WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:04.799 meeting our work session meeting for October the 12th. This 00:00:04.799 --> 00:00:05.719 meeting has been 00:00:05.719 --> 00:00:08.220 duly posted and we do have a quorum present and I'm gonna 00:00:08.220 --> 00:00:09.039 call our meeting 00:00:09.039 --> 00:00:14.160 to order at 505 and we've got a number of announcements and 00:00:14.160 --> 00:00:14.640 we're gonna start 00:00:14.640 --> 00:00:16.420 with that I'll turn that over to Shondria to make the 00:00:16.420 --> 00:00:17.960 announcements before we move 00:00:17.960 --> 00:00:21.320 into the clarification of agenda items. Good evening I'm Sh 00:00:21.320 --> 00:00:22.559 andrian Jarvis with 00:00:22.559 --> 00:00:25.679 the development review well I'm the DRC administrator with 00:00:25.679 --> 00:00:26.820 the development 00:00:26.820 --> 00:00:32.799 services department. The first announcement that we have is 00:00:32.799 --> 00:00:34.320 we sent out 00:00:34.320 --> 00:00:39.939 a notice earlier today about a joint P&Z work session but 00:00:39.939 --> 00:00:41.359 there were two dates 00:00:41.359 --> 00:00:47.600 identified December 13th around from about 2 p.m. to 5 p.m. 00:00:47.600 --> 00:00:49.560 January 9th which 00:00:49.560 --> 00:00:52.850 would be a luncheon and then we've added another date as a 00:00:52.850 --> 00:00:54.280 possibility January 00:00:54.280 --> 00:00:58.250 10th which would also be a luncheon so just if you could 00:00:58.250 --> 00:00:59.560 email your 00:00:59.560 --> 00:01:04.390 availability or preference for each of the meetings that 00:01:04.390 --> 00:01:05.640 would be great. 00:01:13.319 --> 00:01:21.450 Okay the second item I have a long list so the second item 00:01:21.450 --> 00:01:23.840 is the Texas APA 00:01:23.840 --> 00:01:27.849 conference we have two spots available for commissioners if 00:01:27.849 --> 00:01:28.719 you want to attend 00:01:28.719 --> 00:01:32.819 the dates are from November 1st to November 3rd and it'll 00:01:32.819 --> 00:01:33.659 be at the San 00:01:33.659 --> 00:01:39.560 Antonio Hyatt Hotel Texas the American Planning Association 00:01:39.560 --> 00:01:40.920 and they'll have a 00:01:40.920 --> 00:01:48.230 short course for commissioners if anybody's interested yes 00:01:48.230 --> 00:01:51.000 and then Ryan 00:01:51.000 --> 00:01:53.920 Mangita will probably want to talk about the neighborhood 00:01:53.920 --> 00:01:54.879 empowerment summit 00:01:54.879 --> 00:01:59.909 that's happening this weekend on the 15th. Hopefully you 00:01:59.909 --> 00:02:01.280 all have received some 00:02:01.280 --> 00:02:03.420 notification regarding the neighborhood empowerment summit 00:02:03.420 --> 00:02:04.439 it's this Saturday 00:02:04.439 --> 00:02:08.189 from 901 it's an opportunity for us to share our programs 00:02:08.189 --> 00:02:09.479 the city's programs 00:02:09.479 --> 00:02:13.090 with the neighborhoods that we have here in Den to help you 00:02:13.090 --> 00:02:14.520 know keep them going 00:02:14.520 --> 00:02:18.129 so that's something that if you all are able to attend are 00:02:18.129 --> 00:02:19.560 available I hope to 00:02:19.560 --> 00:02:24.759 see you there on Saturday. It is this Saturday October 15th 00:02:24.759 --> 00:02:28.439 from a 9 to 1 and 00:02:28.439 --> 00:02:34.300 it's at the MLK junior Recreation Center. And Ron did you 00:02:34.300 --> 00:02:35.539 want to talk about this 00:02:35.539 --> 00:02:41.159 flyer? Also there's a lot of stuff going on this week this 00:02:41.159 --> 00:02:42.860 Thursday Roman 00:02:42.860 --> 00:02:46.460 McAllen our historic preservation officer has put together 00:02:46.460 --> 00:02:47.280 a session for 00:02:47.280 --> 00:02:52.250 a individual from the Texas Commission to come out and 00:02:52.250 --> 00:02:54.120 speak to individuals that 00:02:54.120 --> 00:02:58.069 are interested in learning more about tax incentives that 00:02:58.069 --> 00:02:59.199 is available if 00:02:59.199 --> 00:03:04.000 those properties are eligible or qualify for that type of 00:03:04.000 --> 00:03:05.360 incentive program. 00:03:05.360 --> 00:03:09.520 So something to come in and listen and learn more about 00:03:09.520 --> 00:03:11.680 those incentives. Okay 00:03:11.680 --> 00:03:17.419 thanks. And then lastly I wanted to welcome Joanne Wilk 00:03:17.419 --> 00:03:18.639 erson I'm sorry I 00:03:18.639 --> 00:03:21.539 messed up your name. She is joining us as a planning 00:03:21.539 --> 00:03:23.280 supervisor in the long-range 00:03:23.280 --> 00:03:26.520 section of planning. She's working with Ron in this group. 00:03:26.520 --> 00:03:28.680 She comes to Denton 00:03:28.680 --> 00:03:31.509 with the wealth of knowledge from Dallas and we are very 00:03:31.509 --> 00:03:35.039 excited to have her here. 00:03:35.360 --> 00:03:41.080 And that's it. Great. You can get with Devon on all the 00:03:41.080 --> 00:03:46.159 announcements. There's a bunch of them. Thank you for the 00:03:46.159 --> 00:03:47.319 update with all the 00:03:47.319 --> 00:03:51.719 announcements and things coming up. That's going to move us 00:03:51.719 --> 00:03:52.800 to our first item 00:03:52.800 --> 00:03:55.680 here in our work session which is clarification of agenda 00:03:55.680 --> 00:03:56.439 items and I'll 00:03:56.439 --> 00:04:00.280 turn that over to you for presentation. Okay we'll go 00:04:00.280 --> 00:04:01.639 through the plats. Does 00:04:01.639 --> 00:04:05.340 anybody have any specific question on the plats? Any 00:04:05.340 --> 00:04:07.560 concerns about those? Okay. 00:04:07.560 --> 00:04:14.680 Commissioner back. Thank you. On PP 16-01A I guess we 00:04:14.680 --> 00:04:17.759 probably have to have the map up there but I'm not sure how 00:04:17.759 --> 00:04:21.759 that that track gets access. There's a railroad track there 00:04:21.759 --> 00:04:22.360 and then it's 00:04:22.360 --> 00:04:26.639 doesn't seem to be anything coming in. I'll invite Mike 00:04:26.639 --> 00:04:30.279 Bell. Okay. I'll be happy to answer that. 00:04:30.279 --> 00:04:36.569 Maybe it's easier if I pull it up on our maps here to show 00:04:36.569 --> 00:04:38.759 you the crossing over 00:04:38.759 --> 00:04:41.160 the railroad. 00:04:41.160 --> 00:04:43.160 Which item are you? 00:04:43.160 --> 00:04:49.160 A on consent agenda item. PP 16-01A. 00:04:51.160 --> 00:04:54.680 Well of course this is going to be slow but if you refer to 00:04:54.680 --> 00:04:55.839 the the backup the 00:04:55.839 --> 00:05:00.110 plat itself there is a little road in the southeast corner 00:05:00.110 --> 00:05:01.439 that follows 00:05:01.439 --> 00:05:04.379 the railroad tracks and then it cuts across to Country Club 00:05:04.379 --> 00:05:05.439 Road. It has access 00:05:05.439 --> 00:05:09.500 on Country Club Road, the very southeast corner. Okay. This 00:05:09.500 --> 00:05:12.639 is going to load for us. 00:05:14.360 --> 00:05:20.480 And this area is for single-family homes? This is actually 00:05:20.480 --> 00:05:21.279 owned by the city of 00:05:21.279 --> 00:05:24.149 didn't. It's going to be the Hickory Creek wastewater 00:05:24.149 --> 00:05:25.920 detention facility. It's come 00:05:25.920 --> 00:05:29.000 before the this Commission before with a specific use 00:05:29.000 --> 00:05:30.759 permit in 2014 and so this 00:05:30.759 --> 00:05:33.160 is the plat to make that happen. Let's see if I can find it 00:05:33.160 --> 00:05:35.560 here for you. 00:05:42.879 --> 00:05:47.230 So this is the property and there's a small little sliver 00:05:47.230 --> 00:05:49.600 right here that 00:05:49.600 --> 00:05:51.490 follows the railroad tracks and actually has access on 00:05:51.490 --> 00:05:52.160 Country Club. 00:05:52.160 --> 00:05:56.170 Is this a gravel road? Correct. Okay is that going to be 00:05:56.170 --> 00:05:56.959 improved? 00:05:56.959 --> 00:06:00.959 PS would you like to answer that? 00:06:00.959 --> 00:06:04.959 PS. Long time no see. 00:06:06.959 --> 00:06:12.959 We purchased the whole tract. Let's change my glasses here. 00:06:12.959 --> 00:06:18.149 I'm PS Arora, you know with the water department. I oversee 00:06:18.149 --> 00:06:19.639 the wastewater and 00:06:19.639 --> 00:06:24.170 drainage functions and this is a tract we had purchased all 00:06:24.170 --> 00:06:25.959 the way to Country 00:06:25.959 --> 00:06:30.209 Club Road and the part we are plotting is on the west side 00:06:30.209 --> 00:06:31.759 of the railroad track. 00:06:31.759 --> 00:06:37.439 We purchased also this part of the access from the property 00:06:37.439 --> 00:06:39.120 owner so we own 00:06:39.120 --> 00:06:42.720 this part of the road and yes we will as part of the 00:06:42.720 --> 00:06:44.639 agreement with the property 00:06:44.639 --> 00:06:47.810 owner we are going to improve it so they will always have 00:06:47.810 --> 00:06:48.399 access to their 00:06:48.399 --> 00:06:51.370 property even though we own it so that's part of the 00:06:51.370 --> 00:06:52.279 agreement we have with them. 00:06:52.279 --> 00:06:56.439 Will this be the only means of egress and ingress? Yes sir 00:06:56.439 --> 00:06:56.920 this would be 00:06:56.920 --> 00:07:00.560 because we can't get access over the railroad track to get 00:07:00.560 --> 00:07:02.519 to the site and 00:07:02.519 --> 00:07:04.889 that so that's where we went in and we purchased this part 00:07:04.889 --> 00:07:05.759 from the property 00:07:05.759 --> 00:07:08.560 owner. This is not a problem for like the fire department 00:07:08.560 --> 00:07:10.079 or anything? No sir. 00:07:10.079 --> 00:07:16.439 There is nothing you know it will be a ground storage tank. 00:07:16.439 --> 00:07:16.920 Oh it's a store? 00:07:16.920 --> 00:07:19.899 Okay. A ground storage tank and with an underground pump 00:07:19.899 --> 00:07:21.560 station with a little 00:07:21.560 --> 00:07:25.009 bit electrical but really not nothing major in terms of 00:07:25.009 --> 00:07:26.879 fire. Okay thanks. 00:07:26.879 --> 00:07:38.240 Anything else? Okay. Any more questions on flex? Not on 00:07:38.240 --> 00:07:43.639 that. Okay. Not on A. On B. 00:07:43.639 --> 00:07:51.160 FP-21, FP-1621? Right. We will have Mike Bell come back up. 00:07:51.160 --> 00:07:53.360 Okay. Commissioner back. Thank you chair. 00:07:53.360 --> 00:08:01.480 Sorry. Go ahead. This one area this is phase one I think of 00:08:01.480 --> 00:08:03.000 this. Correct. Is that is 00:08:03.000 --> 00:08:05.689 it gonna be commercial or residential? This is commercial. 00:08:05.689 --> 00:08:06.399 This is commercial. 00:08:06.399 --> 00:08:10.990 Okay. It's actually between phase one phase one's what you 00:08:10.990 --> 00:08:12.480 see here and to the 00:08:12.480 --> 00:08:14.689 west of that is phase two. Phase two will be all 00:08:14.689 --> 00:08:16.600 residential. This corner 00:08:16.600 --> 00:08:18.560 down at the very south end is actually a zone for 00:08:18.560 --> 00:08:19.920 residential but that'll be the 00:08:19.920 --> 00:08:22.699 detention pond that serves this entire Sherman Crossing 00:08:22.699 --> 00:08:24.319 development. Okay. Do we 00:08:24.319 --> 00:08:27.360 know what kind of commercial enterprises will be in there? 00:08:27.360 --> 00:08:30.680 Not yet. Okay. Okay. 00:08:30.680 --> 00:08:40.820 Thank you. Okay. Any more questions on flats? Okay. We'll 00:08:40.820 --> 00:08:41.919 go to the items for 00:08:41.919 --> 00:08:48.320 individual consideration. The first item is PZ 16164. This 00:08:48.320 --> 00:08:49.440 is the consideration 00:08:49.440 --> 00:08:53.799 and appointment of the vice-chair position. 00:08:57.480 --> 00:09:03.039 So we're gonna need a vice-chair so we have. Sorry. 00:09:03.039 --> 00:09:03.559 Commissioner back. I'd like to 00:09:03.559 --> 00:09:07.159 nominate Devin Taylor for vice-chair. 00:09:09.639 --> 00:09:13.990 Commissioner Hussman. I'm gonna second if there's other I 00:09:13.990 --> 00:09:15.200 mean so I don't know if 00:09:15.200 --> 00:09:20.159 there's other names coming out but if not I'm gonna second. 00:09:20.159 --> 00:09:22.159 We will take a first 00:09:22.159 --> 00:09:27.279 and second. I guess will we do a motion here or or first or 00:09:27.279 --> 00:09:28.200 second in a motion 00:09:28.200 --> 00:09:31.519 and vote in chamber? Because it's on for individual 00:09:31.519 --> 00:09:32.600 consideration and chambers 00:09:32.600 --> 00:09:35.159 will do it in there. Okay. So right now we'll just take 00:09:35.159 --> 00:09:37.879 nominations. Is there anybody else who would like to make a 00:09:37.879 --> 00:09:44.299 nomination that may get a second in our council chambers 00:09:44.299 --> 00:09:46.360 meeting? We can discuss 00:09:46.360 --> 00:09:51.559 all that at this time. No? Okay. The only nominee that's 00:09:51.559 --> 00:09:52.519 come forward at least in 00:09:52.519 --> 00:09:55.639 work session would be Devin Taylor with the first and the 00:09:55.639 --> 00:09:56.679 second so we'll look for 00:09:56.679 --> 00:10:04.480 that in our council chambers meeting. Okay and then the 00:10:04.480 --> 00:10:07.279 next item is SP 1602. 00:10:07.279 --> 00:10:11.809 This is the razor-wrench multifamily site plan and I invite 00:10:11.809 --> 00:10:13.080 Mike Bell back to 00:10:13.080 --> 00:10:18.039 the podium again. All right this one should look familiar. 00:10:18.039 --> 00:10:19.600 At last meeting we 00:10:19.600 --> 00:10:22.370 you know considered the recommendation on the design 00:10:22.370 --> 00:10:23.600 standards that went to 00:10:23.600 --> 00:10:26.289 council yesterday and was approved. They are in effect 00:10:26.289 --> 00:10:28.440 exactly as you saw them 00:10:28.440 --> 00:10:32.399 and so this is the actually for the site plan for the 00:10:32.399 --> 00:10:34.480 multifamily project and 00:10:34.480 --> 00:10:38.129 this will be considered by all for approval and if approved 00:10:38.129 --> 00:10:38.919 here it's done 00:10:38.919 --> 00:10:43.190 it doesn't go to council. The request is for a site plan 00:10:43.190 --> 00:10:44.360 again it's in the south 00:10:44.360 --> 00:10:47.269 mixed-use district of razor ranch and it's three components 00:10:47.269 --> 00:10:47.919 a site plan a 00:10:47.919 --> 00:10:54.000 landscape plan and elevations. The property is shown here 00:10:54.000 --> 00:10:55.080 in yellow is 00:10:55.080 --> 00:10:57.570 going to run the middle of the razor ranch south side and 00:10:57.570 --> 00:10:58.519 on that zoning plan 00:10:58.519 --> 00:11:02.169 we saw last time roughly here. This is where Heritage Trail 00:11:02.169 --> 00:11:02.919 has been built 00:11:02.919 --> 00:11:07.860 along by Wynko and that will extend all the way to the 00:11:07.860 --> 00:11:08.080 south to scripture so it has 00:11:08.080 --> 00:11:15.360 furniture on Heritage Trail. This is a little flipped north 00:11:15.360 --> 00:11:18.919 is towards me just 00:11:18.919 --> 00:11:22.399 just kind of walk you through the site. There are five 00:11:22.399 --> 00:11:24.320 buildings up to here that 00:11:24.320 --> 00:11:29.759 are going to contain 300 units. There are a number of gar 00:11:29.759 --> 00:11:32.840 ages accessory garages 00:11:32.840 --> 00:11:36.320 and then there are three kind of amenity open space 00:11:36.320 --> 00:11:38.519 recreation areas on either 00:11:38.519 --> 00:11:41.250 side. To orient you to kind of what's happening in razor to 00:11:41.250 --> 00:11:41.919 the north here's 00:11:41.919 --> 00:11:46.940 Wynko on this lot down here is the convention center and 00:11:46.940 --> 00:11:49.559 this is the the 00:11:49.559 --> 00:11:53.159 back parking lot for the movie theater. 00:11:55.679 --> 00:11:57.929 This is the landscape plan it complies with the code you'll 00:11:57.929 --> 00:11:59.440 see street trees 00:11:59.440 --> 00:12:02.919 and screening for all the parking lots along all the 00:12:02.919 --> 00:12:05.440 private drives. And then 00:12:05.440 --> 00:12:10.990 for elevations they don't show up too well in a PowerPoint 00:12:10.990 --> 00:12:13.120 so I'm gonna go 00:12:13.120 --> 00:12:16.159 ahead and pull them up in the PDF. 00:12:20.320 --> 00:12:24.470 Sorry Commissioner Beck I was watching the presentation. 00:12:24.470 --> 00:12:25.240 Thank you Chair this is 00:12:25.240 --> 00:12:27.259 the only question I have and I asked you this over the 00:12:27.259 --> 00:12:28.240 phone did you find out 00:12:28.240 --> 00:12:31.000 looking at the left elevation that's the end of the 00:12:31.000 --> 00:12:32.519 apartment. Look like you got 00:12:32.519 --> 00:12:35.879 four distinct units there. Is that all one apartment 00:12:35.879 --> 00:12:37.120 running across there? I 00:12:37.120 --> 00:12:38.960 didn't find the answer but I asked the applicant to come 00:12:38.960 --> 00:12:39.720 prepared to answer 00:12:39.720 --> 00:12:45.840 that. Before I go through this I just want to show you. 00:12:45.840 --> 00:12:47.399 Commissioner Hushbuth. Sorry I 00:12:47.399 --> 00:12:49.610 thought you were. No problem. I'll let you finish. No go 00:12:49.610 --> 00:12:53.000 ahead please. Okay can we go back to the 00:12:53.000 --> 00:13:00.600 slide with the buildings that you're highlighting. Oh yes. 00:13:00.600 --> 00:13:00.600 I'm sorry. 00:13:03.840 --> 00:13:09.899 So give me a do you have an idea traffic pattern wise what 00:13:09.899 --> 00:13:12.559 do we what's the flow 00:13:12.559 --> 00:13:16.490 there so if it feeds it's feeding in the Heritage Trail 00:13:16.490 --> 00:13:18.200 primarily how many lanes 00:13:18.200 --> 00:13:20.409 is that key give me just kind of a day in the life of 00:13:20.409 --> 00:13:21.240 getting in and out of 00:13:21.240 --> 00:13:25.710 there. Sure so Heritage Trails four lanes divided roadway 00:13:25.710 --> 00:13:27.360 and they have they're 00:13:27.360 --> 00:13:30.730 gonna have an inter dedicated left turn lane into the side 00:13:30.730 --> 00:13:31.960 here so this will be 00:13:31.960 --> 00:13:36.639 a median opening and then so that that will be the most the 00:13:36.639 --> 00:13:37.240 traffic coming in 00:13:37.240 --> 00:13:40.379 from Heritage Trail. There are also two secondary access 00:13:40.379 --> 00:13:41.159 points along this 00:13:41.159 --> 00:13:44.279 private drive and it's the private drive that separates the 00:13:44.279 --> 00:13:45.279 town center and the 00:13:45.279 --> 00:13:48.860 movie theater from Winko and in the apartments. This is 00:13:48.860 --> 00:13:50.840 more of a secondary 00:13:50.840 --> 00:13:53.529 private street internal driveway you're used to seeing any 00:13:53.529 --> 00:13:54.080 type of mall 00:13:54.080 --> 00:14:00.250 development. Okay no no no cause for concern I mean I don't 00:14:00.250 --> 00:14:00.799 know that we have 00:14:00.799 --> 00:14:05.480 much say so in it I'm just curious if you've if with that 00:14:05.480 --> 00:14:07.960 amount of traffic 00:14:07.960 --> 00:14:10.580 coming in with the with the residents with the movies that 00:14:10.580 --> 00:14:11.279 you know so you 00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:14.679 have these large surges every two hours let's say if the 00:14:14.679 --> 00:14:15.799 movie theater is 00:14:15.799 --> 00:14:19.029 looking out just have we considered that and we're 00:14:19.029 --> 00:14:20.960 comfortable with. Yes we have 00:14:20.960 --> 00:14:23.309 with every with every side plan our engineering department 00:14:23.309 --> 00:14:23.879 does request 00:14:23.879 --> 00:14:26.960 traffic generation and they analyze that and determine if 00:14:26.960 --> 00:14:27.960 we need more turn lanes 00:14:27.960 --> 00:14:31.159 or wider roads or whatever it may be and I don't have the 00:14:31.159 --> 00:14:32.480 specifics on that but 00:14:32.480 --> 00:14:34.509 they did give the okay and I know that they check that 00:14:34.509 --> 00:14:35.879 every time on every 00:14:35.879 --> 00:14:39.240 request. Okay thank you. If you'd like more information I 00:14:39.240 --> 00:14:39.639 could probably have 00:14:39.639 --> 00:14:42.220 something for you in regular session. No no that'll be 00:14:42.220 --> 00:14:43.559 great thank you. One more 00:14:43.559 --> 00:14:47.830 question Commissioner Taylor. Thank you Chair. Kind of 00:14:47.830 --> 00:14:48.679 expanding on the traffic 00:14:48.679 --> 00:14:52.960 pattern heritage heritage Boulevard is that the name of the 00:14:52.960 --> 00:14:53.600 ? Heritage trail. 00:14:53.600 --> 00:14:58.159 Heritage trail. That's being is that an arterial is it like 00:14:58.159 --> 00:14:59.559 a six lane? Yes it is 00:14:59.559 --> 00:15:05.110 excuse me it's six lane arterial. Yes. Okay and so I guess 00:15:05.110 --> 00:15:05.899 this is this is the 00:15:05.899 --> 00:15:11.799 best overall south of 380 site plan right now I think we 00:15:11.799 --> 00:15:12.559 have is that is that 00:15:12.559 --> 00:15:18.259 true? Correct yeah. What is the in the in the small site 00:15:18.259 --> 00:15:19.840 plan it shows a private 00:15:19.840 --> 00:15:22.919 road that looks like it's like a 30 or 40 foot private road 00:15:22.919 --> 00:15:24.559 two lane along the 00:15:24.559 --> 00:15:27.919 south end of the property that crosses Heritage Trail. 00:15:27.919 --> 00:15:28.960 Correct. Will that go 00:15:28.960 --> 00:15:32.570 ahead and connect on to Bonnie Bray? It will so what you'll 00:15:32.570 --> 00:15:33.720 have is this will be 00:15:33.720 --> 00:15:36.190 Linden will connect all the way and it'll be public until 00:15:36.190 --> 00:15:36.919 it hits Heritage 00:15:36.919 --> 00:15:39.429 Trail once it crosses Heritage Trail the West it'll become 00:15:39.429 --> 00:15:41.679 a private street. The 00:15:41.679 --> 00:15:43.919 same thing with Crescent. Crescent will actually dead end 00:15:43.919 --> 00:15:44.799 into Heritage Trail 00:15:44.799 --> 00:15:47.009 and then you'll have Panhandle you can kind of see the 00:15:47.009 --> 00:15:48.039 outline of where Panhandle 00:15:48.039 --> 00:15:52.480 is gonna be right through here. Okay so are those are those 00:15:52.480 --> 00:15:53.960 is there a better 00:15:53.960 --> 00:15:56.850 site plan that shows I've seen the concept plans that show 00:15:56.850 --> 00:15:57.840 some roads but I 00:15:57.840 --> 00:15:59.759 don't think any of them showed Linden and Crescent really. 00:15:59.759 --> 00:16:01.720 Is there a current 00:16:01.720 --> 00:16:06.580 plan for the layout of roads and in relation to these 00:16:06.580 --> 00:16:08.620 zoning categories or 00:16:08.620 --> 00:16:11.309 whatever they're called the use categories over here? Yeah 00:16:11.309 --> 00:16:12.159 there sure is a 00:16:12.159 --> 00:16:15.259 lot it's just conceptual at this point some of them are pad 00:16:15.259 --> 00:16:17.440 sides so I can 00:16:17.440 --> 00:16:19.250 show it to you but don't don't be too married to the site 00:16:19.250 --> 00:16:20.679 plan. Okay. So I'll be 00:16:20.679 --> 00:16:22.690 sure to show that to you in the regular session if you'd 00:16:22.690 --> 00:16:24.240 like to see that. Okay 00:16:24.240 --> 00:16:26.710 and I also was curious it was hard I was having trouble 00:16:26.710 --> 00:16:29.120 seeing on the site plan so 00:16:29.120 --> 00:16:31.809 this is immediately next to the Winko right and it's like 00:16:31.809 --> 00:16:32.919 back back fence to 00:16:32.919 --> 00:16:36.200 the Winko. There is a private street between them. Yes it 00:16:36.200 --> 00:16:38.000 is. And is there a 00:16:38.000 --> 00:16:43.320 good pedestrian access to the north? I was trying to see if 00:16:43.320 --> 00:16:43.879 there's like is 00:16:43.879 --> 00:16:46.379 that like an eight-foot sidewalk would be along the arter 00:16:46.379 --> 00:16:47.159 ial is that is that 00:16:47.159 --> 00:16:50.120 accurate or? It's a five-foot sidewalk along the arterial 00:16:50.120 --> 00:16:52.820 and do you know the 00:16:52.820 --> 00:16:56.850 sidewalks on the private street side? I have to get back to 00:16:56.850 --> 00:16:58.000 you on that one I 00:16:58.000 --> 00:17:00.690 don't know for sure. Okay because I do imagine if you're a 00:17:00.690 --> 00:17:01.639 hundred feet from 00:17:01.639 --> 00:17:04.339 the grocery store you're probably gonna walk at least for 00:17:04.339 --> 00:17:05.359 small small errands 00:17:05.359 --> 00:17:08.329 like you need you know it's probably almost as fast as 00:17:08.329 --> 00:17:09.319 going to the garage 00:17:09.319 --> 00:17:11.579 and the car out and driving over. So I just wanted to make 00:17:11.579 --> 00:17:12.279 sure that that's 00:17:12.279 --> 00:17:14.900 that's included in this. We did and when we looked at the 00:17:14.900 --> 00:17:15.720 site plan we we showed 00:17:15.720 --> 00:17:18.910 it in conjunction with the cross from the town center there 00:17:18.910 --> 00:17:19.640 's an opening 00:17:19.640 --> 00:17:22.920 basically between the movie theater and the town center 00:17:22.920 --> 00:17:24.680 that corresponds to the 00:17:24.680 --> 00:17:28.099 north side of this property so this is where that private 00:17:28.099 --> 00:17:29.160 drive is and kind of 00:17:29.160 --> 00:17:31.849 that's where the opening is in the town center between the 00:17:31.849 --> 00:17:33.700 movie theater. And so 00:17:33.700 --> 00:17:35.910 could you just put the cursor where roughly where the movie 00:17:35.910 --> 00:17:36.400 theater is I 00:17:36.400 --> 00:17:38.960 don't remember exactly. Roughly in here. Right there okay 00:17:38.960 --> 00:17:41.480 and then the plaza is 00:17:41.480 --> 00:17:44.970 just a little bit further west of the movie theater? It's 00:17:44.970 --> 00:17:45.720 kind of roughly in 00:17:45.720 --> 00:17:49.240 this area. Okay a little bit further north northwest. Okay 00:17:49.240 --> 00:17:50.319 thank you. 00:17:50.319 --> 00:17:53.640 Commissioner Rossell. I think this is thank you as good a 00:17:53.640 --> 00:17:54.880 time and screens as 00:17:54.880 --> 00:17:57.960 any desk a couple questions. Heritage Trail haven't driven 00:17:57.960 --> 00:17:59.960 on it is it is that 00:17:59.960 --> 00:18:03.519 left map up to date? Is it is it? This is the most recent 00:18:03.519 --> 00:18:05.920 Google map. What so I 00:18:05.920 --> 00:18:08.160 guess my question is is Heritage Trail going to be 00:18:08.160 --> 00:18:09.279 continued if so is that the 00:18:09.279 --> 00:18:13.549 city going to be expanded or is this complex going to be 00:18:13.549 --> 00:18:14.359 required to do some 00:18:14.359 --> 00:18:16.569 of that improvement? The developer for Razor Ranch is 00:18:16.569 --> 00:18:17.759 building the street all 00:18:17.759 --> 00:18:21.359 the way down to Scripture. Okay and that will be done 00:18:21.359 --> 00:18:22.880 before construction? 00:18:22.880 --> 00:18:25.269 Construction should start here in the next couple months or 00:18:25.269 --> 00:18:25.960 they're ready to 00:18:25.960 --> 00:18:28.430 go I think as soon as we can get approval of the plans I'll 00:18:28.430 --> 00:18:28.839 be building 00:18:28.839 --> 00:18:31.680 that road. Okay and then secondarily that you brought up 00:18:31.680 --> 00:18:32.759 the point that Crescent 00:18:32.759 --> 00:18:35.930 was coming in a dead end. Does that align with the entrance 00:18:35.930 --> 00:18:36.599 to the apartments or 00:18:36.599 --> 00:18:40.920 what is the impact of that street coming into the apartment 00:18:40.920 --> 00:18:42.279 area right there? Well 00:18:42.279 --> 00:18:44.819 let me let me clarify I think I misspoke just a bit. The 00:18:44.819 --> 00:18:45.839 plan is for Crescent to 00:18:45.839 --> 00:18:48.720 end in the park and it may or may not cross the park to hit 00:18:48.720 --> 00:18:49.400 Heritage Trail. 00:18:49.400 --> 00:18:54.000 Okay. That's still to be determined. Gotcha thank you. 00:18:54.000 --> 00:18:56.119 Commissioner Hesbeth. 00:18:56.119 --> 00:19:00.470 So just one question and you this I may be getting ahead of 00:19:00.470 --> 00:19:02.000 myself but in all of 00:19:02.000 --> 00:19:07.500 this the Crescent and Linden extensions if you will is 00:19:07.500 --> 00:19:09.319 going to be after Bonnie 00:19:09.319 --> 00:19:16.799 Bray's Wadden? Because I couldn't imagine. The Bonnie Bray 00:19:16.799 --> 00:19:17.240 is a city 00:19:17.240 --> 00:19:20.049 project so these will be happening as the developers ready 00:19:20.049 --> 00:19:21.640 to build. I don't 00:19:21.640 --> 00:19:23.480 think they're necessarily timed or one's waiting on the 00:19:23.480 --> 00:19:24.240 other unless early you 00:19:24.240 --> 00:19:28.039 have any other information on that. 00:19:35.440 --> 00:19:40.880 Hey Earl. Earl. I'm getting elbowed over here. I can't see 00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:42.440 you on television. Sorry Earl Esquire 00:19:42.440 --> 00:19:45.579 engineering. Chances are the extension of Linden and Pan 00:19:45.579 --> 00:19:47.000 handle and Crescent will 00:19:47.000 --> 00:19:50.359 occur before the Wadding and Bonnie Bray. Right now the 00:19:50.359 --> 00:19:51.720 city is trying to widen 00:19:51.720 --> 00:19:54.700 Bonnie Bray south of the highway. That's the first phase. 00:19:54.700 --> 00:19:55.680 The second phase is 00:19:55.680 --> 00:19:58.759 everything north of the highway to I believe 380 and we 00:19:58.759 --> 00:19:59.839 haven't even started 00:19:59.839 --> 00:20:04.109 design on that portion as well at all. I think we have sch 00:20:04.109 --> 00:20:05.519 ematics but no our 00:20:05.519 --> 00:20:10.890 construction plan designs. So my thought is cost wise is 00:20:10.890 --> 00:20:14.559 there a way to structure 00:20:14.559 --> 00:20:18.140 that so that we're not recreating the will I guess? I don't 00:20:18.140 --> 00:20:19.079 know. I'm just 00:20:19.079 --> 00:20:23.220 that's my concern that you would be duplicating that do 00:20:23.220 --> 00:20:23.400 duplicating efforts 00:20:23.400 --> 00:20:26.599 so if you have to go back in and tear out if we have a 00:20:26.599 --> 00:20:28.160 developer willing to 00:20:28.160 --> 00:20:31.640 build something I'd like that to remain static versus the 00:20:31.640 --> 00:20:32.640 city come in and tear 00:20:32.640 --> 00:20:35.339 it out once we widen the street and then we end up paying 00:20:35.339 --> 00:20:36.359 for it. It almost 00:20:36.359 --> 00:20:39.440 defeats the purpose of having a developer pay for the 00:20:39.440 --> 00:20:41.400 street. Yeah it's 00:20:41.400 --> 00:20:45.039 more it's a timing issue. I agree with that. However we 00:20:45.039 --> 00:20:46.240 just don't have any 00:20:46.240 --> 00:20:49.420 grading information on how Bonnie Bray is going to be 00:20:49.420 --> 00:20:51.119 designed so you know there 00:20:51.119 --> 00:20:54.849 might be some instances where we may have to tear out 00:20:54.849 --> 00:20:56.559 portions of linden 00:20:56.559 --> 00:20:59.779 crescent or panhandle into the razor range development to 00:20:59.779 --> 00:21:00.720 make the grades 00:21:00.720 --> 00:21:06.799 work depending on how Bonnie Bray is graded. Okay thank you 00:21:06.799 --> 00:21:06.880 . 00:21:06.880 --> 00:21:13.440 Commissioner Taylor. Earl before you leave. So I believe 00:21:13.440 --> 00:21:15.519 the the northern part of 00:21:15.519 --> 00:21:19.029 razor ranch they've already built their roads out on to 00:21:19.029 --> 00:21:20.440 onto Bonnie Bray and 00:21:20.440 --> 00:21:24.210 they you can see where they end the curb about usually 00:21:24.210 --> 00:21:25.240 there's like a curb about 00:21:25.240 --> 00:21:27.470 20 feet away from where Bonnie Bray is and there's like a 00:21:27.470 --> 00:21:28.240 little extension of 00:21:28.240 --> 00:21:32.240 pavement where they're basically planning for where we 00:21:32.240 --> 00:21:33.480 think Bonnie Bray 00:21:33.480 --> 00:21:35.509 is gonna go right and like they're not gonna they're not 00:21:35.509 --> 00:21:36.640 gonna build some fancy 00:21:36.640 --> 00:21:38.990 sidewalks that connect to the existing street knowing the 00:21:38.990 --> 00:21:39.759 existing street is 00:21:39.759 --> 00:21:45.079 then gonna move back 15 or 20 feet right? That's correct. 00:21:45.079 --> 00:21:46.160 Is it I don't know if 00:21:46.160 --> 00:21:48.849 it's possible zoom in on that little spot I can see you're 00:21:48.849 --> 00:21:49.680 putting the mouse 00:21:49.680 --> 00:21:53.480 on the location. 00:22:09.799 --> 00:22:09.940 So when the razor ranch development on the north side came 00:22:09.940 --> 00:22:14.799 in they dedicated 00:22:14.799 --> 00:22:18.700 the remainder of the right away for Bonnie Bray so they and 00:22:18.700 --> 00:22:19.759 I believe they 00:22:19.759 --> 00:22:19.759 built the sidewalk within their property in an easement so 00:22:19.759 --> 00:22:26.440 that in the future the 00:22:26.440 --> 00:22:26.440 city didn't have to rip up that sidewalk. Now it does kind 00:22:26.440 --> 00:22:31.720 of taper back into the 00:22:31.720 --> 00:22:31.720 right away at where we cross the drive because you don't 00:22:31.720 --> 00:22:34.839 want to have your 00:22:34.839 --> 00:22:37.920 sidewalk crossing too far into the side. And if you go 00:22:37.920 --> 00:22:40.460 safety purposes and could you go a little bit further north 00:22:40.460 --> 00:22:41.799 to the next crossing? 00:22:41.799 --> 00:22:44.880 And then you could see where it tapers back in. Yeah and 00:22:44.880 --> 00:22:45.680 they already have like 00:22:45.680 --> 00:22:48.759 some kind of skirting there for where they I'm sure that 00:22:48.759 --> 00:22:50.160 was where they expect 00:22:50.160 --> 00:22:54.410 the road to be or you know maybe there'll be maybe 20 feet 00:22:54.410 --> 00:22:55.000 of concrete 00:22:55.000 --> 00:22:58.069 that gets cut out but it's not like okay. You're talking 00:22:58.069 --> 00:23:00.799 about this widened section here. Yeah. To be 00:23:00.799 --> 00:23:06.720 honest with you I do not know why they did that. So I guess 00:23:06.720 --> 00:23:07.599 I just want to 00:23:07.599 --> 00:23:10.289 say like this they're obviously you're working with them as 00:23:10.289 --> 00:23:11.240 well as you can to 00:23:11.240 --> 00:23:14.210 kind of give them what what the current plans are so they 00:23:14.210 --> 00:23:15.299 don't have to do too 00:23:15.299 --> 00:23:17.910 much or you don't have to do too much rework right? I think 00:23:17.910 --> 00:23:18.920 the intention I 00:23:18.920 --> 00:23:22.160 think when they came in I believe the intention was that 00:23:22.160 --> 00:23:23.440 the sidewalk was gonna 00:23:23.440 --> 00:23:26.240 taper in and tie in at these points but due to safety 00:23:26.240 --> 00:23:27.559 reasons we haven't moved 00:23:27.559 --> 00:23:30.930 it back but I think at that point they I think the driveway 00:23:30.930 --> 00:23:32.160 was in first before 00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:34.690 the sidewalk came in and I think when they built the 00:23:34.690 --> 00:23:35.920 driveway first they 00:23:35.920 --> 00:23:39.910 anticipated sidewalk crossing to be there. All right thank 00:23:39.910 --> 00:23:40.839 you. 00:23:45.000 --> 00:23:47.829 All right if there's anything else I'll jump right back in 00:23:47.829 --> 00:23:48.799 the elevations. 00:23:48.799 --> 00:23:52.039 Continue please thank you. Before I really go through these 00:23:52.039 --> 00:23:52.680 I want to I'll 00:23:52.680 --> 00:23:56.089 go through this building first because it's in color. So 00:23:56.089 --> 00:23:57.440 this is the building 00:23:57.440 --> 00:24:02.019 on the west side it is the the large building that 00:24:02.019 --> 00:24:04.279 surrounds the pool and you 00:24:04.279 --> 00:24:08.150 can see the stone and the color choices that they use 00:24:08.150 --> 00:24:09.480 somewhat reflect the razor 00:24:09.480 --> 00:24:15.799 ranch general color scheme and palette. They do comply with 00:24:15.799 --> 00:24:16.400 all the 00:24:16.400 --> 00:24:19.089 architectural requirements that were approved yesterday and 00:24:19.089 --> 00:24:20.359 that you all saw 00:24:20.359 --> 00:24:24.250 and then I wanted to point out the accessory garages also 00:24:24.250 --> 00:24:24.559 are 00:24:24.559 --> 00:24:27.400 architecturally compatible with the main structures so that 00:24:27.400 --> 00:24:28.480 they'll be really 00:24:28.480 --> 00:24:32.490 nice-looking little garages. Commissioner Ellis. Thank you 00:24:32.490 --> 00:24:34.400 chair. Mike are these the 00:24:34.400 --> 00:24:37.210 hard copies you gave us at last meeting you had said 00:24:37.210 --> 00:24:39.119 something on our yes on 00:24:39.119 --> 00:24:45.109 the dais that that was this correct okay thank you. That's 00:24:45.109 --> 00:24:47.720 really elevations I'm 00:24:47.720 --> 00:24:54.559 happy to go through in more detail. There are four criteria 00:24:54.559 --> 00:24:56.119 in the razor ranch 00:24:56.119 --> 00:24:58.930 overlay district for approval of site plans I've outlined 00:24:58.930 --> 00:24:59.960 those in your backup 00:24:59.960 --> 00:25:02.259 as well. Happy to go through them if you wish but we've 00:25:02.259 --> 00:25:03.079 determined that it meets 00:25:03.079 --> 00:25:09.309 all those requirements and we'll be recommending approval. 00:25:09.309 --> 00:25:11.079 Any other questions 00:25:11.079 --> 00:25:20.880 for Mike on this one? Thank you Mike. Okay we'll skip the 00:25:20.880 --> 00:25:21.539 next two 00:25:21.539 --> 00:25:26.079 plots unless there's any questions and then go to the 00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:27.319 zoning case and I'll ask 00:25:27.319 --> 00:25:35.119 Mike Bell to come back for the podium for Z 1619. 00:25:37.160 --> 00:25:52.230 One second let me grab my notes. Before I begin I do want 00:25:52.230 --> 00:25:53.200 to point out the two 00:25:53.200 --> 00:25:56.750 handouts that I gave that I left on your chair before the 00:25:56.750 --> 00:26:02.720 meeting started. This 00:26:02.720 --> 00:26:06.720 request is a two-parter it's a rezoning request for about 00:26:06.720 --> 00:26:08.880 two acres from NR3 00:26:08.880 --> 00:26:11.839 district to the NRP 12 district. The purpose of this is to 00:26:11.839 --> 00:26:13.680 facilitate the new 00:26:13.680 --> 00:26:16.839 construction of fire station 4 the city of Denton. The 00:26:16.839 --> 00:26:18.079 second part of this is 00:26:18.079 --> 00:26:22.359 they're requesting a mixed-use residential protection 00:26:22.359 --> 00:26:24.079 overlay that would 00:26:24.079 --> 00:26:26.410 restrict all the use of the property back to its current 00:26:26.410 --> 00:26:27.720 zoning of NR3 with 00:26:27.720 --> 00:26:30.019 the exception of community service which is what a fire 00:26:30.019 --> 00:26:31.079 station falls under. So 00:26:31.079 --> 00:26:33.509 essentially an NR3 district with the exception that it 00:26:33.509 --> 00:26:34.480 allows this community 00:26:34.480 --> 00:26:39.910 service use. So the property is a triangular property here 00:26:39.910 --> 00:26:40.359 it's at the 00:26:40.359 --> 00:26:44.630 corner of Sherman Drive and Kings Row in the northeast part 00:26:44.630 --> 00:26:46.079 of the city. The 00:26:46.079 --> 00:26:50.549 existing fire station number four is located on the south 00:26:50.549 --> 00:26:51.920 side of Kings Row. 00:26:51.920 --> 00:26:55.069 The inevitable question is what happens to fire station the 00:26:55.069 --> 00:26:55.759 existing fire 00:26:55.759 --> 00:26:59.730 station four? I did speak with the assistant fire chief 00:26:59.730 --> 00:27:01.160 today to verify that 00:27:01.160 --> 00:27:04.569 the plan is to keep that building for storage eventually 00:27:04.569 --> 00:27:06.119 remodel it. Those are 00:27:06.119 --> 00:27:10.079 the current plans. Just to clarify Mike but it will stay 00:27:10.079 --> 00:27:11.240 under control of the 00:27:11.240 --> 00:27:15.880 city? That's correct that's the intention for right now. 00:27:18.759 --> 00:27:20.250 The existing zoning is a neighborhood residential 3 00:27:20.250 --> 00:27:22.000 district that's a single 00:27:22.000 --> 00:27:24.920 family district three units per acre and again they're 00:27:24.920 --> 00:27:25.640 proposing an 00:27:25.640 --> 00:27:30.980 army 12 with an overlay. The future land use map is low 00:27:30.980 --> 00:27:32.000 residential which 00:27:32.000 --> 00:27:34.299 supports single-family up to 40 units an acre which with 00:27:34.299 --> 00:27:35.119 this overlay is what 00:27:35.119 --> 00:27:41.119 this would be. To kind of highlight the uses that are 00:27:41.119 --> 00:27:43.039 permitted with this change 00:27:43.039 --> 00:27:46.480 again the only changes here in yellow at the community 00:27:46.480 --> 00:27:48.319 service goes from not 00:27:48.319 --> 00:27:52.490 permitted to permitted. Community service is any civic 00:27:52.490 --> 00:27:54.839 governmental use, libraries, 00:27:54.839 --> 00:28:00.160 fire stations, things like that. I have heard from a number 00:28:00.160 --> 00:28:01.279 of neighbors who are 00:28:01.279 --> 00:28:04.890 concerned not necessarily with the new fire station but 00:28:04.890 --> 00:28:06.240 they were concerned 00:28:06.240 --> 00:28:08.680 about what happens to the old fire station location. So 00:28:08.680 --> 00:28:09.680 what happens to the 00:28:09.680 --> 00:28:12.369 existing station and will it be sold? I've already answered 00:28:12.369 --> 00:28:13.359 that but they do plan to 00:28:13.359 --> 00:28:16.480 keep the building used for storage but there is always a 00:28:16.480 --> 00:28:17.720 possibility that they 00:28:17.720 --> 00:28:20.329 sell it. That is the truth. City Council could choose to do 00:28:20.329 --> 00:28:21.000 to go otherwise with 00:28:21.000 --> 00:28:24.759 that property so it could be it could be sold in the future 00:28:24.759 --> 00:28:27.200 . If it was sold with 00:28:27.200 --> 00:28:31.549 today's request when support to the south corner being rez 00:28:31.549 --> 00:28:33.680 oned in the future. So 00:28:33.680 --> 00:28:35.890 the concern is that the city sells and a private developer 00:28:35.890 --> 00:28:36.640 comes in and says well 00:28:36.640 --> 00:28:39.039 there's an army 12 across the street that means that I 00:28:39.039 --> 00:28:40.000 should be able to get an 00:28:40.000 --> 00:28:43.769 army 12 here. I think that's a very valid concern on its 00:28:43.769 --> 00:28:47.000 face. When you really dig 00:28:47.000 --> 00:28:49.769 down into it and we do the analysis we'll see it's really 00:28:49.769 --> 00:28:50.880 not an army 12 on 00:28:50.880 --> 00:28:53.569 this corner it's an R3 that allows fire stations. But how 00:28:53.569 --> 00:28:54.920 would y'all know that 00:28:54.920 --> 00:28:58.480 as commissioners when you get your back up? We're proposing 00:28:58.480 --> 00:29:00.059 us a change in our 00:29:00.059 --> 00:29:03.740 zoning map symbology and what it'll be is what you're used 00:29:03.740 --> 00:29:04.839 to seeing on the 00:29:04.839 --> 00:29:07.420 left is how it shows up. You'd see an army 12 you would 00:29:07.420 --> 00:29:08.319 never know there was 00:29:08.319 --> 00:29:12.109 an overlay unless we told you. On the right what you'll now 00:29:12.109 --> 00:29:12.920 begin to see is 00:29:12.920 --> 00:29:15.599 this kind of hatch pattern and we may change the symbology 00:29:15.599 --> 00:29:16.200 a bit but something 00:29:16.200 --> 00:29:19.329 to the effect of on the zoning map you'll see something on 00:29:19.329 --> 00:29:20.279 there that lets 00:29:20.279 --> 00:29:22.200 you know there's a condition of the zoning there's an 00:29:22.200 --> 00:29:23.079 overlay on the zoning 00:29:23.079 --> 00:29:26.200 there's something unique about it it's not a standard in 00:29:26.200 --> 00:29:27.160 army 12 or whatever 00:29:27.160 --> 00:29:30.599 district that it may be. So that in the future if these 00:29:30.599 --> 00:29:31.759 planners aren't here or 00:29:31.759 --> 00:29:35.930 this commission turns over they'll know to look for that. 00:29:35.930 --> 00:29:37.480 Commissioner Beck. Thank 00:29:37.480 --> 00:29:41.519 you chair. So where the existing fire station is now is in 00:29:41.519 --> 00:29:46.359 R3? Correct. Okay. 00:29:48.920 --> 00:29:55.380 Sure. In the past we've talked about these overlays that we 00:29:55.380 --> 00:29:56.559 were putting on 00:29:56.559 --> 00:29:59.819 zoning and you know we cannot have conditional zoning but 00:29:59.819 --> 00:30:00.720 the council has 00:30:00.720 --> 00:30:06.589 already approved a an overlay for mixed-use residential 00:30:06.589 --> 00:30:07.960 type arrangements 00:30:07.960 --> 00:30:11.920 so we're able to use that we've gone ahead and changed our 00:30:11.920 --> 00:30:13.319 postings in the 00:30:13.319 --> 00:30:16.660 paper where we're allowed to do a more restrictive use so 00:30:16.660 --> 00:30:17.720 you can move forward 00:30:17.720 --> 00:30:21.359 tonight on that if you wish. You might ask why can't we do 00:30:21.359 --> 00:30:22.680 this in other 00:30:22.680 --> 00:30:25.940 locations the reason is this mixed-use protection overlay 00:30:25.940 --> 00:30:26.759 is specific in our 00:30:26.759 --> 00:30:31.230 code to the NR districts so you know we've had other cases 00:30:31.230 --> 00:30:32.039 even the recent 00:30:32.039 --> 00:30:35.039 past why we can't limit all visas down it's just for NR 00:30:35.039 --> 00:30:36.319 districts. I was just 00:30:36.319 --> 00:30:40.009 getting ready to ask that question. Yes as I thought you 00:30:40.009 --> 00:30:42.200 might so just keep keep 00:30:42.200 --> 00:30:44.809 keep an eye out for that that hatching so that y'all will 00:30:44.809 --> 00:30:45.640 now know in the 00:30:45.640 --> 00:30:49.400 future it's just to help us when staff looks at it we'll go 00:30:49.400 --> 00:30:50.039 and identify 00:30:50.039 --> 00:30:52.329 everything and make sure that there's no conditions but to 00:30:52.329 --> 00:30:53.039 make it easier for 00:30:53.039 --> 00:30:55.730 y'all and the council and the developer who comes and looks 00:30:55.730 --> 00:30:56.559 at our zoning maps 00:30:56.559 --> 00:30:58.910 know that there's something there. So just to follow up on 00:30:58.910 --> 00:31:00.359 your point this is 00:31:00.359 --> 00:31:04.730 a tool that we can use in in our zoning areas only. Correct 00:31:04.730 --> 00:31:05.799 . So that's across the 00:31:05.799 --> 00:31:09.359 board citywide we can this may come up again and that would 00:31:09.359 --> 00:31:10.279 be an option as a 00:31:10.279 --> 00:31:14.069 condition that this board can use in these instances but it 00:31:14.069 --> 00:31:15.039 wouldn't be in 00:31:15.039 --> 00:31:17.549 some of the other zoning categories commercial and some of 00:31:17.549 --> 00:31:18.279 the things that 00:31:18.279 --> 00:31:21.450 may come before us that overlay is not an option for us to 00:31:21.450 --> 00:31:22.000 use and I 00:31:22.000 --> 00:31:25.359 understand incorrectly what we're doing. That is correct 00:31:25.359 --> 00:31:26.200 and with the caveat 00:31:26.200 --> 00:31:28.720 there are certain things that you can limit with this 00:31:28.720 --> 00:31:30.000 overlay. Increased 00:31:30.000 --> 00:31:32.720 setbacks, increased building materials and then use 00:31:32.720 --> 00:31:33.920 standards and use 00:31:33.920 --> 00:31:36.130 restrictions which is what we're doing here use restriction 00:31:36.130 --> 00:31:39.720 . Okay. Great thank 00:31:39.720 --> 00:31:43.430 you. And then option number two this has been brought up in 00:31:43.430 --> 00:31:44.640 the subcommittee for 00:31:44.640 --> 00:31:49.109 the city initiated rezonings is the idea of a government 00:31:49.109 --> 00:31:51.200 zoning district being 00:31:51.200 --> 00:31:54.539 created that allows just government uses. I bring this up 00:31:54.539 --> 00:31:55.640 because it did come up 00:31:55.640 --> 00:32:01.839 in the subcommittee and Mr. Crossman who you have the email 00:32:01.839 --> 00:32:03.039 from he was very 00:32:03.039 --> 00:32:05.059 concerned about this and I discussed him I told him it's 00:32:05.059 --> 00:32:05.920 not a guarantee but 00:32:05.920 --> 00:32:09.200 something we're working on but he wanted to urge that if 00:32:09.200 --> 00:32:10.880 that can't happen to 00:32:10.880 --> 00:32:14.029 move forward so I want to put that on the record. Is he 00:32:14.029 --> 00:32:15.440 concerned about it on 00:32:15.440 --> 00:32:20.380 the old building so his concern or the new? He's concerned 00:32:20.380 --> 00:32:21.200 that this would open 00:32:21.200 --> 00:32:23.619 it up the old station to be rezoned for commercials and I 00:32:23.619 --> 00:32:24.400 heard that from a 00:32:24.400 --> 00:32:29.900 number of neighbors as well. Okay. So the idea being if we 00:32:29.900 --> 00:32:31.000 create this zoning 00:32:31.000 --> 00:32:33.769 district government zoning those are on the subcommittee 00:32:33.769 --> 00:32:35.079 please remember that to 00:32:35.079 --> 00:32:39.839 include this site is what he's asking for. Got you. 00:32:40.920 --> 00:32:44.009 And we did notice per state law we received one in 00:32:44.009 --> 00:32:46.200 opposition one in favor 00:32:46.200 --> 00:32:51.029 that's the email and notice that you've received back and 00:32:51.029 --> 00:32:52.240 staff will be 00:32:52.240 --> 00:32:57.980 recommending approval. I'm happy to answer any questions. 00:32:57.980 --> 00:33:00.039 Questions for Mike? 00:33:00.039 --> 00:33:06.849 Thank you. Okay the next item is a rezoning request along 00:33:06.849 --> 00:33:08.720 Crossford Road 00:33:08.720 --> 00:33:12.759 and I will invite Julie Wyatt up. 00:33:16.359 --> 00:33:23.190 Good evening I'm Julie Wyatt. This request before you is Z 00:33:23.190 --> 00:33:25.319 1624 Ranchview 00:33:25.319 --> 00:33:30.319 Specialty Hospital initial zoning. The request is to 00:33:30.319 --> 00:33:30.720 consider a 00:33:30.720 --> 00:33:34.690 recommendation regarding an initial zoning district 00:33:34.690 --> 00:33:36.519 designation of RCCN on 00:33:36.519 --> 00:33:40.799 approximately a third of an acre. This property may look 00:33:40.799 --> 00:33:42.680 familiar to you. We 00:33:42.680 --> 00:33:46.609 did we did look at a zoning case on this a few meetings 00:33:46.609 --> 00:33:48.880 back. The subject property 00:33:48.880 --> 00:33:52.490 is right here in yellow and it is generally located on the 00:33:52.490 --> 00:33:53.440 north side of 00:33:53.440 --> 00:34:02.519 Crawford Road approximately 675 feet from the I-35W on ramp 00:34:02.519 --> 00:34:04.839 . The current 00:34:04.839 --> 00:34:09.840 zoning is RD5X and that is a place holding zoning 00:34:09.840 --> 00:34:11.800 designation that we give 00:34:11.800 --> 00:34:16.329 to properties that are recently annexed. So when the 00:34:16.329 --> 00:34:18.800 applicant came forward 00:34:18.800 --> 00:34:22.550 to the city earlier this year they proposed a specialty 00:34:22.550 --> 00:34:23.400 hospital that would 00:34:23.400 --> 00:34:28.269 include three tracts. This tract that the case that y'all 00:34:28.269 --> 00:34:30.280 saw earlier, this 00:34:30.280 --> 00:34:35.469 tract that's RCCN here and then this small tract here. This 00:34:35.469 --> 00:34:36.760 small tract was in 00:34:36.760 --> 00:34:40.889 the county and so through our discussions with them and and 00:34:40.889 --> 00:34:41.360 how it 00:34:41.360 --> 00:34:44.440 should move forward in development we came to an agreement 00:34:44.440 --> 00:34:45.360 that really that 00:34:45.360 --> 00:34:47.650 should probably be annexed just so that there are 00:34:47.650 --> 00:34:48.920 consistent regulations 00:34:48.920 --> 00:34:52.230 throughout the development. So they went through that annex 00:34:52.230 --> 00:34:53.280 ation process through 00:34:53.280 --> 00:34:56.960 voluntary annexation and that was approved in September of 00:34:56.960 --> 00:34:57.840 this year and 00:34:57.840 --> 00:35:02.880 so at that time it received that RD5X zoning designation. 00:35:02.880 --> 00:35:04.039 So that's our place 00:35:04.039 --> 00:35:09.170 holding zoning designation but it mimics the RD5, it's a 00:35:09.170 --> 00:35:10.719 rural residential zoning 00:35:10.719 --> 00:35:14.159 district within the city of Denton. It mostly has 00:35:14.159 --> 00:35:15.760 residential uses or rural 00:35:15.760 --> 00:35:19.699 type uses and a minimum of five acres. So obviously this 00:35:19.699 --> 00:35:21.119 this piece of property 00:35:21.119 --> 00:35:24.199 which is smaller than five acres doesn't doesn't meet the 00:35:24.199 --> 00:35:24.559 minimum 00:35:24.559 --> 00:35:29.349 regulations for this but there is adjacent RCCN zoning 00:35:29.349 --> 00:35:30.559 which is part of 00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:35.230 this proposed development. There's Country Lakes West here. 00:35:35.230 --> 00:35:36.039 This is actually 00:35:36.039 --> 00:35:39.559 ETJ, this is in the extraterritorial jurisdiction, it's not 00:35:39.559 --> 00:35:40.559 a part of the city 00:35:40.559 --> 00:35:44.840 of Denton and then across the highway is Hunter Ranch MPC. 00:35:44.840 --> 00:35:45.840 More specifically 00:35:45.840 --> 00:35:49.309 with this Hunter Ranch MPC this is more of a moderate 00:35:49.309 --> 00:35:51.440 density and commercial 00:35:51.440 --> 00:35:56.320 zoning in this area. So we looked at the future land use 00:35:56.320 --> 00:35:57.719 designation and it 00:35:57.719 --> 00:36:01.159 shows low density residential and as we talked about on the 00:36:01.159 --> 00:36:02.199 previous zoning 00:36:02.199 --> 00:36:06.760 designation this RCCN really doesn't fit that that rural 00:36:06.760 --> 00:36:09.440 residential zoning or 00:36:09.440 --> 00:36:13.230 future land use designation. The intent of that is to have 00:36:13.230 --> 00:36:14.320 one to four dwelling 00:36:14.320 --> 00:36:18.510 units per acre in a suburban type development pattern. When 00:36:18.510 --> 00:36:19.480 we look at the 00:36:19.480 --> 00:36:23.760 location of this property on an arterial and and close to 00:36:23.760 --> 00:36:25.239 highway with that type 00:36:25.239 --> 00:36:30.860 of access and visibility residential development probably 00:36:30.860 --> 00:36:31.840 isn't gonna happen 00:36:31.840 --> 00:36:35.210 here. It's it's more appropriate for commercial type 00:36:35.210 --> 00:36:37.239 development. So we looked 00:36:37.239 --> 00:36:39.449 and we're like oh this this future land use designation 00:36:39.449 --> 00:36:40.360 doesn't really fit this 00:36:40.360 --> 00:36:44.150 request so we want to take a deeper look at this request. 00:36:44.150 --> 00:36:46.079 So we looked further in 00:36:46.079 --> 00:36:49.059 the comprehensive plan and we looked at the preferred 00:36:49.059 --> 00:36:50.360 growth concept. This 00:36:50.360 --> 00:36:56.679 document was prepared with community involvement when they 00:36:56.679 --> 00:36:57.119 updated 00:36:57.119 --> 00:37:02.280 the comprehensive plan they had community meetings that the 00:37:02.280 --> 00:37:02.280 the 00:37:02.280 --> 00:37:05.099 participants said where do we want development within the 00:37:05.099 --> 00:37:05.840 city of Denton 00:37:05.840 --> 00:37:10.210 and they came they agreed upon this compact purposeful 00:37:10.210 --> 00:37:11.800 growth clustered 00:37:11.800 --> 00:37:15.630 around distinct locations and I know it's kind of hard to 00:37:15.630 --> 00:37:16.840 see but down here 00:37:16.840 --> 00:37:22.679 is the Crawford Road and I-35W intersection. So this was 00:37:22.679 --> 00:37:23.440 one of those 00:37:23.440 --> 00:37:27.789 areas that was determined that it development should really 00:37:27.789 --> 00:37:28.800 happen here and 00:37:28.800 --> 00:37:34.000 in this instance that it was determined a moderate density 00:37:34.000 --> 00:37:34.800 residential or 00:37:34.800 --> 00:37:37.300 moderate density development and that included moderate 00:37:37.300 --> 00:37:38.239 density residential 00:37:38.239 --> 00:37:43.179 uses, employment uses, and commercial uses and and the uses 00:37:43.179 --> 00:37:44.239 embedded in the in 00:37:44.239 --> 00:37:51.800 the RCCN do fit this this moderate density preferred growth 00:37:51.800 --> 00:37:53.280 . So the 00:37:53.280 --> 00:37:56.460 considerations we looked at was that future residential 00:37:56.460 --> 00:37:57.800 development at Robeson 00:37:57.800 --> 00:38:01.250 Ranch and then Hunter Ranch MPC, the Country Lakes, this is 00:38:01.250 --> 00:38:02.039 going to induce 00:38:02.039 --> 00:38:05.340 more demand for retail and services in this area. The 00:38:05.340 --> 00:38:07.639 requested RCCN is a 00:38:07.639 --> 00:38:12.000 logical extension of that existing zoning pattern and 00:38:12.000 --> 00:38:13.159 although it doesn't 00:38:13.159 --> 00:38:16.639 conform to the future land use map it does conform to the 00:38:16.639 --> 00:38:17.920 preferred growth 00:38:17.920 --> 00:38:21.190 concept and that we want commercial development at these 00:38:21.190 --> 00:38:22.280 intersections of 00:38:22.280 --> 00:38:27.159 highways and arterials and that commercial and office 00:38:27.159 --> 00:38:27.800 development 00:38:27.800 --> 00:38:30.539 really should be clustered in these areas as distinct 00:38:30.539 --> 00:38:31.440 centers and then 00:38:31.440 --> 00:38:35.800 transition to to the low density uses toward Country Lakes 00:38:35.800 --> 00:38:37.360 and in the Robeson 00:38:37.360 --> 00:38:41.519 Ranch area. Notification was sent out. We received no 00:38:41.519 --> 00:38:43.920 response letters and so 00:38:43.920 --> 00:38:47.230 based upon these considerations and and the Denton plan we 00:38:47.230 --> 00:38:48.079 do recommend 00:38:48.079 --> 00:38:51.880 approval and I'll stand for any questions. 00:38:56.000 --> 00:39:03.639 Thank you Julie. So we have one more this is a plan 00:39:03.639 --> 00:39:04.920 development amendment for 00:39:04.920 --> 00:39:09.280 Robeson Ranch PD 16-7. All right so we're gonna stay in the 00:39:09.280 --> 00:39:10.400 general area of the 00:39:10.400 --> 00:39:13.199 city of Denton. So this is this is a plan development 00:39:13.199 --> 00:39:14.519 amendment for Robeson 00:39:14.519 --> 00:39:19.059 Ranch. The request is to consider making a recommendation 00:39:19.059 --> 00:39:19.760 to City Council 00:39:19.760 --> 00:39:23.050 regarding a detailed plan amendment for Robeson Ranch and 00:39:23.050 --> 00:39:24.159 what they're wanting 00:39:24.159 --> 00:39:27.449 to do is blend the residential uses and we'll go into that 00:39:27.449 --> 00:39:28.460 and explain that 00:39:28.460 --> 00:39:34.469 further throughout the development. So the subject property 00:39:34.469 --> 00:39:35.440 is located 00:39:35.440 --> 00:39:40.559 north of Robeson Ranch. It is west of I-35W probably 00:39:40.559 --> 00:39:41.719 familiar with where Robeson 00:39:41.719 --> 00:39:46.610 Ranch is. Some background on the plan development it's PD 00:39:46.610 --> 00:39:48.599 173. It was 00:39:48.599 --> 00:39:51.849 developed under the 1991 Denton development or Denton 00:39:51.849 --> 00:39:52.719 development code 00:39:52.719 --> 00:39:59.510 sorry and PDs under under the 91 code had they were kind of 00:39:59.510 --> 00:40:00.239 a two-part process. 00:40:00.239 --> 00:40:03.650 The first part was a concept plan that was the general 00:40:03.650 --> 00:40:06.039 guidelines and land uses. 00:40:06.039 --> 00:40:11.659 Robeson Ranch was approved in 1999. The concept plan was 00:40:11.659 --> 00:40:13.199 and their purpose 00:40:13.199 --> 00:40:18.079 statement emphasized flexibility in a variety of housing 00:40:18.079 --> 00:40:18.639 options 00:40:18.639 --> 00:40:22.320 for an adult community. So that was that was their purpose 00:40:22.320 --> 00:40:24.159 and intent and that's 00:40:24.159 --> 00:40:27.630 reflected in the residential land uses that they approved. 00:40:27.630 --> 00:40:29.440 Single-family luxury, 00:40:29.440 --> 00:40:35.199 single family Premier and single-family Casita were all had 00:40:35.199 --> 00:40:35.559 the same 00:40:35.559 --> 00:40:39.210 permitted uses. They were single-family detached dwellings 00:40:39.210 --> 00:40:40.159 as well as some 00:40:40.159 --> 00:40:45.349 religious institutions, golf courses, public infrastructure 00:40:45.349 --> 00:40:46.840 , fire stations, those 00:40:46.840 --> 00:40:49.590 sorts of things that you would need for a residential 00:40:49.590 --> 00:40:50.619 development. The 00:40:50.619 --> 00:40:54.070 differences between these residential land uses was the lot 00:40:54.070 --> 00:40:55.079 size and then the 00:40:55.079 --> 00:40:58.519 minimum building square foot. So they were they were 00:40:58.519 --> 00:40:59.800 comparable in terms of 00:40:59.800 --> 00:41:03.969 uses but but the sizes were different. Single-family Villa 00:41:03.969 --> 00:41:05.039 permitted two 00:41:05.039 --> 00:41:08.880 family attached dwellings so it's it's different in the 00:41:08.880 --> 00:41:10.559 permitted uses and then 00:41:10.559 --> 00:41:13.389 it also has differences in minimum lot size and square 00:41:13.389 --> 00:41:14.320 footage and then 00:41:14.320 --> 00:41:17.690 multifamily allowed for multifamily development as well as 00:41:17.690 --> 00:41:18.599 some recreational 00:41:18.599 --> 00:41:23.329 facilities nursing homes so and in libraries so some some 00:41:23.329 --> 00:41:23.639 different 00:41:23.639 --> 00:41:30.179 permitted uses. That was all in the concept plan. Since 00:41:30.179 --> 00:41:32.400 1999 the as the 00:41:32.400 --> 00:41:34.659 project has evolved there have been detailed plans that 00:41:34.659 --> 00:41:35.760 have been approved. A 00:41:35.760 --> 00:41:40.170 detailed plan is the final step of a PD and it it parses 00:41:40.170 --> 00:41:42.079 out the details of the 00:41:42.079 --> 00:41:44.599 development and in terms of ropes and ranch it showed where 00:41:44.599 --> 00:41:45.400 the golf courses 00:41:45.400 --> 00:41:48.719 went where the clubhouse was going to go and then it gave 00:41:48.719 --> 00:41:50.239 specific locations for 00:41:50.239 --> 00:41:54.329 all of those residential uses and so let's look at that 00:41:54.329 --> 00:41:55.239 sorry it may be 00:41:55.239 --> 00:42:00.090 difficult to see but so the traditional lots one of those 00:42:00.090 --> 00:42:01.199 residential land use 00:42:01.199 --> 00:42:03.559 categories that's the yellow and you can see the yellow 00:42:03.559 --> 00:42:04.519 interspersed throughout 00:42:04.519 --> 00:42:09.960 the development. The gray was the premier lots the blue was 00:42:09.960 --> 00:42:11.320 the preserve lots and 00:42:11.320 --> 00:42:16.039 then those were the single-family luxury and then the 00:42:16.039 --> 00:42:17.480 single-family villa were 00:42:17.480 --> 00:42:20.760 down in this location so it gave specific locations for all 00:42:20.760 --> 00:42:21.280 of those 00:42:21.280 --> 00:42:26.480 residential uses. As the project has moved forward and 00:42:26.480 --> 00:42:29.360 developed the applicant 00:42:29.360 --> 00:42:32.650 has has realized it that maybe that mix or those specific 00:42:32.650 --> 00:42:33.800 locations of those 00:42:33.800 --> 00:42:36.880 residential uses didn't provide them with the flexibility 00:42:36.880 --> 00:42:37.760 that they needed to 00:42:37.760 --> 00:42:42.800 continue developing. So they are they have a proposal for a 00:42:42.800 --> 00:42:43.480 detail plan 00:42:43.480 --> 00:42:46.739 amendment which would permit those residential land use 00:42:46.739 --> 00:42:48.480 categories of the 00:42:48.480 --> 00:42:51.769 single-family luxury, single-family premier, the single- 00:42:51.769 --> 00:42:52.880 family casita, and 00:42:52.880 --> 00:42:56.750 the single-family villa within all areas designated as 00:42:56.750 --> 00:42:58.940 residential. For the 00:42:58.940 --> 00:43:02.780 single-family villa they're proposing a maximum of 1,200 00:43:02.780 --> 00:43:04.440 dwelling units and then 00:43:04.440 --> 00:43:09.559 this does not this this request does not permit multifamily 00:43:09.559 --> 00:43:11.039 that if they did want 00:43:11.039 --> 00:43:14.679 to come back for the MF2 they would they would have to come 00:43:14.679 --> 00:43:15.360 back with another 00:43:15.360 --> 00:43:18.119 detailed plan amendment this doesn't allow them to put 00:43:18.119 --> 00:43:19.840 multifamily to within 00:43:19.840 --> 00:43:23.480 those residential areas that that would have to come back. 00:43:23.480 --> 00:43:25.440 This request does not 00:43:25.440 --> 00:43:28.519 increase the number of dwelling units it or increase the 00:43:28.519 --> 00:43:29.719 density it really and 00:43:29.719 --> 00:43:33.869 I'm gonna use Commissioner Beck's word it integrates it 00:43:33.869 --> 00:43:35.000 integrates the 00:43:35.000 --> 00:43:38.650 residential uses so and reallocates them throughout the 00:43:38.650 --> 00:43:40.639 development. Yes sir. 00:43:40.639 --> 00:43:45.110 Commissioner Beck. Thank you chair. Okay we talked about 00:43:45.110 --> 00:43:46.679 this over the phone too so 00:43:46.679 --> 00:43:49.110 when you say integrate though it's not like you're just 00:43:49.110 --> 00:43:50.320 gonna have a hodgepodge 00:43:50.320 --> 00:43:54.280 there's still gonna be some sectioning off. Well that is my 00:43:54.280 --> 00:43:55.280 understanding of how 00:43:55.280 --> 00:43:59.750 it will work in practice. This zoning so there's there's I 00:43:59.750 --> 00:44:01.400 guess there's two 00:44:01.400 --> 00:44:05.869 elements the zoning would allow that because the zoning 00:44:05.869 --> 00:44:06.719 says that those would 00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:11.469 allow one lot to be duplex and one lot to be the single- 00:44:11.469 --> 00:44:12.320 family it would allow 00:44:12.320 --> 00:44:15.440 the mixing in that in those terms it's not as specific that 00:44:15.440 --> 00:44:17.500 specific. Did I say 00:44:17.500 --> 00:44:21.059 that right? Did that make sense? Okay but in practice in my 00:44:21.059 --> 00:44:21.920 discussions with the 00:44:21.920 --> 00:44:27.110 applicant because those villas that the the duplex the two- 00:44:27.110 --> 00:44:29.039 family product has an 00:44:29.039 --> 00:44:33.909 additional additional HOA because they have total exterior 00:44:33.909 --> 00:44:36.440 maintenance those in 00:44:36.440 --> 00:44:39.849 practice will be grouped together in specific locations 00:44:39.849 --> 00:44:40.960 because they have 00:44:40.960 --> 00:44:45.920 that additional HOA on top of them. Did that did that make 00:44:45.920 --> 00:44:47.119 it? It's not like they'll 00:44:47.119 --> 00:44:50.199 be stuck in a corner somewhere they'll get a it'll still 00:44:50.199 --> 00:44:51.800 intermingle. There'll be 00:44:51.800 --> 00:44:54.489 intermingled throughout it we don't quite know how it's 00:44:54.489 --> 00:44:55.760 gonna work in 00:44:55.760 --> 00:45:02.199 or how it's gonna look in the final design but but this is 00:45:02.199 --> 00:45:03.920 so now instead of 00:45:03.920 --> 00:45:06.829 all of the different colors all the yellow and the gray and 00:45:06.829 --> 00:45:07.599 the blue and the 00:45:07.599 --> 00:45:11.349 brown for residential that has been flattened out to just 00:45:11.349 --> 00:45:13.039 yellow and so all 00:45:13.039 --> 00:45:16.920 those four residential unit dwelling residential use 00:45:16.920 --> 00:45:18.039 categories could be 00:45:18.039 --> 00:45:24.840 permitted in all yellow areas so that's their proposal. 00:45:24.840 --> 00:45:25.840 Thank you. Commissioner 00:45:25.840 --> 00:45:30.400 Ellis. Thank You Chair. Julie you mentioned it's not 00:45:30.400 --> 00:45:31.960 increasing the proposal is not 00:45:31.960 --> 00:45:35.440 increasing the total number of units is it oh is it 00:45:35.440 --> 00:45:37.480 increasing the total villa 00:45:37.480 --> 00:45:41.840 units? It is it is if you'll look back at the original 00:45:41.840 --> 00:45:44.199 proposal this is how many 00:45:44.199 --> 00:45:48.170 villa units that they that they had. My conversations with 00:45:48.170 --> 00:45:49.440 the applicant is that 00:45:49.440 --> 00:45:52.880 those sold out really fast and so they want flexibility to 00:45:52.880 --> 00:45:54.519 add more of those so 00:45:54.519 --> 00:45:58.059 yes it does increase the number to 1,200. What was the 00:45:58.059 --> 00:46:00.320 original number? It was 00:46:00.320 --> 00:46:09.760 something like 60 it was 60. Commissioner Sullivan. Thank 00:46:09.760 --> 00:46:12.360 you Chair. My concern is that in the areas 00:46:12.360 --> 00:46:18.130 where you currently have the Premier Lots say off of 00:46:18.130 --> 00:46:20.440 Michelle Way that have 00:46:20.440 --> 00:46:24.719 already been built that they bought those with the 00:46:24.719 --> 00:46:25.679 understanding of what was 00:46:25.679 --> 00:46:29.190 going in next door to them so to speak and now they're 00:46:29.190 --> 00:46:30.400 asking to change it to 00:46:30.400 --> 00:46:35.159 where it could drastically change what's going in next door 00:46:35.159 --> 00:46:36.719 . Well is that correct? 00:46:36.719 --> 00:46:42.000 It could change the residential use category product yes 00:46:42.000 --> 00:46:43.480 and staff did look 00:46:43.480 --> 00:46:47.190 at that and because all of these uses were permitted within 00:46:47.190 --> 00:46:48.320 the concept plan 00:46:48.320 --> 00:46:51.929 that this was intended to be kind of a mixed-use housing 00:46:51.929 --> 00:46:53.800 that that was one of 00:46:53.800 --> 00:46:57.960 the the criteria we looked at for approval and we felt like 00:46:57.960 --> 00:46:59.239 because we're 00:46:59.239 --> 00:47:02.360 not really expanding the types of uses these would all be 00:47:02.360 --> 00:47:03.400 the uses that were 00:47:03.400 --> 00:47:10.969 approved with the original concept plan. So is that all 00:47:10.969 --> 00:47:14.400 right so. Hold on. Commissioner Tyler. 00:47:14.400 --> 00:47:19.030 Thank you Chair. So could we go back to the proposed yeah 00:47:19.030 --> 00:47:20.760 this map so it 00:47:20.760 --> 00:47:25.349 indicates lots but those lots would change so you're not 00:47:25.349 --> 00:47:26.719 you know or are you 00:47:26.719 --> 00:47:29.719 gonna put a duplex I guess on a single on the single lots 00:47:29.719 --> 00:47:30.800 basically or are they 00:47:30.800 --> 00:47:34.099 going to redraw them? No and they wouldn't redraw these 00:47:34.099 --> 00:47:35.480 lots we do have a 00:47:35.480 --> 00:47:38.900 running tally of the number of lots within Robeson Ranch 00:47:38.900 --> 00:47:39.719 and they're 00:47:39.719 --> 00:47:47.000 they're separated out into units so they can change the 00:47:47.000 --> 00:47:49.000 density of one area as 00:47:49.000 --> 00:47:53.559 long as the total density stays the same so this does show 00:47:53.559 --> 00:47:55.159 lots but it's really 00:47:55.159 --> 00:47:58.400 more schematic at this point it would when they come in for 00:47:58.400 --> 00:47:59.440 platting as long 00:47:59.440 --> 00:48:05.159 as they maintain the the maximum density and that number of 00:48:05.159 --> 00:48:08.079 lots then this won't 00:48:08.079 --> 00:48:11.360 drive exactly where those lots are placed it's not 00:48:11.360 --> 00:48:12.159 dimensioned out 00:48:12.159 --> 00:48:16.420 necessarily. So for example like unit 10 I think actually 00:48:16.420 --> 00:48:17.079 just we might already 00:48:17.079 --> 00:48:20.159 approved unit 10. Yes right here. Yeah maybe the one like 00:48:20.159 --> 00:48:21.719 unit 18 next to it or 00:48:21.719 --> 00:48:27.030 whatever that would be that would potentially be replanted 00:48:27.030 --> 00:48:27.960 to smaller or 00:48:27.960 --> 00:48:30.460 when it comes to platting it will be smaller lots 00:48:30.460 --> 00:48:32.400 potentially? It could be and 00:48:32.400 --> 00:48:36.590 as long as we keep that that running total to make sure 00:48:36.590 --> 00:48:37.800 they maintain that 00:48:37.800 --> 00:48:42.269 total maximum density. Is there any reason not to go ahead 00:48:42.269 --> 00:48:43.559 and preserve the 00:48:43.559 --> 00:48:48.440 categories of the already plotted areas? They're not gonna 00:48:48.440 --> 00:48:49.980 probably replat 00:48:49.980 --> 00:48:53.519 those right? And they would I mean yes I wouldn't imagine 00:48:53.519 --> 00:48:54.880 that they would replat 00:48:54.880 --> 00:48:57.570 those that the applicants here and they could probably talk 00:48:57.570 --> 00:48:58.320 about how or the 00:48:58.320 --> 00:49:00.130 applicant will be here this evening they could talk about 00:49:00.130 --> 00:49:01.039 how they're gonna move 00:49:01.039 --> 00:49:07.280 forward with this proposal but yes we have 10.1 and 10.2 00:49:07.280 --> 00:49:09.079 here that has been 00:49:09.079 --> 00:49:14.920 recently plotted this 18.2a has been plotted 18.1 is 00:49:14.920 --> 00:49:17.579 currently being 00:49:17.579 --> 00:49:21.139 plotted in this area and then actually they are they're 00:49:21.139 --> 00:49:22.480 wanting to plat this 00:49:22.480 --> 00:49:27.079 area in that sort of villa type development in this area 00:49:27.079 --> 00:49:29.000 right here so 00:49:29.000 --> 00:49:33.139 that plat if if this is approved would move forward with 00:49:33.139 --> 00:49:35.360 that villa product but 00:49:35.360 --> 00:49:39.280 they haven't given me an indication that they would replat 00:49:39.280 --> 00:49:40.719 the existing platted 00:49:40.719 --> 00:49:45.909 lots to the. So the reason I bring this up is it seems like 00:49:45.909 --> 00:49:46.360 it might it might 00:49:46.360 --> 00:49:50.619 lend or you know bring a little sense of security to people 00:49:50.619 --> 00:49:52.280 who are in the 00:49:52.280 --> 00:49:55.489 existing homes to know that their neighborhood is will be 00:49:55.489 --> 00:49:56.280 protected at 00:49:56.280 --> 00:49:59.059 whatever density it currently is and whatever size 00:49:59.059 --> 00:50:00.119 restrictions that 00:50:00.119 --> 00:50:03.099 currently are there they're not going to have you know a du 00:50:03.099 --> 00:50:04.400 plex going next door 00:50:04.400 --> 00:50:08.289 right existing unit sure kind of wonder if that might and 00:50:08.289 --> 00:50:09.360 you know what about a 00:50:09.360 --> 00:50:12.460 third of this is built so a third of this would be categor 00:50:12.460 --> 00:50:14.840 ized you know thank 00:50:14.840 --> 00:50:19.389 you. I'm gonna make some comments too I'm somewhat serious 00:50:19.389 --> 00:50:20.480 in the same concerns 00:50:20.480 --> 00:50:25.840 Commissioner Taylor does I understand some master plan 00:50:25.840 --> 00:50:29.400 community but this if I 00:50:29.400 --> 00:50:33.550 understood you correctly that you can have different house 00:50:33.550 --> 00:50:34.760 types on the same 00:50:34.760 --> 00:50:38.929 lot is very different than our typical subdivision 00:50:38.929 --> 00:50:40.840 requirements in the city 00:50:40.840 --> 00:50:45.559 of Denton so I mean we have in our three in our six you can 00:50:45.559 --> 00:50:47.440 't do duplexes next to 00:50:47.440 --> 00:50:51.000 a single-family home what sounds like we're if I understand 00:50:51.000 --> 00:50:51.360 you correctly 00:50:51.360 --> 00:50:55.210 that's what they're asking the ability to do they may not 00:50:55.210 --> 00:50:56.840 do it in practice but 00:50:56.840 --> 00:51:01.309 we're giving them the ability to do that if they so chose 00:51:01.309 --> 00:51:02.280 to do them I 00:51:02.280 --> 00:51:05.480 understand incorrectly anything that hasn't been platted 00:51:05.480 --> 00:51:06.239 any part that's 00:51:06.239 --> 00:51:10.320 moving forward yes they could because this permits them to 00:51:10.320 --> 00:51:12.039 to blend and to 00:51:12.039 --> 00:51:16.869 mix and integrate those those uses as long as they stay 00:51:16.869 --> 00:51:20.559 within the density yes 00:51:20.559 --> 00:51:23.679 I'm gonna need to think about that a little bit more 00:51:23.679 --> 00:51:25.599 Commissioner Beck thank 00:51:25.599 --> 00:51:28.880 you chair so you mentioned a while ago that the single- 00:51:28.880 --> 00:51:30.320 family villa is what 00:51:30.320 --> 00:51:33.289 they want to increase to 1200 yes and yet the number of 00:51:33.289 --> 00:51:34.119 units is not going to 00:51:34.119 --> 00:51:38.469 change so that means some are going to decrease then yes we 00:51:38.469 --> 00:51:39.039 're looking at 00:51:39.039 --> 00:51:42.389 decreasing they haven't given us an indication on how they 00:51:42.389 --> 00:51:43.440 'll move forward 00:51:43.440 --> 00:51:49.849 with that okay Commissioner Hesbeth so just thinking out 00:51:49.849 --> 00:51:51.440 loud and and thank you 00:51:51.440 --> 00:51:54.739 chair and I'd like to get your insight from the building 00:51:54.739 --> 00:51:56.960 perspective so if I 00:51:56.960 --> 00:52:00.360 think out loud the areas is grown quite a bit right so when 00:52:00.360 --> 00:52:00.960 they get started 00:52:00.960 --> 00:52:04.730 you're probably getting the house in there 150 200 K now 00:52:04.730 --> 00:52:05.599 you're looking at 00:52:05.599 --> 00:52:09.750 400 K to get in there and so then you have an opportunity 00:52:09.750 --> 00:52:10.760 for if you go with 00:52:10.760 --> 00:52:13.760 the villa I'm assuming it's a little cheaper product so you 00:52:13.760 --> 00:52:14.519 can get in the 00:52:14.519 --> 00:52:17.449 neighborhood for less than 400 K and there's a high demand 00:52:17.449 --> 00:52:18.159 to get into the 00:52:18.159 --> 00:52:21.440 neighborhood I want to get in the neighborhood so I just 00:52:21.440 --> 00:52:22.199 got to go get 00:52:22.199 --> 00:52:28.239 older faster it's a great neighborhood but but that being 00:52:28.239 --> 00:52:31.039 said I think we're 00:52:31.039 --> 00:52:34.650 where I'd like your insight is so if you're keeping the 00:52:34.650 --> 00:52:35.800 number if you have 00:52:35.800 --> 00:52:39.030 this running tally you have to manage that new growth right 00:52:39.030 --> 00:52:40.039 and manage those 00:52:40.039 --> 00:52:44.309 people that are coming in and it's a great at a value you 00:52:44.309 --> 00:52:45.960 know but then that 00:52:45.960 --> 00:52:48.210 leaves you a whole bunch of open space and then there's 00:52:48.210 --> 00:52:49.280 materials so you want 00:52:49.280 --> 00:52:52.360 to build like houses next to each other I'm assuming for 00:52:52.360 --> 00:52:53.679 simplicity of you know 00:52:53.679 --> 00:52:58.050 construction and you got to manage the running tally you 00:52:58.050 --> 00:52:59.039 end up with a big 00:52:59.039 --> 00:53:02.159 field at the end of it if you don't do it right you know so 00:53:02.159 --> 00:53:04.320 what my question is 00:53:04.320 --> 00:53:09.320 what is kind of what is the number when you're building to 00:53:09.320 --> 00:53:12.559 make it efficient's 00:53:12.559 --> 00:53:15.869 the wrong word but you know to make sense right if you if I 00:53:15.869 --> 00:53:16.880 have a town home 00:53:16.880 --> 00:53:21.519 and I have homes what number is it efficient to do just one 00:53:21.519 --> 00:53:22.239 of each next to 00:53:22.239 --> 00:53:26.519 each other or in a mass if I'm building them in mass and 00:53:26.519 --> 00:53:27.440 especially she's saying 00:53:27.440 --> 00:53:32.710 going you know 1200 so you mean you got to put them 00:53:32.710 --> 00:53:34.719 together I'm just curious if 00:53:34.719 --> 00:53:37.690 that won't take care of itself in the fact that the 00:53:37.690 --> 00:53:39.000 building and to keep it 00:53:39.000 --> 00:53:43.070 efficient we've got a cluster them to make it worthwhile 00:53:43.070 --> 00:53:44.519 and so that's why I 00:53:44.519 --> 00:53:47.059 just thinking out loud I don't know how that works if you 00:53:47.059 --> 00:53:48.519 're asking I wouldn't 00:53:48.519 --> 00:53:51.940 know how to how they would manage their business and how 00:53:51.940 --> 00:53:53.840 that would work mine 00:53:53.840 --> 00:53:57.170 just comes back to kind of fundamental concern it's it's 00:53:57.170 --> 00:53:58.639 almost like this is in 00:53:58.639 --> 00:54:01.329 opposition to where our Commission normally works we're 00:54:01.329 --> 00:54:02.440 always usually very 00:54:02.440 --> 00:54:06.199 concerned about what somebody can do on an individual piece 00:54:06.199 --> 00:54:07.480 of property and the 00:54:07.480 --> 00:54:10.869 request is to kind of the owner can do kind of whatever 00:54:10.869 --> 00:54:12.360 they want to do within 00:54:12.360 --> 00:54:16.889 these certain parameters they get to decide per se versus 00:54:16.889 --> 00:54:17.760 it's a very 00:54:17.760 --> 00:54:24.489 specific use and I'm just having a little trouble we're not 00:54:24.489 --> 00:54:25.239 trouble I just 00:54:25.239 --> 00:54:28.050 need a little more time to process that because that is 00:54:28.050 --> 00:54:29.400 very different than what 00:54:29.400 --> 00:54:33.590 we normally do and we see zoning cases and platting and 00:54:33.590 --> 00:54:35.000 those types of issues 00:54:35.000 --> 00:54:38.969 that come before our Commission did you have something else 00:54:38.969 --> 00:54:39.840 for I recognize 00:54:39.840 --> 00:54:47.300 Commissioner Solomon my concern is that they are actually 00:54:47.300 --> 00:54:47.679 marketed 00:54:47.679 --> 00:54:50.389 as what they call lock and leave they're designed for 00:54:50.389 --> 00:54:51.760 people who don't really live 00:54:51.760 --> 00:54:55.320 there full-time they may be snowbirds people of that nature 00:54:55.320 --> 00:54:56.199 and so when you 00:54:56.199 --> 00:54:59.690 start interspersing those people or transitioning those 00:54:59.690 --> 00:55:01.280 people into regular 00:55:01.280 --> 00:55:04.250 neighborhoods you're interrupting what the neighborhood is 00:55:04.250 --> 00:55:05.159 supposed to be about 00:55:05.159 --> 00:55:09.050 and that is being a neighborhood so that's my concern the 00:55:09.050 --> 00:55:10.679 other is that when 00:55:10.679 --> 00:55:13.789 you're talking about the fact that they have an HOA all 00:55:13.789 --> 00:55:15.880 that means is that they 00:55:15.880 --> 00:55:19.019 get billed a certain amount at their address they have 00:55:19.019 --> 00:55:20.639 somebody that is hired 00:55:20.639 --> 00:55:23.849 to come by and mow and take care of the yard they don't 00:55:23.849 --> 00:55:24.880 have to be in a cluster 00:55:24.880 --> 00:55:29.699 of 20 because they're in an HOA they just simply get billed 00:55:29.699 --> 00:55:30.840 differently and 00:55:30.840 --> 00:55:33.920 they have different maintenance crews that come by and so I 00:55:33.920 --> 00:55:36.079 'm afraid that when 00:55:36.079 --> 00:55:40.719 you're looking at being able to intersperse those duplexes 00:55:40.719 --> 00:55:41.400 is what I 00:55:41.400 --> 00:55:46.250 call them in and amongst regular neighborhood type setting 00:55:46.250 --> 00:55:47.719 is really 00:55:47.719 --> 00:55:51.920 taking away from what everybody has bought out there for 00:55:51.920 --> 00:55:54.639 and so I guess I'm 00:55:54.639 --> 00:55:57.530 concerned with what you're saying as far as why can't they 00:55:57.530 --> 00:55:58.400 go ahead and say 00:55:58.400 --> 00:56:03.639 here's the area where we want these lock and leaves to be 00:56:03.639 --> 00:56:05.199 so that people who buy 00:56:05.199 --> 00:56:08.530 the homes around it know that they're going to be people 00:56:08.530 --> 00:56:09.840 who aren't there all 00:56:09.840 --> 00:56:13.889 the time and because it could devalue the other people's 00:56:13.889 --> 00:56:15.639 properties if we now 00:56:15.639 --> 00:56:18.250 have a bunch of duplexes in a neighborhood that's 00:56:18.250 --> 00:56:19.400 surrounded by 00:56:19.400 --> 00:56:23.789 single-family homes and and they said the lock and leave to 00:56:23.789 --> 00:56:24.960 me as well and they 00:56:24.960 --> 00:56:27.960 also because I they had a neighborhood meeting and I went 00:56:27.960 --> 00:56:29.440 to that and and what 00:56:29.440 --> 00:56:33.539 they did talk about there was also another side to that is 00:56:33.539 --> 00:56:34.480 the aging in 00:56:34.480 --> 00:56:38.210 place and so we looked at that as well to allow somebody 00:56:38.210 --> 00:56:39.599 who doesn't want to 00:56:39.599 --> 00:56:42.760 maintain a yard anymore to move to those villas so they 00:56:42.760 --> 00:56:44.119 didn't have to have it 00:56:44.119 --> 00:56:48.900 out the maintenance so yeah I they said that same so I 00:56:48.900 --> 00:56:51.280 think they're probably 00:56:51.280 --> 00:56:53.969 those two types of people that would want to use this 00:56:53.969 --> 00:56:55.199 product so yeah I would 00:56:55.199 --> 00:57:00.480 agree with you yeah that I know we've asked you a lot of 00:57:00.480 --> 00:57:01.199 questions have you 00:57:01.199 --> 00:57:04.139 pretty well covered kind of the basics of what this is 00:57:04.139 --> 00:57:05.320 going to be because I 00:57:05.320 --> 00:57:07.650 think we're running out of time and I think one of the 00:57:07.650 --> 00:57:08.679 things is we may want 00:57:08.679 --> 00:57:13.559 to have this discussion in our sure in our public meeting 00:57:13.559 --> 00:57:14.480 rather than it's all 00:57:14.480 --> 00:57:16.300 right here and I know we're short on time is there 00:57:16.300 --> 00:57:17.400 something else that we've 00:57:17.400 --> 00:57:21.360 got on this before we break for food no you did receive the 00:57:21.360 --> 00:57:22.360 option or the 00:57:22.360 --> 00:57:25.440 responses the opposition in favorable letters and neutral 00:57:25.440 --> 00:57:26.360 letters so there 00:57:26.360 --> 00:57:33.820 were quite a few but yes yes well we had to cut it off at 00:57:33.820 --> 00:57:35.920 noon because we got 00:57:35.920 --> 00:57:43.440 them all day as of noon we had 13 in opposition 22 in favor 00:57:43.440 --> 00:57:45.599 8 neutral and 00:57:45.599 --> 00:57:48.800 those are the percentages so 00:57:57.000 --> 00:58:06.719 pretty evenly split okay thank you Julie yeah all right it 00:58:06.719 --> 00:58:08.639 is 6 o 3 and we're 00:58:08.639 --> 00:58:13.210 going to take a short recess and come back for our staff 00:58:13.210 --> 00:58:14.400 report on our 00:58:14.400 --> 00:58:18.440 notification procedure thank you 00:58:24.480 --> 00:58:29.250 going to reconvene our work session at 610 and I think our 00:58:29.250 --> 00:58:30.639 next item is going 00:58:30.639 --> 00:58:36.119 to be notifications yes we'll invite Cindy Jackson 00:58:54.480 --> 00:59:07.440 there maybe you can hear me better okay some of you may 00:59:07.440 --> 00:59:08.960 recall the work session 00:59:08.960 --> 00:59:15.789 presentation that was given to you back in April regarding 00:59:15.789 --> 00:59:17.559 the possible public 00:59:17.559 --> 00:59:23.789 hearing notification process improvements staff at that 00:59:23.789 --> 00:59:24.840 time kind of 00:59:24.840 --> 00:59:28.030 gave you a history of public notifications in the city when 00:59:28.030 --> 00:59:28.559 where we 00:59:28.559 --> 00:59:33.480 are now how we got there and took some feedback from the 00:59:33.480 --> 00:59:35.280 Commission regarding 00:59:35.280 --> 00:59:41.150 ideas on how to improve the the practice since that time we 00:59:41.150 --> 00:59:42.639 've taken into 00:59:42.639 --> 00:59:46.769 consideration the feedback we got as well as the research 00:59:46.769 --> 00:59:47.760 we did on best 00:59:47.760 --> 00:59:55.219 practices for public notification it's not like the 00:59:55.219 --> 01:00:01.800 keyboards in the way okay 01:00:01.800 --> 01:00:06.920 just to give you a brief refresher on the requirements our 01:00:06.920 --> 01:00:08.239 public notice 01:00:08.239 --> 01:00:11.079 notifications for public hearings is based on the 01:00:11.079 --> 01:00:12.760 requirement in Texas local 01:00:12.760 --> 01:00:18.960 government code section 211 - 007 requires published notice 01:00:18.960 --> 01:00:19.920 of the hearing 01:00:19.920 --> 01:00:23.269 in the official newspaper in our case the Denton record 01:00:23.269 --> 01:00:24.679 Chronicle before the 01:00:24.679 --> 01:00:27.679 15th day before the date of the hearing and written notice 01:00:27.679 --> 01:00:28.400 is sent out to 01:00:28.400 --> 01:00:32.489 property owners located within 200 feet of the subject site 01:00:32.489 --> 01:00:33.840 before the tenth day 01:00:33.840 --> 01:00:38.760 of the hearing these are sent required to be sent via 01:00:38.760 --> 01:00:43.039 regular mail the practices 01:00:43.039 --> 01:00:47.429 that we've been following are based on ordinance number 99 01:00:47.429 --> 01:00:49.440 - 029 since the 01:00:49.440 --> 01:00:53.610 presentation was made to you in April we have learned that 01:00:53.610 --> 01:00:55.280 the code on which we 01:00:55.280 --> 01:00:58.420 base our notification practices was actually repealed in 01:00:58.420 --> 01:00:59.699 2002 with the 01:00:59.699 --> 01:01:05.320 approval of the Denton Development Code the 2002 code 01:01:05.320 --> 01:01:06.679 requires the city to 01:01:06.679 --> 01:01:10.380 comply with Texas with Texas local government code 211 01:01:10.380 --> 01:01:11.159 which I just 01:01:11.159 --> 01:01:14.769 explained to you with the previous slide I'm going to tell 01:01:14.769 --> 01:01:15.760 you about a little bit 01:01:15.760 --> 01:01:19.639 about the differences between the two the repealed 01:01:19.639 --> 01:01:22.440 ordinance 99 - 029 requires 01:01:22.440 --> 01:01:24.989 public notice of the scheduled public hearing in the 01:01:24.989 --> 01:01:26.059 newspaper of record 01:01:26.059 --> 01:01:30.280 Denton record Chronicle it requires a legal notice of the 01:01:30.280 --> 01:01:32.000 public hearing be 01:01:32.000 --> 01:01:35.090 sent to property owners located within 200 feet of the site 01:01:35.090 --> 01:01:36.199 via certified mail 01:01:36.199 --> 01:01:41.260 not regular mail as required by the Texas local government 01:01:41.260 --> 01:01:43.800 code and it has 01:01:43.800 --> 01:01:47.820 these additional requirements a courtesy notice sent to the 01:01:47.820 --> 01:01:48.599 other scheduled 01:01:48.599 --> 01:01:52.639 meeting sent to all residents who are living within 500 01:01:52.639 --> 01:01:54.000 feet of the subject 01:01:54.000 --> 01:01:58.300 site sent via regular mail and a posted notice in the form 01:01:58.300 --> 01:01:59.719 of a sign posted 01:01:59.719 --> 01:02:05.139 actually on the subject property giving notice of the 01:02:05.139 --> 01:02:06.760 public hearing 01:02:15.239 --> 01:02:19.519 that's for the 200 foot notice the 500 foot notice goes to 01:02:19.519 --> 01:02:20.719 the residents 01:02:20.719 --> 01:02:31.159 located within the area some issues that we have with the 01:02:31.159 --> 01:02:33.920 current notification 01:02:33.920 --> 01:02:37.000 process are actually the same issues which brought about 01:02:37.000 --> 01:02:38.039 the requirement for 01:02:38.039 --> 01:02:42.199 the certified mail number one the property owners aren't 01:02:42.199 --> 01:02:43.159 picking up their 01:02:43.159 --> 01:02:48.349 certified notices at the post office we receive probably at 01:02:48.349 --> 01:02:50.039 least 50 percent 01:02:50.039 --> 01:02:53.510 wouldn't you say of the notices that we send out via 01:02:53.510 --> 01:02:55.480 certified mail back labeled 01:02:55.480 --> 01:03:00.769 not picked up property owners that do pick them up at the 01:03:00.769 --> 01:03:02.159 post office are kind 01:03:02.159 --> 01:03:05.239 of angry by the fact that they have to drive to the post 01:03:05.239 --> 01:03:06.480 office to get their 01:03:06.480 --> 01:03:10.130 notice and they have called staff and made their feelings 01:03:10.130 --> 01:03:12.280 known about this the 01:03:12.280 --> 01:03:16.159 excessive cost of certified mailings for larger 01:03:16.159 --> 01:03:18.440 notification areas for cases 01:03:18.440 --> 01:03:21.599 that for example take place in a residential neighborhood 01:03:21.599 --> 01:03:22.519 where you've got 01:03:22.519 --> 01:03:25.599 a lot of small lots that are surrounding the site or in the 01:03:25.599 --> 01:03:26.559 case of ropes and 01:03:26.559 --> 01:03:33.199 ranch they had to notify the entire PD area that in the 01:03:33.199 --> 01:03:35.239 past fiscal year the 01:03:35.239 --> 01:03:38.849 cost of mailing the certified notices this is now as of 01:03:38.849 --> 01:03:40.820 August 31st has has 01:03:40.820 --> 01:03:43.659 cost thirty four thousand six hundred and sixty nine 01:03:43.659 --> 01:03:45.159 dollars and we're 01:03:45.159 --> 01:03:48.059 expecting to that to go up by approximately twenty thousand 01:03:48.059 --> 01:03:49.000 dollars when 01:03:49.000 --> 01:03:54.480 we add in September because of that ropes and ranch mailing 01:03:54.480 --> 01:03:57.239 the differences 01:03:57.239 --> 01:04:01.159 between the cost of a certified letter versus the cost of a 01:04:01.159 --> 01:04:02.480 regularly posted 01:04:02.480 --> 01:04:06.949 letter using our mail service is is significant the 01:04:06.949 --> 01:04:08.440 certified mail cost five 01:04:08.440 --> 01:04:12.800 seventy seven per piece and the to send the same notice via 01:04:12.800 --> 01:04:14.719 regular mail is two 01:04:14.719 --> 01:04:23.000 forty two per piece now after perceiving there was an issue 01:04:23.000 --> 01:04:24.280 staff went ahead and 01:04:24.280 --> 01:04:29.400 did some research into surrounding areas 01:04:30.000 --> 01:04:37.079 thank you chair how much for regular mail to 242 okay isn't 01:04:37.079 --> 01:04:37.960 it just a like a 01:04:37.960 --> 01:04:43.940 one or two sheet thing that's going out to its two sheets 01:04:43.940 --> 01:04:45.719 color and it's okay 01:04:45.719 --> 01:04:48.159 okay you're talking about the whole problem we're not 01:04:48.159 --> 01:04:48.480 talking about just the 01:04:48.480 --> 01:04:57.760 mailing anyway we went ahead and we we we surveyed 01:04:57.760 --> 01:04:59.079 surrounding cities to see 01:04:59.079 --> 01:05:02.050 what their their practices are to try to determine what 01:05:02.050 --> 01:05:03.840 best practices are I've 01:05:03.840 --> 01:05:07.909 got the table here is also in an exhibit in your staff 01:05:07.909 --> 01:05:10.760 report the to break it down 01:05:10.760 --> 01:05:13.460 into the simplest terms all of the city surveyed send out 01:05:13.460 --> 01:05:14.639 their public hearing 01:05:14.639 --> 01:05:19.110 notices via regular mail not certified mail two cities Fort 01:05:19.110 --> 01:05:20.079 Worth and Plano do 01:05:20.079 --> 01:05:24.849 send out courtesy notices and all but one city which is 01:05:24.849 --> 01:05:26.960 Fort Worth requires the 01:05:26.960 --> 01:05:30.710 applicant to purchase post maintain and remove the sign 01:05:30.710 --> 01:05:32.300 that gets posted on the 01:05:32.300 --> 01:05:43.400 subject site the proposed revisions that we have worked out 01:05:43.400 --> 01:05:45.199 based on your 01:05:45.199 --> 01:05:49.030 comments and and the best practices are first of all per 01:05:49.030 --> 01:05:50.519 the requirements of 01:05:50.519 --> 01:05:54.119 section 211 07 of the Texas local government code we're 01:05:54.119 --> 01:05:55.159 proposing to mail 01:05:55.159 --> 01:05:58.860 out the notices the 200 foot notices via regular mail and 01:05:58.860 --> 01:06:00.039 not certified mail I 01:06:00.039 --> 01:06:03.530 understand that some commissioners were concerned about 01:06:03.530 --> 01:06:05.000 keeping track of which 01:06:05.000 --> 01:06:09.349 ones were we were returned and that's a very easy thing to 01:06:09.349 --> 01:06:10.480 do because we we 01:06:10.480 --> 01:06:17.570 receive any anything that that is not mailed incorrectly 01:06:17.570 --> 01:06:19.719 for instance they say 01:06:19.719 --> 01:06:26.909 is returned to return to sender or not at this address we 01:06:26.909 --> 01:06:28.079 get those back and 01:06:28.079 --> 01:06:33.340 we can keep track of which ones were returned the courtesy 01:06:33.340 --> 01:06:34.920 notices instead of 01:06:34.920 --> 01:06:40.369 sending regular letters out to the 500 foot radius what we 01:06:40.369 --> 01:06:41.280 're proposing is to 01:06:41.280 --> 01:06:45.599 send out postcards to these these people there would be 01:06:45.599 --> 01:06:46.840 regular four by six post 01:06:46.840 --> 01:06:52.239 cards and that way they can see more readily what the the 01:06:52.239 --> 01:06:54.199 postcard is for and 01:06:54.199 --> 01:06:59.150 and hopefully pay a bit more attention to it we did look 01:06:59.150 --> 01:07:01.519 into the suggestion to 01:07:01.519 --> 01:07:05.079 have it printed on the envelope public hearing notice for 01:07:05.079 --> 01:07:06.559 the the 200 foot 01:07:06.559 --> 01:07:11.940 notices however at this time our mailing service is not 01:07:11.940 --> 01:07:16.440 able to do that another 01:07:16.440 --> 01:07:21.639 revision that we're proposing is to enlarge the minimum 01:07:21.639 --> 01:07:24.039 sign to size to four 01:07:24.039 --> 01:07:27.119 by four current dimensions of the signs that are posted are 01:07:27.119 --> 01:07:28.920 two by three and our 01:07:28.920 --> 01:07:32.090 research we saw all but one city actually uses the four by 01:07:32.090 --> 01:07:33.000 four signs and 01:07:33.000 --> 01:07:36.789 the one city that doesn't is Lewisville and their sign is 01:07:36.789 --> 01:07:38.920 three by four will be 01:07:38.920 --> 01:07:42.369 requiring the app as I noted that will be requiring the 01:07:42.369 --> 01:07:43.960 applicant to purchase 01:07:43.960 --> 01:07:47.760 post maintain and remove the notification sign from the 01:07:47.760 --> 01:07:49.400 site they will 01:07:49.400 --> 01:07:53.179 have to sign an affidavit stating that the sign was 01:07:53.179 --> 01:07:55.199 actually posted on the site 01:07:55.199 --> 01:07:58.070 by a certain date and then they will have to sign an affid 01:07:58.070 --> 01:07:59.079 avit stating the 01:07:59.079 --> 01:08:02.570 sign was removed within X number of days from the subject 01:08:02.570 --> 01:08:04.559 site after the public 01:08:04.559 --> 01:08:10.110 hearing we as I noted we can track the public notices and 01:08:10.110 --> 01:08:11.519 courtesy notices that 01:08:11.519 --> 01:08:15.480 are returned to the Sullivan excuse me what is the 01:08:15.480 --> 01:08:17.000 requirement for where the 01:08:17.000 --> 01:08:21.470 sign is placed versus the property that's being in question 01:08:21.470 --> 01:08:22.439 it has to be 01:08:22.439 --> 01:08:26.020 placed on the property facing the street and right now we 01:08:26.020 --> 01:08:27.479 only place one sign on 01:08:27.479 --> 01:08:30.670 the property and we make sure it's visible and not obstruct 01:08:30.670 --> 01:08:32.199 ed by any foliage 01:08:32.199 --> 01:08:36.279 or trees things like that thank you 01:08:37.640 --> 01:08:41.520 did I hear another question okay and finally we are 01:08:41.520 --> 01:08:43.399 proposing to create a 01:08:43.399 --> 01:08:46.430 link on the planning division web page which will be 01:08:46.430 --> 01:08:47.720 dedicated to public 01:08:47.720 --> 01:08:51.369 hearing notices so it will be easier for the public to find 01:08:51.369 --> 01:08:52.760 these notices on our 01:08:52.760 --> 01:08:59.199 website that concludes my presentation and I'll stand for 01:08:59.199 --> 01:08:59.800 any questions 01:08:59.800 --> 01:09:03.710 Commissioner back thank you chair I like the 01:09:03.710 --> 01:09:05.000 recommendations I think these are 01:09:05.000 --> 01:09:08.920 the good changes a couple questions here on your 01:09:08.920 --> 01:09:10.760 recommendations you say you'll 01:09:10.760 --> 01:09:17.159 track public notices and courtesy notices if they don't get 01:09:17.159 --> 01:09:17.560 mailed up 01:09:17.560 --> 01:09:23.399 come back to you are we putting like a self-addressed stamp 01:09:23.399 --> 01:09:24.239 envelope in there 01:09:24.239 --> 01:09:27.880 form to send that back to us where are you talking about 01:09:27.880 --> 01:09:31.079 for if they send it 01:09:31.079 --> 01:09:34.300 right send it well that's that's something that hasn't been 01:09:34.300 --> 01:09:34.920 discussed but 01:09:34.920 --> 01:09:37.239 that's something we can discuss okay because yeah I've got 01:09:37.239 --> 01:09:37.960 to go through the 01:09:37.960 --> 01:09:40.789 bubble and buy a stamp actually that we would do that 01:09:40.789 --> 01:09:42.359 courtesy for more likely 01:09:42.359 --> 01:09:47.800 get something back so consider that if you will and the 01:09:47.800 --> 01:09:48.640 create a link on the 01:09:48.640 --> 01:09:51.199 planning division web page I like that idea and I was just 01:09:51.199 --> 01:09:52.520 curious and maybe 01:09:52.520 --> 01:09:55.210 this isn't something we can discuss now can we do this for 01:09:55.210 --> 01:09:56.039 all City Council 01:09:56.039 --> 01:09:59.619 Board and Commission meetings where it gives anybody who's 01:09:59.619 --> 01:10:00.960 interested in following 01:10:00.960 --> 01:10:03.880 what's going on in city the city government they go on and 01:10:03.880 --> 01:10:04.479 sign on on 01:10:04.479 --> 01:10:08.810 line they get to select which the City Council and then 01:10:08.810 --> 01:10:10.000 which Commission's 01:10:10.000 --> 01:10:14.270 sign up for it and then when those meetings are held we 01:10:14.270 --> 01:10:15.720 send notices out to 01:10:15.720 --> 01:10:20.920 them online is that something well well that's something 01:10:20.920 --> 01:10:21.479 that we have is that 01:10:21.479 --> 01:10:25.800 beyond our scope right here I think I think it might be 01:10:25.800 --> 01:10:26.680 right now we are 01:10:26.680 --> 01:10:30.699 required by the local government code to send out the 01:10:30.699 --> 01:10:33.279 notices via the certified 01:10:33.279 --> 01:10:39.159 tax rule and if we do that way we don't have a way to track 01:10:39.159 --> 01:10:40.720 in Cindy I just want 01:10:40.720 --> 01:10:43.840 to interject any substantial changes that we do to the 01:10:43.840 --> 01:10:45.119 notification process is 01:10:45.119 --> 01:10:48.800 going to require City Council yes right so these the Cindy 01:10:48.800 --> 01:10:49.920 's outlined are just 01:10:49.920 --> 01:10:54.189 sort of procedural items but anything else would likely 01:10:54.189 --> 01:10:55.640 need a City Council 01:10:55.640 --> 01:10:59.670 action so we're gonna today we're gonna essentially decide 01:10:59.670 --> 01:11:01.000 what we like and send 01:11:01.000 --> 01:11:05.399 it on to the City Council we're just here now 01:11:08.600 --> 01:11:11.319 a recommendation to City Council as to whether or not you 01:11:11.319 --> 01:11:13.199 think that this is 01:11:13.199 --> 01:11:18.199 viable okay okay then one last thing on the cost for signs 01:11:18.199 --> 01:11:19.000 in the proposed 01:11:19.000 --> 01:11:23.279 practice there's a $75 charge there but if the applicant is 01:11:23.279 --> 01:11:25.039 responsible for that 01:11:25.039 --> 01:11:29.039 how is that figure how does that $75 right now that's going 01:11:29.039 --> 01:11:29.680 to be rolled into 01:11:29.680 --> 01:11:33.010 it that's going to be part of the $220 notification fee 01:11:33.010 --> 01:11:34.000 that we already charge 01:11:34.000 --> 01:11:39.560 so in the 220s will be as it stands right now the $220 01:11:39.560 --> 01:11:43.050 notification fee will also cover the cost of the sign but 01:11:43.050 --> 01:11:44.439 that's not a cost 01:11:44.439 --> 01:11:47.600 to the city is it if the applicant has to put the sign up 01:11:47.600 --> 01:11:48.760 themselves it's an 01:11:48.760 --> 01:11:52.239 act applicant puts the sign up himself that just means we 01:11:52.239 --> 01:11:53.239 don't use staff time 01:11:53.239 --> 01:11:57.189 to put the sign up that's what I'm trying to figure the $75 01:11:57.189 --> 01:11:58.640 charge here I'm 01:11:58.640 --> 01:12:03.829 trying to figure okay I'm on exhibit four okay and we're 01:12:03.829 --> 01:12:04.560 looking at current 01:12:04.560 --> 01:12:08.909 practice and proposed practice on the proposed practice or 01:12:08.909 --> 01:12:09.960 current practice 01:12:09.960 --> 01:12:13.850 cities putting up the sign proposed practice the we're 01:12:13.850 --> 01:12:14.840 saying that the 01:12:14.840 --> 01:12:17.189 applicant has to put their own sign up perhaps you can 01:12:17.189 --> 01:12:18.239 answer that question 01:12:18.239 --> 01:12:25.159 right I think you are correct Commissioner Beck that the 01:12:25.159 --> 01:12:25.880 applicant 01:12:25.880 --> 01:12:28.600 we're responsible for that and so that cost would be on the 01:12:28.600 --> 01:12:29.560 applicant okay so 01:12:29.560 --> 01:12:33.720 that's not be part of so that $232 total then we just 01:12:33.720 --> 01:12:35.840 subtract 75 correct that 01:12:35.840 --> 01:12:38.649 would be that would be just a now just an example of what 01:12:38.649 --> 01:12:40.079 that would be okay so 01:12:40.079 --> 01:12:43.079 we're even cheaper going forward again right that's a 01:12:43.079 --> 01:12:44.319 dependent on the 01:12:44.319 --> 01:12:46.680 assumptions that we had there you know it could be more it 01:12:46.680 --> 01:12:47.479 could be less but 01:12:47.479 --> 01:12:50.680 overall the applicant will be responsible for signs for 01:12:50.680 --> 01:12:51.159 general 01:12:51.159 --> 01:12:57.960 okay Commissioner Roselle thank you I've actually 01:12:57.960 --> 01:13:01.079 Mr. Beck led right into some of my line of thinking 01:13:01.079 --> 01:13:04.600 thinking I'm trying to 01:13:04.600 --> 01:13:07.560 understand the efficiency of them putting up a sign versus 01:13:07.560 --> 01:13:08.239 city put up a 01:13:08.239 --> 01:13:11.649 sign currently if I understand it's correctly the city has 01:13:11.649 --> 01:13:12.439 a standard 01:13:12.439 --> 01:13:16.000 template sign that staff goes out and puts on the property 01:13:16.000 --> 01:13:17.039 after hearing staff 01:13:17.039 --> 01:13:22.060 goes and takes it back is that correct and the new proposed 01:13:22.060 --> 01:13:23.159 is they create 01:13:23.159 --> 01:13:26.239 their own sign is there a template they based off of well 01:13:26.239 --> 01:13:27.880 again we haven't come 01:13:27.880 --> 01:13:30.569 to the point net yet where we're going to just we don't 01:13:30.569 --> 01:13:31.399 know we decide if 01:13:31.399 --> 01:13:34.609 they're going to make their go to a sign company the signs 01:13:34.609 --> 01:13:36.159 that the the cities 01:13:36.159 --> 01:13:40.569 that I surveyed they all had it had a form a template form 01:13:40.569 --> 01:13:42.079 for the applicant 01:13:42.079 --> 01:13:44.819 that the applicant would then take to certain sign 01:13:44.819 --> 01:13:46.479 companies that the city had 01:13:46.479 --> 01:13:50.079 made arrangements with to make this sign for a certain cost 01:13:50.079 --> 01:13:51.760 and they would have 01:13:51.760 --> 01:13:55.250 it made at this point we haven't got that far so we assume 01:13:55.250 --> 01:13:56.279 that if other 01:13:56.279 --> 01:13:59.630 cities do it's for this situation they go out they get a 01:13:59.630 --> 01:14:01.039 sign made they go put 01:14:01.039 --> 01:14:03.920 in the property they come to city to sign an affidavit 01:14:03.920 --> 01:14:05.119 saying they've done 01:14:05.119 --> 01:14:09.180 that and then after the hearing they then have to come back 01:14:09.180 --> 01:14:09.720 and sign an 01:14:09.720 --> 01:14:14.710 affidavit that the sign that's been removed exactly I guess 01:14:14.710 --> 01:14:15.600 it goes back to 01:14:15.600 --> 01:14:20.789 the efficiency if the Steve didn't has a an understanding 01:14:20.789 --> 01:14:22.199 with a sign company is 01:14:22.199 --> 01:14:25.420 it maybe more efficient for the city just calling that sign 01:14:25.420 --> 01:14:26.359 company here's 01:14:26.359 --> 01:14:29.119 the details go put the sign and put it in because I'm just 01:14:29.119 --> 01:14:29.640 wondering how many 01:14:29.640 --> 01:14:32.260 times are we tracking down an applicant to get the affidav 01:14:32.260 --> 01:14:34.079 it signed when the 01:14:34.079 --> 01:14:36.399 city could just put it up knew exactly where it was had 01:14:36.399 --> 01:14:37.680 control over that and 01:14:37.680 --> 01:14:42.880 then brought it back down you bring up a good point and 01:14:42.880 --> 01:14:44.399 looking at other cities 01:14:44.399 --> 01:14:48.420 that practice has been something that we were reviewing and 01:14:48.420 --> 01:14:49.760 that's one reason why 01:14:49.760 --> 01:14:53.300 we made that recommendation we myself included aren't 01:14:53.300 --> 01:14:54.640 really purview to if 01:14:54.640 --> 01:14:58.239 those affidavits have to be you know brought in or if they 01:14:58.239 --> 01:14:59.279 were just to be 01:14:59.279 --> 01:15:02.600 mailed in or you know photos it'd be a little bit a little 01:15:02.600 --> 01:15:03.880 bit easier process 01:15:03.880 --> 01:15:07.239 again other cities have done it we can certainly follow up 01:15:07.239 --> 01:15:08.239 with them and see 01:15:08.239 --> 01:15:12.859 how if it's been more efficient for them versus posting it 01:15:12.859 --> 01:15:13.760 themselves 01:15:13.760 --> 01:15:17.250 yeah I guess my initial thought on this is if it's not a 01:15:17.250 --> 01:15:19.359 massive change or Delta 01:15:19.359 --> 01:15:23.960 inefficiency then the city still having control over it 01:15:23.960 --> 01:15:25.279 seems to be a better 01:15:25.279 --> 01:15:27.369 option that we know the exact signs to be placed we can put 01:15:27.369 --> 01:15:28.279 it where we want we 01:15:28.279 --> 01:15:31.960 get it put it up where we need to be instead of hoping that 01:15:31.960 --> 01:15:32.880 they're not 01:15:32.880 --> 01:15:34.510 finding a loophole of where to place it oddly on the 01:15:34.510 --> 01:15:35.439 property or anything like 01:15:35.439 --> 01:15:38.289 that so those are my initial thoughts thank you that's a 01:15:38.289 --> 01:15:38.840 good point 01:15:38.840 --> 01:15:44.119 Commissioner Tyler thank you chair I had a couple of 01:15:44.119 --> 01:15:45.199 questions regarding cost I 01:15:45.199 --> 01:15:48.689 don't know who would be more appropriate to answer and and 01:15:48.689 --> 01:15:51.399 also the sign so in 01:15:51.399 --> 01:15:56.119 this example so is the notification fee charged to the 01:15:56.119 --> 01:15:58.560 applicant yes when they 01:15:58.560 --> 01:16:01.289 submit an application that requires a public hearing an 01:16:01.289 --> 01:16:03.119 automatic $220 is 01:16:03.119 --> 01:16:07.399 assessed as part of their review fee just $220 period 01:16:07.399 --> 01:16:08.920 correct so we don't know 01:16:08.920 --> 01:16:12.350 how much it's gonna cost in the end but that's that's the 01:16:12.350 --> 01:16:13.319 bond that's the 01:16:13.319 --> 01:16:16.970 maximum minimum that we we charge applicants so in the 01:16:16.970 --> 01:16:18.720 example of the the 01:16:18.720 --> 01:16:24.039 recent Robson ranch change you probably sent 2,000 01:16:24.039 --> 01:16:26.920 certified letters 1600 I saw 01:16:26.920 --> 01:16:32.539 yeah 1600 letters and you charge $220 to do that correct 01:16:32.539 --> 01:16:34.159 okay so I was under the 01:16:34.159 --> 01:16:36.659 impression that the mailing fees were actually billed back 01:16:36.659 --> 01:16:37.359 to the app I see 01:16:37.359 --> 01:16:44.520 maybe maybe we actually pay for that mailing for Robson 01:16:44.520 --> 01:16:45.279 because of the large 01:16:45.279 --> 01:16:47.819 amounts I stand corrected because of that large amount we 01:16:47.819 --> 01:16:48.680 asked the applicant 01:16:48.680 --> 01:16:50.890 pay for that but that was like that was almost like a 01:16:50.890 --> 01:16:52.279 courtesy could you write 01:16:52.279 --> 01:16:55.859 versus yeah there could have been yeah but otherwise if if 01:16:55.859 --> 01:16:56.880 it the cost for a 01:16:56.880 --> 01:17:02.560 mailing did exceed exceed 220 the city would only pay the 01:17:02.560 --> 01:17:03.640 rest of that and so 01:17:03.640 --> 01:17:08.520 and in the proposed method they'll still pay the 220 and 01:17:08.520 --> 01:17:09.560 then they'll the 01:17:09.560 --> 01:17:11.880 applicant will also be responsible for a sign or look at 01:17:11.880 --> 01:17:13.039 like a $75 credit for 01:17:13.039 --> 01:17:17.689 the sign I'm trying to understand the sign if if we were to 01:17:17.689 --> 01:17:18.880 have the applicant 01:17:18.880 --> 01:17:21.850 do do it they know there would be there would be no credit 01:17:21.850 --> 01:17:23.159 in that example they 01:17:23.159 --> 01:17:26.550 would still be responsible for the the sign posting and 01:17:26.550 --> 01:17:27.920 cost and all that if 01:17:27.920 --> 01:17:31.840 the fee was to be over 220 of course we'd still be 01:17:31.840 --> 01:17:33.760 responsible for the rest 01:17:33.760 --> 01:17:38.119 if it was less than that 220 would still would be within 01:17:38.119 --> 01:17:39.560 our budget so I do I 01:17:39.560 --> 01:17:43.310 think in general the proposals sound good I like getting 01:17:43.310 --> 01:17:44.359 rid of the certified 01:17:44.359 --> 01:17:48.229 mail it's it's maybe nice to a nice thought to have a 01:17:48.229 --> 01:17:49.840 signature but it does 01:17:49.840 --> 01:17:52.659 make it a lot harder to pick up your mail people people won 01:17:52.659 --> 01:17:53.479 't receive the 01:17:53.479 --> 01:17:56.359 messages in time you know a lot of them get returned so 01:17:56.359 --> 01:17:57.640 forth and so on cuts the 01:17:57.640 --> 01:18:03.319 cost in half sure her mailing the the sign our current sign 01:18:03.319 --> 01:18:04.960 posting is not 01:18:04.960 --> 01:18:08.470 very effective it's a little poster board sized piece of 01:18:08.470 --> 01:18:09.039 plastic with a 01:18:09.039 --> 01:18:12.250 sharpie right like it's a you know a couple of lines and 01:18:12.250 --> 01:18:13.199 written in in 01:18:13.199 --> 01:18:17.550 sharpie what the case is and you know I've been in a lot of 01:18:17.550 --> 01:18:18.640 cities where the 01:18:18.640 --> 01:18:22.199 developers are required to post signs and a lot of times 01:18:22.199 --> 01:18:23.199 they're big they're 01:18:23.199 --> 01:18:26.079 like eight by eight right manager and they have a lot of 01:18:26.079 --> 01:18:26.920 detail and usually 01:18:26.920 --> 01:18:29.850 they actually use it as an as an opportunity to kind of 01:18:29.850 --> 01:18:30.880 advertise their 01:18:30.880 --> 01:18:33.600 project and then they have a whole bunch of legalese 01:18:33.600 --> 01:18:34.600 meeting the legal 01:18:34.600 --> 01:18:37.739 requirements that's all forthright we looked at city of McK 01:18:37.739 --> 01:18:38.439 inney and they 01:18:38.439 --> 01:18:41.130 they actually as we see indicated to have a template of 01:18:41.130 --> 01:18:42.079 what needs to be there 01:18:42.079 --> 01:18:46.229 the size the the font size all that how it's how it's st 01:18:46.229 --> 01:18:48.159 aked and all that the 01:18:48.159 --> 01:18:51.829 one company I did call me that's where the $75 came up I 01:18:51.829 --> 01:18:52.840 asked them how much it 01:18:52.840 --> 01:18:55.640 would cost for that sign and I don't know if it included 01:18:55.640 --> 01:18:56.840 the stake itself but 01:18:56.840 --> 01:19:01.000 they quoted $75 so that would be roughly what that would be 01:19:01.000 --> 01:19:01.319 for the 01:19:01.319 --> 01:19:04.020 applicant if they were to post something in our city and I 01:19:04.020 --> 01:19:04.840 think another version 01:19:04.840 --> 01:19:07.090 another reason why it might be beneficial to have the 01:19:07.090 --> 01:19:07.720 applicant in 01:19:07.720 --> 01:19:10.600 control of the sign is in a lot of cases it's a green field 01:19:10.600 --> 01:19:11.560 and it just that's 01:19:11.560 --> 01:19:14.119 put at the edge of the property with a little some legs and 01:19:14.119 --> 01:19:15.279 feet sometimes it's 01:19:15.279 --> 01:19:17.310 set in the ground sometimes it's attached to a construction 01:19:17.310 --> 01:19:18.000 fence attached 01:19:18.000 --> 01:19:20.689 to an existing building you know things like that I think 01:19:20.689 --> 01:19:21.560 there are a lot of 01:19:21.560 --> 01:19:26.159 different complexities where allowing the applicants to 01:19:26.159 --> 01:19:28.039 post put it how they 01:19:28.039 --> 01:19:30.760 want to do it as long as it does meet visibility 01:19:30.760 --> 01:19:32.479 requirements right and you 01:19:32.479 --> 01:19:34.789 know I think we do need to solve the problem of the small 01:19:34.789 --> 01:19:35.920 unreadable sign and 01:19:35.920 --> 01:19:39.199 that's the main goal is to have a better efficient 01:19:39.199 --> 01:19:41.199 effective notification process 01:19:41.199 --> 01:19:44.680 and larger signs I believe accomplished that and if we can 01:19:44.680 --> 01:19:46.000 get said applicant to 01:19:46.000 --> 01:19:49.039 do something to that effect I think would be better off and 01:19:49.039 --> 01:19:49.960 one one final 01:19:49.960 --> 01:19:54.609 comment the sign placement as I'm expecting you probably 01:19:54.609 --> 01:19:55.079 will have some 01:19:55.079 --> 01:19:57.550 rule every 400 feet of frontage or every 200 feet of front 01:19:57.550 --> 01:19:58.319 age or something like 01:19:58.319 --> 01:20:01.229 that we discussed that internally you know of a corner lot 01:20:01.229 --> 01:20:02.239 you know we would 01:20:02.239 --> 01:20:05.510 prefer it to be on both sides of the street if it's a large 01:20:05.510 --> 01:20:06.399 track of land 01:20:06.399 --> 01:20:09.880 maybe a linear distance you know separation so that you 01:20:09.880 --> 01:20:11.079 know we don't miss 01:20:11.079 --> 01:20:14.329 it and this would just be an administrative change since it 01:20:14.329 --> 01:20:14.760 isn't in 01:20:14.760 --> 01:20:17.359 ordinance right now correct but we would still need to move 01:20:17.359 --> 01:20:18.119 forward at the 01:20:18.119 --> 01:20:21.460 anything that would relate to cost we would have to bring 01:20:21.460 --> 01:20:22.920 forward as a an 01:20:22.920 --> 01:20:26.720 ordinance to update our fees but anything that's procedural 01:20:26.720 --> 01:20:27.359 we can we can 01:20:27.359 --> 01:20:32.149 propose and move that forward okay thank you Commissioner 01:20:32.149 --> 01:20:34.079 Sullivan yeah I 01:20:34.079 --> 01:20:38.359 received my letter on October 3rd and I noticed at the 01:20:38.359 --> 01:20:40.239 bottom here it says that 01:20:40.239 --> 01:20:43.920 the analysis would be posted by the end of the day on the 7 01:20:43.920 --> 01:20:44.920 th and the meeting 01:20:44.920 --> 01:20:48.970 was on the 12th so there's someone who just picked us out 01:20:48.970 --> 01:20:50.199 of the mail which by 01:20:50.199 --> 01:20:53.279 the way I'm within the 200 foot buffer and I didn't get a 01:20:53.279 --> 01:20:55.000 certified letter okay 01:20:55.000 --> 01:20:59.640 I know other neighbors got both certified and regular mail 01:20:59.640 --> 01:21:01.119 and nothing on 01:21:01.119 --> 01:21:05.149 here says please return this if you have an opinion and so 01:21:05.149 --> 01:21:06.960 I'm concerned that 01:21:06.960 --> 01:21:11.609 when you look at the you know the 48 or 56 notices that y' 01:21:11.609 --> 01:21:13.039 all received back how 01:21:13.039 --> 01:21:17.989 many people didn't know where to get the form I wasn't even 01:21:17.989 --> 01:21:18.720 told as a 01:21:18.720 --> 01:21:23.279 commissioner or as a taxpayer that the the public hearing 01:21:23.279 --> 01:21:24.760 was being made was 01:21:24.760 --> 01:21:28.960 being held until after the fact in fact I called Manal and 01:21:28.960 --> 01:21:29.960 she told me about it 01:21:29.960 --> 01:21:33.439 and so I'm concerned that when they're obviously the city 01:21:33.439 --> 01:21:34.760 knew that there was a 01:21:34.760 --> 01:21:38.000 meeting being held since somebody was in attendance I'm 01:21:38.000 --> 01:21:39.239 concerned that there isn't 01:21:39.239 --> 01:21:42.239 enough public notice of meetings that are being held in 01:21:42.239 --> 01:21:43.560 neighborhoods number 01:21:43.560 --> 01:21:46.590 one for the people who live there and number two for the 01:21:46.590 --> 01:21:47.960 commissioners who if 01:21:47.960 --> 01:21:51.109 we want to attend them should be able to be you know to go 01:21:51.109 --> 01:21:52.180 and attend those 01:21:52.180 --> 01:22:02.350 meetings that's you should have if you were within the 200 01:22:02.350 --> 01:22:04.159 foot buffer you 01:22:04.159 --> 01:22:08.899 would have received a certified mail you didn't that's what 01:22:08.899 --> 01:22:09.840 I'm saying 01:22:09.840 --> 01:22:19.479 that would be me I'm a do-it-yourself kind of guy right and 01:22:19.479 --> 01:22:21.760 then there is a 01:22:21.760 --> 01:22:24.710 note and it's very probably not as evident but it does say 01:22:24.710 --> 01:22:25.560 if you're within 01:22:25.560 --> 01:22:29.869 turn of foot you would also be receiving a certified letter 01:22:29.869 --> 01:22:30.359 in that 01:22:30.359 --> 01:22:34.220 certified letter there is the instructions in how you 01:22:34.220 --> 01:22:35.279 respond or one 01:22:35.279 --> 01:22:38.449 provide comments it doesn't say that on here it just says 01:22:38.449 --> 01:22:39.640 this I'm within 500 01:22:39.640 --> 01:22:42.550 feet when I'm looking at the map that's on here I'm 01:22:42.550 --> 01:22:44.000 actually within the 200 feet 01:22:44.000 --> 01:22:48.819 buffer yeah and so that's those are my first concerns that 01:22:48.819 --> 01:22:49.680 this is very 01:22:49.680 --> 01:22:54.579 pitiful actually the second is I need to bid I guess on the 01:22:54.579 --> 01:22:55.359 mailing system 01:22:55.359 --> 01:23:00.220 because to mail a 49 cent letter we're charged we're paying 01:23:00.220 --> 01:23:00.880 two dollars and 01:23:00.880 --> 01:23:04.140 forty two cents or two dollars and twenty seven cents there 01:23:04.140 --> 01:23:05.319 's not an intern 01:23:05.319 --> 01:23:09.300 or part-time person who could put those in an envelope and 01:23:09.300 --> 01:23:11.520 send them out we you 01:23:11.520 --> 01:23:15.029 know the unfortunately what we put the cost that's 01:23:15.029 --> 01:23:16.760 associated with that 242 is 01:23:16.760 --> 01:23:21.960 the actual processing of it printing it how she sees color 01:23:21.960 --> 01:23:24.800 stuffing and labeling 01:23:24.800 --> 01:23:27.489 all that stuff is part of that fear I need to be I need to 01:23:27.489 --> 01:23:28.199 bid on that job 01:23:28.199 --> 01:23:32.369 next time it comes up because I can do it for a dollar that 01:23:32.369 --> 01:23:33.640 seems outrageous to 01:23:33.640 --> 01:23:36.329 me Commissioner Sullivan you can you clarify you said that 01:23:36.329 --> 01:23:37.039 you received that 01:23:37.039 --> 01:23:42.479 that letter after the public hearing October 3rd the 01:23:42.479 --> 01:23:44.880 meeting was October 12 01:23:44.880 --> 01:23:49.300 I never knew well the meeting we having today I'm talking 01:23:49.300 --> 01:23:50.000 about the pub you know 01:23:50.000 --> 01:23:53.640 the meeting at ropes and ranch we yeah we don't control 01:23:53.640 --> 01:23:55.079 that understand okay but 01:23:55.079 --> 01:23:58.760 apparently who wasn't that attended the meeting somebody 01:23:58.760 --> 01:24:01.680 told us Julie how did 01:24:01.680 --> 01:24:07.649 you know about the meeting so isn't I mean is that 01:24:07.649 --> 01:24:09.960 something that we as 01:24:09.960 --> 01:24:12.840 commissioners should be involved in if you know for these 01:24:12.840 --> 01:24:13.880 meetings that you know 01:24:13.880 --> 01:24:17.720 if I want to go to the meeting on Fry Street or you know 01:24:17.720 --> 01:24:19.359 anything that's going 01:24:19.359 --> 01:24:22.600 on that it would help I think us have helped me to know 01:24:22.600 --> 01:24:23.920 what the mood of the 01:24:23.920 --> 01:24:28.050 people are who go to those meetings since you know when you 01:24:28.050 --> 01:24:28.880 read in the 01:24:28.880 --> 01:24:32.890 newspaper it's not always an accurate indication of what 01:24:32.890 --> 01:24:33.880 went on I'm gonna 01:24:33.880 --> 01:24:37.710 kick it to Shandrian on that question so I think I'll try 01:24:37.710 --> 01:24:38.960 to answer it the 01:24:38.960 --> 01:24:41.369 meeting that you're referring to is the neighborhood 01:24:41.369 --> 01:24:42.680 meeting that the applicant 01:24:42.680 --> 01:24:46.960 coordinates and does the notice for that's not actually a 01:24:46.960 --> 01:24:48.079 requirement we 01:24:48.079 --> 01:24:51.569 strongly encourage that to happen so we don't really manage 01:24:51.569 --> 01:24:52.520 that process or 01:24:52.520 --> 01:24:57.439 really have any control over it the city process that we 01:24:57.439 --> 01:24:58.520 are involved in right 01:24:58.520 --> 01:25:04.359 now we do have the control over that so we can do changes 01:25:04.359 --> 01:25:06.560 to that one well I'm 01:25:06.560 --> 01:25:09.770 just concerned that when y'all know about those things why 01:25:09.770 --> 01:25:11.279 not let us know 01:25:11.279 --> 01:25:14.930 about them so that if we want to go to the meetings again 01:25:14.930 --> 01:25:15.840 like I know there was 01:25:15.840 --> 01:25:19.029 a meeting on Fry Street according to the newspaper that was 01:25:19.029 --> 01:25:20.439 very negative well I 01:25:20.439 --> 01:25:22.649 don't know that that's just what was reported in the 01:25:22.649 --> 01:25:23.359 newspaper but I would 01:25:23.359 --> 01:25:27.449 like to attend so I get my own feeling for what goes on 01:25:27.449 --> 01:25:28.500 right and I think we 01:25:28.500 --> 01:25:31.380 have suggestions on how the applicant needs to notify the 01:25:31.380 --> 01:25:32.340 neighborhood but 01:25:32.340 --> 01:25:35.289 again because it's not a requirement for them to do so our 01:25:35.289 --> 01:25:36.800 hands are pretty much 01:25:36.800 --> 01:25:42.920 tied on that end but if you know about it why don't you let 01:25:42.920 --> 01:25:43.960 us know about is 01:25:43.960 --> 01:25:47.750 what I'm asking if y'all know that a meeting is happening 01:25:47.750 --> 01:25:49.800 why not let us know 01:25:49.800 --> 01:25:52.840 that a meeting is happening okay let us choose whether we 01:25:52.840 --> 01:25:54.199 desire to go or not 01:25:54.199 --> 01:25:57.500 that's all I'm asking that's that's Sharon and I can 01:25:57.500 --> 01:25:58.760 discuss that further 01:25:58.760 --> 01:26:02.079 with Manon that's something that we can incorporate if you 01:26:02.079 --> 01:26:03.520 do get you know is 01:26:03.520 --> 01:26:06.560 from a applicant to let the Commission know that's 01:26:06.560 --> 01:26:07.920 something that we can 01:26:07.920 --> 01:26:12.800 certainly be perfect do Commissioner else next thank you 01:26:12.800 --> 01:26:14.520 chair I just want to 01:26:14.520 --> 01:26:16.819 say I'm thrilled that we're having this discussion about 01:26:16.819 --> 01:26:17.439 improving the 01:26:17.439 --> 01:26:20.319 notification I know we're out of time clearly by all the 01:26:20.319 --> 01:26:21.479 discussion it needs 01:26:21.479 --> 01:26:24.699 further discussion and I would love to see this brought 01:26:24.699 --> 01:26:25.800 back to be further 01:26:25.800 --> 01:26:28.989 discussed so thank you for the work you've done I wish we 01:26:28.989 --> 01:26:29.760 had more time to 01:26:29.760 --> 01:26:32.210 talk about it because I do have other things to say but I 01:26:32.210 --> 01:26:33.119 know we're on time 01:26:33.119 --> 01:26:38.800 okay Commissioner back just real quickly so whenever an 01:26:38.800 --> 01:26:39.840 applicant has one of 01:26:39.840 --> 01:26:43.140 these town hall means or neighborhood meeting they are 01:26:43.140 --> 01:26:44.520 expected to notify the 01:26:44.520 --> 01:26:48.439 city is that correct is that part of the process we do have 01:26:48.439 --> 01:26:49.520 recommendations on 01:26:49.520 --> 01:26:53.789 how to notify the city but it's not because it's not a 01:26:53.789 --> 01:26:54.720 required meeting 01:26:54.720 --> 01:26:57.800 there's not you know specific steps that they have to 01:26:57.800 --> 01:26:59.159 follow okay so probably 01:26:59.159 --> 01:27:02.029 what we need to change is that process where they should 01:27:02.029 --> 01:27:03.560 notify the city so if 01:27:03.560 --> 01:27:05.859 we do any changes I suspect it would be that the 01:27:05.859 --> 01:27:07.199 neighborhood meeting is 01:27:07.199 --> 01:27:10.350 required and then we adopt rules for how that meet them 01:27:10.350 --> 01:27:11.479 even is carried out 01:27:11.479 --> 01:27:16.479 thank you Commissioner Hesbeth speed round I too would like 01:27:16.479 --> 01:27:17.359 to discuss more 01:27:17.359 --> 01:27:20.560 about it I'm out on the certification notice just because 01:27:20.560 --> 01:27:22.039 the postman doesn't 01:27:22.039 --> 01:27:24.069 pay attention to what you sign so you could just make a 01:27:24.069 --> 01:27:25.039 straight line and 01:27:25.039 --> 01:27:27.460 they're gonna take it and mail it back to you were paying 01:27:27.460 --> 01:27:30.079 for it I am out on 01:27:30.079 --> 01:27:34.149 requiring the the city the neighborhood meetings because 01:27:34.149 --> 01:27:35.600 that's a headache to 01:27:35.600 --> 01:27:39.479 manage and we have enough headaches and I think there's 01:27:39.479 --> 01:27:41.079 other ways to poll the 01:27:41.079 --> 01:27:46.439 neighborhood and the Robeson ranch thing there's something 01:27:46.439 --> 01:27:47.319 that jumped out at 01:27:47.319 --> 01:27:50.140 me but I can't remember so when it comes back around I'll 01:27:50.140 --> 01:27:52.279 have my notes ready so 01:27:52.279 --> 01:27:56.880 yeah that's a procedural question Commissioner Tyler thank 01:27:56.880 --> 01:27:58.880 you chair so 01:27:58.880 --> 01:28:00.460 I'm assuming that we want to move forward on this we've 01:28:00.460 --> 01:28:01.119 been working on it 01:28:01.119 --> 01:28:04.199 for most of the year would it be appropriate for us to 01:28:04.199 --> 01:28:04.720 continue our work 01:28:04.720 --> 01:28:07.470 session after our public hearing so that the next time we 01:28:07.470 --> 01:28:08.380 see this we can be 01:28:08.380 --> 01:28:17.359 voting on it I'll let staff comment on that voting on that 01:28:17.359 --> 01:28:18.199 is if it's an 01:28:18.199 --> 01:28:21.229 amendment to the DDC if we bring it forward just as an 01:28:21.229 --> 01:28:22.159 ordinance only 01:28:22.159 --> 01:28:25.250 council will see that I guess I guess my point is do we 01:28:25.250 --> 01:28:26.600 want to have another 01:28:26.600 --> 01:28:29.829 meeting in four weeks or do we want to just finish it like 01:28:29.829 --> 01:28:31.000 what would be more 01:28:31.000 --> 01:28:33.689 appropriate way to handle this to continue this 01:28:33.689 --> 01:28:35.119 conversation that we're 01:28:35.119 --> 01:28:37.329 having right now to continue it again this evening like we 01:28:37.329 --> 01:28:37.920 've done on some 01:28:37.920 --> 01:28:42.739 previous meetings rather than doing it at a date in the 01:28:42.739 --> 01:28:44.720 future okay I'm gonna 01:28:44.720 --> 01:28:48.670 let staff how much more do you have of your slides well 01:28:48.670 --> 01:28:50.840 that was it I was done 01:28:50.840 --> 01:28:55.000 it's more just discussion 01:28:55.640 --> 01:28:57.890 Commissioner Hesbeth has a question if you need to think 01:28:57.890 --> 01:29:00.279 about your yeah I mean 01:29:00.279 --> 01:29:04.600 you can it's not a legal question if you want to come back 01:29:04.600 --> 01:29:06.039 you can come back if I can if I 01:29:06.039 --> 01:29:09.319 can interject real quick I know that Commissioner Ellis had 01:29:09.319 --> 01:29:11.000 some comments if 01:29:11.000 --> 01:29:14.979 if it's something that Commission would like to do if you 01:29:14.979 --> 01:29:16.800 can email it to Cindy 01:29:16.800 --> 01:29:19.010 or I and then maybe we can research if there's something 01:29:19.010 --> 01:29:19.880 that I think there's 01:29:19.880 --> 01:29:22.279 some things that I know what we're gonna be looking into is 01:29:22.279 --> 01:29:23.199 the signposting how 01:29:23.199 --> 01:29:25.890 how the affidavit is working we can well that's one thing 01:29:25.890 --> 01:29:26.880 that we're gonna go 01:29:26.880 --> 01:29:29.960 back and research further if there's something that we can 01:29:29.960 --> 01:29:31.399 do during the 01:29:31.399 --> 01:29:34.479 next while we get ready for the next meeting we can 01:29:34.479 --> 01:29:36.119 certainly do that as well 01:29:36.119 --> 01:29:39.909 I think Commissioner Hesbeth is next yeah and I remembered 01:29:39.909 --> 01:29:40.920 so I agree with that 01:29:40.920 --> 01:29:44.359 that I can email thoughts you know to it and in to the two 01:29:44.359 --> 01:29:45.439 dollars you got a 01:29:45.439 --> 01:29:49.239 figure you have even if you mail in bulk you're at 30 cents 01:29:49.239 --> 01:29:51.399 or so per stamp so 01:29:51.399 --> 01:29:54.369 that only leaves you a buck and some change to stuff to 01:29:54.369 --> 01:29:55.479 body envelopes to 01:29:55.479 --> 01:29:59.710 print and color and it's it's it's it's it's high but it's 01:29:59.710 --> 01:30:01.319 not high if you think 01:30:01.319 --> 01:30:03.770 about it because you got to employ someone even when we're 01:30:03.770 --> 01:30:04.279 not mailing 01:30:04.279 --> 01:30:06.130 something out they have to sit there and be ready to mail 01:30:06.130 --> 01:30:07.119 something out they have 01:30:07.119 --> 01:30:09.640 to track something so when you say you didn't get your mail 01:30:09.640 --> 01:30:10.479 they can then go in 01:30:10.479 --> 01:30:13.170 their system their computer system they'll track it by mail 01:30:13.170 --> 01:30:14.079 but and someone's 01:30:14.079 --> 01:30:16.640 got to drive it to the post office they they can't get in 01:30:16.640 --> 01:30:17.720 the wreck if they get 01:30:17.720 --> 01:30:19.819 in the wreck you got to clean it up off the highway get it 01:30:19.819 --> 01:30:20.520 back to the post 01:30:20.520 --> 01:30:23.340 office you know I mean it just there's a lot that happens 01:30:23.340 --> 01:30:24.680 in life that you got a 01:30:24.680 --> 01:30:30.079 plan for that we don't think about what I think about but 01:30:30.079 --> 01:30:30.920 but I'm just saying 01:30:30.920 --> 01:30:34.720 there's it's not a great rate as far as naturally thinking 01:30:34.720 --> 01:30:36.680 but in practice it's 01:30:36.680 --> 01:30:41.640 a headache and and so that cost money. One question and we 01:30:41.640 --> 01:30:42.279 're gonna wrap it up 01:30:42.279 --> 01:30:44.119 Commissioner Rizzo. I don't have a question I was just 01:30:44.119 --> 01:30:44.920 saying because they 01:30:44.920 --> 01:30:47.170 saw things that I would like them to bring back I don't 01:30:47.170 --> 01:30:47.800 feel prepared to go 01:30:47.800 --> 01:30:50.960 forward with any sort of motion or forward momentum after 01:30:50.960 --> 01:30:53.840 tonight so my my 01:30:53.840 --> 01:30:56.050 hope would be they come back in a couple weeks and at that 01:30:56.050 --> 01:30:57.800 meeting we we create 01:30:57.800 --> 01:31:01.609 some action. And again just to clarify this is an item for 01:31:01.609 --> 01:31:02.760 action this is just 01:31:02.760 --> 01:31:06.199 an item for discussion. It's informational. Yes it's an 01:31:06.199 --> 01:31:06.760 informational 01:31:06.760 --> 01:31:10.760 meeting. Once we determine and have our internal meetings 01:31:10.760 --> 01:31:11.359 and get some 01:31:11.359 --> 01:31:14.630 feedback from you all then we will decide how we want to 01:31:14.630 --> 01:31:15.680 present it if we 01:31:15.680 --> 01:31:18.989 want to go forward with a DDC amendment you'll see it again 01:31:18.989 --> 01:31:20.199 here if we want to 01:31:20.199 --> 01:31:22.939 go forward with just an ordinance in front of council then 01:31:22.939 --> 01:31:23.760 you'll see it on 01:31:23.760 --> 01:31:29.930 video or in the audience if you come. Great discussion and 01:31:29.930 --> 01:31:31.399 presentation thank 01:31:31.399 --> 01:31:36.720 you very much. Thank you. At the conclusion of this item I 01:31:36.720 --> 01:31:37.640 'm going to 01:31:37.640 --> 01:31:42.359 conclude our work session at 644 and we'll reconvene as 01:31:42.359 --> 01:31:43.079 quick as we can 01:31:43.079 --> 01:31:45.960 because we are pretty late. 01:31:51.119 --> 01:31:53.510 Good evening and welcome to the City of Denton Planning and 01:31:53.510 --> 01:31:56.039 Zoning Commission 01:31:56.039 --> 01:32:00.069 meeting for October the 12th. This meeting was duly posted 01:32:00.069 --> 01:32:00.880 and we have a 01:32:00.880 --> 01:32:04.729 quorum present and I'm gonna call our meeting to order at 6 01:32:04.729 --> 01:32:06.640 48. Our first time of 01:32:06.640 --> 01:32:10.359 business tonight will be to stand and give the pledge to 01:32:10.359 --> 01:32:12.079 the US and Texas flag. 01:32:20.199 --> 01:32:25.079 For which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, 01:32:25.079 --> 01:32:28.199 with liberty and justice for all. 01:32:30.199 --> 01:32:35.130 On under Texas flag, I pledge allegiance to thee, Texas, 01:32:35.130 --> 01:32:40.199 one state, under God, one indivisible. 01:32:47.199 --> 01:32:52.649 As chair we're going to change our agenda order and we're 01:32:52.649 --> 01:32:53.600 going to need to 01:32:53.600 --> 01:32:57.350 move our item 4A up to our first item that we will consider 01:32:57.350 --> 01:32:58.199 and then we'll get 01:32:58.199 --> 01:33:01.739 back to our agenda and that's going to be under our 01:33:01.739 --> 01:33:03.600 individual consideration 01:33:03.600 --> 01:33:06.479 items it's going to be to consider and appoint a member of 01:33:06.479 --> 01:33:07.359 the P&Z Commission 01:33:07.359 --> 01:33:13.199 for a vice chair position. The chair would entertain motion 01:33:13.199 --> 01:33:16.199 . Commissioner back. 01:33:17.199 --> 01:33:24.239 I motion that we nominate Devin Taylor for vice chair. Okay 01:33:24.239 --> 01:33:25.279 . Commissioner 01:33:25.279 --> 01:33:29.310 Hudspeth. Second. Okay. I have a first and a second to nom 01:33:29.310 --> 01:33:30.520 inate Commissioner 01:33:30.520 --> 01:33:38.670 Taylor. Any discussion? Seeing none, I'll call for a vote 01:33:38.670 --> 01:33:41.000 on board. 01:33:44.000 --> 01:33:59.600 I think you said. Motion carries 7-0. Congratulations. Okay 01:33:59.600 --> 01:34:03.039 . Back to our agenda. 01:34:03.039 --> 01:34:08.840 We're going to item 2A which will be to consider our 01:34:08.840 --> 01:34:11.319 minutes. We'll need to take 01:34:11.319 --> 01:34:16.260 these in three separate motions. So first item will be our 01:34:16.260 --> 01:34:19.439 August 10th meeting. 01:34:19.439 --> 01:34:23.510 Commissioner Taylor. I move approval of the August 10th 01:34:23.510 --> 01:34:25.319 meeting minutes. Okay. 01:34:25.319 --> 01:34:29.850 Commissioner back. Okay. I have a first and a second. Any 01:34:29.850 --> 01:34:34.159 discussion? Seeing 01:34:34.159 --> 01:34:51.399 none, I'll call for a vote on the board. 01:35:05.159 --> 01:35:09.399 If you're waiting on me I was not. 01:35:34.199 --> 01:35:44.239 I'm gonna ask for clarification from staff. Yes. Okay. 01:35:44.239 --> 01:35:44.239 Do we even have four people that were here from the 10th? 01:35:44.239 --> 01:35:55.000 Well then we'll go 01:35:55.000 --> 01:35:55.000 ahead and pass it with three. Okay. Just out of imposs 01:35:55.000 --> 01:36:03.159 ibility. The three that were 01:36:03.159 --> 01:36:09.069 here are in favor so that's gonna pass. Three to zero. 01:36:09.069 --> 01:36:13.640 Generally our rules require four. 01:36:13.640 --> 01:36:17.920 The chair entertain a motion on the September 14th minutes. 01:36:17.920 --> 01:36:19.000 Commissioner back. 01:36:19.000 --> 01:36:23.569 I move we approve those minutes. Commissioner Ellis. I'll 01:36:23.569 --> 01:36:24.439 second that. 01:36:24.439 --> 01:36:30.760 We have a first and a second. Any discussion? Seeing none, 01:36:30.760 --> 01:36:31.600 I'll call for a 01:36:31.600 --> 01:36:34.399 vote on the board. 01:36:52.600 --> 01:36:58.909 Motion carries six zero. And chair look for a motion on 01:36:58.909 --> 01:37:02.640 September the 28th minutes. 01:37:03.800 --> 01:37:06.729 Commissioner Taylor. I move approval of the September 28th 01:37:06.729 --> 01:37:07.920 minutes. Okay. 01:37:07.920 --> 01:37:11.479 Commissioner Rozelle. I second. The first and the second. 01:37:11.479 --> 01:37:15.600 Any discussion? Seeing 01:37:15.600 --> 01:37:25.000 none, we'll call for a vote on the board. Motion carries 01:37:25.000 --> 01:37:28.199 seven zero. That will move 01:37:28.199 --> 01:37:31.800 us to our consent agenda. 01:37:34.880 --> 01:37:39.159 Commissioner Rozelle. I move to approve the consent agenda. 01:37:39.159 --> 01:37:40.279 Commissioner Beck. 01:37:40.279 --> 01:37:47.750 Second. Okay. Have a first and a second. Any discussion? 01:37:47.750 --> 01:37:48.760 Seeing none, I'll call 01:37:48.760 --> 01:37:51.600 for a vote on the board. 01:38:09.039 --> 01:38:16.680 Motion carries seven to zero. That will now move us to our 01:38:16.680 --> 01:38:18.520 items of individual 01:38:18.520 --> 01:38:23.210 consideration. We've already taken item 4A. So that will 01:38:23.210 --> 01:38:28.520 move us to item 4B. 01:38:29.079 --> 01:38:35.840 I will call on Mike Bell to begin that presentation for us. 01:38:39.079 --> 01:38:42.520 Thank you, Chair, members of the Commission. This is the 01:38:42.520 --> 01:38:46.319 project number SP 16-2. 01:38:46.319 --> 01:38:51.520 It's a site plan for Razor Ranch. The request is for a site 01:38:51.520 --> 01:38:52.359 plan for 01:38:52.359 --> 01:38:54.569 multifamily development. It's in the south mixed-use 01:38:54.569 --> 01:38:55.279 district of the Razor 01:38:55.279 --> 01:38:58.699 Ranch overlay district. The multifamily design guidelines 01:38:58.699 --> 01:38:59.800 were approved just 01:38:59.800 --> 01:39:03.510 yesterday at City Council, but every site plan application 01:39:03.510 --> 01:39:04.920 requires three parts 01:39:04.920 --> 01:39:04.920 for Razor Ranch. A site plan, a landscape plan, and 01:39:04.920 --> 01:39:07.720 elevation. So we'll go very 01:39:07.720 --> 01:39:14.449 quickly through those. The site is located here in yellow 01:39:14.449 --> 01:39:16.039 on the zoning map 01:39:16.039 --> 01:39:19.159 for Razor Ranch. You see it's up with this area. Heritage 01:39:19.159 --> 01:39:21.279 Trail forms the eastern 01:39:21.279 --> 01:39:25.460 boundary of the property. This is the site plan. I'll walk 01:39:25.460 --> 01:39:26.119 you through it very 01:39:26.119 --> 01:39:29.760 quickly. There are five buildings equaling 300 units, a 01:39:29.760 --> 01:39:31.960 number of accessory 01:39:31.960 --> 01:39:36.520 garages, and three amenities and open space areas, 01:39:36.520 --> 01:39:39.439 including a pool. This is a 01:39:39.439 --> 01:39:41.779 landscape plan. It complies with the landscape requirements 01:39:41.779 --> 01:39:42.359 for screening 01:39:42.359 --> 01:39:49.279 street trees and tree canopy coverage. And then to help 01:39:49.279 --> 01:39:50.840 orient you, based 01:39:50.840 --> 01:39:53.760 on the work session, I have pulled up the working site 01:39:53.760 --> 01:39:55.079 overall site plan for the 01:39:55.079 --> 01:39:58.880 south side of Razor Ranch. This area here, as I said, it's 01:39:58.880 --> 01:39:59.720 working, so it doesn't even 01:39:59.720 --> 01:40:04.000 reflect this site plan, but this is the property in 01:40:04.000 --> 01:40:06.439 question. So you can see 01:40:06.439 --> 01:40:11.939 there's the town center to the west, movie theater, 01:40:11.939 --> 01:40:14.439 convention center. To the 01:40:14.439 --> 01:40:18.479 north of the property is the Winko. To the east of Heritage 01:40:18.479 --> 01:40:19.359 Trail is a planned 01:40:19.359 --> 01:40:22.949 park, and obviously the various pad sites along 380. So I 01:40:22.949 --> 01:40:24.960 hope that helps with the 01:40:24.960 --> 01:40:28.840 questions from work session on how this is oriented. 01:40:29.720 --> 01:40:40.039 And then the elevations are also in your backup. I don't 01:40:40.039 --> 01:40:40.680 have them pulled up on 01:40:40.680 --> 01:40:42.539 this computer, but I'm happy to go through those if you 01:40:42.539 --> 01:40:43.399 have any questions on 01:40:43.399 --> 01:40:49.159 those. There are four criteria for approval, and the Razor 01:40:49.159 --> 01:40:50.119 Ranch overlay 01:40:50.119 --> 01:40:52.960 district, again outlined in your backup, staff has analyzed 01:40:52.960 --> 01:40:53.880 it and determined that 01:40:53.880 --> 01:40:56.670 they meet all those criteria, and therefore recommends 01:40:56.670 --> 01:40:58.079 approval. The 01:40:58.079 --> 01:40:59.460 applicant is here, and I believe they have a quick 01:40:59.460 --> 01:41:00.359 presentation they'd like to 01:41:00.359 --> 01:41:03.680 make as well. Commissioner Betten. Thank you, Chair. Quick 01:41:03.680 --> 01:41:06.199 question. Mike, we briefly 01:41:06.199 --> 01:41:09.319 discussed Heritage Trail. It was going to be six lanes, and 01:41:09.319 --> 01:41:10.399 there was like eight 01:41:10.399 --> 01:41:14.289 foot wide sidewalks, but nothing was mentioned about bike 01:41:14.289 --> 01:41:15.239 paths or anything. 01:41:15.239 --> 01:41:21.779 Are we putting bike paths along this route? That I'm not 01:41:21.779 --> 01:41:22.840 aware of. I'll look 01:41:22.840 --> 01:41:27.460 back at Earl and see if there's any. You'd like to speak on 01:41:27.460 --> 01:41:37.680 that? Good evening. 01:41:37.680 --> 01:41:41.750 Earl Esquire with Engineering. With regard to Heritage 01:41:41.750 --> 01:41:41.800 Trail, Heritage 01:41:41.800 --> 01:41:45.159 Trail is a four lane divided roadway with five foot 01:41:45.159 --> 01:41:46.840 sidewalks on either side. There 01:41:46.840 --> 01:41:50.930 are no anticipation to install any bike lanes per se along 01:41:50.930 --> 01:41:52.359 Heritage. Are we 01:41:52.359 --> 01:41:55.600 going to restrict those walk lanes from bikes riding on 01:41:55.600 --> 01:41:56.840 them like we do in some 01:41:56.840 --> 01:42:01.199 areas around town? I'm sorry. Are we going to restrict 01:42:01.199 --> 01:42:04.479 bikes from riding on those? It'll be 01:42:04.479 --> 01:42:09.119 shared lanes. Sure. Okay. Thank you. 01:42:13.159 --> 01:42:14.579 There's no other questions for me. The applicant is here, 01:42:14.579 --> 01:42:16.239 and I think they have a 01:42:16.239 --> 01:42:20.609 quick presentation they'd like to make. Okay. That'd be 01:42:20.609 --> 01:42:23.159 fine. I haven't got any cards from them, but if the 01:42:23.159 --> 01:42:25.100 applicants here would like to speak on this item, please 01:42:25.100 --> 01:42:25.880 come forward at this 01:42:25.880 --> 01:42:36.270 time. Would the applicant like to speak? Okay. Good evening 01:42:36.270 --> 01:42:37.720 . My name is Austin 01:42:37.720 --> 01:42:40.949 Bradley with EPC Real Estate Group, the developer for the 01:42:40.949 --> 01:42:42.520 project. I just want to 01:42:42.520 --> 01:42:44.869 thank you guys for your consideration tonight. We've been 01:42:44.869 --> 01:42:46.039 working really closely 01:42:46.039 --> 01:42:49.020 with city staff and the master developer to come up with 01:42:49.020 --> 01:42:50.000 what you guys have seen 01:42:50.000 --> 01:42:52.789 to date. We're really excited about it and what's going on 01:42:52.789 --> 01:42:53.439 in the razor range 01:42:53.439 --> 01:42:57.289 development. I don't have a presentation necessarily. Got a 01:42:57.289 --> 01:42:58.279 few images, but I think 01:42:58.279 --> 01:43:00.329 you guys have seen those in the work session and prior to 01:43:00.329 --> 01:43:02.079 today. So with that, 01:43:02.079 --> 01:43:03.859 I'd be happy to answer any questions you guys have. Got a 01:43:03.859 --> 01:43:04.800 couple questions for you. 01:43:04.800 --> 01:43:10.039 Sure. Commissioner Beck. Thanks, Chair. Probably on second 01:43:10.039 --> 01:43:11.560 thought, the question 01:43:11.560 --> 01:43:15.210 I had about the design of the apartments. I'll get with the 01:43:15.210 --> 01:43:16.439 applicant afterwards, 01:43:16.439 --> 01:43:21.079 and it's not worth mentioning here. Okay. Thank you. 01:43:21.079 --> 01:43:23.840 Commissioner Taylor. Thank you, 01:43:23.840 --> 01:43:28.010 Chair. Good evening. I have a couple of questions. I 01:43:28.010 --> 01:43:30.720 noticed there are not any 01:43:30.720 --> 01:43:36.199 bike racks or bike parking called out on the site plan. We 01:43:36.199 --> 01:43:37.119 've, I know that 01:43:37.119 --> 01:43:40.890 you're under, I believe, an MPC or master plan, so you don 01:43:40.890 --> 01:43:42.000 't have to meet our 01:43:42.000 --> 01:43:44.279 current ordinances, but in our current ordinances, multif 01:43:44.279 --> 01:43:46.039 amily requires bike 01:43:46.039 --> 01:43:48.250 parking. Are you planning on putting in anything like that? 01:43:48.250 --> 01:43:49.199 Absolutely. Yeah. There 01:43:49.199 --> 01:43:51.909 was three amenity spaces shown on the site plan, two of 01:43:51.909 --> 01:43:53.199 which would have bike 01:43:53.199 --> 01:43:55.779 racks, and then we'd have a few bike spaces associated with 01:43:55.779 --> 01:43:56.560 what we're calling 01:43:56.560 --> 01:43:59.489 building C. It's that big C-shaped building. So to answer 01:43:59.489 --> 01:44:00.279 your question, 01:44:00.279 --> 01:44:03.250 absolutely. And then in the work session, I had a question 01:44:03.250 --> 01:44:03.920 I don't know if you all 01:44:03.920 --> 01:44:08.680 watched. Is there, are there pedestrian connections over to 01:44:08.680 --> 01:44:10.199 the shopping area and 01:44:10.199 --> 01:44:13.340 over to the grocery store? Yeah, we have sidewalks on all 01:44:13.340 --> 01:44:14.439 four sides of the site, 01:44:14.439 --> 01:44:17.300 specifically on the north and the south side. I believe the 01:44:17.300 --> 01:44:18.199 north is eight foot 01:44:18.199 --> 01:44:20.760 wide and the south would be five or six foot wide. The 01:44:20.760 --> 01:44:21.960 intent is not necessarily 01:44:21.960 --> 01:44:25.270 to bring pedestrians through our site, but absolutely 01:44:25.270 --> 01:44:26.800 around. Okay. Thank you. 01:44:26.800 --> 01:44:39.520 Yeah. I see no more questions. Thank you. You're welcome. 01:44:39.520 --> 01:44:44.199 Thank you. We don't have any 01:44:44.199 --> 01:44:52.390 cards for anyone else to speak, so. Sorry. You trying to 01:44:52.390 --> 01:44:54.119 ring in? I got a whole 01:44:54.119 --> 01:44:56.579 bunch of stuff here on the screen. You have a question or a 01:44:56.579 --> 01:44:57.960 comment? I do have a 01:44:57.960 --> 01:45:01.500 question. Commissioner Taylor. Thank you. My name was still 01:45:01.500 --> 01:45:02.159 up from the last time, 01:45:02.159 --> 01:45:05.140 so I had to un-ring your ring to get back on the list. Well 01:45:05.140 --> 01:45:06.439 , there's still one ahead of you too, so it hadn't come off. 01:45:06.439 --> 01:45:08.960 So go ahead. I did have one 01:45:08.960 --> 01:45:12.090 question for, I don't know if this would be for you or for 01:45:12.090 --> 01:45:14.399 Red Development. We had 01:45:14.399 --> 01:45:18.550 questions about the order of street development. Are you 01:45:18.550 --> 01:45:20.119 going to build the 01:45:20.119 --> 01:45:24.289 Olive Heritage Trail or just the portion immediately 01:45:24.289 --> 01:45:27.720 adjacent to the property? 01:45:32.720 --> 01:45:35.670 Good evening, Commissioners. My name is Scott Wagner with 01:45:35.670 --> 01:45:37.319 Red Development, the 01:45:37.319 --> 01:45:42.739 development representative of Razor Ranch. We are building 01:45:42.739 --> 01:45:43.359 Olive Heritage 01:45:43.359 --> 01:45:45.930 Trail eventually, but we are building it in phases. The 01:45:45.930 --> 01:45:47.399 first phase currently goes 01:45:47.399 --> 01:45:50.109 from University to the south end of Winko. The next phase 01:45:50.109 --> 01:45:50.920 will be along the 01:45:50.920 --> 01:45:55.270 frontage of this project from Heritage to Linden, and then 01:45:55.270 --> 01:45:57.279 that will turn into the 01:45:57.279 --> 01:46:00.050 west to the Hotel Convention Center that was approved and 01:46:00.050 --> 01:46:02.960 under construction six 01:46:02.960 --> 01:46:07.029 months ago or so. And then the next phase as the property 01:46:07.029 --> 01:46:07.640 builds out, we would 01:46:07.640 --> 01:46:09.850 continue that to Scripture. But as of right now, that's not 01:46:09.850 --> 01:46:10.800 planned or 01:46:10.800 --> 01:46:14.590 scheduled. And the private roads like the Linden, the 01:46:14.590 --> 01:46:15.520 public side or the 01:46:15.520 --> 01:46:18.130 private side, will either of those... What will be built, I 01:46:18.130 --> 01:46:19.359 guess, at the time that 01:46:19.359 --> 01:46:23.399 this complex opens? We just pulled a permit. So what's 01:46:23.399 --> 01:46:25.479 being built for this 01:46:25.479 --> 01:46:28.430 phase is the same street system that's built for the Hotel 01:46:28.430 --> 01:46:29.359 Convention Center, 01:46:29.359 --> 01:46:35.600 and it's basically Heritage to the west. Okay. Thank you. 01:46:35.600 --> 01:46:38.960 Thank you. 01:46:38.960 --> 01:46:44.829 You have no cards for anyone else wishing to speak, so 01:46:44.829 --> 01:46:46.840 either a request 01:46:46.840 --> 01:46:51.439 or a motion at this time. 01:46:53.399 --> 01:46:58.600 Commissioner Hutsman. I move approval for this item. 01:46:58.600 --> 01:47:01.800 Commissioner Bec. Okay. I have a 01:47:01.800 --> 01:47:07.239 first and a second for approval. Any discussion on this 01:47:07.239 --> 01:47:08.079 item? 01:47:09.840 --> 01:47:15.760 Seeing none, we'll call for a vote on the board. 01:47:27.199 --> 01:47:31.479 Motion carries 7-0. Good luck with your project. So we'll 01:47:31.479 --> 01:47:37.119 move us to our item 5, 01:47:37.119 --> 01:47:43.729 public hearings, this evening. I'm going to open the public 01:47:43.729 --> 01:47:46.479 hearing for item A, FR 01:47:46.479 --> 01:47:52.029 16-0013, and I will call on Julie Wyatt for that 01:47:52.029 --> 01:47:54.560 presentation. 01:48:08.039 --> 01:48:10.350 We don't normally have presentations for residential repl 01:48:10.350 --> 01:48:16.720 ats, but I did hear from 01:48:16.720 --> 01:48:19.579 the neighborhood adjacent and the residents who received 01:48:19.579 --> 01:48:20.640 notification, and 01:48:20.640 --> 01:48:20.640 so I wanted to just talk about this replat in terms of the 01:48:20.640 --> 01:48:27.319 original plots and 01:48:27.319 --> 01:48:30.609 then what they're proposing. So this is a residential repl 01:48:30.609 --> 01:48:31.560 at for the Haddad 01:48:31.560 --> 01:48:35.029 addition. They're proposing two lots, one being 01:48:35.029 --> 01:48:37.239 approximately four acres, and 01:48:37.239 --> 01:48:42.569 this has access to Lawrence Way, and then this lot, 01:48:42.569 --> 01:48:43.199 approximately 01:48:43.199 --> 01:48:47.430 two acres, has frontage on Ryan Road. This is a combination 01:48:47.430 --> 01:48:48.600 of two existing 01:48:48.600 --> 01:48:52.720 plots that have residential zoning on them, one being the 01:48:52.720 --> 01:48:54.119 Ryan Road estates and 01:48:54.119 --> 01:49:00.659 a replat of this lot three here, and then Thetford addition 01:49:00.659 --> 01:49:02.119 being a replat of 01:49:02.119 --> 01:49:07.569 this lot right here, which turns into this right here. So 01:49:07.569 --> 01:49:08.800 that previous 01:49:08.800 --> 01:49:12.479 lot three from Ryan Road estates takes in that back portion 01:49:12.479 --> 01:49:13.479 of that lot, 01:49:13.479 --> 01:49:20.760 and then the leftover here is lot two. So that's the plot. 01:49:20.760 --> 01:49:21.479 I'll stand for any 01:49:21.479 --> 01:49:25.720 questions. Got a question. Sure. I didn't think about it in 01:49:25.720 --> 01:49:27.079 work session. Is there 01:49:27.079 --> 01:49:31.000 going to be perimeter street paving improvements required 01:49:31.000 --> 01:49:32.399 along Ryan on this 01:49:32.399 --> 01:49:37.600 replat? I know there's a right-of-way dedication, but I'm 01:49:37.600 --> 01:49:40.439 gonna call Earl Escobar. 01:49:44.000 --> 01:49:45.899 To answer your question, no. They would, now that we have 01:49:45.899 --> 01:49:47.680 implemented roadway 01:49:47.680 --> 01:49:49.890 impact fees, they would, we would collect the roadway 01:49:49.890 --> 01:49:50.760 impact fees at this time. 01:49:50.760 --> 01:49:55.760 Upon development, there has been no proposed development or 01:49:55.760 --> 01:49:57.479 no proposed 01:49:57.479 --> 01:50:00.039 development for this first lot that has frontage on Ryan 01:50:00.039 --> 01:50:01.960 Road, but regardless we 01:50:01.960 --> 01:50:04.649 will end up collecting roadway impact fees. I'm still in 01:50:04.649 --> 01:50:05.680 the old school. I'll 01:50:05.680 --> 01:50:10.949 get caught up to the new thing then. Okay, thank you. Any 01:50:10.949 --> 01:50:13.199 other questions for 01:50:13.199 --> 01:50:19.930 staff? Thank you Julie. Again, this is a public hearing. I 01:50:19.930 --> 01:50:21.880 have no cards appear 01:50:21.880 --> 01:50:24.850 from anyone wishing to speak. Anyone who would like to 01:50:24.850 --> 01:50:26.079 speak on this item is 01:50:26.079 --> 01:50:29.180 welcome to come down. Please state your name and address 01:50:29.180 --> 01:50:29.880 and then fill out a 01:50:29.880 --> 01:50:35.579 card. Again, it's public hearing. Anyone wishing to speak 01:50:35.579 --> 01:50:37.920 on this item? Seeing 01:50:37.920 --> 01:50:40.609 none, we will close the public hearing on this item and the 01:50:40.609 --> 01:50:41.520 chair will entertain 01:50:41.520 --> 01:50:49.300 a motion or discussion. Commissioner Taylor. Commissioner 01:50:49.300 --> 01:50:51.880 Ellis. I second. Okay, we 01:50:51.880 --> 01:50:57.279 have a first and a second for approval. Any discussion? 01:50:57.279 --> 01:51:00.520 Seeing none, call for a 01:51:00.520 --> 01:51:03.079 vote on the board. 01:51:10.439 --> 01:51:17.920 Motion carries 7-0. This time I'm going to move to item B 01:51:17.920 --> 01:51:18.880 and I'm going to open 01:51:18.880 --> 01:51:25.760 the public hearing for FR 16-0014 and I'm going to call on 01:51:25.760 --> 01:51:26.560 Haley 01:51:26.560 --> 01:51:30.800 Zagurski for that presentation. 01:51:40.439 --> 01:51:47.720 All right, good evening. My name is Haley Zagurski with the 01:51:47.720 --> 01:51:48.800 Planning Department. So 01:51:48.800 --> 01:51:52.699 this is a replat of Brinker Crossing. It was originally one 01:51:52.699 --> 01:51:53.720 lot with commercial 01:51:53.720 --> 01:51:57.149 development. It has Nassar Jewelry Store on the southeast 01:51:57.149 --> 01:51:58.520 corner and then a strip 01:51:58.520 --> 01:52:00.960 center on the remainder of the lot and the intent of the 01:52:00.960 --> 01:52:01.800 replat is just to 01:52:01.800 --> 01:52:04.789 separate those two lots to allow for new development of 01:52:04.789 --> 01:52:07.159 that strip center. So if 01:52:07.159 --> 01:52:11.630 there are any questions, I'd be glad to answer those. See 01:52:11.630 --> 01:52:15.680 none. Thank you. 01:52:19.000 --> 01:52:21.560 Again, this is a public hearing. If anyone would like to 01:52:21.560 --> 01:52:23.279 speak on this item, 01:52:23.279 --> 01:52:26.239 please come forward at this time. 01:52:28.479 --> 01:52:32.270 Seeing none, I'll close this public hearing and the chair 01:52:32.270 --> 01:52:33.600 will entertain a motion or 01:52:33.600 --> 01:52:41.380 discussion. Commissioner Beck. I move we approve this item. 01:52:41.380 --> 01:52:43.359 Okay. Commissioner Rossell. 01:52:43.359 --> 01:52:46.800 I second. Okay. We have a first and a second for approval. 01:52:46.800 --> 01:52:49.800 Any discussion? 01:52:51.800 --> 01:52:56.039 Seeing none, I'll call for a vote on the board. 01:53:03.880 --> 01:53:07.619 Motion carries 7-0. We'll move us to our item C and I'm 01:53:07.619 --> 01:53:12.359 going to open the public 01:53:12.359 --> 01:53:18.770 hearing for Z-16-0019 and call on Mike Bell for that 01:53:18.770 --> 01:53:20.640 presentation. 01:53:31.520 --> 01:53:35.600 The project is for fire station number four. It's kind of a 01:53:35.600 --> 01:53:36.640 two-part request. The 01:53:36.640 --> 01:53:39.430 first part is consider a recommendation to City Council 01:53:39.430 --> 01:53:40.560 regarding rezoning the 01:53:40.560 --> 01:53:44.119 property from an NR3 district to an NRME 12 district. The 01:53:44.119 --> 01:53:44.960 second part of this 01:53:44.960 --> 01:53:48.560 request is for a mixed-use residential protection overlay 01:53:48.560 --> 01:53:49.600 to restrict use of 01:53:49.600 --> 01:53:54.130 the property to those within any current district and allow 01:53:54.130 --> 01:53:55.319 community service, 01:53:55.319 --> 01:53:59.590 which is what a fire station is classified as. Subject 01:53:59.590 --> 01:54:00.520 property is shown 01:54:00.520 --> 01:54:03.270 here in yellow. It's at the northeast corner of Sherman 01:54:03.270 --> 01:54:05.239 Drive and Kings Row. 01:54:05.239 --> 01:54:09.159 You can see the existing fire station is located on the 01:54:09.159 --> 01:54:11.039 property to the south. 01:54:12.319 --> 01:54:15.970 Current zoning is NR3. That's a single-family zoning 01:54:15.970 --> 01:54:17.159 district that allows 01:54:17.159 --> 01:54:20.279 up to three units per acre. The proposal is NRME 12 with an 01:54:20.279 --> 01:54:21.720 overlay, but the effect 01:54:21.720 --> 01:54:24.119 of that overlay would essentially revert it back to NR3, 01:54:24.119 --> 01:54:25.800 again just allowing the 01:54:25.800 --> 01:54:28.489 additional community service use, which is fire stations, 01:54:28.489 --> 01:54:29.720 libraries, any other 01:54:29.720 --> 01:54:34.909 civic or governmental building. Feature land use category 01:54:34.909 --> 01:54:36.159 of this property is 01:54:36.159 --> 01:54:40.840 low residential. It is a single-family residential area. So 01:54:40.840 --> 01:54:41.840 with the request 01:54:41.840 --> 01:54:45.239 reverting it back to NR3, that is consistent with low 01:54:45.239 --> 01:54:45.720 residential 01:54:45.720 --> 01:54:50.189 category. A comparison of what the permitted uses would be 01:54:50.189 --> 01:54:50.880 with the 01:54:50.880 --> 01:54:54.000 proposal in the middle column. You'll see the existing and 01:54:54.000 --> 01:54:54.720 on the far right 01:54:54.720 --> 01:54:56.930 you'll see what's proposed. The only change with this 01:54:56.930 --> 01:54:57.800 request would be that 01:54:57.800 --> 01:54:59.760 again, community service goes from not permitted to 01:54:59.760 --> 01:55:00.880 permitted. Everything else 01:55:00.880 --> 01:55:07.079 remains exactly the same. So this is not the first zoning 01:55:07.079 --> 01:55:08.319 case on this property. I 01:55:08.319 --> 01:55:11.800 have kept in contact with many of the neighbors as they 01:55:11.800 --> 01:55:12.680 request updates for 01:55:12.680 --> 01:55:16.619 what's going on, and there are some concerns. Generally I 01:55:16.619 --> 01:55:17.399 think most everyone 01:55:17.399 --> 01:55:19.899 was okay with the new fire station on the new location. The 01:55:19.899 --> 01:55:20.880 main concern is what 01:55:20.880 --> 01:55:24.340 happens to the old station. So that bears the question, 01:55:24.340 --> 01:55:25.359 what happens to the 01:55:25.359 --> 01:55:28.050 existing fire station and will it be sold? I heard that 01:55:28.050 --> 01:55:29.960 many times. I have 01:55:29.960 --> 01:55:34.640 verified again with the deputy fire chief today that the 01:55:34.640 --> 01:55:35.640 fire 01:55:35.640 --> 01:55:37.869 department plans to keep the building and remodel it and 01:55:37.869 --> 01:55:38.800 use it for storage of 01:55:38.800 --> 01:55:42.060 some of their extra apparatus. But ultimately city council 01:55:42.060 --> 01:55:42.800 may decide to 01:55:42.800 --> 01:55:45.010 sell it. That is not the plan now, but it's always a 01:55:45.010 --> 01:55:47.199 possibility in the future. 01:55:47.199 --> 01:55:51.479 So I also heard if it does get sold, wouldn't today's 01:55:51.479 --> 01:55:53.199 request, making it an 01:55:53.199 --> 01:55:57.369 NRME 12 district, support if a private developer purchased 01:55:57.369 --> 01:55:58.880 the old station lot 01:55:58.880 --> 01:56:02.119 from the city and wanted to go to NRME 12, wouldn't this 01:56:02.119 --> 01:56:03.119 allow them to kind of 01:56:03.119 --> 01:56:08.840 make that argument? I think that's a fairly good point. To 01:56:08.840 --> 01:56:09.399 kind of address 01:56:09.399 --> 01:56:13.380 that, the answer is on the face of it, it looks like it's 01:56:13.380 --> 01:56:15.159 NRME 12. But again with 01:56:15.159 --> 01:56:18.039 this overlay, we're essentially reverting it back to NR3. 01:56:18.039 --> 01:56:19.439 Well how do you 01:56:19.439 --> 01:56:21.300 as a commission know that? How does a developer who's 01:56:21.300 --> 01:56:22.279 pulling up the zoning map 01:56:22.279 --> 01:56:24.970 and looking to find places to develop, how do they know 01:56:24.970 --> 01:56:26.680 that? What we're going to 01:56:26.680 --> 01:56:31.359 do is add some zoning map symbology. What you see on the 01:56:31.359 --> 01:56:32.000 left is what you would 01:56:32.000 --> 01:56:34.609 see currently in your backup or on the zoning map. It just 01:56:34.609 --> 01:56:35.760 shows NRME 12, you 01:56:35.760 --> 01:56:37.970 would never know that there's an overlay on it just looking 01:56:37.970 --> 01:56:39.279 at the map. We're 01:56:39.279 --> 01:56:42.050 going to add the cross hatch over it that way. Anybody who 01:56:42.050 --> 01:56:42.760 comes and pulls a 01:56:42.760 --> 01:56:45.960 zoning map up knows there's something additional on this 01:56:45.960 --> 01:56:47.960 property. You all can 01:56:47.960 --> 01:56:50.340 ask the question, what is that? We will tell you that it's 01:56:50.340 --> 01:56:52.119 essentially NR3. It is 01:56:52.119 --> 01:56:55.199 not an NRME 12 property. Therefore that does not lend any 01:56:55.199 --> 01:56:56.319 support towards 01:56:56.319 --> 01:57:02.739 rezoning the old fire station. And additionally, y'all as a 01:57:02.739 --> 01:57:03.840 subcommittee or 01:57:03.840 --> 01:57:06.050 subcommittee of PNZ that has looked at some of the city 01:57:06.050 --> 01:57:07.119 initiated rezoning has 01:57:07.119 --> 01:57:10.680 seen the plans for a government only zoning district that 01:57:10.680 --> 01:57:11.680 is not in place 01:57:11.680 --> 01:57:15.579 right now. But the plan is to create that and some of the 01:57:15.579 --> 01:57:17.239 neighbors you have an 01:57:17.239 --> 01:57:20.359 email from Mr. Crossman requesting that if that moves 01:57:20.359 --> 01:57:21.399 forward to consider this 01:57:21.399 --> 01:57:25.369 site to rezone that to governmental entity zoning district 01:57:25.369 --> 01:57:26.439 in the future if 01:57:26.439 --> 01:57:30.350 that comes about and urging you to do so. And he did ask me 01:57:30.350 --> 01:57:31.239 to read it in the 01:57:31.239 --> 01:57:34.100 record so I'll go ahead and do that now. Go ahead. I wish 01:57:34.100 --> 01:57:35.199 to express my concern 01:57:35.199 --> 01:57:37.810 that the zoning changed NRME 12 would allow the old fire 01:57:37.810 --> 01:57:38.979 station property to be 01:57:38.979 --> 01:57:41.699 rezoned in the future to the same zoning. I have no 01:57:41.699 --> 01:57:44.000 opposition to the case, the new 01:57:44.000 --> 01:57:46.920 fire station, but that the city move forward post-haste and 01:57:46.920 --> 01:57:47.439 creating a new 01:57:47.439 --> 01:57:49.890 government only zoning district. Then apply that new zoning 01:57:49.890 --> 01:57:50.640 to both properties 01:57:50.640 --> 01:57:55.399 in the near future. So again based on that I think it's 01:57:55.399 --> 01:57:55.720 highly 01:57:55.720 --> 01:57:58.020 unlikely that somebody could make a case to come back in 01:57:58.020 --> 01:57:59.159 the future if for 01:57:59.159 --> 01:58:01.510 whatever reason the city sells it and make a petition for 01:58:01.510 --> 01:58:02.760 NRME 12. I don't see 01:58:02.760 --> 01:58:07.100 how we would support that with this overlay. Again this is 01:58:07.100 --> 01:58:07.920 a public hearing. 01:58:07.920 --> 01:58:11.289 We did notify within 200 feet to property owners and 500 01:58:11.289 --> 01:58:11.920 feet to the 01:58:11.920 --> 01:58:14.659 physical addresses of the property. We received one in 01:58:14.659 --> 01:58:15.760 opposition and one in 01:58:15.760 --> 01:58:19.850 favor. You receive those both and you're back on. With that 01:58:19.850 --> 01:58:21.000 staff does recommend 01:58:21.000 --> 01:58:24.029 approval and I'd be happy to answer any questions. A couple 01:58:24.029 --> 01:58:25.600 questions. Commissioner 01:58:25.600 --> 01:58:31.720 Tyler. Thank you chair. Could you just briefly touch on the 01:58:31.720 --> 01:58:33.199 previous history of 01:58:33.199 --> 01:58:39.319 rezoning and proposed rezoning for this parcel? To my 01:58:39.319 --> 01:58:39.800 knowledge there 01:58:39.800 --> 01:58:42.640 was a case in the 90s to rezone this to retail for a gas 01:58:42.640 --> 01:58:43.439 station that was 01:58:43.439 --> 01:58:47.050 denied. Then there was a case just last year I believe to 01:58:47.050 --> 01:58:48.359 rezone it from NR3 01:58:48.359 --> 01:58:52.239 to NR4 and they wanted to do single-family houses with a 01:58:52.239 --> 01:58:52.399 higher 01:58:52.399 --> 01:58:55.090 density. I could tell you just from experience and working 01:58:55.090 --> 01:58:55.399 with that 01:58:55.399 --> 01:58:58.810 applicant that even single-family is difficult to do on 01:58:58.810 --> 01:58:59.920 this property because 01:58:59.920 --> 01:59:03.250 of its shape and getting access. It's on a primary arterial 01:59:03.250 --> 01:59:04.319 road so access has to 01:59:04.319 --> 01:59:06.840 come off Kings Row. Ends up being a cul-de-sac and that 01:59:06.840 --> 01:59:07.560 eats a lot of the 01:59:07.560 --> 01:59:09.829 property. So it makes it very difficult to develop this 01:59:09.829 --> 01:59:11.079 even with NR3. So the 01:59:11.079 --> 01:59:13.479 fire station in our opinion is actually pretty good use. 01:59:13.479 --> 01:59:16.600 Thank you. Commissioner 01:59:16.600 --> 01:59:19.600 Rosale. Thank you chair. This is more for clarification. 01:59:19.600 --> 01:59:23.119 The overlay protection being 01:59:23.119 --> 01:59:25.329 placed on this you mentioned the work session was for 01:59:25.329 --> 01:59:26.680 neighborhood residential 01:59:26.680 --> 01:59:30.840 zoning. Is it for residential or mixed-use zones? Because 01:59:30.840 --> 01:59:31.399 the first slide 01:59:31.399 --> 01:59:33.810 you had made it I'm confused at which one we're allowed to 01:59:33.810 --> 01:59:35.239 going forward apply 01:59:35.239 --> 01:59:39.409 this protection to. The code provision is under the 01:59:39.409 --> 01:59:41.840 categories of NR1 through NRMU. 01:59:41.840 --> 01:59:47.920 1 2 3 4 5 6 NRMU 12 and NRMU. The way it's written is to 01:59:47.920 --> 01:59:48.239 put 01:59:48.239 --> 01:59:51.560 additional restrictions on non-residential or multifamily 01:59:51.560 --> 01:59:52.079 development 01:59:52.079 --> 01:59:56.930 to protect neighborhoods. So it's to be on NRMU or NRMU 12 01:59:56.930 --> 01:59:58.479 or if there's some 01:59:58.479 --> 02:00:00.689 instance where NR6s might allow commercial uses you could 02:00:00.689 --> 02:00:01.039 put it on 02:00:01.039 --> 02:00:04.159 non-residential and multifamily. So the key is the non- 02:00:04.159 --> 02:00:05.359 residential part for the 02:00:05.359 --> 02:00:10.869 protection? Correct. Thank you. Commissioner Beck. Thank 02:00:10.869 --> 02:00:11.479 you chair and 02:00:11.479 --> 02:00:14.579 again just to be clear for anybody's concerned who lives in 02:00:14.579 --> 02:00:15.399 that area and I'm 02:00:15.399 --> 02:00:21.439 one of them this rezoning change with its overlay will not 02:00:21.439 --> 02:00:22.840 allow townhomes 02:00:22.840 --> 02:00:25.460 apartments or anything else down there. This is strictly 02:00:25.460 --> 02:00:26.520 for the fire station is 02:00:26.520 --> 02:00:29.810 that correct? It is the purpose of it is for the fire 02:00:29.810 --> 02:00:31.319 station and allow everything 02:00:31.319 --> 02:00:34.680 in NR3 that's currently allowed in the current zoning. Town 02:00:34.680 --> 02:00:35.680 homes was your 02:00:35.680 --> 02:00:38.840 example that's with an SUP today would be with an SUP 02:00:38.840 --> 02:00:40.640 tomorrow if this were approved. 02:00:40.640 --> 02:00:49.550 Okay great thank you. Commissioner Tyler. I can't locate a 02:00:49.550 --> 02:00:50.880 copy of the actual 02:00:50.880 --> 02:00:54.220 overlay. Do you is that in the backup somewhere like what 02:00:54.220 --> 02:00:55.560 lists what is being 02:00:55.560 --> 02:00:58.279 removed and what's being added? No that's typically dropped 02:00:58.279 --> 02:00:59.560 in the ordinance that 02:00:59.560 --> 02:01:01.470 goes to City Council so it'd be in the wording of the 02:01:01.470 --> 02:01:02.800 ordinance itself. So we 02:01:02.800 --> 02:01:05.880 just make a recommendation for an overlay that restricts 02:01:05.880 --> 02:01:06.760 all uses down to 02:01:06.760 --> 02:01:10.729 NR3 except for community service? Well that's actually the 02:01:10.729 --> 02:01:11.600 applicants request so 02:01:11.600 --> 02:01:13.239 I don't think you have to condition that on top of it they 02:01:13.239 --> 02:01:13.920 're requesting both 02:01:13.920 --> 02:01:16.260 the zoning and the overlay. Okay I just kind of expected to 02:01:16.260 --> 02:01:17.960 see a copy of the 02:01:17.960 --> 02:01:20.439 overlay shall remove these uses or something like that. 02:01:20.439 --> 02:01:22.920 Thank you. I'll just 02:01:22.920 --> 02:01:27.640 make one comment when you if you choose to do a motion to 02:01:27.640 --> 02:01:28.520 consider both of them 02:01:28.520 --> 02:01:33.920 then you would have to do the zoning change and then the 02:01:33.920 --> 02:01:37.520 overlay. Two. No you 02:01:37.520 --> 02:01:40.819 can make it a condition of the zoning change but make sure 02:01:40.819 --> 02:01:41.880 that you add both 02:01:41.880 --> 02:01:44.960 elements into your motion. 02:01:47.359 --> 02:01:53.630 I see no other any other questions for staff? Thank you 02:01:53.630 --> 02:01:55.479 Mike. Again this is a 02:01:55.479 --> 02:01:57.689 public hearing anyone who would like to come forward and 02:01:57.689 --> 02:01:58.319 speak on this item 02:01:58.319 --> 02:02:04.010 please do so at this time. You'll need to come up to the 02:02:04.010 --> 02:02:04.920 mic if you'd like to 02:02:04.920 --> 02:02:08.350 speak on this item and please state your name and address 02:02:08.350 --> 02:02:09.520 and after giving your 02:02:09.520 --> 02:02:11.729 comments we'll need to get a card filled out for me they're 02:02:11.729 --> 02:02:12.800 available outside the 02:02:12.800 --> 02:02:15.800 door. All right I did not fill out a card. Okay. My name is 02:02:15.800 --> 02:02:16.880 Evelyn Mulkeric I do 02:02:16.880 --> 02:02:21.869 live on Royal Acres which is within the 500 feet. I don't 02:02:21.869 --> 02:02:23.920 object to the proposal 02:02:23.920 --> 02:02:29.710 of having a new fire station there but I was expecting more 02:02:29.710 --> 02:02:31.479 of a forward plan 02:02:31.479 --> 02:02:36.989 like the exit since it's triangular the exit would probably 02:02:36.989 --> 02:02:38.560 be right up front to 02:02:38.560 --> 02:02:43.520 Sherman whereas last year there was a proposal to put in an 02:02:43.520 --> 02:02:44.520 apartment building 02:02:44.520 --> 02:02:49.069 a two or two story plantation style whatever and they 02:02:49.069 --> 02:02:50.800 showed an image an 02:02:50.800 --> 02:02:54.970 actual draft of what was planned to be put there. We 02:02:54.970 --> 02:02:56.920 basically the neighborhood 02:02:56.920 --> 02:03:01.390 pay basically declined that because it did not fit into the 02:03:01.390 --> 02:03:02.680 neighborhood. This 02:03:02.680 --> 02:03:06.119 new fire station this this triangular shape there were two 02:03:06.119 --> 02:03:07.600 houses before the 02:03:07.600 --> 02:03:12.420 property is well suited for about two or three houses we 02:03:12.420 --> 02:03:14.000 just didn't want rental 02:03:14.000 --> 02:03:21.460 units or multifamily units there. We have no from what I 02:03:21.460 --> 02:03:23.199 understand there were no 02:03:23.199 --> 02:03:27.520 images there was no draft of what kind of fire station how 02:03:27.520 --> 02:03:28.640 large of a fire 02:03:28.640 --> 02:03:32.409 station because the existing one has two fire engines I 02:03:32.409 --> 02:03:34.039 think and an ambulance 02:03:34.039 --> 02:03:37.180 maybe that's insufficient and I certainly don't want to get 02:03:37.180 --> 02:03:38.000 in the way of 02:03:38.000 --> 02:03:41.819 a new fire station we could certainly use that it's just 02:03:41.819 --> 02:03:43.000 that I expected more 02:03:43.000 --> 02:03:46.170 of a planning is it going to be is the exit going to be on 02:03:46.170 --> 02:03:47.560 Kingsrow or directly 02:03:47.560 --> 02:03:52.220 on Sherman which is the way the existing fire station is 02:03:52.220 --> 02:03:53.880 how large is it going to 02:03:53.880 --> 02:03:58.460 be how many engines do you are you are you expecting to 02:03:58.460 --> 02:04:01.560 house there and what's 02:04:01.560 --> 02:04:06.750 going to your previous mention about what's going to happen 02:04:06.750 --> 02:04:07.640 with the existing 02:04:07.640 --> 02:04:12.300 building you mentioned storage but there's also a water 02:04:12.300 --> 02:04:14.359 well there. I'll 02:04:14.359 --> 02:04:18.520 address the second part first the water is staying as well 02:04:18.520 --> 02:04:19.319 that's actually a 02:04:19.319 --> 02:04:22.010 set a different track than the fire station but that's 02:04:22.010 --> 02:04:23.680 owned by the kind of 02:04:23.680 --> 02:04:25.890 under ownership of the water department not the fire 02:04:25.890 --> 02:04:27.720 department that's planning 02:04:27.720 --> 02:04:30.960 to stay the way it is the reason there's no images with 02:04:30.960 --> 02:04:31.920 this as opposed to the 02:04:31.920 --> 02:04:34.130 townhome which was originally proposed was that was a 02:04:34.130 --> 02:04:35.279 specific use permit they're 02:04:35.279 --> 02:04:38.640 required to submit those plans with the application with 02:04:38.640 --> 02:04:39.720 this this is just a 02:04:39.720 --> 02:04:41.970 straight zoning change there is no site plan attached to 02:04:41.970 --> 02:04:43.000 that however if you'd 02:04:43.000 --> 02:04:45.020 like to see it we do have it I'd be happy to share it with 02:04:45.020 --> 02:04:45.880 you but it's not 02:04:45.880 --> 02:04:52.630 really a condition of this request. Commissioner Taylor or 02:04:52.630 --> 02:04:53.960 is still on the 02:04:53.960 --> 02:04:57.840 board okay yep Commissioner O'Zell nope this 02:04:57.840 --> 02:05:03.039 willing okay thank you again this is a public hearing 02:05:03.039 --> 02:05:05.319 anyone else who would like 02:05:05.319 --> 02:05:10.220 to speak on this item please come forward at this time. My 02:05:10.220 --> 02:05:11.880 name is Dave 02:05:11.880 --> 02:05:15.100 Schultz I live at 2207 Wellington Drive which is in my 02:05:15.100 --> 02:05:17.960 backyard that's where I'm 02:05:17.960 --> 02:05:21.869 at there was what it all is the zoning for I understand the 02:05:21.869 --> 02:05:22.439 fire station but 02:05:22.439 --> 02:05:25.779 what else can they put there and is this going to be a two- 02:05:25.779 --> 02:05:26.960 story I mean I need to 02:05:26.960 --> 02:05:30.109 know a little bit more before I say okay yeah we're fine 02:05:30.109 --> 02:05:31.520 with that what is going 02:05:31.520 --> 02:05:35.119 what can it potentially be other than just oh we might put 02:05:35.119 --> 02:05:36.000 a fire station 02:05:36.000 --> 02:05:40.159 okay I'll call a mic bill to answer those questions please 02:05:40.159 --> 02:05:41.640 sure if the 02:05:41.640 --> 02:05:44.369 Commission would bear me for just a second I can't pull the 02:05:44.369 --> 02:05:45.560 plans that seems 02:05:45.560 --> 02:05:49.119 to be that way. That'd be a great idea yes 02:05:56.960 --> 02:06:04.949 again at this time I don't have any cards from anybody 02:06:04.949 --> 02:06:07.920 wishing to speak on 02:06:07.920 --> 02:06:11.229 this item so if you do wish to speak we will need to get a 02:06:11.229 --> 02:06:12.600 card filled out from 02:06:12.600 --> 02:06:17.000 you either before your comments or after so 02:06:27.000 --> 02:06:27.670 there is a site plan and review by staff now which would 02:06:27.670 --> 02:06:32.239 follow the zoning case 02:06:32.239 --> 02:06:37.880 should it be approved and again I want to stress I'm 02:06:37.880 --> 02:06:40.760 showing this so they have 02:06:40.760 --> 02:06:43.579 an idea to get some comfort level but this really isn't 02:06:43.579 --> 02:06:44.800 part of the request so 02:06:44.800 --> 02:06:49.079 there's not much we can change here tonight but I'd be 02:06:49.079 --> 02:06:50.600 willing to show it 02:06:57.960 --> 02:07:02.859 and this is not been approved yet it is subject to change 02:07:02.859 --> 02:07:07.720 of course we're going 02:07:07.720 --> 02:07:10.319 to be very slow 02:07:22.800 --> 02:07:27.069 I'll go ahead and show the elevation since I have those up 02:07:27.069 --> 02:07:27.520 first 02:07:31.800 --> 02:07:34.800 oh you do okay 02:07:53.680 --> 02:07:56.050 so what you see go ahead and orient this north if I can 02:07:56.050 --> 02:08:05.039 Kings Row on the south 02:08:05.039 --> 02:08:05.039 Sherman Drive here the parking lot will be right here this 02:08:05.039 --> 02:08:11.239 is a detention area 02:08:11.239 --> 02:08:11.239 access for the fire trucks be through here and out onto 02:08:11.239 --> 02:08:16.159 Sherman there's an 02:08:16.159 --> 02:08:22.170 accessory parking to the north anything else you want to 02:08:22.170 --> 02:08:23.680 have a single or two 02:08:23.680 --> 02:08:26.800 story structure I think that was a question as well my name 02:08:26.800 --> 02:08:27.359 is Bradley 02:08:27.359 --> 02:08:30.569 with MJ Thomas engineering part of the design team the 02:08:30.569 --> 02:08:32.359 tallest part of the 02:08:32.359 --> 02:08:36.119 building towers 36 feet is one story there's a tower 02:08:36.119 --> 02:08:36.760 involved in this 36 feet 02:08:36.760 --> 02:08:42.380 tall Brian if we could we could pull the computer back up 02:08:42.380 --> 02:08:43.720 these are elevations 02:08:43.720 --> 02:08:47.430 of what you'll see from Sherman Drive this being the fire b 02:08:47.430 --> 02:08:49.159 ays obviously and 02:08:49.159 --> 02:08:51.109 their tower which is typical architecture for a fire 02:08:51.109 --> 02:08:51.720 station these 02:08:51.720 --> 02:08:57.579 days need to get the address from the engineer for the 02:08:57.579 --> 02:08:58.479 engineering firm as 02:08:58.479 --> 02:09:07.079 well got the name MJ Thomas engineering 3973 West Vickery 02:09:07.079 --> 02:09:08.239 Boulevard Fort Worth 02:09:08.239 --> 02:09:13.220 Texas 76107 thank you for that additional information so 02:09:13.220 --> 02:09:14.199 one story brick 02:09:14.199 --> 02:09:21.199 building metal roof okay so the tower as you can see the 02:09:21.199 --> 02:09:22.760 tower on the side it is 02:09:22.760 --> 02:09:27.369 gonna stand about 36 feet tall and at the bay doors it'll 02:09:27.369 --> 02:09:28.399 stand 30 feet tall 02:09:28.399 --> 02:09:33.170 okay and again if anybody from the public would like to 02:09:33.170 --> 02:09:34.079 come see these after 02:09:34.079 --> 02:09:35.609 the meeting we'd be happy to show it to them and go through 02:09:35.609 --> 02:09:36.199 it in more detail 02:09:36.199 --> 02:09:39.020 okay well I think it helps answer several the questions 02:09:39.020 --> 02:09:39.760 that have come up 02:09:39.760 --> 02:09:47.659 does that change your opinion sir okay sure so you'd you'd 02:09:47.659 --> 02:09:48.880 be in support of 02:09:48.880 --> 02:09:53.800 this moving forward now okay great thank you very much 02:09:56.359 --> 02:09:59.829 thank you for bearing with me through that thank you for 02:09:59.829 --> 02:10:01.279 going to trouble to 02:10:01.279 --> 02:10:06.920 pull that up for us again this is a public hearing is there 02:10:06.920 --> 02:10:07.520 anyone else that 02:10:07.520 --> 02:10:10.920 would like to speak on this item 02:10:17.119 --> 02:10:19.899 Commissioner Hesford do you have a question I'm sorry I 02:10:19.899 --> 02:10:21.560 missed your right on 02:10:21.560 --> 02:10:25.439 the board here no problem Mike is it my question is is it 02:10:25.439 --> 02:10:26.159 comparable to the 02:10:26.159 --> 02:10:31.420 station that's going in off of McKinney comparable design I 02:10:31.420 --> 02:10:32.399 haven't seen those 02:10:32.399 --> 02:10:39.680 designs I'm sorry okay okay yeah so if just a point just a 02:10:39.680 --> 02:10:40.840 point if you wanted 02:10:40.840 --> 02:10:46.520 to see it in practice I don't know that exact address it's 02:10:46.520 --> 02:10:48.039 off of McKinney 02:10:48.039 --> 02:11:00.720 mockingbird and McKinney there you go thank you I don't 02:11:00.720 --> 02:11:02.479 think we have we have 02:11:02.479 --> 02:11:04.680 one 02:11:18.039 --> 02:11:21.760 we're trying to clarify up here we had one letter that I 02:11:21.760 --> 02:11:23.760 haven't read yet that 02:11:23.760 --> 02:11:28.229 was a post request we've had one citizen that's come 02:11:28.229 --> 02:11:29.960 forward to speak in 02:11:29.960 --> 02:11:40.460 opposition Mike do you have any okay will you please come 02:11:40.460 --> 02:11:41.720 back to the mic 02:11:41.720 --> 02:11:50.340 okay will you please come back to the mic please this is 02:11:50.340 --> 02:11:54.680 about the best plan 02:11:54.680 --> 02:11:59.149 that has been proposed for that property so we're not 02:11:59.149 --> 02:12:01.000 against it we just wanted 02:12:01.000 --> 02:12:05.529 to find out how large would it be as the other gentleman 02:12:05.529 --> 02:12:07.159 had in inquired you know 02:12:07.159 --> 02:12:11.039 is it a two-story how many engines are going to be housed 02:12:11.039 --> 02:12:12.600 that kind of thing is 02:12:12.600 --> 02:12:16.489 the exit going to be towards Sherman or is it towards Kings 02:12:16.489 --> 02:12:17.840 row what would happen 02:12:17.840 --> 02:12:22.489 with the existing station okay so that was just a concern a 02:12:22.489 --> 02:12:23.680 layout type thing 02:12:23.680 --> 02:12:27.750 but we're definitely not against it okay so are you neutral 02:12:27.750 --> 02:12:29.000 are you in favor of 02:12:29.000 --> 02:12:33.119 it with no I'm in favor yeah I'm in favor for like I said 02:12:33.119 --> 02:12:33.720 this is the best 02:12:33.720 --> 02:12:36.949 solution so correct well thank you for that we have to keep 02:12:36.949 --> 02:12:37.920 track with how many 02:12:37.920 --> 02:12:41.770 people are in support or neutral or opposition as to what 02:12:41.770 --> 02:12:42.840 type of vote if 02:12:42.840 --> 02:12:45.720 it's just a simple majority or supermajority I appreciate 02:12:45.720 --> 02:12:46.359 you clarifying 02:12:46.359 --> 02:12:51.859 that and sorry if we misinterpreted your comment so I don't 02:12:51.859 --> 02:12:53.600 see any other requests 02:12:53.600 --> 02:12:57.869 to speak at this time it is still open for a public hearing 02:12:57.869 --> 02:12:59.359 and I do have one 02:12:59.359 --> 02:13:03.829 letter here that I'm going to read in the record as well we 02:13:03.829 --> 02:13:05.159 have one opposed 02:13:05.159 --> 02:13:08.770 to this request which is Rudy Gonzalez and so I want to 02:13:08.770 --> 02:13:10.079 read that into the 02:13:10.079 --> 02:13:15.319 record as well is a public hearing is there anyone else who 02:13:15.319 --> 02:13:15.600 would like to 02:13:15.600 --> 02:13:19.199 speak on this item at this time 02:13:28.880 --> 02:13:37.840 is Rudy Gonzalez here the president or just have sent in a 02:13:37.840 --> 02:13:43.359 letter okay seeing 02:13:43.359 --> 02:13:46.270 no one else wishing to come forward at this time I'm going 02:13:46.270 --> 02:13:47.560 to close the public 02:13:47.560 --> 02:13:53.069 hearing and call on Commissioner O'Zell I motion to approve 02:13:53.069 --> 02:13:54.199 this agenda item 02:13:54.199 --> 02:14:03.439 okay thank you with I don't know how it has to be worded I 02:14:03.439 --> 02:14:04.720 move for approval of 02:14:04.720 --> 02:14:12.199 the zoning change with the overlay added upon the rezoning 02:14:12.199 --> 02:14:13.880 with a mixed use 02:14:13.880 --> 02:14:17.529 residential protection overlay that acts as in our three 02:14:17.529 --> 02:14:18.840 except adding community 02:14:18.840 --> 02:14:23.119 service it's exactly what you're gonna see right right that 02:14:23.119 --> 02:14:24.479 's why that's what 02:14:24.479 --> 02:14:30.819 it's a great motion Commissioner Hudson second we have a 02:14:30.819 --> 02:14:33.399 first and a second for 02:14:33.399 --> 02:14:37.560 approval with conditions on the overlay 02:14:39.840 --> 02:14:43.640 anyone else wish to speak or comment on this before we take 02:14:43.640 --> 02:14:44.359 a vote 02:14:44.359 --> 02:14:47.119 Commissioner Taylor sure we have some technical 02:14:47.119 --> 02:14:48.680 difficulties over here so I 02:14:48.680 --> 02:14:52.300 can fill in for a few minutes my father worked at station 02:14:52.300 --> 02:14:54.319 for for over a decade 02:14:54.319 --> 02:14:57.399 they used to call it the retirement home because it was a 02:14:57.399 --> 02:14:57.920 very sleepy 02:14:57.920 --> 02:15:00.279 neighborhood I think it's kind of picked up in traffic 02:15:00.279 --> 02:15:02.399 recently and the first 02:15:02.399 --> 02:15:04.810 time they brought one of the Peterbilt engines out there 02:15:04.810 --> 02:15:05.760 that the pride of the 02:15:05.760 --> 02:15:08.619 city and backed it in they knocked the exhaust pipes off 02:15:08.619 --> 02:15:09.399 because the old 02:15:09.399 --> 02:15:13.159 station was so small and the doors were so low that the the 02:15:13.159 --> 02:15:14.640 stacks wouldn't fit 02:15:14.640 --> 02:15:18.329 in the in the bays so they had to park it on the street for 02:15:18.329 --> 02:15:19.600 a few weeks until 02:15:19.600 --> 02:15:24.729 they had the stacks shortened on the truck and I do feel 02:15:24.729 --> 02:15:26.199 that this is the 02:15:26.199 --> 02:15:29.060 best plan I've seen on this we've seen townhomes and a re 02:15:29.060 --> 02:15:30.199 zone with a cul-de-sac 02:15:30.199 --> 02:15:33.170 trying to cram in houses and it's a hard property to 02:15:33.170 --> 02:15:34.479 develop but it's a great 02:15:34.479 --> 02:15:37.319 place for a fire station providing an essential community 02:15:37.319 --> 02:15:38.520 service this 02:15:38.520 --> 02:15:41.600 overlay is a little confusing because it looks like NRMU 12 02:15:41.600 --> 02:15:42.439 but the overlay 02:15:42.439 --> 02:15:46.489 knocks it all back down to NR3 on all uses so if it ever 02:15:46.489 --> 02:15:47.680 stops being a fire 02:15:47.680 --> 02:15:50.989 station the only thing you do is build houses on third acre 02:15:50.989 --> 02:15:53.079 lots so for all 02:15:53.079 --> 02:15:56.789 those reasons I think this is a great idea I would agree 02:15:56.789 --> 02:15:57.560 Commissioner Tucker's 02:15:57.560 --> 02:15:59.359 yes we've been here for a while and there have been a lot 02:15:59.359 --> 02:16:00.119 of things have come 02:16:00.119 --> 02:16:03.199 forward that the neighborhood has been very opposed to and 02:16:03.199 --> 02:16:04.159 so it's nice to see 02:16:04.159 --> 02:16:06.600 something come forward that is an enhancement and 02:16:06.600 --> 02:16:07.600 protection for the 02:16:07.600 --> 02:16:12.010 neighborhood and I'll be supporting this motion as well any 02:16:12.010 --> 02:16:13.640 other comments or 02:16:13.640 --> 02:16:18.829 feedback before we call for a vote seeing none let's call 02:16:18.829 --> 02:16:19.680 for a vote on the 02:16:19.680 --> 02:16:21.880 board 02:16:34.600 --> 02:16:45.680 motion carries 7-0 that will move us to item D I'm going to 02:16:45.680 --> 02:16:46.520 open the public 02:16:46.520 --> 02:16:53.239 hearing for Z 16 - 0 0 2 4 and call on Julie white for that 02:16:53.239 --> 02:16:55.799 presentation 02:17:04.840 --> 02:17:09.459 so okay well we'll summarize it here okay the request 02:17:09.459 --> 02:17:15.159 before you tonight is 02:17:15.159 --> 02:17:17.739 to consider an initial zoning for a piece of property that 02:17:17.739 --> 02:17:18.399 was recently 02:17:18.399 --> 02:17:18.399 annexed into the city they're requesting our CCN which is a 02:17:18.399 --> 02:17:27.719 logical continuation 02:17:27.719 --> 02:17:27.719 of the existing zoning pattern that is in that area so I'll 02:17:27.719 --> 02:17:33.680 stand for any 02:17:33.680 --> 02:17:40.219 questions staff is recommending approval any questions for 02:17:40.219 --> 02:17:41.040 staff 02:17:41.520 --> 02:17:45.079 Commissioner Zill just for my identification is this 02:17:45.079 --> 02:17:46.120 property going to 02:17:46.120 --> 02:17:48.329 be combined with the other properties this is gonna be one 02:17:48.329 --> 02:17:49.200 medical district or 02:17:49.200 --> 02:17:52.559 is this the same owner that has that entire triangle of 02:17:52.559 --> 02:17:53.780 land that is the 02:17:53.780 --> 02:17:57.389 proposal of course you know zoning is is is all of the uses 02:17:57.389 --> 02:17:59.559 and but the the 02:17:59.559 --> 02:18:02.809 applicant is intending to move forward with they've been 02:18:02.809 --> 02:18:03.559 working on a 02:18:03.559 --> 02:18:08.090 preliminary and final plat and also a site plan for this 02:18:08.090 --> 02:18:09.280 proposal so if 02:18:09.280 --> 02:18:13.440 approved you will see a preliminary plat and final plat 02:18:13.440 --> 02:18:17.159 come forward soon with a 02:18:17.159 --> 02:18:21.100 with an anchor site for a hospital as well as some pad 02:18:21.100 --> 02:18:22.680 sites for some medical 02:18:22.680 --> 02:18:25.479 offices so 02:18:30.120 --> 02:18:34.290 thank you Julie again this is a public hearing anyone who 02:18:34.290 --> 02:18:37.319 would like to speak 02:18:37.319 --> 02:18:42.600 on this item please come forward at this time seeing none I 02:18:42.600 --> 02:18:44.559 'm going to close the 02:18:44.559 --> 02:18:49.030 public hearing on this item and open the floor for a motion 02:18:49.030 --> 02:18:50.159 or discussion 02:18:51.440 --> 02:19:00.040 Commissioner Beck okay I'm over this item great 02:19:00.159 --> 02:19:04.629 Commissioner Taylor okay we have a first and a second for 02:19:04.629 --> 02:19:06.079 approval any 02:19:06.079 --> 02:19:08.600 discussion 02:19:14.719 --> 02:19:19.000 I call for a vote on the board please 02:19:21.440 --> 02:19:37.399 motion carries 7-0 we'll move us to item E I'm going to 02:19:37.399 --> 02:19:38.520 open the public hearing 02:19:38.520 --> 02:19:45.670 for PDA 16 - 0 0 0 7 and call on Julie white for a 02:19:45.670 --> 02:19:48.600 presentation okay this time 02:19:48.600 --> 02:19:51.950 I am going to go through the whole presentation so all 02:19:51.950 --> 02:19:53.280 right this is PDA 02:19:53.280 --> 02:19:59.680 16 7 of Julie Wyatt I have summary slide on that one okay 02:19:59.680 --> 02:20:00.799 the request before you 02:20:00.799 --> 02:20:03.489 is to consider a recommendation to City Council regarding a 02:20:03.489 --> 02:20:04.159 detailed plan 02:20:04.159 --> 02:20:08.799 amendment for ropes and ranch PD 173 to permit the blending 02:20:08.799 --> 02:20:11.079 of residential uses 02:20:11.079 --> 02:20:14.790 the subject property is located on the north side of ropes 02:20:14.790 --> 02:20:17.120 and ranch Road it is 02:20:17.120 --> 02:20:22.739 west of I 35 W I'm just some background on planned 02:20:22.739 --> 02:20:24.879 developments in general and 02:20:24.879 --> 02:20:28.920 and ropes and ranch specifically PD 173 was developed under 02:20:28.920 --> 02:20:30.079 the 1991 02:20:30.079 --> 02:20:33.280 development code planned developments were a two-step 02:20:33.280 --> 02:20:35.120 process first the 02:20:35.120 --> 02:20:38.200 concept plan which was the general general guidelines of 02:20:38.200 --> 02:20:39.079 the development 02:20:39.079 --> 02:20:42.639 and also what land uses would have would be permitted ropes 02:20:42.639 --> 02:20:44.600 and ranch concept 02:20:44.600 --> 02:20:50.049 plan was approved in 1999 their proposal their intent was 02:20:50.049 --> 02:20:51.040 to emphasize 02:20:51.040 --> 02:20:55.209 flexibility and variety of housing options for an adult 02:20:55.209 --> 02:20:57.239 community and here 02:20:57.239 --> 02:21:00.209 we can look at the residential uses that were approved 02:21:00.209 --> 02:21:01.760 through that concept plan 02:21:01.760 --> 02:21:06.229 there were five single-family luxury single-family premiere 02:21:06.229 --> 02:21:07.200 and single-family 02:21:07.200 --> 02:21:11.969 casita all had the same permitted uses the differences in 02:21:11.969 --> 02:21:12.760 those three 02:21:12.760 --> 02:21:16.010 residential use categories were the minimum lot sizes as 02:21:16.010 --> 02:21:16.680 well as the 02:21:16.680 --> 02:21:21.250 minimum building square feet single-family Villa brought in 02:21:21.250 --> 02:21:22.000 two family 02:21:22.000 --> 02:21:26.170 attached dwellings but otherwise kept the same permitted 02:21:26.170 --> 02:21:27.440 uses and their 02:21:27.440 --> 02:21:31.000 minimum lot size was was smaller than than the other 02:21:31.000 --> 02:21:32.520 residential land use 02:21:32.520 --> 02:21:37.049 categories it also included multifamily to which allowed 02:21:37.049 --> 02:21:38.239 multifamily dwellings 02:21:38.239 --> 02:21:42.209 as well as community centers and nursing homes libraries 02:21:42.209 --> 02:21:43.440 that those sorts of 02:21:43.440 --> 02:21:48.840 elements so that that those residential land use categories 02:21:48.840 --> 02:21:49.799 were approved with 02:21:49.799 --> 02:21:54.270 the concept plan since that was approved a couple of detail 02:21:54.270 --> 02:21:55.680 plans have have been 02:21:55.680 --> 02:21:59.329 approved for ropes and ranch the one that's being amended 02:21:59.329 --> 02:22:00.959 now or proposed to 02:22:00.959 --> 02:22:06.079 be amended now is the most recent one approved in 2011 that 02:22:06.079 --> 02:22:07.159 detail plan 02:22:07.159 --> 02:22:11.229 provided for specific locations for each of the residential 02:22:11.229 --> 02:22:12.799 land use categories 02:22:12.799 --> 02:22:17.489 and we'll look at those this this land use plan was 02:22:17.489 --> 02:22:19.159 included with that detail 02:22:19.159 --> 02:22:24.120 plan and the yellow depicted the traditional lots the gray 02:22:24.120 --> 02:22:25.079 depicted the 02:22:25.079 --> 02:22:30.209 premier lots this light blue depicted the preserve lots and 02:22:30.209 --> 02:22:30.920 then down here 02:22:30.920 --> 02:22:34.360 were the the single-family villas those those duplex lots 02:22:34.360 --> 02:22:36.280 so each each of those 02:22:36.280 --> 02:22:41.709 uses had a specific location so due to changing market 02:22:41.709 --> 02:22:43.000 trends and and 02:22:43.000 --> 02:22:46.340 conditions on the site the applicant is proposing a change 02:22:46.340 --> 02:22:47.520 to that detail plan 02:22:47.520 --> 02:22:53.139 that change includes to permit the residential land use 02:22:53.139 --> 02:22:55.719 categories SFL, SFP, 02:22:55.719 --> 02:23:01.639 SFC and SFV with on all areas identified as residential use 02:23:01.639 --> 02:23:02.840 and we'll see that in 02:23:02.840 --> 02:23:07.200 a map in a second as far as the SFV which is the single- 02:23:07.200 --> 02:23:08.440 family villa which 02:23:08.440 --> 02:23:13.399 does permit the two-family attached they are proposing a 02:23:13.399 --> 02:23:15.639 maximum of 1200 of those 02:23:15.639 --> 02:23:21.440 throughout the development MF2 this this request does not 02:23:21.440 --> 02:23:23.879 permit MF2 it doesn't 02:23:23.879 --> 02:23:27.290 show depict a location for that if they did want to come if 02:23:27.290 --> 02:23:28.280 they did want to 02:23:28.280 --> 02:23:31.799 develop that that MF2 residential land use category they 02:23:31.799 --> 02:23:32.799 would have to do 02:23:32.799 --> 02:23:35.729 another detail plan amendment to show where that would go 02:23:35.729 --> 02:23:36.600 and how it how it 02:23:36.600 --> 02:23:41.129 would develop just to let you know this this request does 02:23:41.129 --> 02:23:42.360 not increase the 02:23:42.360 --> 02:23:45.790 total number of dwelling units that were approved with the 02:23:45.790 --> 02:23:48.440 2011 detail plan or 02:23:48.440 --> 02:23:53.159 the maximum density it just reallocates those residential 02:23:53.159 --> 02:23:54.799 uses and mixes them up 02:23:54.799 --> 02:23:59.579 within that residential use area and so they're proposing a 02:23:59.579 --> 02:24:01.000 change in the map 02:24:01.000 --> 02:24:04.559 that looks like this so the yellow is that residential use 02:24:04.559 --> 02:24:06.840 area and I know we 02:24:06.840 --> 02:24:10.030 talked in work session about what's actually developed in 02:24:10.030 --> 02:24:10.920 in this general 02:24:10.920 --> 02:24:14.520 area right here there's about a third you know about 1600 02:24:14.520 --> 02:24:15.159 homes have been 02:24:15.159 --> 02:24:17.750 developed out of the proposed you know little six 02:24:17.750 --> 02:24:21.239 approximately six thousand so 02:24:21.239 --> 02:24:26.430 so the the remaining residential use categories would be 02:24:26.430 --> 02:24:27.799 interspersed 02:24:27.799 --> 02:24:34.350 throughout the the balance of that development so the 1991 02:24:34.350 --> 02:24:35.840 code does have 02:24:35.840 --> 02:24:39.079 the criteria for approval of a detailed plan amendment and 02:24:39.079 --> 02:24:40.280 staff looked at that 02:24:40.280 --> 02:24:43.590 the first criteria that it complies with the general 02:24:43.590 --> 02:24:46.280 concept plan this proposed 02:24:46.280 --> 02:24:52.639 change does does meet that goal or that criteria that it 02:24:52.639 --> 02:24:54.280 permits flexibility 02:24:54.280 --> 02:24:58.809 within the residential land uses it also maintains the 02:24:58.809 --> 02:25:00.639 overall density and it's 02:25:00.639 --> 02:25:04.950 not introducing any new residential land use categories it 02:25:04.950 --> 02:25:06.959 's just furthering what 02:25:06.959 --> 02:25:10.149 what was approved with that concept plan the second 02:25:10.149 --> 02:25:11.079 criteria for approval 02:25:11.079 --> 02:25:14.829 provides a compatible arrangement of buildings and land 02:25:14.829 --> 02:25:15.639 uses that would not 02:25:15.639 --> 02:25:18.489 adversely affect adjoining neighborhoods or properties 02:25:18.489 --> 02:25:20.120 outside of the plan once 02:25:20.120 --> 02:25:23.340 again the proposed modification doesn't alter the permitted 02:25:23.340 --> 02:25:24.399 land uses or the low 02:25:24.399 --> 02:25:29.389 density residential land use pattern provides for adequate 02:25:29.389 --> 02:25:30.120 and safe 02:25:30.120 --> 02:25:33.399 circulation of vehicular traffic since there is not an 02:25:33.399 --> 02:25:34.760 increase in the total 02:25:34.760 --> 02:25:39.680 number of dwelling units there would not by extension 02:25:39.680 --> 02:25:41.399 necessarily be an increase 02:25:41.399 --> 02:25:44.829 in traffic and then in substantial compliance with the 02:25:44.829 --> 02:25:45.840 landscape sign 02:25:45.840 --> 02:25:48.750 subdivision and other regulations of the city and this 02:25:48.750 --> 02:25:49.959 proposal is in compliance 02:25:49.959 --> 02:25:56.069 with that so based upon this criteria staff does the detail 02:25:56.069 --> 02:25:57.040 plan does meet 02:25:57.040 --> 02:26:00.360 this criteria for approval there was a notification sent 02:26:00.360 --> 02:26:01.399 and I know I gave y'all 02:26:01.399 --> 02:26:05.989 a stack of letters we got quite a few these numbers are 02:26:05.989 --> 02:26:07.760 from noon today so I 02:26:07.760 --> 02:26:10.909 know you have more letters in your stack than is actually 02:26:10.909 --> 02:26:12.079 reflected in this in 02:26:12.079 --> 02:26:15.950 this presentation but we as of noon we received 13 in 02:26:15.950 --> 02:26:18.079 opposition 22 in favor and 02:26:18.079 --> 02:26:22.709 then eight neutral responses so based upon the criteria for 02:26:22.709 --> 02:26:24.959 approval and and 02:26:24.959 --> 02:26:27.450 the future land use staff does recommend approval of this 02:26:27.450 --> 02:26:29.159 request and I'll stand 02:26:29.159 --> 02:26:40.079 for any questions the applicant is here so he can answer 02:26:40.079 --> 02:26:44.600 thank you chair I'm 02:26:44.600 --> 02:26:48.000 just trying to understand the arithmetic here so there are 02:26:48.000 --> 02:26:49.719 approximately the is 02:26:49.719 --> 02:26:53.360 the 6,000 the limit or is there actually like some 6,000 in 02:26:53.360 --> 02:26:55.040 some change it's a 02:26:55.040 --> 02:26:59.309 good question the original concept plan approved 7,500 02:26:59.309 --> 02:27:01.040 homes subsequent detailed 02:27:01.040 --> 02:27:08.000 plans actually detailed out 6,000 and I don't have the 02:27:08.000 --> 02:27:09.000 exact number the 02:27:09.000 --> 02:27:15.280 applicant is here 6,300 or around the 6,000 mark they do 02:27:15.280 --> 02:27:19.200 have a a provision 02:27:19.200 --> 02:27:22.760 within the concept plan that allows them to increase the 02:27:22.760 --> 02:27:24.879 density by 5% without 02:27:24.879 --> 02:27:28.729 doing a new detail plan or some sort of approval by City 02:27:28.729 --> 02:27:30.360 Council so they could 02:27:30.360 --> 02:27:35.819 increase those approved lots that were approved in 2011 up 02:27:35.819 --> 02:27:37.760 to 5% anything over 02:27:37.760 --> 02:27:41.549 that would would require approval by City Council I did the 02:27:41.549 --> 02:27:42.600 math and I don't 02:27:42.600 --> 02:27:45.350 I didn't write it down but it I think it was around 300 02:27:45.350 --> 02:27:47.799 lots that they could go 02:27:47.799 --> 02:27:51.670 over that what was approved with that 2011 so let's say 6, 02:27:51.670 --> 02:27:53.760 600 as maybe that 02:27:53.760 --> 02:27:58.290 number is approximately 6,600 and 1,600 or so have been 02:27:58.290 --> 02:28:00.799 built and probably a 02:28:00.799 --> 02:28:03.959 few hundred more have been detail like detail plans have 02:28:03.959 --> 02:28:05.120 been finalized and 02:28:05.120 --> 02:28:11.870 basically been platted so so you've got about 4,500 or 4, 02:28:11.870 --> 02:28:14.159 800 potential future 02:28:14.159 --> 02:28:20.180 lots to be detailed out and these 1,200 new units would be 02:28:20.180 --> 02:28:23.079 all in those 4,800 02:28:23.079 --> 02:28:29.360 future lots yes sir and so I figure that these can be 02:28:29.360 --> 02:28:30.879 smaller lots like they can 02:28:30.879 --> 02:28:34.319 they can actually be physically smaller make 3,000 3,000 02:28:34.319 --> 02:28:34.959 square feet as opposed 02:28:34.959 --> 02:28:39.030 to 6 or 4 so in theory they could put more put them closer 02:28:39.030 --> 02:28:40.360 together yes sir but 02:28:40.360 --> 02:28:44.280 they could also put one of these villas on an 8,000 square 02:28:44.280 --> 02:28:45.440 foot there's no reason 02:28:45.440 --> 02:28:48.129 it doesn't say they have to be on a small lot correct they 02:28:48.129 --> 02:28:48.559 just have a 02:28:48.559 --> 02:28:51.649 minimum but even if they put them on the full-size lots in 02:28:51.649 --> 02:28:52.559 the detail plan 02:28:52.559 --> 02:28:55.149 they're gonna end up with five hundred and seventy because 02:28:55.149 --> 02:28:56.120 you're putting two 02:28:56.120 --> 02:28:59.479 units per lot you're gonna end up with an extra five 02:28:59.479 --> 02:29:01.159 hundred or so units does 02:29:01.159 --> 02:29:04.920 that mean they're going to add park space or space out the 02:29:04.920 --> 02:29:05.959 single family 02:29:05.959 --> 02:29:10.489 more like make everything lot and a half sized or something 02:29:10.489 --> 02:29:11.719 the applicant is here 02:29:11.719 --> 02:29:14.530 and I would call on him to answer how it's actually going 02:29:14.530 --> 02:29:15.600 to work in practice 02:29:15.600 --> 02:29:19.319 within their development because because yes this doesn't 02:29:19.319 --> 02:29:20.440 increase that six 02:29:20.440 --> 02:29:24.350 thousand so there will have to be a way to work that 02:29:24.350 --> 02:29:26.280 because they they have a 02:29:26.280 --> 02:29:30.420 space they're trying to fill so yes he's here is the 02:29:30.420 --> 02:29:31.479 applicant here would like to 02:29:31.479 --> 02:29:35.200 come forward and address some of these questions 02:29:38.200 --> 02:29:41.440 please state your name and address when you get to the mic 02:29:41.440 --> 02:29:42.360 Mr. Chairman members 02:29:42.360 --> 02:29:44.200 of the Commission my name is Todd Fitzgerald here 02:29:44.200 --> 02:29:45.120 representing Robson 02:29:45.120 --> 02:29:49.440 Ranch my address is 9666 East Riggs Road Sun Lakes Arizona 02:29:49.440 --> 02:29:51.280 85248 thank you 02:29:51.280 --> 02:29:54.430 appreciate your time and hearing us likewise of staff been 02:29:54.430 --> 02:29:55.079 very helpful 02:29:55.079 --> 02:29:57.920 working through this really it's a name of flexibility that 02:29:57.920 --> 02:29:58.719 were before you 02:29:58.719 --> 02:30:01.559 tonight requesting this change as Julie said not to restate 02:30:01.559 --> 02:30:02.479 all the same facts 02:30:02.479 --> 02:30:05.190 but not an increase in density not an additional product 02:30:05.190 --> 02:30:06.200 type or even a change 02:30:06.200 --> 02:30:09.629 to what was approved but flexibility to put it in place the 02:30:09.629 --> 02:30:11.399 real to answer your 02:30:11.399 --> 02:30:13.700 question more directly is typically our product sizes have 02:30:13.700 --> 02:30:14.600 been growing over the 02:30:14.600 --> 02:30:19.639 past say 10 to 15 years lot size although they're approved 02:30:19.639 --> 02:30:21.000 to be some 80 50 by 80 02:30:21.000 --> 02:30:24.190 feet have grown to be 60 by 110 each time and all of our 02:30:24.190 --> 02:30:25.120 series are growing 02:30:25.120 --> 02:30:28.120 maybe that's added to the creation of the need for this 02:30:28.120 --> 02:30:29.399 villa product and how 02:30:29.399 --> 02:30:32.110 it's being so well received we're seeing that our densities 02:30:32.110 --> 02:30:33.040 are dropping 02:30:33.040 --> 02:30:36.319 excuse me are dropping as a result of that lot size 02:30:36.319 --> 02:30:38.280 increase so I don't see it 02:30:38.280 --> 02:30:41.790 being a whole bunch of additional land nor units but a 02:30:41.790 --> 02:30:43.280 matter just blending 02:30:43.280 --> 02:30:46.190 what's available and how we offer it the trend being and 02:30:46.190 --> 02:30:47.360 again it's probably 02:30:47.360 --> 02:30:50.280 state the obvious but a 30 40 year build in our projects 02:30:50.280 --> 02:30:51.719 tend to see some 02:30:51.719 --> 02:30:54.409 patterns and what we're really seeking is the ability to 02:30:54.409 --> 02:30:55.280 react to them and 02:30:55.280 --> 02:30:58.469 react and get out front far enough to try to try to spot 02:30:58.469 --> 02:30:59.840 some things coming and 02:30:59.840 --> 02:31:02.989 make a move in time to be have it available rather than be 02:31:02.989 --> 02:31:04.719 on our heels so 02:31:04.719 --> 02:31:08.270 it sounds like what you what you might end up doing is the 02:31:08.270 --> 02:31:09.520 villas might be on 02:31:09.520 --> 02:31:15.020 fairly small lots but then the average size of the the SFL 02:31:15.020 --> 02:31:17.399 SFP FFC might get a 02:31:17.399 --> 02:31:20.159 little bit bigger basically kind of absorb that extra space 02:31:20.159 --> 02:31:20.680 that is what 02:31:20.680 --> 02:31:23.200 has happened correct and the villas also have been we've 02:31:23.200 --> 02:31:24.719 been offering as a pod 02:31:24.719 --> 02:31:28.850 kind of a neighborhood within the community itself and with 02:31:28.850 --> 02:31:29.520 it some open 02:31:29.520 --> 02:31:32.110 space and some area where the other smaller lots and 02:31:32.110 --> 02:31:33.520 smaller backyards not 02:31:33.520 --> 02:31:36.370 maintained the lock and leave has been a big success for us 02:31:36.370 --> 02:31:37.239 and that's how we've 02:31:37.239 --> 02:31:39.690 been marketing them but then an open spacing behind it such 02:31:39.690 --> 02:31:40.440 that there isn't 02:31:40.440 --> 02:31:43.129 somebody else right there if it was to be put at minimum 02:31:43.129 --> 02:31:44.280 setback minimum setback 02:31:44.280 --> 02:31:47.360 they wouldn't be right on top of each other so that's also 02:31:47.360 --> 02:31:48.159 using up some of 02:31:48.159 --> 02:31:51.239 that same land if that answer your question yeah and I had 02:31:51.239 --> 02:31:52.120 there was a few 02:31:52.120 --> 02:31:54.329 more questions that came up in the work session I guess I 02:31:54.329 --> 02:31:55.200 'll go and bring it now 02:31:55.200 --> 02:32:01.430 the generally in our in in like our standard zoning 02:32:01.430 --> 02:32:02.440 neighborhood residential 02:32:02.440 --> 02:32:06.969 type zoning we strongly discourage mixing duplexes just in 02:32:06.969 --> 02:32:08.040 innate like you 02:32:08.040 --> 02:32:11.709 will usually have this street over here will be duplexes 02:32:11.709 --> 02:32:13.639 not a duplex single 02:32:13.639 --> 02:32:16.809 family duplex you know mixed in in the block right and I 02:32:16.809 --> 02:32:17.600 think that's one 02:32:17.600 --> 02:32:20.040 concern that was that was a brought up in the work session 02:32:20.040 --> 02:32:22.600 this even goes into 02:32:22.600 --> 02:32:26.770 the already built properties and says that duplexes could 02:32:26.770 --> 02:32:27.840 go in you know if 02:32:27.840 --> 02:32:30.530 house burned down or something somebody demolished in 02:32:30.530 --> 02:32:31.680 theory they could even go 02:32:31.680 --> 02:32:35.190 in and build the villa in you know in between two existing 02:32:35.190 --> 02:32:36.680 single-family homes 02:32:36.680 --> 02:32:41.399 that's that's counter to like I said a lot of our 02:32:41.399 --> 02:32:42.719 neighborhood residential type 02:32:42.719 --> 02:32:48.840 zoning where we would have some kind of separation between 02:32:48.840 --> 02:32:51.559 the the density and if 02:32:51.559 --> 02:32:54.450 I can speak to that and our goal is the same they don't 02:32:54.450 --> 02:32:56.319 work well kind of lot by 02:32:56.319 --> 02:32:59.239 lot but more as a pot in the lot depths and dimensions the 02:32:59.239 --> 02:33:00.239 rear lot lines would 02:33:00.239 --> 02:33:03.760 be staggered the streetscape wouldn't look it's better to 02:33:03.760 --> 02:33:04.559 be planned together 02:33:04.559 --> 02:33:07.170 and we landscape it together and it's on one system one 02:33:07.170 --> 02:33:08.399 landscape system that's 02:33:08.399 --> 02:33:11.790 operated by an HOA and a separate HOA in fact and it has to 02:33:11.790 --> 02:33:13.600 kind of work the way 02:33:13.600 --> 02:33:16.389 we've always offered it anyway it has to work as one 02:33:16.389 --> 02:33:18.680 complete unit community not 02:33:18.680 --> 02:33:22.200 to not a big house next to a small one if that's you have 02:33:22.200 --> 02:33:23.399 to kind of sound at 02:33:23.399 --> 02:33:26.090 what you're saying in terms of the existing plats I would 02:33:26.090 --> 02:33:27.200 think the plot 02:33:27.200 --> 02:33:31.290 I'm a bit getting out of my belly wick but excuse me the 02:33:31.290 --> 02:33:33.000 plot sets out the terms 02:33:33.000 --> 02:33:34.959 of what would be allowed and what minimums and dimensions 02:33:34.959 --> 02:33:35.520 would be allowed 02:33:35.520 --> 02:33:38.209 and I would I would think a villa wouldn't wouldn't be 02:33:38.209 --> 02:33:39.159 allowed within that 02:33:39.159 --> 02:33:42.549 unless it was just a smaller house if somebody tore it down 02:33:42.549 --> 02:33:43.399 and wanted to 02:33:43.399 --> 02:33:46.209 start again but yeah I believe so you wouldn't be able to 02:33:46.209 --> 02:33:47.959 cut a lot in half or 02:33:47.959 --> 02:33:50.200 something like that without if it's been plotted but you 02:33:50.200 --> 02:33:52.440 could most likely build 02:33:52.440 --> 02:33:56.530 a if you had a house that burned down or was demolished you 02:33:56.530 --> 02:33:58.840 could then build one 02:33:58.840 --> 02:34:02.350 of the villas is that correct a duplex type home anywhere 02:34:02.350 --> 02:34:05.399 in the yellow maybe 02:34:05.399 --> 02:34:10.639 Julie can just per the proposal as long as it doesn't 02:34:10.639 --> 02:34:12.239 exceed that the maximum 02:34:12.239 --> 02:34:17.920 number of villas of 1200 or 12 villa dwelling units of 1200 02:34:17.920 --> 02:34:18.600 they could it 02:34:18.600 --> 02:34:24.329 could go anywhere within the development for the zoning if 02:34:24.329 --> 02:34:25.719 I can just tag on to 02:34:25.719 --> 02:34:29.000 the end of that I think a single villa sometimes there's 02:34:29.000 --> 02:34:29.920 there's not an ability 02:34:29.920 --> 02:34:33.190 to get it to two of them together but it'd be enough space 02:34:33.190 --> 02:34:34.479 for one so it'd be 02:34:34.479 --> 02:34:37.559 a single lot still called a villa but but not with a common 02:34:37.559 --> 02:34:39.000 wall I don't think 02:34:39.000 --> 02:34:42.469 a common wall would be possible in a typical plat with a 02:34:42.469 --> 02:34:44.520 created lot a single 02:34:44.520 --> 02:34:47.280 building maybe of that same side with two side setbacks 02:34:47.280 --> 02:34:48.360 would be provisioned 02:34:48.360 --> 02:34:53.209 for but I don't see it to be possible to have a duplex that 02:34:53.209 --> 02:34:56.319 makes sense a couple 02:34:56.319 --> 02:34:59.879 more questions for you Commissioner Ellis thank you chair 02:34:59.879 --> 02:35:02.000 good evening there's a 02:35:02.000 --> 02:35:04.209 lot of talk about the villas obviously because there's a 02:35:04.209 --> 02:35:05.079 tremendous increase 02:35:05.079 --> 02:35:08.920 from the original plan obviously you you have seen in 02:35:08.920 --> 02:35:11.760 demand for this product how 02:35:11.760 --> 02:35:15.200 is the villa counted as a unit it does have a common wall 02:35:15.200 --> 02:35:16.799 so it's two 02:35:16.799 --> 02:35:20.969 residences in in a villa correct to homeowners to a 02:35:20.969 --> 02:35:22.399 building is that one 02:35:22.399 --> 02:35:26.079 unit or is it two units - so it's separate separate 02:35:26.079 --> 02:35:28.440 ownership so it's two 02:35:28.440 --> 02:35:35.409 units so we are increasing the amount of people if we're 02:35:35.409 --> 02:35:38.079 increasing the villas so 02:35:38.079 --> 02:35:41.659 we're not increasing the units but if a villa counts as two 02:35:41.659 --> 02:35:42.280 units we're 02:35:42.280 --> 02:35:45.829 definitely increasing the population correct but by not 02:35:45.829 --> 02:35:47.079 adding for our part 02:35:47.079 --> 02:35:50.370 by not adding to any of the maximum densities within what 02:35:50.370 --> 02:35:51.239 was approved I 02:35:51.239 --> 02:35:55.600 think the number is 6037 of that detail plan and then that 02:35:55.600 --> 02:35:56.639 five percent slot by 02:35:56.639 --> 02:35:59.639 not extending that we recognize and acknowledge that we 02:35:59.639 --> 02:36:00.760 wouldn't be there 02:36:00.760 --> 02:36:03.639 would be no new people beyond what was provisioned for 02:36:03.639 --> 02:36:05.559 previously spread around 02:36:05.559 --> 02:36:08.870 differently and adjusted but not within the community not 02:36:08.870 --> 02:36:10.000 an increase in density 02:36:10.000 --> 02:36:13.040 there would not be even with a jump like that 02:36:13.040 --> 02:36:18.170 actually okay and something you don't have any single vill 02:36:18.170 --> 02:36:18.879 as around the 02:36:18.879 --> 02:36:22.569 neighborhood now are they all in clusters now they are yeah 02:36:22.569 --> 02:36:22.959 we've only 02:36:22.959 --> 02:36:26.469 ever done on a plot subdivision basis you know one of the 02:36:26.469 --> 02:36:27.920 unit 47 is a recent 02:36:27.920 --> 02:36:31.840 one that is all villas in fact the only one today but it's 02:36:31.840 --> 02:36:33.200 together and with 02:36:33.200 --> 02:36:36.180 final plat with dedications and spells out the terms of how 02:36:36.180 --> 02:36:36.760 it will be 02:36:36.760 --> 02:36:40.709 maintained and how it's different than a typical one and is 02:36:40.709 --> 02:36:42.079 your future plan to 02:36:42.079 --> 02:36:45.760 go along with how you've been building them in pods like 02:36:45.760 --> 02:36:47.360 that accurate yes a 02:36:47.360 --> 02:36:51.479 separate pod per subdivision that would how many are in a 02:36:51.479 --> 02:36:52.799 pod and just by 02:36:52.799 --> 02:36:56.229 phasing that it's not a predetermined amount this is part 02:36:56.229 --> 02:36:56.799 of the flexibility 02:36:56.799 --> 02:36:59.879 we're seeking to see if if it continues to be successful 02:36:59.879 --> 02:37:01.239 and maybe that those 02:37:01.239 --> 02:37:04.579 pod sizes look one way if it's maybe backs off a little bit 02:37:04.579 --> 02:37:05.520 a smaller bite 02:37:05.520 --> 02:37:08.360 would make more sense and we get into this stuff like 02:37:08.360 --> 02:37:09.239 bouncing the dirt and 02:37:09.239 --> 02:37:12.000 the roads and the sewer and water and some of the feasible 02:37:12.000 --> 02:37:14.159 issues that plane 02:37:14.159 --> 02:37:18.149 of those decisions as well as demand okay thank you thank 02:37:18.149 --> 02:37:19.719 you follow up on 02:37:19.719 --> 02:37:24.979 Commissioner Ellis's question if you're changing units we 02:37:24.979 --> 02:37:25.959 're looking at the map 02:37:25.959 --> 02:37:31.680 or the chart we have here essentially a villa is a duplex 02:37:31.680 --> 02:37:33.200 so you have could have 02:37:33.200 --> 02:37:36.280 two family units where you would have had a single family 02:37:36.280 --> 02:37:38.040 unit it's one 02:37:38.040 --> 02:37:41.389 structure but it's actually for two family units and I 02:37:41.389 --> 02:37:42.520 understand that 02:37:42.520 --> 02:37:46.870 correctly basically yes so so you are I think in fact 02:37:46.870 --> 02:37:48.799 increasing the number of 02:37:48.799 --> 02:37:51.629 family units that can go out there even though it may be 02:37:51.629 --> 02:37:53.639 structure wise the same 02:37:53.639 --> 02:37:57.790 footprint but you have two families in a single residence 02:37:57.790 --> 02:37:59.600 versus one and they're 02:37:59.600 --> 02:38:04.649 my understanding her point maybe I'm confusing it Ted that 02:38:04.649 --> 02:38:05.280 is accurate what 02:38:05.280 --> 02:38:08.489 you're saying however with the overall looking at a project 02:38:08.489 --> 02:38:09.559 -wide PD or detail 02:38:09.559 --> 02:38:13.120 plan basis there would be two of those locally more so but 02:38:13.120 --> 02:38:14.280 not more than the 02:38:14.280 --> 02:38:19.280 same 6037 plus or minus anything within a five percent 02:38:19.280 --> 02:38:20.799 increase but no more 02:38:20.799 --> 02:38:25.159 beyond that maybe used used more so in one area the other 02:38:25.159 --> 02:38:26.200 but not for an 02:38:26.200 --> 02:38:29.639 increase overall we're also seeing him with back to the 02:38:29.639 --> 02:38:30.959 increase in lot sizes 02:38:30.959 --> 02:38:33.290 and the north part of the project that hasn't yet been 02:38:33.290 --> 02:38:34.399 developed is a lot more 02:38:34.399 --> 02:38:38.370 relief a lot more hilly so to even achieve the as approved 02:38:38.370 --> 02:38:39.520 lot sizes which 02:38:39.520 --> 02:38:42.600 are smaller than what we're using now the yields are we're 02:38:42.600 --> 02:38:43.600 seeing less yield 02:38:43.600 --> 02:38:46.819 just to just to continue it through our plans in two 02:38:46.819 --> 02:38:48.840 dimensions look one way but 02:38:48.840 --> 02:38:53.520 once you get on site it's some other challenges so that's 02:38:53.520 --> 02:38:54.799 what that's how I 02:38:54.799 --> 02:38:57.879 mean locally there might be an increase in that there's two 02:38:57.879 --> 02:39:00.079 side-by-side on what 02:39:00.079 --> 02:39:03.350 would be one building per se not an overall increase so 02:39:03.350 --> 02:39:04.840 what your point is 02:39:04.840 --> 02:39:09.309 is that although commissioners health else's point is 02:39:09.309 --> 02:39:10.760 correct that you have 02:39:10.760 --> 02:39:14.559 more density being family units there what you're actually 02:39:14.559 --> 02:39:15.639 building is the 02:39:15.639 --> 02:39:19.399 other lots are getting larger and so your point is some 02:39:19.399 --> 02:39:20.760 things are smaller 02:39:20.760 --> 02:39:24.309 and more dense but your other products are actually getting 02:39:24.309 --> 02:39:25.319 larger and less 02:39:25.319 --> 02:39:28.809 dense and so in your opinion it ends up being essentially 02:39:28.809 --> 02:39:29.840 the same density 02:39:29.840 --> 02:39:34.149 overall on a project basis but individually in small areas 02:39:34.149 --> 02:39:34.879 you may have 02:39:34.879 --> 02:39:37.090 areas that are way more dense than what was originally 02:39:37.090 --> 02:39:38.040 proposed and you may have 02:39:38.040 --> 02:39:40.530 some areas that are less dense because of the increase in 02:39:40.530 --> 02:39:41.559 the loss size that a 02:39:41.559 --> 02:39:44.750 fair characterization of what you're describing yes sir 02:39:44.750 --> 02:39:45.239 that's essentially 02:39:45.239 --> 02:39:48.030 correct the other the addition of open space within the 02:39:48.030 --> 02:39:49.200 villa units is the 02:39:49.200 --> 02:39:52.100 other thing that would offset that slightly from looking at 02:39:52.100 --> 02:39:52.719 minimum lot 02:39:52.719 --> 02:39:56.370 sizes and if a minimum was 30 feet wide by 100 feet depth 02:39:56.370 --> 02:39:57.879 those are the two rigid 02:39:57.879 --> 02:40:00.780 dimensions our width has got to be 45 wide it just felt 02:40:00.780 --> 02:40:01.840 better it meets for 02:40:01.840 --> 02:40:04.110 better straight scene and still sticking with 100 feet 02:40:04.110 --> 02:40:05.159 because that's a rigid 02:40:05.159 --> 02:40:07.989 requirement so it's already quite a bit larger in size and 02:40:07.989 --> 02:40:09.079 then additional open 02:40:09.079 --> 02:40:12.569 space within the unit that somehow offsets those numbers 02:40:12.569 --> 02:40:13.959 additionally okay 02:40:13.959 --> 02:40:19.879 several more questions here Commissioner Sullivan yes my 02:40:19.879 --> 02:40:21.200 concern is that this is 02:40:21.200 --> 02:40:26.149 a master plan development as they call it and yet I don't 02:40:26.149 --> 02:40:27.399 see where it's being 02:40:27.399 --> 02:40:32.670 planned so that everybody knows what it is they're buying 02:40:32.670 --> 02:40:34.959 into nobody knows 02:40:34.959 --> 02:40:38.040 where those villas are going to be so that when they buy 02:40:38.040 --> 02:40:39.120 their lot and right 02:40:39.120 --> 02:40:43.229 now they're saying that the build out is about 12 months so 02:40:43.229 --> 02:40:44.680 within that 12 month 02:40:44.680 --> 02:40:48.389 period all of a sudden y'all could decide let's put in a 02:40:48.389 --> 02:40:51.079 row of duplexes in 02:40:51.079 --> 02:40:54.069 the same neighborhood in the same on the same street so 02:40:54.069 --> 02:40:55.799 that the people who bought 02:40:55.799 --> 02:40:58.409 a year ago they don't know what's going to be going in 02:40:58.409 --> 02:41:00.360 there and I think that's 02:41:00.360 --> 02:41:04.280 a cause of concern you're talking about the size of lots 02:41:04.280 --> 02:41:06.360 increasing in fact 02:41:06.360 --> 02:41:09.250 originally when you go through and you look at some of the 02:41:09.250 --> 02:41:10.319 older homes that are 02:41:10.319 --> 02:41:14.600 out there those are on much larger lots than the houses 02:41:14.600 --> 02:41:15.399 that have been built in 02:41:15.399 --> 02:41:20.600 the last year mine being one of them my lot is much smaller 02:41:20.600 --> 02:41:22.159 than the lots on the 02:41:22.159 --> 02:41:26.690 on the east side of ropes and I call big ed road ropes and 02:41:26.690 --> 02:41:29.879 boulevard and so that 02:41:29.879 --> 02:41:34.350 I'm concerned that that when you start looking at the lot 02:41:34.350 --> 02:41:35.680 sizes and what you're 02:41:35.680 --> 02:41:38.760 going to be putting there if you said earlier that behind 02:41:38.760 --> 02:41:39.879 the villas would be 02:41:39.879 --> 02:41:45.559 green spaces and so forth I'm already seeing roads that are 02:41:45.559 --> 02:41:46.239 being cut through 02:41:46.239 --> 02:41:50.290 so that I don't understand how you're going to be able to 02:41:50.290 --> 02:41:51.639 carve out the green 02:41:51.639 --> 02:41:55.079 spaces in an area where there may have been houses planned 02:41:55.079 --> 02:41:56.120 to begin with you 02:41:56.120 --> 02:41:58.889 know decide to change it to a villa and so I'm just I'm 02:41:58.889 --> 02:42:00.280 just I'm concerned that 02:42:00.280 --> 02:42:02.979 people are they're not going to know what they're buying 02:42:02.979 --> 02:42:04.799 into and and I don't 02:42:04.799 --> 02:42:07.729 know why y'all can't just say well in this area we're going 02:42:07.729 --> 02:42:08.639 to have you know 02:42:08.639 --> 02:42:12.540 villas here or over here or at least the possibility of 02:42:12.540 --> 02:42:14.479 villas being in this area 02:42:14.479 --> 02:42:17.430 or that area so that if somebody says I don't want to take 02:42:17.430 --> 02:42:19.120 the chance they buy a 02:42:19.120 --> 02:42:21.370 lot that's a little bit further away than and where you 02:42:21.370 --> 02:42:22.319 know where y'all might 02:42:22.319 --> 02:42:27.670 be having the option of putting a villa a couple of 02:42:27.670 --> 02:42:29.120 thoughts thanks for the 02:42:29.120 --> 02:42:32.489 comments I'm a bit confused in terms of the lot sizes I'm 02:42:32.489 --> 02:42:33.319 not sure how old 02:42:33.319 --> 02:42:36.170 your the light you bought was but I'm comparing it to what 02:42:36.170 --> 02:42:37.120 was approved the 02:42:37.120 --> 02:42:41.139 concept plan and then the minimums every product has 02:42:41.139 --> 02:42:43.559 exceeded that maybe maybe 02:42:43.559 --> 02:42:45.770 you bought after that happened my point was that the 02:42:45.770 --> 02:42:47.440 original density provision 02:42:47.440 --> 02:42:50.639 for was a bit the basis of it was those smaller lot sizes 02:42:50.639 --> 02:42:52.520 that we've not held to 02:42:52.520 --> 02:42:56.790 does that answer that I'm ten feet from my neighbor and I 02:42:56.790 --> 02:42:58.479 know a lot of people 02:42:58.479 --> 02:43:02.059 over there that are 20 feet from their neighbor or 30 feet 02:43:02.059 --> 02:43:02.680 from their neighbor 02:43:02.680 --> 02:43:08.340 so that the lot the lots are smaller now than what they 02:43:08.340 --> 02:43:10.799 were I guess the only way 02:43:10.799 --> 02:43:13.139 could explain is a possible market twist and turn that that 02:43:13.139 --> 02:43:13.920 was an effort out of 02:43:13.920 --> 02:43:20.000 marketing bigger lots at the time where it was coming from 02:43:20.000 --> 02:43:21.719 I'm just saying that 02:43:21.719 --> 02:43:26.909 that if if it's a master plan development then plan it for 02:43:26.909 --> 02:43:27.719 the future 02:43:27.719 --> 02:43:31.260 so people know when they buy what is going to be in and 02:43:31.260 --> 02:43:32.799 around them you know 02:43:32.799 --> 02:43:36.129 it's it's like somebody building a house and they have this 02:43:36.129 --> 02:43:37.200 great green space 02:43:37.200 --> 02:43:41.159 behind them not knowing that that's FM 2499 and so all of a 02:43:41.159 --> 02:43:42.040 sudden they have a 02:43:42.040 --> 02:43:44.920 major thoroughfare coming in behind and so the same thing 02:43:44.920 --> 02:43:45.920 here is if they think 02:43:45.920 --> 02:43:49.079 it's a single-family development all of a sudden down the 02:43:49.079 --> 02:43:50.200 street there may be 02:43:50.200 --> 02:43:54.010 duplexes the lock and leaves where maybe people aren't 02:43:54.010 --> 02:43:55.040 there half half of the 02:43:55.040 --> 02:43:58.489 year and so that's not the same type of a neighbor as a 02:43:58.489 --> 02:44:00.559 regular neighborhood 02:44:00.559 --> 02:44:03.500 understood that's that's my concern I guess to our end and 02:44:03.500 --> 02:44:04.520 that's a concern of 02:44:04.520 --> 02:44:07.879 ours as well and at the time of contract signing there's a 02:44:07.879 --> 02:44:08.799 quite a bit of 02:44:08.799 --> 02:44:11.530 disclosure and paperwork and here's what's coming up and I 02:44:11.530 --> 02:44:12.280 believe within 02:44:12.280 --> 02:44:14.889 that outlines the flexibility within the PD and and the 02:44:14.889 --> 02:44:15.959 need to react to these 02:44:15.959 --> 02:44:19.239 kind of changes and and it's probably amplified more so I'm 02:44:19.239 --> 02:44:19.840 going to say 40 02:44:19.840 --> 02:44:23.639 years not knowing the real answer but with that kind of 02:44:23.639 --> 02:44:25.239 duration I think this 02:44:25.239 --> 02:44:28.319 probably is an example of us trying to say this is it this 02:44:28.319 --> 02:44:29.559 one here will do and 02:44:29.559 --> 02:44:33.209 then and that will get us there realizing now fast forward 02:44:33.209 --> 02:44:34.399 10-15 years 02:44:34.399 --> 02:44:37.600 that it's just not and we're seeing these demands and in 02:44:37.600 --> 02:44:38.680 order to avoid the 02:44:38.680 --> 02:44:41.629 same fate where we would go and pick another spot or two 02:44:41.629 --> 02:44:42.639 and find out that 02:44:42.639 --> 02:44:45.360 another twist took us into larger areas or golf courses or 02:44:45.360 --> 02:44:46.399 something else that 02:44:46.399 --> 02:44:48.950 left this thing as an island that we can't achieve or two 02:44:48.950 --> 02:44:50.040 points of access or 02:44:50.040 --> 02:44:52.729 there isn't sewer locally those are the kind of constraints 02:44:52.729 --> 02:44:53.959 I guess that we're 02:44:53.959 --> 02:44:57.250 focused on with this request but but in terms of planning 02:44:57.250 --> 02:44:58.600 it out the pod by pod 02:44:58.600 --> 02:45:02.319 basis is how we address that and then try to avoid any of 02:45:02.319 --> 02:45:03.360 those scenarios where 02:45:03.360 --> 02:45:07.530 someone wasn't where or didn't didn't know what was coming 02:45:07.530 --> 02:45:09.280 thank you 02:45:09.280 --> 02:45:13.639 Commissioner Roselle thank you for being here I have a 02:45:13.639 --> 02:45:15.639 couple thoughts as well as 02:45:15.639 --> 02:45:19.989 hopefully a question that you might be able to provide some 02:45:19.989 --> 02:45:22.000 insight to first I 02:45:22.000 --> 02:45:25.129 appreciate you talking about the flexibility and the market 02:45:25.129 --> 02:45:25.680 needs for 02:45:25.680 --> 02:45:29.420 that and and because when I looked at a map of yellow it it 02:45:29.420 --> 02:45:30.079 definitely was 02:45:30.079 --> 02:45:32.770 intimidating just think that there's going to be a free-for 02:45:32.770 --> 02:45:33.360 -all but if I 02:45:33.360 --> 02:45:37.719 understand this correctly there's 6037 units yes there will 02:45:37.719 --> 02:45:38.920 never be more that's 02:45:38.920 --> 02:45:43.280 a cap right it is but for a potential for five percent 02:45:43.280 --> 02:45:45.079 density increase so 02:45:45.079 --> 02:45:49.420 so they're there besides the five percent there's not gonna 02:45:49.420 --> 02:45:49.920 be an increase 02:45:49.920 --> 02:45:52.309 in units families or whatever I know that was the point 02:45:52.309 --> 02:45:53.280 earlier but there's 02:45:53.280 --> 02:45:56.840 going to be six thousand ish units how that's divided up is 02:45:56.840 --> 02:45:57.360 obviously the 02:45:57.360 --> 02:46:01.209 question when I was reading through a lot of these letters 02:46:01.209 --> 02:46:02.120 which I appreciate 02:46:02.120 --> 02:46:05.510 those sitting them in it's very helpful for us it seemed 02:46:05.510 --> 02:46:07.760 like there's three if I 02:46:07.760 --> 02:46:10.510 could categorize the oppositions there was kind of three 02:46:10.510 --> 02:46:12.399 things that I felt was 02:46:12.399 --> 02:46:17.729 repeating one was a basic sense of ropes are yeah ropes and 02:46:17.729 --> 02:46:18.479 ranches kind of 02:46:18.479 --> 02:46:21.190 autonomy and controlled to do as you wish there's I can 02:46:21.190 --> 02:46:22.680 sort of that there's 02:46:22.680 --> 02:46:26.120 concern of aesthetics in terms of what a villa looks like 02:46:26.120 --> 02:46:27.639 cosmetically and the 02:46:27.639 --> 02:46:30.719 third one is what we've been talking about is density I've 02:46:30.719 --> 02:46:31.879 heard in work 02:46:31.879 --> 02:46:34.979 session and then tonight you mentioned the idea of lock and 02:46:34.979 --> 02:46:36.920 leave can can you 02:46:36.920 --> 02:46:40.000 help me walk through the habits of that potential 02:46:40.000 --> 02:46:41.719 demographic are they solely 02:46:41.719 --> 02:46:45.280 buying or predominantly buying the villas and then in terms 02:46:45.280 --> 02:46:46.159 of density are 02:46:46.159 --> 02:46:49.159 they not there half the year would is the traffic of those 02:46:49.159 --> 02:46:49.879 individuals 02:46:49.879 --> 02:46:52.459 compensated by them just not being there I'm trying to 02:46:52.459 --> 02:46:53.680 understand how villas 02:46:53.680 --> 02:46:57.440 actually play into density if they're these lock and leave 02:46:57.440 --> 02:46:58.360 type clients can you 02:46:58.360 --> 02:47:01.600 help me out with their patterns I guess the the shortest 02:47:01.600 --> 02:47:02.559 answer is we're still 02:47:02.559 --> 02:47:06.360 learning having done one unit of 63 maybe we spotted a few 02:47:06.360 --> 02:47:07.360 patterns and then 02:47:07.360 --> 02:47:09.270 we're still trying we're eager to see if that's going to 02:47:09.270 --> 02:47:10.159 continue or not whether 02:47:10.159 --> 02:47:13.870 it's someone part-time resident snowbird or what have you 02:47:13.870 --> 02:47:15.799 maybe a widow someone 02:47:15.799 --> 02:47:19.840 that doesn't one partner the other passes and home 02:47:19.840 --> 02:47:20.639 maintenance becomes an issue 02:47:20.639 --> 02:47:22.850 and then this type of product will lend itself more to that 02:47:22.850 --> 02:47:23.479 kind of scenario 02:47:23.479 --> 02:47:26.170 now honestly I don't I don't really have any rigid answer 02:47:26.170 --> 02:47:27.000 in terms of what 02:47:27.000 --> 02:47:30.399 percentage if there are any patterns that are so defined 02:47:30.399 --> 02:47:33.600 but we're seeing in 02:47:33.600 --> 02:47:36.360 terms of the density I don't think we've had any that are 02:47:36.360 --> 02:47:37.399 so high just because of 02:47:37.399 --> 02:47:39.899 the usual planning constraints where they just don't have 02:47:39.899 --> 02:47:41.680 enough room for so 02:47:41.680 --> 02:47:44.159 many lots before you run out of street and then add an open 02:47:44.159 --> 02:47:45.000 space behind them 02:47:45.000 --> 02:47:48.440 that it I guess it made sound uglier than I think it is in 02:47:48.440 --> 02:47:49.600 practice how it 02:47:49.600 --> 02:47:52.360 plays out and how it really feels like a nice neighborhood 02:47:52.360 --> 02:47:53.239 we're proud of it 02:47:53.239 --> 02:47:56.610 we've gotten a lot of positive feedback the street scene is 02:47:56.610 --> 02:47:58.559 it looks good it's 02:47:58.559 --> 02:48:02.100 there's no question though there are several different 02:48:02.100 --> 02:48:03.319 lines of product we 02:48:03.319 --> 02:48:06.559 offer and there's everybody likes something different and 02:48:06.559 --> 02:48:07.159 that's what 02:48:07.159 --> 02:48:10.799 we're trying to fander to so continuing with that and I 02:48:10.799 --> 02:48:11.680 appreciate that the 02:48:11.680 --> 02:48:13.989 candidness I just didn't know if there's when you're doing 02:48:13.989 --> 02:48:14.959 marketing campaigns 02:48:14.959 --> 02:48:17.670 this lock and leave there's actually like this half and 02:48:17.670 --> 02:48:18.719 half or they come 02:48:18.719 --> 02:48:21.120 down here for three months they leave for three months 02:48:21.120 --> 02:48:22.120 during our terrible 02:48:22.120 --> 02:48:24.809 summers or however that worked I didn't know that one of 02:48:24.809 --> 02:48:26.040 the things that was 02:48:26.040 --> 02:48:28.659 brought up by Commissioner Ellis and Commissioner Sullivan 02:48:28.659 --> 02:48:29.399 as well as some of 02:48:29.399 --> 02:48:34.059 the letters that we received was this idea of your freedom 02:48:34.059 --> 02:48:35.280 to build ad hoc 02:48:35.280 --> 02:48:39.299 wherever whenever and the the I guess the insecurity of 02:48:39.299 --> 02:48:40.959 someone purchasing a 02:48:40.959 --> 02:48:44.569 lot putting their harder money to build and then across the 02:48:44.569 --> 02:48:45.159 street is one of 02:48:45.159 --> 02:48:50.799 these pods that pop up is there any mechanism to provide or 02:48:50.799 --> 02:48:52.200 let them know 02:48:52.200 --> 02:48:56.909 lead time or that purchase say in a radius that the plans 02:48:56.909 --> 02:48:58.639 going forward I'm 02:48:58.639 --> 02:49:01.500 trying to understand if there's a way to protect some of 02:49:01.500 --> 02:49:02.639 the residents going 02:49:02.639 --> 02:49:05.770 forward because I'm generally in favor of the flexibility I 02:49:05.770 --> 02:49:06.440 think that that 02:49:06.440 --> 02:49:09.840 resonates with me but I also understand the concern of this 02:49:09.840 --> 02:49:11.319 unknown in terms 02:49:11.319 --> 02:49:14.209 of protecting the asset that they're invested in so have 02:49:14.209 --> 02:49:15.000 you thought about 02:49:15.000 --> 02:49:17.829 that is there any options on the table for that we have and 02:49:17.829 --> 02:49:19.120 in addition to the 02:49:19.120 --> 02:49:21.590 same type of packet we want to circulate up front to say 02:49:21.590 --> 02:49:23.120 that these are in 02:49:23.120 --> 02:49:26.010 master plan community together with flexibility together 02:49:26.010 --> 02:49:26.799 with different 02:49:26.799 --> 02:49:29.489 amenities and all the kind of things that come with that 02:49:29.489 --> 02:49:31.120 back to the pod by 02:49:31.120 --> 02:49:34.829 pod bases we wouldn't want to do on one side of the street 02:49:34.829 --> 02:49:36.239 or other and when we 02:49:36.239 --> 02:49:37.840 built the street we wouldn't be able to stub in sewer 02:49:37.840 --> 02:49:38.639 services because they're 02:49:38.639 --> 02:49:42.510 different lot sizes it kind of lends itself to closing in a 02:49:42.510 --> 02:49:43.680 bank of streets 02:49:43.680 --> 02:49:46.250 and together with the doubly loaded streets so there would 02:49:46.250 --> 02:49:46.920 be the rear of 02:49:46.920 --> 02:49:49.250 someone's lot together with the open space that we've been 02:49:49.250 --> 02:49:50.079 building into this 02:49:50.079 --> 02:49:53.229 product just to provide for the aesthetics and the liv 02:49:53.229 --> 02:49:55.040 ability of it we 02:49:55.040 --> 02:49:57.760 think that affords some of that kind of protection just by 02:49:57.760 --> 02:49:59.479 design and together 02:49:59.479 --> 02:50:01.530 we want to make sure the same thing that it's clear 02:50:01.530 --> 02:50:02.319 everyone knows what they're 02:50:02.319 --> 02:50:07.170 getting there's no surprises in thank you thank you hope 02:50:07.170 --> 02:50:09.360 answer that thank you 02:50:09.360 --> 02:50:12.360 chair thank you come down speaking it's been very 02:50:12.360 --> 02:50:13.799 informative let me ask you a 02:50:13.799 --> 02:50:15.670 question I asked in the working session and the staff 02:50:15.670 --> 02:50:16.639 thought should be better 02:50:16.639 --> 02:50:21.559 prepared to answer obviously market conditions dictate that 02:50:21.559 --> 02:50:24.760 1200 villa units 02:50:24.760 --> 02:50:30.639 are a popular way to go what the market turns to you 02:50:30.639 --> 02:50:32.280 obviously to keep the same 02:50:32.280 --> 02:50:36.309 number of units though that means these bigger units will 02:50:36.309 --> 02:50:37.719 have to decrease so 02:50:37.719 --> 02:50:40.700 what is the market trend which one are we looking at 02:50:40.700 --> 02:50:42.280 decreasing there can you 02:50:42.280 --> 02:50:45.760 if I understand you right I think almost all of our other 02:50:45.760 --> 02:50:47.239 offerings have grown in 02:50:47.239 --> 02:50:49.940 size that's something that's been happening I would say 02:50:49.940 --> 02:50:50.799 over the last maybe 02:50:50.799 --> 02:50:53.319 ten some years after the downturn I think after that 02:50:53.319 --> 02:50:54.639 probably yeah there was a 02:50:54.639 --> 02:50:58.299 general upsizing so I think that's taken place and probably 02:50:58.299 --> 02:50:59.479 we're a bit behind 02:50:59.479 --> 02:51:02.870 the eight ball and coming in to fill what's called void for 02:51:02.870 --> 02:51:03.879 lack of a better 02:51:03.879 --> 02:51:07.229 explanation so you say percentage wise you would probably 02:51:07.229 --> 02:51:08.040 all the units would 02:51:08.040 --> 02:51:10.469 continue to grow you wouldn't have to decrease some of the 02:51:10.469 --> 02:51:11.239 bigger units so you 02:51:11.239 --> 02:51:15.799 can get those 1200 billas I don't foresee it okay I think 02:51:15.799 --> 02:51:16.520 it'd be nice to 02:51:16.520 --> 02:51:18.870 achieve the full six thousand and thirty seven I think we 02:51:18.870 --> 02:51:19.760 're gonna have a hard 02:51:19.760 --> 02:51:22.959 time doing it that's nice to have that there once again in 02:51:22.959 --> 02:51:23.239 the name of 02:51:23.239 --> 02:51:26.579 flexibility in the name of reacting to 15 years down the 02:51:26.579 --> 02:51:27.920 roads twists and turns 02:51:27.920 --> 02:51:30.879 that we aren't thinking about today like to think we can 02:51:30.879 --> 02:51:31.840 get out front of them 02:51:31.840 --> 02:51:35.870 all but it just doesn't work that way okay thank you thank 02:51:35.870 --> 02:51:35.959 you 02:51:35.959 --> 02:51:41.239 Commissioner Ellis thank you chair a couple more questions 02:51:41.239 --> 02:51:42.520 how many villas 02:51:42.520 --> 02:51:48.360 are there currently 63 63 total that's right now and and we 02:51:48.360 --> 02:51:49.200 've been focused on 02:51:49.200 --> 02:51:52.950 villas with this amendment are there are there other 02:51:52.950 --> 02:51:54.680 parameters you're for your 02:51:54.680 --> 02:51:57.850 other product are there other increase in numbers or was 02:51:57.850 --> 02:51:59.079 this just zeroing in 02:51:59.079 --> 02:52:01.639 on increasing the amount of villas because you've maxed out 02:52:01.639 --> 02:52:02.600 accurate right 02:52:02.600 --> 02:52:05.680 current yeah okay this is strictly in order to allow more 02:52:05.680 --> 02:52:06.479 villas and the 02:52:06.479 --> 02:52:09.559 flexibility to place villas okay there was some of those 02:52:09.559 --> 02:52:10.319 flexibilities written 02:52:10.319 --> 02:52:13.920 in the PD and I believe in the 2011 detail plan amendment I 02:52:13.920 --> 02:52:15.520 think this the 02:52:15.520 --> 02:52:19.229 unit 47 I'm a bit speaking off the cuff unit 47 I believe 02:52:19.229 --> 02:52:20.760 was slated for mf2 and 02:52:20.760 --> 02:52:25.319 during that process was changed and labeled as villas yeah 02:52:25.319 --> 02:52:25.840 I think our 02:52:25.840 --> 02:52:28.709 understanding was that residential was residential and then 02:52:28.709 --> 02:52:29.559 that's why there 02:52:29.559 --> 02:52:32.250 wasn't a big need to place it around but that's you're 02:52:32.250 --> 02:52:33.399 saying it really doesn't 02:52:33.399 --> 02:52:36.670 plan this discussion that's what really the whole point of 02:52:36.670 --> 02:52:37.680 our request before 02:52:37.680 --> 02:52:42.030 you is the desire for more villas because of the market 02:52:42.030 --> 02:52:43.040 need that you're 02:52:43.040 --> 02:52:49.639 saying thank you understood thank you thanks I have a 02:52:49.639 --> 02:52:50.680 couple comments and 02:52:50.680 --> 02:52:58.139 questions I want to echo Commissioner Taylor's concerns is 02:52:58.139 --> 02:52:59.000 one of the 02:52:59.000 --> 02:53:02.719 concerns I had in work session is what you're asking is 02:53:02.719 --> 02:53:04.319 very contrary to what 02:53:04.319 --> 02:53:09.090 our normal zoning procedure is in the city of Denton I'm 02:53:09.090 --> 02:53:10.399 somewhat uncomfortable 02:53:10.399 --> 02:53:15.799 with just saying you guys can go do kind of wherever versus 02:53:15.799 --> 02:53:17.319 the plan that it's 02:53:17.319 --> 02:53:20.870 here and here and defined areas because that's essentially 02:53:20.870 --> 02:53:21.840 how the rest of the 02:53:21.840 --> 02:53:26.559 planning is done in our city understand you're an NPC and 02:53:26.559 --> 02:53:28.639 you're your own kind 02:53:28.639 --> 02:53:31.209 of area but we have citizens that are in there that have 02:53:31.209 --> 02:53:32.440 made purchases based on 02:53:32.440 --> 02:53:35.959 the map and the areas have been designated just like we do 02:53:35.959 --> 02:53:36.879 in other parts 02:53:36.879 --> 02:53:42.729 of our city I'm uncomfortable with that I understand the 02:53:42.729 --> 02:53:44.440 flexibility I'm very 02:53:44.440 --> 02:53:46.719 familiar with construction and development business 02:53:46.719 --> 02:53:47.520 understand things 02:53:47.520 --> 02:53:51.430 change and as such I think the developer comes forward and 02:53:51.430 --> 02:53:52.520 says we've had some 02:53:52.520 --> 02:53:56.229 changes and I need to make change we do that see that with 02:53:56.229 --> 02:53:57.399 Robson Ranch I mean 02:53:57.399 --> 02:54:00.600 a raise the ranch several times has come before us with 02:54:00.600 --> 02:54:02.040 things have happened and 02:54:02.040 --> 02:54:05.280 we need to make changes and my preference would be if those 02:54:05.280 --> 02:54:05.799 things 02:54:05.799 --> 02:54:09.110 happen to come back and we'll address what those are versus 02:54:09.110 --> 02:54:10.200 just kind of a 02:54:10.200 --> 02:54:13.000 free-for-all you can kind of design it and go as you like 02:54:13.000 --> 02:54:13.879 and we don't have to 02:54:13.879 --> 02:54:19.239 come back to PNC so so that's one comment do you have a 02:54:19.239 --> 02:54:20.399 response to 02:54:20.399 --> 02:54:24.520 somewhat allay my concern about turning that over to you 02:54:24.520 --> 02:54:25.840 all versus how we 02:54:25.840 --> 02:54:29.649 typically do things with this area is in our three or in 02:54:29.649 --> 02:54:31.319 our six or duplexes or 02:54:31.319 --> 02:54:35.389 whatever those are and if you want to change it you come 02:54:35.389 --> 02:54:36.879 before PNC and ask for 02:54:36.879 --> 02:54:40.590 zoning change fair concern I understand where you're coming 02:54:40.590 --> 02:54:42.680 from I guess our 02:54:42.680 --> 02:54:44.989 challenge and I don't want to keep repeating the same issue 02:54:44.989 --> 02:54:45.760 but in terms of 02:54:45.760 --> 02:54:49.690 we'll just say the numbers 4500 lots left to develop they 02:54:49.690 --> 02:54:50.879 would be in effect 02:54:50.879 --> 02:54:54.680 our kind of final plotting at the remaining 4500 to where 02:54:54.680 --> 02:54:56.079 we're electing 02:54:56.079 --> 02:54:58.500 what's going to go where and and firming up those kind of 02:54:58.500 --> 02:54:59.360 decisions which is a 02:54:59.360 --> 02:55:03.159 bit of what has us in the position we're in does it back to 02:55:03.159 --> 02:55:04.319 the flexibility being 02:55:04.319 --> 02:55:07.389 a need is a big part of that our concern after 02:55:07.389 --> 02:55:09.360 strengthening the community as a 02:55:09.360 --> 02:55:13.139 whole and really it needs to win as a community and work 02:55:13.139 --> 02:55:14.399 together and the 02:55:14.399 --> 02:55:18.190 HOA the residents all of it comes together as one group and 02:55:18.190 --> 02:55:19.079 we're more 02:55:19.079 --> 02:55:21.899 concerned about that than any if that I don't know if that 02:55:21.899 --> 02:55:22.760 does anything to 02:55:22.760 --> 02:55:26.090 address your concerns but the strength of the community is 02:55:26.090 --> 02:55:27.600 paramount and us 02:55:27.600 --> 02:55:30.920 moving through it counting on word of mouth advertising and 02:55:30.920 --> 02:55:32.120 continuing to build 02:55:32.120 --> 02:55:35.729 it up and fill all the different levels at home buyer and 02:55:35.729 --> 02:55:37.159 all of our residents 02:55:37.159 --> 02:55:41.690 specific needs and needs over time sometimes that means a 02:55:41.690 --> 02:55:42.680 large place up 02:55:42.680 --> 02:55:46.229 front and some 10 15 years later a downgrade to something 02:55:46.229 --> 02:55:47.159 they can stay in 02:55:47.159 --> 02:55:51.440 place carry on the same golf games and friends and all 02:55:51.440 --> 02:55:52.520 within the community 02:55:52.520 --> 02:55:56.079 kind of an agent place set up that allows everybody to stay 02:55:56.079 --> 02:55:57.000 put has been a 02:55:57.000 --> 02:56:00.000 big part of the success of this product and the feedback we 02:56:00.000 --> 02:56:01.799 're getting on it 02:56:01.799 --> 02:56:05.020 well that addresses your question but - well I guess let me 02:56:05.020 --> 02:56:06.159 give some feedback 02:56:06.159 --> 02:56:11.360 so you're about 15 years roughly in the project yes sir 02:56:11.360 --> 02:56:12.200 there but and how many 02:56:12.200 --> 02:56:15.239 units do you have so far I think the numbers about 1800 02:56:15.239 --> 02:56:16.680 okay so a little over 02:56:16.680 --> 02:56:21.420 a hundred a year and you've got 4500 units to go so you 02:56:21.420 --> 02:56:23.440 guys quite a while 02:56:23.440 --> 02:56:30.899 we may see at this rate so you know I guess my point is 02:56:30.899 --> 02:56:31.639 that I understand 02:56:31.639 --> 02:56:35.290 things can change we're not talking about that your project 02:56:35.290 --> 02:56:35.959 is going to be 02:56:35.959 --> 02:56:39.309 built out of the next four or five years and I understand 02:56:39.309 --> 02:56:40.479 there's a time and 02:56:40.479 --> 02:56:43.290 money that's spent to come before the Commission and go 02:56:43.290 --> 02:56:45.040 with the city but 02:56:45.040 --> 02:56:48.430 that's not what your development is you're looking at the 02:56:48.430 --> 02:56:49.600 next probably 30 02:56:49.600 --> 02:56:55.020 45 years at least to have this built out and it almost 02:56:55.020 --> 02:56:56.760 feels like the request is 02:56:56.760 --> 02:56:59.639 we just want to kind of be one and done and we can do kind 02:56:59.639 --> 02:57:01.959 of whatever versus 10 02:57:01.959 --> 02:57:04.649 years from now hey things have changed and we need to come 02:57:04.649 --> 02:57:06.799 back and talk about 02:57:06.799 --> 02:57:11.079 what the new market conditions are and my thought is if we 02:57:11.079 --> 02:57:12.440 approve it the way 02:57:12.440 --> 02:57:16.719 that it is you probably don't kind of have to come back to 02:57:16.719 --> 02:57:18.399 talk to P&Z about 02:57:18.399 --> 02:57:20.799 what some of the new ideas and some flexibilities that you 02:57:20.799 --> 02:57:22.000 need and you have 02:57:22.000 --> 02:57:24.969 that basically now granted in this request that you're 02:57:24.969 --> 02:57:26.159 doing is that a fair 02:57:26.159 --> 02:57:30.440 characterization of what you're asking avoiding or 02:57:30.440 --> 02:57:32.639 essentially rezoning is is 02:57:32.639 --> 02:57:37.500 what we are hoping to do and that is accurate how the time 02:57:37.500 --> 02:57:39.200 it takes us I guess 02:57:39.200 --> 02:57:41.889 to react to spot a market demand make sure it's real it's 02:57:41.889 --> 02:57:42.620 not a blip in the 02:57:42.620 --> 02:57:45.809 radar react to it get things in place get a design get get 02:57:45.809 --> 02:57:46.559 the approvals get 02:57:46.559 --> 02:57:49.729 constructed though our concern and what we've seen in the 02:57:49.729 --> 02:57:51.319 past while is that we 02:57:51.319 --> 02:57:54.270 did the 63 we had and they were a huge hit and then just 02:57:54.270 --> 02:57:55.319 the time it takes us 02:57:55.319 --> 02:57:59.459 to get it this way back up is is what we're trying to trunc 02:57:59.459 --> 02:58:01.120 ate so that's 02:58:01.120 --> 02:58:06.309 timing and your points are are not inaccurate but we're 02:58:06.309 --> 02:58:07.399 that's our desire 02:58:07.399 --> 02:58:11.260 but you can continue doing the bill is now correct no sir 02:58:11.260 --> 02:58:12.680 you can only do 63 02:58:12.680 --> 02:58:16.799 period thank you that that's that's what we're before you 02:58:16.799 --> 02:58:18.079 that's our limitation 02:58:18.079 --> 02:58:21.370 and requests continue to come in and we're just seeing a 02:58:21.370 --> 02:58:22.399 lot of positive 02:58:22.399 --> 02:58:26.750 feedback for it and we're eager to try to meet that market 02:58:26.750 --> 02:58:27.479 demand okay 02:58:27.479 --> 02:58:31.229 Commissioner Sullivan thank you for your answers thank you 02:58:31.229 --> 02:58:32.680 sir just to make a 02:58:32.680 --> 02:58:36.950 point house on countryside built in 2002 which I think was 02:58:36.950 --> 02:58:38.559 the 14th house built 02:58:38.559 --> 02:58:45.549 was on 11,536 square feet of lot my house built in 2015 was 02:58:45.549 --> 02:58:48.200 8,750 so it's 02:58:48.200 --> 02:58:51.370 quite a bit of difference in size and this was built during 02:58:51.370 --> 02:58:52.159 the time when 02:58:52.159 --> 02:58:55.719 obviously the market was very strong and so my concern is 02:58:55.719 --> 02:58:57.360 if you've downsized the 02:58:57.360 --> 02:59:03.200 lots from 2002 to 2015 what are you going to do from 2015 02:59:03.200 --> 02:59:05.799 to 2020 especially 02:59:05.799 --> 02:59:08.950 when you can put villas whenever wherever you want to put 02:59:08.950 --> 02:59:09.719 them at some 02:59:09.719 --> 02:59:13.319 point in the future so that's that's where my concern is 02:59:13.319 --> 02:59:14.639 the way the lot 02:59:14.639 --> 02:59:17.719 sizes have changed they've not gotten larger they've gotten 02:59:17.719 --> 02:59:20.319 smaller appreciate 02:59:20.319 --> 02:59:23.290 that net with that not knowing what lot that is you 02:59:23.290 --> 02:59:24.239 referring to that between 02:59:24.239 --> 02:59:27.389 thousand five oh nine countryside well I mean with that the 02:59:27.389 --> 02:59:28.600 street slopes in it 02:59:28.600 --> 02:59:30.809 whether there's some kind of grade that has to be picked up 02:59:30.809 --> 02:59:31.840 my comment was 02:59:31.840 --> 02:59:34.530 strictly related to what's the minimums that were approved 02:59:34.530 --> 02:59:35.719 that we far exceeded 02:59:35.719 --> 02:59:38.180 that when I say they've gotten bigger they absolutely have 02:59:38.180 --> 02:59:38.799 from what was 02:59:38.799 --> 02:59:41.500 approved every one of those dimensions probably by 10 feet 02:59:41.500 --> 02:59:42.079 that's what I was 02:59:42.079 --> 02:59:45.040 referring to I'm sure there's several that are pie shaped 02:59:45.040 --> 02:59:45.639 at the end of a 02:59:45.639 --> 02:59:48.329 cul-de-sac or again there's a lot of grades so we have to 02:59:48.329 --> 02:59:49.239 take up slope and 02:59:49.239 --> 02:59:51.649 still have a buildable envelope that's going to be a large 02:59:51.649 --> 02:59:52.959 lot but again not 02:59:52.959 --> 02:59:56.219 not knowing that specific lot overall they have gotten 02:59:56.219 --> 02:59:57.760 larger of all the sizes 02:59:57.760 --> 03:00:02.799 including the villa in fact I don't see any other questions 03:00:02.799 --> 03:00:03.559 I appreciate your 03:00:03.559 --> 03:00:05.770 time and a lot of time you've given us and a lot of 03:00:05.770 --> 03:00:06.879 information so thank you 03:00:06.879 --> 03:00:09.090 very much thank you very much for your help and likewise 03:00:09.090 --> 03:00:10.000 the staff appreciate 03:00:10.000 --> 03:00:16.440 a lot this is a public hearing I do not have any cards 03:00:16.440 --> 03:00:18.000 wishing to speak at this 03:00:18.000 --> 03:00:21.860 time I do want to let you know that we had a packet that we 03:00:21.860 --> 03:00:23.799 were given and just 03:00:23.799 --> 03:00:29.790 in a quick count by staff we have 29 letters in favor 10 03:00:29.790 --> 03:00:31.120 that are neutral and 03:00:31.120 --> 03:00:35.469 19 that are opposed and if you'd like to speak we'd be 03:00:35.469 --> 03:00:37.319 happy for you to come up 03:00:37.319 --> 03:00:39.569 speak give your name address and present a card but I'm not 03:00:39.569 --> 03:00:40.239 going to go through 03:00:40.239 --> 03:00:43.680 and call each person in this stack so if you've sent in a 03:00:43.680 --> 03:00:45.200 letter great and we 03:00:45.200 --> 03:00:47.000 appreciate that we've read through them and reviewed them 03:00:47.000 --> 03:00:48.360 if you would like to speak we 03:00:48.360 --> 03:00:52.520 would like to have a card from you to come forward 03:00:52.520 --> 03:01:00.680 first of all I don't know how many of these were mailed out 03:01:00.680 --> 03:01:02.530 we never got orders my neighbors didn't get theirs we're 03:01:02.530 --> 03:01:04.840 only down the block we couldn't we couldn't register our 03:01:04.840 --> 03:01:09.840 complaint we don't want to do it okay as far as building 03:01:09.840 --> 03:01:13.239 these units they're building two units on one lot you're 03:01:13.239 --> 03:01:15.920 getting two prices for a house you're getting $303 you're 03:01:15.920 --> 03:01:19.200 getting $600,000 a house you're paying two HOA fees they're 03:01:19.200 --> 03:01:20.870 looking at the money into it they're not looking at what 03:01:20.870 --> 03:01:22.120 you're doing for us believe me 03:01:22.120 --> 03:01:25.590 we do not want them in our neighborhood they can have a 03:01:25.590 --> 03:01:26.920 certain section they can 03:01:26.920 --> 03:01:29.829 put them if they want to put them out there our house we 03:01:29.829 --> 03:01:31.920 bought it in 14 has 03:01:31.920 --> 03:01:36.540 gone up $59,000 for base house so they're making money off 03:01:36.540 --> 03:01:38.200 the houses we do not 03:01:38.200 --> 03:01:44.120 want these in our neighborhood and they're getting two HOA 03:01:44.120 --> 03:01:45.840 for each home for each 03:01:45.840 --> 03:01:49.389 home now instead of one HOA they're getting two and the HOA 03:01:49.389 --> 03:01:51.299 fees we're paying for the 03:01:51.299 --> 03:01:53.510 maintenance on the golf course is about four million 03:01:53.510 --> 03:01:55.159 dollars a year we're paying 03:01:55.159 --> 03:01:58.389 for all this over costs in a restaurant which is another I 03:01:58.389 --> 03:02:00.040 don't know 1.5 million 03:02:00.040 --> 03:02:02.870 dollars that we shouldn't be paying but we're paying it 03:02:02.870 --> 03:02:04.200 because they have a good 03:02:04.200 --> 03:02:06.889 little hold on us and we do not want to see any more of 03:02:06.889 --> 03:02:08.159 this crap going on with 03:02:08.159 --> 03:02:10.629 the stuff they're going to do this favor not doing us a 03:02:10.629 --> 03:02:12.760 favor believe me I'll fill 03:02:12.760 --> 03:02:17.989 a card out thank you for your comments I do want to say 03:02:17.989 --> 03:02:19.079 that we we will be 03:02:19.079 --> 03:02:23.610 entering all of these into the record so thank you for 03:02:23.610 --> 03:02:24.920 everyone who is sent in a 03:02:24.920 --> 03:02:27.469 letter and anyone else who would like to speak please come 03:02:27.469 --> 03:02:28.440 forward at this time 03:02:28.440 --> 03:02:32.719 and give us your name and address Dave Everly I live at 8 03:02:32.719 --> 03:02:34.680 800 Maryland Court 03:02:34.680 --> 03:02:42.280 Robeson Ranch we've been there five years I work for the 03:02:42.280 --> 03:02:43.280 city of Denton when I was 03:02:43.280 --> 03:02:48.149 in school here I was city secretary at Carrollton I've 03:02:48.149 --> 03:02:50.239 never seen a planning and 03:02:50.239 --> 03:02:56.079 zoning request like this heard of it ever my concern is 03:02:56.079 --> 03:02:58.040 your concern if it's 03:02:58.040 --> 03:03:02.360 a mixed-use request you got a duplex which are joined at 03:03:02.360 --> 03:03:03.760 the garage there's 03:03:03.760 --> 03:03:07.409 two garages together and they can be in one lot then you've 03:03:07.409 --> 03:03:08.399 got a single family 03:03:08.399 --> 03:03:13.620 then you got another duplex I don't think if people 03:03:13.620 --> 03:03:16.360 understood that which by 03:03:16.360 --> 03:03:21.000 the way we got this letter and it said nothing we had no 03:03:21.000 --> 03:03:23.479 idea what all this was 03:03:23.479 --> 03:03:29.100 going on and we're in part of that 200 feet there that 03:03:29.100 --> 03:03:30.879 shows down at the bottom 03:03:30.879 --> 03:03:35.459 of this so fortunately unless somebody tears down a house 03:03:35.459 --> 03:03:36.040 we won't have a 03:03:36.040 --> 03:03:40.309 duplex across the street from us currently they're in pods 03:03:40.309 --> 03:03:41.239 like he said 03:03:41.239 --> 03:03:46.059 and that looks really nice people that want those fine the 03:03:46.059 --> 03:03:47.920 retired people most 03:03:47.920 --> 03:03:53.639 of them stay there year-round as I do we do travel a lot 03:03:53.639 --> 03:03:55.120 but we stay there year 03:03:55.120 --> 03:04:01.100 round I would think if you keep these in pods like 63 they 03:04:01.100 --> 03:04:02.159 're right there now 03:04:02.159 --> 03:04:05.870 that would be really acceptable with everybody but if you 03:04:05.870 --> 03:04:07.200 start putting them 03:04:07.200 --> 03:04:12.319 side by side and I just don't see how it's going to work 03:04:12.319 --> 03:04:13.840 and it's gonna 03:04:13.840 --> 03:04:18.559 they're selling a hundred houses a year about building from 03:04:18.559 --> 03:04:20.680 scratch and if you 03:04:20.680 --> 03:04:24.840 start doubling that and doubling that they're already built 03:04:24.840 --> 03:04:26.120 they're building 03:04:26.120 --> 03:04:29.610 new tennis courts new driveways for look off cards so they 03:04:29.610 --> 03:04:30.959 're expecting a lot of 03:04:30.959 --> 03:04:38.270 people there right now I would just say if you pass 03:04:38.270 --> 03:04:40.120 something that groups these 03:04:40.120 --> 03:04:44.590 things in the clusters that would be acceptable with most 03:04:44.590 --> 03:04:45.479 everybody but if 03:04:45.479 --> 03:04:50.180 you just go mixed use and by my understanding mixed use is 03:04:50.180 --> 03:04:50.920 one here 03:04:50.920 --> 03:04:56.920 single-family here a duplex there I couldn't vote for that 03:04:56.920 --> 03:04:58.600 and you can say I 03:04:58.600 --> 03:05:05.760 didn't check no in that box okay 03:05:12.840 --> 03:05:18.200 good evening my name is Alan Shig I live at 9101 Compton 03:05:18.200 --> 03:05:19.959 Street which is part of 03:05:19.959 --> 03:05:22.879 Robson Ranch I've been a resident out there about five 03:05:22.879 --> 03:05:24.840 years now my hearing is 03:05:24.840 --> 03:05:28.399 sort of broken my mind sort of thinks in the simple 03:05:28.399 --> 03:05:30.440 concepts so I might have missed 03:05:30.440 --> 03:05:33.200 some of the pertinent facts that were delivered here today 03:05:33.200 --> 03:05:34.879 now that probably 03:05:34.879 --> 03:05:38.920 is not gonna well I may come across as being ignorant with 03:05:38.920 --> 03:05:39.639 some of the things I 03:05:39.639 --> 03:05:43.620 said because of those factors there but my main point is 03:05:43.620 --> 03:05:44.920 just it's just an 03:05:44.920 --> 03:05:48.680 irritant I think I'm just really irritated about this first 03:05:48.680 --> 03:05:49.479 of all the 03:05:49.479 --> 03:05:53.059 density issue I just don't know how that density can remain 03:05:53.059 --> 03:05:54.360 the same from you 03:05:54.360 --> 03:05:59.579 know what it was to what is proposed now I know the the 03:05:59.579 --> 03:06:01.159 developers probably not 03:06:01.159 --> 03:06:05.129 under any obligation to advise the residents everything 03:06:05.129 --> 03:06:06.000 that they're doing 03:06:06.000 --> 03:06:10.290 but just this process almost seems like it's been been done 03:06:10.290 --> 03:06:12.319 in a vacuum I mean I 03:06:12.319 --> 03:06:17.700 got this here week to ten days ago probably and then I did 03:06:17.700 --> 03:06:19.239 not fill out any 03:06:19.239 --> 03:06:23.309 kind of form because this wasn't included in the notice I 03:06:23.309 --> 03:06:24.920 received initially I 03:06:24.920 --> 03:06:29.280 just received this by certified certified letter I think it 03:06:29.280 --> 03:06:30.079 was Friday 03:06:30.079 --> 03:06:36.040 or Saturday and it would just been so nice if there would 03:06:36.040 --> 03:06:36.639 have been some kind 03:06:36.639 --> 03:06:41.770 of inclusive you know on a part of the residents out there 03:06:41.770 --> 03:06:42.920 there's a lot of 03:06:42.920 --> 03:06:47.639 communications that goes on and Robson ranch but this I 03:06:47.639 --> 03:06:49.479 never heard about it 03:06:49.479 --> 03:06:52.290 now I was gone a little bit in the summer so maybe I missed 03:06:52.290 --> 03:06:53.079 out on some of 03:06:53.079 --> 03:06:57.040 this but if they were just been even even in last week if 03:06:57.040 --> 03:06:58.000 we had just got 03:06:58.000 --> 03:07:02.020 some kind of notice that something was going on but nothing 03:07:02.020 --> 03:07:03.959 was sent out if 03:07:03.959 --> 03:07:06.510 there had been some kind of advisory this is what we want 03:07:06.510 --> 03:07:07.479 to do would like to 03:07:07.479 --> 03:07:11.620 do this would just like to let you know so it's an irritant 03:07:11.620 --> 03:07:12.719 on my part and that 03:07:12.719 --> 03:07:16.799 probably will not sway a decision process in any way but I 03:07:16.799 --> 03:07:17.760 just want to 03:07:17.760 --> 03:07:21.319 let you know that there there are some concerned people 03:07:21.319 --> 03:07:22.840 living out there thank 03:07:22.840 --> 03:07:25.090 you for your time have a question for you before you go 03:07:25.090 --> 03:07:26.000 Commissioner Hussman 03:07:26.000 --> 03:07:30.879 thank you I just wanted to make sure you knew the notices 03:07:30.879 --> 03:07:32.319 that you received or 03:07:32.319 --> 03:07:36.000 so so that's not that's not ropes and rinse that's the city 03:07:36.000 --> 03:07:36.719 of Denton so I 03:07:36.719 --> 03:07:42.360 just don't want you to put your your your frustration or 03:07:42.360 --> 03:07:44.639 concern about notice on 03:07:44.639 --> 03:07:50.600 that particular item on them that that's our responsibility 03:07:50.600 --> 03:07:52.360 and we're making 03:07:52.360 --> 03:07:55.879 improvements every day but that is we'll have to shoulder 03:07:55.879 --> 03:07:56.760 that thank you 03:07:56.760 --> 03:08:00.049 Commissioner I think I understood that but it's just that I 03:08:00.049 --> 03:08:00.760 wish we did 03:08:00.760 --> 03:08:03.959 something internally something internally and like I say 03:08:03.959 --> 03:08:04.840 they may not be 03:08:04.840 --> 03:08:10.459 obligated to do that but wish we would have been thank you 03:08:10.459 --> 03:08:11.000 thank you for your 03:08:11.000 --> 03:08:13.239 comments 03:08:17.719 --> 03:08:21.879 and I'll file a card I did go to the sales office and I 03:08:21.879 --> 03:08:22.840 said what is this all 03:08:22.840 --> 03:08:26.100 about and they showed me a little map down below the dog 03:08:26.100 --> 03:08:26.920 park and said we're 03:08:26.920 --> 03:08:29.899 taking this piece of land and we want to increase the 03:08:29.899 --> 03:08:31.840 density from 34 to 36 that's 03:08:31.840 --> 03:08:35.350 all it's all about and so when my husband said come today I 03:08:35.350 --> 03:08:35.920 thought okay 03:08:35.920 --> 03:08:38.610 we're just gonna come in here and what we heard today was 03:08:38.610 --> 03:08:39.600 not what we were told 03:08:39.600 --> 03:08:42.950 when I went to the sales office just this last week asking 03:08:42.950 --> 03:08:43.479 for a clarification 03:08:43.479 --> 03:08:47.540 on this point so I do feel like it would be nice if there 03:08:47.540 --> 03:08:49.159 was a more detailed 03:08:49.159 --> 03:08:52.870 master plan and that it was more forthcoming to those of us 03:08:52.870 --> 03:08:53.440 who are 03:08:53.440 --> 03:08:56.379 living there and who are buying into there to know what is 03:08:56.379 --> 03:08:57.520 actually happening 03:08:57.520 --> 03:09:00.879 because I do know that where the villas are the people that 03:09:00.879 --> 03:09:01.760 live there are 03:09:01.760 --> 03:09:05.139 enjoying those very much they were very desirable they sold 03:09:05.139 --> 03:09:06.200 out very fast and I 03:09:06.200 --> 03:09:08.620 can see where that concept would be a good concept but I 03:09:08.620 --> 03:09:09.399 was a little bit 03:09:09.399 --> 03:09:12.590 shocked tonight when I heard 1,200 homes it really was a 03:09:12.590 --> 03:09:13.680 surprise to me because I 03:09:13.680 --> 03:09:16.760 was told there was being in this increased density of two 03:09:16.760 --> 03:09:17.520 more homes in 03:09:17.520 --> 03:09:23.899 that area thank you for your comments and this is a public 03:09:23.899 --> 03:09:24.959 hearing anyone who 03:09:24.959 --> 03:09:27.170 would like to speak please come forward this time and give 03:09:27.170 --> 03:09:27.760 your name and address 03:09:27.760 --> 03:09:30.520 and then fill out a card for us when you can before you 03:09:30.520 --> 03:09:33.040 leave Cindy Whitten 104 03:09:33.040 --> 03:09:38.479 13 Belvedere Drive and I'd like to state I'm in opposition 03:09:38.479 --> 03:09:40.100 of this and the 03:09:40.100 --> 03:09:45.219 reason why is because if I understand everything correctly 03:09:45.219 --> 03:09:46.399 tonight there's not 03:09:46.399 --> 03:09:52.149 a specific area identified that these would be built in for 03:09:52.149 --> 03:09:53.719 future homeowners 03:09:53.719 --> 03:09:59.479 that would be buying the sales office cannot or chooses not 03:09:59.479 --> 03:10:00.719 to disclose 03:10:00.719 --> 03:10:05.850 certain information when we bought in 2013 we looked at a 03:10:05.850 --> 03:10:06.639 particular house 03:10:06.639 --> 03:10:11.239 that was across from a field that had yet to be developed 03:10:11.239 --> 03:10:12.559 specifically asked 03:10:12.559 --> 03:10:16.840 because we were interested in that house when they thought 03:10:16.840 --> 03:10:18.079 that development would 03:10:18.079 --> 03:10:22.200 begin and when there would be houses and the sales office 03:10:22.200 --> 03:10:23.840 told us that there was 03:10:23.840 --> 03:10:29.559 no way to tell us when that development would start within 03:10:29.559 --> 03:10:31.719 a nine to twelve 03:10:31.719 --> 03:10:35.200 month period that development was started and we probably 03:10:35.200 --> 03:10:36.200 would have chosen 03:10:36.200 --> 03:10:41.020 that house had we known that those that we weren't going to 03:10:41.020 --> 03:10:41.840 be staring at an 03:10:41.840 --> 03:10:46.200 empty field for much time we like that house better than we 03:10:46.200 --> 03:10:47.200 like the one that 03:10:47.200 --> 03:10:53.159 we purchased but the sales office isn't forthcoming on 03:10:53.159 --> 03:10:55.719 information to future 03:10:55.719 --> 03:11:00.700 homeowners having to do with the development that's going 03:11:00.700 --> 03:11:02.120 on so to ask to 03:11:02.120 --> 03:11:08.500 just be able to put that anywhere within their map that 03:11:08.500 --> 03:11:10.639 zone jello is 03:11:10.639 --> 03:11:27.510 objectionable to me thank you for your comments I'm Barbara 03:11:27.510 --> 03:11:29.360 Hodges and I own a 03:11:29.360 --> 03:11:33.889 home at ropes and ranch and I just had a dress please I'm 03:11:33.889 --> 03:11:34.920 sorry will you give us 03:11:34.920 --> 03:11:40.049 your address please oh 9600 Rosewood Drive Denton Texas in 03:11:40.049 --> 03:11:41.159 the woods so they 03:11:41.159 --> 03:11:46.479 call it everything ends with a wood I've lived there for 03:11:46.479 --> 03:11:48.120 ten years my husband and 03:11:48.120 --> 03:11:52.389 I moved in there and four years ago he passed away and that 03:11:52.389 --> 03:11:54.120 home is too big for 03:11:54.120 --> 03:11:59.040 me to maintain by myself I want I want a villa so bad I can 03:11:59.040 --> 03:12:00.680 't stand it and my 03:12:00.680 --> 03:12:04.110 there's none available my sister is in the same position 03:12:04.110 --> 03:12:05.239 she moved in four 03:12:05.239 --> 03:12:08.889 years ago her husband just passed away and she has a bigger 03:12:08.889 --> 03:12:10.079 home than I do much 03:12:10.079 --> 03:12:14.610 bigger it's on the other side and so she and I are two wid 03:12:14.610 --> 03:12:16.280 ows and we really we 03:12:16.280 --> 03:12:19.930 want to live together in the same under the same roof they 03:12:19.930 --> 03:12:21.840 're very nicely done 03:12:21.840 --> 03:12:25.889 very well kept you there are restrictions to what you can 03:12:25.889 --> 03:12:27.040 do I don't 03:12:27.040 --> 03:12:30.600 know what people are afraid of I really don't I mean 03:12:30.600 --> 03:12:32.280 building them all over the 03:12:32.280 --> 03:12:35.569 place I don't like that either but the way that it is set 03:12:35.569 --> 03:12:36.680 up right now is 03:12:36.680 --> 03:12:41.559 wonderful and you have your own your own set of neighbors 03:12:41.559 --> 03:12:43.440 anyway that's all I had 03:12:43.440 --> 03:12:48.600 to say I'm for them thank you thank you for your comment 03:12:50.799 --> 03:12:54.790 well I'll tell you what I have a question for you learn I 03:12:54.790 --> 03:12:55.680 learned this 03:12:55.680 --> 03:13:05.840 trick not too long ago you were going to help me with a 03:13:05.840 --> 03:13:06.879 question what was your 03:13:06.879 --> 03:13:12.719 question going to be so why I understand that the villas 03:13:12.719 --> 03:13:14.319 are very desirable my 03:13:14.319 --> 03:13:18.850 objection is to not having specific locations and identify 03:13:18.850 --> 03:13:19.719 if they were more 03:13:19.719 --> 03:13:23.239 in pods rather than if they were yes yes I think that there 03:13:23.239 --> 03:13:24.440 's a need for the 03:13:24.440 --> 03:13:29.000 villas to you know as the as the baby boomers get older and 03:13:29.000 --> 03:13:30.399 we see an influx 03:13:30.399 --> 03:13:36.790 of people into these type of neighborhood master plan 03:13:36.790 --> 03:13:38.319 communities I 03:13:38.319 --> 03:13:42.200 think that that's very good my objection is not identifying 03:13:42.200 --> 03:13:42.680 where 03:13:42.680 --> 03:13:46.670 they're going to be so that the homeowner the future home 03:13:46.670 --> 03:13:47.520 owner has a 03:13:47.520 --> 03:13:52.569 choice as to what lot he may want to buy or those of us 03:13:52.569 --> 03:13:55.200 that have existing homes 03:13:55.200 --> 03:13:59.760 know how we're going to be affected by these I don't have 03:13:59.760 --> 03:14:01.280 an objection to the 03:14:01.280 --> 03:14:09.360 the villas themselves just to not having specific specific 03:14:09.360 --> 03:14:11.239 identified areas and 03:14:11.239 --> 03:14:16.790 that being specifically requested I have one follow-up 03:14:16.790 --> 03:14:19.879 question okay thank you 03:14:19.879 --> 03:14:22.909 again this is a public hearing anyone else that would like 03:14:22.909 --> 03:14:23.799 to speak on this 03:14:23.799 --> 03:14:29.000 item please come forward at this time and if you all will 03:14:29.000 --> 03:14:30.719 if you haven't had 03:14:30.719 --> 03:14:33.709 an opportunity to fill out a card I think staff has come 03:14:33.709 --> 03:14:34.840 around and passing 03:14:34.840 --> 03:14:37.690 cards please fill out a card for us my name is Fred Palmer 03:14:37.690 --> 03:14:38.959 I live in 9613 03:14:38.959 --> 03:14:42.260 Lindenwood trail and just doing the numbers and and again 03:14:42.260 --> 03:14:43.159 the villas are 03:14:43.159 --> 03:14:45.180 great and they fit a purpose and that sort of thing but 03:14:45.180 --> 03:14:46.479 right now there's 63 03:14:46.479 --> 03:14:50.639 out of 1800 homes if you do 1200 more out of 4800 homes 03:14:50.639 --> 03:14:52.159 that's 25% so there's 03:14:52.159 --> 03:14:55.430 got to be some controls I'm in favor of the villas but 03:14:55.430 --> 03:14:56.600 there's got to be some 03:14:56.600 --> 03:15:02.159 controls now they go in okay thank you sir 03:15:07.200 --> 03:15:12.709 Mike Weaver 9612 Applewood trail I appreciate the mailing 03:15:12.709 --> 03:15:13.559 that you guys did 03:15:13.559 --> 03:15:18.090 to inform us of what was happening but in my mind what I 03:15:18.090 --> 03:15:20.079 received by snail mail 03:15:20.079 --> 03:15:23.590 and certified mail it was completely unintelligible we 03:15:23.590 --> 03:15:24.559 couldn't tell what was 03:15:24.559 --> 03:15:28.559 going on what was the purpose of the meeting it did board 03:15:28.559 --> 03:15:29.680 did filter through 03:15:29.680 --> 03:15:32.899 on the homeowners and I'm sorry the message board at ropes 03:15:32.899 --> 03:15:33.840 and Rick that it 03:15:33.840 --> 03:15:37.110 was about the villas but if you guys could do a better job 03:15:37.110 --> 03:15:38.280 of communicating 03:15:38.280 --> 03:15:44.719 the specific issues that would be great thank you sir again 03:15:44.719 --> 03:15:46.399 this is a public 03:15:46.399 --> 03:15:49.139 hearing anyone else who would like to speak please come 03:15:49.139 --> 03:15:51.479 forward at this time 03:15:55.399 --> 03:15:58.399 okay we're going to close the public hearing on this item 03:15:58.399 --> 03:16:00.540 and I'll open the 03:16:00.540 --> 03:16:06.879 floor up for discussion and a motion I'm gonna recognize 03:16:06.879 --> 03:16:08.520 Commissioner Hesworth I 03:16:08.520 --> 03:16:12.579 believe you had a question for the applicant yes okay thank 03:16:12.579 --> 03:16:12.799 you the 03:16:12.799 --> 03:16:16.399 applicant please come forward again please 03:16:20.399 --> 03:16:23.709 and I'm sorry give me your name one more time Todd Fitzger 03:16:23.709 --> 03:16:27.680 ald Todd thank you so 03:16:27.680 --> 03:16:31.540 do you have an understanding given given the feedback we've 03:16:31.540 --> 03:16:33.040 received verbally and 03:16:33.040 --> 03:16:38.399 written do you are you comfortable giving me a number of 03:16:38.399 --> 03:16:40.600 pods that make it 03:16:40.600 --> 03:16:45.129 financial and financially feasible for you to commit to so 03:16:45.129 --> 03:16:46.159 for example if 03:16:46.159 --> 03:16:49.459 you're given permission to build pods but they have to be 03:16:49.459 --> 03:16:50.639 in a segment number 03:16:50.639 --> 03:16:55.319 of XYZ are you comfortable or are you able to give a number 03:16:55.319 --> 03:16:56.000 or I mean I 03:16:56.000 --> 03:16:58.690 understand if you're not I'm just curious what that number 03:16:58.690 --> 03:17:00.559 would be I would be 03:17:00.559 --> 03:17:03.459 apprehensive just for the physical constraints and the 03:17:03.459 --> 03:17:05.120 ability to whatever 03:17:05.120 --> 03:17:07.819 the number might be then to go put one in place and it 03:17:07.819 --> 03:17:09.040 happens that there's 03:17:09.040 --> 03:17:12.319 grading issues or a triangular piece because of a wash and 03:17:12.319 --> 03:17:13.040 what have you that 03:17:13.040 --> 03:17:17.979 it'd be very hard to determine you know a pod unit of some 03:17:17.979 --> 03:17:19.479 amount of homes that 03:17:19.479 --> 03:17:22.959 would I guess secure the ability to continue with this 03:17:22.959 --> 03:17:24.440 product and continue 03:17:24.440 --> 03:17:28.909 to move it forward more than I would be apprehensive I'm 03:17:28.909 --> 03:17:30.440 preference would be to 03:17:30.440 --> 03:17:33.879 be able to use do the land planning and not be the the one 03:17:33.879 --> 03:17:35.319 example that's kind 03:17:35.319 --> 03:17:39.180 of adjacent to unit 47 right now was I forget who brought 03:17:39.180 --> 03:17:40.120 it up but it is 03:17:40.120 --> 03:17:43.409 accurate it's not many more units realize there but it's 03:17:43.409 --> 03:17:44.600 just an effort to 03:17:44.600 --> 03:17:46.920 get more of them there and that was a very it's just a 03:17:46.920 --> 03:17:48.040 strange piece of ground 03:17:48.040 --> 03:17:51.549 and it's limited by a wash on one side and a street in a 03:17:51.549 --> 03:17:52.959 dog park and I think 03:17:52.959 --> 03:17:56.180 that's going to become fairly common that just the real 03:17:56.180 --> 03:17:57.360 world is going to be 03:17:57.360 --> 03:17:59.350 some other constraints that would be very hard to plan up 03:17:59.350 --> 03:17:59.879 against especially 03:17:59.879 --> 03:18:02.879 if success continues the ability to take a big bite or a 03:18:02.879 --> 03:18:03.920 small bite or two 03:18:03.920 --> 03:18:06.200 different pods but there's their access and sewer and all 03:18:06.200 --> 03:18:07.120 the other issues that 03:18:07.120 --> 03:18:10.260 that we need to address at the same time for that reason be 03:18:10.260 --> 03:18:11.479 our preference to not 03:18:11.479 --> 03:18:16.090 have to pin down a location or account understanding the 03:18:16.090 --> 03:18:16.799 constraints and then 03:18:16.799 --> 03:18:19.489 the concerns that have been raised with the home side by 03:18:19.489 --> 03:18:20.520 side within the same 03:18:20.520 --> 03:18:23.209 pod or the same subdivision where we can understand that 03:18:23.209 --> 03:18:23.879 and that's not 03:18:23.879 --> 03:18:26.690 something that's not how we've tried to market in order do 03:18:26.690 --> 03:18:27.479 we plan to but I 03:18:27.479 --> 03:18:31.440 don't know if that answers your question many but yes it 03:18:31.440 --> 03:18:34.360 does it candidly you 03:18:34.360 --> 03:18:38.950 know there's the buttons they only give us two they give us 03:18:38.950 --> 03:18:39.920 a yes and a no yes 03:18:39.920 --> 03:18:49.760 and so understanding your your parameters I am limited as 03:18:49.760 --> 03:18:51.319 well and so 03:18:51.319 --> 03:18:58.049 I'm trying to forge middle ground that would obviously 03:18:58.049 --> 03:19:00.920 require more planning 03:19:00.920 --> 03:19:04.569 more commitment on because I understand that at a very 03:19:04.569 --> 03:19:06.879 small level the 03:19:06.879 --> 03:19:10.440 limitations of building and clusters so and so on so forth 03:19:10.440 --> 03:19:13.360 but at the same time 03:19:13.360 --> 03:19:16.920 trying to find a middle ground someplace so no that it may 03:19:16.920 --> 03:19:17.920 you answered my 03:19:17.920 --> 03:19:22.170 question perfectly just trying to to help can I follow up 03:19:22.170 --> 03:19:23.799 to that absolutely to 03:19:23.799 --> 03:19:27.170 that end if there to be some kind of a stipulation that 03:19:27.170 --> 03:19:28.559 need to be contained 03:19:28.559 --> 03:19:32.239 within a pod and not a one-off and some other standalone 03:19:32.239 --> 03:19:34.280 unit would that suffice 03:19:34.280 --> 03:19:37.959 to any end to provide some more structure some some 03:19:37.959 --> 03:19:39.280 increased stability 03:19:39.280 --> 03:19:44.399 I'm one of seven but I'll tell you I'll tell you from my 03:19:44.399 --> 03:19:46.159 one yes because you 03:19:46.159 --> 03:19:50.799 know I'm balancing residents versus understanding you you 03:19:50.799 --> 03:19:51.440 're you're producing 03:19:51.440 --> 03:19:54.739 a superior product everyone gets that you know and the 03:19:54.739 --> 03:19:55.840 neighborhood is is is 03:19:55.840 --> 03:19:59.319 thriving because of your sensitivity to your product and 03:19:59.319 --> 03:20:00.639 and having the ear to 03:20:00.639 --> 03:20:05.399 the to your to your your customers so having that same ear 03:20:05.399 --> 03:20:06.319 yes I mean for me 03:20:06.319 --> 03:20:09.969 just me personally yes because that then allows some 03:20:09.969 --> 03:20:12.959 visibility and some peace of 03:20:12.959 --> 03:20:16.569 mind that we're not just gonna have a vacant lot that this 03:20:16.569 --> 03:20:17.959 will fit their type 03:20:17.959 --> 03:20:23.389 approach and doesn't give a carte blanche 15-year blank 03:20:23.389 --> 03:20:25.959 check you know and also 03:20:25.959 --> 03:20:29.809 for me it helps because I think this body changes right so 03:20:29.809 --> 03:20:31.040 I'd like to try to 03:20:31.040 --> 03:20:36.540 provide some reciprocate so supply supply some stability 03:20:36.540 --> 03:20:37.840 for you and your partners 03:20:37.840 --> 03:20:41.799 as you go forward and we turn limit off and new people come 03:20:41.799 --> 03:20:42.600 on you have 03:20:42.600 --> 03:20:46.540 something in place that allows you to continue to adjust to 03:20:46.540 --> 03:20:47.639 your to your needs 03:20:47.639 --> 03:20:53.889 again as a as a credit or as a just recognizing the good 03:20:53.889 --> 03:20:55.840 work that you do 03:20:55.840 --> 03:20:59.909 and that that Robson ranch is is focused on and doing great 03:20:59.909 --> 03:21:00.840 things hopefully in 03:21:00.840 --> 03:21:03.530 that area so thank you for that yes sir that certainly 03:21:03.530 --> 03:21:05.000 would be something that to 03:21:05.000 --> 03:21:07.489 whatever end it provides additional protection or be 03:21:07.489 --> 03:21:09.040 labeled maybe as a 03:21:09.040 --> 03:21:12.840 final plat comes into that end it gets the label and that 03:21:12.840 --> 03:21:14.040 that's what allows 03:21:14.040 --> 03:21:16.090 those lots to be used for real as opposed to some of the 03:21:16.090 --> 03:21:16.559 other ones 03:21:16.559 --> 03:21:20.120 externally it's probably half a thought but some along 03:21:20.120 --> 03:21:21.520 those lines would be 03:21:21.520 --> 03:21:25.489 preferential in terms of limiting it as opposed to pick an 03:21:25.489 --> 03:21:26.600 actual geographic 03:21:26.600 --> 03:21:29.200 locations without the background and the grading and the 03:21:29.200 --> 03:21:30.200 drainage and all the 03:21:30.200 --> 03:21:34.239 other information thank you again 03:21:38.319 --> 03:21:43.040 you might want to take a seat close by I don't know no stay 03:21:43.040 --> 03:21:43.040 there 03:21:43.040 --> 03:21:45.979 Commissioner Beck I've got a full board and I didn't know 03:21:45.979 --> 03:21:46.959 if they want to ask 03:21:46.959 --> 03:21:51.639 you a question or not okay following the same lines 03:21:51.639 --> 03:21:52.200 Commissioner 03:21:52.200 --> 03:21:54.409 Hudson was talking about you know finding some middle 03:21:54.409 --> 03:21:56.520 ground here the 1200 03:21:56.520 --> 03:22:00.579 number you put up there on the bill is is that something 03:22:00.579 --> 03:22:02.840 you see that's viable 03:22:02.840 --> 03:22:09.600 not viable I'm sorry but that is is is realistic is that 03:22:09.600 --> 03:22:10.559 just a number thrown 03:22:10.559 --> 03:22:16.350 out there the demand for 1200 is it actually there could a 03:22:16.350 --> 03:22:18.559 lesser number be 03:22:18.559 --> 03:22:22.840 presented it's not based on any solid math okay again we're 03:22:22.840 --> 03:22:23.440 having one in our 03:22:23.440 --> 03:22:26.270 hip pocket that we're kind of learning this product and 03:22:26.270 --> 03:22:27.920 even once that happened 03:22:27.920 --> 03:22:31.270 market trends being what they are you can turn that math 03:22:31.270 --> 03:22:32.399 upside down and there 03:22:32.399 --> 03:22:37.459 wasn't any solid number crunching that landed on that 03:22:37.459 --> 03:22:38.280 number it's somewhat 03:22:38.280 --> 03:22:42.379 arbitrary but to try to be safe to try to avoid understand 03:22:42.379 --> 03:22:43.600 market trends too 03:22:43.600 --> 03:22:48.239 but based on what I'm hearing a lot tonight you know there 03:22:48.239 --> 03:22:50.040 and I really 03:22:50.040 --> 03:22:54.040 fully respect the idea of flexibility here I'm pretty much 03:22:54.040 --> 03:22:54.879 for it but I'm 03:22:54.879 --> 03:22:58.069 concerned too that not enough information has been shared 03:22:58.069 --> 03:22:58.760 with everyone 03:22:58.760 --> 03:23:03.350 that has to live with this and the idea of probably setting 03:23:03.350 --> 03:23:04.760 aside some areas 03:23:04.760 --> 03:23:07.329 where these pods can be contained as making that a stip 03:23:07.329 --> 03:23:08.479 ulation this probably 03:23:08.479 --> 03:23:12.190 would be a good idea but I think it would it would come off 03:23:12.190 --> 03:23:13.760 better too if 03:23:13.760 --> 03:23:16.840 there was probably a better public hearing on this with the 03:23:16.840 --> 03:23:18.000 Robeson Ranch 03:23:18.000 --> 03:23:20.590 residents out there so they could get a better grasp of 03:23:20.590 --> 03:23:21.799 this I think you've got 03:23:21.799 --> 03:23:25.040 a good idea I think your head and hearts in the right place 03:23:25.040 --> 03:23:26.440 but they haven't got 03:23:26.440 --> 03:23:30.530 enough information yet to realize that and it would behoove 03:23:30.530 --> 03:23:31.840 you as a developer 03:23:31.840 --> 03:23:36.309 to share that with them so going forward would you consider 03:23:36.309 --> 03:23:37.479 opening this debate 03:23:37.479 --> 03:23:41.270 back up with the residents out there with an understanding 03:23:41.270 --> 03:23:42.479 that maybe we can't 03:23:42.479 --> 03:23:44.790 set some areas aside for these little pods for the the 03:23:44.790 --> 03:23:45.840 bills because there's 03:23:45.840 --> 03:23:49.770 obviously demand for them too we had made some effort to 03:23:49.770 --> 03:23:50.879 put up a posting and 03:23:50.879 --> 03:23:54.069 into Holst a neighborhood meeting apologies if that I think 03:23:54.069 --> 03:23:54.479 that message 03:23:54.479 --> 03:23:59.760 didn't get to everybody we certainly understand the one who 03:23:59.760 --> 03:24:01.000 have involvement 03:24:01.000 --> 03:24:05.170 all the residents as much as we can okay okay thank you sir 03:24:05.170 --> 03:24:08.760 thank you thank you 03:24:08.760 --> 03:24:13.040 chair to I guess continue this because I'm not sure I heard 03:24:13.040 --> 03:24:14.479 the answer I think 03:24:14.479 --> 03:24:18.950 the big scary part is going from 63 villas to this large 03:24:18.950 --> 03:24:20.639 number and and where 03:24:20.639 --> 03:24:23.889 did that number come from honestly it's fairly arbitrary we 03:24:23.889 --> 03:24:24.879 're looking at some 03:24:24.879 --> 03:24:28.360 ratios and what's remaining and a safe number that we 03:24:28.360 --> 03:24:30.399 thought we avoid another 03:24:30.399 --> 03:24:34.379 miss and revisiting this down the road was the extent of 03:24:34.379 --> 03:24:35.280 the man and I mean I 03:24:35.280 --> 03:24:38.530 think that is the stumbling block is just that large 03:24:38.530 --> 03:24:39.760 increase and then 03:24:39.760 --> 03:24:44.040 without a definite plan of where you know nobody wants to 03:24:44.040 --> 03:24:45.559 see property value 03:24:45.559 --> 03:24:47.989 decrease obviously and and that's not your goal and I know 03:24:47.989 --> 03:24:48.840 that the community 03:24:48.840 --> 03:24:52.700 is beautiful and developing the community further is best 03:24:52.700 --> 03:24:54.360 for all we need 03:24:54.360 --> 03:24:57.920 to continue going forward in ropes and ranch I mean it's it 03:24:57.920 --> 03:25:00.079 's a great plan it at 03:25:00.079 --> 03:25:03.430 the aging in place concept is a wonderful concept and yes 03:25:03.430 --> 03:25:04.280 you need more 03:25:04.280 --> 03:25:08.649 than 63 villas out there definitely the scary part is is 03:25:08.649 --> 03:25:10.120 just throwing out this 03:25:10.120 --> 03:25:15.110 amendment without parameters and going from 63 and in the 03:25:15.110 --> 03:25:16.680 mind of residents who 03:25:16.680 --> 03:25:19.370 are there who have invested a great deal of money to this 03:25:19.370 --> 03:25:21.559 1200 number of where 03:25:21.559 --> 03:25:24.530 they don't know where they're going to be so I'm trying to 03:25:24.530 --> 03:25:26.399 wrap my head around 03:25:26.399 --> 03:25:30.329 allowing you to to get this amendment passed and want you 03:25:30.329 --> 03:25:31.239 to continue 03:25:31.239 --> 03:25:35.840 developing as you have the superior product that is there 03:25:35.840 --> 03:25:37.600 it's just that 03:25:37.600 --> 03:25:41.430 that's the stumbling block certainly for those opposed and 03:25:41.430 --> 03:25:42.440 and it's a stumbling 03:25:42.440 --> 03:25:46.909 block for me as well without knowing where these units are 03:25:46.909 --> 03:25:47.959 really going to 03:25:47.959 --> 03:25:51.879 be placed and the amount does scare me at this moment of 03:25:51.879 --> 03:25:55.239 development is probably 03:25:55.239 --> 03:25:59.159 not a whole lot to address it but in terms of the 2500 2700 03:25:59.159 --> 03:25:59.879 acres that is 03:25:59.879 --> 03:26:02.790 remaining and the fact that the original concept plan and 03:26:02.790 --> 03:26:03.879 the previous detail 03:26:03.879 --> 03:26:06.680 plan or the current detail plan shows a lot counted that 03:26:06.680 --> 03:26:07.959 achieved only that six 03:26:07.959 --> 03:26:13.000 thousand and thirty seven the if even if all 1200 were 03:26:13.000 --> 03:26:14.840 implemented and put in 03:26:14.840 --> 03:26:19.790 place I don't see where I would have exceeded the I guess 03:26:19.790 --> 03:26:21.040 our what we're 03:26:21.040 --> 03:26:25.510 going to continue to to try to relate is that the density 03:26:25.510 --> 03:26:27.719 not increasing even if 03:26:27.719 --> 03:26:29.969 it did increase I guess it would be would have a bunch of 03:26:29.969 --> 03:26:30.760 undeveloped land 03:26:30.760 --> 03:26:33.450 at the end which is not something we want we need the 03:26:33.450 --> 03:26:34.639 continuity their lively 03:26:34.639 --> 03:26:38.129 road is a north limit and need to have some spine roads and 03:26:38.129 --> 03:26:39.000 continuous 03:26:39.000 --> 03:26:42.870 development that we would continue to spread out and take 03:26:42.870 --> 03:26:44.159 full advantage of 03:26:44.159 --> 03:26:46.739 the land maintain the beauty of the land and maximize the 03:26:46.739 --> 03:26:47.719 views and there are 03:26:47.719 --> 03:26:50.819 plenty within our game plan that would always be something 03:26:50.819 --> 03:26:51.920 that we definitely 03:26:51.920 --> 03:26:55.000 rolled into any regardless of the ratios or whether the 03:26:55.000 --> 03:26:56.360 market trend changes again 03:26:56.360 --> 03:27:06.000 or continues full on thank you commissioner time thank you 03:27:06.000 --> 03:27:06.559 chair 03:27:06.559 --> 03:27:14.239 excuse me so I personally I'm not too concerned about I 03:27:14.239 --> 03:27:15.760 think the 1200 number 03:27:15.760 --> 03:27:19.510 comes out if it's around 25 or 30 percent I think there I 03:27:19.510 --> 03:27:20.079 've seen 03:27:20.079 --> 03:27:24.610 especially in well-designed communities 30 or 35 percent 03:27:24.610 --> 03:27:26.239 kind of higher density 03:27:26.239 --> 03:27:30.600 duplex can work really well so I don't think as so the 03:27:30.600 --> 03:27:31.719 parameters of keeping 03:27:31.719 --> 03:27:35.790 the same number of units on the entire development and 03:27:35.790 --> 03:27:37.879 having up to 1200 of you 03:27:37.879 --> 03:27:43.600 know of this type of unit sounds good to me but I do come 03:27:43.600 --> 03:27:44.959 back to this planning 03:27:44.959 --> 03:27:50.290 the letting the neighbors know what's coming giving 03:27:50.290 --> 03:27:51.840 protections to the people 03:27:51.840 --> 03:27:54.870 that are already there so I don't feel comfortable 03:27:54.870 --> 03:27:57.520 supporting this as it is but 03:27:57.520 --> 03:28:00.350 I do want I think that I don't want to make you come back 03:28:00.350 --> 03:28:01.760 necessarily and rezone 03:28:01.760 --> 03:28:07.219 regularly but if we had so if we have we have total 03:28:07.219 --> 03:28:09.079 development you know six 03:28:09.079 --> 03:28:15.030 thousand and 1200 and then we say per unit there will be a 03:28:15.030 --> 03:28:16.520 Mac you know you 03:28:16.520 --> 03:28:20.370 know restrictions on how a pod could would be like pods 03:28:20.370 --> 03:28:21.840 will only face each 03:28:21.840 --> 03:28:23.979 other on the street like they won't have houses on one side 03:28:23.979 --> 03:28:25.479 of the street and you 03:28:25.479 --> 03:28:27.159 know single-family on one side and duplexes on the other 03:28:27.159 --> 03:28:27.760 side of the street 03:28:27.760 --> 03:28:35.040 facing each other and you'll have minimum of 20 unit units 03:28:35.040 --> 03:28:37.360 of the duplexes and a 03:28:37.360 --> 03:28:40.299 maximum of 80 or you know if we can't if you came up with a 03:28:40.299 --> 03:28:41.680 set of guidelines for 03:28:41.680 --> 03:28:45.950 how you generally would design pods and then those pods 03:28:45.950 --> 03:28:47.520 were approved at the 03:28:47.520 --> 03:28:50.930 platting like whenever you come in with a unit so this unit 03:28:50.930 --> 03:28:52.239 's gonna be all 03:28:52.239 --> 03:28:55.479 single-family this unit's gonna have one pod it's gonna be 03:28:55.479 --> 03:28:56.559 an 80 unit pod and 03:28:56.559 --> 03:29:01.479 it's gonna have 40 single-family you know and then and then 03:29:01.479 --> 03:29:03.440 at platting you 03:29:03.440 --> 03:29:06.389 know if we could something along those lines where it isn't 03:29:06.389 --> 03:29:07.440 you flying out here 03:29:07.440 --> 03:29:11.309 every six months for a new rezone for another 40 acres or 03:29:11.309 --> 03:29:13.559 whatever but there 03:29:13.559 --> 03:29:16.319 is still some control and some stability and then all of 03:29:16.319 --> 03:29:17.520 the existing already 03:29:17.520 --> 03:29:20.879 built areas if we just left those in their current 03:29:20.879 --> 03:29:22.360 categories I mean it 03:29:22.360 --> 03:29:25.569 doesn't really affect y'all you know building new homes but 03:29:25.569 --> 03:29:26.879 then it gives you 03:29:26.879 --> 03:29:30.629 know a sense of security to the people that already there 03:29:30.629 --> 03:29:32.079 that their use their 03:29:32.079 --> 03:29:36.170 zoning isn't changing kind of out from under them so that's 03:29:36.170 --> 03:29:37.680 that's me kind of 03:29:37.680 --> 03:29:44.700 spitballing a middle ground but you would have to work with 03:29:44.700 --> 03:29:45.639 city staff and 03:29:45.639 --> 03:29:49.290 develop what that would look like would you be comfortable 03:29:49.290 --> 03:29:50.260 with said I don't 03:29:50.260 --> 03:29:52.690 think you're gonna get approval would you be comfortable 03:29:52.690 --> 03:29:54.239 with tabling for four 03:29:54.239 --> 03:29:58.520 or six weeks and coming back with a proposal that had a 03:29:58.520 --> 03:29:59.520 little more 03:29:59.520 --> 03:30:04.879 structure in it as a alternatively would it be possible to 03:30:04.879 --> 03:30:05.239 come up with 03:30:05.239 --> 03:30:08.520 stipulations that would set out something like that a pod I 03:30:08.520 --> 03:30:09.000 've been using 03:30:09.000 --> 03:30:12.760 the term pod but really to be final plat and again with the 03:30:12.760 --> 03:30:13.719 villas especially 03:30:13.719 --> 03:30:16.870 with a separate HOA all the tracks and all the declarations 03:30:16.870 --> 03:30:17.840 are mapped out at 03:30:17.840 --> 03:30:21.159 that stage if it to be a stipulation to say it has to be 03:30:21.159 --> 03:30:22.920 per final plat 03:30:22.920 --> 03:30:28.469 identified as villas and platter pod or both if it's to use 03:30:28.469 --> 03:30:29.280 interchangeably and 03:30:29.280 --> 03:30:31.969 set it whatever those those limitations need to be that 03:30:31.969 --> 03:30:33.479 there couldn't be across 03:30:33.479 --> 03:30:37.190 the street from each other together with a plat by plat 03:30:37.190 --> 03:30:38.959 basis on a villa so I 03:30:38.959 --> 03:30:41.840 would generally be amenable to that but I would worry that 03:30:41.840 --> 03:30:42.959 if we're writing it 03:30:42.959 --> 03:30:46.389 up here right now we're gonna overlook something and there 03:30:46.389 --> 03:30:47.760 's gonna be you know 03:30:47.760 --> 03:30:50.239 it's gonna make something unbuildable or you know so I 03:30:50.239 --> 03:30:51.479 think it would it would be 03:30:51.479 --> 03:30:54.579 better if I think we let staff review you know kind of sit 03:30:54.579 --> 03:30:55.719 down and make sure 03:30:55.719 --> 03:31:00.059 that all the t's across the eyes are dotted so to speak but 03:31:00.059 --> 03:31:01.239 I think that's 03:31:01.239 --> 03:31:03.950 that's basically what I'm what I'd be proposing is like at 03:31:03.950 --> 03:31:04.719 the plat phase 03:31:04.719 --> 03:31:06.100 there'd be some kind of approval and then the other 03:31:06.100 --> 03:31:06.920 question I guess would be 03:31:06.920 --> 03:31:14.950 for staff would this Commission have the ability to go no- 03:31:14.950 --> 03:31:16.899 go at the point of 03:31:16.899 --> 03:31:21.850 plat final planning on a unit I'm gonna call on legal 03:31:21.850 --> 03:31:23.399 because we've had a little 03:31:23.399 --> 03:31:26.950 back and forth here about zoning and platting and so I'm 03:31:26.950 --> 03:31:28.319 gonna ask Jennifer 03:31:28.319 --> 03:31:32.469 to the platting without the basic legal requirements or 03:31:32.469 --> 03:31:33.600 structure within the PD 03:31:33.600 --> 03:31:38.069 then we would not have the discretion to deny it so we 03:31:38.069 --> 03:31:39.719 would have to amend the PD 03:31:39.719 --> 03:31:42.649 we would have to work could we could we add so we're am 03:31:42.649 --> 03:31:44.040 ending the PD now could 03:31:44.040 --> 03:31:46.659 we amend the PD to have additional restrictions that if 03:31:46.659 --> 03:31:47.319 these restrictions 03:31:47.319 --> 03:31:50.739 aren't met would be grounds for denial absolutely because 03:31:50.739 --> 03:31:51.520 the PDs are different 03:31:51.520 --> 03:31:56.479 animals so you have wide authority on reducing the number 03:31:56.479 --> 03:31:57.559 making it a 03:31:57.559 --> 03:32:05.479 clustered planning or the placement so or you can recommend 03:32:05.479 --> 03:32:06.200 that he come back 03:32:06.200 --> 03:32:08.520 because you had mentioned something about keeping the 03:32:08.520 --> 03:32:09.479 existing homes in the 03:32:09.479 --> 03:32:13.829 same zoning structure and he can bring a plan back and we 03:32:13.829 --> 03:32:16.159 can table it for next 03:32:16.159 --> 03:32:19.600 time because if you do go forward here and if it is denied 03:32:19.600 --> 03:32:20.799 and you choose to go 03:32:20.799 --> 03:32:24.930 to council that will require a supermajority vote and so I 03:32:24.930 --> 03:32:25.600 'm not I'm 03:32:25.600 --> 03:32:27.930 not sure you won't be able to bring it back again if 03:32:27.930 --> 03:32:29.200 council denies it for one 03:32:29.200 --> 03:32:35.180 year so this is something you need to consider our 03:32:35.180 --> 03:32:37.000 preference would be to map 03:32:37.000 --> 03:32:39.209 at the stipulations understanding that there's a lot of 03:32:39.209 --> 03:32:40.079 moving parts and maybe 03:32:40.079 --> 03:32:44.930 that's it's too much to do in one meeting tonight I mean if 03:32:44.930 --> 03:32:45.920 there's a list 03:32:45.920 --> 03:32:49.940 of those issues that we can work out quickly and then and 03:32:49.940 --> 03:32:51.280 hopefully be back 03:32:51.280 --> 03:32:53.799 in front of you all very soon that's our overwhelming 03:32:53.799 --> 03:32:55.040 preference again to announce 03:32:55.040 --> 03:32:58.159 the obvious and the interest in moving forward but if we 03:32:58.159 --> 03:32:59.319 can come up with a 03:32:59.319 --> 03:33:02.680 handful of what would create that kind of confidence I 03:33:02.680 --> 03:33:04.200 guess knowing how much 03:33:04.200 --> 03:33:07.840 is going to be enough to create that's going to be the 03:33:07.840 --> 03:33:09.760 battle but but for a handful of 03:33:09.760 --> 03:33:12.219 controls that built in and would be part of this detail 03:33:12.219 --> 03:33:13.559 plan amendment so what in 03:33:13.559 --> 03:33:19.420 itself on the zoning level protection so I think I'm sorry 03:33:19.420 --> 03:33:20.760 I just want to mention 03:33:20.760 --> 03:33:24.729 that another option would be to just give the requirements 03:33:24.729 --> 03:33:26.600 or sort of outline 03:33:26.600 --> 03:33:30.430 exactly what we're looking for and delegate it to staff to 03:33:30.430 --> 03:33:31.440 make sure that 03:33:31.440 --> 03:33:35.610 the plan is compliant before taking it to council as your 03:33:35.610 --> 03:33:37.680 recommendation so I 03:33:37.680 --> 03:33:41.120 think I think I've thrown out my kind of my few that I've 03:33:41.120 --> 03:33:42.600 thought of on the spot 03:33:42.600 --> 03:33:44.850 up here so I don't know if the rest of the Commission would 03:33:44.850 --> 03:33:45.840 weigh in on what 03:33:45.840 --> 03:33:50.000 they think about something like that thank you thank you 03:33:50.000 --> 03:33:51.000 for your comments 03:33:51.000 --> 03:33:54.209 that I think we're going to do that and try if possible to 03:33:54.209 --> 03:33:55.280 move this forward 03:33:55.280 --> 03:34:00.239 this even I would agree that in the past it has not gone 03:34:00.239 --> 03:34:02.159 well when we add a little 03:34:02.159 --> 03:34:05.559 bit here from the dais I think it's always best to get back 03:34:05.559 --> 03:34:06.399 to staff and 03:34:06.399 --> 03:34:09.559 with the applicant and then bring something either back or 03:34:09.559 --> 03:34:10.260 taking on to 03:34:10.260 --> 03:34:12.950 City Council with those things addressed versus us trying 03:34:12.950 --> 03:34:15.120 to add limit here so I 03:34:15.120 --> 03:34:21.000 would concur with that Commissioner Roselle thank you and I 03:34:21.000 --> 03:34:21.600 appreciate that 03:34:21.600 --> 03:34:24.719 conversation some of what y'all have just been talking 03:34:24.719 --> 03:34:25.280 about and I might 03:34:25.280 --> 03:34:28.360 negate some of the points are down but for the purpose of 03:34:28.360 --> 03:34:29.920 this conversation I 03:34:29.920 --> 03:34:32.430 was just going to throw out my thoughts some of them concur 03:34:32.430 --> 03:34:33.360 with you some of them 03:34:33.360 --> 03:34:38.370 do not so in the past we actually recently had this where 03:34:38.370 --> 03:34:38.920 we tabled 03:34:38.920 --> 03:34:41.389 something because we didn't want to get we didn't want to 03:34:41.389 --> 03:34:43.520 mess it up and I think 03:34:43.520 --> 03:34:47.590 in the PD or the MPC case we I feel more comfortable with a 03:34:47.590 --> 03:34:49.600 broader stroke in 03:34:49.600 --> 03:34:54.340 terms of limits just because of the flexibility we have so 03:34:54.340 --> 03:34:56.200 so my thoughts 03:34:56.200 --> 03:35:00.010 and what I wasn't saying I'll go ahead and say now is to 03:35:00.010 --> 03:35:01.639 motion approval for 03:35:01.639 --> 03:35:04.719 this and I had I came up with three conditions that I would 03:35:04.719 --> 03:35:05.440 be okay seeing 03:35:05.440 --> 03:35:12.750 one would be to reduce the overall number so 1200 to 600 03:35:12.750 --> 03:35:14.479 cut in half off 03:35:14.479 --> 03:35:18.149 the top to reassure some of the residents that there's not 03:35:18.149 --> 03:35:18.959 going to be a 03:35:18.959 --> 03:35:22.440 flood of villas the next couple years the second is to 03:35:22.440 --> 03:35:23.680 require cluster 03:35:23.680 --> 03:35:28.659 development so there's not a one-off house or Villa put in 03:35:28.659 --> 03:35:30.559 place or in the 03:35:30.559 --> 03:35:33.260 current homes there's a fire something not have a Villa put 03:35:33.260 --> 03:35:34.159 back into an empty 03:35:34.159 --> 03:35:37.319 lot and the third is to require some sort of buffer in 03:35:37.319 --> 03:35:38.680 between the clustered 03:35:38.680 --> 03:35:43.799 villas and the the current homes so that there is either it 03:35:43.799 --> 03:35:44.760 's a street buffer or 03:35:44.760 --> 03:35:47.569 how it may work out so that there is another protection 03:35:47.569 --> 03:35:48.440 because I'm certainly 03:35:48.440 --> 03:35:52.700 hearing the concerns of the citizens that I've heard about 03:35:52.700 --> 03:35:53.959 not wanting them 03:35:53.959 --> 03:35:55.909 or their fears about it but I've also heard only 03:35:55.909 --> 03:35:56.920 compliments about the 03:35:56.920 --> 03:35:59.010 development and it sounds like some people actually want to 03:35:59.010 --> 03:35:59.559 get into Villa 03:35:59.559 --> 03:36:03.639 really soon and so I'm hearing that I'm hearing that as 03:36:03.639 --> 03:36:04.959 well and so for those 03:36:04.959 --> 03:36:08.319 reasons I would like to see this move forward and if there 03:36:08.319 --> 03:36:09.319 's a way that so at 03:36:09.319 --> 03:36:12.290 600 there would be if this is a booming thing he would have 03:36:12.290 --> 03:36:13.239 to come back to get 03:36:13.239 --> 03:36:16.149 to get more they would have to come back to get more and so 03:36:16.149 --> 03:36:17.200 it kind of puts a 03:36:17.200 --> 03:36:21.270 stopgap measure in the pace of these being built but also 03:36:21.270 --> 03:36:22.420 addresses in my 03:36:22.420 --> 03:36:26.770 estimation to make sure they're in clusters with a buffer 03:36:26.770 --> 03:36:28.319 alleviates some 03:36:28.319 --> 03:36:33.790 of the fear of this interspersed meant or blending that I 03:36:33.790 --> 03:36:35.079 've heard and so I 03:36:35.079 --> 03:36:37.510 would be in favor of going ahead and move this forward and 03:36:37.510 --> 03:36:38.319 it sounds like we 03:36:38.319 --> 03:36:41.010 could put conditions that staff could verify before council 03:36:41.010 --> 03:36:41.719 votes on it which 03:36:41.719 --> 03:36:45.540 if there is a way to make sure we have our ducks in room we 03:36:45.540 --> 03:36:47.440 vote I'm for that 03:36:47.440 --> 03:36:49.739 so that's that's where I am I'd like to see this move 03:36:49.739 --> 03:36:50.719 forward if it's all 03:36:50.719 --> 03:36:55.959 possible Commissioner back thank you chair and I agree with 03:36:55.959 --> 03:36:56.840 Commissioner 03:36:56.840 --> 03:37:00.739 Roselle I think those are three grand ideas but I still 03:37:00.739 --> 03:37:02.559 would prefer to table 03:37:02.559 --> 03:37:07.170 it mainly just to give at least the residents out there 03:37:07.170 --> 03:37:08.000 time to hear a little 03:37:08.000 --> 03:37:13.909 bit more on that I don't see is there any reason why we can 03:37:13.909 --> 03:37:14.840 't get back on this 03:37:14.840 --> 03:37:22.000 in four to six weeks table it for now and get back on it 03:37:22.000 --> 03:37:22.760 four to six weeks 03:37:22.760 --> 03:37:27.459 given the developer time to meet this crime the criteria 03:37:27.459 --> 03:37:28.920 that we set forth to 03:37:28.920 --> 03:37:34.120 work with the staff and also give residents an opportunity 03:37:34.120 --> 03:37:34.600 to you know 03:37:34.600 --> 03:37:37.290 express our concerns more fully and get a better 03:37:37.290 --> 03:37:39.079 understanding what's going to 03:37:39.079 --> 03:37:41.520 be happening here we certainly want to work with the 03:37:41.520 --> 03:37:43.319 residents and inform all 03:37:43.319 --> 03:37:45.799 of our residents and let them know what's going on we in 03:37:45.799 --> 03:37:47.399 the interest of continuing 03:37:47.399 --> 03:37:53.020 forward we would very much appreciate additional controls 03:37:53.020 --> 03:37:54.680 put in place and move 03:37:54.680 --> 03:37:57.840 forward and also we do that and work with staff ahead of 03:37:57.840 --> 03:37:59.799 council and have 03:37:59.799 --> 03:38:02.729 another maybe community meeting and get more word around 03:38:02.729 --> 03:38:03.959 the to our residents in 03:38:03.959 --> 03:38:07.790 the meantime would be our vast preference okay if there's a 03:38:07.790 --> 03:38:08.319 way to head 03:38:08.319 --> 03:38:11.770 in that direction then I would move that we do table the 03:38:11.770 --> 03:38:13.440 item for four to six 03:38:13.440 --> 03:38:17.190 weeks and let's consider these stipulations get the staff 03:38:17.190 --> 03:38:18.079 to work on it 03:38:18.079 --> 03:38:21.639 and at least open an opportunity for the developer and the 03:38:21.639 --> 03:38:22.959 residents out of ropes 03:38:22.959 --> 03:38:26.290 and ranch to discuss this a little bit more thoroughly what 03:38:26.290 --> 03:38:27.879 sorry can I say one 03:38:27.879 --> 03:38:30.110 more thing would be possible to include that as one of the 03:38:30.110 --> 03:38:31.760 conditions rather 03:38:31.760 --> 03:38:36.290 than table it have a vote include additional some kind of 03:38:36.290 --> 03:38:37.159 additional step 03:38:37.159 --> 03:38:40.610 to be taken ahead of council in order to have a vote 03:38:40.610 --> 03:38:42.200 tonight and move ahead 03:38:42.200 --> 03:38:45.719 with additional community involvement motion would be to 03:38:45.719 --> 03:38:46.479 table it for now and 03:38:46.479 --> 03:38:50.079 work through it I'm sorry is that to table indefinitely or 03:38:50.079 --> 03:38:51.959 let's let's set a 03:38:51.959 --> 03:38:57.149 time frame in as quickly as possible yeah we have we have a 03:38:57.149 --> 03:38:58.040 motion on the 03:38:58.040 --> 03:39:04.270 floor now to table for four weeks four weeks that restating 03:39:04.270 --> 03:39:05.180 your motion 03:39:05.180 --> 03:39:11.909 correctly yes okay we have a motion for table for four 03:39:11.909 --> 03:39:15.159 weeks Commissioner Taylor 03:39:15.159 --> 03:39:22.799 reflected on the board yes second okay so to comment I I 03:39:22.799 --> 03:39:24.079 know that you're in 03:39:24.079 --> 03:39:27.149 hurry and I know that you need to get going and there's a 03:39:27.149 --> 03:39:28.559 financial incentive 03:39:28.559 --> 03:39:31.700 and you know and just in there are a lot of reasons why 03:39:31.700 --> 03:39:33.040 that you want to move 03:39:33.040 --> 03:39:37.069 forward as quickly as possible I just worry about being 03:39:37.069 --> 03:39:38.280 able to get everything 03:39:38.280 --> 03:39:41.889 bundled together between now and City Council I'd like us 03:39:41.889 --> 03:39:42.959 to have one more 03:39:42.959 --> 03:39:46.719 look at it and I'd like it to be completely finished before 03:39:46.719 --> 03:39:47.079 it you know 03:39:47.079 --> 03:39:50.079 before it leaves here or at least two very minor details 03:39:50.079 --> 03:39:51.280 that will be corrected 03:39:51.280 --> 03:39:54.360 before City Council and I think we are looking at a to 03:39:54.360 --> 03:39:55.120 define how a 03:39:55.120 --> 03:39:58.079 neighborhood like facing buffers you know is a street of 03:39:58.079 --> 03:39:59.120 buffers an alley of 03:39:59.120 --> 03:40:02.549 buffers back fence is that acceptable you know those kinds 03:40:02.549 --> 03:40:04.840 of things I I think 03:40:04.840 --> 03:40:08.120 it would be more appropriate for us to see it so that's why 03:40:08.120 --> 03:40:10.440 I second we have a 03:40:10.440 --> 03:40:15.319 first and a second any Commissioner husband so on the 03:40:15.319 --> 03:40:19.850 discussion side of things four weeks puts you into 03:40:19.850 --> 03:40:22.159 Thanksgiving and I just I 03:40:22.159 --> 03:40:26.090 don't think that's very considerate I think staff is fully 03:40:26.090 --> 03:40:27.200 capable and brings 03:40:27.200 --> 03:40:33.739 us quality analysis and data each and every week so for me 03:40:33.739 --> 03:40:34.520 personally I think 03:40:34.520 --> 03:40:39.049 it's to define these two three bullet points I think 03:40:39.049 --> 03:40:40.479 Commissioner Taylor had 03:40:40.479 --> 03:40:47.020 some numbers that fit the 50 80 range and then that allows 03:40:47.020 --> 03:40:48.840 Todd to go back to 03:40:48.840 --> 03:40:55.760 his his chain of command if you will or his his co-workers 03:40:55.760 --> 03:40:57.000 and develop a plan 03:40:57.000 --> 03:41:01.000 works and it's efficient and staff can meet with them daily 03:41:01.000 --> 03:41:02.280 can meet with them 03:41:02.280 --> 03:41:05.399 send emails back and forth without having to worry about 03:41:05.399 --> 03:41:06.840 notifications and 03:41:06.840 --> 03:41:11.370 postings and it just really adds an extra layer that 03:41:11.370 --> 03:41:13.799 probably slows a project 03:41:13.799 --> 03:41:17.920 more than helps let me call on staff and ask them what they 03:41:17.920 --> 03:41:18.479 feel like their 03:41:18.479 --> 03:41:22.620 capability is to get their hands around this and get and 03:41:22.620 --> 03:41:24.120 get it put in a format 03:41:24.120 --> 03:41:27.610 to bring it back sure and and just as a point for the 03:41:27.610 --> 03:41:31.200 record the next P&Z 03:41:31.200 --> 03:41:35.219 meeting within the four-week period would be November 9th 03:41:35.219 --> 03:41:36.440 after the four 03:41:36.440 --> 03:41:39.819 week period would be November 9th that would be the fourth 03:41:39.819 --> 03:41:41.479 week we don't meet 03:41:41.479 --> 03:41:46.120 on the 16th and then it's Thanksgiving calendar I can't 03:41:46.120 --> 03:41:51.319 hear you what early 03:41:51.319 --> 03:41:56.329 December and maybe do a special called but if I recall when 03:41:56.329 --> 03:41:57.559 we set our P&Z 03:41:57.559 --> 03:42:02.760 calendar we skipped the meeting before Thanksgiving we 03:42:02.760 --> 03:42:04.200 could certainly do a 03:42:04.200 --> 03:42:07.000 special call if that's what we needed to do to deal with 03:42:07.000 --> 03:42:08.200 this issue and anything 03:42:08.200 --> 03:42:11.690 else that came forward we have November 9th we have 03:42:11.690 --> 03:42:15.479 November 30th and December 03:42:15.479 --> 03:42:26.280 14th I think maybe a little bit too fast I'm thinking early 03:42:26.280 --> 03:42:27.840 December just because 03:42:27.840 --> 03:42:31.200 we have the move to deal with it is true we are moving 03:42:31.200 --> 03:42:34.680 offices yeah if I may 03:42:34.680 --> 03:42:40.909 Commissioner Husband yeah I it adds an extra layer that we 03:42:40.909 --> 03:42:41.879 don't need I mean as 03:42:41.879 --> 03:42:45.520 far as the the the ability for them to talk every day and 03:42:45.520 --> 03:42:46.840 get meetings done 03:42:46.840 --> 03:42:50.229 every day and emails every day versus having a post a 03:42:50.229 --> 03:42:51.959 meeting come back here I 03:42:51.959 --> 03:42:57.479 think is is cumbersome unnecessarily I mean we'll see we'll 03:42:57.479 --> 03:42:57.879 see how the vote 03:42:57.879 --> 03:43:02.959 shakes out it'll be interesting okay 03:43:02.959 --> 03:43:14.520 I understand okay so what I heard from staff is four weeks 03:43:14.520 --> 03:43:15.360 is gonna be tough 03:43:15.360 --> 03:43:19.170 for them but that's the motion that we have and so we we 03:43:19.170 --> 03:43:20.479 have a first and a 03:43:20.479 --> 03:43:25.739 second and have it on the board Commissioner Sullivan we 03:43:25.739 --> 03:43:27.879 voting to table 03:43:27.879 --> 03:43:33.200 or we voting for somebody to come back at a later date it's 03:43:33.200 --> 03:43:34.079 a it's a motion for 03:43:34.079 --> 03:43:38.360 postponement until November the 9th and let me just make 03:43:38.360 --> 03:43:39.840 the comment I'm all in 03:43:39.840 --> 03:43:44.530 favor of the villains I think they're great but I would I'm 03:43:44.530 --> 03:43:45.440 not gonna be 03:43:45.440 --> 03:43:48.559 comfortable with anything less than where are they gonna be 03:43:48.559 --> 03:43:49.479 so that future 03:43:49.479 --> 03:43:53.360 people know exactly what they're buying into the idea that 03:43:53.360 --> 03:43:57.159 it's 600 somewhere 03:43:57.159 --> 03:44:01.159 personally it's not gonna fly I think that we need to know 03:44:01.159 --> 03:44:02.239 we know where the 03:44:02.239 --> 03:44:05.209 golf course is gonna be and it all has drainage and 03:44:05.209 --> 03:44:06.959 everything along with it so 03:44:06.959 --> 03:44:10.469 I think that asking for detailed where are these places 03:44:10.469 --> 03:44:12.840 gonna be is the minimum 03:44:12.840 --> 03:44:20.520 so just FYI guess Commissioner back thank you chair so am I 03:44:20.520 --> 03:44:22.319 hearing staff 03:44:22.319 --> 03:44:25.620 right then that four weeks is not gonna be enough time and 03:44:25.620 --> 03:44:26.559 I maybe need to 03:44:26.559 --> 03:44:36.120 change my motion and properly vet that change okay 03:44:36.120 --> 03:44:40.649 how much time is sufficient step staff is moving to a new 03:44:40.649 --> 03:44:41.319 location that's 03:44:41.319 --> 03:44:44.120 I think Chandrion has a December and the only meeting we 03:44:44.120 --> 03:44:45.639 have is December 14th I 03:44:45.639 --> 03:44:49.850 believe December the rest of it because of the holiday has 03:44:49.850 --> 03:44:51.079 been canceled okay 03:44:51.079 --> 03:44:59.479 so we're looking at December 14th is that correct yes I 03:44:59.479 --> 03:45:00.920 have November 9th 03:45:00.920 --> 03:45:05.760 November 30th and December 14th is that correct 03:45:05.760 --> 03:45:14.889 so it's thanks getting you know I'm trying to compromise 03:45:14.889 --> 03:45:17.079 here could we do it 03:45:17.079 --> 03:45:24.680 on the 30th is that is that a stretch I mean we have a 03:45:24.680 --> 03:45:28.000 motion we have a second 03:45:28.000 --> 03:45:31.459 can we vote on that before give for we get too far I mean 03:45:31.459 --> 03:45:32.159 we're comparing 03:45:32.159 --> 03:45:36.819 schedules we're changing the date we're you know bouncing 03:45:36.819 --> 03:45:38.399 around new dates my 03:45:38.399 --> 03:45:42.079 mind but I'm just trying to firm up my motion but it's 03:45:42.079 --> 03:45:43.840 already been seconded 03:45:43.840 --> 03:45:47.680 we have a friendly amendment that's what I was getting 03:45:47.680 --> 03:45:48.760 ready to give you the 03:45:48.760 --> 03:45:52.770 opportunities is to make sure that staff could get this 03:45:52.770 --> 03:45:54.399 done so we don't have to 03:45:54.399 --> 03:45:58.319 continue it again so when I was trying to get some feedback 03:45:58.319 --> 03:45:59.479 as to when this 03:45:59.479 --> 03:46:04.159 could get done so I make a motion we tell you well this 03:46:04.159 --> 03:46:05.799 until November 30th 03:46:05.799 --> 03:46:14.479 and we've got a first and a second for the 30th of November 03:46:14.479 --> 03:46:15.639 the night so 03:46:15.639 --> 03:46:22.440 November the 30th it is that's first a second yes okay 03:46:22.440 --> 03:46:31.090 Commissioner Taylor did so I'm a comment my concern is very 03:46:31.090 --> 03:46:32.159 similar to 03:46:32.159 --> 03:46:36.899 Commissioner Taylor's it's the mix-mash without some 03:46:36.899 --> 03:46:39.360 definition I think that 03:46:39.360 --> 03:46:42.450 gives a lot of the homeowners some certainty and I think 03:46:42.450 --> 03:46:43.520 the Villa product 03:46:43.520 --> 03:46:47.319 is a great product it's obviously been received well it's 03:46:47.319 --> 03:46:48.840 just the carte blanche 03:46:48.840 --> 03:46:51.379 you can kind of do whatever you want to do is where I have 03:46:51.379 --> 03:46:52.520 a problem with it so 03:46:52.520 --> 03:46:55.670 whether that's having to go to the extreme of actually 03:46:55.670 --> 03:46:56.799 designating it and 03:46:56.799 --> 03:46:59.260 do not the design work or whether it's done with some 03:46:59.260 --> 03:47:00.600 parameters which I think 03:47:00.600 --> 03:47:07.200 is a good suggestion that's the direction that I would be 03:47:07.200 --> 03:47:09.280 in favor of to 03:47:09.280 --> 03:47:13.629 try to provide additional villas and yet provide existing 03:47:13.629 --> 03:47:15.200 residents some comfort 03:47:15.200 --> 03:47:19.639 that it's not gonna be right next door and some of that so 03:47:19.639 --> 03:47:21.079 I hope that gives 03:47:21.079 --> 03:47:25.639 you some direction from I guess each Commissioner here on 03:47:25.639 --> 03:47:26.719 what they're 03:47:26.719 --> 03:47:32.600 looking for I personally am okay in moving this forward 03:47:32.600 --> 03:47:33.879 with some of those 03:47:33.879 --> 03:47:36.659 criteria I don't know if that can get worked out between 03:47:36.659 --> 03:47:37.600 now and when it would 03:47:37.600 --> 03:47:40.629 go before City Council or not when would this one is this 03:47:40.629 --> 03:47:41.760 currently scheduled to 03:47:41.760 --> 03:47:51.000 go before City Council okay well we have a first and a 03:47:51.000 --> 03:47:52.360 second on the board it 03:47:52.360 --> 03:48:00.280 looks like Commissioner Rizzo this clarification it's on 03:48:00.280 --> 03:48:01.799 the agenda for City 03:48:01.799 --> 03:48:05.290 Council number first is that correct yes sir can it be can 03:48:05.290 --> 03:48:06.440 that agenda item be 03:48:06.440 --> 03:48:11.479 bumped two weeks if they if staff and applicant needed more 03:48:11.479 --> 03:48:13.360 time potentially 03:48:13.360 --> 03:48:21.409 we would just have to republish it it would have to be rep 03:48:21.409 --> 03:48:23.399 ublished yes thank you okay 03:48:23.399 --> 03:48:27.379 so nobody else on more any other discussion before I call 03:48:27.379 --> 03:48:28.280 for a vote on 03:48:28.280 --> 03:48:34.889 the board seeing no call for a vote on the board and the 03:48:34.889 --> 03:48:35.879 motion is going to be 03:48:35.879 --> 03:48:41.120 to continue to a date certain of November the 30th and if 03:48:41.120 --> 03:48:41.920 that motion 03:48:41.920 --> 03:48:46.260 fails and we will look for a new motion to look at moving 03:48:46.260 --> 03:48:48.000 on to some direction 03:48:48.000 --> 03:49:02.680 to City Council motion carries four three to continue to 03:49:02.680 --> 03:49:05.799 November the 30th 03:49:09.040 --> 03:49:12.469 well thank you everybody for a very good discussion on this 03:49:12.469 --> 03:49:13.399 item and all the 03:49:13.399 --> 03:49:16.520 folks that have come out this evening and provided some 03:49:16.520 --> 03:49:18.520 input and our hope is 03:49:18.520 --> 03:49:21.659 a commission here over the next several weeks that some of 03:49:21.659 --> 03:49:22.840 the concerns can get 03:49:22.840 --> 03:49:25.600 addressed and then this can be brought back before us again 03:49:25.600 --> 03:49:30.280 you bet thank you 03:49:30.520 --> 03:49:35.389 that will move us to our final item this evening our 03:49:35.389 --> 03:49:36.879 project matrix and 03:49:36.879 --> 03:49:39.639 concluding items 03:49:52.159 --> 03:50:00.879 does anybody have any requests for the matrix update none 03:50:00.879 --> 03:50:01.680 that Commissioner 03:50:01.680 --> 03:50:06.420 Ellis I do and I don't know if this is for the matrix or if 03:50:06.420 --> 03:50:06.840 this is maybe 03:50:06.840 --> 03:50:10.760 just for me sitting new here but it was on my mind since 03:50:10.760 --> 03:50:13.440 last meeting I want to 03:50:13.440 --> 03:50:17.120 be briefed on how this city determines if a traffic study 03:50:17.120 --> 03:50:18.959 is needed okay is 03:50:18.959 --> 03:50:23.219 there a way to to to maybe have that discussion we actually 03:50:23.219 --> 03:50:23.639 do have 03:50:23.639 --> 03:50:26.610 requirements and if Earl do you have a second to come and 03:50:26.610 --> 03:50:27.799 address the question 03:50:27.799 --> 03:50:32.479 we can't do that because it's not currently on the agenda 03:50:32.479 --> 03:50:34.520 okay so we we 03:50:34.520 --> 03:50:37.049 can get you that information but let's do this let's put it 03:50:37.049 --> 03:50:38.399 on the request and 03:50:38.399 --> 03:50:41.639 then after me you can get with Earl and if by chance he can 03:50:41.639 --> 03:50:42.520 address your 03:50:42.520 --> 03:50:45.479 question individually then we'll just say it's taken care 03:50:45.479 --> 03:50:46.399 of and if not then 03:50:46.399 --> 03:50:49.399 we'll do a full presentation at work session that'd be 03:50:49.399 --> 03:50:53.280 satisfactory okay any 03:50:53.280 --> 03:51:00.139 other items for the matrix I just have a comment I had to 03:51:00.139 --> 03:51:02.840 ask for a update on the 03:51:02.840 --> 03:51:10.840 Luke 28 and I 35 project with text on and I really 03:51:10.840 --> 03:51:12.000 appreciated the timeliness 03:51:12.000 --> 03:51:16.530 of the report that was sent out to update us and the only 03:51:16.530 --> 03:51:17.920 follow-up that I 03:51:17.920 --> 03:51:22.479 would have to that would be on May Hill to find out if 03:51:22.479 --> 03:51:24.399 there is any work that's 03:51:24.399 --> 03:51:28.600 planned or currently going on with the overpass at May Hill 03:51:28.600 --> 03:51:30.479 being that 2499 is 03:51:30.479 --> 03:51:33.649 currently being extended into that and looks like we're 03:51:33.649 --> 03:51:35.280 just moving Luke 288 03:51:35.280 --> 03:51:40.899 just down one little farther south and if may Hill can get 03:51:40.899 --> 03:51:42.879 on the radar so it's 03:51:42.879 --> 03:51:47.479 not a it's the next bottleneck in the city for the foresee 03:51:47.479 --> 03:51:48.760 able future okay 03:51:48.760 --> 03:51:54.959 thank you I really appreciate the report okay thank you 03:51:54.959 --> 03:51:58.799 anybody else okay with 03:51:58.799 --> 03:52:03.370 that I'm going to close our meeting at 908 thank you 03:52:03.370 --> 03:52:04.760 everyone