35.960 --> 01:57:36.720 Rodney speak to it 01:57:36.720 --> 01:57:41.449 as well but it's being used for Vortman's employee parking 01:57:41.449 --> 01:57:41.880 it's what I 01:57:41.880 --> 01:57:45.640 understand. Okay thank you. But when he comes up grill him 01:57:45.640 --> 01:57:46.760 he'll know for sure. 01:57:46.760 --> 01:57:50.319 I'm gonna turn over this is Rodney King with EDR out of 01:57:50.319 --> 01:57:52.479 Memphis he's here as the 01:57:52.479 --> 01:57:57.210 developer. Great thank you. Thank you guys. Not a short 01:57:57.210 --> 01:57:58.319 presentation but I'll skip 01:57:58.319 --> 01:58:03.720 through most of it since. Sorry you got ten minutes so. 01:58:03.720 --> 01:58:06.840 Take your time. 01:58:08.479 --> 01:58:11.000 Well just to give you guys a little bit of background about 01:58:11.000 --> 01:58:11.920 EDR we're based in 01:58:11.920 --> 01:58:14.470 Memphis Tennessee with the nation's second largest student 01:58:14.470 --> 01:58:15.720 housing REIT. We're 01:58:15.720 --> 01:58:18.369 a public company we've been around in business for 52 years 01:58:18.369 --> 01:58:19.359 we have about 40 01:58:19.359 --> 01:58:22.880 thousand beds nationwide. We also have six properties in 01:58:22.880 --> 01:58:25.119 Texas ranging located 01:58:25.119 --> 01:58:28.199 in Lubbock all the way down to Texas A&M Commerce what not 01:58:28.199 --> 01:58:29.239 all the way down that 01:58:29.239 --> 01:58:34.439 that marker is wrong all the way down to San Marcos Texas. 01:58:34.439 --> 01:58:36.079 Here just a few of our 01:58:36.079 --> 01:58:39.020 projects in glance as you'll see the project at the bottom 01:58:39.020 --> 01:58:39.800 right is it in 01:58:39.800 --> 01:58:43.189 Fort Worth. We pride ourselves on trying to complement the 01:58:43.189 --> 01:58:44.199 existing architecture 01:58:44.199 --> 01:58:49.109 while improving the site. Here's our project at University 01:58:49.109 --> 01:58:50.039 of Minnesota and 01:58:50.039 --> 01:58:58.560 also Texas Tech. This is Yukon and Austin. Here's a little 01:58:58.560 --> 01:59:00.359 bit of project overview 01:59:00.359 --> 01:59:03.380 as you guys can see we've been you know pursuing this 01:59:03.380 --> 01:59:04.840 project for quite a while 01:59:04.840 --> 01:59:08.439 now over a year. We've had several public meetings we've 01:59:08.439 --> 01:59:11.359 tried to intake the 01:59:11.359 --> 01:59:14.939 public's comments and adjust the plans as necessary. We 01:59:14.939 --> 01:59:16.640 think we've come to a 01:59:16.640 --> 01:59:20.720 final point of the plans that's why we're back here today 01:59:20.720 --> 01:59:21.720 to kind of bring 01:59:21.720 --> 01:59:25.539 a conclusion to this matter. I believe we've made the 01:59:25.539 --> 01:59:26.880 project better once we 01:59:26.880 --> 01:59:30.140 initially started out with the project before we even got 01:59:30.140 --> 01:59:31.560 to P&Z we're about 60% 01:59:31.560 --> 01:59:35.050 park so we've made material increases in the parking we've 01:59:35.050 --> 01:59:36.239 reduced the density 01:59:36.239 --> 01:59:41.800 quite a bit. And Rob alluded to this earlier we actually 01:59:41.800 --> 01:59:42.880 believe this project 01:59:42.880 --> 01:59:48.199 supports the DEN plan 2030. One of the items in the plan is 01:59:48.199 --> 01:59:49.680 supports mixed use 01:59:49.680 --> 01:59:52.789 projects and close proximity to the university. In our 01:59:52.789 --> 01:59:54.000 opinion you can't get 01:59:54.000 --> 01:59:56.710 any closer to the university than this project it is 01:59:56.710 --> 01:59:58.279 literally right across the 01:59:58.279 --> 02:00:01.500 street and it is it is a mixed use project the majority of 02:00:01.500 --> 02:00:02.439 the first floor 02:00:02.439 --> 02:00:06.149 is commercial spaces and also one of the tenants of the 02:00:06.149 --> 02:00:07.439 plan is to create a 02:00:07.439 --> 02:00:10.329 buffer zone between the university and the historic 02:00:10.329 --> 02:00:11.680 neighborhoods and Frye 02:00:11.680 --> 02:00:14.689 Street and Hickory and Oak is that buffer zone in our 02:00:14.689 --> 02:00:16.720 opinion. The scale of 02:00:16.720 --> 02:00:19.319 the project comes down from the university I think you have 02:00:19.319 --> 02:00:19.800 about eight 02:00:19.800 --> 02:00:22.859 nine-story university buildings right across the street so 02:00:22.859 --> 02:00:23.840 this gradually 02:00:23.840 --> 02:00:27.109 brings down the scale of the university into the to the 02:00:27.109 --> 02:00:28.640 neighborhoods and also 02:00:28.640 --> 02:00:32.020 just and collegiate housing in general purpose-built colleg 02:00:32.020 --> 02:00:34.239 iate housing draws 02:00:34.239 --> 02:00:38.420 from the shadow market in our opinion it takes away from 02:00:38.420 --> 02:00:40.039 those students renting 02:00:40.039 --> 02:00:43.359 houses that are five six seven people in a single-family 02:00:43.359 --> 02:00:44.920 house and puts them in a 02:00:44.920 --> 02:00:48.789 project and a product that is specifically geared toward 02:00:48.789 --> 02:00:50.319 them. And the 02:00:50.319 --> 02:00:53.840 then 2030 plan also supports relaxed parking and close 02:00:53.840 --> 02:00:54.800 proximity to the 02:00:54.800 --> 02:00:59.470 university. As I said we believe this project is consistent 02:00:59.470 --> 02:01:00.399 with the plan and 02:01:00.399 --> 02:01:04.369 we hope you guys do too. Just a little bit of information 02:01:04.369 --> 02:01:05.760 on the project is 300 02:01:05.760 --> 02:01:13.069 beds 222 spaces about 77 76.7 percent part is located at 13 02:01:13.069 --> 02:01:14.079 14 Hickory Street 02:01:14.079 --> 02:01:17.840 obviously right across the street from the university. This 02:01:17.840 --> 02:01:18.579 is just a 02:01:18.579 --> 02:01:22.449 comparison to a couple other purpose-built student housing 02:01:22.449 --> 02:01:23.720 projects. We 02:01:23.720 --> 02:01:26.539 believe this project is extremely similar to the youth 02:01:26.539 --> 02:01:27.600 center at Fry Street. 02:01:27.600 --> 02:01:32.140 They are one-to-one park which is probably a block away but 02:01:32.140 --> 02:01:32.960 according to 02:01:32.960 --> 02:01:35.470 our research and according to the manager on site they're 02:01:35.470 --> 02:01:36.159 not utilizing 02:01:36.159 --> 02:01:39.750 all of their parking. So we didn't feel like it was prudent 02:01:39.750 --> 02:01:41.000 or market the market 02:01:41.000 --> 02:01:44.710 wasn't suggesting we needed more parking to satisfy the 02:01:44.710 --> 02:01:46.359 need. The last thing we 02:01:46.359 --> 02:01:49.020 want to do is build a project that's not successful. If we 02:01:49.020 --> 02:01:50.399 believe that we needed 02:01:50.399 --> 02:01:55.130 more parking we would we would we would obviously do it. 02:01:55.130 --> 02:01:56.920 Here's a comparison of 02:01:56.920 --> 02:02:00.050 33 degrees north which is on the south side of campus. It's 02:02:00.050 --> 02:02:01.840 427 beds about two 02:02:01.840 --> 02:02:07.119 348 spaces about 275 are utilized. That's between half and 02:02:07.119 --> 02:02:09.520 three quarters. So the 02:02:09.520 --> 02:02:13.090 market is telling us what the parking demand is for these 02:02:13.090 --> 02:02:14.399 types of projects in 02:02:14.399 --> 02:02:18.270 our opinion. Here's just a quick comparison of the project. 02:02:18.270 --> 02:02:19.319 Rob alluded to 02:02:19.319 --> 02:02:22.649 the height earlier. The height did not grow the way we 02:02:22.649 --> 02:02:24.239 measured height is the 02:02:24.239 --> 02:02:28.310 difference between now and when we present it back in 02:02:28.310 --> 02:02:31.399 January. We also have 02:02:31.399 --> 02:02:34.149 our engineers here for the traffic study. I don't know if 02:02:34.149 --> 02:02:35.159 you guys want us to go 02:02:35.159 --> 02:02:37.739 into detail with it now or we could kind of reserve that 02:02:37.739 --> 02:02:39.399 for questions. I leave it 02:02:39.399 --> 02:02:43.279 up to you Mr. Chair. Let's do for questions. I'm sorry. If 02:02:43.279 --> 02:02:43.920 there's questions 02:02:43.920 --> 02:02:51.090 in the essence of time. Sure sure. Sure if you want to go. 02:02:51.090 --> 02:02:51.359 If you're 02:02:51.359 --> 02:02:55.229 asking if I understood your question you wanted to see if 02:02:55.229 --> 02:02:55.800 we need to have your 02:02:55.800 --> 02:02:58.380 engineers correct. And I think you said if we had questions 02:02:58.380 --> 02:02:59.239 I could come forward. 02:02:59.239 --> 02:03:02.199 I was agreeing with you. If we have questions for them then 02:03:02.199 --> 02:03:03.039 yes we'll bring 02:03:03.039 --> 02:03:07.359 them forward at that time. Sorry if that wasn't clear. No 02:03:07.359 --> 02:03:10.279 problem. And some of the 02:03:10.279 --> 02:03:13.619 amenities that will be included in the project is obviously 02:03:13.619 --> 02:03:15.119 zip car. As Rob said 02:03:15.119 --> 02:03:18.340 there's a fractional share of a car. We're students who don 02:03:18.340 --> 02:03:19.199 't own a car but 02:03:19.199 --> 02:03:23.119 need a car on a per trip basis. We will offer that amenity 02:03:23.119 --> 02:03:24.680 in the project. Well 02:03:24.680 --> 02:03:26.930 also we also have a unique relationship with a company 02:03:26.930 --> 02:03:28.319 called Gotcha Bike. It's 02:03:28.319 --> 02:03:31.130 very similar to zip car but it's revolving around bikes. 02:03:31.130 --> 02:03:31.880 You can rent a 02:03:31.880 --> 02:03:34.020 bike. You can rent a bike for a day. You can rent a bike 02:03:34.020 --> 02:03:34.880 for a week and you're 02:03:34.880 --> 02:03:37.399 charged for that. And also Uber obviously. I think 02:03:37.399 --> 02:03:38.079 everybody's pretty 02:03:38.079 --> 02:03:42.109 familiar what Uber is. Same thing with site capacity and 02:03:42.109 --> 02:03:43.600 utilities. If there's any 02:03:43.600 --> 02:03:47.020 questions revolving around it we have our engineers here to 02:03:47.020 --> 02:03:48.800 do that. Some of 02:03:48.800 --> 02:03:51.689 the advantages of the project in our opinion is it's within 02:03:51.689 --> 02:03:52.399 steps of the 02:03:52.399 --> 02:03:55.689 University. We believe this is the highest and best use of 02:03:55.689 --> 02:03:56.960 this site. It is 02:03:56.960 --> 02:03:59.850 purpose-built collegiate housing right across the street 02:03:59.850 --> 02:04:01.319 from the core of UNT's 02:04:01.319 --> 02:04:05.989 campus. UNT is obviously growing and the demand for purpose 02:04:05.989 --> 02:04:06.920 -built student housing 02:04:06.920 --> 02:04:09.810 is here in the community and we're trying to satisfy that 02:04:09.810 --> 02:04:11.640 need. Also based 02:04:11.640 --> 02:04:15.869 on our multiple properties across the country students and 02:04:15.869 --> 02:04:17.199 when you are in this 02:04:17.199 --> 02:04:21.930 close proximity to campus students don't drive their cars 02:04:21.930 --> 02:04:23.520 to class. They get out 02:04:23.520 --> 02:04:26.079 of bed and they walk to class from this type of location. 02:04:26.079 --> 02:04:27.399 If we're in a garden 02:04:27.399 --> 02:04:30.619 style sprawling project two miles away we believe they 02:04:30.619 --> 02:04:32.239 would drive to class but 02:04:32.239 --> 02:04:35.220 in this type of project we don't believe they will. And 02:04:35.220 --> 02:04:36.359 also this creates an 02:04:36.359 --> 02:04:39.229 entertainment district that is within proximity of the 02:04:39.229 --> 02:04:41.159 University. You have the 02:04:41.159 --> 02:04:44.270 first floor commercial use in a fry street and you have the 02:04:44.270 --> 02:04:45.159 majority of our 02:04:45.159 --> 02:04:48.920 first floor commercial uses. So you're creating this 02:04:48.920 --> 02:04:50.640 vibrant walkable district 02:04:50.640 --> 02:04:56.890 within the University within the University's edge. If you 02:04:56.890 --> 02:04:57.399 measure the 02:04:57.399 --> 02:05:01.270 building from its average grade from its prevailing grade 02:05:01.270 --> 02:05:02.439 the average height of 02:05:02.439 --> 02:05:07.479 the buildings about 58 feet and we're asking for a height 02:05:07.479 --> 02:05:09.119 variance of however 02:05:09.119 --> 02:05:11.220 you guys want to measure. We want five stories and however 02:05:11.220 --> 02:05:11.960 you want to measure 02:05:11.960 --> 02:05:15.140 in our opinion is 58 feet. I think the way Ron is measuring 02:05:15.140 --> 02:05:16.880 is 62 feet. We're 02:05:16.880 --> 02:05:20.369 asking for a parking ratio down from 75 to 76 percent from 02:05:20.369 --> 02:05:22.760 the one-to-one. And 02:05:22.760 --> 02:05:25.409 with that I'll take the Commissioner's questions. And a 02:05:25.409 --> 02:05:26.319 couple questions for a 02:05:26.319 --> 02:05:32.869 Commissioner Beck. Thank you Chair. Good seeing you again 02:05:32.869 --> 02:05:34.920 Mr. Keene. I would like to say you do have an excellent 02:05:34.920 --> 02:05:37.199 product. I went on your site and looked at it. You've got a 02:05:37.199 --> 02:05:41.079 remarkable staff, a laundry list of your developments are 02:05:41.079 --> 02:05:43.600 it's awesome. So regardless 02:05:43.600 --> 02:05:46.319 of what the vote turns out to be here tonight I hope that 02:05:46.319 --> 02:05:47.359 Denton does see you 02:05:47.359 --> 02:05:49.729 here and building this because I think you've got a good 02:05:49.729 --> 02:05:51.560 quality product. Now you 02:05:51.560 --> 02:05:54.500 mentioned that this you felt that this site was the highest 02:05:54.500 --> 02:05:55.600 and best use for it. 02:05:55.600 --> 02:05:59.939 But and I don't disagree that we need this type of building 02:05:59.939 --> 02:06:02.159 there but again why 02:06:02.159 --> 02:06:04.880 five stories why not stay within the limits that are 02:06:04.880 --> 02:06:06.159 already set there with 02:06:06.159 --> 02:06:09.100 this overlay district. I think we covered this in January 02:06:09.100 --> 02:06:09.840 but if you would 02:06:09.840 --> 02:06:15.039 reiterate that for us please. Sure what's driving to be 02:06:15.039 --> 02:06:15.880 frank what's driving the 02:06:15.880 --> 02:06:19.869 height of the building is purely economics. Denton without 02:06:19.869 --> 02:06:20.640 going to an 02:06:20.640 --> 02:06:24.579 elaborated finance you know model. Denton is a high 02:06:24.579 --> 02:06:26.640 property tax municipality and 02:06:26.640 --> 02:06:31.279 land values here are rising. So you have to get a certain 02:06:31.279 --> 02:06:33.239 amount of density for 02:06:33.239 --> 02:06:37.399 any project to pencil so to speak. So that's what's driving 02:06:37.399 --> 02:06:38.399 the height of the 02:06:38.399 --> 02:06:42.569 building. If we could build more we would like to on this 02:06:42.569 --> 02:06:43.640 site because we think 02:06:43.640 --> 02:06:46.539 this site is irreplaceable in our opinion. But to be 02:06:46.539 --> 02:06:47.680 compatible with the 02:06:47.680 --> 02:06:51.109 neighborhood and you know it's a balancing act between you 02:06:51.109 --> 02:06:52.039 know economics 02:06:52.039 --> 02:06:55.689 and the land values and property taxes. So that's what's 02:06:55.689 --> 02:06:56.960 really driving the 02:06:56.960 --> 02:07:02.649 height. We believe if the amendment this is you know not a 02:07:02.649 --> 02:07:03.239 front to the 02:07:03.239 --> 02:07:07.840 residents but if the zoning doesn't change and the land 02:07:07.840 --> 02:07:09.000 value and the 02:07:09.000 --> 02:07:12.880 property taxes don't change the only other variable is land 02:07:12.880 --> 02:07:14.640 value. So if you 02:07:14.640 --> 02:07:17.310 can't get density where you need it you can't pay the same 02:07:17.310 --> 02:07:19.159 amount for the land. 02:07:19.159 --> 02:07:22.819 So you're saying anything less than five stories and wouldn 02:07:22.819 --> 02:07:23.920 't be profitable. 02:07:23.920 --> 02:07:30.340 Correct. Not profitable but not feasible. Okay thank you. 02:07:30.340 --> 02:07:31.439 Commissioner Rossell. 02:07:31.439 --> 02:07:34.960 Thank you chair. I have several questions and hopefully I 02:07:34.960 --> 02:07:35.479 can get through these 02:07:35.479 --> 02:07:40.880 efficiently. I'm trying to figure out how many parking 02:07:40.880 --> 02:07:43.840 spaces there are proposed 02:07:43.840 --> 02:07:47.399 in the plan and I can't count the parking garages but to 02:07:47.399 --> 02:07:47.760 your 02:07:47.760 --> 02:07:51.899 understanding how many proposed spaces are in your site 02:07:51.899 --> 02:07:54.239 plan. I understand it's 02:07:54.239 --> 02:07:58.229 260 spaces that means the residential I mean that means the 02:07:58.229 --> 02:07:58.760 retail is 02:07:58.760 --> 02:08:02.680 parked to code. Both uses are parked to code and we're 02:08:02.680 --> 02:08:03.960 asking for a variance on 02:08:03.960 --> 02:08:10.399 the residential piece to 0.76. Okay so in your narrative 02:08:10.399 --> 02:08:12.039 submitted to us it says 02:08:12.039 --> 02:08:16.909 252. Correct. In our city backup it says the requirements 02:08:16.909 --> 02:08:19.880 260 but you have 258 02:08:19.880 --> 02:08:25.520 leaving you short of the proposed that you had of 260. I'm 02:08:25.520 --> 02:08:26.199 not sure where that 02:08:26.199 --> 02:08:30.630 discrepancy comes in but additionally in the backup exhibit 02:08:30.630 --> 02:08:34.880 3575F it outlines the 02:08:34.880 --> 02:08:39.829 additional 36 parking spaces but on this site plan there's 02:08:39.829 --> 02:08:41.840 45 parking spaces not 02:08:41.840 --> 02:08:47.170 36 and so I hope you can understand my confusion. I'm 02:08:47.170 --> 02:08:48.279 trying to understand what 02:08:48.279 --> 02:08:51.220 actual parking is being presented to us to vote on this 02:08:51.220 --> 02:08:52.359 evening so maybe we can 02:08:52.359 --> 02:08:56.119 start with this. In this exhibit for sub area C site plan 02:08:56.119 --> 02:08:57.680 can you help me 02:08:57.680 --> 02:09:01.939 understand what these nine parking spots to the east are? I 02:09:01.939 --> 02:09:04.159 'm not I don't hear 02:09:04.159 --> 02:09:11.390 you. You're more than welcome to. Yeah can you set it on 02:09:11.390 --> 02:09:14.279 the felt? I've got an overhead there. 02:09:20.439 --> 02:09:24.899 Those nine parking spots to the east are technically within 02:09:24.899 --> 02:09:27.840 our survey but 02:09:27.840 --> 02:09:31.520 they're being used by adjacent property owner. We are not 02:09:31.520 --> 02:09:33.439 counting those spaces 02:09:33.439 --> 02:09:37.859 too in the project but we are legally entitled to them but 02:09:37.859 --> 02:09:39.279 we didn't want to 02:09:39.279 --> 02:09:44.630 go through the legal process of claiming those. Okay. There 02:09:44.630 --> 02:09:45.680 's another apartment 02:09:45.680 --> 02:09:49.760 complex outside the outside of the site map. So they have 02:09:49.760 --> 02:09:50.880 like a lease agreement 02:09:50.880 --> 02:09:55.899 or some sort of? Actually they're just encroaching. Okay so 02:09:55.899 --> 02:09:56.439 I'm understanding 02:09:56.439 --> 02:10:00.810 why when parking is so much of an issue you wouldn't 02:10:00.810 --> 02:10:03.239 include those as some that 02:10:03.239 --> 02:10:08.579 y'all could take back in this. That is certainly an avenue 02:10:08.579 --> 02:10:09.600 we may want to 02:10:09.600 --> 02:10:13.199 pursue but in order to keep the project on a certain 02:10:13.199 --> 02:10:14.760 timeline that's a legal 02:10:14.760 --> 02:10:19.100 process that could take a long time. Okay I certainly 02:10:19.100 --> 02:10:21.239 understand the timing of it 02:10:21.239 --> 02:10:23.930 but it seems like low-hanging fruit as we're talking so 02:10:23.930 --> 02:10:25.119 much about parking that 02:10:25.119 --> 02:10:31.109 there's nine spots just sitting on your land. Correct. And 02:10:31.109 --> 02:10:33.220 so I guess to end my 02:10:33.220 --> 02:10:39.600 point on the parking there is 260 not 258 maybe someone 02:10:39.600 --> 02:10:40.760 from City can tell me 02:10:40.760 --> 02:10:45.039 where the 258 is on our backup. 02:10:51.560 --> 02:10:55.279 Commissioner Rezell the 258 is the calculation that the 02:10:55.279 --> 02:10:56.359 applicant has 02:10:56.359 --> 02:11:00.159 specified in their site plan but the way we calculated it 02:11:00.159 --> 02:11:01.199 made me two parking 02:11:01.199 --> 02:11:04.680 spaces off I think what we did was we rounded up and they 02:11:04.680 --> 02:11:05.359 just 02:11:05.359 --> 02:11:07.600 rounded it to the nearest number so that's the difference 02:11:07.600 --> 02:11:08.359 of the two parking 02:11:08.359 --> 02:11:10.800 spaces. So it's feasible if this project goes forward they 02:11:10.800 --> 02:11:11.439 actually could build 02:11:11.439 --> 02:11:15.329 260? The way that the site plan is currently designed they 02:11:15.329 --> 02:11:17.319 show 258 so 02:11:17.319 --> 02:11:22.500 that's what they I believe can produce is 258. Okay thank 02:11:22.500 --> 02:11:26.760 you. So my other two 02:11:26.760 --> 02:11:29.359 two questions and you heard my question earlier about the 02:11:29.359 --> 02:11:30.439 UNT student housing is 02:11:30.439 --> 02:11:32.579 this a designation that's official from the University and 02:11:32.579 --> 02:11:33.560 do you have it? No 02:11:33.560 --> 02:11:37.600 that was just one of our consultants labeling it we are no 02:11:37.600 --> 02:11:38.520 way an affiliated 02:11:38.520 --> 02:11:41.739 with the University of North Texas we believe that the 02:11:41.739 --> 02:11:43.439 market dynamics the 02:11:43.439 --> 02:11:47.439 majority of our tenants will be students of the University 02:11:47.439 --> 02:11:48.800 by way of a type of 02:11:48.800 --> 02:11:51.689 leasing we're instituting here but we're not affiliated 02:11:51.689 --> 02:11:52.840 with the University and 02:11:52.840 --> 02:11:55.590 to kind of put a bow in your parking conversation we've 02:11:55.590 --> 02:11:56.720 been in discussions 02:11:56.720 --> 02:12:00.159 with the University of North Texas you know over the last 02:12:00.159 --> 02:12:02.000 year and they do have 02:12:02.000 --> 02:12:07.239 an underutilized parking garage and we and UNT students are 02:12:07.239 --> 02:12:08.520 entitled to park 02:12:08.520 --> 02:12:12.319 in that garage so we've made the agreement and we're 02:12:12.319 --> 02:12:13.239 certainly willing to 02:12:13.239 --> 02:12:16.800 agree to this subject to approval that if our parking 02:12:16.800 --> 02:12:18.439 exceeds capacity and a 02:12:18.439 --> 02:12:21.329 UNT student needs parking we are willing to pay the 02:12:21.329 --> 02:12:24.119 difference in that garage for 02:12:24.119 --> 02:12:27.720 our students so that effectively brings us well more than a 02:12:27.720 --> 02:12:28.079 hundred percent 02:12:28.079 --> 02:12:31.109 parking and that garage is within a block and a half of our 02:12:31.109 --> 02:12:32.079 site. Do you know 02:12:32.079 --> 02:12:35.050 how many feet that is? I don't know how many feet. I think 02:12:35.050 --> 02:12:36.359 it is within the 1000 02:12:36.359 --> 02:12:38.100 feet. I think our requirements within a thousand. It is 02:12:38.100 --> 02:12:40.119 within 1000 feet. I don't know if 02:12:40.119 --> 02:12:43.369 staff can clarify that point for us during this hearing 02:12:43.369 --> 02:12:44.359 that this particular 02:12:44.359 --> 02:12:46.939 garage would be within a thousand that we may or may not be 02:12:46.939 --> 02:12:47.520 able to consider 02:12:47.520 --> 02:12:52.810 that. We would actually have to measure that to discern the 02:12:52.810 --> 02:12:53.720 distance so we 02:12:53.720 --> 02:12:55.970 wouldn't be able to just look at a map right now we would 02:12:55.970 --> 02:12:56.760 have to get into our 02:12:56.760 --> 02:13:00.149 GIS system and measure that. Okay. So I have one more 02:13:00.149 --> 02:13:03.680 question slash maybe point. 02:13:03.680 --> 02:13:08.090 Both Mr. Baldwin and you Mr. King have talked about really 02:13:08.090 --> 02:13:09.159 the only difference 02:13:09.159 --> 02:13:11.210 here we're talking about is parking how the height is very 02:13:11.210 --> 02:13:12.279 similar. Correct. We 02:13:12.279 --> 02:13:16.279 were provided from the considerations of staff differences 02:13:16.279 --> 02:13:18.399 in what is currently 02:13:18.399 --> 02:13:23.819 in sub A and sub B and what is being proposed by EDR and so 02:13:23.819 --> 02:13:24.560 if I understand 02:13:24.560 --> 02:13:27.720 this correctly there is a change to maximum building height 02:13:27.720 --> 02:13:28.640 requested, a 02:13:28.640 --> 02:13:31.859 change to maximum parking garage height requested, a change 02:13:31.859 --> 02:13:32.920 of maximum density 02:13:32.920 --> 02:13:36.840 requested, a change or an increase to building coverage for 02:13:36.840 --> 02:13:37.880 residential, an 02:13:37.880 --> 02:13:40.890 increased change to building coverage for mixed use, there 02:13:40.890 --> 02:13:41.880 's a decrease 02:13:41.880 --> 02:13:45.119 requirement for minimum landscape area and there is a 02:13:45.119 --> 02:13:46.479 request to reduce the 02:13:46.479 --> 02:13:51.149 rear yard setback. Y'all are asking for more than parking. 02:13:51.149 --> 02:13:53.039 All those requests are 02:13:53.039 --> 02:13:56.970 particularly driven by height. If we took a story off the 02:13:56.970 --> 02:13:59.000 building obviously the 02:13:59.000 --> 02:14:02.880 density per acre goes down so the primary drivers of those 02:14:02.880 --> 02:14:03.840 requests are 02:14:03.840 --> 02:14:09.600 height in our opinion. Okay thank you. Commissioner Hesbeth 02:14:09.600 --> 02:14:10.840 . Thank You Chair. 02:14:10.840 --> 02:14:16.560 Mr. King. So I have a functional question following up from 02:14:16.560 --> 02:14:17.840 our previous 02:14:17.840 --> 02:14:21.840 conversation. So I'm gonna use and I forget his name the 02:14:21.840 --> 02:14:22.600 first presenter. 02:14:22.600 --> 02:14:27.359 Mr. Baldwin. Thank you. So using that example so Mr. 02:14:27.359 --> 02:14:32.090 Baldwin sends his son to UNT and there at your facility 02:14:32.090 --> 02:14:34.880 right and so my 02:14:34.880 --> 02:14:40.520 question is if he's leasing a room or an apartment in that 02:14:40.520 --> 02:14:42.920 in a quad if you will 02:14:42.920 --> 02:14:46.550 what controls do you have understanding you're limited 02:14:46.550 --> 02:14:47.960 legally and who else 02:14:47.960 --> 02:14:51.069 fills those other three spaces so for example I have all 02:14:51.069 --> 02:14:52.319 daughters right so if 02:14:52.319 --> 02:14:55.359 my daughter's in one of those locations what controls do 02:14:55.359 --> 02:14:58.439 you have about 45 50 02:14:58.439 --> 02:15:02.899 60 year old man renting an apartment in that same quad as a 02:15:02.899 --> 02:15:04.239 20 year old girl? 02:15:04.239 --> 02:15:08.789 First we must abide by all fair housing laws you know that 02:15:08.789 --> 02:15:11.159 's supreme but the 02:15:11.159 --> 02:15:15.800 type of programs and the type of leasing that we implement 02:15:15.800 --> 02:15:17.319 in these projects I 02:15:17.319 --> 02:15:22.550 would venture to say that 99% of our tenants are students 02:15:22.550 --> 02:15:23.479 to the adjacent 02:15:23.479 --> 02:15:26.750 universities so from a control standpoint we lease by the 02:15:26.750 --> 02:15:27.920 bed which 02:15:27.920 --> 02:15:30.920 automatically draws a certain type of clientele in their 02:15:30.920 --> 02:15:33.000 opinion. We also if 02:15:33.000 --> 02:15:35.699 your daughter and three of her friends wanted to come and 02:15:35.699 --> 02:15:36.760 lease at our project 02:15:36.760 --> 02:15:39.430 if she brought four of her friends and wanted to rent a 02:15:39.430 --> 02:15:40.439 four-bedroom we would 02:15:40.439 --> 02:15:43.869 obviously place those people together. We have several 02:15:43.869 --> 02:15:45.479 management type of programs 02:15:45.479 --> 02:15:48.760 from roommate matching to you pick your own unit so we have 02:15:48.760 --> 02:15:49.680 controls and 02:15:49.680 --> 02:15:54.350 incentives to put people where they want to be. But to cut 02:15:54.350 --> 02:15:56.319 to the quick you can't 02:15:56.319 --> 02:15:59.199 prevent that from happening just legally there's I 02:15:59.199 --> 02:16:00.760 understand not saying it's 02:16:00.760 --> 02:16:05.390 it's it's your fault I'm just saying it is a reality. We 02:16:05.390 --> 02:16:06.640 can't steer we can't 02:16:06.640 --> 02:16:12.909 discriminate against any group. Right thank you. Any other 02:16:12.909 --> 02:16:13.439 question? 02:16:13.439 --> 02:16:19.449 Commissioner Alice. I'm sorry thank you I'm gonna go back 02:16:19.449 --> 02:16:20.319 to that parking lot 02:16:20.319 --> 02:16:23.520 question do you have an answer for me? Could you remind me 02:16:23.520 --> 02:16:24.199 of the question? 02:16:24.199 --> 02:16:28.380 Sorry. So that off-site parking the 36 spaces on Bryan 02:16:28.380 --> 02:16:29.800 Street there? Currently 02:16:29.800 --> 02:16:34.819 Vortmans is using that parking spot for employee parking 02:16:34.819 --> 02:16:36.239 and also the owner of 02:16:36.239 --> 02:16:38.719 the project is not here but he also leases some of those 02:16:38.719 --> 02:16:40.159 spaces to 02:16:40.159 --> 02:16:44.670 professors and whomever he could generate cash from. But 02:16:44.670 --> 02:16:45.319 the majority of 02:16:45.319 --> 02:16:49.190 it in my from my interpretation of it is employee parking. 02:16:49.190 --> 02:16:50.639 Okay and then I guess 02:16:50.639 --> 02:16:53.350 my concern with it is then those people who are currently 02:16:53.350 --> 02:16:54.399 using it won't be able 02:16:54.399 --> 02:16:56.709 to use it because it's going to be designated for this 02:16:56.709 --> 02:16:58.440 project. Well based 02:16:58.440 --> 02:17:02.799 on Vortmans square footage of his establishment is being 02:17:02.799 --> 02:17:03.680 cut in half 02:17:03.680 --> 02:17:07.360 basically. He owns about a 24,000 square foot building it's 02:17:07.360 --> 02:17:08.120 being reduced down to 02:17:08.120 --> 02:17:11.840 12,000 square feet and based on our plan we're parking that 02:17:11.840 --> 02:17:13.399 square footage of 02:17:13.399 --> 02:17:22.000 that type of use to code. In the garage. Yeah I understand 02:17:22.000 --> 02:17:22.879 that I'm trying to 02:17:22.879 --> 02:17:25.129 wrap my head around are really increasing spaces if we're 02:17:25.129 --> 02:17:25.680 taking spaces 02:17:25.680 --> 02:17:29.110 away from people who are utilizing them now not affiliated 02:17:29.110 --> 02:17:30.360 with this project. I 02:17:30.360 --> 02:17:34.479 think for the type of use obviously for the type of use I 02:17:34.479 --> 02:17:35.879 think is within code 02:17:35.879 --> 02:17:41.829 but the the retail square footage is being reduced so that 02:17:41.829 --> 02:17:43.479 parking may not 02:17:43.479 --> 02:17:48.040 need to be utilized as it is currently today because the 02:17:48.040 --> 02:17:49.000 the retail usage has 02:17:49.000 --> 02:17:51.049 been cutting ahead. Well the professors have to park 02:17:51.049 --> 02:17:53.239 somewhere. Well the UNT does 02:17:53.239 --> 02:18:00.209 have an underutilized garage. Thank you. Commissioner Hesm 02:18:00.209 --> 02:18:02.520 uth. One and I you may 02:18:02.520 --> 02:18:06.329 not have it ready now but I am very much interested in the 02:18:06.329 --> 02:18:08.319 site you make to the 02:18:08.319 --> 02:18:12.479 2030 plan. If someone can give me I have I had a PDF if 02:18:12.479 --> 02:18:13.239 someone can give me the 02:18:13.239 --> 02:18:16.719 page that you're referencing on the administrative hearing 02:18:16.719 --> 02:18:18.159 that allows for a 02:18:18.159 --> 02:18:23.290 reduction near university or mixed use. You both you have 02:18:23.290 --> 02:18:24.559 cited it but I don't 02:18:24.559 --> 02:18:28.979 I don't I'd like to read it. That I I would have to defer 02:18:28.979 --> 02:18:30.920 to staff. No no I 02:18:30.920 --> 02:18:42.059 mean yes thank you. We're gonna wait for an answer we're 02:18:42.059 --> 02:18:45.680 gonna okay do we have 02:18:45.680 --> 02:18:52.610 any other any other questions for the applicant? Thank you 02:18:52.610 --> 02:18:53.360 sir. Thank you Mr. 02:18:53.360 --> 02:18:59.639 Chairman. This is a public hearing I have a stack of cards 02:18:59.639 --> 02:19:00.280 and we're gonna go 02:19:00.280 --> 02:19:02.680 through these but anyone who wishes to speak this evening 02:19:02.680 --> 02:19:03.520 on this item please 02:19:03.520 --> 02:19:06.409 fill out a card when you come forward if you'll state your 02:19:06.409 --> 02:19:07.600 name and address and 02:19:07.600 --> 02:19:11.270 then you'll have four minutes. The first card first card 02:19:11.270 --> 02:19:13.159 that I have is Donna 02:19:13.159 --> 02:19:18.329 Morris on Oak Street speaking in opposition and that will 02:19:18.329 --> 02:19:19.600 be she will be 02:19:19.600 --> 02:19:24.719 followed by looks like Kim McKibbin. 02:19:27.799 --> 02:19:32.370 I'm Donna Morris I live at 918 West Oak we have owned that 02:19:32.370 --> 02:19:36.440 house for since 2004 02:19:36.440 --> 02:19:40.489 when we first moved there you could walk up and down Oak 02:19:40.489 --> 02:19:41.879 Street and cross the 02:19:41.879 --> 02:19:48.479 street be safe and as things have changed Fry Street 02:19:48.479 --> 02:19:50.959 changed the big 02:19:50.959 --> 02:19:54.879 apartment complex went in with all the students and we were 02:19:54.879 --> 02:19:56.559 told that it really 02:19:56.559 --> 02:20:00.430 wouldn't affect the traffic that much but now if you try to 02:20:00.430 --> 02:20:01.600 back your car out 02:20:01.600 --> 02:20:05.190 on Oak Street any time other than seven o'clock on Sunday 02:20:05.190 --> 02:20:06.760 morning you have to 02:20:06.760 --> 02:20:11.170 wait five to ten minutes to back out. You've spent a lot of 02:20:11.170 --> 02:20:12.559 time on the parking 02:20:12.559 --> 02:20:16.549 situation but nobody's mentioned the traffic increase that 02:20:16.549 --> 02:20:17.360 that would cause 02:20:17.360 --> 02:20:22.299 and it will those cars don't stay parked in those lots all 02:20:22.299 --> 02:20:25.559 week let me tell you. 02:20:25.559 --> 02:20:31.520 UNT does have a underutilized parking garage up there it's 02:20:31.520 --> 02:20:32.360 underutilized 02:20:32.360 --> 02:20:35.920 because they charge too much for the students to park there 02:20:35.920 --> 02:20:37.079 they park all the 02:20:37.079 --> 02:20:41.590 way down Oak Street practically to Carroll Boulevard all 02:20:41.590 --> 02:20:42.799 the way down 02:20:42.799 --> 02:20:46.819 Hickory Street to Carroll Boulevard they park on the 02:20:46.819 --> 02:20:48.719 streets the small streets 02:20:48.719 --> 02:20:52.920 behind us Amarillo, Gregg, Anderson all of those their 02:20:52.920 --> 02:20:55.840 parks so full that it's 02:20:55.840 --> 02:20:59.809 routine for us to go out and have to put a note on a car 02:20:59.809 --> 02:21:01.600 you've blocked my car in 02:21:01.600 --> 02:21:08.340 the parking in the driveway again. You're considering a lot 02:21:08.340 --> 02:21:09.959 on parking and thank 02:21:09.959 --> 02:21:14.209 you I understand that but please consider what you're doing 02:21:14.209 --> 02:21:14.479 to the 02:21:14.479 --> 02:21:18.840 traffic. Okay have a couple questions for you before you go 02:21:18.840 --> 02:21:20.040 . Commissioner Ozil. 02:21:20.040 --> 02:21:23.430 Thank you I appreciate you coming tonight and speaking your 02:21:23.430 --> 02:21:23.879 concerns I 02:21:23.879 --> 02:21:27.489 have a question about traffic are you I want to make sure I 02:21:27.489 --> 02:21:29.280 understand what 02:21:29.280 --> 02:21:31.739 you're requesting or what you're stating to us are you not 02:21:31.739 --> 02:21:32.719 wanting the project 02:21:32.719 --> 02:21:39.159 at all or what do you? Well I understand that times change 02:21:39.159 --> 02:21:41.319 and we get older and so 02:21:41.319 --> 02:21:46.049 forth but we as the residents of Oak Hickory were told when 02:21:46.049 --> 02:21:46.959 that first 02:21:46.959 --> 02:21:51.120 apartment complex went up there were all kinds of traffic 02:21:51.120 --> 02:21:52.760 surveys done most of 02:21:52.760 --> 02:21:56.649 them were done when the students weren't there nothing has 02:21:56.649 --> 02:21:59.040 been done to do 02:21:59.040 --> 02:22:03.639 anything about traffic on Oak and Hickory streets nothing 02:22:03.639 --> 02:22:04.920 the streets are 02:22:04.920 --> 02:22:09.379 the same size right now if you come down Hickory Street and 02:22:09.379 --> 02:22:10.159 cross Carroll 02:22:10.159 --> 02:22:13.239 Boulevard you don't know what lane you're supposed to be in 02:22:13.239 --> 02:22:14.079 and most people 02:22:14.079 --> 02:22:23.719 are in the wrong lane and you have squeezed a bicycle lane 02:22:23.719 --> 02:22:25.120 a left lane only 02:22:25.120 --> 02:22:29.299 a right lane only and lane ahead only and a thing that 02:22:29.299 --> 02:22:30.760 sticks out in the 02:22:30.760 --> 02:22:33.649 middle of the street that makes it look beautiful and there 02:22:33.649 --> 02:22:37.159 's no room for cars 02:22:37.600 --> 02:22:45.299 my husband in August was hit by a car that was backing out 02:22:45.299 --> 02:22:47.239 on Oak Street 02:22:47.239 --> 02:22:51.209 because he was so busy watching for traffic he didn't see 02:22:51.209 --> 02:22:53.860 my husband and the 02:22:53.860 --> 02:22:57.620 traffic is so bad we have to figure out where we're going 02:22:57.620 --> 02:22:58.600 to cross that we get 02:22:58.600 --> 02:23:02.319 enough space that we're able to have time to get across 02:23:02.319 --> 02:23:03.879 before all those cars 02:23:03.879 --> 02:23:10.299 come either I'm willing to pay for a toll gate that goes 02:23:10.299 --> 02:23:11.920 across Oak Street 02:23:11.920 --> 02:23:16.309 to slow them down or something I certainly appreciate the 02:23:16.309 --> 02:23:16.959 feedback on the 02:23:16.959 --> 02:23:21.399 traffic I'm trying to understand is in accordance to this 02:23:21.399 --> 02:23:22.879 proposed project 02:23:22.879 --> 02:23:26.639 how would you what would you like to with the project to 02:23:26.639 --> 02:23:28.239 have I I would like 02:23:28.239 --> 02:23:32.319 the project not to happen until the city makes a real 02:23:32.319 --> 02:23:34.319 commitment to do something 02:23:34.319 --> 02:23:38.659 about the traffic there the city made a commitment several 02:23:38.659 --> 02:23:40.280 years ago and nothing 02:23:40.280 --> 02:23:47.350 happened okay and they they do their surveys in the middle 02:23:47.350 --> 02:23:48.120 of August or the 02:23:48.120 --> 02:23:51.200 middle of January and tell us oh you don't have a problem 02:23:51.200 --> 02:23:52.159 we'll come out and 02:23:52.159 --> 02:23:54.200 sit there for a while and look at it sure and that's 02:23:54.200 --> 02:23:55.600 definitely on the city to 02:23:55.600 --> 02:23:59.540 do yes yes that portion of it I but in terms of the 02:23:59.540 --> 02:24:01.399 developers but if you're 02:24:01.399 --> 02:24:04.989 looking at this project and saying oh they've met 02:24:04.989 --> 02:24:06.840 everything and so forth 02:24:06.840 --> 02:24:11.510 you're not doing what you should be doing for the citizens 02:24:11.510 --> 02:24:13.520 of the city I 02:24:13.520 --> 02:24:16.870 absolutely agree and I take that responsibility seriously 02:24:16.870 --> 02:24:17.840 on how to vote 02:24:17.840 --> 02:24:20.940 that's why I'm just wanting to give you an opportunity to 02:24:20.940 --> 02:24:21.879 express are you 02:24:21.879 --> 02:24:24.600 saying that there should be less parking there should be 02:24:24.600 --> 02:24:25.559 more parking at the 02:24:25.559 --> 02:24:28.100 building I'm trying to understand in relation to the 02:24:28.100 --> 02:24:30.000 project relation to the 02:24:30.000 --> 02:24:33.409 project I'm not worried about the parking I'm telling you 02:24:33.409 --> 02:24:34.440 that those cars 02:24:34.440 --> 02:24:38.159 won't stay parked there all week they go up and down the 02:24:38.159 --> 02:24:40.600 street you as the city 02:24:40.600 --> 02:24:46.649 would be putting 300 more cars in the traffic on Oak Street 02:24:46.649 --> 02:24:48.799 in an area that's 02:24:48.799 --> 02:24:53.260 not equipped to take it now okay thank you couple more 02:24:53.260 --> 02:24:54.319 questions for you 02:24:54.319 --> 02:24:58.559 Commissioner back thank you thank you miss Morris for 02:24:58.559 --> 02:25:00.159 coming down speaking let 02:25:00.159 --> 02:25:02.739 me ask you a question I want to pose this to every other 02:25:02.739 --> 02:25:03.639 individual that 02:25:03.639 --> 02:25:06.790 comes down and speaks tonight you say you've been in on 02:25:06.790 --> 02:25:07.760 your Oak Street house 02:25:07.760 --> 02:25:11.180 since 2004 so you were there you weren't there when they 02:25:11.180 --> 02:25:12.479 did sub area a which was 02:25:12.479 --> 02:25:15.829 in 2000 but you were there when they did sub area B which 02:25:15.829 --> 02:25:18.000 is 2010 at that time 02:25:18.000 --> 02:25:21.879 did you agree with the changes were you part of the process 02:25:21.879 --> 02:25:23.120 we were part of the 02:25:23.120 --> 02:25:26.010 people that were saying you've got to do something about 02:25:26.010 --> 02:25:27.600 the traffic okay I did 02:25:27.600 --> 02:25:31.000 we did not agree with it we didn't agree with it when they 02:25:31.000 --> 02:25:32.239 were putting trying to 02:25:32.239 --> 02:25:39.549 put three or four fast food restaurants in there when they 02:25:39.549 --> 02:25:40.319 were trying to put 02:25:40.319 --> 02:25:47.090 the CVS pharmacy in there we we feel I understand that the 02:25:47.090 --> 02:25:48.840 city moves forward 02:25:48.840 --> 02:25:53.930 and you have to make changes and so forth but I feel that 02:25:53.930 --> 02:25:55.639 over and over again 02:25:55.639 --> 02:26:01.909 we have been told one thing and given nothing okay so you 02:26:01.909 --> 02:26:04.000 feel like that you 02:26:04.000 --> 02:26:07.600 were opposed to it essentially the both of the changes 02:26:07.600 --> 02:26:10.079 there and your feeling is 02:26:10.079 --> 02:26:16.719 what now if this one goes up my feeling now is don't build 02:26:16.719 --> 02:26:17.879 anything else don't 02:26:17.879 --> 02:26:20.719 put anything else in there until you take care of the 02:26:20.719 --> 02:26:21.959 traffic problems you 02:26:21.959 --> 02:26:27.920 have now okay okay thank you Commissioner Hesworth thank 02:26:27.920 --> 02:26:29.000 you chair one 02:26:29.000 --> 02:26:32.149 quick I have a question but I want to get make sure I have 02:26:32.149 --> 02:26:33.200 my boundaries right 02:26:33.200 --> 02:26:38.020 but all what where does city of Denton versus you and T 02:26:38.020 --> 02:26:40.280 fall on this particular 02:26:40.280 --> 02:26:44.440 area as far as control just give me some direction there 02:26:44.440 --> 02:26:45.319 are you referencing in 02:26:45.319 --> 02:26:50.299 terms of ownership in terms of who manages the road and who 02:26:50.299 --> 02:26:51.200 has ability to 02:26:51.200 --> 02:26:55.309 widen the road that those restrictions okay I'm actually 02:26:55.309 --> 02:26:56.120 going to ask Earl to 02:26:56.120 --> 02:26:58.340 come down and speak to some of the traffic issues he's 02:26:58.340 --> 02:26:59.239 present in terms of 02:26:59.239 --> 02:27:02.569 the right-of-way that is city owned right-of-way but there 02:27:02.569 --> 02:27:03.559 are some I believe 02:27:03.559 --> 02:27:05.920 as it relates to parking mechanisms perhaps not in this 02:27:05.920 --> 02:27:06.719 area but further 02:27:06.719 --> 02:27:10.239 down the street but if you have any specificity associated 02:27:10.239 --> 02:27:11.120 with well 02:27:11.120 --> 02:27:16.760 specifically I want to try to focus focus on her concern 02:27:16.760 --> 02:27:19.040 being the 02:27:19.040 --> 02:27:24.479 development bringing more traffic to Oak fry Street Oak in 02:27:24.479 --> 02:27:25.879 general Hickory Street 02:27:25.879 --> 02:27:29.700 in general specifically with this project that corner fry 02:27:29.700 --> 02:27:30.719 Street Oak right 02:27:30.719 --> 02:27:35.600 there but I don't know that that's fall I don't know if we 02:27:35.600 --> 02:27:37.120 have any control over 02:27:37.120 --> 02:27:42.530 that we city have any control over that particular segment 02:27:42.530 --> 02:27:45.639 of street sure if 02:27:45.639 --> 02:27:48.600 Earl can come down and perhaps shed some light on the TIA 02:27:48.600 --> 02:27:49.700 that was submitted 02:27:49.700 --> 02:27:53.280 because that those parameters reflected in the TIA okay so 02:27:53.280 --> 02:27:54.319 don't I want to I 02:27:54.319 --> 02:27:59.319 have a question thank you thank you Earl can we also get 02:27:59.319 --> 02:28:00.360 the date on the TIA 02:28:00.360 --> 02:28:05.959 when it was performed please yes let me backtrack to the T 02:28:05.959 --> 02:28:07.319 IA that was performed 02:28:07.319 --> 02:28:11.190 for the fry Street development it was performed back in 02:28:11.190 --> 02:28:13.520 2010 and when they 02:28:13.520 --> 02:28:20.120 came in they projected the development by making certain 02:28:20.120 --> 02:28:20.639 percentage of 02:28:20.639 --> 02:28:24.440 assumptions of modes of transportation because it's a 02:28:24.440 --> 02:28:25.520 single single resident 02:28:25.520 --> 02:28:28.799 or single room occupancy type development geared towards 02:28:28.799 --> 02:28:29.399 students and 02:28:29.399 --> 02:28:33.399 so when the TIA came in they made assumptions on which mode 02:28:33.399 --> 02:28:33.559 of 02:28:33.559 --> 02:28:37.290 transportation this development take whether it's 02:28:37.290 --> 02:28:39.159 pedestrian or pedestrian 02:28:39.159 --> 02:28:42.260 and bicycle vehicle or buses and so based on that they 02:28:42.260 --> 02:28:43.719 projected the vehicle 02:28:43.719 --> 02:28:47.649 trips to be 79 in the morning during the peak hours which 02:28:47.649 --> 02:28:48.959 is your seven to nine 02:28:48.959 --> 02:28:55.819 and 143 in the afternoon which is your four to six time 02:28:55.819 --> 02:28:57.239 slot and that's usually 02:28:57.239 --> 02:29:00.829 the peak hours of the background itself when everybody's 02:29:00.829 --> 02:29:02.159 most likely going to 02:29:02.159 --> 02:29:04.829 work during those times we're coming back from work and so 02:29:04.829 --> 02:29:06.319 what we did as 02:29:06.319 --> 02:29:11.229 staff earlier this week as we went out there and actually 02:29:11.229 --> 02:29:12.680 observed the traffic 02:29:12.680 --> 02:29:16.110 flow that fry Street development just to see how it matched 02:29:16.110 --> 02:29:18.680 up to the TIA 02:29:18.680 --> 02:29:23.420 and we calculated or recounted 63 in the morning and 156 in 02:29:23.420 --> 02:29:24.440 the afternoon so it's 02:29:24.440 --> 02:29:29.469 it's almost some almost spot-on to what the TIA was was 02:29:29.469 --> 02:29:32.719 assuming and so going 02:29:32.719 --> 02:29:37.030 back to the going to the Hickory Street development that 02:29:37.030 --> 02:29:40.520 was performed I can 02:29:40.520 --> 02:29:55.040 find the cover sheet and June of this year this development 02:29:55.040 --> 02:29:55.879 is half the size 02:29:55.879 --> 02:29:59.760 in terms of number of bedrooms fry Street has 620 beds this 02:29:59.760 --> 02:30:00.399 development has 02:30:00.399 --> 02:30:05.520 300 the retail component is a little bit larger than their 02:30:05.520 --> 02:30:06.239 fry Street but the 02:30:06.239 --> 02:30:08.469 businesses that are going into the retail component of this 02:30:08.469 --> 02:30:09.079 development are 02:30:09.079 --> 02:30:11.190 the same businesses that are being torn out the warm ins 02:30:11.190 --> 02:30:12.600 and the subway so the 02:30:12.600 --> 02:30:15.489 traffic counts for the commercial component should be awash 02:30:15.489 --> 02:30:15.840 so that 02:30:15.840 --> 02:30:20.860 increase in traffic is primarily the multifamily component 02:30:20.860 --> 02:30:22.159 or the student 02:30:22.159 --> 02:30:27.680 bedrooms and so they projected a peak a.m. of 75 and a peak 02:30:27.680 --> 02:30:30.879 p.m. of 108 which 02:30:30.879 --> 02:30:36.069 is somewhat proportionate to the fry Street development in 02:30:36.069 --> 02:30:36.719 terms of scale and 02:30:36.719 --> 02:30:41.659 size and so you know given the background traffic right now 02:30:41.659 --> 02:30:42.360 there's 02:30:42.360 --> 02:30:48.629 about 800 trips in a peak hour on oak and similar amount 02:30:48.629 --> 02:30:50.360 along Hickory and so 02:30:50.360 --> 02:30:53.969 I mean percentage wise it's really not that much of an 02:30:53.969 --> 02:30:56.760 increase less than 10% 02:30:56.760 --> 02:31:01.170 there are some when we were out there observing the traffic 02:31:01.170 --> 02:31:02.280 there are some 02:31:02.280 --> 02:31:06.709 speed issues that can be addressed they're just traffic 02:31:06.709 --> 02:31:07.920 just flying through 02:31:07.920 --> 02:31:12.159 through Oak Street primarily that's where the main entrance 02:31:12.159 --> 02:31:13.319 to the fry Street 02:31:13.319 --> 02:31:18.360 development is now so there are some mechanisms or 02:31:18.360 --> 02:31:19.840 processes that we can 02:31:19.840 --> 02:31:23.530 implement to slow that traffic down whether it's police at 02:31:23.530 --> 02:31:24.440 first and you 02:31:24.440 --> 02:31:28.200 know if that can't be resolved then maybe there's some 02:31:28.200 --> 02:31:28.920 traffic calming 02:31:28.920 --> 02:31:33.319 devices that could be inserted along oak through our 02:31:33.319 --> 02:31:38.840 traffic department so 02:31:38.840 --> 02:31:44.909 so is that our is that under our city of Denton purview to 02:31:44.909 --> 02:31:47.120 so traffic calming 02:31:47.120 --> 02:31:50.899 the those type mechanisms or is that you and tease that 02:31:50.899 --> 02:31:52.280 would be the city of 02:31:52.280 --> 02:31:56.100 Denton okay so that's our roadway thank you that is so if I 02:31:56.100 --> 02:31:57.920 may sure continues 02:31:57.920 --> 02:32:04.520 thank you okay thank you so miss Morris understanding we're 02:32:04.520 --> 02:32:05.159 looking at this 02:32:05.159 --> 02:32:09.370 particular project I want to I want to try to I think we 02:32:09.370 --> 02:32:11.079 can agree that you and 02:32:11.079 --> 02:32:15.129 T in and of itself is growing and more students and they 02:32:15.129 --> 02:32:16.600 have a Dallas campuses 02:32:16.600 --> 02:32:20.670 commuting in and they have the satellite campus there near 02:32:20.670 --> 02:32:22.559 Luke 28 that's growing 02:32:22.559 --> 02:32:26.120 and so I think overall I don't want to hold this particular 02:32:26.120 --> 02:32:27.000 applicant 02:32:27.000 --> 02:32:30.760 responsible for being next to a university that's growing 02:32:30.760 --> 02:32:32.520 that's that's 02:32:32.520 --> 02:32:37.489 the goal right and so I'm curious they make the point okay 02:32:37.489 --> 02:32:38.399 someone's closer to 02:32:38.399 --> 02:32:41.129 the university they're gonna walk they experience the same 02:32:41.129 --> 02:32:42.040 traffic headaches 02:32:42.040 --> 02:32:44.930 that everyone else does so they say hey I'm motivated just 02:32:44.930 --> 02:32:45.719 to walk or ride a 02:32:45.719 --> 02:32:50.079 bike or you zip car does that resonate with you I'm just 02:32:50.079 --> 02:32:52.000 curious does that make 02:32:52.000 --> 02:32:54.270 sense that they're gonna experience the same traffic and 02:32:54.270 --> 02:32:55.239 they would look to 02:32:55.239 --> 02:33:00.209 avoid that by being close to campus and using other modes 02:33:00.209 --> 02:33:02.000 of transportation 02:33:05.879 --> 02:33:11.059 well I don't know that they I understand that they would 02:33:11.059 --> 02:33:14.360 not be using their cars 02:33:14.360 --> 02:33:27.379 to go to school you and T is growing there are other areas 02:33:27.379 --> 02:33:32.879 farther west of 02:33:32.879 --> 02:33:39.340 UNT you look at the apartments that have gone in near the 02:33:39.340 --> 02:33:43.159 hospital complex the 02:33:43.159 --> 02:33:49.959 the road the roads and infrastructure there are far better 02:33:49.959 --> 02:33:53.200 for the density that 02:33:53.200 --> 02:33:57.209 it's going in that has gone in there then the 02:33:57.209 --> 02:34:00.559 infrastructure on Oak Street 02:34:00.559 --> 02:34:04.120 for the density that you're talking about putting in there 02:34:04.120 --> 02:34:07.000 got it okay well 02:34:07.000 --> 02:34:09.520 thank you thank you one more question ma'am 02:34:09.520 --> 02:34:13.879 Commissioner Rizzo thank you this is actually for our all 02:34:13.879 --> 02:34:15.360 thank you thank you 02:34:15.360 --> 02:34:19.920 very much this might just be for the edification of all 02:34:19.920 --> 02:34:21.719 involved it's my 02:34:21.719 --> 02:34:24.110 understanding mobility plan has three basic types of roads 02:34:24.110 --> 02:34:25.079 major artilleries 02:34:25.079 --> 02:34:29.399 secondary arteries and then collector streets and Oak 02:34:29.399 --> 02:34:30.680 Street is on the 02:34:30.680 --> 02:34:35.590 ability plan designated as a secondary artery keys it's 02:34:35.590 --> 02:34:36.360 considered more like a 02:34:36.360 --> 02:34:40.180 one-way couplet so between the combination of Hickory on 02:34:40.180 --> 02:34:40.920 the south 02:34:40.920 --> 02:34:43.319 side and oak on the north side kind of serves as that 02:34:43.319 --> 02:34:45.040 secondary arterial can 02:34:45.040 --> 02:34:49.149 type can you tell me what what the expectation is of a 02:34:49.149 --> 02:34:50.879 secondary arterial 02:34:50.879 --> 02:34:53.579 street what is what does that mean what is what is the 02:34:53.579 --> 02:34:54.959 secondary arterial mean 02:34:54.959 --> 02:34:58.559 secondary arterial it's I mean essentially the principle of 02:34:58.559 --> 02:34:59.159 an arterial 02:34:59.159 --> 02:35:04.239 is to move traffic from one side of town to the other and a 02:35:04.239 --> 02:35:06.000 quick as possible 02:35:06.000 --> 02:35:10.899 manner now the difference between a secondary arterial and 02:35:10.899 --> 02:35:11.559 primary arterial is 02:35:11.559 --> 02:35:15.200 just the volume of traffic the because a primary arterial 02:35:15.200 --> 02:35:16.680 has six lanes that are 02:35:16.680 --> 02:35:20.430 divided in a secondary only has two lanes okay and if I 02:35:20.430 --> 02:35:21.680 understand this the 02:35:21.680 --> 02:35:26.280 front west of Carroll there's a major artery arterial at 02:35:26.280 --> 02:35:28.239 University and then 02:35:28.239 --> 02:35:31.409 their secondary is at Eagle and Oak is that the general 02:35:31.409 --> 02:35:32.799 flow from Carroll West 02:35:32.799 --> 02:35:39.079 Eagle Oak University that are your major quiz in you west 02:35:39.079 --> 02:35:40.200 okay corridors 02:35:40.200 --> 02:35:43.719 that's correct okay thank you mm-hmm 02:35:44.040 --> 02:35:50.770 thank you our next speaker is Kimmy McKibbin at Hickory 02:35:50.770 --> 02:35:51.879 Street speaking in 02:35:51.879 --> 02:36:00.000 opposition to be followed by Anderson Mary or Manny good 02:36:00.000 --> 02:36:01.680 evening this makes 02:36:01.680 --> 02:36:03.920 the fourth time that I've been a community hearing about 02:36:03.920 --> 02:36:04.479 this particular 02:36:04.479 --> 02:36:08.350 project my name is Kim McKibbin and I own the building and 02:36:08.350 --> 02:36:10.280 the business at 1306 02:36:10.280 --> 02:36:15.489 West Hickory that is adjacent to this property and I think 02:36:15.489 --> 02:36:15.840 it's very 02:36:15.840 --> 02:36:22.110 interesting that this was brought up and he talked to you 02:36:22.110 --> 02:36:23.600 about adjacent 02:36:23.600 --> 02:36:27.670 properties having already been talked to and agreeing I'm 02:36:27.670 --> 02:36:28.600 not sure what that is 02:36:28.600 --> 02:36:31.629 if it's because I do kind of share a wall with one that 02:36:31.629 --> 02:36:32.719 they're going to 02:36:32.719 --> 02:36:36.649 tear down those little six spaces there on Hickory and no 02:36:36.649 --> 02:36:38.079 they have not talked 02:36:38.079 --> 02:36:42.379 to me so I'm not sure what they're referring to about about 02:36:42.379 --> 02:36:43.799 that a lot of 02:36:43.799 --> 02:36:46.360 people have talked about the parking here parking is an 02:36:46.360 --> 02:36:47.440 issue they have not 02:36:47.440 --> 02:36:51.040 brought up the fact that they are removing 68 parking 02:36:51.040 --> 02:36:52.200 places from account 02:36:52.200 --> 02:36:55.209 walking around in the parking lot including the only three 02:36:55.209 --> 02:36:55.959 handicapped 02:36:55.959 --> 02:37:01.120 spaces in that section to build the building so they're 02:37:01.120 --> 02:37:02.799 taking away 68 02:37:02.799 --> 02:37:06.290 spaces and I am including the ones along the front on Hick 02:37:06.290 --> 02:37:07.440 ory Street that are 02:37:07.440 --> 02:37:10.329 currently public parking and have meters so yeah that's 02:37:10.329 --> 02:37:12.760 what they're taking away 02:37:12.760 --> 02:37:16.190 traffic is is pretty much a nightmare I can tell you that 02:37:16.190 --> 02:37:17.360 coming down Hickory 02:37:17.360 --> 02:37:20.719 Street it's very dangerous I can tell you that the traffic 02:37:20.719 --> 02:37:22.200 backs up from the red 02:37:22.200 --> 02:37:26.110 light at Fry Street to the red light up at CVS and past 02:37:26.110 --> 02:37:27.959 that so you're literally 02:37:27.959 --> 02:37:31.309 waiting for the lights to change to come through but I don 02:37:31.309 --> 02:37:33.239 't think that it's I 02:37:33.239 --> 02:37:37.500 think that the argument about the traffic is a distractor 02:37:37.500 --> 02:37:38.639 in the case for 02:37:38.639 --> 02:37:42.440 this building this building does not fit the current 02:37:42.440 --> 02:37:44.639 ordinance this contractor is 02:37:44.639 --> 02:37:48.680 asking you to change your city ordinance to change your 02:37:48.680 --> 02:37:49.959 city laws so that they 02:37:49.959 --> 02:37:54.649 can make a bigger profit something about that irritates me 02:37:54.649 --> 02:37:55.719 just a little bit I 02:37:55.719 --> 02:37:59.190 came back to the Fry Street area I bought the building I 02:37:59.190 --> 02:37:59.959 bought the 02:37:59.959 --> 02:38:03.180 business I want to be there to stay I'm aware of what the 02:38:03.180 --> 02:38:05.200 2030 plan is and the 02:38:05.200 --> 02:38:08.719 understanding that this area is a buffer zone between the 02:38:08.719 --> 02:38:10.159 university that does 02:38:10.159 --> 02:38:14.520 not mean that is a big stone wall that means that you have 02:38:14.520 --> 02:38:15.840 a way to gradually 02:38:15.840 --> 02:38:19.770 move from the university back into the neighborhood and I 02:38:19.770 --> 02:38:20.879 understand the 02:38:20.879 --> 02:38:23.750 university's growing but the city of Denton and the 02:38:23.750 --> 02:38:25.079 citizens of Denton are 02:38:25.079 --> 02:38:28.510 not completely responsible for supporting the growth of the 02:38:28.510 --> 02:38:29.239 University 02:38:29.239 --> 02:38:31.989 of North Texas and sometimes that's what we have to look at 02:38:31.989 --> 02:38:33.079 is what's happening 02:38:33.079 --> 02:38:36.319 now another thing about this particular building is that it 02:38:36.319 --> 02:38:37.360 's real pretty here 02:38:37.360 --> 02:38:41.069 on this picture and the this car that's here is sitting 02:38:41.069 --> 02:38:42.639 with its nose in where 02:38:42.639 --> 02:38:45.930 my building would be so there's there's some things like 02:38:45.930 --> 02:38:47.159 that that are happening 02:38:47.159 --> 02:38:51.780 also these buildings these apartments mr. Husspeth asked I 02:38:51.780 --> 02:38:52.719 've got four girls 02:38:52.719 --> 02:38:55.280 what's to keep them from putting a gentleman in there that 02:38:55.280 --> 02:38:56.079 's not so much 02:38:56.079 --> 02:38:58.680 the problem mr. Husspeth from what I talked to the students 02:38:58.680 --> 02:38:59.360 about that have 02:38:59.360 --> 02:39:02.799 these apartments as much as it is there's four people in 02:39:02.799 --> 02:39:03.840 the department and 02:39:03.840 --> 02:39:07.360 then there's somebody's boyfriend with a child somebody's 02:39:07.360 --> 02:39:08.399 girlfriend with a child 02:39:08.399 --> 02:39:11.750 if you've got a room in an apartment that you're paying 02:39:11.750 --> 02:39:13.399 over $700 for 02:39:13.399 --> 02:39:16.860 sometimes you're gonna have split that room and it turns 02:39:16.860 --> 02:39:18.120 into more people in 02:39:18.120 --> 02:39:20.930 the building than what they ever anticipated and yes it 02:39:20.930 --> 02:39:22.319 does happen you 02:39:22.319 --> 02:39:24.909 know they bring in the boyfriend the boyfriend brings in 02:39:24.909 --> 02:39:25.760 the the child and 02:39:25.760 --> 02:39:29.030 then you have a whole assortment of things going on I think 02:39:29.030 --> 02:39:29.760 that using 02:39:29.760 --> 02:39:34.409 Sterling house and Fry Street and 33 North are bad examples 02:39:34.409 --> 02:39:35.559 in these cases 02:39:35.559 --> 02:39:39.969 they've made for bad neighbors and they've changed the the 02:39:39.969 --> 02:39:41.120 feeling of the 02:39:41.120 --> 02:39:43.049 neighborhood they've changed the purpose of the 02:39:43.049 --> 02:39:45.280 neighborhood in a lot of ways so 02:39:45.280 --> 02:39:48.899 you have to consider that comparing just because one got 02:39:48.899 --> 02:39:49.959 built doesn't mean they 02:39:49.959 --> 02:39:53.299 shouldn't build a bigger one one's enough one's really 02:39:53.299 --> 02:39:54.959 enough and the 02:39:54.959 --> 02:40:00.319 property can be utilized in a more community oriented way 02:40:00.319 --> 02:40:01.360 it can also be 02:40:01.360 --> 02:40:05.790 have more housing not housing but retail in it when he says 02:40:05.790 --> 02:40:07.079 that most the first 02:40:07.079 --> 02:40:10.989 floor is retail I disagree because there's a pool and there 02:40:10.989 --> 02:40:11.680 's a patio and 02:40:11.680 --> 02:40:15.719 all those amenities on the first on the first level of this 02:40:15.719 --> 02:40:17.159 apartment complex 02:40:17.159 --> 02:40:19.840 there's so many things that I'd really like to talk to you 02:40:19.840 --> 02:40:20.879 guys about about 02:40:20.879 --> 02:40:23.700 this but one other thing that I want to bring up very 02:40:23.700 --> 02:40:25.239 quickly is to get the fire 02:40:25.239 --> 02:40:30.950 lane that they wanted they have a two-lane street that 02:40:30.950 --> 02:40:32.319 comes down the 02:40:32.319 --> 02:40:37.540 east side of this building and it comes in and out on Hick 02:40:37.540 --> 02:40:39.159 ory and I can't speak 02:40:39.159 --> 02:40:41.670 oh I know people really go really fast on oak but I know 02:40:41.670 --> 02:40:42.920 people go really fast 02:40:42.920 --> 02:40:46.340 on Hickory too so to get in and out on the Hickory coming 02:40:46.340 --> 02:40:47.479 down that street 02:40:47.479 --> 02:40:50.149 they're going to be dealing with all the traffic with the 02:40:50.149 --> 02:40:51.120 speed with the hill 02:40:51.120 --> 02:40:54.010 it's going to be a dangerous situation so I'm just 02:40:54.010 --> 02:40:55.719 concerned about that when I 02:40:55.719 --> 02:41:01.000 look at this particular diagram for things so I'm asking 02:41:01.000 --> 02:41:03.079 that this project 02:41:03.079 --> 02:41:07.079 not be built unless it can conform to our ordinances to 02:41:07.079 --> 02:41:09.000 what the original Fry 02:41:09.000 --> 02:41:11.700 Street ordinance was and I don't think they have any 02:41:11.700 --> 02:41:13.000 intention of doing that 02:41:13.000 --> 02:41:16.229 because it's not profitable for them I think it's a lovely 02:41:16.229 --> 02:41:17.360 project I don't I 02:41:17.360 --> 02:41:21.370 think this is the wrong place to put it got a question for 02:41:21.370 --> 02:41:22.120 you yes sir 02:41:22.120 --> 02:41:24.639 Commissioner Beck thank you chair thank you miss Kevin for 02:41:24.639 --> 02:41:25.600 your presentation and 02:41:25.600 --> 02:41:28.690 to my question to miss Morris how long have you been at 02:41:28.690 --> 02:41:29.760 your location on 02:41:29.760 --> 02:41:33.139 Hickory Street I bought the building three years ago the 02:41:33.139 --> 02:41:33.680 building in the 02:41:33.680 --> 02:41:37.280 business I have been on the front in the Fry Street area 02:41:37.280 --> 02:41:39.360 and in Denton since 1981 02:41:39.360 --> 02:41:43.819 okay so were you part of the process when sub area a and B 02:41:43.819 --> 02:41:45.520 were developed and 02:41:45.520 --> 02:41:53.270 if so how were you about this change I wasn't okay with 02:41:53.270 --> 02:41:54.840 this change I think that 02:41:54.840 --> 02:42:00.329 when they raised all the buildings there in sub area a that 02:42:00.329 --> 02:42:02.000 we lost a piece of 02:42:02.000 --> 02:42:05.059 history in Denton the historical buildings that we lost the 02:42:05.059 --> 02:42:05.719 character of 02:42:05.719 --> 02:42:09.010 those buildings the community that was there and at that 02:42:09.010 --> 02:42:10.079 time you know they 02:42:10.079 --> 02:42:13.239 basically said don't worry it'll just move down the street 02:42:13.239 --> 02:42:13.879 well it did it all 02:42:13.879 --> 02:42:17.260 moved down the street to Main Street and on past that and 02:42:17.260 --> 02:42:18.600 into the industrial 02:42:18.600 --> 02:42:22.280 area so now we've got a big mess down there too but no I 02:42:22.280 --> 02:42:24.040 think that didn't 02:42:24.040 --> 02:42:26.750 really lost some of its character when they lost those 02:42:26.750 --> 02:42:28.040 buildings and I felt for 02:42:28.040 --> 02:42:31.079 these people because that live in the historic buildings 02:42:31.079 --> 02:42:31.940 around it because 02:42:31.940 --> 02:42:34.569 this is not what they bargained for when they bought those 02:42:34.569 --> 02:42:35.879 houses that's not what 02:42:35.879 --> 02:42:40.860 it was and you know to have a building that big go up four 02:42:40.860 --> 02:42:41.840 stories it 02:42:41.840 --> 02:42:44.959 overpowers anything that's across the street on the campus 02:42:44.959 --> 02:42:45.479 so there's not 02:42:45.479 --> 02:42:49.000 really a transition you've got a wall there the businesses 02:42:49.000 --> 02:42:51.840 that are there are 02:42:51.840 --> 02:42:55.260 a lot of them had gone out of business recently because of 02:42:55.260 --> 02:42:56.520 different various 02:42:56.520 --> 02:43:00.090 things the parking that's there they have parking for the 02:43:00.090 --> 02:43:01.079 public on the 02:43:01.079 --> 02:43:06.680 bottom floor so you know so you want to compare that you 02:43:06.680 --> 02:43:07.440 feel like your worst 02:43:07.440 --> 02:43:10.620 fears have been realized in with these the two buildings 02:43:10.620 --> 02:43:11.840 that are already there 02:43:11.840 --> 02:43:15.709 are you concerned that this is are you talking about the 02:43:15.709 --> 02:43:16.879 one building that's 02:43:16.879 --> 02:43:22.129 there well both you got the student building and then the 02:43:22.129 --> 02:43:23.200 apartment complex 02:43:23.200 --> 02:43:27.549 sub area a was the first one yeah to 2000 sub area B was 02:43:27.549 --> 02:43:29.920 2010 so well it's 02:43:29.920 --> 02:43:33.799 2010 the the one that was fry Street sterling house yeah 02:43:33.799 --> 02:43:35.239 those things I think 02:43:35.239 --> 02:43:40.510 you have to really take into consideration what it did for 02:43:40.510 --> 02:43:41.319 the whole 02:43:41.319 --> 02:43:44.280 neighborhood or what it didn't do for the neighborhood so 02:43:44.280 --> 02:43:46.000 if you focus on 02:43:46.000 --> 02:43:49.500 parking and you focus on traffic and you don't focus on the 02:43:49.500 --> 02:43:50.719 the people that live 02:43:50.719 --> 02:43:53.940 there those of us that work there you're kind of missing 02:43:53.940 --> 02:43:55.159 the ball for us because 02:43:55.159 --> 02:43:57.879 that's what the ordinances were originally written for was 02:43:57.879 --> 02:43:58.440 to protect 02:43:58.440 --> 02:44:02.319 that certain area okay thank you you're welcome one more 02:44:02.319 --> 02:44:02.879 question for you 02:44:02.879 --> 02:44:09.459 Commissioner Hesbeth so I want to you own the young the 02:44:09.459 --> 02:44:10.200 coffee shop there I 02:44:10.200 --> 02:44:14.090 mean right okay and so I want to kind of explore that with 02:44:14.090 --> 02:44:14.559 you a little bit 02:44:14.559 --> 02:44:17.450 because you have a unit you have a unique insight to that 02:44:17.450 --> 02:44:18.159 so there's a 02:44:18.159 --> 02:44:20.489 business out of the business that we all get I mean you 02:44:20.489 --> 02:44:21.760 understand just like 02:44:21.760 --> 02:44:25.200 anyone would I mean I wouldn't be able to come in a coffee 02:44:25.200 --> 02:44:26.040 shop and say a 02:44:26.040 --> 02:44:29.120 coffee bean cost this so extrapolate hot water and I should 02:44:29.120 --> 02:44:30.079 be able to pay that 02:44:30.079 --> 02:44:33.479 I mean there's other other factors in there so I'm curious 02:44:33.479 --> 02:44:35.319 though with this 02:44:35.319 --> 02:44:39.559 project specifically I think miss Morris brings a good 02:44:39.559 --> 02:44:40.319 point there's a lot of 02:44:40.319 --> 02:44:46.899 development off campus that I think generates a lot of 02:44:46.899 --> 02:44:47.920 traffic on campus I 02:44:47.920 --> 02:44:51.889 mean because specifically that that complex near the near 02:44:51.889 --> 02:44:52.920 Presbyterian 02:44:52.920 --> 02:44:55.420 Hospital is huge and growing and they're developing those 02:44:55.420 --> 02:44:56.420 different areas and 02:44:56.420 --> 02:45:00.319 they use and it I think that's oak or hickory and so it 02:45:00.319 --> 02:45:02.520 leads you know and so 02:45:02.520 --> 02:45:07.879 and with University being in the shape it is it almost 02:45:07.879 --> 02:45:09.040 motivates people to go 02:45:09.040 --> 02:45:15.819 through oak so I want to set aside the traffic for a second 02:45:15.819 --> 02:45:16.799 just the business 02:45:16.799 --> 02:45:20.430 it would enhance the area because you have that little 02:45:20.430 --> 02:45:21.959 corner right where they 02:45:21.959 --> 02:45:24.450 park their bikes it's kind of dark and I think there's a 02:45:24.450 --> 02:45:25.680 stairway they next year 02:45:25.680 --> 02:45:29.799 yeah that is part of my building yeah so it enhances the 02:45:29.799 --> 02:45:32.319 area by by default just 02:45:32.319 --> 02:45:35.770 kind of along fordman's I'm assuming that's more like that 02:45:35.770 --> 02:45:39.440 sort of thing but 02:45:40.399 --> 02:45:43.079 can you see the good I guess to start there can you see the 02:45:43.079 --> 02:45:44.000 good that it would 02:45:44.000 --> 02:45:47.420 bring your business or are you willing to set that aside 02:45:47.420 --> 02:45:48.719 for the because I think 02:45:48.719 --> 02:45:50.979 the traffic is going to be there regardless right I mean if 02:45:50.979 --> 02:45:51.520 it's coming 02:45:51.520 --> 02:45:53.959 from off-site I don't think there's a way around the 02:45:53.959 --> 02:45:55.159 traffic so I want to kind 02:45:55.159 --> 02:45:57.399 of set that aside that's what I'm saying that's not 02:45:57.399 --> 02:45:58.760 necessarily the major focus 02:45:58.760 --> 02:46:02.799 right and so I think if we're talking more if they come in 02:46:02.799 --> 02:46:04.079 the code with the 02:46:04.079 --> 02:46:08.389 parking does that make you okay because I don't know that 02:46:08.389 --> 02:46:09.479 helps I want to help 02:46:09.479 --> 02:46:11.809 the neighborhood and the fact that they can add more 02:46:11.809 --> 02:46:13.040 parking to come one to one 02:46:13.040 --> 02:46:16.629 I don't think that makes an impact on the day-in-day-out 02:46:16.629 --> 02:46:18.040 lives of the people 02:46:18.040 --> 02:46:21.829 living in that overlay area and then no I don't I think 02:46:21.829 --> 02:46:22.680 that it's absolutely 02:46:22.680 --> 02:46:26.319 necessary that they have at least one-to-one parking but we 02:46:26.319 --> 02:46:27.079 go back to the 02:46:27.079 --> 02:46:30.569 issue again if you build a 60-foot building next to my two- 02:46:30.569 --> 02:46:31.559 story building 02:46:31.559 --> 02:46:34.590 on the west side I'm gonna be in the dark most of the day I 02:46:34.590 --> 02:46:36.760 mean just that's 02:46:36.760 --> 02:46:40.280 the reality of it the other buildings that are there are 02:46:40.280 --> 02:46:41.440 not that height this 02:46:41.440 --> 02:46:44.489 one's going to be definitely out of place the density of 02:46:44.489 --> 02:46:45.479 the people that are 02:46:45.479 --> 02:46:47.879 in there and the kids that will be crossing the street they 02:46:47.879 --> 02:46:48.319 're not going to 02:46:48.319 --> 02:46:50.260 go to the corner and cross with the light they're gonna go 02:46:50.260 --> 02:46:50.799 right across 02:46:50.799 --> 02:46:54.280 Hickory Street now the business side of it and I think 02:46:54.280 --> 02:46:55.239 somebody at one point 02:46:55.239 --> 02:46:59.409 asked me oh you'll have you know all these new people no 02:46:59.409 --> 02:47:00.200 that's not 02:47:00.200 --> 02:47:03.719 necessarily what's going to happen because in the 02:47:03.719 --> 02:47:05.040 summertime and in 02:47:05.040 --> 02:47:09.360 holidays those those kids leave they're gone what it will 02:47:09.360 --> 02:47:12.000 bring is what Sterling 02:47:12.000 --> 02:47:16.239 has brought to us with people you know up on balconies and 02:47:16.239 --> 02:47:17.680 just missing your 02:47:17.680 --> 02:47:20.049 head sometimes with a beer bottle because they're aiming at 02:47:20.049 --> 02:47:20.680 the trash cans 02:47:20.680 --> 02:47:24.319 one of the receptacles that they want to put is adjacent to 02:47:24.319 --> 02:47:26.319 my building so the 02:47:26.319 --> 02:47:30.520 people my balcony will look into their trash can so that's 02:47:30.520 --> 02:47:31.159 a little 02:47:31.159 --> 02:47:35.159 disconcerting for me I don't see anything that this size 02:47:35.159 --> 02:47:36.840 and density of a 02:47:36.840 --> 02:47:42.180 building can bring to the Fry Street area that is going to 02:47:42.180 --> 02:47:43.840 be beneficial if 02:47:43.840 --> 02:47:47.579 they bring it down they increase the retail underneath it 02:47:47.579 --> 02:47:48.360 and they do 02:47:48.360 --> 02:47:54.000 something that that works for the community that works for 02:47:54.000 --> 02:47:55.000 the scale I 02:47:55.000 --> 02:47:59.670 could understand that but right now you know they're they 02:47:59.670 --> 02:48:01.360 're not really looking 02:48:01.360 --> 02:48:05.229 at that they're just looking at their profit margin well 02:48:05.229 --> 02:48:06.760 and I have a question 02:48:06.760 --> 02:48:10.280 specifically with a retail though we we can agree that hadn 02:48:10.280 --> 02:48:11.520 't worked at Sterling 02:48:11.520 --> 02:48:15.899 I can't you can't get in there the businesses that have 02:48:15.899 --> 02:48:16.959 been in and out of 02:48:16.959 --> 02:48:20.760 there correct and these businesses that they're proposing 02:48:20.760 --> 02:48:22.920 have been staples as 02:48:22.920 --> 02:48:25.020 long as I can remember that Jack in the Box has been there 02:48:25.020 --> 02:48:25.799 the subway's been 02:48:25.799 --> 02:48:29.879 there Vortman's have been there I born and raised here I 02:48:29.879 --> 02:48:30.680 don't remember when 02:48:30.680 --> 02:48:37.059 they weren't there and so but yet you mentioned increase 02:48:37.059 --> 02:48:39.000 retail right if you 02:48:39.000 --> 02:48:41.309 look at the if you look at what they're trying to do with 02:48:41.309 --> 02:48:42.479 the 2030 plan and 02:48:42.479 --> 02:48:45.440 where they're trying to move the amount of retail in 02:48:45.440 --> 02:48:46.760 relationship to the size 02:48:46.760 --> 02:48:51.700 of the building here is small and you know I'm I'm sorry 02:48:51.700 --> 02:48:53.120 that the the owner of 02:48:53.120 --> 02:48:56.500 Vortman's isn't here tonight because it's it's his desire 02:48:56.500 --> 02:48:57.479 just to reduce his 02:48:57.479 --> 02:49:01.450 footprint you know he just wants to to make profit he gets 02:49:01.450 --> 02:49:02.319 to keep his bill he 02:49:02.319 --> 02:49:04.770 gets to keep his building and that kind of stuff I'm not 02:49:04.770 --> 02:49:06.639 sure how that works but 02:49:06.639 --> 02:49:10.200 the I think that there's something better that could be 02:49:10.200 --> 02:49:11.399 done with this it 02:49:11.399 --> 02:49:15.159 could be in more open area there is nothing that's being 02:49:15.159 --> 02:49:16.200 offered to the 02:49:16.200 --> 02:49:19.540 community through this building he talks about zip cars 02:49:19.540 --> 02:49:20.520 where you gonna park 02:49:20.520 --> 02:49:24.239 those zip cars he talks about bicycles there's not even a 02:49:24.239 --> 02:49:25.239 bicycle rack on this 02:49:25.239 --> 02:49:28.940 plan so you know when you start looking at alternative 02:49:28.940 --> 02:49:30.040 means once again you're 02:49:30.040 --> 02:49:33.370 you're pulling some things and like I said 68 parking 02:49:33.370 --> 02:49:34.799 spaces the only three 02:49:34.799 --> 02:49:38.200 handicapped parking spaces in the block how does all that 02:49:38.200 --> 02:49:39.520 gonna work I'm just 02:49:39.520 --> 02:49:43.600 not real sure I mean the laws mandate that they'll have 02:49:43.600 --> 02:49:44.760 enough I know yeah 02:49:44.760 --> 02:49:47.409 there's no way around that but what are you I guess that 02:49:47.409 --> 02:49:48.600 kind of if it's okay if 02:49:48.600 --> 02:49:50.979 I ask you a question when you talk about the business side 02:49:50.979 --> 02:49:51.959 of it are you talking 02:49:51.959 --> 02:49:55.559 about my business no just general so we're gonna have 02:49:55.559 --> 02:49:56.440 people come up and say 02:49:56.440 --> 02:49:59.739 it's a business decision and my point is just to neutralize 02:49:59.739 --> 02:50:00.799 that and say they all 02:50:00.799 --> 02:50:04.200 are right I mean yeah no I mean everyone does that that 02:50:04.200 --> 02:50:05.680 that's the price of being 02:50:05.680 --> 02:50:08.260 in business you know there's employees there's insurance 02:50:08.260 --> 02:50:09.920 there's taxes so I so 02:50:09.920 --> 02:50:12.549 that I just kind of want to normalize the conversation so 02:50:12.549 --> 02:50:13.559 that we can all kind 02:50:13.559 --> 02:50:17.239 of be on the same even level playing field and have 02:50:17.239 --> 02:50:19.440 tangible actionable items 02:50:19.440 --> 02:50:23.530 to consider so yeah but what happens to my building I mean 02:50:23.530 --> 02:50:24.440 what happens to the 02:50:24.440 --> 02:50:26.430 building what happens to the traffic and everything to 02:50:26.430 --> 02:50:27.440 during the construction 02:50:27.440 --> 02:50:30.069 phase of all this if you start moving dirt around my 02:50:30.069 --> 02:50:31.479 building my building was 02:50:31.479 --> 02:50:36.149 built in 1942 as a boarding house it's all galvanized pipe 02:50:36.149 --> 02:50:37.840 it's got you know 02:50:37.840 --> 02:50:41.610 I've got the and you start shaking that ground you're gonna 02:50:41.610 --> 02:50:42.200 start shaking the 02:50:42.200 --> 02:50:45.379 building and things are gonna move around and come down and 02:50:45.379 --> 02:50:46.200 I have not 02:50:46.200 --> 02:50:49.549 gotten a stable answer out of that the engineers say oh 02:50:49.549 --> 02:50:51.000 yeah there's plenty of 02:50:51.000 --> 02:50:53.819 capacity for the sewage there's plenty of capacity for the 02:50:53.819 --> 02:50:54.840 water but I actually 02:50:54.840 --> 02:50:56.840 heard one of them stand here and say well if our water 02:50:56.840 --> 02:50:57.760 pressure drops we'll 02:50:57.760 --> 02:51:00.840 just turn on the fire pumps to get the water to our 02:51:00.840 --> 02:51:02.239 building what do you do 02:51:02.239 --> 02:51:05.219 with the rest of the buildings that are there you know what 02:51:05.219 --> 02:51:06.000 do you do with the 02:51:06.000 --> 02:51:08.930 people up the street that were dependent upon that water so 02:51:08.930 --> 02:51:10.879 you know it's a nice 02:51:10.879 --> 02:51:14.440 project it needs to be someplace other than that one point 02:51:14.440 --> 02:51:15.200 whatever it is 02:51:15.200 --> 02:51:19.829 acres in the middle of the block even when you when they 02:51:19.829 --> 02:51:21.520 took the the other the 02:51:21.520 --> 02:51:24.690 the first overlay district the first sub district it took 02:51:24.690 --> 02:51:26.719 the whole block it 02:51:26.719 --> 02:51:30.969 didn't just take the center of a block sure thank you mm- 02:51:30.969 --> 02:51:32.440 hmm one more question 02:51:32.440 --> 02:51:37.940 Commissioner Brazil just a clarification you know the 02:51:37.940 --> 02:51:39.719 coffee shop next to Kush 02:51:39.719 --> 02:51:43.360 and the copy center there what yes that's your property yes 02:51:43.360 --> 02:51:44.120 it's two stories 02:51:44.120 --> 02:51:50.219 okay is the majority of your traffic by foot bike card have 02:51:50.219 --> 02:51:50.879 you measured that 02:51:50.879 --> 02:51:56.479 could you provide some insight into your customers routine 02:51:56.479 --> 02:51:58.079 a lot of it's by foot 02:51:58.079 --> 02:52:02.049 the reason I don't have a lot of car traffic is there's no 02:52:02.049 --> 02:52:03.120 place to park 02:52:03.120 --> 02:52:06.459 recently and I don't know who or how this happened but I 02:52:06.459 --> 02:52:07.639 was very grateful 02:52:07.639 --> 02:52:11.260 the parking spaces were marked retail parking I mean they 02:52:11.260 --> 02:52:14.000 put stickers on them 02:52:14.000 --> 02:52:18.059 when people come in it you know they they have to pay we 02:52:18.059 --> 02:52:19.680 get lots of tickets 02:52:19.680 --> 02:52:22.629 from the University of North Texas if you're there for more 02:52:22.629 --> 02:52:23.479 than an hour and 02:52:23.479 --> 02:52:28.040 sticker goes out so I would say that basically mine is is 02:52:28.040 --> 02:52:29.319 probably more foot 02:52:29.319 --> 02:52:35.040 traffic bicycle traffic and during the week but I'll still 02:52:35.040 --> 02:52:35.959 have I mean the 02:52:35.959 --> 02:52:39.520 people will park their cars and I don't know where they 02:52:39.520 --> 02:52:41.000 park their cars I'm not 02:52:41.000 --> 02:52:44.409 gonna admit that I know where they park their cars they go 02:52:44.409 --> 02:52:45.680 early to get a 02:52:45.680 --> 02:52:49.360 parking space you know on one of the feeder streets they 02:52:49.360 --> 02:52:51.079 come to my shop they 02:52:51.079 --> 02:52:53.510 get something some coffee they work on their homework and 02:52:53.510 --> 02:52:54.559 then they go to class 02:52:54.559 --> 02:52:57.319 and they come back over where I am or they go to the Union 02:52:57.319 --> 02:52:58.639 so the streets are 02:52:58.639 --> 02:53:03.459 being used as as the parking areas sure does your business 02:53:03.459 --> 02:53:05.159 have parking spots 02:53:05.159 --> 02:53:09.399 available what is your parking interesting you should ask 02:53:09.399 --> 02:53:10.000 that question 02:53:10.000 --> 02:53:16.440 I have an agreement with workman's my employees park in 02:53:16.440 --> 02:53:18.680 there a lot okay so I 02:53:18.680 --> 02:53:21.579 will have to get a variance to have a place for my 02:53:21.579 --> 02:53:23.200 employees to park or they 02:53:23.200 --> 02:53:26.280 will be taking up the parking spaces I have ten employees 02:53:26.280 --> 02:53:26.879 they're not there all 02:53:26.879 --> 02:53:32.180 the time but and then I rent for parking spaces from Fort 02:53:32.180 --> 02:53:34.360 man's okay and so 02:53:34.360 --> 02:53:38.399 potentially your your business can be negatively impacted 02:53:38.399 --> 02:53:39.399 by losing those 02:53:39.399 --> 02:53:42.290 parking spots yes not potentially I mean I guess if it goes 02:53:42.290 --> 02:53:42.799 forward it would be 02:53:42.799 --> 02:53:47.469 impacted yeah okay and go back again to the 68 public 02:53:47.469 --> 02:53:48.520 parking spaces that are 02:53:48.520 --> 02:53:52.780 currently now on that lot if people go into Vortman's they 02:53:52.780 --> 02:53:53.200 come through 02:53:53.200 --> 02:53:55.920 Bortman's you know do their thing at Bortman come over grab 02:53:55.920 --> 02:53:56.479 a cup of coffee 02:53:56.479 --> 02:53:59.629 and go back out they know they had a place to park at Fort 02:53:59.629 --> 02:54:01.799 man's so I you know 02:54:01.799 --> 02:54:04.899 when I when I walked that and got to looking at it it was a 02:54:04.899 --> 02:54:05.959 concern sure and 02:54:05.959 --> 02:54:09.180 and just as I as I continue my train of thought in this the 02:54:09.180 --> 02:54:09.920 majority of your 02:54:09.920 --> 02:54:12.479 business is morning coffee drinkers in the morning or in 02:54:12.479 --> 02:54:13.440 the afternoon is there 02:54:13.440 --> 02:54:17.049 also issues yeah there's issues at both times because as 02:54:17.049 --> 02:54:17.920 the people are coming 02:54:17.920 --> 02:54:21.340 in and out just like with the traffic the the highest peak 02:54:21.340 --> 02:54:22.959 is between 9 and 11 in 02:54:22.959 --> 02:54:25.420 the morning that's when the most number of people come 02:54:25.420 --> 02:54:26.639 through the shop it goes 02:54:26.639 --> 02:54:29.559 up again between 3 and 4 in the afternoon okay so if you do 02:54:29.559 --> 02:54:30.120 a traffic 02:54:30.120 --> 02:54:32.719 study you may be missing I mean you may be thinking about 02:54:32.719 --> 02:54:33.639 when people go in and 02:54:33.639 --> 02:54:36.270 out to work but not when they go in and out to class sure 02:54:36.270 --> 02:54:36.760 now that makes sense 02:54:36.760 --> 02:54:42.040 thank you I don't see any other questions thank you very 02:54:42.040 --> 02:54:44.840 much thank you 02:54:45.200 --> 02:54:52.899 next speaker will be Anderson many Mary Mary followed by K 02:54:52.899 --> 02:54:55.760 ale Ward Mary Anderson 02:54:55.760 --> 02:54:59.790 924 West Oak the Morris's and I moved in the same time on 02:54:59.790 --> 02:55:01.360 West Oak we were 02:55:01.360 --> 02:55:04.739 attracted to the area because of its historic character the 02:55:04.739 --> 02:55:05.879 charm the low-rise 02:55:05.879 --> 02:55:09.850 buildings we were promised much on the Frey Street 02:55:09.850 --> 02:55:11.079 development but I want to 02:55:11.079 --> 02:55:13.819 thank Ron for doing a good job I'd like to thank you for 02:55:13.819 --> 02:55:14.760 asking very nice 02:55:14.760 --> 02:55:18.340 questions they've been very eye-opening I've been to some 02:55:18.340 --> 02:55:19.200 of these community 02:55:19.200 --> 02:55:22.440 meetings frankly they're nothing but the same old 02:55:22.440 --> 02:55:24.520 presentation over and over again 02:55:24.520 --> 02:55:28.120 I believe I believe I believe today was the first day I saw 02:55:28.120 --> 02:55:29.440 data about parking 02:55:29.440 --> 02:55:33.950 January 6 2016 Dean does anybody know when classes are in 02:55:33.950 --> 02:55:35.920 UNT and TWU not 02:55:35.920 --> 02:55:41.120 January 6th the parking statistics they believe ask for the 02:55:41.120 --> 02:55:42.239 data it's not there 02:55:42.239 --> 02:55:46.600 it's a belief they already told us 33 North was very it 02:55:46.600 --> 02:55:47.600 wasn't very used they 02:55:47.600 --> 02:55:50.639 didn't December well that's fine everybody had already left 02:55:50.639 --> 02:55:51.319 after exams 02:55:51.319 --> 02:55:54.549 you need to run the parking when people are actually going 02:55:54.549 --> 02:55:56.360 to school there's so 02:55:56.360 --> 02:55:58.610 many things wrong with this plan and I know that most of 02:55:58.610 --> 02:55:59.520 you identified with 02:55:59.520 --> 02:56:02.959 them it's an SRO project shouldn't we stop and think about 02:56:02.959 --> 02:56:03.559 this do you know 02:56:03.559 --> 02:56:05.870 how many other apartments are planned in this area I'm sure 02:56:05.870 --> 02:56:06.840 you do there's the 02:56:06.840 --> 02:56:09.420 scripture one we'll see you then right all these other 02:56:09.420 --> 02:56:10.600 apartments the one right 02:56:10.600 --> 02:56:12.790 next to where they're talking about parking have you 02:56:12.790 --> 02:56:13.680 noticed there's not 02:56:13.680 --> 02:56:15.989 many people parking there not many of those apartments are 02:56:15.989 --> 02:56:16.559 rented what do you 02:56:16.559 --> 02:56:18.799 think is gonna happen next another one that's gonna seek 02:56:18.799 --> 02:56:19.760 the same variants as 02:56:19.760 --> 02:56:23.280 they've gotten this is crazy that's a traffic issue the 02:56:23.280 --> 02:56:24.319 real issue is the 02:56:24.319 --> 02:56:26.790 character of their neighborhood is going down I really don 02:56:26.790 --> 02:56:27.799 't like thinking in my 02:56:27.799 --> 02:56:31.600 home being the buffer I live in a historic district and 02:56:31.600 --> 02:56:33.440 they said mr. King 02:56:33.440 --> 02:56:36.469 said that UNT had eight nine story buildings yes on the 02:56:36.469 --> 02:56:37.760 west side of campus 02:56:37.760 --> 02:56:40.680 nowhere near where they're planning to build in fact the 02:56:40.680 --> 02:56:42.840 best place is what Kim 02:56:42.840 --> 02:56:47.239 said was someplace else either match the restrictions that 02:56:47.239 --> 02:56:48.600 are given or move on 02:56:48.600 --> 02:56:51.799 to the other side of campus where the heights are higher 02:56:51.799 --> 02:56:53.979 closer to 35 the 02:56:53.979 --> 02:56:56.229 term is starting to go downhill and I just spent a lot of 02:56:56.229 --> 02:56:57.159 money renovating my 02:56:57.159 --> 02:57:00.319 house and pretty much I'm pretty sad to see all the 02:57:00.319 --> 02:57:02.200 development it's these guys 02:57:02.200 --> 02:57:04.969 and it'll be their next plan down the street and you know 02:57:04.969 --> 02:57:05.799 they pride themselves 02:57:05.799 --> 02:57:08.129 on the architecture that matches the neighborhood I don't 02:57:08.129 --> 02:57:08.680 know any of those 02:57:08.680 --> 02:57:11.340 that look like a historic neighborhood what about you not 02:57:11.340 --> 02:57:13.040 one they don't care 02:57:13.040 --> 02:57:15.239 nothing's coming into this neighborhood they're only gonna 02:57:15.239 --> 02:57:16.479 raise the value of my 02:57:16.479 --> 02:57:19.760 property because they're going to put on a big building and 02:57:19.760 --> 02:57:20.920 then claim student 02:57:20.920 --> 02:57:27.159 discounts on rents we need more family oriented things we 02:57:27.159 --> 02:57:30.040 need to have growth 02:57:30.040 --> 02:57:34.079 elsewhere not just here we don't need something that big if 02:57:34.079 --> 02:57:34.520 they could match 02:57:34.520 --> 02:57:37.409 the requirements but nothing has changed there are so much 02:57:37.409 --> 02:57:38.520 wrong the part that's 02:57:38.520 --> 02:57:41.329 too many it's too high there's not enough parking they've 02:57:41.329 --> 02:57:42.360 taken some away 02:57:42.360 --> 02:57:47.329 their surveys on everything are dated at the wrong time the 02:57:47.329 --> 02:57:48.319 coverage of the land 02:57:48.319 --> 02:57:51.590 does more than I can build on my house they want to have 70 02:57:51.590 --> 02:57:52.879 % coverage drainage 02:57:52.879 --> 02:57:56.440 water traffic the hospital traffic how are you gonna get to 02:57:56.440 --> 02:57:57.280 the hospital 02:57:57.280 --> 02:57:59.879 anymore when you put this one up and the next one up and 02:57:59.879 --> 02:58:01.360 the next one up at any 02:58:01.360 --> 02:58:03.799 rate I'd like to thank you all and I hope certainly hope 02:58:03.799 --> 02:58:04.559 you go with what 02:58:04.559 --> 02:58:10.610 planning and zoning is suggested not to approve thank you I 02:58:10.610 --> 02:58:11.559 don't see any 02:58:11.559 --> 02:58:14.479 questions at this time do you have a question Larry you are 02:58:14.479 --> 02:58:16.600 ringing okay thank 02:58:16.600 --> 02:58:26.559 you Kale Ward followed by Randy hunt 02:58:33.040 --> 02:58:37.190 thank you I actually have some of these for you guys these 02:58:37.190 --> 02:58:38.399 are from I'm speaking 02:58:38.399 --> 02:58:43.069 on behalf of Brent Erskine owner and property owner of Vert 02:58:43.069 --> 02:58:44.680 mans so would you 02:58:44.680 --> 02:58:46.729 guys like these now or would you like me to hang them out 02:58:46.729 --> 02:58:47.680 sure please pass them 02:58:47.680 --> 02:58:50.299 out and then give us your name and address or if you're 02:58:50.299 --> 02:58:51.040 representing 02:58:51.040 --> 02:58:53.600 someone else 02:59:08.280 --> 02:59:25.760 I sure can okay my name is Kale Ward I am speaking on 02:59:25.760 --> 02:59:26.760 behalf of Brent Erskine 02:59:26.760 --> 02:59:30.049 who is the property owner and business owner of Vertmans 02:59:30.049 --> 02:59:31.840 bookstore on 1314 West 02:59:31.840 --> 02:59:35.709 Hickory so I'm gonna begin I want to apologize for my 02:59:35.709 --> 02:59:36.780 absence on for the 02:59:36.780 --> 02:59:40.659 October 26 2016 meeting I hope it is not interpreted as a 02:59:40.659 --> 02:59:41.959 lack of care or belief 02:59:41.959 --> 02:59:44.360 in the positive impact this development would have on the 02:59:44.360 --> 02:59:45.719 business businesses in 02:59:45.719 --> 02:59:48.709 the Fry Street overlay I want to start by explaining our 02:59:48.709 --> 02:59:49.920 intent by having EDR 02:59:49.920 --> 02:59:53.959 present this project the Vertmans building is over 90 years 02:59:53.959 --> 02:59:54.559 old and has 02:59:54.559 --> 02:59:57.799 been added on to four times for different business models 02:59:57.799 --> 02:59:58.639 our business 02:59:58.639 --> 03:00:01.459 model now is much different than several of the business 03:00:01.459 --> 03:00:02.479 models of the Vertmans 03:00:02.479 --> 03:00:06.709 family ran in the 1920s and 1990s we are neither we're 03:00:06.709 --> 03:00:07.879 neither as sophisticated 03:00:07.879 --> 03:00:11.239 nor we as diversified as mr. Vertman to run a department 03:00:11.239 --> 03:00:12.879 store however we do 03:00:12.879 --> 03:00:16.440 well it what we do well is create college stores with books 03:00:16.440 --> 03:00:17.040 apparel and 03:00:17.040 --> 03:00:20.000 our supplies since we understand who we are and who we are 03:00:20.000 --> 03:00:21.360 not we know we need 03:00:21.360 --> 03:00:25.069 to cut down on the 2000 or 24,000 plus square feet we 03:00:25.069 --> 03:00:26.200 operate Vertmans out of 03:00:26.200 --> 03:00:29.479 to become more efficient we can do this one of two ways 03:00:29.479 --> 03:00:30.360 subdivide our building 03:00:30.360 --> 03:00:33.180 adding more businesses to the area or sell to a student 03:00:33.180 --> 03:00:34.760 living company since 03:00:34.760 --> 03:00:37.219 the new development down the road has empty businesses 03:00:37.219 --> 03:00:38.120 business space for a 03:00:38.120 --> 03:00:40.750 lease we believe selling to a unit to a student living 03:00:40.750 --> 03:00:42.239 company is better for the 03:00:42.239 --> 03:00:46.479 Fry Street area EDR will add businesses or add business to 03:00:46.479 --> 03:00:47.239 the area instead of 03:00:47.239 --> 03:00:50.829 businesses create a new better looking space for our retail 03:00:50.829 --> 03:00:51.920 business which we 03:00:51.920 --> 03:00:54.840 will own and allow us to make sure the Vertmans name 03:00:54.840 --> 03:00:56.040 continues on as a store 03:00:56.040 --> 03:00:59.520 business in this community outside of the positive impact 03:00:59.520 --> 03:01:00.719 this will have on my 03:01:00.719 --> 03:01:03.250 business I believe there are many reasons this project 03:01:03.250 --> 03:01:04.120 should be approved 03:01:04.120 --> 03:01:07.319 increase in property tax for the city increase in city 03:01:07.319 --> 03:01:09.120 municipalities income 03:01:09.120 --> 03:01:12.129 for trash to electricity and clean up several older 03:01:12.129 --> 03:01:13.879 buildings in the overlay I 03:01:13.879 --> 03:01:16.649 understand that these older buildings are mine however they 03:01:16.649 --> 03:01:17.440 need to major 03:01:17.440 --> 03:01:20.409 updating and there is no better way than to do that than to 03:01:20.409 --> 03:01:22.040 add more year-round 03:01:22.040 --> 03:01:25.139 customers for the business businesses in the area even my 03:01:25.139 --> 03:01:26.040 friends who own 03:01:26.040 --> 03:01:29.040 businesses with zero parking will benefit from this however 03:01:29.040 --> 03:01:29.799 there are two 03:01:29.799 --> 03:01:39.479 main reasons I would like to look at in detail next page 03:01:39.479 --> 03:01:41.559 with the increase in 03:01:41.559 --> 03:01:44.200 enrollment at the University of North Texas there needs to 03:01:44.200 --> 03:01:44.760 be a serious 03:01:44.760 --> 03:01:47.329 consideration for zoning changes and the increase in 03:01:47.329 --> 03:01:48.639 revenue for small locally 03:01:48.639 --> 03:01:51.680 owned businesses when the Fry Street overlay was created in 03:01:51.680 --> 03:01:52.840 1999 the 03:01:52.840 --> 03:01:55.940 University of North Texas had approximately 27,000 students 03:01:55.940 --> 03:01:56.239 in the 03:01:56.239 --> 03:02:01.360 fall of 2000 now this same university has 37 over 37,000 03:02:01.360 --> 03:02:02.280 students in the fall 03:02:02.280 --> 03:02:07.319 of 2015 that is a 37.4 percent increase in the student 03:02:07.319 --> 03:02:08.920 population yet EDR is 03:02:08.920 --> 03:02:11.510 only asking for 25 percent increase in the number of 03:02:11.510 --> 03:02:12.879 stories think about this 03:02:12.879 --> 03:02:15.569 the tentative date this project will open would be fall 03:02:15.569 --> 03:02:17.559 2018 and the income 03:02:17.559 --> 03:02:20.260 the incoming freshmen were not even born when the city 03:02:20.260 --> 03:02:22.559 created this overlay as the 03:02:22.559 --> 03:02:24.829 time goes time goes on buildings get old and they are 03:02:24.829 --> 03:02:26.079 replaced with new buildings 03:02:26.079 --> 03:02:29.729 that make that makes sense economically in the space and 03:02:29.729 --> 03:02:30.600 fit the surrounding 03:02:30.600 --> 03:02:33.579 buildings but the youth center at fry being 225 feet away 03:02:33.579 --> 03:02:34.440 having a similar 03:02:34.440 --> 03:02:37.030 configuration and the prevalent height of our proposed 03:02:37.030 --> 03:02:38.040 building is two feet 03:02:38.040 --> 03:02:41.110 taller than the parking deck at youth center suggests that 03:02:41.110 --> 03:02:42.040 our part that our 03:02:42.040 --> 03:02:45.170 project would fit perfectly in the environment from the 03:02:45.170 --> 03:02:46.159 standpoint of height 03:02:46.159 --> 03:02:49.049 the language auditorium and chemistry buildings across the 03:02:49.049 --> 03:02:49.799 street are also 03:02:49.799 --> 03:02:53.280 close in comparison these buildings are large enough that 03:02:53.280 --> 03:02:54.760 our proposed building 03:02:54.760 --> 03:02:58.139 would appropriately match the environment I understand that 03:02:58.139 --> 03:02:58.360 there is a 03:02:58.360 --> 03:03:00.920 parking issue at UNT like there is every other major 03:03:00.920 --> 03:03:03.680 university my suggestion is 03:03:03.680 --> 03:03:07.809 that even if EDR adds another 30 spaces again there will 03:03:07.809 --> 03:03:08.780 still be parking issue 03:03:08.780 --> 03:03:12.340 at UNT we should not make the private sector responsible 03:03:12.340 --> 03:03:13.000 for the parking issue 03:03:13.000 --> 03:03:15.989 UNT has created it is a very hard for me to understand that 03:03:15.989 --> 03:03:16.959 we don't believe 03:03:16.959 --> 03:03:21.219 there is enough walking traffic for EDR not to have one one 03:03:21.219 --> 03:03:23.319 -on-one parking when 03:03:23.319 --> 03:03:26.559 we have more than five businesses within 300 feet that don 03:03:26.559 --> 03:03:27.479 't have any customer 03:03:27.479 --> 03:03:31.000 parking besides meter parking in addition to that with what 03:03:31.000 --> 03:03:31.760 little meter 03:03:31.760 --> 03:03:34.469 parking there is we have put bike racks and loading zones 03:03:34.469 --> 03:03:35.639 for the owners to park 03:03:35.639 --> 03:03:38.409 in please understand I don't have a problem with the 03:03:38.409 --> 03:03:39.379 loading zones or bike 03:03:39.379 --> 03:03:43.459 racks in fact we started at when we started at 103 Avenue a 03:03:43.459 --> 03:03:44.479 and Fry Street 03:03:44.479 --> 03:03:47.290 we paid for a loading zone and I used it to park my vehicle 03:03:47.290 --> 03:03:48.440 the problem is this 03:03:48.440 --> 03:03:51.309 city should have a consistent philosophy we receive a 03:03:51.309 --> 03:03:52.639 negative recommendation from 03:03:52.639 --> 03:03:55.930 the city and if we are honest it is for two reasons they 03:03:55.930 --> 03:03:57.159 think it is too too tall 03:03:57.159 --> 03:04:00.110 and there is not enough parking yet there is a building a 03:04:00.110 --> 03:04:01.079 half a block away 03:04:01.079 --> 03:04:08.209 that has a parking deck 60 feet tall they think there is 03:04:08.209 --> 03:04:09.239 not enough parking 03:04:09.239 --> 03:04:13.000 that yet we let our parking places go to loading zones and 03:04:13.000 --> 03:04:14.120 bike racks these 03:04:14.120 --> 03:04:16.780 loading zones are just used for business owners to park 03:04:16.780 --> 03:04:18.200 their vehicles put bike 03:04:18.200 --> 03:04:22.440 put bike racks bike racks business owners choice and for 03:04:22.440 --> 03:04:22.959 the fast food 03:04:22.959 --> 03:04:26.159 delivery employees to park their cars as a business owner 03:04:26.159 --> 03:04:27.120 on Fry Street since 03:04:27.120 --> 03:04:30.479 November 2017 I have seen several changes and have put 03:04:30.479 --> 03:04:31.280 built relationships 03:04:31.280 --> 03:04:33.549 with many of the business owners in the district all of 03:04:33.549 --> 03:04:35.520 which are positive for 03:04:35.520 --> 03:04:37.479 those that I have spoken with and have owned businesses 03:04:37.479 --> 03:04:38.399 before the youth center 03:04:38.399 --> 03:04:41.420 was built until now excluding lunch businesses have all 03:04:41.420 --> 03:04:42.120 said their sales 03:04:42.120 --> 03:04:44.959 have increased since the new development with EDR's 03:04:44.959 --> 03:04:46.159 proposal adding student 03:04:46.159 --> 03:04:49.219 housing and not adding any new businesses we are sure to 03:04:49.219 --> 03:04:50.000 increase the 03:04:50.000 --> 03:04:53.680 sales of all the small businesses on this street books 03:04:53.680 --> 03:04:55.799 copies coffee beer 03:04:55.799 --> 03:04:59.149 and food our hope is that we drop that we will drive enough 03:04:59.149 --> 03:04:59.879 business to keep 03:04:59.879 --> 03:05:03.350 businesses in the two new developments down the street I 03:05:03.350 --> 03:05:04.559 hope you can see that 03:05:04.559 --> 03:05:08.020 the apartment the apparent apparent benefit to small 03:05:08.020 --> 03:05:09.719 business and evidence 03:05:09.719 --> 03:05:13.280 of how the building fits in fits the environment the lack 03:05:13.280 --> 03:05:14.239 of consistency by 03:05:14.239 --> 03:05:17.719 the city could make a local business owner feel unsupported 03:05:17.719 --> 03:05:18.639 as a local 03:05:18.639 --> 03:05:21.239 business owner who has started three businesses in Denton 03:05:21.239 --> 03:05:22.440 created over two 03:05:22.440 --> 03:05:25.180 point five million dollars in sales tax paid several 03:05:25.180 --> 03:05:26.360 hundred thousands in 03:05:26.360 --> 03:05:30.329 property tax and employs over ten fold over ten full-time 03:05:30.329 --> 03:05:31.500 20 part-time and a 03:05:31.500 --> 03:05:35.100 hundred plus temporary people the decision by the city PNC 03:05:35.100 --> 03:05:35.879 and City 03:05:35.879 --> 03:05:39.639 Council could give up me pause before reinvesting more 03:05:39.639 --> 03:05:41.280 money back into didn't I 03:05:41.280 --> 03:05:44.260 sincerely ask that you place a small vote for small 03:05:44.260 --> 03:05:45.680 businesses so they can 03:05:45.680 --> 03:05:48.770 continue to grow and invest back into didn't and if there 03:05:48.770 --> 03:05:50.239 are any questions I 03:05:50.239 --> 03:05:54.989 will try to answer them best on his behalf okay any 03:05:54.989 --> 03:05:59.840 questions thank you 03:05:59.840 --> 03:06:02.360 thank you 03:06:05.280 --> 03:06:11.079 Randy hunt to be followed by Aaron Knight 03:06:17.680 --> 03:06:21.850 my name is Randy hunt I'm at 722 West Oak it's at the 03:06:21.850 --> 03:06:24.760 corner of Oak and Mounts 03:06:25.639 --> 03:06:30.620 can you raise the microphone or speak closer to thank you 03:06:30.620 --> 03:06:32.920 sure I'm glad to be 03:06:32.920 --> 03:06:37.430 cooperative with the people that need that request well 03:06:37.430 --> 03:06:38.680 that's something here 03:06:38.680 --> 03:06:42.649 it on the record too so gotcha okay so obviously I'm at 22 03:06:42.649 --> 03:06:44.520 West Oak we've been 03:06:44.520 --> 03:06:50.770 there since 2004 and I did go to the first meeting by these 03:06:50.770 --> 03:06:52.120 people that were 03:06:52.120 --> 03:06:55.989 asking for these variances and I think one of the things 03:06:55.989 --> 03:06:57.360 that we're really 03:06:57.360 --> 03:07:01.770 proud that we've been able to almost achieve we have a 03:07:01.770 --> 03:07:02.559 little bit more 03:07:02.559 --> 03:07:06.639 information to do but we're going to get a national 03:07:06.639 --> 03:07:09.000 register district for a big 03:07:09.000 --> 03:07:12.680 chunk of the area like from Hickory Street all the way to 03:07:12.680 --> 03:07:13.799 panhandle from 03:07:13.799 --> 03:07:19.319 Carroll all the way over to probably ponder Street it's 03:07:19.319 --> 03:07:22.159 about 350 houses the 03:07:22.159 --> 03:07:25.719 reason we're getting that is because we have a large 03:07:25.719 --> 03:07:27.520 percentage of homes that 03:07:27.520 --> 03:07:31.319 have not been disturbed but the major reason we're getting 03:07:31.319 --> 03:07:32.559 that is because we 03:07:32.559 --> 03:07:35.889 still have a cultural area that represents why that 03:07:35.889 --> 03:07:37.120 neighborhood was 03:07:37.120 --> 03:07:41.719 built in the first place so every time that there is some 03:07:41.719 --> 03:07:43.000 structure coming in 03:07:43.000 --> 03:07:47.770 that's you know like five-story building compared to 03:07:47.770 --> 03:07:49.680 structures that have been 03:07:49.680 --> 03:07:53.549 there for over a hundred years doesn't complement what we 03:07:53.549 --> 03:07:55.120 're trying to do in 03:07:55.120 --> 03:07:59.489 fact we have visited with the Texas Historic Commission 03:07:59.489 --> 03:08:00.680 about another 03:08:00.680 --> 03:08:06.520 proposed area from ponder Street all the way up to Avenue C 03:08:06.520 --> 03:08:07.920 that's already been 03:08:07.920 --> 03:08:12.510 identified as potential National Register District as well 03:08:12.510 --> 03:08:13.559 so every time 03:08:13.559 --> 03:08:17.530 that something comes in and starts disturbing the cultural 03:08:17.530 --> 03:08:18.600 area it's 03:08:18.600 --> 03:08:23.840 disruptive five stories is disruptive I have no problem 03:08:23.840 --> 03:08:25.680 seeing you know changes 03:08:25.680 --> 03:08:30.799 I have no problem with you know the way it's zone right now 03:08:30.799 --> 03:08:32.479 and if people want 03:08:32.479 --> 03:08:36.520 to come into our area the city that was built the reason 03:08:36.520 --> 03:08:37.719 that UNT is here 03:08:37.719 --> 03:08:41.950 and work with the neighborhood that'd be a good reason to 03:08:41.950 --> 03:08:43.959 do that so really I 03:08:43.959 --> 03:08:48.780 think the focus of my issue with this development is that 03:08:48.780 --> 03:08:49.799 it's not an 03:08:49.799 --> 03:08:57.520 apartment it's a single single-room occupancy that by 03:08:57.520 --> 03:08:59.040 itself is not 03:08:59.040 --> 03:09:02.799 complementary to why the district is there why are the 03:09:02.799 --> 03:09:05.159 buildings there if I 03:09:05.159 --> 03:09:09.479 as a family wanted to move into one of those couldn't do it 03:09:09.479 --> 03:09:11.040 do you think that 03:09:11.040 --> 03:09:14.450 after this you know the current buildings can be built and 03:09:14.450 --> 03:09:15.200 some new owner 03:09:15.200 --> 03:09:23.790 comes in well it ever be switched to apartments no I think 03:09:23.790 --> 03:09:25.159 what we need to be 03:09:25.159 --> 03:09:30.069 working on is apartments that will support families that 03:09:30.069 --> 03:09:31.239 will support a 03:09:31.239 --> 03:09:34.889 community that will support you know the reason that the 03:09:34.889 --> 03:09:37.159 people are here we don't 03:09:37.159 --> 03:09:44.120 need any more single occupancy rooms have a question for 03:09:44.120 --> 03:09:44.920 you Commissioner Beck 03:09:44.920 --> 03:09:47.319 thank you chair thank you mr. on for coming down and 03:09:47.319 --> 03:09:49.399 speaking how long have 03:09:49.399 --> 03:09:53.850 you been in the neighborhood we bought in 2004 okay so you 03:09:53.850 --> 03:09:54.799 were there after 03:09:54.799 --> 03:10:02.959 sub area a yes before sub area B the neighborhood is 03:10:02.959 --> 03:10:04.520 evidently may get 03:10:04.520 --> 03:10:07.280 compromised with the city and University of North Texas 03:10:07.280 --> 03:10:08.840 allowing these bigger 03:10:08.840 --> 03:10:13.120 buildings there that could be considered an encroachment so 03:10:13.120 --> 03:10:14.280 what is it about this 03:10:14.280 --> 03:10:18.870 building that all of a sudden there's not a willingness to 03:10:18.870 --> 03:10:21.000 compromise going 03:10:21.000 --> 03:10:25.120 forward does that is that an assumption that the 03:10:25.120 --> 03:10:26.600 neighborhood was supporting it 03:10:26.600 --> 03:10:31.270 well you tell me I think that's an assumption okay okay 03:10:31.270 --> 03:10:32.000 because I think 03:10:32.000 --> 03:10:35.290 you're a number of people that were living in the Hoke and 03:10:35.290 --> 03:10:36.360 Hickory and other 03:10:36.360 --> 03:10:40.319 areas that were not supportive of that five-story building 03:10:40.319 --> 03:10:41.520 okay that's what I 03:10:41.520 --> 03:10:45.399 wanted to hear yeah okay now we're living with it but just 03:10:45.399 --> 03:10:46.079 because we lived 03:10:46.079 --> 03:10:50.579 with one doesn't mean we want to live with two and the 03:10:50.579 --> 03:10:52.840 biggest threat is that 03:10:52.840 --> 03:10:59.239 there's a proposal for a five-story single occupancy room 03:10:59.239 --> 03:11:00.799 and sro on 03:11:00.799 --> 03:11:07.069 scripture Street and that's just offensive because so 03:11:07.069 --> 03:11:09.040 anyway okay if we 03:11:09.040 --> 03:11:12.610 were at three stories the way it's owned right now I wouldn 03:11:12.610 --> 03:11:14.159 't I would I create a 03:11:14.159 --> 03:11:17.629 compromise you could live with it I can live with that and 03:11:17.629 --> 03:11:19.159 I understand that the 03:11:19.159 --> 03:11:22.680 compromise may have been done so reluctantly I do but that 03:11:22.680 --> 03:11:23.479 seems to be 03:11:23.479 --> 03:11:28.069 the sense here and that what I'm hearing from most people 03:11:28.069 --> 03:11:29.319 so far is that the 03:11:29.319 --> 03:11:32.620 envelopes are being pushed and it puts us in kind of a 03:11:32.620 --> 03:11:34.600 slippery slope situation 03:11:34.600 --> 03:11:37.819 would that be a fair assessment by if we built a five-story 03:11:37.819 --> 03:11:41.319 building there I'm 03:11:41.319 --> 03:11:44.659 sorry I don't know if I got your question okay there's a 03:11:44.659 --> 03:11:45.639 sense that the 03:11:45.639 --> 03:11:48.770 envelope is being pushed now we've already allowed a three 03:11:48.770 --> 03:11:49.559 and a four story 03:11:49.559 --> 03:11:52.870 building there allowed a five-story is this a slippery 03:11:52.870 --> 03:11:54.360 slope situation in your 03:11:54.360 --> 03:11:58.100 opinion it really is because you know in the way that I 03:11:58.100 --> 03:11:59.440 count the stories on the 03:11:59.440 --> 03:12:05.149 on the building is there is this you know maybe we go back 03:12:05.149 --> 03:12:06.239 and look at it or 03:12:06.239 --> 03:12:08.790 maybe I need to go back and look at it but it looks like it 03:12:08.790 --> 03:12:09.879 's more of a four 03:12:09.879 --> 03:12:15.030 story and not a five story so every time that there's a 03:12:15.030 --> 03:12:17.319 variance that's just 03:12:17.319 --> 03:12:22.399 offensive you know it's zoned for a reason and it's zoned 03:12:22.399 --> 03:12:23.840 because there's a 03:12:23.840 --> 03:12:27.430 whole bunch of neighborhoods that are right around the 03:12:27.430 --> 03:12:29.440 university why should 03:12:29.440 --> 03:12:34.909 we be willing to compromise on neighborhoods to accommodate 03:12:34.909 --> 03:12:36.000 businesses 03:12:36.000 --> 03:12:40.870 who want to make a profit okay thank you very much one more 03:12:40.870 --> 03:12:41.040 question 03:12:41.040 --> 03:12:45.120 Commissioner has with thank you thank you for your comments 03:12:45.120 --> 03:12:47.200 I'm gonna try to be 03:12:47.200 --> 03:12:55.399 succinct so help me help me quantify the bad experiences 03:12:55.399 --> 03:12:57.479 with the sterling or the 03:12:57.479 --> 03:13:02.079 current new developments there what what experiences have 03:13:02.079 --> 03:13:03.719 you had that that have 03:13:03.719 --> 03:13:08.600 left you with a negative impression are you familiar with 03:13:08.600 --> 03:13:10.600 the Evers house is the 03:13:10.600 --> 03:13:15.110 is the big yes to story on the corner yes sir so one of the 03:13:15.110 --> 03:13:17.680 comments was you 03:13:17.680 --> 03:13:20.780 know where students are packed into those rooms so they 03:13:20.780 --> 03:13:21.639 hang out on the 03:13:21.639 --> 03:13:27.610 balconies and you know some take sport with what can they 03:13:27.610 --> 03:13:30.120 throw but there are a 03:13:30.120 --> 03:13:36.030 number of conversations that are not g-rated sure and so 03:13:36.030 --> 03:13:37.600 there's just a lot 03:13:37.600 --> 03:13:41.469 of impact when you have that many you know people that are 03:13:41.469 --> 03:13:42.600 geared towards 03:13:42.600 --> 03:13:48.629 students because they're SRO is only that you know wouldn't 03:13:48.629 --> 03:13:50.040 be those same 03:13:50.040 --> 03:13:54.500 kind of problems if they were actually family units one 03:13:54.500 --> 03:13:57.319 would hope but if you're 03:13:57.319 --> 03:14:00.209 trying so let's let's narrow it down let's say I mean 03:14:00.209 --> 03:14:02.079 because I have two 03:14:02.079 --> 03:14:05.520 twenty-year-olds right there dynamically different than 03:14:05.520 --> 03:14:06.639 when they lived at my 03:14:06.639 --> 03:14:09.569 house right I mean it's life just as a way if they figure 03:14:09.569 --> 03:14:11.520 it out I hope I'll get 03:14:11.520 --> 03:14:14.360 back to you but but my point is I don't want to hold this 03:14:14.360 --> 03:14:15.959 development to what 03:14:15.959 --> 03:14:18.979 college kids right I mean there's just it's in the news 03:14:18.979 --> 03:14:20.280 every day college kids 03:14:20.280 --> 03:14:23.629 do this there you know there's athletes that make poor 03:14:23.629 --> 03:14:26.200 decisions at that age bad 03:14:26.200 --> 03:14:28.010 decisions are made I don't want to hold this development to 03:14:28.010 --> 03:14:28.639 that I don't hold 03:14:28.639 --> 03:14:36.000 sterling to that my my point is and I'm curious to get your 03:14:36.000 --> 03:14:37.319 insight do you think 03:14:37.319 --> 03:14:41.600 the fact that they do have a monopoly on that type 03:14:41.600 --> 03:14:43.959 development in that area 03:14:43.959 --> 03:14:47.930 emboldens them so if you're trying if you're trying to get 03:14:47.930 --> 03:14:49.200 a point across to 03:14:49.200 --> 03:14:52.329 sterling and they know they have a monopoly and the 03:14:52.329 --> 03:14:53.879 neighborhood comes out 03:14:53.879 --> 03:14:58.549 against anybody else that would challenge their area their 03:14:58.549 --> 03:14:59.360 business 03:14:59.360 --> 03:15:01.899 model maybe maybe these people do great work I've never 03:15:01.899 --> 03:15:02.879 released for them I'm 03:15:02.879 --> 03:15:04.709 not trying to represent that to you but I am trying to 03:15:04.709 --> 03:15:05.639 represent that there's 03:15:05.639 --> 03:15:08.729 something to be said for competition and the fact that hey 03:15:08.729 --> 03:15:10.280 we're losing students 03:15:10.280 --> 03:15:15.549 and we've got to be better about it to to get our rooms 03:15:15.549 --> 03:15:17.959 back full is there does 03:15:17.959 --> 03:15:21.520 that resonate I just want to get your thoughts on that 03:15:21.520 --> 03:15:23.600 doesn't resonate okay 03:15:23.600 --> 03:15:27.469 let me give you a different scenario absolutely let's talk 03:15:27.469 --> 03:15:28.319 about real 03:15:28.319 --> 03:15:34.370 competition okay you know let's talk about if I'm looking 03:15:34.370 --> 03:15:38.000 for a place to rent 03:15:38.280 --> 03:15:42.700 why would I want to be packed in to a five-story structure 03:15:42.700 --> 03:15:44.040 as if I could get 03:15:44.040 --> 03:15:46.930 to a three-story structure which probably would be a little 03:15:46.930 --> 03:15:48.319 less noisy and maybe 03:15:48.319 --> 03:15:54.590 is not so dominated by students can I answer sure okay so 03:15:54.590 --> 03:15:56.719 now you reflect back 03:15:56.719 --> 03:16:00.790 right so even within the past year so technology has jumped 03:16:00.790 --> 03:16:01.959 so now let's say 03:16:01.959 --> 03:16:05.000 they can offer Apple TV I can tell you now every plug on a 03:16:05.000 --> 03:16:06.079 planet has USB 03:16:06.079 --> 03:16:08.969 connections which they didn't before and so there's there's 03:16:08.969 --> 03:16:10.040 flat screens there's 03:16:10.040 --> 03:16:15.079 4k TVs there's a myriad of technical reasons for a college 03:16:15.079 --> 03:16:16.280 kid that's gonna 03:16:16.280 --> 03:16:19.090 sit in his dorm room and play games watch TV and do 03:16:19.090 --> 03:16:21.000 homework that you could have 03:16:21.000 --> 03:16:23.100 add a whole bunch of amenities a whole bunch of new 03:16:23.100 --> 03:16:24.280 furniture a whole bunch of 03:16:24.280 --> 03:16:28.420 new stuff that would motivate me to want to live in that 03:16:28.420 --> 03:16:29.959 place versus someplace 03:16:29.959 --> 03:16:32.959 else is three stories that's been there a while that may 03:16:32.959 --> 03:16:33.680 not have USB 03:16:33.680 --> 03:16:36.809 connections may not have electric reclining couches you 03:16:36.809 --> 03:16:37.280 know I mean it's 03:16:37.280 --> 03:16:41.700 just so yes technology I think again having to 220 year 03:16:41.700 --> 03:16:43.479 olds that understands 03:16:43.479 --> 03:16:48.420 there's just been a lot happen that would motivate that 03:16:48.420 --> 03:16:50.760 change sure so I have 03:16:50.760 --> 03:16:54.729 to 20 years old as well great minds think alike yeah 03:16:54.729 --> 03:16:55.760 sometimes it gets 03:16:55.760 --> 03:17:00.100 challenging yes but here's here's the real question sure do 03:17:00.100 --> 03:17:02.120 we respect our own 03:17:02.120 --> 03:17:07.430 city right do we respect the culture that brought everyone 03:17:07.430 --> 03:17:08.959 here do we respect 03:17:08.959 --> 03:17:13.610 that there's a historic area that was worth preserving I 03:17:13.610 --> 03:17:15.200 think so that's what 03:17:15.200 --> 03:17:18.959 the question is sure and if we're going to complement why 03:17:18.959 --> 03:17:20.159 people are here in our 03:17:20.159 --> 03:17:25.290 town part of it is that we have a cultural area that's fun 03:17:25.290 --> 03:17:26.399 to be in we 03:17:26.399 --> 03:17:30.750 really need to be thinking beyond as to fry street area we 03:17:30.750 --> 03:17:32.319 need to be thinking 03:17:32.319 --> 03:17:36.670 about a cultural zone area that might follow the original 03:17:36.670 --> 03:17:38.360 city limits let's 03:17:38.360 --> 03:17:42.409 say that were the city limits a hundred years ago sure and 03:17:42.409 --> 03:17:43.920 let's celebrate that 03:17:43.920 --> 03:17:48.790 together let's not destroy what we have by putting more and 03:17:48.790 --> 03:17:49.959 more and more high 03:17:49.959 --> 03:17:54.979 rises around here perfect thank you thank you I see no 03:17:54.979 --> 03:17:58.360 other questions Aaron 03:17:58.360 --> 03:18:05.760 Knight to be followed by Anna petchening 03:18:08.680 --> 03:18:18.280 my name is Aaron Knight I am the general manager of vermin 03:18:18.280 --> 03:18:20.200 and I was 03:18:20.200 --> 03:18:23.850 originally here to speak on behalf of Brent and answer any 03:18:23.850 --> 03:18:25.120 questions that you 03:18:25.120 --> 03:18:31.389 might have had that kill couldn't answer okay we have any 03:18:31.389 --> 03:18:33.719 additional questions 03:18:33.719 --> 03:18:33.719 for represent Commissioner Rizal thank you chair there's 03:18:33.719 --> 03:18:37.920 been a lot of mention 03:18:37.920 --> 03:18:41.250 about your parking spaces in particular can you confirm 03:18:41.250 --> 03:18:42.840 that you use the 36 03:18:42.840 --> 03:18:45.920 across the street we do not actually that is something I 03:18:45.920 --> 03:18:46.559 wanted to clear up 03:18:46.559 --> 03:18:50.530 those are all rented to students actually on a per semester 03:18:50.530 --> 03:18:51.879 basis the 03:18:51.879 --> 03:18:55.579 employees for vertman's park in the same parking lot as the 03:18:55.579 --> 03:18:57.280 customers and as the 03:18:57.280 --> 03:19:00.200 employees of other businesses in the area perfect this 03:19:00.200 --> 03:19:01.280 might be outside of 03:19:01.280 --> 03:19:04.510 your purview but who is renting to those students is it the 03:19:04.510 --> 03:19:05.360 owner of the 03:19:05.360 --> 03:19:08.500 property is the property not a vortman's vertman's doesn't 03:19:08.500 --> 03:19:09.520 have any affiliation 03:19:09.520 --> 03:19:13.600 with that lot Brent is the owner of the business and the 03:19:13.600 --> 03:19:15.520 property and the other 03:19:15.520 --> 03:19:21.770 lot yes yes as part of the perfect and then has there been 03:19:21.770 --> 03:19:22.680 any discussions 03:19:22.680 --> 03:19:26.729 about other businesses continuing to rent potential future 03:19:26.729 --> 03:19:28.159 parking spaces that 03:19:28.159 --> 03:19:33.559 this development will be building that I do not know okay 03:19:33.559 --> 03:19:36.000 that's it thanks thank 03:19:36.000 --> 03:19:40.739 you thank you the last card I have wishing to speak on this 03:19:40.739 --> 03:19:41.440 item is going 03:19:41.440 --> 03:19:45.659 to be Anna pitching me and if there's anyone else that 03:19:45.659 --> 03:19:46.319 would like to speak 03:19:46.319 --> 03:19:49.700 please fill out a card and get that to us up front and then 03:19:49.700 --> 03:19:50.719 we do have a couple 03:19:50.719 --> 03:19:54.540 other cards not wishing to speak but this will be our last 03:19:54.540 --> 03:19:55.239 card that we have 03:19:55.239 --> 03:20:01.690 wishing to speak hi if you don't mind I took notes so I 03:20:01.690 --> 03:20:03.200 wanted to could you give 03:20:03.200 --> 03:20:06.639 us your name and address yes my name is Anna Pichinina I 03:20:06.639 --> 03:20:08.319 live on Fry Street 224 03:20:08.319 --> 03:20:12.309 Fry Street I do not own anything I don't own a property I 03:20:12.309 --> 03:20:13.719 rent I cannot afford to 03:20:13.719 --> 03:20:16.610 buy a house with this development the prices are going to 03:20:16.610 --> 03:20:17.600 go up higher I will 03:20:17.600 --> 03:20:21.270 not be able to afford a house in this area ever I've been 03:20:21.270 --> 03:20:22.559 taking notes I agree 03:20:22.559 --> 03:20:24.579 with most of the people that are speaking against this 03:20:24.579 --> 03:20:25.360 development there 03:20:25.360 --> 03:20:30.030 are several reasons why first of all market somebody said 03:20:30.030 --> 03:20:31.040 market is telling 03:20:31.040 --> 03:20:35.379 them that the parking spots are not being used therefore 03:20:35.379 --> 03:20:35.920 they need to have 03:20:35.920 --> 03:20:40.379 fewer well rec local residents may not use the parking 03:20:40.379 --> 03:20:41.520 spots in sterling 03:20:41.520 --> 03:20:44.760 therefore their garages could be utilized by people that 03:20:44.760 --> 03:20:45.479 are using both 03:20:45.479 --> 03:20:49.450 businesses they cannot because we're not allowed in there 03:20:49.450 --> 03:20:50.920 and from the previous 03:20:50.920 --> 03:20:55.250 meeting earlier in this year somebody mentioned that 03:20:55.250 --> 03:20:56.719 actually there was a talk 03:20:56.719 --> 03:21:00.870 about sterling development allowing residents parking in 03:21:00.870 --> 03:21:01.840 the sterling 03:21:01.840 --> 03:21:07.500 development and yet they were not afterwards another point 03:21:07.500 --> 03:21:09.440 being the 03:21:09.440 --> 03:21:13.409 parking is terrible all the way to the scripture you can 03:21:13.409 --> 03:21:14.760 see cars there any 03:21:14.760 --> 03:21:20.000 time of the day I leave for work at 750 because I am lucky 03:21:20.000 --> 03:21:21.319 I get to work on 03:21:21.319 --> 03:21:25.989 campus and I had the traffic so 750 this is when the 03:21:25.989 --> 03:21:28.639 traffic starts it's really it 03:21:28.639 --> 03:21:32.559 takes me 10 minutes instead of five normally another thing 03:21:32.559 --> 03:21:33.239 that nobody 03:21:33.239 --> 03:21:36.700 really talked about is the sunlight access because on the 03:21:36.700 --> 03:21:37.719 street Oak Street 03:21:37.719 --> 03:21:42.690 currently the sterling development is so high that the road 03:21:42.690 --> 03:21:44.399 next to it freezes 03:21:44.399 --> 03:21:48.000 in the wintertime and does not go out everything else does 03:21:48.000 --> 03:21:48.920 but that road does 03:21:48.920 --> 03:21:52.989 not like and that it just means that most of the day that 03:21:52.989 --> 03:21:54.399 area gets no 03:21:54.399 --> 03:21:57.190 sunlight whatsoever so if we build another development that 03:21:57.190 --> 03:21:57.760 's this tall 03:21:57.760 --> 03:22:02.430 it's going to impact the houses directly behind it because 03:22:02.430 --> 03:22:03.360 the road is not that 03:22:03.360 --> 03:22:07.569 far I mean it's not that white so we're not gaining 03:22:07.569 --> 03:22:10.079 additional shopping places 03:22:10.079 --> 03:22:13.149 or businesses we also practically have a food desert and by 03:22:13.149 --> 03:22:14.159 food desert I mean 03:22:14.159 --> 03:22:18.829 that there is no grocery stores that you can get food from 03:22:18.829 --> 03:22:20.040 in a walking distance 03:22:20.040 --> 03:22:23.760 of campus you can go to get macaroni and cheese and chips 03:22:23.760 --> 03:22:25.159 and fries and burgers 03:22:25.159 --> 03:22:30.200 and beer and some you know sandwiches from CVS but you're 03:22:30.200 --> 03:22:31.200 not going to get 03:22:31.200 --> 03:22:35.000 fresh produce organic produce you have to take a car 03:22:35.000 --> 03:22:37.440 another which which is 03:22:37.440 --> 03:22:40.670 responsible students we have a lot of responsible students 03:22:40.670 --> 03:22:41.760 at UNT I'm a student 03:22:41.760 --> 03:22:45.700 at UNT and a full-time employee at UNT as well they will 03:22:45.700 --> 03:22:47.440 try to get food access 03:22:47.440 --> 03:22:50.149 to that food and they will drive they will use their 03:22:50.149 --> 03:22:51.479 vehicles so even though 03:22:51.479 --> 03:22:53.809 you're trying to minimize the amount of traffic these 03:22:53.809 --> 03:22:55.000 people will still need to 03:22:55.000 --> 03:22:58.770 get around and I don't know anyone who wants to go and 03:22:58.770 --> 03:23:00.479 carry sacks of food on 03:23:00.479 --> 03:23:03.829 the bus or on a bicycle I mean I've seen people do it it's 03:23:03.829 --> 03:23:04.959 just not convenient 03:23:04.959 --> 03:23:08.200 speaking of bicycles roads are in terrible condition 03:23:08.200 --> 03:23:09.399 bicycles are riding 03:23:09.399 --> 03:23:12.090 everywhere if they don't have a lane they go on a sidewalk 03:23:12.090 --> 03:23:12.840 they run over 03:23:12.840 --> 03:23:17.260 people and the cars don't respect they don't respect the 03:23:17.260 --> 03:23:19.239 people riding bicycles 03:23:19.239 --> 03:23:23.000 I myself own a bicycle I'm afraid to ride the roads on that 03:23:23.000 --> 03:23:24.840 bicycle so saying 03:23:24.840 --> 03:23:28.709 that people on bicycles will be living in this building is 03:23:28.709 --> 03:23:30.280 also a little bit 03:23:30.280 --> 03:23:35.620 funny to me I need an additional point I wanted to make is 03:23:35.620 --> 03:23:36.479 that we do need 03:23:36.479 --> 03:23:39.719 community spaces currently we are building so many 03:23:39.719 --> 03:23:41.040 developments around the 03:23:41.040 --> 03:23:45.110 area there is no additional parks and there is no community 03:23:45.110 --> 03:23:46.040 gardens or anything 03:23:46.040 --> 03:23:49.329 like that so there is actually more and more people but 03:23:49.329 --> 03:23:50.920 fewer and fewer places 03:23:50.920 --> 03:23:56.870 for these people to socialize in a free manner say it 03:23:56.870 --> 03:23:58.479 because right now if you 03:23:58.479 --> 03:24:01.870 want to socialize you go to bars and pay money to 03:24:01.870 --> 03:24:04.079 participate in that and 03:24:04.079 --> 03:24:07.879 another distinction I wanted to make in terms of business 03:24:07.879 --> 03:24:09.200 this is business that's 03:24:09.200 --> 03:24:12.100 not locally grown these are people coming from outside of 03:24:12.100 --> 03:24:12.959 town telling us 03:24:12.959 --> 03:24:15.719 how it is in the real world and what it should be and based 03:24:15.719 --> 03:24:16.719 on their research 03:24:16.719 --> 03:24:19.959 it's going to be great but we also have local business 03:24:19.959 --> 03:24:21.200 representatives that are 03:24:21.200 --> 03:24:23.920 telling you well what workmen's telling you that they want 03:24:23.920 --> 03:24:25.680 this but other people 03:24:25.680 --> 03:24:28.350 are telling you that they don't because obviously they have 03:24:28.350 --> 03:24:29.239 their own reasons 03:24:29.239 --> 03:24:32.250 and this development is going to be hurting them thank you 03:24:32.250 --> 03:24:33.079 very much 03:24:33.079 --> 03:24:38.360 right thank you again this is a public hearing anyone who 03:24:38.360 --> 03:24:39.079 would like to speak 03:24:39.079 --> 03:24:42.780 please come forward at this time you can hand it right here 03:24:42.780 --> 03:24:46.840 over the top yes sir 03:24:46.840 --> 03:24:53.110 next I'm Jay West and I'll start off by saying I'm your 03:24:53.110 --> 03:24:55.440 address 2606 Shelby 03:24:55.440 --> 03:25:00.239 Avenue in Dallas okay I represent the developer I'm as a 03:25:00.239 --> 03:25:01.079 consultant to the 03:25:01.079 --> 03:25:04.659 developer so I'll start by saying that I really just wanted 03:25:04.659 --> 03:25:06.000 to address one thing 03:25:06.000 --> 03:25:10.620 that Commissioner Roselle asked about whether the business 03:25:10.620 --> 03:25:11.799 of Vortmans was 03:25:11.799 --> 03:25:15.000 renting any of their parking spaces or the new project 03:25:15.000 --> 03:25:16.319 would be able to rent 03:25:16.319 --> 03:25:18.850 parking spaces to other businesses and I think the answer 03:25:18.850 --> 03:25:19.799 is no that they would 03:25:19.799 --> 03:25:24.299 not because they're providing what the code requires within 03:25:24.299 --> 03:25:25.760 the garage 31 03:25:25.760 --> 03:25:30.350 spaces in the garage which a lot you know a lot of retail 03:25:30.350 --> 03:25:31.440 spaces very 03:25:31.440 --> 03:25:35.940 convenient out of the weather but there are there is a 03:25:35.940 --> 03:25:37.559 place in the Fry Street 03:25:37.559 --> 03:25:39.870 area and I don't know if any of other others have noticed 03:25:39.870 --> 03:25:40.639 it where there's a 03:25:40.639 --> 03:25:44.280 lot of unused parking I might go out on the limb a little 03:25:44.280 --> 03:25:46.079 bit but it is within 03:25:46.079 --> 03:25:50.809 the youth center Fry Street building they put in a lot of 03:25:50.809 --> 03:25:52.559 retail parking but 03:25:52.559 --> 03:25:56.129 if you go if you go over there and park to visit their 03:25:56.129 --> 03:25:58.600 facility you'll park in 03:25:58.600 --> 03:26:01.489 their little garage area their employees park there then if 03:26:01.489 --> 03:26:02.479 you weave your way 03:26:02.479 --> 03:26:06.500 around you come to this very large retail spot and I think 03:26:06.500 --> 03:26:07.520 at one point they 03:26:07.520 --> 03:26:10.500 intended it for it to be metered but basically it's just 03:26:10.500 --> 03:26:11.959 empty because no one 03:26:11.959 --> 03:26:16.590 knows it's there because the access is so circuitous but it 03:26:16.590 --> 03:26:18.040 's probably it might 03:26:18.040 --> 03:26:20.530 be possible now I'm not going to say who's nickel this 03:26:20.530 --> 03:26:21.479 should be on but at 03:26:21.479 --> 03:26:24.200 the city for instance wanted to go to you Center Fry Street 03:26:24.200 --> 03:26:25.079 and say how about 03:26:25.079 --> 03:26:29.209 we pay to create a better access for these parking spaces 03:26:29.209 --> 03:26:30.440 and then you can 03:26:30.440 --> 03:26:35.879 get the revenue from it when students or when patrons of 03:26:35.879 --> 03:26:36.959 those businesses up and 03:26:36.959 --> 03:26:40.399 down the street want to use their parking spaces if you 03:26:40.399 --> 03:26:40.879 provide better 03:26:40.879 --> 03:26:44.809 access and better signage there's probably 40 parking 03:26:44.809 --> 03:26:46.559 spaces in there that 03:26:46.559 --> 03:26:51.600 go unused on a regular basis so that's that's all I had to 03:26:51.600 --> 03:26:52.559 say okay just 03:26:52.559 --> 03:26:57.120 yes I've got a question for you sir okay Commissioner Hesb 03:26:57.120 --> 03:27:00.239 eth so I'm trying to 03:27:00.239 --> 03:27:05.120 pull up you the the lot you're referencing so orient me 03:27:05.120 --> 03:27:06.479 again well it's 03:27:06.479 --> 03:27:09.079 within you Center of Fry Street's building it's not the 03:27:09.079 --> 03:27:10.319 building that we're 03:27:10.319 --> 03:27:17.040 discussing tonight building was built in 2010 they have I 03:27:17.040 --> 03:27:18.879 don't have a you know 03:27:18.879 --> 03:27:21.540 that there's a they have a building that's a long fry 03:27:21.540 --> 03:27:22.719 street that runs from 03:27:22.719 --> 03:27:26.590 fried hickory then there's an open space which is a drive- 03:27:26.590 --> 03:27:28.200 through area yes a cell 03:27:28.200 --> 03:27:30.879 tower in that area yes and on the one side of that open 03:27:30.879 --> 03:27:32.600 space is the five 03:27:32.600 --> 03:27:36.799 story parking structure yes within that parking structure 03:27:36.799 --> 03:27:38.200 on the first level and 03:27:38.200 --> 03:27:42.309 actually it goes down below grade slightly there is some 03:27:42.309 --> 03:27:43.479 parking that's 03:27:43.479 --> 03:27:46.440 hidden in there that's designed for retail students don't 03:27:46.440 --> 03:27:47.159 park in it and 03:27:47.159 --> 03:27:53.079 it's empty I've been I've driven in there myself it's very 03:27:53.079 --> 03:27:53.879 difficult to find 03:27:53.879 --> 03:27:57.579 it's very difficult to get to and it's blocked for view 03:27:57.579 --> 03:27:59.280 from the street because 03:27:59.280 --> 03:28:01.930 they have a little retail space there which they've had 03:28:01.930 --> 03:28:03.360 difficulty leasing on 03:28:03.360 --> 03:28:05.760 a regular basis since they've had a number of tenants that 03:28:05.760 --> 03:28:07.559 have failed so if 03:28:07.559 --> 03:28:10.120 the city this is just I'm just trying to think out of the 03:28:10.120 --> 03:28:11.319 box the city were to go 03:28:11.319 --> 03:28:14.739 to them and say you know what what would it cost to get rid 03:28:14.739 --> 03:28:16.000 of this little retail 03:28:16.000 --> 03:28:20.739 space and create a driveway to allow parking access in and 03:28:20.739 --> 03:28:22.159 out to access this 03:28:22.159 --> 03:28:26.030 lot if we paid for it would you be willing to do it because 03:28:26.030 --> 03:28:26.719 it probably 03:28:26.719 --> 03:28:29.409 would be happy to do it because I'll make money you might 03:28:29.409 --> 03:28:30.440 even negotiate with 03:28:30.440 --> 03:28:33.329 them and get them to pay some of the cost but you'd have to 03:28:33.329 --> 03:28:34.079 give them the 03:28:34.079 --> 03:28:37.879 permission to get rid of one retail space that they're they 03:28:37.879 --> 03:28:39.000 've had difficulty 03:28:39.000 --> 03:28:42.760 leasing anyway on a regular basis sure it's right across 03:28:42.760 --> 03:28:44.200 the street from 03:28:44.200 --> 03:28:48.329 Lucky Looz I'm with you where Lucky Looz is yes sir pretty 03:28:48.329 --> 03:28:49.079 much right across the 03:28:49.079 --> 03:28:55.459 street from Lucky Looz okay thank you okay this is a public 03:28:55.459 --> 03:28:56.399 hearing so anyone 03:28:56.399 --> 03:28:58.649 who would like to come forward and speak on this item 03:28:58.649 --> 03:29:01.719 please do so at this time 03:29:04.079 --> 03:29:08.479 I'm Patrice like I live at 1109 Egan and I put in a card 03:29:08.479 --> 03:29:10.200 that was a yes a 03:29:10.200 --> 03:29:14.770 non-speaking card but I got to speak okay okay so like I 03:29:14.770 --> 03:29:16.479 said I live at 1109 03:29:16.479 --> 03:29:21.299 Egan which I'm an 11-minute walk from my office I teach at 03:29:21.299 --> 03:29:22.680 UNT my office is in 03:29:22.680 --> 03:29:26.409 the auditorium building which will be then is right across 03:29:26.409 --> 03:29:27.940 from Vertmans one 03:29:27.940 --> 03:29:30.840 thing I think we have to remember while we're thinking 03:29:30.840 --> 03:29:32.159 about anything that is 03:29:32.159 --> 03:29:36.930 going to change the current fry Street small area plan is 03:29:36.930 --> 03:29:38.639 that it is surrounded 03:29:38.639 --> 03:29:43.579 by neighborhoods you've got the West Oak historic district 03:29:43.579 --> 03:29:44.719 you've got Oak Hickory 03:29:44.719 --> 03:29:48.040 and then you have my bungalow neighborhood that is behind 03:29:48.040 --> 03:29:48.940 that now my 03:29:48.940 --> 03:29:51.959 neighborhood is going to be part of the National Registry 03:29:51.959 --> 03:29:53.700 and it's also has been 03:29:53.700 --> 03:29:56.840 eligible to be a conservation or historic district for a 03:29:56.840 --> 03:29:57.799 number of years 03:29:57.799 --> 03:30:02.000 we just keep not doing it that's all I have to say about 03:30:02.000 --> 03:30:04.879 that however with the 03:30:04.879 --> 03:30:10.129 more that development goes outside the boundaries that are 03:30:10.129 --> 03:30:11.479 already in place 03:30:11.479 --> 03:30:17.750 like false small area plans the more we whittle away at the 03:30:17.750 --> 03:30:19.520 integrity of these 03:30:19.520 --> 03:30:23.000 historical neighborhoods my concern is of course for 03:30:23.000 --> 03:30:25.040 precedent being set that 03:30:25.040 --> 03:30:29.100 when I one developer comes in and of course when we do give 03:30:29.100 --> 03:30:30.440 a variance to one 03:30:30.440 --> 03:30:34.659 developer we're not giving that a variance to a developer 03:30:34.659 --> 03:30:35.620 who then has 03:30:35.620 --> 03:30:39.250 pinky sworn with us to only do what they say they're going 03:30:39.250 --> 03:30:40.520 to do that developer 03:30:40.520 --> 03:30:44.290 can turn around sell it to anybody else and any type of 03:30:44.290 --> 03:30:45.920 verbal agreements we 03:30:45.920 --> 03:30:48.760 feel like we're getting from those developers are just 03:30:48.760 --> 03:30:49.799 completely out the 03:30:49.799 --> 03:30:55.889 window every SRO builder in Denton since I have been paying 03:30:55.889 --> 03:30:57.200 attention it has 03:30:57.200 --> 03:31:02.569 built and sold every developer has said we are a build and 03:31:02.569 --> 03:31:04.420 hold company I live 03:31:04.420 --> 03:31:08.819 three houses away from the City Park and when the rail 03:31:08.819 --> 03:31:11.520 family came in 15 years 03:31:11.520 --> 03:31:17.159 ago maybe to develop that SRO what what used to be the flow 03:31:17.159 --> 03:31:18.760 hospital site they 03:31:18.760 --> 03:31:22.909 said we're building hold we will be here forever you want 03:31:22.909 --> 03:31:23.920 to call us if we have 03:31:23.920 --> 03:31:27.479 any problems within a couple of years they were gone what 03:31:27.479 --> 03:31:28.440 the sterling 03:31:28.440 --> 03:31:31.569 development is at fry Street currently the dinner steam 03:31:31.569 --> 03:31:32.760 people came through 03:31:32.760 --> 03:31:36.680 and they said we're building hold we will do anything you 03:31:36.680 --> 03:31:37.879 say they're now you 03:31:37.879 --> 03:31:42.239 center they've been sold so it's a myth when a developer 03:31:42.239 --> 03:31:43.680 says oh we're going to 03:31:43.680 --> 03:31:47.479 be here we're the ones who you're going to talk to for the 03:31:47.479 --> 03:31:49.680 next 50 to 100 years 03:31:49.680 --> 03:31:53.930 so I think we should take that into consideration that we 03:31:53.930 --> 03:31:55.000 can like what 03:31:55.000 --> 03:31:58.149 they're saying about where they're going to put their plan 03:31:58.149 --> 03:31:59.280 ters but it doesn't 03:31:59.280 --> 03:32:02.170 matter in the long run because they can sell it to somebody 03:32:02.170 --> 03:32:02.879 's going to do 03:32:02.879 --> 03:32:07.610 whatever they want with those planters this might be false 03:32:07.610 --> 03:32:08.040 free fry Street 03:32:08.040 --> 03:32:13.190 small-area plan is built to protect the fry Street area it 03:32:13.190 --> 03:32:15.040 is built to protect 03:32:15.040 --> 03:32:20.000 the neighborhoods that are surrounding this fry Street area 03:32:20.000 --> 03:32:21.959 you know the city 03:32:21.959 --> 03:32:24.500 of Denton is not in the business of having to provide 03:32:24.500 --> 03:32:25.879 collegiate housing the 03:32:25.879 --> 03:32:28.770 University of North Texas still has space and they are 03:32:28.770 --> 03:32:29.719 extending their 03:32:29.719 --> 03:32:33.030 boundaries they're squaring off a little bit I've seen some 03:32:33.030 --> 03:32:33.920 of the master plan 03:32:33.920 --> 03:32:37.790 they're squaring off some of their boundaries to the east 03:32:37.790 --> 03:32:38.840 and yeah to the 03:32:38.840 --> 03:32:42.829 east and of course to the south they have room if they want 03:32:42.829 --> 03:32:44.440 to provide housing 03:32:44.440 --> 03:32:49.780 but it's not our job as a city to provide housing for 03:32:49.780 --> 03:32:51.799 college students 03:32:51.799 --> 03:32:55.670 remembering that I teach at UNT and I like my students but 03:32:55.670 --> 03:32:56.920 it's not our job 03:32:56.920 --> 03:33:02.379 and secondly if a developer comes in and creates a parking 03:33:02.379 --> 03:33:03.879 mass or a street 03:33:03.879 --> 03:33:08.899 mess a traffic mess then it's not Denton's responsibility 03:33:08.899 --> 03:33:09.840 to go clean up 03:33:09.840 --> 03:33:14.340 after developers who are creating more traffic that should 03:33:14.340 --> 03:33:15.719 all of that is the 03:33:15.719 --> 03:33:20.180 should be on the onus of a developer who is following the 03:33:20.180 --> 03:33:22.000 rules of the fry Street 03:33:22.000 --> 03:33:26.200 small-area plan as handed down by the Denton Development 03:33:26.200 --> 03:33:28.280 Code so that's all I 03:33:28.280 --> 03:33:44.440 have to say about that thank you very much okay I have one 03:33:44.440 --> 03:33:46.239 card from Laurie 03:33:46.239 --> 03:33:52.760 Weller at 2297 Wood Hollow Road here in Denton and she did 03:33:52.760 --> 03:33:53.680 not want to wish I 03:33:53.680 --> 03:33:57.319 did not wish to speak and she is in opposition to the fry 03:33:57.319 --> 03:33:59.200 Street overlay I 03:33:59.200 --> 03:34:06.559 have another card from Jennifer Lane at 1526 Willowood 03:34:06.559 --> 03:34:08.479 Street she does not wish 03:34:08.479 --> 03:34:20.799 to speak and she is in opposition I have a card from 03:34:20.799 --> 03:34:23.000 Kathleen Barnett at 607 03:34:23.000 --> 03:34:30.149 Pearl Street she is in opposition card from William Barnett 03:34:30.149 --> 03:34:31.799 at 607 Pearl Street 03:34:31.799 --> 03:34:39.680 he is in opposition and then we had one other letter from 03:34:39.680 --> 03:34:41.200 Michael Martin at 03:34:41.200 --> 03:34:48.079 2909 Seabright Court in League City Texas and he is opposed 03:34:48.079 --> 03:34:49.639 doesn't wish to speak 03:34:49.639 --> 03:34:55.909 okay and then have one other card from Aaron Piper at 1006 03:34:55.909 --> 03:34:58.760 West Hickory and she 03:34:58.760 --> 03:35:02.920 is in opposition as well those are all the cards that we 03:35:02.920 --> 03:35:04.479 have this is a public 03:35:04.479 --> 03:35:07.450 hearing so anyone else that would like to come forward and 03:35:07.450 --> 03:35:09.000 speak please come do 03:35:09.000 --> 03:35:15.379 so at this time if you're going to speak only to come to 03:35:15.379 --> 03:35:17.040 the microphone and I 03:35:17.040 --> 03:35:21.920 think you've already spoke so we have a rule that you don't 03:35:21.920 --> 03:35:22.959 have one opportunity 03:35:22.959 --> 03:35:25.850 to speak unless someone would like to ask you a question 03:35:25.850 --> 03:35:27.040 and it looks like 03:35:27.040 --> 03:35:29.979 Commissioner Beck wants to ask you a question there's 03:35:29.979 --> 03:35:31.399 something you forgot to 03:35:31.399 --> 03:35:37.290 tell us earlier I did receive one of the 500 foot cards I 03:35:37.290 --> 03:35:38.799 did not reply to that 03:35:38.799 --> 03:35:42.090 so my reply was not one of the four that you had because I 03:35:42.090 --> 03:35:43.639 knew I was going to be 03:35:43.639 --> 03:35:48.840 here in person okay okay great thank you again this is a 03:35:48.840 --> 03:35:50.520 public hearing this will 03:35:50.520 --> 03:35:53.280 be our last call anyone else that would like to speak 03:35:53.280 --> 03:35:54.479 please come forward at this 03:35:54.479 --> 03:36:01.819 time seeing none I'm going to close the public hearing on 03:36:01.819 --> 03:36:02.959 this item and open the 03:36:02.959 --> 03:36:05.770 floor for discussion I just need to make we do have an 03:36:05.770 --> 03:36:07.360 announcement as well from 03:36:07.360 --> 03:36:11.079 staff thank you I just need to make some clarifications for 03:36:11.079 --> 03:36:12.559 the record the 03:36:12.559 --> 03:36:15.950 councilmember that did recuse himself is mr. errs mr. Steve 03:36:15.950 --> 03:36:18.079 Sullivan and I need 03:36:18.079 --> 03:36:20.680 to briefly state the reason for his request and that was 03:36:20.680 --> 03:36:21.520 because his wife 03:36:21.520 --> 03:36:26.440 did have a conflict she had an interest in the business of 03:36:26.440 --> 03:36:27.159 the seller of the 03:36:27.159 --> 03:36:30.450 property so he has recused himself in this case that leaves 03:36:30.450 --> 03:36:31.399 us five members 03:36:31.399 --> 03:36:36.520 because we do have mr. Devin Taylor out because of that we 03:36:36.520 --> 03:36:38.200 have a rule in the 03:36:38.200 --> 03:36:41.909 the City Council rules of procedures seven point five five 03:36:41.909 --> 03:36:43.040 that requires an 03:36:43.040 --> 03:36:47.360 affirmative vote of four members in order to pass an item 03:36:47.360 --> 03:36:48.520 so this is going 03:36:48.520 --> 03:36:51.340 to take four out of the five members present here tonight 03:36:51.340 --> 03:36:52.200 in order to pass 03:36:52.200 --> 03:37:00.680 this thank you okay Commissioner Beck thank you chair I 03:37:00.680 --> 03:37:01.680 have a comment then 03:37:01.680 --> 03:37:05.290 I'd like to make a motion but I'll hold off on my motion if 03:37:05.290 --> 03:37:06.200 other people want 03:37:06.200 --> 03:37:09.680 to make comments too so I want to thank everybody for 03:37:09.680 --> 03:37:10.479 coming down and I 03:37:10.479 --> 03:37:15.450 appreciate your input and that goes for EDR as well what we 03:37:15.450 --> 03:37:17.000 've heard from EDR 03:37:17.000 --> 03:37:20.670 and the people who support it is not surprising and I agree 03:37:20.670 --> 03:37:21.719 with it totally 03:37:21.719 --> 03:37:25.010 there's there's a need for student housing they build an 03:37:25.010 --> 03:37:25.959 excellent product 03:37:25.959 --> 03:37:28.350 and I'd love to see them build here and didn't there's no 03:37:28.350 --> 03:37:29.799 question about that and 03:37:29.799 --> 03:37:33.840 I hope they do but not at this spot and there's a reason 03:37:33.840 --> 03:37:34.719 for that and I think 03:37:34.719 --> 03:37:38.780 the people of the neighborhood have adequately stated that 03:37:38.780 --> 03:37:39.319 that it 03:37:39.319 --> 03:37:42.440 diminishes what all of us have enjoyed for years the 03:37:42.440 --> 03:37:45.000 historical area has a lot 03:37:45.000 --> 03:37:47.059 of significance not just for the people who live there but 03:37:47.059 --> 03:37:47.760 for the people who 03:37:47.760 --> 03:37:51.000 live in them I've been here since the early 70s and I've 03:37:51.000 --> 03:37:52.000 watched this 03:37:52.000 --> 03:37:55.719 encroachment take place so I realized that we all 03:37:55.719 --> 03:37:57.899 understand that the city's 03:37:57.899 --> 03:38:01.049 going to grow and we've got to make changes and I think the 03:38:01.049 --> 03:38:01.639 residents of 03:38:01.639 --> 03:38:03.950 that area have done that I think they've compromised they 03:38:03.950 --> 03:38:05.680 've allowed sub area a 03:38:05.680 --> 03:38:09.360 and sub area B and and for sub area C to come in and just 03:38:09.360 --> 03:38:10.639 keep building it 03:38:10.639 --> 03:38:15.370 bigger the last speaker you know made the good point that 03:38:15.370 --> 03:38:16.680 nothing's ever 03:38:16.680 --> 03:38:20.549 permanent it is a slippery slope for me and I think for 03:38:20.549 --> 03:38:21.559 everybody else there so 03:38:21.559 --> 03:38:25.000 again nothing against EDR again great company hope they do 03:38:25.000 --> 03:38:26.600 build here but I 03:38:26.600 --> 03:38:31.420 have to oppose it so my motion is that we deny request for 03:38:31.420 --> 03:38:33.319 this okay so we have 03:38:33.319 --> 03:38:40.469 a motion on the floor for denial commissioner Ellis I'll 03:38:40.469 --> 03:38:41.680 second that 03:38:41.680 --> 03:38:45.510 motion okay we have a first and a second okay we have a 03:38:45.510 --> 03:38:46.319 first and second any 03:38:46.319 --> 03:38:56.020 discussion commissioner Hudson yes so by the indication of 03:38:56.020 --> 03:38:58.319 the first and second 03:38:58.319 --> 03:39:06.819 this is all just conjecture so but my thought is looking 03:39:06.819 --> 03:39:11.959 back four people came 03:39:11.959 --> 03:39:16.629 back from from the January meeting there was four people 03:39:16.629 --> 03:39:18.120 that were against that 03:39:18.120 --> 03:39:22.549 returned and then there's another handful of new people 03:39:22.549 --> 03:39:24.040 that were against 03:39:24.040 --> 03:39:31.549 and so and I was the wolf pack of one on the first trip and 03:39:31.549 --> 03:39:33.200 so I I think 03:39:34.000 --> 03:39:39.040 understanding respecting the neighborhoods request is I'm 03:39:39.040 --> 03:39:40.000 trying to 03:39:40.000 --> 03:39:43.670 balance that with I don't know that it fixes what we're 03:39:43.670 --> 03:39:45.000 trying to do and I think 03:39:45.000 --> 03:39:52.069 it also is a little short-sighted because what if they just 03:39:52.069 --> 03:39:54.159 decide to get under the 03:39:54.159 --> 03:39:59.020 threshold and you've lost your ability to curtail what goes 03:39:59.020 --> 03:40:00.440 there right and so 03:40:00.440 --> 03:40:04.420 it's like it's almost like I wish there was a way me 03:40:04.420 --> 03:40:06.399 personally just to go meet 03:40:06.399 --> 03:40:08.540 with the neighborhood and say there's got to be a medium 03:40:08.540 --> 03:40:09.399 ground where you can 03:40:09.399 --> 03:40:13.159 at least have a say so and what goes there because if they 03:40:13.159 --> 03:40:14.760 're if they're sold 03:40:14.760 --> 03:40:19.049 out on building there then you're absolutely going to have 03:40:19.049 --> 03:40:19.920 zero say so 03:40:19.920 --> 03:40:23.069 you're gonna you're gonna have this document and this that 03:40:23.069 --> 03:40:24.079 was everything I 03:40:24.079 --> 03:40:27.139 can find says that this overlay was created in 2010 and 03:40:27.139 --> 03:40:28.079 they're gonna get 03:40:28.079 --> 03:40:30.870 under that threshold and and you and so you don't have an 03:40:30.870 --> 03:40:31.760 opportunity to 03:40:31.760 --> 03:40:35.389 modernize that document and curtail it to something you 03:40:35.389 --> 03:40:37.200 want your and so that's 03:40:37.200 --> 03:40:40.469 my concern for the neighborhood is the you know this is 03:40:40.469 --> 03:40:42.360 twice and so at some 03:40:42.360 --> 03:40:44.000 point there's going to be a meeting someplace and they're 03:40:44.000 --> 03:40:44.520 going to say hey 03:40:44.520 --> 03:40:48.639 we'll just do this and so now they don't have to come 03:40:48.639 --> 03:40:50.120 before us and you you don't 03:40:50.120 --> 03:40:52.739 get a chance to to have a neighborhood meeting have a 03:40:52.739 --> 03:40:54.040 neighborhood say so and 03:40:54.040 --> 03:40:56.930 that's my concern for the neighbors I want them to have an 03:40:56.930 --> 03:40:58.319 ability to partake 03:40:58.319 --> 03:41:04.559 and be a part of the process but you the developer is in a 03:41:04.559 --> 03:41:05.200 corner where they're 03:41:05.200 --> 03:41:08.760 either going to decide hey we're going to move on or we'll 03:41:08.760 --> 03:41:10.159 get under threshold 03:41:10.159 --> 03:41:13.409 and now you have this monster building anyway and you have 03:41:13.409 --> 03:41:14.440 no say so and your 03:41:14.440 --> 03:41:18.860 pipes are rattled and everything and and and so I don't I 03:41:18.860 --> 03:41:20.639 don't know of a way 03:41:20.639 --> 03:41:25.190 around it I mean I wish him the best and I agree with the 03:41:25.190 --> 03:41:25.959 Commissioner Beck it's 03:41:25.959 --> 03:41:30.469 great project I disagree with him in that I think it doesn 03:41:30.469 --> 03:41:31.959 't this project not 03:41:31.959 --> 03:41:34.850 being there doesn't fix the traffic it doesn't fix the road 03:41:34.850 --> 03:41:35.799 it doesn't ignore 03:41:35.799 --> 03:41:38.299 the fact that Eagle Drive one of the major thoroughfares 03:41:38.299 --> 03:41:39.360 that you and T just 03:41:39.360 --> 03:41:42.510 redid they took away a lane so what's the real it was two 03:41:42.510 --> 03:41:43.799 lanes each side now 03:41:43.799 --> 03:41:48.750 it's one lane in a center median and so that that adds to 03:41:48.750 --> 03:41:50.440 the problem on oak 03:41:50.440 --> 03:41:52.909 with Bonnie Bray being expanded that's going to add to the 03:41:52.909 --> 03:41:53.639 problem with oak 03:41:53.639 --> 03:41:56.790 razor-rance developing and the convention center going on 03:41:56.790 --> 03:41:57.879 board adds to 03:41:57.879 --> 03:42:00.770 the problem and so I think there's a lot of stuff going 03:42:00.770 --> 03:42:01.840 down the road that 03:42:01.840 --> 03:42:06.950 that you will wish you had a say so in the project versus 03:42:06.950 --> 03:42:08.520 they build it by 03:42:08.520 --> 03:42:13.799 right but you have to put purse I'll put personal feelings 03:42:13.799 --> 03:42:14.879 aside and and and 03:42:14.879 --> 03:42:19.959 there's just too many people that have spoken against it to 03:42:19.959 --> 03:42:21.399 kind of ignore it a 03:42:21.399 --> 03:42:25.959 second time I did that first time so thank you 03:42:25.959 --> 03:42:32.209 Commissioner Roselle thank you chair so when I was here in 03:42:32.209 --> 03:42:33.079 January and I listened 03:42:33.079 --> 03:42:38.489 to the presentation and I did vote to not approve then with 03:42:38.489 --> 03:42:39.879 great expectation 03:42:39.879 --> 03:42:42.850 and hope that EDR would come back with just a no-brainer we 03:42:42.850 --> 03:42:43.559 can get this 03:42:43.559 --> 03:42:46.209 through because it seems like there is a track record there 03:42:46.209 --> 03:42:47.079 is a history to the 03:42:47.079 --> 03:42:51.680 company and like Commissioner Beck said their product is of 03:42:51.680 --> 03:42:53.120 high quality from 03:42:53.120 --> 03:42:55.069 what I can tell and I feel like their history is a 03:42:55.069 --> 03:42:56.200 testament that they might 03:42:56.200 --> 03:42:59.280 not be so inclined as to flip the property they haven't 03:42:59.280 --> 03:43:00.440 done that in their 03:43:00.440 --> 03:43:04.809 in their past and so I really wanted this project to come 03:43:04.809 --> 03:43:06.120 forward to to us 03:43:06.120 --> 03:43:10.770 with just some strength and clarity and to be honest I didn 03:43:10.770 --> 03:43:12.319 't see either to have 03:43:12.319 --> 03:43:15.770 the same narrative resubmitted to us nine months later is a 03:43:15.770 --> 03:43:16.959 little concerning 03:43:16.959 --> 03:43:21.420 that it wasn't even changed to show the changes that was 03:43:21.420 --> 03:43:22.920 made to us and it 03:43:22.920 --> 03:43:26.520 increased the ambiguity of what was trying to be achieved 03:43:26.520 --> 03:43:27.479 here and so I'm 03:43:27.479 --> 03:43:30.540 disappointed in that the parking spaces as I mentioned 03:43:30.540 --> 03:43:31.600 earlier seem to be 03:43:31.600 --> 03:43:38.280 completely all over the place I still I I feel maybe 03:43:38.280 --> 03:43:39.639 confident there was 260 03:43:39.639 --> 03:43:41.559 parking spaces but there's so many different documents that 03:43:41.559 --> 03:43:42.120 have different 03:43:42.120 --> 03:43:48.159 numbers I have concerns with that so in terms of of the the 03:43:48.159 --> 03:43:49.319 the proposal we got 03:43:49.319 --> 03:43:51.770 forth tonight not to discredit any work that's put forth of 03:43:51.770 --> 03:43:52.719 the money involved 03:43:52.719 --> 03:43:54.909 it just seemed a little haphazard and it doesn't instill a 03:43:54.909 --> 03:43:55.840 lot of confidence for 03:43:55.840 --> 03:43:58.430 the project going forward considering some of the discrep 03:43:58.430 --> 03:43:59.959 ancies that we've 03:43:59.959 --> 03:44:02.559 seen throughout the presentation and some of the concerns 03:44:02.559 --> 03:44:03.719 brought up I do 03:44:03.719 --> 03:44:06.350 agree with the Commissioner Hudspeth in terms of traffic 03:44:06.350 --> 03:44:07.360 unfortunately for 03:44:07.360 --> 03:44:10.389 residents of Oak that streets is getting worse I wish they 03:44:10.389 --> 03:44:11.200 'd redo Hickory that 03:44:11.200 --> 03:44:14.110 that traffic and they can like Hickory's is a terrible 03:44:14.110 --> 03:44:16.639 street to drive on period 03:44:16.639 --> 03:44:20.430 but Oak is going to get worse it's going to increase 03:44:20.430 --> 03:44:22.040 traffic if this project 03:44:22.040 --> 03:44:24.239 goes forward or it doesn't or it ever goes forward on this 03:44:24.239 --> 03:44:25.040 piece of property 03:44:25.040 --> 03:44:28.530 razor ranch is still going to hope oak is the natural incl 03:44:28.530 --> 03:44:29.920 ination from Carroll 03:44:29.920 --> 03:44:32.870 or downtown to get to raise a ranch and so there's most 03:44:32.870 --> 03:44:33.920 likely probably gonna 03:44:33.920 --> 03:44:36.450 be a bike lane if there's gonna be issues with oak going 03:44:36.450 --> 03:44:37.280 forward and so I 03:44:37.280 --> 03:44:39.969 hope individuals who live on oak or in that area know that 03:44:39.969 --> 03:44:40.879 that's kind of an 03:44:40.879 --> 03:44:44.879 evil coming and and us not moving this forward potentially 03:44:44.879 --> 03:44:46.399 tonight doesn't 03:44:46.399 --> 03:44:49.399 solve that issue unfortunately oak is developed to be a 03:44:49.399 --> 03:44:51.040 secondary artery it's 03:44:51.040 --> 03:44:54.760 meant to take people from Carroll West to Bonnie Braids it 03:44:54.760 --> 03:44:56.200 's kind of the natural 03:44:56.200 --> 03:44:59.629 progression I used to live on Egan and so I know very well 03:44:59.629 --> 03:45:00.360 the neighborhood 03:45:00.360 --> 03:45:04.680 and in the character of it and oak is what it is and again 03:45:04.680 --> 03:45:05.360 to Commissioner 03:45:05.360 --> 03:45:10.229 Hudspeth's point I feel like when when a company or project 03:45:10.229 --> 03:45:11.840 comes to us asking 03:45:11.840 --> 03:45:15.459 for things it gives the position of power to the city to to 03:45:15.459 --> 03:45:16.719 ask for things 03:45:16.719 --> 03:45:20.399 in return and so to what I believe was his point is if they 03:45:20.399 --> 03:45:21.079 just meet 03:45:21.079 --> 03:45:24.010 everything to code then by right they can build whatever 03:45:24.010 --> 03:45:24.959 they want and so I 03:45:24.959 --> 03:45:27.129 wish there's an opportunity where they were coming and 03:45:27.129 --> 03:45:28.079 asking for things that 03:45:28.079 --> 03:45:31.639 we could have had a dialogue to find a compromise because 03:45:31.639 --> 03:45:32.680 we saw this with 03:45:32.680 --> 03:45:36.000 Buc-E's we tried to interact with Buc-E's to agree on 03:45:36.000 --> 03:45:37.040 something nothing 03:45:37.040 --> 03:45:39.850 ever happened they built by right and the city lost some 03:45:39.850 --> 03:45:41.280 opportunities I feel 03:45:41.280 --> 03:45:44.409 to ask for things from that development because they just 03:45:44.409 --> 03:45:45.600 built by right and so 03:45:45.600 --> 03:45:50.930 that's a legitimate worry here is some other developer come 03:45:50.930 --> 03:45:51.879 in see the the 03:45:51.879 --> 03:45:55.120 ordinances and just build and we won't have any say in it 03:45:55.120 --> 03:45:56.280 we won't be able to 03:45:56.280 --> 03:45:59.170 ask anything and so I guess it goes back to my first point 03:45:59.170 --> 03:45:59.799 I just wish it was 03:45:59.799 --> 03:46:03.069 stronger when it came that we could say yes this this is 03:46:03.069 --> 03:46:03.879 good for the 03:46:03.879 --> 03:46:07.090 development this is good for the the city area but I just 03:46:07.090 --> 03:46:07.959 didn't see it 03:46:07.959 --> 03:46:12.389 tonight and so those are my thoughts I like Commissioner 03:46:12.389 --> 03:46:13.879 Beck said I hope EDR 03:46:13.879 --> 03:46:17.649 builds in Denton I just don't know if this is the property 03:46:17.649 --> 03:46:18.680 or the project 03:46:18.680 --> 03:46:25.120 that's gonna happen Commissioner Ellis thank you chair just 03:46:25.120 --> 03:46:25.559 wanted to say a 03:46:25.559 --> 03:46:27.739 couple words since I haven't said much thank you all for 03:46:27.739 --> 03:46:28.719 sharing your thoughts 03:46:28.719 --> 03:46:34.579 and and that's everybody for or against this development I 03:46:34.579 --> 03:46:36.840 guess I just to give 03:46:36.840 --> 03:46:41.729 my reasoning for denial is sub area a I believe was put in 03:46:41.729 --> 03:46:43.399 place for a reason 03:46:43.399 --> 03:46:48.540 this is a special part of Denton and I think it was put in 03:46:48.540 --> 03:46:50.440 place to try to keep 03:46:50.440 --> 03:46:57.409 some of that specialness about that corner sub area B was 03:46:57.409 --> 03:46:59.079 approved I was not 03:46:59.079 --> 03:47:03.510 on the Commission when it was approved now this is sub C 03:47:03.510 --> 03:47:05.120 that's asking for 03:47:05.120 --> 03:47:09.110 even more than B did with regard to what sub a already has 03:47:09.110 --> 03:47:10.639 in place which was put 03:47:10.639 --> 03:47:14.989 in place again to keep the area special this opens up the 03:47:14.989 --> 03:47:16.200 door if this is 03:47:16.200 --> 03:47:21.549 approved a little bit more for sub area D and E and F etc 03:47:21.549 --> 03:47:24.379 and you know the 03:47:24.379 --> 03:47:28.280 project is great you know to again echo sentiments already 03:47:28.280 --> 03:47:29.760 given it looks like a 03:47:29.760 --> 03:47:33.229 wonderful development for student housing it's just being 03:47:33.229 --> 03:47:34.479 proposed in the 03:47:34.479 --> 03:47:41.059 wrong location Commissioner back thank you chair just a 03:47:41.059 --> 03:47:42.440 couple of statements 03:47:42.440 --> 03:47:46.500 and again both Commissioner Roselle and Husper the correct 03:47:46.500 --> 03:47:47.239 you know oak is 03:47:47.239 --> 03:47:50.239 invariably gonna you know pick up traffic that's unavoid 03:47:50.239 --> 03:47:54.040 able but I think an EDR 03:47:54.040 --> 03:47:56.930 can't control the traffic they can't control student 03:47:56.930 --> 03:47:59.120 activity but by default 03:47:59.120 --> 03:48:02.010 just the fact that they're building there it's gonna 03:48:02.010 --> 03:48:03.159 enhance these and by 03:48:03.159 --> 03:48:06.100 not building it maybe we've got a little time here to work 03:48:06.100 --> 03:48:06.799 out traffic 03:48:06.799 --> 03:48:12.280 situations I think Bonnie Bray actually will help people 03:48:12.280 --> 03:48:14.120 work around these 03:48:14.120 --> 03:48:16.750 residential streets can't say that for sure but I think 03:48:16.750 --> 03:48:17.680 that's a positive 03:48:17.680 --> 03:48:24.200 aspect of that so thank you I'll throw a couple of comments 03:48:24.200 --> 03:48:24.959 I think before we 03:48:24.959 --> 03:48:29.670 run closes for a vote understand the complexity of this 03:48:29.670 --> 03:48:31.799 particular area I 03:48:31.799 --> 03:48:35.899 guess one of the things that strikes me considerably is 03:48:35.899 --> 03:48:37.200 that the the main 03:48:37.200 --> 03:48:41.799 property owner apartments is in support of this project 03:48:41.799 --> 03:48:42.920 they're looking to 03:48:42.920 --> 03:48:49.360 they've been there since early 20s and it's almost 100 03:48:49.360 --> 03:48:52.280 years and looking to 03:48:52.280 --> 03:48:58.549 continue to stay in business and you know when you look at 03:48:58.549 --> 03:48:59.799 the time frame of 03:48:59.799 --> 03:49:03.090 when this overlay was originally put in place it was done 03:49:03.090 --> 03:49:04.719 in 2000 and then it 03:49:04.719 --> 03:49:09.799 was updated in 2010 which is essentially 15 years ago it's 03:49:09.799 --> 03:49:10.840 essentially a zoning 03:49:10.840 --> 03:49:15.530 case and this body this Commission here zoning cases all 03:49:15.530 --> 03:49:17.239 over our city and we 03:49:17.239 --> 03:49:22.129 have many groups that come before us that have very deep 03:49:22.129 --> 03:49:23.399 concerns about 03:49:23.399 --> 03:49:26.290 properties surrounding them and what property owners are 03:49:26.290 --> 03:49:27.159 wanting to do with 03:49:27.159 --> 03:49:31.750 their property and wanting to have their properties rezoned 03:49:31.750 --> 03:49:33.200 and most of those are 03:49:33.200 --> 03:49:37.170 very similar to this case which is a up zoning which is 03:49:37.170 --> 03:49:39.040 going from an NR 2 to an 03:49:39.040 --> 03:49:44.409 NR 3 or in our 2 to NR 4 in our 4 to NR 6 that's because 03:49:44.409 --> 03:49:45.200 there is going to be 03:49:45.200 --> 03:49:48.760 more and more density in our city that is part of our 2030 03:49:48.760 --> 03:49:49.639 plan is to have 03:49:49.639 --> 03:49:53.379 greater density it's to have density inside the loop and 03:49:53.379 --> 03:49:55.000 with that that's 03:49:55.000 --> 03:49:58.319 essentially where these projects in my opinion are going to 03:49:58.319 --> 03:49:59.319 continue to come 03:49:59.319 --> 03:50:02.129 before this Commission and our city is going to have to 03:50:02.129 --> 03:50:03.079 deal with them is 03:50:03.079 --> 03:50:06.659 because there is going to be greater density here our city 03:50:06.659 --> 03:50:07.799 is growing the 03:50:07.799 --> 03:50:13.610 university is growing when you look at the student growth 03:50:13.610 --> 03:50:15.920 of North Texas of 03:50:15.920 --> 03:50:23.799 27,000 in 2000 to now 37,000 that is a huge increase and 03:50:23.799 --> 03:50:24.799 not only is it just 03:50:24.799 --> 03:50:28.719 students but it is staff at the university to support them 03:50:28.719 --> 03:50:30.399 and all the 03:50:30.399 --> 03:50:33.780 other things that go into that and that is just the reality 03:50:33.780 --> 03:50:34.840 that we're faced 03:50:34.840 --> 03:50:40.430 with and being right across the street from the university 03:50:40.430 --> 03:50:41.399 versus in other 03:50:41.399 --> 03:50:45.600 areas and all of the other transportation issues that come 03:50:45.600 --> 03:50:46.319 place of 03:50:46.319 --> 03:50:49.809 if this is built six blocks away from the university or 03:50:49.809 --> 03:50:51.239 half a mile away from 03:50:51.239 --> 03:50:54.129 the university and all these students in half to get from 03:50:54.129 --> 03:50:55.319 where they live to the 03:50:55.319 --> 03:50:58.840 university the traffic issues that the university is going 03:50:58.840 --> 03:50:59.799 to deal with are 03:50:59.799 --> 03:51:01.959 going to be significantly more than them walking across the 03:51:01.959 --> 03:51:02.719 street and going to 03:51:02.719 --> 03:51:08.989 campus so I may be the lone wolf this evening who will pack 03:51:08.989 --> 03:51:10.639 that you know I 03:51:10.639 --> 03:51:16.059 understand that there's a hesitation for a change that 03:51:16.059 --> 03:51:17.959 things want neighbors want 03:51:17.959 --> 03:51:21.879 to see things stay the same but this is a commercial area 03:51:21.879 --> 03:51:23.479 it is right across the 03:51:23.479 --> 03:51:28.149 street from North Texas the traffic there has more to do 03:51:28.149 --> 03:51:28.799 with the number of 03:51:28.799 --> 03:51:31.280 students that go to the university that in my opinion what 03:51:31.280 --> 03:51:31.959 are going to be 03:51:31.959 --> 03:51:36.379 coming for this particular project so I'm not going to vote 03:51:36.379 --> 03:51:39.959 this evening on 03:51:39.959 --> 03:51:44.629 the motion as far as to firm I'll be against the denial 03:51:44.629 --> 03:51:46.159 because I think this 03:51:46.159 --> 03:51:49.049 project long term or another project behind it to 03:51:49.049 --> 03:51:51.000 Commissioner Hudspeth point 03:51:51.000 --> 03:51:54.409 will change a couple of feet and then there will be no say 03:51:54.409 --> 03:51:55.280 and it will be 03:51:55.280 --> 03:51:59.969 built and that will be the end of it and those things may 03:51:59.969 --> 03:52:01.879 that may just be what 03:52:01.879 --> 03:52:05.590 happens on this particular piece of property I do want to 03:52:05.590 --> 03:52:06.879 echo all of my 03:52:06.879 --> 03:52:09.659 fellow commissioners I appreciate everybody who has come 03:52:09.659 --> 03:52:10.440 out time and time 03:52:10.440 --> 03:52:13.549 and time again on this particular issue it takes a lot of 03:52:13.549 --> 03:52:14.719 time to do that it 03:52:14.719 --> 03:52:17.559 takes a lot of time to study the issue go to the 03:52:17.559 --> 03:52:19.920 neighborhood meetings and I 03:52:19.920 --> 03:52:24.379 appreciate you coming out this evening to share your voice 03:52:24.379 --> 03:52:26.479 and so with that if 03:52:26.479 --> 03:52:30.530 there's not anyone else to speak I'm going to call for a 03:52:30.530 --> 03:52:31.959 vote on this issue 03:52:32.280 --> 03:52:35.600 seeing that we will call for a vote on the board and the 03:52:35.600 --> 03:52:37.200 motion before us and 03:52:37.200 --> 03:52:41.559 we have a first and a second for denial 03:52:44.760 --> 03:52:58.600 do we need to do by hand or you got it okay that we may be 03:52:58.600 --> 03:53:02.680 having some 03:53:02.680 --> 03:53:08.530 technical difficulties clarification so if we vote for it 03:53:08.530 --> 03:53:10.360 go ahead if we vote 03:53:10.360 --> 03:53:13.799 for this we're voting for the approval of the denial 03:53:13.799 --> 03:53:15.280 correct about four is a 03:53:15.280 --> 03:53:20.510 vote for denial no would be against denial right okay 03:53:20.510 --> 03:53:22.040 please vote on the 03:53:22.040 --> 03:53:24.239 board 03:53:29.239 --> 03:53:41.729 motion for to denial carries four to one that will take us 03:53:41.729 --> 03:53:46.559 to our final thank you 03:53:46.559 --> 03:53:49.799 everyone for coming out again 03:53:55.920 --> 03:54:00.469 Commissioner Sullivan if you're out in the foyer watching 03:54:00.469 --> 03:54:02.200 online please come 03:54:02.200 --> 03:54:08.159 back to join us or we'll send somebody to come get you here 03:54:08.159 --> 03:54:11.079 is you're good come 03:54:11.079 --> 03:54:13.879 in come join us 03:54:22.479 --> 03:54:28.159 all right that will move us to our final item this evening 03:54:28.159 --> 03:54:29.319 which is going to be 03:54:29.319 --> 03:54:34.459 our project matrix and concluding items Commissioner Roz 03:54:34.459 --> 03:54:36.319 elle thank you first I 03:54:36.319 --> 03:54:39.479 just want to thank staff for getting minutes to us quickly 03:54:39.479 --> 03:54:41.360 I know we talked 03:54:41.360 --> 03:54:44.440 about that like nine months ago how there was a delay it's 03:54:44.440 --> 03:54:45.639 really easy for me 03:54:45.639 --> 03:54:48.729 to think back this is what I said last meeting and confirm 03:54:48.729 --> 03:54:49.760 and so I just wanted 03:54:49.760 --> 03:54:52.459 to publicly thank you all for getting the minutes to us 03:54:52.459 --> 03:54:53.920 timely much appreciated 03:54:53.920 --> 03:54:57.899 and and I will probably give the the balance my time to the 03:54:57.899 --> 03:54:59.200 chair on this but 03:54:59.200 --> 03:55:03.430 I do want to advocate first off some sort of reevaluation 03:55:03.430 --> 03:55:04.799 for having them pay 03:55:04.799 --> 03:55:09.260 $25,000 for a road that the city is requiring I don't know 03:55:09.260 --> 03:55:10.600 how to put that 03:55:10.600 --> 03:55:14.670 into place to review but that's yeah the ESA the mobility 03:55:14.670 --> 03:55:16.719 plan going through ESA 03:55:16.719 --> 03:55:21.219 and having the developer foot that bill that's mind-bogg 03:55:21.219 --> 03:55:22.680 ling to me so I'd love 03:55:22.680 --> 03:55:26.760 to see that discussion go further 03:55:29.600 --> 03:55:37.920 anybody else do we have the I may have missed it on the 03:55:37.920 --> 03:55:39.239 matrix on where things 03:55:39.239 --> 03:55:43.319 yep I'll catch it on my own time sorry thank you 03:55:43.319 --> 03:55:45.079 Commissioner Rozelle I will 03:55:45.079 --> 03:55:49.680 take that balance of time and I would like to see added to 03:55:49.680 --> 03:55:51.440 our matrix the 03:55:51.440 --> 03:55:55.059 point that I addressed in our work session about staff 03:55:55.059 --> 03:55:56.319 which I think is 03:55:56.319 --> 03:56:00.639 already on the agenda to take a look at this ESA mitigation 03:56:00.639 --> 03:56:02.159 on things that are 03:56:02.159 --> 03:56:06.319 required for either mobility plan or utility improvements 03:56:06.319 --> 03:56:07.559 there may be even 03:56:07.559 --> 03:56:11.120 some other areas that staff would have some more insight 03:56:11.120 --> 03:56:12.200 than I would that 03:56:12.200 --> 03:56:16.540 these things come up and to Commissioner Rozelle's point 03:56:16.540 --> 03:56:18.280 and my point of asking 03:56:18.280 --> 03:56:22.030 to quantify it some of these things are not only very 03:56:22.030 --> 03:56:23.959 expensive in dollars but 03:56:23.959 --> 03:56:27.829 also the amount of land that is lost for a developer to 03:56:27.829 --> 03:56:29.680 develop their projects on 03:56:29.680 --> 03:56:32.569 top of the fact that they're already putting in roads and 03:56:32.569 --> 03:56:33.600 infrastructure that 03:56:33.600 --> 03:56:37.409 the city is has drawn on a map and so this needs to go here 03:56:37.409 --> 03:56:38.520 so I think it does 03:56:38.520 --> 03:56:41.409 add to a significant cost burden and I appreciate staff 03:56:41.409 --> 03:56:42.639 being willing to take a 03:56:42.639 --> 03:56:47.860 look at that and bring that back to us so with that I'm 03:56:47.860 --> 03:56:49.399 going to close our 03:56:49.399 --> 03:56:54.079 meeting at 903 thank you everyone