Nov 30, 2020 Zoning Board of Adjustment on 2020-11-30 3:00 PM

Good afternoon and welcome to the Zoning Board of Adjustments meeting for today. The date is Monday, November 30th, 2020. The time is 3.03 p.m. I'd like to call this meeting to order as we do have a quorum. The first item on our agenda is the Pledge of Allegiance to both the U.S. and the Texas flag. Is that a thing we do on Zoom, Ron? You're on mute. Sorry, I was on mute. Yes, we do the Pledge. I apologize. We do the Pledge, so if you're able to, please join us on the Pledge. Pledge of Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America. And to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. On the Texas flag, honor the Texas flag, and Pledge of Allegiance to the Texas, one state under God, one indivisible. Thank you. Thanks. The second item on our agenda is Item 2A, a Work Session Report, which is Receive a Report, Hold a Discussion, and Give Staff Direction Regarding Code Amendments Related to Zoning Board of Adjustment, Composition, and Operational Procedures. So I'll hand it over to staff. Great. Thank you. Give me a second. I'll go ahead and bring up my presentation. Hopefully you all can see the presentation and can hear me. This is a presentation related to our development code amendments that we're currently working on as it relates to the Zoning Board of Adjustment. It's just a part of, again, our code amendments. So just a way of agenda presentation, I'm just going to briefly go over the history of the DDC update, what code amendments we've already started and currently drafting. The Development Code Review Committee go over who they are and how they're helping in this process. A little bit about the proposed schedule, where we are and where we hope to be in the next couple months, and then kind of dive into a little bit more on the amendments as it relates to the Zoning Board of Adjustment. So by way of history, on April 23rd, 2019, the development code was updated. And through that update, we had made some changes to some of the operations and composition. And so we're going to address that later in the presentation. During April and September, the zoning map was also approved by the City Council. And on October 1st, the entire DDC update, 2019 DDC update, was effective, again, October 1st. Obviously, one year later, we're celebrating our year anniversary. Since October of 2019, to date, we have been doing a number of code amendments, primarily addressing nonconformities, performing city initiated rezonings to address those nonconformities, also drafting and getting code amendments approved to, again, address those nonconformities. We also had a number of state law that was passed in the summer of 2019. One specifically, House Bill 2497, which affects the Zoning Board of Adjustment. And that's one of the other reasons why we're doing these code amendments, to make sure that we are in line with the state law that were passed. Again, this House Bill 212497 was one of those, again, that affects the Zoning Board of Adjustment. So again, I kind of briefly went through this, but I just really want to spend a little bit more time to discuss why the code amendments now. Well, again, based on some of the code amendments or the 2019 update, there were some nonconformities that were created, so we're continuing to address that. We want to align our provisions with House Bill 2497, and I'll speak a little bit more towards what that is. We also are obviously improving our development review process, and we want to codify some of that and make sure that that's in our code. And again, we continue to hear from the general public, the development community, the Planning Zoning Commission, City Council, and other boards and commissions on how to better improve our process and our code, and we want to make sure we have an avenue to do so. We've identified a number of code amendments from high priority changes to substantive changes to others that deal primarily with criteria manuals, and then others are just non-substantive changes such as typos, missed references, clarifying the intent and/or deleting some duplication. So these are not as critical, but still need to be done as part of our code amendments. Real quickly, the Development Code Review Committee is made up of three councilmembers, three Planning Zoning Commissioners. You see them listed here. Now, the councilmembers, they may change in the next coming weeks, but again, we have a committee that is charged, change my slide, to assist in the code amendment process by providing guidance, giving us, reviewing the code amendments, but also giving us priorities on what code amendments should be presented and move forward to the Planning Zoning Commission and City Council. So yes, ultimately, the Development Review Committee is just an advisory board, which will provide recommendations, and ultimately, the full City Council will make their decision on the code amendments that we bring forward. Our schedule, as we've been working on this beginning of September, as you all know, with COVID and everything, everything seemed to be put on the back burner. However, we recognize that this is an important part of what we need to accomplish with code amendments. And so we started it again in September. October 6th is when we established or reestablished the DCRC, Development Code Review Committee. We've got a pretty aggressive schedule. We'd like to take things forward as soon as possible. Obviously, with the holidays and with some of the City Council changes, we may pause a little bit, but ultimately, our goal is to get something done by spring of next year. So a lot of these code amendments will be brought forward to the Planning Zoning Commission and ultimately to City Council. But again, I wanted to share this with you because you are part of the Zoning Board of Adjustment. There are code amendments related, and we want to make sure that you are aware of those code amendments that are being brought forward. So the ones that we're going to speak specifically today is related to the composition, the overall operation procedures for the Zoning Board of Adjustment, appeal of administrative decisions. These come to the Zoning Board of Adjustment. So if there is a appeal to a decision by an applicant, property owner, whoever, they have to follow a procedure, and there's a time and there's a way to submit all of those. And again, ultimately, the Zoning Board is the body that decides, makes the final decision on those appeals. In addition, interpretation procedures, that's something that is offered to our development community and/or citizens. They have the opportunity to request, and again, this goes to the Zoning Board of Adjustment for your consideration. And then there are a number of non-substantive changes just to clarify certain dates and due dates and other things like that. So again, I'll go through that in my presentation in a little bit. Okay, so does anybody have any questions before we get going? And I'm going to drop my screen so that we can see everybody. I don't know where Jennifer went, hopefully. I'm here. I just turned off my video. Oh, okay. So just want to make sure we have quorum. Yeah, yeah. You're there. So anybody have any questions on the code amendments, the process, what we're doing, why we're doing it? Again, just want to make sure that we have your buy-in and we want to make sure that you're all involved, at least, in what's going on. Okay, having read this in advance, there was a shortening of the time period in which members of the public could respond to certain things. Yeah, when I get to that point, and I'll bring it up, and again, specifically, we're responding to House Bill 2497, but let me get to that presentation and, Jennifer, if you can interrupt me if I don't see you raise your hand or whatnot, we can discuss that further. Okay, so going back to the presentation. So the first code amendment that we are proposing or recommending staff is, is really to bring back the composition statements that were in the prior development code. We updated the code in 2019, and what we just stated was to reference the Municipal Code of Orrences when it talks about the Board of Adjustment. However, we feel that is more customer service-friendly if we had that information in the code itself, and so what you see here underlined is what we're proposing to include in the 2019 development code. And again, it really lists stuff that we already know. Again, we're just bringing it back, but just to summarize what we're proposing is that the language you see here is that the ZBA is a member of, is made up of seven members and that they are appointed by the City Council and their terms are staggered with two-year terms each. Ron, I've got a question about that. Yes. So we're term-limited as well on this commission, like other, is that right? Like do boards and commissions, like they also have term limits of three two-year terms each? Correct. Correct. Yes. Does that need to be included in this clause here? So when you mean other boards of commission or just? So if we have term limits of three consecutive two-year terms on the Zoning Board of Adjustments, does that need to be included in that clause, that first clause? Oh, I see what you mean. Okay. Let me go back and turn my screen. So I have to go back and forth to make sure we see everybody, because with the PowerPoint presentation, it's hard to see everyone's. So let me flip over to... So yes, there is mention of that, and it may not be here, and that's a good question. I thought it may be on this next slide as it relates to a three-year term. It may be an all-encompassing board and commission three-year term, and that's more likely in the Code of Ordinances, so that's more likely where it's covered. So good question. I think, based on our proposal or recommendation, I think it's fine if we don't include it here in that we just refer that portion to the Code of Ordinances, where it speaks to the ultimate three-year term, three-time terms. Perfect. Yeah, as long as it's included somewhere. And if we're only seeing a segment, that's why we're coming to you. No, no, no. Great. Yeah, because it's included somewhere else, then I get it. I just wanted to bring that up. Yes. Yes. There's a bigger... The Code of Ordinances, I believe, covers all that. Like I said, I thought it was on this one, but it's not. Okay. Okay. Thank you. So the other portion of this is on the composition is also the alternates, as you all know that there are three alternates to the Zoning Board of Adjustment, and basically what this identifies or lists is that how they're also assigned and also appointed, that is, and they also serve a two-year term. They are also a first, a second, and third alternate, and as you all know, if one member is absent, the first alternate will take that place. If there's a second member that's absent, the second alternate will take that place. So this is to ensure that we have quorum at all times, and because it's such an important scheduling thing to have members present, because we do have a time limit in considering applications, and again, postponing a meeting may not be the best thing to have, especially if it is required per state law. Number three relates to the two-year term, as we spoke earlier, and again, the alternates serve the same time frame and staggeredness of making sure that there is always a person or member in the meetings. So we get into the general procedures with the Zoning Board of Adjustment, again, much of this you already know, but what we're trying to do again is bring these statements and these provisions back into the development code, so it's more or less our opportunity to make sure that our development community and our citizens understand what is required of the Zoning Board of Adjustment. So for general purposes or procedures, in order to have a meeting, we need a minimum of six members, which for this meeting we have, that the Zoning Board of Adjustment may adopt rules to govern its proceedings, and this is something that we probably will need in the future to discuss further. There's some rules and procedures that we, the staff, would like to discuss with you all, but it's not covered under this agenda item, but we will certainly bring this up at a future meeting. That the meetings of the Zoning Board of Adjustment may be held at the call of the chairperson and vice chair as well in certain situations, and that the Zoning Board of Adjustment keeps minutes, and we all know that we do keep minutes, and that's something that will be considered later on this agenda. So here's the first part of the procedures that relate to House Bill 2497, and I'm going to stop and share, sorry, to stop the presentation, and bring up that House Bill that was included in your packet. Hopefully you all had an opportunity to look at that, and let me see if I can bring it up here one second. So hopefully you all can see the document on the screen, House Bill 2497, again, where it is underlined. This was passed in 2019, where it is underlined is what was added to the Texas Local Government Code, Section 211. One of the things that was added is that the provision to have a person that's not related to a specific application address or project be able to appeal a decision to the Board of Adjustment. It also clarified that any person that's related, so you have not related, and you also have related to an application under which there are different provisions, but this area was expanded as part of House Bill 2497. In addition, I think this is where Board Member Jennifer mentioned the time in which the appeal must be filed and considered. So the appeal must be filed not later than 20 days after the decision has been made, or prior it was just a reasonable time as determined by the rules of the Board. So the Texas Local Government Code specifically states that an appeal must be made 20 days after the date of the decision. So that is what will be presented as part of the code amendment. I just wanted to share with you how it fits in with the Texas Local Government Code. In addition, yes, Jennifer. Just to mention that it says 20 days, not 20 business days, so I don't know if they've clarified that to be literally 20 days, including Saturdays and Sundays, or whether it includes the day of the decision, just so that people know. When there's a specific number like that, it's easier to miss by a day. Right. Right. To misinterpret it, it may be necessary to ask the state for clarification. We can, and I think we have, when I bring up the code amendment, we can certainly make that part of our code and then verify that further with the state. I think the last addition to House Bill 2497 was also this meeting where we notice for an appeal for one meeting date, but not have a decision. I think some of you were involved in one recently, I think it was in October of last year, where we had to meet the following meeting date. It just needs to be a 24-hour difference, and so that happened, again, in October of last year, but must be considered within 60 days after the date the appeal was filed. This was added in June, or this was part of the House Bill that was passed in June, and we actually applied it for an application that was appealed in October of last year. That's something that we're planning to include in the development code amendments. Let me go back to the code amendments. You can see that we've added where the provision states that anyone that's not related, as well as anyone that's related to the project with the provisions here, so that's covered in our code. This is the section, I think, that you're referring to, or, remember, Jennifer Layne. An appeal shall be submitted to the Development Services Board not later than the 24th date, so maybe this is where we can add calendar days, and that's a good point, and I don't see any issues with that. I think what we're trying to do with our development code is to stick consistently with calendar days rather than business days, so we can clean that up with this particular provision. I think two more here related to the appeal stating that anybody at a public meeting related to an appeal, any interested party, may appear before the Board of Adjustment. This kind of goes over that process, and if there's any action or variance authorizing the issuance of a building permit or COA or certificate of occupancy, CEO that is, that they will be only valid for 90 days, so this is, again, just more technicality just to cover that, again, if this ever was needed to happen or needed to be verified, we have it, and then this is, again, where we cover the 60-day Zoning Board of Adjustment shall decide an appeal at the next meeting for which notices can be, you know, be provided following the meeting, and no later than 60 days, again, maybe put calendar days here as well so that we're clear that it's calendar days from the date of the appeal when it was submitted. So moving on to the other sections of the code, this is, again, related to the Zoning Board of Adjustment. This is under Section 234, which is our administration and procedure section, and basically what we're saying here and just providing that clarification that the Zoning Board of Adjustment shall be the body responsible for hearing appeals of administrative decisions under this CDC and then in accordance with 211.010, which is that version that I shared with you that was part of the House Bill 2497. Further, within that same administration procedure section, we clarify that the six-member concurring vote is required. Just to be clear, when someone asks, "Well, what is 75% of the members?" What we're saying is it's six members, so you need six members of the board in order to approve a variance application. This is more or less for clarification purposes. This right here following, on the second part of this, is that any Zoning Board of Adjustment will always be heard by a minimum of six members, and again, just to restate that, in order to meet quorum, we need six members. The next slide here is just more clarification. It is not the Zoning Board of Appeals. It's the Zoning Board of Adjustment, so just more cleanup on our end. This specifically refers to a section, again, under Administrative and Procedures, where we talk about the related and not related. Again, for what we saw earlier in the House Bill 31, that's part 2497, we're just outlining it here in this part of the code in a little bit more detail under this section. Again, 2.83 is an Appeal to Administrative Decision. What we were on prior, where it was the Procedures section, this is related to specifically Administrative Appeals. The time limit, again, we went from, well, we initially had 10 days. We're going to 20 to be consistent with the House Bill that was passed. We also talk about the stays of proceeding. What this means, basically, is that if there is an Appeal, that certain items must remain stayed until that decision has been made on the appeal. So again, those certain applications must remain undecided, that is, until the appeal is processed and considered. Ron, I have a question on that past slide. It's Kate Linus. Yes. Let me stop my screen and go ahead. Okay. So on that slide, you've got the change from 10 business days to 20 business days, but we need to clarify whether we really mean business days. No, you're absolutely correct. That should say calendar days to be consistent. That should say calendar. Okay. Thank you for that. Yeah. Yeah, so we have areas also mentioning in that 60 days, again, here, and again, this is part of the Administrative or the Appeal on Administrative Decisions. So again, I know it's redundant, but again, this is a different section that speaks to this matter. We want to make sure that that is covered here as well. A little bit more clarification, again, correction in this particular section, but then underneath that is again, it's more clarification that now we're talking about interpretations. Now, there hasn't been a number of interpretations that the Sonia Board of Adjustment have seen recently, but there may be in the future. So this is again to clarify that any interpretation may be appealed to the Zoning Board of Adjustment. Again, again, it's part of that section that we discussed prior. I wanted... So that was it on the Code Amendments. I don't know if you all have any questions. I feel that is pretty much an exercise of making sure that we are in line or aligned with state provisions and also to correct some minor typos or correct references. But again, to reestablish the procedures and the composition back in the Development Code to be more customer friendly and also to be clear as to what the procedures are. So anyone that's looking has an easier way of understanding it. So that's the exercise that we're trying to do, and we wanted to make sure that you all are aware of that. I wanted to put a list together of all of the things that could come to the Zoning Board of Adjustment as an appeal of an administrative decision. We have a number of applications from Zoning Complaints Plan all the way through interpretations. But again, ones that we've heard recently back in October was specifically to an appeal to an administrative decision. But there could be others that, again, would require the Zoning Board of Adjustment's consideration and decision. So this is just a list of what those applications could be. And that concludes my presentation, and I'll be happy to staff for any further questions or any other comments. >> Ron, this is David, a couple of things came to mind. The provision whereby you are struck from being a member of the board applies to Zoom meetings, as well as any other, it's a live meeting, right? >> That's correct. And I don't know if Matt can help me with this one, but I believe there was a -- from the governor's action, I believe, I don't know the term specifically, but it gives us the opportunity to hold meetings via Zoom as long as it's posted, and we have the opportunity to have people comment. >> Okay. That makes sense. And the asset where it said members may be removed for callings, I assume that just refers back to the ethics ordinance. >> That's correct. The city council would have to make that motion, and there has to be some sort of reasoning for that action. >> But, again, within the stipulation of the ethics ordinance? >> That is my understanding, there has to be some sort of reason, and obviously they would have to reference either the ethics -- most likely it would be the ethics section or maybe something else that is referenced, and I'm not going to say it's only the ethics ordinance. There may be other things that they can reference as well. >> Could you repeat what David's question is, because his speech is a little blurry coming through my headset, a bit blurry or without it, too? >> Sure, and then David, interrupt me if I misspeak. Board member Hagens was referring to the clause that the council member can remove a zoning board of adjustment under a certain situation, but that's what he was referring to. >> I didn't hear what the question was, so now I really don't know what you guys are talking about. >> I'll just say to everyone, I lost my headset, Jennifer, or at least I realized it's fuzzy. I'm aware of that, sorry. >> Yeah, I'm just trying to follow what the conversation was, because I could hear Ron, but not yourself, clearly. >> David, can you repeat your question? >> Maybe what the subject even is. >> Well, the question was at the very outset, under what I think was paragraph one when Ron was reading, it said that a board member may be removed by cause from the council, and I said I assume that that just refers back to the ethics ordinance requirements, and his answer, as I understand it, was that's true, maybe not limited to what the ordinance says, but certainly within what the ordinance says. >> Okay, yeah, so what for cause means, thanks. >> Okay. As we go through the code amendments, like I said, if there's anything that changes or comes up that I feel is something that the board should be aware of, I'll certainly make mention of it in future meetings. So Amber, if we can move on to the next item. >> All right, it's my first time chairing a Zoom meeting, so okay, thank you. So that concludes the work session item 2A, correct? >> Correct. >> Okay, thank you, okay. So the next item on the agenda is item 3A, item for consideration, we are considering approval of the minutes of October 28th and October 29th, 2019, and November 18th, 2019. Were there any corrections to the minutes? Commissioner Lane, did you have a comment? >> Yes, I just wanted to suggest that we consider them as a group, move to consider approval of the minutes in their entirety, all three at once, and then if there's a second, then we can of course discuss anything that needs to be changed in them if there is. >> I'll second that. >> Okay, so we are voting on whether or not to approve the minutes as a whole or discuss them as a whole, is that correct, Commissioner Lane? >> The motion is to approve them and with a second, then discussion can occur. >> So is there any discussion of the minutes? I did look over them, it was a really long, complicated meeting, but it didn't stand out in my memory because it was that back-to-back one that we had. I didn't see any big changes or anything that was, you know, staring, that was evident to me. Did anyone else have anything to add to the minutes or correct? Okay, so hearing no objection, I guess we have a motion and a second to approve the minutes. All those in favor, if you could just raise your hand visibly. Any opposed? >> Chair, can I ask the legal question real quick? Mac, would they need to respond or raise their hand, would that be sufficient for the vote? >> As a matter of practice, I shouldn't say policy, but as practice, we've been having a roll call vote, so we've gone one by one just to have a verbal yay or nay from each member of the board. >> Thank you. Again, this is my first Zoom, Chair, so do I -- should I call on each Commissioner individually then as the Chair I call on them? >> Yes, ma'am. >> Okay. Then I'm just going to go left to right, top to bottom, what I see on my screen, Commissioner Meissner, how do you vote? >> Approved. >> It was broken up, but I heard you say approved. Correct? >> Yes. Aye, yes. >> Thank you. Commissioner Redwine, how do you vote? >> Approved. >> Commissioner Higgins? You're on mute, sir. >> Aye. >> Commissioner Linus? >> I approve. >> And Vice Chair Lane? >> Yay. >> And I also approve. So the minutes are approved unanimously. The last item for consideration is item 3b, where we look at the calendar for next year, consider approval of the 2021 ZBA meeting calendar. >> Can that be a screen share? >> Yes. >> I didn't see any big issues, but I know we typically like to talk about the November and December months in particular. >> Let me bring it up, and I'll share it out with the group. I know it's kind of small, but I can move up and down if I need to. Typically they are the last Monday of every month. There are some Mondays that we obviously adjust accordingly, specifically May is one that is not the last Monday of the month. The other one, I think that's it. I think what we need to discuss, I would recommend as staff is looking at the holidays, specifically November, Thanksgiving, and then December between the Christmas holiday and New Year's, there's a zoning board adjustment. That's something maybe the board can discuss specifically. >> We went through this last year and made adjustments, but this year with both Christmas and New Year's coming at the end of a week, I think that having it on the 27th is the best you could possibly do. You wouldn't want to move it up to the 13th. It would only be two weeks behind November. >> Okay. >> So everyone can see this, right? So I was going to say, it may be difficult to get a quorum and staff is going to be requesting time off that week between Christmas and New Year's as well. I would recommend moving it up if we could. And maybe even that Monday after Thanksgiving, I don't know if we could also move up that last week of November to the Monday prior or even the Monday before that. Again, just keeping in mind, you know, people didn't get to see family for Thanksgiving or Christmas this year, and I bet next year there's going to be -- I hope that we can see our families again, and so I'm just concerned about making quorum and having staff available during those holiday weeks, especially after a pandemic year when we can maybe pilot it together again. So I would recommend moving both the November and the December meeting up if possible. And I know we can call a special meeting if we need to, like, if there's really something important that they didn't meet the timeline, we could always call a special meeting. That's just my suggestion. >> Could we not -- sorry. >> Commissioner Redwine. >> Could we combine November, December to an early December meeting? I know if we had a call for a 30-day, you know, I think there's a 30-day window we have to have if something comes up, could we do something like that? >> What say you, Ron, and Mac, is that a thing that the city could do? >> I think that's a possibility. I think we probably would need to have a meeting in November, and then -- and I don't know if, obviously, if it's the last Monday or if it's earlier, one, I think, obviously, we're meeting November 30th today, so it's not going to work, but I think the December one is a little bit more difficult just because of where it sits. Having an earlier meeting in December might be consideration. >> Commissioner Lane, what were you going to put? >> Yes, I was just looking at the calendar, and just the way it's laid out, given that October is a sort of long month, and we would be the 25th of October, perhaps we could use the 22nd of November, and then an earlier day in December, and they would be pretty well spaced out, at least approximately four weeks from the October 1 to -- October 25th to November 22nd, and then if we show as an early one in December, it would be three weeks, not two. >> So I'm hearing November 22nd. Are we saying December 13th or December 20th? >> Either one is reasonably fine, but if you think people will be taking vacation on the 20th, perhaps the 13th would be better, and if we're moving -- if we're thinking in terms of the October 25th, four weeks later, that making it one week earlier in December, then if we did use December 13th, it wouldn't be such a short amount of time between the two, the only one week short rather than two. >> This kicks the can down the road for January 2022. >> Well, and we can't -- there is always the option to call a special meeting if, you know, if there's an applicant who can't meet a particular deadline for whatever reason. There is a process for us to call a special meeting. I'm just, you know, again, just concerned about quorum, and, you know, staff deserves a break, too, once in a while. So, Commissioner Lane, I like that suggestion that, you know, that -- I think that seems like a reasonable compromise. Is there anyone else with any input about that? >> No, I didn't take the same question I would have it be that November 22nd date, but, you know, that's the other question. It would be a holiday week. >> Perhaps the problem is the week after is even more caught up in the holiday. >> Yeah, speaking as a small business owner, I can tell you how hard it was for me on Cyber Monday to make this meeting today. So, yes, I would actually prefer something before Thanksgiving rather than after. >> Actually, I think that the 20 -- talking on December, I think that if you were flipping between 20th and 27th, and I realize that a lot of you don't want either one of those, 20 would be worse than the 27th, I think, in terms of generating a quorum. >> We're actually considering the 13th, if we move the November to the 22nd. >> So do we -- >> You can kick the can down the road on January 22 and deal with it at the time. I'm just saying let's recognize that that's what we're doing. >> And I hear that concern, Commissioner Higgins, and that's why I mentioned that there's, you know, if that's too long of a wait between December 13th and the last Monday of January 2022, that there is a process to call a special meeting if an applicant, you know, requests that. So -- but we don't know what, you know, 2022 will look like. We can only kind of look ahead with what we have here. So if -- is there, like -- do we need to make a motion wrong to approve Jennifer's suggestion of -- yeah? Okay. So we'll just approve the calendar, and we will then use that for scheduling our meetings. >> That sounds great. So can I make a motion? >> Sure. Change the calendar to November 22nd and December 13th. >> I'll second. >> We have a motion from Commissioner Lane and a second from Commissioner Redwine. Commissioner Meisner, how do you vote? >> I'll vote to approve. >> Commissioner Redwine? >> I vote to approve. >> Commissioner Higgins? >> Aye. >> Commissioner Linus? >> I vote to approve. >> Commissioner Lane? >> Aye. >> And I also vote to approve. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Okay. That's it. Are there any -- that's Section 4. Any concluding items for today? Anything else to bring up? >> Floor doesn't have any. I just quickly mentioned that we do have applications for the coming month. If not in December, we don't meet quorum in December, for sure, January. If you are available, please let me know. >> May I ask when the next meeting is scheduled for? I have forgotten. >> We are looking to meet December 14th, if we get six members, hopefully seven is the goal. If it's not in December, then it will be all the last Monday in January. >> Great, thanks. So I think that's it. I guess I will close the meeting now. The time is 3.48 p.m. Thank you again, everyone, for joining us, and I look forward to seeing you if not December 14th, and I'll see you in the new year. >> Great. Thank you, everyone. >> Bye. [BLANK_AUDIO]