Apr 06, 2021 City Council on 2021-04-06 3:00 PM

Good afternoon. Welcome to this meeting of the Denton City Council. Today is April the 6th, 2021. It is 3 p.m. We do have a quorum, so I will call this work session preceding the regular meeting of the Denton City Council meeting to order. And I want to confirm we have no callers for the consent agenda item. Next step in the agenda is questions from council on the consent agenda, questions for staff regarding the consent agenda. Councilmember Brown? I'd like ID 21580 and ID 21595. Is there? I need to have some, I need some clarification and I just kind of want to know. I need some clarification on both. 580, what letter is that in the consent? ID 21580 and ID 21595. All right, bear with me. I think we have Cassie Ogden can speak to item 580. Thank you. There we go. Okay. So let's take them in order. So we'll take item B. Cassie Ogden in the finance department should be able to address that question. I can as well. That is related to our commercial paper program for the 2019 bond program. Each year we have to reauthorize the hundred million dollars that we have associated with that commercial paper program. So that simply comes every year that will come back about the same time to allow for us to use that commercial paper program for both appropriation purposes, but also if we do have the need to actually issue the funds for the bond program, we don't, especially with the bond program, we don't anticipate we would actually issue any of that commercial paper, but it is available for appropriation purposes. Okay. Councilmember Johnson's answer your question just for that first one, 580. I just, I want to clarify appropriation. What, what, what, if something should come up that, I mean, I just need to be clear on what it means. Yeah, absolutely. I have a few contention which you would like to know also. Right. So especially with our, with our bond program, we enter into large contracts. I think the best example is the public safety facility where we can enter into a contract that's 30 million dollars or in excess to, to complete the building. What the commercial paper programs allows us to do is not have to issue the entire 30 million this fiscal year, but issue it as we actually have expenses. So say we have 15 million of expenses this year, we could issue 15 million this year and in the remainder the next year. So when I say appropriation authority, it allows us to enter into that full contract of 40 million in that example without having issued the entire 40 million dollars. Okay. And then, so the second one was C. David, are you going to speak to that as well? I think we have Gary packing on the line. Mayor city Gary pack and director of parks and recreation. We also have Chris Iscato from our athletics team on board as well. Happy to answer any questions. Great. Councilmember Johnson, did you, so this is 595. Did you, item C, did you have any, what question did you have for staff? It says that it was approved in 2018. Does this include our, like, for the different things we have in the park area that these are, this is the company who, who does this? This agreement is for athletic complexes specifically in North Lakes and Dina. In the past staff used to operate those concession stands. So we went out for bid and hired a firm to do that because it was easier for our operations and they pay a fee back to the parks and recreation department to operate those facilities. It's just for the concession stands at those parks. So this is basically for their hiring and taking care of the people who do the work there. Yeah, they're a contractor and they hire their own people and then they perform the work for us and pay us a percentage. Okay. Thank you. Great. Okay. Mayor Pro Tem Davison, Councilmember Meltzer. My question is a follow up on that one to item, on item C. Yes, sir. My question is this. One of the things we talked a lot about at the water park concession stand and the pool, we worked really hard to, to use mostly paper products there. We don't have Styrofoam plates. We try not to use straws, that kind of stuff. Do we have anything like that in place with this vendor? And then in conjunction with that, I realize this is an amendment to an existing contract. So my question is what do we currently have in place? The fall obvious follow up to that is what else can we do under the contract without jeopardizing the relationship? But also I, I know some of the things that they offer out there, you know, candy and nachos and all that kind of stuff, but do they offer anything, you know, more like fresh fruit, things that are good for you? So just to respond to one of those questions, it's a three year agreement, but we asked for an extension just so it wasn't terminating in the middle of the summer, disrupting operations and transferring if we had to to another vendor. So that's the rationale for the extension. We have had conversations about using as many environmentally free products as we can. In regards to apples, they do have fruit on their product description agenda shape. I don't know how often and what specific fruit they have. I'd have to do a, I guess an audit or have a staff go over and do an audit on their inventory. But Chris, I think is on the line. I'm not sure if he knows the answer to the healthy food product question. Yeah, I can answer that to a certain extent. I do know that they are specific to the type of sport that they are serving. So for example, for a soccer tournament or soccer event, they tend to put product together that kind of best fits that in. So oranges and fruits in regards that's typically more of like a breakfast type of item that they tend to include. But as Gary mentioned, it's something that we could definitely go over and take a look at and get you guys an answer for that. Yeah, I'm just speaking only for myself. That's something I'd like to see, whether the contract is the best place to do that or whether that's a conversation with the vendor. I definitely like to see us avoiding the styrofoam plates and stuff and plastic stuff that we've got to pick up off our fields later anyway when it all blows around. Some of the same kind of setup that we have at the water park. Mayor Pretend this is Sarah. I'm going to ask and I had shared this with Gary. I'm gonna ask Gary and his staff to to make a really concerted effort to take the practices that we have at the auditorium and put those across the apartment as well. We have a responsibility to be in fire limiting, environmentally friendly, but we also have a responsibility to reduce that trash as much as we can. The other thing is to look at the healthy food options and work with the vendor, not only for the healthy foods, but for those who have allergies. Me being a parent of a son that was definitely allergic to peanuts, you know, to look at those things that will give parents choices for their Children and not just the everyday candy and things like that. Good deal. Thank you. Great. Councilman Meltzer. Yeah, great. I was on the same two points and I'm very happy to hear with the city manager. I have to say there. I like to ask for a separate presentation on a separate item and a separate presentation on item H because I think it's a real win. And I think the public would like to hear about it. I'd also like to ask for a separate vote on item N as a Nancy don't need a presentation. Got it. And is there anything in particular highlight on H or just in general? Yeah, just what it is and where it is. Okay. Got it. Thank you. Any other questions for staff regarding the consent agenda? Seeing none. Okay. So in summaries for a consent agenda, we have two items pulled item H and item N with one presentation being item H. And if there are no other notes, that'll conclude that portion of the agenda. Okay. And then we'll call our first work session. Let me get back there. First work session is item a ID 2025 54 receive report, hold discussion, give staff direction regarding audit project 20, zero to zero utility payment assistance program. Hello, mayor and council and I pull up my presentation. Good afternoon. All right. Yeah. So I'm Madison Rorschach and city auditor. I'm going to present our findings on our audit of the city's utility payment assistance program. So this audit generally evaluated the effectiveness of the city's prevent loss of utility service, uh, otherwise known as the plus one program, which provides Denton's utility customers with a utility bill payment assistance and city contracts with interfaith ministries, a nonprofit organization to administer this program. And the city's customer services division is, um, generally charged with monitoring the program's administration to ensure contract compliance. Uh, the program was originally established in 1998 and, uh, was designed to provide an avenue, uh, to utility customers, to donate money, to assist other Denton residents in need. Currently, however, the city receives almost $8,000 in donations annually. And the majority of assistance is funded by, uh, Denton municipal electric revenues. And that's illustrated on, uh, in the figure on your slide. And, um, we actually did a survey of other peer municipalities and found that Denton is unique, uh, in funding this type of assistance program, especially prior to COVID-19, uh, the pandemic. So during typical years, uh, inner interfaith disperses an average of $115,000 in assistance through the program. And so this review focused on one, the effectiveness of assistance application processing by the interfaith ministries to the clarity of some contract provisions, three, the quality of customer service being provided by interfaith and for the adequacy of program monitoring processes by the customer service division. So I'll begin by discussing the assistance application process. So, uh, in order to receive utility payment assistance through the city's plus one program, an individual must be an authorized city of Denton utility customer. Each customer applies for assistance through interfaith ministries, uh, who determines if they're eligible for the program based on, um, information received from the customer, which includes evidence of a financial hardship and identification, uh, as well as a copy of the customer's utility bill, um, which is provided by the city's, uh, customer service division. If assistance is awarded, interfaith notifies customer service, uh, to apply the pledged amount to their account. And then each week interfaith sends the city a check to cover the outstanding pledge amounts that they, uh, made throughout the week. So based on our review, about 80% of customers who received assistance had all the required documentation from the applicant and the processing documentation that interfaith uses to approve, um, to support the award of those remaining nine reviewed awards were missing applicant IDs or evidence of financial hardship. And 13 were missing the processing documentation prepared by interfaith such as the pledge letter that they sent to the city, um, or a check request, which is part of sending the check each week. In addition, all supporting documentation of pledges awarded, uh, prior to September of 2018 have been lost, um, because interfaith's previous case management system shut down. Uh, so without adequate retention of applicant supporting documentation, it's difficult to verify if those who received assistance were eligible per our contract. Um, and then similarly without the adequate processing documentation, it's difficult to ensure that the assistant award, assistance awards were properly approved. So, um, based on the same sample, we found that 98% of pledges that we reviewed were properly applied to the customer's account by customer service. So there were a couple of issues with pledges not applied appropriately, but these were, these were generally due to, um, basically the large influx of assistance, uh, applications, uh, due to COVID, the COVID-19 pandemic, and they didn't negatively impact, um, the award recipients. So in addition, we found that two interfaith ministries employees had received, uh, six instances of plus one program assistance over the past couple of years. So based on a review of that documentation, um, approvals and evidence of the financial hardship were generally not well documented. So, um, all qualified dental utility customers should be able to receive utility program assistance. Uh, however, interface employees, since they have increased access to the plus one program, um, we believe that the city and interface should collaborate to develop a review and approval process, uh, for those applicants to avoid any appearance of, of, uh, or con or risk of the, of conflict of interest. And based on their management responses, interfaith and the city are planning to collaborate to minimize the risks associated with, um, document retention issues and, uh, these employee assistance applications. So there'll be a different process in the future to make sure that those are approved appropriately. So next, according to the city's contract with interfaith ministries, the, uh, prevent loss of utility service program is intended to assist residents experiencing short-term financial emergencies from time to time. The contract also generally limits, uh, customer assistance to once a year, uh, which aligns with that stated purpose. That being said, um, we found that the majority of customers who experienced service interruptions, this didn't utility customers, um, experience more than one annually, uh, and that's based on a review of the city's service interruption data. So the contract does include an exception to the, the once a year limit if a customer is designated as an extreme hardship. So this extreme hardship exception generally allows interfaith to more equitably administer assistance to customers. Um, but in general, you don't want an exception to be used overly used. Um, so based on review of interfaith ministries reports, about one third of the assistance pledges that they award, um, went to households who received more than one award annually, uh, which indicates that they would have been designated as an extreme hardship. Furthermore, the contract does not provide guidance or criteria on what, uh, what would constitute an extreme hardship. So according to interfaith's procedures, um, these designations must be approved by the organization's executive executive director. Um, and then based on a review of documentation, um, we, we didn't really find a clear indicator or approval of, of the extreme hardship for a majority of the, how the households that had had, had received assistance, uh, multiple assistance awards. So without guidance on what constitutes an extreme hardship or clear documentation to justify or approve the designation, um, the exception is vulnerable to misuse based on this information, uh, limiting assistance may negatively impact community members with greater long-term financial need. However, expanding or eliminating, uh, restrictions could prevent customers experiencing one-off short-term financial emergencies from receiving assistance, uh, cause funding is limited. These factors are important to consider when defining the extreme hardship designation and considering the plus one programs intended impact. So based on their management response, uh, the city, city staff are evaluating the need for the extreme hardship designation and interfaith has basically said that they will adjust to whatever the, however the city defines it, um, in the future. So next, um, in order to assess interfaith's customer service quality, um, in our internal audit surveyed 40 assistance applicants, half of whom had received assistance and half of whom had been denied. Um, and we got about a 45% response rate and based on that, all applicants felt that they had been treated with dignity and respect by interfaith during the application process, including the six who responded that had actually been denied assistance. So in addition, interfaith has generally implemented some customer service improvements in response to overview that the city performed in 2019. In particular interfaith has begun periodically training employees and staff on customer service best practices. Um, however, these trainings were, have been put on hold due to the COVID 19 pandemic and they were unable to provide us documentation showing who attended the trainings and what content was covered. Similarly, interfaith updated its phone system to record calls with applicants. And according to the executive director, these recorded calls are periodically reviewed for quality assurance purposes. However, there's no formal process to document the results of these reviews. Um, interfaith has also updated its website information to ensure that it's accurate, um, about their staff availability and information. So furthermore, the organization offers an optional, an anonymous customer service survey to its clients and it reports the results of these, uh, these surveys, um, to the organization's executive board each quarter, but these quality reports are not submitted to the city despite that being a contract requirement. So while interfaith appears to have begun implementing several customer service improvements, additional documentation, uh, and reporting of these efforts would provide further assurance to the city that all applicants are, are being treated appropriately. And based on their management response, um, interfaith has begun documenting these customer service quality control processes and, um, we'll report them to the city, um, and we'll report them to the city. So that's good. So finally each month interfaith submits a report to the customer service division on the plus one program, which is required by their contract. Um, the report includes details on the households assisted and denied for that month, um, as well as aggregate information on assistance, denial, assistance, denials, and demographic information for the previous year. So based on discussions with customer service staff, these reports are used to reconcile the assistance payments that the city has received each month to those that were pledged by interfaith. Um, however, the city does not receive or review, um, the bank statements of interfaith's plus one account, which is dedicated just to the city's program. So based on our review of the monthly bank statements, uh, for the past three calendar years, we didn't find any, anything inappropriate. Um, that being said, reviewing these banks, we believe customer service service should review the bank statements as part of their monthly reconciliation process. Um, cause it'll provide further assurance that, um, all funds are spent appropriately and based on their management response, customer service, um, is going to begin reviewing the bank statements. Similarly, the demographic information in these reports, uh, are not typically analyzed or used to enhance the program's effectiveness. So for example, um, based on the survey of applicants that we did, uh, we learned that most, um, most had learned to the plus one program informally from friends or at community events. And, um, we also found that, uh, based on a comparison of those assisted by the program, uh, to aggregate data on Denton residents whose income was below the area of medium income, um, current public outreach strategies appear to be broadly effective. Um, as those with community, those communities with greater need generally appear to be receiving assistance. Uh, that being said analysis of the data may help the city establish performance measures or develop outreach plans to target communities who may not have been reached. So based on their management response, uh, city staff agree with the need for a greater program promotion and aim to use, um, available data sources to inform those outreach activities. So in summary, we issued a total of 14 recommendations, um, all of which were either concurred or partially concurred with, and based on the received management responses, we believe the identified risks will be adequately addressed. And so we recommend closing the project until a follow up review is conducted, um, in the next, the next, you know, few months or so, like six to 18 months. So there we go. All right. Thank you. Questions for staff, uh, council member Johnson and then council member armature. Is this, uh, is going to fight the only one that does this, does distribute money for this one to, um, what exactly is considered hardship proof? Three. If they're not reporting the documentation, how are we sure that it's actually taking place and it's being done fairly? Uh, so interface is the only program that is city funded. So there are other programs in the city to, to provide assistance to customers. I don't know them all off the top of my head. Um, but there are other assistant programs available. Um, I don't remember, can you repeat your second question? Second question of what constitutes a hardship? Okay. And then, and then the third one is, is around the documentation. What, what, how do we know? Yeah. The city con the city's contract with interfaith, um, kind of provide some guidelines about what constitutes constitutes a hardship and some priorities. Um, there's things like income is a big one, but there's also, um, if there are small children in the household, if there are individuals with, uh, disease or illnesses, um, things like that, I could provide you the exact list, um, after this meeting, if you'd like. Well, if the, uh, customer service reports are not being submitted, how are we getting the information we need? The, the quality customer service quality reports are not submitted, but the monthly reporting on who's being assisted in and denied, um, those are being submitted. Okay. I, I feel like you had another question about the documentation. So we found that most of the documentation was there, but they're about 20%. There wasn't full documentation that would be needed to, um, to verify eligibility and also that they were approved correctly within interfaith. Um, and also all of the documentation for the assistance awarded prior to September of 2018 has been lost. So we weren't able to review any of that. So, and the, uh, employees that qualified the documentation for that, was that, do we have that? We found there was some documentation. It wasn't complete. Um, there was some, uh, sometimes there were identification requirements that weren't met that would have been required for people that weren't employees, um, like just requiring an ID. Uh, and then sometimes there were a few where there wasn't exactly financial hardship documentation. Um, so thank you. Okay. Councilor Armitage. So first of all, thanks for conducting this audit. It's a really important one and very interesting findings. Um, I'm, uh, disturbed by, you know, the, the finding of, uh, awarding assistance to, uh, interfaith employees, uh, without, on, on top of that, you know, without even appropriate ID. Um, I, uh, myself, and I know that, you know, staff is just asking for questions and the plan is to follow up at some point. This is not so much a moment of us giving direction. Um, but I will say, uh, I am, uh, have kind of hit my limit with in, uh, in, in patients with interfaith, you know, this is not the first time that, I mean, it, it's the first time we've done in an audit, but there was, I'm trying to remember who did it, if it was through, um, the community development department or, you know, or, uh, customer service HR, but there were customer service issues, which according to those surveyed, uh, for this study, they appeared to have resolved, uh, you know, as far as people leaving in tears and not feeling respected and they've had staffing turnaround. Um, so I'm glad that they've worked on that. Um, but for me personally, you know, these were the kind of level, this is the level of problems that, uh, I'm ready to look for, uh, somebody else to do this really important work. I just wanted to weigh in on that, let my colleagues and the public know. And, and we, part of what I reported on is basically we followed up on what, uh, the customer service division of the city, um, had conducted that review that you're referring to. And we followed up on what they had basically recommended. Um, and, and there appeared to have been some progress. I think COVID, the COVID pandemic slowed them down some. Um, but I, from what I, from their management response, they're, they're beginning to go do those processes more and they're going to start reporting on them to the city, um, in more details, my understanding. So, okay. Any other questions for staff? All right. Senator Meltzer. Some of the findings, uh, disturbing more than, more than others. Uh, you know, when you survey a large group of people and they all say they're treated with dignity and respect. I mean, people don't all feel they're treated with dignity and respect in general in life. So I think that's, uh, that's pretty good. Uh, but, uh, I wanted to ask about the cases where you have some missing, um, some missing documentation, some that you have, what is the materiality of that? And here's why I asked, uh, when we had, this isn't interfaith, but when we had CARES Act, eviction prevention, you know, pretty efficient, uh, process to get the money out. Now, because there's a much more intense demand for documentation, maybe not at a material level. I mean, I don't know, but it takes four hours to process one application. And so money is sitting there while people have needs. So that's, my question is, you know, how material, uh, you know, what is the value of the missing bit, uh, as far as assessing the, the, uh, legitimacy of the need? Yeah. So, um, the majority of the ones that we reviewed, we just statistical sample, right? So we can, we can extrapolate to the population, although it's not exactly perfect. Um, so 80%, which is a, the vast, you know, large majority, um, had all the documentation on the eligibility side and the processing side. So I would say as far as if we're awarding assistance to the people who deserve it, the eligibility side is, is, uh, more material, right? Um, and of those nine, we're missing either IDs or kind of the evidence of financial hardship, which would have been what qualified them. Um, I believe when I believe it's like six. So when you're thinking about 6% ish in turn, you know, plus or minus couple percent because of the statistical sample. Um, I think you could, there's, you can definitely make a case that that is material. I think you could have make a case the other way. You know, we're presenting the facts. Um, and I think there, I think there is some issues with documentation and in the retention of that. So, um, that's why that's what we brought up in the audit. Um, and I'm, I'm hoping that that those will be resolved when we do the followup. Does that answer your question? Um, yeah, it's a little concerning. Uh, do you, do you have a point of view on whether you're going to be closer to six months or closer to 18 months on the followup? Um, I, my, based on their management response, they seem to think that they're going to be complete in the next, you know, a couple of months. So I would say we plan to do the followup review next fiscal year. Okay. That's a long time. That's like six months, right? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. We're in the next fiscal year. So yeah, I would lean a much more to the six month end because these, because you're telling me there are really material gaps. So, you know, we're going to want to see that a ship shape. Thank you. All right. Any other questions for staff? Mayor Pro Tem Davis. Uh, Madison, I think this is, is probably in the scope of what you researched to be able to perform this audit, but if it's not, and if I need to frame this differently to another member of staff later on, just let me know. Um, but how is this contract? I know this is a long standing contract. It's been renewed many times. Um, do we know how it was originally awarded? What the procurement process was? Did we do an RFP or an RFQ? Um, and when we renew the contract, is it typically, uh, you know, comes before us as an item, we have the conversation or are we happy with the service we're getting with this group and we just renew it or have we done subsequent, uh, RFP processes? Do you know? Uh, I, yes. So I can answer some pieces of that. So the originally the program we believe was in 1998. That's when it originally started. It was originally, it did originally go to interfaith. We've been with interfaith the whole time is my understanding. I, I don't know how it was procured at that time because it was so long ago. Um, I know we recently did an RFP. I believe it was an RFP. Um, and interfaith, my understanding is interfaith was there weren't necessarily very many bids. So, uh, if somebody else wants to step in, they're welcome to. This is Sarah. I don't, I don't, I don't know about the procurement part of it, but I think the key point here is what Madison just said in that we are going back and doing procurement processes for things such as this, particularly when it results in the services we're providing to the community. I will say that if you, you know, looking at that chart and I had a chance to visit with Madison in advance and the chart saw the chart as well, we have some responsibility on our side for a better monitoring and better check-ins with not just this organization, but when we're, um, working with grants and other things, it's imperative that we're requiring reports and that we're reporting that information, uh, to council so that when we do bring a procurement process forward, you are completely informed of, of how well these groups are doing. And so we have some work to do on our side. Okay. I appreciate that. And I, um, I was also disappointed by some of the results that we saw, um, disappointed performance in a couple of key areas. Some of those have already been touched on, um, we're unlike some others, I'm not quite at the deal breaking stage with interfaith. I think they're a good organization that does, does what they can in the community. But, um, if we don't see improvement in some of these areas, the next time this comes around, we're going to have a pretty difficult conversation. I can just add one point of clarification. Uh, David gains a city manager. I know we have Ryan and Chris Don that can give more detail as well. The RFP was in, was last year in 2020 and they were the only acceptable proposal that we received to the RFP. Okay. Thank you. That's good to know. Uh, questions. Any other questions for staff? Uh, I'll point out just from my notes, I think it's important. Uh, I don't at no point, I want to be clear. Do I think just because someone works at interfaith that prevents them from being eligible. I think that understanding we have a municipal electric and if they live in Denton, they're limited in their resources. I mean, there are options, obviously for a different provider. One, two, that doesn't mean just because they work there that they have to be independently wealthy or able to not in need of assistance. Right? So I think it's imperative that documentation be on point, but at the same time it's not holistically, uh, it doesn't exclude them because they, where they work and where they, they have to make a living. So that to me is important to note that I, that gives me no heartburn. I mean, you, you, you got to document everything right. But at the same time, if they're, they're citizens, our community, and I think as a council, we have to be better. And I'm gonna, I'm just gonna, um, kind of have to guide this way because yesterday's conversation and this was related to utilities with respect to the water conversation, we're asking about non-residents and how we support them. How does the utility support non-residents? And then today we're saying IDs give us concern. Uh, you know, there's, there's some mixed messaging from this body. And so we're making policies who either we're going to say, you know, here's the rules and you follow them across the board and not kind of pick and choose who we give leniency to. We're lenient to all, or we're going to be, uh, just total line for all, but the vacillation is hard for staff, uh, to kind of, um, get in a groove with us and bring back policies that are consistent. So it'll be important that we, we watch over that. And then Madison, for me kind of going forward, my ask is if there's a flow chart, uh, kind of, uh, almost like a, you know, like a decision matrix, uh, for, um, um, interfaith, I'd love to see that kind of laid out, right? So if someone calls me and says, well, I made it through this part of the process and then didn't go any further. I'd kind of like to see visually what that looks like. So your application is accepted. You have to present documents and if they drop, if it, if they're denied at some point along the way for why, for what reason, it'll just kind of help me visualize where they were in that process. So if something, something like that is possible and maybe city manager staff or something can help you with that, uh, that that'd be great for me just to see. We actually flow chart all of the processes that we audit. So I can probably pull that together pretty quick for you. Awesome. I'd appreciate that. All right. Any other questions for staff? Seeing none. Okay. Thank you, Madison. Appreciate it. Thank you. All right. That concludes item A takes us to item B, which is ID 202320, uh, receive report, hold discussion, give staff direction and staff input regarding the naming applications for parks and trails submitted by residents, local developers, and parks and recreation department. Mayor city council, Gary pack and director of parks and recreation. We've talked quite a bit about park naming over the past, uh, I guess year in regards to updating the, the policy and the ordinance in the process. Um, and we have been working with community members as well as staff on, on holding back on some naming opportunities have been suggested. Uh, they've had, they, since it's been approved with city council, uh, in the past year we have asked them to go ahead and forward their applications. Uh, so we had those, we did provide those to you and Eddie Valdez is our management analyst has been working a lot on this project and he was going to walk through the process and remind you of the ordinance and then the certain steps and get feedback on next steps moving forward. Okay. Thank you. Hello, my name is Eddie Valdez, management analyst for the city of Denton parks and recreation department and public works department as well. Let me go ahead and share my screen real quick. All right. Sorry. Technology needs it. So, um, just, uh, what Gary has reiterated the purpose of today's presentation is to provide a quick overview of the procedures and guidelines outlined in the naming policy. We have received several naming applications for nominations, and this is the first time that staff and city council will go through the naming policy. And lastly, we are desiring that city council review this today and also provide staff for direction for next steps. So, uh, let me give you a quick background over the course of last year, the parks and recreation department updated the naming policy. City council approved the amended naming policy on October 20 of last year. You'll see that in your exhibit too. Uh, also during that time between October and today we have received several naming applications from the community. Um, and also the parks and recreation department submitted nomination. You can see those in your exhibit three and exhibit four as well. Uh, on the next slide, we will do a quick walkthrough, uh, on the naming policy procedures and including several options for city council's review. And also we are seeking city council's direction on these options. Uh, so, uh, on this slide, this is a quick overview of, uh, of the naming procedures from start to finish, including milestones with several options for city council's, uh, consideration. So, uh, however, before I covered this test for naming outline in the policy, I do want to point out that we included an extra step. Uh, you'll see this in the inclusion, uh, column over here. And, uh, uh, in the November parks recreation, uh, beautification board meeting, uh, we received feedback and recommendation from the board that we should include a, uh, public, uh, forum or community meeting, uh, so we can get an extra layer and gather input from the public, uh, for all these, uh, naming nominations. But, uh, based on today, uh, you, uh, this is an option, the inclusion, uh, we can go straight from inclusion to consideration based on, uh, city council's recommendation. So let me go in and start with the first step. Uh, the first step is the submittal of the application from the individual group or organization. And on a staff perspective, we will receive these application and the city manager will, uh, choose a date, uh, for city council's review of these applications. So we are right now in this third step right here in this box. Uh, this is called the council direction. Um, so we narrowed down to two options based on the naming policy and how it is written today. So, um, option number one, uh, city council has the option to form an ad hoc committee. Uh, this ad hoc committee will be a seven member committee and two or more members of the ad hoc committee should be selected from an advisory or governing board. So, um, because all these applications that were submitted and including parks and recreation that have submitted these applications, it would probably make more sense to probably, uh, add two of those, um, community, uh, uh, members from the park board as well. So that's something to want to keep in mind. Now, uh, what ad hoc committee will, uh, go through, uh, will do, will go through these application and provide a recommendation of their findings for city council. And that's what you'll see in this consideration column, um, on under option number one. And also, uh, since we are, you know, if city council decides to do the ad hoc committee, we do have to, uh, create a resolution, uh, that will outline the terms and job responsibilities of the ad hoc committee, uh, which city council will need to review on and vote on a future city council meeting. So that's something to kind of keep in mind as well. Option number two is, uh, city council can bypass, uh, the seven member ad hoc committee. Instead, city council will review the application as it is. Um, uh, you can actually, technically you could even vote on it today, but, uh, that's your option. Uh, well, we're recommending to maybe discuss this on a future meeting and vote on the applications altogether, uh, for a future city council meeting. Also, the city council can hold a public forum to gather input as well. Uh, if you want to include this inclusions, uh, part of this column, um, if not, we can just go straight to, uh, consideration, you know, which you can review that right over here. Oops. Let me go back. Uh, how do I eliminate that? Thank you. There you go. Um, also I do want to, uh, note on this last step, whichever, uh, city mem, uh, city council decides on today, either option one, option two, either way, uh, the final decision will always rest with the city council. So no matter which, uh, which you decide. All right. Uh, this is a brief recap of the previous slide in simplified text form. Um, so, uh, this is hopefully a little bit simpler than, uh, seeing the chart, uh, the parks recreation beautification board, uh, recommends holding a public forum and community meeting. So that's one of the points to consider. Um, again, it is city council decision to recommend moving forward with a public or community meeting. Uh, and also regardless, whichever option city council decides on the options below this on the slide, I, uh, no matter what the final decision shall rest with city council. So I'll just a brief recap option. Number one, city council appoints a member ad hoc committee and we'll review the applications and recommend, uh, recommend their findings to city council option to, uh, on a timeline perspective, uh, city council can bypass the ad hoc committee and review the applications and vote based on their findings, which is the fastest route. Um, but, uh, option one would be the slowest because staff needs to formalize a resolution. And also, uh, back in the parks, recreation and beautification board meeting in November, they did, um, you know, recommend as well to probably go through the seven member ad hoc committee with the public meeting, uh, as suggested as well. And that should be it. Um, do you have any questions or concerns? And thank you again, mayor and city council members, uh, for this opportunity. Let me stop sharing. Okay. Uh, mayor pro Tim Davis and Councilman Meltzer. Thank you for that presentation. And, you know, the applications we're looking at today don't give me any, any particular heartburn, you know? Um, but I know this is the first time we'll be using this new policy in this place. I think we need to be careful of the precedent that we set and how things, uh, how we might do things going forward. I wouldn't see anything wrong with appointing the parks board as the seven member ad hoc committee. The committee has to have two members of a city board or commission on it. Um, I don't know who would, uh, I'd rather not put on staff the necessity of taking applications and council nominations for all these new seven people. When we have a board for parks, um, that is perfectly capable of reviewing these things. They know exactly what we're doing with the parks. Um, the council is going to decide in the end. I don't see the need for a whole nother huge committee process for these particular things. We may find ourselves in the future, you know, there's an application to rename North lakes park or something like that. Maybe we need to do the blue ribbon commission on park naming. Uh, but as it stands today, I don't think we need to go outside the good personnel we already have to look at these applications. Okay. Uh, Councilor Meltzer. I definitely came in with the, uh, similar point of view that these aren't a hugely central consequential kind of thing that, you know, might engage, uh, the whole community in that. So I wasn't looking to go that route. Uh, that, that's a really novel suggestion about sort of deputizing the parks, uh, the parks board. And I would support that. My question, um, is when there is the public input component, whichever way it's run, uh, does the public see, you know, also what would the name be or what would happen if, if it isn't approved, does it remain unnamed or does it, you know, get a, you know, generic locator name? You know, it's kind of a little bit weird. I mean, I imagine some people can just respond, you know, love it, hate it to a particular name, but I think, uh, for something that might help for them to know what the consequences are of each path. Uh, mayor city council, Gary pack and director of parks and recreation. Uh, great question. Um, so the purpose of the public meeting we felt was an opportunity for one, promote the policy and the opportunity for naming of parks now and in the future. Um, also give people an opportunity if they were not aware of the application process and they wanted to submit something on the same parcel that was, that was being nominated, that they, you know, wanted to suggest something different that could at least be considered before it was too late. Um, and then, and then just to give people the opportunity to provide general feedback. Um, obviously this is, you know, meant to be a long-term naming opportunity and we want to make sure that whatever is named, it's named in a good sense and a good step forward. So that was the, the outlook on having the public feedback. Uh, so it was just gathering feedback from everybody for multiple reasons. Okay. I, I, I appreciate everything that was said, but I didn't quite, uh, hear if there was a response to my narrow point, which is as I expect someone in the public might want to know if it's not Patrick Park, let's say nobody else submits anything else. It's just, what happens if they say no, what, what is, what do we call it? So actually as part of this, uh, ordinance and policy adoption, we put in a temporary naming, uh, process. So while, while a property is acquired by the city until it's formally named, we will give it a temporary name. Uh, so whether it's our Navy ridge property. So we, we call everything that's temporary moving forward property. Uh, so we don't confuse that moving forward, you know, over time, we feel like some properties have just been, you know, through osmosis adopted a name. Um, and we want to make sure that we clearly delineate those. So we identify exactly what's available for community, uh, naming moving forward. Okay. So then they, then members of the public would understand if it isn't this, it'll be called XYZ property. That's correct. That would be part of the presentation process. I appreciate that. Thank you. Okay. All right. Seven in the armature. Uh, so I too, uh, like the idea of just sticking with the parks board and having them serve as that seven member board. I, I came into this meeting with exactly that idea. So, um, I'm glad that there is at least a kind of forming consensus on it. Um, I, I like that idea and, uh, I take it that it would then come forward to council after going to, you know, whatever board, whether it's a ad hoc board or, uh, the, or the parks and rec board, you know, for me, the important thing is, uh, you know, no matter what it is decided on is the community outreach and getting community input. Uh, but that's something that the park board can do and that's something that council can do too. Okay. Any other questions for staff? Got it. Uh, Eddie, I just offer one note that I think, uh, uh, upon the inception. So at the beginning of your, um, uh, the diagram you had, I think maybe there's something that runs parallel that kind of has a legacy listing that I think the council member melts his part that has some sort of summary. So here's the individual's name. Here's kind of a summary and an opportunity to start collecting, uh, feedback via, you know, email or something electronically that way. And so it carries through the life of the project. So then by the time it's, it's presented to both the parks board and to the city council, uh, it then has kind of that legacy of, of information and there's kind of a, a wealth of feedback, or at least there's been since inception, an opportunity to comment on it if you wanted to. And then those are kind of just rolled downhill until there's a decision made and we can kind of review that at that point if, if that's doable. Uh, so it's thought there. Any other questions for staff? You know, the comments. So I see the, the, I think there's a majority of council members leaning towards option two for staff's notes. Is there anyone that's leaning towards option one that would be, uh, creating the ad hoc committee so that there, if there's, is there any, um, one that would prefer option one, which is the ad hoc committee? Uh, yes, sir. Councilman Melzer. Are you, uh, sort of taking into that statement, the idea that the ad hoc committee is the parks board? Cause I think you've heard three members so far support the ad hoc committee specifically in that form. Well, no, I think does it not originate with parks and beautification board? Is that what am I missing something there? I think you are. I mean, uh, frankly, uh, you know, the, as presented, it seems that the choices were go out and create a whole new ad hoc committee that includes parks board versus don't have a committee and just, you know, uh, have staff go to the public. So what I think you heard here was a little bit of a one a, which is not listed. Yeah. Okay. So, um, Gary or Eddie, who, whoever's task would, where does it originate? What board does this help me understand that so that I can make sure I have my vernacular, right? So, so as of right now, we took it to park board to get some feedback from them, uh, just as an initial step, uh, since it was a new process. And so it would eventually, we would run it through park board as, you know, to give you a recommendation as well as this ad hoc group. Um, so if park board is that seven member group, we obviously be working directly with them hand in hand on the applications step by step, and then providing you a recommendation at the completion of that review by the park board, uh, in its entirety. Right. So just to summarize what you said, it's going to, it's going through the parks and beautification board. And if that parks and beautification board would serve as an ad hoc committee, you wouldn't re-present it to them. It just be, it would start and end there and then it would come to council. So ergo, it would follow option two pretty closely. I guess it's, it's a little bit of blend of both in a sense that, um, we're not creating a separate ad hoc committee, but you're using the park board as that, that initial step for, for that review, uh, after enduring the public, uh, hearing. Okay. So on a chart perspective, um, you're basically saying to be option to be would be, uh, would be going through city council, but we don't need to create an ad hoc committee because a TB would just park or would replace that. It's not to be, it's one. And, and, and, okay. So the direction's clear. Is there anyone against that? That's, that's kind of the, if there is, there's anyone that, that would prefer a separate committee be created, that's who I need to hear from. Uh, otherwise I think, uh, all three parties represented here on, from a staff perspective, uh, Gary, Eddie and digital Gary, uh, are tracking with us. So is there anybody that would prefer that? Okay. Council member Armitage, I just want to make sure that there's a consensus on that for, on for this idea for, well, I'm working on that. That's what we're trying to find out if there's no one that's a dissenting. So again, if there, is there anyone that would prefer the ad hoc version, I need to hear from you. Okay. So Gary and Eddie, you have your, your direction. Let us know if you have any questions as you move forward. Thank you very much. All right. Appreciate it. Thank y'all very much. All right. That concludes B. Thank you, sir. Uh, that takes us to item C, which is ID 21, two zero seven, uh, receive report, hold discussion, give staff direction and on the certified agenda process for closed meetings. Uh, Mayor, that's going to be Rosa, your city secretary. Got it. Okay. Good late afternoon. My name is Rosa Rios and I am your city secretary and I am here to present the certified agenda information. Okay. So to provide a little bit of background on November 15, 2020, a council. Oh yeah. Sorry. Hold on one moment. Thank you. All right. So let me restart. Okay. So to provide a little bit of background on November 15, 2020, um, council member Armentier submitted a request via the one minute pitch process as outlined in resolution 19 to zero to six. And at that time, um, the in summary, the request was to, um, consider, um, a work session to, um, determine whether or not, um, to continue with recording to actually to begin recording an audio recording of certified, um, of close meeting sessions. And, um, on January 12th, 2021 work session, the request was delivered and the consensus of the city council was to go ahead and continue with a work session. As part of that work session, we did provide, um, a detailed, uh, process from the city secretary's office that outlined how we handle, um, the certified agenda process for all close meetings and or executive sessions that might happen at any, uh, meeting. So to provide information from state law, um, as far as, uh, close meetings or executive sessions, a certified agenda or recording is required. And again, it's required for all proceedings of each close meeting, except for a private consultation permitted under section five five one point zero seven one. And that is the consultation with attorney. So the, our process is that we do prepare a certified agenda with the exception of that five five one point zero seven one. So for a certified agenda, um, the sort of, it does require that it have a certification from the presiding officer, um, that is true and correct record of the proceedings, a statement of the subject matter of each of deliberation, a record of any further action taken and announcement by the presiding officer at the beginning and end of the meeting, indicating the date and time again, um, the process that was provided to you and also is an attachment to this work session item does detail, um, did provide kind of a snapshot of what the certified agenda form looks like for our office. If it does, if there is not a certified agenda, then we do have a recording and the presiding officer is required to announce at the beginning and end of the meeting, indicating the date and time that the close meeting took place. And of course it is a classy misdemeanor for an individual to knowingly participate in any close meeting where a certified agenda recording is not being kept. And our office is very careful to make sure that we do provide a certified agenda for any close meeting, um, item that is considered. And again, with the exception of five five one point zero seven one consultation with a city attorney. So under the Texas government code provisions, there are exceptions that allow for a close meeting. Um, listed here are the most common used by the city of Denton and, um, it is not all encompassing of, you know, the options are available, but a lot of the others, uh, related to other, um, type of, um, entities. So we did not include those. So the preservation and disclosure, we do retain a certified agenda recording for at least two years after the date of the meeting. If an action involving the meeting is brought within that period, then the governmental body shall preserve the certified agenda or recording while the action is pending. Um, to kind of enhance on that a little bit, what we, our office would do is at the end of the two year period, we would, um, do a request for destruction form that we provide to the records management policy committee that lists what those close meeting agendas topics were. And it's reviewed by the attorney, by management and also by the auditor to make sure one that there is no pending litigation, that there's no pending audit and they will let us know whether or not they approve, um, the destruction or basically shredding of the certified agenda in litigation, uh, in a district court involving a alleged violation of this chapter, the court is entitled to make an in-camera inspection of the certified agenda recording, and it could admit all or part of the certified agenda or recording is evidence on an entry of a final judgment and may grant legal or equitable relief it considers appropriate, including an order that the governmental body may make available to the public, the certified agenda or recording any part of a meeting that was required to be open to under this chapter. So, um, again, our office would not allow anybody to, um, review a certified agenda, uh, once without the approval of the city attorney and in case there was maybe a pending litigation, um, we would seek confirmation from his office. Of course, there are exceptions on who can view the certified agenda now without a court order, and that is a member of the governing body that participated, city manager, and of course the city attorney and or his support staff, meaning the, uh, deputy city attorneys or another attorney. And then again, you see kind of here a comparison that the certified agenda recording of a close meeting is available for public inspection and copying only under court order, and that is a class B misdemeanor. And I will take any questions. Thank you. Um, questions for staff. Councilmember Armitage. Yeah, um, can you or Rosa or Aaron or whoever feels comfortable answering them speak to how a recording, uh, could help or could be used in a lawsuit if that ever comes up in a lawsuit. I know that the, um, Texas Freedom of Information Foundation, for instance, considers that one of the advantages of, uh, recording closed sessions as opposed to, uh, only having the certified agenda. Just wondering if somebody in-house would want to speak to that as well. Well, and I think, yeah, Aaron, so it's, it's if you do, right, that was kind of leading, but if your position on that is, is better said. As far as, you know, the, whether, whether city does a certified agenda or recording, understand that the, the purpose, and that's why we, uh, the pages and I think it's exhibit three was included that the purpose of actually doing this is to ensure that one, you're meeting a closed session under a property, a proper OMA exception, and two, that the discussion that you had in there fell under that exception. And I, it's, I know that there are members of the public that may think that these recordings can be used for other purposes, but that's not what the, what the law requires. And so anybody wanting to, to challenge the city's ability or challenge the actual closed session of whether or not it was properly held, that is the kind of litigation that would be down in district court that would be filed to allege that the city council met in closed session and they didn't have a proper justification or they didn't, um, uh, their discussion ventured into other areas. And that's, that's the sole purpose of the litigation. It's not for other types of purposes of whether or what he said, she said, or anything like that. It's just to determine, did you do this correctly? Did you follow the process? And so I suspect that's why not a lot of cities use recordings is a certain summary agenda is that, uh, or the certified agenda is, is what most cities use, but you know, it's certainly doesn't prevent you from having the audio recordings if you want. Thank you. So, so just follow up for clarification. So, um, so in other words, if somebody were to, uh, uh, accuse the city council of, and to bring litigation saying that a closed session was not a legal closed session, if there was a recording, right, then that recording, uh, could be deposed or, you know, could be evidence and it would actually show, uh, you know, assuming that it is a legal closed meeting, it would, it would show that otherwise there's just the certified agenda to go on. And, you know, one of the concerns, um, from, uh, Texas freedom of information foundation and a concern of mine too is, you know, having seen, uh, now I saw only, I think I saw only one, uh, of the closed meeting certified agendas. It was when I was on the public utility board, but it was just very minimalistic. Um, it wasn't, uh, you know, all that different from the agenda posting. Um, and it, it, it met the qualification. So I'm not saying it was improper or illegal. Um, but as you can see from, as, as mentioned in the report, what's required of the certified agenda posting is very minimalistic. So you're not going to get the kind of play by play and the kind of, you know, solid, uh, defense that a city would have with the, with the recording. Uh, so that is just one, one advantage. I just wanted to, uh, just to ask about that one. I believe there are a number. All right. Council, uh, mayor, mayor pro tem Davis. Thank you. I think we're kind of talking at cross purposes. I think the city attorney is talking about that very limited recording that is only the chair saying we are now in closed session for this purpose at this date and time. And council member our mentor is talking about a recording of the entire closed session. And I cannot contemplate a situation in which one, a certified agenda is not just as good as somebody being recorded saying we are now entering closed session because that's all the certified agenda is required to say that's exactly its purpose. That's all it certifies. And two, I can't imagine a situation where we're in litigation and it is somehow advantageous for the other side to have at their disposal the closed session where we discussed legal strategies and that litigation that doesn't make any kind of sense to me. And you know, the city is sued on a pretty regular basis, sometimes meritoriously, sometimes by folks who are looking for a payday, sometimes by folks who are more confused about how they even got to the courthouse than whatever the allegations are in their lawsuit. And the idea that we want to record the city council talking about the steps we're going to take to steward tax dollars, the conversations we're going to have to get the best price on power, the conversations we're going to have on all these things that are very clearly within our authority to have a closed session on. I can't imagine how that's advantageous to the taxpayers at Denton. Can I just clarify? No, we're going to give everyone else an opportunity to speak if that's okay. So thank you. Other questions for staff? Mayor, I'm sorry, Councillor Meltzer. You can switch if you want. Yes, sir. There's times. Okay. So I'm a little unclear now. I mean, are we talking about recording the full session or are we just talking about recording the statement that we're going into closed session? Aaron, if you want to speak to that? As far as my experience, the cities that I'm aware of that use a certified agenda, I know there are cities in Texas that use the tape recordings. How much they record? Is it just the proper that they can properly go into closed session or whether it's the full proceedings? That I don't know. That is sort of on the table for this discussion. I would assume so. Okay. I became unclear. And then if so, if the purpose is, as you describe, Mr. City Attorney, that it's just to determine whether a session was properly closed or was validly closed, what do you, how do you protect all this other stuff that was legitimately closed from being made public, you know, and discovery? That's all going to be reviewed in camera by a judge and they'll make that determination as far as whether it can be released or not. It's not the general litigation that you're thinking of, you know, discovery process. That procedure is spelled out in statute. Okay. The judge will make that determination. And the opposing counsel in such a case wouldn't have heard it before the judge would have made a ruling either then, right? No, no. The way the statute is, the way that typically happens is they're in the judge's chambers listening to the recording. The defendant or petitioner respondent. I mean, you know, I remain as I did, I have no problem with it. I don't see the, frankly, the big upside or the big downside to it, but I have no problem with it. Okay. And before we move, I'm going to ask for other questions for our circle back to Councilman Armitage, but I do need to clarify this. For Aaron, for all the non-JDs, when you say in-camera, does that mean everyone jumps into a Nikon or is that a different definition? It's a legal attorney. I apologize. I try to avoid legal terminology, but it's basically they in-camera means that they've gone inside the judge's chambers and they being the attorneys and the judge and they review or discuss specific issues in those chambers. That's what an in-camera discussion is. Perfect. Thank you. You're awesome. Any other questions? Okay. Councilmember Armitage. Yeah. Just responding to some misconceptions, responding to what Mayor Potem mentioned earlier. So the recording would be a recording of the entire closed session, not just somebody saying we're going to go into closed session. Similarly, a certified agenda is it is a little more than simply saying, you know, we're going into closed session. It says what it's about. It can say more, a lot more than that, but it doesn't have to say any more than what was listed on that slide for it to be legal. Secondly, there are a number, as also mentioned on the slides, there are really a number of exceptions that are already on the books that are already part of law that say that, for instance, if we're consulting an attorney about consulting the city attorney or some externally contracted attorney, then that is covered under attorney-client privilege. And that's not going to, if we're doing that at a closed session, you know, that's not going to become public. So we don't have to worry about those things. Sorry, not become public. It's not going to become, you know, handed over to an opposing attorney. That's just not going to happen in a situation like that. I just want to mention a couple other advantages of this, too. Most importantly, for public trust, you know, the public, of course, has no idea what goes on in closed sessions. But if they knew that we were being recorded, and if we knew, if governing bodies know they're being recorded, we would tend to be especially circumspect, especially cautious, even though, you know, the governing body and the city attorney is probably the only ones that are going to end up ever listening to that recording, if at all. So it's a kind of a self-monitoring device that really takes care of itself in many ways. And that, for me, is the primary benefit. It also serves the benefit of, you know, if there's a closed meeting that a member of that governing body can't attend, or a closed meeting that occurs under, you know, say we're about to have elections in May, someone new comes on, you know, they could be caught up to speed by listening to a recording of a closed session that is still on record. And you can get so much more from that as a member, elected member of a governing body, or appointed member, than simply looking at a certified agenda. You know, I would encourage all my colleagues, if you haven't already, to look at at least one certified agenda just to see how minimalistic they are. Okay. All right. So before you go again, Mayor Procham, I just want to share my thoughts. I mean, I think the city managers outlaid it well. I think it's important for those watching to understand this has been a non-issue. And I want to point out the only one instance we've had of an issue in closed session, we had to issue a public notice about something that happened in closed session because someone misrepresented what happened in there, right? I mean, so we had someone of this, a member of the body at the time, misrepresent what happened in closed session, so much so that it became a public issue that we had to then issue a public statement about that. Other than that, there's been no issue. And I'll point out this body, not all members here, but this body reduced the penalties for exposing information that is discussed in closed session. So I think that's a first step. If we're talking about tightening things up, let's go back to make it punitive to share what happened in closed session. That's something I can get on board with that has real teeth. Now we're talking about misdemeanor charges for people that are violating ordinances in it. So that's real teeth and that's actionable for this body. And it's not punitive as the Mayor Procham-Davis has pointed out. So this has been a non-issue and if we want to get real serious about what happened in closed session, let's make it punitive again to share what's in closed session before the body loosened that restriction. So let's go back to that as a first step. Obviously that's not on the table today, but that's something that has real actionable teeth that I could get behind. Mayor Procham-Davis. Thank you, Mayor. I just want to comment on a couple of things that have been said. First, on the in-camera review process, that is a very common process in litigation and criminal litigation and civil litigation as an attorney who has taken evidence through that process many times and has worked with many judges. You are not always pleased with the outcome of those rulings to assume that the city as the defendant in civil litigation would always be happy with, well, the judge took a look at it and the judge decided it needed to be shown to the whole public. I mean, that's just kind of a naive position to think that as long as there's an in-camera review, as long as a judge is going to look at it, then the city's interests are always going to be protected, that it's never going to be a situation adverse to the city. The reason why we would not want that information outside of a closed session would be under the Texas Open Meetings Act. Those are things that we would have already made the decision as a body that that is closed session material, that is adverse to the city's interests for that to just be out there, because it's not just our folks watching our meetings and watching recordings. It is people who are adverse to the city's interests. There are law firms that specialize in suing this city. There are folks out there who are already adverse to our interests who watch very carefully what we do. So opening up the whole spectrum of our closed sessions, and it's not just, there's this narrative out there that it's all about transparency. Why in the world would the city council ever talk about things behind closed doors? I think we all know that there are things that are best kept behind closed doors until it's time to act in public. The council can never act in private. We can discuss and deliberate. We can get advice from our lawyers. We can hear about competitive matters. When we're negotiating contracts and that kind of thing, we can only ever act in public. It is always on the record, that is always recorded in this city, and it's always made available on the website. I see absolutely no advantage to recording these closed sessions, making them available for anybody who wants to take their shot with the judge and try to get a hold of it. That's only adverse to our interests. Okay. And so we're going to, we're going to wrap this up and move on. Councilmember Amater? Yeah, I just want to speak to something, a related issue of critical importance that you brought up, Mayor Hudspeth, and that is when a council, it was a previous council, removed the punishments for speaking about closed meetings. That's because it was illegal, it is illegal to punish free speech in that way. That's why that was removed. So I don't think we should be bringing that back. Okay. I'll just say kind of just as a closing statement, I hope that, for those of you who see this as a non-issue, I would encourage people to listen more to people in the community who, for whatever reason, feel distrustful of government. It feels, including local government. If we want to increase public trust, one way to do it is by something like this. I really don't think, you know, if you look at the cities that do this, they're not constantly being sued for, so that people can get a hold of their closed meeting records just to expose them. So that, you know, that I see is kind of a red herring, and I think that that's the wrong kind of approach to an issue like this. We should be asking, what is best for public trust? And that should be the, really, the predominant question for all of us. Thanks. So to summarize, so I want to make a statement that I'll summarize and we'll give staff direction. So my statement for those following along, just to give a pragmatic application of this, if you're out there and you send text messages to your friend versus recording yourself sending a video chat so that they can see the whole thing, see your expressions, all those things, that to me equates. I'm sending you a text message in summary, I'll give you an emoji versus you seeing my face smiling, those sort of things. So I think there's, it's just a, it's a way to standardize the communication. It meets the only, it not only meets the state requirements, but I also think it captures the intent of the meetings very well. And so, and then I'll talk to the community. We have, it's important to note, there's 140,000 plus people that live in the city of Denton. So I find it very hard to believe that there's 70,000 people plus that would constitute a majority of the city that does not trust this community. We hear it all the time that we're doing a great job, where we get kudos for going for recouping money and being diligent about people's taxpayer rates. So I don't know that there's 70,000 plus people that think that we're not being transparent and we're going to continue to work there. You never get there. We're going to continue to work hard to be transparent and communicate as best we can. And then I'll just say this, if you believe that there's simply just because you have an audio or a video that clears things up. Well, we have ongoing issues right now where there's video out there and it's, it's, it's the site it's reviewed and understood in two different ways. And that is absolutely what's that issue here. That's what mayor pro Tim Davis has pointed out. People can look at the same thing and see it a different way. And that's happening in our community right now. So why would we think that's going to be different going forward? It's not people here and see things and make their own determinations and it's not going to then just because that's available have a uniform kind of a uniform summary that's just not going to happen. So for that reason, I don't support this. I support us continue to do better, continue to increase transparency in any way we can. But, and I don't think those two are mutually exclusive. I just don't think this is the best best method to achieve that. But if there's so to open it up so that staff can have direction, I guess it would be easiest to say who supports this transition and policy so that staff can then move forward and rework that policy. So the question is, which council members support transitioning from the certified record that we keep now to moving to a either audio or video recording? Okay, so counselor armature counselor melter any others? Okay, seeing none. So Rosa, that gives you the direction. And then we will if there's any other, well, we'll just move forward that staff has direction. And we'll move to that concludes item C, take us to item D, which is ID 21 550. Receive report, hold discussion and give staff direction regarding process impacts and results of service delivery during the February 2021 inclement weather event by the following departments, public works fleet. Mayor, members of council, Terry cater, your fleet superintendent going to give you a quick overview of the winter event from the fleet perspective. Now I'll give you that overview. Thank you. So for the for this event, the fleet department was pretty much standard operating procedure. We are concerned with three main things on a daily basis, and that's fuel availability, staff availability, and parts and supplies. And so the focus for us and preparing for this event was basically fuel, making sure that it got treated, so that would be good for the temperatures that we were hoping not to experience but did. And we did send a winterization memo out to all departments beforehand as a reminder so that they could pick up some of this treated fuel and run it through there's in a diesel systems beforehand. And then to make sure that we had assigned on call technicians and that the operating departments knew who to contact whenever they needed to help. So the things that went right were that we did get we did have an adequate supply of fuel on hand and we were able to treat that fuel beforehand with additional additives that would keep it from gelling down past zero degrees subzero temperatures. We had enough fuel that we could actually help some of our neighbor cities out if needed. And we did have our essential employees reported to work as they always do. So we had a we had a complement of technicians available. We was pretty much working our regular shift schedules. We just continued that. We were able to respond to service requests on a 24/7 basis. And I want to say that we had excellent cooperation between fleet department and many other departments. There were times when we were asked to look locate equipment and share equipment. And everyone I worked with were just phenomenal when it comes out. So the negative impacts that we experienced right off the bat, we had a flood in our parts room. But I have to say that facilities responded and got that taken care of very quickly for us. So that really wasn't too big of an issue for us. We did have some engines that experienced gelling and those were the pieces of equipment that actually didn't get the winterized treatment. And that sounds easy. But when you consider it's not really practical to put your hand on every piece of diesel equipment in the city and get it treated. So that's understandable. We didn't realize that the power is going to go out and that we were going to be asked to supply fuel to every emergency generator in the city. That's one thing that we had not planned for. And while we do have some ability to transport fuel, we were overwhelmed with the request. The other thing that the fire apparatus of water systems rose in some of the apparatus, just from being in the sub zero temperatures for so long, that really wasn't preventable. Where we think we could improve we we have snow and ice equipment. We don't have it scheduled for winterization on an annual basis. We do ask departments to get it out to bring it to fleet so that we can look it over and get it ready. But that doesn't happen 100% of the time because most of the time that equipment will sit there for years before it's ever pulled out and has to go into service. And that's where we're running the problems. So we want to make sure that we have good preventative maintenance schedules in place to address this type of equipment as it's not used on an annual basis. I think we could improve our communications between all the departments. Everybody's kind of going their own direction and seeing what they need to do to handle the event. And I understand that. I think it would be good for all of us to communicate our needs to other departments and to receive what their perceived needs are from us beforehand. Just to help us think about all the alternatives that we may be asked to come up with during the event. I want to make sure that when we do get a schedule in place that it's followed up on and that the directives are completed once we have a PM schedule. I want to make sure every piece of equipment gets looked at on an annual basis. Sometime the end of October, first of November. And right now we'd have to develop procedures for those services because we don't service them frequent enough to be familiar with everything that needs to be done to them. The other thing that we really need to do is improve our ability to transport fuel to emergency generators in this particular case. We had some small tanks that we could use, but a lot of the generators in the city burnt more fuel than we could carry in time. So we are suggesting the possibility of looking at a tanker trailer or a small fuel truck for such an emergency as this. When you look at the equipment that the city has already in place, it's actually pretty impressive. I didn't realize it until I put the list together that we do have a lot of winter equipment. This is actually the equipment that we have on hand. The dollar amounts there are just to give you an idea of what this type of equipment would cost were we to replace it or purchase additional equipment. We have several sand spreaders for various sized trucks. We have several snow plows for various sized equipment from dump trucks to light trucks to skid steers. You can see the various price ranges there if we were to add additional equipment or to replace what we have. Just a few pictures in case you are not familiar with what this type of equipment looks like. We have a towable sand spreader in the upper corner. The snow sweeper out at the airport that we picked up a few years ago used. We have several sand spreaders hanging on a rack. We have several snow plows as you see in the right photo. Just a couple pictures of damage that happened to fire apparatus due to the freezing temperatures. When they are not pumping water, it turns out they make pretty good ice makers. So when that happens, you burst fittings and piping and there was several of those that had to be replaced. Not really preventable. I know that was pretty quick and brief, but I will be happy to answer any questions. >> Okay. Questions? Council Member Meltzer? >> Thank you for that. What a tremendous amount of tuition this whole community has paid finding our vulnerabilities. I was a little curious about the small gas truck idea. Would you be inclined to keep it filled with gas so whatever happens, you know, we have got a supply but doesn't it go bad after a while? How would you manage that? >> It would basically be for transport purposes only. We wouldn't fill it until the emergency arose where we had to. But we may be able to use it in other instances and it would be for the transport of diesel fuel only. >> It seems like there was also an issue with not having adequate supplies for the situation we anticipate. But doesn't that also make you want to have a supply of not just diesel but gas for generators? >> Well, we had an adequate supply, but we couldn't transport it to those. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Okay. Any other questions for staff? >> Mayor, this is Sarah. Just so you know, this concludes our department presentations regarding our inclement weather situation. We have done a tremendous job of capturing all of this information on areas for improvement and put it in a grid format. Our next step will be putting cost associated and timelines with our improvements, working with Madison in the audit department so we can come back together in a presentation to council in May. >> Okay. Great. And one note I would have, Terry, that I would just ask is in addition to kind of pinpointing where our locations are, I think another step, if we could talk to our other kind of governmental bodies, our partners, so TWU, UNT, to make sure where maybe we loop them in on those conversations, they may not have the same access so such that we can help them out. Because I know for one instance, the towers there, the dorms, they have generators, but they weren't able to prep them so they couldn't run them because everything froze. So those type instances, like as we have a heads up to kind of maybe have an email thread that goes out and solicits their information or kind of in advance of that, when we're mapping where our locations are, maybe invite them to share theirs as a supplement to that document. So I'll defer to you and the management on if that's doable, but that would be my ask. Okay. Any other questions for staff? Okay. >> We'll sure do that, Mayor, and actually I just wanted to let you know that once we get the councils sort of okay as our plan goes forward, we will share that plan with not only the county but with our UNT and with TWU to see if we can do a better effort in partnering as well as the community college. >> Excellent. Yes. Great. Okay. Well, thank you very much. Thank you for the presentation. That takes us to our last work session item, which is receive report, hold discussion and give staff direction on pending City Council request for staff research, if you will. >> Good afternoon, Mayor and Council, Stuart Birdseye, assistant to the city manager. I am here today with your pending Council request work session. Sorry, the screen on the bottom wouldn't let me do that, share that the easy way. Just by way of reminder, and for anybody who might be watching for the first time, any Council member request that takes over two hours of staff time or is a policy or work session request comes here that Council members requesting Council member has one minute to present their item and then the remaining Council members have up to one minute to respond and indicate support for the use of staff time. Today we have one request. It comes from Council member Armitour and it is for a staff report on what Texas cities can do to put caps on campaign spending and fundraising for elections, including a list of Texas cities that have caps and what those caps are. Staff has provided a little bit of information down below, just outlining what our estimate of 8 to 10 hours to produce that informal staff report would include. With that information, I will take this down and turn it over to Council member Armitour. Mayor, do you have the minute timer or would you like me to do it? I have it. Thank you. Perfect. All right. Council member Armitour. Yes. So this is obviously a request for information, not a request for a work session, but not my intention is to put forward afterwards a request for a work session on imposing campaign finance caps, fundraising and spending caps for City Council. The reason I preface that with this request for information is because I assumed that a request for a work session would lead Council members to want to know more on the topic if you weren't already aware. So that was why I requested a staff report. I hope that Council members are interested to know what other cities like Dallas, like Austin and others that have chosen to exercise Texas cities right to impose our own caps for the sake of public trust have done and our public economy have done. I will gladly do the research on my own and put a report together if people don't want it from staff. I think people will prefer it from staff. Great. Thank you. Okay. Council member Meltzer. This will be a little test of our ability to find consensus if there is one. I'm interested in what other cities do with regard to campaign finance. That having been said, I think on the spending side, I'm not a lawyer, I'm curious if they do something different, but as an American, I just don't, I think it's flatly unconstitutional to limit political speech, but there's a lot of precedent for putting rules around campaign spending. I'd be interested to know whether any cities exclude contributions from outside the city. And if that went forward in Denton, I'd have to tell my cousin Lenny in Florida, "Thanks for your support, but no check." Okay. Others? Any other comments? Seeing none. Okay. That's going to fail for want of support in even the varying degree, which I did note for the record. Okay. So that concludes item E. That takes us to our closed session. So I will call the, I'll take us into closed session, then we'll take a break to set the room. So we will go into closed session. I will convene the closed session at 4.41 PM. We will consider the following items, consultation with attorneys under the Texas government code, section 551.071. So we're in closed session and we'll take a break and come back and call our one and only item. Let's say it's, let's come back in 15ish minutes right at five o'clock. Thank you. And welcome to this evening's regular meeting, scheduled meeting of the Denton city council. It is 6.30 and we, 6.31, pardon me, on April 6, 2021. And we do have a quorum. So we will get started. I'll call the meeting to order. We will start with the pledge to the United States and Texas flag. Please stand with me if you're able. And we'll do that. Okay. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Honor the Texas flag. I pledge allegiance to the Texas, one state under God, one and indivisible. Thank you. Okay. We do not have any callers. So we will go to the consent agenda and I'll take a motion and I'll note that items H and N were pulled during the work session, but I'll take a motion on the consent agenda. Mayor Pro Tem Davis. Move approval of the consent agenda with the exception of items H and N. Council Member Ryan. I'll second. I think we have a motion from Mayor Pro Tem Davis, a second from Council Member Ryan. Motion for approval for the consent agenda. Any discussion? Okay. Mayor Pro Tem, I'll say you. Aye. Council Member Ryan. Aye. Council Member Baker. Aye. Council Member Meltzer. Aye. Council Member Johnson. Aye. Council Member Armitage. Yes. And Mayor Hutzpah says an aye that passes seven to zero. That takes us to item H first. We did not need a presentation, so I'll call that item. It's HID21. This one does need a presentation. I got it. I got it. So this is item HID21520. Consider adoption of an ordinance of the City of Denton authorizing the interim city manager to execute a park development agreement between the City of Denton and Bloomfield Homes LP for the dedication parkland at the Glenwood Meadows development authorizing acceptance of land and providing an effective date. You're muted, Drew. Sorry. Mayor of City Council Gary Pack and Director of Parks and Recreation. We have a brief PowerPoint for you to show in regards to land acquisition through our parkland dedication development process. Drew Huffman, our assistant director, has been working with the developer, and this is part of the Hickory Trail plan that we had shared with you back in the fall as following our trail plan that we're outlining for the next 25 years plus. So, Drew, if you'd like to go ahead and bring up the PowerPoint. Yes, I will. Good evening, Mayor, City Council, Drew Huffman, Assistant Director of Parks and Recreation. So we're here tonight for the Glenwood Meadows parkland dedication. The Glenwood, this area, so the Glenwood, what will, what will be called the Glenwood Meadows property is located just east of the new Bonnie Bray Bridge and just north of Vintage Boulevard. With this development, with the homes that they're building in this area, due with our dedication requirements, their required land was only almost three-quarters of an acre, and the fee in lieu of the land was only $11,000. The actual dedication of the land will be just shy of 32 acres, and the dedication value is just over a half million dollars worth of property that we're getting. Also excuse me, also wanted to go back and show you here on this map. This indicates right here where our trails plan is that Gary spoke of that we brought to you last fall. This area right here that's circled and tabbed as wetlands is a nationally recognized wetlands. We've really had our eye on this property for quite a while. We knew some type of development would come in, so we knew we would, we had a really good shot at getting it at a very good value that we're getting right now. We worked with the developer. We had one meeting with them. We expressed our desire to, we showed them our trails plan, expressed our desire for this property and how it really encompassed the trails plan and how it would work in with the new residents. Of course, there's future home buyers in this area, and also with the wetlands. We've also already met with Texas Parks and Wildlife with their urban biologists, and of course, we work with our environmental group and storm water control group to really show them this property and what it can be and what it hopefully will be in years to come as a really beautiful wetlands for us to be able to go out and just enjoy the migratory birds that come in and out of this area. You know, we're in a really good flight path for those migratory birds. Also, just our native birds that stay here in this area to be able to watch them in that wetlands, almost like Denton Zone, like small Lila that Louisville has. So, but that's what I have, so I'll stop sharing questions. Questions for staff, Councilmember Meltzer? Not a question, just appreciation of the fact that it's obviously far in excess of what was required. It's protecting tree canopy along the watershed. Yes, sir. Part of our trail connectivity vision, and I think it's just a really good win and to whatever extent, you know, as you're working with a developer that brought that about, kudos, and I move approval. Thank you. Mayor Pro Tem Davis? Ditto, and I'll second. Thank you. So, we have a motion and a second to approve Item H. Any discussion? Okay, so we'll vote. So, Councilmember Meltzer? Aye. Mayor Pro Tem Davis? Aye. Councilmember Baker? Aye. Councilmember Johnson? Aye. Let's see. Councilmember Ryan? Aye. Councilmember Armitage? Yes. Mayor Hutsbeth is an aye as well. That passes seven to zero. Thank you. That takes us to Item N, which does not have a presentation. It's ID 21647. Consider approval of an ordinance of the City of Denton, establishing the Development Code Review Committee as an advisory committee of the city, establishing the powers and duties of the Development Code Review Committee, repealing all ordinances and resolutions in conflict herewith, and providing an effective date. So, I'll take a motion. Mayor Pro Tem Davis? I'll move approval. Okay. Councilmember Baker? I'll second it. Okay. So, we have a motion by Mayor Pro Tem Davis, a second by Councilmember Baker for approval. Discussion? Okay. Seeing none. Mayor Pro Tem, how say you? Aye. Okay. Councilmember Baker? Councilmember Meltzer? We had a whole work session on this, so we didn't need further discussion. I'm just going to be consistent. You know, I feel that it usurps the proper function of a quasi-judicial body with a subset of members. It'll have the effect of narrowing the set of options considered by the full body. So, I'm a no. Okay. All right. Thank you. Councilmember Johnson? Aye. Okay. Councilmember Ryan? Aye. Councilmember Armitter? No. Okay. Mayor Hutzpeth is an aye. That passes five to two. That concludes the consent agenda portion. Takes us to items for individual consideration. First item is AID 21318, consider adoption of ordinance of the City of Denton, Texas, amending the fiscal year 2021 budget and annual program of services of the City of Denton to allow for adjustment to risk retention, to the risk retention fund of $2 million for purpose of funding workers' compensation claims and administration. Good evening, Mayor, City Council, Erin Nguyen, budget manager. Pull this up. Okay. I'm here to talk to you briefly about a request to amend the fiscal year 2021 risk management fund. Essentially, the proposed amendment will increase the expenditure budget by $2 million. The risk fund is inherently volatile and difficult to predict, so this is not unusual for us to come seeking this type of amendment to this fund. What we're seeing right now is that our current expenditures are at about 72% of our budget for the entire fiscal year. This is driven pretty significantly by some additional expenses that were not included in the initial budget, primarily related to workers' comp and hiring an outside firm to manage our claims. So I am here to answer any questions. I also have risk here if there's any more operational questions that you would like to ask. Okay. Thank you. Questions for staff? Okay. Seeing none, I'll take a motion. Councilmember Armitter? I move approval. Okay. Is there a second? Councilmember Ryan? I'll second. Thank you. So we have a motion to approve by Councilmember Armitter, a second by Councilmember Ryan. Any discussion? Okay. Councilmember Armitter, how say you? Yes. Okay. Councilmember Ryan? Aye. All right. Councilmember Baker? Aye. Councilmember Meltzer? Aye. Mayor Pro Tem Davis? Aye. Councilmember Johnson? Aye. And Mayor Hutspeth is an aye as well. That passes seven to zero. And that takes us to item B. ID 21229, consider adoption of the ordinance of the City of Denton approving a joint election agreement and contract with Denton County for joint election services for the regular municipal elections being held on May 1st, 2021. And Mayor, I'm going to recuse from this item. Okay. Let the record show that Mayor Pro Tem Davis has recused for item B. Okay. Thank you. Good evening. My name is Rosa Rios and I am your city secretary and I'm here to present the elections contract for the May 1, 2021 general election. And of course the terms of the contract will continue if a runoff is necessary. So the contract is with Denton County for the administration of elections. This follows the same format as for previous elections in other years. The term is for the general election and again for runoff if any is necessary. The services are for City Council districts one, two, three and four and a runoff if any locations. We have a total of 36 county wide polling locations for early voting with seven in Denton for election day. There are 10 locations in Denton only. So the total participants are 45 entities, which includes the City of Denton. The estimated cost for the entire election is $609,872.26 with Denton's estimated cost at $60,587.45. This is again for the general election only and the final billing will happen after the election is over. The actual number of election day polling locations are going to be 14. We will be billed only for 11 as three of the precincts are shared with Flower Mound and Crum and Ponder and those participants hold 50% more than 50% of the registered voters so they incurred the majority of the cost. You can see here the cost detail for the different line items for early voting, the absentee and for election day. And of course, provisional, the personnel and then the total election costs. As you can see here again, the estimated cost for our city is $60,587.45. And I'll be happy to answer any questions you may have. Thank you. All right. Questions for staff? Councilmember Meltzer? Will CDC guidelines continue to be observed? Yes. Yes, they will as with previous elections. As you know, the Denton County will highly encourage that their poll workers do wear masks and the voters are not required to wear them. But as far as shields, you know, spacing of people in line? I'm sorry, I'm having a little bit of a hard time hearing you. Yeah, you addressed one point, but as far as all the other elements of how they've been running them before, that's all gonna be there with the plexi shields and the spacing on the line and so on. Yes, they will have personal protection stations there with and they will didn't county reported that they've asked their poll workers to make sure that they disinfect the pans, the areas, you know, where voters are touching and everything. So yes, it's going to be the same as every other election. Thank you. Okay. Any other questions for staff? Councilmember armature. So just to confirm voters won't be required to wear masks, but they will be encouraged. Correct? That's correct. Yeah. Okay. Any other questions for staff? Seeing none, I'll take a motion. Okay, Mayor Hutsworth moves approval. Is there a second? Councilman Ryan. I'll second. Thank you. We have a motion and a second to approve item four B. Any discussion? Okay. Mayor Hutsworth is an aye. Councilman Ryan? Aye. Councilmember Baker? Aye. Councilmember Meltzer? Aye. Councilmember Johnson? Aye. And Councilmember armature? Yes. Okay, that passes item six zero. Thank you, Rosa. And that takes us to item C, which is ID 21689. Consider nomination appointments to the development code review committee. And is there, so I see a note underneath that this one that there's, there's no presentation. Is there a presentation for this one as well or no presentation? Mayor, there should be a discussion on this. Hayley, are you there or is Richard or Scott? If I may, I did assist a little bit with the items. So the proposal is to have two members of the city council as well as three members or the other remaining members to be from the planning and zoning commission. Scott, Scott should be, or Ron Mengida should be on the line. Okay. Do you mind going to the next item mayor? And I will, I will find out why the staff is not on the line. Okay. And let me see mayor pro tem Davis, did you have something to add to this one? Well, just to echo what council member Meltzer said earlier on the other item, you know, we've discussed this quite a bit. I'm prepared to make a motion. Uh, if, if we need a little bit of information from staff, that's, that's fine, but I don't think we necessarily do. Okay. Well, let's, we can move forward. That sounds fine. Councilmember armature, you raised your hand as well. Uh, yeah, if, um, if, if we're going forward with it, I just wanted to confirm, uh, are we giving nominations today or we're just voting on the makeup of this committee? Um, so I'm, is there somebody that can speak to, uh, that, or do we need to, I would, I would prefer if you don't mind me letting me let the staff, uh, be on this call and I'm trying to get ahold of him now. Great. Okay. We'll come back to it. So, so we'll table, uh, four C until, um, we can get staff on the line. Is it, do we need, is the Aaron helped me out? Is that, is that good enough? We need to vote on that. You're muted. I'm sorry. Need motion to second a table on item. Perfect. So I move, uh, I'll move that we table item, uh, four C until, uh, staff can get, get on the line. Councilmember armature. I'll second that. Okay. So we have a motion and a second to table item four C, uh, till later in the meeting. Um, discussion, seeing none, uh, mayor Hutzpah says aye. Uh, councilmember armature. Yes. Okay. Councilmember Baker. Yes. Councilmember Melzer. Aye. Councilmember Johnson. Aye. Okay. Councilmember Ryan. Aye. Thank you. Mayor pro tem Davis. Aye. Thank you. Okay. That, that is, uh, that passes seven zero. Uh, I'll call four D, which is, uh, I D two one six seven nine. Consider appointment appointments to the Denton police, uh, department chief, police department chief of police advisory board. That's tough. Uh, so there's no presentation. So I'll take a mayor pro tem Davis. I move appointment of the individuals listed on exhibit two in our backup, the nomination sheet to the Denton police chief's advisory board. You say that easier than me. Is there a second? Uh, Councilmember Baker. I'll second it. Thank you. Okay. So we have a motion and a second to approve, uh, the nomination sheet provided to us in the backup. Uh, is there any discussion? Seeing none. Um, mayor pro tem Davis, how say, Oh, bear with me customer armature. Just a, just a quick question. Uh, their, their first meeting, uh, will be later on in the summer. Is that right? They're going to have a training soon. That's correct. All right. Any other discussion? Okay. Seeing none. Mayor pro tem Davis, how say you? Hi. Okay. Councilmember Baker. Uh, Councilmember Melzer. Hi. Councilmember Johnson. Hi. Councilmember Ryan. Hi. Okay. And what am I missing? Councilmember armature. Yes. Okay. Mayor hudspeth is an eye as well. That passes, uh, seven to zero. We'll take up a four e and then check back on the other. Uh, so with four e it is ID 21548 consider nomination appointments to the city boards commission and committees. Mayor pro tem Davis. Same motion. I move approval. Excuse me. I move appointment of the individuals listed on exhibit to the nomination sheet to their respective bodies. Thank you. Councilmember Meltzer. Yeah, I just wanted to stay for the benefit of some members of the public. We have diversity on this body and it's very reasonable to expect there's going to be a diversity of opinion on boards and commissions. Uh, I'm going to support the slate and second and urge that one opinion that's hopefully beyond debate is that all people who received services through city grants should be treated with equal respect and consideration. I hope we all agree with that. I will second. Thank you. Uh, so we have a motion by Mayor pro tem Davis second by Councilmember Meltzer to approve any discussion. Seeing none. Mayor pro tem Davis. How say you? Well said. Councilmember Meltzer and I thank you. Councilmember Meltzer. I Councilmember Baker. Uh, Councilmember Johnson. Councilmember Ryan. I thank you. Councilmember armature. Yes. Okay. And Mayor hudspeth is a I as well. That passes seven zero. Uh, this city manager. How are we holding up? We're good. Um, both scott mcdonald and ron mongito on the line. Uh, we had a little mix up. So there they were in the way ron's in the waiting room. So they're available to tell you sort of what the story is about this, although it is in the backup, as was mentioned by the mayor pro tem. Great. So I'll pick this this back up. It's uh, so it's item four c i d 21689 consider nominations appointments to the development code review committee. And, um, the question if you so I'll call on Councilmember armature to repeat her question. Uh, I actually, you know, my, uh, the question is moot now, so I'll pass on it. Okay. Um, all right. So then do do I have a motion? Mayor pro tem Davis. Sorry, I had a little trouble. I'm meeting there. I move appointment of the members of the ad hoc development code review committee to the newly newly formed development permanent development code review committee. Thank you. And is there a second councilman ron? I'll second. Thank you. So we have a motion to a point based on the document and a backup from mayor pro tem Davis, a second by council member ryan discussion. Okay. Uh, so mayor pro tem Davis, how say you? I council member ryan, how say you? I council member baker. How say you? Uh, okay. Council member melzer. Council member johnson. I thank you. And then council member armature. Yes. Okay. Mayor hudspeth is an eye as well. That passes 70. Thank you, scott and ron. Uh, so that takes us to our public hearings. So I'll call the first item, which is, um, item a z 20 001 to see hold a public hearing and consider adoption of ordinance of the city of denton texas regarding an amendment to the razor ranch overlay district to amend the concept and zoning map exhibits and amend development standards and design criteria for the development within the eastern portion of razor ranch south campus. And before I forget, I will also open the public hearing for this item. Good evening. Let me get this pulled up and we'll share my screen. Good evening. So the item before you is a zoning amendment for the razor ranch overlay district. Um, the request before you relate specifically to amending the concept and zoning maps within the overlay district. Uh, that's exhibits b one and before and then also adopting, um, development standards and design criteria for the non non residential uses within what's called the south mixed use district. So we'll go through a little bit of history first in case anyone is unfamiliar with razor ranch. Um, so the overall overlay, the entire overlay district rather covers 410 acres. Um, it's divided into two major areas. The marketplace of course on the north side that you're probably all familiar with is mostly developed. Um, and then on the south side of highway 3 80 we have what's called the south campus. Um, and that is about 257 acres that runs down to scripture street within the south campus. There's several sub zoning areas if you will. Um, so this map kind of out outlines those for you. The rr one area that's shown in the reddish pink color is what's known as the town center. So that's where things like the convention center are located. Um, the area in bright yellow is what's called the south rr two district. Um, so that's kind of those perimeter commercial uses where you'd see things, um, like restaurants and retail primarily. And then the other colors on this map represent what's called the south mixed use district. So that's an area that, uh, does permit some commercial uses in certain areas, but it also permits a variety of residential uses. Um, and that's the area that we're primarily focused on with these amendments. So over time, um, because the south mixed use district, uh, wasn't as set in stone as some of the other plans when they first created the overlay district in 2007 and 2008, they left some placeholders for these design standards for some of the, uh, the uses within that area. So tonight we'll be filling in one of those last remaining gaps in the overlay district with the design standards, if those are adopted for those non-residential uses. So to look first at the changes to the conceptual plan, um, this is, is kind of the, the very broad high level, um, zoning map for razor, if you will, that outlines where certain uses are supposed to go. Um, so there are three changes to this map that they're looking to make, um, or three specific areas they're looking to change. Overall, they're updating this, uh, this eastern area to reflect the streets and lots that have been recently plotted within this area. Um, as you can see previously, it was just kind of, uh, different colors on a screen. There wasn't a lot of definition to it. So now that the eastern campus is plotted, we're, we're making those updates, uh, to make it a little more detailed. And then they're looking to change the designation for three properties. So the first is this area, uh, north of the park, which you'll look at in your next agenda item. Um, this area, as you can see, was previously designated for park uses only, uh, they are looking to change that to the, to be a part of the south or our two designation. Um, so that would allow a variety of commercial uses to go here. This is consistent, if you recall, uh, with the work session that was previously had regarding the park and how they, they might look to have some complimentary uses like restaurants on this parcel that could provide eating, uh, nearby eating locations as well as parking for users of the park property. The second parcel is this area here. It's a very small, uh, about one acre site that's located at panhandle and heritage trail. Um, as you can see here, this area was also previously designated for park uses only. And with this proposal, it would change to a consistent designation that would allow things like hotels, offices, um, as well as some multifamily and single family uses consistent with the surrounding property. Um, when the developer first came in and began planning for the East campus, they did discuss this area with the city, um, staff to see if there was any interest in this being a public park due to the small size and the proximity of this much larger park that met all of their, uh, dedication requirements for this area. Uh, we, it was decided that this wouldn't be a logical location for a second public park within razor ranch, um, when we could instead focus on the larger park and amenitizing that the third change to the map is this parcel here, um, along Bonnie Bray at panhandle. So as you can see, it was previously designated only for single family. What they're proposing now is office or single family uses be permitted here. This change in particular is driven by the recent increase to gas well reverse setbacks. When those were changed from 250 to 500 feet, that, that new reverse setback radius, um, encroaches on to well over half of this, this particular parcel, um, because single family uses are a protected use, those could not be permitted within that setback radius. So allowing offices on this parcel as well would give them some, some ability to use that property for something that's not a protected use and that would still be compatible with what we see along Bonnie Bray where many of the single family homes there have been converted to things like offices and daycares. Um, exhibit B four is the zoning plan for razor ranch. So again, those same changes would be reflected on this map. They are proposing no changes to the base zoning designations, which, um, you may recall her from our 2002 DDC. So those would remain as they are here with NRMU and our CCD designations. But this would reflect those use designations changing for those three properties. Again, and some of this, I've already hinted at, so I'll go through it quickly. But some of the considerations that staff looked at with this analysis was again, updating this map just generally to allow for those streets and property lines to be there to be shown on the map would make it much easier to administer this as it's consistent with the property boundaries we see on our maps and in DCAD. Um, and then again, the property north of the park, this change would be consistent with what's in that area and would be consistent with what was discussed at the previous park work session. Uh, this parcel here at panhandle again, what they're proposing is consistent with what's in the area. Um, and then finally here, uh, this change again, as I referenced, um, is driven by that reverse setback increase and does make sense as the single family uses would not be permitted within that setback radius. The next part of the overall change, um, and amendments to the overlay that they're looking to make are to adopt again, as I mentioned that last missing piece. So those non-residential site design standards for the areas that are in the south mixed use district, those would be incorporated into the overlay as exhibits C2, D2 and E2 would cover everything from site design and architecture to parking and landscaping standards, as well as signed standards for any non-residential use in that mixed use part of the campus. Um, the proposed standards are very consistent with the other non-residential development standards in razor ranch. So you would see the continuity of architectural standards, landscaping standards, and, and similar designs that we've seen across the razor ranch campus so far. Um, they are also comparable again to those standards from the 2002 Denton development code that razor was first adopted under, but they do have our, um, enhanced architectural and landscaping standards compared to what we saw with our 2002 DDC. They're not proposing any substantive deviations from what we've seen at razor so far. So again, this would just be allowing them to complete the development with consistent architectural and design standards and the razor ranch site plan process would still apply. So as each of these parcels develops, it would go to the planning and zoning commission for site plan approval to make sure that it is consistent with the standards that have been adopted by council. And then finally, the last piece to this proposed change would be some cleanup items to the main text of the razor ranch overlay district. So providing those references to the new exhibits that would be adopted, um, as well as reorganizing the list of permitted uses, which if you've ever looked at the overlay district was very confusing for the south mixed use district as everything was lumped together with a lot of exceptions. So they've proposed now that they've had a couple of new designations on the map to reorganize that list to make it easier to read and understand. Um, and again, this would primarily just assist with administering the code and making sure that, uh, that what is permitted and proposed on these parcels in the future is consistent with the intent. Public notification was first sent regarding this request when it went to P and Z, um, in January. So when in response to those notices, we received only one written opposition and one in favor. The opposition was from a resident on Bonnie Bray, um, who was concerned with traffic on Bonnie Bray street and they've in favor response was from the adjacent property owner of the town center portion of the campus. The applicant did have a neighborhood meeting prior to that planning and zoning commission meeting. And I believe they'll, uh, they'll touch on what was discussed there in their presentation. Staff is recommending approval of the request and the planning and zoning commission also recommended approval seven to zero at the January 6th meeting. And I will now pull down the screen and stand for any questions. Okay. Thank you. Questions for staff. Uh, seeing none, I, um, I'll take a motion. More questions. Okay. No, I don't. Yeah. No, we don't. So no callers on this item to that point. I'll close the public hearing. Just avoid confusion. Uh, and take a motion. I'll move approval. Thank you. Is there a second council member Ryan? I'll second. Thank you. So we have a motion approved by Mayor Pro Tem Davis Davis, a second by council member Ryan and discussion Mayor Pro Tem Davis. Just want to take a moment to acknowledge the opposition from the neighbor on Bonnie Bray. Uh, the portion that's been switched over to offices, as Haley said, I went out and drove it, took a walk over there. We, my family uses that park over there quite a bit and walk in that area directly across Bonnie Bray is already doctor's offices. That, that portion of the property adjacent has already switched over from homes to offices some time ago. And I also want to acknowledge the change in this plan as a result of our partially as a result of our change in the gas well setbacks, developer found a good use of the land. Okay. Uh, and I'll say, well, just one, that park is fantastic. Uh, I'm excited about the uses on either end of that. And just, if those that aren't tracking along, I think it's my understanding that the villages of razor ranch have since been sold by the builder to now are the developer to someone else. And so that area is just growing exponentially, uh, because they didn't hold that very long. So that must, you know, so I'm just saying, I think that area is, is prime. Obviously, uh, the green space is a key contributor to that. You know, it just makes it a great, uh, walkable area, both those parks there in that close proximity. So, uh, this, these transitions make sense, uh, just, it matches the uses and what's kind of going on. So, uh, that, that was helpful. Thank you for the presentation. Uh, so any other discussions? Okay. Seeing none, uh, mayor pro pro pro Tim Davis, how say you, I, uh, council member Ryan, how say you, I, okay. Council member Baker, council member Meltzer, council member Johnson, um, and then council member armature. Yes. And mayor Hutzpah is an eye as well. That passes seven to zero. Um, that will take us to items for individual consideration continued, which is six a, which is ID two one four nine seven consider adoption of ordinance of the city of Denton authorizing the interim city manager to execute a park development agreement between the city of Denton and, uh, like allegiance Hillview LP mayor city council, Gary pack and director parks integration. I'm going to go ahead and bring up a brief PowerPoint and I'll be available for questions. Okay. This PowerPoint is regarding the razor ranch property and a new park parcel that is part of this overall development. Uh, it's been a few years, uh, I guess probably two years since we first came and talked to you about this process. Uh, this is the location of the razor razor ranch park that we're talking about. And just to give you an idea that here's McKenna park down here, uh, just Southeast of that parcel on Bonnie Bray from an overall development standpoint. Uh, so the park is located in the middle, right? Right on the Eastern side of heritage trail. Uh, Winko is up here to, I guess it'd be the Northwest corner and then, uh, us three 80 is off to your left, uh, on the north side of the park. So we had, um, a community meeting back on March 18th, 2019. Um, I believe council member Meltzer and, uh, current mayor pro tem, Jesse Davis was in attendance as a resident. Um, and then we also had discussion with council following, uh, but some of the key takeaways, uh, walking trails and connectivity, other parks, we do have an eight foot sidewalk in the development that'll connect over to Bonnie Bray, which eventually would be a 10 foot trail heading north and south, uh, water fountains shade is, is, uh, a reoccurring theme in everything we do. Uh, there are 183 trees on property at full growth development services. Haley did the, um, analysis for us. It would be 36% tree coverage on that parcel. Um, we do have irrigation in the turf, uh, so we're gonna keep that healthy. So if we have too much shade that, that could cause the grass not to grow well. Uh, public transportation is available on three 80 as well as Bonnie Bray. And we do have bike racks on the property for those who want to ride their bike to the park, educational signage. We're working on doing some research on, on what those topics are going to be. The developer has pledged to pay for those. So those will go in in the near future. Uh, we did add lighting as part of the, some of the discussion and we are using solar lighting, uh, similar to what we're using our park system. So we have the same brand. Uh, so that's helpful. Uh, that's been installed throughout the park. Uh, call boxes for safety were an item that was discussed. Uh, we've had a few of those in various areas in the park, uh, system over the past few years. We really like to take that and look at that holistically, um, to make sure that we don't play some just periodically. And that's more of a systematic approach, especially with cell phone usage. Um, maybe an alternate could be, um, charging stations for the community, uh, turf quality, green space and trees, trees and more trees, uh, was a theme. And that goes with obviously our tree canopy expansion and shade, uh, parking and ADA accessible parking is, uh, was a concern. We do have, uh, it's a neighborhood park. Uh, typically we don't have parking in neighborhood parks, although we do have some parking lots. Uh, we do have quite a bit of parking within the property, around the property, as well as some ADA, uh, parking opportunities. So I will share a map with that here in the future. Uh, restrooms, we've had a number of discussions about restrooms in our park system. They are very costly and costly to maintain. Um, we are, uh, have had discussions with the developer about working to secure a restroom access in any future restaurants. If they develop on the north side of the property and we'll continue those discussions as that moves forward. But if we do have special events out there of any significance, we would have temporary restroom facilities, uh, street crossing and a traffic light at university and heritage. Um, I believe there's been discussion about the light at university and heritage, uh, and, and I'm sure that'll continue. Uh, we do have street crossings, uh, uh, three, I guess three of the four corners. Uh, the one corner on the northwest side does not have a dedicated, uh, crossing, but we're going to work with our traffic team to see if we could, can't look at putting a hawk signal in there in the future. Uh, consideration for a spray ground or a playground, uh, spray grounds are pretty expensive. Um, and not that we don't want one there. We have identified key locations throughout the city where we could have, um, spray grounds. So they're kind of spread out, uh, strategically. Uh, we have looked at North lakes and McKenna and razor is a kind of a secondary location. So that could be a, um, a fallback location and that's going to be in our master plan moving forward. So we can have that discussion, uh, continued, uh, moving forward from a city council meeting, uh, on April 2nd, uh, we were asked about food truck bays. There is a, uh, basically a crushed granite trail that runs east west on the property, uh, behind the stage that can be used for back of the house for events as well as for food trucks and there's dedicated electric for food trucks. Uh, so that's, uh, an option that was requested a parking for ADA and moms. Uh, we have locations on the north side to right where those, that road I just mentioned is located where you could pull in and drop off. Uh, we, we can probably identify that for parking, but we're gonna have to work through some details on that still in signage. Uh, but there is a place definitely for people to be dropped off to, to go in and use the park and then park elsewhere. Um, uh, protected street crossings we talked about, uh, explore opportunities with the Denton Explorium Museum. Uh, the developers did reach out to, to that group about an option of putting the museum on the north side of the property. And I understand that, that, uh, that wasn't going to move forward wildflowers in the park. Um, we have, uh, the developer has planted wildflowers in a couple, we call them selfie locations with some natural climbing rocks. Um, and we may have to do some reseeding in the future just to make sure that they, they pull through and start developing, uh, hopefully next spring. Uh, a spray ground and water feature, uh, was, was mentioned at council more of an interactive fountain. Um, as I mentioned earlier, a spray ground could be a future location, uh, in this parcel if, if funding is determined. Uh, shade again is very, uh, common theme amongst all of our park properties. This one specifically is shade with solar panels. Um, as of right now, we don't have the funding for that. Um, again, we're at 36% tree canopy at full build out. Uh, but that's, that's mean we can't look at placing some shade strategically located over some benches. Uh, again, once funding is identified, uh, terrace seating with elevated stage. I think this was a question that, uh, councilman Meltzer had asked about, um, as part of council's, uh, directive and a focus item of looking into amphitheaters, we did reach out to a half an associates who's conducting our parks master plan to see if they could give us a proposal to do a deeper dive into amphitheaters throughout the city and for, uh, additional music entertainment opportunities. Uh, so this is one location that we will be looking at, um, in the possibility of maybe a future stage being constructed. And if the desire was, we could always put dedicated seats in there too, if that was an option. Uh, but the, the, the, the turf is slightly terraced. Uh, and then if we put an elevated stage, there would be a view sheds for people in the park as well as people sitting on the mounds, uh, restrooms again, uh, working with the future developer on that, the future development on the north side. And then we're asked to place the design video on Facebook, which was extremely popular and helpful. Uh, so just to follow up on a couple of quick questions, this is the, the original site plan of the property. There is parking on the south side, which is, um, actually the west side of the park on the far west road. There's parking on the park side on the east side, I'm sorry, east side of the park. And then also on some of these side streets, there's parking with ADA as well as general parking. Uh, we did put food truck, uh, electric and parking here, which is on the north side of the property. You can see these potential eateries located here, which could be future, uh, restroom facilities for people using the park. The park is broken into two, two main quadrants and then two sub quadrants of each one. So kind of four areas. Um, so we have the shade located around the trails and on top of the mounds where people could gather and most likely we'll be walking. And then the open space where, if you want to go out and fly a kite, uh, play soccer, play with football, you could do that as well without, uh, running into a tree. Uh, this was one of the original computer generalized renderings that was provided by the developer. And this is what the property looked like, uh, after the sod went down originally when it was still growing in. So it's almost identical to those. Uh, there's some, some minor changes in regards to the, the Hills and how they were going to cut and put some walls in there. Those have been eliminated during the design process process and construction process. Uh, but like I had mentioned, we still need to put in park signs and historical signs, uh, as part of the project. This is the food truck area here. There's crushed granite trail. And then these two pads here where that drop off parking could be located. And then if you look close enough, you can see where the electrical panels are for the food trucks. So they would be self-sufficient. You could see some cars parked here, um, on the west side of the park and then some development going on on the east side of the park where there's additional parking. And then here's just another angle with the grass actually turning green. Uh, you could see some of the workers out there working, uh, in the trees starting to take shape. I went out there this afternoon and looked at them. Uh, they all look pretty good. I was a little concerned about the trees, uh, in regards to the cold weather we had, but they look like they're starting to butt out overall. The developer has, uh, put into the project about $1.3 million, a little bit over, uh, signage is not included in this yet. This was as of March 12th. Uh, so a significant investment into that property. Uh, if, if approved, we would actually work with the funding, uh, the developer to provide one year of maintenance. They've agreed to give us $83,000, uh, for offsetting of one year of maintenance. Uh, they are required by our land dedication and development ordinance to give us 6.14 acres or $364,000 in value per decad. And then a park development fee would be $255,000. Uh, so if we were going to build this park on our own, uh, we would have $255,000 to work with. They spent 1.3 just to give you a sense of how much that development has occurred. So, but they are actually giving us 9.86 acres of land. So a little bit more than they're required to total value of decad is $585,000 plus $1.3 million of development. So overall value of that is, is just shy of $2 million for that, uh, 10 acre park. Uh, we'll work to, uh, with a developer to transfer that 9.86 acres here in the near future. Um, as part of this, since they are building it and dedicating it to the city, they have prepaid their parkland dedication fee. Since we did not have agreement, we will refund them that property per the agreement within 30 days of the approval. And then the eventual refund of all the park development fees up to what they were required to at $255,174. Since they've put in more than that, it would not exceed the $255,000, $255,174 specifically in what they were required to provide. We will not be giving them anything above that amount. So everything that they put in at $1.3 million is above and beyond, uh, based on their own development. So overall, uh, I'm gonna, I'll go ahead and take this down a significant parcel for our parks and recreation department, uh, in investment that would not have been able to happen without the cooperation and agreement of the organization. Okay. Thank you, Gary. Questions for staff council member Meltzer. Uh, first, Gary, thank you so much for, you know, patiently stepping through each of the points of input. Uh, I just want to focus on, uh, and, and, you know, many of them, uh, you know, were clearly addressed. I want to focus on the one where people said trees. They also said trees. They also said more trees. They also said trees for shade. Um, and, uh, you note that there's 183 trees in the current design. Is that any different than the preliminary design? Yes. So, uh, they actually exceeded what they're required to, uh, by 20% was their requirement. They're at 36% at full growth. Yeah. What was the number of trees in the design that was presented to the community versus the 183 now? Did they change? Um, I don't have the exact number of what it was beforehand, but it is an increase. I can get you that exact number. Cause I mean, it says, you know, I'm not seeing a visual that looks different. I mean, you know, I think the reaction of the public that you heard reflected in those repeated comments about trees, you know, it looks like it, you know, a big hot, uh, you know, sudden make pool table with some ripples in it. They did, they did put in some larger trees than they anticipated as well. Uh, talking with the developer. Okay. And then, and what does it take to get to full growth at 36%? It doesn't match, you know, the visual we see is that in like the year 2050 or something? Yeah, that looks like about half of that now. It's going to be some time. It's not going to be a anytime soon. Uh, also depending on the tree and how, how fast that tree grows. Uh, so it could be 25 years before we get to that point. I mean, I, uh, and I, you know, fully acknowledge, um, you know, how much they've put into it, how much more that is than is what is required. But if, uh, we really did want to respond more fully to the public response, uh, is there, is there anything left that we could do? Like, you know, the areas that, that are sort of represented as treat, like he totally wants that, you know, the big empty space in the middle with the kind of promenade down the center. But if, uh, I guess that'd be the north end, I don't know, the corners, you know, it's sort of more heavily planted. Um, you know, could, uh, if we wanted that to be denser than it is as presented now, is there anything left that we could do? I mean, right now we, we, sure, we could put trees in, um, but we need to leave the trees opportunity to grow too. So if we put them too close to each other, they're going to grow into each other and then they're not going to fully grow. They'll, they'll be stunted by that. And then we could have other issues. Um, so in the addition to that, if we have too much shade, especially on the hills, we have a lot of trees on the hills that that grass is, it may not be as thick and thrive as well in shade with the Bermuda. So I understand that we'll have turf issues as well. So there could be a good balance. Mm hmm. No, those, those, those points are well taken. I just don't feel that, um, on judgment that we're at that end of the risk scale of too much. I think it still looks like we're at the too little end. I'd be interested to hear what others think. Uh, and you know, by all means, I wouldn't want to put them in wrong places where it would mess up what's already being planted, but it just looks pretty bare like it's going to be pretty hot and it's going to be real impediment to its being fully utilized. That's my honest reaction. All the other good things not withstanding. So sorry to stick on the one thing, but it's kind of a big thing. Yeah, I guess that's one, one of the challenge of going into a, a bare piece of property that's been completely scraped and re sculpted where there were no trees that were mature enough to give you some of that sense of size and span, uh, where you're going in and you're taking in smaller trees. And by the way, the berm is cool. I mean, I appreciate him, you know, the matting, uh, you know, just changes in elevation that makes it work. The trees, the trees are located, you know, around what you would think would probably the higher area where you're walking, jogging, sitting as opposed to if you're playing soccer, obviously you're not going to necessarily have shade unless the trees are significantly high and the sun's at a different angle, uh, compared to noon. Um, so we're, we're trying to provide that balance where you have open space for recreational play in creativity. Uh, but yet if you just want to go out there and walk, you'll have that intermittent shade, uh, down the road where you have the tree canopy either covering or angled over to the, uh, the, the areas that you're walking along the trail. It's a shaded perimeter. There you go. All right. Those are the words you're looking for. Councilor arm returned and mayor pro Tim Davis. Uh, yeah. So I just want to, uh, to second, uh, council member Melters comment about the, uh, about shade and trees and the, and the community's concern about that. Um, and I would hope that, um, as, as time goes on and people use this area that, uh, they will provide feedback to, to council, you know, through the grapevine. So, um, whoever, you know, is on council at that time, we'll, we'll get a sense of, and the community will have a sense of, uh, what more needs to be done, what the most loved and used parts of that area are. And if there are parts that are not being used cause it's too hot, uh, you know, sometimes there are, um, you know, artificial, uh, shade structures that can, um, uh, be, be implemented while we're waiting for trees to grow in, in certain areas. Uh, but maybe it's use of that space, uh, that, that will end up kind of providing us with more information about that. Uh, so I'll be eager to see that. Okay. All right. Mayor Pritzam Davis. Sure. It may be helpful if I kind of point out the way that our family uses this park. Um, when we want to go someplace where mom can run the track while the kids run around, roll down hills, do whatever kind of free play, this is the park we go to. You know, mom's doing her, you know, marathon training or whatever kind of mess she does. The kids are just playing on the hills, um, enjoying the rocks that Gary mentioned, all that kind of stuff. If we want to go to a playground, it's got a bunch of trees, a little more shaded. Mom's going to sit and chat with a friend or read a book or whatever. And the kids are going to play on a playground with their friends. We go to McKenna park and it's right there in the same neighborhood. The folks that I tend to see in this park, a number of them are exercisers and dog walkers from the apartments that are already there. I imagine we're going to see more of that kind of traffic. Gary mentioned the joggers. That's how we use the park. And that's how I've seen more people using the park. Uh, I did see plenty of Frisbee players, uh, soccer players out there in the open areas. But I think if you want the more natural feeling hilly, more naturally treed park, you go over to McKenna. If you are the kind of person that enjoys the more structured, more formal looking, um, kind of, uh, shaded perimeter park, we'll call it. Then you go over to this park. They're, they're in pretty close proximity. The other thing I want to kind of put a placeholder in is the community did, and this is not the first time we've heard this. We've heard it many times. There were a significant number of folks who wanted some kind of a water feature because it is going to get pretty hot. I, I agree with so far parks assessment that someplace like North lakes would be better for a traditional spray ground. It looks kind of like a playground, but it's got water shooting out everywhere. But this would be a more ideal location for a piece of public art that is also, uh, a water feature. Um, and that could be a really cool opportunity to, to pay homage to the history of this particular, particular parcel. The family that the razor family still involved in our community have been for generations. Um, there are schools named after him. There's now going to be a park named after him. Uh, there was a, you know, much beloved local herd of Longhorns, uh, that used to live on this site. I mean, it, the sculpture almost designs itself. You just shoot some water out of it someplace. Right? So, um, I just want to put a, put a, I just want to put a pin in there and just look out for those A&M folks coming along. Um, but, uh, I just want to put a pin in that as a piece of public art that is also a water feature. That's, this is the perfect kind of place to put something like that. I like that idea. I like it a lot. Okay. Council member Johnson. I did hear you say that there was a bit, there's a smart, there's a venue for food, drugs that will be that. I think that's a great idea that adds, that adds, that will be great. I like that idea. Thank you. Thank you. Just to add a few comments about the, the use of it in the summertime, obviously at, uh, in July and August, uh, whether you're in the shade or not, it's hot. Um, and there are opportunities when you may want to use the park in the wintertime when it's cold, but you want to be out in the sun. So there's, there's an opportunity to actually be out in the sun where you can actually be warmer as opposed to being in the shade. So it's really about finding, I think council member Davis mentioned it pretty well is you got to find the right place at the right time, uh, what you want to do and try balancing that. And, and we want to try, try to provide different experiences throughout our park system and not have the same thing in every location. So we're trying to vary up our playgrounds, our terrain, uh, whenever we can, the quality of our turf. This, this turf is going to be irrigated. Um, there's not a lot of irrigated turf that we have in our park system outside of an athletic field. So, so this will be a higher quality. And one of the concerns that we had from McKenna was actually the quality of the turf being a challenge, uh, because we don't have irrigation there in the, the stickers that are out there. So this does provide people that opportunity to go ahead and roll around on the Hills. Um, so it, we're, we're trying to identify varied opportunities, the opportunities of recreational experiences for the community. Okay. Uh, before I come back around twice, is there anyone else that has not spoken comments for staff? Seeing none. I do want to, I want to absolutely echo, well, I want to start off positive, right? I think that's important. I mean, people watch these meetings and I think you need to start off positive saying that is a dynamic, uh, contribution for our city. And I'm grateful for that, uh, is, you know, and I think we need to start off there and I think we need to highlight that. And that needs to be the primary takeaway that, that you and your staff and city management worked very hard to get this achieved. The developer came and worked with us to, to meet as many, check off as many boxes as humanly possible. Right. And, and it's designed, you often hear this, we don't design it and then it's use lineup. So this was designed for a stage feature for that. And it has kind of the banks for the sound, that sort of thing, the open space for that. So it's, it's, it's, it was done on purpose. And so that is important that we not lose sight of that. Uh, and then off track a little bit. I mean, it's on street parking you talk about, that's again, another, uh, compliment to city staff because those streets were done incorrectly and we held that builder's feet to the fire and got them fixed and got an extended warranty on those streets for the, for the taxpayers to protect them. Uh, so all, I mean, all the way around, we've really checked all the boxes and did great work here. And so, uh, Ms. City Manager, I think just for my two cents worth, I think that would be great to have some sort of one pager that highlights that value that we send out or at least kind of share with council to share on our social medias, uh, because this is a, this is an absolute win. I will ask, I'll ask, uh, Sarah and Ryan to, uh, put together something that puts on our, puts on our, um, you know, social media. I think you're absolutely right. And, and it goes even further, but the, the, the benefits to the public in the park access as well in an area that is rapidly growing and it's going to be a big boom for us, uh, as well. Yeah. No. And, and I think, and I, I don't want to conclude with exactly where, uh, Mayor Pro Tem started directly across the street. It's not far away. I mean, it is literally across the street is you have all the shade you can handle. You have the seating, you have almost a gazebo style stuff on that, on that entire North side of McKenna Park. It's just trees on top of trees, shade on top of shade, you know, so that it, you have that option, uh, and to kind of play off each other and kind of what, whatever your, uh, your appetite is or whatever you're doing with your kids. So, uh, that just really well done. And I want to highlight that. Uh, it's so, if there's anyone else that hadn't spoken initially, which in the street, okay. Councilman Armitage. Uh, yeah. So when I, uh, you know, second that just, it is, it's very exciting. I'm really glad that this is going to happen. I too love the idea of having a food truck area. Um, there are barriers that, you know, food trucks face in other, uh, you know, public parks. So I'm glad that's not going to happen here. It's a really perfect marriage. Uh, I do, uh, have concern in addition to the tree issue about what the cost of upkeep for such large, you know, expansive, uh, turf, you know, we don't really have anything like that, except in, uh, you know, uh, soccer fields and sports fields. If you can speak to, you know, what your sense of what the annual upkeep will be and also, um, you know, hand in hand with that, uh, also kind of from a conservation point of view and environmental point of view, as far as water use, you know, water conservation, um, and, and also, uh, pesticides, especially if, you know, kids are going to be rolling around on the grass, um, uh, you know, just making sure that, uh, we're, we're using, uh, soil and lawn treatment that makes it safe for them to do that in that we're not costing taxpayers too much in over watering, you know, for the sake of this, having a lush carpet of, of grass. So wondering if you could just speak to the annual up, upkeep and what, what that will look like. As I mentioned earlier, um, the developer is giving us $86,000 to offset the first year of maintenance. Um, that's what they were paying for actual maintenance contractor for that facility. Um, we, we went in anticipating $150,000 in expenses, uh, just with adding in water utilities, um, with the trees and the turf, obviously they were watering at a higher rate to get those trees established. Once those trees are established, which they're, they're probably pretty well in at this point in time, we can start backing that water down. Uh, and we'll con we have the ability to control the water too. So we're going to be managing that as much as possible. So we're utilizing our water, um, as smart as we can and as efficiently and effectively as we can. Uh, now there's a lot of landscaping there that is all drip. Um, at some point in time, you know, hopefully we, we don't have to water that as much either since it's more Texas drought tolerant type, type planning materials. So we can start backing off on, on that plant material once everything's well established. Um, so that's the game plan there from, from a, um, uh, longterm maintenance use. Uh, we probably use contractors for some of that as well as staff to supplement that, the, that work. Um, and then we'll follow our current IPM program in regards to any type of application we put on that, that turf to keep it healthy. Um, you know, we do have a one pilot program going to Dean you right now and a ramping up another one at Avondale, uh, trying to balance the costs of those parcels. Uh, it does cost more for those opportunities. So when we, when we come back to you with follow ups, we can provide, uh, both the natural component or the organic component to, to maintain those park and then the inorganic or the, uh, manufactured version as well in, in share with those costs to council. Um, but we're, we're going to be following our IPM program, uh, as we maintain that property moving forward. Great. Okay. Thanks. Oh, just follow up quick. So as far as annual upkeep, you know, so there's that one 50 upfront and the 80 something that the developer will put down. Um, no, no, no, I don't think that's, I think it's one, a it's 80 is what they were spending. They, we budgeted one 50. So it came in half of what we budgeted. You, you had it inverted. Oh, sorry. Okay. Okay. Um, so can you put a figure on what you think the city's contribution might be? Um, you know, year by year, I, I understand, um, you know, your point that it'll cost it is likely to cost more at first as things get settled and then hopefully it'll be less, you know, even just a ballpark guesstimate, not holding you to that. Well, and I want to be clear before you speak, Gary and no, no, he was saying the developer spent more upfront, not the city. No, no, no, that I understand. Um, I'm talking about like afterwards is the city does the upkeep, right? Cause we're going to do the upkeep. It's a city park. So I'm just wondering about the, the annual, uh, maintenance from the city's point of view after, after that. Yeah. So, um, I, I don't want to give you a number. It would be inaccurate. Um, so what I can do and we put that summary together, we can share what the projected expenses might be. Uh, just like with anything, we're looking at technology to help maintain our park system and be smarter moving forward, whether that's autonomous mowers, um, and, uh, electric mowers as well to reduce our costs. Uh, so we're, we're trying to be as creative as we can to use the resources we have, cause we realize it's not an infinite number of, of tax dollars that we have to support our park system. So we're continuously trying to balance maintaining what we have in adding new properties as then continues to grow. So that's a challenge for us by sure, for sure, uh, today and moving forward. So we need to figure out the best place to put our resources and how we're going to maintain them to the best of our ability. Okay. Any other questions? Okay. So, and I just want to conclude yet. No, our, our, this body will continue to focus on setting great policy and we have great directors and great city management in place to do the day in days, day in, day out activities to adhere to those policies. So I appreciate your touching on IPM policy that we put in place that you would then execute. Right. And so I think that's important that we stay, uh, at a policy level and make sure we're given good guidance and direction for you to execute on and have clear direction. So thank you for that. Uh, and, and we look forward to you coming back with what, uh, more information as you have it and it's factual and based on actual experience versus, uh, just kind of estimations. So any, any other questions for staff? Mayor, may I make a comment? Certainly. Um, and I, and this is, you know, you're getting to see, um, another presentation by Gary and, and I want to, um, and I don't think I'll embarrass him, but when you look at the slides that Gary gave the council today that talks specifically about all the things that he worked with his staff and the developer, you know, he didn't talk about the back and forth and back and forth that it took to actually get to the point that it's at. Um, Gary always has in his mind that at best the interest of the community and you see that through his efforts, through signage, solar lighting, um, the public engagement back and forth. And so as you said, and I want to reiterate, it's always in Gary's mind to look at alternative ways to do business and how he, whether that's the contractor, actually the developer maintains the park or as he mentioned, autonomous mowing vehicles that are now out there that we're looking at, which is not a person mowing. It's an actual, uh, autonomous like, um, your I bought a robot that cleans your house. There are, there's new technology and he's in the forefront looking at all of those things. And I just want to, I want to say thank you to Gary because I gave him a hard time sometimes, but I will tell you when you look at someone that's qualified to be a parks and rec director and he looks at all the avenues for what's best for this community, we're lucky to have him. Agreed. Well said. Okay. Any other questions for staff? If not, I'll take a motion. I'm there. Pardon me. I'm looking above you. So counselor Melter. I really look forward to this being a vibrant, well used, um, addition to the city and I move approval, uh, an ordinance authorizing the city manager to execute a park development agreement as, uh, stated on the agenda. Okay. Uh, council member Johnson. I'll second. Thank you. We have a motion and a second to approve item six a any other discussion? Okay. Counselor Meltzer, how say you? I council member Johnson. I council member Baker. I council member Ryan. Aye. Councilor Mayor Pro Tem Davis. Aye. Thank you. Council member Armitter. Yes. Mayor Hutzpeth is a aye as well. That pass is seven zero. Uh, thank you again, uh, Gary and staff. Uh, so that concludes our items that takes us to concluding items. Any, uh, announcements by way of concluding items? Uh, I'm going to take up some time. I have a few, so I'm going to power through them. But if one more time, is there anyone else? Okay. So, uh, we just want to touch on real quick. Uh, for those that didn't know and are watching this, I want to thank staff and management for the new city of Denton, uh, mayor's Facebook page. And so that'll go forward in perpetuity. So as mayor, so you'll have consistent and kind of carry over from this office. So really excited about that and to kind of have that consistency and messaging, uh, in that, in that way. Uh, I want to thank all those that participated and donated in any way to the, uh, Easter celebration there at Fredmore Park and specifically Clark and Clark barbecue and, and DJ Harold Jackson and I know council member Johnson participated. And so it was a good group effort, a great time, great turnout. So thanks to everyone there. Uh, and then on, uh, Kroger's partnering with UNT. And so that event is coming up on Thursday. For those that didn't know, um, I can get you more information, but that'll be exciting. Kroger's a great partner here in our community. Uh, UNT basketball is celebrating their, uh, terrific season. That's, uh, the eighth, seven PM at the super pit. For those that want to go and celebrate, we'll have a proclamation that we'll present to the, uh, athletic director and them, uh, there. So that'll, so, uh, staff and management's helping me craft that. And then, uh, several of us attended the police station groundbreaking. Uh, and so, um, just want to thank all involved in that. And I want to thank my peers because, uh, the, the builder pointed out, I mean, because of the time when we acted, we got in front of a huge cost upswing for materials. And because of the way the former city management and our current management have, uh, constructed those deals, we don't get caught up in that, you know, that design build or I could be butchering the terms, but we lock all that in, in advance. And so we, we, we sidestep those. And so again, that's another great infomercial or infomer, uh, infographic on just a huge savings to the taxpayers, uh, in that way. And then, uh, two more things, uh, I want to thank, uh, uh, well, yeah, I think two more, maybe more. So the police, I want to thank the police department. That is just so scary to me that we had someone trying to abduct people in our community and we work with current police department and mayor, uh, Bill Heidemann. I want to thank him and his staff for, for helping us get, uh, get that person off the street and we're investigating that. So that's a huge, uh, win for our community. And, uh, and there, I did go out to the community market, uh, for opening day Saturday, well attended. Everyone was safe and distance. And for this group, again, thank you because we provided the power out there. So there's no more power strips running across. And so we're still working on restrooms and, and Miss City Manager, whatever you can do to get the County to let us partner with them on a new sign out there. I'll certainly talk to them about that. Yes, but, but, uh, to that end, it was a great event and I encourage everyone to go out and then, uh, let's see, then let's see. Yeah, no, I think that's everything I had. And so any other, any other community announcements thoughts before we end? All right. Seeing none. So we will be, uh, so I'll conclude the meeting at, uh, 7 49 PM and it is still April 6th, 2021. I think we are back on the 13th. And so I will see you then if not sooner, but thank you all very much. Have a great evening.