Jun 05, 2018 City Council on 2018-06-05 12:00 PM

Welcome everybody to this meeting of the Denton City Council on Tuesday, June 5, 2018. We do have everyone here, so we have a quorum. It is 12 noon. We'll move through our work session agenda item beginning with agenda item one, citizen comment on consented items. We do have a blue card. Mr. Robert Donley speaking on consent agenda item 4J. If you'll come, state your name and address. Your time will begin. My name is Robert Donley. I live at 3900 Quail Creek Road, Denton, Texas. And I'm here to say that item 4J is a bad decision and should not be done until an approved route is selected and approved by the City Council as an alternative. This item is not a $467,000 decrease. It's a $19 million increase to the project. If you pass this, the Mayhill Road project will stop just north of my neighbor's driveway, leaving almost half a mile of no project. Staff has only provided a questionable sketch done, I assume, last week with some lines on it that show possible routes and maybe routes, and those have even changed, and possible ways you can connect the two loose ends you're going to create by canceling this part of the project. To pass this without an approved route to finish the project would border on negligence on your part. You end up with a $57 million project that you either can't use or creates two bottlenecks for years and years to come. This less than $4 million project has already taken eight years, and no semen has been poured for a roadway to date. By resetting the limit of the project with no approved route, it could be another eight years, and the people of Denton deserve better than that. You need a way this is going to end. Just put the horse in front of the cart, get you an approved route, and once you have it and it's nailed down, then cancel this part of the project. But to do so, I mean, that's the only sensible, logical, and responsible thing to do. I mean, to do a 3.9-mile project, which is what the Mayhill Road project is, you have to -- you can't have a plan for a 3.5-mile project, and if you cancel this, you have no plan beyond that. I'll be happy to answer any questions you might have if I 've said things you don't understand. >> Any questions, comments? Okay. Thank you very much. >> Thank you, Mr. Donnelly. Okay. The next agenda item is request for clarification of agenda items listed for today's agenda. Councilmember Briggs? >> So I have a few. I've already gotten clarification on one, but -- so I want to start with B, and there are a couple actually, B and P, on food concessions at the parks. On B, my question is, does this include Evers -- Evers baseball field concessions? >> Somebody hear that? Oh, okay. Sorry. >> Hi. Good afternoon, Mayor, Councilmembers. My name is Laura Behrens. I'm the Assistant Director for Parks and Recreation, and you were asking about item B, is that correct? >> Yes, it's going to be on the mega promotions. Yes, this includes -- actually, this is for our adult athletic. It does not include our youth sports. Those are still managed by the youth sports associations. >> Okay. Just for clarification on that. And also, since you're up here, may I go ahead and skip to P? It's the other concessions for the water park and the Civic Center pool. I know that the water park is a newer -- it's a new con cession, so those prices will just be what they are. But my concern is the Civic Center pool area. Do you know -- will those prices for those items be increasing with this contract? >> For the -- you know, for the lower -- well, for the main stay items, they will essentially be the same. It's going to be the added items at the new concession because we have the ability to offer more at the water park with the new concession stand. Those items -- not only will they be new, so the prices, you know, obviously are going to be a little bit different, but there will just be slight increases on some of the other items that were previously offered. >> At the Civic Center pool? >> At the water park. >> Okay, yeah. >> Right, because there's an expansion of the menu there. >> I'm not so concerned about the water park as I am the Civic Center pool. At the Civic Center pool, the prices will remain steady. >> Okay. So they're not going to be increased? >> There's not -- it's my understanding, and I can look at this again really quick, but there's not going to be a significant increase on those items there because we're not really expanding the menu there. >> Okay. >> Correct. >> I just wanted to clarify. >> Yes. >> Okay. Thank you very much. >> So to follow up on that, if you could maybe just verify that because I'd hate for you to say something and then all of a sudden if there's a penny change or that somehow -- so just -- yeah, just make sure we know for sure and then if something changes during the course of the season, then we can find that out. >> I will. Definitely. Thank you. >> Okay. Good. Yep. >> Okay. >> Anything else for parks? >> No. >> Does anybody have anything on a park question while Ms. Barons is up? Okay. No. >> Thanks. >> Thank you. Appreciate it. Okay. Thank you. The next one is F, the landfill. >> Afternoon. >> Hello. So as district 2 and the landfills in my district, I do receive quite a bit of calls on the smell at the landfill. >> Sure. >> And I assume that this purchase is to help contain the odor. >> It is. So my question is, are there any environmental issues with increasing the chemical here at the landfill? >> No, there's not. In fact, in your backup material, as we discussed with the public utilities board, we've included the safety data sheet. So we're actually going to be switching to what we would consider a better alternative from an environmental and health standpoint from what we've used in the past. It's 100% biodegradable. It's non-carcinogenic. It's actually safe for use in the food industry is what we 've learned as well. And so our use of the product, we essentially have a perimeter fence that disperses some vapor to knock down odors trying to escape the landfill. This will actually be used in our water trucks and some on- site vapor systems to suppress the odor at its source. >> Okay. Thank you. I would like to pull item J for a separate vote. >> Okay. >> Okay. My next -- >> Did you want any presentation on J? >> I don't really need one unless somebody else on the council needs one. Maybe our new council member would like a -- >> Yes, I would like to hear about item J in particular with regard to the points or the questions raised by the citizen. >> Okay. All right. Go ahead, council member. >> So L, I guess this would be for Carla or -- >> Or Scott. So I know that we do not have any maternity leave currently . And I know that when we talk about leave, it's the FMLA that we are allowed in the -- if somebody wants to take off, they use their sick time and vacation time. So I just want to make sure that passing this or removing this policy is not going to affect those individuals in any negative way to add more stress to what they may be going through. >> Hi. Passing this policy will not affect the FMLA. So they will still be entitled to those benefits. And if they have additional leave, again, we will consider that as an accommodation, additional vacation or sick that they can use. >> Okay. All right. Thank you. I think that's it. >> Okay. Anybody else? Request clarification. Yes. >> I would like to pull out item R just because some folks will follow the work session on that. But some won't and will only pay attention to the evening. So I'm sure the public will be interested in it. >> Okay. All right. Anything else? Yes. Council member Hatsbett. >> Question. What's the sidewalk list that staff sent me? Is that in the backup? Did I miss it? If not, I may want to just flash that just so people can see what's all in that just as it can be done here maybe. >> Which agenda item are you talking about? >> So that is -- I'm getting it. >> Okay. Is it K? >> Yes. >> All right. >> Good afternoon, mayor, council members. This is pre-Tem. Yes, the list is in the backup. It's exhibit A to the actual contract, second attachment. >> Got it. Okay. >> So I think it's buried somewhere under there. >> Very good. Okay. Thank you. >> Thank you. Anyone else? So I have that we're pulling agenda items J and R. And R is primarily -- staff presentation is not required. Just because it's not staff, it's being presented in the work session. You just wanted to have it on the boat. Or you wanting to have a whole other presentation? >> I think it could be a short version of it. But, yes, my point in asking for it to be pulled out is because I think the public is interested in the issue and would like to hear a little about it. I think it could be very brief. >> Okay. All right. Thank you. Anything else? All right. We'll move on then to agenda items three. Long set of agenda item work sessions. So first one is agenda item 3A. We just were talking about that. Receive report and hold discussion. Give staff direction regarding University of North Texas bike share pilot proposal and proposed interlocal agreement between the City of Denton and the University of North Texas. >> Good afternoon, Mayor, members of council. My name is Martin Nelson, director of transportation here with the City of Denton. We're visiting with you this afternoon regarding a pilot program in conjunction with University of North Texas as it relates to a bike share program. As you may recall earlier this year, council passed ordinance 18-277, which is a pilot in and of itself, is an ordinance establishing a pilot program for dockless or stationless bike share here in our community. Since that point in time, University of North Texas has approached City of Denton staff to see if there were an opportunity to look into a little more robust program. And so understanding that, here momentarily I'll ask that Dr. Alan Clark, associate vice president for information services and transportation come and provide a presentation. But as you stated, Mayor, there is a partner item on the consent agenda that has been pulled off for individual consideration. In front of you is a hard copy of that particular document, which is the interlocal agreement with the ordinance attached to it. In there we made a -- there was a nominal change to paragraph. It's actually section 3D, and it just has at the very end of that paragraph it's as amended. And so I can bring that up if you wish, but it's essentially outlining just in case it's here on page 4 of that document, essentially an add in case there's a change to that particular ordinance that the proposed UNT bike program follows that ordinance, and that ordinance is set to sunset in the September of 2018 timeframe. And as you'll see here momentarily with Dr. Clark's presentation, if approved, the UNT program would take a pilot program out to May of 2019, which would encompass the summer session, the fall semester, as well as the spring semester. So with that, I can come back once Dr. Clark's done presenting and help answer any questions that you have. Without any further ado, I'd like to ask Dr. Clark to come up and present this particular item. >> Thank you. I am very grateful for the opportunity to stand before you, and I appreciate the work that you do for the city. As an alumni for UNT and TWU, when I came here in 1995, there was around 23,000 students. This past year we got to 38,000 students. And so it's growing. When I was given the responsibility for transportation services about three years ago, the first thing that happened to me was we lost 1,200 spaces for construction. And so with that, we have to move from an idea of parking to an idea of transportation, transportation from outside the city, within the city, around the city, and within the university itself. And so with that, you know, we're excited with the idea of spikes being part of that transportation plan, because what is happening is the university is the -- where you have to come connect to the university is getting further and further away from the center of campus. The students are all parking now over across 35 over at Victory and by Apogee Stadium, and so they'll need to be able to commute coming over. Something to let you know is we have -- right now we have 73 parking lots. We have 15 resident halls. And so if we put a bike at each one of those locations, just one bike at each one of those locations, we're in the range of 84 bikes already. And so what we have been working -- and I'm very grateful to the city staff as they have helped us work through this. We're working to the point where we want to do a pilot that is 250 bikes. Something to be recognized is we were recognized as a bicycle-friendly university. That's one of six universities in the state of Texas. We received a bronze rating as far as a part of that. And part of that is because of the work that the city has done by giving us bicycle lanes that go through Highland that are going to go through Oak. And with that, we have started ourselves a program by which there is a committee of students that come together. Thank you to Councilmember Gregory's statement for letting us receive documentation that y'all have prepared for bike-friendly safety, and that is now part of our orientation session. So we have moved greatly in that area. What are we trying to fix by doing this? One, I introduced to you the idea that we're further out. So students are bringing their own bikes. And so we have around 1,100 bikes that are on campus. And as you can see, they're connected and tied to anything that's standing straight up. And so what we're wanting to do is to get to that point where we go tell parents, leave your bicycles at home. Let us provide a bicycle to you. The bicycle is there when you need it, but you don't have to keep up with it and keep it isolated to one individual. So through this bicycle share program, the first thing we 're wanting to do is to get rid of what you see over on your right-hand side of where bikes are just chained to anything that is there. We have about 150, it depends upon the year, about 150 to 200 of those bikes are abandoned. And we also have some problems with those bikes being in ways for ADA reasons as well, tripping hazards because they're sticking out into the concrete area for the walkway. With that, we are going through and trying to organize parking with the campus and the bicycles themselves. What is a bike share program? Well, it's a way for us to have students who can share inv itations for that bicycle. What we are suggesting at this point is that we would use Lyft as someone who handles the logistics on a daily basis. I'm sorry, not Lyft, SPIN. We're working with DCTA as well, I apologize. But work with SPIN to go through and handle the logistics every day. Go get bikes wherever they're dispersed, bring them back in at 7 o'clock that morning. Use the onboard GPS so we as staff can go in and make sure that that is taking place. And make sure that these bikes each day support what we're trying to do as a campus. The goals for the bike share program itself is to reduce the campus traffic inside the campus itself, move outward, have a bike culture that understands the safety of bikes and also understands the use of bikes among 38,000 students. Provide a community that gives alternate modes of transportation. Allow for congestion. How do we deal with that in itself? And have a healthy and reduce the carbon footprint associated with the campus itself. The bike share, as I stated, we're contracting with SPIN. We start out with a pilot for 100 bikes this summer. We've got to fill our way through this. Where we want to get to is in the fall, sometime in that time period, to 250 bikes where we're working with the resident halls and remote parking areas to have those bikes repositioned every day and to be able to come back. The ground operations for the insurance of the SPIN will be going through and following the ordinance. So will the University of North Texas. And making it accessible to the students that are on campus . SPIN will regroup the bikes by 7 o'clock each morning. How do we deal with the fact that we have bikes that we've seen other municipalities where it comes together? We feel like by this method, instead of people owning their own bike, we have the ability now to tell what bikes are used, where they're at, and where do we need them to be instead of just chained to a location and staying there. So we as staff members for the University will coordinate and work with SPIN if it's every morning that we have to do that to ensure that those bikes are in that location. Concerns. How will we collect additional data via social media, electronic data, and information captured from SPIN? We want to collect as much information as we possibly can on ridership, location of the bikes, commutes per day, individuals, number of individuals and how they're using the bikes as well. We share that information with the city and also share that information with TWU so we as a group look to see what the effect is on bikes themselves in the area and on campus. We want to have lessons learned and then come back after the pilot and say what do we do moving forward? Is that number 250 the right number for the Denton campus? Does it need to be more than that? Does it need to be less than that? So but we feel like we've got to work through this over the next year and so the interlocal agreement was devised so that we as UNT are working with the city of Denton and the ordinance that is there to be ensured that the insurance is there, the money is put up as a statement of good faith that we are going to do what we need to do and hopefully lessen the role of what the city has to do in the repositioning of those bikes. So anyway, I quickly went through this. I welcome any questions that you have about what we're trying to do, how we're working to get this done and so I will hush and let y'all bring forth the questions. Councilmember Briggs and Councilmember Gregory and Council member Hutsbeth. I have just a few. So what would the cost of service be to the students? We the University of North Texas are going to pay for the cost of the service for the students so they will have to register so we know who is using the bike, what shape they leave the bike, where they leave the bike, but the cost itself will be carried by the University of North Texas. So it'll be free for them and so I'm assuming this is for internal use of the campus generally. I mean that's what the idea is for. That's correct and to set a geo fence around what we say the campus is and so when we go take that seven o'clock look, it's anything outside that geo fence that is part of the University of North Texas campus. Because when under the parameters and requirement because it says outside or in the city of Denton and so there are many city owned streets through your campus and so when you define city it's not necessarily outside of campus since we have the streets and right away within UNT. So what I hear you saying is that there will more be a boundary that when those bikes are out of not necessarily that that will be by seven o'clock removed. That is correct and you're exactly right. That's why we felt like we needed to go do this interlocal agreement. If they step on that bike and get on the street they're in the city of Denton. And riding on the city of Denton transportation ways and so that was the beginning from when we started and met with Mark and his staff. How do we manage that with and we know we're going to have to have more than a hundred bikes and part of that is going to be through the thorough fare of the University itself but also the city and so we want to gather information as a part of that but you are correct. We're talking about a geo fence boundary and those bikes would stay within that perimeter. Okay thank you. That's my Gregory. V-bikes has been gone for a couple of months and apparently the technology that they used to locate their bikes was not sufficient because there are still V-bikes around town. And they seem to not be able to locate them. So my question is in the repositioning of bikes and rebal ancing of bikes what do you know about Spence ability to accurately locate a bike that might have been left on the courthouse lawn or at the Quaker Town Park so that it could be found within a close proximity and then repositioned back on campus. So our discovery in that process was okay how close can you come to where that bike is and our discussion with Spence was that they within nine feet of what that says on the GIS information to where that's at and we found we felt like we can at least find it within nine feet. So that's what we're working on and if that's not the case then we've got a problem. I hope it works because having a bike share program in town is important and I think that this is a great way to test it out. Clearly the ordinance that we wrote is somewhat lacking since it scared people off and nobody else wanted to come. Councilmember Hesford. Thank you. Thank you for a great presentation. If you could go back to the slide where the bikes were kind of scattered about. You bet. That'll help. Okay great and so I'll get to that. Initially out of the gate can you walk me through how you envision the 7 a.m. rebalancing. So obviously it's not all simultaneous so they'll start let 's say at 5.30, 6 and they start working their magic. Let's say someone takes it before they finish at 7 and ride off. How do you kind of what at what point are you saying okay all present and accounted for. Ordinance calls for a number so I'm assuming they'll be numbered and you're able to kind of get a snapshot in time and say okay done. I just want to understand how that 7 a.m. works and the accountability of that. There's kind of different programs when you get into bike share. Some are freestanding and some are within a low cow or a locker that they need to be in and you have students ride to from lawn locker to the other locker. This is kind of a modified process in this. We are going to expect let's say by Fouts Field that parking lot is going to need several of the bikes to be there. We will have a designated lot secured area where we're going to expect. Let's go with the number 20. We expect 20 bikes to be there at 7 o'clock. And then at the resident hall we expect five bikes to be there. And so it's not just allow them to wonder about and hopefully they get there. We feel like we have a population that's going to start moving about 7 o'clock in the morning. And so we're going to have to have designated counts. And to us that's where we get into the control of this is by having counts. And if we can't start with 20 bikes by Fouts Field, then we personally are going to have to go find out where that bike is and get it there because our students are going to be expecting that mode of transportation to be there every morning. Okay. Very good. And then kind of to bring everyone else up to speed, I talked to Mark and you by proxy, I guess, about an idea. And so I want to share with my peers that given this scenario where the bikes are kind of thrown about and the university ultimately would have to go collect them, my question to Mark was is there an opportunity for kind of UNT to partner with Denton ISD at the ATC and repair? So you have to remove those bikes at some point. They're unaccounted for. Is there an opportunity to then work an agreement with ATC where some engineering, some repair type class can be established to then repurpose those parts and end up with a final product and what you do with that. It could be donated. It could be -- I don't know what that looks like. But I just asked that question for them to explore that. And so that's kind of in the works, in the background. And for me, it was one, give the kids some experience. And the reference I used is kind of the experience going back to Roger's Bike Shop for those that live here long enough. That kind of experience, I mean, that to me, that art form is kind of done by the wayside. There's more -- there's better bikes. They're more, you know, technical but just kind of old, just traditional bike. What do you do with it? You know? And so -- and it also gives those kids that experience. So that's what I'm thinking. They've given me some feedback already. I just wanted to bring everyone else up to speed on that conversation. So thank you. >> Thank you. >> Yes, Councilmember Rathbun. >> I'm not quite sure who might be able to address this, but I imagine the public also would like to be reminded of what the intent was behind the 100 bike limit in the ordinance and how that -- you know, how that looks in comparison with the -- with what's being proposed here. >> So Councilmember, if I understand the question, the original ordinance, ordinance 18-277, the original intent was to limit the number of bikes per operator to 100. At the time we were interfacing with a minimum of four with the potential of maybe two or three more. And our concern as a community or there was a concern within the community and on council that maybe there might be upwards to five, seven, 800 bikes that would inundate our community and how frequently are those particular bikes utilized. And so with that interest in mind and a good neighbor policy, limit the total number of bikes that an operator could have so that we did not end up with stacks of bikes on street corners and creating not only aesthetic issues but, you know, safety issues with respect to ADA and access to homes, businesses, et cetera. >> Joe, sure. >> So was the issue just where they're left overnight or was it just 100 total because of whatever their presence might be during the day? You know, I'm trying to just assess, you know, we're sort of being asked to view this program in light of that ordinance and I'm not quite sure I see, you know, how it matches up because what I'm hearing, just if I can expand a little, you know, what I'm hearing is that we'll catch them all at the end of the day. But, you know, how do we know? I mean, and I don't know frankly if I would have been for the ordinance or not but since that is the ordinance, you know, would ideally, you know, should an alert go off when there are 100 off the campus, whatever time of day? Is that sort of the spirit of the ordinance? >> Mr. Mayor, if I can, I can respond fairly quickly and I understand you. So I think Councilmember Gregory brought up a very interesting comment with respect to the bikes and we're still dealing with that issue now and that they did not have the GPS system deployed or on the bikes that they deployed. And so how do they know? We're still calling them. We still have staff time involved with trying to corral those bikes and remove those from the street and as clutter and art form of some sort. We weren't particularly impressed with all of the bike share operators and having that GPS system deployed as well as the total number, you know, as well as abiding by a total number of bikes. We had some bike share operators say, oh, we don't see a need for a limit. We need them to be ubiquitous on every street corner and so by doing that we're going to flood the market. And so we knew that there was a couple of three different bike operators that their MO was essentially to put more bikes out there than would ever be used. In fact, we got some information back that said, you know, gosh, we've got X number of thousands of bikes deployed in a particular community and they were really excited that maybe 15% of those bikes got used over the weekend. Well, you know, 1,500 rides with 10,000 bikes in your community really wasn't a model that I think that we were willing to engage in. Sure. A little background. I mean, I think for me, I can only speak for myself, the 100 limitation was per operator. So I'm hearing total of 100, that's per operator. So you could have four or five operators. My biggest concern was that we didn't have any data, which I think this pilot program will allow us to obtain. We didn't have any data about who's riding, where they're riding, how often are they riding. And so we were just sort of arbitrarily putting a number of bikes out there, not based on anything other than just the company who was placing them. So it wasn't, from my perspective, wasn't an opposition to a bike share program. It was let's try to gather some data to see what the need is and make an informed choice on that. So I don't think it was necessarily an arbitrary number. We just knew we didn't want a thousand bikes in here without knowing that, you know, half of them or 75% of them won't be ridden. So Council Member Gregory and then Council Member Duff. I think also part of the situation was we had basically two options for how to go forward to work with dockless bike share. And one was to pass an ordinance, as we did, and to set these number limits without data, which came close to arbitrary, but it was just because we didn't know and we don't have much information to do that. The other option, which in retrospect might be a better option, was to do an RFP with an individual company and work out an arrangement with them where we were more certain that they would have the capabilities of rebalancing sufficiently. But we opted to go with the ordinance rather than an RFP. What we're actually seeing now is a version B of an RFP with our partners at UNT, and I think it'll be a good experiment to see if that works better than the ordinance did. Because there were concerns, a lot of concerns about where the bikes were being left and the inability of the operator, and it could be multiple operators of being able to adequately rebalance them. And the operators were saying they could do it, but they couldn't. Yeah, I think this is very much a work in progress. Because until we get all the data to know how many bikes we need out there, what's going to happen with them, and that kind of thing, I noticed that I was in Seattle last week, and I was kind of amazed when I looked around how orderly their bikes were. They had them in permanent locations. So I think as we go along on this, we're going to get more data and we're going to make changes. At this point, I don't think we really know where we're going on this. Yes? So I want to make sure I understand what's being proposed. It's a pilot of 100 first and then scale to 250. Am I making that up? That is 100 first. So the 100 is within the existing ordinance anyway. And then we'll have a readout on the data through the inter local agreement before going from the 100 to 250? That's correct. And we could conceivably recraft the ordinance at that point once we're smarter. So I think that's really encouraging. Yeah, and I appreciate that, but that's not how I understand the read here. And I have a couple questions on the actual interlocal agreement specifically. First is on section 3B. It states UN treaties agrees to operate the pilot, et cetera. Bike share pilot proposal dated April 11, 2018 and attached here to as exhibit A. And I believe that's referring to the white paper. Exhibit A is the white paper. When I read that, I really didn't see that as a proposal. I mean, actually, more -- a proposal structure is more contained in the interlocal agreement. So the white paper doesn't really give details about -- that are contained. So help me understand what we're supposed to be looking for in the white paper that is supposed to act as the pilot proposal. It just seems more like an informational paper. It does provide a level of information, but the ordinance -- or this actually references that ordinance 18-277. So essentially the ILA would follow ordinance 18-277. And what this particular ILA is requesting or what the variance would be to the existing pilots would be one total number of bikes to be deployed at a time, 250 versus the 100, which we've been discussing. And then the other would be the term of the particular pilot program. UNT is wishing or is requesting to have that extended out through the fall and spring semester so that data that we've been talking about trying to gather that data can be -- better data can be gathered and then craft a better program for the out years or for future -- for future ordinance. >> The only thing -- if y'all could maybe look at y'all being -- the university representative and yourself, do we need that white paper attached? Because it says that it's going to be the pilot program in accordance with UNT bike share pilot proposal dated April 11, 2018 and attached here to exhibit A. It doesn't really seem like a -- what I would consider a proposal. So if it's needed, still fine. If not, because I think the proposal -- there's more of the proposal in the actual interlocal agreement than there is in the white paper. So if it doesn't need to -- and if it needs to be -- it doesn't matter to me. But when I was reading it, I was expecting to see terms and things in April about here's where we're going to put them, here's what's going to happen. And it's just more informational in some of the issues that arise. >> Understood. And I understand that this particular item, item R, on the consent has been pulled. So if I may, I'll visit with our colleagues at UNT as well as our legal staff and see if we can present that. >> And if not, that's fine, too. So what I understand is going to the 250, yeah, UNT is going to make some study. Is that something that's needed? But as far as the city goes, that this agreement is saying that there won't be more than 100 in the city, quote, unquote, at any given time. >> That is correct. Yes. >> So really, it won't -- if they have 250, it's not going to be in violation of our ordinance if there's not 100 because as it states, which I agree with in section C, the city agrees that neither it nor ordinance 2018-2-6 regulates the parking of additional bicycles on UNT or state of Texas property in and around the UNT campus. And my understanding is that's correct. I mean, they don't necessarily have to -- I mean, we don't regulate that when it's on private. >> I think the interest, Mayor, is really just to set the parameters of what everybody's understanding was in terms of, you know, where those bikes would be and just have a document that each agency could look at and agree and say, yes, this is -- >> Oh, no, I agree with that. I think it's well written. I think it's pretty clear to me that if they go to 250, there's not an anticipation that we're saying you can have 250 bikes in the city of Denton at any one time. It's saying, hey, we got 100. You guys got 100 in the city and you got 150 on campus. We're all good. Am I misreading -- am I misunderstanding the reading of the agreement? >> That's correct. >> Okay. >> Mayor and members of council, I would also, you know, indicate that we're not naive enough to think that these bikes won't migrate off campus. Regardless of the geofencing, we anticipate some of those to migrate off campus. There -- University of North Texas will have staff assigned along with spin, you know, to bring those back. Are there going to be onesies and twosies here and there that they don't catch the first time around? Most likely. But that's part of that review process. What can we do better? But generally speaking, it's that total of 100, you know, outside or off of general campus area and off of the city of Denton ride. >> Oh, I think it's a great opportunity. I think it's a great opportunity to gather the data that UN T is willing to share with us that they gather from their pilot program. I mean, number of bicycles deployed, specific trip data, monthly trip total, rebalancing. I mean, this is going to be data that I think we can use to refine and maybe tweak our ordinance as we move forward because it's going to be critical in helping us understand what are some of the major destinations from the campus in the city and will help us -- it would be a great planning tool. So I think it's a great partnership between the city and the University of North Texas that we both can learn a tremendous amount from this pilot program. >> And I would mention one other thing as well. SPIN, and it referenced it in the backup material, the information sheet, but SPIN is the only bike share operator who has submitted for a permit and actually provided the deployment plan to our traffic engineering group to approve. And so, you know, no other bike share operator has really stepped up and said, yeah, we can abide by the existing ordinance. And to that extent, they have deployed some bikes at Texas Women's University. So Dr. Clark referenced TWU. So we see that it's going to be not only TWU and University of North Texas, but the city working hand in hand as we move this forward to, you know, implement lessons learned. >> Well, and I think, too, with the data, if there are particular parts of town or specific locations where there seems to be a lot of trips and it falls within the number of bikes, you know, at least for now, who's to say that we can't modify the agreement to say, okay, instead of you picking up every bike, if we have a place at these major locations where people are going, I mean, I think it's going to really help us to try to find the best of both worlds here. And I'm really excited about the opportunity and I thank the university for really taking the lead in that and working with us to really make this a win-win for both organizations. So the only question I do have, which it's just the lawyer in me, so I apologize, when it talks about there wouldn't be X amount of bikes in the city, we're just going to have to have that understanding that if there is, they're just going to get it fixed. I mean, we don't have really any remedy or any kind of -- I mean, we have something in the ordinance that it's violated, but I mean, I think once this gets rolling, I think they will definitely, on the rebalancing, we're not going to see what we saw. >> Correct. >> But I mean, because they're still around. I mean, somebody mentioned -- I mean, I've seen one somewhere that a dad drive by, and I thought, well, okay. So no, I appreciate staff working with the university and coming up with this creative sort of solution and opportunity for us to both learn what would be the best for our respective institutions. So thank you so much for that. >> One final comment I do want to mention is that there would be -- there may be an opportunity or a need to come back with that, with the existing ordinance 18-277 to do some amendment because we've not had a mobility committee meeting. We wanted to get this out in front so the University of North Texas could implement this if it is approved by council. You know, probably coming back through the mobility committee at a later date, later this summer. >> Do you mean to amend our ordinance to match this inter local agreement, or are you meaning to amend it once we have data where we might want to move some things differently? >> I think it's probably neither one of those two options. I suspect that UNT is not going to deploy this until the fall semester, or at least the data that you accumulate, a substantial amount of data won't be available until sometime in the fall or early or even the wintertime. And if so, our ordinance expires before that. So we would at least at a minimum extend our ordinance to coincide with that data receipt. >> So it may just be extending it, renewing it so that it just doesn't expire. >> Most likely sometime in July or August or certainly before September, mid September. >> All right. Councilmember Briggs. >> So on the bikes, because after that conversation I started thinking, so if a bike ends up off the campus into our area and a regular citizen sees it and they want to ride it, that's not going to be possible, right, because they have to be registered? Because, you know, bike share normally would be like, oh, I see a bike, I'm going to hop on it and I'm going to go, but these will be your specific ones and you're paying for them. And so just, I mean, I'm just kind of curious how that -- the only way that a bike can be removed is if it's physically picked up by the company and brought back to campus. >> One of the options is for faculty and staff to be able to ride that bike as well. And so these are going to be, yes, they'll be branded green and black with white lettering with UNT numbers and phone numbers on there, but they will have the ability, other people will have the ability to activate that bike. I think that's something we need to go discuss with SPIN. I never considered somebody else wanting to get on there because it was a green and black university bike itself. >> Well, I honestly, I like the idea of having TW and UNT bikes in our city because that's, you know, what defines us that makes it, you know, a neater bike to ride. But so, okay. And also in the presentation later, may I? >> Sure. >> I'm just -- I'm curious the number of actually how many students live on UNT campus and also if you could just put up a boundary map of the campus and where the geofencing would be just for visual representation tonight. >> We can make that happen. >> Thank you. >> I want to make sure I understood Councilmember Briggs, your response to Councilmember Briggs about if these bikes are out in public, if some citizen of Denton or someone who's a non-student wants to ride it, that's really not been considered so there might be some discussion around that or is that my understanding of what that is? >> Right. I understood that SPIN would have the ability just with their credit card capability to allow you or me or any member of the general public to access the bike, but it also has the capability to use the student ID or the faculty ID to activate when they activate off of that student or faculty ID, then it's a free ride or at least it's subsidized by the University of Texas to their transportation fee. >> Okay. All right. Did you have a follow up, Councilmember Briggs? >> So that would actually be helpful to us to know the difference to divide up what citizens actually use or are using the bike and what students are actually using the bike. So that will be -- that data will be available to us. >> That would be part of some of the metrics and stuff that we could gather and bring back on a periodic basis. Yes, ma'am. >> Thank you. >> So at what point will that decision be made and if it's not -- because I'm still -- I'm thinking it hasn't been made, but if SPIN and UNT decide that, yes, a non-student can use it and that's more of a transaction between SPIN and the non-student that it doesn't have any bearing on UNT or doesn't go through any kind of -- in other words, it's a separate account, separate -- when will that decision be made if it hasn't been made and if it has been made, how do we, you know, get that out to the public? >> Quite frankly, I think it's just a clarification, Mr. Mayor. I think my understanding was that that was the capability of the program. If I'm misunderstanding, I apologize, but we'll get that clarified before the presentation. >> That's a good question and it's something that I think will be helpful to the citizens as well. >> In my understanding, regardless, it should be a technological fix. It's just programming the bike. >> Okay. Councilmember Briggs? >> Just to that point, sorry, I just keep coming up with questions, but in our ordinance, there's a registration fee if it's used in the city per bike or per, I think, the amount of bikes. So that brings me to -- and if that is where our citizens can ride these bikes, how does that -- >> University of North Texas is abiding by everything in the existing ordinance. So they'll be charged the fee per number of bikes deployed. So if it's 100 or if it's 250, they'll be charged on a per basis with the permitting process. >> Oh, by the city? Okay. >> They'll be submitting an application, a permit application for that whole process. >> Okay. >> Councilmember Hatsbeth? >> Briefly. I would just -- wherever we end up on that issue, I'd like to change the wording or try to sell you on some wording, be it registered, not registered, right? Because I think we can get -- as far as the bike user, so as he pointed out, if you register, you can use a bike at no cost. If you use -- if ultimately down the road you can use your credit card, then that person's not registered -- because it may be a student that didn't register that uses the bike with its credit card. You know, so I think if you're getting a student, non-st udent, citizen, I mean, to me that gets a little inaccurate at that point. It's just either we have a record this student registered and/or this staff member registered and they're using a bike or they didn't register and it was used that way. So I just -- I hear people say student, citizen, you know, and so I think that can -- whenever that data comes back become inaccurate if we assign a label of, okay, well, these are citizens and now we have 50 citizens that use a bike. Well, that's not accurate. It may be a student that didn't register that just used a credit card to ride the bike. You know, so I think ultimately when you -- to start off with good, clean data is going to be imperative and I think it's more -- it's just really those two columns as I see it. Okay. Great. Anything else? Any other questions? All right. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Great presentation. Could you flash up the picture, the first slide of this presentation? When I pulled it up on the backup, I thought that is a beautiful, beautiful shot of the campus. So I just needed to say that. That's a wonderful picture. I'd like to have one like that. So if you guys ever decide to sell them, let me know. Okay. Thank you all so much for that. That's a good opportunity. We'll go on to our work session agenda item 3B. Receive report from staff and -- how do you pronounce that? Icon? Icon. Consultants hold discussion, give staff direction regarding design and construction of the American Legion Hall Senior Center. Good afternoon, Mayor, City Council, Gary Pack, and Parks and Recreation. I want to present to you today a proposal on the American Legion Hall. Provide you a little history on the project, some designs, some options, and seek some direction from City Council on our next steps. James Beers, who is from Icon Consulting, is here as well. He was the main person on the project on behalf of the city . So in case he needs to step in, he's available as well. So just a little history, ALH is located at 629 Lackey Street. It consists of two structures, one built in 1957, which is the south building, it's 2,500 square feet, and the north building at 2,000 square feet, that is 2,600 square feet. That does not include the restrooms that -- the square footage for the restrooms that are for the park, which are located on this north section of that new building. Do you know what that -- That's about 700 square feet. Okay. So I won't be using that square footage. Okay. The original building I get, again, I suggested it started in -- it was built in 1957. It's primarily used for drop-in, passive recreation for our seniors, computer space, meeting, event space. We serve lunches there. We have food available for drop-in activities as well. Some of the renderings, you can see it's just an open space building. We have -- we'll set tables and chairs out based on the event. There's an area for TV for people to gather for social activities. And then just some of the exterior of the south building, you can see some of the structural challenges that we'll talk about here in a little bit, as well as some of the structural challenges on the entryway to the building itself. The north building was built in 2003. It's 2,600 square feet. It has fitness equipment, meeting space, pool table, and restrooms. Again, you can see this is just an open space building. Staff is using it the best they can for whatever programming they can offer. So again, you can see tables and chairs that we'll bring out. There's not a real -- a lot of storage in that facility. So we have them on carts. And then you can see we actually have fitness equipment over in the corner of the building that we'll provide for our users as well. And then a pool table, and then both buildings are basically connected with a little structure just to keep people out of the weather if they're going back and forth between the buildings. The original scope, when ICON was hired to do an engineering study, was basically deemed for a one-for-one, they were looking at the south building only. If it was going to be a replacement or a remodel of that south building, that was their focus with no intentional work on the north structure at all. During that process, they provided a report, a building assessment report in May of 2017. They found a number of items, primarily foundation and perimeter wall challenges, groundwater and surface water runoff is impacting the foundation. >> Real quick, is this for both buildings or one building? >> This is the south building. >> South building, okay. The slab for the south building is free-floating. It's not structurally tied into the walls. The walls are not sitting on the slab, but there's actually an elevation difference of between four and six inches between the various sizes or locations of the foundation. The roof needed to be replaced. There were sagging issues due to reduced support. We have non-compliant accessibility from the parking lot. We don't have a sprinkler system in the building, and there 's an opportunity to replace the fire alarm and change lighting to LED, if determined. Based on the report findings, ICON provided options for renovating the building as well as for rebuilding the structure. The south building renovation was approximately $250,000, and replacement of the entire structure was $614,000. At that time, I think it was September of 2017, city council decided to allocate $614,000 for reconstruction of the building, and that was a one-for- one replacement of the 2,500 square foot facility. Later that fall in 2017, ICON again was selected to do the architectural design of the structure, and they met with staff and users of the facility. I think there was approximately 10 meetings over the course of the timeframe, including residents and staff as well. They also used user surveys to identify some information, and one of the things was how they could better utilize the space for the south building and provide dedicated space for activities such as computer labs, fitness rooms, or meeting space. In the spring of 2018, based on that feedback from the users, ICON provided a recommendation and actually provided a change of course from the original direction of the complete one-for-one redevelopment of the south building. They were to renovate, the suggestion was to renovate the north building and provide some additional support functions in that structure, rebuild and expand the footprint of the south building to meet programming needs, and rebuild it as one giant structure and connect the buildings. Total square footage is 7100 square feet, and the adjusted cost of that would be $857,000. Question on that. So, I can't remember the square footage is on the north and south building currently. I think it's 2300. 25 and 2600. 25, which one is the north building? The north building is 2600. 2600. So, right now you've got 5100 out there. The 2500 we were going to think about scraping and replacing altogether. So we're looking at adding another 2000 square feet. Okay. All right. I just want to make sure I've got all that. And that doesn't include the 700 square foot for the restroom? No, I'm not talking about that at all. Okay. I just want to make sure that that's still. So I added the slide. Yes. I'm sorry. So, just to see if I'm tracking, is the 2000 primarily the area that's where the breezeway is now, the additional square footage? Primarily, yes. Okay, I added the slide, so this is not your presentation. Just to kind of recapture the difference between the original scope and the adjusted scope. So the original scope was demolish and rebuild the south building. No improvements again to the north building. They were two separate buildings of 5100 square feet at a total cost of $614,000. Additional considerations from the feedback from the community. And they requested some dedicated space for structured programming to connect the buildings. So they provide improved flow, use, and management. Management could see both buildings at the same time. There would be some restroom reallocation. They'd take the restrooms that would be built in the south building and move those over to the north side and just expand the existing restroom facility. Add some life safety and IT systems to it. And then the overall expansion of that footprint of about 2000 square feet you had mentioned. So I have a question. Go ahead and finish because it may come up later on. Okay. Sorry. Go ahead. So the adjusted scope based on ICON's recommendation was demolish the south building, rebuild and expand the footprint of the south building, connect to the north building, do some renovations as well in the north building at the same time. And then that would improve the overall function of all the space. And it was about 7100 square feet. Total cost of $857,000. Okay. This is -- yeah, go back to that last slide because these are the add-ons. So I want to -- so here our first one was replace the south building at a cost of $614,000. Do nothing to the north building. Then there was some recommendations of let's renovate a little bit of the north building to make it a little bit more functional. Do we know what the estimated cost for that was by itself? Just the north building? Yeah. I mean, because you got in this cost of $857,000, you've got the building of a new building. And from what I just heard, the 2,000 square feet isn't going to be under airspace. It's going to be more breezeway space. And if that's not correct, then somebody can correct that. It's replacing that breezeway space. Let me go to our future. So -- so let me go back to the original. So here's the two buildings. This is the north building, this is the south building, and this is that breezeway that's connecting the two. Which that's not 2,000 feet. No. No. But this is the footprint of the north building right now. Got you. Okay. Here's the park restrooms that we're not talking about. And then this is being added. So that is 590 square feet in itself. And then this is being added as well. So between the two of these is 1,300 square feet. And then there's a little bit of additional space over here to really expand that original footprint of the south building. Okay. All right. Yeah, hold on. Okay. So that's really not usable space. It's just transit space under air. Am I right? A little bit of it is, but the rest is just sort of a walk way or? It's a corridor connecting people to the spaces. And then that front entry space could be used for pre- registration. It could be used for Co-Check, for special events, that type of thing. So then in -- so if I'm starting with a base of 614 to replace the south building, we're doing remodeling to the north building. And then we're reconfiguring the breezeway and adding some space in there. And that's increasing the cost from the original 614 by $2 40,000 basically. That's correct. Is that right? Of that 240, do we know how much of that was sort of slated for reconfiguring the north building? I'm trying to get an idea of the reconfiguration of the additional 2,000 feet breezeway under air is this much -- because it has to be somewhere in that cost. Do you all have a breakdown of that? Yeah. Good afternoon. Thank you. James Beers with ICON. So to answer your question, inside the north building we have an addition. So in a second there's a slide coming up. But right now the base building in that number is to renov ate the existing bathroom. So instead of spending the money in the old replacement of the south building, we're able to combine the bathrooms in the existing -- and if I could flash forward here. Sure. Can I walk around and point? Would that help? Yeah, you've got to stay behind the mic so that the people on the -- being broadcasted can hear. So effectively what you see here is the option where you see the multi -- in the meeting room in the -- I can't see it at this angle. Where is it here? Oh, there we go. Perfect. So right now this is the edge of the existing north building. This will all be condition space. Just to be clear. The only renovation in the base expansion that you see is to update the bathrooms and to provide this corridor to get to those bathrooms and provide egress. In the base expansion. Yes. And you're thinking that's -- Roughly around $127,000 is what we had allocated based on the bathroom fixture count and what we need to get through that space and demolition. Okay. All right. All right. That's helpful. I've got a couple of hands I know that are around. Councilmember Gregory. My question comes with the issue of programming. And I've stopped by there periodically just to say hi and visit. And I'm not seeing very much intensive programming going on . And so I'm seeing 2,000 additional square feet and I'm seeing in that new floor plan some rooms that are closed off. So I'm thinking about are we looking at what kind of added programming are we talking about? What kind of added staffing are we going to need in order to support that programming? And is this still -- this has always been basically a -- in practicality it's been for seniors. Is that what the programming is envisioned for in the future? So currently right now it's very passive programming for the seniors. More like drop-in activities, cards, dominoes, those types of things. And in addition to rentals, right now we have approximately 204 rentals a year in that facility alone. MLK is the most rented at 226. So just in that area of the community there's a significant amount of rentals. And those are for meetings, graduation parties, family gatherings, that type of thing. And then the next highest is North Lakes at 174. So there's a lot of rental activity in there. And that's primarily after hours. The day timing hours would be expanded slightly once the new facility comes on board with an intended more aggressive programming. Both to the passive and then maybe a little more of aggressive fitness programs, structured arts and crafts type things. But primarily in the past it's been more drop-in type activities for seniors. Now you don't have to be a senior to be able to rent the facility after hours either. And it's really a sister facility to MLK that it's under the same budget as MLK and staff is shared for that facility as well. Thank you. Yes, Council Member Brie. So on the North building, it was built I think it's 15 years old, which is not really that old for a building. What was the original use and how much did we pay for that? Do you know how much we paid for it to have it built? I don't have that number. I don't know if Dean has it. I don't have the original cost for that. Okay. I'd like to know that at some point. And so I'm... We built that in 2003 was on an indefinite quantity contract and I can look back in our records and get that cost for you. Okay. All right. Thank you. And so when I saw this, so this is kind of like a senior center and is it, are we trying to make it equal or equitable to this senior center over here? I mean is it going to function the same? Will we have staff there all the time? Will people come in and have a card, pay a fee to use the workout room? And I mean is this what we're looking at? In some aspects, yes. You'll be able to register for programs. Right now you can't because we don't have access to our internet software there. But you'll be able to come in, participate in programs, fitness area. Now the difference between is this senior center has a lot more square footage. So they have the woodworking space, those types of things that we can't offer, but they can come to this downtown facility for that. But there will be structured programming for people. Okay. Councilmember Hotsmith. Thank you. And I was going to, I'll wait. I'll read, I'm going to say it again probably once we get to the other aspects of it. But I guess let me start by saying there's some stuff that 's used that's not been touched on. And I think the span usage of Meals on Wheels operates out of there that hadn't been touched on. I think important to note that the state school sends kids over there to kind of interact and get that kind of a connection and that type of therapy if you will. So that hadn't been mentioned. In my estimation to support what the parks has noted, it's one of the most utilized buildings in our city. And I think that's because of the sense of community around there. And I think noteworthy that I requested, so it's round numbers, $16,000 in 2017 that was earned for the city through that building as it sits now. And so ultimately when we get to the final layout with the additions, I'm really going to have a hard time, or better said, I'm going to solicit. I'm going to solicit this council to support this project at its fullest because it was this same council that the majority of people supported a parking lot that cost $829,454 that generates zero revenue. Does it add to the community? Absolutely. But I'm supporting this project because one, it generates revenue. One it touches a cross section of our community that often buildings don't. You talk about what other facility in our arsenal has the ability to support SPAN, support the Denton State School, support seniors, support that level of rental. And so I think when you put it in context of due consideration but supporting a parking lot at near $1 million to not support this building that has community input that is highly activated. And to that point, so I'll stop and I'll ask James because he went to the facility and sat in and looked for his own eyes as he was drafting it and making this. So I'll allow him to paint a picture of the different activities and kind of what he saw through his own eyes just kind of if you can translate what you saw in that building when you went to go visit to prepare your plans, your scope. Just be a conversation if you want to interrupt me, please do so. Sure. I think one of the key things was and early on is this is a living building. Can you hear me okay? It's a living building. So the intent is we had to see how they function. We had to see how the other MLK, we went to MLK. But seeing with inside the building what's going on and the programming needs, it was quite occupied during our visits as far as transient or walking in activities as you come into the building, but functional activities as well too. One of the key things that we noticed was there was a separation within the plan precipitating the programming is that it was very wide open. It wasn't a safe space. So within those activities from fitness to activities and recreation from like playing pool or doing other activities within the space, it seemed to just be something that was just thrown up against the wall and used. So there was a function there. But each building was active when we were there. We had programming discussions multiple times with staff and also too with the users. So seeing what those usages were, they didn't have the space that was conducive to what their needs were and they're always overbooked. They always needed more space. They did have an issue with parking. Again, we can't fix the streets in the parking. However, with inside the space is that's what precipitated how the building was going to be used. So when the building was parsed off or divided and tables were being used, they have a very eclectic set of equipment, which we want to talk about that as well too through the FF&E piece. But the intent is that every area of that building is fully used and utilized within the times that we've been there and through input through when we're not there, kind of seeing the activities that are going on at different times of day too. So whether it be in the mornings or, you know, working into the evenings or even on the weekend when there is an activity and it's quite an active space. Thank you. Thank you very much. Did that help? Yes, Councilmember Nelson. Then we'll go ahead and finish I think you've got a few more slides so we can because yeah. It's called the Senior Center and we're talking about it as the Senior Center. But you addressed the rentals and apart from the income that the rentals generate, you know, to the extent that that's an indication of how the community sees it, is it not accurate to say that this facility gets about three times the rent als that Denton Senior Center gets? So the Denton Senior Center, they have five rooms that are available for rentals and they have 69 rentals from outside. Versus over 200 for this, right? For two rooms. So I mean, you know, I guess that suggests to me that it is accurate but not sufficient to see it just as a Senior Center, you know, that it seems to function more as a community center, you know, for all those life events that people, you know, seek rentals for. And then I want to ask you, how does its condition compare with other kind of community centers we have like Deena and North Lakes? You know, is it, are they all similarly aged and sagging and so on or is this uniquely, you know, in need of a relook? Yeah, I mean, with the structural challenges from the outside of the south building, it's, I think it's our oldest structure that we have. The Senior Center downtown is old, it's an old structure, but this one is a little bit more needed at this time. You know, MLK was built in 1995ish? Is that correct? Don't quote me on that, but 89, okay, 89. And the north building is built in 2003, structurally that 's fine as well. So there was no need to tear that down. So that was one of the reasons why I just remodel it and add to it. So it was more functional space instead of having two buildings next to each other. Yes. This is on a slightly different tack. Placement of restrooms. To the extent that it is a Senior Center, you know, during the day, you know, have you vetted with the folks who use it during the day or the folks who oversee that operation, the distance from the multi-purpose room, which is where most of their activities happen, to the restroom? Because you've got folks who are mobility challenged and, you know, I'm wondering about that long corridor. That's a great question. It was addressed. There's two trade-offs. One is the cost to look at doing a shotgun situation where the bathrooms are in the back like the existing facility. And the other one was the compromise to utilizing existing plumbing to make it more functional and economically sensible to the overall budget. So the travel distance as it stands right now without expansion, the meeting room you see here still would be that function for the day-to-day daily operations. The multi-purpose in the meeting room would be for the events. So the main daily functions would occur in both spaces, depending on need. But the distance from the middle of the building, if you look up to the top, you're talking roughly about 40 feet of difference and change of a walkway . So that's about from where I'm standing to that wall. So depending on where the bathrooms would have been to where it was, it is accessible. All the floors are maintained accessible within the building and throughout. So yes, it is a travel distance, but it's not more in common than if we were here to walk to the restrooms in the corridor. But it's a little bit less than that based on what we have. So there's a trade-off between economics and also to function. And we tried to marry those two things up together as best we could to be sensible and spend the money in the areas where the program functions could probably serve a better purpose or a higher level. I don't claim to know more than you. And I'm just sharing an observation. You do have that storage space right now positioned by the kitchen. The kitchen's got the plumbing too. So I would just suggest that there's dominoes that can move around and still take advantage of plumbing fixtures. But, you know, it's not my expertise. Yeah, I'm going to tell you, you start moving bathrooms in a slab with four-inch drain lines for toilets and things like that. I mean, yeah, kitchens, they have two-inch drain lines typically. Toilets require four. And now you're -- I mean, there may not even be a four-inch drain line in -- so I hear what you're saying, but when you start talking about that kind of remodeling, you're going to add about 30%, 20% or 30% to that just to jackhammer and move. Is that inaccurate? It's accurate. I mean, we are demoing the building, so it's a build back. But to get the inverts and all the drainage, the technical, it was more cost-effective and functional to see if we can adapt that building. And yes, there is plumbing, lesser drain line. But we're also adding a sprinkler room to the building too. So that's another accommodation to make this function work. So the supporting function within the multipurpose was the kitchen and the storage. And that's still something that we're programming as we see , but that's the need and the fit to support those two multipurpose spaces. So if you were to exit that, you would go to the bathrooms. If you're front or back, there's a difference about 12 feet . If there was a bathroom in the south, that 12 feet didn't make sense to spend the money. At least right now, we consider it where all options are open because this is still in concept. Yeah, it's a new build too. Correct. What about the mayor training that would tell me about that ? No, no, it's not -- it's just -- unfortunately, it's scar tissue. Thank you. It's knowing because you've made that mistake. Yeah. And just to add to that as well, before in the north building and the south building, we basically could have two events going on at the same time. Now we can have a meeting going on in this space, somebody in the fitness area for drop-in. We could have some sort of a rec thing going on here in the rec room and then two events going on in these two spaces. So if a restroom was here, that would just service this room or these two sides. So we could actually have four or five things going on at the same time in this facility. So that way everybody can use the same restroom and there's a way to get to that. Right. Okay. All right. In addition to the base and the adjusted costs that we discussed earlier, the patrons asked for some additional considerations which were at alternates . One was a wall for the computer lab in the classroom, a glass divider for the fitness area instead of a solid wall and then some additional finishes at $45,000. Installation of a solid glass wall at the main entry and I 'll show you some drawings of this and the difference here in a second. And then the installation of a terrace, a concrete overlook that's overlooking the park and the basketball area. So you can kind of spill outside the building a little bit. Is that covered or uncovered? That's uncovered. So it's just uncovered at this point. Just concrete slab? Yes, sir. Yes. But that's on the sort of the east side so for afternoon or evening events it's going to be a little more palatable for folks to use, right? That's correct. Okay. And then furniture fixtures and equipment, that's replacement of tables, chairs, fitness equipment, that type of thing, it's $35,000. And then additional design fee of $35,000. So just to give you the base bid, here's the front entry area that we just talked about. These in the base bid are punch out windows so they're just regular square windows. Two multipurpose rooms, a rec room, an open space meeting room. You have your restrooms that are expanded here and then a fitness area and that is $857,000. The alternates are in color so here's your terrace space on the northeast section of the building or east section. We took the large meeting room and split it into two so you have a dedicated computer lab as well as a classroom for programming. And then this space instead of being a solid wall, it's a glass wall so you can see in and outside of the fitness area and the rec space. And then the front entry area, instead of having a solid wall with punch out windows, it's all glass so you can see inside the space. >> Councilmember Briggs? >> Do you have a question? >> I'm curious about what kind of glass it is and if it's -- since it's -- if it can be busted out really easily. I mean, there's -- I know that we put glass in the police department that was really, really expensive, but it can't be destroyed. So I'm just concerned here with that much glass in the front of a building if it's, you know, broken. >> This is commercial glass. It's not going to be a bulletproof film and such. And yes, there's always the risk of damage or, you know, someone breaking a window. But the intent is to treat the lower part of the window with tempered glass, the upper parts with, you know, typical insulated glass with the color and such so that it protects it from the environment. As far as putting a bulletproof screen, we have not considered that within the budget. So windows can be broken, so yes, more glass, more opportunity for breaking. It's more of an aesthetic. It's more of a conversation that we've been having. That's why it's an option. It wasn't the base. It could improve the look of the building. Again, too, we would consider energy consumption, things like that, you know, as we go through the process. So I want to make sure we're clear on that, too. >> I was thinking more about baseballs, not really bullets, but -- >> Well, if I could just point out, too, that the activities really are here. So this is the corner of Lackey and Wilson. So this is facing effectively the front entryway of the current south building is where the picture that -- that carried up with the sign, and I could flash back if that would help. Let me see if I get that right. Did I get it? There we go. So this is at the corner. So that facade is directly behind the sign that would be relocated as well, too. So what you see here is the breezeway to the building. So where the shadow is, unfortunately, this is kind of where that curve would be resting as you see. So it's up facing the street. Unless it's through the balls in the street and such, things could happen. There is some landscaping as well, too. So it's a standard kind of front to a building, not much like what we see out of the window here. >> And they'd be extremely energy efficient? >> The intent is, yes, it would be an energy efficient gla zing, insulated glass, correct. All the windows, regardless if they're -- the option or the base option would be that from an energy and comm check standpoint. >> It would still have to meet the energy requirements for the city, energy code requirements for the city. >> Correct. >> And the comm check for the mechanical, the shell, I mean , that's what we'd be providing as well, too, to make sure that what we spec will, you know , pass the energy code. >> Chancellor Gregory? >> Would you go back to that -- the last slide that we were looking at the most recent. >> Sure. >> There you go. I'm all for the addition, the concept of rebuilding and connecting the two buildings together. I'm for most of those alternatives. I'm uncomfortable with the glass on that entrance simply because it's west and I don't care how efficient the windows are on the west. That's not as energy efficient as if you had the other concept with the -- have some windows but not have as much sunlight coming in. But I'm for -- I appreciate the changes. I think it's going to make the programming much better and much more useful for a variety of purposes. And so that's -- >> Thank you. >> That's my recommendation for direction. >> Yes, Councilmember. >> No, I think that's a good point on the windows in the front. I think -- and I'll just tell you, for me, the terrorist component is huge because you're talking that many rentals. Well, you have kids, it's inevitable they're going to the park and now you have a parent that can't keep an eye on their kid but you can't keep them from it. So I think that to me will be great and you have the natural shade of the building to kind of keep you out of the heat as well or at least periodically to go check. I think that will be great. >> Any comments, questions? I want to make sure. More slides? >> I do. >> Let's go ahead and wrap it up and then we'll get -- >> Just as the original building cost $250,000 in 2003, the north building. So just some summary slides here. Total base costs, $850,000 adjusted base. The alternates, $85,000. Design fees of $99,000 in total. FF&E of $75,000 which is a total cost of $1.1 million if we were to do everything as presented. What caused the difference? We already covered that in the additional slide. I'll skip over that since we already covered that. And then here's the breakdown specifically of the expenses and revenues. So the original project scope was $614,000 which you approved in September of 2017. Original design fee was $64,000. Additional scope of work was $243,000. With the alternates, FF&E and additional design, that's the $1.1 million I just mentioned. Original project funding which you guys provided, $614,000. So we had to come up with funding to balance that if council decided to move in this direction. We identified park development and land dedication funds from Fredmore Park at $249,000 as an option as well as $100,000 in gas funding that was allocated in the budget this year for a project which we can use as well as $153,000 in interest from our park bond projects that have accrued over the years. That would get us the total funding based off the current estimate from ICON's proposed design. Council Member Briggs. Okay, so that's good to see that there's not anything coming out of our general budget. So it's all accounted for, the money. So I'm okay with the project but parking was brought up earlier and that there's not really much we can do about it but I'm just curious as far as since we are expanding the square footage if the parking that we have available is sufficient for the new parking ordinance that we just passed. Great question as far as the parking. So the expansion of the building per the code and parking is we actually overpark even as we stand now. So we have the same amount of handicap spaces which reside in the south side. We're going to reconfigure those just because of accessibility and grading issues but there's no extra impact on parking as it sits based on the requirement of the current parking and zoning code. Okay. So we're actually below it based on the actual square footage. So I think we're over by two spaces last we checked. It could be three depending on ADA. Okay, thank you. Just to add to that, we have reached out to one of the local churches down the street and a lot of park users use one of their parking lots and we're trying to figure out how we could work together to make sure we're being fair to them because our park users are using their space so we're having discussions about some partnership opportunities there. Okay, so last slide. Yep. Okay. There's three options here for council's consideration. Option one would be basically to move in the direction that we talked about last fall which would be to demolish the south building, rebuild it on its existing footprint at about the $614,000. The one thing that was not accounted for originally was the design cost so that's why that's been added. Option two is demolish the south building, renovate the north building without the alternates. And then option three is basically option two with the alternates and obviously we could drop or add those alternates as deemed necessary when we actually get the bid prices for council's consideration. So there's three options for council's consideration. We're looking for direction and which way to move in regards to design and we'd be willing to move forward as soon as possible. Council's pleasure. Three? Yes, sir. Okay. I'm okay with three but without the glass as well I'm concerned about the sun and the heating of the building, cooling it because utility bills are an issue. I just want to make sure that the rents that we charge to reserve the space are not going to increase, that they're going to stay affordable for the community. I don't know if there's a plan for that or not but I just want to make sure. We haven't discussed about raising the fees. Our fees for the rental rooms are all the same whether it's a large room or a small room. Right now those are $20 for a resident, $25 for a non- resident so they're pretty affordable. Yeah, okay. Thank you. There's an additional fee for after hours for staff too in regards to that. Yes, Council Member Meltzer. I'm in agreement with what Council Member Briggs said and if I'm not mistaken I believe the original building was not built by the city. I believe it was built by veterans from the community as a gift to the community at least so I've been told and well I'd like to know if that's true. You're exactly right, it was built I think by the veterans. If you all remember Councilman Carl Young was on council and his dad was real instrumental in providing that and getting that building up and operational. I think those veterans would be very pleased to see this structure embraced by the community the way it's been. I think it'll make the neighborhood better and the city better. So option three? Council Member Duff? Yeah option three without the glass. Okay. I'm good. Same here option three without the glass. Okay without glass I presume. Yeah I mean option three for me with or without glass I mean I certainly understand so I'm sort of indifferent to that. More important, this is not going to come as a surprise. I think we can do better on some of the costs when I look at $45,000 put in a couple walls. I mean you're already doing construction so I think if we 're going to approach this the same way that we talked about after having the discussion about the Bella Park as far as trying to do some value engineering because I just it just it's very frustrating to see sometimes what what so a question on the terrace. I saw steps. I saw some steps there. So the terrace is going to be elevated? Correct. Do we know how? It's currently at the same grade as the finish for the building. Right. Which is approximately 30 inches above the basketball floor level. Okay so that's that. So we're not changing the existing grade outside of our property. Gotcha. It's just going to go back with it's just going to keep it at that same grade so it'll be either some piers with some fill dirt and four inch or five inch slab. Is there is there a fence or is it will there be a? There'll be a handrail. A handrail around it? A handrail and necessary code railings for the steps. Correct. I'm okay I think this will be a great addition to the community. I just my concern is just make sure that we really twist the screws on the cost because it's it's basically two restrooms a kitchen and then a lot of open space and so we will we will hire an independent estimator after we've got a final design and a final estimate just to make sure that we're comfortable and we're working with city attorney staff right now on creating some different contract templates to allow us to negotiate line by line on those types of projects. We're trying to find projects or contract formats that will provide us a little bit more flexibility up front. Okay. Can I add just in the original structure the agreement which is still intact is we will be doing a pending a probable cost third party will be doing that to vet it out so when you see just walls there's other things lights flooring. So there's amendments to that too so it's a way to just collect it it's kind of hard to get too down into the to the weeds on that today but that's what we'll be doing as we step through the process and working along with with the city as well. Yep. Councilmember Gregory. Where the terrace is on the far north side next to the building and the outdoor restrooms are those HVAC units. Those are the existing condensing units that are in place that's where they've been we kind of have to accept it. Really. Yeah, it is what it is to support the mechanical. It's new it's a very good shape they're only if you know less than 15 years old. I'm just thinking about them in relation to the terrace. We understand we've talked about possibly some wall screening and that too again to looking at that so there may be some additional cost that we have to look at to kind of see what those are to just put up a screen wall but it's not that much you know just deflecting that sound. So you know. No, I just it's a running joke. I mean they think I'm lunatic so it doesn't matter. I move. Yes. Yes. I'm glad I could provide some humility here. Thank you. Yeah, no I just want to say I sat in on I was only make able to make a couple of meetings with James and James and his partner forget his name that were at the meeting but really really great group to work with and very responsive and very flexible as the kind of Miss Betty would point out this that or the other. They were very amenable to that and again was nice enough to stop by on a Thursday and kind of take everything in and see it in action. So really really great job and looking here at your website and seeing you have an office in Sanger in Plano and I think what D. Okay, I was trying to see maybe whenever you get to third office Denton you know is a great place. I've lived there all my life so it's just as a thank you. Okay anybody else believe you have your direction option three with you know some caveats and costs and all those kind of things. So forward. Yep. Fantastic. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you gentlemen. You bet. Thank you very much. Great job. Let's go and take about a five or 10 minute break before we move on to agenda item C. Welcome back to this meeting of the Denton City Council. Tuesday June the fifth 2018. It is 147 we're moving through our work session reports. We are currently on agenda item 3C. Receive report hold discussion give staff direction regarding the various options to cost effectively complete reconstruction projects for the street rehab bond program. Good afternoon Mayor City Council apologize for what you have in front of you. I think you have a couple of slides that were added at the request of a few folks and we made that change this morning for clarification on some of the things that we have done. So you have that in front of you and I'm just going to run through those first three slides just as a quick reminder of where we have come from just in the short 12 months since not even 12 months since I've been here and then right after I run through the first part Danny Kramer who is our deputy director of operations for streets and drainage. He will proceed on with the discussion of streets rehab OCI those really fun things that we have to talk about. As far as capital projects department which streets and drainage are part of we have gone through whole house and reorganized that particular department so that we can focus on project delivery make sure that the projects that have lingered over the time in the form of just not getting out the door fast enough not getting designed quickly not being performed effectively. We have restructured ourselves and refocused our efforts to make sure that that's all taking place. Those things have been in the form of putting in project managers to streamlining the design process so that we can go through a every three year procurement of engineering services professional services that are needed to deliver these projects. We also have been taking a hard look at internal services what do we do if streets and drainage have limited resources in the in the form of manpower what 's the best way to deliver what we've committed to the community that we would get out there. Do we need to outsource some of that construction so we can make up for the gap that we've had over time and not being able to deliver. Those are all things that are ongoing currently. We've also been focusing our efforts and making sure that anytime we do a project we're always working with external stakeholders in the form of text on franchise utilities at most is one that we've been working a lot with lately to just make sure that we're on top of where they are where we're going to be and we really focus and plan those efforts so that it's more of a partnership. We can get a much better project when we partner with water and wastewater they have recently condensed and consolidated their water and wastewater construction efforts so that there's one point of contact there and which has made it much easier for us to also focus our efforts as a conjoined project as one complete project and not going out multiple phases and people wondering well who's coming next. We've also put in place a project management or a program management office so that we can better coordinate all those efforts that we do as a city. Right now our focus has been on establishing that PMO in regard to streets and drainage and bringing in the water and wastewater component but the intent is long term how do we coordinate the field work the work we're doing on just the things that come up on a daily basis a water main break and then we got to go repave it or something that we're doing that is just a spur of the moment or high priority now issue. Those can be coordinated along with the long term plan projects like every one of our major roadway projects or a large water line project. We put a lot of emphasis on making sure that we don't repeat some of the problems that have occurred in the past when projects take a long time to get out the door construction inflation can catch up to you quickly across the nation nationally that average sits at about four and a half percent annually in construction inflation in the Metroplex here in the Dallas Fort Worth area with all the projects that the state has going all the other communities in the area they have work going on we're actually seeing a localized construction inflation of about one percent per month so that nets out somewhere between twelve and a half to thirteen percent annually so a much greater inflation to the cost of the project as we delay getting started on construction. So our efforts have been focused on making sure that one budgets for projects have been secured in the fact that they may not have taken this into account when they were priced originally so we have taken that into account circle back and look at every one of our projects and make sure that we're appropriately funded now. And the other things we've been trying our best to do is look at projects that have similarities that can be bundled together to make sure that we get the best scaling we take advantage of scales of economy. We bundle those so that we do a better job of delivering the project just from a scheduling standpoint and efficiency standpoint. You also have a little snapshot here at the bottom is a segue into Danny's part of this discussion. Some of the street segments that we had initiated as far as what was in the 2012 and 2014 bond program in that program there were four hundred and three segments in both bond programs. Now the 2012 bond program started out looking at what was our lowest OCI scored roadways and it focused on that. The problem is is when you only focus on the number you forget that this particular segment sits right next to another segment of roadway that the OCI is not so bad. So it may not be great may not be a high OCI score but it may be sitting in the middle and doesn't look so bad. But do you really want to go and impact the neighborhood or the folks in the area multiple times over the next four or five years or do you want to do it one time. So one of the things that we have seen is with the 14 bond program there was an attempt to close that gap a little better make sure we got more of the roadways that really needed to work out under construction and then we close the gap in trying to put a complete project together so we took in more of those streets that had a little higher OCI than what we looked at before. So one of our plans was to look at what can what did we deliver in the past 13 14 15 and this is with two construction crews in house and then with some kind of contract helping those two crews typically J go public. So production may look a little small in the 13 14 we were ramping up the 2012 bond program so you had a lot of O&M funding that went into some of those streets and then you have 15 16 17 where we have steadily increased but you also have the infusion of 2014 bond dollars as we made holistic projects and not just focus on one isolated area. There was a little dip in 17 that is purely giving you the number of the 2012 and 2014 bond projects. They actually performed somewhere close to 60 to 63 segments that year and that was made up in O&M funded streets where the OCI wasn't bad enough to make it on either of the bonds but they were significant enough that instead of coming back two or three years later or the next bond program and impacting that neighborhood streets went out and said let's do this now one time. So they infused that O&M money to make that happen and then you see our projections for 18 19 and 20 as we ramp up our efforts through this bringing in contract help to make us to make these projects get out the door faster we focus on better ways of getting the streets constructed and built and complete this 2012 2014 bond program by the end of 2020 as our goal right now. Just as a brief overview this gives you a brief illustration of the green line is the percent of streets and both the 2012 and 2014 bond packages that were complete over on the left. These are the number of segments completed per year so this just really goes back to the previous slide we saw the chart but it gives you a visual reference of how many of each of these years do we accomplish in 2012 bond projects or bond segments that are these dark blue segments and the lighter blue is the 14. The 2012 does kind of ramp down a little bit as we go but it is taking into account more of this holistic approach to the project. And with that I'm gonna let Dan Kramer take over from here. Good afternoon. So we're gonna go over just some basics streets make sure by we're all on the same page understands what we're talking about as we go through. So city of Denton we maintain 426.4 miles of roadway as that's not counting our alleyways but that's our main roads in the city. You know 934 our asphalt 380 our concrete in lane miles with the total replacement cost of about 843,000 per lane mile that equals about 385 million with 909,000 vehicle trips per day on our roadways. Now you've heard everybody talk about OCI and what that stands for is overall condition index and what that is is a number from 0 to 100, 0 being the worst 100 being the best and we do these studies we've had three studies in the past that have gone through we have an outside contractor they'll come in run over it with their vehicle with different sensors and 80% of it is for the pavement condition index and 20% is for a ride index on how the road actually rides. So you know out of those out of those tests we had one in 2003, 2009 and 2015 so we do it roughly every five years to get those numbers. Now as we get those numbers we place them into our system our internal system where we track them and it tracks all of our information every change that we've made we go out we'll put work orders in it'll show the improvements or the decrease over time as how all these roads act over the years. So here's your basic scoring system raising from you know 100 down to 0. Your main categories that we're looking at is you can bundle these up into technically three different categories you got your excellent and very good which are your minor maintenance which is either our micro seal and crack seal sections you know from anywhere from 100 to a 75 then you also have your good and fair to marginal which is your 75 to 65 which those ranges usually are mill and overlays all depending on what level they are as to how deep we have to mill and do our overlay on that and then your poor to very poor which is 45 to 0 is pretty much reconstructed. It's gone far enough the deterioration is bad enough that we can't do anything else past that but go ahead and reconstruct the road. So basically a pavement life cycle curve so as you start out as road first comes up it's 100 and every day as it goes by it slowly deteriorates or just over time over normal wear and tear. So the goal is to look at your your minor maintenance and keep on top of those because in your first 40 percent of life there's only a 15 percent drop in quality. So if we can go out there and stay on top of these roads and do our due diligence which is usually anywhere between five and seven years depending on the traffic and what area the street it is on our asphalt roads we can go back and do a micro seal on these and keep coming back and that'll bring it up it won't bring it back up to 100 but as it drops down to you know close to a 75 or so you're bringing it back up to a 90 85 90 and keeps our roads continuing so you can get the same life out of an asphalt road as you can a concrete road as long as you keep all these maintenance up to date just like changing the oil on your car you need to stay on top of it or you're going to have issues down the road. So here's a condition comparison that we had so these are the 2015 numbers as you can see here in this column of when they came by and did the OCI study you know of how many percentage of our streets were in this category and then we have the current data which is from our excuse me our in-house system where we keep all the improvements that we've done and algorithms over time as the deterioration keeps coming down . So as you can see we've had a drop in some of our roads you know our biggest our excellent and very good both decreased two percent our good to marginal you know our good increase three percent because some of those were dropping down our fair to marginal five percent and poor stayed the same but our very poor increased to five percent which showing us back and forth it's not a good option. Our bond program and how we're doing this was the more we 're looking into it was underfunded and looking at the projects or we weren't looking at using it the most efficient way that we could to get it done. You know our crews have been focusing really hard on getting the bonds getting everything done and part of it I think comes into a little bit of our maintenance program is not up to par where it should be and that's part of our reconstruct and how we're looking at going in and pulling that back up so we get it where we're at where it needs to be. So here's another comparison of us and cities around the area and we're still waiting on a few more to get back to us but this is what we had at the time you know and so we're something to point out you know like Frisco you know 95 percent average OCI most of their roads are concrete and they're newer so a concrete roadway versus an asphalt concrete up front there's less maintenance coming on but as you get farther down in the life of it you have a lot more more expensive maintenance and it's you're talking about shutting roads down more often have more issues as you're doing the maintenance. As long as you keep the maintenance up little by little they can last just as long and we don't have as much you know problems with our citizens as we're shutting whole roadways down just coming in to do a little bit here and there. So some of the OCI activities that are taken care of you got your minor which is your crack seal and micro seal your major which are mill and overlay and those are for your asphalt. Now concrete also has minor repair which is just your joint and crack seal as you have those come up panel replacement that gets into a little bit more but you replace in the section instead of a whole roadway and then you also have your majors reconstructs. Another thing I want to bring up is as our crews are out there as our normal budget as we have sitting in front of us we have so much of our budget is used for OCI and so much of it is used for you know the non-OCI activities and a lot of those non-OCI activities are the emergency funds you know we have hard rain we get more potholes the guys have to go out there pull off the jobs that they're on go out and work on those get those repaired we have you know utility cuts that they work on curb and gutter replacement you know a lot of these options that we have out there are needed but we got to remember that those don't go into our OCI budget improve the overall score for the city those are just things that have to get done as we go. You know our in-house as you can see there on the on the left that's mainly what we do contract services we use some of our concrete contractors to get some of this you know basic stuff done because specialized equipment and we go from there. Daniel real quick question sir as far as the percentage of staff time how would you break down the non-OCI related activities to OCI related in other words percentage 30% non-70 or what would it's based on prior years we're sitting pretty close to 60 40% 60 60 OCI 40% non-OCI. Thank you. Yes sir. So looking at the numbers and trying to get some base numbers that we've asked for in order to go back to repair all the poor and very poor streets if we were just given a number today to get them all back to 100 and go through we 're looking at about 193 million dollars. So you know that would get now that's not counting any of the utilities or anything that's just the street repair as we have right there. So that's all the extra costs and everything else you have to get utility cuts we have to get at miss we'd have to get everybody else to go in and work on that. You know so that roughly works out to about five hundred and seventy five thousand a lane mile for those numbers on the reconstructs. How many lane miles is that do you know? That is for reconstruct that's three hundred and thirty five. And we have how many lane miles was it if I remember twelve hundred right under thirteen right under fourteen hundred with more coming on as some new subdivisions come into the area. Yes Councilmember Maltzer. Is your second bullet indicating that it would take five years to accomplish all that assuming that it were funded? What we did is we put you know best case scenario if we were given a hundred ninety three million and we could get every contractor in the area to come in here and work and shut down every street in Denton we could get it done for that amount of money. But we'd have a lot of happy people on that so probably wouldn't be the best thing. So what we did on the second bullet point we said based on inflation you know you're looking at two hundred and fifty million over the course of five years which that is probably still steep but that is more reasonable for us to start looking at and we got to go back and sharpen our pencils and look at all the timing and look at the schedules and figure out the best way that we can actually get this accomplished and get it done. But rough estimates to get the numbers that's really what we're sitting at for an investment. And I understand the dollar part but my question was about the duration. Yes. Yes you're saying more than five years because you know you can't do it all once right? Well the other question as you know Todd brought up earlier as we're working with engineering and going into our bundles internally no we are not going to be able to do that at all internally with our crews and as I'll talk here in a little bit what we're looking at for our internal crews is to turn them more into a maintenance section where they're working more on you know the micro seals and getting those roads done the crack seals the pothole repairs and everything that we have going on and then the small projects that are going to take you know a month two months and then. I'm sorry I kind of misdirected you. Just give me the full picture where I'm going with this question. You showed us a couple of slides ago was that from 2015 to today five percent of the roads slipped from I think it was fair to very poor. So you know during the time that we're working on the poor and very poor if it's five years five years plus won't another seven eight percent I don't know you tell me slip into very poor where they require reconstruct. Yes. You know then it kind of how do you how do you figure that into the you know into this obviously moving target. Well what we're looking at with with our cost right here for the for the investment would be with the bundling we're able to put more streets in there and make it more palatable for you know a contractor to come in because we're giving them a good lump sum we're giving them a lot of work so we can get more bids on it we can get more contractors coming into area and doing the bigger projects and what that will leave our guys capable of our in house crews to be able to do the maintenance be able to go back and do the get the minor maintenance which the micro seal we outsource because it's very specialized equipment but the major maintenance which is the mill and overlay we have the equipment here and we go through and we'll do the mills and we'll do the overlays so our job would be keeping there are going to be some slippages because there's some that we will not be able to fix in that time but our job is to get on the major maintenance internally and some of the minor maintenance and keep those where they're at and the best to bring them up so that there's very minimal slip into the reconstruct area which the contractors will be taking care of that. So one way we're doing this and I know it's small but it was hard to fit everything on one slide. What I've been working on here is we've had a plan now it's been on an Excel spreadsheet and if there's a change or something else comes up here there it's very hard to adjust everything in the timeline so that everybody can see where we're at and what's going on so this right here is our reconstruct including O&M and bonds you know all the way out to 2020. So what we're doing is the plan is to get everything into right now we're using project but whatever you know what we decide to use the scheduling software in the future but our goal is to have a 60 day outlook that's on a dashboard of some sort which anybody can look at so show us because we've looked at the timing and see where we're at and we can reasonably say that within 60 days our timing is going to be pretty consistent that we can go by anything past that you know you start tossing up to weather delays different areas that we didn't see issues with that are coming up you know the whole schedule is going to be out there but the goal is at first to get a 60 day schedule out there hopefully extend it to 90 but have it where we can see the dashboard see what's getting accomplished see what's out there see what's on the schedule so everybody can go and look at it anytime when they'd like to and these are updated on a weekly basis and the goal is to get all of them as we're working through you know the micro seal our milling overlay schedules and everything out there and with our PMO group tied into this what they'll take is they'll take our schedules and they'll get it with water wastewater and the public all of our franchise utilities and work everything together into one group so we can see an overall city of dentin schedule so that we can verify and we don't have any of some of the issues that we've had in the past with things popping up that we haven't seen or we didn't foresee and you know in proper planning. Yes Council Member Gregory. I think I see it under November of 18. Yes sir. I see the words bundle Hinkle Drive. Now let me tell you something I went out there this spring my wife and I went to a birthday party Carol Rittlesberger turned 100 and when I got out to the car I said honey we can't go in the car we got to go in the pickup it's got 10 ply tires I think that we can make it on Hinkle Drive the 10 ply tires but and I see Mrs. Ritt lesberger every Sunday at church 100 years old and I can avoid her because I'm a little bit faster than she is I can get because every week she says Hinkle Drive when you're going to do something about it so are we really going to start working on it in 2018 and do you think that it'll be finished so that she can see the finished product. So short answer is yes we'll be working on it in 2018 the package actually goes out to bid later this month. Hot dogs. We're making a few minor modifications to the plans right now just in light of some of the public feedback we've gotten but we are going to go to bid this month. Well she's very healthy so she may she'll enjoy seeing it completed. And for that for that conversation I think this that's why I just want to say I really like this graphic I mean it is fantastic because it allows you to if there's things that need to be shifted or whatever I mean it but at least gives you it starts that conversation right and so as we were talking earlier it's like hey be clearly wrong early give some people you know it's like hey here's here's what we have and if there is Jocelyn and around why and that sort of thing but at least it gives you something to shoot at so I just wanted to whoever you know kind of put it I mean because that's a lot of data entry and all that so I appreciate time and effort to get that squared away and then when I that way when I go kicking and screaming about something you I get I get the positives out of the way early. Thank you. Yes. So on this chart if there is not a street listed on there then that means it's not covered by the bond this is just for the bonds like say Spencer or Mills Road like okay and is there a chart a swim chart like this for for those type of streets because those are also people want to know the timing on on those as well. Yes every project that we're working on capital projects which is more what we're talking about Spencer in regard to Mayhill and McKinney they have their own individual project and because they're a little bit broader in scope and and just cost they do have their own particular project and what the PMO is working on right now is a roll up of all of those projects in tune with what Danny's put together here and the kudos Councilman Radsmith actually they really do go to him he put that together and and got that put together but they will be overlaid and the intent is to find a good layout of that so that public council can see exactly where we are at any given time. You know as I as I said earlier our goal is to have 60 day and hopefully all the way up to a 90 day we consistently see a farther breakdown of where it's starting by weeks everything past that we have set up on a quarter basis we 're gonna start in you know first quarter second third or third fourth you know and so forth just where we're at so we have placeholders and then as we set it up in this if we have you know something changes we have some issues all it is is put in that new date and everything can shift out from there so we can really see what the whole schedule is going to look like so it'll really help us in planning and making sure that we get you know the right people in the apartment we have enough people in there to get everything done that we need to get done and it also will allow everybody to see what's going on in the city and where we're at. Thank you Mayor is there a process as we you know are aggressively knocking off all these projects where by we engage the communities before we set the calendar in stone so that particularly if businesses need things to go a little way this way a little way that way you know to keep functioning that we take that into account. So that public engagement part of these projects whether it 's the streets bundled projects or its capital projects in general that's something that we 're focusing on this year absolutely and it is to make sure that we get to the public early talk about the project early before we've made any significant decisions as far as to its scope and its schedule here's what the project is try to get that feedback from them who live it on a daily basis of what potential impacts we might have both during the construction and then what might we not see just because they see it on a daily basis they give us that feedback what you will see this year is us reaching out to the public more frequently either through neighborhood association meetings or general public meetings or even if we're in the business sectors reaching out to those individual businesses on a one-on-one basis so we can really talk to them about what's coming up but that is a program we're developing with the public communications office and making sure that we're a lot more front and center with the public about that. And I appreciate hearing that I think citizens will too and do we also coordinate with text dots calendars because what I hear from citizens is sometimes it feels like they're blocked in with no escape route and then you know we hear well that 's not us that's text dot but are we coordinating in an overt way with them? Yes we meet monthly with them to talk about a variety of projects we actually have two meetings monthly with them one is in regard to the major projects the text dot has ongoing like the I-35s and the FM 2181s the big projects that they are working on and then we have another meeting that is primarily focused on development projects and capital projects we generate that will touch their areas or generate traffic that might impact them so it's a it's a back and forth. We also meet every other month with local emergency services not just our fire department and police department but local communities that come to the local hospitals as well as the county and collaborate with those entities as well on a one-on-one basis. For now some of these routes are DCTA bus routes right and some aren't now I know we've talked about the that in general the life of asphalt versus concrete but in conditions where you've got regular heavy bus traffic you know do we target those routes for concrete and rebar? That's an ongoing discussion and debate that you're seeing in a lot of communities right now not just ours but it's one we're having as well the trade-off that you have with concrete and asphalt comes down to not just how often do I maintain it but it's the cost of maintenance and then it's how long do you have that roadway when you do have to maintain it out of service. Concrete by its nature I can ramp up the cost significantly and keep it under construction on a shorter basis by going with a high early strength concrete but you do ramp the cost up significantly doing that. You'll add another 25 to 30 percent to the project potentially depending on how much of that you put in place so we try to minimize that to locations where we just have to do that in a very short time frame or just a very small area. Asphalt what we've seen over time is asphalt will perform as well as concrete over the long haul as long as you do the maintenance. You can get 30 to 50 years out of asphalt as long as you've built the foundation for the road well which was not done real well in the 70s 80s and 90s arguably the 70s they did a really good job with that but coming into the late 70 s we transitioned to the 80s and so on I mean it's a little history of the construction of roadways but you are getting thinner and thinner to minimize cost and then you're sitting here in an area of the state where we have very clay soil so you got a lot of contraction expansion so the roadway flexes a lot. The problem with concrete when I'm sitting on that type of soil is concrete by its nature is very rigid. So anytime something happens underneath the concrete until the concrete fails we really don't know what's going on. The advantage of asphalt is that if I build it right to take on the weight the traffic the amount of traffic and its longer lifespan I'll see flex ing of the pavement underneath the actual pavement itself so the foundation starts to give I can see it and I can address it quickly when it's less expensive but it does mean you have to be watching it you have to keep an eye on it you have to be doing the routine maintenance that Danny is trying to make sure that we do that every year as we go forward. Councilmember Gregory has a question. Councilmember Meltzer reminded me of something that I want to put out there when you were talking about the DCTA roofs because a few years ago I think it was shortly after I got it we had some roads reconstructed and some of the money came from DCTA because it was roots that they used regularly and they had some funding available for that and I think that we ought to just maybe put a note somewhere to that effect go back and do the research on how that money came about if that was RTC money that they got or what and if there might be any more available because certainly those heavier buses have a bigger impact than all of the automobiles. Some of the key takeaways is you know the lack of the bond implementation what we're going to do to work on that is refocusing our internal crews on maintenance and small reconstruct projects that's our main goal to get our guys to be able to work we're mobile we can go do you know our small projects that we need to get done that don't have a long duration and then we can work on the emergency repairs that have to get done on a daily time you know work you know on the bonds bundling and contracting out as much as possible so that we can get more bidders in more contractors and have the ability to get some better pricing as we're going through and we can get more work done because if I throw a contractor out there tell them they're starting at a and they're ending at B they're on that road the whole time until they get it finished you know if I have our guys out there and we have an emergency somewhere I got to juggle which crew I need to pull off to pull them to somewhere else to fix that emergency and that job may sit idle for a few days while they're fixing that emergency you know and that's never good in the public side is to be able to see that road that started working on it and then they come by three four days out of a week and then there's no one there and it just seems like we don't know what we're doing so you know that's one of our things to work on our current street budget our proposed budget currently is sitting around 15 million that's what we propose so far this year we're going back and we're relooking at some stuff but if we look at it you know an increase of close to 20 to 25 million that would really get us to where we need to be to get our the correct amount of micro seal because this year we have 57.9 lane miles which we're doing micro seal on and that is seven hundred and eighty eight thousand dollars to get that amount done now this goes up and down based on the price for everything but that's what this bid was for so looking at the next years we need to look at and we're putting the plan together now and I don't have all the numbers for you but we're looking at what we need to do to keep our maintenance schedule going and keep it where it needs to be you know every five to seven years you need to go out and do something to an asphalt road so what we're looking at implementing is we have we have the ability we just haven't been using it in the proper way that we can I want to put flags out on our on our cartograph system which tells us what our OCI's are so that when it comes up on each road it's on a rotating schedule every five to seven years it pops up based on you know where we're at on the road every five years it throws a flag up and says hey we need to go take a look at this road we need to check it we'll have the guys go out take a look does it need to be micro sealed this year can it last another two years where we're at on that and if it if it you know comes up and says we do okay we'll put it on the next year and that's one that we plan and just keep going that way so we keep a constant you know constant cycle through all of our roads so all of them are getting looked at and where we're at you know and that's all in just getting the software set up that we have and looking to what we need to do to make sure that we are using all the tools to the best of our ability you know and you know like I said earlier the 2012-2014 bond package together was roughly about 44 million you know and just again to reinstate to really get everything from the poor very poor which is 45 below that's almost 250 million when you look at that spread out over five years based on inflation going with the 12.5 percent based on the construction area you know that's and we are currently going back looking at all the numbers verifying all that but that's you know kind of where it looks like it 's sitting as of right now and yes sir now they have the question side so what exactly does that assuming we figure out where to find it does the 25 million buy versus the 15 million in terms of the the profile you know of our of our OCI spectrum let's say and isn't there is there a point where you know we start seeing benefits like is this a surge so to speak where eventually you know we're going to see it settle down because you know I saw a slide earlier it says spend the dollar here you don't have to spend eight dollars there correct right so it's a 15 million pardon me 25 million dollars inde finitely or just for a period of time and then where does it settle out to so really get and what's the sure kind of prospects so you've got a lot of things at play as that long list of roadways you saw in there broken down into categories obviously every year those roads start to fall into a different category unless something's done to them so what the 25 million is based on is what would be the ongoing maintenance cost to maintain what we have once they're at an acceptable level that's what you're looking at today but we got to get the vast majority of those roadways up to that point so that we can maintain that just like your car you can drive your car for 10 15 20 years if you maintain it but at some point the thing's still going to fall apart or you're going to want a new one but what we're looking at is if you drive it that long you're that dedicated your car at some point there becomes a point where that car is not safe to drive you're going to have that with roads at some point I don't care if it's concrete asphalt you're going to hit 30 40 50 years if we've done the proper maintenance to it and that road is still going to fall into such a fashion that we can't maintain it at an acceptable level so you're always going to have somewhere in the neighborhood of five to ten percent of your total roadway inventory that's going to fall into that level of I need to reconstruct it and that goes into your next I would propose that goes into your next bond program those are your capital projects come the next time around but you get away from where we are now where we're at 25 percent of our roads that fall into that category and you get it down to a manageable level so I'm not out there trying to chase 40 to 45 million dollars a year to reconstruct roadways by themselves just to catch up if I wanted to reset everything in five years. Just make sure I'm tracking so the 25 million is covering the the bringing the marginal and the fair you know and and the good up to right over the sort of second tier was right let me just throw that back up yeah that that 25 million maintains these top three knowing that some of these down here are old age roads just in a typical scenario not these actual numbers some of those would be falling off into that very poor scenario because they're just getting that old and they need that kind of work but this would maintain these top tiers and about half of this bottom tier here in the minor maintenance it would bring those back up into either a very good or good status so that we could continue to get extended life out of those and so that's kind of an ongoing view as long as we have roads and if we don't do that at 15 million we're always going to be having roads you know high level of roads in the poor and very poor right that's part of what you've seen in the past if you just look at these bottom two numbers where we've grown from 20 to 25 percent that's where that gap is starting to break itself apart is if I add the additional funding to streets maintenance that helps prevent my loss in the total number of roadways that fall into these major reconstruct category. Where's the street impact fees that have been bearing on this discussion? Roadway impact fees yep they can be used for a lot of different things typically they end up going towards infrastructure improvements that are needed by the city but are usually developer generated but they can go in a variety of places as long as they fall within that particular service area. I thought well when you say infrastructure I thought road impact fees were for roads they are but that's what I'm talking infrastructure yeah. Yes Councilmember Hutsworth. How was and I think are we phase one on Mockingbird is that what we just finished or because I know it's all the way done but I think I saw on your calendar it stands and I think if I remember correctly from the presentations we did the p aving piece is what we're missing at this point we're finishing I think believe we have finished up all the utilities and I'll get you a better update on that one than what I have off top of my head right now I know the utilities are complete the paving portion is what we're waiting on. Well I drove the whole stretch from McKinney to whatever that backside is so that what's that thank you that's right and so it's paid but maybe it's curve component anyway my point is our question is how did that go because that's a obviously there's a large neighborhood there and I'm assuming you've deployed some I mean there were one there was a large educational piece before we started but how did that go was how was there feedback as far as during that construction were there any points of contention I would have to deal with our street superintendent give you a better idea of that I don't have that fingertips but I can certainly get it for you okay yeah I just like to know that that to me is a good sampling because of the large neighborhood in that area and it was a complete rebuild sure so just kind of understanding how we're doing and I'm impairing that with the large efforts up front to communicate what was coming how it was working out and to kind of take that understand how that went and use that information in the future as we're getting into some of these projects again the messaging that sort of thing so absolutely thank you cut a question I remember when we've done the OCI before I have it before you were here I also would like I wanted some information on the reliability of that science so to speak because we're placing a lot of emphasis on this one kind of standard of measurement and what I see is in 2015 was when our last quote unquote OCI official kind of drive by did they drive every street in Denton yes every street all right so current Denton streets this is based upon some kind of model of deterioration yes is that correct yes that's how you are coming up with this so I don't need to know it now but if offline maybe you could send out a report to the council on that model how that model is calculated based upon expenses because what I'm hearing is you're talking about twenty five million dollars but yet forty percent of our budget for street maintenance goes to non-related OCI activities so I mean obviously we have a lot of things that we are responsible for other than those things that sort of maintain you know reduce the or mitigate the level of deterioration over time yes so I'd like to see that model sure and and just you know refresher of the information on OCI in general because and we'll have a good comparison here shortly the OCI study is being redone now they're getting started soon yeah we should have the revised OCI models from actual sampling this year and we can compare the two models to see the degradation and how they match up but the model does take into account previous OCI studies as well as we started and we can put that into that summary sure because what would be interesting is the roads that we've reconstructed because let's face it we've seen roads that have been reconstructed that within a couple of I mean I've seen it myself a couple two or three years they'll be cracks two inches wide and so it's not just it's also are we ensuring that either the contractors or ourselves and this isn't impugning anybody it's just saying are we doing the best following best practices as far as because I've always understood it was the foundation of the road that is the most critical that it's not the asphalt or the concrete it 's how you prepare that road bed absolutely and it would be interesting to see some of the OCI ratings on roads that are only four or five years old either that we performed in -house we can reconstruct it in-house or that were reconstructed using contractors as we 've noticed we've got the engineering firm to look at some of these cracks in our concrete subdivisions and things such as that so yeah I think just to refresh your course on that whole model and OCI and because I remember when that first came online when I was on council I thought okay this sounds good but we're basing a tremendous amount of money budgets you know reporting of you know our streets are falling apart and they're degrading every day and you know seems like other people are using it too but just nice to be refreshed on what that really entails I mean absolutely 20 percent is rideability okay I mean I guess the road could ride pretty rough but still be in good shape and it can ride pretty smooth to be in horrible shape yeah is that my understanding yes okay okay yes I don't know if this is the right comparison but maybe you can build on this thought but would you have access to knowing safer flower mound what their annual budget dollars per road mile you know that they have in their total network is you know just as a benchmark for whether you know our estimation makes sense or if there's anything we could learn from others who apparently are keeping up their their OCI's if that is the right measure we can absolutely take a look at that and get you an update on that one we did get some information from them for a flower mound with the 95 you know 95 percent OCI their annual budget for the roadway was five million sorry that was Frisco we'll check on the rest of them to get that obviously quite different because it's all new and all concrete right that's flower man I thought might be more comparable plus you know it's a more more attainable I think was 80 percent so anyway that's just a suggestion maybe there are others because and then it also kind of raises the question maybe for finance of you know how do other communities finance other communities that maintain their roads well how do they how do they finance this level of you know road maintenance you know we're obviously not the only city that has to maintain roads but you know do they have higher tax rates or do they you know starve other services or you know how how how do they accomplish it so as we give you a little bit of a preview that what you'll see we are putting together the 2018-19 budget right now basically same approach we took last year balancing it to the effective rate but we're gonna do we're gonna provide you some different alternatives this year and that's gonna basically be for every one cent we're gonna put some together some strata there and some decision-making points one of the one of a couple things in the base budget probably gonna be funding another five to seven inspectors for the roads because we 've seen the obvious I think you're absolutely right mayor in terms of the inspections inspection time of our roads not being adequate and that plays a little bit of a part in it the tech it's so it's not going to matter what they're funding the rates at how they're funding the roads if they're not being built right to begin with and they're all coming in at different levels we're all at a different point in time in terms of where our roads surface it how we how we pay for it how old they are how aggressive we've been historically so the inspectors is going to be a major key budget ask for the for the council next year and during the last two bond committee discussions my understanding is that there was up to a three cent increases approved by the voters for the bond programs the city never took advantage of that so one of the things that we may be taking time giving you a choice on is maybe maybe we budget to the effective rate and you add a petty or two leverage that funding to make those bond programs whole the bond programs are probably somewhere in the sixty to seventy percent value of what it was actually approved because there was not engineering plans for the major roads that were ready to go when the bonds are passed so all that time takes time and you're seeing inflation erode those bond packages also the cost of just simply designing the roads wasn't built into the bond packages that's further eroding the bond packages so we've got a number of suggestions for you that you'll be able to kind of bite into and and and we've got another I think it's roughly right now just another seven hundred thousand dollars a year going towards the road maintenance just from the natural growth in the franchise fee taxes so this is huge on our list it's going to be a major point of discussion for you and where you're going to see most of our recommendations being made there's still some things in public safety that we want to discuss with you but staffing of the roads building them properly engineering them up front and and then continuing to move dollars into that bond program to make those programs whole I think those are probably going to be the crux of our discussion with council this year and I think if we can expedite some of that reconstruct route reconstruct money up there and be a little bit more aggressive on the maintenance it should make a big difference over the next three four or five years as we're preparing for the next bond package but there's no sense trying to throw you know 20 million 25 million dollars a year of maintenance on roads until you get them built right to begin with so that's really going to be the you know the discussion that we have with you I think it makes sense it's just a matter of philosoph ically where do you want to set the tax rate and we're going to give you those choices and we'll move forward as aggressively as you want us to. Councilmember Ryan. Thank you Mayor. On the OCI rating I've seen the segment by segment list do we have that as a GIS at all is it on a map that we can we'd be able to look at. We do. And I asked that from we've got you know right now we're discussing reconstruction as putting back the same as what we had but we've got Bonnie Bray May hill you know some other roads that we may want to think about for the next bond package that it'd be interesting to know the roads that we're actually going to increase capacity on are they you know where are we on OCI on those I would assume that the street like Bonnie Bray right now it's pothole repair we're not going to go in and do anything we're going to be ready reconstructing it so. We can give you that information pretty quickly the map here shows you every street and then we've got it broken out where we can give you a map that shows you just the worst ones. Obviously yes you're absolutely correct every one of our capital projects that are streets related they have an OCI related to that roadway and the O CI will reset itself once the construction is complete. And we can give you that breakdown. Okay I think that would also be helpful for the bond committee when we get into the next round to not only what we want to reconstruct but you know which you know is it is it time for Ryan road to be widened or you know I know capacity also falls into that category absolutely I think the OCI will be an important factor on those decisions. Yes sir. Yes. Just to follow up on my earlier point I completely appreciate what you're sort of preparing us for Mr. City Manager. The sort of additional ask that I'm putting out there is whether we can learn from cities that already have a history of being good at maintaining roads because we don't have that history and in terms of seeing how they approach you know what's the breakout of their budgets and what's their tax rates right because this is you know it looks almost like a well it looks like a really daunting lift but you know clearly there are other communities that do it so how are they different from us. That's my ask to see if that could help us you know give us guidance as we try to make our choices. We'll put together a matrix that makes it simple to see I think there's always going to be that caveat we're not starting from the same point but we can at least we can at least give you some data in terms of how we compare and where we are I think I think it ultimately at the end of the day I go back to repeat the you know repeat what I said again we've got to lift a number of those streets up to the good to excellent category aggressively maintain them and make sure that we've got the proper inspection staff over time it will start changing but it you know there's just the numbers they're showing you are in my opinion merely interesting because that 250 million dollars you saw doesn't include you know tens of millions of dollars of water and wastewater infrastructure to go ahead with that which would require significant rate increases so I think I think this incremental approach and giving you some choices about where you believe the public tolerance is is probably the best way to go and then what I like about what Todd Daniel they're making it look easy it's not been easy getting this organized over the last year but what I like about where they're going with this is it makes it very simple to have discussions with the next bond committee you know it becomes that time to discuss when it's time to go out you know how to size a bond package they've got the information ready to go I think the big change that we've been talking about is before we start you know is we're starting to get permission to move forward with the next bond package if it gets approved is making sure that we've got all the engineering done up front that is really the thing that has hurt this bond these last couple bond packages the most is having to wait several couple of years and then and we're just now engineering Hinkle after that cost estimate of that roadway is eroded 30 40 percent so that is probably the biggest lesson learned out of all this is scheduling it making sure that we you know are appropriately taking care of in-house what we can and then making sure that the engineering is done up front to help hold inflation to in check the best that we can anyway. Yes, Mr. City Manager I have an ask for a surprise a graphic that would capture exactly what you just said because it's come up now twice and as we go into the budget I know it's going to come up more is there's a legacy issue as far as here's the data that was compiled and here's what supported that data versus then versus now so not to put your staff I'm trying to make it is is vanilla as possible but I think I do need some sort of timeline or a procedure list that says here's how we approach bonds in 2017 2018 and here's how the bonds best we can tell were approached then and so there may be 10 steps now and then maybe five steps then I just need to better see and be able to because I think that's going to be an educational component when you say if and when we go to the voters and we say hey we want you to support these bonds and they say well you're 200 roads behind or wherever we are we're closing ground I think it's important to say no no no here's the difference in approaches and and and be able to educate how we got there that sort of thing and what's changed and and and so it's not all because that's educational for me it's not all just it didn't happen it was we weren't prepared to make it happen and then we lost money and so it kind of just kind of rolled downhill so I think that education will prove will prove helpful and answer a lot of questions when we get to that point again we're happy to do it all right okay anybody else oh did you have more slides no we got the questions this time so very helpful thank you I appreciate that great great report great data good data okay if there's no more questions we 'll move on to our next agenda item which is agenda item 3d receive report and hold discussion give staff direction regarding the city of denton drainage system improvements planned or implemented since and or planned or implemented since the 2007 flood so I also didn't have a complete presentation on Friday so I'm passing out a few maps I created this weekend that were not in the backup on Friday but they did get in on Monday morning so just in case you didn't see those these are the additional maps and we will we will provide I know somebody will ask the question we will provide these these new updates to our city secretaries she can help post this to the website okay they're already on the website they are now yes they are thank you they got put on the website Monday morning okay good afternoon mayor council members I'm Chad Allen deputy city engineer and I was invited here today to give an update about drainage projects that have been implemented or constructed since the 2007 flood so I'm going to talk about 25 different projects 17 of them are past drainage projects and eight of them are more current drainage projects that are happening right now so the past range projects are in two categories the projects that were specifically funded after the flooding event in 2000 and seven and then there's ten additional projects I'm going to talk about that were already on the radar but were expedited after that flood so in April of 2007 a huge storm hovered over Denton and unleashed a huge amount of rain in the city and caused flooding around the city and in the downtown area in October of that year city council approved the sale and delivery of two seven million twenty five thousand dollars in certificates of obligation specifically for the design and construction of drainage projects so at that time seven projects were identified to be designed and constructed with the CEOs also there's ten additional projects that were expedited after that flood so these are the seven CEO projects five of these projects have been completed and two of them are still ongoing the Kings Road drainage project actor Street Mingo Road and Paisley box culverts Magnolia and Strickland ponds those have all been completed between September of 2009 and February of 2012 the last two projects Mingo Road at Cooper Creek and peck for drainage improvements are still ongoing here's a map that shows those projects and where they lie around the city these projects consist of box culver improvements like down here at Mingo Road new curb inlets and storm drain in roads that didn't have that kind of infrastructure like an actor Street two different detention ponds and Magnolia and Strickland and then sort of a combination of culvert and channel improvements at Kings Row again peck for and Mingo Road are still ongoing these are the ten additional drainage projects that were expedited after the flood and constructed they've all been completed between early 2008 and the end of 2015 all of these projects were built the city of didn't spend about six point three million dollars on these drainage improvements again here's a map that shows those projects and again these are culvert improvement projects channelization projects and then street storm sewer and curb inlet type projects and then these are more current drainage projects in 2014 bond program five drainage projects were identified and funded as part of the program that's a error on the slide sorry there's five of the projects and then there's some more recent smaller revenue funded drainage projects these are funded with the drainage fee they're designed by in-house staff and constructed by in-house construction crews so these are the five 2014 bond drainage projects they're all ongoing the completion dates in the right column are when we expect construction to be completed councilmember sir has a question sure will you be sharing with us what the phases of PEC for are yes I will be okay okay so the next slide is going to more detail about each of these more current projects this is Eagle Drive drainage phase two the blue part on this map is phase two phase one was constructed as part of the ten additional projects in the past projects category this project is complete we're going to pick up at the upstream end of the phase one project and build this new large box culvert crossing elm down Myrtle down to Eagle where it connects to an existing box underground the benefits of this project is it's going to alleviate long-term recurring flooding in Eagle each of these intersections in Myrtle and in this entire area this neighborhood area that had flooded for years and years yes councilmember Briggs so on the you said all that will be underground this is all this box culvert is all underground there's inlets on the surface of the ground that capture water and put it into the boxes and then there's curb inlets and Eagle Drive that do the same thing and in elm and in locust so the engineers opinion of probable construction costs for Eagle Drive drainage phase two is 1.9 million we just opened bids for this project last month low bid was 2.1 million and we're about to go to construction we anticipate starting construction on Eagle Drive drainage phase two in August of this year we've received bids we've opened them we're working on the contracts now construction will be beginning in August we believe this is Magnolia drainage phase two phase one of Magnolia drainage was construction of this detention pond up here I showed it earlier it was one of the seven initial projects funded after the flood that phase one detention pond really reduced the amount of water that flowed into this neighborhood this neighborhood is flooded for decades it has an underside storm drain system and so this detention pond kept some of the water from getting down in this neighborhood Magnolia drainage phase two will also reroute additional water instead of coming into the neighborhood it's going to be rerouted in these box culverts down Winds or and then down Hinkle to North Pecan Creek so this is really going to improve flooding conditions in this neighborhood as part of this project we're also reconstructing Hinkle Drive this is the bundle this is the famous Hinkle bundle so we're reconstructing Hinkle Drive from University up to Windsor and then we're reconstructing Windsor from Hinkle to Elm the engineers probable opinion of probable construction cost is six point seven three million dollars we're advertising for bids for this project this month and we anticipate construction beginning in October in November of this year this is the downtown drainage trunk line South Bell and Oak Street project this shows all phases of the project we're breaking it into two phases phases one and phase two this project came about because of a downtown master drainage plan that was created in June of 2013 five projects came out of that master plan that would allow improving street drainage in the downtown area this project represents three of the five top projects again we're going to build it in phases because phase two we're anticipating coordination issues with the railroad we wanted to expedite phase one and go ahead and get it under construction and also build this segment in Oak Street adjacent to a development that's happening right here the engineers opinion of probable construction cost for phase one is seven hundred and eighty thousand dollars we anticipate advertising for b ids for phase one in August of 2018 and we expect construction to start at the end of the year for phase one phase two is going to follow up with that after we coordinate with Union Pacific Railroad Chad on the ones that you're giving us the construction commencement date yep could you go back in and offline and just say what are you thinking is the construction time like on Hinkle and Magnolia that's a big project uh-huh I mean that just the drainage alone that's so and then the reconstruction of the street so yeah we're going to start it maybe this year but it may take two or three years I mean I don't have any idea so it'd be nice if maybe if you went back and as best as you could obviously and if you don't comfortable doing that understand but just trying to get an idea of okay what what what a reasonable completion time would be given that things are you don't have a lot of you know extenuating circumstances that really okay yeah well you don't need to do that you don't need to do that on these now I'm just saying go back no no no I have basically a beginning date on this slide and then a completion date right here okay though that's good yes that'll work we can do some subtraction that'll work okay so yeah Eagle Drive we're gonna start in August of 2018 we expect it to take about a year so we're expecting to finish in September of 2019 do you want to go through all the projects like that no no just no just and when you get to this slide we'll see it and and uh I mean if you've got it on there I'll just go back and review the backup again so we're okay yep thank you all right yep we're good okay I believe I was on peck four so this is the peck four project it consists of drainage improvements shown indicated by this red line on the map and then we've also combined it with utility reconstruction project in locust and an elm the blue lines on this map represent the utility reconstruction that we need to do and then the red line is the construction of the large box culverts they're going to help remove the floodplain and cure flooding in the downtown area so what are the utility improvements is it water wastewater so it's water and wastewater lines that are very old we have a history of breaks that we have a lot of problems on these lines they're right in the middle of the text dot roads locust and elm and it's taken us a long time to get permits from text dot in order to rebuild those utilities because text dot doesn't want you to reloc ate those and and leave them in the roadway so for a long long time for years they refused to give us a permit for this project because they wanted us to move the utilities outside the roadways and there's no room you know there's no room so finally we're coordinating with text dot we've done a really good taw's done a really good job of this over the last year to coordinate with text dot and to organize this turn back of these roadways after they're rebuilt and as part of that process text is going to let us rebuild the utilities in the road but we need to do it at the same time or before we do these drainage improvements so we've coordinated all the projects together okay we're going to go to council member Gregory and then councilmember did you have a question and then councilmember hudson yeah so then what i think i'm hearing you say is that we already have a long-term phased in agreement with text dot for transfer of the roads from elm and locust from being text dot facilities to being city facilities and and part of that is contingent on we're redoing the utilities under those roads they're going to rebuild those roads and then they turn them over to us after they've been rebuilt and they become our responsibility is that the three phases so that is exactly what the agreement is going to be right now basically we have a very short memorandum that says this is our plan text out we want to work with you to implement what you just described but we do not have that agreement signed just because we told them we're going to work with you to implement that they've allowed us to move forward with these projects how do you want to say anything else about that you keep creeping up on me trying to make you nervous so part of the ongoing coordination efforts that we have with text that has been this discussion of how do we phase the roadway piece before the roadways become the city of dentons and they they leave text dot control text that's required to upgrade that roadway they need to bring it to current standard and out of disrep air so this is a very concerted effort on our part and text dots we may not have a written agreement but what we have is several conversations from folks in the text dot area office and district offices saying that they are tailoring all their maintenance to come and do these roadway improvements beginning next summer so there's an impetus on impetus on us to get all this done as fast as possible so they can come in and pave element locust all the way up to university drive so this is really just step one and a very big project but you know they change those folks in that office pretty frequently so if we could get it on paper it would be helpful I think we will work to memorialize that the what happens to us highway 77 and us highway 377 do they get moved over to is that a route that goes over to 35 or does it go over to Carroll Boulevard what happens it would merge essentially 377 would basically 377 77 would basically become I 35 and they would just merge as the same designation through town thank you yes so whenever text dot will redo these roads will that include sidewalks or just repayment of the roads their part is just doing the repayment of the roadways that is what they're required to do part of what we are talking to the Council of Governments about is how do we utilize a long-standing sidewalk improvement plan that the city has had and get that additional funding so when we finish all the improvements on them and look as they do include that pedestrian component that would be really nice and so on this there are some current old rock channels there kind of historical and so will they be messed with during this project some of them will they are now part of the problem that we have with those rock line channels is is they are old and they you know they were there to reinforce but they weren't there to reinforce forever so part of that is an ongoing maintenance hazard for us especially as storm water more and more imper vious area is introduced into the downtown area you do have water that comes through there faster than was originally designed for and it causes issues for us so you do have some ongoing maintenance there that's a problem for us we will be preserving what we can but I cannot promise that we will be able to preserve all of it and so when you're not preserving something are you making it bigger and larger and more concrete these are all enclosed underground okay so you you what you will see it be the surface treatment whether it's grass because it's in a landscaped area where it's a roadway or parking lot or wherever it is okay okay thank you very much I think you answered my question but just to sum up give me the give me the time frame again for what do you what do you envision the rollover work being done what is that kind of general time frame and then and then is my the little curb cut mixed in do I have to wait for that or will that happen before then and will so the the pecan and sycamore intersect I think you're talking about we're going to be doing that beforehand because that just needs to happen for accessibility reasons as far as the overall schedule as we talked about just a few minutes ago there are multiple components to this turn back and it even extends beyond just eagle and university there 's discussion ongoing discussion right now textile would like to turn over all of 77 from 35 e where Dallas Drive comes down all the way up to 35 north of 288 so that's in the background and some of the discussions all we're focused on right now is the part that we've talked about turning over the segment of element locust from eagle to university so the way this would work is we phase in all the utility work we do the utility work in locust first that would be where we would focus the drainage in the utility relocations on the southern end of locust and because text out wants to be able to start the paving from the very southern end and continue all the way north to university drive we have another project that is completing design right now it's about 95 percent complete that we anticipate letting to do utility relocations on the northern segment of locust so by the time tech star starts paving they can just do the entire road all the way to the north then while they 're paving we're going to jump back over to elm and hit the southern segment to complete out the drainage piece and the utility relocations and then go do the northern relocations on elm about that time it's a very coordinated concert of construction ballet so we say okay very good thank you yes yes member message nelson so uh with both this project as well as eagle driver wherever we introduce fox culverts um but we're going to end up with basically land where there was a channel with with triple water before and do we have the rights to that land so that drainage easement does that continue to be seen by them so right now they're they are in containing what we would call a drainage easement they're specifically for us to be able to construct and then maintain drainage to be able to do something beyond that we'd have to go back to the property owners and talk to them about a pedestrian easement or some similar right of pedestrian use or public use through there that we could convey with that same easement so there's there's that early considering just so others can tell from heading to obviously we'll chat about this uh you've got a surface set somehow sure uh would it be uh would it be particularly more expensive or less expensive for those surfaces where they're right now to become safe off-road hiking bike paths potentially within green space there's absolutely a chance uh there's a very good opportunity and a lot of communities are recognizing that where we can utilize flood prone or flood prone or drainage areas for more of a park or recreational aspect trails um picnic areas things like that we can look at that and that is part of an effort that we have ongoing we just this week we had a discussion with economic development about how do we put together a potential stormwater master plan that would look at exactly those kinds of areas as well as redevelopment based in those drainage and flood prone areas. Could we look at how these paths would intersect with uh with our mobility plan generally whether they intersect with existing bike travel lanes and just there's a way to uh kind of add value to that. Absolutely and we would propose to cross-reference that with the parks trail system as well. Councilmember Gregory. And along those lines would that mean that we could use uh parks dedication fees that we're collecting for the downtown area to help uh buy those uh pedestrian bicycle path easements. That's out of my room of expertise. We'll certainly take a look at that that's a good idea so we'll see if we can uh what restrictions are placed on those funds right now. So just to emphasize and I mean these are great ideas but you said something that is very critical and that is you've got to go back and get a different type of easement for every one of these sections where we just have an eas ement and so these things run behind people's homes uh next to their yards so that's it's going to be uh if that's going to be the the direction of council that's great but it's probably going to be an interesting endeavor. I don't know if it'd be a challenge or not. I don't know uh and I don't know what those things are worth some people may dedicate them what happens if you get some who want to do it and some who don't so you got all these different segments so um that that's a big challenge that we certainly are have the option to pursue um but I just don't know how all that configures down through there amongst the neighborhoods. Yes councilmember. It's a good point and uh pre-tm was at the last bike Texas conference and uh got some interesting information that that uh those kinds of facilities next to a property actually increase the value of those properties uh so so um if we if we communicate that information to those folks pro properly that this is an enhancement to their property we could probably do it without without having to go through condemnation. Yeah I'd be and I'd be really hesitant to start condemning people for pedestrian pedestrian walkways on drainage improvements um but uh yeah and I think that also is dependent upon the increase of value that's very site specific that's very city specific I mean I can see that in some places and in some places I so I hear that but I just would like to get more into that process to determine what the what the status is of that. Yes councilmember Melzer. Will you be getting into uh what the area is that will be removed from the floodplain and uh oh yes that is it that's coming out right sorry don 't make you push ahead you're you're getting there uh and then I'll just ask you this is phase one and two out of I think four phases. Yes and and will you be describing what phase three and four are. I didn't include phase three and four. I mean just uh you know in a sentence. Sure yeah phases three and four extend the project up to the north and the west and they end at Mulberry and Bernard and um again it's box culvert up past the Denton County Historic Park and then up to Mulberry and over to Bernard there is a big section of that rock line channel that's kind of north of Mulberry that we're going to leave open local drainage on either side you know that's a low point local drainage flows into that rock line channel and then we'll eventually get into the culvert system so that's probably going to stay um that project's under design right now we're designing phases three and four. And the same issues would pertain to but the benefits and the challenges of making that into pedestrian and bike. The engineer's opinion profession construction cost is um 8 .5 million dollars we're about to advertise for bids for PEC four phases one and two including utilities in July and we expect construction to begin in October and November. I think oh yeah and then these last three projects are the smaller revenue funded projects that were designed by in-house staff and they're being built by in-house construction crews. I passed out a revised slide because this had some errors on it I apologize. Kingswood Court is um the construction is complete. Canterbury Court construction's 80 percent complete and Royal Lane and Rockwood Drain Improvements is still in the design process it's 60 percent complete. So here's a map that shows those projects um Kingswood Court is a little cul-de-sac down here by Teasley Lane that flooded at the southern end where it was low water would spill over the curb and flood some properties in this area so we built a storm drain in the cul-de-sac and we're draining up to London Dairy Lane. Canterbury Court includes alley improvements in this area and underground storm drain that prevents flooding of some houses downstream of the alley here and then Royal Lane and Rockwood Drain Improvements includes storm drain and inlet construction in Royal Lane, Rockwood and Misty Lane that's going to prevent flooding of these neighborhoods these homes right here by Nettie Schultz Park. So these are the revenue funded drainage projects that are currently under design and construction and that's all the drainage projects the 25 drainage projects major drainage projects that we've been working on since the 2007 flood. Council Member Gregory. Thank you. On page three you were showing two projects from the 2007 CO bonds that were not completed and you've explained PEC 4 but you didn't explain Mingo Road and Cooper Creek. Okay so Todd's gonna help me with this one. Okay. So Mingo Road has been very first of all it's been a complicated technical design process. A lot of the delay associated with Mingo Road has been has had to do with the railroad the Union Pacific Railroad but before we even get there it wasn 't really all about Mingo Road it was about how to fix the entire drainage watershed in in particular Cooper Creek so we didn't just look at Mingo Road improvements we looked at we conducted a study and we looked at detention pond and regional detention improvements upstream so our consultant Jacobs studied the whole Cooper Creek basin and decided we needed to do multiple types of improvements regional detention and then improvements in Sherman and improvements in Mingo. So when this project was originally funded we kind of went through that whole process of looking at the basin as a whole and then we started working with the Union Pacific Railroad. So we realized a couple years after starting the project that the railroad was going to be a key constriction for flow downstream of Mingo Road so we started coordinating with them and it took us years to participate with them to rebuild their bridge we actually gave money to the rebuilding of the Union Pacific Railroad bridge adjacent to Mingo Road. I think we finally I think the railroad finished that project in 2015 and we had executed a contract with them about a year before to help fund those improvements. Unfortunately there were some issues with the design of the railroad it didn't add the capacity that was needed in order to benefit the upstream areas it was originally expected to lower the water service elevation when they when they widened that bridge but in the end it did not do what it was supposed to do after it was constructed so we started dealing with those issues and then now we're looking at M ingo Road and more of a sort of large project and corridor type level. Todd can talk to you about that if you'd like to do that. Well I'll wait till he's done and then I'll ask my follow- up. So part of what we've done is you the Mingo Road culverts washed out what two years ago? Yes. So new culverts were put back in place after the roadway being closed for a good portion of time. I don't remember what the exact time was. Two years. Two years. So then culverts were put in place. The constriction that we have continually to provide some kind of or level of safety for or at least reduce the flood control measures within that neighborhood to the north it's it's all west no west east of Old North Road on the north side of University Drive it's impacted by this. You can think of it like trying to put a bunch of water through a little tiny hose and that hose is the railroad bridge crossing. We could not get it widened far enough to really remove the flood restrictions that were causing the backup into the neighborhood. So what we've done right now is we are currently looking to engage based on the selection process the RFQ that we put through last fall stormwater design to look at that entire area from much more refined and global perspective and then tying that into what does mingle road need to be long term from Bell Avenue all the way up to Old North and just beyond to include this Cooper Creek crossing. It's a much more holistic approach to how are we going to resolve this scenario. Okay couple of follow ups. So when Union Pacific rebuilt that trestle. Yes sir. It increased capacity didn't it. To a degree yes but it didn't significantly draw the water surface elevation down. It did bring it down a little bit but not much. Okay. Is but but aren't the culverts that we have on mingle road even more restricting the capacity than the railroad is. No not not really. So if mingle road was the only thing there it would be the cause but the issue is is the railroads here and mingle road is down here right so the pipes underneath the road they pass water but the vast majority of the stormwater goes over the road and what's holding up the water is the passage of water underneath the railroad bridge. It's more restrictive because it just can't go anywhere until it gets much higher and goes over the top of the railroad. We may have to talk offline because it seems to me if you 've got a dam here and a dam here and the water is piling up here it's this dam the mingle road dam that's holding it up and that's why it's going over. But that's true but you have a couple of things that happen when anytime and use a good analogy as a dam anytime you cross a creek with a culvert crossing that's a very good analogy because that's exactly what happens. Anytime you put some kind of culvert underneath the road there's a restriction in the amount of flood maybe minimal but just because you're trying to take a wide expanse of water and force it into a little straw it does have an impact on how much water can get through. Now mingle is why that thing washed out right but it had been there a very long time before it finally washed out so part of what happens is you had corrugated metal underneath the roadway which rusts over time and as it rusts the structural integrity erodes and the soil goes underneath it the whole thing goes away. Part of what we're dealing with is I have two dams back to back one higher than the other with just a small hole that may be a little bit bigger but it's still a problem because I can't get a vast majority of the water over and through that railroad bridge so it holds more water back than mingle does kind of the lesser of two evils. Mingle is it sized appropriately to pass it outside of the hundred year storm no but it is what we would term more of a low water crossing. So we have we had spent some money already to start designing yes a bridge over Cooper Creek at mingle when the culverts blew out. How much money did we spend on that how much money did we spend to put the culverts back which are clearly a temporary solution. They are temporary solution I don't have an answer for how much money was actually put into that and I can find that out. Okay I'd like to know that but but in the long run then what you're saying is there needs to be another solution. Yes we don't know what it is right. The solution that was presented under the previous design was elevating a bridge much higher than it arguably should have because the water surface elevations are that much higher so you're building a very expensive bridge for a fairly low use road compared to other roads that we have in the city. Once you're not only building it for the road you're building it so that the water passes through so that those right put relief to those houses up restraint correct and the restriction though is still the bridge because once you elevated the roadway to where it was say out of there out of the condition that it was causing the flooding the bridge still caused the flooding. Okay. Councilman Briggs. Shortly after I started I think there was a staring contest going on with the city and the railroad and they had just come in and made the improvements put in a bunch of rip wrap neck down the capacity of that and we're not about to spend any more money on that railroad crossing and so that was the rub is all that design work that the city had done and some of the assumptions they've made about having a wider mouth there did not come to fruition therefore the design work that had been done was not of any real use at that point and that was the problem you know is there was not enough coordination on the front end and even if even if they even if the railroad had indicated that they would build that additional capacities for more water could move forward there was nothing in writing holding them to that and so they just flat weren't going to spend any more money on that railroad underpass and there was nothing more to be done with mingo other than open the road or leave it shut so it would you know we are we're in the process of having to look for a different kind of a solution because their railroad is just not going to make that investment they made it clear after and I think there was an assumption that they they would be more cooperative than it ended up being I think is the only is the best way I could put I mean Chad do you have anything to add to that so no I understand that I also understand that that we have some partners in the region with the regional transportation council that that have to work with up and that sometimes that by by working with them we can we can be a little more convincing than if it's just us alone trying to talk to them about about working with municipalities of course I've always imagined that I'm sure that there's a good reason that our lawyer will tell us why my idea is wrong of going ahead and building a bridge that will really handle all that water and if it washes out the UP line well we told him but I'm sure that our lawyer would have a reason for for telling me why that's a bad idea in fact our mayor probably just looking from the expression on his face your lawyer probably would have said don't say that in public but I won't be involved in those closed-door discussions yes I mean I just I just want it I want to clear it and you are right and we have used the Council of Government's assistance for instance to get the quiet zones moving finally but it's a whole other thing when you're talking about a brand new investment in the bridge and moving that forward from some of the smaller projects they've been very helpful and it's not only helping us it's helping DCTA trying to eventually get sick of more straightened out down there but with something like that it was just too big of a lift and they were not going to blink so we had to go back to the drawing board and that's about much as I could share not sure who's on base go ahead Councilmember Brayson to that point it's unfortunate that it's taken so long but it's good because it it's opened up opportunities for us with mingo and to maybe provide a path through that area in the future so I have a few questions I think we're at the end of the presentation right or close to it anyway so so when you're changing the drainage do you have to do any environmental environmental impact studies I mean is that required or do you just you do that naturally no we have to look through that and part of that's a partnership with our internal group the stormwater group making sure that if we're in an environment sensitive area that we take matters into account when we're actually working with it or designing with it or just avoiding it all together the other thing that we're looking at is just what kinds of presence are out there in the form of the Corps of Engineers and have a waterways wetlands areas animals that only live in specific areas that are directly related to that so we have to go through the environmental assessment before we do anything significant okay that's good to know for me when I hear drainage improvements just because I had a shocking experience when I first got on council with you know concreting in natural natural creeks so and I know that that is not any any of these projects and I'm glad to hear that but we are doing an underground and then providing land on top which is a little bit different so I'm just I'm glad to hear that so I did hear you mention Mistywood and that's in district 2 and you were doing some improvements there and I heard the word inlet and I'm not really sure what that means and so I'm wondering if you could expand on that since we do have a natural creek running through our neighborhood I'm just kind of confirming that that's not going to be impacted I hope I said the street name right it 's this road right here at the end of Rockwood is when I mentioned Mistywood Lane so a lot of water flows from the east to the west and it gets into Rockwood Lane and there's no storm drain in Rockwood right now so all of the water flows over the west curb line and into the houses west of that between Rockwood and the park and for years we've heard resident reports about the flooding in their backyards we've gone out there to visit with them and we've seen it and we've talked to them about a solution and so we've been planning this small revenue funded drainage project for a long time after repeatedly meeting with these residents who get flooded so the inlet what's the inlets we're talking about in Mistywood it 's just we're installing an underground pipe in Mistywood up Rockwood down Royal Lane to the park where the creek is and we're going to put some curb inlets in Mistywood and in Rockwood and in Royal Lane to gather to collect water and put it into the underground storm drain system and then it and then it'll just drain into into the natural creek in the park yes the pipe flows down to the creek in the park okay that's where the outlet is okay thank you very much sure I had asked before if we're going to get into the implications of the area taken out of the floodplain related to pack four but it's okay with me if we you know pick that up at a later time but I would suggest is you know that that conversation perhaps be done jointly with development to just understand what kind of new development becomes possible once you do that how would it change the profile of downtown you know and whether that has implications for planning where we are currently we're currently yes to your point we are currently running modeling right now to try to ascertain what the pre project and post project values would be downtown and what that what opportunities it might have for future development so it's a significant enhancement to the area caroline do you have that handy caroline booth economic development our report was included in your backup and we are estimating that increase in value would be about sixteen point six million dollars for the comparable we did a comp a sales comp comparison and that's about a twenty three percent increase in the value so I don't know what more detail you would like to have you know projections like this are are helpful and they're useful to to kind of get us thinking but of course we don't know exactly how something might develop we provided the land use breakdown for the area that's currently in the floodplain also for what surrounding it that's not in the floodplain just to give us a reference point it's fair to say values going to increase it's going to bring a lot of land that's not usable right now into play and there are a lot of people that are interested in that but as far as exactly how it could develop and how that might integrate with the changes that are going on with the zoning and the code downtown I think that's you know maybe further conversations will need to be had about that yeah those are why I suggested maybe we do this jointly with the development department so we could see what what might that look like what's not permitted now what would be permitted you know how might that influence the way we think about the design of public space around it a lot of implications it's kind of a fresh chance to consider how dentin how dentin den looks anybody else going around the horn nobody all right was that the conclusion of your presentation yes it is fantastic I appreciate that sure good job good information thank you when did we take a break class 2 1 30 at 1 30 oh we'll go ahead and take another one then 10 minutes every two hours we'll take one every two hours we are reconvening at 3 40 p.m. moving back through our work session reports agenda item three we'll go to agenda item 3e which is receive report hold discussion receive departmental presentations can't read in preparation for the fy 2018 19 proposed budget capital improvement program and five-year financial forecast some error city council Tony pointed director finance I'm actually not doing this presentation melissa will but wanted to open it up just wanted to clarify that this is a continuation of what we've done what we started last year is to have our departments come in front of you and to to present a little bit about their budgets let you know what their goals and accomplishments are what type of initiatives they're engaging in we did get some feedback back from the council on last year's process and so this presentation along with the various presentations that you'll get between now and July when we come back to you with a proposed budget will incorporate many of those things and so one of the items that I'll just point out when you when you start looking at the revenues the expenditures we've provided now a three-year history to give you a little bit more trending analysis if you will to that so I just wanted to state that over the next couple months we'll there'll be a number of departments all our departments will come in front of you and talk a little bit about their departments and about any funds that they might manage so yeah and and then maybe in future presentations because I know in this one as well we're using some reserve funds to make up the difference between the expenses and revenue but it's not really showing on the sheet I mean so if you could just maybe show that as either revenue side or something moving forward at least we'll we'll know how they they're balancing even though we know implicitly it's reserve funds but yeah that's what I think. Good afternoon council may city manager Melissa craft from the chief technology officer we'll get started. Some of the goals and accomplishments for tech overall we completed 74 projects we fulfilled around 8600 service instance requests and held the uptime of 99.96 percent also over the past year we launched our new IT service management system the reason it's not on here I don't have a year's full of data so we looked at our customer satisfaction index previously we would do it on a three point scale over the past year we 're doing it on a five point scale and as of October 1st the current we are at four point eight out of five point oh and also one of the new metrics we started collecting this past October is called our first call resolution of 93 percent so this is the goal to try to take care of an issue on a first time first serve and our percentage is 93 percent our industry average is around 75 80 percent so we're slightly above average in that area also we've gone through an application consolidation reduction initiative so over the past year we decommissioned 39 applications resulting in a savings of one hundred and seventy thousand dollars these are hard licensing costs this does not include soft costs such as people's time it also doesn't even include some of the deferred costs which is additional storage capacity and things for these applications I just want to point that out we also did quite a bit of organizational changes within tech services we consolidated our DME GIS and radio fiber that was previously under DME electric they have been centralized and consolidated under tech services to facilitate better communication organization efficiency and cost savings as a result of that as you'll see in the upcoming slides there is a transfer of 1.6 million of personnel materials operations and maintenance in 1819 and also if you look at the previous year for the radio fiber team we were able to reduce their proposed budget by two hundred and forty eight thousand we also completed several projects I'm gonna go down through all of the list already talked about our IT service management system we also assisted HR and some of the automation processes for their onboarding we also provided a remote access for customer service so they can have employees work from home and the Denton energy center SCADA system some of the software upgrades that we've implemented over the past year was our JD Edwards ERP financial system we actually completed that within six weeks our Pico Terra parks one rec system and so forth thank you some of our upcoming goals a lot of our this also emphasizes a lot of our key initiatives as part of our five-year capital CIP plan our Cisco equipment refresh our network equipment is over seven years old and will need to be replaced this project is estimated at 1.1 million we already have funding in our current project drop cost accounts our desktop laptops are at the end of their five- year lifecycle will need to be replaced this project is estimated at 1.8 million also the radio p25 upgrade radio system is over 18 years old and will need to be replaced this is a significant project and we're actually coming back to talk to you about that in our June 12 presentation this project is currently estimated at 7.6 million quick question yes what do you do with the computers that you replace so the last time we did our refresh we actually donated them to the jail and they were able to repurpose that within the jail system so typically we either try to utilize that source if we can if not it will just go out to auction like all of our other IT assets you also are looking at implementing I'm sorry council member I'm sorry council member has to have a question it doesn't have to be today but can you can you send your general spec so obviously you have a spec in mind for your laptops you're going to source if you can just send me kind of those I'd appreciate it okay also some of the new implementation new software we have a budget software customer relationship management system and our power bi initiative we're also in the process of replacing our computer aided dispatch and records management system for public safety and this project is estimated at 3 million we're also looking at consolidating some of the DME GIS functionality into our general city functionality to consolidate hardware software and storage capacity right now is a little segmented we're also in the process of upgrading a router utility skater network and our goal this upcoming years to complete 75 of 124 projects again some of our budget emphasis is really on our capital infrastructure improvement program right now we have around 2.5 million in current CIP program again most of our equipment's over five years old this includes you know everything from connectivity to all the different 45 buildings we provide support to our primary data center backup data center desktops laptops in the radio system combining all of those projects are estimated at 10 million dollars we're also looking at provided integrated services where possible again this is in an effort to help give the ability to departments to report and access data these projects are estimated at a hundred thousand we're also looking at consolidating a lot of the DME infrastructure with some of our general sources project projected cost savings of a hundred thousand dollars as a result quick question was it council member Malter yes yeah there was a figure on the previous slide that is just kind of stuck in my mind you said your goals to complete 75 of 124 projects yes so there it is so you know what's the nature of the projects that just don't make the cut so really the way we try to historically the way tech services is address projects it's not a first come first serve right now we're doing it based on priority and impact so it's going to be dependent on does the project impact multiple departments does a project meet certain dollar threshold whether that be a medium sized project 50,000 or large sized project of over a hundred K and so forth so we have certain predetermined criteria we try to do that with also some other things is the mobile data computer replacement that's a fancy way of saying of ruggedized computers for public safety we also have a lot of growing infrastructure needs as we're having aging infrastructure we're also seeing a lot of folks really over this past year to utilize a lot of our technical resources as a result we're seeing our storage capacity increased by 25 percent and the next step is the IT security enhancement so we are proposing a new anti-spam solution as well too with the project estimated at 50,000 some of our cost containment strategies I think previously mentioned our consolidation reduction of applications there was 170,000 we were able to save we took a different approach when we were upgrading our ERP system this past year before we used to do turnkey hands off I think we did more of a collaborative joined effort as a result we were able to save $200,000 as opposed to the last time we upgraded we also develop a formal requirements process so before a tech services employee or the app team starts to kick off a project we try to define scope of work with deliverables before we engage with our different departments we also did a phone air card audit which resulted in $25,000 savings and we've also consolidated some of our infrastructure to improve reliability and availability with some of the DME components and some of the other components some of our process improvements we also have an ongoing business initiative review process to determine application necessity and total cost of ownership applications so as new departments are wanting to embark on maybe a new application new hardware we sit with them to try to look at well what's that total cost of ownership over the next five years how much does that cost do we have any alternative solutions or existing solutions they can potentially take advantage of so far we've performed over 25 of those this past year we also consolidated DME GIS and DME communications into technology services to facilitate better communication and organizational efficiency and cost savings we also implemented our IT service management system I think I talked about that previously we also centralized the management of the DME computers to kind of keep them on a standardized upgrade process we also partnered up with CML and data analytics lunch and learn program to me this is one of the fun projects that we have around 15 members through between 15 different departments throughout the city we come in work through lunch to try to talk about how do we standardize data reporting data gathering data language as far as data analytics so that's been a fun project too with the city manager's office so here's the tech services five-year forecast so we're anticipating at the end of this fiscal year to have an ending fund balance of 1.5 million we're requesting as part of our proposal for the next year to draw down on fund balance of 1.16 currently yes oh yeah I'm sorry go ahead yes I'm sorry I just I don't actually understand what technology services revenues are those just transfer payments between departments is that how that works okay yes essentially our cost of service of what it costs for tech so we're requesting to draw down a fund balance of 1.16 million as you know our capital infrastructure program of 2.5 million we try to offset that through any savings and fund balance to try to keep our cost of service at a very predictable level we try to avoid any you know high overages or just try to maintain kind of a steady state with that so as a result of that that's why we're requesting to keep our effective fund balance down to around 2% quick question on that yes when I saw this I didn't quite understand first of all how did we get 1.5 million in the fund balance and secondly you I think you just said that you're drawing it down for capital projects or for I guess equipment replacement so is that is that like will that be built up again in another five years when we have to do this same thing five years ago five years from now yes all right so that's what happens my only my only thought is when I look at the projection out to 22 23 which is only three years the fund balance really isn't changing so how is that accumulation if I'm if I'm on the right track if I'm not then just tell me okay you're not you're not understanding or something but so does that make sense my question makes sense okay so really in our past year we had several tech services vacancies so a good portion of savings has been our vacancies within our positions okay typically for us to recruit someone it can take up to six months sometimes even eight months to fill that position just because of the IT market in the DFW area other times you know as you saw the hundred and seventy K and reduction of applications we let that roll into fund balance so usually as we're trying to do the lifecycle management of applications and hardware typically we try to negotiate either better pricing or centralization where possible so it's a combination of all those different aspects so usually it's own savings salary savings and reduction initiatives so then if you were if I were to ask you okay then for these things that you have to expend funds for capital funds and like over a five year interval replacing of computers yes maybe some software upgrades and all that those capital requirements typically range is it the 2.5 or the two million dollars every every five years or yes and I have an upcoming slide that can kind of show you our capital infrastructure program for the next five years so you can kind of have an idea great and I guess as we move forward then I'd like to sort of see how we are looking at maybe trying to get because if we're using the fund balance to help pay for those cash fund them basically absolutely then this there's got to be something that's going to be happening here that helps get that money in there so I mean yeah I think it's it's an interesting approach because we're sort of moving our own money around we could we could sweep that fund balance each year which many internal service funds do and zero it out as a pass through and then all you're doing is increasing your cost of service payments the next year so really what she's done this year she's had so many cost savings initiatives and vacancies she's just instead of returning that to the other funds we're just using those funds that are still sitting there to buy down the capital project so one way or another it's the same money no no understand that I guess what I'm hearing you say then is that here we're using this money to cash fund in previous years of course you wouldn't I mean just one year but have typically they've been have they've been typically funded with debt or still cash funded we've done the pay as you go program since at least oh wait okay so then somehow that fund balance is going to have to get built back up to a two million or something over the next five yeah and to your point as we look out we can we can increase cost of service a little bit I would never advocate issuing debt for gotcha no no I understand so just that was my concern is how do we get that back up to where we were not in that situation yeah so I think the way she's done it's it just made life a little bit easier from the county perspective but in theory we could have returned that money the other funds and just got ahead of transfer it back and it didn't make sense to do no no understand that but you what you're saying is you the way you get it built back up is you just increase the transfer cost exactly okay you know at this point we're trying to avoid doing that try to keep the stream understand yep okay so a little some of our key users these are the people that really utilize technology as a service you know out of our budget DME encompasses 34% of the budget they're around 5.8 million public safety is another big user of technology services they make up 20% of our budget and our third user of IT service is water at 966,000 some of our revenue expenditures also includes a lot of recent consolidation reorganization again those 11 FTEs from DME at 1.6 million as part of our allocation costs for next fiscal year general fund did increase 241,000 but if you look at that 3.6% of that was because of the recent consolidation with the DME radio into fiber folks we'll say this proposed budget does not include include costs for the radio upgrade replacement to the p25 again we'll we'll come back on June 12th to discuss that a little more but we'll say the radio systems over 18 years old it's currently not supported by Motorola parts are difficult to find interoperability which is key for our public safety to be able to talk with others within the same jurisdiction is very difficult we have experienced failures on a system here recently so the reliability might not be at 100% so what we're recommending is to replace the radio solution with the new p25 system enjoying Denton County's core to hopefully share costs with us in the county and also help expand coverage and capacity and some of the options we were looking at were to either do a lease purchase or government bond funding so our next steps will bring those initial conversations on June 12th with hoping to bring you a plan for next year's fiscal 18 19 budget so here's a breakdown of our FTEs by functional areas you can see over time we did have a change in FTEs between fiscal year 16 17 17 18 that was the consolidation of the DME GIS folks that kind of gave us when it came underway you can see it go from 8 to 12 for dedicated staff for DME and also from 16 17 17 18 we added another position for the CAD administrator for public safety you can see the increase of the 11 FTEs that were transferred as part of the DME consolidation as well. So our key organizational changes again the radio fiber team I keep bringing it up because that really did have a big fiscal impact on the tech services budget of 1.6 million so when we start seeing our revenues and expenditures you're going to see it kind of really jump up they were a big big part of that we also consolidated security under our enterprise security manager so we perform security services for PCI C GS for our water wastewater folks and for DME now they're under one central manager for that purpose we also have a dedicated CAD administrator who repurposed one position to IT project manager and we also repurposed one position for dedicated support for a water wastewater SCADA we also created a new deputy IT director position too. So here are some of our budget highlights again you can see here some of those increases from 6.6 to 7.2 on the general fund not only are we seeing a lot of and I think that's what you're alluding to mayor this does include those not those funds for the 2.4 million for a capital infrastructure program so if you look at the breakdown on how it affects all the funds you can see we were really trying to offset some of those cost of service costs we also experienced a lot of growth as part of that too just in the gen fund we added 23 cameras 11 credit card devices 31 laser fish licenses we also added 259,000 for public safety computer replacements 50,000 for police training facility PC replacement 42k for public safety e-ticketing maintenance replacements we also had our radio allocation of 241,000 that was not previously in our budget so if you start to look at some of those variances and changes a lot of it's been been due to that. So here are some of our budget highlights again you can kind of see our personnel services go from 5.1 to 7 7 million since 2017 2018 between a transfer of the 11 FTEs through the radio fiber and the additional four FTEs that's 15 FTEs that were not there previously in our forecast that was not anticipated. Again materials and supplies you do see it kind of double half of that is really for a radio fiber team for radio replacement and fiber changes. Again you can see our kind of capital infrastructure program over time you can see it back in 1415 that was not the case because we were under warranty under support so we really try to take it anywhere from a five to seven year life cycle as part of our capital infrastructure program. So here's kind of a high level overview of our five year capital plan you can see in 1819 we're proposing an Adobe upgrade we're looking at replacement of our service storage capacity at 310,000 our network equipment at 565,000 so this is going to replace equipment again we provide support to almost 50 different facilities so as they interconnect we have to change those interconnecting components. We also have some application software upgrades that are projected at 50,000 and miscellaneous equipment refresh that's 729,000 around 600,000 is for PC refresh for the entire city and again that 259 for public safety and also the tech DME infrastructure capital refresh at 830,000. That's all I have. So on that last slide what I think I hear you saying is that this is what I think I hear you saying Todd is that for these capital requirements 20 21 22 these numbers down here that somewhere somehow that as those budgets move forward there'll be an accumulation somewhere of money to pay for that it cash which typically will maybe go down to the fund balance is that is that it could it's either going to come out of savings and fund balance or it'll come through a transfer from all the various funds paying their proportionate shares is that usually a one time thing or do you try to do that incrementally over the years well I think the thing that's important here and Melissa's done a nice job of smoothing the five-year plan and we're ranging from two five to 1.8 million over the next five years and I think that's what's important to all the funds in terms of giving them that certainty is trying to avoid any huge spikes there's just makes a little bit easier to budget for it and that's always going to be the goal I think the one the only outlier and the only thing that might contradict a little I said is just that radio system project that we're gonna see next year that tends to have a as you saw we're on 18 years but it tends to have about a 15 year life expectancy so that would be one that would be financed a little differently because it's done so infrequently so we'll be talking about the need for that project next week and financing options for you but in terms of your normal day-to-day expenditures with systems the last five years or less we're gonna aggregate and smooth the funding each year so so didn't help me understand I think this is where I'm lost yeah so we've got this slide that shows the I'm gonna say 18 19 so it's the five-year projection of the capital need if you'll go back to the the forecast on the actual budget it's in there no I'm going I'm talking about the the one where it showed you taking the fund balance in this year and it's so 38 or 39 this one right here so in this forecast revenues expenditures where is the for each year you've got a 2.5 2.4 1.8 where in here is that number built is that number built in it's it's built in there as part of our proposed it's in the expenditures for every year in the five-year forecast and so the fixed asset okay Adam that she shows you in all the expenses so it's in the expenditure line right so it's in there okay gotcha all right back down here to the fixed asset number that you see there that's it all right so that's built into the cause of transfer that you budget all of those costs we're trying to build those in as Todd said to try to have the certainty for all the funds on what kind of costs they 're going to have in the future we try to budget for those any kinds of savings that she generates they go into the bottom line and then each year we look at rebalancing those needs with what the costs are I think where I was confused was because for this budget year there 's such a large fund balance that you're taking it out of there and so that's where I thought it was coming out of what you're saying from for budgeting moving forward it's included in the expenditure line instead of oh gotcha yeah in some cases in the past we have tried to build up the fund balance intentionally knowing that we have a large project coming forward fair enough yeah I got it I got it thank you yeah technology is not cheap so we try to offset some of those costs cost of service we want to keep it consistent I know a sister city that essentially doubled their budget sure team million because they didn't streamline it that I appreciate that impact so very good explanation thank you yes customer husband few questions so when you when you talk about Adobe and some of those softwares are you are you software as a service online or are you Adobe is software service online okay so we do provide that so as part of our kind of our technology services strategy we try to do a cloud first specifically for software as a service so recently like our SharePoint online it's in the cloud our budget software would be in the cloud our contract management is in the cloud so we try to use a hybrid approach so we have some data we keep on site just for regulatory reasons and instances where it just makes better sense to keep it in the cloud keep mobile yeah so like Adobe is that gonna is that low local machines or is it like a Windows 36 I mean Microsoft 365 something where it's an Adobe for those that have Adobe professional those are on site but it has cloud storage attached to it okay got it and then where do we fall as far as so as I think these kind of go together so my concern is ransomware issues and as we move further to more apps right we're looking at more apps coming out where are we on some sort of security for that component I know there's I'm aware of a few different companies that are providing that and I think that's going to be become more pressing for us thank you and I'm glad you mentioned that because as part of one of our requests is to replace our current and I spam more solution we are seeing a lot more traffic get through because of that so we generally as part of our O&M we do bring in a third party to kind of come in and assess us from a procedural from a technology perspective to kind of see where we're at from that threshold so we typically take I would say a defense in-depth approach so we have certain components that help us keep protected but we also try to ramp up our security program so for instance we've done six training sessions with our high risk departments this year just to try to give them one-on-one training on things not to click now I won't look at who I'm looking at now but he did a really good job of reporting things that were suspicious yeah after I never mind yeah which is great because historically that's not been the case so we're seeing an increase increase in that can I get so it's almost like a black hat like a third party that tries to point out vulnerabilities and we also do do some of it in-house on a monthly basis as well too do you have a report of where we stand that I could see some of it would be considered I guess confidential so if you'd like to come to my office maybe we'll definitely show you okay very good and then lastly so where do we fall projecting planning forward paperless is that by department or is that something your department can lead on and inch that way I heard you talk about microfilm that sort of things is that is that is that something you can drive or is that a local department that has to make that decision and then reach out to you so I think it's a combination of both so for instance we just ramped up since we just upgraded our ERP system we in June we're starting to later this this month we're starting an ERP governance committee to try to prioritize our projects and key initiatives and some of that will involve some of the automation and less paperwork process so I think it's more of combination okay very good thank you anything else I've just got a comment I want to thank you and your staff because your department really operates behind the scenes it's not high profile like streets utilities and all that but we I mean we rely upon you and your staff for number one to maintain the integrity of our customer data from hacking to keep us online because I have no idea what I'm doing on my phone or on my computer so I just think you guys do a great job and I just don't know if you get the kind of recognition you should because you really are the heart of what keeps this data flowing in our just like we had a water main break in the streets department was out there fixing it you know they do a great job I can't think of too many times where we've gone down and thank you we appreciate that we've not that 99.6 absolutely so I just want to really give you kudos for that to you and your staff thank you anybody else fantastic all right thank you very much good report sorry my for my inability to see the budget and understand all the nuances of it learn something new every day all right we'll go on then to agenda item F which is receive report hold discussion give staff direction concerning water supply planning to meet the city of didn't futures needs well you can come up if you want I mean you're gonna talk to us about water I'm sure dr. banks will take your your spot y'all can just switch we have enough water that's good thank you very much yeah I 've only got 35 slides good afternoon council Kenny banks I'm general manager of utilities I just saw slide one of 50 so I'm sorry yeah yeah that I have a bunch of slides at the end of it it's not really I'm just cheating yeah I'm sorry yeah no worries well good afternoon I want to talk with you a little bit today about didn't water utilities and specifically about our water supply planning this is a topic that's been discussed a couple of times within the the context of the budget and so it seemed appropriate to bring it forward to you I do want to start with a little bit of history because I believe that it's important to kind of understand how this planning is done on a statewide basis and wanted to go through a little bit of that information with you so I also wanted to talk about the current state of the utility kind of where we're out in space and time give you a very brief overview of our forecasting when this got scheduled I didn't we didn't have the departmental presentations lined up and so I'm going to skim over some of that because some of the forecasting that we use in the departmental presentations that you saw yesterday for water and that you'll see today for wastewater are what I'm going to be referencing so I want to be cognizant of time and the fact that y'all have seen some of that information before and then I'll talk a little bit about our future needs planning so a little bit of a history lesson I promise I'll keep it brief Texas water planning has been in place for quite some time in 1913 we had a legislatively created board of water engineers that was responsible for a variety of water related planning activities mainly appropriations but what really changed things for the state of Texas was our 1950s drought of record that occurred generally around 1950 to 1957 and at the end of that drought which was just economically devastating for the the region the Texas Water Development Board was created both legislatively and actually via an amendment to the Texas State Constitution so that can kind of give you a sense of the magnitude of the of the concern there were a lot of changes that happened that happened between the 1960s and 1980s with regards to responsibilities for the Texas Water Development Board and a few other state agencies like the Board of Water Engineers and then in 1997 Senate Bill 1 was enacted and mandated a system of regional and statewide water supply planning groups that was actually managed by the Texas Water Development Board and that was really put in place to talk about the idea of increasing awareness and vulnerability of the state to drought and then also in recognition of the increase in population and in the state and the associated water needs that came along with that population increase. So the regional and statewide planning that is done as a part of SB 1 divided the state into those 16 regional planning areas each of those areas has a regional water planning group that's responsible for going through the regional plan they're required to be updated every 50 year or I'm sorry every five years and they're required under each of those five year increments to consider a 50 year planning horizon. Denton is in Regency and we are a voting member of the Regency regional water planning group. The regional plans are created a year before the date that the statewide plan is to be adopted and then they are incorporated into that statewide plan. The last regional plan for Regency was adopted in 2016 and the state plan was recently adopted in 2017. The task of these regional water planning groups are set by policy and I've included some of the those tasks in your agenda information sheet just so you'll have them. They're tasked with looking at projected uses, current and possible future water supplies, the economic decisions associated with the use of various water supplies, etc. So it's a very comprehensive look at water use. So I'll give you a real brief overview of the Regency summary. Basically, not surprisingly, the Regency area is highly urbanized and while we contain 25% of the state's population in Regency, we only use about 8.3% of the state's water. That's because we have most of our water usage being done by municipalities and for people in lawns versus heavy agricultural uses that you see in other areas. So the population in this area, not surprising, is growing pretty rapidly, about 6.5 million in 2010, estimated to be 9.9 million in 2040 and about 14.4 million in 2070. Most of our water is from surface water sources and right now our existing supply is about 1. 65 million acre feet per year. So put a little conversion down there when we talk about big water volumes, we have a tendency to talk about them in acre feet. So one acre foot, let me do that for the camera, is equal to 325,851 gallons. So like I said, the demand is mainly municipal, so you can see in the growth trends that are occurring through 2070 that that is almost exclusively municipal demand on this scale. And basically, our 2070 demand is anticipated to be about 2.94 million acre feet, so we've got approximately a 1.36 million acre foot per year shortfall that has to be managed for. Again, the demand is mainly municipal and it's interesting some of the economic analyses that are done. The demand, not meaning the demand by 2070 according to the Regency estimates, is going to be about a 34.6 billion annual combined loss in terms of 2070 dollars and about 373,000 jobs. Councilmember Riggs had a question. So we learned yesterday that we sell our excess water to the other cities around. And so if there's a shortfall, at when and what point will we stop selling, do we know we need to stop selling water to others and reserve it for our population? I've got a slide later that I think will address that issue that we can talk from because I think it's important to understand kind of where, what we 're planning for future supply within that context. So if it's okay, can we discuss that when I get to that slide? Any other? Okay. So real quickly, Regency suppliers are basically, we have around 41 regional water providers and about 360 water user groups. The big players in the region are Dallas Water Utility, Fort Worth Water Utility, North Texas Municipal Water District, Tarrant Regional, Trinity River Authority, and then the Upper Trinity Regional Water District. You can kind of see this graphic here is just essentially another look at the projected demands and kind of where we're at in terms of expectations. We'll go over this in a little bit more detail for us in a couple of slides. We are in Denton County, part of Dallas Water Utility's service area. Right now Dallas Water Utility serves about 2.4 million people. 1.2 million is actually within the Dallas system and then 1.2 million are through 27 wholesale customer cities. We'll give a little bit broader look at kind of where we're at in space and time with regards to the major water providers in the region. So you've got Denton here. We actually are part of the Dallas system, but there's also a supply in our area through Upper Trinity Regional Water District. And you can kind of see here how the major players are arranged here within the DFW Metroplex. So real quick, past and current state of Denton Water Utility. So on Lake Lewis, we have two supplies, two plants, one on Lake Lewisville, one on Lake Ray Roberts. The water rights for Lake Lewisville is about 5% of the volume of the lake. Plant capacity for Lake Lewisville is right around 28 MGD. And that's about where we're going to stay at that particular plant because of the size of the raw water lines that take water from Lewis ville Lake to the plant on Spencer Road. Councilmember, I'm sorry, Councilmember has a question. Yes sir. Thank you, Mayor. You're showing 5% water rights. So when you add up all of the different municipalities or et cetera that have water rights, it adds up to 100%. Would that be correct? That's correct. Okay. And yet we were told yesterday that our part on the dam would be 15 million over a period of time and the total project was only 60. So that doesn't seem like we're paying a percentage of that dam based on our rights. I think, and Tim can help me if I misstate this, I'll look for a thumbs up over here. I think that that's based in part due to the system that is comprised of Lake Ray Roberts and Lake Lewisville because they're interconnected. So is that generally correct? The reasons for that difference is the Ray Roberts project included new storage up in Ray Roberts but expanded storage in Lake Lewisville. So when they raised the pool level in Lewisville seven foot for the Ray Roberts project, our water rights in Lewisville from a standpoint of permitting are 5%, Dallas has 95%, but the cost allocation for the dam expenses are based on a portion of the Lake Ray Roberts storage physically residing in Lewisville. They move the flood storage in Lewisville upstream. So that's why there's that difference. It ends up being about 9% of project cost as opposed to the 5% water rights in the original Lewisville. I guess I thought I heard the number 60 million put out yesterday for the total on the dam project and that we were 15 million which is 25%. It's actually about 150 million. That makes more sense. And I recall stating that, but that was a guess on my part. I actually have those numbers and Tim is correct. It's right now that the overall estimate is $149,999,000. Yesterday when we were shown a comparison to water costs in other cities, we saw that Dallas was a lot less and New Braunfels which I may or may not compare. But Mr. City Manager, I recall you explaining that it's in part because we are burdened with so much plant. But I don't fully understand that, how that works, and I wonder if this is an opportunity to get clear on that. Is there a way that we could be getting water and costing less if we weren't participating in these plants? No, many of our fellow cities out there will own regional treatment plants, that sort of thing. We happen to have two of our own. So that just increases our costs. And really I don't think there's any other choice obviously because of the geography around Denton. But when you're part of these more regional plants, you can share the costs as you're adding cells or whatever. There's efficiencies in that, efficiencies O&M, that sort of thing. So the fact that we're operating two separate plants right now and we're having to expand one of the two, just really you're not going to find many other cities in our situation like that up in the DFW area. Many of them are going to be more regional based and sharing costs. So it's the fact that we don't have more partners to share the costs with? Is that kind of... Yeah, in theory. We're footing the bill ourselves and there may be much greater efficiency building 100 MGD plant and expanding from 20 to 50. But all those financing costs, operational costs, those sorts of things can be spread over many partners. And we lose that efficiency having two separate water sources with two different kinds of plants, things. And you just wouldn't see that dynamic in many other communities. But the geography around Denton makes that a fact of life. Thank you. Real quickly, in terms of the history of Lake Louisville's plant, it started at a 4 MGD plant in 1958. We still had wells in our system at that point. It went to 4 to 8 MGD in '65, 8 to 16 in '75, 16 to 24 in ' 89, and the last expansion was done in '94. So that took us to 28 million. On Ray Roberts, as we've mentioned, we have 26% of the water rights there. Dallas has the remaining. The plant capacity on Ray Roberts right now is 20 MGD, but that plant was designed to be ultimately expanded and we have the physical space and infrastructure necessary to go to 100 million gallon per day. Thank you, Mayor. How does 28 MGD translate into 5% of the water rights? I've got a slide later on that I think will help address that. Okay. I'll wait. So that is actually a bit of a complicated question, but I think if I can talk from that slide I can make it clear. All right. So the water demand forecasting, just a real brief overview , and this is the part that we've talked about a little bit within the budget. The forecasting that we do, of course, on a year-by-year basis and looking at our capital programs is designed to help us to put together our budget, but it also helps us to understand what our water needs are. And so I wanted to touch on that just a little bit for the benefit of those watching and I'll try to keep it brief because I know that we've gone over this before. The projections are done by the City of Denton. We actually use the Council of Governments. We also use -- we take a look at the Regency numbers. We do multiple-year projections to guide our capital, our regulatory programs. One key issue with this entire exercise, when you're talking about planning, both from a capacity standpoint and from a water rights standpoint, you 've got to understand that we have to plan for the peak demand. So we have to have the capacity in the system to be able to move the water around in the city and provide that -- the water needs for the city plus some cushion for that hot August day where we have a very large amount of water usage. So we do this by looking at water customers by class, calculating the usage of that class, projecting how many of the -- projecting the number of those accounts, how much we anticipate them to grow on a year-by-year basis, and then translate that back into volumes in a simple sense. That allows us to look at historical and projected water production in terms of million gallons of water per day is typically what we'll be looking at. This is the average graph, and I think it's important for you to understand that because I'll show you the peak and the difference here. So about -- for '19, under dry conditions, we're looking at about 22.9 million gallon per day on a yearly average. But if you look at '19 for our peak day demand, it's almost double that number. So that's what I'm conveying when we -- when I say we have to plan for that peak demand. We've got to have capacity in the system to be able to meet this demand even though it's quite a bit less than our average yearly usage. So we turn this information into projections. You've seen graphs like this before. This is the average annual graph. One of the things that we talked about yesterday was the idea of the declining per capita per day consumption and kind of what that trend has been looking like lately. We've had some unusual years with regards to rainfall patterns, and so that's -- we suspect that that's partially driving this, but we also suspect that the declining per capita per day is also related to efficiencies in appliances, greater efficiencies in irrigation systems. And we also, as was mentioned yesterday, have a pretty large proportional number of multifamily. So all of those things are likely having influence as well. So we use this information to start projecting our capacity . This happens to be a peak day finished water production estimate, and so you can see the plant expansion that we talked about here. And we're generally trying to have that capacity in place when we get close to this dry year usage pattern mark. But as we talked about yesterday, the ability for us to push this planning horizon out certainly exists, and if our per capita continues to go down, we'll likely see this entire wedge here slide to the right. So every year we take a look at this. Every year we do the projections, and every year we perform this analysis so we can be sure we're timing our capital correctly and also to be sure that we're budgeting correctly. >> Question, Councilmember. >> Yes. >> Does incremental capacity come in sort of minimum size chunks? In other words, is there a reason you're talking about adding 30MGD, which it looks like -- I can't see how far that goes out to the right. Are there different sort of steps, size steps that you could do without losing efficiency? >> That's something that we're taking a look at right now and plan to bring the results back to the Council. It's not as easy as just saying, well, let's do 10MGD, 10MG D, 10MGD, because there are plant processes that just simply don't lend themselves to meshing up with that type of a treatment train all the way through the treatment process of the plant. And so we're looking at that to see if there's an opportunity to maybe size it a little bit smaller. The first one was a 20MGD, so we've at least got the potential of taking a look at that since we have an existing capacity right now. The question is, can we slice it smaller than that? And that's what we're trying to look at right now. Okay. So water supply needs, water rights, and firm yield. This is where we get into the actual water rights of the lakes. So to get back to some of the questions that were asked earlier, we've got to have an understanding of what firm yield actually means. Firm yield is basically saying that it's a model-based approach where we're modeling the maximum annual supply that's available on demand, and then we're basically ensuring that that amount will be in place to be able to accommodate a seven-year drought of record, a drought that was identical in terms of the rainfall patterns that existed in the 1950 to 1957 drought. So that's kind of the planning tool that is used for the water rights component of the system. And so when we look at how much we draw out of the lake on a day-to-day basis, if we're above conservation pool, we've got the ability to pull out more than our water right. It's what we're planning for is that seven-year drought of record. That's why it gets a little bit complicated when you talk about water rights without qualifying it to the idea of this is planning for the worst-case scenario. So under the firm yield concept, our available supply out of Lake Louisville and Ray Roberts combined is about 25 million gallons per day. Our future needs by 2050 in terms of water rights is 45 million gallons per day. Basically that's going to give us a 20-MGD deficit. So I did notice it, and I want to point it out on your AIS, I think there was an error. I believe this value actually says 25 in your AIS. So just for those watching this, this is the correct math. Based on firm yield, and again, this is the worst-case scenario that we have data for in terms of that seven-year drought of record. So this is actually our water rights contrasted against our usage pattern from 1992 projected forward to, in this case, 2035. So I'll try to be brief in explaining this graph. This is when the water rights for Ray Roberts came online. The lake was impounded in 1987, and we began to receive those water rights in 1988. We had prior to that a small raw water contract with the city of Dallas that allowed us to purchase a small amount of water, and we're able to work into that agreement a potential or an effluent credit due to what we were discharging into Lake Louisville. And so you can see at the time that that was put in place, we were actually had quite a bit larger GPCD. I think we were well in excess of 180 gallon per capita per day in this timeframe, and we got close to the need for that before the capacity for Lake Ray Roberts came online. We retained that contract when the Ray Roberts system came online because at the time that trend was indicating that we would probably need that water right much, or we would accommodate the capacity of the water that we were getting from Lake Ray Roberts in a much shorter timeframe. So this is why it's important to plan for this every year because every year we do these projections we saw that the gallon per capita per day was going down and that that time horizon was moving out. So in 2015 that contract actually expired and we chose not to renew it at that time. So now we've been going forward for the last several years with that contract not in place, and we are in need of securing additional water rights to in effect make us drought proof. So we're not this line does not in any way shape or form indicate that we're running out of water that we don't have the capacity to provide the water needs of the city, but it does indicate to us that we need to take a look at getting some additional water rights to ensure that we're meeting that planning horizon issue for the seven year drought of record. So, yes. Yeah, is there anything in our weather pattern history that would indicate whether we're more likely than we might have thought in the past to experience a record drought or less likely you know we're inclining toward greater or lighter rainfall or it's just total unpredictable. Right. Right now the planning tool that's been chosen to be used by the state is the 50 to 57 drought of record. The the certainly weather pattern changes are occurring. And that that is one thing that is being looked at very strongly. Those projections going forward are likely at least they've got the possibility of changing that 50 to 57 drought of record. I just don't think we have enough information on that at this point. So right now this is the the planning horizon or the the planning tool that's that's used. If you ask me if that's going to be the same planning tool even within the the 50 year period that this this actual plan looks like let's say we roll forward to you know 2070 approximately, we very well could have another measurement in place. So we may have more data at that point and better ability to to model what weather patterns are likely to to do. Councilmember Riggs. So when you hear that there's going to be a deficit in our water supply even in the future it's kind of scary. Correct. Right. And so I'm we need water to live. So what do we do to get more water rights? Do we just go back to Dallas or like Louisville? Do we do we get a higher percentage or I mean this is a new process so I'm just curious how right right. What do we do? Well and and I'll I'll I'll talk from this graph to to answer that question. So the the first thing that we're trying is to secure what is referred to as an indirect reuse permit. All right. Basically what indirect reuse means is that we have a ability to claim as a water right with T.C.Q.'s permission and through a permit we have the ability to claim as a water right half of our effluent discharge on a one pass through system if that if that makes sense. So right now we have our our effluent discharge is around 12 million gallons per day on average. So on average what that means is that our water right that we could claim if we're successful in getting that indirect reuse permit is about six million gallons per day. So that's what this green section of the of the graph indicates right here. That's our first option because once we get the permit that 's a no cost option to the city and allows us to keep our rate payers from having to pay for water additional one. Does that reuse does it affect the water quality. It's a one pass system. So the the short answer on that at 6MGD for Lake Louisville I would say the answer to that would be no. One of the things that may come up and we're a very small player in this system there are there are a lot of entities out there that are pursuing indirect reuse by the way. Region C has indirect reuse as one of their big strategies for the entire region that creates a situation where we've got to make sure that we are retaining enough water in that system to maintain environmental flows. So from from my standpoint I wouldn't I wouldn't characterize it as a water quality issue per se I would say that we've got to be sure that we do not overuse indirect reuse as a strategy regionally because that means less water is going to be in the in the streams and that also means that there's a possibility of having less water through that entire system all the way down to the coast. Now before that that becomes a scary issue you also have to keep in mind that we are impounding a lot more water in the region than we ever had and so you've got to contrast the the system as it existed prior to all those impound ments versus the system as it exists today. So that that it's it's a it's an interesting thing to consider when you're talking about a situation where you've got hundreds of millions of gallons per day by multiple users coming out of that system that that's quite a different scenario than 6MGD one pass. Keep in mind if you if you do that it essentially almost catches up because we take that water in we use it and then it gets discharged back again. So when you're talking about that the fluid is the wastewater that's coming out of our water treatment plant. Out of our wastewater treatment plant. Wastewater treatment plant. Correct. And right now it's going into Lake Louisville. That's correct. And are you saying that that we just get credit for that out of Lake Louisville or are you saying that we directly pull it back in and reuse it? No, we get credit for it. That's the difference between what's referred to as a direct reuse and an indirect reuse. Indirect reuse just means you get to claim the credit. The direct reuse means that you're essentially taking that water as wastewater treating it and putting it right back into the system for potable use. And there are some entities that do that. That's not what we're proposing here. There are also just for to explain all the terms there's a nuance issue there with direct reuse too because you've got to differentiate between direct potable reuse and direct non-potable reuse. Right now we have a small direct non-potable use with our reuse program where we provide that water for irrigation purposes. So it's not much. It has a tendency to be less than a million gallon per day. So that's our first strategy is to pursue that system. There's two things that are nice about that. Once we get through the permitting aspect of it and that permit is down at TCEQ currently under review, once we get past that component the cost for this water right is essentially the cost it took to get the permit. The other thing that's nice about it is it tends to grow with the city because as our water needs increase our wastewater effluence will increase and the water right will increase accordingly. The next option is a simpler option but it's going to cost some money. Basically we would go to the city of Dallas and just simply secure a purchase agreement similar to what we had before. So now this is raw water purchase. This is not treated water. So question. So we no longer have a contract with Dallas for Ray Roberts ? We no longer have a contract with Dallas to purchase raw water from them. But we're pumping water out of it now because of our water rights? That's correct. Got you. Okay. Do you have a question? On the assumption that if we didn't kind of create our own capacity that we could buy from elsewhere, do we know that Dallas has excess capacity or is projected to have excess capacity so that would even be possible to do? Well Dallas is certainly planning to meet the needs of its customer base and one of the things that I think it's important to point out as a component of this discussion is that Dallas is a member and is involved with the planning of Region C as much as you know or more than we are. So if you look in the Region C plan, it actually has both of these concepts in that plan currently. The concept of indirect reuse and the concept of purchased water from Dallas. So that's a roundabout way of saying they're planning on doing that as a part of their membership of Region C. So the amount that we're talking about is very small and keep in mind that it's only going to be a situation where we're dealing with raw water, not treated, and keep in mind that this discussion really is not a day- to-day discussion. It's within the context of the firm yield idea, meaning that this is what we would need to have to be able to survive the seven-year drought of record. I would also say that that's a very conservative means of looking at it because effectively what we end up, I think it would be very unlikely that we 're going to go through a seven-year drought of record and get about three years into it and not have some kind of diminishment of water usage that goes beyond what we typically see and would then pull down the usage and the dry year scenario. So in other words, I think that's a very conservative way of looking at it. So basically those are the two options that we are looking at right now. We are in process with both of these. The TCQ is currently reviewing our indirect reuse permit application and then we also have fairly regular talks with the City of Dallas. In fact, we talked with them just about a month and a half ago concerning this idea of water purchase as well as a lake operational agreement that they would like to take a look at. So again, we've talked about this a lot already. Indirect reuse is the first option. Dallas Raw Water Purchase is the second option. Because we have both areas, we have two entities that serve this area. There might be a possibility, we haven't explored it at this time, of purchasing water from the Upper Trinity system as well. That is kind of just another option that's on the table. So projecting this all out, this is generally what we would expect the situation to look like. If we are successful in getting our indirect reuse permit, that would probably put us through kind of difficult to predict, but I'd say at least through 2032. And then we would be looking at that point of entertaining the idea of purchasing that water from Dallas or from another entity. So treatment capacity-wise, we should be in good shape. Again, I want to stress to everybody that what we're talking about here is planning for a seven-year drought of record. We're not talking about day-to-day water usage. So that translates into what I put together to compare where Region C thinks will be in space and time. I chose to use 2050 as a base model year because that's our current projection window. The Region C estimate and our estimate are very similar. You can see dry year estimates, we're anticipating a little bit less demand, about 44 MGD, compared to Region C estimates of 48 million gallons per day. I would say that our estimates are based on actual water use, and we forecast every year. And so I'd like to think that our numbers are a little tighter and a little bit more defensible, no knock against Region C. And then really in terms of makeup, the main difference is purchased water. Yes, I'm sorry. I know we're dealing in unlikely scenarios, but does it make sense that we would be experiencing a seven-year drought, but it wouldn't affect Dallas? The likelihood is that that would be very regional in nature. It would not just affect us. So it would be affecting others as well. And so that's the nice part about the Region C planning because everybody's planning for that firm yield. So it's not just us, it's Dallas, it's every other water supplier and provider. So one thing that I will say is that it's very important for Dallas to maintain the volume in Lake Ray Roberts. It's the only, that system is the only gravity feed system that they have. They have a tendency to, in times of short droughts, to overdraft on the eastern side and move that water in to the system of their chain of lakes. And then as things get drier and drier, they move over to the western side. So the eastern side has a tendency to get more rainfall. And basically, I'm looking over at Tim, did I get that right? It's reversed. Yeah. The western reservoirs don't get as much rainfall as the eastern reservoirs. So the eastern reservoirs tend to be more prolific. Geographically, the western reservoirs are closer to where the demand is. So they get overdrafted. And when it rains, just like it did the last year or so and fills everything back up, it's a non-issue. They tend to overdraft the western reservoirs and have the eastern reservoir system as a under-drafted system that they'd have to import that water in to sustain the later years in a drought record. The other comment that came up about drought record and planning, many of the entities within Region C are planning on what's called safe yield versus firm yield. So what that means is that you'd go through a seven-year drought record and your supplies aren't gone. So you have a safety factor. So Dallas is one of the entities that is planning on the basis of a safe yield. So they're actually planning on something beyond the seven- year drought. But to Kenny's comment on Ray Roberts, because they operate the system as a reservoir system, they tend to preserve the water in Ray Roberts more so than Louisville, because when it rains and rains hard, they want to have the larger catchment area have the bucket downstream. So they tend to keep the lake levels in Louisville higher, which certainly benefits us. And so in the 2011 drought, which was a pretty hard short-d uration drought, one of the lakes with the biggest inventory was Ray Roberts. That's pretty much it. There's more questions. The board just lit up. Council Member Gregory. OK, I want to go back because I didn't hear the answer. What we are able to produce, pull out and convert into pot able water out of Lake Louisville, that MGD number of 28, 25, whatever it is. Yeah, it was 28. 28. How does that compare with what our actual water rights are of 5% of the water that's available in Lake Louisville? Right. So 28 MGD is the plant capacity. The available supply by both reservoirs together because they're connected is 25 MGD in terms of firm yield water right. Does that answer your question? So we can pull out all that we have the right to pull out. That's correct, but keep in mind that we're talking about the firm yield scenario where if you're talking about a situation where we're not into a drought of record, we can actually pull out more water than that and do that on a routine basis. Then another question. There's a new lake that has been approved starting construction in northeast Texas around the bottom, right? Who has the water rights to that? I know that at one point I heard a couple of years ago I read in the news that I think it's Flower Mound backed out of its financial commitment to that. Who's got the water rights? Are there any available that we should try to secure over there? Right. Are you talking about the lower boat arc? I don't know. There's several lakes. Several lakes planned. Ralph Hall, lower boat arc, Marvin Nichols. Lower boat arc is one I believe that is starting to break ground. That's a project that I'm going to look for 10 for confirmation. It's North Texas Municipal Water District, right? So they have all of the water rights to that one? To my knowledge, that's correct. Okay. What about those others? They're a supplier though. Keep that in mind. Okay. So they're regional suppliers. So that they're technically the water rights are theirs but others will be making use of that through their regional supply agreements with North Texas Municipal. Is there, is it even possible at this particular point to look out to 2050 and create a contract with Dallas or with that other agency for some water rights in 2050? I'm sure that it is. The question is going to be one of timing and cost. So the idea is going to be do we want to, we need to plan for that at the time when we're nearing that water right and need because that would, if we don't, they're basically going to enter into a contract but they're going to want to enter into a contract now. So we would effectively be in the same situation if I'm understanding what you're saying correctly that we were in back in this area of the graph, I'm sorry, this area of the graph where we're basically paying for that water right but we're not using it. And the final question, if we ever get to the point, I have a friend who lives on an island, they get their water from a well. Okay. But everybody in this community, because of the capacity that the well has, they have a set number of water taps. And that's all that they have. And that really controls any future growth, any future construction of residences or businesses because it's hard to have a house if you don't have any water. Is there, do we look at in region C, a scenario where at some point down the road, if you look at all of the reservoirs that are available and the fact that it's not likely that we can purchase water from out of state, Oklahoma has never shown any interest in selling any of those kinds of things. Is there ever people, you long term smart guys that plan of saying we have a capacity and we can't grow past this, there's going to be no more water taps available? And you have a slide for that. The short answer to that is yes. Basically, this is a quick series. I promise I'll be fast on those. This is 1910 to 1920. Basically you can see how lakes are added through that system. There's well systems that were around. We had the Garza to Louisville Lake added, Lake Grapevine, Lake Tawakene with a transmission pipeline. We go out larger regionally and start to add dual systems on our transmission lines, new lakes, continue to add lakes into that system, change our service areas and basically what is going on now is there's a lot of lake construction that 's going on in this area with a huge pipeline project that will actually transfer that water in to where Dallas can use it. So the part of the design of Region C and really the overall statewide water plan is to get all of these entities together so these things can be planned. Obviously these lakes take a very long time to permit and construct. And basically now we're looking at systems that are going in new up in this area and over here that will be transferred into the system. So every five years that's looked at again. Every five years it's adjusted. Thank you. Council Member Briggs. So we have focused on planning our future energy needs for a while and to me water is more important so I appreciate the conversation and the presentation today. I would like to ask for kind of, Council Member Gregory said, maybe a list of pros and cons on the options including money and environmental issues on indirect reuse versus purchase and how that would look if we decided to do one and not the other or less indirect use and more purchase when you mentioned draining the creeks out of the natural. It kind of was a little scary as well so just kind of balance those. Right. Well and keep in mind we're required to, the environmental flow issue is looked at. That's a requirement. And so it isn't like we're going to just pull all the water out of that system. It gets a little more complicated on water rights issues for downstream, etc. But again all of that is looked at as a system. I'd be glad to bring that back. Are you looking for qualitative, you know, just a general description or are you looking for more quantitative in terms of cost benefit? Well when we had, when we were talking about our energy needs we had like the pie graph that was here and we, you know, what we purchased, what we, you know, have, that kind of thing. And so I'm looking at this and I'm thinking well if we have this existing what if we purchase more water from Dallas and instead of this plant to the indirect use and how much that would cost us just the balance between the two. Right, right, right. And just again so I can be sure I'm addressing the question correctly. The indirect reuse is not going to cost us anything other than the permit securing cost. After that, after that it is, it is free and clear. In terms of the purchased water for Dallas, I think when we had that contract with them, I'd have to, I'd have to go back and look. Tim and I were talking about it earlier and the number of about a hundred thousand a year it sticks in my mind which probably would translate into being about a hundred and forty thousand a year to get a comparable purchase at this date. But keep in mind that that's a small amount and so you, you know, you start to contrast that against the six million gallons that grows with your city and that's going to be quite a bit more expensive. So we're probably looking at current price half million dollars a year or more. So and that would be at a fixed value versus one that changes over time. So does that help or would you still want me to bring that? That helps, that helps. Maybe, yeah. I'll get offline with you on more environmental issues. Okay, absolutely. I'd be glad to. Thanks. Councilmember Hutsworth. Thank you. So one, one thing that you hadn't touched on, I just want to get a general look at it from your perspective and that's the Desalination. So I had an opportunity to tour the plant in San Antonio and I think they report 13,441 acre feet per year that they get from that and it's also, it's, matter of fact, the water's more pure. They have to go back and add chemicals to get it, you know, get the taste right and avoid the scaling, that sort of thing. So what is your, what is your look on that going forward? Do you think that pursues or, I know the cost issue becomes huge. Yeah, it's a big cost issue and we've also got to consider it from a source standpoint. I believe the, most if not all the desal for San Antonio is actually coastal accessed water and so up in this region we're really only looking at the ability to do desal with brackish groundwater and so the capacity of a system like that is, I think, undetermined although those resources do exist, but that's going to be extremely expensive on a per gallon basis. So we're going to have to pump it from a deep, deep system. It's going to be highly salty, almost certainly, and then we're going to have to desalinate it. So it's possible, it's just, it's probably going to be one of our most expensive, if not the most expensive option available to us. Okay. And then if we could go back to the graph, major water, Texas, major North Texas water providers. Get back to it. This one? Yes. My ask, can you give me something, and so it doesn't have to be, it doesn't have to be any more drilled down than this, but what I'd like to know is the source, how much we get and how we get it. Is it pumped? Is it, you know, and just a little call out, right? So if we get water from- Her provider? I'm sorry? Did you want that, the sources and for each of these individual providers, is that what you're asking? No, for us specifically, yes. Okay. But more, so for example, Ray Roberts, we get, you know, whatever, three gallons, and it's pumped, you know, through this water line, right? So it leaves me with the water line, our max that we get from it, and how? Is it pumped, gravity, you know, I don't know those, and they all may be pumped, I don't know. Right. That kind of component, that's kind of what I'm hitting at. I'd like to know where it came from, how much is our max, and then what the name of the water line that it travels to get to us. Okay. And you're asking that for Denton or for all of these regional providers? Just for Denton, yes. Okay. I can probably address that. The, we've got the two plants, Ray Roberts, Lake Louisville . Lake Louisville plant is on Spencer Road. It draws water in from the intake structure that's right by the I-35 bridge on Lake Louisville, where the old party cove is. Well, no, no, I just want, I want, if you just, someone creates it. Could you get that to him off? Yes. You want it offline? Yeah, yeah, yeah. No worries. I'll just create that for me. Okay, please. Council Member Ryan, I think had some questions. Yeah, I had a question when we look at the firm yield slide versus the slide before it was, which is peak day. We've got current year projection on peak day of, in the 35 , 36 range, this slide 15. Right, yeah, yeah, you may be able to see the actual number easier on this one. Yeah, and I'm just looking at, so we've, how much do we actually produce? I mean, we've got the ability to do, we've got a 28 MGD and a 20, so total of 48. Right. How much are we actually running through there? Because when you look at what our rights are, our rights only allow us 25 if we ended up in a drought situation. So would we be in a huge problem just from the water rights , even though we can clean up the water for a pot? Right, right. The available supply is 25 million gallons per day. Think about that in terms of an annualized basis. All right. So in the summertime, we're going to pull much more water than that. Probably we'll be upper 30s or so to be able to meet those in a dry year scenario. So we've got the ability, even under this situation, to be able to draw more water than that on a daily basis. This is 25 million gallons per day annualized average. Does that help? Yeah, so it's 25 million times 365 per year. Correct, yeah. And in some days you'll have way less than 25 million and in some days you'll have more, depending on the time of the year and the overall usage patterns. And then I guess my other question is on the region map is are we only allowed to purchase or to have rights within our region or are we able to, if there was a new lake going in that's just in region B or East Texas that we would be able to? We can secure water rights from other areas. The trick is going to be getting them here. Okay. So, but yes, that we could conceivably get water rights from outside of our area here. Now region C itself also has some areas along its periphery where water is anticipated to be moved into region C as well. So we can do that both on a small scale, you know, Denton County, or we can do that on a larger scale region C. Okay. And is there such a thing as a trade or a swap that as Dallas starts to buy up rights over in East Texas and we do some, where they can get the water into their lakes on the eastern side and make use of it that we could be involved in helping them get that that we would get a larger percentage of ownership or water rights on Ray Roberts? I suppose any deal is possible, but the question is going to be what water rights do we need to get and would one, would they give those water rights up in one lake for capacity in another? I think that's unlikely. The second is what would the cost of that look like in comparison to just purchasing the water from them as raw water? So I mean, any kind of a deal is possible. I think that that scenario would likely end up costing us more than what we've looked at here. Keep in mind that these suggestions that were done by region C have also been subjected to economic analysis by the consultant that was hired to put the plan together. And so these are supposed to be our best and most economical approaches to doing this. But anything's possible. We could secure outside of the region. We could cut any kind of a deal with the city of Dallas in theory. Okay. Thank you. Councilmember Meltzer. Okay. Probably last question I imagine. In a water shortage drought scenario, I have no idea if the scale is meaningful. Would hydraulic fracturing potentially be a competitor, a significant competitor for water supply versus municipal use? Not according to region C. The mineral interest are a component of what they analyze. I can tell you for us back in the heyday when most of the drilling was going on, we were looking at a small percentage. It was somewhere around 3 to 5% maximum. And I don't think that we'll see that kind of drilling again. Now in fairness, some of the wells that went in, they actually were able to drill a water well in and use that. But we had a lot of water purchased for doing that at the time. That gives me order of magnitude. Thank you. Okay. Sure. Okay. I'm going to have the last question. All right. If you could go back to your need, you should call it the fair, the firm. Okay. Yes. So we've spent the last hour talking about a seven-year drought situation in essence. That's correct. Okay. So that's the worst case scenario in the sense of what people think would be a worst case scenario for planning purposes. Correct. So when I look at this, you're saying that the water rights that we have between Lake Ray Roberts and Lake Louisville is about 25 million gallons per day. Annual average, correct. Annual average. Which that comes out to about 9.1 billion gallons is when I multiply 25 times 365. Right. All right. So that's all of our water rights pursuant to whatever the contracts, the agreements were back then. Correct. All right. So if you go to the what we use, that one, or it was the table, it was that right there. This is the peak day. Do you want the average day? I want the average day, yes. Yes. Okay. Where's the average day on here? It's not on there. Yeah, this is water production in terms of billion gallon per day. This is annual average. Okay. This one's the average, this one's the peak. All right. So then, okay, you just switched slides. Okay. So this is the average right here. Right. So when you're down to 2027. Right. We're sort of at our quote unquote maximum for our water rights just in a normal sense. Right. Yeah. I would argue that we're probably around in this range because we've got to plan for a drought. Right. So then you've been talking about for a seven year drought. Right. But yet if you're not in a seven year drought, we're still going to have a water capacity need. Absolutely. We're going to still, this permit that you've been talking about, this indirect. So I guess my question is, if we're talking about expanding our Ray Roberts plant to 100, is it 100, what was it? How many, to 50 million? Yeah. It is capable of being expanded to that amount. But what we proposed and talked about yesterday was a 50 MG D plant, the existing 20 and 30 million gallon per day additional capacity. So this is where I get confused about that. Okay. So our water rights between both lakes is 25 MGD. Correct. Now, I guess if we purchase water from Dallas that we're pulling out of Lake Ray Roberts, that's why you're saying, because why would we want to spend $90 million to increase our plant capacity unless we believe that that's where we're going to be able to get some of that additional water source from in the future? Two answers to that. That 25 MGD that you're talking about is under the firm yield scenario only. We can draw much more out of the lake if we're not in that scenario. Okay. Let's put the firm yield on the shelf. What I'm trying to figure out is what are our water rights outside of this sort of worst case scenario? So what you're saying is in a drought, we can't pull more than that because we need to conserve water. Correct. But normal situation, wet, dry, annual, whatever. What is the MGD that we have available between the two lakes? If we chose to, if we were not hindered by capacity at all, is that what you're asking? Yes, and we don't have this firm yield, we don't have this seven year drought thing we've got to do. So if we just, what are our rights to pull out of there, regardless of our capacity? 250? Yeah, it's about 230. 230 million gallons per day. Okay, so. Not drought per day. All right. So that's what you're saying is from a planning perspective outside of a drought situation, we're only hindered in our capacity from a mechanical perspective of drawing it out. Right. Treating it and transmitting it. We've been talking seven years, we've been talking about a seven year drought and it's like, oh, are we going to run out of water? And yeah, if we're in a seven year drought, we've got a plan to address that. At least we're working on a plan. Correct. But outside of that, we're tenfold below the capacity. I mean, our capacity right now on that particular one is tenfold less than what we are, not Ray Roberts is different. Right. We've got a tremendous amount of more water that we could draw out than what our capacity has. That's correct. Okay. And keep in mind too, we always have to plan for that peak day. No, I understand. Yes. Yes. But that's not a water shortage issue. No, it's a capacity issue. That's a capacity issue to be able to pump it out. Right. That's where that comes in. Right. Okay. Fantastic. Good information. Thank you very much. I appreciate that. Thorough as always. Any other comments, questions? So we've covered, if we have worst case scenario, we've also covered just the normal circumstances that sounds like we've got a good plan moving forward to secure and to make sure that our city has available water rights for many years to come, except if we don't build the capacity. Correct. All right. Thank you, Dr. Banks. Appreciate it. You bet. Appreciate it. Hey, I think dinner is ready. So let's take a quick break and grab some dinner. Welcome, everybody back to this meeting of the Dent City Council on Tuesday, June 5th, 2018. It is now 534 and we've got one more work session item to go over. It's work session item 3G. Receive report, hold discussion, give staff direction regarding the wastewater and drainage FY 2018-19 operating capital improvement program budgets. Mayor of City Council Tony Puente, Director of Finance, thank you for having me today. This is a very similar presentation as you saw yesterday for the water utilities. The only difference here is that there's another component that we'll be talking with you as a separate presentation. There's actually two presentations, is the drainage component. What I'll tell you is that about 20 of those slides are mine and the rest are probably Kenny Banks. So he'll be coming back up here. Just fair warning. So just really quickly, I'm going to try to go through some of this information that you've already had in your backup. But this is our volume forecast on what we've seen in customer growth, residential, commercial, and wholesale. I just want to point out that we're budgeting at about a 2% growth in customer growth over the planning horizon for this forecast. So again, this is a very similar chart to what you've seen both yesterday and also today on the water side. And what I wanted to point out to you is that one of the projects that is out there that we've identified as a risk is a treatment capacity expansion. So we are now at our 21 MGD capacity for our current plant. We'll be looking at an expanded capacity in a new plant out in the future. That particular plant is actually out kind of on the fring es of our 10-year planning horizon. We do plan to begin potentially, if all things stay equal, an $8 million design in around 2024. And that's actually part of our current CIP. The other component of that will be the expansion that's out in 2028. That particular project in total is about an $80 million project. So again, based on some of the feedback that we heard yesterday on the water side, we'll also be looking at this particular project and within kind of the context of some of the feedback that we got from the council yesterday. So some of the assumptions, again, very similar to what you 've seen on the wastewater side is again, all our rates are based on cost of service, same kind of debt coverage ratios, very similar type of revenue funding versus debt funding. We have a reserve that's about 28 to 39% budgeted expenses. One of the things that we did here was very similar that we did on the water side by removing the customer service component into a separate enterprise, separate internal service fund. We've not done that here with drainage, but we have separated it out and not included that as part of that calculation. And so when we get to that particular discussion on the forecast for the drainage component, you'll be able to see that. That's about a million dollar, so there is a million dollar drainage reserve that's been a component of the wastewater fund for quite some time. To our knowledge, that has never been used. And so we've actually carried that over and we'll show it as a reserve in the drainage component and kind of dedicate it to that particular function. And we'll have some more conversations about that. So some of the cost containment strategies, of course, is similar to some of the other utilities and general government. We've been doing a lot of work on the CIP side, taking a closer look. In this particular forecast, we've tried to levelize the revenue funding contribution over into our CIP to try to better coordinate that and time that with the schedule of when we actually think that those projects are going to happen. So some of the risk, obviously what I mentioned to you is there is an $80 million AMJD expansion or additional capacity through a new facility that will be planned. Out there, yes ma'am. So on that $80 million, I think I heard you say the beginning of the presentation, just to clarify, just for the design is $8 million? Yes. Okay. Just wanted to clarify that that's, and that's part of the $80 million? Correct. Okay. Thank you. So in addition to that, some of the other risk is certainly , and we're seeing this across all our CIP projects is just increasing cost for construction and getting some of these projects done. We have utilized more of our internal crews to try to mitigate some of those costs. Certainly looking at our O&M costs is something that we look at on a yearly basis. And also being cognizant of some of the regulatory requirements that may be out there that may be coming our way. So two very similar options as we did on the water side. And so option one, we can go through the forecast for that. We're recommending in that particular option a 5% rate decrease that reduces the reserves over that five year window, about $8 million. Option two scenario is a 2% rate decrease. The difference there is that we do a little bit more revenue funding of some of our capital, but it reduces the planned debt issuances in the future to again potentially build some capacity for a project like the one that we have here that 's out there kind of on the fringes of that 10 year window. So what we have here is the option one, which is the 5% rate decrease. Certainly we want to be cognizant of where our projected fund balances are and certainly we'll come back and show you a wider picture of more of a 10 year basis. But again, so we were looking at where we thought that our reserves, working capital and operating reserves were over that five year period in relation to where our current policy is for those reserve targets. And certainly while there's a little bit of a dip in 2022, there is a projection, we projected that that fund balance will come back up well within the range of our current fund balance policy. Yes, sir. Real quick question. This may be too specific. But I recall a few years back, we used, I think it was some wastewater and water economic development fund to for I think it was either WANCO or someone and we were going to, I think, pay replenish that fund. Is that in here somewhere? Yes, sir. So you have the development plan lines right here and you see that we're contributing and getting back to a million dollars over that time horizon. So that shows up as a separate reservation within that particular fund. Appreciate it. Thank you. In addition to the other measure that we're cognizant of and looking at is our debt coverage ratio. Again, these are just two metrics, two targets that we look at to kind of judge the financial health of these funds, not just this fund, but we have similar measures on the other funds. So again, we feel that this 5% reduction certainly keeps us well within a good financial picture within that five year horizon. For option two, option two certainly is a little bit healthier option than option one. Again, if you're looking out in 2023, we're projecting a little bit over $10 million in reserve and that's certainly actually nearing kind of the maximum in our current target for that particular fund. Again, cognizant of our debt coverage ratios and this actually puts us in a slightly better position than what I showed you in option one. Again, this is a five year kind of planning horizon and just like we do with the water fund and all our funds is we come back to you on an annual basis and relook at kind of a rolling five year. So there'll be opportunities to continue to evaluate where we are in point in time and if there are needs for us to look at slightly different rate structures, we can certainly do that with you in the subsequent years as we get closer to some of those major projects. So these are just some of the budget highlights for you, some of the detail again, very similar to what you saw yesterday, three year history of our wastewater revenue and just want to be very clear here that this excludes any drainage revenue. So that's not included here, both on the revenue side and on the expense side. We've completely stripped those out and showed them to you separately. Certainly on the expense side, again, this is a three year history and where our current proposed expenditures would be based and all this is based on option one. So I want to be very clear with the council on that. So again, very similar to what we showed you yesterday, 6, 000 gallon residential customer where our current rates stand today, where option two would put those rates and where option one would put us. Certainly as these other entities go into their budget cycles, if there are increases in their rates, certainly our rates will continue to push further to the low side of this particular graph. And this is the commercial customer at 50 gallons and then a commercial customer at 200,000 gallons. So that wraps up my piece of this. Yes sir. Yes, go ahead. I'm sorry. So the $80 million project, similar to the discussion we had yesterday, I assume that when that arrives is subject to some variables, so there's some range around when that might occur. Do you have a rough idea, like yesterday we said, kind of plus or minus two years? Yeah, I think, yeah, can you say about plus or minus two years on that? Yeah, and that's kind of like we're forecasting it like in the middle of the range of probabilities. And if we're talking about doing that 75% debt and 25% revenue, so what would the debt service be? And just to take it a couple of steps further, what rate increases will we be looking at in say potentially eight years? If we're off of, you know, whatever, off the 5% reduced base or off the 2% reduced base, how much will we have to jump in order to cover the debt service when that project hits? So again, I think since we're going to be looking at this particular project, very similar to what we're going to be doing on the water side, I think it might be best for us to kind of bring that back to you and kind of show you some different scenarios on what that might look like. We have very similar type questions on this particular project as well. Yes, go ahead. Yeah, so, you know, might a scenario include, you know, for the reflection, well, both playing the increment of the capital, like, you know, does it have to be that big? Or could that be spread? And then, you know, might we make a less shocking jump to customers by, say, either staying flat or staying well below the inflation rate? You know, is there any benefit to that worth looking at so that we don't, you know, just kind of break the rate payers back, you know, in eight years? Correct. Council Member Gregory. Thanks. We have not, as we've talked about wastewater, we have not had a discussion in a while about the issues that we had a while back regarding overflows, spillage, and I know that we, the last time we had a presentation, it was about some smarter ways of going in and checking those sanitary sewer lines to make sure that they're repaired. But before I want to know how much, whether to reduce it by 2% or 5%, I want to be really comfortable that we are doing, that we have as much money as we could possibly need to make sure that we don't have some more issues like we had a few years ago with this spillage because of the issues with compliance with EPA, but more importantly, the issues with environmental integrity to our water system are, because we live in our, the water system where we're getting our water from. So how are we doing there, and can you show me on those slides what kind of money we're putting into constant repair and upgrades of those systems? And I think Katie can probably speak to that, and certainly when we go into this department presentation, one of those components will be the capital improvement program, and they can actually point out some of those projects. Okay. Yeah, are you talking about when, you know, we had that potential consent decree, but we got out from under that because we were doing such a good program, we had such a good program and system in place. I just want to make sure that our program is still good. Okay, so you're just wanting to make sure that we're still on track there. And that we're not running into a situation where we have overflows, especially down close to the plant because of the water and the effects. Is this where you're wanting direction on at least this component of the 2% or 5%? We can wait until the end. Well, if you want to make the correction now. If you could, because I want to look at the graphs from the one, not the graphs, the projections, the numbers on the 1 and 2% like we did last time to see. So under the 1% and 5% in 2019, our revenue funded capital is $8.4 million. Is that right? 2019? Yeah, 8.4 million. Yes, correct. And our reserve fund, 12, but at the end of that, it's basically 9.5 million. Correct. All right, if we could go to maybe option two then. So the funded capital is 10.4. So about 2 million. So that's where you're that's where that rate difference because I think the other ones are gonna be the same. And the reserve million dollar projected reserve. So about $700,000 difference. Okay. All right. I mean, I don't know when you're gonna decide. I'm gonna leave here in a second to go greet the students. But I would be okay with again, as I sort of reasoned last time with option one, because it's, it's, we're only $700,000 less and but that's just me . Okay, do y'all want to give direction on this particular right now or okay? Wow, it's still so fresh in our minds. Yes, Councilmember Briggs. I'm okay with option one as well. I think that if it was going to put us in a lot of trouble, it wouldn't even be an option for us to consider. So I'm okay with that. And the wastewater charge is always the one that's the most difficult to defend and justify when someone is asking me about that charge. So yeah, I'm good with this. And I feel like next year, we can we can keep evaluating and see where we are. I will tell you, you know, Councilmember, one of the items that relates to this is the newcomer rate that you know, I've had a couple of customers that have called about that we are taking a look at that I would think there's a possibility to, to come up with some recommendations on potentially lowering that based on our 10 and five year averages on that. So that is something that we do plan to address when we come back to you with the rate ordinance. Thank you. Anybody else want to comment on Councilmember Gregory? Option one. Oh, you're holding a finger. Okay. Councilmember Ryan. Well, I would prefer option two because I'm much rather do more revenue funded capital projects. Sure. Okay. As opposed to strapping us with future debt. Okay. Councilmember Dove. Okay. I'm leaning to but I'm not opposed to one so I mean, so my preference to but one doesn't give me heartburn. So right now we have. Oh, you don't turn your mic on. I'm leaning to but one is okay as well. I think same issue. I mean, more for me just again, the cash option to pay it pay down. So, well, I need the information that I've requested and I think we're irresponsible to make a choice between two options without knowing what the impact is of something that's been presented, you know, very plainly right in front of us , but without the implications for the rate payers. So I think we need to, you know, we need to take into account kind of what the arc is for them. And, you know, without that, you know, I'd say we don't have enough information to, to opine. All right. So right now we're standing three, three, three for a preference. Anybody want to change? I'm still is what he's asking for something y'all can get back with us pretty easily. What's what's it is. I'm not sure. I'm not sure. I still understanding exactly what you're what you're wanting. But okay, well, well, there's no reason to, you know, be in the dark. Got an $80 million thing right out there. It's not being 80 million 80 80 million. Yeah. So we've been expressed as something that we would aim to do 75% through debt, 25% through cash. We're told that it might be as soon as eight years from now . And that's going to have implications for rates. So just like to understand what that is. And we might ultimately say, you know, rather than save, you know, rather than take credit, yeah, we took a buck and a half off your bill. You know, we might be better off being able to say we kept rates flat for 15 years. You know, or we're going to make a decision now that is going to lead a future council to be in a position where they can I'm going to make up a number here, you know, where they're going to give people 10% rate increases on every utility they got, because this council wouldn't look down the road. That's what I don't want to do. So so right now, I want to see the projection for what the implications for the rate payer, and then look at look at the whole curve. Right. So what you're saying is you're you're okay with the status quo until you get other information to just keep the rate the same. I didn't say that actually. I said, we don't have enough information to say to give to we don't have enough information in my opinion, to give direction with only direction they 're asking for is option one is a 5% rate decrease, or option two, which is a 2% rate decrease, neither option. It might be right to do one or the other might be right to do something different. We need to see the full set of the full set of data in order to to give direction. That's my opinion. I would I would I would tell you that unless unless you're within five or six years, the integrity and these utility funds the integrity of the data we're going to give you over a 10 year projection is not something you can rely on in not something we would recommend planning on. We can certainly show you when the expenses will be layered in. But there are especially with water, there's so many moving parts here that it's it's a mathematical exercise that my my broader concern is we're sitting on such huge fund balance in this fund right now. You can't justify it. And you know, when we're looking eight and 10 years out, unless the council wants to make it up, you know, make a policy decision that we're going to start a sinking fund which most ratepayers will view as two contingencies. I think it's very, very difficult, but we can we can go through the exercise. I will tell you we're not going to have much confidence level when we get started getting out in years six through 10 on the integrity of the numbers . So I get where you're going. But we won't recommend anything other than you're saying for that reason. What you're telling me means it could be much better than we're seeing because it's it's out years. It could be much worse than we're seeing. So when I have uncertainty, it doesn't lead me to do, you know, the least conservative thing. Right. So I'm not afraid of seeing the math. In fact, I require seeing the math. And I understand that there's there's a range of variation around it. No one's saying that we're afraid of showing the math. I'm just telling you that once we get out in year six, we 're not going to be able to defend the math. So I don't I'm not sure how helpful it is, as your experts on staff, where we've got a pretty good planning horizon the next couple of years. And even then, these numbers move wildly based on where b ids come in, whether projects get actually put into the queue and what happens with the weather patterns. I mean, you could have a situation next year where this significantly changes if this kind of weather that we've been experiencing over the last couple of weeks holds up. So I get where you're going. I'm not sure how helpful it's going to be to you other than identifying an expense down the road. Councilmember Hussbett. Yeah, I'll switch to one that'll give us for. Okay, all right. Still provide that information to us if you would. Because I think that the challenge is going to be council member that I understand what you're saying. And I've had the same thought about with the but we could say that about every I mean, we could say that at 10 years down the road, we're going to need three or four or five fire stations, you know, so I mean, so there's going to be things out there that may or may not come true. So if we can't if the five year forecast is one that we hear from staff that and if you go back and look at the five year forecast and look at how were they lined up with what actually happened, you're going to see you know, when you look at it historically, which we have done, we find that it's pretty much more conservative in the in the actuals. In other words, the the we've saved more money than what we thought we were going to spend. So I get it. And so I certainly respect your your your values. And that's what you need to make a decision. That's what you need. And we've got seven people here who get get to decide how they want to do that. So appreciate that. But if you could provide that just a you know, what would that and just and just give us some assumptions. If we did it in year 10, this is what the rate would need to be based upon everything, you know, because you got 2% growth or whatever all those assumptions going out. It's basically just do a five year forecast for 10 years, which we know that that's that was the whole I'm going to the deck. Okay, I'm going to step out. So it sounds like the direction was option one. So I'm going to step out and let Councilmember Gregory have the chair and I'll probably I'll be back. But if so, I'll you'll see me. Don't rush. Don't rush. We can handle it. So dark. Unless there's any other questions, Dr. Banks is going to come up here and kind of go through the departmental presentation. He'll cover not just the wastewater operating side, but also cover some of the environmental services that's kind of part of this fund. Good evening, Council. I am I reckoning I've got less than or approximately 30 minutes. So I'm going to try to make this as quick as possible. Give us give us room for a bathroom break. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 20 minutes 20 minutes. Okay. All right. And don't talk about trying. So thanks. So real real quickly want to talk about some accomplishments and for the for the wastewater fund. A few things here. We've completed design of the Hickory Creek lift station replacement project. If you recall, that's the the lift station that we actually had some damage occur a couple of of I guess about two months ago, where we had a piece of concrete get in it and actually had the lift station go down. So we've got that in the queue for a replacement of rehabilitation project. Concrete Interceptor Phase four project was completed. Basically the Cooper Creek Interceptor. We did do our wastewater master plan computer model that was that's an important component that leads into the the next item we're currently trying to be as optimistic as we can with regards to the wastewater and water impact fees. Those are required to be done on a five year period. We need that water and wastewater master plan in order to be able to put the impact the capital program together and we really want to get that accomplished before we start the new budget cycle. So that's why we have it in our upcoming, if you will, accomplishments. And we continue just like on the water side to ensure that our in house construction and preventative maintenance costs are lower than what we could get on the by contracting that service out. We track a number of metrics, including equipment and and staff time, and then benchmark against what we can get from from outside services. So goals are to begin construction of the Hickory Creek and West Peak Flow detention facility. Basically those are two facilities that are designed to take in peak flows and store them during periods of high flow. We still do have a infiltration and inflow that happens into our system and so our volumes go up when we get heavy rainfall. We like to build storage capacity within the system to be able to hold that waste material until after the event has has passed and then feed it back into the system that prevents us from having to do a plant capacity increase before we need to. So we want to begin the pump station, of course, meet all the administrative order requirements that were mentioned earlier by Councilman Gregory, just to address that question real real briefly. That's baked into the operating cost. PS and and his staff have done a great job in keeping up with that. Our sanitary sewer overflows continue to go down and are at very low levels. We've been able to use the asset management program to basically right size our capital replacements and and are have been able to keep our budgets down accordingly. And we're meeting all the requirements of the of the AO. So basically we want to continue our in house construction benchmarking. And then we really need to complete a design and construction of a sludge handling project. I mentioned this a little bit last last session about the water side for solids handling at the at the Louisville treatment plant. We have had to undergo a design change in the Pecan Creek plant to deal with our new phosphorus effluent limitations. And basically that is designed to do ferric chloride injections and that creates some additional solids and solids handling challenges. So we're going to a more modern approach to solids handling that is more mechanical in nature to help us deal with those issues. Do we you're talking about bio solids. That's correct. And do we use take all of those and mix them with compost. That's correct. Yes. Yeah. The only thing that is disposed of at the treatment plant is the that doesn't go into the composting operation is whatever is caught on the initial bar screen and then what's separated out prior to all of the settling basins by the essentially it's the grit removal section of it. All the rest of it goes into the composting operation. And do we are we selling enough compost or are we are we getting an over supply of inventory. I don't believe that we're getting an oversupply of inventory. We have a tendency to to build that inventory up in anticipation of sales times because it's only used during certain times of the year. But in terms of building up an excess inventory I don't I don't believe that's the case. We have a question here. So when you say grit day are you speaking of the famous corn. That's correct. You've been out there. Yes. Okay. Yeah. That's absolutely. So that is not where does that go. That that actually gets disposed of at the landfill along with the bar screen. Okay. Yeah. That that material will not break down very effectively in the in the compost operation. So it also gets really bad at Thanksgiving and Christmas. Not to get too detailed. Anyway basically our budget emphasis is always to deliver cost effective solutions. We want to really analyze our asset lifecycle to be sure that we're replacing everything when it needs to be replaced. Continue to leverage technology again. Wastewater Group is has is is very well known for asset management and the use of technology to to make our system last longer. And then translating all of that information I really feel that that leads us to improving our customer service because by doing all of those activities we're reducing our mainline service calls our sewer chokes and our sanitary sewer over flows. So in the asset management plan I've talked about a little bit already. We continue to use that to drive efficiencies and reduce our costs for O&M. We want to really work this upcoming year in getting our solids handling sludge dewatering equipment in place and get it operational to handle all of that material that we need to manage at the plant. Real briefly on the position summary I mentioned to you all yesterday in the water presentation that we were moving to positions to wastewater out of the Field Service Technical Group and that the budget transfer would be able to was going to occur from water to wastewater to pay for those positions. So we're adding to two positions but it's budget neutral. Five-year capital plan again as as yesterday we wanted to give you a high pass overview of our of our capital planning kind of give you a sense of what that looks like and and again I want to point out for the council's benefit and those watching the group assignment numbers because that gives you the the category of the type of capital plan that's going on so when you get the full budget information you'll be able to see those categories know what type of category the expense belongs to and then they 'll be detailed capital improvement sheets in the budget book that will tell you about each of the individual projects cost and a brief description. So the major projects that we're looking at are predominantly those detention facilities the the lift station upgrade got those by fiscal year in this particular slide solids handling the the in system storage that we had talked about a little bit earlier and then we've got a large system of replacements that are our large system of interceptor work that is going on for up sizing our infrastructure on the H ickory Creek and then adding some additional connections and so essentially these are coming in they're labeled one through four and you can see the the individual fiscal years the collective amount of feet being sold or upgraded in that particular series of four are is roughly about 30,500 feet of lines so that's a pretty substantial amount of capacity that's being added there. Could you go back one slide please? Yes. Do you show anywhere in there or do you show somewhere else ? I'm looking at oversized lines and I'm assuming that this has to do with with preparing for new developments that come in and and then they have impact fees so do we see anywhere in this plan where there's revenue coming in from those impact fees to offset some of these costs? Yes, actually when when Tony showed you the the budget pro forma earlier on the revenue side you will actually see impact fee revenues as one of the revenue lines. Okay thank you. Yeah and just so you know the the oversized lines we we basically hold funding in in there and and replenish it each year so that we can have the ability to have capital to bring to bear on on a a line oversized for new development so if a new development goes in and they're required to put a certain capacity in and we deem it to be in the interest of the city to increase that capacity the developer only pays for the capacity of their system and then we basically oversize the line for that additional capacity need that we've identified. Mr. Ray. You can go back that slide thank you. On replacement lines does that include when we're redoing a street and we replace the lines underneath it beforehand? That's correct yeah our our field service replacements are are basically designed we we're always looking at that system on both the water and wastewater side anytime there's a street project that's been proposed to determine whether the life cycle of that asset would indicate that it needs to be replaced at the same time so we tear it up only one time and that's the most cost efficient way to do it. It takes a little bit longer but it will you know hopefully inconvenience the the residents less. Well I guess where my concern is is as you look at 2021 and out you've only got 25,000 listed in there as opposed to 977 on in 2019 it's. We are we are front loaded on that because of all the activity that's going on so it is ramping down I couldn't I couldn't tell you the specifics without going into detail but if you would like to see that information I'm sure we can get it for you. Okay thank you. Sure. Last slide here is to just show you the the overall CIP map for those projects that we've just talked about it's color coded by each of the individual fiscal years and you can see here is that large section of Hickory Creek intercept ors that I mentioned a little bit earlier. So that's it for wastewater. I also wanted to go through environmental services really quickly and give their departmental presentation. This this is a department that exists within departments if you will it's funded by a variety of different sources so wanted to give an opportunity to kind of see where where things are at. Basically the this is FDs by functional area you can see that there's there's not been a whole lot of change in between we are we are proposing a aside from the footnotes we are proposing a one FTE increase in watershed protection due to some of the new regulatory requirements that we have for stormwater inspections. So we're we're getting at capacity for being able to keep up with all the development inspections and then the state has blessed us with some additional regulatory requirements in that regard. Real quickly this is what environmental services looks like there's kind of two major elements to it the assistant director of environmental services is Deborah Vieira. She has the landfill regulatory laboratory manager environmental compliance coordinator in the watershed protection and industrial pretreatment group and then we've got the sustainability side of the organization that's managed by Katherine Barnett which includes keep it beautiful and then also sustainability recycling marketing and outreach. So just a few accomplishments we were actually looked at as a test case for the star communities group which is a a sustainability rating group for for predominantly large cities. Typically you won't see a city of our size in that group but they wanted to take a look at us and see kind of how we would rank out. So we got a three star system which was an interesting exercise to go to that's that's by the way a very good score especially considering our size and it gave us some things to think about that we're talking about bringing into the sustainability plan update discussions that are ongoing right now. We did complete the review and approval of sub chapter 17 matter exceeded all requirements for tcq designation of a high performing pretreatment program. The landfill received a zero compliance history score never liked that scoring system because the zeros the best you can get but that's that's the highest rating possible. We implemented the inner star energy star portfolio manager to track our municipal building energy use and then we've been working with the state energy conservation office Seco to do energy audits of our 10 highest using municipal buildings. Real quickly goals we want to continue to build out our air quality action plan. Oftentimes you see this as the greenhouse gas inventory that we that we bring to you. So we want to kind of add some additional elements as we continue to make that plan of all we need to look at a stormwater ordinance for industrial sites. So we've got that on the radar to meet our municipal separate storm sewer system requirements draft the technical criteria manual that we discussed during the sub chapter 17 revisions complete our update to the sustainability plan adopt and implement. Basically the the others are related to sustainability education series including the roots and shoots program for sustainable schools. That's a program that's really about environmental volunteerism is kind of the next level after our recycling and community garden education that we've been doing. We want to complete the gas well inspection contract evaluate and make a recommendation to city council and one of the things that we've really been working on that I'll share with you later when we do the gas well departmental presentation is continue to approve the public information for gas well inspection so that people can understand how what the inspections look like what activities we're doing what things look like in their neighborhood. You have a question yes. So it may be more of a question when that gas well presentation comes to us but when you're looking at the contract and evaluating are you also looking at what we used to do and comparing that or yes yes yeah absolutely and and I think we can you know we certainly go into detail on that when we have the departmental presentation. Yeah thank you. Real quickly just wanted to go over our performance measures. You can you can see them up here. They're basically in their designed to try to help us understand our workload measures participation rates. Some of them are compliance related and like our elicit discharge reported per number resolved as a metric that we have to report to the state. So I won't spend the time to read through all of these. If you see one that you are interested in or would like some more details on I'd be happy to provide that to you. Departmental cost containment strategies basically we reviewed our water sample collection and analyses we like to do that about every five years and just identify any redundancies or ways that we can do things differently. We were able to save about $19,000 in cost savings by doing that effort and then we also had a reduction of two FTEs under the landfill regulatory compliance division due to the fact that that program is is no longer going to move forward. That's about a $90,000 savings. Completed projects we finally finished the TCK voluntary cleanup program for the old Denton County annex and got that clean bill of health. We restructured our private waste haulers to provide some equity with other municipalities and the way the fee structure was set up it was really more punitive to those smaller haulers and so we worked on that to make sure that they were kind of pushed out of the business by the fee structure. We consolidated recycling education and outreach and keep Denton beautiful under the sustainability group. Renovated a building at wastewater treatment plants into a field laboratory which has been very nice for doing certain kinds of analyses out there and then we installed a permanent odor control vapor system. We had a little discussion about that in consent agenda earlier today. Future projects we continue to look at our mosquito surveillance and response plan. That's one of the responsibilities of environmental services and always on the lookout for new disease concerns and treatment methodologies. Want to deal with our laboratory information management system and continue to make that produce information from data efficiently and then we are going to have some new monitoring and reporting requirements for the landfill permit amendment and we of course are going to work through those to make sure we're compliant there. So that is pretty much it for the department. So I will step aside unless there's any questions. Is there any direction? I missed the first part of the presentation. That was the departmental presentation mayor. The next presentation we have for you is on drainage. Okay. So we've got about 10 minutes before our regular schedule. Do you think we can get through it? I think we can manage that. So one of the things that was requested of us when we came back and talked a little bit about the capital improvement programs on the geo funded side was that we had some gaps and so we had identified what we call channel rehab money. That was really money that came from this drainage fee that we had transferred over capital project and sat there for some time and so what we did at the time we recommended to utilize a little bit over $2 million from that particular account to bridge the gap on some of these geo funded projects that needed the extra funding. So as a result of that the council had asked that we come back and specifically talk about the drainage component and the drainage fee. So just real quick history here. Prior to 1999 the drainage program was funded out of the general fund. It subsequently was moved in 1999 into the wastewater fund and it was funded 70% from water, 30% from wastewater revenues. In 2000 there was a discussion that initiated with the council at the time to implement a drainage fee under some state statutory provisions that allowed us to charge a drainage fee and dedicate it to the specific function. So in 2002 that drainage fee was adopted by the council, was put in place. It was to cover drainage O&M, the storm water program, street sweeping program and about $1 to $2 million of limited capital program. That program and I say limited, it's mainly maintenance and some minor improvements to our existing drainage system but because of the nature of the program we do consider them capital, we do capitalize those in our accounting system and so that's why they're identified as capital. Within the O&M component is also debt service. So there was a debt service component at the time that was also being paid. We are ne aring the end of that particular, those particular issuances. So some of the cost containment strategies here, again budgeted salaries, reducing revenue funding, small capital projects, utilizing mapping to reduce personal time. One of the things that I'll mention to you is that we really want to take certainly the next year and really take a look at this particular operation, continue to have conversations with the council about this operation . We do agree that this operation while it has been part of the wastewater fund has not really been discussed in much detail with the council over the years and so we certainly wanted to separate this out and have more discussions with the council. In the five-year forecast for this particular fund, for this particular operation we are not recommending any changes to the current fee schedule. Again that's been in place since 2002. The drainage fee is calculated on a square footage impervious surface. There is that million dollar reserve that was previously shown and dedicated in wastewater but it's really for drainage and so we do show that over here on this drainage and I'll kind of walk through the perform of that for you. So some of the risk, again we have aging infrastructure, there's public safety considerations, contractor costs are certainly things that we're cognizant of that are impacting our projects. So real simple five-year forecast here for you. So for '19 we're projecting about $4.7 million in rate revenue. This is the drainage fee. There is non- rate revenue, $357,000 that's coming primarily from the general fund to fund some of these programs that aren't covered under the drainage fee like, and I told Katie I wouldn't say the word, but I'm going to say the Mosquito Program is one that's funded out of here. So there's a number of programs that are in this particular function that are funded by transfers primarily from the general fund into this particular operation. O&M components certainly here, revenue funded capital you'll see that that continues to grow as our debt service continues to decrease and so we will be continuing to do projects and Danny will come up here in a minute and talk to you a little bit about some of those capital projects that they'll be engaging in. Again no rate increases being proposed for the drainage fee, no change and there's a million dollars that we're showing in a drainage reserve for any emergency type of situation to come up. Councilmember Gregory has a question. Thank you. Regarding the expenses, the O&M expenses, I'm assuming that that's money that's available to go in and take some of the drainage ditches and clean them out so that the water flows more smoothly. Correct. Those are the types of projects that were contemplated here . Do we do that on a as needed basis? Do we do that? Do we have a regular monitoring program? There's a drainage ditch on the east side of Nottingham, right where Nottingham turns into Audra next to Shiloh Gardens that has some pretty sizable trees now that keep getting beautiful. We'd love to be able to plant in people's yards and I think the larger they get the more expensive it's going to be to clean them out. So I'm concerned about those kinds of things. Let me ask Dan to come up here, Councilmember. Okay. Yes, to answer your question, those aren't on the concrete line channels we do make regular checks of and everything else and we do look around on the natural ones and do make checks. A lot of them we do get phone calls on when we have issues, we'll go out there, we 'll verify and then we'll go out there and see what needs to be done, what kind of cleaning and all that. Just like I said in the streets program before, we need to dive into this department. I'm looking at trying to get more stuff into our system so we can go back over and actually get them on a routine pass every year so we can go by and verify everything. Thanks. I don't know if we're going to get the presentation done by 630. So a couple options, we can do it and be late at going out there, we can just push it to because we're at sort of a stopping point here, is push it to the next work session. I just we've got seven proclamations, six or seven proclamations and I just would hate to keep people waiting out there. So if we could maybe move this to the next the first one of the budget presentations next week if that's okay. Nothing against you guys. It's just okay. Then at we will stand adjourned at 626 and then reconvene up in the city council on the mics now working June 5 2018. It is 634. If you would join me in standing if you're able to pledge allegiance to the US and Texas flag. Honored the Texas flag. I pledge allegiance to the Texas one state under God one indivisible. Okay, we've got several proclamations to read tonight. The first one is women's veteran day. So anybody who's here to accept that proclamation or participate, please come on down and we'll get you introduce yourselves and tell us a little bit about the proclamation. Hi I'm Camilla Zimbal. I'm the commander of the women veterans of America Denton and we're chapter 48 and the proclamation is about the integration services act. 70 years ago women were integrated into the service and recognized as women of the service even though they served long before that they just were not recognized and so President Truman signed an act 70 years ago and this is a celebration of that act and so we're going to have an event at Lil Elm Park on June the 9th for our women veterans to celebrate to educate people concerning women veterans and to continue to grow this chapter that we now have 62 members of. Hi I'm Gina Smith and I am a retired Marine and I am the sergeant at arms for our chapter 48 color guard and honor guard. Hi I'm Diane Frazier. I'm an Air Force veteran and I'm also a member of the color guard. My name is Sandra Miller US Army law enforcement. My name is Cecilia Barr. I served in the US Navy and I'm a proud member of the women's veterans 48. I'm Sharon Boalsley. I'm a retired Army nurse anesthetist and enjoyed serving. Well before I read this I want to thank you all for your service to our country and all those that have served and I'd like for us to just give you a warm round of applause. It's an honor that I will read this proclamation. It's a proclamation by the mayor of the city of Denton Texas whereas Texas salutes and remembers the many American female veterans who have courageously and honorably served in the military on behalf of our nation. And whereas women have formally been a part of the United States Armed Forces since the inception of Army nurse excuse me Army nurse corps in 1901 but have proudly served alongside and supported our nation's military since the American Revolution. And whereas the women's veterans community is the fastest growing subset of American veterans in Texas women comprise over 13 percent of the veteran population a percentage which is higher than the national average and increasing yearly. Whereas women veterans of America chapter 48 and the Denton County Military Veterans Peer Network network advocate for cultural transformation to raise awareness about the service and sacrifice of women veterans. And whereas on June the 9th 2017 Greg Abbott governor of Texas signed Senate bill 805 declaring that June 12th be celebrated as women's veteran day and order that all Texans recognize the role of women in the military forces and to commemorate the sacrifices of and valor displayed by Texas women veterans. And whereas we honor our female veterans and their families for their remarkable sacrifices and outstanding contributions to our nation. Now therefore I Chris Watts mayor of the city of Denton Texas do hereby declare and proclaim June the 12th 2018 as women's veterans day here in the city of Denton and encourage all Denton residents to recognize the courage and contributions of generations of American service women and their families who have proudly served our great state and nation doing their part to protect our land people freedoms and legacy. Thank you ladies so much. I have a confession to make. I made a mistake. Y'all were supposed to help us with the pledges of allegiance so I totally forgot about it so I'm going to own that and be accountable so thank you ladies so much thank you thank you very much thank you. Our next proclamation is men's health week. Is there anybody here for men's this is this is very embarrassing. There's nobody here from I'll stand in for men's health week. Yes that's right. This is a proclamation by the mayor of the city of Denton whereas despite advances in medical technology and research men continue to live an average of five years less than women with Native American and African American men having the lowest life expectancy and whereas educating the public and health care providers about the importance of a healthy lifestyle and early detection of male health problems will result in reducing rates of mortality from disease and whereas men who are educated about the value of preventative health care play in prolonging their lifespan and their role as productive family members will be more likely to participate in health screenings and whereas the men's health network works with Congress to develop a nation a national men's health week awareness period as a specific campaign to help educate men boys and their families about the importance of positive health attitudes and preventative health practices and whereas the men's health month website has been established at men's health month dot org and features resources proclamations and information about awareness events and activities including wear blue for men's health and whereas Denton men's health month will focus on a broad range of men's health issues including heart disease diabetes mental health prostate testicular excuse me and colon cancer and whereas the citizens of this city are encouraged to increase awareness of the importance of a healthy lifestyle regular exercise and medical checkups now therefore I Chris Watts mayor the city of Denton Texas to hereby declare and proclaim June 2018 as men's health month here in the city of Denton and encourage all citizens to pursue preventative health practices and early detection efforts so thank you all. National pollinator week who's accepting the national poll inator because you're going to have to yeah yeah so tell us a little bit introduce yourselves and tell us a little bit about national pollinator week. Hi everyone my name is Sarah Luxton and I work with the the Bee City USA program here at the city of Denton and we're hoping to celebrate poll inator week it's June 18th through the 24th we have several fun events planned for the community partnering with groups like the libraries here scrap Denton we also are partnering with the Texas master naturalist and today I'm joined with by one of the Texas master naturalist from the Elm Fork and we also have our wonderful Denton County beekeepers association who is quite the leader when it comes to educating and helping all the beekeepers bee keepers in the community so I'm going to pass it off to them. Hello I'm Candy Pardue I'm the president of the Denton County beekeepers association and our mission is to support the beekeepers within our county help them be better at their jobs but we also encourage citizens to come out learn about the pollinators there's things you can do every day in your own yard that will help the pollinators within the city of Denton and Denton County and we would love to help you learn what those things are. And I'm Clay Thurman I'm with Elm Fork chapter Texas master naturalist we have a pollinator garden out at Clear Creek we also have one at Leela learning center and I would like to encourage everybody to get into planting pollinator friendly plants and challenge the city of Denton to become a monarch watch city we cannot let Louisville show us up can we? Thank you thank you all this is a proclamation by the mayor of the city of Denton whereas pollinator species such as thousands of species of bees are an essential partners in producing much of our food supply I'm going to read that one more time because it sounds so simple but it's so important I mean it's so important whereas poll inator species such as thousands of species of bees are essential partners in producing much of our food supply and whereas pollinator species provide significant environmental benefits that are necessary necessary for maintaining healthy diverse urban and suburban ecosystems whereas pollination plays a vital role for the trees and plants of our community enhancing our quality of life and creating recreational and economic development opportunities whereas for decades the city of Denton has managed urban landscapes and public lands that include many municipal parks and green ways as well as wildlife habitats and whereas the city of Denton provides recommendations to developers and residents regarding landscaping to promote wise conservation stewardship including the protection of pollinators and maintenance of their habitats in urban and suburban environments now therefore I Chris Watts mayor of the city of Denton Texas do hereby declare and proclaim June the 18th through the 24th of 2018 as national poll inator week here in the city of Denton as an affiliate of Bee City USA and encourage all citizens to recognize and join this observance of our community thank you all so much for bringing this to our awareness Juneteenth who's here for Juneteenth oh is it oh yes I really oh yeah Juneteenth I think he did that on purpose to get that grand entrance I understand that okay yeah all right okay introduce yourself and tell us about Junete enth Willie Hutzmith and Juneteenth is those who don't know the blacks in Texas didn't find out that they were free until two years later someone said they come did they come by boat did the boat get lost we don't know we didn't find out we were free until two years after the the actual freedom took place and so we are celebrating that time hi my name is Yolanda Glover I've been a part of Juneteenth for 23 years right now I'm inactive so I'm just here to support the Juneteenth celebration it is not a black festival why don't some of y'all come out and and and cheer with us I hope you like barbecue and fixings and things like that come on out if you can't dance we'll teach you how to dance all right okay this is a proclamation by the mayor of the city of Denton whereas the city of Denton recognizes the vast contribution that the African-American people have made to this community and where it is it is this population that helped laid a strong foundation for the city of Denton and whereas the 19th of June is the day recognized as freedom day and immense and patient day to celebrate the anniversary of the abolition of slavery excuse me in Texas on June 19th 1865 the day the slaves in Texas were freed and whereas all people of all races are now protected from slavery by law now therefore I Chris Watts mayor of the city of Denton Texas in recognition of the spirit of freedom do hereby declare and proclaim June the 16th 2018 as Juneteenth day to be celebrated at Fred Moore Park in the city of Dent on and urge all citizens to join in the spirit of the celebration and friendship for the good of the citizens of our community thank you so much okay LGBTQ pride month who's here to represent that come on down we're gonna get you to introduce yourselves come on down it's okay no hi my name is George fairy I'm the president of the Stone wall Democrats of Denton County we have our monthly our pride celebration on the 30th of this month and the goal of pride Denton is to shed light on intersectionality and giving people of color voice and visibility so on behalf of Stonewall I'd like to have miss Leslie Gut ierrez speak hi I'm my name is Leslie I'm the treasurer of Stonewall and we wanted to first think our allies on City Council for having a proclamation for pride month there's a lot of safe spaces that we have in Denton from glitter bomb and Andes or the former Mables or crossroads that we know we can go and be who we are and love who we love and we think it's a really visible step forward for City Council to make a proper proclamation and we're really excited because it means that we're gonna ask for more the human rights campaign gave us 33 out of a possible 100 points for LGBTQ friendly cities today which means we're gonna be here knocking on doors asking for an equal rights ordinance because housing discrimination is not okay we are who we are we love who we love and we deserve dignity and respect which means you're gonna see a lot of us I'm CC bar now and it's Cecilia but I'm very proud of this organization in the way we've tried to communicate with parents and community and grow with our inner relationships knock down the questions and educate don't ever hesitate to walk up to us let us know who's in your family or how you're doing dealing with it or ask questions on how to talk to him God bless you and thank you for the proclamation my name is Jordan Villarreal and I'm the vice president of Stonewall my name is Paige Dixon and I'm the vice president of the young Democrats of Denton County and very proud to be here today with my friends Sandy Swan I'm the secretary for Stonewall Democrats Denton County and just here to support our all of our allies and LGBTQ communities in Denton hi I'm Jacqueline Ulysses and I'm not sure if I'm really supposed to be up here okay okay because I'm not part of the Stone wall thing I saw this event via Facebook I want to be a part of it okay okay cool all right yeah for sure I am the secretary of pride at Texas Women's University and I recently came out on Facebook as asexual my name is Camion Connor I am the current chair for outreach Denton we provide a safe space and LGBT youth group here for Denton teens and I'm just so excited to see so many people here and thanks for repping us too my name is Tamsen Price I am the current president of the college Dems of UNT and I am here to support our LGBT community and allies so hey my name is Agatha Bynes and I am a teacher at Texas Women's University my name is Deb Armentar and I'm really proud to teach in the LGBT studies program at UNT and George asked me to come here I'm really proud to stand up here with my friends Clay Thurmond and I am a proud ally of my LGBTQ brothers and sisters I'm Russell Lytle I'm the former president of Stonewall Democrats current president of Dent on Progressives and most importantly member of the community for over 15 years here in Denton and one of your neighbors my name is Max and I'm a black belt in Taekwondo yeah my name is Amber my pronouns are she her and hers these are my kids Max who is 10 and Lulu who is 6 and Lulu and I are very proud straight cisgender allies hi my name is Lindsay Jones and I'm a member of the LGBTQ community hi my name is Kelly Jakes I'm a member of GLAAD at UNT and I'm here to support all my brothers and sisters and allies my name is Ened Eli as Josea I'm a citizen of Denton County and I'm one of the committee members for Pride Denton hi my name is Ashley I'm just happy to be here okay this is a proclamation by the mayor of the city Denton whereas we recognize the June anniversary of the Stonewall uprising in New York as the beginning of the modern lesbian gay bisexual transgender queer equality movement and whereas we recognize the tireless efforts of LGBTQ and allied groups who have pursued equality for all citizens and in Texas abroad where we recognize that on June 27th 2015 the Supreme Court of the United States in the case of Obergefell is that correct how you say that Obergefell Obergefell sorry versus Hodges director Ohio Department of Health ruled that constitution ruled that the constitution grants same-sex couples the same right to marry that heterosexual couple has and whereas we recognize former President Barack Obama 's declaration on June 24th 2016 of the 7.7 acres surrounding the Stonewall Inn as a national monument this is the first National Park Service unit dedicated to the gay rights movement and includes the Tavern Christopher Park and several other streets where protests were held in 1969 now therefore I Chris Watts mayor the city of Denton Texas to hereby declare and proclaim the month of June 2018 as Denton LGBTQ Pride Month in the city of Denton and ask for all citizens to celebrate the work of the LGBTQ in promoting diversity and tolerance in our community and throughout our country thank you all thank you all for being here. Okay our next proclamation is the longest day now I see some some shirts out there that I think are going to be coming down. Good evening how are y'all? Come on in. Would you introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about the longest day and then we'll have everybody introduce themselves. Thank you so much my name is Erin Caston and I am the advisory board chair for the greater Dallas Alzheimer's Association representing Denton County so we keep Denton County represented and for all things Alzheimer's our goal and my task my passion is to help Denton County be aware of what support services are out there what we're about leading research for the complications and the disease of Alzheimer's the longest day is a signature day of action for the Alzheimer's Association during June which is Alzheimer's and brain awareness month held annually on the summer solstice it advocates across the world will honor these are people excuse me facing Alzheimer's disease and their caregivers by participating in activities that they love worldwide there's an estimated 47 million people living with Alzheimer's and other dementias participants will do what they love biking hiking playing bridge swimming here in Denton a couple of our communities play poker they play bingo and this affects all walks in of industry this is not just senior health and I'm a nurse it's not just health care but this is everyone in our citizens here in Denton County whether it's choosing your favorite activity hosting an event or joining a team participants will raise funds and awareness to the advanced critical to advance our critical needs for the Alzheimer's Association in care support research and programs and I like to introduce Jerry. I'm Jerry Sam's and have been involved with the Denton Alzheimer's Association for many years and also any of you are interested we have support groups for caregivers and we would welcome you to join us thank you. Good evening I'm Tanya Blix I am on the walk committee with Aaron and I also work for Good Samaritan Society Denton Village we're celebrating the longest day by opening a dog park this year so I'd like to invite everybody out to our dog park on June 21st in the morning while it's cool bring your dog and we're going to run around and chase dogs for our longest day. Hi I'm Ashley Lascore I am the president of Silver Lining Home Care Solutions and we are a home care agency in Denton and I'm here supporting the Alzheimer's Association we can all fight together to end Alzheimer's we are celebrating the longest day by shining bright and being a silver lining to somebody by spreading a random act of kindness on the longest day and I'm here standing for my grandmother. Hi my name is Veronica Elliott and I am with Brookdale Senior Living we're part of the Alzheimer's Committee or yeah sorry and we just believe in what we do and thank you. Hi my name is Allison Helms I'm a participant in the longest day this year and last year I'm a wedding and portrait photographer here in Denton and so I'm offering many sessions on June 18th and 19th and all the proceeds are going to the longest day fundraiser. I'm Eileen Short and I assist Jerry with different support groups along with serving on the advisory committee. Hello my name is Kimberly Engle and I work with Veronica as well at Brookdale Senior Living. Hi my name is Lisa Schader I work in the financial services industry this is my second year participating in the longest day and to honor my husband's grandmother will be donating clothing and other items to the women's shelter and in honor of my grandmother will be eating a lot of Mexican food. Thank you wonderful thank you all so much for sharing that. This is a proclamation by the mayor of the city of Denton whereas Alzheimer's disease is the most common form of dementia that affects memory thinking and behavior. Alzheimer's disease is a global health crisis worldwide there are an estimated 47 million people living with Alzheimer's and other dementia including 5.4 million in the United States. There is a 29 percent increase in the number of Texas Tex ans age 65 or older with Alzheimer's by 2025 the greatest risk factor for this disease is age over 65 and women are at the epicenter of the Alzheimer's epidemic accounting for two out of the three cases and whereas the disease is the sixth leading cause of death and the cause of death among the top ten in the United States that cannot be prevented cured or even slowed. Alzheimer's disease is the most expensive disease in America and has become a national crisis and whereas since 1980 the Alzheimer's Association has worked to enhance care and support advanced research and advocate for people with Alzheimer's and their families and caregivers. The Alzheimer's Association vision is to reduce the risk of dementia through the promotion of brain health. The Alzheimer's Association the leading voluntary health organization envisions a world without Alzheimer's and has an impact on the global national and local level and whereas the longest day is a sunrise to sunset team event to raise funds and awareness for an awareness excuse me for the Alzheimer's Association this event is held annually on the summer solstice and symbolizes the challenging journey of those living with the disease and their caregivers and those lost to the disease. On this day teams around the world will come together to honor the strength passion and endurance of those facing Alzheimer's. Now therefore I Chris Watts mayor of the city of Denton Texas do hereby proclaim June the 21st 2018 as the Alzheimer's Association the longest day in the city of Denton and encourage all Denton residents to recognize and to support this organization. Thank you for bringing this to our awareness. Thank you so much. Okay if you could our next agenda item will be agenda item three presentation from members of the public if you could roll the introductory remarks please. The Denton City Council has adopted rules of procedure including a code of conduct that applies to citizens as well as council members these rules were enacted to promote an orderly process and to preserve decorum here is a brief review of the rules that apply to citizen reports citizens will have four minutes to give a scheduled citizen report and four minutes to give an open mic report there will be an electronic bell when time has expired if the remarks are not concluded by that time the citizen will be asked to stop speaking if the citizen does not cease and a second request is made the mayor will request to have the citizen removed from the council chamber citizens are asked not to approach the dais if a citizen has papers or other materials to hand out to the council please let the city secretary know in advance for scheduled citizen reports the council may initiate discussion or questions following each citizen report for non scheduled open mic citizen reports the council may listen to citizens speak however because no notice of the subject of the open mic report has been provided to the public in advance the Texas open meetings act limits any deliberation or decision by the council to a proposal to place the item on a future agenda a statement of factual policy or a recitation of existing policy citizens are asked to direct all remarks and questions to the council as a whole and not to any individual member please refrain from making abusive personal impertinent profane or slander ous remarks anyone who violates this council rule of procedure may be immediately removed from the council chamber thank you in advance copies of the rules of procedure are available from the city secretary okay we don't have any scheduled speakers but so we'll go on to the other public speaking portion of the agenda which is the open mic we have a speaker Mr. Willie Hutzpeth if you'll come down state your name and address your time will begin. Mayor and council members my name is Willie Hutzpeth I live at 623 Newton and I wish you all would tell my wife any of you that I have Alzheimer's disease not old timers disease speak to her about that she has a lot of Alzheimer's let me just say let me start off with saying something's wrong with a city that only has two firefighters in the history something's wrong I know I've given lots of excuses as to why that is let me just say to you it doesn't look good and something's wrong with that secondly I notice there's only one female on this council thank you it's not good either so we need to kind of even up things so we can do better I think here's an example of doing better the back to school event has been put on for years and grown to a point at which many kids are being helped and what they do is give out things that the kids will need when school begins why this year did you move it from MLK to maybe it's a better location I don 't know it's a better location okay at the church that it's going to now how are the people in southeastern the ones who need the the the material the most who's being raised by their grandparents are no parents trying to get these items how are they going to get all the way over to Denton Bible Church and why didn't someone contact the people who 've been doing this for years and already have it set up they were eliminated from the whole thought process and in this whole procedure that you're doing what that's what I mean by having somebody on this council that's a little bit better than what you all are presenting yourself as representatives no representation no one was notified that all of these things are going to take place no one from the committees from years past who've done this and had this organized and had something in fact in place that whatever is taking place is taking place no flyers have been distributed you have not notified anybody as to where the thing is going I don't know I don't know what you advertise it if you did something's wrong with that the kids who needed the most are not informed it is moved in a place where they can't get to and there are some supporters of the organization and they were they had vendors vendors who came out and who showed what they were trying to produce many of them were just volunteer even the fire department I even mentioned them in good light but the fire department was there they weren't now you have to pay to be an a sponsor that's backwards we are going backwards and for the mayor to have his name affixed to it that's not good because I know Mayor Watson and he doesn't he would not purposely I don't think do this so I'd say someone needs to look at this the two major issues let the people know who's been doing this for years what you're doing they should be a part of the decision making process rethink taking that thing over to Denton Bible and thirdly you need to talk to some people who've done it who've already they've already done it for years they're in fact ready to do it we're ready to do it this year probably need to contact them and make sure that they know what's going on and that they have a part in this the kids are going to really be hurt that need this to most and I was suggesting you that you look into it and and make some some very much needed changes thank you thank you all right move on to an extra agenda item which is the consent agenda Councilmember Ryan consent agenda item with the exceptions of items J and R all right Councilmember Gregory second so we have a motion to approve in a second to approve the consent agenda items all of them except for items J and R which will be considered as items for individual consideration let's vote on the board please motion carries seven zero we'll now take up item J which is agenda item for J consider adoption of an ordinance of the city of Dentex the home rule city authorizing the approval of change order number four to the contract between the city of Denton and Zachary construction corporation for the mayhole road widening and improvements project I believe it was there did we have a staff presentation requested for that or I know we wanted it to be pulled just so you know we've got a very high level overview of you a few slides okay all right you bet he's wonderful okay mayor council Todd Esther city engineer we're here to present tonight the change order number four for the mayhill project this is the total negative net change order of a little over six hundred sixty seven thousand dollars it was a construction decision during the time of construction knowing that there is a bridge project to be encountered in the next phase of this construction so when we took into account multiple items we were starting to look at how are we building this thing and what is the what is the best value to the city as we continue this project forward just to give you a brief overview mayhill and I apologize the map is turned to the right so north is to your your left side and as you look north mayhill road the project extends from University Drive all the way down to where Edwards and mayhill begin to split or just about right at Blue J lane so in light of the council's decision last fall to explore more avenues to make this a more and less complete project by including the bridge project over the DCA DCTA bridge and provide a much more straight route to mayhill in general we pursued funding through north central north central Texas Council of Governments and had that funding approved to where we have an eighteen million dollar almost nineteen million dollar extension to the project to make this the complete project it was originally intended to be when it was originally considered as a part of that funding agreement the city also has to maintain a match of approximately 20 percent of that eighteen and a half million dollars puts us in there for about four million dollars as construction has proceeded there have been multiple items out on the job site that we've had under runs on quantities where we estimate as best we can during the design phase exactly how much is going to be required of certain items and then during the process of construction you find out that we don't have that exact amount that we're normally using so we either sometimes overrun or under run those items usually we're very close but there are times when you're out in the field that that does present a change so some of those items come from that there was also an agreement with the county Denton County to get some of the right away that we needed and temporary construction easements that we needed to make this roadway of reality so in lieu or in kind for that transfer we're also doing improvements where we're providing a left turn median into the Denton County facility as well as an eight inch water reuse line that they'll use for landscaping irrigation some other things it comes directly out of the wastewater treatment plant we also had a lift station that needed to be modified along Providence Parkway and with some additional taps as we get in the near properties and real estate that are right off of Mayhill Road itself you find out that some of the taps and fire hydrant locations weren't as conducive to the construction operation as we had initially thought so some of those things got moved as well and what we would call a field change and then you wrap it up in a change order such as this so this is a very all-in- compassing change order for a multitude of items the chief of which there are a couple of items on here this shows a couple of the representations of the Mayhill Road alignment so Mayhill coming south I-35 is down this way Colorado Boulevard is over here and the DC TA railroad is here the alignment that was originally considered looked at multiple phases it was a southern alignment and a little bit further north and then one that came through the middle here there were decisions that led to prior to my being here there was a decision led to lining this roadway this way then we've also had some interest through conversations with council members and staff to look at some alternative routes so you see that on this map here the biggest change in the cost is the roadway was originally going to be constructed to about this driveway in this phase now as we are relocating utility lines specifically DME's electric lines there are poles and posts that were set and settled in a certain location that worked for the original alignment they also will work in the future alignment but there is some it's a difficult way to explain this we're having to move poles to make room for new poles it just becomes a convoluted mess to try to work around so one of the things that we looked at was how do we take this piece of the roadway and utilize it for a DME to do what they need to do in the temporary sense for today knowing that eventually when we do get this alignment along the bridge alignment for Mayhill Road when that phase of construction comes in we'll have to make some additional shifting to that utility work as well so we were working through existing and proposed poles by putting in this temporary access that kicked us over on Mayhill Road just a little bit sooner and we're basically delaying this piece of construction for the next phase of operations it was more of an operational decision that led to this change order the roadway still goes where it's going to go we just opted to make this a much cleaner conversion back to the asphalt roadway a little bit earlier and that's what you see in this change order. As a rundown of the change orders we've had four this would be the fourth three of those have been additive change orders they've been items that were run into in the field or they were due to delays that were incurred by franchise utility relocations that incurred us some made us think about this project and how we would deliver it in a different way so that brought some additional cost there and now we have a deduct ive change order to continue to prosecute this project as effectively and efficiently as we can. At this time staff recommends the change order for 667,847 dollars and 97 cents in the negative. Any questions for staff? Seeing none councilmember Gregory. I move approval of item J. Councilmember Ryan. I'll second. Councilmember Briggs. So I just wanted to say that originally I voted no on this item because of uncertainty of the complete project so that I will still be voting no because the uncertainty is still there for this item. Okay any other comments? Seeing none let's vote on the board please. Motion carries six to one. Moving on to agenda item four R which is considered the adoption of an ordinance of the City of Denton approving an interlocal agreement between the City of Denton and the University of North Texas for a bike share pilot program owned and administered by the University of North Texas and providing an effective date. Good evening mayor members of council my name is Mark Nelson director of transportation and bringing forward the item that was discussed earlier this afternoon in the work session. As stated in the work session this is a bike share pilot program essentially what is before you this evening is an ordinance approving an interlocal agreement with the University of North Texas who wishes to advance this bike share program and essentially requesting some variances to an existing bike share ordinance that we have. So with that quick overview I'll outline some of the goals as to how we got to where we are key elements of how that interlocal agreement was drafted. Talk a little bit about some draft policy revisions based on the work session earlier this afternoon and then direction or vote on the proposed ordinance. So I won't read through each of these individually but long or the short is the interest is from the University of North Texas to partner with you with the City of Denton to establish a bike share program to ensure that we're operating within a good neighbor program or policy cleaning up and clearing up safety issues clutters on campus for the University of North Texas as well as within the community at large. And so you know the underlying issue here is the last bullet point is meet the intent of the existing ordinance 2018-277 which was effectuated earlier this year. So with that again University of North Texas wishes to follow the existing regulations. Two primary variances associated with that would be the fact that the current ordinance is due to sunset in the September timeframe and University of North Texas wishes to extend that out through the fall and spring semester so that we could gather data that will help craft a longer term program. And then also part of the variance request would be requesting that more than 100 bikes would be allowed or be deployed. In this case the University of North Texas has indicated that they will initiate with 100 bikes to be deployed and then maybe move up into the number of 200 total bikes to be deployed current ordinance limits that in city limits to 100 bikes. So other key elements certainly have accountability of the operator and how do we do that. Again the University of North Texas is working through SPIN as their logistics arm. They're contracting with SPIN to handle the logistics, do all the rebalancing. They do intend to submit for and pay for a license and permit. They have a, in fact their rebalancing program is more robust than what we have in the current ordinance and then providing additional data so that again we can move forward with a more robust and refined policy in the future. And then again insurance and escrow is also going to be included as part of the existing interlocal agreement. So with that council as part of the work session requested a few revisions so as part of section 3B we removed the white paper exhibit. I've got a typo here it says section 9 it should be section 11. It was also removed out of that component and then section D referenced that or highlighted that previously that we had as part of that or as amended. That was in reference to the existing ordinance. And then section 3 the metrics there was a request to maybe look at how we identify the information or how we identify the users and this is the language that was placed in there added this item 6. And then there was a request for how many students are on campus and the approximate numbers is roughly 6,300 students on campus. One other question that we understood was how was or how would bikes outside of campus or those bikes that weren't specifically branded the UNT spin would they be available for general public and yes they would be available for that. Again it's essentially a nominal programming component to the device on the bicycles. So options this evening would be approve the ordinance that implements the interlocal agreement, provide staff with additional direction if this is not to your agreement and then take no action at this time. You should have at the dais at each of your places the city attorney's office place that revised interlocal agreement for your review. I'll stand for any questions if you have. >> I have a couple of questions. Councilmember Melser. >> Not a question really just a statement that I believe that some form of bike sharing is likely to be in Denton's future. I think that at this time there's more we don't know than we know and I want to express appreciation to UNT for the willingness to work closely with the city in tracking the results and sharing the information and especially in a first phase that's strictly in accordance with the previous ordinance and I believe that through that learning you will eventually be able to craft a better policy going forward. So I'll be voting yes on this. >> Councilmember Briggs. >> I just want to clarify because the citizens can use the bike which is great. Would Spence still be in charge of getting that bike wherever it is if a private citizen used it and putting it back on campus? >> That is correct. >> All right. Thank you. >> Councilmember Ryan. >> Thank you, Mayor. First off, I'm very happy that this is coming forward before us. I did have a question regarding private property if a bike -- if they're doing rebalancing every morning by 7 a.m. and someone takes that bike and goes to an apartment complex that's private property, are there going to be any issues with them going on there to pick that bike up? Or I guess on a second note, if you've only got 6,300 students out of -- what are we at, 38,000 students there total? If you've got that many, have they looked at doing agreements especially with camp or apartment complexes that have a very high student concentration to allow those bikes to be left on their property so the student doesn't get to ride the bike home but then it gets picked up before they get a chance to go to class in the morning? >> If I may, let me answer the first question and we do have Dr. Clark here who may be able to answer the second question. My understanding is that they would be allowed to retrieve their property that may have migrated onto their private property. And again, the intent of the program and the assurances in place in terms of managing that through the University of North Texas Transportation Department, their intent is to get those bikes back on campus to those pooled locations so that they can use them to provide that alternative transportation options from those high activity locations whether it's the library, parking garages or surface parking lots on the periphery of the campus. >> Mayor Watson. >> Councilmember Ryan, thank you for the opportunity to be here. I'm a little embarrassed. I wish I would have thought of that myself. We do run a series of buses that go to each of the high capacity housing areas but I think this is something we need to go look at. Can I check it out for the day or for 24 hours and then it comes back and how do we go do that and can we have it registered differently that this is not just for short term riding on the campus. So I know that we have the ability, speaking with Spinn today, to set geo offenses to establish where we can have multiple riders throughout the day that may not be UNT community. And so I think it's just a third phase we need to go look at. Can we establish a secondary geo offense associated with those apartment complexes and then what is the rebalancing. So I think this is part of the discovery phase for this summer. Let's get those hundred out there and let's find out if there is a need and work with the Student Government Association to find out is there that need to have that bike through the night and you know what I'm coming back from campus. So thank you for the question. I think this is a prime example of the partnerships and the collaboration between the University and the city that has really been a hallmark of just our partnership over the years. So this is going to be I think an opportunity as Council Member Metzler said to grab some data, analyze some data that will help us craft, you know, or continue to craft an ordinance that is workable for the city and also our partners. So thank you all so much for participating in that with us and bringing this opportunity to the city. I see no more requests to speak. Council Member Gregory. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, Dr. Clark and to the staff at UNT for your work on this. Thank you, Mark Nelson, for always figuring out how to deal with the bureaucracy and promote and move forward issues with bicycles. We appreciate I appreciate that. I move approval for the revised ordinance that was presented to us. Council Member Hutzpeth. I too appreciate the collaborative atmosphere. It's really helpful. I really look forward to the data. It's going to be it'll help the city. It'll help other vendors. You know, we mentioned TWU earlier. So I really think this data is going to be really open a lot of doors. So I'm grateful. And so I'll second. All right. We have a motion and a second for agenda item 4R. Let's vote on the board, please. Motion carries 7-0. Thank you very much. Thank you all. Next item is items for individual consideration, which is agenda item 5. We have one agenda item 5A. We do have a card wishing to speak on that. So do we have a staff presentation on that? DENCO 911. Mayor and Council Tony Pueynton, Director of Finance. I don't have a presentation. I just wanted to let the let the council know that we did receive one nomination from the council for consideration to the slate of candidates. In August, DENCO 911 will send back to the council what the all the candidates submissions from all the 33 participating cities and the council will then vote on one of those candidates. And the candidate gets the most votes as the candidate that will serve a two year term on the DENCO 911 board. Okay. Councilman Gregory, do you have a question for staff? Former mayor of Denton, Jack Miller has been serving as the chairman of DENCO 911. Is his term up or is it? The the the actual member that's whose term is up is Jim Carter. He is the the current city representative, one of two. He this he has served two terms. He is eligible to serve another two years term. But again, he was not submitted as a nominee. We just had one. And who was that? So do you know what the status of the mayor, former mayor Miller is? My understanding is that he's still on on the board. Thank you. Councilmember Briggs. And then the nominee is the application that we had in our backup. Yes, you have your her bio and her short resume. Yes. Thank you. All right, we have a speaker. Mr. Willey-Huspits, come down and state your name and address. Your time will begin. Mayor and council. My name is Willey-Huspits. I live at 623 Newton. One of the things that I would like for two things, if we make if you make the public aware of who these who does nominate the nominee is, that would be good so we can then think and maybe make our suggestions or comment on that if if allowed. Secondly, one of the things with the 911 operators that I would like to see taking place are would like to have added to what they do. First you call 911 and they immediately want to know what's your name? What's the problem? And then a series of other questions before you can get out what it is you're calling for. And once they get that information sometimes, well, especially with me, then you'd see that there's no need to ask those other questions. So I would think you say this is my suggestion. 911 operator operator, can I help you? And then give them a second to tell you what it is that they want. Because one time mine was just my horses got out and I wanted to know what to do. And they went through this series. What's the emergency? What's the location? The horses are in a place where there's no way for you to know what the street is and where it is. I have to start describing it. There's a tree at the far end, it's 50 feet, it's to the right. Just ask what is your problem first? Not all the other questions. Where you live and all of that. Thirdly, I need to find out how to make a request for items that are pulled from the consent agenda. I didn't get the comment on the street. I wanted to talk about that too. And had some questions that I wanted to ask. Didn't get to talk about mail because you didn't have it on there so that I didn't get to sign up for a comment about that. Secondly, the bike sharing. Let me think about this. If you take the bikes home and you are allowed to leave it there, where are you going to put it? I think you're creating a problem where those bikes will be , there will be some that's not planning to use them anymore and there they are on the ground, laying there all day. They could use them but they decide not to. That needs to be considered. I think that we have too many consent agenda items. There's ways that you're talking about something somewhere and I've got to figure out where you're talking about that. Because I go to the work sessions, you don't talk about them there, they're just on the sheet that you're going to vote on them. But some of you, you've read this whatever you read and I 'll find out what that is so I can do better with that situation. You pull them. But when they're pulled, I think that we shouldn't have a consent agenda but we'd be all night if we didn't do that. Council Member Briggs. My name is Linda R. Hatman, H-A-P-E-M-A-N and she is a local Denton resident. Okay, thank you. Any other questions? Council Member Meltzer. Yes, I entered Ms. Hatman's name into nomination. She eats, breathes and sleeps emergency preparedness. Linda Hatman for 11 years has been the DCTA safety training manager. She's a responsible, seasoned and articulate professional who trains DCTA employees in emergency preparedness including how to properly interact with 911. So she's sort of a professional customer of 911 you might say. She's responsible enough to serve as the liaison to the FBI Joint Task Force on Terrorism for DCTA. She's highly qualified and I'm happy to move that we put her name forward in nomination. Council Member Briggs. I will second that. All right, we have a motion and a second for agenda item 5A . Let's vote on the board please. Motion carries, 7-0. It's my understanding, our next agenda items are public hearings but we only have one and it's my understanding that that has been withdrawn. Is that correct? All right. So we do not have any items under public hearings for agenda items 6. So we'll move on to agenda item 7 which are concluding items. Council Member Briggs. Okay, so our reuse store, it's a really great asset and I would like to find more ways to advertise it. And I know we also resell paint and I don't think a lot of people realize that and it's much better than throwing it in the landfill. I've heard that other cities have like a giant paint mixer so that the paint can go further and they can remix colors. And I'm not sure if we have one and if we don't, can we look to get one possibly for our reuse store out there. A couple of years ago we received a staff report on a sidewalk ordinance and I have not been able to find that and I'm wondering if we could get that back out. It was about having tables and chairs out in the right of way and it was some sort of ordinance that we either passed or did not. Also during our joint DASD discussion the idea was mentioned for maybe a discount for the Denton ISD teachers and their families at the water park. I would like to see if maybe we could do a pilot program one week this summer to see how that turns out and about maybe implementing something like that next summer if it is successful. And earlier I heard something about a Monarch Watch City and I'm wondering what that is and what do we need to do to be one. And last thing I'd like to know who is in charge of the back to school event in an informal staff report. What changes were made and why and that's it. Councilmember Hussbett. Thank you. Just one thing. I was thinking today I'm wondering if staff can carve out the proclamations when they post the videos. I think those groups may want those or be able to utilize those and so I'm not sure if there's a way to do that but kind of break those out as separate videos so then they could go grab that video segment or re-record it or download it for them to utilize their social medias or whatever that is and that probably could be good branding for the city. Thank you. Councilmember Duff. Yeah, I think we've gone through kind of a long election and I was talking with one of the people, one of the judges and you know I wonder if it would be possible for us to combine the primary with the Denton City election and have them at the same time. It'd probably be two ballots but have them at the same time . I think that would save a certain amount of money also. I mean we go through a primary and then we have a primary runoff and then we have a Denton runoff and people are just getting fatigue. Another problem with that is with mail-in ballots. People mail that in and they've got all the information on the outside and they put the ballot in there. Well because they want to be secrecy they take it out of there and the ballot goes over here and all of a sudden it is in the wrong election. So there were a number of them that were actually, they weren't counted because they don't know who they belong to. I want to be careful that we don't get into deliberations. It is concluding so you've asked for research. I'd like to see us take a look at that and see if we can. I have one, I've said it last time, I'll say it again. I want to thank Nicole Lopez who is an animal control officer here with City of Denton for putting on the fashion show at the adoption center. I don't know if you're able to see some of the pictures and photographs on YouTube and the website but to see the fashion show with the animals was quite remarkable. So she did a stellar job and I just want to give a shout out to her and all those involved with that organization to try to, number one, allow some students from the universities to show their talent and also provide an avenue so that animals can find adoptive families. So I really want to give a shout out to them. Councilmember Briggs. I was there and it was a lovely, lovely event and I'm wondering if you saw the wonderful picture of the lady in the beautiful gown with the dog poop ing. Did you see it? I did. Yeah, it was great. Yes, I did. It's reality. It is. Reality TV. All right, seeing no more requests to speak, we will now adjourn the meeting at 743. Thank you.