Jun 18, 2021 Committee on Persons with Disabilities on 2021-06-18 3:00 PM (SPECIAL CALLED MEETING)

Good afternoon everyone, it is Friday the 18th of June at 3 o' 1 and we're here for a special meeting of the committee on persons with disabilities. Thank you committee members for taking your time for being here. That's regularly an off day. My name is Val Behr, I'm the chair of the committee and we're getting started. Ryan, do we have absences to report? Mr. Chair, we have three absences, Joe Revis, Sam Alphonse and Sonya Redwine. Okay. Well, take that back, Joe Revis just joined us so just Sam Alphonse and Sonya Redwine and they've not been listed as excused at this point. Thank you. And as a special meeting we basically only have two items for consideration. We'll go with item A, CPD 21-020, consider the approval of the minutes for the May 20th, 2021 meeting. And we'll just go down the list, get everyone's approval. John? Yes? Mr. Chair, you may have to call for a motion to approve. I'm sorry. That's alright. All right. It's at the meeting, the minutes. Okay. Great. Second. Second. Great. So now, Ali? I approve. Samara? Yes. Okay. Beth? Approve. Okay. Sally? What was that? You're muted, Sally. Approve. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Joe? We're also muted, Joe. Okay. Thank you. And John and Val made the motion, so meeting minutes are approved for our May meeting. And our second item, CPD 21-021, is receive a report, hold a discussion and give staff direction regarding information provided by the DCTA proposed GoZone on-demand service. I believe we have a representative from DCTA to give us a presentation, so. Yes, Mr. Chair, and I'll let Sarah introduce herself, and I would like the minutes to reflect that Sonja has joined us, so she is with us for the meeting. Oh, great. But we do have DCTA here to present on their GoZone, our proposed GoZone program. Sarah? The floor is yours. Please take it away, and I'm going to drift into the background here. Thank you very much, and thank you again for letting me be here today to speak with everybody. I'm going to give an overview of what the proposed service is, and then this is part of our public involvement process where we're trying to collect feedback. So if it's okay with everybody, I'd like to go through the presentation first and then get into answering questions, have discussion. That way I can record your feedback because all of your feedback today will go to DCTA staff and our board of directors who ultimately make a decision on this proposed service. So if that's okay with everybody, I'll go ahead and share my screen with the presentation. Can everybody see this okay? Okay, great. So what we're going to talk about today is DCTA's proposed GoZone on-demand ride share service. We've been in a public involvement period since April 19th and will be until June 25th where we've been going to numerous groups, public events, online, virtual events, all sorts of things over the last few months, and really glad to be here today as one of those. So this is just a little introduction into what I'm going to talk about today. The proposed service is called GoZone, and what it is is a zone-based on-demand ride share service. It brings in the ability to book by app, and it would be operated in partnership with a company called Via. This would replace the majority of connect fixed routes for the bus service and replace it with on-demand zone service. It would extend our service area beyond the existing service structure, and overall typically create an improved customer experience. So all these topics I'll delve into in more detail. The reason why DCTA is looking at GoZone is that it offers several benefits. On-demand services typically have an improved rider experience, enhanced service delivery, and they also build the agency's overall service efficiency. There is with on-demand typically shorter wait times for your ride. There's the ability, and we are going to, if the service goes through, have bike racks on every vehicle to accommodate our bike riders. It would expand our service to 365 days a year. Much of the fleet would be, about 30%, let me be a little specific right there, would be retrofitted for wheelchair accessibility. This would be in addition to our existing access paratransit service we have today. So that would be about one-third of the GoZone fleet plus the access service would still be there. It would extend the service area, and I'll show you some maps of that. It brings in the ability to book by app if a customer wants to, and it has the ability to pre-book trips. The partner that was selected to have this proposed on-demand service is RiverNorth Transit. They do business as VIA. VIA was founded in 2012. They are well known throughout the transit industry as a visionary market leader, and they provide software and service delivery to over 200 partners across the globe. Regionally, they have service in the city of Arlington. They service the entire city of Arlington. They also work with Tranny Metro over in the Fort Worth area where they have multiple what they call zip zones, which would be similar to the on-demand zones we're proposing. So there would be two major changes when you switch over from fixed route to on-demand. One would be the fleet. Instead of seeing a lot of DCTA buses moving around, you would see the renderings at the bottom of the screen. It would be Chrysler Pacificas, and they would be branded with DCTA logos. There would be seating for up to six passengers. Now, many of these, like I said, will be retrofitted for wheelchair access, so there wouldn't be six people plus the wheelchair in there once crowded up, but the ones not retrofitted could handle up to six passengers. And one really good thing about the fleet with VIA is that they're able to scale the quantity of vehicles up and down based on ridership. So if we saw that ridership increased rapidly, we'd be able to bring in more vehicles very quickly. Another big difference would be virtual stops. Right now we're all used to seeing physical bus stops. This would be swapped out for what's called a virtual stop. And since this is a software-based service, we would be able to put many, many virtual stops across the city, far more than the physical bus stops we have now. And this would just ultimately provide the passengers a lot more pick up and drop-off locations. They would be on most street corners, and then we're able to add them into different locations around the city that would be strategically placed for them with best efficiency. For the fares, there will be a six-month promotion with a proposed service, and it would trade out the fixed route access for GoZone access. So fare structure you're used to today would stay in place, but instead of getting on a bus, you would get on the GoZone instead. Then the data used during that six-month would be used to determine the final fare structure, which is slated for March of 2022. The existing DCTA local regional pass will still provide access to all services, but if you didn't want to buy a day pass, you just wanted to go on a single GoZone ride, it could be purchased for 75 cents. So since this technology brings them the ability to book by app, I always kind of wanted to touch on how that works. To your left, you can see what it would look like when you open up the app. You would select your location and destination. The Rider app would then give you a ride proposal with the pickup location, wait time and fare. And then you would receive your virtual bus stop location, and it would tell you exactly where to go. And like I said earlier, there's going to be a very high number of virtual bus stops around the city. You would then be able to watch your vehicle approach in real time. And then after you get on, you were able to watch your vehicle move throughout your trip and see your estimated time of arrival. At the end of the ride, you're able to rate your driver and your experience. I do want to clarify here because we do get this question a lot. What if I don't want to book by app? You don't have to if you don't want to. We will have our customer service department still in place and there will actually be extended hours and people can call in and they can book your trip. They can do it in advance or they can do it in real time. And also people are able to book by personal computer. So you're able to do it from your own computer, iPhone or the app. So the GoZone service is proposed to go in a phased approach. So begin with a base service. And then there are several add-ons to the base service. And this has to do with the flexibility of on-demand. There's a lot of things you can do with it. And I will go into more detail, but you can see we're going to have a phase one, phase two A and phase two B. So I'll talk about each one of those phases in greater detail. Phase one is the base service. This would launch on September 7th. The base service would replace the majority of connect fixed route service and it would have enlarged zones and didn't the Louisville and Highland village, which are DCTA's member cities. It would provide service Monday through Saturday and it would extend the hours of service. So on the right hand, the screen, you can see what the base zones for this proposed service would be. And then just to clarify and talk about those virtual stops a little more within those zones would be a lot of virtual stops you could travel to and from. So with on-demand, you're able to do a lot of different things. It's very flexible and these are the things that we identified in talking to the cities would be the best add-ons for the service. These would also launch on September 7th and it would provide service to new areas and the DCTA service area. It would also increase the hours of service and that should say Saturday from 8pm to 11pm. It would also allow us to have service on Sunday, which is not something we currently have. We would propose to start serving the Denia neighborhood by doing extension. You can see that on the map on the left hand side in yellow. There would be an addition of the Dart Frankfurt station to the Louisville Highland Village Go Zone. This is because workers are trying to get into those cities for their employment and that would be Monday through Friday during commuter hours. Another add-on as proposed is the Business 121 North expansion and then also a guaranteed ride home expansion, which would be provided Monday through Saturday and this would be a guaranteed ride home program for three additional hours after the base service ends. So as you can see by this list, there's a multitude of things that can be done with on-demand service and these are the areas that we've identified to add into the service plan. Phase 2A would look to incorporating our current access service, which is our ADA paratransit program, plus the addition of adding a Castle Hill Zone. So this is pending launch around March of 2022. It's not definite yet and it would entail having an entirely separate public engagement process but I'd like to talk about it now today and get your feedback at the end of this presentation on this phase as well. So this would be our paratransit service offered within all active Go Zones. The days and hours of service may differ than the base service and the separate access fare structure would still apply. Now we'll say with on-demand technology for clarity with the bringing in access service is I talked about virtual bus stops earlier with access service with on-demand technology. It'll come, it'll do curb to curb service just like our access service does today. Phase 2 also looks at incorporating Castle Hills. This is because the city of Lewisville is in the process of annexing Castle Hills and this would be post-annexation and their service days and hours would also align with base service. And as I said before, a secondary public involvement process would occur before any of these changes took place. Phase 2B is weekday late night service hours. This would be pending launch of summer 2022. This is where we will look at how the service is doing and then we'll assess that data and the ridership performance and decide if we want to add additional three hours of service each night Monday through Thursday. So I talked a lot about service hours and this just kind of shows that to you graphically. On the left is our current hours of operation and on the right with all those yellow dots around it would be the expanded days and hours. So you can see some major differences there would be with we could run later at night, we would add in Sunday and we would operate 365 days a year. So for clarity I'm just going to go through this list and go through exactly what changes and what stays the same. The A-Train service would remain the same and the Phase 1 add-ons would just enhance the A-Train service delivery. The proposed GOZONE covers the entire fixed route territory of the Denton Connect bus and routes 1, 2, 4, and 6 would be removed. Routes 3 and 7 would still operate for at least the first six months of GOZONE service and then they would be reassessed. For the Lewisville Connect bus the proposed Lewisville Highland Village GOZONE covers that entire territory and beyond and so routes 21 and 22 would be removed. And then we have on-demand zones currently the Lewisville Lakeway Zone, Highland Village Lift Zone, and Denton Evening On-Demand Zone all that would be replaced with GOZONE. We also have a Lewisville to Flower Mountain lift program with very low ridership so at this time it is being proposed to be removed as well. So there has been an update since this last presentation. It says right there that MK101 would be replaced with GOZONE. That has been changed based on feedback so MK101 would stay in place. The North Texas Express would be proposed to be removed. That is because of low ridership on that service. Access service as I said before would remain the same and the vanpool program would remain the same. We do have different Cs that we contract service with. Collin County, Capelle, Frisco, all of those would remain the same. Our UNT shuttle services would remain the same and our UNT late night lift program would remain the same. Students, faculty, and staff would still require their appropriate fair media if they wanted to choose to ride GOZONE. New areas of coverage just to recap we'd have extended Saturday hours, the addition of Sunday service, the Denian Neighborhood expansion, Business 121 North expansion, and Castle Hillstone expansion. So as part of the public involvement process our team built a website solely dedicated to this proposed service and getting the community's feedback. It's been open since April 19th. We've had a lot of feedback come through and we're very excited about that. It's a great site. It's dctafeedback.net as seen on the screen and I would really encourage everybody to go to it if you have a moment. You're able to see the map and it's an interactive map. You can comment directly on that map. You can even like, dislike different parts of it. It goes over the service in great detail. It goes over the proposed fare structure and it allows people, you can ask questions, you can just give your thoughts on the service. And there's also three very quick easy to take surveys that we really hope people will participate in. All of this feedback goes to DCTA's executive team, our board of directors, so just please if you have time our staff would really appreciate it if you could go on visit dctafeedback.net. We're also taking for requests for presentations like I did today. If you know of another organization that'd be interested, I can hear about that today. Today's the cutoff, but if you have any ideas, I'm happy to take it today. And then if you want to have a one-on-one question and answer session, you're welcome to sit down with staff and we can just answer questions directly as well. So I'm going to exit out of here. Okay. And then, if y'all will bear with me a moment, I'm going to open up a note screen. And so today, because this is part of our feedback process, if you have feedback, questions, things like that, I'd like to go ahead and get that information for you so that it can be presented to staff and our board members and then questions. I do work in operations and I work with on-demand technology, so I'm a very good person to answer those questions. If there's anything I don't know, I'm happy to find out the answer and get back with you on it. Thank you, Sarah. I think right now for the question and answer, we'll just go down the line on my screen. If you don't have a question right now, we'll move on and then come back to you. I want to make sure everybody has an equal opportunity and time for the Q&A. So I'll start with John if you have any questions. Yeah, I have a couple of questions. One is, has the app been tested, the Apple voiceover? It's the one that we use where the phone talks and Android has something similar called TalkBack and Braille displays. Have you tested it all with that because there are apps that aren't set up well, that aren't accessible for blind people that use those technologies? I can check specifically on those, but I do know one of the reasons we chose Via is because their app has better accessibility than others in the transit industry and since they work with public transit, they're highly focused on it. So they're highly focused on making sure that blind, like there are a lot, anything that can be done, I think they have done. But I can ask specifically about the Apple voiceover. And then they also, I'll put out there, there's multiple languages involved with it too. It's a very sophisticated app. I looked at many options. I work in on demand and I can say across the industry, I feel most confident in terms of accessibility with this app. Okay. Well, that's true. They've been around a while. I didn't know that the app was through that company, that it's their app. Okay. And then as far as payment goes, do you pay through the app? Do you use a debit card with the driver? What are those? How's that? So you can pay through the app if you want. You can also call customer service and use a credit card over the phone. But we have worked out with VIA, that's the main way they do it, but we have negotiated with VIA that we would also like our passengers to use the same fare media they can use today. They can even use cash if they want to use it. So we don't want to take anything away. In terms of payment, we're just looking to bring in additional options for it. Okay. I think that's all I had, actually. Thanks, John. Tamara? Do you have anything right now? You're still on mute, Tamara. There you go. We are talking to them right now. They have agreed to doing exact cash fare right now. And so I can confidently say exact fare. I don't know at this time if they'd be able to change because this is new for their drivers to accept cash. But they're very insistent that they do. Thank you. Beth, do you have any questions right now? Yes, I have a couple of questions. Do you know the vehicle height and how people would be able to get in and out of the seats if they had balance disorders or lower body challenges? I don't know the exact height. I could find that out and return the information to me. I'm happy to do that. With the app and service and like the software, if a passenger has specific needs, then that can be added to your personal account. And when you go to book a trip, it'll be configured into the ride booking that there are special needs for that passenger. And it only has to be done once. So like if a person has a mobility device, they put it in one time when they sign up for the account. And every time they go to book, the software will configure for that. So if you needed a spinning disk to get onto the seat, would you need to bring your own or is that something they would have in the car? They would not have that in the car. So you would need to bring your own. Correct. Okay. I spent time on the website today and I wanted to give you some feedback. I have a mild head injury and watching the video, there was way too much information that came way too fast and I was not able to process or understand a lot of the information about the route changes, the different phases and things like that. And I think that there are other people with intellectual disabilities or brain injuries that may have trouble comprehending some of this information. Tamara is nodding. I'm also concerned about the app because there are a lot of people like me that are not good with apps. Tamara is also shaking her head. Is there any way that there could be like a class for people to learn how to use the app? So I'm just typing this up. I just want to make, bear with me as I type your feedback and answer, I just want to make sure I capture everything. Yes, absolutely. There would be, if this is proposed service, so if it was adopted, DCTA staff would be out heavily in the neighborhood and educating customers on how to use the app. And like I said before, if you don't want to use the app, you're welcome to call our customer service and they would book it on your behalf. You know, that said, a couple years ago when I came to this agency, one of the reasons they really liked me as a candidate was because I spent quite a bit of time in the public sector with all different types of the public and teaching them how to use technology. I have worked with people who have never touched a computer or tablet or anything. And, you know, it takes a lot. And, you know, I've really explained this to my agency, the outreach that'll need to be done. Fortunately, VIA is also very experienced in this area as well because they have launched in so many cities. So the outreach and education would actually be your DCTA team and VIA together getting out in the neighborhood and showing people how to use the technology. Okay. I have one more question. What is the driver training as far as, like, their safety record? Do they have to have a CDL license for this or is it just a regular license? They do not have to have a CDL. And that is actually a positive in the industry right now because there's a severe shortage of CDL drivers across the transit industry. And it would be a ban. So CDL would not be required. Now, like, today when you see the smaller DCTA vans, a CDL is not required for those either. It's required for the, like, the big green buses you've probably seen going downtown. One of the reasons VIA was selected was because they have a very robust driver training program. I mean, they definitely have to, you know, have a criminal background check and they have to pass alcohol and drug testing and meet all those requirements. But there is also a lot of training that VIA does and they require defensive driving. They require sensitivity training. And then even after all the training is done, they have very high standards for driver conduct. And they also have zero tolerance policies in place for drivers. So I personally, because I was very picky in this area, you know, looking at the different providers, I think that they do very well with the standards that they've set for their drivers. All right. Thank you for answering my questions. Thank you. Thank you, Beth. I'm going to jump in because Beth is reminding me of a couple of questions. In reference to the 30 percent that would be retrofitted for a wheelchair access, A, how do those vans look as far as entering? Are there rear entry or side entry? B, would those vans also be available? I'm assuming they'll be available for the public in general. So if those vans are out and about during service, a potential disabled person could potentially be a little more delayed because the vehicle is not available. Correct? They would be open. Yes. All of them are open to general public. So there could potentially, but that's one of the nice things about the technology is that we're able to watch it in real time. And if we start seeing that if our passengers who need the accessible vans are getting longer wait times, then we can add more and we can do it far quicker than we could with the bus. I mean, it's like two to three weeks to add in another van. That is very important from an equity standpoint that we're watching that data closely and making sure that our persons with disability in the community are not having to wait longer. And then as far as the actual physical access to the vehicle, is that a rear entry ramp or a side entry? I haven't seen the final vehicle yet. I've seen all the renderings and everything, but I believe that the final vehicle retrofitted should be through the rear. Okay. And then so will the bus, I guess quote unquote bus stops, will obviously those would be accessible? So locations or virtual stops or whatever? With virtual stops, they're just like in the software, like I showed you that picture of the zone map. So in the software you have little dots all over the place and those are your virtual stops. It tells the driver where to go. And so when you're on the app or you book with customer service, you will be directed to your closest virtual stop. But like I said, there are numerous ones, far more than there are physical bus stops today. So we say to assume that every virtual stop will be accessible. They won't be, since they won't be physical. Oh, okay. You're making to make sure. Right. So I live on the corner of A and B street and that's a virtual stop. I'm assuming that stop would be accessible for me to get to and to safely get on the vehicle. Yes. Yes, I don't. Correct. I think that that's really good feedback and I'm, I feel like I can 99% sure say yes to you. But I, since VIA is designing the virtual stops, let me make 100% sure on that, if you don't mind and report back to, is it okay if I report back to Ryan with the information? Sure. Okay. Sure. I'm having a little difficulty in like understanding the virtual stop thing. Would it be at a parking lot in front of the Walgreens? Would it be in front of an apartment building? It can be. Yeah. I mean, strategically you want to put them at the different corners and then place like if there's an apartment complex makes complete sense to put it right in front of it. If there's a senior apartment complex makes sense to put it right in front of it, you know, to make it as convenient as possible. My hesitation with answering that question is if the city of Denton, like if they have parts of their sidewalk or anything like that that might hinder travel, that would be out of DCTA's control for me to guarantee you. But I think that your distance to traveling to a virtual stop is far less than a physical bus stop. So I think there would be less barriers overall. Now, if anybody needed it, if there's a need for it, like I said, we can do curb to curb service. We would just probably look to do that through the access program. Right. In which you would have to do an application and qualify and those kind of things. I'm sorry, I have another question. So you mentioned that the city and the sidewalks and bus stops, will the current, some of the current bus stops be used as a virtual stop? They can be. I think that it's, we noticed that there are kind of excessive amount of bus stops in some areas, right? Like along the road by TWA, there's like four on within a block, you know, so we would want to clean that up with this opportunity. But for the most part, you know, we would want to make sure that, you know, I've made several statements about this and I think it's gotten through. So the rest of the staff I work with, you know, I think a lot of people have chosen where they live based on there being a bus stop nearby. And we need to make sure that we have virtual stops by existing bus stops, because that's what, you know, we don't want to hinder somebody's life if they are dependent on transit and they made the choice to live by a bus stop. We certainly don't want to take things away. We want to add to with the service. If those bus stops or some are being used, and it's a rear entry vehicle, how would a wheelchair user then enter the van? If it's basically, you know, come to the curb where this physical bus stop is, and the rear entry would basically go out into the street. I can see that being problematic if they're going to be using the actual bus stops that are up now. Because as you said, the city's, you know, that's been an issue with we have accessible bus, but not accessible bus stops. So the bus stops are going to be used and we still have that issue. Okay. I could be wrong. I could be side-entrusted. Let me clarify that first. I haven't seen the final design yet. A lot of that has to do with this is proposed. So we don't have a vehicle yet, you know, until this is actually adopted. I think that's an excellent point. And I will look into that and give you some clear answers on it. My feedback, though, would be to ensure that especially the 30% flee, you know, the virtual stops are not where access is an issue. It would defeat the purpose. We don't mind if I type some notes. Sure, please. So, yes, I think that's excellent. And I mean, that's one of the reasons I was excited to speak to this group today to get some really good feedback. And I think that's really good. Because again, the history of inaccessible bus stops, DCTA saying the sidewalk doesn't belong to them, the city saying the bus stop doesn't belong to them. So, meanwhile, disabled individuals are not able to use an accessible bus because said bus stop is, you know, belongs to no one, therefore, it's not accessible. I mean, and I think, you know, the vehicles are, the service is still proposed. Right. It sounds like. And the rear entry is actually nice. Because you have to do the rear and you sit between two seats. So, you can sit next to your caretaker partner, what have you. But that hasn't been done, like I said, and they say parking lot and somewhere where they would have to pull into a larger apartment community or hospital medical setting or or shopping center. But to use it at a bus stop that would not be there. There's no way that a wheelchair user could I cannot assume that sidewalk would let me out into the street to go to the back of the van to enter the van. Side entry. Okay, let me take that and clarify with them that side entry would be, it may be that their door to door service, like rear entry might be more helpful if they can pull into a driveway. You know, and get closer. But I think that's an excellent point. So I will find out the details on that and get back with this group. Thank you. Anything else has things like that? I'm so happy to hear them. You know, we want to get if this proposed service goes through, I can tell you working in operations department, we're going to want to know these things in advance so that we're putting out a good product for the community. I know the disability community has a lot of concerns and I think a lot of the details are what needs to be addressed because once it started, it's hard to go back. So you know, a lot of people don't consider that quote unquote little things that we have a rear entry bus or van that we're using this bus stop on McKinney. So you're gonna have to roll your chair onto McKinney Street, risk your life just to get a ride on the van because that bus stop will not be accessible. So those are the kind of things that need to be addressed beforehand. And again, the rear entry, I prefer it, but then they're the virtual stops that would have to be, it would have to make sense for a rear entry vehicle to be used at that place. So I mean, and these are, these are really good questions for via, I mean, they are very experienced in doing this in a lot of cities. So it's likely I'm going to come to them with this and they're gonna be like, we do this, we know what we're doing, you know, but let me, I want to be able to communicate it to you. So what do you have any questions? Hello? Yes. Yes. Are you talking to me? Sorry. Yes. Yeah. We're talking to Sally, Sam. Hold on. Okay. Thank you. One thing I wasn't clear about. So right now, I know if I have a doctor's appointment at Medical City at four o'clock, I can get the number four bus over here on university and, and I can see the time that my bus will arrive so I can judge what bus I'm going to take. How do you, how does a person work out the timeliness of appointments with the new schedule? There's an arrive by function. Okay. You can let it know and you can book in advance or you can book real time. I would recommend in advance if you have an appointment. Okay. Or have that. But you say, you know, if you have a four o'clock appointment, I want to arrive by three 55 and the software will take it from there and it'll let you know what time you need to be picked up by in order to do that. We do do that now in our Lewisville Lakeway zone, which I've worked with over the last couple of years and it's a function I'm very fond of. I've used it myself. You know, sometimes I have to get on a little earlier, but it gets me, you know, it allows me to get there in time for is I I'm typically going to our admin office is in Lewisville and I office out of Denton and so I need to arrive by the meeting time and I use that function. Okay. And I have a couple other questions. Um, I was really sad to hear that we're losing the bus to Fort Worth and I understand what you're saying about ridership, but I know a lot of people, uh, that have disabilities that like to take the train. You can take the bus right to the train station in Fort Worth. You can also catch a bus there. Uh, you know, it just provides more than just transportation of Fort Worth. It can, it's like $24 to ride the train one way. You can't beat it. You know, so it's a very, uh, I think it's a really necessary, uh, service for persons that have disabilities. So bear with me as I, I want to make sure I type that one up for sure. Um, the, so route 64, the North Texas express, it, it has had lower ridership. It's, um, a very expensive service. And so that's why they put it out there as part of this public involvement process. A lot of that, I think it's good for route 64 to be included in this because otherwise it's public involvement process would be small. And so it's getting more attention with this one, because we're also talking about GoZone. Um, I've seen other comments come through about it. And so I'm going to take yours and add it to that. And so, like I said before, it, this ultimately would be a decision by the DCTA board directors, but anybody who wants to keep 64, um, just highly encourage them to voice their opinion on it. Cause the more voices, you know, that the board, you know, I can't say what the board will decide. They'll have to look at all the different factors, but I do think that community voices do matter to our staff and board. So I will definitely include that in our feedback to them. Thank you. And I do have, um, one other question. So let's say I go in my electric wheelchair over here to Kroger's and when I get out, it's just hotter than I thought it was going to be. And I just can't even imagine just going home. Uh, so I decide to take the bus typically, uh, you know, there's a bus that I can catch at least once an hour, uh, to get back to my house unexpectedly. What's the time expectancy, uh, given this scenario, given what I just, uh, proposed to you, about 10 minute wait for average. Um, I know it can be a little less than that if you're not in peak time. So if you're in peak time, like, you know, high commuter times, I think the maximum wait time we'd really, if we started crossing over 15 minutes, we would need to add more fleet. Um, but you know, if you, if you're not in a peak time, you could get a ride in like five minutes. So that's one good thing about if you're booking on the app is that it'll give you the proposed time. Cause this has happened to me before where it was like, uh, I'm getting to the train station and I go to book it. And it's like, we'll be there in two minutes. I'm like, Oh no, I'm not going to book it yet. Cause I'm still 10 minutes away. You know, um, the guy, they tend to 11 minutes is the goal. And then, you know, if it started getting longer, you know, over 15 minutes consistently, that's when we could look to adding more fleet. And you can take all your shopping bags with you. We have not heard, we have not determined policy wise and we still need to get feedback from the public. So that was actually a question I was going to ask this group today because, um, you know, if you rely on transit to get to grocery stores and things like that, what is your, like right now our bus drivers can take supposed to take two or three bags, but I think that they take a lot more, you know. Um, so what would be your expectation for how many bags you could bring onto these rights? Four. Two for each hand. That's what I see people carrying. That's reasonable. So thank you for that. Okay. But yeah, I just, you know, the Fort Worth thing, like I said, there's a lot of people that do like to take the train and you can go to San Antonio, you know, you can get a lot of places without taking a plane for a much more affordable price. So I just really hate to see us completely lose that because I don't see any other way to get there really. You have to go through Dallas. Yeah. And nobody's gonna want to do that. Thank you so much. I'm here today to hear what you guys have to say. So this is great. Thank you very much. Um, Joe, do you have any questions? Joe? No? Okay. Um, Sonya? Do you have any questions? One question. And Val, I think you covered one of my questions already just about accessibility. I know that's something we've talked a lot about with DCTA and the current bus stops and not having adequate platforms and sidewalks and all of that. And so I'm glad you asked that question, Val. Um, my question is, um, the area in between. So I know NCTC is there and they're in Corinth. Um, any proposals on, um, getting, um, Go Zone into that area? Um, thinking about, uh, individuals in that, um, area of Denton County. So the reason we had NCTC, I got my associates there. Um, the reason we had service there before was because the school paid for it and then they elected to stop COVID hit. Um, so that's why that service ended. We don't service Corinth because Corinth has not elected to have public transit. Um, we would love to, but we need the city of Corinth to request it. Okay. Um, I know one of the things, um, that we've talked about in the past is just accessibility and into some of the rural, more rural areas of Denton County. Um, any discussions on, on Go Zones in those areas, you know, even Sanger getting into Denton for doctor's appointments and, um, some of those, especially in the Northern part of the County, the Northwest part of the County. It does the, um, proposed zone. It does extend far beyond where our current routes go. Um, Sanger would be out just like Corinth unless they would elect to have us. And like I said, we're more that we would love to service the whole County, but it is, it is up to the cities themselves if they want to dedicate, you know, our Denton Highland village in Louisville for clarity, if anybody's unfamiliar how we're funded, um, half a cent of the sales tax goes towards DCTA and that's 51% of our funding. So if we service to any other cities, it would be taking money from Denton, Louisville and Highland village and basically giving it to another city. So, um, but there really needs buy in from those communities, um, for their residents. We do. And it's somewhat, you know, if they want, um, we do contract with cities. Like that's what I work with primarily with my job. And that's why I work with on demand quite a bit. It's because those cities like to use on demand. Um, but like I work with the city of McKinney and the city of Frisco, they just have a smaller scale transit system than what the mail, uh, member cities have. And then they pay, um, for it with their own funds. We can't do stuff like that. You know, we understand that some rural communities can't necessarily afford a robust transit system, but they might want something smaller. So we're willing to talk with and work with any community on that. Thank you, Val Morgan. Do you have any questions? I think I just need to piggyback. Thank you, Val, uh, on one of your questions about the virtual stops and pickups. Um, what if multiple people have requested a service that, and it's had a particular virtual pickup get there and the vehicle is already full. Is there an instance where that could happen? Not with the way the software is written. So, um, worst case scenario, someone might be there ahead of you. And you know, the, if the van was full, there might be one seat left, but you're the app or if you call customer service, they would let you know you have a 10 minute wait and maybe you walked up behind somebody who was already waiting. Um, but the software will not allow more than six passengers at a time to be booked on one day. It would send another van to pick up. And during your presentation, there was a question about, uh, drivers and that they are vetted through via, are they hired through that organization and you all contract with via, is that how that works? Correct. And with the Arlington service, how long has that been in place? At least two years. Um, I believe it's more like three and they, they started off smaller and then they just recently this year expanded city wide. They've also, uh, with via are doing some, um, autonomous vehicle projects with, uh, University of Texas at Arlington. So, uh, they, at least three and maybe longer than that. Okay. And so what is the, I'm sure that their fare has kind of leveled out. So what is the average cost of their fare? I'll say, do you get it by mile or is it just a flat rate wherever you're going within the zones? So the city of Arlington, they just changed their fare. They increased some of it for longer travel. And I think that really has to do with, they opened up the entire city to it. So the highest fare, I believe is $5 and then $3 was their standard fare. And that's how they started their program. It doesn't, we aren't limited to that fare structure with via though. Via can work around any fare structure we want. Um, so for instance, Trinity Metro and Fort Worth uses them, they use them in a completely different way than Arlington. They take their zip zones with via and incorporate them into the bus and train passes. So it's not, um, it's definitely not limited to paying X amount each time you get on it. There's, and when we kick off the program, um, it'll be based on our current fare structure with day passes. Okay. Oh, I think that's it. Thank you. I enjoyed your presentation. Thank you very much, Allison or Abby. Do you have any questions? I do. I have a couple and thank you so much, Sarah, for being here. And yeah, thanks for all of your questions. Uh, committee. Um, one of the questions that I do have is about the drivers because via is going to be the ones employing all of these drivers. Uh, what kind of protocols are they going to have, for example, for emergencies or let's say someone that has a disability, like maybe someone with epilepsy has an episode or an issue that they have to deal with. Uh, what kind of training and protocols will be, will the drivers have for any sort of situation like that? When we talk about sensitivity training, that is diving into, you know, a lot, um, a lot of issues, you know, in such, it goes into all different areas. It sounds kind of, to me, it sounds very broad. Um, but that kind of training typically goes into medical conditions. Um, you know, anything from disruptive passengers, not, you know, there's a lot of different areas. Um, for a specific, like a seizure, I imagine that they would call 9-1-1 because that's what our bus drivers would do today. Okay. But I mean, there, there is like specific training that they get in emergencies and I just wonder what, if there was like, I guess sensitivity training, they would have like understanding of intellectual disabilities, et cetera. Okay. And then the other question that I have on that too is, um, Beth kind of touched on this a little bit with some of our older generations having issues with the apps, et cetera. Uh, but what about passengers that, for example, are very routine based? Um, what kind of assistance will be provided? For like standing order type trips, like where they're going same time every day. Right. Right. Or, or even just like, for example, like, let's say that I'm someone that I'm very, you know, on my routine and I get up and I get on the bus at eight o'clock in the morning or whatever. And if that bus route is suddenly gone, like, is there going to be any sort of like education or outreach to those people will be there? Will there be someone at the bus stop? Does the bus stop just disappear and the bus never shows up again? Uh, cause yeah, that's kind of a, I guess an issue that I would, I could see happening for some people. I, and I had the same thought, like, cause there is going to be a very, there's been a huge public involvement and then there's going to be a huge community engagement if this plane gets adopted. Um, but I, we have discussed that with via on what about if there are a few people out there who didn't hear about it and they go to their bus stop and they've actually talked about, um, some different solutions they've done in different cities. And so we are talking to via and trying to figure that out. Um, cause I think that that, I agree is you can try to reach every single person in the community, but it's difficult, you know, like even in this public involvement, um, you know, we, we have put it in ads, we've put it in the news newsletter. We have done tons of meetings and stuff, but you still wonder who doesn't know yet. Um, so there via did give us some different options, but we'll have to talk about it more internally and what the best one would be. But that is something I could follow up with you guys on that determinations made, but they did. Um, and I will say that that was one of the reasons we wanted to use them was their level of experience with launching programs and that they would have ideas about those kinds of things. As, as far as like time straight, um, like if they're used to the bus being at eight o'clock every day, this would be a difference because you would get a pickup time or, you know, you could say you want to ride by such and such time, but since it's shared ride, you're going to get, you're not going to get an eight o'clock on the button pickup time. Okay. Okay. All right. Well, thank you so much for that. Do you have any additional comments you want to make? I mean, I'm happy to take any thoughts, opinions at all today. I just think that, I mean, I don't have an issue or even like necessarily an idea of what would fix it. Um, I just think that it's important that the people that, you know, that are routine based, maybe, you know, they live on their own and everything like that, but maybe they have an intellectual disability and they get up and they get on the bus and they go to their job and they get off of work and they go to the bus and they go home. And with that bus changing or anything like that, just some way to make sure that they know and understand, right? Like, I mean, I understand even reaching out to maybe some of our older community as well and teaching them how to use the app, et cetera. Um, but I just feel like outreach to those kinds of communities might be a little bit tricky. Um, sorry. I'm bear with me going back and forth typing up your feedback. Um, I agree. I, I've done a lot of public outreach over the years and I agree. I am, I think, you know, we live in a virtual world right now and that's great and it's effective and cost efficient, but I think that there's real value in getting like a boots on the ground approach. Um, I would definitely, if this, if this service was proposed, I don't work in marketing and communications. I'm an operations person, but I would be heavily involved with the outreach and want to be, um, one of the things I would want to do is actually connect with this group. So if anybody here, um, if it does, if this plan is adopted, um, if anybody here would be interested in working with us on identifying, um, you know, different groups or helping us coordinate to get people together to educate them, we'd be all ears. Um, another big plus is that Denton has a lot of social service, a surf social service agencies and they're very willing to work with us. They've been working with us for a long time now. Um, we meet regularly with them and they are a great resource for reaching out to the community for education as well. But, um, yeah, I, I think we should do a huge push for public education. I know a lot of staff agrees with me, so that would be top priority and we would be very open to any assistance from the community. We could get an identifying people who need it. Yes, Beth. We have, um, Sam next time. Sam, do you have any questions? Yeah, I have a few actually. Um, the first thing is the, the 64 bus that I know that's a, um, expensive route, which you said before, but is it a way where they could, uh, instead of using like a big bus, use like a little, a smaller bus to still be able to have that service there and then that way it won't be as expensive using the big bus. I can definitely put that in the recommendations, Sam. Let me make sure I capture that really quick. Okay. And the other thing, um, a lot of us have ADA certified passes. How would that, with the new VITA system, will we have to get new passes or, you know? So for the, the first six months of that transition phase, we plan on all, um, existing fare structure to stay in place. Okay. Another thing too, um, what Val was saying, it's, I know they have a, a bus stop by Mesa, but they have another one that, that's, I think when you, by that bridge, it's a few places and then it's very dangerous to cross whether you have a wheelchair or, or you have a king or whatever, you know, because, um, they don't have the right, you know, proper bus stops, you know. And the one is, one is by the, I think the vibe apartments, because it's not really like a bus stop. You're getting let out in the street basically and you have to cross over and you have traffic coming from both sides of the street. Do you know what street corners those might be at? It's, it's a, it's on McKinney, but it's after you pass the, uh, 7-Eleven and it's, the name of the apartment is called the vibe apartment, but it's a designated stop that, you know, that has to, uh, uh, take them before you go to the, um, I'm trying to think after that, you go to, uh, the veranda. But like I said, that stop is in the street and it's kind of dangerous because like I said, it's not really, this is like a little sign that they have there, you know, on both sides and it's traffic coming to both sides that is very dangerous. Oh, like I said, it's, it's. I think that's good information. Um, specifically cause I've asked via, they will be designing zone and stops, but, um, in speaking with them, I've asked to make sure to have DCTA staff, um, have their input about the stops because we do feel some need to be put in different places. And just like you're saying, um, so if anybody has any stops they want to call out, I'd be happy to, you know, be your voice for that in terms of planning out the virtual stops. We might, we might be here all day during that. Okay. Um, anyway, if we want to figure out a way, um, I can, I can leave all my contact information with you guys. If anybody's interested in giving, um, like putting a list together, giving input on that, I'm happy to take it. Yeah, that work that we have like a, like a, like a sheet and to make it better to, you know, for the, for the riders, is it not just this, not just a disabled people, but the riders in general, but you know, like I said, it needs to be addressed because we don't want to buy to get hit by a car or bus, you know, because they trying to cross the street to get a bus. Yeah. Yeah. I, I mean, I agree. Like I've, I've had this conversation. I don't work on fixed route. I basically work on the on demand technology. Um, but I know that in talking with the director of operations who does work heavily with us, uh, with the fixed route portions, um, he feels very strongly that if this goes through, this is an opportunity to get rid of any dangerous bus stops. So maybe Sarah, you can be happy to hear what you have to say about if there's stops that you are not comfortable with, um, don't want to see any more, something better. We're happy to hear that. It's the same Sarah. Maybe you can share your information with Ryan and Ryan can send the committee your contact information and we can funnel it that way. Yeah. I'd be happy to do that. Is that okay, Ryan? Okay. Okay. Great. Sam, did you have the last question or? Um, I'm trying to think. I think we covered just about everything. I mean, we talked about the drivers and drivers and, um, the thing, another thing too, uh, is the hours. Would the hours be extended or would it be, you know, like the same? Cause we've been running like on Saturday schedule since last year, DCTA. They'd be extended and they'd be consistent. So right now you'll see the hours change a lot, um, because of the university, because our ridership drops dramatically in like summertime. And then we have an influx in the fall and spring. Um, I can pull that screen back up really quick, but yeah, it would be, there be a good increase. Um, I, I feel that's one of the benefits of this service is the, um, increase in service area and increase in service hours. So, and I'll check on that. This would be with the yellow box around it would be your new service hours. Okay. Another thing too with the trains, why don't the train have more extended hours? I mean, cause it'd be better because people would actually use the train more. It's a south is the hours is longer because currently you only have like two days that that's like late. You have the Thursday and Friday and Saturday. I think no, no Friday and Friday and Saturday. Cause I know like a lot of times, I think recently when they had the thing for the fair, the people had a rush to the train because the train has stopped running at a certain time, right? I'm typing up a bunch of messy notes. Um, okay. So the, uh, the, the service hours extension. So the one, the train doesn't run on Sunday. Yeah, I know that. I know it's Sunday. Don't run on Monday. Yeah. This would replace it on Sundays and it would also, um, take it later on. Sorry. But I did just jot down, uh, longer train hours. Let me stop the share on this one real quick. Um, I can, I can share that feedback. I think, you know, probably one of the main reasons is extremely expensive to run trains. And so that's why it wouldn't have extended hours. Um, it's much more cost efficient to bring in more on demand service. Um, and so those like kind of late nine hours, Dart does run later than us. Yeah. We're looking to extend those hours to where if you do use Dart later in the night, we can pick you up with the goes on service at trendy mills and be your, you know, to take you home the rest of the way. Yeah. Cause that's, that's been a problem with that, you know, at a certain time you don't get it. You pretty much have to get an Uber to get back to your house. And that's part of this proposed plan is to fix that, you know, and we've used the example, a lot of people want to go down to American airlines. If you live all the way up here and you want to go to a Mavericks game, but then after you get out, you can't get back up here. So, um, part of this plan is to propose to fix that. Yeah, that would, that would increase ridership, uh, you know, cause people want to, you know, go to the fair and those games with it. And like I say, when you get back to training mills, if you're not there at a certain time, you know, you S O L, you gotta take a Uber back or live. Yeah. I think that, and that will be, and that is part of this proposal. So, um, um, still range on your feedback, but just kind of writing it in favor of that part of the proposal. Thank you, Sam. Um, okay. We've gone around once. I see Tamera has a hand up. Go ahead, Tamera. Nadia. Baby, DQTA could have the disability community, members of our committee, our friends, I don't like to France because I'm a hands on person. I learned best. I don't need experience in it. I, I think a lot of people are hands on. And so, um, yeah, in terms of educating, um, yeah, I think one of the most successful, like it's great to have online classes and meetings and stuff, but as more of us are getting vaccinated and feel comfortable coming together in person, um, I know I'm vaccinated and I'm happy to get out in person and teach people how to use technology. Is for us, for us, for us, for us bands of country. But Tamera said the idea for individuals to actually go to the band and use them to practice boarding. Yes. Okay. Some more notes. I actually was going to go to that. Will there be an opportunity for especially people with mobility devices to practice boarding one of these vehicles and I'm assuming the driver will be strapped in wheelchairs and get on the buses. So will there be that kind of opportunity for individuals? Where I've missed the first part for the tech to have technology or for individual mobility devices at wheelchairs to actually practice boarding one of the bands, getting out one of the bands for, for the phase one goes on. It's designed for the bus routes and, um, being able to independently navigate the system now. But that's why we're kind of leaving access secondary so that there can be a whole other separate outreach and education for that. But if anybody, I would recommend, if you need any assistance, then access would be the best for boarding and onboarding. If you need assistance getting on and off. Let me rephrase that. Okay. Yeah, sorry. So with the GoZone bands that are going to be retrofitted, so I, as a wheelchair user, I've never used one. So maybe I don't want to wait to my first trip. I would like to try it out and make sure that I understand how to get on or that my wheelchair fits properly, things like that. So will there be opportunities like that? But I guess the second part of the question, will the GoZone drivers of those vehicles be required to put straps on your wheelchair? Or do you just roll the end and then that's it? Because I know that's being discussed, like finalizing the details between access and GoZone. Right. Because with a fixed route, even a regular fixed route, I believe the driver would get out of his seat and strap the restraint on a wheelchair. So it's a hard kind of ply down. Ply down is what they're called. Yeah. And that's how I would perceive it to be in these bands. Like you would need to have some safety calls in place. But obviously a wheelchair user cannot, most of us will not be able to do that, reach down and do it on our own. So. And that makes sense and your bus drivers do that now. Right. So I was asking, will there be, you know, before services start or even during, will there be an opportunity to physically go somewhere to get on a GoZone van to be comfortable and say, "Okay, I can do this. Thank you." Yes. Okay. Not only will there, we will be looking for people to come out and try the service. Basically like a soft run, dry runs is what they are. Yes, we would welcome people in the community who are interested to come out and try it and tell us what they think before we actually open it up to the public. And I think that, you know, using, I would say it would be more of a test run to involve individuals who have mobility devices, service animals, you know, different types of disabilities where a non-disabled person could just get in and out of a van with no problem. So. If the service is adopted, the proposed service, after all this public involvement, I would be happy to reach back out to Ryan and let him know when we're doing those dry runs and looking for volunteers to ride the service. Perfect. That's great. Okay. Beth, do you have a question? Would passengers be allowed to ride in the front seat? Because I know I can't get in the back of a van. I would have to sit in the front passenger seat. I don't know that for sure. And I, but I can ask Bia if they make exceptions and allow people to sit in the front. I can find that out and relay anything. Ryan, if you're okay, anything I don't know for certain today and want to get back with you guys, is it okay if I put it all together and give it to you? I can't quite hear you, Ryan. You're off mute though. You're off mute. I think your mic might be disconnected. Okay. Technical difficulties. Let me type that one down while he's doing that. And just to piggyback off of Beth's question, I think it would make sense to allow that and especially the retrofitted vehicles, because since they will not be allowed to fit six, the retrofitted vehicles will probably fit three or two. Yeah, it'd be much less. Six is for the one, yeah, up to six. That's the max capacity for one that is not and that you're really only going to see during those peak commuter times. Ryan's still having, just give us a thumbs up, Ryan, if it's okay for her to talk. Thank you, Ryan. Beth, did you have a final question? Yes, going back to what Ali had been talking about for people that are used to a routine and how to educate people more, and I tried to tell you that some of the things on the website were, the graphics were just very confusing. If there could be a poster made that simplified everything and that it could be put at the bus stops and at every social service agency and at every police station and every firehouse and every place you could think of that would teach people how to use the system, but in a very simple, simple graphic design. Just typing all this up. So if the service is adopted, part of our outreach would definitely be to get those materials out at all those places you mentioned. Those are all great ideas and definitely the bus stops, social service agencies. I think firehouse is a great idea. I think all city facilities and I know from having worked on the city side for a long time, cities are very gracious about helping public transit and working with partners. So I think that's a good idea and I really appreciate you pointing out the difficulty with some of the material out there. So I will get back with our marketing team with those thoughts and kind of pointed out that we need to have a more simplified graphics going with those. Thank you Beth. Okay Joe, you have a question that I see your hand on. Go ahead Joe. Call from wireless caller. Call from wireless caller. Okay thank you. We are at the airport. Or the DINN airport where I missed. DFW. Okay all right. You would still have to connect to DART because Dallas's DART system, we can connect you to DART through the Trendy Mill Station, but then you would need to get on DART to make it the rest of the way. Okay. Valerie, you have a question. Not a question this time, but just a recommendation as you go more into informing and educating is to try and connect with the ARC of Denton County. It's an organization that supports individuals with disabilities and they work with individuals who are out into the communities. So I think this would be a nice organization for you to coordinate with. Thank you so much. There's a chance that our community relations manager might already be connected to him. She is very good at reaching out to the social service agencies, but I will absolutely bring that back. And if anybody else has recommendations, I'm very happy to take them. Does anyone have any last questions or recommendations, suggestions, ideas? No? All right. Thank you Sarah for all the information and for taking your Friday to present to us. We really appreciate it. Thank you guys so much. This is the best presentation I've done so far with this involvement. You guys are very engaged and gave me a lot to go back with on feedback and consider and think about. So thank you very much for your time. It's very helpful on my end and for the agency. Awesome. Thank you. We look forward to getting those questions answered and that information back. Absolutely. Great. Thank you. Okay. We will move on, I think that is it. We have our concluding items. Anyone have any special announcements at all? No? Just remember, we're still in Pride Month, so Outreach Denton, I know, is doing and last events. Juneteenth is this weekend. So if you're feeling like getting out about, that's happening. And again, July is Disability Pride Month. So there's also events going on with that. Just FYI. So unless anyone has anything, we can move to adjourn. I'll make a motion to adjourn. All right. Anyone second? I second. All right. Great. All right, ladies and gentlemen, 423 again. I appreciate everyone coming to this special meeting. Enjoy your weekend and we'll see you in July. Thanks, guys.