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Planning and Zoning Commission Work Session for October the

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26th. This

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meeting has been duly posted and we do have a quorum

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present. I'm gonna call it

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to order at 435. Our first order of business is going to

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receive

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clarification on agenda items this evening and I will turn

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that over to

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Manal for presentation. Thank you Chairperson Strange. I

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was wanting to seek

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the opinion of the Commission tonight to see if the items

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for public hearing for

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A and for B could be flipped please in the interest of

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anticipated viewers and

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audience. Maybe we could flip the two items so just wanted

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to bring that

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forward and from here we can proceed with our first item

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which is going to be

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the preliminary plat for Ranchview Surgical Hospital. I'll

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ask Julie Wyatt to

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come and present that or answer any questions since it's

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relatively

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self-explanatory.

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I'll answer any questions. I know you all have seen this

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site a few times but I'll

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be happy to show you anything or okay thank you. Thank you

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Julie.

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That was easy. We have another preliminary plat and Mike

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Bell is handling this for

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Eagle Heights. If there are any questions I'll ask Mike to

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come forward.

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Commissioner Begg. Thank you Chair. The only question I

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have is we're approving the plat but is it

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established that there will be multifamily dwelling built

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there? That's

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what the Alkin has expressed their intent to develop. Okay

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but there's

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nothing in stone on that. Okay that's all. Thank you.

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Moving along to the public hearing items. As I mentioned we

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'll deal with

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item 4B first which is an alternative ESA for Ryan Meadows

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edition and Mike

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Bell is going to walk us through this.

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Thank you Mike Bell, senior planner. Also have Debra of

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Environmental

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Services who will be supportive on this case since it's

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environmentally sensitive

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area. The case is to consider recommendation to City

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Council regarding

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an environment and alternative environmentally sensitive

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area plan for

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Ryan Meadows phase two. The property is shown here in

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yellow it's south of Ryan

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Elementary, south side of Ryan Road, east of Country Club

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and to show you on the

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right side this is the lot layout that was approved with

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the preliminary plat.

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So we're really just talking about the southern half.

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Commissioner Begg. Thank

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you Chair. So that road maybe you do it with your cursor

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down there in Creekdale is

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going to do an arc through that subdivision? Right well

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this is Creekdale

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here. Right. I'll show you how it relates to the mobility

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plan and just a right

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okay I'm just trying to a couple slides. Okay thanks. So it

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is just the south

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side of the subdivision. This is the combination of the ESA

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map and our

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city's mobility plan. You can see this is Creekdale Drive

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which you were referring

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to. That's our mobility plan as a collector street on the

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developers

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required to construct it. This is all of Ryan Meadows

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outlined in yellow so you

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can see where it comes through and eventually continue on

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east to the

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existing Creekdale and further on all the way to Teasley.

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There are also three

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environmentally sensitive areas in this tract. There's unde

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veloped floodplain,

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there's some riparian buffer and embedded within that rip

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arian buffer is

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also some water related ESA. I'll be happy to let Debra go

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over those in more

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detail if you have questions about what those entail. But

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you can see the mobility

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plan cut straight through them and there's really no there

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's no way around

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that. So that's the purpose of this request and again I'll

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show you the

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highlighted in white here is Creekdale Drive from that

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mobility plan and we'll

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focus in on this southern part here which you'll see is the

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actual ESAs and

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there are two areas of encroachment shown in red here and

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then where the road

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crosses down at the south part. It encapsulates 0.36 acres

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of floodplain,

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0.07 of water related and 0.39 of riparian buffer. So for

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mitigation of

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that, the encroachment of those areas the African is

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proposing to plant 25 trees

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which are those trees shown right there.

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Again we did send notification it is a public hearing we

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received nothing in

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favor or in opposition. Staff is supportive of the request

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as for the

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considerations in your backup but we do have three

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recommended conditions. One

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that we you know kind of specify the limitations so that it

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's not exceed 0.45

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acres is that was subject to the alternative ESA plan that

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's in your

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backup. There will be 25 trees planted to mitigate the

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removal of the ESAs and

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those shall be three inches diameter at planning and lastly

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that all disturbed

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areas shall be revegetated using native plants and with

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that I'll be happy to

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answer any questions. Commissioner Rossell. Thank you chair

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. I think I have two questions to

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start. First question is this is can you walk me through

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the the balance between

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this being a city road and them being required to mitigate

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if they're

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providing the road on our mobility plan? Right so the the

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alignment of Creekdale

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is conceptually drawn on the mobility plan. Does not

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necessarily have to be

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this curve but generally they have to get from up here to

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down here through

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their property and that's required of them by the city

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mobility plan. The exact

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alignment is not deterrent so essentially they could you

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know curve it

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through the side how they please as long as they get to the

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to the southern half

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and it meets our requirements and there is nothing that

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exempts city roads from

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not having to do an alternative ESA plan. Okay. So that's

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really why we're here

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there's no exemption from that and I think there could be

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why are we making

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them do an ESA plan if we're making them put the road in

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but because that

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alignments not fixed I think there could be an argument

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made that if we didn't

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require these so they could run their road straight through

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it. Sure. And not

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have to do any mitigation. That makes sense. The other

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question I had was it's

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almost a point four acres of riparian buffer. Last time I

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saw the riparian

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buffer come into question we actually had photographs of

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the condition of the

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riparian buffer. Has anyone walked the area to know what

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condition the riparian

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buffer is in or health of it?

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Good evening Commission. We did an assessment in 2014 for

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those four three

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ESAs and the riparian buffer ranked as a fair. Okay so it

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is heavily vegetated. We

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only provide protection to the first hundred feet of the

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riparian buffer

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however the actual buffer extends 200 feet wide. So we

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wanted to make that the

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distinction of what is being protected under the ESA

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regulation what is out

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there. So it is a fair condition it is an undeveloped flood

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plain the water

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related was confirmed so we have a better understanding of

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what is out there

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based on the field assessments. Is there any creek or water

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to your knowledge

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standing there right now? Well I went to the site and

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actually there were

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there was no evidence of water flowing but definitely some

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stagnant water so I

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think that is intermittent type of a stream where flows

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only to certain times

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of the year. Thank you. Commissioner Black. Thank you Chair

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. So you feel

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comfortable with what little work they're going to be doing

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through which

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is again less than 0.4 that there's not going to be any

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loss of any

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significant wildlife there is there any there to lose? Well

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the this request is a

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little bit compound. First we have the ESA the disturbance

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to the ESA that

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they are doing okay and also we look into what they are

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offering as a

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mitigation. In this case they have offered to provide

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additional planting

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adjacent to the ESA not within the ESA but adjacent to the

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ESA and the reason

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is because they went through a conditional letter of my

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revision

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through FEMA which allows them to modify that floodplain

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okay and that have been

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already approved by FEMA subject to work start being done

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and then the

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conditional letter of my revision becomes a permanent

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through a letter of

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my revision. If they start putting more trees within the

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floodplain that

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actually invalid all the parameters that they have modeled

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the floodplain

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and have determined the boundary of the new floodplain so

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what they're doing is

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they understand that mitigation is needed but they are

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willing to provide

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that mitigation adjacent to it. Just keep in mind the same

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as this riparian buffer

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is 200 feet even though only the first hundred feet is

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protected the same

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happened with that year is heavily vegetated so adding to

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it adding the

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mitigation next to it you will make the area greater. I don

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't think that exactly

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answer my question though is there any essential wildlife

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there that would lose

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from this? Well we don't have any endangered species

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identified by

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parks and wildlife in that area. Wildlife yes definitely

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there would be when

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when you have those urban forests and those riparian buffer

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they're definitely

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refuge for wildlife so they there would still be a riparian

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buffer there and the

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disturbance might made those species to relocate

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temporarily but hopefully they

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will come back. Okay now you mentioned and I realize this

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cloner CLOMR when

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they can't do you're talking about the trees the mitigation

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part with the

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trees that's outside of this area but you also mentioned

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that the applicant

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offers as mitigation revegetating all disturbed areas with

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native vegetation so

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is that going to be within that cloner region and what kind

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of vegetation? Well

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mainly would be grasses and what we are looking is we

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specify native because

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they have a better chance to acclimate and get established

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faster just keep in

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mind that we are close to a creek so any area that get und

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isturbed that means that

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that soil have a chance to reach to the creek in a rain

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event so we're looking

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for primarily grasses who keep the soil in place and

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protected. Thank you.

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Commissioner Rosale. Thank you one more question the the ph

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asing chart that I

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have here lots 142 and 143 is where they're planning on

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putting trees is

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lots 142 and 143 going away or are they actually mitigating

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in an area that a

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house is going to be built? Those are common area lots the

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HOA maintenance.

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Okay okay thank you. Commissioner Sullivan. Thank you I'm

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concerned that how

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much water is gonna be coming through that area because

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right now anytime it's

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a heavy rain Hickory Creek is pretty well closed most of

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the time both from River

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Pass and off of 1830 and we've got a street that's coming

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from Creekdale on

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to Hickory Creek and then we have Creekdale coming through

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here plus a lot

272
00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:38,919
of houses being built with a lot of concrete is all that

273
00:12:38,919 --> 00:12:39,840
gonna be draining

274
00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:43,750
into that floodplain area that's then gonna flood Hickory

275
00:12:43,750 --> 00:12:45,360
Creek even more or

276
00:12:45,360 --> 00:12:49,279
are there plans to do something with Hickory Creek Road to

277
00:12:49,279 --> 00:12:50,919
make it not flood

278
00:12:50,919 --> 00:12:55,600
as often? Earl would you care to address that one?

279
00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:01,879
Earl Escobar engineering. What the intent with Hickory

280
00:13:01,879 --> 00:13:05,399
Creek Road oops is to

281
00:13:05,399 --> 00:13:15,120
realign it. Currently Hickory Road is within the floodplain

282
00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:16,480
itself and so it

283
00:13:16,480 --> 00:13:21,169
does flood during heavy rain events and so there should be

284
00:13:21,169 --> 00:13:22,519
a CIP project in the

285
00:13:22,519 --> 00:13:28,899
future that realigns it outside the floodplain here in red.

286
00:13:28,899 --> 00:13:30,440
Okay I thought

287
00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:34,600
that's where it was now. No no no it right now it goes

288
00:13:34,600 --> 00:13:35,879
straight. Okay where's

289
00:13:35,879 --> 00:13:38,179
this Hickory Creek? Right. That's the road and that's the

290
00:13:38,179 --> 00:13:39,440
road. Okay somewhere in this area.

291
00:13:39,440 --> 00:13:44,799
Okay I see so that is a change to Hickory Creek. Yes.

292
00:13:44,799 --> 00:13:48,279
Gotcha okay thank you.

293
00:13:51,159 --> 00:13:55,279
I have a couple questions. Do we have a map without the ESA

294
00:13:55,279 --> 00:13:56,080
on it that we can

295
00:13:56,080 --> 00:13:58,759
zoom in on what that area currently is? I know that's been

296
00:13:58,759 --> 00:14:00,480
farmland I think for

297
00:14:00,480 --> 00:14:03,960
many years back and behind the school.

298
00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:13,000
Well maybe I have one aerial here.

299
00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:23,600
Does that work for what you need? I guess as close as we

300
00:14:23,600 --> 00:14:27,399
can get. Can you turn ESA on

301
00:14:27,399 --> 00:14:29,879
that or not? Let me just go ahead and get the interactive

302
00:14:29,879 --> 00:14:32,840
maps I'll pull that up real quick.

303
00:14:48,440 --> 00:15:04,399
I apparently not. Well I was hoping to be able to look and

304
00:15:04,399 --> 00:15:06,879
see what the current

305
00:15:06,879 --> 00:15:09,769
conditions and what it's been because I know and and the

306
00:15:09,769 --> 00:15:10,720
reason I know is my

307
00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:13,620
kids went to school there at that elementary school so Fall

308
00:15:13,620 --> 00:15:14,320
Festival and

309
00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:17,669
all the things that went on and out in that field just to

310
00:15:17,669 --> 00:15:18,960
get an idea of and for

311
00:15:18,960 --> 00:15:20,899
the rest of Commission an idea of what the current

312
00:15:20,899 --> 00:15:22,000
conditions are out there

313
00:15:22,000 --> 00:15:25,559
that that's mostly been just a plowed and farmland for many

314
00:15:25,559 --> 00:15:26,519
years versus I

315
00:15:26,519 --> 00:15:31,179
don't know when the ESA got established on there and then

316
00:15:31,179 --> 00:15:33,120
the second point which

317
00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:37,000
goes back to the map that you had up that does show the ESA

318
00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:38,159
I know we've had

319
00:15:38,159 --> 00:15:42,360
quite a bit of conversation in the past about roads

320
00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:44,519
impacting the essays and

321
00:15:44,519 --> 00:15:48,250
when you look at that map right there Ryan already impacts

322
00:15:48,250 --> 00:15:49,919
it in at least two

323
00:15:49,919 --> 00:15:55,120
or three places Hickory Creek is through it 1830 is through

324
00:15:55,120 --> 00:15:57,480
it we have this all

325
00:15:57,480 --> 00:15:59,980
over town and I know we've had a lot of discussions in the

326
00:15:59,980 --> 00:16:00,879
past that we can't

327
00:16:00,879 --> 00:16:04,690
put any roads or we don't want roads crossing ESA's and

328
00:16:04,690 --> 00:16:05,960
they are all over

329
00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:09,450
already and that's just a fact of mobility and getting

330
00:16:09,450 --> 00:16:10,840
around our city and

331
00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:14,360
so I just want to draw that to attention because we've had

332
00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:14,879
a lot of

333
00:16:14,879 --> 00:16:18,509
conversation the past about it and we see it in this map

334
00:16:18,509 --> 00:16:19,519
that it exists

335
00:16:19,519 --> 00:16:23,929
probably in at least 20 30 places just in this one area

336
00:16:23,929 --> 00:16:25,480
that this happens all

337
00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:30,100
the time and it's not a very oddball thing that comes

338
00:16:30,100 --> 00:16:32,480
before us it's pretty

339
00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:35,620
normal and so those are just my two comments on this

340
00:16:35,620 --> 00:16:37,200
particular one and then

341
00:16:37,200 --> 00:16:40,460
the other one that final comment is on Commissioner Roselle

342
00:16:40,460 --> 00:16:41,799
's point which was

343
00:16:41,799 --> 00:16:45,149
going to be my question about when it's on the mobility and

344
00:16:45,149 --> 00:16:45,960
it has to go in

345
00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:49,679
there why a developer has to come in and mitigate that when

346
00:16:49,679 --> 00:16:50,600
they have to put that

347
00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:54,629
roadway in there's really not a place for them to put Creek

348
00:16:54,629 --> 00:16:55,879
dale in that it's

349
00:16:55,879 --> 00:16:59,039
not going to end up impacting the essay certainly I think

350
00:16:59,039 --> 00:16:59,799
that's a fair point

351
00:16:59,799 --> 00:17:02,100
something we discussed internally but ultimately there's

352
00:17:02,100 --> 00:17:02,840
nothing in the code

353
00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:06,410
that exempts those requirements and so that's what the ESA

354
00:17:06,410 --> 00:17:07,559
plan came into about

355
00:17:07,559 --> 00:17:10,690
what's it take to make it exempt because if they've got to

356
00:17:10,690 --> 00:17:11,559
go expense of

357
00:17:11,559 --> 00:17:15,049
putting it in things like it's kind of somewhat punitive to

358
00:17:15,049 --> 00:17:15,839
then have to

359
00:17:15,839 --> 00:17:20,529
mitigate for a road that's being told you're going to put

360
00:17:20,529 --> 00:17:23,559
it here when this

361
00:17:23,559 --> 00:17:26,319
application came forward it's one of the issues that we

362
00:17:26,319 --> 00:17:27,559
grappled with saying that

363
00:17:27,559 --> 00:17:29,720
there is a right of way that's required based on our

364
00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:31,000
thoroughfare plan slash

365
00:17:31,000 --> 00:17:36,049
mobility plan and we looked we also weighed the the concern

366
00:17:36,049 --> 00:17:37,039
on what do we do

367
00:17:37,039 --> 00:17:39,509
as it relates to mitigation even though we've seen the

368
00:17:39,509 --> 00:17:40,480
scenario in multiple

369
00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:44,240
areas within our city and as a result it is something that

370
00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:45,640
we've pinpointed or

371
00:17:45,640 --> 00:17:49,039
highlighted and are keen to work internally with our teams

372
00:17:49,039 --> 00:17:50,279
our engineering

373
00:17:50,279 --> 00:17:53,400
our environmental team and ourselves to see if there's an

374
00:17:53,400 --> 00:17:54,759
opportunity where do we

375
00:17:54,759 --> 00:17:57,440
revisit the mobility plan or do we then figure out an

376
00:17:57,440 --> 00:17:58,960
alternative solution as it

377
00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:04,400
relates to public right-of-way requirements so where does

378
00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:05,160
that stand

379
00:18:05,160 --> 00:18:08,809
so at this point hopefully we do intend within the next few

380
00:18:08,809 --> 00:18:09,880
months is to get

381
00:18:09,880 --> 00:18:13,269
some working groups together to understand what the

382
00:18:13,269 --> 00:18:14,559
opportunities are

383
00:18:14,559 --> 00:18:17,680
that are available to us again the Commission also has the

384
00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:18,480
opportunity to

385
00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:21,650
make a request if I'm not mistaken to have this evaluated

386
00:18:21,650 --> 00:18:22,759
or reevaluated or

387
00:18:22,759 --> 00:18:28,019
assessed that broad question or this particular broad

388
00:18:28,019 --> 00:18:30,480
question well I'll make

389
00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:33,369
that recommendation that we look at that because I know

390
00:18:33,369 --> 00:18:35,240
this happens in multiple

391
00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:41,099
places and any time that these impacts that's basically on

392
00:18:41,099 --> 00:18:42,440
the not only is the

393
00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:45,789
developer having to put the the utilities or the road or

394
00:18:45,789 --> 00:18:47,240
whatever in but

395
00:18:47,240 --> 00:18:51,529
if it does then impact an ESA then they have to mitigate it

396
00:18:51,529 --> 00:18:52,400
and have the

397
00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:56,480
additional expense based on being said this is where it has

398
00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:57,480
to go and got to

399
00:18:57,480 --> 00:19:00,799
mitigate it also so I don't know if we need a first or a

400
00:19:00,799 --> 00:19:01,799
second or just a

401
00:19:01,799 --> 00:19:05,400
general effect comes on at the very end of the very end is

402
00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:05,720
an item that needs

403
00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:12,359
to be addressed matrix anybody else have any questions on

404
00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:13,720
this item is a great

405
00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:17,839
presentation thank you Mike

406
00:19:22,440 --> 00:19:26,859
I'm going to ask Ron Menguita our long-range planning

407
00:19:26,859 --> 00:19:29,960
administrator to

408
00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:36,539
make the next presentation for z16 0 0 0 7 thank you chair

409
00:19:36,539 --> 00:19:38,000
members of the

410
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:41,880
Commission this item brought forward to you today is a code

411
00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:43,039
amendment to our

412
00:19:43,039 --> 00:19:43,039
development code regarding a fry overlay district the

413
00:19:43,039 --> 00:19:50,599
request by the

414
00:19:50,599 --> 00:19:55,500
applicant is to amend the overlay district to create a

415
00:19:55,500 --> 00:19:57,200
separate sub area

416
00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:00,809
which is what they're calling sub area C and also provide

417
00:20:00,809 --> 00:20:02,319
additional associated

418
00:20:02,319 --> 00:20:06,990
development standards that would only apply to that

419
00:20:06,990 --> 00:20:09,960
particular sub area as a

420
00:20:09,960 --> 00:20:14,220
way of reference this is the fry Street overlay district it

421
00:20:14,220 --> 00:20:17,359
's possibly 12.8 0

422
00:20:17,359 --> 00:20:23,059
acres or so the youth center which is here and shown in sub

423
00:20:23,059 --> 00:20:25,640
area B was carved

424
00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:30,799
out for a lack of better term in 2010 to allow for that

425
00:20:30,799 --> 00:20:32,839
development to occur they

426
00:20:32,839 --> 00:20:36,849
proposed again a sub area they proposed development

427
00:20:36,849 --> 00:20:39,440
standards again to allow

428
00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:43,940
them to build their development the same similar request is

429
00:20:43,940 --> 00:20:45,680
being asked of this

430
00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:49,799
particular area which is shown in red and this is again sub

431
00:20:49,799 --> 00:20:50,799
area C and the

432
00:20:50,799 --> 00:20:55,400
applicant has proposed certain criteria or design standards

433
00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:56,599
that will allow

434
00:20:56,599 --> 00:21:00,289
their development to occur if this were to move forward and

435
00:21:00,289 --> 00:21:01,559
get approved by City

436
00:21:01,559 --> 00:21:07,500
Council look closer look of the area this is the area

437
00:21:07,500 --> 00:21:10,559
approximately 4.7 acres

438
00:21:10,559 --> 00:21:16,319
I'm sorry 1.75 acres I stand corrected of the area where

439
00:21:16,319 --> 00:21:18,119
currently Vortmans

440
00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:22,710
bookstore is located as well as the subway along Hickory

441
00:21:22,710 --> 00:21:24,400
Street the

442
00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:28,970
applicant is proposing to construct a five-story multi-

443
00:21:28,970 --> 00:21:30,559
level mixed-use

444
00:21:30,559 --> 00:21:34,930
development that will include again the retail Vortmans

445
00:21:34,930 --> 00:21:36,640
bookstore as well as a

446
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:40,000
restaurant it's my understanding that subway will be occup

447
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:41,079
ying that space it

448
00:21:41,079 --> 00:21:44,240
may not necessarily be subway but it will be a restaurant

449
00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:45,599
in addition to that

450
00:21:45,599 --> 00:21:52,470
student living apartments above those commercial uses quick

451
00:21:52,470 --> 00:21:54,599
background of the

452
00:21:54,599 --> 00:21:59,579
project in 2015 there was an application that was submitted

453
00:21:59,579 --> 00:22:02,440
z-15 29 that went

454
00:22:02,440 --> 00:22:06,359
through development review committee it was then forwarded

455
00:22:06,359 --> 00:22:07,599
to the planning zoning

456
00:22:07,599 --> 00:22:11,470
Commission for their consider your consideration at that

457
00:22:11,470 --> 00:22:12,359
meeting with the

458
00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:15,450
planning zoning Commission the Commission recommended

459
00:22:15,450 --> 00:22:17,039
denial 6 to 1 of

460
00:22:17,039 --> 00:22:21,470
that request following that planning zoning Commission it

461
00:22:21,470 --> 00:22:22,359
was then scheduled

462
00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:26,990
to go to City Council and after several meetings of postpon

463
00:22:26,990 --> 00:22:28,240
ement of the

464
00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:34,410
applicant requested that the item be withdrawn on April 8th

465
00:22:34,410 --> 00:22:36,279
of 2016 earlier

466
00:22:36,279 --> 00:22:40,880
this year the applicant chose to reapply for another

467
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:42,920
amendment requests of the

468
00:22:42,920 --> 00:22:47,029
overlay and that occurred on April 8th of 2016 and that new

469
00:22:47,029 --> 00:22:49,160
case number is z-16 7

470
00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:51,970
which is in front of you today for your consideration the

471
00:22:51,970 --> 00:22:53,119
only difference

472
00:22:53,119 --> 00:22:56,160
between the first submittal and the second submittal is

473
00:22:56,160 --> 00:22:57,279
that the applicant

474
00:22:57,279 --> 00:23:01,670
has identified an additional 36 parking spaces which is

475
00:23:01,670 --> 00:23:03,279
located just north of

476
00:23:03,279 --> 00:23:08,099
the subject property north of Oak Street on this on the

477
00:23:08,099 --> 00:23:10,000
north east corner of

478
00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:16,269
Bryan and Oak Street so what does this mixed-use

479
00:23:16,269 --> 00:23:18,160
development comprise of it's

480
00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:21,619
a five-story mixed-use development it has student living

481
00:23:21,619 --> 00:23:22,759
apartments as you

482
00:23:22,759 --> 00:23:29,029
can see here just above the the commercial uses it compr

483
00:23:29,029 --> 00:23:29,680
ises of

484
00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:34,190
approximately 111,000 square feet each bedroom will be le

485
00:23:34,190 --> 00:23:35,160
ased out to

486
00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:39,440
individual students there are a total of 83 dwelling units

487
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:42,279
nine two bedrooms 14

488
00:23:42,279 --> 00:23:48,410
three bedrooms and 64 bedroom units if you were to multiply

489
00:23:48,410 --> 00:23:49,160
that and add that

490
00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:53,250
all up that that calculates up to 300 bedrooms is what this

491
00:23:53,250 --> 00:23:53,960
proposed

492
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:58,410
development is going to have the building height of the

493
00:23:58,410 --> 00:24:00,799
development is 62

494
00:24:00,799 --> 00:24:06,619
feet roughly from ground level to the top of the main

495
00:24:06,619 --> 00:24:09,000
building they're also

496
00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:12,579
proposing a parking garage which is going to be wrapped

497
00:24:12,579 --> 00:24:14,319
around except for an

498
00:24:14,319 --> 00:24:18,880
area to the west this area here will be visible it will not

499
00:24:18,880 --> 00:24:20,279
have anything in

500
00:24:20,279 --> 00:24:22,849
front of it so this is again the parking structure and the

501
00:24:22,849 --> 00:24:23,839
height of the parking

502
00:24:23,839 --> 00:24:27,660
commissioner that is 69 feet tall thank you chair I noticed

503
00:24:27,660 --> 00:24:29,839
it said that if this

504
00:24:29,839 --> 00:24:32,869
sub area see is approved that it could be up to six stories

505
00:24:32,869 --> 00:24:34,039
for the garage is

506
00:24:34,039 --> 00:24:37,960
that correct five stories at six stories you're correct for

507
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:38,799
the garage oh yeah

508
00:24:38,799 --> 00:24:42,079
just for the garage okay so that options there later if

509
00:24:42,079 --> 00:24:43,119
they want to stack on

510
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:46,319
that is what they're proposing now is my understanding so

511
00:24:46,319 --> 00:24:48,160
five story six story

512
00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:52,579
for the garage for the garage okay thank you so again the

513
00:24:52,579 --> 00:24:55,200
parking garage will

514
00:24:55,200 --> 00:25:00,609
have 217 parking spaces and the height of that garage will

515
00:25:00,609 --> 00:25:02,799
be 69.2 feet and

516
00:25:02,799 --> 00:25:06,039
that's measured right here where the people will be able

517
00:25:06,039 --> 00:25:07,440
students and other

518
00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:12,160
folks will be able to access an elevator

519
00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:16,990
as mentioned earlier retail will be allowed or not allowed

520
00:25:16,990 --> 00:25:17,920
but be part of

521
00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:21,230
this development boardman's as shown here will be located

522
00:25:21,230 --> 00:25:22,480
on the ground floor

523
00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:28,240
along Hickory Street this is Hickory here also subway or a

524
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:29,119
restaurant will be

525
00:25:29,119 --> 00:25:34,980
part of this development that's approximately 1600 square

526
00:25:34,980 --> 00:25:35,640
feet of

527
00:25:35,640 --> 00:25:39,869
restaurant space in addition there will be five surface

528
00:25:39,869 --> 00:25:41,599
parking which is in just

529
00:25:41,599 --> 00:25:45,509
general area here just to the east of development and then

530
00:25:45,509 --> 00:25:46,400
again mentioned

531
00:25:46,400 --> 00:25:50,279
earlier 36 surface parking to the north of the project

532
00:25:50,279 --> 00:25:52,240
along north of Oak Street

533
00:25:52,240 --> 00:26:00,980
off-site so here are the standards that is being proposed

534
00:26:00,980 --> 00:26:03,119
currently we have two

535
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:08,609
sub areas we have a sub area a which is everything outside

536
00:26:08,609 --> 00:26:10,160
of sub area B so

537
00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:14,619
anything that was in place with the five Street area is sub

538
00:26:14,619 --> 00:26:16,279
area a and then again

539
00:26:16,279 --> 00:26:20,019
in 2010 with the creation of sub area B they came up with

540
00:26:20,019 --> 00:26:21,480
their own standards

541
00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:25,369
and that's reflected here in this column what the applicant

542
00:26:25,369 --> 00:26:26,480
is proposing is

543
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:31,779
sub area C and we'll start from left to right maximum

544
00:26:31,779 --> 00:26:34,000
building height sub area

545
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:37,319
B I'm sorry sub area A is three stories with a maximum

546
00:26:37,319 --> 00:26:39,720
height of 45 feet the

547
00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:43,599
applicant is proposing five stories with the maximum height

548
00:26:43,599 --> 00:26:46,200
of 62.05 feet. Ron

549
00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:50,119
question for you please sir when was sub area A originally

550
00:26:50,119 --> 00:26:52,039
done? I want to say

551
00:26:52,039 --> 00:26:57,069
2000 around the update of the development code okay I know

552
00:26:57,069 --> 00:26:57,519
there was a

553
00:26:57,519 --> 00:27:00,539
small area plan in 99 and I believe that the overlay

554
00:27:00,539 --> 00:27:02,200
district followed soon after

555
00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:07,960
okay and then B was done when? 2010. 2010 okay so we're 15

556
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:09,160
years down the road and

557
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:13,799
five years after B and we're getting taller each time

558
00:27:13,799 --> 00:27:17,119
correct okay the parking

559
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:21,789
garage for sub area A is 45 feet the applicant is proposing

560
00:27:21,789 --> 00:27:23,039
six stories as

561
00:27:23,039 --> 00:27:30,119
Commissioner Beck alluded up to 69.2 feet the the density

562
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:34,279
as calculated in sub area A. Commissioner Ellis. Thank you

563
00:27:34,279 --> 00:27:35,240
chair. Hi Ron

564
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:39,400
thanks quick question just so I understand is sub area B

565
00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:40,720
simply that

566
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:43,710
youth center development? Correct. That is that outline

567
00:27:43,710 --> 00:27:45,000
that I showed earlier is

568
00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:48,660
the youth center development. Is sub area B? Correct. And

569
00:27:48,660 --> 00:27:50,059
there is no sub area C?

570
00:27:50,059 --> 00:27:53,079
There is not. They're trying to create sub area C with this

571
00:27:53,079 --> 00:27:53,960
proposal? That's

572
00:27:53,960 --> 00:27:58,000
correct. Okay thank you thank you. Maximum density for sub

573
00:27:58,000 --> 00:27:58,960
area A is based on

574
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:02,240
development standards you know meeting parking requirements

575
00:28:02,240 --> 00:28:03,359
the lock coverage

576
00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:07,279
all that and that will dictate what that dwelling per acre

577
00:28:07,279 --> 00:28:09,400
unit count would be.

578
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:14,130
Sub area proposed sub area C is proposing up to 86 dwelling

579
00:28:14,130 --> 00:28:16,319
units per acre. Again the

580
00:28:16,319 --> 00:28:21,440
the total acreage for that development is 1.75 acres with

581
00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:23,519
roughly a

582
00:28:23,519 --> 00:28:27,440
number of dwelling units associated with that project. Park

583
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:29,440
ing ratio the parking

584
00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:34,309
ratio for sub area A is one space per bedroom for units

585
00:28:34,309 --> 00:28:36,079
that have two bedrooms

586
00:28:36,079 --> 00:28:39,779
or more so if they have a two-bedroom unit they need to

587
00:28:39,779 --> 00:28:40,640
provide two parking

588
00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:43,450
spaces if they have a three-bedroom unit they would have to

589
00:28:43,450 --> 00:28:44,559
provide three parking

590
00:28:44,559 --> 00:28:48,240
spaces up to four and four units of course would have to

591
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:48,680
provide four

592
00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:53,039
parking spaces. The applicant is proposing that that ratio

593
00:28:53,039 --> 00:28:54,799
be reduced to

594
00:28:54,799 --> 00:29:03,240
0.76 spaces per bedroom. Commissioner Rossell. Is there a

595
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:04,960
parking ratio for one

596
00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:07,880
bedrooms there's no one bedrooms allowed? There is one

597
00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:09,880
bedroom in the current

598
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:16,500
standards and let me see if I can find that for you. It's

599
00:29:16,500 --> 00:29:18,279
one bedroom would be

600
00:29:18,279 --> 00:29:24,799
1.5 space per unit. Okay thank you. One other question on

601
00:29:24,799 --> 00:29:25,640
the parking room is

602
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:29,509
the parking figured on all of the surface parking so the

603
00:29:29,509 --> 00:29:30,640
five spaces the

604
00:29:30,640 --> 00:29:34,240
36 spaces and then whatever is internal as well? Correct

605
00:29:34,240 --> 00:29:35,720
whatever total they have

606
00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:37,500
that they're providing would be a factor in that

607
00:29:37,500 --> 00:29:38,720
calculation. So even though the

608
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:42,490
five spaces are more than likely kind of serving the retail

609
00:29:42,490 --> 00:29:43,680
they're including

610
00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:46,359
that in this calculation? Correct and I've got a slide that

611
00:29:46,359 --> 00:29:47,359
explains how that's all broken.

612
00:29:47,359 --> 00:29:49,670
It's hard to get ahead of you. No that's fine. Commissioner

613
00:29:49,670 --> 00:29:50,799
Sullivan. Will the

614
00:29:50,799 --> 00:29:54,240
off-site parking be somewhat restricted? I mean would it be

615
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:55,039
restricted to

616
00:29:55,039 --> 00:29:59,200
apartment people only? That is. Or will it be open for

617
00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:00,720
anyone like on the surface

618
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:03,980
the five lots how are they going to regulate that? That is

619
00:30:03,980 --> 00:30:04,680
a question I had

620
00:30:04,680 --> 00:30:06,670
with the applicant and they may want to clarify that during

621
00:30:06,670 --> 00:30:07,400
the public hearing

622
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:11,420
but my understanding is it's going to be gated and there'll

623
00:30:11,420 --> 00:30:13,480
be only used by the

624
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:19,750
people that occupy that space or that development. A couple

625
00:30:19,750 --> 00:30:21,079
other things that

626
00:30:21,079 --> 00:30:24,640
they're proposing either increase or decrease. Building

627
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:26,240
coverage going from 50

628
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:31,440
to 70 for residential mixed-use building coverage 80 to 81.

629
00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:33,200
Minimum landscape area.

630
00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:37,740
The requirement for the sub area A is 15 percent. They're

631
00:30:37,740 --> 00:30:39,460
proposing a 10.7

632
00:30:39,460 --> 00:30:45,099
percent landscape area and then a rear set backyard would

633
00:30:45,099 --> 00:30:46,279
be a reduction from

634
00:30:46,279 --> 00:30:55,349
10 to 5 feet for sub area C. So this is the parking slide.

635
00:30:55,349 --> 00:30:56,759
Commissioner

636
00:30:56,759 --> 00:31:00,740
Strange regarding what is going to be required for each

637
00:31:00,740 --> 00:31:02,799
type of use. The first

638
00:31:02,799 --> 00:31:08,509
one is what's currently required as part of sub area A.

639
00:31:08,509 --> 00:31:10,839
With retail at four one

640
00:31:10,839 --> 00:31:14,599
space per 400 they're required 27. With the restaurant

641
00:31:14,599 --> 00:31:15,880
again one space per 400

642
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:21,160
that's five and then the 300 bedrooms would require one

643
00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:22,400
space per bedroom and

644
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:27,319
obviously that would be 300 so a total 332. With the

645
00:31:27,319 --> 00:31:29,160
proposed changes in the

646
00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:32,509
parking requirement similar they're not proposing to change

647
00:31:32,509 --> 00:31:33,480
anything with

648
00:31:33,480 --> 00:31:36,930
regards to retail or restaurant but they are dropping the

649
00:31:36,930 --> 00:31:38,400
requirement for

650
00:31:38,400 --> 00:31:44,779
bedrooms again two bedrooms or more from 1 to 0.76 space

651
00:31:44,779 --> 00:31:45,839
per bedroom that will

652
00:31:45,839 --> 00:31:52,250
equates to 100 I'm sorry 228. You total that up that's 62 I

653
00:31:52,250 --> 00:31:54,319
'm sorry 260 spaces

654
00:31:54,319 --> 00:32:00,589
and the difference there is 72 spaces from the two

655
00:32:00,589 --> 00:32:04,680
requirements. Does anybody

656
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:07,359
have any questions on the parking requirements before I

657
00:32:07,359 --> 00:32:07,880
move on to

658
00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:11,069
consideration? I have one other follow-up. Do we know and

659
00:32:11,069 --> 00:32:12,279
this may be need to go

660
00:32:12,279 --> 00:32:15,759
to the applicant are the parking spaces included in their

661
00:32:15,759 --> 00:32:16,640
standard rental

662
00:32:16,640 --> 00:32:19,809
agreement or parking space is going to be an additional

663
00:32:19,809 --> 00:32:23,440
charge? I don't know that.

664
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:26,440
If not we can wait till public hearing I'll ask that

665
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:27,880
question. Sounds good.

666
00:32:27,880 --> 00:32:35,599
Thank you. Back to the availability of the parking area so

667
00:32:35,599 --> 00:32:36,319
the retail and

668
00:32:36,319 --> 00:32:39,200
restaurant are going to be able to use the parking garage

669
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:40,960
just like the

670
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:45,119
occupants of the apartments. That's correct. So that anyone

671
00:32:45,119 --> 00:32:46,440
basically could go

672
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:49,210
in park and say I'm gonna go to the bookstore go to the

673
00:32:49,210 --> 00:32:50,319
bookstore and then

674
00:32:50,319 --> 00:32:52,980
have all four classes for four or five hours. That's

675
00:32:52,980 --> 00:32:54,200
something we can ask the

676
00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:58,319
applicant I know another student living apartments

677
00:32:58,319 --> 00:32:59,960
especially that have parking

678
00:32:59,960 --> 00:33:03,369
garages they limit the use of that from just for the first

679
00:33:03,369 --> 00:33:04,480
floor and then maybe

680
00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:08,079
the upper floor parking garage is allowed it's gated so

681
00:33:08,079 --> 00:33:08,960
that it would only

682
00:33:08,960 --> 00:33:12,640
be allowed to the residents but you're correct if it is

683
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:13,359
available for the

684
00:33:13,359 --> 00:33:17,059
public that could be a possibility but we certainly can ask

685
00:33:17,059 --> 00:33:17,799
and verify that

686
00:33:17,799 --> 00:33:24,400
with the applicant. Okay. So as far as consideration the

687
00:33:24,400 --> 00:33:25,799
development does

688
00:33:25,799 --> 00:33:29,200
encourage you know walking and bicycling it's it's

689
00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:30,799
obviously improving the the

690
00:33:30,799 --> 00:33:34,319
site what it is currently it's also providing extended

691
00:33:34,319 --> 00:33:35,319
building setbacks

692
00:33:35,319 --> 00:33:39,359
from Oak and Hickory so they're setting back the building I

693
00:33:39,359 --> 00:33:40,599
think they were

694
00:33:40,599 --> 00:33:46,869
trying to mimic what the youth center did in Hickory. The

695
00:33:46,869 --> 00:33:47,559
proposed development

696
00:33:47,559 --> 00:33:50,720
would keep some commercial uses which is something that's a

697
00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:52,079
positive thing again

698
00:33:52,079 --> 00:33:54,769
board members would be on Hickory as well as the the

699
00:33:54,769 --> 00:33:56,119
restaurant use would be

700
00:33:56,119 --> 00:34:01,289
adjacent to Hickory Street as well. However the height and

701
00:34:01,289 --> 00:34:02,799
density of the

702
00:34:02,799 --> 00:34:06,250
development it's not compatible with surrounding areas the

703
00:34:06,250 --> 00:34:07,039
height of the

704
00:34:07,039 --> 00:34:11,699
youth center is at 55 it's four stories other developments

705
00:34:11,699 --> 00:34:12,719
in the area are

706
00:34:12,719 --> 00:34:15,750
roughly three stories you know so less than what they're

707
00:34:15,750 --> 00:34:17,400
proposing. Parking

708
00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:24,280
requirements in the Fry overlay overlay street district is

709
00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:26,239
purposely and

710
00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:30,340
purpose and intent is to have parking for residents and so

711
00:34:30,340 --> 00:34:31,800
that was an increase

712
00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:38,320
compared to other areas in the city. It also the purpose of

713
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:38,400
the

714
00:34:38,400 --> 00:34:41,179
Fry Street overlay district is also to reduce the parking

715
00:34:41,179 --> 00:34:42,119
requirements for

716
00:34:42,119 --> 00:34:46,780
retail and restaurant and it is compared to other parts of

717
00:34:46,780 --> 00:34:48,960
the city. As far as

718
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:53,559
solid waste there is a requirement that the solid waste

719
00:34:53,559 --> 00:34:56,440
trucks be access the

720
00:34:56,440 --> 00:35:01,760
either the containers themselves or if it's a compactor

721
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:04,199
without having to have

722
00:35:04,199 --> 00:35:09,420
any assistance by the management. We haven't gone to a

723
00:35:09,420 --> 00:35:10,840
solution or gone a

724
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:14,860
solution yet the site plan does not reflect a solution and

725
00:35:14,860 --> 00:35:15,719
that's that's

726
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:19,760
one consideration we need to be mindful of. Ron I'm sorry

727
00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:20,480
to interject would

728
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:24,090
you just specify what they're proposing in terms of their

729
00:35:24,090 --> 00:35:25,719
rollout carts? Yes it

730
00:35:25,719 --> 00:35:28,809
is my understanding that they're proposing containers and

731
00:35:28,809 --> 00:35:29,559
that they're

732
00:35:29,559 --> 00:35:32,840
going to be stored in the parking garage. The amount I'm

733
00:35:32,840 --> 00:35:34,000
not sure I can I can

734
00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:37,389
verify that I think it's four containers and what they're

735
00:35:37,389 --> 00:35:38,599
proposing is they would

736
00:35:38,599 --> 00:35:43,519
roll those out to the either the driveway or the fire lane

737
00:35:43,519 --> 00:35:44,559
or parking

738
00:35:44,559 --> 00:35:49,250
space and during the hours of when the park of when the

739
00:35:49,250 --> 00:35:51,280
trash trucks would be

740
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:54,980
servicing that development and then rolling them back in

741
00:35:54,980 --> 00:35:56,280
after they have been

742
00:35:56,280 --> 00:36:01,170
emptied. That is currently what's proposed our solid waste

743
00:36:01,170 --> 00:36:02,199
department has

744
00:36:02,199 --> 00:36:06,539
reviewed that and is still considering other options but

745
00:36:06,539 --> 00:36:07,719
again there's solid

746
00:36:07,719 --> 00:36:11,110
waste requirements have not been met at this point.

747
00:36:11,110 --> 00:36:12,559
Commissioner Bec. Thank you

748
00:36:12,559 --> 00:36:15,369
Chair. Dimensionally how big are these rollout trash

749
00:36:15,369 --> 00:36:17,440
barrels are they for the

750
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:22,039
whole apartment complex? Correct. Do we know how big they

751
00:36:22,039 --> 00:36:23,920
are? I know they fit in

752
00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:27,960
an integral do you correct me if I'm wrong they're roughly

753
00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:29,719
four by six. I

754
00:36:29,719 --> 00:36:33,159
guess where I'm going with this too would they sit out on

755
00:36:33,159 --> 00:36:33,800
the street easily

756
00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:37,269
without being an obstruction of any kind? The ones that I

757
00:36:37,269 --> 00:36:38,760
've seen of the Frye

758
00:36:38,760 --> 00:36:42,329
Street development one block over has a similar concept

759
00:36:42,329 --> 00:36:43,880
where they have the

760
00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:46,460
apartments themselves have chutes that drop down to the

761
00:36:46,460 --> 00:36:49,480
garage level and into a

762
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:55,530
rollout dumpster container and they're about two to maybe

763
00:36:55,530 --> 00:36:57,559
two cubic yards at the

764
00:36:57,559 --> 00:36:59,710
most or not too big because you know they're not going to

765
00:36:59,710 --> 00:37:00,440
be able to roll it

766
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:05,840
out to the compactor that they do have on site to unload

767
00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:08,599
onto that but solid

768
00:37:08,599 --> 00:37:14,869
waste is concerned is that they're not adequate to

769
00:37:14,869 --> 00:37:16,559
withstand abuse that the

770
00:37:16,559 --> 00:37:22,989
dumpster vehicles can can apply on to them. I actually I

771
00:37:22,989 --> 00:37:24,599
noticed at the Frye

772
00:37:24,599 --> 00:37:28,280
Street apartment site this morning was that they have a

773
00:37:28,280 --> 00:37:29,800
little area that's like

774
00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:32,969
we call it the dumpster graveyard where there's a bunch of

775
00:37:32,969 --> 00:37:34,199
rollout containers

776
00:37:34,199 --> 00:37:38,800
that are damaged the wheels are missing they're damaged and

777
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:39,639
they just

778
00:37:39,639 --> 00:37:43,320
lay it on the side so and that's just you know damage from

779
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:45,119
rolling it out to

780
00:37:45,119 --> 00:37:48,360
their compactor and unloading it doesn't even account for.

781
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:48,960
Are they metal or

782
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:52,400
plastic? They're metal. Okay but again are they and they're

783
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:53,239
going to be rolled out

784
00:37:53,239 --> 00:37:56,340
to the street for the trucks to pick up? I believe that's

785
00:37:56,340 --> 00:37:57,440
their intent. And you

786
00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:02,510
don't think they're gonna they're too big? The issue that

787
00:38:02,510 --> 00:38:03,880
we have is that if

788
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:06,849
they do roll it out well that's the primary access to the

789
00:38:06,849 --> 00:38:07,880
parking garage so

790
00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:10,460
there's gonna be a lot of traffic having to weave around

791
00:38:10,460 --> 00:38:11,400
there and you know it's

792
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:14,389
a coordination nightmare with solid waste because there

793
00:38:14,389 --> 00:38:15,440
could be instances

794
00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:18,019
where there's issues with the dumpster vehicle and they can

795
00:38:18,019 --> 00:38:19,000
't you know service

796
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:21,190
it at that time well for whatever reason or they're running

797
00:38:21,190 --> 00:38:21,960
behind schedule or

798
00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:25,690
not and then there's also potential damage to the container

799
00:38:25,690 --> 00:38:26,280
themselves and

800
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:30,539
who's liable to replace them. Is it the city or is it you

801
00:38:30,539 --> 00:38:31,280
know the management company?

802
00:38:31,280 --> 00:38:35,199
Thank you. And Commissioner Beck just to add on to that

803
00:38:35,199 --> 00:38:36,800
again this whole site

804
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:40,090
plan has been routed through the relevant department such

805
00:38:40,090 --> 00:38:40,840
as solid waste

806
00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:43,429
engineering. Earl has been kind enough to fill that

807
00:38:43,429 --> 00:38:45,039
information in but again the

808
00:38:45,039 --> 00:38:47,960
the resolution to that has to come from the solid waste

809
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:49,199
department as well so

810
00:38:49,199 --> 00:38:51,909
there are some contingencies that would have to be

811
00:38:51,909 --> 00:38:53,400
evaluated should the site

812
00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:59,239
plan move forward. Just to clarify Commissioner Beck the

813
00:38:59,239 --> 00:39:00,000
proposal is to

814
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:04,289
roll those containers to the drive aisle that's just east

815
00:39:04,289 --> 00:39:05,440
of the property not on

816
00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:10,800
to Hickory or Oak it's the drive out next to the on the

817
00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:14,159
property. Correct.

818
00:39:14,519 --> 00:39:20,389
Another consideration is the need for a 10-foot clearance

819
00:39:20,389 --> 00:39:21,800
around the entire

820
00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:26,019
building. Right now the building as it is proposed on the

821
00:39:26,019 --> 00:39:27,719
site plan sits five feet

822
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:31,480
from the property line to the west and that is something

823
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:32,440
that the fire

824
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:35,679
department needs is a 10-foot clearance. Now the fire

825
00:39:35,679 --> 00:39:36,920
department has allowed

826
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:39,989
developments occur five feet but with some sort of

827
00:39:39,989 --> 00:39:41,519
agreement by the property

828
00:39:41,519 --> 00:39:45,510
adjacent stating that they will not build up to that

829
00:39:45,510 --> 00:39:46,800
property so that again

830
00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:50,489
the purpose is to make sure that the fire department has

831
00:39:50,489 --> 00:39:51,840
adequate access to

832
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:56,300
all sides of the building and that still has not been a

833
00:39:56,300 --> 00:39:58,440
receiver obtained as of

834
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:03,260
today and that's my understanding. Commissioner Beck. Thank

835
00:40:03,260 --> 00:40:04,559
you Chair. Are

836
00:40:04,559 --> 00:40:08,280
these particular problems inherent with this particular

837
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:09,679
building its size and

838
00:40:09,679 --> 00:40:14,530
dimensions or would sub area A and B run into similar

839
00:40:14,530 --> 00:40:17,360
problems? I don't think sub

840
00:40:17,360 --> 00:40:21,559
area A I'm sorry sub area B that development had this issue

841
00:40:21,559 --> 00:40:23,679
with with the

842
00:40:23,679 --> 00:40:26,789
the property because it obviously surround and the whole

843
00:40:26,789 --> 00:40:27,639
development is

844
00:40:27,639 --> 00:40:32,960
surrounded by streets. The as far as the solid waste I

845
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:34,800
think they designed their

846
00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:37,690
development to have adequate access so that was not a

847
00:40:37,690 --> 00:40:39,119
concern or an issue at

848
00:40:39,119 --> 00:40:43,940
that time of that review of that property. So in part these

849
00:40:43,940 --> 00:40:44,599
problems are

850
00:40:44,599 --> 00:40:48,079
inherent with this design? I would say that's a fair

851
00:40:48,079 --> 00:40:53,000
assessment. Thank you. Some

852
00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:57,510
other considerations is that the the continuous amendment

853
00:40:57,510 --> 00:40:58,840
of the Fry Street

854
00:40:58,840 --> 00:41:01,900
overlay district would compromise the compatibility of

855
00:41:01,900 --> 00:41:03,960
adjacent land uses but

856
00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:06,969
also would compromise really the purpose and intent of the

857
00:41:06,969 --> 00:41:08,440
the district itself

858
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:14,710
I think it was done back in 2000 however you know we we

859
00:41:14,710 --> 00:41:16,639
recognize that there is

860
00:41:16,639 --> 00:41:20,320
change in the market but again the district was established

861
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:21,239
back then and I

862
00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:24,239
think there's some merits to keeping the purpose and intent

863
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:26,760
. The proposed amendment

864
00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:29,280
and associate development standards are not consistent with

865
00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:30,559
the Denham plan 2030

866
00:41:30,559 --> 00:41:35,130
in regards to gradual transition the scale and character of

867
00:41:35,130 --> 00:41:36,800
the area. Again

868
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:41,170
addressing potential impacts adjacent neighborhood such as

869
00:41:41,170 --> 00:41:43,239
parking or shade

870
00:41:43,239 --> 00:41:48,889
issues that may arise from the proposed development. Not

871
00:41:48,889 --> 00:41:51,039
ifications were sent out

872
00:41:51,039 --> 00:41:57,309
to property owners 200 feet and 500 feet from the overlay

873
00:41:57,309 --> 00:41:59,440
district boundary. We

874
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:02,489
felt that it was important to notify the entire overlay

875
00:42:02,489 --> 00:42:03,840
district because it does

876
00:42:03,840 --> 00:42:08,570
impact them. We sent out 51 notification through certified

877
00:42:08,570 --> 00:42:11,199
and 124 through regular

878
00:42:11,199 --> 00:42:15,590
mail. As of this afternoon we received two in favor and two

879
00:42:15,590 --> 00:42:16,800
in opposition and

880
00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:21,150
you should have copies of the responses in front of you for

881
00:42:21,150 --> 00:42:23,239
consideration. Ron

882
00:42:23,239 --> 00:42:27,000
could I stop you? Will you go back one slide on the where

883
00:42:27,000 --> 00:42:28,480
this is not

884
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:32,199
consistent with Denham 2030? Yes sir. Do we have any

885
00:42:32,199 --> 00:42:33,920
specifics of where it's not

886
00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:39,400
consistent with 2030? Well the maintaining of the character

887
00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:39,679
of the

888
00:42:39,679 --> 00:42:43,119
area I think there's language in the Denham plan 2030 that

889
00:42:43,119 --> 00:42:43,519
talks about

890
00:42:43,519 --> 00:42:47,960
compatibility of an area and this area is actually

891
00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:50,159
designated as the neighborhood

892
00:42:50,159 --> 00:42:54,889
and university compatibility area and it calls out for

893
00:42:54,889 --> 00:42:57,420
certain guidelines to to

894
00:42:57,420 --> 00:43:00,849
make sure that the area is compatible with the surrounding

895
00:43:00,849 --> 00:43:01,800
areas and I felt

896
00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:05,429
that this was a little bit over what the compatibility

897
00:43:05,429 --> 00:43:07,360
should be for a project

898
00:43:07,360 --> 00:43:12,750
in this area. Okay well let me follow up a little more then

899
00:43:12,750 --> 00:43:14,760
. Area B is in place

900
00:43:14,760 --> 00:43:20,840
prior to 2030 being adopted. Correct. I mean this is it's

901
00:43:20,840 --> 00:43:21,840
not exactly the same

902
00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:24,730
but it's very similar we're talking a few feet height

903
00:43:24,730 --> 00:43:26,000
differences and maybe

904
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:30,730
some other things on parking percentages so if it's okay in

905
00:43:30,730 --> 00:43:32,599
sub area B and we

906
00:43:32,599 --> 00:43:36,539
have that in place and we do 2030 why is this such a

907
00:43:36,539 --> 00:43:38,519
difference or what is

908
00:43:38,519 --> 00:43:42,500
the main difference between this and B that makes it such a

909
00:43:42,500 --> 00:43:43,960
no longer consistent

910
00:43:43,960 --> 00:43:47,360
with Denham plan 2030? Well that that youth center is just

911
00:43:47,360 --> 00:43:48,559
one development

912
00:43:48,559 --> 00:43:52,889
obviously that was approved and recommended approval for

913
00:43:52,889 --> 00:43:53,300
that

914
00:43:53,300 --> 00:43:55,900
development occur. We also have to look at the other areas

915
00:43:55,900 --> 00:43:57,519
around there. Now the

916
00:43:57,519 --> 00:44:01,949
difference between the two one is four stories this is five

917
00:44:01,949 --> 00:44:03,719
stories you know

918
00:44:03,719 --> 00:44:07,900
the parking that they have there is one to one this is not

919
00:44:07,900 --> 00:44:09,760
so there's some

920
00:44:09,760 --> 00:44:12,599
differences may not be significant but there's enough

921
00:44:12,599 --> 00:44:13,800
significance that warrants

922
00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:18,260
the difference between the two is significant to not meet

923
00:44:18,260 --> 00:44:18,920
the character of

924
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:26,079
the area. Okay thank you. Yes I'm sorry Commissioner Rosse

925
00:44:26,079 --> 00:44:27,360
au. I think I have

926
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:31,090
several questions and I hope I get them all straight so

927
00:44:31,090 --> 00:44:32,679
forgive me if I don't

928
00:44:32,679 --> 00:44:40,760
but a couple things part of this proposal includes area

929
00:44:40,760 --> 00:44:42,239
outside the

930
00:44:42,239 --> 00:44:46,960
Fry Street overlay district correct? Does that correct? Yes

931
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:49,119
to the north. Are we able to

932
00:44:49,119 --> 00:44:52,849
what's the implications of something outside the district

933
00:44:52,849 --> 00:44:54,159
overlay being part

934
00:44:54,159 --> 00:44:56,530
of a sub area of that district overlay? Are we now

935
00:44:56,530 --> 00:44:57,719
including that in the district?

936
00:44:57,719 --> 00:45:04,159
No the the the overlay district itself has built in a

937
00:45:04,159 --> 00:45:05,559
requirement or a

938
00:45:05,559 --> 00:45:09,889
standard that allows for additional parking to be off site

939
00:45:09,889 --> 00:45:11,239
of the project and

940
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:13,800
it has to be within a thousand feet so it meets that

941
00:45:13,800 --> 00:45:14,920
requirement so any

942
00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:18,070
additional parking could be located outside the subject

943
00:45:18,070 --> 00:45:19,119
area. Okay.

944
00:45:19,119 --> 00:45:25,500
Why was it not included in the notification map? Should

945
00:45:25,500 --> 00:45:26,119
that off-site

946
00:45:26,119 --> 00:45:29,340
parking should the neighbors of that not be told that that

947
00:45:29,340 --> 00:45:31,519
could be parking? Well

948
00:45:31,519 --> 00:45:34,940
they well they're they're kind of but you're again we're

949
00:45:34,940 --> 00:45:36,199
looking at the overlay

950
00:45:36,199 --> 00:45:38,980
we're mending the overlay district and again any

951
00:45:38,980 --> 00:45:40,760
development within the overlay

952
00:45:40,760 --> 00:45:44,280
district if they were required parking spaces and they

953
00:45:44,280 --> 00:45:45,199
needed additional

954
00:45:45,199 --> 00:45:48,409
parking spaces they can get parking spaces again as far as

955
00:45:48,409 --> 00:45:49,519
a thousand feet

956
00:45:49,519 --> 00:45:53,440
from that subject parcel. So if they did move it a thousand

957
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:55,719
feet away that

958
00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:59,800
surrounding area the 200 feet around that parking spot

959
00:45:59,800 --> 00:46:01,360
would not be notified

960
00:46:01,360 --> 00:46:07,570
within this proposal? Correct. They all we're all we're

961
00:46:07,570 --> 00:46:09,079
trying to do is what's

962
00:46:09,079 --> 00:46:12,230
being proposed that is is an amendment to the overlay

963
00:46:12,230 --> 00:46:13,519
district and what's

964
00:46:13,519 --> 00:46:16,760
required of this area here and again in the overlay

965
00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:18,559
district there is language

966
00:46:18,559 --> 00:46:22,079
that speaks to that additional parking spaces can be from

967
00:46:22,079 --> 00:46:23,400
any property as long

968
00:46:23,400 --> 00:46:26,400
as it's within a thousand feet of that subject project.

969
00:46:26,400 --> 00:46:28,719
Okay I understand

970
00:46:28,719 --> 00:46:31,239
you're saying that it doesn't resonate with me necessarily

971
00:46:31,239 --> 00:46:32,199
that the notification

972
00:46:32,199 --> 00:46:35,420
map doesn't get bumped out a little bit for land being

973
00:46:35,420 --> 00:46:37,519
changed. Right let me try

974
00:46:37,519 --> 00:46:40,650
and address that that's because the overlay district the

975
00:46:40,650 --> 00:46:41,679
Fry Street overlay

976
00:46:41,679 --> 00:46:44,900
district is a zoning category in itself. Okay. The parking

977
00:46:44,900 --> 00:46:46,119
the proposed off-site

978
00:46:46,119 --> 00:46:50,969
parking that is shown or reflected the additional 36 wrong

979
00:46:50,969 --> 00:46:52,559
spaces. 36 yes. That

980
00:46:52,559 --> 00:46:55,800
the one the use is permitted off-site regardless so there's

981
00:46:55,800 --> 00:46:56,639
no issue with that

982
00:46:56,639 --> 00:46:59,750
there is no change to the boundary of that zoning district

983
00:46:59,750 --> 00:47:00,559
of the overlay

984
00:47:00,559 --> 00:47:03,550
district so let's use an example where there wasn't an

985
00:47:03,550 --> 00:47:05,159
overlay district and an

986
00:47:05,159 --> 00:47:08,780
applicant came in to change a zoning on a property and the

987
00:47:08,780 --> 00:47:09,960
zoning was permitted

988
00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:12,630
but they also needed X amount of parking and they located

989
00:47:12,630 --> 00:47:13,760
an off-site if that

990
00:47:13,760 --> 00:47:16,840
off-site parking area was permitted by the existing zoning

991
00:47:16,840 --> 00:47:18,079
district it wouldn't

992
00:47:18,079 --> 00:47:21,280
warrant any type of notification. I got you thank you and

993
00:47:21,280 --> 00:47:23,639
then separately from

994
00:47:23,639 --> 00:47:28,280
this can you go back to the proposed ratio of parking that

995
00:47:28,280 --> 00:47:29,079
they're wanting to

996
00:47:29,079 --> 00:47:36,289
amend to or proposed to. This bottom right bottom row here?

997
00:47:36,289 --> 00:47:38,239
Yes that's 76 so

998
00:47:38,239 --> 00:47:41,699
this is a good slide because on their narrative they

999
00:47:41,699 --> 00:47:43,320
identify two main

1000
00:47:43,320 --> 00:47:47,579
components but the city has nine changes and so it seems

1001
00:47:47,579 --> 00:47:49,079
like they simplified it

1002
00:47:49,079 --> 00:47:52,530
to two main components but the two main components say that

1003
00:47:52,530 --> 00:47:53,360
they're wanting to

1004
00:47:53,360 --> 00:47:55,960
increase the permitted height to 58 feet which is not what

1005
00:47:55,960 --> 00:47:57,239
's up here and it says

1006
00:47:57,239 --> 00:48:00,030
they want to reduce their off-site parking or the required

1007
00:48:00,030 --> 00:48:00,679
off-street

1008
00:48:00,679 --> 00:48:06,119
parking to 0.84% which is not right here so can where's the

1009
00:48:06,119 --> 00:48:09,840
discrepancy between these two reports? That and they'll

1010
00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:11,119
probably be able to

1011
00:48:11,119 --> 00:48:13,800
answer that during the public hearing the the submittal

1012
00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:15,960
changed obviously with

1013
00:48:15,960 --> 00:48:21,400
with the the addition of the 36 parking spaces and they

1014
00:48:21,400 --> 00:48:22,679
happen to upload

1015
00:48:22,679 --> 00:48:26,199
probably the same narrative that may be the reason why you

1016
00:48:26,199 --> 00:48:26,840
have that

1017
00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:31,260
discrepancy but the actual code amendment that they supply

1018
00:48:31,260 --> 00:48:31,760
and that we

1019
00:48:31,760 --> 00:48:34,809
reviewed is reflected in this slide here and that's what's

1020
00:48:34,809 --> 00:48:35,960
being proposed. So they

1021
00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:38,460
just submitted the same narrative? That's something maybe

1022
00:48:38,460 --> 00:48:39,400
we can clarify but

1023
00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:42,559
that's okay that could be the case. Okay thank you.

1024
00:48:42,559 --> 00:48:44,639
Commissioner Sullivan back to

1025
00:48:44,639 --> 00:48:49,840
the parking it appears that Bryan and Oak Street there's

1026
00:48:49,840 --> 00:48:50,719
already a parking lot

1027
00:48:50,719 --> 00:48:54,070
there correct is that you understand that is correct that

1028
00:48:54,070 --> 00:48:54,679
is so they're just

1029
00:48:54,679 --> 00:48:57,780
going to be buying using leasing whatever is that parking

1030
00:48:57,780 --> 00:48:58,519
space that's

1031
00:48:58,519 --> 00:49:01,480
already there? They've actually yes I've checked the

1032
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:05,639
then Parasol district and the property owner that owns that

1033
00:49:05,639 --> 00:49:06,280
sub the sub

1034
00:49:06,280 --> 00:49:09,239
property also owns that property. Okay so Mr. Roselle's

1035
00:49:09,239 --> 00:49:11,000
point probably why they

1036
00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:13,440
didn't need to have the notification is that it's already

1037
00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:15,480
parking lot. Does that make sense?

1038
00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:20,119
That's part of it yes. But as Manal mentioned you know it's

1039
00:49:20,119 --> 00:49:21,559
a

1040
00:49:21,559 --> 00:49:25,219
requirement not a requirement but rather an opportunity to

1041
00:49:25,219 --> 00:49:26,239
to look at additional

1042
00:49:26,239 --> 00:49:30,760
parking it can be as far as a thousand feet. Okay just

1043
00:49:30,760 --> 00:49:31,760
wanted to clarify that. Commissioner Ellis.

1044
00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:35,820
Thank you chair okay so the additional parking lot is a

1045
00:49:35,820 --> 00:49:37,719
parking lot now used

1046
00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:42,389
for whom? My understanding it's used by Fortman's bookstore

1047
00:49:42,389 --> 00:49:42,800
that's my

1048
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:45,099
understanding we can certainly clarify that with the

1049
00:49:45,099 --> 00:49:46,199
applicant. Right because

1050
00:49:46,199 --> 00:49:48,510
if we're taking away a parking lot and dedicating it to

1051
00:49:48,510 --> 00:49:49,519
this development then

1052
00:49:49,519 --> 00:49:52,269
we're taking away parking right we're actually not adding

1053
00:49:52,269 --> 00:49:54,000
parking. Right well

1054
00:49:54,000 --> 00:49:58,000
yes I mean it's it's it's parking now and it's being used

1055
00:49:58,000 --> 00:49:59,119
by Fortman employees

1056
00:49:59,119 --> 00:50:02,429
is my understanding and that would then be again part of

1057
00:50:02,429 --> 00:50:03,719
the parking lot. It's only

1058
00:50:03,719 --> 00:50:06,960
being used by Fortman employees now? That's my

1059
00:50:06,960 --> 00:50:08,679
understanding there may be

1060
00:50:08,679 --> 00:50:13,750
some other users of that but we can clarify that again with

1061
00:50:13,750 --> 00:50:14,599
the applicant

1062
00:50:14,599 --> 00:50:24,429
during the public hearing. Okay thank you. So with that

1063
00:50:24,429 --> 00:50:28,199
staff's recommending denial of the

1064
00:50:28,199 --> 00:50:32,510
subject request for the following reasons again not meeting

1065
00:50:32,510 --> 00:50:32,960
the deadline

1066
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:36,980
2030 it compromises the effectiveness of the existing

1067
00:50:36,980 --> 00:50:38,440
overlay district

1068
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:42,440
compatibility with the surrounding area there are certain

1069
00:50:42,440 --> 00:50:43,519
things in their

1070
00:50:43,519 --> 00:50:47,599
proposed code amendment that is not consistent with their

1071
00:50:47,599 --> 00:50:48,800
site plan and

1072
00:50:48,800 --> 00:50:52,070
those are something that we need to address of course solid

1073
00:50:52,070 --> 00:50:52,960
waste approval

1074
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:56,280
is still pending and the boundary agreement with the

1075
00:50:56,280 --> 00:50:57,079
property owner to the

1076
00:50:57,079 --> 00:51:00,469
West has not yet been obtained and for those reasons staff

1077
00:51:00,469 --> 00:51:01,480
is recommending

1078
00:51:01,480 --> 00:51:07,750
denial of this proposed amendment. Commissioner Rossell. I

1079
00:51:07,750 --> 00:51:09,239
think this will be my last one I

1080
00:51:09,239 --> 00:51:15,039
appreciate this is more work session so yes this is more

1081
00:51:15,039 --> 00:51:15,039
this is more

1082
00:51:15,039 --> 00:51:17,969
information about the process of what happens behind the

1083
00:51:17,969 --> 00:51:19,039
scenes before it gets

1084
00:51:19,039 --> 00:51:21,780
here you've had a conversation with the applicant that you

1085
00:51:21,780 --> 00:51:22,239
are going to

1086
00:51:22,239 --> 00:51:25,480
recommend denial they knew that coming in can you talk

1087
00:51:25,480 --> 00:51:27,159
about what happens to

1088
00:51:27,159 --> 00:51:29,199
get this point where I don't make any assumptions but it

1089
00:51:29,199 --> 00:51:30,000
sounds like you sit

1090
00:51:30,000 --> 00:51:32,630
down with them you outline your issues and they make the

1091
00:51:32,630 --> 00:51:33,719
decision to go forward

1092
00:51:33,719 --> 00:51:37,500
or keep talking about that yes so we've met with the

1093
00:51:37,500 --> 00:51:39,440
applicant either face to

1094
00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:43,079
face or over the phone and have several discussions with

1095
00:51:43,079 --> 00:51:45,000
them we were just not

1096
00:51:45,000 --> 00:51:49,570
able to address everything and you know they chose to move

1097
00:51:49,570 --> 00:51:50,960
forward with the

1098
00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:54,190
application we we really wanted to you know get it to where

1099
00:51:54,190 --> 00:51:55,239
we can recommend

1100
00:51:55,239 --> 00:51:58,400
approval but we were just not able to they chose to move

1101
00:51:58,400 --> 00:51:58,960
forward with the

1102
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:05,230
application as is okay thank you I'll follow up on that I

1103
00:52:05,230 --> 00:52:06,119
know sometimes these

1104
00:52:06,119 --> 00:52:11,619
things are timing issues if this was to move forward from P

1105
00:52:11,619 --> 00:52:13,199
&Z this these issues

1106
00:52:13,199 --> 00:52:16,849
are still going to then be addressed by City Council and if

1107
00:52:16,849 --> 00:52:17,840
solid waste is

1108
00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:20,909
enabled to address them the boundary agreement is enabled

1109
00:52:20,909 --> 00:52:22,159
to be obtained it

1110
00:52:22,159 --> 00:52:25,190
doesn't really matter so what may be going on is they're

1111
00:52:25,190 --> 00:52:26,320
aware of the issues

1112
00:52:26,320 --> 00:52:28,809
and they are just in the process of still trying to get

1113
00:52:28,809 --> 00:52:30,000
those ironed out and

1114
00:52:30,000 --> 00:52:33,829
trying to keep their project on a whatever timeline self-

1115
00:52:33,829 --> 00:52:34,800
imposed or not

1116
00:52:34,800 --> 00:52:39,230
right but until these things get addressed City Council

1117
00:52:39,230 --> 00:52:40,480
more than likely

1118
00:52:40,480 --> 00:52:46,280
will not move this forward is essentially where we are at

1119
00:52:46,280 --> 00:52:46,440
this

1120
00:52:46,440 --> 00:52:49,639
particular point in time as I recall when this came before

1121
00:52:49,639 --> 00:52:50,880
us before there

1122
00:52:50,880 --> 00:52:54,230
were a lot more issues than this that were outstanding at

1123
00:52:54,230 --> 00:52:55,519
that time I think

1124
00:52:55,519 --> 00:53:00,760
there were issues with the fire lane and ladder trucks not

1125
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:01,639
being able to get in

1126
00:53:01,639 --> 00:53:05,400
there were some other issues I think the height was still

1127
00:53:05,400 --> 00:53:06,599
roughly about it was

1128
00:53:06,599 --> 00:53:09,500
yeah just to recap real quick for the commissioners that

1129
00:53:09,500 --> 00:53:10,679
weren't at the prior

1130
00:53:10,679 --> 00:53:14,840
meeting the TIA traffic impact analysis was something that

1131
00:53:14,840 --> 00:53:16,880
staff requested since

1132
00:53:16,880 --> 00:53:20,440
then they've submitted it's been reviewed and accepted by

1133
00:53:20,440 --> 00:53:21,340
engineering

1134
00:53:21,340 --> 00:53:27,519
department the fire lane separation distance that also was

1135
00:53:27,519 --> 00:53:28,159
an item that was

1136
00:53:28,159 --> 00:53:31,989
not addressed at the time of January 27th however that has

1137
00:53:31,989 --> 00:53:33,280
been addressed now

1138
00:53:33,280 --> 00:53:37,050
and they have the appropriate distance for their fire lane

1139
00:53:37,050 --> 00:53:38,239
to be placed where

1140
00:53:38,239 --> 00:53:42,690
it is so you're correct Chair strange we we've addressed

1141
00:53:42,690 --> 00:53:43,920
some but we have not

1142
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:48,199
addressed all were there a follow-up what were some of the

1143
00:53:48,199 --> 00:53:48,960
other issues seem

1144
00:53:48,960 --> 00:53:52,829
like there was a pretty good list and I think I think it

1145
00:53:52,829 --> 00:53:54,159
was the it was the

1146
00:53:54,159 --> 00:53:56,809
parking the main thing and I know traffic was the big

1147
00:53:56,809 --> 00:53:57,760
question now is a

1148
00:53:57,760 --> 00:53:59,960
big discussion during the public hearing but because we

1149
00:53:59,960 --> 00:54:01,320
didn't have a TIA we were

1150
00:54:01,320 --> 00:54:05,469
not able to address those certain concerns but we do have

1151
00:54:05,469 --> 00:54:06,440
that now and

1152
00:54:06,440 --> 00:54:10,630
obviously that's something that some answers to we can

1153
00:54:10,630 --> 00:54:12,119
certainly discuss it

1154
00:54:12,119 --> 00:54:16,510
but they do have a TIA traffic impact analysis that has

1155
00:54:16,510 --> 00:54:17,480
been accepted by a

1156
00:54:17,480 --> 00:54:21,000
city engineers do you remember what the parking was before

1157
00:54:21,000 --> 00:54:21,760
the first time it

1158
00:54:21,760 --> 00:54:26,969
came it seemed like it was even lower than this well I

1159
00:54:26,969 --> 00:54:30,920
think it was it was it

1160
00:54:30,920 --> 00:54:36,559
was 0.7 maybe it was just slightly lower by by by adding

1161
00:54:36,559 --> 00:54:37,880
the 36 it bumped it up a

1162
00:54:37,880 --> 00:54:41,440
little bit more all right okay great thank you

1163
00:54:41,440 --> 00:54:44,889
Commissioner Ellis I'm sorry thank you chair okay last one

1164
00:54:44,889 --> 00:54:46,760
I think okay so just

1165
00:54:46,760 --> 00:54:50,000
for some background this was denied last time by a

1166
00:54:50,000 --> 00:54:51,239
different Commission so I'm

1167
00:54:51,239 --> 00:54:56,780
trying to get some history here what is different with this

1168
00:54:56,780 --> 00:54:58,880
proposal today than

1169
00:54:58,880 --> 00:55:02,710
the last time that you all saw it essentially it's the

1170
00:55:02,710 --> 00:55:04,199
additional 36

1171
00:55:04,199 --> 00:55:07,219
parking spaces which is the parking lot the parking lot we

1172
00:55:07,219 --> 00:55:08,519
don't know what it's

1173
00:55:08,519 --> 00:55:11,409
currently used for that we're gonna clarify that's the

1174
00:55:11,409 --> 00:55:13,159
biggest yes yes okay

1175
00:55:13,159 --> 00:55:17,440
okay thank you I will follow up I was on the Commission at

1176
00:55:17,440 --> 00:55:18,480
that time and I voted

1177
00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:21,469
against it at that time because the TIA wasn't done the

1178
00:55:21,469 --> 00:55:22,679
issues with the fire

1179
00:55:22,679 --> 00:55:25,590
lane weren't even addressed yet and it got to be kind of

1180
00:55:25,590 --> 00:55:27,159
that snowball of there

1181
00:55:27,159 --> 00:55:30,230
are so many issues that are outstanding it kind of for me

1182
00:55:30,230 --> 00:55:31,960
broke the place of hey

1183
00:55:31,960 --> 00:55:34,849
there's a couple that probably are reasonably done these

1184
00:55:34,849 --> 00:55:35,440
are some biggies

1185
00:55:35,440 --> 00:55:38,250
and I wasn't comfortable in voting for it at that time

1186
00:55:38,250 --> 00:55:39,320
because those were some

1187
00:55:39,320 --> 00:55:41,949
big issues that I felt like should have been addressed

1188
00:55:41,949 --> 00:55:43,039
before it got to our

1189
00:55:43,039 --> 00:55:45,489
Commission so that's why I voted against it at that time I

1190
00:55:45,489 --> 00:55:47,639
don't know if I guess

1191
00:55:47,639 --> 00:55:50,269
Devin would have been here to have been nobody else is

1192
00:55:50,269 --> 00:55:51,639
gonna be able to chime in

1193
00:55:51,639 --> 00:55:57,460
here but Devin so okay great that's why I voted against it

1194
00:55:57,460 --> 00:55:59,119
just to provide some

1195
00:55:59,119 --> 00:56:01,900
clarification on the fire lane issue they are still

1196
00:56:01,900 --> 00:56:03,480
researching the ability to

1197
00:56:03,480 --> 00:56:06,289
secure an additional five feet from the adjacent property

1198
00:56:06,289 --> 00:56:08,000
correct not not for

1199
00:56:08,000 --> 00:56:14,440
the fire lane but for access and that's still under review

1200
00:56:14,440 --> 00:56:16,000
by them to by the

1201
00:56:16,000 --> 00:56:19,519
applicant to ascertain if they either secure it and provide

1202
00:56:19,519 --> 00:56:20,639
us copy so that we

1203
00:56:20,639 --> 00:56:24,199
are sure that that site plan the way it's currently

1204
00:56:24,199 --> 00:56:25,920
designed meets the fire

1205
00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:33,400
department's requirements Commissioner Alice work session

1206
00:56:33,400 --> 00:56:35,599
thank you chair there

1207
00:56:35,599 --> 00:56:39,650
was discussion I believe I remember hearing about the

1208
00:56:39,650 --> 00:56:40,960
building itself

1209
00:56:40,960 --> 00:56:46,199
Bortman's and and it being historical in some nature was

1210
00:56:46,199 --> 00:56:47,400
that ever addressed I

1211
00:56:47,400 --> 00:56:50,599
don't with anybody I don't recall that discussion with this

1212
00:56:50,599 --> 00:56:53,199
Commission okay I

1213
00:56:53,199 --> 00:56:55,570
might be making that up or it was just being talked about

1214
00:56:55,570 --> 00:56:56,360
out and out in public

1215
00:56:56,360 --> 00:57:00,130
maybe because I think it's a it's a Mount Miller build isn

1216
00:57:00,130 --> 00:57:03,599
't it it's not okay

1217
00:57:03,599 --> 00:57:06,030
we don't know we'll try and get you some info if we can

1218
00:57:06,030 --> 00:57:07,159
prior to but otherwise it

1219
00:57:07,159 --> 00:57:13,719
would have to follow the meeting correct

1220
00:57:16,800 --> 00:57:20,400
all right that's it that concludes my presentation okay any

1221
00:57:20,400 --> 00:57:21,239
other questions for

1222
00:57:21,239 --> 00:57:25,119
Ron thank you very good presentation and lots of

1223
00:57:25,119 --> 00:57:26,800
information and lots of

1224
00:57:26,800 --> 00:57:32,480
questions thank you I know we have one other item for our

1225
00:57:32,480 --> 00:57:33,320
work session it's

1226
00:57:33,320 --> 00:57:36,300
going to be to continue on notifications I think at this

1227
00:57:36,300 --> 00:57:39,159
time just in essence of

1228
00:57:39,159 --> 00:57:42,460
time that we can have as much as we need on notifications I

1229
00:57:42,460 --> 00:57:43,280
'm gonna call a

1230
00:57:43,280 --> 00:57:47,789
recess and let's go ahead and get food at 533 and then we

1231
00:57:47,789 --> 00:57:49,360
'll reconvene here and

1232
00:57:49,360 --> 00:57:55,630
here our next item which will be the notifications good

1233
00:57:55,630 --> 00:58:02,519
evening and welcome

1234
00:58:02,519 --> 00:58:07,190
back to our work session I'll call it back to order at 540

1235
00:58:07,190 --> 00:58:08,719
and I think our

1236
00:58:08,719 --> 00:58:12,690
next item is going to be to receive a report and hold

1237
00:58:12,690 --> 00:58:14,159
discussion on our

1238
00:58:14,159 --> 00:58:17,929
current notification practices and that's gonna be Cindy

1239
00:58:17,929 --> 00:58:19,179
Jackson and Ron

1240
00:58:19,179 --> 00:58:28,159
Magida thank you Commissioners as you'll recall at our last

1241
00:58:28,159 --> 00:58:31,000
meeting we held a

1242
00:58:31,000 --> 00:58:36,590
discussion regarding the proposed notification hearing

1243
00:58:36,590 --> 00:58:38,119
changes and the

1244
00:58:38,119 --> 00:58:40,340
Commission had a lot of questions and a lot of good

1245
00:58:40,340 --> 00:58:41,639
suggestions this is a

1246
00:58:41,639 --> 00:58:47,639
follow-up to that meeting to talk about the feedback that

1247
00:58:47,639 --> 00:58:50,719
we received just to

1248
00:58:50,719 --> 00:58:55,360
cut to recap currently City of Denton follows the

1249
00:58:55,360 --> 00:58:58,199
procedures of the ordinance

1250
00:58:58,199 --> 00:59:04,159
which was repealed in 2002 which require public notice of

1251
00:59:04,159 --> 00:59:04,760
the

1252
00:59:04,760 --> 00:59:07,980
scheduled public hearing in the official newspaper a legal

1253
00:59:07,980 --> 00:59:09,199
notice sent to

1254
00:59:09,199 --> 00:59:13,079
property owners within 200 feet of the site sent via

1255
00:59:13,079 --> 00:59:15,079
certified mail courtesy

1256
00:59:15,079 --> 00:59:18,510
notice of the public hearing sent to residents living

1257
00:59:18,510 --> 00:59:20,199
within 500 feet of the

1258
00:59:20,199 --> 00:59:24,639
subject site and a post notice in the form of a sign posted

1259
00:59:24,639 --> 00:59:25,880
by the city on the

1260
00:59:25,880 --> 00:59:32,090
subject property the proposed revisions that we talked

1261
00:59:32,090 --> 00:59:34,599
about were to mail out

1262
00:59:34,599 --> 00:59:40,010
public hearing notices to property owners within 200 feet

1263
00:59:40,010 --> 00:59:41,000
of the property

1264
00:59:41,000 --> 00:59:44,920
via regular mail instead of certified mail mail out

1265
00:59:44,920 --> 00:59:46,760
courtesy notices within

1266
00:59:46,760 --> 00:59:51,800
500 feet to residents within the 500 foot radius of the

1267
00:59:51,800 --> 00:59:53,800
site via postcard and

1268
00:59:53,800 --> 00:59:57,900
to track public notices and courtesy notices that are

1269
00:59:57,900 --> 01:00:00,519
returned to the city in

1270
01:00:00,519 --> 01:00:04,119
addition we were going to enlarge the sign that we post on

1271
01:00:04,119 --> 01:00:05,559
the site from 2

1272
01:00:05,559 --> 01:00:09,900
feet by 3 feet to 4 by 4 feet we are also going to require

1273
01:00:09,900 --> 01:00:11,039
the applicant to

1274
01:00:11,039 --> 01:00:15,030
purchase post maintain and remove the notification signs

1275
01:00:15,030 --> 01:00:16,400
from the site and we

1276
01:00:16,400 --> 01:00:19,860
are going to create a link on the planning division web

1277
01:00:19,860 --> 01:00:21,159
page dedicated for

1278
01:00:21,159 --> 01:00:27,599
public hearing notices questions any thank you go back to

1279
01:00:27,599 --> 01:00:28,119
me Commissioner

1280
01:00:28,119 --> 01:00:40,010
back okay so that I'm clear here the 200 foot notice and

1281
01:00:40,010 --> 01:00:42,039
the 500 foot notice both

1282
01:00:42,039 --> 01:00:46,730
of those could go to one individual the owner and the 10th

1283
01:00:46,730 --> 01:00:48,440
as well yes okay

1284
01:00:48,440 --> 01:00:51,579
because the object here is to make sure who's ever living

1285
01:00:51,579 --> 01:00:52,840
in that house gets a

1286
01:00:52,840 --> 01:00:56,440
notice on but that you couldn't duplicate it which would be

1287
01:00:56,440 --> 01:00:56,960
okay that

1288
01:00:56,960 --> 01:01:00,909
is correct if the property owner lives on the property they

1289
01:01:00,909 --> 01:01:01,599
'll get you know

1290
01:01:01,599 --> 01:01:05,039
okay good deal thank you

1291
01:01:08,440 --> 01:01:14,159
Commissioner Sullivan since it seems like other cities do

1292
01:01:14,159 --> 01:01:16,079
things different

1293
01:01:16,079 --> 01:01:20,400
and you said this was a legal issue I mean what are the

1294
01:01:20,400 --> 01:01:21,920
minimums and the

1295
01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:27,760
maximums and I guess I'm trying to decide where it says Fr

1296
01:01:27,760 --> 01:01:29,079
isco they send out

1297
01:01:29,079 --> 01:01:33,590
mail notices regular mail yes courtesy notices no do they

1298
01:01:33,590 --> 01:01:34,599
go by different law

1299
01:01:34,599 --> 01:01:39,039
is it their law or and this is our law or is there some

1300
01:01:39,039 --> 01:01:40,760
overriding state law

1301
01:01:40,760 --> 01:01:45,039
there is an overriding state law that actually dictates the

1302
01:01:45,039 --> 01:01:46,239
public hearing

1303
01:01:46,239 --> 01:01:50,719
notification process and that requires the 200 foot notice

1304
01:01:50,719 --> 01:01:51,920
sent via regular

1305
01:01:51,920 --> 01:01:56,159
mail and a legal notice put published in the newspaper

1306
01:01:56,159 --> 01:01:57,760
signs are not included

1307
01:01:57,760 --> 01:02:01,460
and courtesy notices aren't included each city then decides

1308
01:02:01,460 --> 01:02:02,239
if they want to

1309
01:02:02,239 --> 01:02:06,639
go beyond what's required so the 500 feet isn't required it

1310
01:02:06,639 --> 01:02:07,239
's just something

1311
01:02:07,239 --> 01:02:11,750
that the city of Denton does the city of Plano does that

1312
01:02:11,750 --> 01:02:14,440
and the city of Fort

1313
01:02:14,440 --> 01:02:18,360
Worth does that right right I would just want to if we were

1314
01:02:18,360 --> 01:02:19,320
following some legal

1315
01:02:19,320 --> 01:02:22,329
issue how come now other ones aren't following the same we

1316
01:02:22,329 --> 01:02:22,960
're going above

1317
01:02:22,960 --> 01:02:29,340
and beyond what's required gotcha that's all I needed okay

1318
01:02:29,340 --> 01:02:31,719
okay now we received

1319
01:02:31,719 --> 01:02:34,610
some some good feedback from the planning and zoning

1320
01:02:34,610 --> 01:02:35,679
Commission both at

1321
01:02:35,679 --> 01:02:39,960
the meeting and via email subsequent to the meeting I'm

1322
01:02:39,960 --> 01:02:40,880
going to go through these

1323
01:02:40,880 --> 01:02:45,000
one by one the next few slides will cover these suggestions

1324
01:02:45,000 --> 01:02:46,320
the first one is

1325
01:02:46,320 --> 01:02:49,579
to provide a self-addressed stamped envelope with the 20

1326
01:02:49,579 --> 01:02:51,079
for 200 foot mailing

1327
01:02:51,079 --> 01:02:59,199
notice now it's possible to send a envelope a return

1328
01:02:59,199 --> 01:03:00,599
envelope right now via

1329
01:03:00,599 --> 01:03:07,400
our mail service however we cannot have it stamped if that

1330
01:03:07,400 --> 01:03:09,000
's not possible right

1331
01:03:09,000 --> 01:03:13,289
now the the city's mailing service click to net to mail has

1332
01:03:13,289 --> 01:03:14,280
it has indicated

1333
01:03:14,280 --> 01:03:16,929
they are working on that they hope to provide that service

1334
01:03:16,929 --> 01:03:17,599
in the future

1335
01:03:17,599 --> 01:03:25,300
however we don't have that available right now the create a

1336
01:03:25,300 --> 01:03:28,039
link on the city

1337
01:03:28,039 --> 01:03:30,760
of Denton home page to the planning division web page

1338
01:03:30,760 --> 01:03:31,880
dedicated to public

1339
01:03:31,880 --> 01:03:34,840
hearing notices now we've been working with the public

1340
01:03:34,840 --> 01:03:36,000
communications office

1341
01:03:36,000 --> 01:03:38,889
and they have indicated to us that they are in the process

1342
01:03:38,889 --> 01:03:39,920
of redesigning the

1343
01:03:39,920 --> 01:03:44,460
city's website they have told us that the city's website

1344
01:03:44,460 --> 01:03:45,480
the home page of the

1345
01:03:45,480 --> 01:03:48,920
city's website will only be utilized for announcements

1346
01:03:48,920 --> 01:03:50,119
there's going to be no

1347
01:03:50,119 --> 01:03:54,380
links on it to to link to other pages at this time from my

1348
01:03:54,380 --> 01:03:57,119
understanding so what

1349
01:03:57,119 --> 01:04:00,550
they suggested that we place the link to the notices on the

1350
01:04:00,550 --> 01:04:01,840
planning divisions

1351
01:04:01,840 --> 01:04:07,230
home page instead and that would link directly to the

1352
01:04:07,230 --> 01:04:10,280
public hearing page we're

1353
01:04:10,280 --> 01:04:13,090
going to keep working with with the public communications

1354
01:04:13,090 --> 01:04:13,760
office or PCO

1355
01:04:13,760 --> 01:04:17,469
office however to to see what we can do about increasing

1356
01:04:17,469 --> 01:04:18,480
the visibility of that

1357
01:04:18,480 --> 01:04:24,530
that site commissioner Ellis thank you chair question

1358
01:04:24,530 --> 01:04:26,039
regarding though the new

1359
01:04:26,039 --> 01:04:29,980
website are you I noticed the agenda for the committee on

1360
01:04:29,980 --> 01:04:31,920
citizen engagement came

1361
01:04:31,920 --> 01:04:35,639
up in the website is on that are you attending that meeting

1362
01:04:35,639 --> 01:04:36,639
I actually I was

1363
01:04:36,639 --> 01:04:39,750
not aware of that meeting but now that I'm aware of it I

1364
01:04:39,750 --> 01:04:41,239
will I will make the

1365
01:04:41,239 --> 01:04:46,090
point to attend that thank you I'll look into that thank

1366
01:04:46,090 --> 01:04:46,960
you

1367
01:04:49,039 --> 01:04:52,420
another suggestion was to include City Council notice on on

1368
01:04:52,420 --> 01:04:54,000
the same web page

1369
01:04:54,000 --> 01:04:56,889
as the planning and zoning Commission public hearings and

1370
01:04:56,889 --> 01:04:57,960
that's not that's no

1371
01:04:57,960 --> 01:05:01,429
problem we can easily put them both on to all active

1372
01:05:01,429 --> 01:05:03,000
notices for PNC and City

1373
01:05:03,000 --> 01:05:07,039
Council onto a public notice page

1374
01:05:09,519 --> 01:05:12,230
another one was to start an email notification list by

1375
01:05:12,230 --> 01:05:14,000
neighborhood for

1376
01:05:14,000 --> 01:05:16,900
residents to sign up for notifications of activity in their

1377
01:05:16,900 --> 01:05:18,199
neighborhood we

1378
01:05:18,199 --> 01:05:21,239
looked at this and determined that the creation and

1379
01:05:21,239 --> 01:05:22,920
maintenance of this kind of

1380
01:05:22,920 --> 01:05:26,929
proposed list it would take up a great deal of staff time

1381
01:05:26,929 --> 01:05:28,159
and wouldn't be

1382
01:05:28,159 --> 01:05:31,880
possible because of that additional time would also be

1383
01:05:31,880 --> 01:05:33,119
needed to generate an

1384
01:05:33,119 --> 01:05:37,360
email for each individual request received by the city

1385
01:05:37,360 --> 01:05:37,920
development

1386
01:05:37,920 --> 01:05:44,019
request the proposal to create a public notice page on our

1387
01:05:44,019 --> 01:05:46,400
on the planning

1388
01:05:46,400 --> 01:05:50,400
department's website is actually a more efficient way to

1389
01:05:50,400 --> 01:05:51,920
have all of the notices

1390
01:05:51,920 --> 01:05:55,119
in one place easily visible and interested citizens can

1391
01:05:55,119 --> 01:05:55,960
just click on

1392
01:05:55,960 --> 01:05:58,420
that and see if there's anything happening in their

1393
01:05:58,420 --> 01:06:02,280
neighborhood that way

1394
01:06:03,800 --> 01:06:08,619
utilize electronic text alerts well we have been working

1395
01:06:08,619 --> 01:06:10,440
with PCO or public

1396
01:06:10,440 --> 01:06:13,889
communications office on this too and currently the city

1397
01:06:13,889 --> 01:06:15,039
does not have this

1398
01:06:15,039 --> 01:06:19,030
this kind of technology available we have asked them to

1399
01:06:19,030 --> 01:06:20,380
research it and we

1400
01:06:20,380 --> 01:06:23,690
will consider continue to discuss this with the PCO and see

1401
01:06:23,690 --> 01:06:24,760
what we need to do

1402
01:06:24,760 --> 01:06:30,510
in order to develop this feature commissioner back thank

1403
01:06:30,510 --> 01:06:31,239
you chair this

1404
01:06:31,239 --> 01:06:38,039
would relate to the sign on the property

1405
01:06:38,039 --> 01:06:43,719
number that's correct okay thanks the use of postcards for

1406
01:06:43,719 --> 01:06:44,760
both the 200 and

1407
01:06:44,760 --> 01:06:49,309
500 foot mailing using the template from the mail service I

1408
01:06:49,309 --> 01:06:50,519
would prepared a

1409
01:06:50,519 --> 01:06:55,190
mock-up of the 200 foot notice as a postcard and the letter

1410
01:06:55,190 --> 01:06:56,639
notice cost the

1411
01:06:56,639 --> 01:07:00,510
city 242 to mail out and the postcard with a perforated

1412
01:07:00,510 --> 01:07:01,679
reply card would cost

1413
01:07:01,679 --> 01:07:07,000
227 which be a savings of approximately 15 cents here you

1414
01:07:07,000 --> 01:07:09,119
can see a standard

1415
01:07:09,119 --> 01:07:18,679
notification letter for comparison

1416
01:07:23,519 --> 01:07:25,820
and here you can see how it would look before we put it

1417
01:07:25,820 --> 01:07:27,639
together this is why I

1418
01:07:27,639 --> 01:07:31,659
made a mock-up looking like this it doesn't really it's not

1419
01:07:31,659 --> 01:07:32,840
too impressive

1420
01:07:32,840 --> 01:07:36,400
and this is a standard courtesy notice that we mail to

1421
01:07:36,400 --> 01:07:38,400
residents within 500

1422
01:07:38,400 --> 01:07:41,519
feet of the subject site we actually received a courtesy

1423
01:07:41,519 --> 01:07:42,760
notice from the city

1424
01:07:42,760 --> 01:07:47,269
of Fort Worth so we were using that as an example of a post

1425
01:07:47,269 --> 01:07:47,760
card

1426
01:07:47,760 --> 01:07:52,260
notification and then here's our standard courtesy notice

1427
01:07:52,260 --> 01:07:53,760
notification so you can see the differences

1428
01:07:53,760 --> 01:07:59,710
again the letter notice cost the city 242 to mail out and

1429
01:07:59,710 --> 01:08:03,159
the postcard

1430
01:08:07,480 --> 01:08:11,530
I'm sorry I don't have that let me look that up standard

1431
01:08:11,530 --> 01:08:15,719
postcard is 227 as well

1432
01:08:17,800 --> 01:08:24,819
okay based on the comments at the last meeting regarding

1433
01:08:24,819 --> 01:08:26,560
how we would track the

1434
01:08:26,560 --> 01:08:29,220
posting of the signs and who would be responsible for

1435
01:08:29,220 --> 01:08:30,319
paying for the signs I

1436
01:08:30,319 --> 01:08:33,020
went ahead and and I contacted the cities that I had

1437
01:08:33,020 --> 01:08:34,680
researched previously to find

1438
01:08:34,680 --> 01:08:41,050
out how they did that and Fort Worth of course they have

1439
01:08:41,050 --> 01:08:42,199
and didn't we we

1440
01:08:42,199 --> 01:08:44,680
actually have put out the signs ourselves we don't have the

1441
01:08:44,680 --> 01:08:45,039
applicants

1442
01:08:45,039 --> 01:08:49,399
put out the signs Frisco requires his date stamped

1443
01:08:49,399 --> 01:08:51,239
photograph be submitted and

1444
01:08:51,239 --> 01:08:57,189
it can be submitted via either email or fax or it can be

1445
01:08:57,189 --> 01:08:59,119
brought in by the

1446
01:08:59,119 --> 01:09:04,409
applicant individually the signs are all purchased by the

1447
01:09:04,409 --> 01:09:07,000
applicant Lewisville

1448
01:09:07,000 --> 01:09:10,520
excuse me requires a date stamp photograph submitted

1449
01:09:10,520 --> 01:09:11,600
actually all of

1450
01:09:11,600 --> 01:09:16,010
them requires date stamp photograph submitted either via

1451
01:09:16,010 --> 01:09:21,520
email via via fax

1452
01:09:21,520 --> 01:09:26,760
via in person bringing it in as well as the sign affidavit

1453
01:09:26,760 --> 01:09:27,640
really the only

1454
01:09:27,640 --> 01:09:32,600
difference would be Plano Plano requires the applicant to

1455
01:09:32,600 --> 01:09:34,079
actually post the sign

1456
01:09:34,079 --> 01:09:37,899
28 days before the public hearing so the applicant

1457
01:09:37,899 --> 01:09:40,479
purchases the sign and posts

1458
01:09:40,479 --> 01:09:44,789
it and then brings in the affidavit and the photograph with

1459
01:09:44,789 --> 01:09:45,560
their their zoning

1460
01:09:45,560 --> 01:09:47,770
application so it's actually posted before they've even

1461
01:09:47,770 --> 01:09:48,479
submitted their

1462
01:09:48,479 --> 01:09:55,699
application typically with regards to who posted signs the

1463
01:09:55,699 --> 01:09:57,880
applicant will have a

1464
01:09:57,880 --> 01:10:01,819
choice of either having the sign made and posting it

1465
01:10:01,819 --> 01:10:03,840
themselves or having the

1466
01:10:03,840 --> 01:10:06,020
sign company post the sign that sign company will offer

1467
01:10:06,020 --> 01:10:06,680
that service of

1468
01:10:06,680 --> 01:10:12,380
installing the sign as well these are some examples of sign

1469
01:10:12,380 --> 01:10:13,319
specification

1470
01:10:13,319 --> 01:10:17,300
sheets from other cities the city of Denton of course we

1471
01:10:17,300 --> 01:10:18,600
will prepare the

1472
01:10:18,600 --> 01:10:23,510
same type of specifications sheet once we've determined the

1473
01:10:23,510 --> 01:10:25,479
new sign design

1474
01:10:25,479 --> 01:10:31,430
and the size it will be included along with a list of sign

1475
01:10:31,430 --> 01:10:32,840
contractors that

1476
01:10:32,840 --> 01:10:36,039
they can't the applicant can go to to have the sign

1477
01:10:36,039 --> 01:10:38,479
actually manufactured I

1478
01:10:38,479 --> 01:10:42,939
put these two on to point out to you that if you look right

1479
01:10:42,939 --> 01:10:44,119
here it actually

1480
01:10:44,119 --> 01:10:47,680
these two actually require a double-sided sign and they

1481
01:10:47,680 --> 01:10:48,560
post the sign

1482
01:10:48,560 --> 01:10:51,569
perpendicular to the street that makes it easier for people

1483
01:10:51,569 --> 01:10:52,520
who are driving by

1484
01:10:52,520 --> 01:10:57,289
to see the sign rather than having the sign parallel to the

1485
01:10:57,289 --> 01:11:03,319
street some of the

1486
01:11:03,319 --> 01:11:07,369
cities I saw actually did not require this being posted

1487
01:11:07,369 --> 01:11:08,840
perpendicular they

1488
01:11:08,840 --> 01:11:13,350
just wanted it visible from the street that was their

1489
01:11:13,350 --> 01:11:16,960
criteria well that

1490
01:11:16,960 --> 01:11:20,460
concludes my presentation we will be moving this forward to

1491
01:11:20,460 --> 01:11:21,399
City Council in

1492
01:11:21,399 --> 01:11:26,600
the near future and I'll answer any questions you have

1493
01:11:26,600 --> 01:11:28,560
Commissioner back

1494
01:11:28,560 --> 01:11:35,779
that postcard for the 200 foot notice did it have postage

1495
01:11:35,779 --> 01:11:37,880
on it it would it

1496
01:11:37,880 --> 01:11:41,199
would okay so that's not a problem with the postcard that

1497
01:11:41,199 --> 01:11:42,600
that that the top part

1498
01:11:42,600 --> 01:11:45,680
of that would be the reply and it would be a postage page

1499
01:11:45,680 --> 01:11:46,800
page the business

1500
01:11:46,800 --> 01:11:50,050
reply postcard but we have problems putting a self-add

1501
01:11:50,050 --> 01:11:51,479
ressed stamped envelope

1502
01:11:51,479 --> 01:11:56,720
in notices well because of the fact that the mail service

1503
01:11:56,720 --> 01:11:57,640
that we use they don't

1504
01:11:57,640 --> 01:12:00,449
provide that service right now okay they hope to in the

1505
01:12:00,449 --> 01:12:01,760
future and they're

1506
01:12:01,760 --> 01:12:07,560
working on it but it's not provided right now okay the

1507
01:12:07,560 --> 01:12:09,159
signs right now the

1508
01:12:09,159 --> 01:12:13,029
city of Denton is putting the signs up this we are okay do

1509
01:12:13,029 --> 01:12:15,479
we have any idea what

1510
01:12:15,479 --> 01:12:19,640
developers cost what kind of costs they will incur at this

1511
01:12:19,640 --> 01:12:21,399
time we have not gone

1512
01:12:21,399 --> 01:12:24,380
to the point of actually calling sign companies in the city

1513
01:12:24,380 --> 01:12:25,199
to find out how

1514
01:12:25,199 --> 01:12:28,199
much they would cost we're first going to need to develop

1515
01:12:28,199 --> 01:12:29,199
the specs for the

1516
01:12:29,199 --> 01:12:33,479
sign exactly and to get a good idea of what they would cost

1517
01:12:33,479 --> 01:12:35,840
okay thank you

1518
01:12:35,840 --> 01:12:40,439
Commissioner Hatchbeth thank you chair yeah no I'm

1519
01:12:40,439 --> 01:12:42,840
perfectly fine more than

1520
01:12:42,840 --> 01:12:46,729
fine just me I don't know if we need to kick it around but

1521
01:12:46,729 --> 01:12:48,119
there's no need to

1522
01:12:48,119 --> 01:12:53,979
ever add a self-addressed stamp the just the losses on a

1523
01:12:53,979 --> 01:12:56,079
stamp that would never

1524
01:12:56,079 --> 01:13:00,819
be used are monumental I mean it just I mean not to say

1525
01:13:00,819 --> 01:13:02,199
that someone wouldn't

1526
01:13:02,199 --> 01:13:07,119
get used not to say that someone wouldn't appreciate the

1527
01:13:07,119 --> 01:13:08,479
the the effort

1528
01:13:08,479 --> 01:13:14,140
right but the bad outweighs the good in that so I'm I'm I'm

1529
01:13:14,140 --> 01:13:15,279
happy with and I

1530
01:13:15,279 --> 01:13:19,710
think you'll see an increase in response with the postcard

1531
01:13:19,710 --> 01:13:21,520
just because you see

1532
01:13:21,520 --> 01:13:23,609
what it is you don't you know you you kind of it

1533
01:13:23,609 --> 01:13:25,000
automatically engages you

1534
01:13:25,000 --> 01:13:29,659
versus I see it's from the city and I just toss it or you

1535
01:13:29,659 --> 01:13:30,800
know that that sort

1536
01:13:30,800 --> 01:13:34,939
of thing so I think it'll immediately at least get some

1537
01:13:34,939 --> 01:13:36,819
extra attention this way

1538
01:13:36,819 --> 01:13:39,720
so that's our hope very well done thank you thank you

1539
01:13:39,720 --> 01:13:44,930
Commissioner Sullivan the regarding the postage on the on

1540
01:13:44,930 --> 01:13:46,479
the postcard this is

1541
01:13:46,479 --> 01:13:49,489
only paid if they send it back that's correct and I'm

1542
01:13:49,489 --> 01:13:50,159
assuming that'd be the

1543
01:13:50,159 --> 01:13:53,250
same thing with the envelope that would only be paid if

1544
01:13:53,250 --> 01:13:54,760
that yes what they're

1545
01:13:54,760 --> 01:13:57,220
developing is the same kind of system where it would be

1546
01:13:57,220 --> 01:13:59,039
business reply post its

1547
01:13:59,039 --> 01:14:03,810
page only if they respond and send it back well having gone

1548
01:14:03,810 --> 01:14:04,239
to a public

1549
01:14:04,239 --> 01:14:08,890
meeting today out at the the ranch there was a lot of talk

1550
01:14:08,890 --> 01:14:10,479
about the the notices

1551
01:14:10,479 --> 01:14:14,939
and I think most people were very upset over having go to

1552
01:14:14,939 --> 01:14:16,680
the post office to get

1553
01:14:16,680 --> 01:14:19,569
their certified mail only to find out that they still didn

1554
01:14:19,569 --> 01:14:20,439
't know what was

1555
01:14:20,439 --> 01:14:24,869
going on so I think the postcards if we can eliminate the

1556
01:14:24,869 --> 01:14:26,199
certified mail and

1557
01:14:26,199 --> 01:14:29,489
just do everything postcard I think that would be a great

1558
01:14:29,489 --> 01:14:31,680
help for people just to

1559
01:14:31,680 --> 01:14:35,069
at least get the notice my other question is is there a

1560
01:14:35,069 --> 01:14:37,119
time limit where

1561
01:14:37,119 --> 01:14:40,510
information is available to see what's going on because

1562
01:14:40,510 --> 01:14:41,720
that's you know that's

1563
01:14:41,720 --> 01:14:45,510
really that was my frustration when I got my notice is that

1564
01:14:45,510 --> 01:14:46,760
I couldn't go to

1565
01:14:46,760 --> 01:14:50,579
the website to see exactly what was going on right and so

1566
01:14:50,579 --> 01:14:52,520
you know having it

1567
01:14:52,520 --> 01:14:57,720
available after Friday 5 o'clock for the meeting Wednesday

1568
01:14:57,720 --> 01:14:59,100
really is not much

1569
01:14:59,100 --> 01:15:03,109
time for a person to find out more about sure this hearing

1570
01:15:03,109 --> 01:15:05,119
is all about what one

1571
01:15:05,119 --> 01:15:08,399
option would be what most people do is they call the city

1572
01:15:08,399 --> 01:15:09,720
if they get a nose

1573
01:15:09,720 --> 01:15:12,840
they call the city if they don't understand what what is in

1574
01:15:12,840 --> 01:15:13,880
their letter

1575
01:15:13,880 --> 01:15:17,310
they just call the city and talk to the project manager and

1576
01:15:17,310 --> 01:15:18,439
the project managers

1577
01:15:18,439 --> 01:15:21,680
more than happy to tell them what the request is wouldn't

1578
01:15:21,680 --> 01:15:22,680
be more efficient

1579
01:15:22,680 --> 01:15:27,409
though to put all that on the website earlier than the

1580
01:15:27,409 --> 01:15:28,800
Friday after five o'clock

1581
01:15:28,800 --> 01:15:34,680
before the meeting well typically that that is when the the

1582
01:15:34,680 --> 01:15:35,760
staff reports are

1583
01:15:35,760 --> 01:15:40,100
ready they're not ready before that time it could be if

1584
01:15:40,100 --> 01:15:43,880
somebody said now shout

1585
01:15:43,880 --> 01:15:47,670
and I'm just wondering you know is there other than that's

1586
01:15:47,670 --> 01:15:48,840
just the way it's

1587
01:15:48,840 --> 01:15:52,819
always been done but because people I think want more

1588
01:15:52,819 --> 01:15:54,079
information than just

1589
01:15:54,079 --> 01:15:57,909
what you know what they get in this obviously you can't go

1590
01:15:57,909 --> 01:15:58,600
into much detail

1591
01:15:58,600 --> 01:16:03,529
and so I'm just curious to give people more time to look at

1592
01:16:03,529 --> 01:16:05,079
what it is that's

1593
01:16:05,079 --> 01:16:10,880
being proposed just curious thank you

1594
01:16:12,920 --> 01:16:19,560
Commissioner Roselle sorry got you a couple questions I

1595
01:16:19,560 --> 01:16:20,840
think maybe to be

1596
01:16:20,840 --> 01:16:25,000
helpful for me to better understand the purpose of the

1597
01:16:25,000 --> 01:16:26,699
notification at a high

1598
01:16:26,699 --> 01:16:31,869
level is it to notify the public or is it to get a response

1599
01:16:31,869 --> 01:16:32,920
of how they feel

1600
01:16:32,920 --> 01:16:39,500
about the change there is a we do want them to respond yay

1601
01:16:39,500 --> 01:16:40,560
or nay that is an

1602
01:16:40,560 --> 01:16:44,640
intense of the notice actually they and and according to

1603
01:16:44,640 --> 01:16:46,760
the the state law the

1604
01:16:46,760 --> 01:16:51,630
response has to be in writing so that it can be calculated

1605
01:16:51,630 --> 01:16:52,920
so that is why we

1606
01:16:52,920 --> 01:16:58,220
provide a return notification for them to fill out and send

1607
01:16:58,220 --> 01:16:59,840
back to a stating

1608
01:16:59,840 --> 01:17:05,399
yes I'm for it yes I'm no I'm not for it and why sure legal

1609
01:17:05,399 --> 01:17:06,279
purpose for that is

1610
01:17:06,279 --> 01:17:10,789
because if 20% or more of Jack that it requires super enjoy

1611
01:17:10,789 --> 01:17:11,199
perfect that's

1612
01:17:11,199 --> 01:17:14,859
helpful so I have a couple more questions the legal notice

1613
01:17:14,859 --> 01:17:15,279
that has to be

1614
01:17:15,279 --> 01:17:19,390
sent to the 200 obviously it's legally demanded or required

1615
01:17:19,390 --> 01:17:22,239
of us within that

1616
01:17:22,239 --> 01:17:27,359
requirement it does not say it has to be certified it just

1617
01:17:27,359 --> 01:17:28,359
says that we notice

1618
01:17:28,359 --> 01:17:31,760
there's not any further it actually says via regular mail

1619
01:17:31,760 --> 01:17:32,760
dropped in a post off

1620
01:17:32,760 --> 01:17:36,439
in the post the mailbox okay that's the minimum requirement

1621
01:17:36,439 --> 01:17:37,479
there okay perfect

1622
01:17:37,479 --> 01:17:42,840
other thing that Fort Worth postcard has a cue card reader

1623
01:17:42,840 --> 01:17:43,479
on the front do you

1624
01:17:43,479 --> 01:17:48,340
know where that goes to no I don't I tried to scan it and

1625
01:17:48,340 --> 01:17:49,479
it didn't nothing

1626
01:17:49,479 --> 01:17:54,210
came up so great that makes perfect I was curious if there

1627
01:17:54,210 --> 01:17:54,640
's like a website

1628
01:17:54,640 --> 01:17:57,159
that that actually scans to it's that's actually not a bad

1629
01:17:57,159 --> 01:17:58,039
idea that they're

1630
01:17:58,039 --> 01:18:02,079
putting on there third along with information gathering

1631
01:18:02,079 --> 01:18:03,119
Facebook's free

1632
01:18:03,119 --> 01:18:06,449
and we talked about the last time but they didn't come up

1633
01:18:06,449 --> 01:18:07,680
here why there's not

1634
01:18:07,680 --> 01:18:10,029
a dent in planning and zoning Facebook and when we post on

1635
01:18:10,029 --> 01:18:11,000
the website you

1636
01:18:11,000 --> 01:18:13,890
know that automatically pushed to Facebook or that person

1637
01:18:13,890 --> 01:18:14,739
logs in and puts

1638
01:18:14,739 --> 01:18:16,960
a notice on Facebook people can subscribe to see it on the

1639
01:18:16,960 --> 01:18:17,520
timeline they

1640
01:18:17,520 --> 01:18:19,829
could prioritize it on the timeline they would actually

1641
01:18:19,829 --> 01:18:20,720
have the empowerment

1642
01:18:20,720 --> 01:18:24,630
apart from neighborhood newsletters or anything like that

1643
01:18:24,630 --> 01:18:25,880
which is a time for

1644
01:18:25,880 --> 01:18:29,560
the staff and a cost it seems like Facebook is a low-h

1645
01:18:29,560 --> 01:18:30,600
anging fruit in terms

1646
01:18:30,600 --> 01:18:32,930
of notifications there are some Facebook groups out there

1647
01:18:32,930 --> 01:18:33,840
that that do very well

1648
01:18:33,840 --> 01:18:37,439
and I know one particular Commissioner on this Commission

1649
01:18:37,439 --> 01:18:38,600
tries to push that

1650
01:18:38,600 --> 01:18:41,819
information out there but there could be a centralized

1651
01:18:41,819 --> 01:18:43,880
planning zoning page that

1652
01:18:43,880 --> 01:18:47,699
people could like and so I'm in favor of of the effort that

1653
01:18:47,699 --> 01:18:49,039
that might take to

1654
01:18:49,039 --> 01:18:53,640
start lastly and I brought this up last time not me last

1655
01:18:53,640 --> 01:18:54,520
time but the first time

1656
01:18:54,520 --> 01:18:59,130
this came up in terms of postcard verse letters I find post

1657
01:18:59,130 --> 01:19:00,279
cards to be super

1658
01:19:00,279 --> 01:19:05,260
convenient I think a lot of us do however I have intimate

1659
01:19:05,260 --> 01:19:05,920
knowledge my

1660
01:19:05,920 --> 01:19:08,810
brother owns a company that sends out tens of thousands of

1661
01:19:08,810 --> 01:19:09,760
mailers across the

1662
01:19:09,760 --> 01:19:13,279
state of Texas throughout the year and he's done a be

1663
01:19:13,279 --> 01:19:14,720
testing on postcard

1664
01:19:14,720 --> 01:19:17,970
responses verse letter responses and there is such a

1665
01:19:17,970 --> 01:19:19,359
massive significant

1666
01:19:19,359 --> 01:19:22,319
difference on the number of responses he gets from sending

1667
01:19:22,319 --> 01:19:23,399
a letter out verse a

1668
01:19:23,399 --> 01:19:27,800
postcard and so if the intent is to get a response and if I

1669
01:19:27,800 --> 01:19:29,359
could look into his

1670
01:19:29,359 --> 01:19:32,250
data and bring it to y'all it the response comes from a

1671
01:19:32,250 --> 01:19:33,119
letter there's a

1672
01:19:33,119 --> 01:19:36,060
there's a buy-in to opening or taking off the little

1673
01:19:36,060 --> 01:19:37,600
sticker that encloses it

1674
01:19:37,600 --> 01:19:40,409
there's there's some sort of perceived okay I'm committed

1675
01:19:40,409 --> 01:19:41,439
to figuring out what

1676
01:19:41,439 --> 01:19:44,609
this is and once they're in there it seems like there's a

1677
01:19:44,609 --> 01:19:45,439
mental process to

1678
01:19:45,439 --> 01:19:48,170
continue that step where postcard is flip it over throw it

1679
01:19:48,170 --> 01:19:49,439
away and so as

1680
01:19:49,439 --> 01:19:52,600
much as a postcard is convenient it allows for that

1681
01:19:52,600 --> 01:19:55,239
business reply which is

1682
01:19:55,239 --> 01:19:59,949
is great I'm still hesitant if the intent as stated is to

1683
01:19:59,949 --> 01:20:01,720
get a response is

1684
01:20:01,720 --> 01:20:04,090
if there's if there's been research to know what would

1685
01:20:04,090 --> 01:20:05,319
better get as a response

1686
01:20:05,319 --> 01:20:07,800
and I'm not sure if the staff's looked into that there has

1687
01:20:07,800 --> 01:20:08,720
to be without with

1688
01:20:08,720 --> 01:20:11,199
the number of mailers that go out politically or otherwise

1689
01:20:11,199 --> 01:20:11,800
there's got to

1690
01:20:11,800 --> 01:20:15,399
be research out there for conversion rates from letters to

1691
01:20:15,399 --> 01:20:16,680
postcards and so

1692
01:20:16,680 --> 01:20:19,069
I'd be interested in seeing that to make a the best

1693
01:20:19,069 --> 01:20:20,840
intellectual decisions about

1694
01:20:20,840 --> 01:20:23,390
what would be more effective in getting their response

1695
01:20:23,390 --> 01:20:24,520
because I agree I want

1696
01:20:24,520 --> 01:20:26,880
the response day or nades it's helpful for our discussions

1697
01:20:26,880 --> 01:20:28,359
and if a postcard is

1698
01:20:28,359 --> 01:20:31,880
not the best way of doing that that I wouldn't be in favor

1699
01:20:31,880 --> 01:20:32,739
of it if we know

1700
01:20:32,739 --> 01:20:38,689
that it's not gonna yield good responses. Sure, thank you.

1701
01:20:38,689 --> 01:20:40,319
Commissioner Beck. Thank

1702
01:20:40,319 --> 01:20:44,289
you chair. Chicken or egg question here. What is the

1703
01:20:44,289 --> 01:20:45,479
individual out there in the

1704
01:20:45,479 --> 01:20:49,659
community see first the sign or the notice? That's really

1705
01:20:49,659 --> 01:20:51,220
hard to say we get

1706
01:20:51,220 --> 01:20:55,670
calls on all of them. Well I guess what's the intent do we

1707
01:20:55,670 --> 01:20:57,000
try and get the sign up

1708
01:20:57,000 --> 01:20:59,449
before they get their notices? They get they usually get

1709
01:20:59,449 --> 01:21:00,319
posted around the same

1710
01:21:00,319 --> 01:21:04,340
the sign gets posted a few days after the notice goes out

1711
01:21:04,340 --> 01:21:05,880
so that they're

1712
01:21:05,880 --> 01:21:10,439
received hopefully at the same time the sign goes out. Well

1713
01:21:10,439 --> 01:21:10,960
I'm wondering

1714
01:21:10,960 --> 01:21:15,050
if it wouldn't in part answer our address Commissioner Rose

1715
01:21:15,050 --> 01:21:16,239
ll's concern

1716
01:21:16,239 --> 01:21:21,109
about if the sign went up early enough then the homeowners

1717
01:21:21,109 --> 01:21:21,760
would be in

1718
01:21:21,760 --> 01:21:24,720
anticipation of some kind of mailing from the city and

1719
01:21:24,720 --> 01:21:26,399
would be less inclined to throw it away.

1720
01:21:26,399 --> 01:21:43,010
Sure. Okay. Commissioner Ellis. Thank you chair.

1721
01:21:43,010 --> 01:21:44,680
Commissioner Rosell I just wanted

1722
01:21:44,680 --> 01:21:48,750
to ask you if what kind of what was the data that your

1723
01:21:48,750 --> 01:21:50,720
brother had I mean what

1724
01:21:50,720 --> 01:21:57,920
kind of mailers was it marketing or? Yeah I mean solicited

1725
01:21:57,920 --> 01:21:58,800
marketing mailers

1726
01:21:58,800 --> 01:22:03,079
and he's done closed envelope with a loose leaf inside he's

1727
01:22:03,079 --> 01:22:03,920
done brochures

1728
01:22:03,920 --> 01:22:06,760
double tabbed where the address is printed right on the

1729
01:22:06,760 --> 01:22:07,800
actual collateral

1730
01:22:07,800 --> 01:22:12,189
and he's also done postcards and measured conversion rates

1731
01:22:12,189 --> 01:22:13,000
from that

1732
01:22:13,000 --> 01:22:17,319
solicited material. So I guess my my question is we're

1733
01:22:17,319 --> 01:22:19,000
trying to get things

1734
01:22:19,000 --> 01:22:23,659
noticed so I'm wondering to me a postcard is more

1735
01:22:23,659 --> 01:22:26,000
noticeable in the mail

1736
01:22:26,000 --> 01:22:28,250
especially with that Fort Worth one where it's kind of

1737
01:22:28,250 --> 01:22:29,399
printed on that so I

1738
01:22:29,399 --> 01:22:34,130
don't know you know I don't know how that data interprets

1739
01:22:34,130 --> 01:22:35,399
to a public notice.

1740
01:22:35,399 --> 01:22:39,600
I don't know either I think a postcard is definitely easier

1741
01:22:39,600 --> 01:22:40,279
to be noticed I

1742
01:22:40,279 --> 01:22:44,039
think more eyes would see that but if part of the intent is

1743
01:22:44,039 --> 01:22:44,640
to actually get a

1744
01:22:44,640 --> 01:22:49,409
response from what I've learned and read postcards aren't

1745
01:22:49,409 --> 01:22:50,800
the best avenue to get

1746
01:22:50,800 --> 01:22:53,699
a response so that's why I was asking the question about

1747
01:22:53,699 --> 01:22:54,920
notice versus response.

1748
01:22:54,920 --> 01:23:00,470
A postcard is very easy to throw away. Yeah I suppose that

1749
01:23:00,470 --> 01:23:01,520
's true.

1750
01:23:04,199 --> 01:23:09,880
Commissioner Sullivan. I'm curious about the main issue

1751
01:23:09,880 --> 01:23:10,720
being getting a

1752
01:23:10,720 --> 01:23:15,279
response. Yes. Because what we currently get what I got

1753
01:23:15,279 --> 01:23:16,720
there's nothing to

1754
01:23:16,720 --> 01:23:21,979
respond to. What you had was a courtesy notice. If you look

1755
01:23:21,979 --> 01:23:22,699
at what we've got

1756
01:23:22,699 --> 01:23:27,560
what I handed out there is you got a courtesy notice and

1757
01:23:27,560 --> 01:23:28,319
you got the

1758
01:23:28,319 --> 01:23:32,119
regular 200 foot required notice. The 200 foot required

1759
01:23:32,119 --> 01:23:33,100
notice does have a

1760
01:23:33,100 --> 01:23:39,880
response sheet on it. Okay but if we don't know what it's

1761
01:23:39,880 --> 01:23:41,760
about how are

1762
01:23:41,760 --> 01:23:44,659
people going to respond? I get back to the same thing. That

1763
01:23:44,659 --> 01:23:46,079
's when they call the city.

1764
01:23:46,079 --> 01:23:50,680
The information and not just the notice but the real

1765
01:23:50,680 --> 01:23:52,720
information. Yeah. Even with

1766
01:23:52,720 --> 01:23:56,069
something like this where you have a map that you really

1767
01:23:56,069 --> 01:23:57,279
can't read. Mm-hmm.

1768
01:23:57,279 --> 01:24:01,359
Spend more less time on a map and more time on verbiage.

1769
01:24:01,359 --> 01:24:02,880
Right and see and you

1770
01:24:02,880 --> 01:24:06,640
with the postcards we don't have room for a map so it's all

1771
01:24:06,640 --> 01:24:08,079
verbiage. Well I did

1772
01:24:08,079 --> 01:24:12,739
notice on the Fort Worth they said the side in request 15

1773
01:24:12,739 --> 01:24:14,159
800 block of double

1774
01:24:14,159 --> 01:24:17,399
eagle boulevard variants to model home within 300 feet of

1775
01:24:17,399 --> 01:24:18,640
occupied residents.

1776
01:24:18,640 --> 01:24:22,539
Mm-hmm. I've got an idea what that's about. Right. But we

1777
01:24:22,539 --> 01:24:23,439
don't even have that

1778
01:24:23,439 --> 01:24:26,670
kind of a description. It can be something real specific

1779
01:24:26,670 --> 01:24:29,000
and very short just to let

1780
01:24:29,000 --> 01:24:31,689
people know what's going on so they know whether or not to

1781
01:24:31,689 --> 01:24:33,720
be concerned. Right and we try

1782
01:24:33,720 --> 01:24:38,539
to be as specific as we can. It's just sometimes people

1783
01:24:38,539 --> 01:24:39,920
just don't understand

1784
01:24:39,920 --> 01:24:44,340
what we're trying to say. I understand. Okay thank you. I

1785
01:24:44,340 --> 01:24:45,760
may have missed this in the

1786
01:24:45,760 --> 01:24:48,720
presentation. Are we taking a step back from the certified

1787
01:24:48,720 --> 01:24:49,600
mailers to just

1788
01:24:49,600 --> 01:24:52,159
regular mail now? Is that correct? Yes. That's what our

1789
01:24:52,159 --> 01:24:53,359
proposal is. The

1790
01:24:53,359 --> 01:24:56,319
certified if I remember I were six something dollars a

1791
01:24:56,319 --> 01:24:58,560
piece. You were five

1792
01:24:58,560 --> 01:25:02,720
seventy-seven. Okay so I'm on six and we're gonna be down

1793
01:25:02,720 --> 01:25:04,319
around 242.

1794
01:25:04,319 --> 01:25:21,680
Yeah. Any other questions? Thank you.

1795
01:25:28,680 --> 01:25:32,729
Okay that's our last item on our work session. So at this

1796
01:25:32,729 --> 01:25:36,520
time unless we have

1797
01:25:36,520 --> 01:25:41,609
any other questions or any other housekeeping I'm going to

1798
01:25:41,609 --> 01:25:42,920
close our work

1799
01:25:42,920 --> 01:25:48,140
session at 6 0 7 and we'll reconvene in council chambers at

1800
01:25:48,140 --> 01:25:50,479
6 30. Thank you.

1801
01:25:59,279 --> 01:26:01,250
Good evening and welcome to the City of Denton Planning and

1802
01:26:01,250 --> 01:26:04,800
Zoning Commission

1803
01:26:04,800 --> 01:26:09,180
meeting for October the 26th. This meeting has been duly

1804
01:26:09,180 --> 01:26:10,359
posted and we do

1805
01:26:10,359 --> 01:26:13,920
have a quorum present and I will call our meeting to order

1806
01:26:13,920 --> 01:26:15,680
at 6 32. Our first

1807
01:26:15,680 --> 01:26:18,020
order of business will be to stand and give the pledge to

1808
01:26:18,020 --> 01:26:18,920
the US and the Texas

1809
01:26:18,920 --> 01:26:21,159
flag.

1810
01:26:28,560 --> 01:26:31,560
[Pledge of Allegiance]

1811
01:26:59,119 --> 01:26:59,119
The next item on our agenda this evening will be to

1812
01:26:59,119 --> 01:27:06,560
consider our minutes of a

1813
01:27:06,560 --> 01:27:06,560
meeting for October the 12th. The chair will entertain a

1814
01:27:06,560 --> 01:27:12,319
motion.

1815
01:27:15,880 --> 01:27:15,880
Commissioner Rizel. I move to accept the minutes.

1816
01:27:15,880 --> 01:27:22,199
Commissioner Beck. Okay. The first

1817
01:27:22,199 --> 01:27:27,810
and a second any discussion? Seeing none we'll call for a

1818
01:27:27,810 --> 01:27:30,840
vote on the board.

1819
01:27:42,479 --> 01:27:49,340
Motion carries 6 to 0. Next item on our agenda will be our

1820
01:27:49,340 --> 01:27:51,520
consent agenda.

1821
01:27:54,000 --> 01:27:58,460
Commissioner Beck. I move we approve consent. Okay.

1822
01:27:58,460 --> 01:27:59,560
Commissioner Hudspeth.

1823
01:27:59,560 --> 01:28:03,720
Second. Okay. We have a first and a second for approval.

1824
01:28:03,720 --> 01:28:09,079
Any discussion? Seeing

1825
01:28:09,079 --> 01:28:16,340
none we'll call for a vote on the board. That motion

1826
01:28:16,340 --> 01:28:24,399
carries 6 to 0. That will

1827
01:28:24,399 --> 01:28:27,760
take us to our public hearing section this evening. As a

1828
01:28:27,760 --> 01:28:28,920
point of order

1829
01:28:28,920 --> 01:28:31,390
because of the number of cards that we have this evening we

1830
01:28:31,390 --> 01:28:32,199
are going to make

1831
01:28:32,199 --> 01:28:34,500
or the chair is going to make a change in order and we're

1832
01:28:34,500 --> 01:28:35,640
going to hear item B

1833
01:28:35,640 --> 01:28:41,109
first. That is going to be so I'm going to open the public

1834
01:28:41,109 --> 01:28:42,000
hearing for item B

1835
01:28:42,000 --> 01:28:48,369
which will be AESA 16-0002 and I will call on Mike Bell for

1836
01:28:48,369 --> 01:28:49,880
that presentation.

1837
01:28:49,880 --> 01:28:53,479
Thank you chair, members of the Commission. This request is

1838
01:28:53,479 --> 01:28:53,920
for an

1839
01:28:53,920 --> 01:28:57,239
alternative environmentally sensitive area plan for the

1840
01:28:57,239 --> 01:28:58,479
Ryan Meadows edition

1841
01:28:58,479 --> 01:29:03,390
phase 2. In a nutshell there is a roadway Creekdale Drive

1842
01:29:03,390 --> 01:29:04,760
that is on the city of

1843
01:29:04,760 --> 01:29:07,770
Denton mobility plan that the developers is required to

1844
01:29:07,770 --> 01:29:09,279
construct and that roadway

1845
01:29:09,279 --> 01:29:12,460
cuts across some environmentally sensitive areas about a

1846
01:29:12,460 --> 01:29:13,279
little less than

1847
01:29:13,279 --> 01:29:17,880
half an acre. There is no exemption for our mobility plan

1848
01:29:17,880 --> 01:29:19,279
roadways from our ESA

1849
01:29:19,279 --> 01:29:21,840
regulations therefore that's why this plan is required.

1850
01:29:21,840 --> 01:29:24,199
They are proposing some

1851
01:29:24,199 --> 01:29:27,399
mitigation to plan additional 25 trees just outside the

1852
01:29:27,399 --> 01:29:28,600
boundaries of the ESA

1853
01:29:28,600 --> 01:29:33,029
to mitigate for for that disturbance. Staff does recommend

1854
01:29:33,029 --> 01:29:33,640
approval with

1855
01:29:33,640 --> 01:29:38,119
conditions 1 through 3 that the limit that the disturbance

1856
01:29:38,119 --> 01:29:38,720
shall not exceed

1857
01:29:38,720 --> 01:29:41,770
0.45 acres and shall be consistent with the alternative ESA

1858
01:29:41,770 --> 01:29:43,720
plan. That 25 trees

1859
01:29:43,720 --> 01:29:47,689
shall be planted 3 inch diameters at planting and then all

1860
01:29:47,689 --> 01:29:48,520
areas disturbed

1861
01:29:48,520 --> 01:29:51,409
shall be re-vegetated using native plants. With that I'll

1862
01:29:51,409 --> 01:29:52,039
be happy to answer

1863
01:29:52,039 --> 01:29:54,520
any questions.

1864
01:29:55,000 --> 01:30:03,140
Any questions for staff? Thank you Mike. I have one card on

1865
01:30:03,140 --> 01:30:05,319
this item Thomas

1866
01:30:05,319 --> 01:30:11,199
Fletcher speaking in support. Good evening my name is

1867
01:30:11,199 --> 01:30:13,000
Thomas Fletcher 5750

1868
01:30:13,000 --> 01:30:17,680
Genesis Court Frisco Texas 75034. I'm the engineer for the

1869
01:30:17,680 --> 01:30:18,479
applicant and

1870
01:30:18,479 --> 01:30:22,039
really just here to answer any questions if there are any.

1871
01:30:22,039 --> 01:30:23,760
As Mike has pointed out

1872
01:30:23,760 --> 01:30:27,399
the the request is for the construction of Creekdale Drive

1873
01:30:27,399 --> 01:30:28,239
which is on the

1874
01:30:28,239 --> 01:30:31,840
mobility plan. As part of that we've gone through and done

1875
01:30:31,840 --> 01:30:33,399
engineering plans to

1876
01:30:33,399 --> 01:30:36,079
look at the disturbances in order to calculate that.

1877
01:30:36,079 --> 01:30:37,239
Because there's

1878
01:30:37,239 --> 01:30:42,520
undeveloped floodplain we've also gone through the drainage

1879
01:30:42,520 --> 01:30:43,199
analysis.

1880
01:30:43,199 --> 01:30:46,220
We've done a flood study on the project. We've also done a

1881
01:30:46,220 --> 01:30:47,239
clomer conditional

1882
01:30:47,239 --> 01:30:50,880
letter of map revision that has also been approved by FEMA.

1883
01:30:50,880 --> 01:30:52,279
So just give you

1884
01:30:52,279 --> 01:30:55,189
some additional background and would be glad to answer any

1885
01:30:55,189 --> 01:30:56,319
questions on behalf of

1886
01:30:56,319 --> 01:31:03,630
the owner. I've got a question for you. You may or may not

1887
01:31:03,630 --> 01:31:04,359
have been in our work

1888
01:31:04,359 --> 01:31:07,279
session there was a little discussion about some of the ESA

1889
01:31:07,279 --> 01:31:07,920
requirements

1890
01:31:07,920 --> 01:31:11,439
because this road is required at part of mobility plan.

1891
01:31:11,439 --> 01:31:13,680
Just for my own purposes

1892
01:31:13,680 --> 01:31:16,550
as we look at this a little bit deeper in some future work

1893
01:31:16,550 --> 01:31:17,640
sessions can you

1894
01:31:17,640 --> 01:31:21,319
give me an idea how much time and cost y'all have spent

1895
01:31:21,319 --> 01:31:22,260
dealing with this

1896
01:31:22,260 --> 01:31:26,720
particular issue and what the 25 trees and the native

1897
01:31:26,720 --> 01:31:28,239
planting and all those

1898
01:31:28,239 --> 01:31:32,600
things just a ballpark. So the the 25 trees you're probably

1899
01:31:32,600 --> 01:31:33,479
looking at with a

1900
01:31:33,479 --> 01:31:36,470
three-inch tree probably five to six hundred dollars a

1901
01:31:36,470 --> 01:31:37,760
piece installed so

1902
01:31:37,760 --> 01:31:40,430
you're looking at probably twelve to fifteen thousand

1903
01:31:40,430 --> 01:31:41,720
dollars for the trees.

1904
01:31:41,720 --> 01:31:45,399
As part of the city's requirement we have to go through and

1905
01:31:45,399 --> 01:31:46,000
do an ESA

1906
01:31:46,000 --> 01:31:49,680
assessment assessment anyway. So whether we had to come

1907
01:31:49,680 --> 01:31:51,840
before you with a with an

1908
01:31:51,840 --> 01:31:55,720
alternate ESA plan or not we we had to go through that

1909
01:31:55,720 --> 01:31:57,600
process. Through the

1910
01:31:57,600 --> 01:32:01,069
process of making the submittal and so forth I think we've

1911
01:32:01,069 --> 01:32:02,359
been working with the

1912
01:32:02,359 --> 01:32:06,250
city city staff for probably the last three months just

1913
01:32:06,250 --> 01:32:07,479
kind of going through

1914
01:32:07,479 --> 01:32:11,369
going through the assessment kind of looking at the impacts

1915
01:32:11,369 --> 01:32:12,119
and how the

1916
01:32:12,119 --> 01:32:16,180
impacts affect the ESA with the road the design of the road

1917
01:32:16,180 --> 01:32:17,680
how it impacts or how

1918
01:32:17,680 --> 01:32:21,329
it interacts with the clomer and showing that it meets the

1919
01:32:21,329 --> 01:32:22,640
clomer but as far as

1920
01:32:22,640 --> 01:32:26,270
the impacts to the development really the only additional

1921
01:32:26,270 --> 01:32:27,199
impacts because

1922
01:32:27,199 --> 01:32:31,119
since the road is a requirement everything associated with

1923
01:32:31,119 --> 01:32:31,199
the

1924
01:32:31,199 --> 01:32:34,989
construction of the road is already required by the city so

1925
01:32:34,989 --> 01:32:36,079
really looking

1926
01:32:36,079 --> 01:32:39,720
at maybe an additional fifteen thousand dollars for the

1927
01:32:39,720 --> 01:32:40,920
additional plantings in

1928
01:32:40,920 --> 01:32:45,159
the open space. Plus the time. Plus the time correct. How

1929
01:32:45,159 --> 01:32:46,199
much is the engineering

1930
01:32:46,199 --> 01:32:49,850
time approximately for the alternate ESA if you didn't have

1931
01:32:49,850 --> 01:32:50,840
to deal with that

1932
01:32:50,840 --> 01:32:55,659
issue? For the alternate ESA I would say that are you

1933
01:32:55,659 --> 01:32:57,399
asking as far as hours or

1934
01:32:57,399 --> 01:33:01,279
fees or dollars? Dollars I mean I would say it's under a

1935
01:33:01,279 --> 01:33:03,039
ten thousand dollar fee

1936
01:33:03,039 --> 01:33:05,539
expense. So somewhere twenty twenty five thousand dollars

1937
01:33:05,539 --> 01:33:06,159
for this particular

1938
01:33:06,159 --> 01:33:09,600
issue on this project. That's correct. Great that's correct

1939
01:33:09,600 --> 01:33:10,439
. Thank you. Any other

1940
01:33:10,439 --> 01:33:15,260
questions for the applicant? Thank you. Appreciate it.

1941
01:33:15,260 --> 01:33:16,880
Again this is a public

1942
01:33:16,880 --> 01:33:19,920
hearing so anyone who would like to speak on this item

1943
01:33:19,920 --> 01:33:21,039
please come forward

1944
01:33:21,039 --> 01:33:27,750
at this time and give your name and address. Seeing none we

1945
01:33:27,750 --> 01:33:29,760
will close the

1946
01:33:29,760 --> 01:33:34,039
public hearing on this item and open the floor for

1947
01:33:34,039 --> 01:33:36,119
discussion or a motion.

1948
01:33:36,800 --> 01:33:42,439
Commissioner Hudspeth. I move approval with the three

1949
01:33:42,439 --> 01:33:44,119
bullets that staff

1950
01:33:44,119 --> 01:33:49,789
identified as requirements. Okay. Commissioner Beck. I

1951
01:33:49,789 --> 01:33:52,359
second. Okay. We have a

1952
01:33:52,359 --> 01:33:54,880
first and second for approval with the three conditions

1953
01:33:54,880 --> 01:33:56,000
that are in our backup

1954
01:33:56,000 --> 01:34:02,380
as part of this project. Any other discussion or comments?

1955
01:34:02,380 --> 01:34:05,479
Seeing none I'll

1956
01:34:05,479 --> 01:34:08,600
call for a vote on the board.

1957
01:34:15,840 --> 01:34:25,779
Motion carries six to zero. We will now hear item A. So I'm

1958
01:34:25,779 --> 01:34:26,680
going to open the

1959
01:34:26,680 --> 01:34:34,279
public hearing to Z16-0007 and we'll call on Ron Magida to

1960
01:34:34,279 --> 01:34:34,560
make this

1961
01:34:34,560 --> 01:34:37,119
presentation.

1962
01:34:52,279 --> 01:34:53,079
Thank you chair, members of the Commission, members of

1963
01:34:53,079 --> 01:34:56,520
staff. This item

1964
01:34:56,520 --> 01:35:00,630
brought forward to you today is a consideration for a code

1965
01:35:00,630 --> 01:35:01,640
amendment to

1966
01:35:01,640 --> 01:35:05,920
the Fry Street overlay district which is in sub chapter 357

1967
01:35:05,920 --> 01:35:07,039
of the Denton

1968
01:35:07,039 --> 01:35:11,399
Development Code. The request brought forward is to amend

1969
01:35:11,399 --> 01:35:13,319
the overlay district

1970
01:35:13,319 --> 01:35:17,880
to create a new sub area which is sub area C and associated

1971
01:35:17,880 --> 01:35:18,279
development

1972
01:35:18,279 --> 01:35:22,949
standards that go along with just that sub area. For

1973
01:35:22,949 --> 01:35:25,199
reference this is the

1974
01:35:25,199 --> 01:35:31,779
entire Fry Street overlay district outlined here in orange.

1975
01:35:31,779 --> 01:35:32,960
As you recall or

1976
01:35:32,960 --> 01:35:37,560
as you are familiar with the sub area B is an area that was

1977
01:35:37,560 --> 01:35:41,399
carved out in 2010 to

1978
01:35:41,399 --> 01:35:45,779
allow for the development of a student housing or student

1979
01:35:45,779 --> 01:35:47,479
living apartment the

1980
01:35:47,479 --> 01:35:51,250
youth center and associated commercial uses and again this

1981
01:35:51,250 --> 01:35:54,800
was approved in 2010.

1982
01:35:54,800 --> 01:35:59,470
The area here in red identifies the area that the current

1983
01:35:59,470 --> 01:36:01,479
proposal to amend the

1984
01:36:01,479 --> 01:36:05,619
Fry Street overlay district again sub area C and this is

1985
01:36:05,619 --> 01:36:06,960
the subject area

1986
01:36:06,960 --> 01:36:11,579
where this particular project will go if the code amendment

1987
01:36:11,579 --> 01:36:13,279
was to be approved. A

1988
01:36:13,279 --> 01:36:18,149
little closer look of what the area looks like currently

1989
01:36:18,149 --> 01:36:19,760
there's an

1990
01:36:19,760 --> 01:36:22,569
existing bookstore, Wortmans bookstore is located in this

1991
01:36:22,569 --> 01:36:23,960
area as well as a

1992
01:36:23,960 --> 01:36:28,829
subway restaurant and parking. The applicant is proposing

1993
01:36:28,829 --> 01:36:29,840
to construct a

1994
01:36:29,840 --> 01:36:35,159
multi-level mixed-use development five stories to be exact.

1995
01:36:35,159 --> 01:36:36,279
The area use or the

1996
01:36:36,279 --> 01:36:39,680
illustration you see here shows landscaping along both Oak

1997
01:36:39,680 --> 01:36:40,439
and Hickory

1998
01:36:40,439 --> 01:36:47,539
and associated parking spaces with this project. By way of

1999
01:36:47,539 --> 01:36:50,239
background for those

2000
01:36:50,239 --> 01:36:55,479
commissioners that work here on January 27th of this year

2001
01:36:55,479 --> 01:36:56,600
the Planning Zoning

2002
01:36:56,600 --> 01:37:00,470
Commission considered this similar project it was a prior

2003
01:37:00,470 --> 01:37:03,199
project Z1529

2004
01:37:03,199 --> 01:37:06,680
for this project. The Planning Zoning Commission at that

2005
01:37:06,680 --> 01:37:08,239
time recommended

2006
01:37:08,239 --> 01:37:14,760
denial of this request to amend the code 621. It then was

2007
01:37:14,760 --> 01:37:15,439
forwarded to City

2008
01:37:15,439 --> 01:37:19,500
Council for their consideration following that meeting. It

2009
01:37:19,500 --> 01:37:20,279
was put on the

2010
01:37:20,279 --> 01:37:24,500
agenda several times and at one point the applicant withd

2011
01:37:24,500 --> 01:37:25,600
rew the application

2012
01:37:25,600 --> 01:37:30,800
and so that application was withdrawn. On April 8th of this

2013
01:37:30,800 --> 01:37:31,520
year the

2014
01:37:31,520 --> 01:37:36,039
applicant resubmitted a new application which is Z167 which

2015
01:37:36,039 --> 01:37:36,520
is what we're

2016
01:37:36,520 --> 01:37:39,840
considering tonight. The difference between the previous

2017
01:37:39,840 --> 01:37:41,039
application and the

2018
01:37:41,039 --> 01:37:45,239
current application is an additional 36 additional parking

2019
01:37:45,239 --> 01:37:46,680
spaces which you see

2020
01:37:46,680 --> 01:37:55,159
shown here just north of the subject property. The subject

2021
01:37:55,159 --> 01:37:56,159
development the

2022
01:37:56,159 --> 01:37:58,789
five-story mixed-use development comprises of the following

2023
01:37:58,789 --> 01:37:59,720
. It mainly

2024
01:37:59,720 --> 01:38:04,000
comprises of a student living apartment which is

2025
01:38:04,000 --> 01:38:07,640
approximately 111,000

2026
01:38:07,640 --> 01:38:14,020
square feet. The rooms will be leased out individually to

2027
01:38:14,020 --> 01:38:15,920
students. The

2028
01:38:15,920 --> 01:38:22,189
development comprises of 83 dwelling units, 9 two bedrooms,

2029
01:38:22,189 --> 01:38:23,760
14 three bedrooms,

2030
01:38:23,760 --> 01:38:27,520
and 64 bedroom units. If you were to multiply that and add

2031
01:38:27,520 --> 01:38:28,279
that all together

2032
01:38:28,279 --> 01:38:33,279
that comes up to 300 bedrooms in total. The building height

2033
01:38:33,279 --> 01:38:35,039
as proposed will be

2034
01:38:35,039 --> 01:38:38,960
approximately 62.05 feet. The development also has a

2035
01:38:38,960 --> 01:38:39,840
parking garage

2036
01:38:39,840 --> 01:38:44,079
that is proposed that will be completely wrapped except for

2037
01:38:44,079 --> 01:38:45,720
an area to the west

2038
01:38:45,720 --> 01:38:51,989
which will still be able to see the parking garage. The

2039
01:38:51,989 --> 01:38:52,680
parking

2040
01:38:52,680 --> 01:38:57,699
garage has 217 spaces and the height of that parking garage

2041
01:38:57,699 --> 01:38:58,720
is approximately

2042
01:38:58,720 --> 01:39:06,640
69.2 feet. In addition to the student living apartment it

2043
01:39:06,640 --> 01:39:07,840
will also include

2044
01:39:07,840 --> 01:39:12,119
some commercial uses a retail development of approximately

2045
01:39:12,119 --> 01:39:13,079
10,766

2046
01:39:13,079 --> 01:39:17,319
square feet which will be the Vortman bookstore location.

2047
01:39:17,319 --> 01:39:19,279
In addition there is

2048
01:39:19,279 --> 01:39:23,720
a restaurant proposed of approximately 1,600. Currently Sub

2049
01:39:23,720 --> 01:39:25,520
way is the proposed

2050
01:39:25,520 --> 01:39:30,539
user however that's not been confirmed. There is also

2051
01:39:30,539 --> 01:39:32,840
parking on site five

2052
01:39:32,840 --> 01:39:36,329
parking spaces to be exact and that's just going to be just

2053
01:39:36,329 --> 01:39:37,079
east of the

2054
01:39:37,079 --> 01:39:41,250
property and again as mentioned earlier there will be an

2055
01:39:41,250 --> 01:39:42,439
additional 36 parking

2056
01:39:42,439 --> 01:39:48,710
spaces which is off-site and that's across Oak Street. The

2057
01:39:48,710 --> 01:39:50,319
table that you see

2058
01:39:50,319 --> 01:39:56,039
here is a summary of what is required in each of the zoning

2059
01:39:56,039 --> 01:39:56,920
I'm sorry each of the

2060
01:39:56,920 --> 01:40:01,739
sub areas sub area A as I'm sorry Mr. Benguita if we could

2061
01:40:01,739 --> 01:40:02,399
just pause for a

2062
01:40:02,399 --> 01:40:05,449
moment I think that we had a member here who was going to

2063
01:40:05,449 --> 01:40:06,439
recuse himself on this

2064
01:40:06,439 --> 01:40:10,130
matter due to a conflict so he'll be leaving the room while

2065
01:40:10,130 --> 01:40:11,319
we discuss this

2066
01:40:11,319 --> 01:40:15,920
and then we'll invite him back in after this item is over.

2067
01:40:15,920 --> 01:40:18,399
Thank you. This chart

2068
01:40:18,399 --> 01:40:23,069
here illustrates the requirements per the sub areas sub

2069
01:40:23,069 --> 01:40:24,560
area A as illustrated

2070
01:40:24,560 --> 01:40:27,850
earlier is everything that is not sub area B which was

2071
01:40:27,850 --> 01:40:29,760
created again in 2002

2072
01:40:29,760 --> 01:40:33,880
I'm sorry 2010. So I'm going to go through these through

2073
01:40:33,880 --> 01:40:34,920
these requirements

2074
01:40:34,920 --> 01:40:38,800
one by one. The first one is the maximum building height in

2075
01:40:38,800 --> 01:40:40,840
the current sub area

2076
01:40:40,840 --> 01:40:44,760
where this property is located the maximum height is three

2077
01:40:44,760 --> 01:40:46,520
stories 45 feet

2078
01:40:46,520 --> 01:40:53,100
they are proposing a maximum height of five stories 62.05

2079
01:40:53,100 --> 01:40:54,920
feet. The parking

2080
01:40:54,920 --> 01:41:01,189
garage in sub area A is 45 feet they are proposing a six-

2081
01:41:01,189 --> 01:41:03,680
story 69.2 feet tall

2082
01:41:03,680 --> 01:41:08,659
parking garage. Maximum density for sub area A is based on

2083
01:41:08,659 --> 01:41:09,399
the development

2084
01:41:09,399 --> 01:41:13,960
standards parking lot coverage all that that will dictate

2085
01:41:13,960 --> 01:41:15,439
the amount of dwelling

2086
01:41:15,439 --> 01:41:19,409
units per acre. The applicant is proposing that there be a

2087
01:41:19,409 --> 01:41:20,560
set amount up

2088
01:41:20,560 --> 01:41:25,250
to 86 dwelling units per acre for the proposed sub area C.

2089
01:41:25,250 --> 01:41:26,960
Parking ratio for

2090
01:41:26,960 --> 01:41:33,720
two bedrooms or more in sub area A it's one space per

2091
01:41:33,720 --> 01:41:34,800
bedroom in

2092
01:41:34,800 --> 01:41:38,859
proposed sub area C the applicant is proposing 0.76 parking

2093
01:41:38,859 --> 01:41:40,079
space per bedroom.

2094
01:41:40,079 --> 01:41:47,279
A couple other standards that are different from sub area A

2095
01:41:47,279 --> 01:41:48,199
building

2096
01:41:48,199 --> 01:41:53,720
coverage an increase up to 20% from 50 to 70 building

2097
01:41:53,720 --> 01:41:55,279
coverage for mixed use a

2098
01:41:55,279 --> 01:41:59,340
1% increase. Minimal landscape area they're requesting that

2099
01:41:59,340 --> 01:41:59,680
that be

2100
01:41:59,680 --> 01:42:04,569
decreased from 15% to 10.7 and a rear yard setback a

2101
01:42:04,569 --> 01:42:05,880
decrease from 10 foot to

2102
01:42:05,880 --> 01:42:12,960
5 foot of setback. For the benefit of the public the

2103
01:42:12,960 --> 01:42:15,520
subject parking requirements

2104
01:42:15,520 --> 01:42:19,569
as it's currently required under sub area A would require

2105
01:42:19,569 --> 01:42:20,840
that the property

2106
01:42:20,840 --> 01:42:27,720
provide 332 parking spaces that's with one space per

2107
01:42:27,720 --> 01:42:30,279
bedroom for the units that

2108
01:42:30,279 --> 01:42:33,460
have two bedrooms or more as opposed to what's currently

2109
01:42:33,460 --> 01:42:35,479
being proposed which

2110
01:42:35,479 --> 01:42:39,369
they're reducing that parking requirement or parking ratio

2111
01:42:39,369 --> 01:42:40,600
down to 0.76

2112
01:42:40,600 --> 01:42:44,989
that equates to approximately 228 parking spaces and if

2113
01:42:44,989 --> 01:42:46,239
they were to be

2114
01:42:46,239 --> 01:42:49,560
approved under the current proposal they would only be

2115
01:42:49,560 --> 01:42:51,760
required to provide 260

2116
01:42:51,760 --> 01:43:00,810
spaces a difference of 72 spaces. For your consideration

2117
01:43:00,810 --> 01:43:01,840
the following

2118
01:43:01,840 --> 01:43:06,300
development does encourage walk walking as well as biking

2119
01:43:06,300 --> 01:43:08,359
it also provides

2120
01:43:08,359 --> 01:43:12,920
extended building setbacks from Oak and Hickory as well as

2121
01:43:12,920 --> 01:43:13,960
it does provide

2122
01:43:13,960 --> 01:43:18,000
commercial uses along Hickory in the form of the retail V

2123
01:43:18,000 --> 01:43:19,560
ortman bookstore as

2124
01:43:19,560 --> 01:43:24,539
well as the restaurant which in this current state is Sub

2125
01:43:24,539 --> 01:43:26,920
way. Also other

2126
01:43:26,920 --> 01:43:30,920
consideration to consider is that the height and density

2127
01:43:30,920 --> 01:43:32,680
the development is not

2128
01:43:32,680 --> 01:43:35,890
compatible with surrounding area there are other buildings

2129
01:43:35,890 --> 01:43:37,159
in the area that are

2130
01:43:37,159 --> 01:43:42,430
much less. The Friday Street overlay district was put in

2131
01:43:42,430 --> 01:43:44,359
place and when it was

2132
01:43:44,359 --> 01:43:48,720
put in place there was an intent to relax I'm sorry to

2133
01:43:48,720 --> 01:43:50,000
provide adequate

2134
01:43:50,000 --> 01:43:53,079
parking for residents in fact the parking requirements for

2135
01:43:53,079 --> 01:43:53,760
two units or

2136
01:43:53,760 --> 01:43:57,550
more in this overlay district is much higher than any parts

2137
01:43:57,550 --> 01:43:58,439
of the others other

2138
01:43:58,439 --> 01:44:02,359
parts of the city it also relaxes parking for the retail

2139
01:44:02,359 --> 01:44:03,800
and residential

2140
01:44:03,800 --> 01:44:08,260
uses the requirements for the overlay district is less here

2141
01:44:08,260 --> 01:44:09,640
than it is for

2142
01:44:09,640 --> 01:44:14,310
other parts of the city. Other consideration the solid

2143
01:44:14,310 --> 01:44:15,399
waste requirement

2144
01:44:15,399 --> 01:44:18,550
that is required by our solid waste department is still

2145
01:44:18,550 --> 01:44:20,119
being discussed and a

2146
01:44:20,119 --> 01:44:24,789
resolution has not yet been reached. An approved agreement

2147
01:44:24,789 --> 01:44:26,119
has not been received

2148
01:44:26,119 --> 01:44:30,890
from the applicant this agreement is to ensure that there

2149
01:44:30,890 --> 01:44:32,880
is a 10-foot clearance

2150
01:44:32,880 --> 01:44:36,510
around the entire building as it is currently proposed on

2151
01:44:36,510 --> 01:44:38,039
the site plan they

2152
01:44:38,039 --> 01:44:42,949
are five feet from the property line on the west they can

2153
01:44:42,949 --> 01:44:44,779
propose that as long

2154
01:44:44,779 --> 01:44:47,890
as there's an agreement with the property owner adjacent to

2155
01:44:47,890 --> 01:44:48,760
the site if

2156
01:44:48,760 --> 01:44:51,449
they were to get that agreement then our fire department

2157
01:44:51,449 --> 01:44:52,439
would accept that but

2158
01:44:52,439 --> 01:44:57,210
again we would have to have an agreement in order to

2159
01:44:57,210 --> 01:45:00,760
confirm that. The continuous

2160
01:45:00,760 --> 01:45:04,829
amendment to the Fry Street overlay district compromises

2161
01:45:04,829 --> 01:45:05,840
the compatibility

2162
01:45:05,840 --> 01:45:09,899
of the uses around the area and also really compromises the

2163
01:45:09,899 --> 01:45:10,800
purpose and

2164
01:45:10,800 --> 01:45:15,529
intent of the district as it was first proposed or first

2165
01:45:15,529 --> 01:45:17,659
adopted. Lastly the

2166
01:45:17,659 --> 01:45:21,050
proposed amendment and associate development standards is

2167
01:45:21,050 --> 01:45:21,800
not consistent

2168
01:45:21,800 --> 01:45:25,600
with the dam plan 2030 in regards to scale character and as

2169
01:45:25,600 --> 01:45:26,479
well as the

2170
01:45:26,479 --> 01:45:31,390
potential impact to adjacent neighborhoods. Notifications

2171
01:45:31,390 --> 01:45:32,199
were sent out

2172
01:45:32,199 --> 01:45:37,520
to property owners within 200 and 500 foot there were 51

2173
01:45:37,520 --> 01:45:38,279
male certified

2174
01:45:38,279 --> 01:45:42,090
males that were sent out and 124 regular male within

2175
01:45:42,090 --> 01:45:44,319
properties within 500. We've

2176
01:45:44,319 --> 01:45:51,039
received four responses two in favor and in tune opposition

2177
01:45:51,039 --> 01:45:53,119
. With that staff is

2178
01:45:53,119 --> 01:45:56,539
recommending denial of the subject requests for the

2179
01:45:56,539 --> 01:45:58,720
following reason the

2180
01:45:58,720 --> 01:46:01,199
proposed development or proposed code amendment is not

2181
01:46:01,199 --> 01:46:02,159
consistent with the

2182
01:46:02,159 --> 01:46:05,560
dam plan 2030 it compromises the effectiveness of the

2183
01:46:05,560 --> 01:46:06,560
overlay district

2184
01:46:06,560 --> 01:46:09,729
it's not compatible with the surrounding area and the

2185
01:46:09,729 --> 01:46:11,439
development standards are

2186
01:46:11,439 --> 01:46:15,939
inconsistent with the proposed site plan. I just want to

2187
01:46:15,939 --> 01:46:17,479
state that we've been

2188
01:46:17,479 --> 01:46:21,369
working with the applicant for several months now trying to

2189
01:46:21,369 --> 01:46:22,520
get a product or a

2190
01:46:22,520 --> 01:46:26,350
code amendment that is acceptable by staff we've been

2191
01:46:26,350 --> 01:46:27,600
working on it for

2192
01:46:27,600 --> 01:46:32,720
several times we were just not able to get there and the

2193
01:46:32,720 --> 01:46:34,680
applicant chose to move

2194
01:46:34,680 --> 01:46:37,670
forward with the application as is and that's why you're

2195
01:46:37,670 --> 01:46:39,239
hearing it today. A

2196
01:46:39,239 --> 01:46:43,640
couple other reasons again our solid waste requirement has

2197
01:46:43,640 --> 01:46:45,279
not been met and a

2198
01:46:45,279 --> 01:46:49,869
pending solution is still being worked out as well as the

2199
01:46:49,869 --> 01:46:51,079
boundary adjustment

2200
01:46:51,079 --> 01:46:53,510
which I described earlier has not yet been obtained and

2201
01:46:53,510 --> 01:46:54,560
that's something that

2202
01:46:54,560 --> 01:46:59,579
we look forward to getting soon. With that that concludes

2203
01:46:59,579 --> 01:47:00,760
my presentation I

2204
01:47:00,760 --> 01:47:03,930
will be happy to answer any question that the Commission

2205
01:47:03,930 --> 01:47:05,159
may have. A couple

2206
01:47:05,159 --> 01:47:08,310
questions Commissioner Roselle. Thank you chair appreciate

2207
01:47:08,310 --> 01:47:09,439
the presentation I have

2208
01:47:09,439 --> 01:47:12,159
a couple questions you mentioned that the parking

2209
01:47:12,159 --> 01:47:13,439
requirements for the Frye

2210
01:47:13,439 --> 01:47:16,479
Street overlay district are less than other parts of the

2211
01:47:16,479 --> 01:47:17,479
city what is the

2212
01:47:17,479 --> 01:47:20,079
general parking requirement ratio for two-bedroom or more

2213
01:47:20,079 --> 01:47:20,920
apartments in the

2214
01:47:20,920 --> 01:47:26,449
city? Let me clarify that for the residential it's actually

2215
01:47:26,449 --> 01:47:27,640
more than

2216
01:47:27,640 --> 01:47:30,329
other parts of the city where it is less it's in the

2217
01:47:30,329 --> 01:47:31,840
commercial uses the retail

2218
01:47:31,840 --> 01:47:35,989
and the restaurant so for example a two-bedroom we'll go

2219
01:47:35,989 --> 01:47:36,840
back to residential

2220
01:47:36,840 --> 01:47:46,439
a two-bedroom unit would require 1.75 spaces where in this

2221
01:47:46,439 --> 01:47:47,840
is this area is

2222
01:47:47,840 --> 01:47:51,960
it's one space per bedroom. So it's already been lowered a

2223
01:47:51,960 --> 01:47:53,039
little bit almost

2224
01:47:53,039 --> 01:47:55,760
by half for this overlay already for residential? It's

2225
01:47:55,760 --> 01:47:56,800
actually I'm sorry if I

2226
01:47:56,800 --> 01:48:00,439
didn't clarify that it actually increased because the 1.75

2227
01:48:00,439 --> 01:48:01,760
is per unit

2228
01:48:01,760 --> 01:48:05,770
I didn't clarify that so a two-bedroom would be required 1.

2229
01:48:05,770 --> 01:48:07,840
75 parking spaces

2230
01:48:07,840 --> 01:48:11,119
outside the overlay but because this is in the overlay a

2231
01:48:11,119 --> 01:48:13,560
two-bedroom unit would

2232
01:48:13,560 --> 01:48:16,560
require two parking spaces so it's higher in the overlay

2233
01:48:16,560 --> 01:48:17,520
district for the

2234
01:48:17,520 --> 01:48:20,920
residential component. Perfect I appreciate the

2235
01:48:20,920 --> 01:48:22,439
clarification and then on

2236
01:48:22,439 --> 01:48:25,470
your slide that was actually providing background there is

2237
01:48:25,470 --> 01:48:26,399
a image and it was

2238
01:48:26,399 --> 01:48:30,000
entitled UNT student housing at the bottom is that an

2239
01:48:30,000 --> 01:48:31,680
official designation

2240
01:48:31,680 --> 01:48:34,199
that they have to get approved by UNT to be a student

2241
01:48:34,199 --> 01:48:36,279
housing king? I'm not sure if

2242
01:48:36,279 --> 01:48:40,329
that is intended I think that was just for either purpose

2243
01:48:40,329 --> 01:48:41,600
of putting together

2244
01:48:41,600 --> 01:48:44,989
the rendering I don't think that's something that they have

2245
01:48:44,989 --> 01:48:45,840
obtained

2246
01:48:45,840 --> 01:48:48,109
through the University but we can certainly ask the

2247
01:48:48,109 --> 01:48:49,039
applicant if that's

2248
01:48:49,039 --> 01:48:53,399
the case. Perfect thank you. Commissioner Beck. Thank you

2249
01:48:53,399 --> 01:48:53,840
chair.

2250
01:48:53,840 --> 01:49:00,359
Thanks for your presentation. There were about four items I

2251
01:49:00,359 --> 01:49:01,359
think you mentioned

2252
01:49:01,359 --> 01:49:03,989
they're still not resolved with this there was a list of

2253
01:49:03,989 --> 01:49:04,800
things back in

2254
01:49:04,800 --> 01:49:09,760
January we dealt with that hadn't been resolved then so for

2255
01:49:09,760 --> 01:49:10,439
the benefit of our

2256
01:49:10,439 --> 01:49:16,439
audience could you convey what EDR has addressed? Sure back

2257
01:49:16,439 --> 01:49:17,680
in January of this

2258
01:49:17,680 --> 01:49:21,279
year one of the things that wasn't addressed at the time

2259
01:49:21,279 --> 01:49:22,560
was the submittal

2260
01:49:22,560 --> 01:49:26,560
and review of a traffic impact analysis a TIA that has

2261
01:49:26,560 --> 01:49:28,479
since been submitted and

2262
01:49:28,479 --> 01:49:33,659
reviewed and accepted by our engineering department. The

2263
01:49:33,659 --> 01:49:35,479
other item that we

2264
01:49:35,479 --> 01:49:39,600
discussed at the January 27th meeting was the fire lane

2265
01:49:39,600 --> 01:49:41,199
separation from the

2266
01:49:41,199 --> 01:49:44,550
building the applicant was able to address that and they do

2267
01:49:44,550 --> 01:49:45,439
now meet the

2268
01:49:45,439 --> 01:49:50,170
requirements of the fire department. Thank you. Any other

2269
01:49:50,170 --> 01:49:52,880
questions for staff?

2270
01:49:52,880 --> 01:49:59,560
Thank you Ron. Got quite a few cards wishing to speak I'm

2271
01:49:59,560 --> 01:50:02,119
gonna start with

2272
01:50:02,399 --> 01:50:06,170
I'm gonna start with the applicant I have actually two

2273
01:50:06,170 --> 01:50:07,079
cards I don't know who

2274
01:50:07,079 --> 01:50:12,560
would like to go first. Thank you very much Mr. Chair

2275
01:50:12,560 --> 01:50:13,319
ladies and gentlemen my

2276
01:50:13,319 --> 01:50:17,319
name is Rob Baldwin I was at 3904 Elm Street Suite B here

2277
01:50:17,319 --> 01:50:18,800
in Dallas and I'm

2278
01:50:18,800 --> 01:50:23,000
I'm representing EDR in this in processing this application

2279
01:50:23,000 --> 01:50:23,800
. Thank you

2280
01:50:23,800 --> 01:50:26,609
very much for your time I know some of you it's deja vu

2281
01:50:26,609 --> 01:50:27,800
again because you saw

2282
01:50:27,800 --> 01:50:33,359
us here in January. There is we were back in the process

2283
01:50:33,359 --> 01:50:34,479
because we secured more

2284
01:50:34,479 --> 01:50:38,260
parking and then when we resubmitted we thought that we

2285
01:50:38,260 --> 01:50:39,880
tried to take an avenue

2286
01:50:39,880 --> 01:50:42,789
of reducing parking administratively through to the

2287
01:50:42,789 --> 01:50:44,079
planning department which

2288
01:50:44,079 --> 01:50:49,279
did not work out so we our application is about the same as

2289
01:50:49,279 --> 01:50:50,439
it was but with

2290
01:50:50,439 --> 01:50:54,359
additional parking the the heights are actually the same as

2291
01:50:54,359 --> 01:50:55,239
they were when you

2292
01:50:55,239 --> 01:50:58,909
saw in January the difference was we were in our initial

2293
01:50:58,909 --> 01:50:59,920
submittal we were

2294
01:50:59,920 --> 01:51:04,380
to talk about average grade for measuring our heights as

2295
01:51:04,380 --> 01:51:05,520
the city code

2296
01:51:05,520 --> 01:51:09,880
requires but when working through Ron Ron wanted us to add

2297
01:51:09,880 --> 01:51:11,079
the maximum height

2298
01:51:11,079 --> 01:51:13,750
that it would be from existing grade rather than average

2299
01:51:13,750 --> 01:51:14,720
grade so that's why

2300
01:51:14,720 --> 01:51:17,699
it looks like we've increased the height but we really

2301
01:51:17,699 --> 01:51:19,840
haven't. The two items that

2302
01:51:19,840 --> 01:51:25,609
are really outstanding that the last two items one the the

2303
01:51:25,609 --> 01:51:28,239
part of solid waste I

2304
01:51:28,239 --> 01:51:31,220
do a lot of zoning for apartments and a lot of most of the

2305
01:51:31,220 --> 01:51:32,439
apartments that I do

2306
01:51:32,439 --> 01:51:37,310
right now they do have the system where the garbage is

2307
01:51:37,310 --> 01:51:38,520
wheeled out during

2308
01:51:38,520 --> 01:51:41,489
collection days and wheeled back in that way they don't

2309
01:51:41,489 --> 01:51:42,640
have a dumpster area

2310
01:51:42,640 --> 01:51:46,140
which attracts rodents and and smells and everything and it

2311
01:51:46,140 --> 01:51:47,239
works really fine

2312
01:51:47,239 --> 01:51:49,920
and it works well and I'm confident we can work something

2313
01:51:49,920 --> 01:51:51,039
out with the city but

2314
01:51:51,039 --> 01:51:54,479
until we get the issue with the zoning solved we didn't

2315
01:51:54,479 --> 01:51:55,560
want to spend a whole

2316
01:51:55,560 --> 01:51:58,109
lot of time and aggravation going through that. The same

2317
01:51:58,109 --> 01:51:59,079
thing with the

2318
01:51:59,079 --> 01:52:02,140
five-foot boundary agreement we've met with our neighboring

2319
01:52:02,140 --> 01:52:03,079
property owners and

2320
01:52:03,079 --> 01:52:06,560
we're we're confident we can reach an agreement on that but

2321
01:52:06,560 --> 01:52:07,079
they would be in a

2322
01:52:07,079 --> 01:52:09,750
form of a deed restriction to get recorded in the deed

2323
01:52:09,750 --> 01:52:11,119
records and until

2324
01:52:11,119 --> 01:52:15,149
we get zoning in place we didn't want to go through the all

2325
01:52:15,149 --> 01:52:16,640
that exercise as well.

2326
01:52:16,640 --> 01:52:20,439
We fully understand that until those two things get solved

2327
01:52:20,439 --> 01:52:21,880
even if this gets

2328
01:52:21,880 --> 01:52:24,770
approved we couldn't move forward until those were solved

2329
01:52:24,770 --> 01:52:25,520
and and we're

2330
01:52:25,520 --> 01:52:29,039
confident we can get those solved so that's two things. Can

2331
01:52:29,039 --> 01:52:29,600
I stop you a sec?

2332
01:52:29,600 --> 01:52:32,539
Did you say you do have an agreement reached with the

2333
01:52:32,539 --> 01:52:33,279
neighbor? We're

2334
01:52:33,279 --> 01:52:36,840
confident we're going to be able to get one. We've met with

2335
01:52:36,840 --> 01:52:37,479
them and they've

2336
01:52:37,479 --> 01:52:41,159
showed interest in entering into an agreement with us. Okay

2337
01:52:41,159 --> 01:52:41,920
great thank you.

2338
01:52:41,920 --> 01:52:49,010
Okay this really boils down to parking I think. Our heights

2339
01:52:49,010 --> 01:52:49,680
really not any

2340
01:52:49,680 --> 01:52:53,090
different from from Fry the U Center Fry Street. The

2341
01:52:53,090 --> 01:52:54,800
difference between those two

2342
01:52:54,800 --> 01:53:00,199
is that we're proposing less parking for the residential

2343
01:53:00,199 --> 01:53:02,920
portion of 0.7 parking

2344
01:53:02,920 --> 01:53:07,880
spaces per bed versus the one per bed that they do. Rodney

2345
01:53:07,880 --> 01:53:09,079
King will who's my

2346
01:53:09,079 --> 01:53:11,039
client will come up and go through this whole presentation.

2347
01:53:11,039 --> 01:53:11,600
I'll just take a

2348
01:53:11,600 --> 01:53:15,470
minute though. What we're proposing is actually consistent

2349
01:53:15,470 --> 01:53:16,359
in our mind with the

2350
01:53:16,359 --> 01:53:19,739
comprehensive plan. There's a provision of the Denton 2030

2351
01:53:19,739 --> 01:53:20,720
plan that says if

2352
01:53:20,720 --> 01:53:23,479
you're adjacent to the University you you're a good

2353
01:53:23,479 --> 01:53:24,840
candidate to have reduced

2354
01:53:24,840 --> 01:53:27,729
parking because you're putting students right across the

2355
01:53:27,729 --> 01:53:28,600
street from where

2356
01:53:28,600 --> 01:53:32,090
they're going to school. I am a father of one daughter who

2357
01:53:32,090 --> 01:53:33,319
's in college and one

2358
01:53:33,319 --> 01:53:35,630
is about and the son is about to go to college and I've

2359
01:53:35,630 --> 01:53:36,600
been to the colleges

2360
01:53:36,600 --> 01:53:39,819
and kids don't drive as much as they did when I was a kid.

2361
01:53:39,819 --> 01:53:41,800
It's too convenient to

2362
01:53:41,800 --> 01:53:46,840
take uber bicycles other ways to get around especially in a

2363
01:53:46,840 --> 01:53:47,560
college town and

2364
01:53:47,560 --> 01:53:51,560
we're confident that that would be recognized by the

2365
01:53:51,560 --> 01:53:53,199
students who live here.

2366
01:53:53,199 --> 01:53:56,720
Rodney will go into more details on that but I do think

2367
01:53:56,720 --> 01:53:57,880
that in the state of the

2368
01:53:57,880 --> 01:54:02,159
art planning in the United States right now increasing

2369
01:54:02,159 --> 01:54:03,600
density next to colleges

2370
01:54:03,600 --> 01:54:08,039
and reducing parking is is common and accepted and it's

2371
01:54:08,039 --> 01:54:09,359
something Rodney will

2372
01:54:09,359 --> 01:54:11,710
go into a little bit more detail with. I do thank you for

2373
01:54:11,710 --> 01:54:12,560
your time I'll turn

2374
01:54:12,560 --> 01:54:16,039
over Rodney. Yes sir. One other question have you

2375
01:54:16,039 --> 01:54:18,239
considered what DCTA services

2376
01:54:18,239 --> 01:54:20,930
would be providing for this facility possibly as well as

2377
01:54:20,930 --> 01:54:21,800
another means of

2378
01:54:21,800 --> 01:54:24,739
transportation for students? Yes sir Rodney had spoken to

2379
01:54:24,739 --> 01:54:27,600
some folks over DCTA to talk

2380
01:54:27,600 --> 01:54:32,199
about altering schedules to accommodate and none of this is

2381
01:54:32,199 --> 01:54:33,479
gonna be zip cars

2382
01:54:33,479 --> 01:54:36,470
here on campus if you know what a zip car is where you

2383
01:54:36,470 --> 01:54:37,760
people can get like a

2384
01:54:37,760 --> 01:54:41,060
fractional ownership of car just use it when they need it.

2385
01:54:41,060 --> 01:54:42,479
So he will go into

2386
01:54:42,479 --> 01:54:46,350
that a little more detail but it's not it's not like it was

2387
01:54:46,350 --> 01:54:47,239
when I was in

2388
01:54:47,239 --> 01:54:49,550
college there's a lot more options. May have one other

2389
01:54:49,550 --> 01:54:50,399
question. Commissioner Beck

2390
01:54:50,399 --> 01:54:53,479
did you have a question? Yes thank you chair thank you Mr.

2391
01:54:53,479 --> 01:54:54,840
Baldwin for your presentation.

2392
01:54:54,840 --> 01:54:58,710
I would beg to disagree with you though on the height issue

2393
01:54:58,710 --> 01:55:00,000
probably nothing's

2394
01:55:00,000 --> 01:55:03,289
changed but that would mean that the taller height was

2395
01:55:03,289 --> 01:55:04,520
always there in the

2396
01:55:04,520 --> 01:55:08,760
first place in my opinion. Well I was I was at the briefing

2397
01:55:08,760 --> 01:55:09,319
session we talked

2398
01:55:09,319 --> 01:55:12,069
about the sixth floor the sixth floor of a parking garage

2399
01:55:12,069 --> 01:55:13,000
is the same height as a

2400
01:55:13,000 --> 01:55:15,439
five-story a six-story parking garage the same height as a

2401
01:55:15,439 --> 01:55:16,920
five-story residential

2402
01:55:16,920 --> 01:55:20,439
structure because they have lower heights between floors.

2403
01:55:20,439 --> 01:55:22,000
Okay but standing

2404
01:55:22,000 --> 01:55:26,510
side-by-side to sub area A and B are you saying we wouldn't

2405
01:55:26,510 --> 01:55:27,520
see any difference

2406
01:55:27,520 --> 01:55:31,180
in height? Not with A because A has a much shorter height A

2407
01:55:31,180 --> 01:55:32,560
is 35 feet I

2408
01:55:32,560 --> 01:55:35,789
believe between us and the youth center we're within two

2409
01:55:35,789 --> 01:55:37,079
feet of each other. Okay

2410
01:55:37,079 --> 01:55:39,869
let me put you on the spot a little bit here. Okay that's

2411
01:55:39,869 --> 01:55:45,319
what I'm here for. You in your opinion what do you think

2412
01:55:45,319 --> 01:55:51,359
were the top two things that the residents were opposed to?

2413
01:55:51,359 --> 01:55:55,920
Could you? Parking and height. Okay yeah and you've made it

2414
01:55:55,920 --> 01:55:57,039
advance a little bit on the

2415
01:55:57,039 --> 01:55:59,760
parking yet you're still under that and the height really

2416
01:55:59,760 --> 01:56:00,840
hasn't changed at all

2417
01:56:00,840 --> 01:56:05,439
so I'm just curious other than you made a couple of changes

2418
01:56:05,439 --> 01:56:07,439
what brings you back

2419
01:56:07,439 --> 01:56:11,029
here thinking that there's going to be a change of? We

2420
01:56:11,029 --> 01:56:12,920
really believe this is a

2421
01:56:12,920 --> 01:56:16,930
good project and I understand the position you're in it's

2422
01:56:16,930 --> 01:56:17,840
hard to to go

2423
01:56:17,840 --> 01:56:21,539
against neighborhood opposition but we think from a an

2424
01:56:21,539 --> 01:56:23,319
urban design standpoint

2425
01:56:23,319 --> 01:56:27,109
this project makes sense and it made sense for the youth

2426
01:56:27,109 --> 01:56:28,239
center to go there

2427
01:56:28,239 --> 01:56:32,279
and at that height I don't see why it would make less sense

2428
01:56:32,279 --> 01:56:33,399
for us to come in

2429
01:56:33,399 --> 01:56:37,649
so it really boils down in my mind to parking and Rodney

2430
01:56:37,649 --> 01:56:39,600
will go into research

2431
01:56:39,600 --> 01:56:44,869
he's done where the youth center parking is not utilized at

2432
01:56:44,869 --> 01:56:46,640
100%. There's

2433
01:56:46,640 --> 01:56:50,800
there's plenty of extra spaces as are the 33 degrees north

2434
01:56:50,800 --> 01:56:51,920
there's lots of

2435
01:56:51,920 --> 01:56:55,000
spaces in their parking garages that are not used because

2436
01:56:55,000 --> 01:56:56,000
the students just don't

2437
01:56:56,000 --> 01:56:59,880
bring the cars in it so to speak to your point I thought

2438
01:56:59,880 --> 01:57:02,239
that when we resubmitted

2439
01:57:02,239 --> 01:57:06,039
I thought that we're gonna get a lot closer to meeting the

2440
01:57:06,039 --> 01:57:07,479
parking requirement

2441
01:57:07,479 --> 01:57:09,979
based on a administrative reduction in parking that we

2442
01:57:09,979 --> 01:57:11,079
thought we were going to

2443
01:57:11,079 --> 01:57:13,760
get which we didn't but when we were in the system we still

2444
01:57:13,760 --> 01:57:14,479
think it's a good

2445
01:57:14,479 --> 01:57:17,869
project. Thank you sir. You're welcome. One more question.

2446
01:57:17,869 --> 01:57:19,239
Commissioner Ellis. Thank

2447
01:57:19,239 --> 01:57:22,640
you chair. Good evening. Question with regard to the

2448
01:57:22,640 --> 01:57:24,399
securing of the extra

2449
01:57:24,399 --> 01:57:27,729
parking spaces which I understand is now a current parking

2450
01:57:27,729 --> 01:57:28,680
lot is that correct?

2451
01:57:28,680 --> 01:57:32,239
Yes ma'am. And what is it being used for now? I'm sorry?

2452
01:57:32,239 --> 01:57:33,279
What is it currently

2453
01:57:33,279 --> 01:57:35,960
being used for now? I understand it's being used I'll let

2454
01:57:35,960 --> 01:57:36,720
Rodney speak to it

2455
01:57:36,720 --> 01:57:41,449
as well but it's being used for Vortman's employee parking

2456
01:57:41,449 --> 01:57:41,880
it's what I

2457
01:57:41,880 --> 01:57:45,640
understand. Okay thank you. But when he comes up grill him

2458
01:57:45,640 --> 01:57:46,760
he'll know for sure.

2459
01:57:46,760 --> 01:57:50,319
I'm gonna turn over this is Rodney King with EDR out of

2460
01:57:50,319 --> 01:57:52,479
Memphis he's here as the

2461
01:57:52,479 --> 01:57:57,210
developer. Great thank you. Thank you guys. Not a short

2462
01:57:57,210 --> 01:57:58,319
presentation but I'll skip

2463
01:57:58,319 --> 01:58:03,720
through most of it since. Sorry you got ten minutes so.

2464
01:58:03,720 --> 01:58:06,840
Take your time.

2465
01:58:08,479 --> 01:58:11,000
Well just to give you guys a little bit of background about

2466
01:58:11,000 --> 01:58:11,920
EDR we're based in

2467
01:58:11,920 --> 01:58:14,470
Memphis Tennessee with the nation's second largest student

2468
01:58:14,470 --> 01:58:15,720
housing REIT. We're

2469
01:58:15,720 --> 01:58:18,369
a public company we've been around in business for 52 years

2470
01:58:18,369 --> 01:58:19,359
we have about 40

2471
01:58:19,359 --> 01:58:22,880
thousand beds nationwide. We also have six properties in

2472
01:58:22,880 --> 01:58:25,119
Texas ranging located

2473
01:58:25,119 --> 01:58:28,199
in Lubbock all the way down to Texas A&M Commerce what not

2474
01:58:28,199 --> 01:58:29,239
all the way down that

2475
01:58:29,239 --> 01:58:34,439
that marker is wrong all the way down to San Marcos Texas.

2476
01:58:34,439 --> 01:58:36,079
Here just a few of our

2477
01:58:36,079 --> 01:58:39,020
projects in glance as you'll see the project at the bottom

2478
01:58:39,020 --> 01:58:39,800
right is it in

2479
01:58:39,800 --> 01:58:43,189
Fort Worth. We pride ourselves on trying to complement the

2480
01:58:43,189 --> 01:58:44,199
existing architecture

2481
01:58:44,199 --> 01:58:49,109
while improving the site. Here's our project at University

2482
01:58:49,109 --> 01:58:50,039
of Minnesota and

2483
01:58:50,039 --> 01:58:58,560
also Texas Tech. This is Yukon and Austin. Here's a little

2484
01:58:58,560 --> 01:59:00,359
bit of project overview

2485
01:59:00,359 --> 01:59:03,380
as you guys can see we've been you know pursuing this

2486
01:59:03,380 --> 01:59:04,840
project for quite a while

2487
01:59:04,840 --> 01:59:08,439
now over a year. We've had several public meetings we've

2488
01:59:08,439 --> 01:59:11,359
tried to intake the

2489
01:59:11,359 --> 01:59:14,939
public's comments and adjust the plans as necessary. We

2490
01:59:14,939 --> 01:59:16,640
think we've come to a

2491
01:59:16,640 --> 01:59:20,720
final point of the plans that's why we're back here today

2492
01:59:20,720 --> 01:59:21,720
to kind of bring

2493
01:59:21,720 --> 01:59:25,539
a conclusion to this matter. I believe we've made the

2494
01:59:25,539 --> 01:59:26,880
project better once we

2495
01:59:26,880 --> 01:59:30,140
initially started out with the project before we even got

2496
01:59:30,140 --> 01:59:31,560
to P&Z we're about 60%

2497
01:59:31,560 --> 01:59:35,050
park so we've made material increases in the parking we've

2498
01:59:35,050 --> 01:59:36,239
reduced the density

2499
01:59:36,239 --> 01:59:41,800
quite a bit. And Rob alluded to this earlier we actually

2500
01:59:41,800 --> 01:59:42,880
believe this project

2501
01:59:42,880 --> 01:59:48,199
supports the DEN plan 2030. One of the items in the plan is

2502
01:59:48,199 --> 01:59:49,680
supports mixed use

2503
01:59:49,680 --> 01:59:52,789
projects and close proximity to the university. In our

2504
01:59:52,789 --> 01:59:54,000
opinion you can't get

2505
01:59:54,000 --> 01:59:56,710
any closer to the university than this project it is

2506
01:59:56,710 --> 01:59:58,279
literally right across the

2507
01:59:58,279 --> 02:00:01,500
street and it is it is a mixed use project the majority of

2508
02:00:01,500 --> 02:00:02,439
the first floor

2509
02:00:02,439 --> 02:00:06,149
is commercial spaces and also one of the tenants of the

2510
02:00:06,149 --> 02:00:07,439
plan is to create a

2511
02:00:07,439 --> 02:00:10,329
buffer zone between the university and the historic

2512
02:00:10,329 --> 02:00:11,680
neighborhoods and Frye

2513
02:00:11,680 --> 02:00:14,689
Street and Hickory and Oak is that buffer zone in our

2514
02:00:14,689 --> 02:00:16,720
opinion. The scale of

2515
02:00:16,720 --> 02:00:19,319
the project comes down from the university I think you have

2516
02:00:19,319 --> 02:00:19,800
about eight

2517
02:00:19,800 --> 02:00:22,859
nine-story university buildings right across the street so

2518
02:00:22,859 --> 02:00:23,840
this gradually

2519
02:00:23,840 --> 02:00:27,109
brings down the scale of the university into the to the

2520
02:00:27,109 --> 02:00:28,640
neighborhoods and also

2521
02:00:28,640 --> 02:00:32,020
just and collegiate housing in general purpose-built colleg

2522
02:00:32,020 --> 02:00:34,239
iate housing draws

2523
02:00:34,239 --> 02:00:38,420
from the shadow market in our opinion it takes away from

2524
02:00:38,420 --> 02:00:40,039
those students renting

2525
02:00:40,039 --> 02:00:43,359
houses that are five six seven people in a single-family

2526
02:00:43,359 --> 02:00:44,920
house and puts them in a

2527
02:00:44,920 --> 02:00:48,789
project and a product that is specifically geared toward

2528
02:00:48,789 --> 02:00:50,319
them. And the

2529
02:00:50,319 --> 02:00:53,840
then 2030 plan also supports relaxed parking and close

2530
02:00:53,840 --> 02:00:54,800
proximity to the

2531
02:00:54,800 --> 02:00:59,470
university. As I said we believe this project is consistent

2532
02:00:59,470 --> 02:01:00,399
with the plan and

2533
02:01:00,399 --> 02:01:04,369
we hope you guys do too. Just a little bit of information

2534
02:01:04,369 --> 02:01:05,760
on the project is 300

2535
02:01:05,760 --> 02:01:13,069
beds 222 spaces about 77 76.7 percent part is located at 13

2536
02:01:13,069 --> 02:01:14,079
14 Hickory Street

2537
02:01:14,079 --> 02:01:17,840
obviously right across the street from the university. This

2538
02:01:17,840 --> 02:01:18,579
is just a

2539
02:01:18,579 --> 02:01:22,449
comparison to a couple other purpose-built student housing

2540
02:01:22,449 --> 02:01:23,720
projects. We

2541
02:01:23,720 --> 02:01:26,539
believe this project is extremely similar to the youth

2542
02:01:26,539 --> 02:01:27,600
center at Fry Street.

2543
02:01:27,600 --> 02:01:32,140
They are one-to-one park which is probably a block away but

2544
02:01:32,140 --> 02:01:32,960
according to

2545
02:01:32,960 --> 02:01:35,470
our research and according to the manager on site they're

2546
02:01:35,470 --> 02:01:36,159
not utilizing

2547
02:01:36,159 --> 02:01:39,750
all of their parking. So we didn't feel like it was prudent

2548
02:01:39,750 --> 02:01:41,000
or market the market

2549
02:01:41,000 --> 02:01:44,710
wasn't suggesting we needed more parking to satisfy the

2550
02:01:44,710 --> 02:01:46,359
need. The last thing we

2551
02:01:46,359 --> 02:01:49,020
want to do is build a project that's not successful. If we

2552
02:01:49,020 --> 02:01:50,399
believe that we needed

2553
02:01:50,399 --> 02:01:55,130
more parking we would we would we would obviously do it.

2554
02:01:55,130 --> 02:01:56,920
Here's a comparison of

2555
02:01:56,920 --> 02:02:00,050
33 degrees north which is on the south side of campus. It's

2556
02:02:00,050 --> 02:02:01,840
427 beds about two

2557
02:02:01,840 --> 02:02:07,119
348 spaces about 275 are utilized. That's between half and

2558
02:02:07,119 --> 02:02:09,520
three quarters. So the

2559
02:02:09,520 --> 02:02:13,090
market is telling us what the parking demand is for these

2560
02:02:13,090 --> 02:02:14,399
types of projects in

2561
02:02:14,399 --> 02:02:18,270
our opinion. Here's just a quick comparison of the project.

2562
02:02:18,270 --> 02:02:19,319
Rob alluded to

2563
02:02:19,319 --> 02:02:22,649
the height earlier. The height did not grow the way we

2564
02:02:22,649 --> 02:02:24,239
measured height is the

2565
02:02:24,239 --> 02:02:28,310
difference between now and when we present it back in

2566
02:02:28,310 --> 02:02:31,399
January. We also have

2567
02:02:31,399 --> 02:02:34,149
our engineers here for the traffic study. I don't know if

2568
02:02:34,149 --> 02:02:35,159
you guys want us to go

2569
02:02:35,159 --> 02:02:37,739
into detail with it now or we could kind of reserve that

2570
02:02:37,739 --> 02:02:39,399
for questions. I leave it

2571
02:02:39,399 --> 02:02:43,279
up to you Mr. Chair. Let's do for questions. I'm sorry. If

2572
02:02:43,279 --> 02:02:43,920
there's questions

2573
02:02:43,920 --> 02:02:51,090
in the essence of time. Sure sure. Sure if you want to go.

2574
02:02:51,090 --> 02:02:51,359
If you're

2575
02:02:51,359 --> 02:02:55,229
asking if I understood your question you wanted to see if

2576
02:02:55,229 --> 02:02:55,800
we need to have your

2577
02:02:55,800 --> 02:02:58,380
engineers correct. And I think you said if we had questions

2578
02:02:58,380 --> 02:02:59,239
I could come forward.

2579
02:02:59,239 --> 02:03:02,199
I was agreeing with you. If we have questions for them then

2580
02:03:02,199 --> 02:03:03,039
yes we'll bring

2581
02:03:03,039 --> 02:03:07,359
them forward at that time. Sorry if that wasn't clear. No

2582
02:03:07,359 --> 02:03:10,279
problem. And some of the

2583
02:03:10,279 --> 02:03:13,619
amenities that will be included in the project is obviously

2584
02:03:13,619 --> 02:03:15,119
zip car. As Rob said

2585
02:03:15,119 --> 02:03:18,340
there's a fractional share of a car. We're students who don

2586
02:03:18,340 --> 02:03:19,199
't own a car but

2587
02:03:19,199 --> 02:03:23,119
need a car on a per trip basis. We will offer that amenity

2588
02:03:23,119 --> 02:03:24,680
in the project. Well

2589
02:03:24,680 --> 02:03:26,930
also we also have a unique relationship with a company

2590
02:03:26,930 --> 02:03:28,319
called Gotcha Bike. It's

2591
02:03:28,319 --> 02:03:31,130
very similar to zip car but it's revolving around bikes.

2592
02:03:31,130 --> 02:03:31,880
You can rent a

2593
02:03:31,880 --> 02:03:34,020
bike. You can rent a bike for a day. You can rent a bike

2594
02:03:34,020 --> 02:03:34,880
for a week and you're

2595
02:03:34,880 --> 02:03:37,399
charged for that. And also Uber obviously. I think

2596
02:03:37,399 --> 02:03:38,079
everybody's pretty

2597
02:03:38,079 --> 02:03:42,109
familiar what Uber is. Same thing with site capacity and

2598
02:03:42,109 --> 02:03:43,600
utilities. If there's any

2599
02:03:43,600 --> 02:03:47,020
questions revolving around it we have our engineers here to

2600
02:03:47,020 --> 02:03:48,800
do that. Some of

2601
02:03:48,800 --> 02:03:51,689
the advantages of the project in our opinion is it's within

2602
02:03:51,689 --> 02:03:52,399
steps of the

2603
02:03:52,399 --> 02:03:55,689
University. We believe this is the highest and best use of

2604
02:03:55,689 --> 02:03:56,960
this site. It is

2605
02:03:56,960 --> 02:03:59,850
purpose-built collegiate housing right across the street

2606
02:03:59,850 --> 02:04:01,319
from the core of UNT's

2607
02:04:01,319 --> 02:04:05,989
campus. UNT is obviously growing and the demand for purpose

2608
02:04:05,989 --> 02:04:06,920
-built student housing

2609
02:04:06,920 --> 02:04:09,810
is here in the community and we're trying to satisfy that

2610
02:04:09,810 --> 02:04:11,640
need. Also based

2611
02:04:11,640 --> 02:04:15,869
on our multiple properties across the country students and

2612
02:04:15,869 --> 02:04:17,199
when you are in this

2613
02:04:17,199 --> 02:04:21,930
close proximity to campus students don't drive their cars

2614
02:04:21,930 --> 02:04:23,520
to class. They get out

2615
02:04:23,520 --> 02:04:26,079
of bed and they walk to class from this type of location.

2616
02:04:26,079 --> 02:04:27,399
If we're in a garden

2617
02:04:27,399 --> 02:04:30,619
style sprawling project two miles away we believe they

2618
02:04:30,619 --> 02:04:32,239
would drive to class but

2619
02:04:32,239 --> 02:04:35,220
in this type of project we don't believe they will. And

2620
02:04:35,220 --> 02:04:36,359
also this creates an

2621
02:04:36,359 --> 02:04:39,229
entertainment district that is within proximity of the

2622
02:04:39,229 --> 02:04:41,159
University. You have the

2623
02:04:41,159 --> 02:04:44,270
first floor commercial use in a fry street and you have the

2624
02:04:44,270 --> 02:04:45,159
majority of our

2625
02:04:45,159 --> 02:04:48,920
first floor commercial uses. So you're creating this

2626
02:04:48,920 --> 02:04:50,640
vibrant walkable district

2627
02:04:50,640 --> 02:04:56,890
within the University within the University's edge. If you

2628
02:04:56,890 --> 02:04:57,399
measure the

2629
02:04:57,399 --> 02:05:01,270
building from its average grade from its prevailing grade

2630
02:05:01,270 --> 02:05:02,439
the average height of

2631
02:05:02,439 --> 02:05:07,479
the buildings about 58 feet and we're asking for a height

2632
02:05:07,479 --> 02:05:09,119
variance of however

2633
02:05:09,119 --> 02:05:11,220
you guys want to measure. We want five stories and however

2634
02:05:11,220 --> 02:05:11,960
you want to measure

2635
02:05:11,960 --> 02:05:15,140
in our opinion is 58 feet. I think the way Ron is measuring

2636
02:05:15,140 --> 02:05:16,880
is 62 feet. We're

2637
02:05:16,880 --> 02:05:20,369
asking for a parking ratio down from 75 to 76 percent from

2638
02:05:20,369 --> 02:05:22,760
the one-to-one. And

2639
02:05:22,760 --> 02:05:25,409
with that I'll take the Commissioner's questions. And a

2640
02:05:25,409 --> 02:05:26,319
couple questions for a

2641
02:05:26,319 --> 02:05:32,869
Commissioner Beck. Thank you Chair. Good seeing you again

2642
02:05:32,869 --> 02:05:34,920
Mr. Keene. I would like to say you do have an excellent

2643
02:05:34,920 --> 02:05:37,199
product. I went on your site and looked at it. You've got a

2644
02:05:37,199 --> 02:05:41,079
remarkable staff, a laundry list of your developments are

2645
02:05:41,079 --> 02:05:43,600
it's awesome. So regardless

2646
02:05:43,600 --> 02:05:46,319
of what the vote turns out to be here tonight I hope that

2647
02:05:46,319 --> 02:05:47,359
Denton does see you

2648
02:05:47,359 --> 02:05:49,729
here and building this because I think you've got a good

2649
02:05:49,729 --> 02:05:51,560
quality product. Now you

2650
02:05:51,560 --> 02:05:54,500
mentioned that this you felt that this site was the highest

2651
02:05:54,500 --> 02:05:55,600
and best use for it.

2652
02:05:55,600 --> 02:05:59,939
But and I don't disagree that we need this type of building

2653
02:05:59,939 --> 02:06:02,159
there but again why

2654
02:06:02,159 --> 02:06:04,880
five stories why not stay within the limits that are

2655
02:06:04,880 --> 02:06:06,159
already set there with

2656
02:06:06,159 --> 02:06:09,100
this overlay district. I think we covered this in January

2657
02:06:09,100 --> 02:06:09,840
but if you would

2658
02:06:09,840 --> 02:06:15,039
reiterate that for us please. Sure what's driving to be

2659
02:06:15,039 --> 02:06:15,880
frank what's driving the

2660
02:06:15,880 --> 02:06:19,869
height of the building is purely economics. Denton without

2661
02:06:19,869 --> 02:06:20,640
going to an

2662
02:06:20,640 --> 02:06:24,579
elaborated finance you know model. Denton is a high

2663
02:06:24,579 --> 02:06:26,640
property tax municipality and

2664
02:06:26,640 --> 02:06:31,279
land values here are rising. So you have to get a certain

2665
02:06:31,279 --> 02:06:33,239
amount of density for

2666
02:06:33,239 --> 02:06:37,399
any project to pencil so to speak. So that's what's driving

2667
02:06:37,399 --> 02:06:38,399
the height of the

2668
02:06:38,399 --> 02:06:42,569
building. If we could build more we would like to on this

2669
02:06:42,569 --> 02:06:43,640
site because we think

2670
02:06:43,640 --> 02:06:46,539
this site is irreplaceable in our opinion. But to be

2671
02:06:46,539 --> 02:06:47,680
compatible with the

2672
02:06:47,680 --> 02:06:51,109
neighborhood and you know it's a balancing act between you

2673
02:06:51,109 --> 02:06:52,039
know economics

2674
02:06:52,039 --> 02:06:55,689
and the land values and property taxes. So that's what's

2675
02:06:55,689 --> 02:06:56,960
really driving the

2676
02:06:56,960 --> 02:07:02,649
height. We believe if the amendment this is you know not a

2677
02:07:02,649 --> 02:07:03,239
front to the

2678
02:07:03,239 --> 02:07:07,840
residents but if the zoning doesn't change and the land

2679
02:07:07,840 --> 02:07:09,000
value and the

2680
02:07:09,000 --> 02:07:12,880
property taxes don't change the only other variable is land

2681
02:07:12,880 --> 02:07:14,640
value. So if you

2682
02:07:14,640 --> 02:07:17,310
can't get density where you need it you can't pay the same

2683
02:07:17,310 --> 02:07:19,159
amount for the land.

2684
02:07:19,159 --> 02:07:22,819
So you're saying anything less than five stories and wouldn

2685
02:07:22,819 --> 02:07:23,920
't be profitable.

2686
02:07:23,920 --> 02:07:30,340
Correct. Not profitable but not feasible. Okay thank you.

2687
02:07:30,340 --> 02:07:31,439
Commissioner Rossell.

2688
02:07:31,439 --> 02:07:34,960
Thank you chair. I have several questions and hopefully I

2689
02:07:34,960 --> 02:07:35,479
can get through these

2690
02:07:35,479 --> 02:07:40,880
efficiently. I'm trying to figure out how many parking

2691
02:07:40,880 --> 02:07:43,840
spaces there are proposed

2692
02:07:43,840 --> 02:07:47,399
in the plan and I can't count the parking garages but to

2693
02:07:47,399 --> 02:07:47,760
your

2694
02:07:47,760 --> 02:07:51,899
understanding how many proposed spaces are in your site

2695
02:07:51,899 --> 02:07:54,239
plan. I understand it's

2696
02:07:54,239 --> 02:07:58,229
260 spaces that means the residential I mean that means the

2697
02:07:58,229 --> 02:07:58,760
retail is

2698
02:07:58,760 --> 02:08:02,680
parked to code. Both uses are parked to code and we're

2699
02:08:02,680 --> 02:08:03,960
asking for a variance on

2700
02:08:03,960 --> 02:08:10,399
the residential piece to 0.76. Okay so in your narrative

2701
02:08:10,399 --> 02:08:12,039
submitted to us it says

2702
02:08:12,039 --> 02:08:16,909
252. Correct. In our city backup it says the requirements

2703
02:08:16,909 --> 02:08:19,880
260 but you have 258

2704
02:08:19,880 --> 02:08:25,520
leaving you short of the proposed that you had of 260. I'm

2705
02:08:25,520 --> 02:08:26,199
not sure where that

2706
02:08:26,199 --> 02:08:30,630
discrepancy comes in but additionally in the backup exhibit

2707
02:08:30,630 --> 02:08:34,880
3575F it outlines the

2708
02:08:34,880 --> 02:08:39,829
additional 36 parking spaces but on this site plan there's

2709
02:08:39,829 --> 02:08:41,840
45 parking spaces not

2710
02:08:41,840 --> 02:08:47,170
36 and so I hope you can understand my confusion. I'm

2711
02:08:47,170 --> 02:08:48,279
trying to understand what

2712
02:08:48,279 --> 02:08:51,220
actual parking is being presented to us to vote on this

2713
02:08:51,220 --> 02:08:52,359
evening so maybe we can

2714
02:08:52,359 --> 02:08:56,119
start with this. In this exhibit for sub area C site plan

2715
02:08:56,119 --> 02:08:57,680
can you help me

2716
02:08:57,680 --> 02:09:01,939
understand what these nine parking spots to the east are? I

2717
02:09:01,939 --> 02:09:04,159
'm not I don't hear

2718
02:09:04,159 --> 02:09:11,390
you. You're more than welcome to. Yeah can you set it on

2719
02:09:11,390 --> 02:09:14,279
the felt? I've got an overhead there.

2720
02:09:20,439 --> 02:09:24,899
Those nine parking spots to the east are technically within

2721
02:09:24,899 --> 02:09:27,840
our survey but

2722
02:09:27,840 --> 02:09:31,520
they're being used by adjacent property owner. We are not

2723
02:09:31,520 --> 02:09:33,439
counting those spaces

2724
02:09:33,439 --> 02:09:37,859
too in the project but we are legally entitled to them but

2725
02:09:37,859 --> 02:09:39,279
we didn't want to

2726
02:09:39,279 --> 02:09:44,630
go through the legal process of claiming those. Okay. There

2727
02:09:44,630 --> 02:09:45,680
's another apartment

2728
02:09:45,680 --> 02:09:49,760
complex outside the outside of the site map. So they have

2729
02:09:49,760 --> 02:09:50,880
like a lease agreement

2730
02:09:50,880 --> 02:09:55,899
or some sort of? Actually they're just encroaching. Okay so

2731
02:09:55,899 --> 02:09:56,439
I'm understanding

2732
02:09:56,439 --> 02:10:00,810
why when parking is so much of an issue you wouldn't

2733
02:10:00,810 --> 02:10:03,239
include those as some that

2734
02:10:03,239 --> 02:10:08,579
y'all could take back in this. That is certainly an avenue

2735
02:10:08,579 --> 02:10:09,600
we may want to

2736
02:10:09,600 --> 02:10:13,199
pursue but in order to keep the project on a certain

2737
02:10:13,199 --> 02:10:14,760
timeline that's a legal

2738
02:10:14,760 --> 02:10:19,100
process that could take a long time. Okay I certainly

2739
02:10:19,100 --> 02:10:21,239
understand the timing of it

2740
02:10:21,239 --> 02:10:23,930
but it seems like low-hanging fruit as we're talking so

2741
02:10:23,930 --> 02:10:25,119
much about parking that

2742
02:10:25,119 --> 02:10:31,109
there's nine spots just sitting on your land. Correct. And

2743
02:10:31,109 --> 02:10:33,220
so I guess to end my

2744
02:10:33,220 --> 02:10:39,600
point on the parking there is 260 not 258 maybe someone

2745
02:10:39,600 --> 02:10:40,760
from City can tell me

2746
02:10:40,760 --> 02:10:45,039
where the 258 is on our backup.

2747
02:10:51,560 --> 02:10:55,279
Commissioner Rezell the 258 is the calculation that the

2748
02:10:55,279 --> 02:10:56,359
applicant has

2749
02:10:56,359 --> 02:11:00,159
specified in their site plan but the way we calculated it

2750
02:11:00,159 --> 02:11:01,199
made me two parking

2751
02:11:01,199 --> 02:11:04,680
spaces off I think what we did was we rounded up and they

2752
02:11:04,680 --> 02:11:05,359
just

2753
02:11:05,359 --> 02:11:07,600
rounded it to the nearest number so that's the difference

2754
02:11:07,600 --> 02:11:08,359
of the two parking

2755
02:11:08,359 --> 02:11:10,800
spaces. So it's feasible if this project goes forward they

2756
02:11:10,800 --> 02:11:11,439
actually could build

2757
02:11:11,439 --> 02:11:15,329
260? The way that the site plan is currently designed they

2758
02:11:15,329 --> 02:11:17,319
show 258 so

2759
02:11:17,319 --> 02:11:22,500
that's what they I believe can produce is 258. Okay thank

2760
02:11:22,500 --> 02:11:26,760
you. So my other two

2761
02:11:26,760 --> 02:11:29,359
two questions and you heard my question earlier about the

2762
02:11:29,359 --> 02:11:30,439
UNT student housing is

2763
02:11:30,439 --> 02:11:32,579
this a designation that's official from the University and

2764
02:11:32,579 --> 02:11:33,560
do you have it? No

2765
02:11:33,560 --> 02:11:37,600
that was just one of our consultants labeling it we are no

2766
02:11:37,600 --> 02:11:38,520
way an affiliated

2767
02:11:38,520 --> 02:11:41,739
with the University of North Texas we believe that the

2768
02:11:41,739 --> 02:11:43,439
market dynamics the

2769
02:11:43,439 --> 02:11:47,439
majority of our tenants will be students of the University

2770
02:11:47,439 --> 02:11:48,800
by way of a type of

2771
02:11:48,800 --> 02:11:51,689
leasing we're instituting here but we're not affiliated

2772
02:11:51,689 --> 02:11:52,840
with the University and

2773
02:11:52,840 --> 02:11:55,590
to kind of put a bow in your parking conversation we've

2774
02:11:55,590 --> 02:11:56,720
been in discussions

2775
02:11:56,720 --> 02:12:00,159
with the University of North Texas you know over the last

2776
02:12:00,159 --> 02:12:02,000
year and they do have

2777
02:12:02,000 --> 02:12:07,239
an underutilized parking garage and we and UNT students are

2778
02:12:07,239 --> 02:12:08,520
entitled to park

2779
02:12:08,520 --> 02:12:12,319
in that garage so we've made the agreement and we're

2780
02:12:12,319 --> 02:12:13,239
certainly willing to

2781
02:12:13,239 --> 02:12:16,800
agree to this subject to approval that if our parking

2782
02:12:16,800 --> 02:12:18,439
exceeds capacity and a

2783
02:12:18,439 --> 02:12:21,329
UNT student needs parking we are willing to pay the

2784
02:12:21,329 --> 02:12:24,119
difference in that garage for

2785
02:12:24,119 --> 02:12:27,720
our students so that effectively brings us well more than a

2786
02:12:27,720 --> 02:12:28,079
hundred percent

2787
02:12:28,079 --> 02:12:31,109
parking and that garage is within a block and a half of our

2788
02:12:31,109 --> 02:12:32,079
site. Do you know

2789
02:12:32,079 --> 02:12:35,050
how many feet that is? I don't know how many feet. I think

2790
02:12:35,050 --> 02:12:36,359
it is within the 1000

2791
02:12:36,359 --> 02:12:38,100
feet. I think our requirements within a thousand. It is

2792
02:12:38,100 --> 02:12:40,119
within 1000 feet. I don't know if

2793
02:12:40,119 --> 02:12:43,369
staff can clarify that point for us during this hearing

2794
02:12:43,369 --> 02:12:44,359
that this particular

2795
02:12:44,359 --> 02:12:46,939
garage would be within a thousand that we may or may not be

2796
02:12:46,939 --> 02:12:47,520
able to consider

2797
02:12:47,520 --> 02:12:52,810
that. We would actually have to measure that to discern the

2798
02:12:52,810 --> 02:12:53,720
distance so we

2799
02:12:53,720 --> 02:12:55,970
wouldn't be able to just look at a map right now we would

2800
02:12:55,970 --> 02:12:56,760
have to get into our

2801
02:12:56,760 --> 02:13:00,149
GIS system and measure that. Okay. So I have one more

2802
02:13:00,149 --> 02:13:03,680
question slash maybe point.

2803
02:13:03,680 --> 02:13:08,090
Both Mr. Baldwin and you Mr. King have talked about really

2804
02:13:08,090 --> 02:13:09,159
the only difference

2805
02:13:09,159 --> 02:13:11,210
here we're talking about is parking how the height is very

2806
02:13:11,210 --> 02:13:12,279
similar. Correct. We

2807
02:13:12,279 --> 02:13:16,279
were provided from the considerations of staff differences

2808
02:13:16,279 --> 02:13:18,399
in what is currently

2809
02:13:18,399 --> 02:13:23,819
in sub A and sub B and what is being proposed by EDR and so

2810
02:13:23,819 --> 02:13:24,560
if I understand

2811
02:13:24,560 --> 02:13:27,720
this correctly there is a change to maximum building height

2812
02:13:27,720 --> 02:13:28,640
requested, a

2813
02:13:28,640 --> 02:13:31,859
change to maximum parking garage height requested, a change

2814
02:13:31,859 --> 02:13:32,920
of maximum density

2815
02:13:32,920 --> 02:13:36,840
requested, a change or an increase to building coverage for

2816
02:13:36,840 --> 02:13:37,880
residential, an

2817
02:13:37,880 --> 02:13:40,890
increased change to building coverage for mixed use, there

2818
02:13:40,890 --> 02:13:41,880
's a decrease

2819
02:13:41,880 --> 02:13:45,119
requirement for minimum landscape area and there is a

2820
02:13:45,119 --> 02:13:46,479
request to reduce the

2821
02:13:46,479 --> 02:13:51,149
rear yard setback. Y'all are asking for more than parking.

2822
02:13:51,149 --> 02:13:53,039
All those requests are

2823
02:13:53,039 --> 02:13:56,970
particularly driven by height. If we took a story off the

2824
02:13:56,970 --> 02:13:59,000
building obviously the

2825
02:13:59,000 --> 02:14:02,880
density per acre goes down so the primary drivers of those

2826
02:14:02,880 --> 02:14:03,840
requests are

2827
02:14:03,840 --> 02:14:09,600
height in our opinion. Okay thank you. Commissioner Hesbeth

2828
02:14:09,600 --> 02:14:10,840
. Thank You Chair.

2829
02:14:10,840 --> 02:14:16,560
Mr. King. So I have a functional question following up from

2830
02:14:16,560 --> 02:14:17,840
our previous

2831
02:14:17,840 --> 02:14:21,840
conversation. So I'm gonna use and I forget his name the

2832
02:14:21,840 --> 02:14:22,600
first presenter.

2833
02:14:22,600 --> 02:14:27,359
Mr. Baldwin. Thank you. So using that example so Mr.

2834
02:14:27,359 --> 02:14:32,090
Baldwin sends his son to UNT and there at your facility

2835
02:14:32,090 --> 02:14:34,880
right and so my

2836
02:14:34,880 --> 02:14:40,520
question is if he's leasing a room or an apartment in that

2837
02:14:40,520 --> 02:14:42,920
in a quad if you will

2838
02:14:42,920 --> 02:14:46,550
what controls do you have understanding you're limited

2839
02:14:46,550 --> 02:14:47,960
legally and who else

2840
02:14:47,960 --> 02:14:51,069
fills those other three spaces so for example I have all

2841
02:14:51,069 --> 02:14:52,319
daughters right so if

2842
02:14:52,319 --> 02:14:55,359
my daughter's in one of those locations what controls do

2843
02:14:55,359 --> 02:14:58,439
you have about 45 50

2844
02:14:58,439 --> 02:15:02,899
60 year old man renting an apartment in that same quad as a

2845
02:15:02,899 --> 02:15:04,239
20 year old girl?

2846
02:15:04,239 --> 02:15:08,789
First we must abide by all fair housing laws you know that

2847
02:15:08,789 --> 02:15:11,159
's supreme but the

2848
02:15:11,159 --> 02:15:15,800
type of programs and the type of leasing that we implement

2849
02:15:15,800 --> 02:15:17,319
in these projects I

2850
02:15:17,319 --> 02:15:22,550
would venture to say that 99% of our tenants are students

2851
02:15:22,550 --> 02:15:23,479
to the adjacent

2852
02:15:23,479 --> 02:15:26,750
universities so from a control standpoint we lease by the

2853
02:15:26,750 --> 02:15:27,920
bed which

2854
02:15:27,920 --> 02:15:30,920
automatically draws a certain type of clientele in their

2855
02:15:30,920 --> 02:15:33,000
opinion. We also if

2856
02:15:33,000 --> 02:15:35,699
your daughter and three of her friends wanted to come and

2857
02:15:35,699 --> 02:15:36,760
lease at our project

2858
02:15:36,760 --> 02:15:39,430
if she brought four of her friends and wanted to rent a

2859
02:15:39,430 --> 02:15:40,439
four-bedroom we would

2860
02:15:40,439 --> 02:15:43,869
obviously place those people together. We have several

2861
02:15:43,869 --> 02:15:45,479
management type of programs

2862
02:15:45,479 --> 02:15:48,760
from roommate matching to you pick your own unit so we have

2863
02:15:48,760 --> 02:15:49,680
controls and

2864
02:15:49,680 --> 02:15:54,350
incentives to put people where they want to be. But to cut

2865
02:15:54,350 --> 02:15:56,319
to the quick you can't

2866
02:15:56,319 --> 02:15:59,199
prevent that from happening just legally there's I

2867
02:15:59,199 --> 02:16:00,760
understand not saying it's

2868
02:16:00,760 --> 02:16:05,390
it's it's your fault I'm just saying it is a reality. We

2869
02:16:05,390 --> 02:16:06,640
can't steer we can't

2870
02:16:06,640 --> 02:16:12,909
discriminate against any group. Right thank you. Any other

2871
02:16:12,909 --> 02:16:13,439
question?

2872
02:16:13,439 --> 02:16:19,449
Commissioner Alice. I'm sorry thank you I'm gonna go back

2873
02:16:19,449 --> 02:16:20,319
to that parking lot

2874
02:16:20,319 --> 02:16:23,520
question do you have an answer for me? Could you remind me

2875
02:16:23,520 --> 02:16:24,199
of the question?

2876
02:16:24,199 --> 02:16:28,380
Sorry. So that off-site parking the 36 spaces on Bryan

2877
02:16:28,380 --> 02:16:29,800
Street there? Currently

2878
02:16:29,800 --> 02:16:34,819
Vortmans is using that parking spot for employee parking

2879
02:16:34,819 --> 02:16:36,239
and also the owner of

2880
02:16:36,239 --> 02:16:38,719
the project is not here but he also leases some of those

2881
02:16:38,719 --> 02:16:40,159
spaces to

2882
02:16:40,159 --> 02:16:44,670
professors and whomever he could generate cash from. But

2883
02:16:44,670 --> 02:16:45,319
the majority of

2884
02:16:45,319 --> 02:16:49,190
it in my from my interpretation of it is employee parking.

2885
02:16:49,190 --> 02:16:50,639
Okay and then I guess

2886
02:16:50,639 --> 02:16:53,350
my concern with it is then those people who are currently

2887
02:16:53,350 --> 02:16:54,399
using it won't be able

2888
02:16:54,399 --> 02:16:56,709
to use it because it's going to be designated for this

2889
02:16:56,709 --> 02:16:58,440
project. Well based

2890
02:16:58,440 --> 02:17:02,799
on Vortmans square footage of his establishment is being

2891
02:17:02,799 --> 02:17:03,680
cut in half

2892
02:17:03,680 --> 02:17:07,360
basically. He owns about a 24,000 square foot building it's

2893
02:17:07,360 --> 02:17:08,120
being reduced down to

2894
02:17:08,120 --> 02:17:11,840
12,000 square feet and based on our plan we're parking that

2895
02:17:11,840 --> 02:17:13,399
square footage of

2896
02:17:13,399 --> 02:17:22,000
that type of use to code. In the garage. Yeah I understand

2897
02:17:22,000 --> 02:17:22,879
that I'm trying to

2898
02:17:22,879 --> 02:17:25,129
wrap my head around are really increasing spaces if we're

2899
02:17:25,129 --> 02:17:25,680
taking spaces

2900
02:17:25,680 --> 02:17:29,110
away from people who are utilizing them now not affiliated

2901
02:17:29,110 --> 02:17:30,360
with this project. I

2902
02:17:30,360 --> 02:17:34,479
think for the type of use obviously for the type of use I

2903
02:17:34,479 --> 02:17:35,879
think is within code

2904
02:17:35,879 --> 02:17:41,829
but the the retail square footage is being reduced so that

2905
02:17:41,829 --> 02:17:43,479
parking may not

2906
02:17:43,479 --> 02:17:48,040
need to be utilized as it is currently today because the

2907
02:17:48,040 --> 02:17:49,000
the retail usage has

2908
02:17:49,000 --> 02:17:51,049
been cutting ahead. Well the professors have to park

2909
02:17:51,049 --> 02:17:53,239
somewhere. Well the UNT does

2910
02:17:53,239 --> 02:18:00,209
have an underutilized garage. Thank you. Commissioner Hesm

2911
02:18:00,209 --> 02:18:02,520
uth. One and I you may

2912
02:18:02,520 --> 02:18:06,329
not have it ready now but I am very much interested in the

2913
02:18:06,329 --> 02:18:08,319
site you make to the

2914
02:18:08,319 --> 02:18:12,479
2030 plan. If someone can give me I have I had a PDF if

2915
02:18:12,479 --> 02:18:13,239
someone can give me the

2916
02:18:13,239 --> 02:18:16,719
page that you're referencing on the administrative hearing

2917
02:18:16,719 --> 02:18:18,159
that allows for a

2918
02:18:18,159 --> 02:18:23,290
reduction near university or mixed use. You both you have

2919
02:18:23,290 --> 02:18:24,559
cited it but I don't

2920
02:18:24,559 --> 02:18:28,979
I don't I'd like to read it. That I I would have to defer

2921
02:18:28,979 --> 02:18:30,920
to staff. No no I

2922
02:18:30,920 --> 02:18:42,059
mean yes thank you. We're gonna wait for an answer we're

2923
02:18:42,059 --> 02:18:45,680
gonna okay do we have

2924
02:18:45,680 --> 02:18:52,610
any other any other questions for the applicant? Thank you

2925
02:18:52,610 --> 02:18:53,360
sir. Thank you Mr.

2926
02:18:53,360 --> 02:18:59,639
Chairman. This is a public hearing I have a stack of cards

2927
02:18:59,639 --> 02:19:00,280
and we're gonna go

2928
02:19:00,280 --> 02:19:02,680
through these but anyone who wishes to speak this evening

2929
02:19:02,680 --> 02:19:03,520
on this item please

2930
02:19:03,520 --> 02:19:06,409
fill out a card when you come forward if you'll state your

2931
02:19:06,409 --> 02:19:07,600
name and address and

2932
02:19:07,600 --> 02:19:11,270
then you'll have four minutes. The first card first card

2933
02:19:11,270 --> 02:19:13,159
that I have is Donna

2934
02:19:13,159 --> 02:19:18,329
Morris on Oak Street speaking in opposition and that will

2935
02:19:18,329 --> 02:19:19,600
be she will be

2936
02:19:19,600 --> 02:19:24,719
followed by looks like Kim McKibbin.

2937
02:19:27,799 --> 02:19:32,370
I'm Donna Morris I live at 918 West Oak we have owned that

2938
02:19:32,370 --> 02:19:36,440
house for since 2004

2939
02:19:36,440 --> 02:19:40,489
when we first moved there you could walk up and down Oak

2940
02:19:40,489 --> 02:19:41,879
Street and cross the

2941
02:19:41,879 --> 02:19:48,479
street be safe and as things have changed Fry Street

2942
02:19:48,479 --> 02:19:50,959
changed the big

2943
02:19:50,959 --> 02:19:54,879
apartment complex went in with all the students and we were

2944
02:19:54,879 --> 02:19:56,559
told that it really

2945
02:19:56,559 --> 02:20:00,430
wouldn't affect the traffic that much but now if you try to

2946
02:20:00,430 --> 02:20:01,600
back your car out

2947
02:20:01,600 --> 02:20:05,190
on Oak Street any time other than seven o'clock on Sunday

2948
02:20:05,190 --> 02:20:06,760
morning you have to

2949
02:20:06,760 --> 02:20:11,170
wait five to ten minutes to back out. You've spent a lot of

2950
02:20:11,170 --> 02:20:12,559
time on the parking

2951
02:20:12,559 --> 02:20:16,549
situation but nobody's mentioned the traffic increase that

2952
02:20:16,549 --> 02:20:17,360
that would cause

2953
02:20:17,360 --> 02:20:22,299
and it will those cars don't stay parked in those lots all

2954
02:20:22,299 --> 02:20:25,559
week let me tell you.

2955
02:20:25,559 --> 02:20:31,520
UNT does have a underutilized parking garage up there it's

2956
02:20:31,520 --> 02:20:32,360
underutilized

2957
02:20:32,360 --> 02:20:35,920
because they charge too much for the students to park there

2958
02:20:35,920 --> 02:20:37,079
they park all the

2959
02:20:37,079 --> 02:20:41,590
way down Oak Street practically to Carroll Boulevard all

2960
02:20:41,590 --> 02:20:42,799
the way down

2961
02:20:42,799 --> 02:20:46,819
Hickory Street to Carroll Boulevard they park on the

2962
02:20:46,819 --> 02:20:48,719
streets the small streets

2963
02:20:48,719 --> 02:20:52,920
behind us Amarillo, Gregg, Anderson all of those their

2964
02:20:52,920 --> 02:20:55,840
parks so full that it's

2965
02:20:55,840 --> 02:20:59,809
routine for us to go out and have to put a note on a car

2966
02:20:59,809 --> 02:21:01,600
you've blocked my car in

2967
02:21:01,600 --> 02:21:08,340
the parking in the driveway again. You're considering a lot

2968
02:21:08,340 --> 02:21:09,959
on parking and thank

2969
02:21:09,959 --> 02:21:14,209
you I understand that but please consider what you're doing

2970
02:21:14,209 --> 02:21:14,479
to the

2971
02:21:14,479 --> 02:21:18,840
traffic. Okay have a couple questions for you before you go

2972
02:21:18,840 --> 02:21:20,040
. Commissioner Ozil.

2973
02:21:20,040 --> 02:21:23,430
Thank you I appreciate you coming tonight and speaking your

2974
02:21:23,430 --> 02:21:23,879
concerns I

2975
02:21:23,879 --> 02:21:27,489
have a question about traffic are you I want to make sure I

2976
02:21:27,489 --> 02:21:29,280
understand what

2977
02:21:29,280 --> 02:21:31,739
you're requesting or what you're stating to us are you not

2978
02:21:31,739 --> 02:21:32,719
wanting the project

2979
02:21:32,719 --> 02:21:39,159
at all or what do you? Well I understand that times change

2980
02:21:39,159 --> 02:21:41,319
and we get older and so

2981
02:21:41,319 --> 02:21:46,049
forth but we as the residents of Oak Hickory were told when

2982
02:21:46,049 --> 02:21:46,959
that first

2983
02:21:46,959 --> 02:21:51,120
apartment complex went up there were all kinds of traffic

2984
02:21:51,120 --> 02:21:52,760
surveys done most of

2985
02:21:52,760 --> 02:21:56,649
them were done when the students weren't there nothing has

2986
02:21:56,649 --> 02:21:59,040
been done to do

2987
02:21:59,040 --> 02:22:03,639
anything about traffic on Oak and Hickory streets nothing

2988
02:22:03,639 --> 02:22:04,920
the streets are

2989
02:22:04,920 --> 02:22:09,379
the same size right now if you come down Hickory Street and

2990
02:22:09,379 --> 02:22:10,159
cross Carroll

2991
02:22:10,159 --> 02:22:13,239
Boulevard you don't know what lane you're supposed to be in

2992
02:22:13,239 --> 02:22:14,079
and most people

2993
02:22:14,079 --> 02:22:23,719
are in the wrong lane and you have squeezed a bicycle lane

2994
02:22:23,719 --> 02:22:25,120
a left lane only

2995
02:22:25,120 --> 02:22:29,299
a right lane only and lane ahead only and a thing that

2996
02:22:29,299 --> 02:22:30,760
sticks out in the

2997
02:22:30,760 --> 02:22:33,649
middle of the street that makes it look beautiful and there

2998
02:22:33,649 --> 02:22:37,159
's no room for cars

2999
02:22:37,600 --> 02:22:45,299
my husband in August was hit by a car that was backing out

3000
02:22:45,299 --> 02:22:47,239
on Oak Street

3001
02:22:47,239 --> 02:22:51,209
because he was so busy watching for traffic he didn't see

3002
02:22:51,209 --> 02:22:53,860
my husband and the

3003
02:22:53,860 --> 02:22:57,620
traffic is so bad we have to figure out where we're going

3004
02:22:57,620 --> 02:22:58,600
to cross that we get

3005
02:22:58,600 --> 02:23:02,319
enough space that we're able to have time to get across

3006
02:23:02,319 --> 02:23:03,879
before all those cars

3007
02:23:03,879 --> 02:23:10,299
come either I'm willing to pay for a toll gate that goes

3008
02:23:10,299 --> 02:23:11,920
across Oak Street

3009
02:23:11,920 --> 02:23:16,309
to slow them down or something I certainly appreciate the

3010
02:23:16,309 --> 02:23:16,959
feedback on the

3011
02:23:16,959 --> 02:23:21,399
traffic I'm trying to understand is in accordance to this

3012
02:23:21,399 --> 02:23:22,879
proposed project

3013
02:23:22,879 --> 02:23:26,639
how would you what would you like to with the project to

3014
02:23:26,639 --> 02:23:28,239
have I I would like

3015
02:23:28,239 --> 02:23:32,319
the project not to happen until the city makes a real

3016
02:23:32,319 --> 02:23:34,319
commitment to do something

3017
02:23:34,319 --> 02:23:38,659
about the traffic there the city made a commitment several

3018
02:23:38,659 --> 02:23:40,280
years ago and nothing

3019
02:23:40,280 --> 02:23:47,350
happened okay and they they do their surveys in the middle

3020
02:23:47,350 --> 02:23:48,120
of August or the

3021
02:23:48,120 --> 02:23:51,200
middle of January and tell us oh you don't have a problem

3022
02:23:51,200 --> 02:23:52,159
we'll come out and

3023
02:23:52,159 --> 02:23:54,200
sit there for a while and look at it sure and that's

3024
02:23:54,200 --> 02:23:55,600
definitely on the city to

3025
02:23:55,600 --> 02:23:59,540
do yes yes that portion of it I but in terms of the

3026
02:23:59,540 --> 02:24:01,399
developers but if you're

3027
02:24:01,399 --> 02:24:04,989
looking at this project and saying oh they've met

3028
02:24:04,989 --> 02:24:06,840
everything and so forth

3029
02:24:06,840 --> 02:24:11,510
you're not doing what you should be doing for the citizens

3030
02:24:11,510 --> 02:24:13,520
of the city I

3031
02:24:13,520 --> 02:24:16,870
absolutely agree and I take that responsibility seriously

3032
02:24:16,870 --> 02:24:17,840
on how to vote

3033
02:24:17,840 --> 02:24:20,940
that's why I'm just wanting to give you an opportunity to

3034
02:24:20,940 --> 02:24:21,879
express are you

3035
02:24:21,879 --> 02:24:24,600
saying that there should be less parking there should be

3036
02:24:24,600 --> 02:24:25,559
more parking at the

3037
02:24:25,559 --> 02:24:28,100
building I'm trying to understand in relation to the

3038
02:24:28,100 --> 02:24:30,000
project relation to the

3039
02:24:30,000 --> 02:24:33,409
project I'm not worried about the parking I'm telling you

3040
02:24:33,409 --> 02:24:34,440
that those cars

3041
02:24:34,440 --> 02:24:38,159
won't stay parked there all week they go up and down the

3042
02:24:38,159 --> 02:24:40,600
street you as the city

3043
02:24:40,600 --> 02:24:46,649
would be putting 300 more cars in the traffic on Oak Street

3044
02:24:46,649 --> 02:24:48,799
in an area that's

3045
02:24:48,799 --> 02:24:53,260
not equipped to take it now okay thank you couple more

3046
02:24:53,260 --> 02:24:54,319
questions for you

3047
02:24:54,319 --> 02:24:58,559
Commissioner back thank you thank you miss Morris for

3048
02:24:58,559 --> 02:25:00,159
coming down speaking let

3049
02:25:00,159 --> 02:25:02,739
me ask you a question I want to pose this to every other

3050
02:25:02,739 --> 02:25:03,639
individual that

3051
02:25:03,639 --> 02:25:06,790
comes down and speaks tonight you say you've been in on

3052
02:25:06,790 --> 02:25:07,760
your Oak Street house

3053
02:25:07,760 --> 02:25:11,180
since 2004 so you were there you weren't there when they

3054
02:25:11,180 --> 02:25:12,479
did sub area a which was

3055
02:25:12,479 --> 02:25:15,829
in 2000 but you were there when they did sub area B which

3056
02:25:15,829 --> 02:25:18,000
is 2010 at that time

3057
02:25:18,000 --> 02:25:21,879
did you agree with the changes were you part of the process

3058
02:25:21,879 --> 02:25:23,120
we were part of the

3059
02:25:23,120 --> 02:25:26,010
people that were saying you've got to do something about

3060
02:25:26,010 --> 02:25:27,600
the traffic okay I did

3061
02:25:27,600 --> 02:25:31,000
we did not agree with it we didn't agree with it when they

3062
02:25:31,000 --> 02:25:32,239
were putting trying to

3063
02:25:32,239 --> 02:25:39,549
put three or four fast food restaurants in there when they

3064
02:25:39,549 --> 02:25:40,319
were trying to put

3065
02:25:40,319 --> 02:25:47,090
the CVS pharmacy in there we we feel I understand that the

3066
02:25:47,090 --> 02:25:48,840
city moves forward

3067
02:25:48,840 --> 02:25:53,930
and you have to make changes and so forth but I feel that

3068
02:25:53,930 --> 02:25:55,639
over and over again

3069
02:25:55,639 --> 02:26:01,909
we have been told one thing and given nothing okay so you

3070
02:26:01,909 --> 02:26:04,000
feel like that you

3071
02:26:04,000 --> 02:26:07,600
were opposed to it essentially the both of the changes

3072
02:26:07,600 --> 02:26:10,079
there and your feeling is

3073
02:26:10,079 --> 02:26:16,719
what now if this one goes up my feeling now is don't build

3074
02:26:16,719 --> 02:26:17,879
anything else don't

3075
02:26:17,879 --> 02:26:20,719
put anything else in there until you take care of the

3076
02:26:20,719 --> 02:26:21,959
traffic problems you

3077
02:26:21,959 --> 02:26:27,920
have now okay okay thank you Commissioner Hesworth thank

3078
02:26:27,920 --> 02:26:29,000
you chair one

3079
02:26:29,000 --> 02:26:32,149
quick I have a question but I want to get make sure I have

3080
02:26:32,149 --> 02:26:33,200
my boundaries right

3081
02:26:33,200 --> 02:26:38,020
but all what where does city of Denton versus you and T

3082
02:26:38,020 --> 02:26:40,280
fall on this particular

3083
02:26:40,280 --> 02:26:44,440
area as far as control just give me some direction there

3084
02:26:44,440 --> 02:26:45,319
are you referencing in

3085
02:26:45,319 --> 02:26:50,299
terms of ownership in terms of who manages the road and who

3086
02:26:50,299 --> 02:26:51,200
has ability to

3087
02:26:51,200 --> 02:26:55,309
widen the road that those restrictions okay I'm actually

3088
02:26:55,309 --> 02:26:56,120
going to ask Earl to

3089
02:26:56,120 --> 02:26:58,340
come down and speak to some of the traffic issues he's

3090
02:26:58,340 --> 02:26:59,239
present in terms of

3091
02:26:59,239 --> 02:27:02,569
the right-of-way that is city owned right-of-way but there

3092
02:27:02,569 --> 02:27:03,559
are some I believe

3093
02:27:03,559 --> 02:27:05,920
as it relates to parking mechanisms perhaps not in this

3094
02:27:05,920 --> 02:27:06,719
area but further

3095
02:27:06,719 --> 02:27:10,239
down the street but if you have any specificity associated

3096
02:27:10,239 --> 02:27:11,120
with well

3097
02:27:11,120 --> 02:27:16,760
specifically I want to try to focus focus on her concern

3098
02:27:16,760 --> 02:27:19,040
being the

3099
02:27:19,040 --> 02:27:24,479
development bringing more traffic to Oak fry Street Oak in

3100
02:27:24,479 --> 02:27:25,879
general Hickory Street

3101
02:27:25,879 --> 02:27:29,700
in general specifically with this project that corner fry

3102
02:27:29,700 --> 02:27:30,719
Street Oak right

3103
02:27:30,719 --> 02:27:35,600
there but I don't know that that's fall I don't know if we

3104
02:27:35,600 --> 02:27:37,120
have any control over

3105
02:27:37,120 --> 02:27:42,530
that we city have any control over that particular segment

3106
02:27:42,530 --> 02:27:45,639
of street sure if

3107
02:27:45,639 --> 02:27:48,600
Earl can come down and perhaps shed some light on the TIA

3108
02:27:48,600 --> 02:27:49,700
that was submitted

3109
02:27:49,700 --> 02:27:53,280
because that those parameters reflected in the TIA okay so

3110
02:27:53,280 --> 02:27:54,319
don't I want to I

3111
02:27:54,319 --> 02:27:59,319
have a question thank you thank you Earl can we also get

3112
02:27:59,319 --> 02:28:00,360
the date on the TIA

3113
02:28:00,360 --> 02:28:05,959
when it was performed please yes let me backtrack to the T

3114
02:28:05,959 --> 02:28:07,319
IA that was performed

3115
02:28:07,319 --> 02:28:11,190
for the fry Street development it was performed back in

3116
02:28:11,190 --> 02:28:13,520
2010 and when they

3117
02:28:13,520 --> 02:28:20,120
came in they projected the development by making certain

3118
02:28:20,120 --> 02:28:20,639
percentage of

3119
02:28:20,639 --> 02:28:24,440
assumptions of modes of transportation because it's a

3120
02:28:24,440 --> 02:28:25,520
single single resident

3121
02:28:25,520 --> 02:28:28,799
or single room occupancy type development geared towards

3122
02:28:28,799 --> 02:28:29,399
students and

3123
02:28:29,399 --> 02:28:33,399
so when the TIA came in they made assumptions on which mode

3124
02:28:33,399 --> 02:28:33,559
of

3125
02:28:33,559 --> 02:28:37,290
transportation this development take whether it's

3126
02:28:37,290 --> 02:28:39,159
pedestrian or pedestrian

3127
02:28:39,159 --> 02:28:42,260
and bicycle vehicle or buses and so based on that they

3128
02:28:42,260 --> 02:28:43,719
projected the vehicle

3129
02:28:43,719 --> 02:28:47,649
trips to be 79 in the morning during the peak hours which

3130
02:28:47,649 --> 02:28:48,959
is your seven to nine

3131
02:28:48,959 --> 02:28:55,819
and 143 in the afternoon which is your four to six time

3132
02:28:55,819 --> 02:28:57,239
slot and that's usually

3133
02:28:57,239 --> 02:29:00,829
the peak hours of the background itself when everybody's

3134
02:29:00,829 --> 02:29:02,159
most likely going to

3135
02:29:02,159 --> 02:29:04,829
work during those times we're coming back from work and so

3136
02:29:04,829 --> 02:29:06,319
what we did as

3137
02:29:06,319 --> 02:29:11,229
staff earlier this week as we went out there and actually

3138
02:29:11,229 --> 02:29:12,680
observed the traffic

3139
02:29:12,680 --> 02:29:16,110
flow that fry Street development just to see how it matched

3140
02:29:16,110 --> 02:29:18,680
up to the TIA

3141
02:29:18,680 --> 02:29:23,420
and we calculated or recounted 63 in the morning and 156 in

3142
02:29:23,420 --> 02:29:24,440
the afternoon so it's

3143
02:29:24,440 --> 02:29:29,469
it's almost some almost spot-on to what the TIA was was

3144
02:29:29,469 --> 02:29:32,719
assuming and so going

3145
02:29:32,719 --> 02:29:37,030
back to the going to the Hickory Street development that

3146
02:29:37,030 --> 02:29:40,520
was performed I can

3147
02:29:40,520 --> 02:29:55,040
find the cover sheet and June of this year this development

3148
02:29:55,040 --> 02:29:55,879
is half the size

3149
02:29:55,879 --> 02:29:59,760
in terms of number of bedrooms fry Street has 620 beds this

3150
02:29:59,760 --> 02:30:00,399
development has

3151
02:30:00,399 --> 02:30:05,520
300 the retail component is a little bit larger than their

3152
02:30:05,520 --> 02:30:06,239
fry Street but the

3153
02:30:06,239 --> 02:30:08,469
businesses that are going into the retail component of this

3154
02:30:08,469 --> 02:30:09,079
development are

3155
02:30:09,079 --> 02:30:11,190
the same businesses that are being torn out the warm ins

3156
02:30:11,190 --> 02:30:12,600
and the subway so the

3157
02:30:12,600 --> 02:30:15,489
traffic counts for the commercial component should be awash

3158
02:30:15,489 --> 02:30:15,840
so that

3159
02:30:15,840 --> 02:30:20,860
increase in traffic is primarily the multifamily component

3160
02:30:20,860 --> 02:30:22,159
or the student

3161
02:30:22,159 --> 02:30:27,680
bedrooms and so they projected a peak a.m. of 75 and a peak

3162
02:30:27,680 --> 02:30:30,879
p.m. of 108 which

3163
02:30:30,879 --> 02:30:36,069
is somewhat proportionate to the fry Street development in

3164
02:30:36,069 --> 02:30:36,719
terms of scale and

3165
02:30:36,719 --> 02:30:41,659
size and so you know given the background traffic right now

3166
02:30:41,659 --> 02:30:42,360
there's

3167
02:30:42,360 --> 02:30:48,629
about 800 trips in a peak hour on oak and similar amount

3168
02:30:48,629 --> 02:30:50,360
along Hickory and so

3169
02:30:50,360 --> 02:30:53,969
I mean percentage wise it's really not that much of an

3170
02:30:53,969 --> 02:30:56,760
increase less than 10%

3171
02:30:56,760 --> 02:31:01,170
there are some when we were out there observing the traffic

3172
02:31:01,170 --> 02:31:02,280
there are some

3173
02:31:02,280 --> 02:31:06,709
speed issues that can be addressed they're just traffic

3174
02:31:06,709 --> 02:31:07,920
just flying through

3175
02:31:07,920 --> 02:31:12,159
through Oak Street primarily that's where the main entrance

3176
02:31:12,159 --> 02:31:13,319
to the fry Street

3177
02:31:13,319 --> 02:31:18,360
development is now so there are some mechanisms or

3178
02:31:18,360 --> 02:31:19,840
processes that we can

3179
02:31:19,840 --> 02:31:23,530
implement to slow that traffic down whether it's police at

3180
02:31:23,530 --> 02:31:24,440
first and you

3181
02:31:24,440 --> 02:31:28,200
know if that can't be resolved then maybe there's some

3182
02:31:28,200 --> 02:31:28,920
traffic calming

3183
02:31:28,920 --> 02:31:33,319
devices that could be inserted along oak through our

3184
02:31:33,319 --> 02:31:38,840
traffic department so

3185
02:31:38,840 --> 02:31:44,909
so is that our is that under our city of Denton purview to

3186
02:31:44,909 --> 02:31:47,120
so traffic calming

3187
02:31:47,120 --> 02:31:50,899
the those type mechanisms or is that you and tease that

3188
02:31:50,899 --> 02:31:52,280
would be the city of

3189
02:31:52,280 --> 02:31:56,100
Denton okay so that's our roadway thank you that is so if I

3190
02:31:56,100 --> 02:31:57,920
may sure continues

3191
02:31:57,920 --> 02:32:04,520
thank you okay thank you so miss Morris understanding we're

3192
02:32:04,520 --> 02:32:05,159
looking at this

3193
02:32:05,159 --> 02:32:09,370
particular project I want to I want to try to I think we

3194
02:32:09,370 --> 02:32:11,079
can agree that you and

3195
02:32:11,079 --> 02:32:15,129
T in and of itself is growing and more students and they

3196
02:32:15,129 --> 02:32:16,600
have a Dallas campuses

3197
02:32:16,600 --> 02:32:20,670
commuting in and they have the satellite campus there near

3198
02:32:20,670 --> 02:32:22,559
Luke 28 that's growing

3199
02:32:22,559 --> 02:32:26,120
and so I think overall I don't want to hold this particular

3200
02:32:26,120 --> 02:32:27,000
applicant

3201
02:32:27,000 --> 02:32:30,760
responsible for being next to a university that's growing

3202
02:32:30,760 --> 02:32:32,520
that's that's

3203
02:32:32,520 --> 02:32:37,489
the goal right and so I'm curious they make the point okay

3204
02:32:37,489 --> 02:32:38,399
someone's closer to

3205
02:32:38,399 --> 02:32:41,129
the university they're gonna walk they experience the same

3206
02:32:41,129 --> 02:32:42,040
traffic headaches

3207
02:32:42,040 --> 02:32:44,930
that everyone else does so they say hey I'm motivated just

3208
02:32:44,930 --> 02:32:45,719
to walk or ride a

3209
02:32:45,719 --> 02:32:50,079
bike or you zip car does that resonate with you I'm just

3210
02:32:50,079 --> 02:32:52,000
curious does that make

3211
02:32:52,000 --> 02:32:54,270
sense that they're gonna experience the same traffic and

3212
02:32:54,270 --> 02:32:55,239
they would look to

3213
02:32:55,239 --> 02:33:00,209
avoid that by being close to campus and using other modes

3214
02:33:00,209 --> 02:33:02,000
of transportation

3215
02:33:05,879 --> 02:33:11,059
well I don't know that they I understand that they would

3216
02:33:11,059 --> 02:33:14,360
not be using their cars

3217
02:33:14,360 --> 02:33:27,379
to go to school you and T is growing there are other areas

3218
02:33:27,379 --> 02:33:32,879
farther west of

3219
02:33:32,879 --> 02:33:39,340
UNT you look at the apartments that have gone in near the

3220
02:33:39,340 --> 02:33:43,159
hospital complex the

3221
02:33:43,159 --> 02:33:49,959
the road the roads and infrastructure there are far better

3222
02:33:49,959 --> 02:33:53,200
for the density that

3223
02:33:53,200 --> 02:33:57,209
it's going in that has gone in there then the

3224
02:33:57,209 --> 02:34:00,559
infrastructure on Oak Street

3225
02:34:00,559 --> 02:34:04,120
for the density that you're talking about putting in there

3226
02:34:04,120 --> 02:34:07,000
got it okay well

3227
02:34:07,000 --> 02:34:09,520
thank you thank you one more question ma'am

3228
02:34:09,520 --> 02:34:13,879
Commissioner Rizzo thank you this is actually for our all

3229
02:34:13,879 --> 02:34:15,360
thank you thank you

3230
02:34:15,360 --> 02:34:19,920
very much this might just be for the edification of all

3231
02:34:19,920 --> 02:34:21,719
involved it's my

3232
02:34:21,719 --> 02:34:24,110
understanding mobility plan has three basic types of roads

3233
02:34:24,110 --> 02:34:25,079
major artilleries

3234
02:34:25,079 --> 02:34:29,399
secondary arteries and then collector streets and Oak

3235
02:34:29,399 --> 02:34:30,680
Street is on the

3236
02:34:30,680 --> 02:34:35,590
ability plan designated as a secondary artery keys it's

3237
02:34:35,590 --> 02:34:36,360
considered more like a

3238
02:34:36,360 --> 02:34:40,180
one-way couplet so between the combination of Hickory on

3239
02:34:40,180 --> 02:34:40,920
the south

3240
02:34:40,920 --> 02:34:43,319
side and oak on the north side kind of serves as that

3241
02:34:43,319 --> 02:34:45,040
secondary arterial can

3242
02:34:45,040 --> 02:34:49,149
type can you tell me what what the expectation is of a

3243
02:34:49,149 --> 02:34:50,879
secondary arterial

3244
02:34:50,879 --> 02:34:53,579
street what is what does that mean what is what is the

3245
02:34:53,579 --> 02:34:54,959
secondary arterial mean

3246
02:34:54,959 --> 02:34:58,559
secondary arterial it's I mean essentially the principle of

3247
02:34:58,559 --> 02:34:59,159
an arterial

3248
02:34:59,159 --> 02:35:04,239
is to move traffic from one side of town to the other and a

3249
02:35:04,239 --> 02:35:06,000
quick as possible

3250
02:35:06,000 --> 02:35:10,899
manner now the difference between a secondary arterial and

3251
02:35:10,899 --> 02:35:11,559
primary arterial is

3252
02:35:11,559 --> 02:35:15,200
just the volume of traffic the because a primary arterial

3253
02:35:15,200 --> 02:35:16,680
has six lanes that are

3254
02:35:16,680 --> 02:35:20,430
divided in a secondary only has two lanes okay and if I

3255
02:35:20,430 --> 02:35:21,680
understand this the

3256
02:35:21,680 --> 02:35:26,280
front west of Carroll there's a major artery arterial at

3257
02:35:26,280 --> 02:35:28,239
University and then

3258
02:35:28,239 --> 02:35:31,409
their secondary is at Eagle and Oak is that the general

3259
02:35:31,409 --> 02:35:32,799
flow from Carroll West

3260
02:35:32,799 --> 02:35:39,079
Eagle Oak University that are your major quiz in you west

3261
02:35:39,079 --> 02:35:40,200
okay corridors

3262
02:35:40,200 --> 02:35:43,719
that's correct okay thank you mm-hmm

3263
02:35:44,040 --> 02:35:50,770
thank you our next speaker is Kimmy McKibbin at Hickory

3264
02:35:50,770 --> 02:35:51,879
Street speaking in

3265
02:35:51,879 --> 02:36:00,000
opposition to be followed by Anderson Mary or Manny good

3266
02:36:00,000 --> 02:36:01,680
evening this makes

3267
02:36:01,680 --> 02:36:03,920
the fourth time that I've been a community hearing about

3268
02:36:03,920 --> 02:36:04,479
this particular

3269
02:36:04,479 --> 02:36:08,350
project my name is Kim McKibbin and I own the building and

3270
02:36:08,350 --> 02:36:10,280
the business at 1306

3271
02:36:10,280 --> 02:36:15,489
West Hickory that is adjacent to this property and I think

3272
02:36:15,489 --> 02:36:15,840
it's very

3273
02:36:15,840 --> 02:36:22,110
interesting that this was brought up and he talked to you

3274
02:36:22,110 --> 02:36:23,600
about adjacent

3275
02:36:23,600 --> 02:36:27,670
properties having already been talked to and agreeing I'm

3276
02:36:27,670 --> 02:36:28,600
not sure what that is

3277
02:36:28,600 --> 02:36:31,629
if it's because I do kind of share a wall with one that

3278
02:36:31,629 --> 02:36:32,719
they're going to

3279
02:36:32,719 --> 02:36:36,649
tear down those little six spaces there on Hickory and no

3280
02:36:36,649 --> 02:36:38,079
they have not talked

3281
02:36:38,079 --> 02:36:42,379
to me so I'm not sure what they're referring to about about

3282
02:36:42,379 --> 02:36:43,799
that a lot of

3283
02:36:43,799 --> 02:36:46,360
people have talked about the parking here parking is an

3284
02:36:46,360 --> 02:36:47,440
issue they have not

3285
02:36:47,440 --> 02:36:51,040
brought up the fact that they are removing 68 parking

3286
02:36:51,040 --> 02:36:52,200
places from account

3287
02:36:52,200 --> 02:36:55,209
walking around in the parking lot including the only three

3288
02:36:55,209 --> 02:36:55,959
handicapped

3289
02:36:55,959 --> 02:37:01,120
spaces in that section to build the building so they're

3290
02:37:01,120 --> 02:37:02,799
taking away 68

3291
02:37:02,799 --> 02:37:06,290
spaces and I am including the ones along the front on Hick

3292
02:37:06,290 --> 02:37:07,440
ory Street that are

3293
02:37:07,440 --> 02:37:10,329
currently public parking and have meters so yeah that's

3294
02:37:10,329 --> 02:37:12,760
what they're taking away

3295
02:37:12,760 --> 02:37:16,190
traffic is is pretty much a nightmare I can tell you that

3296
02:37:16,190 --> 02:37:17,360
coming down Hickory

3297
02:37:17,360 --> 02:37:20,719
Street it's very dangerous I can tell you that the traffic

3298
02:37:20,719 --> 02:37:22,200
backs up from the red

3299
02:37:22,200 --> 02:37:26,110
light at Fry Street to the red light up at CVS and past

3300
02:37:26,110 --> 02:37:27,959
that so you're literally

3301
02:37:27,959 --> 02:37:31,309
waiting for the lights to change to come through but I don

3302
02:37:31,309 --> 02:37:33,239
't think that it's I

3303
02:37:33,239 --> 02:37:37,500
think that the argument about the traffic is a distractor

3304
02:37:37,500 --> 02:37:38,639
in the case for

3305
02:37:38,639 --> 02:37:42,440
this building this building does not fit the current

3306
02:37:42,440 --> 02:37:44,639
ordinance this contractor is

3307
02:37:44,639 --> 02:37:48,680
asking you to change your city ordinance to change your

3308
02:37:48,680 --> 02:37:49,959
city laws so that they

3309
02:37:49,959 --> 02:37:54,649
can make a bigger profit something about that irritates me

3310
02:37:54,649 --> 02:37:55,719
just a little bit I

3311
02:37:55,719 --> 02:37:59,190
came back to the Fry Street area I bought the building I

3312
02:37:59,190 --> 02:37:59,959
bought the

3313
02:37:59,959 --> 02:38:03,180
business I want to be there to stay I'm aware of what the

3314
02:38:03,180 --> 02:38:05,200
2030 plan is and the

3315
02:38:05,200 --> 02:38:08,719
understanding that this area is a buffer zone between the

3316
02:38:08,719 --> 02:38:10,159
university that does

3317
02:38:10,159 --> 02:38:14,520
not mean that is a big stone wall that means that you have

3318
02:38:14,520 --> 02:38:15,840
a way to gradually

3319
02:38:15,840 --> 02:38:19,770
move from the university back into the neighborhood and I

3320
02:38:19,770 --> 02:38:20,879
understand the

3321
02:38:20,879 --> 02:38:23,750
university's growing but the city of Denton and the

3322
02:38:23,750 --> 02:38:25,079
citizens of Denton are

3323
02:38:25,079 --> 02:38:28,510
not completely responsible for supporting the growth of the

3324
02:38:28,510 --> 02:38:29,239
University

3325
02:38:29,239 --> 02:38:31,989
of North Texas and sometimes that's what we have to look at

3326
02:38:31,989 --> 02:38:33,079
is what's happening

3327
02:38:33,079 --> 02:38:36,319
now another thing about this particular building is that it

3328
02:38:36,319 --> 02:38:37,360
's real pretty here

3329
02:38:37,360 --> 02:38:41,069
on this picture and the this car that's here is sitting

3330
02:38:41,069 --> 02:38:42,639
with its nose in where

3331
02:38:42,639 --> 02:38:45,930
my building would be so there's there's some things like

3332
02:38:45,930 --> 02:38:47,159
that that are happening

3333
02:38:47,159 --> 02:38:51,780
also these buildings these apartments mr. Husspeth asked I

3334
02:38:51,780 --> 02:38:52,719
've got four girls

3335
02:38:52,719 --> 02:38:55,280
what's to keep them from putting a gentleman in there that

3336
02:38:55,280 --> 02:38:56,079
's not so much

3337
02:38:56,079 --> 02:38:58,680
the problem mr. Husspeth from what I talked to the students

3338
02:38:58,680 --> 02:38:59,360
about that have

3339
02:38:59,360 --> 02:39:02,799
these apartments as much as it is there's four people in

3340
02:39:02,799 --> 02:39:03,840
the department and

3341
02:39:03,840 --> 02:39:07,360
then there's somebody's boyfriend with a child somebody's

3342
02:39:07,360 --> 02:39:08,399
girlfriend with a child

3343
02:39:08,399 --> 02:39:11,750
if you've got a room in an apartment that you're paying

3344
02:39:11,750 --> 02:39:13,399
over $700 for

3345
02:39:13,399 --> 02:39:16,860
sometimes you're gonna have split that room and it turns

3346
02:39:16,860 --> 02:39:18,120
into more people in

3347
02:39:18,120 --> 02:39:20,930
the building than what they ever anticipated and yes it

3348
02:39:20,930 --> 02:39:22,319
does happen you

3349
02:39:22,319 --> 02:39:24,909
know they bring in the boyfriend the boyfriend brings in

3350
02:39:24,909 --> 02:39:25,760
the the child and

3351
02:39:25,760 --> 02:39:29,030
then you have a whole assortment of things going on I think

3352
02:39:29,030 --> 02:39:29,760
that using

3353
02:39:29,760 --> 02:39:34,409
Sterling house and Fry Street and 33 North are bad examples

3354
02:39:34,409 --> 02:39:35,559
in these cases

3355
02:39:35,559 --> 02:39:39,969
they've made for bad neighbors and they've changed the the

3356
02:39:39,969 --> 02:39:41,120
feeling of the

3357
02:39:41,120 --> 02:39:43,049
neighborhood they've changed the purpose of the

3358
02:39:43,049 --> 02:39:45,280
neighborhood in a lot of ways so

3359
02:39:45,280 --> 02:39:48,899
you have to consider that comparing just because one got

3360
02:39:48,899 --> 02:39:49,959
built doesn't mean they

3361
02:39:49,959 --> 02:39:53,299
shouldn't build a bigger one one's enough one's really

3362
02:39:53,299 --> 02:39:54,959
enough and the

3363
02:39:54,959 --> 02:40:00,319
property can be utilized in a more community oriented way

3364
02:40:00,319 --> 02:40:01,360
it can also be

3365
02:40:01,360 --> 02:40:05,790
have more housing not housing but retail in it when he says

3366
02:40:05,790 --> 02:40:07,079
that most the first

3367
02:40:07,079 --> 02:40:10,989
floor is retail I disagree because there's a pool and there

3368
02:40:10,989 --> 02:40:11,680
's a patio and

3369
02:40:11,680 --> 02:40:15,719
all those amenities on the first on the first level of this

3370
02:40:15,719 --> 02:40:17,159
apartment complex

3371
02:40:17,159 --> 02:40:19,840
there's so many things that I'd really like to talk to you

3372
02:40:19,840 --> 02:40:20,879
guys about about

3373
02:40:20,879 --> 02:40:23,700
this but one other thing that I want to bring up very

3374
02:40:23,700 --> 02:40:25,239
quickly is to get the fire

3375
02:40:25,239 --> 02:40:30,950
lane that they wanted they have a two-lane street that

3376
02:40:30,950 --> 02:40:32,319
comes down the

3377
02:40:32,319 --> 02:40:37,540
east side of this building and it comes in and out on Hick

3378
02:40:37,540 --> 02:40:39,159
ory and I can't speak

3379
02:40:39,159 --> 02:40:41,670
oh I know people really go really fast on oak but I know

3380
02:40:41,670 --> 02:40:42,920
people go really fast

3381
02:40:42,920 --> 02:40:46,340
on Hickory too so to get in and out on the Hickory coming

3382
02:40:46,340 --> 02:40:47,479
down that street

3383
02:40:47,479 --> 02:40:50,149
they're going to be dealing with all the traffic with the

3384
02:40:50,149 --> 02:40:51,120
speed with the hill

3385
02:40:51,120 --> 02:40:54,010
it's going to be a dangerous situation so I'm just

3386
02:40:54,010 --> 02:40:55,719
concerned about that when I

3387
02:40:55,719 --> 02:41:01,000
look at this particular diagram for things so I'm asking

3388
02:41:01,000 --> 02:41:03,079
that this project

3389
02:41:03,079 --> 02:41:07,079
not be built unless it can conform to our ordinances to

3390
02:41:07,079 --> 02:41:09,000
what the original Fry

3391
02:41:09,000 --> 02:41:11,700
Street ordinance was and I don't think they have any

3392
02:41:11,700 --> 02:41:13,000
intention of doing that

3393
02:41:13,000 --> 02:41:16,229
because it's not profitable for them I think it's a lovely

3394
02:41:16,229 --> 02:41:17,360
project I don't I

3395
02:41:17,360 --> 02:41:21,370
think this is the wrong place to put it got a question for

3396
02:41:21,370 --> 02:41:22,120
you yes sir

3397
02:41:22,120 --> 02:41:24,639
Commissioner Beck thank you chair thank you miss Kevin for

3398
02:41:24,639 --> 02:41:25,600
your presentation and

3399
02:41:25,600 --> 02:41:28,690
to my question to miss Morris how long have you been at

3400
02:41:28,690 --> 02:41:29,760
your location on

3401
02:41:29,760 --> 02:41:33,139
Hickory Street I bought the building three years ago the

3402
02:41:33,139 --> 02:41:33,680
building in the

3403
02:41:33,680 --> 02:41:37,280
business I have been on the front in the Fry Street area

3404
02:41:37,280 --> 02:41:39,360
and in Denton since 1981

3405
02:41:39,360 --> 02:41:43,819
okay so were you part of the process when sub area a and B

3406
02:41:43,819 --> 02:41:45,520
were developed and

3407
02:41:45,520 --> 02:41:53,270
if so how were you about this change I wasn't okay with

3408
02:41:53,270 --> 02:41:54,840
this change I think that

3409
02:41:54,840 --> 02:42:00,329
when they raised all the buildings there in sub area a that

3410
02:42:00,329 --> 02:42:02,000
we lost a piece of

3411
02:42:02,000 --> 02:42:05,059
history in Denton the historical buildings that we lost the

3412
02:42:05,059 --> 02:42:05,719
character of

3413
02:42:05,719 --> 02:42:09,010
those buildings the community that was there and at that

3414
02:42:09,010 --> 02:42:10,079
time you know they

3415
02:42:10,079 --> 02:42:13,239
basically said don't worry it'll just move down the street

3416
02:42:13,239 --> 02:42:13,879
well it did it all

3417
02:42:13,879 --> 02:42:17,260
moved down the street to Main Street and on past that and

3418
02:42:17,260 --> 02:42:18,600
into the industrial

3419
02:42:18,600 --> 02:42:22,280
area so now we've got a big mess down there too but no I

3420
02:42:22,280 --> 02:42:24,040
think that didn't

3421
02:42:24,040 --> 02:42:26,750
really lost some of its character when they lost those

3422
02:42:26,750 --> 02:42:28,040
buildings and I felt for

3423
02:42:28,040 --> 02:42:31,079
these people because that live in the historic buildings

3424
02:42:31,079 --> 02:42:31,940
around it because

3425
02:42:31,940 --> 02:42:34,569
this is not what they bargained for when they bought those

3426
02:42:34,569 --> 02:42:35,879
houses that's not what

3427
02:42:35,879 --> 02:42:40,860
it was and you know to have a building that big go up four

3428
02:42:40,860 --> 02:42:41,840
stories it

3429
02:42:41,840 --> 02:42:44,959
overpowers anything that's across the street on the campus

3430
02:42:44,959 --> 02:42:45,479
so there's not

3431
02:42:45,479 --> 02:42:49,000
really a transition you've got a wall there the businesses

3432
02:42:49,000 --> 02:42:51,840
that are there are

3433
02:42:51,840 --> 02:42:55,260
a lot of them had gone out of business recently because of

3434
02:42:55,260 --> 02:42:56,520
different various

3435
02:42:56,520 --> 02:43:00,090
things the parking that's there they have parking for the

3436
02:43:00,090 --> 02:43:01,079
public on the

3437
02:43:01,079 --> 02:43:06,680
bottom floor so you know so you want to compare that you

3438
02:43:06,680 --> 02:43:07,440
feel like your worst

3439
02:43:07,440 --> 02:43:10,620
fears have been realized in with these the two buildings

3440
02:43:10,620 --> 02:43:11,840
that are already there

3441
02:43:11,840 --> 02:43:15,709
are you concerned that this is are you talking about the

3442
02:43:15,709 --> 02:43:16,879
one building that's

3443
02:43:16,879 --> 02:43:22,129
there well both you got the student building and then the

3444
02:43:22,129 --> 02:43:23,200
apartment complex

3445
02:43:23,200 --> 02:43:27,549
sub area a was the first one yeah to 2000 sub area B was

3446
02:43:27,549 --> 02:43:29,920
2010 so well it's

3447
02:43:29,920 --> 02:43:33,799
2010 the the one that was fry Street sterling house yeah

3448
02:43:33,799 --> 02:43:35,239
those things I think

3449
02:43:35,239 --> 02:43:40,510
you have to really take into consideration what it did for

3450
02:43:40,510 --> 02:43:41,319
the whole

3451
02:43:41,319 --> 02:43:44,280
neighborhood or what it didn't do for the neighborhood so

3452
02:43:44,280 --> 02:43:46,000
if you focus on

3453
02:43:46,000 --> 02:43:49,500
parking and you focus on traffic and you don't focus on the

3454
02:43:49,500 --> 02:43:50,719
the people that live

3455
02:43:50,719 --> 02:43:53,940
there those of us that work there you're kind of missing

3456
02:43:53,940 --> 02:43:55,159
the ball for us because

3457
02:43:55,159 --> 02:43:57,879
that's what the ordinances were originally written for was

3458
02:43:57,879 --> 02:43:58,440
to protect

3459
02:43:58,440 --> 02:44:02,319
that certain area okay thank you you're welcome one more

3460
02:44:02,319 --> 02:44:02,879
question for you

3461
02:44:02,879 --> 02:44:09,459
Commissioner Hesbeth so I want to you own the young the

3462
02:44:09,459 --> 02:44:10,200
coffee shop there I

3463
02:44:10,200 --> 02:44:14,090
mean right okay and so I want to kind of explore that with

3464
02:44:14,090 --> 02:44:14,559
you a little bit

3465
02:44:14,559 --> 02:44:17,450
because you have a unit you have a unique insight to that

3466
02:44:17,450 --> 02:44:18,159
so there's a

3467
02:44:18,159 --> 02:44:20,489
business out of the business that we all get I mean you

3468
02:44:20,489 --> 02:44:21,760
understand just like

3469
02:44:21,760 --> 02:44:25,200
anyone would I mean I wouldn't be able to come in a coffee

3470
02:44:25,200 --> 02:44:26,040
shop and say a

3471
02:44:26,040 --> 02:44:29,120
coffee bean cost this so extrapolate hot water and I should

3472
02:44:29,120 --> 02:44:30,079
be able to pay that

3473
02:44:30,079 --> 02:44:33,479
I mean there's other other factors in there so I'm curious

3474
02:44:33,479 --> 02:44:35,319
though with this

3475
02:44:35,319 --> 02:44:39,559
project specifically I think miss Morris brings a good

3476
02:44:39,559 --> 02:44:40,319
point there's a lot of

3477
02:44:40,319 --> 02:44:46,899
development off campus that I think generates a lot of

3478
02:44:46,899 --> 02:44:47,920
traffic on campus I

3479
02:44:47,920 --> 02:44:51,889
mean because specifically that that complex near the near

3480
02:44:51,889 --> 02:44:52,920
Presbyterian

3481
02:44:52,920 --> 02:44:55,420
Hospital is huge and growing and they're developing those

3482
02:44:55,420 --> 02:44:56,420
different areas and

3483
02:44:56,420 --> 02:45:00,319
they use and it I think that's oak or hickory and so it

3484
02:45:00,319 --> 02:45:02,520
leads you know and so

3485
02:45:02,520 --> 02:45:07,879
and with University being in the shape it is it almost

3486
02:45:07,879 --> 02:45:09,040
motivates people to go

3487
02:45:09,040 --> 02:45:15,819
through oak so I want to set aside the traffic for a second

3488
02:45:15,819 --> 02:45:16,799
just the business

3489
02:45:16,799 --> 02:45:20,430
it would enhance the area because you have that little

3490
02:45:20,430 --> 02:45:21,959
corner right where they

3491
02:45:21,959 --> 02:45:24,450
park their bikes it's kind of dark and I think there's a

3492
02:45:24,450 --> 02:45:25,680
stairway they next year

3493
02:45:25,680 --> 02:45:29,799
yeah that is part of my building yeah so it enhances the

3494
02:45:29,799 --> 02:45:32,319
area by by default just

3495
02:45:32,319 --> 02:45:35,770
kind of along fordman's I'm assuming that's more like that

3496
02:45:35,770 --> 02:45:39,440
sort of thing but

3497
02:45:40,399 --> 02:45:43,079
can you see the good I guess to start there can you see the

3498
02:45:43,079 --> 02:45:44,000
good that it would

3499
02:45:44,000 --> 02:45:47,420
bring your business or are you willing to set that aside

3500
02:45:47,420 --> 02:45:48,719
for the because I think

3501
02:45:48,719 --> 02:45:50,979
the traffic is going to be there regardless right I mean if

3502
02:45:50,979 --> 02:45:51,520
it's coming

3503
02:45:51,520 --> 02:45:53,959
from off-site I don't think there's a way around the

3504
02:45:53,959 --> 02:45:55,159
traffic so I want to kind

3505
02:45:55,159 --> 02:45:57,399
of set that aside that's what I'm saying that's not

3506
02:45:57,399 --> 02:45:58,760
necessarily the major focus

3507
02:45:58,760 --> 02:46:02,799
right and so I think if we're talking more if they come in

3508
02:46:02,799 --> 02:46:04,079
the code with the

3509
02:46:04,079 --> 02:46:08,389
parking does that make you okay because I don't know that

3510
02:46:08,389 --> 02:46:09,479
helps I want to help

3511
02:46:09,479 --> 02:46:11,809
the neighborhood and the fact that they can add more

3512
02:46:11,809 --> 02:46:13,040
parking to come one to one

3513
02:46:13,040 --> 02:46:16,629
I don't think that makes an impact on the day-in-day-out

3514
02:46:16,629 --> 02:46:18,040
lives of the people

3515
02:46:18,040 --> 02:46:21,829
living in that overlay area and then no I don't I think

3516
02:46:21,829 --> 02:46:22,680
that it's absolutely

3517
02:46:22,680 --> 02:46:26,319
necessary that they have at least one-to-one parking but we

3518
02:46:26,319 --> 02:46:27,079
go back to the

3519
02:46:27,079 --> 02:46:30,569
issue again if you build a 60-foot building next to my two-

3520
02:46:30,569 --> 02:46:31,559
story building

3521
02:46:31,559 --> 02:46:34,590
on the west side I'm gonna be in the dark most of the day I

3522
02:46:34,590 --> 02:46:36,760
mean just that's

3523
02:46:36,760 --> 02:46:40,280
the reality of it the other buildings that are there are

3524
02:46:40,280 --> 02:46:41,440
not that height this

3525
02:46:41,440 --> 02:46:44,489
one's going to be definitely out of place the density of

3526
02:46:44,489 --> 02:46:45,479
the people that are

3527
02:46:45,479 --> 02:46:47,879
in there and the kids that will be crossing the street they

3528
02:46:47,879 --> 02:46:48,319
're not going to

3529
02:46:48,319 --> 02:46:50,260
go to the corner and cross with the light they're gonna go

3530
02:46:50,260 --> 02:46:50,799
right across

3531
02:46:50,799 --> 02:46:54,280
Hickory Street now the business side of it and I think

3532
02:46:54,280 --> 02:46:55,239
somebody at one point

3533
02:46:55,239 --> 02:46:59,409
asked me oh you'll have you know all these new people no

3534
02:46:59,409 --> 02:47:00,200
that's not

3535
02:47:00,200 --> 02:47:03,719
necessarily what's going to happen because in the

3536
02:47:03,719 --> 02:47:05,040
summertime and in

3537
02:47:05,040 --> 02:47:09,360
holidays those those kids leave they're gone what it will

3538
02:47:09,360 --> 02:47:12,000
bring is what Sterling

3539
02:47:12,000 --> 02:47:16,239
has brought to us with people you know up on balconies and

3540
02:47:16,239 --> 02:47:17,680
just missing your

3541
02:47:17,680 --> 02:47:20,049
head sometimes with a beer bottle because they're aiming at

3542
02:47:20,049 --> 02:47:20,680
the trash cans

3543
02:47:20,680 --> 02:47:24,319
one of the receptacles that they want to put is adjacent to

3544
02:47:24,319 --> 02:47:26,319
my building so the

3545
02:47:26,319 --> 02:47:30,520
people my balcony will look into their trash can so that's

3546
02:47:30,520 --> 02:47:31,159
a little

3547
02:47:31,159 --> 02:47:35,159
disconcerting for me I don't see anything that this size

3548
02:47:35,159 --> 02:47:36,840
and density of a

3549
02:47:36,840 --> 02:47:42,180
building can bring to the Fry Street area that is going to

3550
02:47:42,180 --> 02:47:43,840
be beneficial if

3551
02:47:43,840 --> 02:47:47,579
they bring it down they increase the retail underneath it

3552
02:47:47,579 --> 02:47:48,360
and they do

3553
02:47:48,360 --> 02:47:54,000
something that that works for the community that works for

3554
02:47:54,000 --> 02:47:55,000
the scale I

3555
02:47:55,000 --> 02:47:59,670
could understand that but right now you know they're they

3556
02:47:59,670 --> 02:48:01,360
're not really looking

3557
02:48:01,360 --> 02:48:05,229
at that they're just looking at their profit margin well

3558
02:48:05,229 --> 02:48:06,760
and I have a question

3559
02:48:06,760 --> 02:48:10,280
specifically with a retail though we we can agree that hadn

3560
02:48:10,280 --> 02:48:11,520
't worked at Sterling

3561
02:48:11,520 --> 02:48:15,899
I can't you can't get in there the businesses that have

3562
02:48:15,899 --> 02:48:16,959
been in and out of

3563
02:48:16,959 --> 02:48:20,760
there correct and these businesses that they're proposing

3564
02:48:20,760 --> 02:48:22,920
have been staples as

3565
02:48:22,920 --> 02:48:25,020
long as I can remember that Jack in the Box has been there

3566
02:48:25,020 --> 02:48:25,799
the subway's been

3567
02:48:25,799 --> 02:48:29,879
there Vortman's have been there I born and raised here I

3568
02:48:29,879 --> 02:48:30,680
don't remember when

3569
02:48:30,680 --> 02:48:37,059
they weren't there and so but yet you mentioned increase

3570
02:48:37,059 --> 02:48:39,000
retail right if you

3571
02:48:39,000 --> 02:48:41,309
look at the if you look at what they're trying to do with

3572
02:48:41,309 --> 02:48:42,479
the 2030 plan and

3573
02:48:42,479 --> 02:48:45,440
where they're trying to move the amount of retail in

3574
02:48:45,440 --> 02:48:46,760
relationship to the size

3575
02:48:46,760 --> 02:48:51,700
of the building here is small and you know I'm I'm sorry

3576
02:48:51,700 --> 02:48:53,120
that the the owner of

3577
02:48:53,120 --> 02:48:56,500
Vortman's isn't here tonight because it's it's his desire

3578
02:48:56,500 --> 02:48:57,479
just to reduce his

3579
02:48:57,479 --> 02:49:01,450
footprint you know he just wants to to make profit he gets

3580
02:49:01,450 --> 02:49:02,319
to keep his bill he

3581
02:49:02,319 --> 02:49:04,770
gets to keep his building and that kind of stuff I'm not

3582
02:49:04,770 --> 02:49:06,639
sure how that works but

3583
02:49:06,639 --> 02:49:10,200
the I think that there's something better that could be

3584
02:49:10,200 --> 02:49:11,399
done with this it

3585
02:49:11,399 --> 02:49:15,159
could be in more open area there is nothing that's being

3586
02:49:15,159 --> 02:49:16,200
offered to the

3587
02:49:16,200 --> 02:49:19,540
community through this building he talks about zip cars

3588
02:49:19,540 --> 02:49:20,520
where you gonna park

3589
02:49:20,520 --> 02:49:24,239
those zip cars he talks about bicycles there's not even a

3590
02:49:24,239 --> 02:49:25,239
bicycle rack on this

3591
02:49:25,239 --> 02:49:28,940
plan so you know when you start looking at alternative

3592
02:49:28,940 --> 02:49:30,040
means once again you're

3593
02:49:30,040 --> 02:49:33,370
you're pulling some things and like I said 68 parking

3594
02:49:33,370 --> 02:49:34,799
spaces the only three

3595
02:49:34,799 --> 02:49:38,200
handicapped parking spaces in the block how does all that

3596
02:49:38,200 --> 02:49:39,520
gonna work I'm just

3597
02:49:39,520 --> 02:49:43,600
not real sure I mean the laws mandate that they'll have

3598
02:49:43,600 --> 02:49:44,760
enough I know yeah

3599
02:49:44,760 --> 02:49:47,409
there's no way around that but what are you I guess that

3600
02:49:47,409 --> 02:49:48,600
kind of if it's okay if

3601
02:49:48,600 --> 02:49:50,979
I ask you a question when you talk about the business side

3602
02:49:50,979 --> 02:49:51,959
of it are you talking

3603
02:49:51,959 --> 02:49:55,559
about my business no just general so we're gonna have

3604
02:49:55,559 --> 02:49:56,440
people come up and say

3605
02:49:56,440 --> 02:49:59,739
it's a business decision and my point is just to neutralize

3606
02:49:59,739 --> 02:50:00,799
that and say they all

3607
02:50:00,799 --> 02:50:04,200
are right I mean yeah no I mean everyone does that that

3608
02:50:04,200 --> 02:50:05,680
that's the price of being

3609
02:50:05,680 --> 02:50:08,260
in business you know there's employees there's insurance

3610
02:50:08,260 --> 02:50:09,920
there's taxes so I so

3611
02:50:09,920 --> 02:50:12,549
that I just kind of want to normalize the conversation so

3612
02:50:12,549 --> 02:50:13,559
that we can all kind

3613
02:50:13,559 --> 02:50:17,239
of be on the same even level playing field and have

3614
02:50:17,239 --> 02:50:19,440
tangible actionable items

3615
02:50:19,440 --> 02:50:23,530
to consider so yeah but what happens to my building I mean

3616
02:50:23,530 --> 02:50:24,440
what happens to the

3617
02:50:24,440 --> 02:50:26,430
building what happens to the traffic and everything to

3618
02:50:26,430 --> 02:50:27,440
during the construction

3619
02:50:27,440 --> 02:50:30,069
phase of all this if you start moving dirt around my

3620
02:50:30,069 --> 02:50:31,479
building my building was

3621
02:50:31,479 --> 02:50:36,149
built in 1942 as a boarding house it's all galvanized pipe

3622
02:50:36,149 --> 02:50:37,840
it's got you know

3623
02:50:37,840 --> 02:50:41,610
I've got the and you start shaking that ground you're gonna

3624
02:50:41,610 --> 02:50:42,200
start shaking the

3625
02:50:42,200 --> 02:50:45,379
building and things are gonna move around and come down and

3626
02:50:45,379 --> 02:50:46,200
I have not

3627
02:50:46,200 --> 02:50:49,549
gotten a stable answer out of that the engineers say oh

3628
02:50:49,549 --> 02:50:51,000
yeah there's plenty of

3629
02:50:51,000 --> 02:50:53,819
capacity for the sewage there's plenty of capacity for the

3630
02:50:53,819 --> 02:50:54,840
water but I actually

3631
02:50:54,840 --> 02:50:56,840
heard one of them stand here and say well if our water

3632
02:50:56,840 --> 02:50:57,760
pressure drops we'll

3633
02:50:57,760 --> 02:51:00,840
just turn on the fire pumps to get the water to our

3634
02:51:00,840 --> 02:51:02,239
building what do you do

3635
02:51:02,239 --> 02:51:05,219
with the rest of the buildings that are there you know what

3636
02:51:05,219 --> 02:51:06,000
do you do with the

3637
02:51:06,000 --> 02:51:08,930
people up the street that were dependent upon that water so

3638
02:51:08,930 --> 02:51:10,879
you know it's a nice

3639
02:51:10,879 --> 02:51:14,440
project it needs to be someplace other than that one point

3640
02:51:14,440 --> 02:51:15,200
whatever it is

3641
02:51:15,200 --> 02:51:19,829
acres in the middle of the block even when you when they

3642
02:51:19,829 --> 02:51:21,520
took the the other the

3643
02:51:21,520 --> 02:51:24,690
the first overlay district the first sub district it took

3644
02:51:24,690 --> 02:51:26,719
the whole block it

3645
02:51:26,719 --> 02:51:30,969
didn't just take the center of a block sure thank you mm-

3646
02:51:30,969 --> 02:51:32,440
hmm one more question

3647
02:51:32,440 --> 02:51:37,940
Commissioner Brazil just a clarification you know the

3648
02:51:37,940 --> 02:51:39,719
coffee shop next to Kush

3649
02:51:39,719 --> 02:51:43,360
and the copy center there what yes that's your property yes

3650
02:51:43,360 --> 02:51:44,120
it's two stories

3651
02:51:44,120 --> 02:51:50,219
okay is the majority of your traffic by foot bike card have

3652
02:51:50,219 --> 02:51:50,879
you measured that

3653
02:51:50,879 --> 02:51:56,479
could you provide some insight into your customers routine

3654
02:51:56,479 --> 02:51:58,079
a lot of it's by foot

3655
02:51:58,079 --> 02:52:02,049
the reason I don't have a lot of car traffic is there's no

3656
02:52:02,049 --> 02:52:03,120
place to park

3657
02:52:03,120 --> 02:52:06,459
recently and I don't know who or how this happened but I

3658
02:52:06,459 --> 02:52:07,639
was very grateful

3659
02:52:07,639 --> 02:52:11,260
the parking spaces were marked retail parking I mean they

3660
02:52:11,260 --> 02:52:14,000
put stickers on them

3661
02:52:14,000 --> 02:52:18,059
when people come in it you know they they have to pay we

3662
02:52:18,059 --> 02:52:19,680
get lots of tickets

3663
02:52:19,680 --> 02:52:22,629
from the University of North Texas if you're there for more

3664
02:52:22,629 --> 02:52:23,479
than an hour and

3665
02:52:23,479 --> 02:52:28,040
sticker goes out so I would say that basically mine is is

3666
02:52:28,040 --> 02:52:29,319
probably more foot

3667
02:52:29,319 --> 02:52:35,040
traffic bicycle traffic and during the week but I'll still

3668
02:52:35,040 --> 02:52:35,959
have I mean the

3669
02:52:35,959 --> 02:52:39,520
people will park their cars and I don't know where they

3670
02:52:39,520 --> 02:52:41,000
park their cars I'm not

3671
02:52:41,000 --> 02:52:44,409
gonna admit that I know where they park their cars they go

3672
02:52:44,409 --> 02:52:45,680
early to get a

3673
02:52:45,680 --> 02:52:49,360
parking space you know on one of the feeder streets they

3674
02:52:49,360 --> 02:52:51,079
come to my shop they

3675
02:52:51,079 --> 02:52:53,510
get something some coffee they work on their homework and

3676
02:52:53,510 --> 02:52:54,559
then they go to class

3677
02:52:54,559 --> 02:52:57,319
and they come back over where I am or they go to the Union

3678
02:52:57,319 --> 02:52:58,639
so the streets are

3679
02:52:58,639 --> 02:53:03,459
being used as as the parking areas sure does your business

3680
02:53:03,459 --> 02:53:05,159
have parking spots

3681
02:53:05,159 --> 02:53:09,399
available what is your parking interesting you should ask

3682
02:53:09,399 --> 02:53:10,000
that question

3683
02:53:10,000 --> 02:53:16,440
I have an agreement with workman's my employees park in

3684
02:53:16,440 --> 02:53:18,680
there a lot okay so I

3685
02:53:18,680 --> 02:53:21,579
will have to get a variance to have a place for my

3686
02:53:21,579 --> 02:53:23,200
employees to park or they

3687
02:53:23,200 --> 02:53:26,280
will be taking up the parking spaces I have ten employees

3688
02:53:26,280 --> 02:53:26,879
they're not there all

3689
02:53:26,879 --> 02:53:32,180
the time but and then I rent for parking spaces from Fort

3690
02:53:32,180 --> 02:53:34,360
man's okay and so

3691
02:53:34,360 --> 02:53:38,399
potentially your your business can be negatively impacted

3692
02:53:38,399 --> 02:53:39,399
by losing those

3693
02:53:39,399 --> 02:53:42,290
parking spots yes not potentially I mean I guess if it goes

3694
02:53:42,290 --> 02:53:42,799
forward it would be

3695
02:53:42,799 --> 02:53:47,469
impacted yeah okay and go back again to the 68 public

3696
02:53:47,469 --> 02:53:48,520
parking spaces that are

3697
02:53:48,520 --> 02:53:52,780
currently now on that lot if people go into Vortman's they

3698
02:53:52,780 --> 02:53:53,200
come through

3699
02:53:53,200 --> 02:53:55,920
Bortman's you know do their thing at Bortman come over grab

3700
02:53:55,920 --> 02:53:56,479
a cup of coffee

3701
02:53:56,479 --> 02:53:59,629
and go back out they know they had a place to park at Fort

3702
02:53:59,629 --> 02:54:01,799
man's so I you know

3703
02:54:01,799 --> 02:54:04,899
when I when I walked that and got to looking at it it was a

3704
02:54:04,899 --> 02:54:05,959
concern sure and

3705
02:54:05,959 --> 02:54:09,180
and just as I as I continue my train of thought in this the

3706
02:54:09,180 --> 02:54:09,920
majority of your

3707
02:54:09,920 --> 02:54:12,479
business is morning coffee drinkers in the morning or in

3708
02:54:12,479 --> 02:54:13,440
the afternoon is there

3709
02:54:13,440 --> 02:54:17,049
also issues yeah there's issues at both times because as

3710
02:54:17,049 --> 02:54:17,920
the people are coming

3711
02:54:17,920 --> 02:54:21,340
in and out just like with the traffic the the highest peak

3712
02:54:21,340 --> 02:54:22,959
is between 9 and 11 in

3713
02:54:22,959 --> 02:54:25,420
the morning that's when the most number of people come

3714
02:54:25,420 --> 02:54:26,639
through the shop it goes

3715
02:54:26,639 --> 02:54:29,559
up again between 3 and 4 in the afternoon okay so if you do

3716
02:54:29,559 --> 02:54:30,120
a traffic

3717
02:54:30,120 --> 02:54:32,719
study you may be missing I mean you may be thinking about

3718
02:54:32,719 --> 02:54:33,639
when people go in and

3719
02:54:33,639 --> 02:54:36,270
out to work but not when they go in and out to class sure

3720
02:54:36,270 --> 02:54:36,760
now that makes sense

3721
02:54:36,760 --> 02:54:42,040
thank you I don't see any other questions thank you very

3722
02:54:42,040 --> 02:54:44,840
much thank you

3723
02:54:45,200 --> 02:54:52,899
next speaker will be Anderson many Mary Mary followed by K

3724
02:54:52,899 --> 02:54:55,760
ale Ward Mary Anderson

3725
02:54:55,760 --> 02:54:59,790
924 West Oak the Morris's and I moved in the same time on

3726
02:54:59,790 --> 02:55:01,360
West Oak we were

3727
02:55:01,360 --> 02:55:04,739
attracted to the area because of its historic character the

3728
02:55:04,739 --> 02:55:05,879
charm the low-rise

3729
02:55:05,879 --> 02:55:09,850
buildings we were promised much on the Frey Street

3730
02:55:09,850 --> 02:55:11,079
development but I want to

3731
02:55:11,079 --> 02:55:13,819
thank Ron for doing a good job I'd like to thank you for

3732
02:55:13,819 --> 02:55:14,760
asking very nice

3733
02:55:14,760 --> 02:55:18,340
questions they've been very eye-opening I've been to some

3734
02:55:18,340 --> 02:55:19,200
of these community

3735
02:55:19,200 --> 02:55:22,440
meetings frankly they're nothing but the same old

3736
02:55:22,440 --> 02:55:24,520
presentation over and over again

3737
02:55:24,520 --> 02:55:28,120
I believe I believe I believe today was the first day I saw

3738
02:55:28,120 --> 02:55:29,440
data about parking

3739
02:55:29,440 --> 02:55:33,950
January 6 2016 Dean does anybody know when classes are in

3740
02:55:33,950 --> 02:55:35,920
UNT and TWU not

3741
02:55:35,920 --> 02:55:41,120
January 6th the parking statistics they believe ask for the

3742
02:55:41,120 --> 02:55:42,239
data it's not there

3743
02:55:42,239 --> 02:55:46,600
it's a belief they already told us 33 North was very it

3744
02:55:46,600 --> 02:55:47,600
wasn't very used they

3745
02:55:47,600 --> 02:55:50,639
didn't December well that's fine everybody had already left

3746
02:55:50,639 --> 02:55:51,319
after exams

3747
02:55:51,319 --> 02:55:54,549
you need to run the parking when people are actually going

3748
02:55:54,549 --> 02:55:56,360
to school there's so

3749
02:55:56,360 --> 02:55:58,610
many things wrong with this plan and I know that most of

3750
02:55:58,610 --> 02:55:59,520
you identified with

3751
02:55:59,520 --> 02:56:02,959
them it's an SRO project shouldn't we stop and think about

3752
02:56:02,959 --> 02:56:03,559
this do you know

3753
02:56:03,559 --> 02:56:05,870
how many other apartments are planned in this area I'm sure

3754
02:56:05,870 --> 02:56:06,840
you do there's the

3755
02:56:06,840 --> 02:56:09,420
scripture one we'll see you then right all these other

3756
02:56:09,420 --> 02:56:10,600
apartments the one right

3757
02:56:10,600 --> 02:56:12,790
next to where they're talking about parking have you

3758
02:56:12,790 --> 02:56:13,680
noticed there's not

3759
02:56:13,680 --> 02:56:15,989
many people parking there not many of those apartments are

3760
02:56:15,989 --> 02:56:16,559
rented what do you

3761
02:56:16,559 --> 02:56:18,799
think is gonna happen next another one that's gonna seek

3762
02:56:18,799 --> 02:56:19,760
the same variants as

3763
02:56:19,760 --> 02:56:23,280
they've gotten this is crazy that's a traffic issue the

3764
02:56:23,280 --> 02:56:24,319
real issue is the

3765
02:56:24,319 --> 02:56:26,790
character of their neighborhood is going down I really don

3766
02:56:26,790 --> 02:56:27,799
't like thinking in my

3767
02:56:27,799 --> 02:56:31,600
home being the buffer I live in a historic district and

3768
02:56:31,600 --> 02:56:33,440
they said mr. King

3769
02:56:33,440 --> 02:56:36,469
said that UNT had eight nine story buildings yes on the

3770
02:56:36,469 --> 02:56:37,760
west side of campus

3771
02:56:37,760 --> 02:56:40,680
nowhere near where they're planning to build in fact the

3772
02:56:40,680 --> 02:56:42,840
best place is what Kim

3773
02:56:42,840 --> 02:56:47,239
said was someplace else either match the restrictions that

3774
02:56:47,239 --> 02:56:48,600
are given or move on

3775
02:56:48,600 --> 02:56:51,799
to the other side of campus where the heights are higher

3776
02:56:51,799 --> 02:56:53,979
closer to 35 the

3777
02:56:53,979 --> 02:56:56,229
term is starting to go downhill and I just spent a lot of

3778
02:56:56,229 --> 02:56:57,159
money renovating my

3779
02:56:57,159 --> 02:57:00,319
house and pretty much I'm pretty sad to see all the

3780
02:57:00,319 --> 02:57:02,200
development it's these guys

3781
02:57:02,200 --> 02:57:04,969
and it'll be their next plan down the street and you know

3782
02:57:04,969 --> 02:57:05,799
they pride themselves

3783
02:57:05,799 --> 02:57:08,129
on the architecture that matches the neighborhood I don't

3784
02:57:08,129 --> 02:57:08,680
know any of those

3785
02:57:08,680 --> 02:57:11,340
that look like a historic neighborhood what about you not

3786
02:57:11,340 --> 02:57:13,040
one they don't care

3787
02:57:13,040 --> 02:57:15,239
nothing's coming into this neighborhood they're only gonna

3788
02:57:15,239 --> 02:57:16,479
raise the value of my

3789
02:57:16,479 --> 02:57:19,760
property because they're going to put on a big building and

3790
02:57:19,760 --> 02:57:20,920
then claim student

3791
02:57:20,920 --> 02:57:27,159
discounts on rents we need more family oriented things we

3792
02:57:27,159 --> 02:57:30,040
need to have growth

3793
02:57:30,040 --> 02:57:34,079
elsewhere not just here we don't need something that big if

3794
02:57:34,079 --> 02:57:34,520
they could match

3795
02:57:34,520 --> 02:57:37,409
the requirements but nothing has changed there are so much

3796
02:57:37,409 --> 02:57:38,520
wrong the part that's

3797
02:57:38,520 --> 02:57:41,329
too many it's too high there's not enough parking they've

3798
02:57:41,329 --> 02:57:42,360
taken some away

3799
02:57:42,360 --> 02:57:47,329
their surveys on everything are dated at the wrong time the

3800
02:57:47,329 --> 02:57:48,319
coverage of the land

3801
02:57:48,319 --> 02:57:51,590
does more than I can build on my house they want to have 70

3802
02:57:51,590 --> 02:57:52,879
% coverage drainage

3803
02:57:52,879 --> 02:57:56,440
water traffic the hospital traffic how are you gonna get to

3804
02:57:56,440 --> 02:57:57,280
the hospital

3805
02:57:57,280 --> 02:57:59,879
anymore when you put this one up and the next one up and

3806
02:57:59,879 --> 02:58:01,360
the next one up at any

3807
02:58:01,360 --> 02:58:03,799
rate I'd like to thank you all and I hope certainly hope

3808
02:58:03,799 --> 02:58:04,559
you go with what

3809
02:58:04,559 --> 02:58:10,610
planning and zoning is suggested not to approve thank you I

3810
02:58:10,610 --> 02:58:11,559
don't see any

3811
02:58:11,559 --> 02:58:14,479
questions at this time do you have a question Larry you are

3812
02:58:14,479 --> 02:58:16,600
ringing okay thank

3813
02:58:16,600 --> 02:58:26,559
you Kale Ward followed by Randy hunt

3814
02:58:33,040 --> 02:58:37,190
thank you I actually have some of these for you guys these

3815
02:58:37,190 --> 02:58:38,399
are from I'm speaking

3816
02:58:38,399 --> 02:58:43,069
on behalf of Brent Erskine owner and property owner of Vert

3817
02:58:43,069 --> 02:58:44,680
mans so would you

3818
02:58:44,680 --> 02:58:46,729
guys like these now or would you like me to hang them out

3819
02:58:46,729 --> 02:58:47,680
sure please pass them

3820
02:58:47,680 --> 02:58:50,299
out and then give us your name and address or if you're

3821
02:58:50,299 --> 02:58:51,040
representing

3822
02:58:51,040 --> 02:58:53,600
someone else

3823
02:59:08,280 --> 02:59:25,760
I sure can okay my name is Kale Ward I am speaking on

3824
02:59:25,760 --> 02:59:26,760
behalf of Brent Erskine

3825
02:59:26,760 --> 02:59:30,049
who is the property owner and business owner of Vertmans

3826
02:59:30,049 --> 02:59:31,840
bookstore on 1314 West

3827
02:59:31,840 --> 02:59:35,709
Hickory so I'm gonna begin I want to apologize for my

3828
02:59:35,709 --> 02:59:36,780
absence on for the

3829
02:59:36,780 --> 02:59:40,659
October 26 2016 meeting I hope it is not interpreted as a

3830
02:59:40,659 --> 02:59:41,959
lack of care or belief

3831
02:59:41,959 --> 02:59:44,360
in the positive impact this development would have on the

3832
02:59:44,360 --> 02:59:45,719
business businesses in

3833
02:59:45,719 --> 02:59:48,709
the Fry Street overlay I want to start by explaining our

3834
02:59:48,709 --> 02:59:49,920
intent by having EDR

3835
02:59:49,920 --> 02:59:53,959
present this project the Vertmans building is over 90 years

3836
02:59:53,959 --> 02:59:54,559
old and has

3837
02:59:54,559 --> 02:59:57,799
been added on to four times for different business models

3838
02:59:57,799 --> 02:59:58,639
our business

3839
02:59:58,639 --> 03:00:01,459
model now is much different than several of the business

3840
03:00:01,459 --> 03:00:02,479
models of the Vertmans

3841
03:00:02,479 --> 03:00:06,709
family ran in the 1920s and 1990s we are neither we're

3842
03:00:06,709 --> 03:00:07,879
neither as sophisticated

3843
03:00:07,879 --> 03:00:11,239
nor we as diversified as mr. Vertman to run a department

3844
03:00:11,239 --> 03:00:12,879
store however we do

3845
03:00:12,879 --> 03:00:16,440
well it what we do well is create college stores with books

3846
03:00:16,440 --> 03:00:17,040
apparel and

3847
03:00:17,040 --> 03:00:20,000
our supplies since we understand who we are and who we are

3848
03:00:20,000 --> 03:00:21,360
not we know we need

3849
03:00:21,360 --> 03:00:25,069
to cut down on the 2000 or 24,000 plus square feet we

3850
03:00:25,069 --> 03:00:26,200
operate Vertmans out of

3851
03:00:26,200 --> 03:00:29,479
to become more efficient we can do this one of two ways

3852
03:00:29,479 --> 03:00:30,360
subdivide our building

3853
03:00:30,360 --> 03:00:33,180
adding more businesses to the area or sell to a student

3854
03:00:33,180 --> 03:00:34,760
living company since

3855
03:00:34,760 --> 03:00:37,219
the new development down the road has empty businesses

3856
03:00:37,219 --> 03:00:38,120
business space for a

3857
03:00:38,120 --> 03:00:40,750
lease we believe selling to a unit to a student living

3858
03:00:40,750 --> 03:00:42,239
company is better for the

3859
03:00:42,239 --> 03:00:46,479
Fry Street area EDR will add businesses or add business to

3860
03:00:46,479 --> 03:00:47,239
the area instead of

3861
03:00:47,239 --> 03:00:50,829
businesses create a new better looking space for our retail

3862
03:00:50,829 --> 03:00:51,920
business which we

3863
03:00:51,920 --> 03:00:54,840
will own and allow us to make sure the Vertmans name

3864
03:00:54,840 --> 03:00:56,040
continues on as a store

3865
03:00:56,040 --> 03:00:59,520
business in this community outside of the positive impact

3866
03:00:59,520 --> 03:01:00,719
this will have on my

3867
03:01:00,719 --> 03:01:03,250
business I believe there are many reasons this project

3868
03:01:03,250 --> 03:01:04,120
should be approved

3869
03:01:04,120 --> 03:01:07,319
increase in property tax for the city increase in city

3870
03:01:07,319 --> 03:01:09,120
municipalities income

3871
03:01:09,120 --> 03:01:12,129
for trash to electricity and clean up several older

3872
03:01:12,129 --> 03:01:13,879
buildings in the overlay I

3873
03:01:13,879 --> 03:01:16,649
understand that these older buildings are mine however they

3874
03:01:16,649 --> 03:01:17,440
need to major

3875
03:01:17,440 --> 03:01:20,409
updating and there is no better way than to do that than to

3876
03:01:20,409 --> 03:01:22,040
add more year-round

3877
03:01:22,040 --> 03:01:25,139
customers for the business businesses in the area even my

3878
03:01:25,139 --> 03:01:26,040
friends who own

3879
03:01:26,040 --> 03:01:29,040
businesses with zero parking will benefit from this however

3880
03:01:29,040 --> 03:01:29,799
there are two

3881
03:01:29,799 --> 03:01:39,479
main reasons I would like to look at in detail next page

3882
03:01:39,479 --> 03:01:41,559
with the increase in

3883
03:01:41,559 --> 03:01:44,200
enrollment at the University of North Texas there needs to

3884
03:01:44,200 --> 03:01:44,760
be a serious

3885
03:01:44,760 --> 03:01:47,329
consideration for zoning changes and the increase in

3886
03:01:47,329 --> 03:01:48,639
revenue for small locally

3887
03:01:48,639 --> 03:01:51,680
owned businesses when the Fry Street overlay was created in

3888
03:01:51,680 --> 03:01:52,840
1999 the

3889
03:01:52,840 --> 03:01:55,940
University of North Texas had approximately 27,000 students

3890
03:01:55,940 --> 03:01:56,239
in the

3891
03:01:56,239 --> 03:02:01,360
fall of 2000 now this same university has 37 over 37,000

3892
03:02:01,360 --> 03:02:02,280
students in the fall

3893
03:02:02,280 --> 03:02:07,319
of 2015 that is a 37.4 percent increase in the student

3894
03:02:07,319 --> 03:02:08,920
population yet EDR is

3895
03:02:08,920 --> 03:02:11,510
only asking for 25 percent increase in the number of

3896
03:02:11,510 --> 03:02:12,879
stories think about this

3897
03:02:12,879 --> 03:02:15,569
the tentative date this project will open would be fall

3898
03:02:15,569 --> 03:02:17,559
2018 and the income

3899
03:02:17,559 --> 03:02:20,260
the incoming freshmen were not even born when the city

3900
03:02:20,260 --> 03:02:22,559
created this overlay as the

3901
03:02:22,559 --> 03:02:24,829
time goes time goes on buildings get old and they are

3902
03:02:24,829 --> 03:02:26,079
replaced with new buildings

3903
03:02:26,079 --> 03:02:29,729
that make that makes sense economically in the space and

3904
03:02:29,729 --> 03:02:30,600
fit the surrounding

3905
03:02:30,600 --> 03:02:33,579
buildings but the youth center at fry being 225 feet away

3906
03:02:33,579 --> 03:02:34,440
having a similar

3907
03:02:34,440 --> 03:02:37,030
configuration and the prevalent height of our proposed

3908
03:02:37,030 --> 03:02:38,040
building is two feet

3909
03:02:38,040 --> 03:02:41,110
taller than the parking deck at youth center suggests that

3910
03:02:41,110 --> 03:02:42,040
our part that our

3911
03:02:42,040 --> 03:02:45,170
project would fit perfectly in the environment from the

3912
03:02:45,170 --> 03:02:46,159
standpoint of height

3913
03:02:46,159 --> 03:02:49,049
the language auditorium and chemistry buildings across the

3914
03:02:49,049 --> 03:02:49,799
street are also

3915
03:02:49,799 --> 03:02:53,280
close in comparison these buildings are large enough that

3916
03:02:53,280 --> 03:02:54,760
our proposed building

3917
03:02:54,760 --> 03:02:58,139
would appropriately match the environment I understand that

3918
03:02:58,139 --> 03:02:58,360
there is a

3919
03:02:58,360 --> 03:03:00,920
parking issue at UNT like there is every other major

3920
03:03:00,920 --> 03:03:03,680
university my suggestion is

3921
03:03:03,680 --> 03:03:07,809
that even if EDR adds another 30 spaces again there will

3922
03:03:07,809 --> 03:03:08,780
still be parking issue

3923
03:03:08,780 --> 03:03:12,340
at UNT we should not make the private sector responsible

3924
03:03:12,340 --> 03:03:13,000
for the parking issue

3925
03:03:13,000 --> 03:03:15,989
UNT has created it is a very hard for me to understand that

3926
03:03:15,989 --> 03:03:16,959
we don't believe

3927
03:03:16,959 --> 03:03:21,219
there is enough walking traffic for EDR not to have one one

3928
03:03:21,219 --> 03:03:23,319
-on-one parking when

3929
03:03:23,319 --> 03:03:26,559
we have more than five businesses within 300 feet that don

3930
03:03:26,559 --> 03:03:27,479
't have any customer

3931
03:03:27,479 --> 03:03:31,000
parking besides meter parking in addition to that with what

3932
03:03:31,000 --> 03:03:31,760
little meter

3933
03:03:31,760 --> 03:03:34,469
parking there is we have put bike racks and loading zones

3934
03:03:34,469 --> 03:03:35,639
for the owners to park

3935
03:03:35,639 --> 03:03:38,409
in please understand I don't have a problem with the

3936
03:03:38,409 --> 03:03:39,379
loading zones or bike

3937
03:03:39,379 --> 03:03:43,459
racks in fact we started at when we started at 103 Avenue a

3938
03:03:43,459 --> 03:03:44,479
and Fry Street

3939
03:03:44,479 --> 03:03:47,290
we paid for a loading zone and I used it to park my vehicle

3940
03:03:47,290 --> 03:03:48,440
the problem is this

3941
03:03:48,440 --> 03:03:51,309
city should have a consistent philosophy we receive a

3942
03:03:51,309 --> 03:03:52,639
negative recommendation from

3943
03:03:52,639 --> 03:03:55,930
the city and if we are honest it is for two reasons they

3944
03:03:55,930 --> 03:03:57,159
think it is too too tall

3945
03:03:57,159 --> 03:04:00,110
and there is not enough parking yet there is a building a

3946
03:04:00,110 --> 03:04:01,079
half a block away

3947
03:04:01,079 --> 03:04:08,209
that has a parking deck 60 feet tall they think there is

3948
03:04:08,209 --> 03:04:09,239
not enough parking

3949
03:04:09,239 --> 03:04:13,000
that yet we let our parking places go to loading zones and

3950
03:04:13,000 --> 03:04:14,120
bike racks these

3951
03:04:14,120 --> 03:04:16,780
loading zones are just used for business owners to park

3952
03:04:16,780 --> 03:04:18,200
their vehicles put bike

3953
03:04:18,200 --> 03:04:22,440
put bike racks bike racks business owners choice and for

3954
03:04:22,440 --> 03:04:22,959
the fast food

3955
03:04:22,959 --> 03:04:26,159
delivery employees to park their cars as a business owner

3956
03:04:26,159 --> 03:04:27,120
on Fry Street since

3957
03:04:27,120 --> 03:04:30,479
November 2017 I have seen several changes and have put

3958
03:04:30,479 --> 03:04:31,280
built relationships

3959
03:04:31,280 --> 03:04:33,549
with many of the business owners in the district all of

3960
03:04:33,549 --> 03:04:35,520
which are positive for

3961
03:04:35,520 --> 03:04:37,479
those that I have spoken with and have owned businesses

3962
03:04:37,479 --> 03:04:38,399
before the youth center

3963
03:04:38,399 --> 03:04:41,420
was built until now excluding lunch businesses have all

3964
03:04:41,420 --> 03:04:42,120
said their sales

3965
03:04:42,120 --> 03:04:44,959
have increased since the new development with EDR's

3966
03:04:44,959 --> 03:04:46,159
proposal adding student

3967
03:04:46,159 --> 03:04:49,219
housing and not adding any new businesses we are sure to

3968
03:04:49,219 --> 03:04:50,000
increase the

3969
03:04:50,000 --> 03:04:53,680
sales of all the small businesses on this street books

3970
03:04:53,680 --> 03:04:55,799
copies coffee beer

3971
03:04:55,799 --> 03:04:59,149
and food our hope is that we drop that we will drive enough

3972
03:04:59,149 --> 03:04:59,879
business to keep

3973
03:04:59,879 --> 03:05:03,350
businesses in the two new developments down the street I

3974
03:05:03,350 --> 03:05:04,559
hope you can see that

3975
03:05:04,559 --> 03:05:08,020
the apartment the apparent apparent benefit to small

3976
03:05:08,020 --> 03:05:09,719
business and evidence

3977
03:05:09,719 --> 03:05:13,280
of how the building fits in fits the environment the lack

3978
03:05:13,280 --> 03:05:14,239
of consistency by

3979
03:05:14,239 --> 03:05:17,719
the city could make a local business owner feel unsupported

3980
03:05:17,719 --> 03:05:18,639
as a local

3981
03:05:18,639 --> 03:05:21,239
business owner who has started three businesses in Denton

3982
03:05:21,239 --> 03:05:22,440
created over two

3983
03:05:22,440 --> 03:05:25,180
point five million dollars in sales tax paid several

3984
03:05:25,180 --> 03:05:26,360
hundred thousands in

3985
03:05:26,360 --> 03:05:30,329
property tax and employs over ten fold over ten full-time

3986
03:05:30,329 --> 03:05:31,500
20 part-time and a

3987
03:05:31,500 --> 03:05:35,100
hundred plus temporary people the decision by the city PNC

3988
03:05:35,100 --> 03:05:35,879
and City

3989
03:05:35,879 --> 03:05:39,639
Council could give up me pause before reinvesting more

3990
03:05:39,639 --> 03:05:41,280
money back into didn't I

3991
03:05:41,280 --> 03:05:44,260
sincerely ask that you place a small vote for small

3992
03:05:44,260 --> 03:05:45,680
businesses so they can

3993
03:05:45,680 --> 03:05:48,770
continue to grow and invest back into didn't and if there

3994
03:05:48,770 --> 03:05:50,239
are any questions I

3995
03:05:50,239 --> 03:05:54,989
will try to answer them best on his behalf okay any

3996
03:05:54,989 --> 03:05:59,840
questions thank you

3997
03:05:59,840 --> 03:06:02,360
thank you

3998
03:06:05,280 --> 03:06:11,079
Randy hunt to be followed by Aaron Knight

3999
03:06:17,680 --> 03:06:21,850
my name is Randy hunt I'm at 722 West Oak it's at the

4000
03:06:21,850 --> 03:06:24,760
corner of Oak and Mounts

4001
03:06:25,639 --> 03:06:30,620
can you raise the microphone or speak closer to thank you

4002
03:06:30,620 --> 03:06:32,920
sure I'm glad to be

4003
03:06:32,920 --> 03:06:37,430
cooperative with the people that need that request well

4004
03:06:37,430 --> 03:06:38,680
that's something here

4005
03:06:38,680 --> 03:06:42,649
it on the record too so gotcha okay so obviously I'm at 22

4006
03:06:42,649 --> 03:06:44,520
West Oak we've been

4007
03:06:44,520 --> 03:06:50,770
there since 2004 and I did go to the first meeting by these

4008
03:06:50,770 --> 03:06:52,120
people that were

4009
03:06:52,120 --> 03:06:55,989
asking for these variances and I think one of the things

4010
03:06:55,989 --> 03:06:57,360
that we're really

4011
03:06:57,360 --> 03:07:01,770
proud that we've been able to almost achieve we have a

4012
03:07:01,770 --> 03:07:02,559
little bit more

4013
03:07:02,559 --> 03:07:06,639
information to do but we're going to get a national

4014
03:07:06,639 --> 03:07:09,000
register district for a big

4015
03:07:09,000 --> 03:07:12,680
chunk of the area like from Hickory Street all the way to

4016
03:07:12,680 --> 03:07:13,799
panhandle from

4017
03:07:13,799 --> 03:07:19,319
Carroll all the way over to probably ponder Street it's

4018
03:07:19,319 --> 03:07:22,159
about 350 houses the

4019
03:07:22,159 --> 03:07:25,719
reason we're getting that is because we have a large

4020
03:07:25,719 --> 03:07:27,520
percentage of homes that

4021
03:07:27,520 --> 03:07:31,319
have not been disturbed but the major reason we're getting

4022
03:07:31,319 --> 03:07:32,559
that is because we

4023
03:07:32,559 --> 03:07:35,889
still have a cultural area that represents why that

4024
03:07:35,889 --> 03:07:37,120
neighborhood was

4025
03:07:37,120 --> 03:07:41,719
built in the first place so every time that there is some

4026
03:07:41,719 --> 03:07:43,000
structure coming in

4027
03:07:43,000 --> 03:07:47,770
that's you know like five-story building compared to

4028
03:07:47,770 --> 03:07:49,680
structures that have been

4029
03:07:49,680 --> 03:07:53,549
there for over a hundred years doesn't complement what we

4030
03:07:53,549 --> 03:07:55,120
're trying to do in

4031
03:07:55,120 --> 03:07:59,489
fact we have visited with the Texas Historic Commission

4032
03:07:59,489 --> 03:08:00,680
about another

4033
03:08:00,680 --> 03:08:06,520
proposed area from ponder Street all the way up to Avenue C

4034
03:08:06,520 --> 03:08:07,920
that's already been

4035
03:08:07,920 --> 03:08:12,510
identified as potential National Register District as well

4036
03:08:12,510 --> 03:08:13,559
so every time

4037
03:08:13,559 --> 03:08:17,530
that something comes in and starts disturbing the cultural

4038
03:08:17,530 --> 03:08:18,600
area it's

4039
03:08:18,600 --> 03:08:23,840
disruptive five stories is disruptive I have no problem

4040
03:08:23,840 --> 03:08:25,680
seeing you know changes

4041
03:08:25,680 --> 03:08:30,799
I have no problem with you know the way it's zone right now

4042
03:08:30,799 --> 03:08:32,479
and if people want

4043
03:08:32,479 --> 03:08:36,520
to come into our area the city that was built the reason

4044
03:08:36,520 --> 03:08:37,719
that UNT is here

4045
03:08:37,719 --> 03:08:41,950
and work with the neighborhood that'd be a good reason to

4046
03:08:41,950 --> 03:08:43,959
do that so really I

4047
03:08:43,959 --> 03:08:48,780
think the focus of my issue with this development is that

4048
03:08:48,780 --> 03:08:49,799
it's not an

4049
03:08:49,799 --> 03:08:57,520
apartment it's a single single-room occupancy that by

4050
03:08:57,520 --> 03:08:59,040
itself is not

4051
03:08:59,040 --> 03:09:02,799
complementary to why the district is there why are the

4052
03:09:02,799 --> 03:09:05,159
buildings there if I

4053
03:09:05,159 --> 03:09:09,479
as a family wanted to move into one of those couldn't do it

4054
03:09:09,479 --> 03:09:11,040
do you think that

4055
03:09:11,040 --> 03:09:14,450
after this you know the current buildings can be built and

4056
03:09:14,450 --> 03:09:15,200
some new owner

4057
03:09:15,200 --> 03:09:23,790
comes in well it ever be switched to apartments no I think

4058
03:09:23,790 --> 03:09:25,159
what we need to be

4059
03:09:25,159 --> 03:09:30,069
working on is apartments that will support families that

4060
03:09:30,069 --> 03:09:31,239
will support a

4061
03:09:31,239 --> 03:09:34,889
community that will support you know the reason that the

4062
03:09:34,889 --> 03:09:37,159
people are here we don't

4063
03:09:37,159 --> 03:09:44,120
need any more single occupancy rooms have a question for

4064
03:09:44,120 --> 03:09:44,920
you Commissioner Beck

4065
03:09:44,920 --> 03:09:47,319
thank you chair thank you mr. on for coming down and

4066
03:09:47,319 --> 03:09:49,399
speaking how long have

4067
03:09:49,399 --> 03:09:53,850
you been in the neighborhood we bought in 2004 okay so you

4068
03:09:53,850 --> 03:09:54,799
were there after

4069
03:09:54,799 --> 03:10:02,959
sub area a yes before sub area B the neighborhood is

4070
03:10:02,959 --> 03:10:04,520
evidently may get

4071
03:10:04,520 --> 03:10:07,280
compromised with the city and University of North Texas

4072
03:10:07,280 --> 03:10:08,840
allowing these bigger

4073
03:10:08,840 --> 03:10:13,120
buildings there that could be considered an encroachment so

4074
03:10:13,120 --> 03:10:14,280
what is it about this

4075
03:10:14,280 --> 03:10:18,870
building that all of a sudden there's not a willingness to

4076
03:10:18,870 --> 03:10:21,000
compromise going

4077
03:10:21,000 --> 03:10:25,120
forward does that is that an assumption that the

4078
03:10:25,120 --> 03:10:26,600
neighborhood was supporting it

4079
03:10:26,600 --> 03:10:31,270
well you tell me I think that's an assumption okay okay

4080
03:10:31,270 --> 03:10:32,000
because I think

4081
03:10:32,000 --> 03:10:35,290
you're a number of people that were living in the Hoke and

4082
03:10:35,290 --> 03:10:36,360
Hickory and other

4083
03:10:36,360 --> 03:10:40,319
areas that were not supportive of that five-story building

4084
03:10:40,319 --> 03:10:41,520
okay that's what I

4085
03:10:41,520 --> 03:10:45,399
wanted to hear yeah okay now we're living with it but just

4086
03:10:45,399 --> 03:10:46,079
because we lived

4087
03:10:46,079 --> 03:10:50,579
with one doesn't mean we want to live with two and the

4088
03:10:50,579 --> 03:10:52,840
biggest threat is that

4089
03:10:52,840 --> 03:10:59,239
there's a proposal for a five-story single occupancy room

4090
03:10:59,239 --> 03:11:00,799
and sro on

4091
03:11:00,799 --> 03:11:07,069
scripture Street and that's just offensive because so

4092
03:11:07,069 --> 03:11:09,040
anyway okay if we

4093
03:11:09,040 --> 03:11:12,610
were at three stories the way it's owned right now I wouldn

4094
03:11:12,610 --> 03:11:14,159
't I would I create a

4095
03:11:14,159 --> 03:11:17,629
compromise you could live with it I can live with that and

4096
03:11:17,629 --> 03:11:19,159
I understand that the

4097
03:11:19,159 --> 03:11:22,680
compromise may have been done so reluctantly I do but that

4098
03:11:22,680 --> 03:11:23,479
seems to be

4099
03:11:23,479 --> 03:11:28,069
the sense here and that what I'm hearing from most people

4100
03:11:28,069 --> 03:11:29,319
so far is that the

4101
03:11:29,319 --> 03:11:32,620
envelopes are being pushed and it puts us in kind of a

4102
03:11:32,620 --> 03:11:34,600
slippery slope situation

4103
03:11:34,600 --> 03:11:37,819
would that be a fair assessment by if we built a five-story

4104
03:11:37,819 --> 03:11:41,319
building there I'm

4105
03:11:41,319 --> 03:11:44,659
sorry I don't know if I got your question okay there's a

4106
03:11:44,659 --> 03:11:45,639
sense that the

4107
03:11:45,639 --> 03:11:48,770
envelope is being pushed now we've already allowed a three

4108
03:11:48,770 --> 03:11:49,559
and a four story

4109
03:11:49,559 --> 03:11:52,870
building there allowed a five-story is this a slippery

4110
03:11:52,870 --> 03:11:54,360
slope situation in your

4111
03:11:54,360 --> 03:11:58,100
opinion it really is because you know in the way that I

4112
03:11:58,100 --> 03:11:59,440
count the stories on the

4113
03:11:59,440 --> 03:12:05,149
on the building is there is this you know maybe we go back

4114
03:12:05,149 --> 03:12:06,239
and look at it or

4115
03:12:06,239 --> 03:12:08,790
maybe I need to go back and look at it but it looks like it

4116
03:12:08,790 --> 03:12:09,879
's more of a four

4117
03:12:09,879 --> 03:12:15,030
story and not a five story so every time that there's a

4118
03:12:15,030 --> 03:12:17,319
variance that's just

4119
03:12:17,319 --> 03:12:22,399
offensive you know it's zoned for a reason and it's zoned

4120
03:12:22,399 --> 03:12:23,840
because there's a

4121
03:12:23,840 --> 03:12:27,430
whole bunch of neighborhoods that are right around the

4122
03:12:27,430 --> 03:12:29,440
university why should

4123
03:12:29,440 --> 03:12:34,909
we be willing to compromise on neighborhoods to accommodate

4124
03:12:34,909 --> 03:12:36,000
businesses

4125
03:12:36,000 --> 03:12:40,870
who want to make a profit okay thank you very much one more

4126
03:12:40,870 --> 03:12:41,040
question

4127
03:12:41,040 --> 03:12:45,120
Commissioner has with thank you thank you for your comments

4128
03:12:45,120 --> 03:12:47,200
I'm gonna try to be

4129
03:12:47,200 --> 03:12:55,399
succinct so help me help me quantify the bad experiences

4130
03:12:55,399 --> 03:12:57,479
with the sterling or the

4131
03:12:57,479 --> 03:13:02,079
current new developments there what what experiences have

4132
03:13:02,079 --> 03:13:03,719
you had that that have

4133
03:13:03,719 --> 03:13:08,600
left you with a negative impression are you familiar with

4134
03:13:08,600 --> 03:13:10,600
the Evers house is the

4135
03:13:10,600 --> 03:13:15,110
is the big yes to story on the corner yes sir so one of the

4136
03:13:15,110 --> 03:13:17,680
comments was you

4137
03:13:17,680 --> 03:13:20,780
know where students are packed into those rooms so they

4138
03:13:20,780 --> 03:13:21,639
hang out on the

4139
03:13:21,639 --> 03:13:27,610
balconies and you know some take sport with what can they

4140
03:13:27,610 --> 03:13:30,120
throw but there are a

4141
03:13:30,120 --> 03:13:36,030
number of conversations that are not g-rated sure and so

4142
03:13:36,030 --> 03:13:37,600
there's just a lot

4143
03:13:37,600 --> 03:13:41,469
of impact when you have that many you know people that are

4144
03:13:41,469 --> 03:13:42,600
geared towards

4145
03:13:42,600 --> 03:13:48,629
students because they're SRO is only that you know wouldn't

4146
03:13:48,629 --> 03:13:50,040
be those same

4147
03:13:50,040 --> 03:13:54,500
kind of problems if they were actually family units one

4148
03:13:54,500 --> 03:13:57,319
would hope but if you're

4149
03:13:57,319 --> 03:14:00,209
trying so let's let's narrow it down let's say I mean

4150
03:14:00,209 --> 03:14:02,079
because I have two

4151
03:14:02,079 --> 03:14:05,520
twenty-year-olds right there dynamically different than

4152
03:14:05,520 --> 03:14:06,639
when they lived at my

4153
03:14:06,639 --> 03:14:09,569
house right I mean it's life just as a way if they figure

4154
03:14:09,569 --> 03:14:11,520
it out I hope I'll get

4155
03:14:11,520 --> 03:14:14,360
back to you but but my point is I don't want to hold this

4156
03:14:14,360 --> 03:14:15,959
development to what

4157
03:14:15,959 --> 03:14:18,979
college kids right I mean there's just it's in the news

4158
03:14:18,979 --> 03:14:20,280
every day college kids

4159
03:14:20,280 --> 03:14:23,629
do this there you know there's athletes that make poor

4160
03:14:23,629 --> 03:14:26,200
decisions at that age bad

4161
03:14:26,200 --> 03:14:28,010
decisions are made I don't want to hold this development to

4162
03:14:28,010 --> 03:14:28,639
that I don't hold

4163
03:14:28,639 --> 03:14:36,000
sterling to that my my point is and I'm curious to get your

4164
03:14:36,000 --> 03:14:37,319
insight do you think

4165
03:14:37,319 --> 03:14:41,600
the fact that they do have a monopoly on that type

4166
03:14:41,600 --> 03:14:43,959
development in that area

4167
03:14:43,959 --> 03:14:47,930
emboldens them so if you're trying if you're trying to get

4168
03:14:47,930 --> 03:14:49,200
a point across to

4169
03:14:49,200 --> 03:14:52,329
sterling and they know they have a monopoly and the

4170
03:14:52,329 --> 03:14:53,879
neighborhood comes out

4171
03:14:53,879 --> 03:14:58,549
against anybody else that would challenge their area their

4172
03:14:58,549 --> 03:14:59,360
business

4173
03:14:59,360 --> 03:15:01,899
model maybe maybe these people do great work I've never

4174
03:15:01,899 --> 03:15:02,879
released for them I'm

4175
03:15:02,879 --> 03:15:04,709
not trying to represent that to you but I am trying to

4176
03:15:04,709 --> 03:15:05,639
represent that there's

4177
03:15:05,639 --> 03:15:08,729
something to be said for competition and the fact that hey

4178
03:15:08,729 --> 03:15:10,280
we're losing students

4179
03:15:10,280 --> 03:15:15,549
and we've got to be better about it to to get our rooms

4180
03:15:15,549 --> 03:15:17,959
back full is there does

4181
03:15:17,959 --> 03:15:21,520
that resonate I just want to get your thoughts on that

4182
03:15:21,520 --> 03:15:23,600
doesn't resonate okay

4183
03:15:23,600 --> 03:15:27,469
let me give you a different scenario absolutely let's talk

4184
03:15:27,469 --> 03:15:28,319
about real

4185
03:15:28,319 --> 03:15:34,370
competition okay you know let's talk about if I'm looking

4186
03:15:34,370 --> 03:15:38,000
for a place to rent

4187
03:15:38,280 --> 03:15:42,700
why would I want to be packed in to a five-story structure

4188
03:15:42,700 --> 03:15:44,040
as if I could get

4189
03:15:44,040 --> 03:15:46,930
to a three-story structure which probably would be a little

4190
03:15:46,930 --> 03:15:48,319
less noisy and maybe

4191
03:15:48,319 --> 03:15:54,590
is not so dominated by students can I answer sure okay so

4192
03:15:54,590 --> 03:15:56,719
now you reflect back

4193
03:15:56,719 --> 03:16:00,790
right so even within the past year so technology has jumped

4194
03:16:00,790 --> 03:16:01,959
so now let's say

4195
03:16:01,959 --> 03:16:05,000
they can offer Apple TV I can tell you now every plug on a

4196
03:16:05,000 --> 03:16:06,079
planet has USB

4197
03:16:06,079 --> 03:16:08,969
connections which they didn't before and so there's there's

4198
03:16:08,969 --> 03:16:10,040
flat screens there's

4199
03:16:10,040 --> 03:16:15,079
4k TVs there's a myriad of technical reasons for a college

4200
03:16:15,079 --> 03:16:16,280
kid that's gonna

4201
03:16:16,280 --> 03:16:19,090
sit in his dorm room and play games watch TV and do

4202
03:16:19,090 --> 03:16:21,000
homework that you could have

4203
03:16:21,000 --> 03:16:23,100
add a whole bunch of amenities a whole bunch of new

4204
03:16:23,100 --> 03:16:24,280
furniture a whole bunch of

4205
03:16:24,280 --> 03:16:28,420
new stuff that would motivate me to want to live in that

4206
03:16:28,420 --> 03:16:29,959
place versus someplace

4207
03:16:29,959 --> 03:16:32,959
else is three stories that's been there a while that may

4208
03:16:32,959 --> 03:16:33,680
not have USB

4209
03:16:33,680 --> 03:16:36,809
connections may not have electric reclining couches you

4210
03:16:36,809 --> 03:16:37,280
know I mean it's

4211
03:16:37,280 --> 03:16:41,700
just so yes technology I think again having to 220 year

4212
03:16:41,700 --> 03:16:43,479
olds that understands

4213
03:16:43,479 --> 03:16:48,420
there's just been a lot happen that would motivate that

4214
03:16:48,420 --> 03:16:50,760
change sure so I have

4215
03:16:50,760 --> 03:16:54,729
to 20 years old as well great minds think alike yeah

4216
03:16:54,729 --> 03:16:55,760
sometimes it gets

4217
03:16:55,760 --> 03:17:00,100
challenging yes but here's here's the real question sure do

4218
03:17:00,100 --> 03:17:02,120
we respect our own

4219
03:17:02,120 --> 03:17:07,430
city right do we respect the culture that brought everyone

4220
03:17:07,430 --> 03:17:08,959
here do we respect

4221
03:17:08,959 --> 03:17:13,610
that there's a historic area that was worth preserving I

4222
03:17:13,610 --> 03:17:15,200
think so that's what

4223
03:17:15,200 --> 03:17:18,959
the question is sure and if we're going to complement why

4224
03:17:18,959 --> 03:17:20,159
people are here in our

4225
03:17:20,159 --> 03:17:25,290
town part of it is that we have a cultural area that's fun

4226
03:17:25,290 --> 03:17:26,399
to be in we

4227
03:17:26,399 --> 03:17:30,750
really need to be thinking beyond as to fry street area we

4228
03:17:30,750 --> 03:17:32,319
need to be thinking

4229
03:17:32,319 --> 03:17:36,670
about a cultural zone area that might follow the original

4230
03:17:36,670 --> 03:17:38,360
city limits let's

4231
03:17:38,360 --> 03:17:42,409
say that were the city limits a hundred years ago sure and

4232
03:17:42,409 --> 03:17:43,920
let's celebrate that

4233
03:17:43,920 --> 03:17:48,790
together let's not destroy what we have by putting more and

4234
03:17:48,790 --> 03:17:49,959
more and more high

4235
03:17:49,959 --> 03:17:54,979
rises around here perfect thank you thank you I see no

4236
03:17:54,979 --> 03:17:58,360
other questions Aaron

4237
03:17:58,360 --> 03:18:05,760
Knight to be followed by Anna petchening

4238
03:18:08,680 --> 03:18:18,280
my name is Aaron Knight I am the general manager of vermin

4239
03:18:18,280 --> 03:18:20,200
and I was

4240
03:18:20,200 --> 03:18:23,850
originally here to speak on behalf of Brent and answer any

4241
03:18:23,850 --> 03:18:25,120
questions that you

4242
03:18:25,120 --> 03:18:31,389
might have had that kill couldn't answer okay we have any

4243
03:18:31,389 --> 03:18:33,719
additional questions

4244
03:18:33,719 --> 03:18:33,719
for represent Commissioner Rizal thank you chair there's

4245
03:18:33,719 --> 03:18:37,920
been a lot of mention

4246
03:18:37,920 --> 03:18:41,250
about your parking spaces in particular can you confirm

4247
03:18:41,250 --> 03:18:42,840
that you use the 36

4248
03:18:42,840 --> 03:18:45,920
across the street we do not actually that is something I

4249
03:18:45,920 --> 03:18:46,559
wanted to clear up

4250
03:18:46,559 --> 03:18:50,530
those are all rented to students actually on a per semester

4251
03:18:50,530 --> 03:18:51,879
basis the

4252
03:18:51,879 --> 03:18:55,579
employees for vertman's park in the same parking lot as the

4253
03:18:55,579 --> 03:18:57,280
customers and as the

4254
03:18:57,280 --> 03:19:00,200
employees of other businesses in the area perfect this

4255
03:19:00,200 --> 03:19:01,280
might be outside of

4256
03:19:01,280 --> 03:19:04,510
your purview but who is renting to those students is it the

4257
03:19:04,510 --> 03:19:05,360
owner of the

4258
03:19:05,360 --> 03:19:08,500
property is the property not a vortman's vertman's doesn't

4259
03:19:08,500 --> 03:19:09,520
have any affiliation

4260
03:19:09,520 --> 03:19:13,600
with that lot Brent is the owner of the business and the

4261
03:19:13,600 --> 03:19:15,520
property and the other

4262
03:19:15,520 --> 03:19:21,770
lot yes yes as part of the perfect and then has there been

4263
03:19:21,770 --> 03:19:22,680
any discussions

4264
03:19:22,680 --> 03:19:26,729
about other businesses continuing to rent potential future

4265
03:19:26,729 --> 03:19:28,159
parking spaces that

4266
03:19:28,159 --> 03:19:33,559
this development will be building that I do not know okay

4267
03:19:33,559 --> 03:19:36,000
that's it thanks thank

4268
03:19:36,000 --> 03:19:40,739
you thank you the last card I have wishing to speak on this

4269
03:19:40,739 --> 03:19:41,440
item is going

4270
03:19:41,440 --> 03:19:45,659
to be Anna pitching me and if there's anyone else that

4271
03:19:45,659 --> 03:19:46,319
would like to speak

4272
03:19:46,319 --> 03:19:49,700
please fill out a card and get that to us up front and then

4273
03:19:49,700 --> 03:19:50,719
we do have a couple

4274
03:19:50,719 --> 03:19:54,540
other cards not wishing to speak but this will be our last

4275
03:19:54,540 --> 03:19:55,239
card that we have

4276
03:19:55,239 --> 03:20:01,690
wishing to speak hi if you don't mind I took notes so I

4277
03:20:01,690 --> 03:20:03,200
wanted to could you give

4278
03:20:03,200 --> 03:20:06,639
us your name and address yes my name is Anna Pichinina I

4279
03:20:06,639 --> 03:20:08,319
live on Fry Street 224

4280
03:20:08,319 --> 03:20:12,309
Fry Street I do not own anything I don't own a property I

4281
03:20:12,309 --> 03:20:13,719
rent I cannot afford to

4282
03:20:13,719 --> 03:20:16,610
buy a house with this development the prices are going to

4283
03:20:16,610 --> 03:20:17,600
go up higher I will

4284
03:20:17,600 --> 03:20:21,270
not be able to afford a house in this area ever I've been

4285
03:20:21,270 --> 03:20:22,559
taking notes I agree

4286
03:20:22,559 --> 03:20:24,579
with most of the people that are speaking against this

4287
03:20:24,579 --> 03:20:25,360
development there

4288
03:20:25,360 --> 03:20:30,030
are several reasons why first of all market somebody said

4289
03:20:30,030 --> 03:20:31,040
market is telling

4290
03:20:31,040 --> 03:20:35,379
them that the parking spots are not being used therefore

4291
03:20:35,379 --> 03:20:35,920
they need to have

4292
03:20:35,920 --> 03:20:40,379
fewer well rec local residents may not use the parking

4293
03:20:40,379 --> 03:20:41,520
spots in sterling

4294
03:20:41,520 --> 03:20:44,760
therefore their garages could be utilized by people that

4295
03:20:44,760 --> 03:20:45,479
are using both

4296
03:20:45,479 --> 03:20:49,450
businesses they cannot because we're not allowed in there

4297
03:20:49,450 --> 03:20:50,920
and from the previous

4298
03:20:50,920 --> 03:20:55,250
meeting earlier in this year somebody mentioned that

4299
03:20:55,250 --> 03:20:56,719
actually there was a talk

4300
03:20:56,719 --> 03:21:00,870
about sterling development allowing residents parking in

4301
03:21:00,870 --> 03:21:01,840
the sterling

4302
03:21:01,840 --> 03:21:07,500
development and yet they were not afterwards another point

4303
03:21:07,500 --> 03:21:09,440
being the

4304
03:21:09,440 --> 03:21:13,409
parking is terrible all the way to the scripture you can

4305
03:21:13,409 --> 03:21:14,760
see cars there any

4306
03:21:14,760 --> 03:21:20,000
time of the day I leave for work at 750 because I am lucky

4307
03:21:20,000 --> 03:21:21,319
I get to work on

4308
03:21:21,319 --> 03:21:25,989
campus and I had the traffic so 750 this is when the

4309
03:21:25,989 --> 03:21:28,639
traffic starts it's really it

4310
03:21:28,639 --> 03:21:32,559
takes me 10 minutes instead of five normally another thing

4311
03:21:32,559 --> 03:21:33,239
that nobody

4312
03:21:33,239 --> 03:21:36,700
really talked about is the sunlight access because on the

4313
03:21:36,700 --> 03:21:37,719
street Oak Street

4314
03:21:37,719 --> 03:21:42,690
currently the sterling development is so high that the road

4315
03:21:42,690 --> 03:21:44,399
next to it freezes

4316
03:21:44,399 --> 03:21:48,000
in the wintertime and does not go out everything else does

4317
03:21:48,000 --> 03:21:48,920
but that road does

4318
03:21:48,920 --> 03:21:52,989
not like and that it just means that most of the day that

4319
03:21:52,989 --> 03:21:54,399
area gets no

4320
03:21:54,399 --> 03:21:57,190
sunlight whatsoever so if we build another development that

4321
03:21:57,190 --> 03:21:57,760
's this tall

4322
03:21:57,760 --> 03:22:02,430
it's going to impact the houses directly behind it because

4323
03:22:02,430 --> 03:22:03,360
the road is not that

4324
03:22:03,360 --> 03:22:07,569
far I mean it's not that white so we're not gaining

4325
03:22:07,569 --> 03:22:10,079
additional shopping places

4326
03:22:10,079 --> 03:22:13,149
or businesses we also practically have a food desert and by

4327
03:22:13,149 --> 03:22:14,159
food desert I mean

4328
03:22:14,159 --> 03:22:18,829
that there is no grocery stores that you can get food from

4329
03:22:18,829 --> 03:22:20,040
in a walking distance

4330
03:22:20,040 --> 03:22:23,760
of campus you can go to get macaroni and cheese and chips

4331
03:22:23,760 --> 03:22:25,159
and fries and burgers

4332
03:22:25,159 --> 03:22:30,200
and beer and some you know sandwiches from CVS but you're

4333
03:22:30,200 --> 03:22:31,200
not going to get

4334
03:22:31,200 --> 03:22:35,000
fresh produce organic produce you have to take a car

4335
03:22:35,000 --> 03:22:37,440
another which which is

4336
03:22:37,440 --> 03:22:40,670
responsible students we have a lot of responsible students

4337
03:22:40,670 --> 03:22:41,760
at UNT I'm a student

4338
03:22:41,760 --> 03:22:45,700
at UNT and a full-time employee at UNT as well they will

4339
03:22:45,700 --> 03:22:47,440
try to get food access

4340
03:22:47,440 --> 03:22:50,149
to that food and they will drive they will use their

4341
03:22:50,149 --> 03:22:51,479
vehicles so even though

4342
03:22:51,479 --> 03:22:53,809
you're trying to minimize the amount of traffic these

4343
03:22:53,809 --> 03:22:55,000
people will still need to

4344
03:22:55,000 --> 03:22:58,770
get around and I don't know anyone who wants to go and

4345
03:22:58,770 --> 03:23:00,479
carry sacks of food on

4346
03:23:00,479 --> 03:23:03,829
the bus or on a bicycle I mean I've seen people do it it's

4347
03:23:03,829 --> 03:23:04,959
just not convenient

4348
03:23:04,959 --> 03:23:08,200
speaking of bicycles roads are in terrible condition

4349
03:23:08,200 --> 03:23:09,399
bicycles are riding

4350
03:23:09,399 --> 03:23:12,090
everywhere if they don't have a lane they go on a sidewalk

4351
03:23:12,090 --> 03:23:12,840
they run over

4352
03:23:12,840 --> 03:23:17,260
people and the cars don't respect they don't respect the

4353
03:23:17,260 --> 03:23:19,239
people riding bicycles

4354
03:23:19,239 --> 03:23:23,000
I myself own a bicycle I'm afraid to ride the roads on that

4355
03:23:23,000 --> 03:23:24,840
bicycle so saying

4356
03:23:24,840 --> 03:23:28,709
that people on bicycles will be living in this building is

4357
03:23:28,709 --> 03:23:30,280
also a little bit

4358
03:23:30,280 --> 03:23:35,620
funny to me I need an additional point I wanted to make is

4359
03:23:35,620 --> 03:23:36,479
that we do need

4360
03:23:36,479 --> 03:23:39,719
community spaces currently we are building so many

4361
03:23:39,719 --> 03:23:41,040
developments around the

4362
03:23:41,040 --> 03:23:45,110
area there is no additional parks and there is no community

4363
03:23:45,110 --> 03:23:46,040
gardens or anything

4364
03:23:46,040 --> 03:23:49,329
like that so there is actually more and more people but

4365
03:23:49,329 --> 03:23:50,920
fewer and fewer places

4366
03:23:50,920 --> 03:23:56,870
for these people to socialize in a free manner say it

4367
03:23:56,870 --> 03:23:58,479
because right now if you

4368
03:23:58,479 --> 03:24:01,870
want to socialize you go to bars and pay money to

4369
03:24:01,870 --> 03:24:04,079
participate in that and

4370
03:24:04,079 --> 03:24:07,879
another distinction I wanted to make in terms of business

4371
03:24:07,879 --> 03:24:09,200
this is business that's

4372
03:24:09,200 --> 03:24:12,100
not locally grown these are people coming from outside of

4373
03:24:12,100 --> 03:24:12,959
town telling us

4374
03:24:12,959 --> 03:24:15,719
how it is in the real world and what it should be and based

4375
03:24:15,719 --> 03:24:16,719
on their research

4376
03:24:16,719 --> 03:24:19,959
it's going to be great but we also have local business

4377
03:24:19,959 --> 03:24:21,200
representatives that are

4378
03:24:21,200 --> 03:24:23,920
telling you well what workmen's telling you that they want

4379
03:24:23,920 --> 03:24:25,680
this but other people

4380
03:24:25,680 --> 03:24:28,350
are telling you that they don't because obviously they have

4381
03:24:28,350 --> 03:24:29,239
their own reasons

4382
03:24:29,239 --> 03:24:32,250
and this development is going to be hurting them thank you

4383
03:24:32,250 --> 03:24:33,079
very much

4384
03:24:33,079 --> 03:24:38,360
right thank you again this is a public hearing anyone who

4385
03:24:38,360 --> 03:24:39,079
would like to speak

4386
03:24:39,079 --> 03:24:42,780
please come forward at this time you can hand it right here

4387
03:24:42,780 --> 03:24:46,840
over the top yes sir

4388
03:24:46,840 --> 03:24:53,110
next I'm Jay West and I'll start off by saying I'm your

4389
03:24:53,110 --> 03:24:55,440
address 2606 Shelby

4390
03:24:55,440 --> 03:25:00,239
Avenue in Dallas okay I represent the developer I'm as a

4391
03:25:00,239 --> 03:25:01,079
consultant to the

4392
03:25:01,079 --> 03:25:04,659
developer so I'll start by saying that I really just wanted

4393
03:25:04,659 --> 03:25:06,000
to address one thing

4394
03:25:06,000 --> 03:25:10,620
that Commissioner Roselle asked about whether the business

4395
03:25:10,620 --> 03:25:11,799
of Vortmans was

4396
03:25:11,799 --> 03:25:15,000
renting any of their parking spaces or the new project

4397
03:25:15,000 --> 03:25:16,319
would be able to rent

4398
03:25:16,319 --> 03:25:18,850
parking spaces to other businesses and I think the answer

4399
03:25:18,850 --> 03:25:19,799
is no that they would

4400
03:25:19,799 --> 03:25:24,299
not because they're providing what the code requires within

4401
03:25:24,299 --> 03:25:25,760
the garage 31

4402
03:25:25,760 --> 03:25:30,350
spaces in the garage which a lot you know a lot of retail

4403
03:25:30,350 --> 03:25:31,440
spaces very

4404
03:25:31,440 --> 03:25:35,940
convenient out of the weather but there are there is a

4405
03:25:35,940 --> 03:25:37,559
place in the Fry Street

4406
03:25:37,559 --> 03:25:39,870
area and I don't know if any of other others have noticed

4407
03:25:39,870 --> 03:25:40,639
it where there's a

4408
03:25:40,639 --> 03:25:44,280
lot of unused parking I might go out on the limb a little

4409
03:25:44,280 --> 03:25:46,079
bit but it is within

4410
03:25:46,079 --> 03:25:50,809
the youth center Fry Street building they put in a lot of

4411
03:25:50,809 --> 03:25:52,559
retail parking but

4412
03:25:52,559 --> 03:25:56,129
if you go if you go over there and park to visit their

4413
03:25:56,129 --> 03:25:58,600
facility you'll park in

4414
03:25:58,600 --> 03:26:01,489
their little garage area their employees park there then if

4415
03:26:01,489 --> 03:26:02,479
you weave your way

4416
03:26:02,479 --> 03:26:06,500
around you come to this very large retail spot and I think

4417
03:26:06,500 --> 03:26:07,520
at one point they

4418
03:26:07,520 --> 03:26:10,500
intended it for it to be metered but basically it's just

4419
03:26:10,500 --> 03:26:11,959
empty because no one

4420
03:26:11,959 --> 03:26:16,590
knows it's there because the access is so circuitous but it

4421
03:26:16,590 --> 03:26:18,040
's probably it might

4422
03:26:18,040 --> 03:26:20,530
be possible now I'm not going to say who's nickel this

4423
03:26:20,530 --> 03:26:21,479
should be on but at

4424
03:26:21,479 --> 03:26:24,200
the city for instance wanted to go to you Center Fry Street

4425
03:26:24,200 --> 03:26:25,079
and say how about

4426
03:26:25,079 --> 03:26:29,209
we pay to create a better access for these parking spaces

4427
03:26:29,209 --> 03:26:30,440
and then you can

4428
03:26:30,440 --> 03:26:35,879
get the revenue from it when students or when patrons of

4429
03:26:35,879 --> 03:26:36,959
those businesses up and

4430
03:26:36,959 --> 03:26:40,399
down the street want to use their parking spaces if you

4431
03:26:40,399 --> 03:26:40,879
provide better

4432
03:26:40,879 --> 03:26:44,809
access and better signage there's probably 40 parking

4433
03:26:44,809 --> 03:26:46,559
spaces in there that

4434
03:26:46,559 --> 03:26:51,600
go unused on a regular basis so that's that's all I had to

4435
03:26:51,600 --> 03:26:52,559
say okay just

4436
03:26:52,559 --> 03:26:57,120
yes I've got a question for you sir okay Commissioner Hesb

4437
03:26:57,120 --> 03:27:00,239
eth so I'm trying to

4438
03:27:00,239 --> 03:27:05,120
pull up you the the lot you're referencing so orient me

4439
03:27:05,120 --> 03:27:06,479
again well it's

4440
03:27:06,479 --> 03:27:09,079
within you Center of Fry Street's building it's not the

4441
03:27:09,079 --> 03:27:10,319
building that we're

4442
03:27:10,319 --> 03:27:17,040
discussing tonight building was built in 2010 they have I

4443
03:27:17,040 --> 03:27:18,879
don't have a you know

4444
03:27:18,879 --> 03:27:21,540
that there's a they have a building that's a long fry

4445
03:27:21,540 --> 03:27:22,719
street that runs from

4446
03:27:22,719 --> 03:27:26,590
fried hickory then there's an open space which is a drive-

4447
03:27:26,590 --> 03:27:28,200
through area yes a cell

4448
03:27:28,200 --> 03:27:30,879
tower in that area yes and on the one side of that open

4449
03:27:30,879 --> 03:27:32,600
space is the five

4450
03:27:32,600 --> 03:27:36,799
story parking structure yes within that parking structure

4451
03:27:36,799 --> 03:27:38,200
on the first level and

4452
03:27:38,200 --> 03:27:42,309
actually it goes down below grade slightly there is some

4453
03:27:42,309 --> 03:27:43,479
parking that's

4454
03:27:43,479 --> 03:27:46,440
hidden in there that's designed for retail students don't

4455
03:27:46,440 --> 03:27:47,159
park in it and

4456
03:27:47,159 --> 03:27:53,079
it's empty I've been I've driven in there myself it's very

4457
03:27:53,079 --> 03:27:53,879
difficult to find

4458
03:27:53,879 --> 03:27:57,579
it's very difficult to get to and it's blocked for view

4459
03:27:57,579 --> 03:27:59,280
from the street because

4460
03:27:59,280 --> 03:28:01,930
they have a little retail space there which they've had

4461
03:28:01,930 --> 03:28:03,360
difficulty leasing on

4462
03:28:03,360 --> 03:28:05,760
a regular basis since they've had a number of tenants that

4463
03:28:05,760 --> 03:28:07,559
have failed so if

4464
03:28:07,559 --> 03:28:10,120
the city this is just I'm just trying to think out of the

4465
03:28:10,120 --> 03:28:11,319
box the city were to go

4466
03:28:11,319 --> 03:28:14,739
to them and say you know what what would it cost to get rid

4467
03:28:14,739 --> 03:28:16,000
of this little retail

4468
03:28:16,000 --> 03:28:20,739
space and create a driveway to allow parking access in and

4469
03:28:20,739 --> 03:28:22,159
out to access this

4470
03:28:22,159 --> 03:28:26,030
lot if we paid for it would you be willing to do it because

4471
03:28:26,030 --> 03:28:26,719
it probably

4472
03:28:26,719 --> 03:28:29,409
would be happy to do it because I'll make money you might

4473
03:28:29,409 --> 03:28:30,440
even negotiate with

4474
03:28:30,440 --> 03:28:33,329
them and get them to pay some of the cost but you'd have to

4475
03:28:33,329 --> 03:28:34,079
give them the

4476
03:28:34,079 --> 03:28:37,879
permission to get rid of one retail space that they're they

4477
03:28:37,879 --> 03:28:39,000
've had difficulty

4478
03:28:39,000 --> 03:28:42,760
leasing anyway on a regular basis sure it's right across

4479
03:28:42,760 --> 03:28:44,200
the street from

4480
03:28:44,200 --> 03:28:48,329
Lucky Looz I'm with you where Lucky Looz is yes sir pretty

4481
03:28:48,329 --> 03:28:49,079
much right across the

4482
03:28:49,079 --> 03:28:55,459
street from Lucky Looz okay thank you okay this is a public

4483
03:28:55,459 --> 03:28:56,399
hearing so anyone

4484
03:28:56,399 --> 03:28:58,649
who would like to come forward and speak on this item

4485
03:28:58,649 --> 03:29:01,719
please do so at this time

4486
03:29:04,079 --> 03:29:08,479
I'm Patrice like I live at 1109 Egan and I put in a card

4487
03:29:08,479 --> 03:29:10,200
that was a yes a

4488
03:29:10,200 --> 03:29:14,770
non-speaking card but I got to speak okay okay so like I

4489
03:29:14,770 --> 03:29:16,479
said I live at 1109

4490
03:29:16,479 --> 03:29:21,299
Egan which I'm an 11-minute walk from my office I teach at

4491
03:29:21,299 --> 03:29:22,680
UNT my office is in

4492
03:29:22,680 --> 03:29:26,409
the auditorium building which will be then is right across

4493
03:29:26,409 --> 03:29:27,940
from Vertmans one

4494
03:29:27,940 --> 03:29:30,840
thing I think we have to remember while we're thinking

4495
03:29:30,840 --> 03:29:32,159
about anything that is

4496
03:29:32,159 --> 03:29:36,930
going to change the current fry Street small area plan is

4497
03:29:36,930 --> 03:29:38,639
that it is surrounded

4498
03:29:38,639 --> 03:29:43,579
by neighborhoods you've got the West Oak historic district

4499
03:29:43,579 --> 03:29:44,719
you've got Oak Hickory

4500
03:29:44,719 --> 03:29:48,040
and then you have my bungalow neighborhood that is behind

4501
03:29:48,040 --> 03:29:48,940
that now my

4502
03:29:48,940 --> 03:29:51,959
neighborhood is going to be part of the National Registry

4503
03:29:51,959 --> 03:29:53,700
and it's also has been

4504
03:29:53,700 --> 03:29:56,840
eligible to be a conservation or historic district for a

4505
03:29:56,840 --> 03:29:57,799
number of years

4506
03:29:57,799 --> 03:30:02,000
we just keep not doing it that's all I have to say about

4507
03:30:02,000 --> 03:30:04,879
that however with the

4508
03:30:04,879 --> 03:30:10,129
more that development goes outside the boundaries that are

4509
03:30:10,129 --> 03:30:11,479
already in place

4510
03:30:11,479 --> 03:30:17,750
like false small area plans the more we whittle away at the

4511
03:30:17,750 --> 03:30:19,520
integrity of these

4512
03:30:19,520 --> 03:30:23,000
historical neighborhoods my concern is of course for

4513
03:30:23,000 --> 03:30:25,040
precedent being set that

4514
03:30:25,040 --> 03:30:29,100
when I one developer comes in and of course when we do give

4515
03:30:29,100 --> 03:30:30,440
a variance to one

4516
03:30:30,440 --> 03:30:34,659
developer we're not giving that a variance to a developer

4517
03:30:34,659 --> 03:30:35,620
who then has

4518
03:30:35,620 --> 03:30:39,250
pinky sworn with us to only do what they say they're going

4519
03:30:39,250 --> 03:30:40,520
to do that developer

4520
03:30:40,520 --> 03:30:44,290
can turn around sell it to anybody else and any type of

4521
03:30:44,290 --> 03:30:45,920
verbal agreements we

4522
03:30:45,920 --> 03:30:48,760
feel like we're getting from those developers are just

4523
03:30:48,760 --> 03:30:49,799
completely out the

4524
03:30:49,799 --> 03:30:55,889
window every SRO builder in Denton since I have been paying

4525
03:30:55,889 --> 03:30:57,200
attention it has

4526
03:30:57,200 --> 03:31:02,569
built and sold every developer has said we are a build and

4527
03:31:02,569 --> 03:31:04,420
hold company I live

4528
03:31:04,420 --> 03:31:08,819
three houses away from the City Park and when the rail

4529
03:31:08,819 --> 03:31:11,520
family came in 15 years

4530
03:31:11,520 --> 03:31:17,159
ago maybe to develop that SRO what what used to be the flow

4531
03:31:17,159 --> 03:31:18,760
hospital site they

4532
03:31:18,760 --> 03:31:22,909
said we're building hold we will be here forever you want

4533
03:31:22,909 --> 03:31:23,920
to call us if we have

4534
03:31:23,920 --> 03:31:27,479
any problems within a couple of years they were gone what

4535
03:31:27,479 --> 03:31:28,440
the sterling

4536
03:31:28,440 --> 03:31:31,569
development is at fry Street currently the dinner steam

4537
03:31:31,569 --> 03:31:32,760
people came through

4538
03:31:32,760 --> 03:31:36,680
and they said we're building hold we will do anything you

4539
03:31:36,680 --> 03:31:37,879
say they're now you

4540
03:31:37,879 --> 03:31:42,239
center they've been sold so it's a myth when a developer

4541
03:31:42,239 --> 03:31:43,680
says oh we're going to

4542
03:31:43,680 --> 03:31:47,479
be here we're the ones who you're going to talk to for the

4543
03:31:47,479 --> 03:31:49,680
next 50 to 100 years

4544
03:31:49,680 --> 03:31:53,930
so I think we should take that into consideration that we

4545
03:31:53,930 --> 03:31:55,000
can like what

4546
03:31:55,000 --> 03:31:58,149
they're saying about where they're going to put their plan

4547
03:31:58,149 --> 03:31:59,280
ters but it doesn't

4548
03:31:59,280 --> 03:32:02,170
matter in the long run because they can sell it to somebody

4549
03:32:02,170 --> 03:32:02,879
's going to do

4550
03:32:02,879 --> 03:32:07,610
whatever they want with those planters this might be false

4551
03:32:07,610 --> 03:32:08,040
free fry Street

4552
03:32:08,040 --> 03:32:13,190
small-area plan is built to protect the fry Street area it

4553
03:32:13,190 --> 03:32:15,040
is built to protect

4554
03:32:15,040 --> 03:32:20,000
the neighborhoods that are surrounding this fry Street area

4555
03:32:20,000 --> 03:32:21,959
you know the city

4556
03:32:21,959 --> 03:32:24,500
of Denton is not in the business of having to provide

4557
03:32:24,500 --> 03:32:25,879
collegiate housing the

4558
03:32:25,879 --> 03:32:28,770
University of North Texas still has space and they are

4559
03:32:28,770 --> 03:32:29,719
extending their

4560
03:32:29,719 --> 03:32:33,030
boundaries they're squaring off a little bit I've seen some

4561
03:32:33,030 --> 03:32:33,920
of the master plan

4562
03:32:33,920 --> 03:32:37,790
they're squaring off some of their boundaries to the east

4563
03:32:37,790 --> 03:32:38,840
and yeah to the

4564
03:32:38,840 --> 03:32:42,829
east and of course to the south they have room if they want

4565
03:32:42,829 --> 03:32:44,440
to provide housing

4566
03:32:44,440 --> 03:32:49,780
but it's not our job as a city to provide housing for

4567
03:32:49,780 --> 03:32:51,799
college students

4568
03:32:51,799 --> 03:32:55,670
remembering that I teach at UNT and I like my students but

4569
03:32:55,670 --> 03:32:56,920
it's not our job

4570
03:32:56,920 --> 03:33:02,379
and secondly if a developer comes in and creates a parking

4571
03:33:02,379 --> 03:33:03,879
mass or a street

4572
03:33:03,879 --> 03:33:08,899
mess a traffic mess then it's not Denton's responsibility

4573
03:33:08,899 --> 03:33:09,840
to go clean up

4574
03:33:09,840 --> 03:33:14,340
after developers who are creating more traffic that should

4575
03:33:14,340 --> 03:33:15,719
all of that is the

4576
03:33:15,719 --> 03:33:20,180
should be on the onus of a developer who is following the

4577
03:33:20,180 --> 03:33:22,000
rules of the fry Street

4578
03:33:22,000 --> 03:33:26,200
small-area plan as handed down by the Denton Development

4579
03:33:26,200 --> 03:33:28,280
Code so that's all I

4580
03:33:28,280 --> 03:33:44,440
have to say about that thank you very much okay I have one

4581
03:33:44,440 --> 03:33:46,239
card from Laurie

4582
03:33:46,239 --> 03:33:52,760
Weller at 2297 Wood Hollow Road here in Denton and she did

4583
03:33:52,760 --> 03:33:53,680
not want to wish I

4584
03:33:53,680 --> 03:33:57,319
did not wish to speak and she is in opposition to the fry

4585
03:33:57,319 --> 03:33:59,200
Street overlay I

4586
03:33:59,200 --> 03:34:06,559
have another card from Jennifer Lane at 1526 Willowood

4587
03:34:06,559 --> 03:34:08,479
Street she does not wish

4588
03:34:08,479 --> 03:34:20,799
to speak and she is in opposition I have a card from

4589
03:34:20,799 --> 03:34:23,000
Kathleen Barnett at 607

4590
03:34:23,000 --> 03:34:30,149
Pearl Street she is in opposition card from William Barnett

4591
03:34:30,149 --> 03:34:31,799
at 607 Pearl Street

4592
03:34:31,799 --> 03:34:39,680
he is in opposition and then we had one other letter from

4593
03:34:39,680 --> 03:34:41,200
Michael Martin at

4594
03:34:41,200 --> 03:34:48,079
2909 Seabright Court in League City Texas and he is opposed

4595
03:34:48,079 --> 03:34:49,639
doesn't wish to speak

4596
03:34:49,639 --> 03:34:55,909
okay and then have one other card from Aaron Piper at 1006

4597
03:34:55,909 --> 03:34:58,760
West Hickory and she

4598
03:34:58,760 --> 03:35:02,920
is in opposition as well those are all the cards that we

4599
03:35:02,920 --> 03:35:04,479
have this is a public

4600
03:35:04,479 --> 03:35:07,450
hearing so anyone else that would like to come forward and

4601
03:35:07,450 --> 03:35:09,000
speak please come do

4602
03:35:09,000 --> 03:35:15,379
so at this time if you're going to speak only to come to

4603
03:35:15,379 --> 03:35:17,040
the microphone and I

4604
03:35:17,040 --> 03:35:21,920
think you've already spoke so we have a rule that you don't

4605
03:35:21,920 --> 03:35:22,959
have one opportunity

4606
03:35:22,959 --> 03:35:25,850
to speak unless someone would like to ask you a question

4607
03:35:25,850 --> 03:35:27,040
and it looks like

4608
03:35:27,040 --> 03:35:29,979
Commissioner Beck wants to ask you a question there's

4609
03:35:29,979 --> 03:35:31,399
something you forgot to

4610
03:35:31,399 --> 03:35:37,290
tell us earlier I did receive one of the 500 foot cards I

4611
03:35:37,290 --> 03:35:38,799
did not reply to that

4612
03:35:38,799 --> 03:35:42,090
so my reply was not one of the four that you had because I

4613
03:35:42,090 --> 03:35:43,639
knew I was going to be

4614
03:35:43,639 --> 03:35:48,840
here in person okay okay great thank you again this is a

4615
03:35:48,840 --> 03:35:50,520
public hearing this will

4616
03:35:50,520 --> 03:35:53,280
be our last call anyone else that would like to speak

4617
03:35:53,280 --> 03:35:54,479
please come forward at this

4618
03:35:54,479 --> 03:36:01,819
time seeing none I'm going to close the public hearing on

4619
03:36:01,819 --> 03:36:02,959
this item and open the

4620
03:36:02,959 --> 03:36:05,770
floor for discussion I just need to make we do have an

4621
03:36:05,770 --> 03:36:07,360
announcement as well from

4622
03:36:07,360 --> 03:36:11,079
staff thank you I just need to make some clarifications for

4623
03:36:11,079 --> 03:36:12,559
the record the

4624
03:36:12,559 --> 03:36:15,950
councilmember that did recuse himself is mr. errs mr. Steve

4625
03:36:15,950 --> 03:36:18,079
Sullivan and I need

4626
03:36:18,079 --> 03:36:20,680
to briefly state the reason for his request and that was

4627
03:36:20,680 --> 03:36:21,520
because his wife

4628
03:36:21,520 --> 03:36:26,440
did have a conflict she had an interest in the business of

4629
03:36:26,440 --> 03:36:27,159
the seller of the

4630
03:36:27,159 --> 03:36:30,450
property so he has recused himself in this case that leaves

4631
03:36:30,450 --> 03:36:31,399
us five members

4632
03:36:31,399 --> 03:36:36,520
because we do have mr. Devin Taylor out because of that we

4633
03:36:36,520 --> 03:36:38,200
have a rule in the

4634
03:36:38,200 --> 03:36:41,909
the City Council rules of procedures seven point five five

4635
03:36:41,909 --> 03:36:43,040
that requires an

4636
03:36:43,040 --> 03:36:47,360
affirmative vote of four members in order to pass an item

4637
03:36:47,360 --> 03:36:48,520
so this is going

4638
03:36:48,520 --> 03:36:51,340
to take four out of the five members present here tonight

4639
03:36:51,340 --> 03:36:52,200
in order to pass

4640
03:36:52,200 --> 03:37:00,680
this thank you okay Commissioner Beck thank you chair I

4641
03:37:00,680 --> 03:37:01,680
have a comment then

4642
03:37:01,680 --> 03:37:05,290
I'd like to make a motion but I'll hold off on my motion if

4643
03:37:05,290 --> 03:37:06,200
other people want

4644
03:37:06,200 --> 03:37:09,680
to make comments too so I want to thank everybody for

4645
03:37:09,680 --> 03:37:10,479
coming down and I

4646
03:37:10,479 --> 03:37:15,450
appreciate your input and that goes for EDR as well what we

4647
03:37:15,450 --> 03:37:17,000
've heard from EDR

4648
03:37:17,000 --> 03:37:20,670
and the people who support it is not surprising and I agree

4649
03:37:20,670 --> 03:37:21,719
with it totally

4650
03:37:21,719 --> 03:37:25,010
there's there's a need for student housing they build an

4651
03:37:25,010 --> 03:37:25,959
excellent product

4652
03:37:25,959 --> 03:37:28,350
and I'd love to see them build here and didn't there's no

4653
03:37:28,350 --> 03:37:29,799
question about that and

4654
03:37:29,799 --> 03:37:33,840
I hope they do but not at this spot and there's a reason

4655
03:37:33,840 --> 03:37:34,719
for that and I think

4656
03:37:34,719 --> 03:37:38,780
the people of the neighborhood have adequately stated that

4657
03:37:38,780 --> 03:37:39,319
that it

4658
03:37:39,319 --> 03:37:42,440
diminishes what all of us have enjoyed for years the

4659
03:37:42,440 --> 03:37:45,000
historical area has a lot

4660
03:37:45,000 --> 03:37:47,059
of significance not just for the people who live there but

4661
03:37:47,059 --> 03:37:47,760
for the people who

4662
03:37:47,760 --> 03:37:51,000
live in them I've been here since the early 70s and I've

4663
03:37:51,000 --> 03:37:52,000
watched this

4664
03:37:52,000 --> 03:37:55,719
encroachment take place so I realized that we all

4665
03:37:55,719 --> 03:37:57,899
understand that the city's

4666
03:37:57,899 --> 03:38:01,049
going to grow and we've got to make changes and I think the

4667
03:38:01,049 --> 03:38:01,639
residents of

4668
03:38:01,639 --> 03:38:03,950
that area have done that I think they've compromised they

4669
03:38:03,950 --> 03:38:05,680
've allowed sub area a

4670
03:38:05,680 --> 03:38:09,360
and sub area B and and for sub area C to come in and just

4671
03:38:09,360 --> 03:38:10,639
keep building it

4672
03:38:10,639 --> 03:38:15,370
bigger the last speaker you know made the good point that

4673
03:38:15,370 --> 03:38:16,680
nothing's ever

4674
03:38:16,680 --> 03:38:20,549
permanent it is a slippery slope for me and I think for

4675
03:38:20,549 --> 03:38:21,559
everybody else there so

4676
03:38:21,559 --> 03:38:25,000
again nothing against EDR again great company hope they do

4677
03:38:25,000 --> 03:38:26,600
build here but I

4678
03:38:26,600 --> 03:38:31,420
have to oppose it so my motion is that we deny request for

4679
03:38:31,420 --> 03:38:33,319
this okay so we have

4680
03:38:33,319 --> 03:38:40,469
a motion on the floor for denial commissioner Ellis I'll

4681
03:38:40,469 --> 03:38:41,680
second that

4682
03:38:41,680 --> 03:38:45,510
motion okay we have a first and a second okay we have a

4683
03:38:45,510 --> 03:38:46,319
first and second any

4684
03:38:46,319 --> 03:38:56,020
discussion commissioner Hudson yes so by the indication of

4685
03:38:56,020 --> 03:38:58,319
the first and second

4686
03:38:58,319 --> 03:39:06,819
this is all just conjecture so but my thought is looking

4687
03:39:06,819 --> 03:39:11,959
back four people came

4688
03:39:11,959 --> 03:39:16,629
back from from the January meeting there was four people

4689
03:39:16,629 --> 03:39:18,120
that were against that

4690
03:39:18,120 --> 03:39:22,549
returned and then there's another handful of new people

4691
03:39:22,549 --> 03:39:24,040
that were against

4692
03:39:24,040 --> 03:39:31,549
and so and I was the wolf pack of one on the first trip and

4693
03:39:31,549 --> 03:39:33,200
so I I think

4694
03:39:34,000 --> 03:39:39,040
understanding respecting the neighborhoods request is I'm

4695
03:39:39,040 --> 03:39:40,000
trying to

4696
03:39:40,000 --> 03:39:43,670
balance that with I don't know that it fixes what we're

4697
03:39:43,670 --> 03:39:45,000
trying to do and I think

4698
03:39:45,000 --> 03:39:52,069
it also is a little short-sighted because what if they just

4699
03:39:52,069 --> 03:39:54,159
decide to get under the

4700
03:39:54,159 --> 03:39:59,020
threshold and you've lost your ability to curtail what goes

4701
03:39:59,020 --> 03:40:00,440
there right and so

4702
03:40:00,440 --> 03:40:04,420
it's like it's almost like I wish there was a way me

4703
03:40:04,420 --> 03:40:06,399
personally just to go meet

4704
03:40:06,399 --> 03:40:08,540
with the neighborhood and say there's got to be a medium

4705
03:40:08,540 --> 03:40:09,399
ground where you can

4706
03:40:09,399 --> 03:40:13,159
at least have a say so and what goes there because if they

4707
03:40:13,159 --> 03:40:14,760
're if they're sold

4708
03:40:14,760 --> 03:40:19,049
out on building there then you're absolutely going to have

4709
03:40:19,049 --> 03:40:19,920
zero say so

4710
03:40:19,920 --> 03:40:23,069
you're gonna you're gonna have this document and this that

4711
03:40:23,069 --> 03:40:24,079
was everything I

4712
03:40:24,079 --> 03:40:27,139
can find says that this overlay was created in 2010 and

4713
03:40:27,139 --> 03:40:28,079
they're gonna get

4714
03:40:28,079 --> 03:40:30,870
under that threshold and and you and so you don't have an

4715
03:40:30,870 --> 03:40:31,760
opportunity to

4716
03:40:31,760 --> 03:40:35,389
modernize that document and curtail it to something you

4717
03:40:35,389 --> 03:40:37,200
want your and so that's

4718
03:40:37,200 --> 03:40:40,469
my concern for the neighborhood is the you know this is

4719
03:40:40,469 --> 03:40:42,360
twice and so at some

4720
03:40:42,360 --> 03:40:44,000
point there's going to be a meeting someplace and they're

4721
03:40:44,000 --> 03:40:44,520
going to say hey

4722
03:40:44,520 --> 03:40:48,639
we'll just do this and so now they don't have to come

4723
03:40:48,639 --> 03:40:50,120
before us and you you don't

4724
03:40:50,120 --> 03:40:52,739
get a chance to to have a neighborhood meeting have a

4725
03:40:52,739 --> 03:40:54,040
neighborhood say so and

4726
03:40:54,040 --> 03:40:56,930
that's my concern for the neighbors I want them to have an

4727
03:40:56,930 --> 03:40:58,319
ability to partake

4728
03:40:58,319 --> 03:41:04,559
and be a part of the process but you the developer is in a

4729
03:41:04,559 --> 03:41:05,200
corner where they're

4730
03:41:05,200 --> 03:41:08,760
either going to decide hey we're going to move on or we'll

4731
03:41:08,760 --> 03:41:10,159
get under threshold

4732
03:41:10,159 --> 03:41:13,409
and now you have this monster building anyway and you have

4733
03:41:13,409 --> 03:41:14,440
no say so and your

4734
03:41:14,440 --> 03:41:18,860
pipes are rattled and everything and and and so I don't I

4735
03:41:18,860 --> 03:41:20,639
don't know of a way

4736
03:41:20,639 --> 03:41:25,190
around it I mean I wish him the best and I agree with the

4737
03:41:25,190 --> 03:41:25,959
Commissioner Beck it's

4738
03:41:25,959 --> 03:41:30,469
great project I disagree with him in that I think it doesn

4739
03:41:30,469 --> 03:41:31,959
't this project not

4740
03:41:31,959 --> 03:41:34,850
being there doesn't fix the traffic it doesn't fix the road

4741
03:41:34,850 --> 03:41:35,799
it doesn't ignore

4742
03:41:35,799 --> 03:41:38,299
the fact that Eagle Drive one of the major thoroughfares

4743
03:41:38,299 --> 03:41:39,360
that you and T just

4744
03:41:39,360 --> 03:41:42,510
redid they took away a lane so what's the real it was two

4745
03:41:42,510 --> 03:41:43,799
lanes each side now

4746
03:41:43,799 --> 03:41:48,750
it's one lane in a center median and so that that adds to

4747
03:41:48,750 --> 03:41:50,440
the problem on oak

4748
03:41:50,440 --> 03:41:52,909
with Bonnie Bray being expanded that's going to add to the

4749
03:41:52,909 --> 03:41:53,639
problem with oak

4750
03:41:53,639 --> 03:41:56,790
razor-rance developing and the convention center going on

4751
03:41:56,790 --> 03:41:57,879
board adds to

4752
03:41:57,879 --> 03:42:00,770
the problem and so I think there's a lot of stuff going

4753
03:42:00,770 --> 03:42:01,840
down the road that

4754
03:42:01,840 --> 03:42:06,950
that you will wish you had a say so in the project versus

4755
03:42:06,950 --> 03:42:08,520
they build it by

4756
03:42:08,520 --> 03:42:13,799
right but you have to put purse I'll put personal feelings

4757
03:42:13,799 --> 03:42:14,879
aside and and and

4758
03:42:14,879 --> 03:42:19,959
there's just too many people that have spoken against it to

4759
03:42:19,959 --> 03:42:21,399
kind of ignore it a

4760
03:42:21,399 --> 03:42:25,959
second time I did that first time so thank you

4761
03:42:25,959 --> 03:42:32,209
Commissioner Roselle thank you chair so when I was here in

4762
03:42:32,209 --> 03:42:33,079
January and I listened

4763
03:42:33,079 --> 03:42:38,489
to the presentation and I did vote to not approve then with

4764
03:42:38,489 --> 03:42:39,879
great expectation

4765
03:42:39,879 --> 03:42:42,850
and hope that EDR would come back with just a no-brainer we

4766
03:42:42,850 --> 03:42:43,559
can get this

4767
03:42:43,559 --> 03:42:46,209
through because it seems like there is a track record there

4768
03:42:46,209 --> 03:42:47,079
is a history to the

4769
03:42:47,079 --> 03:42:51,680
company and like Commissioner Beck said their product is of

4770
03:42:51,680 --> 03:42:53,120
high quality from

4771
03:42:53,120 --> 03:42:55,069
what I can tell and I feel like their history is a

4772
03:42:55,069 --> 03:42:56,200
testament that they might

4773
03:42:56,200 --> 03:42:59,280
not be so inclined as to flip the property they haven't

4774
03:42:59,280 --> 03:43:00,440
done that in their

4775
03:43:00,440 --> 03:43:04,809
in their past and so I really wanted this project to come

4776
03:43:04,809 --> 03:43:06,120
forward to to us

4777
03:43:06,120 --> 03:43:10,770
with just some strength and clarity and to be honest I didn

4778
03:43:10,770 --> 03:43:12,319
't see either to have

4779
03:43:12,319 --> 03:43:15,770
the same narrative resubmitted to us nine months later is a

4780
03:43:15,770 --> 03:43:16,959
little concerning

4781
03:43:16,959 --> 03:43:21,420
that it wasn't even changed to show the changes that was

4782
03:43:21,420 --> 03:43:22,920
made to us and it

4783
03:43:22,920 --> 03:43:26,520
increased the ambiguity of what was trying to be achieved

4784
03:43:26,520 --> 03:43:27,479
here and so I'm

4785
03:43:27,479 --> 03:43:30,540
disappointed in that the parking spaces as I mentioned

4786
03:43:30,540 --> 03:43:31,600
earlier seem to be

4787
03:43:31,600 --> 03:43:38,280
completely all over the place I still I I feel maybe

4788
03:43:38,280 --> 03:43:39,639
confident there was 260

4789
03:43:39,639 --> 03:43:41,559
parking spaces but there's so many different documents that

4790
03:43:41,559 --> 03:43:42,120
have different

4791
03:43:42,120 --> 03:43:48,159
numbers I have concerns with that so in terms of of the the

4792
03:43:48,159 --> 03:43:49,319
the proposal we got

4793
03:43:49,319 --> 03:43:51,770
forth tonight not to discredit any work that's put forth of

4794
03:43:51,770 --> 03:43:52,719
the money involved

4795
03:43:52,719 --> 03:43:54,909
it just seemed a little haphazard and it doesn't instill a

4796
03:43:54,909 --> 03:43:55,840
lot of confidence for

4797
03:43:55,840 --> 03:43:58,430
the project going forward considering some of the discrep

4798
03:43:58,430 --> 03:43:59,959
ancies that we've

4799
03:43:59,959 --> 03:44:02,559
seen throughout the presentation and some of the concerns

4800
03:44:02,559 --> 03:44:03,719
brought up I do

4801
03:44:03,719 --> 03:44:06,350
agree with the Commissioner Hudspeth in terms of traffic

4802
03:44:06,350 --> 03:44:07,360
unfortunately for

4803
03:44:07,360 --> 03:44:10,389
residents of Oak that streets is getting worse I wish they

4804
03:44:10,389 --> 03:44:11,200
'd redo Hickory that

4805
03:44:11,200 --> 03:44:14,110
that traffic and they can like Hickory's is a terrible

4806
03:44:14,110 --> 03:44:16,639
street to drive on period

4807
03:44:16,639 --> 03:44:20,430
but Oak is going to get worse it's going to increase

4808
03:44:20,430 --> 03:44:22,040
traffic if this project

4809
03:44:22,040 --> 03:44:24,239
goes forward or it doesn't or it ever goes forward on this

4810
03:44:24,239 --> 03:44:25,040
piece of property

4811
03:44:25,040 --> 03:44:28,530
razor ranch is still going to hope oak is the natural incl

4812
03:44:28,530 --> 03:44:29,920
ination from Carroll

4813
03:44:29,920 --> 03:44:32,870
or downtown to get to raise a ranch and so there's most

4814
03:44:32,870 --> 03:44:33,920
likely probably gonna

4815
03:44:33,920 --> 03:44:36,450
be a bike lane if there's gonna be issues with oak going

4816
03:44:36,450 --> 03:44:37,280
forward and so I

4817
03:44:37,280 --> 03:44:39,969
hope individuals who live on oak or in that area know that

4818
03:44:39,969 --> 03:44:40,879
that's kind of an

4819
03:44:40,879 --> 03:44:44,879
evil coming and and us not moving this forward potentially

4820
03:44:44,879 --> 03:44:46,399
tonight doesn't

4821
03:44:46,399 --> 03:44:49,399
solve that issue unfortunately oak is developed to be a

4822
03:44:49,399 --> 03:44:51,040
secondary artery it's

4823
03:44:51,040 --> 03:44:54,760
meant to take people from Carroll West to Bonnie Braids it

4824
03:44:54,760 --> 03:44:56,200
's kind of the natural

4825
03:44:56,200 --> 03:44:59,629
progression I used to live on Egan and so I know very well

4826
03:44:59,629 --> 03:45:00,360
the neighborhood

4827
03:45:00,360 --> 03:45:04,680
and in the character of it and oak is what it is and again

4828
03:45:04,680 --> 03:45:05,360
to Commissioner

4829
03:45:05,360 --> 03:45:10,229
Hudspeth's point I feel like when when a company or project

4830
03:45:10,229 --> 03:45:11,840
comes to us asking

4831
03:45:11,840 --> 03:45:15,459
for things it gives the position of power to the city to to

4832
03:45:15,459 --> 03:45:16,719
ask for things

4833
03:45:16,719 --> 03:45:20,399
in return and so to what I believe was his point is if they

4834
03:45:20,399 --> 03:45:21,079
just meet

4835
03:45:21,079 --> 03:45:24,010
everything to code then by right they can build whatever

4836
03:45:24,010 --> 03:45:24,959
they want and so I

4837
03:45:24,959 --> 03:45:27,129
wish there's an opportunity where they were coming and

4838
03:45:27,129 --> 03:45:28,079
asking for things that

4839
03:45:28,079 --> 03:45:31,639
we could have had a dialogue to find a compromise because

4840
03:45:31,639 --> 03:45:32,680
we saw this with

4841
03:45:32,680 --> 03:45:36,000
Buc-E's we tried to interact with Buc-E's to agree on

4842
03:45:36,000 --> 03:45:37,040
something nothing

4843
03:45:37,040 --> 03:45:39,850
ever happened they built by right and the city lost some

4844
03:45:39,850 --> 03:45:41,280
opportunities I feel

4845
03:45:41,280 --> 03:45:44,409
to ask for things from that development because they just

4846
03:45:44,409 --> 03:45:45,600
built by right and so

4847
03:45:45,600 --> 03:45:50,930
that's a legitimate worry here is some other developer come

4848
03:45:50,930 --> 03:45:51,879
in see the the

4849
03:45:51,879 --> 03:45:55,120
ordinances and just build and we won't have any say in it

4850
03:45:55,120 --> 03:45:56,280
we won't be able to

4851
03:45:56,280 --> 03:45:59,170
ask anything and so I guess it goes back to my first point

4852
03:45:59,170 --> 03:45:59,799
I just wish it was

4853
03:45:59,799 --> 03:46:03,069
stronger when it came that we could say yes this this is

4854
03:46:03,069 --> 03:46:03,879
good for the

4855
03:46:03,879 --> 03:46:07,090
development this is good for the the city area but I just

4856
03:46:07,090 --> 03:46:07,959
didn't see it

4857
03:46:07,959 --> 03:46:12,389
tonight and so those are my thoughts I like Commissioner

4858
03:46:12,389 --> 03:46:13,879
Beck said I hope EDR

4859
03:46:13,879 --> 03:46:17,649
builds in Denton I just don't know if this is the property

4860
03:46:17,649 --> 03:46:18,680
or the project

4861
03:46:18,680 --> 03:46:25,120
that's gonna happen Commissioner Ellis thank you chair just

4862
03:46:25,120 --> 03:46:25,559
wanted to say a

4863
03:46:25,559 --> 03:46:27,739
couple words since I haven't said much thank you all for

4864
03:46:27,739 --> 03:46:28,719
sharing your thoughts

4865
03:46:28,719 --> 03:46:34,579
and and that's everybody for or against this development I

4866
03:46:34,579 --> 03:46:36,840
guess I just to give

4867
03:46:36,840 --> 03:46:41,729
my reasoning for denial is sub area a I believe was put in

4868
03:46:41,729 --> 03:46:43,399
place for a reason

4869
03:46:43,399 --> 03:46:48,540
this is a special part of Denton and I think it was put in

4870
03:46:48,540 --> 03:46:50,440
place to try to keep

4871
03:46:50,440 --> 03:46:57,409
some of that specialness about that corner sub area B was

4872
03:46:57,409 --> 03:46:59,079
approved I was not

4873
03:46:59,079 --> 03:47:03,510
on the Commission when it was approved now this is sub C

4874
03:47:03,510 --> 03:47:05,120
that's asking for

4875
03:47:05,120 --> 03:47:09,110
even more than B did with regard to what sub a already has

4876
03:47:09,110 --> 03:47:10,639
in place which was put

4877
03:47:10,639 --> 03:47:14,989
in place again to keep the area special this opens up the

4878
03:47:14,989 --> 03:47:16,200
door if this is

4879
03:47:16,200 --> 03:47:21,549
approved a little bit more for sub area D and E and F etc

4880
03:47:21,549 --> 03:47:24,379
and you know the

4881
03:47:24,379 --> 03:47:28,280
project is great you know to again echo sentiments already

4882
03:47:28,280 --> 03:47:29,760
given it looks like a

4883
03:47:29,760 --> 03:47:33,229
wonderful development for student housing it's just being

4884
03:47:33,229 --> 03:47:34,479
proposed in the

4885
03:47:34,479 --> 03:47:41,059
wrong location Commissioner back thank you chair just a

4886
03:47:41,059 --> 03:47:42,440
couple of statements

4887
03:47:42,440 --> 03:47:46,500
and again both Commissioner Roselle and Husper the correct

4888
03:47:46,500 --> 03:47:47,239
you know oak is

4889
03:47:47,239 --> 03:47:50,239
invariably gonna you know pick up traffic that's unavoid

4890
03:47:50,239 --> 03:47:54,040
able but I think an EDR

4891
03:47:54,040 --> 03:47:56,930
can't control the traffic they can't control student

4892
03:47:56,930 --> 03:47:59,120
activity but by default

4893
03:47:59,120 --> 03:48:02,010
just the fact that they're building there it's gonna

4894
03:48:02,010 --> 03:48:03,159
enhance these and by

4895
03:48:03,159 --> 03:48:06,100
not building it maybe we've got a little time here to work

4896
03:48:06,100 --> 03:48:06,799
out traffic

4897
03:48:06,799 --> 03:48:12,280
situations I think Bonnie Bray actually will help people

4898
03:48:12,280 --> 03:48:14,120
work around these

4899
03:48:14,120 --> 03:48:16,750
residential streets can't say that for sure but I think

4900
03:48:16,750 --> 03:48:17,680
that's a positive

4901
03:48:17,680 --> 03:48:24,200
aspect of that so thank you I'll throw a couple of comments

4902
03:48:24,200 --> 03:48:24,959
I think before we

4903
03:48:24,959 --> 03:48:29,670
run closes for a vote understand the complexity of this

4904
03:48:29,670 --> 03:48:31,799
particular area I

4905
03:48:31,799 --> 03:48:35,899
guess one of the things that strikes me considerably is

4906
03:48:35,899 --> 03:48:37,200
that the the main

4907
03:48:37,200 --> 03:48:41,799
property owner apartments is in support of this project

4908
03:48:41,799 --> 03:48:42,920
they're looking to

4909
03:48:42,920 --> 03:48:49,360
they've been there since early 20s and it's almost 100

4910
03:48:49,360 --> 03:48:52,280
years and looking to

4911
03:48:52,280 --> 03:48:58,549
continue to stay in business and you know when you look at

4912
03:48:58,549 --> 03:48:59,799
the time frame of

4913
03:48:59,799 --> 03:49:03,090
when this overlay was originally put in place it was done

4914
03:49:03,090 --> 03:49:04,719
in 2000 and then it

4915
03:49:04,719 --> 03:49:09,799
was updated in 2010 which is essentially 15 years ago it's

4916
03:49:09,799 --> 03:49:10,840
essentially a zoning

4917
03:49:10,840 --> 03:49:15,530
case and this body this Commission here zoning cases all

4918
03:49:15,530 --> 03:49:17,239
over our city and we

4919
03:49:17,239 --> 03:49:22,129
have many groups that come before us that have very deep

4920
03:49:22,129 --> 03:49:23,399
concerns about

4921
03:49:23,399 --> 03:49:26,290
properties surrounding them and what property owners are

4922
03:49:26,290 --> 03:49:27,159
wanting to do with

4923
03:49:27,159 --> 03:49:31,750
their property and wanting to have their properties rezoned

4924
03:49:31,750 --> 03:49:33,200
and most of those are

4925
03:49:33,200 --> 03:49:37,170
very similar to this case which is a up zoning which is

4926
03:49:37,170 --> 03:49:39,040
going from an NR 2 to an

4927
03:49:39,040 --> 03:49:44,409
NR 3 or in our 2 to NR 4 in our 4 to NR 6 that's because

4928
03:49:44,409 --> 03:49:45,200
there is going to be

4929
03:49:45,200 --> 03:49:48,760
more and more density in our city that is part of our 2030

4930
03:49:48,760 --> 03:49:49,639
plan is to have

4931
03:49:49,639 --> 03:49:53,379
greater density it's to have density inside the loop and

4932
03:49:53,379 --> 03:49:55,000
with that that's

4933
03:49:55,000 --> 03:49:58,319
essentially where these projects in my opinion are going to

4934
03:49:58,319 --> 03:49:59,319
continue to come

4935
03:49:59,319 --> 03:50:02,129
before this Commission and our city is going to have to

4936
03:50:02,129 --> 03:50:03,079
deal with them is

4937
03:50:03,079 --> 03:50:06,659
because there is going to be greater density here our city

4938
03:50:06,659 --> 03:50:07,799
is growing the

4939
03:50:07,799 --> 03:50:13,610
university is growing when you look at the student growth

4940
03:50:13,610 --> 03:50:15,920
of North Texas of

4941
03:50:15,920 --> 03:50:23,799
27,000 in 2000 to now 37,000 that is a huge increase and

4942
03:50:23,799 --> 03:50:24,799
not only is it just

4943
03:50:24,799 --> 03:50:28,719
students but it is staff at the university to support them

4944
03:50:28,719 --> 03:50:30,399
and all the

4945
03:50:30,399 --> 03:50:33,780
other things that go into that and that is just the reality

4946
03:50:33,780 --> 03:50:34,840
that we're faced

4947
03:50:34,840 --> 03:50:40,430
with and being right across the street from the university

4948
03:50:40,430 --> 03:50:41,399
versus in other

4949
03:50:41,399 --> 03:50:45,600
areas and all of the other transportation issues that come

4950
03:50:45,600 --> 03:50:46,319
place of

4951
03:50:46,319 --> 03:50:49,809
if this is built six blocks away from the university or

4952
03:50:49,809 --> 03:50:51,239
half a mile away from

4953
03:50:51,239 --> 03:50:54,129
the university and all these students in half to get from

4954
03:50:54,129 --> 03:50:55,319
where they live to the

4955
03:50:55,319 --> 03:50:58,840
university the traffic issues that the university is going

4956
03:50:58,840 --> 03:50:59,799
to deal with are

4957
03:50:59,799 --> 03:51:01,959
going to be significantly more than them walking across the

4958
03:51:01,959 --> 03:51:02,719
street and going to

4959
03:51:02,719 --> 03:51:08,989
campus so I may be the lone wolf this evening who will pack

4960
03:51:08,989 --> 03:51:10,639
that you know I

4961
03:51:10,639 --> 03:51:16,059
understand that there's a hesitation for a change that

4962
03:51:16,059 --> 03:51:17,959
things want neighbors want

4963
03:51:17,959 --> 03:51:21,879
to see things stay the same but this is a commercial area

4964
03:51:21,879 --> 03:51:23,479
it is right across the

4965
03:51:23,479 --> 03:51:28,149
street from North Texas the traffic there has more to do

4966
03:51:28,149 --> 03:51:28,799
with the number of

4967
03:51:28,799 --> 03:51:31,280
students that go to the university that in my opinion what

4968
03:51:31,280 --> 03:51:31,959
are going to be

4969
03:51:31,959 --> 03:51:36,379
coming for this particular project so I'm not going to vote

4970
03:51:36,379 --> 03:51:39,959
this evening on

4971
03:51:39,959 --> 03:51:44,629
the motion as far as to firm I'll be against the denial

4972
03:51:44,629 --> 03:51:46,159
because I think this

4973
03:51:46,159 --> 03:51:49,049
project long term or another project behind it to

4974
03:51:49,049 --> 03:51:51,000
Commissioner Hudspeth point

4975
03:51:51,000 --> 03:51:54,409
will change a couple of feet and then there will be no say

4976
03:51:54,409 --> 03:51:55,280
and it will be

4977
03:51:55,280 --> 03:51:59,969
built and that will be the end of it and those things may

4978
03:51:59,969 --> 03:52:01,879
that may just be what

4979
03:52:01,879 --> 03:52:05,590
happens on this particular piece of property I do want to

4980
03:52:05,590 --> 03:52:06,879
echo all of my

4981
03:52:06,879 --> 03:52:09,659
fellow commissioners I appreciate everybody who has come

4982
03:52:09,659 --> 03:52:10,440
out time and time

4983
03:52:10,440 --> 03:52:13,549
and time again on this particular issue it takes a lot of

4984
03:52:13,549 --> 03:52:14,719
time to do that it

4985
03:52:14,719 --> 03:52:17,559
takes a lot of time to study the issue go to the

4986
03:52:17,559 --> 03:52:19,920
neighborhood meetings and I

4987
03:52:19,920 --> 03:52:24,379
appreciate you coming out this evening to share your voice

4988
03:52:24,379 --> 03:52:26,479
and so with that if

4989
03:52:26,479 --> 03:52:30,530
there's not anyone else to speak I'm going to call for a

4990
03:52:30,530 --> 03:52:31,959
vote on this issue

4991
03:52:32,280 --> 03:52:35,600
seeing that we will call for a vote on the board and the

4992
03:52:35,600 --> 03:52:37,200
motion before us and

4993
03:52:37,200 --> 03:52:41,559
we have a first and a second for denial

4994
03:52:44,760 --> 03:52:58,600
do we need to do by hand or you got it okay that we may be

4995
03:52:58,600 --> 03:53:02,680
having some

4996
03:53:02,680 --> 03:53:08,530
technical difficulties clarification so if we vote for it

4997
03:53:08,530 --> 03:53:10,360
go ahead if we vote

4998
03:53:10,360 --> 03:53:13,799
for this we're voting for the approval of the denial

4999
03:53:13,799 --> 03:53:15,280
correct about four is a

5000
03:53:15,280 --> 03:53:20,510
vote for denial no would be against denial right okay

5001
03:53:20,510 --> 03:53:22,040
please vote on the

5002
03:53:22,040 --> 03:53:24,239
board

5003
03:53:29,239 --> 03:53:41,729
motion for to denial carries four to one that will take us

5004
03:53:41,729 --> 03:53:46,559
to our final thank you

5005
03:53:46,559 --> 03:53:49,799
everyone for coming out again

5006
03:53:55,920 --> 03:54:00,469
Commissioner Sullivan if you're out in the foyer watching

5007
03:54:00,469 --> 03:54:02,200
online please come

5008
03:54:02,200 --> 03:54:08,159
back to join us or we'll send somebody to come get you here

5009
03:54:08,159 --> 03:54:11,079
is you're good come

5010
03:54:11,079 --> 03:54:13,879
in come join us

5011
03:54:22,479 --> 03:54:28,159
all right that will move us to our final item this evening

5012
03:54:28,159 --> 03:54:29,319
which is going to be

5013
03:54:29,319 --> 03:54:34,459
our project matrix and concluding items Commissioner Roz

5014
03:54:34,459 --> 03:54:36,319
elle thank you first I

5015
03:54:36,319 --> 03:54:39,479
just want to thank staff for getting minutes to us quickly

5016
03:54:39,479 --> 03:54:41,360
I know we talked

5017
03:54:41,360 --> 03:54:44,440
about that like nine months ago how there was a delay it's

5018
03:54:44,440 --> 03:54:45,639
really easy for me

5019
03:54:45,639 --> 03:54:48,729
to think back this is what I said last meeting and confirm

5020
03:54:48,729 --> 03:54:49,760
and so I just wanted

5021
03:54:49,760 --> 03:54:52,459
to publicly thank you all for getting the minutes to us

5022
03:54:52,459 --> 03:54:53,920
timely much appreciated

5023
03:54:53,920 --> 03:54:57,899
and and I will probably give the the balance my time to the

5024
03:54:57,899 --> 03:54:59,200
chair on this but

5025
03:54:59,200 --> 03:55:03,430
I do want to advocate first off some sort of reevaluation

5026
03:55:03,430 --> 03:55:04,799
for having them pay

5027
03:55:04,799 --> 03:55:09,260
$25,000 for a road that the city is requiring I don't know

5028
03:55:09,260 --> 03:55:10,600
how to put that

5029
03:55:10,600 --> 03:55:14,670
into place to review but that's yeah the ESA the mobility

5030
03:55:14,670 --> 03:55:16,719
plan going through ESA

5031
03:55:16,719 --> 03:55:21,219
and having the developer foot that bill that's mind-bogg

5032
03:55:21,219 --> 03:55:22,680
ling to me so I'd love

5033
03:55:22,680 --> 03:55:26,760
to see that discussion go further

5034
03:55:29,600 --> 03:55:37,920
anybody else do we have the I may have missed it on the

5035
03:55:37,920 --> 03:55:39,239
matrix on where things

5036
03:55:39,239 --> 03:55:43,319
yep I'll catch it on my own time sorry thank you

5037
03:55:43,319 --> 03:55:45,079
Commissioner Rozelle I will

5038
03:55:45,079 --> 03:55:49,680
take that balance of time and I would like to see added to

5039
03:55:49,680 --> 03:55:51,440
our matrix the

5040
03:55:51,440 --> 03:55:55,059
point that I addressed in our work session about staff

5041
03:55:55,059 --> 03:55:56,319
which I think is

5042
03:55:56,319 --> 03:56:00,639
already on the agenda to take a look at this ESA mitigation

5043
03:56:00,639 --> 03:56:02,159
on things that are

5044
03:56:02,159 --> 03:56:06,319
required for either mobility plan or utility improvements

5045
03:56:06,319 --> 03:56:07,559
there may be even

5046
03:56:07,559 --> 03:56:11,120
some other areas that staff would have some more insight

5047
03:56:11,120 --> 03:56:12,200
than I would that

5048
03:56:12,200 --> 03:56:16,540
these things come up and to Commissioner Rozelle's point

5049
03:56:16,540 --> 03:56:18,280
and my point of asking

5050
03:56:18,280 --> 03:56:22,030
to quantify it some of these things are not only very

5051
03:56:22,030 --> 03:56:23,959
expensive in dollars but

5052
03:56:23,959 --> 03:56:27,829
also the amount of land that is lost for a developer to

5053
03:56:27,829 --> 03:56:29,680
develop their projects on

5054
03:56:29,680 --> 03:56:32,569
top of the fact that they're already putting in roads and

5055
03:56:32,569 --> 03:56:33,600
infrastructure that

5056
03:56:33,600 --> 03:56:37,409
the city is has drawn on a map and so this needs to go here

5057
03:56:37,409 --> 03:56:38,520
so I think it does

5058
03:56:38,520 --> 03:56:41,409
add to a significant cost burden and I appreciate staff

5059
03:56:41,409 --> 03:56:42,639
being willing to take a

5060
03:56:42,639 --> 03:56:47,860
look at that and bring that back to us so with that I'm

5061
03:56:47,860 --> 03:56:49,399
going to close our

5062
03:56:49,399 --> 03:56:54,079
meeting at 903 thank you everyone