Aug 03, 2021 City Council on 2021-08-03 2:00 PM

Good afternoon and welcome to this meeting of the Denton City Council. It is 2 p.m. It is August the 3rd and we do have a quorum so we will get started. So I'll call the meeting to order. First item is comments on the consent agenda from callers. So staff will let me know if we have any callers on the consent agenda. No sir, no callers today. Thank you very much and so then I'll turn to my colleagues questions for staff regarding the consent agenda. Council member McGuire. Thank you. I have two items. I'd like to request that item I be pulled so that I can recuse and then regarding item F, could staff explain to me what easement acquisition services are and does that include the easements themselves? Who's best to speak to easements? Thank you. Good afternoon Mayor, Council, Chris Campbell here. Water utilities infrastructure manager. So the the easement acquisition services that Kimley-Horn will provide is they will work with our real estate folks to acquire those easements, work through the the appraisal services and and all the documents. Is it just the services related to the easements or does that include the cost of acquiring the easements? Yes, yes that does include the cost of acquiring the easements as well. Thank you. We're looking at additional 10 easements. Okay all right thank you so much. Absolutely okay. Councilmember Armitage. Yes I want to pull B and C as individual items for individual vote. I'm going to be voting no to these and hope there will be a you know at least a brief discussion. I'd be happy to if it would help staff I'd be happy to kind of state my concerns now. Yeah if you could just say what you want in the let me not assume do you want a presentation or just discussion? Just a brief presentation just to frame it more for the public you know than for council but I don't need like a PowerPoint just for somebody from staff to be here and just announce the situation. Announce each each of them they're both they're both related they're about members of the one member of the Committee on Persons with Disabilities another member of the Traffic Safety Commission being removed with cause and okay well then oh just just need the direction so staff can adjust accordingly when they're present present okay okay so if so if it's not helpful to staff to for to know my objections now I don't have to state them I know we'll just take it up okay great yeah okay is that that's everything okay Councilman Bet. Thank You Mayor before I ask my questions can I ask for how how we're handling counselor our pro mayor pro tem Meltzer's request to speak just for the the procedure of it all well because we have the buttons and he and he does not have the buttons that's right so I will address the buttons and then look to him so he's after the buttons is the order of events thank you thank you Mayor okay so I also wanted to BNC pulled so that's when it's been done and my issues were simply the the I removal in a consent block I'm gonna say to staff in general I'm going to to request a poll for future notification I'm gonna request a poll any removals out of consent just just going forward then ask that those be in an individual vote okay I'm gonna I'm gonna let the city manager speak on that sure council members we had a meeting just recently with the city secretary and we recognize there are some issues related to this this very issue of people being on and then coming off so what we're going to be doing is coming up with some recommendations for and working through this for a new policy or a new direction so we recognize there are some issues today the reason it's on here is we did confer with the city attorney's office and we really had no choice but to put it on here because of what it's currently saying we have to do however we recognize the need to revisit this and that's what we're going to do awesome thank you so much okay and then I had a brief question on F and that was simply what are the additional eight parcels that will be considering I'm not sure I need a full presentation I just didn't see it in the presentation or in the backup sorry to make you walk up and down so this is this actually is is right at the brinker right near Bucky's and so what what tech stop proposes they would like to put a bypass in at brinker to where you know you could take the exit and actually go over not take that go to the light to make things smoother so it will be those parcels there on the south side of I-35 okay yes on the Bucky side so yes sir okay and then also to clarify I did miss miss speak that the easement acquisition cost does not include the actual cost of the parcels or the actual easement easement that's them working with us to get everything acquired working through the process okay and this is and there's it's those eight parcels are just that hypothetical retail right in front of Bucky's is that what we're talking about so it will be yes that and then for it you know a little bit north and south as well so we do have a easement there now we do have water line there in at Bucky's and but as you further go south and further go north we'll need to read good good afternoon pretend they spoke deputy director for waterways rotor just to clarify specifically the parcels along I-35e on the south side between loop 288 and the Bucky's so this is the Old West there's a gas station at the corner right and a couple of other parcels in commercial area and then this is just this the initial right-of-way easement part of those parcels I guess where I was going with is I mean my questions are at are we are is there going to be any attempt to need to remove any of those businesses is where I was going with that at this time text out is still going through a redesign this is a project that came in really late this is not any project that is related to the Mayhill expansion there's a mayhole interchange expansion project and now they're adding this extra project to a dress the Brinker issue that's currently going on exactly at Brinker interchange you have a stoplight and everything backs up so that is a new project so they're gonna add that piece and they're still working through design the design is not final but they've given the green light for us utilities to be relocated and look at options so at this time it shows in their plans that we're not impacting buildings but we're really coming close but we don't know we don't have the final plans to say hundred percent okay cool I know that's not your main to the vote I just was it is important to what we're discussing in context so thank you that's all mr. Ritter. Thanks. Councilman Burke. Good afternoon everyone. Item G is just it's inquiry about this particular program I've heard of it but I've never understood how a home comes to this point can someone speak on why I mean not I mean a more of how do we go up doesn't you know a citizen go about getting help for their homes or home improvement and it just seems like this the amount is fairly high for a renovation so can somebody explain how do we get to this point I've had persons to email me call me and ask me about the program yes Danny Shaw is on the line to answer the questions and if she is not on the line sir Keekler's here hello I'm also available almost you know with community services staff member from community services beside hi I'm all over the community services I can answer some of those questions the city of Denton receives federal CDBG and home funds currently the program is funded with home funds and we assist persons who are low to moderate income in the city of Denton with help to repair or is unable to do that we can reconstruct their home on this project we are rehabbing the house the house is in a lot of need of repair it has significant foundation issues and because of the rising cost the cost have been going up consistently recently on construction and that's the reason for the higher cost at this time if somebody wishes to apply they just need to contact our office we'll take an application and at that time determined with them whether the house needs to be repaired or if it needs to be reconstructed any further questions yes just about how long would something like that take from the point of them putting in an application to the point of them knowing that their home has been approved in preparing for the reconstruction or repair we are trying to move faster on these so we are trying to complete the process for application and bidding within all within six months and then just find the contract and start the project thank you that's all I had okay thank you okay and then any other any other questions consent agenda mayor Proctor Melter thanks mayor just in case you haven't caught at councilman Davis has requested that he and I be pulled for separate votes he's expecting to be with us in the evening session okay got it all right so let me go back to be and see understanding the city manager's statement that this is a process that the City Council has asked for that is being reviewed by staff are you still wanting to pull those that's Councilman Rometer yes I do still want to pull those great okay so for staffs record I have I B C E B and C are not a specific presentation basically a summary of events and I and E is just for recusal for mayor pro for councilmember Davis so that's what I have all right any other questions on the consent agenda seeing none all right that'll take us into our first work session so I'll call a first item which is ID 2 1 1 2 8 receive report hold hold a discussion give staff direction regarding the comprehensive plan update other plan updates and form-based code thank you mayor members council run again principal planning with development services go ahead and share my screen our presentation hopefully you all can see that presentation again good afternoon excited to be here we started the comp plan update process back in February of this year we're at a milestone where we felt we would like to share where we are on the process so we've got a number of items that we like to share with you as well as some updates to other items I will be presenting just this first slide I was lucky enough to pull that that card really the objective today is really share where we are in the process as I mentioned earlier where are we on the schedule also the public engagement that we've been involved in of course with COVID and with some of the restrictions we started off with virtual and we understand that there is a need for in-person meetings as well so we're gearing up for that coming next month so we'll be talking a little bit about how we're gonna get that public engagement with the community and what we've heard so far we've held a number of workshops and charrettes and we wanted to share what we've heard at a very high level discussion just to kind of give you some idea of what we've heard obviously this is not the end we still have more time to get input and so just again want to share that mr. David Gaines will come down and talk about other plans how this fits in with the comprehensive plan we obviously have a lot of work that's being done with the mobility plan the parks recreation trails master plan as well so those will all be discussed by David and then council asked about bringing forward some discussions or some information related to form-based codes and so our consultants that actually worked or is working on the comp plan update has experience and one in particular the project manager put together and drafted form-based code and actually administered it in a location so that he previously worked at so he brings a lot of insights and I'm excited to hear what he has to share with you all and hopefully you all can ask questions and we'll go from there so that is really the objective of this afternoon's work session item and again I will turn it over to our consultant he is calling in so hopefully he's on the line and I will stand here and advance the slides if he is available do we have the caller Rachel I'm not aware Ron but if you'll stand by let me check on that okay if not Ron you'll have to go if not I'll go I'll go ahead and do the presentation so I'll go ahead and begin and if he goes chime in we'll definitely let him in okay so we are in phase three right now you can see that we're around mid August to mid September we are going to be holding an in-person open house this is something that we hope to have at our new location the development services building we hope to have a lot of folks there what we will be doing there is sharing some of the things that we've already heard but also what we're thinking or drafting as part of the comprehensive plan update including the future line use map so exciting to share that with the community we will also have a virtual online open house for those that are not able to be able to make the in person there's an opportunity for them to go online similar to going to an open house they can they can log in click on every section of the open house and learn what we've again presented and hopefully learn and provide input regarding that the stuff that we've presented this will be available to them for 24 hours so someone wants to go midnight they can go on that virtual open house so again to give the opportunity for as many input as possible we want to make that available that will be available for 20 for two weeks again 24 hours from that point on early fall 2021 we will obviously start working on drafting the comprehensive plan again very very preliminary we hope to by phase five when we get to council we will have a final draft of the comprehensive plan so we're looking at late fall 2021 and then for adoption late fall so again depending on the holidays and schedules we hope to present the final draft to the council late fall possibly early winter 2022 what so what have we heard so far just to give you an idea of the public engagement I kind of mentioned it already we've had a number of meetings workshops 131 community members attended their first workshop there were approximately 630 comments received we then held a Charette workshop where 51 community members attended and that garnered 850 comments so there's a lot of information shared by the community and we put that all together and from there we're collecting it and analyzing it and hopefully we can present that to the community soon we also have an interactive issues and opportunities map for those that have not had the opportunity online on our dedicated website den city of den comm forward slash den plan 2040 you can go on there and click on a interactive map identify a location and if you have an issue or concern you can click on it and enter your comments if you haven't if you have an opportunity you can also click on that location and provide an explanation of an impossible opportunity for that area so that's a great tool to have again 101 responses we continue to have we continue to have online questionnaires available for the community and so far we've received 175 responses regarding those questionnaires and then online vision statement exercise just again what is your vision of den come 2040 we want to hear from you and we've been collecting those that's an ongoing exercise available again on our dedicated website and then again I want to re-emphasize our upcoming in-person and open house virtual which which are scheduled to begin or start on September 16th so September 16th is when we will have that in-person open house following that we will have that virtual open house online that will run for two weeks 24 hours for those that are not able to attend that workshop or open house so what have we heard so far we had four major topics that we wanted to highlight the first two that you see here new growth areas and infrastructure we'll start with new growth areas what we've heard is we want to see right development in the right place at the right time so that is to ensure that you know development doesn't occur in areas that are already overly dense but at the same time we want the right development and at the right time so that's what we've heard from the community we also heard preserve open space as well as rural areas that is a common theme that we've heard want to make sure that we preserve those areas for future folks we also heard about housing housing opportunities and making sure that we provide a diverse housing option for for our community not just single-family but if there's an opportunity for you know duplexes or townhomes we know we have multifamily all over the city but we'd like to encourage other options that are affordable as well it is on okay Ed are you on the call no okay I will continue and Rachel if you if he's hello oh okay and you are on with the City Council and we are on slide six talking about new growth areas okay well thank you Ron I apologize for the technical difficulties and Marin City Council the same to you I apologize for that my name is Ed Boyk I'm with matrix design group and I'm going to be happy to take this over at this point I think I heard Ron that you were talking a little bit about the diverse housing options that the public had told us thus far as I joined on this conversation so what I'm going to do is quickly rego go recap that new growth area so as Ron I'm sure said all this information I'm presenting to you today is about the information we've heard so far from the public and we've had extensive public outreach that's gotten us to this point some of the overriding themes were that the new growth areas really needed to have the development being the right type of development the right place and the right time and through that a lot of the other comments started to supported the preservation of those open spaces and rural areas that are really part of the cultural identity and heritage of Denton as Ron was noting as well the diverse housing options the community really believes that they've been more options needed not just for work for house workforce housing but for executive entry-level quality multifamily rentals and townhomes detached single-family households basically homes that could support all different household types with being you know pushing for development to be the right type the right place the community also had a lot of comments so far about infrastructure you know reinvesting into the community through that infill infill that would help support that preservation of agricultural and open space this infrastructure can also support and enhance those existing neighborhoods and serves to provide some of those diverse housing options and also economic development opportunities if the infrastructure is planned appropriately for those economic development growth areas so infrastructure doesn't just need to be functional it can beautify and enhance Denton's identity and one way that it can do this is through the implementation of complete streets with the infrastructure this is some of the some of the concepts that we've been hearing from the community you know in complete streets that you're not familiar can be things that have white sidewalks you know it could have shade trees adequate on-street parking to support adjacent uses bike lanes there's a lot of different ways that complete streets can be implemented they are not a one-size-fits-all solution and could you go to the next slide please and on this slide it should show an example of a complete street this is just one that illustrates all the different concepts that could be possible in a complete street it could have like I said the white sidewalk the chicanes or neck down at the intersection to reduce the crossing for pedestrians but ultimately the takeaway from this is the infrastructure investment this is just saying with infrastructure for streets you can develop develop something that's not only functional but also something that is an enhancement beautification and supports the long-term vitality of the City of Denton next slide please so we've also heard a lot about economic development and it was really important through our feedback to ensure that any efforts that we had related to economic development were ones that affirmed and validated all the work that has gone into play already with the economic development strategic plan there's a tremendous amount of information that gathered from the community and a very strong plan is put together and frankly all the comments that we received so far have been largely in support of the conclusions and strategies in that plan and I'm just going to put a couple on the slide right here to show that those continue to be those themes really finding ways to increase those job opportunities collaborating with those anchor institutions such as the universities and hospitals and how do you do that you can develop employment based upon the assets and the training programs the university programs could be supported for the development opportunities you could also partner with those universities and anchor institutions for research parks and incubators you could also you know enhance your small business support for your economic development by creating assistance programs process improvement and then finding ways to ensure that the infrastructure is well-developed transportation and technological infrastructure to support those small businesses as for downtown it's incredibly clear that it's a very valued portion of the community it's a cultural community heart of Denton and the community really wants to continue to capitalize on downtown and the square itself additional events are entertainment arts functions to really support a place of downtown and the place of the of the square and to enhance the flavor of downtown through the continued support for local businesses and an expansion of local businesses in the downtown and also the environment that supports it for the walkable streets the pedestrian focused environment new development is not off the table nor is redevelopment in the downtown however the community says it really needs to be considerate of the character of the square so you don't want to put something in there that's not going to fit contextually with the square however outside of the downtown say along transit lines or near the a train station it might be appropriate to have a different type of downtown building that's something that does support the continued economic and development and activities in the downtown area but it really it goes back to that first point on the news real slide it has to be the right type of development in the right place at the right time so you want to find those buildings which support the downtown character and existing businesses and that could be multifamily and office but not something that takes away from the real identity and cultural heart of Denton being those buildings around the square next slide please so the community's comments also have a have a place and how we shape our land uses some of the things that came of this is that since the community's got a strong importance on preserving that rural heritage and open spaces some of the new land use designations that could be considered include agriculture which would be a district that really reinforces the preservation of the land in the EPJ that's not slated for development anytime soon but preserves the agricultural and ranching character and heritage of the city of the City of Denton as well as reduces the possibility and gives the city a policy to turn to to influence and ensure contextually sensitive development in the agricultural area so you don't end up with incompatible development or far-flung subdivision in an area that is largely intended to be retained as open space for agricultural base and ag can support other compatible uses as well which includes agritourism and other supportive uses that are compatible with the agricultural context one other land use that could be possible for the future land use map is master plan community and that term can be misused I mean a lot of developers or other entities might use that to market just subdivisions but really what's important and the land use description would say it says as well as the policies and strategies that are in the general plan about that land use is that it's really designed to promote complete developments developments that provide multiple uses and a sense of place and an environment where you can live work and play on the screen I have an example in the bottom right hand corner of the Verado master plan community this is a award-winning renowned master plan community in the Phoenix metro area and while I'm not suggesting that then it's gonna have foam trees with our desert environment mountains what I am wanting to show is that what Verado does is it behaves as a complete community it has a downtown with retail office multifamily uses it has smaller properly scaled streets very walkable you can go between neighborhoods easily schools are integrated parks are integrated and employment's integrated it's a complete package so it becomes an asset it's an asset that can contribute to the community as a complete neighborhood so it's important with master plan communities on this map is that they have goals and policies which support that concept now it's important to note as well that it doesn't have to be a singular end result of the community like Verado or a multi-use community like that it can have to take on different forms for example you could have a master plan community that serves all those points about being a complete neighborhood but be focused on different purposes such as an agricultural based one so you might have a larger lot but ultimately it's not just serving a single youth it might be agricultural rural ranch that type properties that have other amenities that support a jobs to resident balance as well as being appropriate for the context are located in so the the intent of proposing master plan community or has a potential concept is that it can show on your comprehensive plan that you've identified areas where additional detailed planning areas might be found that support these complete neighborhood style approaches next slide please other little changes that have been noticed notice that could be possible from the comments we've received so far including re-examining the low and moderate residential youth category to potentially incorporate some provisions and policies that could for allow for discretion to allow a neighborhood scale commercial in those areas and when I say that I mean carefully carefully scaled and appropriately filed commercial in those low and moderate residential areas on arterial corners or on arterial and collector corners but definitely nothing large and this has been executed in other communities as well where they wanted to preserve the integrity of their comprehensive plan land-use map without having to go back to that map to make the small changes for small commercial opportunities that are really assets and important beneficial pieces to the health of the neighborhood but it's important that there be good well-crafted policies to limit the extent of that occurring and to make sure that it's done in the right place and at the right time at the right scale along with that the community has continued to reinforce the value of parks and open space potential solutions to that on the future land-use map could be expanding the land-use around water courses lakes the wildlife corridor areas that connect between those and other public parks and open spaces and so that we've been exploring some little concepts on a future land-use map revision business innovation has been identified it's like it's really important to the economics future of them that has a fairly broad description in the current comprehensive plan so there's a lot of possibilities that could be low located there from office parks to research parks to retail to light industrial and I don't think that that's necessarily a bad thing but what it's important to do is to make sure that the business innovation is done right again we're targeting back to that right time right place right type of development these business innovation areas really could benefit from additional studies such as small area plans so that you can really drill down and understand what asset and what context you have for each of them because each of the business innovation areas that are identified on the future land-use plan do have a different character and do have a different asset and by drilling down with intense small area planning you can be very specific about what you want to see for an end goal so that could be you know research parks it could be business incubators and those collaborations with universities depending on the assets it could be you know from light industrial or warehousing or business park scale development or retail there's a lot of options next slide please just to show some of those concepts we have identified a couple regional located concepts that could be suitable in the business innovation area and some of them are office oriented some of them are office and warehousing and office and industrial research innovation in a lot of different ways there's a lot of different ways to to get there but I think it's important that that they get and based on the community comments we've received so far that the business innovation area be one that drives the future of Devin's economy in a flexible way at the comprehensive level and then drills down through a small area plan and with that I think we'll move on to the next slide and I'll turn this over to the assistant city manager good afternoon David Gaines assistant city manager I'm just going to go into briefly talk about how our other plans align with the comprehensive plan specifically in terms of in terms of our timeline in our focus previously in the presentation we already talked about the economic development strategic plan that was approved and now it's in alignment with the comprehensive plan as it moves forward but these other we have four just example plans here as well that are in line with the comprehensive plan and kind of show the amount of work that's going to be done over the next number of months for planning it's been an emphasis from us we've been talking about it quite frequently with council and certainly internally about having all of our plans aligned and having them say the same thing I think we know that there are issues right now with some of our plans not doing that so it's certainly been a focus for us and so I'll start with the mobility plan we have that plan to to to have that complete in fall of 2021 really in line precisely with the comprehensive plan we obviously have had that draft mobility plan since 2020 and the reason the driver for the delay was having it aligned with the comprehensive plan we could have pushed that forward sooner in the in the calendar year and gotten it done before the comprehensive plan but we knew we would run into the same issues that we have now so that's the intent with the mobility plan is to have it approved right along with the comprehensive plan and have those same land use assumptions incorporated in the mobility plan and also that focus on complete streets that we're talking about in the comprehensive plan as well so we'll see that again at the same timeline we'll have those work sessions as we move forward the comprehensive solid waste management strategy that's we've presented a number of updates to council we know I think council is aware of the iterative process that we've had to this point so just on a timeline based standpoint we have a work session scheduled for September both with PV and with City Council and ultimate adoption of that plan is is planned for December 2021 as you see there parks and rec master plan is another very significant master plan that we have moving forward that I know councils had updates on throughout the process that's also planned for adoption in December 2021 and we have a work session scheduled in October with City Council for updates on the plan and to end to get guidance in direction moving forward and as we think about the comprehensive plan to the parks plan obviously a number of connections from the tree canopy to trails and just throughout where the where parks are and what that plan is over a long period of time also wanted to point out the stormwater master plan this one has a longer time horizon we are planning a work session in October to talk about our stormwater our drainage master plan this has been a need in the city for quite a while to have a true CIP a true plan understand our needs from a drainage perspective start thinking about how we're going to fund those needs so we have a work session in October and our intent would be to kick kick that process off following the work session that is a long process about 12 to 18 months after we have that work session so a little bit longer horizon but the comp plan certainly plays into that as well so I just wanted to give those updates on the plans talk about our thought process on how they're gonna fit together and give you some some benchmarks on timelines moving forward for the presentation I know we go to form-based codes now I imagine this is probably a good time for questions on the comp plan okay questions for staff Councilman bet thank you mr. mayor so one thing I just want to lead with this it's it's really I mean in the presentation I really love that you guys were you know paying attention to the feedback from the community you know getting these concepts of neighborhood scale and and complete streets and you know not just bricks and mortar designations but you know sort of the multivariate multimodal uses that that really need to go on in a in the city of our size so that's that's really excellent I appreciate that and and just a sort of a comment about the the feedback on the other side getting back to the community is I know that you said you had something like 100 175 interactions with the interactive map so I'm really gonna sort of urge you guys to get with the customer service and Ryan's group and whatever and really really push to get more input so that you know it feels like I mean I love that we have almost 200 people but it also feels statistically insignificant to a town of 143,000 so you know I mean to the extent that we can get those numbers up that would be really really great so my questions on this were or maybe sort of a comment on this is that I think there's a lot we've heard we've seen a lot of feedback on the Gateway small area plans we're gonna see some issues today on like the northern gateway at 289 35 there's been ongoing discussions on the like the 428 Hartley Clear Creek area a gateway southern gateways and and I think we really need to do a lot more nailing down of that and communicating are getting the feedback back from the community about what they want to see about those gateways because we're having to make these ongoing decisions and you know we want to do what the community wants but the same token it's not always clear that that's that it feels more sometimes like we're throwing spaghetti at the wall a little bit and I don't want to see what sticks necessarily so no no understand counseling back you know even back you know with playing zoning commission they actually asked that we work on a small area plan for that area I 35 in loop 288 intersection we definitely feel like we do need to do a smaller planning I'll see the comprehensive plan is a very high level 30,000 feet you know vision plan however to really understand the area smaller plan gets it even closer to what that area needs and as mentioned in the presentation what is the context what are the assets so that those are the things that we can focus on so definitely something when the comprehensive plan hopefully gets adopted we'll have a list of smaller plans that we can start working on now along with that and my sort of my last comment is is it seems like we're seeing and you sort of alluded to this our David actually alluded to this when he was talking about the cohesive efforts and and that was we're starting to see synergies arise organically between our various planning which makes sense I mean that they all you know mobility impacts development and trails and everything else but and and some that we know in advance that we're seeing that that obviously connect them but to the extent that staff at the various department heads could pay attention to those and maybe see CMO's office could sort of collect those synergistic elements that really dovetail so that we could focus on them in ways to to to accelerate them and improve them and you know not just denote them but actually like you know help them along right just you know from you know working from inside meaning you know hearing some of the thoughts and some of the discussions with the directors there's a lot of synergy going on and hopefully we can put all that together right thank you. Councilmember Armitage. Yes so three issues questions that arose from these slides so first slide number six and you don't have to show the slide but just to know where I'm getting this from the public said preserving open and rural areas and diverse housing options you know are among some of the things that are really important to them those are really important to me too and I was wondering if and the if if staff is already thinking about you know not not only kind of how we can state these as as our values for a comprehensive plan but and build new things up but also to look at the ways in which you know current codes and ordinances you know might unintentionally or intentionally doesn't don't matter but you know create barriers to these things I assume the answer is yes but I was just wondering if you wanted to kind of speak to that so I could get a sense of a preview. Yeah you so some of the the goals and the vision that we've heard you know a lot of it is just reaffirming the stuff that's already in the Den Plan 2030 and certainly you know protecting our open space providing more diverse housing opportunities or options I can say that it's in the Den Plan 2030 obviously we want to see that transition into the 2040 as well as far as how we take that to the next level or to the next step obviously you're correct you know the comprehensive plan is a very guide it's a very high level of guiding document it gives us the guidance in order to make decisions ultimately the codes the standards that we adopt are gonna have to reflect the comprehensive plan how we do that and how it's implemented administered we definitely need to be in line with the comprehensive plan but it's same time making sure that we don't you know hinder some of the the things that we want to accomplish as well through those codes and those standards okay yeah thank you so in other words so this this high-level discussion is coming first and well we've got that in our minds those discussions coming next development code some of the other codes will follow if we need to see an update or amendment we'll definitely make sure but all in all just making sure that again those those standards and those codes are in line with the vision okay yeah and you know just to mention is just one example for instance you know our codes recently you know were for relatively recently have changed to allow accessory dwelling units you know but what we found you know what what I found I haven't heard anyone disagree is that you know there are still a number of barriers you know to getting ADU so it will be interesting to look at kind of the way that we were I don't know if how much it matters you know the way that we word those ideals if for instance in a plan you know if it we weren't specific enough in the 2030 plan maybe in the 2040 plan to saying you know incentivizing diverse housing options or removing barriers to diverse housing options do you know what I mean yeah no councilman I'm sure I think that's a great example right with the dental plan 2030 having more affordable or not affordable but more housing options obviously the then code was done in response to that by allowing more housing options such as accessory dwelling units in residential areas now when the code was drafted obviously there's things that was put together may need to be tweaked a little bit to make sure that it flows better that's something that the staff is currently working on as well to make sure that again not to hinder the vision of the conference plan but to establish some standards in order to get to that exactly okay great thank you and so my second question has to do with slide 9 again you don't have to go to slide 9 but just for anyone who's following wondering where I'm getting this from about kind of looking at different agricultural new land use agricultural land use designations to the ones listed in ranching or I guess it may be three year-old ranching rural heritage and agritourism I'm wondering about you know family farms would that be I don't know if that would kind of come under ranching or if that's a smaller category you know some people have a family farm might not considered a ranch but I know that you know as we're now doing permitting in the ETJ you know there are kind of questions that have come up and things that y'all are you know going through anyway I was wondering if that would be a separate category or would fall under ranching I think it's sort of premature right now this this is a new use a future line use that we're thinking of so I think we need more time to really craft that and I think in the description of that future language designation we'll have a better idea but certainly we'll take in more of the comments that we receive and finalize some what we're thinking and what that should be yeah excellent well I really like that we're considering this because I think that you know I mean there are many ways in which we're seeing I think that our our city codes which kind of make sense in a more urban or even suburban environment might not make as much sense or might not be justified in it in a rural environment so finally about the business innovation idea you know I'll just kind of I'll express my reservation but it's it's not so much a no it's just kind of it's just expressing my you know reservation that you know if you ask almost any business owner is your business innovative you know I think just about anybody would say yes because in some way there is something innovative about every business you know but but you know we've seen examples on council there was one time where you know this this council you know myself included you know said no to a basically you know truck parking facility that was saying it was it was business innovation and so you know I wonder if the solution to you that problem is getting more specific about how we define business innovation and expanding more on that which seems to me I might be misunderstanding what that slide was suggesting or maybe the the opposite where I'm kind of more inclined but again I might change my mind on this is to kind of just back away you know from it because it can get just so subjective and so complicated and to look at instead kind of zoning as just using you know zoning to say that these are the kind of uses we don't want here and these are the kind of uses that are allowed here you know and leaving it up to you know I mean when it comes to incentivizing businesses then the question of is this innovative or not that subjective come up anyway just your comment your question just to kind of recap a little bit right the business innovation is again a very high level future language designation you know a presentation stopped talked about you know a small area planning to kind of you know get more closer to what that area should be in terms of context and assets and in ultimately the zoning is going to dictate you know what goes there and so hopefully through the comprehensive plan the small area plan a little bit more detailed can inform what that zoning should be or what those uses should be in that area so it's all working in line so we would like to get mentioned you know the smaller planning as we mentioned earlier in certain areas that you know we can get closer and identify what zoning district to give the council to give the planning Zoning Commission to give the community an idea of what that area should be thank you and yeah I'll be really eager to and listen very carefully you know to that discussion because I'm skeptical about the small area plan idea but I might end up deciding it's it's a really really good idea councilmember why thank you mayor so to the point about the interactive map is it still up because I can actually cannot find it anywhere I will verify but cityofdenton.com forward slash didn't plan or didn't plan 2040 okay there was a lot I found that website okay and there was some stuff on there but I didn't I wasn't able to find I will make sure that it's available yes so a couple of just little questions what time is the open house on September 16th we are scheduling that from 6 to 8 6 to 8 the in-person or open house yes sir yes ma'am okay my next question is for Ed and have you had an opportunity to visit Denton yet councilman no I have not and I'm intending to be there in September in September you said yes I'll be there for the open house excellent all right well I look forward to meeting you there I know that with the 2030 plan we had a citizens advisory committee that was involved in that do we have that again this year we do not okay and and was is that just a COVID kind of issue or what what would play with the with the 2030 it was a larger effort you know we hadn't updated our plan in you know 15 years with this one is this is just to kind of revisit some of our existing conditions and just update it based on you know major not you know major local issues so we didn't feel the need for a community advisory committee fair enough yeah we're probably not making gigantic changes compared to the 2030 plan right so to council member Armenters point about you know the DDC our codes you know I know that we just had like a big big big overhaul in 2019 what exactly is the process for updating that recently overhauled DDC to reflect the priorities that we lay out in the 2040 plan well you know we are actually bringing forward some code amendments you know through the development code review committee is sort of our sounding board so staff has identified and you know and have heard from the community and you know various folks about what needs to be fixed so we've put a priority list and we're sharing that with the DC RC the development code review committee hopefully with their review and moving some items forward we will bring it forward to the planning zoning Commission and ultimately to the City Council for your own consideration okay excellent that that definitely answers my question so it's sort of on a on a code-by-code basis we're looking at it right you know it's always important you know whenever there's something that needs you know corrections we certainly want to hear it and you know she will have to assess it and then bring it forward in that step you know with the DC RC planning zoning Commission and then City Council okay great thank you Councilmember bet all right this is my second round would it be fair to let mayor pro tem have any questions I haven't raised my hand yet but thank you well no I'm gonna I will follow your your your recognition mr. mayor I just was trying to be fair yes sir thank you so are you recognizing me sir yes okay real briefly then the only comment I wanted to make is as we're going through this process especially say for example on open land development and we're we're we're tweaking it we're physically figuring out the designations the uses that we might not have had before not just for open land but for other uncategorized uses that we're we're encountering and changes to the to the code what always happens is development likes to get in front of those and develop in front of them which then obviates the need for the code changes because that kind of land doesn't exist anymore because they developed it in the old style to get in front of the new changes so I guess what I'm saying is be mindful of this as we go through our standard operating procedures you know this is not a dig against the development community if I had an opportunity to go in and do that I would do it too so I guess is as you're satisfying your very stakeholders we don't want to cut off opportunities for better planning by by unrestricted development understood thank you councilmember I'm looking at the slide number six it says what we've heard so far and it what's what's sticking in my head is the the terminology that says preserve open rule areas and then I'm looking over here under the infrastructure reinvest into the community through infield and so in feeling to me sounds like the urban part of reinvesting into the community is there can you connect that to the preserving the open rule areas if we're talking about small small area plans well the the preserve the open I mean that's more of say the periphery of the city the outskirts of the city further out the infill is what you're talking about in the core of the city right the core of the city but in these open rule areas is that are they gonna have opportunities to is that gonna be like in feeling I mean is everything gonna be I know we're growing out let me just stop there let me stop and think we're growing out and I'm imagining let's say on the north corridor of the city above 288 are we gonna have some little little mixed communities you know or in in the infilling part are we connecting everything like that it's all going to be open rules well the future land use plan is just gonna give an idea what that area should be you know ultimately you know the development will come in and it's something that the council will have to decide in terms of connecting obviously there's the roadway connections there's the parks and trails connections I think that's important to establish as well in those areas so as far as development we don't know for sure what will be there other than in general terms under the future land use map I know that one of the things I hear often is the complaints that come in are what the concerns I'm not gonna use complaints to be positive the concerns that come in is that the development the developers come in and develop the neighborhoods but the infrastructure of the streets you know it seems like that's always to the people that always seems like an afterthought and so it tends to him up the smoothness of getting that development in without so much consternation in putting it in so I'm just gonna assume that that's up for consideration for sure you know as we're going through and really looking at the impact of the roadways before these big large developments come in we had that issue over there off of 288 over here the deer run people they're more I don't it's just seemed to me that they weren't necessarily complaining about the development of itself but the infrastructure that appeared not to have been a part of you know the planning process councilmember bird this is this is a very good point I think this goes back to the discussion we had yesterday when we talked about taking a more comprehensive approach when your city engineer and we're looking at our capital projects when development services is doing a review for a project that we are we're talking to each other on a regular basis and looking at what the developer needs to put in do they pay impact fees what are the city what's the city going to be doing from a capital improvement program and how do we make sure that any impacts to that road that infrastructure that's in place it's replaced to the level it needs to be or they build to the capacity that it needs to be and so those are the things that we are looking at we're confirming and we're working closer together to ensure that but that's a very good point okay Councilman pardon me mayor Pro Tem Melter thank you very much I'll tell you I think this is the most important thing you know this council will work on especially including the kind of code revisions that'll help fulfill the vision and so much appreciation for our wise residents what they have to say one bit of input and then a couple of questions I love the fact that we're consciously trying to knit together the various planning efforts into the comprehensive plan to make sure they tick and tie in fact the mayor's pointed out in the past that sometimes mobility plan and future land use map aren't in agreement and it makes it tough to do policy so mobility plan mass drainage park solid waste I would suggest that a couple of others to kind of tick and tie there's already kind of some nods to the economic development plan in here that would be a conscious one but also the affordable housing strategic plan that you know isn't here yet but I think that would also be one to you know include by reference and tick and tie as appropriate I have a couple of sort of philosophical questions to tap our you know consultants knowledge and mayor if you want to say pursue those offline you know to keep it moving that be alright with me but like that at least you know tee up the questions you addressed the the planned communities definitely are the wave of the present and when you commented about how the master plan communities how they kind of have everything and then you say they will really add but I'm curious what you've seen they seem so self-contained and I'm curious what circumstances you see that lead them to the people in them to be supportive of services for outside the master plan community for the community as a whole what creates the connective tissue and I'll let you respond to that if you choose and I'll ask the other one after that. Thank you Mayor Pro Tem. This is Ed Boyk with Matrix Design Group. You know it's a common question I think a lot of communities are battling with is how to make sure that these master plan communities don't become communities unto themselves where they they through their circulation plans or their design end up being the self-contained bubbles that have no relationship to the rest of the community and while I don't think I have I can point to exact exact examples of where they overcome this I know that the what you'd want to do is be considered of policies in this comprehensive plan and then through the implementation that push for that connectivity to be established whether it was street connectivity or the arrangement of lots on the edges the edge treatment of these communities so that they become a seamless component of your community and integrated with the developments that surround rather than becoming an island unto themselves. So if there's a connective tissue physically well there's lots to think about there and then I'm just sort of tee up for your thoughts you know I'm seeing more and more how our economy is getting reorganized from stores and offices to distribution centers and data centers people you know with more people working from home delivered. As you see business innovation areas whatever that means, acknowledging Council Member Armitage's point, as you see business innovation opportunities coming to communities that are planning you know what are you still seeing that where people are competing for work I know some highly automated manufacturing is coming back on shore I'm wondering if there's you know or to that maybe and I'll take up at least a brief first answer. Thank you Mayor Pro Tem. This is Ed again. That's a really good point you're making and something actually I talked about recently office of the co-worker was what these new industrial areas or employment areas could represent and what we're finding is even through federal policy levels through states and local entities all throughout our industrial economy in the United States there's been efforts put in place to I would almost say create supply chain redundancy or our abilities to weather economic impacts in a way at a local level where you have these clustered industries that could take advantage of supply chain and dependencies between each other so to preserve the ability to manufacture and supply should there be disruptions such as what we recently gone through with the pandemic. So in the innovation area there may be some opportunities to look towards those types of solutions to create those total package industry solutions that are local in Denton rather than far-flung far away and specialized. Wow that's really interesting. Thank you. Lots to think about. Okay and then let's have a couple of things and then we'll move to the next part of presentation. So I want to agree with Councilman Beck on a couple of things and I'm gonna ask for a follow-up and I'm gonna set a timeline for end of this month preferably. I think he makes a solid point that when we're talking about community feedback and I don't I think it's a little low right I'm flying blind but here's what I know we've we've received the feedback at a pace and so I'm asking Ed and his team to project forward right so what is a good number best practices and and you know just best practices community 140,000 people what is a good sample size that it would represent a informed kind of or we've reached enough feedback that we're comfortable with and so they you know whatever that number is we need to have a goal right we don't just need to say we're giving max effort and we're gonna get as many people as possible honey that we need to understand in advance what we project good is on its own just a number with the community then we can rank where we are and we can get active and trying to drive that number up to hit that that mark but we don't have a mark that I'm aware of and if we already have it great send it to me and then I and Scott did you want to speak to that before just just a couple of pieces I want to make you aware of I will tell you that we're having an open house mid September so I believe September the 17th we're just finalizing the dates and we're gonna we're gonna highlight that at the Development Services Center we're gonna have all of our associated departments parks and rec community services economic development the chamber we're gonna have that open house in person we're probably gonna have a couple different events in person to solicit additional feedback as well as matrix will be providing a virtual open house so for two weeks we'll be soliciting more feedback so we'll get that information and then of course we'll we'll get Ed's viewpoint on what he believes that number would look like for you know a community of our size sure yeah no and I think that's great I mean those two can work and I think he needs to commit to what's good based on statistics and etc etc and then we those efforts will drive to that number but at least we'll have a number of you know set a goal and absolutely we and we had a completely different plan of course pre-pandemic and this is very very much been a challenge I think that I will tell you from my experience of going through this process we've been pretty fortunate with our our online and the number of participants we intended I'm going to various schools throughout the community and having individual open houses where we might see five ten maybe the max of 20 people at each of those events having people in the hundreds was great so okay yeah no and I think and I take your point and I think those two can run parallel I think we can say we're doing great all things considered but in a in a perfect world here's statistically good for our analysis and so yeah thank you very much for that and then the I think Ron I want to kind of give some guidance hopefully in advance of that in-person meeting and on the back half of this I think we need to give some sort of indication for citizens on the percentage of control that we have for example if you're talking open spaces absent us owning it right we're limited and what we can do right and so citizens need to kind of understand no different than that interactive budgeting tool that you kind of hey you're over budget you know on the website we got to kind of have to communicate that to say we can't get into what kind of brick you use we can't do these things and so at least that didn't that didn't stop the input but at least it's it's not misleading to you know to say hey look this this 200 acres we'd love to say what to do with it in order to do that we need to buy it you know it's and so I think you know so that may be hey we have 10% control over this item or if it's something that we have more control over this is 90% of the stuff that we have control over but at least that way we're communicating to those that we're interacting with that they kind of have a clear understanding of hey this is state of Texas County whatever those regulations limits our activity here but if you want to focus on these things great if you want to talk across board great but at least people kind of have some direction from us and then kind of getting back to another thing that councilman Beck touched on I think it's really critical that and I'll defer to you on how we do that but that's a big pain point of mind as well if we if we roar like a lion we're going to scare developers away to the old plan right and all our meetings are public they're posted a week in advance we talk have work sessions there's plenty of time to get in under the old code before the new one so I think whatever whatever process process or policy you believe is most effective to bring people to the table and let's talk versus running them away or running them to the old code or old practices is important and obviously you interact with them regularly so whatever you can do around that is fantastic just want to echo that because I think it's a really good thing and we cannot ask the cable industry when they're trying to stop theft I mean you just you never get in front of it so I want to kind of bring them in and have a conversation and then lastly I think I'd like to see along the first around that point I'd like to see some sort of I know you track it or look at it but some kind of regular reporting to the council on open spaces in in that rural area that that we might be ripe for us to hey consider land purchase here consider land purchase there I know it's a latter part of the bond but it is obviously it passed in the bond and it's important to the citizens and so kind of a regular update and it could be Friday reports or something just kind of a regular I guess it'd be need to be legal reports so that we don't price ourselves out of the market but but but some sort of you know it could be quarterly I mean I defer to you I don't have a specific time in place but I just think that would be good to know and so as those opportunities roll around or as you kind of say hey developments take and shape this way we may want to act on this or that you know I'd love to take your guidance along that so I'm sure Gary loves to hear that yes he has his hands in all the pots yes he does so mayor just some clarification on that if we could because I want to make sure so not just in the ETJ though you want to look at Gary's looking holistically I mean all across the city and actually will be coming back to council here very quickly in a closed session regarding some options he's already got his eye on a lot of things and he's way ahead of the curve but I'll have Gary work with with Ron's and he's already doing it through the permitting process when a development comes in Gary's involved and right in there in the middle of it looking at where we can get park space or open space but we will continue to look at that as well as now the ETJ so that we don't miss on that out on opportunities yeah no that's fantastic and just a regular update on that it would be would be really good to understand you know where those opportunities are so okay go right ahead okay yeah no we're gonna go ahead and you will come back I mean I waited two rounds and we I'm just not gonna but I had a response to mayor Pro Tem's comment which came last go ahead Ron okay so a couple of months ago there was a request to bring the council more information on form-based code and we we wanted to put it along with this presentation because we feel that it is related to the comprehensive plan update so with that I'm just gonna turn it over to Ed and he's gonna take this part of the presentation as well excellent thank you Ron mayor council again my name is Ed Boyk with matrix design group and I have just a handful slides for you to go through regarding form-based code and Ron let's move on to the next slide that has the slide 14 is that up on the screen yes it is thank you okay so I just want to kind of go through brief in brief you know what our form-based codes and what they are not form-based codes are land development regulations so they're really no different than any other design regulation or traditional Euclidean use regulation or typical zoning for community however it's different I'm you know in that is a different type of regulation that focuses on building form like function and appearance and mostly on the building form and its appearance set and how it's set from the site it's less focused on you and in some cases form-based codes have no focus on use at all it allows the form of the building to dictate how a building is to be used but what they do really effectively is they help support a place place making the complementary design between what's done in the public realm and on the private property to create an environment that follows a vision so they're really good at that but what they're not they're not design rate design guidelines they are not purpose to enforce specifically although they can have elements to do this they're not designed to enforce a certain architectural style they're not designed to enforce certain colors and things like that that people might look to have in a building they are not historic preservation codes I mean they are not designed to in a pure sense to create a historic preservation environment preserve existing structures in that fashion or or to support infill in historic preservation areas that are compatible with the historic environment they certainly are not a solution for everything they have their place they have their purpose and they are just one of the tools that's in the toolbox of all land development codes that could be considered if used in the right place and in the right way next slide so they do have certain advantages and certain disadvantages that go along with them one of the significant disadvantages I'm just going to jump into that column first is that they're unfamiliar because they are a tool not used often and oftentimes when there are when they are used they're not used exactly as they are are built to be used and it does require education of your staff it requires education of your community and of the developers and landowners so that they understand how to use the tool if they're not educated if they're not familiar with that they're gonna be a reject the tool and it's not going to be able to be useful for the community but one of the big advantages of a form-based code as I was saying on the other slide is that it is a tool that can readily implement that urban vision and really integrate seamlessly into existing development so it gives you a very predictable built environment there is a path for success for form-based codes that I'll go on it into on an upcoming slide but it's important the form-based codes are really great for taking a vision and putting a program to it and then provided there's the will of the community to see this through there's a strong community support for it there's strong property owner support and developer support it can easily push a result that achieves that vision the end result those buildings tend to be more adaptable and reusable in place rather than having to be demoed and reconstructed as they would in a more traditional learning approach if they're designed correctly form-based codes can help reduce that regulatory burden and streamline process but all of that really goes back to a well-educated staff of very precisely designed code that knows what it wants to accomplish and a lot of buy-in from the community you may have to integrate some of those traditional regulations into a form-based code meaning standards for compatibility or architecture or lighting or parking because they don't form-based codes often don't address all those elements adequately by themselves and sometimes especially in areas where you're trying to transition from one type of built environment to another and use form-based codes with that tool you need some of these supplemental tools to help you get there so like a lot of development code that becomes a hybrid of a lot of different mechanisms to achieve a vision especially when you consider use because form-based codes are light on use there is a potential for a lot of compatibility impact that are unforeseen because you don't have a lot of regulation for it so that's where that other support and other tools such as compatibility standards and use standards to a light degree parking and lighting and landscaping and everything else might help but importantly again form-based codes are not a solution for everything they're not right in all circumstances but if you do it right they can be a huge asset and beneficial next slide so I personally have had experience seeing as a government public planner a form-based code from an idea on a plan through implementation as a code and I wanted to kind of walk through my experience with that to give you an example of how it could be approached and what I believe is a proper path to success Peoria Illinois Rust Belt community in Illinois almost Caterpillar heavy equipment manufacturer an older city one of the oldest cities in the state of Illinois has a large portion of the community was built on with a traditional urban environment it's got some similarities to that and there is a university integrated in there a lot the great old neighborhoods but it's also experiencing a lot of development on the fringe and there was a want by the council and the community to reinvigorate the older parts of the community and they did it through a couple different things and what I believe is the proper path of success and I really want to stress this is being important for form-based codes is that you need to have a very strong plan that plan needs to be very comprehensive have an extremely strong vision and have conducted a very strong assessment of what you're trying to what kind of what your result is to be what that vision is we when I was involved with this there is a lot of assessment and study of the built environment to the existing assets and how to capitalize on them retain those really valuable pieces and then to develop additional structures that support that so the plan had to be really good it had to be something that the community had total buying in for and it also had to be something that not only the community support but the development community the financiers and neighborhood components everybody was just understood what the purpose was why we're doing it as a community and why it was so important from that it gave strong implementation about how to zone this and use own form-based code through something called a regulating plan it's really just a zoning method it's just a different type of one the regulating plans do reinforce a street and building relationship between the private development and the street development and where I found that where we found in Peoria over where they were most useful was to really hone in on those special places those place making areas and I'm on the map that you see the regulating time you see and I apologize if it's a little hard to read and everything I'll try to describe it we this particular area was honed in as being the core of a neighborhood on the West Bluff neighborhood of Peoria Illinois and the area that's in white and what the colors on the street is the area where the form-based code applies and applies only to that area because that's the area that was intensely studied that had community buy-in had existing assets and the form-based code could be successful and really readily implement that urban division that was established by the plan so the orange color for instance describe standard for how the building should address the street which was the main street and actually Main Street through that area as those properties turned and head towards the neighborhood that we have like purple shading and blue shading and yellow shading that those were different form-based standard for the different side of the private property to ensure that the uses transition the property back into the largely single-family two-family and mixed I'm sorry multifamily areas surrounding this main corridor area this area is also a budding a university an urban university Bradley University in Peoria as well so there was an intent that the form-based area was going to support not only the local neighborhood economy but also the student population students shopping the student entertaining and whatever else but then also we want to make sure that stayed in that main core and then outside that area we still need it suitable and easy for the neighborhoods to develop so the areas in gray did not have a pure form-based code on them they did not have a pure traditional zoning code on the mirror it was a hybrid code the hybrid code that a bridge between a pure form-based approach and the zoning a traditional use-based approach which made it a lot easier for homeowners to continue to develop and use their properties without having to adhere to that really strict and defined standards of the form-based code the form-based code was successful and has been implemented with development because it had clear standards really well-drafted clear consistent standards that use diagrams to support the text of the code and we simplified and streamlined the process as an incentive for people who wanted to follow the form-based code in those areas they got I guess I got the short line they got to go through an administrative review they they knew what to expect and as long as they checked the boxes they they got their approvals in a heartbeat so if there is a path for success to form-based code I think it really it focuses on making sure you have a good study of the area in place if you're realistic about where it's appropriate and where it's not and knowing it's not the tool that's going to work everywhere and then develop standards that are extremely clear simple to use utilize the diagrams to explain the differences clearly to the community and to make sure that you know education programs are in place to support the staff the community and so on to really use the form-based code just as a good tool and with that next slide I wanted to thank you for the opportunity to speak to you today both about the comprehensive plan update and the form-based code and we do have the websites for the comprehensive plan update listed in there on that slide as well and as has been noted before we really wanted to report back what we've heard so far because the community outreach is not done yet and the event in-person in September is going to add tremendously to the feedback we've gotten so far and then with the virtual component being live for an additional two weeks after that it's going to be accessible to anyone who chooses to or cannot be in person they're going to be able to participate in the exact same fashion online so I think we'll get we'll get to that threshold of what is good enough or what is appropriate for the amount of community engagement we can get for the community and give us a lot more confidence to add to the confidence that we already had about the public engagement we've had so far so thank you again for your time today okay thank you and questions for staff councilor Armitage yes so first I just want to respond to mayor pro tem's comment about master planned communities I completely concur you know with the concerns expressed there you know and we'll be interested to see you know moving forward you know how disparity is and possibly how disparities that exist in the 2030 code between saying on the one hand we want to preserve all this on the one hand we want to develop all this you know what how they can be kind of better reconciled to provide clear direction you know this this is one of those areas you know anyway I'm not so sure if we want if if I want I should say 2040 plan to get into the weeds of kind of talking about master plan communities maybe that wasn't the suggestion in the slide and it was just being used in it is an example but anyway I concur you know with with those concerns so about form-based codes I'm I'm excited about I'm excited that we're even having this discussion I love the idea of a form-based code I want it as much as as we can get it as I see it there are things about our current code really not even our current code just the way we conceive of codes and have since before any of us you know we're here that unwittingly enable segregation by you know having certain neighborhoods that are restricted and are being restricted to single-family housing you know and having other residential neighborhoods where you know well if you can't afford to own your own home you know you have to live here here here right so it ends up you know and so one of the great advantages of a form-based code is is desegregation right of neighborhoods and giving more people access to different kinds of neighborhoods more flexibility for where people can live and it also does away with or ideally anyway you know some of the concerns that people have for instance people who say you know I don't want apartments in my neighborhood well sometimes if you interrogate that well why because they're so big and tall well what if we make a rule that you know a form-based code doesn't say for instance you can't have you know you can't have duplexes or triplexes or quad I was forget the four plexes or quad plexes whatever you know four plexes it says you know it might but it might say you know you can't have a building that's taller than two stories you know you can only have a one-story building right and then you can show and I love that it mentions on the slide this is this is some input on my part the importance of diagrams you know and I think that not only diagram nothing instead of diagrams but in addition to diagrams and I don't even know if this is possible although technologically it certainly is to have actual photographs you know sample photographs of what these things of what examples would look like for instance a a triplex that looks just like the houses in the neighborhood right so anyway I'm strongly in favor of this for the reasons I just stated you know and and I think and if there's consensus to on on council to you know further pursue this I'd be very curious to kind of have these conversations with residents who are public conversations with residents who are skeptical about it to find out you know well what is it that you don't like about apartments in your neighborhood I think it'll vary by neighborhood right but if we can kind of get at the details of that we can come up with solutions that might not make everybody happy but that will be more equitable and more flexible. Councilmember Bet. Thank You Mayor yeah I'm gonna echo some of that that that councilmember Arntor just said I will say that my interest in this is is is less so I don't want my you know McDonald's to have a southwest flair like you see in New Mexico sometimes that's that's that wouldn't be what my interest is for for form-based codes but more this issue of not necessarily transitioning to them but and maybe this is more of a question to Ed is where is it where is it benefit flexibility which is what a lot of what I think council Armitage was getting at and and having getting over the hump and barriers of complaints about breaking the character of a neighborhood I don't know that I mean my concern is you know how do we use it in a way that you know again doesn't doesn't make a Southwest McDonald's but at the same token allows for multi-use flexibility is there a flip side to - I need a three-sided coin here one of one of my other concerns though is I don't I don't want to redefine some some of the comments that Ed had and and this is where I'm super glad you have some expertise and maybe this is actually a question to Ed and and that is where can we avoid telling a neighborhood what their form should be and then rather adopting the existing character of a neighborhood and then allowing flexible use within that character I think that's honestly more what people in Denton from my conversations anyway would like to have is take the existing character this sort of organically developed on its own and then have a character character consistent mixed use within that and is there a way I guess to sort of combined form and and I was especially interested in the that sort of transitional form-based codes that he talked about for priori as pretty providing connective tissue to the rest of Piora Peoria so if either you or Ed could comment on that I'd really like to know I'll see if Ed can address both comments there's a lot there's a lot sorry back comment so I'll see if I can boil it down you did mention that you know the integrity of a neighborhood is pretty important so a lot of people in Denton and there's like there are different many different mechanisms that are available to do that but form-based codes don't have to be the one that achieves that when we did and in Peoria the form-based hybrid code it really the right way to I guess the other way to determine it would be that it was a traditional development code that had character-based design standards for that area meaning that these were it was an over look it almost could have been an overlay that identified the way the house should be designed to be can continue to be compatible with that area there was a strong preference by the community to retain the single-family nature of many of those areas that were predominantly single-family and there was a strong desire by the community for the areas that were a mix of single-family and two-family to be kept that character as well but there wasn't a strong want by anybody in Peoria at that time to introduce higher density concepts there now where that could be helpful though is on the edges so if you and I say edges meaning the edges of your form-based core so when I referred to that regulating plan with having those colors that kind of led into the more traditional area perhaps those areas that were you know color-coded on the transition would be the right place to put a higher intensity so you kind of got down into the neighborhood you continue to preserve the integrity but on the edges of those predominant residential areas you've provided provisions or you've given them provisions for more units or more walkable filed development that can be supported and can be an asset to as well be the form-based core in that area so there's like it to take a step back to begin there's a lot of ways to get there form-based codes don't have to be the solution to that they can be one depending on the way you want to approach it a lot of the existing tools that are available to a community through your typical zoning code overlays character and neighborhood development plans and overlays can can largely take care of a lot of these a lot of the compatibility issues unless you're looking to go in a different direction where you really take the hands off the wheel on uses and let the market have more flexibility but like I indicated on a previous slide when you take the hands off the wheel there are a lot of unintended consequences and conflicts that can pop up and you may have to resort to some of those compatibility standards nonetheless to make sure that the form-based code doesn't drastically alter a character that was expected in an area I just want to follow up real briefly and ask is is there to that last point this sort of concept of the the hybrid approach and technology is there is there I mean I know you're going to be advising our team here locally but is there is there particular you know good good and and bad things that that inhibit you from moving forward in in in the hybrid approach or so either way you know I don't I don't recall things that inhibited what I do remember is that there were opportunities for redevelopment within neighborhoods infill lot-by-lot infill that resulted in more compatible structures and uses based upon the context so I remember a lot of the info location ended up with helpers that were you know not garage forward and had the appropriate roof pitches to be complementary to the area so they were they were supportive of the context they blended in you could tell they were new but they were not a traditional suburban garage forward home and an otherwise you know walkable Porsche forward type neighborhood so they I didn't I didn't see that as being an inhibit and inhibiting any development in that area rather because we had done a good job of engaging with the community and the education there was an understanding for the expectation on how to get through the process quickly and the development responded to that thing that is being a financial and time advantage for them to see their development move forward thank you councilman armature just wanted to say briefly I concur with apologies I'm forgetting your name and I can concur with Ed that you know not at least as I understood what you were saying you know having a kind of fully form-based code could lead to problems that there's a balance I definitely agree with that just wanted to make it clear that that was my view and I think that you know there are many ways in which we lean too heavily on uses in our codes but that doesn't mean to do away with uses entirely any other questions for staff member to Meltzer storing up a question just a thought on master plan communities to extent that it is going to get kind of covered in the comprehensive plan a thought would be you know to encourage each master plan community to have some unique amenity that's intended for the entire city and then as a result you end up with a network of plant communities and each you know provide a unique amenity and that that's becomes kind of connective tissue that's just a concept on open space you know responding to the topic of control and kind of expectations of the public I would suggest that that a good process would be to articulate our goals ultimately in terms of the map the desired pattern of preservation and then to develop arms-length incentives that give Gary tools I mean he's really quite excellent at using the tools that we have and maybe maybe there are more so that he can you know so that developers know what we're shooting for it gets him the ability to work you know with them more creatively and then the whatever purchases we need to make can be better targeted to fill in the gaps in that plan so I think we can achieve it's like like most things in life if you have a goal what a plan you can probably control more than you think you can last on on form-based codes really my question is just what what do we see as next steps and I want to sort of suggest maybe there's a parallel path that one piece of the work would be within the affordable housing work to size it you know how much impact do we think this approach can have as we saw for what number of units in total are we targeting for target targeting to achieve of affordable housing you know and then kind of rank order this within the list of tactics that are going to be recommended so that's one bad size it you know and rank it and sequence it and then you know just can that be parallel path with working out all this careful process illustration detail where the garage door goes with the roof pitches should be you know so that it would fit existing neighborhoods characters to ensure success so you know hopefully that question is what are the next steps Scott mr. mayor if I might thank you sure and I think maybe that's a great way to summarize maybe all of the comments what we've heard this afternoon are great I will tell you that one of the biggest next steps for us will be the open house that we're going to have that will be announcing very shortly I will say that on our next comp plan update that will include maybe a little bit more detail will refine some of the scope and incorporate some of what we've heard I think with the form-based discussion and maybe that we can solicit a little bit more work from matrix as we as we flush this out and how we can use it within our community maybe we can schedule a little more time with matrix in our community as well as maybe a little bit early but we do have a new planning director that will be starting with us September 1st she has some experience in form-based code and in particular in hybrid so we can we can get some of that information maybe in a Friday report in the coming weeks and certainly we'll wanted that open house to be while she was here and on board give her a couple of weeks to get her feet wet but we'll bring forward some of what we've heard here today we'll make sure that matrix is soliciting feedback in the open house both in the virtual open house as well as in person and to your point mayor pro tem Meltzer Gary will be a part of that open house so they'll they'll have some staff present as well as we look at the inclusion of all of our master plans with the comp plan in that comprehensive approach as our city manager is directed so I think that all of that works well we'll have that open house we'll come back to council with an update of where we're at and maybe explore a little more on form-based or the idea of whether it's a hybrid form-based or maybe some overlays and some ideas that will work specifically here in Denman okay thank you for the time council member I with all of that being said thank you very much it sounds simple enough to me but I'm looking at the term focusing what they are focused focuses on building form site function and appearance and looks like there's a little oxymoron instead what they are not design guidelines how do we what is why am I looking at that as though focusing on building form site function appearance not part of the design guidelines and I'll address that I think there's there's that's - there's two different elements there so and I'll use the squares an example so where it is that we we have the square the square already has many elements that exist it doesn't have a form-based code that highlights how the square works but we have design guidelines that in turn keep the character of the square allows the flexibility of what it is that we're doing on the square so it functions like a form-based code but it is not a form-based code it's design guidelines so Ed and I don't know if you want to piggyback on that anymore yes thank you that's a pretty good description because a form-based code when it focuses on a parent when I'm when I when I included a parent there the intent is that how it appears to address the street how it appears from you know maybe a division of story but not necessarily the material element of the structure so a form-based code appearance standard could be related to roof pitch but it may not tell you what type of material goes on the roof or what the windows look like exactly how many divided plates should be put into it you know how much of the front of the building should be glazed with window it may not go into all those details I do want to stress that often an element that is included in form-based code because ultimately a code by it you know you itself is not enough to achieve a vision that's desired by a community and so these the design portion or the appearance portion of a form-based code can become much more robust and it's important if you're trying to use this as a tool to incentivize development in an area to be careful about how that's approach so that you don't create a disincentive to development in there because of extremely rigid and flexible standards that expect one particular result rather form-based code is often predicated upon the ability to build once and then be able to reuse and have some flexibility with how it's implemented so there's always a balance it's going to depend on that planning effort and where the focus is and then the level of code that's a vision by the community is being appropriate in those areas and again going back to what Scott said exactly sometimes it can be an intense design guidelines and while the square may have design guidelines it doesn't have form standards that also support that it's still realized upon the use and the design guidelines to dictate use moving forward so hopefully that muddy the waters a little bit more okay all right okay thank you very much hold the date September 16th that's our day that's where we're going got it thank you very much for your time uh-huh appreciate it that concludes item a takes us to item B which is ID 2 1 1 6 2 9 receive report hold discussion and provide direction on a proposed data center project on property leased from the city of Denton Energy Center good afternoon mayor see council Terry Nolte assistant general manager at DME good afternoon I'm gonna pull up my presentation all right okay good afternoon now I want to spend some time today answering questions that council has brought up about this proposed data center that we've discussed with you about three weeks ago we've had a number of questions that have come up by council members and by others about certain aspects of the project and just want to be transparent about exactly what the project is and what it isn't so as you may recall this is a project that we're proposing to be cited at the Denton Energy Center on 31 acres of lease property it's being developed by Tanaska power solutions under contract with the eventual owner there is a nondisclosure agreement between the city of Denton and Tanaska and that's the reason why we have not disclosed the owners name that will be forthcoming the owner is a established blockchain infrastructure company they have a number of facilities across North America and they have a number of patents on blockchain technology as well so very sophisticated player in this space their facilities are all predicated on a hundred percent carbon neutral business model at each of their facilities so four primary benefits that we want to go through here today one is the environmental benefits and sustainability impacts secondly how the facility will actually improve the ERCOT grid reliability third talk about the economics of the project as it relates to the general fund revenues and fourth finally how it impacts electric rates here in Denton so when we think about this project coming to Denton a lot has been said about the large electric demand that the facility will place on the grid and it seems it seems a little counterintuitive to think that a large electric consumer would have a beneficial environmental impact but that is the case with this particular site so as you see here on the slide what we're doing is we're comparing the carbon emissions from this facility it cited in Denton versus the carbon emissions that would be associated with the same size facility located in either China or elsewhere in ERCOT and the table on the left shows you the actual annual generation mix in ERCOT in 2020 you can see coal was seventeen point nine percent of the total makeup of generation in ERCOT renewables was twenty two point eight percent in 2020 China on the other hand sixty seven percent coal and only eight point nine percent renewables in 2018 didn't have more current data to compare 2020 to 2018 a couple of reasons why we're using China the primary one is that we've you've probably read that a lot of these data mining operations cryptocurrency mining operations are moving from China to the US the Chinese government is now no longer encouraging this technology they from what I've read believe that it has the potential to undermine the control of the Chinese central bank by instituting or recognizing cryptocurrency as a form of legal tender secondly the environmental impacts as you can see China with a large coal fleet the energy intensity of these operations in that mix of generation does in fact create a significant CO2 emission source these facilities in China have typically been mobile a lot of them are mobile facilities where they're moved to hydroelectric facilities during periods of extreme weather rain fall events and that surplus electricity rather than spilled being spilled over the dam is used to power these facilities however there was a downside associated with that once the surplus water was over they moved over to different places in the grid and then were connected up to these coal-fired generators so as you can see on the right two million tons a year of CO2 emissions from a facility this size in China a 1.1 million tons per year if the facility were located in a non hundred percent renewable area and in Denton since we're a hundred percent renewable zero so a very significant reduction in carbon emissions secondly and this is a little more technical I'm trying to try this to simplify this as much as I can we think about the electric grid in Texas we think about the energy that when we turn a light switch on it powers our lights our fans our motors but there are other products besides electricity the energy itself that are necessary in order to keep the grid reliable those are referred to as ancillary services and they're really a set of reserves or surplus energy that's online in order to maintain the frequency of the grid the little diagram shows that we have a balancing act going on here between supply and demand every millisecond of every day and the idea what ERCOT does is they balance that supply and demand with resources in order to keep that needle as close to 60 Hertz as possible when it moves to the right and gets an increase then we need to slow down the machines in order to get it back into balance when it moves to the left we need to speed up and get back into balance so there are four products they're used responsive reserve service which is a service that is a market based offering that we buy and sell DME buys and sells in the market it's a ten minute responsive reserve which means that when ERCOT calls on it to get this balance back in it has to be available and producing within 10 minutes regulation up and regulation down that's to that has to be responsive within five minutes and that's to make sure that when when incremental demands come on when motors are turned off when the wind stops blowing when the weather forecast is missed all these different variations allow these products to be used to balance that supply and demand so they regulate up and they regulate down and the non spinning reserves are as the word indicates generators that are not generating but can be brought online in 30 minutes to meet an emergency requirement so these products are absolutely essential to the reliability of the grid and the proposed data center will be a provider of these services to the grid the data center is a fully interruptible load which means it can go from the full demand to zero in less than a minute therefore it qualifies for three of those ancillary services the rake up rake down and responsive reserves it also can act as a non spinning reserve if the facility is at full capacity or some portion of capacity you can shut down completely and that is equivalent to a generator coming online in the system every day the facility will forecast the price of these ancillary services and we'll make a commercial decision whether to consume electricity or to sell ancillary services to the market then they can do a combination of any of those products in order to maximize the revenue to the data center so it's a significant source of potential revenues for the data center besides the cryptocurrency mining and the blockchain operations that they're doing these resources provide immediate relief for necessary ancillary service demands unlike a generator which would take four years to permit and construct this facility will be online in less than six months and so it will bring a significant source of additional ancillary service or reliability services to the grid immediately and the demand is dispatchable so as market conditions change the facility can choose to economically run or to not run or to sell any of these ancillary services as a result of winter storm yuri ERCOT recently in the last three to four weeks has increased its purchase of ancillary services that is in an effort to stabilize the grid I think we've had I've heard the term ERCOT has a fragile grid well one of the ways to strengthen that grid is to procure more of these reserves on an hour to hour basis so you have more safety valve if you will a safety valve is larger in the event that you have a unit trip offline a gas pipeline interruption the wind doesn't show up the way it was anticipated so what ERCOT has done is they're increasing the amount of ancillary services that they're buying and these types of resources are exactly what they need in order to meet that new demand to give you an indication of how real this is during winter winter storm yuri we spent 49 million dollars on ancillary services DME did that was with the cost of that reliability was even during a period of unreliable energy so it's a very large potential source of revenue for this facility we'll talk a little about the economics of the project each year the DME and yesterday you heard in our budget discussions about the franchise fee and return on investment so we pay 5% of electric gross revenues to the city each year as a franchise fee 80% of that goes to the street fund we also provide a return on investment to our single shareholder the city of Denton of three and a half percent for 2021 that's actually at 6% and we'll drop back to three and a half percent in 2023 fiscal year 23 we also have a sales tax on the sale of electricity that comes to the city and from this particular facility there will be significant investment in equipment and that will result in over a million dollars of property tax from the site improvements so for the project I'm going to give you the ranges of what we anticipate based upon a full build out so these are 2000 fiscal year 2023 the first full year of operation the annual range is projected to be between 9 and 11 million dollars franchise fees make up four and a half four to four and a half of course 80% of that would go to the street fund unless this council decides that you wanted to to change that percentage the ROI and taxes amount to between five and six and a half million per year and that's at the three and a half percent obviously at six percent during fiscal year 2022 that we're just getting ready to embark upon that number would be significantly higher there inside of that tax ROI and taxes is about three million dollars of sales tax and property taxes so the incremental general fund available revenue available to this council if this project is approved is between five point eight and seven point four million dollars per year without approval the project these funds will not be available and the use of the funds is purely discretionary by this council one of the things that we've spoken with several view about is how to take some of this money and your market for sustainability and certainly you can do that by ordinance you just need to figure out what you want to spend the money on and you can do it by ordinance some funding examples on the sustainability side this is by far this is not an exhaustive list just a few samples of things and the costs that we might be looking at so under the climate adaption and resiliency we could get developing the climate action plan saves about 2.4 million 2.5 million metric tons through 2030 at a cost of about a half a million dollars increasing or supporting electric vehicle adoption and here in this example 30% gasoline passenger adoption which would be 15 to 20,000 vehicles it saves 450,000 metric tons of carbon and would require about a seven million dollar investment for charging infrastructure other environmental improvements green space you can see the numbers tree canopies forest area improving grassland tree planting and then the list goes on the sustainability department would be glad to give you even more details on the options that they've looked at and the equivalent carbon reductions there's been interest in air quality monitoring we think that for $60,000 we could put in an air monitoring a small air monitoring network here in Dent and of course sustainability includes energy efficiencies and increasing energy efficiency through social equity programs like low-income weatherization pretty significant reductions of 845 pounds of equivalent co2 per year per home at about $3,500 per home with a pool of money that we're talking about from this project you could do quite a few homes if the council decided to do that electric rate stabilization another key benefit of this project as you've heard in our budget presentations the cost of URI was about 140 million dollars this projected this project is anticipated to provide a net income contribution of between eight and nine million dollars at full build out that is net income to DME not to the city to DME so that's to our bottom line and that would offset the cost of winter storm URI which is somewhere between 5.9 and 6.3 million per year that's the debt cost associated with that 140 million of long-term debt that we're placing so without that as we come back to you and later this year to talk about rates the potential impact is about 3% and that would be sometime if you were to approve such a rate increase without this project that would be about a 3% rate increase in order to cover that 5.9 to 6.3 million dollars per year so just in summary because it's a lot of numbers the ranges are shown here on the left so eight million to nine million dollars of electric fund relief electric rate relief a hundred percent of that net income would go to electric rate relief annual surplus franchise fee after 80% dedicated to the street fund would give you eight hundred to nine hundred thousand dollars per year ROI and taxes somewhere between five and six and a half million dollars a year so discretionary funding to this council from this project would be five point eight to seven point four million dollars per year so for today the direction we're asking for is any additional information that you would need in order to support this project and gain approval and to discuss how you might assuming that you wanted to move forward with the project how you might gain consensus on how to use these incremental general funds we anticipate being back before you on August 17th for a closed session to discuss the power purchase agreement with the eventual owner of the data center we'll also have a zoning hearing and action to rezone that property at the deck and then we'll have two individual consideration items the power purchase agreement and the lease agreement after those are approved then the project would move into the development permitting phase and if all goes smoothly the first phase of the project would be online in December with that I will be glad to answer any questions and if we could so we'll discuss amongst ourselves but really while staff is standing there understanding it's a passionate issue but let's really try to be succinct in question and answer and and not really advocating or that sort of thing let's get the answers we need give and so summarizing and correct me where I'm wrong Terry I have noted you need information with respect to what information additional information is needed to make a decision so that we can prepare for the work session and then current my note not yours current support because if we don't have support we want to indicate that early so that you can prepare the the rate increase presentation etc etc so we can communicate that clearly and then really that's gonna it's gonna be kind of choose your own destiny book you're too young to remember those books but it's gonna be kind of what that I have some other notes but we'll see where we fall so again questions for staff succinct as possible less diet I just want to make sure we get maximized time with staff and then we can discuss amongst ourselves councilmember back thank you mayor I'm not known for for being succinct but I'll do my best so in the form of a question we'll lead off with a question is it fair to say a couple weeks ago is pretty hard about the onion about the current conservation issues that originally at the time with that presentation that I you can you can be honest that was I was a pretty good I ask a lot of questions about conservation let's put it that way is that fair to say yes sir yeah just to be I'm always honest so I will say that mr. Nolte Terry indicated that he'd been in consultation with a number of council members and I'm happy to say I was one of those people and I had great qualms and concerns at the beginning about essentially what looked like on the surface as doubling the energy demands of Denton I will say and this is a bit of a critique to you and Tony you you sold this poorly three weeks ago and I'll just be honest you sold it much better today and you you illustrated some of the issues that I had concerns about I will say that you know bringing in the concepts of the the carbon load that we would be reducing from moving to China moving off of fossil fuel grids in the United States actually moving to our 100 percent renewable portfolio each of those is incremental reductions in carbon now I guess the analogy I will say is that what we have is essentially a runaway team from from Asia that we are fostering potentially and we have the opportunity here not just to foster that child and run around but be the adult in the room and run around behind them turning off the lights which is akin to your 100 percent control and dimming it during periods of a high energy demand which increases the reliability as you said I will also say though that we the opportunity to move past that and take an extension to set a tone for best practices one of those best practices is identify businesses that we can connect to our renewables which you didn't mention in this presentation right here we'd be actually increasing the demand in Texas for renewables by purchasing so much renewables a second thing I wanted to point out was that I'm not sure I could completely go get on board with it except I would like to see that earmarking that you talked about as possible discretionary funding I think that was what would sell me on a project like that is not just fostering the runaway team and running around turning off the lights and telling them to clean their bedroom in the sense of making a bedroom available for emergency guests which is your reliability analogy but I would also say that we have the opportunity to say for this business which maybe some people have qualms about crypto mining I do it's it's not a it's not socially exciting business but the opportunity to use the monies to change the conservation behavior and best practices within Denton that you you know some of those policies that you illustrated I think are really important we can we can take this opportunity to say we want to say to businesses that not only will you use a renewable portfolio as we specified but we want you to take these extra steps to contribute to say a sustainability fund if that's the direction we want to go that augments social equity practices for example not just have a solar fund or Green Sense fund but maybe socially equitable grants to low-income individuals talk about you know we can we can increase our conservation through enhanced monitoring of our air quality that everyone worries about and so not just use the reliability of West Texas and solar but the the reliability in in the city of Denton and use those funds for you know changing mobility planning to increase conservation so I guess what I'm saying is I mean I think there's opportunities here to make this a model system for how we want businesses to behave how we want to see our economic development in the future and I think I'm going to tease you a little bit I think you and Tony need to learn to identify the salient features that appeal to the citizens of Denton more so than just looking at the financial piggy bank kind of elements of it so I guess I didn't I wasn't succinct and I didn't really ask Tony much questions but I will I will pass the dais okay one moment got councilmember armature I have a question and then some comments my question is did did staff seek out this this unnamed company or did they come to us who made the first move councilmember armature I think as we explained a few weeks ago we were approached by Tanasca as the developer they have a business where they work with a number of these blockchain companies to try to find spots in the grid that have available transmission and electric capacity and that's who we that's who brought this opportunity to us yeah so Tanasca brought the opportunity of this this unnamed company I mean cryptocurrency and did they know did did Tanasca in coming to to staff did they say you know look I know you know with Yuri and everything we have the kind of position you're in we think we could we could help you you could help us you know did they kind of frame it like that no no councilmember armature simply as developer their interest is is finding the most cost-effective place to to locate this facility and are you know just so happens that you know we through our investments that we've made in our transmission system for the benefit of the whole ERCOT grid we happen to have some sites that are very well suited for this type of a large electric load and that's doing their due diligence that's how they found us yeah I can just and I didn't mean to insinuate anything I could just imagine from their perspective them thinking okay we can see how you know a community that might not want us you know before February now they might look at this a little differently yeah I would just say that the you know the economics these are arms-length negotiations on economics and that really we have a threshold level that we've put out there that said if you know if you want to if you want to come here and put your facility here then these are the terms economic terms that you're gonna have to meet and so far we've been able to come to an agreement on on those we still have some work to do we're still working on the power purchase agreement but yeah there there was there was there was no nexus between our situation as a result of Yuri and the location of this facility they just happened they came to us at that time okay so thank you so that's that's that's good to know so they kind of the points I want to make and I'll try to you know frame it in terms of the kind of question you're asking us or direction you're asking us for which is you know seems to be and correct me if I'm misrepresenting it but you know what what are objections we might have that that could be answered how could we this be made more amenable than maybe somebody to a council member who's not amenable to it so I'll try to answer that without misleading you know without being misleading so I am very very skeptical about this and will be a really I'll be a really hard tell I don't want to say no or never impossible but I don't want to you know be misleading about well if this happens don't you know make me happy and then I end up not happy with happy with it that's that would be dishonest on my part so I just want to be clear so some of my concerns have to do and I'll just list them the the NDA you know I don't feel comfortable the fact that we don't even know who this company is I know we know who Tanaska is but that makes me really uncomfortable and by the way these these objections or concerns are in no particular order just the order which I have in the list them so I have a real hard time with that one thing that might make me you know a little more amenable to or you know feel more comfortable with the presentation with how this is presentable to us is I feel like there's kind of a slippage between the terms you know data center and cryptocurrency or you know Bitcoin farm I've had to you know school myself on the difference and it appears that there really is an important difference and and so or not just a difference but differences you know I feel like if we were really talking about a data farm we would be talking about we wouldn't even necessarily know what kind of data operation or operations would be going on in there right but we're talking about a specific company that a specific business that does crypto currency farming and I understand that you know it could be used in the future for as a data center by other kinds of businesses but for now I feel like this is what we're talking about so anyway for me it would just be be more helpful if we would kind of call it what as I see it it is number three I obviously I don't want a rate increase and I don't I don't like the way you know I feel like and I understand that we're being told simply that staff would recommend a three percent rate increase not well if you say no to this then you have to I understand and I appreciate the language that it would be a staff recommendation and that it's you know up to council but you know I'm not convinced that I mean I should say I I am convinced that because of Yuri you know we're in and also because of the debt that we were already in because of the the gas plant you know we're in a difficult financial situation and there's no getting outside of it and pretending that we're not wouldn't help so I'm not pretending that that everything's fine it's not but I still don't see that a three percent rate increase you know for 2022 effective immediately in October 2021 I haven't seen why that is necessary so I would not approve of such a rate increase I would want to see kind of more creative ways of trying to you know keep rates down without tying it to tying a rate increase to say no to this it feels like almost kind of a you know if it feels like a very hard sell combined with them I'll just say that it just feels like a very hard sell that's going on and then just you know finally you know another thing I guess that I appreciate more is you know the the framing kind of well if we didn't if we said no you know then they would go somewhere else and have more a bigger you know impact on the climate you know I understand that because you know that if if Rex are counted as renewable energy then this can be considered at net neutral I don't I personally don't consider Rex renewable energy I I'm not against Rex the existence of Rex but I consider them a little award you get a gold star for producing renewable energy and as I've compared it you know before it's like the difference between getting good grades in school and then you know being awarded a little McDonald's hamburger coupon because you've got good grades in school if you use the McDonald's hamburger coupon then that comes from the good grades that that you've produced if you've earned those good grades but if you give it to someone else and they use it they they don't get the credit for the good grades right but I do understand that this is the way Rex circulate and and and so I'm not saying that it's illegal or anything it's just that that's how I see it so so anyway those are my concerns I I know they're really really strong concerns strongly worded but that is I guess where I stand okay Councilmember Guara thank you Mayor Terry I appreciate you going into so much more detail in this presentation I especially appreciated the the touching on ancillary services I think I'm like maybe approaching understanding what you're talking about would it be accurate to say that when the data center is selling their ancillary services that ERCOT is paying them not to operate is that how that works yes depending on which ancillary service that they they're selling so you have to kind of think backwards because this is a load not a generator so if you think about if they're running at 50 percent of their output then they have the ability to either increase their demand which effectively it responds to surpluses that may be in the market and to try to bring that frequency back into the middle and likewise if they are running in the middle and they decrease their demand that frees up electricity that's otherwise in the market to kind of push that frequency back to the right level so now how much they sell whether they run at 50% of maximum demand or they run at 75% or 25% that will be a decision that they'll make on a day-to-day basis because that market actually clears or is settled based upon offers and bids that are made in the day ahead market so you're correct in the way you're thinking about it in order to sell those products that means that there has to be flexibility to either ramp down or ramp up or go off completely to sell those products okay so so ERCOT you know if they're you know doing regulation down ERCOT might be paying them to not run or to run at a lower capacity but if they're doing regulation up would ERCOT then be paying them to increase their capacity and increase their electricity usage it's that's the right way to think about it's actually just the opposite because they're a load not a generator so at a generator situation they'll pay you to move up pay you to move down here that pay you to move up move down as well and what they pay you for is the range that you're willing to offer into the market so if I was to offer 10 megawatts of regulation up and 10 megawatts of regulation down they'd pay me whatever the clearing price was for the regulation up and they'd pay me the 10 megawatts for the regulation down and as long as I respond to their signal within five minutes I get paid okay so that they're actually paying you to stand by so you get paid for those services even though you're really maybe not being called on them they're actually paying you for the ability to provide them okay so when we talk about this load being interruptible it's not necessarily DME that's making the decision about when to interrupt or when to adjust that usage at that that decision is being made between the client and ERCA is that correct well I think there's a couple ways to think about it one is the pure economics so when prices are very high and assuming that they're paying the spot market price for electricity then it would be who them to not run when prices are very high because that would erode the margin that they're making on whatever operation they're doing within the data center when prices are low that's when they should be running at full out to produce their product so they'll make an economic decision based upon the instantaneous or the spot price of electricity on how much they'll actually pull in from the grid how much demand they'll place on the grid they will also as we're structuring the power purchase agreement there will be some pretty severe incentives that during scarcity periods or high demand periods that they not be there that they not be consuming electricity during those periods okay all right that that that helps for sure um can you explain a little bit about and this kind of goes back to our conversation that we had yesterday about franchise fees I very much want to have I'm gonna email staff I want a work session on franchise fees but perhaps I'm misunderstanding how franchise fees work but why would a facility that really does not include significant infrastructure build out why would that increase franchise fee revenue yeah because franchise fees are paid as a percent of the the bill so it's just a percentage of the electric the price of electricity that is consumed by the facility and think of the franchise fee it's paying for the right to locate its structure its infrastructure on city-owned property but much like a like the telecommunications companies that have wires running up and down the street they're paying for the right to locate their facilities in our community but they're also going to be leasing the land from us correct mm-hmm oh David David gains assistant city manager so I think I think maybe just a little a different context might help we're getting the 5% franchise fee just comes from DME revenue so by them using electricity DME will get revenue so 5% of our revenue just goes to the general fund as any revenue to DME or most revenues to DME if that helps yes that does help yeah I was not understanding that franchise fees were a percentage of revenue and just a thank you for that we are bringing that conversation back as a follow-up to the budget good yes I need that okay another question so I'm glad David could interpret your question okay so so this company is going to be purchasing recs in an amount equivalent to the electricity that they're using aside from that is there anything else that that would make this facility carbon neutral are we saying it's carbon neutral because of the recs it's carbon neutral because of the recs okay okay so on you on slide four you have the and I do appreciate the comparison of you know co2 emissions per year if this facility were to locate in China versus elsewhere in Urquhart versus Denton I do have to say it's it seems a bit disingenuous to say that there will be zero co2 emissions as a result of this facility locating in Denton you know that the point is well taken that Urquhart's grid is more efficient in terms of co2 emissions per kilowatt hour than China's and it's certainly the case that that Denton DME the city of Denton we are trying to be good citizens we're doing our part to try to make the Urquhart grid more renewable and and reduce co2 emissions per kilowatt hour across the grid right I think that that that's a wonderful thing that we're doing we absolutely should be doing it I hope that that other utilities follow that example San Antonio looking at you but that's not exactly the same as saying that the electricity that we use in our city doesn't produce any carbon emissions right so when I look at this I say okay we're trying our best to improve the Urquhart market and improve carbon emissions across the Urquhart market but but that still brings us to you know perhaps slightly less than but approximately 1 million one hundred and thirty four thousand and nine tons of carbon emissions per year as a result of this existing yeah I guess I will take issue with you Councilmember McGuire on on the issue of Rex not being a zero carbon emission and I know you weren't on council but we've spent some time with the prior council discussing Rex and and how they're actually generated so I think the way to think about this is that as we talk about reliability there are times when there's not sufficient renewable energy generation in the grid to meet the demand of the grid at that time and then our choice is to turn things off because there just isn't enough electricity that's what happened in February and we don't want to repeat that so on an annual basis when we look at the energy consumed by this facility there will be one megawatt of zero carbon emissions generated in the state of Texas for each megawatt that's consumed by this facility just like here in Denton every megawatt hour of energy that we consume as a city there was a megawatt hour at some point during the year that was generated with no carbon emissions and that's the way the Rex work and I think trying to put to find a point on it other than it's a one-for-one megawatt for a wreck is probably misleading okay I point well taken and I think that that does reinforce my point that that we're certainly doing the right thing right and and that that purchasing Rex is better than not purchasing Rex it improves the renewable to fossil fuel ratio in the ERCOT market I still I can't quite get away from this 1.1 million tons of co2 emissions per year and what would what would help me to get over it would be if I could see some kind of a detailed proposal and this is something I think we can I mean I think we're supposed to be sort of talking this out as a council a proposal that would demonstrate how that 5.8 to 6.9 million dollars per year in revenue that we're going to see in the general fund how can we use that to long-term reduce the carbon emissions of the city by 1.1 million or more I'd prefer much more per year and and if if we can use this revenue to make significant long-term changes you know you mentioned some excellent ones investing in electric car infrastructure acquiring green space weatherizing homes if if if we can see savings through those types of you know carbon emission savings to those types of initiatives that would be greater than 1.1 million tons of co2 per year then I would say this is worth it we could simply buy 1.1 million tons of Rex and retire them that would cost about five million dollars so there are options out there I guess more more to the point if we can invest in long-term solutions of that reduce energy usage and reduce fossil fuel usage in the city but but excellent point yes all right thank you that's all comes from Burke thank you I just want to say to the point here but before I say all of that I'm gonna say this I appreciate your your description of everything I like the way that you laid it out it sounds like you're from the south you talk a little slower so it came through I was able to process that thank you so much I'm actually from the north so it's hard for me to thank you thank you very much I appreciate you giving giving some processing time for it for everything I after I visited the deck I was so excited to go home and tell my husband I know he's watching right now because he just told me he was watching and I explained to him about the five-minute you know and being on top of everything I really enjoyed that tour you guys made it very interesting and very easy to understand so thank you for that I am in agreement that this process should go forward and these are the reasons why I have had an opportunity to listen here and the environmental benefits and understanding the air quality processes that we need to be mindful of and the impact I think that although this although this facility is coming on it sounds like there is a lot of it it sounds so massive you know when I initially heard it it sounds it almost impossible for us to be able to keep up with you know and the way that it was put earlier just seemed like everything was just gonna be just so intense and I was a bit nervous about that but I think that the way that you've explained it it's just pretty much tit-for-tat it's not going to impact us very much I hear that you know and I appreciate the environmental impact on that point from what I understand I know that there's some some of us that don't you know particularly agree with that I you have done a great job explaining to me I can hear it about the ERCOT grid and reliability I remember it's talking at the deck it in my head now you know I have I got everything's gonna stay on kindergarten level with me because I we all got to understand even just talking about a grid I had envisioned in my head that there's this little grid in the sky you know kind of like what's going on here and things go up and come down but as you explain it there's a pool of you know energy that we're using and taking out and paying for and and receiving funds for so you've explained that very well I appreciate the opportunity to always be ready for emergencies always having an opportunity to be ready for the emergencies and also being able to put into the grid renewables and when I talk about renewables to anybody that I can talk to about it that listens to me I go back to our conversation as a learning opportunity for me in understanding that if we're 100% renewable that that's what that means that we're always going to have wind and we're at some point and we always have Sun and we have opportunities to renew our energies source so thank you city of Dayton for that incremental general fund revenues let me go over to let me go over here to to slide number eight how much could the general fund benefit there's all these millions of dollars per year the incremental general fund revenue available five point eight to seven point four million dollars a year already in my head you know something about these streets we always need more money for our growth in our traffic but I'm just wondering and I'll send as this for a city manager about not sidewalks but parking lots does that include parking lots the streets include parking lots because we need some parking lots that need to be paved and well streets yes the streets fund can we also have facility management that works with streets for parking lots but we are actually trying to address and come up with a prioritization for prioritization okay so we can come up with some prioritization on that what is ROI mean again return on investment return on investment so like a stock dividend okay like a dividend I got that I got some dividends us and I am mr. mayor also interested in putting the air quality monitoring project on the table I think that that is something that we and acquiring the green space but more so the air quality monitoring project I will always believe that didn't has clean air and all of our our hair that we do have trouble with comes from the south and in I'll blame our neighbors for that I won't mention any names but we can also of course be mindful of our air monitoring projects and then I'm over here on slide 10 and the electric rate stabilization so I'm just confirming that data center so I can figure this out the data center projected DME net income contribution eight to nine million annually and the cost of winter storm URI five that that we're paying off a hundred and forty million I mean or yes we're doing with that money so that five point nine to six point three is the debt and interest payment or the principal and interest payment on the hundred and forty million dollars that we're gonna be placing okay principal and interest okay and then there's a three percent again that keeps cropping up in my dreams without these projected incremental net income contributions we will be recommended three percent rate so that's the other reason why I will want to support this because I don't want to put any additional burden like that on to the city so with all of that being said and I think I've gone through the community benefits which is very important the one through four and I'll just leave it right there thank you mr. mayor thank you yes so dinners here I'm gonna try to get through these questions hopefully we'll pick up steam counselor in bed thank you mr. mayor Tony one of the concerns is brought to me by sorry not Tony Terry I was looking at Tony and I'm sorry one of the questions that was brought to me by by some people in the community is that they were really really concerned that the the deck was going to be used to fund to to to power this and let me be let me ask it as is is the the deck going to directly power the data center or is you just using the land for no sir no the deck is delivering into the grid into the her cut grid at a different point than where this facility will be pulling energy out of the grid yeah they're very close proximity but we think about how many hours a year the deck runs you know it runs maybe 20 percent of the hours in a year in a good year this facility will run 95 percent of the hours so it's just again the deck property because of the infrastructure that's there on the transmission side the the ability to deliver the amount of energy that this facility is taking anticipated to take that's why it's located at that property and so you know it's fair to say that this is the deck the deck in its power generation is while it's both it's they're both would be related to the grid overall that there's not a direct coupling between the data center and the gas plant that's correct the deck is part of the the city's renewable resource plan it is the it is the financial hedge if you will against those periods of time when prices or when the wind doesn't blow and we have to buy from the market we then can run the deck in order to mitigate that that cost that high cost in the market during those periods when our renewable resources are not delivering energy so then it would also then be fair that we could use some of the proceeds as from say if we move forward with this to to offset additional conservation concerns we could craft our overall portfolio of this in our city and develop standards that would reduce additional carbon and we could we could tackle additional energy concerns additional conservation concerns reduce carbon even further than sort of the base rate of simply moving from China to Denton I think you know it's all on the table it's up to you that's a policy decision that that council will have to make on how they want to use these funds so I guess you know as we move forward and I'm wrapping this up for me I'm for this if we as a body move forward with additional conservation measures fund additional conservation practices really continue to to you know do the air money and and and make sure that this is approached in a socially equitable way especially to our people that would be on us but if without those components I I understand council requires concerns about you know pulling additional carbon and I but I think we can do that if we craft our citywide policy in a smart way I will say I'm wearing my tack shirt right now I work fair for you know fair what's the phrase having a brain for were you for full disclosure that's the phrase I meant to say for full disclosure I work for facility that has a large data center in Austin the I will say there's no substantial difference between how what you calculate in response to other counselors questions how you use that data can be socially equitable or not I would I would agree with some of the people that the cryptocurrency mining is not particularly socially equitable but what I like is that if we do this right as a council and set standards we can say what the standards we want for any data center that might be more social equitable that came to Denton to do and then the last question I will ask is the it was related to the the the the franchise fees as is counselor McGuire and arm tur both suggested there's that's that's up to us to set how we use those franchise fees is there there's the but about the budgets that we saw yesterday that you and other department well I guess Tony's the department head but the other department had suggested were not contingent on these franchise fees is that correct from this project I'd have to defer to David on that one okay or Cassie or whoever has the numbers I forgot Cassie was hiding back in the back there good afternoon Cassie Ogden director of finance the budgets that we presented yesterday did not include anything with this project so because it's still outstanding I didn't want to present an assumption so that was separate we would have to bring back a different budget if this was approved so we could we could massage the use of say the franchise fee ratios and equations for this project versus what we saw yesterday and maybe make even those more conservation maybe it's 80% to conservative bicycle fleets or something whatever we decide as a council body yes that's up to council all right thank you that's all my questions mr. mayor all right bear with me councilmember armature just since okay there we go so a question a clarifying question I think I know the answer to you but I want to make sure I understand correctly and then a kind of further point of concern that you know that I hope staff can find helpful based on additional kind of comments that have been made so my question is so say given that so others have kind of suggested at least the possibility of in addition to kind of possible counterbalancing conservation efforts that might come in terms of policy in conjunction with with this kind of cryptocurrency deal I if I understand correctly I think others have suggested maybe the possibility of you can of using some of that revenue to go towards and maybe I'm misinterpreting but using some of that revenue to possibly go towards conservation efforts you know green efforts locally of some kind and what I wanted my question was that am I right in in my guess just based on what I've heard from you so far and seen in the presentation that staff would would still recommend a 3% increase if all of that revenue wasn't coming right to DME in other words if that revenue was going elsewhere that y'all would still recommend that 3% increase so can you can you comment on that correct me if I'm wrong I'll just take the first part real quick mayor if you don't mind yes I mean the additional revenues are completely up to you to decide how you want to use them whether you want to use them for sustainability programs or whatever the the DME net income numbers are not included in those discretionary funds that we identified that are available to the council for whatever things you want to spend them on okay so I should have used the term then that the DME net income okay so so that increase is attached to that and so so maybe I was misunderstanding if y'all were just talking about the discretionary income and not be okay so thank you so that does that helps clarify for me that not only what you know David if you want to address okay no you you explained it well it also helps clarify for me what my colleagues were suggesting so I'll just just state in kind of why I get my problem with the net carbon neutral idea because I haven't really gone into detail on that before and I'm not saying that it's wrong but it's kind of I see it as kind of a philosophical issue of how we each envision kind of counterbalancing or you know harm versus good right so you know Rex so there's the issue of which I know I've you know I like to talk about about why I don't see Rex as real renewable energy but awards you get for renewable energy that have this that have extreme that happen to have exchange value but but say Rex are you know say we consider Rex renewable energy you know if you see it as the good we do if one sees kind of the good we do for the environment as kind of counterbalancing the harm we do almost like grades that gets get averaged out you know you get three A's and three F's so it doesn't mean that you both that you do excellent in the course and fail it at the same time it means it averages out to a three right there's some kind of counterbalancing or you know even better it's a three of six kind of you know grading scheme where okay you get three F's but three A's so we'll take the three A's and you get an A right so I feel like that the net neutral argument is kind of that latter approach that says like that the good you do not only kind of mixes and averages out with the bad but supplants it my own view when it comes to not when it comes to grading but just irreversible environmental harm and also just kind of moral issues in general is you know if you do say you know if you take if you take three lives and then you save three lives you know it's not life-neutral you know it's like you did three amazing things and three bad things you know so that's all of that is to say that's where I stand on this I hope that was helpful and just showing that I'm not saying that's a lie it's it's just kind of a way it's a choice of kind of the moral or philosophical framework once you see that that that that balance or counterbalance councilman require thank you I councilmember Armenter's point is well taken you articulated that much better than I did so to give direction I'm I'm open to continuing to look at this I'm not entirely opposed to it what I would like to see from staff is and probably not DME staff is most likely you know probably someone from our sustainability department should be the one to put this together you know we've got the the approximately eight to nine million dollars per year going to DME we've got approximately 3.2 to 3.6 million going to the streets fund and then we've got approximately five point eight to six point nine million going to the general fund what I'd like to see is what would be the most impactful things that we could do with that money in terms of reducing the demand for fossil fuels by reducing electricity demand elsewhere in the city particularly from residential customers I appreciate councilmember backs suggestion of trying to sort of kill two birds with one stone by giving grants to low-income individuals to weather eyes their homes to to reduce electricity demand that way I'd like to see what are some of the most impactful uses of that money to reduce the number of cars on our road and then look at look at tree preservation as well but and I'd like to see those in terms of carbon emissions both carbon emissions produced carbon emissions prevented carbon sequestered in the case of tree preservation so next time we come back to this conversation that's what I'd like to see all right okay last call here in the room because I'm gonna call on council you're not in the room last call not in the room pardon me in the room because then I'm gonna recognize mayor Pro Tem and then I'm gonna sum up and we're gonna be done so I'm just opening the floor for last comments seeing none councilman mayor Pro Tem Melzer thank you I would say I certainly started out skeptical first time I heard about this I still have some serious questions so I do hope to get them asked and I'll say it's been very helpful hearing the conversation the commission Councilmember Beck's analysis certainly very thought-provoking and just a little wind up to my questions if the world is going to data centers and distribution centers for the planet I want them to be in renewables that is good so if you're counting the goods and the bads that is good if we pay to support the renewable markets more is produced and added to the grid that's just how markets work that is good I'm very clear on that for Denton sake I want us to get more than our fair share of that if you will sustainable data center business not just this one but the second and the third one behind it and the fact that we'd win the business through our commitment to support the renewable market great and if that in turn funds a transformative commitment to sustainability and Denton even better so questions I could be wrong but Bitcoin could go bust I don't you know it could go the way of tulip bulbs in the 1630s mostly I don't care because computer capacity is fungible but Ken this is for Terry can we avoid being in a situation where we have contracted for a ton of new renewables to come on to the grid and we get stuck if they end up in some kind of reorganization a period of time yes Mayor pro tem a great question and we are contracting for that parade of horrors so that if it were to happen we would not be left with any liability that's a great goal and we're gonna be very interested in the details of how that works so I'm looking forward to hearing more on that my second question in yesterday's discussion about what percentage of the franchise fee you know would go to the streets fund it was it was in the context of identifying well I guess we've got two presentations at streets fund Frances the gap in streets you know of all the kind of identified resources and what we're trying to solve for the gap was 1.5 million a year for the next you know four-year period and the reason I objected to just saying it's flat 80% no matter what and we'd have to apply that to this is because of that over here applying that 80% just because well that's the formula you know results in four to four and a half million in franchise fee if if we just had a mechanism to say we want to fill the gap you want to fund that million and a half gap that would free up out of this project of this pro forma anyway an additional two and a half to three million dollars that could go into the sustainability fund or rate reduction or you know whatever else council prioritizes so my question is is it within council prerogative to create a different class of service let's say for data centers with different franchise fuels once once we collect the revenue it's certainly is council for council prerogative to send the revenue wherever ultimately we want to we want to send it if we want to have the 5% revenue come from all of DME and go 80% to streets 20% the general fund you can do that if you want to subdivide that out and have certain pieces of that revenue go towards streets and other pieces go toward the general fund we can do that so council has ultimate flexibility to do whatever is council's prerogative that's very helpful I appreciate that those are my questions for now I look forward to hearing more detail on it I mean the the the difference between the initial impression this is made you know and then kind of more thoughtful version of it today it's really remarkable and I think this I'm favorably inclined I think there are many interesting possibilities I supportive of you know council member McGuire's interest in kind of working out what that sort of sustainability fund could really look like and kind of what its value could be thanks okay and just to clarify I heard the statements but my question would be for you is that is is any of what you said contingent on how the money is being spent that's what I didn't get clarity on so there's there's a return on investment and you mentioned the kind of carbon the the projects that you think will help reduce carbon and you mentioned the value and the the purchasing energy from us but what I didn't hear was if your general position is contingent on how the ROI is allocated I mean I'm favorably inclined toward the whole project because of my first comments that I think as I've said on many previous projects that have come before council high energy users to the extent that they are going to exist because we're not getting rid of refrigerated foods or data centers or whatever you know I want them to be in debt non-renewable so I'm already favorably inclined but I think we can make this really you know really outstanding make it even better really outstanding by you know kind of crafting the uses of the the additional revenue beyond great stabilization which is a good thing and beyond the fact that it does it would at least fill the gap in streets you know that we talked about yesterday okay looking for yes sir thank you very much I appreciate it so so Terry I have a couple of questions and thoughts and I'll just they'll be mixed in because I I'm on about three pages here so one I just want to kind of thank staff for your due diligence I mean I think under your guidance and Tony's guidance and all the financial staff etc we were we were leaders on the commercial paper component and then others came behind us and that was before anyone had ever heard of winter storm Yuri and we were properly positioned well in advance of everyone and so it headed a curve on that headed a curve on the uplift charges right we led a billion dollar industry down south of us and kind of led that charge so I mean just outstanding work and I think that's critical to me in making this decision it's you never know what's coming but you can always make financially sound decisions and and and be conservative with with ratepayers money and that really is is where I draw I think if you you can split hairs on what's important to people here's what's important to people rates very important but in it affects everyone in the city of Denton we have a monopoly and so that that drives a lot of my decision because when I when you talk about something that affects 140,000 people you have my complete attention you know and I think that's important and then also I think it's important to note your slide I mean it's the one time that I've understood us to have a true global environmental effect right because we're pulling it's it's leaving China regardless but either way we're removing that use and and and have an opportunity to affect it in a way and I'll get ahead of my notes I think it's I think it's important to note the the neutrality that you point out it's it's in a vacuum it's not across the entire system and I think that's what gets missed it's it's it's the this item this item in a vacuum is net neutral right and and that's I think that's a valid statement to say versus the entire system uses this or that you know it's like we're just saying this for that straight line and so I think I track with you I could be misunderstanding it wrong and then I I think that's noteworthy that this could spin up that quickly right I think that that's that's noteworthy that relief we could get to our insurer and give some confirmation for our ratepayers pretty quickly my question would be from a lease perspective I'm assuming there's a there's a fee there's a financial engagement at the lease level as well and and then in addition let me see what else I have I think we go to so help me understand how many black start facilities are in the state of Texas there are 13 right so when we're talking about people understanding where Denton is and approaching Denton we're one of 13 in the entire state of Texas correct yes so we're pretty noteworthy from from that you know we're positioned pretty uniquely and so that that's important to note on how people find us and why we're on the their radar and then you touched on it but but I just want to understand it better so everyone in the state of Texas that the generates energy sends it up to the grid and then it comes back down there's no one regardless of where any facility is there's not a direct feed to a particular use it all goes up to the grid all comes down am I right on a wholesale basis mayor that is absolutely correct the exception would be someone that has rooftop solar rooftop solar can be fed directly into your home system and other types of small distributed generation doesn't necessarily get into the get onto the wholesale high voltage transmission grid great great point so everyone in our space regardless of where this use went it's going to affect the grid the same yes sir okay so that guides my decision I want to benefit I'm a fiduciary and responsible to the ratepayers in the city of Denton and I think to benefit them after the hurt after winter storm URI is is it's it's fantastic to have that opportunity to not have to raise rates and so that that to and maintain all other policies that we have for fund balance etc and then I'll ask you are you familiar with the Wall Street Journal article that that highlighted the investor and tonight is tonight is that am I saying that right right there's an investor that I read that article but are you familiar with that yeah and so I think that to me was important reading that and understanding the level of commitment and support this primary institution has and when we're talking about reading the industry people at that level do not invest haphazardly and so that to me was was important just to validate the use case and then could you speak on Rex and renewables because I need to understand make sure I understand that right because can you have can you get credit for renewables without a wreck no sir in ERCOT in Texas all of Texas even other parts that aren't served by ERCOT the every resource that generates electricity that's deemed renewable must register with ERCOT and with the state of Texas and there's an accounting that goes on where the the actual generation of that resource whether it's wind or solar biomass whatever type of renewable resource at the end of each year it's actually each month there are renewable energy credits that are awarded to the generator that is properly registered as a resource as a renewable resource by the state of Texas and so every megawatt of renewable energy that is generated in the state of Texas is accounted for within the ERCOT and Texas tracking system so yeah so and so statewide there's no way to vibrate those two I can't say hey I'm gonna go get my and get credit renewable credit for it somewhere else I have to go through this process in the state of Texas yeah for DME be under the renewable resource plan the Denton renewable resource plan our method for determining a hundred percent renewable energy is to use that tracking system the ERCOT tracking system and so our contracts we we purchase the energy from those facilities we then transfer the credits from the facilities account at ERCOT into our account at ERCOT and then we retire those recs so that that carbon emission never happened and can't happen because we retire them some people take them and sell them they're fungible they could be sold to third parties and there's a lot of some of the biggest companies mayor that that you think has been environmentally conscious like Amazon Apple Google Microsoft when they when they established their environmental goals and their carbon neutrality goals their method for compliance is renewable energy credits and that's how they measure their progress towards that goal right many many of the renewable resources here in Texas are contracted to those entities and they contract with those entities they may not have facilities here in Texas that actually consume the electric but they purchase the renewable energy credits as carbon reduction right yes no and I've read a lot of articles that there's an uptick in that space as well it's very competitive yes and then help me understand from a facility standpoint with this with this land lease would it be on the west side of the deck and then so in theory would it add additional sound buffering from that neighborhood to the west and I could be there are two parcels one is just south of the deck so it's between the deck and the airport if you will and then the other parcel is on the north side of the deck between sandwich between the natural gas line that comes into the deck and a substation that's out towards Jim Christian Road okay got it so I'd be interested to see if there's any I know I'm tracking with you I don't think it's exactly where I was picturing but if there's any benefit there that would be important to note for me and then help me understand picking up kind of where Mayor Pro Tem left off if they leave so their lease in the property if they leave do we then take ownership of the building what does that look like in your mind so the way that the lease is structured and again that will come before you this council for approval any improvements that are made on the property are owned by the by the data center company and if the lease were to terminate they would have a set amount of time to remove those from the property if they failed to remove them they would become the property of the city got it okay thank you that's helpful got it okay so I think that is everything and in summary I'll say this just and staff can go back and rewatch this there's there is enough support I would say there's a consensus to move forward right I think I discount and just for staffs accounting so that you know I discount anything that talked about the use of the funds because we're not there right we you can't you can't put the cart before the horse in my it just in my I'm charged with calculating this and that's that's my analysis you know you have to have you know kind of governance that how you do that and so you can take a look at that and I'll say just in summary I mean when you I appreciate your bluntness that's what we asked staff to do we asked staff to bring us decisions and I guarantee you there's households everywhere in the city that have to make tough budget decisions right and it's either this or that every day in their households and so I it's it's it's difficult no question but that's what we're charged to do and so I think it is reasonable to say from a from a rate perspective this is what we're looking at that's that's where we don't I don't want to make it I don't think we should make it punitive to for staff to come give us the the barebone hard facts is uncomfortable as that is that's that's a situation at hand yes sir so mayor Tony point the general manager for DME just one quick point of clarification here so what we would anticipate doing and and I don't dispel what you're saying about it being a little bit premature our thought process will be to bring back to council probably the 17th that the an ordinance to create a fund called a sustainability fund obviously the first revenue potential that would ever go into that fund and whatever mix the council decides to make and they could potentially make it as we create the fund wouldn't start until December so you so that first year would likely be a seed year that would give staff time sustainability staff and certainly I want to be clear you know that's something that we believe that the state sustainability group should take on not DME then they could then bring that back to you as recommendations all these things that you've talked about so I just want to be clear with you mayor that that that's kind of what we're thinking is to bring back the creation of that fund and in conjunction with some of these items for consideration sure dollars that first year would likely be a seed year sure but I think it's important though to note it's that it wouldn't have a bucket of money in it be you know that's that's the that's the thing I'm trying to make sure we manage expectations so okay and then I'll follow up with with some other notes I have with staff directly and we'll go from there I'm it's we're gonna take a break and go on we don't have to do the closed session those that are in line to speak get with staff during the break or meet with them independent and the what and then yeah that so I'm sorry distracted but thank you very much thank you thank you it's 525 oh the closed session item we don't need the closed session item so that was a placeholder we don't need that so we will be back at 530 pardon me 630 it is 525 now we'll adjourn until our regular meeting at 5 thirty thank you good evening and welcome to this meeting of the Denton City Council it is now 631 again we do have a quorum so I'll call the meeting to order and the first thing on our agenda is the pledges to the United States and Texas flag so if you will please stand if you're able under the Texas flag I pledge allegiance to the Texas State under God one okay that brings us to our presentations from members of the public and we have a quick video that will show the Denton City Council has adopted rules of procedure including a code of conduct that applies to citizens as well as council members these rules were enacted to promote an orderly process and to preserve decorum here is a brief review of the rules that apply to citizen reports citizens will have four minutes to give a scheduled citizen report and four minutes to give an open mic report there will be an electronic bell when time has expired if the remarks are not concluded by that time the citizen will be asked to stop speaking if the citizen does not cease and a second request is made the mayor will request to have the citizen removed from the council chamber citizens are asked not to approach the dais if a citizen has papers or other materials to hand out to the council please let the city secretary know in advance for scheduled citizen reports the council may initiate discussion or questions following each citizen report for non scheduled open mic citizen reports the council may listen to citizens speak however because no notice of the subject of the open mic report has been provided to the public in advance the Texas Open Meetings Act limits any deliberation or decision by the council to a proposal to place the item on a future agenda a statement of factual policy or a recitation of existing policy citizens are asked to direct all remarks and questions to the council as a whole and not to any individual member please refrain from making abusive personal impertinent profane or slanderous remarks anyone who violates this council rule of procedure may be immediately removed from the council chamber thank you in advance copies of the rules of procedure are available from the city secretary great and we have one citizen that is pre-registered to speak and so that's miss Edel and I hope I'm saying that right okay we'll give her just another moment see no movement okay then that takes us to open mic is there anyone here that was wanting to speak during the open mic period okay that takes us to seeing the movement that takes us to the consent agenda for those just a reminder for my work session items B C E and I were pulled and only B and C require a presentation but I'll take a motion and we'll have to use yeah so Councilmember McGuire okay is consent agenda accepting items B C E and I thank you Councilmember Byrd thank you we have a motion by Councilmember second by Councilmember Byrd and I think I have to take a hand vote is that right or can we vote on the screen and then hand vote thank you okay so Councilmember McGuire how say you aye Councilmember Byrd how say you okay Councilmember Davis how say you aye Councilmember Beck aye okay Councilmember Armitage yes and Mayor Hotspot there's a aye as well and then Mayor Pro Temelter aye thank you so that passes seven to zero that the first item is item B which is ID 2 1 1 3 1 1 consider approval of a resolution of the City of Denton providing for removal for cause of a member of the committee on persons with disabilities thank you Mr. Mayor I understand that you want it just commentary on both of those items yes and let me pull that as well let me call that as well thank you for that that's item C which is ID 1 3 1 2 consider approval resolution of the City of Denton providing a removal for cause remember from the Traffic Safety Commission in accordance with article what is that X IV so that's 14 section 14.16 thank you good evening mayor and council I am Rosa Rios and I'm your city secretary I'm here to present some information on both of the items so your city charter does make a stipulation that a boarding commission member may only be removed for cause of course that is not permissive but it's not mandatory but it is just permissive so you're not actually required to do so should you choose not to but there's a couple of sections in the city code that address boarding commission member attendance as well as how a member could be removed for potential cause for violating that attendance policy so the boarding commission handbook that is adopted by City Council pretty much every year those revisions that we try to do annually and then presented to you toward the first of the year is adopted by resolution and that does require that the city secretary if the determination based on the attendance reports from staff liaisons show that there's been a violation of city policy basically that a member has missed more than three meetings and or a missed 50% of meetings held in an annual year then that member could be removed for cause following and of course the city secretary is required to send that written notification the members asked to submit his resignation if not face potential removal and if no response is received by that deadline by that 10-day deadline then the code the handbook mandates that the city secretary schedule an item for consideration for council to consider the potential removal of the member and that is why we are here today it is because of that requirement there was information in your backup material that kind of provided history on the two members and their service tenure as well as the meetings that they missed that constituted that more than three unexcused absences members do have the ability to seek a an exception from council for any meeting that they miss that may not meet the excused absence criteria we did not receive any such notice from the members and based on that that is why we're here today and I'm happy to answer any questions you may have okay thank you Councilor Armitage so I have comments not a question so I had asked these for these two items to be pulled first I want to say that I completely understand that the proposed removal of these two committee members was not personal at all this was merely you know it kind of administrative practice just based on what the policy is so I understand that and it is not at all personal and I think that they understand that as well I'm going to just explain why I'm going to be voting no to this and hope that my colleagues will listen and consider possibly voting no as well so first I'll start with Kevin Sample who is on the Traffic Safety Commission and by the way I've spoken to both of these the members and they both want to stay on these committees I asked them as as you know or as staff knows there have been other situations where no appointees of mine were not no longer able to make the meetings because they were working people and the meeting moved to a time during the day when they couldn't attend because of their jobs so they weren't weren't able to or they had it got a different job and that wasn't compatible and so and I was perfectly okay with that because they were okay with it these two cases are different so I'll just explain briefly why so Kevin Sample on the Traffic Safety Commission he represents diversity on this committee in really important ways a number of intersecting ways which have to do with how I first met him see Kevin is black he is a veteran he has served this country on more than one occasion and when I met him he was homeless with and he's he's very out about that now otherwise I wouldn't be mentioning it and also very open about the about having PTSD as a result of his experiences overseas and also experiences compounded by experiences living on the street when I met him he came to me because he had witnessed a friend of his he was it was killed by the train across from the near the police station and he was concerned about train safety and and so staff was really wonderful in getting in advocating to you know improve those those safe safety measures and I thought this is when a slot came up for this Traffic Safety Commission I thought this is the kind of person I want on this committee because he's he represents really much-needed diversity and he's really concerned about traffic safety Sam Alphonse also was homeless when I met him he is now work living in an apartment so is Kevin by the way and I'll explain very briefly just why he can know a lot why he had to miss these meetings Kevin had to miss the meetings because the job that he got he's he's now the manager for the habitat for humanity resale store he started out just doing some minor repair work and now he's a manager for both of their stores before kovat the meetings were in the evening now meetings are during and under kovat they were during the day and he just couldn't come because of his job so he would like to see the meetings return to being in the evening so they're more accessible for working working people otherwise our committee boards and committees are not open to working people in the case of Sam he is legally blind and he is also as I said formerly homeless and he also happens to be african-american representing variety of different kinds of diversity on this committee including people who have been homeless with disabilities the reason why he wasn't able to attend had to do with accessibility issues and I know that staff you know has done a really good job with trying to work with him on how to make these zoom meetings more accessible all both of these issues have to do with kovat but for him it's an accessibility issue as as well and so for these reasons and thank you for hearing me out I think it's really important that we are not remove people from the committee just because of disability related or work related accessibility issues okay councilmember Davis thank you mayor I do have a question for staff I'm going to ask first about item B and then item C on item B how many times did the city secretary's office or anybody from staff reach out to this committee member and to talk with them about these unexcused absences well staff does reach out to the board member you know pretty much before every meeting in order to try to make sure that we are able to establish a quorum we do also have an attendance policy that we make members aware of that you know if they're not able to attend a meeting they do have ten days to to ask for an exception to the absence and sometimes there's been no response so I don't be able to that's mr. Alphonse you receive no response whatsoever from him correct not asking you know not offering a reason why he had to miss or asking to be brought up on up to speed on the meeting or asking for meeting times to be changed or anything like that right yes so we did previously at the request of council poll a Board and Commission members asking you know if they had any input on there or concerns about the proposed schedule things like that and so staff had worked with the members the member you know to try to make sure that we were able to reach out and be available also to assist them to attend a meeting should they have the need but we still a council member might have heard from mr. Alphonse but staff has still not heard from mr. Alphonse at all my understanding it's no what we did some of the steps that we took more recently was that we did send start sending a text asking for the member to check his email all right council member I'm the liaison for the committee on persons with disabilities Ryan Adams customer service and public affairs prior to the limit of absence is being met we had not heard from mr. Alphonse typically our practice is to call an email prior to a meeting if we don't get a response of whether a member will be there we attempt again and so we did have successive meetings where we did not hear from the member enough to where that member reached their limit I will say that in the most recent months probably about two meetings worth we have had more consistent communication with mr. Alphonse and so it this would have item would have come up anyway due to that lack of communication ahead of time but since then I do want to mention that we have had communications with the member okay and then on on see that's the Traffic Safety Commission mr. sample I guess he he came to a recent meeting and it was in attendance at a recent meeting and talked about a letter he received yes okay so he received notifications and then has now been at meetings has he attended regularly since then or yes so he did make noted at a Traffic Safety Committee meeting that you know that he had received the letter my office did not receive any indicate any response from him but there has only been one meeting for that commission and he did in fact attend attended that one thank you all right any other questions for staff okay councilor Armitage let's see should we are we taking them one at a time yeah just a motion okay so I move no for if we're taking one in for B I move no all right is there a second councilman McGuire I second the motion to deny all right so we have a motion by councilor Armitage for item B second by councilman McGuire any discussion counselor Beck yes do would it be the intention of the the counselor Armator to reappoint these persons if they were to to be removed sure well I'm not sure how to address that I'm not sure I can address another counselor I'm not sure about the right the appropriateness of that councilor Armitage so well actually I hadn't thought about that until you asked I suppose I would because they they still want to be on the committee okay I don't know if I don't know if they'd say I don't know if that would change there you know being removed from the committee wouldn't that would change they're still wanting to be on I can't say I hadn't thought to ask that of them but I would I would certainly ask no problem any other discussion mayor Pritz and Melter yeah I think it's very laudable of councilor Armitage to have you know encouraged and sort of found individuals from different walks of life you know who can potentially contribute to different points of view and I would hope she would do it again it's just a simple requirement that they actually be able to attend sudden it's not a to be on these committees to deserve and I would hope that if it's if it's these same individuals but with you but with it we can clearly identify that they you know can make it work and serve or other individuals similarly qualified and adding diversity and unique voices you know either way we just we just do actually need people to you know to to be able to come and to come so that's you know I haven't heard that these things happen in the past but they're addressed and now they will be able to serve it's not I don't have a feeling of judgment about it other than we need people to actually serve you know to be able to come to the meetings there's work to be done it's not you know thank you I would I would like it to be these individuals individuals it sound like they sound like you know really great potentially great contributors but they need to actually be people who come got it okay any other session okay council member Armitage I'll say you all right motion to deny yes and so council member McGuire yes okay councilman back no council member Davis no council member bird no mayor protein Meltzer I'm sorry no thank you and mayor Hotspeth is a I but that the motion to deny fails four to three so correct me wrong that that's in the affirmative right right so the motion was to to deny correct and that they were there were were you in favor or I was a I was in favors three four and it fails okay so I'll take another motion councilor Davis I move approval of the resolution item B do I have a second councilor Beck I second okay we have a motion by councilmember Davis second by councilmember Beck councilmember Davis how say you aye councilor Beck how say you aye council member bird how say you aye councilman McGuire how say you no council member armature how say you no and mayor protein melts or how say you okay and mayor Hotspeth for consistency is a nay passes for three takes us to item C I'll take a motion councilmember Davis I'll be the meaning again but also second what a councilman mayor pro tem Meltzer had to say and move approval of the resolution in item C okay we have a motion to approve item C is there councilman Beck I'll second for the same discussion that we had earlier thank you motion by councilmember Davis second by councilmember Beck any discussion seeing none councilmember Davis how say you aye councilmember Beck how say you aye councilmember bird thank you council member McGuire hey councilmember armature no mayor pro tem Meltzer I and mayor Hotspeth is a nay that passes for three that's item C thank you that takes us to item E which please let the record reflect E and I going forward so let the record reflect councilmember Davis is recused for these two items and so I'll call item ID two one one four nine five consider adoption of ordinance of the city of Denton Texas authorizing the city manager or their designee to execute a interlocal competitive compare cooperative pardon me purchasing agreement with Denton County so there's no presentation I'll take a motion councilmember McGuire I move approval thank you councilmember Beck I second okay we have a motion by councilmember McGuire second by councilmember Beck discussion seeing none councilmember Guara how say you aye councilmember Beck aye councilmember bird aye thank you councilmember armature yes okay mayor pro tem Meltzer aye thank you and mayor Hotspeth is aye as well that passes six to zero takes us to our last item which is item I which is ID two one one five six eight consider adoption of ordinance of the tech of the city of Denton authorizing the inter interim city manager to execute an agreement for transportation with Denton independent school district there is no presentation for this either I'll take a motion councilmember armature I move approval thank you councilmember Beck I second thank you we have a motion by councilmember armature second by councilmember Beck and is there any discussion seeing none councilmember armature how say you yes councilmember Beck yes councilmember bird thank you councilmember McGuire oh okay thank you appreciate that let the record reflect reflect councilmember McGuire is recused for this forgive me for that for not mentioning that in the first place so mayor pro tem Meltzer aye and mayor Hotspeth is a I as well that passes five to zero awesome okay that concludes the consent agenda thank you very much that takes us to section four of your agenda items for individual consideration we have first is item a a two one zero zero zero one consider adoption of ordinance of the seat of Denton Texas regarding municipal services agreement pursuant to Texas local government code section four three dot zero six seven two mayor members of council Ron McGuida principal planner with development services let me pull up my presentation as mentioned in the introduction that this is a consideration for a municipal services agreement and annexation schedule for a property that the property owner submitted an annexation petition for for this to be annexed into the city of Denton the again the request is for the municipal service agreement though the petitioner is mr. Robert Harris representing the Harris ranch ownership with the city of Denton the site shown here in yellow outlining yellow generally located on the southwest corner of I 35 north and future extension loop 288 the site property is approximately 247 point seven eight acres and again the request also includes approval of a schedule of annexation the site that is being proposed is also looking looking to develop as a logistics center location the applicant submitted a conceptual site plan that shows seven buildings there are existing gas wells within the site two drilling site areas one plug gas well as well again the existing area is currently agricultural and has existing ponds the municipal service agreement is part of this annexation request it is the first of five steps in the annexation process all of these services that you see here listed were prepared and is in your backup with explanations of how services will be provided both the city staff as well as the property owner applicant have reviewed this agreement there has been some minor edits and those are incorporated into the municipal service agreement that you have in your backup the schedule for annexation under steps that lead to annexation as you can see here tonight we will be hearing or considering three items the municipal service agreement which is the first there will also be a public hearing and then last the first reading of the annexation if successful the annexation ordinance will be publicate published that is in the local newspaper the DRC and then scheduled for September 14th is the second reading of the annexation at that point that will be again if affirmed adoption of the annexation ordinance and in turn annex the property into the city just want to give you some context as to what the area is as far as future land use designation it shows that the subject property is under the business innovation future land use designation and then the zoning there is not a zoning because it's not in the city yet so that is something that the applicant will be submitting if again the annexation is successful with that I'll stand for any questions okay thank you councilmember McGuire thank you um so in keeping with our theme of environmentally friendly economic development I I just want to say I'm very excited about this whole area developing you know in the direction of industrial development I do have some concerns as this area develops about the increase in in truck traffic on 35 especially we know that that's a that's a dangerous roadway and and trucks are huge producers of greenhouse gases so my question is have you or the developer or anybody involved in this project had any conversations with the Kansas City Southern rail line about utilizing that that railroad connectivity as a way to move goods as opposed to trucks the staff to my line to my knowledge has not I'm not sure if the applicant has we concern if the applicant is here there's this he may be able to address that question no no we have not had any conversations with the railroad about any type of transportation by the way my name is Dennis Chauvin I'm with half associates I'm representing the owners nice to meet you all right thank you I would like to suggest I guess that perhaps those those conversations happen as we move forward I was also wondering I saw something about ESA's on this property can you give us some more details about the nature of those ESA's sure there was a pre-application that preceded these annexation application in the at the time there was discussion on those ESA's and I believe there are primarily riparian habitats buffers that is not habitat but buffers at the point of development there will be an opportunity for them the the applicants to evaluate those ESA's and if it is determined that those ESA's do exist on site they will have to avoid or seek other options in terms of developing their property okay thank you okay Councilor Arometer so just a question really about process so I can kind of think looking forward so so how does it work so say that there's a yes vote to the municipal services agreement no vote to the annexation not saying that I anticipate that I'm just trying I'm wondering you know with one coming before the other how would that work could there be a municipal services agreement without since station the the if there was safe for the sake for discussion the annexation does not go through then the municipal service agreement does not get so that was my that was my understanding to you so why did it is there a reason why they came in this order yes per Texas local government code the municipal service agreement must come first establish the services in order for the annexation process to continue okay that's I learned something new thank you very much Councilor in bed come on there we go so so a little bit about the the sort of the railroad in the ESA inventory have we let me start with the ESA have we inventory our ETJ and adjacent properties such that this actually is an these eases are known eases and we know their characteristics relative to our own internal definitions or these more in the category of likely eases if you will my understanding my understanding Commission back is that back in 2005 when the ESA regulations were put in place a map was put together using UNT data and therefore it includes areas outside the city ETJ specifically and because the area has been it's been a while since since the evaluation had occurred the process is that if there is an development immediately we we recommend that that ESA be evaluated to confirm that it does exist and at that point if it is then obviously the ESA regulation supply if it does not then that is removed from the ESA map okay and and then just ask a sort of a process workflow question if we approve the multiple service agreement and we improve the the annexation and those are all going but let's say something about the final plan either do the eases or doing the platting or whatever fails I mean that we're still have that territory now in our in our internal jurisdiction there's there's not there's no back workflow element correct once annexation occurs it's in the city and therefore would need to apply or comply with the requirements of the city in terms of development in terms of zoning okay thank you Councilmember Davis thank you mayor just so we're all perfectly clear and then the public knows if we approve annexation through this agreement we're agreeing to pretty basic municipal services we're not agreeing to a particular type of zoning or a particular site plan or a particular land use or anything like that correct that is correct that comes later okay and when that comes at that time we can have those conversations about well let me ask you this it might be a better question we've talked some already about a small area plan for this neck of the woods how how do we think that potential development on this tract will line up with that small area plan do we think that we might fall in line together or are we gonna be figuring out what business innovation really means long before that I can't yeah I apologize I won't be able to answer that question I think it's still premature I think we still need to do the smaller plan but generally we are looking at this area as you know it is an area that's seeing a lot of growth and we want to make sure we get it right good deal thank you and if there aren't any more questions mayor I'm ready to make a motion I'm gonna move adoption of the ordinance authorizing the city manager to execute the municipal services agreement okay and I second yep discussion mayor Pro Tem I'm sorry you muted sorry yeah Ron I know this is the sort of form of question that you don't won't necessarily like but just to make a point certain make certain certain points are clear if if the municipal service agreement and the annexation fail with the city of debt and any say at all over what happens with any environmentally sensitive areas that are on the property no since they were not developed they wouldn't be in the city of them and and similarly I understand their castles on the property is that right that is correct and if the if the municipal service agreement and the annexation failed with the city of debt have any say about reverse setbacks in what can be built in proximity to the gas wells no since there will not be in the city okay just want to make sure that was clear for everybody I would have moved approval had not already been moved I'll let you go vote as you see fit thank you come from back I'm gonna actually vote yes on this but I will chide ourselves that we had a recent vote on property across the street as you will across the freeway that had a similar long-term goal and now we are I'm going to ask that we we do keep careful mind of the small area plan that councillor Davis mentioned simply because this area is clearly wanting to move into logistics on its own without our input and if council doesn't want that we need to get that small area plan in place because it's doing that all on its own so that would be my comment okay we have a motion in a second any other discussion okay councillor Davis I'll say you I mayor Hutsworth is a I councillor back I councilmember McGuire I councilmember armature yes councilmember bird I mayor pro tem Meltzer thank you passes 7-0 thanks Ron thank you okay that takes us to our first public hearing and I'll open so I'll call it and then I'll open a public hearing so it's item a Z to 1 - 0 0 0 5 a hold a public hearing and consider adoption of ordinance of the city of Denton Texas regarding a change in zoning district and use classification from mixed-use neighborhood MN and residential are four districts to residential are six district on approximately point three two six acres and I'll open the public hearing now and mayor point of privilege this is our historic preservation officer for those of you who have not met Cameron Robertson and I don't believe she's had the opportunity to really present in this chambers before so just wanted to say welcome to her good evening everyone hope it goes well if not come back thank you so my name is Cameron Robertson I'm the historic preservation officer I will be presenting Z 21 0 0 5 a which is a residential zoning so the request is for a rezoning of 0.3 to 6 acres from mixed use neighborhood and residential four districts to a residential six district the subject property is currently vacant it is approximately 0.1 acres of MN district and 0.23 acres of our four district based off historic aerials it is assumed that the property has been vacant since 1984 it is surrounded by MN our four resent residential three and public facilities districts so this is just a quick overview this is the zoning map in 2002 and the current zoning map and then the proposed zoning map which shows us our six so going through our rezoning we do a general approval criteria for all applications through the DDC section 2.4 point 5e I will be focusing mainly on points 3 and 8 and we also look at zoning criteria for approval via DDC section 2.7 point 2d and I'll be focusing on 1 5 and 6 so the Denton plan this site is designated as low residential this is intended for new development up to four dwelling units per acre to promote walkability access to parks open space and recreation amenities the r6 is consistent with our future land use map it does permit a variety of lower intensity housing types available to the community at a scale in a form that is typically found in the established residential area and it's also within walking distance of parks and school facilities it also serves as a transition between the low residential area as you see on the map to the south in the downtown compatibility area just to the north it is an info lot surrounded by existing neighborhoods and infrastructure the proposal furthers the overall goal to promote a compact development pattern in this area so the r6 is consistent with surrounding zoning and the development pattern the existing land use along Robertson Street is mixed use it has residential restaurant and religious assembly uses the infill development would provide a variety of housing options that are complementary in scale and character and like I said on the last slide it would serve as a transition between that single-family neighborhood and mixed use on Robertson into the south as well as the downtown transition area to the north as you see highlighted in blue on the screen there are three duplexes and two fourplexes currently located within 650 feet or less of the subject property and there is no direct vehicular connection to the neighborhood to the south except along Robertson Street this is because along Y Street that is owned by Dart development would require conformance with current site design standards including screening and landscaping so to run through the public facilities and services available the transportation would generate around 30 vehicle trips per day with two total morning peak hour trips and for evening the school attendance zones are Borman elementary school Calhoun middle school and Denton high school and this is proposed to generate at least one elementary student the parks that are in proximity within 0.4 miles is Fred Moore Park and this meets the parks department's goal of 10 minute walk to a park there is public water and wastewater services already available at the site and is approximately 0.6 miles from the central fire station the public outreach we did a newspaper out on July 17th we had a property posted on July 16th we mailed 29 public notices 87 courtesy notices and we had no opposition we did have one in favor which is located at 521 Robertson Street and that is Michael tally and we had no neutral so planning and zoning Commission recommends approval 6o and staff recommends approval of the requested zoning as it complies with our criteria and sections 2.4 point 5e and 2.7 2d of the development code and I am free to take any questions and I know that the applicants are here as well if you have any questions for them okay great councilmember Davis did you hear correctly that dart owns the old railroad right away along Y Street yes that is correct okay so not one of the other two railroads that we typically deal with but dart owns that railroad right-of-way particularly where the old railroad Y used to be correct okay thank you okay councilmember I'm supportive of the duplex but my question is can you remind me what's allowed in our six that's not allowed in the overlap of MN and an R4 in terms of uses you know why do we need to change zoning to allow a duplex and so in terms of the R6 we are allowed to have single-family detached townhomes duplex triplex and four plexes currently in the proposed project would be a four plex you are not allowed to have a four plex within a R4 zoning but it is permitted within MN however based off the maps and staff discussion we didn't feel that MN felt fit because it would allow for higher density usage such as multifamily dwelling but from the map you showed the MN would be more consistent with the overall residential or zoning map for this region so I guess and there's sort of a semi industrial use across the street with the Claire's kitchen and the public facility if you know I'm not against the duplex if it was a vote on the duplex BAM our quad or four plex I vote that I'm just weird I'm just weirded out by the the movement to R6 I guess is and I'll have to think about that while others ask questions. Councilmember Armitage. So I have a similar question is the kind of the reverse question what uses are allowed in the mixed use that are that would not be allowed in the newly proposed designation? So in the MN it you are allowed to have the four plex and the multifamily dwelling so everything's allowed in terms of the residential from single-family all the way to multifamily dwelling but in terms of R6 you're not allowed to have that multifamily dwelling so when staff was doing analysis we determined that it was best with this project that putting forward that we would not allow to do the full mixed use just because it is that transition area between downtown and going into single-family residents and that low residential area so we felt that by doing an R6 rezoning it would allow for a nice transition between the two areas of an R3 R4 and then the downtown compatibility area to the north and and I mean where's the closest business on and it's right here. Clara's Kitchen. That's what I thought I was going to get the business that I know. Yes. Yeah yeah and so this wouldn't affect you know they're standing obviously you know I'm I too you know don't have a problem at all with the four plex I think four plexes should be allowed anywhere a house is a single-family home is allowed just with consideration to scale but I'm potentially concerned I'm still trying to figure out you know how I will vote on this I'm just concerned about kind of possibly shutting off the possibility of other you know locally owned businesses in this area that could go really nicely with residences like how you know Clara's Kitchen just goes so nicely with the residential neighborhood feel so anyway I don't know if if you had any answers to that concern or if other council members will but that's gonna be kind of my my sticking point not that I have something specifically in mind but I would just I would hate to shut off the possibility of you know people starting a locally owned business in such a great neighborhood where it mixes so well with residences and in businesses it's it's unfortunate that this kind of zone I mean it seems like there's just something kind of off in the zoning the way it is anyway where you had to kind of work around to find a category you know that fits so I look forward to changing the codes so it isn't so difficult to find a fit like this that where you could do both okay councilmember bird is there gonna be an opportunity for another type of facility to residential facility to get on that property as well or is this this four place is just it I would like the applicant to speak to that if they're here I'm not sure there is the opportunity to do like I said single family up to four plexes I'm not sure what the idea of the applicant is I know that currently is proposed to do a four plex but that doesn't mean that you know moving forward there isn't that opportunity to go let lower density so the property is large enough to maybe put another a single family home or a couple of more or something like that just trying to get an idea of how how much property we're talking about here do we have any more information on the type of four plex that's going on there is it gonna be you know the style is there anything or does that matter right now I have I do have some of that information but we're kindly yes all right I got it I understand thank you that's all ahead councilor Davis thank you mayor staff has let us know already a little bit about some of the history of the site and some of the questions that were answered and forgive me if I've just missed it but do we know how we ended up with the split zoning was there a use there previously on the MN portion that ended up in our MU and then we rezoned everything and do we know how we got the split zoning it is completely unknown it's been that way since 1991 we're not sure why it was split initially and that it's continued to be split since then but unfortunately we do not have that information that's why it was initially split and forgive me if I missed it in the explanation you gave earlier about when we were talking about different densities but would a fourplex be allowed under in M and excuse me MN and if so is there a particular reason and you can defer to the developer if you need to why we're seeking our six as opposed to MN if it's if the use is allowed in in M so the R6 was a staff recommendation and to the applicant we felt that it was a better transition zoning between that low residential to the south as well as the downtown compatibility area to the north so we just thought it would be a better transition that if they did want to do a fourplex that moving forward especially into the future land use map and everything that it we still have that low residential area so we just we just felt ultimately that was a better transition than doing the straight MN just because the area around it to the north is directly across along Robertson Street would be low residential in the future as well would it be fair to say and I mean finding no fault with this at all but it would be fair to say that because it was a residential use that this particular developed this applicant is proposing that that staff felt like that felt better in general I mean that just fit better in general because it was going to be a residential use that's being proposed yes okay okay sorry count mayor pro tem councilor armature I don't mind mayor pro tem going since I know at all go ahead okay well no no no hold on this is just the process I got to keep it all straight and so if I mean councilor you've requested to speak go ahead well I understand mayor that it's easier to I understand mayor pro tem thank you councilor armature okay just just quick quick question so and so just to confirm I just want to make sure because council member Davis question was kind of very much like kind of where I was how I was thinking so just to confirm a duplex sorry a fourplex is allowed in MN yes right okay so yeah so based on that I would much prefer an MN for this since it would allow them I'd be curious to know if they what objections they might have it would allow them to do what they want to do and it would not preclude people from you know starting from have making their own you know small businesses around if that's what they want to do but if it ends out to be kind of organically just residential then it then it can be that or it could change I just feel like there's more flexibility and I can't see the harm and I I looked at the you know if there were notifications that said where people said we don't want businesses in this neighborhood I would be listening to that I know the businesses there is very much a kind of locally beloved one and it's small fits the scale of the neighborhood so anyway that's where I stand okay mayor pro tem Melzer yeah actually I was going down the exact same road is so so we did clarify that the intended use could fit in and then I guess this is a question for the city attorney then is is that an available motion to us to you know rather than approve what's been proposed since it's a public hearing you know is there a way to get to that result within this public hearing of it of approving it as a man yes sir good evening thank you mayor council Scott McDonald director of development services just for a point of clarity I did speak with the applicant the applicant is okay going to MN staff recommended what you have before you today if in fact we were to change to MN we'd have to re-notice and go before PNC and then come back to council so it'd be going to PNC and the eighth and come back to council in the 21st keeping in mind that they would have other opportunities to put commercial uses on this property versus being just a residential property so that's where staff recommendation was at for the neighbors is that this was just going to continue to be a residential property perhaps a little denser but it wouldn't necessarily be a commercial use so that that is an option and of course the applicant is acceptable to that okay give me just one moment mayor pro tem while I have you is that does that you have any questions for staff well I hear that the applicants amenable but you know I'm concerned about being heavy-handed you know like it's sort of they're minimal because they want to get to yes I don't want to be burdensome no but if they would actually like that outcome you know I would you know I realized it's putting a lot of process in the way I think it is a better outcome given that funny little triangle of land that you know is opposite in other business I mean I think everything that's been expressed suggests that would be a good outcome especially because I hope this project goes you know as intended they don't know that doesn't always happen so but once you change the zoning it sticks so you know we've opened the door to uses so so I guess I'm looking for some way to tell if the applicant is really okay with it you know if this is really palatable and if so I would like to go in that direction okay well let me let me kind of I have some questions and and I'll was a neighborhood meeting held do you know right neighborhood meeting and so that's a little concerning for me traditionally we asked that right and and I think if we deviate in certain neighborhoods I think that can look less than great right so that gives me a little concern I also am concerned because we're gonna do a lot of construction on Robertson Street really soon and so the timings a little concerning but really what I'd like to hear from staff is what we're not we hadn't discussed as a setbacks and so for four-part cars per residents and so I kind of want to hear from staff on the setbacks and you know because I think there's some I think there's a there there right and and and I'd rather just get to that like why there's something missing right and and I'll be fully transparent I think a single-family home goes there all day if you if you look at the backup and let me let me say this I'm biased I live about two blocks away so very familiar with this and I walked it today and talked to the residents and I couldn't get anyone to talk to me either so I understand efforts were made but I just think for consistency purposes I think a neighborhood meeting at least an invitation and then if that hey no one responded so we didn't have it that just presents better you know and and then I do have concerns when you're talking about gentrification and changing of a neighborhood that now there's a pin you know you you circle the blue spaces and I don't think that house next to the church is a four-plex it presents as a single home now maybe they have the rooms divided up but it it presents like a single-family home a lot I drove it again today so but I say that to say if we're talking single-family home that that that we're gonna rent or serve a family that that to me is but I guess from the applicant if they want to explain what the rents are gonna be right and give some so if it's manageable rents to then that to me is a is a is a consideration right it's like hey here's something less than great in my estimation in exchange for serving the community better you know that that kind of gives me some peace of mind but really I want to someone I need someone explain to me to setbacks and driveways four cars per home is what we is what we require so that's driveway that's a garage and in two cars but from the diagram I can't track how that stacks up in this sure good evening Haley Zagorski with Development Services so a four-plex actually requires two spaces per dwelling unit so they would have two in each of the driveways that were shown on that diagram single-family homes and duplexes do require four per unit but four plexus is two per unit there you go so okay the difference got it and so for me I mean I'll just tell you just from experience right I mean every house around in my house is a habitat home and all of them have four cars you know and and and so and that road is more narrow than you get further into the neighborhood it's it's pretty narrow and it's it's the only cut through other than Dallas Drive where you can avoid the train right that's only railroad trestle and so it gets a lot of traffic and get a lot more and probably go myself to service by saying that but but but I say that to say it gets a lot of traffic and and you're putting extra cars parked on the road because it just living and it's nothing it's not negative at all I think it's just you'll have a family and you'll have kids that live there longer they go to live there while they're going to school which is great I mean all great things I just think from a from a practical standpoint I have concerns about not having the four-part cars and that makes sense to me what we're trying to do and it's admirable but it just I'll be quiet saying this I if they if the rents are going to be a consideration that I can get there if not I'm not going to support it just because I think a single-family belongs there if you pan out if you look at staffs kind of analysis and thank you for that it's r3 r4 as far as you can see there's nothing else there other than the the the the public facilities etc so that that's my stance but again I yeah sorry and Justin Beatle 1445 County Road 223 Collinsville Texas we are the owner developers as far as I just want to answer the rent sure each one of the the units is about a thousand two square feet we were anticipating between a dollar ten to a dollar fifteen per square foot so just slightly be over a thousand dollars for rent so that was our original intent on those there two-bedroom brand new we actually have pictures of another unit a duplex that we built over off of Oak Street that shows the exact materials exactly what it's going to look like it's definitely I mean they're nice nice-looking structures what's the while other people are talking I'll pull it up what's the address for the oh afforded those pictures to you and we'll get others than edge quest thank you very much that that's very helpful thank you and let's see if we have stay close just in case others have question okay Council member the question for the developer here if we were not to go with the fourplex how many houses you think you would be able to put on that single single-family homes if we were not to go with the fourplex and maybe recommended single-family dwellings about how much you think you can get on get on there I think as far as a single-family home would be to do and that would probably be about the same same square footage because of the because of the awkward shape of the lots it's going to be interesting on what I don't know exactly off top of my head what those square footages okay thank you okay seeing no other questions were you able to find the no okay got it I'm sorry oh I'm sorry Mary Pro Tem did you have a question yeah I really appreciate you if we could hear from the applicant you've heard the discussion about alternatively going to amen which would be you know a whole another round of process and I just like to you know hear your thoughts about there any up upside for you in that is it all just you know hurdle or does that have any appeal to you we're not opposed to the amen zoning we're able to accomplish what we're wanting to with either either of the zoning so if that's something the council recommends we're not opposed to that the only thing that it does do is just kind of prolong the development process but we're accustomed to that so but we're not opposed to going to an MN zoning okay yep guess what let's see if this these are for you Councilor Davis sir thank you just a couple of questions my first one is you know let's say we went through the exercise of doing an amen instead are y'all still planning to build basically the same thing you'd build if you got the r6 that this application is for yes okay so if we if we did change it there's not necessarily y'all aren't planning to put in a community entrepreneurial kind of an outfit or a small store or a restaurant or anything like that up to this point those have not been any of the conversations of doing that more so in our minds we were thinking this was a vacant lot that's been vacant since 84 it could have nice nice four plex on it's close to school families could move in there whatever it might be we had not thought about putting any type of the business there sure and can you talk to us about the neighborhood meeting did y'all try to have a neighborhood meeting did you I mean what happened there when we filed that the truth doesn't matter I have a twin brother who was in a serious motorcycle accident and I ended up going to spend time with him and we did not hold that meeting and so I realize now that that's something that that mayor would like to have had but truthfully I was with him during that period of time and I know that you know delay is always less than desirable would y'all be amenable to postpone it to try to have a neighborhood meeting to see what people in the neighborhood have to say about it I'm just a little concerned by only having one response and then the mayor not having much luck getting getting folks opinions in the lead up to this meeting and maybe give them the neighborhood a little bit more opportunity to be heard if that's what council would like for us to do then then we can do that me personally my belief is because of the way that the building looks I don't know if there would be anyone that's going to be really opposed to it I think it would be different if we were putting in something that wasn't aesthetically pleasing as far as a developer as far as a four plex but we can hold that if you would like us to thank you councillor back if I might just our staff would be able to pull up this image except for mayor pro tem Melzer would not be able to see it because we can't put it into the zoom so if you know we want to do this an alternative way via email or some other means we can display it just mayor pro tem will not be able to see the image just you display it I'll text him a picture how about that okay thank you thank you yes okay I'm familiar with that house got it okay thank you okay and let me get back so I can see Paul what's your what's your phone number no just kidding okay counselor back thank you just for clarity that that picture was of an example of the type of duplex that the developer wishes to put on this project yes okay I just wanted to be clear on that so and and again I guess what I heard was the developer is amenable to having a delay for a neighborhood meeting and the developer fully intends to put a duplex whether we approve r6 or MN or delay is that a fair assessment of sort of what we've said to you okay yeah I think that's all my questions thank you okay and so I'll just say yeah I'm very familiar with that because it popped up in that other lot on where you know where it is and it was a question the world is that but it does look good it just it's it's a fish out of water and so and I respect that that that I appreciate that explanation right and because that's helpful with with respect to the neighborhood meeting I'll see where they go the the rents are are comfortable I mean again that's that's below market for sure if you're talking to bedroom so I appreciate those efforts so we'll see where we go I got to think about that but I do appreciate that explanation and but and then from a staff perspective just kind of know that I'm concerned about the dropping of pins in in in places and then that kind of spidering out and as a reference point right because I think that just kind of is a challenge but I again I'll I'll concede the one person I talked to that I finally got to come to the door across the streets as long as he wasn't building it in their front yard they were okay with it so that's all the feedback I was able to get and so staff do we have any do we have any callers hi mayor yes this is Rachel we do have one perfect okay I'll hatching through right now thank you if you'll mute then that will be on a delay just in case we say something on torque but if you can give your name and address then you'll have four minutes sure thank you my name is Chris Watts 419 South Carroll Boulevard suite 1b here in didn't 76201 I guess my primary question is when I hear in our big zoning of four units per acre and I understand that this is four units on a third of an acre that doesn't seem to comply with the code first of all let me say I think that a duplex here of course and I think there's some discussion whether it's a duplex or a fourplex but my understanding is there they're proposing a fourplex which will be double the size I think of the picture that y'all just saw so my primary question is how is it being justified that four units can go on a third acre if the density is four units per acre and I might have misheard that so I will hang up because those are my comments okay thank you thank you staff so in terms of an r6 zoning it does comply it you can fit a fourplex on the property we looked at fitting when they initially came to do a pack meeting with us which is a pre-application conference we looked at a bunch of different scenarios and the fourplex did fit it did comply with our DDC code so I apologize if I miss provided misinformation during the presentation but it does comply with the r6 zoning you are allowed to build a fourplex it does fit on the lot it does meet those standards for the lot area okay okay councilmember back just procedurally it we've been discussing potentially a delay a vote a motion for against would finalize this action am I understanding that correctly you are correct so if we don't wish to finalize that action then we probably don't want to vote we tonight and maybe encourage the the applicant to delay their their their request so they could voluntarily or someone could make a motion yes can we make a motion to delay their request make a motion to postpone this item okay unless I'm wrong about I want to check with legal if that's yes okay thank you mayor and thank you legal Scott McDonnell director of development services perhaps we wouldn't want to postpone or bring this back to council but perhaps remand it back to P and Z and then we could just re-notice and come back with the appropriate zoning or whatever the outcome would be okay yes thank you I appreciate that insight councilman armature okay so quick comment and then question working towards this you know what what do we do now procedurally as for the callers concern you know it appears to me and the developer could correct me if I'm wrong but that you know that property that was shown could very could be a fourplex that a fourplex is not necessarily twice as big as a duplex you could have a read you could have a huge duplex and you could have you know in this within the same size size home it could be a single-family home carbon to carbon to four just means that the spaces are smaller so just wanted to confirm that yes that's why that that wasn't a concern of mine so what I was kind of going to do but I want to make sure I'm doing the right thing was to I was going to make a motion and so I'm asking if this would have the intended effect to I was thinking a motion to deny and encourage them to and to ask them to have a neighborhood meeting and come back to you know P&Z with MN or whatever else might be recommended I don't feel comfortable with this with the R6 but this sounds to me like a good development but I also don't feel comfortable with the fact that there wasn't a neighborhood meeting so is what would be the best action to have that happen without any unintended negative consequences you know for the developer of the neighborhood it wouldn't be a denial because the denial then would create another set of consequences for them it would truly just be remanded this back to Planning and Zoning Commission for consideration okay so it wouldn't take a denial to do that in other words okay yeah and so and I could request a neighborhood meeting with that yeah yeah staff will take care of that okay so do you is there a motion to remand it down yes yeah I would like to remand it to P&Z and ask the developer to have a neighborhood neighborhood meeting and by the way I'm very sorry about your family members what what happened to them completely understand so I think it would be good to have a neighborhood meeting now and then counseling back yeah I second that and then staff is there were you trying to get and get my attention is there any any other callers no sir perfect okay then I'll close the public hearing we have a motion by councilmember Armantor to remand it back down to P&Z to take another look at it in in that got it Scott if you may for me do you need to have a zoning associated with that or is that something no we can carry it forward okay so you will take care of it okay got it so yeah so motion by Councilmember Armantor to remand it down to P&Z for another look at it and a neighborhood meeting would be incorporated in that process by proxy and then councilmember back you second it did second it sir yeah okay got it making sure sorry okay and then discussion any discussion I will echo that you know again thank you for letting us know about your brother hope he's recovering well and thank y'all for your commitment to to working with us here pardon the slight delay but but I'm grateful for your patience so with that Councilmember Burke I just want to note that that area does have an association so you'll probably have to get on their their schedule to meet with them to have that meeting okay thank you for that so Councilmember Armatur how say you yes Councilmember Beck aye Councilmember McGuire aye Councilmember Burke aye Councilmember Davis aye Mayor Pro Tem Meltzer aye and Mayor Hutz but as I well as well that passes 7-0 thank you Scott for your flexibility and great job Cameron thank you very much okay that takes us to item 5B which is Z 2000 005 C hold public hearing and consider adoption of ordinance of the City of Denton Texas regarding a change in the zoning district and use classification for mixed use regional MR to district district to light industrial ally district on approximately 142 acres of land good evening let me pull up my presentation good evening Council I'm Julie Wyatt senior planner with the City of Denton and I'm presenting Z 20-0005 Denton Commerce Center to you this evening so the request before you is to rezone that 142 acres from mixed use regional to light industrial district the subject property is located just west of I-35 at the the end of loop 288 where that in that location world would be extended in the future the current zoning map shows the property is MR district and that's that purple that you see on your screen and they are proposing to rezone to Li district the criteria for approval in all zoning cases is in sub chapter 2 of the Denton Development Code and we'll talk about these as we talk through the project so the first thing that we always talk about is Denton plan 2030 and that future land use designation so the subject property is within a business innovation future land use designation that is intended for those large tracts of land that are appropriate for well-planned larger scale office and employment parks it also allows room for supporting uses like commercial retail hotels residential Li district is consistent with business innovation it's one of those a couple of districts we typically see within the business innovation future land use designation the permitted uses in Li are consistent with the intent of business innovation light manufacturing distribution office and then that variety of commercial uses it also permits development at that larger scale as well well something we talked about at the planning and zoning Commission and that staff talked about was those commercial development standards the Denton Development Code does have a provision in sub chapter 7 that does exempt some light industrial developments from those commercial design standards if it's set back from the the right-of-way in this instance you can see the subject property here given the given the rights of way that that are along three three sides of the property that would limit the development of the property without those commercial design standards so we feel like those commercial design standards would be something that would apply to the property and that would move forward with the development of the property something we also talked about tonight was that small area plan and that was discussed at planning and zoning and City Council a small area plan for this general area being that it is one of our gateways of our city and has a lot of activity for development as part of that discussion we did talk about those industrial uses on on the the west side of the highway so it was something that that Li would be consistent with that discussion another criterion for approval is significant changes to warrant the zoning change in order to discuss this we're gonna go way back we're gonna go back to 1999 and that in the 1999 Denton plan at that time there was there was a thought that this area would be end up being kind of a regional shopping and mixed-use district and you can see that on the the map on your screen the site has that red star on it and it's surrounded by that dark purple that was our mixed use a regional mixed-use center and the zoning that reflected that vision it was our CCD which was a regional center commercial downtown if you remember your 2002 didn't development code we updated our dent our comprehensive plan in 2015 and that's that didn't plan 2030 at that time the determination was those the regional centers that we had in place the loop to it or the the loop at south of town and then razor ranch as well as the airport that those regional centers were were kind of appropriate and that this area really should transition to that more employment type uses and so that's where that future land use of business innovation came in however that zoning of that RCCD and eventually transition to that MR zoning with the 2019 didn't development code remained in place so that current zoning of MR really is a vestige of a comprehensive plan from 1999 it really hasn't been updated to reflect that current comprehensive plan minimizes adverse impacts on surrounding property LI is appropriate in this area and we don't anticipate that it would create adverse impacts for the surrounding property as you can see on your screen much of the surrounding property is undeveloped or used for agricultural purposes but as this area develops we do anticipate that it will that it will develop consistent with that future land use designation and that would generally facilitate that industrial distribution and employment type uses of course with some commercial uses along along the the the corridors and I do want to mention here the applicant has indicated that they intend to develop the site with either warehouse or some other lighter industrial type use and and I just wanted to point out that if that were a pretty if if the zoning is approved they could develop with any of the uses permitted in in Li so we're going to go over that next so I've just it's in your backup all of the permitted uses within Li but I did want to go over these briefly in the presentation because if the property if the rezoning was approved it could develop with any of these uses and Li provides for a variety of commercial uses the the spreadsheet on your screen shows that that a sample of those commercial uses what the existing zoning would permit and that's that MR and then it shows what the the zoning districts that we typically see in business innovation that's that geo and also Li and you can see a lot of those commercial uses really translate among all of these zoning designations and then we just want to talk about the industrial uses MR does permit some of those employment uses but maybe not at the scale that we that we are typically want to see in business innovation and that's where that geo and in this instance Li would come in there was a analysis of the public facilities and services available to serve the property given the sites adjacency to the I-35 corridor and loop 288 and in that future extension of loop 288 there's adequate access to the subject property and there are future improvements to this area here I've got a schematic of I-35 and in those future improvements to I-35 that will be coming along in in the upcoming years as well as that extension to loop 288 and this is a running concurrent with a comprehensive plan amendment to the mobility plan that we'll be talking about next so that will also talk about the transportation related to that there is water and sewer available in the area they'll of course have to do additional analysis as they move forward with the development but there are facilities to connect to they did public notification was sent out we didn't receive any responses related to the request and the planning and zoning Commission recommended of the approval of the request as well as staff recommends approval as it does comply with the criteria for approval in sub chapter 2 and I'll be happy to answer any questions and the applicant does have a presentation okay let's open the public hearing and then I guess let's do questions for staff that way the applicant can note those and address that in their presentation as needed so councilmember McGuire thank you mayor heads but I you were showing right-of-way dedications on three sides of the property obviously the south side is 288 the east side is 35 what is that right-of-way dedication on the north end of the property 1173 is that going to be widening as well that is actually we'll be talking about that road a little bit more within the comprehensive plan piece but that is 1173 is going to have some changes going forward it's actually going to track to the north and connect to to I 35 where highway 377 comes in so it's going to be the new earth hole road that current 1173 will remain in place and in our our draft mobility plan has it as a secondary arterial so there probably will be right-of-way dedication that will be needed in order to fully construct that road to the ultimate conditions okay okay I we've talked about it before but I don't have it in my head what is the timeline on the 288 expansion I have that right here our engineering group is here tonight to answer questions related to that but they did provide me some information and and it is my understanding that it would be ready to go out to bid or is anticipated to be go to go out to bid in April of 2026 it's also my understanding that loop 288 is gonna kind of develop differently in this area and that the access roads will come first and then the trap the main lanes will come second and they're nodding at me yes all right yeah that is a longer timeline than I had in my head for some reason okay I'm gonna keep ringing this bell yes it's adjacent to 35 it's also adjacent to Kansas City Southern Railroad have there been any discussions regarding connectivity with the railroad I have not discussed that with the applicant but they are here and I I anticipate that be able to answer that before the cat the meeting yes but I yeah I mean I know that the answer is no because we spoke before the meeting but just just want to keep hitting on that I'd love to see greater utilization of our railroad resources I am concerned about excessive semi truck traffic on 35 and I think that utilizing that railroad is a good way to minimize those safety and environmental concerns okay any other questions did we lose mayor pro tem or okay well Billy let me know okay seeing none then we're ready for the applicants presentation I believe and I think they have ten minutes each total of 20 minutes there's two yes he's here I'm gonna pull up his presentation let's make sure I get it right thank you there is a presentation oh I'm gonna okay it's important almost there there you go let me there you go Todd Finley six three eight five Plum Creek Frisco Texas thank you for your time thank you for and you can adjust that however you need so we're I'm with CLX ventures so I'm just kind of do a quick you said I had ten minutes yes sir a little bit about our firm Brad Copeland and Tony Long are the co-founders and so Brad Copeland has been doing development for 30 over 30 years has spent time at Trammell Crow, Crow Holdings, Clary on Partners, Tony Long is the other co-founder CLX was formed two and a half years ago Tony was an executive for 30 years with Trammell Crow and CBRE has was head of global asset management toward the end of his time at CBRE my name is Todd Finley and I was with Trammell Crow as well had a little bit of dialogue with Tony Long I was a lot lower down on the food chain but it's still kind of knew each other and I also spent 12 years doing industrial development for Hillwood investment properties Eli Ellis is our CFO and runs our books and he spent some time at JP Morgan so a little bit about us this is just a development activity we really focus on two product types class a distribution and class a multifamily that could be rap rap product garden style our main focus is in Texas a lot of us spent a lot of time traveling all over the country so we want to try to do as much as we can a car now and stay in Texas we have done developments north of Denton all the way to South San Antonio have stuff in Houston as well so a little bit about the regions that we are in since we're tonight talking about light industrial thought it would be appropriate to show you some renderings and actual photos of a building we just completed a year and a half ago at DFW Airport this is a million square foot building was leased to a large e-commerce group that I'm sure a lot of us have used or shopped online with but you can see that when we show renderings we pretty much develop what that is so this is another development that we did in South Dallas it's another million footer just south of interstate 20 off Houston Street it's also a million square foot cross dot this is a photo this was a just one building of four in Houston it was a project when I was at Hillwood we did we jv'd with Brad Copeland how I met him and so this was a very similar to what we're proposing to do here in Denton right off interstate I-45 and spring just south of spring so this is I'll spend most of the time on this diagram this is first this what we're showing here is the the the area that we are planning to zone goes all the way to the railroad the the buildings and the colorful piece is what we call phase one 73 acres and so a couple things I just wanted to kind of go over is this is a conceptual plan but it is what we plan on doing site selection why we selected this site it has great access to I-35 it keeps trucks and vehicle traffic off the city streets because of that direct access the adjacency to the Kansas City Southern Railroad it gives us the opportunity to to serve rail served if you know if they're available right so that was important obviously one of the main drivers is the demand for class a distribution in this market and this part of the country not just didn't all over Texas so another thing I'd like to point out is on our plan as you can see right here where I'm you moving the cursor this is a detention pond area we have two of them on site we've already run our hydrology based on convergent conversations with the city of Denton what I want to note is this this setback is based on the future right away the future frontage for the I-35 expansion it has already been purchased by textile so therefore there is the frontage road right right now is as well we hear our development we already plan on that future right away so the other thing is is this detention pond area has to be there no matter what develops there's nothing else we can do because of the drainage there's a lot of topography on the site it kind of has a ridge kind of going through this this middle building and so the detention areas are so that we have to drain this way and then and then the western half this way so I want to just kind of throw that out there some things that we are doing to kind of go above and beyond is we we plan on using a minimum of 30% native grasses in that front front yard setback along I-35 so we want to add as much native grass as we can we were working right now to see if we can improve upon that but that's something that's important to us another thing in this same area right now the city's standard is three inch caliper trees we have committed to go to a four inch caliper day one in this area to increase the the tree canopy our plan also incorporates not having any dock doors facing I-35 so right now I'll show you in a rendering but this is what we call an industrial a rear load so all the dock doors will be on this backside and then just to note as far as setbacks the I believe the building setback for light industrial is 30 feet we're going to be approximately 200 to 225 feet away from the future frontage road so quite a quite a bit of difference as far as that any questions so far on this we can come back to yes as we talked about renderings earlier it's really important for us to make sure the city understands this is a high quality product and you know what we show is what we plan on doing so this is a rendering it helps obviously it's not perfect but I don't have all the trees that we plan on doing but it gives you an idea of what a rear load looks like it also gives you an idea of the proximity away from the future frontage road for I-35 which the I-35 expansion I met with text on today won't be complete until 2025 potentially 2026 so but but what it is is we have four main entrances to this building you see the glass storefront on this end and then two entrances in the middle and the same thing on the other side this is a just something that we are planning on doing not a condition of zoning but just wanted to explain to the council our commitment to sustainability we are planning ongoing LEED certified on our four speculative buildings it does add some additional cost just just so we're clear this is not the building that we're planning on building but we there is some additional cost to that but it in the long run it helps save costs for our attendance and and attract the type of tenants that we're looking for so we it's something that we believe in our capital believes in and so we are pursuing that any questions great thank you questions for the applicant let me get there sorry bear with me okay seeing none any questions great thank you very much did that good okay so it is a public hearing any do we have any calls staff no sir not for this one great okay so then at this time I'll call close the public hearing and I'll either take a motion or additional questions mayor Proctor Meltzer yeah actually I just wanted to say to the applicant welcome to Denton I hope you pay lots and lots of taxes thank you for choosing us I move approval and and I hope at some point you think it would be awesome for the I-35 facing front to be a place where you'd invite local artists to do a mural I'll say that I move okay thank you is there a councilman McGuire I second okay we have a motion by mayor Proctor Meltzer second by councilmember McGuire discussion councilmember Davis thank you mayor I want to thank Todd and his company for coming to Denton I want to thank you for taking the time to reach out and to answer questions ahead of time making yourselves available and in fact accommodating a pretty busy schedule on my part so I appreciate that I also want to take this opportunity to express just a little bit of tension I have on this site I intend to vote yes for the item because I appreciate the way that this particular developer goes about this particular type of development my only heartburn here is that that small area plan I wish we had done it back in 1999 I wish that we had maybe done the ED piece back in 1999 to help solidify what we wanted that this gateway to our to our city to be I think especially we just annexed 200 plus acres across the street from here we have really got to keep an eye on this if this council does not intend that to councilmember Beck's point earlier if council does not intend for this to be the logistics hub in North Denton then we need to get on the phone to our ED folks that we need to talk to our chamber folks and we need to respectfully planning staff we need to kick that SAP into high gear otherwise we're going to be doing a piecemeal like this and not every developer is going to bring us a high-quality product like this not every developers going to be as available for input we're gonna have some really tense conversations up here on the dais if we don't get ahead of it okay counselor bet I think counselor Davis for doubling down so I'll double down on his double down that we really need a small area plan sooner rather than later I wish development services would maybe prioritize that one I don't have a problem with the logistics had I been on council at the time of Hirschbach I would have voted for it so I think that's fine it's been trucking there for a long time I do say I intend to vote for for B but I do have some heartburn about the upcoming C so I'll cover that heartburn when we we get to it thank you counselor bird I appreciate the development I'm looking forward to it but I wanted to clarify something I mayor pro tem was mentioning something this is very light had mentioned something about a mural we are a city that to have murals around so that's one of our flavors and I think he had mentioned something about maybe you all can put a nice mural on your building when you get there and it looked like you didn't really hear what he said so I just wanted to clarify that with you we'll look forward to having something really cool on the building maybe thank you that's it okay thank you seen any other questions comments for this segment seeing none mayor so again motion by mayor pro tem melts was second by councilman McGuire and mayor pro tem house say you I councilmember wire I councilmember back I councilmember armature yes councilman bird I councilmember Davis I and mayor Hudson is a I passes 7-0 and with that I do kind of I'll leave that to staff kind of that note about the art components understanding the building may change so on the building may not be great but just we'll take your direction on that and as always always mess it up but in those conversations if we could talk about sourcing materials construction equipment materials if that's a thing then mayor just a point of clarification the item of small area plans the topic has come up several times tonight and as we look and and really contemplate our update of our comprehensive plan I would like to suggest and I know we have a long list of it but I really really think we need to have a work session to talk about and focus on small area plans to get some direction from council so we can get this going and get it moving okay and if you're okay with that I'd like to do that sooner than later sure let me see how my Friday looks yes so yeah you bring that back that'd be great thank you all right well good luck with your project thank you very much okay so that takes us to the item C get there which is item CCA 2 1 - 0 0 0 1 a hold public hearing and consider adoption of ordinance on Friday pardon me on Friday to come back to that ordinance of the city of Denton Texas regarding a comprehensive plan amendment to modify the roadway component map of mobility of the mobility plan to remove a section of future Cindy Lane generally located west of I-35 southbound service road good evening let me pull up my presentation and I'll open a public hearing all right almost there okay Julie Wyatt senior planner with the city of Denton and I am presenting CA 21 - 0 0 0 1 this is also related to the proposed Denton Commerce Center so before we get into the specific request so just want to talk a little bit about mobility planning within the city of Denton because we don't see requests like this very often so the mobility plan is a component of our comprehensive plan it establishes those roadway connections in that frame that roadway framework and it also includes pedestrian in that bicycle network so it's not just cars it's our it's all modes of transportation within this city it is modified and updated intermittently either in response to a specific request as you are seeing tonight or as part of the just that the maintaining and updating of our comprehensive planning efforts within this city as I mentioned it includes those transportation networks and that hierarchy of transportation so you've got your highways and your arterials and then all the way down to collectors in the neighborhood streets those aren't included on there but they are part of our hierarchy of roadways excuse me our current plan replaced our 1998 plan and our current plan is is from 2011 or and that was amended in in 2011 so we had a 1998 plan that was amended several times that finally on that last amendment was in 2011 and then was updated in in 2015 2016 and currently we have an update underway so as part of our continued comprehensive plan updates we're also looking at our mobility plan they should be updated from time to time so it's it's time so now we're going to get to the specific request as I mentioned we we adopted an updated mobility plan in 2016 and that reclassified Cindy Lane from a neighborhood street to a secondary arterial and also extended it from highway 280 all the way to FM 156 so you can see just to orient you here's kind of that that mobility plan the subject property straight down to the middle of this map here is I 35 here's highway 77 and that looped 288 extension Cindy Lane is this green dotted line kind of snaking through the map didn't development code section seven point eight point seven requires that developments when they when they include a proposed corridor they have to dedicate the right of way for that corridor so it for a secondary arterial it's typically 65 to 110 feet wide there the applicant is proposing to modify the mobility plan to remove a portion of Cindy Lane in particular that area that runs north south through the center of the subject property and just to remind you it is that that subject property there at west of I 35 kind of where where loop 288 currently terminates so the current mobility plan is is this map in the right here and it here's I 35 just to orient you here's kind of the subject property highway 77 is this location and it's something we talked about at our previous public hearing the I'm sorry not so highway 77 turns into 1173 so currently 1173 runs just straight and connects to I 35 here it will eventually track to the to the north as that primary arterial loop 288 extends to the south and then Cindy Lane you can see kind of how it impacts the subject property as well as properties to the south connecting to highway 380 in this location cutting through the ranch of states and then on toward points to the north the draft mobility plan that our engineering group has been working on actually removes Cindy Lane entirely it was a road that did not factor in our mobility plan prior to 2016 and by their analysis it really isn't necessary for mobility in the area going forward and so they are proposing to remove Cindy Lane as part of that proposed mobility plan to allow it to remain a neighborhood street within the ranch of states but that it would terminate at the north end of that neighborhood and then the mobility of the area would instead rely upon Windsor Road cutting across I 35 in this location and then heading toward the west loop 288 as well as those access roads that I 35 corridor and access roads as well as other arterials that are going north and south the criteria for approval for comprehensive plan amendments this is a part of our comprehensive plan it takes a comprehensive plan amendment to modify it is in sub chapter 2 that's the general criteria but we also have the specific criteria and that's really what we're going to focus on tonight there are two sections to the criteria for approval for comprehensive plans there's that one section where one of the fault of the criteria must be met and then there are just additional review standards that must that we need to consider as we look at this so the there are two elements to the one criteria that must be met C&D or something that's by staffs analysis that it meets and that is that events trends or facts since the adoption of the comprehensive plan have changed those original findings and they've also changed the character of the area and so we're going to talk about that in the next couple of slides but before we get to that I do want to talk about just the future land use map and how it interacts with our mobility plan so before I go into the the the text in the analysis I do want to talk about the comprehensive plan for a moment so this map here shows you your the future land use map and that's overlaid on top of our mobility plan you can see those those familiar colors in that future land use map south of the subject property which has that that red star on it is that industrial commerce that's that dark purple that then kind of fades into that business innovation that that lighter purple area just to the north and then to rural parts to the north between those two you have that yellow and that yellow is you know with that low residential and that's that that's that island of ranch estates that that that that that future land use designation is for that protection of that that neighborhood and it's something that we consider when we look at zoning districts so you can see that how Cindy Lane moves toward the north that it moves from that industrial commerce to the south through that low residential then through that business of innovation and on to points north now and now that I've set that table I want to talk about our analysis so I've got we looked at the mobility element of the Denton plan 2030 so in one provide the safe efficient movements for motor vehicles bicycles and pedestrians in a sustainable way that complements Denton's plans grow strategy given those divergent goals in those future land use designations from industrial commerce to low resident residential to business innovation and those desired uses within those that that crossing of Cindy really works against that those the intent of those future land use designations and so this connectivity between all of these could could conflict with that growth strategy and then we are looking at that mobility plan update and that and that more recent engineering analysis and that does remove Cindy Lane focusing instead on the moss branch and lovers lane corridors to the West and avoiding that expansion of existing residential streets so avoiding that that impact to that existing neighborhood street also we looked at that business innovation future land use designation the intent is for large tracts of land to be developed with kind of employment and more industrial type uses and that that has larger lot sizes anywhere from 10 20 to 30 acres for maybe a smaller project all the way up to 90 or 100 acres for larger campuses and given the location of Cindy Lane between that railroad corridor we talked about and the I-35 corridor really kind of splits these large tracts into kind of bisecting them in a manner that's inconsistent with that type of large development pattern that we want to see in this area and so especially because of the that potential width that it's sort of a 110 foot swath that would cut through this these tracts of land and that could impede the development in a way that's consistent with with business innovation and then finally just a key action within our comprehensive plan is that we should be updating our mobility plan on a regular basis and looking at it as circumstances change and so this is just part of part of that exercise events trends or facts that have really changed maybe that original calculus in 2016 and the character of the area so I want to look at aerial maps from those two different points in time so first we're going to look at 2015 you can see it may not be apparent it's pretty zoomed out but this area hadn't really developed all that much at that time it was still kind of kind of kind of far out there and and and that Cindy Lane is shown that that anticipated route of Cindy Lane kind of cut through that that kind of wide open area but since then we've seen a lot of development on our west side of town and that's kind of especially adjacent to this corridor and you can see all of those yellow dots that show either excuse me a develop industrial developments that are have been developed or are currently maybe in the platting stage or some other development stage so that really is changing this character of this area and that this Cindy Lane though the current alignment really induces trucks to move to use that corridor and and cut through what is what is already an established development pattern north of highway 80 so it really kind of changes that that character of the area the area has changed in character just given that development pattern and so it could just have a negative impact of that neighborhood and furthermore engineering is looking at at that draft mobility plan kind of simplifying how we approach that mobility plan I'm looking at that that arterial framework but allowing flexibility with with collector streets within that framework so so that even areas that maybe don't have an arterial cutting directly through them could still be served by a collector roadway within that that mobility plan framework to continue to flesh out our our mobility options within the city we also looked at those additional review standards substantial benefit to the city it is consistent the proposal is consistent with that draft mobility plan it's also compatible with our land use goals are consistent with those it would not the proposal would not negatively alter the existing or proposed land use pattern and then we also looked at adverse impacts of removing that road and given that that that is a proposed arterial but it's not really there yet it's it's it it's not functioning there's not existing trips on it right now that removing that road would not alter any transportation patterns right now public notification was sent out and we did receive one in opposition but he further clarified at the meeting that he was in support he was not he was in opposition to adding Cindy Lane and he further clarified at the Planning and Zoning Commission he was in support of removing Cindy Lane we've also talked with another neighbor in the general area just about the mobility of the area and talked to them about how the proposed Windsor would cut across I-35 to to open up additional avenues of mobility in the area so the Planning and Zoning Commission did recommend approval of the request four to two and staff recommends approval of their quest as it is consistent with the with the criteria for approval I'll be happy to answer any questions I'm really technical questions I'm probably gonna rely on my engineering group that's behind me so but but we're here to answer any questions okay and do we have any caller staff okay though though let's know Councilman Beck thank you mayor so I agree that punching a major arterial particularly with trucks through was it ranch something estates that's that's not ideal but what's also not ideal is that we have no no crossing except for lovers and mass branch and some other things across what will soon to be the corner of our loop and we have you know we need what it feels like we need something in this area to cross 288 and not force any sort of business innovation any sort of development like we just saw a second ago if they want to if they want to go to lunch they have to go all around and they kid there's no way for them to get in and out it's almost a cul-de-sac light industrial business innovation area and this concerns me in terms of network connectivity and so I guess my question is given that our mobility plan has is it is it 2,500 feet flexibility I can't remember the number but there's a fairly substantial amount of east west or north-south depending on which way the road goes in this case north-south so east-west flexibility when we finally you know plot that road out it seems to me we have an opportunity to maybe maybe maybe not make Cindy Lane but Cindy Lane to or something else that runs up along the tracks and gives actually some of the access way that we were talking about earlier to the Kansas City Railroad that then would not cul-de-sac the northwest corner of our proposed future 288 development so maybe you could comment a little bit on the the mobility flexibility and you know ways that we if you know we could simultaneously not run trucks through a neighborhood but also not cul-de-sac this corner I'm gonna let the expert Chandra answer that if that's a sure that would be awesome good evening mayor and council this is Chandra with the engineering regarding your question of swapping or replacing a Cindy Lane we are actively considering a collector's street to run from future Windsor all the way to the future West Loop 288 frontage road so this will serve the businesses or any other tracks that develop south of this location like a Harris Ranch we saw earlier in the meeting so that will serve the need so the idea then would would be to drain these these light industrial or business innovation areas east-west along Windsor not so so Windsor you can all the way go to Loop 288 and since the western side is railway tracks to get access off of rail in the current standards is almost impossible so the north-south collector makes more sense you're gonna you're gonna the idea would be to job Windsor north-south and hit 288 or away from 288 in that case actually Windsor and Loop 288 runs parallel if you see on the location right right there but it curves just to the west as we come around towards Lovers Lane and Moss Branch is where it's gonna come down that's right so I'm not talking about the east west part I'm talking about you know forming a little corner that's impossible to get in and out of so so so how how do we access that area for the people that would work there for the light industrial that we're trying to attract there so the draft mobility plan we have shown does not have any collectors shown so we could always add collectors for east-west to connect with the loop in the future across on the western western side of the tracks fair enough but then why isn't it just is easy to call that Cindy Lane with the proposed 288 frontage and the Windsor overpass that wasn't considered in 2015 so it could be as you said Cindy Lane - which would be run shorter between future Windsor to the southern side of the loop so it won't have to cross 288 and it would stay between those segments so so that all sounds good I like the whole idea of Cindy Lane - and I'm not I I think we all agree trucks through ranch land estates is bad so but the problem is if we vote yes or no we don't have a plan for Cindy Lane - we can't make an assessment about something in mobility that that's not on the mobility plan so I guess before I I mean before I would like to eliminate Cindy Lane - as my flexible 25 I'd like to have Cindy Lane - to fall back on so that I had north-south network connectivity it feels like it's it's a little early it's like one step early for me is what I guess when they're saying the hi Scott I have one more time well and I just and I might mention that as we talked about the comp plan earlier today and we're referencing the mobility plan that will be following suit these are all of those elements and this Chandra indicated and the draft mobility plan there are there are some some roadways that are presented to it this just wasn't going to work in the configuration that it was and I think those alternates will be coming forward so we're not going to have a section of the city that we wouldn't have connectivity to we just we just don't know what that is today but but the current environment doesn't work and that's why we bring it forward to you as a consideration okay I think that's fair enough but the might my concern is just what I said a second ago is if we eliminate it now then I for sure have a cul-de-sac that's the default condition if I if if if you come back to me with a plan of saying okay here's our proposed mobility changes then I have something that I can latch on to and make a decision about but right now essentially what you're asking is for me to make you know for me to sequester with you know the this this corner and and I I don't know it's a little concerning for me okay we'll see we'll see where the majority is councilman armature yeah so I didn't have a chance to watch the planning and zoning meeting and I was wondering if someone could characterize as best you can the the two objections what the objections were sure well I know one and and I think it was a similar concern as to councilmember backs concern regarding just general mobility in the area the other vote to recommend denial I I don't know what his reasoning was so sure okay councilman McGuire thank you Chandra I I'm having trouble picturing what you're talking about with Windsor do you have any kind of graphic that you can show us showing where Windsor is going to connect to 288 sure or go cross 288 so what do you see on the screen here is the proposed 2020 mobility that removed the Cindy Lane so our proposed collector would run from south of loop 288 all the way to future Windsor which is a overpass across 35 so basically since we have the liberty to move the future mobility east or west by 1,000 feet so we could align as such from south of loop 288 future to Windsor it could be anywhere and this also serves the proposed annexation of the Harris ranch that will be part of the city thank you sorry is so is Windsor going to curve up and connect to like where Cindy Lane is in the current mobility plan we can add this as a collector since the proposed mobility road doesn't show any of the collectors it just shows the arterials or the primary idea okay okay all right yeah that answers why I was confused I think okay thank you how sure customer Davis thank you mayor I've got to kind of add an additional reason besides just punting through putting trucks through to putting this cart before this particular horse currently whenever there's any kind of zoning case in this area the citizens or ranch of states come forward and they talk about how Western Boulevard was put through without a whole lot of input from them maybe there was maybe there wasn't how Cindy Lane was realigned to line up with Western Boulevard how they had to fight tooth and nail to get us text out to have a stoplight there because there were fatality accidents there and if you look at the current the 2016 mobility plan Cindy Lane is anticipated to basically be an extension of Western Boulevard and that would be moving truck traffic off of the 35 frontage roads and off of 35 to this new parallel Cindy Lane secondary arterial but then at the same time I have to scratch my head and wonder why in the world in 2016 we thought that was a good idea not just because range of states is there but also because what truck needs to run from the airport north past 380 keep going through some other you know pseudo industrial area business innovation area and then end up back at a different part of loop 288 so I think the whole thing was ill-conceived from the beginning I think the new proposal to have collectors that serve the actual areas more like what we have down on like precision around the Peterbilt facility kind of in the West Park area where we have roads that are designed to fit the facilities that are there these kind of bigger facilities as opposed to let's just punch through a road that looks good on the map regardless of what's underneath it and you know in this case that happens to be a very established neighborhood and r1 lots and all that kind of stuff so I I think this makes all the sense in the world the other reason why I'm okay with it coming before some of this other development that we're talking about is because the developer we heard from today needs to know how they can build and if it if that right-of-way requirements still on the books for something that we feel like is ill-conceived or could be that could be moved and changed then this is the time to do it so that developer can do that project that we all just voted in favor of the zoning for on top of that I get to go back to the folks in in district 3 and say you know you don't have to worry every single time you get a note from City Hall it's about somebody wanting to put semi trucks down your neighborhood Councilmember Armitage so I'm I'm really strongly sympathetic to Councilmember Davis just expressed I I'm ambivalent but maybe without reason about Windsor only because and it makes perfect sense on the map to see how Windsor connects I'm just concerned that I feel like by voting on this and maybe I just need you to reassure me by voting on this I'm not voting on Windsor you know because I'm concerned that there could be some you know potential damage that I haven't even thought of you know I would hate for Pete I know that there have been you know kind of complaints about construction on Windsor and I would hate for you know I would feel terrible some neighborhood came forward and said you know why don't you ask us about you know about Windsor so can I feel can I rest assured that by deciding on this we're not necessarily deciding on Windsor that that would come before us to that would have to come before us to separately that's correct to two separate pieces this is just getting rid of his road segment that doesn't necessarily have a rail crossing today so there isn't a rail crossing that that coincides with this nor is it what it is that we would propose to do and I think to Councilmember Davis's point of organically how this would work but really we want to get go through the competent land process and the mobility plan then get that feedback provided so we'll be visiting this area it's developed very differently than what it did to the past and that's what we're trying to work through today okay thank you so in that case I will second that motion just with the understanding that I'm that I still don't know about Windsor I just need to hear more from the people who live around there okay and staff do we have any callers no sir not for this one okay great so I'll close the public hearing and I'll just say this we just had a meeting last week and so to that end why this makes sense because I don't want to have another conversation about another crossroad across Luke 288 and I'm in no hurry to create one you know I just I take a nice break from Luke 288 talk again because we don't have control over those things right so just if we can eliminate the as much as we can those conflict points where we're growing at a pace that may be faster than text dot wants and funding issues and promises that sort of thing so that to avoid that conflict is great for me obviously at that Councilmember Davis and whoever else is in agreement that Ranch Estates does not need that extra traffic through there I mean that is I mean you're talking about some of the largest residential lot single-family lots in the city and so it makes no sense to incentivize people to drive trucks through there and so that makes sense to me to kind of solidify that direction and and I think the decision will come we don't have the money to make a decision on that but I think I take comfort in in staffs analysis of there is a plan and it is north-south connectivity and it's a straighter approach to it and even in the meantime I mean looking at the map I think it's it's it's it lovers there to the to the west tie 35 I mean that segment I don't know how many miles that is but it's not a huge distance as is north-south existing road I mean I I couldn't get Google Maps to crank it out for me I think fingers wouldn't let me drop a pin but anyway it doesn't it doesn't look it's not as far and so you have north-south connectivity now and then we'll just inch that over a bit and having a second parallel connectivity so I'm comfortable with that so thank you staff for bringing that forward and I'm sure the folks at Ranch Estates appreciate you as well so any other discussions for we vote mayor for Tim Melter is there actually a motion on the floor not yet okay so yeah the basic choice is if you vote yes then we live with a certain amount of anxiety that the north-south connectivity hasn't been solved it but staff has said they'll bring it forward if we vote no the community of Ranch Estates continues to live in anxiety so I understand with them and I move approval of the item okay councilmember Davis was that a motion from councilmember yes then I'll second we'll have to fiddle with the buttons that have been pushed oh we got to do it verbally anyway so forgive me councilmember Armitage but so we have a motion by councilmember Meltzer pardon me mayor pro tem Meltzer second by councilmember Davis any other discussion briefly mayor if I could yes I just want to second account literally second when councilmember Meltzer said and thanks staff for thinking a little bit outside the box it's not every day that we need to go change in the mobility plan and when a new development comes in say you know the run right to that tool in the toolbox but there are times where we can look back six years ago and say well we didn't get that one right and we're not ready for the full plan yet so let's let's tweak it where we need to so I appreciate that creativity okay any other discussion okay mayor pro tem Meltzer I'll say you I councilmember Davis I councilmember Armitage yes thank you councilmember Beck yes but staff don't don't don't not plan north-south connectivity here so yes thank you councilmember Guar aye thank you councilmember Bird aye and mayor Hudson I as well that passes seven zero thank you where are we okay we'll just knock this out so call item D which is Z two one zero zero two B hold a public hearing and consider adoption of an ordinance of the city of Denton Texas regarding a change to the zoning district and use classification for plan development PD district and light industrial Li district to general office geo district on approximately twenty four point nine three acres of land good evening mayor and members of council Sean Jacobson assistant planner I'll just pull up the presentation here and I'll open the public hearing all right so I'll be presenting Z 21 zero zero zero to be prominence this is a request to rezone approximately fifty eight point five five acres as follows at twenty four point nine three acres would go from planned development and light industrial zoning to general office twenty three point four seven acres from planned development to mixed-use neighborhood and approximately nine point seven acres from planned development to light industrial this property is bordered by loop 288 University Drive and Mayhill Road and prominence way there's a mix of undeveloped and commercial lots in a residential lot all zoned light industrial to the northwest and a single-family neighborhood to the south across prominence way there's approximately 26 acres of floodplain covering the north and center of this property with extensive environmentally sensitive areas in that same area and the tree canopy is also within that floodplain along prominence way the proposed zoning would replace that PD with current zoning districts containing a similar mix of uses but would be subject to all current DDC standards so just to give y'all a little background this PD was created in 2000 and it had a concept plan that divided the subject property into four areas a B C and E each authorized for different mix of uses including commercial industrial and residential and there was about 18 acres that were planned to be a future park designation dedication this was all created under an interim development code that existed at the time while they were writing the 2002 DDC and so it meant that this PD was vested in an odd mix of standards uses were from 1991 the landscape code was from 1988 and the processes were from a development code that was never actually official beyond that interim so it's it was frozen in an odd space and time in terms of regulations in 2002 City Council approved zoning 3.92 acres out of that area a to employment center commercial which then transitioned to light industrial zoning so what's proposed now is to take those areas a B C and E and that area would include what was previously zoned out and take them to again zoning districts that essentially have a similar mix of uses but which have those current DDC standards that apply to them so this is that original concept plan you can see a B C and E there was a D it was the south it doesn't affect this property you see the current proposed zoning so PD where we have that geo the MN and the LI zoning so we have our general and specific criteria for approval we'll touch on that first off we want to look at our comprehensive plan in particular future land use we've talked a lot about business innovation and that is the primary land use on this property but there's also a transitional area of moderate density residential that business innovation is intended for those large tracts of lands to develop with a mix of commercial supporting residential and retail uses moderate density is intended for residential a mix of residential that's denser near retail near parks these proposed zonings allow a mix of uses that fits that business innovation as well as a mix of residential uses including multifamily that would fit within the moderate density beyond the future land use map this is also ensuring that the property would be held to all the standards of the 2019 dent development code so protecting ESA protecting trees and that just aligns better with our dent and plan 2030 goals it's also enabling a mix of uses to develop at the intersection of two key corridors which fits the preferred growth concept in dent and plan 2030 and it's allowing for employment and moderate density housing to develop near potential future park and trail area as well as allowing a broader range of uses that fit within that future land use kind of a key criteria for this one is general criterion seven minimizing adverse environmental impacts skin just highlighting where this PD is vested there's essentially almost no protection for tree canopy or for environmentally sensitive areas the PD basically says environmentally sensitive areas exist and that's it this would ensure that our current protections would apply to any future applications on this site and it also applies a higher tree canopy so in terms of planting new tree canopy as well there was very limited requirement for tree canopy in the PD all three of these zoning districts would have a high percentage requirement for new tree planting as well as was landscaping across the board there and in terms of minute mitigating the potential adverse impacts from development on this property would be held to the higher landscaping standards we now have in the DDC for right-of-way screening and for parking lot screening providing greater screening for the neighborhood to the south from any future development would also apply our updated commercial building design standards to any future development here looking briefly general criterion 11 so zoning criteria F adequate streets and public facilities as I noted there was a plan to dedicate a future park area out of the floodplain under the PD that has not occurred because the area never developed the applicant is still proposing as once this property goes to platting to dedicate a similar approximately 18 acre area out of that floodplain and the parks department supports that future dedication they're looking forward to working with the applicant on it and they've actually been shown proposed future trail through that area on the draft parks trail plan so the opportunity to have a park and a trail potentially near future development on this site in terms of transportation want to look at trafficking area this there's not a proposed use for this site yet and so a TIA was prepared but it was based on kind of estimates of potential high-traffic uses it's looking at about seven thousand five hundred sixty-five daily trips potentially TIA actually looked at ten intersections in the area out to 2029 found that six out of ten of those would operate a level of service D or better which is you know is kind of our baseline there three of ten currently today operate a level of service of E or F and one and then the remaining intersection is actually a proposed driveway off of loop 288 which would be expected during the PM peak hours to operate at a level of service F and the TIA found that there would be increased delays decreased level of services out to 2029 crucially though the potential site development is actually a minor source of those increases in traffic it's primarily driven by the growth that's anticipated surrounding that area however some mitigation was proposed as part of the TIA a major one would be a future signal light at prominence Drive potentially when it realigns with Audra or sooner if it's warranted and that would be as when the civil engineering plans came in for this site and this site is estimated to be responsible for about 25% of that cost that would raise that intersection up to a level of service C which would be higher than where it is today even with the additional development TIA also recommended looking at a right turn deceleration lay on loop 288 northbound again that would be looked at when civil engineering plans came in for this site and text out in the city of Denton were recommended to approve two driveways off of the ramp rather than one so that those would both function at a higher level of service also looked at some long-term solutions one is that that intersection at Spring Valley and quick trip text out will be extending the median there so that people no longer be trying to cross at that point so that and I know we're aware their challenges there today and that will be addressed people will simply not be able to cross there once that median is extended addressing some issues that are currently there now and in the future also there will be a potentially a text out freeway bypass for 380 at 288 to reduce some of those traffic pressures modern wastewater is available fires within eight minutes of fire station 2 no expected law enforcement issues we did do public outreach received one letter of opposition neighborhood meeting was held two neighbors attended expressed some concerns about traffic but also an appreciation for the proposed geo zoning so with that planning zone Commission recommended approval 6 to 0 and staff does recommend approval the request as it complies with our criteria both generally and specifically so with that stand for any questions okay questions for staff councilmember Armitage I wanted first here with the public had to say there was any public comments I'll save my okay counselor back thank you mayor so you know this this corner is atrocious for stormwater runoff and exit ramps and the new you know 288 expansions the the 380 expansions it's in the floodplain the extent of the floodplain so okay I mean can you can you pull up slide 12 and well then I'll want to flop back to the slide 16 sort of back and forth so yeah I mean you can see there's just there's not a lot if you if you move the the left boundary over for the extension of the ramps the right away that would we need and the northern right away that we need for those lanes the with the floodplain extensions I mean there's not a lot of develop a land and and you know that's it's a big stormwater issue there so I take all those points I I completely concur with stuff so I guess more to the point of what's what's the best way to not have structures and concrete surfaces and impermeable things in that area is is that this plan that staff is proposing I mean what what's the best way to prevent the sort of ESA and stormwater runoff issues that we we will have both now and going forward well I think what's important to keep in mind is that right now we have a PD that does in fact allow development in in much of that area and what we would now be proposing and as I said does not really provide for all that much protection for ESA for floodplain not very very limited and what we can say about what happens there under this under what's being proposed all future applications would have to fall under all of our current regulations so those protections that we have now would be able to come into play whereas right now there's a PD that says these things can be built there and in fact there's also you know between then and now there've been FEMA has approved some floodplain letter of map revision in that area to take some of that area out of the floodplain and that there really wasn't much we could say about that because there is a PD in place now everything comes under our authority and the full protection of the DDC so the best way to mitigate a lot of that danger is to pull it out of the PD and allow for that flexibility that the right-of-way that would we would have the right-of-way and the floodplain yes sir that really brings it under way where we actually have a say over it comes to us okay that makes a lot of sense and I will make a comment that completely unrelated to this item that when take stop puts that median in oh you're gonna have to get in front of that because everybody gassing up at the quick trip is is gonna blow their stack not being able to turn left anyway thank you okay staff do we have any colors no sir not at this time thank you any other questions for staff the applicant has a card in as well but questions for staff seeing none okay then let's see that you yes if you want to come Lee if you want to speak so ten minutes I do believe hopefully not nearly that long yes sir Lee Allison without some engineering group here to represent the project the client owner Henry rife is with me this evening as usual staff Shawn has made an excellent presentation covered everything I'd like to highlight a few items or focus on a few one this developer was working on this project prior to 2000 and during that time he'd made quite a number of inroads and with that as development codes were changing he needed to memorialize some of those put them in place so the work that he had done would not be lost and that's how the PD came about since then he is applied for and received a conditional letter of map revision most of the earthwork related to that has already been accomplished there's a couple of bridges that create connectivity throughout the site that need to be completed and a sewer line those are being worked on the land uses in the current zoning ordinance or what's being proposed are very similar to what's there today in the PD actually with a little bit of shifting I'd say that the total intensity is going to be a little less than what is there but the land uses are there and they're similar and this current zoning ordinance works well with that by removing the PD and going to straight zoning there are some protections such as with the environmentally sensitive areas and the flood plains etc that in the trees and landscaping I think you'll get a higher quality development than you would under the PD still with the same kind of land uses also the traffic impact analysis it identified a lot of traffic issues out there the point is those exist under the PD or under the proposed zoning if we leave the PD as it is today we could rename that traffic impact analysis the PD traffic impact analysis and it actually might be a little bit more intense than what came up today is we did the traffic impact analysis for the proposed zoning so it kind of really negates the the impact of this change in zoning there's not really an impact there you've got a traffic impact analysis that applies any of the case and it doesn't really change when it comes to part dedication even before 2000 the owner was wanting to dedicate this land one member of the Planning and Zoning Commission wanted to know if it could be possible to include in the ordinance the requirement for the dedication our understanding is that's not possible but I do want to point out that for over 20 years now the developer has been wanting to dedicate that property so it will happen we want the agreement to make sure the city's willing to accept it when it's time to dedicate so with that I think we've got a good project a good case here and hope you'll give it favorable consideration and I'll be glad to respond to any questions you might have at this time or later if if needed okay thank you any questions for the applicant Councilman Burke I just have one question here about the connectivity between Audra and prominence is it going to connect is it going to is a road gonna move up to where Audra is or are we moving Audra how does it work out my understanding is that the long-term hope is for Audra to move down to line up with prominence and at that time that would help to resolve some current traffic issues actually at both Audra and prominence I know that right now you cannot if you're going north on 288 you can't make a left turn on Audra so that's gonna satisfy that or will we not be able to make a left turn on Audra I want to make sure that I'm yes yes you would be able to make a left turn there yes and in the event that a signal comes in then that would even be a signalized left turn okay thank you okay any other questions I have I have thought Sean can you help me my only thought is looking at it Li connecting with Mayhill and then I look at blag and I just I didn't I was curious but there's that bridge right there right and so obviously I know they'll have to work around that connectivity but that's a brand new road and I just want to understand what Li generally can you hit the highlights of what's allowed in Li and then just buyer beware I'm gonna be extremely sensitive to where they connect how they connect it's a brand new road brand new sidewalk lots of trees lost on the front end getting that in there you know extra trees lost for driveway or would would you know I you know I just wouldn't be able to get there I'm just gonna be I'm just full disclosure whatever comes back if I'm here I'm gonna I'm gonna have lots of consternation because it's a brand new road and brand new sidewalk that assuming they're gonna want to connect to that they're gonna tear into and it's gonna make me nervous but Li what goes in there absolutely and so we'll note now the the actual the PD zoning in that area where the PD would allows it's essentially Li what's permitted there now and so I think there there are some additional users but essentially that was intended if you even look on the map basically said for the PD this is intended for light industrial okay so that's what's permitted there now got it okay then yeah that I'm good with that it'll just be you know where we connect and how we do that and that it doesn't degrade the work we just did I mean it's a fantastic stretch of road so I'm gonna be sensitive about that all right any other questions Oh counselor armature yeah it's gonna you know wait to hear public feedback but I don't know if any members of the public no there's no callers no callers no one here in person speaking um so you know I'm concerned about several things so primarily the you know traffic issues in the area which I realized there are planned you know solutions to those but since some of those are relying on a text dot I don't know you know when those improvements are going to happen I don't feel kind of like I can confidently assure the neighborhoods that are concerned about traffic in around May Hill Bucky's area and the loop that that that these these will not remain concerns or you know get get be increased by this development so I'm concerned about that did you say but just orient much say Bucky's yeah other end of yeah University Drive not I-35 but yeah so 35 no it's not it's University Drive and May Hill area oh okay got it okay thank you thank you sorry okay got it I was looking at something else sorry okay any other questions okay seeing none counselor Davis I'm gonna move approval I think this does a lot of things for the developer does more for Denton because it brings us up to up speed where we are now but based on this and some of the prior items I'm gonna start seeing when I see business innovation on the future land use loop future land use map the flume I'm just gonna imagine a little shrug emoji because it really could just go anywhere and I hope when we look at our comp plan when we get specifically the future land use map I hope we do something to address that okay shout out to the shrug emoji counselor bird thank you thank you we have motion by councilmember Davis second by councilmember bird any other discussion okay counselor Davis how say you I counselor bird councilmember Beck I councilmember McGuire I'm relieved that this zoning change will provide greater protection for those ESA's I look forward to working out a plat that that provides even greater protection I thank you counselor member armature yes and sorry about my mix-up getting ahead of myself mayor pro to Meltzer I thank you mayor Hutzpah says I as well that passes 7-0 thank you very much okay that takes us to a couple more items here so we have item E which is a two one zero zero zero one a whole public hearing and consider a petition for voluntary annex X annexation of approximately 247 point seven eight acres of land and I'll open the public hearing thank you mayor members counsel Romney get a principal planner with development services give me a second here to pull up my presentation mayor can I ask a question while he's pulling that up yes sir so just point of information or these are non-action items right the next the next two things that we're just doing for the public having the hearing doing the reading and the councilman Davis the next item public hearing I'm there is a vote required to accept the annexation petition but the other item the individual item for consideration does not require a vote good deal thank you what he said okay I think I have it so this is the public hearing item for the subject annexation the Harris ranch the property as we have seen during the discussion earlier regarding the municipal services agreement this is a property located on the southwest corner of I 35 north and the future extension of loop 288 the item here is just to hold the public hearing give the opportunity for the general public to give comments again I won't discuss all of this information we already discussed it there is a proposed conceptual site plan for this site logistic center buildings very extensive development proposed future land use designation is business innovation currently no zoning as it is currently in the ETJ per the schedule this is the second item of five items for the annexation process we are at the public hearing stage and then September 14th is when we'll have the final consideration and hopefully at annexation with that I'll stand for any questions okay questions for staff oh and if you can pull down the slides okay thank you great seeing none counselor Davis I move acceptance of the petition thank you councilmember McGuire I second thank you we have motion by councilmember Davis second by councilmember McGuire discussion seeing none councilmember Davis how say you aye councilmember McGuire aye councilmember Beck all right councilmember Armitage yes thank you councilmember bird all right thank you mayor pro tem Meltzer I thank you and mayor Hutzpah is a I as well that passes 7-0 that takes us to our final item this evening which is and oh I closed the public hearing and then that takes us to a final item this is six six a which is a two one zero zero zero one B conduct the first of two readings of an ordinance of the city of Denton Texas annexing approximately two hundred forty seven point seven eight acres of land generally located on the southwest corner of I-35 north and the future extension of loop 288 thank you mayor members of council this item has read in the introduction is the first reading of to tonight is the first reading of the caption of the ordinance and I will just skip some some through this slide and get to the caption and I'll read it for the record so for the record I am going to read the caption for the annexation petition an ordinance of the city of Denton Texas annexing approximately two hundred forty seven point seven eight 78 acres of land generally located on the southwest corner of I-35 north and the future extension of loop 288 to the city of Denton Denton County Texas providing for a correction to the city map to include the annex land and providing for a savings clause and effective date so that is the caption and I've read it for the record there is no action on this item as we will bring this item as part of the second reading again on September 14th for consideration by the City Council okay thank you very much thank you so that concludes item 6a and takes us to concluding items any concluding items see none I do have one I'm trying to get it to populate bear with me there's any others there is the Denton Diablo's minor league soccer team is playing in the national championships here at Denton High School and that's coming up on the 7th I think that's is that this Saturday I think yes and it's at 730 Denton High School there's tickets available I think that they're trying to do some ticket giveaways if you have kiddos but you can go to look up Denton Diablos or go to their social medias and look them up again Saturday to 7th 730 Central Time and they're playing in the national championships for their league and then I think also councilmember McGuire you have an event Saturday is that right yes I have a town hall this Saturday on August the 7th at 10 a.m. at Lake Forest Park in the pavilion next to the playground it will be kid-friendly there will be popsicles nice excellent council member yeah miss mayor I want to just send my thanks to Alexander Elementary they had their welcome back teachers Ruha this morning so I had an opportunity to see the new teachers and some returning teachers met some folks with the administrators from didn't ISD and I just want to let you all know that that's my number one sub school I spent more time at that school as a substitute teacher than any other time and I told them that they can call still call on me even though I'm on the City Council I'll take some time to come over and say hello to everyone once in a while so that was great I appreciated that thank you all excellent okay and then last thing I have is a there is for those that are interested there's wake up Wednesday with the chamber across the street at Denton Brewer company the code that's at 8 in the morning I do believe but that's always a lot of fun a lot of good folks if you want to pop in yes then disc off the new grand opening for the second course this this Saturday right yeah Saturday morning so I'll be there as well so lots of good things happening here in the city and for those that are dropping their kids kids off at UNT we thank you very and TWU and NCTC thank you very much for that and 922 923 will conclude this evening's meeting. Thank you.