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meeting our work session meeting for October the 12th. This

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meeting has been

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duly posted and we do have a quorum present and I'm gonna

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call our meeting

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to order at 505 and we've got a number of announcements and

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we're gonna start

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with that I'll turn that over to Shondria to make the

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announcements before we move

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into the clarification of agenda items. Good evening I'm Sh

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andrian Jarvis with

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the development review well I'm the DRC administrator with

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the development

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services department. The first announcement that we have is

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we sent out

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a notice earlier today about a joint P&Z work session but

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there were two dates

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identified December 13th around from about 2 p.m. to 5 p.m.

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January 9th which

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would be a luncheon and then we've added another date as a

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possibility January

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10th which would also be a luncheon so just if you could

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email your

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availability or preference for each of the meetings that

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would be great.

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Okay the second item I have a long list so the second item

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is the Texas APA

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conference we have two spots available for commissioners if

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you want to attend

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the dates are from November 1st to November 3rd and it'll

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be at the San

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Antonio Hyatt Hotel Texas the American Planning Association

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and they'll have a

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short course for commissioners if anybody's interested yes

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and then Ryan

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Mangita will probably want to talk about the neighborhood

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empowerment summit

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that's happening this weekend on the 15th. Hopefully you

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all have received some

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notification regarding the neighborhood empowerment summit

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it's this Saturday

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from 901 it's an opportunity for us to share our programs

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the city's programs

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with the neighborhoods that we have here in Den to help you

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know keep them going

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so that's something that if you all are able to attend are

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available I hope to

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see you there on Saturday. It is this Saturday October 15th

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from a 9 to 1 and

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it's at the MLK junior Recreation Center. And Ron did you

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want to talk about this

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flyer? Also there's a lot of stuff going on this week this

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Thursday Roman

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McAllen our historic preservation officer has put together

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a session for

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a individual from the Texas Commission to come out and

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speak to individuals that

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are interested in learning more about tax incentives that

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is available if

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those properties are eligible or qualify for that type of

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incentive program.

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So something to come in and listen and learn more about

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those incentives. Okay

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thanks. And then lastly I wanted to welcome Joanne Wilk

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erson I'm sorry I

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messed up your name. She is joining us as a planning

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supervisor in the long-range

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section of planning. She's working with Ron in this group.

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She comes to Denton

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with the wealth of knowledge from Dallas and we are very

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excited to have her here.

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And that's it. Great. You can get with Devon on all the

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announcements. There's a bunch of them. Thank you for the

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update with all the

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announcements and things coming up. That's going to move us

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to our first item

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here in our work session which is clarification of agenda

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items and I'll

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turn that over to you for presentation. Okay we'll go

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through the plats. Does

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anybody have any specific question on the plats? Any

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concerns about those? Okay.

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Commissioner back. Thank you. On PP 16-01A I guess we

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probably have to have the map up there but I'm not sure how

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that that track gets access. There's a railroad track there

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and then it's

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doesn't seem to be anything coming in. I'll invite Mike

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Bell. Okay. I'll be happy to answer that.

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Maybe it's easier if I pull it up on our maps here to show

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you the crossing over

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the railroad.

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Which item are you?

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A on consent agenda item. PP 16-01A.

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Well of course this is going to be slow but if you refer to

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the the backup the

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plat itself there is a little road in the southeast corner

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that follows

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the railroad tracks and then it cuts across to Country Club

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Road. It has access

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on Country Club Road, the very southeast corner. Okay. This

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is going to load for us.

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And this area is for single-family homes? This is actually

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owned by the city of

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didn't. It's going to be the Hickory Creek wastewater

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detention facility. It's come

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before the this Commission before with a specific use

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permit in 2014 and so this

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is the plat to make that happen. Let's see if I can find it

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here for you.

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So this is the property and there's a small little sliver

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right here that

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follows the railroad tracks and actually has access on

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Country Club.

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Is this a gravel road? Correct. Okay is that going to be

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improved?

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PS would you like to answer that?

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PS. Long time no see.

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We purchased the whole tract. Let's change my glasses here.

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I'm PS Arora, you know with the water department. I oversee

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the wastewater and

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drainage functions and this is a tract we had purchased all

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the way to Country

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Club Road and the part we are plotting is on the west side

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of the railroad track.

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We purchased also this part of the access from the property

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owner so we own

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this part of the road and yes we will as part of the

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agreement with the property

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owner we are going to improve it so they will always have

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access to their

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property even though we own it so that's part of the

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agreement we have with them.

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Will this be the only means of egress and ingress? Yes sir

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this would be

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because we can't get access over the railroad track to get

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to the site and

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that so that's where we went in and we purchased this part

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from the property

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owner. This is not a problem for like the fire department

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or anything? No sir.

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There is nothing you know it will be a ground storage tank.

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Oh it's a store?

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Okay. A ground storage tank and with an underground pump

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station with a little

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bit electrical but really not nothing major in terms of

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fire. Okay thanks.

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Anything else? Okay. Any more questions on flex? Not on

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that. Okay. Not on A. On B.

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FP-21, FP-1621? Right. We will have Mike Bell come back up.

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Okay. Commissioner back. Thank you chair.

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Sorry. Go ahead. This one area this is phase one I think of

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this. Correct. Is that is

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it gonna be commercial or residential? This is commercial.

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This is commercial.

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Okay. It's actually between phase one phase one's what you

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see here and to the

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west of that is phase two. Phase two will be all

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residential. This corner

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down at the very south end is actually a zone for

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residential but that'll be the

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detention pond that serves this entire Sherman Crossing

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development. Okay. Do we

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know what kind of commercial enterprises will be in there?

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Not yet. Okay. Okay.

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Thank you. Okay. Any more questions on flats? Okay. We'll

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go to the items for

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individual consideration. The first item is PZ 16164. This

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is the consideration

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and appointment of the vice-chair position.

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So we're gonna need a vice-chair so we have. Sorry.

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Commissioner back. I'd like to

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nominate Devin Taylor for vice-chair.

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Commissioner Hussman. I'm gonna second if there's other I

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mean so I don't know if

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there's other names coming out but if not I'm gonna second.

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We will take a first

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and second. I guess will we do a motion here or or first or

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second in a motion

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and vote in chamber? Because it's on for individual

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consideration and chambers

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will do it in there. Okay. So right now we'll just take

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nominations. Is there anybody else who would like to make a

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nomination that may get a second in our council chambers

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meeting? We can discuss

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all that at this time. No? Okay. The only nominee that's

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come forward at least in

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work session would be Devin Taylor with the first and the

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second so we'll look for

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that in our council chambers meeting. Okay and then the

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next item is SP 1602.

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This is the razor-wrench multifamily site plan and I invite

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Mike Bell back to

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the podium again. All right this one should look familiar.

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At last meeting we

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you know considered the recommendation on the design

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standards that went to

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council yesterday and was approved. They are in effect

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exactly as you saw them

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and so this is the actually for the site plan for the

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multifamily project and

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this will be considered by all for approval and if approved

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here it's done

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it doesn't go to council. The request is for a site plan

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again it's in the south

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mixed-use district of razor ranch and it's three components

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a site plan a

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landscape plan and elevations. The property is shown here

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in yellow is

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going to run the middle of the razor ranch south side and

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on that zoning plan

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we saw last time roughly here. This is where Heritage Trail

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has been built

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along by Wynko and that will extend all the way to the

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south to scripture so it has

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furniture on Heritage Trail. This is a little flipped north

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is towards me just

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just kind of walk you through the site. There are five

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buildings up to here that

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are going to contain 300 units. There are a number of gar

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ages accessory garages

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and then there are three kind of amenity open space

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recreation areas on either

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side. To orient you to kind of what's happening in razor to

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the north here's

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Wynko on this lot down here is the convention center and

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this is the the

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back parking lot for the movie theater.

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This is the landscape plan it complies with the code you'll

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see street trees

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and screening for all the parking lots along all the

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private drives. And then

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for elevations they don't show up too well in a PowerPoint

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so I'm gonna go

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ahead and pull them up in the PDF.

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Sorry Commissioner Beck I was watching the presentation.

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Thank you Chair this is

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the only question I have and I asked you this over the

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phone did you find out

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looking at the left elevation that's the end of the

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apartment. Look like you got

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four distinct units there. Is that all one apartment

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running across there? I

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didn't find the answer but I asked the applicant to come

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prepared to answer

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that. Before I go through this I just want to show you.

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Commissioner Hushbuth. Sorry I

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thought you were. No problem. I'll let you finish. No go

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ahead please. Okay can we go back to the

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slide with the buildings that you're highlighting. Oh yes.

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I'm sorry.

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So give me a do you have an idea traffic pattern wise what

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do we what's the flow

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there so if it feeds it's feeding in the Heritage Trail

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primarily how many lanes

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is that key give me just kind of a day in the life of

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getting in and out of

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there. Sure so Heritage Trails four lanes divided roadway

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and they have they're

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gonna have an inter dedicated left turn lane into the side

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here so this will be

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a median opening and then so that that will be the most the

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traffic coming in

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from Heritage Trail. There are also two secondary access

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points along this

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private drive and it's the private drive that separates the

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town center and the

266
00:13:45,279 --> 00:13:48,860
movie theater from Winko and in the apartments. This is

267
00:13:48,860 --> 00:13:50,840
more of a secondary

268
00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:53,529
private street internal driveway you're used to seeing any

269
00:13:53,529 --> 00:13:54,080
type of mall

270
00:13:54,080 --> 00:14:00,250
development. Okay no no no cause for concern I mean I don't

271
00:14:00,250 --> 00:14:00,799
know that we have

272
00:14:00,799 --> 00:14:05,480
much say so in it I'm just curious if you've if with that

273
00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:07,960
amount of traffic

274
00:14:07,960 --> 00:14:10,580
coming in with the with the residents with the movies that

275
00:14:10,580 --> 00:14:11,279
you know so you

276
00:14:11,279 --> 00:14:14,679
have these large surges every two hours let's say if the

277
00:14:14,679 --> 00:14:15,799
movie theater is

278
00:14:15,799 --> 00:14:19,029
looking out just have we considered that and we're

279
00:14:19,029 --> 00:14:20,960
comfortable with. Yes we have

280
00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:23,309
with every with every side plan our engineering department

281
00:14:23,309 --> 00:14:23,879
does request

282
00:14:23,879 --> 00:14:26,960
traffic generation and they analyze that and determine if

283
00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:27,960
we need more turn lanes

284
00:14:27,960 --> 00:14:31,159
or wider roads or whatever it may be and I don't have the

285
00:14:31,159 --> 00:14:32,480
specifics on that but

286
00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:34,509
they did give the okay and I know that they check that

287
00:14:34,509 --> 00:14:35,879
every time on every

288
00:14:35,879 --> 00:14:39,240
request. Okay thank you. If you'd like more information I

289
00:14:39,240 --> 00:14:39,639
could probably have

290
00:14:39,639 --> 00:14:42,220
something for you in regular session. No no that'll be

291
00:14:42,220 --> 00:14:43,559
great thank you. One more

292
00:14:43,559 --> 00:14:47,830
question Commissioner Taylor. Thank you Chair. Kind of

293
00:14:47,830 --> 00:14:48,679
expanding on the traffic

294
00:14:48,679 --> 00:14:52,960
pattern heritage heritage Boulevard is that the name of the

295
00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:53,600
? Heritage trail.

296
00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:58,159
Heritage trail. That's being is that an arterial is it like

297
00:14:58,159 --> 00:14:59,559
a six lane? Yes it is

298
00:14:59,559 --> 00:15:05,110
excuse me it's six lane arterial. Yes. Okay and so I guess

299
00:15:05,110 --> 00:15:05,899
this is this is the

300
00:15:05,899 --> 00:15:11,799
best overall south of 380 site plan right now I think we

301
00:15:11,799 --> 00:15:12,559
have is that is that

302
00:15:12,559 --> 00:15:18,259
true? Correct yeah. What is the in the in the small site

303
00:15:18,259 --> 00:15:19,840
plan it shows a private

304
00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:22,919
road that looks like it's like a 30 or 40 foot private road

305
00:15:22,919 --> 00:15:24,559
two lane along the

306
00:15:24,559 --> 00:15:27,919
south end of the property that crosses Heritage Trail.

307
00:15:27,919 --> 00:15:28,960
Correct. Will that go

308
00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:32,570
ahead and connect on to Bonnie Bray? It will so what you'll

309
00:15:32,570 --> 00:15:33,720
have is this will be

310
00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,190
Linden will connect all the way and it'll be public until

311
00:15:36,190 --> 00:15:36,919
it hits Heritage

312
00:15:36,919 --> 00:15:39,429
Trail once it crosses Heritage Trail the West it'll become

313
00:15:39,429 --> 00:15:41,679
a private street. The

314
00:15:41,679 --> 00:15:43,919
same thing with Crescent. Crescent will actually dead end

315
00:15:43,919 --> 00:15:44,799
into Heritage Trail

316
00:15:44,799 --> 00:15:47,009
and then you'll have Panhandle you can kind of see the

317
00:15:47,009 --> 00:15:48,039
outline of where Panhandle

318
00:15:48,039 --> 00:15:52,480
is gonna be right through here. Okay so are those are those

319
00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:53,960
is there a better

320
00:15:53,960 --> 00:15:56,850
site plan that shows I've seen the concept plans that show

321
00:15:56,850 --> 00:15:57,840
some roads but I

322
00:15:57,840 --> 00:15:59,759
don't think any of them showed Linden and Crescent really.

323
00:15:59,759 --> 00:16:01,720
Is there a current

324
00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:06,580
plan for the layout of roads and in relation to these

325
00:16:06,580 --> 00:16:08,620
zoning categories or

326
00:16:08,620 --> 00:16:11,309
whatever they're called the use categories over here? Yeah

327
00:16:11,309 --> 00:16:12,159
there sure is a

328
00:16:12,159 --> 00:16:15,259
lot it's just conceptual at this point some of them are pad

329
00:16:15,259 --> 00:16:17,440
sides so I can

330
00:16:17,440 --> 00:16:19,250
show it to you but don't don't be too married to the site

331
00:16:19,250 --> 00:16:20,679
plan. Okay. So I'll be

332
00:16:20,679 --> 00:16:22,690
sure to show that to you in the regular session if you'd

333
00:16:22,690 --> 00:16:24,240
like to see that. Okay

334
00:16:24,240 --> 00:16:26,710
and I also was curious it was hard I was having trouble

335
00:16:26,710 --> 00:16:29,120
seeing on the site plan so

336
00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:31,809
this is immediately next to the Winko right and it's like

337
00:16:31,809 --> 00:16:32,919
back back fence to

338
00:16:32,919 --> 00:16:36,200
the Winko. There is a private street between them. Yes it

339
00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:38,000
is. And is there a

340
00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:43,320
good pedestrian access to the north? I was trying to see if

341
00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:43,879
there's like is

342
00:16:43,879 --> 00:16:46,379
that like an eight-foot sidewalk would be along the arter

343
00:16:46,379 --> 00:16:47,159
ial is that is that

344
00:16:47,159 --> 00:16:50,120
accurate or? It's a five-foot sidewalk along the arterial

345
00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:52,820
and do you know the

346
00:16:52,820 --> 00:16:56,850
sidewalks on the private street side? I have to get back to

347
00:16:56,850 --> 00:16:58,000
you on that one I

348
00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:00,690
don't know for sure. Okay because I do imagine if you're a

349
00:17:00,690 --> 00:17:01,639
hundred feet from

350
00:17:01,639 --> 00:17:04,339
the grocery store you're probably gonna walk at least for

351
00:17:04,339 --> 00:17:05,359
small small errands

352
00:17:05,359 --> 00:17:08,329
like you need you know it's probably almost as fast as

353
00:17:08,329 --> 00:17:09,319
going to the garage

354
00:17:09,319 --> 00:17:11,579
and the car out and driving over. So I just wanted to make

355
00:17:11,579 --> 00:17:12,279
sure that that's

356
00:17:12,279 --> 00:17:14,900
that's included in this. We did and when we looked at the

357
00:17:14,900 --> 00:17:15,720
site plan we we showed

358
00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:18,910
it in conjunction with the cross from the town center there

359
00:17:18,910 --> 00:17:19,640
's an opening

360
00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:22,920
basically between the movie theater and the town center

361
00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:24,680
that corresponds to the

362
00:17:24,680 --> 00:17:28,099
north side of this property so this is where that private

363
00:17:28,099 --> 00:17:29,160
drive is and kind of

364
00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:31,849
that's where the opening is in the town center between the

365
00:17:31,849 --> 00:17:33,700
movie theater. And so

366
00:17:33,700 --> 00:17:35,910
could you just put the cursor where roughly where the movie

367
00:17:35,910 --> 00:17:36,400
theater is I

368
00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:38,960
don't remember exactly. Roughly in here. Right there okay

369
00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:41,480
and then the plaza is

370
00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:44,970
just a little bit further west of the movie theater? It's

371
00:17:44,970 --> 00:17:45,720
kind of roughly in

372
00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:49,240
this area. Okay a little bit further north northwest. Okay

373
00:17:49,240 --> 00:17:50,319
thank you.

374
00:17:50,319 --> 00:17:53,640
Commissioner Rossell. I think this is thank you as good a

375
00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:54,880
time and screens as

376
00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:57,960
any desk a couple questions. Heritage Trail haven't driven

377
00:17:57,960 --> 00:17:59,960
on it is it is that

378
00:17:59,960 --> 00:18:03,519
left map up to date? Is it is it? This is the most recent

379
00:18:03,519 --> 00:18:05,920
Google map. What so I

380
00:18:05,920 --> 00:18:08,160
guess my question is is Heritage Trail going to be

381
00:18:08,160 --> 00:18:09,279
continued if so is that the

382
00:18:09,279 --> 00:18:13,549
city going to be expanded or is this complex going to be

383
00:18:13,549 --> 00:18:14,359
required to do some

384
00:18:14,359 --> 00:18:16,569
of that improvement? The developer for Razor Ranch is

385
00:18:16,569 --> 00:18:17,759
building the street all

386
00:18:17,759 --> 00:18:21,359
the way down to Scripture. Okay and that will be done

387
00:18:21,359 --> 00:18:22,880
before construction?

388
00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:25,269
Construction should start here in the next couple months or

389
00:18:25,269 --> 00:18:25,960
they're ready to

390
00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:28,430
go I think as soon as we can get approval of the plans I'll

391
00:18:28,430 --> 00:18:28,839
be building

392
00:18:28,839 --> 00:18:31,680
that road. Okay and then secondarily that you brought up

393
00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:32,759
the point that Crescent

394
00:18:32,759 --> 00:18:35,930
was coming in a dead end. Does that align with the entrance

395
00:18:35,930 --> 00:18:36,599
to the apartments or

396
00:18:36,599 --> 00:18:40,920
what is the impact of that street coming into the apartment

397
00:18:40,920 --> 00:18:42,279
area right there? Well

398
00:18:42,279 --> 00:18:44,819
let me let me clarify I think I misspoke just a bit. The

399
00:18:44,819 --> 00:18:45,839
plan is for Crescent to

400
00:18:45,839 --> 00:18:48,720
end in the park and it may or may not cross the park to hit

401
00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:49,400
Heritage Trail.

402
00:18:49,400 --> 00:18:54,000
Okay. That's still to be determined. Gotcha thank you.

403
00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:56,119
Commissioner Hesbeth.

404
00:18:56,119 --> 00:19:00,470
So just one question and you this I may be getting ahead of

405
00:19:00,470 --> 00:19:02,000
myself but in all of

406
00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:07,500
this the Crescent and Linden extensions if you will is

407
00:19:07,500 --> 00:19:09,319
going to be after Bonnie

408
00:19:09,319 --> 00:19:16,799
Bray's Wadden? Because I couldn't imagine. The Bonnie Bray

409
00:19:16,799 --> 00:19:17,240
is a city

410
00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:20,049
project so these will be happening as the developers ready

411
00:19:20,049 --> 00:19:21,640
to build. I don't

412
00:19:21,640 --> 00:19:23,480
think they're necessarily timed or one's waiting on the

413
00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:24,240
other unless early you

414
00:19:24,240 --> 00:19:28,039
have any other information on that.

415
00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:40,880
Hey Earl. Earl. I'm getting elbowed over here. I can't see

416
00:19:40,880 --> 00:19:42,440
you on television. Sorry Earl Esquire

417
00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:45,579
engineering. Chances are the extension of Linden and Pan

418
00:19:45,579 --> 00:19:47,000
handle and Crescent will

419
00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:50,359
occur before the Wadding and Bonnie Bray. Right now the

420
00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:51,720
city is trying to widen

421
00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:54,700
Bonnie Bray south of the highway. That's the first phase.

422
00:19:54,700 --> 00:19:55,680
The second phase is

423
00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:58,759
everything north of the highway to I believe 380 and we

424
00:19:58,759 --> 00:19:59,839
haven't even started

425
00:19:59,839 --> 00:20:04,109
design on that portion as well at all. I think we have sch

426
00:20:04,109 --> 00:20:05,519
ematics but no our

427
00:20:05,519 --> 00:20:10,890
construction plan designs. So my thought is cost wise is

428
00:20:10,890 --> 00:20:14,559
there a way to structure

429
00:20:14,559 --> 00:20:18,140
that so that we're not recreating the will I guess? I don't

430
00:20:18,140 --> 00:20:19,079
know. I'm just

431
00:20:19,079 --> 00:20:23,220
that's my concern that you would be duplicating that do

432
00:20:23,220 --> 00:20:23,400
duplicating efforts

433
00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:26,599
so if you have to go back in and tear out if we have a

434
00:20:26,599 --> 00:20:28,160
developer willing to

435
00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:31,640
build something I'd like that to remain static versus the

436
00:20:31,640 --> 00:20:32,640
city come in and tear

437
00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:35,339
it out once we widen the street and then we end up paying

438
00:20:35,339 --> 00:20:36,359
for it. It almost

439
00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:39,440
defeats the purpose of having a developer pay for the

440
00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:41,400
street. Yeah it's

441
00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:45,039
more it's a timing issue. I agree with that. However we

442
00:20:45,039 --> 00:20:46,240
just don't have any

443
00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:49,420
grading information on how Bonnie Bray is going to be

444
00:20:49,420 --> 00:20:51,119
designed so you know there

445
00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:54,849
might be some instances where we may have to tear out

446
00:20:54,849 --> 00:20:56,559
portions of linden

447
00:20:56,559 --> 00:20:59,779
crescent or panhandle into the razor range development to

448
00:20:59,779 --> 00:21:00,720
make the grades

449
00:21:00,720 --> 00:21:06,799
work depending on how Bonnie Bray is graded. Okay thank you

450
00:21:06,799 --> 00:21:06,880
.

451
00:21:06,880 --> 00:21:13,440
Commissioner Taylor. Earl before you leave. So I believe

452
00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:15,519
the the northern part of

453
00:21:15,519 --> 00:21:19,029
razor ranch they've already built their roads out on to

454
00:21:19,029 --> 00:21:20,440
onto Bonnie Bray and

455
00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:24,210
they you can see where they end the curb about usually

456
00:21:24,210 --> 00:21:25,240
there's like a curb about

457
00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:27,470
20 feet away from where Bonnie Bray is and there's like a

458
00:21:27,470 --> 00:21:28,240
little extension of

459
00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:32,240
pavement where they're basically planning for where we

460
00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:33,480
think Bonnie Bray

461
00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:35,509
is gonna go right and like they're not gonna they're not

462
00:21:35,509 --> 00:21:36,640
gonna build some fancy

463
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:38,990
sidewalks that connect to the existing street knowing the

464
00:21:38,990 --> 00:21:39,759
existing street is

465
00:21:39,759 --> 00:21:45,079
then gonna move back 15 or 20 feet right? That's correct.

466
00:21:45,079 --> 00:21:46,160
Is it I don't know if

467
00:21:46,160 --> 00:21:48,849
it's possible zoom in on that little spot I can see you're

468
00:21:48,849 --> 00:21:49,680
putting the mouse

469
00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:53,480
on the location.

470
00:22:09,799 --> 00:22:09,940
So when the razor ranch development on the north side came

471
00:22:09,940 --> 00:22:14,799
in they dedicated

472
00:22:14,799 --> 00:22:18,700
the remainder of the right away for Bonnie Bray so they and

473
00:22:18,700 --> 00:22:19,759
I believe they

474
00:22:19,759 --> 00:22:19,759
built the sidewalk within their property in an easement so

475
00:22:19,759 --> 00:22:26,440
that in the future the

476
00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:26,440
city didn't have to rip up that sidewalk. Now it does kind

477
00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:31,720
of taper back into the

478
00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:31,720
right away at where we cross the drive because you don't

479
00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:34,839
want to have your

480
00:22:34,839 --> 00:22:37,920
sidewalk crossing too far into the side. And if you go

481
00:22:37,920 --> 00:22:40,460
safety purposes and could you go a little bit further north

482
00:22:40,460 --> 00:22:41,799
to the next crossing?

483
00:22:41,799 --> 00:22:44,880
And then you could see where it tapers back in. Yeah and

484
00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:45,680
they already have like

485
00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:48,759
some kind of skirting there for where they I'm sure that

486
00:22:48,759 --> 00:22:50,160
was where they expect

487
00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:54,410
the road to be or you know maybe there'll be maybe 20 feet

488
00:22:54,410 --> 00:22:55,000
of concrete

489
00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:58,069
that gets cut out but it's not like okay. You're talking

490
00:22:58,069 --> 00:23:00,799
about this widened section here. Yeah. To be

491
00:23:00,799 --> 00:23:06,720
honest with you I do not know why they did that. So I guess

492
00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:07,599
I just want to

493
00:23:07,599 --> 00:23:10,289
say like this they're obviously you're working with them as

494
00:23:10,289 --> 00:23:11,240
well as you can to

495
00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:14,210
kind of give them what what the current plans are so they

496
00:23:14,210 --> 00:23:15,299
don't have to do too

497
00:23:15,299 --> 00:23:17,910
much or you don't have to do too much rework right? I think

498
00:23:17,910 --> 00:23:18,920
the intention I

499
00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:22,160
think when they came in I believe the intention was that

500
00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:23,440
the sidewalk was gonna

501
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:26,240
taper in and tie in at these points but due to safety

502
00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:27,559
reasons we haven't moved

503
00:23:27,559 --> 00:23:30,930
it back but I think at that point they I think the driveway

504
00:23:30,930 --> 00:23:32,160
was in first before

505
00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:34,690
the sidewalk came in and I think when they built the

506
00:23:34,690 --> 00:23:35,920
driveway first they

507
00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:39,910
anticipated sidewalk crossing to be there. All right thank

508
00:23:39,910 --> 00:23:40,839
you.

509
00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:47,829
All right if there's anything else I'll jump right back in

510
00:23:47,829 --> 00:23:48,799
the elevations.

511
00:23:48,799 --> 00:23:52,039
Continue please thank you. Before I really go through these

512
00:23:52,039 --> 00:23:52,680
I want to I'll

513
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:56,089
go through this building first because it's in color. So

514
00:23:56,089 --> 00:23:57,440
this is the building

515
00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:02,019
on the west side it is the the large building that

516
00:24:02,019 --> 00:24:04,279
surrounds the pool and you

517
00:24:04,279 --> 00:24:08,150
can see the stone and the color choices that they use

518
00:24:08,150 --> 00:24:09,480
somewhat reflect the razor

519
00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:15,799
ranch general color scheme and palette. They do comply with

520
00:24:15,799 --> 00:24:16,400
all the

521
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:19,089
architectural requirements that were approved yesterday and

522
00:24:19,089 --> 00:24:20,359
that you all saw

523
00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:24,250
and then I wanted to point out the accessory garages also

524
00:24:24,250 --> 00:24:24,559
are

525
00:24:24,559 --> 00:24:27,400
architecturally compatible with the main structures so that

526
00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:28,480
they'll be really

527
00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:32,490
nice-looking little garages. Commissioner Ellis. Thank you

528
00:24:32,490 --> 00:24:34,400
chair. Mike are these the

529
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:37,210
hard copies you gave us at last meeting you had said

530
00:24:37,210 --> 00:24:39,119
something on our yes on

531
00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:45,109
the dais that that was this correct okay thank you. That's

532
00:24:45,109 --> 00:24:47,720
really elevations I'm

533
00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:54,559
happy to go through in more detail. There are four criteria

534
00:24:54,559 --> 00:24:56,119
in the razor ranch

535
00:24:56,119 --> 00:24:58,930
overlay district for approval of site plans I've outlined

536
00:24:58,930 --> 00:24:59,960
those in your backup

537
00:24:59,960 --> 00:25:02,259
as well. Happy to go through them if you wish but we've

538
00:25:02,259 --> 00:25:03,079
determined that it meets

539
00:25:03,079 --> 00:25:09,309
all those requirements and we'll be recommending approval.

540
00:25:09,309 --> 00:25:11,079
Any other questions

541
00:25:11,079 --> 00:25:20,880
for Mike on this one? Thank you Mike. Okay we'll skip the

542
00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:21,539
next two

543
00:25:21,539 --> 00:25:26,079
plots unless there's any questions and then go to the

544
00:25:26,079 --> 00:25:27,319
zoning case and I'll ask

545
00:25:27,319 --> 00:25:35,119
Mike Bell to come back for the podium for Z 1619.

546
00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:52,230
One second let me grab my notes. Before I begin I do want

547
00:25:52,230 --> 00:25:53,200
to point out the two

548
00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:56,750
handouts that I gave that I left on your chair before the

549
00:25:56,750 --> 00:26:02,720
meeting started. This

550
00:26:02,720 --> 00:26:06,720
request is a two-parter it's a rezoning request for about

551
00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:08,880
two acres from NR3

552
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:11,839
district to the NRP 12 district. The purpose of this is to

553
00:26:11,839 --> 00:26:13,680
facilitate the new

554
00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:16,839
construction of fire station 4 the city of Denton. The

555
00:26:16,839 --> 00:26:18,079
second part of this is

556
00:26:18,079 --> 00:26:22,359
they're requesting a mixed-use residential protection

557
00:26:22,359 --> 00:26:24,079
overlay that would

558
00:26:24,079 --> 00:26:26,410
restrict all the use of the property back to its current

559
00:26:26,410 --> 00:26:27,720
zoning of NR3 with

560
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:30,019
the exception of community service which is what a fire

561
00:26:30,019 --> 00:26:31,079
station falls under. So

562
00:26:31,079 --> 00:26:33,509
essentially an NR3 district with the exception that it

563
00:26:33,509 --> 00:26:34,480
allows this community

564
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:39,910
service use. So the property is a triangular property here

565
00:26:39,910 --> 00:26:40,359
it's at the

566
00:26:40,359 --> 00:26:44,630
corner of Sherman Drive and Kings Row in the northeast part

567
00:26:44,630 --> 00:26:46,079
of the city. The

568
00:26:46,079 --> 00:26:50,549
existing fire station number four is located on the south

569
00:26:50,549 --> 00:26:51,920
side of Kings Row.

570
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:55,069
The inevitable question is what happens to fire station the

571
00:26:55,069 --> 00:26:55,759
existing fire

572
00:26:55,759 --> 00:26:59,730
station four? I did speak with the assistant fire chief

573
00:26:59,730 --> 00:27:01,160
today to verify that

574
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:04,569
the plan is to keep that building for storage eventually

575
00:27:04,569 --> 00:27:06,119
remodel it. Those are

576
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:10,079
the current plans. Just to clarify Mike but it will stay

577
00:27:10,079 --> 00:27:11,240
under control of the

578
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:15,880
city? That's correct that's the intention for right now.

579
00:27:18,759 --> 00:27:20,250
The existing zoning is a neighborhood residential 3

580
00:27:20,250 --> 00:27:22,000
district that's a single

581
00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:24,920
family district three units per acre and again they're

582
00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:25,640
proposing an

583
00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:30,980
army 12 with an overlay. The future land use map is low

584
00:27:30,980 --> 00:27:32,000
residential which

585
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:34,299
supports single-family up to 40 units an acre which with

586
00:27:34,299 --> 00:27:35,119
this overlay is what

587
00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:41,119
this would be. To kind of highlight the uses that are

588
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:43,039
permitted with this change

589
00:27:43,039 --> 00:27:46,480
again the only changes here in yellow at the community

590
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:48,319
service goes from not

591
00:27:48,319 --> 00:27:52,490
permitted to permitted. Community service is any civic

592
00:27:52,490 --> 00:27:54,839
governmental use, libraries,

593
00:27:54,839 --> 00:28:00,160
fire stations, things like that. I have heard from a number

594
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:01,279
of neighbors who are

595
00:28:01,279 --> 00:28:04,890
concerned not necessarily with the new fire station but

596
00:28:04,890 --> 00:28:06,240
they were concerned

597
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:08,680
about what happens to the old fire station location. So

598
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:09,680
what happens to the

599
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:12,369
existing station and will it be sold? I've already answered

600
00:28:12,369 --> 00:28:13,359
that but they do plan to

601
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:16,480
keep the building used for storage but there is always a

602
00:28:16,480 --> 00:28:17,720
possibility that they

603
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:20,329
sell it. That is the truth. City Council could choose to do

604
00:28:20,329 --> 00:28:21,000
to go otherwise with

605
00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:24,759
that property so it could be it could be sold in the future

606
00:28:24,759 --> 00:28:27,200
. If it was sold with

607
00:28:27,200 --> 00:28:31,549
today's request when support to the south corner being rez

608
00:28:31,549 --> 00:28:33,680
oned in the future. So

609
00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:35,890
the concern is that the city sells and a private developer

610
00:28:35,890 --> 00:28:36,640
comes in and says well

611
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:39,039
there's an army 12 across the street that means that I

612
00:28:39,039 --> 00:28:40,000
should be able to get an

613
00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:43,769
army 12 here. I think that's a very valid concern on its

614
00:28:43,769 --> 00:28:47,000
face. When you really dig

615
00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:49,769
down into it and we do the analysis we'll see it's really

616
00:28:49,769 --> 00:28:50,880
not an army 12 on

617
00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:53,569
this corner it's an R3 that allows fire stations. But how

618
00:28:53,569 --> 00:28:54,920
would y'all know that

619
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:58,480
as commissioners when you get your back up? We're proposing

620
00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:00,059
us a change in our

621
00:29:00,059 --> 00:29:03,740
zoning map symbology and what it'll be is what you're used

622
00:29:03,740 --> 00:29:04,839
to seeing on the

623
00:29:04,839 --> 00:29:07,420
left is how it shows up. You'd see an army 12 you would

624
00:29:07,420 --> 00:29:08,319
never know there was

625
00:29:08,319 --> 00:29:12,109
an overlay unless we told you. On the right what you'll now

626
00:29:12,109 --> 00:29:12,920
begin to see is

627
00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:15,599
this kind of hatch pattern and we may change the symbology

628
00:29:15,599 --> 00:29:16,200
a bit but something

629
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:19,329
to the effect of on the zoning map you'll see something on

630
00:29:19,329 --> 00:29:20,279
there that lets

631
00:29:20,279 --> 00:29:22,200
you know there's a condition of the zoning there's an

632
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:23,079
overlay on the zoning

633
00:29:23,079 --> 00:29:26,200
there's something unique about it it's not a standard in

634
00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:27,160
army 12 or whatever

635
00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:30,599
district that it may be. So that in the future if these

636
00:29:30,599 --> 00:29:31,759
planners aren't here or

637
00:29:31,759 --> 00:29:35,930
this commission turns over they'll know to look for that.

638
00:29:35,930 --> 00:29:37,480
Commissioner Beck. Thank

639
00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:41,519
you chair. So where the existing fire station is now is in

640
00:29:41,519 --> 00:29:46,359
R3? Correct. Okay.

641
00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:55,380
Sure. In the past we've talked about these overlays that we

642
00:29:55,380 --> 00:29:56,559
were putting on

643
00:29:56,559 --> 00:29:59,819
zoning and you know we cannot have conditional zoning but

644
00:29:59,819 --> 00:30:00,720
the council has

645
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:06,589
already approved a an overlay for mixed-use residential

646
00:30:06,589 --> 00:30:07,960
type arrangements

647
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:11,920
so we're able to use that we've gone ahead and changed our

648
00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:13,319
postings in the

649
00:30:13,319 --> 00:30:16,660
paper where we're allowed to do a more restrictive use so

650
00:30:16,660 --> 00:30:17,720
you can move forward

651
00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:21,359
tonight on that if you wish. You might ask why can't we do

652
00:30:21,359 --> 00:30:22,680
this in other

653
00:30:22,680 --> 00:30:25,940
locations the reason is this mixed-use protection overlay

654
00:30:25,940 --> 00:30:26,759
is specific in our

655
00:30:26,759 --> 00:30:31,230
code to the NR districts so you know we've had other cases

656
00:30:31,230 --> 00:30:32,039
even the recent

657
00:30:32,039 --> 00:30:35,039
past why we can't limit all visas down it's just for NR

658
00:30:35,039 --> 00:30:36,319
districts. I was just

659
00:30:36,319 --> 00:30:40,009
getting ready to ask that question. Yes as I thought you

660
00:30:40,009 --> 00:30:42,200
might so just keep keep

661
00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:44,809
keep an eye out for that that hatching so that y'all will

662
00:30:44,809 --> 00:30:45,640
now know in the

663
00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:49,400
future it's just to help us when staff looks at it we'll go

664
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:50,039
and identify

665
00:30:50,039 --> 00:30:52,329
everything and make sure that there's no conditions but to

666
00:30:52,329 --> 00:30:53,039
make it easier for

667
00:30:53,039 --> 00:30:55,730
y'all and the council and the developer who comes and looks

668
00:30:55,730 --> 00:30:56,559
at our zoning maps

669
00:30:56,559 --> 00:30:58,910
know that there's something there. So just to follow up on

670
00:30:58,910 --> 00:31:00,359
your point this is

671
00:31:00,359 --> 00:31:04,730
a tool that we can use in in our zoning areas only. Correct

672
00:31:04,730 --> 00:31:05,799
. So that's across the

673
00:31:05,799 --> 00:31:09,359
board citywide we can this may come up again and that would

674
00:31:09,359 --> 00:31:10,279
be an option as a

675
00:31:10,279 --> 00:31:14,069
condition that this board can use in these instances but it

676
00:31:14,069 --> 00:31:15,039
wouldn't be in

677
00:31:15,039 --> 00:31:17,549
some of the other zoning categories commercial and some of

678
00:31:17,549 --> 00:31:18,279
the things that

679
00:31:18,279 --> 00:31:21,450
may come before us that overlay is not an option for us to

680
00:31:21,450 --> 00:31:22,000
use and I

681
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:25,359
understand incorrectly what we're doing. That is correct

682
00:31:25,359 --> 00:31:26,200
and with the caveat

683
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:28,720
there are certain things that you can limit with this

684
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:30,000
overlay. Increased

685
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:32,720
setbacks, increased building materials and then use

686
00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:33,920
standards and use

687
00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:36,130
restrictions which is what we're doing here use restriction

688
00:31:36,130 --> 00:31:39,720
. Okay. Great thank

689
00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:43,430
you. And then option number two this has been brought up in

690
00:31:43,430 --> 00:31:44,640
the subcommittee for

691
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:49,109
the city initiated rezonings is the idea of a government

692
00:31:49,109 --> 00:31:51,200
zoning district being

693
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:54,539
created that allows just government uses. I bring this up

694
00:31:54,539 --> 00:31:55,640
because it did come up

695
00:31:55,640 --> 00:32:01,839
in the subcommittee and Mr. Crossman who you have the email

696
00:32:01,839 --> 00:32:03,039
from he was very

697
00:32:03,039 --> 00:32:05,059
concerned about this and I discussed him I told him it's

698
00:32:05,059 --> 00:32:05,920
not a guarantee but

699
00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:09,200
something we're working on but he wanted to urge that if

700
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:10,880
that can't happen to

701
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:14,029
move forward so I want to put that on the record. Is he

702
00:32:14,029 --> 00:32:15,440
concerned about it on

703
00:32:15,440 --> 00:32:20,380
the old building so his concern or the new? He's concerned

704
00:32:20,380 --> 00:32:21,200
that this would open

705
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:23,619
it up the old station to be rezoned for commercials and I

706
00:32:23,619 --> 00:32:24,400
heard that from a

707
00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:29,900
number of neighbors as well. Okay. So the idea being if we

708
00:32:29,900 --> 00:32:31,000
create this zoning

709
00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,769
district government zoning those are on the subcommittee

710
00:32:33,769 --> 00:32:35,079
please remember that to

711
00:32:35,079 --> 00:32:39,839
include this site is what he's asking for. Got you.

712
00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:44,009
And we did notice per state law we received one in

713
00:32:44,009 --> 00:32:46,200
opposition one in favor

714
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:51,029
that's the email and notice that you've received back and

715
00:32:51,029 --> 00:32:52,240
staff will be

716
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:57,980
recommending approval. I'm happy to answer any questions.

717
00:32:57,980 --> 00:33:00,039
Questions for Mike?

718
00:33:00,039 --> 00:33:06,849
Thank you. Okay the next item is a rezoning request along

719
00:33:06,849 --> 00:33:08,720
Crossford Road

720
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:12,759
and I will invite Julie Wyatt up.

721
00:33:16,359 --> 00:33:23,190
Good evening I'm Julie Wyatt. This request before you is Z

722
00:33:23,190 --> 00:33:25,319
1624 Ranchview

723
00:33:25,319 --> 00:33:30,319
Specialty Hospital initial zoning. The request is to

724
00:33:30,319 --> 00:33:30,720
consider a

725
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:34,690
recommendation regarding an initial zoning district

726
00:33:34,690 --> 00:33:36,519
designation of RCCN on

727
00:33:36,519 --> 00:33:40,799
approximately a third of an acre. This property may look

728
00:33:40,799 --> 00:33:42,680
familiar to you. We

729
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:46,609
did we did look at a zoning case on this a few meetings

730
00:33:46,609 --> 00:33:48,880
back. The subject property

731
00:33:48,880 --> 00:33:52,490
is right here in yellow and it is generally located on the

732
00:33:52,490 --> 00:33:53,440
north side of

733
00:33:53,440 --> 00:34:02,519
Crawford Road approximately 675 feet from the I-35W on ramp

734
00:34:02,519 --> 00:34:04,839
. The current

735
00:34:04,839 --> 00:34:09,840
zoning is RD5X and that is a place holding zoning

736
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:11,800
designation that we give

737
00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:16,329
to properties that are recently annexed. So when the

738
00:34:16,329 --> 00:34:18,800
applicant came forward

739
00:34:18,800 --> 00:34:22,550
to the city earlier this year they proposed a specialty

740
00:34:22,550 --> 00:34:23,400
hospital that would

741
00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:28,269
include three tracts. This tract that the case that y'all

742
00:34:28,269 --> 00:34:30,280
saw earlier, this

743
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:35,469
tract that's RCCN here and then this small tract here. This

744
00:34:35,469 --> 00:34:36,760
small tract was in

745
00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:40,889
the county and so through our discussions with them and and

746
00:34:40,889 --> 00:34:41,360
how it

747
00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:44,440
should move forward in development we came to an agreement

748
00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:45,360
that really that

749
00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:47,650
should probably be annexed just so that there are

750
00:34:47,650 --> 00:34:48,920
consistent regulations

751
00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:52,230
throughout the development. So they went through that annex

752
00:34:52,230 --> 00:34:53,280
ation process through

753
00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:56,960
voluntary annexation and that was approved in September of

754
00:34:56,960 --> 00:34:57,840
this year and

755
00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:02,880
so at that time it received that RD5X zoning designation.

756
00:35:02,880 --> 00:35:04,039
So that's our place

757
00:35:04,039 --> 00:35:09,170
holding zoning designation but it mimics the RD5, it's a

758
00:35:09,170 --> 00:35:10,719
rural residential zoning

759
00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:14,159
district within the city of Denton. It mostly has

760
00:35:14,159 --> 00:35:15,760
residential uses or rural

761
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:19,699
type uses and a minimum of five acres. So obviously this

762
00:35:19,699 --> 00:35:21,119
this piece of property

763
00:35:21,119 --> 00:35:24,199
which is smaller than five acres doesn't doesn't meet the

764
00:35:24,199 --> 00:35:24,559
minimum

765
00:35:24,559 --> 00:35:29,349
regulations for this but there is adjacent RCCN zoning

766
00:35:29,349 --> 00:35:30,559
which is part of

767
00:35:30,559 --> 00:35:35,230
this proposed development. There's Country Lakes West here.

768
00:35:35,230 --> 00:35:36,039
This is actually

769
00:35:36,039 --> 00:35:39,559
ETJ, this is in the extraterritorial jurisdiction, it's not

770
00:35:39,559 --> 00:35:40,559
a part of the city

771
00:35:40,559 --> 00:35:44,840
of Denton and then across the highway is Hunter Ranch MPC.

772
00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:45,840
More specifically

773
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:49,309
with this Hunter Ranch MPC this is more of a moderate

774
00:35:49,309 --> 00:35:51,440
density and commercial

775
00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:56,320
zoning in this area. So we looked at the future land use

776
00:35:56,320 --> 00:35:57,719
designation and it

777
00:35:57,719 --> 00:36:01,159
shows low density residential and as we talked about on the

778
00:36:01,159 --> 00:36:02,199
previous zoning

779
00:36:02,199 --> 00:36:06,760
designation this RCCN really doesn't fit that that rural

780
00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:09,440
residential zoning or

781
00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:13,230
future land use designation. The intent of that is to have

782
00:36:13,230 --> 00:36:14,320
one to four dwelling

783
00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:18,510
units per acre in a suburban type development pattern. When

784
00:36:18,510 --> 00:36:19,480
we look at the

785
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:23,760
location of this property on an arterial and and close to

786
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:25,239
highway with that type

787
00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:30,860
of access and visibility residential development probably

788
00:36:30,860 --> 00:36:31,840
isn't gonna happen

789
00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:35,210
here. It's it's more appropriate for commercial type

790
00:36:35,210 --> 00:36:37,239
development. So we looked

791
00:36:37,239 --> 00:36:39,449
and we're like oh this this future land use designation

792
00:36:39,449 --> 00:36:40,360
doesn't really fit this

793
00:36:40,360 --> 00:36:44,150
request so we want to take a deeper look at this request.

794
00:36:44,150 --> 00:36:46,079
So we looked further in

795
00:36:46,079 --> 00:36:49,059
the comprehensive plan and we looked at the preferred

796
00:36:49,059 --> 00:36:50,360
growth concept. This

797
00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:56,679
document was prepared with community involvement when they

798
00:36:56,679 --> 00:36:57,119
updated

799
00:36:57,119 --> 00:37:02,280
the comprehensive plan they had community meetings that the

800
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:02,280
the

801
00:37:02,280 --> 00:37:05,099
participants said where do we want development within the

802
00:37:05,099 --> 00:37:05,840
city of Denton

803
00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:10,210
and they came they agreed upon this compact purposeful

804
00:37:10,210 --> 00:37:11,800
growth clustered

805
00:37:11,800 --> 00:37:15,630
around distinct locations and I know it's kind of hard to

806
00:37:15,630 --> 00:37:16,840
see but down here

807
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:22,679
is the Crawford Road and I-35W intersection. So this was

808
00:37:22,679 --> 00:37:23,440
one of those

809
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:27,789
areas that was determined that it development should really

810
00:37:27,789 --> 00:37:28,800
happen here and

811
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:34,000
in this instance that it was determined a moderate density

812
00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:34,800
residential or

813
00:37:34,800 --> 00:37:37,300
moderate density development and that included moderate

814
00:37:37,300 --> 00:37:38,239
density residential

815
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:43,179
uses, employment uses, and commercial uses and and the uses

816
00:37:43,179 --> 00:37:44,239
embedded in the in

817
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:51,800
the RCCN do fit this this moderate density preferred growth

818
00:37:51,800 --> 00:37:53,280
. So the

819
00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:56,460
considerations we looked at was that future residential

820
00:37:56,460 --> 00:37:57,800
development at Robeson

821
00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:01,250
Ranch and then Hunter Ranch MPC, the Country Lakes, this is

822
00:38:01,250 --> 00:38:02,039
going to induce

823
00:38:02,039 --> 00:38:05,340
more demand for retail and services in this area. The

824
00:38:05,340 --> 00:38:07,639
requested RCCN is a

825
00:38:07,639 --> 00:38:12,000
logical extension of that existing zoning pattern and

826
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:13,159
although it doesn't

827
00:38:13,159 --> 00:38:16,639
conform to the future land use map it does conform to the

828
00:38:16,639 --> 00:38:17,920
preferred growth

829
00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:21,190
concept and that we want commercial development at these

830
00:38:21,190 --> 00:38:22,280
intersections of

831
00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:27,159
highways and arterials and that commercial and office

832
00:38:27,159 --> 00:38:27,800
development

833
00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:30,539
really should be clustered in these areas as distinct

834
00:38:30,539 --> 00:38:31,440
centers and then

835
00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:35,800
transition to to the low density uses toward Country Lakes

836
00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:37,360
and in the Robeson

837
00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:41,519
Ranch area. Notification was sent out. We received no

838
00:38:41,519 --> 00:38:43,920
response letters and so

839
00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:47,230
based upon these considerations and and the Denton plan we

840
00:38:47,230 --> 00:38:48,079
do recommend

841
00:38:48,079 --> 00:38:51,880
approval and I'll stand for any questions.

842
00:38:56,000 --> 00:39:03,639
Thank you Julie. So we have one more this is a plan

843
00:39:03,639 --> 00:39:04,920
development amendment for

844
00:39:04,920 --> 00:39:09,280
Robeson Ranch PD 16-7. All right so we're gonna stay in the

845
00:39:09,280 --> 00:39:10,400
general area of the

846
00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:13,199
city of Denton. So this is this is a plan development

847
00:39:13,199 --> 00:39:14,519
amendment for Robeson

848
00:39:14,519 --> 00:39:19,059
Ranch. The request is to consider making a recommendation

849
00:39:19,059 --> 00:39:19,760
to City Council

850
00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:23,050
regarding a detailed plan amendment for Robeson Ranch and

851
00:39:23,050 --> 00:39:24,159
what they're wanting

852
00:39:24,159 --> 00:39:27,449
to do is blend the residential uses and we'll go into that

853
00:39:27,449 --> 00:39:28,460
and explain that

854
00:39:28,460 --> 00:39:34,469
further throughout the development. So the subject property

855
00:39:34,469 --> 00:39:35,440
is located

856
00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:40,559
north of Robeson Ranch. It is west of I-35W probably

857
00:39:40,559 --> 00:39:41,719
familiar with where Robeson

858
00:39:41,719 --> 00:39:46,610
Ranch is. Some background on the plan development it's PD

859
00:39:46,610 --> 00:39:48,599
173. It was

860
00:39:48,599 --> 00:39:51,849
developed under the 1991 Denton development or Denton

861
00:39:51,849 --> 00:39:52,719
development code

862
00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:59,510
sorry and PDs under under the 91 code had they were kind of

863
00:39:59,510 --> 00:40:00,239
a two-part process.

864
00:40:00,239 --> 00:40:03,650
The first part was a concept plan that was the general

865
00:40:03,650 --> 00:40:06,039
guidelines and land uses.

866
00:40:06,039 --> 00:40:11,659
Robeson Ranch was approved in 1999. The concept plan was

867
00:40:11,659 --> 00:40:13,199
and their purpose

868
00:40:13,199 --> 00:40:18,079
statement emphasized flexibility in a variety of housing

869
00:40:18,079 --> 00:40:18,639
options

870
00:40:18,639 --> 00:40:22,320
for an adult community. So that was that was their purpose

871
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:24,159
and intent and that's

872
00:40:24,159 --> 00:40:27,630
reflected in the residential land uses that they approved.

873
00:40:27,630 --> 00:40:29,440
Single-family luxury,

874
00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:35,199
single family Premier and single-family Casita were all had

875
00:40:35,199 --> 00:40:35,559
the same

876
00:40:35,559 --> 00:40:39,210
permitted uses. They were single-family detached dwellings

877
00:40:39,210 --> 00:40:40,159
as well as some

878
00:40:40,159 --> 00:40:45,349
religious institutions, golf courses, public infrastructure

879
00:40:45,349 --> 00:40:46,840
, fire stations, those

880
00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:49,590
sorts of things that you would need for a residential

881
00:40:49,590 --> 00:40:50,619
development. The

882
00:40:50,619 --> 00:40:54,070
differences between these residential land uses was the lot

883
00:40:54,070 --> 00:40:55,079
size and then the

884
00:40:55,079 --> 00:40:58,519
minimum building square foot. So they were they were

885
00:40:58,519 --> 00:40:59,800
comparable in terms of

886
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:03,969
uses but but the sizes were different. Single-family Villa

887
00:41:03,969 --> 00:41:05,039
permitted two

888
00:41:05,039 --> 00:41:08,880
family attached dwellings so it's it's different in the

889
00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:10,559
permitted uses and then

890
00:41:10,559 --> 00:41:13,389
it also has differences in minimum lot size and square

891
00:41:13,389 --> 00:41:14,320
footage and then

892
00:41:14,320 --> 00:41:17,690
multifamily allowed for multifamily development as well as

893
00:41:17,690 --> 00:41:18,599
some recreational

894
00:41:18,599 --> 00:41:23,329
facilities nursing homes so and in libraries so some some

895
00:41:23,329 --> 00:41:23,639
different

896
00:41:23,639 --> 00:41:30,179
permitted uses. That was all in the concept plan. Since

897
00:41:30,179 --> 00:41:32,400
1999 the as the

898
00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:34,659
project has evolved there have been detailed plans that

899
00:41:34,659 --> 00:41:35,760
have been approved. A

900
00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:40,170
detailed plan is the final step of a PD and it it parses

901
00:41:40,170 --> 00:41:42,079
out the details of the

902
00:41:42,079 --> 00:41:44,599
development and in terms of ropes and ranch it showed where

903
00:41:44,599 --> 00:41:45,400
the golf courses

904
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:48,719
went where the clubhouse was going to go and then it gave

905
00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:50,239
specific locations for

906
00:41:50,239 --> 00:41:54,329
all of those residential uses and so let's look at that

907
00:41:54,329 --> 00:41:55,239
sorry it may be

908
00:41:55,239 --> 00:42:00,090
difficult to see but so the traditional lots one of those

909
00:42:00,090 --> 00:42:01,199
residential land use

910
00:42:01,199 --> 00:42:03,559
categories that's the yellow and you can see the yellow

911
00:42:03,559 --> 00:42:04,519
interspersed throughout

912
00:42:04,519 --> 00:42:09,960
the development. The gray was the premier lots the blue was

913
00:42:09,960 --> 00:42:11,320
the preserve lots and

914
00:42:11,320 --> 00:42:16,039
then those were the single-family luxury and then the

915
00:42:16,039 --> 00:42:17,480
single-family villa were

916
00:42:17,480 --> 00:42:20,760
down in this location so it gave specific locations for all

917
00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:21,280
of those

918
00:42:21,280 --> 00:42:26,480
residential uses. As the project has moved forward and

919
00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:29,360
developed the applicant

920
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:32,650
has has realized it that maybe that mix or those specific

921
00:42:32,650 --> 00:42:33,800
locations of those

922
00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:36,880
residential uses didn't provide them with the flexibility

923
00:42:36,880 --> 00:42:37,760
that they needed to

924
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:42,800
continue developing. So they are they have a proposal for a

925
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:43,480
detail plan

926
00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:46,739
amendment which would permit those residential land use

927
00:42:46,739 --> 00:42:48,480
categories of the

928
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:51,769
single-family luxury, single-family premier, the single-

929
00:42:51,769 --> 00:42:52,880
family casita, and

930
00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:56,750
the single-family villa within all areas designated as

931
00:42:56,750 --> 00:42:58,940
residential. For the

932
00:42:58,940 --> 00:43:02,780
single-family villa they're proposing a maximum of 1,200

933
00:43:02,780 --> 00:43:04,440
dwelling units and then

934
00:43:04,440 --> 00:43:09,559
this does not this this request does not permit multifamily

935
00:43:09,559 --> 00:43:11,039
that if they did want

936
00:43:11,039 --> 00:43:14,679
to come back for the MF2 they would they would have to come

937
00:43:14,679 --> 00:43:15,360
back with another

938
00:43:15,360 --> 00:43:18,119
detailed plan amendment this doesn't allow them to put

939
00:43:18,119 --> 00:43:19,840
multifamily to within

940
00:43:19,840 --> 00:43:23,480
those residential areas that that would have to come back.

941
00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:25,440
This request does not

942
00:43:25,440 --> 00:43:28,519
increase the number of dwelling units it or increase the

943
00:43:28,519 --> 00:43:29,719
density it really and

944
00:43:29,719 --> 00:43:33,869
I'm gonna use Commissioner Beck's word it integrates it

945
00:43:33,869 --> 00:43:35,000
integrates the

946
00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:38,650
residential uses so and reallocates them throughout the

947
00:43:38,650 --> 00:43:40,639
development. Yes sir.

948
00:43:40,639 --> 00:43:45,110
Commissioner Beck. Thank you chair. Okay we talked about

949
00:43:45,110 --> 00:43:46,679
this over the phone too so

950
00:43:46,679 --> 00:43:49,110
when you say integrate though it's not like you're just

951
00:43:49,110 --> 00:43:50,320
gonna have a hodgepodge

952
00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:54,280
there's still gonna be some sectioning off. Well that is my

953
00:43:54,280 --> 00:43:55,280
understanding of how

954
00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:59,750
it will work in practice. This zoning so there's there's I

955
00:43:59,750 --> 00:44:01,400
guess there's two

956
00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:05,869
elements the zoning would allow that because the zoning

957
00:44:05,869 --> 00:44:06,719
says that those would

958
00:44:06,719 --> 00:44:11,469
allow one lot to be duplex and one lot to be the single-

959
00:44:11,469 --> 00:44:12,320
family it would allow

960
00:44:12,320 --> 00:44:15,440
the mixing in that in those terms it's not as specific that

961
00:44:15,440 --> 00:44:17,500
specific. Did I say

962
00:44:17,500 --> 00:44:21,059
that right? Did that make sense? Okay but in practice in my

963
00:44:21,059 --> 00:44:21,920
discussions with the

964
00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:27,110
applicant because those villas that the the duplex the two-

965
00:44:27,110 --> 00:44:29,039
family product has an

966
00:44:29,039 --> 00:44:33,909
additional additional HOA because they have total exterior

967
00:44:33,909 --> 00:44:36,440
maintenance those in

968
00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:39,849
practice will be grouped together in specific locations

969
00:44:39,849 --> 00:44:40,960
because they have

970
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:45,920
that additional HOA on top of them. Did that did that make

971
00:44:45,920 --> 00:44:47,119
it? It's not like they'll

972
00:44:47,119 --> 00:44:50,199
be stuck in a corner somewhere they'll get a it'll still

973
00:44:50,199 --> 00:44:51,800
intermingle. There'll be

974
00:44:51,800 --> 00:44:54,489
intermingled throughout it we don't quite know how it's

975
00:44:54,489 --> 00:44:55,760
gonna work in

976
00:44:55,760 --> 00:45:02,199
or how it's gonna look in the final design but but this is

977
00:45:02,199 --> 00:45:03,920
so now instead of

978
00:45:03,920 --> 00:45:06,829
all of the different colors all the yellow and the gray and

979
00:45:06,829 --> 00:45:07,599
the blue and the

980
00:45:07,599 --> 00:45:11,349
brown for residential that has been flattened out to just

981
00:45:11,349 --> 00:45:13,039
yellow and so all

982
00:45:13,039 --> 00:45:16,920
those four residential unit dwelling residential use

983
00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:18,039
categories could be

984
00:45:18,039 --> 00:45:24,840
permitted in all yellow areas so that's their proposal.

985
00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:25,840
Thank you. Commissioner

986
00:45:25,840 --> 00:45:30,400
Ellis. Thank You Chair. Julie you mentioned it's not

987
00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:31,960
increasing the proposal is not

988
00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:35,440
increasing the total number of units is it oh is it

989
00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:37,480
increasing the total villa

990
00:45:37,480 --> 00:45:41,840
units? It is it is if you'll look back at the original

991
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:44,199
proposal this is how many

992
00:45:44,199 --> 00:45:48,170
villa units that they that they had. My conversations with

993
00:45:48,170 --> 00:45:49,440
the applicant is that

994
00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:52,880
those sold out really fast and so they want flexibility to

995
00:45:52,880 --> 00:45:54,519
add more of those so

996
00:45:54,519 --> 00:45:58,059
yes it does increase the number to 1,200. What was the

997
00:45:58,059 --> 00:46:00,320
original number? It was

998
00:46:00,320 --> 00:46:09,760
something like 60 it was 60. Commissioner Sullivan. Thank

999
00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:12,360
you Chair. My concern is that in the areas

1000
00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:18,130
where you currently have the Premier Lots say off of

1001
00:46:18,130 --> 00:46:20,440
Michelle Way that have

1002
00:46:20,440 --> 00:46:24,719
already been built that they bought those with the

1003
00:46:24,719 --> 00:46:25,679
understanding of what was

1004
00:46:25,679 --> 00:46:29,190
going in next door to them so to speak and now they're

1005
00:46:29,190 --> 00:46:30,400
asking to change it to

1006
00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:35,159
where it could drastically change what's going in next door

1007
00:46:35,159 --> 00:46:36,719
. Well is that correct?

1008
00:46:36,719 --> 00:46:42,000
It could change the residential use category product yes

1009
00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:43,480
and staff did look

1010
00:46:43,480 --> 00:46:47,190
at that and because all of these uses were permitted within

1011
00:46:47,190 --> 00:46:48,320
the concept plan

1012
00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:51,929
that this was intended to be kind of a mixed-use housing

1013
00:46:51,929 --> 00:46:53,800
that that was one of

1014
00:46:53,800 --> 00:46:57,960
the the criteria we looked at for approval and we felt like

1015
00:46:57,960 --> 00:46:59,239
because we're

1016
00:46:59,239 --> 00:47:02,360
not really expanding the types of uses these would all be

1017
00:47:02,360 --> 00:47:03,400
the uses that were

1018
00:47:03,400 --> 00:47:10,969
approved with the original concept plan. So is that all

1019
00:47:10,969 --> 00:47:14,400
right so. Hold on. Commissioner Tyler.

1020
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:19,030
Thank you Chair. So could we go back to the proposed yeah

1021
00:47:19,030 --> 00:47:20,760
this map so it

1022
00:47:20,760 --> 00:47:25,349
indicates lots but those lots would change so you're not

1023
00:47:25,349 --> 00:47:26,719
you know or are you

1024
00:47:26,719 --> 00:47:29,719
gonna put a duplex I guess on a single on the single lots

1025
00:47:29,719 --> 00:47:30,800
basically or are they

1026
00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:34,099
going to redraw them? No and they wouldn't redraw these

1027
00:47:34,099 --> 00:47:35,480
lots we do have a

1028
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:38,900
running tally of the number of lots within Robeson Ranch

1029
00:47:38,900 --> 00:47:39,719
and they're

1030
00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:47,000
they're separated out into units so they can change the

1031
00:47:47,000 --> 00:47:49,000
density of one area as

1032
00:47:49,000 --> 00:47:53,559
long as the total density stays the same so this does show

1033
00:47:53,559 --> 00:47:55,159
lots but it's really

1034
00:47:55,159 --> 00:47:58,400
more schematic at this point it would when they come in for

1035
00:47:58,400 --> 00:47:59,440
platting as long

1036
00:47:59,440 --> 00:48:05,159
as they maintain the the maximum density and that number of

1037
00:48:05,159 --> 00:48:08,079
lots then this won't

1038
00:48:08,079 --> 00:48:11,360
drive exactly where those lots are placed it's not

1039
00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:12,159
dimensioned out

1040
00:48:12,159 --> 00:48:16,420
necessarily. So for example like unit 10 I think actually

1041
00:48:16,420 --> 00:48:17,079
just we might already

1042
00:48:17,079 --> 00:48:20,159
approved unit 10. Yes right here. Yeah maybe the one like

1043
00:48:20,159 --> 00:48:21,719
unit 18 next to it or

1044
00:48:21,719 --> 00:48:27,030
whatever that would be that would potentially be replanted

1045
00:48:27,030 --> 00:48:27,960
to smaller or

1046
00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:30,460
when it comes to platting it will be smaller lots

1047
00:48:30,460 --> 00:48:32,400
potentially? It could be and

1048
00:48:32,400 --> 00:48:36,590
as long as we keep that that running total to make sure

1049
00:48:36,590 --> 00:48:37,800
they maintain that

1050
00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:42,269
total maximum density. Is there any reason not to go ahead

1051
00:48:42,269 --> 00:48:43,559
and preserve the

1052
00:48:43,559 --> 00:48:48,440
categories of the already plotted areas? They're not gonna

1053
00:48:48,440 --> 00:48:49,980
probably replat

1054
00:48:49,980 --> 00:48:53,519
those right? And they would I mean yes I wouldn't imagine

1055
00:48:53,519 --> 00:48:54,880
that they would replat

1056
00:48:54,880 --> 00:48:57,570
those that the applicants here and they could probably talk

1057
00:48:57,570 --> 00:48:58,320
about how or the

1058
00:48:58,320 --> 00:49:00,130
applicant will be here this evening they could talk about

1059
00:49:00,130 --> 00:49:01,039
how they're gonna move

1060
00:49:01,039 --> 00:49:07,280
forward with this proposal but yes we have 10.1 and 10.2

1061
00:49:07,280 --> 00:49:09,079
here that has been

1062
00:49:09,079 --> 00:49:14,920
recently plotted this 18.2a has been plotted 18.1 is

1063
00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:17,579
currently being

1064
00:49:17,579 --> 00:49:21,139
plotted in this area and then actually they are they're

1065
00:49:21,139 --> 00:49:22,480
wanting to plat this

1066
00:49:22,480 --> 00:49:27,079
area in that sort of villa type development in this area

1067
00:49:27,079 --> 00:49:29,000
right here so

1068
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:33,139
that plat if if this is approved would move forward with

1069
00:49:33,139 --> 00:49:35,360
that villa product but

1070
00:49:35,360 --> 00:49:39,280
they haven't given me an indication that they would replat

1071
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:40,719
the existing platted

1072
00:49:40,719 --> 00:49:45,909
lots to the. So the reason I bring this up is it seems like

1073
00:49:45,909 --> 00:49:46,360
it might it might

1074
00:49:46,360 --> 00:49:50,619
lend or you know bring a little sense of security to people

1075
00:49:50,619 --> 00:49:52,280
who are in the

1076
00:49:52,280 --> 00:49:55,489
existing homes to know that their neighborhood is will be

1077
00:49:55,489 --> 00:49:56,280
protected at

1078
00:49:56,280 --> 00:49:59,059
whatever density it currently is and whatever size

1079
00:49:59,059 --> 00:50:00,119
restrictions that

1080
00:50:00,119 --> 00:50:03,099
currently are there they're not going to have you know a du

1081
00:50:03,099 --> 00:50:04,400
plex going next door

1082
00:50:04,400 --> 00:50:08,289
right existing unit sure kind of wonder if that might and

1083
00:50:08,289 --> 00:50:09,360
you know what about a

1084
00:50:09,360 --> 00:50:12,460
third of this is built so a third of this would be categor

1085
00:50:12,460 --> 00:50:14,840
ized you know thank

1086
00:50:14,840 --> 00:50:19,389
you. I'm gonna make some comments too I'm somewhat serious

1087
00:50:19,389 --> 00:50:20,480
in the same concerns

1088
00:50:20,480 --> 00:50:25,840
Commissioner Taylor does I understand some master plan

1089
00:50:25,840 --> 00:50:29,400
community but this if I

1090
00:50:29,400 --> 00:50:33,550
understood you correctly that you can have different house

1091
00:50:33,550 --> 00:50:34,760
types on the same

1092
00:50:34,760 --> 00:50:38,929
lot is very different than our typical subdivision

1093
00:50:38,929 --> 00:50:40,840
requirements in the city

1094
00:50:40,840 --> 00:50:45,559
of Denton so I mean we have in our three in our six you can

1095
00:50:45,559 --> 00:50:47,440
't do duplexes next to

1096
00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:51,000
a single-family home what sounds like we're if I understand

1097
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:51,360
you correctly

1098
00:50:51,360 --> 00:50:55,210
that's what they're asking the ability to do they may not

1099
00:50:55,210 --> 00:50:56,840
do it in practice but

1100
00:50:56,840 --> 00:51:01,309
we're giving them the ability to do that if they so chose

1101
00:51:01,309 --> 00:51:02,280
to do them I

1102
00:51:02,280 --> 00:51:05,480
understand incorrectly anything that hasn't been platted

1103
00:51:05,480 --> 00:51:06,239
any part that's

1104
00:51:06,239 --> 00:51:10,320
moving forward yes they could because this permits them to

1105
00:51:10,320 --> 00:51:12,039
to blend and to

1106
00:51:12,039 --> 00:51:16,869
mix and integrate those those uses as long as they stay

1107
00:51:16,869 --> 00:51:20,559
within the density yes

1108
00:51:20,559 --> 00:51:23,679
I'm gonna need to think about that a little bit more

1109
00:51:23,679 --> 00:51:25,599
Commissioner Beck thank

1110
00:51:25,599 --> 00:51:28,880
you chair so you mentioned a while ago that the single-

1111
00:51:28,880 --> 00:51:30,320
family villa is what

1112
00:51:30,320 --> 00:51:33,289
they want to increase to 1200 yes and yet the number of

1113
00:51:33,289 --> 00:51:34,119
units is not going to

1114
00:51:34,119 --> 00:51:38,469
change so that means some are going to decrease then yes we

1115
00:51:38,469 --> 00:51:39,039
're looking at

1116
00:51:39,039 --> 00:51:42,389
decreasing they haven't given us an indication on how they

1117
00:51:42,389 --> 00:51:43,440
'll move forward

1118
00:51:43,440 --> 00:51:49,849
with that okay Commissioner Hesbeth so just thinking out

1119
00:51:49,849 --> 00:51:51,440
loud and and thank you

1120
00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:54,739
chair and I'd like to get your insight from the building

1121
00:51:54,739 --> 00:51:56,960
perspective so if I

1122
00:51:56,960 --> 00:52:00,360
think out loud the areas is grown quite a bit right so when

1123
00:52:00,360 --> 00:52:00,960
they get started

1124
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:04,730
you're probably getting the house in there 150 200 K now

1125
00:52:04,730 --> 00:52:05,599
you're looking at

1126
00:52:05,599 --> 00:52:09,750
400 K to get in there and so then you have an opportunity

1127
00:52:09,750 --> 00:52:10,760
for if you go with

1128
00:52:10,760 --> 00:52:13,760
the villa I'm assuming it's a little cheaper product so you

1129
00:52:13,760 --> 00:52:14,519
can get in the

1130
00:52:14,519 --> 00:52:17,449
neighborhood for less than 400 K and there's a high demand

1131
00:52:17,449 --> 00:52:18,159
to get into the

1132
00:52:18,159 --> 00:52:21,440
neighborhood I want to get in the neighborhood so I just

1133
00:52:21,440 --> 00:52:22,199
got to go get

1134
00:52:22,199 --> 00:52:28,239
older faster it's a great neighborhood but but that being

1135
00:52:28,239 --> 00:52:31,039
said I think we're

1136
00:52:31,039 --> 00:52:34,650
where I'd like your insight is so if you're keeping the

1137
00:52:34,650 --> 00:52:35,800
number if you have

1138
00:52:35,800 --> 00:52:39,030
this running tally you have to manage that new growth right

1139
00:52:39,030 --> 00:52:40,039
and manage those

1140
00:52:40,039 --> 00:52:44,309
people that are coming in and it's a great at a value you

1141
00:52:44,309 --> 00:52:45,960
know but then that

1142
00:52:45,960 --> 00:52:48,210
leaves you a whole bunch of open space and then there's

1143
00:52:48,210 --> 00:52:49,280
materials so you want

1144
00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:52,360
to build like houses next to each other I'm assuming for

1145
00:52:52,360 --> 00:52:53,679
simplicity of you know

1146
00:52:53,679 --> 00:52:58,050
construction and you got to manage the running tally you

1147
00:52:58,050 --> 00:52:59,039
end up with a big

1148
00:52:59,039 --> 00:53:02,159
field at the end of it if you don't do it right you know so

1149
00:53:02,159 --> 00:53:04,320
what my question is

1150
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:09,320
what is kind of what is the number when you're building to

1151
00:53:09,320 --> 00:53:12,559
make it efficient's

1152
00:53:12,559 --> 00:53:15,869
the wrong word but you know to make sense right if you if I

1153
00:53:15,869 --> 00:53:16,880
have a town home

1154
00:53:16,880 --> 00:53:21,519
and I have homes what number is it efficient to do just one

1155
00:53:21,519 --> 00:53:22,239
of each next to

1156
00:53:22,239 --> 00:53:26,519
each other or in a mass if I'm building them in mass and

1157
00:53:26,519 --> 00:53:27,440
especially she's saying

1158
00:53:27,440 --> 00:53:32,710
going you know 1200 so you mean you got to put them

1159
00:53:32,710 --> 00:53:34,719
together I'm just curious if

1160
00:53:34,719 --> 00:53:37,690
that won't take care of itself in the fact that the

1161
00:53:37,690 --> 00:53:39,000
building and to keep it

1162
00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:43,070
efficient we've got a cluster them to make it worthwhile

1163
00:53:43,070 --> 00:53:44,519
and so that's why I

1164
00:53:44,519 --> 00:53:47,059
just thinking out loud I don't know how that works if you

1165
00:53:47,059 --> 00:53:48,519
're asking I wouldn't

1166
00:53:48,519 --> 00:53:51,940
know how to how they would manage their business and how

1167
00:53:51,940 --> 00:53:53,840
that would work mine

1168
00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:57,170
just comes back to kind of fundamental concern it's it's

1169
00:53:57,170 --> 00:53:58,639
almost like this is in

1170
00:53:58,639 --> 00:54:01,329
opposition to where our Commission normally works we're

1171
00:54:01,329 --> 00:54:02,440
always usually very

1172
00:54:02,440 --> 00:54:06,199
concerned about what somebody can do on an individual piece

1173
00:54:06,199 --> 00:54:07,480
of property and the

1174
00:54:07,480 --> 00:54:10,869
request is to kind of the owner can do kind of whatever

1175
00:54:10,869 --> 00:54:12,360
they want to do within

1176
00:54:12,360 --> 00:54:16,889
these certain parameters they get to decide per se versus

1177
00:54:16,889 --> 00:54:17,760
it's a very

1178
00:54:17,760 --> 00:54:24,489
specific use and I'm just having a little trouble we're not

1179
00:54:24,489 --> 00:54:25,239
trouble I just

1180
00:54:25,239 --> 00:54:28,050
need a little more time to process that because that is

1181
00:54:28,050 --> 00:54:29,400
very different than what

1182
00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:33,590
we normally do and we see zoning cases and platting and

1183
00:54:33,590 --> 00:54:35,000
those types of issues

1184
00:54:35,000 --> 00:54:38,969
that come before our Commission did you have something else

1185
00:54:38,969 --> 00:54:39,840
for I recognize

1186
00:54:39,840 --> 00:54:47,300
Commissioner Solomon my concern is that they are actually

1187
00:54:47,300 --> 00:54:47,679
marketed

1188
00:54:47,679 --> 00:54:50,389
as what they call lock and leave they're designed for

1189
00:54:50,389 --> 00:54:51,760
people who don't really live

1190
00:54:51,760 --> 00:54:55,320
there full-time they may be snowbirds people of that nature

1191
00:54:55,320 --> 00:54:56,199
and so when you

1192
00:54:56,199 --> 00:54:59,690
start interspersing those people or transitioning those

1193
00:54:59,690 --> 00:55:01,280
people into regular

1194
00:55:01,280 --> 00:55:04,250
neighborhoods you're interrupting what the neighborhood is

1195
00:55:04,250 --> 00:55:05,159
supposed to be about

1196
00:55:05,159 --> 00:55:09,050
and that is being a neighborhood so that's my concern the

1197
00:55:09,050 --> 00:55:10,679
other is that when

1198
00:55:10,679 --> 00:55:13,789
you're talking about the fact that they have an HOA all

1199
00:55:13,789 --> 00:55:15,880
that means is that they

1200
00:55:15,880 --> 00:55:19,019
get billed a certain amount at their address they have

1201
00:55:19,019 --> 00:55:20,639
somebody that is hired

1202
00:55:20,639 --> 00:55:23,849
to come by and mow and take care of the yard they don't

1203
00:55:23,849 --> 00:55:24,880
have to be in a cluster

1204
00:55:24,880 --> 00:55:29,699
of 20 because they're in an HOA they just simply get billed

1205
00:55:29,699 --> 00:55:30,840
differently and

1206
00:55:30,840 --> 00:55:33,920
they have different maintenance crews that come by and so I

1207
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:36,079
'm afraid that when

1208
00:55:36,079 --> 00:55:40,719
you're looking at being able to intersperse those duplexes

1209
00:55:40,719 --> 00:55:41,400
is what I

1210
00:55:41,400 --> 00:55:46,250
call them in and amongst regular neighborhood type setting

1211
00:55:46,250 --> 00:55:47,719
is really

1212
00:55:47,719 --> 00:55:51,920
taking away from what everybody has bought out there for

1213
00:55:51,920 --> 00:55:54,639
and so I guess I'm

1214
00:55:54,639 --> 00:55:57,530
concerned with what you're saying as far as why can't they

1215
00:55:57,530 --> 00:55:58,400
go ahead and say

1216
00:55:58,400 --> 00:56:03,639
here's the area where we want these lock and leaves to be

1217
00:56:03,639 --> 00:56:05,199
so that people who buy

1218
00:56:05,199 --> 00:56:08,530
the homes around it know that they're going to be people

1219
00:56:08,530 --> 00:56:09,840
who aren't there all

1220
00:56:09,840 --> 00:56:13,889
the time and because it could devalue the other people's

1221
00:56:13,889 --> 00:56:15,639
properties if we now

1222
00:56:15,639 --> 00:56:18,250
have a bunch of duplexes in a neighborhood that's

1223
00:56:18,250 --> 00:56:19,400
surrounded by

1224
00:56:19,400 --> 00:56:23,789
single-family homes and and they said the lock and leave to

1225
00:56:23,789 --> 00:56:24,960
me as well and they

1226
00:56:24,960 --> 00:56:27,960
also because I they had a neighborhood meeting and I went

1227
00:56:27,960 --> 00:56:29,440
to that and and what

1228
00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:33,539
they did talk about there was also another side to that is

1229
00:56:33,539 --> 00:56:34,480
the aging in

1230
00:56:34,480 --> 00:56:38,210
place and so we looked at that as well to allow somebody

1231
00:56:38,210 --> 00:56:39,599
who doesn't want to

1232
00:56:39,599 --> 00:56:42,760
maintain a yard anymore to move to those villas so they

1233
00:56:42,760 --> 00:56:44,119
didn't have to have it

1234
00:56:44,119 --> 00:56:48,900
out the maintenance so yeah I they said that same so I

1235
00:56:48,900 --> 00:56:51,280
think they're probably

1236
00:56:51,280 --> 00:56:53,969
those two types of people that would want to use this

1237
00:56:53,969 --> 00:56:55,199
product so yeah I would

1238
00:56:55,199 --> 00:57:00,480
agree with you yeah that I know we've asked you a lot of

1239
00:57:00,480 --> 00:57:01,199
questions have you

1240
00:57:01,199 --> 00:57:04,139
pretty well covered kind of the basics of what this is

1241
00:57:04,139 --> 00:57:05,320
going to be because I

1242
00:57:05,320 --> 00:57:07,650
think we're running out of time and I think one of the

1243
00:57:07,650 --> 00:57:08,679
things is we may want

1244
00:57:08,679 --> 00:57:13,559
to have this discussion in our sure in our public meeting

1245
00:57:13,559 --> 00:57:14,480
rather than it's all

1246
00:57:14,480 --> 00:57:16,300
right here and I know we're short on time is there

1247
00:57:16,300 --> 00:57:17,400
something else that we've

1248
00:57:17,400 --> 00:57:21,360
got on this before we break for food no you did receive the

1249
00:57:21,360 --> 00:57:22,360
option or the

1250
00:57:22,360 --> 00:57:25,440
responses the opposition in favorable letters and neutral

1251
00:57:25,440 --> 00:57:26,360
letters so there

1252
00:57:26,360 --> 00:57:33,820
were quite a few but yes yes well we had to cut it off at

1253
00:57:33,820 --> 00:57:35,920
noon because we got

1254
00:57:35,920 --> 00:57:43,440
them all day as of noon we had 13 in opposition 22 in favor

1255
00:57:43,440 --> 00:57:45,599
8 neutral and

1256
00:57:45,599 --> 00:57:48,800
those are the percentages so

1257
00:57:57,000 --> 00:58:06,719
pretty evenly split okay thank you Julie yeah all right it

1258
00:58:06,719 --> 00:58:08,639
is 6 o 3 and we're

1259
00:58:08,639 --> 00:58:13,210
going to take a short recess and come back for our staff

1260
00:58:13,210 --> 00:58:14,400
report on our

1261
00:58:14,400 --> 00:58:18,440
notification procedure thank you

1262
00:58:24,480 --> 00:58:29,250
going to reconvene our work session at 610 and I think our

1263
00:58:29,250 --> 00:58:30,639
next item is going

1264
00:58:30,639 --> 00:58:36,119
to be notifications yes we'll invite Cindy Jackson

1265
00:58:54,480 --> 00:59:07,440
there maybe you can hear me better okay some of you may

1266
00:59:07,440 --> 00:59:08,960
recall the work session

1267
00:59:08,960 --> 00:59:15,789
presentation that was given to you back in April regarding

1268
00:59:15,789 --> 00:59:17,559
the possible public

1269
00:59:17,559 --> 00:59:23,789
hearing notification process improvements staff at that

1270
00:59:23,789 --> 00:59:24,840
time kind of

1271
00:59:24,840 --> 00:59:28,030
gave you a history of public notifications in the city when

1272
00:59:28,030 --> 00:59:28,559
where we

1273
00:59:28,559 --> 00:59:33,480
are now how we got there and took some feedback from the

1274
00:59:33,480 --> 00:59:35,280
Commission regarding

1275
00:59:35,280 --> 00:59:41,150
ideas on how to improve the the practice since that time we

1276
00:59:41,150 --> 00:59:42,639
've taken into

1277
00:59:42,639 --> 00:59:46,769
consideration the feedback we got as well as the research

1278
00:59:46,769 --> 00:59:47,760
we did on best

1279
00:59:47,760 --> 00:59:55,219
practices for public notification it's not like the

1280
00:59:55,219 --> 01:00:01,800
keyboards in the way okay

1281
01:00:01,800 --> 01:00:06,920
just to give you a brief refresher on the requirements our

1282
01:00:06,920 --> 01:00:08,239
public notice

1283
01:00:08,239 --> 01:00:11,079
notifications for public hearings is based on the

1284
01:00:11,079 --> 01:00:12,760
requirement in Texas local

1285
01:00:12,760 --> 01:00:18,960
government code section 211 - 007 requires published notice

1286
01:00:18,960 --> 01:00:19,920
of the hearing

1287
01:00:19,920 --> 01:00:23,269
in the official newspaper in our case the Denton record

1288
01:00:23,269 --> 01:00:24,679
Chronicle before the

1289
01:00:24,679 --> 01:00:27,679
15th day before the date of the hearing and written notice

1290
01:00:27,679 --> 01:00:28,400
is sent out to

1291
01:00:28,400 --> 01:00:32,489
property owners located within 200 feet of the subject site

1292
01:00:32,489 --> 01:00:33,840
before the tenth day

1293
01:00:33,840 --> 01:00:38,760
of the hearing these are sent required to be sent via

1294
01:00:38,760 --> 01:00:43,039
regular mail the practices

1295
01:00:43,039 --> 01:00:47,429
that we've been following are based on ordinance number 99

1296
01:00:47,429 --> 01:00:49,440
- 029 since the

1297
01:00:49,440 --> 01:00:53,610
presentation was made to you in April we have learned that

1298
01:00:53,610 --> 01:00:55,280
the code on which we

1299
01:00:55,280 --> 01:00:58,420
base our notification practices was actually repealed in

1300
01:00:58,420 --> 01:00:59,699
2002 with the

1301
01:00:59,699 --> 01:01:05,320
approval of the Denton Development Code the 2002 code

1302
01:01:05,320 --> 01:01:06,679
requires the city to

1303
01:01:06,679 --> 01:01:10,380
comply with Texas with Texas local government code 211

1304
01:01:10,380 --> 01:01:11,159
which I just

1305
01:01:11,159 --> 01:01:14,769
explained to you with the previous slide I'm going to tell

1306
01:01:14,769 --> 01:01:15,760
you about a little bit

1307
01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:19,639
about the differences between the two the repealed

1308
01:01:19,639 --> 01:01:22,440
ordinance 99 - 029 requires

1309
01:01:22,440 --> 01:01:24,989
public notice of the scheduled public hearing in the

1310
01:01:24,989 --> 01:01:26,059
newspaper of record

1311
01:01:26,059 --> 01:01:30,280
Denton record Chronicle it requires a legal notice of the

1312
01:01:30,280 --> 01:01:32,000
public hearing be

1313
01:01:32,000 --> 01:01:35,090
sent to property owners located within 200 feet of the site

1314
01:01:35,090 --> 01:01:36,199
via certified mail

1315
01:01:36,199 --> 01:01:41,260
not regular mail as required by the Texas local government

1316
01:01:41,260 --> 01:01:43,800
code and it has

1317
01:01:43,800 --> 01:01:47,820
these additional requirements a courtesy notice sent to the

1318
01:01:47,820 --> 01:01:48,599
other scheduled

1319
01:01:48,599 --> 01:01:52,639
meeting sent to all residents who are living within 500

1320
01:01:52,639 --> 01:01:54,000
feet of the subject

1321
01:01:54,000 --> 01:01:58,300
site sent via regular mail and a posted notice in the form

1322
01:01:58,300 --> 01:01:59,719
of a sign posted

1323
01:01:59,719 --> 01:02:05,139
actually on the subject property giving notice of the

1324
01:02:05,139 --> 01:02:06,760
public hearing

1325
01:02:15,239 --> 01:02:19,519
that's for the 200 foot notice the 500 foot notice goes to

1326
01:02:19,519 --> 01:02:20,719
the residents

1327
01:02:20,719 --> 01:02:31,159
located within the area some issues that we have with the

1328
01:02:31,159 --> 01:02:33,920
current notification

1329
01:02:33,920 --> 01:02:37,000
process are actually the same issues which brought about

1330
01:02:37,000 --> 01:02:38,039
the requirement for

1331
01:02:38,039 --> 01:02:42,199
the certified mail number one the property owners aren't

1332
01:02:42,199 --> 01:02:43,159
picking up their

1333
01:02:43,159 --> 01:02:48,349
certified notices at the post office we receive probably at

1334
01:02:48,349 --> 01:02:50,039
least 50 percent

1335
01:02:50,039 --> 01:02:53,510
wouldn't you say of the notices that we send out via

1336
01:02:53,510 --> 01:02:55,480
certified mail back labeled

1337
01:02:55,480 --> 01:03:00,769
not picked up property owners that do pick them up at the

1338
01:03:00,769 --> 01:03:02,159
post office are kind

1339
01:03:02,159 --> 01:03:05,239
of angry by the fact that they have to drive to the post

1340
01:03:05,239 --> 01:03:06,480
office to get their

1341
01:03:06,480 --> 01:03:10,130
notice and they have called staff and made their feelings

1342
01:03:10,130 --> 01:03:12,280
known about this the

1343
01:03:12,280 --> 01:03:16,159
excessive cost of certified mailings for larger

1344
01:03:16,159 --> 01:03:18,440
notification areas for cases

1345
01:03:18,440 --> 01:03:21,599
that for example take place in a residential neighborhood

1346
01:03:21,599 --> 01:03:22,519
where you've got

1347
01:03:22,519 --> 01:03:25,599
a lot of small lots that are surrounding the site or in the

1348
01:03:25,599 --> 01:03:26,559
case of ropes and

1349
01:03:26,559 --> 01:03:33,199
ranch they had to notify the entire PD area that in the

1350
01:03:33,199 --> 01:03:35,239
past fiscal year the

1351
01:03:35,239 --> 01:03:38,849
cost of mailing the certified notices this is now as of

1352
01:03:38,849 --> 01:03:40,820
August 31st has has

1353
01:03:40,820 --> 01:03:43,659
cost thirty four thousand six hundred and sixty nine

1354
01:03:43,659 --> 01:03:45,159
dollars and we're

1355
01:03:45,159 --> 01:03:48,059
expecting to that to go up by approximately twenty thousand

1356
01:03:48,059 --> 01:03:49,000
dollars when

1357
01:03:49,000 --> 01:03:54,480
we add in September because of that ropes and ranch mailing

1358
01:03:54,480 --> 01:03:57,239
the differences

1359
01:03:57,239 --> 01:04:01,159
between the cost of a certified letter versus the cost of a

1360
01:04:01,159 --> 01:04:02,480
regularly posted

1361
01:04:02,480 --> 01:04:06,949
letter using our mail service is is significant the

1362
01:04:06,949 --> 01:04:08,440
certified mail cost five

1363
01:04:08,440 --> 01:04:12,800
seventy seven per piece and the to send the same notice via

1364
01:04:12,800 --> 01:04:14,719
regular mail is two

1365
01:04:14,719 --> 01:04:23,000
forty two per piece now after perceiving there was an issue

1366
01:04:23,000 --> 01:04:24,280
staff went ahead and

1367
01:04:24,280 --> 01:04:29,400
did some research into surrounding areas

1368
01:04:30,000 --> 01:04:37,079
thank you chair how much for regular mail to 242 okay isn't

1369
01:04:37,079 --> 01:04:37,960
it just a like a

1370
01:04:37,960 --> 01:04:43,940
one or two sheet thing that's going out to its two sheets

1371
01:04:43,940 --> 01:04:45,719
color and it's okay

1372
01:04:45,719 --> 01:04:48,159
okay you're talking about the whole problem we're not

1373
01:04:48,159 --> 01:04:48,480
talking about just the

1374
01:04:48,480 --> 01:04:57,760
mailing anyway we went ahead and we we we surveyed

1375
01:04:57,760 --> 01:04:59,079
surrounding cities to see

1376
01:04:59,079 --> 01:05:02,050
what their their practices are to try to determine what

1377
01:05:02,050 --> 01:05:03,840
best practices are I've

1378
01:05:03,840 --> 01:05:07,909
got the table here is also in an exhibit in your staff

1379
01:05:07,909 --> 01:05:10,760
report the to break it down

1380
01:05:10,760 --> 01:05:13,460
into the simplest terms all of the city surveyed send out

1381
01:05:13,460 --> 01:05:14,639
their public hearing

1382
01:05:14,639 --> 01:05:19,110
notices via regular mail not certified mail two cities Fort

1383
01:05:19,110 --> 01:05:20,079
Worth and Plano do

1384
01:05:20,079 --> 01:05:24,849
send out courtesy notices and all but one city which is

1385
01:05:24,849 --> 01:05:26,960
Fort Worth requires the

1386
01:05:26,960 --> 01:05:30,710
applicant to purchase post maintain and remove the sign

1387
01:05:30,710 --> 01:05:32,300
that gets posted on the

1388
01:05:32,300 --> 01:05:43,400
subject site the proposed revisions that we have worked out

1389
01:05:43,400 --> 01:05:45,199
based on your

1390
01:05:45,199 --> 01:05:49,030
comments and and the best practices are first of all per

1391
01:05:49,030 --> 01:05:50,519
the requirements of

1392
01:05:50,519 --> 01:05:54,119
section 211 07 of the Texas local government code we're

1393
01:05:54,119 --> 01:05:55,159
proposing to mail

1394
01:05:55,159 --> 01:05:58,860
out the notices the 200 foot notices via regular mail and

1395
01:05:58,860 --> 01:06:00,039
not certified mail I

1396
01:06:00,039 --> 01:06:03,530
understand that some commissioners were concerned about

1397
01:06:03,530 --> 01:06:05,000
keeping track of which

1398
01:06:05,000 --> 01:06:09,349
ones were we were returned and that's a very easy thing to

1399
01:06:09,349 --> 01:06:10,480
do because we we

1400
01:06:10,480 --> 01:06:17,570
receive any anything that that is not mailed incorrectly

1401
01:06:17,570 --> 01:06:19,719
for instance they say

1402
01:06:19,719 --> 01:06:26,909
is returned to return to sender or not at this address we

1403
01:06:26,909 --> 01:06:28,079
get those back and

1404
01:06:28,079 --> 01:06:33,340
we can keep track of which ones were returned the courtesy

1405
01:06:33,340 --> 01:06:34,920
notices instead of

1406
01:06:34,920 --> 01:06:40,369
sending regular letters out to the 500 foot radius what we

1407
01:06:40,369 --> 01:06:41,280
're proposing is to

1408
01:06:41,280 --> 01:06:45,599
send out postcards to these these people there would be

1409
01:06:45,599 --> 01:06:46,840
regular four by six post

1410
01:06:46,840 --> 01:06:52,239
cards and that way they can see more readily what the the

1411
01:06:52,239 --> 01:06:54,199
postcard is for and

1412
01:06:54,199 --> 01:06:59,150
and hopefully pay a bit more attention to it we did look

1413
01:06:59,150 --> 01:07:01,519
into the suggestion to

1414
01:07:01,519 --> 01:07:05,079
have it printed on the envelope public hearing notice for

1415
01:07:05,079 --> 01:07:06,559
the the 200 foot

1416
01:07:06,559 --> 01:07:11,940
notices however at this time our mailing service is not

1417
01:07:11,940 --> 01:07:16,440
able to do that another

1418
01:07:16,440 --> 01:07:21,639
revision that we're proposing is to enlarge the minimum

1419
01:07:21,639 --> 01:07:24,039
sign to size to four

1420
01:07:24,039 --> 01:07:27,119
by four current dimensions of the signs that are posted are

1421
01:07:27,119 --> 01:07:28,920
two by three and our

1422
01:07:28,920 --> 01:07:32,090
research we saw all but one city actually uses the four by

1423
01:07:32,090 --> 01:07:33,000
four signs and

1424
01:07:33,000 --> 01:07:36,789
the one city that doesn't is Lewisville and their sign is

1425
01:07:36,789 --> 01:07:38,920
three by four will be

1426
01:07:38,920 --> 01:07:42,369
requiring the app as I noted that will be requiring the

1427
01:07:42,369 --> 01:07:43,960
applicant to purchase

1428
01:07:43,960 --> 01:07:47,760
post maintain and remove the notification sign from the

1429
01:07:47,760 --> 01:07:49,400
site they will

1430
01:07:49,400 --> 01:07:53,179
have to sign an affidavit stating that the sign was

1431
01:07:53,179 --> 01:07:55,199
actually posted on the site

1432
01:07:55,199 --> 01:07:58,070
by a certain date and then they will have to sign an affid

1433
01:07:58,070 --> 01:07:59,079
avit stating the

1434
01:07:59,079 --> 01:08:02,570
sign was removed within X number of days from the subject

1435
01:08:02,570 --> 01:08:04,559
site after the public

1436
01:08:04,559 --> 01:08:10,110
hearing we as I noted we can track the public notices and

1437
01:08:10,110 --> 01:08:11,519
courtesy notices that

1438
01:08:11,519 --> 01:08:15,480
are returned to the Sullivan excuse me what is the

1439
01:08:15,480 --> 01:08:17,000
requirement for where the

1440
01:08:17,000 --> 01:08:21,470
sign is placed versus the property that's being in question

1441
01:08:21,470 --> 01:08:22,439
it has to be

1442
01:08:22,439 --> 01:08:26,020
placed on the property facing the street and right now we

1443
01:08:26,020 --> 01:08:27,479
only place one sign on

1444
01:08:27,479 --> 01:08:30,670
the property and we make sure it's visible and not obstruct

1445
01:08:30,670 --> 01:08:32,199
ed by any foliage

1446
01:08:32,199 --> 01:08:36,279
or trees things like that thank you

1447
01:08:37,640 --> 01:08:41,520
did I hear another question okay and finally we are

1448
01:08:41,520 --> 01:08:43,399
proposing to create a

1449
01:08:43,399 --> 01:08:46,430
link on the planning division web page which will be

1450
01:08:46,430 --> 01:08:47,720
dedicated to public

1451
01:08:47,720 --> 01:08:51,369
hearing notices so it will be easier for the public to find

1452
01:08:51,369 --> 01:08:52,760
these notices on our

1453
01:08:52,760 --> 01:08:59,199
website that concludes my presentation and I'll stand for

1454
01:08:59,199 --> 01:08:59,800
any questions

1455
01:08:59,800 --> 01:09:03,710
Commissioner back thank you chair I like the

1456
01:09:03,710 --> 01:09:05,000
recommendations I think these are

1457
01:09:05,000 --> 01:09:08,920
the good changes a couple questions here on your

1458
01:09:08,920 --> 01:09:10,760
recommendations you say you'll

1459
01:09:10,760 --> 01:09:17,159
track public notices and courtesy notices if they don't get

1460
01:09:17,159 --> 01:09:17,560
mailed up

1461
01:09:17,560 --> 01:09:23,399
come back to you are we putting like a self-addressed stamp

1462
01:09:23,399 --> 01:09:24,239
envelope in there

1463
01:09:24,239 --> 01:09:27,880
form to send that back to us where are you talking about

1464
01:09:27,880 --> 01:09:31,079
for if they send it

1465
01:09:31,079 --> 01:09:34,300
right send it well that's that's something that hasn't been

1466
01:09:34,300 --> 01:09:34,920
discussed but

1467
01:09:34,920 --> 01:09:37,239
that's something we can discuss okay because yeah I've got

1468
01:09:37,239 --> 01:09:37,960
to go through the

1469
01:09:37,960 --> 01:09:40,789
bubble and buy a stamp actually that we would do that

1470
01:09:40,789 --> 01:09:42,359
courtesy for more likely

1471
01:09:42,359 --> 01:09:47,800
get something back so consider that if you will and the

1472
01:09:47,800 --> 01:09:48,640
create a link on the

1473
01:09:48,640 --> 01:09:51,199
planning division web page I like that idea and I was just

1474
01:09:51,199 --> 01:09:52,520
curious and maybe

1475
01:09:52,520 --> 01:09:55,210
this isn't something we can discuss now can we do this for

1476
01:09:55,210 --> 01:09:56,039
all City Council

1477
01:09:56,039 --> 01:09:59,619
Board and Commission meetings where it gives anybody who's

1478
01:09:59,619 --> 01:10:00,960
interested in following

1479
01:10:00,960 --> 01:10:03,880
what's going on in city the city government they go on and

1480
01:10:03,880 --> 01:10:04,479
sign on on

1481
01:10:04,479 --> 01:10:08,810
line they get to select which the City Council and then

1482
01:10:08,810 --> 01:10:10,000
which Commission's

1483
01:10:10,000 --> 01:10:14,270
sign up for it and then when those meetings are held we

1484
01:10:14,270 --> 01:10:15,720
send notices out to

1485
01:10:15,720 --> 01:10:20,920
them online is that something well well that's something

1486
01:10:20,920 --> 01:10:21,479
that we have is that

1487
01:10:21,479 --> 01:10:25,800
beyond our scope right here I think I think it might be

1488
01:10:25,800 --> 01:10:26,680
right now we are

1489
01:10:26,680 --> 01:10:30,699
required by the local government code to send out the

1490
01:10:30,699 --> 01:10:33,279
notices via the certified

1491
01:10:33,279 --> 01:10:39,159
tax rule and if we do that way we don't have a way to track

1492
01:10:39,159 --> 01:10:40,720
in Cindy I just want

1493
01:10:40,720 --> 01:10:43,840
to interject any substantial changes that we do to the

1494
01:10:43,840 --> 01:10:45,119
notification process is

1495
01:10:45,119 --> 01:10:48,800
going to require City Council yes right so these the Cindy

1496
01:10:48,800 --> 01:10:49,920
's outlined are just

1497
01:10:49,920 --> 01:10:54,189
sort of procedural items but anything else would likely

1498
01:10:54,189 --> 01:10:55,640
need a City Council

1499
01:10:55,640 --> 01:10:59,670
action so we're gonna today we're gonna essentially decide

1500
01:10:59,670 --> 01:11:01,000
what we like and send

1501
01:11:01,000 --> 01:11:05,399
it on to the City Council we're just here now

1502
01:11:08,600 --> 01:11:11,319
a recommendation to City Council as to whether or not you

1503
01:11:11,319 --> 01:11:13,199
think that this is

1504
01:11:13,199 --> 01:11:18,199
viable okay okay then one last thing on the cost for signs

1505
01:11:18,199 --> 01:11:19,000
in the proposed

1506
01:11:19,000 --> 01:11:23,279
practice there's a $75 charge there but if the applicant is

1507
01:11:23,279 --> 01:11:25,039
responsible for that

1508
01:11:25,039 --> 01:11:29,039
how is that figure how does that $75 right now that's going

1509
01:11:29,039 --> 01:11:29,680
to be rolled into

1510
01:11:29,680 --> 01:11:33,010
it that's going to be part of the $220 notification fee

1511
01:11:33,010 --> 01:11:34,000
that we already charge

1512
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:39,560
so in the 220s will be as it stands right now the $220

1513
01:11:39,560 --> 01:11:43,050
notification fee will also cover the cost of the sign but

1514
01:11:43,050 --> 01:11:44,439
that's not a cost

1515
01:11:44,439 --> 01:11:47,600
to the city is it if the applicant has to put the sign up

1516
01:11:47,600 --> 01:11:48,760
themselves it's an

1517
01:11:48,760 --> 01:11:52,239
act applicant puts the sign up himself that just means we

1518
01:11:52,239 --> 01:11:53,239
don't use staff time

1519
01:11:53,239 --> 01:11:57,189
to put the sign up that's what I'm trying to figure the $75

1520
01:11:57,189 --> 01:11:58,640
charge here I'm

1521
01:11:58,640 --> 01:12:03,829
trying to figure okay I'm on exhibit four okay and we're

1522
01:12:03,829 --> 01:12:04,560
looking at current

1523
01:12:04,560 --> 01:12:08,909
practice and proposed practice on the proposed practice or

1524
01:12:08,909 --> 01:12:09,960
current practice

1525
01:12:09,960 --> 01:12:13,850
cities putting up the sign proposed practice the we're

1526
01:12:13,850 --> 01:12:14,840
saying that the

1527
01:12:14,840 --> 01:12:17,189
applicant has to put their own sign up perhaps you can

1528
01:12:17,189 --> 01:12:18,239
answer that question

1529
01:12:18,239 --> 01:12:25,159
right I think you are correct Commissioner Beck that the

1530
01:12:25,159 --> 01:12:25,880
applicant

1531
01:12:25,880 --> 01:12:28,600
we're responsible for that and so that cost would be on the

1532
01:12:28,600 --> 01:12:29,560
applicant okay so

1533
01:12:29,560 --> 01:12:33,720
that's not be part of so that $232 total then we just

1534
01:12:33,720 --> 01:12:35,840
subtract 75 correct that

1535
01:12:35,840 --> 01:12:38,649
would be that would be just a now just an example of what

1536
01:12:38,649 --> 01:12:40,079
that would be okay so

1537
01:12:40,079 --> 01:12:43,079
we're even cheaper going forward again right that's a

1538
01:12:43,079 --> 01:12:44,319
dependent on the

1539
01:12:44,319 --> 01:12:46,680
assumptions that we had there you know it could be more it

1540
01:12:46,680 --> 01:12:47,479
could be less but

1541
01:12:47,479 --> 01:12:50,680
overall the applicant will be responsible for signs for

1542
01:12:50,680 --> 01:12:51,159
general

1543
01:12:51,159 --> 01:12:57,960
okay Commissioner Roselle thank you I've actually

1544
01:12:57,960 --> 01:13:01,079
Mr. Beck led right into some of my line of thinking

1545
01:13:01,079 --> 01:13:04,600
thinking I'm trying to

1546
01:13:04,600 --> 01:13:07,560
understand the efficiency of them putting up a sign versus

1547
01:13:07,560 --> 01:13:08,239
city put up a

1548
01:13:08,239 --> 01:13:11,649
sign currently if I understand it's correctly the city has

1549
01:13:11,649 --> 01:13:12,439
a standard

1550
01:13:12,439 --> 01:13:16,000
template sign that staff goes out and puts on the property

1551
01:13:16,000 --> 01:13:17,039
after hearing staff

1552
01:13:17,039 --> 01:13:22,060
goes and takes it back is that correct and the new proposed

1553
01:13:22,060 --> 01:13:23,159
is they create

1554
01:13:23,159 --> 01:13:26,239
their own sign is there a template they based off of well

1555
01:13:26,239 --> 01:13:27,880
again we haven't come

1556
01:13:27,880 --> 01:13:30,569
to the point net yet where we're going to just we don't

1557
01:13:30,569 --> 01:13:31,399
know we decide if

1558
01:13:31,399 --> 01:13:34,609
they're going to make their go to a sign company the signs

1559
01:13:34,609 --> 01:13:36,159
that the the cities

1560
01:13:36,159 --> 01:13:40,569
that I surveyed they all had it had a form a template form

1561
01:13:40,569 --> 01:13:42,079
for the applicant

1562
01:13:42,079 --> 01:13:44,819
that the applicant would then take to certain sign

1563
01:13:44,819 --> 01:13:46,479
companies that the city had

1564
01:13:46,479 --> 01:13:50,079
made arrangements with to make this sign for a certain cost

1565
01:13:50,079 --> 01:13:51,760
and they would have

1566
01:13:51,760 --> 01:13:55,250
it made at this point we haven't got that far so we assume

1567
01:13:55,250 --> 01:13:56,279
that if other

1568
01:13:56,279 --> 01:13:59,630
cities do it's for this situation they go out they get a

1569
01:13:59,630 --> 01:14:01,039
sign made they go put

1570
01:14:01,039 --> 01:14:03,920
in the property they come to city to sign an affidavit

1571
01:14:03,920 --> 01:14:05,119
saying they've done

1572
01:14:05,119 --> 01:14:09,180
that and then after the hearing they then have to come back

1573
01:14:09,180 --> 01:14:09,720
and sign an

1574
01:14:09,720 --> 01:14:14,710
affidavit that the sign that's been removed exactly I guess

1575
01:14:14,710 --> 01:14:15,600
it goes back to

1576
01:14:15,600 --> 01:14:20,789
the efficiency if the Steve didn't has a an understanding

1577
01:14:20,789 --> 01:14:22,199
with a sign company is

1578
01:14:22,199 --> 01:14:25,420
it maybe more efficient for the city just calling that sign

1579
01:14:25,420 --> 01:14:26,359
company here's

1580
01:14:26,359 --> 01:14:29,119
the details go put the sign and put it in because I'm just

1581
01:14:29,119 --> 01:14:29,640
wondering how many

1582
01:14:29,640 --> 01:14:32,260
times are we tracking down an applicant to get the affidav

1583
01:14:32,260 --> 01:14:34,079
it signed when the

1584
01:14:34,079 --> 01:14:36,399
city could just put it up knew exactly where it was had

1585
01:14:36,399 --> 01:14:37,680
control over that and

1586
01:14:37,680 --> 01:14:42,880
then brought it back down you bring up a good point and

1587
01:14:42,880 --> 01:14:44,399
looking at other cities

1588
01:14:44,399 --> 01:14:48,420
that practice has been something that we were reviewing and

1589
01:14:48,420 --> 01:14:49,760
that's one reason why

1590
01:14:49,760 --> 01:14:53,300
we made that recommendation we myself included aren't

1591
01:14:53,300 --> 01:14:54,640
really purview to if

1592
01:14:54,640 --> 01:14:58,239
those affidavits have to be you know brought in or if they

1593
01:14:58,239 --> 01:14:59,279
were just to be

1594
01:14:59,279 --> 01:15:02,600
mailed in or you know photos it'd be a little bit a little

1595
01:15:02,600 --> 01:15:03,880
bit easier process

1596
01:15:03,880 --> 01:15:07,239
again other cities have done it we can certainly follow up

1597
01:15:07,239 --> 01:15:08,239
with them and see

1598
01:15:08,239 --> 01:15:12,859
how if it's been more efficient for them versus posting it

1599
01:15:12,859 --> 01:15:13,760
themselves

1600
01:15:13,760 --> 01:15:17,250
yeah I guess my initial thought on this is if it's not a

1601
01:15:17,250 --> 01:15:19,359
massive change or Delta

1602
01:15:19,359 --> 01:15:23,960
inefficiency then the city still having control over it

1603
01:15:23,960 --> 01:15:25,279
seems to be a better

1604
01:15:25,279 --> 01:15:27,369
option that we know the exact signs to be placed we can put

1605
01:15:27,369 --> 01:15:28,279
it where we want we

1606
01:15:28,279 --> 01:15:31,960
get it put it up where we need to be instead of hoping that

1607
01:15:31,960 --> 01:15:32,880
they're not

1608
01:15:32,880 --> 01:15:34,510
finding a loophole of where to place it oddly on the

1609
01:15:34,510 --> 01:15:35,439
property or anything like

1610
01:15:35,439 --> 01:15:38,289
that so those are my initial thoughts thank you that's a

1611
01:15:38,289 --> 01:15:38,840
good point

1612
01:15:38,840 --> 01:15:44,119
Commissioner Tyler thank you chair I had a couple of

1613
01:15:44,119 --> 01:15:45,199
questions regarding cost I

1614
01:15:45,199 --> 01:15:48,689
don't know who would be more appropriate to answer and and

1615
01:15:48,689 --> 01:15:51,399
also the sign so in

1616
01:15:51,399 --> 01:15:56,119
this example so is the notification fee charged to the

1617
01:15:56,119 --> 01:15:58,560
applicant yes when they

1618
01:15:58,560 --> 01:16:01,289
submit an application that requires a public hearing an

1619
01:16:01,289 --> 01:16:03,119
automatic $220 is

1620
01:16:03,119 --> 01:16:07,399
assessed as part of their review fee just $220 period

1621
01:16:07,399 --> 01:16:08,920
correct so we don't know

1622
01:16:08,920 --> 01:16:12,350
how much it's gonna cost in the end but that's that's the

1623
01:16:12,350 --> 01:16:13,319
bond that's the

1624
01:16:13,319 --> 01:16:16,970
maximum minimum that we we charge applicants so in the

1625
01:16:16,970 --> 01:16:18,720
example of the the

1626
01:16:18,720 --> 01:16:24,039
recent Robson ranch change you probably sent 2,000

1627
01:16:24,039 --> 01:16:26,920
certified letters 1600 I saw

1628
01:16:26,920 --> 01:16:32,539
yeah 1600 letters and you charge $220 to do that correct

1629
01:16:32,539 --> 01:16:34,159
okay so I was under the

1630
01:16:34,159 --> 01:16:36,659
impression that the mailing fees were actually billed back

1631
01:16:36,659 --> 01:16:37,359
to the app I see

1632
01:16:37,359 --> 01:16:44,520
maybe maybe we actually pay for that mailing for Robson

1633
01:16:44,520 --> 01:16:45,279
because of the large

1634
01:16:45,279 --> 01:16:47,819
amounts I stand corrected because of that large amount we

1635
01:16:47,819 --> 01:16:48,680
asked the applicant

1636
01:16:48,680 --> 01:16:50,890
pay for that but that was like that was almost like a

1637
01:16:50,890 --> 01:16:52,279
courtesy could you write

1638
01:16:52,279 --> 01:16:55,859
versus yeah there could have been yeah but otherwise if if

1639
01:16:55,859 --> 01:16:56,880
it the cost for a

1640
01:16:56,880 --> 01:17:02,560
mailing did exceed exceed 220 the city would only pay the

1641
01:17:02,560 --> 01:17:03,640
rest of that and so

1642
01:17:03,640 --> 01:17:08,520
and in the proposed method they'll still pay the 220 and

1643
01:17:08,520 --> 01:17:09,560
then they'll the

1644
01:17:09,560 --> 01:17:11,880
applicant will also be responsible for a sign or look at

1645
01:17:11,880 --> 01:17:13,039
like a $75 credit for

1646
01:17:13,039 --> 01:17:17,689
the sign I'm trying to understand the sign if if we were to

1647
01:17:17,689 --> 01:17:18,880
have the applicant

1648
01:17:18,880 --> 01:17:21,850
do do it they know there would be there would be no credit

1649
01:17:21,850 --> 01:17:23,159
in that example they

1650
01:17:23,159 --> 01:17:26,550
would still be responsible for the the sign posting and

1651
01:17:26,550 --> 01:17:27,920
cost and all that if

1652
01:17:27,920 --> 01:17:31,840
the fee was to be over 220 of course we'd still be

1653
01:17:31,840 --> 01:17:33,760
responsible for the rest

1654
01:17:33,760 --> 01:17:38,119
if it was less than that 220 would still would be within

1655
01:17:38,119 --> 01:17:39,560
our budget so I do I

1656
01:17:39,560 --> 01:17:43,310
think in general the proposals sound good I like getting

1657
01:17:43,310 --> 01:17:44,359
rid of the certified

1658
01:17:44,359 --> 01:17:48,229
mail it's it's maybe nice to a nice thought to have a

1659
01:17:48,229 --> 01:17:49,840
signature but it does

1660
01:17:49,840 --> 01:17:52,659
make it a lot harder to pick up your mail people people won

1661
01:17:52,659 --> 01:17:53,479
't receive the

1662
01:17:53,479 --> 01:17:56,359
messages in time you know a lot of them get returned so

1663
01:17:56,359 --> 01:17:57,640
forth and so on cuts the

1664
01:17:57,640 --> 01:18:03,319
cost in half sure her mailing the the sign our current sign

1665
01:18:03,319 --> 01:18:04,960
posting is not

1666
01:18:04,960 --> 01:18:08,470
very effective it's a little poster board sized piece of

1667
01:18:08,470 --> 01:18:09,039
plastic with a

1668
01:18:09,039 --> 01:18:12,250
sharpie right like it's a you know a couple of lines and

1669
01:18:12,250 --> 01:18:13,199
written in in

1670
01:18:13,199 --> 01:18:17,550
sharpie what the case is and you know I've been in a lot of

1671
01:18:17,550 --> 01:18:18,640
cities where the

1672
01:18:18,640 --> 01:18:22,199
developers are required to post signs and a lot of times

1673
01:18:22,199 --> 01:18:23,199
they're big they're

1674
01:18:23,199 --> 01:18:26,079
like eight by eight right manager and they have a lot of

1675
01:18:26,079 --> 01:18:26,920
detail and usually

1676
01:18:26,920 --> 01:18:29,850
they actually use it as an as an opportunity to kind of

1677
01:18:29,850 --> 01:18:30,880
advertise their

1678
01:18:30,880 --> 01:18:33,600
project and then they have a whole bunch of legalese

1679
01:18:33,600 --> 01:18:34,600
meeting the legal

1680
01:18:34,600 --> 01:18:37,739
requirements that's all forthright we looked at city of McK

1681
01:18:37,739 --> 01:18:38,439
inney and they

1682
01:18:38,439 --> 01:18:41,130
they actually as we see indicated to have a template of

1683
01:18:41,130 --> 01:18:42,079
what needs to be there

1684
01:18:42,079 --> 01:18:46,229
the size the the font size all that how it's how it's st

1685
01:18:46,229 --> 01:18:48,159
aked and all that the

1686
01:18:48,159 --> 01:18:51,829
one company I did call me that's where the $75 came up I

1687
01:18:51,829 --> 01:18:52,840
asked them how much it

1688
01:18:52,840 --> 01:18:55,640
would cost for that sign and I don't know if it included

1689
01:18:55,640 --> 01:18:56,840
the stake itself but

1690
01:18:56,840 --> 01:19:01,000
they quoted $75 so that would be roughly what that would be

1691
01:19:01,000 --> 01:19:01,319
for the

1692
01:19:01,319 --> 01:19:04,020
applicant if they were to post something in our city and I

1693
01:19:04,020 --> 01:19:04,840
think another version

1694
01:19:04,840 --> 01:19:07,090
another reason why it might be beneficial to have the

1695
01:19:07,090 --> 01:19:07,720
applicant in

1696
01:19:07,720 --> 01:19:10,600
control of the sign is in a lot of cases it's a green field

1697
01:19:10,600 --> 01:19:11,560
and it just that's

1698
01:19:11,560 --> 01:19:14,119
put at the edge of the property with a little some legs and

1699
01:19:14,119 --> 01:19:15,279
feet sometimes it's

1700
01:19:15,279 --> 01:19:17,310
set in the ground sometimes it's attached to a construction

1701
01:19:17,310 --> 01:19:18,000
fence attached

1702
01:19:18,000 --> 01:19:20,689
to an existing building you know things like that I think

1703
01:19:20,689 --> 01:19:21,560
there are a lot of

1704
01:19:21,560 --> 01:19:26,159
different complexities where allowing the applicants to

1705
01:19:26,159 --> 01:19:28,039
post put it how they

1706
01:19:28,039 --> 01:19:30,760
want to do it as long as it does meet visibility

1707
01:19:30,760 --> 01:19:32,479
requirements right and you

1708
01:19:32,479 --> 01:19:34,789
know I think we do need to solve the problem of the small

1709
01:19:34,789 --> 01:19:35,920
unreadable sign and

1710
01:19:35,920 --> 01:19:39,199
that's the main goal is to have a better efficient

1711
01:19:39,199 --> 01:19:41,199
effective notification process

1712
01:19:41,199 --> 01:19:44,680
and larger signs I believe accomplished that and if we can

1713
01:19:44,680 --> 01:19:46,000
get said applicant to

1714
01:19:46,000 --> 01:19:49,039
do something to that effect I think would be better off and

1715
01:19:49,039 --> 01:19:49,960
one one final

1716
01:19:49,960 --> 01:19:54,609
comment the sign placement as I'm expecting you probably

1717
01:19:54,609 --> 01:19:55,079
will have some

1718
01:19:55,079 --> 01:19:57,550
rule every 400 feet of frontage or every 200 feet of front

1719
01:19:57,550 --> 01:19:58,319
age or something like

1720
01:19:58,319 --> 01:20:01,229
that we discussed that internally you know of a corner lot

1721
01:20:01,229 --> 01:20:02,239
you know we would

1722
01:20:02,239 --> 01:20:05,510
prefer it to be on both sides of the street if it's a large

1723
01:20:05,510 --> 01:20:06,399
track of land

1724
01:20:06,399 --> 01:20:09,880
maybe a linear distance you know separation so that you

1725
01:20:09,880 --> 01:20:11,079
know we don't miss

1726
01:20:11,079 --> 01:20:14,329
it and this would just be an administrative change since it

1727
01:20:14,329 --> 01:20:14,760
isn't in

1728
01:20:14,760 --> 01:20:17,359
ordinance right now correct but we would still need to move

1729
01:20:17,359 --> 01:20:18,119
forward at the

1730
01:20:18,119 --> 01:20:21,460
anything that would relate to cost we would have to bring

1731
01:20:21,460 --> 01:20:22,920
forward as a an

1732
01:20:22,920 --> 01:20:26,720
ordinance to update our fees but anything that's procedural

1733
01:20:26,720 --> 01:20:27,359
we can we can

1734
01:20:27,359 --> 01:20:32,149
propose and move that forward okay thank you Commissioner

1735
01:20:32,149 --> 01:20:34,079
Sullivan yeah I

1736
01:20:34,079 --> 01:20:38,359
received my letter on October 3rd and I noticed at the

1737
01:20:38,359 --> 01:20:40,239
bottom here it says that

1738
01:20:40,239 --> 01:20:43,920
the analysis would be posted by the end of the day on the 7

1739
01:20:43,920 --> 01:20:44,920
th and the meeting

1740
01:20:44,920 --> 01:20:48,970
was on the 12th so there's someone who just picked us out

1741
01:20:48,970 --> 01:20:50,199
of the mail which by

1742
01:20:50,199 --> 01:20:53,279
the way I'm within the 200 foot buffer and I didn't get a

1743
01:20:53,279 --> 01:20:55,000
certified letter okay

1744
01:20:55,000 --> 01:20:59,640
I know other neighbors got both certified and regular mail

1745
01:20:59,640 --> 01:21:01,119
and nothing on

1746
01:21:01,119 --> 01:21:05,149
here says please return this if you have an opinion and so

1747
01:21:05,149 --> 01:21:06,960
I'm concerned that

1748
01:21:06,960 --> 01:21:11,609
when you look at the you know the 48 or 56 notices that y'

1749
01:21:11,609 --> 01:21:13,039
all received back how

1750
01:21:13,039 --> 01:21:17,989
many people didn't know where to get the form I wasn't even

1751
01:21:17,989 --> 01:21:18,720
told as a

1752
01:21:18,720 --> 01:21:23,279
commissioner or as a taxpayer that the the public hearing

1753
01:21:23,279 --> 01:21:24,760
was being made was

1754
01:21:24,760 --> 01:21:28,960
being held until after the fact in fact I called Manal and

1755
01:21:28,960 --> 01:21:29,960
she told me about it

1756
01:21:29,960 --> 01:21:33,439
and so I'm concerned that when they're obviously the city

1757
01:21:33,439 --> 01:21:34,760
knew that there was a

1758
01:21:34,760 --> 01:21:38,000
meeting being held since somebody was in attendance I'm

1759
01:21:38,000 --> 01:21:39,239
concerned that there isn't

1760
01:21:39,239 --> 01:21:42,239
enough public notice of meetings that are being held in

1761
01:21:42,239 --> 01:21:43,560
neighborhoods number

1762
01:21:43,560 --> 01:21:46,590
one for the people who live there and number two for the

1763
01:21:46,590 --> 01:21:47,960
commissioners who if

1764
01:21:47,960 --> 01:21:51,109
we want to attend them should be able to be you know to go

1765
01:21:51,109 --> 01:21:52,180
and attend those

1766
01:21:52,180 --> 01:22:02,350
meetings that's you should have if you were within the 200

1767
01:22:02,350 --> 01:22:04,159
foot buffer you

1768
01:22:04,159 --> 01:22:08,899
would have received a certified mail you didn't that's what

1769
01:22:08,899 --> 01:22:09,840
I'm saying

1770
01:22:09,840 --> 01:22:19,479
that would be me I'm a do-it-yourself kind of guy right and

1771
01:22:19,479 --> 01:22:21,760
then there is a

1772
01:22:21,760 --> 01:22:24,710
note and it's very probably not as evident but it does say

1773
01:22:24,710 --> 01:22:25,560
if you're within

1774
01:22:25,560 --> 01:22:29,869
turn of foot you would also be receiving a certified letter

1775
01:22:29,869 --> 01:22:30,359
in that

1776
01:22:30,359 --> 01:22:34,220
certified letter there is the instructions in how you

1777
01:22:34,220 --> 01:22:35,279
respond or one

1778
01:22:35,279 --> 01:22:38,449
provide comments it doesn't say that on here it just says

1779
01:22:38,449 --> 01:22:39,640
this I'm within 500

1780
01:22:39,640 --> 01:22:42,550
feet when I'm looking at the map that's on here I'm

1781
01:22:42,550 --> 01:22:44,000
actually within the 200 feet

1782
01:22:44,000 --> 01:22:48,819
buffer yeah and so that's those are my first concerns that

1783
01:22:48,819 --> 01:22:49,680
this is very

1784
01:22:49,680 --> 01:22:54,579
pitiful actually the second is I need to bid I guess on the

1785
01:22:54,579 --> 01:22:55,359
mailing system

1786
01:22:55,359 --> 01:23:00,220
because to mail a 49 cent letter we're charged we're paying

1787
01:23:00,220 --> 01:23:00,880
two dollars and

1788
01:23:00,880 --> 01:23:04,140
forty two cents or two dollars and twenty seven cents there

1789
01:23:04,140 --> 01:23:05,319
's not an intern

1790
01:23:05,319 --> 01:23:09,300
or part-time person who could put those in an envelope and

1791
01:23:09,300 --> 01:23:11,520
send them out we you

1792
01:23:11,520 --> 01:23:15,029
know the unfortunately what we put the cost that's

1793
01:23:15,029 --> 01:23:16,760
associated with that 242 is

1794
01:23:16,760 --> 01:23:21,960
the actual processing of it printing it how she sees color

1795
01:23:21,960 --> 01:23:24,800
stuffing and labeling

1796
01:23:24,800 --> 01:23:27,489
all that stuff is part of that fear I need to be I need to

1797
01:23:27,489 --> 01:23:28,199
bid on that job

1798
01:23:28,199 --> 01:23:32,369
next time it comes up because I can do it for a dollar that

1799
01:23:32,369 --> 01:23:33,640
seems outrageous to

1800
01:23:33,640 --> 01:23:36,329
me Commissioner Sullivan you can you clarify you said that

1801
01:23:36,329 --> 01:23:37,039
you received that

1802
01:23:37,039 --> 01:23:42,479
that letter after the public hearing October 3rd the

1803
01:23:42,479 --> 01:23:44,880
meeting was October 12

1804
01:23:44,880 --> 01:23:49,300
I never knew well the meeting we having today I'm talking

1805
01:23:49,300 --> 01:23:50,000
about the pub you know

1806
01:23:50,000 --> 01:23:53,640
the meeting at ropes and ranch we yeah we don't control

1807
01:23:53,640 --> 01:23:55,079
that understand okay but

1808
01:23:55,079 --> 01:23:58,760
apparently who wasn't that attended the meeting somebody

1809
01:23:58,760 --> 01:24:01,680
told us Julie how did

1810
01:24:01,680 --> 01:24:07,649
you know about the meeting so isn't I mean is that

1811
01:24:07,649 --> 01:24:09,960
something that we as

1812
01:24:09,960 --> 01:24:12,840
commissioners should be involved in if you know for these

1813
01:24:12,840 --> 01:24:13,880
meetings that you know

1814
01:24:13,880 --> 01:24:17,720
if I want to go to the meeting on Fry Street or you know

1815
01:24:17,720 --> 01:24:19,359
anything that's going

1816
01:24:19,359 --> 01:24:22,600
on that it would help I think us have helped me to know

1817
01:24:22,600 --> 01:24:23,920
what the mood of the

1818
01:24:23,920 --> 01:24:28,050
people are who go to those meetings since you know when you

1819
01:24:28,050 --> 01:24:28,880
read in the

1820
01:24:28,880 --> 01:24:32,890
newspaper it's not always an accurate indication of what

1821
01:24:32,890 --> 01:24:33,880
went on I'm gonna

1822
01:24:33,880 --> 01:24:37,710
kick it to Shandrian on that question so I think I'll try

1823
01:24:37,710 --> 01:24:38,960
to answer it the

1824
01:24:38,960 --> 01:24:41,369
meeting that you're referring to is the neighborhood

1825
01:24:41,369 --> 01:24:42,680
meeting that the applicant

1826
01:24:42,680 --> 01:24:46,960
coordinates and does the notice for that's not actually a

1827
01:24:46,960 --> 01:24:48,079
requirement we

1828
01:24:48,079 --> 01:24:51,569
strongly encourage that to happen so we don't really manage

1829
01:24:51,569 --> 01:24:52,520
that process or

1830
01:24:52,520 --> 01:24:57,439
really have any control over it the city process that we

1831
01:24:57,439 --> 01:24:58,520
are involved in right

1832
01:24:58,520 --> 01:25:04,359
now we do have the control over that so we can do changes

1833
01:25:04,359 --> 01:25:06,560
to that one well I'm

1834
01:25:06,560 --> 01:25:09,770
just concerned that when y'all know about those things why

1835
01:25:09,770 --> 01:25:11,279
not let us know

1836
01:25:11,279 --> 01:25:14,930
about them so that if we want to go to the meetings again

1837
01:25:14,930 --> 01:25:15,840
like I know there was

1838
01:25:15,840 --> 01:25:19,029
a meeting on Fry Street according to the newspaper that was

1839
01:25:19,029 --> 01:25:20,439
very negative well I

1840
01:25:20,439 --> 01:25:22,649
don't know that that's just what was reported in the

1841
01:25:22,649 --> 01:25:23,359
newspaper but I would

1842
01:25:23,359 --> 01:25:27,449
like to attend so I get my own feeling for what goes on

1843
01:25:27,449 --> 01:25:28,500
right and I think we

1844
01:25:28,500 --> 01:25:31,380
have suggestions on how the applicant needs to notify the

1845
01:25:31,380 --> 01:25:32,340
neighborhood but

1846
01:25:32,340 --> 01:25:35,289
again because it's not a requirement for them to do so our

1847
01:25:35,289 --> 01:25:36,800
hands are pretty much

1848
01:25:36,800 --> 01:25:42,920
tied on that end but if you know about it why don't you let

1849
01:25:42,920 --> 01:25:43,960
us know about is

1850
01:25:43,960 --> 01:25:47,750
what I'm asking if y'all know that a meeting is happening

1851
01:25:47,750 --> 01:25:49,800
why not let us know

1852
01:25:49,800 --> 01:25:52,840
that a meeting is happening okay let us choose whether we

1853
01:25:52,840 --> 01:25:54,199
desire to go or not

1854
01:25:54,199 --> 01:25:57,500
that's all I'm asking that's that's Sharon and I can

1855
01:25:57,500 --> 01:25:58,760
discuss that further

1856
01:25:58,760 --> 01:26:02,079
with Manon that's something that we can incorporate if you

1857
01:26:02,079 --> 01:26:03,520
do get you know is

1858
01:26:03,520 --> 01:26:06,560
from a applicant to let the Commission know that's

1859
01:26:06,560 --> 01:26:07,920
something that we can

1860
01:26:07,920 --> 01:26:12,800
certainly be perfect do Commissioner else next thank you

1861
01:26:12,800 --> 01:26:14,520
chair I just want to

1862
01:26:14,520 --> 01:26:16,819
say I'm thrilled that we're having this discussion about

1863
01:26:16,819 --> 01:26:17,439
improving the

1864
01:26:17,439 --> 01:26:20,319
notification I know we're out of time clearly by all the

1865
01:26:20,319 --> 01:26:21,479
discussion it needs

1866
01:26:21,479 --> 01:26:24,699
further discussion and I would love to see this brought

1867
01:26:24,699 --> 01:26:25,800
back to be further

1868
01:26:25,800 --> 01:26:28,989
discussed so thank you for the work you've done I wish we

1869
01:26:28,989 --> 01:26:29,760
had more time to

1870
01:26:29,760 --> 01:26:32,210
talk about it because I do have other things to say but I

1871
01:26:32,210 --> 01:26:33,119
know we're on time

1872
01:26:33,119 --> 01:26:38,800
okay Commissioner back just real quickly so whenever an

1873
01:26:38,800 --> 01:26:39,840
applicant has one of

1874
01:26:39,840 --> 01:26:43,140
these town hall means or neighborhood meeting they are

1875
01:26:43,140 --> 01:26:44,520
expected to notify the

1876
01:26:44,520 --> 01:26:48,439
city is that correct is that part of the process we do have

1877
01:26:48,439 --> 01:26:49,520
recommendations on

1878
01:26:49,520 --> 01:26:53,789
how to notify the city but it's not because it's not a

1879
01:26:53,789 --> 01:26:54,720
required meeting

1880
01:26:54,720 --> 01:26:57,800
there's not you know specific steps that they have to

1881
01:26:57,800 --> 01:26:59,159
follow okay so probably

1882
01:26:59,159 --> 01:27:02,029
what we need to change is that process where they should

1883
01:27:02,029 --> 01:27:03,560
notify the city so if

1884
01:27:03,560 --> 01:27:05,859
we do any changes I suspect it would be that the

1885
01:27:05,859 --> 01:27:07,199
neighborhood meeting is

1886
01:27:07,199 --> 01:27:10,350
required and then we adopt rules for how that meet them

1887
01:27:10,350 --> 01:27:11,479
even is carried out

1888
01:27:11,479 --> 01:27:16,479
thank you Commissioner Hesbeth speed round I too would like

1889
01:27:16,479 --> 01:27:17,359
to discuss more

1890
01:27:17,359 --> 01:27:20,560
about it I'm out on the certification notice just because

1891
01:27:20,560 --> 01:27:22,039
the postman doesn't

1892
01:27:22,039 --> 01:27:24,069
pay attention to what you sign so you could just make a

1893
01:27:24,069 --> 01:27:25,039
straight line and

1894
01:27:25,039 --> 01:27:27,460
they're gonna take it and mail it back to you were paying

1895
01:27:27,460 --> 01:27:30,079
for it I am out on

1896
01:27:30,079 --> 01:27:34,149
requiring the the city the neighborhood meetings because

1897
01:27:34,149 --> 01:27:35,600
that's a headache to

1898
01:27:35,600 --> 01:27:39,479
manage and we have enough headaches and I think there's

1899
01:27:39,479 --> 01:27:41,079
other ways to poll the

1900
01:27:41,079 --> 01:27:46,439
neighborhood and the Robeson ranch thing there's something

1901
01:27:46,439 --> 01:27:47,319
that jumped out at

1902
01:27:47,319 --> 01:27:50,140
me but I can't remember so when it comes back around I'll

1903
01:27:50,140 --> 01:27:52,279
have my notes ready so

1904
01:27:52,279 --> 01:27:56,880
yeah that's a procedural question Commissioner Tyler thank

1905
01:27:56,880 --> 01:27:58,880
you chair so

1906
01:27:58,880 --> 01:28:00,460
I'm assuming that we want to move forward on this we've

1907
01:28:00,460 --> 01:28:01,119
been working on it

1908
01:28:01,119 --> 01:28:04,199
for most of the year would it be appropriate for us to

1909
01:28:04,199 --> 01:28:04,720
continue our work

1910
01:28:04,720 --> 01:28:07,470
session after our public hearing so that the next time we

1911
01:28:07,470 --> 01:28:08,380
see this we can be

1912
01:28:08,380 --> 01:28:17,359
voting on it I'll let staff comment on that voting on that

1913
01:28:17,359 --> 01:28:18,199
is if it's an

1914
01:28:18,199 --> 01:28:21,229
amendment to the DDC if we bring it forward just as an

1915
01:28:21,229 --> 01:28:22,159
ordinance only

1916
01:28:22,159 --> 01:28:25,250
council will see that I guess I guess my point is do we

1917
01:28:25,250 --> 01:28:26,600
want to have another

1918
01:28:26,600 --> 01:28:29,829
meeting in four weeks or do we want to just finish it like

1919
01:28:29,829 --> 01:28:31,000
what would be more

1920
01:28:31,000 --> 01:28:33,689
appropriate way to handle this to continue this

1921
01:28:33,689 --> 01:28:35,119
conversation that we're

1922
01:28:35,119 --> 01:28:37,329
having right now to continue it again this evening like we

1923
01:28:37,329 --> 01:28:37,920
've done on some

1924
01:28:37,920 --> 01:28:42,739
previous meetings rather than doing it at a date in the

1925
01:28:42,739 --> 01:28:44,720
future okay I'm gonna

1926
01:28:44,720 --> 01:28:48,670
let staff how much more do you have of your slides well

1927
01:28:48,670 --> 01:28:50,840
that was it I was done

1928
01:28:50,840 --> 01:28:55,000
it's more just discussion

1929
01:28:55,640 --> 01:28:57,890
Commissioner Hesbeth has a question if you need to think

1930
01:28:57,890 --> 01:29:00,279
about your yeah I mean

1931
01:29:00,279 --> 01:29:04,600
you can it's not a legal question if you want to come back

1932
01:29:04,600 --> 01:29:06,039
you can come back if I can if I

1933
01:29:06,039 --> 01:29:09,319
can interject real quick I know that Commissioner Ellis had

1934
01:29:09,319 --> 01:29:11,000
some comments if

1935
01:29:11,000 --> 01:29:14,979
if it's something that Commission would like to do if you

1936
01:29:14,979 --> 01:29:16,800
can email it to Cindy

1937
01:29:16,800 --> 01:29:19,010
or I and then maybe we can research if there's something

1938
01:29:19,010 --> 01:29:19,880
that I think there's

1939
01:29:19,880 --> 01:29:22,279
some things that I know what we're gonna be looking into is

1940
01:29:22,279 --> 01:29:23,199
the signposting how

1941
01:29:23,199 --> 01:29:25,890
how the affidavit is working we can well that's one thing

1942
01:29:25,890 --> 01:29:26,880
that we're gonna go

1943
01:29:26,880 --> 01:29:29,960
back and research further if there's something that we can

1944
01:29:29,960 --> 01:29:31,399
do during the

1945
01:29:31,399 --> 01:29:34,479
next while we get ready for the next meeting we can

1946
01:29:34,479 --> 01:29:36,119
certainly do that as well

1947
01:29:36,119 --> 01:29:39,909
I think Commissioner Hesbeth is next yeah and I remembered

1948
01:29:39,909 --> 01:29:40,920
so I agree with that

1949
01:29:40,920 --> 01:29:44,359
that I can email thoughts you know to it and in to the two

1950
01:29:44,359 --> 01:29:45,439
dollars you got a

1951
01:29:45,439 --> 01:29:49,239
figure you have even if you mail in bulk you're at 30 cents

1952
01:29:49,239 --> 01:29:51,399
or so per stamp so

1953
01:29:51,399 --> 01:29:54,369
that only leaves you a buck and some change to stuff to

1954
01:29:54,369 --> 01:29:55,479
body envelopes to

1955
01:29:55,479 --> 01:29:59,710
print and color and it's it's it's it's it's high but it's

1956
01:29:59,710 --> 01:30:01,319
not high if you think

1957
01:30:01,319 --> 01:30:03,770
about it because you got to employ someone even when we're

1958
01:30:03,770 --> 01:30:04,279
not mailing

1959
01:30:04,279 --> 01:30:06,130
something out they have to sit there and be ready to mail

1960
01:30:06,130 --> 01:30:07,119
something out they have

1961
01:30:07,119 --> 01:30:09,640
to track something so when you say you didn't get your mail

1962
01:30:09,640 --> 01:30:10,479
they can then go in

1963
01:30:10,479 --> 01:30:13,170
their system their computer system they'll track it by mail

1964
01:30:13,170 --> 01:30:14,079
but and someone's

1965
01:30:14,079 --> 01:30:16,640
got to drive it to the post office they they can't get in

1966
01:30:16,640 --> 01:30:17,720
the wreck if they get

1967
01:30:17,720 --> 01:30:19,819
in the wreck you got to clean it up off the highway get it

1968
01:30:19,819 --> 01:30:20,520
back to the post

1969
01:30:20,520 --> 01:30:23,340
office you know I mean it just there's a lot that happens

1970
01:30:23,340 --> 01:30:24,680
in life that you got a

1971
01:30:24,680 --> 01:30:30,079
plan for that we don't think about what I think about but

1972
01:30:30,079 --> 01:30:30,920
but I'm just saying

1973
01:30:30,920 --> 01:30:34,720
there's it's not a great rate as far as naturally thinking

1974
01:30:34,720 --> 01:30:36,680
but in practice it's

1975
01:30:36,680 --> 01:30:41,640
a headache and and so that cost money. One question and we

1976
01:30:41,640 --> 01:30:42,279
're gonna wrap it up

1977
01:30:42,279 --> 01:30:44,119
Commissioner Rizzo. I don't have a question I was just

1978
01:30:44,119 --> 01:30:44,920
saying because they

1979
01:30:44,920 --> 01:30:47,170
saw things that I would like them to bring back I don't

1980
01:30:47,170 --> 01:30:47,800
feel prepared to go

1981
01:30:47,800 --> 01:30:50,960
forward with any sort of motion or forward momentum after

1982
01:30:50,960 --> 01:30:53,840
tonight so my my

1983
01:30:53,840 --> 01:30:56,050
hope would be they come back in a couple weeks and at that

1984
01:30:56,050 --> 01:30:57,800
meeting we we create

1985
01:30:57,800 --> 01:31:01,609
some action. And again just to clarify this is an item for

1986
01:31:01,609 --> 01:31:02,760
action this is just

1987
01:31:02,760 --> 01:31:06,199
an item for discussion. It's informational. Yes it's an

1988
01:31:06,199 --> 01:31:06,760
informational

1989
01:31:06,760 --> 01:31:10,760
meeting. Once we determine and have our internal meetings

1990
01:31:10,760 --> 01:31:11,359
and get some

1991
01:31:11,359 --> 01:31:14,630
feedback from you all then we will decide how we want to

1992
01:31:14,630 --> 01:31:15,680
present it if we

1993
01:31:15,680 --> 01:31:18,989
want to go forward with a DDC amendment you'll see it again

1994
01:31:18,989 --> 01:31:20,199
here if we want to

1995
01:31:20,199 --> 01:31:22,939
go forward with just an ordinance in front of council then

1996
01:31:22,939 --> 01:31:23,760
you'll see it on

1997
01:31:23,760 --> 01:31:29,930
video or in the audience if you come. Great discussion and

1998
01:31:29,930 --> 01:31:31,399
presentation thank

1999
01:31:31,399 --> 01:31:36,720
you very much. Thank you. At the conclusion of this item I

2000
01:31:36,720 --> 01:31:37,640
'm going to

2001
01:31:37,640 --> 01:31:42,359
conclude our work session at 644 and we'll reconvene as

2002
01:31:42,359 --> 01:31:43,079
quick as we can

2003
01:31:43,079 --> 01:31:45,960
because we are pretty late.

2004
01:31:51,119 --> 01:31:53,510
Good evening and welcome to the City of Denton Planning and

2005
01:31:53,510 --> 01:31:56,039
Zoning Commission

2006
01:31:56,039 --> 01:32:00,069
meeting for October the 12th. This meeting was duly posted

2007
01:32:00,069 --> 01:32:00,880
and we have a

2008
01:32:00,880 --> 01:32:04,729
quorum present and I'm gonna call our meeting to order at 6

2009
01:32:04,729 --> 01:32:06,640
48. Our first time of

2010
01:32:06,640 --> 01:32:10,359
business tonight will be to stand and give the pledge to

2011
01:32:10,359 --> 01:32:12,079
the US and Texas flag.

2012
01:32:20,199 --> 01:32:25,079
For which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible,

2013
01:32:25,079 --> 01:32:28,199
with liberty and justice for all.

2014
01:32:30,199 --> 01:32:35,130
On under Texas flag, I pledge allegiance to thee, Texas,

2015
01:32:35,130 --> 01:32:40,199
one state, under God, one indivisible.

2016
01:32:47,199 --> 01:32:52,649
As chair we're going to change our agenda order and we're

2017
01:32:52,649 --> 01:32:53,600
going to need to

2018
01:32:53,600 --> 01:32:57,350
move our item 4A up to our first item that we will consider

2019
01:32:57,350 --> 01:32:58,199
and then we'll get

2020
01:32:58,199 --> 01:33:01,739
back to our agenda and that's going to be under our

2021
01:33:01,739 --> 01:33:03,600
individual consideration

2022
01:33:03,600 --> 01:33:06,479
items it's going to be to consider and appoint a member of

2023
01:33:06,479 --> 01:33:07,359
the P&Z Commission

2024
01:33:07,359 --> 01:33:13,199
for a vice chair position. The chair would entertain motion

2025
01:33:13,199 --> 01:33:16,199
. Commissioner back.

2026
01:33:17,199 --> 01:33:24,239
I motion that we nominate Devin Taylor for vice chair. Okay

2027
01:33:24,239 --> 01:33:25,279
. Commissioner

2028
01:33:25,279 --> 01:33:29,310
Hudspeth. Second. Okay. I have a first and a second to nom

2029
01:33:29,310 --> 01:33:30,520
inate Commissioner

2030
01:33:30,520 --> 01:33:38,670
Taylor. Any discussion? Seeing none, I'll call for a vote

2031
01:33:38,670 --> 01:33:41,000
on board.

2032
01:33:44,000 --> 01:33:59,600
I think you said. Motion carries 7-0. Congratulations. Okay

2033
01:33:59,600 --> 01:34:03,039
. Back to our agenda.

2034
01:34:03,039 --> 01:34:08,840
We're going to item 2A which will be to consider our

2035
01:34:08,840 --> 01:34:11,319
minutes. We'll need to take

2036
01:34:11,319 --> 01:34:16,260
these in three separate motions. So first item will be our

2037
01:34:16,260 --> 01:34:19,439
August 10th meeting.

2038
01:34:19,439 --> 01:34:23,510
Commissioner Taylor. I move approval of the August 10th

2039
01:34:23,510 --> 01:34:25,319
meeting minutes. Okay.

2040
01:34:25,319 --> 01:34:29,850
Commissioner back. Okay. I have a first and a second. Any

2041
01:34:29,850 --> 01:34:34,159
discussion? Seeing

2042
01:34:34,159 --> 01:34:51,399
none, I'll call for a vote on the board.

2043
01:35:05,159 --> 01:35:09,399
If you're waiting on me I was not.

2044
01:35:34,199 --> 01:35:44,239
I'm gonna ask for clarification from staff. Yes. Okay.

2045
01:35:44,239 --> 01:35:44,239
Do we even have four people that were here from the 10th?

2046
01:35:44,239 --> 01:35:55,000
Well then we'll go

2047
01:35:55,000 --> 01:35:55,000
ahead and pass it with three. Okay. Just out of imposs

2048
01:35:55,000 --> 01:36:03,159
ibility. The three that were

2049
01:36:03,159 --> 01:36:09,069
here are in favor so that's gonna pass. Three to zero.

2050
01:36:09,069 --> 01:36:13,640
Generally our rules require four.

2051
01:36:13,640 --> 01:36:17,920
The chair entertain a motion on the September 14th minutes.

2052
01:36:17,920 --> 01:36:19,000
Commissioner back.

2053
01:36:19,000 --> 01:36:23,569
I move we approve those minutes. Commissioner Ellis. I'll

2054
01:36:23,569 --> 01:36:24,439
second that.

2055
01:36:24,439 --> 01:36:30,760
We have a first and a second. Any discussion? Seeing none,

2056
01:36:30,760 --> 01:36:31,600
I'll call for a

2057
01:36:31,600 --> 01:36:34,399
vote on the board.

2058
01:36:52,600 --> 01:36:58,909
Motion carries six zero. And chair look for a motion on

2059
01:36:58,909 --> 01:37:02,640
September the 28th minutes.

2060
01:37:03,800 --> 01:37:06,729
Commissioner Taylor. I move approval of the September 28th

2061
01:37:06,729 --> 01:37:07,920
minutes. Okay.

2062
01:37:07,920 --> 01:37:11,479
Commissioner Rozelle. I second. The first and the second.

2063
01:37:11,479 --> 01:37:15,600
Any discussion? Seeing

2064
01:37:15,600 --> 01:37:25,000
none, we'll call for a vote on the board. Motion carries

2065
01:37:25,000 --> 01:37:28,199
seven zero. That will move

2066
01:37:28,199 --> 01:37:31,800
us to our consent agenda.

2067
01:37:34,880 --> 01:37:39,159
Commissioner Rozelle. I move to approve the consent agenda.

2068
01:37:39,159 --> 01:37:40,279
Commissioner Beck.

2069
01:37:40,279 --> 01:37:47,750
Second. Okay. Have a first and a second. Any discussion?

2070
01:37:47,750 --> 01:37:48,760
Seeing none, I'll call

2071
01:37:48,760 --> 01:37:51,600
for a vote on the board.

2072
01:38:09,039 --> 01:38:16,680
Motion carries seven to zero. That will now move us to our

2073
01:38:16,680 --> 01:38:18,520
items of individual

2074
01:38:18,520 --> 01:38:23,210
consideration. We've already taken item 4A. So that will

2075
01:38:23,210 --> 01:38:28,520
move us to item 4B.

2076
01:38:29,079 --> 01:38:35,840
I will call on Mike Bell to begin that presentation for us.

2077
01:38:39,079 --> 01:38:42,520
Thank you, Chair, members of the Commission. This is the

2078
01:38:42,520 --> 01:38:46,319
project number SP 16-2.

2079
01:38:46,319 --> 01:38:51,520
It's a site plan for Razor Ranch. The request is for a site

2080
01:38:51,520 --> 01:38:52,359
plan for

2081
01:38:52,359 --> 01:38:54,569
multifamily development. It's in the south mixed-use

2082
01:38:54,569 --> 01:38:55,279
district of the Razor

2083
01:38:55,279 --> 01:38:58,699
Ranch overlay district. The multifamily design guidelines

2084
01:38:58,699 --> 01:38:59,800
were approved just

2085
01:38:59,800 --> 01:39:03,510
yesterday at City Council, but every site plan application

2086
01:39:03,510 --> 01:39:04,920
requires three parts

2087
01:39:04,920 --> 01:39:04,920
for Razor Ranch. A site plan, a landscape plan, and

2088
01:39:04,920 --> 01:39:07,720
elevation. So we'll go very

2089
01:39:07,720 --> 01:39:14,449
quickly through those. The site is located here in yellow

2090
01:39:14,449 --> 01:39:16,039
on the zoning map

2091
01:39:16,039 --> 01:39:19,159
for Razor Ranch. You see it's up with this area. Heritage

2092
01:39:19,159 --> 01:39:21,279
Trail forms the eastern

2093
01:39:21,279 --> 01:39:25,460
boundary of the property. This is the site plan. I'll walk

2094
01:39:25,460 --> 01:39:26,119
you through it very

2095
01:39:26,119 --> 01:39:29,760
quickly. There are five buildings equaling 300 units, a

2096
01:39:29,760 --> 01:39:31,960
number of accessory

2097
01:39:31,960 --> 01:39:36,520
garages, and three amenities and open space areas,

2098
01:39:36,520 --> 01:39:39,439
including a pool. This is a

2099
01:39:39,439 --> 01:39:41,779
landscape plan. It complies with the landscape requirements

2100
01:39:41,779 --> 01:39:42,359
for screening

2101
01:39:42,359 --> 01:39:49,279
street trees and tree canopy coverage. And then to help

2102
01:39:49,279 --> 01:39:50,840
orient you, based

2103
01:39:50,840 --> 01:39:53,760
on the work session, I have pulled up the working site

2104
01:39:53,760 --> 01:39:55,079
overall site plan for the

2105
01:39:55,079 --> 01:39:58,880
south side of Razor Ranch. This area here, as I said, it's

2106
01:39:58,880 --> 01:39:59,720
working, so it doesn't even

2107
01:39:59,720 --> 01:40:04,000
reflect this site plan, but this is the property in

2108
01:40:04,000 --> 01:40:06,439
question. So you can see

2109
01:40:06,439 --> 01:40:11,939
there's the town center to the west, movie theater,

2110
01:40:11,939 --> 01:40:14,439
convention center. To the

2111
01:40:14,439 --> 01:40:18,479
north of the property is the Winko. To the east of Heritage

2112
01:40:18,479 --> 01:40:19,359
Trail is a planned

2113
01:40:19,359 --> 01:40:22,949
park, and obviously the various pad sites along 380. So I

2114
01:40:22,949 --> 01:40:24,960
hope that helps with the

2115
01:40:24,960 --> 01:40:28,840
questions from work session on how this is oriented.

2116
01:40:29,720 --> 01:40:40,039
And then the elevations are also in your backup. I don't

2117
01:40:40,039 --> 01:40:40,680
have them pulled up on

2118
01:40:40,680 --> 01:40:42,539
this computer, but I'm happy to go through those if you

2119
01:40:42,539 --> 01:40:43,399
have any questions on

2120
01:40:43,399 --> 01:40:49,159
those. There are four criteria for approval, and the Razor

2121
01:40:49,159 --> 01:40:50,119
Ranch overlay

2122
01:40:50,119 --> 01:40:52,960
district, again outlined in your backup, staff has analyzed

2123
01:40:52,960 --> 01:40:53,880
it and determined that

2124
01:40:53,880 --> 01:40:56,670
they meet all those criteria, and therefore recommends

2125
01:40:56,670 --> 01:40:58,079
approval. The

2126
01:40:58,079 --> 01:40:59,460
applicant is here, and I believe they have a quick

2127
01:40:59,460 --> 01:41:00,359
presentation they'd like to

2128
01:41:00,359 --> 01:41:03,680
make as well. Commissioner Betten. Thank you, Chair. Quick

2129
01:41:03,680 --> 01:41:06,199
question. Mike, we briefly

2130
01:41:06,199 --> 01:41:09,319
discussed Heritage Trail. It was going to be six lanes, and

2131
01:41:09,319 --> 01:41:10,399
there was like eight

2132
01:41:10,399 --> 01:41:14,289
foot wide sidewalks, but nothing was mentioned about bike

2133
01:41:14,289 --> 01:41:15,239
paths or anything.

2134
01:41:15,239 --> 01:41:21,779
Are we putting bike paths along this route? That I'm not

2135
01:41:21,779 --> 01:41:22,840
aware of. I'll look

2136
01:41:22,840 --> 01:41:27,460
back at Earl and see if there's any. You'd like to speak on

2137
01:41:27,460 --> 01:41:37,680
that? Good evening.

2138
01:41:37,680 --> 01:41:41,750
Earl Esquire with Engineering. With regard to Heritage

2139
01:41:41,750 --> 01:41:41,800
Trail, Heritage

2140
01:41:41,800 --> 01:41:45,159
Trail is a four lane divided roadway with five foot

2141
01:41:45,159 --> 01:41:46,840
sidewalks on either side. There

2142
01:41:46,840 --> 01:41:50,930
are no anticipation to install any bike lanes per se along

2143
01:41:50,930 --> 01:41:52,359
Heritage. Are we

2144
01:41:52,359 --> 01:41:55,600
going to restrict those walk lanes from bikes riding on

2145
01:41:55,600 --> 01:41:56,840
them like we do in some

2146
01:41:56,840 --> 01:42:01,199
areas around town? I'm sorry. Are we going to restrict

2147
01:42:01,199 --> 01:42:04,479
bikes from riding on those? It'll be

2148
01:42:04,479 --> 01:42:09,119
shared lanes. Sure. Okay. Thank you.

2149
01:42:13,159 --> 01:42:14,579
There's no other questions for me. The applicant is here,

2150
01:42:14,579 --> 01:42:16,239
and I think they have a

2151
01:42:16,239 --> 01:42:20,609
quick presentation they'd like to make. Okay. That'd be

2152
01:42:20,609 --> 01:42:23,159
fine. I haven't got any cards from them, but if the

2153
01:42:23,159 --> 01:42:25,100
applicants here would like to speak on this item, please

2154
01:42:25,100 --> 01:42:25,880
come forward at this

2155
01:42:25,880 --> 01:42:36,270
time. Would the applicant like to speak? Okay. Good evening

2156
01:42:36,270 --> 01:42:37,720
. My name is Austin

2157
01:42:37,720 --> 01:42:40,949
Bradley with EPC Real Estate Group, the developer for the

2158
01:42:40,949 --> 01:42:42,520
project. I just want to

2159
01:42:42,520 --> 01:42:44,869
thank you guys for your consideration tonight. We've been

2160
01:42:44,869 --> 01:42:46,039
working really closely

2161
01:42:46,039 --> 01:42:49,020
with city staff and the master developer to come up with

2162
01:42:49,020 --> 01:42:50,000
what you guys have seen

2163
01:42:50,000 --> 01:42:52,789
to date. We're really excited about it and what's going on

2164
01:42:52,789 --> 01:42:53,439
in the razor range

2165
01:42:53,439 --> 01:42:57,289
development. I don't have a presentation necessarily. Got a

2166
01:42:57,289 --> 01:42:58,279
few images, but I think

2167
01:42:58,279 --> 01:43:00,329
you guys have seen those in the work session and prior to

2168
01:43:00,329 --> 01:43:02,079
today. So with that,

2169
01:43:02,079 --> 01:43:03,859
I'd be happy to answer any questions you guys have. Got a

2170
01:43:03,859 --> 01:43:04,800
couple questions for you.

2171
01:43:04,800 --> 01:43:10,039
Sure. Commissioner Beck. Thanks, Chair. Probably on second

2172
01:43:10,039 --> 01:43:11,560
thought, the question

2173
01:43:11,560 --> 01:43:15,210
I had about the design of the apartments. I'll get with the

2174
01:43:15,210 --> 01:43:16,439
applicant afterwards,

2175
01:43:16,439 --> 01:43:21,079
and it's not worth mentioning here. Okay. Thank you.

2176
01:43:21,079 --> 01:43:23,840
Commissioner Taylor. Thank you,

2177
01:43:23,840 --> 01:43:28,010
Chair. Good evening. I have a couple of questions. I

2178
01:43:28,010 --> 01:43:30,720
noticed there are not any

2179
01:43:30,720 --> 01:43:36,199
bike racks or bike parking called out on the site plan. We

2180
01:43:36,199 --> 01:43:37,119
've, I know that

2181
01:43:37,119 --> 01:43:40,890
you're under, I believe, an MPC or master plan, so you don

2182
01:43:40,890 --> 01:43:42,000
't have to meet our

2183
01:43:42,000 --> 01:43:44,279
current ordinances, but in our current ordinances, multif

2184
01:43:44,279 --> 01:43:46,039
amily requires bike

2185
01:43:46,039 --> 01:43:48,250
parking. Are you planning on putting in anything like that?

2186
01:43:48,250 --> 01:43:49,199
Absolutely. Yeah. There

2187
01:43:49,199 --> 01:43:51,909
was three amenity spaces shown on the site plan, two of

2188
01:43:51,909 --> 01:43:53,199
which would have bike

2189
01:43:53,199 --> 01:43:55,779
racks, and then we'd have a few bike spaces associated with

2190
01:43:55,779 --> 01:43:56,560
what we're calling

2191
01:43:56,560 --> 01:43:59,489
building C. It's that big C-shaped building. So to answer

2192
01:43:59,489 --> 01:44:00,279
your question,

2193
01:44:00,279 --> 01:44:03,250
absolutely. And then in the work session, I had a question

2194
01:44:03,250 --> 01:44:03,920
I don't know if you all

2195
01:44:03,920 --> 01:44:08,680
watched. Is there, are there pedestrian connections over to

2196
01:44:08,680 --> 01:44:10,199
the shopping area and

2197
01:44:10,199 --> 01:44:13,340
over to the grocery store? Yeah, we have sidewalks on all

2198
01:44:13,340 --> 01:44:14,439
four sides of the site,

2199
01:44:14,439 --> 01:44:17,300
specifically on the north and the south side. I believe the

2200
01:44:17,300 --> 01:44:18,199
north is eight foot

2201
01:44:18,199 --> 01:44:20,760
wide and the south would be five or six foot wide. The

2202
01:44:20,760 --> 01:44:21,960
intent is not necessarily

2203
01:44:21,960 --> 01:44:25,270
to bring pedestrians through our site, but absolutely

2204
01:44:25,270 --> 01:44:26,800
around. Okay. Thank you.

2205
01:44:26,800 --> 01:44:39,520
Yeah. I see no more questions. Thank you. You're welcome.

2206
01:44:39,520 --> 01:44:44,199
Thank you. We don't have any

2207
01:44:44,199 --> 01:44:52,390
cards for anyone else to speak, so. Sorry. You trying to

2208
01:44:52,390 --> 01:44:54,119
ring in? I got a whole

2209
01:44:54,119 --> 01:44:56,579
bunch of stuff here on the screen. You have a question or a

2210
01:44:56,579 --> 01:44:57,960
comment? I do have a

2211
01:44:57,960 --> 01:45:01,500
question. Commissioner Taylor. Thank you. My name was still

2212
01:45:01,500 --> 01:45:02,159
up from the last time,

2213
01:45:02,159 --> 01:45:05,140
so I had to un-ring your ring to get back on the list. Well

2214
01:45:05,140 --> 01:45:06,439
, there's still one ahead of you too, so it hadn't come off.

2215
01:45:06,439 --> 01:45:08,960
So go ahead. I did have one

2216
01:45:08,960 --> 01:45:12,090
question for, I don't know if this would be for you or for

2217
01:45:12,090 --> 01:45:14,399
Red Development. We had

2218
01:45:14,399 --> 01:45:18,550
questions about the order of street development. Are you

2219
01:45:18,550 --> 01:45:20,119
going to build the

2220
01:45:20,119 --> 01:45:24,289
Olive Heritage Trail or just the portion immediately

2221
01:45:24,289 --> 01:45:27,720
adjacent to the property?

2222
01:45:32,720 --> 01:45:35,670
Good evening, Commissioners. My name is Scott Wagner with

2223
01:45:35,670 --> 01:45:37,319
Red Development, the

2224
01:45:37,319 --> 01:45:42,739
development representative of Razor Ranch. We are building

2225
01:45:42,739 --> 01:45:43,359
Olive Heritage

2226
01:45:43,359 --> 01:45:45,930
Trail eventually, but we are building it in phases. The

2227
01:45:45,930 --> 01:45:47,399
first phase currently goes

2228
01:45:47,399 --> 01:45:50,109
from University to the south end of Winko. The next phase

2229
01:45:50,109 --> 01:45:50,920
will be along the

2230
01:45:50,920 --> 01:45:55,270
frontage of this project from Heritage to Linden, and then

2231
01:45:55,270 --> 01:45:57,279
that will turn into the

2232
01:45:57,279 --> 01:46:00,050
west to the Hotel Convention Center that was approved and

2233
01:46:00,050 --> 01:46:02,960
under construction six

2234
01:46:02,960 --> 01:46:07,029
months ago or so. And then the next phase as the property

2235
01:46:07,029 --> 01:46:07,640
builds out, we would

2236
01:46:07,640 --> 01:46:09,850
continue that to Scripture. But as of right now, that's not

2237
01:46:09,850 --> 01:46:10,800
planned or

2238
01:46:10,800 --> 01:46:14,590
scheduled. And the private roads like the Linden, the

2239
01:46:14,590 --> 01:46:15,520
public side or the

2240
01:46:15,520 --> 01:46:18,130
private side, will either of those... What will be built, I

2241
01:46:18,130 --> 01:46:19,359
guess, at the time that

2242
01:46:19,359 --> 01:46:23,399
this complex opens? We just pulled a permit. So what's

2243
01:46:23,399 --> 01:46:25,479
being built for this

2244
01:46:25,479 --> 01:46:28,430
phase is the same street system that's built for the Hotel

2245
01:46:28,430 --> 01:46:29,359
Convention Center,

2246
01:46:29,359 --> 01:46:35,600
and it's basically Heritage to the west. Okay. Thank you.

2247
01:46:35,600 --> 01:46:38,960
Thank you.

2248
01:46:38,960 --> 01:46:44,829
You have no cards for anyone else wishing to speak, so

2249
01:46:44,829 --> 01:46:46,840
either a request

2250
01:46:46,840 --> 01:46:51,439
or a motion at this time.

2251
01:46:53,399 --> 01:46:58,600
Commissioner Hutsman. I move approval for this item.

2252
01:46:58,600 --> 01:47:01,800
Commissioner Bec. Okay. I have a

2253
01:47:01,800 --> 01:47:07,239
first and a second for approval. Any discussion on this

2254
01:47:07,239 --> 01:47:08,079
item?

2255
01:47:09,840 --> 01:47:15,760
Seeing none, we'll call for a vote on the board.

2256
01:47:27,199 --> 01:47:31,479
Motion carries 7-0. Good luck with your project. So we'll

2257
01:47:31,479 --> 01:47:37,119
move us to our item 5,

2258
01:47:37,119 --> 01:47:43,729
public hearings, this evening. I'm going to open the public

2259
01:47:43,729 --> 01:47:46,479
hearing for item A, FR

2260
01:47:46,479 --> 01:47:52,029
16-0013, and I will call on Julie Wyatt for that

2261
01:47:52,029 --> 01:47:54,560
presentation.

2262
01:48:08,039 --> 01:48:10,350
We don't normally have presentations for residential repl

2263
01:48:10,350 --> 01:48:16,720
ats, but I did hear from

2264
01:48:16,720 --> 01:48:19,579
the neighborhood adjacent and the residents who received

2265
01:48:19,579 --> 01:48:20,640
notification, and

2266
01:48:20,640 --> 01:48:20,640
so I wanted to just talk about this replat in terms of the

2267
01:48:20,640 --> 01:48:27,319
original plots and

2268
01:48:27,319 --> 01:48:30,609
then what they're proposing. So this is a residential repl

2269
01:48:30,609 --> 01:48:31,560
at for the Haddad

2270
01:48:31,560 --> 01:48:35,029
addition. They're proposing two lots, one being

2271
01:48:35,029 --> 01:48:37,239
approximately four acres, and

2272
01:48:37,239 --> 01:48:42,569
this has access to Lawrence Way, and then this lot,

2273
01:48:42,569 --> 01:48:43,199
approximately

2274
01:48:43,199 --> 01:48:47,430
two acres, has frontage on Ryan Road. This is a combination

2275
01:48:47,430 --> 01:48:48,600
of two existing

2276
01:48:48,600 --> 01:48:52,720
plots that have residential zoning on them, one being the

2277
01:48:52,720 --> 01:48:54,119
Ryan Road estates and

2278
01:48:54,119 --> 01:49:00,659
a replat of this lot three here, and then Thetford addition

2279
01:49:00,659 --> 01:49:02,119
being a replat of

2280
01:49:02,119 --> 01:49:07,569
this lot right here, which turns into this right here. So

2281
01:49:07,569 --> 01:49:08,800
that previous

2282
01:49:08,800 --> 01:49:12,479
lot three from Ryan Road estates takes in that back portion

2283
01:49:12,479 --> 01:49:13,479
of that lot,

2284
01:49:13,479 --> 01:49:20,760
and then the leftover here is lot two. So that's the plot.

2285
01:49:20,760 --> 01:49:21,479
I'll stand for any

2286
01:49:21,479 --> 01:49:25,720
questions. Got a question. Sure. I didn't think about it in

2287
01:49:25,720 --> 01:49:27,079
work session. Is there

2288
01:49:27,079 --> 01:49:31,000
going to be perimeter street paving improvements required

2289
01:49:31,000 --> 01:49:32,399
along Ryan on this

2290
01:49:32,399 --> 01:49:37,600
replat? I know there's a right-of-way dedication, but I'm

2291
01:49:37,600 --> 01:49:40,439
gonna call Earl Escobar.

2292
01:49:44,000 --> 01:49:45,899
To answer your question, no. They would, now that we have

2293
01:49:45,899 --> 01:49:47,680
implemented roadway

2294
01:49:47,680 --> 01:49:49,890
impact fees, they would, we would collect the roadway

2295
01:49:49,890 --> 01:49:50,760
impact fees at this time.

2296
01:49:50,760 --> 01:49:55,760
Upon development, there has been no proposed development or

2297
01:49:55,760 --> 01:49:57,479
no proposed

2298
01:49:57,479 --> 01:50:00,039
development for this first lot that has frontage on Ryan

2299
01:50:00,039 --> 01:50:01,960
Road, but regardless we

2300
01:50:01,960 --> 01:50:04,649
will end up collecting roadway impact fees. I'm still in

2301
01:50:04,649 --> 01:50:05,680
the old school. I'll

2302
01:50:05,680 --> 01:50:10,949
get caught up to the new thing then. Okay, thank you. Any

2303
01:50:10,949 --> 01:50:13,199
other questions for

2304
01:50:13,199 --> 01:50:19,930
staff? Thank you Julie. Again, this is a public hearing. I

2305
01:50:19,930 --> 01:50:21,880
have no cards appear

2306
01:50:21,880 --> 01:50:24,850
from anyone wishing to speak. Anyone who would like to

2307
01:50:24,850 --> 01:50:26,079
speak on this item is

2308
01:50:26,079 --> 01:50:29,180
welcome to come down. Please state your name and address

2309
01:50:29,180 --> 01:50:29,880
and then fill out a

2310
01:50:29,880 --> 01:50:35,579
card. Again, it's public hearing. Anyone wishing to speak

2311
01:50:35,579 --> 01:50:37,920
on this item? Seeing

2312
01:50:37,920 --> 01:50:40,609
none, we will close the public hearing on this item and the

2313
01:50:40,609 --> 01:50:41,520
chair will entertain

2314
01:50:41,520 --> 01:50:49,300
a motion or discussion. Commissioner Taylor. Commissioner

2315
01:50:49,300 --> 01:50:51,880
Ellis. I second. Okay, we

2316
01:50:51,880 --> 01:50:57,279
have a first and a second for approval. Any discussion?

2317
01:50:57,279 --> 01:51:00,520
Seeing none, call for a

2318
01:51:00,520 --> 01:51:03,079
vote on the board.

2319
01:51:10,439 --> 01:51:17,920
Motion carries 7-0. This time I'm going to move to item B

2320
01:51:17,920 --> 01:51:18,880
and I'm going to open

2321
01:51:18,880 --> 01:51:25,760
the public hearing for FR 16-0014 and I'm going to call on

2322
01:51:25,760 --> 01:51:26,560
Haley

2323
01:51:26,560 --> 01:51:30,800
Zagurski for that presentation.

2324
01:51:40,439 --> 01:51:47,720
All right, good evening. My name is Haley Zagurski with the

2325
01:51:47,720 --> 01:51:48,800
Planning Department. So

2326
01:51:48,800 --> 01:51:52,699
this is a replat of Brinker Crossing. It was originally one

2327
01:51:52,699 --> 01:51:53,720
lot with commercial

2328
01:51:53,720 --> 01:51:57,149
development. It has Nassar Jewelry Store on the southeast

2329
01:51:57,149 --> 01:51:58,520
corner and then a strip

2330
01:51:58,520 --> 01:52:00,960
center on the remainder of the lot and the intent of the

2331
01:52:00,960 --> 01:52:01,800
replat is just to

2332
01:52:01,800 --> 01:52:04,789
separate those two lots to allow for new development of

2333
01:52:04,789 --> 01:52:07,159
that strip center. So if

2334
01:52:07,159 --> 01:52:11,630
there are any questions, I'd be glad to answer those. See

2335
01:52:11,630 --> 01:52:15,680
none. Thank you.

2336
01:52:19,000 --> 01:52:21,560
Again, this is a public hearing. If anyone would like to

2337
01:52:21,560 --> 01:52:23,279
speak on this item,

2338
01:52:23,279 --> 01:52:26,239
please come forward at this time.

2339
01:52:28,479 --> 01:52:32,270
Seeing none, I'll close this public hearing and the chair

2340
01:52:32,270 --> 01:52:33,600
will entertain a motion or

2341
01:52:33,600 --> 01:52:41,380
discussion. Commissioner Beck. I move we approve this item.

2342
01:52:41,380 --> 01:52:43,359
Okay. Commissioner Rossell.

2343
01:52:43,359 --> 01:52:46,800
I second. Okay. We have a first and a second for approval.

2344
01:52:46,800 --> 01:52:49,800
Any discussion?

2345
01:52:51,800 --> 01:52:56,039
Seeing none, I'll call for a vote on the board.

2346
01:53:03,880 --> 01:53:07,619
Motion carries 7-0. We'll move us to our item C and I'm

2347
01:53:07,619 --> 01:53:12,359
going to open the public

2348
01:53:12,359 --> 01:53:18,770
hearing for Z-16-0019 and call on Mike Bell for that

2349
01:53:18,770 --> 01:53:20,640
presentation.

2350
01:53:31,520 --> 01:53:35,600
The project is for fire station number four. It's kind of a

2351
01:53:35,600 --> 01:53:36,640
two-part request. The

2352
01:53:36,640 --> 01:53:39,430
first part is consider a recommendation to City Council

2353
01:53:39,430 --> 01:53:40,560
regarding rezoning the

2354
01:53:40,560 --> 01:53:44,119
property from an NR3 district to an NRME 12 district. The

2355
01:53:44,119 --> 01:53:44,960
second part of this

2356
01:53:44,960 --> 01:53:48,560
request is for a mixed-use residential protection overlay

2357
01:53:48,560 --> 01:53:49,600
to restrict use of

2358
01:53:49,600 --> 01:53:54,130
the property to those within any current district and allow

2359
01:53:54,130 --> 01:53:55,319
community service,

2360
01:53:55,319 --> 01:53:59,590
which is what a fire station is classified as. Subject

2361
01:53:59,590 --> 01:54:00,520
property is shown

2362
01:54:00,520 --> 01:54:03,270
here in yellow. It's at the northeast corner of Sherman

2363
01:54:03,270 --> 01:54:05,239
Drive and Kings Row.

2364
01:54:05,239 --> 01:54:09,159
You can see the existing fire station is located on the

2365
01:54:09,159 --> 01:54:11,039
property to the south.

2366
01:54:12,319 --> 01:54:15,970
Current zoning is NR3. That's a single-family zoning

2367
01:54:15,970 --> 01:54:17,159
district that allows

2368
01:54:17,159 --> 01:54:20,279
up to three units per acre. The proposal is NRME 12 with an

2369
01:54:20,279 --> 01:54:21,720
overlay, but the effect

2370
01:54:21,720 --> 01:54:24,119
of that overlay would essentially revert it back to NR3,

2371
01:54:24,119 --> 01:54:25,800
again just allowing the

2372
01:54:25,800 --> 01:54:28,489
additional community service use, which is fire stations,

2373
01:54:28,489 --> 01:54:29,720
libraries, any other

2374
01:54:29,720 --> 01:54:34,909
civic or governmental building. Feature land use category

2375
01:54:34,909 --> 01:54:36,159
of this property is

2376
01:54:36,159 --> 01:54:40,840
low residential. It is a single-family residential area. So

2377
01:54:40,840 --> 01:54:41,840
with the request

2378
01:54:41,840 --> 01:54:45,239
reverting it back to NR3, that is consistent with low

2379
01:54:45,239 --> 01:54:45,720
residential

2380
01:54:45,720 --> 01:54:50,189
category. A comparison of what the permitted uses would be

2381
01:54:50,189 --> 01:54:50,880
with the

2382
01:54:50,880 --> 01:54:54,000
proposal in the middle column. You'll see the existing and

2383
01:54:54,000 --> 01:54:54,720
on the far right

2384
01:54:54,720 --> 01:54:56,930
you'll see what's proposed. The only change with this

2385
01:54:56,930 --> 01:54:57,800
request would be that

2386
01:54:57,800 --> 01:54:59,760
again, community service goes from not permitted to

2387
01:54:59,760 --> 01:55:00,880
permitted. Everything else

2388
01:55:00,880 --> 01:55:07,079
remains exactly the same. So this is not the first zoning

2389
01:55:07,079 --> 01:55:08,319
case on this property. I

2390
01:55:08,319 --> 01:55:11,800
have kept in contact with many of the neighbors as they

2391
01:55:11,800 --> 01:55:12,680
request updates for

2392
01:55:12,680 --> 01:55:16,619
what's going on, and there are some concerns. Generally I

2393
01:55:16,619 --> 01:55:17,399
think most everyone

2394
01:55:17,399 --> 01:55:19,899
was okay with the new fire station on the new location. The

2395
01:55:19,899 --> 01:55:20,880
main concern is what

2396
01:55:20,880 --> 01:55:24,340
happens to the old station. So that bears the question,

2397
01:55:24,340 --> 01:55:25,359
what happens to the

2398
01:55:25,359 --> 01:55:28,050
existing fire station and will it be sold? I heard that

2399
01:55:28,050 --> 01:55:29,960
many times. I have

2400
01:55:29,960 --> 01:55:34,640
verified again with the deputy fire chief today that the

2401
01:55:34,640 --> 01:55:35,640
fire

2402
01:55:35,640 --> 01:55:37,869
department plans to keep the building and remodel it and

2403
01:55:37,869 --> 01:55:38,800
use it for storage of

2404
01:55:38,800 --> 01:55:42,060
some of their extra apparatus. But ultimately city council

2405
01:55:42,060 --> 01:55:42,800
may decide to

2406
01:55:42,800 --> 01:55:45,010
sell it. That is not the plan now, but it's always a

2407
01:55:45,010 --> 01:55:47,199
possibility in the future.

2408
01:55:47,199 --> 01:55:51,479
So I also heard if it does get sold, wouldn't today's

2409
01:55:51,479 --> 01:55:53,199
request, making it an

2410
01:55:53,199 --> 01:55:57,369
NRME 12 district, support if a private developer purchased

2411
01:55:57,369 --> 01:55:58,880
the old station lot

2412
01:55:58,880 --> 01:56:02,119
from the city and wanted to go to NRME 12, wouldn't this

2413
01:56:02,119 --> 01:56:03,119
allow them to kind of

2414
01:56:03,119 --> 01:56:08,840
make that argument? I think that's a fairly good point. To

2415
01:56:08,840 --> 01:56:09,399
kind of address

2416
01:56:09,399 --> 01:56:13,380
that, the answer is on the face of it, it looks like it's

2417
01:56:13,380 --> 01:56:15,159
NRME 12. But again with

2418
01:56:15,159 --> 01:56:18,039
this overlay, we're essentially reverting it back to NR3.

2419
01:56:18,039 --> 01:56:19,439
Well how do you

2420
01:56:19,439 --> 01:56:21,300
as a commission know that? How does a developer who's

2421
01:56:21,300 --> 01:56:22,279
pulling up the zoning map

2422
01:56:22,279 --> 01:56:24,970
and looking to find places to develop, how do they know

2423
01:56:24,970 --> 01:56:26,680
that? What we're going to

2424
01:56:26,680 --> 01:56:31,359
do is add some zoning map symbology. What you see on the

2425
01:56:31,359 --> 01:56:32,000
left is what you would

2426
01:56:32,000 --> 01:56:34,609
see currently in your backup or on the zoning map. It just

2427
01:56:34,609 --> 01:56:35,760
shows NRME 12, you

2428
01:56:35,760 --> 01:56:37,970
would never know that there's an overlay on it just looking

2429
01:56:37,970 --> 01:56:39,279
at the map. We're

2430
01:56:39,279 --> 01:56:42,050
going to add the cross hatch over it that way. Anybody who

2431
01:56:42,050 --> 01:56:42,760
comes and pulls a

2432
01:56:42,760 --> 01:56:45,960
zoning map up knows there's something additional on this

2433
01:56:45,960 --> 01:56:47,960
property. You all can

2434
01:56:47,960 --> 01:56:50,340
ask the question, what is that? We will tell you that it's

2435
01:56:50,340 --> 01:56:52,119
essentially NR3. It is

2436
01:56:52,119 --> 01:56:55,199
not an NRME 12 property. Therefore that does not lend any

2437
01:56:55,199 --> 01:56:56,319
support towards

2438
01:56:56,319 --> 01:57:02,739
rezoning the old fire station. And additionally, y'all as a

2439
01:57:02,739 --> 01:57:03,840
subcommittee or

2440
01:57:03,840 --> 01:57:06,050
subcommittee of PNZ that has looked at some of the city

2441
01:57:06,050 --> 01:57:07,119
initiated rezoning has

2442
01:57:07,119 --> 01:57:10,680
seen the plans for a government only zoning district that

2443
01:57:10,680 --> 01:57:11,680
is not in place

2444
01:57:11,680 --> 01:57:15,579
right now. But the plan is to create that and some of the

2445
01:57:15,579 --> 01:57:17,239
neighbors you have an

2446
01:57:17,239 --> 01:57:20,359
email from Mr. Crossman requesting that if that moves

2447
01:57:20,359 --> 01:57:21,399
forward to consider this

2448
01:57:21,399 --> 01:57:25,369
site to rezone that to governmental entity zoning district

2449
01:57:25,369 --> 01:57:26,439
in the future if

2450
01:57:26,439 --> 01:57:30,350
that comes about and urging you to do so. And he did ask me

2451
01:57:30,350 --> 01:57:31,239
to read it in the

2452
01:57:31,239 --> 01:57:34,100
record so I'll go ahead and do that now. Go ahead. I wish

2453
01:57:34,100 --> 01:57:35,199
to express my concern

2454
01:57:35,199 --> 01:57:37,810
that the zoning changed NRME 12 would allow the old fire

2455
01:57:37,810 --> 01:57:38,979
station property to be

2456
01:57:38,979 --> 01:57:41,699
rezoned in the future to the same zoning. I have no

2457
01:57:41,699 --> 01:57:44,000
opposition to the case, the new

2458
01:57:44,000 --> 01:57:46,920
fire station, but that the city move forward post-haste and

2459
01:57:46,920 --> 01:57:47,439
creating a new

2460
01:57:47,439 --> 01:57:49,890
government only zoning district. Then apply that new zoning

2461
01:57:49,890 --> 01:57:50,640
to both properties

2462
01:57:50,640 --> 01:57:55,399
in the near future. So again based on that I think it's

2463
01:57:55,399 --> 01:57:55,720
highly

2464
01:57:55,720 --> 01:57:58,020
unlikely that somebody could make a case to come back in

2465
01:57:58,020 --> 01:57:59,159
the future if for

2466
01:57:59,159 --> 01:58:01,510
whatever reason the city sells it and make a petition for

2467
01:58:01,510 --> 01:58:02,760
NRME 12. I don't see

2468
01:58:02,760 --> 01:58:07,100
how we would support that with this overlay. Again this is

2469
01:58:07,100 --> 01:58:07,920
a public hearing.

2470
01:58:07,920 --> 01:58:11,289
We did notify within 200 feet to property owners and 500

2471
01:58:11,289 --> 01:58:11,920
feet to the

2472
01:58:11,920 --> 01:58:14,659
physical addresses of the property. We received one in

2473
01:58:14,659 --> 01:58:15,760
opposition and one in

2474
01:58:15,760 --> 01:58:19,850
favor. You receive those both and you're back on. With that

2475
01:58:19,850 --> 01:58:21,000
staff does recommend

2476
01:58:21,000 --> 01:58:24,029
approval and I'd be happy to answer any questions. A couple

2477
01:58:24,029 --> 01:58:25,600
questions. Commissioner

2478
01:58:25,600 --> 01:58:31,720
Tyler. Thank you chair. Could you just briefly touch on the

2479
01:58:31,720 --> 01:58:33,199
previous history of

2480
01:58:33,199 --> 01:58:39,319
rezoning and proposed rezoning for this parcel? To my

2481
01:58:39,319 --> 01:58:39,800
knowledge there

2482
01:58:39,800 --> 01:58:42,640
was a case in the 90s to rezone this to retail for a gas

2483
01:58:42,640 --> 01:58:43,439
station that was

2484
01:58:43,439 --> 01:58:47,050
denied. Then there was a case just last year I believe to

2485
01:58:47,050 --> 01:58:48,359
rezone it from NR3

2486
01:58:48,359 --> 01:58:52,239
to NR4 and they wanted to do single-family houses with a

2487
01:58:52,239 --> 01:58:52,399
higher

2488
01:58:52,399 --> 01:58:55,090
density. I could tell you just from experience and working

2489
01:58:55,090 --> 01:58:55,399
with that

2490
01:58:55,399 --> 01:58:58,810
applicant that even single-family is difficult to do on

2491
01:58:58,810 --> 01:58:59,920
this property because

2492
01:58:59,920 --> 01:59:03,250
of its shape and getting access. It's on a primary arterial

2493
01:59:03,250 --> 01:59:04,319
road so access has to

2494
01:59:04,319 --> 01:59:06,840
come off Kings Row. Ends up being a cul-de-sac and that

2495
01:59:06,840 --> 01:59:07,560
eats a lot of the

2496
01:59:07,560 --> 01:59:09,829
property. So it makes it very difficult to develop this

2497
01:59:09,829 --> 01:59:11,079
even with NR3. So the

2498
01:59:11,079 --> 01:59:13,479
fire station in our opinion is actually pretty good use.

2499
01:59:13,479 --> 01:59:16,600
Thank you. Commissioner

2500
01:59:16,600 --> 01:59:19,600
Rosale. Thank you chair. This is more for clarification.

2501
01:59:19,600 --> 01:59:23,119
The overlay protection being

2502
01:59:23,119 --> 01:59:25,329
placed on this you mentioned the work session was for

2503
01:59:25,329 --> 01:59:26,680
neighborhood residential

2504
01:59:26,680 --> 01:59:30,840
zoning. Is it for residential or mixed-use zones? Because

2505
01:59:30,840 --> 01:59:31,399
the first slide

2506
01:59:31,399 --> 01:59:33,810
you had made it I'm confused at which one we're allowed to

2507
01:59:33,810 --> 01:59:35,239
going forward apply

2508
01:59:35,239 --> 01:59:39,409
this protection to. The code provision is under the

2509
01:59:39,409 --> 01:59:41,840
categories of NR1 through NRMU.

2510
01:59:41,840 --> 01:59:47,920
1 2 3 4 5 6 NRMU 12 and NRMU. The way it's written is to

2511
01:59:47,920 --> 01:59:48,239
put

2512
01:59:48,239 --> 01:59:51,560
additional restrictions on non-residential or multifamily

2513
01:59:51,560 --> 01:59:52,079
development

2514
01:59:52,079 --> 01:59:56,930
to protect neighborhoods. So it's to be on NRMU or NRMU 12

2515
01:59:56,930 --> 01:59:58,479
or if there's some

2516
01:59:58,479 --> 02:00:00,689
instance where NR6s might allow commercial uses you could

2517
02:00:00,689 --> 02:00:01,039
put it on

2518
02:00:01,039 --> 02:00:04,159
non-residential and multifamily. So the key is the non-

2519
02:00:04,159 --> 02:00:05,359
residential part for the

2520
02:00:05,359 --> 02:00:10,869
protection? Correct. Thank you. Commissioner Beck. Thank

2521
02:00:10,869 --> 02:00:11,479
you chair and

2522
02:00:11,479 --> 02:00:14,579
again just to be clear for anybody's concerned who lives in

2523
02:00:14,579 --> 02:00:15,399
that area and I'm

2524
02:00:15,399 --> 02:00:21,439
one of them this rezoning change with its overlay will not

2525
02:00:21,439 --> 02:00:22,840
allow townhomes

2526
02:00:22,840 --> 02:00:25,460
apartments or anything else down there. This is strictly

2527
02:00:25,460 --> 02:00:26,520
for the fire station is

2528
02:00:26,520 --> 02:00:29,810
that correct? It is the purpose of it is for the fire

2529
02:00:29,810 --> 02:00:31,319
station and allow everything

2530
02:00:31,319 --> 02:00:34,680
in NR3 that's currently allowed in the current zoning. Town

2531
02:00:34,680 --> 02:00:35,680
homes was your

2532
02:00:35,680 --> 02:00:38,840
example that's with an SUP today would be with an SUP

2533
02:00:38,840 --> 02:00:40,640
tomorrow if this were approved.

2534
02:00:40,640 --> 02:00:49,550
Okay great thank you. Commissioner Tyler. I can't locate a

2535
02:00:49,550 --> 02:00:50,880
copy of the actual

2536
02:00:50,880 --> 02:00:54,220
overlay. Do you is that in the backup somewhere like what

2537
02:00:54,220 --> 02:00:55,560
lists what is being

2538
02:00:55,560 --> 02:00:58,279
removed and what's being added? No that's typically dropped

2539
02:00:58,279 --> 02:00:59,560
in the ordinance that

2540
02:00:59,560 --> 02:01:01,470
goes to City Council so it'd be in the wording of the

2541
02:01:01,470 --> 02:01:02,800
ordinance itself. So we

2542
02:01:02,800 --> 02:01:05,880
just make a recommendation for an overlay that restricts

2543
02:01:05,880 --> 02:01:06,760
all uses down to

2544
02:01:06,760 --> 02:01:10,729
NR3 except for community service? Well that's actually the

2545
02:01:10,729 --> 02:01:11,600
applicants request so

2546
02:01:11,600 --> 02:01:13,239
I don't think you have to condition that on top of it they

2547
02:01:13,239 --> 02:01:13,920
're requesting both

2548
02:01:13,920 --> 02:01:16,260
the zoning and the overlay. Okay I just kind of expected to

2549
02:01:16,260 --> 02:01:17,960
see a copy of the

2550
02:01:17,960 --> 02:01:20,439
overlay shall remove these uses or something like that.

2551
02:01:20,439 --> 02:01:22,920
Thank you. I'll just

2552
02:01:22,920 --> 02:01:27,640
make one comment when you if you choose to do a motion to

2553
02:01:27,640 --> 02:01:28,520
consider both of them

2554
02:01:28,520 --> 02:01:33,920
then you would have to do the zoning change and then the

2555
02:01:33,920 --> 02:01:37,520
overlay. Two. No you

2556
02:01:37,520 --> 02:01:40,819
can make it a condition of the zoning change but make sure

2557
02:01:40,819 --> 02:01:41,880
that you add both

2558
02:01:41,880 --> 02:01:44,960
elements into your motion.

2559
02:01:47,359 --> 02:01:53,630
I see no other any other questions for staff? Thank you

2560
02:01:53,630 --> 02:01:55,479
Mike. Again this is a

2561
02:01:55,479 --> 02:01:57,689
public hearing anyone who would like to come forward and

2562
02:01:57,689 --> 02:01:58,319
speak on this item

2563
02:01:58,319 --> 02:02:04,010
please do so at this time. You'll need to come up to the

2564
02:02:04,010 --> 02:02:04,920
mic if you'd like to

2565
02:02:04,920 --> 02:02:08,350
speak on this item and please state your name and address

2566
02:02:08,350 --> 02:02:09,520
and after giving your

2567
02:02:09,520 --> 02:02:11,729
comments we'll need to get a card filled out for me they're

2568
02:02:11,729 --> 02:02:12,800
available outside the

2569
02:02:12,800 --> 02:02:15,800
door. All right I did not fill out a card. Okay. My name is

2570
02:02:15,800 --> 02:02:16,880
Evelyn Mulkeric I do

2571
02:02:16,880 --> 02:02:21,869
live on Royal Acres which is within the 500 feet. I don't

2572
02:02:21,869 --> 02:02:23,920
object to the proposal

2573
02:02:23,920 --> 02:02:29,710
of having a new fire station there but I was expecting more

2574
02:02:29,710 --> 02:02:31,479
of a forward plan

2575
02:02:31,479 --> 02:02:36,989
like the exit since it's triangular the exit would probably

2576
02:02:36,989 --> 02:02:38,560
be right up front to

2577
02:02:38,560 --> 02:02:43,520
Sherman whereas last year there was a proposal to put in an

2578
02:02:43,520 --> 02:02:44,520
apartment building

2579
02:02:44,520 --> 02:02:49,069
a two or two story plantation style whatever and they

2580
02:02:49,069 --> 02:02:50,800
showed an image an

2581
02:02:50,800 --> 02:02:54,970
actual draft of what was planned to be put there. We

2582
02:02:54,970 --> 02:02:56,920
basically the neighborhood

2583
02:02:56,920 --> 02:03:01,390
pay basically declined that because it did not fit into the

2584
02:03:01,390 --> 02:03:02,680
neighborhood. This

2585
02:03:02,680 --> 02:03:06,119
new fire station this this triangular shape there were two

2586
02:03:06,119 --> 02:03:07,600
houses before the

2587
02:03:07,600 --> 02:03:12,420
property is well suited for about two or three houses we

2588
02:03:12,420 --> 02:03:14,000
just didn't want rental

2589
02:03:14,000 --> 02:03:21,460
units or multifamily units there. We have no from what I

2590
02:03:21,460 --> 02:03:23,199
understand there were no

2591
02:03:23,199 --> 02:03:27,520
images there was no draft of what kind of fire station how

2592
02:03:27,520 --> 02:03:28,640
large of a fire

2593
02:03:28,640 --> 02:03:32,409
station because the existing one has two fire engines I

2594
02:03:32,409 --> 02:03:34,039
think and an ambulance

2595
02:03:34,039 --> 02:03:37,180
maybe that's insufficient and I certainly don't want to get

2596
02:03:37,180 --> 02:03:38,000
in the way of

2597
02:03:38,000 --> 02:03:41,819
a new fire station we could certainly use that it's just

2598
02:03:41,819 --> 02:03:43,000
that I expected more

2599
02:03:43,000 --> 02:03:46,170
of a planning is it going to be is the exit going to be on

2600
02:03:46,170 --> 02:03:47,560
Kingsrow or directly

2601
02:03:47,560 --> 02:03:52,220
on Sherman which is the way the existing fire station is

2602
02:03:52,220 --> 02:03:53,880
how large is it going to

2603
02:03:53,880 --> 02:03:58,460
be how many engines do you are you are you expecting to

2604
02:03:58,460 --> 02:04:01,560
house there and what's

2605
02:04:01,560 --> 02:04:06,750
going to your previous mention about what's going to happen

2606
02:04:06,750 --> 02:04:07,640
with the existing

2607
02:04:07,640 --> 02:04:12,300
building you mentioned storage but there's also a water

2608
02:04:12,300 --> 02:04:14,359
well there. I'll

2609
02:04:14,359 --> 02:04:18,520
address the second part first the water is staying as well

2610
02:04:18,520 --> 02:04:19,319
that's actually a

2611
02:04:19,319 --> 02:04:22,010
set a different track than the fire station but that's

2612
02:04:22,010 --> 02:04:23,680
owned by the kind of

2613
02:04:23,680 --> 02:04:25,890
under ownership of the water department not the fire

2614
02:04:25,890 --> 02:04:27,720
department that's planning

2615
02:04:27,720 --> 02:04:30,960
to stay the way it is the reason there's no images with

2616
02:04:30,960 --> 02:04:31,920
this as opposed to the

2617
02:04:31,920 --> 02:04:34,130
townhome which was originally proposed was that was a

2618
02:04:34,130 --> 02:04:35,279
specific use permit they're

2619
02:04:35,279 --> 02:04:38,640
required to submit those plans with the application with

2620
02:04:38,640 --> 02:04:39,720
this this is just a

2621
02:04:39,720 --> 02:04:41,970
straight zoning change there is no site plan attached to

2622
02:04:41,970 --> 02:04:43,000
that however if you'd

2623
02:04:43,000 --> 02:04:45,020
like to see it we do have it I'd be happy to share it with

2624
02:04:45,020 --> 02:04:45,880
you but it's not

2625
02:04:45,880 --> 02:04:52,630
really a condition of this request. Commissioner Taylor or

2626
02:04:52,630 --> 02:04:53,960
is still on the

2627
02:04:53,960 --> 02:04:57,840
board okay yep Commissioner O'Zell nope this

2628
02:04:57,840 --> 02:05:03,039
willing okay thank you again this is a public hearing

2629
02:05:03,039 --> 02:05:05,319
anyone else who would like

2630
02:05:05,319 --> 02:05:10,220
to speak on this item please come forward at this time. My

2631
02:05:10,220 --> 02:05:11,880
name is Dave

2632
02:05:11,880 --> 02:05:15,100
Schultz I live at 2207 Wellington Drive which is in my

2633
02:05:15,100 --> 02:05:17,960
backyard that's where I'm

2634
02:05:17,960 --> 02:05:21,869
at there was what it all is the zoning for I understand the

2635
02:05:21,869 --> 02:05:22,439
fire station but

2636
02:05:22,439 --> 02:05:25,779
what else can they put there and is this going to be a two-

2637
02:05:25,779 --> 02:05:26,960
story I mean I need to

2638
02:05:26,960 --> 02:05:30,109
know a little bit more before I say okay yeah we're fine

2639
02:05:30,109 --> 02:05:31,520
with that what is going

2640
02:05:31,520 --> 02:05:35,119
what can it potentially be other than just oh we might put

2641
02:05:35,119 --> 02:05:36,000
a fire station

2642
02:05:36,000 --> 02:05:40,159
okay I'll call a mic bill to answer those questions please

2643
02:05:40,159 --> 02:05:41,640
sure if the

2644
02:05:41,640 --> 02:05:44,369
Commission would bear me for just a second I can't pull the

2645
02:05:44,369 --> 02:05:45,560
plans that seems

2646
02:05:45,560 --> 02:05:49,119
to be that way. That'd be a great idea yes

2647
02:05:56,960 --> 02:06:04,949
again at this time I don't have any cards from anybody

2648
02:06:04,949 --> 02:06:07,920
wishing to speak on

2649
02:06:07,920 --> 02:06:11,229
this item so if you do wish to speak we will need to get a

2650
02:06:11,229 --> 02:06:12,600
card filled out from

2651
02:06:12,600 --> 02:06:17,000
you either before your comments or after so

2652
02:06:27,000 --> 02:06:27,670
there is a site plan and review by staff now which would

2653
02:06:27,670 --> 02:06:32,239
follow the zoning case

2654
02:06:32,239 --> 02:06:37,880
should it be approved and again I want to stress I'm

2655
02:06:37,880 --> 02:06:40,760
showing this so they have

2656
02:06:40,760 --> 02:06:43,579
an idea to get some comfort level but this really isn't

2657
02:06:43,579 --> 02:06:44,800
part of the request so

2658
02:06:44,800 --> 02:06:49,079
there's not much we can change here tonight but I'd be

2659
02:06:49,079 --> 02:06:50,600
willing to show it

2660
02:06:57,960 --> 02:07:02,859
and this is not been approved yet it is subject to change

2661
02:07:02,859 --> 02:07:07,720
of course we're going

2662
02:07:07,720 --> 02:07:10,319
to be very slow

2663
02:07:22,800 --> 02:07:27,069
I'll go ahead and show the elevation since I have those up

2664
02:07:27,069 --> 02:07:27,520
first

2665
02:07:31,800 --> 02:07:34,800
oh you do okay

2666
02:07:53,680 --> 02:07:56,050
so what you see go ahead and orient this north if I can

2667
02:07:56,050 --> 02:08:05,039
Kings Row on the south

2668
02:08:05,039 --> 02:08:05,039
Sherman Drive here the parking lot will be right here this

2669
02:08:05,039 --> 02:08:11,239
is a detention area

2670
02:08:11,239 --> 02:08:11,239
access for the fire trucks be through here and out onto

2671
02:08:11,239 --> 02:08:16,159
Sherman there's an

2672
02:08:16,159 --> 02:08:22,170
accessory parking to the north anything else you want to

2673
02:08:22,170 --> 02:08:23,680
have a single or two

2674
02:08:23,680 --> 02:08:26,800
story structure I think that was a question as well my name

2675
02:08:26,800 --> 02:08:27,359
is Bradley

2676
02:08:27,359 --> 02:08:30,569
with MJ Thomas engineering part of the design team the

2677
02:08:30,569 --> 02:08:32,359
tallest part of the

2678
02:08:32,359 --> 02:08:36,119
building towers 36 feet is one story there's a tower

2679
02:08:36,119 --> 02:08:36,760
involved in this 36 feet

2680
02:08:36,760 --> 02:08:42,380
tall Brian if we could we could pull the computer back up

2681
02:08:42,380 --> 02:08:43,720
these are elevations

2682
02:08:43,720 --> 02:08:47,430
of what you'll see from Sherman Drive this being the fire b

2683
02:08:47,430 --> 02:08:49,159
ays obviously and

2684
02:08:49,159 --> 02:08:51,109
their tower which is typical architecture for a fire

2685
02:08:51,109 --> 02:08:51,720
station these

2686
02:08:51,720 --> 02:08:57,579
days need to get the address from the engineer for the

2687
02:08:57,579 --> 02:08:58,479
engineering firm as

2688
02:08:58,479 --> 02:09:07,079
well got the name MJ Thomas engineering 3973 West Vickery

2689
02:09:07,079 --> 02:09:08,239
Boulevard Fort Worth

2690
02:09:08,239 --> 02:09:13,220
Texas 76107 thank you for that additional information so

2691
02:09:13,220 --> 02:09:14,199
one story brick

2692
02:09:14,199 --> 02:09:21,199
building metal roof okay so the tower as you can see the

2693
02:09:21,199 --> 02:09:22,760
tower on the side it is

2694
02:09:22,760 --> 02:09:27,369
gonna stand about 36 feet tall and at the bay doors it'll

2695
02:09:27,369 --> 02:09:28,399
stand 30 feet tall

2696
02:09:28,399 --> 02:09:33,170
okay and again if anybody from the public would like to

2697
02:09:33,170 --> 02:09:34,079
come see these after

2698
02:09:34,079 --> 02:09:35,609
the meeting we'd be happy to show it to them and go through

2699
02:09:35,609 --> 02:09:36,199
it in more detail

2700
02:09:36,199 --> 02:09:39,020
okay well I think it helps answer several the questions

2701
02:09:39,020 --> 02:09:39,760
that have come up

2702
02:09:39,760 --> 02:09:47,659
does that change your opinion sir okay sure so you'd you'd

2703
02:09:47,659 --> 02:09:48,880
be in support of

2704
02:09:48,880 --> 02:09:53,800
this moving forward now okay great thank you very much

2705
02:09:56,359 --> 02:09:59,829
thank you for bearing with me through that thank you for

2706
02:09:59,829 --> 02:10:01,279
going to trouble to

2707
02:10:01,279 --> 02:10:06,920
pull that up for us again this is a public hearing is there

2708
02:10:06,920 --> 02:10:07,520
anyone else that

2709
02:10:07,520 --> 02:10:10,920
would like to speak on this item

2710
02:10:17,119 --> 02:10:19,899
Commissioner Hesford do you have a question I'm sorry I

2711
02:10:19,899 --> 02:10:21,560
missed your right on

2712
02:10:21,560 --> 02:10:25,439
the board here no problem Mike is it my question is is it

2713
02:10:25,439 --> 02:10:26,159
comparable to the

2714
02:10:26,159 --> 02:10:31,420
station that's going in off of McKinney comparable design I

2715
02:10:31,420 --> 02:10:32,399
haven't seen those

2716
02:10:32,399 --> 02:10:39,680
designs I'm sorry okay okay yeah so if just a point just a

2717
02:10:39,680 --> 02:10:40,840
point if you wanted

2718
02:10:40,840 --> 02:10:46,520
to see it in practice I don't know that exact address it's

2719
02:10:46,520 --> 02:10:48,039
off of McKinney

2720
02:10:48,039 --> 02:11:00,720
mockingbird and McKinney there you go thank you I don't

2721
02:11:00,720 --> 02:11:02,479
think we have we have

2722
02:11:02,479 --> 02:11:04,680
one

2723
02:11:18,039 --> 02:11:21,760
we're trying to clarify up here we had one letter that I

2724
02:11:21,760 --> 02:11:23,760
haven't read yet that

2725
02:11:23,760 --> 02:11:28,229
was a post request we've had one citizen that's come

2726
02:11:28,229 --> 02:11:29,960
forward to speak in

2727
02:11:29,960 --> 02:11:40,460
opposition Mike do you have any okay will you please come

2728
02:11:40,460 --> 02:11:41,720
back to the mic

2729
02:11:41,720 --> 02:11:50,340
okay will you please come back to the mic please this is

2730
02:11:50,340 --> 02:11:54,680
about the best plan

2731
02:11:54,680 --> 02:11:59,149
that has been proposed for that property so we're not

2732
02:11:59,149 --> 02:12:01,000
against it we just wanted

2733
02:12:01,000 --> 02:12:05,529
to find out how large would it be as the other gentleman

2734
02:12:05,529 --> 02:12:07,159
had in inquired you know

2735
02:12:07,159 --> 02:12:11,039
is it a two-story how many engines are going to be housed

2736
02:12:11,039 --> 02:12:12,600
that kind of thing is

2737
02:12:12,600 --> 02:12:16,489
the exit going to be towards Sherman or is it towards Kings

2738
02:12:16,489 --> 02:12:17,840
row what would happen

2739
02:12:17,840 --> 02:12:22,489
with the existing station okay so that was just a concern a

2740
02:12:22,489 --> 02:12:23,680
layout type thing

2741
02:12:23,680 --> 02:12:27,750
but we're definitely not against it okay so are you neutral

2742
02:12:27,750 --> 02:12:29,000
are you in favor of

2743
02:12:29,000 --> 02:12:33,119
it with no I'm in favor yeah I'm in favor for like I said

2744
02:12:33,119 --> 02:12:33,720
this is the best

2745
02:12:33,720 --> 02:12:36,949
solution so correct well thank you for that we have to keep

2746
02:12:36,949 --> 02:12:37,920
track with how many

2747
02:12:37,920 --> 02:12:41,770
people are in support or neutral or opposition as to what

2748
02:12:41,770 --> 02:12:42,840
type of vote if

2749
02:12:42,840 --> 02:12:45,720
it's just a simple majority or supermajority I appreciate

2750
02:12:45,720 --> 02:12:46,359
you clarifying

2751
02:12:46,359 --> 02:12:51,859
that and sorry if we misinterpreted your comment so I don't

2752
02:12:51,859 --> 02:12:53,600
see any other requests

2753
02:12:53,600 --> 02:12:57,869
to speak at this time it is still open for a public hearing

2754
02:12:57,869 --> 02:12:59,359
and I do have one

2755
02:12:59,359 --> 02:13:03,829
letter here that I'm going to read in the record as well we

2756
02:13:03,829 --> 02:13:05,159
have one opposed

2757
02:13:05,159 --> 02:13:08,770
to this request which is Rudy Gonzalez and so I want to

2758
02:13:08,770 --> 02:13:10,079
read that into the

2759
02:13:10,079 --> 02:13:15,319
record as well is a public hearing is there anyone else who

2760
02:13:15,319 --> 02:13:15,600
would like to

2761
02:13:15,600 --> 02:13:19,199
speak on this item at this time

2762
02:13:28,880 --> 02:13:37,840
is Rudy Gonzalez here the president or just have sent in a

2763
02:13:37,840 --> 02:13:43,359
letter okay seeing

2764
02:13:43,359 --> 02:13:46,270
no one else wishing to come forward at this time I'm going

2765
02:13:46,270 --> 02:13:47,560
to close the public

2766
02:13:47,560 --> 02:13:53,069
hearing and call on Commissioner O'Zell I motion to approve

2767
02:13:53,069 --> 02:13:54,199
this agenda item

2768
02:13:54,199 --> 02:14:03,439
okay thank you with I don't know how it has to be worded I

2769
02:14:03,439 --> 02:14:04,720
move for approval of

2770
02:14:04,720 --> 02:14:12,199
the zoning change with the overlay added upon the rezoning

2771
02:14:12,199 --> 02:14:13,880
with a mixed use

2772
02:14:13,880 --> 02:14:17,529
residential protection overlay that acts as in our three

2773
02:14:17,529 --> 02:14:18,840
except adding community

2774
02:14:18,840 --> 02:14:23,119
service it's exactly what you're gonna see right right that

2775
02:14:23,119 --> 02:14:24,479
's why that's what

2776
02:14:24,479 --> 02:14:30,819
it's a great motion Commissioner Hudson second we have a

2777
02:14:30,819 --> 02:14:33,399
first and a second for

2778
02:14:33,399 --> 02:14:37,560
approval with conditions on the overlay

2779
02:14:39,840 --> 02:14:43,640
anyone else wish to speak or comment on this before we take

2780
02:14:43,640 --> 02:14:44,359
a vote

2781
02:14:44,359 --> 02:14:47,119
Commissioner Taylor sure we have some technical

2782
02:14:47,119 --> 02:14:48,680
difficulties over here so I

2783
02:14:48,680 --> 02:14:52,300
can fill in for a few minutes my father worked at station

2784
02:14:52,300 --> 02:14:54,319
for for over a decade

2785
02:14:54,319 --> 02:14:57,399
they used to call it the retirement home because it was a

2786
02:14:57,399 --> 02:14:57,920
very sleepy

2787
02:14:57,920 --> 02:15:00,279
neighborhood I think it's kind of picked up in traffic

2788
02:15:00,279 --> 02:15:02,399
recently and the first

2789
02:15:02,399 --> 02:15:04,810
time they brought one of the Peterbilt engines out there

2790
02:15:04,810 --> 02:15:05,760
that the pride of the

2791
02:15:05,760 --> 02:15:08,619
city and backed it in they knocked the exhaust pipes off

2792
02:15:08,619 --> 02:15:09,399
because the old

2793
02:15:09,399 --> 02:15:13,159
station was so small and the doors were so low that the the

2794
02:15:13,159 --> 02:15:14,640
stacks wouldn't fit

2795
02:15:14,640 --> 02:15:18,329
in the in the bays so they had to park it on the street for

2796
02:15:18,329 --> 02:15:19,600
a few weeks until

2797
02:15:19,600 --> 02:15:24,729
they had the stacks shortened on the truck and I do feel

2798
02:15:24,729 --> 02:15:26,199
that this is the

2799
02:15:26,199 --> 02:15:29,060
best plan I've seen on this we've seen townhomes and a re

2800
02:15:29,060 --> 02:15:30,199
zone with a cul-de-sac

2801
02:15:30,199 --> 02:15:33,170
trying to cram in houses and it's a hard property to

2802
02:15:33,170 --> 02:15:34,479
develop but it's a great

2803
02:15:34,479 --> 02:15:37,319
place for a fire station providing an essential community

2804
02:15:37,319 --> 02:15:38,520
service this

2805
02:15:38,520 --> 02:15:41,600
overlay is a little confusing because it looks like NRMU 12

2806
02:15:41,600 --> 02:15:42,439
but the overlay

2807
02:15:42,439 --> 02:15:46,489
knocks it all back down to NR3 on all uses so if it ever

2808
02:15:46,489 --> 02:15:47,680
stops being a fire

2809
02:15:47,680 --> 02:15:50,989
station the only thing you do is build houses on third acre

2810
02:15:50,989 --> 02:15:53,079
lots so for all

2811
02:15:53,079 --> 02:15:56,789
those reasons I think this is a great idea I would agree

2812
02:15:56,789 --> 02:15:57,560
Commissioner Tucker's

2813
02:15:57,560 --> 02:15:59,359
yes we've been here for a while and there have been a lot

2814
02:15:59,359 --> 02:16:00,119
of things have come

2815
02:16:00,119 --> 02:16:03,199
forward that the neighborhood has been very opposed to and

2816
02:16:03,199 --> 02:16:04,159
so it's nice to see

2817
02:16:04,159 --> 02:16:06,600
something come forward that is an enhancement and

2818
02:16:06,600 --> 02:16:07,600
protection for the

2819
02:16:07,600 --> 02:16:12,010
neighborhood and I'll be supporting this motion as well any

2820
02:16:12,010 --> 02:16:13,640
other comments or

2821
02:16:13,640 --> 02:16:18,829
feedback before we call for a vote seeing none let's call

2822
02:16:18,829 --> 02:16:19,680
for a vote on the

2823
02:16:19,680 --> 02:16:21,880
board

2824
02:16:34,600 --> 02:16:45,680
motion carries 7-0 that will move us to item D I'm going to

2825
02:16:45,680 --> 02:16:46,520
open the public

2826
02:16:46,520 --> 02:16:53,239
hearing for Z 16 - 0 0 2 4 and call on Julie white for that

2827
02:16:53,239 --> 02:16:55,799
presentation

2828
02:17:04,840 --> 02:17:09,459
so okay well we'll summarize it here okay the request

2829
02:17:09,459 --> 02:17:15,159
before you tonight is

2830
02:17:15,159 --> 02:17:17,739
to consider an initial zoning for a piece of property that

2831
02:17:17,739 --> 02:17:18,399
was recently

2832
02:17:18,399 --> 02:17:18,399
annexed into the city they're requesting our CCN which is a

2833
02:17:18,399 --> 02:17:27,719
logical continuation

2834
02:17:27,719 --> 02:17:27,719
of the existing zoning pattern that is in that area so I'll

2835
02:17:27,719 --> 02:17:33,680
stand for any

2836
02:17:33,680 --> 02:17:40,219
questions staff is recommending approval any questions for

2837
02:17:40,219 --> 02:17:41,040
staff

2838
02:17:41,520 --> 02:17:45,079
Commissioner Zill just for my identification is this

2839
02:17:45,079 --> 02:17:46,120
property going to

2840
02:17:46,120 --> 02:17:48,329
be combined with the other properties this is gonna be one

2841
02:17:48,329 --> 02:17:49,200
medical district or

2842
02:17:49,200 --> 02:17:52,559
is this the same owner that has that entire triangle of

2843
02:17:52,559 --> 02:17:53,780
land that is the

2844
02:17:53,780 --> 02:17:57,389
proposal of course you know zoning is is is all of the uses

2845
02:17:57,389 --> 02:17:59,559
and but the the

2846
02:17:59,559 --> 02:18:02,809
applicant is intending to move forward with they've been

2847
02:18:02,809 --> 02:18:03,559
working on a

2848
02:18:03,559 --> 02:18:08,090
preliminary and final plat and also a site plan for this

2849
02:18:08,090 --> 02:18:09,280
proposal so if

2850
02:18:09,280 --> 02:18:13,440
approved you will see a preliminary plat and final plat

2851
02:18:13,440 --> 02:18:17,159
come forward soon with a

2852
02:18:17,159 --> 02:18:21,100
with an anchor site for a hospital as well as some pad

2853
02:18:21,100 --> 02:18:22,680
sites for some medical

2854
02:18:22,680 --> 02:18:25,479
offices so

2855
02:18:30,120 --> 02:18:34,290
thank you Julie again this is a public hearing anyone who

2856
02:18:34,290 --> 02:18:37,319
would like to speak

2857
02:18:37,319 --> 02:18:42,600
on this item please come forward at this time seeing none I

2858
02:18:42,600 --> 02:18:44,559
'm going to close the

2859
02:18:44,559 --> 02:18:49,030
public hearing on this item and open the floor for a motion

2860
02:18:49,030 --> 02:18:50,159
or discussion

2861
02:18:51,440 --> 02:19:00,040
Commissioner Beck okay I'm over this item great

2862
02:19:00,159 --> 02:19:04,629
Commissioner Taylor okay we have a first and a second for

2863
02:19:04,629 --> 02:19:06,079
approval any

2864
02:19:06,079 --> 02:19:08,600
discussion

2865
02:19:14,719 --> 02:19:19,000
I call for a vote on the board please

2866
02:19:21,440 --> 02:19:37,399
motion carries 7-0 we'll move us to item E I'm going to

2867
02:19:37,399 --> 02:19:38,520
open the public hearing

2868
02:19:38,520 --> 02:19:45,670
for PDA 16 - 0 0 0 7 and call on Julie white for a

2869
02:19:45,670 --> 02:19:48,600
presentation okay this time

2870
02:19:48,600 --> 02:19:51,950
I am going to go through the whole presentation so all

2871
02:19:51,950 --> 02:19:53,280
right this is PDA

2872
02:19:53,280 --> 02:19:59,680
16 7 of Julie Wyatt I have summary slide on that one okay

2873
02:19:59,680 --> 02:20:00,799
the request before you

2874
02:20:00,799 --> 02:20:03,489
is to consider a recommendation to City Council regarding a

2875
02:20:03,489 --> 02:20:04,159
detailed plan

2876
02:20:04,159 --> 02:20:08,799
amendment for ropes and ranch PD 173 to permit the blending

2877
02:20:08,799 --> 02:20:11,079
of residential uses

2878
02:20:11,079 --> 02:20:14,790
the subject property is located on the north side of ropes

2879
02:20:14,790 --> 02:20:17,120
and ranch Road it is

2880
02:20:17,120 --> 02:20:22,739
west of I 35 W I'm just some background on planned

2881
02:20:22,739 --> 02:20:24,879
developments in general and

2882
02:20:24,879 --> 02:20:28,920
and ropes and ranch specifically PD 173 was developed under

2883
02:20:28,920 --> 02:20:30,079
the 1991

2884
02:20:30,079 --> 02:20:33,280
development code planned developments were a two-step

2885
02:20:33,280 --> 02:20:35,120
process first the

2886
02:20:35,120 --> 02:20:38,200
concept plan which was the general general guidelines of

2887
02:20:38,200 --> 02:20:39,079
the development

2888
02:20:39,079 --> 02:20:42,639
and also what land uses would have would be permitted ropes

2889
02:20:42,639 --> 02:20:44,600
and ranch concept

2890
02:20:44,600 --> 02:20:50,049
plan was approved in 1999 their proposal their intent was

2891
02:20:50,049 --> 02:20:51,040
to emphasize

2892
02:20:51,040 --> 02:20:55,209
flexibility and variety of housing options for an adult

2893
02:20:55,209 --> 02:20:57,239
community and here

2894
02:20:57,239 --> 02:21:00,209
we can look at the residential uses that were approved

2895
02:21:00,209 --> 02:21:01,760
through that concept plan

2896
02:21:01,760 --> 02:21:06,229
there were five single-family luxury single-family premiere

2897
02:21:06,229 --> 02:21:07,200
and single-family

2898
02:21:07,200 --> 02:21:11,969
casita all had the same permitted uses the differences in

2899
02:21:11,969 --> 02:21:12,760
those three

2900
02:21:12,760 --> 02:21:16,010
residential use categories were the minimum lot sizes as

2901
02:21:16,010 --> 02:21:16,680
well as the

2902
02:21:16,680 --> 02:21:21,250
minimum building square feet single-family Villa brought in

2903
02:21:21,250 --> 02:21:22,000
two family

2904
02:21:22,000 --> 02:21:26,170
attached dwellings but otherwise kept the same permitted

2905
02:21:26,170 --> 02:21:27,440
uses and their

2906
02:21:27,440 --> 02:21:31,000
minimum lot size was was smaller than than the other

2907
02:21:31,000 --> 02:21:32,520
residential land use

2908
02:21:32,520 --> 02:21:37,049
categories it also included multifamily to which allowed

2909
02:21:37,049 --> 02:21:38,239
multifamily dwellings

2910
02:21:38,239 --> 02:21:42,209
as well as community centers and nursing homes libraries

2911
02:21:42,209 --> 02:21:43,440
that those sorts of

2912
02:21:43,440 --> 02:21:48,840
elements so that that those residential land use categories

2913
02:21:48,840 --> 02:21:49,799
were approved with

2914
02:21:49,799 --> 02:21:54,270
the concept plan since that was approved a couple of detail

2915
02:21:54,270 --> 02:21:55,680
plans have have been

2916
02:21:55,680 --> 02:21:59,329
approved for ropes and ranch the one that's being amended

2917
02:21:59,329 --> 02:22:00,959
now or proposed to

2918
02:22:00,959 --> 02:22:06,079
be amended now is the most recent one approved in 2011 that

2919
02:22:06,079 --> 02:22:07,159
detail plan

2920
02:22:07,159 --> 02:22:11,229
provided for specific locations for each of the residential

2921
02:22:11,229 --> 02:22:12,799
land use categories

2922
02:22:12,799 --> 02:22:17,489
and we'll look at those this this land use plan was

2923
02:22:17,489 --> 02:22:19,159
included with that detail

2924
02:22:19,159 --> 02:22:24,120
plan and the yellow depicted the traditional lots the gray

2925
02:22:24,120 --> 02:22:25,079
depicted the

2926
02:22:25,079 --> 02:22:30,209
premier lots this light blue depicted the preserve lots and

2927
02:22:30,209 --> 02:22:30,920
then down here

2928
02:22:30,920 --> 02:22:34,360
were the the single-family villas those those duplex lots

2929
02:22:34,360 --> 02:22:36,280
so each each of those

2930
02:22:36,280 --> 02:22:41,709
uses had a specific location so due to changing market

2931
02:22:41,709 --> 02:22:43,000
trends and and

2932
02:22:43,000 --> 02:22:46,340
conditions on the site the applicant is proposing a change

2933
02:22:46,340 --> 02:22:47,520
to that detail plan

2934
02:22:47,520 --> 02:22:53,139
that change includes to permit the residential land use

2935
02:22:53,139 --> 02:22:55,719
categories SFL, SFP,

2936
02:22:55,719 --> 02:23:01,639
SFC and SFV with on all areas identified as residential use

2937
02:23:01,639 --> 02:23:02,840
and we'll see that in

2938
02:23:02,840 --> 02:23:07,200
a map in a second as far as the SFV which is the single-

2939
02:23:07,200 --> 02:23:08,440
family villa which

2940
02:23:08,440 --> 02:23:13,399
does permit the two-family attached they are proposing a

2941
02:23:13,399 --> 02:23:15,639
maximum of 1200 of those

2942
02:23:15,639 --> 02:23:21,440
throughout the development MF2 this this request does not

2943
02:23:21,440 --> 02:23:23,879
permit MF2 it doesn't

2944
02:23:23,879 --> 02:23:27,290
show depict a location for that if they did want to come if

2945
02:23:27,290 --> 02:23:28,280
they did want to

2946
02:23:28,280 --> 02:23:31,799
develop that that MF2 residential land use category they

2947
02:23:31,799 --> 02:23:32,799
would have to do

2948
02:23:32,799 --> 02:23:35,729
another detail plan amendment to show where that would go

2949
02:23:35,729 --> 02:23:36,600
and how it how it

2950
02:23:36,600 --> 02:23:41,129
would develop just to let you know this this request does

2951
02:23:41,129 --> 02:23:42,360
not increase the

2952
02:23:42,360 --> 02:23:45,790
total number of dwelling units that were approved with the

2953
02:23:45,790 --> 02:23:48,440
2011 detail plan or

2954
02:23:48,440 --> 02:23:53,159
the maximum density it just reallocates those residential

2955
02:23:53,159 --> 02:23:54,799
uses and mixes them up

2956
02:23:54,799 --> 02:23:59,579
within that residential use area and so they're proposing a

2957
02:23:59,579 --> 02:24:01,000
change in the map

2958
02:24:01,000 --> 02:24:04,559
that looks like this so the yellow is that residential use

2959
02:24:04,559 --> 02:24:06,840
area and I know we

2960
02:24:06,840 --> 02:24:10,030
talked in work session about what's actually developed in

2961
02:24:10,030 --> 02:24:10,920
in this general

2962
02:24:10,920 --> 02:24:14,520
area right here there's about a third you know about 1600

2963
02:24:14,520 --> 02:24:15,159
homes have been

2964
02:24:15,159 --> 02:24:17,750
developed out of the proposed you know little six

2965
02:24:17,750 --> 02:24:21,239
approximately six thousand so

2966
02:24:21,239 --> 02:24:26,430
so the the remaining residential use categories would be

2967
02:24:26,430 --> 02:24:27,799
interspersed

2968
02:24:27,799 --> 02:24:34,350
throughout the the balance of that development so the 1991

2969
02:24:34,350 --> 02:24:35,840
code does have

2970
02:24:35,840 --> 02:24:39,079
the criteria for approval of a detailed plan amendment and

2971
02:24:39,079 --> 02:24:40,280
staff looked at that

2972
02:24:40,280 --> 02:24:43,590
the first criteria that it complies with the general

2973
02:24:43,590 --> 02:24:46,280
concept plan this proposed

2974
02:24:46,280 --> 02:24:52,639
change does does meet that goal or that criteria that it

2975
02:24:52,639 --> 02:24:54,280
permits flexibility

2976
02:24:54,280 --> 02:24:58,809
within the residential land uses it also maintains the

2977
02:24:58,809 --> 02:25:00,639
overall density and it's

2978
02:25:00,639 --> 02:25:04,950
not introducing any new residential land use categories it

2979
02:25:04,950 --> 02:25:06,959
's just furthering what

2980
02:25:06,959 --> 02:25:10,149
what was approved with that concept plan the second

2981
02:25:10,149 --> 02:25:11,079
criteria for approval

2982
02:25:11,079 --> 02:25:14,829
provides a compatible arrangement of buildings and land

2983
02:25:14,829 --> 02:25:15,639
uses that would not

2984
02:25:15,639 --> 02:25:18,489
adversely affect adjoining neighborhoods or properties

2985
02:25:18,489 --> 02:25:20,120
outside of the plan once

2986
02:25:20,120 --> 02:25:23,340
again the proposed modification doesn't alter the permitted

2987
02:25:23,340 --> 02:25:24,399
land uses or the low

2988
02:25:24,399 --> 02:25:29,389
density residential land use pattern provides for adequate

2989
02:25:29,389 --> 02:25:30,120
and safe

2990
02:25:30,120 --> 02:25:33,399
circulation of vehicular traffic since there is not an

2991
02:25:33,399 --> 02:25:34,760
increase in the total

2992
02:25:34,760 --> 02:25:39,680
number of dwelling units there would not by extension

2993
02:25:39,680 --> 02:25:41,399
necessarily be an increase

2994
02:25:41,399 --> 02:25:44,829
in traffic and then in substantial compliance with the

2995
02:25:44,829 --> 02:25:45,840
landscape sign

2996
02:25:45,840 --> 02:25:48,750
subdivision and other regulations of the city and this

2997
02:25:48,750 --> 02:25:49,959
proposal is in compliance

2998
02:25:49,959 --> 02:25:56,069
with that so based upon this criteria staff does the detail

2999
02:25:56,069 --> 02:25:57,040
plan does meet

3000
02:25:57,040 --> 02:26:00,360
this criteria for approval there was a notification sent

3001
02:26:00,360 --> 02:26:01,399
and I know I gave y'all

3002
02:26:01,399 --> 02:26:05,989
a stack of letters we got quite a few these numbers are

3003
02:26:05,989 --> 02:26:07,760
from noon today so I

3004
02:26:07,760 --> 02:26:10,909
know you have more letters in your stack than is actually

3005
02:26:10,909 --> 02:26:12,079
reflected in this in

3006
02:26:12,079 --> 02:26:15,950
this presentation but we as of noon we received 13 in

3007
02:26:15,950 --> 02:26:18,079
opposition 22 in favor and

3008
02:26:18,079 --> 02:26:22,709
then eight neutral responses so based upon the criteria for

3009
02:26:22,709 --> 02:26:24,959
approval and and

3010
02:26:24,959 --> 02:26:27,450
the future land use staff does recommend approval of this

3011
02:26:27,450 --> 02:26:29,159
request and I'll stand

3012
02:26:29,159 --> 02:26:40,079
for any questions the applicant is here so he can answer

3013
02:26:40,079 --> 02:26:44,600
thank you chair I'm

3014
02:26:44,600 --> 02:26:48,000
just trying to understand the arithmetic here so there are

3015
02:26:48,000 --> 02:26:49,719
approximately the is

3016
02:26:49,719 --> 02:26:53,360
the 6,000 the limit or is there actually like some 6,000 in

3017
02:26:53,360 --> 02:26:55,040
some change it's a

3018
02:26:55,040 --> 02:26:59,309
good question the original concept plan approved 7,500

3019
02:26:59,309 --> 02:27:01,040
homes subsequent detailed

3020
02:27:01,040 --> 02:27:08,000
plans actually detailed out 6,000 and I don't have the

3021
02:27:08,000 --> 02:27:09,000
exact number the

3022
02:27:09,000 --> 02:27:15,280
applicant is here 6,300 or around the 6,000 mark they do

3023
02:27:15,280 --> 02:27:19,200
have a a provision

3024
02:27:19,200 --> 02:27:22,760
within the concept plan that allows them to increase the

3025
02:27:22,760 --> 02:27:24,879
density by 5% without

3026
02:27:24,879 --> 02:27:28,729
doing a new detail plan or some sort of approval by City

3027
02:27:28,729 --> 02:27:30,360
Council so they could

3028
02:27:30,360 --> 02:27:35,819
increase those approved lots that were approved in 2011 up

3029
02:27:35,819 --> 02:27:37,760
to 5% anything over

3030
02:27:37,760 --> 02:27:41,549
that would would require approval by City Council I did the

3031
02:27:41,549 --> 02:27:42,600
math and I don't

3032
02:27:42,600 --> 02:27:45,350
I didn't write it down but it I think it was around 300

3033
02:27:45,350 --> 02:27:47,799
lots that they could go

3034
02:27:47,799 --> 02:27:51,670
over that what was approved with that 2011 so let's say 6,

3035
02:27:51,670 --> 02:27:53,760
600 as maybe that

3036
02:27:53,760 --> 02:27:58,290
number is approximately 6,600 and 1,600 or so have been

3037
02:27:58,290 --> 02:28:00,799
built and probably a

3038
02:28:00,799 --> 02:28:03,959
few hundred more have been detail like detail plans have

3039
02:28:03,959 --> 02:28:05,120
been finalized and

3040
02:28:05,120 --> 02:28:11,870
basically been platted so so you've got about 4,500 or 4,

3041
02:28:11,870 --> 02:28:14,159
800 potential future

3042
02:28:14,159 --> 02:28:20,180
lots to be detailed out and these 1,200 new units would be

3043
02:28:20,180 --> 02:28:23,079
all in those 4,800

3044
02:28:23,079 --> 02:28:29,360
future lots yes sir and so I figure that these can be

3045
02:28:29,360 --> 02:28:30,879
smaller lots like they can

3046
02:28:30,879 --> 02:28:34,319
they can actually be physically smaller make 3,000 3,000

3047
02:28:34,319 --> 02:28:34,959
square feet as opposed

3048
02:28:34,959 --> 02:28:39,030
to 6 or 4 so in theory they could put more put them closer

3049
02:28:39,030 --> 02:28:40,360
together yes sir but

3050
02:28:40,360 --> 02:28:44,280
they could also put one of these villas on an 8,000 square

3051
02:28:44,280 --> 02:28:45,440
foot there's no reason

3052
02:28:45,440 --> 02:28:48,129
it doesn't say they have to be on a small lot correct they

3053
02:28:48,129 --> 02:28:48,559
just have a

3054
02:28:48,559 --> 02:28:51,649
minimum but even if they put them on the full-size lots in

3055
02:28:51,649 --> 02:28:52,559
the detail plan

3056
02:28:52,559 --> 02:28:55,149
they're gonna end up with five hundred and seventy because

3057
02:28:55,149 --> 02:28:56,120
you're putting two

3058
02:28:56,120 --> 02:28:59,479
units per lot you're gonna end up with an extra five

3059
02:28:59,479 --> 02:29:01,159
hundred or so units does

3060
02:29:01,159 --> 02:29:04,920
that mean they're going to add park space or space out the

3061
02:29:04,920 --> 02:29:05,959
single family

3062
02:29:05,959 --> 02:29:10,489
more like make everything lot and a half sized or something

3063
02:29:10,489 --> 02:29:11,719
the applicant is here

3064
02:29:11,719 --> 02:29:14,530
and I would call on him to answer how it's actually going

3065
02:29:14,530 --> 02:29:15,600
to work in practice

3066
02:29:15,600 --> 02:29:19,319
within their development because because yes this doesn't

3067
02:29:19,319 --> 02:29:20,440
increase that six

3068
02:29:20,440 --> 02:29:24,350
thousand so there will have to be a way to work that

3069
02:29:24,350 --> 02:29:26,280
because they they have a

3070
02:29:26,280 --> 02:29:30,420
space they're trying to fill so yes he's here is the

3071
02:29:30,420 --> 02:29:31,479
applicant here would like to

3072
02:29:31,479 --> 02:29:35,200
come forward and address some of these questions

3073
02:29:38,200 --> 02:29:41,440
please state your name and address when you get to the mic

3074
02:29:41,440 --> 02:29:42,360
Mr. Chairman members

3075
02:29:42,360 --> 02:29:44,200
of the Commission my name is Todd Fitzgerald here

3076
02:29:44,200 --> 02:29:45,120
representing Robson

3077
02:29:45,120 --> 02:29:49,440
Ranch my address is 9666 East Riggs Road Sun Lakes Arizona

3078
02:29:49,440 --> 02:29:51,280
85248 thank you

3079
02:29:51,280 --> 02:29:54,430
appreciate your time and hearing us likewise of staff been

3080
02:29:54,430 --> 02:29:55,079
very helpful

3081
02:29:55,079 --> 02:29:57,920
working through this really it's a name of flexibility that

3082
02:29:57,920 --> 02:29:58,719
were before you

3083
02:29:58,719 --> 02:30:01,559
tonight requesting this change as Julie said not to restate

3084
02:30:01,559 --> 02:30:02,479
all the same facts

3085
02:30:02,479 --> 02:30:05,190
but not an increase in density not an additional product

3086
02:30:05,190 --> 02:30:06,200
type or even a change

3087
02:30:06,200 --> 02:30:09,629
to what was approved but flexibility to put it in place the

3088
02:30:09,629 --> 02:30:11,399
real to answer your

3089
02:30:11,399 --> 02:30:13,700
question more directly is typically our product sizes have

3090
02:30:13,700 --> 02:30:14,600
been growing over the

3091
02:30:14,600 --> 02:30:19,639
past say 10 to 15 years lot size although they're approved

3092
02:30:19,639 --> 02:30:21,000
to be some 80 50 by 80

3093
02:30:21,000 --> 02:30:24,190
feet have grown to be 60 by 110 each time and all of our

3094
02:30:24,190 --> 02:30:25,120
series are growing

3095
02:30:25,120 --> 02:30:28,120
maybe that's added to the creation of the need for this

3096
02:30:28,120 --> 02:30:29,399
villa product and how

3097
02:30:29,399 --> 02:30:32,110
it's being so well received we're seeing that our densities

3098
02:30:32,110 --> 02:30:33,040
are dropping

3099
02:30:33,040 --> 02:30:36,319
excuse me are dropping as a result of that lot size

3100
02:30:36,319 --> 02:30:38,280
increase so I don't see it

3101
02:30:38,280 --> 02:30:41,790
being a whole bunch of additional land nor units but a

3102
02:30:41,790 --> 02:30:43,280
matter just blending

3103
02:30:43,280 --> 02:30:46,190
what's available and how we offer it the trend being and

3104
02:30:46,190 --> 02:30:47,360
again it's probably

3105
02:30:47,360 --> 02:30:50,280
state the obvious but a 30 40 year build in our projects

3106
02:30:50,280 --> 02:30:51,719
tend to see some

3107
02:30:51,719 --> 02:30:54,409
patterns and what we're really seeking is the ability to

3108
02:30:54,409 --> 02:30:55,280
react to them and

3109
02:30:55,280 --> 02:30:58,469
react and get out front far enough to try to try to spot

3110
02:30:58,469 --> 02:30:59,840
some things coming and

3111
02:30:59,840 --> 02:31:02,989
make a move in time to be have it available rather than be

3112
02:31:02,989 --> 02:31:04,719
on our heels so

3113
02:31:04,719 --> 02:31:08,270
it sounds like what you what you might end up doing is the

3114
02:31:08,270 --> 02:31:09,520
villas might be on

3115
02:31:09,520 --> 02:31:15,020
fairly small lots but then the average size of the the SFL

3116
02:31:15,020 --> 02:31:17,399
SFP FFC might get a

3117
02:31:17,399 --> 02:31:20,159
little bit bigger basically kind of absorb that extra space

3118
02:31:20,159 --> 02:31:20,680
that is what

3119
02:31:20,680 --> 02:31:23,200
has happened correct and the villas also have been we've

3120
02:31:23,200 --> 02:31:24,719
been offering as a pod

3121
02:31:24,719 --> 02:31:28,850
kind of a neighborhood within the community itself and with

3122
02:31:28,850 --> 02:31:29,520
it some open

3123
02:31:29,520 --> 02:31:32,110
space and some area where the other smaller lots and

3124
02:31:32,110 --> 02:31:33,520
smaller backyards not

3125
02:31:33,520 --> 02:31:36,370
maintained the lock and leave has been a big success for us

3126
02:31:36,370 --> 02:31:37,239
and that's how we've

3127
02:31:37,239 --> 02:31:39,690
been marketing them but then an open spacing behind it such

3128
02:31:39,690 --> 02:31:40,440
that there isn't

3129
02:31:40,440 --> 02:31:43,129
somebody else right there if it was to be put at minimum

3130
02:31:43,129 --> 02:31:44,280
setback minimum setback

3131
02:31:44,280 --> 02:31:47,360
they wouldn't be right on top of each other so that's also

3132
02:31:47,360 --> 02:31:48,159
using up some of

3133
02:31:48,159 --> 02:31:51,239
that same land if that answer your question yeah and I had

3134
02:31:51,239 --> 02:31:52,120
there was a few

3135
02:31:52,120 --> 02:31:54,329
more questions that came up in the work session I guess I

3136
02:31:54,329 --> 02:31:55,200
'll go and bring it now

3137
02:31:55,200 --> 02:32:01,430
the generally in our in in like our standard zoning

3138
02:32:01,430 --> 02:32:02,440
neighborhood residential

3139
02:32:02,440 --> 02:32:06,969
type zoning we strongly discourage mixing duplexes just in

3140
02:32:06,969 --> 02:32:08,040
innate like you

3141
02:32:08,040 --> 02:32:11,709
will usually have this street over here will be duplexes

3142
02:32:11,709 --> 02:32:13,639
not a duplex single

3143
02:32:13,639 --> 02:32:16,809
family duplex you know mixed in in the block right and I

3144
02:32:16,809 --> 02:32:17,600
think that's one

3145
02:32:17,600 --> 02:32:20,040
concern that was that was a brought up in the work session

3146
02:32:20,040 --> 02:32:22,600
this even goes into

3147
02:32:22,600 --> 02:32:26,770
the already built properties and says that duplexes could

3148
02:32:26,770 --> 02:32:27,840
go in you know if

3149
02:32:27,840 --> 02:32:30,530
house burned down or something somebody demolished in

3150
02:32:30,530 --> 02:32:31,680
theory they could even go

3151
02:32:31,680 --> 02:32:35,190
in and build the villa in you know in between two existing

3152
02:32:35,190 --> 02:32:36,680
single-family homes

3153
02:32:36,680 --> 02:32:41,399
that's that's counter to like I said a lot of our

3154
02:32:41,399 --> 02:32:42,719
neighborhood residential type

3155
02:32:42,719 --> 02:32:48,840
zoning where we would have some kind of separation between

3156
02:32:48,840 --> 02:32:51,559
the the density and if

3157
02:32:51,559 --> 02:32:54,450
I can speak to that and our goal is the same they don't

3158
02:32:54,450 --> 02:32:56,319
work well kind of lot by

3159
02:32:56,319 --> 02:32:59,239
lot but more as a pot in the lot depths and dimensions the

3160
02:32:59,239 --> 02:33:00,239
rear lot lines would

3161
02:33:00,239 --> 02:33:03,760
be staggered the streetscape wouldn't look it's better to

3162
02:33:03,760 --> 02:33:04,559
be planned together

3163
02:33:04,559 --> 02:33:07,170
and we landscape it together and it's on one system one

3164
02:33:07,170 --> 02:33:08,399
landscape system that's

3165
02:33:08,399 --> 02:33:11,790
operated by an HOA and a separate HOA in fact and it has to

3166
02:33:11,790 --> 02:33:13,600
kind of work the way

3167
02:33:13,600 --> 02:33:16,389
we've always offered it anyway it has to work as one

3168
02:33:16,389 --> 02:33:18,680
complete unit community not

3169
02:33:18,680 --> 02:33:22,200
to not a big house next to a small one if that's you have

3170
02:33:22,200 --> 02:33:23,399
to kind of sound at

3171
02:33:23,399 --> 02:33:26,090
what you're saying in terms of the existing plats I would

3172
02:33:26,090 --> 02:33:27,200
think the plot

3173
02:33:27,200 --> 02:33:31,290
I'm a bit getting out of my belly wick but excuse me the

3174
02:33:31,290 --> 02:33:33,000
plot sets out the terms

3175
02:33:33,000 --> 02:33:34,959
of what would be allowed and what minimums and dimensions

3176
02:33:34,959 --> 02:33:35,520
would be allowed

3177
02:33:35,520 --> 02:33:38,209
and I would I would think a villa wouldn't wouldn't be

3178
02:33:38,209 --> 02:33:39,159
allowed within that

3179
02:33:39,159 --> 02:33:42,549
unless it was just a smaller house if somebody tore it down

3180
02:33:42,549 --> 02:33:43,399
and wanted to

3181
02:33:43,399 --> 02:33:46,209
start again but yeah I believe so you wouldn't be able to

3182
02:33:46,209 --> 02:33:47,959
cut a lot in half or

3183
02:33:47,959 --> 02:33:50,200
something like that without if it's been plotted but you

3184
02:33:50,200 --> 02:33:52,440
could most likely build

3185
02:33:52,440 --> 02:33:56,530
a if you had a house that burned down or was demolished you

3186
02:33:56,530 --> 02:33:58,840
could then build one

3187
02:33:58,840 --> 02:34:02,350
of the villas is that correct a duplex type home anywhere

3188
02:34:02,350 --> 02:34:05,399
in the yellow maybe

3189
02:34:05,399 --> 02:34:10,639
Julie can just per the proposal as long as it doesn't

3190
02:34:10,639 --> 02:34:12,239
exceed that the maximum

3191
02:34:12,239 --> 02:34:17,920
number of villas of 1200 or 12 villa dwelling units of 1200

3192
02:34:17,920 --> 02:34:18,600
they could it

3193
02:34:18,600 --> 02:34:24,329
could go anywhere within the development for the zoning if

3194
02:34:24,329 --> 02:34:25,719
I can just tag on to

3195
02:34:25,719 --> 02:34:29,000
the end of that I think a single villa sometimes there's

3196
02:34:29,000 --> 02:34:29,920
there's not an ability

3197
02:34:29,920 --> 02:34:33,190
to get it to two of them together but it'd be enough space

3198
02:34:33,190 --> 02:34:34,479
for one so it'd be

3199
02:34:34,479 --> 02:34:37,559
a single lot still called a villa but but not with a common

3200
02:34:37,559 --> 02:34:39,000
wall I don't think

3201
02:34:39,000 --> 02:34:42,469
a common wall would be possible in a typical plat with a

3202
02:34:42,469 --> 02:34:44,520
created lot a single

3203
02:34:44,520 --> 02:34:47,280
building maybe of that same side with two side setbacks

3204
02:34:47,280 --> 02:34:48,360
would be provisioned

3205
02:34:48,360 --> 02:34:53,209
for but I don't see it to be possible to have a duplex that

3206
02:34:53,209 --> 02:34:56,319
makes sense a couple

3207
02:34:56,319 --> 02:34:59,879
more questions for you Commissioner Ellis thank you chair

3208
02:34:59,879 --> 02:35:02,000
good evening there's a

3209
02:35:02,000 --> 02:35:04,209
lot of talk about the villas obviously because there's a

3210
02:35:04,209 --> 02:35:05,079
tremendous increase

3211
02:35:05,079 --> 02:35:08,920
from the original plan obviously you you have seen in

3212
02:35:08,920 --> 02:35:11,760
demand for this product how

3213
02:35:11,760 --> 02:35:15,200
is the villa counted as a unit it does have a common wall

3214
02:35:15,200 --> 02:35:16,799
so it's two

3215
02:35:16,799 --> 02:35:20,969
residences in in a villa correct to homeowners to a

3216
02:35:20,969 --> 02:35:22,399
building is that one

3217
02:35:22,399 --> 02:35:26,079
unit or is it two units - so it's separate separate

3218
02:35:26,079 --> 02:35:28,440
ownership so it's two

3219
02:35:28,440 --> 02:35:35,409
units so we are increasing the amount of people if we're

3220
02:35:35,409 --> 02:35:38,079
increasing the villas so

3221
02:35:38,079 --> 02:35:41,659
we're not increasing the units but if a villa counts as two

3222
02:35:41,659 --> 02:35:42,280
units we're

3223
02:35:42,280 --> 02:35:45,829
definitely increasing the population correct but by not

3224
02:35:45,829 --> 02:35:47,079
adding for our part

3225
02:35:47,079 --> 02:35:50,370
by not adding to any of the maximum densities within what

3226
02:35:50,370 --> 02:35:51,239
was approved I

3227
02:35:51,239 --> 02:35:55,600
think the number is 6037 of that detail plan and then that

3228
02:35:55,600 --> 02:35:56,639
five percent slot by

3229
02:35:56,639 --> 02:35:59,639
not extending that we recognize and acknowledge that we

3230
02:35:59,639 --> 02:36:00,760
wouldn't be there

3231
02:36:00,760 --> 02:36:03,639
would be no new people beyond what was provisioned for

3232
02:36:03,639 --> 02:36:05,559
previously spread around

3233
02:36:05,559 --> 02:36:08,870
differently and adjusted but not within the community not

3234
02:36:08,870 --> 02:36:10,000
an increase in density

3235
02:36:10,000 --> 02:36:13,040
there would not be even with a jump like that

3236
02:36:13,040 --> 02:36:18,170
actually okay and something you don't have any single vill

3237
02:36:18,170 --> 02:36:18,879
as around the

3238
02:36:18,879 --> 02:36:22,569
neighborhood now are they all in clusters now they are yeah

3239
02:36:22,569 --> 02:36:22,959
we've only

3240
02:36:22,959 --> 02:36:26,469
ever done on a plot subdivision basis you know one of the

3241
02:36:26,469 --> 02:36:27,920
unit 47 is a recent

3242
02:36:27,920 --> 02:36:31,840
one that is all villas in fact the only one today but it's

3243
02:36:31,840 --> 02:36:33,200
together and with

3244
02:36:33,200 --> 02:36:36,180
final plat with dedications and spells out the terms of how

3245
02:36:36,180 --> 02:36:36,760
it will be

3246
02:36:36,760 --> 02:36:40,709
maintained and how it's different than a typical one and is

3247
02:36:40,709 --> 02:36:42,079
your future plan to

3248
02:36:42,079 --> 02:36:45,760
go along with how you've been building them in pods like

3249
02:36:45,760 --> 02:36:47,360
that accurate yes a

3250
02:36:47,360 --> 02:36:51,479
separate pod per subdivision that would how many are in a

3251
02:36:51,479 --> 02:36:52,799
pod and just by

3252
02:36:52,799 --> 02:36:56,229
phasing that it's not a predetermined amount this is part

3253
02:36:56,229 --> 02:36:56,799
of the flexibility

3254
02:36:56,799 --> 02:36:59,879
we're seeking to see if if it continues to be successful

3255
02:36:59,879 --> 02:37:01,239
and maybe that those

3256
02:37:01,239 --> 02:37:04,579
pod sizes look one way if it's maybe backs off a little bit

3257
02:37:04,579 --> 02:37:05,520
a smaller bite

3258
02:37:05,520 --> 02:37:08,360
would make more sense and we get into this stuff like

3259
02:37:08,360 --> 02:37:09,239
bouncing the dirt and

3260
02:37:09,239 --> 02:37:12,000
the roads and the sewer and water and some of the feasible

3261
02:37:12,000 --> 02:37:14,159
issues that plane

3262
02:37:14,159 --> 02:37:18,149
of those decisions as well as demand okay thank you thank

3263
02:37:18,149 --> 02:37:19,719
you follow up on

3264
02:37:19,719 --> 02:37:24,979
Commissioner Ellis's question if you're changing units we

3265
02:37:24,979 --> 02:37:25,959
're looking at the map

3266
02:37:25,959 --> 02:37:31,680
or the chart we have here essentially a villa is a duplex

3267
02:37:31,680 --> 02:37:33,200
so you have could have

3268
02:37:33,200 --> 02:37:36,280
two family units where you would have had a single family

3269
02:37:36,280 --> 02:37:38,040
unit it's one

3270
02:37:38,040 --> 02:37:41,389
structure but it's actually for two family units and I

3271
02:37:41,389 --> 02:37:42,520
understand that

3272
02:37:42,520 --> 02:37:46,870
correctly basically yes so so you are I think in fact

3273
02:37:46,870 --> 02:37:48,799
increasing the number of

3274
02:37:48,799 --> 02:37:51,629
family units that can go out there even though it may be

3275
02:37:51,629 --> 02:37:53,639
structure wise the same

3276
02:37:53,639 --> 02:37:57,790
footprint but you have two families in a single residence

3277
02:37:57,790 --> 02:37:59,600
versus one and they're

3278
02:37:59,600 --> 02:38:04,649
my understanding her point maybe I'm confusing it Ted that

3279
02:38:04,649 --> 02:38:05,280
is accurate what

3280
02:38:05,280 --> 02:38:08,489
you're saying however with the overall looking at a project

3281
02:38:08,489 --> 02:38:09,559
-wide PD or detail

3282
02:38:09,559 --> 02:38:13,120
plan basis there would be two of those locally more so but

3283
02:38:13,120 --> 02:38:14,280
not more than the

3284
02:38:14,280 --> 02:38:19,280
same 6037 plus or minus anything within a five percent

3285
02:38:19,280 --> 02:38:20,799
increase but no more

3286
02:38:20,799 --> 02:38:25,159
beyond that maybe used used more so in one area the other

3287
02:38:25,159 --> 02:38:26,200
but not for an

3288
02:38:26,200 --> 02:38:29,639
increase overall we're also seeing him with back to the

3289
02:38:29,639 --> 02:38:30,959
increase in lot sizes

3290
02:38:30,959 --> 02:38:33,290
and the north part of the project that hasn't yet been

3291
02:38:33,290 --> 02:38:34,399
developed is a lot more

3292
02:38:34,399 --> 02:38:38,370
relief a lot more hilly so to even achieve the as approved

3293
02:38:38,370 --> 02:38:39,520
lot sizes which

3294
02:38:39,520 --> 02:38:42,600
are smaller than what we're using now the yields are we're

3295
02:38:42,600 --> 02:38:43,600
seeing less yield

3296
02:38:43,600 --> 02:38:46,819
just to just to continue it through our plans in two

3297
02:38:46,819 --> 02:38:48,840
dimensions look one way but

3298
02:38:48,840 --> 02:38:53,520
once you get on site it's some other challenges so that's

3299
02:38:53,520 --> 02:38:54,799
what that's how I

3300
02:38:54,799 --> 02:38:57,879
mean locally there might be an increase in that there's two

3301
02:38:57,879 --> 02:39:00,079
side-by-side on what

3302
02:39:00,079 --> 02:39:03,350
would be one building per se not an overall increase so

3303
02:39:03,350 --> 02:39:04,840
what your point is

3304
02:39:04,840 --> 02:39:09,309
is that although commissioners health else's point is

3305
02:39:09,309 --> 02:39:10,760
correct that you have

3306
02:39:10,760 --> 02:39:14,559
more density being family units there what you're actually

3307
02:39:14,559 --> 02:39:15,639
building is the

3308
02:39:15,639 --> 02:39:19,399
other lots are getting larger and so your point is some

3309
02:39:19,399 --> 02:39:20,760
things are smaller

3310
02:39:20,760 --> 02:39:24,309
and more dense but your other products are actually getting

3311
02:39:24,309 --> 02:39:25,319
larger and less

3312
02:39:25,319 --> 02:39:28,809
dense and so in your opinion it ends up being essentially

3313
02:39:28,809 --> 02:39:29,840
the same density

3314
02:39:29,840 --> 02:39:34,149
overall on a project basis but individually in small areas

3315
02:39:34,149 --> 02:39:34,879
you may have

3316
02:39:34,879 --> 02:39:37,090
areas that are way more dense than what was originally

3317
02:39:37,090 --> 02:39:38,040
proposed and you may have

3318
02:39:38,040 --> 02:39:40,530
some areas that are less dense because of the increase in

3319
02:39:40,530 --> 02:39:41,559
the loss size that a

3320
02:39:41,559 --> 02:39:44,750
fair characterization of what you're describing yes sir

3321
02:39:44,750 --> 02:39:45,239
that's essentially

3322
02:39:45,239 --> 02:39:48,030
correct the other the addition of open space within the

3323
02:39:48,030 --> 02:39:49,200
villa units is the

3324
02:39:49,200 --> 02:39:52,100
other thing that would offset that slightly from looking at

3325
02:39:52,100 --> 02:39:52,719
minimum lot

3326
02:39:52,719 --> 02:39:56,370
sizes and if a minimum was 30 feet wide by 100 feet depth

3327
02:39:56,370 --> 02:39:57,879
those are the two rigid

3328
02:39:57,879 --> 02:40:00,780
dimensions our width has got to be 45 wide it just felt

3329
02:40:00,780 --> 02:40:01,840
better it meets for

3330
02:40:01,840 --> 02:40:04,110
better straight scene and still sticking with 100 feet

3331
02:40:04,110 --> 02:40:05,159
because that's a rigid

3332
02:40:05,159 --> 02:40:07,989
requirement so it's already quite a bit larger in size and

3333
02:40:07,989 --> 02:40:09,079
then additional open

3334
02:40:09,079 --> 02:40:12,569
space within the unit that somehow offsets those numbers

3335
02:40:12,569 --> 02:40:13,959
additionally okay

3336
02:40:13,959 --> 02:40:19,879
several more questions here Commissioner Sullivan yes my

3337
02:40:19,879 --> 02:40:21,200
concern is that this is

3338
02:40:21,200 --> 02:40:26,149
a master plan development as they call it and yet I don't

3339
02:40:26,149 --> 02:40:27,399
see where it's being

3340
02:40:27,399 --> 02:40:32,670
planned so that everybody knows what it is they're buying

3341
02:40:32,670 --> 02:40:34,959
into nobody knows

3342
02:40:34,959 --> 02:40:38,040
where those villas are going to be so that when they buy

3343
02:40:38,040 --> 02:40:39,120
their lot and right

3344
02:40:39,120 --> 02:40:43,229
now they're saying that the build out is about 12 months so

3345
02:40:43,229 --> 02:40:44,680
within that 12 month

3346
02:40:44,680 --> 02:40:48,389
period all of a sudden y'all could decide let's put in a

3347
02:40:48,389 --> 02:40:51,079
row of duplexes in

3348
02:40:51,079 --> 02:40:54,069
the same neighborhood in the same on the same street so

3349
02:40:54,069 --> 02:40:55,799
that the people who bought

3350
02:40:55,799 --> 02:40:58,409
a year ago they don't know what's going to be going in

3351
02:40:58,409 --> 02:41:00,360
there and I think that's

3352
02:41:00,360 --> 02:41:04,280
a cause of concern you're talking about the size of lots

3353
02:41:04,280 --> 02:41:06,360
increasing in fact

3354
02:41:06,360 --> 02:41:09,250
originally when you go through and you look at some of the

3355
02:41:09,250 --> 02:41:10,319
older homes that are

3356
02:41:10,319 --> 02:41:14,600
out there those are on much larger lots than the houses

3357
02:41:14,600 --> 02:41:15,399
that have been built in

3358
02:41:15,399 --> 02:41:20,600
the last year mine being one of them my lot is much smaller

3359
02:41:20,600 --> 02:41:22,159
than the lots on the

3360
02:41:22,159 --> 02:41:26,690
on the east side of ropes and I call big ed road ropes and

3361
02:41:26,690 --> 02:41:29,879
boulevard and so that

3362
02:41:29,879 --> 02:41:34,350
I'm concerned that that when you start looking at the lot

3363
02:41:34,350 --> 02:41:35,680
sizes and what you're

3364
02:41:35,680 --> 02:41:38,760
going to be putting there if you said earlier that behind

3365
02:41:38,760 --> 02:41:39,879
the villas would be

3366
02:41:39,879 --> 02:41:45,559
green spaces and so forth I'm already seeing roads that are

3367
02:41:45,559 --> 02:41:46,239
being cut through

3368
02:41:46,239 --> 02:41:50,290
so that I don't understand how you're going to be able to

3369
02:41:50,290 --> 02:41:51,639
carve out the green

3370
02:41:51,639 --> 02:41:55,079
spaces in an area where there may have been houses planned

3371
02:41:55,079 --> 02:41:56,120
to begin with you

3372
02:41:56,120 --> 02:41:58,889
know decide to change it to a villa and so I'm just I'm

3373
02:41:58,889 --> 02:42:00,280
just I'm concerned that

3374
02:42:00,280 --> 02:42:02,979
people are they're not going to know what they're buying

3375
02:42:02,979 --> 02:42:04,799
into and and I don't

3376
02:42:04,799 --> 02:42:07,729
know why y'all can't just say well in this area we're going

3377
02:42:07,729 --> 02:42:08,639
to have you know

3378
02:42:08,639 --> 02:42:12,540
villas here or over here or at least the possibility of

3379
02:42:12,540 --> 02:42:14,479
villas being in this area

3380
02:42:14,479 --> 02:42:17,430
or that area so that if somebody says I don't want to take

3381
02:42:17,430 --> 02:42:19,120
the chance they buy a

3382
02:42:19,120 --> 02:42:21,370
lot that's a little bit further away than and where you

3383
02:42:21,370 --> 02:42:22,319
know where y'all might

3384
02:42:22,319 --> 02:42:27,670
be having the option of putting a villa a couple of

3385
02:42:27,670 --> 02:42:29,120
thoughts thanks for the

3386
02:42:29,120 --> 02:42:32,489
comments I'm a bit confused in terms of the lot sizes I'm

3387
02:42:32,489 --> 02:42:33,319
not sure how old

3388
02:42:33,319 --> 02:42:36,170
your the light you bought was but I'm comparing it to what

3389
02:42:36,170 --> 02:42:37,120
was approved the

3390
02:42:37,120 --> 02:42:41,139
concept plan and then the minimums every product has

3391
02:42:41,139 --> 02:42:43,559
exceeded that maybe maybe

3392
02:42:43,559 --> 02:42:45,770
you bought after that happened my point was that the

3393
02:42:45,770 --> 02:42:47,440
original density provision

3394
02:42:47,440 --> 02:42:50,639
for was a bit the basis of it was those smaller lot sizes

3395
02:42:50,639 --> 02:42:52,520
that we've not held to

3396
02:42:52,520 --> 02:42:56,790
does that answer that I'm ten feet from my neighbor and I

3397
02:42:56,790 --> 02:42:58,479
know a lot of people

3398
02:42:58,479 --> 02:43:02,059
over there that are 20 feet from their neighbor or 30 feet

3399
02:43:02,059 --> 02:43:02,680
from their neighbor

3400
02:43:02,680 --> 02:43:08,340
so that the lot the lots are smaller now than what they

3401
02:43:08,340 --> 02:43:10,799
were I guess the only way

3402
02:43:10,799 --> 02:43:13,139
could explain is a possible market twist and turn that that

3403
02:43:13,139 --> 02:43:13,920
was an effort out of

3404
02:43:13,920 --> 02:43:20,000
marketing bigger lots at the time where it was coming from

3405
02:43:20,000 --> 02:43:21,719
I'm just saying that

3406
02:43:21,719 --> 02:43:26,909
that if if it's a master plan development then plan it for

3407
02:43:26,909 --> 02:43:27,719
the future

3408
02:43:27,719 --> 02:43:31,260
so people know when they buy what is going to be in and

3409
02:43:31,260 --> 02:43:32,799
around them you know

3410
02:43:32,799 --> 02:43:36,129
it's it's like somebody building a house and they have this

3411
02:43:36,129 --> 02:43:37,200
great green space

3412
02:43:37,200 --> 02:43:41,159
behind them not knowing that that's FM 2499 and so all of a

3413
02:43:41,159 --> 02:43:42,040
sudden they have a

3414
02:43:42,040 --> 02:43:44,920
major thoroughfare coming in behind and so the same thing

3415
02:43:44,920 --> 02:43:45,920
here is if they think

3416
02:43:45,920 --> 02:43:49,079
it's a single-family development all of a sudden down the

3417
02:43:49,079 --> 02:43:50,200
street there may be

3418
02:43:50,200 --> 02:43:54,010
duplexes the lock and leaves where maybe people aren't

3419
02:43:54,010 --> 02:43:55,040
there half half of the

3420
02:43:55,040 --> 02:43:58,489
year and so that's not the same type of a neighbor as a

3421
02:43:58,489 --> 02:44:00,559
regular neighborhood

3422
02:44:00,559 --> 02:44:03,500
understood that's that's my concern I guess to our end and

3423
02:44:03,500 --> 02:44:04,520
that's a concern of

3424
02:44:04,520 --> 02:44:07,879
ours as well and at the time of contract signing there's a

3425
02:44:07,879 --> 02:44:08,799
quite a bit of

3426
02:44:08,799 --> 02:44:11,530
disclosure and paperwork and here's what's coming up and I

3427
02:44:11,530 --> 02:44:12,280
believe within

3428
02:44:12,280 --> 02:44:14,889
that outlines the flexibility within the PD and and the

3429
02:44:14,889 --> 02:44:15,959
need to react to these

3430
02:44:15,959 --> 02:44:19,239
kind of changes and and it's probably amplified more so I'm

3431
02:44:19,239 --> 02:44:19,840
going to say 40

3432
02:44:19,840 --> 02:44:23,639
years not knowing the real answer but with that kind of

3433
02:44:23,639 --> 02:44:25,239
duration I think this

3434
02:44:25,239 --> 02:44:28,319
probably is an example of us trying to say this is it this

3435
02:44:28,319 --> 02:44:29,559
one here will do and

3436
02:44:29,559 --> 02:44:33,209
then and that will get us there realizing now fast forward

3437
02:44:33,209 --> 02:44:34,399
10-15 years

3438
02:44:34,399 --> 02:44:37,600
that it's just not and we're seeing these demands and in

3439
02:44:37,600 --> 02:44:38,680
order to avoid the

3440
02:44:38,680 --> 02:44:41,629
same fate where we would go and pick another spot or two

3441
02:44:41,629 --> 02:44:42,639
and find out that

3442
02:44:42,639 --> 02:44:45,360
another twist took us into larger areas or golf courses or

3443
02:44:45,360 --> 02:44:46,399
something else that

3444
02:44:46,399 --> 02:44:48,950
left this thing as an island that we can't achieve or two

3445
02:44:48,950 --> 02:44:50,040
points of access or

3446
02:44:50,040 --> 02:44:52,729
there isn't sewer locally those are the kind of constraints

3447
02:44:52,729 --> 02:44:53,959
I guess that we're

3448
02:44:53,959 --> 02:44:57,250
focused on with this request but but in terms of planning

3449
02:44:57,250 --> 02:44:58,600
it out the pod by pod

3450
02:44:58,600 --> 02:45:02,319
basis is how we address that and then try to avoid any of

3451
02:45:02,319 --> 02:45:03,360
those scenarios where

3452
02:45:03,360 --> 02:45:07,530
someone wasn't where or didn't didn't know what was coming

3453
02:45:07,530 --> 02:45:09,280
thank you

3454
02:45:09,280 --> 02:45:13,639
Commissioner Roselle thank you for being here I have a

3455
02:45:13,639 --> 02:45:15,639
couple thoughts as well as

3456
02:45:15,639 --> 02:45:19,989
hopefully a question that you might be able to provide some

3457
02:45:19,989 --> 02:45:22,000
insight to first I

3458
02:45:22,000 --> 02:45:25,129
appreciate you talking about the flexibility and the market

3459
02:45:25,129 --> 02:45:25,680
needs for

3460
02:45:25,680 --> 02:45:29,420
that and and because when I looked at a map of yellow it it

3461
02:45:29,420 --> 02:45:30,079
definitely was

3462
02:45:30,079 --> 02:45:32,770
intimidating just think that there's going to be a free-for

3463
02:45:32,770 --> 02:45:33,360
-all but if I

3464
02:45:33,360 --> 02:45:37,719
understand this correctly there's 6037 units yes there will

3465
02:45:37,719 --> 02:45:38,920
never be more that's

3466
02:45:38,920 --> 02:45:43,280
a cap right it is but for a potential for five percent

3467
02:45:43,280 --> 02:45:45,079
density increase so

3468
02:45:45,079 --> 02:45:49,420
so they're there besides the five percent there's not gonna

3469
02:45:49,420 --> 02:45:49,920
be an increase

3470
02:45:49,920 --> 02:45:52,309
in units families or whatever I know that was the point

3471
02:45:52,309 --> 02:45:53,280
earlier but there's

3472
02:45:53,280 --> 02:45:56,840
going to be six thousand ish units how that's divided up is

3473
02:45:56,840 --> 02:45:57,360
obviously the

3474
02:45:57,360 --> 02:46:01,209
question when I was reading through a lot of these letters

3475
02:46:01,209 --> 02:46:02,120
which I appreciate

3476
02:46:02,120 --> 02:46:05,510
those sitting them in it's very helpful for us it seemed

3477
02:46:05,510 --> 02:46:07,760
like there's three if I

3478
02:46:07,760 --> 02:46:10,510
could categorize the oppositions there was kind of three

3479
02:46:10,510 --> 02:46:12,399
things that I felt was

3480
02:46:12,399 --> 02:46:17,729
repeating one was a basic sense of ropes are yeah ropes and

3481
02:46:17,729 --> 02:46:18,479
ranches kind of

3482
02:46:18,479 --> 02:46:21,190
autonomy and controlled to do as you wish there's I can

3483
02:46:21,190 --> 02:46:22,680
sort of that there's

3484
02:46:22,680 --> 02:46:26,120
concern of aesthetics in terms of what a villa looks like

3485
02:46:26,120 --> 02:46:27,639
cosmetically and the

3486
02:46:27,639 --> 02:46:30,719
third one is what we've been talking about is density I've

3487
02:46:30,719 --> 02:46:31,879
heard in work

3488
02:46:31,879 --> 02:46:34,979
session and then tonight you mentioned the idea of lock and

3489
02:46:34,979 --> 02:46:36,920
leave can can you

3490
02:46:36,920 --> 02:46:40,000
help me walk through the habits of that potential

3491
02:46:40,000 --> 02:46:41,719
demographic are they solely

3492
02:46:41,719 --> 02:46:45,280
buying or predominantly buying the villas and then in terms

3493
02:46:45,280 --> 02:46:46,159
of density are

3494
02:46:46,159 --> 02:46:49,159
they not there half the year would is the traffic of those

3495
02:46:49,159 --> 02:46:49,879
individuals

3496
02:46:49,879 --> 02:46:52,459
compensated by them just not being there I'm trying to

3497
02:46:52,459 --> 02:46:53,680
understand how villas

3498
02:46:53,680 --> 02:46:57,440
actually play into density if they're these lock and leave

3499
02:46:57,440 --> 02:46:58,360
type clients can you

3500
02:46:58,360 --> 02:47:01,600
help me out with their patterns I guess the the shortest

3501
02:47:01,600 --> 02:47:02,559
answer is we're still

3502
02:47:02,559 --> 02:47:06,360
learning having done one unit of 63 maybe we spotted a few

3503
02:47:06,360 --> 02:47:07,360
patterns and then

3504
02:47:07,360 --> 02:47:09,270
we're still trying we're eager to see if that's going to

3505
02:47:09,270 --> 02:47:10,159
continue or not whether

3506
02:47:10,159 --> 02:47:13,870
it's someone part-time resident snowbird or what have you

3507
02:47:13,870 --> 02:47:15,799
maybe a widow someone

3508
02:47:15,799 --> 02:47:19,840
that doesn't one partner the other passes and home

3509
02:47:19,840 --> 02:47:20,639
maintenance becomes an issue

3510
02:47:20,639 --> 02:47:22,850
and then this type of product will lend itself more to that

3511
02:47:22,850 --> 02:47:23,479
kind of scenario

3512
02:47:23,479 --> 02:47:26,170
now honestly I don't I don't really have any rigid answer

3513
02:47:26,170 --> 02:47:27,000
in terms of what

3514
02:47:27,000 --> 02:47:30,399
percentage if there are any patterns that are so defined

3515
02:47:30,399 --> 02:47:33,600
but we're seeing in

3516
02:47:33,600 --> 02:47:36,360
terms of the density I don't think we've had any that are

3517
02:47:36,360 --> 02:47:37,399
so high just because of

3518
02:47:37,399 --> 02:47:39,899
the usual planning constraints where they just don't have

3519
02:47:39,899 --> 02:47:41,680
enough room for so

3520
02:47:41,680 --> 02:47:44,159
many lots before you run out of street and then add an open

3521
02:47:44,159 --> 02:47:45,000
space behind them

3522
02:47:45,000 --> 02:47:48,440
that it I guess it made sound uglier than I think it is in

3523
02:47:48,440 --> 02:47:49,600
practice how it

3524
02:47:49,600 --> 02:47:52,360
plays out and how it really feels like a nice neighborhood

3525
02:47:52,360 --> 02:47:53,239
we're proud of it

3526
02:47:53,239 --> 02:47:56,610
we've gotten a lot of positive feedback the street scene is

3527
02:47:56,610 --> 02:47:58,559
it looks good it's

3528
02:47:58,559 --> 02:48:02,100
there's no question though there are several different

3529
02:48:02,100 --> 02:48:03,319
lines of product we

3530
02:48:03,319 --> 02:48:06,559
offer and there's everybody likes something different and

3531
02:48:06,559 --> 02:48:07,159
that's what

3532
02:48:07,159 --> 02:48:10,799
we're trying to fander to so continuing with that and I

3533
02:48:10,799 --> 02:48:11,680
appreciate that the

3534
02:48:11,680 --> 02:48:13,989
candidness I just didn't know if there's when you're doing

3535
02:48:13,989 --> 02:48:14,959
marketing campaigns

3536
02:48:14,959 --> 02:48:17,670
this lock and leave there's actually like this half and

3537
02:48:17,670 --> 02:48:18,719
half or they come

3538
02:48:18,719 --> 02:48:21,120
down here for three months they leave for three months

3539
02:48:21,120 --> 02:48:22,120
during our terrible

3540
02:48:22,120 --> 02:48:24,809
summers or however that worked I didn't know that one of

3541
02:48:24,809 --> 02:48:26,040
the things that was

3542
02:48:26,040 --> 02:48:28,659
brought up by Commissioner Ellis and Commissioner Sullivan

3543
02:48:28,659 --> 02:48:29,399
as well as some of

3544
02:48:29,399 --> 02:48:34,059
the letters that we received was this idea of your freedom

3545
02:48:34,059 --> 02:48:35,280
to build ad hoc

3546
02:48:35,280 --> 02:48:39,299
wherever whenever and the the I guess the insecurity of

3547
02:48:39,299 --> 02:48:40,959
someone purchasing a

3548
02:48:40,959 --> 02:48:44,569
lot putting their harder money to build and then across the

3549
02:48:44,569 --> 02:48:45,159
street is one of

3550
02:48:45,159 --> 02:48:50,799
these pods that pop up is there any mechanism to provide or

3551
02:48:50,799 --> 02:48:52,200
let them know

3552
02:48:52,200 --> 02:48:56,909
lead time or that purchase say in a radius that the plans

3553
02:48:56,909 --> 02:48:58,639
going forward I'm

3554
02:48:58,639 --> 02:49:01,500
trying to understand if there's a way to protect some of

3555
02:49:01,500 --> 02:49:02,639
the residents going

3556
02:49:02,639 --> 02:49:05,770
forward because I'm generally in favor of the flexibility I

3557
02:49:05,770 --> 02:49:06,440
think that that

3558
02:49:06,440 --> 02:49:09,840
resonates with me but I also understand the concern of this

3559
02:49:09,840 --> 02:49:11,319
unknown in terms

3560
02:49:11,319 --> 02:49:14,209
of protecting the asset that they're invested in so have

3561
02:49:14,209 --> 02:49:15,000
you thought about

3562
02:49:15,000 --> 02:49:17,829
that is there any options on the table for that we have and

3563
02:49:17,829 --> 02:49:19,120
in addition to the

3564
02:49:19,120 --> 02:49:21,590
same type of packet we want to circulate up front to say

3565
02:49:21,590 --> 02:49:23,120
that these are in

3566
02:49:23,120 --> 02:49:26,010
master plan community together with flexibility together

3567
02:49:26,010 --> 02:49:26,799
with different

3568
02:49:26,799 --> 02:49:29,489
amenities and all the kind of things that come with that

3569
02:49:29,489 --> 02:49:31,120
back to the pod by

3570
02:49:31,120 --> 02:49:34,829
pod bases we wouldn't want to do on one side of the street

3571
02:49:34,829 --> 02:49:36,239
or other and when we

3572
02:49:36,239 --> 02:49:37,840
built the street we wouldn't be able to stub in sewer

3573
02:49:37,840 --> 02:49:38,639
services because they're

3574
02:49:38,639 --> 02:49:42,510
different lot sizes it kind of lends itself to closing in a

3575
02:49:42,510 --> 02:49:43,680
bank of streets

3576
02:49:43,680 --> 02:49:46,250
and together with the doubly loaded streets so there would

3577
02:49:46,250 --> 02:49:46,920
be the rear of

3578
02:49:46,920 --> 02:49:49,250
someone's lot together with the open space that we've been

3579
02:49:49,250 --> 02:49:50,079
building into this

3580
02:49:50,079 --> 02:49:53,229
product just to provide for the aesthetics and the liv

3581
02:49:53,229 --> 02:49:55,040
ability of it we

3582
02:49:55,040 --> 02:49:57,760
think that affords some of that kind of protection just by

3583
02:49:57,760 --> 02:49:59,479
design and together

3584
02:49:59,479 --> 02:50:01,530
we want to make sure the same thing that it's clear

3585
02:50:01,530 --> 02:50:02,319
everyone knows what they're

3586
02:50:02,319 --> 02:50:07,170
getting there's no surprises in thank you thank you hope

3587
02:50:07,170 --> 02:50:09,360
answer that thank you

3588
02:50:09,360 --> 02:50:12,360
chair thank you come down speaking it's been very

3589
02:50:12,360 --> 02:50:13,799
informative let me ask you a

3590
02:50:13,799 --> 02:50:15,670
question I asked in the working session and the staff

3591
02:50:15,670 --> 02:50:16,639
thought should be better

3592
02:50:16,639 --> 02:50:21,559
prepared to answer obviously market conditions dictate that

3593
02:50:21,559 --> 02:50:24,760
1200 villa units

3594
02:50:24,760 --> 02:50:30,639
are a popular way to go what the market turns to you

3595
02:50:30,639 --> 02:50:32,280
obviously to keep the same

3596
02:50:32,280 --> 02:50:36,309
number of units though that means these bigger units will

3597
02:50:36,309 --> 02:50:37,719
have to decrease so

3598
02:50:37,719 --> 02:50:40,700
what is the market trend which one are we looking at

3599
02:50:40,700 --> 02:50:42,280
decreasing there can you

3600
02:50:42,280 --> 02:50:45,760
if I understand you right I think almost all of our other

3601
02:50:45,760 --> 02:50:47,239
offerings have grown in

3602
02:50:47,239 --> 02:50:49,940
size that's something that's been happening I would say

3603
02:50:49,940 --> 02:50:50,799
over the last maybe

3604
02:50:50,799 --> 02:50:53,319
ten some years after the downturn I think after that

3605
02:50:53,319 --> 02:50:54,639
probably yeah there was a

3606
02:50:54,639 --> 02:50:58,299
general upsizing so I think that's taken place and probably

3607
02:50:58,299 --> 02:50:59,479
we're a bit behind

3608
02:50:59,479 --> 02:51:02,870
the eight ball and coming in to fill what's called void for

3609
02:51:02,870 --> 02:51:03,879
lack of a better

3610
02:51:03,879 --> 02:51:07,229
explanation so you say percentage wise you would probably

3611
02:51:07,229 --> 02:51:08,040
all the units would

3612
02:51:08,040 --> 02:51:10,469
continue to grow you wouldn't have to decrease some of the

3613
02:51:10,469 --> 02:51:11,239
bigger units so you

3614
02:51:11,239 --> 02:51:15,799
can get those 1200 billas I don't foresee it okay I think

3615
02:51:15,799 --> 02:51:16,520
it'd be nice to

3616
02:51:16,520 --> 02:51:18,870
achieve the full six thousand and thirty seven I think we

3617
02:51:18,870 --> 02:51:19,760
're gonna have a hard

3618
02:51:19,760 --> 02:51:22,959
time doing it that's nice to have that there once again in

3619
02:51:22,959 --> 02:51:23,239
the name of

3620
02:51:23,239 --> 02:51:26,579
flexibility in the name of reacting to 15 years down the

3621
02:51:26,579 --> 02:51:27,920
roads twists and turns

3622
02:51:27,920 --> 02:51:30,879
that we aren't thinking about today like to think we can

3623
02:51:30,879 --> 02:51:31,840
get out front of them

3624
02:51:31,840 --> 02:51:35,870
all but it just doesn't work that way okay thank you thank

3625
02:51:35,870 --> 02:51:35,959
you

3626
02:51:35,959 --> 02:51:41,239
Commissioner Ellis thank you chair a couple more questions

3627
02:51:41,239 --> 02:51:42,520
how many villas

3628
02:51:42,520 --> 02:51:48,360
are there currently 63 63 total that's right now and and we

3629
02:51:48,360 --> 02:51:49,200
've been focused on

3630
02:51:49,200 --> 02:51:52,950
villas with this amendment are there are there other

3631
02:51:52,950 --> 02:51:54,680
parameters you're for your

3632
02:51:54,680 --> 02:51:57,850
other product are there other increase in numbers or was

3633
02:51:57,850 --> 02:51:59,079
this just zeroing in

3634
02:51:59,079 --> 02:52:01,639
on increasing the amount of villas because you've maxed out

3635
02:52:01,639 --> 02:52:02,600
accurate right

3636
02:52:02,600 --> 02:52:05,680
current yeah okay this is strictly in order to allow more

3637
02:52:05,680 --> 02:52:06,479
villas and the

3638
02:52:06,479 --> 02:52:09,559
flexibility to place villas okay there was some of those

3639
02:52:09,559 --> 02:52:10,319
flexibilities written

3640
02:52:10,319 --> 02:52:13,920
in the PD and I believe in the 2011 detail plan amendment I

3641
02:52:13,920 --> 02:52:15,520
think this the

3642
02:52:15,520 --> 02:52:19,229
unit 47 I'm a bit speaking off the cuff unit 47 I believe

3643
02:52:19,229 --> 02:52:20,760
was slated for mf2 and

3644
02:52:20,760 --> 02:52:25,319
during that process was changed and labeled as villas yeah

3645
02:52:25,319 --> 02:52:25,840
I think our

3646
02:52:25,840 --> 02:52:28,709
understanding was that residential was residential and then

3647
02:52:28,709 --> 02:52:29,559
that's why there

3648
02:52:29,559 --> 02:52:32,250
wasn't a big need to place it around but that's you're

3649
02:52:32,250 --> 02:52:33,399
saying it really doesn't

3650
02:52:33,399 --> 02:52:36,670
plan this discussion that's what really the whole point of

3651
02:52:36,670 --> 02:52:37,680
our request before

3652
02:52:37,680 --> 02:52:42,030
you is the desire for more villas because of the market

3653
02:52:42,030 --> 02:52:43,040
need that you're

3654
02:52:43,040 --> 02:52:49,639
saying thank you understood thank you thanks I have a

3655
02:52:49,639 --> 02:52:50,680
couple comments and

3656
02:52:50,680 --> 02:52:58,139
questions I want to echo Commissioner Taylor's concerns is

3657
02:52:58,139 --> 02:52:59,000
one of the

3658
02:52:59,000 --> 02:53:02,719
concerns I had in work session is what you're asking is

3659
02:53:02,719 --> 02:53:04,319
very contrary to what

3660
02:53:04,319 --> 02:53:09,090
our normal zoning procedure is in the city of Denton I'm

3661
02:53:09,090 --> 02:53:10,399
somewhat uncomfortable

3662
02:53:10,399 --> 02:53:15,799
with just saying you guys can go do kind of wherever versus

3663
02:53:15,799 --> 02:53:17,319
the plan that it's

3664
02:53:17,319 --> 02:53:20,870
here and here and defined areas because that's essentially

3665
02:53:20,870 --> 02:53:21,840
how the rest of the

3666
02:53:21,840 --> 02:53:26,559
planning is done in our city understand you're an NPC and

3667
02:53:26,559 --> 02:53:28,639
you're your own kind

3668
02:53:28,639 --> 02:53:31,209
of area but we have citizens that are in there that have

3669
02:53:31,209 --> 02:53:32,440
made purchases based on

3670
02:53:32,440 --> 02:53:35,959
the map and the areas have been designated just like we do

3671
02:53:35,959 --> 02:53:36,879
in other parts

3672
02:53:36,879 --> 02:53:42,729
of our city I'm uncomfortable with that I understand the

3673
02:53:42,729 --> 02:53:44,440
flexibility I'm very

3674
02:53:44,440 --> 02:53:46,719
familiar with construction and development business

3675
02:53:46,719 --> 02:53:47,520
understand things

3676
02:53:47,520 --> 02:53:51,430
change and as such I think the developer comes forward and

3677
02:53:51,430 --> 02:53:52,520
says we've had some

3678
02:53:52,520 --> 02:53:56,229
changes and I need to make change we do that see that with

3679
02:53:56,229 --> 02:53:57,399
Robson Ranch I mean

3680
02:53:57,399 --> 02:54:00,600
a raise the ranch several times has come before us with

3681
02:54:00,600 --> 02:54:02,040
things have happened and

3682
02:54:02,040 --> 02:54:05,280
we need to make changes and my preference would be if those

3683
02:54:05,280 --> 02:54:05,799
things

3684
02:54:05,799 --> 02:54:09,110
happen to come back and we'll address what those are versus

3685
02:54:09,110 --> 02:54:10,200
just kind of a

3686
02:54:10,200 --> 02:54:13,000
free-for-all you can kind of design it and go as you like

3687
02:54:13,000 --> 02:54:13,879
and we don't have to

3688
02:54:13,879 --> 02:54:19,239
come back to PNC so so that's one comment do you have a

3689
02:54:19,239 --> 02:54:20,399
response to

3690
02:54:20,399 --> 02:54:24,520
somewhat allay my concern about turning that over to you

3691
02:54:24,520 --> 02:54:25,840
all versus how we

3692
02:54:25,840 --> 02:54:29,649
typically do things with this area is in our three or in

3693
02:54:29,649 --> 02:54:31,319
our six or duplexes or

3694
02:54:31,319 --> 02:54:35,389
whatever those are and if you want to change it you come

3695
02:54:35,389 --> 02:54:36,879
before PNC and ask for

3696
02:54:36,879 --> 02:54:40,590
zoning change fair concern I understand where you're coming

3697
02:54:40,590 --> 02:54:42,680
from I guess our

3698
02:54:42,680 --> 02:54:44,989
challenge and I don't want to keep repeating the same issue

3699
02:54:44,989 --> 02:54:45,760
but in terms of

3700
02:54:45,760 --> 02:54:49,690
we'll just say the numbers 4500 lots left to develop they

3701
02:54:49,690 --> 02:54:50,879
would be in effect

3702
02:54:50,879 --> 02:54:54,680
our kind of final plotting at the remaining 4500 to where

3703
02:54:54,680 --> 02:54:56,079
we're electing

3704
02:54:56,079 --> 02:54:58,500
what's going to go where and and firming up those kind of

3705
02:54:58,500 --> 02:54:59,360
decisions which is a

3706
02:54:59,360 --> 02:55:03,159
bit of what has us in the position we're in does it back to

3707
02:55:03,159 --> 02:55:04,319
the flexibility being

3708
02:55:04,319 --> 02:55:07,389
a need is a big part of that our concern after

3709
02:55:07,389 --> 02:55:09,360
strengthening the community as a

3710
02:55:09,360 --> 02:55:13,139
whole and really it needs to win as a community and work

3711
02:55:13,139 --> 02:55:14,399
together and the

3712
02:55:14,399 --> 02:55:18,190
HOA the residents all of it comes together as one group and

3713
02:55:18,190 --> 02:55:19,079
we're more

3714
02:55:19,079 --> 02:55:21,899
concerned about that than any if that I don't know if that

3715
02:55:21,899 --> 02:55:22,760
does anything to

3716
02:55:22,760 --> 02:55:26,090
address your concerns but the strength of the community is

3717
02:55:26,090 --> 02:55:27,600
paramount and us

3718
02:55:27,600 --> 02:55:30,920
moving through it counting on word of mouth advertising and

3719
02:55:30,920 --> 02:55:32,120
continuing to build

3720
02:55:32,120 --> 02:55:35,729
it up and fill all the different levels at home buyer and

3721
02:55:35,729 --> 02:55:37,159
all of our residents

3722
02:55:37,159 --> 02:55:41,690
specific needs and needs over time sometimes that means a

3723
02:55:41,690 --> 02:55:42,680
large place up

3724
02:55:42,680 --> 02:55:46,229
front and some 10 15 years later a downgrade to something

3725
02:55:46,229 --> 02:55:47,159
they can stay in

3726
02:55:47,159 --> 02:55:51,440
place carry on the same golf games and friends and all

3727
02:55:51,440 --> 02:55:52,520
within the community

3728
02:55:52,520 --> 02:55:56,079
kind of an agent place set up that allows everybody to stay

3729
02:55:56,079 --> 02:55:57,000
put has been a

3730
02:55:57,000 --> 02:56:00,000
big part of the success of this product and the feedback we

3731
02:56:00,000 --> 02:56:01,799
're getting on it

3732
02:56:01,799 --> 02:56:05,020
well that addresses your question but - well I guess let me

3733
02:56:05,020 --> 02:56:06,159
give some feedback

3734
02:56:06,159 --> 02:56:11,360
so you're about 15 years roughly in the project yes sir

3735
02:56:11,360 --> 02:56:12,200
there but and how many

3736
02:56:12,200 --> 02:56:15,239
units do you have so far I think the numbers about 1800

3737
02:56:15,239 --> 02:56:16,680
okay so a little over

3738
02:56:16,680 --> 02:56:21,420
a hundred a year and you've got 4500 units to go so you

3739
02:56:21,420 --> 02:56:23,440
guys quite a while

3740
02:56:23,440 --> 02:56:30,899
we may see at this rate so you know I guess my point is

3741
02:56:30,899 --> 02:56:31,639
that I understand

3742
02:56:31,639 --> 02:56:35,290
things can change we're not talking about that your project

3743
02:56:35,290 --> 02:56:35,959
is going to be

3744
02:56:35,959 --> 02:56:39,309
built out of the next four or five years and I understand

3745
02:56:39,309 --> 02:56:40,479
there's a time and

3746
02:56:40,479 --> 02:56:43,290
money that's spent to come before the Commission and go

3747
02:56:43,290 --> 02:56:45,040
with the city but

3748
02:56:45,040 --> 02:56:48,430
that's not what your development is you're looking at the

3749
02:56:48,430 --> 02:56:49,600
next probably 30

3750
02:56:49,600 --> 02:56:55,020
45 years at least to have this built out and it almost

3751
02:56:55,020 --> 02:56:56,760
feels like the request is

3752
02:56:56,760 --> 02:56:59,639
we just want to kind of be one and done and we can do kind

3753
02:56:59,639 --> 02:57:01,959
of whatever versus 10

3754
02:57:01,959 --> 02:57:04,649
years from now hey things have changed and we need to come

3755
02:57:04,649 --> 02:57:06,799
back and talk about

3756
02:57:06,799 --> 02:57:11,079
what the new market conditions are and my thought is if we

3757
02:57:11,079 --> 02:57:12,440
approve it the way

3758
02:57:12,440 --> 02:57:16,719
that it is you probably don't kind of have to come back to

3759
02:57:16,719 --> 02:57:18,399
talk to P&Z about

3760
02:57:18,399 --> 02:57:20,799
what some of the new ideas and some flexibilities that you

3761
02:57:20,799 --> 02:57:22,000
need and you have

3762
02:57:22,000 --> 02:57:24,969
that basically now granted in this request that you're

3763
02:57:24,969 --> 02:57:26,159
doing is that a fair

3764
02:57:26,159 --> 02:57:30,440
characterization of what you're asking avoiding or

3765
02:57:30,440 --> 02:57:32,639
essentially rezoning is is

3766
02:57:32,639 --> 02:57:37,500
what we are hoping to do and that is accurate how the time

3767
02:57:37,500 --> 02:57:39,200
it takes us I guess

3768
02:57:39,200 --> 02:57:41,889
to react to spot a market demand make sure it's real it's

3769
02:57:41,889 --> 02:57:42,620
not a blip in the

3770
02:57:42,620 --> 02:57:45,809
radar react to it get things in place get a design get get

3771
02:57:45,809 --> 02:57:46,559
the approvals get

3772
02:57:46,559 --> 02:57:49,729
constructed though our concern and what we've seen in the

3773
02:57:49,729 --> 02:57:51,319
past while is that we

3774
02:57:51,319 --> 02:57:54,270
did the 63 we had and they were a huge hit and then just

3775
02:57:54,270 --> 02:57:55,319
the time it takes us

3776
02:57:55,319 --> 02:57:59,459
to get it this way back up is is what we're trying to trunc

3777
02:57:59,459 --> 02:58:01,120
ate so that's

3778
02:58:01,120 --> 02:58:06,309
timing and your points are are not inaccurate but we're

3779
02:58:06,309 --> 02:58:07,399
that's our desire

3780
02:58:07,399 --> 02:58:11,260
but you can continue doing the bill is now correct no sir

3781
02:58:11,260 --> 02:58:12,680
you can only do 63

3782
02:58:12,680 --> 02:58:16,799
period thank you that that's that's what we're before you

3783
02:58:16,799 --> 02:58:18,079
that's our limitation

3784
02:58:18,079 --> 02:58:21,370
and requests continue to come in and we're just seeing a

3785
02:58:21,370 --> 02:58:22,399
lot of positive

3786
02:58:22,399 --> 02:58:26,750
feedback for it and we're eager to try to meet that market

3787
02:58:26,750 --> 02:58:27,479
demand okay

3788
02:58:27,479 --> 02:58:31,229
Commissioner Sullivan thank you for your answers thank you

3789
02:58:31,229 --> 02:58:32,680
sir just to make a

3790
02:58:32,680 --> 02:58:36,950
point house on countryside built in 2002 which I think was

3791
02:58:36,950 --> 02:58:38,559
the 14th house built

3792
02:58:38,559 --> 02:58:45,549
was on 11,536 square feet of lot my house built in 2015 was

3793
02:58:45,549 --> 02:58:48,200
8,750 so it's

3794
02:58:48,200 --> 02:58:51,370
quite a bit of difference in size and this was built during

3795
02:58:51,370 --> 02:58:52,159
the time when

3796
02:58:52,159 --> 02:58:55,719
obviously the market was very strong and so my concern is

3797
02:58:55,719 --> 02:58:57,360
if you've downsized the

3798
02:58:57,360 --> 02:59:03,200
lots from 2002 to 2015 what are you going to do from 2015

3799
02:59:03,200 --> 02:59:05,799
to 2020 especially

3800
02:59:05,799 --> 02:59:08,950
when you can put villas whenever wherever you want to put

3801
02:59:08,950 --> 02:59:09,719
them at some

3802
02:59:09,719 --> 02:59:13,319
point in the future so that's that's where my concern is

3803
02:59:13,319 --> 02:59:14,639
the way the lot

3804
02:59:14,639 --> 02:59:17,719
sizes have changed they've not gotten larger they've gotten

3805
02:59:17,719 --> 02:59:20,319
smaller appreciate

3806
02:59:20,319 --> 02:59:23,290
that net with that not knowing what lot that is you

3807
02:59:23,290 --> 02:59:24,239
referring to that between

3808
02:59:24,239 --> 02:59:27,389
thousand five oh nine countryside well I mean with that the

3809
02:59:27,389 --> 02:59:28,600
street slopes in it

3810
02:59:28,600 --> 02:59:30,809
whether there's some kind of grade that has to be picked up

3811
02:59:30,809 --> 02:59:31,840
my comment was

3812
02:59:31,840 --> 02:59:34,530
strictly related to what's the minimums that were approved

3813
02:59:34,530 --> 02:59:35,719
that we far exceeded

3814
02:59:35,719 --> 02:59:38,180
that when I say they've gotten bigger they absolutely have

3815
02:59:38,180 --> 02:59:38,799
from what was

3816
02:59:38,799 --> 02:59:41,500
approved every one of those dimensions probably by 10 feet

3817
02:59:41,500 --> 02:59:42,079
that's what I was

3818
02:59:42,079 --> 02:59:45,040
referring to I'm sure there's several that are pie shaped

3819
02:59:45,040 --> 02:59:45,639
at the end of a

3820
02:59:45,639 --> 02:59:48,329
cul-de-sac or again there's a lot of grades so we have to

3821
02:59:48,329 --> 02:59:49,239
take up slope and

3822
02:59:49,239 --> 02:59:51,649
still have a buildable envelope that's going to be a large

3823
02:59:51,649 --> 02:59:52,959
lot but again not

3824
02:59:52,959 --> 02:59:56,219
not knowing that specific lot overall they have gotten

3825
02:59:56,219 --> 02:59:57,760
larger of all the sizes

3826
02:59:57,760 --> 03:00:02,799
including the villa in fact I don't see any other questions

3827
03:00:02,799 --> 03:00:03,559
I appreciate your

3828
03:00:03,559 --> 03:00:05,770
time and a lot of time you've given us and a lot of

3829
03:00:05,770 --> 03:00:06,879
information so thank you

3830
03:00:06,879 --> 03:00:09,090
very much thank you very much for your help and likewise

3831
03:00:09,090 --> 03:00:10,000
the staff appreciate

3832
03:00:10,000 --> 03:00:16,440
a lot this is a public hearing I do not have any cards

3833
03:00:16,440 --> 03:00:18,000
wishing to speak at this

3834
03:00:18,000 --> 03:00:21,860
time I do want to let you know that we had a packet that we

3835
03:00:21,860 --> 03:00:23,799
were given and just

3836
03:00:23,799 --> 03:00:29,790
in a quick count by staff we have 29 letters in favor 10

3837
03:00:29,790 --> 03:00:31,120
that are neutral and

3838
03:00:31,120 --> 03:00:35,469
19 that are opposed and if you'd like to speak we'd be

3839
03:00:35,469 --> 03:00:37,319
happy for you to come up

3840
03:00:37,319 --> 03:00:39,569
speak give your name address and present a card but I'm not

3841
03:00:39,569 --> 03:00:40,239
going to go through

3842
03:00:40,239 --> 03:00:43,680
and call each person in this stack so if you've sent in a

3843
03:00:43,680 --> 03:00:45,200
letter great and we

3844
03:00:45,200 --> 03:00:47,000
appreciate that we've read through them and reviewed them

3845
03:00:47,000 --> 03:00:48,360
if you would like to speak we

3846
03:00:48,360 --> 03:00:52,520
would like to have a card from you to come forward

3847
03:00:52,520 --> 03:01:00,680
first of all I don't know how many of these were mailed out

3848
03:01:00,680 --> 03:01:02,530
we never got orders my neighbors didn't get theirs we're

3849
03:01:02,530 --> 03:01:04,840
only down the block we couldn't we couldn't register our

3850
03:01:04,840 --> 03:01:09,840
complaint we don't want to do it okay as far as building

3851
03:01:09,840 --> 03:01:13,239
these units they're building two units on one lot you're

3852
03:01:13,239 --> 03:01:15,920
getting two prices for a house you're getting $303 you're

3853
03:01:15,920 --> 03:01:19,200
getting $600,000 a house you're paying two HOA fees they're

3854
03:01:19,200 --> 03:01:20,870
looking at the money into it they're not looking at what

3855
03:01:20,870 --> 03:01:22,120
you're doing for us believe me

3856
03:01:22,120 --> 03:01:25,590
we do not want them in our neighborhood they can have a

3857
03:01:25,590 --> 03:01:26,920
certain section they can

3858
03:01:26,920 --> 03:01:29,829
put them if they want to put them out there our house we

3859
03:01:29,829 --> 03:01:31,920
bought it in 14 has

3860
03:01:31,920 --> 03:01:36,540
gone up $59,000 for base house so they're making money off

3861
03:01:36,540 --> 03:01:38,200
the houses we do not

3862
03:01:38,200 --> 03:01:44,120
want these in our neighborhood and they're getting two HOA

3863
03:01:44,120 --> 03:01:45,840
for each home for each

3864
03:01:45,840 --> 03:01:49,389
home now instead of one HOA they're getting two and the HOA

3865
03:01:49,389 --> 03:01:51,299
fees we're paying for the

3866
03:01:51,299 --> 03:01:53,510
maintenance on the golf course is about four million

3867
03:01:53,510 --> 03:01:55,159
dollars a year we're paying

3868
03:01:55,159 --> 03:01:58,389
for all this over costs in a restaurant which is another I

3869
03:01:58,389 --> 03:02:00,040
don't know 1.5 million

3870
03:02:00,040 --> 03:02:02,870
dollars that we shouldn't be paying but we're paying it

3871
03:02:02,870 --> 03:02:04,200
because they have a good

3872
03:02:04,200 --> 03:02:06,889
little hold on us and we do not want to see any more of

3873
03:02:06,889 --> 03:02:08,159
this crap going on with

3874
03:02:08,159 --> 03:02:10,629
the stuff they're going to do this favor not doing us a

3875
03:02:10,629 --> 03:02:12,760
favor believe me I'll fill

3876
03:02:12,760 --> 03:02:17,989
a card out thank you for your comments I do want to say

3877
03:02:17,989 --> 03:02:19,079
that we we will be

3878
03:02:19,079 --> 03:02:23,610
entering all of these into the record so thank you for

3879
03:02:23,610 --> 03:02:24,920
everyone who is sent in a

3880
03:02:24,920 --> 03:02:27,469
letter and anyone else who would like to speak please come

3881
03:02:27,469 --> 03:02:28,440
forward at this time

3882
03:02:28,440 --> 03:02:32,719
and give us your name and address Dave Everly I live at 8

3883
03:02:32,719 --> 03:02:34,680
800 Maryland Court

3884
03:02:34,680 --> 03:02:42,280
Robeson Ranch we've been there five years I work for the

3885
03:02:42,280 --> 03:02:43,280
city of Denton when I was

3886
03:02:43,280 --> 03:02:48,149
in school here I was city secretary at Carrollton I've

3887
03:02:48,149 --> 03:02:50,239
never seen a planning and

3888
03:02:50,239 --> 03:02:56,079
zoning request like this heard of it ever my concern is

3889
03:02:56,079 --> 03:02:58,040
your concern if it's

3890
03:02:58,040 --> 03:03:02,360
a mixed-use request you got a duplex which are joined at

3891
03:03:02,360 --> 03:03:03,760
the garage there's

3892
03:03:03,760 --> 03:03:07,409
two garages together and they can be in one lot then you've

3893
03:03:07,409 --> 03:03:08,399
got a single family

3894
03:03:08,399 --> 03:03:13,620
then you got another duplex I don't think if people

3895
03:03:13,620 --> 03:03:16,360
understood that which by

3896
03:03:16,360 --> 03:03:21,000
the way we got this letter and it said nothing we had no

3897
03:03:21,000 --> 03:03:23,479
idea what all this was

3898
03:03:23,479 --> 03:03:29,100
going on and we're in part of that 200 feet there that

3899
03:03:29,100 --> 03:03:30,879
shows down at the bottom

3900
03:03:30,879 --> 03:03:35,459
of this so fortunately unless somebody tears down a house

3901
03:03:35,459 --> 03:03:36,040
we won't have a

3902
03:03:36,040 --> 03:03:40,309
duplex across the street from us currently they're in pods

3903
03:03:40,309 --> 03:03:41,239
like he said

3904
03:03:41,239 --> 03:03:46,059
and that looks really nice people that want those fine the

3905
03:03:46,059 --> 03:03:47,920
retired people most

3906
03:03:47,920 --> 03:03:53,639
of them stay there year-round as I do we do travel a lot

3907
03:03:53,639 --> 03:03:55,120
but we stay there year

3908
03:03:55,120 --> 03:04:01,100
round I would think if you keep these in pods like 63 they

3909
03:04:01,100 --> 03:04:02,159
're right there now

3910
03:04:02,159 --> 03:04:05,870
that would be really acceptable with everybody but if you

3911
03:04:05,870 --> 03:04:07,200
start putting them

3912
03:04:07,200 --> 03:04:12,319
side by side and I just don't see how it's going to work

3913
03:04:12,319 --> 03:04:13,840
and it's gonna

3914
03:04:13,840 --> 03:04:18,559
they're selling a hundred houses a year about building from

3915
03:04:18,559 --> 03:04:20,680
scratch and if you

3916
03:04:20,680 --> 03:04:24,840
start doubling that and doubling that they're already built

3917
03:04:24,840 --> 03:04:26,120
they're building

3918
03:04:26,120 --> 03:04:29,610
new tennis courts new driveways for look off cards so they

3919
03:04:29,610 --> 03:04:30,959
're expecting a lot of

3920
03:04:30,959 --> 03:04:38,270
people there right now I would just say if you pass

3921
03:04:38,270 --> 03:04:40,120
something that groups these

3922
03:04:40,120 --> 03:04:44,590
things in the clusters that would be acceptable with most

3923
03:04:44,590 --> 03:04:45,479
everybody but if

3924
03:04:45,479 --> 03:04:50,180
you just go mixed use and by my understanding mixed use is

3925
03:04:50,180 --> 03:04:50,920
one here

3926
03:04:50,920 --> 03:04:56,920
single-family here a duplex there I couldn't vote for that

3927
03:04:56,920 --> 03:04:58,600
and you can say I

3928
03:04:58,600 --> 03:05:05,760
didn't check no in that box okay

3929
03:05:12,840 --> 03:05:18,200
good evening my name is Alan Shig I live at 9101 Compton

3930
03:05:18,200 --> 03:05:19,959
Street which is part of

3931
03:05:19,959 --> 03:05:22,879
Robson Ranch I've been a resident out there about five

3932
03:05:22,879 --> 03:05:24,840
years now my hearing is

3933
03:05:24,840 --> 03:05:28,399
sort of broken my mind sort of thinks in the simple

3934
03:05:28,399 --> 03:05:30,440
concepts so I might have missed

3935
03:05:30,440 --> 03:05:33,200
some of the pertinent facts that were delivered here today

3936
03:05:33,200 --> 03:05:34,879
now that probably

3937
03:05:34,879 --> 03:05:38,920
is not gonna well I may come across as being ignorant with

3938
03:05:38,920 --> 03:05:39,639
some of the things I

3939
03:05:39,639 --> 03:05:43,620
said because of those factors there but my main point is

3940
03:05:43,620 --> 03:05:44,920
just it's just an

3941
03:05:44,920 --> 03:05:48,680
irritant I think I'm just really irritated about this first

3942
03:05:48,680 --> 03:05:49,479
of all the

3943
03:05:49,479 --> 03:05:53,059
density issue I just don't know how that density can remain

3944
03:05:53,059 --> 03:05:54,360
the same from you

3945
03:05:54,360 --> 03:05:59,579
know what it was to what is proposed now I know the the

3946
03:05:59,579 --> 03:06:01,159
developers probably not

3947
03:06:01,159 --> 03:06:05,129
under any obligation to advise the residents everything

3948
03:06:05,129 --> 03:06:06,000
that they're doing

3949
03:06:06,000 --> 03:06:10,290
but just this process almost seems like it's been been done

3950
03:06:10,290 --> 03:06:12,319
in a vacuum I mean I

3951
03:06:12,319 --> 03:06:17,700
got this here week to ten days ago probably and then I did

3952
03:06:17,700 --> 03:06:19,239
not fill out any

3953
03:06:19,239 --> 03:06:23,309
kind of form because this wasn't included in the notice I

3954
03:06:23,309 --> 03:06:24,920
received initially I

3955
03:06:24,920 --> 03:06:29,280
just received this by certified certified letter I think it

3956
03:06:29,280 --> 03:06:30,079
was Friday

3957
03:06:30,079 --> 03:06:36,040
or Saturday and it would just been so nice if there would

3958
03:06:36,040 --> 03:06:36,639
have been some kind

3959
03:06:36,639 --> 03:06:41,770
of inclusive you know on a part of the residents out there

3960
03:06:41,770 --> 03:06:42,920
there's a lot of

3961
03:06:42,920 --> 03:06:47,639
communications that goes on and Robson ranch but this I

3962
03:06:47,639 --> 03:06:49,479
never heard about it

3963
03:06:49,479 --> 03:06:52,290
now I was gone a little bit in the summer so maybe I missed

3964
03:06:52,290 --> 03:06:53,079
out on some of

3965
03:06:53,079 --> 03:06:57,040
this but if they were just been even even in last week if

3966
03:06:57,040 --> 03:06:58,000
we had just got

3967
03:06:58,000 --> 03:07:02,020
some kind of notice that something was going on but nothing

3968
03:07:02,020 --> 03:07:03,959
was sent out if

3969
03:07:03,959 --> 03:07:06,510
there had been some kind of advisory this is what we want

3970
03:07:06,510 --> 03:07:07,479
to do would like to

3971
03:07:07,479 --> 03:07:11,620
do this would just like to let you know so it's an irritant

3972
03:07:11,620 --> 03:07:12,719
on my part and that

3973
03:07:12,719 --> 03:07:16,799
probably will not sway a decision process in any way but I

3974
03:07:16,799 --> 03:07:17,760
just want to

3975
03:07:17,760 --> 03:07:21,319
let you know that there there are some concerned people

3976
03:07:21,319 --> 03:07:22,840
living out there thank

3977
03:07:22,840 --> 03:07:25,090
you for your time have a question for you before you go

3978
03:07:25,090 --> 03:07:26,000
Commissioner Hussman

3979
03:07:26,000 --> 03:07:30,879
thank you I just wanted to make sure you knew the notices

3980
03:07:30,879 --> 03:07:32,319
that you received or

3981
03:07:32,319 --> 03:07:36,000
so so that's not that's not ropes and rinse that's the city

3982
03:07:36,000 --> 03:07:36,719
of Denton so I

3983
03:07:36,719 --> 03:07:42,360
just don't want you to put your your your frustration or

3984
03:07:42,360 --> 03:07:44,639
concern about notice on

3985
03:07:44,639 --> 03:07:50,600
that particular item on them that that's our responsibility

3986
03:07:50,600 --> 03:07:52,360
and we're making

3987
03:07:52,360 --> 03:07:55,879
improvements every day but that is we'll have to shoulder

3988
03:07:55,879 --> 03:07:56,760
that thank you

3989
03:07:56,760 --> 03:08:00,049
Commissioner I think I understood that but it's just that I

3990
03:08:00,049 --> 03:08:00,760
wish we did

3991
03:08:00,760 --> 03:08:03,959
something internally something internally and like I say

3992
03:08:03,959 --> 03:08:04,840
they may not be

3993
03:08:04,840 --> 03:08:10,459
obligated to do that but wish we would have been thank you

3994
03:08:10,459 --> 03:08:11,000
thank you for your

3995
03:08:11,000 --> 03:08:13,239
comments

3996
03:08:17,719 --> 03:08:21,879
and I'll file a card I did go to the sales office and I

3997
03:08:21,879 --> 03:08:22,840
said what is this all

3998
03:08:22,840 --> 03:08:26,100
about and they showed me a little map down below the dog

3999
03:08:26,100 --> 03:08:26,920
park and said we're

4000
03:08:26,920 --> 03:08:29,899
taking this piece of land and we want to increase the

4001
03:08:29,899 --> 03:08:31,840
density from 34 to 36 that's

4002
03:08:31,840 --> 03:08:35,350
all it's all about and so when my husband said come today I

4003
03:08:35,350 --> 03:08:35,920
thought okay

4004
03:08:35,920 --> 03:08:38,610
we're just gonna come in here and what we heard today was

4005
03:08:38,610 --> 03:08:39,600
not what we were told

4006
03:08:39,600 --> 03:08:42,950
when I went to the sales office just this last week asking

4007
03:08:42,950 --> 03:08:43,479
for a clarification

4008
03:08:43,479 --> 03:08:47,540
on this point so I do feel like it would be nice if there

4009
03:08:47,540 --> 03:08:49,159
was a more detailed

4010
03:08:49,159 --> 03:08:52,870
master plan and that it was more forthcoming to those of us

4011
03:08:52,870 --> 03:08:53,440
who are

4012
03:08:53,440 --> 03:08:56,379
living there and who are buying into there to know what is

4013
03:08:56,379 --> 03:08:57,520
actually happening

4014
03:08:57,520 --> 03:09:00,879
because I do know that where the villas are the people that

4015
03:09:00,879 --> 03:09:01,760
live there are

4016
03:09:01,760 --> 03:09:05,139
enjoying those very much they were very desirable they sold

4017
03:09:05,139 --> 03:09:06,200
out very fast and I

4018
03:09:06,200 --> 03:09:08,620
can see where that concept would be a good concept but I

4019
03:09:08,620 --> 03:09:09,399
was a little bit

4020
03:09:09,399 --> 03:09:12,590
shocked tonight when I heard 1,200 homes it really was a

4021
03:09:12,590 --> 03:09:13,680
surprise to me because I

4022
03:09:13,680 --> 03:09:16,760
was told there was being in this increased density of two

4023
03:09:16,760 --> 03:09:17,520
more homes in

4024
03:09:17,520 --> 03:09:23,899
that area thank you for your comments and this is a public

4025
03:09:23,899 --> 03:09:24,959
hearing anyone who

4026
03:09:24,959 --> 03:09:27,170
would like to speak please come forward this time and give

4027
03:09:27,170 --> 03:09:27,760
your name and address

4028
03:09:27,760 --> 03:09:30,520
and then fill out a card for us when you can before you

4029
03:09:30,520 --> 03:09:33,040
leave Cindy Whitten 104

4030
03:09:33,040 --> 03:09:38,479
13 Belvedere Drive and I'd like to state I'm in opposition

4031
03:09:38,479 --> 03:09:40,100
of this and the

4032
03:09:40,100 --> 03:09:45,219
reason why is because if I understand everything correctly

4033
03:09:45,219 --> 03:09:46,399
tonight there's not

4034
03:09:46,399 --> 03:09:52,149
a specific area identified that these would be built in for

4035
03:09:52,149 --> 03:09:53,719
future homeowners

4036
03:09:53,719 --> 03:09:59,479
that would be buying the sales office cannot or chooses not

4037
03:09:59,479 --> 03:10:00,719
to disclose

4038
03:10:00,719 --> 03:10:05,850
certain information when we bought in 2013 we looked at a

4039
03:10:05,850 --> 03:10:06,639
particular house

4040
03:10:06,639 --> 03:10:11,239
that was across from a field that had yet to be developed

4041
03:10:11,239 --> 03:10:12,559
specifically asked

4042
03:10:12,559 --> 03:10:16,840
because we were interested in that house when they thought

4043
03:10:16,840 --> 03:10:18,079
that development would

4044
03:10:18,079 --> 03:10:22,200
begin and when there would be houses and the sales office

4045
03:10:22,200 --> 03:10:23,840
told us that there was

4046
03:10:23,840 --> 03:10:29,559
no way to tell us when that development would start within

4047
03:10:29,559 --> 03:10:31,719
a nine to twelve

4048
03:10:31,719 --> 03:10:35,200
month period that development was started and we probably

4049
03:10:35,200 --> 03:10:36,200
would have chosen

4050
03:10:36,200 --> 03:10:41,020
that house had we known that those that we weren't going to

4051
03:10:41,020 --> 03:10:41,840
be staring at an

4052
03:10:41,840 --> 03:10:46,200
empty field for much time we like that house better than we

4053
03:10:46,200 --> 03:10:47,200
like the one that

4054
03:10:47,200 --> 03:10:53,159
we purchased but the sales office isn't forthcoming on

4055
03:10:53,159 --> 03:10:55,719
information to future

4056
03:10:55,719 --> 03:11:00,700
homeowners having to do with the development that's going

4057
03:11:00,700 --> 03:11:02,120
on so to ask to

4058
03:11:02,120 --> 03:11:08,500
just be able to put that anywhere within their map that

4059
03:11:08,500 --> 03:11:10,639
zone jello is

4060
03:11:10,639 --> 03:11:27,510
objectionable to me thank you for your comments I'm Barbara

4061
03:11:27,510 --> 03:11:29,360
Hodges and I own a

4062
03:11:29,360 --> 03:11:33,889
home at ropes and ranch and I just had a dress please I'm

4063
03:11:33,889 --> 03:11:34,920
sorry will you give us

4064
03:11:34,920 --> 03:11:40,049
your address please oh 9600 Rosewood Drive Denton Texas in

4065
03:11:40,049 --> 03:11:41,159
the woods so they

4066
03:11:41,159 --> 03:11:46,479
call it everything ends with a wood I've lived there for

4067
03:11:46,479 --> 03:11:48,120
ten years my husband and

4068
03:11:48,120 --> 03:11:52,389
I moved in there and four years ago he passed away and that

4069
03:11:52,389 --> 03:11:54,120
home is too big for

4070
03:11:54,120 --> 03:11:59,040
me to maintain by myself I want I want a villa so bad I can

4071
03:11:59,040 --> 03:12:00,680
't stand it and my

4072
03:12:00,680 --> 03:12:04,110
there's none available my sister is in the same position

4073
03:12:04,110 --> 03:12:05,239
she moved in four

4074
03:12:05,239 --> 03:12:08,889
years ago her husband just passed away and she has a bigger

4075
03:12:08,889 --> 03:12:10,079
home than I do much

4076
03:12:10,079 --> 03:12:14,610
bigger it's on the other side and so she and I are two wid

4077
03:12:14,610 --> 03:12:16,280
ows and we really we

4078
03:12:16,280 --> 03:12:19,930
want to live together in the same under the same roof they

4079
03:12:19,930 --> 03:12:21,840
're very nicely done

4080
03:12:21,840 --> 03:12:25,889
very well kept you there are restrictions to what you can

4081
03:12:25,889 --> 03:12:27,040
do I don't

4082
03:12:27,040 --> 03:12:30,600
know what people are afraid of I really don't I mean

4083
03:12:30,600 --> 03:12:32,280
building them all over the

4084
03:12:32,280 --> 03:12:35,569
place I don't like that either but the way that it is set

4085
03:12:35,569 --> 03:12:36,680
up right now is

4086
03:12:36,680 --> 03:12:41,559
wonderful and you have your own your own set of neighbors

4087
03:12:41,559 --> 03:12:43,440
anyway that's all I had

4088
03:12:43,440 --> 03:12:48,600
to say I'm for them thank you thank you for your comment

4089
03:12:50,799 --> 03:12:54,790
well I'll tell you what I have a question for you learn I

4090
03:12:54,790 --> 03:12:55,680
learned this

4091
03:12:55,680 --> 03:13:05,840
trick not too long ago you were going to help me with a

4092
03:13:05,840 --> 03:13:06,879
question what was your

4093
03:13:06,879 --> 03:13:12,719
question going to be so why I understand that the villas

4094
03:13:12,719 --> 03:13:14,319
are very desirable my

4095
03:13:14,319 --> 03:13:18,850
objection is to not having specific locations and identify

4096
03:13:18,850 --> 03:13:19,719
if they were more

4097
03:13:19,719 --> 03:13:23,239
in pods rather than if they were yes yes I think that there

4098
03:13:23,239 --> 03:13:24,440
's a need for the

4099
03:13:24,440 --> 03:13:29,000
villas to you know as the as the baby boomers get older and

4100
03:13:29,000 --> 03:13:30,399
we see an influx

4101
03:13:30,399 --> 03:13:36,790
of people into these type of neighborhood master plan

4102
03:13:36,790 --> 03:13:38,319
communities I

4103
03:13:38,319 --> 03:13:42,200
think that that's very good my objection is not identifying

4104
03:13:42,200 --> 03:13:42,680
where

4105
03:13:42,680 --> 03:13:46,670
they're going to be so that the homeowner the future home

4106
03:13:46,670 --> 03:13:47,520
owner has a

4107
03:13:47,520 --> 03:13:52,569
choice as to what lot he may want to buy or those of us

4108
03:13:52,569 --> 03:13:55,200
that have existing homes

4109
03:13:55,200 --> 03:13:59,760
know how we're going to be affected by these I don't have

4110
03:13:59,760 --> 03:14:01,280
an objection to the

4111
03:14:01,280 --> 03:14:09,360
the villas themselves just to not having specific specific

4112
03:14:09,360 --> 03:14:11,239
identified areas and

4113
03:14:11,239 --> 03:14:16,790
that being specifically requested I have one follow-up

4114
03:14:16,790 --> 03:14:19,879
question okay thank you

4115
03:14:19,879 --> 03:14:22,909
again this is a public hearing anyone else that would like

4116
03:14:22,909 --> 03:14:23,799
to speak on this

4117
03:14:23,799 --> 03:14:29,000
item please come forward at this time and if you all will

4118
03:14:29,000 --> 03:14:30,719
if you haven't had

4119
03:14:30,719 --> 03:14:33,709
an opportunity to fill out a card I think staff has come

4120
03:14:33,709 --> 03:14:34,840
around and passing

4121
03:14:34,840 --> 03:14:37,690
cards please fill out a card for us my name is Fred Palmer

4122
03:14:37,690 --> 03:14:38,959
I live in 9613

4123
03:14:38,959 --> 03:14:42,260
Lindenwood trail and just doing the numbers and and again

4124
03:14:42,260 --> 03:14:43,159
the villas are

4125
03:14:43,159 --> 03:14:45,180
great and they fit a purpose and that sort of thing but

4126
03:14:45,180 --> 03:14:46,479
right now there's 63

4127
03:14:46,479 --> 03:14:50,639
out of 1800 homes if you do 1200 more out of 4800 homes

4128
03:14:50,639 --> 03:14:52,159
that's 25% so there's

4129
03:14:52,159 --> 03:14:55,430
got to be some controls I'm in favor of the villas but

4130
03:14:55,430 --> 03:14:56,600
there's got to be some

4131
03:14:56,600 --> 03:15:02,159
controls now they go in okay thank you sir

4132
03:15:07,200 --> 03:15:12,709
Mike Weaver 9612 Applewood trail I appreciate the mailing

4133
03:15:12,709 --> 03:15:13,559
that you guys did

4134
03:15:13,559 --> 03:15:18,090
to inform us of what was happening but in my mind what I

4135
03:15:18,090 --> 03:15:20,079
received by snail mail

4136
03:15:20,079 --> 03:15:23,590
and certified mail it was completely unintelligible we

4137
03:15:23,590 --> 03:15:24,559
couldn't tell what was

4138
03:15:24,559 --> 03:15:28,559
going on what was the purpose of the meeting it did board

4139
03:15:28,559 --> 03:15:29,680
did filter through

4140
03:15:29,680 --> 03:15:32,899
on the homeowners and I'm sorry the message board at ropes

4141
03:15:32,899 --> 03:15:33,840
and Rick that it

4142
03:15:33,840 --> 03:15:37,110
was about the villas but if you guys could do a better job

4143
03:15:37,110 --> 03:15:38,280
of communicating

4144
03:15:38,280 --> 03:15:44,719
the specific issues that would be great thank you sir again

4145
03:15:44,719 --> 03:15:46,399
this is a public

4146
03:15:46,399 --> 03:15:49,139
hearing anyone else who would like to speak please come

4147
03:15:49,139 --> 03:15:51,479
forward at this time

4148
03:15:55,399 --> 03:15:58,399
okay we're going to close the public hearing on this item

4149
03:15:58,399 --> 03:16:00,540
and I'll open the

4150
03:16:00,540 --> 03:16:06,879
floor up for discussion and a motion I'm gonna recognize

4151
03:16:06,879 --> 03:16:08,520
Commissioner Hesworth I

4152
03:16:08,520 --> 03:16:12,579
believe you had a question for the applicant yes okay thank

4153
03:16:12,579 --> 03:16:12,799
you the

4154
03:16:12,799 --> 03:16:16,399
applicant please come forward again please

4155
03:16:20,399 --> 03:16:23,709
and I'm sorry give me your name one more time Todd Fitzger

4156
03:16:23,709 --> 03:16:27,680
ald Todd thank you so

4157
03:16:27,680 --> 03:16:31,540
do you have an understanding given given the feedback we've

4158
03:16:31,540 --> 03:16:33,040
received verbally and

4159
03:16:33,040 --> 03:16:38,399
written do you are you comfortable giving me a number of

4160
03:16:38,399 --> 03:16:40,600
pods that make it

4161
03:16:40,600 --> 03:16:45,129
financial and financially feasible for you to commit to so

4162
03:16:45,129 --> 03:16:46,159
for example if

4163
03:16:46,159 --> 03:16:49,459
you're given permission to build pods but they have to be

4164
03:16:49,459 --> 03:16:50,639
in a segment number

4165
03:16:50,639 --> 03:16:55,319
of XYZ are you comfortable or are you able to give a number

4166
03:16:55,319 --> 03:16:56,000
or I mean I

4167
03:16:56,000 --> 03:16:58,690
understand if you're not I'm just curious what that number

4168
03:16:58,690 --> 03:17:00,559
would be I would be

4169
03:17:00,559 --> 03:17:03,459
apprehensive just for the physical constraints and the

4170
03:17:03,459 --> 03:17:05,120
ability to whatever

4171
03:17:05,120 --> 03:17:07,819
the number might be then to go put one in place and it

4172
03:17:07,819 --> 03:17:09,040
happens that there's

4173
03:17:09,040 --> 03:17:12,319
grading issues or a triangular piece because of a wash and

4174
03:17:12,319 --> 03:17:13,040
what have you that

4175
03:17:13,040 --> 03:17:17,979
it'd be very hard to determine you know a pod unit of some

4176
03:17:17,979 --> 03:17:19,479
amount of homes that

4177
03:17:19,479 --> 03:17:22,959
would I guess secure the ability to continue with this

4178
03:17:22,959 --> 03:17:24,440
product and continue

4179
03:17:24,440 --> 03:17:28,909
to move it forward more than I would be apprehensive I'm

4180
03:17:28,909 --> 03:17:30,440
preference would be to

4181
03:17:30,440 --> 03:17:33,879
be able to use do the land planning and not be the the one

4182
03:17:33,879 --> 03:17:35,319
example that's kind

4183
03:17:35,319 --> 03:17:39,180
of adjacent to unit 47 right now was I forget who brought

4184
03:17:39,180 --> 03:17:40,120
it up but it is

4185
03:17:40,120 --> 03:17:43,409
accurate it's not many more units realize there but it's

4186
03:17:43,409 --> 03:17:44,600
just an effort to

4187
03:17:44,600 --> 03:17:46,920
get more of them there and that was a very it's just a

4188
03:17:46,920 --> 03:17:48,040
strange piece of ground

4189
03:17:48,040 --> 03:17:51,549
and it's limited by a wash on one side and a street in a

4190
03:17:51,549 --> 03:17:52,959
dog park and I think

4191
03:17:52,959 --> 03:17:56,180
that's going to become fairly common that just the real

4192
03:17:56,180 --> 03:17:57,360
world is going to be

4193
03:17:57,360 --> 03:17:59,350
some other constraints that would be very hard to plan up

4194
03:17:59,350 --> 03:17:59,879
against especially

4195
03:17:59,879 --> 03:18:02,879
if success continues the ability to take a big bite or a

4196
03:18:02,879 --> 03:18:03,920
small bite or two

4197
03:18:03,920 --> 03:18:06,200
different pods but there's their access and sewer and all

4198
03:18:06,200 --> 03:18:07,120
the other issues that

4199
03:18:07,120 --> 03:18:10,260
that we need to address at the same time for that reason be

4200
03:18:10,260 --> 03:18:11,479
our preference to not

4201
03:18:11,479 --> 03:18:16,090
have to pin down a location or account understanding the

4202
03:18:16,090 --> 03:18:16,799
constraints and then

4203
03:18:16,799 --> 03:18:19,489
the concerns that have been raised with the home side by

4204
03:18:19,489 --> 03:18:20,520
side within the same

4205
03:18:20,520 --> 03:18:23,209
pod or the same subdivision where we can understand that

4206
03:18:23,209 --> 03:18:23,879
and that's not

4207
03:18:23,879 --> 03:18:26,690
something that's not how we've tried to market in order do

4208
03:18:26,690 --> 03:18:27,479
we plan to but I

4209
03:18:27,479 --> 03:18:31,440
don't know if that answers your question many but yes it

4210
03:18:31,440 --> 03:18:34,360
does it candidly you

4211
03:18:34,360 --> 03:18:38,950
know there's the buttons they only give us two they give us

4212
03:18:38,950 --> 03:18:39,920
a yes and a no yes

4213
03:18:39,920 --> 03:18:49,760
and so understanding your your parameters I am limited as

4214
03:18:49,760 --> 03:18:51,319
well and so

4215
03:18:51,319 --> 03:18:58,049
I'm trying to forge middle ground that would obviously

4216
03:18:58,049 --> 03:19:00,920
require more planning

4217
03:19:00,920 --> 03:19:04,569
more commitment on because I understand that at a very

4218
03:19:04,569 --> 03:19:06,879
small level the

4219
03:19:06,879 --> 03:19:10,440
limitations of building and clusters so and so on so forth

4220
03:19:10,440 --> 03:19:13,360
but at the same time

4221
03:19:13,360 --> 03:19:16,920
trying to find a middle ground someplace so no that it may

4222
03:19:16,920 --> 03:19:17,920
you answered my

4223
03:19:17,920 --> 03:19:22,170
question perfectly just trying to to help can I follow up

4224
03:19:22,170 --> 03:19:23,799
to that absolutely to

4225
03:19:23,799 --> 03:19:27,170
that end if there to be some kind of a stipulation that

4226
03:19:27,170 --> 03:19:28,559
need to be contained

4227
03:19:28,559 --> 03:19:32,239
within a pod and not a one-off and some other standalone

4228
03:19:32,239 --> 03:19:34,280
unit would that suffice

4229
03:19:34,280 --> 03:19:37,959
to any end to provide some more structure some some

4230
03:19:37,959 --> 03:19:39,280
increased stability

4231
03:19:39,280 --> 03:19:44,399
I'm one of seven but I'll tell you I'll tell you from my

4232
03:19:44,399 --> 03:19:46,159
one yes because you

4233
03:19:46,159 --> 03:19:50,799
know I'm balancing residents versus understanding you you

4234
03:19:50,799 --> 03:19:51,440
're you're producing

4235
03:19:51,440 --> 03:19:54,739
a superior product everyone gets that you know and the

4236
03:19:54,739 --> 03:19:55,840
neighborhood is is is

4237
03:19:55,840 --> 03:19:59,319
thriving because of your sensitivity to your product and

4238
03:19:59,319 --> 03:20:00,639
and having the ear to

4239
03:20:00,639 --> 03:20:05,399
the to your to your your customers so having that same ear

4240
03:20:05,399 --> 03:20:06,319
yes I mean for me

4241
03:20:06,319 --> 03:20:09,969
just me personally yes because that then allows some

4242
03:20:09,969 --> 03:20:12,959
visibility and some peace of

4243
03:20:12,959 --> 03:20:16,569
mind that we're not just gonna have a vacant lot that this

4244
03:20:16,569 --> 03:20:17,959
will fit their type

4245
03:20:17,959 --> 03:20:23,389
approach and doesn't give a carte blanche 15-year blank

4246
03:20:23,389 --> 03:20:25,959
check you know and also

4247
03:20:25,959 --> 03:20:29,809
for me it helps because I think this body changes right so

4248
03:20:29,809 --> 03:20:31,040
I'd like to try to

4249
03:20:31,040 --> 03:20:36,540
provide some reciprocate so supply supply some stability

4250
03:20:36,540 --> 03:20:37,840
for you and your partners

4251
03:20:37,840 --> 03:20:41,799
as you go forward and we turn limit off and new people come

4252
03:20:41,799 --> 03:20:42,600
on you have

4253
03:20:42,600 --> 03:20:46,540
something in place that allows you to continue to adjust to

4254
03:20:46,540 --> 03:20:47,639
your to your needs

4255
03:20:47,639 --> 03:20:53,889
again as a as a credit or as a just recognizing the good

4256
03:20:53,889 --> 03:20:55,840
work that you do

4257
03:20:55,840 --> 03:20:59,909
and that that Robson ranch is is focused on and doing great

4258
03:20:59,909 --> 03:21:00,840
things hopefully in

4259
03:21:00,840 --> 03:21:03,530
that area so thank you for that yes sir that certainly

4260
03:21:03,530 --> 03:21:05,000
would be something that to

4261
03:21:05,000 --> 03:21:07,489
whatever end it provides additional protection or be

4262
03:21:07,489 --> 03:21:09,040
labeled maybe as a

4263
03:21:09,040 --> 03:21:12,840
final plat comes into that end it gets the label and that

4264
03:21:12,840 --> 03:21:14,040
that's what allows

4265
03:21:14,040 --> 03:21:16,090
those lots to be used for real as opposed to some of the

4266
03:21:16,090 --> 03:21:16,559
other ones

4267
03:21:16,559 --> 03:21:20,120
externally it's probably half a thought but some along

4268
03:21:20,120 --> 03:21:21,520
those lines would be

4269
03:21:21,520 --> 03:21:25,489
preferential in terms of limiting it as opposed to pick an

4270
03:21:25,489 --> 03:21:26,600
actual geographic

4271
03:21:26,600 --> 03:21:29,200
locations without the background and the grading and the

4272
03:21:29,200 --> 03:21:30,200
drainage and all the

4273
03:21:30,200 --> 03:21:34,239
other information thank you again

4274
03:21:38,319 --> 03:21:43,040
you might want to take a seat close by I don't know no stay

4275
03:21:43,040 --> 03:21:43,040
there

4276
03:21:43,040 --> 03:21:45,979
Commissioner Beck I've got a full board and I didn't know

4277
03:21:45,979 --> 03:21:46,959
if they want to ask

4278
03:21:46,959 --> 03:21:51,639
you a question or not okay following the same lines

4279
03:21:51,639 --> 03:21:52,200
Commissioner

4280
03:21:52,200 --> 03:21:54,409
Hudson was talking about you know finding some middle

4281
03:21:54,409 --> 03:21:56,520
ground here the 1200

4282
03:21:56,520 --> 03:22:00,579
number you put up there on the bill is is that something

4283
03:22:00,579 --> 03:22:02,840
you see that's viable

4284
03:22:02,840 --> 03:22:09,600
not viable I'm sorry but that is is is realistic is that

4285
03:22:09,600 --> 03:22:10,559
just a number thrown

4286
03:22:10,559 --> 03:22:16,350
out there the demand for 1200 is it actually there could a

4287
03:22:16,350 --> 03:22:18,559
lesser number be

4288
03:22:18,559 --> 03:22:22,840
presented it's not based on any solid math okay again we're

4289
03:22:22,840 --> 03:22:23,440
having one in our

4290
03:22:23,440 --> 03:22:26,270
hip pocket that we're kind of learning this product and

4291
03:22:26,270 --> 03:22:27,920
even once that happened

4292
03:22:27,920 --> 03:22:31,270
market trends being what they are you can turn that math

4293
03:22:31,270 --> 03:22:32,399
upside down and there

4294
03:22:32,399 --> 03:22:37,459
wasn't any solid number crunching that landed on that

4295
03:22:37,459 --> 03:22:38,280
number it's somewhat

4296
03:22:38,280 --> 03:22:42,379
arbitrary but to try to be safe to try to avoid understand

4297
03:22:42,379 --> 03:22:43,600
market trends too

4298
03:22:43,600 --> 03:22:48,239
but based on what I'm hearing a lot tonight you know there

4299
03:22:48,239 --> 03:22:50,040
and I really

4300
03:22:50,040 --> 03:22:54,040
fully respect the idea of flexibility here I'm pretty much

4301
03:22:54,040 --> 03:22:54,879
for it but I'm

4302
03:22:54,879 --> 03:22:58,069
concerned too that not enough information has been shared

4303
03:22:58,069 --> 03:22:58,760
with everyone

4304
03:22:58,760 --> 03:23:03,350
that has to live with this and the idea of probably setting

4305
03:23:03,350 --> 03:23:04,760
aside some areas

4306
03:23:04,760 --> 03:23:07,329
where these pods can be contained as making that a stip

4307
03:23:07,329 --> 03:23:08,479
ulation this probably

4308
03:23:08,479 --> 03:23:12,190
would be a good idea but I think it would it would come off

4309
03:23:12,190 --> 03:23:13,760
better too if

4310
03:23:13,760 --> 03:23:16,840
there was probably a better public hearing on this with the

4311
03:23:16,840 --> 03:23:18,000
Robeson Ranch

4312
03:23:18,000 --> 03:23:20,590
residents out there so they could get a better grasp of

4313
03:23:20,590 --> 03:23:21,799
this I think you've got

4314
03:23:21,799 --> 03:23:25,040
a good idea I think your head and hearts in the right place

4315
03:23:25,040 --> 03:23:26,440
but they haven't got

4316
03:23:26,440 --> 03:23:30,530
enough information yet to realize that and it would behoove

4317
03:23:30,530 --> 03:23:31,840
you as a developer

4318
03:23:31,840 --> 03:23:36,309
to share that with them so going forward would you consider

4319
03:23:36,309 --> 03:23:37,479
opening this debate

4320
03:23:37,479 --> 03:23:41,270
back up with the residents out there with an understanding

4321
03:23:41,270 --> 03:23:42,479
that maybe we can't

4322
03:23:42,479 --> 03:23:44,790
set some areas aside for these little pods for the the

4323
03:23:44,790 --> 03:23:45,840
bills because there's

4324
03:23:45,840 --> 03:23:49,770
obviously demand for them too we had made some effort to

4325
03:23:49,770 --> 03:23:50,879
put up a posting and

4326
03:23:50,879 --> 03:23:54,069
into Holst a neighborhood meeting apologies if that I think

4327
03:23:54,069 --> 03:23:54,479
that message

4328
03:23:54,479 --> 03:23:59,760
didn't get to everybody we certainly understand the one who

4329
03:23:59,760 --> 03:24:01,000
have involvement

4330
03:24:01,000 --> 03:24:05,170
all the residents as much as we can okay okay thank you sir

4331
03:24:05,170 --> 03:24:08,760
thank you thank you

4332
03:24:08,760 --> 03:24:13,040
chair to I guess continue this because I'm not sure I heard

4333
03:24:13,040 --> 03:24:14,479
the answer I think

4334
03:24:14,479 --> 03:24:18,950
the big scary part is going from 63 villas to this large

4335
03:24:18,950 --> 03:24:20,639
number and and where

4336
03:24:20,639 --> 03:24:23,889
did that number come from honestly it's fairly arbitrary we

4337
03:24:23,889 --> 03:24:24,879
're looking at some

4338
03:24:24,879 --> 03:24:28,360
ratios and what's remaining and a safe number that we

4339
03:24:28,360 --> 03:24:30,399
thought we avoid another

4340
03:24:30,399 --> 03:24:34,379
miss and revisiting this down the road was the extent of

4341
03:24:34,379 --> 03:24:35,280
the man and I mean I

4342
03:24:35,280 --> 03:24:38,530
think that is the stumbling block is just that large

4343
03:24:38,530 --> 03:24:39,760
increase and then

4344
03:24:39,760 --> 03:24:44,040
without a definite plan of where you know nobody wants to

4345
03:24:44,040 --> 03:24:45,559
see property value

4346
03:24:45,559 --> 03:24:47,989
decrease obviously and and that's not your goal and I know

4347
03:24:47,989 --> 03:24:48,840
that the community

4348
03:24:48,840 --> 03:24:52,700
is beautiful and developing the community further is best

4349
03:24:52,700 --> 03:24:54,360
for all we need

4350
03:24:54,360 --> 03:24:57,920
to continue going forward in ropes and ranch I mean it's it

4351
03:24:57,920 --> 03:25:00,079
's a great plan it at

4352
03:25:00,079 --> 03:25:03,430
the aging in place concept is a wonderful concept and yes

4353
03:25:03,430 --> 03:25:04,280
you need more

4354
03:25:04,280 --> 03:25:08,649
than 63 villas out there definitely the scary part is is

4355
03:25:08,649 --> 03:25:10,120
just throwing out this

4356
03:25:10,120 --> 03:25:15,110
amendment without parameters and going from 63 and in the

4357
03:25:15,110 --> 03:25:16,680
mind of residents who

4358
03:25:16,680 --> 03:25:19,370
are there who have invested a great deal of money to this

4359
03:25:19,370 --> 03:25:21,559
1200 number of where

4360
03:25:21,559 --> 03:25:24,530
they don't know where they're going to be so I'm trying to

4361
03:25:24,530 --> 03:25:26,399
wrap my head around

4362
03:25:26,399 --> 03:25:30,329
allowing you to to get this amendment passed and want you

4363
03:25:30,329 --> 03:25:31,239
to continue

4364
03:25:31,239 --> 03:25:35,840
developing as you have the superior product that is there

4365
03:25:35,840 --> 03:25:37,600
it's just that

4366
03:25:37,600 --> 03:25:41,430
that's the stumbling block certainly for those opposed and

4367
03:25:41,430 --> 03:25:42,440
and it's a stumbling

4368
03:25:42,440 --> 03:25:46,909
block for me as well without knowing where these units are

4369
03:25:46,909 --> 03:25:47,959
really going to

4370
03:25:47,959 --> 03:25:51,879
be placed and the amount does scare me at this moment of

4371
03:25:51,879 --> 03:25:55,239
development is probably

4372
03:25:55,239 --> 03:25:59,159
not a whole lot to address it but in terms of the 2500 2700

4373
03:25:59,159 --> 03:25:59,879
acres that is

4374
03:25:59,879 --> 03:26:02,790
remaining and the fact that the original concept plan and

4375
03:26:02,790 --> 03:26:03,879
the previous detail

4376
03:26:03,879 --> 03:26:06,680
plan or the current detail plan shows a lot counted that

4377
03:26:06,680 --> 03:26:07,959
achieved only that six

4378
03:26:07,959 --> 03:26:13,000
thousand and thirty seven the if even if all 1200 were

4379
03:26:13,000 --> 03:26:14,840
implemented and put in

4380
03:26:14,840 --> 03:26:19,790
place I don't see where I would have exceeded the I guess

4381
03:26:19,790 --> 03:26:21,040
our what we're

4382
03:26:21,040 --> 03:26:25,510
going to continue to to try to relate is that the density

4383
03:26:25,510 --> 03:26:27,719
not increasing even if

4384
03:26:27,719 --> 03:26:29,969
it did increase I guess it would be would have a bunch of

4385
03:26:29,969 --> 03:26:30,760
undeveloped land

4386
03:26:30,760 --> 03:26:33,450
at the end which is not something we want we need the

4387
03:26:33,450 --> 03:26:34,639
continuity their lively

4388
03:26:34,639 --> 03:26:38,129
road is a north limit and need to have some spine roads and

4389
03:26:38,129 --> 03:26:39,000
continuous

4390
03:26:39,000 --> 03:26:42,870
development that we would continue to spread out and take

4391
03:26:42,870 --> 03:26:44,159
full advantage of

4392
03:26:44,159 --> 03:26:46,739
the land maintain the beauty of the land and maximize the

4393
03:26:46,739 --> 03:26:47,719
views and there are

4394
03:26:47,719 --> 03:26:50,819
plenty within our game plan that would always be something

4395
03:26:50,819 --> 03:26:51,920
that we definitely

4396
03:26:51,920 --> 03:26:55,000
rolled into any regardless of the ratios or whether the

4397
03:26:55,000 --> 03:26:56,360
market trend changes again

4398
03:26:56,360 --> 03:27:06,000
or continues full on thank you commissioner time thank you

4399
03:27:06,000 --> 03:27:06,559
chair

4400
03:27:06,559 --> 03:27:14,239
excuse me so I personally I'm not too concerned about I

4401
03:27:14,239 --> 03:27:15,760
think the 1200 number

4402
03:27:15,760 --> 03:27:19,510
comes out if it's around 25 or 30 percent I think there I

4403
03:27:19,510 --> 03:27:20,079
've seen

4404
03:27:20,079 --> 03:27:24,610
especially in well-designed communities 30 or 35 percent

4405
03:27:24,610 --> 03:27:26,239
kind of higher density

4406
03:27:26,239 --> 03:27:30,600
duplex can work really well so I don't think as so the

4407
03:27:30,600 --> 03:27:31,719
parameters of keeping

4408
03:27:31,719 --> 03:27:35,790
the same number of units on the entire development and

4409
03:27:35,790 --> 03:27:37,879
having up to 1200 of you

4410
03:27:37,879 --> 03:27:43,600
know of this type of unit sounds good to me but I do come

4411
03:27:43,600 --> 03:27:44,959
back to this planning

4412
03:27:44,959 --> 03:27:50,290
the letting the neighbors know what's coming giving

4413
03:27:50,290 --> 03:27:51,840
protections to the people

4414
03:27:51,840 --> 03:27:54,870
that are already there so I don't feel comfortable

4415
03:27:54,870 --> 03:27:57,520
supporting this as it is but

4416
03:27:57,520 --> 03:28:00,350
I do want I think that I don't want to make you come back

4417
03:28:00,350 --> 03:28:01,760
necessarily and rezone

4418
03:28:01,760 --> 03:28:07,219
regularly but if we had so if we have we have total

4419
03:28:07,219 --> 03:28:09,079
development you know six

4420
03:28:09,079 --> 03:28:15,030
thousand and 1200 and then we say per unit there will be a

4421
03:28:15,030 --> 03:28:16,520
Mac you know you

4422
03:28:16,520 --> 03:28:20,370
know restrictions on how a pod could would be like pods

4423
03:28:20,370 --> 03:28:21,840
will only face each

4424
03:28:21,840 --> 03:28:23,979
other on the street like they won't have houses on one side

4425
03:28:23,979 --> 03:28:25,479
of the street and you

4426
03:28:25,479 --> 03:28:27,159
know single-family on one side and duplexes on the other

4427
03:28:27,159 --> 03:28:27,760
side of the street

4428
03:28:27,760 --> 03:28:35,040
facing each other and you'll have minimum of 20 unit units

4429
03:28:35,040 --> 03:28:37,360
of the duplexes and a

4430
03:28:37,360 --> 03:28:40,299
maximum of 80 or you know if we can't if you came up with a

4431
03:28:40,299 --> 03:28:41,680
set of guidelines for

4432
03:28:41,680 --> 03:28:45,950
how you generally would design pods and then those pods

4433
03:28:45,950 --> 03:28:47,520
were approved at the

4434
03:28:47,520 --> 03:28:50,930
platting like whenever you come in with a unit so this unit

4435
03:28:50,930 --> 03:28:52,239
's gonna be all

4436
03:28:52,239 --> 03:28:55,479
single-family this unit's gonna have one pod it's gonna be

4437
03:28:55,479 --> 03:28:56,559
an 80 unit pod and

4438
03:28:56,559 --> 03:29:01,479
it's gonna have 40 single-family you know and then and then

4439
03:29:01,479 --> 03:29:03,440
at platting you

4440
03:29:03,440 --> 03:29:06,389
know if we could something along those lines where it isn't

4441
03:29:06,389 --> 03:29:07,440
you flying out here

4442
03:29:07,440 --> 03:29:11,309
every six months for a new rezone for another 40 acres or

4443
03:29:11,309 --> 03:29:13,559
whatever but there

4444
03:29:13,559 --> 03:29:16,319
is still some control and some stability and then all of

4445
03:29:16,319 --> 03:29:17,520
the existing already

4446
03:29:17,520 --> 03:29:20,879
built areas if we just left those in their current

4447
03:29:20,879 --> 03:29:22,360
categories I mean it

4448
03:29:22,360 --> 03:29:25,569
doesn't really affect y'all you know building new homes but

4449
03:29:25,569 --> 03:29:26,879
then it gives you

4450
03:29:26,879 --> 03:29:30,629
know a sense of security to the people that already there

4451
03:29:30,629 --> 03:29:32,079
that their use their

4452
03:29:32,079 --> 03:29:36,170
zoning isn't changing kind of out from under them so that's

4453
03:29:36,170 --> 03:29:37,680
that's me kind of

4454
03:29:37,680 --> 03:29:44,700
spitballing a middle ground but you would have to work with

4455
03:29:44,700 --> 03:29:45,639
city staff and

4456
03:29:45,639 --> 03:29:49,290
develop what that would look like would you be comfortable

4457
03:29:49,290 --> 03:29:50,260
with said I don't

4458
03:29:50,260 --> 03:29:52,690
think you're gonna get approval would you be comfortable

4459
03:29:52,690 --> 03:29:54,239
with tabling for four

4460
03:29:54,239 --> 03:29:58,520
or six weeks and coming back with a proposal that had a

4461
03:29:58,520 --> 03:29:59,520
little more

4462
03:29:59,520 --> 03:30:04,879
structure in it as a alternatively would it be possible to

4463
03:30:04,879 --> 03:30:05,239
come up with

4464
03:30:05,239 --> 03:30:08,520
stipulations that would set out something like that a pod I

4465
03:30:08,520 --> 03:30:09,000
've been using

4466
03:30:09,000 --> 03:30:12,760
the term pod but really to be final plat and again with the

4467
03:30:12,760 --> 03:30:13,719
villas especially

4468
03:30:13,719 --> 03:30:16,870
with a separate HOA all the tracks and all the declarations

4469
03:30:16,870 --> 03:30:17,840
are mapped out at

4470
03:30:17,840 --> 03:30:21,159
that stage if it to be a stipulation to say it has to be

4471
03:30:21,159 --> 03:30:22,920
per final plat

4472
03:30:22,920 --> 03:30:28,469
identified as villas and platter pod or both if it's to use

4473
03:30:28,469 --> 03:30:29,280
interchangeably and

4474
03:30:29,280 --> 03:30:31,969
set it whatever those those limitations need to be that

4475
03:30:31,969 --> 03:30:33,479
there couldn't be across

4476
03:30:33,479 --> 03:30:37,190
the street from each other together with a plat by plat

4477
03:30:37,190 --> 03:30:38,959
basis on a villa so I

4478
03:30:38,959 --> 03:30:41,840
would generally be amenable to that but I would worry that

4479
03:30:41,840 --> 03:30:42,959
if we're writing it

4480
03:30:42,959 --> 03:30:46,389
up here right now we're gonna overlook something and there

4481
03:30:46,389 --> 03:30:47,760
's gonna be you know

4482
03:30:47,760 --> 03:30:50,239
it's gonna make something unbuildable or you know so I

4483
03:30:50,239 --> 03:30:51,479
think it would it would be

4484
03:30:51,479 --> 03:30:54,579
better if I think we let staff review you know kind of sit

4485
03:30:54,579 --> 03:30:55,719
down and make sure

4486
03:30:55,719 --> 03:31:00,059
that all the t's across the eyes are dotted so to speak but

4487
03:31:00,059 --> 03:31:01,239
I think that's

4488
03:31:01,239 --> 03:31:03,950
that's basically what I'm what I'd be proposing is like at

4489
03:31:03,950 --> 03:31:04,719
the plat phase

4490
03:31:04,719 --> 03:31:06,100
there'd be some kind of approval and then the other

4491
03:31:06,100 --> 03:31:06,920
question I guess would be

4492
03:31:06,920 --> 03:31:14,950
for staff would this Commission have the ability to go no-

4493
03:31:14,950 --> 03:31:16,899
go at the point of

4494
03:31:16,899 --> 03:31:21,850
plat final planning on a unit I'm gonna call on legal

4495
03:31:21,850 --> 03:31:23,399
because we've had a little

4496
03:31:23,399 --> 03:31:26,950
back and forth here about zoning and platting and so I'm

4497
03:31:26,950 --> 03:31:28,319
gonna ask Jennifer

4498
03:31:28,319 --> 03:31:32,469
to the platting without the basic legal requirements or

4499
03:31:32,469 --> 03:31:33,600
structure within the PD

4500
03:31:33,600 --> 03:31:38,069
then we would not have the discretion to deny it so we

4501
03:31:38,069 --> 03:31:39,719
would have to amend the PD

4502
03:31:39,719 --> 03:31:42,649
we would have to work could we could we add so we're am

4503
03:31:42,649 --> 03:31:44,040
ending the PD now could

4504
03:31:44,040 --> 03:31:46,659
we amend the PD to have additional restrictions that if

4505
03:31:46,659 --> 03:31:47,319
these restrictions

4506
03:31:47,319 --> 03:31:50,739
aren't met would be grounds for denial absolutely because

4507
03:31:50,739 --> 03:31:51,520
the PDs are different

4508
03:31:51,520 --> 03:31:56,479
animals so you have wide authority on reducing the number

4509
03:31:56,479 --> 03:31:57,559
making it a

4510
03:31:57,559 --> 03:32:05,479
clustered planning or the placement so or you can recommend

4511
03:32:05,479 --> 03:32:06,200
that he come back

4512
03:32:06,200 --> 03:32:08,520
because you had mentioned something about keeping the

4513
03:32:08,520 --> 03:32:09,479
existing homes in the

4514
03:32:09,479 --> 03:32:13,829
same zoning structure and he can bring a plan back and we

4515
03:32:13,829 --> 03:32:16,159
can table it for next

4516
03:32:16,159 --> 03:32:19,600
time because if you do go forward here and if it is denied

4517
03:32:19,600 --> 03:32:20,799
and you choose to go

4518
03:32:20,799 --> 03:32:24,930
to council that will require a supermajority vote and so I

4519
03:32:24,930 --> 03:32:25,600
'm not I'm

4520
03:32:25,600 --> 03:32:27,930
not sure you won't be able to bring it back again if

4521
03:32:27,930 --> 03:32:29,200
council denies it for one

4522
03:32:29,200 --> 03:32:35,180
year so this is something you need to consider our

4523
03:32:35,180 --> 03:32:37,000
preference would be to map

4524
03:32:37,000 --> 03:32:39,209
at the stipulations understanding that there's a lot of

4525
03:32:39,209 --> 03:32:40,079
moving parts and maybe

4526
03:32:40,079 --> 03:32:44,930
that's it's too much to do in one meeting tonight I mean if

4527
03:32:44,930 --> 03:32:45,920
there's a list

4528
03:32:45,920 --> 03:32:49,940
of those issues that we can work out quickly and then and

4529
03:32:49,940 --> 03:32:51,280
hopefully be back

4530
03:32:51,280 --> 03:32:53,799
in front of you all very soon that's our overwhelming

4531
03:32:53,799 --> 03:32:55,040
preference again to announce

4532
03:32:55,040 --> 03:32:58,159
the obvious and the interest in moving forward but if we

4533
03:32:58,159 --> 03:32:59,319
can come up with a

4534
03:32:59,319 --> 03:33:02,680
handful of what would create that kind of confidence I

4535
03:33:02,680 --> 03:33:04,200
guess knowing how much

4536
03:33:04,200 --> 03:33:07,840
is going to be enough to create that's going to be the

4537
03:33:07,840 --> 03:33:09,760
battle but but for a handful of

4538
03:33:09,760 --> 03:33:12,219
controls that built in and would be part of this detail

4539
03:33:12,219 --> 03:33:13,559
plan amendment so what in

4540
03:33:13,559 --> 03:33:19,420
itself on the zoning level protection so I think I'm sorry

4541
03:33:19,420 --> 03:33:20,760
I just want to mention

4542
03:33:20,760 --> 03:33:24,729
that another option would be to just give the requirements

4543
03:33:24,729 --> 03:33:26,600
or sort of outline

4544
03:33:26,600 --> 03:33:30,430
exactly what we're looking for and delegate it to staff to

4545
03:33:30,430 --> 03:33:31,440
make sure that

4546
03:33:31,440 --> 03:33:35,610
the plan is compliant before taking it to council as your

4547
03:33:35,610 --> 03:33:37,680
recommendation so I

4548
03:33:37,680 --> 03:33:41,120
think I think I've thrown out my kind of my few that I've

4549
03:33:41,120 --> 03:33:42,600
thought of on the spot

4550
03:33:42,600 --> 03:33:44,850
up here so I don't know if the rest of the Commission would

4551
03:33:44,850 --> 03:33:45,840
weigh in on what

4552
03:33:45,840 --> 03:33:50,000
they think about something like that thank you thank you

4553
03:33:50,000 --> 03:33:51,000
for your comments

4554
03:33:51,000 --> 03:33:54,209
that I think we're going to do that and try if possible to

4555
03:33:54,209 --> 03:33:55,280
move this forward

4556
03:33:55,280 --> 03:34:00,239
this even I would agree that in the past it has not gone

4557
03:34:00,239 --> 03:34:02,159
well when we add a little

4558
03:34:02,159 --> 03:34:05,559
bit here from the dais I think it's always best to get back

4559
03:34:05,559 --> 03:34:06,399
to staff and

4560
03:34:06,399 --> 03:34:09,559
with the applicant and then bring something either back or

4561
03:34:09,559 --> 03:34:10,260
taking on to

4562
03:34:10,260 --> 03:34:12,950
City Council with those things addressed versus us trying

4563
03:34:12,950 --> 03:34:15,120
to add limit here so I

4564
03:34:15,120 --> 03:34:21,000
would concur with that Commissioner Roselle thank you and I

4565
03:34:21,000 --> 03:34:21,600
appreciate that

4566
03:34:21,600 --> 03:34:24,719
conversation some of what y'all have just been talking

4567
03:34:24,719 --> 03:34:25,280
about and I might

4568
03:34:25,280 --> 03:34:28,360
negate some of the points are down but for the purpose of

4569
03:34:28,360 --> 03:34:29,920
this conversation I

4570
03:34:29,920 --> 03:34:32,430
was just going to throw out my thoughts some of them concur

4571
03:34:32,430 --> 03:34:33,360
with you some of them

4572
03:34:33,360 --> 03:34:38,370
do not so in the past we actually recently had this where

4573
03:34:38,370 --> 03:34:38,920
we tabled

4574
03:34:38,920 --> 03:34:41,389
something because we didn't want to get we didn't want to

4575
03:34:41,389 --> 03:34:43,520
mess it up and I think

4576
03:34:43,520 --> 03:34:47,590
in the PD or the MPC case we I feel more comfortable with a

4577
03:34:47,590 --> 03:34:49,600
broader stroke in

4578
03:34:49,600 --> 03:34:54,340
terms of limits just because of the flexibility we have so

4579
03:34:54,340 --> 03:34:56,200
so my thoughts

4580
03:34:56,200 --> 03:35:00,010
and what I wasn't saying I'll go ahead and say now is to

4581
03:35:00,010 --> 03:35:01,639
motion approval for

4582
03:35:01,639 --> 03:35:04,719
this and I had I came up with three conditions that I would

4583
03:35:04,719 --> 03:35:05,440
be okay seeing

4584
03:35:05,440 --> 03:35:12,750
one would be to reduce the overall number so 1200 to 600

4585
03:35:12,750 --> 03:35:14,479
cut in half off

4586
03:35:14,479 --> 03:35:18,149
the top to reassure some of the residents that there's not

4587
03:35:18,149 --> 03:35:18,959
going to be a

4588
03:35:18,959 --> 03:35:22,440
flood of villas the next couple years the second is to

4589
03:35:22,440 --> 03:35:23,680
require cluster

4590
03:35:23,680 --> 03:35:28,659
development so there's not a one-off house or Villa put in

4591
03:35:28,659 --> 03:35:30,559
place or in the

4592
03:35:30,559 --> 03:35:33,260
current homes there's a fire something not have a Villa put

4593
03:35:33,260 --> 03:35:34,159
back into an empty

4594
03:35:34,159 --> 03:35:37,319
lot and the third is to require some sort of buffer in

4595
03:35:37,319 --> 03:35:38,680
between the clustered

4596
03:35:38,680 --> 03:35:43,799
villas and the the current homes so that there is either it

4597
03:35:43,799 --> 03:35:44,760
's a street buffer or

4598
03:35:44,760 --> 03:35:47,569
how it may work out so that there is another protection

4599
03:35:47,569 --> 03:35:48,440
because I'm certainly

4600
03:35:48,440 --> 03:35:52,700
hearing the concerns of the citizens that I've heard about

4601
03:35:52,700 --> 03:35:53,959
not wanting them

4602
03:35:53,959 --> 03:35:55,909
or their fears about it but I've also heard only

4603
03:35:55,909 --> 03:35:56,920
compliments about the

4604
03:35:56,920 --> 03:35:59,010
development and it sounds like some people actually want to

4605
03:35:59,010 --> 03:35:59,559
get into Villa

4606
03:35:59,559 --> 03:36:03,639
really soon and so I'm hearing that I'm hearing that as

4607
03:36:03,639 --> 03:36:04,959
well and so for those

4608
03:36:04,959 --> 03:36:08,319
reasons I would like to see this move forward and if there

4609
03:36:08,319 --> 03:36:09,319
's a way that so at

4610
03:36:09,319 --> 03:36:12,290
600 there would be if this is a booming thing he would have

4611
03:36:12,290 --> 03:36:13,239
to come back to get

4612
03:36:13,239 --> 03:36:16,149
to get more they would have to come back to get more and so

4613
03:36:16,149 --> 03:36:17,200
it kind of puts a

4614
03:36:17,200 --> 03:36:21,270
stopgap measure in the pace of these being built but also

4615
03:36:21,270 --> 03:36:22,420
addresses in my

4616
03:36:22,420 --> 03:36:26,770
estimation to make sure they're in clusters with a buffer

4617
03:36:26,770 --> 03:36:28,319
alleviates some

4618
03:36:28,319 --> 03:36:33,790
of the fear of this interspersed meant or blending that I

4619
03:36:33,790 --> 03:36:35,079
've heard and so I

4620
03:36:35,079 --> 03:36:37,510
would be in favor of going ahead and move this forward and

4621
03:36:37,510 --> 03:36:38,319
it sounds like we

4622
03:36:38,319 --> 03:36:41,010
could put conditions that staff could verify before council

4623
03:36:41,010 --> 03:36:41,719
votes on it which

4624
03:36:41,719 --> 03:36:45,540
if there is a way to make sure we have our ducks in room we

4625
03:36:45,540 --> 03:36:47,440
vote I'm for that

4626
03:36:47,440 --> 03:36:49,739
so that's that's where I am I'd like to see this move

4627
03:36:49,739 --> 03:36:50,719
forward if it's all

4628
03:36:50,719 --> 03:36:55,959
possible Commissioner back thank you chair and I agree with

4629
03:36:55,959 --> 03:36:56,840
Commissioner

4630
03:36:56,840 --> 03:37:00,739
Roselle I think those are three grand ideas but I still

4631
03:37:00,739 --> 03:37:02,559
would prefer to table

4632
03:37:02,559 --> 03:37:07,170
it mainly just to give at least the residents out there

4633
03:37:07,170 --> 03:37:08,000
time to hear a little

4634
03:37:08,000 --> 03:37:13,909
bit more on that I don't see is there any reason why we can

4635
03:37:13,909 --> 03:37:14,840
't get back on this

4636
03:37:14,840 --> 03:37:22,000
in four to six weeks table it for now and get back on it

4637
03:37:22,000 --> 03:37:22,760
four to six weeks

4638
03:37:22,760 --> 03:37:27,459
given the developer time to meet this crime the criteria

4639
03:37:27,459 --> 03:37:28,920
that we set forth to

4640
03:37:28,920 --> 03:37:34,120
work with the staff and also give residents an opportunity

4641
03:37:34,120 --> 03:37:34,600
to you know

4642
03:37:34,600 --> 03:37:37,290
express our concerns more fully and get a better

4643
03:37:37,290 --> 03:37:39,079
understanding what's going to

4644
03:37:39,079 --> 03:37:41,520
be happening here we certainly want to work with the

4645
03:37:41,520 --> 03:37:43,319
residents and inform all

4646
03:37:43,319 --> 03:37:45,799
of our residents and let them know what's going on we in

4647
03:37:45,799 --> 03:37:47,399
the interest of continuing

4648
03:37:47,399 --> 03:37:53,020
forward we would very much appreciate additional controls

4649
03:37:53,020 --> 03:37:54,680
put in place and move

4650
03:37:54,680 --> 03:37:57,840
forward and also we do that and work with staff ahead of

4651
03:37:57,840 --> 03:37:59,799
council and have

4652
03:37:59,799 --> 03:38:02,729
another maybe community meeting and get more word around

4653
03:38:02,729 --> 03:38:03,959
the to our residents in

4654
03:38:03,959 --> 03:38:07,790
the meantime would be our vast preference okay if there's a

4655
03:38:07,790 --> 03:38:08,319
way to head

4656
03:38:08,319 --> 03:38:11,770
in that direction then I would move that we do table the

4657
03:38:11,770 --> 03:38:13,440
item for four to six

4658
03:38:13,440 --> 03:38:17,190
weeks and let's consider these stipulations get the staff

4659
03:38:17,190 --> 03:38:18,079
to work on it

4660
03:38:18,079 --> 03:38:21,639
and at least open an opportunity for the developer and the

4661
03:38:21,639 --> 03:38:22,959
residents out of ropes

4662
03:38:22,959 --> 03:38:26,290
and ranch to discuss this a little bit more thoroughly what

4663
03:38:26,290 --> 03:38:27,879
sorry can I say one

4664
03:38:27,879 --> 03:38:30,110
more thing would be possible to include that as one of the

4665
03:38:30,110 --> 03:38:31,760
conditions rather

4666
03:38:31,760 --> 03:38:36,290
than table it have a vote include additional some kind of

4667
03:38:36,290 --> 03:38:37,159
additional step

4668
03:38:37,159 --> 03:38:40,610
to be taken ahead of council in order to have a vote

4669
03:38:40,610 --> 03:38:42,200
tonight and move ahead

4670
03:38:42,200 --> 03:38:45,719
with additional community involvement motion would be to

4671
03:38:45,719 --> 03:38:46,479
table it for now and

4672
03:38:46,479 --> 03:38:50,079
work through it I'm sorry is that to table indefinitely or

4673
03:38:50,079 --> 03:38:51,959
let's let's set a

4674
03:38:51,959 --> 03:38:57,149
time frame in as quickly as possible yeah we have we have a

4675
03:38:57,149 --> 03:38:58,040
motion on the

4676
03:38:58,040 --> 03:39:04,270
floor now to table for four weeks four weeks that restating

4677
03:39:04,270 --> 03:39:05,180
your motion

4678
03:39:05,180 --> 03:39:11,909
correctly yes okay we have a motion for table for four

4679
03:39:11,909 --> 03:39:15,159
weeks Commissioner Taylor

4680
03:39:15,159 --> 03:39:22,799
reflected on the board yes second okay so to comment I I

4681
03:39:22,799 --> 03:39:24,079
know that you're in

4682
03:39:24,079 --> 03:39:27,149
hurry and I know that you need to get going and there's a

4683
03:39:27,149 --> 03:39:28,559
financial incentive

4684
03:39:28,559 --> 03:39:31,700
and you know and just in there are a lot of reasons why

4685
03:39:31,700 --> 03:39:33,040
that you want to move

4686
03:39:33,040 --> 03:39:37,069
forward as quickly as possible I just worry about being

4687
03:39:37,069 --> 03:39:38,280
able to get everything

4688
03:39:38,280 --> 03:39:41,889
bundled together between now and City Council I'd like us

4689
03:39:41,889 --> 03:39:42,959
to have one more

4690
03:39:42,959 --> 03:39:46,719
look at it and I'd like it to be completely finished before

4691
03:39:46,719 --> 03:39:47,079
it you know

4692
03:39:47,079 --> 03:39:50,079
before it leaves here or at least two very minor details

4693
03:39:50,079 --> 03:39:51,280
that will be corrected

4694
03:39:51,280 --> 03:39:54,360
before City Council and I think we are looking at a to

4695
03:39:54,360 --> 03:39:55,120
define how a

4696
03:39:55,120 --> 03:39:58,079
neighborhood like facing buffers you know is a street of

4697
03:39:58,079 --> 03:39:59,120
buffers an alley of

4698
03:39:59,120 --> 03:40:02,549
buffers back fence is that acceptable you know those kinds

4699
03:40:02,549 --> 03:40:04,840
of things I I think

4700
03:40:04,840 --> 03:40:08,120
it would be more appropriate for us to see it so that's why

4701
03:40:08,120 --> 03:40:10,440
I second we have a

4702
03:40:10,440 --> 03:40:15,319
first and a second any Commissioner husband so on the

4703
03:40:15,319 --> 03:40:19,850
discussion side of things four weeks puts you into

4704
03:40:19,850 --> 03:40:22,159
Thanksgiving and I just I

4705
03:40:22,159 --> 03:40:26,090
don't think that's very considerate I think staff is fully

4706
03:40:26,090 --> 03:40:27,200
capable and brings

4707
03:40:27,200 --> 03:40:33,739
us quality analysis and data each and every week so for me

4708
03:40:33,739 --> 03:40:34,520
personally I think

4709
03:40:34,520 --> 03:40:39,049
it's to define these two three bullet points I think

4710
03:40:39,049 --> 03:40:40,479
Commissioner Taylor had

4711
03:40:40,479 --> 03:40:47,020
some numbers that fit the 50 80 range and then that allows

4712
03:40:47,020 --> 03:40:48,840
Todd to go back to

4713
03:40:48,840 --> 03:40:55,760
his his chain of command if you will or his his co-workers

4714
03:40:55,760 --> 03:40:57,000
and develop a plan

4715
03:40:57,000 --> 03:41:01,000
works and it's efficient and staff can meet with them daily

4716
03:41:01,000 --> 03:41:02,280
can meet with them

4717
03:41:02,280 --> 03:41:05,399
send emails back and forth without having to worry about

4718
03:41:05,399 --> 03:41:06,840
notifications and

4719
03:41:06,840 --> 03:41:11,370
postings and it just really adds an extra layer that

4720
03:41:11,370 --> 03:41:13,799
probably slows a project

4721
03:41:13,799 --> 03:41:17,920
more than helps let me call on staff and ask them what they

4722
03:41:17,920 --> 03:41:18,479
feel like their

4723
03:41:18,479 --> 03:41:22,620
capability is to get their hands around this and get and

4724
03:41:22,620 --> 03:41:24,120
get it put in a format

4725
03:41:24,120 --> 03:41:27,610
to bring it back sure and and just as a point for the

4726
03:41:27,610 --> 03:41:31,200
record the next P&Z

4727
03:41:31,200 --> 03:41:35,219
meeting within the four-week period would be November 9th

4728
03:41:35,219 --> 03:41:36,440
after the four

4729
03:41:36,440 --> 03:41:39,819
week period would be November 9th that would be the fourth

4730
03:41:39,819 --> 03:41:41,479
week we don't meet

4731
03:41:41,479 --> 03:41:46,120
on the 16th and then it's Thanksgiving calendar I can't

4732
03:41:46,120 --> 03:41:51,319
hear you what early

4733
03:41:51,319 --> 03:41:56,329
December and maybe do a special called but if I recall when

4734
03:41:56,329 --> 03:41:57,559
we set our P&Z

4735
03:41:57,559 --> 03:42:02,760
calendar we skipped the meeting before Thanksgiving we

4736
03:42:02,760 --> 03:42:04,200
could certainly do a

4737
03:42:04,200 --> 03:42:07,000
special call if that's what we needed to do to deal with

4738
03:42:07,000 --> 03:42:08,200
this issue and anything

4739
03:42:08,200 --> 03:42:11,690
else that came forward we have November 9th we have

4740
03:42:11,690 --> 03:42:15,479
November 30th and December

4741
03:42:15,479 --> 03:42:26,280
14th I think maybe a little bit too fast I'm thinking early

4742
03:42:26,280 --> 03:42:27,840
December just because

4743
03:42:27,840 --> 03:42:31,200
we have the move to deal with it is true we are moving

4744
03:42:31,200 --> 03:42:34,680
offices yeah if I may

4745
03:42:34,680 --> 03:42:40,909
Commissioner Husband yeah I it adds an extra layer that we

4746
03:42:40,909 --> 03:42:41,879
don't need I mean as

4747
03:42:41,879 --> 03:42:45,520
far as the the the ability for them to talk every day and

4748
03:42:45,520 --> 03:42:46,840
get meetings done

4749
03:42:46,840 --> 03:42:50,229
every day and emails every day versus having a post a

4750
03:42:50,229 --> 03:42:51,959
meeting come back here I

4751
03:42:51,959 --> 03:42:57,479
think is is cumbersome unnecessarily I mean we'll see we'll

4752
03:42:57,479 --> 03:42:57,879
see how the vote

4753
03:42:57,879 --> 03:43:02,959
shakes out it'll be interesting okay

4754
03:43:02,959 --> 03:43:14,520
I understand okay so what I heard from staff is four weeks

4755
03:43:14,520 --> 03:43:15,360
is gonna be tough

4756
03:43:15,360 --> 03:43:19,170
for them but that's the motion that we have and so we we

4757
03:43:19,170 --> 03:43:20,479
have a first and a

4758
03:43:20,479 --> 03:43:25,739
second and have it on the board Commissioner Sullivan we

4759
03:43:25,739 --> 03:43:27,879
voting to table

4760
03:43:27,879 --> 03:43:33,200
or we voting for somebody to come back at a later date it's

4761
03:43:33,200 --> 03:43:34,079
a it's a motion for

4762
03:43:34,079 --> 03:43:38,360
postponement until November the 9th and let me just make

4763
03:43:38,360 --> 03:43:39,840
the comment I'm all in

4764
03:43:39,840 --> 03:43:44,530
favor of the villains I think they're great but I would I'm

4765
03:43:44,530 --> 03:43:45,440
not gonna be

4766
03:43:45,440 --> 03:43:48,559
comfortable with anything less than where are they gonna be

4767
03:43:48,559 --> 03:43:49,479
so that future

4768
03:43:49,479 --> 03:43:53,360
people know exactly what they're buying into the idea that

4769
03:43:53,360 --> 03:43:57,159
it's 600 somewhere

4770
03:43:57,159 --> 03:44:01,159
personally it's not gonna fly I think that we need to know

4771
03:44:01,159 --> 03:44:02,239
we know where the

4772
03:44:02,239 --> 03:44:05,209
golf course is gonna be and it all has drainage and

4773
03:44:05,209 --> 03:44:06,959
everything along with it so

4774
03:44:06,959 --> 03:44:10,469
I think that asking for detailed where are these places

4775
03:44:10,469 --> 03:44:12,840
gonna be is the minimum

4776
03:44:12,840 --> 03:44:20,520
so just FYI guess Commissioner back thank you chair so am I

4777
03:44:20,520 --> 03:44:22,319
hearing staff

4778
03:44:22,319 --> 03:44:25,620
right then that four weeks is not gonna be enough time and

4779
03:44:25,620 --> 03:44:26,559
I maybe need to

4780
03:44:26,559 --> 03:44:36,120
change my motion and properly vet that change okay

4781
03:44:36,120 --> 03:44:40,649
how much time is sufficient step staff is moving to a new

4782
03:44:40,649 --> 03:44:41,319
location that's

4783
03:44:41,319 --> 03:44:44,120
I think Chandrion has a December and the only meeting we

4784
03:44:44,120 --> 03:44:45,639
have is December 14th I

4785
03:44:45,639 --> 03:44:49,850
believe December the rest of it because of the holiday has

4786
03:44:49,850 --> 03:44:51,079
been canceled okay

4787
03:44:51,079 --> 03:44:59,479
so we're looking at December 14th is that correct yes I

4788
03:44:59,479 --> 03:45:00,920
have November 9th

4789
03:45:00,920 --> 03:45:05,760
November 30th and December 14th is that correct

4790
03:45:05,760 --> 03:45:14,889
so it's thanks getting you know I'm trying to compromise

4791
03:45:14,889 --> 03:45:17,079
here could we do it

4792
03:45:17,079 --> 03:45:24,680
on the 30th is that is that a stretch I mean we have a

4793
03:45:24,680 --> 03:45:28,000
motion we have a second

4794
03:45:28,000 --> 03:45:31,459
can we vote on that before give for we get too far I mean

4795
03:45:31,459 --> 03:45:32,159
we're comparing

4796
03:45:32,159 --> 03:45:36,819
schedules we're changing the date we're you know bouncing

4797
03:45:36,819 --> 03:45:38,399
around new dates my

4798
03:45:38,399 --> 03:45:42,079
mind but I'm just trying to firm up my motion but it's

4799
03:45:42,079 --> 03:45:43,840
already been seconded

4800
03:45:43,840 --> 03:45:47,680
we have a friendly amendment that's what I was getting

4801
03:45:47,680 --> 03:45:48,760
ready to give you the

4802
03:45:48,760 --> 03:45:52,770
opportunities is to make sure that staff could get this

4803
03:45:52,770 --> 03:45:54,399
done so we don't have to

4804
03:45:54,399 --> 03:45:58,319
continue it again so when I was trying to get some feedback

4805
03:45:58,319 --> 03:45:59,479
as to when this

4806
03:45:59,479 --> 03:46:04,159
could get done so I make a motion we tell you well this

4807
03:46:04,159 --> 03:46:05,799
until November 30th

4808
03:46:05,799 --> 03:46:14,479
and we've got a first and a second for the 30th of November

4809
03:46:14,479 --> 03:46:15,639
the night so

4810
03:46:15,639 --> 03:46:22,440
November the 30th it is that's first a second yes okay

4811
03:46:22,440 --> 03:46:31,090
Commissioner Taylor did so I'm a comment my concern is very

4812
03:46:31,090 --> 03:46:32,159
similar to

4813
03:46:32,159 --> 03:46:36,899
Commissioner Taylor's it's the mix-mash without some

4814
03:46:36,899 --> 03:46:39,360
definition I think that

4815
03:46:39,360 --> 03:46:42,450
gives a lot of the homeowners some certainty and I think

4816
03:46:42,450 --> 03:46:43,520
the Villa product

4817
03:46:43,520 --> 03:46:47,319
is a great product it's obviously been received well it's

4818
03:46:47,319 --> 03:46:48,840
just the carte blanche

4819
03:46:48,840 --> 03:46:51,379
you can kind of do whatever you want to do is where I have

4820
03:46:51,379 --> 03:46:52,520
a problem with it so

4821
03:46:52,520 --> 03:46:55,670
whether that's having to go to the extreme of actually

4822
03:46:55,670 --> 03:46:56,799
designating it and

4823
03:46:56,799 --> 03:46:59,260
do not the design work or whether it's done with some

4824
03:46:59,260 --> 03:47:00,600
parameters which I think

4825
03:47:00,600 --> 03:47:07,200
is a good suggestion that's the direction that I would be

4826
03:47:07,200 --> 03:47:09,280
in favor of to

4827
03:47:09,280 --> 03:47:13,629
try to provide additional villas and yet provide existing

4828
03:47:13,629 --> 03:47:15,200
residents some comfort

4829
03:47:15,200 --> 03:47:19,639
that it's not gonna be right next door and some of that so

4830
03:47:19,639 --> 03:47:21,079
I hope that gives

4831
03:47:21,079 --> 03:47:25,639
you some direction from I guess each Commissioner here on

4832
03:47:25,639 --> 03:47:26,719
what they're

4833
03:47:26,719 --> 03:47:32,600
looking for I personally am okay in moving this forward

4834
03:47:32,600 --> 03:47:33,879
with some of those

4835
03:47:33,879 --> 03:47:36,659
criteria I don't know if that can get worked out between

4836
03:47:36,659 --> 03:47:37,600
now and when it would

4837
03:47:37,600 --> 03:47:40,629
go before City Council or not when would this one is this

4838
03:47:40,629 --> 03:47:41,760
currently scheduled to

4839
03:47:41,760 --> 03:47:51,000
go before City Council okay well we have a first and a

4840
03:47:51,000 --> 03:47:52,360
second on the board it

4841
03:47:52,360 --> 03:48:00,280
looks like Commissioner Rizzo this clarification it's on

4842
03:48:00,280 --> 03:48:01,799
the agenda for City

4843
03:48:01,799 --> 03:48:05,290
Council number first is that correct yes sir can it be can

4844
03:48:05,290 --> 03:48:06,440
that agenda item be

4845
03:48:06,440 --> 03:48:11,479
bumped two weeks if they if staff and applicant needed more

4846
03:48:11,479 --> 03:48:13,360
time potentially

4847
03:48:13,360 --> 03:48:21,409
we would just have to republish it it would have to be rep

4848
03:48:21,409 --> 03:48:23,399
ublished yes thank you okay

4849
03:48:23,399 --> 03:48:27,379
so nobody else on more any other discussion before I call

4850
03:48:27,379 --> 03:48:28,280
for a vote on

4851
03:48:28,280 --> 03:48:34,889
the board seeing no call for a vote on the board and the

4852
03:48:34,889 --> 03:48:35,879
motion is going to be

4853
03:48:35,879 --> 03:48:41,120
to continue to a date certain of November the 30th and if

4854
03:48:41,120 --> 03:48:41,920
that motion

4855
03:48:41,920 --> 03:48:46,260
fails and we will look for a new motion to look at moving

4856
03:48:46,260 --> 03:48:48,000
on to some direction

4857
03:48:48,000 --> 03:49:02,680
to City Council motion carries four three to continue to

4858
03:49:02,680 --> 03:49:05,799
November the 30th

4859
03:49:09,040 --> 03:49:12,469
well thank you everybody for a very good discussion on this

4860
03:49:12,469 --> 03:49:13,399
item and all the

4861
03:49:13,399 --> 03:49:16,520
folks that have come out this evening and provided some

4862
03:49:16,520 --> 03:49:18,520
input and our hope is

4863
03:49:18,520 --> 03:49:21,659
a commission here over the next several weeks that some of

4864
03:49:21,659 --> 03:49:22,840
the concerns can get

4865
03:49:22,840 --> 03:49:25,600
addressed and then this can be brought back before us again

4866
03:49:25,600 --> 03:49:30,280
you bet thank you

4867
03:49:30,520 --> 03:49:35,389
that will move us to our final item this evening our

4868
03:49:35,389 --> 03:49:36,879
project matrix and

4869
03:49:36,879 --> 03:49:39,639
concluding items

4870
03:49:52,159 --> 03:50:00,879
does anybody have any requests for the matrix update none

4871
03:50:00,879 --> 03:50:01,680
that Commissioner

4872
03:50:01,680 --> 03:50:06,420
Ellis I do and I don't know if this is for the matrix or if

4873
03:50:06,420 --> 03:50:06,840
this is maybe

4874
03:50:06,840 --> 03:50:10,760
just for me sitting new here but it was on my mind since

4875
03:50:10,760 --> 03:50:13,440
last meeting I want to

4876
03:50:13,440 --> 03:50:17,120
be briefed on how this city determines if a traffic study

4877
03:50:17,120 --> 03:50:18,959
is needed okay is

4878
03:50:18,959 --> 03:50:23,219
there a way to to to maybe have that discussion we actually

4879
03:50:23,219 --> 03:50:23,639
do have

4880
03:50:23,639 --> 03:50:26,610
requirements and if Earl do you have a second to come and

4881
03:50:26,610 --> 03:50:27,799
address the question

4882
03:50:27,799 --> 03:50:32,479
we can't do that because it's not currently on the agenda

4883
03:50:32,479 --> 03:50:34,520
okay so we we

4884
03:50:34,520 --> 03:50:37,049
can get you that information but let's do this let's put it

4885
03:50:37,049 --> 03:50:38,399
on the request and

4886
03:50:38,399 --> 03:50:41,639
then after me you can get with Earl and if by chance he can

4887
03:50:41,639 --> 03:50:42,520
address your

4888
03:50:42,520 --> 03:50:45,479
question individually then we'll just say it's taken care

4889
03:50:45,479 --> 03:50:46,399
of and if not then

4890
03:50:46,399 --> 03:50:49,399
we'll do a full presentation at work session that'd be

4891
03:50:49,399 --> 03:50:53,280
satisfactory okay any

4892
03:50:53,280 --> 03:51:00,139
other items for the matrix I just have a comment I had to

4893
03:51:00,139 --> 03:51:02,840
ask for a update on the

4894
03:51:02,840 --> 03:51:10,840
Luke 28 and I 35 project with text on and I really

4895
03:51:10,840 --> 03:51:12,000
appreciated the timeliness

4896
03:51:12,000 --> 03:51:16,530
of the report that was sent out to update us and the only

4897
03:51:16,530 --> 03:51:17,920
follow-up that I

4898
03:51:17,920 --> 03:51:22,479
would have to that would be on May Hill to find out if

4899
03:51:22,479 --> 03:51:24,399
there is any work that's

4900
03:51:24,399 --> 03:51:28,600
planned or currently going on with the overpass at May Hill

4901
03:51:28,600 --> 03:51:30,479
being that 2499 is

4902
03:51:30,479 --> 03:51:33,649
currently being extended into that and looks like we're

4903
03:51:33,649 --> 03:51:35,280
just moving Luke 288

4904
03:51:35,280 --> 03:51:40,899
just down one little farther south and if may Hill can get

4905
03:51:40,899 --> 03:51:42,879
on the radar so it's

4906
03:51:42,879 --> 03:51:47,479
not a it's the next bottleneck in the city for the foresee

4907
03:51:47,479 --> 03:51:48,760
able future okay

4908
03:51:48,760 --> 03:51:54,959
thank you I really appreciate the report okay thank you

4909
03:51:54,959 --> 03:51:58,799
anybody else okay with

4910
03:51:58,799 --> 03:52:03,370
that I'm going to close our meeting at 908 thank you

4911
03:52:03,370 --> 03:52:04,760
everyone