Jun 03, 2014 City Council on 2014-06-03 2:00 PM

See if there's any cards to speak on consent agenda items, and I believe we have All right, so we'll move on to our Regular agenda session we'll go to request for clarification of agenda items listed on the June 3rd 2014 agenda any clarifications Yes, I more just had a comment on P on the bike share program And it was just a thought maybe we're already doing this but when we do go to service those bikes I was hoping that we just use a local bike shop to try to encourage local business in town so not really a question but Mayor if I could I'm glad you brought that up. Mr. Hawkins because unrelated to your specific comment, but That item is on your agenda and for consideration but in reality the Denton County Transportation Authority has stepped forward and is actually making that grant application I don't think there's any problem with the council adopting this resolution Although it may not be used in exactly the way it was intended, but we've got an opportunity for Incredibly good intergovernmental cooperation effort. They have an intense interest in moving that forward And I think it will enhance our abilities to get that program started So while I'd suggest that you go ahead and approve that item on the consent agenda, but we may not in fact need it Make the grant application because the DCPA has moved ahead with that and we appreciate that Thank you. That'll okay good. Yes, that's my road. Thank you mayor And as far as I understand maybe mr. Nelson can help with this I think these bike share programs involve a company that sets up the stations and the bikes and part of their role is maintenance of Those things because they're a different type of bike they lock into these types of things that maybe you can speak to that a bit I address this question. That's correct. Thank you. Health member as Mr. Oden was indicating they Just depends on how you set that maintenance program up. So If and when we get the ground and remove that forward That would certainly be a high priority is to work with one of the local bike entities or Bike bike shops here to assist with that again We're reaching out with our partners over at University of North Texas and TW. So this is truly a Collaborative effort to move this project along but yes in terms of rebalancing maintenance on the vehicle on the bikes local All right. Yes, that's my ring over. Thank you mayor. Yeah, well we're on that so that explains why the Deadline for the submission of that was made the 30th or whatever and it seemed to me we were kind of behind the Had the cart here behind the horse, but we're just going to go ahead and submit this to them Let me Application which should have already gone forward application was submitted on Friday through through DCTA and City didn't as a co-applicant Good Any others? Yes, thank you mayor on Consent agenda item. Oh, I would ask that we pull that or individual consideration so that I can recuse myself since My I have family members in In my immediate family they're involved in that organization All right Any others? I've got one just clerical just to alert the my colleagues on Agenda item in the open action item. I think it's 6a We just have a sort of a Scrivener's indiscrepancy with the amount of acreage which legal has already been made aware of so I believe they're going to get us the Corrected from our it'll be correct on the ordinance in the caption is the one that Yes, sir Wanted out that there is a Posting issue we've posted that is two point nine one two acres and in the body of the ordinance itself in section one There's been an inversion of the digits and it's posted as two point one Two point one nine two so consistent with the property description which is also attached to the new give it to the ordinance The proper amount of acreage is two point nine one two so please Act on that with that little correction there And just as sort of a housekeeping matter before we get on to the work session items I would like to start the council meetings in the public on time at 630 So if we have works that we're going to try to put the work the closed sessions that have action items in them At the beginning and then if we hit that close to that 630 time deadline Then we're going to circle back around after the open session and reconvene back in the closed session I just think it's important to to get us out there on time for the public Any questions or comments about that great all right we'll move on to work session reports then 3a Receive hold of discussion give staff direction regarding the creation of a tax increment investment zone for the construction of Hotel and Convention Center Thank you mayor when I asked our director of economic development Amy visit if she would present this item for your consideration this afternoon Thank you, Amy Thank you mayor and City Council members I'm gonna frame this issue for you briefly And then I'm going to introduce our consultant who has put together the project plan and financing plan for the proposed Hotel and Convention Center Ters Get the PowerPoint to open will be doing good Just said to back up a little bit and and frame this project for you This is you're considering today the creation of a tax increment reinvestment zone That will help facilitate the financing of the proposed Hotel and Convention Center project on December 10th 2013 the City Council adopted or approved the master development agreement and At that time it triggered a feasibility period as you're all aware During the feasibility period the design Development architectural drawings were created and you all have reviewed those and approved them We have now solicited construction bids those are due on June 17th so about two weeks from now The an important component of the feasibility period is the creation of the tax increment reinvestment zone What this does what the turge does is it allows other tax ing entities to participate in? the financing mechanism for the construction of the Convention Center only and It is necessary to know that the turge is created and that We know what what if any the participation would be from the ISD in the county? Before all entities involved can make a final determination on the feasibility and the financing of the project So this is one step in that feasibility period It's a prerequisite for making a final determination if the project is not deemed feasible by all entities The City Council will have the opportunity at a future date to dissolve the turge And I just want to make you all aware that that creating the turge at this time would not Make the project final or and go forward in any way it is just a feasibility Mechanisms that is a necessary step to determine whether or not the project can go forward The the timeline from here will be today. You'll hear a work session with our consultant who has prepared a preliminary project plan and finance plan for the turge and then will bring forward for your consideration on June 17th a public hearing and Ordinance creating the turge with that. I'm going to introduce David Pettit Who is the consultant who has put together our project plan and finance plan? Thank you, thank you for having me this afternoon. It's good to be back home. I am from Denton Graduate from Denton high school and also have a master's in public administration from the University of North, Texas One of the council members pointed out in my previous presentation to the economic development partnership that I Used the term TIF and turge interchangeably tax increment financing is a concept tax increment reinvestment zones are Specifically found in the statute that creates a tip tax increment reinvestment zone chapter 311 of the tax cut So we've put together a presentation a little bit of an overview of this document here, which is the first step necessary in putting together a Project in financing plan and also a tax increment reinvest ment zone To forward Amy Oh Perfect thank you the purpose of the city of Denton turge number three is the The proposed city of Denton turge number three is approximately 13 acres. You are very familiar with the area I mentioned in the previous. This is where we actually had my high school prom at the Radisson years ago about 25 years ago Located at the intersection of interstate 35 and North Texas Boulevard The purpose of the turge is to facilitate the development of a full-service hotel and convention center I Like to do this with my clients and explain kind of the process as we go through in establishing a tax increment reinvestment zone And we're working with TIF notice. I'm interchanging that but on a turge the creation ordinance There's two ordinances one is the boundary we establish the boundary of the turge Two is the term we also Establish the city participation if the city is bringing the turge forward and we also look at the turge board makeup The turge board can be between five people and 15 people and we also prepare a preliminary project and financing plan Which is what this is here. It is preliminary through a separate action Once the TIF is created the preliminary project and financing plan is separately considered by the turge board by resolution and By the City Council through a separate order The proposed site the the land to be developed is currently vacant undeveloped land owned by the University of North Texas So I think that's an important thing right now is because you're currently getting zero taxes from this property So anything that you do is going to be a net gain to the city and to the other taxing jurisdiction the The uses there are a number of different sales or a number of different taxes that are going to be generated off of this including real property personal property sales tax and hotel occupancy for the purposes of the TIF we are just talking about Real property and so we have 318 hotel rooms a restaurant of 2400 square feet 7485 there will be food and beverage throughout the hotel and then the convention space we anticipate would be tax exempt because City won't We conducted a taxable value analysis and we examined comparable taxable values taxing jurisdiction participation rates just kind of some placeholders the turs term and anticipated revenues to the turfs Now I do want to go back that The comparable taxable values probably the most important thing that we do in our analysis There's three ways to appraise property one is on income approach Two is on a cost approach and three is on a comparable approach for taxable value purposes the comparable approach By far gives you a better number Because we are taxing jurisdictions that to be fair and equitable across taxable properties We go through an exhaustive list and look at properties and then we say Look at that property. Okay, unfortunately in the city or Denton County the most expensive property Hotel property is the Marriott at Champion Circle at 58,000 What we did was we expanded that we found two hotels that looked Pretty similar one would be the Hilton South like the other one it came in at a hundred and fourteen thousand dollars a room and then we also looked at the Embassy suites at in grapevine which came in at eighty nine thousand. However, it was built in 1998 So we felt very comfortable as we move forward with our Taxable value analysis that we had a hundred thousand dollar per room taxable value Now understanding that this will be used for educational purposes we do assume a 15% educational space credit So take a hundred thousand dollars at 15% discount. We come up with a taxable value of 27 million dollars We then looked at financial analysis as far as participation from each of the taxing jurisdictions We looked at the city of Denton contributing a hundred percent of its real property tax revenue Potentially Denton County looking at 75% of the real property tax revenue and then also Denton ISD contributing its INS at 75% Similar to the county but not their M&O because that would be a negative impact to their budget For every dollar they make above a certain amount. They have to give that money back because they are Robin Hood District but the INS is new money to the district So they would be retaining 25% of 25 cents of every dollar that's generated while contributing 75% So if we look at the overall tax rate We have two dollars and fifty cents With our participation. We're right at about half that At a dollar twenty seven. So that is really our inputs before we conduct our analysis this is The final thing that I wanted to kind of set up was the T ERS term We anticipate that the TERS term will be I Recommended 30 years because the anticipated note is looked at being 25 years for the certificates of obligation However, the first five years of a TIF nothing really occurs because you start the TIF today You know best case you're gonna come back and you're gonna have that hotel coming online as you can see here We have coming online the first year in 2017 but that's only a 50% and then it ramps up over several years. So What we've tried to do is allow for a 30 year to to capture The entire Full period of full revenue producing years for the hotel So over a 30 year period And as I mentioned before no revenue until at least 2017 Then only partial until stabilized So the total revenue from real and personal property generated during that 30 years is 27 million dollars The TERS number three anticipated gross revenue is 13.6 Just looking at the real property So you can see this is kind of a breakdown of the overall aggregate The amount of potential TERS and then the amount of net benefit to each of the taxing jurisdictions Dr. Wilson was in our previous Economic Development Partnership and he wanted to point out that the green that you see there would be going to the state with this My argument back to him is well if they ever do change the state allocation wouldn't you much rather generate it locally and have to go through Austin and I don't think he disagrees with that But he did want to point out that that's why they would only look at the INS Not the M&O portion of this. I Have a real quick question. Yes, sir on the on your big chart here when you talk about the appraised value You said it's gonna take a few years to ramp up to the I think you said 27 million Help me understand help me understand that I mean once the hotel is finished if we're doing it based on just comparable properties not based on income approach Correct or market value. Why is it taking a couple years for it to ramp up to 27 million? There's a couple of different factors one is the appraisal district They'll tell you that they look at construction draws and they look at everything else Essentially they will have a dollar amount that they've set their minds through a comparable and during that time period on January 1st of each year When they do those appraisals They'll say that's 30% complete. That's 50% complete or that's 75% complete and Understanding the tax appraisal process you don't receive that revenue until a full 16 months later So you go through your your your notices in May you'll go through your certified role Do I 28 Then you actually send out those invoices and then that money's due January 31st So any new product that's coming online is gonna have to have a stabilization period and so that's why we include a number of different Years so in 2017 if it opens its doors We're gonna have 50% that came in from 2016 then we take it up to 75% then we do a hundred percent So I've done this for about 20 years And it seems to be pretty accurate if you allow that ph asing if you try to do too much too early Your numbers never come in to where you anticipate that it 'd be coming in Okay, and then maybe I've asked the wrong question for the purposes of the the calculation and the the computing the T ERS But the appraisal district are you saying that the apprais al district in 2017 will only show as a taxable value? 50% of okay. All right. Yes. Okay, and and that's due to the lag. Yes. Okay, that's due to the lack All right. Thank you. Sorry. It could have been no no no no no. Thank you So we have 13 million dollars being contributed as far as project costs We have to put the project cost in the preliminary project in financing plan I do like to put the caveat little asterisk there that the 13.6 million dollars is the estimated TERS revenue that would be contributed towards the convention center debt Basically applied as a project cost per chapter 311 of the Texas cap tax code Now my caveat is is that the TERS revenue represents current assumptions of project build out in taxing jurisdiction participation So if there's less development, it's less than 318 rooms Or the other taxing jurisdiction participation is less than that TERS revenue will be less So that's why we call it a preliminary So as far as our next steps We anticipate bringing this back to you answering your questions today, but in a public hearing City Council on June 17th creation of that adoption of that creation ordinance Also through a separate resolution Looking at the board appointment Once the board has been approved bringing the project and financing plan this preliminary to the TERS board for approval into a final project in financing plan And then bringing that to city back to City Council for final adoption So at that point you have a created tip and a final project in financing plan That gives us the document to attach to the participation agreements with the ISD and also with the county And then I mentioned this previously I only anticipate the tip board having to meet once I just did this in Irving where they floated CEOs and the tip was being pledged We just need one time to meet one time and pledge a hundred percent of that revenue to the city and you'll never meet again So some council members like that That concludes my presentation I'm happy to answer any questions any questions. Yes Thank you. I'm playing a little bit of catch-up. So forgive me if I'm When in your valuation analysis you stated the two Comparables because there wasn't one in Denton County that was really considered to be comparable as the South Lake H ilton and the great vine embassy suites correcting My question is given the demographic differences and the likely revenue per room differences How confident are you that the hotel owner wouldn't or couldn't argue successfully for a lower valuation? I guess because my question is if the valuation is less? Turfs revenue is less There's something to be made up there And I'd let mr. Fortune kind of explain because I think that you would be made whole on your payments that would be going to your CEO However, you know the properties have to be fair and equitable across taxing jurisdictions So I've always had proper developers when they're looking they're getting a hundred percent of something. They'll say I want a higher value Well, they can't be higher than everybody else because you have to be fair and equitable Because there could be a lot of litigation so essentially, but that's why we like the comparables So if this hotel is built and performs to what we think it will perform at it's going to be at a comparable level That's the best that we can do we can get into some income approaches My answer your question is simply that dollar amount would be less because right now we're projecting over a 30-year period But I think with the information that we have that's the best Comparable data that we have there are some hotels like the the Gaylord and also The Great Wolf Lodge they're close to 190, but they have a lot of wasted space That's you know kind of hard to calculate it. You know is the taxable is it not? So I felt that those two hotels were probably the best you know the highest hotel that you have In Denton County is that Marriott? And I think this is going to be a higher level because it's going to have a hundred thousand square feet attached to it And it has the connotation of a convention headquarters hotel if you look at the Omni in downtown for worth It's about 160 thousand a door So I feel really good that we're being in a conservative, and we're even taking the 15% deduction on that for the education right? Thank you Yes, no road. Thank you, Mary on that last point 15% educational Discount is that set I've heard different percentages along the way as we've discussed this and If not when does that get set is that a year-by-year? Thing or is that gets set at some point, and that's what it 's going to be for 30 years It's not to set and 15% is an estimate at this time. It's based on the square footage that the Hotel has allocated for the purpose of Educational the educational aspect and so that is really an unknown to us until the praise of district evaluates that and they make a decision But for the purpose of conservatively planning and estim ating we've assumed that what we believe to be the maximum number And that is about 15% based on the amount of space that would be primarily There's a if you recall when we showed you the plans there was some classroom facilities associate located in the Hotel itself as well as the first floor of the hotel was was really seen as being a training ground between the back the house areas and some of the Check-in areas for where you would see students actively involved in the operations So the square footage thing will be set at some point in terms of how much is being devoted to educational purposes it's then up to The appraisers to determine kind of how that formula works Yeah And I would imagine that on an annual basis there will need to be some documentation showing a level of activity of for educational purposes that I have to demonstrate the president's in order to receive that exemption, but I don't my understanding is that it's not Set at 15% year one and it's that way every year. It's something that will have to be Determined I guess my I Wouldn't call it a concern necessarily But I mean we're in this feasibility period where we're trying to figure out if the numbers work And I would imagine at least from the O'Reilly point of view That number is somewhat important to kind of their bottom line and how they project that So I guess if it's that ambiguous How do we at the end of the day determine whether or not this is the product that I think everybody feels good about it based on The research that they've done and in the fact that other state institutions have been able to partner with a private hotel and You know for educational purposes and that private hotel actually Received a an exemption. I think there's a precedent that that they believe is is founded and From the standpoint of the actual value of the hotel I mean this pet has talked about one methodology when we were showing you the pro forma last year We used a different methodology, and we're very close in that in that that value I think it's always been an understood concept through Negotiating the master development agreement that none of us can predict with certainty what that value is and so we could be off 10 or 15 percent either way into Councilmember Johnson's point if the value were to be less the way we structured our deal is that the rent would be more and so There's a safety mechanism that we've tried to establish in the development agreement to keep the city whole But I hope that answers your question Yes Thank you mayor uh John if I if I could I Thought the 15% and I thought we had that in there somewhere that was the cap I mean that was the max that that's the max that we've agreed to That we believe is is is available, and that's the max that we have in the master development agreement alright That's that it is in there. Yes, okay. Yes, all right I'm gonna talk to my maybe could go higher. I don't believe it can go higher Okay, I think that's what I thought we had that stated some place all right. Thank you I've one other question. Yes, thank you mayor Just quick question does the creation of a of a terse Limit the future use of the property within the zone in any way No Because it's really about where the revenue goes because everybody pays the same amount of taxes It's just that the taxing jurisdictions have decided to set this money up into an account to pay for improvements I have seen an attorney general's opinion that we dealt with great vine mills mall that once a Terse is dissolved you still have to spend that money in that Terse So once you pay off those bonds it's best to terminate that bond Terminate the turks sure at that time, but no there's no really Restrictions I couldn't see one versus the other that there would be a difference because it was a turks okay I've got a couple questions for you John on this Just to sort of frame this in a way that I can understand it The city's already committed that they'll whether there's a turks or not all the proper real property taxes will be committed to our debt service That's correct, so the turks is primarily here to help augment supplement Reduce if you will the quote-unquote rent payments that I mean it when I read the developers agreement And it talked about the creation of the turks The O'Reilly management OHM or OMA In is the right house power management OHP DS over I hotel part whoever it's the person to sign that development agreement has the right Based upon the level of participation as expressed by the school district in the county That if it's not acceptable to them they can terminate the agreement Which it's sort of a weird kind of thing because the the the higher the value which creates more of a turks Revenue which helps them pay less rent But it also increases their school taxes I mean because they have to pay the the O&M of the school right is that correct that's great. They have to pay that So do we have an idea? First of all if what what they're anticipating as a level that would Allow them to think that okay. This is what we need do we know what that is I think they're expecting or hoping for at least a 75% level participation from the school district in the county We we have tried to show them and illustrate to them in the city's pro forma not in the financing sure that was provided to you today a conservative 50% contribution and The reason for creating the turks the city wouldn't have to have the turks in order to allocate and dedicate our tax rate to this But their mechanism to capture the school district participation and the county participation Required that the turks we just didn't believe that the there would be very easy asked at the school districts in the county to participate in A turks that we weren't involved in ourselves, and so that 's why we we approached it this way sure but but but you're you're right if the if the level of participation is Is sufficient then the O'Reilly? Fatality or hotel partners can make a determination that they can move forward based on that Sure, great this page, and this is water that's gone way under the bridge I think for the thing that I've as I as I read the developers agreement the master agreement and as I thought about this concept I Hope in the future that when we have an issue like this that is contractually a Cause for termination and what I would consider a deal-k iller I mean if they don't like what we do here what the what's not what we do if we don't like what the school District does or the county does as far as a level participation They can either pull the plug or use that as leverage to you know come forward with some other asks And it's a situation like that. I'm not quite sure why this is done at the tail end, and I don't need an explanation I'm just saying that I would think that if something that were this important would be something that we would do closer to the front end Instead of literally based upon this timeline. This is the last thing from what I'm understanding That will be completed before so we can all make a determination of feasibility This is one of many steps councilman mayor was that that we have in in Listed in the master development agreement that are part of a feasibility period right One is is creation of the turd one is getting the design development drawings completed one is getting construction bids back Approving a guarantee max price contract with the contracting firm We'll have to go through a bonding process to issue notice of intent to sell bonds The hotel owner will have to demonstrate that they've achieved the franchise commitment They will have to demonstrate that they have obtained their financing in a manner that's satisfactory to the city Only then will we issue bonds and move forward so there's there's many 10 possibilities of where people can reevaluate that We took a stepped approach we tried to create as much protection for all the parties in this so that we can take a step evaluate in the Circumstance of the environment and take another step, but all those steps preclude us issuing bonds and Making the project really at that point would consider it being a go and have we had some preliminary discussions with the other taxing entities about what their level of expectation may be as far as the Level of participation or is it just they don't know if it 's gonna be from zero to a hundred or do they have some idea ? And if so is this we haven't had any formal discussions with anybody And I don't have a good feel for us whether or not they would be willing to participate for 30 years at 75% I suspect that they might want to come back at a different percentage or at a different number of years Or just a flat amount use a percentage will contribute up to 2 million I'm not sure what they would do at this point. We are scheduled on June 24th to make a presentation to the school board I've reached out to the county I have yet to receive Feedback from them yet as to when they might like us to come and talk to them more surely about I guess they know what? We're asking for now well, and I have had several informal conversations with people As the project has progressed, but we just didn't have a chance before today, right? Yes Thank you, so what you're saying in terms of this the feas ibility study period And that's part of what this is is to determine for the developer determine whether it's really feasible for them to finance this But there are a lot of other triggers that could Mean that this does not happen so if for example the construction costs come in and the cost for the convention center is much higher per square footage than what we had anticipated and because of the amount of money that we are limiting to to even discuss doing if it if it shrunk the convention center to Too small of a footprint that might be enough of a trigger that that we as the council could say we're out. That's correct Yes, thank you mayor and I think these are all important points because the last thing we want to do as we start getting into These formal discussions with that nice the in particular is that this is all on them That if they don't approve this and the whole thing's going away, and it's all their fault. That's not the pressure I think we just need to say that publicly That that we want to be putting on these partners of ours in the community the question is do they want a partner on a project that is Unofficial to them in the long run because at the end of the day This is UNT property if this project falls through it will remain UNT property not Potentially developable property with other tax values that can be added to it that they will benefit from but that it 's a true partnership At the end so I think these are important things to communicate as we move forward with this process. Yes and it's my understanding on the school finance portion the the the O&M and and Quite frankly I'd like to press them to give some some education on when we have our next joint meeting That there's a certain price per student so in other words the revenue they're getting off of this That I mean they're bringing in is additional revenue But yet it may be that the state doesn't have to contribute as much in other words. It's not necessarily an increase It's just sort of where does the money come from does it come from at the law and taxes or does it come from the state? so in some sense I Mean, it's not a break even per se but if you get a finite set of money given some I think that was a point Mr.. Pettit was trying to make earlier, and that is on that green portion of the pie chart This this portion right here The the state funding allocation provides so much money for students more money that we receive locally From this local tax base means there's less money coming from the state in order to maintain that funding for student forms Okay, and and and we believe that certainly it's better to generate that money locally because there's a lot of benefit to the local economy When that is that value locally as opposed to coming from the state so I think the school district sees that as positive as well Although for them it may be revenue neutral on their own inside Okay, good You mentioned the the dollar amount because I have a lot of councils that asked me this Dr.. Wilson was just saying there's a lot of different ways that you can calculate it But eight thousand dollars per student is the amount the state allows you so any dollar you make less than that they make up the difference Any dollar you generate over that you have to give back to the state so that's kind of the benchmark that we count But on the O&M You know they're maxed out at their O&M at 50 cent or the 49 cents of their 50 cents and they get to keep 100% All right Any other questions yes that's member I The the difference of the 30 year versus 25 year in that last five years because the master agreement talks about being paid off By year 25 that last five years. What can that revenue be used for is it? Can be used for the capital reinvestment account can it be used for what? We did not collect in those first two years that they that they are not paying if there's any money In the turrs at the conclusion of the debt it has to be used for the project, so it probably go to The asset replacement reserve fund that was established for the convention center All right, yes, yes, just a final question maybe for John Assuming we get through this turrs, and we get the participation everyone is kind of looking for When do we anticipate the end of this feasibility period to be at this point yeah, that's yes Late summer is what I'm anticipating and there's a lot of variables to that So I'm a little cautious even saying that first of all remember. There's no set specified date in the master development agreement that says September 1 is the end of the feasibility period these are sequential events where there's 30 days from this this Occurrent 30 days from getting construction bids for something to happen and 20 days from this so collectively we believe that this is probably a August to September time frame is what I'm anticipating But there will be actions that we may be coming to the council and asking you to do to take some steps Prior to them though we would for example be talking about perhaps a parameters ordinance for the issuance of bonds Prior to that feasibility period we won't have to issue the bonds But there's a lot of things that have to occur in order to go through the process to sell bonds to be ready by the end of that feasibility period and So there are a lot of things that will be coming back to you probably just about every council meeting between now and in Mid to late August with some kind of item in regard to the Commission Center project But that is at least the plan right now. We get the construction bids back toward the end of June Or excuse me mid-june and the councilman McGregory's point if the bids were to come back outside of a window that the city and or the developer believe is doable There may be another iteration of working with That bid process to be able to to make the project more manageable If that were the case then that time frame may be pushed back just a few months One final question on that so there will come a point when all these elements are satisfied or you know, they've been worked through and They'll come a meeting where we have to is there there's a point where the city can or each jurisdiction that the developer I Guess you and T. I don't know how they do it But with the city they'll come up time when we have a meeting that says we are or are not moving forward In other words, we're not it's not just a series of five sort of steps and then all of a sudden well because we proved All these it's done. They'll come a point. Okay, we got all this information now We get to decide do we move forward or not in my mind the council in December made? Approved the steps that work following right now through the master development agreement that requires this to go through the process of creating the turds We'll start the bond issuance process here very shortly. We started the design process and All those things will come to you piecemeal over the next few months But to your point the day that we come to you and say we're going to pull the trigger and issue The bonds actually sell the bonds that is when the project becomes the final yes Okay, so what you're saying is that each of these little steps is approval of the entire project So if you get down to the financing of the bonds it would sort of that's is the intention of saying Do y'all still want to move forward or are you saying the message is if we've proved all these things up to that point Then it's sort of by acquiescence well in order to be ready to go with construction and get the design Completed we have to have the funding and so there is if you recall we're doing 35 percent design development drawings That are on the streets right now. We'll get those bids back for the construction and guaranteed max price contract We'll come to the council Negotiated contract with the contractor assuming the prices match our expectations The council would approve that contract that will be contingent on the city selling bonds We won't be committed to that project unless we actually sell the bonds at a future point in time We'll ask you to do a notice of intent to sell probably in mid-july We won't be issuing the bonds We're just doing the notices that are required to get us to the point where we can't issue the bonds We'll come back and we'll do it a parameters ordinance It says you're authorizing us to sell the bonds at a point in time When the interest rates just like we do right now for refundings and other things And the council has approved the final design of the project and we can sell the bonds at that point but we've got to be able to do that to get to the final design Do you understand sort of the thrust of my question and that is? And maybe some of the council members who I mean I'm new to this process So it almost as if like well if you say yes to each one then at the end if you go You know, I don't really think this is a good idea from my own perspective There's really nowhere that you can unless you just say no, I'm not going to vote to approve them. So yes Well sort of my response my understanding and incorrect me If I'm technically wrong on this is that we have a lot of checkpoints to make between now and issuing the bonds and there are several points at which we might say I'm uncomfortable as a as a council ensures four votes on the council that says I don't approve of this That might stop the process from moving forward So I don't know that there's any one point but I think there are several points at which if there's is that if there's information that comes and the one that I keep thinking about is is those kind if the construction bids come back and you know because our Developer has talked about the the hotel may have X number of rooms or it might be smaller based on the the the bid the construction bid and if and if the construction bid meant that that the Convention Center was too small that might be a point where we just pulled the plug on it and said no so I think that there are several that there there are a lot of opportunities for us to to Rethink if there's something during this feasibility period that that makes us feel too uncomfortable about going forward I would think if we'd said yes all the way through and it's time to sell the bonds it would be Yes, that's what I'm hoping that's what we would have done a disservice to the staff and to the community by going far . Yep Yes, it seems like when we got into our vote in December that that was more of kind of the do we want to head in This direction assuming certain metrics are met During the feasibility and so we're looking at almost purely financing questions They either come in and that's gonna be on both sides could be O'Reilly comes back and says I can't we can't make the numbers work But it might be helpful to kind of review for us Maybe not here, but even in a back of just so we're all clear and what that kind of matrix is by which we're making this second Go-ahead decision because we already made the original one saying let's move forward with this project assuming these things checked off So you might it might be helpful for Remind those of us who are here and those of us who are new kind of what those metric points are that we're looking for and you've Listed some of those off before but that might help us here . Yeah, it's something just absolutely and the time you bet Yes, sir Thank You mayor Yes, I Think we need to be careful about what we say here that we haven't made decision and I will point to a different item on the agenda today, which is on work session number three, which is the changes in the strategic plan Objective three point two point three reads utilize the Convention Center to market Denton as a destination city I think we got the cart ahead of the horse here if we're looking at creating approving a strategic plan which addresses the Convention Center before we in fact have it so And and I think this is just a result of all these pieces moving at one time But I think we better be careful about And therefore I think this is important for you're asking for that we continue to keep all the pieces in the right order And know what the order is Thank you any other questions Seeing none. All right. Thank you gentlemen. Appreciate it. Thank you very much Moving on to work session 3b Receive report hold discussion give staff direction regarding Denton plan and didn't development code amendments to allow for various land uses at North Texas State Fairgrounds Thank You mayor. I'm gonna ask mr. Ron man Gita who is our development review coordinator Administrator to present this item for your consideration. Thank you Ron Thank you Mr. Mayor members of the council members of staff brought for you today is a presentation to get your direction on a Request that we receive from the North Texas State Fairgrounds and I'll get into their requests in a little bit, but wanted to Provide you real quick a description of their the purpose of this presentation We will present a background information on what we're looking at and also all the requirements That's going to be necessary in order for their requests to be met And those are development code of the included development code amendment potential comprehensive plan amendment zoning change request and One or two specific use permit requests as well So the request from the North Texas State Fairground is to use their property to store vehicles for a long period of time and these vehicles as We've seen I'll show some photos of what they've done recently and a couple years ago is to have these vehicles there and for the purpose of generating revenue for the state fair grounds unfortunately the Use which is storage of vehicle is not a permitted use by itself as a primary Use so that's what staff has been charged to look into and we've got an option prepared And I'll go through that option and what they need to do again Certain requirements that they have to to meet before they can do so So way of background we have the The need or the request to have vehicle storage at the fair ground facility they back in 2011 were using the site for storage vehicles and at that time code enforcement was involved and Again recently in March of this year. They were using the fairgrounds for the storage of vehicles The vehicles are actually from a dealership the classic car used car dealership Where they are currently constructing their dealership off of I-35 and Parker's page However, because they're not at that point where they can move their vehicles at that location They needed to move vehicles and they chose to move it here for the time being this was back in I believe the first Event started early in the year I'm not sure if it was February January But we were noticed by the residents of the neighborhood just directly north of the fairgrounds That there were vehicles stored and some of them were being stored up to the property line of the fairgrounds to the north Obviously that generated some Complaints we were then brought in in our community improvement services acted on that Since then we've been meeting with the fairgrounds representative and they would like to Find a way in which they can store vehicles there On a more permanent basis where they would be allowed and not temporary Just on that point I didn't it wasn't clear from the backup So there was a reason on this latest kind of train of cars that was parked there because they're waiting on a shop to open Up or a space that they're expanding over a 535 what? What would be the need in it long term of this assuming that car dealership gets to where it needs to go? Who else would they be servicing if they do this on a more? It's only a guess that they can certainly Market it for other dealerships. I'm not real sure I can't assume Okay, but that didn't that didn't brought up as no they just want the option to do something to be able to in the event that they are I Don't know if you recall but actually a year or so ago we had an issue with Peterbilt a Third party vendor was using the old bill at afford at the corner of Bonnie Bray and and 380 They had the same type of contractual arrangement with the property owner where they were storing trucks there It was due to a peak time where? Peterbilt was producing more trucks than their third party vendor was able to get him out of dent and deliver them to the used end users We have not resolved that issue. They have not expanded the footprint of where they currently store their vehicle So if we reach another area where Peterbilt starts performing at a higher level than their vendor can get them out the door I know the vendors going to be looking for other opportunities where they can store vehicles So we're at least aware of that unresolved Potential for storage of vehicles or at least a need for storage of vehicles Because we have not been able to resolve that issue with the vendor that Peterbilt is using Yeah, probably not just I just bring that up because part of that is Interesting important context and if you have a major manufacturer in town That needs space to be able to do what they're doing and we want them to manufacture more and more more more As part of what they're doing There's a context there versus just some out-of-town dealer needs a space temporarily for a time and they're making money off of this These contexts seem to be somewhat important as we're looking into this. So I appreciate that I Would just like to add to Councilman runs comments that well that may be true the local neighborhoods don't think so Right Maybe you're about to get to this but I went out there this morning what what cars are parked there right now? I also went out there this morning and there are vehicles there and I counted maybe 40 45 vehicles range from the compact to trucks to there may be two large fans but ranges in types of vehicles who do those vehicles belong to my Guess would be classic use cars. Okay. Thank you. I Don't know if this is for you or for legal but when is a car no longer parked but stored What's the difference between a car being parked somewhere and being stored somewhere The the way we define storage is that it's it's being stored for not an immediate sale or immediate Movement so it's there for a longer period of time There are requirements for parking so we have those requirements and there are also requirements for storage So there is a distinct difference between a car being parked and then obviously Moved in a in a timely manner versus a car that's stored for a longer period of time Say some for example these vehicles are stored probably in over 30 days is my guess or even more So I believe that just the timing is the difference So so do we have a legal definition that that says after so many days? It's not being parked, but it's been stored there. There isn't a a set date number number of days We do have a definition for outdoor storage and And that applies not to just vehicles, but to all other types of storage But we do not have a number of days because my my my understanding is is that? classic That particular dealership has those cars over there, but there may be a card that they put over there Today's Tuesday Maybe they put it up that came in and they put it over there over there Friday They have a customer that comes in and they want that particular car that car that meets those particular guidelines So it's been there four days, and now it's gone is that stored or parked? In by definition because it's there for it's off-site is that is what we're assuming It would probably be considered storage So so part of the definition that we've got I mean is it a is it a definition in our books? That if it's if it's not on site its storage, and if it is on site. It's parked well again When we get to the presentation we we have an example for example auto and RV sales Is a permitted use and they are able to store vehicles on site, and they would be considered storage stored vehicles on said property now What you're asking is if they are stored somewhere else is that considered storage or is that considered park? Against I don't think that the location makes a difference It's I believe it's just the timing of how long they're stored and I'm offered to legal if they have any other Yes, the question on the table is how long does the car have to be parked before it's deemed stored, right? and I think Mr.. Minghida's analysis Excuse me is a fair one and that is it's really a question of time and a question of purpose with regard to the reason that the car is Situated where it is I don't think that We have a specific definition that would answer that with any more clarity than mr.. Minghida's comments in my addition to So again, I want to just help our viewing public just to so show them where we were looking at This is the site plan of the North State Texas fairgrounds, and and this is a actually a good illustration my understanding is that the vehicles initially were parked up in this area here They have since then been moved and my understanding is there there in this general location now so away from the neighborhood and further south towards the back part of Kroger which the North Texas State fairgrounds was very kind enough to do and to address the issue while we work through this matter oh Yes, sir When I was there this morning if you kind of look at the north East of that church parking lot mm-hmm. That's where I saw all the if you go up point the pointer up right there There was a row like a bunch of cars parked right there Because you can see there's an empty lot Right right there right and that's chain link so you can just walk right up there and about 40 feet south of there Where's where all of the cars were parked okay? Yeah, and I saw some some over here as well, so they they potentially could be storing vehicles up in that area as well Actually the the need Must comply with the requirements and again our task staff 's task is to find an option in which We can allow them to have storage of vehicles legally, but wanted to Make sure that they have the opportunity one of the things that we have to look at she's the future land use designation for This particular location this illustration here shows that it is designated as existing land use The area just to the south of the fairgrounds is community mixed-use Center This illustration identifies or lists the existing land use Center as Within established residential areas new development Should respond to existing development with compatible land uses patterns and design standards And I'll get a little bit more into that and why? May maybe this location isn't the best suitable site The zoning of the property is to they've got NRM you 12 to the north adjacent to the neighborhood and then NRM you to this to the southern part of their boundary or their property and then around the Subject site we've got CMG which is the Kroger site and then around to the north and northeast are NR3 and NR4 and some NRM you and so forth So what are they what do we need to do first to even get them to where they need to be? One of the first thing is to do a development code amendment again This is something that we need to discuss and receive direction from council if we want to go this direction The use of storage of vehicle is not a permitted or a use in sub chapter 5 currently we would have to add that to the list of uses as a primary use and Then once we establish that Determine which zoning districts it would fall under It would also behoove us to list if they are permitted by right if they would require SUP or if there are limitations that we need to place per that zoning district Currently as we discussed earlier the storage of vehicles would be permitted as a secondary use for a Primary use of the two that I've listed here are auto and RV sales and also vehicle repairs So if you have an auto and RV sales, and this is the car dealerships are examples of an auto sales use They have the ability to store vehicles now There are there are areas within The dealership that they would dedicate for display and those are usually along the front of their their business But they can also store vehicles where they're not ready to sell the vehicles and they can they can they can store those in the rear of the property and those will be considered stored because Per our our definition of outdoor storage those items including vehicles are not ready for Immediate sale so they're considered stored and they're there for a longer period of time while display is For immediate sales and so in that in essence those vehicles or other items could be sold Immediately right you know that very that very moment again goes back to the timing of the situation This is real quick question. Yeah is the I? Mean another several issues here, but it seems like the on- site off-site Designation seems to be one of the potential determining factors here. Let's say for instance They entered into a lease with the North Texas Fairgrounds that said we want to lease this land as part of our auto-sale center At this at the 35 location right all right that doesn't mean they're gonna have sales personnel there But they're leasing it as an extension of that Is the off-site component of that it was what makes it problematic to store vehicles there? That's that's part of it because we would approve that with a use What would that use be it would be auto and RV cells at that location and? So it has to happen at that location right right if we're saying that they're gonna be using and currently that that property zone NrMu in army 12 and auto and RV cells are not permitted, okay? Thank you Okay, so We've had to create a definition for storage vehicles again We do not have this in our current code and then add that land use that primary land use that storage of vehicles in Subtractor 35 5 so how do we determine what zoning district we would allow? Storage of vehicles one of the things that we preliminarily did just to get an idea We looked at auto and RV cells vehicle repair commercial parking lots self-storage Again, these are uses that are currently in the development code as a way of comparison comparing and I've highlighted the seven Locations or zoning districts that potentially we could consider if we went in this direction Where's vehicle storage would be permitted either by right SUP or through a limitation? CMG CME RCCD ECC ECI IC and ICG now these are a lot are more commercial more higher intense zoning district makes sense They also again permit auto and RV cells all the way throughout vehicle repair as well and commercial parking lot so I Think staff is pretty comfortable that these potential zoning districts could be potential zoning district where we would add vehicle storage as a zoning district Actually it makes sense to Find a zoning district that's close to the The fairgrounds and I'm just going to skip one real quick to illustrate One of those zoning district that we listed that potentially could be a zoning district that would allow vehicle storage Would be CMG and I don't have it listed here, but it's this pink area here is CMG so if the State fairgrounds would like and again assuming that we've established that vehicle storage is a permitted use in the CMG Their next step would need to be to zone that property to allow for that that use While you I was going to ask this question later, but while you have that slide. Yes I'm curious With the NRM you are with the CMG, okay In those big charts that we have allowed use or permitted use or use with SUP Does either NRM you are CMG? allow for rodeos That's a good question. Well, it's part of the presentation rodeos are considered major event entertainment and NRM you does not permit. Oh, it doesn't does not Wow, it CMG allows it with a specific use for okay. What about? Would that be the same for? livestock shows or dog shows We don't have a specific use for that But if it was associated with say the fairground or with the way of rodeo that probably war or food contest Barbecue cook-offs and things like that. Yeah again major event I mean if it was large enough that it was part of that I would assume that it would be it would fit in that same and bears would be a major event I would say so yes, so how we've determined it to be so what we're really learning here is That They've been operating Not in compliance with our zoning for years and years for years So we probably auto addresses right true, and that's that's part of presentation. I got a few more slides, okay I'm sorry. No, that's fine. I didn't you didn't have the PowerPoint in our no no So again the zoning needs to be where they can allow for that use Obviously we have to do the development code amendment in order to get the CMG assuming they want to go forward with the CMG First they would have to amend the comprehensive plan Obviously our zoning must match our comprehensive plan in this in this case They would have to change their future language designation from what is currently existing land use and bring Community mixture Center up to this Area where they're currently so that we would then follow that with a rezoning change request To allow them to move CMG up again so that it's consistent with the future language designation so Two step process Okay, a couple of more questions to go along with that These are sort of random and not in any particular order Would it be possible thinking about the neighborhood that backs up to this where there's a Row of houses right in individual residences is it possible for us to either? If a zoning change comes about to do we have to Change the zoning for the entire property or could we change the zoning for part of the property or zoning? With an SUP that that does something to to respect the those residences To the north but allow for the uses that have been going on on that property Before that was zoned One way or the other sure and before the the the current comprehensive plan was in place That we laid on top of it that made what they did actually Forming non-conforming right the the answer the quick answer to that is They don't have to zone the entire property they can they can choose to as you can see this property or the North State Texas State Fairgrounds is zoned in two different zoning so they can choose just to go with the the bottom if they chose To or extended north if that's if that's what they want Thank you mayor well actually it would seem to me there's a third step and that is then they have to have an SUP Assuming that all this got done, then you'd have to do an SUP on top of that so it'd be three steps But for the major event in the entertainment yeah, right right in order for them to get Because parking or auto sales which includes parking or storage is not included in CMG except With the SUP right it no we kind of change subject there We were talking about the rodeo and so if they were successful in getting The say the zoning in place we would have to also look at looking to make them conforming for that major event entertainment to be Conforming they would have to get a specific use for it for that major event entertainment use But wouldn't they also have to get that? If they wanted SUP to store vehicles because CMG does not only allows that under SUP no CMG We don't have a use For storage of vehicles we can choose to put an SUP Sonji, but you still have to do an SUP in order to allow it because it's not there correct Okay, we can choose to add that other layer of an SUP if we took if that was the direction moving forward Thank you, and all of this Rezoning to CMG with an SUP ASAP Would does that require Does that require? Replatting or a lot of unanticipated Financial expenditures on the part of the North Texas State Fair Association there wouldn't be any need for platting I believe the property is already platted the only expense would be the application fees for processing the comprehensive plan the rezoning request and Potentially the SUPs as well how much would that cost? Depending it's based on the size of the property It's a minimum $2,000 with say $16 per acre is what I can recall so run the $2,000 for each application so they need to they need to have some revenue like like parking cars. Yeah, sorry cars to cover that Again we kind of already talked about the specific use permit requirement If we were to approve a CMG Currently the CMG would not allow a major event center the fairgrounds without a specific use permit So in order to be in conformance, we would require them to do that as well We can also do an alternative which is the last bullet here we can change the requirement for an SUP on CMG properties to allow major event centers But remember when we do that that affects all other CMG properties throughout the city And we don't we don't want to do that as well So the next few slides kind of illustrate What staff's recommendation is? our initial recommendation for Amending the comprehensive plan and rezoning property to CM G We're not recommending for for that to happen the reason being is by introducing CMG to the North now it may not extend all the way to the north, but it is still moving northbound where there are existing Neighborhoods that we feel that need to be protected by introducing CMG that also opens it up for other intense uses Such as motels hotels that sort of thing we know that's probably not going to happen But if in the event that say the state and state Sells the property and the zoning is in place that it could be in the next you know in the future at least So again staff is not in it's not recommending that we move CMG up to This area again because it will introduce more intense uses north where the neighborhoods are located If we keep things status quo just to clarify They can continue on with fairgrounds activity, and they're not violating anything because they're existing non-conforming use the status stays the fair It's only if there is a seeking of a zoning change that would call that on to question. That's correct The second part of this recommendation is that we are not in support of Recommending that we amend the CMG to allow major event centers or entertainment Without an HUP in all the CMG zoning district as I mentioned earlier if we do that that affects all the other CMG properties that are in the city, and I've kind of identified or highlighted some of those We know that most of these already are built out, but again the potential is there before major event centers to Locate in these areas without a specific use permit and potentially affecting neighboring properties again Staff is not in support of that so that being said there are a number of Questions I'm sure you all have I'll be I'll be happy to answer them But I wanted just to give you an idea that there isn't just a one-step process We do have a number of different things that staff has to do but also That the fairgrounds have to do in order to get what they 're requesting Yes It just a question why why is this before us at this point? It's a little unusual for a zoning request change possibility to get put on a work session Agenda topic prior to any real application being in is it because we all know that this would be a major hall going forward and People just want to get a sense of the comfort level with this before anyone enters into it reasons the reasons before you is because Majority of the council has contacted myself and legal department and asked for us to present a Legal way that we can allow the storage use at the North Texas State Fairground Understand there's a notice of violation letter pending right now with the North Texas State Fairgrounds for the violation again the illegal Use by the storage of vehicles on their property We've resolved the immediate issue right now as it relates to classic dodge so we won't have to move into enforcement But and we know that they're looking for Ways to raise the revenues in fact if we recall you've got an informal staff report here recently from us where we had an Application from them asking for about forty thousand dollars in funding for them to do a feasibility study as they're looking for another area to move into So we do know that they have that type of activity They've made it very clear to us that if another opportunity presents itself for them to store vehicles They feel they have the right to do so in our conversations with legal we feel that's not correct But that's why this items before you is we're coming back as a result of direction that was given to myself as opposed to legal To find a some legal options on how we can get them to allow them to have that storage use at that facility where they're located right so to clarify majority of the previous council That is that is correct, okay? Thank you mayor so Pointful clarification the rodeo is a non-conforming use so But because they were doing rodeos there before the property was zoned in our MU that is allowed so if the question would be if they could Produce documentation that they stored vehicles on the property before it was owned in our MU They would be grandfathered and continued could continue to do so well and actually there is such a document where an SUP was approved back in 96 they came to get approval from the council to allow for off-street parking Onto their property so they didn't already have that they came to ask for it back in 96 and the council approved it tied to the fair event There have been some legal questions as to That SUP and there's actually a closed session item posted in case We want to have discussions with legal on some of the concerns as it relates that SUP I guess they didn't have it they didn't have it by right to even park on that property so back in 96 they came to Ask for the council to be able to use that property for parking as it relates to their event yeah, I mean the purpose of my question is this so so we're talking about zoning and What they're doing on the property now? Isn't conforming to the zoning that they have We're telling them you can't park cars on the property because that doesn't conform to your zoning Well, we don't have a zoning for parking cars. So I guess my question really is I don't I'm trying to understand what we're allowing them to use the property for rodeos because they were doing that before it was zoned We're assuming that and we'll have to verify this but they were legally approved to do rodeos and they have you know that proof If you're like you're suggesting if they do have a legal permit to store vehicles in the manner that they're doing now That in essence, you know, if it was approved back then it would be considered illegal not corn But I don't think we do but I'm just trying to deal with facts and not sure You know being emotionally selective because we like something and not something else That makes sense. Thank you Yes councilmember Inglebread. Thank you mayor Let's just set aside the zoning issue in the whole leading side of it for a moment. The fairgrounds been there a long time the Community built up around it and over time literally, I know staffs worked with the community to Work work together to find a way to allow them to accommodate the rodeo I mean they've they've made a lot of modifications in terms of where they move the stage and the sound levels and all kinds of things it's an attempt to keep that going which is it's it's a long established activity event in the community and yet Live with the neighborhood But as times gone by the fairgrounds looking for more revenue So they have created some weekend events the neighborhoods have particularly been concerned about those Okay, that's alright that with the staff they and the Fairgrounds were participated to keep the noise level down when they had a band there on the weekend Sometimes dog shows and some of those things nobody really worried about it one way or the other but all of a sudden a new level of activity has come along called storage and There were some vehicles then those vehicles went away and then came in all of the Struct super structure for the North Texas parking garage. They moved all of those concrete Pieces in there set them down stored them there and then they needed them the trucks came in pulled them out took them over to the university Well all of a sudden right after that here comes a whole nother set of cars so the neighborhoods are seeing another level of activity that they didn't see before and At this point They're a little concerned about I mean that's the way I read this about and you have to remember in addition to that Right up the road at the old bill udder Ford site Peter built or whoever was running their storage operation was storing a lot Hundreds of new trucks there and now and I didn't know this Evidently there's been a discussion of storing those trucks at the fairground Possibly or no, so I don't want to leave it at an indication I'm just letting you know that we have this unresolved issue and we have this Landowner that said they're looking for additional opportunity. Okay, so it you're you're looking that yeah, that's a possibility and and That brings another whole issue forward Because those trucks are of a different weight class and in fact we now have banned those from 30 from University the state has Unless they're going to do business locally if you'll notice there's no semis the gravel trucks and such aren't going up and down University They're swinging around on the loop and missing going through so Some people were were arguing that it at bill udder That alone was a violation that they shouldn't be allowed to store those vehicles there because they shouldn't be able to bring a heavy vehicle on the 380 past 35 all these pieces are swirling around out here and basically it appears to the neighborhoods that the activities ramping up and That's I think we're the big concern And not from a legal perspective, but but that's what we've got to deal with is the legal perspective growing out of all this activity and concern Well, and I believe we have as a placeholder a closed session item that addresses this with Unless there's any other sort of Questions or comments relating to that other than some of the possible legal? resolutions or ramifications and sure just one yes, and that has to do with the Storage if you will of those semi-tractors What we had up here was Auto and RV sales and in fact those were vehicles that weren't sold It didn't mention anything about a heavier duty vehicle nor did it mention vehicles that were already sold which I think is the case for the the Peterbilt vehicles those were already sold and simply waiting to be shipped out to to the owners So do we even have a category and we have a whole storage yard over off a 35w? How's that zone so I? Bet know you bring up a good point coming in well. We'll have to do is probably expand our Research and yeah, if you would at least I would certainly like to know What category that falls into because it looks like we don 't even have one and they're operating under something over there Okay, thank you So I guess I'm confused as to what direction you're seeking from counseling I mean if we just if we put the rest of the discussion to closed session It doesn't seem completely proper that we would give all of that direction in that context since we now have a public presentation How do we plan on working that out or maybe you can clarify what direction you want and maybe we can What we've done is we've tried to present some options for you to consider as to how we can reach Again the direction given to us and that is find a way for the fairgrounds to legally have this use on that property But if we're going to do that as you saw it's going to tell quite a bit of movement from the planning staff planning zoning ultimately the council will have to work closely with the Fairgrounds to get that done Just want to make sure that That's direction you wanted us to head Otherwise also want you to make you aware that we still have this unresolved issue, so if in the future It's made aware of the city's made aware that they are storing vehicles again. That's still a violation of our ordinance There'll still be a letter a notice violation letter probably sent to them, and we'll still be dealing with the same issue Well first of all Thank you for the report. I'm so grateful that I'm not the only one with unresolved issues It seems to me From what I'm gathering and this is sort of responding to councilmember Rodin who has no unresolved issues So mentally healthy, it's just sickening You need another hug I've had plenty. Thank you the it seems to me that that what I'm gathering from the direction is We like the North Texas State Fair Association It's been a good neighbor. It's been a good generator of economic activity for the city for a number of years and we like neighborhoods, too and I think the North Texas State Fair group has tried to work really hard with the neighbors to to Develop a good relationship, and I think that what we would like to what I would like to see is some kind of a resolution To this so that the fair Could continue to generate some additional revenue so that at some point they could realize their goal of Moving to a better bigger better location more appropriate for the kinds of big event activities as they would like to continue to do because They know as well as we all know that long term. That's not going to be the best location there So for it to grow for it to thrive it needs to move but in the meantime if If we can allow them some opportunities to generate revenue in a way that does not create undue hardship on the neighborhoods That that we should try to find a way to make that happen He Thank you has there been any complaints from the neighborhood since the cars removed to the southwest corner of that property Or were they mainly when they were parked on the north side ? The complaints are mainly when they're parked on the north side the first time I'm hearing that they're back on north side It's what you just mentioned earlier. I was not aware that they had agreed to keep them down on the south side, okay? But I have not talked to community improvement services in at least a week So I don't know if they've got any new complaints since then okay I'm just wondering if during this time of us figuring this out if maybe they could be moved down to that corner for sure That's what we had agreed on okay, and that's what they said they were going to do should have taken a picture Thank you mayor well, I would like to propose An option for my fellow council members is that we asked staff to host a neighborhood meeting that would include the CIS staff planning folks and and the fairgrounds folks let them all sit down together and and Sort of talk together for sure that we have a formal discussion together before we Start looking at zoning and everything else, and we don't know where anybody's at Then we'd have a better sense it seems to me where the neighborhood is and they may understand better what? What the fairgrounds wants to do and and and sort of suggest maybe some limits? Maybe everybody can come to an agreement, which is sort of what we've kind of tried to do over the years. I think If I could get you to go back to your what you're not recommending as staff All right now what my understanding is from your presentation was you did not want to extend The CMG north because of the fear of the additional uses correct We've had numerous zoning cases where we've rezoned and we have literally tightened it down to the specific use I mean I Can probably name three or four right off the top of my head? So I'm not so concerned with that because we can put an overlay that will that will provide some protection there And so then we need to address well What about making some change to one zoning classification that would affect all of them? Well, we can do that with it. I'm saying I think we can and I know you're not recommending it but I think we have enough tools in order to really ratchet this down and to give them you know something what they need at this point and To also provide protection to the neighborhood and to also insulate the other zoning categories That we may have a fear that because we put an SUP on whatever we're allowing here, which gives council another look We have the tools. Yeah, and so I think Neighborhood meetings great. I think though from what I'm hearing and Colleagues correct me if I'm wrong that the direction would be use the tools We have that we've utilized in the past as precedent I mean this isn't something that we were not used to doing right to find a way to Craft it and we can say was too specific But we do it all the time to try to accommodate people that have been good for our community And to make sure that this is but I will also say as a caveat to that I would like either an informal staff report or work session actually on There's been some talk about a relocation north and there's been some talk about that can't happen because of the lack of utilities I want this council to address that Because that's a long I-35 corridor, and I think we need to we need to have a good frank discussion about Where we're willing to put in infrastructure ahead of development Why and why not and I think this is a great example of if somebody's going somewhere where there's not But it's also going to open up if there are utilities that 's going to open up a whole different section of a major Corridor I just want to have that discussion quite frankly and that would be more of a long-term solution Where as here we're trying to find a short-term solution so Unless I hear some objection what would it be the direction of the council to give them some guidance or some directions say go find a way To pull all the tools out of toolbox to craft something that will meet the needs That they have while also meeting the interest that you as planning have on the fears that you have And bring it back to us and let us see if that'll work If I might add this has the interest of the neighborhood in mind as well, and that's why I think the meeting isn't yes Absolutely feedback yes, absolutely absolutely We'll set the meeting with the neighborhood with fairground s and with staff and get some get some feedback from them as well Is that do we have that okay? All right? Thank you very much appreciate it and We're going to with the with my colleagues indulgence into some sex upset objection, please let me know we're going to move the Work session item e which is receive report and hold discussion give staff direction regarding project recommendations from the citizen bond advisory committee To now is that okay with everybody okay? Yes, let's do that So we're calling that yes, yes, we're calling that agenda. I'm sorry George interrupts All right, thank you mayor members of the council it's a real pleasure to be with you today to talk about the bond committee's Recommendations as you know we've been working Really over the last six months with a 51 member citizen advisory committee to come back to the council with recommendations for the bond program So we have with us today mr.. Randy Robinson. I think he just slipped in just a moment ago Over here we he's one of the co-chairs of the committee Tim crouch also co-chaired the committee unfortunately He could could not be here today due to work commitment I also want to take a moment to just introduce a few other folks that are with us today We have Sarah Hoffman Brandon McCluskey and Janet Shelton they were our subcommittee chairs and Before I turn it over to Randy for his presentation just want to say it's been a real pleasure working with all of these Chairs and subcommittee chairs and as well as the entire committee I know we've got a number of those folks represented today They work very very hard spent a lot of time and effort Weekends nights and all hours in between to put this together for you, so I really appreciate everyone's help and doing that so with that Randy I'll turn it over to you Thank you Brian, I did tell Brian to not go too far away There's a couple of buzzwords if they're if they come up. He's gonna step in But I do want to as well as I want to thank all the staff that Has been there for us in the last six months They've been a tremendous help There's been All kinds of requests for information reports. Let's see it this way. Let's see it that way. Let's change it a little bit Let's do this. What about this? What about that? They've been very accommodating I want you to know that and we're very appreciative for for what they did as well as We have some of the other bond committee Members here today. I want to recognize them and thank them Gene I want to thank you especially I stole your quote in the newspaper. I hope you appreciate that she's She goes to more movies than I do so Anyway, thank you, Gene. I want to recognize you for that for that comment As Brian said in November 2013 the council formally established the Citizens Bond Advisory Committee Which was 51 members including two co-chairs And as he said Tim Crouch the other co-chair of the committee couldn't be here and actually I Was gonna report he's he's actually at a tennis tournament in Plano because we don't have a tennis facility big enough to host it here but That's in that comes a little later We met roughly two times a month just in informal meetings over that six-month period And concluded at the end of May just as this past week and The way we Divided everything up. We basically took three subcomm ittees and divided it into specific service areas transportation which included drainage facilities and leisure services Now the request from City Council was that That we focus on some priorities one being existing facilities infrastructure drainage improvements in the downtown area They also the council also specifically requested that we look at the reconstruction of two fire stations fire station number three and four For those of you who may or may not know fire station number threes on McCormick Street over by 35 McCormick and fire station number four is out on Sherman Drive and also to look at 12 million dollars in street reconstruction for City streets They also asked council also asked that we evaluate whether to recommend new facilities and infrastructure And the council also asked or requested that we consider including funding for public art projects As far as the input public input that we received we held four community meetings during During really during the month of January 1st of February in very Various parts of town at rec centers and In those community meetings we had a total of 139 attendees they came out on a Saturday morning or a Monday night and Asked questions saw We had staff available. We had committee members available I know some of some of y'all were there as well and To answer questions make comments solicit input We also received 166 comments suggestions through our email through a website and Just the old-fashioned way by telephone and then comment cards. We received it at these community meetings The recommendations as you have seen in your backup, I'm sure the committee has recommended Unanimally, I might add it at the last meeting we for all that was there. It was it was unanimous vote that we recommend to the council a total bond package of 98.175 million You can round that up to a hundred newspaper rounded up to a hundred, but you know, we thought 98 sound a little better. So Anyway, that would of course be for November 2014 election The allocation of these projects within the categories that we have is one Transportation at sixty one point seven million. That's approximately sixty three percent of the total package Drainage improvements and we'll see these in detail a little later At eight and a half million dollars or about a little under nine percent of the total package public safety at sixteen and a half million dollars at which is seventeen percent this does include the reconstruction of the two fire stations we talked about before and we're specifically asked that we look at and then parks and library services at Eleven point three or eleven point six million dollars or eleven point six percent. Excuse me in addition we We also included for those projects that were Under under the public art policy that would be eligible for public art. It 'd be a piece of this bond package That totals about five hundred thirty five thousand dollars In public art total for all this and we can get into the detail if you'd like later about where that where that falls The slide we've all been waiting on Pro the program assumes up to a three cent tax rate increase over the Six year period or the funding period financing period these bonds That tax rate estimate is based upon an eight percent growth for the assessed values in 2014 15 and a four percent growth after that thereafter, so if we Can conservatively say we're gonna have an eight percent growth and add warm values this this year or this coming fiscal year and We can maintain a four percent growth for the remaining years Then that's how the three cent was calculated based upon this this dollar amount Obviously if these Growth rates are up It has less of an impact on the tax rate and it's just a match. It's just a matter of how the math is going to function And it can ask you real quick sure friends may be for Brian When did when do the taxes get levied? In the process all at once or staggered or how does that? Tell me to be ready for the slide We're planning to issue approximately 19 million dollars for 2014 15 so in April of next year 15 We'd issue 19 million dollars so the tax rate would come the following years of 2015 16 We'd issue or we'd levy up to additional three cents of property taxes to cover that debt service now if there's a value increase For the following year that greater than the four percent that we're assuming that could potentially reduce that So does the inverse work as well that if there's if it's less then it may be that there's a either a larger tax increase or We just don't do Some of the project. I mean how does that yeah, yes, sir the inverse is correct I mean if we decided that for whatever reason one of our projects wasn't ready to go or the design or engineering was taking longer than We needed we would we would issue less in this coming year and the tax rate impact would be delayed Could be one one year or longer depending on the values or when the project was ready to move forward So once you issued the three cents, let's say the year that you specified Would that would that mean that all the debt will have been issued or? You're pulling that in to cover the debt that's already been issued and debt you're anticipating issuing in the near future I would need that that additional tax rate to pay for the additional debt service in the first year of the bond program And then in the future years that tax rate plus the reduction of debt that we have is that's being paid off from other Isuances would be reduced and that would allow us to pay for what is that three cents? I mean what kind of what's that big map just is it few million dollars five say Let me think just get back to it. Yeah Did anybody have a question I thought you Like sorry, you bet. Sorry. Go ahead. Thank you. Thank you, Brian just as a From from my own personal experience mayor the the last bond package we passed was in 2005 I was on the oversight committee that helped implement that Once it was passed and the reason it took nine years is because we didn't have the growth And so if you don't have the growth, you don't issue the data. Okay, you know or do the projects and so You know, there's there's not it's not an automatic deal that You know, it's gonna happen. Sure great. Thank you. Thank you, Randy Any other questions on on that part Okay, okay Then getting into then some of the more specific areas of the package the first Part is the street reconstruction which totaled 24 million dollars and I Apologize for the the slide you can kind of see If you look at the the map but not focus on it, it'll look like it'll stand come out at you like a You'll see a spaceship in there somewhere Here's a bigger one over here if y'all want to look at it if you haven't looked at it yet or or later But it's it's a little easier to see But there there is a priority list streets that street reconstruction that We looked at and that this represents 24 million dollars of that recommended list there there is a more specific list if you look at it street by street of What the priority is I can say this the? Even at 24 million dollars, it's far short of bringing the streets up to an OCI rating of What is we consider acceptable which is 40 and so I know Councilman Johnson was on co-chair of the Street bond committee last time or you're on the Street bond committee as well and as well as some others and that Priority list that we saw in 2012 is basically the same thing We're looking at now, but the ones that got left off of the 20 million dollars Will be now we'll hit the next 24 with this Mobility improvements This is represented on This map over here again. I'm sorry It's kind of hard to see from your seats, but these are the projects Mainly There there's of course one of the major ones we have and I 'll talk about that one a little bit Is Bonnie Bray from I 35 e north to scripture? So this is taking care of the north section of Bonnie Bray and then also from University north to Windsor would be bright money break and then the other wheeler ridge which is a connector basically off of from 2181 to Jordan Lane, it's more of a understand there's Sometimes the only way to get to the neighborhood is to cut through Kroger parking lot or back behind Kroger or something and so it's an issue that needs to be fixed It's kind of like water, you know water will find the least path the least resistance and sometimes Going next to the dumpster behind Kroger is a big path least resistance. So this fixes that it's a safety issue Ruedell extension Essentially brings Ruedell across there's a new train crossing there at Ruedell and mingo and that brings Ruedell into the city facility there which opens that up and allows The trucks to get in whereas had they had to go through neighborhoods now More Street expansion if you'll go out when you go out to Kimberly Drive East of Lutede a there's a there's a little bitty piece of more Street It goes from four lanes to one and a half lanes But basically this essentially takes it all the way to m ingo Road which are assuming Mayhill Road which is going to open that's going to need to be opened up there by the government offices and and the tax appraisal district and all that and Then Hickory Creek Road from 2181 South to River Pass that essentially takes that That narrow road there back through all that neighborhood that's built up the elementary schools back there just about to To the railroad crossing just north of that Traffic Improvements one thing and you go back on this Randy that was one question I had for you if there were questions on specific Groups of projects like transportation traffic parks Would you want the questions to be at the end or do you want them as you go or how does it? What's the council's pleasure whatever y'all want to do? How do y'all? Okay, okay, we'll do that. Absolutely you bet. I may answer the question somewhere later on. I don't know but and I have Essentially all my subcommittee chairs are here so I Conduct behind this This podium pretty quick Traffic what's classified as traffic is five point seven million. That is the construction of a transportation transportation division facility which essentially allows us to There there are some projects that That need to happen that that will allow us to be able to better manage our traffic flows in the city essentially from from a lot one location automatically and That that is that facility That's what we're talking about there quiet zones For those of you who were at the Center for visual arts this morning during the the naming celebration Almost perfect timing but the train came through during it during that celebration in fact, I Was in a some fundraiser music MTD fundraiser where Donna Trammell wrote a parody about the train whistles that come through downtown and so That's that's what that is. There's a We can go into more specific specifics about it, but essentially it you don't have to have the train blowing from the time you hit Prairie Street to McKinney Street traffic selling signal improvements There's probably I Can't remember the exact number, but we put a number in there three million dollars, which essentially takes care of there's about Brandon help me user 30 or 40 30 Yeah, they're 36 traffic signals in the city that are 30 Years old 30 plus years old so Not only you know from You want to you want to upgrade those make them more safe to pass under So that that includes that there's not a there is a list but sometimes the sometimes the opportunity presents itself and it's not on the list and so that that's why there's a just an traffic signal improvement number in there and then railroad quiet zone same thing we're talking about from Prairie to McKinney goes on to Goes on north to on the From McKinney all the way out around patch mingo and and out that way So it essentially creates a quiet zone pretty much through the entire city as that comes through and that's very similar to what DCTA is done with their track it's the same technology where there 's more of a An isolated signal that it comes from the track not from the train Drainage projects There's essentially five drainage projects on here a lot of which is downtown You may be familiar with the pecan Creek or the peck for drainage improvements we have this would be the second phase of that which The first phase is already been completed. So this will complete the second phase The Eagle Drive drainage project phase one has already been completed. This will complete that project then we also have some some trunk line improvements and some drainage improvements along Bell Avenue that Has a tendency to flood down through Bell Avenue to so when people come from From Dallas to spend their money on Industrial Street, they can walk across there when it's raining At Hickory and Bell Public safety facilities I'll just say this we fire station number three and four are the two oldest facilities we have in town these my My uncle who's spent 30 years with the fire department Was at fire station number four when it opened and he's been retired for 20 years Now he wasn't there the whole 30 years, but I'm just trying to put in perspective how long it's been there And obviously there's a lot of things that have changed since in fact fire station number four I think there's some trucks we have that can't get in there because of the height of the doors and all that so Much much needed and of course The reason for three being more expensive is essentially land acquisition costs because of where it is. Oh Yes, yes I don't know if this is the best time to ask the question, but since you're on that slide If you've ever run for council you have to go and talk to the firefighters And if you go talk to the firefighters, they keep asking us about the the fire training facility And that's probably a keyword for one of the staff to jump up But I don't see anything in here on it Was there any discussion about that? Is there money that's needed in order to add to the money that was already designated in past bonds? What's the status of that? Yeah. Yes, it was it's it's a it's a very worthy project that a lot of people are passionate about and Unfortunately carries a very large price tag with it as we all know It is certainly one of those items that Need to have very heavy consideration Hey we're recommending three cent right if y'all want to do four cents You know, we could probably do a fire training facility, but we we kind of cut it off there. So That's a great political. Yeah. I know well, you know, and I don't plan on Reynolds for City Council But yeah, it's just one of those things a Lot of times you it's funny to say this in a 98 million dollar package at ten million dollars Makes a lot of difference, but it does swing it a lot And so that is a high dollar item that is very much needed We do think there is Some opportunity in fact committee looked into it very heavily of You know what is from a regional standpoint? What is the demand for a fire training facility? What kind of operational? Revenue can be generated by I think that needs to be looked at and develop further and I think that's how the committee felt to One question and I remember I was on council before when they considered it and they were gonna issue it out CEOs So they did a lot of but when I talked with some of the firefighters the ten million dollars I couldn't quite get a an understanding of because they're really two components to the training facility There was a classroom facility which was classroom facility and then there were the actual the training component which is the the drive the driving instructional track the Swift water rescue all these things that actually go behind the fire station Which I think of that ten million somebody correct me if I 'm wrong because I don't know but I thought there I heard numbers of like either four six million for one of those and the rest for the other Was there it was there a look at bifurcating those particular? Aspects of that fire train, so was it just all considered as one Sarah Thank you What They originally asking for was 12 million Yes, they've split this into a phase one phase two and cut it back to as per phase one to ten million But what we were told was there really wasn't a way to cut back that portion any smaller to a smaller amount That's not all of the projects you mentioned. It's not the swift water rescue But it is the basic trior faint fire training the tower the classroom All the things that they felt like were essential if you're going to do the project, okay good. Thank you appreciate it . Thank you very much Any other questions on that Fire training the relocation of community communication center and Cib and within the police department that's down here on East Hickory Street Police lobby renovation and then finally the police firing range improvements, which is out by the airport By the way all these facilities we had a tour of the committee subcommittee There a tour of all these facilities on a Saturday morning that wasn't included in the the meetings that we reported for but Basically took a tour of all these facilities looked at them Walked in I would encourage you to look at The fire stations in particular and the fact that we haven 't touched our police firing range in a long time it's it's a It's it's really a behind behind the times Parks at eleven point three million dollars The first project is for additions to the water works park this is basically a wave pool and concession sands and That's a two point four four million Expansion to our trail system Within the city various trails Playground replacements that's citywide. That's not a specific playground but citywide spray ground at two hundred thousand and we understand there's a there's a private effort of In place to raise a hundred thousand dollars to contribute to that as well South lakes and Lake Forest Park improvements property acquisition for future parks and library services tennis center remodeling expansion Talked about Tim not being here And you know a lot of these things are If you look at this also as a from an economic development standpoint, this is a for those who Understand or appreciate what sports? Sporting events can do from economic development standpoint . They can put People in hotels and motels they drive sales tax to the city this expansion would allow the I Joked about it, but it would literally allow these types of tournaments to be hosted here in Denton Which would bring in families and and dollars to spend here The Southwest Park master plan and design which is the park property we purchased in the last Bond election and then finally the Vella soccer complex phase two which is Concession stand in restrooms for that for that facility North Town There are a few projects that did not Make the list for various reasons some of these were or simply that Perhaps the kind of these may have been a concept they weren't Quite fully developed developed to the point that we could get hard numbers on what it would cost But the fees in particular received a lot of support not only from the committee But also from the public a lot of the public comments dealt with these these four Projects here, and so I wanted to especially mention those as Something that's very worthy of future consideration Whether it be through another CIP bond package here or or some other way of funding these but and also if there if there is a Some money available in the budget to do Conceptual study of what it would take To fully implement some of these things and develop a cost on it to do that I would encourage the council to look at that as that becomes available. I know there's never enough money available, but these are These were very people were very passionate about things and if you've been to the community market it's a it's a lot different than then What you used to see were you know? the farmers market Parked in front there along Carol Boulevard I Buy vegetables down there every Saturday, and it is packed It is there are people there. It's wall-to-wall people within that The tent city as I call it where a lot of activity a lot of local local folks and It is it's a it's a very unique thing that didn't You can find a lot of things there. You can't find anywhere else and so I would encourage you to look at that What it would take Where it would be how much it would cost what it would look like And then obviously everybody talks about downtown parking We we know it's an issue we we know that the residential growth in downtown is is causing all parking to bust at the seams and then You know and then also you have people to come down for for the the renewed restaurants and nightlife and And all that the live music Seeing this scene that's going on down here downtown parking garage would be very nice to have We just didn't have it developed further far enough to know where it would be what it would cost what it would look like and that's That's what we're encouraging visitor center Kim Phillips with the convention visitors bureau brought us a great idea and concept of having a convention and visitors bureau downtown to for to pass that information about downtown kind of a tourism center if you will again Let's develop the idea a little further and then finally just an overall municipal complex space and facilities plan That as we look at these in the future We've got something on the shelf that we can pull off and say Hey, this might be a good one to go into this this bond package or not and Then finally the calendar Starting with tonight June 3rd course, this is our our presentation to you with our recommendations The chronology of this June 25th would be presentation PNZ and There'd be Pretty much almost immediately starting a public education Campaign to educate to what what this is what's going to be on the package Finally the public hearing that the council would hold On August 5th and then the actual date that y'all would consider calling the election Which again would be November 4th this coming year. It's going to be a crowded ballot as we all know but we I guess some more of the Mary I guess some more the better the voter turnout that the more indicative is of what what people want So that's not not always a bad thing Just in closing and I know y'all got some questions, but I do want to just one comment That our observation that I have, you know, I think this may be my third or fourth bond package to look at either in a Either specific or general or whatever it is And it seems like they all take on a personality and so the personality of the 2005 Bond proposal was economic development The question we asked ourselves at that point in time is what can we do? Remember we had a booming economy In 2005 the site there was no no end in sight is to is to I mean some people even Were dumb enough to open a bank during that period time In 2005 everything was rosy and So we said, okay, let's how can we capture this economic development that we know is coming and let's take advantage of it And so that's how we looked at everything Obviously in 2012 we said hey, we we've got really need to fix the streets And I'm sorry Kevin. I don't have the props I started bring them but I didn't but you know in the spirit of didn't being the condiment capital, North, Texas I've I've captioned this this package as the catch-up bond package so It's not quite sriracha, but Folks we're really paying kit playing catch-up here We're catching up to a lot of things that we know we should have been doing a long time before and so to me that that Validates hopefully to you rings the necessity to buy the bullet call for the Let's let's face the tax increase and do it and get it done not put it off until we're 150,000 Population when it's gonna be even worse. So any questions Go around yes First of all, let me just say thank you for your service Condiment comments aside. Thank you for your service and everyone else's service on that I mean when we first looked at the total amount of needs which was somewhere around 300 million that the staff presented us with and then We had citizen input That's crazy amount of stuff that you guys had to come to the table Work out all the differences everyone had and come with a package that apparently You guys voted on unanimously at the end of the day So I appreciate your leadership Tim's leadership sub committee chairs leadership and everyone who participated or this time because that is a tremendous job That you guys done what you gave us is great. So thank you for that. Thank you A couple of questions and one is You know, the splash park was one of these that kind of came up organically I remember when they started talking about that Jim we met in the library with some of the organizers of that Yeah Yeah, that's exactly right with kids running around And it found its way from initially not being a part of a proposal by the parks to now being a part of the recommendation I noticed that what was allocated is two hundred thousand dollars There is this you mentioned this possible matching funds, but it doesn't seem like the recommendation Requires those matching funds. How did you guys what's the final discussion on that? Is that is that kind of held as a only if this matching fund comes up? Yes. Yes, that's the That yes, that is exactly right. It's it's a if there's a matching fund Out there to help support pay for this then then it is a that that's how it got there Yeah, I might be worth talking about I mean seems like the total price Vegas two hundred thousand for what they're considering anyways, and that's being allocated Nothing else is being required a matching fund if that grassroots level right and I think that the amount of time It's caused them to it's taken them to get to where about ten thousand right now It's taking them some time through a lot of just grassroots backyard barbecue type donations That I'm almost inclined to say this has demonstrated the community support for that enough to just Let's just put that on there and fund it as needed instead of but but I was just curious as to how you guys Yeah, I don't know that we can I don't know that we can restrict it. That's it by saying it Will only commit the half you commit the half. I think it's it's there And and like you say it's it's a hundred thousand dollars unless you're trying to sell Trying to raise it Backyard barbecues, it's a lot of money, but at the same time in the grand scheme of things. It's not Compared to what's the total package, right? In as it relates to Public art and this might be a staff question as well. I've got a couple questions and that is kind of how the the the the options for how It'll look on the ballot as it relates to all those things are all these kind of different line options It's public art separate is it combined in that which I'm sure you're prepared to talk about But were there any specific I know we had Funded a public art master plan study That was going to be done. I imagine Hasn't been completed at this point. That's right But was there anything specific in turn in terms of public art projects that were recommended or is it just kind of the level? Of funding it's issued to level of funding To To break it down into two answers one Those those projects which would be non infrastructure non-transportation drainage projects like facilities and parks and and libraries and things like that are Considered eligible for a percentage of that to be part of part of the public art funding and so if you look at the breakdown of Projects there's actually a two percent Dollar amount in the public art category for those for those projects now that doesn't mean that 132 million dollars or hundred 160,000 Dollars is going to be allocated for fire station before It's got to be Allocated I'm there's any bond attorneys here. They can they can throw something at me right now But it's as long as it's a related project It'll be spent on that And no there isn't there were no specific art projects given to us it basically we knew there was a master plan in the works But we figured it probably would not be fully Developed by the time we presented this I think they initially told us sometime in the summer and so And obviously you've got a public art committee that would decide all these things anyway, and so we Basically just looked at the funding mechanism for it It's my final question if I may just on is In your recommendations does it include a prioritization of what year These particular projects are done No, really it's it's up to Brian Langley and the finance No really it's it's it has to do with you know winner the bonds good We're gonna be able to issue the bar or sell the bonds it also has a lot to do with It also has to do with really the logistics of being able to do things right and we can't Probably if you let's take the fire stations for instance. I think there's already some identified Available property for fire station before that'll probably happen first But then we're in we're also at the end of a project for fire station number two. It's not quite finished and so Can you really take to have two under construction at the same time? So there's a lot of logistics that have to be looked at through Really what what's the capacity to handle the construction or the reconstruction or the street projects? One thing we did verify and Jim Jim cultures here he committed to it. He said it Jim said he could reconstruct as many streets and Denton as we could pay for Per year But No, that's not exactly said anyway There's a lot of moving parts in there, and I think we don 't have a chronological schedule yet We want to we want some dark moving as quick as we can after after these things are done because we want people to see progress Councilmember Gregory, thanks, Mary Brady again, thank you and all of the members of the committee or the work that you've done This isn't your first one and the fact that you would be willing to do it again I'm very grateful. I think everybody's sitting up here And and I gotta say it just shows the quality of the new district to councilmember That at his first regular meeting he's got ankle fixed Five years District three district two been working on it Ryan shows up boom it happens Along with that I Understand the the issue about about the public art funding not being For all of these projects how do you you know do that with the drainage project? But then I scratched my head about so how do you do a public art project in association with the police firing range? Now I've seen some art that I don't know maybe it is a good target but but we're not are are we and this may be a Brian question are we limited when with that money does it does that art have to be? At or around the firing range or or is that for use do we do we have more flexibility in how that? Public art money would be you Councilman we would have some flexibility what we're proposing to do is have four Propositions that would be considered by the voters and so under that one it would be for public safety Improvements and so the public art would be associated with any kind of public safety improvements So it wouldn't be as I think as Randy was trying to point out just for station three or just for station four or just the Firing range it could be for any public safety area that we thought it was appropriate to have it So if the public art committee comes back after they complete their master plan It feels like really central fire station is where they need to have some key public art Improvement there it could be there So we've just allocated by the project just for the calculation purposes on that spreadsheet But it really can be used depending on how council wants to do it within that proposition itself so likewise for transportation There's a $30,000 element. It's coming from a transportation facility, but it could be for any area that 's connected to transportation well, I'm glad to hear that there's that flexibility because because With that kind of thing The the central stations there on East Hickory, which is our grand corridor That would be a better place and sticking a sculpture out in an area that does not get a lot of traffic and would not Be enjoyed by by enough public Councilman road, I'm sorry. I didn't answer your second question. Well ago when you asked and will there be a separate proposition for public art there will not be that's Just to clarify that it's that was debated in the very beginning That's purely a recommendation That's y'all's decision. We felt like that we identified a number of $535,000 within this total bond package and For those Ellsworth projects is a 2% For public art so but it isn't is not a separate ballot Adam on the Yes, I'm sorry, thank you mayor is the tennis center the North Lakes tennis center yes, okay Cool, and then the transportation division facility. What does that look like is that I don't know much about that It's it's essentially it's located over in the service center off of Lattimore and Texas Street We're purchasing Yes purchasing is still there the training facilities there . Okay, there's a Some other city services there, but it's it's it's on that property if you will As far as We have Renderings of that do you remember I think it's it's very utilitarian Is it I mean is it staffed and I mean it's not a just a computer Yeah, yeah, it's it is staffed and then the the railroad quiet zones - that's that's kind of new to me That's you explain a little bit about that. I know you did a little there, but probably John you'll try that Martin Nelson get the best Quieter just trains be a little quieter Quiet zone is Alternative crossing for a railroad to cross a road currently as a train goes to the central part of town They have to activate their horn. It's very loud and as they do that, it's You know hundreds of yards before they get to the intersection all the intersections downtown It feels like it sometimes there's a constant train horn as you go downtown There's more and more residents moving to the downtown area and because of the neighborhoods that the train already travels through This proposal seeks to take some funding and look for an alternative technology that allows either a quiet or more directed Activation of a horn just to the traffic. It's very similar to what you see on the DCTA crossings at Mayhill right now or Brinker or some of those other cross ings where the horn is just activated right there for the traffic That's this waiting to cross the tracks as opposed to having to come all the way through a larger corridor So this is a first step in in helping take care of some of those those Louder intersections as we we have more populated area of the town I think there's also say other safety features of this that You can't drive around follow up on can't drive around the arms Because it was some curbing and things like that Council member Engelbrecht, I think had a follow-up on that . Yeah. Thank you. I Was yeah wanted to know why was that listed in two parts a particular reason why we? Know we just it was broken into two phases. I guess if you will Okay, just first phase was directly down Second phase was taking from McKinney We're not been on out. Okay, right Mind if I follow up just go ahead with the couple other things. I'm up. Okay first off with regard To public art and the firing range you know there's at least one citizen who would like for us to take the public art at the airport and Probably put it at the firing range because I think it's already been shot full of holes With regard to Hinkle Boulevard our street I understand that The road portion of that is being recommended But the drainage portion of it that is needed before the road is done is not recommended It is actually it's it's the It's not it doesn't say Hinkle it's it it's another Okay, yeah, all right, okay, thank you I Guess a quick follow-up. I'm sad to hear that councilmember Gregory doesn't think that police officers would appreciate art I mean, I know they're big and brawny but anyway order I did say that My question is probably a question for Brian you said it's gonna be in four parts So that flexibility just like what we have with the art Do you have flexibility on the projects meaning if you know something happened a development happened where it made more sense to? To reconstruct a certain road than another road that's currently in mobility. Do we have that flexibility within the categories? Yes to that question and typically what's happened in Dent on in the past is once we've had a bond election It's been approved will form an oversight committee and so any kind of projects that need to be adjusted Maybe materials are more expensive as faults more expensive or concrete concrete more expensive so we can do Less or more of those projects we go back to an oversight committee, which is typically been It'll be the co-chairs and maybe some of the subcommittee chairs and some others so it's kind of a lifetime appointment To that as right as Randy knows But we'll ask those folks to serve on that committee and then we'll be able to vet those kinds of issues with them to go forward but the way that the ballot language will read will be Transportation improvements as an example of sixty one point seven million so it'll be very broad that gives us some flexibility to handle that It won't have each one of these individual projects listed on it Thank you, but we'll hold true to that by going back to the oversight committee when there needs to be adjustments Yeah, I've got a few questions, but I wanted to give is everybody Yes, go ahead. I've got one in on the Bonnie Bray project and I definitely can understand the from scripture to 35 then we skip an area and then we're doing an area from University to the Windsor is there what was the reason behind you doing the University of Windsor in this phase? Or in this bond Skipping you mean skipping the middle section? Skipping the middle section and we're going to an area That's that's the same width is that middle section with very little development or projected development You've got North Lake parks on one side and running into Windsor is a two-lane up there yeah, and I'll have to Slaps far enough down We've already funded that section from 380 down to scripture fully funded it for construction and We do anticipate a lot of growth on the on the west side with razor ranch and any redevelopment in any of that commercial property from scripture down to 35 e we fully funded the right-of- way acquisition and 15% design up through a preliminary enough to acquire right-of-way the thought behind the section north of that from 380 to Windsor was with the continued growth of razor ranch and with the lack of turning movement capabilities because it's four lane non-divided without Sheltering that we need some way to get those cars out so that we could have more progression of traffic Thanks Anyone else exactly what I was gonna say Well I'll tell you I attended the first two public hearings are maybe my first two one of Dean you wanted the Civic Center, and I just walked away thinking how in the world are people gonna be able to narrow these projects down Done a great job on doing that. I mean obviously spent a lot of time a lot of effort in vetting the issues that staff you know believe were important in the community issues I Guess I have a question on the the process or the the the ballot per se I know it's going to be just broad categories But are these projects? Pursuant to the categories that we have that connected to the amounts are those going to be memorialized in the ordinance calling for the election or or What I mean? I mean, I'm assuming that's part of the public information and part of this and you know obviously it'll be there I think there's gonna be some some language I don't know if it's gonna be on the ballot or not, but that kind of has a breakdown of not specific projects Here's what here's what how much this money is and how much it's going for what kind of what it's going for but certainly it's gonna be part of Any kind of and and that's we've already Brian said this is for life, and I've already told her by the committee you're not you're not dismissed yet Yeah, that once once this election gets called. It's gonna be a public education process It'll certainly be part of that. I think maybe even broch ures that we're gonna do as well the city can't advocate for or against right, but Information can be provided Yes Just in the proposition language itself and then the ordinance that the council actually uses to call the election and to approve the bonds They'll be a little bit more granularity it won't be project by project but as Randy pointed out and all of the Materials that go out to the public about what's planned to be done will have those those projects listed So be able to be seen exactly what's in there so then in past bond elections Do we track what was put out as far as what would be? Performed and then what we've achieved and what we've devi ated from I mean do we do we dress her and again that goes back to that Oversight committee process is that if we decide for whatever reason a fire station is gonna cost a little bit more than we thought And we may not have enough money to do the firing range improvements as an example Just an example we could come back and talk about how do we want to reallocate anything within that public? Safety category do we want to go back and make some adjustments sure a couple of questions I have in the transportation part if you're able to go back a couple of slides And and I will tell you when I look at this from a higher elevation, I think somebody told me We've got gosh was it 650 or some odd lane miles under OCI 40 and Then I think the 24 million covers about 90 something or something like that What's proposed in the bond programs covering about 2025 percent of those roads that are under 40 well, and I really appreciate that you doubled What was what was that because I think we're really behind on that The only couple questions I have and it doesn't even it has to do with all the product but there's only really two that I I'd like to have a clear understanding of why one was picked over the other and One in particular was you have the more street expansion Which you said it was one and a half lanes and talked to I think Brandon is too but I went out there and walked it I'm taking after councilmember Gregory where he measured for the bike lanes And it's probably about 40 45 feet wide when it narrows down and then goes in front of the praise little district and salad beauty supply and the one that was the connection from Hickory Creek Road 2181 to 2499, which is a very small segment. They're about the same price But that would complete an entire Expansion of Hickory Creek Road. I see the four six lanes. I'm not quite sure is it Do we know if it's four or six lanes divided on Hickory Creek? Six okay, and that's connecting to 24 99 24 99 which is I think being constructed And that's in the fastest growing part of the city, which is southern district district four So I'm trying to I don't think I'm gonna really talk to more much more about it because it sounds like there's the flexibility Within the bond program that if something happens and there 's a greater need So let's say for instance those two projects somewhere two or three years later 2499 is built We still got the choke point at Shady Oaks and Morris and so we don't have a whole lot of traffic going across there and Mayhills Done and we've got all this that that somebody could look at that and go this might be a little bit more because I think It was staffs number two or three Recommendation on that so I'm glad to hear that there's the flexibility But there's also the identification of the specific project right in in the literature But I tell you it's a I mean we all could have a different take on this But I think good heavens to be able to narrow it down the way you did And to perform in such a way to come up with projects that are and I agree with councilmember Rodin if the splash park is $200,000 if that's what it is I mean That's just I would I would agree with his sentiment on that that if that's something that can be done for that and and it just Probably should be done. So again. Thank you very much. I appreciate that I appreciate the flexibility and the hard work that everybody's done on this As I began to look at some of the backup is an education for me learning just the different aspects of the city and and how you figure these things out and how do you prioritize and as I said when I First attended those meetings. I thought good heavens. How are you gonna do that? But you did it Yeah, I told and I appreciate that. Thank you. And I think my statement at the first meeting we had in December of course given the time here was I said it's like You got you got enough presence to tell to your kids are gonna get a present the other three don't get anything The hardest thing is not figuring out which to get it is which three don't Any other questions any Comment from any of the subcommittee chairs or okay. Thank you all very much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you I appreciate it. Thank you All right, we're gonna move on to agenda item C you want to see okay. Yeah Well, we've got the council committees that were yeah, do you want let's do that. Let's do the council committees We'll go to agenda item. We'll just stay in order agenda item D Which is receive a report hold discussion give staff direction regarding City Council committee nominations and City Council Board appointments Thank you mayor our city secretary Jennifer Walters is going to outline this item for you for your consideration. Thank you Jennifer Thank you mayor and council members In your packets that you got received on Friday you had a listing of the committees external committees and Council board committees that you all have you also had a listing of the current membership and proposed membership from those of you who supplied me with those And you also had a listing of a little brief description of each of them. There was one Change I want to make to that backup and that is on the Council board committees under the economic development partnership. I put in there that the position held by Mark Burrows was vacant actually his term does not expire until 2014 which is now anyway But it is he is able to complete that term I Think that's right and Jennifer. I apologize. I think I was not aware when we talked this morning. I think his He has term limited off of that. I thought her his term was not up, but I think he has term limited on it But I think he has term limited on it. So okay, so take it would take back everything I said it would be just forget it is bacon. It is vacant. I apologize so what we can do this evening then if you like is go through each of the committees and See how you'd like to play these out, and then I'll have a amended List up at your spots during the regular meeting that you can confirm these Appointments or nominations or whatever if you're ready to do that this evening, so if you're okay with that all Sorry to a question sure Okay, go ahead. I was just gonna say that just to clear some of these early. I just There's a couple I'm willing to kind of back off of because there's there's interest in and so it might kind of help us Out a little bit and one would be I'd be willing to back out of audit finance Just off the bat and then convention and visitors bureau so that might clear off some of those and give some other folks a chance to jump on those I Know that councilmember Gregory had said it he had a couple of them to they said well He could stay or leave depending on what the group consensus was but I didn't know if we wanted just Do those in order if you want to do now? I would definitely like to be on CVB if you really are backing off that I mean unless somebody Just kidding well, oh yes, I just thought it looked full I Believe there's only three allowed for each so kind of make a decision there We'll have a quorum and then I'll have to come to all these meetings Councilmember Gregory yes, well just just to help in in clearing the slate for folks that want to go on I Would be glad to step out. I'm currently on the hotel occup ancy tax committee I'd be glad to step out of that one to leave room for someone else And I guess we need to have a separate conversation about economic development partnership board because that whole committee is Actually nominated to a different process than what we're doing today right now But it I think it plays into the overall workload of the individual council members and I would be willing to to submit a letter of resignation to make a position available there for the the two council appointees So that there would be room for two folks Or throwing things out I'd like to be on the EDP board I mean That's been a big focus of mine, and I certainly would like to serve on that especially as the mayor audit finance I'd like to be there, but if not that's okay Hotel motel tax if somebody just isn't burning to have that that'd be something that I'd be interested in There's not anybody that other than councilmember rodin on the downtown TIF number one, so I certainly Would would be willing to do that But I think those are probably my two main preferences, and I know that there's been some discussion about the agenda committee and You know either posting it as a council meeting so that other council members can attend or having a third person on there so We can address that if there's need to talk about that here today, or how y'all want to proceed with that I really don't have any heartburn either way on that so On that particular issue I suppose That would require a resolution on the part of council to to change the committee Did we do that be a resolution or yes all of them are established by resolution? You come out the agenda committee correct. I thought that was established by the Ordinance it's in the rules of procedure, but I believe that it was also established by a resolution Either way, we'd have to do some kind of legislative change Well, I'll just weigh in say yeah, I prefer I like that idea of having it posted so that Others can show up they want so that we don't have to worry about folks showing up they want to then a question regarding that if it's posted as a meeting of the council and There's not a quorum I guess this is for our city attorney If it's posted as a is a meeting and there's not a quorum can they still meet? If there's not a quorum of the committee it would not be a meeting per se The question then on the table I guess would be could that piece of business be discussed short of a quorum and Under the open meetings act it could be because the violation of law is only if a quorum is present so the discussion could be had short of a Forum but I would point out to the council that we do have a An ordinance change that would be required backing up on this question that was earlier on the table our rules of procedure embodied in our ordinance Do specify the makeup of this agenda committee we may have done it by resolution to but it's specified to be the mayor the mayor pro tem and the city manager So if we're going to go in a different direction We would need to come back and amend these provisions to allow a large Yes councilman Well, my name is on regional transportation council Councilmember road is already there. So okay pull my name off that Really my I Haven't listed my name on too many. I really only put it on the ones where I thought I could really help The CVB and Mobility Or pretty important to me. I'd like to be involved with those hot funds or a hotel occupancy tax that We got plenty of people there so you can pull me off of that one But I would like to be on the CVB and and mobility Looks like airport you only have three so we're good, correct Mayor yes, I Can there's four on the committee on citizen engagement. I 'd be happy to go off of that that would leave the three positions there There is a vacancy on environment I Like the environment I'll do that one Do we just want to run down these to see We've got the agenda committee we've got that sort of how we want to handle that we just want some Direction from legal as far as the posting for a council meeting so that other council members can attend and it's my understanding that if somehow There's not a quorum of you're saying a quorum of the committee members Which is what's that? You've got to have to Our big problem right now is going to be we're going to have to address this underlying ordinance okay, right now is the Ordinance directs that the agenda committee is made up of the mayor the mayor pro tem and the city manager and so if the council can provide some direction with regard to What you want to do then we'll figure out how to make that happen either by amending the ordinance and or addressing that resolution Okay, so I guess the question from what I'm hearing you saying is that is the council direction saying the agenda committee will be made up of more than those people or the agenda committee meeting will be posted in a manner such that council members can attend and if desired Have an opportunity to to speak Right, that's my my question of the council and that is what do you want to do? How do you want to handle? the agenda committee and Me that direction I'll figure out how to make okay because those currently are posted But they're not posted as a council meeting they're posted as a as the agenda committee meeting so that is it is posted, right? Well and to clarify So any other of these normal committees mobility environment such The recommendation from legal would be that we not get additional council members at those meetings, correct? to a to avoid What well if if the committee meetings are posted as a Committee meeting right and and the quorum then would be two of three at these particular committee meetings You know the clean approach to this is to hold those committee postings just as they are if you want for more than for example the agenda committee if you want more than Three members to be able to attend that we're gonna have to post that as a city council meeting So we need to distinguish between whether a posting it as an agenda committee meeting Made up of however you're gonna make up your agenda committee or whether you want it to be posted as a council meeting Right and so I guess the question for me becomes and I guess this is for my colleagues to answer is is the benefit of? That I mean if at some point in any of these committees we start saying This is posted as an entire city council meeting then you kind of lose the point of why you have a committee in the first place Which is to do additional vetting that can be done kind of a smaller level and then pushed up to council If you start having in a city council meeting just to set the agenda for a city council meeting I'm curious as to At the end of the day the wisdom of that especially if the council members are chiming in and discussing that if there 's interest in that Then why not just make it a part of your council meeting and decide your agenda at the end of every council meeting prior to That or something, but I'm not sure that's smart way either So I guess I'm curious as the other folks thoughts of why why why we'd want Why we're wanting the head in that direction because I'm not sure we'd want to do that with other council committees And just to get some discussion on that Yes, right The one thought I have is that the other council committees on the top level here are designed to make a recommendation To the city council they're vetting something to make a recommendation That's really not what goes on in the agenda committee then the committee says the committee They don't come back and ask the council whether they whether that's okay. I mean, they're not making a recommendation They're actually making a decision about what's coming forward when and to that extent it is different and it would make some sense I think to To allow other members to come forward and and present items or listen to what's going on in that process Because they don't really have any other opportunity for input. I Don't know how we do that And I don't have a real strong feeling one way or the other it it had occurred to me a while back that a the the agenda committee can meet Sometimes the newspaper reporter is there there are a lot of other staff members there, but if Two more council members showed up It would be It would be illegal because it's not posted as a council meeting and and so It I just found it odd that that Here's a meeting that involves the City Council that a lot of other people can attend but as a council member you're actually limited from attending and And then I just thought isn't that peculiar and and is that the best idea? Given given the different nature of the agenda committee But I don't have any problems with the way it's been going the last few years And so I think it's up to everybody else just to see how they feel about it that that's that was my logic from even You know suggesting the discussion Some cities Strike a middle ground in their rules of procedure and so I 'll lay out this as a possibility if you want to look at it Some cities create a procedure whereby there is an agenda committee And it generally works similar to the way ours currently does But there is a provision in the rules of procedure which would allow Any two members of the City Council to request an item to go on the agenda and should that happen? then that item will be submitted to the agenda committee and will thereafter be placed on an agenda an upcoming agenda, so that's a Middle ground if the desire is to allow the other members some input I'll lay that out Because I have seen that before and it is a possibility if you want to look at something along those lines I believe we already have a very similar procedure to that in our current rules That'll offer that is it two members or one member two members. I believe have to Contact them either the city manager or a member of the Agenda committee well in my memory is failing. See no you remembered that it's right in there Well, and I know that that's the formal process But I I certainly have never experienced that if I wanted something on the agenda that you know I mean it calls city manager or someone say I'd really like to see this on the agenda So I mean if it came to the point where you needed the two Means you've got a more of an issue than just getting something on the agenda so I Know John you'd brought this up as well I don't have any problem with either way, but I think you 're right councilmember road inside if we do it What what are we trying to achieve in that and so that's over? I think we're trying to flush out So you you'd sort of talked about it before the election You know just do that idea out is that still your position or what are your thoughts on it? well based on the the Qualifications of it becoming a city council meeting versus just the agenda I'm fine with the way that it's running right now. Okay, all right Okay, so do we just want to just keep the way it is and I'm fine with it the way it is simply because It's just I'm talking about a fix for a problem. That's not really a problem And if it becomes a problem, then maybe we can we can go back and revisit Okay, is that? Acceptable to everybody else I see nodding of the heads in the affirmative. Okay. All right All right. We'll go on to then Airport Committee looks like Councilmember Johnson, that's a desire that you have is that correct? All right, and that would fill that committee up and all right audit finance Let's see councilmember rodin and Hawkins already there Kings vacant I have a preference Ryan you have a preference I pulled out Oh, did you okay? All right Well, then so it leaves basically two two spots. So Councilmember Ryan if you want to do it then both he and I would be on that. All right Committee on citizen engagement now, I know councilmember Engelbrecht you were willing to pull out Councilmember Gregory here you still is that still your preference? Yes. Okay, so Who wants to arm wrestle I'm kidding. So we've got who do we got? Right, so Ryan will go right in there. Thank you. Yep. Yep. All right good Council appointee performance review. I don't remember if is it Does the mayor mayor pro tem by definition are they on that ? Oh, they're not okay So we've got basically oh we can just Yeah, all right these charts man, I That's okay. That's my fault. I'm the one that's Mobility this is the problem Okay Yeah, so in essence Ryan expressed councilmember Ryan and councilmember Johnson expressed an interest and so we only have one vacancy Mayor I'll remove my name from that list. Okay Committee on the environment we've got that one. I believe that in Hawkins Ethics committee, I guess it stays done constitute the same hotel occupancy tax The Hawkins Watson Ryan, okay And then on these external ones We do a different process. I believe on that. Is that right and are they? Doesn't look like we have any change except the North Texas Commission regional transportation council Johnson Oh, okay, that's right. That's right I'm sorry Well on the North Texas Commission it that's vacant because Burrows is out. Is that generally the mayor that does that I? Don't believe so I believe that is by individual membership, I know that the city manager is a member and Mayor Burrows was a member, but I don't believe it has to be The mayor it can be Anyone who would like to be a member We don't even have to have them. I mean I can do that, but if somebody has a strong burning desire I mean I can I can fill in there Someone raised a question about DRMC and I've been going to those those meetings as well so but I think on the on the agenda for the mobility committee is talking about Having an alternate generally for RTC which might come out of our city and it could be a conversation could be had with some Of these other there are several transportation Meetings in the region that we can talk about it perhaps in another mobility meeting, but you can I guess you can put my name in Okay, great so community justice. We're gonna keep Councilmember rodent yes, then convention and visitors bureau, then we'll have Engelbrück Ryan and Johnson, correct Dallas regional wrote in Lake Ray Roberts Engelbrecht North Texas Commission watts RTC wrote in techs TMP a will stay with Mayor Watts Development code review I have Engelbrecht Ryan Johnson Property maintenance code wrote in Engelbrecht Ryan and Then the board committees Let's skip EDP for a minute Go down to the downtown tip We could put wrote in and Mayor Watts and West Park tours the members of the EDP board serve as members of the West Park tours So okay, there's really nothing for that, so we're back to just EDP Currently councilmember Johnson serves as the chamber representative and So it looks like if Councilmember Gregory is is resigning your position or either I can do that Okay, I'm interested in that sounds like Mayor Watts is interested in that and you can stay on from the chamber perspective Is that correct or well you just need to be aware that if there's three of us there? Somebody brought it up at our EDP board meeting today if there's three of us there does that have to be posted? If he's acting in a different capacity Capacity Are you looking at me when you're saying that the problem could be that it is if it's purely chamber issues Issues not related to city business, but sometimes these are overlapping it just bears a little bit of caution Mayor if I could just ask a question I guess I'm asking the questions that somebody does the ordinance that creates that board say there will be two city council members serving on it or that there will be two appointees of the City Council because if it says to the City Council members Then it would raise a question to me of whether a third one even if they're appointed by the chamber would violate It says to City Council members You would then have three right And then there's also the throwing in that nominating committee What we just what y'all decide at this meeting still has to go be presented to a nominating committee, which is comprised of it It's all three members City Council picks two and then there's a member from the chamber There I'm looking at the resolution that's in our backup on that it's it's 2014 - zero zero nine And it's And what it says is Two members of the board shall be City Council members at the time of their appointment To their original term they may serve out all three terms Even if they are no longer members of the City Council After the original appointment as long as they continual is continuously served throughout the three terms They must be residents of the City of Denton So to me it doesn't sound like it's an exclusive thing that it either has to be two City Council members Or that it is limited to two City Council members Council member Johnson was not a council member at the time of his appointment, right? He was on you were on the chamber. So that should I would just say I am if Mayor if you and Kevin would like to be on there you feel strongly about it. I've had some time on there I'm happy to serve out my term or I'm also happy to Step off if need be I don't want to stand in the way if you guys are You guys are interested in it then I can go to Chuck at the chamber and say let's appoint someone else to so I don't I Will tell you I mean How long have you been on it? Aren't you the chair vice chair? Yeah, I've been on it for a year if if I mean I Know that to me it really comes Comes down to Kevin and I because I think you need to be there quite honestly. I mean you were appointed by the chamber And if you if you want to step down, that's fine, but your vice chair you're due to be president Or chair next I guess this coming cycle. Is that right? I don't know. I don't know Whatever you want to do, you know my desires. I've never been on it for six years on council I think I ran pretty strongly under the economic development model And so I think there's a place that I could really help effectuate some positive change in that in that that body Or get beat up trying so What well I'm okay with with trying it with you still being on as the chamber representative unless legal just says you cannot do that I'm okay with that If it because I know councilmember Rodin has a strong interest in that as well And I don't want there to be some type of situation that creates some yeah And to say and to point out if we get to some Issue of conflict with him being there I agree with you kind of being on the ramp at the chair and you being mayor that would be the makeup So I'd be willing to step back if we're able to have the three of us. Let's do it I would agree with that so and we still have to go through the official Nominating process, but I think that would be a great And we'll just have to trust legal to give us some direction on that and councilmember Johnson's term expires this year anyway, so he'd have to be reappointed And by the way And mayor yes, yes what actually happens on that is that? We appoint the council appoints a nominating committee yes that has a council representative and chamber representative To to fill out that slate of recommendations yes, yes, yes and And we can either appoint that those two council members at this meeting or we can if it's not unless it's not posted correctly for next All it is to appoint a team okay. I point the nominating committee. Yes, all right Well it sounds like we've made some headway on that great great discussion. I appreciate that We'll get these cleaned up and have it your spots this evening So you can consider them when we go upstairs So the only ones will be considering are the ones that says committee down to external It'll be just be those that one two three four five six seven eight You can do that yeah, you can do the ad hoc okay. Those would be all right. You might just want to wait Well, you could do the downtown tip If you wanted or whichever ones we can do tonight, let's do it. All right fantastic Any more questions on that agenda item? Fantastic then we will move on to agenda item I Think it's See Receive report and hold discussion provide direction on proposed revisions to the city of Denton strategic plan We could Brian Langley can present that we can do that now. I'm just looking at the clock That's not that's something you could do later if you wanted to to get to the closed session items before the 630 meeting Okay, I'm just looking at the clock. Yeah, why don't we? How long is your presentation Brian? Okay, let's go ahead and I think we can get through the clothes Let's try the closed sessions first because some of them are just contracts and and then we might be able to get to this Yes, absolutely six thirty. Yes All right, so we will defer agenda item C till after the Closed session or the regular sit called City Council meeting at 630 So we will now convene in closed session to consider specific items when these items are listed the City Council reserves right to adjourn into closed meeting and So we will now head into closed session You You You You You You You You You You You You You They told me to wait a couple seconds after the music so now most I want to call to order this council Regular council meeting dated June 3rd at a 650 p.m. We do have a quorum and our first item on the agenda is the Pledge of Allegiance And I want to introduce some special guests that we have we have Jake Wesson a Rick Wesson with his son Jake Wesson and fellow scout member Ethan chin who will be leading us in the Pledge of Allegiance to both the US flag and the Texas flag and They are from troop 366 achieving their citizenship of the community merit badge gentlemen come forward If you can please join me in the pledge of the American and Texas flag Honor the Pledge allegiance to the Tech of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God Invisible with liberty and justice for all Please join us in the Texas flag Honor the Texas flag I pledge allegiance to the Texas one state under God Thank you guys, thank you All right, we'll go with our next agenda item which is election of mayor pro tem Councilmember Gregory, thank you mayor. I move that we nom inate councilmember Jim Engelbrink to be mayor pro tem All right. I have a motion Have a second does it require a second? Yes, okay, yes Okay, we have a motion and a second to nominate Jim Engelbr ink as mayor pro tem If you would vote on the board, please Mr. Engelbrink is succeeds mayor pro tem. Thank you Proclamations and presentations I'll come forth and if frost Chadwick is here if he could join me I'm sorry We've got a proclamation for mr. Ross Chadwick who is the current fire chief who has announced his retirement and From from our service and we've really appreciated his service over the years to the dent fire department And and I know that the six years I spent on the council I sure appreciated your leadership and guidance and and the issues when we dealt with with fire situations and and the budget and so forth So we really appreciate your service here, and we'd like to read this proclamation in the record for you Do you have anybody yes, would you like to come join him you sure okay, all right, okay Sorry, okay. All right didn't mean to call you out a resolution appreciation of Ross Chadwick to all to whom these presence shall come greetings whereas on June 6 2014 Ross Chadwick will retire after working for the city of Denton since December 29th 1995 And whereas the city of Denton has been extremely fortunate having enjoyed the dedicated and outstanding service of Ross and wishes to recognize that service And whereas among his many contributions to the city Ross provided exceptional leadership and vision for the Denton fire department throughout his 18 years as fire chief Accomplishing many goals including the development of a comprehensive civil service recruiting and testing program to enhance the diversity of the department Establishment of the city's first meet and confer labor agreement investment in technology and training to provide outstanding emergency management services Construction of fire station number seven the first gold level lead certified fire station in Texas renovation of the central fire station designed for reconstruction of fire station number two and Planning for reconstruction of fire station number three and four and whereas Ross has been a leader in the fire service and the fire department As an instructor at the California Fire Academy San Diego State University and University of North Texas He is certified by the Texas Commission on fire protection as the head of a fire department as head of a fire department and a master firefighter and instructor has actively served many years on the League of California City's fire service task force and the Texas Municipal League Public Safety Committee And was a charter member of the National Fire Protection Commission 1710 committee which is a national standard for fire department deployment And whereas Ross has applied his numerous talents and skills toward the advancement of the city and has earned the full respect of his fellow employees Colleagues and citizens of Denton now therefore the City Council Of the city of didn't hereby resolves that the sincere and warm appreciation of Ross Chadwick felt by the citizens and staff of the city of Denton Be formally conveyed to him in a permanent manner by reading this resolution in the official minutes of the city of Denton and forwarding to him a true copy Thereof passed and approved this third day of June 2014 Chris watches Thank you, thank you very much mayor watts congratulations to your new post I look forward to watching you guys on TV not necessarily being here members of the City Council Thank you very much for the last 18 and a half years not that you've all been on the dais But certainly you have supported the fire department and I am honored and privileged to have been here for 18 and a half years The fire department is outstanding and only comes from community support council support and city management support So anyway, I am humbled by by this honor and I accept it and remind you all that on Friday from three to five at the center for community Visual Arts Center We're having a little reception for cake and punch and I'd love to have you guys all show up mayor watts. Thank you very much Thank you very much. Appreciate it Agenda item number four is citizen reports. I do not see any citizens reports on the agenda. So we'll go on to agenda item Number five, which is the consent agenda Enlisted below these these items are pretty much administrative in nature bids contracts and other things And I'm going to go ahead and read the agenda item number five And I'm going to go ahead and read the agenda item number five Enlisted below these these items are pretty much administrative in nature bids contracts and the like and at any time any of these items can be pulled As an item for individual consideration by any member of the council Yes Yeah Um, do we have a motion? Yes. Yeah, I understand. I understand. We're pulling item five. Oh, so I move approval of Agenda items five a through P with the exception of oh All right, and do we councilmember Hawkins? I second All right. We have a motion to adopt the consent agenda excluding item. Oh, and that will be considered for individual consideration What could we vote on the board, please? Motion passes we will now take up agenda item Oh Mayor for the record. Mr. Gregory has recused and has now less the council chambers. Thank you. Madam city attorney Councilmember Hawkins, I move approval of agenda item. Oh Councilmember Rodin. I second that we have motion to second on please vote on the board Motion passes unanimously. We'll wait for councilmember Gregory to return And now we'll move to agenda item 6a considered option of it Okay, I've been instructed by our Illustrious city attorney that I will need to read this entire caption To satisfy the requirements of the law. So please bear with me as I do that and forgive any mistakes Consider adoption of an ordinance one finding that a public use and necessity exists to acquire through the exercise of the right of eminent domain One permanent electric utility easement and one temporary construction easement encumbering 2.192 and we'll have a correction on that and 1.1 six. Oh acres of land respectively The permanent electric utility easement to be used and utilized for and in connection with the expansion construction maintenance replacement augmentation and improvement of electric transmission and distribution lines facilities and structures There in the ordinance as the DME expansion project the temporary construction easement to be used and Utilized for the purposes of access staging of materials and equipment Construction and grading activities related to the DME expansion project the affected lands and interests being generally situated in the S McCracken survey abstract number 817 city of Denton Denton County, Texas as more particularly described in exhibits A - 1 and a - 2 and depicted in exhibits B - 1 and B - 2 respectively Attached to the ordinance and made a part thereof said tracks of land and all related interests therein to be acquired and damages resulting There from collectively referred to there in the ordinance as the property interests to authorizing the filing and prosecution of eminent domain Proceedings to acquire the property interests 3 authorizing the expenditure of funds thereof 4 making findings 5 providing a savings clause And 6 providing an effective date Parcel 60 - dent municipal electric 69 kv Spencer to Denton North interchange transmission line upgrade project councilmember Gregory Oh, sorry, yes, I'm sorry go ahead Pamela, okay? sorry Mayor City Council. Thank you Before you tonight obviously are several eminent domain ordinances that are going to give staff the authority to move forward With eminent domain proceedings to acquire the land rights necessary for these tracks and they are for the 69 kv transmission line Upon favorable motion I will go ahead and proceed through the location maps and the legal description for each one So councilman Gregory if you want to go ahead and read the motion That's member Gregory. Yes. Thank you mayor. I move that the city of didn't authorize the use of the power of em inent domain to acquire one a permanent easement acquisition encumbering 2.9 1 2 acres of real property and to a temporary construction easement Acquisition encumbering 1.1 6 0 acres of real property being generally located in the s mccracken survey abstract number 8 1 7 and All being more particularly described in exhibits a 1 and a 2 and depicting Depicted in exhibits b 1 and b 2 respectively to the ordinance now under consideration And on the overhead screen being now displayed to the audience for the DME expansion project in the city of Dent on, Texas All right. This is the location map. It's at the corner of loop 288 and Sherman This is the legal description for the electric Pamela wanted to recognize councilmember road Second were you gonna second that motion? Yeah. I'm sorry. Go ahead. Sorry. That's all right. All right This is the legal description for the electric easement. It 's 2.9 1 2 acres This is the survey for the electric easement. It's a two- page document for the 2.1 or 9 1 2 acres That's the second page runs along the loop This is the legal description for the temporary construction easement and it's 1.6. Oh acres and that's the actual survey drawing for the temporary construction easement And that's the second page so we can move on to the next item Sure, go ahead go ahead Matt is one to recognize the city attorney just for clarification with regard to The motion I heard the the movement Mentioned 2.9 1 2 acres, which is entirely accurate with regard to the property description in your backup Please note that we do need to correct section 1 of the ordinance as we discussed in the work session We did have an inverted digit that number is accurate at 2. 9 1 2 rather than and substituting what is stated there Which is 2.1 9 2 Is that couch is a friendly amendment or is that just going to be part of the ordinance? It's a friendly suggestion that okay, we'll do all right, so we have a motion in a second and let's vote on the board Motion passes unanimously We'll go on to agenda item 6b now read the caption and then turn it over to the panel and then we'll entertain the motion. Sorry about that Considered option of an ordinance one finding that a public use and necessity exists to acquire through the exercise of the right of eminent domain One permanent electric utility easement and one temporary construction easement encumbering 0.040 and 0.048 acres of land respectively The permanent electric utility easement to be used and utilized for and in connection with the expansion construction maintenance replacement augmentation and improvement of electrical transmission and distribution lines facilities structures there in the ordinance as the DME expansion project The temporary construction easement to be used and utilized for the purposes of access staging of materials and equipment construction grading activities relating to the DME expansion project the affected lands and interest being generally situated in the s McCracken survey abstract number 817 city of Denton Denton County Texas as more particularly described in exhibits a - one and a - two and depicted in exhibits B - one and B - two respectively attached to the ordinance and made a part thereof said tracks of land and all related interest to the ordinance and made a part thereof said tracks of land all related interest therein to be acquired and damages resulting therefore collectively referred to the there in the ordinance as the property interest to authorize the filing and prosecution amendment domain proceedings to acquire the property interest 3 authorizing the expenditure of funds thereof therefore excuse me for making findings 5 providing a savings clause and 6 providing an effective date and this is for partial C 7 didn't municipal electric 69 KV Spencer to Denton North interchange transmission line a great project Mr. C manager thank you I'm gonna ask Pamela England to present this item to you as well thank you all right this is the location map it's on the northwest corner of loop 28 8 and Sherman Drive and the 69 KV easement is just clipping the bottom corner of this property and upon favorable motion I will proceed to display the legal descriptions and surveys sure Councilmember Hawkins thank you mayor I move that the city of Denton Texas authorized the use of the power of em inent domain to acquire one a permanent easement acquisition encumbering 0.040 acres of real property and to a temporary construction easement acquisition acquisition encumbering 0.040 acres of real property being generally located in the s mccracken survey abstract number 817 and all being more particularly described in exhibits a one and a two and depicted in exhibits B one and B two respectively to the ordinance now under consideration and on the overhead screen being now displayed to the audience for the DME expansion expansion project in the city of Denton Texas Councilmember Rhodes thank you mayor I second we have a motion second you may proceed all right here's the legal description for the electric easement and the survey drawing for the electric easement 0.040 acres here's the legal description for the temporary construction easement and here's the survey for the temporary construction easement 0.048 acres all right if we could vote on the board All right motion carries thank you we'll go on to agenda item 6C I'll read the caption once again consider adoption of an ordinance one finding that a public use and necessity exists to acquire through the exercise of the right of em inent domain fee simple title to the surface estate with waiver of surface use related to the mineral state of a 2.493 acre track of land to be used and utilized for and in connection with the expansion construction maintenance replacement augmentation and improvements of electrical transmission and distribution lines facilities and structures there in the ordinance the DME expansion project the affected lands and interest being generally situated in the T Toby survey abstract number 128 8 city of Denton Denton County Texas is more particularly described and depicted in Exhibit A attached there to the ordinance and made a part thereof said track of land and all related interest therein to be acquired and damages resulting there from collectively referred to there in the ordinance as the property interest to authorizing the filing and prosecution of eminent domain proceedings to acquire the property interests three authorizing the expenditure of funds there up there for for making findings five providing a savings clause and six providing an effective date. This is for parcel C 13 dash didn't municipal electric 69 KV Spencer to Denton North interchange transmission line upgrade upgrade project. Mr. C. manager. Thank you Mayor. I think this is the last item from Mr. England to present tonight so Pam thank you. All right. I just want to point out that this is a fee acquisition not an easement. It is for expansion of the substation that's located along the west side of locus just south of the loop. The upon favorable motion I will proceed to display the legal descriptions and surveys for the property. Councilmember Johnson. Thank you Mayor. I move that the city of Denton Texas authorize the use of the power of em inent domain to acquire a fee title estate to 2.493 acres of real property being generally located in the T Toby survey abstract number 1288 and all being more particularly described and depicted in Exhibit A respectively to the ordinance now under consideration and on the overhead screen being now displayed to the audience for the DME expansion project in the city of Denton Texas. We have a motion in a second. We vote on the board please. Oh no no sorry she's got to play that. I show you the legal description. Thank you Mayor. We do have we handed out earlier a substituted legal description. Yes. And so may I assume that the motion would entail this substituted legal description in lieu of the one that is actually in your backup on the motion please. Yeah. And I said Councilmember yes yes and you're seconding with the substituted legal description. Yes. Thank you. Sorry you may proceed. All right. This is the legal description and this is the survey. It's 2.493 acres. Oh is that okay. That's all right. Well now we can think Galen's got one for you. Now we can vote on the board. Motion passes unanimously. I will read the caption for agenda item 6 D. Consider adoption of an ordinance one finding that a public use and necessity exists to acquire through the exercise of the right of eminent domain fee simple title to a 10.372 acre track of land to be used and utilized for and in connection with expansion construction maintenance replacement augmentation and improvement of electric transmission and distribution facilities and structures. The affected lands and the interest being generally situated in the M forest survey abstract number 417 city of Denton Denton County Texas as more particularly described in exhibit a attached there to the ordinance and made a part thereof located generally in the northwest quadrant of the intersection of Gisling Road and Black Road the property interest to authorizing the filing and prosecution of eminent domain proceedings to acquire the property interest. Three authorizing the expenditure of funds therefore for making findings five providing a savings clause and six providing an effective date. Then municipal electric Arco substation project the public utility board recommends approval six zero. Thank you. My name is our executive manager for administration with DME and he'll present this. Thank you Mr. Campbell. Thank you your honor honorable council members. Four years yet another eminent domain item and I do appreciate your time on this. The location map is displayed on the screen and upon favorable motion I'll show the legal description and the survey for the property. All right. Thank you. Councilmember Engelbrecht. Thank you mayor. I move that the city of Denton Texas authorize the use of the power of eminent domain to acquire a fee acquisition of 10.3 7 2 acres of real property being generally located in the M forest survey abstract number 4 1 7 and all being more particularly described and depicted on exhibits a and b respectively to the ordinance now under consideration and on the overhead screen being now displayed to the audience for the DME expansion project in the city of Denton Texas. Councilmember Hawkins. I second. Shown on the screen now is the legal description for the 10 .3 7 2 acres. And this drawing depicts the actual survey of the 10.3 7 2 acres. All right. Thank you. We have a motion to second. Let's vote on the board. Motion carries unanimously. Thank you. Thank you. At this time we'll move on to agenda item 7 which is items for individual consideration and under agenda item 7 we have agenda item 7 a which is received certification of an initiative petition regarding the banning of hydraulic fracturing in the city of Denton from the city secretary and give staff direction. Thank you mayor. Our city secretary Jennifer Walker is going to address this item. Thank you mayor and council on May 7 2014 members of a committee of petitioners submitted an initiative petition regarding the banning of hydraulic fracturing in the city of Denton. The required elements of the petition have been reviewed found to be sufficient and is hereby certified to be in compliance with the provisions of the city charter. Thank you. Thank you madam city secretary. I would request the madam city attorney just to sort of give an update on the next steps. Certainly mayor glad to address that with the certification of this petition. Certain requirements of our city charter do come into play and also certain deadlines that are resident in our city charter also come into play. Our charter does provide that 60 days from today's date the council will be required to give final consideration to this initiative ordinance and to take action as it concerns the ordinance. I believe that there are a couple of possibilities that the council can consider. I might also add that the charter does require that a public hearing be had upon final consideration so the staff will move forward with the publication of this public hearing and set some time on an upcoming agenda within this 60 day period for the council's consideration of this initiative ordinance. Currently we are looking likely at the date of July the 15 th as being within that specified 60 day period. So this item will be coming forward for your consideration to enact the ordinance as presented by the petitioners or in the alternative to call an election with regard to this matter and put the issue before the voters here in the city of Denton. Thank you. So there's no action required on this item today. No sir. None at this time. All right. Thank you. Then we'll move on to agenda item 7b consider appointments to council committees city managers. Thank you mayor. The city secretary is going to address this item for you as well. Thank you. Thank you mayor and council. During the work session we reviewed your proposed city council committee assignments. Those have been revised in our at your spots up at your des ks and if you would like I could go through them all or you can just approve them as presented. Council member Gregory. I don't think it's necessary to go through them unless council members have found a mistake or need a correction. And if I don't see any of them I'm going to move approval as of the list as submitted by our city secretary. Council member Rodin. Second that. All right. Let's vote on the board please. Are there any Mr. Engelberg. Council member Engelberg. Yes. I just wanted to ask the city secretary I'm assuming this will become a part of the minutes. OK. So the public has a way to go back and look this over because it's not on tape. Mr. Mayor Pro Tem I apologize for not recognizing you as mayor pro Tem because you are now mayor pro Tem now. Accepted. Yes. Yes. Let's vote on the board. Motion carries unanimously. Thank you. We'll move on to public hearings agenda item 8A. Hold a public hearing consider adoption of an ordinance of the city of Denton Texas providing for zoning change from a downtown residential to DR2 zoning district classification use designation to a downtown commercial general DCG zoning district classification and use designation on approximately 0.184 acres located on the south side of West Oak Street approximately 104 feet west of the intersection of West Oak Street and Avenue B in the city of Denton. Thank you. Thank you mayor. This is the first of three public hearings tonight. I'm going to ask Mr. Brian Lockley who is our director of planning and administration to present this zoning case. Thank you city manager mayor members of the city council the item before you are this zoning request is for CVS pharmacy. Again it's for request to rezone the subject property from DR2 to DCG classification and use designation. The subject property is shown here is located on the south side of West Oak Street generally west of the intersection of West Oak Street and Avenue B. The current zoning of the side is shown here is DR2. As you can see immediately east of the site is a large sw ath of DCG as well as to the south is DCG. Here's just a expanded view of that zoning and how it relates to some of the surrounding properties immediately west of the property as a largely residential area multi- family to the east. On the other side of Avenue B those properties are part of the Fry Street overlay district. The future land use map for this area and the surrounding areas at downtown University core. The didn't plan notes that that is specified as commercial areas of the downtown core. The place is a great that has places of great vitality with a mix of educational residential retail office service government cultural and entertainment development. This is the proposed site plan that really shows the location of that area here and if I can just highlight it for you here with my cursor. This is the area that's in question here. The rezoning is to allow for this property the CVS to take access from this location here. This will be a right hand only. There is a laundromat here that I do believe this for sale that was property will ultimately be redeveloped at some point in time and then here to the west as a multi-family development here. The CVS was going to occupy the hard corner here at Avenue B and Hickory Street. It has a corner orientation with access also here to the north. Although this is unrelated to the zoning it's important to make those comments because the reason for the rezoning here is for the applicant to meet all of the requirements for development of this site. This will allow the applicant to meet the open space requirement as well as some parking for this general location here. So without this access, not the access but without this property here, then the applicant does not meet all of the open space and some of the other code requirements pursuant to the code that allows for that development. I would also note that during the review of this by staff and by the Planning and Zoning Commission there was a lot of conversation related to the pedestrian oriented nature of this area. Although this is not designated as pedestrian oriented it is adjacent to the Fry Street Overlay District and the University of North Texas. There is a lot of pedestrian activity so despite the fact that it doesn't carry that designation the fact of the matter is that it is in a largely pedestrian area. So although that was one of the considerations the staff really factored into this review for the CVS and the access it ultimately boiled down to the ability to develop the site and whether or not these requirements could be met without this rezoning and what alternatives staff could develop with the applicant to allow for the landscaping here, parking as well as the buffering and the mitigation that would be required. These are just some site photos that show the property. This is the laundromat here. This is the area here just to the right on this photo that shows the location of that access point. This is the multifamily on the other side west of the property. This is just a comparison of the development DR2 and DCG was what's being proposed on some of the on this property here. Now this is important also to note because the site plan that I that I just provided is not a part of this rezoning request. Okay, there is no guarantee that that's what's going to be developed. Obviously, rezoning are independent of development. So although this is what although this is the plan that has been submitted. There is not a requirement by the city that the property developed in the manner that it is shown. I do just want to make that clear and that's why this district comparison is important to illustrate retail sales . Obviously, it was permitted movie theaters, SUV restaurants are permitted drive through facilities and so on are also permitted. These are some of the other uses in the DCG that would also be permitted. They're not currently permitted or otherwise are restricted via SUV in the DR2. And then these are the industrial which are largely not permitted except for veterinary clinics, which are permitted and limited here wholesale sales and nurseries as well as veterinary clinics. Some of the institutional uses that are permitted are shown here and not permitted. And these down here also permitted per suant to this zone district classification. So with that understanding and that review and analysis by staff and the and the review by the planning and zoning commission. Staff found that the proposed rezoning does conform to the future line use element of the didn't plan and it does provide for adequate provisions of transportation, water, sewer schools and other public requirements and public convenience. A notification was sent out. 14 were sent to 200 foot properties, 56 to 500 foot properties within that radius staff is did not receive any. At the time of this preparation for this meeting. As a result, the planning zoning commission did recommend approval of this request unanimously in the development review review committee also recommended approval of this request. So that concludes my presentation and I'll stand for any questions. Councilmember Gregory. Thank you, Mayor. Understanding that this site plan is not necessarily the final thing. I'm just curious about a couple of things on it. Where the doors were to be how do people get into the building. There's a door here, right in front of the handicapped parking, and then there's a corner orientation here that is also a door. Okay, and generally speaking CVS pharmacies have drive through drive throughs for the for the pharmacies. Yes. Does this. It does not. It does not. It does not. Thank you. Councilmember wrote. Thank you, Mayor. Yeah, Brian, I want to just, first of all, applaud your, your staff on working with them on the orientation of this that corner is important. Yes, make it pedestrian friendly. You know, as much as I love Sukho tie. And I used to go there all the time in college, you can get this 99 cent entrees and I think a lot of people are mourning the loss of that cheap tie. There is something nice about having a pharmacy if you're trying to get more walkability for folks who live there who don't need to get in their cars to just get basic essentials so you know there's some benefits to this project I do want to rewind a bit. Because I was following it a bit through the planning and zoning commission. Yes, and there was a point the last time I think they heard it. They were hearing a hardship application relating to some of the entries into this property, can you back and I know the staff recommended against it. Yes, they voted for it. Can you tell us what it was that was being asked at that time what you were against. And what's changed since then. What was asked that the request was for a hardship variance to allow for this to be an access point that did not meet the spacing requirements for the access here to the apartment complex into the existing accesses to the laundry dry cleaners located here. There was staff's belief and understanding of the site plan that because access was provided here. As well as this access here which was a left in and a right out here on the south side of this property that that was adequate to provide access to this pharmacy here. Again, we 're trying to think into the future and looking at it from a redevelopment perspective. And from that standpoint, understanding that this laundrom at would possibly be redeveloped in the future. To, to, and I'm just going to speak for myself personally at this point . I felt it may have been more conducive for this laundromat to take on this piece of property to make it maybe more pal atable as a redevelopment project in the future than just an access point here for the CVS. The planning is only commission. They looked at it. And, you know, because they weren't unable, unable to meet some of the landscaping requirements per the development code. They agreed that they thought that the access point was okay. So the hardship as presented by the applicant was we can't meet the landscaping requirements. So therefore we need a new. Well, they wanted that they wanted to provide a third point of access here that was their request. And one of the issues that we talked about was, okay, well, how are we going to meet all of the other requirements, given this, given the size of this building and one of the issues that we talked about was just limiting this access to a left in only and then providing the rest of this area as pedestrian you can see a sidewalk in here, as well as. Landscaping and trees and it's a buffer. And so does the planning department continue to have concerns about that additional curb cut into the into the property. At this point I feel like we've been able to mitigate it as best we can, as best we can. With the development, you know, we'll look at the laundry facility when that comes in and see how we can manage the redevelopment of that side and ultimately, you know, the property to the west if if they so choose, but at this point we're comfortable with the plan that's before you. And this is probably the second if not the first I mean we have to do some pedestrian counts of the most walked area of our town. And so, and when as we're getting redevelop ment into there to make sure that the values that we have for walkability are reflected in our new development is so crucial. Yes, because it's going to be there for 3040 years, and you can't go back. No. And so, I guess my question then relating to this is, as a condition of approving the zoning . Can we take away what planning and zoning allowed for in that hardship variance decision by restricting access into that parcel. This request is simply for a rezoning that relates to the land use itself the access pursuant to the code for them to have this as a left in is a was a separate requirement for the code that goes to PNC for their review and their approval. I'm not. I don't perhaps that's a legal question. Yeah, whether what if there was an interest in that could we. Yes, the question Brian would be, could the council apply some sort of overlay to affect what the Councilman is artic ulating. I guess that would be the question on that that would be the question but as I understand the limitations of the overlay restrictions. And then, I guess I would need to understand more what what you're considering, as far as the limitation of this being a lefty and only and causing it to remain that way into the future but as far as we're concerned, if this property does not develop, I think that that's what I was thinking more in terms of because if this property doesn't. We have all of these provisions in place, if someone were to. Yes was not to develop on this site and someone else were to come in. I think from a staff perspective we would move to bring this back to undo this the rezoning and the var iances and the different things that have already been done. And I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. 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I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. I think that's what we're considering. So you're pretty sure there's not going to be a drive- through there? I'm as comfortable as I can be at this point. Thank you. Okay. Council Member Johnson. Thank you, Mayor. Brian, do you know if CVS Pharmacy owns the property at this point? I believe they're waiting. I don't know if they've closed on it. They do? Yes, they do own it. Thank you. Mayor Pro Tem Engelbrecht. Thank you, Mayor. I know there was some -- it's my understanding there was some discussion with staff about the fact that laundry site , that corner site that's left is going to be awfully small and therefore somewhat difficult to develop. Sort of the problem we had with the old fire station that sat between what was there before. Couldn't find anybody to develop it because there's no parking, there's no anything. There's a building and a little bit of ground. And if that parcel that they want to put a driveway into was not rezoned, did it potentially then be acquired to combine with that corner property and make it a decent size redevelopment property, as I understand it? Is that -- that's kind of what the staff was thinking earlier on? That's what I mentioned and as I stated, that was what I considered in my review in looking at this, that that might have been more appropriate for that laundry facility there. But that's not one of the -- that was more or less after those discussions had been initiated. Do you know -- did CVS acquire this little parcel or the developer, whoever that is, after the other parcel or did it all occur at one time? Do you know? Yeah, it all occurred at one time. Okay. Staffs understand. So the other parcel was rezoned, it was just this one that was not -- or the others was zoned properly. You just had to bring this one into control. Just bring that small piece in. Well, the argument I saw here was the fact that they needed more landscaping. Yes. That the alternative would be to make an exception to the landscape requirement and not allow the driveway. Would that not be -- That's an alternative, yes. And just leave it as a parcel sitting there. They couldn't use it if it wasn't rezoned. They could not, yes. Okay. Is there a representative from the applicant here this evening? Yes. Okay. Is there going to speak? Yes. All right. Okay. Thank you. Any other -- see no other request to speak? I think that will do it. Thank you, Brian. We'll call you back up if we have any questions. We will now open the public hearing. And this is a public hearing, so we have two cards, but you don't have to have a card to speak at a public hearing. But we will call the two cards down. Chase Helm and -- well, I apologize. Is it William -- Scazzaro. Scazzaro. Yes, sir. Please come down to the mic so we can -- yeah, come on. And if you would, state your name and address, please. William Scazzaro, SCAZZERO, 5948 Melanie Drive, Fort Worth, Texas, 76131. All right. I'm part of the law firm that represents the property owner . Just here to introduce Mr. Helm, who is the expert on behalf of the applicant. My name is Chase Helm. I'm with Winkleman Associates. I'm here on behalf of CVS Pharmacy, 6750 Hillcrest Plaza Drive, Dallas, Texas. All right. Any questions for the applicants? Councilmember Rodin. Thank you, Mayor. Thanks for coming out here tonight, talking about this. I guess I'll ask some similar questions about that kind of additional drive-through and kind of what you're thinking and what you're needing. Again, hearing some of the concerns we have about kind of the walkable landscape, streetscape, I guess you have along Oak Street, and wanting to keep down on the number of curb cuts as pedestrians and bicyclists are heading down there frequently. What were you thinking in needing that versus just retaining what you have on Avenue B versus on Oak Street? Well, the main concern from CVS was if you're coming down Oak Street, since it's one way, by the time you reach Avenue B, there's a good chance you're not even going to see the CVS in time to make the turn, or you're going to have to cut across real quick and try to make it. We believe by having the curb cut there, and it left and only creates a safer atmosphere and also prevents people from passing up Avenue B and then having to go all the way around the block to come back up Hickory and then eventually get back in, or if not, go somewhere else. And there are some questions about how secure the site plan is leading into the future. What can you speak to about that? We've submitted everything to city civil plans, building plans. We've gone through -- I think we're on our second round of comments today. So basically they're, like you said, pretty much about as final as you can get without the approvals. Okay. Thanks. Any other questions? I have one. This seems like deja vu to me. I mean, whether it's a drive-through driveway, it doesn't -- so is it my understanding that that driveway off of Oak Street, the left only turn, is that an absolute necessity for you guys? Yes. As well as I'm aware. Okay. All right. That was the only question I had. Anybody else have any more questions? Councilmember Johnson. Thank you, Mayor. As we talk about the walkability of this area, which there are tons of students moving, much of the pedestrian traffic that I've seen here seems to be from the campus going northbound. So, you know, as I'm looking at this, I don't know how I feel about multiple driveways, but as I'm looking at the site plan, it seems to me that westbound traffic on Oak to get to the CVS, assuming they know where it is, will turn left onto Avenue B, make another right turn in, which to me seems like that's where most of the students would be walking. If they're leaving campus, going to housing to the north, logically they're going to be walking down sidewalks next to streets. So a thought comes to mind that the left turn in off of Oak could in fact reduce danger to pedestrians by having folks go past the intersection, turn left into the driveway and in, versus making a turn and then another turn. It seems to me like Avenue B is logically where most of the pedestrian traffic would be, at least that's what I see when I drive around there. So just a thought and I guess if I have to frame it as a question, was that your thinking? Not exactly, no, that's not exactly what we were thinking, but that is a good point, because especially when we've been over there on the site, Avenue B is the heavily traveled pedestrian corridor. I do have one other question because it's been asked a couple of times of staff and so we'll ask you as the applicant. Is there an intention to have a drive through associated with this pharmacy? No, there's not. I know we had issues in the past with another one and we went through CVS and they said this is fine without a drive through. And I believe in this zone we also do need a specific use permit to allow for a drive through. Okay, so if it does, we would come back here again for that . All right, all right. Mayor Pro Tem Engelbrecht. Thank you Mayor. You made provisions for bike racks. Yes, we do have several bike racks if you look just to the east of the handicapped spots. I can't tell from the size of this thing I got on mine either, so great. Thank you. Are there any other questions? Seeing none. Thank you gentlemen. Thank you. And this is a public hearing. We have no more blue cards, but if anyone wishes to speak on this item, please come down and state your name and address. Anybody wishing to speak? Mayor Pro Tem Engelbrecht. Thank you Mayor. I did have a question for staff. If you want to wait until we close the meeting, close the hearing, it's fine. Seeing no one else to speak on this, I will now close the public hearing. And Mayor Pro Tem Engelbrecht. Thank you Mayor. Brian, I know one of the concerns we've had for years on a number of our major throughways was trying to minimize curb cuts so that we maximize the flow of traffic. That's always, for years we've closed up these long open curb areas because people are always much slower. Everything slows down. Nobody knows who's turning in or turning out. It seems to me that if the current facility, although it's vacant, it's going to have a curb cut there somewhere. It's going to be a loud one, I would assume, on Oak Street. Then we have this one. Then there's a curb cut immediately past that for the apartment complex. I'd like your professional opinion on the effect of that on the traffic flow and on the safety of pedestrians and bicy clists. I know the argument's been made that it should cut it down on Avenue B, but what does that do for those two items on Oak Street? Well, let me -- And the legality, by the way, of our standard for the distance between curb cuts. Okay. To your first comment, yes, it has been our practice to close curb cuts on redevelopment projects that do not meet our current spacing requirements. In the past, what we've done is we've moved to allow projects that redevelopment access where they're appropriate, and then we examine the location of those existing curb cuts that may be better suited to be closed off to allow for that free flow of pedestrian traffic. In this instance, obviously, this has been a site that has been undeveloped, and this wasn't existing. It wasn't an existing curb cut that was there. We did have an opportunity to close that, and the location of this curb cut does not meet our current spacing requirements. However, that doesn't -- and what that does is it actually just disrupts the pedestrian flow as cars exit in and out of these different locations. You know, it's just not a complete or smooth transition for pedestrians to gain access or, I'm sorry, to move east and west on Oak Street. It doesn't make for an impossible, I guess, route, but it just makes it -- you know, you just need to be more aware of what's going on around you. So in the instance or the development of the laundry facility here on the corner, what we will do at the time that that property is redevelop ed is examine the location of those existing curb cuts, what's being proposed, and determine what's the best location for the curb cuts to minimize or to improve the amount of safety that's over there as best we can. I mean, obviously, we want to provide some form of access to the property to make it viable, but we also want to consider how can we reduce, shrink down those curb cuts, because some of them are very wide. I mean, some of them are two and three cars wide. You know, what we want to do is shrink them down. That minimizes them, improves the flow of traffic, veh icular as well as pedestrian, and just try to improve it the best we can. You know, it's balancing out that need to redevelop the site, make it viable with also all of the amenities that go along with it for the pedestrian and for the vehicle. So are all these curb cuts as they stand now, is that within our current code, being that close together? I would say no. No. A lot of these properties developed years and years ago before our current code was even adopted. So we're dealing with properties that have, you know, that it's time for them to redevelop. In this case, was there was a curb cut existing? Yes, sir. In this parcel prior? Yes, there was. And so basically we're just going to go ahead and allow that to continue as opposed to taking the opportunity to make it safer, if you will, for pedestrians and bicycles. That was the recommendation of the-- That was the thinking. Yeah, that was-- Okay. Thank you. Councilmember Rhoade? Thank you, Mayor. I'm still, you know, this is our probably the second most urban area we have in town, Square. Downtown. What's happening around the Fry Street area. It's arguably a cultural district in its own right. And I really, again, I appreciate the orientation of where this is on the site. I almost wish that whole-- some level I wish the parking requirements weren't such that it required just this huge sea of parking that backs it up so far so that the corresponding Avenue B and Oak side could have more room. I mean, this is where we want to put density. And so be that as it may, we're stuck with at least the parking as it is. But adding this additional drive-in area, I don't know. I'm just not sure it conforms with the values of what we're trying to do in this pretty precious area that we could have some really cool redevelopment. And so I don't know if that's a question there. I mean, it's just kind of my novice planning mind reaching out to your expert planning mind. That was one of the challenges that we considered and evaluating not only the rezoning requests, but also the variance. And, you know, this isn't the only request or variance that we've reviewed. We review a number of them, and those are several items that we have to weigh on whether or not to close this access point, provide access from this location, you know, the economic benefits of this redevelopment and so on. So it's a delicate balancing act. And moving forward, I guess thinking a bit beyond this, but while we have this in front of us, the requirements in the downtown area that have different parking requirements are due to an overlay district that they're in, correct? Or is it a zoning category? If you're in the central business district, you're only required to provide the parking that was already in existence. Right. And that only applies to that particular area? That's correct, yes. Would there ever be any wisdom in moving that into areas that you see become more and more urban, so to speak, and more likely that a good bulk of folks going to that CVS are going to be on foot coming from the university or nearby apartments? It is, and it's going to be -- and as I consider your questions and questions from the other council members, if we look at the area or survey the area that's inside the loop and all of the redevelopment opportunities in there, parking access, those are some of the issues that we've actually just -- we've actually been examining and been discussing with a lot of the developers, development community, with our consultant that's working on our rewrite. And so putting that information together to better understand what is -- what caused these properties to develop and be viable in a manner that will also allow for that pedestrian activity, vehicular traffic to continue is really what -- really been the basis of all of those different discussions. Councilmember Johnson. Thank you, Mayor. In some cities, Brian, as you know, when you've got either a green field site or redevelopment site, you're not really sure what's going to happen next door, what can be requested of the applicant in the event that the curb cut is really necessary for their business. Would be that they agree to allow the adjacent property to have shared access of the drive. Yes. And as we've been talking, we're talking about the dry cleaner, which is clearly a redevelopment site at some point. It'll get bought. I don't know that it's operational anymore. If, you know, if it was your professional opinion that -- or Council's opinion that we just couldn't live with this drive because there's a drive next to it and another drive next to it, not knowing what's going to happen on the corner, but looks to me like the existing curb cut at the dry cleaner is probably -- that doesn't even meet our distance requirement from the intersection. That's right. Would it be reasonable to ask of the applicant if that was what it took to get the curb cut that they would agree to a shared access in the future for the dry cleaner? Which then it would make it obviously look a little bit different, right, because you've got a left end only and you don't have a left out. That's true. It's a left end only and you can't get out that way. That's right. It would necessitate some modification to the curb cut itself, but it might be a way to find a middle ground if it was, you know, Council's decision. So do you think that would be -- have we done that here? I'm new to this up here. We have done that. Again, this is a rezoning request. This isn't the proper venue to make that type of a request because we're only looking at the land use here. If this property or the laundromat, that would be a separate agreement that would have to be entered into by the applicant and the laundry facility itself when that property came in to redevelop. That's not something that we would -- that we could condition based on a rezoning application. Okay. That absolutely makes sense from a planning perspective to have that joint access, but how we go about doing it at this point in time when the laundry facility is not ready to develop or there isn't any even activity planned for that site. Sure. I think what I'm getting at is not a requirement that it be made done because we are talking about zoning, but it sounds to me like the questions that are coming are, okay, they already own it, right? So if it's zoned, that's what they're going to want to do. Sure. Or it's going to be trees or something or they'll sell it or whatever. But if what we're talking about is the driveway, I guess I 'm thinking about a potential solution that might help us get comfortable with the drive. They're not asking for the driveway today, but they're asking for the zoning that would then indicate they'd want the driveway, right? That would allow for the drive. Right. So it's just a thought. I don't think that we would -- I guess that's -- I'm asking a question of you there. Yes. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. >> I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. I'm asking a question of you there. >> How many are we removing? There's three that are a part of this planned development. I don't know how many existed. Do you know how many existed? No? How many existed prior to? >> We removed one from the corner. We removed one from the corner. Then the restaurant that occupied the corner, there was one on this side and two. So it looks like they replaced one. We're getting rid of one. And then we located -- relocated another one. So I would say we're still -- we removed one or possibly two access points. >> Okay. And I know this area quite well. I'm just wondering, you know, if you're going to be able to get to the west, on that apartment complex, how much curb cut is there, their percentage of the curb? Do you have the aerial on that? >> This is the access here to the apartment. >> And they have front-end driving as well, front-end parking, which means that for the next 200 foot pass there, there is about 75% of that curb is not there, which in turn has caused pedestrians to automatically walk on the other side of the street. >> Yes. >> Has been my recollection of what happens in that area. >> Let's see if I can pull this overhead. >> Okay. >> Here's Hickory Street. Here's Avenue B. Oak Street, just to orient you, this is the hard corner. And this is the corner of the CVS that's going to locate here. So we've got access -- we've got access here. Looks like we've had access here. This is access into the fire station here. Then you have the access here. You have the one here. You have the one to the left of the street. You have the one to the right of the street. And then you have access to the one to the left of the street. And then you have access to the one to the left of the street. And then you have access to the one to the right of the street. And then you have access to the one to the left of the street. And then you have access to the one to the right of the street. And then you have access to the one to the left of the street. So not counting the two that still exist at the laundry facility on the corner here. Those two are still in play. Okay, so we're taking it from six on their side down to three. To three on their side, yes. Okay. Do you have the -- I don't know if the aerial view is how close in it is on the original presentation. I can pull an aerial if you want to see a -- Let me go back to the aerial. Okay, just to orient you again, this is Avenue B. Here's Oak Street. Here's Hickory Street here. This is the apartment complex right here. This is the access that's being proposed right here. This is one access point here. And here's the other one on the other side of the apartment complex there. But it's also pull-in parking all the way across the front of that apartment complex. That is correct, yes. So that has naturally caused people to walk on the other side in the past. So that's the path. For comfort and safety, yes. Yes. In the absence of the mayor, I'm going to continue the hearing. And I have a question. I had my own name up on the board. Right, I'll call myself. With regard to Mr. Johnson's point that he raised, is there any reason why we can't make that a condition of the zoning ? That that be literally just put on their condition that that's a dual access? That it can be in the future used as a dual access for that other property? I would -- my initial thought is to say no. But I would defer to our legal counsel on that. And the reason being, I absolutely agree with the rationale for the joint access. But again, because this is a zoning request that's only dealing with land use and how the property is going to be used, the access is really a function that we would obtain during the planning or subdividing of the property or the general layout. And I think that's the reason why we don't have a site plan process per se in the city that we look at the access, we look at the layout of the site, the circulation and all of those. That's just all part of our building permit process. So it's not a separate -- it's not an approval that occurs prior to a building permit moving for approval to the building department. I generally am in agreement with the analysis. I caught the eye of the applicant. I don't think that that's something they're particularly interested in. But I agree with your analysis. This is a zoning case and forcing the agreement of the adjacent property owner is probably outside the scope. Then I don't see any other -- I want to follow up with that because it seems to me that I have -- I don't know what that is, but interesting. It's your fingerprints, huh? Oh, no, not mine. Somebody else's. It is a land use issue. Yes. And we have zoned other properties, I'm almost sure, in various areas where we've had these joint small properties. And part of the issue there was that you would allow access from one property to the next so that folks didn't have to go back out on the street. That's correct. And I don't see what the difference is here. You're allowing an access within one person's property to another, and we've done that before. We absolutely have. And it's a land use issue, which goes with zoning, does it not? It goes with zoning in the sense that a property is going to be developed, not in the sense that a property is going to be rezoned from one land use to another. Typically when we require cross access, shared parking, or the like, we look at it during the planning process or during the initial development phase of the process when we have an application that's coming in where we can partner or pair two developers together so that they can better collaborate on a better overall project. Because the CVS is being developed today, and we don't know how soon the laundromat or that corner may develop. That's an issue that we would have to broach with the owner of the laundromat to ask them to approach the CVS and ask if they could obtain a joint access utilizing this existing one here on the west side, the one that's proposed here. But to condition it, to condition this zoning, typically we do that via an overlay and that's to mitigate any impacts on the proposal, any impacts from the proposal use on the adjacent properties. This isn't a situation where we've got impacts that we're trying to mitigate on an adjacent property because of traffic or some other issue that we've got to manage better via this rezoning. It's a little separate. I understand where you're going and I absolutely agree with it. This is just not the correct venue to do that. I want to ask one more question then. This is, we're trying to make this primarily a pedestrian area, other than flow through traffic. I mean, there's a lot of pedestrian issues here. How many, is it good planning practice in a high pedestrian area to have three egress areas for one business? I mean, is that very standard? It seems to me that that's way out of the norm. You just don't see that very often. We do see it very often, but it may be the exception in some instances, but you can make the argument that it may be appropriate in others, depending upon the circumstances and the intensity of the development. Okay. Thank you. Councilmember Rodin. Yeah, I guess we're searching for tools that don't exist. And for some, I guess the procedure of the hardship variance goes through P&Z and stops with them. And so there's no opportunity for a council who thinks that 's outside the values that we have for this area to go back and fix what they might think might have been arguably an errant decision by another body. And so we don't have that tool. And it's just, it's unfortunate that the only tool we have to prevent a problematic part to what is otherwise a good development project is to just deny the zoning request, which might have the same effect. But that's a heavy-handed approach because the zoning from a particular perspective isn't problematic in terms of the zoning. It's just we all know what's going to be done with that, and there's a question as to whether or not that's the best use of that corner or that spot and whether or not it's good to have another third thing. So I guess as we look into the future of this, I don't know what we can learn from this sort of thing, but I think we lack, at this level, as it's coming to us right now after these decisions have been made, we lack the tools to kind of get the quality development that we think that area deserves, and we just need to learn from that. Got a question. And I think it goes back to, and I understand Councilmember Rhodes' frustration, but I'm not so sure that, I mean, one of the next agenda items we're looking at is a rezoning of, I believe it's some residential land. One of those things is we put, you know, planning zoning has advised for some restrictions, plans, and I'm not so sure, and I guess I've never heard a definitive answer to, okay, this is a rezoning case. So if someone were to make a motion to rezone this property , I'm not saying I'm going to do it or whoever's going to, but I'm just, I'm not so sure that I'm willing to just accept that if we, if someone who didn't like this plan with that third driveway off of Oak Street, and I also want to just point out, my screen isn't working. When I put it on screen, I don't get what's up here, so I 've been having to try to see that. But, so if someone were to make a motion, and I'm not making a motion, this is hypothetical, make a motion for rezoning with a condition that the only points of ingress e gress are the one off of, I'm assuming that's Hickory, and I'm assuming the other one's off Avenue B, is that not a valid exercise of our powers to do that within a zoning case? >> You've referenced the next item, and I'm not going to get into it because we haven't called it up too much. >> Sure. >> But there's a difference in the types of cases. This other one is an overlay condition that would relate to notification on the site itself. So it's just, it simply continues to be related to a zoning use of property, i.e. the gas well on the site itself. So that would distinguish itself from the overlay condition that would force the applicant to share a driveway with another property owner. >> No, I'm not so sure, I didn't mean to share a driveway, I meant if there was something to say eliminate it, if there was a condition to eliminate it, is that not something that council can do within its? >> Eliminate the curb cut, I guess is the question. >> Yes. >> Is a condition of zoning. >> Yes. >> Well, back to Councilman Rhoads comment, I think that the appropriate, and this is just a suggestion of mine, is that given the sentiment of council and the desire to have, to limit the access, if council saw fit to maybe the table, so that way we could determine or see the level of interest by the applicant. I haven't discussed this with the applicant, I don't know what their interest is in doing this, but if we were to do that, that allowed us to go back and look at this access point and determine what other options were available that they were amenable to, then we could enter into some other type of arrangement, and then bring that back to illustrate for the council how we've addressed this issue separate and apart from the rez oning. >> And I appreciate that. I guess we don't have to answer it tonight, but I still would like an answer to the question of do we have within our powers as city council with this type of situation, if we were to say we would make a motion to approve the zoning with the condition that the third left turn only drive from Oak Street into the site be eliminated, that it not be there. That's really all I was asking is do we have the ability to do that. Now if you want to go back and, but I'll say that and I'll recognize from other council members, that was my question. Council Member Gregory. >> Thank you, Mayor. Are we still in hearing or are we-- >> No, the public hearing has been closed. >> Okay. I'm confused. I completely understand what we are moving, what we are trying to achieve. But Council Member Ryan has, I think, helped with his question, put it in perspective a little bit, in that at this particular location, we are moving, according to this plan, we are moving from, I believe, six curb cuts down to three. So we are moving in the right direction. And I like that. I would like it even better if we could move it to two by eliminating the one on Oak Street. And if a motion to postp one to give staff time to work with the applicant a little more time to come up with an alternative, I think that we could take what is an improvement and make it even a better improvement. That's my observation. >> Mayor Pro Tem Ingebrecht. >> Well, Mayor, I'm ready to make a motion if there's no one else on the board. >> I see none. >> All right. Well, I appreciated the idea that Council Member Johnson brought forward. And it makes sense in terms of, yeah, we want to develop this property, but we also have another property to consider that needs to be developed, too. And so I would make a motion that we postpone this to a date certain that we can determine here whatever that needs to be and direct staff to have a discussion with the applicant to look at making this a cross -- what is that term? >> Cross access. >> Yeah, cross access issue. Recognizing that we may have to give up a little bit on the -- >> Landscape. >> On the landscaping, understand it, understandable. But we get another curb cut clear. We have a greater chance, I think, of utilizing that other corner. And if that corner is utilized, that brings more traffic, in my opinion, to CV S as well. So I see this as potentially a win for everybody. So there 's my motion. And I don't know what date do we -- do we have some idea? I know that we don't want to hold the applicant up too long, but we've got to have time for discussion. >> Well, the next, Mayor Pro Tem, it looks like the next meeting date is June 17th, and then after that is July 15th . >> So I'll go with June 17th, and in the hopes that it's done, we could always postpone it again if it didn't get done or -- >> Okay, so motion is to postpone to date, sir, June 17th council meeting? >> Yes. >> Councilmember Rodin. >> Second, Pat. >> We have a motion on the board. Please vote on the board. Oh, was there something? Sure. I'm sorry. I didn't see Councilmember Johnson had posed a question. So we will postpone the vote until his comment. >> It's just a point of clarification. The idea that I was sharing was a shared access, not a cross access, into the driveway. So the idea would be a larger curb cut, a larger shared curb cut that would allow for left in and left out onto Oak. >> Okay. I just want to make sure -- because we do have cross access that's interior on properties. I wasn't recommending that. I was recommending a shared access. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> And that's a good question, and if I could just have maybe some clarity on the motion. Is the motion to postpone to date certain to explore all options? >> There you go. >> Okay. And is that your second? >> Yes, it is. >> Okay. All right. Now we can vote on the board, please. Motion passes unanimously. Thank you. Thank you, Brian. All right. We'll move on to agenda item 8B. Hold a public hearing and consider adoption of an ordinance approving a rezoning of 2.98 acres from neighborhood residential mixed use NRMU zoning district to the neighborhood residential mixed use 12, NRMU 12 zoning district with a mixed use residential protection overlay. >> Thank you, Mayor. Our Director of Planning and Administration is also going to present this public hearing . Thank you, Brian. >> Thank you, sir. Again, as the request was read into the record, this is to consider adoption of an ordinance appro ving a rezoning of a property off of Teasley. Just by way of background, this property is part of a larger track of land with split zoning. The applicant is requesting to rezone the property at NRMU 12 to construct single family detached homes and/or town homes. And this would allow for this development to continue and connect with the button track, which was a previous rez oning that was also considered by the City Council. The property in question this evening is highlighted here in red. Just to give you some orientation, this is Teasley Road here. This is a sundown ranch subdivision. This is LA Nelson Elementary School. This is the corner of Ryan here. This is the Valero Gas Station. And this is an existing mobile home park that's currently being vacated for development. The future land use plan of this area calls for existing land uses, and that basically states that within established residential areas, new development should respond to existing development with compatible land uses, patterns, and designs. The current zoning is shown here is NRMU, as is most of that property that I just highlighted. Just to the east, that property is on NR4. And then to the west, there's a combination of NR2, NR3, and NR4 properties. The proposed zoning is for NRMU 12 with conditions, and that's in the form of an overlay, that's shown here. Again, this is the property. If it were approved by you, it would take on this NRMU 12 zoning that would also mirror this property here and be developed. And this is just to show the properties, the meets and bounds description of how much of that property is zoned. This is the emergency tower that's out there, if you're familiar with that area at all. This is the mobile home park that's currently being vacated. These are just some site photos of the property. I believe this is from Ranchman Boulevard from the Sundown Ranch subdivision. This is Teasley, and this will just connect through this subdivision here. This is some more photos looking west from Sundown Ranch subdivision in the drainage area over there. This is the emergency tower. That property is somewhat elevated up on, somewhat of a hill. If you travel down Teasley at all, it's heavily treed here along the frontage, and most of that development will occur in this general area. These are some photos that look at the Sundown Ranch subdiv ision off of Ranchman. And again, this is the mobile home park that's to the house . It's again being vacated to allow for future development here. Most of those mobile homes, I believe, that were located here are being relocated, if not moved entirely to the mobile home park just south of Teasley and Ryan on the south side of the elementary school. So just per the zoning analysis, the NRMU does not allow single-family dwelling, and that's really what's driving the NRMU-12, which does allow for single-family homes. These are just some of the other commercial uses that are permitted or limited by these two zone districts. The other half of that zoning request is the elderly housing component that's also proposed as part of this development that's going to remain as NRMU and not move to NRMU-12. So again, elderly housing is a permitted use, limited in the NRMU-12. There are some gas wells. Let me back up just for a moment here, just so I can illustrate that for you. This is the location here for the elderly housing that is a permitted use, and then the single-family would be located in this area here. There are some gas wells located adjacent to this property. These are shown here. One is approximately 785 feet, and the other is about 1,400 feet from this proposed rezoning and future development for single-family and elderly housing. And pursuant to the development code that lists the criteria for the approval, this rezoning does conform to the future land use element. The proposed rezoning does facilitate the provisions for transportation and other public convenience. Now, the overlay conditions that are being proposed as part of this request are consistent with the overlay conditions that have also been a part of the rezoning for the surrounding properties as they relate to the existence of those gas wells. That's for the notification of the gas wells to potential buyers, as well as for subsequent buyers and not just the first homeowner. And these are that the developer or successor shall notify the purchaser of the existence of the gas well, that the note shall be placed on the residential plat, identifying the location of those gas wells, and that that note should also advise the purchasers of the existence of the producing well. So despite the fact that, you know, at some point those wells may become dormant, we do want to ensure that they're noticed that at some point those gas wells may be refract or re-drilled or something else in the future just dependent upon the operator. That is also going to be included in the restrictive coven ants for any association that may exist or take over for the property owner once it leaves the hands of the developer. This is a notification map again. This is sent out as part of these rezoning requests. Notices are sent to property owners within 200 and 500 feet . And as of this writing staff did not receive any notices in favor or in opposition to this rezoning request. As a result, the Planning and Zoning Commission did review this and does recommend approval, as did the Development Review Committee. So that concludes my presentation and I'll stand for any questions. Any questions? Yes, Councilmember Ryan. Is there a type size requirement on the notification so it doesn't disappear on the survey and become fine print somewhere down there? No, it doesn't. There's a listing of standard notes and we 've actually we've talked about bolding and italicizing it so that it does stand out so that it's very easy to miss the note, as you point out. Yes. Councilmember Rodin. Do these notification requirements mirror precisely what we did on a similar development a few months back? I mean, are these the exact same terms that we we developed up here in relation to another? Yes, there were three rez oning requests. I think the first one was initiated for the rezoning off of Ryan. Right, that's the one. Behind the elementary school, yes, where we started that conversation and these have just followed. So these are just what we always agreed to as part of that. And we've just followed suit for each one that's come subsequent to that. Okay, thanks. I have a question. You're specifically referencing two existing gas well, I believe gas well pad sites are actually operating gas wells, those two? Yes. Are there any plats that have been filed that are within that 1200 feet that in other words, we're saying you got two of them. And these are specifically mentioned. Yes, but if there's some gas well plants that are within that 1200 feet, what's any type of provision made for those if any in this regard? There are two gas wells that are noted here. Gas well, these are the gas well plat numbers that were approved as part of the platting process site plan process that specifically calls these out because these are located. There are no other gas well plats within a 1200 radius of this property. That's why. And they would be then subject to the new ordinance since there's no. Mayor pro tem Engelbrecht. Thank you, Mayor. You mentioned both single family and senior housing. Is this senior housing proposed to be within 1200 feet of these gas wells? No, the senior housing will be located in this area here, which is outside. This is for it's outside the range. All right, very good. All right. Any other questions for staff? Seeing none, we will open the public hearing. I have no cards, but would like anybody who would like to come speak to simply state your name and address. Good evening. My name is Thomas Fletcher with Kim Lee Horn 5750 Genesis Court Frisco, Texas 75034. I am the engineer for the owner of the property and the applicant. And just a couple things I'd like to share with you tonight regarding this zoning case. The zoning case before you is for a proposed development for single family development. The proposed retirement or elder elderly housing development is a separate parcel that's not part of this zoning request. So it is they remainder of the track. It already has in our immune zoning. So what we're proposing this. This zoning request here would be for just single family. There is no elderly component of that. A couple of things I'd like to mention. The question came up about the gas well notification. We have actually submitted for review to the city and put together language for that. We I'm the engineer on the Kelso, the Ryan Road project, as well as the mobile home and this as well. So we've been working closely with city staff to develop the language and to to provide the adequate notice on the on the plat. So kind of what I can show you here is is on a typical plat we go through and we have our general note. Some are required. They're standard notes required by the city of Denton. Others are specific to a particular development. But we've also provided on here what we're calling a gas well vicinity map. And on that gas well vicinity map, we actually show the proposed development location and the location of the three gas wells that are located within twelve hundred feet of the proposed development. And if you notice the one to the south, it's not located within twelve hundred feet of all lots that we're proposing , but it is located within twelve hundred feet of a few on the south end of the development. So we're including it within the plat so that all owners are all potential home buyers within this development. We'll see that and have notice. Another thing I'd like to share with you is the reason for the zoning is so that we can we're doing a development to try and bring several assemblies of land together and do one master plan development. The advantage of this master plan development is such that with the greater density and more homes, it gets to a point where we can provide more amenities for the future residents of this development. Originally, when we were looking at the Teasley trails phase one and two, which has got an approved preliminary plat and is an older preliminary plat that plans are going through. It did not have enough residential lots to support an amen ity center. So as we've been able to get the zoning, the N.R. six zoning on the R.J. button track, and as we're here in front of you tonight for the N.R.M.U. twelve on this remaining three acres or just under three acres, it allows us to combine all these assemblies of land and do a nice overall master plan development that allows us to really provide nice amenities for these future residents. One other thing I'd like to share with you is the owner of the land and my client had the land was the land owner for the gas well that's shown here in this exhibit. He has since acquired the lease rights and has hired a contracting company to go out and cap that well. So that well is going to be out of service. It's going to be all the correct procedures that are required through the Texas Railroad Commission. That company will go through those procedures. That well will be capped at some point in the future. There would be a amended preliminary platter, a new preliminary plot so that we could develop in that area. The original preliminary plot had development in that area with the new with the gas ordinance. Some of those lots had to be removed from the preliminary plot. And then with this gas well going away, we will be able to to get rid of that gas well. So where there's three gas wells within twelve hundred feet , there's there's only going to be two once that's taken care of. And I'll be glad as the applicant be glad to answer your question. Councilmember Gregory. Thank you, Mayor. Would you put up those plant notes again, please? That you showed us just a moment ago. The the the map that you're showing there, the gas well vicinity map, is that required by the city? I'm not sure if it's a requirement of the overlay conditions, but it was discussed that we should we should have something on the platter. We were requested that something on the plot would show where the locations of the gas well are in relation to the property, since they are not contained within the limits of the property. Well, I would just like to say to you or to the staff, whoever came up with that idea way to go. And I was feeling actually a lot of warmth towards the developer. So, so I mean, if it's really you're doing claimant, I mean , I've already hugged everybody here on the dais tonight. We appreciate that. And I will say that we have it's been a collaborative effort with staff and and you know, we're trying to meet the concerns of the city and the citizens and provide an upfront development. Well, thank you. Thanks, Tab. I think that that that is moving in the direction that we 're looking for in trying to find ways to to adequately notify. I've got a question in the ordinance. There was also restrictions that and I'm assuming it's at the developers election as far as putting the wording and the notes that are included in a one small a in either the subdivisions declaration of restrictive covenants or a restriction in the deeds for all subdivision lots was a was a condition of this. And so you guys are okay with that. As far as that that's correct. Okay. And it's my understanding and please correct me, Madam City Manager, if I'm if I'm off base on this, but I know the plat records are recorded. But the I believe declaration of restrictive covenants and or deed restrictions. Those actually become a component of a title commitment to some degree. If there's one if there's one achieve, so it's going to show up somewhere. Right. And what we have agreed to there's the deed restrictions. We have the all you know the the option of doing the deed restrictions or the HOA documents and what our builder is agreed to is having a section in the HOA documents that clearly states that their gas wells currently at the time of development. There were gas wells located within 1200 feet of the property and then the HOA will show up on the fact that there's codes, covenants and restrictions will show up on the title search. But an actual deed restriction is something they were not comfortable with. And that's why there was your option given in there in that language. All right. Okay. Any other questions. The applicant any questions. All right. Thank you. Thank you very much. And this is a public hearing and still open so if anyone would like to speak on this item. Please come down and state your name and address. Anyone like to speak. Seeing none at this time we will close the public hearing. And Councilmember Hawkins. If we're ready I'll move approval of eight B. All right. We have a motion. Councilmember Rodin. I guess to clarify do we need to make the motion with the additional conditions that the staff recommends. If you'll just approve the ordinance as written it does have the condition articulated in the ordinance. Then I second that. All right. Let's vote on the board. Motion carries seven zero. Thank you. We'll move on to agenda item eight C. Hold a public hearing considered adoption of ordinance regulating a rezoning from a neighborhood residential for in our four zoning district to a neighborhood residential mix use in our M. Zoning District with an overlay district on approximately four point nine acres property located at the northeast corner of McKinney Street in Rockingbird Lane. Thank you mayor or director of planning and development Brian Lockley will present this case. Thank you. Good city manager mayor members of the city council this next item before you is a rezoning for one of their fire stations as was read into the record. This is a rezoning from in our four to in our in you on approximately four point nine acres four point nine acre property with overlay restrictions. This is a subject property here outlined in yellow located in the northeast corner of Mockingbird and McKinney Street. The fire station already exists here in this location and this is the subject of the rezoning itself. Zoning map for this property consists of in our four there is some adjacent in our immune to the southeast as well as in our immune 12. If this rezoning is approved as presented this property would become in our immune. The future land use map for this property calls for the existing land use which just takes into account the protection of the existing neighborhoods and other uses that come in there that are in support of that neighborhood . These are some site photos that shows the fire station here . This is just another photo. This is a photo of the fire station and this is looking south from the property here as well as looking west. The reason for the rezoning request is actually to allow for the expansion of the fire station in amending this zoning. It will allow the fire station to expand beyond its current boundaries and do far more than what's what's currently allowed on some of those adjacent properties. The property owners within 200 and 500 feet as shown here. We did receive one notice here to the that's shown here in red. That's in opposition to the request. Believe that notice. The notice was provided. However, pursuant to that and the development review committee recommendation, it was recommended approval subject to an overlay condition and that overlay condition was a request by the planning and zoning commission. Really to limit the uses on that property. I mean, it's going to be used for the fire station and MRM in our immune does allow for a host of other uses planning zoning commission felt best that if they were to add an overlay restriction to assuage any concerns by the neighborhood that it was going to be used for that purpose to limited to community service uses in particular a fire station. So that was the request by by planning zoning commission. And that concludes my presentation. Councilman road. Thank you, Mayor. I guess my first question is, is this the applicant, the city, I guess, concur with that condition. Yes, we do concur with that. Okay, because, you know, it's going to be there for a long time. So and that leads to my second question. This is more just kind of from a process perspective. So I was reading the backup and I'm always interested to know what some of the respondents say. And there was one in opposition and I was interested to see that they were concerned about apartments going up there and it made me think and I wasn't able to see it in the backup. What was what did the notice say that made them conclude that apartments were going there is that that you talked about the zoning category and what was allowed. That's correct. It's because of the zoning category and the uses that are allowed. And that's typically one of the questions or the comments that we receive. What does this zone and allow, which is a very good question to ask because what may be proposed today, ultimately may not be developed or may occur at some point time in the future. So, in order to eliminate any of those concerns or confusion by some of the surrounding property owners, they just decided to eliminate all other uses and just say since this is going to be for the city for a fire station, that's just reduce the uses to that. Okay, thank you. Councilmember Gregory. Following up on Councilmember rodents question. Yes, she came in, she attended the PNC meeting. Well, it looks like a he he brought up so. Okay. He or she was there and found out about that's correct. Yes . Thank you. Thank you. Mayor protein mingle break. Thank you, Mayor. We have made this extreme, if we pass this we make this extremely restrictive. Very much so. I mean, I know that we have a large amount of this property we're wanting to, to preserve as many trees as possible, particularly on that north side, buffering the neighborhood . I can see somebody coming along in a little while going this is city property you know we ought to have a whatever a park bench out there a bird watching sanctuary something associated with a tree area and, in essence, as I see it, we wouldn't be able to do that on property that otherwise is just going to be sitting there. And what would we have to do come back and rezone. Yeah, that's not the purpose of the property that the trees will serve as a natural buff. I agree. And so what we're looking at. And for the preservation of those trees is to shield it to buffer the fire station to the expansion from those neighborhoods. It's not going to be for public use, either where a tree or something else should should be located there. Okay. I'll let you and Emerson work that out when somebody realizes that's public property and there's a nice stand of trees that they could go sit in or walk in or. Okay, we've talked about his his use of fire stations for parks and so well, that worked out. Thank you. Thank you. Any other questions. This is a public hearing I will now open the public hearing . I don't have any personal cards, but anyone wishing to speak on this item please come down and state your name and address. Anybody wishing to speak on this item. Last call anybody wishing to speak. We will now close the public hearing Councilmember road. Thank you, Mayor I move approval of just lost it agenda item. 8C Thank you. Councilmember Gregory. Well, I second that I want to hear from the applicant, George. We appreciate the council's consideration of this request. All right, we have a motion to second. Let's vote on the board. Motion carries 7 0. We'll move on to agenda item number nine citizen reports. I don't believe we have any citizen reports scheduled. We'll move on to item number 10 concluding items. Anybody have any. Yes. Councilmember road. Thank you, Mayor. Just a suggestion for a future agenda item. I know it's been about a year since we've looked at the smoking ordinance and we made some revisions to it. And we agreed to revisit that because there are some questions about what are some possibilities we can do in the future. It's been a year. I think it's time maybe to bring that back up for additional discussion. So I'd like to do that. The other thing is just an announcement. And that is that on Monday night on the 9th, I believe, is Monday, June 9th at six o'clock at Eastside Social Club is another one of these Denton creatives mixers. This time it's tech mill, which is a locally homegrown organic kind of tech advocacy group kind of from an economic development point of view. But they're celebrating kind of the startup community. So there's going to be a list of people talking at that event. So I'd like to invite all the council members there and anyone who's watching who wants to show up and see what's going on that six o'clock Eastside Social Club next Monday. Thank you. Councilmember Gregory. Thank you, Mayor. This morning, I along with several people here on the dais attended the naming ceremony for the Patterson Appleton Center for Visual Arts. It was a great ceremony. We got to hear about a couple of families, three individuals who really have done a lot of the laid a lot of the foundations for what we're enjoying in Denton today. When Roy Appleton spoke, he he he reminisced about some stories about when he was on the Chamber of Commerce and some of the adventures that they that he shared. Really reminded me an awful lot of Councilmember Rodin's trip to Los Angeles a couple of weeks ago for the Sriracha plant because he told a story about a promotion called Dynamic Denton that they did where they went to they identified several major cities in the United States and sent out invitations to all of the CEOs that were located in those cities. And they had a dinner and they had they encouraged and got 25 Denton citizens to go out to Los Angeles or to New York City or to Chicago and be at those dinners and sit at the tables. And they also convinced Phyllis George who was reigning Miss America at the time from Denton to be the entertainment and they got standing room only attendance at these events. And he told a story about in Los Angeles that they rented a billboard. And they said, Los Angeles and Denton, Texas. We could be twins, give or take three million people. And that that billboard created such a buzz in Los Angeles and among the TV stations and radio stations that that everybody was talking about Denton back then. And I was thinking about the buzz that's been going on Twitter. It's it's 40 years later 50 years later. But we're still finding innovative ways to promote our city . But it was a great event and we honored some very good people at that event. The mayor was able to reveal the plaques and I think they were very the families were very appreciative of the event. It was it was a great time. It was a great Denton moment. Absolutely. Council member Ryan, I just wanted to announce to the public that one of my campaign promises of having a meeting in my district every month is now been scheduled for the third Monday of each month. Our first meeting will be on June the 16th from six thirty to eight thirty at the North Branch Library. And it's open to anyone within the city or even outside the city. It's not restricted to district to by any means and I'd like for as many people to come out as possible. Thank you. Mayor Pro Tem Engelbrecht. Thank you, Mayor. In sort of the same light of something that Mr. Gregory just mentioned, we we heard about folks who have done things in Denton. And I'm always amazed at what people are doing here. And there are so many folks doing something and I just want to make another notice to the public about an item that was in the Monday newspaper less cockerels. Notification there was a request in there for children's books. Michelle Lynn, who is a librarian at Evers Park Elementary, took it basically upon herself to find a way to provide reading materials to the to the children who are part of the lunch program that is administered to the parks department. Many of them don't have an opportunity to get involved in the library's reading program for the summer. And so she has went about devising a method to get books to those children on a recurring basis, age appropriate. And she has gone out to the community and asked for donations of children's books. And I want to recognize, first off, Ruth's room and recycled books for both having donated books and are continuing to donate books through the summer. But also to remind folks that you will find a yellow box at a number of Denton locations where you can donate children 's books of all ages. They need them at all levels. They're sorting them out, etc . by age category and going to be prepared to give them to them. There are locations at the Denton branch libraries, DATCU in downtown, Jupiter House Coffee, Mr. Chopsticks, Denton Community Market, Scrap Denton, and there may be some others that will be boxes that will be placed. But just look for a large yellow box and the information we posted on there and she would appreciate all the children's books she can get for this program for the summer. Thank you. Councilmember Hawkins. Thank you, Mayor. Last week, the Strickland Middle School sixth graders invited me to tag along with them to the Perot Museum and we got to take the A train down there and go to the museum and they were the most well behaved kids I had hung out with. When I was in sixth grade, I was not that well behaved. And we had a great time. We ate pizza in the parking lot. And it just so happened on the ride back, I was escorted by Denton police officers. I didn't do anything wrong. We just met up with them. So I just wanted to say thank you to Strickland Middle School. Thank you. Well, I have just one one request, Mayor, if you just refer to me as Councilman Engelbrecht, I'd appreciate it. I'm fine with that unless there's some formal reason why we need to go otherwise. I'm real happy with. All right. Yeah, we'll see. I'll take that under advisement. Thank you. Whatever you want. I've got a couple that I want to request, but I do want to say that the celebration this morning was quite spectacular . And the thing that really, I think, was motivational and inspirational to me was that it was about at the late 1970s is when basically Peterbilt, Victor's and Tetrapack came to this community. Well, I graduated in 79. So I know the population at that time was probably 35 or 40 thousand people. And that was a that was a big deal to secure those three companies. And as Mr. Appleton spoke, some of those economic development ideas that he had were quite quite innovative at that time and still would be would be today. So it was a it was a wonderful, wonderful celebration. I just had a couple of things that I'd want to get on the agenda eventually. Mr. City manager sort of consistent with some of my campaign issues or campaign ideas. A couple of regarding economic development. I would like to propose and go through the proper channels, the board council work session proposal to add to the economic development partnership board, a voting member of the black Chamber of Commerce and the Hispanic Chamber of Commerce. When and if that gets reconstituted, put that through the proper channels. I would like to review our economic development tax incentive policies to actually talk about through the proper channels a wage level. We've talked about we want to give incentives for high wages, but we really don't define that. I'd like to get a little bit more specific on that, as we 've seen in the past. One is and I think it was shown in Council Member Rhodes trip out to California. I think we need to talk about creating recruitment teams and really following up on that and using that as an example to try to really begin to to attract and promote Denton in a very proactive, very specific way, really target the different types of industries that we would we would like to do. And I would like to set a goal. I know I had stated a goal personally, but I'd like for the board together with the council to set a goal on how many new jobs we want at what certain wage level to really try to give us a bar to shoot for. I mean, sometimes people work better under a goal, a specific goal. So I would like for us to at least consider that and be able to talk about that. I would like to have an agenda item with my colleagues to talk about increasing the public comment time to five minutes on public hearings. I know that would require us to be here a little bit longer , but I know I heard a lot over the campaign that three minutes and as we all know, trying to answer a question in two or three minutes is almost is almost impossible. Curious as to I believe the council before the election. I'm sorry, planning and zoning passed or recommended approval of a letter of support for the HLC on the City Hall West. I believe it was a state marker or something along those lines that I think that hasn't come to council yet would just be curious on that. Let's see. I would like to have a work session. I mean, we've all talked about growth and the projected growth that we're going to experience in this city. I'd like to have a work session on from finance. Is there a way that we can determine what our costs are per capita as we grow? Because then that will give us an idea of what we also need to begin to plan for as far as revenue. I know we have the five year forecast, but those are sort of based on assumptions, you know, two or three percent increase. But we're all talking about this tremendous growth that's coming our way that's already here. So I'd really like to see if we can find a way to quantify that on a per capita basis based upon how many police officers fire off the firefighters and so forth. Libraries, parks based upon number of people. Let's see if there's anything else left. A couple more things and then and then we'll go into talking about our sessions that we still have left to do and whether we want to continue those to another time. I would like to get up and it could be an informal staff report or maybe a work session in our development code. We have a lot of timelines that the city meets as far as 10 days after submission. They've got 10 days to look, make comments or however many days those are just the different timelines that the city staff is under as far as responding back to certain. Documentation. I'd like to see if we couldn't at least consolidate that. I'd like to see that and I think colleagues would as well just to have an idea of what that is in a summary form, not not in a code, but just try to consolidate that. So just so I can have an understanding essentially in the development. Yes, yes, yes. And then to maybe have a work session on do we have any kind of reporting mechanism that specifically addresses each application and where they are in that process? Not so much. Well, how many of our applications are we meeting this time deadline? But it's almost like a report. I see here's every application that is where is it in the process? If it exceeds one of those time frames, it's flagged by just some idea of tracking that. And lastly, which was just brought up today in a meeting, I would like to have a work session on oh, this is yeah, this is one. The tree code. I would like to either get a report from the Committee on the Environment or I'd like to have a report to counsel in a work session. Where are we with the tree code? Where's the impasse? How do we get it moving? Do we need it? I just want us to collectively consider that because it seems like it's been somewhere other than before the full body. And I would just like to get you all thoughts on how we move in that direction. And one item in particular, it's my understanding that if you get a grading and clearing permit and you clear a lot and grade the lot, that your tree mitigation that you pay is part of the tree ordinance or tree mitigation ordinance. But yet if you come back and develop it and plant trees, you don't get credit. And I would like to have a work session on that to see if we can't maybe mitigate that a little bit because if I think it can cause some unnecessary financial burden to developers and also cause development maybe to slow down. So I just like to have a work session on that. Sorry about that, guys. Wanted to get all that out. That's it for me. Any other any other items? That's it. That's the yes. Let's see. I'm going to council member pro TM. No, I'm afraid. Lord. Oh, just just a comment about your request on the development code. I think that's aren't we in a rewrite process supposed to be seeing a review of the new pretty soon. We are getting close on the clarity on study is addressing a lot of that. But I think we can give a summary of where we are on that and some specifics of things that have been implemented. Okay. Well, I thought was with regard to the mayor's request and all due respect, I hate to use up staff time for something that we get it. We get a report and then three weeks later we get a new ordinance that may be changing that. Sure. Absolutely. I mean, absolutely. You bet. The new ordinance and no problem. You bet. That seeing no other that concludes this council meeting. Now we've got two items that are potentially three. We have an open work session item, which was the strategic plan that city managers said that they could do that either now or we could do it now or we could end that take. I think Brian said earlier that take 15 or 20 more minutes or we could do that. Try to schedule a subsequent council meeting and wanted to get your your take on that. Would y'all are y'all open to just reschedule it for the next. Okay. And we had a couple of closed session items that were outstanding posted. One was the last one, which was I talked with the utility department and they said they could just include that in a Friday reading file. It wasn't that critical. So we can do that. And so then the other other only open one would potentially be if we wanted to revisit the one about the fair association and then if there was anything left over from the discussion on on gas wells in the closed session. So if if not, then that will be the conclusion of our meeting if we don't have any desire to take those up or if we've concluded those items. Any everybody okay. You wore me out. All right. All right. Good. Good deal. All right. Then that will conclude our our meeting. Thank you.