Jan 20, 2021 Planning and Zoning Commission on 2021-01-20 4:30 PM

Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to the planning and zoning work session meeting for Wednesday, January 20 2021. We don't have any public comments for the consent agenda item this evening so we can hop right into work session reports. The first one is item to a PZ 20 dash 010 listed on the agenda and it's to hold the discussion regarding the policy to preserve cross timber upland habitats of 10 contiguous acres or greater. I'm not sure who's presenting on this. Christie is pulling it up. So good evening, commissioners, and tonight I will be giving you this summary of the cross timers upland habitat. To start us off I wanted to give you a short review of how our forested areas are identified and given the designation of upland habitat. And I want to point out that Ditten is unique among the local communities in maintaining a predetermined map that was adopted by the city with the development code in 2002. At the time the researchers created this map. They consider features such as the forest canopy, topography, and soils and staff has maintained this map since where the map is map amendments are approved through the ESA field assessment. ESA field assessment is a procedure outlined in the Ditten development code which calls for a qualified personnel such as staff or a third party to confirm that the environmental sensitive areas exist as it's shown on the map. When we confirm that it exists as shown on the map or we confirm that the boundaries are where it's found in the field, then we amend the map to reflect those field conditions that were found at the time of the assessment. For the upland habitat, that criteria for confirming the designation is that the forest canopy is 10 contiguous acres or greater. That the dominant species be either post oaks, a mixture of those post oaks with black jacks, or a mixture of all of these species of post oaks, black jacks, and burroaks. And that there is an understory vegetation that's amenable to the upland vegetation that we would find in these upland habitats and that there is sandy loam soil. When confirmed to exist, development is required to preserve a percentage of that upland habitat. As you may know for the non-residential developments that is 30% to be preserved and for residential lots, a residential development is 50%. The council, they didn't require that those preserved areas that are preserved to be contiguous, but rather left it as strongly encouraged because they recognized that there was many variables that go into site design. So that's the language remain at strongly encouraged to maintain some contiguousness in the upland habitat. And this infographic is something I have put together to help facilitate an understanding of how to preserve that contiguousness in the upland habitat. So the question for us was, where did this come from? And regarding the history of this 10-acre minimum, the researcher, we staff researched the available minutes, memos, and planner's notes that were in the archives and confirmed that this concept was brought in early in the discussion when they were putting together this new 2002 DDC. Ecology researchers had provided a literature review of scientific articles where there was a minimum of 10 acres was one of the several factors that were being considered to turn a qualitative description into a quantitative description of what is a good habitat. One of the questions that was being asked, for example, is how much land is needed for animals to readily access variable resources? And then those details seem to have permeated the policy discussion subsequently. Along with those landscape ecologists, other researchers were influencing the discussion with questions of how to blend the long-term ecological values with the short-term economic decision-making, and then it seems that policymakers were setting a standard that is easy to understand with the minimum acreage protection requirements that creates a consistency and an expectation for the landowners. And lastly, Commissioner Beck had requested more information on what other communities might have on the books for the protection of upland habitats, and to our knowledge, the town of Flower Mound is the only other community in the local DFW area that does protect the habitat as a holistic ecosystem and specifically the habitats of these upland habitats. And they also, I might point out, have in their definition of what is an upland habitat a minimum of 10 acres in size. With that, I will stand for any questions. Oh, yeah, we'll get to that one. I'll pull this down. I think Commissioner Beck had a question. Yeah, I think, Kristi, I appreciate, I really like the infographic that made clear the sort of definition of continuity that the city's using. I emailed you this, but I'm mentioning here for completeness, and that is doing a little bit of background research, and there's issues where it's completely dependent on whether you're talking about edge boundary or other things that you know about because of your role and background. And so the kind of, the sustainability, the ability to fragment or not fragment an ecosystem, the usefulness of a corridor in a larger parcel is completely dependent on the shape and space and size. And so this is why I was asking you for sort of, what was the citations at the time that were used, because it feels like that the sort of simplistic 10-acre rule doesn't at all match what I've been reading and teaching for the last several years. I have admittedly, I haven't taught a lot of ecology classes, but enough. So anyway, I'd really appreciate those citations when you get a chance. I mean, I know this is just a work session, so like, you know, there's lots of things in front of a work session. But when you get a chance, because the shape in particular and sort of coreness, if you will, the compactness are really, really important and sort of, I think going forward, this issue of, you know, when can we call something fragmented to where it's unuseful for flora and fauna? When can we call it fragmented to where it is still useful for flora and fauna because it connects up, say, rose lawn and some other, you know, larger 10-acre parcels? You know, if there's a little thread of land there, you know, we don't want to call that small and fragmented because it's not doing anything when the reality is it's connecting wildlife. And so while I really appreciate this presentation, it honestly opened up as many questions as it answered. So I'd appreciate maybe some more follow-up on that. Sure. I'd be happy to. I just needed some time to… Oh, yeah. No, no, no, no. I'm not. It's not a rush. Thank you for your time. Is there any other questions for Christy? I do not see any. Christy, thanks for the presentation. Sure. We have another work session report, and it's to hold a discussion regarding native plant material used in site design for development, and I imagine Christy is going to continue on. All right. OK. So for the native plant selection, so there was more, there was a request for the native plants. There was a request for more information on how native plants are promoted by the Denton Development Code and what are our policies and exceptions and the use of natives in the residential and non-residential projects and for HOA lots and alternative ESA plans. So I've pulled it all together in one matrix to help show this all in one slide. And this shows you the different types of projects and the requirements or the way that the policy is applied to promote the use of native plants and the adaptive plants that are on the city's plant list. And I might point out that in the environmentally sensitive areas that we do require that those native plants be used and that we don't typically allow for adaptive plants, but those are options for the development community to choose from for the other type of development projects. And I also want to point out some of the benefits and challenges with the use of native plants, including that when we use these native plants, there is an improved environment with the water, air, soil, ecology, that we are promoting reduced resource needs and long-term that there is a reduction in long-term costs. However, when these developers are choosing for these native plants, there are some challenges with that choice, including that it's still sometimes difficult to acquire some of these plants. Not all of them. Many of them are readily available now, but some are still difficult to acquire or just not commercially available at all. And that there's a need for a revision in maintenance plans, which comes with its own challenges in finding a company, a maintenance company that can work with those native landscapes that require a different maintenance plan. And there's also the community acceptance, getting the development community used to the idea of selecting from native plants. And then the other thing I wanted to show you was this is a riparian recovery mix that was applied to a project that was, this is an alternative ESA plan that was implemented in 2019. I took this picture in the spring of this year, and this was a, this was the riparian recovery mix that you see often that is being used and, or in those plans that are being brought to you by, especially by the, some of our consultants with Kimberly-Gorn engineering firm. And this is readily available by a local distributor and there are a couple of other local distributors of these native plant seed mixes that we have found and we make available to that development community whenever that is requested. And with that, I'll stand for any questions on this one. Chris Rebek. Thank you, Chair. Christy, so it occurred to me that we could dovetail some of our interests here. And so I wanted to ask how the city, if the city would be amenable or is already actually exploring. I know that like, again, for rose lawn and for some of the other developments, there's been transplantation efforts, particularly coordinated through Clear Creek and where some of these species are trying to be saved and moved to other locales and it's challenging for some species. They don't like to be moved. They like to grow naturally. But I wonder if we couldn't incentivize developers to transplant as a way of mitigating loss in some fashion and if we could explore that, that transplantation, you know, maybe there's a reduced burden for development if they're willing to engage in transplantation rather than clear cutting and replanting kind of avenues would be one thing that I thought. And then the other thing, could you we talked about this before, but could you clarify for native, one of the reasons I asked for this work session was, could we clarify code enforcement requirements for if you've got native plants and they're growing in their native plant growth cycle. You know, I know we have, you know, the wildflower rules, which are particular and allow us to, you know, grow until they go to seed and then the code enforcement kicks back in again. But do we have other code enforcement special exceptions and rules for native plants as we're trying to repair these parcels? I'm not well versed in, to tell you the truth. So I might see if maybe we could defer to Richard to see if he has any more information on this. I just want to make sure, was this, can you repeat it again? I'm sorry. That's okay. I, the second part, the second question I asked was it connected to the the wildflower special exceptions for code enforcement, where you didn't have to, you didn't have to maintain your property if you were trying to let native wildflowers go, you could let them go to seed and then regular code enforcement rules would kick in. And I, my question to Christy was, are there other similar special exceptions if we're trying to do repairs and or development of native species in our various development projects where, you know, we have exceptions to code enforcement beyond, the only ones I'm aware of are wildflowers, is it just wildflower? It is, there's a provision that allows for, because we're the monarch butterfly, so there is the ability to do sort of the butterfly habitat or garden, but I think that would fall under that same exception for wildflowers, but we can look into that to make sure, but I think that would, I don't know that it's as clear in the property maintenance code though. So, yeah, maybe when you're exploring that, and I don't know that it's a super high priority item, but if we could help the success rate of some of these native ecosystems and properties by allowing owners and developers to, for non-flowering plants, for trees and bushes and other sorts of ecosystems, if we can sort of expand the exception rules in the same way we did for wildflowers to support more healthy ecosystems in our bioswales and other things that are not necessarily considered flowering plants, and I know you don't typically mow a bioswale because it's typically watery, but nevertheless, if we could maybe chart out some avenues that help promote this redevelopment of this kind of more favorable ecosystem, that'd be great. Any other questions for Christy on this item? Great, Christy, thanks for being here and presenting this evening. That brings us to just our regular agenda, and I think it is just as is straightforward, right, Richard? Just go right through it? That's correct. That's correct. Fantastic. So we'll start with the consent agenda item 3A FP 20-29. Does anyone have any questions on this final plat? We can bring Julie up. Julie, it looks like we have a question for you. Can you take a look at this razor plat? I can. Can you hear me? I'm going to... I can hear you. All right. Great. Okay. Let me... I have a short presentation. I can pull that up, or if I can just answer the questions? All right. Can I speak, Chair? Yeah, of course. Commissioner Beck. Thank you. Sorry. No, if you could pull up something with the drainage maps, I'm not opposed to this. I just was confused by where the drainages are and how we're designing these final drainages, especially in light of the 100-year floodplain crossing over part of the property. So if you could just clarify that for me, I'd be probably good to go. Let me pull up the plat. Maybe we can discuss that. I just don't want to flood out of storefront or something. Sure. So the site that is actually the subject of the plat is just these boundaries right here. That floodplain is to the south of the site. And they have worked with our engineering group to design that drainage plan to conform to the code requirements and also satisfy any requirements for that development. So yes, there is that drainage area to the south of the site. However, the subject property is in this area. Is that answer? Well, I thought that corner crossed over right there. Yes. That little corner is in the 100-year floodplain. And there's no development in this plat reading that that I can tell, right? So we're not going to allow anything over these drainage easements or that chunk of 100-year floodplain. You are exactly correct, sir. Yes, the development of the site will be closer in this area. That satisfies -- I just want to make sure that we're not having buildings on top of 100-year floodplains. Absolutely. Thank you. Any other questions for Julie on this item? Okay. Seeing none, we'll progress. I'm going to jump right quickly back up to item two, just the minutes from January 6th. Is there any changes or comments on the minutes from January 6th? Great, seeing none, we'll go to the items for individual consideration. First one is item -- well, first and only one is item 4A, PP 20-31, and it is Sean Jacobson's item. Sean, with us this evening? Yes, sir. Fantastic. Floor is yours when ready. Thank you. All right, and you should be seeing my screen and my presentation. We got it. All right. Lovely. So, there we go. So yes, this is PP 20-31. This is a preliminary plat of the Mayhill edition, and the staff is recommending denial but does support the applicants or is comfortable with the applicant's request for an extension to date certain, and I will be happy to take any questions you have. Are there any questions for Sean on this item? Commissioner Beck. Thank you, Chair. So, as I recall from the backup, there was -- they were out of compliance for drainage, stormwater, terrain gradients, canopy, ESAs. I mean, they generally were sort of territorial and water drainage issues across this. I know that one of our commenters commented about the lack of bike and pedestrian access in this proposal, was that one of the reasons or did that currently also meet code? So if I can address that for a moment, there was actually, I believe the root of that was simply a labeling error which should have been shown on the plat as Stockbridge was shown as Somerset. So there actually is pedestrian and bike connectivity directly to the nearest road, Stockbridge, which is to the south there, and of course that is one of the things that we would have corrected prior to recommending approval of this plat. So there is actually full pedestrian and bike connectivity to the neighborhood, and that does enable connection to the Med Park station for residents. But for the other sort of more ecological, if you will, reasons that the current plan doesn't match compliance, is that correct? Yes, there are some matters we're working on, primarily calculations and labeling, but things that didn't need to be resolved. So I guess that was my question. Is it that the paperwork isn't in place or that they're not currently meeting criteria? Well, there are things that simply need to be done accurately and legally before we can approve it. In some cases, it might be considered a matter of paperwork, but it's something that's of absolute necessity. For instance, having access to a drainage easement in case there was ever a problem in the future. I'm just making sure that those are shown correctly. No, no, no. I'm not second guessing you. That kind of paperwork thing, that's generally, they have it or they don't and they're satisfying requirements or not. I was just curious if it was more in the realm of you could see their characteristics and they were not in compliance, or you couldn't determine their characteristics because you lacked sufficient reports and paperwork. I believe the latter may be true of the drainage calculations. There was some additional information that needed to be received in order to calculate it. But overall, most of the concerns were matters where I can see how they will be resolved. Okay. Next email. Thank you. Appreciate it. Yes, sir. Commissioner Ellis, I believe I saw your hand up. Yeah, I was just confirming that. Is it 217 that is the request for the extension? Yes, ma'am. Is there any other questions for Shawn on this item? Great. Thank you very much, Shawn. Sir. All right, that moves us into our three public hearing items for this evening, starting with Shawn's item, actually, five AS 20 dash 0010. Shawn, the floor is back to you when you're ready. Thank you, sir. Let me make sure I pull up that presentation here. Okay. Good evening, Mr. Chair and members of the Planning and Zoning Commission. Again, I am Shawn Jacobson, Assistant Planner here to present item S2010, the 400 South Elm Bar Use. This is a specific use permit to permit a bar tavern or lounge use on approximately .451 acres in the MN District. The previous use on this site was a major automotive repair use, and the site was vacant for approximately eight months before the applicant redeveloped the site and opened the current use, indoor recreation use, axe throwing and billiards. That opened on November 20th. One of the things that patrons are permitted to do at this time is bring in alcohol to consume on site, but this site does not currently operate a bar. They are proposing to add a bar tavern or lounge use, and that does require the specific use permit in the MN District. You can see their site plan here and north is to the right. This is an existing commercial building, and the applicant is not proposing to add anything to the building. The only changes proposed to the site itself are replacing some broken concrete with landscaping and restriping the parking lot, adding some additional spaces. They are limited in what they can do on the site because of the presence of the flood point. As I noted, there is a current, since November 20th, indoor recreation use, and this would be the addition of a second use. So again, we have our general approval criteria and our specific SUP criteria for approval that we consider. It's always important to look at our future land use map and then plan 2030. This property actually has two future land use designations, downtown Denton and downtown compatibility area. That downtown Denton designation is designed to provide a mix of context-sensitive uses, which include entertainment, commercial, residential, office, and then that compatibility area, as we've discussed before, is to provide that area of where residential and commercial meet. It includes commercial, but we want to see it be in a scale and form that's sensitive to the surrounding built context. The proposed use, along with the indoor recreation use, because they would of course be together, that provides a new entertainment and commercial use in this area in an existing commercial building. This would be consistent with our Denton Plan 2030 goal of providing commercial on a scale that fits the area. It also meets our goals of developing along corridors, along that Elm Street corridor, and strengthening existing commercial areas. So keeping businesses in those buildings rather than having them be vacant. This proposal also helps further the Denton Plan 2030 sound growth vision of downtown Denton energized by new entertainment, supporting day and nighttime activity, and a true urban lifestyle. We always have to consider compatibility with the surrounding area. As you can see, this is certainly a mixed-use area, and that South Elm corridor is a pattern that already includes a number of bars, some you can see there, some farther up, as well as restaurants that serve alcohol. What is proposed would be in that existing single-story building that has been there for decades. The proposed bar use would support that new indoor recreation use, as I said, and occupying an otherwise vacant building. I'll touch on this more in a moment, but the site redevelopment has included removing the vehicles that were stored in the rear as part of that major automotive repair use and which were previously adjacent, just with no separation, to the residential, so it's helped to improve that site. This running property is similarly zoned and is mostly developed. The addition of this use isn't expected to limit future redevelopment of the area. And as you can see here, this is that rear yard prior to the redevelopment. You have cars, whether employee cars or cars that are being repaired, which is right next door to that. Those are now gone. I just want to look at how potential negative impacts of this use would be mitigated. Just on a general level, this would enable and help the staff of the business to carefully monitor alcohol consumption. Right now, folks can bring in beer or wine to drink, and of course, staff do everything they can to monitor that, but being able to sell it would allow them to set careful minimums and bring them under TABC supervision. We've also provided and the applicant supports a condition of approval that alcohol and sale and service would be limited to beer and wine, so we wouldn't be talking about any type of liquor as part of this approval, and that was something that neighbors expressed a concern about in the neighborhood meeting as well, they prefer just beer and wine. In terms of visual impacts, the redevelopment, as you can see here, involved, as we discussed, removing the vehicles from behind the building. It also means we no longer have open bay doors. Those have been covered over with sort of replicated barn doors, so you're not going by and having vehicles being repaired on site in your neighborhood. They've also replaced what was broken cement with a landscape area. In terms of noise and traffic impacts, vehicles can only exit this site onto South Elm Street, which of course, funnels them away from any of the adjacent residential, and the site plan limits parking to that front lot. The applicant has also supported a condition of approval that staff has recommended that sale and consumption of alcohol be limited to the interior of the building only. Also the dumpster will be maintained in the front yard rather than being moved to the rear yard, which would have put it directly adjacent to the residential properties there. In terms of public facilities, specifically reached out to emergency services because there is another ax throwing venue in Denton, Ironwood Ax Throwing on Hickory Street, just asked if they had any emergency service calls, that's been open since December 2019. They've had no calls to that address, and they expressed no specific concerns about adding the requested bar use to the venue. In terms of transportation, as you can see here, weekday, their estimate is an average of 53.58 daily trips on weekends, get about 123 average daily trips on Saturday, 36 on Sunday. They are fronting on a primary arterial and there was no TIA that was necessitated by this number of trips. Solid waste service can continue to be provided through the dumpster on site, water and wastewater in place, new infrastructures needed. Of course, it's always really important to look at the neighborhood response, we sent out all of our standard notices, we did receive four responses in favor, you can see that includes many of their properties directly adjacent to the property requesting the specific use permit. There was a neighborhood zoom meeting, two attendees came and they were those folks that lived right next door to the north and south. Their concerns, they expressed, were addressed by the restriction to indoor only service and not having liquor. They specifically said they did not oppose adding the bar use as it was proposed by the applicant. So taking all of these things into consideration, staff recommends approval with the following conditions as it's consistent with Denton Plan 2030 meets the criteria for approval. Those conditions are that the sale and consumption of alcoholic beverages shall be limited to the interior of the building and that alcohol, sale and service will be limited to beer and wine and will not include hard liquor. With that, I will take any questions you all have. Any questions for Sean? This is just an education question from my ignorance. I assume there's sort of a percent alcohol definition that's the actual threshold rather than the kind of beverage. So that would be something that would be set by the actual license that could be obtained by the business based on the definition of wine or beer versus liquor. I believe it's just based on the type of permit they'd be able to obtain. Thank you. Hey Sean, can you tell me the kind of the context, the rationale behind selling it only on the interior of the building is are there places in town, I mean, I'm thinking like patios that's probably still under the roof line. Is that included or maybe can you help me understand what that means and why it's a condition? So in this case, this would not include under a patio or in that backyard area. The applicant felt that because due to the floodplain they can't put up any sort of fencing between them and the neighbors in the back that it would not be a particularly neighborly proposition to have activities out there at this time. That might be something that could change in the future. And the applicant was also taking into consideration just some fire code standards that could be triggered based on the number of occupants and so they chose not to use that patio area out front at this time. Gotcha. Entirely within and I will say that was also something that was brought up in the neighborhood meeting that the neighbors appreciated that they wouldn't have folks outside adjacent to their residences. And then this is kind of tangential but the city has reworked a lot of that drainage in that kind of corridor. Is it expected that floodplain will persist? Maybe it's not relevant to this conversation but I am curious. We just redid all that drainage to I thought remove some of the floodplain designation. I know Access Bank wanted to build a parking lot and there's some other things kind of happening in the South Elm area. Is there any progress on changing that floodplain there? Did actually we were I was able to speak with Michael Smith for our floodplain administrator as part of this and there is certainly work ongoing that will result in that property eventually in two stages moving out of the floodplain but until the actual designation is addressed there's still under restriction about where they can put in place but there's definitely work ongoing and like I say it will be in that property it will be in two phases that it will come out of the floodplain at least based on the plans that I've seen. Gotcha. Okay. Thanks for that update. Commissioner Ellis. Thank you Chair. Sean can you give any details about the neighborhood meeting? How many people were there? Was there any direct opposition to the request? Certainly. There were two residents that were there and they were I believe their resident directly to the south who has a business and also lives there and then to the northwest. They had a number of questions but basically they expressed that their concerns were satisfied but what they had heard and when I asked them directly they said they had no opposition to this request as described. Thank you. Any other questions for Sean? Richard? I was just going to have if Sean you can explain the neighbor directly to the west that might since we we haven't received anything from them it might help also put that in perspective. Certainly. The neighbor directly to the west is actually the owner of this property and is technically the signed the applicant is the person operating more but the owner of this property is actually had to sign off on this SUP being submitted so the support is understood to be there because it's the same property owner. Makes sense. Makes for that extra context. Any other questions for item 5A with Sean? Christian or Beck? Thank you Chair. So I know Ironwood is the axe throwing is all inside. Is the axe throwing all inside on this one? Yes sir. Okay that okay that's it thank you. Any other questions? Great. Thank you Sean for the presentation. Before we move on to item 5B I just want to let the record show that Commissioner Anderson has joined us and we are on item 5B as in Bravo Z20-0013 and I'll invite Julie Wyatt for presentation. Good evening let me pull up my presentation. Good evening I'm Julie Wyatt senior planner with the City of Denton and for this item I'm presenting Z20-0013 loves travel stop. So the request before you is to rezone the subject site outlined in yellow from general office and mixed use regional districts to highway corridor district. The property is developed as a loves travel stop. I mean the purpose is to facilitate the continued use and restoration of that existing travel plaza after a text dot right of way acquisition that's going to be coming forward soon. So some background on the property before we talk about the zoning case. This property was actually the subject of a zoning request in 2015 that rezoned the property from RCCN to ECC to facilitate the development of the use. The use was developed in 2017 and 2018. At that time it was under the 2002 code and we didn't have a use that fully encapsulated the entire facility. Actually what we did under the 2002 code is we looked at the activities that were associated with the use retail sales drive through restaurant car wash those sorts of things and we looked to see if they were permitted and that's how the use was classified to capture those activities. So that that loves travel stop was constructed in 2019. As you know we adopted the 2019 development code and within that that new code we had a new use. So instead of having all of those disparate uses and we now have one use that describes the entire site and that's travel plaza. So it includes all of those things like gas station parking rest stop other services to motors to motorists. With the 2019 code that the zoning for the site also transitioned to geo and MR districts for that that transition table which made this use non-conforming. So now it brings us to the present text dot has approached the property. They are going to be acquiring a strip of property along the frontage and that's going to be that's going to require the removal of some landscaping parking and also a portion of that fuel canopy and so in order to restore the site the property owner has purchased an additional four point seven acres just to the west of the site and will and is pursuing the rezoning in order to kind of restore that site. So now we'll get to this current request. So you see the current zoning map showing that combination of MR and geo districts and then the proposed zoning of that HC district in red. The criteria for approval are in subchapter two of the debt and development code and we'll kind of touch on those as we talk about the project. The site is in is in a business innovation feature land use designation that's intended for large tracts of land for employment parks and employment uses also supporting uses such as retail hotels and residential so that commercial piece. Given this site's location next to I-35 the HC district is consistent with the future land use map. It really was kind of made for this kind of location along a highway and it does allow for the development of both employment uses as well as those supporting commercial uses at those highway scales. Another thing we're going to touch on is significant changes to warrant the change with that implementation of the 2019 debt and development code the site did become nonconforming and so and then and as I talked about with that present condition they are going to need to make some changes to the site to accommodate that textile right of way acquisition so so really that is what's precipitating this zoning change. We looked at that impacts regarding the surrounding properties as I stated HC HC district is appropriate in this area. This is this is kind of at the intersection of I-35 as well as highway 77 to the east of the site. It's the area has a lot of undeveloped property but it also has a lot of transportation related uses so just north of the site there's a truck wash just due east to the site. There's another travel stop and as this area develops staff does anticipate that properties adjacent to I-35 will develop with those commercial unemployment uses that you typically find along highways and which are permitted in the HC district. And one other thing to note this is in a gateway area within the city and so HC does require those commercial design standards so we want to make sure that our gateways look nice and that they look that they're developed in a way that that we we expect commercial development to to to move forward. One other thing I want to touch on and that is public facilities. This isn't introducing a new use to this intersection it really is just maintaining that existing use at its current scale. There is adequate access to the property from I-35 no additional trips are anticipated. Barthold Road is is anticipated to be improved adjacent to the site in the next two to three years I-35 will eventually expand north and from University and capture this site and as you can see on on your screen that access road will take in that the front area of that loves Barthold Road will will be expanded to three lanes each way with some turn lanes so those are those are transportation improvements that are expected in the future. And as I said because it's not a redevelopment of the site they'll just maintain their existing water and sewer lines. Public outreach was sent out we received one letter in favor and that is for the site just to the north of the subject property. Staff recommends the approval of the request we do anticipate it to go to the February 16th City Council meeting and I'll be happy to stand for any questions. So any questions for Julie. Thanks Julie are they going to lose the car wash on the north side once they expand that roadway the new expansion that Barthold Road. Oh you know I don't I have not looked into that as far as the that property just north of Barthold. I haven't looked at that is terms of where the I-35 impact will potentially cause any requirements for that site so so if it does I'm sure it will be forthcoming soon but I'm not sure as of now. Gotcha thank you very much I just was this I'm sure when they were developing that loves did they not take in consideration that service road going that was going to go in I mean it seems like they're going to spend a lot of money to fix something if they would have just waited a few months or so you know they could have done it the right way the first time. You know I have I'm not exactly sure I wasn't involved in the project at that time but you know given the the continued expansion of I-35 I'm not sure if those plans had been drawn up at that time so I'm I you know we we do try to work with applicants to make sure that they're aware of future changes but you know I'm not sure if they were available at that time. No problem thank you very much. Any other questions for Julie hey Julie was this an imminent domain or they voluntarily sell this to TextDOT? I'm not sure typically we we do hear from property owners where TextDOT reaches out and they they they work with TextDOT to figure out the best way to to approach this I'm not sure how that's working out in this instance what sort of negotiations they've had with TextDOT thus far. To Commissioner Anderson's point it kind of frames my thought process around this more if they like voluntarily entered into redoing their entire project or if this is kind of a response to not having an option. We are there a representative for the applicant is supposed to be calling in tonight so he may be able to provide more information regarding that for you tonight. And the other question I had Julie and this is more of a global city question in terms of planning is we have another item on the same street coming up next and we think about that intersection I believe is is a deep dark circle on like the mobility plan you said they call it a gateway right so this one South I-35E and I think I-35W are these main entrances and maybe on 380 these are the main entrances in the city and it seems like we have planned for or resigned ourselves to a gateway part of the north just being a truck Mecca all things truck stop truck wash and I'm curious if if this is like a resignation of the city that this is what we want our gateway from Oklahoma to be or if I just don't know how the city views and maybe you can help inform me on how they planned or was the vision of what a gateway was supposed to look like with did it have aesthetics or is it just like there's gonna be a lot of people here let's just note it on a map I just love to know what a gateway is supposed to be if it has that designation so our didn't plan 2030 identified several areas and they globally called them focus areas so it would be and I'm referring to my dent plan right now centers corridors gateways and branding stations and then travel centers so so they did provide for these or looked at these areas and and and indicated those are areas that should be planned through small area plans in the future so as we are continuing to implement our dent and plan 2030 and update our twin dent and plan 2030 we are you know we should be looking at these areas in terms of design and part of and part of the the intent of having those commercial design standards at these gateway areas is to ensure that they will be designed in a commercial way you know we look long and hard when somebody wants to come in with a specific zoning district to make sure it would be designed in accordance with with what we would deem to be commercial or office standards so that's kind of how we've looked at approached it thus far but in the future there may be additional small area plans that the city undertakes in order to look at specific standards for these these different focus areas I think that answer my question probably not to my full satisfaction but that's okay I I will just say I think Denton is an economically diverse interesting place between the colleges and Peterbilt and all what's happening in the industrial park and I mean we have a myriad of things to showcase and I certainly it's it's very well aware if you're driving up I-35E one of the first businesses to Denton is Buckeyes if you're driving up I-35W one of the last businesses before you get to Denton is Buckeyes if you're driving in from Gainesville down to Denton one of the first things you see when you crossing the borders is love's truck stop and I don't want Denton to be known as people who drive through our town as man they got a lot of gas and fueling stations when we have a very vast diversity of economy that I like to showcase to those just driving through Denton I think the project we approved a couple weeks ago behind Acme Brick gets us you know closer to showcasing those things and so I just think maybe we should get a small area plan in place for the northeastern part of Elm and 35 sooner rather than later so we can actually as a city start planning what we want that gateway and what we want our introduction to the city to be more than reacting to companies rightfully wanting to drive economic action in town I think this is great for our economy the next project seems to be economically positive but if if the idea is to have a small area plan for these centers then I would say let's go ahead and start that process especially since we have it seems like a little bit of an open quadrant at that intersection north of town Chris you're back in the thank you chair in the interest of discussion real briefly then what what would you envision I mean are you in you know envisioning you know I mean what would be your recommendation if you want if you were you know Lord Governor of the city I like where that was heading so off the cuff I just said we have a zone the future land use maps as business innovation in that area and so I would want business innovation however that looks like and I think when it was first pitched to me my understanding of what business innovation is was like more corporate campus type infrastructure large buildings I bring in a diversity of jobs keep residents from commuting out of Denton but house tops staying in Denton and so if I could wave a magic wand I would I would want like a corporate headquarters to to be competitive with with Frisco we were losing a ton of business campuses that are just you know buildings to other cities and I would love to win some of those and we have a designated spot in our city to build those and so I'm not saying that a loves truck stop is not an economic driver of our city I just don't know if I historically or contextually would define that as business innovation and I would love to attract I know we have a thriving ed tech market kind of downtown in our city there's there's industries that I think we can we can more actively approach and lure in I'm not talking about tax abatement or anything else but I'm just talking about getting diversity into our town in the way that keeps our house tops in Denton for eating and working and living I think that's admirable and I'm I'm not pushing back at all the reason I asked my question chair was those are businesses there now and sort of to put a to put an Apple ask Google Oracle ask campus right there means we have to build north of it or south of it and and we we I mean I don't see a reason to to D travel Plaza the intersection you know unless that's actually what you're advocating is to is the eventual D truck detruckment of that intersection no no no I think that that truck intersection has been a lot of ways symbolic of the north side of town and I think it adds to the culture as you go into cram and things like that I certainly don't want to D truck the intersection but I'm saying I would like to showcase the diversity of our economy for for the sake of fuel who is driving through town or or thinking about moving to Denton that we have the ability to showcase on the biggest road in our in our town Christopher Cole lecture that area has been a truck Mecca for over 40 years so this is nothing new I mean this has been there since I was a little child all that so I mean it's a trucking area always has been a trucking area you know I mean we've got these manufacturers down Tetra Pak Peterbilt you got to have to have a trucking area I mean somewhere and it's been there for damn near over 45 years and I don't you know I'm not panicked about it you know I think it's it's expected that's where I would expect to go you know just because you know I mean there were more truck stops there back in the day you know that whole thing was all nothing but truck stops so I just wanted to throw that history out there so there's nothing new yeah Christopher I really appreciate that I'm not anti truck stop at all and and it's been there and I'd love to keep it there I'm not against this project either I just I guess my core fear as I look at the city is we have this area of business innovation if it just comes truck stops is that a deterrent for other companies coming in I don't know it wouldn't be for me necessarily I just if we have a lot of semis just parking there overnight and and cluttering the the kind of smaller roads on Elm right there is it a turn for expansion outside of the of the trucking industry or if didn't wants to be like known as like the truck capital of Texas then let's just own it I'm not trying to assess opinion on that rather just trying to figure out what business innovation is and what a gateway to the city is Christian Smith thank you not to belabor the point and the last from any other work session as we need to get to but I think just I would want to second the chairs recommendation maybe council if we can start maybe learn council staff we can start looking at a small area plan especially with that really truly being as 100 coal ranch down 35w begins to expand I mean that really is going to be the gateway for both east and west future Denton and so I think it might be important and I if you know to answer Commissioner Beck's point if if I had a magic wand for for Commissioner Rosella way if I you know a nice rest stop I mean I know it's still trucking but something that's a nice visitor center something that's that maybe even a park something that's that's there that that'd be welcoming to the travelers to stop down as you're at the loves they go across the street to a really nice city park something like that I mean there's a there's a number of different things we could do that would be that would be welcoming and inclusive so um yeah just an idea thank you Smith uh Commissioner Ellis thank you chair yeah and just to offer my two cents on that you know I had brought up with staff earlier the the mention of the word gateway and what that means and does staff take that into consideration when considering some of these requests and to chair's point and Commissioner Smith's point I mean you got to have a vision for what a gateway is right and a gateway certainly should be welcoming and if what we're putting in there are transient things like trucks and truck stops and things that kind of pass through a city that's not really welcoming um so we if we're going to designate something as a gateway and I believe this area we have um I know on a small area plan committee I was on we picked the gateways of the city um and if we are going to designate that we should have some kind of plan for them so that it makes decisions we make for the future easier if we know what we want there in future development thank you Commissioner Ellis Commissioner Smith I'm sorry and as as Commissioner Ellis was was talking there I mean even more so we have the the high school is going to be going in there we've seen more and more developments that are coming up 428 and along that north side of 288 there that we're probably gonna have some home home developments up that area at some point in time too so yeah I think I think even though this has nothing to do with the zoning request I think it it brings up an idea to us in the commission that we maybe need to point out the city now that a small area plan probably is a good time for us start discussing this Christian back yeah I am actually I I take everyone's point that that's saying that I would like a better you know Oklahoma side uh Gainesville side gateway to Denton then then then maybe an industrial truck stop my my point to to chair earlier was simply that you know if we're going to have a small area plan if we want to have a beautification plan and you don't think a a trucking center is compatible then you're eventually talking about the detruckment if I can use my own word uh that I coined 10 minutes ago uh of that region if if if if trucking is incompatible with the vision then then we might as well do the hard math now until these businesses out you go um which I don't I don't know of a mechanism to do that but um other you know otherwise I would say take chair's point and and the other commissioner's point and and develop a small area plan just north of it or just south of it um but uh I'm not I'm not comfortable you know telling telling this this trucking area that you have to detruck so anyway I don't want to get in we're we're we're way off in the weeds here so well I appreciate the engagement of the discussion I can certainly add this I'll I'll be adding this to the matrix uh in a couple hours uh to revisit more in depth Richard do you have something to add the only thing I wanted to add this will be back in the very very near future this will be one of those items that we're going to discuss as part of the comp plan update and so we just had our sort of pre-kickoff meeting with with the consultant last week and so this will be in front of you sooner than later but I think on a much on a much larger scale as well and I think we need to look even a little broader in the past you know we've had these areas even um land use our our rural or rural areas um this area part part partly has that with that rural area zoning where we really didn't capture um how we wanted to see the city grow and so uh we we do we get into these reactionary um uh moments when when we get a project in uh and it kind of gives us a hard it's hard for us sometimes to analyze it because we don't have anything to analyze it with because we've always had these areas as the holding you know as the holding zone or the holding area well um it's no longer the holding area that this is where development is occurring and um I think as a city as we grow we just need to really keep that keep that focus on um how we designate these areas from a land use and and the appropriate zoning um and and again going back to the difference between il versus go why they both do allow similar uses um the go does put in in place those those design requirements um so that was one of the big the big components at least to this um to this proposal if that if that helps at all yeah thanks richard look forward to coming back and i just think to summarize uh kind of my point is i'd rather the city maintain a position of proactivity and control uh planning vision forecasting than uh being reactive all the time and then this area kind of highlights that for me uh julie thank you for the presentation you have one more uh that's item 5c uh it's pd 20-002a um and you have the floor when ready all right uh can everyone see my presentation yes okay so this is pd 20 0002 hershbach so we're staying in the same area that we were talking about earlier this request is a zoning change from general office and rural residential districts to a planned development district on 90 acres the purpose of the pd is to define a new use fleet service provider and the use specific standards associated with it and provide a development plan for 38 acres um with 52 acres remaining for future development so the current zoning map shows the subject site here outlined in black you've got the go along the frontage of highway 77 and loop 288 with uh rural residential on the north side of the property um it would if approved transition to pd with go as the base zoning district um overall uh the this is the pd overall the phase one would be the proposed fleet service provider um and uh the definition is in your backup it's a business that supports the movement of goods um by means of truck transport and is not open to the general public primary activities would include driver training support services company administration uh customer support sales accessory uses would be fleet storage maintenance facilities fuel station and truck wash base the definition excludes warehousing storage or transfer of goods and this and um and i just reiterate this this use would not be open to the public so this is a little different than the use that we talked about earlier where that travel plaza is open um to the general motoring public this would be just for the employees of that business um it includes use specific standards for that for buffers um and then phase two because it's in a pd any development of that remaining acreage would require a major pd amendment and approval by the planning and zoning commission and city council through the dual public hearing process um just to give you a lay of the land as far as the the surrounding roadway network um it is the site the subject property we're talking about today is um is adjacent to highway 77 with that specific phase one just fronting on 77 um the larger development also includes frontage along loop 288 and bonnie bray bonnie bray is designated as an arterial however in that area if you have driven it lately it is it is not designed to those arterial standards as of now um and it is near the i-35 corridor it's about 2900 feet from that intersection of highway 77 and i-35 um the pd standards would follow the go standards um and um and including uh that phase one hey julie can interrupt real fast i think commissioner beck has a question sure you're on mute oh there you go yep sorry uh there we go uh yeah no this this actually this this slide is is just as good as the previous one um are we defining this use with this action or is fleet service provider previously defined it is not previously defined great question so um this that the intent of this pd is to kind of define that use and um and uh and seek approval of a development plan for that use uh the code doesn't really have a use that adequately captures um what they're proposing to do so if you recall in my previous presentation where that travel plaza used we used we looked at all of the different uses that would um go on those activities that would go on the on that site and we sort of just kind of all lumped them together um with the new code we created one use that captured everything um this pd kind of does the same thing it's creating a use that captures all of the activities um but also provides those limitations on it and that limitation being that it's not open to the general public and those additional buffer standards so that is the intent of this of this pd so um just just to clarify if any future if if uh if chair waves his magic wand and we become the trucking mecca of of north texas um this would be the standard we would use for um competitive fleet service provision in denton and other locations um this is a this is a use that we are considering as part of of our refinement of our 2019 code to potentially adding in there um um for for other developments but as of now approval of this pd would not permit approval of this use in any other place but right here so we're not we're not so i'm confused now i'm not trying to be aggressive or anything are we setting a standard for fleet service provision or are we not setting a standard for fleet service provision we are setting um as part of this um we are setting that definition kind of how we're we're approaching that definition but it is not generally applicable throughout the city at this time am i okay does that make all right richard may want to jump in here if i may help a little bit there's a there's a provision in the ddc um chapter uh sub chapter five uh 524 that allows um for the director to um classify or create new uses uh in in addition with that established use specific standards when when they first approached us we were not comfortable just allowing this use um because it didn't quite fit um with with that travel plaza anymore we didn't want to allow these everywhere and so that's where it was sort of the creation of this new use um given this parcel it was through through a pd um that way it gives us some time to further examine it and then if we need to establish use specific standards or require an sup i think that'll be something that will be discussed later as we uh as we look at the refinement of the ddc over the next couple months and so i guess the follow-up question is are these use standards um based on the request of the developer and these are the kinds of uses that they would like to see because they're creating it and we're therefore setting our standard to match their creation or these based on sort of mpa based definitions of of fleet service provision that you know many cities kind of use again i'm you know i'm just trying to understand you know as as we develop new uses where where where are they coming from and and what and you know or are we creating them on the fly to match a development the challenges in the past these have been identified as a as a travel plaza we further define travel plaza to exclude these types of uses because they would be they could be permitted everywhere um part of the challenge is um you know new uses pop up all all the time and so for me it's let's let's just call it what it is um define it that way and that way it's clear um and and avoid any vagueness or ambiguity um define the use and then as we add it you know add it into the ddc but then at that point it's up do we want to allow it as as a by right um with you specific standards or through a through an sup in in this particular instance it was related to this parcel while it had the go we're not saying that it should go um in go but it incorporated with this pd provided you know the the variety of of items that that are that julie will go through um we felt as though it it it could be appropriate at this location hey thanks guys i appreciate it a follow-up to that richard that maybe you can clarify if this and maybe commissioner beck was asking the same question i didn't interpret the answer if if we added a use for fleet services to the table would it be permitted in go would it require an sup in go and then if it's the latter why are we using a pd and not an sup in geo i'm confused when i think about the chart of uses per zoning category is is the fleet service provider as you see it in in the chart the matrix would it fall under go and then if it does what letter would be in that cell would it be permitted sup what how do you envision this i think it'll be part of that that that broader policy discussion but but for me to me it would be more appropriate in in the industrial some of the whether it be heavy industrial um at that point we were we were not wanting to support a a zoning change to to that type of uh district i'm kind of going back before the the go while it does allow for some of those industrial just um uses uh it does require uh site design standards where the industrial districts do not and so um we were again it it is located across the street um looking at their current facility it doesn't seem to be too noxious of a use but i think that's one of those as we as we kind of um move down move down the ladder on on refining these um the ddc that'll be part of that overall discussion beginning at dcrc and where where should some of these new uses where does it make sense and where is it appropriate so if i could um repeat back what i heard just so i understood it it sounds like the city in general is okay with fleet services being at this location but they were hesitant on just rezoning it industrial because all uses under industrial would not necessarily be supported but this particular one the city would support in this general location did i understand that correctly in a so in association with the pd exactly where right correct refining the use to exactly the land use that the applicants wanting correct but not necessarily setting that as the standard we may want to include additional standards as we as we look at parcels that could or could not develop and so it may end up being being an sup um but again that i think that'll just take a a much larger discussion um yeah regardless of this vote tonight it sounds like there's a lot of discussion that needs to be happening around this commissioner cole you had your hand up before mr alice so richard you said basically they're just moving across the street expanding and moving across the street correct so that use is already across the street correct okay thank you commissioner alice thank you chair yeah so richard julie i so i guess what the pd is doing is trying to make this use that we don't have defined fit into a geo zoning standard of building i have that correct yep as the basin i know julie has a number of a lot more slides that will probably answer some of those questions okay yeah i can't feel can't help but feel like it's a little bit of a manipulation of the code in a way um that i'm not sure that it is really a good thing for our city to be doing um but at any rate i know we have a lot more presentation to hear so um i'll stop talking so we can do that uh julie back to you all right so um so the the pd would have to follow all of geo development standards and dimensional standards and use standards and then the the fleet services use also um i've got on there that phase one um they they're meeting that tree preservation requirement um the landscaping they are providing those additional buffers along um the the uh the west north and east property lines um they are so are also providing um overall tree canopy that's that's actually exceeds geo um given the the trees that they're proposed to plant as well as the um the existing canopy it's about 41 of the lot um and uh and then any development on the site would have to any buildings would have to conform to um the ddc section 7.10.5 which is the which are those commercial development standards they're also proposing some open space recreation amenities um and we'll talk about those um the one change to the permitted uses um once again is inclusion with that uh fleet service provider so um so just wanted to talk about their site plan briefly they are proposing um first the area in green is their 24 000 square foot administration and support building um it would include uh company offices conference rooms uh training rooms exercise space laundry facilities day rooms and changing rooms places for their drivers to use it includes as proposed in 19 000 square foot uh inspection and truck wash here a truck repair shop in this location and those more intense uses are located toward the rear of the property behind some existing trees and and parking lot screening they're also proposing a walking loop for their drivers in this location fenced dog park to be um to be in this general location long-term car storage as well as tractor trailer storage toward the rear of the property um and then 123 parking spaces um for for visitors um for that office space and then two access driveways to highway 77 so as we talked about earlier the site has frontage to highway 77 and that's where access would come from here is just a brief discussion of their landscape plan uh this this uh west property line would include a 30-foot landscape buffer with the north and east property lines showing a 20-foot landscape buffer within that area three ornamental trees would need to need to be planted every 25 linear feet uh 474 additional ornamental trees um i'm sorry which would include which would be for a total of 474 additional ornamental trees plus one large canopy tree every 30 linear feet we want to make sure that those buffers have a substantial amount of landscaping material in them so that they screen those those more intense uses on to the rear of the site and those need to be at least 50 evergreen once again we want to make sure that they that there's adequate screening in the winter time as well two bioswales are proposed along the subject property their detention pond is located here and there's a bioswale proposed here and then in this location the code defines a bioswale is a vegetated channel designed to transport store and allow for infiltration of water as a landscape feature to allow that water to be cleaned especially adjacent to some of that impervious area and once again i talked about that mature tree canopy there's also a substantial amount of tree preservation along um this area here it's kind of separating that admin building from um that that more maintenance area and then right-of-way screening in accordance with um the uh the dent in development code uh the criteria for approval is in sub chapter two um in summary the project is consistent with the general criteria um but we're going to kind of go we're going to touch on these as we move forward with the development with the um discussion of the property and then there is specific criteria for approval for pd's um so first of all we're going to talk about dent plan 2030 um i we're uh we're kind of still in in that business innovation discussion um as stated before that's kind of intended for those large tracts of plan um for well-planned um larger scale office and employment uses with those supporting uses go and li are typically the districts that we look at i know we talked earlier about hc but but typically we see geo and li within business innovation they are proposing that base zoning of geo which is consistent with the future land use map but as we look at the differences between geo and li we we really gravitate toward geo on these more visible corridors because it does come with those commercial and office development standards as well as that minimum tree canopy of 30 overall just so make sure that our corridors are developed with those higher development standards and then i want to talk about the overall goals with the dent plan 2030 so it also brings in element six and that's our mobility element and our mobility element talks about freight transportation is a key economic component of the region it provides a statistic that 98 percent of the u.s mainland population can be reached from that i-35 corridor and when you think about denton's location um on the uh on the north side of the metro area along that i-35 corridor you can you can reach you can go north and hit i-40 or i-70 and and and and highways to the north really reaching a lot of the united states from from denton there's a goal m2 and that we want to enhance denton's economy by supporting the city's freight network but we want to be careful about where we place these that these that freight routes and and these types of uses should be separated from our smaller scale walkable areas of their city that more fine grain development and this proposal is consistent with element six because it provides for that freight for freight drivers and that employment use but it is on that fringe it is on the outskirts um to uh with direct access to a primary primary arterial and that i-35 corridor and so it would provide that access with that um with that limited disruption to our more dense areas we also looked at impacts to the surrounding property and we separated that we looked at current development and then we also looked at future development so first let me talk about current development um as we sort of talked about this general area the existing developments along i-35 and highway 77 um really do um support and complement our transportation and freight activities we have we have across the street we have the that existing hershbach um location that they are proposing to transfer to this site we've got logistics and fleet services in addition on the south side we've got the travel plazas at the intersection of 35 and highway 77 and truck wash in that general area we've also got commercial development along i-35 and office development um to the north of the subject property we've got some rural residential and then we've got and to the south we've got some future residential and so we and then we have a lot of undeveloped property in in the area so um so before we get to the future development i just want to show you some site photos um and i've i've moved my pictures around so my star doesn't quite match where it should but the subject site is generally in this area you can kind of see that landmark of of of those tree area um and here is um from the north looking south toward highway 77 and loop 288 and and it is pretty undeveloped um i know there's a lot going on south of the subject property but we've here you can kind of see where those travel uses are and here's kind of some pictures of their current facility along highway 77 and then this is looking to the east from from the i-35 corridor and once again you can kind of see those transportation uses with that that undeveloped area surrounding the subject property so now we want to talk about because we've kind of seen that there's a lot of undeveloped area what the what the future development will is may look like so to the west and northwest of the site you've got geo district so that suggests that future development will be consistent with the proposed permitted uses within that base zoning district and that development scale so we do anticipate more compatible uses as you move toward i-35 southwest of the site we have pd 142 in this location um i know you can't see it but y'all may be familiar this is that commercial center that stonehill center here um i'm sorry that is down to the south but we do have we do have pd 142 which anticipates um uh more uh commercial or maybe light industrial office uses um within that pd right here um to the north of the site we've got our district that future with the future land use designation that's consistent with the subject property um the the site is currently or that area to the north of the site is currently used for agricultural purposes but current zoning generally permits single family community or agricultural uses that's why that buffer coming in is really important because we want to make sure that any visual impacts for those parking areas would be reduced to the south as a subject site you've got that rcc uh i'm sorry that mr district which is sort of that regional commercial district and then you've got some public facilities with university uses um and then i want to look um just i discussed briefly the hills of denton there's a master plan community just to the east of the subject property um it's not developed yet but it does have a concept plan associated with that master plan community on the subject property is here outlined in blue and those areas adjacent to bonnie bray here as well as loot 288 indicate or or permit office and commercial uses and those are intended for retail restaurant those commercial uses as well as office and some light industrial uses so the proposed geo district would be consistent with that develop type of development um provides greater building building design amenities and connectivity so generally the development must be consistent with the geo standards and that would be for that especially for that future phase two more specific to the fleet service provider they are looking to provide those additional buffers to those adjacent undeveloped properties providing additional tree canopy in excess of what geo requires it's it's actually more consistent with what we see in maybe our mn district and that they're proposing with the new and preserved canopy about 41 percent and this would be an increase of existing canopy currently there's about 220 000 square feet of canopy on the site give or take and this would be this would increase that overall canopy so it really meets our helps further our goals for increasing the city's overall tree canopy and they're also providing open space recreation amenities for employees and that's that dog park as well as the walking areas um non-residential uses are they an appropriate area location and planning um so commercial and uh and appointment uses permitted within the pd are appropriate for the area given the surrounding commercial or development pattern as well as that zoning pattern the provoke the proposed use provides a variety of uses to support the employees so it does support that that business the development of the site does require that commercial design and landscaping standards and as i mentioned before those elements of the site that are a little more intense are set back from that right of way about 490 feet and are screened from those adjacent properties to mitigate any visual impacts for those for those more intense uses the there the nearest fire station is off of Windsor in this location and the use is consistent with the surrounding area is not expected to generate a significant increase in crime or nuisance issues water wastewater they will have to extend both water and sewer to the site and that water will have to be looped in accordance with our our engineering requirements there is an existing wastewater lift station in in this location that will have to be replaced to increase capacity and accommodate the proposed development the cost to construct any in this improvement will and any other improvements will be the responsibility of the developer so this is because this use is not open to the public it's only estimated to generate about 297 trips per day that's about 197 for that office use and then about 100 truck trips so this doesn't meet the thresholds for a tia sidewalks will be required along highway 77 as i mentioned there's those two access points along highway 77 no access to bonnie bray or loop 288 however if you're familiar with the access roads on loop 288 in this location there is a a ramp 277 near the subject site and highway 77 as i mentioned does connect to the i-35 corridor just northeast of the subject property i'm sorry northwest of the subject property so we have we did send out public notification we have received and and these these numbers may not be accurate because i believe we've received some additional responses as during the meeting but we have received about seven notices in opposition about eight in favor because of the opposition letters that we have received it is a 20 22 opposition which will require a super majority so six out of seven of council members must vote to approve or would have to vote in it to approve the project for it to be to for it to take effect so staff does recommend approval of the request as it complies with the criteria for approval and the city council public hearing is tentatively scheduled for february 16th and i'll be happy to answer any questions the applicant is here tonight and we'll be able to answer questions um during the regular meeting mr beck thank you chair uh julie can you go to slide 22 sure um okay yeah so um that has the elements of the uh the draft mobility plan on it and as i recall um uh i believe brian john was telling us we're we're expanding 288 to a a loop around the city and we're adding a secondary or secondary arterial approximately on the north side of the of the subject property um is and so i guess my question it relates to how how is the developer and or the city taking those 288 expansion and secondary arterial expansion into account when they're developing this property well the mobile there is a revision to the mobility plan that is currently under review right now um yes loop 288 will eventually extend so you can kind of see where it ends right now and it will eventually extend and go all the way to the west through the west side of the city and then eventually tag up i believe it vintage on the south side i think that project is is still a number of years away in addition currently right now there's not any arterials that are affecting this subject site except for bonnie bray um on on the for that undeveloped site um so right now it is it is not anticipated anticipated to affect the subject property of course with any new mobility plan changes or um or development of that remaining 52 acres uh would would have to take into account any of those mobile mobility changes i guess my question more went to if there was expansion of 288 um on the south uh eating into the frontage of the space too and if there was expansion of the arterial to the north eating into the frontage of that arterial or easement of that arterial in this case would is there sufficient buffer on those north and south locations that that the project could develop even with anticipated expansion sure i'm gonna i'm gonna go let me pull here this might be a better one so this the phase one um does not have any frontage along loop 288 right now there aren't any plans to expand loop 288 however when this phase develops there may be right-of-way dedication um to allow for frontage roads to be developed on loop 288 so there may be right-of-way dedication for that phase two um not only for loop 288 but also for bonnie bray and that will just kind of depend on that on any mobility changes and and those requirements once those do develop um at this time there are no proposed expansions for highway 77 they will have to they will have to install a sidewalk on highway 77 in accordance with our requirements but it is not anticipated to negatively affect that phase one thank you sure commissioner smith thank you chair um julia they're going to be doing a presentation the applicants will be doing a presentation during uh public correct yes sir okay this primarily and if the if the applicants listening in are watching and just wanting to know what they're going to do with the site that they're going to be vacating uh if it's just going to be an empty old fleet service site and they're going to sell it does somebody else give you more fleet service and we're going to have a bunch of fleet service in that area or what the intent would be with the the site they're vacating so thanks thank you commissioner smith any other questions for julie all right fantastic um that concludes our work session agenda items for this meeting we will reconvene at 6 34 regular meeting uh here on zoom so we will see you in 18 minutes thank you good evening ladies and gentlemen and welcome to the planning and zoning commission regular meeting for wednesday january 20th 2021 i'll call this meeting to order at 6 31 seeing that we do have a quorum please let the record show that commissioner prunetta is absent this evening the first item of business is uh to uh provide a pledge of allegiance to the u.s and texas flag commissioners you can feel free to unmute yourself if you'd like to join along i pledge allegiance to the flag of the united states of america and to the republic for which it stands one nation under god indivisible with liberty and justice honor the texas flag i pledge allegiance to the texas one state under god one and indivisible thank you the next item of business is to consider our minutes from january 6th commissioner smith make a motion to approve and commissioner alice second we have a first and a second for approval any discussion we'll call a vote be a roll call uh starting with commissioner smith aye commissioner alice aye commissioner beck aye commissioner anderson aye commissioner cole aye chair is also an aye motion carries six zero next item uh for consideration is the consent agenda we just have one item 3a fp 20-0029 commissioner smith make a motion to approve i christopher anderson a second we have a first and a second for approval any discussion scene nine i call for a vote via roll call starting the commissioner smith commissioner alice aye commissioner beck aye commissioner anderson aye commissioner cole aye chair is also an aye motion carries six zero next item for business is item 4a pp 20-0031 i'll invite sean jacobson for presentation the floor is yours sean when ready thank you mr chair pulling up my presentation now so okay good evening mr chair and members of the commission presenting preliminary plot 2031 the preliminary plot of the mayhill edition staff is recommending denial of this request at this time as it does not meet health requirements as outlined in exhibit two the applicant is requesting an extension to a date certain of february 17th and staff does not oppose this request with that i will take any questions christopher beck thank you chair uh sean can you reiterate what we talked about at work session with vis-a-vis the pedestrian and mobility access issues with this property certainly there was a question raised about whether pedestrian access had been provided from this property on to stockbridge the street leading to the south which has the connection to the med park station and in fact it does there is currently a labeling issue on the flatten of course we are recommending denial and that would be one thing that would be fixed when that labeling issue is fixed it'll be clear that pedestrian access is provided from this site directly to the pedestrian network leading to the med park station thank you sean and and i just like to say in general i know we're likely to to vote for an extension uh but does seem like there's a lot of work here um a lot of a lot of elements that staff caught that that caught my eye too and i i encourage the developers to um that they've got some homework to do at least for this commissioner anyway thank you is there any other questions for this item okay chair will certainly hear a motion commissioner smith make a motion to approve an extension to date certain of february 17 commissioner beck i'll second that we have first and a second to approve a 30-day extension to a date certain of february 17th 2021 any discussion seeing none i'll call for a vote via roll call starting with commissioner smith all right commissioner ellis aye commissioner beck aye commissioner anderson aye commissioner cole aye chair is also an aye motion carries six zero uh that next uh agenda item is item 5a this is the start of our public hearings item 5a is s 20-0010 this item is to be presented by sean jacobson the floor is yours thank you pull up my presentation all right good evening again mr chair and members of the planning and zoning commission my name is sean jacobson assistant planner presenting s 20-0010 the 400 south elm bar use this is a specific use permit request for a bar tavern or lounge use on approximately 0.451 acres in the mn district the previous use of this site was a major automotive repair use and the site was vacant for approximately eight months after that business closed at which time in november 20 the applicant opened the site after redeveloping it with an indoor recreation use specifically axe throwing and billiards one of the other things permitted here is that patrons can bring in alcohol to consume but it is not currently permitted to actually serve alcohol on the site and so in order to add that bar tavern lounge use in order to be able to serve alcohol the applicant is requesting that specific use permit you can see here the site plan north is to the right this is an existing commercial building and no additions are proposed in terms of building minimal site changes are proposed partly because the floodplain does not allow significant changes or any structures within it there are 18 parking spaces and one change of the applicant was able to make was to replace an area of broken up concrete with additional landscaping as you know we have our general approval criteria as well as our specific sup approval criteria to continue to consider as we're as you're deciding whether to approve this specific use permit one of the most important things we consider is our comprehensive plan and the future land use map this site is designated with two future land use designations downtown denton and downtown compatibility area the downtown denton designation that's to provide for a mix of context sensitive uses so that can include entertainment commercial residential office but designed in a way that fits the area and downtown compatibility area provides that kind of a meeting point between downtown residential and commercial areas and again the goal there is where there's commercial that it's in a scale and form that's sensitive to the surrounding built context in this case the bar and tavern and lounge use would be combining with the existing indoor recreation use to provide a new entertainment commercial use in an existing commercial building so something that's been there but bringing in that new use this use would be consistent with the goal of providing commercial on a scale that fits the area because we're not changing the existing building it's been there for a long time it also meets our denton plan 2030 goals of corridor development so it's along that south elm corridor as well as strengthening commercial areas by bringing in new businesses to baking buildings keeping those going lastly this use would also help further denton plan 2030's sound growth vision of downtown denton that is energized by a new entertainment which supports day and nighttime activity in a true urban lifestyle we'll still need to look at compatibility with the surrounding area as you can see this is truly a mixed use area as both commercial and residential in the south elm street corridor in particular has a pattern of development that includes both bars and restaurants that serve alcohol this proposed bar tavern lounge use as i said would support that new indoor recreation use and occupying otherwise vacant building additionally and i'll talk a little bit more about this in a minute but the site redevelopment for these new uses that's included removing vehicles from the rear of the yard that were there as part of the major automotive repair use and that actually helps improve the compatibility of this site with the area surrounding property is similarly zoned and it's mostly developed so this specific use if it's permitted not be expected to limit future redevelopment in the area as you can see here it's where those vehicles used to be under the old use used to be under the old use and they are no longer adjacent to that home just need to look at mitigating potential negative impacts just in general this being able to control the sale and service of alcohol with this use enables the staff of the business to carefully monitor consumption and it also applies texas alcohol beverage commission supervision to the business we're also recommending and the applicant has agreed to a condition of approval that alcohol sale and service would be limited to beer and wine would not include hard liquor distilled spirits in terms of mitigating potential visual impacts and the redevelopment of the site actually helped that as you can see besides the removal of the vehicles behind the building those bay doors that used to be there have been removed been replaced with full barn doors so you don't have open bay doors you don't have vehicle repair on site adjacent to neighboring residential and facing out onto the street as well as a replacement that broken cement with a new landscape area in terms of mitigating noise and traffic impacts as you can see there vehicles can only exit on the south elm street which as we know is one way which means they're funneled away to the south from the existing residential to the east and north parking as well as limited to the front lots you won't have people pulling out directly adjacent to folks houses and staff is also recommending and the applicant has agreed to a condition of approval that the sale and consumption of alcohol would be limited to the interior of the building so a lot of the potential for that noise impact would be mitigated in that way and in terms of refuse area the dumpster would be maintained in the front yard rather than being moved to the rear where it would have been adjacent to residential it was public facilities spoke specifically with emergency services because there is another ax throwing venue in denton on hickory street and it's they confirmed that in the time it's been open since december 2019 they've had zero calls for service to that location they expressed no specific concerns about adding proposed bar use to this property in terms of transportation impacts it's expected to average about 53 trips a day on weekdays on saturdays about 123 sundays about 36 at south elm street as a primary arterial this didn't require this wasn't the level of traffic impact that required a traffic impact analysis solid waste service could be provided due to dumpster already on site water and wastewater in place and of course we need to consider the surrounding neighborhoods so we sent out all the standard notices and signs we received four letters in favor as you can see there there was a neighborhood zoom meeting which was attended by two neighbors the concerns they expressed were in as as they said addressed by the limitations to indoor only service and not allowing liquor so limiting that to beer and wine and when asked directly they expressed no opposition to the bar use as proposed i do also want to note that as you can see there's a residential use immediately to the west of this property there's no response shown there that's in part because the same landowner owns the subject property and that adjacent residential property and signed off on this application as well may not have submitted specific approval but they're actually party to this request so with that staff is recommending approval with the following conditions since this use meets our criteria for approval and is consistent with fit and plan 2030 those conditions are that the sale and consumption of alcoholic beverages shall be limited to the interior of the building and then alcohol sale and service will be limited to beer and wine will not include hard liquor that'll stand for any questions and i know the applicant is also on the line and he has a presentation prepared as well great thank you shawn any questions for staff before we turn it over for applicant presentation okay if the applicant is on we'd love to see the presentation and as they're kind of loading up once the applicants are ready we would ask for your name and address for the record so mike are you there well so said that the applicant may not be on the call my apologies mr chair i'm not seeing the applicant on here that is totally fine uh in the interim i don't think i opened the public hearing so i probably should do that now um so let the public hearing open i might be closing it soon um shawn do you know if they're wanting to make a presentation and they just weren't here should we try to get in touch with them are they okay proceeding i want to be respectful to i think yeah i think he he may have misunderstood uh the call in time but uh i think he'll be fine if we proceed as well okay um all right so we don't have anyone calling on this so i'll go ahead and close the public hearing um and then we can have a motion put on the table and then the discussion around it commissioner smith make a motion to approve the staff recommendations great we have a first commissioner anderson i second the motion we have a first and a second for approval is there any discussion around this item seeing none i'll call for a vote via roll call starting with commissioner ellis aye commissioner beck aye commissioner anderson aye commissioner cole aye commissioner smith aye chair is also an aye motion carries six zero that brings us to our next item for discussion is item 5b z20-0013 this item will be presented by julie wyatt and i will open the public hearing julie whenever you're ready uh the floor is yours good evening just a moment i'll get that presentation pulled up so almost there all right here we go sorry about the delay okay this request before you is z20-0013 loves travel stop um the request is a rezoning from general office and mixed use regional districts to highway corridor district for the subject property outlined there in yellow the site is developed as loves travel stop and the purpose is to facilitate the continued use and restoration of that existing travel plaza after a text up right away uh acquisition that is forthcoming some background on the site uh in 2015 they pursued a rezoning request from rcc into ecc to facilitate the existing use um at that time we didn't have a clearly defined use for a travel plaza we sort of just looked at all of the activities on site um and and applied those to that um zoning and that and that development to capture those activities um so uh so they constructed the site in uh 2017 and 2018 in 2019 we adopted the uh the 2019 ddc and with that we actually captured all of those activities so we created that travel plaza use um that was more clearly defined and we also transitioned the zoning on the subject property um to that geo and mr districts as part of that new use and transition that use was made non-conforming um that brings us to the present uh text dot is acquiring a strip of property along the frontage of the site um and that will require some removal of landscaping parking and a portion of the fuel canopy in order to restore the site um the the property owner has purchased 4.7 acres um uh budding the western property line and they're pursuing the rezoning for the entire site so the current zoning map you i show here is um a light blue is that's the geo and then we've got mr surrounding and they are proposing to rezone this uh this corner to hc the criteria for approval for rezoning cases is in sub chapter 2 of the denton development code and we'll talk about these as we talk more about the project the site has a future land use designation per denton plan 2030 of business innovation this is intended for kind of employment uses large tracts of land that have office parks and employment parks but it also allows for supporting uses such as retail hotels and residential i'm given the location of the site adjacent to to the i-35 corridor hc is consistent with that future land use map because it does provide that supporting um commercial component to that business innovation um and and then furthermore just generally for the permitted uses of hd hc district it allows for the development of both employment and supporting commercial uses at that highway scale so it is consistent with that future land use designation um another criterion is significant changes to warrant the change implementation of the 2019 ddc as i mentioned did cause the site to become non-conforming and the proposed rezoning would just correct that issue allow the property owner to make changes to the property which result from the right-of-way acquisition and you can see just generally that area where i um text dot will acquire their outlined in blue minimizes adverse impacts on surrounding property this is a highway corridor and hc was sort of developed for this type of area and this type of use and it is appropriate in this area so the the surrounding development includes a truck wash to the north there's a travel plaza just due east of the subject site there's also future office to the north and there's other transportation related uses along highway 77 so the proposed use or the existing use is consistent with that surrounding development pattern as the area develops staff does anticipate the properties along i-35 will develop consistently with what's out there now in terms of that commercial and employment uses to you to use that access that that easy access onto i-35 as well as the visibility and hc does require commercial design standards because this is a visible corridor we want to make sure it's designed in a commercial way and so hc does does require that public facilities and services available to serve the property this is an existing use and they don't intend to to increase the intensity of the use so no additional trips would be generated by the proposal however there is adequate access to i-35 and just to let you know some transportation improvements in the area barthold road is anticipated to be rebuilt in the next two to three years and that's a part of this widening project that tex dot has for i-35 you can kind of see that area in purple and how that affects that subject site the and then here's that barthold road it will be straightened out and additional capacity will be added and the water and wastewater will remain a notification was sent out we received one letter in response and that was in favor of the request and that's shown here right here in green and that is that truck wash just to the north of the site so based upon on the criteria for approval staff recommends approval of the request um this is anticipated to go to council on february 16th and i'll be happy to answer any questions the applicant was supposed to be calling in tonight i don't know if we've had any technical technical difficulties but i believe he is on the phone to answer any questions great thank you very much is there any questions for julie or for the applicant regarding this project okay great uh julie thank you for the presentation we do not have anyone um wishing to speak um any citizens i i certainly want to provide the applicant a chance to speak they would like we have no questions for you right now but the applicant's on and would like to say something please feel free to do so all right well wait maybe they're on mute i'll give them a couple more minutes hello can you hear me i can if you could just state your name and address we'd love to hear from you hey this is jeremy reese wishapol engineering group uh address is 4420 jackson street mariana florida uh three two four four eight and uh we're the engineers of the project i basically just wanted to call in to answer any questions you guys had um it seems like there's really no questions or anything um so i mean it i don't really have anything to add to what julie had presented so i think we're all we're good to go with everything you guys are well mr reese mr reese i appreciate you at least being available i don't see that we have any questions right now um so again appreciate you uh making yourself available but no questions as of right now okay uh with that i'm going to go ahead and close the public hearing and turn it for a motion and then discussion commissioner beck i make a motion to approve as described by staff we have a first for approval commissioner smith i'll second we have a first and a second for approval any discussion on this item seeing none i'll call for a vote uh via roll call starting with commissioner ellis aye commissioner beck aye commissioner anderson aye commissioner cole commissioner smith aye chair is also an aye motion carries six zero congratulations the next item for our agenda is 5c pd 20-0002a this is also presented by julie wyatt and i'll invite her for presentation and i will open the public hearing all right let me pull out my presentation all right this item is pd 20002 hershbach so the request before you is a zoning change from general office and rural residential to plan development on 90 acres the subject side is outlined here in yellow it is on the north side of town adjacent to highway 77 and loop 288 bonnie bray makes up its eastern property line the purpose of the pd is to define the use for for the subject site and that is fleet service provider as well as use specific standards the the the and the additionally the pd would provide a development plan for 38 acres so a development for that fleet service provider use with 52 acres remaining for future development so a phase two development so the current map shows the subject property here outlined in black it does have go along the frontage of highway 77 and loop 288 with rural residential on the north side of the tract they are proposing a plan development pd with a geobase zoning designation so first we want to talk or look at the overall plan for the pd it is proposed to be developed in two phases the phase one would be that fleet service provider the definition associated with the proposed use is a business which supports the movement of goods by by means of truck transport and is not open to the general public primary activities include driver training support services company administration and and customer support and sales accessory uses include fleet storage maintenance facilities major or minor vehicle repair fueling station and truck wash bays this definition excludes the warehousing storage and transfer of goods it also includes use specific standards particularly related to buffer requirements which we'll talk about as we talk about the site plan phase two any development of phase two will require a major plan development amendment it would have to conform to the minimum requirements in geo but prior to the development of that 52 acres it would require approval from city council through the dual public hearing process so it would come back before you again just to look at some mobility in the area as i mentioned the high the height is adjacent to highway 77 it does have frontage along 77 for phase one the entire site so phase two includes also frontage along loop 288 and bonnie bray bonnie bray is an arterial however it is not designed to those standards at this time loop 288 is considered a highway and highway 77 is an arterial it is about 2,900 feet from the intersection of highway 77 and i-35 the the backup material and the next couple of slides just discuss those pd standards and they really just conform to those geo uses use in terms of permitted uses and development standards phase one generally generally exceeds those geo standards including the minimum open space that buffer requirement and that is related to that particular use it is proposed to have a 30-foot buffer along the west property line and then 20-foot buffers along the north and east property lines and that is in excess of what the code would require it's also proposing additional tree canopy approximately 535,000 square feet of mature of new mature tree canopy which is proposed and that's in addition to the to the 154,000 square feet of of preserved tree canopy and then they're also proposing open space requirement or open space recreation amenities such as a walking trail in a dog park the the difference in permitted uses from geo and the plan development is the addition of that fleet service provider in the use specific standards so we'll take a little bit we'll take a look at their site plan they are proposing an administration building in this general area that will include facilities for offices conference and training rooms exercise space laundry facilities day rooms and changing rooms and those are for those those those transportation employees of the Hirschbach company as I stated it wouldn't be open to the public a 19,000 square foot truck inspection and truck wash in this location that's about 490 feet from that right of way so the site is laid out to sort of push those more intense uses toward the rear of the site away from that highway 77 corridor there are two access points along highway 77 that is where the site gets its access they're proposing a truck repair shop in this location and then a truck tractor trailer storage in the rear of the site as well as long term car storage and visitor parking for that office use they're also proposing a a walking trail along the drainage area and and a dog park we also want to just touch briefly on that landscape plan here's where you can see those locations of the buffers so you can see outlined in green the 30-foot buffer is proposed for this location and then the 20-foot buffers to the north and the east of the subject site those buffers have to be planted according to the use specific standards with three ornamental trees every 25 linear feet so that's a total of 474 additional ornamental trees plus one large tree every 30 linear feet minimum forage caliber and that is a total of 132 additional large canopy trees also wanted to point out they are proposing a fence along that property boundary a six-foot fence to to additionally aid in screening they're proposing a bioswale in this location and in this location that is a per our code a vegetated channel designed to transport store and allow infiltration of water as a landscape feature and those are important and near near impervious areas to to accommodate for that runoff and and as i mentioned they are proposing additional mature tree canopy with plantings and large preserved areas you can see that preserved area here sort of separating that administration use from those those more intense uses toward the rear of the site the criteria for approval are in sub chapter two and and we have general criteria approval and per staff's analysis it does meet the criteria for the general criteria for approval but we will hit on that as we talk about the project and there is specific criteria for approval for plan developments so first we want to talk about the plan about den plan 2030 the future land use designation is business innovation as i mentioned in the last presentation is intended for large tracts of land that are for a larger scale office and employment parks what with those supporting uses typically we see geo and li to support business innovation those those uses in those districts are kind of our employment uses with some commercial uses permitted as well they're proposing a base zoning of geo and and we feel like that is consistent with that future land use given the given the permitted uses additionally geo does require commercial and office development standards since this is on one of arterial road ways we want to make sure it's developed in in a way that's appropriate given that location and so those those higher standard development standards are are are important in this area additionally want to talk about element six with the dentin plan and that's our mobility element within that within element six it does discuss freight and it discuss freight freight as a key economic component in the region region and one statistic it provides is that 98 percent of the mainland opposite population can be reached from that i-35 corridor since dentin is sort of at the top of the metro area with i-35 running through it it does sort of lend itself to that that freight use in terms of that economic component m2 one of those goals within element six um does state that we should enhance dentin's economic dentin's economy by supporting the city's freight network but we do need to be careful about where it goes freight routes should be separated from our smaller scale and walkable areas of the city that you know given the the size of the trucks we want to make sure that the that that it's not in our our high pedestrian areas the proposal is consistent with with this element because it does provide that support for those freight services but it is along that outer edge of the city with direct access to those arterial network so it provides that um that that access but but limited disruption to those denser areas of the city we also looked at impacts to the surrounding property and we looked at it from two aspects first the current development what's out there now and then later we'll discuss what what future development may bring so currently when we look at the surrounding properties we see that this this corridor this i-35 and highway 77 corridor does have a lot of transportation related uses we've got travel plazas along the i-35 and highway 77 intersection there's south is a subject property the the proposed um a developer of this site actually has an existing facility i'm in that location that they would be moving to this side if it were approved and there is truck repair logistics and fleet services across highway 77 from this site there's also a truck wash along 35 35 has additionally office so employment uses as well as commercial uses to the north and south of the site there's future residential development to the south of the subject property there's rural residential and there's a lot of undeveloped property which we'll talk about there's also a university area just to the southeast of the subject property on the proposal would not introduce new activities so as you can see based upon the definition of fleet services and what is around there the proposal would not that those uses would complement what's already existing in the area and and furthermore development of phase two would have to follow those geo standards and would require approval from city council after coming before the planning and zoning commission so there's additional scrutiny on on that development um just some sites photos of the property this is um so this vantage point is north looking toward the south here's highway 77 and loop to um 288 you can see those existing transportation uses um just across that the street and and the undeveloped property surrounding the subject site um just to give you an idea of what their existing facility looks like here are two two images from google earth for their subject property along highway 77 now and then here's another vantage looking from i-35 toward the east and you can see the existing development as well as the surrounding property so because there is so much undeveloped property we want to make sure that we look at how this this proposal would affect future development so first of all we look to the west and northwest um the proposal does have consistent zoning with the west and northwest so we anticipate that that property will develop in a manner with uh consistent with the subject site including proposed permitted uses in development scale southwest of the subject property we've got pd 142 here that is intended to be developed with commercial office light industrial and multifamily uses so that would be consistent with the proposed plan development in terms of that geo-based zoning district um north of the subject property um that does have that rr district that's one of our holding um designations when a property is annexed into the city it gets that rr designation until it gets a permanent zoning um that side is being used for agricultural purposes under the current zoning um it does permit single-family community or agricultural uses it does have a future land use designation consistent with the subject site so the comprehensive plan um anticipates or or contemplates a development consistent with that that business innovation future land use designation but it does have it does have that agricultural use now so we want to make sure that we we treat that that property boundary in a way that would be sensitive to that surrounding use so it does include this that's where that landscape buffer comes in with that fencing as well as the landscaping around the subject property just to reduce those reduce those potential visual impacts of that parking in the rear of the site and one part one place we haven't talked about is east of the subject property that is actually part of a master plan community within the city it is the hills of denton it's a mixed uh mixed use development it does um have uh commercial and office uses along bonnie bray and um and loop 288 in this location this is that red and pink area um and it it um the permitted uses in that area um allow for a variety of commercial and office in sunlight industrial uses provides greater building design amenities and connectivity so generally the development must be consistent with those geo standards specifically however that fleet service provider provides those additional buffers that is in excess of what the code would require additional uh mature canopy so about 41 percent of that lot when those trees are have have matured would be covered in entry canopy and that's an increase of that existing canopy currently there's about 220 000 square feet of canopy so it would be an increase um and it does provide those open space recreation amenities for employees that walking trail in the dog park appropriate area location and planning for the site so um the commercial uses and appointment uses permitted within the proposed pd are appropriate for the area and that is not only given that geo base zoning district but also the um the uh the proposed fleet service provider use given the agglomeration of those transportation issues in the surrounding area and that uh that proposed use would provide uh provide for a variety of um activities to support the employees of that company the development of the site would would require that commercial design and landscaping standards so we will make sure that those um that uh that uh any development along that corridor is designed well and um and then as i mentioned those elements of the site that are a little more intense those um the the repair in the the truck wash those are set back off of highway 77 to minimize their their visual impacts about 450 feet additionally you've got that buffer to screen from those adjacent properties um there is a fire station within the eight minute or less response time it is at windsor and bonnie bray um and the use is consistent with the surrounding area so we don't anticipate it would generate a significant increase in crime or nuisance issues um they will have to extend water and sewer to the site um and um as for sewer there is an existing lift station um and this general area that will have to be upgraded for that capacity um the cost to construct that upgrade will be the responsibility of the developer and then the street and and transportation network surrounding them so the estimated trip generation is about 297 trips per day per our engineering highway 77 can accommodate those trips that excuse me that includes about 197 trips for the office and then 100 truck trips this doesn't meet the thresholds for the tia however um sidewalks will be required along highway 77 the site the phase one does have frontage along highway 77 so that improvement will be required um we we talked about in the work session i just want to highlight again any development of phase two will have to go through an engineering review and any right-of-way dedication or perimeter and street improvements will be reviewed and required at that time um there is no access to bonnie bray or loop 288 from this site um but the loop 288 entrance and exit ramps do provide access to 77 and then highway 77 does provide that connectivity to i-35 um we have sent out notification um a uh and we have received um several responses in opposition they're still coming via email but um as of my last accounting it was seven and that does account for 22 percent of the surrounding property area so it will require a super majority at city council to approve the request um we've also received um eight responses in favor of the request um the applicant um did uh did send out notifications for a neighborhood meeting um she will be able she will be making a presentation tonight and we'll be able to answer any additional questions regarding that neighborhood meeting i believe she did not get any rsvps to that but she did speak to some surrounding property owners and she can discuss that further um so staff recommends approval of the request it does comply with the criteria for approval um if uh um and the next step is the tentative city council public hearing on february 16th and um that concludes my presentation and i will be happy to answer any questions uh thank you julie uh here's your call i think you've been waiting patiently thank you uh thank you chair uh julie for my own edification uh the diagonal lines in the red that's how the city limits correct to the north um let me make sure that i uh in terms of yes you are correct yes etj all that around there is etj as well okay all right thank you sure christopher anderson thank you chair thank you julie uh i do have a quick question i don't i if i missed it earlier i apologize but this is a truck wash office space all this stuff but it says the request by first baptist church i didn't know the church was in trucking um that is the property owner okay so they're so they're they're flipping this property to this company the company that's already across the street the applicant could probably answer that further but currently the property is under ownership of that first baptist church yes sir okay i was i didn't know if we discussed that earlier or not i just saw that i'm like why is a church in transportation and i know that church is not across the street because thank you um see no other questions for julie i'd like to invite the applicant uh for presentation good evening commissioners this is amy bissett can you hear me we can amy i know you know the drill but if you state your name and address uh for the record uh you'll have 10 minutes or if there's a group we can extend that to uh extend that further absolutely this is amy bissett 97 land company 100 west oak street denton 76201 we are going to do a combined applicant presentation and julie should be queuing up our slides for us right now um i would julie when you do get the slides up if you'll go ahead and go to slide two i'd like to start by introducing our team um mark smith is with henry s miller he is the developer for the pd as a whole and he's on the call tonight brian cal was is i'm sorry colwis is with hershbach and he represents the end user who intends to develop um sub district one as julie showed in her presentation and then we also have brad baker with gh and architects on the line and drew donofsky with claymore engineering to answer any technical questions related to engineering or architectural design and julie will you go ahead and go to slide three please we are going to do a combined presentation and i'm going to introduce brian with hershbach a little bit later in the presentation but i want to start by kind of giving you an overview of what i intend to hit on i do want to look at this project as it relates to the overall um goals that were established by the community in the denton plan 2030 i want to look at its consistency with the future land use plan and map look at um specifically we'll walk you through the pd elements and pd standards that we're proposing for this site and look at the current development pattern the economic development impact the mobility plan and the mobility elements within the denton plan as it relates to this project and hershbach as a corporate citizen and community partner in denton and the reason that we're going to go into this level of detail is we did we have had significant neighborhood engagement over the course of several months and as julie mentioned we did mail out invitations to host a neighborhood meeting and we did not receive any rsvps however to provide a little more context the 22 opposition is a what i'll call a majority property owner that borders us on a couple of sides that represents the owner and investor for hills of denton or a large part of hills of denton and so we proactively reached out to um that majority property owner and had three meetings with them between november and january and we also did mail out invitations for a neighborhood meeting as well um nobody rspp but i did receive a response from the property owner directly across highway 77 from this project and spoke with them at length um just before the holidays and um so we did um we did intent we did engage the the property owners um as much as we possibly could and there were some questions raised during those conversations specifically with the representative for hills of denton about whether or not this project is consistent with the city's vision for the future from a land use standpoint as well as an economic development standpoint and so i do want to go into some level of detail about those particular aspects julie if you'll go to slide four please and as as julie mentioned i'll be quick here the this area is designated in the comprehensive plan future land use map as business innovation and as she stated is intended for large tracts of land for well planned large scale office and employment parks we have a 90 acre pd here um with the primary uses that would be allowed in business innovation being office research and development live manufacturing with um generous linked open space i believe will demonstrate shortly that we are we are providing both employee amenities as well as neighborhoods buffering that accommodate a significant amount of open space and and we are developing in a campus like and corporate park setting that is intended to have a vision that is carried out consistently across multiple phases of development julie if you'll go to slide five please um i have highlighted here on the screen the the corridor that is currently zoned general office and you can see that it extends from the north side of route 288 up highway 77 and then continues up i-35 and general office is um one of the two zoning categories as julie mentioned that would be most compatible with business innovation and light industrial being other we did look at both um zoning categories as a base zoning district for this pd and i'll go into a little more detail but it in a moment about why we went with general office and some of the things that were considered in in while contemplating and having conversations with the city about that if you'll go to slide six julie um so overarching this pd while we're calling it the hershbach pd because the intent of creating it is to facilitate hershbach expansion and development of a of a campus um on this site and it is broader than just hershbach they'll be taking sub district one and then there will be future development for sub district too but as generally speaking the base zoning is um general office geo which is consistent across this corridor and the intent is to establish a new land use which i'll go into more detail about momentarily and to provide campus amenities that go above and beyond what would be required in geo based zoning including um dog park walking trails bio swills and um a densely planted landscape buffer to and a screening fence to create um a visual buffer for any of the neighboring property owners will you go to slide seven please julie um julie looked at this detailed plan with you so i'm not going to to belabor it um the western side of the property would be the hershbach campus and the eastern side would be sub district two i'm going to speak to each of those individually julie if you'll go to slide eight and the pd development standards as a whole so and they're written to apply to both both sub districts is that they would comply with the dimensional standards for the geo districts they would comply with landscape and tree canopy for the geo district the parking ratio that would be applied would be as provided in the dvc unless it's amended by a future detailed plan if somebody that wants to develop in sub district two wants to propose a different parking ratio it would be considered as a part of that pd amendment which would be brought back before you with dual public hearings and then the permitted uses would be the same as geo as well plus establishing this new use which would be a fleet service provider as julie's already defined for you i won't go back through that but i do want to delineate why we've created a new use we looked very hard at can we sit into an existing land use per the dvc and the closest was travel plaza which you just considered a travel plaza in the previous public hearing but the the difference is so stark that we really felt like travel plaza one is not appropriate for this this area it's more appropriate along i-35 than it is pulled off of 35 and closer to loop 288 but it is intended for the public and for motorists and this is going to be a closed campus that is intended for employees and to support their logistics and supply chain activities that this company provides to the dentin community and to the the country as a whole so um we we created the new use because of that and i actually there was a question during the work session about um did we write the use to to meet our needs and um the answer is no we did not i did a lot of research on um what exists in other development codes and the closest thing that i found that was consistent across development codes was a trucking terminal but in the case of the trucking terminal um the the the primary function is the loading or unloading of goods and the storage of goods which is not the case here and what what this this use really boils down to is that they provide logistics and supply chain support to other businesses they're not um they're not warehousing goods or loading unloading goods or creating manufacturing anything on this campus and so not only did we write the new um the new land use but we also um defined what accessory uses would be allowed as a part of that and the use specific standards that we proposed for those accessory uses are consistent with it what already exists in geo zoning specifically and outside storage is allowed as an accessory use in geo zoning but it is required to be in the side or rear yard only and be opaquely screened and have some other provisions associated with mitigating nuisances to the neighbors so we looked at um really trying to mirror what was already in the ddc and provide that in this particular proposal just to confirm you guys can still hear me we sure can okay i just didn't want to talk and and and didn't realize that i'd been disconnected so thank you and julie and amy just as a check-in point you're a little at 10 minutes and you have 20 minutes so i just wanted to um check in with you on timing thank you and so the pd um development standards for the entire campus slide nine julie and we really we contemplated going with um a light industrial zoning but we really wanted to be consistent with the geo zoning that is that is throughout that corridor and we wanted to comply with the commercial design standards associated with geo that we would not be required to comply with in in light industrial so those design standards address site design and orientation um or multiple building developments building mass informed building transparency and windows and building materials we're proposing some slight amendments to building materials otherwise we're proposing to conform to those standards entirely and julie if you'll go to slide 10 um i've highlighted here specifically what the what we're proposing vary from with those standards um one of which being that um we that architecturally finished metal would be an allowable material um if it's if it's visible from the public right of way even if it's visible from the public right of way that um masonry will comprise 50 percent of the exterior finishes visible from the public right of way which is consistent with the commercial design standards but that um industrial uses as identified in the ddc can use architecturally finished metal for up to 50 percent of the building facade so i do want to point out i don't want to skip over we do propose some variations to those standards um that are minor overall when you look at the the overall standards that we're complying with um julie if you'll go to slide 11 please the hershblock trucking terminal specifically um just to show you guys some architectural elevations um this would be an administrative and support building which would be the primary use it's going to look like a corporate office um a campus environment there will be accessory uses that would be um set back behind the main use that um would be screened with um the entire site would be screened with a landscape buffer and then there would be a fence along um behind the main building which i'll depict for you um in slide 12 julie if you'll go to slide 12 please um so you can see in slide 12 the the fence is highlighted in black across the front um so it's behind the main administrative and office building so the accessory uses would be largely screened from view the landscape buffer would um is highlighted in green here that would go um around all um neighboring property would surround the property and provide a screening for all neighboring properties and then um interior to the site would be a dog park and some walking trails i do want to point out that while we would we're proposing overall with a pd to conform to um the geo design or the geo landscape and tree standards on this particular detailed plan which you would be um solidifying with the approval of this pd zoning has over 70 tree preservation on site and over 45 landscape percentage slide 13 please and i'm getting close to handing this off to brian um i do want to point out that from an economic development standpoint hershbach is critical to um this community there they have key supply chain activities in this area where they bring goods from the midwest to five of our major taxpayers and economic development um um just businesses in denton including target us cold storage wenco aldi and southwire which is united copper they're not on this map but they're on the other side of town and slide 14 please julie and to go further into this i do believe that this supports the economic development strategic goals of providing supply chain and logistics and companies in denton to be able to support our major business as these five businesses in denton provide over 400 million dollars in tax base and two and a half million square feet of real estate and they're a key industry sector and the backbone of denton's economy so from an economic development standpoint i do believe that the project is consistent with the goals the strategic goals of the city and slide 15 please you guys talked about this extensively in work session i was listening at that during that discussion and this has been identified as a gateway area in the comprehensive plan and the uses on this corridor it's a less than a mile long corridor that connects to freeways and they are all currently somehow truck and travel related uses and which are supported in the comp plan with the caveat that they be located appropriately and away from your main and walkable pedestrian oriented areas in town slide 16 please lastly before i turn it over to brian i just want to say that hershbach is an existing business in denton they have been located here for several years and they are looking at a 40 million dollar capital investment in the denton economy by by moving into this campus they provide high wage jobs on site they offer year-round training to their drivers including providing 2500 to 3000 hotel nights annually with local spending when they have their driver orientations which are every week and that they have a green fleet technology and are part of the epa smart way program which i will let brian talk more about if he would like to and with that julie if you'll go to slide 17 i'm going to turn it over to brian with hershbach well good evening can everyone hear me yes very good my name is brian colwis i'm general council and chief risk officer at hershbach hershbach is a truckload carrier based out of debuque iowa i want to spend a little bit of time talking about our company culture we're not your typical trucking company and just to give you an example i wish all of you would have the opportunity to see our home office here in debuque iowa it's like walking into google our owner of our company our ceo does not have an office i'm the company attorney i don't have an office our chief people officer that oversees human resources does not have an office we're very transparent very open very open privately owned company for example we share our profitability numbers with our with our employees everyone is very very well compensated very very good bonus objective bonus structures for individuals all the jobs we'll be creating down there will be high paying jobs our company culture is called all in to win and that means everyone that comes into contact with hershbach needs to be a winner and that includes the city of denton and the citizens of denton it includes our drivers it includes our vendors it includes the the motoring public it includes our customers you can tell by the design of our building we're not your typical trucking company another example of how we're not your typical trucking company you can see that we have a dog park and you're probably asking why would a trucking company want a dog park in order to hire and retain the very best drivers out there in the world or in the country you need to do some creative things and one of those things is we allow our drivers to take pets with them on the road our drivers are out for four and five weeks at a time and it'd be nice to have a companion in the truck with you when you go well that presents its own challenges what do you do with the dog when the truck goes into the shop so one of the things we'll be doing is putting a dog park in for our drivers and their dogs we started in 1935 kind of the american dream ray hershbach one person one truck and mr hershbach hauled loads of meat out of the midwest and down to the port of houston and hauled bananas back to the midwest to this day we still haul meat out of the midwest and haul bananas back we stayed true to our roots now we're the 62nd largest truckload carrier we're the fifth largest refrigerated carrier in the u.s if you've eaten pork chicken or beef out of the midwest anywhere in texas there's a very very good likelihood it came in on one of our trucks we are a truckload carrier like amy said we don't have a cross doc operation there won't be any loading or unloading of trucks at this facility basically it's a place for us to stage equipment hire and train new drivers and basically have a place for us to do drop and hook operations and then run a shop out that's going to be the primary purpose of this uh of this location to tell you a little bit about us we've uh we're very progressive our oldest tractor right now in our fleet is a 2018 and those are slated to go away here in the next few months in a few months our oldest tractable will be a 2019 we've got 1100 new pieces of equipment ordered this year trackers we've got over 2000 new trailers ordered and these are all late model equipment they're the safest most environmentally friendly and most reliable pieces of equipment on the road i heard earlier that we're a critical to the to the to the city of denton and and to the to the to the country i'm going to go one step farther we're essential throughout covid we've been we've been still trucking we're still going to work every day we're masking up when we're at work in order to keep feeding keep feeding the country and having a location in denton will will definitely help us and make us more efficient we could turn to the next slide julie why expand in denton right now we have four acres down there we want to grow in denton because it's a great location for us we're great bringing 15 to 20 drivers new drivers per week into the denton facility but we've got a driver training program we're starting in debuque where we bring people in from scratch that have never driven a truck before and we teach them how to do it the Hirschbach way the right way using our all into zero safety techniques all into zero means zero accidents that's the only only acceptable goal when it comes to safety it's kind of our hub of texas from denton you can get anywhere we run a lot of texas if you ran a line of all of our freight lanes there would be a direct line from the midwest down down to denton texas on i-35 if you had to sum us up in one word we're a meat holler out of the midwest that's really what we do well and we're we're part of the essential function of hauling food to those in the country we have bought in the past peter bilts and some of them have been created down in denton right now we don't own any peter bilts but in the future we might and having a location in denton might make that a heck of a lot easier we do deliver to many local places of denton all the target winco us storage local parts purchasing is one thing that the city of denton can can get out of this you know when we have a location of that size all of our parts will be ordered and shipped to that denton facility you're probably asking how does denton win because everyone that comes into contact with Hirschbach as a winner jobs high paying jobs tax revenue we're a very progressive employer our growth when i started here six years ago we had around 600 power units we're now over 1800 uh we we have modest growth plan for this year uh but we're we're we're clearly a growing company and a very progressive company um i thank all of you for your time and i'll turn it back over thank you brian that's actually the conclusion of our presentation and we're happy to answer any questions thank you amy and brian commissioner smith thank you chair um brian this is a lot of these questions might be more for you but amy feel free to chime in as well but um what is the uh what is the intent with the old location across uh 77 once you guys relocate uh if we did approve this zoning yeah mr smith thank you for that question um the answer to that is i don't know uh right now we are at the very beginning phases of this we're probably a couple years away before we can move in i can tell you this that uh we would likely sell it if you had to ask me right now and said if the building was built right now i could tell you we would sell it but we're going to be good citizens i mean we want to sell it to um someone that's going to conform with the current uh planning and zoning designation of that area um but that would be our intent is to sell it to someone else that could utilize that building we have pumped um i don't quote me on it but we've pumped several hundred thousand dollars into that building since we bought it between concrete putting up a uh an area for the dogs and redoing much of the inside of the building as well yeah that was giving my next question is how much how much adaptation did you make that building if you bought it yourself if you bought it you guys didn't build that one originally um how much how much adaptation did you make it to what you guys are doing now and would it be an easy sell later on down the road to somebody who was maybe to convert into some other type of light industrial yeah i think it would i think would sell in a heartbeat um i i mean it's a nice facility we've kept it up we we've invested in it um it'd be a great location for someone there's just a lot of activity in that area so sure um how do you how many do you guys currently employ uh they're at the the current location for hirschbock at that location there's approximately 25 mechanics um and these are high paid very high high paid uh mechanics and then we have an orientation staff there for our new and incoming drivers and then we have a handful of recruiters down there to recruit uh new drivers overall there's around 10 of them so i would guess around 35 but keep in mind we do employ many many people that live in the state of texas sure you take iowa and illinois out of the mix i would bet texas is our third highest uh number of people that we employ for our company because of our drive because we're we're over 48 states so yeah and of course your your drivers are great employees and i'm sure some of them come from a lot of them come from across texas but if we're looking at it from a city of denton standpoint and we're wanting to find something that's beneficial to uh denton citizens and you know obviously the denton economy figuring out you say high high paid employees you have 35 now the new location how many permanent employees that would be or foreseeably could be citizens of the city of denton do you see maybe being there in that new location would still be about 35 just the new updated um facilities or would you see growth in the uh in the permanent employees once you actually be working full-time out of that location oh for sure there will be growth down there because we're going to grow the number of bays we have when you look at the size of a shop um you know you're limited to how many bays you have that's basically your limitation on how many employees you can have working in there so we've got 25 mechanics in there now we're now going to grow this thing to well over double the amount of bays you i'm sure you could pretty easily handle 100 mechanics through there um if you're running 24 hours a day seven days a week okay so maybe taking it you know at a kind of on a high end it could maybe grow from about 35 employees to almost you know 100 120 sounds like yeah don't hold me to that i we haven't done it i'll forecast but but i think that's i think that's fair given the scope and size of this project okay thank you so questions i have mr anderson thank you chair uh this is just a quick question it's not going to make or break any kind of deal like that but the fence along the that's going to hide the back section of the property amy uh what kind of material is that going to be is that just going to be like a six foot wooden picket fence or is that going to be masonry cinder blocks at this point in time it's intended to be um a vinyl fence so it will be um more durable than wood but it will be um it will be decorative and not be um something you can see through if that answers your question it does it does it's that's better material than replacing picking broken fence pieces all the time so no that's great thank you mr alice thank you chair i'm curious as to how many bays are planned for the site as well with regard to storage and the accessory use what is how much storage is there for tractors and i believe cars as well commissioner ellis i am pulling that information up for you give me just a moment commissioner else would you prefer that we also pull the plan up as she's talking through it it's really looking for numbers so either or is fine i i want to say and i'm not putting my hands on it quickly enough and i don't want to hold you up but um i do have the architect and the engineer on the phone as well but i believe that it's um 17 bays and um maybe 120 ish um spaces for long-term storage and um brad if you're if you're on the line if you hit star six you can unmute and maybe able to answer that more specifically as well yes amy can you hear me we can okay uh yes this is jenny to state my information this is uh brad and brad baker texas registered architect uh at ghn in springfield missouri 300 south jefferson 65806 um yes hang on a second yeah amy was right it looks like uh we've designed a building that could be expanded in the long term um the original shop building we've actually made room for a total of it could be up to 24 tractors but it's the way we counted it would be more like 17 like she said and then parking the same way we had a i think she had the numbers right but it doesn't have to all be developed in one shot so uh it could be faced forward so the 120 trailer spots should be about right okay and on that note um fuel was mentioned too in in the plan it where would that be located commissioner ellis this is amy i actually wrote that definition and when i wrote it it was um i was trying to be broad enough in case it didn't get incorporated into other um into the ddc in the future but to my knowledge there are no fuel um stations proposed on this site that's why i couldn't find it anywhere okay i appreciate it thank you any other questions for uh julie or the applicant i know we have some people that have been patient waiting on the phone commissioner smith thank you chair just one last question what was uh an aim this might be a question for amy i don't think i caught this at all in julie's presentation i know it's a two-phase development but what is the intent with phase two amy is it a um something to be developed later that's similar to what's going to be a phase one or an expansion of phase one or something completely different i think i missed that in the first presentation so the commissioner smith at this point there's no um impending development for phase two the intent is to um establish the pd standards and um then begin to market it for potential end users um i've got mark smith with henry s miller he's um he'll be responsible for the remainder of that land and developing sub district too so mark if you're available if you want to hit um star six and unmute yourself you can address commissioner smith directly as well uh this is mark smith can you hear me we can okay i'm mark smith henry s miller equity partners 5151 beltline uh dallas texas uh our intent for the 53 acres there is to have resource development um industrial uses um light industrial uh it could either be divided into several lots uh it could be divided into two lots or it could sell to one user uh we we agree to the standards that are being placed in here and we will uh make sure that whoever uh we talk to or negotiate with will be aware of these standards and we'll hold to them okay thank you very much okay i do not see any other questions right now so um staff if you could do me a favor and just maybe mute the the applicant's lines make sure they're all muted so when we go to callers there's not connectivity issues i appreciate that um for this item we had 16 people make comments using the online form there were 13 in support of this item and three against all of these comment forms were emailed to all the commissioners and our city secretary to be recorded there are four individuals that have been waiting patiently to speak to us and so at this time i'll ask staff to connect the first caller and we'll wait for connection okay hello this is uh vent carter live at 2043 chin road which is a road just off again east ganja road uh understanding uh growth has got to happen but my concern is is will there be will we see semi-traffic on east ganja road with trucks exiting off 35 and coming up east ganja road and going north on bonnie bray kind of a back way into the man i know they have to go up to 77 because i've been listening but uh what's to prevent truck drivers for semis coming down these roads that are not designed for semi-trucks that's my only concern yeah mr carter i appreciate you calling in and expressing that concern this property has no uh connection to bonnie bray or to ganzer the only way they could they could enter the property is off 77 so um i don't have a map right in front of me but i would think naturally the only form of traffic would be from loot 288 or 35 um would be the quickest most efficient route to the location uh not bonnie bray bonnie bray they can't get to the property for bonnie bray oh i'm aware they'd have i'm aware i'm aware they'd have to go up to 77 and turn but i know truck drivers if there's an easier or quicker way to get there they may try they may try to come this way and that's my concern so i mean i know where the road the entrance is going to be on 77 but it would make more sense to go down but i'm just concerned would there be nothing to prevent them from going that way if they want to that's correct there's nothing to prevent them from exiting ganzer going through ganzer down to bonnie bray down to loop 288 and over to 77 that's correct right yeah that was i'm just saying those roads aren't designed for semi that was my concern so i definitely understand i appreciate you calling in bringing that to the to our attention okay thank you thank you have a good day and if i uh can we go ahead and pass the next caller through thank you mr carter just good evening you are with plan zoning if you could state your name and address you'll have four minutes to speak sure my name is shula matter 16950 dallas parkway with 120 and they may ask permission since i represent five properties and instead of talking four minutes on each if i can do like five to six minutes all together like it's my initial presentation that's okay with you yes that's okay you have six thank you so much okay thank you so much and good evening my name is shula nature and i'm a representative of cat bentham 35 five six ten and eleven bentham is described as a university city and the city of science technology arts and music it has a big medical center and conference center all of these are on the east side of highway 35 bentham has always also been blessed with a wonderful airport and big industrial component around it all on the west side the property that we're discussing is right in the intersection of 288 and i-35 and it's the front and most visible place of the gateway for the whole northeast quadrant this should be the newest and well planned area of the future of bentham with that in mind the future plan calls to the front to be zoned cgo and described officially by the city and i'm reading intended to provide locations for variety of workplaces and complementary uses principal uses including office research and development related supporting uses the go district provide area for flexible office space encouraging establishment of research and development opportunity for business innovation under that the city the city shows a picture of beautiful office buildings something like whole business park in prisco or legacy in plano this learning request is a big deviation from this plan and vision and will adversely affect the whole northeast quadrant the use request of tracking distributors or as the applicant is beautifying the name to fleet service provider is not an allowable use in many cities you will not see this use in plano frisco allen prosper selina etc as one city manager told me tracking does not bring much tax benefit to the city and it creates an environmental store and pays very low wages as to this zoning case did you see the colored pictures of the buildings that are proposing the only missing thing in this picture are hundreds of trucks initially miss white mentioned in the report that there would be between 25 to 50 trucks and the next report 50 to 100 i studied the project in depth with few experts in the tracking industry describing the project that is about 40 acres of land with 80 000 square feet of buildings those experts estimate that this size facility will have about 250 to 400 trucks and maybe more you do not invest 40 million dollars for 50 tracks i asked mr kanan and the city if given their zoning who will monitor how many tracks there will be and the response was that there will be no monitoring of the city and he does not know how many will be a very big question on this case also is why didn't the city require traffic studies in this case it's a very important factor let's talk a little about the process that was handled in this case i happened to find out about the zoning when the broker comes to my came to my office to ask for a sewer easement for a small commercial project i asked who's running the zoning and was told amy to say i was told i hear from her but i didn't after waiting a couple of weeks i reached out to her only then we had a zoning a zoom meeting and she sent me some claims after receiving them and finding out that this was not a little commercial project and in fact was a very damaging heavy industrial project i contacted mrs white and my to my disappointment she said that the staff was going to recommend approval although the city knew that this case would be her in january 6 notices to the meeting were not made up until december 21st my office received them on december 31st it seems that the information is being hidden all the time and a short notice on holiday week emphasized it then the meeting was moved today so then the moving was moved to january 20 preparing for this meeting tonight i talked with neighboring residents that informed me that there was a neighborhood meeting i had no knowledge of the neighborhood meeting when i called mr said i was told that since i knew about the project she they decided not to invite me to the neighborhood meeting i guess they knew i would oppose in the applicant's report to the city they said that they called a neighborhood meeting and nobody showed up i'm here to tell you that i did not show up because i was not invited and didn't know about it the city recommends two neighborhoods meetings the second one never was called mrs rich reached out to me and asked to have a zoom meeting last monday during which she told me that they made changes but she could not show them to me yet later that day mrs emails me and said shula i do not have any materials to send to you i will talk to you through the changes to our zoning request and steps we are taking to provide the buffer to your property once we have everything finalized and she puts in parentheses later in the evening or tomorrow i will send you the final version to date i have not received anything zoning that request buffer means that it's bad thing and they're trying to hide i'm going i'm going that the entire quadrant will lower this will lower the whole entire quadrant lower the values and uses of thousands of acres on the northeast and it's bad for the city of danston as pmd members you're here because you care about the city and its development i hope that you will not approve the zoning case for the use that is not even allowed in most cities i'm sure that hers back is a great company but it does not belong here thank you very much thank you very much for for calling in i want to see if anyone has any questions for you does any here's our questions for miss westler miss westler can you turn down your tv are you are you there yeah okay yeah we're just we're getting an echo can can you clarify something you when you mentioned your address on record you gave a dallas address is that correct yes sir i'm a real estate broker and i represent and the owners okay so you're not a property owner adjacent to this property i'm the president of their corporation and i represent them yes okay that might be a reason you might have not gotten a notification do you know if the oh no no no no no no no no no i'm i'm on the application i'm on the list definitely i'm on the list and i did get the notices it just went forward the neighborhood meetings they decided not to have me because i guess they didn't want me to find my opinion and that is not a neighborhood meeting okay i appreciate the clarification and the owners that you represent do they have adjacent property to this yeah right we have like six adjacent properties i think we are like 80 percent my owners have about 4 000 acres the whole northeast quadrant of this area they are the most wonderful caring people they've worked with many cities in this area and they always are waiting to do the right thing and they and to hold off for the right development we were approached by actually by hirschbach themselves to and other tracking companies to sell land my my owners could have made a lot of money making those sales but they decided not to they decided that this quadrant should be high quality with the vision of the city it shouldn't be a tracking place if the city made you know when the city was young and it was rural and they gave some tracking zoning that was in the past i think now we need to look at the future of denton and this quadrant is the future of denton that should be the quality the very big part if you go further up is is the most gorgeous rolling um rolling gate country land and i noticed when i showed my clients that land i took them to stonebridge to show them because it's kind of the same topography and i showed them this is my vision for this deal to be like a stone bridge like with a lot of amenities and rolling and beautiful and surrounded by quality commercial quality office quality employment and you know as i said you know um you know as one of the city managers that i quoted they say many cities do not allow tracking use like this because they say it's environmentally like here they're going to wash 400 tracks by the creek i mean the whole thing is just wrong and then you know they said tracking brings very little tax benefits for the city it creates environmental floor and pays very low wages so i i envision that i think denton has such an aura of beautiful quality academic education wonderful things we are in an era of wonderful technology high you know med medicine and so on and what can be more perfect than that area for the expansion of denton and and you're and and i think the city is lucky to have people like my owners that are sitting and waiting to do the right thing we could have slapped a lot of such zoning i think i could have made a lot of sense i think i appreciate your answer and some of the points you had made you certainly uh to me were clear earlier the one thing i do want to ask it seems as though um during this discussion it part of the rationale that this isn't um the best fit for denton is it doesn't compare to frisco alan prosper or mckinney and i'm curious do you represent ownership groups that want to change their property to make it more like alan mckinney and prosper is that the goal is to make northeast denton like the other cities i think i don't think it's like the other city because denton has its uniqueness there's no other city has denton has the wonderful universities and the wonderful spirit no it's not to make them like but what i was trying to show is like like new architectural new innovation new things that are compatible with the education of denton with all the values of denton no it shouldn't be like a plain it shouldn't be like in the frisco i was bringing it as an example for architectural and newness and caring of what is going in okay that makes sense i just i appreciate you acknowledging that denton is unique and like no other city which is maybe why this use case doesn't exist in other cities exactly and and i think i think the closest i can compare denton to in my mind is austin gotcha well uh it looks like we have another question for you go fast christian or beck yes thank you chair um can i ask um caller what um if you don't think that this is an appropriate use or consistent use does uh the the adjacent uses that are already involved in these uses well um is it that you'd like to see those go away well it's well you know i i don't think i ever want to push anybody away i think everybody that is there you know needs to be grandfathered and it needs to be working with the city i think right is right and wrong is wrong and then so i think i think those you know and if they find better places to move on it'll be wonderful but if they decide to stay there there and they've been part of the community and i think we need to respect that but not to put more things like that and i'm sure that each one of you dropped by those facilities and it's not the best but they're part of the community and we respect that but we shouldn't add on to it is there any other questions for uh miss netzer yes sir i don't see any other questions but i appreciate you calling in and bringing your concerns to us thank you and thank you very much for considering it and caring about them so thank you very much of course bye have a good evening if i could ask staff to bring in the third caller good evening you're with pnz if you could state your name and address you have four minutes to speak very good this is robert nicholas and i'm an attorney at miclos sinclair plc the address business address is 1800 valley du lane suite 360 farmers branch texas 75234 and i represent cat denton and uh miss netzer i will say that i did not have the sound on during her presentation so if i say anything that's redundant in any way i don't think i will uh but if i do i i apologize um and i'll just cut right to it um i'm speaking in opposition i'm sorry this is cody with city of denton how you doing tonight i'm good how are you doing all right thank you um just want to let you know i'm queuing you up to be the next uh person to speak you're on you'll have four minutes to speak on this item and um i'm going to place you on hold right now and whenever uh robert is is finished with his four minutes i'll patch you in i this is all right thank you uh apologize for that confusion robert uh will you please continue okay i and i have the sound off so can y'all hear me we we can now okay i'll restate it sorry yes please this is robert nicholas and i'm a land use attorney at miclos sinclair plc my office uh address is 1800 valley du lane suite 360 farmers branch texas 75234 i represent cat denton and uh miss shula netzer uh i had the sound off with y'all so i apologize if i'm saying anything redundant to what i said 30 seconds ago or anything that she said uh but i didn't hear what she said so i'll cut right to it i'm speaking in opposition uh to this zoning case uh i don't know whether miss netzer said that or not but she uh represents approximately 5 000 acres uh to the north northwest northeast of this property site so even though this appears to be a 22 opposition if the rest of this 200 foot buffer zone was in this area the opposition percentage would be significantly higher than just the 22 so i wanted to emphasize this i was watching the work uh session and uh i agree with the concept or the thought process that was going through what this application is is this is a general office for structure and land site but this is an industrial use attached to the plan development so this is a uh industrial intrusion into a general office use and the future land use map for business innovation calls this designation is intended for large tracts of land that are appropriate for well-planned larger scale office and employment parks with supporting uses such as retail hotels and residential primary uses include office research and development and light manufacturing so with respect to your planning staff and the applicant i will respectfully disagree and state that i believe that this is in opposition to your future land use map and in opposition to general office i could say a lot of words and throw a lot of words at you but i think that the most significant uh way to uh i guess get over uh what the opposition really is and what the concern really is here is is that once you allow an industrial use in a general office area just like your previous case uh where you had loves truck stop going next to a bunch of other uh truck related uses once you put a truck related use here and you saw that 17 truck bays truck parking truck idling uh truck repair uh that's what you're going to get next to this site that's what you're going to get because put yourself in the place of a landowner next to this are you going to put restaurant with porches across a vinyl fence from 50 trucks idling at 3 a.m are you going to put a hotel next to that are you going to put residential next to that of course not so what's going to happen is is that i know legally and you've got your city attorney here very very good man uh each case does not say that you have to pass another case but what you'll see is is that you're adjoining landowners will be stuck they'll have to bring in industrial and industrial type and transportation uses adjacent to this use because they won't be able to do the restaurants retail the data centers the light office uses what you're going to do is you're going to transform this area of elm north of 288 and east of i-35 into truck and truck transportation uses and pull it away from what it's originally intended to be which is general office with some residential with retail and office uses so what you're going to do is you're going to transform this corridor and i think that is a against the future land use map and against general office which is exactly why they sort of stapled on top of your general office pd uses this industrial use that's really the only way that they could justify and try and meet your future land use guidelines so i think if you want transportation uses in this corridor then approve this uh uh site if you want to follow what i believe the vision of dent was for this corridor not only this particular location but it's adjacent and surrounding uses i would ask you to oppose this and i'm going to say this finally this is not a site that has been sitting there with grass growing for 20 or 30 years and you can't get anybody there this is a well-sought site if you turn this down tonight harshback i'm sure is a terrific company and on the other side of i-35 it makes perfect sense to put something like this there heck there are already a bunch of truck traffic uses over there anyway but at this site once you put this here you're saying we're going to have to put a lot of other truck related and industrial uses right next to it and you're foregoing what i believe dent really intended for this corridor to be uh so i'm asking you to vote against this to deny this uh and the red flag should be that it requires a super majority to go to council anyway you wouldn't do this with the residential area you wouldn't put uh an industrial use in a residential corridor um and and fit it into a residential structure and it's the same thing here you'll get this company here you'll get it in your city you'll get the employment here and by turning this down tonight you're going to get a better use at this location that makes more sense it is more in line with your future land use map that's it well mr nicholas i certainly appreciate you calling in and providing your perspective any questions commissioners for the caller commissioner beck yes uh thank you chair mr nicholas um i'll ask you the same question that i asked the previous speaker and that is uh if you don't think that this use across the street is appropriate what uh is it is it that your vision that that the existing trucking uses should be uh slowly uh depreciated and gotten rid of okay i know that there's a truck use to the south southeast of this site and it sounds like they're selling off and moving regardless uh so i'm not going to tell y'all what to have with that particular location but this location is north of 288 and it looks like the intention of the city of denton was to make this an office retail and hotel use going north there i would never ask you to run out any existing business or uh non-conform any existing business i just think that once you put this on the north side of 288 what you're doing is you're saying this whole area needs to be industrial industrial related and truck uses and uh i don't think that's what the city intended when it did a future land use map um so i'm not going to speak for what that particular location should or shouldn't be i'm a big fan of letting businesses that are operating normally stay but i don't think you double down on it if you had um a use that you weren't happy with at a particular location i don't think you say well i'm going to put two or three more next to it and double or triple down on something that would be incompatible with your future land use you just let them run their course move their time and they look like they're intending to move anyway that would be my answer and it is thank you any other questions for mr nicholas i don't see any i appreciate you calling in and articulating your perspective thank you very much thank you all and i'm going to ask staff to patch through our final caller for this evening good evening you're with planning and zoning if you could state your name and address you'll have four minutes to speak okay my name is sean terry it's 1800 valley view lane and farmers branch texas and i'm with centurion american we are the owners of the two tracks of land that is directly across from this proposed zoning change on 288 and so am i alive now can i go you're alive you can go okay appreciate you and thank you pnz for staying listen to us you know we've we've got the land like i said the two tracks of land that we actually own that's across the street from this proposed zoning change you know we put a lot of work and effort went through with time spent with the city of denton in regard to these two tracks as well as the kings ridge single-family community that is currently being developed which is crossing the new high school um we're opposing this zoning change this northeast quadrant of i-35 and 77 we feel like should be some kind of high quality development that you see along 121 different places like that you know obviously when you got residential mixed in with a lot of truck traffic it's a little harder to sell homes and i know you guys have heard a lot of people speak tonight and things like that and i won't beat a dead horse so to speak but you know we just oppose this due to the fact again that we want to do some more residential over there bringing more high quality homes in and we felt like having something like this with this amount of trucks that'll be going right across the street from us with the added noise and things it could be a challenge for us and and again i appreciate you guys times and gals times for being here and listen to us talk and i'll uh i'll sit back and answer any questions that you might have i appreciate mr sarah any questions for the caller uh i do not see any uh but i appreciate you calling in and providing your your two cents and perspective okay thank you all very much and have a good evening thank you you too bye bye any more callers that concludes uh the public speaking or public hearing part of that i'm gonna go ahead and close the public hearing officially and turn it to the dais for a motion and discussion commissioner smith um before i make a motion i'd like to just say that i think that the uh i think the public comments have been um well heard and received i think that uh you know that we've uh certainly a tricky area for us to put a for us to approve a zoning but that uh that area has always um screamed to me as exactly what the flume has it as business innovation um sounds like from what's uh you know hearing from the representative from uh brian from from hershbach that it seems like the company is doing things that are uh you know leading edge of a trucking industry they're uh trying to take care of their employees they uh it seems like the growth of this site if it's zoned correctly would i would bring employment and economic strength to the city um so i do want to make a motion to approve the project uh but i want to make that with a caveat of um i think that discussion we had in work session that commissioner roselle or chair was all brought up is extremely important that this is uh there's more and more of these projects develop and as we kind of set something like this it's a very large commercial project it'll be somewhat of a cornerstone in this area um we need to create a a small area plan and so i do want to make a motion to approve uh and um we'll look forward to talking about that matrix when we get to it commissioner cole i'll second we have a first and a second for approval uh discussion we'll start with commissioner anderson thank you chair uh first i'd like to say you know thanks to amy and brian for both uh your presentation and that helped clarify several some questions i had regarding the design and the intent of the use of the property uh i look forward to watching your project progress uh i'm going to go ahead and vote as an eye for this project i think that whole corridor out there as commissioner cole stated earlier has been as far as i've lived and did in my whole life it's been known as a trucking area uh 76 trucks off the tna that's out there now used to be 76 truck style we played baseball for them they sponsored a lot of little league pony league teams in this city uh that whole area has been uh has been that corridor and i don't see where this is going to be that much of a difference and if we can keep it in one area that's great instead of spreading it out all over the area and uh you know uh thank you again to uh hersbach for investing 40 million dollars into the city that each of us on this commission uh like so much or we wouldn't be sitting here and listening to these presentations and uh i hope you do take advantage of your new neighbor here in ditten uh peter built and order some vehicles and trucks from them uh that would be a great partnership for both of you and uh i do like your motto i'm in on this i'm all in so uh hope you're all in to win and uh i just want to say i'm going to go ahead and vote eye for this and uh i hope i can say welcome to ditten so thank you uh well christopher anderson you will have to officially vote later on but i appreciate uh your voice in support now uh christopher beck thank you chair um so i'm going to follow in from what commissioner anderson said it seems like um oh you know i that this area has you know been a trucking area um i've driven back and forth uh up this corridor to get to oklahoma and see family from the houston area my entire life and that's a trucking area even though i'm only a 2007 uh transplanted and um it the other thing that particularly appealed to me is they're unlike many of the development projects uh that they were exceeding capacity on some of the environmental era uh conditions that are you know near and dear to my particular heart in addition uh the campus doesn't look like a typical at least the elevation didn't look like a typical um uh kind of project so i it feels like for business innovation just like commissioner smith said we we have a a modern more innovative more contemporary use that has been there for a while as commissioner anderson said so i think i'm i'm also going to be supporting this thank you christopher alice thank you chair well i may be the lone wolf on this because i do have just so many concerns on this request um and it's not that i'm disrespecting this company or their business um they're a fine company they've been a fine neighbor in denton um but my concerns are you know we don't have a current plan or vision for this gateway we don't have a current definition for this land use we don't even know if we want it in the city or where but when we discussed it in work session we know we don't want it in geo we don't think but we're going to try to fit it in geo by finagling some parameters in a planned development except we don't have a full planned development because we're not discussing phase two and if we're trying to put it all into a pd we probably should have a full vision for the pd not a phase two that needs a major uh plan development that has to come back here i think this is a significant facility and i think what we're setting up is for phase two to effectively be more trucking related uses and if that was the vision that we had for this which i don't know if it is or it isn't it's hard for me to support a plan development that's not planned i'm also concerned with the adjacent property owners that have have called in today and talked with us they have master plan communities with single family uses multi-family uses and some commercial uses office uses but not industrial uses like major trucking facilities so i'm having a real hard time getting on board with this because our decision is to be planning for the future and with our lack of vision here i can't say that this is what our vision is i don't think that's what our vision is on that side of the road i understand we keep saying oh it's already happening on the other side of the road it's very divided there where where they're wanting to build this use is not there it's on the other side of the highway it's on the other side of the loop right now in a small way but it's not on that side of loop 288 like is being proposed now if we do allow this i am convinced that that is what we are going to have for this corridor going forward and right now that isn't something that i'm willing to get on board with thank you commissioner alice christner beck yes thank you chair i i want to push back slightly on what commissioner alice said that use has been there as several of the commissioners said including myself for for years and years and years and so the development for single family multi-family town hall master plan committee moved into an area with existing usage of light industrial general office uses i guess with the idea that that would die off i but at the same time the representatives say they don't want to kick these elements out and i mentioned this to chair earlier you know unless we're willing to say that this is not a use that i want that's not that i'm going to put my thumb on the scales to make this untenable that's a use that's already there and it's almost literally across the street from the existing use so um i i think this i'll i'll just be i'll just cards on the table i think this is uh developers wanting light industrial uses versus developers wanting single family homes and this is a developer versus developer issue and um there is existing use and developers in in in low in situ um i'm versus uh hypothetical development in the future i'm i don't feel comfortable trying to to run this out and i think you could do a small area plan that said i'm going to have the tesla trucking group i'm going to have the hershbach austin light campus i'm going to make this yes it's going to be geo and line industrial but you could do a small area plan that said this is a light industrial that is sexy instead of light industrial that's detroit blight and and that's up to us so uh those are my two cents commissioner alice yeah thank you chair and i'll just push back with some of those comments where we're not dealing with an industrial use it's geo that is what we're dealing with here it's geo and rr and they're requesting that the base zoning be geo not industrial on that side and i don't believe this is a developer versus developer i believe this is all about planning and all about a vision and all about a major corridor that brings people into the north side of living in the city of denton all right i'm gonna uh tread into these waters of i think a really good and healthy discussion and um i'll be honest i've kind of richard you want to go ahead and speak yeah and i'm not trying to i just wanted to point out the the geo district because i think it's i always say it's the most misunderstood district that we have in the in the 2019 ddc and i think it's important just to note that this this transition from rccn to to geo and so there were no industrial uses permitted prior um it transitioned to to geo which now does permit industrial uses so while it's not a strictly industrial district it does allow for light manufacturing allows for medium manufacturing with an sup and it does allow for wholesale and warehousing the prior district they had a limitation of 55 000 square feet the geo does not and so it is really a a hybrid district and i just don't want us to get too hung up on on the name general office but but it does allow for a variety of those of those uses including an industrial that that was all just wanted to note that thanks richard uh back to to what i hope is not a long soliloquy i remember uh a couple decades ago um i got news my family got news that peter built had paid for a super world commercial and that the truck that they were going to put in the commercial was going to have denton texas on the side of it this is before tivo or dvr and literally in my house as a kid i remember us all rushing the tv so we could see peter built drive down through a super world commercial with denton texas on the side of it and since then and other than peter built i've never seen a company wanting and being proud of the city of denton i haven't seen a national landscape like peter built did in that super world commercial i don't know if hirschbach's ever going to buy a super world commercial but i do know that they're wanting to invest in denton and no one else has done it in that corridor to the size and the extent in which they're coming to the table with real dollars to support our town and so if we had a another option that has been brought to this this area then let's let's hear it how long has that been sitting there hirschbach has committed to denton they've already been operating in denton they want to expand into denton with 100 mechanics jobs that that's good paying work to keep people living in denton keeping their dinner dollars in denton buying at our stores here in denton and so again if other companies want to come and put this kind of investment up and commit to the city of denton like hirschbach has already done and is doing tonight then i i welcome it i want to see it but right now hirschbach is at the table with dollars and no one else is and to the point of developer versus developer i tend to agree with my commissioner beck this is not people coming from the hartley field coalition saying these are our homes that that's backing up to this is foreign dallas money owning 5 000 acres and wanting to protect that investment this it's it is 100 a developer from out of town wanting to make sure the hills of denton is successful it's not protect our our farm land which is a lot more compelling to me east of here down at hartley field when we were going through all that well y'all remember the issues east of here so it does seem like i mean two of the four callers tonight were were highly incentivized monetarily to make sure this thing doesn't go in and so i don't see any other way than kind of to beck's point we have i don't even know if it's a developer versus developer it seems like there's a corporation wanting to commit to denton and a developer wanting to protect a massive housing project from from down in dallas i think is where they were calling from and so that's just not a compelling argument at all that being said it's incumbent on the city the mayor council staff to protect this corridor because the creep potential is real i think uh sean terry was the one who said it and commissioner ellis echoed it that this could set a precedent of a lot of trucking and to commissioner beck's point is that we want i don't i don't know commissioner ellis brings up a good point of this is not the most traditional pd we've ever seen and so i think we have a massive responsibility to get a small area plan done asap to ensure other people who are looking to purchase property understand the expectations of the city but since that hasn't been done i'm certainly not in a position to try to punish or lobby my opinions on harshbox investment and say well wait a couple years while the city figures out what we're going to do with the land we haven't done it yet i don't think it's right to have them wait until it does get done that being said in addition to the small area plan i'm not a fan of the way city kind of put this together no offense to the planners involved but to commissioner ellis's point this was one of the the um less tightly formed pds we've seen uh certainly uh we have a pd that's doesn't seem to be very specific on the adjacent property under the pd which i'll be honest almost excuse me to vote no on this because it's it seems really haphazard and i and i certainly wouldn't want to see this again or the other commissioners to see this again and so uh with with maybe a stern admonition i think we need to clean up pds uh and actually make them planned developments um those are my two cents uh sorry if it's more stream of consciousness but i i fully support this project and what hirschbach is is doing and i and i certainly want them buying peter built trucks um so i'd like to see that happen if it's not tesla trucks going forward any other discussion on this item all right seeing none we'll take a vote via roll call starting with commissioner ellis and with my vote i will say this is not against hirschbach or anything that they do um or have done with our city this has to do with me being against trying to fit this into a geozoning and i will vote no commissioner beck for the reasons i said earlier i'll be voting yes uh commissioner anderson yes commissioner cole yes commissioner smith aye chair is also an aye motion carries five one congratulations next item of business is the concluding item our matrix i will turn the floor over to richard for any updates and then to the dais forward discussion i think i know which item to add um to to the matrix um i don't know that i'll have it on the next agenda but but i do promise i will have that um at least a a beginning discussion on that most likely on the 17th along with with the fees um so i'll have um selena reach out we may want to start a little early to have that discussion but it might be a good segue as we're updating the comprehensive plan um to really look at these areas but i'd also like to take a step back and and look at at the gateways overall um in fact we had a just internally uh we've had that that discussion um both with with the city manager's office uh as well as our development service management and just where we're headed and now that we've got some things under under wraps with respect to just our development review and really getting back out there and and starting looking at neighborhood planning area planning and and it kind of segues perfectly with right where we are right now with the with the comprehensive plan update so if you can just give me a couple weeks to put a little bit more together on that um but i'd like to come back at least on the 17th with an initial discussion for these um for these uh for these area plans with that i happy answer any questions awesome thanks for the update christner beck yes thank you chair um richard i i emailed you this um earlier but i i think it's worth noting here for the future matrix and and that is um and i think i semi included it in previous meetings uh after cody gave his presentation uh and that is uh lately in the last two weeks or so i've been getting a lot of questions maybe it's because i'm a computer guy and people know that or whatever i don't know but a lot of how do you get information online about active projects and and the thing is we we now know thanks to the work session cody told us all how to do it but i think there's a real dearth of public awareness and so if if we could do what i sort of suggest an email and for the rest of the commissioners i i asked richard if he could look into getting a web page that was a walkthrough on how to how to go from the active projects map uh all the way out to all the information uh the way a lot of people said what's coming who's the point of contact uh you know what's the decapped links all that that's all available nothing has to be invented richard's team has done that already i just think what this is is an education outreach and training issue not a not a technology issue and i think it just needs a single web page to to make uh accessible to citizens and that's something that we've already that's already started and so i think that that email went out i know it went through the through the manager's office and so i believe it's already in the works to develop that page i think as i mentioned before with our our current system and software that what we're running we do have some limitations but again that that will will change hopefully by the end of the year once we get once we get up and running with the new software and then start to be able to have these plans being being accessible online it's just it just allows for for greater transparency as well as giving folks an idea of what's going on and not having to call staff or or do multiple requests it's easier to just have that information available to them and then follow up with questions as opposed to having um going back and forth and so that that's sort of our our intent and um i know we'll get there and um but but that that is in the works the um that additional that's awesome that's awesome i think it's going to save you and steward and everybody else a lot of time um fielding questions because you'll already have those pre prefab answers yeah thank you any other uh questions or things to update christopher thank you i i was just uh curious richard if any of our city systems endpoints were hit by the solar winds cyber attack i know some of the others were and counties were uh do you have any knowledge of that or i'm not aware i can i can follow up with with our it and and and report back but i'm not aware that that um there was okay cool thanks commissioner anderson just want to after the meeting i wondered if richard could stick around for a minute because i have a personal question to ask uh after after what this is certainly can i stay around too mr anderson absolutely any other questions or concerns for the matrix okay uh seeing none i will call the meeting to a close at 8 45 thank you everyone see you in a in a couple of weeks. - Bye.